avatar-rigging

[crisp tendon]

Plenty of good tutorials on YouTube to learn about it and how to do it

[steel spire]

i'm more of a text guy

:pain:

[steel spire]

what's this like as a base? (haven't done hands and fingers yet)

[fierce grail]

https://docs.vrchat.com/docs/rig-requirements

[steel spire]

i've already been looking at that
i'm just asking about the bone positions and that

[fading verge]

this is really frustrating as fuck, anyone can help me this problem?

[fierce grail]

You're missing required bones: https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/251862595030482955/404301325380091906/guide.png?width=283&height=300

[steel spire]

t
that's
not what i'm asking about

i know i'm missing bones

i'm asking about the positions

[fierce grail]

Although in case of SDK3 avatars you don't need fingers.

[steel spire]

i'd rather not do every bone, then have to redo everything because of bad positioning

[fierce grail]

You're missing shoulder bones as well. It would be the best if your model was T-posing. Hip bone could be added as well, but it's optional.

[modern lantern]

Positioning should be close to how the human bone is, so you can just do it approximately. It also dictates pivot point for joint rotation.

[steel spire]

god i can't figure this out

[brisk terrace]

Im having a weird issue, i have a weapon with some bones to animate it but in unity the bone is moving a lot more than what is weightpainted to it.

[steel spire]

how would i have eye tracking for a "flat" eye (one that moves around, doesn't rotate)

setting up eye tracking causes left/right to not work and up/down to make the eyes raise into the head or out of it

possibly related issue, the eye bones don't seem to be influencing the eyes enough

rest

moved

[brisk terrace]

mmmm maybe use normal bone to rotate and then use the bone that actually moves the eye to link to it using a position constraint and lock some of the axis down

so it slides instead of rotates

[steel spire]

i'm trying to understand but this is my first time creating an armature so i don't understand

[sudden coral]

symmetry was on, after a long time I found that it was an option under symmetry called something like 'vertex groups' or something, which makes sense now, but i couldn't find it anywhere online

[steel spire]

also, how should i set up the legs?
should i have two bones within the hip that go sideways, or just have bones in the legs themselves parented to the hip?

[crisp tendon]

Parented to the hips yes

[steel spire]

alright

this good?

[crisp tendon]

You also need feet bones

[steel spire]

i know, just adding those

gottem

[crisp tendon]

I'm not sure what the behavior is going to be if they're straight like that

[steel spire]

oh, woulda thought it'd make sense since it's going from the top of the foot to the bottom
take it they're better off at an angle?

[kindred pollen]

keep this in mind o:

[steel spire]

i'm trying to base it off something like that, but since he's a square boy i need to adapt it
and since i'm a total newbie with rigging i don't know the best way to adapt things

[crisp tendon]

You'll also need custom animations too if you want it to move as it should

[steel spire]

oh no

i think it should still be fine though, i've done some messing with posing and while a bit uncanny it's humanoid enough to work

is this terrible

[kindred pollen]

I have no idea how the IK'll resolve that lol

[steel spire]

what'd be the best way to set it up

[kindred pollen]

I'd recommend setting it up like the image I linked above shows, if you want to use VRChat's IK/animation set o:

If you're gonna rig it up as a Generic rig then it doesn't really matter how you rig it, but it won't work in VR (i.e hands and head won't be tracked afaik?)

[steel spire]

so should i have two bones in the feet?
i'm not sure how i'd set them up with the whole vector stuff

[kindred pollen]

You don't need a toe bone, but your avatar's foot might hover off the ground if you go too high - shouldn't be a problem here because of the avatar's design

afaik you do need at least 3 finger bones on each hand (thumb, index and middle) mapped for the IK to work, but they don't need to be weight-painted to anything

[steel spire]

yeah, i'm intending on setting up the finger bones soon
does the foot bone need to be directly connected to the knee one?
i'd assume i have to have the tip of it be on the ground?

[kindred pollen]

it should be connected, and yeah

[steel spire]

should i try having the end angled and scaled so it touches the lower front of the foot?

[kindred pollen]

sorry, clarify? o:
generally if you want to use VRChat's IK/anim set, set it up pretty much exactly how the image shows
#avatar-rigging message

again toe bones being optional c:

[steel spire]

i mean, i can't have the bone sideways or it won't touch the floor and the knee bone

but if i had it at an angle so it's at the edge of the foot while still connected to the knee bone would it be alright?

like this

[kindred pollen]

oop, sorry for the delay - I'd recommend dropping the bottom of the knee bone down a bit for that though

[blazing dust]

can someone help me? So, I did everything I needed to do, I made sure of it, but my avatar is stuck in a t-pose position... How do I fix?

I'm trying to get all the help I can so sorry if I'm bugging everyone

[kindred pollen]

would you mind sending a screenshot of your rig? o:

[steel spire]

how's this?

[blazing dust]

sure

[kindred pollen]

ankle could be a bit higher but otherwise that should be fine afaik

[steel spire]

how 'bout this?

[kindred pollen]

yup!

[steel spire]

👍

thanks

[blazing dust]

Heres one

[kindred pollen]

Your hip bone is below the tops of your thigh bones, which can cause issues (though not constant T-posing issues) - also, would you mind sending a closer screenshot of one of the hands? o:
also, the Build Control Panel might have some errors/warnings listed, as well as the Unity console

should be a button to open the console at the top-left of the asset browser

[kindred pollen]

there's..lots of issues there lol
The hand should be rigged in a flat open position, not curled in on itself - the fingers also aren't straight and I can't tell if a thumb bone is mapped there or not?

def keep this in mind:

[blazing dust]

ok

so what do I do? just click the 'Enforce T-Pose' button or..?

[kindred pollen]

could try that to see if it fixes it, but otherwise I'd recommend changing it in Blender

[kindred pollen]

still the hip bone issue but should otherwise be fine - are at least the index, middle and thumb bones mapped?

[blazing dust]

yes

[kindred pollen]

Make sure that there aren't any errors/warnings in the build control panel, and make sure that there aren't any in the Unity console as well

[blazing dust]

k

[steel spire]

oh god i can't get bends working right

im not sure if i'll be able to do this

[steel spire]

i might just

see if someone would be up to re-rigging for me

[steel spire]

okay would anyone be alright with doing that
i can give either the base file that's fully rigged, or the file i've been working on

[kindred pollen]

might want to look in VRCTraders, one of the #community-servers-old and/or https://ask.vrchat.com/c/commissions/avatar-commissions/35 for that o:

[steel spire]

alright

[blazing dust]

So, I tested it again. It still is stuck in a t-pose

[rare hamlet]

When I'm in Lyuma play mode and in game, my avatar's fingers are rolled slightly. They look fine in Blender and Unity (not play mode). How do I fix this?

[fierce grail]

I'd check bone rolls in Blender.

[rare hamlet]

What’s the correct bone roll for VRC rigs? Last I checked the flat side of the finger bones are pointing upward

Do I need to zero all bone rolls or something?

[fierce grail]

Zero bone rolls yes

[rare hamlet]

I’ll try that. Thx

[rare hamlet]

Seems like the scale is off also. The bones look longer in Unity than they do in Blender.

"Apply Transforms" in object mode doesn't seem to help

That in Blender was what I tried

[main shore]

Anyone have a good tutorial on rigging accessories?

[hexed cypress]

anyone happen to know what may be causing these vertices to detach from export in blender to unity? I've gone back roughly 20 times today and to no avail, same result no matter what weight painting i confirm is done... hmmmm

[crisp tendon]

Did you make sure those parts move correctly in Blender ?

Are the bones still there in Unity ?

Which export are you using ?

[hexed cypress]

they sure do

by selecting the body then the armature and just standard ol export i do with every model

[crisp tendon]

[hexed cypress]

yeh, i am a bit stumpt

[crisp tendon]

Did you try with the cats export ?

[hexed cypress]

i never use cats

[crisp tendon]

And that's a fresh reimport in Unity ?

[hexed cypress]

that's right

[crisp tendon]

What are the bone names ?

Did you check your shapekeys ?

[hexed cypress]

same naming convention for vrc

all shape keys are good

i separated the mesh for the cloak and made sure to remove them before rejoining to the body again

still same issue

[crisp tendon]

I just noticed that your shoulders, arms and lower arm bones were all disconnected and far apart, is there a reason for that ?

[hexed cypress]

none really but i've been using this rig over the past year and it's been scaled perfectly for FBT

only thing i added was the cloak

just re-exported. named the fbx differently and still

[crisp tendon]

Are you sure the clock isn't weight painted to something it shouldn't be ?

