sk-lore

[flint wadi]

unless of course you guys imply that the lore is inherently trivial which, lol, sure

[pure belfry]

Seth losing his memories and seeing Pharloom through fresh eyes kinda represents how it might be for irl Seth to experience Silksong through his own eyes maybe?

[flint wadi]

(could explain why silksong doesnt do it very well)

[hushed shadow]

its such a sweet tribuite idk how anyone could hate it

[sinful nimbus]

To any player who isn't knowledgeable about Seth's out of universe origins the sad music is going to come off as completely jarring and inappropriate

[sterile jacinth]

That makes sense. I don’t know if Seth even knows about sister splinter. He seems extremely isolated

[solar tapir]

Because unn isnt pale being, and all pale beings desire worship

[hushed shadow]

and yknow what? thats okay

[sterile jacinth]

Yeaaah it’s not about his past it’s who he chose to become after

[slow olive]

Oh! I was just playing out a scenario of seth actively hunting stickbugs sentinel style then jumping off before hornet gets close to him as a way to foreshadow his appearance as nyleth's shrine guardian. Just some musings on how to improve seth's presence in the game 😅

[hushed shadow]

this is for seth not for anyone else

[sinful nimbus]

Dude

[flint wadi]

lore doesnt matter guys

[opaque pier]

The radiance also isnt pale tho

[flint wadi]

pack it up

[solar tapir]

She is pale

[steep talon]

ah, yeah Lumpy was just saying: "It would be cool to have Seth defend against stickbugs" and I replied with not sure that would work

[sterile jacinth]

I think personal choice is a big theme in silksong and that reflects in Seth too. You’re seeing him how he chooses to be

[hushed shadow]

when it comes to a tribuite yeah the criticism rly doesnt 😭 sorry

[flint wadi]

why did you bother with defending it though

[solar tapir]

Gms Pk and Rad are pale

[opaque pier]

Thats news to me

[gentle aspen]

rad isn’t a pale being

[slow olive]

Not really defend but like actively hunting them

[solar tapir]

huh

[flint wadi]

could be a tribute AND be an organic addition to the game, how many straws did you prepare for this

[sinful nimbus]

Saying a character isn't compelling isn't an attack on the idea of adding a tribute or Seth himself its just saying the character isn't well written

[steep talon]

yeah i getcha, Still I think it would be weird for Seth to leave Nyleth or the shrine I guess without defence

[ornate forge]

People do be kinda miserable

[opaque pier]

I thought only pk wl and gms were

[gentle aspen]

this is true

[solar tapir]

What is rad then

[gentle aspen]

a higher being

[terse warren]

Just a higher being

[slow olive]

I do see how weird it is that seth is fighting off choristers (is that what theyre called) when there isnt really a reason for gms to be looking for nyleth

[lethal burrow]

its not

[solar tapir]

I always thought she is pale

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t really think his backstory is the point. I think his character is about who he chooses to be afterwards. I do wish we got more lore but I can understand

[sinful nimbus]

The only person who actually brought up the IRL backstory wasn't me or anyone else saying its not a good character

[terse warren]

Fml 🐌 myself now

[steep talon]

i think Seth is a pretty organic addition to the game

[ornate forge]

A particularly strong higher being though

[foggy fractal]

what does fml mean

[terse warren]

Fuck my life

[solar tapir]

Make sence bc she also desire worship

[ornate forge]

Fuck my life

[sinful nimbus]

Well what he chooses to be afterwards isn't meaningful if we don't know what he did beforehand

[foggy fractal]

💔 fuck my stupid chungus life !!!

[sinful nimbus]

You can't contrast anything with that

[pure belfry]

More like "Not every character needs lore and can be a good character without it."

Literally, like I mentioned earlier, everyone still liked Quirrel even before knowing his lore. That means lore isn't the always a determining factor in the quality of a character.

[flint wadi]

we already said why he isnt, theres not enough things elaborated about him in a way that ties him to where he is

[terse warren]

Also not very meaningful if he has 0 memories at all

[sterile jacinth]

I think the point is he doesn’t care either. Like that’s behind him and he’s choosing to start anew

[flint wadi]

nah lore doesnt matter its a tribute <3

[sinful nimbus]

But he didn't

[flint wadi]

who cares about immersion

[hushed shadow]

he isnt that well written and you can criticize it ! either way i think its okay for him to have sad music no matter his writing . because either way even adding him into the game is an extra mile, most games probalby wouldve just added a tribuite to the end credits only

[sinful nimbus]

Seth got amnesia (also unexplained) he didn't decide to move on

[sterile jacinth]

Where are you getting this?

[slow olive]

Fell into the waters of forgetfulness

[pure belfry]

that's why I just said. I thought you were being sarcastic in your originial comment.

[sinful nimbus]

He literally doesn't remember anything from his time as Shrine Guardian, read his dialogue

[lethal burrow]

well the only person is still bringing it up is you so seems like you're still interested in the subject

[terse warren]

He literally says his first memory was waking up by a lake (the one which you throw him in) and that he was just born

[sterile jacinth]

Yes I know. But he also says he doesn’t really care who he was before

[ornate forge]

Does anyone have a degree in creative writing here I wonder

[slow olive]

Theyre being sarcastic with those replies

[terse warren]

I don't think he knows who he was before

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah he doesn’t. I also don’t think he cares to find out and that’s ok

[terse warren]

So it's your headcanon

[graceful grail]

He also says new body, is that accurate or only new mind?? Or is it acctual seth in seth bugs body??

[sterile jacinth]

I think there’s some dialogue that supports it but I could be misremembering

[foggy fractal]

he says "I suppose I am indeed! I was born into this world not long ago, waking beside a lake with only this weapon laying beside me."
that or we assume he's hiding something

[slow olive]

Isnt there dialogue about what he decides to do after waking up with no memories

[gentle aspen]

I think it’d be pretty fucked up if it was meant to be “actual seth in seth bug’s body”

[sterile jacinth]

I doubt he’s hiding anything

[pure belfry]

Why would Hornet need to know Seth's past? She wouldn't gain anything from prying into it and doesn't have any incentive for bursting Seth's bubble and telling him what happened either.

[solar tapir]

alr I refreshed my memory, rad is more some essence entity and not pale at all

[sterile jacinth]

Yes exactly

[solar tapir]

my bad

[hushed shadow]

wait on the topic of hornet prying into things i love hornet but why did she pry into the green princes memories and kill him LMAO

[gentle aspen]

She doesn’t need to know anything it would just be nice for the character to have more depth or be more present in the story

[foggy fractal]

so his line about being born into this world not long ago is true therefore he doesn't know anything about his past

[sterile jacinth]

My theory is that it’s like ending a chapter of a book. Like I bet it was sort of a mercy to green prince as well. He needs rest. It’s only with his death that Verdania starts to regrow

[flint wadi]

who said it had to come as an inquiry, it could come up and revealed in an encounter oR extra dialogue
youre approaching this from a very rigid perspective, hornet doesnt have anything to gain from a solid 30% loredrops in pharloom, yet she goes after them either way (COUGH COUGH LOST VERDANIA COUGH COUGH)

[sterile jacinth]

Yea

[hushed shadow]

ohh yes that makes a lot of sense actually , watching it happen in game is just really funny though i was like "YOU KILL HIM ???" after beating clover dancers 😭

[ornate forge]

I think he wanted to die. He wanted to be with his love in his home. Same with Karmelita. She was elderly and frail and was going to die anyway. Living out one last fight in her prime before she died was kind of a mercy.

[edgy nebula]

canonically hornet only kills green prince/the 4th heart for a test of strength of challenges soon to come

[flint wadi]

amazing

[sterile jacinth]

Same with Karmelita. Their times are over and their deaths have been overdue. It’s time to start anew

[gentle aspen]

which is so funny its stupid

“Why’d you doom far fields”

“Sorry little shit I needed to know if I was really that guy”

[lethal burrow]

how did she know that was going to happen though lol

[pure belfry]

I don't view Verdania the same way I view Seth because there's not really a reason to go to Verdania unless you do it for the Heart Quest. I agree it feels pointless killing Green Prince if you do it after.

[edgy nebula]

literally already beat a god and decided to just kill a guy

[slow olive]

Tbf karmelita was lowkey asking for it wasnt she

[sinful nimbus]

What changed

[gentle aspen]

not really

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t know. But that’s what ended up happening. I think a lot of the themes are ending of an era and the start of new life

[sinful nimbus]

Fake conservation activist

[slow olive]

Wasn karmelita saying something about hornet taking her on in her prime

[flint wadi]

point is, hornet can learn about the world in more ways than directly asking them, and even then, her "prying" into things is not an unheard of thing when she literally does it with the green pricne

[gentle aspen]

Also its not like karmelita has a choice in the matter anyways

[ornate forge]

She was this huge hulking ant queen. Barely breathing. Yes she wanted to die reliving a fight from her prime.

[steep talon]

Well okay, I think he's an organic addition to the game. He's a strong bug that was chosen by some voice, most likely Nyleth. Even after loosing his memories he retains his combat skills. I think there is some room to theorize whether the voice gave him power or not, and how it might be connected to his memories being taken away. He's also just a great boss, the hearts I think try to experiment with the types of challenges for the player, to not get repetetive. Khann is a long gauntlet with a middling difficulty boss at the end, Nyleth is two bosses in a row, and Karm is a small gauntlet with a very difficult boss at the end. Like i dont get it, if it's not spelled out in the game, maybe we should continue to theorize and ask question instead of just "whoops, not an organic addition" or whatever

[gentle aspen]

yes but that doesn’t mean she wanted to die or knew she was gonna die

[sterile jacinth]

She was going to die anyways. The Skarr are practically gone. Far fields was going to die anyways. The time to start life again is now

[pure belfry]

My point was her "prying into Verdania" is a bad example for you to use because I don't think it makes sense either.

