#Support - Feedback

1 messages · Page 5 of 1

gilded dock
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As far as I am aware you're supposed to be able to resupply yourself like how medic can heal themselves, it's just bugged right now

grim fog
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Suggestion : currently a unique capability of support is having a quick build of construction but that currently ties with squad performance

A solution :

  1. 50%-80% discount for support to build anything

  2. Squad points have a separated points for other member and support

If there's 200 squad points and SL decided to built a spawn point, the whole 200 squad points is gone EXCEPT for support player, they will have 200 points until they use it personally

brittle oak
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Nah i think mabye for ctf or rush as u basically get no squad points but u get plenty in conquest/dom

inner monolith
inner monolith
zenith carbon
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The faster self-heal is an idiotic decision, just as giving the medic the smg is imo

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Peanut said this best but healing and shooting better just makes your class the assault class. That’s literally not the point of medic

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Vehicle discussion a bit but i would be down with m2s dealing this effect to those brick walls

inner monolith
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Yes. I've been arguing this for months now lol. It's inconsistent, it's overpowered and it favors selfish medics. If FAK was like support crate, i.e. resupplies bandages and can't be picked back up, it would be in line with the rest of classes not having access to infinite resources. And even selfish medics, much like supports currently, would be forced to leave bandages for their teammates behid when attempting to resupply themselves.

zenith carbon
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I am down with the concept of a support as shotgun class though

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I’m honestly quite against the easy provision of the AR/SMG/DMR class to like. Assault, medics and engineers but supports just suffer with every slow gun in the game

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Furthermore it’s something that gives support an alternate niche - walking/tank fire into rooms

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I know, ‘we will never add shotguns’ and all, but it would be a pretty good addition imo

velvet wing
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Dmrs to support 😎

zenith carbon
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Especially since all the other classes have gameplay variation other than recon

zenith carbon
# velvet wing Dmrs to support 😎

Honestly? FUCK YEAH. The DMRs are optimal for defensive play anyhow, why in the hell are we not providing them to the ideal defensive class?

velvet wing
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Finally, someone gets it

zenith carbon
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Imo? DMRs should go to assault, recon and support only tbh

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Engineers are a maybe but i just don’t think they belong with medics

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That said, i feel like i’d rather force the engis to give up dmrs as well and make them an AR/PDW only role

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Feel free to clown me on this, i just think we gotta start really making roles feel like ‘roles’ instead of vehicles for whatever wank you wanna get off today

inner monolith
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Tbh I don't understand why anyone would go DMR on recon. Every other class gets more utility to go with it.

velvet wing
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Recon should get smgs 😎

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Medics should have ars taken from them

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Especially now that smgs are much shorter range.

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Support is the only class right now that's playstyle basically NEEDS dmrs

inner monolith
velvet wing
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I agree that ranger armor should go away. But I run light armor anyway lol

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And I'm definitely still a menace. I don't run ars with medic so it forces me to lose a lot of encounters at longer ranges now or run a carbine

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But this is support. Had a whole discussion in medic about this already

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Support could benefit from roller skates tbh

zenith carbon
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Someone made that segways idea a while back and i can kinda see where they were coming from

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That said… as a conq player, i’d rather people just use the vehicles

inner monolith
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Support pocket quad hell yeah

velvet wing
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Lmao

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Let support call in a motorized wheelchair

zenith carbon
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Special wheelchair skin: mr. President

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You get to dress as FDR

velvet wing
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I'd buy that

flat sedge
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Will say this about weapons, I am fully up for giving supports DMRs, I just feel that would start to step on recon's toes a bit too much

paper vector
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Assault already has DMRs

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Recon DMRs are worthless except for the drone

zenith carbon
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I think recon really needs a role definition tbh, it’s in a… weird place

flat sedge
# paper vector Assault already has DMRs

Aye I get that

I just believe weapon choices should be more class restricted (Not as much as support but more akin to some weapon catergoris should be tied more to certain roles such as DMRs and snipers 100% goes to recon & give them option to either carbines or ARs, assault should not get DMRs or anything with more range than ARs type idea and that deal)

velvet wing
weary garden
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Recon renamed sniper
Dmrs removed

velvet wing
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Lmao, that'd work true

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Oh one more thing

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Give support riot shield lol

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Like why doesn't it have that

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Give 1 score per bullet taken. Could it be farmed? Yes. Would it be worth it? No

flat sedge
velvet wing
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Yes, but support might survive exactly one of those

dire ridge
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Gonna reiterate. Support should be immune to bullets smaller then 7.62 unless its in the face or limbs. Caz Oki cant balance SMGs at all anymore.

zenith carbon
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honestly i feel like that would be just a nightmare to balance afterwards? there's probably less extreme things we can do for the same effect

flat sedge
zenith carbon
dire ridge
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The Whole point of Armor. The armor damage system.

inner monolith
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Way too many knobs to tweak. Just give me flat damage reduction so SMG tickle like they should.

gilded canopy
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dmr's for support would be the win for the class

dire ridge
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DMR's on support. That bait. Now Support should get the riot shied. as well as Blast resistance. But really to the previous point. SMGs still melt people to quickly and Supports to slow and to clungy to fight them back. Which is really ass because If I start a gun fight against an SMG I should WIN that gunfight. not lose because the spray more bullets faster.

meager salmon
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support should get riot shield tho

flat sedge
inner monolith
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No more getting one shot from RPGs hitting the wall you're aiming from >:(

flat sedge
inner monolith
flat sedge
inner monolith
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I know just memeing XD

dire ridge
gilded canopy
dire ridge
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While its an idea to have support be a back line player and fight from range, its not wise to make another sniper which can take the job of a sniper and get away with being countered atleast "once" That will enrage people

meager salmon
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i already dont exactly know what the reasoning was behind assault getting marksman rifles, I think it was just fine for them to be limited to engi and recon, as both of those classes are meant to be able to gear their entire loadout towards dealing big damage from afar. that is not what assault is, nor is it really what support is. support is more for close and medium range crowd control as well as close-support with a focus on squad care

dire ridge
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however. I will 100% use a DMR as a battle rifle and mag dump an SMG player in CQC. but i still at the moment.

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AM a paper tiger

gilded canopy
meager salmon
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its also important to not just conveniently ignore that support has quite a few weapons waiting in the wings (tbf, I dont understand why there is a hold up on releasing the new content if its already finished), and its also possible that we will soon see bipod largely improved and perhaps even integrated into supports weapons instead of an alternative to a proper grip, which alone would help a lot with supports inflexibility

meager salmon
dire ridge
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Lets look at this.

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Class's most of them are ok. But over all "half baked." combined warefare and balancing for large combat fights, vehical play, useful vehicals. "half baked" Armor system on the surface seems cool, but if the end run of things now. "half baked."

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Oki's been working on shit we cant see and its annoying because Mans got a community but Larry is the face of his battle bit project. Who knows. maybe Okis fighting to figure out how to save himself from unknown issues

meager salmon
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what i meant was that there wasnt any reason for assault to get DMRs. its a class that, like medic, can run minimal armour for maximum ssspeeeeeed but at the time, DMRs were not very good at all and no one really used them, especially for run-and-gun. it didnt do anything for the class

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it only took away specialisation from engi and recon

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and variety in class specialisation is one of this games weaker points

weary garden
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Assault's kit was meant to be all rounder build how you want to type

Ammobox, smoke launcher, rope gun, a bunch of stuff that fits different distances

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so you can play door buster or DMR depending on playstyle

dire ridge
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Me- Runs and guns with DMR's just to spit people. Pre DMR buff Me now- Still runs and guns with DMR's just to spit people Post DMR buff

weary garden
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or you could do that

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But for those who don't want to specialize into healing/vehicle/recon/machineguns you have assault

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an all around gun guy

meager salmon
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and DMRs arent all around guns. rather, they arent meant to be. theyre long range marksman rifles that do well cqc because of their high damage.

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can do well, i should say

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just like sniper rifles can be cqc monsters since they, in theory, lack a ttk. but thats not how sniper rifles are meant to be used, and its not the most effective way to use them either

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and imo, rope only fits long distance roles because you can combine it with a DMR. otherwise its a flanking tool. same with smoke and shield, as assault is meant to be right up in the thick of things. throwing down small amounts of ammo while helping keep the pressure on the enemy at the closest ranges

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support is geared towards doing the same thing, but at medium ranges. it needs weapon variety in the weapon types it alreadys has and better character stats to do that effectively, not simply being given DMRs and told to go get em boys

weary garden
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Dmrs stretch into range and PDWs stretch into cqc

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that was the intent, and so far it works fine

meager salmon
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PDWs is fine. cqc is where assault is meant to be. but like i already said, assault is not a class geared towards long range. thats what engi and recon are for. the more oki reduces the individuality of the different classes, the more it becomes a pointless and annoying system altogether

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assault should have probably gotten SMGs with the other gun types instead of DMRs and have SMGs taken away from medic, since medic tramples on assaults toes fucking hard

weary garden
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You should absolutely be able to subclass into roles when your gadget selection is so wide

meager salmon
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i dont really get the logic there. engi has zero gadgets to specialise into CQC, and simply equipping an SMG does not achieve cqc specialisation, and ARs arent cqc-specialised in the first place, and removing them from medic along with smgs would leave medic with basically no gun variety

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ARs are the "basic bitch" guns that do well in close and medium range, but dont necessarily shine at either. thats where SMGs come in for cqc, and DMRs (and admittedly a couple ARs) come in for medium range

weary garden
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there is subclassing in engineer, in assault, in support, the classes that are missing it are recon due to weapon limits and medic bc medic is too much since the start

meager salmon
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c4 is an unbalanced piece of shit that treads on the toes of guns in general in extreme close range. its also not exclusing to engi. repair tool has nothing to do with combat so i dont see the point of mentioning it. tandem does almost 0 infantry damage as its meant purely vehicles.

weary garden
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That's still cqc

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and when frag gets buffed to be good AOE wise, bascially an oversized noobtube, is that also just not cqc?

