hk-help

[trim hawk]

I mean the shooting

[ruby shuttle]

for second phase, its just at like 1.75 speed

you spelt it wrong

[trim hawk]

do you mean ||uumuu||?

[dire burrow]

Oh yeah I almost forgot, ||Oro and Mato as well||

And I mid-diff a couple of bosses, so I could practice them as well

[keen stream]

is that the spelling??

[dire burrow]

||Hornet 2, White Defender thats it||

Wait what

There’s not so many hard fights

Huh

[keen stream]

||uumuu|| is in fact not included in spoilers

[dire burrow]

Wdym

It is

[trim hawk]

for me it's mainly just inconsistency that gets me

[keen stream]

wtf

[trim hawk]

you edited your message the first time

[keen stream]

ohh

i see

[trim hawk]

maybe it slips past then

[ruby shuttle]

huh

weird

[dire burrow]

||Imma be honest NKG and Pure Vessel aren’t super hard for me for some reason, but maybe because they have obvious tells and don’t two v one you and they aren’t…. whatever Markoth is||

[trim hawk]

||NKG and PV are hard to learn but they're just so consistent||

[dire burrow]

Uhhh not really?

[ruby shuttle]

there basically just sped up versions of ||HK and TMG||

[trim hawk]

like there is still some execution difficulty

[keen stream]

||mmc|| not even in ||attuned|| is kinda funny

[trim hawk]

but what you need to do is always clear

not as much variance to have to account for

[dire burrow]

I didn’t visit the statue

[ruby shuttle]

okay wait, who at Team Cherry decided the order for ||HoG||

its just so random

[runic belfry]

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

[trim hawk]

dartboard

[runic belfry]

finally

omg

i hate ||pv||

[ruby shuttle]

i feel like they should have done ||HoG in P5 order||

[keen stream]

im ass against ||oblobbles||

[runic belfry]

back to ||pop||

[ruby shuttle]

like, why is ||flukemarm between MMC and Mantis Lords?!||

[trim hawk]

I think the issue with that is that ||HoG merges similar bosses|| and also ||P5 skips some stuff||

[dire burrow]

Ok so now my goal right now is every boss on ||Ascended|| and If I feel like it, ||Radiant?|| right?

[trim hawk]

though I guess they could have at least vaguely based it off that

[trim hawk]

that's basically what I did before even touching ||any of the Pantheons||

well for most

I got kinda bored ||doing the dream warriors||

[dire burrow]

Honestly, I’m dreading having to do ||No eyes, the fight is not hard but stupid long||

[ruby shuttle]

its just annoying

[dire burrow]

||Also Galien and Markoth||

||Galien isn’t that hard but I feel like I get hit more often by him than I should||

[keen stream]

its the last one

[trim hawk]

I find that it's usually just me being greedy with that

[keen stream]

im starting to hate this more than ||radkoth||

[runic belfry]

whos that

[ruby shuttle]

||oblobbles||

[runic belfry]

;-;

[keen stream]

its finally white

[runic belfry]

you changed your name 😭

bro does not like em

[keen stream]

last 3

[keen stream]

i despise them

[runic belfry]

does ||absrad|| not show up in ||hog||?

[keen stream]

she does

[runic belfry]

but it says normal

[ruby shuttle]

its just ||radiance||

[keen stream]

but its just ||radiance|| for some reason

[runic belfry]

ohhhhh

weird

[ruby shuttle]

what if ||PV had a lever so you could practice HK||

[runic belfry]

should add ||hk and normal radiance|| to it

[runic belfry]

||or a dream nail feature like the others ||

[keen stream]

thats what i've always wanted ngl

[vestal ivy]

Most overglazed fight ever is ||radkoth|| not ragebaiting

[keen stream]

i have less than 1% chance of winning

[ruby shuttle]

you got it

theres still a chance

[keen stream]

kinda tbh, but now i find ||oblobbles|| to be much much worse

||radkoth|| is just as hard... but ||rad oblobbles|| is just more frustrating

[vestal ivy]

Ok i get where ur coming from but theyre ||4 howling wraiths|| away from extintion

[thick wing]

WHY ISN'T SPOILER WORKING

[neat karma]

i dont think you got the right word there

[neat karma]

its with two bars, ||like this||

[thick wing]

oh

[vestal ivy]

Best word i could find to get my point across

[keen stream]

should i just patiently wait here?

[vestal ivy]

My honest thoughts:

[thick wing]

|| radiant Markoth wasn't that hard for me ||

finally got it to work

[neat karma]

its overhated, overglazed is like the opposite of that

[vestal ivy]

What....

Why is any and every gif a spoiler now

[acoustic sigil]

Every link is

[neat karma]

i do NOT want to watch whatever that gif was

[vestal ivy]

No just a jiggly bunny dessert being slapped

Was funny mate promise

[neat karma]

yeah youre not changing my mind with that description

[vestal ivy]

LMAOO

[keen stream]

how tf do yall do this?

no matter how much i practice, i just dont get it

[ruby shuttle]

be patient

[vestal ivy]

What r u fighting again

[keen stream]

||absrad|| again

[vestal ivy]

Just got in this chat so

[neat karma]

you should be baiting it

[vestal ivy]

U can do it mate. As much as i wanted to flex about how ive beat that fight i wont 💔

Just takes practice

[neat karma]

that part is just like ||galiens sycthe, it follows where youre about to be, so mislead it and then go the right way||

[ruby shuttle]

you just did

[keen stream]

i literally have 0.7% win rate

[neat karma]

||Easy way to do so is to jump out into the void when its not attacking then double jump back into the platform, if done correctly she should shoot the air||

[vestal ivy]

I didnt say how i did it so no

[stoic cedar]

||i would recommend that strategy of jumping out to bait the lasers outward only for the later half of the climb since the lasers get more accurate as u get further in the climb, the bottom is mostly random so the bait doesnt really work at all||

[keen stream]

im gonna cry myself to sleep

i kinda get the "bait the laser" part now

[ruby shuttle]

you can ||pogo absrad so your offscreen, that way the orbs will despawn if they come after you||

[keen stream]

i just need to react faster

[keen stream]

i forgot about that

[trim hawk]

its not cheesing because I said so

[shut sparrow]

that's not a good start if you're inexperienced

[shut sparrow]

you can forget it again

you did not name the boss yet

also don't demand a response

[keen stream]

with my stupidity, i probably will

what bosss

[ruby shuttle]

thats the point

[shut sparrow]

I'm sorry but you have to be more specific

[keen stream]

that's the point

[shut sparrow]

that's how they work

[keen stream]

bruh

[ruby shuttle]

then it wouldnt be ||radiant||

[shut sparrow]

it's supposed to be difficult

[keen stream]

thats just ||ascended||

just fckn practice them

[shut sparrow]

Why exactly are you trying to beat ||radiant|| bosses?

[ruby shuttle]

have you beaten them on ||ascended|| first?

[shut sparrow]

well if you don't find it fun you can do something else

[drowsy yarrow]

The orbs at the end are actually a bit slower, but dangerous if one of them doesn't despawn. For my "parallelogram variant" strategy, I try to lure them into the platforms, but if it's going to miss the platform, I ||double jump|| and ||dash|| back to the original platform. The original "parallelogram" always just ||dashes|| to the left, jumps, and ||dashes|| right starting from the left platform, which is probably easier but a lot slower.

They despawn off of every edge of the screen, but there's a buffer zone they can enter and exit just barely off screen.

[trim hawk]

you could always try charm abuse

[runic belfry]

wait does ||true ending mean that i died?||

damn

but didnt i kill ||radiance?||

wdym

what

[stoic cedar]

||true ending is the ending where u fight radiance||

[runic belfry]

no

bro

[ebon copper]

doi g ||radiant|| bosses is pointless before ||p5||, you can do it for fun but there is no other reason to do them before

[runic belfry]

wait does ||true ending mean that i died?||

thats what i asked

||true ending being void heart ending||

[drowsy yarrow]

You're not describing ||true ending||. ||True ending|| is killing the ||Radiance||

[ebon copper]

its much easier than ||radinat hall of gods||

in fact doing ||eb|| is much easier than ||radhog|| imo

[remote jacinth]

||eb|| is free if youre decent at the game tbh

[shut sparrow]

@keen stream for last phase I recommend this. The second part is what you wanna be doing

[ebon copper]

ye, its not that bad for the most part

[remote jacinth]

Imo ||ab is also only problematic for p5 and p3 to some extent, the others are really easy||

[trim hawk]

I kinda disagree

[ebon copper]

you are missin quite a lot of progress than

[runic belfry]

||eb||?

