folia-help

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[livid crag]

when its more stable and more developer plugin supports as a regular user, you should just wait.

[keen fable]

steps ?

[livid crag]

steps to make it happen

[arctic tapir]

1. spawn villager
2. make it go thru portal
3. look at console
4. cry

[livid crag]

I think you did it

[upper marten]

How to build Folia?

[arctic tapir]

clone repo

[karmic urchin]

Out of ram

[arctic tapir]

applyParches

and ram

[steel glade]

are the G1GC flags from aikar's flags recommended for folia? I'm doing a staging run with ~20 people who are pretty run out

[inner swift]

Should be okay

[steel glade]

sounds neat

i made a pterodactyl egg that just has the download link set to my jenkins instance building folia, it's hacky but it will do for now

[jagged ether]

fyi built jars are on the API afaik

[deft hatch]

its just for me that command blocks aren't working?

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[steel glade]

are they?

i didn't think they'd be ready yet

[sudden tusk]

Please do read the announcement as well as the above message from the bot.

[steel glade]

yeah thats what i was thinking

I only use it for my internal staging environment

literally just a jenkins instance on my lan

[jagged ether]

Ptero egg making seems like a valid use case to me

[sudden tusk]

Best not be distributing anything now, leaving it to folks competent enough to build themselves :3

Not slandering anyone who isn't. Just... it's not the right time for everyone to be poking this beast. It's very, very early! 🙂

[steel glade]

you don't see me sending the link do you I'm just using it myself

only a matter of time before the issues flood in anyway im sure ShitBukkit and all 80,000 of those sites will have it up in no time 🙃

[keen fable]

Use snapshot releases from their discord

[steel glade]

to my understanding for this, ticking regions in parallel still has a chance to be more efficient with <massive amounts of players and <32 hardware threads it's just that the most performance gain over stock paper

also I've had good experiences so far running high thread count applications on my M2 mac i'm pretty sure it will scale up fine

macos's scheduler is insane

[steel glade]

the gymnastics that modern kernels have to do to assign proper affinities to high and low power cores is mad

[finite hinge]

There are number of threads used already in Paper for chunk IO, chunkgen, netty, etc so you're probably already using more than you think or otherwise starving the system because you don't have enough cores available. Add to that the overhead caused by setting up the region threading system and you need to be able to run a few regions to make up the difference

If you can only run one region at a time it isn't worth it, 2-4 probably isn't worth it, depends on your server/players

If your world is pregenerated you can probably get away with fewer than 16 cores but not that many fewer

Oh yeah I forgot you also have threads for GC and since you're trying to get more players and more chunks going at once you're going to have larger heaps so those have more work to do too

https://github.com/PaperMC/Folia/#how-to-best-configure-folia has some example numbers for all of those

Like 16 cores might be too few for 300 players even, it will depend on your setup

[steel glade]

Thanks for the info, this is a gold mine! Someone should pin this

[finite hinge]

I mostly just repeated what's in that link I gave at the end

Well, I forgot it was in there until after I wrote it all out 😛

For our test setup I think 32 cores was too few even

But that was over 300 players actively trying to abuse it without a pregenerated world

I mean, we had 64 cores but yeah, 32 would have been too few

I suspect some of the chunkgen stuff was scalability issues though rather than 16 threads not being enough

[steel glade]

New worldgen is sllllllllooooooooooowwwww

I’ve noticed it even on small worlds

[steel glade]

Is it IO-bound at that scale?

[livid crag]

I think leaf concluded that’s really just worldgen being slow that being the core issue during test. That’s why pregen is plastered everywhere on the readme as recommendation.

[daring nimbus]

It is slower than on Paper though, which is a bit unexpected

[finite hinge]

chunkgen is making the chunks from scratch, not loading them from disk

[steel glade]

I mean like

[finite hinge]

Saving them happens later too so no IO

[steel glade]

Memory and saving

[midnight warren]

Hey quick question, if I have a world on Folia, can I expect it to work on Paper if I drop it in to a Paper server from Folia?

[daring nimbus]

Yes, that will work

[rotund fossil]

https://is-my-eboy.lol/​‌⁠⁠‌‍⁠‍​‍‌‍​‌‌‌​‌‍⁠⁠​‍​​​⁠‌⁠​​

chunky isn't supported

it doesn't load when i put it in

[fierce knot]

message.txt by @rotund fossil: https://pastes.dev/K9aimEvJ9J

[karmic urchin]

You must use dev builds : https://ci.codemc.io/view/Author/job/pop4959/job/Chunky/461/

[next bloom]

the plugin has to actually support folia, you can't just change any plugin to make it work with folia by flipping some value in a config

[rotund fossil]

is velocity/bungeecord supported by folia?

would velocity plugins kill itself

[twin kernel]

Has anyone here built an economy plugin that supports Folia yet?

I guess I need to make one myself for testing. but just lazy aha

[prime glen]

Well it's a Paper fork

so probably it supports a proxy server

[rotund fossil]

with so many custom stuff

[prime glen]

https://tryitands.ee

[prime glen]

Vault?

[twin kernel]

the economy thats support Vault

[fiery vessel]

It doesn't look like any support folia yet

[prime glen]

Essentials

[twin kernel]

I have one Vault that support Folia already

[prime glen]

Or any plugin that doesn't do anything else rather than just have a database for it's economy

[rotund fossil]

haha

[twin kernel]

Really? Essentials doesn't seem to support Folia yet

[rotund fossil]

i have a 16 core cpu laying around

[prime glen]

maybe try Ultra Economy but i think that it's payed

[prime glen]

have you tried to see what's broken?

You can take a look at the api related stuff that has been reported as being broken in the readme

[twin kernel]

As far as I know, if the developer does not add the support keyword (folia-supported: true) to plugin.yml, Folia will refuse to load it

[fiery vessel]

Folia is vastly different from paper, I suspect a great deal of things would be broken

[prime glen]

well yeah that's how it works

but you can try it and see if it's actually broken by putting that line in plugin.yml

[twin kernel]

Essentials definitely has a large number of schedulers, Folia completely breaks Bukkit's scheduler and Essentials most likely won't be able to finish loading ...... at all (of course doesn't work)

[prime glen]

but yeah i also suspect that essentials is broken as it's a pretty complex plugin that does a ton of stuff

[unique crystal]

Essentials has a branch

https://github.com/EssentialsX/Essentials/tree/refactor/folia

[prime glen]

also this is very useful when searching for plugins to test out https://github.com/PaperMC/Folia#current-broken-api

[twin kernel]

This is definitely what I wanted, clone and build tests immediately

thanks for your help

[twin kernel]

Yes, I checked this list.
I'm finishing the adaptation of my own plugin.

[rotund fossil]

is there an anticheat that supports folia rn?

[cyan wasp]

How to build folia?

[unique crystal]

read papers readme, its the same process

[ivory dust]

How do I download

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[jagged ether]

You can build the server yourself

[rotund fossil]

Why though?

It isn't hard to run gradlew applyPatches

then the other command

just type gradlew tasks

and they'll all show up

[viral stone]

Because the builds are provided primarily for devs/people who know what they're getting into

the expectation is that if folia is for you at this point in time, you can run a few basic commands

We don't want people handing out jars at this moment because it increases the burden of support we have to deal with from people who fail to read

[tidal bay]

W thinking

[plain shuttle]

[Folia-1]no main manifest attribute, in

what does this mean?

[jagged ether]

Read the PaperMC/Paper README.md on how to build and do the same with Folia

[keen fable]

Can someone try to reproduce ?
https://github.com/PaperMC/Folia/issues/27

[arctic tapir]

2 sec

can reproduce

[keen fable]

Thanks

[idle furnace]

do we have a way to count current active regions, or get the region from the ServerTickEndEvent ?

[tranquil epoch]

currently no way to, plan to add something though later

[idle furnace]

thanks for the feedback m8

and keep up the excellent work!

[tulip blaze]

I noticed that CraftScheduler.handle has had support removed, was there a suggested alt to this in Folia?

[arctic tapir]

using the right scheduler

[tulip blaze]

Alright, so is there a global scheduler that replaces the Bukkit.getScheduler().runTaskTimer calls?

Is it the AsyncScheduler?

