#[Official] Alteration Help

1 messages · Page 2 of 1

thin garden
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Very much a "chaotic good" roguish type. All about stalking, hiding, ambushing. I don’t like “ornate” and over the top things. Im a very simple person. The weapons are housed in separate thigh sheaths. I do like the idea of the weapons being more magical in nature, especially with their GEF flares and the awesome zests that come with them and how they change your physical appearance (examples below):

Kontii raises his kelyn gladius and a gout of flame explodes outwards from it, tapering off into several different streams that encircle him in a blazing inferno that roars with the fury of a million burning stars.  Kontii's eyes suddenly take on a hue as black as coal, and soon after the blaze fades away into the air.
You see Kontii Slie'Phox the Bodyguard.
He appears to be a Human.
He appears to be in the prime of life.  **He has fiery deep black eyes ** ```
*(My eyes are normally hazel)*

I also wonder if there was a way to incorporate the lesser moods ambients into them (will have to post those in the morning, as I'm half asleep already).
thin garden
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And the dagger's cool stuff

As you draw an oak-handled faenor misericord, luminescent slivers of electricity slither along the blade.
>raise my miser
You raise your faenor misericord into the air, causing a whirling zephyr of intense blue light to wreath itself around you.  The energy builds in intensity like the heart of a thunderstorm until your entire body is cloaked in the blazing aura.  Slowly, the maelstrom subsides with a barely audible rumble, but your eyes feel strange and tingly.
Roundtime: 6 sec.```
thin garden
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Perhaps is there someone who can help out this into words for me? 😇

A4E75B58-B69B-4018-A674-DA30185FC676.jpg
thin garden
modest matrix
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a double-edged blue-black dagger with runes of death and destruction

stuck fossil
stuck fossil
# thin garden

A gold-inlaid <material> short-sword with a ruby pummel

quick trout
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a twilight blue starsong dagger treated with a rainbow sheen

thin garden
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For the fire shortsword (fire GEF).... since it's kelyn, want to stay with one of it's more natural colors... thinking something like this:
A matte black Kelyn coustille etched with three glowing sigils
the sigils being a direct connection to the actual abilities/ambients/zests of the blade, which i'm hoping makes it a legal alteration
As Kontii draws a wide-bladed kelyn gladius, three tiny orbs of blazing flame swirl along the blade.

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for the dagger (lightning GEF).... i'm thinking something like this:
A wickedly edged faenor dagger with luminescent veins
With the luminscence being a direct conncetion to it's actual abilities/ambients/zests...
As you draw an oak-handled faenor misericord, luminescent slivers of electricity slither along the blade.

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And now this is where you kind folks crush my hopes and dreams and say neither of those are even remotely legal.

lyric atlas
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You cant have luminescence.

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There are alchemy potions that allow you to add similar effects when handed to a GALD merchant. Check out ‘dye additives’ on the wiki

verbal swan
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you can have glowing as a dye additive. Don't see why you can't change that to luminescence.

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hell, get one of those mushrooms and extract that.

broken wave
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I'd take a glowing and ask for luminous etc. It's worth asking at least

coral aspen
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You can't have luminescence. Dye additives are the only way to add glowing, and it has to be specifically a glowing color, because dye additives will only work in dyes otherwise.

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So you can have "glowing (color) (whatever)" but can't be "glowing (whatever)".

thin garden
coral aspen
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If we're specifically looking at the glowing red sigils, yes, 100%. I don't know about the weapon noun offhand because I'm not on the wiki page for that.

thin garden
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yep! and thank you! the sigils is what I was hoping to verify. The coustille was straight from the short sword wiki for acceptable nouns

coral aspen
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Coolio!

thin garden
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would i need to bring something red with me, or just the vial? (was able to find one already)

verbal swan
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I think you get a vial of red dye and dump the glowing in it.

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but I'm not sure.

broken wave
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You used to need to pre dump but I believe you can now get the color of your choice and just bring the additive

coral aspen
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What Archsenex said in a much more succint way than I was about to.

thin garden
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got it... thank you all. Trying to be prepared!

broken wave
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I should make more additives soon.

coral aspen
broken wave
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EG season is good to be prepared.

thin garden
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When you reference the dyes.... do you just mean standard dyes from a dyers tent?

verbal swan
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the additives are alchemy.

broken wave
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Additives can be added to any alchemy dye. The tent dye converts to alchemy dye, and converts cobbling dye to alchemy if needed as well

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Yeah, dye additives are a distinct thing

thin garden
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ah, got it - i need to find an alchemy dye.... I found the additives
You remove a vial of glowing dye additive from in your archer's tool kit.

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is a dye like this acceptable? I see it's also included in the alchemy dye page:

You inspect the red vial of dye and the creator has provided the following information:

This is Dyer's Tent dye that will dye items red by a clerk at a Dyer's Shop.```

https://gswiki.play.net/Alchemy_dyes#Dark_red_dye
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Also - by chance does anyone have backroom access to the cobbler in Cysaegir that I could commission to grab me a silvery dye?

image.png
verbal swan
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Lemme ask on the crafting server.

broken wave
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If this is for an alter, you don't need to bring the dye. Just the additive

thin garden
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indeed, that's what it'd be for

broken wave
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If you want to use the self service dye system, then you need a dye and no merchant

thin garden
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got it - definitely for an alteration

stiff rose
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the only way to use glowing additive in an alter is to get glowing black runes of death

modest matrix
novel aurora
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I am trying to come up with some ideas for the custom settings on calling cards, but I don't really know what the customizations look like. Does anyone have an example with custom settings? ```Custom Settings
Custom Calling Card Article: Not Set
Custom Calling Card Setting 1: Not Set
Custom Calling Card Setting 2: Not Set
Custom Calling Card Setting 3: Not Set

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I am just not sure how they appear on the card is all

ocean pelican
novel aurora
onyx wing
# 
 Custom Calling Card Setting 1:  @~}~ Healing, Heroics, and House Calls ~{~@
 Custom Calling Card Setting 2:    ~ Fancy Shoes & Clothing, and Chrisms ~ 
 Custom Calling Card Setting 3: Shop at Arkati Aided!  Ebonwood Way, Landing!```
daring canyon
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Are all merchants who offer alterations able to alter a day/nightbringer weapon? Or is this gear something like Animal gear where I need to look for a specific merchant?

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Specifically asking because of premium Sunday triple merchant spooky GALD thing.

coral aspen
verbal swan
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I would take your weapon and ask whoever gets you (should you get spun) A) if they're comfortable working with it, and B) if A is no, if you could wait for someone who is, and as always, C) take an alternate thing or two just in case.

daring canyon
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Thanks both of you.

flat matrix
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I know I've done day/night before, but it will vary from person to person based on comfort level, as Xeraphina said, and also other factors -- for example, we may not have time for something complex and we limited our session to easy things, etc. It never hurts to ask when it's your turn, and always have a back up, as Vyrshkana said!

For GALDapalooza specifically, btw, (the OOC term for the reasonably regular premium merchanting I and a few other GMs do), most of us will tackle anything that is allowable. That does include animalisitc gear, btw -- there are things that are Avaluka-only, but not everything is.

tacit ermine
# daring canyon Are all merchants who offer alterations able to alter a day/nightbringer weapon?...

Clarification on Animalistic gear: If you want the ANIMAL SPIRIT changed in any way, you need Wilkes or one other merchant (who I forget). But if you want the look of the weapon/armor/headdress itself changed, any GALD merchant should be able to do that - like if you want to change "some black double leather" to "some rainbow-hued hunts embossed with a screaming goat across the chest" ( ⬅️ please don't actually make this )

flat matrix
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I could see a few characters with that armor

tacit ermine
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I can too crying that's why my plea not to make it

thin garden
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Yessss. I didn’t envision my bard in animal gear until this very moment.

flat matrix
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the one i'm really thinking of already has armor that has like a backflap on it with a lot of rolton-themed things I've done....

tacit ermine
daring canyon
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One more question….if I do a Sadie scroll for the day/night will that be overly complicated? Since I really don’t know how the fields interact in the first place?

verbal swan
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I honestly wouldn't use a Sadie scroll for a weapon that changes attributes constantly.

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that sounds like a recipe for getting stuck.

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But YMMV.

coral aspen
coral aspen
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... unstick?

daring canyon
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Yah it’s just that the weapon seems to do a gazzilion things and then you switch it to dark side and it does a gazzilion more 😂

wanton garden
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If you don't want it to exist in the universe, don't think it up!

thin garden
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okay... so setting asaide Traiva's WONDERFUL alteration she added to my queue.... curious to hear ideas on improving this one as well...
I have a grobey scripted bracer/buckler (so it transforms into a bracer to be worn, and then into a shield/buckler)

Bracer form: A dark villswood bracer wrapped in vivid wavy grains surrounding a knotted glowing bull's-eye
Buckler form: A dark villswood buckler with vivid way grains surrounding a knotted glowing bull's-eye at the center

I really like the concept of a "mirrored" style buckler, but i feel like that's not appropriate, since this is a villswood material.
Would it be inappropriate for it to be a mirrored metal surrounding a villswood piece of knotted wood in the center? Would and idea around that get insta denied?

lyric atlas
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you can always add adornments. Its covered under the alter rules. As long as its clear the material is villswood and not the adorning materials, you should be fine

thin garden
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Bracer form: A dark villswood bracer wrapped in vivid wavy grains surrounding a small reflective xxxx sigil.
Buckler form: A dark villswood buckler with vivid way grains surrounding a polished mirrored xxxx.

debating what kind of symbol of sigil i want on it

slender epoch
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Screaming goat so it matches your upcoming armor obviously.

frozen sierra
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I dunno where we put wedding/knitting requests anymore so:

Designs: Gauntlet, sparrow, hand, veil, fan

Colors: Mahogany

Fabrics: The new wools, starsilk

frozen sierra
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Also, all the new flora/fauna from TL/TN docs would be welcome too for wedding books.

timber fiber
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Design: herb

hasty berry
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Does anyone know if the base description Alteration rules are different from the 15/15/15 for a standing tent? And if so, what those are?

frozen sierra
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It can have a long, not a show. It always has to be a tent.

hasty berry
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Great thanks! 100% has to be the noun “tent”?

frozen sierra
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"The standing version of the tent may be altered with a long description, but not a show. The description must include "canvas tent."

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but if you want it fancier you can make like...a silk-draped canvas tent set on carved ebonwood poles or something

hasty berry
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Great thanks! Must have skipped over that, I only read the room alteration guidelines

tulip sorrel
brittle coral
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This tropical tree is a towering beauty whose trunk is studded with short conical prickles that make its trunk difficult to climb. Limbs part off of its upper reaches, where a lush, high-crowned canopy is created by the long-stalked dark green leaves. Bright orange pumpkin-shaped capsules hang from above, each surrounded by dried out husks where counterparts have exploded as they grow overripe and germinate the area.
Leaf – a long-stalked dark green leaf
Bark – a curl of red-sheened bark
Twig – a twisted sandbox tree twig
Fruit – a bright orange pumpkin-shaped capsule
Thorn – a short conical prickle
Flower – a monoecious red unpetalled flower
Flower – a white sandbox tree flower
Flower – an unpetalled white tree bloom

tulip sorrel
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amazing

proud sonnet
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Saw this, thought it might help ppl

lament aspen
proud sonnet
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Oh that was fast. Yay I helped! 🥰

stiff rose
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Some of my favorite alter design-adjacent links:

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I welcome others to share their favorite links!

frozen sierra
lament aspen
lament aspen
frozen sierra
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Also, I won't link directly but "A Game of Clothes" blog is fantastic if you know what Game of Thrones house your character would be in and want some "free" inspiration.

modest matrix
frozen sierra
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How do you get the hat to talk?

modest matrix
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Think naughty things

tulip sorrel
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I have another tree request pretty please. A Rainbow Eucalyptus.

brittle coral
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Oh, I did one of those before.

tulip sorrel
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Aww, ok, I'll keep looking.

frozen sierra
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a contured,rainbow,eucalpytus
The circumference of the tree trunk is grooved by large contours as the medium-height eucalyptus branches out into a canopy of vibrant, waxy green leaves. Long strips of bark have peeled away from the trunk, revealing a kaleidoscope of pigments that brighten the environs. Unearthly blues and purples are mixed in with shocks of red and orange with tints of yellow and green present.

tulip sorrel
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So beautiful

frozen sierra
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Leaf – a vibrant waxy green leaf
Bark – a strip of rainbow-hued bark
Twig – an iridian-woven twig
Thorn – a sharp prismatic needle
Flower – a cluster of milky white flowers
Flower – a thin-spoked ivory flower
Flower – a warm-centered alabaster blossom

brittle coral
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(Is this the one we built last year?)

tulip sorrel
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Is it in prime? I wouldn't want to take away from someone's unique item. But if it's in another instance, that would be an amazing addition to my pool.

frozen sierra
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This is the one I made up right now?

