career-advice

[hardy burrow]

we'll see how it goes, thank you!~

[hoary heart]

I'd be really surprised if you regret it. If you're a curious and hardworking person university is like valhalla. It's not for nothing that people are all romantic about their time at uni.

[raven wolf]

When learning coding is it best to focus on one language or many?

[round mica]

hi guys.

[smoky quest]

One language

[hardy burrow]

I was actually stuck between computer science or computer engineering and I think this basically seals it since computer science does not offer the postgrad of security. So thank you a lot, know that you helped path my life))

[hoary heart]

cheers! Well you're the one who's about to put in the years. Good luck! Remember when the going gets tough (and it does for everyone even the people who look god-level), reach out. There are friends everywhere 🙂

[dense mesa]

Do CS if you wanna go into cyber security

Computer science is more about computation, what can be computed and how

[hardy burrow]

wouldn't engineering provide a more low level knowledge?

[dense mesa]

Engineering is about customer requirements, implementing systems to measure and control to satisfy requirements

[dense mesa]

Maybe if you do EE, you'd get a better understanding of computer architecture and so on. But this is just a subfield of security, where CS is definitely more beneficial

[hardy burrow]

main problem is the "department" that teaches computer science doesn't provide the ability to study security at all

Not as a postgrad, nor as a career itself

[dense mesa]

You'd still be better off doing CS without any security modules in my opinion, and then self teaching the rest as you go. Engineering is an okay option, but even electronic engineering won't provide the necessary background in security, unless you have specific modules in hardware security or something

CS will teach you the basic concepts that are used in security, EE will likely teach you how to design under constraints, which isn't as relevant and/or useful

[hardy burrow]

Hmm I understand.. You're right about self teaching I suppose. Specially in security where there are a bunch of well respected certificates to go by.. I'll have to keep looking into it

[hoary heart]

Interesting. I guess it really depends on what kind of security you want to do. It's a broad church. If you want to be at the bleeding edge of the latest CVEs then CS for sure. All the recent sudoedit vuln stuff recently was straight from a CS dept right? Very interestings stuff. OTOH if you want to be a day-to-day enforcer of iso27K1 or essential 8, SE will give you a lot to work with.

You have the opportunity to have a fine and prosperous with both. CS is definitely more technically difficult, which some people love, but ... hard is hard. SE is marginally less technically difficult (less likely to make you cry). So really it's a very personal decision.

*fine and prosperous career

[reef violet]

failed my coding interview. I feel so bad

[summer roost]

!rule 7

[inner wren]

Rules

7. Keep discussions relevant to the channel topic. Each channel's description tells you the topic.

[summer roost]

!rule 6 rather

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[summer roost]

!rule 9 also

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[weak hamlet]

Hey question, I’m started getting into Python, CS, and others this year. I’m 24, not sure if it’s too late to do a career change lol. I’m going back to school and I want to switch degrees to CS. Attempting to get a dev job soon. Any advice?

[balmy spade]

My advice, from personal experience, is the reassurance that it's not too late to do a career change.

[weak hamlet]

Thank you! Feels as if I should’ve started this in middle school. Hopefully it all works out

[summer roost]

“The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time is now.” – Chinese Proverb

[tidal laurel]

im aiming to become a data scientist should i get a degree in cs and then masters in data science ? or both ug as well as pg in data science

[misty raft]

statistics is the best major for that, ds is a very watered down degree

cs and stats should be the best tbh ds degrees are so new and unproven in the job market

[tidal laurel]

thank you smm!!!

[tight spoke]

Will i always require a collateral for applying for a student loan ?

[summer roost]

What country are you in?

[tight spoke]

India.

[wise pier]

how important is knowing the intricacies of the computer system when learning programming? i've heard a couple people say that it's necessary to know c or assembly

[smoky quest]

it depends.
Some folks prefer a bottom approach where you go from the lowest level of abstractions to the highest and some others prefer a top down approach where you start at very high level and very simple and add more to it until you understand the whole stack.
But that has nothing to do with #career-advice

[wise pier]

okay thanks for the indepth explanation, and sorry about that. didn't understand where else to ask this

[limber barn]

I'm in the exact same boat. Going to go back to Uni next fall. Best of luck to you! 40 more years or less(if you're lucky) so its definitely not too late!

[short spoke]

Does taking any courses in the I.T. field require no thesis projects?

kinda childish reason, but I just don’t want to do any thesis, research whatsoever, but it doesn’t mean that I’m bad at it (17 senior hs here for context)

[dense mesa]

@short spoke a lot of uni degrees will require dissertations in the final year

[short spoke]

ok depression levels went times 3

fml

[marsh wigeon]

hi

[inner wren]

Hey @marsh wigeon!

It looks like you tried to attach a Python file - please use a code-pasting service such as https://paste.pythondiscord.com

[dense mesa]

If you want to do a computer science degree, that will probably require a dissertation. Just doing something in IT is less likely to require one because it's a more vocational field. When you say the "I.T. field", are you talking about programming (such as with Python), or actual IT (such as for businesses) ?

[ocean ledge]

lets not call them dissertations-- maybe bachelor thesis is the correct term

dissertations are an entirely different animal

[ocean ledge]

that is a childish reason, as it really isn't a big deal to write a bachelors thesis at the end (which requires literally no original research, so i'm not getting the hesistation)

[calm herald]

@vapid jay

[remote forge]

Guys can u help with one question

[sinful blaze]

ye ?

[sinful blaze]

hmm

wut do u want ?

[lilac remnant]

What's this have to do with career discussion

[sinful blaze]

ikr

[remote forge]

Program to question

[sinful blaze]

ask dis q in #help section

[remote forge]

I didn't see bro sry

[sinful blaze]

np

[remote forge]

There are many help sections which one

[sinful blaze]

anything

[remote forge]

Ok

[dense mesa]

In the UK, large pieces of undergraduate writing are called dissertations, whereas a thesis is what you write for a masters or PhD. It's just a matter of which location you're in, not that one term is better than another.

[smoky quest]

It's actually a great thing!
Once you go beyond the junior level or pissing code job type, you will need to write presentations and documents. As in most things, it's not rocket science, it's about practice.

[silk hedge]

I need career guidance. I'm currently doing b. Tech in IT.

[smoky quest]

Can you expand a bit more? It's a bit terse

[silk hedge]

I want to get into ML analyst, I have done python fundamental, What do nxt?

[near ocean]

Whole bunch of undergrad math

[smoky quest]

what's a b. Tech in IT?

[dense mesa]

It's a degree in India I believe, undergraduate IT

[smoky quest]

ah thanks! good to know

[tawdry juniper]

should i take artificial intelligence as a sixth subject in my hs freshman year?

[pulsar drum]

Yes, if it interests you.

[tawdry juniper]

i kinda also missed the date to apply

so any suggestions on how to get them to enroll me in it?

[sage pumice]

email the prof

[pulsar drum]

Contact the instructor or the CS department (if your school has a department for that)

How you ask? Well just look above. There are some suggestions given.

[somber moth]

Anyone know how I can find someone to help me develop a wifi connected Live LED display such as the one in the picture?

Delete if not allowed, just extremely curious about this LED WiFi Clock display I came across

[tawdry juniper]

gotcha, thanks

[tawdry juniper]

i'll do that

[unkempt lichen]

This is cool, would love to work on something like this!

[plush galleon]

Actually it's off-topic

You can try in #python-discussion or in #internals-and-peps

[silk hedge]

I want to know that data scientist are ask dbms, OS, DSA, TOC, COA during job selection ??

[storm tangle]

as a junior dev, how does one ask for help? i've tried repeatedly and no one seems to grasp that the complexity of the problem theyre asking me to solve is considerably beyond my reach

[late cave]

Hi Everyone! Its been a while! I have a technical interview coming up for an employee support analyst position. I would really love it if someone could help me jot down a few questions i should look out for! Thank you ☺️

[elder nimbus]

If anyone around is a Site Reliability Engineer and has time, I'd love to pick your brain. I'm working on building skills to make myself more marketable in that field (Python being #1) but Id like some benchmarks and idea of where to focus.

[radiant moon]

learn some big cloud provider APIs -- AWS, Azure
not all of it -- that's insane 🙂

[elder nimbus]

Have my own cluster running Docker and Kubernetes to get exposure there as well

Any resources for learning APIs you could suggest? That's definitely a new area for me

[radiant moon]

heh, I know of nothing.
The AWS ones are poorly documented, so if you can figure them out, that's probably worth a bit more 🙂

[elder nimbus]

True, I do have the well architecture framework to go through, I imagine there will be some links in there

Appreciate it, Offby1, that's 2 since I joined the Discord lol

[buoyant seal]

Check dev ops section here
https://github.com/kamranahmedse/developer-roadmap

[neat jolt]

Please Delete if this is on the wrong thread......What are the most realistic projects you can do on your own that help you get ready for working in this field. Thank you!

[radiant moon]

hard to answer authoritatively, but I wrote a URL shortener
uses DynamoDB as the back end; has a little JS and CSS

[neat jolt]

Thanks... Been doing some starter projects (rolling_dice, password_gen, calculator) which has been fun and good learning experience, just trying to figure out more of a pathway to more useable projects. Thanks again.

[magic aurora]

im an absolute beginner (basically forgot everything in college). is automation a good place to start?

[gleaming tiger]

I feel that there are more opportunities for software engineer (cpp, java) than algorithm engineer?

[dusty quail]

Hello friends. I have been working with flask and django framework for 4 years. I live in Iran and I love working on international projects. I'm happy to be able to help. Of course, I also have a team that has the ability to do React projects.

[smoky quest]

What's an algorithm engineer to you?

[gleaming tiger]

like image processing engineer(object detection) or anomaly detection in financial fields ?

[smoky quest]

These are software engineer or related

You may have more maths people in some areas too

[gleaming tiger]

But these require much different skills. Image processing requires 'image' knowledge, while those skills are completely not necessary in developing a web page .

[smoky quest]

I had classes about that at school. Some folks go through it as part of the normal curriculum, some specialization or through their job

This is just a domain among any others

[gleaming tiger]

And i found that there are more opportunities in background development and font-end development.

[smoky quest]

You mean backend

[gleaming tiger]

yeah

[smoky quest]

But even in these, these domains are very wide. Front-end may also include mobile, but depends on the definition

And sometimes, you may find yourself developping some VR or AR mobile app, which do require image processing. Or may develop some backend which require detecting anomalies

[gleaming tiger]

In company, I think, font-end developers are not supposed to have knowledge in image processing. Maybe another guy with related knowledge will join in the product developing.

[smoky quest]

not necessarily

[naive drift]

Hey I just passed my school

I know basics of programming and will pursue cs in my college, in the free time should I explore different subjects

Or study cs which they will teach in the college also?

[smoky quest]

Depends what you are optimizing for:

• learning different subjects could be enriching and exposing you to other mode of thinking and domains
• learning more about cs would make you have an easier time at school and learn some of the things they won't teach (especially around real life practices)

As usual, what you care might be more somewhere in the middle rather than the extremes

[naive drift]

Yes you are right, I want to start a start up, for that exposure to other subjects is important (eg, electronics) and deep knowledge of a single subject is also important (like cs)..so basically I lie in the middle of the spectrum

[gray anvil]

if you're talking about college as in university, my personal guideline for myself (in a UK uni) was:

half of my elective mods were niche areas of my degree that I was interested in, and half were outside my subject but also within my interests (language, psychology)

some stuff you can pick up from societies too if you're on the ball about joining useful ones

[naive drift]

Yes thats a good idea, I will keep it in mind.

[shadow mist]

Hey guys, I just recieved a job offering in which the company is trying to "low-ball" me. How do I ask for a higher salary without losing the offer?

[sly sable]

Hi 2all. How I can receive intern-job? Now I'm a beginner in Python. I just need more practice in real IT-company

[rotund orchid]

Both are fine, though python does have more job openings there than c+t does. In addition, Job opportunity for python will likely grow faster than c++ at apple, due in part to the emergence of machine learning and ai tech in the company.

[gleaming tiger]

Really? From what i see in China, python bring some but not much advantage in job market. On the other hand, being familiar with C++ implies that you have solid background knowledge in programming.

