career-advice

[vital wyvern]

It's a bit more technical. At least at my employer, our sales engineers tend to be wildly proficient at the actual day to day job.

[keen yoke]

oh wow

[worldly swallow]

sales engineering = how best to sell me this pen? (doesn't know)

systems engineering- can't discern what that is from its name

[fringe sphinx]

This is just another area where the title doesn't exactly map to the responsibility: Sales Engineer, Systems Engineer, Pre-Sales Engineer, Solution Engineer, Solution Consultant all could be the same job... or completely different jobs... depending on the company & person.

But in general, there are people who work with the customer (often IT, Operations, or Engineering) to explain, develop a technical proposal, understand the customers requirements and how it fits with the product, work internally with engineering to communicate or validate any customer-specific problems, etc.

[safe tundra]

Hello guys newbie here M3

[terse forum]

hiii guys im just starting w/python please guide me i have done python previously but i want to do it seriously this time. give me a plan where to start from and how to improve logics. im an intermediate , so please kindly help me accordingly

[terse forum]

can anybody help me! w/how i can create a music player website and in order to do so what i have to do and where to start from!

dis server is dead or whatt?

[harsh river]

first off, you're asking in the wrong place, look at the channel description, and then #❓｜how-to-get-help

[vapid jay]

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/6P6vBtPVNNnGh9nh/?mibextid=Mk4v2M

Thoughts on this short? Caz I've been seeing linkedin ppl commenting or saying that ghost job posts and fake job offers. Company posting for same job again every 2 months

[fathom gorge]

im 35 with 0 job experience what advice can any of you give me

i've been studying python for 6 months and would like to pursue a career in that

[trim crypt]

I guess build something to add into your portfolio

[fathom gorge]

but im worried about my lack of work for the last 15 years

what do you think about working for free, like you know for experience would that help?

[trim crypt]

Sure

[fathom gorge]

someone told me that would lower my value, like no one would hire someone thats willing to work for free, how do you feel about that

[trim crypt]

Then why do we have interns?

[fathom gorge]

true

do you think theres any hope for me? should i just go back to college and get a degree

[trim crypt]

Thats a tough one

[fathom gorge]

im already 35 by the time im finished i will be around 40

[proud glacier]

You could do open source work

[trim crypt]

Its a matter of just putting in the effort tbh. Its not too late to study but I think the better move is to just start getting work, no matter the job/position is. Once you get the job, rise the corporate ladder through training and streamlining work process, and if you're good enough, you could try job hop but I'd worry about that later.

[harsh river]

by the time you're finished with what?

[fathom gorge]

with getting a comp sci degree

[fathom gorge]

im blessed to be living comfortably without a job because of my parents, they tell me to just focus on the studying and not worry about a job

so im puttting full effort into studying python, i just hope im not studying all this for nothing

[trim crypt]

alright you got this 🦾

[fathom gorge]

thanks man, thanks for all the advice

i get a lot of anxiety thinking that im going to spend years python and never be able to find a job related to it

[trim crypt]

You can worry about that later. Just focus on finishing your studies with Python. Maybe get a cert at CS50p.

[fathom gorge]

yeah im actually doing CS50p

[trim crypt]

OK go for it. Its only like 10 lessons

[fathom gorge]

i just got the final to do and im finished

[trim crypt]

Oh nice

[icy berry]

I know many your age doing the same

[icy berry]

doing volentary, open source work will help a lot to prove to any future employer that you have more things to offer. now, a big caviat is that not all open source work are benefitial.

finding a project that you use is a great place to be. as you can help out with things that actually improve how you use the thing

[terse forum]

ma bad!!

i dont have perms @harsh river

[terse forum]

where to ask a questions? or for help please guide me ?

[harsh river]

please read the content in that channel.

[hexed drum]

If any server is dead it's not this one

[solar wedge]

good luck homie and let me know how it goes im trying to learn also to make a decent living out of this

[dull belfry]

How can I find part time work i can do it need not be paid like I am hoping to work in a real professional environment just for the experience

[radiant tulip]

Who can make 2d asset please dm me

[dull belfry]

I can share my resume can someone guide me. I tried applying for few remote positions on linkedin. I didn't get noticed and they were looking for freshers

Maybe trying out open source contribution can be a thing. But I can't find any place to start rather than contributing to projects of people that I know

[white relic]

Feel free to share your résumé (with personal info censored) for feedback. Where in the world are you located?

[dull belfry]

Ok am from India

[dull belfry]

the 2 years of experience is actually 1😅

[white relic]

(am getting ready for work, I'll try to get back in an hour or so, maybe others have suggestions)

[dull belfry]

ye ok np

[storm sinew]

@dull belfry Perhaps mention what technologies, languages, frameworks, etc you used in the projects section.

Like you did with Google OAuth, for example.

The open source contribution text is vague so it doesn't add much. It could help to name some specific project you contributed to.

[dull belfry]

Ohk

[dull belfry]

I Can specify I made use django-allauth

[dull belfry]

Yea but I don't have any worth projects to mention than simple crud apps i made.. i have to get resume worthy project

[white relic]

I agree with the above, you really need more specificity in your projects and contributions. The order is also kind of backwards imo, I would always start with education then experience and projects.
The skills section (if you have one) should be demonstrated by the projects.

Am I correct in understanding you've never held a regular job? That's OK, you're a student, but usually "experience" means professional experience

[dull belfry]

Oh ok so I merge experience to skill section and name it skills and projects?

[white relic]

I'm not based in India but in the USA you would be looking for paid internships and IMO you have a decent chance of finding one if you are diligent about looking.

But you have to start early (like now, to find an internship for next summer)

[dull belfry]

I have tried few over LinkedIn and i got few calls but they not like internship they were offering training I should pay

[white relic]

Maybe different where you are.

Paying for experience is a scam.

[dull belfry]

Yes I dropped them but is LinkedIn only place I look for these opportunities?

[white relic]

Maybe just Projects but yeah that would be a start.
Try to show in what way you exercised all of those skills in the projects.

[dull belfry]

ok i will do it thanks for suggestion

Is it ok to have certification section does it matter or should I put it in education

[white relic]

Also location dependent. I know LinkedIn is a common place to find work. I haven't been job hunting in the last few years so I don't know what places are good. From the hiring perspective I think most of my company's recent hires have been from postings on our own website but some were referred there by LinkedIn. I don't have the statistics on that.

[dull belfry]

Yeah ok

[white relic]

Maybe in a subheading under education. You could include relevant coursework (Data Structures, etc. Not every course you have taken) in the same way.

[dull belfry]

Ok

[white relic]

Currently I feel the certifications are taking up more space than they merit. Certs aren't worth much.

[dull belfry]

Yea was thinking same I will merge it with education

[white relic]

But they show you have an interest outside of your mandatory studies and the rest of the résumé is light, so mentioning them won't hurt you and may help.

[dull belfry]

Hmm ok

I might spend some more time to actually make some projects tbh i haven't taken more than week for most of my projects

Or maybe should I like modify my existing applications and add more features

[pliant parcel]

hy

here to make some friends?

[peak halo]

hello, general conversation belongs in the three off-topic channels.

[edgy mesa]

I made some huge resume changes 🔥 who wants to see it

[peak halo]

don't wait for permission. if you want a resume review, just post it.

[edgy mesa]

Does this look solid enough to get an entry level position in qa/ data analytics?

Because right now im just applying to every position including data science, data analytics, supply chain analyst , SAP consultant , business analyst, qa tester, pretty much anything lol

I filter down to no experience in the search to get better chance

[worldly swallow]

filter out or filter down to?

[edgy mesa]

Yeah filter down

[worldly swallow]

I feel like I want to move the skills to the bottom, or somewhere

They seem somewhat sparse as well

[edgy mesa]

Didn’t even notice that, thanks

[pliant parcel]

i had this phd in computer science & engineering from MIT //

[edgy mesa]

What lol

[edgy mesa]

Holy Moly

[worldly swallow]

philosophy for computational science* thesis? I don't get it. I'm not familiar with the process in general.

[peak halo]

you only have one name? not a given name and family name?

[edgy mesa]

@worldly swallow hey what do you think about the tweaks you suggested?

[pliant parcel]

sorry computational science?

is it worth it ?

[worldly swallow]

The bullet points about each project generally shouldn't be paragraphs. I'd make these points convey skills and value in a more concise manner, whether value for a business or for users

[true harness]

what is worth what 🤔

[edgy mesa]

So change it into like one or two sentences ?

Cool, I’ll just delete some sentences

[errant thicket]

hey everyone thanks i’m finally not unemployed i couldn’t land a help desk job but i got another warehouse job wishing for the best

hoping to get in the tech industry soon ima finish school and keep working 💪

[pliant parcel]

the phds

got only poorly, homless & desperate?

[fast fossil]

interns tend to/should get paid

[white relic]

I know quite a few PhDs who are well paid, none who are unemployed.
I can't think of anyone with a PhD in CS though.

[bleak heron]

🤨

you could've at least found the right typeface

[sand patio]

lmao

[vapid jay]

So basically im in my final semester of university, i have alot of skills woth python, data science, data analytics, machine & deep learning.
However, i want to make use of these skill & get paid for as a side hustle but I don't know where to start. Ive done a couple of fiverr gigs from a guy who outsourced it to me but he disappeared & now im side hustle-less.
What to do?
(Please tag me when replying)

[pine sleet]

you have a full time job lined up after graduation? are you also in the U.S?

[vapid jay]

Umm, well im from Pakistan (applying for scholarships in the UK so lets see)
But as of now, i dont have any jobs lined up after graduation since the job interviews i gave told me to join them now & not later.
But even so, i want to do side hustles like freelancing & doing projects from my home

[white relic]

you do not have time for a side hustle.
you need to be finding a job

[pine sleet]

yeah this is not really the stage in life where people spend time doing side gigs

a side gig implies you have a main gig

[vapid jay]

But i still have till may 2025 for graduation

[pine sleet]

yes, and I believe it's internship/job season for summer 2025 right now in many parts so you should be focusing on that

you should have a full time job secured within the next couple of months

[white relic]

(side note: "final semester of university" suggests you're graduating in December, in most universities with a semester-based system; at least, that's what I assumed)

(but it does not really affect the overall thrust of the comments here)

[vapid jay]

Sorry should've mentioned that meant until mid 2025

[frozen orchid]

can someone help me i get a error and idk why

[pine sleet]

#1035199133436354600

[pine sleet]

May, right? Most students graduate in May

[vapid jay]

Yup

[pine sleet]

right. you don't have a lot of time, you need to be focusing on securing a full time job after you graduate

[vapid jay]

Alright but like even if I start looking for a job ofcourse that'll take some time, but in the meantime, i really wanna earn some for myself so i dont have to ask my parents for money for every little thing especially when upgrading my tech systems

[pine sleet]

you most likely won't be able to make a significant amount of money doing independent freelancing without a lot of time and effort (which again should be going towards a full time job)

[vapid jay]

I will work on it, ive got my LinkedIn set & running good, im gonna he uploading stuff on GitHub regularly soon

[pine sleet]

you've got about 8 months, I'm sure you can hang in there for that long with your parents

[vapid jay]

Haha yes thats true

[white relic]

yeah, when I was in school, December was already full on interview season.
mind you, I was not one of the students who had a job lined up early.

[pine sleet]

you've done it for the past couple decades, a few more months wouldn't hurt. you'll have a lot more autonomy after you land a FT job

[vapid jay]

Im not proud of not earning for myself since I joined uni 😭, but i didn't have the necessary skills to sell in exchange for money before. But now, i see people all over the internet doing amazing stuff and even earning from it and i just get bummed out that even after learning so much im still...doing nothing

[white relic]

Comparison is the thief of joy.
Not having to work your way through college is a privilege. It's not shameful. Side gigs are stressful and usually not great money. People going that route fail as often as they succeed - bear in mind, you're not seeing linkedin posts from people who tried to take on too much and flunked out. Take advantage of not needing to support yourself for the next few months and use it as an opportunity to get the best position you can going forward.

[vapid jay]

That's really nice advice, thankyou i needed that

[faint depot]

Attending uni atm. Gonna use every single free/paid for resource I have available to upskill myself. Gonna get that fucking apprenticeship one way or another

[fast fossil]

isn't CS a bit too broad to even have a PhD option?

[fringe sphinx]

Wdym?

A PhD is earned for a dissertation: broadly speaking, a unique contribution to the field

So, almost by necessity, the PhD has a very narrow focus... the tip of a needle of research.

[fast fossil]

That's kind of what I meant, it's gonna be very narrow, like, I suppose I was more thinking of how CS as a field is too broad of a descriptor for what your PhD work is related to, like, it's gonna be something very specific that does fall under CS, but it's not like a CS degree in the sense that you don't just gain a bunch of high level knowledge in CS as a whole
but I suppose this logic applies to every other field

[smoky quest]

kinda the same for all the fields. Like a phd in math, or social sciences or etc.
It would then be qualified by the more specific area

[fast fossil]

yeah, I realized that by the end of writing my message 😁

[next holly]

HI GUYS

I REALLY NEED YOUR HELP

[analog sun]

!cban 928454166190358568

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @nova current permanently.

