#Vector - Feedback

1 messages · Page 3 of 1

gaunt torrent
#

It’s not good at 20 or even 30 rn

#

And there’s already better smgs up close

compact sentinel
#

for your sake i hope you're trolling

gaunt torrent
#

??????? The mp7 has had a better ttk since launch

compact sentinel
#

if you think the vector is bad at 30m then you should really switch over to candy crush or something

#

fwiw i think mp7's damage fall off should start out at 20m like most other SMGs

#

but the vector is still strong. it was braindead easy to use with no recoil and the damage fall off starting at 50m

gaunt torrent
#

The mp5 matched the prenerf vector ttk

#

With less recoil

#

The pp2k is stronger than the mp7 rn

vagrant talon
gaunt torrent
#

It’s not

compact sentinel
#

mmm, no

gaunt torrent
#

Oh and the ump rework fucking exists

compact sentinel
#

even now mp5 has a slower TTK against no armor and medium armor, only being faster against light armor

compact sentinel
#

groza and the UMP just straight up should not exist in the current state they're in

vagrant talon
#

vector still kills faster than the MP5 almost universally at point blank

gaunt torrent
#

And the mp5 has near negative recoil being actually effective to its old damage fall off end range which even the vector wasn’t doing

#

Atleast not without more work than the mp5 takes

#

I have to stop myself from pulling down with the mp5 because it literally doesn’t move

#

All this without mentioning fall off start differences

compact sentinel
#

10m vs 20m. the horror

gaunt torrent
#

Makes a pretty big difference

#

Especially in the case of 10 vs 40

compact sentinel
#

the reality of the matter is that vector was way too strong, and it got a well deserved range nerf. i wouldn't be opposed to it getting 40 bullets back as opposed to 36, but with how little recoil it has, damage fall off starting at 10m was very much warranted

gaunt torrent
compact sentinel
#

no, not really

#

aim punch was annoying on every single weapon

gaunt torrent
compact sentinel
#

vector wasn't used because of aim punch, it was used because of the fast TTK + no recoil + 40 bullets. aim punch was just the cherry on top

gloomy snow
#

Guys if you nerf the vector in cqc field it will literally be dog water

compact sentinel
#

the discussion was about it being not good enough at range

gloomy snow
#

Which is why earlier I said its fine the way it is

compact sentinel
#

yeah, it is

gloomy snow
#

Amazing at cqc but sucks at lrc

gaunt torrent
#

It’s so niche it fails at competing with other guns in its own niche. I can’t deal with you people

#

There are ars better than the vector in its niche

agile hedge
#

smg medics crying about the g3 in the vector thread HyperXD

#

funniest shit i've ever seen

pallid crypt
#

when the smg does what a smg does best in its intended range instead of crossmapping from sandysunset to wakistan

gloomy snow
#

Real

gaunt torrent
gaunt torrent
#

your only argument so far has essentially boiled down to "the weapon is fine" meanwhile it's the worst of it's class and performs worse at it's role than weapons outside of it's class (fal says hi). i'm not asking for it to be buffed into s tier, but it definitely needs something, 10m fall off is too limiting, especially if the other smg's aren't going to be limited in the same way. i'd like to see it's fall off end reigned in further from 150 to 100 (or lower) with a small buff to its fall off start from 10 to 20m

#

as someone who actively uses the vector still since, as we can see from this channels message history, it continues to print salt based on it's pre-nerf state it's definitely not in a great place compared to it's counterparts.

compact sentinel
#

the TTK is better than every other SMG except for the UMP (which is overtuned as fuck) and MP7 (which needs harsher damage fall off)

compact sentinel
gaunt torrent
#

and the only ttk charts i can find for the vector still treat it as 24 damage instead of 22

compact sentinel
#

PP2K is 0.240, MP5 is 0.225

#

vector is still 0.200 even at 22 damage

gaunt torrent
#

2k definitely isn't .240 after the buffs

compact sentinel
#

24 dmg at 1000 rpm vs 22 damage at 1200 rpm

#

guess which one gets to 100 faster

gaunt torrent
#

.200 within 10m, how often do you think you miss that mark and start losing damage?

