sk-lore

[twin dragon]

not an imprint

TK with the voidheart's a higher being

iirc

[low oracle]

NKG might be an exception, and GMS doesn't necessarily want worship. She wants her followers to make song to her or something along those lines.

[pliant meadow]

When is that stated? I haven't heard about this before

[pliant meadow]

Which sounds an awful lot like worship

[twin dragon]

That's what i said as if i remember correctly

because i uh

don't know

[twin dragon]

Yes, that's a form of worship

worship comes in many shapes and forms

[pliant meadow]

Okay then 😭

[half zenith]

Literally almost every named male/masc character in Silksong is either:

• Flamboyantly gay
• Too young
• A jerk
• A creep
• Possessed
• Dead
  And of the few remaining men/masce who are hypothetically romanceable, Hornet shows zero interest in any of them

[dire lynx]

its inside her body, as it was before the surgery

[pliant meadow]

Hey maybe Trobbio is bi

[half zenith]

You have a point. He could be bi

[dire lynx]

she says herself "Whatever remnant still lingers in my shell feels calmed"

[low oracle]

Then where is the absolute difference to being bound?

[half zenith]

But frankly Hornet probably isn’t interested in him. They’re both freaks but Hornet doesn’t seem interested in his brand of freak

And honestly my gaydar pings him as gay

Flamboyantly, brightly gay

[twin dragon]

Absolute insanity of sk lore, as usual

[low oracle]

In Act 3 he is Emo diva gay.

[half zenith]

Yes exactly

[twin dragon]

The parasite isn't imprinted upon her soul

[low oracle]

Absolute insanity is one channel above.

[twin dragon]

unlike the rest

[dire lynx]

because binding is the fusion of minds, on being ceases to be. the parasite still exists as an entity inside hornet, which can be seen when it lashes out at her will with the witches crest heal

she controls it, but didnt consume its mind

or whatever it has

[low oracle]

But Eva also does things in the real world, as seen by her singing. Additionally all crests impact the real world, so is it the bound creatures acting out as well?
The parasite always existing inside of Hornet seems a little off to me. For example, why would she not just fully remove it?

[dire lynx]

who cares if it seems off to you, its what the game says

[half zenith]

And meanwhile, of everyone who she seems kinda into, or at least who you could ship her with:

• Forge Daughter
• Shakra
• Lace
• Second Sentinel
• Phantom
• Eva
• Karmelita?
• Varga
  They’re all either a woman or a more neutral to fem leaning enby

Conclusion: Hornet is a flaming lesbiab

[low oracle]

The "remnant" in question might just be the crest, but whatever.

Who is Varga?

[twin dragon]

Crests are imprints upon one's soul, it's not described as such

[low oracle]

Witch Crest is a crest. So it is viewed by the game as a crest. Otherwise Hornet could equip it at any given moment, if she were caoable of just commanding the parasite.

[half zenith]

The flea warrior

I might’ve misremembered her name but it’s something like that

[dire lynx]

gameplay vs lore

[low oracle]

Isn't she really annoying because Hornet isn't a flea?

[half zenith]

Fair point but consider: fluffy stronk woman

[twin dragon]

That's vog

are we deadass

[half zenith]

…Right. I am bad with names of minor characters

I hauve ADHD

[low oracle]

The tentacles lashing out aren't really lore. In the slab, hornet can have the Witch already obtained. Yet she needs her cape to equip the Witch crest. What would that mean? The parasite is in the cape?

[twin dragon]

Hk fans otw to make the most batshit insane headcanons and then complain about established lore

[half zenith]

I doubt it’s as intentional in HK, but you could technically apply the “player character sexuality implied through who conveniently happens to be shippable with them” to HK aswell

In that… there’s not much going on there

[low oracle]

The Knight doesn't even have a gender lmao.

[twin dragon]

The knight is barely a character in the first place

[low oracle]

Why? Because you have full control of what they do?

[twin dragon]

Almost mindless and serves the narrative purpose of letting YOU explore the kingdom

I mean it has its own backstory but that is also THK's backstory

[twin dragon]

Through the eyes of TK

[low oracle]

Hence all endings are canon. Silksong connects to two of these endings.

[dire lynx]

hornet seems more ace than anything, but nobody is ready for that convo

[twin dragon]

What

All ending can't be canon if silksong is canon

[half zenith]

For who the knight shows zero interest in, we have:

• A young adult woman with a very obvious crush, who The Knight does not return and probably finds low-key amusing
• A polite young lady The Knight checks in on but has nothing more going on
• A few weirdos just passing by
• A flaming lesbian grieving her wife
• Two scammers
• Zote. Fucking Zote
• Several literal ghosts

[low oracle]

Only Dream No More and Embrace the Void lead into Silksong.

[twin dragon]

These are the 2 possible canon endings yeah

[low oracle]

The fan ships for the Knight are not what you would like to see.

[twin dragon]

[half zenith]

Low-key why’d you phrase it like that though. I’m some form of aspec you know, I get how Hornet feels. Don’t really care about it when you have a job and mental illnesses and will probably just outlive everyone you ever love anyway

[half zenith]

I was getting to that part

[low oracle]

I speculate every ending in Hollow Knight AND Silksong is cannon, and they all connect in different timelines.

[low oracle]

You should get away from that part.

[dire lynx]

most shippers arent even willing to accept lace is a child, let alone me mentioning hornets asexuality

[twin dragon]

both thk and sealed siblings can't connect to silksong

[low oracle]

Hornet had relationships though, according to the HJ.

[half zenith]

Is this about Ghost being tiny? Because Ghost is an adult and the narrative treats them as such, otherwise Bretta’s crush would be reallly creepy

[stray fog]

Tc ain't building a multiverse (probably)

[twin dragon]

TK is hella old yeah

[dire lynx]

yeah, but she outlived them all and seemingly hasnt been in or persued one in ages

[twin dragon]

But it doesn't have much of a personality to form ships w him

[low oracle]

Which is why their timeline ends in HK.

[twin dragon]

Then they can't be canon, as the timeline has to follow into silksong

[half zenith]

I’m not gonna lie you’re low-key sounding like a tumblr fan in a bad way. I agree with your point that Hornet is some form of aspec but no one will take you seriously if you’re that argumentative about it (/genuinely giving advice)

[dire lynx]

??

[low oracle]

Ghost isn't even alive. And Vessels don't seem to age like normal bugs. The part I mean revolves around stuff you'd call "Alabama".

[twin dragon]

[low oracle]

All endings are canon, you decide which to pursue.

[twin dragon]

Also the ghost IS a living being

[half zenith]

OHHHHHHHH
Yeah I don’t count those as shippable. Fans are weird and I stay the hell away and let them write what they want knowing it’s not my thing

[twin dragon]

he's hollowed out by the void

IT'S*

[low oracle]

The place where it was born, where it died, where it all began. - White Lady

[stray fog]

Vessels are borderline alive

[sinful nimbus]

They're undead

[stray fog]

Exactly

[low oracle]

The Hollow Knight could be alive, since it was able to grow properly. The size probably isn't achieved through training either, the White Lady is big too.

[dire lynx]

lost kin is also weirdly larger than every other vessel, wish we learnt more abt thks growth

[twin dragon]

Tk is a zombie, so we solved the reason why it doesn't grow

peak

[stray fog]

All vessels are like that though

[twin dragon]

Bv and thk are seemingly different

since they could grow

[stray fog]

I'm taking about the zombie part

[sinful nimbus]

Broken Vessel isn't abnormally large there are others like her in the abyss

[twin dragon]

misgendering

[low oracle]

Since it has a nail, it was probably an attempt at a pure vessel too. It isn't infected either, though I really would have liked to see its shade.

The Knight maybe found the nail, idk. Not implying the nail from broken vessel.

[twin dragon]

A dead organism can't grow

[stray fog]

Im saying that all the vessels are undead, so that is not what stops their growth

[twin dragon]

are they?

[stray fog]

Why wouldn't they be

[sinful nimbus]

They're undead that means they're biologically dead

IE they can't grow

[low oracle]

We do not know if THK is dead. It is the only vessel that grew large, probably because of White Lady genes.

[twin dragon]

They seemingly can grow

[pliant meadow]

What abt thk?

[stray fog]

Bv and tk should be identical in terms of undead-ness

[twin dragon]

EVERY vessel has white lady genes

[sinful nimbus]

Exception to the rule

[stray fog]

This is circular reasoning though

[sinful nimbus]

It probably magically grew as TK is the same age as it

[half zenith]

ANYWAY. My theory. Now who IS ghost shippable with?

