C#, JS and Python use the latter
#voice-chat-text-0
vocal basin
mostly to do this:
thing
.method()
.await
.method()
.await
.method()
.await
instead of
await (await (await thing.method()).method()).method()
it doesn't get in the way as much in the first option
Rust doesn't have syntax support for dictionaries at all, it's all implemented in libraries
partially because there is more than one dictionary type
the standard library has HashMap and BTreeMap
which behave differently and have different type requirements
you can do JSON in code
let object = json!({
"key": "value"
});
let value = matchjson!(
object,
{"key": (value: str)} => value,
_ => panic!("didn't match anything"),
);
assert_eq!(value, "value");
I should actually run that and test if it works at all
vocal basin
```rust
let object = json!({
"key": "value"
});
```
object defined here
can extract more than one field at a time
fn main() {
let object = json!({
"a": 1,
"b": 2
});
let sum = matchjson!(
object,
{"a": (x: i64), "b": (y: i64)} => x + y,
_ => panic!("didn't match anything"),
);
println!("{sum}");
}
or nested stuff
fn main() {
let object = json!({
"outer-key": {
"middle-key": {
"inner-key": "deeply-nested"
}
}
});
let value = matchjson!(
object,
{"outer-key": {"middle-key": {"inner-key": (value: str)}}} => value,
_ => panic!("didn't match anything"),
);
println!("{value}");
}
scarlet halo
๐
vocal basin
or nested stuff
```rust
fn main() {
let object = json!({
"outer-key"...
Rust allows doing this without any language-level support specific to these features
!e
obj = {"a": 1, "b": 2}
match obj:
case {"a": x, "b": y}:
print(x + y)
wise cargoBOT
!e
```py
obj = {"a": 1, "b": 2}
match obj:
case {"a": x, "b": y}:
pr...
:white_check_mark: Your 3.14 eval job has completed with return code 0.
3
this is Python equivalent
vocal basin
can extract more than one field at a time
```rust
fn main() {
let object = j...
whereas, if you wanted a BTreeMap or a HashMap, you'd generally write something like this:
let map = Map::from([
("a", 1),
("b", 2),
("c", 3),
]);
Python doesn't provide a B-Tree implementation in its standard library
except for the SQLite module
scarlet halo
what's a B-Tree?
vocal basin
balanced tree where all leaves are at the same depth
scarlet halo
oh
vocal basin
also has a property of having gigantic nodes
up to thousands of children per parent
iirc Rust uses branching factor of 8
crimson pond
will python be dead in 2026
vocal basin
no
scarlet halo
will python be dead in 2026
will you? (probably, and hopefully not)
crimson pond
you're so rude @scarlet halo
vocal basin
relatively small for B-Trees
performance depends a lot on the workload, but, yes, in Python it's fast
scarlet halo
you're so rude <@710856373675491381>
what did i do
crimson pond
will you? (probably, and hopefully not)
.
scarlet halo
yeah i hope you live?
vocal basin
(B-Trees aren't binary trees)
AVL is very popular in C
because easy to write
balanced not binary
specifically, height-balanced
AVL Tree is height-balanced too, but not as much as a B-Tree
AVL guarantees left and right subtrees differ by no more than one
(whereas in B-Tree it's by no more than zero across all subtrees of a node, however it might have some slots not be filled in)
willow light
Grandmother on my father's side, my mother is from the Axis Powers side of the family (German-Italian)
vocal basin
B-Trees are the default choice for on-disk databases
willow light
About 40 minutes northwest of Boston, yes
vocal basin
because of the large node size
AVL doesn't have that, since it's a binary tree, so it's almost exclusively used in-memory
scarlet halo
vocal basin
which option?
wait you have icons?
@scarlet halo do be careful with sharing use of alternative clients publicly, Discord does ban for that sometimes
unless they changed their mind
scarlet halo
never heard of anyone getting banned for that, i think it's an empty threat by Discord
vocal basin
never heard of anyone getting banned for that, i think it's an empty threat by D...
it did happen a lot, but not recently
and this is not a threat by Discord
it's a policy, that you agreed to, that they sometimes choose to enforce
vocal basin
they do
vocal basin
opinions on this menu?
triangle's border is slightly visually annoying
remove/thicken
@tepid edge only SSH-based stuff nowadays
vocal basin
triangle's border is slightly visually annoying
probably because of this
inner stuff touches the outer stuff
tacit crane
@vocal basin you remember the file transfer thing i did the websocket thing but to get the response too much stuff to manage so just switched to http
scarlet halo
inner stuff touches the outer stuff
ah, wait let me try something
vocal basin
<@264054779888533515> you remember the file transfer thing i did the websocket t...
if you semi-persist connections, it might work well too
scarlet halo
maybe like this? (or another pixel?)
vocal basin
@frosty garnet it's not an all or nothing thing
tacit crane
i need confirmation if the file was transfered.
i can do it by identifier but the codebase was already too complicated so just gave up
vocal basin
decreasing probability of the successful attack
tacit crane
i might do it in the future
vocal basin
maybe like this? (or another pixel?)