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I would never steal an alter design. Unless I saw it on an NPC. Then dibs.

brittle coral
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Oh, I thought maybe it was one you created and were sharing

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I didn't mean to imply you store it.

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er stole

frozen sierra
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Oh nah. ❤️ And it's all good, I have def ripped off enough of your NPCs clothes to be considered an alter thief.

brittle coral
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haha

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Its the highest form of flattery.

opal urchin
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I'm assuming that anything firewheel related is off limits for forage prop?

frozen sierra
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Probably. I haven't tried to get anything "rare" but our MHO was denied a glowbark in their space.

opal urchin
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Thanks Kiki.

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Do you think Bonsai is off-limits? Could my tree be a: stout ghostwood bonsai tree? or stout,ghostwood,bonsai

brittle coral
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For a foraged item prop? It would mean making sure that you know it is small instead of regular size, which would mean no bark, no grass/moss.

opal urchin
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Oh, interesting. Got it.

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The richness is 🔥

broken wave
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I'm debating trying to make a tree for a bungalow, was wondering if dwarf would still be small enough to have but still get bark/twigs etc.

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like a dwarf cherry tree etc.

brittle coral
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Yes.

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I allow it for dwarf trees, but if it is potted no grass/moss

broken wave
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cool. guess that's one project for Merchant week

opal urchin
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Otherwise, does the description basically need to suggest it is growing inside the property?

frozen sierra
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Nope.

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You can put it in a pot, urn, planter, etc

brittle coral
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Unless it is a tree or bush or ground cover. A potted dwarf tree is allowed.

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We get super fancy with our very careful word placement sometimes.

broken wave
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yeah, I was thinking like the dwarf citrus frankentrees you can have to have every citrus fruit on your porch in one package

brittle coral
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Unfortunately, all foraged item props can only have one fruit.

silent vapor
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Question I'm totally asking for a friend:

  1. If it is provided, can plinite be used in an alteration?
  2. Would I be allowed to alter a piece of plinite for use in Deck the Halls items... if I don't like the color? (It's not dyeable - believe me, I checked.)
coral aspen
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ALTER 43 says no. It has special properties

silent vapor
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But my world domination plans!

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... does ALTER 43 also apply to altering the chunk of plinite itself to make it prettier?

coral aspen
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I can't say. While it specifically calls out Rift gems in this, it will likely need to be revised to account for any gem that has special properties.

broken wave
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I imagine it's determing if "had something else inside it" was a special property

timber fiber
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I have a question about the forage prop! When it comes to evergreen trees that do not flower, is it possible to use those settings for the seed cones instead?

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I'm thinking something along the lines of:

a vert-leafed, cypress, tree ~ Tall and slender with a stately silhouette, the cypress stands as an evergreen sentinel reaching high into the sky. Glimpses of weathered bronze bark can be seen through the feathery, blue-green foliage and clusters of tiny silver and copper-colored seed cones nestle within its lush, needled branches.

Leaf: a spray of soft, feathery vert, needles
Twig: a thin dark, bluish-grey, twig
Bark: a curl of, scaly bronzed, bark
Mushroom: a fuzzy-capped, ivory white, mushroom
Flower: a spherical, silver-scaled, cone
Flower: a small, copper-colored, cone
Flower: an unfurled, blue-grey, cone
Moss: dense, bright green, moss
Scent: Earthy and refreshing, the invigorating aroma is light and herbal with hints of pine and citrus.

Am I understanding it all correctly? I don't want to waste a merchant's time 😊

modest matrix
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#alteration-help message

Items appropriate for inventory locations for leggings and gambesons can now be converted to the dedicated inventory slots.

Leggings, stockings, hosen, petticoat(s), and underskirt(s) can be converted to the legging slot.

Gambeson, undershirt, chemise, and shift can be converted to the gambeson slot.

In each major town, you will find in the clothier or general shop a mist-filled silver bowl. Placing a wearable item into the bowl will reveal some information about how the item is classified under the new system and, if it is eligible to change slots, will allow you to update its slot.

Let's say I have a metamorphic SHIRT and I alter it to an UNDERSHIRT and then convert it. Is it going to wipe the metamorphic script during conversion?

I vaguely remember the script on leggings getting wiped during conversion.

@lament aspen ❤️ ty, hot ping because I can't reply to the original message.

(I need my clothing to layer better because I'm tired of using sort, Yes, I have a shimmer trinket.)

brittle coral
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Would you mind emailing me that so I can look at upgrading it?

timber fiber
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Sure!

brittle coral
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Its a makes sense situation.

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Also, so I don't forget again.

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Can you send me a separate email about the Dragonfly Title for you and Missoni?

timber fiber
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I couldn't find examples of evergreens so thought it best to ask

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Will do!

brittle coral
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By the time I get home from day-job ,I start running through my to-do list and... straight out of the head.

timber fiber
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I know that feeling ❤️

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Don't overdo it and take care of you too. COVID can wipe you out for a long time yet

brittle coral
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Yea... its .. been exhausting ... I ended up going to bed a little after 9 last night which is so unheard of for me so I am trying to be careful.

broken wave
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Oh, yeah, thank you for asking about cones. I could go for that over flowers too.

timber fiber
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Emails sent

lament aspen
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Well undershirt has a typo so it won't work at all currently 😭

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It doesn't, but hypothetically a merchant shouldn't turn a shirt into an undershirt because we have the undershirt separate slot now

modest matrix
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Hot take: There shouldn't be a shirt slot, and there should only be an undershirt slot where all shirts/blouses go, so they layer properly.

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ty for checking tho

timber fiber
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What if I want to wear a shirt over an undershirt though?

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Pop those collars!

modest matrix
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This the 1400s, women aren't allowed to wear shirts.

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Now if we change the genre to high fantasy from whatever weird concept we're not really abiding by currently, I'll allow it.

brittle coral
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undergown goes in the undershirt spot, dress goes in the shirt spot

modest matrix
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Sure and then when you wear cloth armor (robes - which can be many nouns), nothing layers correctly, because it switches locations back and forth constantly.

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We need an under armor, but above undershirt slot I guess that auto-layers beneath armor.

My goal is container over armor over shirt.

I have the meta shirt. I would script swap it to an undershirt slot item. But there's no script swap at EG. So that leaves me with trying to alter the shirt into an undershirt, and then converting it in the chamber, and then altering it back into a shirt?

brittle coral
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So... the biggest container you'll get in the layering system is maybe 2-3 lbs. The order is over-the-front (vest, bodice, apron, etc), shirt, undershirt. All of those slots do not have major container storage at all.

modest matrix
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The issue is caused by having armor and shirts occupying the same space with flag layer on.

You can sort auto head - and the armor/shirt slot will switch places back and forth.

stiff rose
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I usually sort my armor to a different spot after sort auto head, so I end up with over-the-front > chest (non-armor) > undershirt, with armor typically either right before over-the-front or right after undershirt.

hasty berry
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Is Kraetian a valid word (when describing an item) or does it need to be Kraet. Ie A Kraetian Widget or A Kraet Widget?

lyric atlas
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Are twigs from foraged item prop trees considered alteration fodder? Like could i use a twig as fodder for something like turning my scabbard into a different wood type?

frozen sierra
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Probably as an adornment but not changing the material

modest matrix
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What twig are you using, unless it's a rare material you don't need fodder and I don't think the foraging system has rare stuff

lyric atlas
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I dont know, more or less seeing whats out there

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My scabbard needs an upgrade

stiff rose
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There are a couple foraging item props out there that are rarer trees, such as the Lasimor one in Mistwatch. I believe it has a cooldown on how frequently it can be harvested for resources, though.

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For what it's worth, I have used witchwood sticks that were foraged as fodder before. They're in very limited places in game, though, so again.. a bit of a constraint on how often the material can be generated.

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(I usually go for runestaves first. They drop like candy at DR.)

coral aspen
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You'd need a significant amount of twigs to change the overall material.

verbal swan
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hands over 50ct jar full of twigs

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(This was a joke.)

opal urchin
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Use the firewheel twig to create a firewheel tree forage prop — firewheel tree promulgation and infinite fodder.

coral aspen
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This is a forum and I can't gif like I want to right now.

verbal swan
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...Bugs Bunny saying NO?

opal urchin
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I didn’t make the rules.

modest matrix
coral aspen
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That's called merchant shopping

modest matrix
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Cool. Don't ask for 2 twigs if I hand you 1. (Nobody else does this/requires this.)

coral aspen
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Logistically speaking, a single twig is too little to do much of anything beyond making a ring, maybe a bangle, or a couple of beads.

opal urchin
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Do any material merchants exist? Like, they bring their own fodder, and will only make things ghezyte, but they charge a lot more for it?

modest matrix
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If a player asks merchant A to do something and they deny it, and then the same player asks merchant B to do something and they approve it, and then asks merchant C to do the same thing and they also approve it.

It's not the player who is in the wrong and maybe merchant A should re-evaluate how they're merchanting/interpreting the rules/if they're having a bad day and need to take a nap.

coral aspen
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There are plenty of merchants who will specifically deny requests on something if the request is for something that they do not have enough material for. There is a reason there was specific limitation on "medium bolts of elesine" vs. "large bolts of elesine".

modest matrix
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For rare/limited materials, yes. I thought we had already established that. Which is why I asked him, what he's trying to do.

coral aspen
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The question itself implied that it was a rare/limited material. If you hand a merchant a twig for a common material, then that twig shouldn't even be accepted for alter fodder.

modest matrix
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I mean, maybe he's roleplaying in this roleplaying game.

coral aspen
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Firewheel = rare/limited
Maoral = common, no fodder needed.

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We're not debating roleplaying when it comes to alter fodder.

modest matrix
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I didn't think you could forage up any rare material, so this whole scenario is weird.

broken wave
coral aspen
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Forage item props are not the same as foraging. As Shan noted, there is a lasimor tree that has time limits for getting pieces off it, however not only is it timed, but I'm fairly certain it was mentioned that the pieces from it cannot be used as alter fodder. Additionally, as Shan noted, you can forage for witchwood sticks (and likely the only one that I believe can be actually foraged), but those are considered rare enough that if you need to provide them for fodder, you need to provide enough so that it make sense for what you are requesting.

modest matrix
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Sure, this goes back to situations like, how many lor runestaffs would you like to make me a door/table. And that's going to be a variable # depending on who you ask. It all seems a bit silly to me. I provide you with the word, you give me the word in exchange, even if you're "in theory" giving me more of the word than I give you.

flat matrix
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As an FYI, with the new alter fodder items, they will typically have an analyze or at least GM-facing instructions on how much it should be used for. For non-"alter fodder" items being used as alter fodder, some of it really will be dependent on how stringent a particular merchant is. If you are told definitively that this particular stick or something has size limitations, then continuing to ask other merchants would definitely fall under merchant shopping.

If, however, the merchant just is not wanting to take it because it isn't enough, I do recognize that where we as individuals draw a line can be different. If you want to ask another merchant, it's best to clarify though, so it doesn't give the appearance of merchant shopping. For example, "Hey, another merchant said I needed at least 4 of these, but I've heard time and again that others get it done with 1 or 2...are you willing to work with this?"

I would never consider that level of honesty to be merchant shopping, but after asking another one as a gut check, further asking may also be considered merchant shopping. Just FYI.

We all operate off this: "The quantity of material supplied should match the amount of embellishment requested" -- that's from ALTER 41. The subjective bit becomes where each of us will draw the line. I agree that 1 twig of something is not going to cut it for doing something like changing "a wood scabbard" to "a witchwood scabbard" for example. A handful of twigs or at least a couple witchwood rods? Sure.

We do strive for consistency, but there are definitely going to be some differences.

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It's one of those really hard areas on our side too, because we know it is a player dissatisfier if we err too far on either side of the median.

modest matrix
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If we're going to play the "you didn't give me enough" game, then I want some of the material back when I give you "too much" of it.

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There was an idea, I don't remember how long ago, that we could stack/save units of material. And you deduct units from us during alterations. I vaguely remember @lyric atlas suggesting it?

flat matrix
#

Also, certain extremely rare materials have explicit directions that they don't get made "of" that item but are adornments upon the item when provided as fodder, just as a reminder.

lyric atlas
#

Yeah, i did, but the apparatus kinda handles over half of my idea from the time

wintry turtle
#

If I remember right, I was unsuccessful. 😄

flat matrix
#

/suppresses tip joke

modest matrix
lyric atlas
#

The part i liked about my idea from the time, was that a single shield or runestaff would supply more fodder than a twig

wintry turtle
#

This conversation is a good reminder to stock up.

lyric atlas
#

So there was value there. Id buy a weapon of a rare mat if it meant it would give me fodder for several items

#

But a 400k somnis scabbard is like…chill

modest matrix
#

I think it could work, but someone would have to define how much material is required for each noun.