• Ogrim. Why can you fight him in his dreams enough times to get it acknowledged?
• Tiso -Ghost seems disappointed that Tiso died before they could duel, if player reaction is any indication
• Grimm. Excuse me -“our” child? A flaming dance? Whooo boy Grimm is looking like a flaming homosexual and honestly a fellow god is probably one of the better choices for a god
• Quirrel, if you ignore certain implications about his fate -their interactions are… nice, and can be interpreted as either platonic or romantic
  Conclusion: Probably some form of aspec, definitely asexual, if they are into anyone romantically it seems to be only men and mascs

[twin dragon]

We don't get much else on the topic

[low oracle]

Not every vessel is dead, at least we don't know wether or not the Hollow Knight is dead.

[twin dragon]

im sticking to it

[pliant meadow]

So it did still grow

[sinful nimbus]

Not naturally which is what the convo is about

[dire lynx]

i have experienced it and seen it, reddit, insta, yt. people will downvote or hate on you for pointing out how lacenet is problematic, and how has anything ive said come off argumentative??

[twin dragon]

Thk took steroids

that's the conclusion

The steroids were of a suspiciously orange ish color

[low oracle]

Grimmchild will become the new Grimm, so...

[stray fog]

I like the theory that the white lady did some growth magic (because shes a plant being)

[half zenith]

Is that canon? Ah. Romances with him are a temporary fling then

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet being asexual/aromantic doesn't seem to be grounded in anything unlike Lace being a child

[twin dragon]

Yeah but we don't rlly see her directly have a love interest

[low oracle]

Basically the child thing means nothing. It is just that Grimm is technically underage and not underage throughout his lifecycle.

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah its not really that type of story

[twin dragon]

Hornet hive knight romance spinoff

slop

[low oracle]

Not possible. Unless Team Cherry gives us the badass bee vomitting move, then I'll accept it.

[twin dragon]

it's a joke

TC unironically making a zote game is more probable

[low oracle]

I'm not joking. I want the bee vomit attack.

[twin dragon]

you ain't gettin it

[low oracle]

You ain't getting Zoteboat either.

[half zenith]

Lace is an immortal artificial construct who’s been around for a long ass time. I think normal logic around biological age doesn’t apply here, especially knowing she had her mental development stunted by being under the thumb of an abusive parent. It is supposed to be subjective

[dire lynx]

we get vespa fight back in dlc and unlock bee vomit

[sinful nimbus]

What?

[stray fog]

Lace age discussion

[twin dragon]

Sea of sorrow IS zoteboat

[half zenith]

I’m not the one who brought it up for the record

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah but what?

[low oracle]

No, I let Zoat die

[fresh badger]

What?

[twin dragon]

did you know that lace is a wifi router

[twin dragon]

I didn't

[low oracle]

You should have.

[twin dragon]

won't know who's right till we see

schrodinger's zote

[half zenith]

Look. I don’t want to get into ANOTHER discourse discussion about this. Same old discourse every time, my opinion never changes so what’s the point

[stray fog]

Lace is actually the GNU foundation

[stray fog]

Hes funny though

[low oracle]

Lock him in a box with void.

[twin dragon]

Lace is actually mr mushroom's daughter

[sinful nimbus]

Easiest way to avoid discourse is to avoid being wrong, that's not subjective

[fresh badger]

I miss Powdered 😭

[low oracle]

His bossfight is ass.

[stray fog]

They both have white bodies 🤯

[twin dragon]

This is not always correct unfortunately

[twin dragon]

they both have a shroom ass head

therefore lace is a shroom

[half zenith]

Let’s just go with my theory that the game implies The Knight is vaguely aspec, maybe demiromantic leaning towards gay? and Hornet is probably a lesbiab but doesn’t really care about that rn

[stray fog]

What does aspec mean?

[twin dragon]

what the fuck is that terminology

[sinful nimbus]

The game never implies TK is aspec why are we making stuff up 😭

[half zenith]

Vaguely on the spectrum of aromantic and or asexual in some form

[fresh badger]

:true:

[half zenith]

The knight has no interest in Bretta

[stray fog]

Oh

[twin dragon]

The knight barely has a mind

[sinful nimbus]

Not showing attraction for one individual doesn't mean its aspec lol

[sinful nimbus]

No

[twin dragon]

?

[half zenith]

‼️ LOUD INCORRECT BUZZER ‼️

[sinful nimbus]

Vessels are sapient beings with minds that's kinda the point of the game

PK was wrong

[twin dragon]

True

that's what i meant

[half zenith]

To both of you I mean. The Knight is sentient, PK was wrong. The Knight is also probably aspec or at the very least not interested in women

[fresh badger]

TK romance is gross and boring

TK found family is where its at

[twin dragon]

Yeah vessels are sentient

[shy magnet]

the knight probably doesnt care its got bigger fish to fry

[twin dragon]

But their cognitive capacities seem limited

Stunted by the void or wtv

[twin dragon]

a moth

[fresh badger]

Wdym?

[sinful nimbus]

yeah but proof

[stray fog]

Hold on that's what my teacher said about me. Idk what it means though

/j

[fresh badger]

TK is able to draw maps just as well as Cornifer, use imagination for dreamgate

[sinful nimbus]

This just seems like a headcanon

[twin dragon]

can't talk RAAH

[half zenith]

In that they have autism? Sure buddy. Go ahead and say that their being nonverbal and odd means they aren’t fully a person

[twin dragon]

But yeah i am wrong yet again

those are physical disabilities

[twin dragon]

?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[half zenith]

You have a point there. But let me have my fun as an aspec person

[shy magnet]

what ❓

[half zenith]

Is that the fucking Pepe emoji??? Please tell me you’re a normal person

[sinful nimbus]

I'm not against that headcanon I just thought it was weird how it was portrayed as actually having grounds in the game

[stray fog]

It doesn't seem like what he was saying at all

[twin dragon]

[shy magnet]

this is so feelspkman

[half zenith]

…My apologies for being unusually argumentative. I’m normally nicer but I’m on a road trip and sleep deprived and going mad from ADHD

I’ll try to be nicer

[dire lynx]

good ending after sotv, hornet, the nailmasters/sage, nailsmith , cornifer, iselda, elderbug, nymm and thk meet up with the knight in the abyss

[stray fog]

[twin dragon]

It's fine

Maybe

i'll think about it

[fresh badger]

Dont you lump Oro and Mato in with that bastard Sheo 🥀 Mato treats TK as a son and Oro accepts TK's flowers

[dire lynx]

true, my bad gng

[stray fog]

Pool party but evil water

[half zenith]

…Do you really not know what the Pepe emote means? It’s a fascist dogwhistle, and you might be a normal person but using it in the wrong place might give the wrong impression

[shy magnet]

what 😭

[half zenith]

Just giving a word of advice so people don’t think you’re like super 4chan rotted or whatever

[twin dragon]

Interesting

[dire lynx]

you were calling me the tumblr person when ur spouting ts now vro

[fresh badger]

[stray fog]

Damn I thought it was a funny frog

[twin dragon]

I like how it stares you down

and it doubles as the pale king

[shy magnet]

my guy i dont think anyone cares its a drawing of pepe as the pale king

[half zenith]

Hey. I’m not being argumentative right now, I’m just trying to give advice and bad at communicating it politely. I hauve autism sadly 😭

[fresh badger]

Judgemental stare of the White Dad

[stray fog]

Would this emoji even be on the server if this was the case

[shy magnet]

anyways is powdered really gone

[half zenith]

That’s the point of a dogwhistle. The people the dogwhistle is for will recognize it while normal people might miss it

[twin dragon]

Who's powdered

[fresh badger]

My goat my zote

[stray fog]

Haven't seen them (forgot pronouns and they're not in the server rn so I can't check) in months

[shy magnet]

🥹🥹🥹

[half zenith]

A-Anyway. My terrible social skills aside

Headcanon that Pharloom has a very Victorian way of doing social skills that relies on complex subtlety and signaling

[sinful nimbus]

I miss khezu 😔

[half zenith]

And that clovers have kind of become a symbol of homosexuality due to the green princes being gay as hell. So a clover worn over the heart signals you’re gay

[twin dragon]

uh???

