sk-lore

[unborn nova]

Why would the pilgrims be fans of the wanderer?

[marble oasis]

i mean i’m pretty sure reaper is just a silk snipper

he was just like the lebron of silk snipping

[craggy smelt]

he was great at the harp

[unborn nova]

I wonder what do the wanderer, reaper, beast, witch, architect, shaman have in common that made them bindable to Hornet's crest.

[halcyon merlin]

nothing?

i think "anyone" can bind someone else nature

the thing is having a lot/still having your own nature

(i dont remember what eva says)

and well hornet is special

half weaver that is basically a race a god made
and
half wyrm

• pale being

[marble oasis]

nah this is a wyrmspawn exclusive

her nature is specially malleable

since wyrms whole schtick is transformation

[halcyon merlin]

would make sense

on why she can have a lot

[craggy smelt]

changing is a wyrm thing
binding is a weaver thing
changing by binding might be a hornet thing

[marble oasis]

although other wyrmspawn might be able to focus them in rather than bind

[unborn nova]

What's the difference between focus and bind? (not talking about gameplay)

[muted lantern]

Focusing is just focusing the soul in your body to make your shell heal something we only really know pk and his kids can probably do, binding is using her magical silk (known for it's healing propeties, to externally bind her wounds. likely something only weavers do

[unborn nova]

Isn't silk just a form of soul?

[muted lantern]

Hornet metabolizes soul into silk, but the process is different than the vessels using soul directly

[halcyon merlin]

prettu much

[rapid bloom]

Pilgrim, these perilous roads are unlike those of Crispia.

[rapid bloom]

Yeah, it is. The Weavers turn soul into silk which they can keep on looms.

And it's interesting to me that back in Hallownest, in Weaver Den, they had a dozen of them.

[dreamy onyx]

whats the deal with pendras?

they seem to be in Verdania but also Moss Grotto and Weavenest Atla

I think there's also one in the Memorium

maybe im just thinking too deep about them but i just find it interesting how they're in several lush areas

[craggy smelt]

creatures from Verdania may have propagated far into the mosslands area

I think there might even be a deeper connection between Verdania and the Mosslands

compare Verdanian eggs to Mossland creature eggs

they aren't quite the same, but there are similarities - maybe a distant connection?

[halcyon merlin]

it does make sense that verdania and moss have a connection

[marble oasis]

When i went to the memorium the first time I actually didn’t realise it was verdanian plants, I thought it was still just moss grotto

[dreamy onyx]

yeah same

[dreamy onyx]

i wish there'd have been a mention of it

it seems mildly important

also they're basically the only bugs to survive from Verdania minus the green prince

[marble oasis]

are they not only in verdania?

[dreamy onyx]

There's a one in the foreground of Memorium and some silhouettes in Moss Grotto and the mossy portion of Weavenest Atla

[marble oasis]

?

pretty clearly whatever that glowing one is

[heavy gyro]

It's a leftover from when verdania was next to moss grotto

It got replaced by wormways and moved to near greymoor

[unborn nova]

That's maybe an oversight, but would be cool if there is lore explanatiob.

[graceful grail]

How have i never noticed that this was lumble the lucky here??

The Weavers were Mean 😤

[muted lantern]

I think hes just lumble now.

[midnight reef]

probably would've made more sense back when Verdania was above the Moss Grotto, lol

[stray fog]

What if the moss druid dialogue about sensing another heart is actually leftover from this as well?

Shes talking about green prince

It looks like this dialogue is a hint for players
Telling them that a fourth old heart exists near the moss areas. One that is too faint to be sensed by the shamans

[stray fog]

@whole holly you're the moss druid expert

[craggy smelt]

hmm, maybe

now, it almost reads like Moss Druid wants to spark a new Heart in the Mosslands

'why not here?!'

[muted lantern]

can't wait for the dlc heart of moss

[craggy smelt]

City of Moss

[marble oasis]

Doesn’t his title change after he gives you the dice

[muted lantern]

does it? i was just making a joke about him dying

[marble oasis]

I knew it

Also apparently he’s a woman in the translations

[ionic basalt]

Lumble the normal

[muted lantern]

Odd

well, do we ever get a gender for lumble? i don't remember if hornet calls him sir or not

[dreamy onyx]

yeah

"I'm sure I can grasp the rules quickly enough, sir"

[unborn nova]

Why did Gurr even steal Gilly's doll?

[crimson coyote]

Yeah it’s a male

[craggy smelt]

it was an ultra rare collectible

he's clearly into those

[unborn nova]

What's so special about the doll?

[whole holly]

yeah, Moss Druid seems like bug that is trying to concoct new heart, but for what reason we aren't sure

we know strong mortals are strengths of the their land, also Karmelita was able to resist/ward off haunting

it seems that New Moss Heart may do similar thing against Lifeblood and Moss Lands will have new strength they need

[whole holly]

i don't think Clover dancers are Heart moss druid is trying to sense, but her lore was affected by scrapped and rewritten content, her dialogue hints at four existing hearts some believe

[marble oasis]

moss druid talks about needing a “new” heart so it wouldn’t make sense for her to be talking about an existing one

[stray fog]

Oh

Alright

[whole holly]

yeah, it seems misaligned with Moss Druid's mission

[muted lantern]

Does loyal mergwin or the grand gourmand die after their quest in act 3?

[craggy smelt]

nope, they live!

[muted lantern]

Of all the people to survive lol

it had to be that asshole and his dog

[marble oasis]

isn’t mergwin sort of the dog here

[stray fog]

https://youtu.be/ilFUHGyhxWQ
This video has an interesting theory about the wastes

At 9:36

They postulate that the wasteland has multiple layers

However, I'm still a believer in the theory that pharloom is in a mountain

Thats why the surface is near both, the cradle, and far fields

[pastel valve]

I’m pretty certain that he didn’t care about the doll

All of it was a plan to trap hornet

He saw hornet talking to gilly a few times, possibly saw her on fetch quests and decided to steal the doll so she would come looking

And that’s what we did

He even made a last attempt by placing a trap at the doll in case he was defeated

[drifting walrus]

He did it to lure in hornet to add her to his collection

[marble oasis]

surface is near ff?

[drifting walrus]

Given how vertical the place is and the theme of ascension that checks out

[drifting walrus]

The secret cindril room

[marble oasis]

is that the surface

[drifting walrus]

Yes

The map outlines paths away from pharloom

[marble oasis]

and?

[drifting walrus]

They would obviously be across the surface wastes

[marble oasis]

across the wastes yes

across the surface no

you are conflating two things

[dire lynx]

The surface and the wastes arent the same. We only see the surface in silksong

[drifting walrus]

That doesn’t make sense to me

I feel they would be one and the same

[dire lynx]

its confusing, but they are different

[drifting walrus]

Is this from tc?

[dire lynx]

yes

leth is the community manager for TC

[whole holly]

me too

[drifting walrus]

Ok unless ari or something corroborates that I refuse to believe it

[dire lynx]

??

[whole holly]

does Hallownest have Old Hearts?

[drifting walrus]

Not that we know

[whole holly]

but who could it plausibly be?

[unborn nova]

Maybe, a good candidate I assume would be Ogrin.

[drifting walrus]

White lady or the wyrm shell maybe?

[whole holly]

i mean i always thought that Dreamers were parallels to Old Hearts, and Vespa

[dire lynx]

the big mushroom, the old king of deepnest, mantis lords

[whole holly]

it can't be Higher Beings, because Old Hearts are mortals and don't die of age

[drifting walrus]

The old hearts are memories

[unborn nova]

How about Ogrim?

[drifting walrus]

Not dreams

[whole holly]

yeah, Vespa and Dreamers can be memories

[whole holly]

Seer says memories as in context of dreams , in fact Dream Weilder Charm is from her dreams/memories

[dire lynx]

he doesnt really have an area so i dont think so

[drifting walrus]

Isma tear might be an old heart

[dire lynx]

ismas tear is a fruit according to the item description

[whole holly]

Isma has Grove so she could be a Old Heart

do you think Lifeblood Heart and Nightmare Heart are related to Old Hearts?

[drifting walrus]

No

[dire lynx]

no

[drifting walrus]

They’re related to higher beings

[whole holly]

Crystal Heart?

[dire lynx]

the nightmares heart is explicitly a higher being

[whole holly]

me neither

[dire lynx]

thats literally just a power source for a robot

is second sentinel an old heart?

[drifting walrus]

Bruh you literally just contradicted yourself

[whole holly]

i mean nobody said Automatons can't be Old hearts, but i doubt they are

[whole holly]

how so?