[final ravine]

You could use #❓｜how-to-get-help

[queen notch]

sorry didnt realize this is career chat

[pine sleet]

not as much as it was for your first job, i'd say. you could probably move your side projects down on the resume and prioritize on your experience more

[smoky quest]

it depends on 👏 the 👏 demonstrated 👏 skills 👏

[fast fossil]

as in what skills the projects you put on your CV demonstrate?

[smoky quest]

right, comparing to the rest.
What do you want the reviewer to learn from it?

[near ocean]

Personally i'd rather the reviewer look at my professional experience instead

[rapid holly]

#python-discussion

[dusk rover]

Nah men

[fringe sphinx]

Side projects are also how you show your passion or depth, beyond your job. Even with 10 YoE, a meaningful side project(s) can be impressive and show that you're continually growing or knowledgeable in different ways.

[buoyant seal]

In some cases side projects are requested as obligatory for job vacancies at Middle and higher rank 😅
At least i saw such job vacancies

[pliant parcel]

could'nt find it

typeface name?

[pliant parcel]

hey goku saan

[rose aurora]

Is Data Engineering a good field to start with as a fresher?

[fringe sphinx]

Wdym? As a fresher, you're not specializing other than whatever degree track you're in

But, I'm biased (as someone in data engineering): data skills are good things to learn regardless of your career path.

[rose aurora]

@i am learning Java Full Stack they took a generic interview based on Problem Solving skills and assigned me the role of Data Engineer.

[fringe sphinx]

Who is they?

Is this a job or Uni?

[white relic]

What does that mean? Does this influence what courses you can take? What major/what kind of program are you studying?

[tepid marsh]

anyone know a good place to study discord bot coding online for free?

[fringe sphinx]

#discord-bots start here

[tepid marsh]

thx

[outer dragon]

Another update for anyone who even remembers:

Completed all the requested features by using the output from the previous program as input to a new program and bolting on a few columns to the output Excel sheet.

Pushed back against my manager pretty hard about how I didn't want to use someone else's tool without attribution to them for their work, and also about working with the tool in its current state.

Ended up giving a presentation on the project yesterday to my Director and some higher-ups. Everything went well and I included slides about the current structure of the tool and proposed a code-restructure on another slide. Everyone seemed receptive to it, and the only one who seemed worried about it was my manager. No clue why. My manager's manager even suggested making it available to all teams within the company, which is what should have been happening to begin with.

But now that we have the green-light for a code restructure I basically have to start over and throw out all of the code I've written for the past month

[white relic]

It sounds like a success to me. You pushed for what you felt was necessary and convinced stakeholders to let you do it.

Making a success of the rewrite may bring your manager around.

Or give you an opportunity to work around him if necessary

[fringe sphinx]

Well done

[trail plaza]

I want to be a Data analyst

[lost glade]

What do people mean when they say " be a jack of all trades " are they implying to learn everything for example learning everything in the IT scope like backend , frontend , machine learning and cyber security or better or having a wider scope like having skills of PCB designing , Web Designing and Graphic Design?

[pine sleet]

generally when people are starting out, they focus on breadth rather than depth. they usually end up drilling down more and finding a specific field or niche later in their career

one might argue that by being knowledgeable in a wide variety of topics you can be far more flexible and versatile and work well in any company in any project

[lost glade]

Currently in highschool Ive done projects that include Machine Learning , CAD modeling , 3D Printing , PCB designing , basic figma skills and basic backend. Im lost for my career path I dont want to go on a study path and abandon the skills ive learnt.

[fringe sphinx]

In terms of how broad is broad enough; think of it as degrees of distance from your field. Want to be an SWE? Then learn a bit of systems, cloud, networking, software architecture, project management, CI/CD, etc. it's very subjective and personal, perhaps graphic design is adjacent if your focus is web dev.... or pcb design is relevant if you're doing low level work.

[pine sleet]

Im lost for my career path
this is normal, it's fine and it happens. even college students are lost up till their second, even third year and switch degrees

[fringe sphinx]

There's no rule like: you must learn x, y, x... just don't over specialize early

[pine sleet]

for now keep exploring new things, build new and cool projects, see what you like

[fringe sphinx]

No wrong answer as long as you're learning something new

[lost glade]

but following job trends also needs to be taken in right?

[pine sleet]

Not too much. some people make “job market bad” a whole thing - if you are skilled and hardworking you will not have trouble finding a job pretty much anywhere

[rose aurora]

The company in which I am selected as a Data Engineer

[rose aurora]

Fresher as I have completed my graduation in 2024 so I am just looking for a job

[cursive compass]

are u gonna be data analyst

[lilac nebula]

Any data scientist?

[peak halo]

be sure to always ask your actual question. don't "ask to ask".

[lilac nebula]

Is there anyone who is an actual data scientist , if so , what was your major? For how many years have you been ?

[peak halo]

computer science, with an emphasis on data science/AI

[lilac nebula]

How interesting AI is

[peak halo]

it's interesting, but it doesn't work the way that people probably think it does.

[lilac nebula]

I might minor in AI so I’ll have to my research

Within data science what programming languages do you use?

[peak halo]

if you want to work in DS/AI without getting a masters, you need to get as much DS/AI experience as an undergrad as you possibly can, or you won't be able to compete with masters degree holders.

I only use Python.

[lilac nebula]

Python! As I only want to use , I wanted to be a software dev before I started college . Do you use sql?

[peak halo]

I don't, but you should probably know it.

[lilac nebula]

Where’d you take computer science at , university

[peak halo]

yes

[meager robin]

hey...!

[stable stump]

Hi

[plush obsidian]

HI GUYS
IM LESHAAAAAUUUUNNNNN DDDDDDDIIIIIIINNNNNGGGGGGLLLLLLEEEEENNNNNUUUUUUT

[vapid jay]

hello

is python a good choice for cloud computing? or am i better off learning another language?

[muted night]

how can u manage programming with a full time job completely different @leaden jasper

[peak halo]

is your goal to work for Amazon, Microsoft, etc. on their AWS or Azure teams? Or do you want to be a developer who uses those platforms?

[leaden jasper]

I'm an Aerospace Engineer and specialize in modeling and simulation. So I use programming there. But otherwise I use programming in other parts of my life, like in my volunteering work for a non-profit.

[muted night]

damn

sounds like a lot of work

[vapid jay]

sounds green but do I have to work for those companies

i'd rather be/do the latter

[smoky quest]

It's not work if you enjoy it

[muted night]

amazon made aws and microsoft made azure, just letting u know

[peak halo]

when you ask about doing "cloud computing", what do you think that involves?

[heavy widget]

hi, i am wonder is someone here who is AI Architect? I want to be in one day

[fast fossil]

you pretty much need a masters degree in the field for that
or so I hear in these chambers

also, the title itself probably doesn't really say that much about what one does in said role

[heavy widget]

i readed about it on Udemy com and i was wonder do i need studies and they said only certificates (many many) and my own work (portfolio)

[fast fossil]

AFAIK certificates are mostly worthless
there are exceptions, but probably not for the role you mentioned
I'm sure Stelercus can tell you more about it (he works in the field), but I know he will say that a degree is a must, probably a masters at least

[fringe sphinx]

A degree will be the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation.

[spare sinew]

Is building good connections on LinkedIn a good approach? Like is it useful?

[smoky quest]

As opposed to?

[heavy widget]

i dont have time for that, i just droped my studies from mechanic shit

[smoky quest]

Are you okay with a path far more difficult with less compensation and less opportunities?

[autumn urchin]

I am currently an Engineer (Operations/Delivery) at a fortune 500 company. I started out as a field technician. I mainly support teams that are dedicated to various clients. My work ranges from physical installs to helping deliver automation (primarily Ansible/Python). Almost all of the scripting and projects I've solely worked on have been in Python. The most successful was a program I coded for on site technicians to automate OOB configurations for Dell/HP/Lenovo servers for a very large client. This is instead of them manually configuring them and peers validating their work. I first setup DHCP servers on the techs laptops as well as 48 port Cisco switches. This is so the techs can connect to individual servers or multiple servers (up to 47 - switch capacity minus connection for laptop) at once. The program connects to the clients build API to pull data for configurations for whichever build they are working. It continually looks for active connections within the DHCP server IP range. When it finds one, or multiple as everything is multi-threaded, it performs http requests to check the server serial number. It then associates this serial number with the data pulled from the build API in order to then push out that server's specific configurations using Redfish API running on the servers. The program then pulls all of the configured data, hardware health, and hardware inventory from the servers, using Redfish API again, which it then puts into an Excel report for the entire build.

I do have an issue with updating the program and effectively distributing it to the techs. I would like to create some sort of update service within the program that reaches out to the Github repository to update, but I am not sure how to do that. I'll be looking into that at some point and making it a reality. I am currently working on recreating the entire program into a web-server hosted on the company VPN using Django and a reverse-proxy. I won't have to worry about distributing the updated program anymore this way, and I get to learn more fun things.

Anyway, I am hoping to build upon my coding abilities and eventually transition into a career as a SWE. I've been looking for advice and guides on what I need to learn to start a career as a SWE based on my current abilities. I have definitely found helpful information, but I am here to ask people who are already well into SWE careers how I should go about achieving my goal?

[white relic]

am a little confused, does the wall of text relate to the question?
this channel is for discussing careers, not just anything that you happen to be doing for a job (the help- and topic-oriented channels being more appropriate for that purpose)

basically is this a question about creating an update service or is it about developing your skills

[autumn urchin]

Yeah, sorry about that. The bulk is information showing where I am at with my abilities. The last few lines are my question.

[fringe sphinx]

If your question is: How do I prepare to be a SWE? 1. Practice the craft: do projects... and don't worry about specialization... breadth is important at first. 2. It's not just about coding - other technical skills are important. 3. Learn about things that are important to engineers - testing, deployment, automation, cloud/linux/etc.

[autumn urchin]

Thank you. Any suggestions on resources to get me there? I have a Udemy course for Python, am working on one of Harvard's CS50 courses, and I attempt leetcode problems daily.

[fringe sphinx]

To keep my stretch of gym analogies going: Leetcode is like doing curls at the gym. It feels good, but is largely a waste of time.

[fringe sphinx]

Projects. Do things... preferably useful things... with code.

[autumn urchin]

lol, I do like the analogy. From what I've seen people seem to just point to leetcode when prepping for interviews. So that makes sense. I'll keep working on the project I described above and try to come up with some other useful ideas as well. Thank you.

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, leetcode is totally appropriate for prepping for interviews, but that's after you're already squatting 300 lbs 🙂

[worldly swallow]

@smoky quest yo is bachelor in software engineering a good degree from hiring perspective

[smoky quest]

definitely

[worldly swallow]

awesome

I'll get started on that soon

finishing it in 2025

start 24 class of 25 lets go

[true harness]

that's fast

[worldly swallow]

It's gonna be pretty hard if I think the way I normally do

but u know me, I give it my all and doin whatever it takes

[fringe sphinx]

The thing about learning coding (and school) is: it's largely a function of putting the time in. It's not about being the smartest or cleverist.

[worldly swallow]

I mean that it will be hard for me because I hear about something interesting and stop and go google about it

i get hung up on so much information. I hear something cool and stop and think about it

I theorize maybe I won't want to get hung up on such info to accelerate through this, but then in a lesson there's not really a way to discern what will and won't be on an assessment

people have said to take like preassessments and stuff to figure out where you are in a class

i'm taking some certification right now to practice doing acceleration and it's pretty difficult. thinkin about 38 courses sound hard. I will have to get into a different frame of thinking with all the hacks I can to make this work

Don't mind spending some extra time fiddling with things that feel like they will be useful (but that seem like direct conflict with how i will have to work)

[fringe sphinx]

I feel you. Time management is really important: success in Uni is 99% time
Management,

(Nobody believes it, and I doubt this advice has ever changed anyone's behavior)

[pine sleet]

real. I will continue to start all my assignments at 11pm

[worldly swallow]

i mean sheit I will try

there ppl on there that say they finish their shit in one term while working a full time and part time job

already need to grind to finish this cert im workin on by quota

smh 😄

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, this nonsense again.

If you're not trying to learn anything, you can manage your time however you want.

[worldly swallow]

but they passed somehow

[vapid jay]

What job fields are in python except for Ml or web development with django? @fringe sphinx

[fringe sphinx]

Nearly every scientific, computing, math, engineering, etc field uses Python (not exclusively, but significantly). https://spectrum.ieee.org/top-programming-languages-2024

[fleet reef]

I passed* my college classes while working 16h days and often weekends too, averaging less than 4h sleep per night
It being possible doesn’t mean it’s easy
I ended up dropping out because I couldn’t keep going

*was a C student, but I still consider that a personal win considering everything that was happening at once

[fringe sphinx]

This is different. they're trying to speedrun an online bachelors in 6 months.

[worldly swallow]

finish in 2025 at least, which is different than the six month thing

[fleet reef]

You can do that?