#

vs more flexible 20m and the mp7 for some reason with 40

compact sentinel
#

positioning issue

gaunt torrent
#

see it's funny how it's a skill issue when the vector is struggling within it's own class but not when losers were getting killed by a full 40rd mag dump at 100m because they were standing still in an open field

#

vector is a legitimate downgrade from the other smgs you use while leveling

wide nimbus
#

That's power creep

vagrant talon
#

PP-19 is just garbage

#

SMGs in general I think have been nerfed a little too far, but the nerfs were applied to the bad ones as well as the good ones

#

Which is a bit of an issue

gaunt torrent
#

+10m to it's fall off start with a nerf to it's fall off end would be totally reasonable and not even take it above the other smgs ahead of it

#

though the pp19 still needs a full rework

wide nimbus
#

I really don't care about how the weapons are balanced, it seemed like a flawed argument that the worst thing needed to be buffed because simply because it's the worst, which would either leave it still the worst and that logic would apply to it again or a new gun becomes the worse and now that needs a nerf.

gloomy snow
#

Honestly the pp19 is fine the way it is

gaunt torrent
#

it feels like shit to use given that people within the same building don't even take full damage from the vector rn

gloomy snow
#

it has its own identity since its an smg with good range

#

low damage and pretty decent rpm

gaunt torrent
#

yeah it's identity is "the worse mp5"

gloomy snow
#

not anymore

#

the mp5 got nerfed

#

of them idsay they are pretty neck and neck

gaunt torrent
#

??? they only nerfed the range on the mp5

#

which is the same nerf the pp19 got

#

it's literally just worse than the mp5

vagrant talon
gloomy snow
#

honestly its not

#

the pp19 has more range than the mp5

#

but less damage

#

the mp5 has more damage

#

but worse range

#

they have a differences of 50 rpm

#

what's the big deal?

vagrant talon
#

Because an SMG attempting to lean into longer range efficacy doesn’t work. It still has bad damage dropoff/velocity

#

It just becomes a weaker version of weapons from other classes

gloomy snow
#

So what your saying is give the pp19 a buff?

gaunt torrent
#

especially when there's already a better smg doing the same thing, even with an earlier fall off start, they have the same base recoil while the mp5 has +4 damage and a higher rate

#

the pp19 needs a rework to not be just "the mp5 but worse" or "the better mp5" if it gets a damage buff

vagrant talon
compact sentinel
gaunt torrent
#

and to get back on topic, giving the vector +10m to it's fall off start (from 10 to 20) would atleast help it not feel so shit when some guy down the hall isn't taking full damage

compact sentinel
#

vector is already the 3rd best SMG in CQC, it doesn't need a range buff

gloomy snow
#

Honestly idk seems really risky to give the vector a buff

gaunt torrent
gloomy snow
#

it was literally the most broken gun in the game before

gaunt torrent
#

yeah no shit, and giving it 10m worth of range after it lost 40m, 2 damage, and 4 rounds in it's mag plus the biggest benefit of aim punching everyone to the moon isn't going to instantly make it king

gloomy snow
#

Lokisam going full nerd mode on us today bois

gaunt torrent
#

and most broken gun in the game is highly debatable. fal and groza doing the same shit since release and still untouched

#

scorpion still crazy as well

gloomy snow
#

Ahhhhh

#

scorpion is not overpowered

#

thats a huge stretch

gaunt torrent
#

it's the king of cqc even better than the vector

gloomy snow
#

plus it also got its min range nerfed by 50m

gaunt torrent
#

actually it only got it's fall off end nerfed by 60m

#

nobody was shooting a scorpion at a target 200m away

gloomy snow
#

60m is a lot when it only has 200

gaunt torrent
#

and we still aren't shooting at a target 140m aways

gloomy snow
#

it makes it fall quicker

#

bro legit doesn't know how damage range work

gaunt torrent
#

it has the highest cqc dps and it's fall off starts later than the vector

gloomy snow
#

20m

#

literally 10 more than the vector

vagrant talon
gaunt torrent
#

yeah, alongside every other smg except the pp19 and the mp7. oh and fun fact the p90 also starts at 20