meager salmon
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youre still strawmaning. repair tool is meant to be used with a vehicle. it has nothing to do with combatting the enemy. Tandem is used strictly against vehicles. It is not comparable even slightly to an SMG. C4 is a destruction tool that is extremely poorly balanced and thus can be used in lieu of a sidearm because oki refuses to change it, so i guess you have a point there, but its still not specific to engi. assault can equip it too

weary garden
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so you want to remove player choice to force people to play certain classes how you think they should be played

meager salmon
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and again, "being able to be used in cqc" isnt even slightly enough to make something a tool that specialises in cqc. because that would mean that a sledgehammer is also a cqc-specific tool

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huh?

weary garden
meager salmon
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im not going to keep arguing with a brick wall lol

weary garden
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Anyways, as always, if you can get more people to your cause, then it's on the table

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So far though, I've seen nobody else support your DMRs on support concept

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except for a guy back in june

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wait fuck

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hold on I mixed myself up

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You were arguing for assault to not have DMRs, right

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same idea

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get supporters, build a concept, it'll get read etc

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I personally think it's fine and weapon choice should get extended with recon gaining smgs

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make a class that isn't just sniper

velvet wing
velvet wing
zenith carbon
flat sedge
flat sedge
zenith carbon
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that's the thing yeah, smgs have a much larger niche than most of the other guns thanks to just how cqc many of the maps are

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well that and how everyone is moving in the big blobs which reduces the distance of your average engagement considerably

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medic gets smgs and faster heal, whoop de doo assault is a useless class

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doesn't make a difference if it can grappling hook up a building or has a sledgehammer, especially not when the medic also has C4

flat sedge
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add unlimited

zenith carbon
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assault dmrs aren't really a big problem to me except for the fact that I see DMRs as too much of a range extension for assault

flat sedge
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I am fully up for making each class have a preferred range/combat (AKA assault being more CQC based as a idea)

zenith carbon
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yeah i'm totally down with medic losing the smg and assault losing the DMR

weary garden
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So who keeps smgs

zenith carbon
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assault and engi

weary garden
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Engi and recon?

flat sedge
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keep smgs on?

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I am up for recons getting carbines

weary garden
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Assault SMG with bonuses sounds like a balancing nightmare

zenith carbon
# weary garden Engi and recon?

now recon is honestly a kinda fascinating idea to me because that is a place where i feel like you'd actually get different subclasses via the weapons

weary garden
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Unless we want to remove the passice

flat sedge
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Personally I am up for giving recon a more medium range or lower weapon

zenith carbon
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recon really should get some good buffs to really be a 'recon' tbh

weary garden
flat sedge
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aye fair

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again I said medium or lower for a reason

zenith carbon
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it should be well and possible for recons to be quietly moving around the map and catching out flankers and growing blobs

flat sedge
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leaves it up to debate

zenith carbon
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instead recon is just 'we control the hyperlongrage weeeee'

flat sedge
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but PDWs & carbines would be my first two thoughts

weary garden
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You could comfortably find 3 weapon classes per class I think

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Question is which ones

flat sedge
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Well I suppose might as well look at assault first & go down the list

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Assault (Leader I guess as well)
Medic
Support
Recon

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(Personal hope is Assault gets mainly CQC focused, medic jack of all trades but master of none, and recon being long ranged with some options to operate in medium to close range possibly and support given just more weapons in his tool belt (possibly DMRs but might as well get the rest setup first)

velvet wing
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If they wanted to give leader something, let leader use any weapons and armor lol

flat sedge
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Personally I am okay with that

velvet wing
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I dont' think anyone should be jack of all trades except SL tbh

flat sedge
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keep in mind with medic I said master of none as well

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so capable of assisting a more dedicated role but never over shadowing them in their role

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(using a example from the idea ; Medic would not have the CQC power of a assault, the long range sniping of a recon nor defensive options that a support would bring, but would equally help with all of them ,while also helping cover their weaknesses)

velvet wing
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No matter what you do, medic will be stronger than every class as long as it can self heal. Assault should be the every man class imo

flat sedge
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and I feel assault should be well as the name implies the guy assaulting the points, storming the buildings & so on aka more CQC focused kit

velvet wing
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Assault just means attack. So they should be the kit doing most of that. They already have ARs and SMGs, there's not really any more CQC focus you could get lol. This all belongs in some other feedback section for sure

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If support or engineer could resupply armor somehow, I feel support wouldn't feel as garbo right now anywho

flat sedge
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Agreed on the feedback part and Lost aye I get what they have now but keep in mind the prior conversation

woven fossil
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I feel like armor resupply is inevitable unless the big armor damage balance sweep effects stuff majorly

flat sedge
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agreed

woven fossil
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who knows if the playerarmor damage number will even be added still

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losing an exo helm in 1 fight and being at a disadvantage until respawn is still one of the most annoying things ingame

flat sedge
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aye

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one time value so to speak for a lifetime downside

velvet wing
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Yea, some kind of resupply or repair mechanic needs to be added at some point for sure. Unless you want to have a tarkov type system where you shoot someone 300 times in the chest and they don't die with some ammo types (which sounds terrible to me)

meager salmon
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yeah, giving leaders, at the very least, access to SMGs along with probably 10 bandages would easily make it a class people would use

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(squad lead class, not just all squad leaders)

flat sedge
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I know they are suppose to get airstrikes and the like at some point

meager salmon
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yeah, but i hope airstrikes will not be something that gets seen more than a few times per match. or otherwise much larger scale maps

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i frankly dont see how they will fit into the current map spread unless their damage output is extremely underwhelming

zenith carbon
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Probably the bfv v2s ngl

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Prepare for your squad to refuse to use their points for anything other than the big v2 rocket

velvet wing
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I got it

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this'll make people play SL

meager salmon
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what does that mean for people who didnt play BFV much

velvet wing
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give them a megaphone

meager salmon
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haha

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honestly, fuck yeah

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lemme yell and attract enemy attention. then my squad thats hiding in da bushes can charge in to the obj once its light on men

zenith carbon
velvet wing
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SL is so neglected it doesn't have it's own feedback spot 😭

zenith carbon
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Since the devs had to pivot to other development nothing else of significance other than special vechs ever appeared in callables so players just went for v2s only

meager salmon
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Recon is the kid who scraped his knee a bit, support is the one who is literally drowining, and squad lead is the skeleton at the bottom of the ocean

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medic is the one who isnt hurt at all but mom and dad are still only paying attention to them

meager salmon
inner monolith
meager salmon
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oh. i always assumed that was for the squad leader position within the squad

inner monolith
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I mean. I think it's the same thing for practical purposes.

meager salmon
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though in hindsight it makes more sense that its the class since its with all the other classes

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grouping-wise

velvet wing
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Give support a big rock to throw at people

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or to roll up hills

meager salmon
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up hills?

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its a dude with a machine gun, not the god of time, space, and gravity

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the only things that roll up are pillbugs

inner monolith
meager salmon
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pfft

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im imagining the rocks from The Forest

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an annoyance more than anything else

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or the pebbles or whatever they were called

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also, support would probably do well with a cluster grenade. doesnt do much damage, probably wont even kill unless someone gets hit when under 45 health or whatever, but deals moderate damage over a much larger area than a frag grenade

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wont kill many people when thrown down the tunnels in frugis, for example, but it will sure as hell hit them

zenith carbon
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Support new throwable: big ass kitchen knife

meager salmon
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nah that would 100% be a recon thing

zenith carbon
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No recon is the regular throwing knife

meager salmon
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recon is the guy who shows up with a gun held together by duct tape. he definitely has a kitchen knife because he lost his tac knife

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or broke it

zenith carbon
meager salmon
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lmao

zenith carbon
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also been thinking about that armor discussion earlier

meager salmon
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oh, perhaps support should get a shield variant that has slower movement speed than the assaults shield, but covers the users entire body from the front, and can be "deployed" to make the user unmoveable (even from the knockback of getting shot), and it extends about a quarter of a metrer or so on the left and right. a small, moveable sandbag of sorts

zenith carbon
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wonder if it'd make sense if instead of refillable shields, support armor didn't deplete and just provided a flat damage decrease to certain types of ammo at all times

meager salmon
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would be terrifying to see a wall of support shields slowly making their way down the tunnel towards you, deploying, then undeploying to move forward a bit before deploying again

zenith carbon
meager salmon
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fuck yeah

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because lets be honest; the assault shield works for a moveable shield, but it absolutely does not work as a shield for protecting an location

zenith carbon
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honestly i feel like it might be worth looking into a walking fire/tank class

meager salmon
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its too easy to shoot around, too easy to move with gunfire, and too vulnerable to damage from explosives

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support would rock with a shield that is slower but doesnt have those critical downsides, and would play very well into the purpose of the class

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that directional bullet whizzing change that was just announced, i think is gonna be a small indirect nerf to support, though not just to support

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directional whizzing was 100% needed, but itll make it even easier to find and annihilate a machine gunner laying down suppressive fire

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but maybe not. we will see when all these changes eventually drop. i just wish he would stop delaying fixes to shit thats straight up broken (cough new support resupply) to release with the gameplay changes

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the resupply change would have been a breath of fresh air for support players, but instead its just a choking on air

zenith carbon
velvet wing
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I think after every patch he should prioritize hot fixes for all the bugs. Then go ahead and move forward for another 2-3 weeks making whatever

meager salmon
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fr. hes doing a great job managing his monumental amount of work, but its too much for one dev regardless of how well they manage their time

zenith carbon
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not as an insult like the guy needs other devs to help in this this is already a bit too large for him to keep running solo

velvet wing
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and also get some buddies to help lol

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Hire whoever put in that bounty system on that one free egirls server lol, that guy clearly knows what fun is

meager salmon
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man i played on that server only one time before it presumedly got DDOSed

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was like "man im gonna play the hell out of that server tomorrow"

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tomorrow never arrived for that server

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T_T

zenith carbon
meager salmon
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you earned "kibble" by just being on the server n whatnot, and you could spend that kibble to place bounties on other players

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they got marked on the map and whoever killed them got the kibble

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it was fuckin hilarious. good fun

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and honestly? a funny as shit way of "nerfing" snipers

velvet wing
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So you can just be a dick for funzies

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Or give the top guy on your team something to fear

meager salmon
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ahahah i didnt even think to try that

gilded dock
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Oki might be making steps for an armor rework right now

weary garden
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Armor Rework: exo armor removed

sweet sinew
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Still love my exo armor, but requires a very specific playstyle