I'd use a third colour for the inner part of the border
@tacit crane if you control routing, you control where the requests go
tacit crane
if you have control to the dns right?
vocal basin
so need to at least do DNS-over-HTTPS
vocal basin
if you have control to the dns right?
you don't need to control DNS to make requests to the DNS server go to you
@frosty garnet signature and the file are also often downloaded off different mirrors
trusted platform module
scarlet halo
maybe a different design?
vocal basin
also TDX
scarlet halo
vocal basin
TPM is kind of like a ubikey inside your computer from what I understand
it has its own private and public key
you can somehow poke it and make it sign something
vocal basin
https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/developer/tools/trust-domain-extensions/...
this to me is slightly more interesting
running trusted code on untrusted host
frosty garnet
Prove Platform Integrity: The TPM can attest that the server booted securely (e.g., using Secure Boot) and is running trusted, unmodified software.```
wise loom
```Prove Key Origin: The TPM can attest to the CA that the private key was gener...
is there any book that describes TPMs and how they work or what sort of guarantees they're supposed to provide?
wise loom
why would you have a *book* for that
same reason you have books about BIOS and UEFI security
vocal basin
same reason you have books about BIOS and UEFI security
page 1:
they're not secure
end
scarlet halo
page 1:
they're not secure
end
you can set a password for you BIOS/UEFI but thats about it right?
frosty garnet
vocal basin
you can set a password for you BIOS/UEFI but thats about it right?
not that sort of security
wise loom
page 1:
they're not secure
end
we don't always learn something because it's perfect or because it does what it says.
sometimes we learn things because we have to.
stray pewter
Im going to be in the Royal Air Force in 6-8 months and since the Royal airforce has a strong presence in the middle east right now constantly being deployed there i probably will be deployed too @wind raptor so if I don't come back in a few months you know why haha
My training starts at raf Cranwell base in 7 ish months
vocal basin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEy0VKSFnO0
(that rack in the background runs no BIOS)
scarlet halo
(that rack in the background runs no BIOS)
how does that work?
vocal basin
how does that work?
it's called an operating system
thing that controls the computer
very new idea
scarlet halo
never heard of such a thing as an "operating system" what could that possibly mean ๐ค
wind raptor
Im going to be in the Royal Air Force in 6-8 months and since the Royal airforce...
I don't think they deploy 15 yo kids
vocal basin
or so the Germans would have us believe
scarlet halo
I don't think they deploy 15 yo kids
i think they do actually, but hey i have no idea.
stray pewter
I don't think they deploy 15 yo kids
By that time I will be 16 so a pilot officer
16 is the minimum
wind raptor
Ahh
stray pewter
17 is the usual or 18 but 16 is allowed
wind raptor
Still too young in my books. it's 18 here
vocal basin
stray pewter
Still too young in my books. it's 18 here
Can't wait to die for a country I have no relation to by blood or birth
craggy vale
heavy zenith
is that for reading SPI-chips
wind raptor
Can't wait to die for a country I have no relation to by blood or birth
If you are not actually patriotic, then why do it?
heavy zenith
cool I think I have one of those around
craggy vale
I'm working on my apu
scarlet halo
and im still here with the stock BIOS ๐ฅฒ probably getting spied on
stray pewter
If you are not actually patriotic, then why do it?
I loves planes
wind raptor
I loves planes
Then become a pilot
wise loom
do Apple iPads/iPhones/Macs have a BIOS?
vocal basin
UI disaster
scarlet halo
do Apple iPads/iPhones/Macs have a BIOS?
i believe so, there's something before/above the actual operating system which i can only assume is the BIOS
stray pewter
Then become a pilot
I love military planes
scarlet halo
I love military planes
then become a military pilot
vocal basin
fancy looking thing
scarlet halo
fancy looking thing
that's how they get you, see how it says "xiaomi"
vocal basin
fancy looking thing
I bought this one because it's USB A and C
vocal basin
that's how they get you, see how it says "xiaomi"
xiaomi used to be relatively high quality
phones got worse over time
some other stuff still okay
wise loom
For a USB stick, you can try SanDisk, but any vendor that provides max writes before failure and even an MBTF (mean-time-between failure) in their product sheet.
vocal basin
I bought this one because it's USB A and C
vocal basin
For a USB stick, you can try SanDisk, but any vendor that provides max writes be...
ADATA is probably the one I trust the least; I don't remember what my opinion on SanDisk is
I accidentally pressed ctrl+w
vocal basin
this can get fancier/worse:
three USB connectors on a single SD car reader
it's not `side-loading', it's software installation
vocal basin
this can get fancier/worse:
three USB connectors on a single SD car reader
this abomination
scarlet halo
it's not \`side-loading', it's software installation
it's kind of stupid to call it side-loading to be honest, you don't say side-loading when downloading stuff on Windows (or any other Desktop OS)
scarlet halo
this abomination
what did they do to the USB A ๐ญ
vocal basin
scarlet halo
NO.
vocal basin
I boot Windows off USB C
stuck with bad m.2 (SATA), still having to use it via some adapter
wise loom
PXE boot over network
scarlet halo
well, if your computer is powered through USB does that count <:pithink:65224755...
... don't even think about it
vocal basin
I do have several computers which can be powered through USB (without a batter) but I doubt any of them can be booted from it too
I just do this
what about cloud KDEs instead of cloud GNOMEs?
gnomysticism
scarlet halo
what about cloud i3s?
vocal basin
@tepid edge doing rebase locally also applies correct signature
scarlet halo
Child labor at it's finest
vocal basin
@wind raptor @tepid edge rebase then merge commit, the ultimate compromise
wind raptor
!cpban 910878143974375494
wise cargoBOT
:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @violet arch until <t:1761329746:f> (4 days).
scarlet halo
why is it cpban and not just ban
vocal basin
comp
scarlet halo
ah
wind raptor
compromised account ban
vocal basin
@tepid edge curl
@scarlet halo it's just for money
immediate reward
@tepid edge depends on whether memory improves
largely
beyond that
reasoning is difficult to observe
memory is easier
wind raptor
!cpban 1025814992387330079
wise cargoBOT
:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @soft niche until <t:1761330130:f> (4 days).
vocal basin
context window is the wrong approach
frosty garnet
vocal basin
"tbf, do you expect an average US citizen to get this right?"
easy to poison
just like humans
@primal shadow even more surprising given it contains clocks like item 4 in here
bitter tinsel
damn they upped the verification standards rip
9 10 minute blocks in crazy
yea but not on this account
@whole bear
nah it's cool that account is perm suspended
ill just verify again
I used to just mass join servers and one of them got my account permanently suspended idek what that was
yea no it wasn't
it's like discord TOS
no just the number and then DOS most people in here just know me by this name so i stuck by it
can the 9 10 minute block be concurent and does being in the vc count?
vocal basin
finally bought myself a tablet, now picking what drawing software to install
heavy zenith
free or paid
vocal basin
@peak depot and pokes the eardum
vocal basin
finally bought myself a tablet, now picking what drawing software to install
I just learned it has touch strength sensitivity
bitter tinsel
paid software still exists? 
