open-beta-discussion

[umbral ether]

Anyone else been crashing quite a bit on the beta build?

[crude dragon]

Negative

[tidal oak]

Nope

[pliant plaza]

me good

[tulip meadow]

Is vrchat down rn?

[tulip meadow]

Yes

[silk kelp]

Seems to be having big issues.

[tulip meadow]

Yeah It wont let me In

[fathom tendon]

cant change avi

[tulip meadow]

API is down

[fathom tendon]

when will it be fixed?

[tulip meadow]

Unsure

could be a few mins could be a few hours

[fathom tendon]

oki doke

hopefully soon lol

[timber jewel]

Please keep discussions in #open-beta-discussion related to the ongoing open beta.
You can check out #server-status for information on the outage.

[tidal oak]

ye

[tidal oak]

let's see what's going to be next

[crude dragon]

Vrchat still hasn't fixed the issue that tooltips don't work in the report screen for prints while in VR 🙁

[crude dragon]

also, sticker report tab should keep a total history of that persons stickers, because they can place a bad sticker, than instantly place a normal sticker which hides the bad one in the report sticker tab

[lucid trench]

i am having issues getting ChangeEndValue on the new tweens to work..
initializing a virtual tween with the same start and end value.. and then updating the end value and triggering it to play "should" work
but for some reason the update callbacks never get called

when i instead just kill the old handle and create a new virtual tween as the target value should be updated it works ofc.. eh..

i feel like more complete example code could.. help

[flint frost]

doesn't sound Open Beta related... you should make bug reports on the feedback board: https://feedback.vrchat.com/bug-reports

[limber quartz]

https://feedback.vrchat.com/open-beta/p/noticable-delay-between-warp-effect-firing-and-remote-user-disappearing

[hushed solstice]

ive gifted about 70 gifts on the open beta over the course of like 3 different times and every single time i gift a sub i get kicked out of the instance with a unusual client behavior

this is some bs lol

anyone else had this happen ?

[earnest sparrow]

Jee I wish we had a way to disable these globally so we didn't have to see thiiiiis

[tidal oak]

I guess the system behavior Get hit something when you do gift to on public other users but I'm not sure those other users they run different versions VRChat somehow it triggeredVersion Live/Version Beta/Version Suspicious Users Clients Chances + When that happens again you can report the bug when you did too much gift

Don't waste the money

[dense musk]

all those poor giftees probably don’t consider it a waste! 😂

[grim breach]

Please please open a canny while logged in with the user account that made the gifts and got kicked!

[molten cobalt]

you add the physics bones components to your avatar in unity and then upload

[vague elm]

so im trying to upload my avatar into vrc but it just keeps creating a prefab instead of continuing on to the next phase
am i doing something wrong.....?

[edgy lantern]

im auctually having trouble with that to where do you go to put it on or select it

[molten cobalt]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4MTUG9KhVA&t=1s

[edgy lantern]

booba thanks

[molten cobalt]

there's not many video tutorials at the moment for physics bones

[spring salmon]

Yea I don't think that video goes over how to apply them I looked at it and I'm still lost 💔

[molten cobalt]

so far it seems the 2 video tutorials assume your vaguely aware of how Dynamic Bones Work

[spring salmon]

Yea I've never used dynamic bones

[dark dune]

Has anyone had trouble with avatars crashing during build & test mode on the avatar dynamics beta? I've got this in my logs, and my avatar just has the unity default humanoid pose.

[pine tangle]

Well that's one hell of a debug

[dark dune]

Yeah I'm assuming it's their code obfuscation going brrr

[pine tangle]

probably haha

[dark dune]

But at least the call stack shows that it's something under FinalIK that's crashing

I just noticed I had a phys bone collider that had a null root transform, let me test again and see if that fixes it

[pine tangle]

yep. Some missing references. So you must have something null somewhere

[dark dune]

Yeah, I'll send in a bug report if I can find it. I assume it'd be preferable for the SDK to error about it, rather than having the avatar crash

[weak wharf]

How do I become a beta tester

[floral flint]

Please send your log to the support team !

[pine tangle]

Definitely

[floral flint]

#open-beta-announcements

[dark dune]

Will do! I'm still trying to narrow down the cause a bit more before I open an issue. I had this working before, and there's only a few things I changed, just have to isolate which one.

[soft mason]

dang, how were you able to stick the sword in the wall and keep it there?

better yet does anyone know how that works

[lime yarrow]

It's just a world constraint

[soft mason]

something something world constraints id assume

ah

[wheat fjord]

how do I get my physbones to move away from the collider they are touching

[lime yarrow]

But I'm going to have a system soon that detects if it's stuck in a wall or not

And then falls to the ground if it isnt

[dim cloak]

someone has to do it

[lime yarrow]

Oh shit I had this exact idea a while ago and completely forgot about it! Thanks for the reminder!

Time to be as annoying as humanly possible!

[dim cloak]

xD ended up making my own in blender/substance haha

gonna put this together for a bit

[languid basin]

You should make it fuck the mirrors when you press it

Like just disable the mirrors completely

This is a joke plz don’t ban me vrchat /s

[faint monolith]

Hey so is there anyway I can go back from the beta update because I dislike the fact that I can’t join or see my friends since most are live

[proven oxide]

if you're on quest, its not a high chance

the oculus thing for versions is pretty bad

[fallow rock]

I've done this. it's a 1 way ticket to have 90% of the lobby block you the millisecond they learn it's you

[proven oxide]

praise the mirror gods they oh so love

[faint monolith]

Is there anything I can do?

[proven oxide]

as far as I've heard, no

[lime yarrow]

https://vrchat.canny.io/open-beta/p/1181-optional-haptic-feedback-on-contact-sendersreceivers-and-phys-bones

[proven oxide]

its not exactly vrc's fault that oculus sticks you in beta

[faint monolith]

So should i like- message oculus orrr

[spring salmon]

Omg I figured out physbones all by myself 💀

[faint monolith]

Cause this is pretty frustrating

[spring salmon]

Time to commit crimes 👹

/j

[proven oxide]

you can try and send feedback or get a response from em, sure, but i wouldnt know any way of getting back into live for quest

[faint monolith]

Okay well thanks ig

[lime yarrow]

Just have it on a dynamics enabled big red button that says do not press. And then you can just blame whoever pressed it

[proven oxide]

fun idea

ofc it'd only be temporary so no one has to join another lobby

[fallow rock]

If people are willing to have a sense of humour, yes, but most Trusted people do not when it comes to taking their mirror from them

[lime yarrow]

Of course I'm only joking

You shouldn't do this because nobody in a public lobby will appreciate it

But if you're just with your friends, go for it

[cedar kettle]

is there a known way to get global colliders on bones other than like the hands and fingers? Particularly I want some on my arms

[proven oxide]

you'd add em yourself im p sure

[fallow rock]

I'd be down for it. Make it rng so there's some risk to it and then publicly blame the person so everyone in the world blocks them.

[lime yarrow]

I think you just need to add them to one of the collision tags that already exist

Like hand, etc

Oh wait, you mean phys bone colliders

Not sure. Then, sorry

[near grove]

I would genuinely laugh, as long as it doesn’t crash you I’m okay with it

[proven oxide]

^

[lime yarrow]

Jokes are fine, just don't go overboard. That's the general consensus

[proven oxide]

as long as it wont lag and/or crash me, im cool with p much anything

[near grove]

Yeah

[proven oxide]

or if its loud
loud noises hurt

[cedar kettle]

All good, I appreciate the attempt

[soft mason]

actually makes me wonder is there a way to have objects that stay in place without the use of world constraints

[small surge]

Guess if you use same _IsGrabbed parameter on 2 places , only one will work, had to rename em 1 & 2 to make it behave would only trigger one

[carmine snow]

When will the dynamic bones becoming to the live build

[timber plinth]

dynamic bones already is on the live build

if u mean physbones probably a week or two from now

[edgy quartz]

Hey, quick question with the sdk, any one know how to set up a pickupable Object?