[hushed shadow]

doesnt hornet clarify she needs her heart like when they first meet 😭

[terse warren]

Hornet says that actually methinks ?

[lethal burrow]

-# khann is great tho

[ornate forge]

I like to think that as hornet delves into her memory she passes away not because hornet has like murdered her or anything. Like she was huge and struggling to breath

[steep talon]

yeeh. Middling difficulty not middling boss fight

[gentle aspen]

Only if you have elegy of the deep when you talk to her and don’t have all three hearts already

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah. Karmelitas time is over. It’s time to start anew

[flint wadi]

its in the game, is it not? we're judging on what was showcased in the game and lost verdania is indeed something thats a canon part of the story

hornet would indeed pry into things

[terse warren]

!wiki

[oak meadow]

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Hollow_Knight_Wiki

Hollow Knight Wiki

Hollow Knight Wiki

Affiliates

Individual Affiliates

[foggy fractal]

which line y'all want I got the page ready

[terse warren]

I

Forgot

To add Karmelita's name

[gentle aspen]

you’re gonna be a really shitty mod

[slow olive]

Shame

[terse warren]

I'm sorry 😭

[lethal burrow]

The standards aren't high

[foggy fractal]

which line ragh

[ornate forge]

She was a good Queen.

[gentle aspen]

ok

[terse warren]

After getting Everbloom

[sterile jacinth]

Was yeah :( she’s past her prime

[pure belfry]

I don't view canon the same way you do. We can definitely assume now not even all of HK's endings are canon, and yet they're all in that game

[flint wadi]

they are though lol

[gentle aspen]

Pale beast... bringing ruin... we had sensed it... you writing, harsh, our final fate...
If power... you come seeking... mine is faded.... mortal... time taken...
Hornet: Great one, I come not to see you as you are, rather I would know you as were, before the pale monarch, when once your heart beat bright and brave.
Kcha! Then see me... beast... Those distant memories... Mine once was power... wild... proud...

[hushed shadow]

karmaleita is my fav boss because its like a closure to her story

while the others kinda feel like you just intrude their memories

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah I feel the same with green prince and Kahnn

[foggy fractal]

mine is structured better har har har

Karmelita:
Pale beast... bringing ruin... we had sensed it... you writing, harsh, our final fate...
If power... you come seeking... mine is faded.... mortal... time taken...

Hornet:
Great one, I come not to see you as you are, rather I would know you as were, before the pale monarch, when once your heart beat bright and brave.

Karmelita:
Kcha! Then see me... beast... Those distant memories... Mine once was power... wild... proud...

[flint wadi]

theyre only whatifs if you factor silksong but from the perspective of hk alone, all endings are valid and can happen

[terse warren]

Oh damn

Hornet is an asshole once again

[edgy nebula]

khann is cool but he couldve been far better

[hushed shadow]

women cant do anything omg

[sterile jacinth]

Their grip on the land, their frustration, is still there. You stop that. You let life begin again

[pure belfry]

If we're talking about if they're canon to Silksong or not, it's definitely not possible for all of HK's endings to be canon to Silksong

[hushed shadow]

chat raging in 3... 2.... 1....

[terse warren]

The word Far is now giving me whiplash

[cedar skiff]

coral tower should have had an exploration segment like verdania

i did love the gauntlet but its kinda eh

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah I agree 😔

[cedar skiff]

nyeths a fake ass boss

[hushed shadow]

i rly wish it did . and less gauntlets too

[steep talon]

khann is cool but he couldve been far fields better

[hushed shadow]

also over the garden wlal pfp omg hia

[lethal burrow]

this is at least better than the dreamers that we know not that much about.

monomon? She was sort of smart and also a teacher and a historian.

lurien? bro watched 👁️👁️

harrah is at least at least given a lot of substance, but like, compare the hearts to the dreamers and I think they're not that bad

[cedar skiff]

karmelita feels like the only true one besides the intended to be optional green prince

khann and nyleth are just kinda there man

[gentle aspen]

We know a decent amount about monomon

[cedar skiff]

what does he even DO?

[steep talon]

she's the "anti wanderers crest" boss

[cedar skiff]

I LOVEEE OTGW

[sterile jacinth]

I think their frustration and pain still affects the land and you’re there to put them to rest for real

[hushed shadow]

the fact that all the dreamers were originally gonna look like lurien is so funny to be bro THAT ISNT HERRAH 😭

[flint wadi]

youre bringing up endings which, sure, can be omitted for one reason or another, but theres nothing that omits lost verdania from the story

this is a nothing statement, lost verdania is canon to silksong and whatever it brings about is still part of the story now

[cedar skiff]

its the time of the year....

[edgy nebula]

khann? he was the strongest warrior pre-gms, presumably

[hushed shadow]

ME TOOOO I NJEED TO REWATCH IT FOR HALLOWEEN

[slow olive]

Khann is a strong bug thats not pale or high in nature but still was able to conquer half of pharloom

[foggy fractal]

3 inconspicuous dreamers:

[edgy nebula]

strong enough to put half of pharloom in a chokehold and command his legions

[terse warren]

Bro all he does is move coral around he's not him

[lethal burrow]

Honestly, his design would've probably been easier to retcon into a weaver

[steep talon]

all over the garden wall fans during fall: "Hmm you know, that Dante guy was kinda onto something"

[lethal burrow]

I don't really know what else there is beyond what I just said

[edgy nebula]

hes literally a military leader, hes also fucking prophesized by his people

[cedar skiff]

eh the exposition we get is kinda shallow is what i meant

theres so much to karmelita and again nyleth is a fake ass boss and coral tower feels a little empty

[flint wadi]

his relation to nyleth is unexplained which weakens them both as additions

obviously seth could comeup as a completely unrelated character but hes tied to NYLETH, and she already is very flimsy and isolated from the rest of the story as theres not even foreshadowing for her in comparison to the other 3 hearts, it contributes to her feeling very alien to pharloom and seth feel jarringly unexplained enough

[lethal burrow]

hornet looks so funky in this art

[cedar skiff]

wanderers crest is a fake crest for noobs

[edgy nebula]

fair, we shouldve gotten more mention of khann, more than the other hearts, he literally ruled half of pharloom

[pure belfry]

I only consider Lost Verdania to make sense at all if done for the Heart Quest.

Otherwise I think it's a mistake on the game's part for Hornet to pry into Green Prince's memories and kill him for no reason other than cut out his beating heart and keep it as a trophy.

[cedar skiff]

yesss exactl

[silk dirge]

khann is a pretty obvious reference to genghis khan i think

[sterile jacinth]

Let’s not do crest discourse in the lore channel

[flint wadi]

it doesnt matter what you consider its in the game and thus can be fairly judged as part of it lol

[edgy nebula]

he doesnt seem very tyrantish though

[lethal burrow]

he's tied to her in a pretty obvious way.

She had guardians that protected her or her order and he is the last one

[cedar skiff]

its not discourse its a fact

[steep talon]

so we should theorize about them then?

[silk dirge]

his achievement is literally called tyrant

[drifting apex]

what is he trying to say?

[terse warren]

Clearly I was being humorous

[cedar skiff]

nyleth is just empty in general lol

[sterile jacinth]

Dude please don’t

[terse warren]

Me when metatext

[foggy fractal]

yeah she looked a little different back then

[cedar skiff]

nyleth doesnt even really have a pre established connection to shellwood before act 3

[steep talon]

Hornet remarks that it would have beem hard to live under khann if you dont like fighting

[hushed shadow]

first child of the weavers i assume ?

[terse warren]

Pure weavers I assume

[flint wadi]

hornet killing gp after 3 hearts is just as canon as her using his heart for the ritual

[gentle aspen]

She was well aware of the vessel project and how it was meant to work, she was aware of the dichotomy between PK and Rad’s abilities and possibly had an attempt to deal with the infection herself

[gentle aspen]

“First Child” = weavers

[steep talon]

feels pretty tyrant-ish to me

[edgy nebula]

his tyranny may have been more nuanced, as he states he wants to "free them all" and he also says to "hone yourself" and "defy your limits

[gentle aspen]

First children of GMS

[hushed shadow]

this is definitely my favorite hornet render

[pure belfry]

and I'm saying I think it was an oversight because what valid reason does Hornet have to invade his memories, kill him, and keep his heart as a trophy in her home? it doesn't make sense.

[flint wadi]

in fact its MORE canon because the game intends for you to clear the other 3 first

[lethal burrow]

Weavers are the first children and everything else should then become clear

[gentle aspen]

why would it be an oversight???

[flint wadi]

its.still.part.of.the.game.

[edgy nebula]

her forehead slowly shrinks

[ornate forge]

He only takes orders from a first child. The first children of GMS were the Weavers. Therefore he only takes orders from Weavers.

[flint wadi]

hornet killed green prince and kept his heart as a trophy

[drifting apex]

yeah but what is he trying to say with that line? my english isnt too good

[edgy nebula]

as her head gets smaller she gets ruder and stupider

[gentle aspen]

You can do all four regardless there’s even special dialogue for if you already have three hearts and go after a fourth for karmelita

[sterile jacinth]

I think it’s more like laying him to rest. His pain is still effecting Verdania. Doing that lets it regrow

[pure belfry]

something being part of the game doesn't exclude it from being a mistake or an oversight

[gentle aspen]

vaultkeepers are high upon the totem pole basically, they are high up in the citadel’s ranks. Weavers are higher

[slow olive]

Is there special dialogue if u leave khann or nyleth as the last hearts?