]
scarlet halo
wind raptor
where's hemloc been
!cpban 913437445100560394
wise cargoBOT
:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @steep panther until <t:1761331619:f> (4 days).
vocal basin
@wind raptor if you've seen mm from me, I mentioned it several times
they do sometimes send 2
not 4
I mean messages
where is the setting for touch-to-wake-screen on android
I forgot
aaa
time to resume search
scarlet halo
where is the setting for touch-to-wake-screen on android
that isn't default?
vocal basin
on my xiaomi I need to double-tap it
on my pixel I need to tap it once
the new tablet doesn't react to that by default
wait no it does
I was doing something wrong
peak depot
vocal basin
of bit and bit
scarlet halo
binary digit
vocal basin
**bi**nary dig**it**
last i should be highlighted too
scarlet halo
then it would be biit
scarlet halo
last i should be highlighted too
what do you mean it is highlighted ๐
vocal basin
@wind raptor you can expand that further
@wind raptor same, I guess?
I recently clicked on the search bar
that was quite an event
wind raptor
that was quite an event
Haha yeah. They are really pushing their "other" content it seems
tepid edge
@vocal basin I got randomly teleported back in time in the channel, was Cairn the game where you got a photosensitivity warning that you stopped playing?
vocal basin
<@264054779888533515> I got randomly teleported back in time in the channel, was...
I don't think so
this was Don't Stop, Girlypop! Lite
Cairn is quite static
tepid edge
would've been surprising
I intend to buy cairn at some point after it comes out probably
vocal basin
same authors as Haven
vocal basin
this was [Don't Stop, Girlypop! Lite](<https://store.steampowered.com/app/382882...
another epilepsy rhythm game
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2370000/Lumines_Arise/
vocal basin
another ~~epilepsy~~ rhythm game
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2370000/Lumi...
(creators of Tetris Effect)
you can argue it's a fable, if you choose to
vocal basin
I intend to buy cairn at some point after it comes out probably
it seems to be made for a controller but it's good enough on keyboard+mouse for me
wind raptor
Gotta pick up the kiddos. Cheers!
vocal basin
for some reason I though 1984 was released earlier than it was
late 1940s not 1930s
`We' is quite old
1920s
it's, in fact, a documentary
no exaggeration
all true facts
@amber raptor in Russia sometimes those parties do win on proper issue, but not on the country level
(prior to 2022)
((actual opposition not KPRF/LDPR/other ER satellites))
@amber raptor "popes are always elected from cardinals"
another such example
tepid edge
Jesters could give bad news to the King that no one else would dare deliver. In 1340, when the French fleet was destroyed at the Battle of Sluys by the English, Phillippe VI's jester told him the English sailors "don't even have the guts to jump into the water like our brave French".
Wikipedia
vocal basin
โโ the dash
potent carbonBOT
tepid edge
&mdash
potent carbonBOT
vocal basin
like the symbol
tepid edge
i understood
tepid edge
I just thought the command might exist
vocal basin
!charinfo stuffโโโstuff
wise cargoBOT
tepid edge
Linux Dev System (VM, running Deepin 20.9 Linux). The guest VM had the hostโs C:\ mounted (hgfs). Dumped included.
vocal basin
what if the police officer has an identity disorder and counts as two
bad cop/psycho cop
@primal shadow and then there are loose words like algae
(taxon-ish but a non-clade)
@haughty pier that is horrifying
this is, like, data loss automation
it gets funny when you accidentally swap the order
@tepid edge /dev/sdโผ1
tepid edge
!charinfo /dev/sdโผ1
wise cargoBOT
tepid edge
viral solar
wow... ๐
ya
yeah
lets discuss geopolitics
i cant say what i think he deserves
i dont know anything about charlie chaplin
lets make a show about us talking geopolitics
loooool
XD!
wish i could talk in VC
somber heath
wish i could talk in VC
!voice for if you don't already know
wise cargoBOT
slow urchin
when you dive deep in systems design is really complex
ocean solar
woeful blaze
Has anyone used barcode generator?
urban summit
primal shadow
normal geyser
Hola
woeful blaze
Hello how is everyone
slow urchin
hey
how is it going
these two characters are confusing haha
actually i think that's the deal
it's because this tiny "tsu" is to make the next sylable stronger
yes
haha
difficult language
pronounce easy, difficult grammar
i wish i could talk lol
time to be more active
Do you guys think math is important for low level programming?
somber heath
@orchid plinth ๐
somber heath
@opal plinth ๐
bitter tinsel
<@1283073661137453118> ๐
how are you not admin yet
somber heath
how are you not admin yet
I'm ill suited to the position.
haughty pier
@wise loom here's what I play: https://rephial.org/
wise loom
@slow urchin https://repost.aws/knowledge-center/prepay-services
runic cape
@somber heath I can't talk LMAO
@somber heath wat dis
Active for at least nine different ten-minute blocks (equivalent to consistent conversation for 1 hour 30 minutes)
wary jacinth
gtg
somber heath
@gaunt lagoon ๐
quartz beacon
No
I can hear you
Stopppp
I'm just on headphones
Sorry It overwhelmed me
The rapid reading just got me
You can count
Just rhythmically
Or to a song
Yes
My brain is good with rhythmic stuff
I like patterns
I live on this exact type of habitat
Called Plantage (Plantation)
It has greenery and a zoo
quartz beacon
Called Plantage (Plantation)
It's near red light
I occasionally visit
I'm mostly friendly with prostitutes cause I'm asexual and they're working class
quartz beacon
I'm mostly friendly with prostitutes cause I'm asexual and they're working class
There's 1 individual one who violated my boundaries
Who's the singer?