Like a sword or sheild, light saber etc?

[timber plinth]

i tried to make a quest compatible keyboard for my avatar but man it requires so many layers and parameters

[rough cape]

is anybody else unable to leave the open beta on quest?

[coarse stag]

which is why the world needs ContactSender, not ContactReceiver

[edgy quartz]

Uninstall and reinstall

[rough cape]

done that multiple times'

first thing i tried

[edgy quartz]

Anyone worked on this or nah?

[lime yarrow]

I never said anything about adding contact receivers to the world.

And I also am not talking about the ability to add contact senders to the world. I'm talking about contact receivers on an avatar being able to detect colliders in worlds that already exist

I specifically do not want it to be on a world by world case. I want it to work universally in existing worlds

[edgy quartz]

Oh hey @dim cloak i think i commented on your youtube video lol

[dim cloak]

Haha yes i think ya did!

[edgy quartz]

You don't know anything about setting up a pick upable object with physbones do you?

[dim cloak]

Uh I generally know how it's done, I just haven't done it myself yet.

Been working on other things xD

[iron meadow]

I’m gonna scream at this dude..

I can’t find out how to get into the beta thing

[edgy quartz]

Makes sense, i'm having a issues where as soon as i grab the object it disapears in unity.

Needing constraints maybe? I'm sorta a unity dumb dumb i think

[dim cloak]

[dim cloak]

It's a bit complex to explain over messages on discord haha

[mental marsh]

I love it so much

[edgy quartz]

Yooooooooooo

N U T

[iron meadow]

I checked the store on oculus, I don’t see “details” or how to update the game

[mental marsh]

I have wanted to make a nut button for so long but never had the time to do it

[iron meadow]

This guide doesn’t work

[coarse stag]

@lime yarrow I see. that doesn't sound easy for VRChat to implement in exactly that way. the whole performance boost of Avatar dynamics is from VRChat writing their own physics engine on top of burst compiler. Having to interface with existing world colliders in Unity physics would defeat a lot of the performance optimization

[dim cloak]

Yeah i just made the model in blender earlier and then textured it in substance really quick haha it is totally worth

[coarse stag]

anyway that's what the canny is for. we'll see

[iron meadow]

Bro I’m gonna cry

[lime yarrow]

What about a similar runtime conversion that adds sender scripts to colliders

[mental marsh]

Once I make time I will make a avitar that is just all nut buttons

[coarse stag]

it seems hard to add sender scripts to every collider in a world

it really seems like something a world author would have to think about

like, my world VRMC has 10000's of colliders

[edgy quartz]

Gotcha, if you ever have the time lmk, i know you ain't got no obligation for it but yep XD

[dim cloak]

LOL please make it public

also make it so when you walk it triggers the nut sound

[lime yarrow]

Or as you said, the easiest solution would probably be just to let us interface with particle collision callbacks

[coarse stag]

yeah that would be a cool canny IMHO

[edgy quartz]

With a particle system of...

Nothing lewd

Just water

[mental marsh]

Yep I will try with the limited skills I have

[lime yarrow]

You should make it. You're more technically minded than me

[vague elm]

lolnot the nut button

[coarse stag]

we can still use Stop Action

[vague elm]

thats hilarious

[dim cloak]

You're just wanting to make it so you can drop an object in the world and then pick it back up whenever you want, right?

[edgy quartz]

Yeppers

[lime yarrow]

Yeah which is what I intend to do until better support is released

[dim cloak]

Let me finish making my animations for doing exactly that with this button and then i can record a quick video explaining it and send it to you

[lime yarrow]

Stop action just because a whole lot easier to wrap my simple brain around because of avatar dynamics sender's and receivers

[edgy quartz]

Sweeeeeeet, thank you

[mental marsh]

Imagine the possibilities

[lime yarrow]

Like using them in conjunction makes a lot more sense than the old method

To me at least

[iron meadow]

I fucken give up. thousands of hours gone to waste because the crappy guide doesn’t help and I can’t even join my friends and for what? Just so the game runs two frames faster?

I GIVE UP

[muted brook]

open beta isnt compatible with live lmao

[small surge]

Drop cubes on ground that interact with people walking on em and trigger sounds , ugh 🔨 🐇

[edgy quartz]

Honestly just wait a week or so

[lime yarrow]

Oh man that's pretty good

[hallow drift]

thousands of hours

[lime yarrow]

Oh and just like fun traps in general

[hallow drift]

0.0

[mental marsh]

Prob mirror dwelling

[iron meadow]

I’m gonna impale myself on a railing…

[mental marsh]

Nice

[edgy quartz]

This update can bring some pretty cursed content

[lime yarrow]

For somebody with supposedly thousands of hours in this game, you sure don't have a lot of patience. Something vrchat taught me over my 7,500 hours is patience

[hallow drift]

oh I was saying the beta hasn't been out for thousands of hours

[mental marsh]

I think they meant like in total because they probably deleted their game

[hallow drift]

yeah

[edgy quartz]

Don't you know unity time is different than real time XD

[iron meadow]

No, vrchat in general

[small surge]

Right now the grab bone is animated is the one thing that i need a fix for or no gesture that move ears will behave if someone grab for (canny) ,eh well has other stuff to do

[iron meadow]

I can’t get into the beta

[hallow drift]

for that many hours in a video game, you sure are incompetent at using it

[mental marsh]

It is the most simple thing what do you play on?

[hallow drift]

wait until it's put into live

[iron meadow]

Quest

[small surge]

Seen other questers stuck on it, not alone

[lime yarrow]

Okay guys, let's ease up a bit on the arguing

No they're having trouble getting into the beta

Not out of it

From my understanding

[iron meadow]

I went to the store, my library, I tried the website

[mental marsh]

Go to the app click on your library and go to vrc then scroll down and go to the version and click it then put it to beta and restart your headset

[rough cape]

im having trouble getting out of it 😅

[mental marsh]

Unless you are trying to get out then it is different

[mental marsh]

I have a solution

[lime yarrow]

Yeah it is a common problem apparently

But this person that was referenced is having the opposite problem

[rough cape]

what is it?

[small surge]

1500+ lines above here theres some that had to reset theirs to get back to normal

[lime yarrow]

Once they get in they're going to be right back here complaining that they can't get back out to see their friends

[mental marsh]

Put it back to live then delete the game after that restart your headset and re download it

[timber plinth]

theres people who change their status to say theyre stuck in the beta

[mental marsh]

That is what worked for me

[iron meadow]

I can’t see the version thing in the store page

[rough cape]

alright ill try that, thanks for the help

[hallow drift]

I wish we had threads in this channel - have a different thread for each separate issue i swear

[mental marsh]

Welcome

[mental marsh]

There would be too many

[hallow drift]

no use in spamming the chat in "plz help I can't exit quest beta" every 30 seconds

[edgy quartz]

If all else fails

[mental marsh]

I will show a picture

[edgy quartz]

Factory reset headset

[iron meadow]

Thanks

[hallow drift]

better than having a chat derailed every time someone wants to be babied instead of reading and using the search button in discord

[mental marsh]

Where it says version

Under language

[iron meadow]

I see it

[mental marsh]

Click the numbers

And do the steps I told you to do

[iron meadow]

Oh my lord thanks dude

[mental marsh]

Any time

[flat patrol]

Tell them they can't go back to live. It was a trap to jail the horny user.

[edgy quartz]

O

[iron meadow]

Horny?

[lime yarrow]

That would be pretty funny if it was true hahaha

[edgy quartz]

XD

[mental marsh]

The wewe jiggle

Imagine imagining how to imagine

[edgy quartz]

Plot twist, the live never comes out.

it was a ploy to have the horny users in the beta forever

AKA horny jail

[iron meadow]

Now that that’s resolved, have a nice day or night people

[mental marsh]

Goodnight

[lime yarrow]

We'll see you again

When you can't get out of it

Lmao

Have fun

[mental marsh]

Definitely

[iron meadow]

Probably not

I see how to get out

I’m not that stupid

[lime yarrow]

Are you aware that quest avatars don't have phys bones on them by default?