[dire lynx]

guys, do we know what a rhetorical question is

[drifting walrus]

If the crystal heart isn’t an old heart then how is the cogwork heart

[drifting walrus]

No I’m autistic

[whole holly]

she asked rhetorical question, as in if Crystal heart was theoretically old heart rthen cogwork heart would be as well

but i don't think they are on basis on fact that they have to be mortals

[dire lynx]

then why ask about cogwork heart 😭

[whole holly]

i asked mostly because i want to know about opinions of public, but equivalent of Old Hearts in Hallownest are non-Higher Being rulers or creators?, like Vespa, Dreamers and possibly Isma

[dire lynx]

the dreamers were just regular people(ignore herrah weaver retcon)

[quiet flare]

Hmm so it makes me think, Were the old hearts kind of higher beings?

[unborn nova]

Could Lord Fool be an old heart (when he was alive)?

[dire lynx]

no, they are explicitly not higher

[quiet flare]

Maybe not higher higher like PK or radiance but maybe just a little higher than normal bugs

[whole holly]

i think lurien is regular bug but monomon is weirdly enough similar to old heart, based on characteristics

[quiet flare]

Because of they being more powerful

[whole holly]

they are powerful mortals but they are still bugs

[dire lynx]

they are the peak of mortal bugs

[whole holly]

maybe, it is possible, also that huge mushroom that is somewhat inactive/hibernating

[dire lynx]

monomon is just a smart lady

[quiet flare]

So it could apply to hallownest too, Hornet could enter some bugs memories like Isma or Lord fool, and acquire their old hearts

[marble oasis]

I don’t think so

[whole holly]

she created Jelly-forms as they are referred to as , in game

[dire lynx]

isma and lord fool are dead, so that isnt an option

[quiet flare]

Yeah just like nyleth and King kahnn

[dire lynx]

those are both alive

[unborn nova]

It seems like Fog Canyon wasn't always like that and was part of Greenpath, the thing is where did the jellyfish come from?

[dire lynx]

until you take the hearts

[unborn nova]

Monomon is from Karak?

[marble oasis]

the plants don’t seem especially invasive

[dire lynx]

i think they are another form of artificial life, like the cogworks, kingsmoulds, eva etc

[quiet flare]

Really, because we only visit them in their memories, but in real world we only find statues of them

[whole holly]

i would say Nyleth's condition parallels Isma's, Lord Fool's parallels Khann's, maybe memories of dead person can still be of value

[unborn nova]

Monomon is artificial too?

[marble oasis]

are we sure isma is dead

[dire lynx]

no, i meant the jelly enemies

[marble oasis]

if nyleth was somehow alive

[unborn nova]

Where did Monomon come from?

I don't think Monomon is native to Hallownest.

[marble oasis]

lord fool probably dead though but that doesn’t mean he couldn’t have been an old heart in his own time

plus surely someone is still running the colosseum

[dire lynx]

dont know, i agree foreign though

[marble oasis]

do you guys have anything backing that up

or just vibes

[quiet flare]

Probably just vibes

[dire lynx]

vibes, nothing else like her in all hallownest

[unborn nova]

yeah, vibes.

[whole holly]

vibes are enough, lol

[unborn nova]

The closest would be the jellyfish in Karak.

[dire lynx]

yes

[quiet flare]

Oh right, but at least they don't friggin explode!

[dire lynx]

yumama

[whole holly]

what are they called?

[dire lynx]

yumama

[whole holly]

gelatinous drifter and jelly form are kind of similar description, what is with TC and not giving Jellyfish regular names, or even description?

[marble oasis]

Nothing like the crystals in crystal peak either

[whole holly]

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Uoma https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Yuma

[marble oasis]

Nothing else like the Hive

Hallownest is simply a wonderful and varied place

[dire lynx]

yeah, those are habitats. try the actual species within kingdoms

there is nothing akin to monomon in all of hallownest

[whole holly]

i agree, Monomon is creating unique creatures as well

[marble oasis]

The jellyfish are from the plants in fog canyon

[whole holly]

i wish we get similar jellyfish creatures in Sea of Sorrows/Pharloom Bay

[whole holly]

?

[dire lynx]

based on what

[whole holly]

likely vibes

[marble oasis]

#1412484247679275082 message

oh you’re not in moss server

hang on

[whole holly]

doesn't explain monomon

[marble oasis]

yes it does?

[dire lynx]

how

[whole holly]

unless you imply that Queen's Garden produced old heart

[whole holly]

who created her then?

[marble oasis]

who created you bro

[whole holly]

a parent, but plant creating dreamer doesn't make sense in particular

[marble oasis]

either she was a normal hallownest bug that performed jelly experiments on her own body or she’s just a naturally occurring advanced jelly

[whole holly]

neither of them make sense, you are making assumptions to explain it

[marble oasis]

we know she was doing jelly experiments lol

[whole holly]

unless Phenomena occurred on other bugs

[whole holly]

so she is bug that performed experiments on her body? doesn't make sense in particular since it lacks evidence

[dire lynx]

i dont see why our conclusion thats shes a foreigner is any less reasonable than either of these

[whole holly]

i agree with you

[marble oasis]

It’s not unreasonable but I’m tired of the explanation that everything interesting about Hallownest came from somewhere else

The Knights are foreign, the King is foreign, the Queen is foreign, half of Deepnest is foreign, the Hive is foreign, Bardoon is foreign, Mask Maker is foreign, the Ancient Civ is foreign, etcetera etcetera

[pearl thunder]

i mean the point of hallownest is kind of that people from all over come together in this new "haven" that has since fallen into ruin

[marble oasis]

I know this isn’t your stance but I have seen all of these argued at one point or another

[marble oasis]

those things are from the kingdom’s peak though

i get people coming afterwards

[pearl thunder]

most of the bugs you named are from the kingdoms peak, or at the very least during the first infection

[dire lynx]

well the king is foreign, the weavers are foreign (wouldnt say thats half of deepnest tho), we know that at least ze'mer is as well

[pearl thunder]

the knight came about during the first infection, king came prior to the kingdom existing, same for the queen, deepnest, the hive, and the ancient civ is ancient, mask maker was seemingly around during the peak as well, unsure about bardoon though

[whole holly]

they mean Five Great Knights, since they said Knights plural

[pearl thunder]

Ah, then definitely around before the peak

[marble oasis]

I mixed in the real ones with the argued ones

Since that’s what people draw on

[whole holly]

i don't think White Lady is foreign though

[dire lynx]

ancient civ seems more like a global spanning group, wouldnt call that foreign

[marble oasis]

They say White Lady must have come with the King, or Isma and Ogrim arrived with Zemer, or so on and so forth

[dire lynx]

also, that may not be something you like, but most of them are reasonable to say

[peak mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/broken-vessel-lost-kin-hello-chat-hollow-knight-gif-8337070408169624266

[dire lynx]

the way i see it fog canyon became the way it is because of monomons experiments, it clearly used to be part of greenpath

she may have started with the bubble plants and made those into the jellys

[jovial girder]

I think the jellyfish are supposed to contain the infection

[dire lynx]

i agree

[pearl thunder]

A common theory, but honestly not all that substantiated, though there's nothing contradicting the idea

[stray fog]

Mantis lords

Traitor lord included

[unborn nova]

Is the whisp thicket flame cult related to the grimm troupe or it is its own thing?