I misheard
Oh lmao
Should've gotten plugs
Wait you've been in Amsterdam?
It's weird there aren't really many gay prostitutes
Oh okay
You should visit Amsterdam if your health allows it
Out of loyalty or health?
I'm glad I left Ukraine. I'm like severely mentally ill from the rapid change and PTSD is making me cry at least once a week
But bicycle makes me happy
We won't commiserate. We'll take bicycles and I'll feed you edibles :)
And discuss funny shit
Yeah
Weed helps with a lot of my mental issues actually
But i don't smoke it
I do take edibles once in a while
And start noting stuff done
I have 2 jokes I wrote recently
Can you rate them?
"I don't understand Chinese speakers
Like WHAT ARE YOU SAYING?"
"What do you call a Squirrel Mechanic?
||Nuts and bolts||"
The 2 jokes
Peak of my performance
That's the joke yes
Yes
That's the joke
Could work for any language one does not speak
Ok I see the crowd would not go crazy over these jokes
๐ณ
Squirel sex
Saw this
And it made me think "if I had to be executed I'd like to die here"
somber heath
@static wasp ๐
hexed trout
hi people 
just here to lurk before I head to bed
earnest sierra
i hi ๐ I am trying to get some coding done
stray pewter
@somber heath I presume you dislike my "coping mechanism" of avoiding the thought of killing and just destruction of targets.
its one of the most common amongst air force verterns
earnest sierra
gonna see if having company makes fastapi debugging less painful
hexed trout
i hi ๐ I am trying to get some coding done
niceee, any project in particular youโre working on?
earnest sierra
......what just happened
hexed trout
ahh
earnest sierra
i mean i'm not that fond of the military either
and to be fair if we start talking about killing people i may have to bounce
hexed trout
I think itโs hard when like, 70% of deaths in Ukraine/russia are entirely from drone combat
earnest sierra
eh. i was in the military (not us)
i was 18 and didn't exactly have a choice
i don't think all soldiers are evil
but this is not a subject i currently care to dwell on
hexed trout
dehumanizing tools of murder doesnโt make them less murderful I guess, would be my take, not to be negative or attack whatever you do for a living Dev
earnest sierra
I just said "oh dear" to the username ๐
okay sorry but this convo is. not great for me. gonna bounce, try again another time
hexed trout
haha see ya ursa
earnest sierra
i mean it seems like
hexed trout
good luck on the coding
earnest sierra
the conversation is happening
somber heath
<@317279909112446976> I presume you dislike my "coping mechanism" of avoiding th...
I asked you how you would feel if, after the fact, you discovered that your order to destroy a target resulted in the targeting of a funeral, wedding or hospital. Your response of "Well, I guess they were in the wrong place at the wrong time." shows a casual indifference to human life that I find repugnant.
stray pewter
I asked you how you would feel if, after the fact, you discovered that your orde...
if I were, I think that killing people in any way is bad. But If I were faced with such a forced task, that would likely be a coping mechanisim I would use
quartz beacon
if I were, I think that killing people in any way is bad. But If I were faced wi...
Ok war criminal
hexed trout
awkward night in the VCs lol
quartz beacon
awkward night in the VCs lol
10 am for me
hexed trout
lol ursa
earnest sierra
timezone twinsies!
yeah i was trying to get away from the convo
and then. i t came to the other channel
hexed trout
10 am for me
yea I was just referring to myself, I know Opal is also in (I think) the middle hours of his day?
somber heath
19:16
hexed trout
ah, arriving to be late then 
earnest sierra
(opal did frog get your pronouns correct? sorry just verifying)
somber heath
I'm a cisgendered AMAB.
earnest sierra
cool beans
hexed trout
also never thought to ask, good question
earnest sierra
i mean a cis amab person who wants to use they/them or whatever gets to. but i'nm just being pydantic lol
somber heath
I'm a he.
earnest sierra
okay thank you for clarifying โค๏ธ
hexed trout
i mean a cis amab person who wants to use they/them or whatever gets to. but i'n...
isnโt cis usually like, the default pronouns for your gender/sexuality?
somber heath
Yes.
hexed trout
genuine question I have no idea how this shit works haha
earnest sierra
i mean pronouns and gender don't have to correlate
like usually they do!
but not always
hexed trout
i mean pronouns and gender don't have to correlate
ah, guess I never thought about it that way, that kinda makes sense
earnest sierra
also i am concerned this topic is distrssing to others?