[iron meadow]

Yeah

[lime yarrow]

Okay cool

Have fun then

[mental marsh]

I have help and I know a way to get in and out of beta anytime

[edgy quartz]

Really sucks i'll have to reupload all my quest avatars tho

[mental marsh]

E

[flat patrol]

Don't need to

[iron meadow]

Big boo- I mean.. flowy hair here I come!

[rough cape]

that and people arent going to update public avatars for physbones quest untill after its live

[near grove]

hey ik this isnt the right place for this but can anybody help me with vr headsets

[mental marsh]

Somewhat

[mental marsh]

Sure

What ya need help with?

[flat patrol]

I probably won't backlogs too much on quest upload to add phys

[near grove]

thanks for helping btw

so

[short jasper]

You should probably go to the right place, or DMs.

[near grove]

@mental marsh can i dm u

[mental marsh]

Yes

[flat patrol]

I can already see people send DM to have their favorite avatar update with physbone

[lime yarrow]

From quest users, yeah

[flat patrol]

I feel like a slave or something sometime with them

[lime yarrow]

I made a quest avatar that is literally just a rock, and somehow it blew up, and now I get 10+ daily friend requests from quest users

It's something

[mental marsh]

Is it the rock you can sit on?

[lime yarrow]

Yes

[short jasper]

The heck is the logic of friending the author

[lime yarrow]

I don't know

[mental marsh]

I hate people who use it to sly

[short jasper]

I have that happen to me too all the time

[mental marsh]

Fly

[lime yarrow]

Hahaha

That wasn't intentional but it is a very fun use for it

I discovered afterwards how useful it was

[rough cape]

i see that avatar everywhere lol

[lime yarrow]

Originally the avatar was just an inside joke between my wife and I

[mental marsh]

But it is mostly children who use it

[lime yarrow]

Because she played as a Goron from TLOZ

And I was her Rock Husband

[mental marsh]

Lol

[short jasper]

I feel like personally they should make the root bone rotation an optional thing or at least disable it on avatars with converted physbones because I notice that's why a lot of avatars seem to have issues with automatic conversions.

What do y'all think

[lime yarrow]

Perhaps

Make a canny about it

[short jasper]

Definitely gonna when I get to my pc

Canny is a pain to use on my phone

[lime yarrow]

Fair

[short jasper]

I noticed it cause I typically always used the head as the root bone for my dynamic bones in the past and it kinda fucked up head rotations completely

[ocean knot]

yeah. animation behavior is borked. in some fringe cases you can animate by disabling the physbone frame 1, doing the animation, then re enabling it on the last frame of the anim, but thats a jank workaround at best

[short jasper]

Or just make a root bone for the hair/any other object

Are we talking about the same thing here?

[ocean knot]

we are.

[short jasper]

Nothing I said had anything to do with animations

I'm referring to how if you have an avatar with a dynamic bone on the head acting as the root in the past it breaks head rotations somewhat because it's counting the head as part of the physbone chain

[ocean knot]

whether its ik, gesture, or animation, the root bone translate and rotate issue is the cause for discrepancy

[tawny herald]

So can you switch between live and beta?

[ocean knot]

until its behavior begins to resemble dynabone, it will cause problems on multiple established avatar configurations

thankfully i think its something they can fix

[slender ocean]

why not just add the head bone to the exclusions

[crimson nexus]

is there a way to get off the beta on quest? i changed my version back but it's still on the beta

[slender ocean]

I’ve heard if you have shared accounts on your headset you have to do it on the primary account

[crimson nexus]

i do not

[slender ocean]

otherwise reinstalling after putting it back should work

[crimson nexus]

aight

[karmic zenith]

Thank you

[ocean knot]

because the bone having issues is the bone behind the phys bone. its not in the chain

in their case its likely the neck, if head was root

[short jasper]

what

No

I'm referring to ONLY avatars that have been converted to physbones automatically by VRChat

[ocean knot]

as am i

[short jasper]

And it wouldn't affect the neck because the neck is before the the head bone

Phys bones only affect what's after the bone it's root is assigned to.

[near grove]

Hello, I'm having a bit of trouble, I was in the beta version and I tried to switch back to live but I still can't join people, it shows up as release but it won't work

[ocean knot]

i am aware, but the bone before the root has odd behavior that dynabone didnt have, it affects animations and IK.

[short jasper]

Therefore, before physbones when people use dynamic bones, and they use a dynamic bone component, and make the root bone the head, it functions differently, because in Dynamic bones, the root bone is not affected by the dynamics, while in Physbones it's the opposite.

[lime yarrow]

Because if you add the head bone to the exclusions, any bones after that are automatically excluded. Which defeats the purpose in the first place

[flat patrol]

You can't, anjoy the Boing boing

[coarse stag]

the way we used to solve that in DynamicBone is using a curve which starts at 0 and then goes to 1

aren't curves still possible with PhysBone?

[small surge]

They are there, just behind the ( C )

[lean hamlet]

So to fix it I just gotta factory reset and I'll be able to go into live servers again??

[lime yarrow]

Is this true though? In every setup I've ever done for dynamic bones, the root is also effected by the settings

[lime yarrow]

Well yeah but that isn't talking about rotating with physbones

It's talking about being able to be animated

[short jasper]

No no

It isn't it's referring to it being affected by physics

[lime yarrow]

Since when has dynamic bones allowed for translation

[short jasper]

This has nothing to do with animations

[lime yarrow]

No, I'm pretty sure it's refering to transform, not the physics

[flat patrol]

IsAnimated was already soso in the close beta.

[lime yarrow]

Again, dynamic bones never behaved like you are saying they did. The root bone was also affected by physics.

[ocean knot]

i am deeply familiar with dynamicbone and its quirks. we are saying the same thing in two different ways. the root ofbmy wing is parented to my forearm, and physbone conversion messes up the forearm unless i shift the physbone root up 1 bone in the chain. and yes, it also affects animations

[lime yarrow]

But could not be rotated with transform

[short jasper]

On Dynamic bones, the root bone does NOT get affected by dynamic bone physics, at all, period. Meaning it will not move like the rest of the chain does when moving around and such, nothing to do with animations.

With physbones, it's the opposite, it doesn't translate, yes, but it still rotates like the other parts of the chain

[lime yarrow]

Yes it does smh

[short jasper]

I need a visual example of this because I'm 100% convinced y'all are confused of what I'm talking about

[lime yarrow]

I think our definitions of "bone" are mixed up

[ocean knot]

im trying to say i have the same issue as you and that bone translste\rotate animations are also impacted by the issue, and you are arguing it.

[lime yarrow]

When I say the root bone is affected, I mean as if the root was the head of the bone

And the next "joint" was the tail of said bone

Thus, the first "bone" is indeed affected

[ocean knot]

our issues differ slightly, but the cause is identical

if the physbone behavior match dynabone in this aspect, neither of us would be experiencing the problem. we are describing two different symptoms of the same issue

[lime yarrow]

What I'm trying to say is that it does match dynamic bones behaviour in trixxed's case

[ocean knot]

except it doesnt

[lime yarrow]

They are talking exclusively about physics affecting the root bone. Which it has always done in dynamic bones

[short jasper]

look at me in the fucking(/lh) eyes and tell me this dynamic bone is affecting the root bone

It's affecting the chain yes but it has no affect on the root

[lime yarrow]

Ahh

You are correct yeah

[chrome parcel]

so to anyone who may have been having issues with tails no longer animating with your physbones there's a very simple toggle for it at the bottom under the parameter tool tip called 'Is Animated'

simply toggle that for any bones that are being effected by an animation

[lime yarrow]

I was getting confused because I always remembered that dynamic bones added an extra "bone" between any disconnected bones

If you put the root as the head, and then had disconnected bones for the hair it would add an extra simulated bone to bridge the gap

[short jasper]

meanwhile the same setup in physbones ends up with this

[lime yarrow]

Which lead to me having to add individual scripts per hair strand

[mossy python]

So I've created a HP system for this avatar. I want to decrease the HP every time someone touches the soul, how do I do this?