I mean it's a headcanon i rlly can't say shit

[shy magnet]

this is the kind of headcanon lore we need here

[half zenith]

Perhaps asking someone if they “know the green prince” or similar is a roundabout polite way to ask if someone is gay

(I’m not stating any of this as canon. It’s a headcanon)

[twin dragon]

[half zenith]

Victorian parlance, continued: any kind of formal ball or event where courtship is expected to happen, wearing a symbolic red string of fate means you already have a partner

Wearing a white string in a certain subtle way is a cry for help

[gentle aspen]

if it’s a self admitted headcanon why is it here

[half zenith]

We don’t have a headcanon or fanfic channel

We badly need one

[gentle aspen]

no we don’t

[dire lynx]

#sk-discussion is fine enough

[fresh badger]

The highly venerated #sk-discussion

[half zenith]

I’m obsessed with Victorian England weird sexismy social norms and interesting insect behavior

What can I say

[gentle aspen]

that’s extremely niche and would see little to no use

[half zenith]

You’d be surprised

[gentle aspen]

hk general and sk discussion exist

[gentle aspen]

no, I really wouldn’t

[dire lynx]

ive been very active on here (lurking or discussing) and only seen the want for a fanfic channel twice

[fresh badger]

Anyways can we get back to talking about how bloatroaches are like gourmet bileroaches

[half zenith]

Ew /pos

[twin dragon]

they prob taste 4x worse

[fresh badger]

Like imagine the amount of fat you can render out of a bloatroach steak by pansearing it

[twin dragon]

Instead of fat it'll be toxic fumes

Asbestos wagyu

[fresh badger]

Just develop an immunity???

[twin dragon]

Buddy

[half zenith]

-DISGRACED CHEF LUGOLI

[stray fog]

😭

[dire lynx]

do we think they did that thing where you cook the organs inside the stomach

[fresh badger]

You could make like luxury clothing out of bloatroach pelts

[twin dragon]

lugoli said my roach seasoned with bilespecies is RAW

[shy magnet]

wow hes blue now

[twin dragon]

i can see benjin and crull doing that

[gentle aspen]

…what

[half zenith]

Ew no

[gentle aspen]

no

[fresh badger]

Look how mf fluffy they are

[shy magnet]

dont know about luxury

[gentle aspen]

You’re an idiot

[dire lynx]

Haggis is a savoury pudding containing sheep's pluck (heart, liver, and lungs), minced with chopped onion, oatmeal, suet, seasonings, and salt, mixed with stock, and cooked while traditionally encased in the animal's stomach

now with roach guts 🍽️

[twin dragon]

As if people in sinner's road aren't dirty enough

[fresh badger]

Actually maybe the stilkin covers are fashioned from bloatroaches looking at it

[stray fog]

Average #sk-lore message

[gentle aspen]

Its filled with noxious gases that would pervade their disgusting moss covered head

[fresh badger]

Noxious is subjective

[gentle aspen]

Its form is absurd... Surely it would not be able to hold itself in the air? The noxious gasses in its stomach must provide its levity.

Imbecile

[fresh badger]

Yeah well Hornet's a prude

She calls sapient slaves disgusting and stinky

I dont trust her tastes

[stray fog]

How much gas does this mf have to fucking levitate 😭

[dire lynx]

all roads lead to slabflies

[twin dragon]

They are disgusting and stinky, however i don't think they deserve to die unlike a certain individual

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet on her way to call a renowned delicacy repulsive and disgusting (She doesn't even eat food)

[fresh badger]

TRUUEEEEE

[twin dragon]

One great taste of pharloom ain't it?

[sinful nimbus]

Yeah

[twin dragon]

Moors overthrow the citadel and make a feast out of the gourmand

[pliant meadow]

You mean the moorbugs?

[twin dragon]

Yeah

[pliant meadow]

Yeah okay lol

[dire lynx]

get the stillkin in there also

[twin dragon]

They'd eat anyone tbf

[fresh badger]

On another note

Isnt pale lake really interesting

Like the rocks around it

Have that hexagonal basalt look

[stray fog]

Wait is the lake close to deep docks?

Because I remember something about basalt forming near lava or something idk

[dire lynx]

no its in the ducts lmao

[gentle aspen]

they should mine all the craftsmetal in there

[fresh badger]

Craftsmetal is also weird, theres a deposit there but its like square columns not hexagonal columns

[twin dragon]

craftsmetal comes from john higher being, which vomits metal that is used in crafts

[pliant meadow]

Nubbie with another peak quote

[rare light]

tuff

[devout slate]

Is he... dead?

[stray fog]

Yes

😔

[devout slate]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[hidden crater]

https://tenor.com/view/é-complicado-mano-gif-9589218753428981877

[flat hatch]

[grave stream]

how did the knight hold an everbloom with his stubby arms if everblooms destroy void?

[stray fog]

It never came in contact with the void inside them

[fresh badger]

Vessel bodies arent void, the void is inside their body

[stray fog]

Only their fingers

[grave stream]

ok

so the everblooms just kinda float

[fresh badger]

Wdym

[grave stream]

honestly i don't even know

they only work when inside the void?

otherwise they just sit ontop

[stray fog]

Its just a normal flower outside the void

[grave stream]

ok

[stray fog]

No superpowers

[grave stream]

also

what even are lurien and monomon

i know that they're dreamers, duh

but what are they?

[limpid summit]

Lurien is probably regular enough

Monomon might have experimented on herself to get the tentacles

[edgy river]

Tbh im not sure about that because white lady says it would be foolish for her to accept an everbloom in HK

So it might have other properties

[fresh badger]

No?

[random harbor]

White Lady - Delicate Flower - After giving Delicate Flower

Ah, what precious gift it offers, though alas I shan't accept.
Not of me that flower, nor of this kingdom. Far it travelled to reach this place, brought by one beloved, fair knight of lands serene.
There is rare power hidden in those frail petals.
To hold it so close, one must surely be unaware of its nature...

@mushspore used /npcs misc name: White Lady category: Delicate Flower dialogue: After giving Delicate Flower

[fresh badger]

I think it is interesting that the archives are filled with mini jellyfish particles the same green as Monomon

[stray fog]

I always thought this dialogue meant "its ironic that a void creature is carrying around the only thing capable of destroying it"

But then why didn't she accept the flower? 🤔

[fresh badger]

No use for it

[stray fog]

She has an everbloom with her in red memory

[lyric rose]

Ok I got a theory

In Sea of Sorrow, we might get some explanation on the jellyfish

See what the natural jellyfish are like in the sea

There is a lightning rod at the top of the “lifeblood spire” so it’s possible there are some electrical experiments going on.

[limpid summit]

Hmm

Maybe

I think the uomas are somehow like artificial yumas

But who knows how Monomon got that genetic info

Maybe she did go to the loom

[stray fog]

Who is the speaker here?

The mushroom clan?

And who put the wish there in the ducts

[limpid summit]

The mushroom clan

[stray fog]

They call him "master herald"
So are there other heralds under mr mushroom?

[limpid summit]

Uhhh

Probably not

I think it’s just an ornate title

Hornet calls him the herald

[fresh badger]

Honestly

I think no

I think theres like a nomadic group of shrumals seperate from other mushroom clans

Who go around foretelling Mr Mushroom's presence

[limpid summit]

Oh I mean it’s probably not the same dudes from the Nest

But it is Shrumals

[stray fog]

Why do they even want someone to go meet mr mushroom in all his locations

These mfs are weird

[deft wagon]

Does the term ‘silk flies’ appear anywhere in the game, or is it only used as the filename for the sprites of those small bugs?

[sinful nimbus]

Pretty sure its from the files only

[edgy river]

This doesn't really track for me as a reason to not accept a gift

[limpid dock]

why did they need to recycle silk with greymoor workers? dont they already have infinite silk from gms?

[heavy gyro]

They dont wanna waste anything

[edgy river]

Not quite infinite

[limpid dock]

yeah but isnt that enough already?

what is silk used for anyway

[heavy gyro]

Its possible that they wanted to use as much silk as possible, so recycling the silk would mean they can use more silk quicker

[edgy river]

I understand it as they get silk from her in a constant rate. They can't just get as much as they want

[edgy river]

Almost everything

[limpid dock]

like?

machines are powered by silkflies

thats like different isnt it

[edgy river]

Silkflies come from silk infused bugs

[limpid dock]

yeah

except for whiteward stuff

what is silk used for

[edgy river]

For bugs to be this silk infused it needs tons of Silk

[heavy gyro]

As a weapon

[edgy river]

They also used in the construction of the weavenests

[heavy gyro]

Possibly as parchment too like in hallownest

[edgy river]

And spells

And probably Eva

[limpid dock]

hm what are the silk vending machines for
seems like citizens also used it for something

[edgy river]

Maybe to string rosaries?