[arctic tapir]

suggest you read this: https://github.com/PaperMC/folia#the-new-rules

but yes, probably depending on what you're doing

[tulip blaze]

Hilariously enough I did read that but looked over the "acting as a replacement for the BukkitScheduler." part

thank you

[tulip blaze]

I'm just using it as a general timer to read online player locales for translations

so the region stuff really wouldn't be needed, more like the global aspect

[idle furnace]

In ServerTickEndEvent the getTickNumber() shouldn't return the current tick, considering more then one region? I have noticed that all events increment it and expected some repetitions.

[lucid basin]

Will Folia Support 1.16.5? (Or High,Lower Versions)

[dreamy dirge]

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[lucid basin]

[idle furnace]

but will be possible to update your world to 1.19.4

[lucid basin]

great for survival server, awful for boxmining server.. (according to me)

[ebon rivet]

How much blocks needed went from center of laggy region to entire in not laggy region?

[dreamy dirge]

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[sudden tusk]

Please rephrase, this sentence is not comprehensible

[true bolt]

Can someone help me building Folia? Im using the guide https://github.com/PaperMC/Paper#how-to-compiling-jar-from-source but when I use the createReobfBundlerJar im getting these error:

PS C:\Users\mayiv\Downloads\Folia-master> .\gradlew createReobfBundlerJar
fatal: not a git repository (or any of the parent directories): .git

FAILURE: Build failed with an exception.

* What went wrong:
Could not determine the dependencies of task ':createReobfBundlerJar'.
> Could not resolve all dependencies for configuration ':serverRuntimeClasspath'.
   > Could not create task ':folia-server:jar'.
      > Command finished with 128 exit code: git -c commit.gpgsign=false -c core.safecrlf=false rev-parse --short=7 HEAD

* Try:
> Run with --stacktrace option to get the stack trace.
> Run with --info or --debug option to get more log output.
> Run with --scan to get full insights.

* Get more help at https://help.gradle.org

BUILD FAILED in 596ms
PS C:\Users\mayiv\Downloads\Folia-master>

[ebon rivet]

How much does a region count for in folia? Units of measurement - blocks

[sudden tusk]

That's answered by the middle link I think

[livid crag]

please read the readme page, it has an explanation.

[hexed ice]

fatal: not a git repository (or any of the parent directories): .git
You need to clone the repo, not download as zip

[true bolt]

Ow, thank u, im gonna try that

[ebon rivet]

This information is not provided in FAQ

[hexed ice]

the faq link is not the middle link

[sudden tusk]

As I said it's the middle link

[idle furnace]

it seems i am quite outdated, what is BoxMining ?

[lucid basin]

a game mode where you mining and fight in a box (translate)

[ebon rivet]

Readme information look same than in FAQ

[idle furnace]

region size? If can be small or quite big, depends on the number of players on it

[ebon rivet]

For example now I tested, and it's needed around ~1500 blocks to change region (Point (Without lags) < -- ~1500 Blocks player moved < -- High utilized region center (/tps information) with huge lags)

[sudden tusk]

the middle link.

[idle furnace]

I think the region follows the playing, until the player meets another one. Been that the blocks in it get added and removed as the player moves +-

[sudden tusk]

You don't need to assume or guess. The middle link, which I have mentioned three times as being the place that documents it, explains it all.

[keen fable]

hey! Someone else got strange redstone bugs (redstone not triggering) ? I cannot figure out how to reproduce step by step. It just happens, sometimes.

[inner swift]

Is that some kind of clock that's crossing chunk borders?

[keen fable]

No, everything is inside the same chunk. I've seen some strange bugs on 1-tick clocks, even in a single chunk. I'm trying to reproduce but it seems kind of random

Its like, everything is locked, redstone don't change its state

Even destroying/replacing blocks don't work

Example: Clock on the right is locked. Even when you destroy / replace observers. Clock on the left works. everything is inside the same chunk

Design

[candid shadow]

Which java do I use to build?

idk which one is newest

the only one that says its a jdk is the eclipse one

oh fuck this ill just try it on wsl

[candid shadow]

cant find where to get gradlew like anywhere

oh dumbass me

[keen fable]

i was wondering. Can i report this issue with a region file ?

[livid crag]

Yes, please test on regular paper and with vanilla redstone selected and see

If it works with regular paper, file a report with the region files included.

[keen fable]

It doesn't appear anymore. It might be me

[livid crag]

Could also be vanilla, weird stuff does happens but if you find a way to reproduce it, make sure to open an issue!

[sharp trellis]

Where do I download this and is it better then normal paper?

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[arctic tapir]

#folia-help message

all 3

[sharp trellis]

alright thanks

I have 12 cores

[livid crag]

That’s awesome. The page linked gives you a general recommendations

[sharp trellis]

so it should be fine?

[livid crag]

12 core may see no benefit if not performance degradation

Minimum recommended is 16+ physical cores

[sharp trellis]

I have 64gb of ram so I should be good with ram I think

I'm not doing near 100 players so I definitely should be good

[inner swift]

Are you sure you need Folia? Paper can run 100 on a good 12 core just fine (assuming 3900x)

[livid crag]

Then you should be perfectly fine with regular Paper

[sharp trellis]

I have 12 cores so id assume id want to use them

instead of just 1

[livid crag]

Regular paper already uses more than 1 just in different areas.

[sharp trellis]

oh

[livid crag]

Please read the project page for the information. It is explained why a minimum of 16 is strongly recommended

[sharp trellis]

ya alright I already read a little bit but ill read the rest

ya I'm gonna go with normal paper for now at least

thanks

[keen fable]

Depends on server needs, if you need 10 simulation distance, 10+ view distance and 8 mob spawning range 100 players will probably crash the server

[inner swift]

Yes, I'm assuming a standard setup (as in, normal multiplayer setups at that player range are assumed to have some compromise)

[arctic scaffold]

100+ is only possible on paper if you butcher gameplay

[keen fable]

I know that my opinion may be controversial, but I think that Folia works better than paper for ~= 50 players with vanilla gameplay on a 12 core server.* (*If you configure it carefully)

[arctic scaffold]

idk tbh

[inner swift]

Might be true, let's say close-ish to 100

[finite hinge]

If you have the hardware for it Folia is going to almost always be a win

But you have to have the hardware for it

[arctic scaffold]

how much of a win could it be with 50 people tho?

50 is easy on paper

[finite hinge]

The only time it won't be a win is when all your players are grouped in one location or when you don't have enough cores to actually benefit from region threads

[arctic scaffold]

with minimal configuration

[keen fable]

Not if you keep vanilla behavior, thanks to Folia players can now build awful things like this without bothering other players

[finite hinge]

On another note I'm pretty sure we saw a server running Folia today with 600 players

[arctic scaffold]

that was 2b2t i think

[finite hinge]

Yeah

[arctic scaffold]

absolutely nuts

[finite hinge]

"if you have the hardware for it" is going to mean most people won't want to use Folia, btw

[karmic urchin]

I agree, on a configuration that respects vanilla parity it is very difficult to exceed 30 players with a good tps, folia is really a savior on this point.

The only thing that worries me is that there was some slowdown on the loading of chunks in the test video but I don't know from how many players this problem really starts

[finite hinge]

Because the hardware for it is like $1000 just for the CPU

Loading chunks for hundreds of players is always going to be a bottleneck

Like, you're pushing the boundaries of NVMe, the VFS subsystem in the kernel, filesystem design, etc

[livid crag]

this to me is another "niche" usage of Folia and I know a few server owner may even run the degraded performance with less than recommended core just for this to happen.

[daring nimbus]

I can say that chunk loading was fine during the 2b2t test for me. Generation was horrible, but visiting already generated chunks worked reasonably well for 600 players

[livid crag]

since mobspawning is done in each individual region on Folia, you can technically restore the bebavior of farms closer to single player than Paper can ever do.

[finite hinge]

Chunk generation is also just really slow, chunks are complicated yo

[livid crag]

gonna pregen with now improved Chunky on Folia 😉 about 20% faster

[inner swift]

(Curious, is that from your own testing?)