It's very easy to make a blunder like that without noticing

[hexed cypress]

i went through every vertex group

[crisp tendon]

And there's no cloth/dynamic bones i assume

[hexed cypress]

2 for the sides so it drapes and swings back and forth

found that those were twisted 170 degrees and zeroed them out

[crisp tendon]

Could be fucky collision then

[hexed cypress]

but that still didn't fix it

i don't use any collision

[crisp tendon]

So the issue is still there before the dynamic bones ?

[hexed cypress]

are there any import options in blender, in the Model tab, that could be messing with verts?

and yes

when i applied an animator to test the humanoid rig, this pose is the proxy_stand_still

t-pose looks perfectly fine

just very odd, when i move the bones in the animator, the verts are detached but then back in blender, they are moving perfectly fine with the bones

[crisp tendon]

No constraints or modifiers ?

In your hierarchy you have a ton of stuff, and exporting with manual selection is a bit risky

Could be something else in blender that doesn't make its way to unity

[hexed cypress]

only the body mesh and armature are selected on export with the "selected objects" bubble ticked

[crisp tendon]

Kinda out of guesses, there might be a lot of things done here that i'm not aware of

in terms of rigging, weight painting, exporting, importing

[unreal jay]

I'm just wondering how I would go about rigging a hanging chain or cable for Unity if I intend to use dynamic bones. the red dots should be anchor points, I would really respect having some ideas thrown my way

[sage patio]

you may need to use FinalIK

I've also heard of a shader specifically for ropes, but that probably isn't as flexible as a proper IK solution

[unreal jay]

thank you!

[crisp tendon]

I'd personally have an upside down bone above the middle that has the whole chain painted to it

that way when the bone rotates the chain rotates with the bone head

[unreal jay]

So like limiting it's movement on 2 axis, right?

[crisp tendon]

only X probably

[unreal jay]

I figured I might have to resort to that, giving it a dangling effect seems to be a bit more complicated.

thank you though

[crisp tendon]

Well with the dynamic bone you get the effect

[fallen temple]

When in full body, I've noticed my toes are a bit tilted upwards, and the rest of the foot goes to the sides. Did I rig them wrong?

Oh lol nvm I see why now, but still having issues with the toes

[hexed cypress]

yeah, i explained everything and what steps i took to try to solve it. i guess i'm trying to hyper-optimize too much :/

[crisp tendon]

What are you trying to optimize btw ?

[hexed cypress]

not using cloth sim and using the least amount of dynamic bones

[hexed cypress]

after about the literal 50th time, ended up having to completely remove weighting from the bits of the cloak that were meant to move with my dynamic bones since they' were being held in place by the other parts of the mesh that are stationary

no more mech wings lol

thank you for your help and insight @crisp tendon ! 🙂

[crisp tendon]

Wish i could have figured out the issue

[hexed cypress]

that was my work around! i completely removed any weighting from the hips/spine/chest since those areas didn't need to be attached to my dynamic bones! :)))

[brisk terrace]

when i use CATS it said i don't need to do the full body fix but when we tried the model in full body, the hips was spun out 180 degrees.

how do i fix it now ?

[crisp tendon]

Is your bone rotated ?

[brisk terrace]

the pointed end is up

[crisp tendon]

Make sure to clear bone rolls

And apply all transforms in object mode before export

[brisk terrace]

visual or object transform

it looked like this

[crisp tendon]

That is a massive hip bone wtf

It's also at the same height or lower than the legs

[brisk terrace]

same height

[crisp tendon]

Yeah that's bad

https://youtu.be/2sfTEBAl8sA

[brisk terrace]

oh that's a long video

but ty

but that video doesn't help with the bone setup ... just the realbody scaling.

how do i clear bone rolls?

[crisp tendon]

ctrl + R in edit mode

[brisk terrace]

that makes me roll the bone

[crisp tendon]

It shouldn't, it zeroes it out

[brisk terrace]

so i set it to zero

[crisp tendon]

Maybe a 2.79 thing

[brisk terrace]

so having the bone at 0 roll is fine then

[crisp tendon]

yes

but your hip bone should be straight

[brisk terrace]

ok i changed that too

the FB now should be good ?

cause the model had a very rotated hip

much more than what the bone was

[crisp tendon]

Your bones need to be connected

[brisk terrace]

but not the hip to leg ?

cause im getting confused with what you said earlier

about the hip bone being the same height as the legs

[sage patio]

@brisk terrace the "head" of the bone is what defines where the bone is

aka the larger sphere

[brisk terrace]

ok

so..... how is it suppose to be place? is it at the same height as the legs or not and by connected do you mean the other end has to match the spine

[crisp tendon]

hip bone doesn't need to be this small, but the rotation/location should be like the above

[brisk terrace]

ok done. and what about the apply transform said earlier ... i have 2 choices

apply object or visual transform

[crisp tendon]

go with object

[brisk terrace]

ok... and this should fix the FB problem of the hips spinning around ?

[crisp tendon]

Hopefully

[brisk terrace]

should i just do the full body fix in cats instead?

[crisp tendon]

You should not no

[brisk terrace]

ok the avatar is completely remade now... going to see if it works

[brisk terrace]

all good now ty

[brazen wolf]

does anyone know why unity would altar or remove finger bones?

seems to do this alot for me

[brazen wolf]

nvm it merged incorrectly and i didn't notice

[vestal condor]

How does one weight paint a jaw bone and get the inside of the mouth? Ping me.

[crisp tendon]

you hide the rest

[vestal condor]

I've tried going into edit mode and hiding parts of the mesh, but they reappear

[crisp tendon]

You need to enable vertex masking in weight paint

top left corner, tiny cube with dots on the corner

[vestal condor]

Alright ty, ill look that up

[clever wind]

im attempting a quadruped ik thing

you think this would work in vr chat

?

[bleak halo]

Can anyone tell me why in Blender, the arm looks correct, but when I export it to FBX and port into Unity, the arm gets bent all weird?

[crisp tendon]

Are your bones connected in blender ? What does the armature look like ?

[steel halo]

Could someone help me with rigging an arm? No matter what I or the person I commissioned try it ends up looking janky in game

[crisp tendon]

help doing what ?

[steel halo]

Arm rigging

The entire thing is kind of janky

At this point I'm so desperate I'd offer payment lmao

[crisp tendon]

Yeah but what does that mean ? How does it look and how is it currently rigged

[steel halo]

Like it functions but the shoulder is really messed up, the elbow is very jagged, and part of the hand doesn't bend into the wrist properly

[supple knot]

That's a weight painting issue then

[steel halo]

Yeah I suspected that as well but my commissioner insists it isn't

I sent the model to a friend who is familiar with this kind of stuff and he didn't see the issue

[bleak halo]

@crisp tendon unfortunately, this is one of the FFVII models I wanted to take a crack at and it has a ton of bones. From what I can tell, everything is attached properly. What else might you you need to see explicitly that may help rule out other things?

[crisp tendon]

Can you post videos/pics of the issue/armature in blender

[crisp tendon]

They need to be connected in the bone level, where you chose the parent there's a "connected" checkbox

[steel halo]

The issue really doesn't show up in blender, it's only once in VRC

[crisp tendon]

Trust me

[steel halo]

I mean what do you want pictures of

[crisp tendon]

The bone rotations are kinda all over the place

and the arm/shoulder bones aren't connected

Also the shoulder bones are super large

[bleak halo]

@crisp tendon So I checked and none of the bones on this model have that "connected" box checked. I'm assuming that needs to be done then. Is there anything else I should look for before exporting again with those bone changes?

[crisp tendon]

Can you show the armature in the model in blender ? I assume it moves correctly in pose mode

If so, apply pose as rest pose with Cats addon

[bleak halo]

It's ugly, but here's what the armature looks like inside the model. I hope this is what you were asking for. And yes, as far as I can tell, everything moves correctly in pose mode.

[crisp tendon]

I think you need to change the parent of the twist bone in each forearm

You can see they're parented to the upper arm instead

and i believe that is the issue'

the twist bone being the tiny bone between the upper and lower arm

[bleak halo]

So looking at it, it looks like that little bone is parented to the right arm, should that be parented to the elbow instead? Or am I misunderstanding?

[crisp tendon]

Yep, elbow

[bleak halo]

Will this be another situation that I will need to check the "connected" box as well on that tiny bone?

[crisp tendon]

You need to change the parent bone

and that's good

twist bones are generally already placed in the exact same spot as their parent bone

[bleak halo]

So I tried it and it looked good in Unity, but when doing a test, I'm getting weird arm rotations. What's interesting is when I do "emotes" things look right as far as I can tell, but when it goes back to the idle animation, I can literally see the arms twist to the incorrect position. Then of course movement animations also look wrong at the elbow as well. Starting to think this model is a bust XD

[crisp tendon]

Do you have a custom idle animation ?