[flint wadi]

its a pretty big mistake then

[gentle aspen]

don’t think so

there aren’t npcs you can talk to and those bosses don’t have dialogue irl

[slow olive]

Oh true

[lethal burrow]

things she knows is not the same as characterization or knowledge about her and that last part is only a theory albeit one I've not heard before

[flint wadi]

cool symbolically but from the perspective of the player its just her killing him for no fucking reason lets be honest LOL

[edgy nebula]

woulda been cool to see khann as an npc, i feel like he'd be a sort of mentor to hornet ngl

[terse warren]

They only take order from weavers ig

[past cypress]

Green Prince: Green Prince has clearly shown to be extremely nihilistic in the game and would starve to death in Sinner's Road or in Verdania if Hornet didn't intervene. Her intervention allows him to regain those memories and he lashes out violently so Hornet kills him in self-defense.

Karmelita: A great test for Lost Lace. Karmelita herself was clearly far too old and weak to actually do anything with the Far Fields so dead or not she was not going to regroup the Skarrs.

Khann and Nyleth are dead (?) already

[sterile jacinth]

Yeah that’s why I’m theorizing lol. I was confused about it but it made me think

[lethal burrow]

"his tyranny may have been more nuanced" is crazy out of context though you have to admit

[edgy nebula]

true yeah

[pure belfry]

in your mind, what incentive does Hornet actually have for killing Green Prince and keeping his heart after the quest is over? what valid explanation could there be. Genuinely curious.

[gentle aspen]

knowledge on what she knows is knowledge about her

She’s a teacher and archived a bunch of stuff on Hallownest

[sterile jacinth]

It’s laying him to rest. His pain is still effecting Verdania and Hornet doing that allows him to rest. Verdania only regrows after

[gentle aspen]

Idk she wants to prove her strength same as karmelita

[lethal burrow]

The way I justified to myself is that you grant him the mercy of dying with his lover in the land of his memory as opposed to dying alone in the grave of his kingdom

[drifting apex]

woah so the soundtracks we hear in choral chambers is what it would sound like if the choir played it if they were able to play it?

[hushed shadow]

1. who knows when she will need another heart ? maybe itll be useful when verdania regrows

2. hornet yearned for love but none of her mates matched her lifespan. maybe the conjoined heart is a symbol for somehting she thought she'd never obtain

[past cypress]

#sk-lore message

[lethal burrow]

it's true another heart would be good for nutrients on a long walk. Who knows when she'll find another nut-meg bar

[flint wadi]

just picking up what the game put down, hornet got into his head out of curiosity, pries into his private memories and kills him going off her own judgement for some vague bullshit reason that allows verdania to regrow

[ornate forge]

Nom Nom hearts

[lethal burrow]

she kills him in self-defence

[flint wadi]

clearly, hornet lied
clearly, hornet did not permit green prince his moment LOL

[lethal burrow]

that is true she thought she was sneaky with it

[pure belfry]

Maybe it'll be useful once Verdania regrows.
Isn't she pretty resolved to leave Pharloom once it's saved? She even says as much to Lace and the Bellhart citizens. She's not staying in Pharloom so why keep the heart?

[flint wadi]

which doesnt jive from ludonarrative perspective cause dying in the memories is not fatal (which is something 100% of people will know)

so it comes across as her deliberately seeking out the clover dancers and killing them

no good reason kek

[drifting apex]

whats he trying to say?

[slow olive]

Ok im not sure about self defense. The purpose of elegy of the deep is for her to enter memories of strong bugs of the past to get their heart right? So hornet using elegy of the deep on green prince means she's entering the memory with the assumption that shes gonna take his heart

[hushed shadow]

hes so confusing bro tell him to go back to hallownest 😭

[pure belfry]

which is why it doesn't make sense if you do it post-heart quest

[rugged spear]

i genuinely believe the 4th heart thing boils down to "yeah you can do this but why the fuck?" and thats no moral justification despite Hornet's dialogue about it

[hushed shadow]

maybe she assumed she could help him, she helped many people who thought they had no purpose (second sentinel, pinstress, fleatopia, etc.) she was clearly resonating with him before he decided to attack, and from then on it was self defense

[rugged spear]

and that GP was basically the morally worst route you can go to at the price of being able to skip one of the bosses

[slow olive]

I do have to agree hornet doing elegy of the deep on green prince without any prompt does feel disconnected from the main plot. Feels more like an easter egg.

[gentle aspen]

pretty much

[lethal burrow]

The Pontiff found some truth in the great melody that made him die or something, maybe he killed himself.

[flint wadi]

its a part of the game that was intended by tc to be likely discovered AFTER you clear the hearts that were highlighted by the quest and hinted at by the shamans

so it being an honest oversight makes even less sense

[drifting apex]

Ah makes sense

[pure belfry]

The real reason Hornet kills Green Prince is actually she's homophobic

[spark valve]

Karmelita is arguably worse as a fourth heart

[lethal burrow]

maybe we have to accept that hornet isn't a very good person....

[slow olive]

The problem with this is the lack of dialogue to suggest that this is actually the purpose

[foggy fractal]

hello tammo

[flint wadi]

yeah karmelita is even funnier LOL

[lethal burrow]

We need to make a big list of all the morally questionable things hornet has done

[spark valve]

They didn’t even try to come up with an excuse

[ornate forge]

Idk Karmelita is probably better as a fourth heart. It's a mercy killing. Fighting her in her prime and she passes away during the memory.

[foggy fractal]

haha karmelita I need that heart for completion purposes now let me in your dreams - Hornet

[slow olive]

It runs in the family

[lethal burrow]

holy shit pharloom is Canada now you're allowed to legally murder old people

[rugged spear]

I dont think theres any moral justification to doing all of it, its just the video game equivalent of doing the evilest path just because YOU as the player has the option to

and killing Green Prince is (how i see it at least) is "Ok player you can skip out one of these bosses if you dont wanna go through them, just know youre being a massive fucking dick" kinda situation

[pure belfry]

In what way is it implied you're supposed to find it after? You actually get the Crawfather summons before completing the Heart Quest so you're going to be in that area of Greymoor anyway and see the entrance.

[flint wadi]

i didnt lol

its not clear whatsoever

its at the very corner and you are focusing on the mound atop the craw lake

and later youre likely already gone from there

[rugged spear]

Lorewise realistically I dont think Hornet would actually do all 4 hearts out of choice

[slow olive]

Yea but they could at least add some dialogue to suggest that its a possible route to take

[flint wadi]

plus people might just prioritize THE MAIN QUEST over a side one

[pure belfry]

the entrance isn't hidden tho if I remember. Just a clearly open path

[hushed shadow]

i mean she tries to ease his guilt before he takes offense so

[ornate forge]

I mean yeah. Both situations whether you need her heart or not its basically a mercy killing. She is the elderly leader of her people and she laments on her youth. She is barely breathing this giant hulking queen. Also I don't think you murder her not in the same way as the Green Prince. I think if you beat her in the memory she just passes away because of her age.

[hushed shadow]

she coudlve definitely worded it better but she didnt go in there intending to kill him 😭

[pure belfry]

might be wrong on that but I think once it opens in act 3 it's clearly visible. Not a hidden wall or anything

[flint wadi]

its off camera, theres no reason to beat around the bush and explore around the mound when its implied to be within it

and again, crawfather summon isnt even a guarantee encounter for everyone, theres a solid percentage of people who missed it
none of this compares to having a quest entry in the fucking journal and a literal marker on the map

[flint wadi]

its OFFCAMERA

its tucked away in an area you have no reason to explore

youre going INTO the mound, a place that was established to be the craw's nesting ground

[slow olive]

Makes it seem even more of an easter egg that u can take green prince's heart

[flint wadi]

i genuinely would not discover verdania if not for unintentionally looking it up

[gentle aspen]

I found it naturally

[flint wadi]

its proximity to craw lake does nothing lol

[gentle aspen]

guess you’re not a real explorer fr

[flint wadi]

fr fr

[pure belfry]

but the actual function it has in game is an alternative option for the heart quest. That is the only thing you can use the heart for and the only thing you actually gain from Verdania

[flint wadi]

even though i did the rest of the content blind...

including the stupid masks

[steel turret]

And all that glaze isn’t even true, Steel Seer Ji’s masters pack up higher beings on the regular

[rugged spear]

I didnt find jack shit cuz the stupid Craws didnt summon me

[pure belfry]

so from a gameplay perspective, there literally is no reason to do Verdania except as an alternate route for the heart quest

[flint wadi]

^^^ see

[flint wadi]

...
its a whole new area

with new enemies
and story
and a boss

and it concludes gp's storyline

[edgy barn]

Green Prince is notably, not one of Steel Seer Zi's masters.

[flint wadi]

like what

[rugged spear]

this goes to headcanon territory but i just see the Verdania choice as "yeah this is fucked up but im not gonna deal with the Krusty Tower so ill put this under 'NECESSARY EVIL'" choice

[slow olive]

Can u leave gp in the cage

[flint wadi]

yeah but you likely wont

[edgy barn]

Of course.

[slow olive]

Does he die in act 3 if u do

[flint wadi]

no i think he just sits there

his death would lock you out of verdania journal entries

[edgy barn]

No.

[flint wadi]

and the memento

[lethal burrow]

idk I figure it act three you would look around a bunch because there's a bunch of different stuff so I would wonder what's different, doesn't take more than a few seconds to just look at the edge of the screen to see if there's new weird stuff hanging around

[slow olive]

Oh right i forgot about the journal and the memento part

[flint wadi]

i knew it was a clover area going off memorial and teasers

but, where do you think i would look for a clovery area

[slow olive]

Mosshome lol

[flint wadi]

grey grim greymoor?
or verdant mosslands

[steel turret]

Hornet was talking about Mortal Bugs in general though, and unless Steel Seer zi’s masters are higherer beings or something (which tbf is possible) that label applies to them too

[lethal burrow]

i'm not talking about trailers lol

[pure belfry]

It's a new area that Hornet also doesn't have anything obivous to gain from. Someone already mentioned that the only reason Hornet uses Elegy of the Deep is for the Hearts, Hearts which she has knowledge of no other use for but the Heart Quest.