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Need some love tho, still doesn't feel like it protects a whole lot (especially the helmet)

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Honestly if you're going to eat a -10% move speed on top of a -10% from the weapon you're forced to take, full exo armor should turn all headshots into regular damage

meager salmon
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yep. you need a flat damage reduction across your whole body in addition to the armour when wearing exo armour. being dreadfully slow makes it dead easy to just shoot ya legs, and that alone makes exo armour a joke

sweet sinew
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Getting my bell rung on full health with fresh armor by an M200 is kind of infuriating

meager salmon
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aye. im still of the opinion that bringing M200 headshot multi down and L-armour damage way up and moving it to a different category of weapons would let the other sniper rifles have room to move into

sweet sinew
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Disagree, m200 isn't an anti-vehicle rifle

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I understand its position as a heavy sniper and that's fine, no problems there

meager salmon
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i mean, L-armour is things like quads n shit.

sweet sinew
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Quads and humvees

meager salmon
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aye. which imo dont belong in the same category tbf

sweet sinew
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I'd happily see bolt action rifles not get damage mitigation when punching through windscreens

meager salmon
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just gonna whisper this real quiet

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i dont think they do tbh

sweet sinew
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P sure everything does currently

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According to OKis notes

meager salmon
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im literally always getting +70, +77, etc assists from putting a round into people in choppers

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i have never once seen a +40, +50 assist when sniping chopper folk

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

heavy sage
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support should be way faster also they should have a way to replenish armor

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

livid carbon
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yeah sure but i don't think running support on medium is the way it's supposed to be played, heavy and exo are the way to go, if they were any good

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apart from being bullet sponges for 1 engagement you're probably gonna loose anyway due to superb thicccness and thus sluggishness

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

livid carbon
tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

livid carbon
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just gimme the mg3 and imma start fucking with those adhd coke medics on a really german basis

livid carbon
paper vector
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it can absorb at most 25 base damage, against most guns

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and it covers a smaller area

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

high gate
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and that's the main problem with exo armor. it just does not cover enough of your character

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it doesn't matter how strong exo armor is when your arms and legs are so huge and easy to hit

tight narwhal
paper vector
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Then we should have a step above that where you cannot move at all but are fully indestructible

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Would really solidify the role of support players on the battlefield

tight narwhal
livid carbon
stark breach
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an EOD suit would be fucking COOL

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give it some screen edge blur cuz its hard to see out of?

woven fossil
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I ran some tests of shooting every magazine to empty, and speed reloading the gun. To see which gun outputs the most bullets within a 1 minute timer.

First test, stock attachments
L86A1
Base mag- 10 magazines, 300 rounds.
Quick- 11 magazines, 330 rounds
Drum- 6 mags and 6/55 on the 7th, 379 rounds

MG36
Base mag- 7 magazines, 280 rounds
Drum- 5 magazines, 300 rounds

M249
4 magazines, 400 rounds

ULTIMAX 100
4 magazines, 400 rounds. (This was closer to being ready to fire than the m249 though)

Second test, with B-25 URK grip to maximize reload speed
(Only tested with drum magazines since they had the most output from test 1)

L86A1
Drum B-25 URK- 7 magazines, 385 rounds

MG36
Drum M-25 URK- 5 magazines and 53/60 on the 6th, 307 rounds

M249
B-25 URK- 4 magazines, 400 rounds

ULTIMAX 100
B-25 URK- 4 magazines and 85/100 on the 5th, 415 rounds

lofty wraith
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can we just get 1 more class of weapons to use kittenCry

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

meager salmon
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at that point just give DMRs to medic too

lofty wraith
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Idc what class of weapon just a 3rd option

velvet wing
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supports should get dmrs or more battle rifles

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take 'em away from assault and give the L86 and stuff to assault

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That way assault will maybe have net neutral

zenith carbon
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Give them to support and engi

flat sedge
dry bobcat
#

At the end of the game there's no "most resupplies" ranking. That's how much oki hates Support

meager salmon
# flat sedge I like this

me too. but instead of stripping BRs from assault, strip DMRs from assault. id imagine the distinction between DMRs and BRs would be BRs are lower damage in exchange for higher fire rate and full auto. giving that to assault would allow them to reach into medium ranges without reaching into long ranges, and same would apply to support, which is what support is already (supposed to be) good at

zenith carbon
zenith carbon
#

just kinda excessive to give them all the capability

meager salmon
#

aye. ive always been of the opinion that assault doesnt need the actual marksman DMRs. its not a long range class. thats what recon and Engi are, giving assault semi-auto snipers steps on engi's toes too much

#

and hell, take SMGs away from engi and medic, and give them to assault

flat sedge
meager salmon
#

assault should be the CQC specialist. let engi keep carbines and PDWs, but let SMGs be assaults thing

zenith carbon
#

you just can't sustain the fire while dragging down on the recoil enough to make it worth it

meager salmon
#

aye. DMRs would cater to Engis ability to smack a tank from 500m, and BRs would cater to supports need to cover close and medium ranges

#

assault and medic have no business being able to 2-shot from 500m. its assault, not recon lol

shadow walrus
dusty plinth
# meager salmon aye. DMRs would cater to Engis ability to smack a tank from 500m, and BRs would ...

None of that makes any sense unless your phrasing suggests something else; a DMR is not effective against even lighter tanks and don't aid in a Combat Engineer's role at all, if anything Engineers actually commonly carry Assault Rifles and Carbines, so I'm not sure why games constantly associate them with SMG's and PDW's when it's actually rather rare for them to carry such.

The "Support class" is just a fancy name games tend to use for Automatic Rifleman/Machine Gunner which obviously don't carry Battle Rifles, though there are rare circumstances such as the SCAR HAMR that bridge the gap between a LMG and a Battle Rifle.

meager salmon
#

the range of a DMR compliments the range of the RPG nicely

#

also, no, i do not agree that "Support" is just a fancy name for autorifleman/machine gunner. it just seems that way because thats the only kind of gun they have access to at the moment. They are, as the name would suggest, support infantry. they are they to support the people doing the fighting in the very front of the frontline with gadgets and weapons to allow them to do so. the "Linebackers" of BBR, to put it one way

dusty plinth
# meager salmon also, no, i do not agree that "Support" is just a fancy name for autorifleman/ma...

It is because pretty much every game that utilizes classes that includes a Support role primarily has access to LMG's and MMG's. Additionally, "Support weapon" is almost always referred to in conjunction with LMG's, and in some circumstances MMG's, and HMG's.

Longer distance rifles can technically be classifed as "support weapons" and Medics and Engineers can also be referred to as "support classes" by textbook deifnition when you consider the roles they all possess, but when it comes to military classification, Automatic Riflemen and Machine Gunners are classifed as Support classes.

meager salmon
#

not really sure how all of that relates to battelbit. Support is defined not only by its weapons, but also by its armour and gadgets. the exo armour, at least in theory, gives support the best survivability, and the ammo box is what enables people to get back in the fight when theyve run out of all their shit. and when the frontline falls, theyve got extra throwables and the option for heavy weaponry to try to hold their position despite the disadvantageous momentum.

#

there is absolutely nothing that says support is "the machinegun class" and nothing but "the machine gun class". having the Mk14 and G3 would allow support to put hardhitting, accurate rounds into the enemy from their position behind the messy frontline

#

its not supports job to be the ones dying on the frontline. if anything, a support dying is a direct impact to the ability for everyone else there to keep their gunfire up

weary garden
meager salmon
#

oki said so?

#

son of a bitch

weary garden
#

Exo armor was created for bipod machinegunners

#

ammo kit was created for the machinegun fantasy

meager salmon
#

except both the bipod and exo armour are awful lmao

weary garden
#

Now

shell hound
#

Oki should play a few live matches then.

weary garden
#

Larry and Vili are working on armor level stuff so normal armor should be more accessible

#

was 2 devstreams ago tho so idk what's goin on there

#

And Oki knows bipod sucks

#

he just gets nightmares to old bipod

#

so yknow

#

There's awareness at least

#

how long it'll take to actually get what they deserve is anyone's guess though, mine included

inner monolith
inner monolith
# weary garden Exo armor was created for bipod machinegunners

But as explained here, the gameplay reason it makes sense to couple LMGs and heavy armor is because you are making yourself a stationary target with a gun that does not have the fastest time to kill. As we don't have suppression, the ability to at least draw attention and make enemies shoot at you is the closest thing to distracting from their ability to hit other targets.

#

However, coupling accurate weapons with armor would risk making them an essentially safer sniper with barely any tradeoffs.

#

I still understand how DMRs could fit within their wider gameplay role, but it is the specific combo of good armor + hard hitting accurate weapon that I find potentially problematic.

#

One idea I've mentioned before is to make exo helmet disable the ability to use long range scopes. Its consistent gameplay wise since it is presumably a bulky thing, much like nightivision gear. And it would let them use a DMR without being able to tank headshots, which is a pretty big deal.

#

(unless you want to go with ironsights, in which case, sure why not)

zenith carbon
#

a thought i had was maybe just tying armor choices to what gun you're carrying too

#

you just don't get the choice to use the exo with the dmr

inner monolith
zenith carbon
#

you summed everything up as well as i could've hoped lol, upvoted and left

celest kraken
# weary garden he just gets nightmares to old bipod

the biggest thing he could do that would strongly buff bipods while avoiding the old bipod dominance is to just make bipod deployment less janky and more consistent. shooting through windows is so janky and even if you do manage to get the bipod to deploy the recoil from you gun can shift the model back enough that the bipod legs actually slip off the window and it undeployes

weary garden
#

The downsides also don't make sense

celest kraken
#

as it is, the only way to actually use bipods right now is when prone because of how janky they are

#

once bipods become something actually usable rather than a janky situational tool you can start adjusting the numbers with the mindset that those will be the actual experienced numbers.

as it is, 90% of the experience with a bipod will be during its undeployed state unless you massively change your playstyle into being a stomach crawler. its actually decent then, but it becomes so situational that you will start blowing holes in walls just so you can prone instead of use the nearby window

weary garden
#

Sure, but you're also giving up a grip slot for even more downsides

#

If it wasn't giving up a grip slot, then maybe it'd be worth adjusting numbers to compensate bipod but right now losing advantageous stats is adjusted numbers

celest kraken
#

look where the bipod is on all of these images!

image.png image.png image.png 1200px-PEO_M249_SAW_Para_ACOG.png 0of1luwmb9a71.png
#

bipods should generally be mounted as far fowards as possible

tight narwhal
#

One message removed from a suspended account.

weary garden
weary garden
royal hare
meager salmon
#

Fuck yeah. Ash and Rsh wombo combo

calm swallow
#

Modify Ammo box to make it x to drop the box, left click to self supply, and right click to supply others.