[limpid dock]

there are already stringing machines

plus that would be inefficioent cause its 30 rosaries a spool

[mint stratus]

How often do y’all think hornet needs to eat, drink, and sleep? Been thinking about her metabolism for a hot second

[edgy river]

Maybe never?

Can pale beings die like that?

[limpid dock]

i think pale beings cant die naturally and they have to be slain or something

[twilit crest]

Never.

[rich bison]

Are there any locations that appear in both games ? Or some ref to hk in silksong ?

[twilit crest]

I can’t remember where (I think at the inn in greymoor) but Hornet says she doesn’t require regular sustenance

[twilit crest]

Mostly just hunters journal stuff

[mint stratus]

Red memory

[rich bison]

Ok thanks

[twilit crest]

Oh yeah that too

[rich bison]

I didn't play to silksong yet so what is this ?

[sinful nimbus]

Memory of Hornet's time in Hallownest

[stray grove]

Hollownest*

[spark valve]

hollawnest

[whole holly]

when joke doesn't land

[sinful nimbus]

Oh weird I thought it was hallow

Mandela effect

[twilit crest]

It should be Hallow but Hollow works too

[stray fog]

Is it not?

[whole holly]

it is

[spark valve]

idk that nest looks pretty hollow to me with all those caves

[silk dirge]

Hellownest

[spark valve]

pharloom is such a downgrade as a name icl

[sinful nimbus]

we running out of things to complain about dawg

[foggy fractal]

you do have a point there

[spark valve]

no it's just sort of relevant

[foggy fractal]

we can just circle back to Lace Age, Retcons, Slabfly Discussion

easy

[spark valve]

hallownest is hallowed because it's the land of gods and nest because that's an established convention for places bugs live

pharloom sure the loom part is clear but phar? why is it being far an important part of its identity?

[foggy fractal]

happy new years Tammo and Starpengu !!! 🥳

[spark valve]

happy new years

[sinful nimbus]

happy belated new years

[sinful nimbus]

That's what it was called when Karmelita was in power duh

[foggy fractal]

ohhhhh

far fields ? 🤔

[spark valve]

far fields is also a weird name but whatever

[foggy fractal]

what is not a weird name

[spark valve]

most of the area names are less weird than far fields

what is far about the fields

[foggy fractal]

than what is the weirdest

[limpid summit]

Hornetcentric naming

I guess it’s the farthest fields from Hallownest

[foggy fractal]

they are far and are fields ?

[spark valve]

far from what

[limpid summit]

Would moss grotto be Closer Fields

[spark valve]

far is a relative term

[foggy fractal]

far from the center of pharloom 🤔 far from uhhhh the citadel !

far from mt fay

[sinful nimbus]

They went all in on the alliteration

HK didn't have thaaat much

[spark valve]

they didn't even tho

[sinful nimbus]

Soul Sanctum and uhh

[sinful nimbus]

"Sands of Karak" and "Verdania"

[spark valve]

there are a few alliterated things sure but it's not like they forced it

[silk dirge]

fortnite area names

[foggy fractal]

its peak

[spark valve]

mount fay blasted steps moss grotto wisp thicket sinner's road greymoor bilewater putrified ducts

[silk dirge]

nah fortnite would never have an area name as cool as like

choral chambers

[sinful nimbus]

shhh

[foggy fractal]

high halls 🗣️

[spark valve]

choral chambers is also fake alliteration

[sinful nimbus]

point is that its there more than in HK

[foggy fractal]

but high halls is real doe !

[sinful nimbus]

Pharloom's Folly

[spark valve]

high halls is real

[silk dirge]

why lol

wtf is a fake alliteration

[sinful nimbus]

The ch is different

[spark valve]

because they represent different sounds

[silk dirge]

i see

[foggy fractal]

because the ch in choral is pronounced differently than the ch in chambers !

[spark valve]

k vs t͡ʃ

[sinful nimbus]

is ch taken in the ipa or something

or do they not do double letters

[spark valve]

they generally don't do double letters plus it's an affricate so it's represented as the stop plus the fricative with that mark

ʃ is the 'sh' sound

[sinful nimbus]

[foggy fractal]

!

[spark valve]

that is alliterative

[silk dirge]

is that an integral

[foggy fractal]

what if Hornet was alliterative too 🤔 Hornet Hallownest

[spark valve]

they use the same letter

[spark valve]

herrah is the surname so she's hornet herrah

herrah's full name ofc being Cindril Herrah

[sinful nimbus]

TRUE

[foggy fractal]

I see...

[spark valve]

sandsea wastes has the alliterative first word, blackbarrens, city of steel

[foggy fractal]

Sea of Sorrow

🥶

[silk dirge]

does that imply the existence of atla herrah, karn herrah, absolom herrah and murglin herrah

[spark valve]

they're all sisters so yeah

[whole holly]

What is even proof of herrah being last name , is monomon’s first name Omoo last name Monomon?

[oak palm]

Why does the cave the citadel is in seem to have its own light

[sinful nimbus]

HK just has unexplained light

[low oracle]

How do we know the citadel is in a cave?

[oak palm]

All of pharloom is is it not

It's all caves and tunnels

Though im confused abt mount fay

Because crystal peak actually like extended above the surface but mount fay presumably doesn't

[sinful nimbus]

you can see the roof and walls of the cavern

[oak palm]

So why is it considered a mountain

[low oracle]

No, it isn't. At the top of the cradle there is definetely the surface. And remember that the surface of the caves isn't always on the same height.

[low oracle]

Where? Can you send a screenshot?

[low oracle]

Are there even last names in HK? I've never seen an example. They all use normal names, titles, or a combination of the two.

[sinful nimbus]

I don't have silksong installed atm but its in memorium and the entrance to putrified ducts as well as songclave

[oak palm]

Not really pharloom at that point

But the height thing could be true

[foggy fractal]

first name Hollow last name Knight

[oak palm]

You can see the ceiling in memorium?

[whole holly]

Idk star was saying that herrah is last name

[sinful nimbus]

p sure

the last name stuff was a joke

[whole holly]

Lame

[low oracle]

Pharloom, as in the playable map. And Mount Fay could either the the Fayhorn (I don't think so) or just the surface.

[foggy fractal]

like two or three spirits but those are all backer characters

speaking of backer characters they also added backer credits to hk

well backer character credit

[silk dirge]

those have always been there i think

i remember seeing the option before silksong

[whole holly]

Is garmond from nameless town? He seems like it

[low oracle]

Which precisely? Except for the backer names of course, if that is what you mean.

[whole holly]

He also looks Irish

[foggy fractal]

Poggy Throax
Magnus Strong
Pepertos Noo

[low oracle]

I think he seems to be from the cut (uncut?SoS) map, since his helemt resembles a seashell. Nameless town would also make sense. However I believe it is implied that the Old Penitent came from the nameless town and they don't really look alike.

[edgy nebula]

pepertnos noo, created by perpetual noob

[low oracle]

I think that's just their first/normal name to be honest. That's just how names in HK work.

[whole holly]

Memento looks like his helmet too though

[edgy nebula]

nameless town is ancient, he wouldnt be

[whole holly]

How ancient older than haunting?

[edgy nebula]

Yes

[whole holly]

I mean lore somewhat makes it impossible but I believe that’s because of rewrites because there is no good reason why his helmet looks like cones in nameless town and memento

[low oracle]

Which is why I understand the speculation. To expand on what @edgy nebula said, the weavers lured the residents of the nameless town into Pharloom, for them to serve the citadel of song. Old Penitent also has some dialogue that makes sense alongside this, though you'll have to look it up yourself. Garmond on the other hand became a warrior after his town was haunted, seeking to take revenge.

[foggy fractal]

well they're all backer characters anyways
I don't think theres a sigle hk character with a last name, would've be funny though 🗣️ Hornet Hallownest !!!

[whole holly]

Old Penitent is kinda too vague as well

[low oracle]

Well, the god tamer isn't a skarr or karak either. Yet they are an ant with a Karak-like weapon.

[low oracle]

On a serious note, Hornet's full name/title is: Hornet, Daughter of Hallownest

[whole holly]

Godtamer vaguely resembles ant nor skarr we see specifically

I do hope we see Shakra’s and Gardmond’s towns

[foggy fractal]

I don't think thats a full name

[low oracle]

Drawn down... blessed call...
Sisters... accord...
Silence above...

