python-discussion

[onyx marlin]

Can i learn python from his yt videos? Is it useful?

[past shard]

it is , but make as much stuff by urself as u can.

[past shard]

!kindlinng

[edgy kraken]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[young flare]

Personally, I think learning from a structured course / book is more efficient than random youtube videos

[past shard]

@onyx marlin use these for projects

[onyx marlin]

Ty for your advice

[past shard]

His youtube videos are quite good and structured

[past shard]

Tho, they invite you to tutorial hell.

[torn viper]

Should I be prefixing everything I'm not explicitly exporting from a package with an _, or is there a better metric I should be using?

[past shard]

@onyx marlin you can use the book , "automate the boring stuff with python" too, it's very good and teaches you about automation and scraping.

[spice hill]

If you're making a library, then yes, it's a good idea to _underscore names you don't want to promise the stability of.

[onyx marlin]

Where can i find this book?

[torn viper]

Thank you

[past shard]

!res

[edgy kraken]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[young flare]

Maybe some like it, some don't, I personally don't especially those extremely long, 12 hour long videos. I feel like many people give up before finishing it completely. I find that when topics broken down to smaller parts (like a course or book) have better attention span because people have a better sense of tracking their progress rather than tracking progress based on how much time they have consumed off the video. But that might just be me

[onyx marlin]

@past shard found it!! Ty

[past shard]

It's free online

[young flare]

Never in my life have I fully completed those 12 hours long videos because mid way I feel so discouraged on how long it is

[spice hill]

Sometimes the meaning of _ is ambiguous, I don't know if there's a good way to systematize it. For example, you might intend for an attribute to be used freely anywhere within a library, but not by outside users; and then you might have attributes that are only intended to be used within a single module.

[onyx marlin]

There's also an udemy version.

In that list

[past shard]

yeah you can use that too

[crisp jay]

Some of his videos are good but meh

[pallid garden]

good but meh?

[onyx marlin]

Ok. Thank you brother!

[torn viper]

That's kind of what annoys me about __ apparently not being recommended (and for this, I've been trying to actually do things somewhat properly). I'd say for my case I'd rather be clear with what is externally usable, since a few of my other design choices stem from that approach.

[spice hill]

I personally would not avoid __ for private attributes (intended to be used only within a class). Especially if you don't plan to support subclassing

[past shard]

Yeah, I can agree with that but, it's kinda a bootcamp for beginners to get into coding and the video is just all of his short tutorials combined into one long video. It prepares you for cool stuff you can do with one lonng guide.

[spice hill]

do note that __ only works for class attributes/methods, not items in a module

[pallid garden]

bootcamps are memorable, but not the content

a few months you will remember that you watched a long ass video for 12 hours

but probably only 50% of the content

at best

[past shard]

That is true , but being actively involved even after the bootcamp is the main part because that will engrain the stuff that you learned in your mind.

[pallid garden]

yea

[frail forge]

Yoo

[merry pilot]

yo how could i learn to code in python (nd on a scale 1/10 how hard is it)

[pastel sluice]

!res start with a tutorial, and see for yourself how difficult it is.

[edgy kraken]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[pastel sluice]

we get a lot of questions along the lines of "how hard is it to do this?" and the only fair answer is "We can't tell you, because that's all going to come down to you"

[merry pilot]

thanks

[dusky crag]

I was (mostly) able to understand window functions and even used them to make some pretty nice queries i needed for my project. Took ALOT of time trouble shooting though.

[kindred hemlock]

I talk python

[dusky crag]

Syntax Error on line 1: 'I talk python'

[kindred hemlock]

loooool

[dull dune]

specifically, I think cs50p is the best starting point. Make time for it at least a few times a week, and engage with the content: watch the videos, read the notes, play with the example, and do the exercises

and recognize that you're not really learning python, you're learning how to program and python is the vehicle. that can help clarify what's worth deeply understanding vs just memorizing

[merry pilot]

this may be the most helping comunity i ve seen

[proud escarp]

depends on what you want to do, and as mentioned how hard it is varies between people, but learning enough of the syntax required to start learning specific applications of the language is maybe a 4/10 on my scale! the problem-solving is harder than the syntax

[merry pilot]

thx guys

[dull dune]

I'd also recommend this after an intro course/book/whatever: https://www.composingprograms.com/

it's more about how to think about designing programs and working with and building abstractions (which is the real gist of what software development is). It's an updated version of the wizard book using python and is for a class taught at Berkeley @merry pilot

[harsh swallow]

Sounds like something I recommend, but without a link - I always tell people to use pen and paper and plan their things, instead of just trying to write code without thinking. And I mention how i use that in my bigger projects as well, it's not a sign of beginner vs advanced, it's about planning

[misty kite]

is there a way to delete a file without it going into my recycle bin? i have a script that generates a bunch of files and then deletes any old ones and it results in my recycle bin having like 4000 files in it after i run it enough

rn im using os.remove

[golden mortar]

It's not easy, but it's not the kind of thing where you're either a super genius who can handle it or you aren't. If you put in enough time and effort, you can learn it.

[unborn lagoon]

Doesn't os.remove already do a "permanent" delete?

[misty kite]

theyre being put in my recycle bin

#ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval message

[oblique spindle]

Documentation of os.remove says it removes them permanently

[misty kite]

weird, maybe it's an arg or something, lemem check the docs

[kindred hemlock]

This is the best helping community you've ever seen

I wouldn't have even started if it weren't for these good friends of ours

[merry pilot]

rue

true*

[misty kite]

what im doing is i have a script that generates font bitmap data and i have an option to save the bitmaps to files, so i can look at how they turned out

but i sometimes change the character set, so i have it delete all the old bitmaps in the folder before rendering

[clear fable]

hi

[unborn lagoon]

Odd, I'd have to look at the code, since I doubt it's os.remove doing it.

[misty kite]

lemme see

[kindred hemlock]

Doesn't os.remove like remove the code?

[oblique spindle]

Confused noises

[unborn lagoon]

It removes a file.

[kindred hemlock]

Sorry am dumb lmao

[misty kite]

im just doing

cwd = os.getcwd()
if(save_font):
    old_chars = os.listdir("chars")
    for i in old_chars:
        os.remove(cwd+"/chars/"+i)

probably better to use like os.path.join but i couldnt be bothered at the time

[unborn lagoon]

Could you clear the recycle bin and run the code again? Perhaps it's just older files and not your code.

[misty kite]

maybe

[wise imp]

shutil.rmtree go brrrt

[misty kite]

very possible

[wise imp]

pathlib btw

[minor silo]

hello everyone new here

can anybody tell me what is git or git hub

[misty kite]

ik that exists
i just didnt feel like it xd

[misty kite]

github is a site where you store projects and stuff
it allows multiple people to work on a project more easily

[minor silo]

oh okay

thank u

[misty kite]

np
and git is basically a software that github uses, it's used to manage updating and working on software
so like if you mess up when you write some code and you wanna go back to an old version, git can help with that without you having to manually make backups

also i can confirm it was that i had manually deleted some of the files, os.remove is working as normal

i probably should have checked that first lmao

[steady rain]

remember not to put parentheses around if conditions
also use pathlib

[misty kite]

? wait why not

[steady rain]

if statements don't need parentheses, so including them just makes your code noisier.

[misty kite]

yeah i know htey dont need it i just do it for clarity idk
got used to it after writing in other langs

[wise imp]

I also write other langs but I don't pollute my Python code with them, smh /lh

[steady rain]

well, make sure that you stop if you end up writing python in a team, so you don't irritate your teammates and make you change it.

anyway, if you used pathlib

directory = Path.cwd() / "chars"
if save_font:
    for path in directory.iterdir():
        path.unlink()

[wise imp]

btw, yeah, if you're trying to remove the entire directory (which you seem to be doing, maybe shutil.rmtree (scary AF though, make sure to be really sure that you're removing the right directory) does actually also help with the recycle bin stuff (which is weird anyway, but still)

[misty kite]

it wasnt actually os.remove it was me not realizing i had manually removed some files lol
silly mistake on my end

[tiny kraken]

sure i would like that

i ll take a look

https://github.com/Leshiro/jisuke what do you think of the readme file i personally really like it now

[surreal ridge]

what can i make with python

[golden mortar]

Python is a general-purpose programming language. You can make virtually any computer program or application with it.

[surreal ridge]

what kind of applications

[golden mortar]

Any applications

That's what general-purpose means

[cyan scaffold]

You can browse through the topical channels on this server to get an idea

[golden mortar]

It's not necessarily suitable for all kinds of applications, but it's still possible

You could implement an extremely slow-running Elden Ring in Python given enough time and effort

[south vessel]

Is there any free tiktok api or tools that provide tiktok profile info and other things

[golden mortar]

Have you looked at https://developers.tiktok.com/ ?