[dire lynx]

unique thing, the consensus here is that it stems from burning the silk and staying free of the haunting

[grim locust]

will there be an act 4

[dire lynx]

probably not imo

[stray fog]

Pharloom will be dead af after act 3

[dire lynx]

not really, it seems to be in a position for recovery

[stray fog]

Its implied that killing karmelita will be bad

And the haunting and void combined will kill a lot of people

When bellhart citizens got un-haunted, some died

So this will happen to the rest of pharloom too

[dire lynx]

they werent just haunted, they were strung up

what widow was doing is not normal haunting

[whole holly]

Plasmium is going to resurrect lot of people

[stark ocean]

on top of that mister mushroom visits and he only does that to witness dying kingdoms

[dire lynx]

not true

So, the Herald visits this land too...
If he is here, now, then great change or a savage end is inevitable. He would care to see nothing else...

his arrival means great change is soon to come

[marble oasis]

He is the Death tarot

[dire lynx]

he a signifier of change

[stark ocean]

also a signifier of death like what happened in hallownest

that quote from hornet also mentions the possibility of pharloom's end

[dire lynx]

yes, but what you said is wrong, he doesnt only visit to witness dying kingdoms

[stark ocean]

yeah r

[maiden meteor]

Pharloom is very much implied to be saved methinks

Despite Hearts being killed, Hornet says that in time Pharloom will be reborn

[stray fog]

In time

Not in act 4

[maiden meteor]

well yeah

but it’s not exactly dead either

I’d compare it to being on life support

Hornet basically brought it from the brink of death

[stray fog]

Yes

[maiden meteor]

I think Mr. Mushroom so far moreso signifies change of status quo

Hallownest was stuck in half-stasis state for ages before Ghost shows up

and Pharloom been under Citadel for a long period too

and both times all of the major forces (except void) are basically wiped clean

and I firmly believe that Hallownest ain’t so hopeless as people make it out to be

There’s no civilizations left except for Mantises iirc but it’s still alive

[whole holly]

there are uninfected characters as well

[crimson patio]

Can’t really be called a civilization

A settlement at best

[stray fog]

#hk-lore message
@whole holly maybe he died, and then the lifeblood he was carrying caused lifeblood plants to sprout. And then he got infected

[whole holly]

Mantis Tribe is exclusively civilization

[maiden meteor]

And I’m also p sure that it won’t lose its mythological status attracting adventurers, except this time it will be much less deadly undertaking

[stray fog]

This discussion is going to turn into semantics

[crimson patio]

Yea but the other uninfected characters arent

[whole holly]

sure, that is interesting for sure, maybe Joni was eventually going to be resurrected? i mean we took her spirit

[whole holly]

it will eventually become civilization either way

[maiden meteor]

Hallownest is prob could become a really good haven for those without home or something

it’s free real estate

[whole holly]

traveling and nomadic groups and such

[crimson patio]

Now that there’s no king left, might as well

[heavy gyro]

Maybe void has something to do with the resurrections

[whole holly]

Grey Prince Zote will be king ig

[stray fog]

Prime city of tears housing for half a rosary

[whole holly]

Void?

[maiden meteor]

entire relicseeker society gon move there after Lemm shows them whole 4 arcane eggs

[crimson patio]

TK really said down with the monarchy
Takes the king’s brand, kick the old king’s corpse, becomes king, dip into the void

[heavy gyro]

Lifeblood has a loose connection with void due to the abyss creature and the abyss lifeblood room, and the lifeblood events happen during act 3 (but that could be passage of time)

[whole holly]

Grey Prince Zote still remains i guess

[maiden meteor]

Not if you leave him to die

[stray fog]

The dlc could answer this

[whole holly]

1. that could be seal, i my opinion, i think it is connected to physical location 2. most likely passage of time

plus Lifeblood Room is partially in Dream Realm i guess, maybe Abyss Creature can tear the veil?

[maiden meteor]

do you think Abyss Creature is confused as to why the fuck it ended up in Pharloom

[stray fog]

It probably can

[maiden meteor]

I mean, void certainly can

[whole holly]

????

[maiden meteor]

It just bursts into Rad’s dream realms as no big deal

[whole holly]

characteristics of higher being

[stray fog]

I thought the knight was doing that

[maiden meteor]

I think it’s kinda both

[whole holly]

me as well

[maiden meteor]

Knight calls out to the void and void comes

Shade Lord also manifests out of dream into physical realm

And seemingly void has invaded White Palace too

[stray fog]

Kingsmoulds were already there

[maiden meteor]

Yeah but we see black tendrils connecting to grounds mould

[whole holly]

it was transported there for kingsmoulds, however first point is because of Void Heart

[stray fog]

Oh

[crimson patio]

Seems that as long as there’s a single drop of void present the void can go anywhere it wants

[maiden meteor]

My working theory is that void connected to dead mould, usurped palace moulds and used them to kill PK

[crimson patio]

Idk

[stray fog]

Please team cherry tell us how pk died 🙏

[crimson patio]

If his lighthouse alone can calm the sea of void, why would his innate light not be enough to repel mere kingsmoulds

[maiden meteor]

Lighthouse is just light so void’s likely just kinda annoyed by it

While PK is like pure Soul which Void very much loves to eat

and as we see in Silksong it doesn’t really have to be unified by Void Heart to consume god

in hindsight PK was really stupid to place his hiding spot so close to Abyss

but he probably didn’t know enough about void to consider it that much of a threat to himself

[whole holly]

maybe Void inside Kingsmould was a threat to him? since Abyss door is closed

[heavy gyro]

We see that void is even able to consume the radiance when she is weakened, so perhaps PK's grief led him to be weakened and let the void get to him. But that wouldn't explain why he doesn't have void streaks under his eyes

[graceful grail]

I need to change something on the wiki, how do I do this?

[neat ether]

Are the bellbeast and the bellway station a legit way that the people of pharloom used to travel, or is it only for Hornet to use since she has a relationship with a bellbeast?

Trying to make sense of out it, since the stagways were obviously used by other bugs. Plus there's always the tram station

[edgy nebula]

we hear that bugs used to travel the bellways in gilded carriages

but the bell beast is never mentioned to be the one carrying them i dont think

[neat ether]

So is the bellway station just used for the tunnel system below it?

[whole citrus]

have you ever thought of why there is a pin in fourth chorus when you see him dormant?

[foggy fractal]

probably from seamstress

[whole citrus]

yes thats what i thought

we never see seamstress with the golden pin pinstress has

also is this normal

[neat ether]

Better question, have you wondered how the fourth chorus got there in the first place? Considering how big it is

[whole citrus]

trueeee

[foggy fractal]

my guess would be z axis

[whole citrus]

maybe the citadel sent him to attack the seamstress

which also explains the pin

[neat ether]

That's the guess, just wondering how it got through the damn cave systems. The Citadel is like waaay above and the deep docks is I believe one of the lowest level of pharloom

[whole citrus]

maybe it was built there instead of in the workshop

[neat ether]

Built half submerged in lava? The main theory it was there was to hunt down the pinstress sisters, which one hid away in the far fields

It would make a lot more sense if it was the sentinel like automatons

At least imo, since the second sentinel was made for combat. Could be possible that the Citadel made a terminator type robot to hunt down heretics

[whole citrus]

but that begs a question bout pinstress

[neat ether]

They seem to be an order of knights that used to serve the Citadel, until they defected for whatever reason. Similar to the knights of hallownest I believe

[stray fog]

Chorus = transformer theory

[foggy fractal]

🤔

[stray fog]

. /j

[neat ether]

Robugs in disguise?

[whole citrus]

that means the first sentinel may have died to the pinstress

[neat ether]

Could be, or they were made to replace them

[whole citrus]

i dont know bout that one

the pinstresses trained the sentinels i believe

[shadow sapphire]

Yeah they did

[neat ether]

The sentinels were made to safekeep the pilgrims I believe? Maybe the pinstress were formed to do that too

[shadow sapphire]

That’s why they have similar techniques

[whole citrus]

eavtly

[shadow sapphire]

Oh, Soul Knight

[whole citrus]

exactly*

[neat ether]

Trained or based on? Since they're robots, maybe something with crests and the essence of a bug?

[shadow sapphire]

https://tenor.com/view/my-besto-friendo-jujutsu-kaisen-zorothex-gif-23553828

[neat ether]

Used to be a great time killer

[shadow sapphire]

Yessir

[stray fog]

Citadel robots have silk flies in them

[whole citrus]

bound the crest of the pinstress...

[stray fog]

Peak

[whole citrus]

is hornet ended up killing the pinstress rather than sparing her

if*

[neat ether]

If Hornet was more tuned with her pale side to dominate and gain power

[whole citrus]

yea

we boutta be seing this on tiktok and shorts tomorrow

[neat ether]

I do wonder if by having different crests for too long it would start to permanently affect her base personality

[whole citrus]

maybe expanding in a new game or dlc

if dlc i dont think it would be sea of sorrow

[neat ether]

Would be cool to see if you use the beast crest for long, npc would comment on how more feral Hornet is looking/being

[whole citrus]

true

[neat ether]

She doesn't even use her needle to strike, instead she used her claws. Something all weavers seem to have, as with the first sinner/widow

[whole citrus]

thats probably how lifesteal works in beast bind

[neat ether]

Or would Hornet start to act more like her mother Herrah, since her title is also the beast

[whole citrus]

maybe a hunter-beast crest, including herrah, hornet, and the beast

moveset and personality

[neat ether]

Combi crests would definitely be cool

[whole citrus]

imagine architect and shaman

[neat ether]

Now she has a diagonal saw pogo for her downward attack

[whole citrus]

its her original afterall

[neat ether]

Those might conflict or contrast? Tech vs magic, something more compatible might be Shaman/Witch

[whole citrus]

oh yeah

or wanderer and architect

short drilly attacks allowing toolspam and 3 yellow tools

maybe thro win 1 blue slot

[neat ether]

Blue slots really are the strongest in the game, apparently defense is the key

[whole citrus]

i see blue as more of support/defense, not just defense

red is attack/buff and yellow is utility

[neat ether]

When I first started, I thought red tools were gonna be the strongest

[whole citrus]

same

[neat ether]

Which is still true if you have the architect crest and isn't afraid of losing money

[whole citrus]

if you have architect you must have pollip pouch

in my opinion

[neat ether]

Depends on what red tools you run ig, if you for example use volt vessels and pimpillo, using the blue tool that let's you sling two at once might give you greater burst dps

Pollip is great for dot and conservation

[whole citrus]

which crest do you think is the best

[neat ether]

On effectiveness, playstyle or just vibe?