#

Also fix bipod

rain crown
# velvet wing supports should get dmrs or more battle rifles

I really don’t like this idea. I think support’s class identity is pretty antithetical to the core identity of dmrs. That said, I’m also not sure how I feel about assault having dmrs either. I think it might make more sense for them to have smgs instead, but that’s beside the point.

Support’s whole thing is being able to put a lot of automatic fire on a target area for a long time. They’re not snipers. It’s true that support is sorely in need of weapon variety right now, but we already know that a whole bunch of new weapons for support are coming up. Giving support dmrs sounds to me like a band aid fix for lack of weapon variety more than anything.

velvet wing
#

Supports lock down areas with a lot of oppresive fire. DMRs are great at locking down lanes in general

#

they fit supports current playstyle excellently

calm swallow
#

Man... support class weapon wise feels really weak after so many adjustments and additions elsewhere in the game...

rain crown
# velvet wing Dmrs aren't supposed to be snipers

A dmr is a designated marksman rifle. It is not a suppressing fire weapon. It is a precision weapon. A DMR in real life is a squad level sniper rifle. In the game it’s a sniper rifle that trades volume of fire for damage. Support is going to be getting more weapons in the future, but dmrs just don’t fit with the class.

velvet wing
#

I personally don't care how a gun is in real life

#

the reality is DMRs are fantastic at holding down areas at range. Support is slow af and good at holding down areas

#

It just kind of fits currently

#

Now I agree, I'd prefer support just gets a bunch of weapons that aren't DMRs

#

but if you want a quick weapon boost, DMRs would fit pretty well currently

rain crown
velvet wing
#

Eh idk. I think the DMRs fit great. The G3 would be pretty fun as support in particular. But idk, they'll figure out what to do with support eventually

livid carbon
#

i mean there is an hk gun that's very similar to the g3, might even be an official hk version of the g3 idk but it's an lsw

#

fix bipod.

calm swallow
#

DMRs aren't a good support weapon category.

#

LMGs, LSWs, MMGs, HMGs.

livid carbon
rain crown
calm swallow
#

Medium Machine Gun

livid carbon
rain crown
#

Not super common anymore, technically. The terminology has gotten very convoluted over the years

iron cloud
#

Ditching the game finally. Reason? Devs being as out-of-touch with the initially great game as BF2042 was. And I hoped for it to be better for some reason...
Support received FOUR guns on launch. One of which is literally a copydice reskin w/embedded 40rndr.

And what do they add after THREE MONTHS of zero content? One more AR and one more DMR! Congratulations, now you have a dozen and one more! Why aren't you happy morons?!

So... That's the final straw. After controversal UI and balance changes and gun drought comparable only to aforementioned 2042, I'm returning to BF4. Yes, the game is old and limited when compared to BBR in technical terms, but, at the very least, I have guns to shoot with while using my favorite class there. Three or four times more, to be specific.

Maybe it would be seen by developers. Maybe they'll fix their minds... Albeit I highly doubt that given the recent event. Thanks for some well spent time (about 100+hrs with each gun), I'm leaving. Finally.

rain crown
calm swallow
livid carbon
#

k, but the mg42 is ackhschuhally an lmg and if you wanna get real specific it's the first umg, universal machine gun
vehicle mounted ✅ , squad automatic weapon ✅ and whatever else ✅

rain crown
calm swallow
#

Bait. Cope.

The major factor In considering something an LMG or MMG is the caliber. Ironically the MG 42 is AKSHUALLY a GPMG.

#

Though if we went solely off the round it fires and weight, it’s a MMG

livid carbon
calm swallow
#

Honestly though getting down to brass tacks, I don’t care what they classify anything as, just add more guns.

livid carbon
#

ye

calm swallow
#

And buff the usability of the mg36

#

Has way too much recoil for 5.56.

livid carbon
#

oh yes

flat sedge
flat sedge
# livid carbon what's an mmg?

it is the middle ground between a LMG/general purpose machine gun & a HMG (which definitions have changed over time, in WW1 & 2 it was about weight & crew size , more modern times it is caliber , as a example of a WW1/WW2 MMG the browning 50 cal without the water cooling jacket)

livid carbon
flat sedge
#

Again keep in mind the definition of the time I used

AKA "a example of a WW1/WW2 MMG"

#

Which directly relates to crew & weight

#

(AKA a one manned operated MG was a LMG generally(BAR), if it was a crew operated gun & had some weight, it was a MMG (Browning50 cal) and you get the idea of a HMG, more weight but equally it offered longer sustained fire on average)

#

in modern times the definition tends to refer to caliber alone

livid carbon
#

k whatever, i want my mg3 and then i'm happy that's all

flat sedge
#

Fair enough

#

I just want support to get one or two new weapons with the armor update at least

livid carbon
#

ye

flat sedge
#

(No offense I understand adding a new DMR, but a AR? We got more of those than LSGs,LMGs and DMRs combined)

rain crown
flat sedge
#

Kinda mixed on the L86, MG36 is up for debate

#

L86 wise is a 30 round on 775 RPM

#

MG36 offers better sustained fire for certain than the L86 (600 RPM on a bigger mag size of 40 if I recall correctly)

weary garden
#

question

#

if new weapons filled the same niche as current ones, would you guys be ok with "real life accurate" reworks for current weapons

meager salmon
#

thats dependant on the circumstances, but generally yes i prefer balancing a weapon within its primary real-life characteristics. RPM, Mag size, those are things we have actual numbers for for IRL guns. Damage, recoil, movement speed, all things that are assigned arbitrary numbers in a video game, so you can change those up (within a range) without making it "unrealistic" because theres no numerical IRL reference frame for those values in the first place

weary garden
#

I mainly mean RPM but yea

flat sedge
meager salmon
#

Mag size too. MG36 is a great example. The drum mag in game is very clearly a Cmag. Cmags are 100nd drums (even more ironically, the reload speed on the MG36 with the drum mag is exactly in-line with the 100rnd LMGs)

weary garden
#

Ignore mags bc that's fucked for every gun

#

but cool cool cool

meager salmon
#

true. but perhaps that just means it needs to be un-fucked for all the guns lol

#

especially quick-mags being smaller. thats not a quick mag, thats a short mag lmao

weary garden
#

depends on what you want to see first

flat sedge
meager salmon
#

true

meager salmon
flat sedge
meager salmon
#

nah it was even smaller before. quick mag got two extra rounds along with the RoF change lol

flat sedge
#

Ah

weary garden
#

Oki moment

#

I think he forgot that it increases recoil

flat sedge
#

still find that odd lol

#

I can understand possibly reducing control but increasing recoil less so

weary garden
#

control, the stat of all time

meager salmon
#

TBF, there arent many examples of quick mags being short mags in disguise, but they do exist and the 419 was and kinda still is especially egregious about it. its just part of a general trend of oki sort of discarding the essence of a guns or attachments name (and thus identity) for the sake of balancing

weary garden
flat sedge
weary garden
#

anyways I got what I needed you guys can go back to talking about DMR on support 😛

meager salmon
#

could. but instead didnt

#

DMRs on support; break G3 and Mk14 off into their own category (stats are already fine as is, as they arent really in-line with the actual DMRs anyway lol) and give that to support and assault instead of DMRs

#

i still think that makes by far the most sense with where the game currently is

flat sedge
#

take some of the hard hitting ARs & add them in there as well

meager salmon
#

Mk14 and G3 are never going to fit into the DMR category without either 1) the other DMRs suffering in terms of balancing, or 2) the G3 and Mk14 suffering in terms of balancing. shoehorning them in is just a bad idea

#

and BRs would absolutely fit the role of support. they arent DMRs and thus arent long range weapons, theyre just excellent medium range weapons. Support is just as much a medium range fighter as it is a frontline fighter

weary garden
#

SCAR and FAL are also technically battlerifles

#

just adding here

meager salmon
#

aye

weary garden
#

also, cool game thing, yyou can actually do weapons per class, it's not an entire weapon class thing

meager salmon
#

and they too are major outliers within the AR category

weary garden
#

have you guys tried the f2000 btw

meager salmon
#

and frankly, ive always thought they could both do with more velocity to compliment their high recoil-high damage philosophy. being in BRs with the Mk14 and G3 would allow them to have that

livid carbon
weary garden
#

conceptually, as a high rof low recoil low BTK what do y'all think of it

#

not how it is in game but conceptually

#

cuz we're all on the underpowered boat here

livid carbon
# weary garden have you guys tried the f2000 btw

tactical tuna looks hot af - on par with hot milsim dads (in your area right this fucking instant) - but feels like a cod gun, literally hit marker simulator, it kills so fucking slow, the only thing slower is the charging handel on the mg36

weary garden
#

not a great metric

#

but if you've tried new aug yknow

livid carbon
#

haven't tried it grrr
it's on my list tho

#

but nahhh it's a worse famas, how ever that may even be possible HyperXD

flat sedge
meager salmon
#

dont insult my famas you monster

flat sedge
clear maple
#

so hyped to see there was an update today with new weapons, and immediately disappointed to see support getting rawdogged again lmao

#

honestly tempted to just uninstall at this point

rain crown
clear maple
#

SoonTM

rain crown
# meager salmon and BRs would absolutely fit the role of support. they arent DMRs and thus arent...

I really do think it would be a mistake adding guns to support that aren’t LSW/SAWs or machine guns. Assuming a battle rifle category was created for weapons like the G3, FAL, Scar-H, and Mk14, they still don’t fit with support.