[pine sleet]

under very specific circumstances yes

[fringe sphinx]

reddit is full of ppl speedrunning WGU: https://www.reddit.com/r/WGU/comments/19ewz5k/speedrunning_cs_degree_days_12/

(for everyone else, this is not a recommended strategy)

[worldly swallow]

that degree is relatively difficult to speedrun unless u are up to speed in math

i dont really give a shit, everyone says degree in software engineering is good

passing is all i ask and I think the school is only pass/fail anyways

i just want the money.

aside from that, for anyone reading, take into account that people working on such speedruns may already have considerable experience in their fields.

If i can get $200k pay and not be limited then fuck it. I see some students working on cool things and think "wow they are getting a quality education" but fuck it, not really worth four years and $100k

or $35,000 I think it would cost from calculations of one way I was looking at

I've already got considerable experience in IT and programming, if that changes anything about how you feel, if not then whatever. I don't need approval, but I'm not gonna go in there and cheat myself either.

[delicate swift]

[vapid jay]

I basically want to learn skills that will help me land a job but I'm unsure of what field to go for. If I want to make cli applications for pc like I've been doing in my university classes what field is that can you tell? Is it desktop application developer

[delicate swift]

I didn't know that speedrunning degrees were a thing.

And for what it's worth; it's not only the degree that will guarantee you a $200k+ offer

Or a job at all, realistically. Awful market competition nowadays

[fringe sphinx]

What education level are you in now? How far away is Uni?

[vapid jay]

I've been unemployed since my graduation 2 year ago

[fringe sphinx]

Ah, what degree?

[vapid jay]

In bachelor in computer science

[worldly swallow]

right. I'll try to make the most of what I'm doing in there.

[harsh river]

wait what

[delicate swift]

Good luck
Formal education is always something to strive for because it makes things that much easier

[fringe sphinx]

If you're struggling to find work, remember that tech is bigger than just programmers. There are many jobs, from customer facing technical roles to engineering support and QA/testing to operations.

[harsh river]

you went to college?

[fringe sphinx]

Consider applying to a wide range of jobs, to get your foot in the door.

[delicate swift]

Customer facing would be the end of me. I'd just rather work in a warehouse at this point.

[fleet reef]

Wait what what?
Ping me in OT or DM me if you want to hear about it

Not really advice that people wanting good careers should hear

[delicate swift]

Completing a degree just to work in a call center would not be it for me

[fringe sphinx]

Perhaps depends on what types of customers. If your customers are other techies / engineers, would that change things?

[vapid jay]

I want to go for a swe role as pay and career in other fields are very low paying in my country. QA makes around 300$ a month

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, but if you've gone 2 years with no work experience... even QA would get something on your resume.

[delicate swift]

Oh now that you put it like that, it sounds a lot more bearable
Yeah I'd consider it

[worldly swallow]

What I'm getting at is- if u and others can do it and I can't then there's something wrong with me. I don't work 16 hour days so I should be able to do it. if not then i need to fix myself.

[vapid jay]

But if I can learn a framework or some skills to land a swe job what should I learn?

[delicate swift]

I guess I'm just bothered about the prospect of facing call center type of support, with people ringing you to yell at you

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, but "it" in your case is very different than "it" in theirs.

But, I agree with the principle; we're all capable of great things.

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, I deal with a lot of customers. I like it. But I'm not dealing with PC help desk 🙂

[delicate swift]

Mayhaps I'll see where life takes me.
I'm still drawing out on that lateral move to a full-time data engineer position

[vapid jay]

Like for example in web app development you need to learn django. So for desktop application development do I need to learn some framework?

[delicate swift]

Junior SWE -> SWE -> Data engineer
Nothing could go wrong, just follow the yellow brick roads

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, well... that's basically my field. There's a lot of "customers" involved in data engineering.

[fringe sphinx]

For web app development, a company may use any of many possible frameworks. Django is one example... knowing Django (or Flask or FastAPI) will make it easier to learn others.

[vagrant sandal]

The main idea is: Throw effort at anything and eventually you'll succeed. Two caveats:

• Some things require a lot of effort
• Some people can't throw effort at things fast enough

And that's fine. That's just how life works. You're trying to force yourself to burn as bright as others without knowing whether or not you are equipped to do the same. As someone that has gone down the same hellhole and is now swallowing SSRIs, don't do that. It's fine to have something idealistic to strive to get to, but at some point you'll just have to say "Fuck it, any more is diminishing return" and stop.

[nocturne drum]

should I keep using visiual studio for python

[fringe sphinx]

For desktop development, you also could any of many frameworks... so it's very hard to guess what stack to learn.

[fringe sphinx]

Wrong channel for this type of q, ask over in #python-discussion

[vapid jay]

What is the most famous ones like django? Which most companies use. Like whenever I apply for an entry level job they ask for more than 2 years of experience as well as expertise in some frameworks. So I wanted to learn some framework that would help me securing a job.

[worldly swallow]

uh well I am calculating in my mind finishing by end of 2025 so 14 months

I feel like I have to knock out the credits that quickly or things could change out from under me

[fringe sphinx]

There's no single answer to this. You can go look at job postings and see what keywords come up often, but I doubt any single stack is going to be more than 15-20% of your hits.

[worldly swallow]

like "hey this isn't accepted transfer credit anymore"

[fringe sphinx]

Afaik, once you start on a degree program, the degree requirements are set in stone... even if they change it for later cohorts.

[vagrant sandal]

Force yourself to burn and and you will burn out. Burn out and it will take more than a strong will to get back up. Talk to your academic counsellor on this. I, in good faith, cannot offer you any advices on this because my programme, policies, etc., is different from yours.

Eating antidepressants while trying to study is not an experience I'd recommend to anyone

[vapid jay]

This means I will have to learn the stack after I get accepted for the job as I can't learn all the frameworks. But even for entry level jobs they require experience with framework as well as 2 year jobs experience. How is this possible I'm very confused

[pine sleet]

if it requires 2 years of experience it is by definition not entry level

[worldly swallow]

I just keep moving to avoid the bad thoughts

[vapid jay]

True but 90% of job listing ive seen asks for 1-2 years of experience in entry level roles

[worldly swallow]

I'd have to be unenrolled actually to get credits online

however many u can even get for SWE degree, which would require coding assignments aye?

[vagrant sandal]

U(nethical) LPT: Bullshit your say through. Go have a vacation while participating in OSS development. Then you can write that off in your CV as "Freelancing developer"

[worldly swallow]

So may not be too big of an issue, might have to enroll sooner than later

[fringe sphinx]

This is why we interview. Thank goodness.

[smoky quest]

do you really want to work for people who would buy that?

[worldly swallow]

sure

[vagrant sandal]

I'm not. My career isn't in SWE :P

[smoky quest]

I assure you that you would not want that

[smoky quest]

That explains a lot

[worldly swallow]

fuck. well im gonna dip out of here and stop talking about it and go get my degree. au revoir.

[vapid jay]

I've filled my cv experience part by fiver freelancing experience as there is no need of a certification for it.

[vagrant sandal]

CC @fringe sphinx, I know my place already: Just a hobbyist that dives a bit too far into programming and DevOps. Sure as shit ain't gonna be applying for any SWE positions anytime soon

[smoky quest]

so maybe your place isn't about giving unethical/inapplicable advice either?

[worldly swallow]

yall don't know me but I know all of you. and I send love and best wishes.

[vapid jay]

But people demanding 2 years job experience for roles that are entry level is also not a right thing

[smoky quest]

entry level jobs do not require experience by definition

[vapid jay]

They do in job description. As far as I've seen.

[smoky quest]

They may be looking at degree or equivalent experience.
Or we aren't looking at the same job descriptions

[vagrant sandal]

Considering my career lies in manufacturing consumer food products, fuck no. The moment I, we, do something wrong, the impact is measured in at best "thousands of cases" to "percent of the population" at worst.

[smoky quest]

Same could apply to any job

[vapid jay]

Maybe but in my country mostly all jobs demand that plus experience with different frameworks

[smoky quest]

I can't speak for your country. Sorry about that

[vapid jay]

And I've applied for many many foreign country jobs for me to know that they usually dont hire entry level roles from overseas as they'll have to spend money in sponsoring them

Hence here I am unemployed and depressed

[vagrant sandal]

Yup. I'm not gonna become the one responsible for a Staph. aureus outbreak tyvm

[smoky quest]

Without a degree nor experience, your chances to find a job overseas is pretty much nil

[vapid jay]

I have a bachelor's degree in computer science

[smoky quest]

ah nice! I was confused by your previous message here #career-advice message

[serene terrace]

anyone got time to join a call i got some questions ab comp sci field that im indecisive over

[vapid jay]

No worries. I would not have been this depressed for not finding a job. Its that I've wasted 4 years on my degree and still can't find a jobs. That's the reason

[smoky quest]

Hi! It will be simpler to ask here in the channel

[smoky quest]

yeah, the market is tough everywhere!

[serene terrace]

i just cant decide what is best to concentrate my degree on i got 1 of 5 options and im unsure which one is best for me im going back to school for a associates in applied science

[vapid jay]

True. I always assumed that you learn what you have to do on job. But it's completely opposite they ask you to know everything beforehand even for entry level roles

[smoky quest]

it's a bit of both

[summer roost]

if you're trying to hire someone who will have an easy time learning stuff on the job, one of the best signals available to you is how much stuff they already know

[vapid jay]

What stuff to learn beforehand is what I don't get

[summer roost]

https://missing.csail.mit.edu/ might be useful to you

[wispy raven]

Hey

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> scam

[pine sleet]

Hello, your message has been deleted as it violates our rules

[distant urchin]

Oh this is interesting. Does it involves common linux commands. I only know basic ones

[fallen verge]

yo, does anyone wanna chat about college or their potential career path

[fast fossil]

Is that any different from offline bachelors credibility-wise?

[pastel thunder]

How to avoid doing silly mistakes that can do blunders when released for public (in software)

For example i put incorrect limits for logging something and even tested the code for that incorrect limit.

Usually these bugs are caught before but it makes a poor impression when you say you are done and some teammate catches such bugs.

[vapid jay]

im aware that they did. i think my question wasn't clear enough. let me rephrase it to: do smaller companies (let's say startups) use AWS and Azure as well? or do they create their own?

[muted night]

unit tests 🤷
https://docs.pytest.org/en/stable/

[strong lava]

Really? Again? <@&831776746206265384>

[kindred jackal]

Hello, I’m in need of honest criticism and advice for my resume for software engineering intern positions.

Please feel free to be blunt. I’m genuinely looking for advice and won’t take it personally if someone calls me resume shit or something.

How can I improve my resume (new skills, languages, structure, etc) for software engineering positions?

[west flicker]

Are full stack web devs basically software engineers?
And are they really demanded on the field?
How high are they demanded on the field

[primal ivy]

Good morning
I noticed I have an active voucher discount that expires today. Anyone insterest to use it DM

[west flicker]

Who's a full stack web dev and what do they do

[buoyant seal]

https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#TestDrivenDevelopmentByExample
https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#UnitTestingPrinciplesPracticesandPatterns
Unit tests 😏

also eliminating smells of code, like not doing shit like silencing generic Exceptions in python
Not having them in any way logged and silenced
Handling precise exceptions
Not sure which book has stuff about it for python. may be this one
https://www.amazon.com/Clean-Code-Python-Refactor-legacy/dp/1788835832
This book is more conventional but not in python
https://martinfowler.com/books/refactoring.html

and preferably running typing for python
https://careers.wolt.com/en/blog/tech/professional-grade-mypy-configuration
https://docs.python.org/3/library/typing.html

Also preferably having intensive logging coverage
with multiple levels.
Visibility matters to simplify debugging
https://docs.python.org/3/library/logging.html
Far easier catching mistakes when they spit warning and error level msgs about themselves 😅

But the cornerstone is unit testing of course, everything else is nice cherry on top.
Except the anti pattern thing. Doing anti patterns in python is just asking for troubles

[west flicker]

What's FE and BE
And what's DevOps

[buoyant seal]

FE - Frontend development. doing visual part of web sites if web frontend (Html/CSS/jS-TS), but can be also iterpreted into desktop/mobile frontend too (all other languages)
BE - Backend development. doing server side part of web applications. usually interactions with relational databases, calling other APIs and doing other domain logic. In modern ways, it is smth that runs on Linux servers.
DevOps - it has several meaning, but in jobs terms it means handling Server (Linuxes again, yay) infrastructure as a code way. Using Terraform/Pulumi/Kubernetes and other stuff to define how Frontend and Backend should be deployed automatically through your code, and being observed with your monitoring systems

[fringe sphinx]

Indentation is weird? Why are projects / certifications / skills at a different left alignment than everything else? How can you list the bachelors program if you haven't finished the associates? Put experience after education, that's the most important block. Take a look at other templates like "Jake's resume" (google it). The experience bullets can be improved; no technical info

[winged steeple]

Can anyone help me

[near ocean]

#python-discussion

[buoyant seal]

reading through it...

Education section... having rank as italic made it very not noticable, and i had to guess what the hell are those Scholarships doing there.
Could be cool to switch bachelor to normal font, and those options to smth less noticable as italic

Projects... okay Embedded development the first one
second one: Ordinary school project, sounds as not very worthy to note may be, unless there is indeed high effort present. OOP based is shown as achievement, but it is a regular thing like.