[ebon copper]

than ||hornet|| does come

[mellow vigil]

If you have || voidheart hornet will come ||

[ebon copper]

explain

[trim hawk]

||I personally subscribe to the mantra of don't get hit||

||maybe its a little overkill practice I guess||

[ebon copper]

||ab|| is not the same as|| eb||, but ye, ||p1-2|| is easy and the next easiest is ||p4 for ab||

[trim hawk]

though its a different story if you ||did radiant with heavy charm abuse||

[ebon copper]

there are bosses in ||hog|| that are harder to do on ||radiant|| than ||p5|| itself

[trim hawk]

||I don't mean all||

|| all radiant I agree is too much||

[ebon copper]

besides, if you can do all bosses ||ascended|| confidently there isnt a way you should be losing in ||p5||

[trim hawk]

really ||radiant|| is just doing ||ascended|| confidently outside of a few exceptions

[ebon copper]

my opinion is kinda screwed tbf, since when i was doing ||p5||, i got to|| absrad|| in like 6 attempts, and than got there basically everytime after, and just kept dying there to nerves

[drowsy yarrow]

Honestly I feel like ||p4ab|| is similar difficulty to ||p3ab||. ||Failed champ -> Markoth -> Watcher Knights|| can be tough, and ||PV|| is tense with nerves.

[ebon copper]

if ||hornet|| isnt there, than you are eighter missing a ||dreamer, or voidheart||

[trim hawk]

can't really prepare for nerves

other than comically overtraining

I guess that's where doing ||radiant|| comes in

but like just do runs

[astral belfry]

Idk why my Friend hate Hollow Knight, does because game hard?

[drowsy yarrow]

||p3ab|| is only hard because of ||zote and collector||, but ||collector|| isn't bad with ||cyclone slash||, and ||zote|| can have ||5 lifeblood|| going in.

[trim hawk]

I kinda disliked it first time playing a few years ago

[ebon copper]

the thing is all ||hog|| progress is pointless unless you get some lvl of consistent in it

[mellow vigil]

We don’t know your friend, so we don’t really know why they don’t like it

[trim hawk]

common points of complaint could be that there is kinda a bit of being lost

standard metroidvania stuff sure but that's not for everyone

but also the game is definitely hard as a beginner

which can compound with sometimes having to make a trek back to where you died constantly

at least most of the time it's not that long

[ebon copper]

i keep dying to fking ||white defender,|| and the offchance i get past, ill die to ||markoth||

i mean, if you have ||void heart|| and the door is open than ||hornet|| should be there, or its maybe bugged

[mellow vigil]

|| Are you sure it’s voidheart and not kingsoul ||

[ebon copper]

is it black or white?

[drowsy yarrow]

||White Defender|| isn't too bad for me because of the healing opportunities during his ||dung throw|| and immediately after his ||spike shockwave||. ||Markoth|| is understandable, and ||watchers|| don't give much healing opportunities.

[trim hawk]

||one of them you can't unequip too||

[ebon copper]

ye, i just get bored and start to make mistakes like halfaway into the fight

maybe just enter, and see if ||hornet ||shows up

id guess its a visual glitch

[mellow vigil]

|| Hornet should be in the temple, but not the egg ||

Or it could be bugged

[trim hawk]

wouldn't be too surprised for an edgecase to slip past

[mellow vigil]

|| Yeah, the big infected room, not the mostly empty black room ||

[drowsy yarrow]

The main benefit of ||radiant|| practice is that it forces you to learn the right way to deal with every move. On ||ascended|| you can still get away with not knowing how to deal with one move or move combo, but not on ||radiant||

[trim hawk]

and like wouldn't that just be the right way?

like I still learn opportune times to heal and all

[mellow vigil]

|| That’s pantheon 5, which is different ||

[trim hawk]

||regular radiance is the original TLB, and then they added a way harder one in an update||

[mellow vigil]

|| Hornet shows up for regular radiance, at the black egg temple ||

[drowsy yarrow]

||Ascended is already taking twice the damage of the p5 version, so it really should be good enough for most people, even with nerves, especially if you take healing opportunities. But forgetting boss fight strategies can happen a lot too with only ascended practice.||

[trim hawk]

I guess ||p5 does give a good amount of spas||

I don't really think that needs a spoiler

[ebon copper]

and learning how to heal in bossfights can be really good for ||p5||

[trim hawk]

but like uh nail go brr

[ebon copper]

every boss has windows to heal

[trim hawk]

man really

[ebon copper]

focus only 1 of them 1st

[burnt grove]

bruh I meant ||spells|| as how you write something

[ebon copper]

the 2nd gains some health after the 1st dies

[burnt grove]

I tried but the second one has Little to no room to attack

[burnt grove]

and the attacks are yoo Quick

[trim hawk]

I think it's ridiculous for it to even be considered a spoiler

[burnt grove]

I mean yeah

[trim hawk]

Like that's just a core mechanic introduced 10 min into the game

[ebon copper]

you just have to learn the timing, you already did ||absrad||, so they should be easy

[burnt grove]

I did It today :D

[burnt grove]

maybe a ||charm build||?

[trim hawk]

I guess ||spell twister||?

[ebon copper]

i mean, using ||mark of pride and shaman stone|| will help for sure

[trim hawk]

Honestly not too difficult

When I did it I didn't even bother taking off ||dashmaster||

[burnt grove]

something like this?

yes i know dw

its on purposes

[ebon copper]

oop

[burnt grove]

okay

i miss ||quickslash|| :(

[ebon copper]

when you are gonna ||overcharm|| always leave the most expensive charm last, and just fill up the rest of the slots only leaving 1

[trim hawk]

||most of radiance's attacks are attacks you've seen in other bosses already so I wouldn't worry too hard||

||though a bit annoying to do HK again if you fail||

[burnt grove]

maaaan fuck I almost made ittt

[shell abyss]

do ||spell twister || and ||shaman stone|| effects stack

[ruby shuttle]

yes

you get stronger ||spells that cost less soul||

[burnt grove]

what ||charm|| do I sacrifice then

[trim hawk]

they just do complete unrelated things so no reason for it to conflict

[shell abyss]

nice

[shell abyss]

no i was just asking a question

[primal vapor]

Honestly my go to build is || Sharp Shadow, Long nail, Mark of pride, Quick slash, and Glory. But I'm more of a nail user. ||

Honestly I've never done a soul build. I don't really know how strong they are anyways.

[ebon copper]

||sharp shadow|| is painfully useless

[burnt grove]

for ||oblobbles|| that Will never work

[trim hawk]

I almost never deviate from ||strength pride quicknail and spell twister or nailmaster||

[ebon copper]

it would

its just harder

[ruby shuttle]

||sharp shadow does do the same damage as your nail, but for two notches its not worth||

[trim hawk]

the moment ||sharp shadow staggered a boss into where I was dashing I instantly unequipped it||

[primal vapor]

Is were talking || oblobbles || then obviously not. I had that unequipped for || C2 || Must of read it wrong lol.

[ebon copper]

there doesnt exist a scenario in the game where it actually does more dmg than just using your nail optimally

[trim hawk]

the only real draw I can see is ||longer dash that honestly isn't really ever necessary||

||and just kinda gets in the way of muscle memory||

[primal vapor]

Woah, Woah... || I wouldn't say longer dash isn't necessary. || there good uses.

[ebon copper]

its neigher better nor worse because that, but it does mean you have to change your playstyle in accordance to the different ||dash|| distance every so often

[trim hawk]

||the stagger contact damage thing I just can't accept on my build||

[ebon copper]

it really isnt tho

[burnt grove]

what kind of fucking boss

[trim hawk]

But certainly not ||2 notches of value||

||hardly 1 notch||

[burnt grove]

moves TOWARDS YOU when you ||abyss Shriek|| them

[zinc verge]

Guys how do I beat ||elderbug||?