What support does need (and what we know it’s getting) is more variety within the weapon classes it does have access to. LSWs and machine guns with more variance in their fire rates, damage, and other stats.

flat sedge
#

just feel they should've priotized a support option for this patch over another AR

gilded canopy
#

Idk why ppl are so against support having DMR's :((

rain crown
#

It just doesn’t fit with what the class is meant to do. It doesn’t make any more sense than it would to give assault the M249.

flat sedge
#

I am fully okay with support getting DMRs or potentionally just a new class labeled battle rifles

flat sedge
#

if defensive play, I can see a DMR doing some work at distancing people in situtions

#

if holding a area, similar idea but I can see where you are coming from abit more

#

if only sustained fire this brings issues with some of the other guns like the L86 being in conflict as well

rain crown
#

A DMR? No, I don’t think so. But a higher damage, lower fire rate machine gun like the M240? Absolutely. Slap a magnified optic on top and go nuts.

flat sedge
#

Might as well break down the reasoning bob

rain crown
#

The reasoning for what? Which part?

flat sedge
#

your reasoning on the no dmrs for support

rain crown
#

It just doesn’t fit with support’s class identity. A DMR is a marksman weapon. Yes it can hold areas relatively well, but that’s by using accurate shots, not a large amount of fire. They aren’t rapid firing weapons in the grand scheme of things.

Support’s whole deal is building a fort, getting inside, and then putting more bullets and ammunition down range than anyone else can. High precision and accuracy are not what support is built for. Volume of fire is.

flat sedge
rain crown
#

When it comes to combat specifically, support’s identity is definitely more based on heavy automatic fire, though.

flat sedge
#

For me I can see with those definition DMRs can support the squad against ranged targets

rain crown
#

A DMR wouldn’t be particularly strong on support because it lacks the magazine capacity to do what it would need to anyway. And support doesn’t need to reach out hundreds of meters and fight snipers either.

rain crown
flat sedge
#

I would also add the fact with how various systems work

#

you tend to as a support trying to do your idea

#

gets shot & killed as the enemies may have one or two go down

#

be it that is beside the point

rain crown
#

One of the bigger points is that dmrs don’t have the capacity to provide suppressing fire the way the rest of the support guns do. You would want a machine gun like the M240 for that, which would have higher damage and lower fire rate than, say, the M249. To make up for the massively increased ammunition capacity and overall firepower, it has shorter range and worse handling than a DMR would.

flat sedge
#

Well issue is suppressing fire in this game isn't that good in most cases

rain crown
#

I don’t mean suppressing fire as in the mechanic which darkens your screen a bit, I mean firing a shitload of bullets where the enemy is so they can’t maneuver without being hit.

flat sedge
#

Like only cases I have found myself using it, is a M249 or such in furgis subway

#

and I get what you mean

#

that is the only suppressing fire in this game

#

similar to Destiny 2's sweet business

rain crown
flat sedge
#

Forgot some HE rounds everey 20th shot

#

just splash guys near those corners

royal hare
inner monolith
flat sedge
fringe tree
#

Assault can use dmrs too, faster reload and ads

rain crown
flat sedge
#

but recon drone wise I do find it tends towards being easily shot down if anyone notices it

rain crown
#

I’m not totally sure I like assault having dmrs anyway

#

Smgs would make more sense imo

flat sedge
#

Agreed

#

Personally would like weapon choice to be more class based (think BF1)

#

give them their own preferred ranges type idea

zenith carbon
#

The only classes for which this really applies is recon and support

#

But assault, medic and engi all get to enjoy everything else in the game

gilded dock
#

For the longest time, Assault straight up just had assault rifles, with, what, one exception?

flat sedge
#

no exception beside ARs & the various secondaries

heavy sage
#

medic and engineer get way to many weapon categorys

inner monolith
# heavy sage medic and engineer get way to many weapon categorys

Does engi even need DMRs? Feels a bit too strong tbh. Atm you can tap someone and if they run to cover, you just pull out the ol' RPG and blow it open anyway. You can also use the RPG to clear out trees and other stuff that breaks your sightlines. And when they're set up in some high hill raining death on vehicles, it's also hard to dislodge them as they can tap anyone trying to approach.

heavy sage
#

yeah engineer has to many categorys

#

heres my suggestion:

#

assault: Dmrs, pdws, battle rIfles (when they get added) ars. carbines

#

medic: smg, pdw, carbine, ar

gilded canopy
#

DMR's for support: good

#

thats my whole argument

heavy sage
#

engineer: smg, pdw, ar

gilded canopy
#

good: fun

meager salmon
#

why would assault get DMRs but not engi

#

hell, why would engi get SMGs

rain crown
meager salmon
#

i think SMGs should be assaults thing

inner monolith
heavy sage
#

support; lmg, lsw, battle rifle

rain crown
heavy sage
#

recon : sniper and dmr

#

fine replace smg with dmr for engineer

meager salmon
#

yeah. you dont design a class to contradict itself lol

inner monolith
rain crown
#

support should not have battle rifles. It does not make sense. They’re getting more MGs and LSWs anyway which will fill those gaps

rain crown
meager salmon
#

like, if we are getting real real, DMRs should frankly be a recon only thing

inner monolith
rain crown
#

Take sniper rifles away from recon, too synergistic. Take lmgs away from support, too synergistic.

heavy sage
meager salmon
#

because not only are marksmans the only people to ever deploy with marksman rifles, recon has such awful armour options that any other class getting DMRs makes DMRs on recon pointless

inner monolith
rain crown
heavy sage
#

remove guns from the game

#

they are too powerful at range

rain crown
meager salmon
#

its just got such awful armour and gadgets that playing on squad-level means your constantly getting your head blown off

heavy sage
#

id be fine with dmrs being a recon only thing if recon was less of a shit class

rain crown
meager salmon
#

lol fair

#

but honestly, recon is a shit class for no good reason

#

it has 12 armour

#

full-stop

#

all of its armours have 12 durability, and it can only equip empty helms

rain crown
meager salmon
#

WAITING

#

(im hyped for this)

rain crown
#

Stay on topic lmao

meager salmon
#

neva

timid night
woven fossil
#

Just did some testing in community servers
Yes the raised exo helmet does have an accurate hitbox, so it is literally a flat disadvantage to run for no reason, it doesnt protect your face.

We tried sniping through the eyeholes of the RU adidas visor but either that helmet has protection over the eyehole or the bullet is too big to fit in the eyeslot

flat sedge
# heavy sage heres my suggestion:

mine are
Leader(There is only one, might as well allow some options) : Everything but LMGs & snipers
Assault(CQC focused) ; ARs. PDWs,SMGs and Carbines
Medic(Jack of all trades but master of none) : ARs, and dmrs (possibly carbines as well)
Engineer(mixed options to suit various situations) : ARs,SMGs, and battle rifles
Support (Defensive play spec with a focus on heavier weapons) : LSGs, LMGs and battle rifles
Recon (both marksman & force recon) : DMRs, Snipers,PDWs and carbines

edity edit : forgot SMGs

livid carbon
#

smgs just vanished

heavy sage
#

if assault is cqc then why dont they get smgs

weary garden
#

bro forgot smgs existed

#

This was his smg nerf

flat sedge
#

I knew I forgot something lol

#

made that durning some EDF + 12 midnight

#

sec

#

@livid carbon @heavy sage @weary garden fixed my mistake

livid carbon
flat sedge
#

I would personally add it

livid carbon
#

yes but oki is oki kittenCry
"it's intended" yeah why oki why kittenCry

weary garden
#

This is a neat list

#

Idk how mnedic DMR would go

#

and battlerifle on support seems dangerous

flat sedge
#

Battle rifle is a case of giving them a 3rd category that offers some extra range/ a different style to the others while still keeping to the defensive play & heavy weapon idea

weary garden
flat sedge
#

I would also rework the way medic self heal works

#

but that has been discussed in other feedbacks

#

but for short answer
rework the self heal to be a worse combat heal but infinite option

weary garden
#

I would give medic carbine just to let all classes have 3 gun types

weary garden
flat sedge
weary garden
#

So just bandage

#

Except shots interrupt it

#

Eh

#

Not a bad concept but too tired to think about it

kind geyser
#

littlebird armed unusable now 😦

brittle oak
#

Nah just higher barrier to entry

#

Also ehy in this thread?

gilded canopy
#

How op would be to let support and medic get back their boxes?

#

would solve the issue of making support and (more rarely) medic not useless at preforming their roles and it prevents box spam from bf

brittle oak
#

Medic can

#

So support should too

gilded canopy
#

Bruh, kinda vent and devs are dropping awesome content lately and making so much good progress in the game but

There is always a fuck-up with support, it really seems like Oki just dont like the class and tries to work on it as less as possible fdafdadfdfd

Again, im glad of the new changes and im impressed about the fast-peace updates being so good, it just feels kinda weird how he implements a top system, and support is nowere shown there, implements the ammo box system, and it is still lacking in comparison to the medic one... the lack of weapons and the absolute awful state that it was at the launch... idk man :s

tight narwhal
#

One message removed from a suspended account.

flat sedge
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but to sum it up

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Remove the ability to gain additional boxes but any gadget increases is effectively a extra +100% to the box's capacity

woven fossil
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This helmet literally serves zero purpose. it is a flat downgrade of every other exo helmet. same slow stats but no face armor.

image.png
paper vector
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Are you sure that this actually makes any difference?

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It would make sense that all exo helmets shared the same hitbox.

royal hare
weary garden
brittle oak
shell hound
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Yeah, there's armor hit boxes for helmets.

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Facemasks are part of the varying hitbox, and lifted ones like that are useless to all but shots from above.

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Same with the ear covers on some helmets.

weary garden
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Every day the armor system gets even stupider

snow python
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Needs a serious revamp

weary garden
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Adding to the list

Fix Bipod
Fix Armor
Add Support Guns

shell hound
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I wish I was.

woven fossil
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After further armor testing

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It appearst he Exo Shoulderpads do not actually have their own hitbox. Its just the vest

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However it seems as though the high collar on the neck of exo does have a hitbox.

rain crown
woven fossil
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From what I can tell the armor hitboxes work like this.

image.png
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and also posssiibbllyy the shoulder straps on the vests. but hard to tell.

Either way we have these huge damn shoulderpads that dont do anything.

royal hare
woven fossil
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yeah the front was very weird to actually get an armor plink for some reason .