[radiant moon]

heh

[digital fjord]

it is very region dependent. Here the most hired for languages are PHP and Java

[gleaming tiger]

Yeah. Java software engineer is the most wanted, in China.(personal opinion)

[gray anvil]

it really depends on your region

I'm a ways South of China and Python/Ruby is in demand here for "proper" programming jobs

a lot of freelance work available for php

[digital fjord]

yeah, look what jobs are in your area before picking a language/framework if you want to be hireable, don't just learn vue.js and then get mad that all the jobs are for java server pages.

[ruby harness]

Thats what I'm doing. I looked around for jobs and it is mostly React. So I started learning React

[twin laurel]

Hey

I am into graduation and a year is only left

Still I haven't figured what should I do

Anyone any advice?

[gilded swan]

Do about what? @twin laurel

[vapid jay]

Do for a living

[keen moon]

I would say I'm a fairly advanced python user, code with Cython and stuff. Also got into C++ but still a beginner. I have a physics background. Is there any kind of carreer prospects for me in terms of python programming?

Been doing a lot of monte carlo simulations (particle transport)

[weak ginkgo]

Hello everyone, I don't know if it s the right channel but I need help please on my project

Is someone who can help me please?

[near ocean]

This isnt the right channel, try #❓｜how-to-get-help

[weak ginkgo]

@near ocean thank you for your support but I don't have right to post on this place

[near ocean]

You dont post there, you read how to claim a help channel and then you find an open one and post your question

[weak ginkgo]

Thank you

[marsh wind]

Data Science is a fairly common path for physicists. If you are not into that, web backend software engineer, devops or automation of different things can be interesting too

[twin laurel]

Well u can say that

[keen moon]

Isn't it kinda hard to get a position in web dev or automation without a degree?

[marsh wind]

don't you have degree is physics? sorry maybe I read you wrong, I inferred that from "I have a physics background." and "Been doing a lot of monte carlo simulations (particle transport)"

[keen moon]

No I mean

I have a bachelor in physics, and am finishing a masters in medical physics

[marsh wind]

also, there are quite some people who are getting web dev positions without any degrees whatsoever

[keen moon]

But I'm into software development

[marsh wind]

it might depend on country a bit, so if you mention yours it could help us to give you more targeted answer. But overall with bachelor and masters in physics you should not have hard time getting into software developemnt, especially if you did fair share of coding during your studies (on side or as part of them)

[keen moon]

Portugal, my thesis is 100% computational. I coded the physics, ray and sphere tracing, BVH, most of it in Cython, and some basic stuff in C++. I dunno how I can be useful, where someome else with a proper degree isn't better suited

[marsh wind]

don't underestimate yourself that's a common pitfall of people who has not the "proper" degree (also read a bit on imposter syndrome, that's very common thing).
It does not really matter what you coded. What matter is the fact that you coded and that you can showcase/explain to other what you did, how and why (on different levels of depth/abstraction depending if you speak to recruiter, developer or physicist) as well as the fact that you can prove you know some good practices and can apply them.

[runic jewel]

I came across a job advert this morning that said they don't provide any requirements for the perfect candidates, because there isn't a simply formula for the best candidate. Instead, the company said they just test the crap out of you and decide based on skills whether you're good enough. So, if you can find a company that approaches hiring in that way, you'll have no trouble. Not that you should be worried in the first place given what you've just said about your skills. Good luck!

[hoary heart]

with your background I think you'll probably be able to pick your employer (at least where I'm from Med-tech is aggressively talent-seeking). Unless you're keen to study more, if I were you I'd just make my CV nice and shiny and make a list of med-tech companies who you'd consider as employers. There may be some rejection but if you don' get some interest/follow through I'd find it hard to believe. I'm sure you'd be able to learn the tools that the team use on the job.

[hoary heart]

Haha, that's the hiring approach google pioneered "throw a broad net".

I'm not sure if it's like this everywhere but I've just been offered a job that was described that way (minimum requirements). I contacted them because I think the employer is interesting, though turned out the job is, er, not python. But they want to offer me a role anyway. Not sure how I feel.

[near ocean]

Tbh im not sure i'd like to go through batteries of tests just for some position not even mentioning base requirements

[hoary heart]

Depends on the employer.

When you think about it, if your employer has a big serious filter to get in then you can feel good once your there that you'll be working with capable people. Obviously there are plenty of holes in this theory.

[summer roost]

I know that one of the Python Steering Council members (the subset of CPython core developers who make decisions about the future direction of the language) has a physics background instead of computer science.

A 100% computational thesis that gave you experience in Cython, C++, and Python makes you a lot more valuable than you think.

Lots of finance companies hire physicists as programmers, too. The advanced math and computational modeling background is great for quantitative analysis

I know more than a few professional developers with physics doctorates and no computer science degree.

It also could take you far into the data science direction, if that's something you'd be interested in. Or machine learning. There are a lot of jobs that primarily attract computer science graduates, but where a CS background doesn't give enough math to be great at the job, and having both math and programming experience can help you skip the queue

[hoary heart]

I mostly hang out with physicists (since I was a web developer in a large physics department for many years and was the same age as the phds students at the time so made basically all my friends) ... about a third of the physicists who completed their doctorates in this millenium are now doing basically the same thing as me.

We're watching as all the physicists "decay" away from academia. One more friend who is extremely talented (did postdoc at princeton) finally quit last month in despair. That guy is so smart though, came with me to google recruiting event in CS department about 10 years ago and they picked him out immediately, so even though he still thinks he's an academic, he'll probably in tech (my world) soon 😕

[peak halo]

!warn 859597286097944627 Recruiting for paid opportunities is prohibited.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @vapid jay.

[vocal inlet]

What CS fields are heavy in math? Because people say you don't need to know a lot of math to do programming, but I want a field that utilizes math

[pulsar drum]

Data science, ML, graphics programming (e.g. for video games). That's by no means an exhaustive list.

[vocal inlet]

Data science/ML seems appealing to me

[haughty surge]

Math Improvement Link: https://www.thisworldthesedays.com/math-equation-explenation.html

[neat dune]

are you a Geant4 user too?!

i haven't met many people who work with it

[keen moon]

I'm not a user, but I do have to look into its source code from time to time. My work and geant4 are very similar. The difference is that geant4 is obviously much more mature and has contributions from much much smarter people than me

[keen moon]

@marsh wind @tawny skiff @hoary heart @summer roost your words are very heartwarming, I've actually been losing sleep over this

[summer roost]

You might have less computer science education than a CS student, but you have more math, and probably more experience maintaining large projects over time. Employers will find those valuable, don't worry.

[gray anvil]

not everything that involves programming requires Cs. I actually find most people employed in DS in my country did economics or statistics, or jumped into programming while leveraging their existing domain knowledge in related roles like marketing

[marsh wind]

I attest to that, having a PhD in physics and now working as Data Scientist/Project manager in AI-ish startup

[twin laurel]

Well am pretty bored of programming stuff and lost motivation to do it. Is there anything I can learn which Inolves littles programming?

[neon turret]

What are the easiest or most entry-level jobs that would apply to coding on python or any other language?

[marsh wind]

I know that feeling 🙂 you are welcome. Keep your head up and don't lose motivation and you'll be good

[tacit wharf]

How will the future of dev jobs look like with this in hand ?

[dense mesa]

Easier

[tacit wharf]

I'm scared.

This will only make the unemployment rate higher.

[dense mesa]

Or it will make developing quicker and easier?

[tacit wharf]

Gonna try to today and will respond accordingly

[molten oak]

I am looking for certified tester

[dense mesa]

Recruitment isn't allowed here

[tacit wharf]

What are recommeded skills required for a web dev job atm ?

[buoyant seal]

https://github.com/kamranahmedse/developer-roadmap

[runic jewel]

I've recently spent a lot of time reading about 'expertise' and from what I understand, the current trend in psychology is that years in profession, qualifications, nor the number of publications you have are very good predictors of your knowledge (particularly in identification tasks). So you need to test everyone. Now, that doesn't mean that people with long careers and good qualifications are useless, it just means they have other things to offer like contacts and behavioural traits that are likely to be beneficial. In other words, expertise as a term excludes the social side of experience and mainly pertains to knowledge and your ability to implement that knowledge.

[soft patrol]

Greetings from The Wholesome Company,

We are doing a webinar on - Data Processing Pipelines for Machine Learning & Deep Learning
This is especially helpful for getting internships.

It is free of cost and certificate will be provided on attending the webinar.
So register now!

https://bit.ly/MLDeepLearningWEBINAR

Guys please register!!

[dense mesa]

!rule 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[dense mesa]

@soft patrol

[vapid jay]

What are the needed skillset for python web developer 2021 ?

[radiant moon]

well obviously: you need to know at least one web framework like flask or django
wouldn't hurt to be comfortable with a database, and cloud service things like e.g. AWS s3, SNS

front-end stuff as well: js framework, css, html

[vapid jay]

okay

Thanks

[radiant moon]

build some web service thing and show it off
put the source code on github, get a hosting provider, and put it out there for the world to see
https://teensy.info/ is my example

[vapid jay]

yes , got it .

will do

[tepid whale]

Hi i'm currently a sophomore in Ghana in Kwame Nkrumah University of Science and Technology. I'm starting to develop a passion for the software field of computers and would like some advice on how i can be able to achieve the necessary skills so i can immediately get a job once i graduate. I'm not sure if you guys know much about Ghana and wanted to also ask about abroad opportunities.

[smoky quest]

Is the degree you are working on related to the field of computer science?

[tepid whale]

yep. I'm currently studying computer enginerring btw

[smoky quest]

sounds like you are on track then.
You could increase your odds by practicing outside of classes. That can make a lot of difference in terms grades

[tepid whale]

oh wow. it'll definitely make things harder because i'm pretty sure i have to maintain a good grade as well but i'm willing to do what it takes to achieve a good future lol

[smoky quest]

it depends.
Classes will typically only have X hours to cover a topic. By practicing more, you can build a better understanding and go deeper, which makes it then easier for your grades.

But yeah, the priority should be your grades

[tepid whale]

In KNUST in Ghana, we use a CWA system

oh wow. nice. I'm developing a passion for programming though. it seems in university, they wont really go into depth of it so i'll have to be an expert on my own

yep. I've heard. :).

[radiant moon]

they have the Internet on computers now

[tepid whale]

i've realized how high in demand programmers are

[vapid jay]

ur example was cool

[radiant moon]

tx

I don't think that ever helped me get a job, but you never know; and it was fun to build

[vapid jay]

it's a cool idea

[radiant moon]

it's sort of a cliché but ... 🤷

it's very hard for me to think up a project that is easy enough that I'll manage to finish it, but hard enough to be interesting. That was one of them. You'll notice I started it like 6 years ago 🙂

[humble nebula]

What are the most handy bunch of subjects to know if you want to build something

[radiant moon]

that would ... depend ... on what you're trying to build

[smoky quest]

in the context of a career, it's about relevant skills and tools to achieve the goals.
Whether to be more efficient or because they are used in your area

[reef violet]

would anyone mind reviewing my cover letter? Would prefer to pm

[gilded swan]

Hi does anyone have a resume on hand that i can use as a template? I have a career fair soon and want it to look good.

[viral tundra]

[rain lark]

Hi, I was wondering when you do attend live interviews and do coding problems there, is it an issue if you want to look up syntax of how to write a certain code?

(i was able to get away with looking up some syntax for online interviews)

[marsh wind]

I think it's something to clarify with the interviewer before the live coding starts.
generally interviewers don't really care that you don't remember by heart some specific syntax they won't to see how you think and approach the problem at hand. Having said that, if you can't write something basic like list comprehension, a simple class/function it can be alarming

[rain lark]

ic, thanks

[rough patrol]

I can not be satisfied in life. I can not finding myself in better company

[muted surge]

google docs has a few and i use one that is made for LaTeX

[shadow pewter]

hey guys

i graduated in civil engineering

but i think i don't like it, would be hard for me to start to learn python? i have all the time, i don't have a job, i can learn things fast and i have experience with delphi

[radiant moon]

probably pretty easy

[shadow pewter]

i am good at math and algorithms, what u guys recommend for me to start, how long u think it will take for me to learn

[radiant moon]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[frosty spindle]

i want help and mentoring in #machine-learning

#data-science-and-ml want to do project in this

[boreal adder]

Eeee — Today at 1:00 PM
Hi, I've noticed a lot of entry/junior level jobs in data analytics are more focused on excel and visualization skills. I'm more interested in data analysis/engineering but typically those roles have higher entry barrier. I'm wondering how realistic you think it would be for me to skip over the excel/visualization side and jump right into database management, data mining, cleaning, apis, and other stuff more geared toward data engineering.