#

so, the vector is the only gun starting lower, while doing less cqc dps than the scorpion (at 20m) and the mp7 (out to 40m)

gloomy snow
#

The scorpion has only one good trait and thats within 40m combat

#

If it got a nerf it would literally suck ass

vagrant talon
#

Unless you’re heavily prioritising leg shots then the point blank ttk of the MP7 and Vector will be about the same overall

gloomy snow
#

Fair since the vector has 250 more rpm

gaunt torrent
gloomy snow
#

And less recoil

vagrant talon
gaunt torrent
#

i mean, the diff is like .012? between vector/mp7 to begin with

#

it's functionally the same regardless but still a difference

#

also the mp7/vector have the same recoil except the vector's higher horizontal recoil (by .1, functionally the same)

vagrant talon
#

Guns at 25 damage just happen to suffer in ttk from armour a lot more than guns at 22 damage

gloomy snow
#

^^^^^

vagrant talon
#

I made a graph for it…

#

:D

#

(annoying watermark makes it more of a :| though)

gaunt torrent
#

armor should be 1 extra shot for the vector for each level

#

if my math is mathin

vagrant talon
#

I made a math mather to math for me
And I ain’t arguing with what it tells me

gaunt torrent
#

110 with 5 hits is still 2 under ranger/light

#

i mean it's simple math thankfully

#

until you add fall off

wide nimbus
#

And this is not a perfect world

#

So that is completely irrelevant

vagrant talon
vagrant talon
gloomy snow
#

Bro just keep it the way it is

gaunt torrent
#

Yeah tbh I went back to using the better smgs, 7k kills on vector time to let it rest.

agile hedge
#

7k? how didn't that get stale after like 1k HyperXD

gaunt torrent
agile hedge
gaunt torrent
#

Vector isn’t a threat past like 35m. Easier to just mp7 and be a threat out to 80

agile hedge
#

also you're fast enough to dodge bullets anyway so huh

agile hedge
#

honestly idc vector feels good close up but sucks at range, smg what does someone expect

gaunt torrent
#

No problem for dmrs to push all the way to smg range but god forbid smg reach half of ar range

#

Y’all are weird

agile hedge
#

dmrs will go suck any smgs nuts and ar nuts aswell

#

one panic spray up close might succed but dmrs really aren't that good up close

gaunt torrent
#

Dmr players doing the exact thing I told the ar players to do 3 months ago, aka stop getting caught sprinting. The good players don’t seem to be having problems

agile hedge
#

i think you're just whining about how you can no longer easily kill people at ranges you shouldn't with a cqc gun but w/e no bad blood here ay?

gaunt torrent
#

But you can do it. Just not with the vector

agile hedge
gaunt torrent
#

Which makes it de facto worse than its competitors

#

It sucks that if I want to use an smg it’s the mp7 from 0-200

agile hedge
#

vector still shreds in cqc tho, where it should
really i don't see the problem
but that's just me probaly, i'll take a cqc gun for dense maps
an ar for allrounder capabilities
a dmr for funny ranged shenenigans
and the ultimax for lots of ranged boolets

#

and rly if you go by logic, cqb guns will always "suck" on a battlefield
or yk be to good for what they are

gaunt torrent
#

I mean, if we go by reality the smgs would be way better because of the map design, which is what happened

#

Now the smgs are tuned around dogshit map design

#

But anyway, the problem right now is the vector sucks in comparison to the rest of the class. If the rest of the smgs are nerfed down to it’s level the class is dead outside of like, namak.

#

Just no point to use smg when there are ars that can fill the same niche

agile hedge
#

realism
but jokes aside if you wanna go all competitive just use the mp7?
also using one gun for all maps with all ranges feels whacko to me, some maps just aren't for cqc, deal with it

gaunt torrent
#

Even the maps where you’d expect smgs to shine the vector falls short to other smgs. Yes I can use the mp7 and am. Just tired of using the same gun to feel like I’m getting fair fights. The only advantage the vector has over the mp7 right now is when my connection is shit I’m more likely to get the assist counts as kill because the mp7 will be 50-75 assist instead of the 80 needed for the extra kill

#

And I do switch weapons for longer maps, I liked the acr even before the buff and still do

#

Can’t wait to have the FAL back either

agile hedge
#

what maps are you talking about?
also, mp7 gets to stale while having 7k kills with the vector HyperXD

gaunt torrent
#

7k kills across 2 prestige’s yes

#

I put 3.5k on the p90 last prestige before the nerfs because I was on a server where I was just getting easy flanks the whole time

#

For like weeks

agile hedge
#

and what about the mp7 👀

gaunt torrent
#

3.3k?