Drawn down = drawn into Pharloom
Sister = Weavers
Silence above = The haunting doesn't take effect above the cradle

[whole holly]

Makes sense does Penitent look similar to silhouette we see in nameless town?

[foggy fractal]

I meant like who specificly created what character
like it would display the backer name under the character's name when you meet em

[silk dirge]

yeah

thats always existed i think

[low oracle]

I'm not bringing up some stupid theory. I'm just saying that Team Cherry makes art first. They have characters designed not to be organized, but to look great and beautiful. otherwise they'd owe us an explanation of Karmelita. I wouldn't want to think about it too much, but she basically wears her own skin around her skin, in which she also hides sharp blade. As another person said: "that would be like hiding scissors in your foreskin".

[foggy fractal]

hell nah !

[low oracle]

The silhouette is just a basic elder pilgrim (large horn, Minecraft body). Hence the town was likely pretty big and was the origin of most, if not all pilgrims.

[foggy fractal]

find a screenshot or footage then ! I bet my rosary string on ts

[whole holly]

That sad, it is also sad we cannot dream nail skrill they run away from needolin too

[low oracle]

It isn't. But if we were another character talking to Hornet, we could know her as both "Hornet" and "Daughter of Hallownest".

[foggy fractal]

🗣️ Spawn of those who dared to flee!

[low oracle]

They're not haunted, hence they are pure of silk.

[whole holly]

Yeah but not pure of dreams though

[low oracle]

But let's compare. Sorry for the nameless town picture, it's the only one i could find. Either way, the Old Penitent seems to have been a coveoutus pilgrim, at least he resembles them the most.

[low oracle]

What do you mean?

[whole holly]

Even if they don’t have silk they still have thoughts

[low oracle]

Yeah, but not really. They're as thoughtful as real life ants. They haven't been ascended by any higher being or even gained sentience on their own.

[lone folio]

I definitely still think that at least some of the nameless folk are the original pilgrims before the whole pilgrim thing started

Not sure about the worm pilgrims

[low oracle]

Which ones?

The ones with light shells? Agile pilgrim or something?

[lone folio]

Like the first merchant you find

[low oracle]

Okay.

[lone folio]

They are very different compared to every other pilgrim

[whole holly]

I wish Pharloom had actual Higher Being who worked against GMS and weakened her influence

[low oracle]

Obviously Team Cherry gave us this much variety of Pilgrims so we know they aren't all the same, hence only the horned pilgrims and OP are definitely from nameless town. The young horned pilgrims (little with wings) seem to be the earlier stage of life before the pilgrim elder (square). Most pilgrims with the one, long horn seem to be the same species though. So it seems a large majority of pilgrims originated from the nameless town.

[low oracle]

Both Fayhorn and Nyleth are speculative higher beings, which both have their own good points. Weavers even seem to have somewhat worshipped Fayhorn to a degree.

[whole holly]

It is Fayforn

[whole holly]

I mean Old Penitents face looks similar shape wise, and we can’t see horn

[lone folio]

The absolute goat fearful pilgrim:

[whole holly]

Neither are able to ward off haunting , Karmalita was able to prevent haunting

[low oracle]

The definite outliers of regular pilgrim species are:
-Sherma
-Fearful Pilgrim
-Pilgrim Preacher
-Scared Pilgrim
-Pavo
-Creige
-Frey
-Loam
NPC Pilgrims that resemble normal pilgrims
-Flick the fixer
-Mort
-Old Penitent
Random possible pilgrim NPCs:
-Plinney
-Loyal Mergwin (+Master)
-Yarnaby
-Pondcatcher Reed

Make what you want of this list. Due to the Whitewards operations, silk is basically born into any pilgrim. All outliers of normal pilgrims are also not haunted, hence they probably aren't cursed from birth.

[twin dragon]

Too bad the kingdom decided to work against its higher being

[low oracle]

I didn't read anything, imma catch up a bit.

[low oracle]

Unn didn't prevent the infection either, from taking over her mosskin. And Nyleth completely resembles Unn in almost every way. I didn't respond to HB fighting back against GMS, I meant that there (prob) are other higher beings in Pharloom.

[low oracle]

I spent way too long making ts.

[whole holly]

Because she was control freak, if there was Dream higher being that would be great

[low oracle]

That's like saying that Hallownest's citizens worked against the Radiance. The true assholes are the Weavers and the Moths. They had valid reasons, but they also use those reasons to justify causing massive problems and involving innocent bugs/HBs.

[whole holly]

Unn is only innocent Higher Being ever

[whole holly]

Nyleth being only innocent old heart

[plain gazelle]

it's GMS's light

[low oracle]

I like NKG and Pale King the most though, just because of how they work.

[low oracle]

No? She dies and it definitely doesn't vanish.

[plain gazelle]

act 2 opening cutscene, weaver queen, act 3 opening cutscene

plus widow quote

[oak palm]

Oh wait i guess that makes sense

Everything darkens

When gms is gone

[plain gazelle]

yeah it's not like all light goes away cuz caves are just passively lit in HK from whatever source, but the actual golden light is supposed to be GMS methinks

[formal fjord]

yeah widow was kinda obsessed with gms

[oak palm]

Yeah i know the citadel just has like a daytime level of lighting and i found that weird

[formal fjord]

pretty sure she was the only weaver still serving her

[formal fjord]

yeah creeped me out too

[oak palm]

Definitely adds a lot to the atmosphere tho

[twin dragon]

The true asshole was gms all along

and the conductors

[twin dragon]

"dream higher being"

what is with this obsession

[oak palm]

The weavers are not to be absolved at all

They were also terrible

[twin dragon]

Yeah

[oak palm]

Basically all 3 of them are at fault

[twin dragon]

Though the weavers were fearmongered into doing such atrocities by gms

conductors had no real reason to be assholes

and yet they were

[whole holly]

Soul and Void are getting boring and Dreams can have more variation

[twin dragon]

you have music dreams now

that are built with silk

[whole holly]

I get that

[oak palm]

Just because they had a reason to do it doesn't excuse the terrible shit they did

But yeah conductors are significantly worse ig

[twin dragon]

That's what im saying

[low oracle]

GMS started all this and wasn't very reasonable. The Weavers passed all the pain on to completely innocent regular bugs. The conductors lacked knowledge of what they were keeping at bay, hence not knowing the dangers of silk use.

[twin dragon]

They created a caste system

[whole holly]

No I means essence like Nightmare Heart, Unn, Radiance , Lifeblood Creature

[twin dragon]

that's already evil enough

[whole holly]

GMS, Weavers and Citadel? Yeah it is cycle

[low oracle]

The Weavers did that already, they were made to be seen as gods. The conductors just took their place.

[twin dragon]

Yes, but there was not much they could benefit from this worship

conductors on the other hand..

Whiteward itself is a crime against bugkind

[oak palm]

We know the weavers wanted to rule

As false monarchs

From the mask maker's dialogue

So they also had some selfish reasons aside from stopping gms

[twin dragon]

Yes, but those stuck to their plan

instead of lavishly indulging AND failing at their job

[low oracle]

The conductors had to keep the citadel running somehow. The weavers left them with too many problems unresolved. To me, the Weavers had the worst impact on other bugs.

[twin dragon]

You could say gms started all of this shit

Though the weavers selfish desires could've been part of their reason to rebel

[low oracle]

Yes, but she only affected the Weavers at first. Morally, the Weavers were the ones to pull everyone into the cycle, not even escaping themselves.

[twin dragon]

Gms destabilized the old kingdoms

Though the timeline isn't very clear

it could've been the citadel

verdania got taken down by the haunting that's for sure

[low oracle]

They need some Pale King guy to just work everything out. He seems to be pretty competent at building up relations and aggreements.

[twin dragon]

About that

did you uh forget

when he usurped an already existing god within the land

and that backfired horrendously

[low oracle]

Three gods already existed. Yet somehow only one decided to attack. And that wasn't even because of the Pale King, it was because the moths left the Radiance. Pale King wouldn't have wanted their worship if he knew of the consequences. The moths definitely could have predicted what would happen.

[stray grove]

He never did that

[random harbor]

Seer - Bringing Essence - Returning with 2400 Essence

So much Essence... So bright.... You truly are the Wielder my tribe so long has dreamed of.
The folk of my tribe were born from a light. Light similar to Essence, similar to that powerful blade, though much brighter still.
They were content to bask in that light and honoured it... for a time.
But another light appeared in our world... A wyrm that took the form of a king.
How fickle my ancestors must have been. They forsook the light that spawned them. Turned their backs to it... Forgot it even.
And so this kingdom was born from that betrayal. But the memories of that ancient light still lingered, hush whispers of faith... Until all of Hallownest began to dream of that forgotten light.
Ah, but what's done is done. And so am I. The Wielder has at last appeared and I've held the memories of my tribe for long enough. It is time for us to be forgotten too.
Don't remember us, Wielder. Don't honour us. We do not deserve it...
Aahh... I'm sorry...
Light... Radiance...
I... remember you.

