avatar-rigging

[cyan adder]

thanks

[livid pond]

Sorry I would say no..

[fading verge]

I've made edits to this model how would I rig this, I would Imagine I would have to Re-rig it

[fallen temple]

How do I put my right wrist with the right elbow?

Nvm, found out

[dusty stone]

Rigging done.

Man, that was painful with WhiteNight. Now for the next bit...

[lethal lark]

Hey guys, I have an avatar where the hip is slanting upwards on the right side when using full body. I've seen issues like this before and it's normally to do with the hip and spine bone placements & size. But I've looked at those and done everything I can to line them up perfectly. What else could cause the hip to slant up?

[dusty stone]

Strange. My armature doesn't appear to be exporting into an FBX file.

nevermind - ignore me

Ignore me again - seems like the rig isn't actually being recognised? Also, it is on the wrong direction.

How do I ensure the Armatures export correctly?

Cuz something is fucking up when it is being exported - it doesn't recognise an armature in the FBX File on export.

[crisp tendon]

If the rig is there then it's recognized

Is it weight painted though

[dusty stone]

Yeah

I spent tons of time doing that.

[crisp tendon]

Can you show your blender window ?

[dusty stone]

What do you want to see specifically?

Part of the weight painting to confirm it is recognised, or...?

... Guess this?

I'm doing an unorthodox thing - making an avatar based on a non-humanoid, but using a humanoid rig to do it.

I just added more bones on the original armature to suit my needs for the wings.

except those front, super long pairs - they're actually arms.

Haven't used CATS to fix the model, but I imagine I might need to do some of what CATS does manually in order to do other rig stuff?

[sage patio]

yes, you might need to redo some weight painting. one thing I noticed is that you probably exported and re-imported the model a few times, and you exported with the "Add leaf bones" option enabled, which adds those "Ankle.001" bones or whatever.

those are the extra bones that stick out

you can remove those

just to be sure that the bones you are removing are not actually moving anything, you can go to pose mode and try to move them and see what happens

if nothing on the mesh moves, you can just remove those bones

[dusty stone]

Normally I would use the CATS tool, but I was told specifically not to.
So I guess I need to do some of what CATS does for it to appear in Unity...?

[sage patio]

what would you need to use CATS for?

[dusty stone]

Just fixing armatures in Blender, usually

That was for MMD ones that I used as a base, but this one's unique - I had to piece this one together on my own.

So I was told to not use 'Fix Model' for here.

[sage patio]

yea, don't use it

it will most likely ruin your work

[crisp tendon]

How are the hip/spine/chest weight painted ?

[dusty stone]

The word 'Armature' didn't appear before, I should mention.
Just imported it again now.

and it has the word 'Armature'. It had 'Hips' before, not 'Armature'.

As for the hips...

They have none.

I didn't give them any.

The model is a floating baby Jesus Fetus - The hip does nothing for me and needed unique stuff.

i've been recreating this feller - WhiteNight

From a side-shot, it has 3 unique bones from the Chest.

WNTail1, WNTail2, WNTail3.

It was so I could animate the tail; I wanted to give this model a custom idling animation - since it is floating, that idle animation could play while I move around anyways.

I positioning the mesh to where it fit best on the humanoid rig that I snatched from a previous avatar.

The armature that WhiteNight mesh is using is fixed, but it was fixed in another project by CATS - I just imported that FBX from that Blender project into the WhiteNight Blender project and used that rig as a base.

if that information is useful.

New development:

Armature faces the correct way.

Armatures are blasted to hell, though.

It seems like it mostly just didn't connect them itself, since the Armatures are still there.

[sage patio]

first, make sure the bone parenting is correct

second, in that same screen, make sure that all of the bones are correctly assigned

then go to Pose (at the bottom), hit Reset, then Enforce T pose

[dusty stone]

Well it's not... in pain, anymore.

I need to check the parenting, though.

Not sure what's up with left and right leg. They're set correctly.

but it isn't here.

[dusty stone]

I assume this is in Blender, so I'll check there.

How should bones be parented?

[crisp tendon]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/251862595030482955/404301325380091906/guide.png?width=283&height=300

[dusty stone]

alrighty

Seems the same to me - Left and Right leg function similarly.

unlesss those WingBones and stuff being parented to the chest mean something?

and the Tails.

[smoky cradle]

Is there anything I can do to fix the Ishue?

[sage patio]

yes, go to your FBX file, go to the Rig tab in the inspector, click Configure, then make sure the bones are mapped

[smoky cradle]

thank you. 🤝

[dusty stone]

I still have no idea what's going on.

the legs are perfectly normal here on the rig,

but broken in Unity.

[dusty stone]

as seen here

[dusty stone]

I cannot figure this out. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

My last idea involves putting my other VRC Avatar's FBX into the same project and copying the armature source into the WN model.

I've exhausted every single trick I could find and come up with.

There's nothing wrong the hierarchy.
There's nothing wrong the with naming scheme.
All the essential bones are there.

I am stumped.

[sage patio]

what does it look like in Pose mode?

[dusty stone]

In Blender?

[sage patio]

yes

[dusty stone]

That's part of it

[sage patio]

that is not pose mode

that is Edit mode

[dusty stone]

wait hold on, let me hit X-Ray

Same thing, really.

[sage patio]

while in Pose mode, go to the "Pose" menu in the top left, and go to Clear transform > Reset unkeyed

see what happens

[dusty stone]

alrighty.

... Nothing's changed.

[sage patio]

in Edit mode, try this

and for good measure, in Object mode, select everything with A and try this

[dusty stone]

Is there some visible thing you're looking for, just outta curiosity?