Certifications... okay, cool name of a provider. Cloud infrastructure, so you are not only Embedded developer then

Skills... OOP Computer Programming (basic stuff all students learn in university at 1-2year... okay u have graduation pointed for 2026 year, now i understand why it is present, probably latest learnt
Data structures is ordinary stuff of software engineering degree too, again 1st/2nd year
Linux CLI basic stuff of CS program too.
C,C++ i expect from this resume at ordinary student level i guess too

Some work experience is nice

And interests are sport related, nothing exactly contributing towards programming

TLDR: resume... very ordinary stuff all people go through during CS degree
The only thing standing out, Arduino experiments and Oracle Certification for cloud infra

[buoyant seal]

Recommendations to fix:
Pick language u love (and preferably job role speciality u would wish to work with), and learn it throughly, build projects in it. It is your own responsibility to learn language and tech stack around for job after graduation
(current languages u pointed i don't consider as learnt because they are highly likely at very early student level everything hints, under question if u like to work with them)

Read and learn stuff for code quality
https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#CodeCompleteAPracticalHandbookofSoftwareConstruction
https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#TestDrivenDevelopmentByExample
https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#UnitTestingPrinciplesPracticesandPatterns
And apply to projects u build

https://darklab8.github.io/blog/choosing_pet_projects.html
build more meaningful projects as well if u can

P.S. pick wisely language u wish to work after graduation, try multiple ones. Until u found the most loved
Check there are plenty job vanacies for it
And you are okay with job roles for it.
U have time until graduation at 2026 to pick the best. Get yourself smth u certainly can love to work with, or at least going to hate less than others 😉

[true harness]

• scholarships are usually more appropriate for academic applications
• for your experience, did you do any actual web development? the bullets don't demonstrate any developing of web (if yes, you should definitely talk about that)

[west flicker]

What's css, js, ts
What'd you say for python concerning these careers
And what does software engineering have to do with these

[buoyant seal]

😏 u could learn Java if u wish. u have many years ahead to perfect it.
Usable both for Backend (good for modern development for Linux), Android and Desktop development.
And also usable to make the best games and participate in modding of communities like

• Minecraft (over 100'000 mods exist for it)
  • pretty cool mods are there https://wiki.industrial-craft.net/index.php/Tutorial:First_Steps#Basic_steps_in_a_new_world
• or Statsector (over 400 mods are present for it at least)
  • i find personally it very cool how much effort some people make into them there, like this web site presents conglomerate of mods for it http://www.ashesofthedomain.info/

Pretty universal language to equip CS student with. and known to build quality stuff

[buoyant seal]

css = Cascading Style Sheet https://www.amazon.com/Head-First-HTML-CSS-Standards-Based/dp/0596159900 , thing to style html
Js = Javascript, Ts = Typescript. ergh... they are defacto standard today to do interactive web frontend. Typescript is a thing on top of Javascript to fix its problems.
Usage of other languages is very problematic for front side at client side in user browser, because ecosystem grew only around them mostly last dozens of years
Important language for frontend developers.

We backend devs can implement front too, and using just html, css and lightweight additions of js through htmx and vanilla js, but it has its own challenges and limitations

[buoyant seal]

What'd you say for python concerning these careers
shrugs. usable for Backend, Data engineering, DevOps engineering, Quality Assurance, Data science and Machine learning as far as i know.
Very specific language in its applications due to being scripting dynamic typed one with performance and parallelism problems (which in some future years are going to be fixed one day may be, but until then usage for lets say desktop apps is not very wise)
It has advantages to being easier for mathematicians and for beginners
And its nature and popularity drived it very forward in terms of ecosystem (u could be missing in other languages all the nice stuff python has)
quite easy to unit test too (again due to its unlimited freedom and dynamic typeness)
It is possible to build millions of code lines applications in it, question though appears, should they be built in it 😏

[buoyant seal]

FE,BE,DevOps are just job role specializations that software engineer could choose.
FE,BE,DevOps people are supposed to be software engineers, but not all software engineers are FE,BE or DevOps 😉

[west flicker]

What language is good for creating apps and softwares

[fast gulch]

I’ve been asked to lead the AI transformation at my company, and it’s got me thinking a lot about what being “AI First” really means and what a playbook for that might look like. Is anyone else going through something similar at their job? I’d love to hear what’s been working for others or any cool insights you’ve had around AI projects.

[peak halo]

what kind of company is this?

[fast gulch]

Venture capital. My input supports both internal functional teams (accounting, HR, legal, etc.) and occasionally the investment teams, though less frequently.

[tepid marsh]

python-

[west flicker]

Thank you sir 😁

[tepid marsh]

😄

[random acorn]

For Desktop apps I would really recommend C#

Use it with Visual Studio

[west flicker]

For 100 lvl computer science student who wants to learn Python while in school, what should be my daily schedule. Cos I'm finding it hard to fit in learning python to my daily activities
Class starts from 8am-6pm

[random acorn]

For mobile applications there are a lot of options, my choice would be maybe Java

[west flicker]

You mean VS code?

[random acorn]

Microsoft has two apps/products, Visual Studio Code(blue one) and Visual Studio(purple one)

[west flicker]

I use VScode

[fringe sphinx]

I'm not normally a cynic. But, "AI First" genuinely means the executive team has spent too much time following buzz. It means nothing and is corporate nonsense. You can literally do anything and create good PowerPoint to make them happy.

[fringe sphinx]

I know people leading AI transformation programs at F50 companies: for them, their strategy is nuanced, focused and purposeful. It's not 'AI first' it's focused on gaining organizational experience and small wins, and looking to build on those.

[wild cradle]

Hi, I just finished my degree first class and was given an opportunity to fast-track PhD in SE. Should I take it? Or prioritize Work experience?

I dont have any plans in becoming a lecture nor like teaching people. The fees that come with continue studying is also something that Im scared to take on

[delicate swift]

Man, does it really get better once you have the foot in the door?
My internship will be ending soon-ish, and I've been applying for full-time jobs for a while now — few interviews, even fewer callbacks. No offers.
I understand breaking into the field may be hard at first, but should I expect it to get worse or better after getting the experience credentials as a full-time? Otherwise... yup. Not very pleasant.

[pliant parcel]

anyone AI engineer here?

[wild cradle]

Any benefits to taking a PhD? Do reqruiters really favor that you have a PhD over having work experience?

[fringe sphinx]

Depends on what job you're applying to.

[pliant parcel]

any aerospace engineer here?

[wild cradle]

as in PhD is much more favourable in research positions?

but the jobs in research is really limited..

[pliant parcel]

is there any phd online?

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, if you want to do research or 'science', a PhD is very helpful.

[wild cradle]

is there a high demand for researchers? Im scared Ill waste years of my life and take on more debt trying to get a position in research positions

[peak halo]

by the time you finish a PhD, there will probably be plenty of positions in AI that prefer PhDs.

[fast gulch]

their strategy is nuanced, focused and purposeful. It's not 'AI first' it's focused on gaining organizational experience and small wins, and looking to build on those.

I wholeheartedly appreciate your take. Perhaps my use of "AI First" was a poor choice of words. I'm working to ensure our approach is everything but "corporate nonsense."

I've been focusing my energy on training plans company wide to get people past the media buzz. I've also been working diligently towards getting pilot projects identified and created to show early value.

However, there's still quite a bit of folks who are stuck on GenAI vs understanding actual ML solutions vs data-science solutions and understanding those differences.

Hence why I asked the question. I'd love to hear more about these "people leading AI transformation programs at F50 companies" and how their thinking about it. If you're willing to share.

[limpid trench]

Are computer science degrees useful?

[fringe sphinx]

A few thoughts: I have a good friend struggling with AI/ML Ops; his organization is cranking out models that quickly deteriorate in utility. ML Ops is a real challenge, for a variety of reasons.

[peak halo]

they're practically a requirement if you want to get a job as a developer these days.

[limpid trench]

Yea, but will the information be useful to learn? Also how flexible is the degree with other industries?

[fringe sphinx]

They've experimented in a few domains: some for chat bots, others for education (course) development, etc, some for executive decision making.... it takes a variety of skill sets and a significant organizational investment (from ops to DS) that few organizations can bear. Smaller shops are better off sourcing models rather than creating one offs of marginal quality and insufficient resources: I spend a good amount of time convincing people -not- to try to build out something custom that they can't maintain

[fringe sphinx]

How does one measure usefulness or flexibility?

[fast gulch]

I hear you there. We normally fall on the "buy" side of the build/buy decision.

[fast gulch]

That being said, what about fine-tuning some of these general models to help increase accruacy for use-cases? That's an area that's been on my list to explore.

[limpid trench]

With prior experiences

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, we build plenty... but usually anything LLM related is: buy it because of effort required to maintain it

[turbid shore]

I am feeling a bit lost in my academic career
I don't feel any attraction toward my subjects or a willingness to do them as I am not even sure where I go after high school. All that is in my head is finish high school. Get a degree. Get a job. Nothing is clear. All I know is that I want to develop software for the people. I love creating software and seeing people enjoy it. I enjoy paying attention to it's design, function and all the details that an audience may miss but will unknowingly appreciate.

What careers can I look into that will allow me to do this? From there, I can work backward and figure out what degree is for me and become motivated. I hate the idea of just working aimlessly and "doing well" and then deciding what I want to do; cause then there is no end goal.

[true harness]

software engineering. cs degree

[turbid shore]

Then this causes me to ask another question. I am unable to differentiate between software engineering and software development. Are they the same? Are they different? What is the difference, if so?

[true harness]

they are the same

[turbid shore]

I see.
Is computer science difficult? I have seen skits where people make it look impossible which has unfortunately made me have a negative view about it.

Also, what is mechatronics?

[true harness]

it is difficult. you probably can't just fly through

[true harness]

combination of robotics and other stuff. you can Google for more info

[turbid shore]

I don't want to tip the recommendation, but will CS also allow me to design how my software looks? Or just how it functions?

[true harness]

both

[deft herald]

The intersection of electrical and mechanical engineering. Typically used for robotics type of stuff

[radiant tulip]

who can make 2d assets? dm me (2d art designer i need

[turbid shore]

I see
My brother does that and I was wondering if I would be into it as well. But I prefer more programming. I enjoy debugging my software and after (strenuous) long hours of staring at my code and tweaking it, finally getting it to work. I also enjoy designing my software. I currently work with Pascal, in Delphi, using the VCL library to create GUI applications that run natively on Windows. This language preceeds C#, which is the closest example that most people will be familiar with.

[deft herald]

If you have more than zero programming experience, then you've got a leg up already going into a university program

[turbid shore]

I'm just a little concerned about my math and science. My programming skills are beginner at best.

[hearty totem]

I understand "AI first" as two possibilities: either a company that is pretty much a chatGPT wrapper. Or a company that is "data first", i.e. it's value comes from the data it produces, and they say "AI first" because it sounds fancier. Worked for both types, the later case has a much better success rate

[open raven]

When should I do leetcode problems, I’m just now understanding classes

[dusty wedge]

I'm seeking a partnership with someone who can provide access to an account on a freelancing platform. If you are interested in exploring this opportunity, please feel free to reach out to me for further discussion.

[deft herald]

1 - this is not the place for recruiting
2 - why do you need someone else to give you access to a freelancing platform?

[open raven]

Indubitably

[true harness]

after learning some dsa

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> repeated scam. Was already told they breach rules in #career-advice message

[leaden jasper]

!cban 1254700307049611329 scam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @dusty wedge permanently.

[fresh raft]

Guys without a bachelor degree, is there any chance to get any job(specially remote) just only by doing so many projects, competitive knowledge

[smoky quest]

that wouldn't be quite plausible at this time

[fresh raft]

reason?

[gray dragon]

cara acho que sua visao esta errada

[smoky quest]

well, what would be the reason to hire someone remotely without experience or education when there are thousands of applications of people with all of these?

[fresh raft]

that means people prioritize degree over skills?

[smoky quest]

degrees are proof of skills

among other things

[fast fossil]

and nothing stops you from having a degree AND skills

quite the opposite actually, it's sort of difficult to kinda get a degree without any skills

[true harness]

not only that, but almost all the roles i see nowadays are at least hybrid

[fresh raft]

There are so many example, getting a job without degree!

[smoky quest]

then it should be easy for you to get such job

[fast fossil]

count them up and divide by the total number of "getting a job"

[digital fjord]

A remote job is the key issue. 100% WFH is usually not something you start out with, but something you eventually negotiate with your manager even in your usual positions

[fast fossil]

it's also not like working in an office is that bad, I actually quite enjoy it
you get to talk to people and such and the commute is not that terrible either

[fresh raft]

I appreciate. I think approach is the key with the positive mindset and obviously the skills also

[fast fossil]

also have you like ever seen a 100% WFH job listing that required anything less than a senior?

[smoky quest]

Can you rephrase it in english?

[digital fjord]

well, without a degree, the hardest part is demonstrating your skills in a reliable way.

[fresh raft]

yes

I got it

[random acorn]

I don't have a degree is CS (I have in statistics) and by personal learning, projects and hard work I got a job as an integration engineer in a big 4 company last august. It is definitely possible.