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either the hand hitbox is too huge or the bullet projectiles collide with it

shadow walrus
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The not being able to build in spawns thing is a little too wide imo. there are some points in dom and conquest where the entire obj is a spawn point and it really snuffs creativity when defending.

gilded dock
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Exo armor needs to at least partially cover the limbs

meager cypress
heavy sage
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support is way to slow

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the armor make u to slow

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most of the guns ads so slow that you can get killed 3 times before you are even looking through your sight

flat sedge
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(effectively Support tries to be Nurgle without nurgle's upsides)

heavy sage
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theirs no way to replenish armor yet the armor still gives debuffs when destroyed

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generally just a shit class

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i want to like support

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but its just utterly dogshit right now

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the replenishing ammo thing was nice

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but a lot more needs to be done to support

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before it is viable

flat sedge
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to sum it up, Support tries to be like a nurgle playstyle ( Slow, durable and heavy hitting when setup) without any of the upsides and only a one time durable (where nurgle has regeneration to help keep their durability between fights)

woven fossil
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What support should be is actually very simple, but itd be very easy to make too op.

"Slow class in exchange for very good [firepower or defense]"
the firepower is lacking and the armor is too

flat sedge
heavy sage
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way too slow class in exchange for shitty firepower AND defense

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there are 0 positives

dusty plinth
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Support should be able to replenish and resupply body armor as well.

velvet shoal
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Please allow supports to use more than just LSGs and LMGs. Submachine guns or Marksman rifles would really open up options and encourage more people to play it.

meager salmon
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SMG would be interesting with how slow support is lol
tho i think it doesnt really fit the class. And it seems Oki intends for the class to specifically be machinegunner, so i dont think theres much hope for anything other than LSWs and LMGs

flat sedge
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I would say I am up for giving them battle rifles & the like

meager salmon
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as am i, but ive heard a few times that oki just isnt up for it

flat sedge
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on one hand true, on the other he changed his mind on bandage healing

meager salmon
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because he knew he wasnt gonna win that one

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and actually what we wanted was medic nerfed, not everyone else buffed

flat sedge
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He could've just added a dedicated heal gadget over bandage heals

meager salmon
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i remember when it was just medic that could heal. what we have now is significantly more arcadey and chaotic

flat sedge
meager salmon
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some people like it, but it was also a step away from ever getting a milsim mode

flat sedge
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equally it has reduced revives

meager salmon
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but as far as that relates to support, we better be careful what we wish for. instead of buffing support he could just give everyone the LMGs and LSWs lmao

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"ITS FAIR NOW BITCH"

flat sedge
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(Support : "More guns?"
Okri : "more guns."
Okri gives everyone access to LMGs & LSGs
Support : "Saddness")

meager salmon
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what youve done there is gone into the future and brought information from there back here. youve created a time loop

flat sedge
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hmm Time loops are always headaches

meager salmon
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wait give support time guns

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sends the enemy back 20 seconds in time

tight narwhal
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flat sedge
meager salmon
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that way they will only slightly outgun you next time

tight narwhal
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flat sedge
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spas ya mean?

tight narwhal
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meager salmon
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nah

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a spaztic kid

flat sedge
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also you ever looked into what spas means?

meager salmon
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now i dont want to

tight narwhal
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meager salmon
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that message gives a real foreboding vibe

flat sedge
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Sporting Purpose Automatic Shotgun

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aka SPAS

tight narwhal
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flat sedge
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so many guns

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Also may have to edit that section

tight narwhal
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flat sedge
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but yea I hope we get a RPD

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Well wiki is still young

tight narwhal
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flat sedge
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so it is a mix of figuring out how to do various things is happening

hot solar
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only real way to play this class is to run medium armor, exo is more of a liability then a help after 1 fight, and heavy armor is just the worse armor class super slow with little health increases.

flat sedge
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I will say Support will get better once armor repairing gets added or if they adjust how it breaks

tight narwhal
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flat sedge
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But still will have the current weaknesses of the whole your arms get infront of the chest when ADSed (Arms & legs don't reduce damage or are armored)

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One big box that can be picked up after deployed

hot solar
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i rather have none breaking armor that just has a damage reduction
of course it would need a lot of work to balance but it really make armor useful

tight narwhal
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hot solar
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dropped medkits heal to slow but i think this discussion is for a different chat

tight narwhal
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hot solar
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oh no your fine you were using it to add on to what you were saying about ammo boxes i was mainly saying that to myself lol

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what i said had nothing to do with support

dusty plinth
tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
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There simply needs to be a greater varieity of LSW's and MG's which seems to be on the horizon but I'm confused as to why they aren't held to priority when Assualt, Engineer, and Medic are already stacked with weaponry.

zenith carbon
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Frfr

tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
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Weaponry relative to each class needs a rebalance as firearms tend to carry weight for the classes they're assigned to; PDW's aren't typically carried by anti-infantry (Assault class) soliders and Engineers don't carry DMR's and thus I believe both should be removed from such.

velvet shoal
tight narwhal
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meager salmon
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man ive been saying to give really heavy anti material rifles to recon for FOREVER

dusty plinth
# tight narwhal One message removed from a suspended account.

DMR's are commonly carried by both Anti-Infantry and Recon soldier's thus it makes sense for them to carry such, but an Engineer's role doesn't require them to engage in longer-range precision-based combat, thus I don't believe they should have access to DMR's.

meager salmon
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move m200 to that category as its entry-level, dealing a lil more damage to things like quads and LBs

tight narwhal
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meager salmon
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like, you gonna move real slow with them, probably as slow as support, but you can start poking armour if it gets real campy

tight narwhal
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meager salmon
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aye

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support needs almost as much attention as the MSR T_T

dusty plinth
tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
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Both Medics and Engineers count as "Support" classes because their primary goal is to provide aid to anti-infantry soliders.

tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
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Ironically the M249 is designed to be used on the frontlines -- why games consistently design the Support class to be a more passive and stationary role makes no sense to me.

tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
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I think the issue is the role of Automatic Rifleman and Machine Gunner is often combined to make the "Support class" because of their similar attirbutes but the reality of it is, the solider than carries the M249 and the solider that carries the M240B are typically tasked with different roles and placed at different points of the battlefield.

meager salmon
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because IRL people dont throw away their own life to YOLO a single machinegunner

tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
tight narwhal
meager salmon
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or discussing your differences over a cup of tea

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(ive done this with an enemy before. BBR is golden i swear)

tight narwhal
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dusty plinth
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There needs to be enough realism and enough fiction for the game to both retain it's immersion but be entertaining in a casual sense.

Right now it seems it's leaning more toward to casual side which would be fine if this game was attempting to compete with Call Of Duty.

meager salmon
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this game isnt competing with anything

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its doing its own thing

dusty plinth
# meager salmon its doing its own thing

Kind of but for the most part, no it isn't.

The game heavily takes after the Battlefield franchise but also impliments many Mil-Sim aspects to give it a breath of fresh air.

tight narwhal
dusty plinth
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The irony is the extreme medic meta is more comical than the blocky and cartoony graphics.

tight narwhal
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shadow walrus
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am i the only one who feels like an unwanted stepchild playing support

weary garden
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no

shadow walrus
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it got even worse when 2 new weapons got added but neither for support

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oh wiat this is the feedback channel

shadow walrus
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on namak they blew out the wall to the building

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many of the walls as you can see. feels kinda bad to be denied this kind of clever use of the building

weary garden
shadow walrus
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i know its not a support only issue but, as the instabuilder it feels like one of supports main themes

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i c

weary garden
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so it's not neccessarily unable to build on obj but unable to build on spawn locations

weary garden
shadow walrus
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crying and sobbing

weary garden
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yup

flat sedge
flat sedge
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Also I do hope we get a RPD as well (I love that gun)

weary garden
quartz scaffold
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Here is a list of issues I have noticed while playing mainly support:

  • In the rush game mode you never get enough points to build stuff, this makes the main benefit of insta build almost useless.
  • Lack of guns, but this is already known
  • Only the L86 feels like a viable weapon, the others are very underwhelming, in particular the ultimax
  • Running speed is major pain point, even if you use the lightest Armor and L86

Everything else, is very much fine, playing support is lot's of fun and being able to give the team cover or fortify a location is realty enjoyable.

But, with the new changes to the builds spawn rules, reinforcing an objective is way harder than it used to be, because many doorway and window can't be barricated now because you get the error "you can build on spawn point"

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One last thing is, I would love to see a zipline option to build ziplines as the support.
Kinda like the hesco wall is exclusive to support.

Or, if possible, the abily to build mini bridges, or rooftops.

Or more simply, give us planks and nails, so that I can build bridges between two building.

meager cypress
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I'll counter with: the new ultimax is awesome, you just wont win dps races with it

tight narwhal
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zenith carbon
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the ultimax is a shining light

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honestly i really do like most of them (even the l86, which i personally kinda hate playing with) - if bipods worked better and we had more reliable options for some type of walking-fire suppression mode that would be nice

meager cypress
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tbh since the ultimax redux it still wins most dps races its just harder because you need to hit all them headshots
but its probably the nastiest weapon in the game at medium range that isnt strapped to a humvee

dusty plinth
meager cypress
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it feels like 300 but its probably high 100's to mid 200's
BBR ranges are weird

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one of the problems with finally getting the kriss nerfed was people claiming laser ranges that were longer than reality

velvet wing
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Give support a comically large backpack

shell hound
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More than what it already has?

gilded canopy
weary fog
empty acorn
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I've seen various opinions about support, with some saying it's "garbage". After having played support a lot withy trusty 249, here's my take.

In this game, as it is now , support acts as literal support. Slow and bulky, but can bring the pain. It isn't meant for run and gun, instead raining down hellfire.

I just had a match where I tore through half their team because they funneled through the same small area. Support can be incredible, but it's situational.

Imo, if we want support to be viable for everyone, it needs two things.

  1. Movement speed buff. Whether people agree or not, no one wants to play as a class that takes half the match to get from point A to point B.

  2. Access to PDWs. The class shouldn't be limited to only support based weapons. Imo we should be promoting gameplay variety, and giving support players the option to run and gun like assault and medic.

weary fog
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And only to have point b get capped, and then need to run to C, which is already capped but enemy back-capped A and your team left all the humvees and quads scattered at D for some reason XD

dusty plinth
# empty acorn I've seen various opinions about support, with some saying it's "garbage". After...