[karmic urchin]

This is understandable. Clearly the best thing is to pregen the chunks. But we all know that pre-generating a big world can be very long. The folia documentation defines that for it to be really efficient the players have to be spread out, but I wonder what the right balance is regarding the size of the world in relation to these two factors

[livid crag]

https://github.com/pop4959/Chunky/pull/253/files

[finite hinge]

afaik this is from before 1.17 so it is even more complicated now but fairly similar

[livid crag]

lmao like 0.0001% of people ever understand this

[daring nimbus]

the merge radius for regions isn't that big iirc, so its not like you need a "1 player every 1000 blocks" like it probably was on 2b2t today

also Folia has a chunk generation per player limit iirc, not sure how fast you would hit that with default settings though

[prisma oriole]

Can someone give me any reasons why I shouldn't just implement folia now on my server?

Or is there not any

[viral stone]

it's still experimental and barely any plugin support for it?

[livid crag]

read all the faq and decide for yourself.

[keen fable]

Yes!

[prime juniper]

Hello. Can some one please tell me, how I can download an run Folia from Gihub?

[viral stone]

basically, follow the build instructions from the paper repo

[prime juniper]

Where is it?

[viral stone]

the paper github repo

[prime juniper]

I can not find it, on the Guthub.

Sorry

[viral stone]

there is a link to it right below the pretty picture on the readme for the folia project

[prime juniper]

"Paper" that?

[viral stone]

yes

that will take you to the paper repo, then read the readme

[prime juniper]

thanks : )

[dreamy dirge]

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[pulsar mauve]

there was 700-800 players at peak

:D

it is very likely folia but they also have their fork that does evil stuff so the server may scale higher then regular folia

but the server was VERY close to vanilla-like

there was probably like 100,000+ entities

mob spawn rates were crazy

another thing to note is that there was 0 anticheat so players were flying around and cheating

so yeah really good test because that doesn't happen on normal servers at all

[pulsar mauve]

generating chunks in the nether and end where generation is kinda fast was fine

loading was very fast for me as-well

[pulsar mauve]

there were a few servers using horizontally scaling chunk generation on 1.12.2 where generation is offloaded to other machines so i am sure something like that will happen again

[viral stone]

The chunk system is much more complex than back in those days

[lucid valve]

The only major thing that holds folia atm is the chunk generation or chunks in general?

[pulsar mauve]

nothing holding it back really

chunk generation doesn't matter that much except for new servers that don't pre-gen

even for 2b2t it doesn't matter that much except for in the nether which has quite fast generation

but 2b2t has massive amounts of nether explored already

folia even in current condition is basically the perfect thing for servers like 2b2t where everyone is far away from each-other 99% of the time

[late heart]

There is also a shady guy who recoded the server sided entity handleing and offloaded it to a different thread he calls it spacefabric, or smth like that. He also where able to achive simular results.

[late heart]

yup thats what I meant

[unique crystal]

Can't see that working well

[rapid cipher]

With that number of threads the only thing server would do is context switching

[viral coral]

i like how his CPU usage is being absolutely demolished even in the lobby

2000% CPU usage seems like a bit of a waste only to hold 220 players lol

[finite hinge]

20 cores for a lobby

That... sounds like something Paper can do?

I suppose it depends on what the entities are

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[fiery vessel]

You need to build it yourself, follow the guide for paper, its the same process

[steep moth]

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[sudden tusk]

!warn 612613210197065768 Do not spam commands in help channels

[brave blaze]

:raised_hands: Warned GitHub Actions#0452 (Do not spam commands in help channels) [1 total infraction] -- mbaxter#1592.

[rotund fossil]

Wtf???

Istg

2 commands isn't spam

I just did /hangar and that music video(lol)

[sudden tusk]

This is not the place.

This is a help channel. Would you like to continue with your antics?

[rotund fossil]

Wow that is rude.

Very.

[sudden tusk]

!kick 612613210197065768 Misuse of a help channel.

[brave blaze]

:raised_hands: Kicked GitHub Actions#0452 (Misuse of a help channel.) [2 total infractions] -- mbaxter#1592.

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[wicked mantle]

probably shouldn't spam it

[south harness]

It is in #announcements channel 💀

[inner swift]

The source code is what is shared in #announcements, not a download link for a build

[jovial glen]

If we really wanted to test the limitations of poor hardware with folia at what point would it be pointless (I assume the CPU is going to be the main issue)

Mainly for the intents of testing things not benchmarking

[unique crystal]

Just try it then?

[past dune]

purely as an interested observer of this projects progress, how does the stability of it compare to normal paper currently?

[keen fable]

hey! Anyone else by having those crashs?:

java.lang.IllegalStateException: Already sent chunk [.., ..] to player EntityPlayer['...'/2052349, uuid='...', l='ServerLevel[world]', x=-8.49, y=68.00, z=66.43, cpos=[-1, 4], tl=11138538, v=true]

[jagged ether]

Define stability

Folia is in very early development and still has lots of missing features and likely bugs

[keen fable]

It seems pretty stable (stable = default behavior), but i've got few crashes

[past dune]

fair enough 🙂

[silver sierra]

check the issue tracker, if you don't see it already reported open an issue with as much detail as possible

[keen fable]

Even if I don't know how to reproduce ?

[livid crag]

yes that way someone that spotted the issue who MAY know how to reproduce can chip in

otherwise most people just blush it off as a one off thing which not exactly uncommon even in vanilla.

[jovial glen]

Had a feeling that would be the answer

[thorny snow]

I have 6 cores ryzen 9 vps. Would Folia be better?

[livid crag]

Not enough so likely not.

[keen fable]

On very special occasions, yes. (Low IO Threads, Low Worker Threads, Low Netty Threads, localized lag, 10-20 player average, low view distance..)
Otherwise no! I won't recommend using folia with less than 16 core except if you have those special needs

[unique crater]

What's the minimum ram needed for a Folia server?

[viral coral]

probably 1gb

whatever the minimum is for paper

[finite hinge]

Slightly higher than Paper but probably lost in the margins, a single extra player loading chunks would add more usage

[visual falcon]

Folia doesn't have worldborder commands

[viral coral]

correct

[celest forum]

might be able to do that yourself using packets

if its something u absolutely need

[livid crag]

@viral coral

[viral coral]

works fine

[livid crag]

runs on 512M with 1 player, 256M just crash on startup

[viral coral]

well yeah 256mb isn't enough for anything modern minecraft

[livid crag]

so I'd say 1G is a good number

actually nvm 512M dies now too

yeah nvm its extremely unhappy and shut itself down after I performed a teleport

[grave rose]

TUINITY chunk system worker

[livid crag]

leaf be like: dont slaughter my babies Owen

[rancid pendant]

nobody else an og enough to find the other easter egg in folia

[grave rose]

👀

[rancid pendant]

like 5 ppl here probably could figure it out

[pseudo ibex]

When will folia be releasing public builds that are downloadable via the paper website?

[livid crag]

When it is ready, you can subscribe to #announcements for any future announcement

[pseudo ibex]

Hmm ok

What was the first folia Easter egg?

[livid crag]

The worker is called Tuinity Chunk System work with Tuinity being a reference to leaf's fork of Paper called Tuinity before he joined Paper.

[next bloom]

Isn’t that what it’s called in paper?

[glossy locust]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1028859290456428634/1045506811215753226/Paper_Canvas_PaperMC.png on 11/24/22 was one

[livid crag]

oh yeah that too

the code bits behind the banner wallpaper is the actual code in Folia (was not named before)

[pseudo ibex]

Wow so how long has folia been worked on?

[livid crag]

a few months according to leaf unless you want to count all the pre-patches that's currently in paper.

[pseudo ibex]

Wow

[livid crag]

if you are counting pre-patches like player chunkmap and chunk-rewrite you can say it actually take years.

[pseudo ibex]

Hello when I try to build it, I get this error https://logs.ronanplugins.com/axiyafebon

Any ideas on how to fix it?

[glossy locust]

my guess is your path got too long or onedrive is screwing with it

[pseudo ibex]

Hmm solution?

[glossy locust]

compile it in a folder with a smaller path

[celest forum]

OneDrive isnt the issue, the path is too long

or possibly the spaces

C:\Users\USER\OneDrive\Folia

this is where i made my project

[pseudo ibex]

hmm want to join me the typing-sounds vc in paper?

[celest forum]

too late for me to speak @pseudo ibex

yes

did u try compiling in just the onedrive directory

if that doesnt work try just straight up C drive

[final gyro]

Anyone working on a Folia Pterodactyl Egg?