I'd suggest trying to clear bone rolls in blender and do a clear export

alt + R in edit mode

on all bones

[bleak halo]

I don't believe I've ever touched the idle anims or made any custom ones outside of gestures/fx layer stuff. I suppose it's possible I accidentally made a change on the default anim, but I haven't noticed any other avatars behaving this way. And thank you, I'll try that. Is there any cleanup work that needs to be done after clearing bone rolls?

[crisp tendon]

Nope, it's a one step operation

[bleak halo]

Come to think of it, is it possible to test the walk/idle anims within unity? That would speed up my testing progress on this a ton lol

[crisp tendon]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/361742235525709825/367234075338997760/view_guide.png?width=152&height=676

this but with idle controller

[bleak halo]

Thank you, I'll try it out. Regardless if I'm able to get this model to work or not, I really appreciate your help!

[crisp tendon]

No worries, feel free to ping me if you've got further questions

[bleak halo]

Are these generally errors that can be ignored when there are many extra fluff bones on arms/legs or do they usually mean bad things?

[sage patio]

you can ignore them

[bleak halo]

Awesome, thanks!

[supple knot]

https://tenor.com/xdsf.gif

[crisp tendon]

It's a very old image

[umbral sandal]

Sorry, I have a question about blender & CATS please (I'm a zbrush user so i am severely lacking overall knowledge about blender)
So I imported the fbx to blender, rigged it. Then found a tutorial that mentioned CATS, do I have to re-import the fbx file then start rigging from the start using CATS?
And must I merge all mesh into a single piece (including coat, hair and eyeballs) or I can leave them as separated meshes ?
Big thanks

[crisp tendon]

Cats doesn't do rigging
It's better to only separate skinned meshes that have blendshapes out from those that don't

So coat, hair and eyeballs should all go together with the rest of the body

You might just want to separate the head/face and remove the blendshape from the other mesh

[umbral sandal]

About the eyeballs, if i merge them all together then rig, would the eye bones interfere with the face mesh ? I usually rig the eyes & face separately with 2 set of bones for 3d printing. Im not sure how would that work on vrc avatar XD

[crisp tendon]

One armature, two meshes

The eyes can go with the face or the body, doesn't matter much

[umbral sandal]

right, i'll try to dig deeper into that

thanks for the clarification

[crisp tendon]

no worries, feel free to ping me with any question you have

[umbral sandal]

On that topic @crisp tendon , could help to recommend an avatar making course for me please?

[frigid shuttle]

I was wondering if someone could tell me why there isn't a bone for the "Dyn_jaws" vertex group.
This is my first time rigging an avatar (since someone did it... well... very questionable) so I have no experience with Blender whatsoever.
The only time I used Blender was for CATS.

[twilit dock]

What's the default bone-setup for a humanoid model? Is there a reference picture I could use?

[frigid shuttle]

@twilit dock

[twilit dock]

Thanks a bunch!

[fading verge]

how can i rig this?

[crisp tendon]

Mixamo

[timber scarab]

I need rigging help

I don't what program I need to use

[kindred pollen]

most people use Blender c:

[pine sapphire]

@timber scarab Read the chat before you post. Ruuubick posted an answer to that same question right there. 🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️

[turbid garnet]

What # of polys is considered too much

[sleek isle]

70,000

[kindred pollen]

https://docs.vrchat.com/docs/avatar-performance-ranking-system#pc-limits

70k on PC, 20k on Quest

[turbid garnet]

Thx

I'm rigging MW & CW operators

I'm good with botching textures though lol

[slate stratus]

thats pretty useful tbh ^^

[vague gyro]

Anyone know what could cause an avatar to go "knock-kneed" in a crouch animation other than needing to move the knee joints in front of the hips and feet?

cause i'm having a weird case. a slight to moderate crouch causes the avatar to go knock-kneed, but a deep crouch fixes the issue and straightens the knees out like they're supposed to be. i've moved the knees in front of the hips/feet and reset roll on the bones, so i have no idea what's causing it

[supple knot]

If that happens it's usually a matter of the avatar's height/bone length

[vague gyro]

hmm, it's not too far out of proportion from what i usually use. i'm too tired to troubleshoot right now, i'll puzzle it out later. thanks for the tip, i'll try adjusting bone lengths if nothing else seems to be working

[brazen marsh]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/805856585163079720/805889581886210059/unknown.png

This is what i put together to follow, after awhile I stopped needing to use it but i still have it. The things indicated in red are required to have (if your avatar doesn’t use this such as feet for a ghost, you can still have it there just not tied to any mesh) The far left picture is what the default tutorial vrchat avatar’s hierarchy looks like in Blender. As long as you follow something of this nature you should be good to go.

[fierce grail]

Chest bone is required, Hips are optional

[brazen marsh]

yeah thank you for the reminder , this image is really really old lol

[broken haven]

Question about CATS plugin: can I prevent it from renaming all of my humanoid joints? I REALLY don't wanna have to redo all of the cloth colliders on my avatar because CATS renamed the joints and Unity no longer knows where the cloth colliders go. 🙃

[broken haven]

Nvm, no longer needed. Just fixed my legs myself instead of being a lazy bum and making CATS do it.

[winter plover]

anyone know why whenever i mess with my bone parenting(i messed something up the first time) it says i have nothing mapped?

[remote narwhal]

what should I select for my visemes?

[sage patio]

none of those, you are expected to use the AA, OH and CH shape keys

which your model does not have

if you create those yourselves, you would then be able to select them in the list and use them to create all of the other shape keys

[tidal jolt]

Hey, all. I've been working on a model for the past month. I have little to no experience with blender, yet I've made it this far purely by being able to follow tutorials and a little artistic application.

But I'm stuck at weight painting.

At this point, I'm doubtful a tutorial can help, and I'm reaching out for someone with a little experience with rigging to give me a shove in the right direction.

[sage patio]

@tidal jolt that is a very good looking model so far

this is the rig layout you should follow

toe bones are not required

after you have the bones, then comes the weight painting

you can use the automatic weights feature in blender when parenting the mesh to the armature to get you a head start

[tidal jolt]

@sage patio I've forgotten to mention that I do have an armature, and I've tried automatic weights. I guess I should try to re-orient my arms into a Tpose

[sage patio]

you should yea, but you can do that after weight painting to make that easier

since you'd just be able to move the bones to do that

did the automatic weights work?

or did it work but looked janky

[tidal jolt]

It worked, but yeah, there's clipping and deformation in ways that shouldn't be happening.

In green, I highlighted the drawstring- where is it going?
In red, the inside of the coat is getting dragged along as well.
You can see clipping where the rolled-up sleeve is supposed to squash and where the top clips through the coat.

I've noticed the hair bones dragging the coat's collar too. Annoying, to say the least

[sage patio]

good start. now would be the manual clean up part

in object mode, click on the mesh, then shift click the armature

then switch to Weight painting mode

to switch which vertex group you're weight painting to, hold CTRL and left click on the bones

or, you can manually select the group from the Vertex groups list

[tidal jolt]

Think I'll start with the drawstrings, and all that clipping in the front

[tidal jolt]

Gonna be honest, this image is less about the process and more about how I kinda gave up (for now). Mind you, I'll give this weight-painting stuff as many tries as it takes, but here's a funny image while I gather my sanity.

[sage patio]

lmao

I would also make sure that your model is symmetrical

both geometry wise (where it can be done) and bone wise

bone naming is also very important to make sure weight painting is mirrored correctly

[tidal jolt]

Oh it's all there, what you just said, I just kinda got frustrated and painted the whole pair of pants.

[sage patio]

lol

the gradient tool is VERY useful

for example

if you want to weight paint the lower leg, set weight slider to 1, click slightly above knee, and then drag down

that will paint everything below

then, set weight slider to 0, and click slightly above the ankle

and then drag down

if you want to limit your painting to a specific part of the mesh, go to edit mode, select what you want to paint, switch back to weight paint mode, and then click either the faces or vertices icon right next to the Weight painting mode drop down

[tidal jolt]

Now there's a good tip

[sage patio]

as a pro tip for selecting stuff, you can hit numpad +/- to expand/shrink your selection

and you can ALT + leftclick on a vertex/edge/face to select a loop

for example, a ring around the leg

[tidal jolt]

Oh god, my numpad is not present

[sage patio]

from there, you can expand the selection using numpad to select most of the leg

yea, I got a new keyboard specifically because of that lol

well, not just that

but a good reason'

you can always just remap it

or use the windows on screen keyboard kek

[tidal jolt]

I'll keep that in mind.

