ability to move servers
#general
minor badge
for MC, luka?
spiral garden
wonder if the new daemon is going to fix the zipbomb issue
spiral garden
do gsuite admins see how much space each user uses up 👀
minor badge
then you might as well just go for a cheaper one, no? https://uwu.whats-th.is/C4jEPRP.png
same amt of storage, €7/mo cheaper
spiral garden
because apparently i have unlimited gdrive storage for the next two years
yes
and also no
since the domain is centrally managed by the ministry of education
ashen cliff
Make sure to make a SharedDrive... or 50 of them.
ashen cliff
The upload limit should be like 300GB/day from my experience.
spiral garden
yeah that's a lot
ashen cliff
TFW I have to upload a 1TB tar.
spiral garden
plex
ashen cliff
I should be at 670TB currently, no good way of knowing since it's hidden in shared drives.
I legit just mirror websites I use a lot and don't want them to randomly vanish.
spiral garden
tbh i wouldn't mind hosting a plex server with that storage, but it's a bit of a pain
ashen cliff
Legit mirroring 3 Russian forums, just for Cisco firmware.
spiral garden
since radarr/sonarr never want to work properly
ashen cliff
Say what you need and I most likely have it.
spiral garden
doubt
spiral garden
right now i'm running 15.5(3)M
ashen cliff
Actual unlimited except for machines with very low CPU scores.
minor badge
yeah their traffic is indeed unlimited
ashen cliff
bWFnbmV0Oj94dD11cm46YnRpaDpmMGQ1MjQ4Zjk3NzFiMjY0MTNhYWE1ZjNkOGNmYjliNDIwZTk0MDA1JmRuPTI5MDA=
Should do the trick for the Cisco C2900 firmware.
(Base 64 decode it)
limber knotBOT
👀
quasi valley
ashen cliff
So. Anyone know any good VPS that has enough storage for my mirroring shenanigance?
1Gbps, 250GB HDD/SSD and owners that won't shoot me for torrenting.
Could just go for Contabo.
jovial cloak
@twin lagoon AMP doesn't use tmux to run the actual game servers, it's definitely not a tmux wrapper 😂
twin lagoon
what the fuck is tmux being used for then
i could've sworn it used tmux for game servers before
jovial cloak
if you're not using Docker it spawns the AMP daemon processes in tmux so that you can access their consoles if necessary.
but there's no layer between AMPs backend and the game server process
jovial cloak
it now takes under 1 second to manage an instance when you double click it
I'm actually gonna hide the loading screen in the next feature update and let it just make the final requests in the background
limber knotBOT
not instant smh
jovial cloak
its only not instant if the instance you're managing is on a different machine
since it has to preauthenticate you
since ya know, it has to take a moment to be secure if its talking across different machines 😂
Ptero is nice in the way Fortnite is. Keeps the kids away from the serious stuff.
I'm glad the summer hosts have something to use 😂
ashen cliff
the summer hosts
A yes. We have those yearly in Slovenia.
HOSTING IN SLOVENIA LOCAL CONNECTION!
Actually Contabo.
Wasn't there a meme blog page that had something about reselling Contabo for MC?
twin lagoon
why not?
limber knotBOT
s/ptero is/web panels are
Correction, <DiscordBot> <06phonicuk> web panels are nice in the way Fortnite is. Keeps the kids away from the serious stuff.
runs
jovial cloak
lol
waxen panther
my mans doesnt know how much michael knows 
twin lagoon
i used it a month ago maybe
limber knotBOT
but I probably have to setup ptero on my private server for some friends soon
twin lagoon
whatever is on the website for 10 servers or something
limber knotBOT
don't want to always be bothered just to add some plugin or datapack 😆
jovial cloak
limber knotBOT
also I guess it would be nice to have when I play gMod with friends eventually 
can't ¯_(ツ)_/¯
jovial cloak
because he uses a managed host 😂
limber knotBOT
lmao
minor badge
or, god forbid, just use docker without anything special as they're literally not necessary
limber knotBOT
because it's not open source and I prefer to use open source software if it exists ;)
btw. are you ever gonna rebrand to a better name? xD
minor badge
^ impossible to find on search engines cause of google's amp
limber knotBOT
that will be 50 bucks for SEO optimization btw
jovial cloak
"I only use open-source software" say people who have probably never looked at the source of anything they use xD
AMP actually has an open API though, which is why you can modify it
its basically "I'm too cheap and this is a convenient excuse"
ashen cliff
Ripcord.
twin lagoon
phoenix is talking on IRC
minor badge
ok? discord doesn't have any permitted clients where i can read the source, so it is not possible for me to switch back and forth between servers without their client
jovial cloak
No small proportion of my userbase are ex-ptero users though, and ex-multicraft for that matter
limber knotBOT
I have no issue paying for open source software
finite wave
hello, I am asking to see if there is a version where I am enable to download plugins that has all games like TNT RUN, HIDE AND SEEK, BEDWARS. All that. as well as FRACTION, SKYWARS all that. (You get the point) Just a version where i can get every single thing in Minecraft servers.
limber knotBOT
and I donate to the ones I use when I can
so gtfo
because then I have 100% control about it
finite wave
He is special
jovial cloak
you're an exception, if I could make the same revenue from AMP while having it open source then I probably would - but the reality is that for the average user 'open source' is just a proxy for 'I don't have to pay for it' which is why most open source projects struggle with funding
minor badge
the ability to know what it's doing at any time is also important imho
limber knotBOT
just take ripcord as an example: their webhook support is attrocious, I would be willing to fix it. dev doesn't want to
also if a dev stops to maintain it others will continue it
minor badge
if you want money for amp, FOSS + paywall the support
limber knotBOT
with proprietary software you will have to find an alternative
minor badge
the idiots who need amp always need support anyways
jovial cloak
If your software is friendly and well written it doesn't need support, that's a revenue model that actually relies on people having problems.