[hardy ingot]

until there is a official release not publicly i guess

you can use the paper egg and just replace the server jar until then tho

[finite hinge]

1. OneDrive syncing is known to interfere with Paper/Folia builds
2. On Windows due to path length limits you usually have to work in the root of your drive (C:\Paper, C:\Folia)
3. Make sure you have your anti-virus ignore your Paper/Folia clone directory as they'll not only make the build way slower they've been known to break builds in the past
4. All of this would be simpler and faster if you did it in WSL2

[left dirge]

Or just used mac os or Linux.

[arctic tapir]

can you buy me a mac then

[tropic otter]

Why it needs that much cores?

[viral stone]

Because it splits the world up into regions

that takes CPU effort

and what's the point in splitting up the world into regions if you don't have the CPU cores to actually handle it?

(not to mention that hyperthreading is generally ass and does impact single thread performance somewhat drastically)

[tropic otter]

I have 16cores on my vps, but i'll have to take another one if it take 100% of the cpu

[scenic sky]

your vps wont run folia well

[viral stone]

We don't recommend VPSes for this stuff

[tropic otter]

Why not?

[scenic sky]

poor performance?

[viral stone]

Because VPSes have hefty overheads

[scenic sky]

if you truly need folia, you can afford to have something better than a vps

[viral stone]

and many caveats around how thread scheduling works on them

[tropic otter]

Do you have a recommandation?

[arctic tapir]

a dedicated server

[tropic otter]

Ok

[proud vine]

you may want to check out hetzner or ovh, they have good dedicated servers

[golden mica]

will 7950x work well?

may i want change my 13700k to 7950x

[lyric phoenix]

I am currently using purpur and have i9 9900k, Can I get more power on this core? will there be any incompatibilities

[viral stone]

please read the annoucements/FAQs...

[lyric phoenix]

still want to know the experience of using people

[viral stone]

The docs literally state that all your plugins will not work

[unique forge]

💀

[golden mica]

em?

[unique forge]

how is that a viable upgrade

[golden mica]

Do you mean that there is not much difference after upgrading? Because my current server has about 100 daily active users, and there are no restrictions on various things. I have deeply optimized the server configuration and the like, and now the tps can barely reach 15.

[unique forge]

@golden mica they both have 16 cores

[golden mica]

nop

[unique forge]

not to mention you’d be switching out a motherboard and maybe even ram

[golden mica]

13700k is 8P and 8E

[unique forge]

well yeah but if the region is already 20tps its not going to matter wether its a e core or p core

a real upgrade would be a 32> epyc cpu

[golden mica]

But I don't know if it will be affected after I turn on the small core. At present, the small core is turned off and the large core is overclocked to 5.6 to use, because I am afraid that the server scheduling will be on the small core.

[unique forge]

do you use ddr4 or 5?

[golden mica]

Not sure yet! I will test the opening and closing of the small core, and then make a decision, I want to achieve 200 days, no limit on redstone, and TPS can be 20

now is ddr4 3000 with 13700k 🙂

[unique forge]

👍🏻

[golden mica]

I did a test at the time, I used 13700k to turn off the small core, - Utilisation: 11.1% / 200.0%

So it's kind of bad 😦

[unique forge]

ngl just get the 96 core epyc and dedicate a core to every player @golden mica

[golden mica]

But I saw the test before, 5950x utilization: ... /800%@unique forge

[chilly edge]

How to build it?

[golden mica]

Think of a sentence, if you don't know how to build it, then it is most likely not suitable for you now

Unstable now 🙂

[chilly edge]

I tried to build it. First I have to build paper with git and then replace the sourcecode but i doest work…

[arctic tapir]

no lol

you clone this

then execute the 2 commands needed

check the paper repo for instructions

[chilly edge]

Yeah git clone and then replace

[golden mica]

clone it and turn on the workfloow

[arctic tapir]

no replace

[golden mica]

change the build.yml and waiting ~

[arctic tapir]

you clone the folia repo

NOT paper repo

[viral stone]

I mean, if you wanna take advantage of github actions to build, sure, you can mess with workflows

but, like, if you have the basic skills that you really should have if you're going to use experinental sofware, it's easy

folias build steps are the exact same as papers, just, cloning the folia repo instead of the paper one duh

[chilly edge]

Ok

[potent burrow]

Hello, after reading a few things on the repo and on the docs, if I’m not mistaken folia can basically handle tons of players if you feed it with a bunch of cores right?

[rare hare]

Folia will be more performant than Paper if you have a high amount of cores available and the players on your server are spread out.

[potent burrow]

Sounds really interesting

It’s definitely a pain to have 5 servers synchronised to support 400 players at once

[pine tusk]

Synchronisation of servers is problematic in many ways, true multithreading although hard to achieve is best

[finite hinge]

E cores are like a raspberry pi, you should ignore them for the purposes of thinking about how many cores you have for Folia. They might have some use you definitely shouldn't consider them 1:1 with the P cores or with Ryzen cores

E cores aren't some power optimized version of their regular cores, that's what the T suffix CPUs are for. E cores are Atoms

[tropic otter]

How can i have a jarfile to try it? Because when i build it my jarfile is 1kb...

[finite hinge]

It's really only meant for plugin developers and such right now, that's why there aren't any builds available

It has some known bugs and limitations and there are essentially no plugins available for it

[tropic otter]

I know, but i'm realy curious and i have a 16cores 24gb ram server available

[finite hinge]

Follow the build guide for Paper then I guess

[tropic otter]

Do you know where i can find it?

[finite hinge]

If you're on Windows ensure you clone the git repo into the root of your drive (C:\Folia, D:\Folia, etc), ensure OneDrive isn't trying to sync the folder, maybe make your anti-virus ignore that directory, or even better set up WSL2 and build it in there

https://github.com/PaperMC/Paper#how-to-compiling-jar-from-source

[tropic otter]

Ok thx

[tawdry merlin]

Looking at the doc and if I'm not dumb it would be:
Clone the folia repo
./gradlew applyPatches
./gradlew createReobfBundlerJar

And then it's in build/libs?

[arctic tapir]

https://tryitands.ee

[tawdry merlin]

Cool, I'll try that for fun and giggles.

I'm used to messing with bleeding edge and Folia is definitively worth messing with

[visual crown]

how does folia compare to performance focussed jars like purpur, or pufferfish?

[foggy blaze]

Depends on how you use it

If you use it for a small spleef server, it literally does nothing.
It’s intended for server with lots of players spread out all over the world

So if you ran a survival Minecraft world with 500 players.
Folia would handle it like a champ,
And purpur would shit itself

[visual crown]

large SMP server

[visual crown]

really?

[foggy blaze]

Ya

[visual crown]

500 players? That blows everything else out of the park

[viral stone]

with the correct hardware + usecase, yes

[visual crown]

I have ryzen 9 5950x

[viral stone]

the entire point of folia is that it splits the world(s) up into regions to tick them individually, rather than the single threaded nature of the vanilla server

[visual crown]

right

i dont suppose it's compatible with most plugins?

[foggy blaze]

Lol yeah not really

[visual crown]

is it a bit like multipaper

[visual crown]

Is there a list of plugins that it is compatible with?

[livid crag]

Not yet

[foggy blaze]

Don’t think so

[livid crag]

it will be on Hangar when its ready

[livid crag]

it's nothing like multipaper. You can read the technical details on the readme page.

[foggy blaze]

Thing is, it’s such an early release you shouldn’t really even consider using it unless you super super duper know what you’re doing.

It’s really only “public” for plug-in devs rn as far as I can tell

[livid crag]

yes, that too. it's released for developers to make changes to their plugins.

[visual crown]

Seems very promising

[livid crag]

yeah 2b did a test on their April fool's day and it was cool to see they get even more people than our public test.