[whole citrus]

lets do all three

so say
Effectiveness -
playstyle -
just vibe -

[neat ether]

Effectiveness - wanderer (old reliable)
Playstle - Architect (variety and plenty of flavor)
Just vibe - Beast (baby I'm preyin on you tonight)

[whole citrus]

effectiveness - wanderer or max evolved hunter
playstyle - architect
just vibe - reaper(for some reason) and shaman

im not saying reaper is bad

[neat ether]

Reaper is a very comfy crest, loved it for exploration

[whole citrus]

the pogo is the best

for reaper

[edgy nebula]

this doesnt sound very lore-like

[whole citrus]

we were talking about what fourth chorus is doing in far fields, and the seamstresses relation with the citadel and all

but we got side tracked

scroll up

[low oracle]

There's also the Savage Beastfly journal entry.

[honest sun]

if hornet can do this, then with enough silk she could do somthing like crystal heart dash but with silk???? or would she need the crystal heart?

[low oracle]

The difference is, crystal dashe initially builds up momentum, which is then carried for an indefinite amount of time.
Hornet on the other hand uses silk to build up an attack that won't harm her, meaning she has to be fully shielded with i-frames/silk during the attack. No momentum is carried anywhere, she just dashes with an additional silk boost.
Hornet probably also couldn't use crystal dash, simply because of how brutally reckless it is. The crystal heart wasn't even intended for this purpose. However I believe a vessel meant to seal a Higher Being would have a tougher shell.
Hornet with Silkspeed anklets and flea brew has similar, if not more speed, at least in-game.

The ascending ability (forgot) on the other hand works essentially the same as crystal heart, so maybe Hornet could use crystal heart like the Knight? I don't know though, since she always lands on her feet, unlike the Knight crashing into random stuff. The force even causes harm to enemies that are close to the crystal dash.

[low oracle]

By the way, where is this location at? Looks like the citadel, in which moss mother definitely isn't present.

[stray fog]

She can only do 2 or 3 silk spears before running out of silk, so a crystal dash would require an insane amount of silk

[low oracle]

Isn't that sharp dart?

[stray fog]

My bad

[past cypress]

Probably a randomiser or some type of modded gauntlet

[low oracle]

I guessed that might've been the case.

[swift needle]

its the conductors melody

room

the guantlet

gauntlet*

[maiden meteor]

I wonder if Hornet would even survive wielding Crystal Heart

it seems to have a massive amount of energy

I feel like even if she survived initial usage she’d probably be crushed by its force

[solar tapir]

I wonder where extacly the knight keeps the heart? He consumed it or just use its power while heart is in the pocket?

[hexed jasper]

i don't think she's that fragile man

[maiden meteor]

I think it probably is inside Knight’s body

[stray fog]

I mean it is hollow

Might as well store things inside

[solar tapir]

Same

[low oracle]

The mothwing cloak and wings were both seemingly absorbed into the organic composing of the Knight. I don't think it'd be too far a stretch that the same applies to crystal heart, isma's tear and the mantis claw.

[solar tapir]

Mb

[low oracle]

What do you mean?

[solar tapir]

maybe

[low oracle]

Ah.

[maiden meteor]

I think it’s case by case

[solar tapir]

In the end its somewhere inside him anyway

[low oracle]

*them

[solar tapir]

Ye

I always confused about it

[maiden meteor]

I would say it isn’t a stretch to assume Knight uses claw normally

Tear is probably completely dissolved inside

[solar tapir]

Wings is somwhere under the cloak

[maiden meteor]

Wings and cloak are weird ones cause like

what are they even

why cloak gives us ability to dash

[solar tapir]

Dunno

Cloak itself seems to be part of a body

[stray fog]

Its a moth*wing*

Idk how exactly it works

But wing

[low oracle]

Tear is described as a talisman, so it's less organically part than the claw. Though I won't ask the question I thought about yesterday, wether mantises have organically formed claws or not.

[rich roost]

So is hornet his gf or smth

[stray fog]

Whose gf?

She doesn't have any current partner

[rich roost]

The hollow knight

[stray fog]

They're siblings

[rich roost]

O sorry

[maiden meteor]

Silksong has it simpler by explaining everything with “Yeah, Weavers could do that too”

[low oracle]

From the math we can do with the relation between the Pale King, White Lady, Herrah and the resulting vessels/hornet, it is reasonable to assume the vessels have organic "cloaks". It's nothing new really, the Karak have organic armour too, and at the very least most mantises "cloaks" are also organic. The Lords have very different cloaks, which aren't known to be organic or not.
Either way, the wings and cloak pretty much become part of the Knight, and so does the voidheart.
Anything else just isn't elaborated upon and improved in Silksong, as seen with the following changes:
-only sapient enemies carry currency
-It is VERY clear wether something is part of Hornet or not (sole exception is the faydown cloak)

[maiden meteor]

Except fayhorn cloak

[low oracle]

Well instead of you just picking up a golden helmet, a blue cube and a big axe, your upgrades actually make sense, both physically and lore-wise.

[rich roost]

@stray fog I wish hornet was my gf

[stray fog]

...

Shes an insect though

Dont say that

[blissful harbor]

not to mention she’s a literal stick figure

[low oracle]

"Appearance doesn't matter"-proceeds to not even look at the in-game version of her.

[rich roost]

Ok sorry it was joke

[low oracle]

#sk-lore

[rich roost]

#would

[low oracle]

#banned

[mortal venture]

get his ass

[rich roost]

/j.

[gleaming relic]

❓

[low oracle]

I'm not a mod though.

[mortal venture]

oh :(

[compact pelican]

I think i know what most of the mottled skarr dialog mean

Noku = yes

Kha = you

Mauak rosarys or warrior

Gri =right?

Rkraha who

Uohk = are

Hopfully im right

[rich roost]

W faps

[stray fog]

Don't continue the joke bro

[gleaming relic]

hes unfunny ignore him

[rich roost]

#banhim

That’s mean and your not respecting my pronouns

[past cypress]

I doubt they mean actual words

[blissful harbor]

bug gibberish is in fact gibberish

[rich roost]

True

[stray fog]

We shouldn't just dismiss the theory like this

[gleaming relic]

you're saying nothing

[rich roost]

Im trying to have a discussion about bug gibberish

[rich roost]

Yeah some one needs to like map it out or smth

[rich roost]

Your my number one opp

And yung lean sucks @gleaming relic

[maiden meteor]

I think it’s just funny that Weaver Silk Magic is basically Deus Ex Machine

“Oh no, how am I gonna escape from deepest depths of the world?”
A conveniently placed silks-based traverse system:

[stray fog]

It would be funny if this is what caused them to make silk soar in the first place

[low oracle]

Does make sense though, since correlation can equal causation. The Weavers had to traverse somehow too.

[stray fog]

@whole holly bro made a fire representation of the abyss creature

[maiden meteor]

what if Abyss Creature is just a head

[stray fog]

This person is cooking

This detail may not be intentional, but its. Cool

[maiden meteor]

Idk, I feel like HP masks just represent shell’s durability

Like

Mask is our outer shell thus HP is shaped like mask

I wonder tho how Knight uses Lifeblood

[rich roost]

🐛

[maiden meteor]

do they just smother it around mask???