[ocean knot]

physbone affects one more bone in the hierarchy than dynabone did. period. it doesnt move like it does, but its rotation and translation are still being dictated by the script, which causes a variety of issues.

[lime yarrow]

Ah yeah I can see why that would be really annoying .

[ocean knot]

ans trixxed's video supports what im saying,

[short jasper]

It's less so annoying since all you have to do is add a root bone instead, but it's a problem with avatars that have been automatically converted that have dynamic bones cause it also turns the head into a physbone with that setup

[lime yarrow]

Yeah this makes a lot more sense to me now

[mossy python]

So do y'all know how to help with my problem?

[ocean knot]

yes, this exactly

[lime yarrow]

That would indeed be a major problem with the autoconversion process

Let's pray it's fixed promptly

[short jasper]

yeah making a canny rn

[ocean knot]

i suspect multiple canny posts cover the issue without explicitly narrowing down their shared cause

[flat patrol]

Add the tag hand in the contact receiver

[lime yarrow]

Finding them and pointing out that they can effectively be merged into one canny post may help

[short jasper]

I honestly thought I was fucking insane for a moment cause when I was checking for those vids the dynamic bones in the physbones project accounted for the root bone

[mossy python]

I don't know what a contact reciever is lol

[mossy python]

All I know is physbone stuff, I have no idea how to make stuff work across avatars

[flat patrol]

Well read the documentation before asking

[mossy python]

I did and I didn't get it lol

[flat patrol]

There's some tutorial on YouTube

[short jasper]

lemmie find it rq

[flat patrol]

It's not even a week so information is not out there for everything

[lime yarrow]

Even so, people work incredibly quick

[flat patrol]

The new system is really easy. Mostly time and ideas are the limit.

[lime yarrow]

It's pretty simple when you boil it down, yeah. But using simple building blocks to make complicated complex creations is what is the most fun

But it's very easy to learn, imho which is why I implore anybody who reads this to take the time to sit down and watch tutorials, and ask questions

There's never been a better time to learn avatar creation in general

[spring salmon]

Is thier a simple tut on making a avatar quest compatible?

[iron meadow]

I am back again

It worked

[molten cobalt]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=343&v=8MkgXcidxg4&feature=emb_title

[spring salmon]

Ty!

[molten cobalt]

about the only thing you need to do different than this tutorial is not like dissolve all of your hair bones because now you can use them

[mossy python]

Seems easy enough actually lol, sadly I don't have a way to test it til I have other people online

[spring salmon]

Ah okay

[lime yarrow]

If you need to test other people touching stuff, you can either touch it yourself as it will work the same if you have it set to work with yourself, or you can try testing it in unity using Lyuma's avatar emulator, and a dummy gameobject with a contact sender on it with any tag like hand, finger, etc

[mossy python]

I made it so self can't touch it

[lime yarrow]

Is there a reason?

[mossy python]

Also the object is not in the player's reach

[mossy python]

Yes it's supposed to be the avatar's soul, so other people touching it decreases the HP of the avatar

[lime yarrow]

You can add a sender that extends out from your hand for testing purposes

[mossy python]

It wouldnt make much sense if you could just kill yourself

[lime yarrow]

Right but you can enable it for testing

[mossy python]

Fair

[lime yarrow]

And then shut it off

[winter oracle]

Toggles seem to bug out the physbones on quest (idk about pc)

[flat patrol]

Try to kill yourself by allowing self interaction. But having someone else helping is easy.

In the hub map

That sounds wrong but oh well

Do it

[flat patrol]

Ask shitty the bat maybe

Shade*

...

I should go

[hardy dove]

Yo is anyone else stuck in Open Beta on their Oculus Quest?

It’s glitched to where you can log in but you can’t join anyone

[winter oracle]

Thats supposed to happen

[hardy dove]

Yeah but you can’t switch back

To live

I tried, it doesn’t work

[winter oracle]

Uninstall vrchat and make sure its on the live version when you reinstall

[hardy dove]

Others have tried that and stated that it didn’t work, but I’ll give it a shot

[winter oracle]

they most likely didnt put the version back to the live

[mossy python]

So does the reciever have to be on a bone or can it just be a game object

[flat patrol]

Anything

[full fulcrum]

ii just switched back to live without a problem

[mossy python]

Right now it doesn't seem to work at all

[flat patrol]

The value are float

[mossy python]

It looks like this

[flat patrol]

From0.0 to 1.0

[astral locust]

Unity can treat anything as bone as long as it has a transfrom afaik.

The bone length is just the length to the it's children

[mossy python]

So any idea why this isn't working though?

[flat patrol]

You saying a single empty won't work?

[astral locust]

Not if you want collision on a physbone, but a receiver will work on a single empty.

[short jasper]

Got it up https://feedback.vrchat.com/open-beta/p/1181-in-game-automatic-conversion-causes-issues-with-dynamic-bones-that-had-cert

[flat patrol]

Empty work with collision

[mossy python]

Do y'all have any idea why this reciever doesn't work?

[astral locust]

What do you mean by not working?

[mossy python]

It doesn't increase the parameter

[iron meadow]

Alright

[mossy python]

As I have specified it to do

[astral locust]

On Enter sets the value to 1 for a frame then back to 0.

[iron meadow]

I know how to get out of the beta version but it won’t let me

As predicted…

[flat patrol]

Let me imagine really hard how you specified it

[iron meadow]

I’m getting that problem with getting out of the beta version

[astral locust]

Uninstalling and reinstalling didn't work?

[iron meadow]

I haven’t tried that

Will I have to sign in again afterwards?

[astral locust]

No clue

[iron meadow]

Hmm

Alright

I’ll give it a go

[mossy python]

I changed it and it still is doing nothing

[near grove]

Why are so many people having trouble getting out of beta while my idiotic ass can't even figure out how to get into it..

[carmine snow]

When does dynamic bones build go live for quest

[mortal plume]

never

as for Physics bones, those are still in beta

[carmine snow]

Yeah those

[mortal plume]

not sure when the ETA for live is

[carmine snow]

Sorry

[winter oracle]

phys bones might come out this week or next week, thats what people have said

[astral locust]

I don't think there's an option to increment an value with the receiver, but you can play a series of animation in as incrementing or decrementing something.

[mossy python]

Yeah I planned to do that

I just learned the parameter has to be a float, I was using an integer

[astral locust]

Before IK gets merged into live?

[winter oracle]

again ive only been told they might come out for the live

[hazy linden]

From what I understand, the IK beta is supposed to last a long time. Like a month or longer.
They just plan to keep it compatible with live in its own beta until it's perfect. So I wouldn't be surprised if dynamics comes out before it

[tender dome]

do physbones on quest have a hard limit?

[stiff acorn]

There isn't a hard limit AFAIK, but here's the performance rank values for them on Quest.

[mortal plume]

Sipp, which province are you from?

out of curiosity

[gilded stream]

For physbone syncing between PC and Quest, does the entire armature need to be the same?

[rugged dirge]

so like having small problems, like some avatars I make are just completely stiff, like it doesn't track my body at all

[nocturne copper]

Is anyone else's vrchat avatar upload screen keep pausing when they click in the window? i am unable to upload my avatar haha

[gilded stream]

Not mine, no.

[nocturne copper]

so odd i wonder why thats happening then :.(

[true ice]

So when the new bones are on something, does this prevent them from being transformed at all?

[gilded stream]

Hmm, only thing I can think of is a script that would cause it.

[gilded stream]

By default, yes. If you want to animate them, you have to hit the checkbox "Is Animated"

[true ice]

mmm..that doesnt seem to fix my problem but maybe i just got edit a few things

[ocean knot]

so i'm finding this isnt entirely true. it is mostly, but some transforms, especially ones involving the root bone, don't play very nice.