[flint wadi]

yeah ok memorium

just memorium is enough to imply its existence alongside the journal entries which are missing

[rugged spear]

At that point shes kinda like pulling the plug on the life support

[flint wadi]

at least karm greets death there lol

[lethal burrow]

I don't think you're correct about anything.

You shifted the goal post in this weird way while you're making it seem like I'm talking about the game explicitly directing the green area to be over there, but I'm not I'm just saying there would be.... thing, a thing maybe, that would be worth spending a few seconds scrolling to the right to see if anything changed for

[gentle aspen]

well sure but she also notes if you talk to gilly how she’s fucking over far fields

[lethal burrow]

where here do I mention the game specifically indicating the green Clover area is over there?

[edgy barn]

The masters are absolutely not being considered in this dialogue. We don't even know if they are mortal bugs, or bugs at all.

[rugged spear]

Wait how so, i kinda missed their entire subquest

[gentle aspen]

If Hornet defeated Skarrsinger Karmelita after completing SEEK: The Old Hearts:
This giant, old ant... Her death seems recent, but her presence here...
Was it her? Could it be? The strength that sustained these caves? If so, what will happen now?
Hornet: They will wither and fade... And you may sadly know it was my needle that brought her end.
You, miss? But why? Why destroy something so vital?
Hornet: It is a difficult thing to explain simply... A test was needed, to ensure my strength before a greater challenge soon to come.
Hornet: Know, in time, these caves may see opportunity to regrow, flourish even, though that rebirth is itself a task enormous... longer than a lifetime, many lifetimes.
Hornet: For that task to succeed, it will fall to bugs like you to sow the first seeds.

[pure belfry]

"Hm, let me just play this song I learned from the Shamans to enter this grieving dude's memories, take his heart, and put it on my shelf in case I need it in this kingdom I never intend to return to."

[steel turret]

You’re right I just wanted to glaze the city of steel, they must be some real DEMONS over there if they’re enslaving higher beings

[lethal burrow]

she's trying to find why Farfield is so vibrant and it's because of the aunt queen sustaining it somehow and with her death, the land will fade

[edgy barn]

Watch the higher beings they compress turn out to be weakened Unn level.

[rugged spear]

Oh ok yeah this is definitely a dick move option

Ok so in a fuckin like

Whatcyha ma call it

the Railway problem i forgot

[lethal burrow]

"it is a difficult thing to explain"

Hand of the author ass moment

[steel turret]

We never fight Unn, maybe that’s a huge feat

[rugged spear]

its morally better to kill GP then

[gentle aspen]

well unn weakened to the point the godseekers didn’t attune to her

[foggy fractal]

trolley problem ?

[gentle aspen]

powerscaling morality is crazy

[steel turret]

I thought Unn was hiding, must’ve misremembered

[gentle aspen]

No, she’s weakened for some unknown reason

[lethal burrow]

they tuned to gruz mother

[naive lake]

I think radiance infecting all of her offsprings gave her massive depression damages

[edgy barn]

Which goes to show how weak Unn currently is.

[gentle aspen]

well there’s a tablet written about it by the mosskin so I don’t entirely agree about the order of events

[rugged spear]

It's a flimsy excuse, but Ill put this under my "its not something Hornet would actually do but they just dont want to lock you out of this boss content. I mean you can do it but why " gameplay/story segregation folder

actually yeah sorry not sorry GP has to go

[gentle aspen]

hornet when she has to kill a gay person just because

lmao

anyways its been too chill got too long we need to start slab discourse again

[steel turret]

Really, it’s all GP’s fault for not banding together with the other heart bosses way back when and taking the fight to the citadel

[terse warren]

Do you not get Gilly there if you defeat Karm and used her heart?

[gentle aspen]

blaming the colonized for getting colonized is certainly a take

[pure belfry]

I don't know why people are so desperate to justify it like "No. Oversights can never exists in games. It's simply not possible it could ever be an oversight"

[naive lake]

the moment they killed pale stag they had to go

[gentle aspen]

I dunno why you’re assuming it is an oversight

you can do this with any of the four hearts its clearly intended to be possible

[edgy barn]

Pale Stag deserved it.

[gentle aspen]

oversights usually break the game in some way

[steel turret]

It is my take, yes. Khan + Nyleth + Carmelita + GP could’ve demolished the citadel

[terse warren]

Ok like, oversights aren't a good thing anyways

[rugged spear]

I just see it as the same way where you can kill the Nailsmith in HK, though tbf at least you're given this some sort of signal that he wants it so its not entirely equivalent

[pure belfry]

I'm saying the only use for the hearts is for the heart quest, so it doesn't make sense for Hornet to take it after the Heart Quest

[rugged spear]

Again I think the excuse is flimsy but its also a point in the game where realistically it shouldnt happen eitherway, just that its born out of player choice being taken priority (not getting locked from fight a boss)

[pure belfry]

literally the only reason she learned elegy of the deep is for the hearts to perform the spell

[edgy barn]

There IS an unused quest icon for GP. Meaning that initially all four hearts were going to be mandatory to finish the game.

[pure belfry]

that is...odd

[sonic dawn]

is there any reason to why mount fay has a lot of weaver constructions?

its full of it

[foggy fractal]

yes we'll tell it to you straight if you wanna

[pure belfry]

I feel like they should've kept it mandatory ngl. It would fix the whole issue. You can still save Green Prince from the cage and do the full quest in Act 3 if you missed him before right?

[sonic dawn]

ye

[foggy fractal]

though the game does explain it

[sonic dawn]

i dont remember even though i already finished it

[flint wadi]

i didnt shift anything, i dont get why are you hung up about the trailers when i only brought them up as part of what gave away verdanias existence to me

and im bringing up mosshome becasue, if anything, silksong is pretty consistent with biomes and as a general rule of thumb - a desert biome will be close to another desert area
a lava area is gonna be preceeded with another lava adjacent area,
swamp by another swamp... and so on, its not rocket science to assume that a player will PROBABLY start looking for the clover area (with only assumption of its existence and the well established biome continuity) in a place closest to it in terms of theming (which happen to be mosslands as theyre the only brightly vibrant area in the game and happen to be at the edge of the map), instead of greymoor of all things, the exact opposite of it

you, however, are spouting bullshit equivalent to "skill issue", because no, there IS a difference between what a player can reasonably infer from what the the information the game puts down for them, and what they are more likely to come across through dumb luck

theres nothing noteworthy or significant changed about craw lake to even IMPLY that its something worth looking for, its a relatively unchanged area especially after you clear crawfather (which happens inside the mound)

youre telling me its my fault i missed AN ENTIRE AREA because i didnt go a wee bit to the right in a room which has absolutely no indicators of being altered in act 3? (youre also overplaying the degree to which these areas change, its reasonable to expect that the player will check every ceiling, but otherwise theres very few other layout alterations to any existing rooms besides the citadel)

even watcher of the edge gets a hint in the game, and its far more minor than lost verdania

[sonic dawn]

https://tenor.com/view/hollow-knight-gif-25277476

[foggy fractal]

Your legged ancestors (Weavers) once found her company compelling, enough to build their chambers and their calling device at the height of this perilous peak. - Maskmaker

Sister, spider, if seeking commune with the creature atop this mount, take the climb above as test, a challenge beyond even our setting. Upon that summit gained, and creature hailed, know it shall choose what gift to grant, with death as likely as insight. - Weavers

[sonic dawn]

ooo

[foggy fractal]

so basically Weavers revered the fayforn

[sonic dawn]

btw do we know anything about fayforn

[supple plover]

it's pretty freaking awesome

[foggy fractal]

not much besides that its a her, can grant gifts, pretty powerful

as well as the whole weaver connection

[flint wadi]

true i love fayhorn

[pure belfry]

Weavers were like "Cool birb up there. Take a look"

[sonic dawn]

man there really is A LOT of stuff that feels like it needs to expand

the greyroot, fayforn, karak

do yall they tc will make dlcs for each topic?

[supple plover]

I wish Team Cherry made up some unit or measurement of time for the bug worlds that I could nerd over

[orchid whale]

I just had a thought.
Why is there a diving bell to the Abyss in Deep Docks?

Has anyone questioned this?

[sonic dawn]

prob the citadel exploring the abyss

[pure belfry]

"Might give you some feathers, might just kill you. Let's find out."

[terse warren]

TC really fumbled by writing a throwaway line about the Karaka kingdom controlling "half of Pharloom" uh

[sonic dawn]

there is so much that needs to be explained

[supple plover]

Hornet being revealed as this Really really old lady thanks to her birthrights as spawn of a pale being and a weaver was a Huge twist

[foggy fractal]

eh we'll probably never get an explanation on some things

[gentle aspen]

Cuz weavers were there

[foggy fractal]

jojoker you're late mwhahah

[orchid whale]

I don't think there's an explanation necessarily, but I do think that's an interesting mystery to add to the pile...
Is it possible this is how the Weavers long ago got into the Abyss, maybe?

[gentle aspen]

We already knew this though

[sonic dawn]

the weavers dont build bells

[orchid whale]

I mean in conjunction with the early Citadel

[pure belfry]

I wonder what a theoretical Fayforn bossfight would be like? like if the Fayforn decided to try and kill Hornet, and you had to fight it to get the Faydown cloak.

[supple plover]

I didn't

[sonic dawn]

guess we have to wait 3 years for a dlc

[gentle aspen]

Groal 2.0

Air groal

[supple plover]

what exactly is the issue?

[sonic dawn]

greyroot def deserves a dlc to explain what the hell it is

[orchid whale]

Why?

[gentle aspen]

eh

Don’t think so

[pure belfry]

would elegy of the deep potentially work on Greyroot?

[flint wadi]

not really its pretty well explained upon

[sonic dawn]

i mean, its just there

[upper copper]

Who was speaking here?