[stray fog]

Thats why I said that it may not be intentional

[maiden meteor]

oh mb

[hexed jasper]

Maybe they just consume it like void consumes stuff in silksong

[stray fog]

Its alright

[hexed jasper]

like liquid basically

[stray fog]

When you kill a lifeseed, blue particles go inside you

[maiden meteor]

Lifeblood seems to have ability to “mend” things so I imagine you have to have it flow inside you to repair things

like Hornet has to inject that shit straight into her bloodstream

so Knight probably doesn’t fully consume it

and just has it flow inside void body

[stray fog]

I just realized that lifeblood is called plasmium because plasma is a component of blood

[maiden meteor]

Plasma also shines or smth

glows is better word

(I mean thermodynamics plasma)

but fr yeah that makes sense

[stray fog]

https://youtu.be/OjLnJPJHrYY

[low oracle]

I'm seriously tired of people pretending Lifeblood is worse than the infection, when it so clearly isn't.

[stray fog]

It makes you stronger and is less aggressive

W

[rich roost]

W commentary

[maiden meteor]

Lifeblood is scary because it’s more subtle

Infection is pretty straightforwardly evil

[cedar skiff]

lifeblood is lame

as a concept

just useless

[rich roost]

https://tenor.com/view/w-ww-letter-w-letra-w-alphabet-gif-13608181638804917497

Lifeblood = stupidpoopyheadblood

[low oracle]

The things is though, lifeblood never actually spreads just because. It is always some dumb bugs, thinking they can better the world and stuff. The infection is basically unavoidable to most, and so is the haunting (for those ensnared in the cycle of song). Lifeblood on the other hand is just the equivalent of a drug. The drug gets abused, so somehow the drug is bad, not the people abusing it.

If I could resist one of the three infections, Lifeblood would be the easiest of the three by far.

[maiden meteor]

also what if

what if Pharloom lifeblood is so volatile because Abyss Creature isn’t present there

like Void going nuts until Knight arrived

[stray fog]

Why would it want to make lifeblood more tame though

[maiden meteor]

Maybe it’s just chill like that

[stray fog]

True. We don't know its intentions

[maiden meteor]

I mean Joni seems pretty normal to me and they were probably drinking lifeblood daily

[rich roost]

https://tenor.com/view/ted-wookiee-ted-show-seth-macfarlane-gif-6494550722613678840

[maiden meteor]

there’s also no serious lifeblood outbreaks in Hallownest like ever

except ambiguous mention by Hornet

[stray fog]

But then why was lifeblood taboo if it was chill

[maiden meteor]

Well, it probably still could cause serious side effects and I wouldn’t trust bugs to not overdo it constantly

[low oracle]

Joni didn't do good with the lifeblood, though she probably presented herself as a sort of healer. Xylotol on the other hand is an idiot that straight up forced the entire environment to become "infected". The Lifeblood would have never actually done this by itself, which is why we shouldn't pretend it is any more dangerous than it is made ou to be. It isn't good, but it isn't bad just because, it is bad because idiots abuse it byond their mortal limits.

[solar tapir]

This is a really interesting assumption

[low oracle]

The same reason drugs are taboo; People won't respect their own limit and capability. The drugs aren't the problem, but you can't really ban the people either.

[maiden meteor]

also Abyss creature kinda just shows up in Godhome and helps us

[solar tapir]

That and abyss creature itself is another higher being who is messing with your bugs

And thats why they are heretics

[maiden meteor]

Abyss encounter also seems like a friendly encounter

Creature basically goes “Yo, you’re chill as hell, there’s a little token of my appreciation”

[low oracle]

Slight correction: the abyss creature is never said to be a higher being, only a god. That also makes sense, as it isn't even named after anything lifeblood related, nor does it have the butterfly aesthetic, like the Radiance is a moth, and the infection looks like moth eggs.

At some parts.

[solar tapir]

god = higher being or what u mean

[maiden meteor]

I don’t think Abyss Lifeblood room is any sort of prison, cause why would PK make a prison that opens by ODing on sealed god’s stuff

[low oracle]

God = Powerful creature of great strength
Higher Being = Basically what humans define as their god

[solar tapir]

We talking about hk and there god = higher being

anyway abyss creature is something godly

something u dont wanna mess with

[maiden meteor]

Maybe it’s a result of void and lifeblood colliding

[solar tapir]

as a ruler

[low oracle]

And how would Pale King create a door that only allows Lifeblood-based (or so) creatures to enter. Usually it should be the other way around, since Lifeblood creatures would pose much more of a threat. To me it seems that the Abyss creature itself made the door (or the Lifeblood HB), so to only allow true followers to enter. Under normal conditions, something under the influenze of Lifeblood shouldn't be able to harm the creature.

[maiden meteor]

Lifeblood core room is just weird as hell

[low oracle]

Doesn't make sense though, it really just doesn't. Lifeblood and Void are basically almost complete opposites from each other.

[solar tapir]

for me it seems neutral btw

[maiden meteor]

Why’s there lifeblood so deep? Why is there Creature? Why is there arcane egg? Why is it within dream realm?

[low oracle]

Definitely, it's just addicts that spread lifeblood, causing harm.

[maiden meteor]

also worth noting that we only see Creature in dream (Lifeblood core room and Godhome)

what if it’s dream manifestation of lifeblood hivemind

[solar tapir]

Was it dream or not in room is a mystery

[low oracle]

Within the dream realm isn't true, it has dream powers however. NOT specifically the Abyss Creature, but whatever Higher Being is responsible for Lifeblood. We know it has to be a higher being because of the essence particles, which are also associated with NKG, PK, RAD and Unn.

[solar tapir]

it seems both at the same time

[low oracle]

Since the door is physical, the core room isn't a dream. Dreams/Dream Realms are entered via dreamnail, and only with dreamnail (or dream powers).

[lone folio]

Lifeblood discussion rates have spiked since sea of sorrow teaser and TC will just troll everyone by making the dlc one big fishing Simulator with no lifeblood

[maiden meteor]

Lifeblood Size 2 Fish

[solar tapir]

Yeah but dream particles in that room is still confusing

[blissful harbor]

lifeblood core is a dream

TK wakes up outside, it’s filled with endless clouds and dream particles

all characteristics of a dream

[solar tapir]

But u enter there physically

that the confuse

[low oracle]

No, they'll rename Lifeblood AGAIN, giving us no explanation. So be ready to use terms like Bloodlife, Blue Blood, funny drug, Plasmanuminay.

[maiden meteor]

Who said that part isn’t a dream

[blissful harbor]

dream shenanigans

[maiden meteor]

Hornet seemingly enters Sinner’s cage but she always wakes up outside

[low oracle]

I would relate them in a similar way to P5 Unn. She also has these particles for no apparant reason, hence idk.

[solar tapir]

That another mystery

[maiden meteor]

We don’t really know to what extent dreams can be controlled

[lone folio]

Enough to move an entire palace into one

That's the extent

Or not

[low oracle]

If that was how easily dreams/dream realms could be entered, HK lore would not make much sense. The plot of needing to enter a dream likely isn't just left out in that specific instance.

[maiden meteor]

in some cases veil between physical and dream realms is extremely thin

[blissful harbor]

it’s one specific dream, it’s clearly not the norm

[low oracle]

The Palace is real, hence it's a dream realm, a physical place in a separate dimension.

[maiden meteor]

We do know that dream powers are reserved for extraordinary beings though

[low oracle]

But the norm would apply, as it is clearly associated with an unknown higher being. You don't enter the NKG fight by entering the tent.

[maiden meteor]

Palace is real

you die there for good

[blissful harbor]

wouldn’t being associated with a HB…make it make more sense??

NKG and the lifeblood dream are just completely different scenarios

[maiden meteor]

(except Weavers but they’re like half gods)

[lone folio]

They are like

Pretty good wizards

[maiden meteor]

I think it’s fair enough to assume that GMS taught weavers dream stuff

[low oracle]

No? All other HB places inside of dream realms require the dreamnail. White Palace and NKG fight mostly. The path of Pain is the only other instance, though I speculate it's a dream, as it disappears after beating it. Hence it likely isn't a physical location.

[blissful harbor]

TK walks into the dream because it’s been brought in there, it’s like the dreamers forcing TK into the dream realm, but with a door instead of literally shoving them in

[blissful harbor]

the dream nail is not required to be forced into a dream, the dreamers do it

[low oracle]

Not really, we can't make exceptions at random. Besides, what speaks FOR the fact that the room is a dream realm / dream.

[blissful harbor]

and again those are different scenarios

[low oracle]

Witches.