ANYWAY
programming time
i am doing this like the fastapi docs show and it's not working :((
earnest sierra
trust me i know :/
calm ginkgo
hi <@778585347562930208> good to see you in here again
hi!
hexed trout
i am doing this like the fastapi docs show and it's not working :((
never used fastAPI before but Iโm curious; whatโs your goal and/or problem?
earnest sierra
i don't particularly care just tell me which words to use
lol
we;ve got mages!
no pronoiuns no kings!
gondor has no pronouns gondor needs no pronouns!
earnest sierra
never used fastAPI before but Iโm curious; whatโs your goal and/or problem?
well i'm just trying to create a DB model and use an API to retrieve it
hexed trout
ah I see
earnest sierra
and idk i can't figure out why the way i'm writing it wrong
lemme see
maybe i should do a basics thing
like, do a v basic app just to check the way i'm calling it is correct
like. when i declare a model
if i do
class Item(SQLModel, table=true)
.......anarcho fascist
wow what
communist libertarians!
eh not that well versed in political theory
yes
let's talk about fastAPI
:3
ok fair
calm ginkgo
Litestar > FastAPI
earnest sierra
dyknow jonathan coulton
hexed trout
sometimes people get into programming here; it is why I lurk mainly
earnest sierra
idk litestar i might check it out
earnest sierra
i'm singing along
earnest sierra
mainly responding to Ursa with that
aww appreciate
rob zombi is dragula
hee
what kinda genre?
i am. technically kind of a musician? ๐
i performed recently so i'm calling myself that
hmmm i am tbh mostly a folk person
in a filk convention (filk: a genre of sci-fi/fantasy folk)
quartz beacon
earnest sierra
also i like "the future soon"
hexed trout
in a filk convention (filk: a genre of sci-fi/fantasy folk)
thatโs a crazy name for a genre spinoff that specific hahaha
earnest sierra
lol, it's pretty niche. i love it tho
just the existence of recorded music
is amazing
i was in a bunch of performances i nthe same weekend i performed and i got to record some and i am so grateful for it
hexed trout
wtf lmao
earnest sierra
......i shouldn't share recordings from my show
want to tho ๐
like i'm allowed
oh? do share
quartz beacon
earnest sierra
just. i feel like it wouldn't fit the vibe
hexed trout
that Star Wars music is pretty catchy though so I can understand enjoying jizz(THE GENRE) enough to want to name it
earnest sierra
that's a bnuy
lol
amazing
tbh i am also bad at image recognition
had to ask for help the last time i had to recognize things for captcha
i have a cat OC named cousin throckmorton
quartz beacon
earnest sierra
bnuy!
hexed trout
looks more like a frog than a cat, thatโs funny
quartz beacon
hexed trout
cute bunnies!!
earnest sierra
i don't have a pet, my kid is pestering me for a bunny tho
can you get them not to shit on the floor
i am it is true
somber heath
@hollow herald ๐
earnest sierra
my kid is 11
no i realize
this is why so far i said no
but the training not to shit on the floor was a major point
i told them i might consider a hamster/rat but they were like, i don't want an animal that dies in 3 years
hexed trout
maybe a hamster potentially too? Since theyโre pretty easy from what I understand but are still fun to hold
hexed trout
i told them i might consider a hamster/rat but they were like, i don't want an a...
fuck they countered it already lmao
earnest sierra
i mean any pet is
and fair dues i'd rather not have a pet personally
hamshalla
literal lol
hexed trout
also Ursa in your defense your child is not at an age where they will know what they want in 3 years
3 years from now they might not a rabbit or a hamster
earnest sierra
i don't know if my apartment allows cats, but hamsters are probably allowed
eh
also my kid spends weeks on end in another country visiting my mom so i'd have to take care of the pet then anyway
so eh
rather not
nah i'm very thoroughly leaning nope
euros yeah
hexed trout
also my kid spends weeks on end in another country visiting my mom so i'd have t...
oh wow yeah thatโs basically your own pet at that point
earnest sierra
germany ๐ immigrated here two years ago
i do have a hungarian citizenship but that's not where i'm from
cos my grandparents got thrown out by nazis
of hungary
(heh. ppl generally do not expect where i'm from)
hungary = magyar
somber heath
Spain?
somber heath
earnest sierra
yeah well
there's a reason i'm not there anymore
no i'm just from israel
can we not
please
anyway
just one kid
but they use they/them pronouns
i guess they just wanna be like mom ๐
yeah
well hmm
right now one is he/him and two are she/her
but the one i live with is he/him
yeah
what's the question again?
we don't
the she/hers aren't parents
they're like. i go see them, i don't live with them
vocal basin
@quartz beacon that other framework isn't AI-centric
hexed trout
oh hey yuya didnโt even see you come in
earnest sierra
and it's a conversation that needs to happen
solomon
solomon
i just said
cmon
ough
ah ok fair
custody!
i mean
polycule doesn't mean everyone coparents
i'm a nonbinary mom it's a thing
you can be whatever
nice
like, you CAN coparent with multiple parents. but it's very risky for the person who isn't on the birth certificate
bc the other parents can just cut them off with zero recourse
earnest sierra
i know someone it happened to
they're called beans
the green things that bite you
nods wisely
i think mostly it just wants to chill
vocal basin
they got Floridified
earnest sierra
if you have an alligator phone you crocodial
eh i'm not a huge deep fried person
mashed potatoes
of monmouth?
hexed trout
hi chadstatus. interesting uh, bio there
earnest sierra
ooh i got a thing from unemployment agency...
wooden pewter
u didnt get the server update ?
hexed trout
(heading to bed, good night/timezone-appropriate-goodbye friends 
)
earnest sierra
byebye
quartz beacon
(heading to bed, good night/timezone-appropriate-goodbye friends <:h_goodnight:7...