[flint wadi]

...it isnt

[gentle aspen]

Lace

[orchid whale]

Or Phantom

[flint wadi]

its part of the citadels efforts to recycle and employ silk

[upper copper]

Source for either?

[flint wadi]

its pretty major actually

[sonic dawn]

where does it imply that

[orchid whale]

Their silhouettes are both in the memory.

[gentle aspen]

The two of them are there and I believe lace’s silhouette moves

[upper copper]

Which one?

[terse warren]

Because what the hell did they control aside from Sands and Blasted

[orchid whale]

Both, one of them is saying it to the other. Lace is kneeling down while Phantom is in a test tube thing.

[upper copper]

Because I heard someone say that tc confirmed that lace was speaking. But I need confirma

[gentle aspen]

lace is standing up straight

[gentle aspen]

They didn’t

[lethal burrow]

I disagree

[orchid whale]

Yeah but the whole non-binary thing lol

[upper copper]

…Confirmation

[supple plover]

I don't know, but I imagine they were around and doing whatever before Grandmother Silk came along

[lethal burrow]

birb

[gentle aspen]

the nonbinary thing is an assumption from the journal

[upper copper]

Dunno why I cut off

[orchid whale]

So?

[gentle aspen]

which makes most entities not gendered

[orchid whale]

Most entities are species, not individuals

[gentle aspen]

do you believe garmond to be nonbinary because he’s referred to as they in the journal?

[lethal burrow]

The Weavers were investigating ways to take care of grandmother silk, and they were thinking about the abyss, that wasn't their final plan though.

[flint wadi]

the enemies are dreg collectors

the windmills have silk spools within them constantly winding down

theres a tablet or two about silk collection as well

[flint wadi]

then youre wrong

[terse warren]

But they were alive even after GMS came around

[orchid whale]

That uses "they" because it talks about two people...

[sonic dawn]

im talking about greyroot not greymoore

[flint wadi]

oh

[sonic dawn]

lol

[flint wadi]

ohhh my bad

[sonic dawn]

dw

[terse warren]

No, it uses "they" even when referring exclusively to Garmond

[gentle aspen]

In the journal entry? It isn’t using they in that way

[sonic dawn]

but just think about it

[flint wadi]

yeah greyroot is weird

[sonic dawn]

a random witch made of roots, that can easily transform a pale being + a half pale half weaver being into roots with no background of who it is and why it does what it does

[terse warren]

!wiki Lost Garmond

[oak meadow]

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Lost_Garmond

Hollow Knight Wiki

Lost Garmond

Lost Garmond is a boss in Hollow Knight: Silksong. He is the black-threaded form of Garmond.

Theme

Dark Descent

Location

Blasted Steps

Health

900

Damage Modifiers (per weapon level)

2    1.5    1.2    1.1    1

Reward

Hero's Memento

Journal Kills

1

Gender

Male

Voice

Nic "Bitter Bits"

[lethal burrow]

then YOUR wrong (not so fun to be on the other end of the accusatory stick is it?)

[flint wadi]

but its a cool indirect white lady lore i suppose

[gentle aspen]

“Vigorous old knight and their noble companion”

that’s not referring to the both of them their is referring to Garmond

[sonic dawn]

like, it is a very powerful being that we know almost nothing about

[orchid whale]

Oh yeah
Okay so why can't Garmond be non-binary?

[upper copper]

What’s up with that tho

[sinful nimbus]

"They" doesn't indicate gender anyway

[gentle aspen]

She’s a parasite who attaches onto other entities in order to continue its own existence it seems

[flint wadi]

youre simply not correct, theres a difference between what a player can reasonably find and what requires more indicators from the game
(you started this fad first btw)

[sinful nimbus]

Garmond is a dude he's called Sir

[lethal burrow]

No listen we know from Hollow knight lore, that void makes you lose your gender

[supple plover]

I'm not sure then, but it isn't super insane to me... You could just assume they were uncontested before when they were plentiful, and lived amongst the other leaders with the bugs they represented

[gentle aspen]

He calls himself a dude and so does Hornet

The Journal just doesn’t gender

[lethal burrow]

yeah, and the difference is subjective and I think you're wrong.

It's a secret for sure but it's not unfindable.

[orchid whale]

Only if you don't know someone's gender, but Hornet knows Garmond, so why would she write they?

All this shows is Garmond uses either pronoun

[sinful nimbus]

No, BV is a girl

[supple plover]

it's too many ambiguities atm for me to give you a good answer

[sonic dawn]

who

[gentle aspen]

Garmond only ever refers to himself as he

and Hornet refers to himself as he in the dialogue

[orchid whale]

?

[lethal burrow]

His alone journal entry also uses he him pronouns

[gentle aspen]

He’s not nonbinary

[orchid whale]

So he/they

[sinful nimbus]

I often call people who I know the genders of "they", it doesn't indicate that they are non-binary its literally neutral

[flint wadi]

its finding requires either unreasonable amounts of scanning every room or dumb luck, no id say there are some principles in game design that are objective

[sonic dawn]

he/him

[flint wadi]

i think youre wrong

[lethal burrow]

you're over selling it

[gentle aspen]

Hornet’s notes aren’t the omniscient part of the journal we’re referring to gang

[orchid whale]

You guys can't just say that "The journal doesn't gender but only sometimes" lol

[lethal burrow]

I know you think I'm wrong

[supple plover]

I think you guys are taking this a bit too seriously lol

[orchid whale]

She knows Garmond, that's not something you need to be omniscient for

[sinful nimbus]

What

[flint wadi]

this is coming from my genuine experience of looking for verdania so trust me im not lol

[lethal burrow]

I am aware that you missed it

[sinful nimbus]

Verdania's location makes no sense yes

[flint wadi]

THANK YOU

[orchid whale]

Look

It says "they"

I'm just stating facts.

[lethal burrow]

there's no more chips you can push on the table, the information is known, and my opinion is had on it

[gentle aspen]

are you reading what I’m saying
The first part of the journal is the omniscient part
The second part isn’t, it is what Hornet knows of the character and her actual notes

[sinful nimbus]

It was moved there in development because the Old Hearts quest seems to be rewritten

[sonic dawn]

thats an entire different game

[flint wadi]

and youre just saying "nuh uh"

[sinful nimbus]

Do you know what "they" means

[flint wadi]

so i cant let it go while youre acting all high and mighty

[sinful nimbus]

Because it doesn't mean male female or non-binary, its ambiguous

[orchid whale]

The second part uses they

[lethal burrow]

i'm just disagreeing you're the one of asserting that it's indisputable fact that you indeed correct

[flint wadi]

not really awnsering my points about what can be reasonably deduced about its location

[sonic dawn]

"they" can be anything

[gentle aspen]

oh my god

[sonic dawn]

him he she her or whatever

[gentle aspen]

sure man garmond is nonbinary

jesus

[orchid whale]

Why does that make you mad lol

[sinful nimbus]

They is grammatically correct for everyone yes

Yeah Joker take a chill pill its just lore

[sonic dawn]

"hi my name is hornet what are your pronouns"

[gentle aspen]

I’m not mad I’m annoyed you’re being obtuse

[lethal burrow]

I don't think your points add anything.

I think it's reasonable to find given its location and you disagree and you're the opinion that your opinion is factually correct and I also disagree about that, and I don't think anything you've brought up changes my opinion.

[orchid whale]

Also no the first half doesn't just use they, this is Shakra's

Or is this "obtuse" to point out?

[flint wadi]

buddy

[sinful nimbus]

What is your point Daydel?

[flint wadi]

fuck off lmao

[lethal burrow]

get the hunters Journal for the first garmond fight

[orchid whale]

Garmond uses he/they

[orchid whale]

Yes
It uses they

[foggy fractal]

Vigorous old knight and their noble companion, working together to see their lands cut free from haunted madness. -> The omniscient part

They too seek the spectre at the Haunting's heart, though I fear that foe would pose a challenge beyond their mortal limits. -> as in Garmond & Zaza

[sinful nimbus]

Everyone knows Garmond can be referred to with they because.... duh

[orchid whale]

Pronouns yes

[sonic dawn]

garmond and zaza are refered as one

[sinful nimbus]

Everyone uses they/them unless they set a personal boundary against it

[sonic dawn]

they are partners

[flint wadi]

genuinely fuck off
"heres why verdanias location makes no sense going off what the game establishes about the world and how the player is likely to navigate it"
"um, nuh uh, irrelevant, i think youre wrong"

[lethal burrow]

no 👍

[flint wadi]

why am i trying

[sonic dawn]

they = garmond AND zaza

[orchid whale]

Their noble steed

[sinful nimbus]

No

[sonic dawn]

oh you mean the journal

[sinful nimbus]

Garmond literally is referred to with they i just don't get why this is a big deal

It tells us nothing

[terse warren]

Well yeah, considering the whole phantom argument stems from 1 journal line

[sinful nimbus]

Phantom is a girl she's called sister

[terse warren]

Yes

[orchid whale]

1.) Could just be she's speaking to Lace.
2.) Phantom goes by either

[flint wadi]

yeah i never understood the nonbinary thing when phantom is literally refered ingame as female

[sinful nimbus]

No Lace is the one outside of the pod Phantom is in and she's the one moving and she's the one its in character for to be speaking

[flint wadi]

^

[orchid whale]

It's because the perspective of whose speaking is unclear and not consistent with the journal, but again- she could just go by both.

[sinful nimbus]

Phantom uses they/them yes but... no one cares most people do that

[lethal burrow]

"here's why it makes no sense"

I didn't see anything you said illustrated how it makes no sense.

You just said that there was nothing indicating it and how because it's green it should be near green stuff (never mind shellwood not being right next to mossgrotto)

The enemies around craw lake are different and it's not immediately obvious where the summons wants you to go, it's absolutely not unreasonable to explore around a little bit.