[blissful harbor]

wdym what speaks for it
literally look at it, essence particles everywhere, endless clouds thst are found only in the dream realm
The screen fading into essence particles upon picking up the charm, and again TK waking up at the end

[maiden meteor]

Dreamnail is probably only required to enter dreams forcibly

[blissful harbor]

it’s literally more of a leap to say it’s not a dream

[whole holly]

yeah, i watched that

[blissful harbor]

wym exceptions at random

[maiden meteor]

Lifeblood Core is basically a rite of passage

[blissful harbor]

nkg and the palace are literally just not the same as the lifeblood core idk what to say

[maiden meteor]

Abyss Creature lets us in willingly

[whole holly]

i prefer my representation honestly, it has more horror aspect

[low oracle]

Then perhaps it is both. Many things do speak for your argument, however not the fact there is a door in the normal dimension. Maybe the door just leads to a dream realm of the Lifeblood HB, that makes most sense tbh.

[blissful harbor]

that’s what i said in the first place

[low oracle]

It just blinks really calmly at you though, and the ambience translates that too.

[maiden meteor]

Creature is just a floating head because they spent all budget on Radiance’s copyright infringement case

[whole holly]

all the more reason it should be horror

[lone folio]

You will look real silly when it's actually Myla

[low oracle]

This is the lore chat. We are arguing and discussing lore. I'm not stupidly going to hold to my arguments when they make less sense. If I agree with you, be happy you brought forth good arguments that could convince me.

[low oracle]

Whiteward is horror. This definitely isn't.

[blissful harbor]

be happy? in the lore chat? youre asking too much buddy

[low oracle]

be happy?~~ in the lore chat? youre asking too much buddy~~

[lone folio]

That is the main point of any theorizing

[whole holly]

only time where player has been transported to dream realm without dream nail are dreamer sequence and abyss lifeblood room

[low oracle]

Yeah? I just said so, no need to tell me.

[lone folio]

That is the main point of telling you

[whole holly]

i would say it is analog horror, changing life around it without victim having negative symptoms and feeling great

[lone folio]

Being for real I don't like this

[maiden meteor]

I don’t think Abyss Creature is malicious

[low oracle]

I don't get it, but that probably just depends on your personal perspective.

[blissful harbor]

anyways who wants to talk about how the bell beast is just a specially grown gromling

[lone folio]

Just doesn't feel right with everything else we have

[maiden meteor]

and Pharloom’s disaster is a case of untended garden

[whole holly]

me neither, i just copy pasted abyss creature head on mind flayer, it is probably a giant butterfly

[solar tapir]

Same vibe

Cool looking anyway

[whole holly]

yeah, it is mind flayer body from stranger things

[maiden meteor]

Zylotol brought Lifeblood where it wasn’t supposed to be

[lone folio]

Probably is

[whole holly]

thanks

[vivid kernel]

THE SILKSONG IS REAL!

[low oracle]

Pharlooms disaster is a wannabe scientist, actually a drug addict, breaking every rule of science and injesting unknown substances into the environment. If Lifeblood was any other infection, the results would be the same if not worse.

[low oracle]

It should have been the ULTRAKILL mindflayer

[maiden meteor]

Abyss Creature probably has no control over Pharloom’s Lifeblood or doesn’t know of its presence here

[solar tapir]

For me i think if theres something besides a head at all it will be something bulkier

[whole holly]

i hope they don't disappoint us by giving us this:

[lone folio]

NO WAY LET ME GO TELL #sk-help THEY WILL GO INSANE

[lone folio]

Looks like that one terraria boss

[whole holly]

i disagree

[maiden meteor]

If Creature wanted to forcibly make everyone addict Joni would be selling syringes in dark alley

[blissful harbor]

i mean
her blessing does turn all your vitals into lifeblood

[whole holly]

i do like this kinda,

[blissful harbor]

omg Mebi jumpscare

[maiden meteor]

Yeah but it doesn’t seem to be forced in any way

Joni even questions if they really gave you the blessing

which (imo) implies it had to be earned

[low oracle]

Not even in a dark ally, and not selling either. She would be running around and stabbing people with syringes forcefully.

[lone folio]

If the root predictions are correct and all of that butterfly stuff is fake I will uninstall silksong

[low oracle]

Good

[maiden meteor]

Abyss Creature even seems to be overly protective of its “gift”

[low oracle]

It could also be roots overtaken by the butterfly HB. Nothing points at it being the HB of Lifeblood.

[maiden meteor]

maybe it doesn’t really want people to turn into mindless zombies like in Pharloom

[lone folio]

True true

[low oracle]

Fucking drug addicts messing everything up

[whole holly]

there are no good designs on web, this is good but inaccurate:

[lone folio]

This is also an option

[low oracle]

Imma go now, gotta get some sleep. Bye!

[lone folio]

I am pretty sure on at least half of this being actually true

[maiden meteor]

Hornet enters underwater Abyss and sees Knight play monopoly with Creature

[whole holly]

i also should go to sleep, bye everyone

[lone folio]

I should also say bye and go play Monopoly

[craggy smelt]

big butterfly

[whole holly]

I want hollow knight design to be more unique and less uniform, I don’t particularly like Abyss Creature I can already guess it will look like worm body with wings logically as it wouldn’t be attached to humanoid or winged avian butterfly body

[serene quest]

I have a mini theory about Sea of Sorrow, since the name abrriviets to SOS I think the dlc will start with somebody getting an SOS signal and Hornet tryin to figure where it's coming from

[ionic quarry]

Still on my playthrough but have to know, is there an intentional connection between these masks hanging up and the godseekers? Or is that just a coincidence?

[edgy nebula]

cooncidence, theyre just the heads of cogwork bugs

[ionic quarry]

Gotcha

[craggy smelt]

that would be fun
I wonder how Hornet will discover it - a wishwall would be the easiest means, if a little contrived

guess it depends on who exactly is calling for help

[edgy nebula]

probably grindle calling hornet to come be a pirate with him

cause a pirate is free

[neat ether]

Or maybe she thought it came from another civilization, she does became more prone to helping others. Even if at the start she says she'll only do so if it has benefit to her, she softened up quite a bit during the game as it goes on

[graceful copper]

fleas are carnivorus

they eat moorwing

[neat ether]

Food is food

Can't be picky in a crumbling society

[cunning carbon]

How old is lace, she was made by GMS but was that before or after the weavers rebellion

[drifting walrus]

After most likely

Since phantom is her sister who was born to operate the exhaust organ

Though that depends when the citadel was established enough to need it

[cunning carbon]

I don’t think the weavers built the underworks. The Citadel originally wasn’t very grand, it was humble. Made of ungilded cut stone.

I don’t know how exactly the pilgrims were intended to keep GMS cocoon strong, maybe through chant and prayer. But greed led them to make the underworks and automate

[drifting walrus]

That’s actually the exact reason

The architect choir atop the cogcore was intended to replace the pilgrims

[crimson patio]

The choir was supposed to sing to keep GMS asleep

But then the conductors took over and started making automatons to replace the pilgrims in singing

And y know other things like maintenance and service and guarding as well

[cunning carbon]

But it makes me wonder why lace and phantom were made and how they were given such different roles. “Yes, my daughter that I hate, go work the sewage station that is necessary for my imprisonment.” Maybe she shout them out as a way to expel her power and influence and the conductors looked at phantom and went “woah… free labor!”

[drifting walrus]

Lace was an attempt at a true “daughter” after the failure of the weavers, phantoms skill with a needle might be similar to the sentinels

[crimson patio]

Lace’s fencing have a lot of similarities to the sentinels too

They all gotta get it from someone else

[cunning carbon]

I thought the sentinels got their data from the pinstres’ due to having the same big X attack

[crimson patio]

They could
We don’t know

[muted lantern]

Phantom probably had a similar role to lace as gms's assassin (going off the dialogue frome caretaker about how lace saw herself as the guardian of the place and killed pilgrims) Until they for whatever reason were determined to be flawed and thrown out.

[crimson patio]

There’s some evidence and connection here and there
But is there really in game written lore proving it?

[cunning carbon]

Guess we’ll need to wait for Hollow Knight 3: Palelaugh

[neat ether]

What's the purpose of the exhaust organ again? Was it to just expel waste to bilewater?

[muted lantern]

Seems to expel some kind of exhaust, my suspicion is it's exhaust from burning bodies in whiteward maybe? Silk seems to be infused into the exhaust since the mist has such magical properties.

[drifting walrus]

Might explain the wraiths too

[neat ether]

Are the banshees there ghosts? Failed attempts of making daughters by gms? They do sap out silk I believe

Also is the whiteward a morgue or was it a hospital?