Might work for RedHat and megacorps but not for small ISVs
limber knotBOT
I sure wonder how big open source projects like linux still maange to exist... oh right, people actually support well made, essential software monetarily
jovial cloak
yeah, massive multi-billion dollar corporations support it, not the individual end users
limber knotBOT
if your software is actually worth it people will support it
minor badge
in that case, just make installation terse? it's not a big deal as long as it works for you
limber knotBOT
explain to me who the end user of linux is?
because it sure isn't the desktop users, lol
it's big companies
minor badge
or just accept that people like phoenix and i exist and will sway people away from your software for being closed when other solutions like ptero exist
limber knotBOT
besides the fact that nothing stops you from selling open source software
ashen cliff
INB4 impossible to build due to a paywalled/private lib.
limber knotBOT
there is zero reason to do that, krusic
ashen cliff
I know. But I've seen people do that.
limber knotBOT
I hope you refunded it, lol
minor badge
i mean, in that case it wouldn't be open source software anyways
jovial cloak
The guys who make Ptero don't do it as their day job right? It's in their spare time around other obligations. Nobody is relying on donations to Ptero to pay bills, keep a company running, etc. It's easy to give your time away when it's not worth anything.
ashen cliff
I did.
limber knotBOT
I never said you should give it away gratis
jovial cloak
if you 'sell' open source software, then there's nothing stopping someone from compiling it and giving it away - non-viable model.
limber knotBOT
I have an ideological standpoint that copyright shouldn't exist, not an economical that everything should be gratis
jovial cloak
Open source games for example work by making the 'code' open source (and indeed gratis) but pay walling the actual game content
limber knotBOT
there is: support, advertisement, etc
nobody is stopping giving away your software for free anyways
if you believe it can't be cracked then its already cracked
jovial cloak
If copyright didn't exist it'd be almost impossible to sell anything you made that wasn't a physical item. No author could sell books because someone could just roll off infinite copies.
limber knotBOT
and society would need to adjust, yes
jovial cloak
You'd remove a lot of means by which people monetize their time beyond physical means
minor badge
they already do
ashen cliff
Daily reminder Linux Foundation exists, mostly due to sponsors and they still have money to pay everyone.
jovial cloak
Aye, due to multi million/billion dollar companies.
limber knotBOT
also if you often buy games on humble bundle: you can set the FSF to receive your donations
(and you can give them 100% of the price when buying bundles but you should give the devs stuff too 👀 )
but for bundles like EA shit I always donate 100% lmao
jovial cloak
There's another revenue model I'm going to be exploring in the future though that could be interesting - AMP is getting a plugin/module store to let developers share stuff they've built with the API. Been considering an 'app-store' style cut for commercial/premium plugins.
limber knotBOT
would be cool to enforce open source licenses there and providing source code to all buyers automatically ;)
would be pretty easy for a store to do
runs
jovial cloak
lol
limber knotBOT
I wish spigot had done that in its resource section when it started :S
I also wish github would've force open source license and banned abuse of their repos 👀
jovial cloak
Open Source is great ideologically, but on a small scale incompatible with capitalism. If you're Mozilla, Blender or the Apache foundation then so many big companies rely on you that they pay to keep you around out of their own necessity. But small ISVs that sell to consumers don't have that luxury.
Otherwise the Ptero guys would be swimming in money with the size of their userbase xD
limber knotBOT
yes, free-market capitalism sucks and we need to do everything we can to control it
jovial cloak
weird exception, FiveM makes a lot despite being open source, but they lock features behind a paywall
limber knotBOT
thank god we don't have the US model in Germany/most of the EU lol
minor badge
hey insane idea, you go open source within what open source actually allows? you can still require payment for source, but that payment would be for both source and software
limber knotBOT
he fears that people will just share the source online and nobody will buy it anymore
jovial cloak
correct
limber knotBOT
because apparently his software isn't good enough that people want to pay for it
or something
dunno what other reason one would have 👀
jovial cloak
lol
minor badge
they'd still have to pay for help with it
golden gust
The concern is that most licenses state that if you get the bin, you get the source
waxen panther
my man really bringing capitalism into open source
limber knotBOT
because people sure aren't going to download from shady sources and risk viruses for 10 bucks
ashen cliff
What about the Factorio model?
jovial cloak
well like I said, if people paid for software that was good purely because it's good, then the Ptero guys would surely be able to quit their jobs and work on it full time
golden gust
The only way OSS software generally earns cash is via donations and support contracts
jovial cloak
but I don't see any of them driving a Tesla
waxen panther
not everything in life has to be for money
limber knotBOT
the goal isn't to get rich, the goal is to be able to live
you need nothing else in live
*life
golden gust
Live sustainabily, if you're relying on donations... oof
limber knotBOT
some people are idiots too, doesn't change my views ¯_(ツ)_/¯
but I can try to shape society so that the goals ov more people align to mine
jovial cloak
my goal right now is to expand, next year I'm going to be hiring my first full-time engineer 😄
minor badge
@twin lagoon 
heady spear
I pay my rent with money from an open source project
jovial cloak
I'll actually have to be in the office in good time to let them in xD
heady spear
I must be a unicorn
limber knotBOT
yeah, alsmost half of my money comes from open source, lol
golden gust
I support open source, but, at the same point, I'm not some delusional stallman worshiper and believe that devs should be paid fairly for their time, being open source doesn't make the time investment any less, and lets face it, most open source projects relying on external funding flop unless somebody somehow picks them up
openSSL is literally one of the most used libraries, and it took a fuckoff huge gaping security issue before companies actually figured "Well, shit, we better support this project"
limber knotBOT
well it's also my opinion that governments should pay for open source development (e.g. via ubi) if the users don't
jovial cloak
well if UBI was a thing then half the issue goes away
limber knotBOT
and they partially do, there are grants for open source development if you have a "fitting" project
jovial cloak
lots of universities support open source projects
limber knotBOT
unfortunatelly "gaming" is not something that gets money often because it's often seen as entertainment and a luxury rather than culture
but that's changing now so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
imageine minecraft 1.8 pvp esport
oh wait, that is a thing
golden gust
The thing is that you can spend hours discussing the ideals of how devs would be able to OS their shit, get paid a decent amount and be happy
But, that's not the case right now
minor badge
fite me 1.7 1v1 phoenix
golden gust
and you can peddle all you want in OSS happy fun land, but, we're far from it
minor badge
1.8 made my sword 0.0032s slower to recharge so its unplayable
limber knotBOT
lukaor: have fun https://play.eslgaming.com/minecraft/germany
heady spear
There's a huge difference between software that is used in the enterprise world, and Minecraft server mods tho
golden gust
Realistically, if you wanna earn a living on software, your either charging for the software, or spending time throwing your time into providing support contracts to be able to fund development, which eats into development time until you start getting a team who you can pay, etc, etc
enterprises don't give a shit about the software they use
heady spear
too big a difference to draw parallels tbh
golden gust
Once again: openSSL
heady spear
Right. Because companies don't want to spend money
jovial cloak
I remember reading about some NodeJS library that was used by literally millions of people and the developer had never seen a single penny from it
heady spear
but minecraft plugins aren't used in the enterprise world soooooooooooooooooo
limber knotBOT
but there are professional minecraft servers! that's enterprise!