I agree with #1 but disagree with #2.

Giving Support PDW's is not promoting gameplay variety, in fact it's doing the exact opposite which you actually unintentially pointed out -- the "run and gun" playstyle shouldn't be seamlessly handed down through every class, allowing Support access to the games current meta weapons only allows for people to play exactly how people play Medic and Engineer currently only with unlimited ammo and grenades to spam.

Gameplay variety would actually be giving classes less access to weaponry and equipment which would incentivize people to choose different classes and segregate roles, the only class that should heavily promote RnG playstyles is Assault given it's title and the gadgets that they use.

empty acorn
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BF3 and 4 gave support access to other guns and it went off fine. I don't see a legitimate reason for limiting support to only LMGs

dusty plinth
dusty plinth
empty acorn
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What downside is there to letting support run PDWs?

dusty plinth
empty acorn
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As it stands now, there is hardly any class variety. The primary class you see people run is medic or assault. Support and recon aren't as popular.

Now, under no circumstances do I want recon given access to other guns, that is a recipe for diaster. However, there are zero downsides to giving support PDWs. I guarantee you, can even promise you, if support had PDWs, we'd see a lot more support players.

#

Movement speed aside, not everyone likes LMGs or wants to use them.

dusty plinth
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No PDW or SMG should be a 3-shot-kill.

empty acorn
#

They're not meta weapons though. They are normal weapons, like all the others.

All Support getting PDW's means is meta weapons with unlimited ammo.

So you're okay with LMGs having unlimited ammo as support, but not PDWs.

dusty plinth
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Unless we're discussing hotshots of course.

empty acorn
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I think you're also forgetting that "unlimited ammo" as support doesn't really exist. It's not a simple left click hold to give yourself ammo like you can as medic.

dusty plinth
empty acorn
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Look, I'm not interested in debating alledged meta weapons, I just want support to be more viable. and one way of doing that is giving them access to PDWs. No class should be limited to only one category of weapons. Even recon has snipers and DMRs.

dusty plinth
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Then suggest for Support to have access to DMR's and Battle Rifles; of all things why suggest the games current meta?

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Support is designed around being a slower-paced, position-holding class, that doesn't need to change- rebalanced, sure, but DMR's and Battle Rifles having excellent range and being heavy-hitters adhere to how the class is designed to be played as well.

PDW's don't.

empty acorn
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lol DMRs, hell no

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Meta =/ over powered.

#

Yes, support is generally a "support" class, but that doesn't mean it should be limited to only that

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Assault class is intended to be assault, but not everyone plays it that way. Same thing with support. People can play a class however they want.

dusty plinth
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It does.

Even if it has variying types of weapons. It should promote a certain role.

empty acorn
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You've yet to really explain how support having PDWs is such a bad thing. All you've said is "potential infinite ammo", which is false.

empty acorn
dusty plinth
# empty acorn You've yet to really explain how support having PDWs is such a bad thing. All y...

Because it goes against the role of Support, you yourself stated you want to "run and gun" which is literally in the Assualt classes title.

Also, the amount of ammo a single crate can provide to a person outweighs arguing semantics. It's pretty easy to run out of ammo with SMG's and PDW's, thus being able to completely resupply yourself several times over with a weapon that has almost zero downsides is pretty overpowered.

dusty plinth
empty acorn
# dusty plinth Because it goes against the role of Support, you yourself stated you want to "ru...

So, by your logic, if I want to be a team player and provide ammo to my team, I should be forced to use guns I might not like, be in the mood for, or even enjoy using? I am genuinely so confused by your takes, because they make no sense at all. If I had said to give SMGs, or even assault rifles to support, I am 100% sure you would have come up with some other reason to say "support should be limited."

Gameplay variety has never hurt anyone. Classes having access to different tyes of guns has never hurt anyone. Stop slapping support players in the face with "you chose to be this stupid class, you can use stupid guns that are only meant for bipodding".

dusty plinth
# empty acorn So, by your logic, if I want to be a team player and provide ammo to my team, I ...

"if I want to be a team player and provide ammo to my team, I should be forced to use guns I might not like, be in the mood for, or even enjoy using?"

Yes, that's exactly how class-based shooters work. There should be clear downsides to every class.

"If I had said to give SMGs, or even assault rifles to support, I am 100% sure you would have come up with some other reason to say "support should be limited."

SMG's and PDW's are practically the same weapons and are both meta in this game, Assault Rifles could still adhere to the classes purpose, so I wouldn't have an issue with that.

"Gameplay variety has never hurt anyone."

Your deifnition of such is what killed 2042 and is the issue with this current game.

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Specifically referencing PDW's for Support makes zero sense as they don't align with the role's purpose at all.

The Groza is a pocket cannon and the P90 is a laser beam- to me it just sounds like you want to run and gun with the games best weapons without the downside of worrying about loosing ammo.

snow python
#

The Support suffers from am EXTREME lack of weapon variety, I know it's tempting to say, give me these guns but would it really make the class feel distinct

#

I actually think we should get Shotguns
https://youtu.be/gJ5xDfIjjKQ?si=ZMELEgXGrp7nKQy5

YouTube
Arch
SHOTGUNS: The Right Tool for the Wrong Player

Can make all the differences in the world, Mr Freeman
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⍜ SUPPORTER TIER PATRONS: - THANK YOU! -
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zenith carbon
# dusty plinth "if I want to be a team player and provide ammo to my team, I should be forced t...

reading this over after the fact but lots of nodding

serious note: support isn't incompetent at its job. It's pretty fucking good at it. giving it weapons like ARs and SMGs just means 'hey it's finally our time to do... the same thing everyone else is'. there's a reason why the guy carrying ammo and heavy weapons is the slowest - it eventually forces inf to stop, and gives powerful defensive advantages.

If you really, really want more weapon variety - shotguns and battle rifles. the former is extremely limited range but offers more mobile supports pushing with their squads effective personal defence; the latter has strong mid-to-long range performance but doesn't have the supreme suppression nor mag benefits of an LMG (which should be scaled up tbh. suppression barely exists and it's infuriating)

#

but you can't just like. make every class get everything they want. because then you don't have a class-based shooter, you have a loadout picker with mild restrictions

gilded canopy
#

Please just give us the DMR's ;;v;;

shell hound
#

2042 died because it tried to shove a hero shooter into a game series that has always been a class choice shooter, and did it in the dumbest ways possible. Support flat out needs additional content to equal out the amount of gameplay variance that every other class has currently, even if it's just one additional class of weapon like DMRs or Battle Rifles.

livid carbon
#

gib rpk and mg3 kat
also fix bipod and bring scorpion to assault.

gilded canopy
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mp5 with bipod

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and x4 scope pls

weary garden
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@empty acorn the main reason to avoid support getting other classes guns is exo armor. DMR exo, SMG exo, repairable armor, they're all held back to the frustration potential of a fast moving or fast killing or whatever exo armor player. I like the concept, and I feel like recon would benefit for the same thing for similar reasons, but until exo isn't a tank, exo is just stuck being slow by nature of game balance

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The class does need new weapons, which could provide class playstyle variety but we're too limited by the 4 we have

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As for your class upside, while the potential is there, the class suffers from an undervalued and rare niche, which can be helped by movespeed buffs, no argument there. Just not sure if it hits the root

livid carbon
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what about fixing your armor kat

weary garden
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Also held back until exo armor isn't the way it is

velvet wing
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Give support a pug mask

dusty plinth
# zenith carbon but you can't just like. make every class get everything they want. because then...

Which is what I was trying to explain; additionally- which ironically earlier on I stated Battle Rifles and/or DMR's made the most sense to be given to Support- is that the weapons have to coincide with the actual role. PDW's and SMG's for Support make absolutely zero sense and coming from someone who used them extensively to level up, the only issue is that you can run out of ammo quickly due to their high fire rates and limited mags unless you sacrifice speed for heavier vests that can carry more ammo which goes against the desire to "run and gun".

Call my a skeptic but all that tells me is he desires to run around freely with PDW's and SMG's without having to worry about resupplying ammo which just further extends the games meta rather than actually offering gameplay variety.

#

Technically however, there are distinct differences between LSW's, LMG's, and MMG's, the third coming to BattleBit in the near future; the issue being the balancing of how these weapons perform against other categories.

As I've stated many times, the Support class seems to be a joint between Automatic Rifleman and Machine Gunner military classes, but just because they both carry loads of ammunition and "machine guns", that doesn't mean their roles are similar and can easily have their lines blurred.

dusty plinth
twilit nimbus
#

the experience I have had with support make's it come off as very inconsistent some times you can get shot at and either tank the hits or your armor is melted in half a second I think that the support is to frail to justify how slow it is and not tanky enough to justify the lack of speed and I'm operating under the assumption that you're wearing exo armor the support's armor shouldn't be able to be completely vaporized in half a second by an smg you should be able to take a lot more punishment considering that you're encouraged by you're equipment to stifle and suppress incoming pushes I just think that the only change support need right now is an increase to the classes durability.

empty acorn
empty acorn
# weary garden <@258102752717045761> the main reason to avoid support getting other classes gun...

Then get rid of op exo armor. shrug Support shouldn't be a tank/brute class, this isn't an MMO nor a survival shooter. Support needs to become more viable, and the only way of doing that is giving it access to other guns. Absolutely no one wants 24/7 gunplay with an LMG. They are fun for a while, but they aren't something you want to use the entire time you play. The "solution" shouldn't be "play another class" or "give them DMRs."

DMRs are fun if you enjoy it and enjoy having a trigger finger. Most people don't.

zenith carbon
#

It’s not that no one wants to play slower or more defensively. It’s that the game is currently structured to overly privilege aggressive chickenshit gameplay. Sure, this will make support more ‘viable’, in the sense it will make it competitive with aggressive chickenshit gameplay, but it’ll just make the game less varied, less interesting and less fun

Support doesn’t need to become a gimped ass assault. Support needs more ways to perform its current role (defensive supporting fire + ammo provision). If you want to do that, the last thing you do is give it ARs

But if you just succumb to the logic that battlebit is how it is and can’t change then while we’re at it, why not give recon the AR too? Because some people don’t want to do recon’s job of reconaissance and tracking with snipers, no, they’re being punished for not being good at snipers! The woe

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You know, come to think of it, i think the class system’s very unfair for variety and ease. Let’s just remove all the classes and give players a third gadget slot featuring all the formerly class specific gadgets they want

woven fossil
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if we're gonna be slow as hell we need more firepower and/or defense its literally that simple.