I did notice the armatures are now see-through.

but that's probably because i was in pose mode originally

[dusty stone]

Okay, it seems to have... normalised somewhat in Unity.

Muscles & Settings, it looks fine, so...

It'll work.

It's bodged together, but it will work.

hopefully

[remote notch]

I am trying to set a rest pose so that I can edit some meshes while they are turned a certain way, is there a way that I can save my default pose and revert to it after I am done editing the meshes?

[crisp tendon]

alt + R to reset bone rotations

[remote notch]

I just got it. You can click these 2 buttons on the armature modifier in edit mode

[fading verge]

I gave up and deleted all the bones, I'll redo it and I'll look for a few tutorials

[sharp viper]

I think, for next time, what was happening to you was that the bones had no skinned meshes associated with them (no parts of your mesh did anything with those bones floating in space

when you do that, unity will remove them

also, there's something going on over here

so you might now have some weight in those bones

if you want invisible bones, generally you would do that by inverting normals and using backface culling, or a shader that is completely transparent

or, look into generic rigs

if you're curious how those work, flowerofgood's flowerpot is free to download and has one

[dusty stone]

Can I tell unity to not do that?

Or does reapplying the bones do that?

Also, there's probably weighting issues still; I just wanted to make sure the rig would work

@sharp viper I could do tell it to not create an armature from this model and assign it all myself, right?

[fading verge]

Bruh is blender messing with me?

Parent and keep offset

yet its not folowing

bruh

[fading verge]

nvm

I'm dumb

I was switching between edit and object mode to add new bones

[sharp viper]

If there's no mesh associated to the bone it will just ignore it, but you can manually assign, sometimes.

[uneven onyx]

Trying to tidy up my rigging to fix a few small IK issues I've been having, wondering if anyone notices any glaring issues (I've hidden most of the non-humanoid bones to make things easier to see)

[sage patio]

the hip bone should be very small

[uneven onyx]

I am still getting this error as well

and I understand what it's supposed to mean

but I can't see the angle discrepancy

[unreal shoal]

So... nobody is pointing this out, but it seems that "height" scale for full body rigging there.. involves the EYE BONES

I copied my armature, rotated it with snap on so that the fingertips went down to the ground

the highlighted bones are the fingers, the two standing up on the side are the eye bones.

this avatar is almost perfect for fullbody

[wooden verge]

okay so
i have this jacket texture right
im using texture painting to give it a proper design, etc etc,
however as you can see by the blue circles, the base colour texture ive made isnt applying to the material slot?
it just ends up as a black sphere, and when i render it doesnt work.
how do i apply the material properly? am i making some kind of rookie mistake? I havent touched this program since 2016 in any serious capacity lmao
i cant really atlas my materials if its all just black spheres, so im a bit stuck

[fading verge]

Hello guys is it possible to convert the rotation of a bone into the translation of another bone for twist bones in unity ?

Without final ik that Is

Thank you

[sleek isle]

I don't really get what you show here

[wooden verge]

-----i wasnt adding textures.

bloody hell i think ive got it

[sage patio]

yes, using Rotation constraints

add a rotation constraint to the twist bone, add one Source, drag the wrist bone (for example) in it, and set the weight to 0.5

[fading verge]

I know about rotation contraints but I’m trynna slide the bone instead not rotate it

[sage patio]

hm

[fading verge]

Like everytime the hand bone rotatateson the z axis the twist bones slided back

Also thinkinf of using something similar for hard surface rigging like a bionic arm with pistons and such

[sage patio]

you can pick which axis the rotation constraint is controling

the Freeze axis boxes

[fading verge]

Yeah but it copys rotation as far as I know it won’t do a translation

I want my twist bone to rotate and translate

Basically like for every degree of rotation move the bone on the z axis by 2mms type shit

[sage patio]

yea, that can't be done using constraint iirc

unless someone proves me otherwise

[fervent hornet]

Cant really have it be that accurate IIRC but rotation at a distance has translation to it so you can mess with that

[fading verge]

Hmm interesting I’ll have to see what I get once in unity

@fervent hornet

[fervent hornet]

I can send a mini prefab to show what I mean if you struggle with it 👍

[late helm]

Can I create an avatar that has no arm? And because I am creating a character that is a bird. Can this give any bugs?

[crisp tendon]

You still need the arm bones, even if they are not weight painted

[late helm]

even if my avatar doesn't move your arms?

[crisp tendon]

correct

[late helm]

so I add the arms and remove the weights from him?

[crisp tendon]

yep

[late helm]

Ok, Thanks bro

[livid pond]

guess what

i need help again with jawbones

please help is just a bone....

[kindred pollen]

Again, I'd highly recommend downloading Blender and trying it yourself! o:

[livid pond]

again, i hate blender and im not installing it again even if someone paid me money

thats why im begging

[kindred pollen]

You're likely going to have to commission someone to do it then, unfortunately

[livid pond]

its jsut a bone!

a jaw bone! its rigged in mixamo

5 minutes!

please

it sucks making 3d models on your own with no help for them later to be motionless due to 1 bone

[kindred pollen]

Sorry, I really don't know what to suggest lol
If you learn how to do it in Blender, you could rig it yourself and fine-tune it how you see fit (heck, you could avoid jaw bones altogether and use visemes/blendshapes too)

[livid pond]

dude , im going to tell this again

its not funny, im very stressed

im about to stop making avatars from how greedy people is

[kindred pollen]

It's not strictly greed, rather they learned how to use Blender/Maya/their modelling software and became proficient enough (presumably lmao) to warrant asking for money - while adding a bone and weight-painting it is relatively simple work, it's still work