  • Ring - 0.1u
  • Bracelet - 0.5u
  • Something else - 1u
lyric atlas
#

Yeah. That was my general idea

modest matrix
#

I'd support that idea. But not this, one twig, two twig system. It's arbitrary.

lyric atlas
#

Transparency and clarity from all merchants so that no one felt incentivized to merchant shop

#

I personally felt it would help merchants too. Clarity for all

quick trout
#

Consistency would also reduce the likelihood that I skip going to certain merchants entirely.

lyric atlas
#

There is also the thing where i go buy fodder that im supposed to be asked for, and the gm doesnt ask

#

Its like…i do appreciate it, but if i didnt need it, i didnt want to spend on it

flat matrix
#

(I am guilty of forgetting to ask sometimes...sorry for contributing to the issue!)

#

Merchanting is busy, and it's easy to miss something, lol

lyric atlas
#

But i obv dont know

flat matrix
#

It's an interesting idea, for sure!

#

Not one I'd code, LOL

#

I'll stick to fluff and not things that require math

wintry turtle
#

I truly don't mind if you don't ask, not so much because I don't have the materials but because I want to make things quicker. Exchanging a bunch of fodder during busy sessions can slow up the works.

lyric atlas
#

I understand that side of it

#

I do worry about buying something expensive and getting little value out of the fodder personally

coral aspen
wintry turtle
#

I haven't had that issue with the stuff known to be bought as fodder, like arathiel beads. With things like lor runestaves, it has sometimes been inconsistent.

coral aspen
#

I have definitely been on the receiving end of that plenty of times and having to point to rarities and ALTER takes more time than just having the fodder ready.

lyric atlas
#

I can see that side of it too

opal urchin
#

Can I ask a question? But where did fodder come from as a concept? Does it enhance the game or serve some useful purpose? Is it in pursuit of realism?

lyric atlas
#

Im a fan of fodder personally. I find fodder a satisfying loot chase

modest matrix
wintry turtle
#

Total guess work on my part, but I think the idea is to keep certain things relatively rare when you see them out and about. If the world has only 100 things made out of gold, for instance, and you keep that number steady by requiring the consumption of a gold item to create a gold item, gold is still rare.

opal urchin
#

I guess merchants used to be scarce, but as they became more common, had to introduce elements of scarcity to it?

verbal swan
wintry turtle
#

I hadn't thought about it that way, but that makes some sense, actually! All alterations used to be vanishingly rare. I mean, I counted myself lucky if I got one or two in a year.

modest matrix
#

I do think some things should be rare, but what is considered rare and what is actually rare is ... not accurate.

verbal swan
#

coughglaescough

modest matrix
#

If I can find it, in unlimited quantity via the treasure system. It's not rare.

lyric atlas
#

And DR ruined alot of that

modest matrix
#

I'm okay with you creating actual rare materials, and requiring me to provide it.

verbal swan
#

forget the treasure system. If I can find it in unlimited quantities so long as I shovel silvers at a regular non-special event shop, it's not rare.

modest matrix
#

But stop calling not rare things, rare, just because in the 1800s it was classified as rare, but the game doesn't actually support that classification

lyric atlas
#

Ive spent 4k shards on fodder already this run

opal urchin
#

Not that my opinion matters, but I think I’m in agreement with Alastir.

I feel like the whole point of alterations is it help us build the world around us in personalized amazing ways. And fodder feels like a barrier to that. But then again, I don’t find value in collecting it either, it just feels like storage management stuff to me.

modest matrix
#

I will need to stock up before the end

tulip sorrel
#

Add fodder to the collectibles system! Turn it in and forget it until you need it.

wintry turtle
lyric atlas
#

Rare alter fodder needs to be all over the system. Rare critter drops. Etc

modest matrix
#

The problem is that it's not easily accessible using that system.

lyric atlas
#

The treasure system is a snooze as is. Its all ‘silver’ or ‘silver with extra steps’

modest matrix
#

I thought about suggesting a copy/paste of the TICKET system and the rare fodder is different currencies. So you can deposit/withdraw.

lyric atlas
#

The apparatus does that pretty cleanly

#

You just need things to drop in Alter Fodder form

opal urchin
#

I think I’d rather just see merchants that specialize in rare materials… you want glaesine alter… YYY merchant is your person, and it will cost 14m silvers.

lyric atlas
#

Until the merchant leaves the game because the gm left staff. Or they have off hours. Or they are the 8am zul merchant

#

Im totally ok with fodder but the game needs to generate it organically

opal urchin
#

Fair point — I guess maybe I’d like to see merchants that specialize in rare materials, in addition to fodder.

lyric atlas
#

I dont mind a ‘pay me buckets’ and ill make you a somnis trinket

wheat zodiac
#

If some materials weren't rare we wouldn't want them as much as we do, that's half the draw. It's for showing off.

Now where's my rosesilk 👁️

lyric atlas
#

Rare is fine. Unobtainable is pretty meh for me.

#

Disir feathers are rare drops and i promise the game isnt swimming in them

modest matrix
lyric atlas
#

The ‘you need a bunch of these’ is definitely asking for trouble. Because if someone gets ‘a bunch’ for a pile of silver (or cash) and thats not honored…

frigid grove
modest matrix
#

May as well throw it out here... I'm looking for assistance in creating some sonic armor. I'll choose the ASG of the description I like the best, so it can be robes, which opens up a ton of possibilities? I prefer a long description.

I'd like something that uses light/darkness more than sound. https://gswiki.play.net/Sonic_alteration
I'd really like something that describes movement.

My initial concept is something like this, but I'm open to other suggestions.

image.png
verbal swan
#

a voluminous robe of tattered shadowy grey rags

modest matrix
wintry turtle
#

Do you have the option of making it IACL where it also describes something about the wearer's form? I'm not sure what the limitations on sonic armor are.

#

If so, then something like "a penumbra of drifting fabric wound about his form" might work.

#

"Penumbra" is a good word. So is "umbral." Hmm, an umbral array of shifting fabric...

modest matrix
# 
>sing
You sing a melody.
[No valid armor type was specified.  Defaulting to ASG 6.]
You begin singing and focus your voice into a vortex of air centered around your body.
[Creating a swirling sonic barrier around you equivalent of ASG 6.]
Sing Roundtime 3 Seconds.
>remove barrier
You can't remove that.

It can't be held, so there might be some leeway there.

#

penumbra is a great word tho! As is umbral.

#

This is the help I need. I'm going to leave it open for a few days to mull it over. But I'll give rewards to any idea, partial or full, that I end up using!

opal urchin
#

Liminal wisps of windswept cloth

stiff rose
#

an umbral shroud of windswept skeins of shadow

#

could probably use 'rippling' in there instead of either umbral or windswept

modest matrix
#

Thanks for the additional ideas!

Just to clarify my, I'll give rewards statement.

I'll be paying out 10 million silvers in total, so feel free to toss out as many ideas as you'd like.

I would also be open to a Ghezresh-themed design. https://gswiki.play.net/Ghezresh

onyx wing
#

an indigo and silver swirl of light and shadow that wreaths the form

verbal swan
#

Question: Would either display or vault be an acceptable noun for a Gem Caboodle?

modest matrix
#

I like vault let's go with that

onyx wing
#

Miniature vault

#

a portable safe.

broken crescent
broken crescent
brittle coral
#

This page already existed, but I added a table. I can't maintain this table and someone may need to make it prettier but this is what I can do for now.

brittle coral
tacit ermine
#

this is so handy! Thank you!

modest matrix
#

Probably better to ask here than in HH & ToT.

Taesssaet - Typo? (3 sss)

I've never heard of some of these materials.

coral aspen
#

The majority would have been in recently released documents with new materials. I believe Thandiwe included links in the table

lyric atlas
#

Some are still missing, but what a great chart to have! Sortable by type is amazing too, because it helps me think of new ideas I hadn't before

flat matrix
#

Add what’s missing!

coral aspen
lyric atlas
#

I can try...when it breaks, I warned you!

brittle coral
coral aspen
modest matrix
#

Can we talk about the huge list of changes that happened last december without announcement/discussion

lyric atlas
#

I think there were several conversations around those changes in several different places. i recall being part of a few myself

wheat zodiac
#

According to that chart aqilorn does not need fodder and while I'd be quite happy if I missed something and that's not true, I think it's probably an error?

coral aspen
frozen sierra
#

Do we have anything outside of just "patterned batiste" akin to toile or Toile de Jouy in Elanthia?

brittle coral
#

Let me check, I think toile is allowed.

frozen sierra
#

Okay, I did a wiki search and couldn't find it but it also doesn't push out "toil"

brittle coral
#

toile Any of various transparent linens and cottons.

#

You can use toile

frozen sierra
#

Thank you so much!

opal sedge
#

a macabre armored-figure earring bound within a dark-spoked crystalline wheel

Would this pass muster?

stiff rose
#

I'd remove both hyphens but otherwise it seems okay to me

opal sedge
#

The hyphen in the wheel is a rift gem. Not sure that one could be removed.

#

But ty for feedback

stiff rose
#

oh yeah, that makes sense for it!

broken crescent
#

I'm probably overdue for this, but I could use some help. I have a warrior, who I think of as sort of a knight errant (with a little mercenary mixed in). He has some nice things, but is short on a look.

I had the good fortune to catch a GALDapalooza and a generous host for my cloak, which I'm very fond of:
a bearskin longcloak mantled with a ruff of dark fur
And I did a Sadie scroll for my "good stuff" pouch:
a waxed canvas hip-satchel (with a show: The waxed canvas hip-satchel is plain, but finely stitched, with well-applied wax to keep the contents safe and dry.)
I'm quite happy with those two: they're what I'd like to build around. I have a backpack, a satchel, and some full plate that need work. (And other assorted stuff, but if I can get those three nailed down, I think I'll be happier.)

Any suggestions?

lyric atlas
#

Do you have a figure from movies or fiction you would use as inspiration?

broken crescent
lyric atlas
#

Is he an everyman soldier, a heroic knight-in-training, etc

broken crescent
#

Much more the everyman soldier. The "knight errant (with a little mercenary mixed in)" is really how I think of him. He wanders, is open to the idea of being heroic, but frankly spends most of his time just taking jobs.

lyric atlas
#

any background to the character?

#

Sounds like the sort of guy who would have been a knight...if life didn't happen...he has skills and he uses them to get by

broken crescent
#

That's how I see him, yes. Not much for background.

frozen sierra
#

a tiny hammered silver sword pendant strung from a braided leather cord, <armor> under a quilted dusky cornflower cotton gambeson framed in scuffed leather, a pair of slate blue linen trousers hemmed in crossing black stitchwork, buy some boots from a cobbler

broken crescent
#

I like those very much. On the edge of nice. But as Ptolemy said, life happened.

#

(The alters are nice. I meant the gear presents as nicely made, but worn.)

frozen sierra
#

Your dude needs some color on him.

broken crescent
lyric atlas
#

Even if your 'background' is ....'Ted would have been Sir Ted one day...but he could never get the dirt off his shoes or the blood off his blade', that is often plenty to start forming a 'vision' for how your character looks. Then, like you point out, leaning into those adjectives that seem to indicate not so much that the clothing and gear is 'worn, scuffed or brushed'...but more that the character underneath those is.

stoic sparrow
#

Sounds like Bronn.

lyric atlas
#

There you go. WWBD?

wintry turtle
#

I kind of like that idea of leaning more on texture than on color, and I very much see his Vibe as wearing well-made gear that has lived a life. So with your alterations, I think I would go plain, almost utilitarian items that detail their wear and tear. I'm getting a picture of earth tones and dun hues. Function over form, but we'll crafted and shaped to the wearer's needs over long use.

verbal swan
#

I've done some with, like, etched designs that are almost worn away.

opal sedge
#

A career soldier or adventurer might also have quite a few items that incorporate beasts and creatures they've faced over the years. I'm a fan of using natural materials sometimes too.

#

Leather boots that have been mended or reinforced with a caribou hide for example

#

stag hide shirt with a collar ringed by orc claws and troll teeth
some fitted stag hide trousers fringed with orc claws and troll teeth

A shirt and trousers my GoS giantman wore

frigid grove
#

For the armor you could indicate that it has been used but is still taken care of. Scratched but polished, for example. I also sometimes completely leave off color from my wardrobe because I'm moderately color-blind in real life and have trouble enough matching in the real world

wheat zodiac
#

Does anyone know if the older scripted pauldrons (like the ones that were digging prizes at Caligos) can be "pauldron" singular rather than plural?

#

You analyze your elk hide pauldrons and sense that the item is largely free from merchant alteration restrictions, but the creator has stated that "The item has restrictions on changing the noun."

lyric atlas
#

I'm pretty sure yes...I think I had one altered up for a gift into a single pauldron and then also had it ez scripted

stiff rose
#

If it's already scripted, it can't have an ezscript applied to it.

lyric atlas
#

I might have used a different one then

lyric atlas
#

Question on Vethinye.
So we have starsong, which is the combat metal. And Starveil which is the fluff metal.