[true ice]

Yea i think that may be where im having trouble

a root doesnt want to move even if the animate is allowed

i can seperate the dynamics and move them a bone down but then it doesnt move quite how id like

[gilded stream]

Correct.

That's why you can't put physbones on the hips or any bones like that, at the moment.

[ocean knot]

yeah i havent found a solution outside of adding a bone in the chain for the physroot to have as its parent. but that has the potential to break animations themselves

[gilded stream]

Subdividing in some cases would work.

[torpid reef]

Ive seen one use a physbone as a replacement for an aim/look at constraint when it comes to 2 handing weapons etc. I really need to test this out!

[near grove]

Has anyone done a more detailed doc or tutorial on contacts/receivers?

[true ice]

So, the only bones that you shouldent be able to attach things to atm are the ones that make up the mapping for an avi right?

[molten cobalt]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6V7hJVwn-Cs&t=1s

[hallow drift]

I've found Moons touch triggers helpful too

whoops didn't actually link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0P_MIqjISOw

[near grove]

Thank you both!!!

[molten cobalt]

basically these two videos are the extent of what's currently available outside of the vrchat documentation

[hallow drift]

I'm happy though - after fighting against the unity animation controller I figured out how to make it work for my setup

[gilded stream]

Pretty much, yeah.

[true ice]

weird, is there any reason it wouldent be for a different bone then? I have a "Root" Bone for something that isnt one of those that also doesnt wanna transform

[robust flower]

i cant seem to activate open beta on my oculus quest

[hasty ginkgo]

Can you turn it off?

[sick copper]

Idk whether it's an open beta bug or not, but after trying open beta, everyone starts to look like bots even when I turned off my safety settings. This carried into live version too, so I have to manually turn robots into people (show avatar). How do I fix it? fiddling with the safety setting didn't change anything.

It was okay till I ran the physicsbone open beta

[weary lichen]

is the sdk in open beta info valid for making physbone avis?

[hallow drift]

SDK - Avatars?

yeah

[weary lichen]

alr ty

[true ice]

@sick copper i was having that problem before the beta opend :o i thought it was only me. I assumed it was something with the servers just being slow at the time

[sick copper]

yeah so annoying to manually turn on each person when I am in a room with 30 people

[true ice]

Yea, im not sure what causes it. I havent been in a public world since then so idk if im still having the problem or not

[mossy python]

It's working!

[dim cloak]

That is really cool

[vapid storm]

Any idea how to enable this on quest anyone?

[coarse dock]

Yes

Wait so I can where any Avatar and dynamic Bones will work for quest 2

[half tiger]

My question is

Does anyone have a avatar with bones in them yet

[coarse dock]

Noo sadly

[coarse stag]

Hey just a reminder, I uploaded 2.9.7 of Av3 Emulator here:
https://github.com/lyuma/Av3Emulator/releases

If you didn't update to 2.9.6 or 2.9.7 I fixed a few issues related to PhysBone that caused them not to emit animator parameters in some cases

[coarse dock]

@coarse stag dynamic bone works on Oculus quest 2

[molten cobalt]

you mean the physics bones as Dynamic bones absolutely do not work on the quest

[coarse dock]

@molten cobalt physics bone don't? But I thought it was a open beta

[fallow rock]

Dynamic bones and Phys Bones aren't the same thing

[coarse dock]

I'm sorry

I just never had dynamic bones @fallow rock

[dim cloak]

And quest never will have dynamic bones. The new system put into place are Physbones which quest users can see. They function like dynamic bones, but are not the same thing.

[coarse dock]

Oh ok thx for telling me @dim cloak

[drifting nacelle]

this updates, seems to break the sdk, when i remove this, sdk fixed afain.

[molten cobalt]

but yes you can use the new physics bone system on quest to have your bones jiggle

[brave forge]

Gonna be coming back on to the beta side.

[coarse dock]

Can I use any Avatar for physics bone

[brave forge]

Pretty much as long as it has bones for the physicbone script.

[dim cloak]

Only avatars that creators have made quest-compatible with them are visible.

[brave forge]

Oh

[molten cobalt]

you have to update your avatar to use physics bones because there's no Auto conversion system on Quest avatars because Quest never had Dynamic bones

[dim cloak]

Any avatar that was made prior to the beta will not have physbones on quest. They will for PC, but not quest.

[molten cobalt]

so basically if you're not comfortable uploading avatars no physics bones until like a week or two after it released

[coarse dock]

Because I'm a quest user

[half tiger]

I physically cannot upload avatars so my question to clear it up, is it possible to clone a avatar off of someone WITH physbones

[dim cloak]

Yes, lots of people have been cloning mine and using it in the beta, as well as quite a few others.

[molten cobalt]

yes just there's not going to be many public avatars with those at this time because everybody is working on their personal avatars at the moment

[half tiger]

May i dm you to ask a few questions?

[dim cloak]

Sure

[coarse stag]

Can you share console errors?

[cosmic hedge]

How do you get out of open beta, I tried doing the same thing I did to get the open beta but it won't install

[shrewd estuary]

reinstall vrchat'

facebook is big dumb when it comes to switching between betas

[cosmic hedge]

I did

[shrewd estuary]

2nd times the charm ??

[charred palm]

Tbh I think physbone are easier then dynamic bones

[cosmic hedge]

😭

[shrewd estuary]

facebook does betas horribly jesus fuck u gotta go through a whole maze to get out of one

[molten cobalt]

not surprised as they are literally designed for vrchat purposes instead of just being a third-party add-on

[shrewd estuary]

dynamic bones' cooler cousin

[coarse dock]

Can anyone make me a avatar with physics bone if anyone doesn't mind

[restive tapir]

i have an avatar that her hair grows with a controler, by moving the bones, at the moment is broken, will it be fixed? and can physbones be animated? like i mention for changing hair length?

[rugged dirge]

is there something with characters being completely stiff and not tracking at all

because im having a problem with that

[upper sonnet]

I have no idea how the beta works or how to get it started

I read that you can log back into ur active account if u use the beta

[rugged dirge]

what do you use

oculus or steam.

[upper sonnet]

Oculus

[rugged dirge]

ok.

basically go into your oculus app and search up vrchat.

scroll down to the version and tap on it.

then change the channel to open beta

[upper sonnet]

Is it safe tho

[charred nebula]

I just noticed that script too, did they sneak in built in climbing functionality? 👀

[rugged dirge]

should be

nothing really happens to your account

[upper sonnet]

Okay cuz someone on the vrchat Facebook page said they wasn’t able to go back to normal

[rugged dirge]

if you want to return to the live you have to switch back and uninstall and reinstall the game.

oculus going back to live is a bit wonky

but it should be fine

[upper sonnet]

Hmn okay thank you I might try it after a few days

Since it’s like just new

[rugged dirge]

it might come out in a few days

maybe a week

or 2

if you wanna wait until then

your choice

[upper sonnet]

Hmn then yeah I can wait. Thank you so much for the info

[half tiger]

It’s “safe” but it may be buggy

[charred nebula]

👀

[upper sonnet]

Fair enough

[charred nebula]

whoop

[molten cobalt]

what happens if you add it

[upper sonnet]

Climbable??

[charred nebula]

didn't mean for that to be a reply

But yeah

there's a climbing script now

[rugged dirge]

what's the climbable.

[charred nebula]

But how does it work

[vague jay]

Super buggy for quest. I've tried changing back to live three times, and it's not working

[half tiger]

I can change just fine

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[upper sonnet]

I feel like it can varie

[rugged dirge]

maybe like that test cat thing

like a fake playspace mover

[charred nebula]

It also adds a rigidbody

[rugged dirge]

perhaps-?