I'd recommend trying it out again! there's lots of tutorials available on rigging c:

(specific terms to look for would be "adding bones in blender", "how to weight paint in blender", "add bone to existing armature", etc)

[livid pond]

ill have to say no again, because i already tried and had lot of rages attacks, im here because i gave up, that doesnt mean i even tried. i dont want more rage attack, and more unuseful tutorials i always fail do to my short mind, and i dont even understand the half of the words you say and im not interested

ill give stuff for the work

like art

[kindred pollen]

I commend you for trying! people def don't just pick up Blender on their first couple goes lol, but the fact that you gave it a go anyway is vv respectable c:
Nonetheless though, if you want someone else to rig the avatar, you'll likely need to commission them unfortunately

[livid pond]

please , stop saying "lol "and "commision". im about to have an stroke

[fallen temple]

Anything I can help with?

[fallen temple]

Does anyone know anything about twist bones?

I can't seem to make it look good on my rig

[sage patio]

have a rotation constraint on the twist bone with 0.5 weight

the source should be the bone below it

[fallen temple]

Thanks! I'll try it out after I set it up in blender

[golden kernel]

I'm having a problem with merging armatures with meshes, I have everything scaled and when I merge the armatures the scale of the mesh resets.

[fading verge]

does anyone know why my deformation looks different in unity compared to blender ?

unity

blender

thanks in advance

[frozen jacinth]

my stomach moves in when I bind in FBT but is fine other wise how do I fix this?

[crisp tendon]

weight paint better i guess

[crisp tendon]

how many bones are there supporting this and what does the weight painting look like ?

[proven belfry]

how and why is this a thing?

[crisp tendon]

shapekeys ?

[proven belfry]

yeah but for some reason they've attatched themselves to the clothing

I spent so long fixing up these clothes and now they're all kinds of busted

[livid pond]

yeah, jawbones

[sleek isle]

@fading verge 4 vertex group is the maximum in the current unity version.

If more affect it . They will get discard

@frozen jacinth the spine is to far from the leg/hip. Something like that.

[viral kraken]

why am i getting this error wtf?

bro come on

[livid pond]

i hate it too

dammit mixamo ill crush you

[viral kraken]

if i make the legs smaller in blender (after mixamo rig) will he be shorter?

[sleek isle]

mixamo dont like when limbs are separated

[scenic lichen]

Seperate the clothing as a mesh and delete the shapekeys. Then join meshes again

[proven belfry]

it's my first time doing stuff like this

[fickle cosmos]

@livid pond I hope this could motivate you to learn new skills!
I have had 0 experience from blender or any other 3d software. I have ADHD so my consentration can be hard sometimes and also I bang my head on the wall all the time!
But you get better at it when you do it more. I have burning desire to get my own avatar to VRchat, It wasn't that fast, or easy as I thought. But just dont give up! You wont get anything in life if you just giveup.
I took the hard route and I want to make everything, I mean Everything from Scratch, I started from basic cube and I havent took any image textures from internet, I have just made all by my self. Why not, It cant be that hard.. 😄

I just try to find something positive from every part of avatar making, This Rigging part will shorten my life for sure 😄 haha ! Still great amount of work ahead, and I don't even know what I don't know yet.

You should find some friend who could help you with basics if you struggle a lot.
-MadDusa

[proven belfry]

do you know what this stuff means?

[scenic lichen]

Should be pretty self explanatory

you should really join meshes though

[proven belfry]

I did, but that's what caused my problem

it might also be this

there might be too many.. polys?

I think?

[livid pond]

i do that omg, also i did that from scratch too , could i see your stuff? also the problem is rigging but i advanced a lot for sure

[livid pond]

also mad dusa... this is ABSOLUTELY stunning

i LOVE the model

every single one its made from scratch (except mixamorig)

[fading verge]

I do have 6 bones affecting that area thank you make sense now

[fickle cosmos]

One jaw bone wont stop you! I added bones for expressions like corner of the mouth, jaw, cheeks, eyebrows, lips.. But It will make my life easier at the end (I hope so 😄 )
Good job, You will get far if you just continue, cladly nowdays you can watch tutorials for everything ! and most of thema are free!

[livid pond]

It looks like the model is so complex

[proven belfry]

It's alright, I've gone back into blender and combined a load of the meshes without breaking anything

it's now gone from 6 to 2

[livid pond]

sadly the trouble is so big, but i still im okie using my inexpressive sculptris stuff it took 2 whole years to learn

my concern is people calling my avatars trash due to the failed mixamo rigs and lack of expressions or mouth movement

[fickle cosmos]

Dont let other people stop you, Show them that you can do something cool!
If you want some expressions/mouth movement, then you will learn how to do them/fix them, or pay for someone to do that job for you. Sadly nothing is free in this world, exept some advises like this 😄
Good advice is not to rush with your model, If you make something in hurry and make shortcuts, It propably will show in final product!

[livid pond]

lmao thats what im doing, asking people for a little viseme and ill be done

well i actually rush in every single model

i can make 5 a day!

its not because i want to rush, im naturally speedy and nervous

im a perfectionist so i update all

the pinacle was making myself

it took 7 updates

[sleek isle]

you can do that in blender

[fading verge]

I ended up getting rid of one of the bones and cleaning up manually thanks for the tip tho you're amazing

I had twist bones and volume restoring ones on basically every joint

Now the shoulder get no love

@sleek isle

[sleek isle]

with a well place bone and weight paint. 4 group is enough I would say.