And seen as you've done lots of aggravated insulting, I think I'm allowed to do a little bit too, so I'll just say that it really just sounds like you're pissy because you missed it and you wanna justify why it's the games fault, rendering you incapable of respectfully disagreeing

[sinful nimbus]

Its not inconsistent with the journal what

[orchid whale]

One uses sister, the other they.

[sinful nimbus]

"They" is ambiguous and can be used for women, yes

[sonic dawn]

you cant have a gender and not have a gender at the same time

[sinful nimbus]

Its 2025 dawg step up your game and learn how neutral pronouns work

[sonic dawn]

if its a she, then its a she

[lethal burrow]

quantum gender

[sonic dawn]

[orchid whale]

I don't know why people keep on saying they is used for ambiguity.
You only usually do this when you don't know someone's gender or are speaking generally.
If you're writing a log about someone in the bestiary, and Phantom is a she, you'd... use she. That's how it works for Lace, that's how it works for Shakra.
'They' in this context as being ambiguous either implies Hornet doesn't know her gender, or Phantom is non-binary.

[lethal burrow]

I wonder why they use they for lost Garmond then

[sonic dawn]

phantom is a girl

[terse warren]

Garmond is a he and referred to as "they: in the journal 🥴

[sinful nimbus]

You can use gendered pronouns and they interchangeably I do it all the time and its not that unusual

[orchid whale]

Non-binary

[sonic dawn]

but it has a "he", so it is a he

[lethal burrow]

i'm not even being facetious. I'm genuinely wondering.

[terse warren]

Yes, and Phantom is a she

[sonic dawn]

yeah

[sinful nimbus]

Like idk what to tell you, you are just unaware of how words work

[sonic dawn]

why does everything gotta be about pronouns

[orchid whale]

I'm literally saying how it works lol
You don't use they/them interchangably unless you don't know someone's gender or are speaking generally

[lethal burrow]

We're arguing over fictional characters pronouns this is stupid. ...Let's argue over a fictional character's maturity and age instead

[sinful nimbus]

Because pronouns are awesome

[upper copper]

Lace?

[gentle aspen]

people do that all the time

[lethal burrow]

[sonic dawn]

until you have to tell someone a she is a she because it is called a she

[sinful nimbus]

You have never used they to refer to someone you know the gender of?

[gentle aspen]

that’s just how language works

[lethal burrow]

I use them/them a lot for people I do know the genders of because I'm lazy and I can just use it for everyone

I am widely inconsistent

[orchid whale]

No it isn't lol
Like you CAN sure, sometimes that'll flow better, sometimes you'll be speaking generally, and often people won't mind!

That's not this context???

[sinful nimbus]

Why not

[orchid whale]

Because it's inconsistent

[sinful nimbus]

They is ambiguous you can use it for women

[lethal burrow]

idk team Terry could've just been inconsistent about their usage

[sinful nimbus]

Its not inconsistent its two words to refer to the same thing

[gentle aspen]

Wdym “no it isnt” it literally is

[orchid whale]

Okay but why here?

[lethal burrow]

idk that's just how William decided to write it that day I guess

[orchid whale]

Okay so why doesn't Hornet say they for Shakra?

"Just because"?
You're making this up lol

[sinful nimbus]

"Why do you use multiple words to refer to the same thing" because that's how english often works

[sonic dawn]

phantom is a woman, you dont call sister someone who is non binary

[orchid whale]

That's not what I said lol

[sonic dawn]

solved

[sinful nimbus]

It is

[lethal burrow]

It's ambiguous who's talking though isn't it?

[orchid whale]

Or she/they

[upper copper]

Back

[sonic dawn]

she/her*

[upper copper]

Um

[sinful nimbus]

Pronouns are words that refer to a noun (Phantom in this case) and you can use multiple pronouns (She, they, etc) to refer to one person

[lethal burrow]

everyone is they because everyone can be referred to as it

[sinful nimbus]

She/they isn't a gender lmfao

[gentle aspen]

Some people care about the specificity of the pronouns used
Some people just use the terms “they/them” for other people more

[orchid whale]

Why doesn't Lace say "They spun us to fade" when referring to GMS?
Would that make sense? Clearly people just randomly use they/them when referring to people in all contexts, so that would make sense right?

[sinful nimbus]

Yes that would

Easy question try harder next time

[orchid whale]

Okay!
We're talking about a bestiary

[lethal burrow]

yes but random can go both way

[lethal burrow]

true the beastie is written directly by the devs so we can only assume that the team is also inconsistent as looks to be demonstrated

[sinful nimbus]

Is it that hard to grasp the concept of calling a woman a they

[gentle aspen]

It does make sense idk why you’re trying to argue this doesn’t make sense that people use them and other pronouns

[terse warren]

They clearly do, since that's what happens in Garmond's journal entry

[gentle aspen]

you do not need to be nonbinary to be referred to using they/them pronouns

[lethal burrow]

I think it's just a matter of team Cherry not being totally consistent with their usage of pronouns in the journal entry

[orchid whale]

I don't even know why I'm arguing this when this is literally what the game says lol.
You can make up your own explanations if you want.

OH, but hey! You guys can complain to the wiki too if you're SO insistent this is just some RANDOM inconsistency for no reason.

[sinful nimbus]

This is what happens when TC doesn't put enough queer rep in the game \🥀

[graceful basin]

Why do we first see Eira's beastlings in act 3?

[sonic dawn]

fan wiki

[sinful nimbus]

The wiki is wrong too yes

[lethal burrow]

I don't know why you're getting so spun up about this

I mean, I do know why it's because lots of people are disagreeing and it's a hard position to be in when everyone is pelting you with tomatoes

[gentle aspen]

I did get the possibly female bit added to the wiki actually because of this exact conversation we’re having right now

[upper copper]

Pregnant

[orchid whale]

Okay! Complain to the wiki and have it corrected then? 🙂

[lethal burrow]

I've been there

[sonic dawn]

look, its simple "they" can be used for ANY gender, she, him, or anything else, "they" is used not specifically and only for nonbinary people

[sinful nimbus]

The wiki staff acknowledges that Phantom is likely a girl in fact they're just wusses that don't want to upset people since there was an edit war

[orchid whale]

I mean! It's a fan wiki, it CLEARLY has misleading info

[sinful nimbus]

People have gotten them to try and change it they just haven't

[upper copper]

What character is this

[gentle aspen]

why are you so mad about this

[sinful nimbus]

Also what's your point

[orchid whale]

Wow I wonder if they included this?

[sinful nimbus]

What

[sonic dawn]

this person wants every character to be nonbinary or smth

[lethal burrow]

Calm yourself or things will turn against you in a way you can imagine only in your darkest dreams

[gentle aspen]

You already posted this

[orchid whale]

I know I did, I posted it

[gentle aspen]

also what exactly are you trying to say here

[sinful nimbus]

I'm confused what your point is? The wiki was never relevant to the current conversation and no one claimed it to be accurate

[terse warren]

The wiki isn't a source btw

[lethal burrow]

I have warned you now. Nothing else can be done.

[gentle aspen]

Why even bring up the wiki

[sinful nimbus]

This is so tuff

[orchid whale]

Then it should be corrected 🙂

[gentle aspen]

that isn’t relevant to the current conversation

[sinful nimbus]

It should but it hasn't been

[orchid whale]

Yes it is lmao

[frosty gate]

I'd ask what's the topic but I think this is not a shitshow im willing to be part of

[gentle aspen]

It isn’t

[lethal burrow]

caged animals act in erratic and desperate ways

[sinful nimbus]

If you're so dead set on changing it you should complain about it yourself instead of asking us to

[orchid whale]

Yes it is lmao

[sonic dawn]

a person wanting the characters to be nonbinary

[sinful nimbus]

Also this isn't lore

[gentle aspen]

it’s another group of people who are going with the information they have

[orchid whale]

I'm not, that';s my point

[gentle aspen]

They’re not a source

[lethal burrow]

True, we should talk about when the Weavers left

[sinful nimbus]

Neither are we so ????

[orchid whale]

OH, what information do we have?

[sinful nimbus]

No one cares if the wiki has something that's inaccurate

[terse warren]

You say this like it's the easiest thing in the world

[orchid whale]

Not this wiki lol

[gentle aspen]

whatever this conversation is entirely pointless since you’re this angry

[lethal burrow]

probably a good idea to just agree to disagree and move onto another topic

[orchid whale]

I'm not the only one talking about it lol, I'm just annoyed

[gentle aspen]

and no this wiki isn’t easy to change the page is literally locked

[gentle aspen]

because of this very kind of conversation

[lethal burrow]

probably a good idea to just agree to disagree and move onto another topic

[orchid whale]

It's as if they don't want it to have misinformation...

[lethal burrow]

probably a good idea to just agree to disagree and move onto another topic

[sinful nimbus]

You ain't the arbiter of what this channel talks about cuh 💔

There is literally a mod in chat

[lethal burrow]

So you disagree then?

[gentle aspen]

No, they just don’t want to engage in this kind of discourse and argumentation

[sinful nimbus]

Yes I want to keep arguing that Phantom is a girl

[lethal burrow]

i'm allowed to suggest things for people to do aggressively

there's no rule against that

[sinful nimbus]

There is a rule against spam actually

[lethal burrow]

oh well Who am I to ruin any fun then?

[orchid whale]

So why did they throw their hat in the ring...?

Or is it meant to be objective?

[lethal burrow]

The rule of threes is far older than any rule The Internet age has ever conjured

[frosty gate]

Well this is a dumb topic and shame one anyone for engaging on it, both sides of the argument

[gentle aspen]

They are attempting to be as objective as possible

that is the intention of the wiki

[naive lake]

gang can yall stfu and discuss this shit in dms, trheads or in #hk-general

[sinful nimbus]

The information on the wiki is wrong big whoop no one cares they've been wrong about character genders for years now

Phantom is still called a sister

[upper copper]

What animal are the judge species?