[vague jay]

Hm just a bug for me and hopefully it gets fixed first

[half tiger]

Biggest problem is i need socialization but i cannot join anybody or any server cause its a live server

[charred nebula]

Hmm

[molten cobalt]

wonder if this is intended for avatars or just a early component for like physics bone worlds

[rugged dirge]

wouldn't be a problem if it would come out already

kek

[charred nebula]

there's also a 'disallow theft' toggle on it too

[upper sonnet]

Imma test it out and if I can’t log back into Normal world then oh well ig

[vague jay]

Yea, it sucks when you can't play for days because of bugs

[half tiger]

I can play the game. Just not in servers

[rugged dirge]

I also need to find a way to view colliders in unity

[charred nebula]

Some of these functions on it seem like stuff you'd see for a pickup item, so maybe?

[vague jay]

The only world I can get into and see others is the Avatar Dynamics world thing

[dim cloak]

Unless it could function like being able to be picked up in worlds, just as a component on the avatar instead.

[upper sonnet]

I’ll let y’all know how it works for me

[half tiger]

And it warns you about that possibility in #open-beta-info

[vague jay]

Yea I know, that's pretty much why I tried changing back straight away

[charred nebula]

A unfortunate downside of beta builds

[near grove]

If I had to guess it’s probably using the same system shown on the cat girl for lifting avatars but using maybe colliders as grabbing points?

[half tiger]

If you read it and complain you’re hopeless

[vague jay]

I didn't fucking expect it would be this fucking buggy mate

[autumn hull]

@charred nebula I'd say it's forked off of VRC_Pickup in some way, at a guess. Anyone tried implementing it on an avatar?

[dim cloak]

Have you checked to see if you can put this on / use this in game on an avatar yet? @charred nebula

[charred nebula]

It IS in the beta SDK, so yeah, you can just attach it to your avatar right now

[upper sonnet]

Signing in now

[charred nebula]

just not really sure how it'd work

Like, do I just, slap it on, and then I can climb in game?

[half tiger]

It’s an open beta. What did you expect?

[near grove]

Wait so the climb script is in the SDK?

[charred nebula]

Is it triggered by something

does it have to be attached to some kind of prop

do I have to attach something to it, etc etc

There's no mention of the script on the doc pages that I can find

[near grove]

The beta is meant more so for people smart enough to solve these kinds of issues on their own lol. Also no duh it’s buggy it’s a beta.

[autumn hull]

Given the way pickups and other interactibles work, I'd say put a collider on the climbable object.

[charred nebula]

That should just be anything that exists in a world then

[upper sonnet]

Everything seems normal

[charred nebula]

Anybody here in the super secret closed beta gang that could ask in those channels?

I'd reckon someone among them has probably poked at it by now

[autumn hull]

Why not just try putting a climbable and a collider on an object to see if it works in-game?

[charred nebula]

It's an avatar sdk

[autumn hull]

Yeah, so?

[half tiger]

I am watching you currently

[autumn hull]

Put it on your arm, or your avatar's body, make a tall avatar and see if people can climb it.

[charred nebula]

Oh, do you mean like just stick a object on my hand or somethin with the script and see what happens? v:

[autumn hull]

Yup.

[charred nebula]

Oh

huh

[flat patrol]

I never thought of asking what that script was for so idk

[molten cobalt]

so the world physics bone hypothesis seems to be correct?

[autumn hull]

Tupper actually confirmed PhysBones would be available for worlds eventually, but as a Phase 2 thing. Avatars first, sort out the initial bugs, then Worlds.

[charred nebula]

Well, it's named Climbable, so all I can assume is they might be working on built in support for climbable surfaces with it, but the beta SDK doesn't seem to allow it to be uploaded ,so maybe it accidently got mixed into the avatar sdk?

[upper sonnet]

The beta is running very smoothly for me I love it sm

[flat patrol]

They say both SDK will be one at some point

[charred nebula]

Oh, they're gonna be merging it back together?

[flat patrol]

With the manager things

Don't remember how they call it

Like a hub

For asset

[charred nebula]

Honestly, I really hope they do add in some kind of built in climbing support that lets ya just, climb where ever
Though course with an opt out for those that want to disable it for their worlds

[proven remnant]

so maybe I did this wrong but added something with a phys bone that is grabbable but it stays attached to me? is the only way to keep it floating in air when ppl or I grab it if I use like world space or?

[molten cobalt]

yeah that would be nice if climbing was a first-party feature

[flat patrol]

Sure but you see what happening. The UI is becoming kind clusted

At some point we will end up with preference level of submenu

[upper sonnet]

Does anyone have or know of new avatars for beta

[chrome parcel]

Join the avatar dynamics world

there is a few there

[sullen vigil]

There's some tricks for it. But it takes some explaining and i woke up like 2 minutes ago.

[proven remnant]

I would super appreciate it when you get the chance

[elder cairn]

All of my physbone avatars are broken on quest, what is happening?

[gilded stream]

So I never looked at it, but how does skinned mesh's bounding box work with phys bones and large stretching? Do you have to assign your bounding box with the assumption of stretching?

[sullen vigil]

Depends. Are they going to be looking away when grabbing it?

As if so then yes.

[gilded stream]

Gotcha, I figured that was the case.

[sullen vigil]

Ifoptimzation is not an issue or it's for a separate grabbable object you could also just physically put the object on the end of the bone. Then the object only needs it's own little bounding box

[gilded stream]

Yeah, I already have that for one of my objects. Was thinking more about tails and such.

Hmm, so since we can't use constraints on Quest, is there an alternative method to that?

Also question, how is Physbones synced? Is it still similar to Dynamic Bones where the calculations are done locally but with minor events synced?

[sullen vigil]

from what i seen i think the part that's synced is if a bone is grabbed. what bone, and from what point.
other then that, like dynamic bones. there's no sync.

[gilded stream]

Ah, so basically if that bone gets animated in some fashion that a quest user can't see, then it won't update for them?

[sullen vigil]

basically.

[gilded stream]

Well shoot

[sullen vigil]

what's the goal?

[gilded stream]

I have an object that can be pulled from my hand. I wanted to make the stretch distance fairly far but keeping the bone for the object that sits in my hand in the right location, I was using long bones and constraints.

Is there a way to make an object stretch farther but still be attached to your body in the same spot?

[lime yarrow]

#open-beta-discussion message

[half tiger]

I am never leaving beta

[gilded stream]

What about hanging out with all your friends?

[half tiger]

Never.

[subtle wharf]

yo could there be different shapes for contact senders/receivers? or colliders for physbones?

[half tiger]

I got my close friends on beta and the chill ppl on beta worlds

[molten cobalt]

but what are you going to do once the beta is done

[subtle wharf]

personally i enjoy the beta way more, not only is it calmer, but there's no children at all

[half tiger]

Right

[half tiger]

Die.

[gilded stream]

Yes... calmer... Flashback to furry getting his PP tugged 😨

[half tiger]

[opal valley]

I think I kinda did this by parenting my bone to another long bone with no weights.

[gilded stream]

Hmm, I'm having trouble visualizing that.

[near grove]

havent played around with contacts much but i was wondering if the contacts have to be on any bone/mesh or if it can just be floating individually from the avatar

say i wanted one over my shoulder or so but not in contact with my model or any bone

[molten cobalt]

yes they don't have to be attached to your bones

[near grove]

nice

[molten cobalt]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6V7hJVwn-Cs&t=8s

[near grove]

ty i forgot about these tutorials

[timber jewel]

seems a bit over dramatic don't you think? 😅

[opal valley]

Looks silly but I can stretch the object very far and it's original bone stays the same.

[half tiger]

I said that as a joke. Not trying to be serious

[timber jewel]

Yeah ik just like my reply to it was lmao

[gilded stream]

Hmm, how would I do something like this if say I wanted my object to follow my hand when it's not being pulled?

[half tiger]

Ok, just wanted to make sure

[timber jewel]

No problem xD

[opal valley]

I'm not too sure. Something with constraints I would guess. I'm still trying to figure it out too. xP

[gilded stream]

Yeah I know how to do it with contraints, but that's not Quest compatible unfortunately.

[opal valley]

Oh, I see.