[cyan scaffold]

I'm assuming you have to rent an API key

[golden mortar]

If free access to that info is not provided through the official API, it's safe to assume that any other means would violate Tiktok ToS

which means that we can't help you with it on this server

!rule 5

[edgy kraken]

Rules

5. Do not provide or request help on projects that may violate terms of service, or that may be deemed inappropriate, malicious, or illegal.

[south vessel]

oh okay.
I'm making a discord bot what would send live stream notifications and notifications for video uploads and account summaries at the end of the day
I can't really fill all of the needed things cause i don't have them

[silver plover]

Or specifically: https://developers.tiktok.com/blog/research-api-wrappers-on-github-announcement / https://github.com/tiktok/tiktok-research-api-wrapper

[copper walrus]

!resources

[edgy kraken]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[eternal shoal]

can anyone guide me for GSOC

[crisp jay]

alot of things

[wise imp]

pong

[lunar cobalt]

Does anyone know how to make a looping perlin noise map?

[copper walrus]

Dancing snake

[lunar cobalt]

So it can be seamlessly tiled

[eternal shoal]

for games?

[lunar cobalt]

In this case I wanna use it for the background

Its the space and Ill use it to vary the tint of the background

so it needs to be tileable

[eternal shoal]

okay

so can you tell me about the issue

[lunar cobalt]

I dont know how to make a perlin noise map that loops over

It should work in a way that basically reconnects to itself at the end to the start

[misty kite]

hm

what you can do is make an input noise map that loops and then feed that in

[clever aurora]

hello guys

today i did a personal project can you guys give feedback for it?

[lunar cobalt]

?

not sure what you mean

[languid notch]

Python ones

[clever aurora]

https://www.repowave.space/

[misty kite]

one sec

[alpine dragon]

Guys, how do I redo an if statement?

[cerulean ravine]

tell us more about why it need to be redone. Sounds like you need a while loop.

[misty kite]

ok actually just doing modulus on the inputs makes it... seamful

[alpine dragon]

I need it to redo because if i misspell the word "calculator" it lets me redo the input until i get the word right

[cerulean ravine]

ok, so it will be something like while <word is misspelled>: <ask for word>

[paper jay]

How can I keep a bot online if my computer turns off?

I know I have to run the code in like a

[alpine dragon]

You cant 🙂

[unborn lagoon]

You keep your computer on, or you use another computer (either another one you have or a hosting service).

[alpine dragon]

Just kidding, you can

[paper jay]

Like raspberry pi?

Those?

[alpine dragon]

Maybe yes

[lament rose]

You could do it that way, or pay for a service

In the case of a raspberry pi you'd need to keep it on

Any external hosting service just handles that for you

[eternal shoal]

do as amy said or recursion can be used

[alpine dragon]

Yh, but if I did a variable for the input how do i keep redoing it with while loop, if and the variable input?

[cerulean ravine]

can you show us how you would check if the word was misspelled? Let's say you have a variable word.

[alpine dragon]

Ok

Lemme send screenshot

[copper walrus]

Try this, dont copy paste

Word_spelled = bool(False)
while Word_spelled == False:
    Word = input("Enter the word calculator")
    if Word.lower() == "calculator": 
        Word_spelled = bool(True)

[cerulean ravine]

you can use False, no need for bool(False), and then while not Word_spelled:

[paper jay]

Replit?

[cerulean ravine]

lastly, Python usualy doesn't use upper-case for variables.

[copper walrus]

Its my phones autocorrecy

[alpine dragon]

Me too 😭

[lament rose]

Replit isn't a hosting service from what I know, also doesn't handle your bot token securely

[cerulean ravine]

you can turn that off, right?

[copper walrus]

Its turned off automatically in my IDE but I typed the code in discord sooo

[frigid trout]

Is there a problem with starting your variable with upper-case?

[cerulean ravine]

yes: other people will comment on it, and it will distract you from getting your answer.

[copper walrus]

Its a convention, not enforced but followed by everyone

[alpine dragon]

No but it doesn't read the variable as one

[cerulean ravine]

Is There A Problem With Using Caps in ENGLISH?

[misty kite]

ok i was worried for a moment but i got something that works i think
you just take regular perlin noise, but in the input noise function you take the modulus of the coordinates

[alpine dragon]

Nope

As its for screaming

[cerulean ravine]

Yes There Is: It looks weird, and PEOPLE won'T understand Why You Are Doing It.

it hinders communication

[copper walrus]

Butt using CAPS IN ENGLISH is not according to the rules

[alpine dragon]

Its for goofing on what other people SaY or always for SCREAMING

[misty kite]

def random_gradient(x, y, repeat_size = 16):
    a = x % repeat_size
    b = y % repeat_size
    r = hash(f"{a}{b}")
    return math.cos(r),math.sin(r)

using hash() for this isnt optimal since it's not deterministic but it'll do

[eternal shoal]

it will introduce a seam

[misty kite]

not if you do it right

#ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval message

[eternal shoal]

using high dimensional mapping is the right way

[cerulean ravine]

don't you want the noise to be continuous?

[misty kite]

it is

see the link

might break for higher octaves idk

[eternal shoal]

I am not sure what were the requirements of the guy

[cerulean ravine]

looking at the code, it seems like two x values very close together could get noise values far apart, because hash() is discontinuous? But I could be missing something.

[autumn pelican]

Log in with a browser, get your session cookie and curl it passing the cookie as a parameter and it works

[misty kite]

the noise can be anything

what i posted isnt the full perlin noise function, the gradient takes in the noise and smooths it

all that rly matters is that it's reproducable for that run of the program and that there's no internal state

[ocean ridge]

hi guys! im going to make a super light weight but really fun to use IDE for python. its not gonna be as bloaty as pycharm and certainly not as boring as vs code. Any suggestions fellow python users?

[chilly umbra]

wdym by fun?

[ocean ridge]

going to have glowing text + ambient music and gotta brainstorm more

[ocean ridge]

any features u would like to have? any extensions that you use in vs code that u like to see replicated here? (strictly python only for now)

[copper walrus]

I like to use math module

[chilly umbra]

auto completetion, formatting, and diagnostics are always appreciated

[ocean ridge]

ai based autocomplete? or the usual one?

[chilly umbra]

lsp based is fine

[copper walrus]

!topic

[edgy kraken]

Off-topic channels

There are three off-topic channels:

• #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval
• #ot1-perplexing-regexing
• #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

Use any of the three, it doesn't matter.
The channel names change every night at midnight UTC and are often fun meta references to jokes or conversations that happened on the server.

See our off-topic etiquette page for more guidance on how the channels should be used.

[ocean ridge]

isnt this about python 😔

[copper walrus]

How I feel after staring at code for 5 hours instead of studying:

[ocean ridge]

how is it related to the features though?

[ocean ridge]

sure thats a necessity.

[copper walrus]

You need to import it from outside and it does some stuff normal python doesent do

[lusty reef]

Anyone ever get so frustrated with a portion of their code that they just delete the module and want to start over? lmao

[ashen cipher]

yes

[copper walrus]

Bro HELL YEA

[lusty reef]

I essentially did that with my microphone/audio/Whisper code

Because it was nonstop phantom transcriptions, no matter what I did, with webrtcvad

[copper walrus]

Python be telling me that there's a indent error when the fricking code IS LITERALLY INDETTED CORRECTLY,
I don't delete the code tho, i just crash out

[lusty reef]

But I'm also a newbie, and real time audio/transcription is one of the most stressful/harder things to deal with apparently

[ashen cipher]

well yeah

you're essentially plugging in a wave into your program and somehow finding words in that wave

[lusty reef]

So I'm just going to have to suffer in trying to figure it out or is there anything that can help with that lol

[eternal shoal]

Doing Open Source Contribution is hard.
Finding Projects that are sweet spot in difficulty and interest is harder

[surreal ridge]

whats some beginnef level examples (no boring click games)

[alpine dragon]

Calculators

[dull dune]

have you taken a python class/worked through a textbook/etc yet?

[surreal ridge]

no hence why i asked to make sure if i wanna go thru w it

[dull dune]

I don't see that being super productive without some programming background

[surreal ridge]

??? u good?

[dull dune]

yes

[surreal ridge]

R u deadass?

[odd wyvern]

yestrday i was helping my little brother learn python for 5 hours and he only new the print("hello world") can someone pls tell me a good way to teach him faster?

[surreal ridge]

atbs

[dull dune]

yes, if you don't have any idea how to program, staring at code is a bad place to start

cs50p is great

Investing a week of regular time in that would open up a ton of ability to usefully read code

[dull dune]

Cs50p

[dull dune]

I mean... Have you worked through it?