Frankly though, if my monkey brain can't just click a button and have all that happen, then I don't wanna mess with it.

[sage patio]

lol

[tidal jolt]

See my guy in my pfp? I'm gonna model him next if I can figure out how to finish this one.

[sage patio]

very nice 👌

[grand sinew]

is there a way to rig a tail that isn't too complicated? I'm making a character with a big tail, not looking for anything fancy, just don't want the tail to be full rigid while the character moves
I guess a hair rigging tutorial could also work
sorry if it's an stupid question, I'm kind of a noob here lol
(avatar is for desktop mode btw)

[supple knot]

People use dynamic bones for tails

It's like $20 on Unity Asset STore

[tiny pine]

what have i done wrong here?

https://cgi.tutsplus.com/tutorials/building-a-basic-low-poly-character-rig-in-blender--cg-16955

also this s the guide ive been following and the step im at is step 44

ah screw it im leaving it there tonight, im tired

[fading verge]

what file type do i need to export my model as for it to be rigged in unity?

[brazen marsh]

Recommended to be .fbx

[fading verge]

ok

[sage patio]

you don't rig stuff in unity

Unity is a game engine, not a 3d modeling program

you rig stuff in Blender

[fading verge]

for the model to still be rigged

[sage patio]

once you have a rigged model, then you can import it in unity

[fading verge]

ye, thats what i meant

[strong oxide]

Getting an error in unity, surrounding an avatar that I had previously uploaded, I don't know if I accidentally did something, but It's something to do with the spine hierarchy.

[kindred pollen]

Select the avatar's model file in the asset browser, then go to its rig import settings in the inspector and check that? o:

the chest bone there might have become unmapped for some reason

[strong oxide]

Thanks.

[untold wyvern]

hi, i've rigged this avatar trice now, one with 5 fingers and one with 3 but on both the hand looks like this? anyone know why?

[strong oxide]

I had once encountered an issue like that, it affected almost every finger on my avatar, I happened to have moved my avatar out of the rigs starting place, or so I'm to believe that's what my issue was, I'm not able to say much with regards to rigging because I don't know much about it.

[woven wing]

Hey, would anyone be able to help me with unity? Im working with a 3D model that a creator has built to hopefully create a new avatar.

[broken haven]

Wondering if anyone has worked out any means of having shoulders actually function with FBT. As it stands, FBIK completely ignores the shoulder joints, and it makes arms bend like pipes, and it looks absolutely terrible.
I don't think Unity constraints would work too well, unless I make the shoulders completely unweighted and use a dummy shoulder that's a child of the upper arm joint. But then the avatar will look bad without FBT.
Anybody have any ideas?

[woven wing]

How do you delete certain bones in unity?

[modest wagon]

How can I make sure that my avatars fingers won't go inside the palm when making a fist with the index controllers?

[broken haven]

Make your fingers shorter. lol

Or you can override the Index tracking and use a fist gesture animation instead with 3.0 avatar.

[modest wagon]

Well I don't wanna override it, but I could try the other option

[tiny pine]

Bone Heat Weighting: failed to find solution for one or more bones
got this error

is anyone able to help?

[sage patio]

@woven wing you don't. that's not what unity is for

you do that in a 3d modeling program, like Blender

@tiny pine scale the model up 100x before doing it

[tiny pine]

100x?

alright ill try that. and then anything else i should do when i do that?

[sage patio]

scale it back down after

I've heard that the issue can be caused by stuff being too close

[tiny pine]

ok so you're saying scale up the model to 100x, then scale it down 100x, then that should fix it?

actually theres also the fact that ive been dealing with the avatar 3x its normal size.
so that may be the problem

[cursive moss]

how should i be contraining my cloth (my cape) ? looks fine in unity https://i.gyazo.com/f8a6a9bb89dd36bb090420f499e0e3f7.mp4 but a travesty in game

actually this is a better representation of how it looks by default

[tiny pine]

1. i have no idea how to fix it
2. that looks quite good

[tidal jolt]

@sage patio Thanks, man. I'm getting somewhere now

[fading verge]

alright so im having this problem with cats to where it removes certain bones with this avatar, which are the arm bones. ive tried renaming them but cats still removes them nontheless. https://gyazo.com/d5c299fc1364feb79df6958f22be0910

[broken haven]

Shoulders probably have no weight. CATS removes bones with zero weights by default, try turning that option off.

[restive hatch]

Hi all! I just need some quick help with something - ill be upgrading to fullbody tracking in a week so im trying to work on a model thatll be compatible with that. Im a bit confused about how hip bones work however - will i be able to move my hips with an armature like this?

when it comes to putting models together im very used to not paying attention to the hip bone since i could only move my arms so i dont really know how this all works yet >_<

[sage patio]

@restive hatch that is pretty much what a hip bone should look like

[restive hatch]

Alright awesome, thanks! i just wasnt sure as moving the hip bone in blender moves the whole body for whatever reason 😓 but thats comforting to know!

[sage patio]

that's because the hip bone is the root bone

[restive hatch]

ahh i see, okay! Thanks heaps! :)

[obsidian sundial]

Does anyone know anything about the workflow from VRoid directly to Unity using the VRM Converter? I'm encountering this issue when converting to VRChat, which is preventing the hair from moving in-game at all

[crisp tendon]

Well, yeah, that's a bit much

[alpine cove]

Hi folks, my rig seems to be fitting right now and the controllers/trackers are exactly where they would be on my real body, but when I bind in my arms are always significantly bent and cannot fully extend. This is a little frustrating.

What edit should I do to tweak the severity of this issue?

[sage patio]

your User real height is probably too high

if you turn it down, it should fix your issue

[alpine cove]

Is that the main adjustment? It's a bit annoying since having that changed for other rigs also causes issues ^^"
Alright then.

[sage patio]

your only other option is to change the proportions of the model

[alpine cove]

Currently what I'm doing yeah.
Edited my model and got to the point where everything says it should match up. But arms just bend on bind.

[sage patio]

did you measure yourself IRL?

[alpine cove]

Got estimates, focused mainly on pictures and tracker/controller positions until I got to the point I'm at now

[remote raven]

Oh shoot i messed up, but I like this

[last viper]

Anyone know how to fix the "please map chest" error?

[sage patio]

click on the FBX, look at the inspector, go to the Rig tab, click "Configure", then assign the chest bone in the Chest slot

[last viper]

@sage patio Thank you so much. This modeling thing is intimidating.

[sage patio]

👍

[tiny pine]

i got the bone heat weighting failure message again. .-.

[last viper]

@sage patio Hey, sorry. I tried to build & publish, and got another error? "file not found exception: %appdata%/etc/"name.prefab"??

[broken haven]

If you have any other errors in your console, you need to fix them. Unity can't compile anything if there are errors. Clear your console log, then try again, and check the errors. Fix the errors it shows you. Probably broken and/or missing scripts/references.

[tiny pine]

@sage patio i dont want to sound repetitive but could you assist me in figuring out why the hell the bone heat weighting failure message is appearing when i think ive done everything right? Also ive seen you're really good with helping people out.

[lament grove]

Hi folks, anyone had a problem like this happen to them?

Origin point for all meshes and armatures is in the exact same spot

no modifiers are on (except the armature ofc)

I've fixed a thing like this before manually by just moving the mesh around, but why is it even happening, and only on one side

It's perfectly fine on the other side

I exported it without the armature

and it's ok, but then again, armatures do be important so I've got not a single idea how should i go around it now

[supple knot]

Scale armature/object 100x and then do automatic weight painting. Heat Fail is because the vertices are too close together

Then you scale it back down to 1x after

[supple knot]

If you have a mesh/fabric over the skin and you don't plan on taking it off on the model, just delete all the vertices under the stockings

[tiny pine]

I tried making the scale 100% but it was way too big. I tried to zoom out to get the whole thing in view but I couldn’t see the whole thing

But I shall try a bigger size and give it a go. Thank you

[supple knot]

100x is just what most people do

It's just so you can automatic paint, then you scale it back down

[iron hill]

Hi ! So I have an avatar base that has a hips-spine1-spine2-chest-upperchest hierarchy , do yo uthink it can be kept like this ?