[near grove]

i wish

after day 1 all the quest users figured out how to get in

meaning children start showing up

I had some child just screaming his lungs out in one lobby

another he was just going up to people looking for attention

many examples i wont go over but in short there are more children than id expect

oh yeah one screamed at me when they saw my wobbling skeleton avatar

i couldnt even tell what emotion they were conveying from it

was it fear? excitement?

i couldnt fucking tell

maybe he was just screaming for the hell of it idk

[gilded stream]

Lol

[near grove]

I avoid public lobbies if I can mostly because of kids

in beta i cant do that because i want to see what other people are doing with the new systems, talk about how they work, and then use that info for future reference

also because people like to harass furries in public lobbies and I'm not about being on the receiving end of insults because I have a furry avatar

its cool what people have been making

[elder cairn]

May i have some help cuz i look like a desktop player even tho im on quest

[near grove]

the most interesting ive seen so far is a functional omatone and a keyboard for mutes

[near grove]

then just shave yourself. they cant make fun of you for being a furry if you have no fur.

[gilded stream]

I saw the keyboard, that was really cool.

[near grove]

but I'm uploading a test avatar on the same base I used to make my main avi, just using the default textures. uploading with the beta SDK to see how this particular avatar looks with physbones and what I can do with it

https://tenor.com/view/bingus-gif-18888188

[near grove]

galaxy brain

[elder cairn]

Help pls i literally cant do anything

[near grove]

I'm not sure personally

I'm only just dipping my toes in myself

[errant rose]

Is there a physbone in the hip?

[near grove]

im gonna throw out a guess and say you probably but phys bones in places you shouldnt have @elder cairn

phys bones in certain places breaks certain parts of the avatar

[errant rose]

Physbones act especially weird when placed in areas they shouldn't

[near grove]

like for example the wrist

[errant rose]

I'm still investigating that on mine

[near grove]

if you put a phys bone in the wrist you cant move your wrists

same with hips

[past dock]

where do i report a bug? if you have a duplicated parameter (in the phycisc bone branch) it breaks the avatar entirely

[errant rose]

I think gireison pointed that out before

It's especially weird with costum locomotion

[gilded stream]

Quite a few people have

[elder cairn]

I didnt make the avatar and its with every physbone avatar, they worked before

[errant rose]

Thank you for the tip though.

[near grove]

yeah same applies to like i said before the hips, but also the spine and neck

basically points of articulation break

[gilded stream]

Well, you can sort of if "Is Animated" is checked, but it will behave funny.

[errant rose]

I wonder why

Hm

[near grove]

it doesnt look great though

might as well just not have a phys bone there anyways

[gilded stream]

Yeah pretty pointless anyhow.

[errant rose]

True

[near grove]

i cant remember if they actually moved around

[errant rose]

It occurred to me that one of the avatar broke

[near grove]

when i get on later ill check my wobbly skeleton and see if it actually made any difference to have it

[errant rose]

But worked without a hitch with dynamic bones

[near grove]

i think everything from the elbow down to the wrist just freezes up

I think the transition is gonna break a lot of avatars

[errant rose]

For me, everything from the neck down just breaks

[near grove]

i mean yeah

conversion isnt 1:1

but its a fair exchange for what we get in return

[errant rose]

Surprisingly, some avatar worked without a hitch

[near grove]

definitely a good trade-off

[errant rose]

But some with more complex dynamic bone setups break

[near grove]

having to fix certain dyn bone avatars but you can do more with them now

exactly

now my character is generally more expressive as a result of everyone actually being able to see it

and I can adjust my jaw

i still need to figure out how to stretch it though

[errant rose]

Isn't there an option in the Physbone description that allows you to stretch it

[near grove]

yeah but im talking about the actual model stretching with it

[errant rose]

I saw it ingame before and it's finicky

[near grove]

i can stretch the bone its (what im assuming is) the animator stuff i need to figure out

[chrome parcel]

I literally can't find a pc player in the avatar dynamics world

[near grove]

makes sense

I think quest players are more excited because we finally get physics and stuff after not having it for so long

beta is being flooded by quest users excited for phys bones

I'm sure the physbones aren't as exciting for people who've had dynamic bones this whole time

[near grove]

exactly! we're just pumped lol

not quite

its actually very exciting for pc players

especially avatar creators

[molten cobalt]

it's a lot better performance and the touching each other's bones and having them moving is new for us as well

[near grove]

since you can actually interact with them and so all kinds of stuff without plugins and with better performance

No I get that what I'm saying is Quest players haven't had anything like this at all

and i personally refused to use dynamic bones because there was no point in utilizing it if most people wouldnt see it anyways

Eh. I always put them in the PC versions of my avatars

Mostly so I could sign in on my PC and record some clips of it

buuuuuut I'm super hype for the avatar dynamics stuff

having something universal that's compatible on all platforms is gonna be wayyyy cool

[ashen terrace]

Most of mines didn't because I use gravity lol

[errant rose]

hmm

could gravity affect an avatar?

hm

it appears the gravity in the bone i set the physbone up is at zero

strange

[ashen terrace]

It's a dynamic bones setting, the auto conversion seems to delete any gravity I had on old avatars

Also my one avatar that animated dynamic bones on/off seems messed up now

I use values like -0.01 to -0.001 which do have an effect

It gives me nice droopy ears

[errant rose]

hm

i might have to analyse the settings

since the avatar previously had dynamic bones in the chest

[torpid reef]

Gravity at the moment for physbones act like force, which is not what gravity did for dynamic bones.

[fiery mist]

got me some stiff hair with that slider

[torpid reef]

Yeah it is trying to force it down

[timber jewel]

but isn't that what gravity should do?

[chrome parcel]

aaaa

I'm so happy

parameters with avatar dynamics are locals so i can do as many contacts as i want

16 contacts

ermergerd

i'll never run out

[torpid reef]

Well comparing gravity from dynamic bones the way most are used to is that gravity had a gradual change based on your bones angle. So if you were standing normally the gravity amount would be low but if you were upside down then the gravity would be maxed out.

Force in the other hand did what we got at the moment.

[timber plinth]

i think there needs to be a more clean and flexible way to disable physbones that doesnt involve making the object Inactive or the component Inactive, because there needs to be a way to reset the bones back to their original resting positions to fix bugs with stretching and frozen positioning that is convoluted to deal with otherwise. Something simple like how Enabled works with unity constraints should do the trick

[torpid reef]

Yeah I really want a reset all bones button. I keep posing my bones without noticing.

[timber plinth]

reminder that Gravity was one of the worst things in DB and that Force was way better if you wanted dangling

[timber plinth]

well sure but what i was asking for is something completely different

[torpid reef]

Ah yeah

[timber plinth]

if you have an animation to toggle tongue dynamics so it doesnt flop about when your mouth is closed

theres like 50 things that go wrong when disabling the component

especially if someone is currently holding it or has posed it

[timber jewel]

Tbh I feel like what we have whith Phys Bones makes more sense to call gravity

[torpid reef]

Cant you animate the properties?

[timber plinth]

yes and no

[timber jewel]

since it acutally pulls stuff down and works like gravity should do

[timber plinth]

in order to force the change to happen you need to toggle the physbone object

[torpid reef]

True

[timber plinth]

and only works in one direction

would be neat to see physbone wind

[torpid reef]

That too

[timber plinth]

and world gravity reactive physbones

[torpid reef]

Yeah having them collide to world like floor and walls would be cool

[timber jewel]

yeah I acutally used to have a floor collider sphere on my Avatar because I didn't want my Tail to go through the floor, with Phys Bones I now just use a plane collider

[torpid reef]

Which is nice that we finally have a plane collider :)

[timber jewel]

yesss

[torpid reef]

Ive also seen people use it like a way to constrain skirts

[timber jewel]

I love them

[timber plinth]

although thats pretty much its only use

[timber jewel]

I was so confused at first when I added a plane collider, since there was no way to change it's size

[timber plinth]

i like the physbone collisions in general

since it collides with the entire capsule not just the bone points

[torpid reef]

Yeah

[timber plinth]

no longer do i have weird moments where my hand just phases through my chains

[torpid reef]

Thats true!