[fading verge]

it is damn that looks really clean

that area is my nemesis

this 10/10

[sleek isle]

the deformation possible with that one extra bone is something

[fading verge]

what does that one do exactly and what is it parented to ?

[sleek isle]

it parent to the hip and copy the 100% rotation of the leg

[fading verge]

and it targets that area that tend to cave in right ?

https://gyazo.com/09142bc6788d6717925c3fd398a0dcf7

this area

Another way to weight paint is in blender it had added the ctrl+a in 2.8/2.9 that makes a perfectly circle weight paint on limbs. Body parts makes it a little more complicated. And I’d recommend if it’s the legs cut them off from the body and do the legs one at a time to the bones.

[sleek isle]

https://gyazo.com/38a5539c7d85019cc6a13730da058599

[fading verge]

as expected thank you

Also in that video it looks like it is a uh MMD

[fading verge]

k

lol

[sleek isle]

but for your model its since fine without

[fading verge]

Well what I’m saying is MMD models are borked up the ass sometimes

but his rigging is really good tho

[fading verge]

yeah Imma stop here coz I'll never stop if I continue it can always be better lol

[wind night]

say i don't want my fingers to bend in the middle, just flip up and down as a whole
which finger bone should i weight the whole finger to in that case? base? middle? tip?

[fickle cosmos]

You can use one bone then for whole finger?

put all weight to that first bone

[feral saddle]

Hello! Has anyone had any problem with Blender's FBX exporter making the last shapekey as Basis and the Basis as the last shapekey? I've tried putting an empty shapekey in the end to see if it fixed it but it still applies the last (with actual moving data) shapekey as basis.

[sage patio]

@feral saddle try exporting using CATS plugin and not blender's exporter

[feral saddle]

Already tried it. I got it fixed by going to the basis shapekey and moving one of the vertices 0,00001. Yep, it's weird but it worked now.

[frozen jacinth]

should I use IK bones on my avatar for FBT? It was designed with sdk 2.0 in mind so I don't know if the automatic IK means anything in the vr descriptor.

[sleek isle]

wut

[sage patio]

no

there is nothing different rig wise setting up avatars for 3.0

[raw heath]

Is this a good bone setup?

[glass sphinx]

Does my head have to be a seperate mesh from the body?

[sleek isle]

From the front. Probably yes

[sleek isle]

No but it's a good practice with hight density mesh.

[glass sphinx]

@sleek isle Oh ok. I have a low poly count one. Um. So when I rotate the bones why doesnt the model move with it? Like if I rotate all the bones the body stays behind.

[sleek isle]

Look as there is no vertex group weight paint to the body

Or armature attached to it

[glass sphinx]

I built a whole armature and attached it. I was following along a YT video and did excactly as she did. But when she moves hers its different from mine. Idk why mine isnt attached.

[gleaming mesa]

is there a way to browse the animation frames without actually putting that state into effect?

in blendar

i want to insert a keyframe based on a keyframe earlier in the animation

i could copy paste the keys in some cases, i know

[gleaming mesa]

sometimes i animate though without changing the frame first for example, so i need to navigate frames without the current pose being reset

[glass sphinx]

Did I do this right? When I rotate the bones the mesh won't move with it. Is that normal? I haven't done weight painting yet

[crisp tendon]

Well, probably do the weight painting lol

[glass sphinx]

ok I started and it helps. But how do i make it so only specific bones conrtrol specific parts? It seems to be general overall weight painting

[crisp tendon]

Select a specific bone and paint a specific part

root bone moves everthing

[glass sphinx]

If I select a bone it selects all bones..

[sage patio]

create vertex groups with the same name as the bones you want the vertices to move with

and then paint some vertices

[glass sphinx]

huh? I'm new to this. This is my first avatar I'm making

[sage patio]

you should search up weight painting tutorials

[glass sphinx]

I have but they do it differently from me and it's confusing

like this one tutorial she just could click on in and weight paint but for me I cant do that

[sage patio]

well yea

but you need vertex groups to weight paint lol

like I said, create vertex groups with the same name as your bones

there are also ways to do automatic weight painting

with varying results

[glass sphinx]

could you discord call and walk me through?

[sage patio]

na sorry, would take too long and too frustrating

• already in call

[glass sphinx]

😦 aight

[gleaming anvil]

@glass sphinx
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mZd19L30FU&list=PL2EEbgwoJzdt5kFVDyY2lliNqf7cWJeD3&index=13
I suggest watching this video and the next video in the playlist
It's quite long so if you want you can turn it to 2x speed and wait until she talks about vertex groups, or start your armature from scratch following this and then weight painting in the next tutorial.

[glass sphinx]

yeah lol thats the video I mentioned.

I followed everything she did

[gleaming anvil]

what does your vertex group menu look like. This is what mine looks like after symmetrizing (if that's the right term) my armature

this should happen when you Ctrl + click the bone

[glass sphinx]

Hmmm you seem to have found something

yeah mines empty. huh. I named and saved all the bones

[gleaming anvil]

Hmm yea, might be worth starting over since it doesn't take too long and paying more attention to the vertex group creating part of the tutorial?

not a super expert myself lol

[glass sphinx]

ah. yeah I see the part of the video I accidentally skipped over

[gleaming anvil]

Not sure if you'll be able to do it vith the mesh merged, but ik that tutorial suggests creating a copy of it before you join everything together

cool! I hope you get it fixed!

[glass sphinx]

Yeah. Seems I'll have to resort to a previous save and re texture lmao. I messed up but it's not that bad.