[sage patio]

no, it should go hips > spine > chest > neck

you can technically have hips > spine > chest > upperchest > neck

but vrchat's ik doesnt really like upperchest bones

[iron hill]

ty, I dissolved the 2pairs into spine / chest, it seems to be ok

[hot latch]

Hi everyone! I'm complete doodoo crap at Blender and it's my 1st time rigging an avatar.... I got a model that was way too big and tried to scale it down and stuff to do the rig (it was also placed horizontaly for whatever reason)

But when i try to parent the rig to the model with Automatic weights, it makes the model go back to its original state but the scaling still says it's scaled down and stuff....... idk what to do

[sage patio]

in object mode, do CTRL + A > All transforms

(with the object you scaled selected)

[hot latch]

before parenting?

man... it made its new information the default ones but when i parent the rig to the model it still does the giant

[tiny pine]

:D doomslayer

[hot latch]

hell yea

[tiny pine]

But 100x isn’t the only one that will work? Also thank you

Another question: my avatar doesn’t exactly have a neck as seen in this photo. I have the neck and head bones inside it. Should I remove them somewhere else or just make a really small neck at the top of the body?

[kindred pollen]

sorryforthepingaa

[mint sierra]

By chance did you have troubles importing the original file for this one?

Friend of mine had a similar model to this with this issue.

[tiny pine]

Umm I can’t remember. I don’t think so, but if I did have troubles that’s just my lack of experience

Also I tried making it bigger then joining it and it worked, really happy! Unfortunately, a bunch of things almost warp when I move parts. As the avatar is split up into 6 parts, I want to try and separate those models parts so then I hide the others and work on just a specific part.

[mint sierra]

I could try to find it and fix it for you, I fixed my friends.

[tiny pine]

I’ll send it to you this afternoon when I get home if I can’t try and fix it today

Also that is very kind if you to offer doing that

[mint sierra]

Let me know and I'll add you, Or you could sent the fbx here

[tiny pine]

I’m at school and i can’t access discord here

I’m still going to try

[tiny pine]

im unable to fix it or send it to you

[tidal jolt]

My soul is leaving my body possibly forever this time

Not done yet, I guess!

[tiny pine]

Really?

[toxic adder]

Not sure whether I should ask here or in FBT channel, but I have a model that match up pretty much with all trackers and controllers.
However if I stretch my right arm all the way to the right for example, the body will be pulled to the right; same for left one as well. I play around with real user height setting and it either pull the avatar when stretch all the way, for bend the arm when stretch all the way.
What should I change in Blender/Unity or any setting to fix this issue? Thank you

[iron hill]

Do you guys see a reason why weight paint is correct in blender and unity, and wrong once uploaded ? I am making a dress, which is close to the body. Once in vrc the body clips badly.

is there anything like a maximal number of vertex groups for a vertex ?

[sleek isle]

Yes 4

[iron hill]

Ty ! this could maybe explain

[sleek isle]

In blender you have the option to limit vertex group. It will delete the smalless one after the number set

[iron hill]

oh , excellent , I didn't knw that

[iron hill]

this was the reason -now the clipping occurs in blender too - TY ! that will same me hours

[sage patio]

@iron hill to avoid clipping with clothing, you can also just make a shape key that shrinks the body to prevent clipping

[iron hill]

that sounds like a plan , I will give it a try. Also I recreated the dress by duplicating body faces and knifing into that for snugg parts.

[fading verge]

i have a model but i have no idea what to do with it since idk how to rig

[fringe kelp]

how do i give an avatar physics

[ocean hearth]

(I don't see a commissions section on the server, so as the subreddit keeps cockblocking my post, I'll try here) I bought what I can only call an avatar shell a while back, and the creator dosn't respond to any messaging to help, the avatar is there, it's just not rigged, so I'm looking to get it rigged, and there's minor modifications I want done to it that are above my knowledge to make. So I need someone with the skills to do that. I am willing to pay of course, which can be worked out once details are gone over. Anyone interested, feel free to DM me.

[crisp tendon]

https://ask.vrchat.com/c/commissions/avatar-commissions/35

[ocean hearth]

Thanks for trying, but it says in the guidelines that this section isn't for what I'm looking for.

[crisp tendon]

Yes, because you're supposed to reach out to the people who posted their services there

[sage patio]

@ocean hearth you can also go to the VRC Traders discord ( #community-servers-old )

[fading verge]

Does anyone know why every time I favorite a skin, it doesn’t show? It says I have 10 favorited skins but only 4 show (I’m on oculus quest 2 btw)

[sage patio]

they could have been made private, or taken down

not sure

[fierce grail]

API being weird, even happened to me. You need to wait 1-2 days for it to update.

[fading verge]

Ah ok, thank you @fierce grail @sage patio

[worn crow]

hi fwendos

i got a vrchat model but the head is messed up when i play in non vr

the head is turned 180 degrees by the neck

but when someone in vr uses it the model is fine

has anyone here had that kinda issue?

[tiny pine]

This isn’t the bloody channel for that

[sage patio]

totally is though

[tiny pine]

The message I was talking about got deleted

[sage patio]

ah

my bad

[tiny pine]

It was something about cs:go and skins and withdrawing and crap

[heavy tinsel]

It was a bot, they spammed it in every channel.

[errant elk]

Is this a rigging issue I'm having? my avatar is jerking forward every time I play an emote

[fierce grail]

Sounds like related to those bugs: https://vrchat.canny.io/bug-reports/p/build-1093-using-emotes-push-the-avatar-forwards-before-pulling-it-backwards
https://vrchat.canny.io/bug-reports/p/build-1093-using-emotes-on-desktop-on-30-avatars-will-not-move-the-avatars-head

[errant elk]

so the issue isnt me?

would that be considered a client issue then?

[iron hill]

Hi ! Is there a way to render a test avatar with wireframe in vrc ? I would need to see the faces to tune the weights.

[sage patio]

go to the Avatar Testing world, there is a flashlight that uses a wireframe shader

[iron hill]

waaa ! ty ! excelent

did I tell you you are a treasure yet ? it confirms

[sage patio]

lol

thanks :p

[iron hill]

it is really handy, and fun to watch

[iron hill]

That allowed me to fix arm twist and shoulder nightmare - ty so much again @sage patio

[fading verge]

Hi is anyone willing to fix the weight painting in my avatars legs? Please DM me if so

[uneven frost]

I managed to weightpaint everything but these two damn vertices and it's driving me nuts

[sage patio]

shift + K is the shortcut to assign weights to all selected vertices

[uneven frost]

I just tried it, though it only moved a bit closer xD

[sage patio]

do you have Auto normalize enabled?

[uneven frost]

Yeah

[sage patio]

disable it

then, hit Shift + K

then do Weights > Normalize all

and re-enable auto normalize

[uneven frost]

Thank you, it worked!

[sage patio]

👍

[vocal sentinel]

anyway, as I was saying I have some problems with the rig of a certain character because the settings were a bit messed up

https://gyazo.com/bc8421084309b5c84569886db54c3738

it usually shows Import/export and then the settings to fix the model

where is it

I'm using blender 2.93

is there a fix of rigs for blender 2.93??

[fierce grail]

Stable version of CATS doesn't work properly on 2.93. You need to install development version of it.

[vocal sentinel]

alright then

thanks

[vocal sentinel]

how do you know this? did you find it out yourself or did you get help from some people?

[fierce grail]

I just looked at their Github. https://github.com/GiveMeAllYourCats/cats-blender-plugin/issues/281

[vocal sentinel]

ah, alright then

[vocal sentinel]

Thanks for your help

[flat schooner]

What a quick way to attach those parts to a bone?&

[crisp tendon]

Select those parts in edit mode, and select the bone in the vertex group list, click assigh

[flat schooner]

this happened?

my original problem was that the coat's chest part didn't follow the bone, I don't need to re-do it, do I?

then I tried the whole mesh re-rigging but then ssome of the hair bones had been tied to the collar

[crisp tendon]

I don't think you did it correctly

I don't think you should re-rig anything

[flat schooner]

😕

I'm kinda at a loss trying to think about how to fix it

this is my first time using blender lol

[crisp tendon]

Go back to the first point when it was rigged but with the eyebrows issue

[flat schooner]

no that was much worse

as I mentionned, the hair bones were attached to the collar

[crisp tendon]

Were they also weight painted to something else ?

[flat schooner]

I didn't weight paint anything manually, I just merged the coat and the original model with CATS's fix and ctrl J

The arms attached perfectly, I'm not sure why the chest didn't want to

[crisp tendon]

Did the vertex groups have the same names ?

[flat schooner]

Like the bones? Probably

Could I take this sculpted mesh and clone it onto a new coat with an armature to try to merge them again?

[crisp tendon]

I mean, that'd help cats for the merge

[flat schooner]

So, I now have a functional bone called "Upper Chest", if I can merge/attach it to the chest bone, it should work

...how do I attach 2 bones? 😛

Ok never mind I just made the chest its parent, phew

[glad parrot]

Hello there, I am on a full body tracker and creating an avatar with a humanoid rig, For experienced people, Do you suggest checking the "connected" on the bone relations for limbs and spine-chest-neck-head? Obviously not good for left right leg towards the hips . Any info or tips?