Gn
obsidian dragon
hi @somber heath
quartz beacon
Foul Fowl
earnest sierra
ok gotta focus, bye!
vocal basin
@quartz beacon would be funny if they did like what snakes do:
lands onto a cow, eats it whole, and then just lays there for half a year
quartz beacon
vocal basin
@quartz beacon "good 'British' food: fish and chips premium edition"
(as in just the most stereotypical British food)
Kangaroos conducting nuclear tests to team up with Emus?
so called seismic communication devices
stray pewter
vocal basin
brb
somber heath
stray pewter
quartz beacon
quartz beacon
Car
somber heath
stray pewter
vocal basin
most typical excuse for me not to go to the store: it's midnight and the store is closed
somber heath
@topaz sandal ๐ ๐
topaz sandal
oh hi, just checking what do python people chat here
quartz beacon
@topaz sandal ๐
topaz sandal
๐
stray pewter
stray pewter
quartz beacon
We laten de oceaan leeglopen en verkopen je het water ervan!!
@crude nova hello heisenberg
๐ทBlue crystal
crude nova
Hello @quartz beacon ๐
stray pewter
quartz beacon
Oh hey opel, can I send some stuff I photographed? I'm the opposite of a professional
Wildlife
stray pewter
stray pewter
stray pewter
vocal basin
He's EVIL and fucked up
"and, while all other seagulls are like that too, this one at least doesn't try to hide it"
quartz beacon
"and, while all other seagulls are like that too, this one at least doesn't try ...
Oh yeah fuck seagulls
Awful critters
stray pewter
Oh yeah fuck seagulls
:(
quartz beacon
quartz beacon
He's staring
stray pewter
stray pewter
Where did you get a chance to get that?)
This is the lancaster mk1 ww2 bomber at RIAT
elfin fractal
!unmute @quartz beacon
wise cargoBOT
:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: pardoned infraction timeout for @quartz beacon.
quartz beacon
Damn
They took @quartz beacon out back and shot her in the head
The gay solidarity bridge
In sloterdijk
stray pewter
quartz beacon
My bike
elfin fractal
quartz beacon
somber heath
quartz beacon
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1187005022261747722/1424989648437907506/S...
Tit?
Not a tit
๐
somber heath
Spotted Pardalote.
quartz beacon
stray pewter
somber heath
Jikky, when talking about ice-cream.
@nocturne oracle ๐
Antimatter ice-cream.
stray pewter
what country is ๐ณ๏ธโโง๏ธ all the pretty girls are from there
quartz beacon
what country is ๐ณ๏ธโโง๏ธ all the pretty girls are from there
Transnistria
๐ซก๐ณ๏ธโโง๏ธโง๏ธ
dry jasper
@crude nova how is the backend python course going?
fading quiver
hello
dry jasper
Schlieren
somber heath
@clever imp ๐
ocean solar
somber heath
@tough tartan Because I don't want to disturb the household.
tough tartan
oh
somber heath
It being nighttime.
tough tartan
mb
somber heath
Hey fkorthfkszzz.
tough tartan
i have a question to anyone who is quite experienced in the field of programming
somber heath
Ask.
primal shadow
That looks like a statement
not so much a question ๐
If you don't ask, we can't answer.
tough tartan
so basically i am learning python as a side hustle and i am still a complete beginner
how hard it is to get a job after 2 years of python
tough tartan
That looks like a statement
my bad
english is not my first language
and as you may know languages behave differently so i thought that this is okay in english too
so thanks for your correction
somber heath
Auto deletion of that url. Rightio.
calm ginkgo
so basically i am learning python as a side hustle and i am still a complete beg...
depends, what do you know besides python?
tough tartan
nothing i am completely new to these things
calm ginkgo
then it's gonna be tough
somber heath
my bad
english is not my first language
Your use of English was not substandard. You made yourself understood.
calm ginkgo
python is mostly a tool, you need to learn how to use that tool for something...like web dev or devops or ML or healthcare etc
tough tartan
so is there anything you suggest me to learn along with python
calm ginkgo
so is there anything you suggest me to learn along with python
depends on what your interests and goals are
figure out what you want to do as a career first
tough tartan
my only goal is to fill up my time and perhaps earn some money before graduating from med school
calm ginkgo
-_- then maybe you can look into e-health and bioinformatics? you'll need to know some genetics and need to know python
tough tartan
are there available jobs in these fields
calm ginkgo
are there available jobs in these fields
no it's rare
but getting a job with your experience in other fields is even harder
that's not to say you can't try
tepid edge
If you're interested in programming I'd focus on stuff that's useful to you either in your studies or elsewhere
tough tartan
bruhhhh
chatgpt made it look so easy
it was like just by finishing intermediate level you can start doing small gigs as a freelancer and earn 5 dollars an hour
tepid edge
Intermediate level what
tough tartan
as in being an intermediate level programmer
primal shadow
so basically i am learning python as a side hustle and i am still a complete beg...
Very, if it's 2 years of just python. There's a lot more expected of developers these days.
calm ginkgo
bruhhhh
chatgpt made it look so easy
it was like just by finishing intermediate...
yeah no, good luck finding a job..the market is pretty bad rn
somber heath
Welcome to the Hotel California, @cerulean ridge .
tepid edge
A mid-level developer is someone with ~3-5 years of professional experience
primal shadow
and as you may know languages behave differently so i thought that this is okay ...
Mostly I was just saying you shouldn't ask or announce that you're going to ask a question. Just ask the question you want to ask
somber heath
"Such a lovely place..."
primal shadow
A mid-level developer is someone with ~3-5 years of professional experience
Professional experience
You miss a lot working alone
It is a critical distinction you include
primal shadow
Many think "I started learning 10 years ago and pick it up every few months, I've been programming for 10 years!"
somber heath
If I closely observe myself, am I self studying?
primal shadow
If I closely observe myself, am I self studying?
I think that's studying the self
๐คฃ
somber heath
Self-studying self.
tough tartan
lol
tepid edge
If you want to make money as a software dev, at a minimum you're competing with what someone with no programming knowledge can cobble together with chatgpt
primal shadow
Self-studying self.