heady spear
it's quite easy to make money from open sourced plugins here, enough to where it makes a difference
golden gust
No, but the same form of concepts across the board apply
golden gust
e.g. No rando server host is going to pay for your control panel if they dont' got to
"essential" plugins like Ess, WG, WE... hardly see any donations
Well, moss got a patreon recently afaik, but, still
limber knotBOT
just license your panel it as AGPL, then they have to provide source for any small modification 
and if they don't, DMCA them
minor badge
cat wanna go out together 🥺
heady spear
FAWE brings in a decent amount of donations, WE doesn't. But FAWE actually asked for donations whereas WE didn't
golden gust
Nobody in this community will generally care to contrib to a project unless you force their hand or spend time pushing for donations
heady spear
If you publish software for free without ever asking for anything in return then I think it's fair for people to assume that you don't care
jovial cloak
I'm actually making a piece of software that's AGPL, free to use but if you want to distribute it without making modifications public then you have to pay
golden gust
e.g. via has the "ur servhuhr her"
jovial cloak
it's a piece of bookkeeping software
limber knotBOT
so it's not AGPL, got it
jovial cloak
no, it's AGPL - read what I said more carefully 😉
AGPL requires that if you make any changes, you share them
cedar spade
Well, moss got a patreon recently afaik, but, still
@golden gust EssentialsX (not MOSS) has had a Patreon for nearly 3 years :p
heady spear
but also plz follow license terms :D<3
golden gust
implying I care to follow Essx
limber knotBOT
AGPL also allows sharing of binaries without limitations as long as you provide source
golden gust
What's a MOSS?
cedar spade
Moss Oss Ss S
minor badge
would it be against the spigot rules to sell ad slots unless you pay? 
jovial cloak
actually the important detail of AGPL is that if you provide a web service and modify it you have to share the source too. It removes the 'service loophole'
all users of the software must have access to the source even if they're using it remotely
limber knotBOT
Proximyst: you can't have advertisement in plugins
jovial cloak
the idea being that if for whatever reason someone wanted to take this software, modify it and not share the source as per the AGPL terms, they'd have to pay for a licence
minor badge
mm
limber knotBOT
yes, the rest is just the standard GPLv3 which allows sharing of the binary
minor badge
i'm excited to see hangar's stand on that
limber knotBOT
if they don't ban that then that will be Pepega
jovial cloak
so if someone just wants to use the software, it's free - if they want to make changes and sell it as a commercial product/service without sharing their changes, they gotta pay
limber knotBOT
(or at least limit it to the startup log or something)
jovial cloak
but since it's software for businesses, it can be a different model
jovial cloak
nope, this is a "If you're open source too, great - if not, pay up"
limber knotBOT
but yeah, paying for a non-open source license is a standard model in the oss community too
minor badge
meh, i hope it'll be allowed
golden gust
advertising stuff on startup, etc, I can hardly fault; Kinda bleh but so long as it's not impacting players or stupidly OTT, I can't really say i have much complaint about it, given that that is basically one of few ways for plugins to earn cash bar "PLZ DONAT"
minor badge
i'd be happy with paying for a plugin if i could see its source, use it freely and whatnot, and then pay for it if i don't want the ads
golden gust
All plugins on hangar will be OSS anyways
limber knotBOT
I mean at that point one could just patch out the ads 👀
(but most probably wont do that so ¯_(ツ)_/¯)
vernal moth
Don't think hangar has any policies yet
minor badge
that's fine, phoenix
quasi valley
I'd just auto replace those with "please donuts"
limber knotBOT
if you really want to do ads then please pull them from an external server btw., that way I can add it to the adblock host lists 👀
vernal moth
Let's leave that for when we have a MVP
minor badge
if they want to do it themselves, they've put in effort to handle it, and will need to maintain their patch
minor badge
kek
jovial cloak
inb4 plugin won't start if it can't talk to the ad server xD
minor badge
nah i'm a sane dev
limber knotBOT
just return a fake response
heady spear
proxi sane? lel
minor badge
if you take steps to make it clear you're not going to support my development, i'm not going to stop you
limber knotBOT
at that point you can just add a system flag/key file which can be easily faked though glances at a certain open source, paid resource
minor badge
nah i'm not going to help in not supporting me, but i'm not going to hinder it
limber knotBOT
that's reasonable. why waste time with the people that don't want to support you.