Is there a different name for 'vethinye' in its starveil form? or is it vethinye either way, and the distinction is in starsong/starveil

#

So like if I make a 'starveil ring'. Cool. Can you make a 'vethinye ring' out of starveil fodder?

broken wave
#

I think vethinye and starsong are the interchangeable combat names, and starveil is the fluff name, and there's no crossover, like vethinye is the term only for armaments, so all jewelry in the material is starveil.

#

All ots example of non combat were strictly starveil

lyric atlas
#

yeah that was the question I was trying to get at. The documentation doesn't seem totally clear
Starsong/vethinye are going to be interchangeable for alteration purposes on items made out of vethinye that are combat items.


Properly worked by Inyexat forgers, vethinye's natural properties are enhanced and strengthened, and it becomes suitable for the rigors of combat-oriented items. Worked this way, vethinye may also be known as starsong.```
#

I'm not sure if that means...its ALL vethinye, but you can only call something starsong if its a combat item

#

or...its only vethinye WHEN its a combat item

#

It says 'vethinye' is the ore...and ore is not a combat alloy, obviously. So dunno

broken wave
#

My read is that the process of making it safe for jewelry usage makes it starveil specifically

lyric atlas
#

right, I'm just wondering if the Erithi name for it changes

#

or if the erithi don't have a name for 'starveil

#

nm. Found the answer in the bottom of the OOC notes on the culture doc

Vethinye refers to both the base ore and the final starsong product.
Starveil requires alter fodder to use. It cannot be used for weapons, armor, shields, and armor accessories. It is used for jewelry and adornments only (such as inlays on items), and the name is always starveil, not vethinye and not starsong.
So you can have "a starveil bracelet" or "starveil earrings" but for other items it would be like "starveil-inlaid gauntlets" and such
Starsong/Vethinye are only for use as weapons, armor/accessories, and shields. Additional combat information forthcoming.```
#

vethinye is indeed combat only

flat matrix
#

Okay good, you found it. I was pretty sure I'd addressed all that! And yes, I'm sure the erithi and Inyexat have terms for starveil in their own tongues, but sometimes less is more when throwing 8 million new terms out, so I didn't come up with ones!

stiff rose
#

As someone who likes new terms, I very much appreciate that approach. It's very easy to reach new word fatigue.

verbal swan
#

I cannot tell you how many wiki tabs I have open because I had to look stuff up for the bazillionth time.

opal sedge
#

a suit of stygian rusalkoren platemail featuring erratic caligninous whorls of azure

Anyone have suggestions? I wanted to call out the natural azure swirls of rusalkoren but not in love with the above.

onyx wing
#

swirled in|by erratic whorls of azure?

#

WOAH, there's a feature I didn't expect. you can type s/oldword/newword and it will fix your previous message

spare timber
#

whats the common format of a veola hairstyle request? something like this make sense?
<hair> layered in a scales-like pattern that erupt into <description>

#

with description being the veola with item in or out?

supple minnow
#

That's fine, or just add <hat> or <thing>, we can usually figure it out with the rest of the alteration.

frozen sierra
#

I usually give it as <item>

#

<hair> wrapped around <item> in a cluster of thick, large braids

wraith oracle
#

Vanah did a little primer once:

! <adj>   =  Placeholder for the adjective and noun of inserted item
! <noun>  =  Placeholder for the noun of the inserted item
! <a/n>   =  Used to tell script that you'd like it to handle inserting a correct article
!            ("a" or "an") when template uses either <adj> or <noun>

Examples: 
a black velvet tricorn with <adj> buttons
         a black velvet tricorn with <a/an> <adj>-buttoned white cockade
         a black velvet tricorn with <a/an> <noun>-beaded veil
         a black velvet tricorn adorned with <full>

You can toss s after <adj>s or <noun>s to pluralize it```
#

That text looks remarkably like script comments btw 😉

spare timber
#

oh nice thanks all

lament aspen
#

That's not quite what he was after though but for the hairstyle there's no similar placeholder so anything goes

spare timber
#

lets be honest, my request is going to be a nightmare even if there was simple instructions. I need a sign that says "please be patient with me, I'm still learning Veolas"

supple minnow
spare timber
#

normal: A pair of green ceramic horns
short green ceramic horns
Hair : <hair> layered in a scales-like pattern that erupt into <item>
insect/aquatic: A pair of green ceramic horns topped by <a/an> <adj>
gem/button: a pair of green cermaic horns pierced with <a/an> <adj>

don't need too many fancy side options because its mostly just to make Corpip look more dragon-like in his features

supple minnow
#

Go full dragon.

spare timber
#

lol that would be a good gimmick but Corpip isn't the sales person

#

I wonder how goofy the alters on the shop keeper can be... like if "Gnome dressed in a dragon costume" would fly so I could put Corpip to work selling things

lament aspen
#

I wasn't able to fix what I broke on Veolas yet so don't freak out if stuff isn't changing

broken wave
#

You feature crept too far and too greedily and now it's all coming undone?

lament aspen
#

I pushed an orc ear in and it went in the flower side

#

And I clearly didn't test my fix

stoic sparrow
#

Orcs are plants confirmed

supple minnow
spare timber
#

taking suggestions on this as the new EG charm theme for this year sold by Yetdim:
(a/an) (adjective) wheel charm featuring an upside-down (dye)(material) figure in the center. | (a/an) (adjective) wheel charm featuring an upside-down (material) figure in the center.
The wheel of misfortune

#

working on getting some sounds finally added to my charm sound maker too
maybe a custom adjective of "modulating" ? - dopplering? whats a good word to describe how a sound is altered by spinning?
With a template of "screems of glee/fear/etc"

low veldt
#

Is it considered a relatively standard GALD service to have the appearance of my SK tattoo changed? Just trying to plan ahead for EG

opal sedge
#

a diaphanous auroralaen bliaut veiled in a fall of starveil-wefted mesh with a clinging sheer elesine chemise that shrouds the contours of the hidden form underneath
Had a lot of fun with the dramatic drapery and new illegal clothing

spare timber
#

spluttery - as an adjective for sound. Seems to be a real word, any reason it might not be allowed?

opal urchin
#

Ghostwood does not need fodder, correct? Just the leaves?

frozen sierra
#

Correct

opal urchin
#

Thanks Kiki.

tulip sorrel
low veldt
#

Thanks! So I need a tattoo merchant, and one in particular that’s willing to do it - got it 🙂

quick trout
#

There was a doubt from a merchant about permissibility, so I am asking here for QC approval to alter a Bugs on Parade Bug Jar from: "a copper-lidded blown glass jar" into 'a copper-lidded bug jar'. Thanks.

brittle coral
#

Was it the "bug jar" part?

quick trout
#

I believe so, though I don't understand why. There are cookie jars and candy tins and cigar boxes and all sorts of similar concepts around the game.

mossy mist
#

Anyone want to design me a super neat tent? 🥺

scenic fog
#

Anyone here done custom spirit servant or know of any? I just want to see what people have come up with so far to get some general idea of what works.

stiff rose
frozen sierra
mossy mist
# frozen sierra go on what's the theme

It's keeping my band of gnomes warm in the hinterwilds, so it's got to be cozy. Druidic/nature/wolf/avian/bone components all good. Nothing gaudy, simple is good.

frozen sierra
#

a squat artic white canvas tent framed in dusky warg pelts
[Den of the Artic Moon]
Arcing branches of rough hewn spruce cross over each other to form the domed ceiling, crude runic carvings covering each bare limb. Irregularly shaped strips of hide and pelts surround the walls, providing shelter from the outside world. Bedrolls of patchwork fabric and rolled pillows surround a tiny stove, druidic tomes and whittled peripats strewn about carelessly. Hanging from the center peak are a series of carved bone disks supporting tiny votives. The area smells heavily of herbs and smoke. (Custom scent)

mossy mist
#

Brilliant. Thank you!

vapid quail
#

That is beautiful

#

Now I know who to get to design mine, sitting in my locker for ages

frozen sierra
#

I love designing tents. The only thing that gets tricky is if you want removable storage/bedding/lamp.

mossy mist
#

I was going to ask how those interected. Say I did have a bedroll and torch - what happens?

frozen sierra
#

In theory if it's done right when you have Hanging from the center peak are a series of carved bone disks supporting tiny votives. -- if you put a "torch" inside out Hanging from the center peak is an unlit/lit torch.

#

But I also welcome when Vanah comes back in the morning and tells me how wrong I am. >)

lyric atlas
#

If you want , i can dig up mine and send it to you. It included the template I was using to fit it all in

#

Even things like 'the lantern is lit, or not' requires thought

# 
A tiled parquet floor of anthracite grey teak fills out the interior of this stately tent.  The white canvas walls are drawn together by a latticework frame above a rug that dominates the interior.  At the rear, a stack of shipping crates rests near a tall mistwood side table upon which sits a model bone white frigate.  The faint scents of dried tea leaves teased with hibiscus fill the tent.  You also see a tent flap.
Obvious exits: none```
No placeables
# 
A tiled parquet floor of anthracite grey teak fills out the interior of this stately tent.  Hanging from the tent poles above is a latticework octagonal domed lantern lit with a burning Liabo-hued flame, which sheds its light upon a split-color rug of onyx and alabaster pashmina that dominates the interior.  At the rear, a stack of shipping crates rests near a tall mistwood side table upon which sits a model bone white frigate.  The faint scents of dried tea leaves teased with hibiscus fill the tent.  You also see a tent flap.
Obvious exits: none```
with placeables and a lit lantern
mossy mist
#

Excellent, I appreciate the examples. Thanks!

lyric atlas
#

in retrospect?

#

I would have never bought the garbage can

#

My shipping crates there are the can, but you can't remove it. It made designing the whole tent a little harder

mossy mist
#

Should the placeables be in the tent when it's altered? Do they get altered separately? Both?

frozen sierra
#

Nah - tent first, you can buy OTS inserts/furniture/bedrolls and get them altered to in there

mossy mist
#

Roger that.

scenic fog
#

All I gotto say is thank god for ChatGPT, I impulse purchased a spirit customizer and would have been hopelessly stuck without it.

scenic fog
#

can long descriptions of regular items contain commas?

coral aspen
#

They cannot

modest matrix
#

Is there a standard format used for when parts of the alteration are underlined? I've noticed different GMs underline different portions of the alteration.

I would ideally like all the items to be formatted the same way. So if you replicate an alteration, GM A doesn't underline some portion while GM B underlines a different portion (Using the same words in the same way/same description.)

scenic fog
#

I've also noticed this seems to be all over the place and also sometimes affects how you can reference the item in game.

modest matrix
#

How you can reference it in game is determined by the short (15/15/15).

a,piece of,equipment = touch piece equipment
a piece of,meh,equipment = touch meh equipment

#

I vaguely recall the underlined portion of a long is determined by $_ so I guess I can start throwing that in my whispers, but it would be cool if there were just a standard way of doing alters that everyone followed.

scenic fog
#

I remember having 2 items that had identical descriptions but were referenced differently

modest matrix
#

They have 2 different 15/15/15. The middle 15 always determines the modifier to the noun. If you leave it blank, the noun will be the target, but it will always target that item first, no matter if there is another item found in any location (ground included).

scenic fog
#

so the underlining is its own thing and not related to 15/15/15 then

modest matrix
#

Correct

scenic fog
#

Death Announce - How the Spirit Servant announces your death.
How do they normally announce it? I don't remember seeing that messaging before.

trail geode
#

they can do a flare or they can drop by people and tell them your name, it looks like this:

A faint green light explodes over the Ruined Temple. The light seems to spread over the sky in a palm leaf-shaped pattern before receding and ultimately fading from view.

or

A huffy volcano spirit zooms into the area and flits past you. As it does, a trailing stream of languidly hanging lava begins forming into a name next to the spirit. The spirit spells out the name, "Cleric".

scenic fog
#

I can see why it takes them time to develop stuff, this is more work than I expected.

lament aspen
#

If you are particular, you can specify

#

The tent discussion was accurate. The room description is built sentence by sentence depending on what items are present. Altered placed items and scents count toward the 511 character limit

#

The sentence containing the light source has three alternate options: no light source placed (you could include like a permanent one that's always lit here but you don't provide or light your own), a line for when you place a light source but it is unlit, and the a third alternate line for if a light source is placed and lit

#

You can use like <adj> and <full> for placeholders like in Veola, but it can't be pluralized. The sentence structure should presume one singular light source and one singular bedroll/chair. Alterations to make those plural will not read correctly

#

If you use <full> you may run into the character limit more frequently, but have more control of your room design based on your light source and bedroll alterations

#

I'll see the next time I fiddle with it (no timeline, teasers, or promises) if I can give you more control about what shows and what is in You also see.

lyric atlas
#

As advice, I can offer that i did up the tent interior description at first with all placeable so i would know that my longest possible descriptions would be within limits

modest matrix
# lament aspen If you are particular, you can specify

I am particular. I was recreating a set of alters I already had to keep a spare set in my moardrobe so my shimmer trinket model could make a look without having to dress/undress Alastir. But now I have the same description, with slight variations in the underlining. And I didn't want to take up more of the 2 hour time frame during the merchant session.

lament aspen
#

You will have better results if you add the request to the initial... request

quick trout
#

This sounds like me with the bug jar yesterday. I was trying to get my item so I could "get bug jar".

modest matrix
lament aspen
#

I want a battered dark leather satchel with a scratched clasp, with the hyperlinks around dark leather satchel or whatever

#

So we set it up the way you want the first time

#

Ain't no thing

modest matrix
#

I like your base adjective + noun, so you know what you're manipulating.