I'm currently working on googles data analytics certification, and the process of data analysis really got me interested in the more technical side used in data engineering. I have a high school diploma, I've been learning python for almost a year, brushing up on my excel knowledge from high school, and I started the basics of SQL last week. Just to be clear I'm willing to bite the bullet and do work I don't enjoy as much to get where I want, but I would appreciate someone else's opinion on how attainable my goal is.

[dense mesa]

You need excel and visualisation

[shadow pewter]

could someone help me with just few minutes how to start in python, what i will need to download and use to edit, where to download, etc

i really want to learn it but i don't know how to even start

[dense mesa]

@shadow pewter go to general and type in !resources
This is a career discussion channel

[boreal adder]

Anything else?

[sick vigil]

ig this will be helpful
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqtD5dpn9C8

[vapid jay]

Imposable

[sick vigil]

what?

[vapid jay]

[sick vigil]

🙂

[vapid jay]

thats where i learned

[sick vigil]

lol sammee

[vapid jay]

but i picked the 6 h course. Why does this chat have like 20 second timeout wtf

[sick vigil]

lol

[vapid jay]

inb4 takes career discussion to ot channel

[vapid jay]

hey ive been wanting to learn python cuz i've heard that it helps in game development and ethical hacking

[late cloak]

I don't know many games that are developed in python, I think Mount and Blade was, but normally it's just leveraged for other tasks/features within the game itself. I'm not sure if that's what you meant. Think Lua is more heavily used for scripting though. Anywya, im not in the game industry

[vapid jay]

Long way to go for second, game dev can be started after basics. Practically right away after OOP

I wanna learn python can anyone hook me up with some lessons?

can send you few i used myself

[delicate garden]

Wouldnt c++ be more beneficial for game development

You could also try using the unreal engine

[smoky quest]

not necessarily. You won't make a AAA across multiple platforms.
So most languages, even python would be fine to make a game

[delicate garden]

True

[vapid jay]

Sure hmu on dms ig

[wild sundial]

I have 3 days to crash course Django for a job interview (coding session with some engineers). Any advice? 😅 I am currently going through a video series on making a blog.

[vapid jay]

Official Python tutorial imo

[spiral nimbus]

Hey guys, starting to look at career paths for CS. What are recommendations? For some background, I graduated with a nuclear engineering degree and self-teaching myself android app development and python

[main sleet]

What are you interested in? App development? Embedded systems? Web dev?

[spiral nimbus]

To be honest knowing myself there is very little I wouldn't be interested. That being said I haven't had much time experiencing each aspect to be able to say "oh I like/dislike that"

I do like app development and solving problems on the Hacker Rank website @main sleet

[main sleet]

Well, you already have a degree and when it comes to coding it’s more about willingness to learn anyways so that’s fine

Having the degree just shows you can commit and learn, there’s no reason why, with some practice and examples of work you have done in free time or at uni, that you can’t just apply for openings in your area

Start ups or smaller companies would be a good place to go as they would be more willing to hire on personality than somewhere big.

Have you had any exposure to coding other than the self taught stuff? @spiral nimbus

[spiral nimbus]

Very minimally at school, they skimmed over it but didn't do a good job so that's why I'm teaching myself

[main sleet]

Yeah that’s fair enough, I was lucky enough to have quite good computing departments… are you based in UK or elsewhere?

[spiral nimbus]

In the US

@main sleet

[late cloak]

Is the actual coding session in/about django, or is what they specified in their job description django? I'm just trying to understand if they were asking for x amount of years with it, and you have zero experience and now they're testing you on it, then that's gonna show 😅

[wild sundial]

For my screening, I told them that I only used it for a month or so and they said that was fine. From what they said, they want to see me setup a project and try to implement features that they will instruct me during the session.

[late cloak]

I'm guessing you're allowed to actually google stuff during this right?

[wild sundial]

Correct. Anything that is part of a normal day to day workflow.

[late cloak]

Oh okay lol.

[wild sundial]

Any good standard procedures that I should master in my timeframe? I have built a couple routes and some models but don't know what the core essentials should be.

[stoic talon]

Hi guys, I'm Brazilian, how are you?

[vivid bobcat]

Hallo ,can i ask a question but it is outside any matter here, i have presentation for my college about a job site like LinkedIn and i added some information like how much job searcher and what kind of jobs is available,
They required for the representation is to Wright 15 pages about most important things in this project and they ask me about what inside this pages, and I'm realy anxious and I'm afraid that i would not beable to convince them nor give them right answers , so if anyone interested into giving me any advices I'm realy much appreciated and my deadline will be tommorw , btw I'm not english speaker so please excuse me for my bad English ^_^.

[hollow kindle]

i have a question

[wary quarry]

Just keep following tutorials, you likely won’t master anything as a beginner in 3 days. Cover as many basics as possible

[hoary heart]

They say that Django is just: ORM + views/routing + templating engine so perhaps if you just have a conceptual understanding of these and know how to find your way to do basics in all 3 areas.

These days even templating is less used, as we're moving to API/js-frontend world.

Understanding views lays foundations here though. If you can ask question you should ask whether they expect you to be able to use CBVs.

(whether CBVs are basics really depends)

[keen moon]

where are you from?

[sick vigil]

guys i wanted to learn hacking so how can i learn it
i have also check on youtube but i can't find anything

[hoary heart]

in what sense? I'm pretty involved with django that's for sure. why do you ask?

[keen moon]

You said that med tech is talent seeking where you from

[main sleet]

Not sure if the server is allowed to tell you exactly how to or where to learn how to hack…. But If you’re interested in cyber security, pen testing or ethical hacking I would look at hackthebox and cyber discovery I’m sure udemy or khan academy would have some good courses as well

[hoary heart]

Ah. Australia.

[hoary heart]

Not sure what you're searching but defcon didn't come up in your searches?

[sick vigil]

yes they were showing 20 mins video with title"how to hack wifi password"

[sick vigil]

oh okaayy thank youu

[vapid jay]

You a skid bro

[sick vigil]

bruh ig its doesn't matter right

anyone can learn it

[vapid jay]

not anyone unless you get around the wrong people

[keen moon]

Well, Australia do be scary

[wild sundial]

Thank you for your reply. I have yet to delve into hooking up React to Django though I have a playlist saved. It shouldn't be too complicated to do right?

@hoary heart I've seen a Django project where the React front was completely separate (Docker backend, Yarn front). I am guessing that requires hooking in templates in settings.py?

[slate rivet]

I don't know if this is the right place to ask but I need help choosing a career, I'm soon going to college but I cannot decide a major... I've narrowed it down to Computer Science, IT, Software / Computer Engineer..

[radiant moon]

sure seems like the right place to ask
I mean the name is #career-advice 🙂

[radiant moon]

also, choosing a major, and choosing a career, are two very different things
people often find themselves with a career that they didn't deliberately choose
but of course you do choose your college major
I know nothing, but still: my hunch is that any of the three majors you listed will be fine for your career

[devout furnace]

Is a bachelors degree in cs good enough to find a good job in python? Or should i go for a masters

[radiant moon]

🤷
I don't even have a bachelor's, and I've had programming jobs for a long time

[devout furnace]

Wow lol

How much is the pay?

[near ocean]

A relevant bachelor's or any bachelor's in general, also can you talk about how you got into the industry without a degree

[shadow moss]

Whatever let’s you graduate. Degree in “right major” > Degree >>>>> No degree

[stoic talon]

gente

[devout furnace]

How are the hours and days and stuff?

[radiant moon]

40-hour weeks most of the time. Occasional "cruch mode"

[radiant moon]

No bachelor's at all. I got a two-year degree from a community college, and got a job through their co-op program. From then on, employers only cared about my previous work experience, not my education (which strikes me as quite sensible)

[devout furnace]

So an associates degree? I think thats what its called

[balmy spade]

Similar. I have a two-year general ed degree and more than a decade of retail worker experiencing. I applied for an internship with a tech company, got the job for my communication skills and "good attitude", and proved myself from there.

[radiant moon]

exactly

[devout furnace]

Would you reccomend i get a bachelors degree? Are there any benefits that it has over an associates

[radiant moon]

well they say that some employers will ignore you if you don't have one
I personally found four-year college to be a waste of time and money, so never graduated
YMMV of course

[balmy spade]

It's definitely a personal choice situation. A degree shows dedication to a goal and accomplishment. It's something you can leverage when interviewing and negotiating. How far it goes? Well that's going to depend on the company.

[rigid talon]

I beg to differ

I feel degrees can be a waste of time when it comes to some things. I'm far more capable of doing more being the self taught learner i am than anything school has offered me.

I currently am dropped out of highschool yet I'm studying university level material and have cs knowledge far ahead of what they would teach me rn

I believe you could still get a job as a software engineer or any developer purely based off of your projects, github and stack overflow and possibly some ceritifates. Internships are great too.

[summer roost]

it's possible, yes, but it's a much more difficult path.

and that depends a lot on the country - there are countries were it isn't possible at all.

[balmy spade]

Very true that each country has different requirements. I'm self-taught and not at all a fan of "school". But I do try and temper my opinions, giving credit to just how hard school actually is. It is an accomplishment that doesn't deserve to be overlooked.

[digital fjord]

here, every single tech job requires either a trade school or a degree

[radiant moon]

fwiw, here's an economist who wrote a book called "The Case Against Education" https://www.aei.org/education/higher-education/the-case-against-education-a-long-read-qa-with-bryan-caplan/

[summer roost]

that's specific to America, keeping to the point that it's country specific.

it's one of those things that's heavily influenced by survivor bias: people hear the success stories about someone who never went to college and landed their dream job anyway, but you never hear about the people who never went to college and wound up under-employed for the rest of their lives. There's more of them, but they're harder to single out and draw attention to.

[summer roost]

To answer your original question: employers will view an associate's degree less favorably than a bachelor's degree, but much more favorably than no degree at all. Back of the napkin, it's maybe 80% as useful as a bachelor's degree, let's say.

But also, the degree isn't the most useful thing that you get from college. Networking, building a support system of others in your field, resources that can help you land internships or co-ops, the opportunity to work is a teacher's assistant or a research assistant, etc are all more valuable than the degree itself.

Especially internships. Internships are hard to get without going to college, and they're incredibly, unbelievably useful, at least in the software development field. They're far, far more useful than literally anything else you could spend your time doing or learning.

in the US, college is expensive, and I buy the argument that a 4 year school isn't necessarily the best choice, and that a 2 year associate's degree might be a better choice - and I think it's much better than no degree. But if you do go for the 4 year degree, there's a lot of things that you can do with your time while in college that can drastically increase your return on investment.

[balmy spade]

In the states, again, the community colleges are tightly partnered with local business to produce the talent desired. It's actually how I got my internship, talking with the director of the local college. It would have been harder to know the opportunity was there, but not impossible. So, yeah, the networking is super powerful.

[devout furnace]

I see, thank you

What exactly do you do in software development internships?

[summer roost]

yeah. none of these things are necessities, but they're all helpful steps. At the very least, going to a community college and getting an associates degree is more helpful to you for getting a good job than not going to any college and not getting any degree.

[balmy spade]

"learn" is my knee-jerk answer to that

[summer roost]

it'll depend on the company, but in a nutshell, you'll learn to develop some software with actual business value as part of a team.

you'll see what it's like to work on a project that has been around for several years, most likely - which is a very different development experience than you are likely to have already had. And you'll learn about how decisions are made about where to invest resources on a product, and you'll learn how to collaborate with others on a project.

[balmy spade]

Our intern devs spend their days working closely with the product owner, learning all the systems they support. They also get tasked with light-weight stories, often tech-debt. Something that challenges them, but is doable.

And hopefully the company lets (and encourages) you to sit with other teams/processes. Soaking in all the knowledge while gauging where your interests lay for possible full-time.

[summer roost]

I went to a school that has a co-op program, so I had three 6-month full-time internships as part of a 5 year college program. I spent 9 months (6 months plus my only summer vacation) working full time at a research lab for the school working on a research project about performing geolocation and ad-hoc peer-to-peer networking over WiFi (and continued that job part time during the next school year), then the next year I spent 6 months working full time on an expert system for generating safety data sheets at a large chemical company, and the next year I spent 6 months working full time at a small hardware company whose flagship product was a device you could tap into a fiber line to record all data transferred over the fiber network to disk for an hour or so.

and from these experiences I learned a lot about how to work as part of a team, and I learned what sort of skills employers care about, and I learned what types of jobs I do and don't enjoy

[summer roost]

a huge part of being a professional developer is dealing with technical debt, and most developers are never exposed to it at all before their first industry job. Working on an existing codebase than many people have contributed to is a very different experience.