minor badge
also why fuck them over, they're still supporting my metrics as hardly anyone turns them off anyways :p
limber knotBOT
xD
I even got the "leakers" of my premium resources to not turn off my personal metrics lol
jovial cloak
baffles me how many plugins have undisclosed metrics
limber knotBOT
if you don't enable by default then metrics won't work ¯_(ツ)_/¯
jovial cloak
AMP doesn't even submit crash reports unless you opt in xD
minor badge
even paper does metrics
limber knotBOT
and I don#t think spamming users to enable metrics if they are disabled is nice either
minor badge
it's got an easy toggle in the plugins dir (iirc?)
metrics which do not invade privacy are fine if they're possible to fuck off
zealous wedge
if only there were an opt-in global toggle for metrics
limber knotBOT
if only
zealous wedge
cries in sponge
jovial cloak
I wonder how many server IPs have been leaked from plugins phoning home
limber knotBOT
most wouldn't use that either ¯_(ツ)_/¯
heady spear
I told leakers of plotsquared how to compile it themselves rather than dowloading it from some sketchy leak site
then I kindly asked them to disable bstats so that it didn't fuck up our metrics 🤷♂️
zealous wedge
oh blackspigot is such a joke
limber knotBOT
why would that fuck up your metrics?
minor badge
blackspigot's only good purpose to me is test servers. i use it when i have to check issues or just set up plugins for others
golden gust
implying people compiling plugins on their own will update it
and yea, what can they really do about black
zealous wedge
it's really funny when they have "cracked" versions of open source plugins
golden gust
at the end of the day, their legality is questionably solely around the "does the license all devs should be using allow this", in which yes, it literally does
mighty storm
Technically black spigot isn't any more illegal than not open sourcing the plugins because GPL
zealous wedge
like it's obviously a site for idiots
limber knotBOT
technically they are violating it by not providing the code to the binaries that they share
next wind
and most of the time, theres a free alternative to those plugins anyways
golden gust
I mean, I do have to admit
limber knotBOT
yeah, a cost implies quality
mighty storm
I promise you'll never see a blackhangar
zealous wedge
well if it's paid it's clearly better /s
golden gust
It was fucking comical when the DRM system of BS failed, so people couldn't use their pirated plugins because the DRM system of the piracy site said nome
was either BS or one of the other larger ones
zealous wedge
heh
mighty storm
Oh yeah lol
zealous wedge
why on earth would a pirated plugin site have DRM.....
golden gust
anti-leak leak protection
limber knotBOT
becasue it's run by idiots
golden gust
Don't want people to steal your leaks
jovial cloak
oh the irony
mighty storm
Only thing I've gotten from there is CMI
jovial cloak
that's just parasitic behaviour
mighty storm
That plugin ain't worth $15, it's barely worth $0
limber knotBOT
this is my favourite metrics graph btw: https://bstats.org/plugin/bukkit/ChestShop/1109#shopAccounts more plugins should log such operational data :D
mighty storm
Yeah never buy Songoda plugins lmao
next wind
this wobble is really cool
mighty storm
Or use them for that matter
peak dirge
phoenix616: consider https://bstats.org/plugin/server-implementation/Velocity/4752#managed_servers
next wind
woah
limber knotBOT
there will be even more (like transactions per half hour) once bastian pulls my bstats pr
that's an interesting drop on july 25th
zealous wedge
eww tux, 75% Java 8?
minor badge
yuck
limber knotBOT
re online/offline mode: stats doesn't take bungee into account unless you explicitely add that
mighty storm
Wasn't there a Pr for that too
zealous wedge
hard fork wen
cedar spade
hard fork! hard fork!
limber knotBOT
for every paper one, yes
minor badge
by default*
golden gust
You can opt out as normal
peak dirge
@zealous wedge I've brought up the possibility to moving to Java 11 as the new minimum for a future, major release of Velocity. Lots of people opposed.
zealous wedge
aww
sly fog
There's bStats/config.yml in the plugins folder
zealous wedge
time to beat up some server hosts?
golden gust
People contributing to stats is nice, however; We literally don't get paid, so being able to see that people use our stuff is pretty much the only real thing we get lol
zealous wedge
peak dirge
If they force Java 11 as a minimum, then that would be enough for me to do it
limber knotBOT
imagine if they moved to java 14 for their client when they update their renderer
cedar spade
@spiral eagle That is a default bStats metric (or at least was, when we set it up)
peak dirge
Our power is growing, but slowly.
zealous wedge
I feel like they'll only go to an LTS release
limber knotBOT
afaik every plugin can track that by simply adding a graph with the correct name and field
peak dirge
Well, Java 17 isn't too far off
mighty storm
They're their own support
zealous wedge
yeah, it's like a year? now, since java 15 is just being released
peak dirge
Hopefully that means we get a proper FFI and primitive collections
minor badge
yeah it's next september
zealous wedge
it's the corporate world, they'll want to go with a platform they can purchase support for if they need it
peak dirge
Not really 8 cores. It's really reporting the number of logical processors, which counts hyper-threading.
mighty storm
not related but sure
cedar spade
"8+ core" systems are often shared hosts with multiple server instances running
peak dirge
It's more likely those are old 4 core/8 thread Intel systems from the days where that was the highest core/thread count you could get on a mainstream "gaming" chip
golden gust
I think we're gonna have to wait for some super awesome java feature or some global event where all intel GPUs die and all their manf plans spontaniously compust
cedar spade
I mean, Mojang could just... drop old hardware...
peak dirge
Well, until that pesky AMD came in and made $500 4-core chips obsoleted by $400-500 12-core chips
golden gust
It's their intel GPU driver hacks which are the issue
limber knotBOT
can you even play 1.16 with more then 5 fps on these?!?
cedar spade
was under the impression you can use newer Java versions with newer Intel graphics chipsets, just certain old ones had the issue?
peak dirge
yeah, I think it was like ancient Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge integrated graphics?
golden gust
I have no idea, it's intel
peak dirge
those require a specific old version of Java to get decent performance?
zealous wedge
does ivy bridge count as ancient now? wasn't that only 2012?