What if you monitor the footage of the study of the self?
tough tartan
then why are people getting into programming if the market is shit
somber heath
Lizards.
calm ginkgo
i know hundreds of people looking for a job rn with degree in cs
primal shadow
And what if that event is itself recorded for further study
somber heath
Monitor monitor.
primal shadow
then why are people getting into programming if the market is shit
It takes time to realize how shit things are
and once you've begun a path, it can be hard to change
so many got on the path when it was a roses and rainbows
tepid edge
Imo software is a good field to get into if you enjoy programming and reading docs and debugging
primal shadow
only to find it's all been replaced by shit a few years later
tepid edge
You can still develop a very valuable skillset
tough tartan
i know hundreds of people looking for a job rn with degree in cs
is it because they didnt ifnd the job they are looking for or they werent able to ifnd any?
tepid edge
But if you half ass it I don't see a bright future
primal shadow
But the golden days seem to have come to an abrupt end
calm ginkgo
is it because they didnt ifnd the job they are looking for or they werent able t...
there's lots of jobs, but no one wants anyone without experience
primal shadow
is it because they didnt ifnd the job they are looking for or they werent able t...
Many new grads en up in non tech roles
Stocking shelves, unloading trucks, flipping burgers
the economy be shitty here
tough tartan
there's lots of jobs, but no one wants anyone without experience
is making mock projects considered an experience or not
tepid edge
I am biased, I got into the field with no degree or notable experience
somber heath
Flex. Flip trucks.
tepid edge
But it's region/time/luck dependent
primal shadow
is making mock projects considered an experience or not
It is, but nothing replaces work experience
the paradox of entry level work
everyone wants experience
no one wants to hire without it
so where to get it?
calm ginkgo
i recently turned down a candiate because they didn't have any experience, her resume was poorly formatted and had so many typos ..so that's important
primal shadow
Resumes can be so wild sometimes
calm ginkgo
is making mock projects considered an experience or not
no, but it's good to put on your resume for sure, and open source contributions are even better
primal shadow
or more often than not it seems
tepid edge
Idk if you write your own compiler I'd count that for more than working at some no-name company doing frontend work
somber heath
I have a love/hate relationship with proofreading other people's stuff.
tepid edge
But YMMV
tough tartan
It is, but nothing replaces work experience
ok lemme put it this way
i am 19 with zero experience regarding programming or anything related
how hard would it be to get a job or even small gigs in two years time
candid fox
ok lemme put it this way
i am 19 with zero experience regarding programming or ...
Students usually take 4 years to complete their studies, and that's full time learning. You're competing against them.
calm ginkgo
I have a love/hate relationship with proofreading other people's stuff.
i get nitpicking a comma or semicolon, but 5 or 10 mistakes show carelessness
primal shadow
ok lemme put it this way
i am 19 with zero experience regarding programming or ...
I can't read the future, but the market is shit
maybe it'll get better, but the goal seems to be eliminate all the jobs, hoard all the money
But 2 years seems a bit lacking compared to a full education
Granted I studied without spending money for ~ 2 years before finding a job
tough tartan
damn
then i guess imma drop the idea of learining python
i mean spending two years developing a skill and you are not even getting a penny afterwards
working at mcdonalds seems more productive imo
candid fox
It's still a valuable skill, but it pairs best with something else. I'm self taught in Python. I started as an animator though, and I was able to use python to pivot into a related role
calm ginkgo
damn
then i guess imma drop the idea of learining python
i mean spending two yea...
i think you're understimating the usefulness of knowing a programming language..it's better to know than not know...slowly build up your portfolio..by the time you;re out of med school, you'll be a great candiate with programming also under your belt
tough tartan
when i first thouht about learning python i thought to myself that the worst it can get to is getting paid 3$an hour after two years of studying
but now it seems that getting paid 15cents an hour is an accomplishment
tough tartan
i think you're understimating the usefulness of knowing a programming language.....
so basically learning python along with data science and then combine it with my med degree?
candid fox
In my experience, most people learning programming for the money and not the passion don't make it
tough tartan
In my experience, most people learning programming for the money and not the pas...
i am learning it to fill up my time
and would prefer if i get at least a portion of what i poures into it
calm ginkgo
so basically learning python along with data science and then combine it with my...
look at karl friston for instance, he invented the most well known physics behinds neural networks and AI we use today ..he was a medical doctor and a physicist also
mixing paradigms is a great way to differentiate yourself
tough tartan
look at karl friston for instance, he invented the most well known physics behin...
that guy is a genius
also being a physicist and a doctor is almost impossible for an average guy wanting an average life
calm ginkgo
a genius is just a person who puts a lot of effort into their work
you can be a genius too
amber raptor
I am king in valley of the mutes!
somber heath
Mm.
amber raptor
Bye Opal
calm ginkgo
I am king of the world! (โฏยฐโกยฐ)โฏ๏ธต โปโโป
tough tartan
convincing
ok
what should i learn along with python
like should i learn another programming language or should i get into data science and ai
candid fox
don't worry about other languages for now
calm ginkgo
just start with python, finish it and then eventually you'll realize concepts transfer over to other languages
data science and ai and all are math heavy and will require a bit more discipline from your side...it's not a spectator sport in the least
but if you put your mind to it and do a little bit every day then you'll surely get to a good level of knowledge
tough tartan
i dont mind putting in the time and effort if its gonna pay back
calm ginkgo
well i dunno what's gonna pay back if not knowledge
candid fox
You will always be better off knowing python than not knowing python
tough tartan
excessive unrelated knowledge would seem more of a waste of time if you dont get to use it
candid fox
if you use a computer, python is helpful
tough tartan
You will always be better off knowing python than not knowing python
true
every tech guy ik said this thing to me
and it is actually what made me get to python
tough tartan
if you use a computer, python is helpful
unfortunately i dont think computers play a big part in my major
candid fox
unfortunately i dont think computers play a big part in my major
you don't think computers are important in the medical field?