That is.. If I cant un parent things. I don't save at periodic intervals....

yeah but in this her model is plit up into different meshes. My whole model is One solid mesh

[gleaming anvil]

If I remember correctly, there's a point where she tells you to save a copy of your blender file before merging the head and bodice. Did you do that?

[glass sphinx]

yeah... nooo

[gleaming anvil]

Is it possible you could go into edit mode, select everything that's separated in the tutorial (head, body, teeth, tongue etc) with L copy the vertices, delete them and paste them back?

[glass sphinx]

oh and just manually seperate them that way? Great idea! Thank you

ok do ears have to be seperate? Since she's a furry avatar? Rigging furry avatars seems different than human ones. Since we have different ears and tails

and idk what to name those bones

[gleaming anvil]

Most likely yes if you want to rig the ears. I didn't because mine is human and you can't usually move your ears.
I'd probably name it like "Ear Left" and symmetrize it and add a vertex group for that when you're going into weight painting.
That's my guess!

[glass sphinx]

ok thank you. There doesn't seem to be any in depth tutorials for furry charaters. Most YT videos are "Just download a model from this website and repaint it in blender or this other program" or "Just go in and ajust the bones so they fit" Nothing real in depth like Rainhet's videos

[gleaming anvil]

yea, her videos are a real life saver

[scarlet jasper]

When adding clothes in blender that have their own armatures, do I need to delete the old armature once I "join" it to my base model armature?

[sage patio]

@scarlet jasper no, you need it

you merge the bones and their associated weights using CATS plugin

don't forget to change the specified armature under the mesh's armature modifier

[scarlet jasper]

thank you

[vital void]

I spent hours trying to rig my avatar and nothing worked

[elfin meadow]

"Nothing worked"?

[vital void]

connecting the rig to my model

I was using blender

[elfin meadow]

You just need to parent your mesh to your armature

And then weight paint it - there's lots of tutorials on it.

[vital void]

Oh

Whats weight paining

[elfin meadow]

It's how you say which bones affect which parts of your mesh

[vital void]

I feel silly

that could have been helpful

thx

[strong spruce]

Does anyone know if I can copy the blendshapes from an older version of my model to a newer one? I feel like the short answer is no

[gleaming mesa]

i usually end up doing it the opposite way

port mesh changes to the old version

[buoyant badge]

anyone know how to fix this im struggling alot

[sage patio]

what, the hoodie moving weirdly?

looks like it's weighed to bones it shouldn't be

click one of those vertices in edit mode, then hit N to open the menu on the right side, and then go to the Item tab

there should be a list of vertex weights

[crisp tendon]

probably forearm or whatever bone that is in the arm

[buoyant badge]

go i click on the hoodie enter edit mode then click on the hoodie to draw some vertices, then hit n? cuz it only closes and opens the cats menu @sage patio

all arm bones had vertex groups connected to all bones, eyes, face, shoes. I removed them all and now the arm wont move with the hoodie, obviously, but how can i add a the proper vertex groups

[sage patio]

that is NOT just the CATS menu, there are multiple tabs arranged vertically

CATS is one of them

there is one tab called Item

if you have a vertex selected in edit mode, you will see in that tab all of the vertex groups that vertex belongs to

aka, which bones have an influence on that particular vertex

that will tell you which vertex groups you need to go look for in Weight paint mode so you can remove the weight painting in the wrong spots

[primal flare]

How do I fix this?

[rose wagon]

Honestly it looks fine to me. If it's T posing it's T posing. Sometimes unity is weird and says it's not
You could always press enforce T pose and see what happens

[valid relic]

having some trouble with transfurring weights during a little kitbashing. could i get someone willing to view screenshare for a bit

both the models being kitbashed are mine and where made and exported by myself from vroid

[fickle cosmos]

Im propably missing something here. I want to attach snakes to my base armature, but it does this weird thing when I Ctrl + J it in object mode.
snake bones stays in right position, but mesh goes straight!
I managed to parent these bones to base armature, but it didnt help

[crisp tendon]

Apply transforms before merging

You can also bake pose with cats if not already done

[fickle cosmos]

oh! it worked!

I havent done that in cats, im getting closer!

[fickle cosmos]

I think im improving! 😄 oh my...

It might have something to do with my weightpainting, wild guess

but it didnt explode with cats, but it deletes all bones from snakes

[teal mantle]

can anyone help? I am following the tutorial to lower my avatar to my normal height so i can touch the ground with my hands but its saying my armature isnt in there?

https://youtu.be/2sfTEBAl8sA. I’m following their tutorial

[fickle cosmos]

I will skip rigging for today, This goes just worse... 😄

[crisp tendon]

select the armature and press S

[teal mantle]

Not home at the moment now but what will that do? @crisp tendon

[crisp tendon]

scale

[teal mantle]

Is it not scaled right? Looks ok to me

[teal mantle]

@crisp tendon How can I tell if it’s scaled right on the avatar? I can’t export it because it’s not in the right place right?

[crisp tendon]

How did you plan on making the avatar your own height ?

[teal mantle]

From that video. Basically just shorten that and the armature

[crisp tendon]

You just need to ace the armature down, not the mesh

@fading verge You just need two bones for each three fingers

The left one is the most correct one except there's three bones

[kindred pollen]

heck I haven't seen Maw in forever

[teal mantle]

Ok thanks

[crisp tendon]

Try alt + R on bones in edit mode before exporting

[crisp tendon]

You can just weight paint it to the middle bone yeah

[tardy root]

Anyone know if this is even fixable? It looks like the rig and weight paint are just not made for FBT. The hips are too far forward and when I move things around it just breaks. Here's an exaggerated example of what I mean

[sleek isle]

Chest don't really rotate forward in vr. Move it more back.