#

I feel like that should be standard operating practice.

#

Looking at the majority of my items, it seems the full 15/15/15 is what most people do, and then some people do the whole thing up to the noun, but maybe that's the default settings kicking in.

lament aspen
#

Try not to worry about taking up time to get what you want

#

We want you to walk away happy

#

Whether it's words we have to look up or where you want the hyperlinks to fall

#

But presume we are going to put it in the 'wrong' spot and ask up front

quick trout
#

It would be great if staff could suggest alternatives when they say no. Yesterday when I tried to get my bug jar altered and was told no, the merchant handed me back my item. So I left. If they had suggested an alternative or asked what I was trying to accomplish, we could have both walked away satisfied.

modest matrix
lament aspen
#

I was not involved in the bug jar thing so I cannot opine on the circumstances, I'm sorry

quick trout
#

Understood. I don't have anywhere else to share the feedback that it can be seen before the end of the festival, so this seemed like the best logical place.

lyric atlas
quick trout
#

The curious case of the bug jar has been solved, another merchant didn't have any concern with the request.

verbal swan
#

Personally, I generally ask "May I please have "long description", with a 15/15/15 of "word(s)/word(s)/noun, whatever other things like internal fields here?"

lament aspen
#

And if I don't do it to your liking, you ask me to change it

verbal swan
#

I do! cower

opal sedge
#

Boss Gnome

opal urchin
#

Do kauri trees exist in Elanthia?

verbal swan
#

do they exist on Earth?

opal urchin
#

Yes. Sorry, let me rephrase the question in a way to more likely to elicit a helpful response. I am interested in a kauri tree, which is the common name for the tree (agathis australis). The word is Maori. May I make a kauri tree?

broken wave
#

Is there a non Maori equivalent?

opal urchin
#

No (at least I don't think so).

broken wave
#

In common usage, not scientific

opal urchin
#

Localized to New Zealand.

broken wave
#

Possibly. They can be a little weird about stuff in that area

lament aspen
#

General rule is that it exists in the real world and doesn't have a name that's based on a real world place, it's probably fine

opal urchin
#

maori for "Lord of the Forest"

#

Seems like a nice tree for KF.

lament aspen
#

If you ask me for a word I don't know, I'll freeze like a deer in headlights, tell you to hold on, and then look on the GM resources and the player wiki to see if anything pops up. If nothing pops up, I generally don't want to be the first sucker, do will ask the GM Hive Mind

opal urchin
#

Makes sense.

broken wave
#

Doesn't look place based or anything

lament aspen
#

If no one answers, it depends on how easily I can tell based on Google if it is a real world tree not based on a real world language word

#

I may tell you I don't know and don't feel comfortable with it, and if you have an alternate youd be willing to use

opal urchin
#

Thanks Vanah -- this helps me understand how to work through it. I think I'll get sorted on a design slip and see how it works out. And, if it's a no go, I'll go a different direction. Appreciate everyone.

lament aspen
#

And in that case, where I am not sure, if you want to wait to see if the next merchant has more tree knowledge, that wouldn't be considered merchant shopping

#

It's when someone gets a firm no based on some ALTER rule or other firm guideline and have been told no and try to get someone to slip up and do it anyway that's the problem

coral aspen
verbal swan
#

Please note that if there's a place named after the tree you might run into trouble.

long niche
#

Diverse Drapes, Dapper Drapes, Drape Gowns Primer
Indres and Penelia will be back again to alter Drape-wear. Here's a primer, since people were very confused.
#1159200741374836849 message

frozen sierra
#

And if anyone wants help with a design, I'm happy to help you get prepped

long niche
#

Kiki can seriously rock out designs with these.

ebon saffron
#

I'm honestly not sure why two of my ideas "a bulky leather blacksmith's bag" and "a bulky leather tool bag" got denied tonight when the following have been sold readily OTS or were common prizes at various events during 2022-2023. a dark cotton jeweler's tool roll a leather smithing apron a wine red smithing apron an equine groomer's kit a brown leather groomer's kit a coral-clasped red locksmith's tool belt a stiff leather potion bag with a large brass rolton-shaped clasp a leaf-shaped red alchemical bag with a small black leather tie

My idea's seem to be just as descriptive and within the same vein as these so can someone please explain it to me?

lyric atlas
#

This came up recently in a forum post as well. How far can people go with 'professional/trade/craftsman descriptors on gear. There does seem to be an 'all over the place' standard on what is offered and what is allowed

frozen sierra
#

Does your blacksmith bag only hold things that are for blacksmithing?

modest matrix
#

:side-eye:

broken wave
#

I can at least see that "smithing apron" works for all forms of metalsmithing, which differentiates it from blacksmith's bag, which is a specific profession that uses common tools to other metalworker professions. The tool bag I'm having a harder time with

ebon saffron
# frozen sierra Does your blacksmith bag only hold things that are for blacksmithing?

It's a bag of holding that I use to hold most of my tools/blacksmithing gear, including slabs when I forge, yes. It's not restricted to only hold blacksmithing gear mechinically, no, but neither is the groomer's kit I own which was sold at Rumor Woods which would theoretically be the same issue. It doesn't have to hold gear specific to a groomer.

ebon saffron
flat matrix
#

The "all over the place" standard occurs because of a few reasons...1. ancient grandfathering (aka they've been around and ubiqituous to GS for so long, we grandfathered them in), 2. GMs making errors in making something, and 3. Something that's been reviewed and determined to be allowable because it is just the easiest way to describe it and it is something definably different.

This is one of those SUPER hard grey areas that no one is ever going to get totally right. We don't want to just blanket disallow them, but we also can't just blanket allow them because we get some super weird requests! In the moment, it is best, if not sure, to turn it down and ask for an alternative to avoid #2.

There are also some exceptions for things that are specially scripted, so the term is allowable because the script puts restrictions on it and keeps it to that particular type of item.

Insofar as bulky -- I'm thinking bulky would describe the bag and probably be okay, but my understanding was that the original ask was for "bulging" which implies items inside it and describes that and not just the bag, which is why it would be denied. A merchant already unsure about a few of the terms may then also turn around and be more inclined to also turn down bulky, because after a long merchanting session, we start questioning ourselves!

frozen sierra
#

I mean a jeweler's roll has a very specific look/meaning. It is an item but the other things are there to make it easier for us in text to have some information about what they are/can hold. Like an alchemy bag that holds alchemy jars and that makes sense. And I think the argument could be made if there was a script that only allowed one to put blacksmith things in there that it could be a blacksmith bag.

flat matrix
#

Many of your examples are items that were determined to be very distinct in appears, such as Kiki said.

I definitely get that it is a fine line, and it is definitely one that can cause a lot of frustration on both sides of the alteration ❤️

modest matrix
#

I get a good idea of what a blacksmith bag looks like, it's similar to a duffel bag.

ebon saffron
# flat matrix The "all over the place" standard occurs because of a few reasons...1. ancient ...

Which is why I'm not arguing the bulging aspect, I understand and accept that, despite the bag itself being of a magical background.

I will however say that a jeweler's roll is no more definitive than a roll of any other tools, that can be and frankly are used/kept in rolls, and if you want examples I can cite them. The idea that a roll of tools evoking a specific thought is purely subjective unless it is strictly used only by that vocation, and tool rolls, or even more, groomer's kits are not indicative objectively anymore than what I requested. Same as an alchemical or potion bag being definitive over any other bag without it being opened and shown the contents.

Nor was I pointing to items from "ancient" times, but things GM's have put out for sale within the last two years, which I assume had to pass QC before being sold.

If there's something specific to a bag of holding's script that prevents it from being described that way, I would expect it to be in the analyze, or updated to reflect that to alleviate confusion, but the item in question analyzes with You analyze your suede hip-satchel and sense that the item is largely free from merchant alteration restrictions, but the creator has stated that "There do not seem to be any specific limitations."

I understand if errors are made, which I think I demonstrated well enough last night. What I don't understand is the inconsistency in these determinations which do not seem grounded in objective considerations.

Your third point to me would seem to justify the alteration I requested as much as any of the other OTS items that I pointed to. If we're simply talking the easiest way to describe something, calling it a blacksmith's bag is without a doubt is the easiest way and is just as definably different as they are.

Now if we just disagree, that's fine too. I accept that as well, but as you said, I found it quite frustrating which is not something that happens often.

#

Now all this said, I do truly appreciate everything GM's do, especially those who merchant as I'm sure they catch fire all the time, and I can't imagine it's easy so I hope this is taken as constructive feedback and not as any personal attack.

lyric atlas
#

I have a map tube with not one single map in it. Just an fyi. It is very old.

#

I can understand both sides of this.

frozen sierra
#

Maybe it's made from maps. 😆

modest matrix
#

Can someone ELI5 custom fatal afflares

frozen sierra
#

I used to have a 'housebreaker's harness', which does describe a specific type of harness vs 'this harness could be for anything!'.. but it gets a bit murkier in GS as to whether or not that's allowed these days with how uncommon that term may be. This kind of makes me want to try to get one altered again..

frozen sierra
#

So you could make like ethereal eels shooting out and constricting the enemy. You could make prismatic starbursts slashing them with elongate strips of silken pink energy.

wheat zodiac
#

I believe it's any standard/non scripted flare, I'm not savvy enough to know what category that is called

rotund inlet
#

it only applies to cat b flares. script flares remain as the script dictates.

wheat zodiac
#

Missoni is though! Yes, that

modest matrix
#

So gheztye would be a no, because it's a material.
And blink would be a no, because it's a script.
But terror would be a yes, because it's in B.

rotund inlet
#

correct

frigid grove
#

If you want, I will sell you my bulging loot sack for 20m

soft elm
#

I'm looking for information on the new style peglegs, as I'm thinking about converting my mopleg over to the new style one I purchased last DR. But, I'm a big confused. The analyze says:

a tally-marked grey driftwood pegleg

You analyze your grey driftwood pegleg and sense that the item is largely free from merchant alteration restrictions.

The creator has also provided the following information:

This item is customly set to be a pegleg.

The grey driftwood pegleg can be freely altered, but a long description will not show up in your features. It must remain what it is intended for (a tally-marked grey driftwood pegleg), and cannot be changed to something else, which is detailed in ALTER 14.

You get no sense of whether or not the pegleg may be further lightened.

But when I wear it, it shows in my features as: She has a tally-marked grey driftwood pegleg for a leg, the artificial contraption covered in a tattered treasure map.

So my question is, how do I go about altering this thing, and where is that extra field pulling from / how do I customize that part?

dark flax
#

The treasure map part is pulling from the item itself, but it's not something that is alterable. So you'd be able to add a SHOW description to it and change the base 15/15/15 itself via merchants.

opal urchin
#

For alter 15/15/15, do you have to have 3 words? Or can you just have <an adjective> <noun>? (E.g. a small knife).

dark flax
#

You don't need 3 words.

opal urchin
#

Thank you.

flat matrix
#

You always have an article, adjective, and a base field. The article field will always have an article, but it doesn't have to have anything else.

The adjective field can be blank, but bear in mind that you won't have an adjective to differentiate it.

The noun will always have the noun.

So you could do.... "a small,,knife" or "a,small,knife" or "a,,knife"

#

the middle example, you could GET SMALL KNIFE.

#

In the first, you could not...becuase small is not in the adjective field.

broken wave
#

I highly recommend having an adjective. Some systems get wonky if you don't

flat matrix
#

Even without an adjective, "GET KNIFE" or "GET FIRST KNIFE" will work, just FYI

soft elm
#

Was it a fever dream, or were these updated to allow compatibility with things like nailpolish and cosmetics - for the unique feature field?

dark flax
soft elm
#

rub my peg
You rub a tally-marked grey driftwood pegleg in your hand.
tap my peg
You tap a tally-marked grey driftwood pegleg, which is in your right hand.

If nothing else, a gal can really never have too many peglegs. I'm certain some adventure requiring maps will be in my future, and then it will be my time to shine.

limber zealot
#

If one wanted to create a full shoulder great kilt for a man using an IACL item, would an IACL gown off the female form work for that? It's not gendered anywhere, is it?

frozen sierra
#

You could do a leg one (pants or skirt) and do "a <color/fabric> tartan that wraps around the legs and drapes over the right/left shoulder" Maybe?

limber zealot
#

Oooh, I didn't think about that. Super illegal. 😂

wheat zodiac
#

Does anyone know if the Borrowed Plumes Masques can use pronouns in the custom wear description?

long niche
#

Yes.

wheat zodiac
#

Delightful. Thank you!

ebon saffron
#

They're also nicely scripted.

frozen sierra
#

And will probably be for sale at the Kindred games?