[drifting walrus]

According to the Hunter journal they’re an extension of someone’s will cast in silk

So probably phantom

[muted lantern]

Also on the topic of phantom, I'm starting to have the creeping suspicion that phantom faded even under GMS's care which I understand isnt the common take among the fandom, but lace 2's needolin dialogue where she's begging her mother to notice her and prove that she shouldn't be discarded and replaced she says "I will not fade, I will not take" as if fading was a reason to be discarded rather than the result of such. It's a long shot but I feel there's a possibility phantom aging caused them to fade naturally and that's why lace was made the way she was, as a countermeasure as well as a means to keep her dependant.

[neat ether]

If they're made of silk, and phantom seemed to need silk, why doesn't she just eat them? Is she stupid?

[drifting walrus]

Well the mask phantom wears is actually from lace

And it might be what’s kept her alive so long

[neat ether]

Lace seemed to know where Phantom is, is there a reason why she didn't visit her sister more/try to help her out?

They seem to have a bond with one another

[drifting walrus]

There’s a needolin dialogue in front of the mirror in the exhaust organ with lace and phantom

[edgy nebula]

im curous on why phantom was in the lifepod

what is it even for

[muted lantern]

It's probably hard to watch your sister slowly die of a terminal illness, especially as a kid lace probably didn't stick around.

[muted lantern]

To buy them time maybe.

Like a cryo pod, maybe they woke up between shifts

[muted lantern]

Also bobbir what do you think of my above essay as to why phantom might have been abandoned

[neat ether]

Yeah probably she considered her sister a lost cause and tried to forget to reduce the pain

[muted lantern]

Phantom might have also asked lace to kill them like they wanted hornet too, and lace couldn't do it

[edgy nebula]

i like it

[neat ether]

She wanted to die in battle right? A mercy kill essentially

[edgy nebula]

we wouldnt know for sure of course because phantom's lore is a mystery but her fading is quite possible

[neat ether]

She does seem frayed, like her silk that made her is starting to unravel

[muted lantern]

I think it just provides a clean explanation for why lace is made as a child, and why phantom was abandoned.

[craggy smelt]

puts me in mind of the pod Eva was in to sustain her
she might've been a silk-based life like Lace and Phantom, but even more frail
Eva needs a pod permanently, Phantom needs it periodically
Lace doesn't need one seemingly... yet

[neat ether]

Does Eva have a body or is she just soup in a tank?

[muted lantern]

She's probably made of silk but isn't as well made as lace or phantom so she'd come apart outside of her tank

[edgy nebula]

wonder what "Our silken sight" means

[muted lantern]

Farsight maybe?

[lone valve]

How long do you guys think Hornet could last in Pantheon of Hallownest? Ik for a fact she’s definitely not beating Radiance because Radiance was defeated by the void itself instead of it just being the Knight.

[muted lantern]

Or maybe her ability to see cresrs

[muted lantern]

I think she could hold her own up until radi

[edgy nebula]

i think she'd lose to pv ngl

[edgy nebula]

in that case why would it be "our"

[muted lantern]

Could be royal we like gms? But I doubt it

Farsight most likely

[craggy smelt]

'silken sight' might refer to her insight ability
why she uses 'our' in a couple of cases (our silken sight, our senses' limits) isn't really clear

the Weavenests are supposed to be built beyond Silk's sight

[edgy nebula]

i dont think eva ever uses it aside from the ndd

[craggy smelt]

maybe her thoughts are more like GMS than her spoken speech

she was made to mimic divinity, after all

[drifting walrus]

If the fanfics are right hornets silk is probably enough to sustain her

[muted lantern]

If that was a possibility in Canon Eva would have proposed it. Her form seems too unstable to survive outside her pod, hence why she chooses to become a part of hornet rather than her own independent being.

[drifting walrus]

1. Eva is a failed creation and incapable of existing outside her vessel 2. She probably requires far more silk as a false higher being to sustain than something like lace

[muted lantern]

I think it would be neat if hornet made some kind of mobile pod or something like a deep sea diving suit to contain her, but whether that's remotely possible is debatable

[drifting walrus]

Considering if you refuse to assimilate her hornet states that her own will would be overcome by Eva

It seems her vessel was purpose built to contain and prevent her power from leaking

[muted lantern]

More like she fears it will alter her identity, though it seems like evas willingness to be bound means that there wasn't much effect if she does accept, that line to me does imply that something unwilling would have strong changes to hornets personality, which adds to the dark implications of weaver queen.

[drifting walrus]

Well that’s exactly what the crests do by altering her fighting style and whatnot

It would be interesting if having a specific crest equipped changed certain interactions

[muted lantern]

Yeah I like the idea crests influence her personality a bit when active, it's kinda implied by beast crest giving her a very different and more aggressive taunt

[edgy nebula]

hornet should become a hillbilly when using reaper

[drifting walrus]

That’s why I love those alternate outfit concept arts for each crest

[muted lantern]

I think it would be hard to implement but it would be cool if architect made her talk like the cogworks, with the stutter and the weird speech patterns.

[unborn nova]

who built nyleth's shrine.

[limpid summit]

Weavers

Probably

The snails (?) say it was the Citadel who did it so its either Weavers or Conductors

Everything preceding Seth is stone Weaver era citadel architecture

And all the corpses near Seth are choir

[unborn nova]

Why did Seth kill the choirs?

[limpid summit]

The conductors probably rolled back the Nyleth worship once the Citadel became a big religious entity

No minor pagan gods just the pilgrimage

They probably tried to dismantle the shrine

[craggy smelt]

most likely that, yeah

[stray fog]

True

[graceful grail]

Did the assistant do something to make the lifeblood more volatile than normal??

He seems to be doing what he is doing on purpose insted of just being a dumb assistant

[craggy smelt]

he and Zylotol were seeding it around the cavern and injecting it directly into lifeforms

[graceful grail]

He just seems to be winging out sorta

[craggy smelt]

there were some Wishes that involved collecting different types of blood and mixing it with Plasmium, but they were sadly cut

those might've given a good reason for lifeblood being all freaky

[graceful grail]

Do you think the assistant gave his life as the spark for it to grow

[craggy smelt]

maybe, I don't even know what that would mean

but if he and Zylotol were both injecting Lifeblood, maybe at one point it drained his life to spark further growth

[graceful grail]

Why would it consume him before like that?? Why he die?? It must be suicidal.

[craggy smelt]

who knows how it thinks

maybe something decided that Zango was more useful as fertilizer

[graceful grail]

I think zango willingly gave his life to it. Maybe thats why it is spreading so fast initially. It was literally just planted when hornet arrived

[craggy smelt]

could be

[limpid summit]

But like Yak

Why would the Weavers do that anyway

Were they actually like tolerant

[graceful grail]

Why is this room behind a breakable wall and nothing here. Am i missing something??

[cunning carbon]

It's to nudge you to the idea of the wisp thicket and have you search for it

[graceful grail]

Lame, would have never found that place ever. I would assume this is part of bellheart.

Wisp thicket is hidden to good 😠

[cunning carbon]

For all our benefit, that place sucks

"oh yeah, let fill an area with explosive homing enemies, that's good game design"

[stray fog]

Wisp thicket is too small

[drifting walrus]

And the worst flea rescue in the entire game

[cunning carbon]

I would have never gone there if there wasnt a flea

[graceful grail]

That you cant get silk from or parry and they deal double damage and the bugs that spawn them have no windup on their attacks 😊

[cunning carbon]

It's certainly game design

[drifting walrus]

Then make a boss around them

[graceful grail]

Peak game design

[cunning carbon]

And no silk from the boss so you can't heal

[graceful grail]

And Cogflys dont home on it

[drifting walrus]

And make it self destruct

[cunning carbon]

This is why Australians shouldn't be considered people

Absolute monsters

[drifting walrus]

Love how this turned into FOTF diss track

[graceful grail]

Why isnt whiteward in the ost on apple music 😢 😢 😢

[drifting walrus]

Using Apple Music was your first mistake

[graceful grail]

Whats best??

[drifting walrus]

I use Spotify

[stray fog]

Imagine paying to play the song you want

[graceful grail]

The apple music classical has a diffrent mix, it does some better.

[drifting walrus]

True

[cunning carbon]

Yo guys, no hate but #sk-discussion

[stray fog]

Sorry

[craggy smelt]

it might have been a true Citadel decision

they wanted pilgrims, an arrangement with a major power in shellwood for safe passage would have been in their interest

that'd be true whether it was the Weavers or the Conductors who forged the pact

[maiden meteor]

I feel like Nyleth handled her offspring while Weavers dealt with wood tribe

also I don’t see why Citadel would try to destroy shrine before haunting

they seemed to have tried to preserve things

especially ecosystems

(I mean in Memorium)

[craggy smelt]

the splinters may have emerged in force after Nyleth's decline, going by Sister Splinter's nd

This land is ours, now!
Other, other, sleeping deep...