[tardy root]

Like the whole mesh? or the bones

[sleek isle]

The Bone 🦴

In edit mode make the spine straight from the hip

[ruby furnace]

can someone help me with all these errors on my avatar? i'm putting together the bones and half of them are coming back as red

[teal mantle]

I have this problem now lol.

[fickle cosmos]

How is your Weight paint looking like?
Looks like you are missing some weight paints

[plucky glacier]

hello! i'm still very much a noob with blender just started learning to create my first avatar, i have a question did i just screw myself over and delete everything till the structure and do i have to start it all over again?

apologies if it's not the right channel i'm not even sure what to call this process

[teal mantle]

Will look into that thanks. Thought that might be it

[fickle cosmos]

Hello! This is more #3d-modeling at the moment what you are doing ^^
I would go there to continue discussion and maybe explain your problem littlebit more!

[plucky glacier]

alright thanks!:)

[meager ether]

do you have a "hips" bone?

[fickle cosmos]

I managed to attatch snake armature to my base armature now! But it wont remember weightpaints what i have already made, is there way to parent mesh to armature without needing to do it all over again?
I did one snake seperetly, weightpainted it correctly and dublicated it then and now I managed to join armatures, but it looks like I need to fix all of them manually.... But all snakes already have "fixed" weightpainting but they didint like when i had to seperate mesh that I could join them.
I might go couple saves back and see if i can do this differently

[fervent hornet]

Are all the bones named differently? If bones have the same names then their vertex groups will merge instead of creating new groups

[fickle cosmos]

Thats one thing what i was thinking, lets see what i can do

Damn, okey, first problem comes when I apply armature, snake stops to respond to armature in posemode. Which I think is the idea.
but If I wont do it and try to join them they just teleport and wont stay where bones were...
So I kind of have to apply and re weightpaint them, but it just doenst make any sense in my head..

[fervent hornet]

How are you applying the pose mode? CATs?

[fickle cosmos]

nope

also when i try to apply new rest pose snake goes straight.. to hell 😄

[fervent hornet]

When I've done similar things to this, I did these steps:

1. Apply pose as rest pose via CATs
2. Rename all bones if other armatures share the names
3. Apply rotation, position and scale of armature and mesh if needed
4. Join meshes and armatures

[fickle cosmos]

Fixing model deletes all snakes.. 😄

[fervent hornet]

Yeah dont use that fix model when youre not a perfect humanoid imo

[fickle cosmos]

It wont let me to merge armatures in cats if i wont fix model first

[fervent hornet]

You should be using this, and joining armatures one at a time with Ctrl+J

[fickle cosmos]

this happens when I join armatures with ctrl + J

[fervent hornet]

Did you apply the pose as rest before joining? How many armatures do you have right now in total?

I guess one thing about CATs is if you have multiple armatures in pose mode at the same time it really struggles doing the right one

[fickle cosmos]

Yes and still teleports like that.
Every snake has seperate bonestructure at the moment

and I have been trying to do this with only one snake at the time'

[fickle cosmos]

Hmm hey thanks ! Thats lots of work for helping me!
That looks easy to follow!

[fervent hornet]

Took me like 6 tries because I kept fucking up lol

You're just lucky I was making my own medusa at one point 😏

[fickle cosmos]

what key you press to get that apply menu?

Oh ! thats cool ^^

search works

[fervent hornet]

Yeah apply is ctrl+A

Still using blender 2.79 😔

[fickle cosmos]

I still have problems, Let me restart blender and I will follow that video and see what happens

[fervent hornet]

Like I said earlier, make sure you are not in pose mode for any armature besides the one you are working on

[fickle cosmos]

Almost works! 😄

I fixed it! Ah.. I had to change snake mesh armature to base armature first

damn.. I need break now

[fervent hornet]

When I get burnt with blender, I usually relax with some more blender

[fickle cosmos]

Nope, still problems :DD I just dont get thisI might miss something or I have something wrong in here! im so close, but so far!

[fervent hornet]

Might be something small or a difference in versions. I know rigging has changed from 2.79->2.8+

[fickle cosmos]

My snek likes to teleport to sky for some reason, it looks first fine but that happens 😄 I need to triple check stuff and I will save that video of yours even thoug It wont go that smoothly for me.. 😄

[fervent hornet]

Make sure that your main armature is also applied on all transforms

[fickle cosmos]

good point

[ruby furnace]

I do. I'm pretty sure I put all the bones to the correct spots. The main errors are saying on the feet and the hands

[fickle cosmos]

Okey, I have to just rename bones, Looks like it fixes my problems!
It works the way how you showd when bones are named correctly!
Lesson learned here 😄 Thank you for your help!

[spiral bobcat]

hi, this is surely a stupid question, but how do you link the bones? because I have watched several videos on youtube but in my version of blender it is different, it does not appear as in the videos and I do not know where to link, if someone could help me please.

[fickle cosmos]

If you havent done weightpainting, you can use automatic weightpaints, or if you want to make it from 0 use empty

[spiral bobcat]

I'm sorry, I don't know what you mean, what I mean is to join the bones

[fickle cosmos]

@spiral bobcat ctrl + J in objectmode

[spiral bobcat]

ohhh Thank you very much

[hardy sail]

Hi, I've used the Data Transfer modifier to add clothing to a model in Blender 2.9, in Pose Mode via CATS it works totally fine and well, but when I import it to Unity the Data Transfer is not applied/is wrong. Anyone know why? I've exported about 5 times now. Please ping me if you do

[crisp tendon]

Apply it manually ?