[quasi tulip]

Hi! not very expert here, which one is the correct jar file for run the server? Just built it

[hexed ice]

both will work

the paperclip one downloads and patches the vanilla assets when you start it, the other one includes that already

[quasi tulip]

Ty ^^

[celest forum]

is that a linux thing or something? i disabled hyperthreading on my 10700k and i got the same single core speeds as enabled

[viral stone]

depends on the workload

hyperthreading basically relies on some parts of the CPU being duplicated in the pipeline

some parts of that pipeline are too large to duplicate, which means that depending on the workload can massively stall that pipeline

idk how noticable it is, but figures around like 30% where common improvements for disabling HT iirc

[finite hinge]

He means any single thread will be slower when HT is enabled, not that it'll be slower when you only have one thread doing stuff

Linux at least is pretty good at scheduling things so if you have 4 real cores it won't share a core between 2 threads (HT) unless you have more than 4 cores worth of work to do

Windows used to be really bad at that so disabling HT was a common suggestion to improve game performance

Dunno how bad it is these days

It's not a full extra core so depending on workload if you have 4 cores/8 threads and you have 8 threads of work to do you'll get up to 2x the perf to up to 30% perf loss vs disabling HT

[chilly edge]

(I tried with IntelIJ)

[karmic urchin]

Will it be possible to use Folia as a... load balancer? xD (I mean not that many players in the world, but a heavy world) on, say, 8 cores (Ryzen 7)? That is, won't it be worse in performance Paper

[celest forum]

you could try it but seems like a lot of people here will say youre better off using paper

[karmic urchin]

cli everything works, the IDEA does not 😄

[finite hinge]

If the players are all grouped up close to each other no, Paper will be better. Otherwise the answer is "it depends" but Paper would probably still be better

[sudden tusk]

Probably can still count it on one or two hands 😆

[daring nimbus]

There is this list https://github.com/BlockhostOfficial/folia-plugins (Just from copied #folia-dev, but looks to be accurate to me)

[tawdry merlin]

Alright, got it to work so I can test more.

Now, I may be dumb but looking at the documentation, I need to allocate thread for:

• chunk system io
• chunk system work

How would I do that?

[inner swift]

In a paper yml (probably global one)

chunk-system:
  gen-parallelism: default
  io-threads: -1
  worker-threads: -1

[tawdry merlin]

Wait, is it supposed to generate it?

I also though it was weird to have bukkit and spigot yml but not paper

[dreamy dirge]

Where did paper.yml go?

In 1.19, paper.yml has been split into two files, both in the config directory. In paper-global.yml you will find configuration that changes behavior of the whole server, and in paper-world-defaults you will find configuration that can be overridden on a per world basis. See https://docs.papermc.io/paper/per-world-configuration for more information on overrides. The function of server.properties, bukkit.yml, and spigot.yml remains unchanged for this time.

[tawdry merlin]

Ah, that's why

I was going through Folia but missed that since it's been long enough that I didn't started a server

so -1 is "automatically" or disable?

[inner swift]

-1 is a weird case, in this case it's automatic

[tawdry merlin]

Yeah, that why I was asking

Can't be sure if it "disable" the feature, use the "default" behaviour or "automatic" with -1

[amber solstice]

I have a test server with folia on if anyone wants to join

[tawdry merlin]

So, which is better? To let it automatically do it or to setup properly according to your hardware capability?

[arctic tapir]

no

[daring nimbus]

I would try -1 and if you experience issues you can always adjust it manually afterwards

[inner swift]

In Paper, the defaults are fine

[tawdry merlin]

It's for Folia in that case

[inner swift]

In Folia, well, basically this

[tawdry merlin]

Alright

Gonna finish the setup tomorrow and test that further

Thanks!

[finite hinge]

If we knew what good values would look like for Folia it would use them when you set it to -1 😛

I mean, the ones it's using are probably good but Folia is more likely to benefit from tuning things like that, usually Paper has cores to spare

[spring comet]

Assuming Chunky develops a version for Folia (which I am sure they haven't yet) would it run faster on Folia than on paper as Folia can use multithreading?

[jagged ether]

Chunky supports Folia already iirc

And Folia doesn't mess with chunk generation, chunk gen has already been async in Paper

[sly elm]

ya its already on codemc/actions for dev builds, just no release with it yet (still working on some other things first before doing that)

folia is early access right now anyway

iirc it is nearly the same as paper though, there really isnt too much to expect, its not like world gen got faster suddenly with ticking different regions separately

or at least far as i'm aware and/or have tested

[jagged ether]

I mean it should be exactly the same

[sly elm]

which is pretty sure why leaf still said you kinda still wanna pregen if you are going to have a huge number of players otherwise world loading will chug since it needs to gen

though i will say, pretty impressed that stuff loaded at all (even though it was slow) for the big 300 player test that was run

cause that was all with gen

[keen fable]

Still got this error when loading the region file on Paper. So strange, maybe Folia don't save redstone game time correctly ? I cannot figure out how to replicate step by step. It happens sometimes, It fixes itself. Then happen later

This seems to be located at the block exact position. If you delete/replace the block, it doesn't solve anything. But if you wait few minutes (30-60 mins) it run fine again. I'm using the vanilla algorithm

Also, this doesn't seem to affect redstone powder. According to my experiments

[livid crag]

Man you are professional bug hunter!! Mind filing a report ??

[keen fable]

I can! I was afraid of reporting a bug i can't replicate

[rugged rover]

Not sure what I am doing wrong on compiling Folia, I cloned the repo, opened with IntelliJ and ran the gradle build, it spit out 3 jar files folia-api, folia-server, and folia. Neither folia-XXXX.jar or folia-server-XXXX.jar will launch when running start.bat

[livid crag]

Having some pointers in the report may help. Leaf fixed quiet a few redstone state bugs already months ago

But I really appreciate you with all your reports @keen fable

[silver sierra]

follow the build instructions in papers readme

[rugged rover]

Ill give that a shot

[keen fable]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6XT1RHW4Cw

Here is a video of that bug. This region file was saved with Folia, I opened it in Paper. I cannot reproduce it.. It just happens sometimes

But when it happens, it is saved in the region file

[tranquil epoch]

does it occur when you log out and the chunk unloads or when you stop the server

[keen fable]

Both I think. But I'm not sure

[tranquil epoch]

is this for all redstone in a chunk or just some redstone in the chunk

[keen fable]

Just some blocks, some redstone in the chunk. This bug is specific to the block level AFAIK

[rugged rover]

That worked by the way, appreciate the help

[tranquil epoch]

got sidetracked there a bit but I think I found the issue, it happens when merging as it uses the wrong tick offset

[livid crag]

[uneven trench]

any tutorial to compile the folia jar?

[wise nacelle]

Nope, if you don't know what you are doing you shouldn't use foila yet

[uneven trench]

I just want to test it on my test server, it is not for production.

[livid crag]

Same way you do on paper. Please read instruction there or search the millionth time people asked in the last week.

[uneven trench]

but for someone who has never compiled, isn't there a tutorial on youtube about this? something more detailed

[livid crag]

Most people would agree text doc is way more detailed and effective than videos… reading is an unskipable part.

[paper stone]

You can find the commands for this on the paperweight example repo

[plain shuttle]

is folia better for multiple players distributed around the world or for multiple players in a relatively dense space?

[livid crag]

Distributed

[plain shuttle]

Okey

[pseudo ibex]

No

It’s in beta after all

[pseudo ibex]

I would think not, search it up

[prime glen]

not even alpha dude

[prime juniper]

Ryzen 9 5950X 16 core 32 threads. 128 GB OF RAM How many players can play on Folia in theory?

[golden mica]

i saw a guy test it with 5950x, fake player with fly and about 800players AVTPS:19.20

[prime juniper]

omg

[golden mica]

so crazy, right?

[prime juniper]

Yeah, sounds like multipaper, but better, because only 1 server

[golden mica]

yes, i test multipaper with 13700k

and may 100player tps get down 😦

i have no limit to redstone or something else, Villger's number is more than 1000!

[prime juniper]

I need to try, but i don't know will it works with my plugins.

[golden mica]

3 multipaper server

plugins with Mysql will work well

[prime juniper]

I mean Folia

[golden mica]

dont worry

ess coi chunky luckperm is alread support!

[prime juniper]

I have a 300gb world file, don't want to break it 🙂

[golden mica]

if your server like RPgame or minigame and lot of plugins, you will wait so long~

[prime juniper]

Good luck devs with Folia - this is what we need)

Folia + peerworld plugins = Success =))))

[golden mica]

my server is absulotly survival so it means i dont need so much plugins, haha

[prime glen]

Remember the 1.8 days with 200 players in one server and everything going smooth 👹

[prime juniper]

I have Bedwars, skyblock, OITC, Tnt-tag and private survival =)))

[golden mica]

that's alright

The higher the version, the worse the optimization

[daring nimbus]

The higher the Version, the more complicated the game is

[golden mica]

i just run a server and now may 100 Players per day

[prime juniper]

oh =(((

[golden mica]

100 people online at the same time ：）

[prime juniper]

My max online just 20 😦

[golden mica]

It is a public service service

[golden mica]

i thought you will get over me one day !