@kirbbean used /npcs quest name: Seer category: Bringing Essence dialogue: Returning with 2400 Essence

[twin dragon]

The rest were chill like that

[low oracle]

And the "land" was literally created by him. He made it one "land". He united it to become a functioning kingdom.

[stray grove]

Seer calls her ancestors fickle and blames them for turning their backs on Rad

Nothing indicates there was any compulsion for them to do so or that PK violently usurped their land

They also literally tried to kill her

[low oracle]

Could you please be more specific? I don't get your argument. But I do get, that even Seer blames the moths. They knew.

[twin dragon]

There's no argument, you've tore it down congrats

[low oracle]

...

[twin dragon]

Though i'd doubt even a pale king could fix up the vicious cycle that the weavers created

Hornet could do that doe

[stray grove]

He very easily could just not in a way that would be very narratively compelling

[low oracle]

Yeah, I kinda meant before they already established slavery, betrayal, capitalism and endless lies. Hornet doesn't seem competent enough either. After all, I'm referring to a good ending, for everyone.

[twin dragon]

Hornet was not, infact, competent enough

You could pin the blame on the shamans though

[whole holly]

Yeah, it doesn’t make sense narratively

[stray grove]

If PK was around back then he could just have killed GMS it would be very easy

That would solve almost the entire problem

[coral falcon]

Definitely

[low oracle]

Shamans are always assholes and always have been. Hornet on the other hand was simply naive. She didn't even have a plan for what to do against GMS grabbing her. Like, did she think GMS would stay still?

[low oracle]

He would give her a loyal child or some shit like that.

[twin dragon]

I think she'd beaten the shit out of gms enough

for her to show any resistance

Pk would bruteforce gms no doubt

hallownest has some sort of war history

[whole holly]

Yeah or at least pure vessel not even born in abyss

[twin dragon]

which is not elaborated upon anywhere but

uh

[stray grove]

No he’d just kill her

GMS is a monster and PK wouldn’t enable her

She doesn’t want a child she wants a doll

[low oracle]

Pale King doesn't use direct force though. He uses intelligence to defeat power.

[twin dragon]

Nothing a big soul blast can't do

[stray grove]

Not because he wasn’t capable of force but because he favored the peaceful option

[low oracle]

That for some reason made me think of Pale King giving GMS the Collector. Idk why.

[twin dragon]

What

Why would he do that

[stray grove]

He’d probably lead with peace realize it was a complete waste of time and just kill her

[low oracle]

100 000 sawblades, with 200 000 more well on the way.

[stray grove]

PK isn’t afraid of taking action when something compromises the safety of his citizens the only reason he has to come up with an elaborate plan to seal Radiance is because she really can’t be fought directly

[twin dragon]

Pk would rebuild pharloom from the ground up

[stray grove]

GMS doesn’t have that issue and he’s much stronger than her

[twin dragon]

since the entirety of pharloom at that point in time is a flawed system

[stray grove]

I mean outside of the context of the hypothetical he wouldn’t really have much reason to do that

Or to engage with her at all

[low oracle]

Whatever it means to "enable" her, I thought about a solution where everyone has something to gain. I feel that GMS wanted a true daughter but failed at giving them what they wanted. Lace doesn't like existing as a construct and the Weavers wanted freedom for some reason (idk).

[stray grove]

He has his own kingdom and doesn’t care about anywhere else

[twin dragon]

Guess what context we're explicitly talking about

[stray grove]

I know

[low oracle]

Maybe Pale King would just gobble up GMS in wyrm form.

[stray grove]

I don’t think it’s meaningful because it’s not in character for him to act that way

[stray grove]

He doesn’t need to be in Wyrm form

He could just unravel her by focusing

It would genuinely be trivial

[twin dragon]

unless pharloom directly interferes with hallownest's duties

[low oracle]

Yeah, but that would be much funnier.

[twin dragon]

What if gms binds pk

[stray grove]

She wouldn’t be able to

That’s not how bind works she doesn’t have that ability

[low oracle]

Unless of course there was no Radiance. Then he'd still be around, with Hornet and the Weavers remaining in Deepnest. At some point, the Citadel would pose a threat to the Weavers, hence leading him to defend his kingdom. Perhaps even leading a war on Pharloom, so to stop the threat at its very core.

[twin dragon]

she can bind creatures to herself

[stray grove]

No she can’t

[twin dragon]

I'd take strung to serve as point of reference but it's non canon

[stray grove]

You said it yourself

[low oracle]

I think she does have the ability, just not for a literal God. Weavers and Hornet can both "bind", Hornet didn't inheret it from the Pale King.

[spark valve]

Eeeeh haunting is arguably sorta comparable (also the suspicious missing weavers)

[stray grove]

Hornet can Bind other creatures, which is a unique ability she has due to her Wyrm heritage (as Eva tells us). TK could do the same thing

GMS isn’t a Wyrm so she can’t

[stray grove]

I don’t agree that it’s comparable

[low oracle]

"Binding" sounds a lot like something to do with strings, just saying. I don't know what Eva dialogue you are referring to.

[stray grove]

The suspicious missing weavers likely had their silk drained

Nothing implies she bound them

I’m not sure how the haunting is comparable

[spark valve]

The lack of corpses is strange if that’s the case but sure that’s possible

[whole holly]

GMS is higher being, GMS has collected weavers who are successfully brought to her cages remain in citadel lot of people assume GMS binds them and I think so too

[low oracle]

Well, there are no corpses...
And I don't think that Team Cherry would leave them out for no reason.

[spark valve]

The silk heart dialogue about their shells and souls being hers but yes it’s not exactly the same

[whole holly]

They we would see their husk

[stray grove]

I mean she wanted their silk and draining someone’s lifeforce could result in the body turning to dust or whatever

[twin dragon]

Plus there would rlly be no reason for the silk god to only drain the silk from weavers

[stray grove]

Idk why she’d have to consume them in their entirety mind and all

She just needed silk

[twin dragon]

It could help her with its production or something

[whole holly]

That’s pretty much binding

[stray grove]

I mean yeah

[low oracle]

That seems like a pretty stretched explanation, when you could simply say she was binding them. What even speaks against it?

[stray grove]

Eva

[low oracle]

Send please.

[twin dragon]

Eva says that no mortal can do such thing

[spark valve]

It’s their soul

[twin dragon]

Id asume gms is excluded from the bunch

Plus, silk hearts dialogue refer to itself as plural

[spark valve]

Hornet’s thread contains essence other weavers are likely the same

[low oracle]

GMS doesn't seem very mortal to me...
So while Hornet is a demigod/HB because of the PK, GMS is just a God/HB and always has been.

[stray grove]

I mean I’m sure she can do something similar but I don’t think it’s exactly the same as what Wyrms do

[low oracle]

Probably because of the hivemind stuff.

[stray grove]

The malleable nature is a Wyrm thing and Focus/Hornet’s Bind are probably unique

[whole holly]

GMS has control over silk and soul I assume she can bind and when hornet is said to have unique way to bind I assume it means because she is child of pale being wyrm, not specifically something all wyrms have just Her Wyrm father

[low oracle]

Bind - bind silk
What part of this do you not get? The Knight can't bind, because they don't have silk.

It is literally in the name.

[whole holly]

Plus Focus is higher being ability and is safe to assume she has analogous abilities

[stray grove]

TK’s focus has the same effect as Hornet’s unique Bind

[spark valve]

The malleable nature thing isn’t just focus tho it’s potentially possible to focus things without being able to use their crest

[twin dragon]

Bind is also related to binding ones memories

Which is possibly how hornet learns silk skills

[low oracle]

Focus isn't HB ability, since Soul Sanctum could do that too. Only HB (+descendants/ascended) and Shamans can achieve a Pure Focus however.

[stray grove]

Sure I’m not denying that my point is that Hornet’s Bind is nevertheless atypical this isn’t something Weavers can do irrespective of whether or not they’re getting the crest

[whole holly]

GMS likely binds their Silk and maybe memories which would explain it , it makes sense for her to be less limited for weavers

[twin dragon]

You were arguing against gms doing it

[stray grove]

GMS may be able to but there’s not much evidence to suggest it

[low oracle]

Not possibly, it says "bind" as the prompt.