[timber jewel]

but then I found out that it's basically as big as it can be xD

[timber plinth]

its infinitely large

Limit Angle is also a god send

Stiffness is total trash

[timber jewel]

One thing that's a bit meh is that only your hands are used to collide with other people

[torpid reef]

I do wish we could split the limit angle tho

[timber plinth]

i like it that way personally although it would be nice to add feet

[timber jewel]

even manually adding idk foot collider won't work

[timber jewel]

Yeah I made a canny for that aswell, so that we can decide in the Avatar descrpitor to also use feet.
https://feedback.vrchat.com/open-beta/p/1181-suggestion-for-a-better-collider-section-in-the-avatar-descriptor

One thing I find kinda weird is that with Phys Bones, you now basically always have to add and end point otherwhise the last bone in a chain is always missing

This is with endpoints manually set (and how it was with Dynmaic Bones)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/829777956641308692/950405321115992114/unknown.png

And this is how it looks without manually adding end points
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/829777956641308692/950405445435150366/unknown.png

[torpid reef]

Ive not really had this happen, maybe it is because that model didnt exported with end bones?

[timber jewel]

no, it has no end points

because before they weren't requierd

with Phys Bones you now need those sadly

Oh yeah and btw since we were talking about plain colliders, they are shown in the Avatar Menu when you have Phys Bones in the Avatar Overlay activated
https://feedback.vrchat.com/open-beta/p/1181-plane-collider-is-shown-in-avatar-menu-when-phys-bones-avatar-overlay-is-tu

[velvet flax]

does anyone know the default for when everything converts?

just the default settings

[timber jewel]

Im mean I guess there are some conversion values but idk

[timber plinth]

thats how its always been though

even in the dynamic bone era, not having an end bone means you don’t get a collider at the end of your chain, and you don’t get rotation at the end of your chain either

[timber jewel]

nope, with Dynmiac Bones it wasn't needed

[timber plinth]

it was needed, or at least an end offset length

i know this because i had to purposefully place an end bone at each dynamic bone chain or export with leaf bones in order for them to work properly

there is also something to note with how stretching works in physbones

[timber jewel]

Hm, I mean I made a video comparing it:
https://youtu.be/oKkCS8KzNqg

with Dynmiac Bones, the last bone in the Chain of the Whiskers moved, with Phys Bones they didn't

[timber plinth]

dynamic bones also require an endpoint like i said before, you can tell because without an end point you will not have a sphere collider at the end of your chain

compare it with something more obvious like the tail or ears

[timber jewel]

hmmm I will look in to that again when I'm home

But with Pyhs Bones the last bone in the chain wasn't moved anymore compared to Dynamic Bones

maybe Auto Conversion doesn't like it? idk

[timber plinth]

in dynamic bones the last bone in the chain is not rotated

If you use end offset length in dynamic bones it might not translate properly when auto converting

disable auto conversion before comparing them

[timber jewel]

hm yeah maybe it's the auto conversion, I have to look in to it when I'm back home

if it's the auto conversion it's still a bit meh, since it would always miss the last bone

[timber plinth]

https://feedback.vrchat.com/open-beta/p/1181-request-enableactive-property-for-physbones-colliders-and-contacts

[near grove]

is there any documentation on how to use the parameters for phys bones

im not sure the short explanation is good enough for me

[twilit needle]

Does anyone know where to get avatars with the new dynamics on quest

[timber jewel]

https://docs.vrchat.com/v2022.1.2/docs/physbones

there is a Parameter secion in there

[near grove]

ah

didnt see

[novel shore]

in open beta physic bones
avatars 3.0 movements is not natural
but if i swich with avatars 2.0 everything is normal

[ashen terrace]

I beg to differ

I'm gonna need to make some recordings and cannies when I get home

But there's different uses of each

[timber plinth]

Gravity wasnt bad because it interpolated itself, it was bad because it multiplies with elasticity

meaning as you rotated the root the chain would get increasingly more stiff

and it would just be awful, turning into some sort of hyperactive springy plank

[torpid reef]

Thats true, but it was the only effect which allowed to keep the rest pose when standing straight

[timber plinth]

yea

[torpid reef]

If they could do a similar effect but less stiffness it would be nice

[timber plinth]

but at the cost of making it not even act like a dynamic bone anymore

Physbones has a nice balance since now Pull and Gravity are both forces

the Spring setting is really funky though

its like similar to the inverse of Damping in DB

but it also affects the force

so its really strange

[torpid reef]

I still dont know what pull is actually doing

[timber plinth]

pull is a multiplier that controls how much force is used to get the bones into their resting position

spring is how much it will wiggle

but it also affects the force

since less wiggly makes it look more elastic/stiff

[torpid reef]

alright

[timber plinth]

honestly the only real way to calibrate them is to pop them on in play mode and mess about

[torpid reef]

yeah, I just converted my values from my dynamic bones so ive been scared to mess with it

[lapis bone]

So...when's avatar dynamics coming out?

[timber plinth]

i kinda wish the sdk had an edit physbones button

where u can play with it like its in play mode but it retains your settings

[torpid reef]

you can always copy the component script and paste it when outside of playmode

[timber plinth]

yes but unless you have a program to do that for you its tedious

and you can only do it one at a time

[torpid reef]

Hopefully not soon, there is alot of things needed to be fixed/adjusted/added

[timber jewel]

I think that's not really possibile, I just go to play mode, change the settings and then copy the component

I guess it stays in beta for a month or so

[timber plinth]

it should be possible to run the simulation whenever you want, or at the very least to copy the component values to stack and then rewrite them

[lapis bone]

Dammit-

[torpid reef]

You can always join the beta

[timber jewel]

I prefer it that way, so they can get rid of most of the issues

(and hopfully add better conversion)

[timber plinth]

the main thing also is that the only people in the beta are people who want to beta test so youre not going to find anyone outside of like the same 40 people and in no other lobby than the dynamics hub

[timber jewel]

true

[timber plinth]

i remember people being surprised to see me in the hub only to realize that

[timber plinth]

they probably will get a little bit better at transferring values but i don’t think it will ever be 1:1

older quest avatars won’t have dynamics anyways so i assume with time they will eventually phase out of public use

especially given the vast number of quest users

stiffness for example theres no way it can translate over perfectly

[timber jewel]

nah it will never be 1:1

[ashen terrace]

Sooo

[timber plinth]

because stiffness works as a cone from the root bone

limit angle is based on each bone

[torpid reef]

I keep getting into lobbies where people on live are in the physbone hub..

so it is actually empty

[timber plinth]

same, its silly

idk what they think theyre accomplishing

[ashen terrace]

They're trying to test the dynamics

[timber jewel]

limit angle is nice though, can prevent stuff from going inside me xD

[ashen terrace]

I met some people that were confused

[timber plinth]

the tutorial to get on the beta is the first thing you see and its a huge wall

[timber jewel]

Yeah same I don't really get why

[timber plinth]

all we need now is to force you to read it and press Confirm to be able to continue into the world

[torpid reef]

What is reading lol

[ashen terrace]

I never saw some tutorial on the world

[timber plinth]

will be annoying for open beta playees but at least would get people to not just walk past the info screen

[timber plinth]

u must be blind

[ashen terrace]

The first thing I saw was avatar pedestals

And a mirror

[torpid reef]

Its off to the side of the spawn

[timber plinth]

look 10° to the right and there is a red colored ui box

tells you how to get onto the beta branch in steam

doesnt show the quest process tho

[torpid reef]

Ive met alot of quest users who couldnt get to live

[timber plinth]

i have it memorized in my head because of how many times i went there

[timber plinth]

lol yea if they werent in the discord server they were out of luck

[timber jewel]

That's what I think when people ask questions in here that were awnserd in #open-beta-info and #open-beta-announcements xD