lol optifine is not a performance mod
golden gust
Mojangs JRE has a driver hack for intel GPUs
peak dirge
yes, it's from 2012 and is definitely ancient
golden gust
Are those era of intel "GPU"s even using supported OGL versions? o.O
zealous wedge
it's really not... I know so many people with 2012 laptops
peak dirge
But then again, the game works fine with newer versions of Java
zealous wedge
until last summer I was on ivy bridge on my desktop lol
golden gust
the game itself is fine
zealous wedge
it's the Intel driver's fault
peak dirge
Also helps that I don't use a broken, insecure OS with a GPU that is barely able to handle video decoding.
zealous wedge
but of course Intel won't be helpful
peak dirge
Intel would rather you upgrade your computer.
zealous wedge
well yes
minor badge
@twin lagoon https://youtu.be/v5C68aoORAE 🥺
twin lagoon
🥺
cedar spade
again I didn't think the JRE itself had the hack, just newer JREs were detected/flagged up by intel drivers and borked by them?
zealous wedge
yeah, it's a thing in the exe manifest
peak dirge
@zealous wedge though for 1.1.0 I do plan to push Java 11 as a recommended minimum
minor badge
if you want/need java 11 features, use it
don't let your userbase decide your technical limitations
peak dirge
we do have a compression optimization that requires it
minor badge
java 11 is the default on ubuntu, debian, arch, and more anyways
golden gust
Well, yea
minor badge
so they're going out of their way to stay outdated
golden gust
But, shared hosts
zealous wedge
ah yes let me make configurate java 11+
minor badge
shared hosts should not be a concern
zealous wedge
that'd go over so well
peak dirge
@minor badge We already do, though. We're using MethodHandles. Also, we got plenty of dum Windows users using Velocity.
golden gust
I mean, they shouldn't be a concern, but, they are something you have to consider
minor badge
adoptopenjdk pushes java 11 as default choice i believe
they can stay on velocity 1.0, cat :p
golden gust
But, they can't
minor badge
outdated software for outdated software
void void
What did you guys eat for breakfast?
golden gust
Ideally we'd bitchslap the fuck out of shared hosts who are that incompetent, bu, at the same point, we're stuck with what we got
Not like we can really say "oh, yea, go use X a host instead, they support java whatever and are good"
minor badge
if he needs java 11 features, they can either choose to stay on outdated, unsupported software, or move on to modern times
golden gust
The problem is that consumers often don't have a choice
It's easy to say "fuck those on unsupported versions", but, realistically, that's literally 90% of people running your software on a managed host
minor badge
lots of hosts nowadays supports java 11/14 through some option (often just renaming jar but it works...)
zealous wedge
Also forge is iffy on newer javas
golden gust
which is often undocumented and hiding around the internet somewhere
minor badge
then it's back to the host's fault; they should document it in their FAQ or the likes, in a page such as "How to run Velocity"
peak dirge
basically, we have to set a baseline and stick to that
zealous wedge
especially the older big mod pack versions are java 8 only
peak dirge
sad, but how can we fix customer ignorance?
golden gust
^ which is entirely the issue
peak dirge
not all of us are veteran system administrators and developers
golden gust
A customer is gonna shove velocity on a java 8 shared host,blow up, ree and move on
minor badge
still isn't velocity's fault
golden gust
No
minor badge
the host has to move on to modern software
golden gust
But who do you think is going to get the flack of it?
This isn't a fantasy world where you can print some message somewhere and hosts magically upgrade
minor badge
don't really care; it's a simple "Move to one of these hosts X, Y, or Z who support Java 11"
golden gust
Well, it's not your platform....
minor badge
i do that with my own plugins
golden gust
Nor is there a list of hosts who support java 9+ who aren't shit
and you'll take a userbase knock because of that
minor badge
if they're not going to use up to date software, i'm not going to change mine to handle them
golden gust
If that's what you wanna do, go for it
But, at the end of the day, your userbase is going to be smaller because of your choice
minor badge
fine by me lol, i'm still not going to take a step back in time due to someone being determined to be outdated
golden gust
I really want mojang to bump the java version
Just so that I can watch all the people cry who are using shitty shared hosts
peak dirge
Again, if Mojang bumps the minimum, I really really really will bump Velocity ASAP to the version they choose as their new LTS.
But that probably won't happen for a while.
Java 8 is still going to get bug fixes and security patches until 2030
waxen panther
Tux is my favourite developer
golden gust
brb, writing a magical virus which will spend the next few months silently spreading, and eventually pop all affected intel GPUs
jovial cloak
I just realized I could make AMP auto opt out everyone from papers metrics xD
So they had to manually opt in
golden gust
brb, working on AMP detection
minor badge
and not like it'd make a difference in the metrics anyways :')
waxen panther
L
jovial cloak
Privacy nominally, I could add it to AMPs privacy settings on first setup
Although it's be a little redundant in the highsec mode where the outgoing firewall is an IP whitelist
sand estuary
huh I normally look these types of discord up myself but I never expected myself for them to go look for me when I had a PaperMC discord invite in my dm's lol
finite wave
Xuxk
mighty storm
ill buy it by running git clone and mvn package
sand estuary
I probs got that on my list, I mean I do have around 60 premium plugins on spigot
heady spear
we use gradle so hah
heady spear
tho we do publish poms
so you could prolly use mvn package
I don't know. I much prefer maven D:
minor badge
why not use gradle?
mighty storm
when i was younger i thought pom was porn
i mean rn looks like m
gradle is too confusing plus i hate the idea of putting gradle in every project that uses it
minor badge
you should use a wrapper for maven too
and how is it confusing lol
its just a build file
heady spear
I mean gradle is pretty sick, and if you have a more complicated build setup then you should definitely use it because maven becomes quite cancerous
mighty storm
too complicated, I like my nice organized xml structure
minor badge
my gradle build script is also organised and simple
mighty storm
the only thing gradle has that i see as a pro is the specifying what repo deps belong to
heady spear
the fact that you can actually script shit is pretty hot
mighty storm
con is the pom from the dep has to match the requested version, learned that the hard way 👀
heady spear
so as soon as I need to actually customize the build process, I use gradle.