[fresh raft]

Thanks my boy!

was it hard to make it?

[random acorn]

Well the interviews will definitely vary by company and position but it was nothing that difficult

Just OOP concepts, databases and algorithms in my language of preference

In some companies the entry level interviews are not that difficult to pass, you have to have your bases right

[fresh raft]

thanks @random acorn

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> not sure how to classify this

[vapid jay]

What

It's just a Google play giftcard

[fringe sphinx]

We don't allow anything like this, it's generally scams or things like that.

[vapid jay]

Ok

But how would it be a scam

It's just a giftcard code

[near ocean]

Not the channel or the server for this my guy

[slim garden]

Hi there, quick question 🙂 can I post a job on this discord? If so, what is the right channel to do it?

[vapid jay]

I'm not in any active servers

[pine sleet]

no, we do not allow recruiting anywhere on this server

[slim garden]

Glad that I asked, thanks for the heads up!

[rapid ledge]

Hello, I need some carrer orientation if anyone is available

[smoky quest]

it depends on the question

[rapid ledge]

I'm 19, I started python 4 months ego and focused on django for about a month, I did some pretty cool web applications but I think of leavig all these to focus on AI/ML. Because of the rise in popularity of this field I think and also because I like logical programming. I'm just confued whether I should continue with web development(wich is saturated) or move on to AL/ML

[peak halo]

if you switch to AI/ML, you should expect to probably get a masters degree. how much education are you willing to get?

[rapid ledge]

I just finished grade 12

and I think of lerning all these at home

[peak halo]

jobs in AI/ML select candidates based on their theoretical knowledge of AI and ML. Not their programming skills per se. If you don't get at least a bachelors degree, you almost certainly will not be able to get a job in the space.

[fringe sphinx]

Pre-Uni: generalize. Learn a little of both.

[rapid ledge]

Oow okay I understand. What can you advise me to do? progrssing with backend ? Does it worth it? or willl it continue to?

[fringe sphinx]

Again, generalize. Learn to build a web app, or a game, or train a model, or whatever you're interested in. Pick things you know the least about, and repeat

[rapid ledge]

Okay thank you

[leaden brook]

Hi, I was wondering if there are any placement students here who got Python-related placements?

I wanted to talk to one if that is ok.

[pine sleet]

what are "placement students" and "Python-related placements"?

[lost cypress]

Hello again!

So remember recently I mentioned how it’s been 3 or so days since I sent that follow up message to my interviewer, it’s around 10 days now and they haven’t opened the message yet even though he connected back with me pretty fast on LinkedIn.

Should I leave it alone or would it maybe be a good idea to send an extra follow up to his email? I’m just worried about the fact that he didn’t respond or maybe even thinks I never sent a follow up. Or he expected the follow up to be through email?

I’m not sure

[hasty cedar]

Hi! So i learnt coding 2 months ago. I was playing a blockchain game and wanted to automate an action, so I found how to use the game API to get real time infos, select the ones i need and my code would send transactions to the blockchain everytime an action is ready to be made. Now that this is done, I am looking for new project / new way to make money with python. So if any idea, suggestion or anything lmk. I'm also a math major c:

[white torrent]

Basically extended internships usually done for a year or so as part of a higher education course/degree

[white torrent]

I’m no longer in university however I did a Software Engineering placement as part of my course, and the main language on the codebase I worked on was Python - if you have questions feel free to ask away

[fringe sphinx]

Do you have their email, not just LinkedIn?

[lost cypress]

On their linked in, after clicking the contact info button their email is there

a lot of recruiters don’t usually have theirs on it but he does

[fringe sphinx]

Consider crafting a short but professional Thank You / follow up.

[lost cypress]

So even tho I sent one on LinkedIn already right?

[pliant parcel]

how ot o get a turing award?

[harsh river]

Context? Where?

[pine sleet]

do something exceptional in the field of computer science

[pliant parcel]

maybe pioneer a novel framework for AI?

hope so

[unique tide]

Hi everyone,

I need some advice regarding my career journey. I initially learned Python but have recently lost interest. I'm considering switching to web development (HTML, CSS, JavaScript), but my college teaches Python as part of the Artificial Intelligence and Data Science course, which starts in my second year.

I feel confused because I’ve received conflicting advice about whether to focus on C/C++, Java, or web development. I’ve tried to explore all of these but have struggled to make progress, and I feel like I’ve wasted a month since college started.

I would greatly appreciate any guidance or a clear roadmap for my four years in college to help me manage my learning effectively.

Thank you!

[random acorn]

Instead of choosing a set of languages, I would advise you to think what is it that drives you in this field, what is it that you like. This is what's important from my perspective. When you find your likes and dislikes then you choose the tools of your preference from the suggested ones regarding that field

[warm drum]

i think you would have to start with c/cpp, it helps you a lot with the basis of programming language helping you understand how memory works varables. At this point it's better if you follow what @random acorn saying

[neat jackal]

Do you know free bot hosts where the databases work and the commands do not bug?

[fringe sphinx]

Progress is measured over years not one month. There's no need to specialize now, instead focus on learning through projects: do something in areas you're interested in, repeat.

Also: https://spectrum.ieee.org/top-programming-languages-2024

[tepid marsh]

nahh 😭

[unique tide]

I think i am familiar with basic of programming i have done baisc in c/c++ python java all three of them but i am confussed mostly now between web develepment and python

[unique tide]

yaah

[fringe sphinx]

Anything specific you're confused about?

[unique tide]

between that if i should continue python where i have left or start a new journey with web development html css and java script because of internship opportunities

[fringe sphinx]

Are you in Uni? What year?

[unique tide]

yaah this is my first year its been only 1 month since it has been started

programming i have done till now is mostly in my school days and after the break i got before college starting

[fringe sphinx]

Focus first on school. Then on social: meeting people (such as through clubs) is important to your career and mental health. Then, practice coding through small projects. You should 'get good' at a programming language, such as Python. You should probably also do a web dev project at some point. Focus on getting good, rather than gaining 'job skills': people who jump around trying to min max their resume are focused on superficial skills

[unique tide]

okay

[unique tide]

I will try my best sir 🙂

[fringe sphinx]

Also: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QxI-RP6-HM

[delicate swift]

...Say, here's a question; do recruiters even give a thought about you putting down things like IDEs or editors in your skills tab? It... sort of feels like filler.

Been meaning to ask this for a while now.

[peak halo]

recruiters (and HR talent acquisition people in general) don't have technical training in the domains that they recruit for. they're probably using keywords that the hiring manager told them about.

[low matrix]

My wife wants to do an in-person programming bootcamp, but doesn't know where to look. I tried meetup and facebook and im having difficulty finding them. They all seem to be online only.

Are there other websites or search phrases I should be looking? I dont know where to look

[fringe sphinx]

What country?

[fringe sphinx]

What do -you- mean by recruiter? As Stel says, recruiters are a specific role in the hiring process... and sometimes ppl say recruiter when they mean 'hiring manager'.

[delicate swift]

By recruiters, I refer to the people in charge of picking out the candidates from the initial applicant pool

[low matrix]

USA, California

[fringe sphinx]

Depending on the org, there's often multiple people there, the recruiters might gather a pile of resumes and do a simple filter, but in my xp, the hiring manager (or committee) will do the actual review.

[devout zenith]

Most are fake job offers

[leaden brook]

Hi, I want to ask what type of tasks do you get on placement? Also when is the best time to be applying? Did you have a lot of work experience e.g. python related when applying (to show that your a strong candidate for the placement)?

Sorry I didn't reply sooner. I was busy.

[hearty totem]

It depends, oft is about catching attention. VScode, PyCharm, JetBrains all sound like filler indeed. But one sentente I saw in a CV once about editors caught my attention. The sentence went: "Vim, vim is peace, vim is zen, vim is great to program with pedals". It certainly got my attention

[scarlet belfry]

You might want to try looking at universities in your area or community colleges. I know one of the big universities here runs a bootcamp.

I think a lot of them are online because of the nature of many people doing bootcamps having busy lives where they cannot easily travel to the places where the bootcamps are.

Also you can make more money by offering to more places (if im being cynical).

https://adadevelopersacademy.org/ this one is in person, it focuses on women and minorities iirc, its in Seattle and Atlanta iirc. Its pretty hardcore from what i hear but it also has an internship included.

I considered applying before i decided to go back to school and get my BSCS.

[leaden brook]

Thank you, I'm gonna start applying rn.

[pastel thunder]

after carefull thinking about it, I have concluded its i do mistake because I want to be fast, and last time when I did testing (in our code it takes 16 hours to test completely) I made a small change and didnt test it

I think my manager might be thinking I am going slow, but this will have him think a lot more things

[buoyant seal]

16 hours to test completely? This is not unit testing

We have millions code lines and all tests run just 30 minutes 🙂

Tests should be fast for them to be useful. 16 hours is tech debt by 16-32 times

[random acorn]

From personal experience with supervisors and team leaders, I would say most of them prefer clean solutions and bug free even if that means do take a bit of extra time (of course not always the case in every scenario)

[pastel thunder]

yup,
also in our case there is a lot of file management, deletion, rename etc
And our application runs on linux and windows both,
in such case testing is is even more tiring then usual

[iron lichen]

guys think i so much peapol now learning python

[smoky quest]

What about it?

[iron lichen]

we not gonna found a job

[smoky quest]

okay

[random acorn]

Focus on what you have to do/learn/build now and the job find will come later on, everything in its order

[iron lichen]

yeah i know , but 40% of programmers learning python

[random acorn]

And tomorrow they'll be learning rust maybe

You have no control over the market's trends, focus on your own personal development, it's the only thing you can control and basically worth your time

Moreover, this also just means it is in demand 😄

[topaz abyss]

i mean probably pays better than frontend 😭

[topaz abyss]

honestly its like that for every language these days

[fringe sphinx]

They're learning software engineering, and happen to be using Python to do it.

[scarlet belfry]

There's tons of people learning everything. You have to resist the temptation to doom and gloom and just do it anyway.

[white torrent]

Did you have a lot of work experience e.g. python related when applying (to show that your a strong candidate for the placement)?
When I was applying, I had basically zero Python experience. My workplace was more focused on "does this candidate have any programming experience in ANY language" when interviewing.

Also when is the best time to be applying?
I applied as soon as applications for placements opened, which for me was around this time 3 years ago, and I had the offer to start in summer of 2022 by around Christmas time of 2021.

I want to ask what type of tasks do you get on placement?
I got given a bunch of different tasks, but they almost all were related to Python. A lot of my job was adding new features into our codebase or fixing issues raised internally or by customers. I also got asked to refactor or build testing for a lot of existing code.

[tame spade]

guys i chose java as my 1st programming language should i be focusing on mastering 1 language first or learning multiple languages at once but not so mastering them

[zenith torrent]

learn one language first, i beg you. After learning one, it will be easier to learn more since a lot of languages are similar to each other

[tame spade]

is java a bad pick as a first

[zenith torrent]

it's definitely not bad but there are definitely easier choises
I've seen a programmer start with java and he managed to study computer science In college and worked at multiple websites

so don't worry much about it, just make sure you study it a lot and understand it

[tame spade]

thanks

[peak halo]

No one ultimately cares how many languages you "know". They care about what kinds of things you're able to do. How long have you been learning Java?

[tame spade]

i just started like a month

[peak halo]

Depth in a specific language is more valuable than breadth across multiple languages. Any programmer worth their salt can rapidly acquire surface-level knowledge of any programming languages.

[faint depot]

My knowledge in python is still at a basic level, but i know enough about it where I can learn another language and pick it up a lot easier as I already have a better understanding of the core basics. I'm currently learning C (alongside imporving my python) just in prep for my 2nd (technically first year) of uni as I'll be doing a lot of hardware programming. I undestood a lot of the key concepts purely because of the knowledge I have from python

[marble pebble]

Anyone good at coding python and wanna make a quick $150?

[fringe sphinx]

!rule 9 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[marble pebble]

Oops

[marble pebble]

So where can I go to find good paid work 😂 I would have thought this is the 1 place to go

[fringe sphinx]

Fiverr perhaps

[fiery epoch]

Hi guys I am Aniket das, 3rd year of 4 years Computer Science and Engineering course, I want to get a job in a company by the last year of my college, I desperately need this, I have a good hands on python, I am very knowledgeable in Ai/Ml cause they are my personal selected subjects that I am focusing on and I am doing great, I have developed many ai for fun, but I need to put them on git profile which I am not doing a bad habit of mine . Can anyone suggest me the best way to get a job remote or on campus any one please 🙏🥺???

[fringe quiver]

Hi, I hope all members doing well.
I need your help. In next few days I've a job interview as Nerwork Development Engineer in AWS. So can you privde any site which have examples questions, code.

[supple galleon]

Hello guys want to start learning python what is the best way i can start learning

[smoky quest]

In terms of career, a CS degree will be the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[supple galleon]

I am pursuing chemical engineering but I want to learn coding as well

[smoky quest]

"Automating the boring stuff" is a popular resource

[supple galleon]

Thanks for helping bro

[graceful citrus]

I personally liked Python Complete, dm me and I can send you the link

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> recruitment

and cross posting

[crisp stream]

!cban 1285594770953076849 Racism is not welcome here

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @zenith vector permanently.