[trim hawk]

A lot of the floating ones

[ebon copper]

that sucks

[ebon copper]

he immortal

[trim hawk]

||shriek knock back is really odd i find||

||so I just don't shriek them||

I much prefer ||fireball to bunch them up||

[ebon copper]

||oblobles|| always change directions if they arent looking at you and you hit them

easy to corner yourself if you spam too hard

[burnt grove]

dude theyre such a paaain

2nd phase Is impossible

[primal vapor]

|| I think shriek is perfect for Radiance, and flying bosses, other then that not so much, I usually spam shrieked Rad first phase. ||

[trim hawk]

Play super passive I guess

dont greed

Or you just get met with a bullet to your face

[ebon copper]

i mean, ||shrie||k is the best ||spel||l in terms of dps

[trim hawk]

as for the dodging uh idk what to say other than dodge?

[ebon copper]

if you want to do bosses optimally you stand next to them and ||nailturnaround/shriek|| cycle them

[trim hawk]

go play some touhou and come back for raw dodging

[zinc verge]

wdym its also peak for many other bosses
some include
||nightmare king grimm, pure vessel, soul tyrant, white defender, failed champion and more||
you just need to find a good opening

[ebon copper]

depends on your perspective

[trim hawk]

got pretty power crept

[zinc verge]

hard at first but get used to it

[trim hawk]

my perspective is from ||doing NKG and GPZ before her so I found Radiance way easier than them||

[burnt grove]

I DID ITTT

I DEFEATES THEM

[trim hawk]

now they no longer exist forever

[autumn fractal]

were you doing ||radiant||

version

[burnt grove]

yes

[trim hawk]

Took me ages too

[burnt grove]

this Is the max I can get right?

[inner hound]

yes

[halcyon sierra]

Any tips for ||oblobbles|| all bindings I'm getting my ahh kicked

[halcyon sierra]

Damn

[primal vapor]

You know what... I just remembered a decent use for || Sharpshadow, primal aphids, hit them once, dash through, it does your nail damage turn around and slaughter them. ||

[trim hawk]

I play just super safe

[primal vapor]

But it's not as fun...

[halcyon sierra]

Whjch ||nail art ||should I be using for em

[burnt grove]

thank youuu

[halcyon sierra]

Fun and || primal aspids || in the same sentence 🥀🥀🥀

[halcyon sierra]

Hope i can reach that point before silksong is out

[trim hawk]

How to beat ||radiant primal aspid||

[inner hound]

i dont really like ||sharp shadow||, I think its not worth it compared to other charms

[inner hound]

use ||defender's crest||

[halcyon sierra]

Shi mb

[halcyon sierra]

U need || shade lord || for that

[inner hound]

why is ||shade|| even a spoiler ???

[trim hawk]

||shade as a concept is lore stuff I guess ||

[primal vapor]

Isn't that like the 3rd or 4th enemy you fight... really common if you suck.

[halcyon sierra]

It's for the || 2 new endings added with|| ||godhome ||

[primal vapor]

Ah...

[zinc verge]

why is everything a spoiler after ||dirtmouth||?
not like anyone can die to a ||tiktik||

[burnt grove]

for ||oblobbles||?

[burnt grove]

hope the same for you

[halcyon sierra]

Mf how's||dirtmouth|| a spoiler 😭😭

[trim hawk]

If ||staggered bosses didn't have contact damage I would pass it off as just not worth the price but the way you can stagger the boss and dash into the corpse is just very not good in my books||

[inner hound]

even ||King's Pass|| is a spoiler now

[trim hawk]

at this rate you can't even say hollow

[halcyon sierra]

Struggling with || p2 all bindings cuz of them ||

[halcyon sierra]

Hollow knight

[zinc verge]

i really don't know why tbh
its literally a tutorial area made to teach new players the basics of the game
it isn't made to be difficult

[primal vapor]

Hollow knight

Hmmm...

[trim hawk]

Mods kill them

[halcyon sierra]

Lol

[zinc verge]

guys how do I defeat hollow knight

[jade sedge]

The rule needs to be clear and simple

[halcyon sierra]

He spoiled the game's name

[burnt grove]

why are you doing ||all bindings||

[primal vapor]

Hornets suck, they sting like multiple times.

[jade sedge]

Just play the game?

[primal vapor]

Awwww, it didn't work.

[inner hound]

cuz thats fun i guess?

[trim hawk]

Is jumping a spoiler?

[zinc verge]

the flaming pillars deal 2 masks of damage
they are tough to avoid too

[halcyon sierra]

|| I'm mixing between doing all radiant bosses and all bindings to beat p5 again so that I wouldn't get bored from playing bosses non stop ||

[jade sedge]

||If you are talking about the boss, spoiler tag it.||

[autumn fractal]

show ur ||charm build||

[primal vapor]

Nail swinging must be one too

[inner hound]

are you gonna do ||P5AB|| ?

[halcyon sierra]

|| if u don't have shadow dash just use desolate dive for i.frames or just walk away||

[halcyon sierra]

|| after i do all bosses radiant and get all bindings for the first 4 pantheons ||

[primal vapor]

|| Don't you need shade cloak to get Des dive? ||

[trim hawk]

I feel |~the i frames would barely come out in time if reacting and just walking isn't doable in the first place||

[zinc verge]

umm I am using
||glowing womb, weaversong, grimmchild, heavy blow, joni's blessing||

[halcyon sierra]

I meant the white version forgot the name

[halcyon sierra]

WOAHHHH

[autumn fractal]

worst troll ever?

worst bait ever?

[halcyon sierra]

Good joke

Wait

[trim hawk]

Bro

[halcyon sierra]

HOW'S|| COMPASS A SPOILER||

[primal vapor]

You should put || Sharpshadow in there too. ||

[ebon copper]

||overcharming with joni|| is peak

[zinc verge]

not enough ||notches||

[trim hawk]

Did they just get a list of items in the game and blindly dump that into the list of banned words

[inner hound]

||overcharm|| with ||unbreakable greed||, its very good

[trim hawk]

can you even say key?

oh now that's totally fine I guess

[primal vapor]

Hot take... || Steady body isn't a horrible charm. ||

Collect

[trim hawk]

Swarm

[jade sedge]

Fyi, the bot isnt triggered by all words that need tags

[inner hound]

kinda cold take, many people use it and I love it too

[trim hawk]

for many though it does kinda do nothing

You need to go on the offense

[autumn fractal]

heard this was really good for ||P5|| because of all the bosses your fighting you get so much extra money!

[zinc verge]

alright i killed a bunch of ||tiktiks||
okay my build is now
||joni's blessing, grimmchild, glowing womb, heavy blow, unbreakable greed||

[trim hawk]

But also ||for 1 notch whatever||

[primal vapor]

|| So arguably since steady body is a decent charm by your words, and sharpshadow is arguably better, therefore sharpshadow must be a good charm || 💯

[halcyon sierra]

Jokes aside use these maybe

[ebon copper]

as someone who gladly hates on both, ||sharp shadow|| is much worse than ||steady body||

[stoic cedar]

||u want to be using a mix of narts and spells for this fight. the starting strategy for ab oblobbles is the same as regular oblobbles: u want to get them both on one side of u, clumped up, and coming towards u. if it can be avoided, u dont want to stay in the middle in between the two. then after u clump them up and they are coming towards u, u just need to keep them clumped up by continually knocking them back with narts and shade souls. u generally want to try to use a shade soul while they are shooting infection to guarantee a double hit (as long as its safe to do so), since if u try to shade soul them when they are just floating around then they wont take as much knockback and its hard to keep them from cornering u. if u get a double hit then they get knocked back a lot further and u can more easily prevent urself from getting cornered. speaking of getting cornered, u need to know when to switch sides; if they are getting too close and u r getting cornered, then u need to wait for a time when both are not shooting infection in order to shade dash and switch to the other side of them. just keep repeating this until one of them dies.||

||on second phase, when theres only one left, u want to use a combination of dash slashes and shade souls to kill off the last one. this phase is just about spacing urself correctly and going for safe hits. dont try to be too aggressive and know when to switch sides in this phase as well.||

i have attached a reference kill video

[halcyon sierra]

||steady ||goated y'all geekin

[primal vapor]

I am a ||sharp shadow|| Stan and I will die on this hill.