[odd wyvern]

thanks i have done python for over a year now and i still only know <!DOCTYPE html>
<html>
<head>
<title>Google Sign-In App</title>

<script src="https://accounts.google.com/gsi/client" async defer></script>

</head>
<body>
<h1>Welcome to My Site</h1>

<!-- 1. The Configuration Div -->
<div id="g_id_onload"
     data-client_id="YOUR_GOOGLE_CLIENT_ID.apps.googleusercontent.com"
     data-context="signin"
     data-ux_mode="popup"
     data-callback="handleCredentialResponse"
     data-auto_prompt="false">
</div>

<!-- 2. The Visual Button Div -->
<div class="g_id_signin"
     data-type="standard"
     data-shape="rectangular"
     data-theme="outline"
     data-text="signin_with"
     data-size="large"
     data-logo_alignment="left">
</div>

<script>
    // This function handles the response from Google
    function handleCredentialResponse(response) {
        console.log("Encoded JWT ID token: " + response.credential);
        
        // Send the token to your Python backend for verification
        fetch('/login/google', {
            method: 'POST',
            headers: { 'Content-Type': 'application/json' },
            body: JSON.stringify({ id_token: response.credential })
        })
        .then(res => res.json())
        .then(data => {
            if (data.success) {
                window.location.href = "/dashboard";
            } else {
                alert("Login failed!");
            }
        });
    }
</script>

</body>
</html>

[solemn rain]

Whats this

[dull dune]

that's not python

[odd wyvern]

oh sorry that was javascript

[solemn rain]

Thats html

[odd wyvern]

and javascript

[lunar elk]

And JWT.

[solemn rain]

with javascript

[odd wyvern]

yeah

[lunar elk]

Uhh, how should I get back into Python..? I need it for Discord bot devving but yeaah, I never went in-depth into it.

[thorny latch]

trying to re-learn Python here

my first programming language

[visual juniper]

why re learn ?

[thorny latch]

it's been so long since I've ever used it

[visual juniper]

if you already know it , you can glance over ur previous notes and get a good feel for it

no need to start at 0

[thorny latch]

I lost all of it

[visual juniper]

how long ?

[brazen patrol]

Exactly

[thorny latch]

started since 8th grade and stopped since 10th grade, which means it would be 2 years now

[brazen patrol]

Since u already know it, cli projects to recall stuff

[thorny latch]

alr, do you recommend it for Backend purposes?

I'm starting with Flask

[brazen patrol]

Yh, but depends on what u are building

[brazen patrol]

Flask is good for beginners, minimal, makes u learn how web works

[thorny latch]

alr

[visual juniper]

did you make any projects back then ?

[thorny latch]

yeah

[visual juniper]

..such as

[thorny latch]

it was all just in the terminal

useless scripts, and I wanted something bigger so that's why I moved to JavaScript then later started using TypeScript

[visual juniper]

i was just trying to get a feel for what concepts you knew in python
but sure , start at 0 if u want to , it would just be a bit of waste of time to start at 0 if u already knew stuff , but if u didnt , then start at 0

[thorny latch]

I don't think am starting at 0, I jumped directly into learning Flask

[visual juniper]

do you know classes ?

decorators , functions

actually u dont need to know much about decorators , u wont be making any yourself

[thorny latch]

seen classes before but never actually implemented it once

and about functions, yeah

[brazen patrol]

Yh, jst some basics of classes, since beginner flask is all function based routes

[visual juniper]

i suggest giving it a go , its one of the fundamentals , a lot of libraries use classes

[visual juniper]

true , flask is pretty simple

[thorny latch]

that's why I want to learn it just to learn more about Backend Development instead of using ExpressJS and more

[brazen patrol]

Yh, once one is comfortable then one can learn more in depth classes for class based routes

[brazen patrol]

Good choice

[thorny latch]

I've always used ExpressJS, I did grasp a few concepts but I couldn't expand, because I wanted to use TypeScript for ExpressJS and setting it up either creates hell lots of errors when put into production or something else

a pain especially trying to find out what it meant by TypeError: argument handler must be a function

[chilly trout]

i hate AI so much bro

i asked claude code to fix a simple seg fault its been 20+ minutes

ima just do it myself atp

[brazen patrol]

How is ur strength of Python compared to TS

[brazen patrol]

It’s time to google

[languid notch]

Would've saved yourself 20 mins

[chilly trout]

yep

[languid notch]

(or took 20 hours)

[thorny latch]

well, I'd say I'm more familiar with Python than TS

[chilly trout]

20 dollars a month for what 😭

wait 40* actually im stupid

[ornate wren]

I got some serious doubt of how much the AI Coding agents will respect the archictecture of the program when editiing multiple files..

[chilly trout]

sometimes it does, sometimes it doesnt

it depends how complicated the thing i want from it actually is

[ornate wren]

Also if the archictecture is "custom" (not something that has been seem too much in github or the general open code) i think it will be even messiere

[brazen patrol]

Then get good at it, since u are heading the backend way, jst play around with flask with template, then later as an api, break stuff n learn

[chilly trout]

claude code does a decent job but yeah i do agree

[brazen patrol]

That’s the worry

[ornate wren]

I only used chatgpt prompt what i want in smaller pieces, i asked a few times for the whole foundation of a project (like build a hexagon archictecture for x purpuse) but i had later to code a lot of stuff on my own and also asked for smaller changes

Btw i aint paying for A.I (i only used chatgpt, gemini and deeepseek free chat options)

[chilly trout]

chatgpt isnt integrated into coding enviroments (mayb its possible through moltbot or something idk) so it usually sucks (or is just annoying) to prompt for large projects

[chilly trout]

claude has areally good free option but you cant use claude code and theres a message limit

[ornate wren]

It may be easy if you pay for the API (tokens)

[chilly trout]

yeah

[ornate wren]

So i aint even vibecoding correctly

[chilly trout]

😭

[ornate wren]

Using I.A usually kills my learning process and its making my skills dulll

So i'm really missing coding stuff by hand like before

[wise imp]

it's called openclaw now

not moltbot

[ornate wren]

openmeme is the correct name

[wise imp]

what's a hexagon architecture???

[ornate wren]

https://alistair.cockburn.us/hexagonal-architecture from the very creator of this design

[upbeat sleet]

Is it okay to sleep 13 hours a day cuz I’m unemployed college student

[ornate wren]

10 hours seems like the limit

13 hours you already wake up tired lol

[upbeat sleet]

I’m always tired so its whatever

More sleep is better cuz I don’t gotta deal w this world

[wise imp]

Unlikely, sleeping for too long (regularly) contributes to similar health risks as not sleeping enough
If you're constantly tired, might be worth it to check with a doctor

[upbeat sleet]

I did

My blood work is good

But still

So they can’t help

[red mural]

They'd probably suggest other things to look at

[upbeat sleet]

Nop I’m healthy on paper

[wise imp]

Could be a mental issue too I suppose
Pick up a hobby or a sports activity to do regularly, go out, yk, do something besides strictly college

[upbeat sleet]

All sorts of healthy

[red mural]

Well 13 hours of sleep a day is not healthy

[wise imp]

Make projects with Python (very topical for this server and especially for this channel)

[upbeat sleet]

I’m seeing a psychiatrist who has prescribed me some non working ssris for now

I have an appointment w him in like a week but idk

[wise imp]

that site won't load for me, maybe it's silently failing on me because I'm using a VPN, anyway, I just looked it up on google, went to wikipedia, will read from there I guess

[wise imp]

well, mention this I guess

[red mural]

I don't think we can give any advice that'd be more valuable that your medical doctor / psychiatrist

[upbeat sleet]

I did man

[wise imp]

(also, this is #python-discussion)

[upbeat sleet]

I swear its all useless

I went to sleep at like 3 AM

And woke up at 5 and something PM

[upbeat sleet]

Python is boring for me, I prefer sleeping

So I don’t have to deal with w this world

I don’t like this world at all

[wise imp]

irregular sleep schedule might also contribute to disturbances in your sleep pattern

[wise imp]

I was more so saying that this might not be the channel for this discussion

!ot

[edgy kraken]

Off-topic channel

#ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

Please read our off-topic etiquette before participating in conversations.

[upbeat sleet]

Man I feel the same regardless, but how does ur schedule look like?

U go sleep and wake in the same time always?

[alpine dragon]

I dont even have a schedule XD

[wise imp]

moved to #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare message
cc @alpine dragon

.topic

[verbal wedge]

**Do you have any plans for future projects?**

Suggest more topics here!