[sage patio]

@glad parrot for the spine you probably should have it all set to connected

[glad parrot]

@sage patio Thank you for the reply, can u tell me briefly why for the spine-chest-neck should better be connected?

[sage patio]

if the bones are perfectly lined up it shouldn't really matter if it's connected or not, but the only reason to not have it connected is if the bone should be further

[glad parrot]

Thank you, yeah i see some of those really perfectly calibrated full body tracking avatars connect their bones, but some don't as well, i thought it'd be a big deal

[sage patio]

@glad parrot important things are really just angles and having some things straight

[hexed breach]

do you need ik's in vr chat rigs?

and are mouth movements handled with blend shapes or with actual bones

[modern lantern]

You don't need them if you're going to use it as humanoid rig, unity will do that for you. The required bones are as in the image above.

[modern lantern]

You can use either of them.

[scenic geyser]

Why do I keep seeing these when my avatar is fully rigged?

[novel aurora]

you didnt complete configuration, id imagine
it cant automatically map that

[scenic geyser]

How can I fix it?

[novel aurora]

oh god, it's been ages since i touched unity...
uhhh, i think if you click your model in the hierarchy, there's a Rigging tab off to your right?
You click that, then the "Configure..." button on the lower right of the image of the humanoid silhouette

[glad parrot]

Press your Avatar's FBX or whatever format u use, on the Asset window and in the inspector, theres "Rigging" tab, click that and make sure its humanoid, after that click "Configure" and map all the bones corresponding to the Unity humanoid rig

[scenic geyser]

I did that already

and it still shows

[fading verge]

i need help

[sleek isle]

That unfortunate

[sage patio]

@scenic geyser what object did you put the avatar descriptor on

and also, did you hit "Unpack prefab"

[scenic geyser]

no but i'll try

[tidal jolt]

Hi, Hello, back at it again and I have no idea how to rig the face.

Anyone got a good starting point?

[crisp tendon]

Everything weight painted to the head bone except for the two eye balls

[tidal jolt]

What I'm hoping to do is be able to open the mouth and emote

[crisp tendon]

You do that through visemes

[tidal jolt]

WaitwaitwaitThat's it?

Hoh

I'm done then

Let's go to unityyyyyy

Almost forgot- Thank you, @crisp tendon 🙇

[swift phoenix]

Heyo! I'm on a quest to create a perfect avatar rig for vrchat, the one where nothing will be transformed, shifted, or anything else, and maybe i could even touch the floor. is there any definitive information on how vrchat does scaling and floor/playspace transformation depending on the avatar used? or maybe any reference armature that can be used as a base. or source code idk. i really want to work on my avatar, and i want to start with ideal proportions, so i wouldn't need to rescale anything later on...

(plz tag me if anyone replies, this server is too big for notifications otherwise... thanks a lot)

[uneven frost]

Best way to merge the chest bones +weight paint on the suit to the base??

[sleek isle]

Can you refrase

[crisp tendon]

Data transfer modifier

[reef coral]

Hello there so uhh i'm still pretty new to blender and i'm trying to figure out how to group bones/put them in a chain in blender for the cape of this avatar, i did it in unity to show as an example of how it needs to look like

[novel aurora]

i would advise cutting down on the bone chains when you make the final product, as you really only need like five tops, prolly just three would do. segmented into far less parts, too.

[sharp cliff]

Gawwwd dam those are some juicers 👀

[uneven frost]

;)))

[uneven frost]

Also thank you I knew about data transfer but forgot it existed

[reef coral]

that's cool,,, but all i wanna do is what i did in unity

not in need of opitimization rn i'll mess around with that later on if i need to

that's a model from the game btw

[novel aurora]

and i would say look up a video on rigging and weight painting as it’s been so long that i could do it for you, but not explain to you

:Sc it’s not fresh enough in my memory, where all the buttons are

[reef coral]

i already looked up multiple videos but i couldn't find anything that could help me so far

that's why i came here

i know weight painting, that's not what i'm trying to do right now

if you could link me something that would help me in this i'd appreciate it thought

[novel aurora]

fiddlesticks, i have nothing on-hand D:
i’ll go find something rq, as rn i need to dry myself off still

i dunno, maybe something like this?
https://youtu.be/uK7TTDn1rZ8
you just slap the Add Bone button and drag it into place, setting the bones‘ parent when you get to the torso :')
that’s the gist of what I recall

maybe it’s different now, as i last did rigging in 2.8

[reef coral]

i use 2.79 anyways

the thing is that all the bones are already set for the cape, hopefully i'll find how to stack/group them in this vid

okay that's defo not it

i just wanna do the same thing i did in unity,, it must be so damn easy but i just don't know how to do it

[novel aurora]

i’m confused as to what your issue is?
just... connect them to each other, by setting the parent and child in the bone(?) tab

if it’s the end of the bone chain, there’s no need to set a child, just the parent

[reef coral]

i just wanna parent (?) them like this

they are already connected, but not grouped together

[crisp tendon]

Before doing any of this, you should remove at least 80% of the bone count

The amount of bone is ridiculous and useless

[reef coral]

that's true, it's a raw model from the game

but honestly i don't know if i should deal with that myself yet

[crisp tendon]

Better now than never, because it's often never

[reef coral]

i'm doing this for myself so the amount of bones in it is not bothering me, i like messing around with dynamic bones and colliders so

that's not my focus right now

[crisp tendon]

If you like dynamic bones then performance should be important to you, because this will be extremely unoptimized and very poorly performant

[reef coral]

not a bother to me seriously

i'm fully aware

but for me everything runs well

[fading verge]

And anew was one born, to create and publish only the most unoptimized avatars

[hexed breach]

are there specific names we have to call each bone?

[hexed breach]

should it be on the root?

[hexed breach]

how did you end up fixing that?

[sage patio]

@hexed breach yes, the top most object

[hexed breach]

ok sweet

[hexed breach]

you got a moment or you busy?

i am stuck with that same humanoid rig problem that king emerald had

also do i need the android build support?

[fading verge]

for quest avatar/world uploads yup

[hexed breach]

ok i ended up getting it working

[scenic geyser]

Where is the button for that?

[sage patio]

I'm asking because you should never do it

unless you have to for some reason

[scenic geyser]

I didn't

The thing is, I wasn't paying attention to discord the past few days because I was making models

Why can't I click the upload buttons?

[sage patio]

make sure you only have one avatar enabled in the scene

[scenic geyser]

I do

[sage patio]

check if you have any errors

[scenic geyser]

I do but idk how to fix them

they were the same ones

How can I fix them?

[lethal tendon]

Go to the humanoid option area where you can see all the bones and drag your hands feet and upper arm to where it says hands feet and upper arm

[iron hill]

Hi ! What wuld be the reason for a toe bone to be floating in the wrong place in vrc, while being ok in blender and unity ? It seems to move with my headset movements, too.

its like disconnected from the foot bone, floating 10 cm ahead and above
The bones parenting and vertex groups appear correct in blender, too.

[iron hill]

I reverted to 2.92 - dev version didn't help for me.

[vocal sentinel]

Did someone just ping me?

[warm iris]

Having an odd issue with unity so i put my avatar into unity and went to edit the rig changed it to human and clicked configure and nothing happens i get no option to get into the rig editor

and its not the project because it worked on another rig

[hexed breach]

i figured it out

you online?

[scenic geyser]

yes

i was playing some SMB3

[hexed breach]

here get in a channel i'll tell you

oh there is no voice channel

discord call me

[buoyant badge]

so this base had no eye bones, and i tried adding em my self and didnt go to well, can anyone help me with getting my eye bones working, in unity when i turn them to look anywhere they float out of the head, ive tried weight painting in several ways and still nothing.

[fading verge]

sounds like a rouge weightpaint

check every bone and make sure no bones have paint for the toe except the toe bones of course

[north vigil]

anyone know whats causing this

[tiny pine]

What’s the problem?

[north vigil]

leg folds and glitches when ever the head moves

[tiny pine]

Yeah, not sure

Someone else should have the answer

[iron hill]

I had remains of mirrored groups haunting a bit everywhere - cleaned up everything now is all good - TY for pointing me this way

[fading verge]

no pronlemos

[mossy sonnet]

so i was following a google docs on how to make an avatar and i reached the rigging stage and im pretty lost, how do i set up vertex groups? and how do i assign them to the skeleton i've made?