[inner hound]

||sbody|| allows for very good combos on bosses that get knocked back like ||oblobbles or lost kin paired with quicklash||, and is just comfortable in my opinion

[ebon copper]

you might, if you keep using it

[solid heart]

Yeah, it's not a debate, you can hate it, but the utility it offers is invaluable

[trim hawk]

||I feel that it might be a bit too good and make me reliant on it to screw me over for charm binding||

[primal vapor]

Tch... Next your going to tell me you hate || grubsong || to or whatever .

[ebon copper]

difference between ||sbody and ss|| is that ||sbody|| actually helps you do more dmg, not less

[ebon copper]

nahh, ||grubsongs|| amazing for my ||radiant|| build

[primal vapor]

Exactly!

Wait...

[inner hound]

ur right, but i still use it

[trim hawk]

I do love ||elegy for radiant but I stopped using it because it was just not giving me any meaningful practice||

[ebon copper]

its not ||elegy its, song||

[primal vapor]

You can't just do me like that. That was cold man.

[ebon copper]

im not even lieing btw

[trim hawk]

Yeah ik talking about different thing

[runic belfry]

why the hate on ||s shadow|| 😔

[ebon copper]

i use it when i use ||melody||, its a goated meme combo

[trim hawk]

||kinda funny how many bosses you can effortlessly bully with the laser sword||

[primal vapor]

He gets it!

Hell yeah, SS brother!

[runic belfry]

oops

[trim hawk]

||stagger contact damage :(||

[runic belfry]

wtf whyd they not work

[inner hound]

i dont like ||sharp shadow|| and i dont use ||grubsong|| cause its not useful when you dont get hit a lot, like in ||pantheons||

[runic belfry]

oh

ive never had that happens to me yet tho

[ebon copper]

cause it actively takes away from the dmg you could be doing for more inconsistency in movent

[trim hawk]

It's very rare

But the worst thing ever

[primal vapor]

But it looks cool...

[trim hawk]

also not a fan of ||increased dash but only for shadow||

[runic belfry]

||dashmaster and ss|| is peak

[ebon copper]

i mean, if you are using it for fun, than sure, but it still remains bad

[runic belfry]

trust

||ss|| i feel like the chip dmg is good no?

[primal vapor]

Fine... How about || Carefree Melody? ||

[runic belfry]

from it proccing while dodging?

[trim hawk]

In a world where ||staggered bosses don't have contact damage I'm a sharp shadow main||

[inner hound]

for ||1 notch and normal dash length i would use sharp shadow||

[halcyon sierra]

My phone died xd thank u so much for this I appreciate it
Imma try it later

Rn imma go play marvel rivals or ow with my friends

[ebon copper]

no, you could be doing more dmg if you werent in a long ass ||dash|| anaimation

[shut sparrow]

not a great charm but there are worse

[runic belfry]

😔

[primal vapor]

Better the || Grimmchild ||

[shut sparrow]

||also it costs 2 notches. You could be dealing a lot more damage with a different charm||

[runic belfry]

buff it fr

[shut sparrow]

it is

[ebon copper]

much better

[trim hawk]

||I do not like to rely on luck like that||

[ebon copper]

exactly

[trim hawk]

||I strongly value consistency||

[ebon copper]

using that is actively hindering yourself

[runic belfry]

wait is ||melody 2 or 3 notch?||

[inner hound]

I love ||dashmaster|| because of how good it is in all glitches

[tribal sandal]

2

[ebon copper]

3

[inner hound]

3

[ebon copper]

wrong

[tribal sandal]

meant 3

mb

[trim hawk]

||dashmaster stays on for my entire playtrhough in main game||

[primal vapor]

I wouldn't be caught dead doing || Pure Vessel without SS, it's impossible for me.||

[runic belfry]

what would the best hybrid build be then? both ||spells|| and nail

[trim hawk]

||respond always with a preemptive jump and PV is solved||

[ebon copper]

||pv||s so much more fun if you dont rely on ||invincibility frames||

[shut sparrow]

It's not that bad. The longer ||dash is mainly just a problem for higher level gameplay. The main problem is you getting used to a longer dash which costs 2 notches. It isn't usually an actively bad charm by itself though||

[tribal sandal]

||quick slash shaman strength and spell twister is a pretty good option||

[runic belfry]

only place I will say ||ss|| sucks is ||pop||

[runic belfry]

alr

[tribal sandal]

yeah

[primal vapor]

I'm not getting into higher game play anyways. I pride myself in being a filthy casual player.

[inner hound]

recently tried ||pv|| with ||ss||, got killed very quickly because im not used to the altered ||dash length|| even if i do him on ||radiant|| easy

[ebon copper]

by using the ||2 notches ||on something that does less dmg if you use it than just playing optimally without it, i would say that its a hiderance

[tribal sandal]

lol

[runic belfry]

whats the difference between higher tier gameplay and casual

like what do they do different

[ebon copper]

optimise dmg

[trim hawk]

hyper aggro melt bosses don't get hit

[tribal sandal]

and something like ||p5ab||

[primal vapor]

That's the thing, your not used to it, if you used SS every fight it would be better becuase it's your playstyle.

[trim hawk]

hug boss spamming up nail to not have knockback

[inner hound]

||fury + qs nailcancels||

[runic belfry]

what are ||nailcancels || 😭

[ebon copper]

its really boring if you spend a lot of time with every attempt, or every boss, so you wanna get to the hard part soon, and get in a many tries as possible, so you try and optimise doing dmg on the easier parts as much as possible

[shut sparrow]

by that definition ||strength would be a hindrance if you have 3 notches because shaman is a bit better. Just because there is a better option doesn't mean the initial option is bad||

[tribal sandal]

idek

[shut sparrow]

please tag ||SS||

[inner hound]

fair, but still got him charmless faster than with ||ss, quicklash, strenght, mop||

[shut sparrow]

that's not an argument

[ebon copper]

the thing is ||strenght and shaman|| fit into the same build, as they are both in the top3 charms for 3 ||notches||

[runic belfry]

||ss dashmaster shaman unb strength and dream wielder 🔥 ||

[primal vapor]

The highest I'm going is || P5 || Then moving to Silksong. When it comes out.

[shut sparrow]

||if you have 3 notches||

[tribal sandal]

fair

[inner hound]

thats why i say hes still right

[ebon copper]

while ||ss|| would have to be better than stuff like ||sb, nmg, dw, spell twister, heart||, and prob more to be viable

[runic belfry]

what are these abbreviations. 😭

[ebon copper]

not sure what you are trying to say with that,
like in a cursed rando or something?

[inner hound]

depending on your level, it can actually be better than ||heart||

[shut sparrow]

So you're saying whether a charm is an active hindrance or not depends on the amount of charms for the same cost or less which are better?

[shut sparrow]

you spawn with ||3 notches...||

[ebon copper]

||heart gives survivability, ss|| gives nothing but pain

[runic belfry]

cursed rando is 1 no?

[shut sparrow]

idk

[primal vapor]

I don't know if it makes it more reasonable but I'm a switch player so || SS || makes it way easier for me lol.