[rugged barn]

Lots

Not lots of energy for them, though

[alpine dragon]

Me too actuallly

[ashen cipher]

i dont have energy for anything x.x

[spiral karma]

hi

[young flare]

Greetings

[ashen cipher]

o/

[spiral karma]

i wanna do a music bot
and i have
from youtube_dl import YoutubeDL
But when i run, it says no module found

what i do?

[pastel sluice]

!ytdl

[edgy kraken]

Our youtube-dl, or equivalents, policy

Per Python Discord's Rule 5, we are unable to assist with questions related to youtube-dl, pytube, or other YouTube video downloaders, as their usage violates YouTube's Terms of Service.

For reference, this usage is covered by the following clauses in YouTube's TOS, as of 2021-03-17:

The following restrictions apply to your use of the Service. You are not allowed to:

1. access, reproduce, download, distribute, transmit, broadcast, display, sell, license, alter, modify or otherwise use any part of the Service or any Content except: (a) as specifically permitted by the Service;  (b) with prior written permission from YouTube and, if applicable, the respective rights holders; or (c) as permitted by applicable law;

3. access the Service using any automated means (such as robots, botnets or scrapers) except: (a) in the case of public search engines, in accordance with YouTube’s robots.txt file; (b) with YouTube’s prior written permission; or (c) as permitted by applicable law;

9. use the Service to view or listen to Content other than for personal, non-commercial use (for example, you may not publicly screen videos or stream music from the Service)

[spiral karma]

oh

ok, and if i have
import requests
and it says no module found, what i do?

[young flare]

you aint slick

[cyan scaffold]

Ironic how YouTube has ytdl tutorials on it

[narrow iron]

@spiral karma no module for the import? You might have to install the library if you do not have it

[spiral karma]

i have it, but i should put smth in requirements.txt?

[cyan scaffold]

No you have it you're good

[alpine dragon]

How to erase a message in python?

[cyan scaffold]

Depends on the message

[alpine dragon]

An input

[cyan scaffold]

Well you can write a space character to replace it or use an escape code to do it

Wdym erase an input message

[alpine dragon]

I mean that if i do an input instead of covering the whole screen it just erases the input and makes me write in the same line

[gaunt badge]

!d getpass

[edgy kraken]

getpass

Source code: Lib/getpass.py

Availability: not WASI.

This module does not work or is not available on WebAssembly. See WebAssembly platforms for more information...

[gaunt badge]

maybe you want this, but I'm still not fully understanding I think

[brazen patrol]

Cli or …

[alpine dragon]

It should be like /r and smt

[brazen patrol]

Ohh the carriage return?

[cyan scaffold]

It's \r and then whatever characters you want to overwrite on that line

[alpine dragon]

Maybe, dont know much like you all do about python

[alpine dragon]

So its \r and the variable of the input?

[cyan scaffold]

Well actually this isn't a Python specific issue per se

[cyan scaffold]

Experiment yourself because I don't know what you mean by "and the variable"

\r doesn't delete any character. It just brings you back to the beginning of the line so you can write over stuff

[alpine dragon]

So i have a variable for the input so i can reuse it later and doing \r how do i reuse the input variable for it?

[cyan scaffold]

What you type for an input() is given to the program so you can capture it in a variable to be re/used. No need to do any printing for any of this

[alpine dragon]

I know, but how should it be coded?

I just need an example

[cyan scaffold]

Well here's one

my_input = input()
print("Uppercase:", my_input.upper())

[alpine dragon]

Does it delete the first input?

[cyan scaffold]

No

[alpine dragon]

Ok, not pretending but i need it to delete the input 🙂

[cyan scaffold]

You can run it and see if it's what you want

[brazen patrol]

I think the input function is called once, so what ever u type into it is the only one alive when the program is running

[alpine dragon]

I know what it does, i know sufficiently to code

[cyan scaffold]

Like what you type in for it?

[alpine dragon]

But not all of python

[cyan scaffold]

Again you can print \r and then a matching number of spaces as the input

[stark mango]

\r sends the cursor to the beginning of the line

[alpine dragon]

I have for now a programm that its only function that is a calculator. Since its designed to have a lot more functions i need to say what function i want to use deleting the input and giving me the what i need

[stark mango]

You can overwrite the line with whitespaces and ask for input again

[cyan scaffold]

Oh but I guess this won't work because input() requires a line break to work

[stark mango]

If you're doing a more complex terminal user interface, use ncurses library

[wise imp]

nah, use textual

[alpine dragon]

What that?

[wise imp]

or just do subprocess.run("clear", shell=True)

[alpine dragon]

textual

[wise imp]

!pypi textual

[edgy kraken]

textual v8.0.0

Modern Text User Interface framework

Released on <t:1771261934:D>.

[cyan scaffold]

If you're doing a TUI app you should use a library like textual like people suggested here.
If it's just "delete the line of input" you could use an escape code to go back one line and delete it

Now thinking about it it's probably going to be two escape codes

[stark mango]

There this ansi code \033[A you can print to go up by one line the same way as \r to go to beginning

not the recommended way tho

[alpine dragon]

Textual huh? Lemme try that

[stark mango]

Anthropic is apparently using react for their tui lol

[alpine dragon]

Does textual work in Coding Python?

[stark mango]

1

[wise imp]

it's written in Python and you interact with it via Python

[stark mango]

^

[alpine dragon]

I have an app that simulates python since im on android mobile

[stark mango]

if it has a terminal ui it should work

[compact loom]

isnt there a file type i can include on github which shows what librarys people will need to use my project?

[stark mango]

which app

[alpine dragon]

Ok

[alpine dragon]

Its called Coding Python

[stark mango]

it should work fine on something like termux or pydroid

not sure about that app

[wise imp]

I think you're talking about a pyproject.toml and/or requirements.txt

[compact loom]

ahh it might be requirements.txt

i just wanna make some half decent documents for my not very complicated autoclicker program

cause again im sure when people look at my github and wanna see my progress, they probably wanna see i was documenting from early on

[alpine dragon]

You mean Pydroid3?

[cyan scaffold]

Dependency listing isn't really documentation... Maybe you mean a RAEDME.md?

[compact loom]

yeah im writing my README rn

[cyan scaffold]

Cool

[compact loom]

im writing a bit of context about why i made the application, then ill give some information about the application itself

[cyan scaffold]

pyproject.toml/requirements.txt is also important. Usually you leave out dependencies and only include one of these files to install them from

[compact loom]

what do you mean leave out dependencies

[somber osprey]

hello I wanna ask tiny question

sys — System-specific parameters and functions

This module provides access to some variables used or maintained by the interpreter and to functions that interact strongly with the interpreter. It is always available. Unless explicitly noted otherwise, all variables are read-only.

are they talking about something like environmetn variables but in python's "shell"

[cyan scaffold]

You shouldn't track and add dependencies in your git repository

[compact loom]

you mean like import ...?

[young flare]

He meant, you shouldn't include the binary installation of your libraries (like your .venv folder) in your git repo

[cyan scaffold]

Whatever you pip install or whatever

[compact loom]

ohh i dont do that

i .gitignore that stuff

[somber osprey]

It's not offtop yeah ?

[young flare]

yeah pretty much

[cyan scaffold]

Yeah so in order for people to then be able to run your project you do add one of those pyproject.toml or requirements.txt files so they can set up an environment themselves

[compact loom]

okay got it thank you

[somber osprey]

spare me

( I tried searching for myself )

[young flare]

what have you been searching for?

[somber osprey]

What are variables in sys

[young flare]

like the list of variables sys has in it?

[crisp jay]

too slow

[somber osprey]

yeah but confirm that this term is general scientific one - like the audit I just learned about and proposal

I found both computer science and uhhm economics definition of that word

I do like elders

okay bye

I am very grateful

[young flare]

<@&831776746206265384>

[autumn pelican]

Then use selenium and bare with the side effects

[wise imp]

bare?

[autumn pelican]

Bear

[crisp jay]

im doing it

also should i make selenium download ublock using the official website or use wget to download it

[brisk token]

Are we only allowed to post questions on #❓｜how-to-get-help or if they're very short can we write them here?

[dry pike]

short here fine

[wise imp]

you can't post questions in #❓｜how-to-get-help

[dry pike]

funny

[brisk token]

Oh sorry I meant #1035199133436354600

[wise imp]

apology not accepted /s

[brisk token]

import pandas as pd
from scipy.stats import quantile

CL_Data = pd.read_csv(r"\NYMEX_CL1!, 1D_62cc5.csv") #removed file path

returns = CL_Data.close.pct_change()
pos_returns = returns[returns > 0]
neg_returns = returns[returns < 0]

pos_returns = pos_returns[pos_returns > pos_returns.quantile(.9)]
neg_returns = neg_returns[neg_returns < neg_returns.quantile(.1)]```

For some reason, `neg_returns` and `pos_returns` have the exact same index. Am I calculating something wrong?