#

I feel like that's why they were getting taken away from RW

limber zealot
timber fiber
#

I love those Tartan Cloth pieces SO much

#

Can't wait to rock the Arisaid at the Games

stiff rose
#

Ear Candy questions:

  1. When designing the appearance with the gem inserted, can we specify <adj> or <full> like with Veolas, or does it only take the adj+noun and no article?
  2. Can we have a hyphen after the gem, such as <gem>-inlaid? (I know Joolas can't handle a hyphen but Veolas can.)
supple minnow
stiff rose
#

Thank you!

rotund inlet
#

can confirm yes on 2, i have a <gem>-scaled snake

stiff rose
#

Thank you both! Plans are coming together.

onyx wing
#

Do we have headlocks in Elanthia?

#

like, wrestling move.

lyric atlas
#

I feel like we used to if we don't. Sounds familiar to voln fu messaging?

onyx wing
#

or UAC.

lament aspen
#

I think there are some ucs messages that reference it

onyx wing
#

ok.

#

Thank you 😄

lament aspen
#

HOWEVER now I need to know why

onyx wing
#

WWE and Teadragons.

lament aspen
#

I tilted my head a few times like a confused dog

onyx wing
#

Grimacing with pain, the tiny forest green teadragon has found himself in an awkward position. Atop a rose petal-covered platform, a black teadragon has pinned him to the ground and wrapped his iridescent pink tail around his neck. With wings aflutter in mock desperation, the smaller teadragon has sent nearby rose petals into flight. A long green tail can be glimpsed at the edge of the illusion, hinting at a new arrival that may threaten to turn the tables of this adorable match-up.

ocean pelican
#

whispers Teadragon Thunderdome

onyx wing
#

darn skippy!

#

I've got ... three done.

broken crescent
lament aspen
#

Restday! Restday! Restday!

onyx wing
#

Well, now I get to file that with "HEAD ON! Apply directly to the forehead!" for things that are on repeat forever in my brain.

ebon saffron
# onyx wing or UAC.

You have types of holds in UCS that include both submissions and various joint locks wthin the grappling verbiage.

#

I don't know that I've come across a headlock specifically, but that's not far from a rear naked choke which I've used a lot in UCS combat for fun.

#

It stands to reason if you can do an RNC, you should be able to do a typical headlock.

lyric atlas
#

How to spot a BJJ practioner 👆

hasty berry
#

Pirate Harnesses: the noun must remain “harness”, correct?

mossy mist
#

Nope.

lament aspen
#

I think there are just limited options to what makes sense. Harness...bandolier....

stiff rose
#

I have one that is a vest.

mossy mist
#

Mine is a cincture

lament aspen
#

something that could conceivably have slots, straps, sacks, tubes, pouches, and other containers

hasty berry
#

Ok thanks, that definitely changes things

frozen sierra
#

There any specific rules around altering lockpicks? Think the material has to be visible..not sure what else

lament aspen
#

It's pretty wide open as long as it has a point. I don't think the material has to be visible, I think a locksmith can examine it.

#

I have a lot of hairpins, letter opener, nail file, corset stay, fan slat, hatpin etc non lockpicks on my rogue

#

It is vastly easier when the material is the adjective

verbal swan
#

knitting needles, briar thorns...

frozen sierra
#

thanks. yeah, I'll probably keep the material as the adjective. I'll have to do some post EG planning.

lament aspen
#

Fun to remove a hairpin from my hair, pick a lock, and put it back

ebon saffron
#

Mine is a baldric.

coral aspen
ebon saffron
frozen sierra
#

yeah. my housebreaker's harness was a no go, so mine's now a bandolier.. which I keep shortening to 'band' and then fail to put things in my urglaes band.

modest matrix
#

Look up the containers script, I think I added band for bandolier

#

Or make an alias

ocean pelican
#

I had to train my brain to use bando

lyric atlas
#

So im looking to create something like,’a jar of silver sand’ or ‘a vial of silver sand’. Something like that. Anyone have suggestions for a base item? I was generously gifted a ritual vial that seemed like it might work, but the scripts dont seem to make sense as it implies a liquid pretty heavily.

#

Id love something where i could pour out a small amount of the sand or something similar

stiff rose
#

there are those neckpouches that are designed to hold sand for divination (where it's poured out) - it's a Shakat practice

lyric atlas
#

Hmm

#

That sounds interesting

stiff rose
#

I think you can get them on Mist Harbor?

lyric atlas
#

Oh really?

stiff rose
#

The Black Sands sellsit

lyric atlas
#

Hmm. Looks like the sand itself isnt an alter option.

#

But its pretty close. Thanks!

timber fiber
lyric atlas
#

Id appreciate it. Id prefer to avoid the ez script route

stiff rose
#

I think you can buy different colored sand?

lyric atlas
#

Oh? Hmm

stiff rose
spare timber
#

There is divination sand in FWI yeah that
there is also uh... ritual bags? in Solhaven clerical shop that might be altered into sand?

stiff rose
#

that is the shop which is linked from the article I linked earlier

timber fiber
#

Oh wait, I'm wrong, it was seawater

lyric atlas
#

Oh you can

stiff rose
#

I think the sand only has three uses per but you can always buy more

lyric atlas
#

No silver. I wonder if i can permify it

timber fiber
#

It does. Roh did sand divination at a recent bookworms

broken wave
#

ask for the sand to be dyable

lyric atlas
#

I dont know much about dye. Where/how would i ask that?

timber fiber
#

@ vanah here

broken wave
#

mostly just keep asking until Vanah starts to sigh

stiff rose
#

probably should try to see if it can be dyed first before asking

broken wave
#

true

lyric atlas
#

Truw

#

Ok. What kind of dye is dye?

#

There are like different types?

spare timber
#

they are all dye for alteration purposes
it only matters if its player creation stuff

lyric atlas
#

Yeah but this would need to be repeated over and over

broken wave
#

yeah, honestly for veola's etc. the ability to dye sand would make really cool options

lyric atlas
#

If i have to buy sand and dye it each time

broken wave
#

that's better than altering it over and over!

stiff rose
#

Just.. go a dyer's tent, buy a duy, and order to have them pour it on the sand.

lyric atlas
spare timber
#

as mentioned, the most likely candidate would have been the ritual pots, but they need to be a liquid.. hmm otherwise I think you are ... oh wait
There are the rarer now Ritual Daggers that leave symbols which I think might be able to be made sand?

# 

This is a Ritual Dagger item.  Really, this just means that it has verb traps geared toward performing rituals.

The item is dual-tiered: there are verb tiers, and then there are additional special ability add-ons.  Nearly all verb traps allow for targets (use VERB my dagger  WITH/AT (target)), and there are other factors that will introduce some variety.  Currently there are 2 verb tiers and 4 special ability add-ons (permanent scarring, commune, intercession, and sacrificing).  Generally, unlocking from Tier 1 to 2 will be offered on occasion as a specialized service; however, the add-ons will be extremely rare and should be considered a pie-in-the-sky type of service.

The Tier 2 verbs on this dagger  are:
 POUR - allows you to coat the dagger in certain specific substances from the food system and some of the old "ritual potion" items; or clean it.
        [Cleaning nouns = water, bourbon, whiskey, liquor.]
        [Coating nouns = blood, oil, grease, ether, liquid, venom, essence, bile, effluvium, ichor.]
 PULL - to draw ritual circles.  You can also convert "circular stain" items to these circles.
 POINT - traces a pattern over the skin at the low grip; temporary scarring at middle grip.  You can POINT without a target at mid-grip to toggle the scar/trace patterns - there is hand differentiation.
 WAVE - to draw patterns that "hang" in the air.
 CLENCH - lets you toggle your grip level on the dagger .
 TURN - purely fluff
 NUDGE - allows you to cut your palm or someone else's palm, among other things.
 CLEAN - lets you clean any coating on the dagger  in a fancier way than pouring.

The daggers come in 3 different flavors:  default, Arkati, and custom.  This dagger  is set up as default, and it cannot be toggled to the other flavors.  The ability to allow toggling will be offered on occasion.

Aesthetic alterations are perfectly acceptable -- the dagger  must remain a dagger-appropriate item.  You are able to have both a long and a show.  It is highly recommended that you keep any long descriptions brief.
-----------------------------------------------------````
stiff rose
lyric atlas
#

👍

spare timber
#

bah that looks like it needs liquid too... hmm

lyric atlas
#

I was tempted to make one and ez script some sand actions

broken wave
#

i just checked, the sand cannot be dyed. So we need to request it!

lyric atlas
#

::flees

spare timber
#

I have a charm template that is a vial with <X> in it... then just make some macros with Actions like I do with my nose

lyric atlas
#

But isnt that still gonna have a noun of charm?

spare timber
#

pretty sure yeah.

ocean pelican
#

Yeah, the only sand thing I can think of is the sand pouches with scrying sand in them

spare timber
#

ritual potion - Gritty thick silvery sludge/paste/mixture

ocean pelican
#

ew.

spare timber
#

I'm trying to help the guy out here
in my own way...

lyric atlas
#

You are turning my guys remains into joint compound!

spare timber
#

the ritual pots are great because you can kneel and interact with the circle it makes

#

and permify it

lyric atlas
#

I might have to just bite the bullet and alter up a smooth stone

#

Use ACT from there

spare timber
#

use more acts

lyric atlas
#

Oh. Im not shy with ACTs. Ive been tempted to layer ACTs over my warcries, because i hate the RP of them

spare timber
#

The witch set , with the daggers the case and the vials, the vials were all just fluff with some generic messaging right? nothing made like a salt ciircle?
A physical version of the ritual potions could be cool

supple minnow
#

DTH summoning circle.

timber fiber
#

not in the witch set. Elysani is correct

#

ritual potions make circles

frozen sierra
#

I was making a DTH with the noun of "ring"

lyric atlas
#

Of fire

frozen sierra
#

So you could make it "circle"

lyric atlas
timber fiber
#

I'd be all over something making salt circles. Just saying!

supple minnow
#

Fighting ring.

spare timber
#

a ring of teeth

frozen sierra
#

WELL NOW I HAVE TO DO THAT

# 
default: a wide fairy ring of white-frosted amethyren mushrooms
gem:
feather: a ring of amethyren wind chimes dangling <adjs> charms 
flower: a semicircular ring of jadewood-framed vellum screens painted with watercolor <adjs>
ribbon:
creature:
pointed:
misc: a ring of marble elven statues each posed adjacent to (something) <a/an> <noun>
lyric atlas
#

Im gonna add a flower side to my picture frame to turn it into a gallows

timber fiber
#

Yeah, stealing that, Kiki

frozen sierra
timber fiber
#

You had me at fairy ring

supple minnow
#

a tiny ring of yarn-tied twigs showcasing <bug> combatants

lyric atlas
#

I told obelins to make a spirit beast fighting ring

#

So he could do regional tournaments

stiff rose
#

a gruesome ring of <adj>s rising upward in a macabre display

paired with a dark elf finger

lyric atlas
#

Lol

#

Loooovely

spare timber
#

yeah who needs deadman's finger mushrooms now that we have actual dead man and women's fingers

near crag
#

Does anyone know the specs for altering a spirit servant? Do they have to be some kind of flying creature?

frozen sierra
#

I've seen a baby cocktrice and one of those little bobble head creatures from Princess Monokoe

near crag
#

I know one of the pet illusions being sold at EG is a cockatrice, but the other one is a pixie, which makes me think they need some kind of flying ability? Or... floaty ability, I guess? Those little creatures didn't have wings.

brittle coral
modest matrix
#

I have a custom singing sword cert. As a polearm user, I think I'm going to go with half moon. Looking for any interesting suggestions that might not give away immediately that it's a weapon.

frozen sierra
#

A lucent silvery grey half-moon.

lament aspen
#

I thought I did one like that once but can't find the description to share

modest matrix
#

#alteration-help message

Thandiwe 🌙: @vankrasn You can use light, sound, mist, smoke, vapor, or whatever, but the key thing is that it is not substantial.

Thandiwe, when you said that sonic armor could use light. Can you provide an example of how "light" would be used in the sonic alteration? (Armor specifically)

frozen sierra
#

I just did ^^

#

Radiant, scintillating, glowing, blazing etc etc

modest matrix
#

Would you say shadows are related to light?

brittle coral
#

I wouldn't, they are opposite.

#

Also, QC denied it.

#

And rightly so.

modest matrix
#

Can you provide an example of how "light" would be used in the sonic alteration?

brittle coral
#

Radiant, scintillating, glowing, blazing....

modest matrix
#

How is air radiant, scintillating, glowing or blazing?

brittle coral
#

Because it is made of magic and sonics.

frozen sierra
#

Your shroud has to be "air" but that air can be dark or light colored.