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> looks like an alt trolling

[crisp stream]

!cban 1287123474313383937 Nazism is not welcome here either

[inner wren]

:ok_hand: applied ban to @meager talon permanently.

[west flicker]

So what's the best frontend programming language
And which one's better and more profitable between frontend and backend

[near ocean]

Theres only one viable language for frontend and its javascript

[lilac sundial]

Do universities really matter that much for masters degrees

[white relic]

it depends on your location and to some extent on the field

my answer would be: it matters, but not a lot

[fringe sphinx]

I'd agree with trentj, I dont think the Uni matters (master's or undergrad) significantly for SWE field... altho there are exceptions for the absolute top tier or if you want to go into certain credential driven fields.

[white relic]

also depends on your preexisting network/experience, the answer might be different for a student going straight from BS to MS than for an industry professional looking to pick up one while working. That kind of thing

For PhDs it definitely matters a lot more

[lilac sundial]

I see

[fringe sphinx]

Hmm. I was answering what I perceived as the question: you asked whether Uni matters? And I translated that as: does the Uni ranking matter to hiring managers? There's a separate question of whether the quality of masters programs are the same / whether you'll get more out of a better program. That wasn't what -I- was answering, and I really don't know.

[lilac sundial]

Np man

[lilac sundial]

Also another question , is getting into a higher rated uni for MS harder than getting into one for BS

[true harness]

generally it's about the same difficulty in terms of acceptance rates. you can look at admission rates for specific schools to see

[lilac sundial]

Alr

Generally speking though, what criterea do they assess

[true harness]

your preliminary research for the schools you want should give you that information. it will be things like grades, transcript, standardized tests, etc

[lilac sundial]

Like grad exam and BS grades?

[true harness]

yes

[lilac sundial]

Also idk if ur from the states or not but what are some good states to study/work

On the eastside

[peak halo]

you want to be searching in terms of cities, not states.
any of the cities in the Boston-Washington corridor should do.

[lilac sundial]

Thank

[split spruce]

Hello everyone, i recently started with Software development on my college, im using python i downloaded it from pycharm
Can someone maybe give me a start on what i should begin with or a litte tutorial, because these youtube videos are really hard for me to learn from..

[quasi star]

try to learn from the docs

[timber cliff]

skibidi

[peak halo]

@timber cliff this is not a shitposting server. please make sure all your messages are substantive and relevant to the channel topic.

[calm grove]

yo

[west flicker]

Yh my roommate who's a final year student and a first class student said he mastered coding before he got into university and the university is only useful for the certificate

[vital wyvern]

There's much more value in universities than simply obtainin a degree. Some of the general education classes you take still help create a more well rounded, academic background.

There's also the social aspect-- the amount of networking opportunities in university attendance cannot be understated.

[timber cliff]

kk sorry :/

[split spruce]

what is docs

[raw nest]

The experience is more valuable than the certificate.

[hearty totem]

You probably want to head to #❓｜how-to-get-help and then to #python-discussion , this channel is specifically about career questions.

[faint depot]

read automate the boring stuff by ai sweigart. the books is completely free on his website for you to access. once you have gone through the book and have a basic understanding of python, start reading through the official python documentation. the documentation is not a good way to learn python at the beginning of your programming journey, unless you already have decent knowledge in python or another programming language. also see the python discussion channel for more info.

[faint depot]

another thing, dont give up. im still at the beginning of my programming journey and ive been rejected from every single IT/engineering (general and software) apprenticeship. it sucks ass but i keep going. every setback, i look back, analyse where i went wrong and then, i adapt my plan accordingly

[fringe sphinx]

The point of University, and SWEing, is not 'learning how to write code'. People who think it is are missing the point.

[sleek kayak]

Would it be appropriate to put your resume here for advice?

[untold dew]

Documentations
https://docs.python.org/3/
Also you can go through w3
At a beginner level - this helped me a lot -> BroCode, a Yt channel.

[near ocean]

Yes

[sleek kayak]

Any advice for my resume? I'm aiming for an internship at a mid-level company for the Summer of 2025.

[fringe sphinx]

Overall good. Intern bullets are a bit long, way too much reading involved: bullets are bullets, not paragraphs

Be consistent with month abbreviations vs spelled out.

Not a big deal, but the order is a little unusual... usually education on top or bottom. For your status, I'd put Education first.

The Tetris AI: maybe say more about the genetic engineering algorithm... high score isn't particularly interesting: but perhaps something about maximizing high scores or beating other algorithms/etc.

Most recent internship: would be nice to say something about dev skills (including testing, git, ci/cd. Co-authorship on its own bullet.

[west flicker]

So what's the point

[fringe sphinx]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyLy7Fu4FB4

[lost flume]

don't know why i'm here for now, might join back when it's relevant, this is literally my first message.

[peak halo]

take a look at #welcome to learn more about what this server is about. each channel serves a specific purpose--be sure to read the description of each channel to know what topics are relevant.

[vapid violet]

Make sure you link your github/website/linkedin (If not already)

[left oasis]

Hey all, I am a computer information systems major going for an associates to get my foot in the door and practice networking. I am already pretty confident in my programming w/ python, and want some people opinions on how to handle an issue i'm having w/ a professor

Currently our chapter is describing the usage of F-Strings to format output (The class is like intro the python, I have to take it to do stuff that actually interests me sadly)

In the book is specified python 3.8 or later.
F-String literals only gained support in 3.6 and later
Currently running 3.12.4 on my machine

Submitting a basic program of

print(f"{"A":^10}")
print(f"{"A A":^10}")
print(f"{"AAAAA":^10}")
print(f"{"A     A":^10}")```

The professor marked this as wrong, stating that it does not in fact run, and "Did you even try running your code."

I am trying to keep it professional, but I am incredibly frustrated as this is the head of the CS Department, and I had tested the code multiple times. The only possible way they could be getting the syntax errors they described in their grading would be if they are using a Python version earlier than 3.6

How should I approach this? I don't know if its best to tell them to their face that they are using a version of python not supported by the course, and to get my grade adjusted cause bit is making up somehow majority of the grade for the class...

[pine sleet]

I think you should let them know and try to get the grade adjusted, but just make sure you're being polite about it

[left oasis]

I agree, I also really am trying to get a great grade in this class, and generally this semester. I flunked out of my first attempt at college right before covid and am just going back now. Its incredibly frustrating because this is not the first issue I've had with this professor

I am trying to get a 4.0, and really put a good foot for my time in college, and it feels incredibly restricing in this class to actually do programming.

I am unable to use ANYTHING that has not been covered in the class, and even the usage of functions to encapsulate things and make it easier to test is looked down upon as we havent covered it yet

What recommendations do you guys have for really getting better at programming and properly using my time in college to get myself ready for a career?

[edgy mesa]

Any advice?

@left oasis hey we have the same major haha

[left oasis]

Nice! Im taking my class over at Housatonic Community College, Where are you going? Any advice for someone just heading right into it as a freshman and 1/2 (Got some college credits from transfer)

[edgy mesa]

I graduated already , no I don’t have advice im fucking stupid

I wouldn’t be here if I had the answers

[left oasis]

Lmao I feel that

[edgy mesa]

Im just trying to get my resume critiqued that’s all , feel free to give me suggestions

[left oasis]

Something I would potentially look into w/ the projects section of the resume maybe highlighting the length of time the projects took (If this is something you want known, or to present them as just months

It would give more time information for how long you worked on a project, and your ability to keep focused on one for a longer period of time

[edgy mesa]

I see

[true harness]

this syntax was only made valid recently 😉. but this is off topic for #career-advice

[edgy mesa]

Would you hire someone with my resume for a entry level data analyst job @true harness

[left oasis]

Ooh shoot okay, I thought it might fit here. Where would questions on academics fit do you think?

[true harness]

#python-discussion works fine for python. off topic for how to approach your prof

[left oasis]

okay I might just repost the original question there, Thank you!

[true harness]

i don't do any hiring, so i wouldn't know

[edgy mesa]

Fair

[fringe sphinx]

!pep 701

[inner wren]

**PEP 701 - Syntactic formalization of f-strings**

Status

Accepted

Python-Version

3.12

Created

15-Nov-2022

Type

Standards Track

[fringe sphinx]

See motivation 1, and look at the release version.

[left oasis]

ooh thank you! Will do

[fringe sphinx]

Tbf, the code looks like it shouldn't run to me too (at first glance) because of the embedded use of double quotes.

[left oasis]

That's true, I had just found usage of it this way to be supported, but upon testing it had worked and hadn't assumed anything was amiss.

I asked the professor if he would like a revised verison of the project submitted or if it can be graded as of 3.12.4 (version I submitted with)

Will find out how he responds, but its interesting to find this issue now instead of later

[fringe sphinx]

FWIW, in case it's not clear, professor could be running 3.11

[slim cedar]

Does python still be far away from perfect to be used on android platform ?

[fringe sphinx]

#python-discussion please

[trim crypt]

@hollow mauve if you have a question about career more than programming, you can ask it here.

[peak halo]

<@&831776746206265384>

[summer roost]

!warn @plush blade This is inappropriate. Any further attempts to use our server to report people to harass someone else will be met with a ban.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @plush blade.

[open ivy]

I am trying to fly my Cessna, can I learn from the fighter pilots?

I failed to get a job after 800 applications (one of the reasons why I don't like that strategy in the early career).

Maybe if I had a lesson or two from people who actually have difficulties I don't (defaulted on medical debt, immigration status, not a white male, etc)?

Like they must be far superior compared to me if they can get a job with their (unfair) disadvantages (which are very well documented) and I can't. Time to be their student?

[smoky quest]

what's your latest resume?

[open ivy]

I need to update it. I got a job thought a lucky chance with a friend and need to put the new stuff on.

I should have an updated resume in a month. This job will most likely will last until march or so when the company goes out of business.

In a networking strategy, the resume is still useful but it comes into play later. I never heard about anyone who was broke and unemployed but had many connections in tech. If I end up money poor and friend rich that would be a very strange situation. I may write an article about it one day, given how unusual it is in a quant-STEM field.

[smoky quest]

Congrats!

Note there is no shortage of well connected people no one wants to work with

[open ivy]

By "well connected" do you mean "friend rich and job poor" in that they have plenty of friends but cannot get a job?

[smoky quest]

yeah

[open ivy]

One would think that if they are likable and can keep friends, then they would also make a good coworker? But that is not the case I guess.

[smoky quest]

It's awesome to have drinks with friendly and likeable people.
But it's even better to make billion dollar businesses with skilled people

plus people can be both nice AND skilled 😉. But just being nice isn't enough

[open ivy]

I have skills from a long-standing passion in tech, thankfully, but struggle to be "likable" in a bar setting. But I have "the buck stops here" so when people get angry at me, I don't push this anger out to other people. So that should act in my favor.

[smoky quest]

social skills are definitely something worth working on!

[fading walrus]

Hello I turned 15 a month ago, school just started, I have a job which I work on the weekends. I’ve started learning python recently because it seems easy. I can only learn it a few hours at a time on the weekdays at school, and I’ve been doing for about 3 days now. I understand variables, input, str, print, int, float, title, strip functions. I l have joined this discord in hopes that someone is willing to teach me some more skills about coding, primarily web development as I want to quit my job that I’ve been at for a year making pizza. Anyone with information would be great benefit

If anyone is willing to spend some time with me after school I’d love to chat and learn how to build a website.

[tranquil storm]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[tranquil storm]

Flask is great for making websites. It is relatively easy to use

[fading walrus]

Would you mind showing me how to use it tomorrow?

[vapid jay]

ig starting with HTML, CSS and JS is a good choice

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> ads

[pine sleet]

Hello, your message has been deleted for violating our server rules (no advertisements)

[plucky shuttle]

Hello what do you all think is the best programming language for accounting?

[smoky quest]

python

[plucky shuttle]

Why?

[vapid jay]

python is great for data analysis

python is easy, it can integrate with excel and databases, large community

you can also checkout 'R' programming language @plucky shuttle

it's main purpose is data analysis, visualization (graphs/ charts), financial modeling and more

[fringe sphinx]

Typo: parcicipated

Your internship says "backend", but your tasks all say: "devops"

[smoky cairn]

That was my official job title, but all my tasks were devops related, should I just change the job title to be more representative?

[vapid jay]

?

[fringe sphinx]

sorry, wrong ping, that was for eli

[hollow axle]

Is there usually software positions for someone still in highschool. I’m looking at getting a job now and I’m wondering if I could go Into a role like a python developer but I’m not sure if their are usually people hiring that will accept people who also have to commit to school hours

[fringe sphinx]

Not in my experience, no. I know of HSers who've done web dev or other small projects, or landed (rare) internships.

[prisma spoke]

what do for college ?
😳
👉👈

[surreal folio]

Hello everyone I’m new here and I’ve decided to code with python
How do I get started

[fringe sphinx]

Ask in #python-discussion plz

[vapid jay]

python.org

[quaint whale]

hi i just started today and i downloaded visual code studio. does anyone reccomend a good first tutorial?