[runic belfry]

oos

[shut sparrow]

I was a switch player too and that doesn't really change anything

[ebon copper]

by the time you get to ||strenght||, you can have more than ||6||

[runic belfry]

1 mask and 1 ||notch|| i think (curse rando)

[inner hound]

im not a ||ss|| enjoyer, but ||heart|| becomes useless in very late game

[ebon copper]

imo, the order goes: ||qs, shaman, strenght, spell twister||

[trim hawk]

I hardly see a point even early game

[runic belfry]

parkour trust

[shut sparrow]

that was not my point. My point is that you can have ||strength and shaman in your inventory but not have the required notch amount. So you'd have to decide. And by your definition simply because shaman is a tiny bit better that makes strength a hindrance because there is a better option. ||

[ebon copper]

as someone quite late into the game, id say its a cool ||charm||, and id use it over ||ss|| any day of the week

[shut sparrow]

depends on your other charms

[inner hound]

i use ||sbody and nmg instead of twister||

[primal vapor]

Bad take imo... If your a new player early game, that thing is a life saver || Fragile or not ||

[runic belfry]

||nmg|| as no major glitches ? 😭💀

[ebon copper]

correct, in that scenario, putting on ||strenght|| hiders your progress

[runic belfry]

im so cooked

[inner hound]

depends on what ||spells and nail upgrades|| you have

[ebon copper]

||nail masters glory||

[trim hawk]

||I mean I guess but the fragile aspect really pushed me away first playing||

[runic belfry]

oooh

yeah im dumb

[inner hound]

me too, never used it before i made it ||unbreakable||

[shut sparrow]

In that scenario, yes. But that doesn't make the entire charm a hindrance. Just like ||sharp shadow isn't a hindrance simply because there can be better options||

[ebon copper]

||sharp shadow|| if you have the other ||charms|| i mentioned is tho

[trim hawk]

The only times it's detrimental are pretty niche edgecases

Otherwise it's like fine and looks cool

[ebon copper]

since, you cant physically get enough ||notches|| for there to be a place for it, unless you are missing a lot of ||charms||

[trim hawk]

goddamit

[shut sparrow]

and ||strength if you have other charms (and not a lot of space) is too. Any charm can be a hindrance based on your other options and the situation practically making calling a charm a hindrance irrelevant||

[trim hawk]

So is this not like new or something

I can't imagine this existed for long

[inner hound]

it makes you too far away from the boss you ||dash through|| to keep dealing good damage sometimes

[ebon copper]

thats fair, but to the best of my undrstanding the discussion was mostly for ||godhome|| content, and endgame stuff, that isnt traverse or parkour

[trim hawk]

It's a change in playstyle

Though often detrimental

[ebon copper]

and in that case|| ss|| is a hinderance

[trim hawk]

You can still work around that

some of the fatter bosses it could turn out better

but 2 ||notches|| eeeh

[shut sparrow]

The point I was trying to make is that ||sharp shadow isn't generally a bad charm as in it actively hinders you. It is just overshadowed a lot more than many other charms.
The charm itself unlike womb, thorns or heavy blow for example isn't a hindrance except for specific situations though||

[trim hawk]

like how does ||NMG|| get away with 1

[ebon copper]

the main problem with it imo, is that it just increases neighter survivability nor dps

[shut sparrow]

Again that doesn't make it a hindrance at all time. It would be a hindrance if it lowered any of them

[inner hound]

I am pretty sure there are no bosses besides ||umuu|| that cant be ||dashed through with normal dash length|| if you are close enough to them

[ebon copper]

ohh, so thats what you meant, yes, it does not directly cut your dps or survivability, just indirectly

[trim hawk]

Itd be more a matter of spacing

like if you want to maintain a nail distance

[ebon copper]

we could say that ||ss|| is twice as good as any of the ones you mentioned, since those charms hinder you both directly and undirectly

[shut sparrow]

and even that only if you have better options or are playing on a very high level

[ebon copper]

fair enough

[timber bay]

curious about ||SS||, is it not majorly useful against stuff like ||NKG's dash/slash attack||? or we're saying the highest dps build just doesn't use it

[shut sparrow]

The charm itself doesn't hinder you at all. It's simply not as good as many other ones in many situations.
That's not comparable to literally hurting you when putting it on

[ebon copper]

it does not, ||pogoing|| is more dmg

[inner hound]

||though ss is optimal for PV speedrun I think||

[trim hawk]

You could ||mart instead for way more damage without being kilometre away||

[timber bay]

no ||parry||? 🥺

[ebon copper]

thats why im saying its twice as good ina way

[shut sparrow]

anyway this discussion isn't for this channel. You can ping me in #hk-general if you wanna add more to it

[trim hawk]

I do not feel comfortable doing that

too much risk for not enough reward

[ebon copper]

||parry|| is sadly not optimal normally since it gives freezeframes

[timber bay]

its okay if ||pogoing|| is better i just didnt know

[inner hound]

in ||pufferfish and flame pillar attack|| it allows for slightly better combos than without

[ebon copper]

im good, happy to have a good discussion tho

[trim hawk]

I just ||shadow through and charge slash before he leaps||

[timber bay]

that works too

[ebon copper]

no, im saying sadly cause i want parry to be better...

its my fav mechanic in the game

[timber bay]

same that would be cool

[trim hawk]

I'd assume ||SS|| ruins the spacing for that

[timber bay]

you can hit more times if you dont ||dash|| through if we're talking optimally but yeah thats a good attack to use

idk why ||ss|| would change that he moves a significant distance i thought

[trim hawk]

you could adjust and move farther back before dashing

but I'd rather just be safe

[ebon copper]

that, you can also hit almost twice in the time that you ||dash|| with ||sharp shadow||, and than there is the fact that its taking up ||2 notches||

[timber bay]

the ||2 notches|| part is the real stinger

[trim hawk]

For as many strategies ||SS gives, it kinda takes away just as many||

[timber bay]

it just changes your gameplay style

[ebon copper]

itd be great if it was free

[trim hawk]

I'd accept 1

[timber bay]

it would but it would be in every build then

it would be great if ||wayward compass|| was free 🙂

[ebon copper]

not really, the inconsistent ||dash|| distace would still be something thats quite bad in many fights

[trim hawk]

50/50

[timber bay]

actually make ||glowing womb -2 notches|| that would make it usable

[trim hawk]

Well exact ratio it's better idk

[ebon copper]

agreed

[trim hawk]

Honestly negative cost ||charms|| kinda sound potentially cool

If the effect isn't too crippling

like no halving movement speed or something

[timber bay]

like ||bindings|| but for all the time

[ebon copper]

if ||glowing womb|| was -2, itd make ||soul eater|| viable without ||overcharm||

[timber bay]

and then ||soul eater|| cancels out the negative effects basically

[ebon copper]

sorta

[trim hawk]

||glowing womb + king soul maybe?||

[timber bay]

just hit the boss

[trim hawk]

Though ||5 is still crazy||

[timber bay]

||king soul|| isnt worth 2 ||notches||

[ebon copper]

now thats a terrible build

[timber bay]

i think it drains your soul faster than it replenishes

[trim hawk]

7 ||notch weaversong||

[ebon copper]

id still find a way to use it honestly

[ruby shuttle]

slow build ||heavy blow, deep focus, baldur shell||

[timber bay]

||weaversong grimmchild glowingwomb hiveblood shape of uun baldurshell||

[ebon copper]

and less chance to heal

[solid heart]

You forgot ||thorns||

[timber bay]

yes that one too

how much does that add up to

[ebon copper]

12

[timber bay]

with our theoretical -2

[ebon copper]

with ||thorns|| 13

[trim hawk]

Is it any worse than||quick + deep focus and Joni||

[ebon copper]

so its doable

ohh, with the -2 itd be 9

itd be like kinda decent actually

[timber bay]

could add something dumb on top

||grubsong||

just spoiler it all

[ebon copper]

yea, ||overcharming|| on that with ||womb||

[timber bay]

absolutely

[trim hawk]

well hey at least you're not robbing yourself of healing from the drain

[ebon copper]

W

[upper sable]

||So I’m doing pantheon of hallownest, and so far I’ve managed to get to absolute radiance once and, after like 20 attempts, I beat them individually, but I’m terrified of beating her at the end of the pantheon. The ONLY bosses I struggle with at this point are her and Pure Vessel. I need help deciding something. My charm loadout I plan on using is quick focus, shaman stone, carefree melody(gonna have to do a new playthrough for that), and I’m deciding between soul catcher and shape of Unn. Which is better for Pure Vessel and Absolute radiance?||

[ebon copper]

id advise to not use more than ||2 notches|| on ||defensive charms||

[trim hawk]

||I love unn but I can't recommend it in the build||

also just not a ||melody|| guy

[upper sable]

||Quick focus|| is kind of a necessity for me. XD

Can’t play the game without it

[trim hawk]

||Unn|| kinda fulfils a similar role

kinda

and also funny ||slug||

[ebon copper]

i mean ||qf, unn and melody|| is crazy

[cursive escarp]

||how do i beat sly||

?