#

But it can't be a shroud of darkness or a shroud of light.

modest matrix
#

a,writhing,shroud of windswept shadows emanating subtle whispers

Here's my attempt to use light and sound. I'd like something similiar without tossing out the idea.

brittle coral
#

replace shadows with mist, I think you can do mist.

#

YOu could do smoke

#

vapor

#

I mean, all those things work in place of shadow

opal sedge
#

a caliginous shroud uttering susurrations in a foreign tongue?

modest matrix
#

susurrations is a good word

opal sedge
#

If you're a follower of Luukos go with sibilance

modest matrix
#

Ghezresh, I asked for subtle threats but it was too sentient 😂

opal sedge
#

ominous susurrations perhaps

modest matrix
#

After careful deliberation, I think I settled on smoke. It gives me about the same mental picture. So ty.

spare timber
#

a caliginous clinking cloak
channel your inner lost in space

silent vapor
#

Are there acceptable nouns for wands other than wand/rod/baton?

lament aspen
#

Can you think of any

#

I feel like you would be the expert on this

coral aspen
#

Scepter, I think, is one

#

I'm pretty sure

lament aspen
#

Depends on the system we're talking about too

coral aspen
#

They've dropped in treasure system

#

That's what I'm going on

lament aspen
broken crescent
#

Yeah, a thesaurus gives me a bunch of things that I think are runestaves, rather than wands.

stiff rose
#

Vanah approved noun for wands: doodlebug

lament aspen
#

VOI: 0

brittle coral
#

(Thandiwe gets a paper bag to breathe into and starts building a fallout shelter. QUICK, in here!)

verbal swan
#

...darn it, there are no instances of doodlebug on the wiki.

gloomy ibex
#

as a waggler we should be able to wave anything and call it a wand... magical properties shouldnt be stifled. a stick, twig, and a switch should all be able to hold appropriate amounts of mana

#

wagglers of the world unite

coral aspen
#

I trust Merriam-webster more

stiff rose
#

Fortunately for us, Merriam-Webster notes that a doodlebug is, in fact, a divining rod! Which is basically a wand. But probably one with minor water in it.

silent vapor
stiff rose
#

I can offer from personal experience that the system using wands to wave recognizes only specific nouns. If the wand has a noun not recognized by that system, such as "horn", then you can't wave it. But you can usually activate it by other means.

Source: my imbue box and testing.

silent vapor
#

Honestly... I just want to alter 2 wands to have a different noun, but I also kind of don't like baton, rod, or scepter because they seem... too big to be wands.

#

They might just end up being... wands

trail geode
#

baton is one of those words that covers the gamut from "conductor" to "marching band" and has a very different visual picture depending on where you came in

lament aspen
#

We could rally for made up racial and cultural nouns

#

What sounds good

silent vapor
#

d'oodlebuhg?

lament aspen
#

Ugh no apostrophes please

silent vapor
#

I enjoy that the apostrophe is your only objection there.

lament aspen
#

And it's mechanical, the old system no likey

#

None of the fancy new words with apostrophes got into DEFINE because it no work

stiff rose
#

doodle-bug

silent vapor
stoic sparrow
#

How dare you suggest marching bands aren’t magical

stiff rose
#

Or that they also can't be set on fire.

I mean on fire.

Maybe both.

silent vapor
#

Fine. If it's a marching band from Mad Max: Fury Road and there's fire spewing out of every single horn...

... I'll call it magical

verbal swan
#

[Insert gif of Portland's Darth flaming bagpiper unicyclist here]

gloomy ibex
#

Hey All, working on a familiar certificate, but i don't have a list of current familiar ambients. Where can I get them? Wiki doesn't list the ambients. A GM's assistance would be appriciated... FYI its Cat ambiants i am looking for

modest matrix
#

deathstick

frigid grove
gloomy ibex
#

would any of the Delirium giftshop toybox stuffimals be equivalent to being altered to a feline toy?

frozen sierra
#

Are arcroses something that needs to be provided? Like if I put in a request to sadie for something with them is that a no-go?

brittle coral
#

Because they are an EG gemstone, yes.

frozen sierra
#

Okay, thank you. 🙂

wheat zodiac
#

I feel like I know the answer to this but I have second guessed myself one too many times

Can you EZscript a worn container?

coral aspen
#

Yes, as long as it doesn't already have a script, you should be able to EZscript it.

#

In fact, the wiki page calls out OPEN and CLOSE as viable options for containers only.

wheat zodiac
#

Thank you!

lavish ravine
#

My characters have a powerful need.

IMG_8007.jpg IMG_8009.jpg
#

The soles look like horse shoes

lavish ravine
#

New personal story arc for Faerinn idea. Finally got that 10 ft vampire lover. They share a wardrobe now. At some point Faerinn became a vampire and does not realize it .

quick trout
#

There were hoof-shaped cobbling pieces sold at a festival sometime in the last year.

lavish ravine
#

steeples fingers

verbal swan
#

they also dropped in the cairn.

lavish ravine
#

I have not considering bring actual nightmare hooves into this. This is valuable input

verbal swan
#

Has anyone gotten a specimen board altered?

ocean pelican
#

Are you asking if they can be altered? Because the answer is yes.

verbal swan
#

More a matter of wanting to know designs?

#

The specimen adjective is a sticky wicket wrt the 15/15/15, so I'm curious as to how people have handled it.

lyric atlas
#

Any particular reason for me to worry about whether or not the term 'shagreen' will be allowed to describe shark or ray skin leathers?

lament aspen
#

An untanned leather (rawhide) with a rough, granulated surface, typically made from a horse's or oranger's back, or from a shark or ray (a la stingrays). It is NOT generally used as a fabric for clothing; it is more utilitarian -- hilts, scabbards -- or decorative -- book bindings, small cases, etc. -- in nature. For Elanthian purposes, using it for leather armor is fine, just be aware of the rough texture.

lyric atlas
#

yup yup. Its literally intended for a belt

#

something like

#

a low-slung ray shagreen swordbelt

verbal swan
#

I'm hoping that the new gems in Icemule Trace and Zul Logoth aren't going to need to be supplied for alterations on account of them not being limited to ascension level hunting areas.

thin garden
#

*****On the off chance that they are - If anyone EVER needs one of these for alteration material. Ping me, and I'll hold some aside for you.

lyric atlas
#

id assume that all of them are on the rarity chart in one way or another

verbal swan
#

rarity chart shmarity chart, I'd much rather just refer to the "You must supply this" list.

#

I can totally understand the "If it's only found in an ascension hunting area it must be supplied" logic. If I can (hypothetically) find one right outside the gates, not so much.

#

...which suddenly begs the question, is there going to be some new cloth material made from strandweaver silk we'll have to supply spinnerets for.

lyric atlas
#

I would give the staff a little time to sort it out.

lament aspen
#

You just need to look the gem up on the website to see the rarit--oh no

#

I probably need to kick the alchemy loader too so they work with rummage and jars

verbal swan
#

YES PLEASE

tulip wing
#

Does anyone know off-hand if the custom fields for nail and finger on the blood red hands are limited to just single word adjectives, or is there some wiggle room to work with those fields a bit? /punday

flat matrix
#

15 characters limit

tulip wing
#

Thank you!

frozen sierra
#

Can metallic gowns be altered by anyone now? Or who should we be looking out?

Thanks!

brittle coral
#

Anyone can alter them so long as they follow the rules.

#

I thought I updated the analyze to reflect that.

frozen sierra
#

This is a Metallic Gown at Tier 4 / 4. It may be altered freely provied it remains metallic in nature.Verbs for the satin bliaut are: Kick, Pull, Push, Rub, Tap, Tilt, Turn, Touch, Clench, Poke, Pinch, Prod.

Oh yeah, it did. Also there's a typo in the update.

#

i bugged it

#

And thank you!

brittle coral
#

🙂

verbal swan
#

Am I wrong in thinking that captiql is not a restricted material? aka I don't need alter fodder?

coral aspen
verbal swan
#

I checked that, thank you. I only ask because I've looked over the entire page and have repeatedly been asked to supply multiple things that have a NO in alter fodder required column. Will consider it answered!

lament aspen
#

Look at the bottom of the rolton doc, it should list the ones that are required to provide

#

I forget offhand and can't look at work

verbal swan
#

Thanks.

#

👍

zinc plank
#

Looks like it is actually on the Precious Materials of the Aran Irith page

# 
This is a "catch-all" document with new items, but it also pulls together previously released items. Those item restrictions, if any, are not superseded by this document.

This includes: agita, aganjira, captiql, naraina, shadarl, surita, etc.

Combat materials follow normal alter rules for those materials (shadarl, surita, aganjira, etc.)

Erithi gems from the Elanthian Gems document require alter fodder

Snow jade, lotus ruby, celestial pearls require alteration fodder

Everything else is open use, no fodder required```
verbal swan
#

crap.

#

so I do need to supply captiql.

#

sigh

coral aspen
#

No...

verbal swan
#

...okay, given that I am thoroughly confused at this point I am going to come up with alternatives.

coral aspen
#

I'm pulling up the article to be certain, but I'm pretty sure that captiql is specifically mentioned because it's a specific material noted in the doc, not necessarily because it's restricted.

#

It was mentioned again, in June, in Atan Irith/Precious Materials doc under fabrics.

verbal swan
#

I don't think anything's actually been sold made out of it.

coral aspen
#

I'm getting to the point here...

#

The roltons doc came out first, and specifically outlines the availability of certain materials, and lists ataela and qiviut as the ones that require fodder, with everything else noted as open use.

timber fiber
verbal swan
#

huh.

coral aspen
#

The reason why it was called out in precious materials was because it was first mentioned in the other doc, and that the precious materials doc does not supercede what was released prior, ie, the roltons doc.

#

So, captiql is open use, and shouldn't require alter fodder.

flat matrix
#

Captiql does not require fodder. Xeraphina is correct

verbal swan
#

awesome.

#

addes captiql yarn to her list

stiff rose
#

Are Veola hair accessories capable of having any sort of show description applied to them or are they strictly longs?

(I suspect not but can't find anything specifically stating so on the wiki and would appreciate confirmation.)

supple minnow
# 
You tap a white brocade fascinator with a diagonal spill of netting, which is in your right hand.
>l my fascinator
OH HEY.  IT'S FANCY.```
stiff rose
#

Is the show specific to the side? Can it reference the item placed in it?

verbal swan
#

Pretty sure it's the same show for all sides, which is why I don't bother with a show.

stiff rose
#

I'm actually ok with that if that is the case!

lament aspen
#

Same show all sides

#

Just like deck the halls

#

And redacted

stiff rose
#

Thank you all very much!

verbal swan
#

...redacted...

#

tries to think of something else that could be given the Veola/DtH treatment

frozen sierra
#

Did IACLs get a ninja update on the analyze?

lament aspen
#

The player facing instructions were updated to match the GM notes

flat matrix
#

Yes, I updated them yesterday

#

So that you had all the same information we had and there was no misunderstanding

#

Wiki is updated as well

frozen sierra
#

Awesome, thank you. 🙂

#

Also lol at the person who was trying to a six pack the easy way.

flat matrix
#

That's been in our notes since the beginning, but it wouldn't be the craziest thing we've seen asked for

coral aspen
#

^^^^^^^

flat matrix
#

It wouldn't be the craziest thing we've seen asked for this month LOL (we love everyone's creativity in IACL requests)

coral aspen
#

I've been scarred and traumatized. /s

frozen sierra
#

I'm giving myself a coughing fit I'm laughing so hard.

verbal swan
#

...sounds like I need to start asking for crazy stuff. /s

frozen sierra
#

I do have a comment about shoulder-baring because like...shoulder-baring as a dress term is like neutral of exposing the skin/body beneath? it's just a cut of a shirt/dress

verbal swan
#

off-shoulder

flat matrix
#

off-shoulder is fine

verbal swan
#

or off-the-shoulder

flat matrix
#

shoulder-baring is showing the exposed skin

#

off-shoulder is indicating it is off the shoulder (and you can then INFER it is showing skin)

coral aspen
#

worn low on the shoulders (for IACLs, not non-IACLs, specifically)

frozen sierra
#

I'm gonna have to disagree just from garment crafting standpoint. I respect what you are saying and get that baring/exposing anything is against the goal and starts dipping into too risque but "shoulder-baring" garments are a cut.

stiff rose
#

Would "exposing the shoulders" be considered acceptable, since the shoulders could well still be covered by other material beneath?

#

I'm trying to figure out how to phrase future IACL requests.

flat matrix
#

It's never going to be exactly perfect

#

Nothing has changed with IACL alter rules -- you just now can see MORE of the guideliens that we had on the GM side

timber fiber
#

I'm with Greatfalls on this. Just because a garment is shoulder-baring, doesn't necessarily mean it's exposing flesh. It could be over a chemise, for example.

ocean pelican
#

what if it's shoulder-bearing instead?

#

shoulders just covered with more shoulders.