calm ginkgo
pubmed looks at you from a distance
tough tartan
you don't think computers are important in the medical field?
i am not sure
but have never seen any doctor using one other than looking into histories
tough tartan
_pubmed_ looks at you from a distance
what is pubmed
calm ginkgo
doctors use computers all the time my dude...like all the time
candid fox
i am not sure
but have never seen any doctor using one other than looking into ...
yes and where do you think those histories are stored? It's all custom software
calm ginkgo
blast and other things are also used by doctors all the time
the point is a lot of software is used by doctors..
tough tartan
i see now
but yk i am a bit greedy
i was hoping that i can make some money before graduating
but it feels i was just a delulu
calm ginkgo
it's not greedy to want to make money for yourself
tough tartan
it's not greedy to want to make money for yourself
i mean ye
in order to build a cooperative society we should all share what we earn
abstract solstice
tough tartan
this way we can get rid of the concept of getting a job to earn a living
calm ginkgo
ideally yeah, but sadly that's not reality
tough tartan
what is ideal about this
its the absolute definition of corruption and greediness
why would anyone work to feed sb else
calm ginkgo
communism baby /jk
primal shadow
damn
then i guess imma drop the idea of learining python
i mean spending two yea...
Python can make you more effective at other jobs, and it's also a good thing to learn to expand your own ability to solve problems.
tough tartan
communism baby /jk
bro i am totally against communism
primal shadow
a genius is just a person who puts a lot of effort into their work
Genius is more about capacity than effort.
primal shadow
convincing
ok
what should i learn along with python
like should i learn another ...
Odin Project is a great thing to do alongside
calm ginkgo
bro i am totally against communism
okay, i'm not a communist either
tough tartan
Odin Project is a great thing to do alongside
what is this
tough tartan
okay, i'm not a communist either
doesnt seem like it
calm ginkgo
doesnt seem like it
wdym?
primal shadow
what is this
An online free course to learn HTML/CSS/JS
primal shadow
Alongside Linux & Git
then they jump into Rails if you want, guide you in finding a job
A really solid resource, IMO
tough tartan
then they jump into Rails if you want, guide you in finding a job
should i do this alongside python or should i drop python and study this?
primal shadow
I liked going back and forth
since the foundational concepts of programming carry across languages
tough tartan
ok
should i do java or ruby
tough tartan
isnt it like the most common language
primal shadow
so...neither for now?
๐คท most common how?
SQL is pretty ubiquitous
JS is everywhere as well
tough tartan
idk
i once so stats and ajva was the most popular one
primal shadow
Good luck living in the modern world without JS
tough tartan
i dont understand, so when i start with odin project which path should i choose
primal shadow
fuck larry ellison is all I have to say about Java
shrewd dragon
Java is prominent because a lot of older systems don't want to upgrade and can't afford to upgrade so you see a lot of establishs apps and companies using it.
tough tartan
what after finishing it
tough tartan
no
i am just asking
ik it is stupid, but i just wanna know
primal shadow
Foundations is the important part
Then you can do either, JS or Ruby
Do em both, who cares, learn more
shrewd dragon
@tough tartan you should pick something you enjoy and think will be profitable and learn it little by little, gain enough to build something even if its small and then reiterate in my opinion building is key to learning and keeps you far from "Tutorial Hell"
primal shadow
But if you have no interest in Ruby, jump in with more JS
But remember, Java is to Javascript as Grape is to Grapefruit
They are not related
like at all
tough tartan
But if you have no interest in Ruby, jump in with more JS
ik nothing about both of them
so i cant tell if i am interested or not
primal shadow
So do the foundations ๐
tough tartan
But remember, Java is to Javascript as Grape is to Grapefruit
my dumbass thought it is an extension
like somehting you learn after java
shrewd dragon
Javascript is a great beginner language for sure you can do basically anything with JS. Same with Python. and its straightforward higher level languages
tough tartan
So do the foundations ๐
true
primal shadow
Odin Foundations alongside Python should last you a while
But a solid understanding of JS I think is critical
even if you're not a programmer, being able to open the dev console on a site
tough tartan
ok great
imma go and try and finish the basics of python this week so i cna start with odin asap
tough tartan
thanks for everything guys
primal shadow
๐
meh, when not PTT mute works
although reducing user volume is a nice fix too
shrewd dragon
Who here would be down for structured mock interviews?
peak depot
#career-advice try there
quiet oar
I learn Piton
primal shadow
That sounds fun
kind quiver
#announcements Hello evryone !
primal shadow
Hello announcer of the announcements channel
wise loom
back in the day, when Ubuntu was still working..
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/KivFqn4Fh_E
somber heath
@final canopy ๐
somber heath
@languid kite ๐
primal shadow
brb
final canopy
<@648612726960029725> ๐
hi?
did i do something wrong?
i was asking for advice
im new to this
Django i mean
not dev work
im an IT teacher
learning a new framewrok
somber heath
did i do something wrong?
I like to wave to people who have not yet gained their speaking privileges. People often miss noticing the text channel, here, that accompanies the voice chat.
somber heath
You may like to see #โ๏ฝhow-to-get-help or ask around in #web-development. I've not really studied Django. But you can still ask your question if you like.
final canopy
im currently doing my pgce in secondary computing to be an IT teacher
so im learning this
primal shadow
That's fun