[ebon copper]

surely you dont need that much survivability

[trim hawk]

Insert don't get hit message

[upper sable]

I do when both bosses deal 2 damage every hit

[timber bay]

run

[ebon copper]

i mean, the solution is to get hit less

[ruby shuttle]

those are valuable ||notches that should be used for something like strength||

[upper sable]

I get that, and this build may just be temporary. I’ve already switched my charm loadout many times

[ebon copper]

its worth getting somewhat consistent in all bosses except ||absrad|| on ||ascended||

[trim hawk]

If the boss dies faster that's less opportunities to get hit in the first place

[timber bay]

getting all ||endings|| does not account for skill issue I'm sorry

[timber bay]

this is my idea of a good time

[upper sable]

Also I find it funny how, as someone who’s beaten every Soulsborne game and its hardest bosses… I struggled a lot with ||false knight||. Granted hollow knight is my first ever completed 2d platformer, but still

[snow steppe]

bad time

[simple island]

||Carefree melody… ewww
Do you really wanna bet you beating p5|| on a dice roll ?
Do you really want to think until the end of time that "yeah, I’ve beaten ||p5||, probably only cuz I got lucky though"

[timber bay]

every soulsborne game has the same animations so they get kinda predictable, learning a whole new game with a different artstyle in a different dimension though

[simple island]

Have some god darn confidence in yourself, practice the bosses you struggle with until you get consistent, then just beat the thing with a normal charm build that doesn’t pray on dice rolls

[ruby shuttle]

||carefree melody never works on the first hit, then every hit after that, you have a 10% of it activating, where it then resets back to zero||

[upper sable]

Isn’t she already sorta based on luck? Sure you can beat her without luck, but it’s still helpful getting the right RNG

[ebon copper]

thats why you beat it many times

[upper sable]

Fair enough.

[ebon copper]

she isnt, its perfectly doable dmgless everytime in theory

[upper sable]

Honestly the one thing that’s helped me get through ||pure vessel|| was ||unbreakable strength||

[simple island]

That is completely true, but you can very much limit that by just being less aggressive in the ||platform phase and waiting long enough for the good patterns to appear||

[timber bay]

||strength|| objectively good

[upper sable]

So yeah maybe I do just need to practice the bosses

[upper sable]

||I prefer shaman stone for Absrad, but unbreakable strength for pure vessel, which feels so conflicting||

[stoic cedar]

So why not use both?

[timber bay]

i do both

[upper sable]

But I also need ||quick focus||. I can’t play the game without it

That’s like 9 charm slots

[timber bay]

my build is ||strength, shaman, mark of pride|| and a few others

isnt it 6 or am i off

[upper sable]

All three require 3 charm slots

[timber bay]

the fact we can say this but not ||notches|| is kinda crazy lol

[timber bay]

oh yea your build does yes

[ebon copper]

optimal build is: ||shaman, strenght, qs, and eighter twister or sb|| and something

[timber bay]

oh yeah ||quickslash|| too

i think i was ||overcharming|| when i was doing the ||mark of pride|| stuff

||hitting 2x as much is better than doing a little more damage per hit||

[upper sable]

The thing is… I don’t like using ||quickslash|| for fast bosses like ||pure vessel|| and ||NKG||, due to them ||teleporting|| a lot

[timber bay]

it's specifically good on ||pure vessel|| especially with the attack where ||spikes pop out||

[upper sable]

I am definitely considering it for ||absrad||, but I also have to consider ||pure vessel|| into the charm build

[timber bay]

you just need to b in its face the whole time

if you want it to be useful

[upper sable]

That attack always fucks me over… if I do literally anything other than just focus on avoiding the attack I get hit

[ebon copper]

||qs|| is increadible in every fight other than like maybe ||no eyes|| if you get really bad rng

[timber bay]

i get it, ||after avoiding the slam he does at the start (or getting hit by it 😂) i just kinda try to get next to him||

[upper sable]

I’m always next to him then

[timber bay]

oh yyeah I'm a ||steady body||-er

but you can do the same thing with ||upslashes||

[upper sable]

Also… how come when you get hit with 2 damage while you have 1 ||lifeblood heart||, you take 3 damage? Does that only happen for me?

[stoic cedar]

Visual bug

[timber bay]

weird

[upper sable]

Wait what

[upper sable]

Just a visual bug?

[stoic cedar]

Yep

[upper sable]

Wow… I’ll have to confirm that.

[deft glade]

||If you defeat NKG in Godhome with Grimmchild equipped, would that complete the Ritual? Or does it have to be in Grimm's tent?||

[upper sable]

I assume it has to be in ||Grimm’s Tent||

No source of information ive ever seen has said otherwise

[timber bay]

thats such a specific niche case I'm kinda curious lol but theres no way since you can use the charm against the boss if you do it that way

[upper sable]

Why?

[ruby shuttle]

it has to be in ||grimms tent||

[deft glade]

Actually, no. ||Grimmchild doesn't appear for the Grimm fights, including Godhome ones.||

[deft glade]

Curious

[timber bay]

reallyyyyyy

so it is basically the same

fascinating

[upper sable]

Oh. Thought you were doing a challenge run or something where you need that.

Fair enough

[timber bay]

rando where you ||can only reach nkg in godhome||

[upper sable]

Alright… which is better for ||Pure Vessel|| and ||absrad||? ||Quick Slash||, or ||Unbreakable Strength?||

XD

[ebon copper]

..., i cant, i shouldnt type on my phone

[deft glade]

||Or just banish them||

[timber bay]

||QS|| just practice the timing a little bit before you go all in

[timber bay]

true

you dont have ||grimmchild|| in that case tho

[ebon copper]

anyway, it doesnt complete the ||ritual||

[upper sable]

But why choose ||Grimmchild|| over ||carefree melody||?

[timber bay]

doing ||p5|| with the worst charm build possible

[upper sable]

XD

[timber bay]

idk you like how it looks, or you never use ||carefree|| anyways

[ebon copper]

ofc, very

[upper sable]

||deep focus, steady body, compass, Grimmchild, glowing womb, and Joni’s blessing to overcharm. XD||

[timber bay]

add ||heavy blow|| and we have a deal

[deft glade]

||Love how you overcharmed||

[upper sable]

Oh shit

[dense raven]

what about || thorns of agony too ||

[upper sable]

Thought I said ||heavy blow, not steady body||

[timber bay]

oh yes thats it

thats good

[upper sable]

||Remove compass and steady body, add heavy blow instead||

[timber bay]

||joni's blessing to overcharm|| is so objectively funny, the thing that is supposed to make you ||take more hits|| does the opposite 😭😭

[timber bay]

yes actively detrimental charms only

[upper sable]

And on top of ||deep focus|| being added previously… XD

God I wish there was a charm that boosted the cooldown between ||shade cloak|| uses… 😔

Probably wouldn’t use it, but still

[timber bay]

me too

there arent a lot of synergies

in basegame

[upper sable]

Wouldve been nice if ||sharp shadow|| and ||dashmaster|| instead decreased the cooldown instead of boosting the damage

That just makes more sense

Actually I’m just now realizing, why didn’t they do that?

[timber bay]

didnt know about the boosting damage thing

but yeah it should do the other thing

[ebon copper]

would be way too strong

[timber bay]

would balance ||sharp shadow||

[upper sable]

So… about that. Does it often hit twice, or does it only hit twice when striking the enemy with your nail during the effect? Cause I swear to god, I’m hitting the enemy with the nail during the effect but I’m not getting soul

[copper lava]

😔

[dense raven]

it hits twice?

[fluid garden]

i mean you still wouldnt use ||3 notches for that compared to just charms that boost your damage||

[upper sable]

🤷‍♂️

Apparently not

So yeah

[dense raven]

oh yeah it does

[timber bay]

||4 notches!!||

[dense raven]

if its in range

[ebon copper]

depending on the numbers it could be a good idea, but the decrease would have to be quite small

[upper sable]

Oh it does?