[prime juniper]

I decided to abandon all the minigames, and make new, unique minigames

[prime juniper]

• in our country no one trusts servers made in the same country, everyone wants to play on hipixel)

[golden mica]

I only opened one server, just a total of vanilla survival servers, I suggest that if you want to open a good server, the first step is to do a good field, the mini-game needs a number of people

[prime juniper]

Yeah 100%

[golden mica]

So, where you come from?

[idle furnace]

and a 1/20 of the biomes, redstone, mobs

🙂

[finite hinge]

If you patch out everything added since 1.8 I bet you could get 200 players again

[nova spire]

how to compile?

[inner swift]

Same steps as Paper

[nova spire]

What did I do wrong?

[arctic tapir]

show the whole error

[prime juniper]

Are there any anticheats yet for folia ?

[glossy locust]

grimac

[prime juniper]

It works on folia ?

Nice

[cobalt oriole]

I can't build folia,

❯ ./gradlew createReobfBundlerJar
> Task :folia-api:compileJava FAILED

FAILURE: Build failed with an exception.

* What went wrong:
Execution failed for task ':folia-api:compileJava'.
> error: release version 17 not supported

* Try:
> Run with --stacktrace option to get the stack trace.
> Run with --info or --debug option to get more log output.
> Run with --scan to get full insights.

* Get more help at https://help.gradle.org

BUILD FAILED in 2s

Strangely, my ./gradlew javaToolchains seems to only auto-provision JDK 11 and 16:

 + Eclipse Temurin JDK 11.0.18+10
     | Location:           /home/socket/.gradle/jdks/OpenJDK11U-jdk_x64_linux_hotspot_11/jdk-11.0.18+10
     | Language Version:   11
     | Vendor:             Eclipse Temurin
     | Architecture:       amd64
     | Is JDK:             true
     | Detected by:        Auto-provisioned by Gradle

 + Eclipse Temurin JDK 11.0.18+10
     | Location:           /home/socket/.gradle/jdks/eclipse_adoptium-11-amd64-linux/jdk-11.0.18+10
     | Language Version:   11
     | Vendor:             Eclipse Temurin
     | Architecture:       amd64
     | Is JDK:             true
     | Detected by:        Auto-provisioned by Gradle

 + Eclipse Temurin JDK 16.0.2+7
     | Location:           /home/socket/.gradle/jdks/eclipse_foundation-16-amd64-linux/jdk-16.0.2+7
     | Language Version:   16
     | Vendor:             Eclipse Temurin
     | Architecture:       amd64
     | Is JDK:             true
     | Detected by:        Auto-provisioned by Gradle

[arctic tapir]

I assume you're on the latest commit?

[cobalt oriole]

reflog:
d34fb87 (HEAD -> master, origin/master, origin/HEAD) HEAD@{0}: clone: from https://github.com/PaperMC/Folia

latest commit is d34fb87 on github, so yea

I mean, I can see it's meant to provision java 17, soo...

[tropic otter]

Hello, do you know how i can fix this error while doing gradlew createReobfBundlerJar?
The error:

> Could not resolve all dependencies for configuration ':serverRuntimeClasspath'.
> Could not create task ':folia-server:jar'.
> Command finished with 128 exit code: git -c commit.gpgsign=false -c core.safecrlf=false rev-parse --short=7 HEAD```

[arctic tapir]

did you clone the repo

[tropic otter]

yes? i made git clone <link>

[arctic tapir]

ok

did you apply patches

[tropic otter]

yes

[arctic tapir]

show the whole log

[tropic otter]

ok, wait a min

Ok i think i've found something, if it didn't work i'll ask again

[meager marsh]

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4

rip

guess that answers my question

so Folia will only be useful in a year or 2 when all good mods are hopefully ported up

[arctic tapir]

won't take 2 years for plugins to get updated lol

[meager marsh]

Im talking like modpacks

[arctic tapir]

...?

[meager marsh]

or would folia not work with mods anyway 😄

[arctic tapir]

no

it's a paper fork

not forge

[dreamy dirge]

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[meager marsh]

ngl

never even heard of paper before

can someone toss me a short version of what paper is and why anyone would use it over like forge

[patent idol]

Do u know what plugins are?

[meager marsh]

barely

dont have a great understanding of them

[patent idol]

Just imagine it only as a server side mod, that players don't need to have installed

[meager marsh]

gotcha

so basically same thing as a datapack?

[scenic sky]

you can modify basically anything in the game with forge

less with paper

[blissful basin]

Datapacks cant do much stuff

Plugins are normal java

[patent idol]

The difference is, paper can run plugins and can't run mods, while forge is the exact opposite - can run mods and can't run plugins

[meager marsh]

bummer but makes sense thanks

[tropic otter]

Now we're talking about that, will paper make a server software who support both in the future?

[scenic sky]

no

[tropic otter]

Sad

[blissful basin]

https://github.com/MohistMC/Mohist

[keen fable]

theres still hybric server softwares that use mixin implementations

[blissful basin]

There is mohist which is hybrid of forge and paper

[tropic otter]

Not all plugin works

[vivid tinsel]

And it also breaks things

[keen fable]

I'd recommend arclight instead of mohist

[scenic sky]

id recommend using neither of them

if you need mods, use forge or fabric

[tropic otter]

And there is cardboard wich is a fabric mod, but not completed

[scenic sky]

if you want plugins, use bukkit-something

[tropic otter]

And if i want both? 🗿

[vivid tinsel]

Cardboard is another hybrid thing

[livid crag]

Don’t use hybrid

Otherwise you won’t get any support if you encounter issue and those community are very small so good luck getting help

[vivid tinsel]

There are mod equivalents of plugins out there

[tropic otter]

Not for everything

But i think we're in the wrong Channel to talk about that

[livid crag]

Dw 2b will be first that push to production and most anarchy server will follow

[glossy locust]

there's a lot of 1.13+ issues that 2b would need to fix

like infinite oceans consuming the entire world from flying machines

[scenic sky]

that sounds like a problem

[wicked mantle]

2b but water world

[scenic sky]

there will be some 2b2t land resurrection project

with 12 kids in a team

[tropic otter]

did i have to download a specific spark version?

[wicked mantle]

pretty sure the spark that supports folia is still in a PR

[tropic otter]

ok

[edgy oyster]

how to download a folia.jar ?

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[foggy blaze]

Wtf happened here

Lemme join

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[finite hinge]

Bukkit API can't deal with mods adding new inventories, items, entities, blocks, etc so even if you made something that merged them together plugins are likely to explode if you try to do something with a mod

[hexed cove]

well things like arclight exists that add bukkit/spigot api to forge server that's probably best that you can get

[tacit tartan]

they also break like half the API and most major plugins will tell you to take a hike if you report an issue with them

[tropic otter]

Bruh

[hexed cove]

my experience with arclight is small but I don't think there were any major non working plugins maybe world edit but not sure
this is arclight 1.16

[tacit tartan]

history dictates that they will either break something or have a major contreversy soon so ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[livid crag]

That really just popular in China and Russian

I don’t know any big well known server in the west use that at all

[hexed cove]

that server is small pixelmon server that is currently dead so yea (the from screen i sent)

[tropic otter]

Is Worldedit compatible or it's still not? I'd like to test something

[ionic cradle]

discord.gg/enginehub

Best to ask them

[tropic otter]

Ok

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[lucid basin]

give me folia JAR @dreamy dirge

[finite hinge]

Uh

[viral coral]

no

[lucid basin]

sad..

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[visual falcon]

just build the jar noob

[tacit tartan]

if they're yelling at kaguya for it then they probably don't know how, in which case they shouldn't have the jar anyways

[finite hinge]

While that's more or less what we're saying that's not a nice way to do so 😛

[lucid basin]

i want kaguya for version 1.16.5 of folia because it is a very nice bot

[dreamy dirge]

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[arctic tapir]

what

[viral coral]

please read

[lucid basin]

i'm just kidding, i think i'm speaking in translation so my messages are not going well?