minor badge
you can make it do anything maven can
mighty storm
my build process 99% of the time is mvn clean package
minor badge
and same other way around
minor badge
same with me for gradle with ./gradlew shadowJar
mighty storm
the hell is a shadowJar, is this sonic or something
minor badge
thats shadowing libs into the jar
mighty storm
throwing shade at the jars icy icy
minor badge
shading is shadowing; original term was shadow
heady spear
either way, I think maven and gradle are both very good and capable tools and they are both tools that I make use of
bazel and buck on the other hand were made by Satan
to inflict pain on humanity
minor badge
leiningen is superior to all 😳
mighty storm
I love when I see rory and she goes 'hey!'
minor badge
@void void wanna write a clojure compiler 😳😳
heady spear
I love me
left swift
U sure
heady spear
shut up
left swift
Sry dad
heady spear
https://cubecoders.com/AMP
is this the stuff that was blatantly advertised 950 times in here?
minor badge
yes
digital peak
finaly updating to 1.16.2 from 1.16.1
heady spear
The discord button not aligning with the other buttons triggers me
digital peak
should i really backup the server before updating?
minor badge
yes?
digital peak
bc the server map file is like 70gb
minor badge
still yes...
heady spear
hallonsaft<3
next wind
lmao they might want to work on the design a bit more
heady spear
I love nazi panels
left swift
Reskin pterodactyl and sell it for money
heady spear
tbf without the rotation it's basically the hindu swastika
so this is clearly cultural appropriation
mighty storm
👀
heady spear
Reskin pterodactyl and sell it for money
great idea
left swift
I'm telling
left swift
U just assume my species
heady spear
the amp issue tracker is full of breaking issues lel seems very trustworthy
the perk of foss is that you can fix broken shit yourself and then help others
left swift
Isn't there an energy drink called amp
left swift
This panel is just doomed from the start lol
heady spear
also the ptero website is a lot sexier
so instant win
it looks way more professional 👀
and considering it's a web panel, I'd expect their website to not be 💩
heady spear
only time I'm fine with non-oss shit is when it comes to games
zealous wedge
we support new mcma
left swift
Stan
left swift
Minecraft machine attacks
left swift
Mom cant make art
zealous wedge
mcmyadmin
left swift
Lol
heady spear
oh yuck
zealous wedge
the old panel ppl used
mighty storm
ius that like phpmyadmin
heady spear
out of all the shitty panels that exist out there
pterodactyl is the least shit
I've used mcmyadmin
it ew
left swift
That was like the panel every host used in 2013
mighty storm
how many hosts actually use their own panel
zealous wedge
there's a reason amp exists :p
mighty storm
i know of 2 but ive only used 2
left swift
Ovh does
mighty storm
well, minecraft hosts
mighty storm
i know of 2
mcpro uses their own for minecraft and terraria, and multicraft for all the other games :p confuses the shit out of people lmao
i think serverminer has their own too?
idk how theyre doin
zealous wedge
see multicraft is and always will be the worst panel
olive marlin
I saw most hosts using ptero with custom skins.
zealous wedge
because you get logs where all the important parts are skipped
heady spear
I didn't mind using ptero when we still used panels
golden gust
a handful do, I used to work for a host which dev'd their own in house panel
zealous wedge
from its stupid fucking rate limiting
golden gust
The thing is that most hosts don't wanna pay for a dev team to implement this stuff
mighty storm
nowadays i just give them ssh access and say have fun
golden gust
it's much easier to just shove WHCMS, ptero/multi and call it a hosting provider
golden gust
Yea
left swift
Billing stuff
jovial cloak
@next wind thats from a very old version, it's the default image from gravatar
These days it uses the 'mystery person' icon
next wind
oh the weird swastika?
mighty storm
i actually saw how the backend of mcpro's works, it's actually very cool. so many tools they never fucking use such as: turning off new servers on nodes when it gets near capacity
jovial cloak
Yeah, that's the default from gravatar if you give it an MD5 sum of an empty string
mighty storm
oh thats how those are generated
void void
@void void wanna write a clojure compiler 😳😳
@minor badge probably not
jovial cloak
@heady spear also there are no breaking issues right now.
void void
current one works ok
next wind
are you a dev on that @jovial cloak
minor badge
heck
jovial cloak
@next wind I'm the dev
next wind
alright
next wind
^
zealous wedge
be wrong city I guess
jovial cloak
The cubecoders site itself is due for a makeover, it's based on Bootstrap 2 xD
jovial cloak
But on the whole people don't get put off as evidenced by sales volume
mighty storm
bootstrap 2?? isn't 5 in beta
vernal moth
Yes
jovial cloak
It's not been touched in a long time, had other priorities
heady spear
be wrong city I guess
tf how can I be wrong about my own impression of something
vernal moth
Bootstrap 3 was 2013
left swift
#zmlisoverparty
mighty storm
ah yes
jovial cloak
Cubecoders was founded in 2012, blimey really puts it in perspective xD
I've been doing this full time for 8 years
heady spear
is it CubeCoders or Cubecoders? 👀
left swift
The question we all wondered
jovial cloak
CubeCoders when styled
Hey whoever just saw the site, did you see the light or the dark theme?
heady spear
noman, the hashtag isn't trending yet
next wind
dark theme
heady spear
we need to spread it so ppl know that zml is in fact cancelled D:
left swift
Send retweets
heady spear
i mean depends on your definition of ugly
if your definition is correct then I disagree
jovial cloak
Interesting that view since its the same layout on both more or less
left swift
City so mean today
mighty storm
so ive a question
jovial cloak
The app is sexy tho
mighty storm
let's say you're at school and wanna play some minecraft. there's just one problem: mojang.com and minecraft.net are blocked, so you can't sign in to your accoutn. is using an offline mode server justified in this scenario, given that everyone already owns the game?