[hardy sail]

In Unity or Blender?

It works perfectly in Blender. Unity is the problem. Or the way Blender is exporting it

[crisp tendon]

In blender

[hardy sail]

Ah, I can try to do that.

[dire urchin]

Anyone know how to parent bones in blender?

[vague moat]

Select bones, select parent as last and Ctrl + P

[sage patio]

if you're wondering how to get the mesh to follow the bones, that is called Weight painting

simply having an armature with bones and a mesh parented to the armature isn't enough

you need to tell the mesh, or more precisely, each vertex, which bones have an influence on them

[ruby furnace]

does anyone know how to fix this error?

[livid pond]

can anyone remove the weightpainting from my mixamo model? i dont want deformed stuff lol

[tulip ravine]

if you remove all weight painting, nothing will move though

and it's extremely easy to do in blender too, no need to get someone else to do it

[livid pond]

i said tons of times i dont use blender

its just a little help to remove it from the head and mane

[crisp tendon]

You keep asking people to do everything you don't want to do, at some point you'll need to learn how to use any program, it doesn't have to be blender

[livid pond]

like what program?

[livid pond]

reeplace i dont want with " i cant"

[tulip ravine]

why can't you use blender? the thing you're asking is a few clicks at most

[crisp tendon]

Maya is another one

[tulip ravine]

select your vertices you don't deformed -> mesh data block -> remove from all vertex groups

[teal mantle]

Almost there. Anyone know about this? The knees ben into each other as well when Im kneeling or in crouch position

[tulip ravine]

post the rig

preferably from a program that displays bones and not unity please

[livid pond]

dammit stop with blender..pleaSE

[livid pond]

can you do bone and weightpainting

[tulip ravine]

i'll stop bothering you then 👍 don't worry

[livid pond]

nooo i didnt meant that

its cause i get angry with that ...conversation)?

[crisp tendon]

Yes you can do the same thing in Maya

[livid pond]

oh, then im getting it

is it easy?

[crisp tendon]

Nope, harder than blender, but that's your only option since you can't use blender for some reason

[livid pond]

oh god_ i cant use it because of my learning problems

i said it TONS of times

and the anxiety stuff

[crisp tendon]

That's only stopped you so far, everyone else with learning disability i've helped before managed to do it

[fickle cosmos]

My mood after weight painting and im not even ready yet... 😄

[crisp tendon]

I highly recommend the weight paint master addon

The project weight feature is godlike

And overall more tools available at hand

[fickle cosmos]

Is it free?

I think I would propably want something to help with this, I can't turn this to fun activity 😄

[crisp tendon]

I think it's 15$

very much worth it

[fickle cosmos]

where i could find it?

[crisp tendon]

https://gumroad.com/l/weight_paint_tools

[teal mantle]

Just wanted to say thanks guys. Got it figured out for full body even

[fickle cosmos]

Thank you! I will check that tomorrow!

[limber junco]

not sure if this is the right channel but, what do you do when the avatar is rigged correctly but it says this?

[fading verge]

If my model doesnt have arms, do I still create hands for the armature

[sage patio]

yes

[atomic hemlock]

Hi, I’m currently trying to make an Avatar but it has a naturally hunched over position and it’s leaning forward. It’s supposed to be leaning forward. How do I rig it so that it works well while leaning forward? I’ve tried it before and the result was really bad.

[halcyon mortar]

smooth

[atomic hemlock]

yes

[tall vine]

Is to possible to add a mask to an avatar with its own lip sync?

Like id have a mask that was togglable and also moved with speech

[crisp tendon]

Sure, just do the visemes on the mask with the same shapekeys, and scale that mask with a bone

[dim monolith]

So I've seperated my avatar to make weight painting easier for myself, I've painted the hair and skirt fine but when it comes to the body and these accesories I can't select any bones or do any weight painting :I

[sage patio]

you don't select bones, you select vertex groups

if a vertex group has the same name as a bone, it will move with that bone.

changing the name of the bone will change the name of the vertex group

[dim monolith]

I used to be able to select the bones with ctrl left click, so I don't have to click on the vertex group window, but now I know there's another way I thank you

(didn't know you can select the other way round)

yeah I can select the bone with ctrl left click with the hair, and then blender megically selects the associated vertex group

[tall vine]

Thx

[tall vine]

@crisp tendon do you mean like using the shape shape keys from the avatar and scaling it?

im new to this so im just trying to fully understand what you said

https://gyazo.com/78cbbb797362cff14fb5ae65d435442e

If so I only have the avatar in unity so I guess id export it to blender and yoink the shapekeys if thats what u mean

[crisp tendon]

You want to create a child bone for the jaw, weight paint the mask to it, and for your toggle you just scale that bone up. The shapekeys will be the same on the mask and mouth

[tall vine]

oooooooooh

What exactly do you mean by scaling up the bone?

Would it also be possible to add a new bone or rather use the on in the gif and just pose it for the shapekeys manually?

[crisp tendon]

Press S on the jaw bone

Go up and down

It'll shrink what's weight painted to it

Your gesture in vrchat will just be enabling an animation that scales the bone that was the mask from 0 to 1

[tall vine]

Thats definitely a thing seems like i need to learn a bit more about this stuff

[tall vine]

Would anyone be willing to walk me through it id pay

[raw lake]

I need some help, when it comes to this

Atlas is non-functional as i need a script to fix it

[crisp tendon]

Click Join Meshes ?