[vapid jay]

Interesting

[balmy spade]

Vastly different, which is why we don't shy away from saying "pick a story, we're here to help as you complete it". Sometimes I shake my head at our "drink from a fire-hose" methods but it seems to turn out okay. At least, very few of the interns I've mentored have done more than say "this is a lot" Most bring new improvements we've never thought of

[radiant moon]

in my experience, most interns are about as good as regular new-hires

[shadow mist]

Any advice for a new quant on growing?

[balmy spade]

Moral here: Never under-estimate the value you bring to an employer being the fresh set of eyes.

[dense mesa]

Trading, research or SWE?

[shadow mist]

Mix between trading and SWE; My role mainly consists of testing strategies and automating them.

[drifting condor]

anyone here doing the freelancing on web scraping and automation ?

[shadow mist]

Done that before.

[drifting condor]

What are the best tool you used and how it goes?

[marsh wind]

What's drunk from fire hose method?

[sage pumice]

variation on "bite off more than you can choose"?

[thin narwhal]

What online certificates it has for software engineering?

[hoary heart]

Having been on all sides of the degree v. not university degree argument, and as an employer tl&dr for me is that: uni is long and hard.

That means people who have completed a degree have proven themselves to be smart, determined and likely gritty. Non-uni people can be those things but don't bank on it, but for people who have a degree you can at least be 100% sure they can finish an assignment. Those who did well can finish a hard one on time. I've been burned by making these assumptions incorrectly of non-uni-educated people.

Take from this what you will, but anecdotally this is my experience.

[balmy spade]

Not a lot of our teams have a intro-course to our processes/structure/setups. It is very much an all-or-nothing learning experience and we just encourage new team members that they are in no way expected to remember everything. Not on day one, week one, or even month one.

It's actually something my company is slowly catching up on. Breaking thing down into consumable pieces with better documentation.

[vapid jay]

Hi, can I add my bootcamp projects to GitHub and show it to the recruiter

[reef kayak]

Yea why not

If I adding dynamodb as a skill then would it be Amazon dynamodb or just dynamodb?

[gray anvil]

I think aws /amazon dynamodb actually pings better on keyword searches

[vapid jay]

college part is probably country specific too

[dense mesa]

<@&831776746206265384>

[inner fox]

Yes, you can get away with it in western countries but in Asian countries and even Oceania it's essential, just a different culture

[dense mesa]

<@&831776746206265384> once again

[lime bay]

I'm looking for a resume template like this. Would be grateful if anyone had one.
https://i.redd.it/z4n2fw2vv5971.png

[humble mist]

This is fairly close I beleive https://github.com/ChrisDienes/latex_resume

[lime bay]

It's not the exact one but thanks for the GitHub. It pointed me to latex where I can look for the one I want.

[dense mesa]

https://latexresu.me

[devout furnace]

Anyone here from NY? I need to know if there are any good python jobs here, is there like a website to find them

[cold hollow]

LinkedIn

[devout furnace]

Thank u

[spice musk]

This is the one I believe. You just need to move the sections around https://www.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/7y8k6p/im_an_exrecruiter_for_some_of_the_top_companies/

[vapid jay]

[lime bay]

Thanks. Very Helpful

[wild sundial]

How common is it to get coding tests about API's and such? For an interview, I was asked to setup a Flask HTTP service for get and post and blanked out as I had no idea what to do. I was unable to implement 406 for get and 403 for post.

[gray anvil]

dunno about common, but I had to pass one to get my current role

[wild sundial]

I am coding it out in flask now so that I can deepen my understanding. The get seems easier than I thought, I assigned a variable to request.args.get and if not the right type, then return 406. The POST seems tricky though with authentication for 403

[late cloak]

I had to do that, but it was only a GET. I was allowed to google but didn’t really need it since they let me use whatever I was most comfortable with.

[iron drum]

Walmart Mock Test
We are at the peak of the on-campus and off-campus recruitment drive happening in and around colleges. So this week, Coding Ninjas will help you prepare for the Walmart recruitment for third and fourth-year engineering students.

What is Walmart?
It is an American multinational retail corporation that operates a chain of hypermarkets, discount department stores, and grocery stores from the United States.

ABOUT THE TEST
We are conducting a mock test series from 3rd – 10th July, 2021 for Walmart Labs Recruitment 2021. This mock test will feature a series of coding and MCQs that can help you get a hang of the real-time interview at Walmart and prepare you for the same.
MOCK TEST SERIES SCHEDULE:
Date: July 3 - July 10, 2021
Duration-90 min (10 aptitude and 3 Coding problems)
Test Link: https://lnkd.in/gUQZh8T

ABOUT WALMART OFF CAMPUS DRIVE:
The MNC is currently recruiting for various IT-based positions at entry-level and is known for conducting a minimum of 6 rigorous interview rounds which includes the following:
Coding Test
Telephonic Round
Technical GD
One-on-one with the Hiring Manager
2 HR rounds

If you guys want you can participate

[empty oracle]

Hi guys
Just wanted to ask if Python is enough for a OOP language on the resume?

[thin karma]

Hey guys, what is the best way for a beginner to build a 'portfolio'? Should smaller projects from school classes be added to GitHub as a starter?

Is GitHub the thing that I have to show to recruiters?

[abstract pawn]

do you know coding forza?

[thin karma]

Sort of. I took 1 year certificate, so I know the basics. Currently working on my personal Python project

[abstract pawn]

ok so I got speech recognition in my code and I want it to recognizie me by my voice, any possibilities??

[thin karma]

I have background in marketing and economics. Python is my new 'bonus skill'

[charred furnace]

@abstract pawn probably not the best place to post your question, try #❓｜how-to-get-help or #data-science-and-ml

[abstract pawn]

no other places are available bro

your probably right tho

😖

[thin karma]

Are you based in the US?

[wheat radish]

Based in Stockholm, Sweden. Remote work is possible!

[vapid jay]

Hey, @wheat radish, we do not allow for recruitment. Sorry.

[mild stag]

hello, this might not be specifically related to the chanel's topic, but I will ask anyway: can anybody tell me if having a decent set of skills in C/Cpp/Py and some common frameworks can, in any way, guarantee some stable job positions?

[safe loom]

What do you mean by frameworks? Web? ML? Usually the people I knew with C/C++ background worked in embedded systems

[sterile vault]

I've personally briefly worked on a project which involved C++ library with Python wrapper (FreeCAD). Being able to understand (or, maybe, even modify) C++ source code would be a valuable asset.

But the only thing that "guarantees" a job is having a CEO dad.

So - a lot of stuff related to 3d and computation where people rely on C/C++ extensions to speed up the Python code. Unfortunately, I don't know what's the job market here.

[inner wren]

Server Information

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[onyx kite]

$ 2000,00 every month for working with ERP system is a good salary?

[gray anvil]

2000 dollars with a comma? you being paid in euros or what

[onyx kite]

2000 USD or R$ 10.000

[wary quarry]

Good salary is largely dependent on your cost of living and financial needs

[spark cedar]

How long does it take to become DS full-stack developer

I'm really confused on what to do tbh

i want to do full stack. but also specialize in an ML field.

I don't specifically know how I should self-learn and in what order I should self-learn these topics

my end goal is to eventually build a start-up

any tips on ways to approach this career option?

[onyx kite]

for me it's pretty great

[vapid jay]

is there anyone doing their CS degree in germany?

[solar jacinth]

Hi everyone, I am looking for some industry info from someone who works in/is familiar with privacy engineering. Anyone here that could chat with me a little bit? 😄

[late cloak]

Do you have a degree or complete a bootcamp?
Also if you want to specialize in ML you’d be looking for that specific position. Full stack wouldn’t help with that.

[spark cedar]

I'm going into undergrad this fall.

hmm i see. Don't ML Engineers need to know full-stack tho?

because I also want to build applications (since goal is ML startup)

[late cloak]

Guess a better question is are you gonna be pursuing to get your start up off the ground after your undergrad? I was more answering if you pursue a job you’ll focus on ML positions rather than full stack. Anyway, yes if you want to do everything, then you’ll need to be familiar with everything. 😅

[spark cedar]

Ah i see. Ideal would be to learn ML + Full stack in the fastest but also most intuitive way as possible and start pursuing startups during undergrad if opportunity seems feasable.

to pursue this, what do you think i should learn first then? ML/DS or full-stack?

[near ocean]

Why would ML engineers need to know full stack?

[late cloak]

I don't think he wants to be an ML engineer, seems like he just wants to start a startup. So they're thinking they have to do everything on their own, but really interested in ML ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[vapid jay]

Is it worth doing cs degree is a developing country? Im thinking of this before doing it or do electrical engineering and do programming on the side but im afraid i might not have time to do it. If i take cs maybe i wont find a good job and wont get enough but i wanna do it. If i take EE maybe i wont like idk and ill just do it for money. I started game development maybe thats why im intersted in it. If cs is not worth it i could so free lencing but maybe may parents lol. Idk man deciding is challenging. I could easily take it but not im considering other factors.

[crude crown]

If you're aiming towards money, don't go to ECE. Nowadays software in general pays quite better compared to the even better paying fields in ECE... but that's today.

[crude crown]

Not full stack, but there's for sure a tendency to for ML engineers to be considered as a sort of jack of all trades (except frontend development stuff). Ask me how I know... To be honest, in a typical ML Engineer role nowadays, you're looking at 80% (at the most if you're lucky, if not more) of the time being focused on backend development/data engineer kind of stuff.

But, for sure, there are situations where you might happen to be more focused on "data science" like stuff than rather data engineering stuff.

[lament pawn]

Is there an option to go full remote working in another country?

[late cloak]

Think that’s totally up to the company and having to deal with that scenario. Feel like it’s harder to find a company okay with doing that.

[gray anvil]

yeah. out of sight, out of mind, can't see it being good for progression either. unless by another country you mean eindhoven to antwerp or something

[maiden narwhal]

if you are a recruiter what type of project will you look to hire a guy with no experience ?

[smoky quest]

the closest to my business

[maiden narwhal]

haha true may be i should frame my question what should be good project to showcase so i get a job

[smoky quest]

same answer

If I am a business doing a mobile app, I won't care about your wordpress website

and vice versa

[maiden narwhal]

ah i see so there is no good answer its too generalised i guess

[smoky quest]

exactly. Not having experience makes you a huge unknown.
Having a degree demonstrates you have had an education and been taught various areas and people will be betting that investing in you will pay off. Or you don't have a degree and then it's all about reducing the risk of hiring you and showing that you are worth hiring comparing to the 10s of other resumes with a degree

[maiden narwhal]

well said i have a degree but not in computer science so i am skeptical and i am looking for a career change

[smoky quest]

You may want to see how you could leverage your existing degree and how applicable it could be in the context of CS

[maiden narwhal]

got a degree in civil engineering not sure how can i find connection

[smoky quest]

me neither. But it's worth investigating

[gray anvil]

civil engineering surely has applications for programming. idk, traffic flow modelling? I'm sure there are tons things someone with domain knowledge of civil engineering could do after learning some programming for data analysis

or perhaps there are companies developing programs for civil engineering use cases that you can try and join

[hoary heart]

yeah, seems like having a small coding portfolio and and UG in civeng would be easy for career change, tbh I've seen lots of people do this transition, tons of (other) engs (ee, mech, etc) getting in to swe in my xp.

just having completed an UG degree, demonstrates diligence, picking up coding (have you done much?) should be fine. Just pick which part of tech you want to go after, web? data eng? infra/plumbing? and do some homework

[gilded swan]

Is it ever to early to apply to jobs? I only know how to solve easy hackerrank problems in Python and i only know the syntax for HTML, CSS, Javascript, and SQL.

[radiant moon]

if you don't have the qualifications for a particular job -- and aren't even close -- then you're just wasting their time and yours by applying

[thorn osprey]

can i learn python after learning it can i code a bot ?

[late cloak]

Do you have a degree, bootcamp, or just self taught? Seems like you’re not that confident in your own skill set. Also, entry levels are not gonna drop you in expecting to know everything. In the case of only able to solve easy hackerrank problems, in one hand is fine, but that’s mostly what all interviews will test you against. So being able to solve medium difficulty problems would be somewhat necessary, or you’ll find it hard to get passed first round of tech interview.