[lethal burrow]

It could be lace that's being referred to though

[foggy fractal]

WAWAWAWA

[gentle aspen]

Well Phantom’s in some sort of bacta tank

[sonic dawn]

no, its lace calling phantom "sister"

[orchid whale]

Okay, but everyone this conversation has said the idea that Phantom uses they/them is just "random they usage and has nothing to do with Phantom's pronouns"

So why would the wiki, trying to be objective and only give information with sources, include "they/them" and "possibly female" instead of just "female?"

[frosty gate]

The source quite literally says "It's unclear who's talking" about that Needolin Dialogue

[sinful nimbus]

Highly implausible as Phantom is the one inside the strange pod thing and its not as in character as it is for Lace

[edgy nebula]

wawawawawawawawawawawawawawa!

[lethal burrow]

wawawa

[gentle aspen]

that is not what anyone has been saying

[sinful nimbus]

I don't really care what the wiki says

[terse warren]

"You have been mod pinged" ahhh

[orchid whale]

You called me obtuse over it lol

[sinful nimbus]

No one cares about the wiki I literally just said its inaccurate 💔

[foggy fractal]

how about we look at other needolin memory dialogues to see if theres other instances of multiple bugs speaking

[gentle aspen]

no

don’t post memes

[naive lake]

gang i think "she spun us to fade she spun us to break, wy sister why us" is good enough alright

[sinful nimbus]

As has already been explained, the wiki staff agree Phantom is likely female however they decided to Both-sides the argument to avoid pissing anyone off. It has nothing to do with the actual truth

[lethal burrow]

does a reaction image count as a meme chat?

[edgy nebula]

hornet just uses they/them in her journal entries if the gender isnt explicitly stated

[orchid whale]

Yes, the wiki staff definitely think Phantom is only female.
As that's what they wrote.

[lethal burrow]

Verdict seems to be no

[terse warren]

The strawmanning is crazy

[sinful nimbus]

Its not what they wrote because they Both-sides'ed the argument as I just explained

[lethal burrow]

The father of the flaming is crazy

[orchid whale]

That's not what a straw man is

[flint wadi]

for one
shellwood is right above mosshome lol, doesnt really put a dent into what i was talking about either way, there are still consistent overarching biomes for ~70% of locations in this game, its a trend that informs your navigation

two
"attend... home... wheel..." is pretty clearly refering to the watermound if you can put two and two together lol, i dont see how THATS not obvious, the craw lake area itself is not implied to be the focus point in the summons, youre going straight for the craws "home" which also happens to include a wheel, which, if youre were to the area even once, you might at least recognize the giant ass watermill in its very background and deduce where the summons is actually pointing at

yes i am getting heated because instead of addressing what i had to say from the start you started beating around the bush and just downplaying stuff i had to say with "youre wrong lol" even though i wrote a whole paragraph to answer what you had to say

[upper copper]

The voltwyrm fallacy

[sinful nimbus]

For the record the wiki isn't "objective" in its character gendering. They think Little Fool is a dude just because he sounds like one and they think Broken Vessel is genderless based on literally nothing

[edgy nebula]

father of the flame is a wickerman you dolt.... smh..

[sonic dawn]

the wiki isnt official

[terse warren]

Star: "They agree Phantom is likely female"

You: "They think Phantom is exclusively female"

likely≠exclusively

[gentle aspen]

anyways I’ll disengage with this discussion since it isn’t being done in good faith atp I think

[orchid whale]

1.) What's the source?
2.) So they... wrote the pronouns she uses.
Because that's the most objective info they can give with what we have to go off of.

[edgy barn]

Aren't all vessels genderless (hence Hornet being The Gendered Child)?

[foggy fractal]

what lore should we talk about then ? is there any significance to zi being coloured differently than jinn and the other steel assasin ? the flying one

[gentle aspen]

they (the devs) only confirmed two vessels being not gendered

[sinful nimbus]

White Lady hasn't gone up to every vessel and asked for their pronouns so it makes far more sense for that piece of dialogue to refer to sex

[gentle aspen]

And gender is a social construct so a vessel could definitely be gendered yada yada

[terse warren]

Some vessels are gendered?

[orchid whale]

What's the second?

[sinful nimbus]

THK and TK

[edgy nebula]

hollow knight

[terse warren]

Major spelling mistake from Joker everyone point and laugh

[lethal burrow]

"attend home wheel" could just as easily mean the roof as the door that's inside the building that most players probably don't even remember as anything more than another wall, most people would explore around the building and then enter into it. Or after completing it wonder if there's anything new in the area after the boss to see if maybe anything changed

Either because of Act III or the death of the boss

[lethal burrow]

But are you leaving or are you lurking?

[orchid whale]

Where did TC say this?

[foggy fractal]

mods are always lurking...

[sinful nimbus]

I'll do the moderating for you man dw

[edgy nebula]

we should rank ss characters on how good they are at dancing

[lethal burrow]

No they're a mod if you point and laugh you'll get banned 💀

[gentle aspen]

Sorry I was busy watching a guy getting waterboarded

[sinful nimbus]

Deleted Team Cherry livestream

[foggy fractal]

like irl ?

[orchid whale]

Yeah, that's what I just posted

[gentle aspen]

sometimes

[sinful nimbus]

So why are you asking cuh \🥀

[random harbor]

Developer comment: Protagonist is genderless

According to Ari Gibson, the game's protagonist is genderless.

Source

@kingoclowns used /dev-comments source: Reddit name: Protagonist is genderless

[orchid whale]

I'm asking, where did Team Cherry say THK is gendered? That sems wrong

[naive lake]

gang i'm pretty sure void doenst have a gender

[terse warren]

Starpengu mod application when

Actually you should immediately be given alumni for seniority

[sinful nimbus]

They said it in Adelaide Australia

[edgy barn]

They meant it was not gendered, it was a spelling mistake.

[sinful nimbus]

You can check the transcript of the livestream for yourself

[naive lake]

Like the manifeststion of nothingness

[frosty gate]

I'd actually would prefer to have a Flea as a mod

[edgy barn]

within the-...? What's the full quote?

[lethal burrow]

"to witness secrets sealed one must endure the hardest punish"

"To actually figure out the lore one must sit through conversations of pointless lore channel debates"

[foggy fractal]

oh right aren't you like a coast guard or something

[upper copper]

Am I the only one who thinks that Herrah does not look like a weaver?

[frosty gate]

I'd prefer to have those little mosquito guys from Putrified Ducts as a mod

[sinful nimbus]

Ari and William are constantly talking over eachother its wild

Bro didn't get to finish his sentence

[lethal burrow]

Haven't they gone on record saying that they disagree with pretty much everything that isn't in the game when it comes to the story

[orchid whale]

The mods only ever do anything if someone commits the sin of posting a meme

[edgy nebula]

how they dont attack eachother mid recording is beyond me

[lethal burrow]

like they said, they disagree about major story points so pretty much only the things that make it into the game are canon

[frosty gate]

She doesn't, current theory says she changed after giving birth to Hornet

[lethal burrow]

Unless I miss remembering

[sinful nimbus]

If I remember correctly that quote was about prerelease content

[lethal burrow]

this has been a big debate, but most people agree it's a retcon to make the story work better (which the story does work better for the change to be fair)

And most people agree with a birth metamorphosis of some kind that made her look weird... or at least that's what we say to cope

[lethal burrow]

i'd be willing to bet it's still applies though

[sinful nimbus]

After Silksong retconned everything, perhaps so

[edgy nebula]

what should we tlak about that is actually good

[lethal burrow]

It's been almost a month since slab fly discourse

[sinful nimbus]

I had a slabfly discourse earlier today wym

[frosty gate]

Don't get star going again

[lethal burrow]

oh damn, I missed it 😔

[sinful nimbus]

Its a weekly occurrence at best

[edgy nebula]

it's either lace age discussion, debunking lacenet, hornet racist and homophobic, or some dumbass shit like clowning on gms

[flint wadi]

youll go to the roof for a couple seconds, see that theres nothing waiting for you there
and go "hm maybe i check inside the home wheel"

doesnt really alter anything

verdanias discovery depends on the sole possibility that you MIGHT explore around craw lake instead of going for the "home" listed in the summons

also when leaving the quest it becomes pretty clear pretty quick that the area actually wasnt altered significantly much at all, the craw jurors are gone after you beat crawfather and there are practically 0 changes to surrounding terrain to warrant the thought of "hmmm wait this place is kinda different, i think ill stick around a little more"

[sinful nimbus]

City of Steel 🗣️

[edgy nebula]

so tired of it, lets rank silksong characters on how likely they are to be pulled over while drunk driving

or that

[upper copper]

Fleas and Zylotol

[gentle aspen]

Actually I have a discussion to purport

[buoyant rampart]

The fleas have a vehicle and something to drink

[gentle aspen]

why do you think Vespa trained Hornet?

[sinful nimbus]

My current HC is that the City of Steel wiped out the Ancient Civilization for using void

[lethal burrow]

"you go to the"- speak for yourself, I shouldn't need to remind you that your experience isn't universal. I never argued It wasn't a secret, only that it's a reasonably findable one.
I also never argued that your specific actions led you not to find it

[sinful nimbus]

\🥀

[frosty gate]

Anything that isn't another social commentary on Silksong please

[upper copper]

Hornet had nobody else

[edgy nebula]

i dont wanna talk about hornet anymore...

[sinful nimbus]

The tramway to the Hive implies it was a diplomatic deal between nations

[flint wadi]

im only making up a general scenario of where the player will go assuming they are somewhat familiar with the game

[frosty gate]

A big fuck you in the King's face perhaps? Maybe she was left alone and the befriended the bees when she was young, it was close

[sinful nimbus]

What

[frosty gate]

The tramway was not finished

[sinful nimbus]

What

[gentle aspen]

does it?