mighty storm
this was last year
jovial cloak
@next wind what would you change there?
golden gust
That's part of the primary reason why offline mode exists...
next wind
less clutter, more consistent theme, better colors
simpler menu
Make the buttons for all the social media and stuff align
make that image at the top not look like a demo and more of a picture
jovial cloak
Are you on a high dpi display perchance?
heady spear
activate your windows you heathen
next wind
only reason to switch to linux
heady spear
and what is that giant green monster in the bottom right corner
mighty storm
activating windows is like $100 smh
mighty storm
oh just like real life
heady spear
I bought my license for $20
I need it for the dual boot that I use once per year**
wtf day
mighty storm
still too much for a decent at best OS, $0 take it or leave it
heady spear
freudian slip lol
left swift
Bunch of os pirates here
heady spear
I have some weird app on my windows boot that keeps activating rgb shit in my pc
so am always afraid to boot into windows
bcuz it turns my apartment into an impromptu rave
mighty storm
how is it pirating
you lefgit download it from microsoft
do you not know what pirating is
next wind
hes talking about city
mighty storm
it's more freeloading than anything, but it's designed to be that way lol
heady spear
what how am I a pirate
next wind
but its like 150 dollars on microsofts website
left swift
Why u getting so defensive it's a joke
heady spear
I own a windows license and I use ubuntu budgie as my daily driver
jovial cloak
@next wind can I get your thoughts on the Linux tutorial video?
mighty storm
reminder linux is free 😎
minor badge
BOTH as in libre and as in gratis
next wind
@next wind can I get your thoughts on the Linux tutorial video?
@jovial cloak i dont have linux lol
jovial cloak
@next wind I know, that's the point
heady spear
what
quasi valley
imagine needing a french and a german term to say what "free" means
jovial cloak
As someone who doesn't use it what your impressions are.
left swift
heady spear
gratis is also a very scandinavian term so
jovial cloak
minor badge
gratis and libre are both from latin
left swift
Flavortown
heady spear
from grātuītō
minor badge
uhh
next wind
yeah that tutorial is good
heady spear
yarn is sexy
jovial cloak
@next wind would you say it makes you think "okay yeah I could do this"?
heady spear
@potent fossil was it u that was raving about nuxt because I like it so far
it's good
next wind
yeah its simple
jovial cloak
To someone who isn't massively familiar with linux
heady spear
now I have 950 thousand questions for u
heady spear
tf the video is just reading the stuff that is printed in the terminal
I suppose it's nice that you care about visually impaired people
left swift
jovial cloak
The subtitles were literally just me dumping the script I read out into a text file xD
next wind
nice to watch before you buy the product though so that you know its simple
jovial cloak
I love how YouTube handles that
It matches up the subtitles file for you automatically
zealous wedge
@heady spear cancel me bby
heady spear
why do people ping pong me
quasi valley
🏓
zealous wedge
what are you 20 or sth lukaor
heady spear
did you stop to consider whether or not I wanted to get ping ponged
zealous wedge
no
heady spear
selfish
zealous wedge
@heady spear i won't stop
heady spear
i like u less than that weird stank coming from my dishes
ur basically sink dirt to me
zealous wedge
sad
heady spear
u should be more like kenny
zealous wedge
why :3
heady spear
kenny is very nice
zealous wedge
imagine being upside down smh
heady spear
he doesn't randomly ping pong me
ooooo nuxt dev mode hot hot
I might actually like web development
I've refused to do anything web related since like 2015
left swift
More pictures for the #zmlisoverparty trend
heady spear
or well, front end web stuff
left swift
Cancel culture is free karma
zealous wedge
cancel me harder
left swift
Lol
regal path
does anyone know of an alternative to paper for fabric/forge
heady spear
👀 spönge
regal path
hm
heady spear
well, soon at least
viral hornet
twin lagoon
@viral hornet 🥺
zealous wedge
merry talon
Stop using them to clean dishes, they have rights
zealous wedge
worn ember
No simp September
zealous wedge
:3 no
ebon jolt
hello world
worn ember
Bukkit.shutdown()
worn ember
ok i wont
jovial cloak
I really wanna experiment with my terrain generation and deformation offloading...
done properly you could detonate huge amounts of TNT without any performance impact
worn ember
you can already do that
jovial cloak
not the way I've got it in mind
worn ember
only 100tnt is processed a tick or something
jovial cloak
loool that's only a side-effect, not the main idea
the plan is that your Minecraft server wouldn't perform terrain generation of deformation processing locally at all
you'd offload it to a more powerful machine
I've wanted to build a CUDA accelerated terrain generator for ages
I already talked about this, I could - but probably won't
the idea I've had is that you'd have a beefy server with a couple of nVidia TESLA cards in it
and have it serve terrain logic for multiple actual game servers
It'd be a plugin and an application that you ran on a separate server
you could make a paid service out of it easily enough though
it'd massively increase how many players you could handle
Terrain gen is a fairly big consumer of CPU time yes
Pathfinding is also way up there for mobs
a lot of those tasks could be GPU accelerated though
the thing is this is real "big boy" stuff here, because most people are not using servers with beefy GPUs in
something like an nVidia Tesla K80M runs at over $4K USD
yeah its crazy
void void
<@&748618676189528155>
golden gust
?ban @void void spam
leaden oxideBOT
mute spittah#9042 was banned | spam
golden gust
Really, no auto delete, that's fucking ass
golden gust
it does
waxen panther
Not hard for the bots to get around lmao
golden gust
or, did...
mighty storm
probably hacked accounts
golden gust
issue is that not everybody has phones
Not like getting a phone number is super hard
mighty storm
Gay
waxen panther
Not as sexy as proxi
queen moat
Does anyone know of some plugins that allow for timers?