[dense raven]

but it doesnt give soul

[ebon copper]

getting more invincibility frames would be really strong

[upper sable]

||thorns of agony|| can hit twice? With or without swinging the nail?

[fluid garden]

oh right i usually play with the charm exaltation mod which makes ||dashmaster 1 notch|| so i got used to it i suppose

[dense raven]

im not really sure i dont use it and wasnt bothered further searching on google

i think without tho

[upper sable]

Yeah ||thorns of agony|| isn’t worth the research. XD

[dense raven]

rs

[fluid garden]

i mean yeah but i dont think itd be any better still once you just learn to dodge and ||ddark when needed||

[ebon copper]

true, but it would still make the game fundamentally easier

[timber bay]

like a slight increase. like you can ||dash|| 3 times in between ||shade cloak w dash master|| base game, with this it would be maybe 2?

[dense raven]

it would be ||4 charm notches tho, ||and you wouldnt have to make it super broken, you could just make it slightly faster.

[ebon copper]

thats not slight at all

[upper sable]

||wait does desolate dive provide I frames like descending dark?||

[timber bay]

it is basically refreshing your ||cloak|| every second

[ebon copper]

ye, i agree itd be possible to tweak it just right

[ebon copper]

not the same way but yes

[timber bay]

whats base game ||cloak|| refresh I'm curious

[ebon copper]

it only gives iframes on the landing

[upper sable]

Elaborate please.

If you can

[ebon copper]

while falling with ||ddark you dont take dmg, while falling with dive|| you do, you only get iframes when you are in the animation of landing and like .4secs after that

[simple island]

I don’t understand what they mean myself lol

[upper sable]

Oh.

[simple island]

Really ?? I never knew that
It is so random

[upper sable]

I mean it makes sense

[ebon copper]

its at least what ive heard, and it seems to be correct from my own experience ingame

[upper sable]

||Ddark|| is an upgraded version of ||desolate dive||

Only makes sense the I frames are improved

[timber bay]

you dont ||pass thru enemies invincibly when using dive?||

[ebon copper]

i think so, but now im getting confused myself

lol

[upper sable]

||ddark is the only spell with I frames right?||

[upper sable]

Know the feeling. XD

[timber bay]

what would be the point if you land on an enemy and when their hit box touches you you get hit before completing the attack

you can only ||dive|| next to enemies then

[upper sable]

Ugh I knew I should’ve spoiled that

[ebon copper]

i might have been just plain wrong, and since ive not used ||dive|| on enemies for quite a whie, i didnt get enough data myself

[upper sable]

Well you’re bound to get ||ddark|| eventually anyways, it’s like the second easiest upgraded version of a ||spell|| you can get aside from ||shade soul||

[timber bay]

i was playing with it in rando for a while i just assumed it was the same but maybe QoL did something

[upper sable]

And I have a feeling it’s a fun challenge for speedrunners to work around

[ebon copper]

i do play randos, but i basically never use ||dive|| outside of ||absrad|| fight

[upper sable]

||Ddark|| is such a fucking fun ||spell||… possibly my favorite move in the entire game.

[simple island]

You can definitely ||dive into enemies whatever the upgrade
You even do that just after getting dive at soul master||

Methink your info is bullshit

[timber bay]

i had lvl 0 ||nail|| and no other ||spells|| 😭😭😭

[upper sable]

I wish I could play Randos… but I don’t have a pc… 😔

[ebon copper]

well, i already pleaded guilty

[ebon copper]

nail0 is lowkey op

[upper sable]

“Your honor, he pleads ‘it was just an oopsie-woopsie’”

[timber bay]

how much dmg does it do again

[upper sable]

5

Max nail does I think 21 or 23

[ebon copper]

21

[dense raven]

absolutely insane

bro i always forget about the spoiler thing

[ebon copper]

it upgrades in additions of 4

[dense raven]

pisses me off ngl

[timber bay]

yeah it was badd for awhile i also had lowered soul gain i had to increase over time

anyways ||dive|| does 35 if you get both hits

[ebon copper]

the split nail setting with 1 heart is what destroeyd me most out of all the randos i did

[upper sable]

HOW IS THAT A SPOILER?!

[timber bay]

the first hit should be invincible how else are you gonna get that attack to connect

[upper sable]

Plan on doing a no ||nail upgrade|| run sometime… without ||spells||. ||Flukemarm|| is gonna be fucking impossible

[timber bay]

you gonna do the ||skips for no spells||

or just not use them unless absolutely necessary

[upper sable]

No im just gonna use ||spells|| when necessary to traverse areas

[dense raven]

u should do || no vs elder baldur lmao ||

[timber bay]

fair fair no need to do 15 hour skip it isnt low% 😂

[upper sable]

I can’t even ||nail pogo|| off of a single enemy to skip to ||Hornet||. XD

[timber bay]

this is what i was thinking of

[upper sable]

?

[dense raven]

its possible with like frame perfect damage boosting

absolutely insane

so u can get to || greenpath without vs ||

[ebon copper]

||enemy pogos|| are decently doable in this game tbf

[dense raven]

yeah ofc

[upper sable]

Oh yeah the ||longnail|| strat against the ||baldur|| blocking ||greenpath||?

[timber bay]

||fireballess baldur|| yeah

[dense raven]

not even || longnail i dont think ||

it probs helps but u can still do it withourt i think

[ebon copper]

you can also do it with|| dream shield||, and even just itemless

[timber bay]

it probably helps a little

[ebon copper]

tas can do it itemless

[upper sable]

Yeah I’m using ||spells|| for that guy, I’m probably gonna fail at the no ||spell|| strat, and I usually don’t do glitches for challenge runs anyways

[timber bay]

thats ok you have fun with it thats what matters

[dense raven]

|| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6ietCz6dk0 ||

[upper sable]

… I’m not doing the skip to ||resting grounds||, that’s worse

[ebon copper]

its not a glitch

[ebon copper]

that1s easy imo

[timber bay]

with ||nail 0|| too

[dense raven]

yeah

its insane

[upper sable]

Don’t you need to nail pogo off of your ||shade|| like 3 consecutive times?

[timber bay]

it takes so many freaking hits

[dense raven]

at || blue lake skip? ||

[timber bay]

yes to do it itemless

[upper sable]

Yeah, that’s the only way to get to ||resting grounds|| to get ||dreamshield|| early

[dense raven]

yeah u can pogo off ur || shade's nail slashes, and then the added two hits on the shade ||

[ebon copper]

well, yes, but that ist really the hard part, the hard part is that one of them has to be a ||parry||

[dense raven]

yeah

[upper sable]

I’ve never even gotten a ||parry|| intentionally when playing the game…

[dense raven]

lmao same tbh

[upper sable]

What is the timing on that I wonder

Like 1 frame?

[dense raven]

it isnt that hard to || parry || i dont think

[ebon copper]

its not that bad at all

[dense raven]

yeah

[ebon copper]

its quite forgiving

[upper sable]

I don’t know how the ||parry|| timing works

[timber bay]

you just hit the attack while its out

[upper sable]

All I know is I hit as they hit

[ebon copper]

you have to hit a tinybit earlier compared to when what you are ||parrying hits||

[upper sable]

But I dunno if the nail slash itself has to be after or during their nail slash

[timber bay]

when you see it readying to slash you ready to slash

[upper sable]

If that makes sense

[drowsy yarrow]

||Parry timing depends on whether the enemy's nail hitbox is touching your damage hitbox. If so, it's one frame. If it's only colliding with your nail hitbox and not your damage hitbox, it always works.||

[upper sable]

oh

[ebon copper]

is it really 1 frame?

no way

[drowsy yarrow]

I heard it was, never verified though

[timber bay]

||you arent being hit by the attack so its not a perfect parry but its still a parry technically||

[ebon copper]

i see no chance for that, it couldnt be so consistent if it was

[timber bay]

||your nail hitbox lasts for a few frames so maybe if the enemy enters your hitbox while its out its a perfect parry||

[drowsy yarrow]

||If it's colliding with your nail hitbox first, then it's still consistent, since you immediately gain iframes||

[timber bay]

is that why it does the double clang sound effect on ||NKG|| slash attack

[upper sable]

Oh btw. So, as a reminder, hollow knight is my first ever completed 2d platformer. And guess what this dumbass forgot to do for like 3/4ths of ||white palace||? I forgor to ||nail pogo||, only remembering it’s a thing at the one time it’s required, and also after looking up a guide

I honestly forgot about that mechanic so much my first playthrough

[ebon copper]

||the perfect parry does indeed come from your nail hitbox lingering, how it works is that the nail hitbox that would normally only be around for a couple of frames causes freeze frames with parrying, so it ends up lingering for longer, and if your timing was actually perfect you can techically parry twice in one hit, meaning that if your nail hitbox also overlaps with the bosses hitboy, itll register as 2 hits to the boss||

[upper sable]

||I wonder if it’s possible to beat hollow knight using only parries? 🤔 Sekiro music starts blasting||

[ebon copper]

it probably is

[dense raven]

how would you deal damage

wait do ||parries|| deal damage??