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either make exo armor good or make these guns have much better ttks or control

zenith carbon
#

Or slow down the main ‘assault’ classes as it were somehow

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maybe we should reduce base ammo on some of the vests?

weary garden
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And I'm trying to

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But people like exo armor and oki doesn't want to remove stuff people use

woven fossil
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With how many extra bandages people carry now, the heavy ammo kit could probably use more points for bandies

zenith carbon
#

Oh def

paper vector
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Right now I can understand that it could get a bit repetitive but that can be changed

high gate
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it doesn't matter how tanky it makes you when you basically can't cross the street in sandy, and your limbs are still fully exposed

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

paper vector
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It does not do that but it wouldn’t be too OP if it did

livid carbon
#

@woeful linden

BBRSUPPORTBINGOsupportsuxtm.png
woeful linden
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Ok, that's pretty good LOL

livid carbon
#

here's the empty one if you'd like to

BBRSUPPORTBINGO.png
weary garden
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Support is a dead class man

livid carbon
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it isn't.

ok maybe... but hope dies last ok man kittenCry
no need to destroy my love for it that hard

woeful linden
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I see usually 1 of them per squad in my games generally, but still. These guys need more guns LOL

#

Even giving Engis the ability to slap EXO helmets back on their Supp friends's heads would be a good buff to Supp tbh

weary garden
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that's just not coming soon

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Might just take a break from the game and come back when they decide to drop the support update that was promised back in EA

livid carbon
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i need that mg3 and aug hbar lol

woeful linden
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Need that M60 with 50 dmg and 10 meter damage dropoff start, and also a minimum damage of 48, at 500 rpm and dog handling.

weary garden
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yea

#

see you guys in 4 months then

livid carbon
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42dmg, 1200rpm and 2 v-recoil/1.6 h-recoil

weary garden
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1 for each gun

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assuming support gun is even chosen

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and not just another smg

livid carbon
flat sedge
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but yea, I am still unsure why they chose to focus on a new AR over a new LSG/LMG

woeful linden
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ARs are very easy to make, and there are a lot of them in the military for good reason. Primary weaponry!

weary garden
flat sedge
flat sedge
weary garden
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Stay hopeful man, I'm not

flat sedge
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To clarify

#

I meant we had ones in the work in progress list

gilded dock
royal hare
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the guns they focus on first should be the ones missing from the support pack which was the F2000 and 2 LMG/SGs

weary garden
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Actually on the pack are more guns

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They're just not greyed out

royal hare
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wym?

dusty plinth
# royal hare

Top one is certainly the M60, the bottom one kind of like the Type-88 but it could also be the PKM.

weary garden
woven fossil
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after 135 ish hours of support and less than 15 on any other class I have prestiged back to rank 1

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so Oki, you can add the new LMGs now since i wont be able to use them yet

gilded canopy
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FDDSADSDFSADS im trying to play other classes but feel like im giving my back to the team (?

violet smelt
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MG3 when, I cry

livid carbon
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i need that gun, desperatly
there has to be a reason for supports running around blasting Erika and making smg medfucks fear us

violet smelt
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But yes, support desperately needs more weapons. It doesn't help that 1 out of 4 is basically dead in the water.

livid carbon
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make that 2/4 and if you wanna be real harsh only the ultimax does what it's supposed to 😦

snow python
gilded canopy
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Now its mostly that im getting bored of the same 4 weapons without having any progression, already unlocked everything dffdafds

snow python
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I just hate being punished by the armour system for playing a class I enjoy. I'm honestly tired of being punished for existing.

livid carbon
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literally, tried using support with the m249, the only viable gun is ultimax, everything else sucks about the class, we need more guns and better armor

violet smelt
livid carbon
dry bobcat
snow python
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Feels like that sometimes

woven fossil
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There's pretty much no reason to use an LSW aside from reload and running speed. LMGs are just better

flat sedge
flat sedge
slender surge
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I love support, I wish it was more dynamic ❤️

empty acorn
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Day 4 of asking for support to be granted access to PDWs or SMGs, whichever is deemed better balance wise.

gilded canopy
empty acorn
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Give DMRs to assault then, but give support PDWs. It's not going to kill anyone if support has more weapon variety in that regard.

gilded canopy
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I woudnt mind having PDW's / SMG's tho, but please DMR's ;;w;;

#

more now than ever when we have the G3

empty acorn
# gilded canopy Support is supposed to be mid-range in the back of the battle, thats exactly wha...

You can't provide said support with a DMR. Support is provided with an LMG or full auto weapon. Not to mention, support gives ammo on the frontlines. You can't give ammo at medium range. I'm not opposed to support get both DMRs AND PDWs, but if it's only one, it has to be full auto category.

I'm not trying to limit DMRs, this isn't even about them. I just want better weapons for support. I'm tired of lugging LMGs halfway across the map and taking FOREVER to ADS.

woven fossil
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give support flamethrowers grenlaserhyper

meager salmon
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only if friendly fire

snow python
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GIVE SUPPORT SHOTGUNS

woeful linden
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@ DMRs for Support

#

tl;dr,

the actual role for volume of fire down a firing lane simply does not exist in this game. There's the main problem: people will CLAP BACK and KILL YOU if you're just holding mouse1. An actual bipod would fix this issue because they would not be able to compare to the LMG user's accuracy, a better suppression system would fix this issue because it'd force the irl effects of LMG's role onto the character.

As of now, ARs let me fulfill the role of 'accurate rapid fire down a lane at an enemy,' from nearly any class, BUT:
DMR is the only thing that lets me fulfill the 'lock down a sight line' role because it allows me to do that at a range just outside of CLAP BACK reach of ARs, or with a greater deadly accuracy than ARs at mid range. I can suppress window dwellers and blunt advances in a way that other guns can't. DMRs as they are right now in the current gun ecosystem would be right at home with Support.

gilded canopy
woeful linden
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In lieu of a working fucking bipod so that LMGs could actually play from behind their team (increased range to avoid CLAP BACK) or do the lock down a line of sight meme (increased accuracy to outgun), give 'em the DMRs!

dry bobcat
meager salmon
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im still on the "add proper suppression mechanics" train

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tho, the way i see it, that was sort of fucked over the moment Oki decided to buff all the other classes instead of properly nerfing medic (people wanted medic nerfed) by giving people a way to just... ignore the consequences of getting yourself shot out of carelessness

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now that he's taken away the consequences for getting shot, i worry that that only leaves rather intrusive suppression mechanics as our options

fierce dawn
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Yeah there's basically no downside for a sniper just sitting there even if they're eating like three bullets at long range to line up the m200+ranger barrel headshot.

#

You basically need some kind of suppression mechanic or support will never be able to do its job since recons outnumber them massively

dry bobcat
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"I'll pretend that I didn't hear that" - oki

zenith carbon
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support and recon tamp down game pace by their inherent structure so suppression is a good extension in any case

meager salmon
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nah, the bandaging shit hurt snipers as well. Honestly, it made the game as a whole more cheesable. at Early Access release, the game did "do stupid shit, get stupid prizes" really well. If you run around in the open and get sniped, even if its not a kill, you gotta find a medic now or you wont last long. That discouraged lone-wolf medics. If you run out of your fortified position, even if you make it, youll probably get shot. Thats a huge disadvantage in your next gunfight. That discouraged lone-wolf medics. And as a sniper, i can genuinely say I dont have to worry as much. I dont have to be as careful about taking stray rounds or direct sniper hits because i can just use a couple bandages, all hunky dory. It makes it easier for me to lone-wolf snipe. In my opinion, game flow was better before bandaging. It was a stupid addition that oki made because he himself plays SMG medic and didnt want to nerf that.
Not myself nor anyone else I played with wanted other classes to have self healing, we just wanted medics to not have it. But now everyone has it, risk-assessment and risk-management is hardly a thing, and the game plays not all that differently from other AAA shooters except the bleeding, which is way more of a gimmick than a feature than it used to be

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but i digress, give support 10 bandages. we get shot a fuck tonne compared to other classes. partly because we are slower than a drunkard stumbling home, partly because its our job to get shot more. give us something to justify our slow-asses

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(also ill throw this here; fuck off with the reduced bleed-out timers. That shit just serves to make the game play more like every other shooter out there. Stop making this games unique mechanics less unique ffs)

snow python
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Honestly, I could see the suppression mechanic be something like increasing recoil, reducing control, and such. Things that aren't as gross I think and could make being suppressed actuall impactful while not just being a boring drunk or blind effect.

zenith carbon
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half the asia servers are so fucked with it

snow python
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Also shotguns, and not poopy ones. Shotgun can be fun if they aren't made to be pure cancer. They made snipers amazing, I think they can do shotguns.

livid carbon
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!shotguns

wild pilotBOT
#

Info Are you planning the addition of shotguns?

NO

flat sedge
livid carbon
zenith carbon
meager salmon
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it had bandages. but they only stopped bleeding. you couldnt use them again to continue healing. y'know, encouraging teamwork n stuff. shit that BBR seems to be developing away from :/

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if you got shot, you stopped the bleeding if you were bleeding, and you found a fucking medic. lone-wolfing was punished severely and removing medic self-healing (or at least greatly nerfing it) would have stopped medic lone-wolfing as well. but no. that is not what we got

flat sedge
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  1. They were less than current (you 9/10 saw the bandage number change)
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  1. They only fixed bleeding with no heal
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  1. they revived down players
zenith carbon
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but honestly no, you're right tbh

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so much of the rebalancing so far has been weakening the aspects of the game that force teamplay in favor of maintaining the things that least encourage it

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if there has been any at all, and to a large extent there just hasn't tbh

tight narwhal
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One message removed from a suspended account.

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One message removed from a suspended account.

zenith carbon
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tripwire sounds good