#

Not that much, mostly just using it to reach other weapons

#

I’m about 2k into the fal as well

agile hedge
#

you do realize how "hypocritical" that seems right xD
to say "mp7 gets to stale for me"
but whatever vector still fucks in cqc which is all i'm after with that thing, if i didn't use the scorpion cuz it's cooler that'd be

gaunt torrent
#

The problem is the vector fucking in cqc is that, again, it’s worse than it’s direct competitors, the mp7 and also the scorpion, has always been worse than both of them in terms of raw ttk. And now with the meta shift (everyone playing dmrs) the vector doesn’t have enough reach to fight. So either switch to an ar that can or play any of the other smgs that are unaffected by the meta change

#

(Or the abomination that is the ump 🤮 )

agile hedge
#

yeah fuck the ump

gaunt torrent
#

The other smgs are just more consistent than the vector

#

Even when they fall short on raw ttk

agile hedge
#

but honestly i think people now use dmrs because they don't feel like a wet, rotting, warm sock to use anymore, not really "meta guns" although they are a tier

gaunt torrent
#

Well they got buffed so a lot of people are trying them

#

I’m not saying they are the meta just that the meta is feeling out dmrs

agile hedge
agile hedge
gaunt torrent
#

Prenerf yes

#

Post nerf it remained competitive off of everyone staying in close enough to stay over 20 damage

#

Now that’s not consistent

agile hedge
#

yeah a small buff to like 15m dmg falloff start and smth else idk would prolly help but that could risk getting the crutch vector back
but rn the groza and ump are the biggest crutch and cringe offenders

#

also devs are working on smth rn but not that so yeaaahhhhhhh...

gaunt torrent
agile hedge
#

well imma keep asking to fix bipod and bring scorpion to assault xD

gaunt torrent
#

I agree with those changes too

#

Assault should have every weapon imo

#

Anyway to randomly explain why I have so many vector kills, it’s just really really satisfying when you’re shooting people, getting the hit marker sound, and then the kill sound

#

I can do that all day

#

I have done that all day

#

Scorpion hits the same way for me

#

But I never have the scorpion long enough to enjoy it

gaunt torrent
agile hedge
#

haha i don't bother with prestiging, it just isn't worth it for me but ye the "br br deng" of the scorpion is very nutty

#

but i use the osprey on the vector so it doesn't have the same oomph to it

gaunt torrent
#

Osprey is nice too though I did quit running it. Just feels a little bit off to me

#

If I didn’t prestige I’d have quit by now. Gotta keep the dopamine points rolling

gloomy snow
#

Can't believe grown men are actually fucking fighting and arguing over a block gun game balance

agile hedge
#

this was a peaceful debate, no toxicity here...

gloomy snow
#

I don't just mean here but in all of the channels

#

Crazy bro

agile hedge
#

crazy?

#

i was crazy once...

#

but yeah that's the battlebit community

vagrant talon
#

pretty crazy I know

gaunt torrent
#

i think arguing is good. even zombies can live in eternal toleration of one another.

agile hedge
gaunt torrent
#

also yeah, this has been a pretty chill convo. nothing wrong with either side here. i get where people coming from not wanting to buff the vector but it's definitely pretty lackluster when compared to its counterparts and i'd like to see it get something to help its consistency issues (especially since it's my favorite gun and it being in this state makes me sadge)

#

feels like i have to use the mp7 until i get the scorpion, do you know how long that takes

#

way more time than i expected because i can't find a 240hz server hosted in central

vagrant talon
#

Lokisam is not allowed to use weapons under 900rpm

gaunt torrent
#

what's the p90 fire rate?

agile hedge
#

800rpm

gaunt torrent
#

ezzzzzz

#

he's wrong

#

hahahaha

#

how is the p90 post range nerf?

agile hedge
#

idk haven't tried it still pretty much the same tho

gaunt torrent
#

dope

vagrant talon
gaunt torrent
#

what's the fal fire rate?

vagrant talon
#

Lokisam is not allowed to use weapons under 650rpm

gaunt torrent
#

see, now you're just being mean

#

what's scar/ak15 fire rate?

vagrant talon
#

570/600

gaunt torrent
#

then you are once more defeated

#

but that's like my entire list of weapons i like

tranquil geyser
#

ive been thinking on this and for some reason the mp7 does feel more comfortable. mp7 apparently is .253 at light and normal armor ttks and faster for unarmored. vector's at .2 for unarmored, but consistently .25 for light and normal ttk.