[crisp tendon]

You should check out automatic weight painting, which creates vertex groups for all existing bones with rudimentary weight painting

You can then edit those vertex group's weight painting if you need to

[mossy sonnet]

alright

[sage patio]

when you parent the mesh to the armature using CTRL + P, you have multiple options. one of them is empty groups, another is Automatic weights

[mossy sonnet]

uh i had to parrent? and is it ok if it's multiple mesh? XD

this is what i got rn

[crisp tendon]

It's alright if you separate the face and body, but nothing else

You're keeping that flat shaded on purpose ?

[mossy sonnet]

ye

i recreated it from a model i made in a game a while ago

but anyways these are all separate pieces

is there a way to connect them or something?

found it ctrl - j

for what ever reason the color of these three (changed to pink) are now linked

along with other parts

aight i cant fix it... slowfully and painfully but i can

[mossy sonnet]

???

[crisp tendon]

Why are your ankles in your knees ?

[sage patio]

@mossy sonnet you're missing both feet and hand bones

you don't need anything weighed to them, but they need to be there

[mossy sonnet]

oh

[sage patio]

also, you rigged the spine very strangely

[mossy sonnet]

i was just following this

[sage patio]

the legs and shoulder bones should be disconnected

[sage patio]

yea, you forgot the Ankle and wrist bones

[mossy sonnet]

they're there in my blend project though XD

[sage patio]

yea that is uh

[mossy sonnet]

also i think i need 2 hip bones... but it didn't say "left" or "right" hip ;-;

[sage patio]

not how you're supposed to do it

no, you don't need 2 hip bones

[mossy sonnet]

should i just delete the skeleton?

[sage patio]

no

[mossy sonnet]

hu

[sage patio]

to disconnect bones, you do this

like for the legs and shoulders

[mossy sonnet]

i already parented and auto weighted it, can i still fix it?

[sage patio]

yes

[mossy sonnet]

also where tf do hip bones go???

[sage patio]

you have one hip bone

[mossy sonnet]

OH

[sage patio]

the small one

[mossy sonnet]

i though you connected it to each leg joint

ye

[sage patio]

no

[sage patio]

it should not be connected

[mossy sonnet]

this look better?

[sage patio]

you can't do double joints like you're trying to do with those balls

I mean, technically it's possible yes, but it's more complex

using 2 sets of bone chains per limb, and unity aim constraints and rotation constraints

[mossy sonnet]

ah it said i needed knees and elbows and wasn't sure how to put them

im sure if other people got their hands on this model they'd have a heart attack

got it XD

no more red message

[mossy sonnet]

it's giant ;-;

imma jsut deal with it tomorrow

[glacial dawn]

Has anyone experienced this problem with full body tracking? I rigged this for someone and everything else is fine, but with full body tracking, the right leg appears to be going straight up on the y axis

[crisp tendon]

Can you post screenshots of your armature in blender, front and side view

[glacial dawn]

this doesn't happen in non-fullbody tracking, and they've said this doesn't happen with other models (so it's probably not their set up)

it's an autorig pro rig, would that be the issue?

I've ported models before just using a simple armature (no IK, etc.) and that worked ok

[crisp tendon]

Never heard of that addon

[glacial dawn]

IK bones, bones to control deforms, etc.
Which it probably causing the issues somehow, but it's weird because everything else seems to be working fine (and this addon has export options specifically for Unity's humanoid rigging)

I've tried running it through cats, but unsurprisingly it just destroyed everything and the import was unusable

I don't know if it's a leg length issue

actually this might be it:

[sleek isle]

Lift it up until no more tilt.

Maybe haft the distance is a good guess

[iron hill]

Hi ! another question : can you name fingerbones arbitrarily, and still have previously existing hands animations working ? Or do you have to name finger bones like it appears in the animation properties ?

[sage patio]

names don't matter, you map out which bones are which in the unity rig config

proper naming is still important though, and you should have a good naming scheme

[iron hill]

yes, thank you ! I have a naming that makes good sense, but difgferent from what I usually see, and I felt like lazy to change everything if not needed

is it the same for blendshapes ? I guess not

[sage patio]

if you mean the ones for blinking and talking, you specify those in the avatar descriptor

[iron hill]

mm no, I meant gneral facial expressions to map to hand gestures

[sage patio]

those you animate yourself anyway

so the names don't matter

[iron hill]

Say I have an animation that is keyed on "smile face" , but I import a mesh that has the blenbdsahpe named "big smile"

[sage patio]

yea then that won't work

[iron hill]

ok, ty

I ask because I have some nice animations in japanese, and I wiuld like to translate the shapes in blender

so I'd need to translate the animations too

Thank you again 😄 afk

[dapper hare]

how hard is it to rig up an avatar that has none

[mossy sonnet]

i did it for the first time yesterday (on a avatar i made) and it takes a few tries but it's not that hard

[languid yacht]

hey im pretty new to using blender, less than 48 hours of experience, and am trying to rig one of my wow characters for vrchat. i've managed to somehow get the bones to stay with the mesh when moving it in pose mode but when i do rotate things the mesh tears like this:

how do i get it to not tear and just warp slightly so that it stays attached

[dapper hare]

are there any helpful videos you used?

[mossy sonnet]

one sec

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PEsqdkGgQLMZYzWNLdjkVewTSxUmurTY5qCDa-7iRXY/edit

this helped me along with some people here

[dapper hare]

alr thx

[fading verge]

So me and a friend are making an avatar and we exported it as sdk2 right? So when I use 3 point body tracking it works fine etc. We wanted to move to sdk3 so we recopied the stuff over but when I try using full body the avatar collapses onto the floor? Is there something we might be doing wrong?

It seems like I can move the whole character up and down with my right foot.. the left moves the left foot like slightly.. head is head.. hips.. I don't even know if it's tracking the hip one, it seems to do nothing.

[eager moat]

Quick question what animation file types can unity use?

[crisp tendon]

Its own

[fading verge]

Mm.. Guess I'll look elsewhere..

[crisp tendon]

Can you post any pictures of your rig in blender ?

[fading verge]

Uh, yeah one moment

[fading verge]

Okay so my friend has actually been doing the rigging but nobodies helped? So I'll @winged topaz so he can get you the files. I'm merely doing textures cause I'm big noob haha

He'll send it in a few minutes. Thank you @crisp tendon you've been the most help thus far

[winged topaz]

@fading verge @crisp tendon

Yeah, I posted in both #avatar-help first and then #avatars-2-general between 2 days ago and yesterday, but I didn't receive any help at all :C

TL;DR, the SDK3 version of the model collapses on itself when Snippy tries it with full body tracking, while the SDK2 version works like a charm, however the problem with SDK2 is that I have no idea on how to link the animations (Sad, Happy, Shock, etc) to the controller gestures in Unity, while the SDK3 version has a very well designed handslayer controller script.

However, here are the screenshots of the rig you asked for

By the way, the avatar works perfectly in SDK3 without full body tracking, so the rigging works I guess

[crisp tendon]

Why is your spine disconnected from your hip bone ?

[winged topaz]

Idk, that's how Mixamo made it

do I have to connect everything?

[crisp tendon]

Definitely not

Mixamo connects all bones

Your hip>head line should be connected yeah

which means you might have to straighten your model a bit

as it's arched back

[winged topaz]

yeah, because it was leaning forward on the first revision 🤷‍♂️

Why does the full body tracking work perfectly on SDK2 and VMC tho?

[fading verge]

Ignore vmc it has different modes that 'fix' things

[winged topaz]

ah yeah right

[fading verge]

On default though it does break

[winged topaz]

but SDK 2, tho...

I can't seem to be able to connect them, when I do so, the legs move above the hips bone

[hexed breach]

hey so when importing from unity to vrchat

do bones stretch?

right now my models arms are stretching more downward

[winged topaz]

I connected the pelvis/hips bone to the rest of the spine, also the thighs are parented already, I see the dotted lines @crisp tendon

[crisp tendon]

Your hip bone need to be straight up

[winged topaz]

So like this?

[crisp tendon]

Yep

[winged topaz]

I also saw these in the SDK3 settings, do they matter?

Also, I've now straightened the hips bone, what's next?

[crisp tendon]

Not for your issue no

If you've straightened the bones then you can clear bone roll in edit mode with alt + R

[winged topaz]

ok done

[crisp tendon]

You can give it a try then

[fading verge]

Welp okie dokie let's see how this works haha, thanks for the help so far @crisp tendon

[winged topaz]

yeah thanks @crisp tendon
hope I can still bother you with few questions if it still glitches lol

it's my first avatar, so I'm learning everything now with it

[winged topaz]

@crisp tendon @fading verge

Ok so, after following your steps, the legs are twisted in Unity (I guess I'll undo the clear roll) and the model still collapses, please ignore the full pink shader, it's normal as I forgot to change shader, just look how the model still collapses when my friend tries it in full body tracking, I'm also sending a screenshot of the SDK2 version where, however, SAME model and BEFORE the hips straightening thing, it still works perfectly fine!