[subtle coyote]

wow you can now react in python discussion

thats rad

[brisk token]

So basically neg_returns and pos_returns get the exact same values and index even though I'm trying to filter them by >0, and <0

[dry pike]

oh what, reaction time

why is there a comma in your file name 🤔

[brisk token]

That's just the file path formatting for the platform I downloaded the csv data from

It won't affect my numbers, my issue is that
neg_returns.index
and
pos_returns.index
Get the exact same value

But I filtered them...

[runic flower]

You probably want to name a column?

pos_returns = returns[returns.colname > 0]
neg_returns = returns[returns.colname < 0]

[charred tusk]

@runic flower is your site open source?

[runic flower]

Aha I see.

pos_returns = CL_Data[returns > 0]
neg_returns = CL_Data[returns < 0]

[runic flower]

Not yet, the codes been undergoing some amount of upheaval, I'll need to clean it up a bit first.

[charred tusk]

It's uh... huge
I'll ping you in OT

[brisk token]

I think my code may be correct? I rechecked the indexes they're not the same anymore after rerunning a few things, and even though the statistial stuff are the exact same

Positive Continuation: 38.46%

Negative reversion: 38.46%
Negative Continuation: 61.54%```

As the output, I think that's just a coincidence.

I think I just didn't rerun everything by accident, mb

Thanks for your help guys

[ocean ridge]

hi guys

im making an ide for python. #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval for sneak peek!

[wet burrow]

Hello guys

[autumn pelican]

What is ublock for?

You'd probably just install the extension and add it to the web driver configuration

Or I suppose downloading it once through the WD would work as well

[placid ether]

@inland karma if you're up for doing it today, please say either here or in DMs

best in DMs as I might not get a notification otherwise

[crisp jay]

for making selenium not use 4gb of ram

[fervent pewter]

Hi i'm new at python

[hallow umbra]

Hype train into achieving a master's science degree at Kyiv Polytechnic Institute in the next 2 years! 🥳

[fervent pewter]

Hi

Does anyone know how python works?

🥹

[harsh swallow]

In what way do you mean?

[fervent pewter]

I have 0 knowledge of python and i'm interested in learning coding

🥹

[jade roost]

I usually don't recommend using videos for learning programming. But it shouldn't matter since you're a complete beginner. Try picking up a tutorial from YouTube.

[pastel sluice]

!res

[edgy kraken]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[pastel sluice]

Try something from the resources list

[frail scaffold]

what should l use

[jade roost]

As I've said, any tutorial from YouTube should suffice.

Or try out the book, "Automate the boring stuffs". I've heard good things.

[frail scaffold]

But you dont recomment yt instead what do u recommend

[fervent pewter]

Python is difficult?

[fallen yoke]

no

[jade roost]

Oh you meant in that sense. Of course I would recommend a book.

[frail scaffold]

Why a book instead of a tutorail

[fervent pewter]

Do u make money with python

[jade roost]

Quite the opposite, actually.

[frail scaffold]

well u can if you want

[pastel sluice]

<@&831776746206265384>

[fervent pewter]

How?

[jade roost]

I personally don't prefer learning from videos because when I try to learn a certain project, they do things in ways that I don't prefer doing. Just a preference.

[fervent pewter]

I think coding is nice

[jade roost]

Maybe learn the basics for now instead of thinking how you'll use that to earn bucks.

[crisp jay]

wdym

[fervent pewter]

I will

[jade roost]

Ignore it. They're probably shitposting.

[gaunt badge]

!kick 1326652614519029873 No, try again. Read our #rules before.

[edgy kraken]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied kick to @fallen yoke.

[glacial ginkgo]

whats up chat

[jade roost]

Teeny Peeny, lmao. What a name.

[frail scaffold]

So books and docs mostly or?

[jade roost]

Yes. Or a mix of both. Doesn't really matter as long as you learn.

But for absolute beginners, I'd say videos are just fine.

[frail scaffold]

yeah for sure

[frail scaffold]

what books though

[glacial ginkgo]

I also find I learn more by reading and working through docs.

[jade roost]

@frail scaffold Here you go.

[jade roost]

I concur. Documentations for the win.

[frail scaffold]

yeah tutorials are passive and boring

[frail scaffold]

Do u think tutorials are passive and boring ?

[wise imp]

well, if you just watch them, I can definitely see how they might feel that way

[jade roost]

They're... alright. I mean, there are some really good ones.

[glacial ginkgo]

I mean, I like to listen to and watch tutorials in the background while I do other stuff. It is good to get a primer that way before digging in. Data with Baraa really helped me through a lot of concepts but nothing has been as good as turning off wifi and sitting down with a learning project and some downloaded md files + the sdk.

[silver plover]

People can be passive. It's about what you do, not what you use

[silver plover]

What do you think?

[frail scaffold]

Yeah true honeslty for me l cant stand step by step tutorials even books

[frail scaffold]

Very true

[frail scaffold]

Id rather think and break the problem into smaller parts and try and solve each myself

[silver plover]

Some tutorials I like. This one is good: https://numpy.org/devdocs/user/quickstart.html

[fervent pewter]

I kinda read the person who send me a message

Why did he delete it?

[jovial onyx]

hello

[golden mortar]

I accidentally pasted something that was in my clipboard but that I didn't intend to send here. I meant to send this:

• Automate the Boring Stuff is a really good book for complete beginners and it's free to read online.
• If you prefer to watch video tutorials Corey Schafer's playlist is also really good.
• I also recommend Harvard’s free online course CS50P: Introduction to Programming with Python.
• Python Programming MOOC 2026 is an alternative online course with lots of integrated practice problems you can do directly in the browser.

[jovial onyx]

ooh

there is reactions now

thats cool

[clever axle]

Yo I'm in y11 and I wanna be a software dev but I only know python and I wanna learn another language but I need to balance it with school though yall got any advice?

[jovial onyx]

just start

[golden mortar]

There's no point in learning multiple languages just for the sake of it. You're much better off just making more projects using Python, of gradually increasing size and complexity.

[timber bolt]

Hey yall What are your thoughts on coursera courses for python

[clever axle]

Oh ok thanks

[golden mortar]

I don't think they're necessary. There are a lot of good free resources.

[jade roost]

You're better off mastering one language. Migration gets easier when your foundation is strong.

I, on the other hand, tried Java as my second language after python when I was still a beginner. You could try looking into that if you want.

[timber bolt]

Even if the free sources don’t give me certifications? Or does that no matter

[golden mortar]

They matter very little.

[gloomy radish]

guys what does “snek” mean?

[jade roost]

Context?

[jovial onyx]

its a tag

[gloomy radish]

the server tag of this server

[clever axle]

Oh ok thank you

[jovial onyx]

snek sounds like snake

python is a snake

[autumn forge]

like snake but cuter

[gloomy radish]

🐍

[jade roost]

It's just a tag. Meant as a joke since python is a species of "snake".

[timber bolt]

Like how about when I look for a job. If I don’t get certs how can I prove I have knowledge. I know people say having a portfolio helps but can’t anyone just copy stuff and make up a portfolio?

[gloomy radish]

it looks cool i will take it on my precious profile

[jovial onyx]

I dont think certs are worth much and making projects are more meaningful for resumes and help your skills more

[golden mortar]

Honestly, it's extremely difficult to get a job without a degree.

Is there a reason you can't go to uni and study CS?

[gloomy radish]

i got the “precious” snek tag

[glacial ginkgo]

Im kinda struggling to pick a new learning project now. I have a solkd handle on syntax, oop, control flow, error handling, data structures/data structure manipulation. Idk I got started bc I have an ai homelab but I dont care about the ai stuff now that I understand it better. Just cant come up with anything to get excited about.

[jovial onyx]

!kindling

[edgy kraken]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[timber bolt]

College is too expensive. Don’t really
Have time for it either. That’s why I took the cert path so I can do it on my own pace

[jade roost]

Try making a game. It's really easy to pick up and quite fun too. Check out the pygame library if you're interested.

[frosty oriole]

The expense part can be done using grants, loans, scholarships, or a combination. Most universities will have a financial aid office to talk to.
Putting in the time is just something you need to do. The other people applying for the jobs you're applying to will have put in 4 years of university, you need to as well

[granite wyvern]

Should we be suggesting pygame-ce instead of pygame across the board these days? Asking as a non-pygame user.

[gloomy radish]

i am in my new home with no electricity how can i charge my phone without powerbank or nthg

[wise imp]

in my biased opinion, yes

[jade roost]

Shoot. My bad. You're right. CE is the better and most used version.