[viral coral]

sarcasm / joking through a translator never works well

[finite hinge]

It barely works at all in text, after running through a translator it's definitely not going to work

[livid crag]

Use only simple sentence. Like this for example. Should help a bit.

[lapis igloo]

Hi where i can download Folia?

i need build it?

[arctic tapir]

yes

instructions on paper readme

[knotty egret]

I have error Unsupported class file major version 64 when i clone repository

How to fix it?

[cobalt oriole]

use java 17

[arctic tapir]

how are you building it

[tropic otter]

Go to your gradle settings and put java 17

I already have this problem and i fixed it doint this

[knotty egret]

Yes this fixed the issue, thanks. I couldn't find the right answers on google.

[tropic otter]

Np

[lapis igloo]

Its possible limit the cpu usage of Folia?
Folia need 16 Cores, but i want test it with mine 12 cores Ryzen 9 5900x
its possible use only 10 cores for doing test

?

[tropic otter]

Well, create a VM with 10 cores

[livid crag]

That's all controlled by JVM anyway.

read the readme part for some optional configs

but you are going to end up with bottleneck really quick once you get enough of regions going.

[scenic sky]

folia doesnt "need" 16 cores

it can survive

[viral stone]

Best you're gonna get for a limit is to configure the cpu affinity, beyond that, thing go brr

[livid crag]

I mean yeah it is just going to not be very happy

[scenic sky]

its a test anyways so who cares

[tropic otter]

Do you have an idea of stable release date?

[dreamy dirge]

__There Is No ETA__

Updates to Paper do not have any sort of estimate for when they release, ever. Any and all updates will arrive when they are ready, and the only thing to do is wait for them patiently along with everyone else.

ETA means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

__There Is No ETA__

Updates to Paper do not have any sort of estimate for when they release, ever. Any and all updates will arrive when they are ready, and the only thing to do is wait for them patiently along with everyone else.

ETA means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[next bloom]

NO

[livid crag]

I am faster

[next bloom]

should update that to be a more general message about no etas for anyting

[livid crag]

update to project ? maybe?

coz be Velocity, Paper, Waterfall, or Folia

or software

[scenic sky]

updates to our projects do not have any sort of estimates for when they release

[viral stone]

Update dis moons

[scenic sky]

[livid crag]

ok I asked

[scenic sky]

did you ask dn?

[lapis igloo]

Thanks guys, so cool this project

[tropic otter]

Ol thanks

[paper stone]

Check Paperweight-example repo to learn about all commands 🙂

[arctic tapir]

..?

it was a question to them

i wasn’t asking how to build it lol

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[paper stone]

I litterally told you where you could find the awnser to what you're looking for

[arctic tapir]

either i don’t understand you or you don’t understand me

[blissful basin]

He wasn't asking for the instructions

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[left swan]

Did you need help @prime juniper?

[prime juniper]

Can I download folia ?

[left swan]

You can't download jars at the moment.

You have to build the source (https://github.com/PaperMC/Folia) following Paper's standard compilation guide.

[prime juniper]

ok! thank you!

[tawdry merlin]

Yeah, it's written: "ideally" at least 16 cores.

But it's also the early stage of the project, thing can and will improve

Personally I have a test servers with just 6 cores to test and mess with it, it's not "production ready" anyway

[idle furnace]

Yep, with 6 cores runs smoothly

[keen fable]

you have to manually change thread options if you don't want to run with 1 region thread lol

[potent burrow]

Is there any memory consumption benchmark when folia was tested?

[viral coral]

not really

[bleak oar]

https://discordapp.com/channels/289587909051416579/1083640315497418842/1083914537494921286

[viral coral]

yeah but that's not really useful

[livid crag]

That’s a graph

[bleak oar]

it was using 1.9tb

for 400 players

[viral coral]

it wasn't

if you looked at the image you just linked

the jvm only got a heapspace of around 0.5TB

but eitherway, no sane person is going to run their minecraft servers with that amount of memory

you do not need 0.5TB of memory

[potent burrow]

That’s what I thought, thanks guys

[viral coral]

memory consumption isn't gonna change much

it'll be practically the same as paper

[potent burrow]

Alright

[undone acorn]

How long were the gc pauses for those lol

[viral coral]

couple miliseconds

it wasn't using g1

[undone acorn]

Pretty good for 400gb 💪

[knotty egret]

is there any method for create region? I need test something

[next bloom]

Join with another account and teleport 50k blocks away

[prime juniper]

why no forge 😢

[hybrid shore]

Do you plan to have forge server with 100+ players?

[prime juniper]

that is the dream

[hybrid shore]

First, gl with finding players. Second, if you want you can port it to forge 😛

[prime juniper]

oh, here's a question
is it possible to push this folia thing to the extreme and spread computation across multiple machines?

[hybrid shore]

in it's current state, no

[prime juniper]

i like that answer

[hybrid shore]

And it is unlikely to ever be possible, you would have to write such a solution yourself.

If you want that then look at multipaper

[prime juniper]

Its more likely it would be able to scale to like 200+ cores than that being supportred (would that work currently)

Am I able to play with folia now?

[viral coral]

if you can build it

sure

[prime juniper]

When does Folia release

[glossy locust]

it is released, if you can build it

[prime juniper]

I only kind of know what that means so I guess I'll just have to wait
If I set up a regular paper server now, will I be able to switch over later?

[viral coral]

yes

[prime juniper]

Whaddabout systems with multiple CPUs?

[viral coral]

it runs

doesn't mean it's a good idea to use it on a system with multiple cpus

but it runs

[prime juniper]

Can someone just, like, build it for me?

I want an excuse to fire up the old R720

[viral coral]

no

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[prime juniper]

In that case, nobody better slip me a jarfile in my DMs. I'll be really mad.

[left swan]

I was just about to, but I won't now, thanks for letting me know!

[prime juniper]

You better not 😠

[wicked mantle]

I definitely won't

[idle furnace]

Un idea to help these guys, that can't compile a version, why not make versions available but temporary (with a big red alert at start stating valid for like 1 week) ? Just my 2 cents

[jovial helm]

They’ll be available at some point. The build step is an intentional filter.

[prime juniper]

Is the entirety of folia just the like 20 patches or whatever

[livid crag]

One giant one yeah why?

[prime juniper]

Seems very concise / simple compared to other multithreading projects. Its a good thing spottedleaf is the goat

[viral coral]

i mean

it's still like 30k lines of code

small amount of patches, large amounts of code

[inner swift]

(Noting that it depends on stuff like the chunk system rewrite which was huge too)

[livid crag]

30k line is a lot if you know how much a typical paper fork has extra yeah and all the pre-patches

[viral stone]

Jars are literally available from the API, if you can't even use that, you should probably wait until a release

[dreamy dirge]

⚠️ Please do not share any links to builds of Folia at this time. We are intentionally not providing easy to find/obtain downloads right now - when the time is right, everything will be available through official PaperMC distributions.

[prime juniper]

Yeah honestly the filter was a good idea

[jagged ether]

Since when did big red alerts stop anyone from asking for help

[left dirge]

Never

[lone sand]

Will folia support plugins that paper supports?

[inner swift]

No

[arctic tapir]

those plugins need to add support for Folia

[dreamy dirge]

Folia

Folia is a fork of Paper that adds multi-threaded region support. Many plugins will require updating to support Folia. There is no ETA for publicly available builds.

For more information:

• Readme
• FAQ
• Regionising logic
• Detailed overview
• Javadocs

Folia will:

• NOT be backported to older versions <1.19.4
• NOT be merged into Paper
• NOT be ported to Fabric nor Forge

Stay tuned to #announcements for any further info about releases.

'ETA' means 'Estimated Time of Arrival'!

[lone sand]

Thats a bummer

All the hype sounds like it will be better then paper

[viral coral]

not necessarily

[viral stone]

it changes how stuff ticks

and has massively different hardware requirements which hugely inflates the cost

it's a niche piece of software for a niche use-case

[lime lintel]

it'll be better than paper for some cases and not others

[inner swift]

Folia has a different purpose from Paper rather than being better

[lime lintel]

for most people it'll probably be too expensive to even run so

[idle furnace]

Also true, but we get that anyway.