[crisp tendon]

Legs are twisted in Unity ?

Are you sure your bone names are correct ?

You wouldn't be the first

[winged topaz]

I didn't touch them, they're the default Mixamo ones

here's how they look in Unity

However, I can get back working at it in about 3 hours 😐

[crisp tendon]

Yeah checking the names and the actual rotation in blender would be preferable

[winged topaz]

I'll check in about 3 hours 🙂

[wild palm]

hello, does anyone know how to copy the movement of the arm to a secondary arm? my avatar has 4 arms, and with some pain ang googling I got it to work like I want in blender, and succesfully uploaded a version to VRchat, but the settings didn't seem to transfer over..., here's a screenshot

in blender I got a bunch o "shadow" and "dummy" bones, probably from the bone constraints I messed around in

[fading verge]

I'm not technically savvy in this but I wanna say that looks really cool!

[tulip ravine]

Bone constraints in blender only apply to its own animation system, you’ll have to set them up in unity using “rotation constraints” (note: only available on PC)

[winged topaz]

Hi I'm back, how do I check the rotation of the bones?

Also, I'd like to know how can I check if the thighs and hips are a perfect 180 degree in Blender?

[grand pulsar]

I'm having a problem with this neck rigging for an avatar i'm making, in the blender file the neck works fine

AW COME ON

sorry the image didn't load i gotta

why

look you can just download the image and see what i mean i'm not fixing it

[crisp tendon]

When you press 1 on your numpad, your avatar is facing you right ?

[winged topaz]

of course

although I use the Q-menu

2 new warnings on the SDK 3

[crisp tendon]

Can you check the bone names and make sure they're correct ?

[winged topaz]

Yeah, as I said, I didn't rename them:

[crisp tendon]

No, by check i mean click on the actual bones, and make sure each side is correct

[winged topaz]

looks like it

all the bones on the left are obviously .L and the ones at th right are .R

[crisp tendon]

You should probably straighten your legs

from the front view, being straight on the Z axis

[winged topaz]

when I did it last time, VRChat SDK said they weren't at 180 degree angle

[crisp tendon]

Yeah that's another issue but you can ignore it for now

[fading verge]

try to apply the transforms too, it helps sometimes.

[winged topaz]

So me and my friend gave a little try at the model again last night, but it still collapses.
Also, now for some reason the camera viewpoint is at the character's crotch rather than between the eyes despite that the ball is exactly between the eyes in unity!!!!!

[sage patio]

check to make sure the model was not exported with cameras in the scene

[winged topaz]

Nah, it's just the model and the armor, I select them and when I export the FBX I always tick "Selected objects only" and besides, there's no camera in that .blend to begin with

[lofty mountain]

Hey i have an issue with an avatar upload: it says: "LowerLeg is not first child of UpperLeg or Foot is not first child of LowerLeg; u may have problems with Shin Rotations"
Anyone have any fix?

[sage patio]

that shouldn't prevent you from uploading

[lofty mountain]

ik, but it looks wonky in fbt

[sage patio]

what does your rig look like?

[lofty mountain]

how do i check that?

[sage patio]

click on the FBX, look at the inspector, go to the Rig tab, and click Configure

and take a screenshot

[lofty mountain]

okay ty ill try that

[fading verge]

I need to find out if my character needs rigging or is all ready to go plz. I never made avatars for vrchat before so i dont really know

also i dont have a mouth for it because i also need help on the lip syncing

[astral warren]

There is no model in this file @fading verge

It contains a prefab with a reference to a model, but the model was not included.

[fading verge]

😐 oh...

@astral warren this is what its supposed to look like (this is grouped by the way so maybe only use it for template?)

[normal shard]

Hey if anyone is around I've been trying to figure this out for hours and I'm probably just being dumb. scrubbed through and checked all the weights so I think it has to be a parenting issue or something.

[umbral nymph]

uh how do i fix this vertex that wont move with the bones???

[normal shard]

Is it weight painted?

[astral warren]

It’s missing weight

[umbral nymph]

how do i fix it??? not sure how to do manual weight painting

i really should learn though XD

[umbral nymph]

how can i fix it?

[umbral nymph]

im not sure how to weightpaint

[astral warren]

it's sloppy, but just copy the weight of a vert next to it and apply it to that one. most likely won't notice a difference

[umbral nymph]

how do i do that??? lol

[astral warren]

use weight paint mode to see it's weight

If you have never rigged a model before this might be outside your skillset

[umbral nymph]

uhhhhh i swear i did nothing

[astral warren]

I would contact the person who made it and tell them they have a weighting error

[umbral nymph]

im the one that made it ;-;

[astral warren]

You rigged it?

[umbral nymph]

i got it off deviantart (the shirt) and it was fine before but after merging armatures it got like that

might just use a different shirt then because it wont even let me weightpaint at all

[umbral nymph]

how do i fix this??? when changing to a shader that doesnt have culling editing it is see through

[sleek isle]

Why your legs are flat at the back

[tidal jolt]

All that sitting around

[golden zenith]

anyone ever find out how to fix the head slightly shifting when calibrating into fbt?
my hands also slightly shift when i calibrate, its very annoying because it makes my torso bend because my head is not where it is meant to be

[fading verge]

I need help rigging this avatar i just got new user rank and i want a new avatar for my self can anyone help me rig this avatar?

[arctic hearth]

need help rigging this avatar's beak, got it a while back and the guy who made it for me didn't rig it

[north hearth]

How do I add collision from an avatar tail to a surface, like a floor? or would that break

[sage patio]

add a collider to the Armature object

make it very big

and move it down

[north hearth]

Its been a long time since ive messed with it, ill test it out

[fading verge]

my avatar seems to not be rigged can anyone help me with the rigging?

[north hearth]

You click on mapping on the very bottom left, then automap. If there are still errors, click enforce t-pose

as shown in the photos

then click apply.

I literally had this problem with my avatar yesterday

[runic vale]

Ok here's a weird one. I've had this issue for a long time. When I'm in world in fbt, the left toe will bend upwards when I lower myself towards the ground while standing. It also happens when I'm laying down and playspace myself lower. There's a certain height where this occurs. I can move myself up and down and see it happen. So it's not weight painting or a shape key/animation. The weights match the right toe, etc. What's going on? I thought about painting the whole foot all Foot weights but I'm in full body and it will look more natural to keep the Toe weights.

[umbral nymph]

How do I reverse normals in blender??? Been so long that I don’t remember haha!!

[kindred pollen]

Alt and N iirc, or go up to the Normals menu and click Flip o:

[umbral nymph]

Where is the normals menu???

[runic vale]

Under Mesh

[kindred pollen]

^ oop sorry yeah, it's under Mesh - Select your mesh in Object Mode, then go to Edit Mode and look here:

[umbral nymph]

I don’t even have the mesh menu

Wait found that

[runic vale]

It appears in Edit mode

[umbral nymph]

Yeah I realized that lol

[fading verge]

can someone rig this plz??? idk how to and i have a hard time understanding how to see bones in blender while seeing the model itself

if you want i can send folder instead :(

its fine if no

[kindred pollen]

I'd recommend looking at the #community-servers-old, VRCTraders and/or https://ask.vrchat.com/c/commissions/avatar-commissions/35 for a commission instead c:

[umbral nymph]

so i tried to reverse the normals but when put back into unity it wasnt changed

[kindred pollen]

weird o:
Select all the faces and press CTRL and N to recalculate the normals instead, then export the model and see if that works?

assuming you don't need some inverted normals as a part of the model

[umbral nymph]

so now the empty parts are there allo the time????

before it was only there when i used a quest shader

[kindred pollen]

not super sure on that, sorry o:

[umbral nymph]

help??? lol

figured it out

[runic vale]

oh no

[umbral nymph]

i just duplicated the mesh then fliped the duplicated one

all good now yay

[maiden kiln]

You can try data transfer, but normally you'd better create your own clothing on top of your avatar mesh once you duplicate the clothing mesh, it will keep your avatar weights this is just a hint ofc so you'll never have clipping, also don't forget to set to solidify and delete the inner mesh and you're done.

[umbral nymph]

it wasnt a clipping issue, the mesh just wasnt there on one side but was on the other

[sage patio]

in those cases you use the Solidify modifier