[warped marsh]

I am beginner too, I think Programming with Mosh's Python tutorial provide more details to start with, I don't actually know if it is best, but I started from him

[quaint whale]

thank you!

[vapid jay]

Quick brag: Officially a incoming MSCS student 🙏 can't wait to make the most of these next few years to set myself up for a nice life.

[warped marsh]

🔥

[quaint whale]

is it possible to have a job without a computer related title?

[near ocean]

like, in general?

[quaint whale]

nooo like data science related

i want to know how is the job market

[pine sleet]

what do you mean by title

like previous work?

[quaint whale]

like a degree

[pine sleet]

ah

it is possible but very difficult

[quaint whale]

its because im learning medicine but i would like to code also

and i dont know if i should drop off

[deft herald]

If you want to get a career in something unrelated to your current major, then you should change majors

[quaint whale]

theres no such thing in spain

[deft herald]

no such thing as changing majors?

[quaint whale]

like if i change majors is like starting from zero

[smoky quest]

That's normal and expected. If you are in year 3 and switch major to something completely different, you will have been missing 3 years worth of studies

[pine sleet]

i'm sure some classes will transfer over?

[smoky quest]

Like the biology classes?

[quaint whale]

i did physics major also

and if i wanted to do something related with informatics thay said that i would have to start from 0

[pine sleet]

I'm not sure how it works in Spain but at least in the US a lot of your first year classes will transfer over (for instance, I took chemistry and physics my first year which would transfer over if I wanted to change major to biology, and the stuff like history, english, etc)

[true harness]

math will be a prereq for both, surely

[quaint whale]

yes but its not like that in barcelona

[smoky quest]

EU countries don't always work in terms of credits

[quaint whale]

we do have credits but they have to teach exactly the same to convalidate

which never happens because calculus in physics is diff from calculus in other courses

i think in USA you take the classes with other majors

[pine sleet]

we do

[fringe sphinx]

Data 'Science' is very academic and is very credential driven: more so than data engineering or software engineering.

[topaz abyss]

yeah i do web dev but its mostly freelance, and if you do land one its probably not really a job, its just a pay per project your the dev kinda thing

python is more of a professional thing ig these days

[timber yoke]

print("Percentage Calculator")
print("")

while True:
cost = float(input("Enter Cost: "))
discount = float(input("Enter Discount Percentage: "))

percentage_decimals = discount/100

amount_off = percentage_decimals * cost
print(" ")
print(f"Discount amount is", amount_off)
total_cost = cost-amount_off
print(f"your total cost would be", total_cost)
print(" ")

check out this percentage calculator

[vapid jay]

nice

[visual flax]

Is it normal to hate being around other engineerings? I feel really insecure being around professional engineers as a second year student. I really how how I'm still trying for a engineering degree at 24

being around other professional engineers honestly makes me feel worse

[true harness]

no

[smoky quest]

How does someone else impacts your skills?

[deft pelican]

That's an environment issue. People should make you feel comfortable and safe.

[carmine isle]

If I was you, I'll leave that feeling aside , and I would start learn from them and ask them

[primal dove]

Is there jobs enough to take master's degree in ai and programming?

[fringe sphinx]

Insecurity and imposter syndrome are very common problems. Just look at all the hits here: https://www.google.com/search?q=imposter+syndrome+site%3Areddit.com%2Fr%2Flearnprogramming

[fringe sphinx]

These feelings will hinder your growth as an engineer: you have to learn humility and set aside ego. Learn from everyone around you: as Bill Nye said: "Everyone you meet knows something you don't."

[umbral frigate]

The legendary science guy with a legendary quote?

[wanton birch]

Do they treat you a certain way which makes it feel bad or you feel that way despite them not saying/doing anything to you?

[visual flax]

They seem to downplay my ideas and have decided im not worthy to give revelant ideas.

They've also decided they can tell someone they don't know what they're talking about without knowing them at all.

I know I'm only a second-1 year student but the way they said it really made me feel inadequate but it's ok i know I did my best to get through school despite my struggles

[wanton birch]

Maybe they don’t know how to handle someone like you. There are many talented and skilled people who are not good teachers or mentors.

[visual flax]

They use slight oversight in my wording to make it sound like I'm wrong I'm not actually

[wanton birch]

Guessing this is some type of an internship/co-op. Just get as much out of it as possible and focus on finishing your degree. Maybe one day when an interviewer asks you one of those “tell me about a difficult situation you have encountered while working with others” questions, you will have this experience to talk about!

[visual flax]

Alright ty I appreciate it Fahim!

[fringe sphinx]

or: that's how they are with each other too. Engineers tend to be pedantic and argumentative. Have you hung out in #python-discussion ? 🙂

[buoyant seal]

i noticed i encounter from time to time people/novices(which can be masquerading as long term workers too)
which get hurt from any constructive criticism.
For this reason i tend to try being as neutral as possible when speaking with them (if i have to, and if i have to review their PRs)
They get hurt anyway though, and can argue against obvious mistakes as being not mistakes
I try to distance myself from such people if i recognize them. Keeping distance from people that can't take any critism is probably easiest solution (on another side of this fence)

If u are such person, that can easily get hurt from any critism. u need to... tough up and being very... flegmatic about all of it.
Just fix a thing or offer valid arguments (not silly arguments appeared because of your laziness and stubborness, but real valid arguments why your point of view could be better). Usually easier just to aggree and fix a thing than arguing, as rarely cases when need to argue appear (less than 5% cases for me tbh)
Most cases when critism is offered, people just wish it being fixed and done with it. Your work could be just not upholding to some standard of quality, and fixing this thing will make it good enough to pass and continue

People can't know everything in IT, it is too large. Just accept that mistakes can be and will be, fix and go on further
in most cases people will not even care in the slightest that u made this yet another mistake, as long as u learn from it and hopefully will not repeat in a future
in most cases, mistakes pretty much can be expected on your part and unavoidable, as person holding domain deep knowledge regarding this specific area is only another person and not documented this knowledge in any accessable/known way

[fringe sphinx]

+1. Code reviews with new juniors can be difficult to navigate, especially when you're a few steps up in seniority

[vapid jay]

Syntex error

[iron lichen]

guys whats mean this code

def calculateSalary(bonus, deduction):
retur 5000 + bonus - deduction

this what mean

[near ocean]

#python-discussion

[warped marsh]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[visual flax]

Does not compute

[deft herald]

Technically it's about salary, so it fits in #career-advice right?

[peak halo]

No

[main knoll]

Hello everyone!

[main knoll]

I'd recommend learn python the hard way, great book.

[weak kindle]

Yellow

[warped marsh]

Also a choice yeah, depends on if people want to watch book or watch tutorial

[worldly warren]

im going for cyber sec I want to purple team what certs do you guys think would be good? I already have networking+ security+ linux+ what else would be good mainly for red teaming and blue teaming

[pine sleet]

Hi, your message has been deleted as it violates our server rules (rule 6/9)

[slender copper]

Hi im 17 years old studying cyber-security T-Level in the UK. My goal is to go into penetration testing. Last year i was doing A-Level mathematics but i didn’t try enough and failed. Will i still be able to get into uni/will it be worth without that qualification or would it benefit me to sit Core Maths - AS Level equivalent maths. Can i get away with simply not going uni?

[pine sleet]

IDK about all the UK specific stuff but you should definetely go to university

[white relic]

There's "what can I get away with" and then there's "what is the best option for my career"

[icy hare]

Sisters and Brothers of Python, what would convenience you i'm proficient at python given I have years of experience in other languages? Would a video of my coding a full stack application in Django be enough? How about a Github Repo with a ML system that extracts recipes from anime movies?

What would it take to put you at your ease?

[deft herald]

Are you like, applying for jobs with python proficiency as a requirement?

[vital wyvern]

How about a Github Repo with a ML system that extracts recipes from anime movies?
Wait no this would genuinely be impressive I think.

[deft herald]

Yeah that does sound cool. I don't watch a lot of anime...are there lots of recipes given in those movies? haha

[icy hare]

Don't you want a recipe for um... this?!

[icy hare]

Thanks, let's pair on this. You start by watching all the anime you can find, and I'll start by researching the history of cooking to get a sense of what makes a good recipe someone would actually want to use. Will meet back here tomorrow and share our findings.

Actually, i'm guessing would buy the recipe based completely on novelty alone and it wouldn't even need to be good. Whew, we just cut our effort in half

[icy hare]

among other things, yes.

[shy sigil]

Let's say I want to apply for a software company. What are some things that they'd value and choose me for? Apart from a decent grasp on Software Architecture and evidence of experience in using collaboration tools like git, is it more about being experienced in building software relevant to the role you're applying for? For example, if you're applying for a web role, be it front-end, are they more likely to be interested in web based projects or just any project that shows you have a core grasp on building technologies related to programming, and collaborative tool experience. Also using good software architecture in that technology. For example would they prefer a front-end app or building a text editor from scratch with collaborators and with good software architecture?

Because I have made a text editor with most things in-house, and I do consider it a project I'd show on my CV (probably my only good one so far), but should I rather start making web apps?

[faint depot]

Best go uni. You would need a full A level, not a partial one. You could try the apprenticeship route for example with BT. But its better you do your A levels and get at least a B in all your A levels

[fresh kraken]

Hey, if any beginner need help learning I can teach. Free! Not a ad! Just someone looking to help someone else and test their knowledge.

[pine sleet]

you can help in #1035199133436354600

[fresh kraken]

I kinda want to help someone who is a beginner and learn how to give lessons. But thanks!

[solar wedge]

do you mean by text or call? I am keen to learn if u can text and point me in right direction with any code i make if possible

[karmic token]

I'm trying to decide if a Computer Science degree is right for me.
I've been programming for 10 years and have ample full-time work experience writing software in the fields:

• gaming (both client and server, but not graphics or anything engine-level)
• web + native apps (full stack, from horizontal scaling of servers to horizontal scaling of buttons)
• pharmacy (i.e. processing prescriptions, checking chemical compatibility of drugs, working around complex legal regulations, billing insurance cards, etc.)
  I am very confident that I will be able to secure another software engineering job if I wanted to, even without the CS degree. I definitely love programming, but I'm not quite sure that any of these industries are quite right for me. I would like to come out of college with the ability to try working in many other industries.

So are there advantages of getting a CS degree? What other degree could I consider to expand my career options? I think that I might be interested in things like robotics, simulation, graphics, or perhaps something that I haven't heard of yet.

[smoky quest]

So you are saying you have 10 years of employment history as a full time software engineer and are wondering if you should go back to school?

[vapid jay]

There aren't any courses in my university where people teach about development.
Can someone please tell what all courses and skills I need to acquire to become a complete developer?

I'm pursuing bachelor's in computer science but there's only theoretical subjects which are taught here.

I do competitive programming as well and I'm able to get the hang of computer science fundamentals like computer architecture, operating system, compiler design, computer network, database management system etc...

But I don't have any knowledge about how's development done and what all skills, technologies is required?

Is there any video on youtube or somewhere else from where I can learn.

Please help. I'm literally very confused right now.

[karmic token]

I worked a lot in high school. I've already quit and gone to school for a CS degree but am thinking that I want to switch to another major

around 6 years ish of professional experience & the 10 years just comes from the time I spent learning the stuff (4 unpaid years)

[smoky quest]

what do you mean by working a lot in high school? high school or student jobs aren't typically counted as experience

So is it correct to state you have 6 years of paid professional experience since you left school?

[karmic token]

Sure

[smoky quest]

alright, then the degree could matter in cases like:

• In your country, it's a great accelerator or a requirement for promotion/management
• You want to target more theoretical fields for which you would benefit from the theory

If you are doing the same job in a different industry, then it may not matter as much so many years later

[karmic token]

I was hoping for some insight on what types of programming careers exist which require a non-cs degree as a barrier for entry

[smoky quest]

Roles are more like a distance function. Given you are referring to programming career, there is no reason to prevent people with a programming career but without a given non-cs degree

[slender copper]

the issue is i failed my last year so now i’m on a t-level. willl that be enough

[vital wyvern]

Nobody can predict the future, getting a regular degree is your best chance at getting the job you want. Also please stop cross-posting in multiple channels and ignoring the discussion or response in one or the other.

You stated you “didn’t try hard enough.” To make my stance abundantly clear, we do not need half committed cybersecurity professionals. If you don’t want to “try” to better yourself for this field, this job isn’t for you.

[faint depot]

Are they equivalent to a BTEC? BTECs are accepted by degree apprenticeships as long as you get at least like DMM but best aim for DDD

[faint depot]

What T-level are you doing? Btw im from the uk as well but im unfamiliar with T-levels

[slender copper]

t-level cyber security

it is equivalent to 3 A-Levels and comes with a 45 day work placement within relevant industry

[slender copper]

well first of all, no need to put someone down for something like that, and i just haven’t stated that i was disappointed for not trying

on top of that i cross posted to reach a larger audience because of my niche style of question

[faint depot]

That sounds pretty good. The work placement could actually help you find and get you into a decent degree apprenticeship scheme. Does it still have a pass-distinction grading system? If so, aim for distinction and get into university. Like the rest of the people say on the discord, youre better off going to a university

[slender copper]

alright sound

but as i asked will i be okay without maths, or do i HAVE to at least take that core for more credibility

[faint depot]

Oh shit. No you dont need to. You couldve literally done a BTEC IT course, get distinction all across and use that to get into uni and degree apprenticeships

A lot of the polytechnics and most degree apprenticeships will accept a BTEC qualification

[vital wyvern]

One of the most widely recognized certifications for red-teaming in Cybersecurity has a common phrase "try harder." I'm not saying you're not capable of trying harder, I'm saying rescinding yourself to a less supported/conventional degree path because you didn't do well on one test isn't conducive to success.