[frosty oriole]

unfortunately we haven't figured out a way to generate electricity from thin air yet

[jovial onyx]

depending where u from try community college its cheaper

[wise imp]

we haven't?

what about dense air then

[autumn forge]

I'd say so. It avoids problems with installing it on more recent versions of Python

[frosty oriole]

i guess except windmills

[golden mortar]

Well, there's wind power.

[frosty oriole]

though i dont know how well they work in thin air

[timber bolt]

Unfortunately I’m a felon so won’t be able to get financial aid and stuff like that

[jovial onyx]

try community college

[frosty oriole]

yeah i dont know what to tell you about that

[gloomy radish]

you guys didnt, i tought python made that possible

[jovial onyx]

nah only rust has that feature

[gloomy radish]

i am installing rust on my phone

[jovial onyx]

[glacial ginkgo]

do you have 50 potatoes, 100ft of 20ga wire, a usb cable, a soldering iron, and some basic electrical tools?

[crisp jay]

transform the heat of your body into electrical energy

[timber bolt]

That’s why I thought going for certs would help but if it’s the same as taking free courses then I won’t bother paying for the courses. Just wanted some feedback from the pros

[granite wyvern]

A gas powered soldering iron I presume?

[wise imp]

a soldering iron?

[fervent pewter]

Thank you so much!!!!

[manic flare]

Do you have a couple of hundred dollar bills to pay for the electricity?

[gloomy radish]

not 50 potatoes but 20 i have a usb cable that is from usbA to usb lightning

[granite wyvern]

Or just to burn, to drive your tubine?

[gloomy radish]

WE DONT HAVE ELECTRICITY YET

[frosty oriole]

certifications and free online courses are essentially worthless in the SWE field. previous related experience is the most valuable, with degrees as a second

[golden mortar]

Sorry to hear that. Not trying to discourage you, it's very possible to learn programming on your own, but it is a fact that the job market is very rough right now, even for people who do have degrees, so I just want to be upfront about your chances of actually getting hired.

[frosty oriole]

literally just go to like any public building

[manic flare]

Yeah, that’s why I asked if you had money to get it

[gloomy radish]

its 22:08

[frosty oriole]

and?

[gloomy radish]

everywhere is closed

[frosty oriole]

just go to bed then not having your phone charged for one night wont kill you

this is literally not even an issue

[manic flare]

Wait til morning 🧠

[gloomy radish]

then i have work

i charge it at work then.

[manic flare]

Wait til evening 🧠

[golden mortar]

Seems like you have no choice.

[wise imp]

thing is, we won't really be able to find out if it didn't actually kill them

[frosty oriole]

it is how it is

[gloomy radish]

what if my mobile data runs out do we have free no cc needed mobile data?

[peak relic]

You could eventually buy a hand crank powerbank.

[jade roost]

I have no idea where this conversation is going. Lmao.

Anyway, I'm off. Goodnight, guys.

[gloomy radish]

its going to the mountains

[wise imp]

"Man Dies in Mysterious Circumstances After Phone Runs Out of Battery and Electricity Bill is not Paid"

[granite wyvern]

Unliklely. But what's your data quota? If you avoid video, data is a lot lower.

[granite wyvern]

I took it that the electricity isn't yet arranged/connected.

[gloomy radish]

4GB

[manic flare]

Kansas City, Antarctica

[golden mortar]

Acute social media withdrawal syndrome?

[gloomy radish]

is it my storry

??!

[wise imp]

hope not

[gloomy radish]

good night guys, i will write here when i get to work

[wise imp]

ASthMWA

[fading valve]

Does scipy.optimize.linprog just not work at all for integer linear programming? It has an integrality argument that is ALLEGED to treat a variable as an integer, but in reality it just BRAVELY ignores this argument.

The documentation says that it uses highs (a C++ ilp solver) as a backend for ilp problems, but it returns floating point garbage. This happens if I let it default to highs or manually specify method="highs". Eg:

A_ub = [[617700, 1234977], [-7069232, -14133623], [1757440, -57677832], [4694092, 70576478]]
b_ub = [0, 0, -1, 9444371]
lsoln = linprog(A_ub[-1], method="highs", A_ub=A_ub, b_ub=b_ub, bounds=(None, None), integrality=1)
lsoln.succes: True
lsoln.x: [-2.61384659e-07  1.30737094e-07] # scholars will note these are not integers
lsoln.fun: 7.999999999989568

Is there a way to make scipy actually do this, or do I have to use a different library?

[gloomy radish]

[gloomy radish]

is this c or python?

[fading valve]

scipy is a python library

[gloomy radish]

okay 👍 i dont know

[wise imp]

well, that doesn't make for an exciting headline
we must imply the poor guy was also... poor

[gloomy radish]

thats me

i am poor

[glacial ginkgo]

a game does sound fun. I had an idea to combine "learn by teaching" with programming by making a teaching rpg. Like your "class" is literally instantiated as a subclass of your character and you have to write functions to attack, move, and use your inventory (which is a list you have to instantiate after unlocking). Idk.

[manic flare]

Interesting

[fading valve]

I think I'll try PuLP (different python library) instead, it really is so stupid that scipy has an integrality flag but it's just completely broken, like, why not just remove it if it does not work 🤔

[gloomy radish]

guys please ping me after i go to sleep i want to wake up to notifications

[robust ledge]

Do it! Love games like that.

[wise imp]

@gloomy radish are you asleep yet?

[gloomy radish]

no i sleep in 4 minutes

[manic flare]

How will we know when you fall asleep?

[wise imp]

an rpg-7?

[gloomy radish]

i dunno i will get my phone of in 3 minutes

[unborn heron]

Y'all quick question

do yall think that making a DnD style game is possible

[wise imp]

yes

[unborn heron]

not much screen and stuff but mostly rp

I have a sick idea with some of the new stuff I learnt last class

[gloomy radish]

last 2 minutes

guys never forgett me

[glacial ginkgo]

that would teach different kinds of lessons

[gloomy radish]

😭

[golden mortar]

It's very possible. There's been literally hundreds of D&D-inspired games.

[gloomy radish]

DnD do not disturb?

[unborn heron]

I am thinking of a up to 8 players and i think i alr got how the player database can work

[glacial ginkgo]

like... the history of rpg games is just "somebody forked dnd"

[unborn heron]

Dungeons and Dragons

[wise imp]

namely to watch out for backblast, how to aim the thing, what else?

[golden mortar]

Mm, yeah, I think the idea of xp and levels originally came from D&D.

[gloomy radish]

goodnight

[golden mortar]

Yeah, it did.

[unborn heron]

depending on how you use the term level

cuz the first time it was used i think is tetris stuff

[manic flare]

Wait just a moment so we ping him so he’s definitely asleep

[unborn heron]

or yk the original pong

[golden mortar]

In the sense of level-based character progression.

[glacial ginkgo]

I think the earliest use was in working tools

[unborn heron]

then yeh

[golden mortar]

So all games with xp and levels draw on D&D indirectly.

[unborn heron]

also yall imma send a code review again i hope this time someone sees it D

XD*

[manic flare]

Ping

[glacial ginkgo]

https://www.britannica.com/topic/role-playing-video-game

[manic flare]

Ping

[glacial ginkgo]

u up?

[unborn heron]

Ping
Pong

[gleaming marten]

.offtopic

Goddang command fail

[steel whale]

just got a hall effect keyboard

[gray prawn]

Hi

[jade bone]

Hi

[pallid garden]

lol for some reason reactions are enabled

[autumn forge]

it is the latest and greatest update

[autumn forge]

#changelog message

[pallid garden]

oh hell yea

[rare tiger]

yay

[autumn forge]

now the pins are out of date

[craggy trench]

woah

[rare tiger]

I used SDL to make mine

wouldn't recommend making a widget toolkit in python though

[pallid garden]

from what i saw on linkedin, everyone and their grandma

bad joke, ignore me

[rare tiger]

Python isn't very fast, especially for something as complex as a widget toolkit

[rapid bridge]

GUI usually isn't done from complete scratch, since your operating system has some widgets built in, but sometimes people do just grab OpenGL or similar and get drawing - this can cause accessibility issues, break some input methods and such.

TUIs are pretty straightforward, swap the terminal to the appropriate modes, and do the positioning as required.

[rare tiger]

Yes, but it's quite slow

[cerulean ravine]

how fast do widgets have to be? What are yours doing?

[rapid bridge]

I've seen a couple people do perfectly serviceable TUIs and GUIs in Python

Batgrl, kivy for example

I do expect that work went into performance there that you'd perhaps get away with in C++, but it's definitely not a major obstacle.