[sage pumice]

yes and yes, many people have done it

[thorn osprey]

so where can i learn it sir/maam ?

[sage pumice]

!resources have you looked at these?

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[vapid jay]

Hi yall, LF a MENTOR. to guide me through the learning process, applying, work etc. Everything really. Someone experienced maybe, who could spare some time and knowledge. Thank you.

[mortal wedge]

I can't commit to being a mentor, but am always more than happy to answer questions here. I would encourage you to think of the learning process as being somewhat separate from the job application process, as what you're learning for your job is not necessarily what you're learning to land the job. Some tips off the top of my head:

There are three steps towards getting a job:

1. Getting the interview: This is influenced by resume/people skills
2. Nailing the interview: This is generally familiarity with the language and tools you need along with practice answering both algorithmic/knowledge questions and having answers for behavioral questions.
3. Not getting fired: This is where you'll need to practice the actual skills that you're using on the job.

I would look at this list and try to figure out what you still need to do and what you need to focus on.

[silver tinsel]

Hey all, I have three pretty broad but related questions (to each other, and to python). Anyone's thoughts, experience, or 2 cents would be appreciated:

1. I want to build a web app for my company and host it on an intranet. Very simply two pages, one basically accepting data in a form, the other displaying an interactive dashboard with Dash of the input data (time series type stuff). I'd like the site to be pretty and modern but not flashy. Is Django & Python enough to do all this?

2. Do companies hire junior developers where 90% of their experience is Django & Python? Or is a much broader scope of HTML, CSS, and JS necessary. I understand it might be preferred, but do these types of jobs even exist?

3. Does anyone or has anyone ever heard of freelance developing using just Django & Python? This freelancing job would be the primary income stream, not a side hussle.

[smoky quest]

1. Yes. Maybe even too much depending on what you want
   2 yes. Junior are juniors by definition and are more looked at for potential growth than past experience
   3 yes

[silver tinsel]

Thanks bud. If it's not obvious from my questions I'm trying to gain experience now to make a transition into a career as a Python developer in maybe 5 years or less. I'm very concerned with do it go all in on one language and a couple frameworks and libraries (Python and Django for example), or do I try to become a generalist and spend my time divided between html, css, js, Python, sql, etc. At least for the vast majority of my time / knowledge in the short term, meaning the next few years

[smoky quest]

This came up recently: https://github.com/ossu/computer-science

It may be easier to group them by how many doors they open. For instance starting with html+css+javascript opens the door to anything website/frontend, while python/sql is more on the backend side

[silver tinsel]

Wow this is a tremendous resource! Thank you, I hadn't seen this before

[hollow peak]

i have just graduated highschool and im really interested in coding, but I'm not sure what career paths are open if i take this route. i don't know much about jobs or companies to work for. I'm just really interested in coding and would like to do it for a living.

[radiant moon]

if you code it, they will hire 🙂

[mighty dawn]

Hey guys...

[neon kite]

Hello

[mighty dawn]

I am suresh.... I am a beginner in python and currently I am working in legacy machines....I see that, using pythong, django, flask -> we can create web application and some oter, we can create windows applications etc.. which is best to enter....

[full cedar]

Just make sure to first: Research in what type of career best interest you. Secondly, know the recommendations and requirements of the working ethics behind that role. Lastly, practice coding a lot, and you'll eventually be inside a job in no time.

[proud rapids]

hey guy i have a question, electronic devices have computer inside them but when we mention about electronic/electrical engineer, mostly they rarely mention about working on computer issue rather than software engineer ?

[inner fox]

Hey, I want to make a blog website from scratch and use Django for it. Any good websites/books to learn practical Django from?

Books would be more preferable

Maybe I should look in #web-development lol

[radiant moon]

yeah ... iirc the django tutorial is a blog, or something like it

[inner fox]

Which Django tutorial?

Link 😬

[radiant moon]

sorry, it's a poll
https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/3.2/intro/tutorial01/

[inner fox]

Is there a book published by Django devs

[full forge]

Electrical engineers work with electrical equipment, and their job responsibilities may include researching, designing, testing, and maintaining devices. They help improve things like power generation, communications, and navigational technology I dont think they deal with softwares

[smoky quest]

They can. It depends also if you look at high power or low power

There are also things in between software

In the industrial context, there are also PLCs

[full forge]

Yes

[spark island]

so a side career thing im gonna do when im 18, and start when im about 16, is building a phone and electronics franchise that allows enhanced work and speeds on standard electronics for no appearant reason, is this a good idea? (total cost to produce a phone would be 250+cost of workers+profit for me+ any extra parts decided, so itd be a 250 dollar phone. is that worth it? or? yes its python related since I am infact coding and doing everything in python.

[smoky quest]

how does python relates to the phone?
Why doing it at all if there are no reasons?
How do you plan on keeping the cost that low per unit?

[spark island]

notice every worker except people that work on servers, would be a seasonal or volunteer job also with very short shigts

[spark island]

well, apple should have their cost at about 200, so producing a phone for 250, thats better than an apple for only 500 and apple can still make profit at 200 dollars, i dont think itd be that hard

and python can be used for hardware, so I can make a phone with python (ill be 18 in a few years, about 2 and a half)

[desert moat]

You are not getting components as cheap as apple would. It's not as easy to find workers who'd agree with low payment and seasonal work.

I still don't understand what it is exactly you're going for.
Your own build and your own OS?

[full forge]

yes the first time investment in it would be sky high

[spark island]

or i can develop the hardware on my own as i am right now, and apple for their bottom line phones such as a standard 12 costs as low as 50, and the price for me to even produce a single phone woulld be 250

[spark island]

yes, cause I dont exactly like the current phone wars, and Id like to build a phone that blasts other companies out of the way so that people start moving to a single brand phone instead of fighting over 2 or having to take a while to decide, if there was a company that could just have a phone better than them all, and be able to get 2 of the one phone instead of spending so much for another brand (1000) it would end it all

the current phone model even has sim access

meaning, if i were to build the phone, I can place my current samsung card in it, and it should work, just no calls or anything of that sort yet.

[desert moat]

MS tried to do that. It's incredibly difficult to compete with iOS and Android on the OS market, and even more difficult to be seen on the phone producers market.

[spark island]

microsoft, yeah people dont really like billionaires starting stuff, so thats a no brainer

[desert moat]

You need to think of making people find you, trust you, risking switching, supporting apps that are almost essential now, and much more.

[spark island]

mhm, first app ive started on has been the calculator app

python makes it easy to do first so yeah.

[desert moat]

People want so much more... Social media, mail, calendars, etc. And they want existing services, not new ones.

And also, support for the product, both the phone and the OS.

[spark island]

so my plans with the hardware is to make pretty much any other app able to be transported over no matter what programming language it uses. c++, C#, Java, Javascript, and html, which some apps do use.

thats my plan, not for sure since c# is very picky with what it goes with from my knowledge

[desert moat]

Good luck!

[spark island]

Thanks.

I forgot to mention that I dont need translators cause I know a bit of german, japanese, and mandarin chinese, and planning to learn more so pretty much every job is covered. plan on learning indonesian for no reason also.

[smoky quest]

imho, you are aiming way too high and forgetting a lot of things.
You should start a cost estimate on what you will need, pieces you will need, costs etc.

[spark island]

I have already basically assembled a 8 GB Schematic for it.

[smoky quest]

based on what? Have you built a prototype yet?

[spark island]

not in person

[smoky quest]

Have you also established the cost based on the bom? What about extra devices (camera, etc.)?

What about the software?

worked out the battery requirement and power usage?

The placement of the antennaS?

[spark island]

it has a camera, motherboard, currently only 8 gb of memory, wanna make that 16, processor equivillent of my current phone, sim slot, antenna, gps, about 16 hour battery life, 4K screen, 7 inch big (hopefully), usb type C charger type, back screen that is 1080p touchscreen for taking pictures with the back camera as it wont have a front, 3K video, and 12 megapixel pictures, subwoofer and treble mini speakers, and topped with a carbon fiber case (real carbon fiber)

[smoky quest]

and just to be clear, you have that worked out down to the bom?

[spark island]

not sure what bom is

[smoky quest]

bill of material

[spark island]

250 consumer price.

[smoky quest]

think of it as a spreadsheet with the list of every single components, their exact model numbers and costs

[spark island]

(USD)

[smoky quest]

which motherboard do you plan to use?

[spark island]

well originally it was gonna be a raspberry pi due to it already having the capabilities of allowing python to run mass ammounts of memory, and stuff like that, but i think im going to hard code that and switch to another motherboard which probably is cheaper, and more effective at being thin.

im not exactly sure what packages to use in a scenario for doing things like that in hard code tho.

and a raspberry pi has pre installed packages to handle processors without you needing it in your code

[smoky quest]

These are the things which may snowball

Especially that you have to connect that to all the devices in a compact and efficient manner

[spark island]

the problem ive had finding parts that would be thinner, is i cant use another brands parts, cause copyright, and whatnot, and raspberry pi is too big yes, but I litterally have not been able to find anywhere which sells phone parts which sat what their compatible with

and all sources online for building mobile devices point to raspberry pi

[smoky quest]

well, there is the zero, but either way it will require skills in electronics

Which is why I am pointing at this being a very big endeavor where entire companies have failed. You would have much better success with smaller projects

[spark island]

agh the zero and pico are dumb cause they will cost more than their worth and the processors and memory is very low

[smoky quest]

The battery to run a normal rpi alone for 16h is not what I would exactly called phone sized

so there is that

[spark island]

main problems Ive really had with getting it thin. there are types of raspberry pi with very little components like the A, but are olld and outdated.

and dont have toppers such as hats

[smoky quest]

right. However if you go with a rpi, plus battery, plus devices, plus hats, that won't fit in anyone's hands

[spark island]

yeah

exactly. but there are very small mobile device companies that sell their parts for cheaper and whatnot, but since their small, ussually arent the best for projects like this

in quote of the chinese "a smart phone shouldnt take future technology, it should be easy and fast to make"

[smoky quest]

I completely disagree. Phones are very much high tech. They use the latest, greatest and most advanced technologies available

[spark island]

well not exactly, in america we just care about them being thing and big, while if you go to china phones are ussually taller and thinner but also thicker

[smoky quest]

like which model?

[spark island]

Well uhh theres no american translation for them.

they dont really use iphones in china. its mostly androids alot of samsung

[smoky quest]

You can find samsung and oneplus everywhere. Are you referring to other kinds?

[spark island]

yeah, you can even litterally go to places and get entirely custom phones

[smoky quest]

mind writing down the chinese name? I can figure out the rest

thanks! You got me curious about that part

[spark island]

theres hundreds one is luckystar which produces iphones, and they will do custom phones and stuff, but itlll have to use android or iphones pre built in

[lime estuary]

Men why it doesn't work?

[desert moat]

Incorrect indentation.

And comparison operator is == not =.

And semi-colon is missing after the if comparison.

[full forge]

colon or semicolon?

i think colon

[vapid jay]

@full forge Don't worry, he's fixed it now

[dense mesa]

@spark island take it from someone doing engineering, this is a cool personal project, but competing with any company is out of the question for years

[dense mesa]

People aren't simply gonna buy from you because they "don't really like billionaires starting stuff", this is a huge oversimplification of a complex problem, and not one that works in your favour

[dense mesa]

What happens when people want apps for the Play/App Store on their phones? They're all gonna be running on a VM in your Python environment?

[dense mesa]

You're closing off entire markets there because you think some knowledge of a language is enough to translate a phone OS into. This is really not the case, translation can be highly technical, and doing one language alone will take tens of hours

[dense mesa]

Think about why they have prebuilts. If it was as easy as you make it out to be, why would these companies knowingly waste their money on more expensive parts? (Hint: there's a good reason and it's because it's cheaper)

Do it as a personal project to learn about this stuff, showcase it somewhere and so on. For legal reasons at the very least, DO NOT try to sell this as a consumer good before getting a legal consultation.

[safe loom]

I have a question about careers in IT in general since I've seen the growth of the general salaries for US and the world. Can IT jobs face decline and be less paid? I'm kinda worried since I ditched my plans 2 yrs ago to do IT like data and web.

[dense mesa]

Can you expand on what you mean by "data" and "web"?

[safe loom]

By that I mean I have gotten some experience in data science and AI on top of webdev skills.