i'm not sure the .003 difference for normal and light ttk is worth using it over the mp7 when the mp7's slower fire rate makes it more controllable than the vector.

might just be a playstyle thing on my end since i'm not the best at recoil control, just an interesting thing i noticed

#

oh and mp7 ads time is snappier

gaunt torrent
#

also the 30m extra fall off start time

#

it's pretty easy to end up hitting the range where you need +1 with the vector

tranquil geyser
#

oh is vector falloff tighter than mp7? i cant check rn, dont have the game open xD

#

vector identity feels weird mostly cause of how it compares to mp7, other smgs are fine imo

gaunt torrent
#

vector fall off starts at 10m and it does 22 damage

#

you dip below 20 very quickly

#

mp7 is 25 damage falling off starting at 40m

tranquil geyser
#

huh interesting

#

i wouldnt mind the falloff still being there provided that the vector outperforms mp7 within that range but it really doesnt feel like it

gaunt torrent
#

that's cause it doesn't

tranquil geyser
#

yeah lmao, id hesitate on upping the range but having it be the best smg within that 10m range would be a great compromise imo

agile hedge
#

scorpion...
and water melons

#

sry intrusive, sleep deprived thoughts won

gaunt torrent
#

yeah that's really my issue with the vector, again, it's so niche and then isn't even the best in its niche

#

the scorpion does it better (by actually having a crazy ttk)

#

and the mp7 is basically the best all round smg (ignoring the ump, until it gets nerfed it doesn't exist to me)

#

the only thing the vector does better than any other smg is get assist counts as kill

#

and as expected some of the sweatier players i know are using m110 as an smg rn

tranquil geyser
#

i think the scorpion should have a better ttk by virtue of being, well, the scorpion, but vector should be a 2nd within that 10m yea

tranquil geyser
gaunt torrent
#

if your aim is good enough the follow up shot seems to not be a problem, these are some super sweaty guys so i doubt most people could do it consistently but it's definitely annoying

#

course i'm also playing with 60 ping vs their like 14 so maybe i'm just not reacting at all on their screen

agile hedge
#

"reverse" dmg curve + firerate buff moment
aka low dmg up close but then the normal dmr curve

vagrant talon
#

Even if you do it perfectly with limb shots, the ttk is still slower than most primaries on torsos

#

Looses to even the AUG in ttk if you can avoid hitting chest with both

#

I feel like whoever is doing this has convinced themselves that 0.3 seconds is a smaller amount of time than it actually is

#

Not to mention that hip firing with 200rpm is not going to be as consistent

agile hedge
#

the range on this thing is kinda meh
15-20m damage fall off start would be great
rn it's just the funny brrrrrrrrr gun but got no real value to give to the user, every other aggro smg does the same stuff but better

gaunt torrent
#

pretty much, still prints salt from people who are still mad about pre-nerf vector so it does have that

stray oriole
gaunt torrent
#

it needs 5-10m meters on it's fall-off start (it's currently 10, bring it to 15 or 20m) and it'd be perfect

#

i've had to fully stop using it unless i want to reset my router between every couple games because after 2-3 matches it starts taking half a mag or more to kill people point blank

#

my connection is so unstable it's unreal. 5, 6, 7 hitmarkers on ump (not even hitting armor) and then i die

stray oriole
stray oriole
gaunt torrent
#

It really doesn’t tho. I can watch streamers play on servers with 200 ms getting multis with the vector cause it actually kills people

#

Literally watching a different game

#

And then I get 1 bulleted by a guy after I put half a mag into them

stray oriole
#

Perhaps my connection is also shit then.

gaunt torrent
#

I got a server with 23 ms one time during the first week and it was a different world

#

The problem is every server in the server list says 30 but I join and it’s 60-80

#

Sometimes 90

stray oriole
#

That's my average ping

#

Regardless not an issue with the vector. I do feel like dmg drop off could be more consistant within smgs.

gaunt torrent
#

It’s not directly an issue with the vector but if I get the kill in 6 with the ump i still have 19 shots to miss with before I’m fucked . If I use half a vector mag I have no overhead

hushed vigil
#

buff vector

ionic fractal
#

there is a reason it was nerfed to the ground

gaunt torrent
ionic fractal
gaunt torrent
ionic fractal
#

i don't think we speak of the same patch then