[twin dragon]

Can you read

[low oracle]

There is more evidence suggesting it than not.

[whole holly]

Relative to weavers sure but relative to Pale Beings not really

[stray grove]

There is not really any evidence suggesting it at all

The absent Weavers in the cages is the only thing worth a damn

[twin dragon]

Lack of weaver corpses, strung to silk i guess? Lace dialogue in the abyss

[stray grove]

Strung to Serve isn’t canon so stop bringing it up Lace dialogue is irrelevant

[whole holly]

I didn’t say it was exclusive to higher beings but they can do it I just pointed that out in argument

[low oracle]

Can you read? - The question asks my capability of understanding and comprehending whatever words some guy spits out. Yes, I very well can read. So what?

[spark valve]

I agree hornet’s special in that she can use other crests but that’s not necessarily because she’s the only one who can bind entities

[fresh badger]

Would GMS even need to Bind

[twin dragon]

Very well

[stray grove]

Just ignore him

[fresh badger]

Or could she just silkeater spaghetti slurp the silk out of the weavers

[spark valve]

Her malleable nature just allows her to then use boundaries entities in an extra way

[low oracle]

Okay.

[fresh badger]

Are silkeaters gms's actual 1st attempt at a daughter

Since they have silken sight like she does

[stray grove]

Nah I think she is if Weavers could Bind entities their silk wouldn’t have waned

[low oracle]

So what is it? You seem to be implying something when asking me if I can read.

[twin dragon]

Bold of you to assume that

[stray grove]

Extracting soul from living bugs is a big deal Shamans can’t do it without specific tools either

[spark valve]

I mean hornet’s ability to gain silk on hit might be a wyrm thing idk if that’s the same as focus/binding tho

[twin dragon]

Its a wyrm thing yes

[stray grove]

I think those are pretty interconnected

There are different types of focus

What you’re describing is a quality of Wyrm focus

[whole holly]

It doesn’t make sense for GMS to not be able to Bind/Focus since she is higher being and not limited like weavers are

[stray grove]

Which Hornet inherits

Hence her unique Bind

[foggy fractal]

quick focus, deep focus, thk focus (attack)

[low oracle]

Weavers can produce silk from soul. So when and how was their silk waning? And why would Hornet be more capable of producing silk, yet she has to prove herself more weaver than wyrm.
Even regular ass bugs could get soul at the expense of others.

[spark valve]

Ok but now we’re back to why her bind is unique, it’s not necessarily a quirk of her bind itself

[low oracle]

Who even says her bind is unique? (in HK)

[whole holly]

Not really binding crests might be unique to her but not binding weavers since they were likely directly brought to GMS given what cradle cages suggest and lack of corpses

[stray grove]

I’m not sure I follow

[twin dragon]

Bind is a weaver thing yes

But hornets bind inherits focus properties

[spark valve]

Her using crests and weavers not being able to isn’t necessarily the bind being special so much as her malleable nature letting her actually adopt them once bound

[whole holly]

Spiral Focus, Pure Focus, Hunter’s Crest Focus, Godseeker’s Crest Focus

[spark valve]

Like they absorb the same stuff hornet can just do more with it

[whole holly]

I doubt that , It doesn’t make sense for GMS to not be able to Bind/Focus since she is higher being and not limited like weavers are

[low oracle]

Do you know what "focus" is? Because any bug can do that. A "Pure focus" not so much. Either way, Weavers can focus. That is literally what silk skills are.

[twin dragon]

Talking about the absorption thing focus

[stray grove]

Weavers can’t absorb Soul from other bugs tho
Which seems relevant and important when we’re discussing the effects of an ability that requires you to absorb the soul of another bug

[low oracle]

The bind? As in, binding creatures of significance?

[foggy fractal]

so many to choose from!

[whole holly]

Which presumably GMS has as higher being

[stray grove]

If Weavers could just bind other bugs their silk wouldn’t have waned

[twin dragon]

Binding creatures of significance is inherited from pk

[stray grove]

I would argue the basic functionality of the pale shell is to allow you to focus/bind without obtaining a crest

[low oracle]

-Weavers can’t absorb Soul from other bugs tho -
Soul Master could do it. A regular ass bug could. But the Weavers not???

[spark valve]

Assuming that would let them restore their reserves

[twin dragon]

Interesting how they made up a word for such stuff

Without them being able to do it themselves

[low oracle]

Says who? If you say Eva, send a fucking pic. I've asked this two times already.

[whole holly]

Yeah weavers may be limited , GMS and Hornet isn’t because Hornet can somehow use external soul as silk when binding crests

[twin dragon]

Wiki

[stray grove]

Well the initial claim was that GMS was doing it to replenish her reserves so unless we’re disregarding that idk how that would follow

[twin dragon]

Eva wiki

[low oracle]

I don't want to read 30 different dialogues bro.

[twin dragon]

But reading is good

[stray grove]

It also doesn’t make much sense for absorbing the lifeforce or another bug to not replenish your fading lifeforce like where does it go

Hornet binds shit and turns the soul into more silk

She even gains silk while binding entities

[whole holly]

Let’s separate binding crests and silk skills first guys , one occurs silk which weavers planned for descendant to absorb , other has soul imprint that is stated to be unique to hornet

[stray grove]

The same as when striking enemies

Idk why we’re saying these are two unrelated abilities

[twin dragon]

Btw how did weavers know about crests

[spark valve]

Yeah that’s true

[whole holly]

They have it , since they have proficiency with soul

[low oracle]

I've gotta go now. Imma rather sleep than spend another fucking second awaiting a conclusive answer.
Maybe I should just always answer with "wiki" when anyone asks for my source.
Did you know that Hornet is void?

[whole holly]

Weavers were expected another weaver to bind them so that is weaver skill

[stray grove]

That’s not binding another entity

Not in the same way as what is being discussed anyway

[whole holly]

I would say it is discussed, only binding crests is mentioned to be unique to hornet, that’s almost explicitly what Eva talks about, Hornet can bind soul imprints because of her wyrm nature

Weavers only interacted with Silk because that is how GMS ascended them

[edgy nebula]

my greatest achievement as a karak discusser

[stray grove]

Graig is just a guy he doesn’t write the lore
Also there are Karak specimens in the Memorium

[edgy nebula]

yeah but fuck those guys

also graig is like an ancient wise wizard or something

[whole holly]

Citadel had to have had thriving Karaks and coexisted with memorium for that to happen

[stray grove]

You could make the argument that Khann’s empire fell pre-citadel but the environment didn’t dry up immediately meaning Citadel were able to grab some shit in between

Idk why it really matters

[edgy nebula]

it doesnt but discussing useless timeline facts is all karak has

[spark valve]

Karak falling during the conductor era aligns best with the facts but the game basically explicitly says it doesn’t really matter

[whole holly]

I mean you could argue that memorium was able to revitalize Verdania and Karak partially and that’s why they mutated or failed , but it is speculation

Moss Grotto and Shellwood seems most preserved

[narrow horizon]

guys i've figured it out

zote isn't the son of greyroot or monomon (??) or whatever

zote is the son of his father... and his mother

[twilit crest]

Do we know why shakra doesn’t go into the citadel proper?

[edgy nebula]

genius

[narrow horizon]

cuz nobody needs map there (idk cuz she's too girlboss for capitalistic greed + her cool master lady prolly wouldn't want to)

[plain gazelle]

she does, after she finds her master she'll help you beat high halls arena

[narrow horizon]

other than to help Hornet that one time

[plain gazelle]

she's following her master's trail and her master never went into the citadel

[twilit crest]

I had no idea wow

Well thanks chat

[twilit crest]

I knew why mechanically I just wondered if there was a lore reason

Siri pls words like lore exist

[narrow horizon]

her master never went there because girlboss queen slay doesn't need to go to that nasty citadel

[lone folio]

You did it.. you figured it out

One small step for HK lore and a big leap for humanity

[narrow horizon]

🙏🙏

[muted lantern]

She also comes off as disgusted by the citadels machines, so she wouldn't want to go in.

[narrow horizon]

yeah

[ocean crown]

She can for the high halls gauntlet iirc but she really doesn’t need to. She was only there fore her master

And then after to protect bellheart

[twilit crest]

Oh fr?