Like, something to fire a redstone pulse every 60 seconds
worn ember
does it have to be a plugin? you could make a timer using redstone
worn ember
Truckerman
void void
jane truck
next wind
Why not just have a hopper clock
queen moat
Because I don't want to use that much redstone
grand pewter
i know its a joke
next wind
you would need 1500 repeaters if i did my math correctly
worn ember
only plugins i can find is to prevent it 
next wind
eh a hopper clock wouldnt be that bad
woven otter
🏳️🌈
@mighty storm shouldn't that include all colors?
next wind
it might have some performance impact though if you have a bunch
finite wave
queen moat
So literally no plugin exists for this
hallow swallow
anyone knows
queen moat
yike
mighty storm
<@!> shouldn't that include all colors?
@woven otter wha
finite wave
He said the lgqbt flag was racist
woven otter
@left swift I think that's because wiz was demoted
hallow swallow
@next wind it works
left swift
I was here only 1 hour ago
hallow swallow
but shows like it doesnt exist
next wind
because you dont have it registered
finite wave
I mean
hallow swallow
how to register it?
woven otter
@left swift 
left swift
next wind
thats different for each plugin
finite wave
Send the command packet
woven otter
ping pong
next wind
🏓
left swift
void void
finite wave
ashen cliff
Oh. My 250GB estimate was a bit off: https://posili.me/i/2020-09-05_21-27-50.png
Found the AuthMe user.
golden gust
literally nothing new there
ashen cliff
Paper ads everywhere.
glad narwhal
green?
@hallow swallow As i know add chat color before the word or smth
queen moat
data modify block ~-2 ~ ~ set value {TransferCooldown:5}
I'm trying to make a custom cooldown timer by using a commandblock like this, but it's not working at all, anyone got a clue?
worn ember
space between ~ and -2 maybe?
mighty storm
that'll just be ~ for x and -2 for y i think
quasi valley
didn't know blocks could hold nbt?
mighty storm
Grass is snowy or not snowy
quasi valley
that's a blockstate property, not nbt
queen moat
I found this in a 1.13 command and tried adapting it for 1.16
mighty storm
Ah okay
mighty storm
it was a fix
mortal zinc
it's quite old, but still funny
mighty storm
A very vital fix
mortal zinc
i was actually talking to spigot recently, tried to offer an alternative to the build delay
basically extend JIRA to reject tickets for outdated builds, then they don't even need this
mighty storm
We just close if it's less than 1.15.2
mortal zinc
then md_5 chimes in with another reason I hadn't considered: he just doesn't want people to experience bugs from outdated versions
kinda strange
i get where he's coming from, but I don't like his solution
limber knotBOT
I mean, if you really want to run an old version you just disable the delay ¯_(ツ)_/¯
mortal zinc
true
i'd do that always, but if i release a tool into the wild that supports spigot servers, I don't imagine SpigotMC would like if I included that param when starting the server
i mean, specific to posting a resource to their repositoriy
queen swift
.g Suggestion 1.16
limber knotBOT
(DiscordBot) https://forums.minehut.com/topic/21888-suggestion-116-compatible-jobs/ -- (Suggestion) 1.16+ Compatible Jobs - Plugins - Minehut...: "Aug 16, 2020 ... Hi, Im making a post just to request that a 1.16 compatible jobs plugin gets added (for example jobs reborn on Spigot). My friend..."
queen swift
Fuck this men xd
worn ember
demon has a nice way with words
potent fossil
tbh that is a fix
mortal zinc
fixing md_5's blunders
mortal zinc
lol
potent fossil
(for legal reasons that's a joke Choco)
mortal zinc
😮
left swift
Hi simp
potent fossil
Kamusta mana
worn ember
Namaste
mighty storm
nani
quasi valley
mighty storm
Oh kneny
We were talking about your list of shame somewhere
Someone was talking about Spartan so I linked your list
quasi valley
somewhere
quasi valley
good thing that person wasn't near me
vernal moth
Uwu?
mighty storm
mini nooo
quasi valley
lazy eye mini again
twin lagoon
uwu
quasi valley
twin lagoon
f
mighty storm
Now I only pet Rory and :3
twin lagoon
rory!
mighty storm
yes
twin lagoon
how's rory
zealous wedge
uwu
mighty storm
hai z0w0
zealous wedge
you should go home
mighty storm
hello
vernal moth
Not having a car near to pet is an emergency
potent fossil
UWU BACK AT ME
vernal moth
Car
potent fossil
THIS IS NOT OK
mighty storm
:3
quasi valley
NO
vernal moth
Yes gboard
quasi valley
DONT DO IT
mighty storm
Honestly I agree (assuming you mean cat)
potent fossil
ÛwÛ
vernal moth
Why is somebody streaming in waiting room?
mighty storm
join my server where we have a channel dedicated to uwuing that you have to manually be added to
potent fossil
ok dm link
quasi valley
cuz rigby
vernal moth
Phone at 7%, time to sleep
mighty storm
Streaming but deafened
Hm
I wish there was a channel you could join that would channel deafen you but not mute
Like a void to scream into
pastel pivot
Can someone help me with this Minecraft and swing related question please? My experience with swing is very limited and SO doesn't seem to be the right place to ask this. https://stackoverflow.com/q/63757771/3882565
potent fossil
SO is the right place, that's just not an SO-quality question
Let me read it hold on
potent fossil
hmm
mighty storm
lmao
potent fossil
im not sure how to start debugging that stonar
mighty storm
Make a voice channel called "no dashes" smh
pastel pivot
okay thanks anyway.
pastel pivot
yes probably .. 🤔
potent fossil
Btw, SO will like for you to include code snippets in the question text, what you tried, what is not making sense, etc. SO is much more like a reference manual than a QA site, so the questions need to be super descriptive which is hard for ppl to do sometimes
Just, for future
limber knotBOT
one of the stackexchange.com sites might be better
zealous wedge
@mighty storm theres been an emergency