[vapid jay]

Yo

[ashen elk]

IT doesn't seem to be slowing down anytime; if you are talking about your job being automated then that's another matter

[ashen elk]

what's your current bg btw?

[safe loom]

1 year of Python (PyTorch, scikit-learn, Flask, Django), some knowledge in Java, some experience in JS (React) and some knowledge in SQL. Before that I was doing an earth sciences master.

[ocean ledge]

the relevant thing is "what projects have you worked on at work?"

[safe loom]

Computer vision problems and putting a ML model in production

[gilded swan]

What projects do you guys have on your portfolio?

[near ocean]

Couple webapps, my thesis, small python scripts, small js canvas things right now

[patent void]

How do I make projects with scrapy,

Ideally I want to use it to look for intelligence on the dark web as a job

[charred brook]

!unsubscribe

[patent void]

What was that

[smoky quest]

you may have better luck in #python-discussion .
This channel is about career discussions

[vapid jay]

what would be a better career path with python (web dev, data scientist, app dev)?

app developer includes game devs

app dev? game devs?

thatll be a bad industry to focus on, for web dev you dont need algebra and other stuff to be a web dev

eh im rly good at math i don't have a problem with it

also if youre gonna be a game dev with python, dont because you will have to make the most basic ass game ever

wait why? what about people who make big games/ apps? I'm counting apps like netflix and stuff in app dev

the one problem with web dev which i have is that new frameworks keep coming and u gotta keep learning them

DS is my number one right now but i might be overlooking some advantages to other positions

[vapid jay]

idk about app dev, i only know that you can make basic games with python, and being game dev is a terrible industry if your gonna use python or C#

[vapid jay]

oh i see. well would you choose DS or web dev?

[vapid jay]

web developer but it's your choice

which career makes the most

plus, my dad told me that Data scientists are on demand

web developers make most I think

actually i will check on google

[shadow moss]

What is your degree in?

[vapid jay]

im in middle school

it seems to have no specific answer due to the amount of variables

[shadow moss]

Your way too early to specialize, just focus on general programming

[vapid jay]

I could've known that earlier

to me personally making UI's seems to be fun but i don't wanna become an expert in it and then end up having to learn DS or web frameworks

i mean i would rather get super good at something than be ok at a ton of things

[shadow moss]

You have 5-9 years before workforce. Alot can change

[vapid jay]

u have a point there

[shadow moss]

Even as entry level, you can jump

[vapid jay]

hmm alright so if i get into an entry level position for web dev i can go to DS?

the problem with that is that my experience would be toward web dev and that might impact what job i get

one last question. Should i spend time making games in pygame? i mean, is it useful?

[sterile vault]

Gamedev is a fun way to really hammer down some concepts, like why OOP is useful.
However, it's near-zero chance that you would be doing that professionally.

[shadow moss]

Maybe, it’s hard to say. DS requires a degree generally

But web dev to game dev or back is easily doable

[dense mesa]

What?

[vapid jay]

does DS have a seperate degree? i thought there is only one degree for coding

[vapid jay]

wdym what

[vapid jay]

i see. i do need to improve at using classes since i have close to no experience with them

[dense mesa]

Data scientists usually have a degree in data science, maths, stats or CS

[vapid jay]

math? for DS? i get that u need math but a math degree seems a bit overboard

ye i had no idea that data science was a degree

[viscid marten]

How did my self-thought people catch their first job? I thought it'd be a little easier than it is. lol

[radiant moon]

a co-op program at a community college
granted, the program I was in at the community college was computer stuff, but I was self taught before then too

[smoky quest]

not as much as you think. Most DS isn't about devising new machine learning algorithms

I would also suggest you to not demean people like that. It's pretty aggressive, baseless and not conducing to great conversations.

[gray anvil]

Anz does have a point though, and while he could've said it nicer, a middle schooler should definitely not be giving anyone career advice

[smoky quest]

Am not fond of gatekeeping. You can qualify arguments based on your experience but they ought to stand on their own merit

[balmy spade]

Networked through a local college and found a company taking on interns (paid). Took the risk, haven't looked back. I was taking a certification course at the time. Self-taught, but with only retail on my resume wanted something tech to have on it.

[thick ruin]

Anyone know any avaialbe python or programming jobs?

[radiant moon]

linkedin probably does

[orchid ivy]

https://www.python.org/jobs/
https://www.pythonjobshq.com/

[outer geyser]

hi guys im new here on python

[rich trellis]

@orchid sun

[polar compass]

hi guys. i'm a data science junior. i was just wondering if data structures & algorithms really matters in the data science cycle

[clear orchid]

@polar compass Depends on what part of data science you want to be in. It's a very large field. In general, yes.

[summer roost]

it's certainly helpful if you ever decide you want to move from data science to software engineering, too. Definitely a useful thing to know.

[brisk trench]

What type of softwares do software engineers make?

[summer roost]

... every?

"software engineer" is just the job title for "professional software maker"

in some countries that might be called a "software developer" instead.

whether it's called "software developer" or it's called "software engineer", it's basically the same job, and people with that job make pretty much everything that you would recognize as software.

[cunning roost]

So what can I do by only mastering python

[vapid jay]

Hey! I am an electronics engineer. I always wanted to integrate my hardware knowledge with software(for the sake of Automation). On which topic should I do masters inorder to fullfillthis goal?

[buoyant seal]

I'll say for fields I am sure:
Data Science, Web Development, Devops, QA in web dev

plus some partial access to microcontroller programming.

There is going Game Development, plus some people said Mobile App Dev and Cyber Security, but here I heard less info on my own

I am purely in web dev /partial devops / partial QA.

[cunning roost]

whats Devops?? so u must be a tech millionaire?

[buoyant seal]

Devops is a person who
a) simplifies development through automation of testing / deployment cycle
b) makes code that raises infrastructure for all your servers/applications in an automated way
c) raises monitoring systems to see server / internet / bug traffic in your infrastructure
d) makes sure to decrease load on the infrastructure through different load balancing methods

[buoyant seal]

I am not a millionare. I am just a regular web dev in industry programming. I hope to presume I reached middle level, or at least I am going to reach it in some nearby months.

[vapid jay]

(Hello I've a question)
Regarding to:- machine learning engineer
So if I could do a bachelor in cs in Pittsburgh Carnegie Mellon University it will take 4 years to its worth it to do phd after I graduated or can I do phd and graduation together and how much years does it take to do phd .?

[void sluice]

Should I do Bachelor in CS or Bachelor in CS with specialization in Data Science ??

[gray anvil]

depends, do you want to have a better chance applying to software engineer roles or data science roles?

[zealous ruin]

Hey

I Have Learned Python And Did Some Projects On My Own And How To Know If Iam Ready To Land In JOb and mastered programming

i mean Should Ihave To LeARN mORE Or Should IHave tO land for an job

[vapid jay]

Let's say u need to speak new language , the best way to do it is to get in there with the people who speak it and then try to grasp it , instead of using a dictionary sitting at yr home trying to learn it .... Long story short , start working on real world problems and you'll find yourself googling details abt how to get the task done , learn while you work ! , you won't get anything a "perfect time to start working" ! does not exist

[iron drum]

Those who wanna grab the free trial of coding ninjas course on operating systems
Can visit the website and enroll themselves using this link:
https://www.codingninjas.com/courses/operating-system?utm_source=campus-ambassador&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=free-trial-java_cn3776

You'll get the course for free for 1 month

[vapid jay]

if u r doing bachelor in CS then in reality there is no specialization in data science . In B.Sc u will learn about all basic concepts about programming and theory of computation.

but if it does exist then go with it if u like to work with data

[gray anvil]

buncha stats, econometrics, and ml modules probably

[vapid jay]

?

[gray anvil]

additional mods for a CS degree with a data science specialisation

[vapid jay]

!list

[inner wren]

Do you ever find yourself writing something like this?

>>> squares = []
>>> for n in range(5):
...    squares.append(n ** 2)
[0, 1, 4, 9, 16]

Using list comprehensions can make this both shorter and more readable. As a list comprehension, the same code would look like this:

>>> [n ** 2 for n in range(5)]
[0, 1, 4, 9, 16]

List comprehensions also get an if statement:

>>> [n ** 2 for n in range(5) if n % 2 == 0]
[0, 4, 16]

For more info, see this pythonforbeginners.com post.

[vapid jay]

i cant decide between web dev and ai, any advice?

[lucid vapor]

There's really no advice that we can give. Find what you enjoy and pursue it.

[near ocean]

Those fields arent even tangentially related, how do you pick between one of them

[vapid jay]

well my passion is programming, and i dont like math but i dont hate it either so i assume web dev would be the best choice

[mortal wedge]

AI has a lot of math involved, if you want even a surface understanding of the tools involved you'll probably need an understanding of linear algebra and matrix math.

I may be wrong on that, I've heard that tensorflow really dumbs things down/makes it simple

[broken mesa]

.

[gilded swan]

Sign up for career fairs thats what im doing lol

[hoary torrent]

You are right, I am a logistics student with average knowledge of python and was able to create cool things such as CNN image classifier with Tensorflow and Keras

Of course if you are planning to do anything with AI, try to work with arrays, matrices and determinants to get the idea of it all

[sweet field]

Hi. I'm new to python.

How do I increase the token lifetime. JWT

[near zenith]

Do you know any python?

[mortal wedge]

What fluffybear said, if you're still in school utilize school resources like school career fairs

[split ocean]

@last grotto - Don't give up! All the developers, admins, and dev ops people out there had to start from somewhere. If your working a customer service now, have you thought about getting an entry level IT job just to break in the field? Once you get in you could network/cross train to learn new skills, and demonstrate your own. Meanwhile, keep practicing/learning all that you have learned so far so you don't loose it. If you keep trying and take action...it will happen for you my friend.

[covert vector]

what r the different types of computer engineers

and does a computer engineer fall into another branch of engineering or is it its own branch

[dense mesa]

It falls into computer engineering

[covert vector]

ok

[dry flower]

I have a unique idea for you. I can't guarantee results but if you're really desperate you should try this and let me know the results.

I thought of a weird strategy that could work for having employers find your resume. Mind you, I haven't tried this, however I might soon™

You can buy LinkedIn "shout-outs" on fiverr. The audience ranges from 1m-5m+ users, you can also specify which category you want to target: IT/Cyber security for example

The posts are permanent and from what I've seen typically cost $10-30 USD.

Again, not sure if this works, however I'm sure you could get job offers from having someone post about your profile / credentials and resume.

Just thinking outside of the box, might pay off for one of you.

Edit: Search linkedin audience on fiverr.com```

Good idea to get your resume in front of a lot of people if you're not picky about that

[dry flower]

Let me know how it goes if you do it. I'm going to do something similar once I get some more projects done

[astral whale]

Is there a good test of skill level? I've been applying to jobs but i don't know exactly where my skill level with python is at or what projects i could do to display that skill level.

[acoustic wraith]

hmmm not sure

[stray jewel]

Spent a whole day writing a script to convert pdf to text and then export to a .txt file because there are no really good PDF libraries for Python

None that I could find, at least. I’ll ask around in here. But to be more relevant to the topic: I’m an intern at intel. They definitely give you lead roles even as an intern. I am the only person in my team who knows React so I am project lead… in my first software position. Cool feeling

[vapid jay]

Hey @spare solar, we do not allow for recruitment here. Sorry.

[gray anvil]

broadly speaking you need to demonstrate the ability to apply your knowledge in an work setting

or a work function, so that leads into what kind of entry role are you going for

[buoyant seal]

make defined to which role you apply.
to junior / or middle or whatever level in dev field you prefer
and just you know... google 10+ job vacancies and check skills mentioned for this role.
make some average (by excluding some rarely mentioned skills) out of this to define what needs to be known at this level.

[zealous berry]

Hi there, I'm new to python. I started learning on Udemy/freecodecamp. I'm still exploring different path i could take since python offers different options.. Could you, if possible, share your end goal with python?

[gray anvil]

share yours innit. what do you want to work in

[inland rune]

init

[keen moon]

How is this possible ? :o

He seems to have everything to get a job

[inland rune]

yeah

[sinful pumice]

Hi everyone! (: I’m trying to figure out what I want to do career wise so I can pick the appropriate University or courses..Is the only way to really figure out what you enjoy doing- (in terms of backend vs frontend development)- by making projects and seeing what you like?

[keen moon]

Try stack overflow jobs, write your developer story and mark it as actively looking for job.

I'm not from the field, I'm also trying to break in, so I don't really know too much to help you.