[maiden meteor]

that could also imply they just were at odds with Nyleth

and once she died they could rule Shellwood undisputed

oh I misread ur message it seems mb

[craggy smelt]

I like to think there's a connection between them

both very plant-like creatures

maybe there were multiple 'seeds', and Nyleth was only the first

[maiden meteor]

I think white-ish plants are Nyleth offspring while wood tribe are own thing

or maybe a mutation of sort

Shellwood houses a lot of different life

[craggy smelt]

the splinters are described as bugs with wood-like shell, so maybe not the same type of creature as the seemingly truly plant-like flower creatures

[maiden meteor]

I wonder if Greyroot could have any relation to Nyleth too

or maybe it actually originated in Bilewater?

[maiden meteor]

ahhh I missed that part

[craggy smelt]

interesting possibility

[maiden meteor]

It would make sense splinter tribe would adapt to wood-like environment

like bilewater bugs are all mossy and stuff

[maiden meteor]

Well, it’s just weird baby root cradle is in Bilewater

maybe it originated there but then moved to less hostile Shellwood

[craggy smelt]

yeah, maybe the pollution drove her away

[maiden meteor]

Or maybe Shellwood is good source of sacrifices because it’s on pilgrimage path

I imagine it’s hard to find dumb pilgrims in Bilewater

Greyroot physiology is really weird

I’m not even sure Cradle and Shellwood Greyroots are connected physically

Maybe it’s like

[plain gazelle]

i think the reason it's hard to explain why the bud is in bilewater is because we're missing a whole stage of the root life cycle, we never see what actually hatches out of the victims in the Chapel. presumably it's some mobile form that can wander off and then die/metamorphosize again into the bud

[maiden meteor]

Cradle births baby that turns into Greyroot and then it does something to sustain Cradle

After all Greyroot needs nectar fruits for whatever reason

[craggy smelt]

interesting, the sources of plantlife from different entities
moss and leaves from Unn
shellwood from Nyleth
unknown growths from White Lady, at least potentially
ashen roots from Greyroot
the blue growths from Lifeblood sources

[stray fog]

What if pale ferns are from the white lady🤔

[craggy smelt]

is that like the plants in White Palace?

I could definitely see her as being their source

(it's tomorrow now)

[graceful grail]

Use Sawtooth circlet on worms for MEAT EXPLOSION!!!💥 🍖 💥

[whole holly]

maybe Plantlife from isma, as well as Verdania(maybe that is natural? or from palestag? or clover dancers)

[stray fog]

!wiki pale fern

No results

Its a grey grass in hallownest

@coolscoot why are all your messages deleted

Im trying to find the pale chart

[stray fog]

Did bro get banned

[whole holly]

i can't see him either what happened

we are going to sacrifice old hearts to bring scoot back from memory

[stray fog]

🔥

[whole holly]

i need his brain full

[stray fog]

Apparently this has happened before too

[whole holly]

to Scoot or to other people? it is not like he was doing anything to get banned

[stray fog]

Scoot

[whole holly]

i disappeared multiple times, does he live in country where discord is banned?

[stray fog]

That wouldn't delete all his messages

[whole holly]

so he had to get removed from channel or his account deleted??

[heavy gyro]

His account still exists

[whole holly]

oh

[stark quest]

Why didn’t Lace die after being voided? Is it because of GMS? She was extending her life in the Abyss with her silk?

[stray fog]

Gms made a cocoon to temporarily block the void

[craggy smelt]

new clover is coming from the Green Prince's body, but he seems like part of a dynasty, so there was likely growth before him

Isma seems to have taken root and is growing about her grove, maybe she will become the source of life for that region

I always saw her as related to the mosskin, but people have pointed out some slight similarities with her and Nyleth, so maybe she's also a 'Seed'

kind've a neat idea (maybe Nyleth originally had an anthropoid form also)

[unborn nova]

Isma's Grove and Nyleth's Shellwood have very different looking vegetation, so maybe there are different "seed" for different typed of plants.

[craggy smelt]

yeah, that'd be the coolest way for that concept to work

every 'Seed' generates a different biome

[late solstice]

Wat will happen after act 3
Since gms is gone
There wont be haunting

[craggy smelt]

haunting is gone, and the Void chills out

bugs can rebuild

free of the Citadel, the Weavers, and GMS

I like to think an Act 4 involves the steel bugs showing up and arresting Hornet for Void crimes

taking her to the City of Steel

[stray fog]

All the husks will go back to being dead

Pharloom can recover, but it will take time

[crystal urchin]

Guys I think Grimm from HK is secretly Trobbio

[craggy smelt]

I think he's not

[crystal urchin]

JK

[unborn nova]

Are the crawbugs haunted or not?

[frosty turret]

Does lace start her rebellion against gms when Hornet arrives or after she is defeated in the cradle?

[neat ether]

I think maybe when she arrives? Because there was a theory that she was the one who let the silkfly remove the spell on the rune cage, thus allowing her to escape

[novel kernel]

Guys any theories why some fleas are inteligent and can speak but they can fly but other fleas can fly but they only say awoo do you think that these fleas you need to find are kids and npc fleas are adults

[hidden urchin]

Probably linked to the flea juice

Anyone think the beach in the new DLC could be linked to other kingdoms or an vast ocean that could link to hallownest or maybe other land of creatures

[rapid bloom]

A callback to Hallownest would be something all of us want, but all of the game so far tried to be its own thing, with a few mentions of Hallownest.

[unborn nova]

I think it is just a life cycle.

flying and dumb to non-flying and intelligent.

the big flea is just an anomaly from citadel's experimentstion.

[rapid bloom]

From their breeding programs.

Which brought forth some abominations.

Pretty sure the Moorwing was also a result of the Citadel.

[unborn nova]

Yeah, if moorwing was natural, the greymoor would've been an empty town/land.

[rapid bloom]

Imagine if Greymoor was called Greenmoor before.

Since it used to be a fertile land before the Citadel.

[unborn nova]

Greymoor and Sinner's Road was probably like Wisp Thicket before the Citadel.

[rapid bloom]

I wonder where the craws would fit...

[rapid bloom]

Oh yeah, Wisp Thicket!

I hate that area.

But as of lore importance, it does hold some significance.

[whole holly]

they were reapers even before silk stuff

i think in chapel of reaper there is a craw, personally

Greenmoor would have lot of vegetation and resemble wisp thicket little

maybe verdania as well

[placid acorn]

Why do the pilgrims start at bone bottom and not the blasted steps if the entrance to pharloom is the blasted steps?

[whole holly]

bone bottom is safe haven maybe, lot of pilgrims aren't ready to ascend to citadel

[spark valve]

they have to ring the bells on their way up

under normal conditions the elevators by that entrance would probably have been used to bring pilgrims down to bonebottom but those aren't operational

[frosty gate]

This is a fair assumption but the mapping is still really weird

I think there's just another entrance from below

[novel kernel]

Yeah like they modified grand reeds and choir clappers to be ultimate killing machines

[spark valve]

the door doesn't open unless they're all rung

[marble oasis]

i would imagine the vegetation was split between shellwood, wisp thicket, whatever bilewater used to be, and verdania

[frosty gate]

Oh yeah that's for sure, I just mean it's weird that Bone Bottom is there and the entrance is above

[rapid bloom]

Pretty sure the Grand Reeds were fed to be bigger than their other Chorists, no?

[spark valve]

there are a ton of elevators stuck halfway between bonebottom and the entrance

[pearl thunder]

High standing insect of the Choir, bearing a bow. This elite Reed has been trained and fed beyond its smaller fellows.
Grand Reed, Hunter's Journal, upper portion

[limpid summit]

Tf they feed him

[pearl thunder]

food?

[marble oasis]

he ate his vegetables and grew big and strong

[marble oasis]

i think these are from when they were actively bringing pilgrims up to serve in the choir

[frosty gate]

Ngl, i though these were cages

[spark valve]

that is what the pilgrimage is yes, but they still have to do the trek

[frosty gate]

But those look like they havent been used for a long time

[spark valve]

yes things are defunct

[marble oasis]

the pilgrimage was a bit later when they needed to spread out the arrivals

at first they needed all hands on deck to start the choir and keep her asleep

eventually the choir was full, the pilgrimage became an obstacle and the ones who arrived were sent to the underworks, and then even the underworks were full and no one was allowed in

[frosty gate]

Which would mean there hasn't been any new pilgrims for who knows how long