[lethal burrow]

I disagree with that scenario then

[sinful nimbus]

The tramway is literally functional in game

[frosty gate]

It implies the oposite

[flint wadi]

the thought process of "hmm maybe its not outside" -> "i should check the home itself then"

[lethal burrow]

Why else would there be a tram leading to kingdoms edge?

[flint wadi]

ok whats your scenario

[lethal burrow]

yeah, but I think most people would check most of the outside before heading in

[gentle aspen]

Hype moments and aura

also idk it leads to the hive sure but its sealed off

[frosty gate]

"Failed Tramway"

[edgy barn]

A blocked off section of Kingdom's ege too. Like, the Hive is the only thing there.

[sinful nimbus]

Um

[gentle aspen]

They’re not talking about failed tramway gang

[lethal burrow]

We're talking about the successful tramway

[sinful nimbus]

I'm not talking about the failed tramway I'm talking about the tram that leads to ancient basin and kingdom's edge

[frosty gate]

Which else goes from Deepnest to hive?

[lethal burrow]

The thriving in its lane Tramway

[edgy barn]

We are talking about the Deepnest-Ancient Basin-Kingdom's Edge Tramway.

[gentle aspen]

Wrong reaction

[frosty gate]

The one in Deepnest is the failed one

[edgy barn]

There are two tramways in deepnest

[sinful nimbus]

There are two trams in deepnest one of them is functional and goes between Deepnest, Ancient Basin, and Kingdom's Edge near the hive

The other is Failed Tramway which goes nowhere

[edgy nebula]

where would failed tramway even have gone

[sinful nimbus]

It is marked in this image

[edgy nebula]

ooooh

[lethal burrow]

mask maker? I guess he asked for a tram for better deliveries

[sinful nimbus]

Deepnest was kinda stacked with content wow

[frosty gate]

That one is so far from anything related to the inhabitants of the place

[sinful nimbus]

Indeed

However there isn't much other explanation for it leading to Kingdom's Edge

[edgy barn]

Maybe they wanted it to connect City of Tears with Queen's Garden without building through the fungal wastes?

[sinful nimbus]

I guess the entrance from Queen's Gardens into outer Deepnest where they would then expand or something

[frosty gate]

This is an assumption but it seems the King just wanted to connect all Hallownest, whether they liked it or not

[radiant badger]

Gotta do like 4 more area's. Should be lore accurate now tho

[sinful nimbus]

The Kingdom's Edge was deliberately not expanded into as per Cornifer's dialogue

[lethal burrow]

I don't think the whole of bio water served as a bay, specifically the bay was originally located between bile water and verdania so presumably it's location was never bilewater

[sterile jacinth]

Peak 🔥

[radiant badger]

I'm gonna makenit have a bunch of sub area's like the citadel

[gentle aspen]

okay another question

Do you think GMS was physically abusive

[sinful nimbus]

[lethal burrow]

also karak people took up half of pharloom

[sterile jacinth]

I think more mentally and emotionally

[limpid summit]

She beats the fuck out of hornet

[sterile jacinth]

True

[gentle aspen]

true..

[edgy barn]

Yeah but it all probably wouldn't be considered one area

[limpid summit]

But yes what Lilly said

She probably just harped on the weavers

[gentle aspen]

Yeah

[limpid summit]

And they harped for uer

[gentle aspen]

I dunno I just have this mental image of her using her scissor blades on phantom

and idk why

[sterile jacinth]

Rip phantom

[foggy fractal]

who's scissor blades ?

[sterile jacinth]

Maybe it could have been to “fix them” if it even happened

[lethal burrow]

When did lace come into existence anyways?

[frosty gate]

Also, before going off, despite disagreeing in that they had some sort of trade connection, I think the Spiders and the Bees are probably in good terms with eachother since they rejected the King. The real fucking question is what the hell was going on between Spiders and Mantis

[gentle aspen]

I mean, the spiders didn’t really reject him

[sterile jacinth]

I don’t know. I think after the weavers left? It’s not clear

[gentle aspen]

They made deals they exchanged silk the weavers seemingly knew the designs of seals of binding

[limpid summit]

I mean actually maybe she did attack the weavers why does she just have swords lying around

[gentle aspen]

Deepnest just isn’t Hallownest land

And PK respected that

mantises were beefing with mostly wildlife of deepnest as well

[limpid summit]

I feel like definitely during Conductors when all the local Weavers were sealed and GMS was stirring

[gentle aspen]

I assume the stalking devouts were after infection

[radiant badger]

I also wanted to keep it more small considering my lore reason why the coral gorge is filled with water because of mount fay

[frosty gate]

Quirrel quite literally said they never accepted the King

[limpid summit]

Phantom though she might have been older

[gentle aspen]

quirrel’s also BALD

Sorry that was mean

Accepted him as a ruler certainly

[foggy fractal]

hey nothing wrong about being bald

[gentle aspen]

PK respected that

but they still did deals and traded

herrah was the number one draft pick after all

[edgy barn]

Having a common enemy doesn't necessarily make you friends.

[sterile jacinth]

I’d assume she only attacked them after she knew about the rebellion

[gentle aspen]

Prime LeBron

[foggy fractal]

LeGOAT...

[sinful nimbus]

Did she know about the plan to trap her

I don't know which is worse

[gentle aspen]

I mean

[sterile jacinth]

I doubt it. If she did it was too late. The weaver nests were hidden for a reason

[gentle aspen]

I think so?

she knows the other weavers had plans for Hornet

unless it was like that one guy

[sinful nimbus]

Did this deity get beaten by her own creations, or was she just so clumsy that she got trapped with a trap made of the very substance she can magically sense?

[gentle aspen]

“I have plans I cannot elaborate on or the haters will sabotage me”

oh you mean GMS I’m stupid

probably not

[limpid summit]

Dr Umar

[sterile jacinth]

I think she just got beat by her own creations

[gentle aspen]

they definitely hid in the weavenests and planned

[foggy fractal]

oh does GMS have scissors split in half and not needles

[gentle aspen]

Yes

[sinful nimbus]

GMS crest shows scissors iirc

[gentle aspen]

She think she ryuko matoi

[teal drift]

Gms is the slicer

[foggy fractal]

scissor esque design

but never a full scissor

[sterile jacinth]

Interesting that the source of silk would have scissors as a motif

[foggy fractal]

hmmmm TC what are you trying to say

[gentle aspen]

why the fuck are you snailing me

stop lurking

[vestal swan]

Cuz I said this like a week ago

[gentle aspen]

That is poor snail etiquette

[vestal swan]

[gentle aspen]

We have standards

We’re not animals

[vestal swan]

Abusive mother moment

[fringe comet]

we are snails

[sterile jacinth]

Trueeeee

[gentle aspen]

yoo she definitely used her scissor blades whenever lace or phantom got too loud and “uppity”

[teal drift]

Gms uses scissors cuz shes trying to cut herself free from oppression

[gentle aspen]

“I’ll give you something to cry about” ahh

[foggy fractal]

speaking of does anyone here have that hud fully recreated ?

[teal drift]

Gms was too busy being a hostage to interact with lace and phantom smh

[gentle aspen]

Yeah

[sterile jacinth]

Ough I bet. I also bet she tried to “fix” phantom and it didn’t work

[gentle aspen]

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/File:Weaver_Queen_HUD.png

[sterile jacinth]

Banished to bilewater

[foggy fractal]

aye thanks

[fringe comet]

the scissors that make up her legs for sure

[gentle aspen]

Crazy how her bum ass doesn’t even give us infinite silk

My glorious PK could never

[edgy barn]

Beatiful. I hope we get to actually use it in gameplay in some context.

[sinful nimbus]

In the shade lord bossfight

[gentle aspen]

You can, through a Glitch

[foggy fractal]

I've seen a mod about it but they got the hud wrong smh

[fringe comet]

crest of the mother

[sterile jacinth]

Crest of the weaver

[gentle aspen]

I think you have to use a silk eater during the binding process or smth

Actually wait this short has ai slop

[edgy barn]

Yeah but I want like, the actual crest. Being able to see missing masks would be good too.

[sterile jacinth]

Ew

[gentle aspen]

https://youtube.com/shorts/_JVmOeABbBw?si=5XdQiS-gMpwIep-o

[upbeat star]

But does it permanently stay?

[frosty gate]

Do you mean this for the bees or the mantises? I don't think its the case, but they are also very chill about each other despite being close

[gentle aspen]

idk I haven’t personally done the glitch myself

probably not if you close the game

[vestal swan]

It stays as long as you don't save and quit iirc

[lethal burrow]

You can just say ass

[vestal swan]

He's trying to be hip

[edgy barn]

the mantises are not chill with deepnest and deepnest is not really close to the hive.

[frosty gate]

Actually, I might be dumb, we don't really know if Deepnest and The Hive were close

[gentle aspen]

Aren’t you pushing 30

[vestal swan]

Yeah a year and a half ago

[gentle aspen]

your hip is trying to be

I wouldn’t talk

[foggy fractal]

jojoker aren't you like 21 ? that's like middle aged for a discord server

[gentle aspen]

I grew up here man

In the trenches

[foggy fractal]

the trenches 🗣️

[lethal burrow]

George trenches

[frosty gate]

Yeah I know the mantises were not chill with the Spiders. Now I really do wonder, why did Vespa train Hornet

[upbeat star]

I was gunna say something but im older than both of you so nvm

[gentle aspen]

oh well that’s cuz they’re wild animals

most of the things they killed were

[vestal swan]

Because TC had this idea years ago and then they put like no effort into making it make sense but they just did anyway so

[gentle aspen]

also that was part of the deal

[fringe comet]

yeah, just cause TC says so

[gentle aspen]

I’m pretty sure devouts only starting being a problem post infection

[fringe comet]

i mean its just unexplained its not like a plot-hole or anything

[upbeat star]

Maybe hornet came to her by her self? Idk