[winter bronze]

Hey

[buoyant seal]

Learn how to do

1. git (best practices and CLI commands)
2. design patterns

3. Perhaps, getting a hang of linux, it would match goodly your set of langs

Tbh, it would be great if you would choose the field you like the most

It would allow you just to search job vacancies from same field, and starting learning necessary skills

[brisk trench]

Hello everyone! Just wondering, if your trying seek in a profession of software engineering. What degrees or courses will you have to complete?

[sand veldt]

I would say it depends on what post you're planning to apply for
for instance certain jobs require you to have prior experience working with certain frameworks, languages
So, something like a full stack certification might prove useful

[brisk trench]

What are the main programming languages that are used in software engineering?

[vocal scarab]

@patent zephyr hi

[mortal hazel]

Realistically the term "software engineer" is so broad as to be meaningless in terms of giving precise advice I think

And from a broader career sense, I think asking "what do I need to do X job" is setting yourself up for disappointment. I spent the longest time doing the things I needed to be a lawyer (because that was the "career" I thought I wanted) without ever stopping to consider whether I enjoyed all those aspects of what I was doing enough to actually enjoy such a career.

I'm not saying it isn't important to consider what career you might want and to think about what you need to do to achieve that, but depending what stage of life/work you are at, you may be better served finding what aspects of that career you actually enjoy.

i.e. Do you like maths? Perhaps going down the data-science or machine-learning route is for you
Do you like creating tangible things? Perhaps web-dev, where you get to really see a visual representation of your labours is more your thing
Do you have an interest in some non-tech field like medicine/sports/chemistry etc? Perhaps you can look at where that subject interfaces with software and programming and find a career there

[elfin breach]

Good evening from uzbekistan. How are youall?

Guys I have a serious question. and the question is vue or react.js to learn as a framework. which one do you guys prefer?

[peak portal]

I'm with react

[elfin breach]

I have been learning web development since 5 month . After doing some projects on python, django I have to choose one of them that reason i asking you guys

[delicate garden]

Either

I think react is easier to learn personally

[winter dagger]

Hello Everyone!!
I really need guide career-wise
I've known Python for a while but I've not really broadened my knowledge in it, Started Django recently and I've been finding it interesting
I'm wanting to start applying for remote jobs but don't know if that'll be earlier than expected given my intermediate level of experience.
Am I to still grasp knowledge in both languages before applying or during the course of my Job, develop my skills further?

[smoky quest]

what's the other language? You only refer to python.
Either way, just apply and see what happens 🙂

[delicate garden]

What sort of job do you want?

[winter dagger]

Any related to Django or Python
Preferably Django

[winter dagger]

oh.. I meant Python and Django

But relating to other languages.. I'll be sticking with Python and Django Framework

Thanks tho

[delicate garden]

Might want to learn about databases, devops as well

[winter dagger]

Nice!!

Cool tho

[vapid jay]

hey fellas i have a python interview soon and they said i need fundamental knowledge of it, what things would that include

[mortal wedge]

At the very least, understand control flow and data structures. Understand all the loops (especially for loops) and understand how dicts/lists work.

[vapid jay]

will do thank you very much for your input<3

[mystic bear]

also know some of the (awesome) built-in functions

[rugged bobcat]

To be as good to get a internship in a company in software engineering/programming, do you have to be decent at a programming language or good

[summer roost]

Depends on the company.

[rugged bobcat]

If I am good at a programming language are the chances of me getting a paid internship high?

At a regular company

[ocean ledge]

how good are we talkin here

[sterile pecan]

How can I stat up with Python

I am a java programmer

I want to start up with Python

[mystic bear]

Bang out some code

[uneven cradle]

Start how you started with Java

[elfin breach]

Are you react developer

[delicate garden]

No but i used both before

[elfin breach]

I see, well vue.js is the one easeier then react but there are less job included to this framework thats why im

comparing

[tulip jacinth]

I'm a Python fizzbuzz expert and I get paid $69,420USD a year

[astral whale]

Do you have recommendations for where to get certified?

[fervent reef]

Hi, kinda new here.
So I finished python beginner course a month ago, ever since I've been trying to improve the skill using some platforms like codewars and the likes.

On reaching the hard level I find it hard to solve most of the problems given, maybe sometimes I do check other peoples code, just to know how to solve it... I later found out I'm not improving,

[fervent reef]

Is there any way I can improve my programming skill,

Also I'll like to start my first project, but I don't know how

[inner wren]

Hey @vapid jay!

It looks like you tried to attach a Python file - please use a code-pasting service such as https://paste.pythondiscord.com

[rose solstice]

Should I invest my time to learn Django
Like become a expert in Django only
Is it worth full and will it get me a online job ( not a high paying one, even 100$ is good for me )
Please tell me is it worth it and should I do it

Please if possible answer in DM cuz this channel gets clouded

[onyx kite]

I know three or four things about python, like it's pretty solid. how would a $ 24,000/year can be achievable for me?

I know three or four things about python, like it's pretty solid. how would a $ 24,000/year can be achievable for me?

[buoyant seal]

100$ per which time frame?

regardless, Django is good at this time moment

but things change you know
So it is good skill only for now.
Better investing in learning most universal skills in order to be able switching between technologies quickly

[rose solstice]

@buoyant seal per week or more

I say Django cuz its a good way to learn python one, two it will give me experience, three If i learn it right now, i can get some jobs quick and easy giving me experience, five if you know programming I believe its easy to learn something new because the basics are mostly the same

[buoyant seal]

well, sure you can earn that much with django.

earning this much per day.
or if your skill is big enough... in one hour

[spark cedar]

what do you specifically mean by universal skillls?

[buoyant seal]

good practices in programming.
DRY, SOLID, YAGNI
Learning Design patterns
Learning SQL, principles to work optimized with db, normalization, indexes, N+1 problem
Learning best practices behind unit testing
Learning architecture designs
Learning how to wield git and good practices behind it.
Learning basics of how internet works
Learning how security/encrypting works

learning the most universal skills, you are highly likely will be able to switch painlessly in a short time to new programming language.
it makes a good foundation.

Then diving a bit further
Learning good practices specific to language

it will make sure you can switch painleslly to new frameworks

and only after that jumping to more details specific to framework.

hmm

[spark cedar]

hmm i see

[buoyant seal]

I'll clarify a bit. Everything should be learned.
I mean that things which I mentioned should be firstly learned more in deapth.

[spark cedar]

will this apply to DS/ML? Or specifically software engineering? Or programming in general

[buoyant seal]

it is easy to learn in a small part enough to make it working, deep level of understanding requires a bit more than that

[buoyant seal]

I mentioned for software engineering / programming in general
hmm, DS/ML is a bit standing out in this regard, I think it could be having a bit different set of things to get it working. I am only very briefly familiar with ML though.

[spark cedar]

hmm i see

[spark cedar]

How do you specifically learn DRY, SOLID, YAGNI? Is it something that you stay aware of as you are coding out certain projects? The biggest barrier that I specifically face is that, I code something out, the program works, but my code is absolutely trash. I don't specifically know how to make my code better.

[compact warren]

any software engineers out there, in terms of the financial aspect what makes software engineering more attractive then starting a career in something like business. If any?

[dense mesa]

I'm aiming to work as a software engineer for a few years before "spinning out" and doing my own startup. The main reasoning behind this is to get enough money saved before taking the huge risk to start a business.

A career in business is also useful for actually learning how to run a business, but from talking to people working in finance/business, their hours are awful in return for the compensation they get

You're overworking yourself to basically earn a regular hourly wage, whereas with software you're more likely (this is an insanely general statement) to have more reasonable hours for your total compensation

Going into software means you're with smart people who have smart ideas, more opportunities to find co-founders for a future startup, access to internal company resources and structure layouts which can be useful for starting your own thing

[buoyant seal]

Taking attention to understand, during reading good books where it is well explained.
Applying at practice.

I can highly recommend
head first design patterns
Besides getting patterns, it gives all oop related best practices. As well as giving easy foundation to finally grasp SOLID

All principles I got explained from
clean code in python by Mariano Anaya
A bit heavy book, but after reading three python books where same material was partially explained, and after reading head first book, this book goes well then

The final teacher is always practice, but the books quite shorten amount of required practice to get it ;)

[vapid jay]

how can i save a string that the user puts into tkinter input field

[smoky quest]

wrong channel

[sudden quartz]

the chances of one being good a programming is already low

[spare hound]

.get method

[hearty island]

i think you're suffering from burnout

at most you should be coding for like maybe 2 or 3 hours max

it is an exhausting field and you have to take care of yourself

i had the same issue

if you try to force coding when you're frustrated you'll only get angrier

it's completely fine to not code for a day or two so you can rest

well i'll quote you verbatim then

"Even though, I learned all in bachelors, i was lazy and didn't do quite well, and I am suffering because of the time I lost in bachelors doing everything except studying." I had the same issue man

I had bad mental health issues combined with poor profs and i couldn't do it

everything felt so impossible that I would angrily spend hours at office hours getting frustrated

nah it is man

burnout is very real (at least I think so) but maybe other people can back me up here

it's a lack of experience on how to handle coding bc it's not like other things

yeah a lot of my generation does too

it makes me so sad to see them struggle man

I wish I could help but they're so addicted to living their lives on a tiny screen and it causes lots of focus issues and other mental health issues

the mind is a powerful thing and what you feed it can affect you in a powerful way - NF

you are the media you consume now really

it took a lot of mistakes and shit to realize this all at 20

we can talk offline if you want more privacy

[uneven herald]

Hello!

[ashen parcel]

Hello

How are you all

[hearty island]

in a better place mentally

[ripe spear]

Hedge fund analyst or cypto data scraper?

[hearty island]

idk what are you more into?

[ripe spear]

both 50/50

am a fresh grad so open to anything atm

[dense mesa]

@ripe spear do you mean a technical analyst for a hedge fund?

[ripe spear]

Would be more quantitative based, and the data scraper is for a crypto vc fund

[dense mesa]

So quant developer or ?

[ripe spear]

or

[near ocean]

You dont just decide to become a quant like that one day...
Do you have a degree in maths, comp sci, engineering of any kind?

[hearty island]

yeah i second what mariosis said

a career as hard as that takes a lot of careful planning... any career does

[ripe spear]

Physics

but am a nerd and love coding and maths so... both are interesting and viable options to me

[gilded swan]

What type of jobs/companies should i apply to that are fine with me not having a degree?

[hearty island]

the smaller to midsize ones most likely

if you spend a coupe good years at a midsize one and then do really well, impress them, you can move on to a bigger one. that's what my uncle did.

[near ocean]

Yes your degree is fine, most quant positions are C++ (and python), however so i would start learning C/Cpp if you want to go into front office stuff

[sage pumice]

?

[final smelt]

would anyone know what to look for regarding automation jobs like selenium? (ie. junior level)

[summer roost]

In the professional world, Selenium is only used to test other software, so the relevant job searches would be for "QA" or "Testing" personnel

[final smelt]

I see

[fleet marten]

I'm looking at this job posting at a bank Programmer What a title...

[final smelt]

a bank programmer? like with excel sheets?

[hearty island]

but do you make bank?

[deep laurel]

hi guys

i am new to python how should i learn could u suggest me some cources

[paper bay]

Hey I am looking for internships is it possible ?

[smoky quest]

why not?

[paper bay]

Like what is the best approach and since I am independent guy not a student how do I get it , and this is for India which barely has any internships

[smoky quest]

if you are independent, why looking for internships and not a job directly?

also I can't speak for anything in India

[paper bay]

Is it okay to DM ?

[smoky quest]

I would rather avoid

If it's super personal and shameful, sure

[jade pawn]

I disclosed my new employer name to my current employer and colleagues. I am in notice period.
Do you think my jealous colleagues or angry boss can harm my reputation at new company or do any other sort of damage?

[smoky quest]

very unlikely

[jade pawn]

If they do, should I be worried

[smoky quest]

it depends

[jade pawn]

Like?

[smoky quest]

if it's true, verifyiable, how much pull they have or how many people they know there, the accusations, etc.

[jade pawn]

Damn. I am ruined

[spice musk]

How so? It’s not like they can’t find out that information afterwards anyways?

[smoky quest]

again, very unlikely

[spice musk]

Your new employer might have already contact old one for a reference

[smoky quest]

do you have any specifics?