[rare tiger]

75fps, I had a flexbox-like layout engine and css parser for styling

For fun mostly

I also know Javascript and I'm learning Nim

[pallid garden]

"60fps CLI in react"

[rapid bridge]

Yeah, you do have to talk to OS to open a window and draw on it

[oblique spindle]

The emojis are back? 🤩

[rapid bridge]

The OS also has e.g. a textbox that behaves "correctly" for the platform (text navigation, copy paste, special input methods and such)

You don't have to use it, but then it's usually polite to reimplement the native behavior

[stoic elm]

Hiii guys , is there free alternatives to cursor , Antigravity ?

If i do not ?

Thank you

[rare tiger]

I want to rewrite my widget toolkit it in Nim

[unborn heron]

I've never been this close to a headache but not a headache before XD

[rare tiger]

also it's just fun to learn something new

Yeah

Nim is compiled

so it's a whole lot faster

Oh yeah, I'll need to fix it lol

[pastel sluice]

I tried out Nim and was somewhat let down by it. The language compiles to fast code and it isn't hard to learn, but it's full of design decisions that felt compulsively quirky, and it's just not getting much uptake compared to, say, Rust. And the direction of the language is dictated mostly by one guy who is rather opinionated about it.

[autumn pelican]

YOOO

[rare tiger]

Really with programming in Python correctly you mostly should just be following PEP style guidelines wherever possible

PEP 8 is like 90% of the style guidelines

the others are just little things that are good to follow

yeah

[frail scaffold]

sup

[rare tiger]

not much

None of them lol, my CS teacher taught us PEP styling

[young flare]

i never had to read peps except a few specific ones

[oblique spindle]

I would rather use a formatter than write perfect PEP8 code

[young flare]

yeah formatters and linters help with it

but with time you automatically write on your own without their help lol

[rare tiger]

fair

No

[stone hollow]

quick question: i have a project im planning on working on but im unsure about how to do a specific part should i ask this in here or put it in python help. The part i need help with is a rather short thing

[rare tiger]

If it's a quick question you can ask here

but if it's more involved go to #1035199133436354600

[frail scaffold]

first google and try reading official documentatin

@pallid garden Your actually really new here

[crisp jay]

look it up the docs

[glacial ginkgo]

How would you guys go about writing a heavily sanitized code executor? I am running with my python-rpg game idea but I obviously can't just let players have raw execution. I'm thinking of something like parsing, linting the code for safety, running it a separate process with try-except soup, and then checking if the results are valid with the game rules and then just comparing the new value to the game state and updating the game state. This way the code has to work, can't crash the game, and still does what it is supposed to? Or am I overcomplicating this?

[pastel sluice]

This isn't an easily solved problem. Sandboxing Python is inherently difficult

[rugged barn]

That seems hard to do

[frosty oriole]

i think i'm missing context here but why does a game need to run arbitrary user code?

[glacial ginkgo]

Uh the idea is to make a game where players use python to write things they want to do before they can do them. Like their character "class" is literally a class, inventory is a list and they have to write functions to manage it and equip stuff. It's a learning game.

[surreal knot]

huh did reaction permissions change in this channel ?

[rare tiger]

yes

[raw bramble]

Wdym?

Omg

[crisp jay]

wait how do you read the output file of python -m profile with the -o flag?

[surreal knot]

only staff could react before

[raw bramble]

Yeah 🤩🤩🤩

[frosty oriole]

i see. maybe you design your game as a python library that users can call into?

[fiery yarrow]

ironically, this change actually reduces staff permissions

[zealous lion]

we can still flex image perms if we need to

[glacial ginkgo]

That's an interesting idea. I still need to figure out how to convert player code to game state safely tho.

[silent wave]

Applied for a data analyst role at cern 🙂

[unborn lagoon]

From stdlib, you can use the pstats module.

[frosty oriole]

you wouldn't need to worry about it

[languid notch]

How do I get the list to print out the tuples of the zip object instead of a reference to the zip object in #bot-commands message

[crisp jay]

thanks

[young flare]

dont use zip

[oblique spindle]

??

[unborn lagoon]

You'd need to iterate over the zip object for you to get tuples.

[young flare]

lst = [(c, r) for r in e]

[languid notch]

:hmm

[fiery yarrow]

the reaction restriction to pydis-and-discord-wide emojis did not apply to staff before. now it does. this may not apply to all staff, like mods or higher, but for us helpers, it does

[oblique spindle]

Ohh I understand, also how to become a helper?

[steady rain]

see #roles

[fiery yarrow]

perhaps you can answer that question, being a director, stel. are all staff levels no-external-emojis here?

[steady rain]

staff (with nitro) should still be able to use external emojis

[oblique spindle]

I just need a role with color , I'm scared of losing this color :(

Also when is this role getting removed?

[steady rain]

you can give us a nitro boost, or give us money on patreon for our prize chest.

[fiery yarrow]

isn't the aoc role usually removed come the first week of february

[steady rain]

we'll sunset the AOC stuff Soon.

[oblique spindle]

Yeah I was wondering that

[oblique spindle]

I mean I think it's easier to get the contributer role tbh , and I've no money :(

[steady rain]

the contributor role is the only one you can "work for", I guess

[ornate wren]

@glacial ginkgo You have check RLMS (recursive language models) they run repl with AI generated code and they do sandbox the code, you may look how they do it

[autumn pelican]

hi

[upbeat sleet]

The gym > python

[dusty ember]

who says you can't have both

[steel whale]

life does

[uneven harness]

can someone help me in #1475285983166595234

[upbeat sleet]

Yup

[swift sparrow]

I can see someone has already replied

[dusty ember]

i know people who're jacked and cracked

[autumn pelican]

i went to the gym once 6 years ago ask me if im joking

[upbeat sleet]

Programmers are sassy ( most )

And low testosterone

[pastel sluice]

@upbeat sleet You can stop trolling now, thanks.

[bright shoal]

you should join me and @slender urchin at Diamond Gym

[bright shoal]

3000 reps of rhabdo 🗣️

[charred tusk]

Aboo wake up you’re dreaming again

[upbeat sleet]

Such a flex ! 😜🤪

sassy boy 💪

[dusty ember]

it's best you listened to infinimata

.topic

[verbal wedge]

**How would you learn a new library if needed to do so?**

Suggest more topics here!

[upbeat sleet]

I’d just ask chatgpt how

And proceed

[autumn pelican]

??

[pastel sluice]

look at the examples, copy one, build on it until it matches my needs

[bright shoal]

I have a question, check #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval

[autumn pelican]

dude i was the 0th percentile BMI for my age range

[autumn pelican]

read the docs

[crisp jay]

by looking at docs/good tutorials (im looking at you tkinter)

[pallid garden]

what do you think an interviewer might ask for a python fastAPI interview

[crisp jay]

what async does

[pallid garden]

specifically asyncio?

or just async in general

[crisp jay]

probably in general

take my information as a grain of salt

[verbal citrus]

maybe what kind of middleware is appropriate for certain scenarios?

[short solstice]

@uneven harness take a look at this message for detailed resources

[pallid garden]

ive no idea im going to have to look it up

[verbal citrus]

yeah that's going to be something i'd ask probably

[unborn adder]

Remember, no ChatGPT.

[charred tusk]

🤨

They’re taking my AIs!!

[charred tusk]

So… you’re a corpse?

[autumn pelican]

yh

[steady rain]

The lightest person alive for a given height is the one person who's the 0th percentile, I would think

And the heaviest is 100

[random bronze]

do ya'll use coding agents for programming?

[surreal knot]

no

[random bronze]

never ever?

[crisp jay]

no

[glacial ginkgo]

Not anymore, but only because I'm still very new to programming and actually learning how to build the little stuff I was vibing has helped make me better. I still don't think I want to 100% vibe but I plan on eventually using ai completions to speed up my work once I'm confident I really know what I'm doing.

[verbal citrus]

i do nowadays for web design stuff that i hate doing

[random bronze]

lol

i hate web too

[rare tiger]

No because that removes the fun out of programming imo

[velvet trout]

Use it when you're an intermediate, not for vibe coding, but as an Assistant and code reviewer for bugs / optimization areas.

[ornate wren]

vibe coding seems to good to launch a quick mvp

[random bronze]

huh? i use it for vibe coding aswell lol new models seems to work fine for basic use cases

like making dashboards and other stuff or similar complexity slightly harder even!

[random bronze]

do you tell it how to structure the code or how you will be running it or what dependencies to use or purely vibe coding?

[vale wasp]

1st and 99th percentiles.

[random bronze]

i also think i'd need to build a habit of reading lot of ai written code 😩

[vale wasp]

Not if you paid me.