[buoyant seal]

I'm pursuing bachelor's in computer science but there's only theoretical subjects which are taught here.

I do competitive programming as well and I'm able to get the hang of computer science fundamentals like computer architecture, operating system, compiler design, computer network, database management system etc...

But I don't have any knowledge about how's development done and what all skills, technologies is required?
then i am the friend you need 😋
https://youtu.be/Nf-ysT2vErQ?t=29

There are Core Software Engineering skills, reusable for pretty much all software engineering job roles (Writing code well documented, unit tested and etc)
And there is technology fluff on top u are supposed to know (Like for backend job roles, u are can be expected to know specific languages, writing backend api, working with databases, working with linux and etc. Specifics are very depending on exact job role, but they all use some generic popular programming language u could become familiar with closely in advance)

For reusable stuff all software devs need to know in terms of skills and what to learn further, go through Code Complete (it teaches everything and makes overview or short intro for the rest)

• https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#CodeCompleteAPracticalHandbookofSoftwareConstruction
  For the essential skill to have commercial grade code quality, make sure to learn unit testing trhoughly
• https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#TestDrivenDevelopmentByExample
• https://darklab8.github.io/blog/favourite.html#UnitTestingPrinciplesPracticesandPatterns

For fluff of technologies related to specific job position, just query Linkedin or Indeed.com to see which stuff is required to know for specific job roles
Or check hiring web sites preferably local to your area for more relevant information specific to you which language in demands and tech
https://roadmap.sh/ Also those roadmaps could be useful for the same discovery of fluff

[buoyant seal]

My recommendation is to try working with some specific User Interfaces
Like building web site, like building desktop or mobile application. Once u tasted it u should see what u prefer more
Try to discover your favourite language and corelate it with information from hiring web sites, which job roles are available for it, and how many, can u build career upon it? if yes
Get better with this preferably very popular hirable language (Like Java usable for backend/desktop/mobile at the same time)
And 1-2 books would not hurt.

P.S. extra tip. try to not fall into trap of how to use some languages like Javascript at the start. They are quite painful at code scale.
Make sure u indeed willing to work with language like that in your career.
Some languages are harder to use at a start, but very easy to use later at code size growth.

Choose projects to build and build them 😉 Build them preferably useful for someone, for yourself, or for gaming community, discord bot or smth
https://darklab8.github.io/blog/choosing_pet_projects.html
Careful choice like that will make project more long term living

Learn core software engineering skills mentioned, make it priority.
Make sure your long term projects chosen to clean up and make in quality to be presentable
They will be able to live through dozen of years through your career with you if u will make it right (and will be able to recognize a problem users actually have and your solution is able to help with it)

First projects do not have to be that much useful though, if u just try yourself in a new language or new technology. It is nice to choose later for deep dive
U will get closely familiar with specific language/ecosystem only if u will remain with it through year/years
All this stuff is... long term commitments, so choose wisely what u enjoy better (with correlation for what is hirable in your local job market)

[vapid jay]

Can python really make a good-looking UI?

[peak halo]

Yes. You can ask about that in #user-interfaces

[vapid jay]

The UI made by tkinter is not pretty, I’m serious

[peak halo]

This is the career discussion channel. Please go to #user-interfaces

[spiral tusk]

for any indians over here, when sitting for the coding rounds in placements do companies prefer c++ and java over python?
because python is my main language and all my projects(mainly ML and data analysis) are in python and im hoping to get into a backend role but i dont think my uni gives us any choice over the role we get to apply for and i don't want to limit my options.
so do you think i should just stick to python even during coding rounds or learn java too?

[lost cypress]

if my college GPA is 2.96, is rounding it to 3 for job searching / resume purposes considered lying or unethical? in terms of the professional field

[peak halo]

Don't round up.

[opaque frost]

the more coding languages you know, the better

[peak halo]

I don't agree with this. Any developer can gain enough superficial knowledge in a programming language to do leetcode-style questions.

[opaque frost]

yeah but what will an employer think? will they choose someone who knows python only, or python AND java

it increases his chances of getting hired - idk tho

[peak halo]

Anyone can list all the languages they've used on a resume, and that doesn't ultimately tell anyone how skillful that person really is with that language. What matters is what sorts of things the applicant has demonstrated that they're able to do.

[opaque frost]

yeah true, youre right

[spiral tusk]

So it's fine if all my projects on my resume are in python(for the backend) but I still say I know java in the skills section? Or do i need to make a project in Java too?

I'm making a web dev project with python for the backend stuff too so technically I'll have html,css and js too

[peak halo]

if the position you're applying for would involve you doing a certain kind of thing in Java, they'd want to see that you've done something along those lines in Java. And if the position would mostly involve you doing the kinds of things you've already been doing in Python, then they won't care if you claim to know Java or not.

[spiral tusk]

Got it.

I heard a lot of people saying that companies look down on applicants who use python in coding rounds tho

Apparently because it's too easy or something or because it isn't the fastest language

[peak halo]

If Python makes a certain task "too easy" as compared to doing the same task in (for example) Java, then that task isn't actually challenging.

[vapid jay]

hey guys i am trying to decide whether to do machine learning with python or web development any suggestions?

[peak halo]

I don't know how common this interview practice is where you're applying, but it sounds like a bad interview practice. if they're going to ask you to complete a programming task, it should be in a language that you'd use for that job, and thus they shouldn't penalize you for picking some other language that they secretly dislike.

[peak halo]

I work in ML professionally. if you want to work in that space, you need to be willing to get at least an AI-oriented bachelors degree, and probably also a masters.

AI/ML positions are about applied theory. not software engineering.

[vapid jay]

well unfortuanetly for me i not doing cs as a major i discovered by passion pretty late

[peak halo]

then you shouldn't pursue AI/ML for career purposes.

[vapid jay]

i wasnt pursueing it for career purposes

plus i have heard of a lot of self taught devs getting jobs so not all hope is lost

[peak halo]

this is the career discussion channel, so that's the default assumption.
I always encourage people to learn about things that interest them just for the sake of learning. there are some pinned resources in #data-science-and-ml

[vapid jay]

ohh sorry for wasting your time i didnt see that

[peak halo]

the self-taught devs who get jobs are a small subset of all the degreeless people who seek developer jobs. especially these days.

[peak halo]

you are not wasting my time.

[vapid jay]

i was mostly trying to become a solo developer

[peak halo]

like, a freelancer?

[vapid jay]

you could say that

[peak halo]

what country do you live in?

[vapid jay]

botswana but i will be moving to the us

there arent rlly a lot of programmers here but the demand is high our usual salary is like 200k upwards

[peak halo]

that's cool. if you stay in Botswana, you might actually have more success than if you move to the US, since Botswana (I presume) has a lower cost-of-living.

[dark arrow]

sample size of 1 but for me they didn't care what language i used

[vapid jay]

no actually our cost of living is high

[dark arrow]

they did ask questions about every language/tool i listed in my resume though

[peak halo]

oh, darn.

[vapid jay]

not even 200pula(our local currency) can get you grocieries for a week

[vapid jay]

like getting a shirt and pants can cost you well over 200

[peak halo]

that's unfortunate. I thought Botswana was one of the most economically successful countries in SS Africa.

[vapid jay]

it is but at the same time we have a lot of problems

its not all sunshine and rainbows

[fringe sphinx]

What is your major?

[spiral tusk]

What tools have you listed?

[dark arrow]

git, docker

[spiral tusk]

And if I may ask what role are you in rn in your job?

[dark arrow]

i intern in summer 2025

role is systems engineer

[spiral tusk]

Nice, i need to start applying for internships too I'm in my third year rn and only now I've started learning DSA and stuff. Do you think it's better to apply to startups or to bigger firms as a beginner?

[dark arrow]

i dont have any insight about that

[worthy oasis]

Ok, I just want to know that what's the average amount of time spending of learning python and getting a online job.

[deft herald]

Typically it'd be 4 years to get a degree

[worthy oasis]

Do I really need a degree to get a job ?

[near ocean]

yes kinda

[deft herald]

It's the "path of least resistance" to starting a career in software

you can always do freelance though but IMO that's pretty difficult to make real money off of. Especially for those with less experience

[worthy oasis]

I see, thank you for the explanations.

[vapid jay]

im planning on being an architect.

and i will be hopefully if i can win another scholarship to get me there.

[fast fossil]

a software architect, right?

[vapid jay]

just a regular architect.

designing buildings and well whatever comes as an oppurtuty.

[delicate swift]

Heard that architecture degrees are insanely demanding.

[vapid jay]

yeah they are.

[delicate swift]

Good luck, and success to it. It's one hell of a job, indeed

[untold crystal]

hi
I have 43% in inter
and a 2.89/4 GPA in ADP
am I qualified to apply for a bachelor's or master's?
if not, will they consider my work experience instead
what should i do ? pls help

[vapid jay]

im pretty sure its because it ivolves peoples lives if you fuck up bad.

[untold crystal]

do companies give internship and job even with a completed two year degree?

[vapid jay]

thank you, i plan to do my best.

[fringe sphinx]

SWE is a competitive field. There are many ways into the field, but a bachelor's degree is the path of least resistance. Can you get a job? Maybe, but with a lot more difficulty and fewer options. If you can build up some work experience in an adjacent field, and network (meet people and find someone who'll give you some work experience), that'll significantly help your outcomes.

[delicate swift]

Networking, specifically, is insanely useful. As I learnt, a lot of things are through people indicating and knowing you. And boy, isn't it hard to get to know the right people from the start.
Which also begs the question; Billy, wanna become a piece to my network? 🙂 /hj

[untold crystal]

e.g 2 year degree and 2 year work experience , sound good ?

lets network

[near ocean]

why stop at 2 years, finish your bachelors

[untold crystal]

bcx i cant apply to any bachelor degree cx of low marks at my high school, they wont consider my degree gpa first

[near ocean]

An associates is better than nothing but you should consider transferring to a bachelors when you can

[pastel thunder]

Microsoft (research fellowship) vs cadence SDE?
which would be better if:
Microsoft is paying less, but aim is MSCS?

[violet merlin]

guys is the Ai coding thhinf no cap unlike the cap devin ai

[pine sleet]

what

[deft herald]

Let's see if i can translate...

Is AI-produced code in any way different than the Devin AI which turned out to be a scam?

[balmy mural]

Have you considered South Africa? Lots of developer jobs down here, and pays very well compared to cost of living. Would also likely be an easier move than US

[fast fossil]

what, and you'd never be able to get a Bachelor's ever in your life again? Obviously not, so yeah, there certainly are options even if your GPA was at some point not as good as one might hope

[obtuse ridge]

wsup pals, out of context question a lil, how long did it take you to work at a job non related to programming before you actually qualified yourself enough to be hired as swe and what kind of job did you work before that?

[wanton birch]

You might want to consider applying for some other smaller diploma where you could prove yourself first and then apply with that qualification for bachelors.

[fringe sphinx]

What country is this?

[peak halo]

it usually takes four years; for me it took longer. I worked at Starbucks the whole time.

[cobalt moat]

what are these for? what do hiring managers see?

im offended by these questions

[smoky quest]

standard questions in the USA

[cobalt moat]

why though

[smoky quest]

it's explained in the screenshot

[cobalt moat]

the description contradicts itself in the first sentence. i do not trust it

[smoky quest]

how so?

[cobalt moat]

"are considered without regard to race"
then why is it asking for race

[smoky quest]

I mean, it's explained in the second paragraph

[cobalt moat]

i dont trust the second paragraph due to the first sentence of the first paragraph

[smoky quest]

Never apply to places you do not trust

[cobalt moat]

all of them have this

[smoky quest]

yeah, it's standard questions in the USA

[cobalt moat]

why though

[smoky quest]

It's explained in the second paragraph of the screenshot

[cobalt moat]

which i do not trust

[smoky quest]

then do not apply.

[cobalt moat]

i want to apply but i want to know what these questions are for

what do hiring managers see on their end?

[smoky quest]

why would you apply to a place when you don't even trust their intake form? If you can't trust that, you can't really trust them with any information about yourself

[smoky quest]

they may or may not access all of that information

[cobalt moat]

because its a standard question in the US

[smoky quest]

that's how a lot of scams work: with FOMO.
They make you think you would win so big that it's worth taking the risk.

Though here, it's standard questions

[cobalt moat]

what is done with the information i give it

[smoky quest]

it's laid out bare in the screenshot

[cobalt moat]

which i do not trust

[smoky quest]

Then anything can happen with that information

[cobalt moat]

thats not even an answer to my question

[smoky quest]

it is an answer to your question considering you do not trust them

[cobalt moat]

nuh uh