#

Agh, I have reached the point of semantic satiation and now shoulders looks like the weirdest word ever.

coral aspen
#

something, something... arm-bearing joke... for the right to bear arms

flat matrix
#

ROFL

ocean pelican
#

we should just arm bears instead.

coral aspen
#

Bears don't need any more help

timber fiber
#

That's a scary thought, Tivvy!

frozen sierra
#

#saveshoulderbaring

quick trout
#

The recent changes to IACL defy logic and precedent for how the script has been used in the past. I cannot fathom why anyone would bother with IACL if they can't do something as basic as bearing a shoulder with it. smh.

flat matrix
frigid grove
#

Can someone post the new analyze? I have a lot of iacl and am curious

flat matrix
#

It's on the wiki

#

https://gswiki.play.net/IACL_items#Analyze ```The creator has also provided the following information:

~~ Illegal Alteration Clothing Line (IACLs) ~~
This item can have different descriptions when held and worn. Wait! What?? That's right, you can now have a tight bodice, low-rise pants, or maybe a long cloak that actually drags on the ground. Keep in mind that normal alteration rules may still apply based on merchant personalities and general good taste.

Verbs: ATTEND, REMOVE, RUB and WEAR

Alteration Guidelines:

  • You can have a base, long, and show
  • Base: the same for both worn and unworn
  • Long: not required for unworn (unless you want a show) but required for worn
  • Show: not required, but if you have it, it will be the same for worn and unworn, and you will need a long for unworn too
  • DISALLOWED: Anything that references exposed skin is not allowed (so no shoulder-baring shirts or tight pants revealing a toned abdomen, for example)
  • Overly Risque Items: This script is not meant to get around any policies on overly risque items. The merchant has final say on this.

This item has the following worn description:
a crisp white linen shirt with sleeves rolled up to the elbows

You get no sense of whether or not the shirt may be further lightened.```

quick trout
flat matrix
#

I assure you it is not. The wording is taken straight from what has always been the GM notes --- I cannot speak to a GM doing an illegal IACL, which I am positive has happened because there are loads of grey areas.

And there are ways you can get something that falls off the shoulders that isn't mentioning exposed skin in the way the script has said not to use it.

boreal saffron
#

I'd need an example of how to write an off the shoulder garment with this clarification. It was already pretty awkward working stuff because the garments don't trap his/her.
And.. An Illegal Illegal Alter? 😖

stiff rose
#

I'm not clear on how shoulder-baring references skin?

boreal saffron
#

Yes. Please give un an example of how to write it?

frozen sierra
#

cold-shoulder, cutout-shoulders, peep-shoulder, keyhole-shoulders

boreal saffron
#

You can have that on any alter.

frozen sierra
#

a tunic with a cowled neckline ending just below the shoulders

boreal saffron
#

THAT one needs an IACL. Gotcha.

frozen sierra
#

a gown with a rolled neckline skirting the shoulders in orange puce tulle

stiff rose
#

I get that we can't request a dress that is something like, "a super sexy dress leaving the skin of both shoulders visible" or whatever, since that's talking about showing the skin itself in how it's worn. But "shoulder-baring" reads to me that this dress is cut in a way that it does not cover the shoulders, not that the shoulders are completely uncovered by anything at all. What I am I misreading here?

frozen sierra
#

But I still agree with the original point that like shoulder-baring feels like calf-length in that it's describing the cut/style rather than yeah what Shan said.

flat matrix
#

and I'm guessing we may be getting too literal over that original example for all the reasons stated

quick trout
#

Can't be showing them ankles!

boreal saffron
#

The toned abdomen thing, I get. If you sell the pants with a toned abdomen to a character with a pot belly, it doesn't make sense. The shoulders, not so much. Everyone has shoulders.
Basically, are we just talking about skin/body parts that can be specific to a character? Like not referencing a tattoo, or birthmark? If it's more generic "skin bearing", then maybe it's not the case?

stiff rose
#

Man, I keep mixing up bearing/baring here. Pretend I'm writing the right version, haha.

flat matrix
#

and since we're fixated on shoulders....yes, if you aren't mentioning showing the skin or whatever, it's probably going to wind up fine. I'll talk to the script owner, since we did NOT anticipate this response over making the analyze more clear (and it was a player request, by the way).

I do know why you're frustrated, but it really has been a rule this entire time and it hasn't been a problem, so I don't think it's going to be one.

quick trout
#

The shoulder-baring example given was probably not the best one. Beefy arms busting out of sleeves or ripped abs bursting through a gambeson, that makes sense to restrict I guess. Visible shoulders seems pretty innocuous since it isn't describing the quality of the skin, just that there isn't clothing ON that part of the body...

stiff rose
#

Yeah, I feel like it's just the shoulder example that is what is causing some confusion and frustration. Otherwise, the expanded analyze makes perfect sense and is great to see on the player side.

boreal saffron
coral aspen
#

🐻 🦾

stiff rose
#

I may also be wrong, but I suspect that many who regularly use IACLs commenting here also take great pains to perfect a specific outfit's "look", including with layers, where an IACL gown that is cut to not cover the shoulders might very well be paired over something that does cover them up. And combined in such a way that it legit makes sense, not "oh this dress says I can see skin, but that chemise says I can't, what do".

boreal saffron
#

Ayup. I wrestled forever and on two separate alters to try to have a properly backless tunic that had a spill of extra fabric at the hips. It's tough out here on these fashionista streets.

modest matrix
#

Just catching up, but isn't women showing skin OOG?

#

Like, they were all bundled up and covered in the 1400s. You couldn't even show an ankle, let alone a shoulder.

ocean pelican
#

Depends on what part of the world you're looking at, what time period, etc. But even in Western cultures in certain eras that fit within our time period, there were trends/fashions/garments that we might consider scandalous even now. So a visible ankle or shoulder or decolletage could be period-appropriate.

vapid quail
#

I need one of these….

image0.jpg
#

Mask and wearable blanket ig

tropic spoke
#

omg... I need that too

verbal swan
quick trout
frozen sierra
#

it's gorgeous but it also looks heavy and snuggly

vapid quail
#

Bleh seems ai generated but still, I want!

#

Now to find someone to make one. I can quilt but crochet and knitting elude me

frozen sierra
#

Crotchet is really easy and peaceful.

coral aspen
#

Also, it may be AI, but that is 100% double if someone can manage to figure out a pattern.

boreal saffron
#

I tried felting... for five minutes until I skewered myself. Quilting it is!

ocean pelican
#

Felting needles are vicious

fleet cloud
brave stirrup
#

So I'm hopeful some of you experts out there maybe can assist my outlandish alter idea...lol

I'm in shattered, so anything goes

I want to change my Shadarl Brig to a Football outfit, shoulder pads, helmet, etcetera. Orange and Black theme (Oregon State Beaver)

I'll also do my UAC boots as Football Cleats, and maybe Gloves as Batting Gloves

Anyway, looking for some ideas if anyone has any

onyx wing
#

a bulky football uniform ? Vivid hues of orange and black surround the image of a ferocious teeth-bared beaver emblazoned on the front of the shirt. On the back, in bold capital letters is the name "STAV-MEISTER", stretched to the limit over huge shoulderpads. A rounded helmet with a faceguard completes the uniform, a drooled-on mouthguard dangling from the front.

brave stirrup
brave stirrup
onyx wing
#

a bulky,football,uniform

zinc plank
brave stirrup
brave stirrup
lyric atlas
#

Looking for a way to get mass series of alterations done to my enhancive jewelry to make them all very simple. A blue brooch. A gold brooch. A tin pin. A steel bracer, etc. It is hell on my eyes when my enhancives are mixed into my normal inventory and all of them are normal jewelry descriptions with 15/15/15

Are there any in-game options for something like this other than actual gald services?

#

Id even take a lich script that simply changes the description of something on my end to ‘pin enhancive 1’ or something

trail geode
#

The immediate thing I think of is dye, although I’m not sure you can dye jewelry but the wiki doesn’t say you can’t

stiff rose
#

Can you dye them?

lyric atlas
#

The dye system is terrifying

stiff rose
#

Oop Tikba got it first.

lyric atlas
#

But i can try

#

Which dye is most likely to work?

stiff rose
#

I'd just go to the dyer's tent in the Landing, buy a dye there and use it.

lyric atlas
#

Arent there like 5 types of dye?

stiff rose
#

3 I believe, yes

lyric atlas
#

If the dyer tent fails, where would i find the other two?

#

So i can try them all?

frozen sierra
stiff rose
#

Yeah, worse thing that happens is they won't dye. The other two are cobbling dyes (from a cobbling warehouse) and alchemy dyes (made via alchemy). I believe that if you ask the npc about convert in the tent, you'll get the alchemy version.

lyric atlas
lyric atlas
stiff rose
#

Good luck!

lyric atlas
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Those alter wands an option?

stiff rose
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They add a description on at the end of the 15/15/15. So they're an option if you want it to look longer/fancier.

lyric atlas
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Oh nm. Im trying to go the other way

stiff rose
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Some of the dye colors in the tent include stuff like "plain white", etc, which could potentially end up as "a plain white [material] pin" or whatever.

lyric atlas
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Yeah. Id just like ‘a white pin’

stiff rose
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Depending on its inspect material, it might or might not show when dyed. You'll get a confirmation before dying of what it'd look like.

lyric atlas
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Ok. Worth a try

frozen sierra
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You could just plot your next 15 alters instead of getting L/D at every merchant. angryshake

lyric atlas
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Nah. Im not wasting a gald on something like this

frozen sierra
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I don't think it's a waste if it makes you happy/your play easier. But good luck! I hope there's a solution.

flat matrix
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It's literally a GALD! It's not a waste if it gets you want you want!

lyric atlas
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Sure. But its got opportunity cost. It would be about 20 gald services. Thats more than i get in a year, even with EG included

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Three sides of a veola/DtH or ‘a white pin’. Its no contest 😂

zinc plank
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The imbeds don't actually have a material so they just come out as "a color brooch"

frigid grove
lyric atlas
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I will report back when I get a chance. Deep in the weeds on my next youtube video

fleet cloud
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I dyed some fancey armor "plain blue" den I ruin'd it by impalin/galdin it witta ki-lin horn! 😆

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Sumptimes it aint wot makes ye happy...it's jus dat ye aint made it to a merchant inna years....anna had no good idears at da time.

lyric atlas
#

Okay...so the dyes are working on the enhancives....

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BUT

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I think they are detecting a permanently sung to item (or maybe even a temp one) as some sort of script that stops the dye

lament aspen
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Some metals cannot be dyed

lyric atlas
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similar items like rings, bands, etc don't work for the dyer if they are loresung to

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I tried a cloth item too

lament aspen
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That does not sound familiar but dyes are finicky

#

Can you bugitem one of them attn Vanah please

lyric atlas
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absolutey. thank you

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I mean this IS helping. I've got 3 items done so far

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so I appreciate this option to the extent its working

#

maybe copper isn't dyeable?

# 
  some ashen leather gloves sheathed in teal ombre scales (18/25 charges)
  a tear-cut red sunstone neckchain
  a dark grey talisman
  a dark grey buckle
  a silver and aquamarine stickpin
  a tooled ruby brooch
  a silver and pink dreamstone bracer
  a deep indigo bracelet
  a snake-etched copper earcuff
  a wide-brimmed sleek leather hat adorned with a backswept stylized golden flame (123/200 charges)
  an opal-inset silver earcuff (10/11 charges)
  a pair of opal and copper earrings (7/11 charges)
  an emerald-set copper necklace (6/11 charges)
  a tattooed symbol of Voln (83/100 charges) (hidden)
  a lapis-inlaid copper stickpin (26/29 charges)
  a cut diamond studded copper stickpin (13/16 charges)
  a dreamstone inset copper brooch (15/18 charges)
  a rune-etched mithril buckle (19/23 charges)
  a laje-bound orase badge (charged until 12/19/2024 18:41:26 CST)
  a gold and turquoise sash (9/12 charges)
  a side-slit pewter baldachin tabard shot through with electrum threading (11/17 charges)
  a steel blue bracelet (18/19 charges)
  a deep indigo band (14/15 charges)
  a starstone inset platinum ring (9/10 charges)
  a princess-cut pink topaz ring (8/11 charges)
  some etched ora leg greaves (19/29 charges)
  an imflass wire anklet with blue-green sea glass clusters (189/200 charges)
  a pair of black and grey socks stitched with the moon of Liabo (21/21 charges)
  a pair of silver-hued leggings (12/13 charges)```
making progress!
#

hmm...maybe anything thats got a gemstone isn't gonna work? Like the aquamarine and the topaz?

lament aspen
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I don't see copper with a page on the wiki or the dyable metals listed anywhere

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I am travelling today so cannot check but that feels right

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I dunno

#

What does it inspect as

lyric atlas
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ok, don't feel the need to. appeciate it!

# 
You carefully inspect your copper stickpin.

You determine that you could wear the stickpin anywhere on your body.  The stickpin appears to serve some purpose.```
lament aspen
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Nothing, cool cool