[viral stone]

Like, the nature of changing how stuff ticks is that it changes the entire way that threading work in regards to plugins; in a way that is wholey incompatible with bukkit, hence why you need to opt-in as a plugin dev, cos otherwise, pretty much any plugin expecting the whole "single thread" will eat shit

[lone sand]

Lol

So basically it will be able to process stuff faster

[jagged ether]

Not really

it will be is able to process multiple stuff at a time

[idle furnace]

Things run in parallel, ticks in parallel

[lone sand]

K

[inner swift]

Folia will be able to handle more stuff at the same time than Paper provided that it is given a lot of somewhat strong physical cpu cores (recommended min 16 for now)

And that players aren't sticking together much

[lime lintel]

well I assume it won't be as good anyway

[jagged ether]

Skyblock is a great use case for Folia, PVP on a map where all players are near each other you want Paper

[lime lintel]

yeah that's what I was thinking

will make life a lot easier

[marsh pecan]

how to build

[lime lintel]

@jagged ether

[lime lintel]

no one's gonna help

[marsh pecan]

this is sad

[lime lintel]

they won't offer support to build it as it's experimental

which is understandable

[marsh pecan]

oh okay thanks tho

[jagged ether]

hmm

[lime lintel]

go to GitHub and build it like anything else with maven or gradle (I haven't looked so idk what one)

maybe it's even different to that

I have no idea

[jagged ether]

Read github.com/PaperMC/Paper README.md and do the steps mentioned there on Folia's source

[lime lintel]

there's a better answer lmao

[pseudo ibex]

Ok what is it?

I followed the build process of paper and building folia worked fine

[hexed ice]

nacio's message was the better answer that was being referred to

[lime lintel]

@pseudo ibex "there is a better answer" referring to Nacio's message like Warrior said. Not as in theres a better answer than that, but as in that was a better answer than mine

[pseudo ibex]

Ohhh

[charred galleon]

Good evening! Can you tell me what Folia is, I didn't quite understand what it was for

[hexed ice]

https://github.com/PaperMC/Folia#readme

[charred galleon]

The translation is bad

[hexed ice]

we can't really help with your translator being bad

https://www.deepl.com/translator

[real heart]

In a nutshell it splits the server into regions, with each region having its own thread

[jagged ether]

Incorrect, there's a pool of threads not for each region

[subtle wasp]

but each region has its own "main thread," no?

[real heart]

Does that mean a region could use 2 threads if it wanted to, or is it limited to only one?

[jagged ether]

No

There are X amount of threads shared between Y amount of regions

[subtle wasp]

its own virtualized main thread

[jagged ether]

And yeah there is only one "main" thread at a time for ticking a region

[real heart]

Does the number of threads in the pool depend on the current playercount up to a max, or is it always the same number of threads?

[jagged ether]

Pretty sure it's just calculated somehow based on available threads in the system or can be overriden with a property

[livid crag]

All information you asked can be found on the official repo @real heart you should take a look

[real heart]

oh sorry, i forgot about the github repo

i've been using git cli too much lol

[honest aurora]

folia is perfect for kitpvp as the map is already pregenerated and there's a lot of players in one small space

[livid crag]

that's quite the oppsite. if players are close, it will not really help

as it will just be one giant region.

[honest aurora]

obviously but i do think it'd perform better than paper

[livid crag]

The most perfect example where Folia will help a ton is Anarchy server and that's probably why 2b2t did a test on it

[honest aurora]

even if by a slight margin

[honest aurora]

yeah but that's an extreme case, not many servers like 2b2t

[potent burrow]

How many players did they reached during the test?

[livid crag]

the issue with many players toghether is really down to the packet spam each player get, if you ever noticed, no matter the forks, if there are many player together, the ping always suffers

[potent burrow]

But overall most smp servers will benefit from it

[livid crag]

600+

[potent burrow]

Insane

[honest aurora]

definitely, I just mean to say that little to no servers have the same amount of load from just the map alone etc as 2b2t

[potent burrow]

Any servers with more than 80 players (splitter across one map) on a single server will benefit from Folia

[livid crag]

yeah but not every server with 80 players have the $$$$ for the hardwares

[potent burrow]

I want folia support for a few plugins so bad lol

[livid crag]

You can kindly ask the developers

but it takes time espeically if the plugin is open source

[potent burrow]

The user experience would be way better on a single server than having 6 different servers

[inner swift]

Well, most smp servers that have the required hardware, that is

[livid crag]

not everyone has unlimited free time to develop.

[potent burrow]

Understandable

[livid crag]

Most of them will accept a feature request on their github page, and they will let you know for sure if they have plan to support it or not.

The key is just not to be too pushy about it

[potent burrow]

The developer from Itemsadder said no if I’m right

A bit disappointing but hopefully they will change their mind

[livid crag]

The hope is as the server starts to actually use Folia, someone else will step up the game to make a plugin just like itemAdder or they'd change their mind yeah... similiar to how some plugin started off only supporting spigot then seeing paper is taking basically 90% of the server software, they would change thier mind for sure.

[potent burrow]

Yeah, really hope so

Maybe they did not read why Folia was going to be so useful for many servers 🤷‍♂️

[livid crag]

yeah that gave me the vibe too but its best for him to find out himself.

paper didnt make Folia to intentionally break every spigot plugin

but rather, a change is needed if you want for example, see 600 players in a server without it being 1 tps.

[potent burrow]

Yeah, this is literally the future

Being able to handle 600 players on a single instance is really good for both the users and the owners

[viral coral]

that response sounds like they've read 4 lines in the readme and stopped caring after

[potent burrow]

I hope that’s the case

[left swan]

Where's this?

[viral coral]

sponge is an entirely new api

[potent burrow]

In their help forum

[viral coral]

folia breaks like 4 parts of the api

[potent burrow]

Let me find the link for you

https://forum.devs.beer/d/398-future-folia-support-for-itemsadder/2

[viral coral]

he is making the bad assumption that the entire "plugins ecosystem" needs to be rewritten

he literally did not spend more than 2 minutes looking at folia

[potent burrow]

Hope he will in the future so we can have ItemAdder compatible with Folia

[wind halo]

What the hell

😂

[left swan]

Folia doesn't touch the "plugins loader"? Is he getting this confused with Owen's PR?

[livid crag]

(alright now we know the dev of itemAdder diddnt read the Folia page, still dont harass people though, he will eventually find out anyway)

[potent burrow]

Yeah, all good

[left swan]

I've spoken to him a bit before, i'll shoot him a message and just let him know

[livid crag]

[viral coral]

i mean the servers that run folia probably don't run IA tbf

after like 100 players you'd probably want to build your own thing

[left swan]

100% agree

[potent burrow]

Why?

[viral coral]

performance and any limitations

[potent burrow]

I’m planning on releasing my V2 with IA and I’ve heard only good things about it even with lots of players

Servers with 800+ players released with it

[viral coral]

having a closed source proprietary plugin at the core of your server is a horrible thing

[half vault]

valid points exist to not update your plugin yet but he didn't seem to know them

[potent burrow]

You’re right here

[left swan]

@livid crag What are some plugins that have updated to support Folia?

Chunky did right?

[potent burrow]

I think there’s an unofficial gist

[left swan]

There's probably something on his weebsite

[jovial helm]

Chunky did yeah

[viral coral]

especially when stuff has the potential to ruin performance or introduce dupes

[potent burrow]

There’s an alternative to IA and it’s open source

[livid crag]

LukePerm, Bluemap, squaremap, spark, bolt, chestshop, GrimAC, Viaversion, gravityControl, FreedomChat, Maintenance, chunky

on top of my head.

[viral coral]

yeah i'd rather build my server off of oraxen if i had to use something out of the box

[potent burrow]

Yeah oraxen

[keen fable]

DiscordSRV soon 🤓

[left swan]

EssXDiscord >

[livid crag]

before Essentials?

[keen fable]

If they merge my pr yes

[livid crag]

@rancid pendant are you seeing this?

can you allow that to happen??

[rancid pendant]

i want to merge their prs yes

oh they mean discordsrv prs

man your pr is cursed

not caching reflection

not even using method handles

[left swan]

LukePerm

[zinc vortex]

Developed by Lukeo

[livid crag]

LucyPerm