[ornate wren]

having specifications, the tech stack, your prefered libs is nice since you can add them to the prompt

[steady rain]

If you're heavier than 100% of other people, that's the 100th percentile, is it not?

[crisp jay]

just do a saas man

[vale wasp]

Percentile is from 1 - 99. It's weird.

[ornate wren]

you can have 0 percent right?

[random bronze]

yes but then im not sure if its "vibe coding" bcz.. when you're vibe coding you shouldn't care about Anything.

and just seeing it work

[slow rivet]

well the term is very poorly defined

[random bronze]

???

[crisp jay]

whats 0% of something

[ornate wren]

nothing

[random bronze]

wht does saas have to do with this 😭

[vale wasp]

0 percent, yes. 0th percentile, no.

[slow rivet]

some people use vibe coding to mean fully ai generated with no technical input from the user, some mean vibe coding as in just using ai for most work, some call using ai at all vibe coding

[crisp jay]

bro doesnt know

[random bronze]

Karpathy <- person who coined it, said you shouldn't care about code at all when you're doing it

[ornate wren]

Yeah i'm not sure, if its a project that you do not want to throw it to the garbage quickly, you will have to maintain it in the future so you may care about the tech stack, the libs, architecture

[random bronze]

the heck are you on about 😭 have you ever actually shipped anything? i still don't know what does saas have to do with what we're talking about.

[ornate wren]

You can still vibe your way into the mvp, but you may add guardrails for best results

[orchid pier]

Coding too hard bro I still don't know def broo

[crisp jay]

just do it

[random bronze]

!d def

[edgy kraken]

def

8.7. Function definitions

A function definition defines a user-defined function object (see section The standard type hierarchy):

[random bronze]

do you speak english 😭

[crisp jay]

ngl they should change def to fun

[crisp jay]

as my second language

[velvet trout]

Well, yeah, to be specific, it depends on context.

[random bronze]

thats one of the most stupid things i've heard from someone lol, why would they do that 😭 ?

[crisp jay]

because its fun

[long tangle]

What the fuck is object oriented programing

[ornate wren]

everything is a object

[long tangle]

Huh

[random bronze]

no need to worry about it tbh

[cerulean ravine]

are you in a frame of mind to learn about it?

[slow rivet]

basically a specific way structure your projects

[crisp jay]

basically you have a thing with information and "methods" (actions)

[random bronze]

why do you ask?

[long tangle]

Yeah bro

[ornate wren]

Can we de debate oop in this channel or its a heated subject? @cerulean ravine

[vale wasp]

OOP is a method of combining data structures with the functionality that they need.

[crisp jay]

its like if c structs had the possbility to add functions in them

[cerulean ravine]

we can talk about it, not sure it will be a debate.

[random bronze]

we've been bundling data like that since before OOP was a thing, whats so "oritented" about it?

[vale wasp]

Why would it be a heated subject?

[ornate wren]

Because mostly definitions of oop are deadly wrong..

[slow rivet]

oop is actually kinda poorly defined, the definition has shifted a lot over the years. Tho python is generally considerd to be very oop heavy

[vale wasp]

You can add functions to C structs. Sort of.

[random bronze]

wym sort of?

[crisp jay]

because its an abstraction of the world,you can see that everything is an object (irl),with its own attributes and methods that interact with eachother

[vale wasp]

You can add pointers to functions to the struct and then when you instantiate you need to actually point them at the desired functions.

[ornate wren]

OOP was not classes or methods (modula, c++ style that has infected every language), it was about objects that could change their own state based on MESSAGES that they could comply or not

[crisp jay]

im pretty sure there is an academic paper thing about oop

[slow rivet]

right, and methods are a very ergonomic form of message passing

[vale wasp]

Was there an issue with my definition which does not mention either classes or methods?

[cerulean ravine]

"messages" was how Alan Kay first talked about it, but that is not the way people talk about it now.

[vale wasp]

The concept evolved, as many things do.

[crisp jay]

can we make functional programming the new meta?

[velvet trout]

def means define, it is used to define (create) a function, a function is just a block of code which you can call more than once however you like. A function takes some inputs (called as arguments) and returns a value, a function is called by its name with () (called as parenthesis)

example:

def add(number_1, number_2):
    result = number_1 + number_2
    return result

result = add(2, 3)
print(result)

You can call the function add with different inputs as many times as you want. In this case, the function helped you save the logic of addition of numbers in a single place without needing to repeat the same addition logic whenever you repeatedly need it to add numbers.

[ornate wren]

C structs with methods is just an improvement or a evolution of the Module concept, with iinheritance (bad) and interfaces (implementation definitions, nice)

[crisp jay]

tldr; its like math functions (y = ax + b)

[velvet trout]

Real.

I prefer to expect the learner as knowing literally nothing, and be as explicit and english as possible, that's why i even used explicit long variable names over abbreviations.

[ornate wren]

A functional core and imperative shell maybe, deterministic / pure functions

[random bronze]

thats an expression not a function

f(x) = ax + b
or if you want formal mapping
f:x -> ax + b

lambda x : a*x + b

[cerulean ravine]

has this helped at all?

[orchid pier]

Idk this bro I don't understand bro

[vale wasp]

What don't you understand?

[orchid pier]

No bro

[random bronze]

yeah you gotta have an actual usecase example like that don't usually click anyway

[orchid pier]

Surprising bruh everyone else would of understand by now

[vale wasp]

Please don't call me "bro". If you tell me what you don't understand, I can see if I can explain such that you do.

[random bronze]

its totally normal not to get it at first lol

[crisp jay]

you know how to solve a quadratic equation? (or at least remember)

[velvet trout]

Could you clarify what exactly do you not understand in this?

First of all, relax your mind, do not think you wouldn't understand or this is scary or anything that is negative.

Re-read what i wrote in the message, see the first word or a few words together, then come back and look if you understand it or not. Note down what you did not understand and i will help you understand it.

[orchid pier]

No

[random bronze]

not sure hows that related to the use of def

[orchid pier]

Bro I was coding for like 3 weeks and 4 days now

[random bronze]

all good

[random bronze]

what were you coding?

[frail scaffold]

Guys I am overwhelmed by the amount of options l have

[orchid pier]

I made a quiz type game

[random bronze]

nice

[crisp jay]

you know how to get the area of a triangle?

[rare tiger]

how so?

[orchid pier]

No

[velvet trout]

Tho it's helpful for those individuals who have done math (assuming they're fine or fluent with it) to learn programming from a mathematical perspective and similar analogies.

[random bronze]

what part did you struggle the most with?

[orchid pier]

Def bro

I wanna learn it

[random bronze]

oh how do you know its a thing in python? who told you that

[crisp jay]

ngl programming is very similar to math,thats why i like it

[random bronze]

?????
are you just saying random things??

this is #python-discussion

[orchid pier]

I was reading the online python compltior book

[crisp jay]

im trying to learn him how to use functions by approaching math

[ornate wren]

Functional programming is very like math, i don't find the multiparadigm programming languages we have today to be like math

[random bronze]

you don't need def to measure the area 😭

[orchid pier]

How long did it take u to learn def?

[steady rain]

A few minutes.

[swift sparrow]

Don't worry about comparing yourself to others

[orchid pier]

My brain is this slow bro taking me hours I don't know still

[crisp jay]

keep going

[vale wasp]

def is just a keyword that is used for defining a function.

[random bronze]

you don't need def for any of the things you've said above

[crisp jay]

you will get it,friction is the part of learning things

[cerulean ravine]

this is why you should stop asking questions like this

[orchid pier]

I ain't spending 10 days learning def

[steady rain]

I think you're probably deliberately self-sabotaging at this point.

[crisp jay]

tell me something that you know from math

[orchid pier]

What does that mean?

[rare tiger]

Basically, you use def to define a resuable block of code that can return data back. For example, you can have a function that multiplies an integer (number) by two and returns it back for use later or in the moment.

def multiply_by_two(input):
    output = input * 2
    print(f"{input} times two is {output}.")
    return output

number = 4
multiplied_number = multiply_by_two(input=number)

[orchid pier]

1+1 = 2

[crisp jay]

its easier for me to explain using it tho

[velvet trout]

Yeah, I don't think Mellow is one of those people in my message. And programming in Python, at beginners' level, IMO, is more explicit, easier than writing the equivalent or similar in math.

[waxen hazel]

hey guys
ideas on how to get chatgpt to read a problem effectively and meet all its requirements?

[cerulean ravine]

that sounds off-topic. this channel is about Python

[orchid pier]

Explain it more simpler bro

[rare tiger]

I can't tell if this is ragebait or not at this point 😭