[spice musk]

What is it you’ve done that you don’t want them to know? 😂

[jade pawn]

Just my colleagues they are jealous I got big jump and my boss threatened me by saying, you might receive job threats at new job so better to stay here. Better less money than no money

[smoky quest]

so that's bs

They would just be opening themselves up to libel and burn some bridges. On your side, you can just brush it up as noise and jealous folks

As a concrete example, there is a reason most companies won't say anything else than whether you worked there or not during reference checks. It's because they got sued when they say anything more. So your boss would be opening the company and himself to lawsuit, especially if they make up something

[jade pawn]

I live in third world country so no such thing as sue

[smoky quest]

You can still threaten if they try something

It's about making them understand they have more to loose than to gain by taking such action

And with regards to your colleagues, I am not sure to understand their incentives to be mean to you. It might be in their interest to be nice to you so they could use you to get a better job as well

That said, I can't speak for your unspecified third world country.

[jade pawn]

Yes but one colleague is boss special guy that guy may do it

[smoky quest]

Then just brush it off as someone being jealous

Why would the new company believe them?

Alternatively, you could also mention to your new company that you are receiving threats from your current employer and to be mindful of it

[jade pawn]

If I tell them I might come off as guy who talks bad about current employer etc.

If I dont mention this to new company, would it be fine as well?

[smoky quest]

there is no best way. It's very specific to the situation

[jade pawn]

However my current boss accepted my resignation.

[smoky quest]

Warning the new company you are receiving threats isn't trash talking the current one

[jade pawn]

He said you still have a week to think

[smoky quest]

depending on your relationship, you may also mention the threats to your current boss and how it's impacting your decision

why the fuck would you want to stay in a such a hostile company

[jade pawn]

Exactly. Just worried if they will ruin my reputation or do any damage with new company. For sure I wanna leave this hostile company

Boss said after threatening, we can also increase ur salary etc

[smoky quest]

they are just manipulative. either way, what can they say to the new company?

[jade pawn]

True.
Maybe they can say I am not good performer, etc etc to hurt my chances to stay there for longer. Idk honestly.

Although they totally depend on me for the work I do. They have to find replacement now

[smoky quest]

the new company won't be stupid. they did interview you and did see what you can do

[jade pawn]

Exactly! So I shouldnt worry at all right?

[smoky quest]

from what you said, sounds more like idle threats. But again, that's very specific to your situation

[jade pawn]

So you think I should worry? Or find another job as backup now?

[smoky quest]

No one on this channel can tell you for sure.
It does appear you will be fine but can't guarantee it.

[jade pawn]

I am so sad

[smoky quest]

It's temporary. Once you are out of reach from their claws, you will be happier

But no one on this channel knows about your country, the people you talked to or the way they deal with things. I wouldn't trust anyone to tell you either way.

[modest lantern]

Hey 😀
Newbie in here

[vapid jay]

Hi! Me too! Welcome 🙂

[sonic mica]

is it true that the web dev job market is getting pretty shitty and that software engineering is a safer bet?

[spice musk]

No

[quartz trench]

seriously?

[shy bramble]

I was wondering if its common for people to do remote coding jobs as a part time side income?

I primarily want to do 3D animation but also build pipeline tools for VFX on the side.

[sage pumice]

is web dev not software engineering?

[buoyant seal]

web dev is a branch of software engineering 😉
every web dev is a software engineering, but not every software engineering is a web dev.

[quartz trench]

i wanna ask something....is there any software job in malaysia?

[near ocean]

You can find out through a job board

[fleet marten]

it was like 68k+ on the posting, and the required skills / job duties didn't quite align. Another posting wanted working knowledge of XML among other programming languages. Bank Tech posts are fun

[hearty island]

Hey that sounds pretty good

[fleet marten]

I was tempted but the commute would be a bit rough, I just love how their HR departments clearly do not understand tech.

[near ocean]

Fintech ads are always special

Trust a fund manager to OK a job ad lmao

[fleet marten]

The one wants javascript and HTML to write reports and manage the database... do you know what javascript is or did you just read about it online there HR? The title? SQL Developer

[sterile vault]

What's your the current situation with remote jobs market? I'm currently finishing my long-term freelance contract and wonder if it would be more lucrative to continue freelancing until I can apply to middle+ positions, or applying to teams as a junior. No US/EU visa, strictly international teams.
I have less than a year of freelance experience. Is 2k$+ month for a full-time position realistic/too high/too low in a current market?

[carmine wraith]

Which is the best site to find fresher jobs?

[near ocean]

Use all of them, theres no best

[final smelt]

would i be able to get a job after completing multiple online python courses? what jobs would i be able to get?

[sturdy sundial]

good night, i wanted to create a plugin module in jpython for the autopsy tool. fetch data from SQLLITE databases.

[frosty lichen]

one of the most important things you can do, without a degree, is completing projects that show the skills you have, that your prospective employers can see

if you have a job currently, I'd recommend looking for any opportunities internally that you could solve a problem or improve some process with software that you can write; if you don't, maybe try volunteering for a non-profit you care about? some may have a problem that could be solved with python

but simply taking the courses won't be enough, in my experience

[smoky quest]

It's gonna be very difficult and the type of jobs will likely be very basic.

[frosty lichen]

I don't think that's necessarily true, if you can do the stuff I said, or otherwise find a way to convince people that you know your stuff (which of course depends on you knowing your stuff in the first place)

[smoky quest]

So you think it's not very difficult?

[frosty lichen]

it's not easy, by any means, but it is possible and you don't have to settle for a bad job

[smoky quest]

Taking on someone without any degree/cert/bootcamp or experience is a huge risk. Companies also receive hundreds of resumes for each position. So making them stand out and getting into the ATS pipeline will not be easy

Furthermore, if they get hired, they would also be downplayed and paid less because of that

[frosty lichen]

I have never had any formal education in programming, or any college at all for that matter, but I was able to get a dev job a few months ago, by basically doing exactly what I said before. in downtime at my old job, which was not remotely tech-related, I worked on programming solutions to problems we were having, and that experience is ultimately what got me this job

[smoky quest]

oh that's actually nice. Congrats!

That definitely does not sound easy

[frosty lichen]

yeah, you will be paid less (I would know 🥲). and it depends on your location, but at least in the US, "paid less" for a software dev is still more than average. taking this job was a $14k raise for me, but is still well below the average rate for a dev

but switching careers is never easy, and accepting subpar pay is unfortunately part of the deal for now, but the important thing is you'll have your foot in the door and you can build some better connections in the industry

[smoky quest]

The most difficult part is getting that first job. Companies will care less afterwards

[frosty lichen]

thanks! I don't want @final smelt to get discouraged, but I also want to be clear that it's not a walk in the park either

[smoky quest]

Me neither. I may have phrased things a bit too direct but I wanted them to recognize they won't get a job 2 weeks after finishing their first online course.

But am glad we have concrete examples of people who made it

[frosty lichen]

it took me like four months once I actively started looking, and I think it probably helped that I had a longer history of programming experience (as a hobby) than it sounds like Wizen does, so their experience wrt timing could certainly differ

[final smelt]

i've made many projects and added it to my github. i'm not sure about some projects as far as 'ethics' go.. (like automating my unemployment survey every month automatically)

i've also made crypto trading bots, walmart bots, webscraping scripts for amazon, newegg, etc..
i made a flask website that uses rest api and 2 auth encryption with salt.

[frosty lichen]

yeah I would not show a prospective employer that unemployment one lol

[final smelt]

it's been about a year since i got laid off of my old tech job. since then, i've been teaching myself python. @frosty lichen seems you've got a lot of great tips. I'll look into that. Thanks!

[vapid jay]

hey guys how do i open python

[frosty lichen]

it's hard to tell based on these descriptions alone how significant those projects are, so you'll have to judge for yourself, but if they're not really major, I think it'd be a good idea to do some pro bono work for a non-profit that matters to you, like I suggested before. it was very helpful to me that I was able to show employers things I did that actually solved a real problem (in my prior job) and were used in real life by those people. helping out a non-profit not only accomplishes that but it's also just a good look, it reflects well on you as an individual

and of course, it feels good to help out too 😜

[vapid jay]

how do i open python? 😅

[ocean ledge]

wrong room, use a different channel

[frosty lichen]

you're in the wrong channel for that

[final smelt]

go to https://www.python.org/

[vapid jay]

i still dont know how to open it because it doesnt say how to 😕

[ocean ledge]

yo, this channel is for career discussions-- look at the side and choose a channel like #python-discussion

[final smelt]

@frosty lichen would you be able to give me an example of a nonprofit that would need coding examples/projects? to me, i thought of nonprofits that work with soup kitchens

[ocean ledge]

unless you actually don't mind giving away time and energy for free, just apply for normal tech jobs with actual pay

if you want to do something that looks good and also builds your skills appropriately, join an open source project and contribute

but regardless, just apply for jobs-- if you wait around to see if you're "ready" you'll miss out on employers who really don't care too much about your lack of credentials

[frosty lichen]

the question Wizen had asked was about getting a job, without a degree or prior professional experience, and I'm suggesting nonprofit work as something to show prospective employers that you are capable of completing meaningful work

[frosty lichen]

I agree on that, you have nothing to lose from applying now, regardless

[ocean ledge]

you will most likely not get meaningful work if you're doing work for free at a nonprofit

[frosty lichen]

why not?

[ocean ledge]

i would say working on an OSS project is far better when it comes to "tech cred" when looking at resumes

[fathom sparrow]

I'm kind of at that point. Any recommendations for getting into open source projects? I fork items on github and immediately get lost and intimidated.

[ocean ledge]

there are lots of projects out there that have fairly low hanging fruit specifically for beginner devs-- an example tag on github for this is https://github.com/topics/good-first-issue

[fathom sparrow]

Ill check those out. Thanks

[frosty lichen]

I can't give you any specific organizations, you should probably look locally for that. search for orgs doing stuff that you care about, whether that's wildlife preservation, or fostering organizations, or whatever, I dunno what matters to you. in any case you would probably have to help them figure out what you could actually help with. the people you will be talking to most likely don't understand technology very well and won't immediately know where a dev could help. here's a good twitter thread on that: https://twitter.com/hillelogram/status/1410408672610729986

Hillel (@hillelogram)

In short: if you're a software developer and want to improve things, here's what you can do:

1. Find an org doing work you believe in
2. Say "I'm a software dev and want to volunteer, how can I help you?"
3. Listen.

And that's how tech can fix the world's problems. Fin.

Likes

338

Twitter · Jul 1, 2021, 1:23 AM

contributing to open source projects as pasta suggested is probably also a good idea. personally I always find it difficult to find issues that are simple enough for me to address as a new contributor and that haven't already been "claimed" by someone else, but you could certainly have better luck than I do (or a greater willingness to tackle more complex issues lol)

[final smelt]

sounds good. thanks again

[crude crown]

This might not be the best place to ask but hopefully the more experienced people here might have a clue: is anyone aware of a decent service/platform to get mentors or for career guidance but targeted for people with 5+ years of professional experience? I'm thinking of things like someone with say 12 years of XP mentoring or giving some advice to someone with 6 years of XP.

[smoky quest]

We do something like that internally at $DAY_JOB

might be worth bringing it up with your manager to see if they can get the ball rolling

[crude crown]

well, I was kind of excluding resorting to people at $DAY_JOB, due to possible conflicts of interest and office politics shenanigans. I imagine that on a platform like the one I've mentioned that would be a way smaller concern.

[smoky quest]

In some sense, you can do that here. Just without the 1-1

[vapid jay]

Hey guys, pretty new to python and I'm trying to figure out where to put my focus. I'm kinda interested in scraping, how viable is it as far as future profitability?

[smoky quest]

I would recommend to broaden your focus. scraping is pretty niche

[vapid jay]

Hmmm okay

[vapid jay]

As far as broadening my focus, is there something else that incorporates scraping pretty well or shift my focus completely?

[frosty lichen]

the logical extension of web scraping is data science 😌

[smoky quest]

Most people would just be backend software engineer. Scraping is just a single application of it

[vapid jay]

Thanks

[gray anvil]

pure semantics, but would yo include data analysis under the umbrella data science

[frosty lichen]

I would think so

"data analysis" is a little bit vague though. all kinds of things might be called "analysis". but then I suppose all kinds of things might be called "data science", so.......... hmmmm

[gray anvil]

I've done a DS course and having gone through it I wonder how often people mean something closer to Data Analytics when they say Data Science

in a sense DS roles kinda feel like luxury roles, and most places aren't equipped to properly make use of a full on data scientist