[upper sable]

I… think?

Me forgor

[ebon copper]

depends on where your nails hitbox is

[timber bay]

you can only fight bosses that you can parry?

[dense raven]

right

[ebon copper]

it only deals dmg if it overlaps with the boss itself

[timber bay]

basically you do damage then it calculates the ||parry||

[dense raven]

that sounds unnecessarily difficult

[timber bay]

or like you did damage the frame before the ||parry|| hits something like that

unnecessarily difficult like activating the ||grimm bonfire in 3 hits||

[simple island]

(Basically unless you wanna be nerdy about it don’t think about ||parrying too hard and just don’t rely|| on it)

[ebon copper]

but its waaay too cool a mechanic

[upper sable]

I saw the word ||bonfire|| and I instantly started flashing back to dark souls 3(my second favorite game next to hollow knight)

[simple island]

Sekiro better imo tbh imo

Anyway

[upper sable]

Gameplay wise yes

[timber bay]

if you like ||parries|| practice on ||NKG or the nailmaster bros||

[upper sable]

But it has less replay value(no build options aside from prosthetics) and in my opinion not as good lore

Oh wait you mean for parrying?

Am I dumb?

[ebon copper]

best parries are on ||pv|| and ||hornet2||

[timber bay]

i dunno the ||hornet one is it in reaction to her parry lol||

[ebon copper]

yes

its fun af

[simple island]

It is consistent but it is really useless lol
It also requires ||quick slash||

[timber bay]

||parry gods pv, hornet and hollow knight||

[ebon copper]

its so cool to do tho

[undone hornet]

Can I have some help please ?
I just started the game , and I really enjoy it but ||I encountered someone called hornet , she's so fast and I can't beat her after dying like 8 times and I hate the long road to go back|| can someone give me some tips?

[bleak gale]

what bench do you respawn at?

[dense raven]

does anybody know || how much essence soul tyrant gives? ||

also a good build for || soul tyrant ||, i have || all charms ||

[acoustic sigil]

300

[acoustic sigil]

||Shaman stone, quick slash, strength, spell twister||

[dense raven]

cool thanks

just beat him

now i can || ascend seer!! ||

111% time

now all i have to do is || p4||...

[snow vigil]

gluck

[dense raven]

bro i gotta do || pv || for the first time on 4hp

any tips lmao

[acoustic sigil]

No

You'll need to practice him in ||Hall of Gods anyway ||

[ebon copper]

||#hk-help message||

[dense raven]

we're in hk help vro

what

OH

[acoustic sigil]

It's a link to a previous message

[dense raven]

yeah i just realised

thanks

when he starts healing, is that in a 2nd phase? or does he just do that in 1st phase

[ebon copper]

its not really a heal, and it could be called the 2nd phase

[dense raven]

well yk he is like " focusing "

should i change anything here for || pv? i have all charms and all notches ||

like im wondering if i should use || sharp shadow, is it worht it? ||

[stoic cedar]

looks good to me, u dont need to change a thing

[dense raven]

cool thx

[dense raven]

i spent 35 min practicing || pv, now i cant even get to pv in the pantheon 😭 ||

[grand tapir]

I'd recommend taking a break then coming back to it after about an hour

But make sure you can still beat ||pv|| before you jump back in

[normal vessel]

Hey guys, I'm trying to get the ||''Carefree Melody'||' charm but I'm confused.
I beat the ||Nightmare King Grimm ||and encouterend someone down the well in ||Forgotten Crossroads||, but he left and I don't know where he went. Anyone help pls?

[olive mirage]

once you beat ||nkg there is no way to get carefree melody ||

the dude you saw at the ||bottom of the well has nothing to do with the trope. just a random chance||

[ebon copper]

if you give me your gamefile ill saveedit you one thats the same but with ||carefree melody||

[olive mirage]

It would get rid of ||Grimm child though||

[ebon copper]

ofc, but you could just have both files

[ebon copper]

go into: appdata: local low: team cherry: hollow knight
and drop the savefile in my dms, ill give you an edited version and change the name so it loads onto another saveslot, all youll have to do is download the savefile i give you and put the new savefile into the same folder you pulled the original from

[keen stream]

ts is my exact build last night

[spice orchid]

||is the 1% pantheon 4? ||

[ebon copper]

yes

[spice orchid]

thanks

[subtle bear]

I was so confused

[stoic cedar]

hello, any media of in-game content needs to be spoilered as per channel rules. unfortunately u will have to delete ur message and resend the video spoilered to conform to channel rules.

[subtle bear]

Ok

[shut sparrow]

||I believe the float glitch in the video happened because of the shade soul. If you don't find a tilted wall you'll have to quit out. You can also ask in #speedrunning if you want||

[subtle bear]

I quit it because even when I touch the ground or death wall I will still float

It fix now I just thought i was weird

[grizzled fulcrum]

@cool_fredCould someone help me? I'm new to the game and I'm also Brazilian, I don't understand much English.

[subtle bear]

Yeah

What do you need help with

[hexed prawn]

||does anyone know why i dont get the herald ending ive beaten the hollow knight and ive did all the rest its my last achievement w p5 soimeone plz help 9ive looked everywhere online||

[grizzled fulcrum]

with everything friend

Can you tell me if there are any Brazilians here?

[subtle bear]

Lol, só me diga onde você está no jogo

[grizzled fulcrum]

Opa brasileiro tbm vai ajuda muito

Tô na cidade louva deus

[vague birch]

i'm struggling to beat the ||trial of the fool?|| what charm build would be best? i can buy any of the ones that can be bought

[grizzled fulcrum]

Is it mandatory to speak English?

[subtle bear]

Cidade das lágrimas?

[grizzled fulcrum]

Cidade louva deus

Obrigatório fala inglês?

[shut sparrow]

from the ones you have I recommend||shaman stone, nailmaster's glory, soul catcher, quick focus.
You really want to focus on nailarts and spells||

[shut sparrow]

yes

[grizzled fulcrum]

I don't know much English, it's going to be complicated for me, but here we go.

[olive mirage]

yes

[grizzled fulcrum]

Are there a lot of Brazilians on this server?

[olive mirage]

yes

but its english only so the moderators dont have to use google translate

[shut sparrow]

so the last place you ||talked to Mr. mushroom was in king's pass?||

[grizzled fulcrum]

If someone is Brazilian, could you say this word please so I can identify it (br)

[olive mirage]

if you find someone who speeks your langauge you can dm them but its english only when you are on the server

[hexed prawn]

yes affirmative

[shut sparrow]

and you haven't been skipping the credits?

with qol mod for example

[grizzled fulcrum]

I'm using Google Translate lol

[hexed prawn]

no i waited till the end of the credits

and i tried 2 times

i did it after the 112% idk if it has anything to do with it

[shut sparrow]

do you play on pc?

[grizzled fulcrum]

I'm sorry, are you Brazilian?

[hexed prawn]

yes i do

[shut sparrow]

and have you ever used any mods?

[olive mirage]

no

ask your question an ill try and help