She probably doesn’t like ventricas

[edgy nebula]

oh yeah she says that in the ventrica pin description i think

[muted lantern]

Funnily enough the line im referring to is hornet describing the ventricas to shakra and she says it's disgusting

[twilit crest]

Same brain

[oak palm]

The line also implies a greater disdain for the citadel

It's roughly like "What you describe sounds just as hideous and unnatural as anything else in that place"

[twilit crest]

Oh yeah I think I remember this

If she doesn’t like citadel tech then I wonder if she will be joining us in pharloom bay

Kinda doubt it now

[muted lantern]

I want us to see shakra in pharloom bay, get excited to finally get a map, and then her head twists backward and it's a fucking nosk.

[twilit crest]

Someone get this mf a job in Sydney right now

[muted lantern]

the white roses from the cradle might be these ones? maybe a gift from the truce with nyleth?

[dry compass]

could Undercrank shell and macebug be the same shell i mean look at them

nvm

[south estuary]

do we have a clear timeframe in when widow haunted bellhart?

[muted lantern]

Oh god, you can find garm fighting valiantly against the black threads in blasted steps in act 3 before he turns....

[muted lantern]

It's presumably been like that for a while but probably not like, years.

Frey has been locked in her shop since the town got haunted, untouched, same with scrounge, so likely hasnt been long enough for either to run out of food.

[ionic stump]

Atleast a few days in hk’s time

[plain gazelle]

i feel like it was very recent, like in response to hornet entering pharloom. widow's dialogue:

"Oh! Ohhhh! They shall join... Union upon your thread... A gift, for your waking. A world strung to serve...

Ohhhh! She is here! The rare birthling! Precious child of Wyrm and Weaver!"

"a gift for your waking" = GMS is expecting hornet to wake her, and the second dialogue shows widow is aware of who hornet is ahead of time

[muted lantern]

I think it's more like months or weeks

[craggy smelt]

long enough for Frey to clean out her stock of goods

[dry compass]

1-2 days before Hornet arrived

most likely

[muted lantern]

okay so whats in this giant thing, if the others are to hold nectar? is this just a giant nectar container, or maybe its just a water barrel?

[robust wagon]

Probably to hold more nectar

It's like a wine cellar

[cursive sinew]

That place creeped me out when I first got there man 😭 😭

[muted lantern]

It's just like, a collosal size for whats essentially a barrel of wine.

[robust wagon]

They're big barrels...

[muted lantern]

I guess that explains why he has endless nectar with no known supplier

Theres a lot of variety in sizes of the barrels, i wonder if it's all the same type of nectar or different nectars for each

mb he stores the cheap stuff in the big ones

[muted lantern]

Who just ghost pinged me?

or is discord bugged lol

[robust wagon]

No someone replied to you

[muted lantern]

did it get deleted?

i only saw a ping.

but no message

[stray fog]

I did

I asked you which area the barrels were from

[muted lantern]

Oh it's under halfway house, when getting the premium nectar

For taste of pharloom

[twin dragon]

What the fuck is the great gourmand

[muted lantern]

Genuinely I think they are just a wild animal, maybe some conductors beloved pet. Its needolin dialogue imply it has very little intelligence and only cares about eating, it seems a lot less sapient than most haunted bugs.

[twin dragon]

Could be some conductor's weird exotic pet

But we don't rlly know we don't get much

[muted lantern]

I think it's very funny, mergwin treats them like this super refined noble, singing about how refined their taste is and then their needolin dialogue sounds like a really hungry radiance; Speaking in all caps with ellipses.

[twin dragon]

Mergwin's a crazy old guy

[craggy smelt]

big tick

Mergwin says he's the last left who appreciates them

None are left now who venerate them as they deserve, save for the loyal, lonely bug who stands before you.

implies that there were more followers before

some weird Citadel sub-culture

(maybe the Gourmand ate all the others...)

[twin jolt]

is it just me or does revek look hella similar to the coral bugs? i thought they were the same species at first

[muted lantern]

Yeah he and some other spirits glade guy look a lot like guys from karak. Its very interesting. Not sure what to make of it tho.

[nimble tide]

https://tenor.com/view/hornet-silksong-dance-hornet-dance-hornet-silksong-gif-3654151901745923854

[whole holly]

i always think about one thing, but it is hypothetical

[twin dragon]

please don't

[whole holly]

i think about the fact that Hornet can bind Soul Master in theory

[whole holly]

lol

[whole holly]

does she become Silk Master?

i also think about another thing, will we get Cut Spider in Sea of Sorrows DLC, i want that Spider to have Plasmified Silk, kinda opposite of weavers

[heavy gyro]

It would probably be like the shaman crest

[whole holly]

i agree with that

I wonder what crest hornet will get in SoS

[twin dragon]

fish

[whole holly]

Lame ass answer

[twin dragon]

But fish

stop plasmiumglazing

[young dune]

https://vxtwitter.com/Leg_dinner/status/2005079449067520396?s=20

Leg eater (@Leg_dinner)

New Sea of Sorrow crest?

▶ Play video

vxTwitter / fixvx • GIF · Dec 28, 2025, 12:52 AM

[twin dragon]

i want water knight, not slop blue infection

[delicate jungle]

i want second sinner

[whole holly]

Blue Infection will overtake everything, i wish it competed with haunting in citadel's peak instead of replacing it

[twin dragon]

nuh

[rapid bloom]

He could have been some official in the Citadel, we don't really know what the Gourmand is, do we?

He could have been at first the one that tested the food which the pilgrims would later consume

He is not a pilgrim

[whole holly]

we ARE getting Lifeblood, even if it wasn't in Pharloom Bay somehow it would still spread in wormways and we would see it in moss grotto and shellwood

[twin dragon]

Yeah

unfortunately or fortunately

depending on how hard they cook

[whole holly]

they will cook it but i also didn't really like getting Lifeblood turned into Infection, it feels like Retcon

[twin dragon]

I'm neutral about it

it's a decent explanation as to why it's taboo

but the whole joni thing also doesn't seem to add up

[whole holly]

yeah, but Joni was heretic i guess

[twin dragon]

I mean the body deformation part

Maybe she's some sort of chosen one by the weird lifeblood thing

[whole holly]

yeah, that's true but Alchemist did inject it

[twin dragon]

true

[whole holly]

yeah, she likely revered Lifeblood rather than exploit it unlike Alchemist did

[twin dragon]

Maybe joni had some sort of connection to it

worship

[whole holly]

Joni most likely consumed it in lower amounts, but it is interesting that she created Charm called Joni's Blessing and Salubra gave Salubra's Blessing, it is weird but Blessing has religious undertones

[twin dragon]

Isn't joni lifeblood from the inside out?

[heavy gyro]

Joni's blessing replaced vital fluids with lifeblood

[twin dragon]

Also how did weavers know about crests if having a malleable nature is something only select hbs can do?

[whole holly]

Yeah but I think it was blessing or some ability she received rather than it being injected into her bloodstream

[whole holly]

You don’t have to have multiple crests to understand crests, Weavers may have sensed Soul Imprits

[twin dragon]

from what or who exactly though

[heavy gyro]

Mask makers also understand crests

[twin dragon]

I could see why they do

but weavers?

[astral trout]

A theory could be that they have studied the biological and personality effects of certain bugs and made a theory that something like crests exist, weaver have already shown themselves to be capable scientists with machines like silkshot, anklets and farsight.

some crests do minorly change biology in horent like beasts crest reaction to healing

[whole holly]

because they have some form of knowledge of silk and by extension soul, it is not that shocking they understand soul imprints in their limited way which eva comments on

[twin dragon]

Hm, could be

[whole holly]

but it doesn't make sense why shamans wouldn't understand it, Shaman Corpse we bind is regarded as Great Power not necessarily soul imprint

[twin dragon]

One thing can have several definitions

[whole holly]

i know but it doesn't make sense for shamans not to sense our multitude of Soul Imprints

[twin dragon]

Eva describes such as a speciality of hers

[twin dragon]

caretaker immediately recognizes ts

[whole holly]

yeah, i guess, they can see hornet acquired new nature

[whole holly]

but i think in Sea of Sorrows , Crest will be plasmified, upon binding hornet gets overtaken with Lifeblood and has to get cured to unlock new crest somewhat like cursed crest, who knows maybe Plasmium will awaken Root Parasite

[twin dragon]

that's hella repetitive

[whole holly]

we need Lifeblood thing wrapped up honestly before i get fatigue too

[whole holly]

not particularly, it will only happen 2 times

[astral trout]

maybe that would be like an evolved version of witch crest like hunter

[twin dragon]

Yeah that's enough