[raw lake]

Can;t, it softlocks blender

I think for now, ima give up on trying this lol

[sleek isle]

In avatar 3.0, you could make a bunch of animation that move the jaw up and down that get fire when the viseme parameter are detected.

or the simple way. Move the bone and pose to shapekey with the cats plugin in blender.

name the shape key the same as your face

merge the mask mesh to the face mesh

to toggle the mask on and off. weight paint the mask to a bone and parent it to the head bone

in an animation scale that bone

[tall vine]

Im so lost in the sauce right now. So can I use the bone present on the mask to pose?
I feel like im doing this all wrong I legit cant even replicate the bone on the mask like I do it that way I did it the first time and only the bone moves nothing else

[sleek isle]

create ah/oh/ch

then generate the other with cats

[tall vine]

Aight I'll attempt

can i do this in pose mode or do i have to do it in object mode

[sleek isle]

the bone is blue in the gif

pose mode

[tall vine]

I cant select the bone while in pose mode with the CATS plugin should I pose, turn it on, save , turn it off, and repeat?

oh im stupid ur legit doing that in the gif my bad im brain dead

Where do these shape keys go when i do them through the cats plugin? The bones shape key list is empty

[tall vine]

I deadass cant make the shapekeys do anything😂

https://gyazo.com/149bdd0e970233abab567d4265654029

if this shit didnt look as fire as it does I woulda gave up hours ago lmao

[fading verge]

can someone please help me

[sleek isle]

not like that

[tall vine]

https://gyazo.com/d6ecc0dbe68a3e79a24062c36e314dd8

Is there something im leaving out when doing this? still does nothing when i pose in pose mode

Though the mouth is open when i switch to edit mode but moving the value does nothing

[crisp tendon]

You're moving the object in object mode, shapekeys is edit mode

Watching basic tutorials would help you a lot, and quicker

[tall vine]

true

[tall vine]

we making moves😎

https://gyazo.com/526ebb65e95a448d5ec9f8482e39e337

So I should do all 16 shapekeys this way?

[crisp tendon]

Yep

[tall vine]

💦

[tall vine]

Im guessing now I should connect the bone to the head and weight paint it

[tall vine]

The bone connected to the mask doesn't have to be functional right? It just has to be there to be scaled later?

[crisp tendon]

wdym by functional

[tall vine]

Like it doesnt have to connect to anything except the mask parts

[crisp tendon]

Well you should merge your meshes, and your bone should be a child of the head bone

[tall vine]

oooh yeah my bad I forgot that part

[tall vine]

https://gyazo.com/ce683394ccd409f94f600a89b63b0028
How do I select bones in the armature?

Sorry Ive been blowin up this channel all day I just really wanna make this work

[vernal onyx]

When I get the error that a certain bone isn't the first child of another bone, is the only way to fix that to rename the rest of the bones so that they are alphabetically after the bone that is supposed to be the first child?

Or am I missing something

[fervent hornet]

Yeah because unity doesn't let you reorder stuff in the prefab

[fading verge]

Does anyone know a fast way to rig avatars good?

Trying to use mixamo results in buggy models for me.
Most of the time it messes up materials for me, leaving only 1 material for everything which completely borks UV mapping
Secondly I get no jaw / mouth bones even on ones where existing mouth bones exist

I have 0 experience in Blender so idk how to do that...
I have about 20 models I need rigged and unless there's a way to to do this in batches...

[sage patio]

@fading verge https://youtu.be/4fICQmBEt4Y

[fading verge]

thx ❤️

[sage patio]

I will warn you though, even though it says "5 minutes" it's still manual work, and "5 minutes" is more like "5 minutes, for someone who knows what they're doing"

[fading verge]

So, could be hours. Hmmpf.

[sage patio]

there's a reason people charge a lot for models, especially scratch ones lol

[fading verge]

Yeah my friend apparently paid $200 for a scratch model... I'm thinking about shelling out money to have all mine rigged

[sage patio]

I would suggest trying to do it yourself, since if you get decent at it, you can start charging to do it for people

[vernal onyx]

Maybe a stupid question, but when it comes to constraints, and having multiple sources, having both at 1 weight is functionally the same as having both at .5 right?

[sage patio]

that's a really good question, I feel like it would yea

I think that having the sum of all weights be equal to 1 is probably good practice though'

[vernal onyx]

I think if you want every weight to be exactly evenly split, you would want to use 1, as it would automatically split the weights for you. In cases where you want certain things to exert more influence over the constraint, you would want to divide it up evenly. Maybe.

[fervent hornet]

Constraints work off percentage of the whole. If you have a constraint linked to two things with equal weight to both the actual number doesnt matter since it will be weighted evenly between the two IIRC

[sage patio]

for two sources it probably matters less, but he does have a point for more than 2 sources

doing 1 for all of them would be better than 0.3

since more precision

[fervent hornet]

lmao

How many 0.3's can you put in the field anyways

Honestly I mainly use constraints for moving things around so my stuff is usually boolean

Just tested it, number does not matter if they are all equal, if you have something constrained to 4 other things with 0.1 weight then it is equally constrained to the 4 of them. Doesnt matter if you use 0.1, 0.25, or 1.

[vernal onyx]

Good to know

Thanks

[fervent hornet]

👍

[tall vine]

I swear I ask a question and then like a minute later I somehow manage to figure it out

[tall vine]

Im trying to merge a mesh to a bone but I cant see the bone I added in the list.
https://gyazo.com/7c340fce539436d6b8a46de95aa98540

[robust crescent]

select both 2 bones, ctrl+p (keep offset) , have to fix it after tho but should be visible

[tall vine]

The new bone is parented to the head already and I fixed but still isnt there

Should I just connect a new bone to the mesh and merge the armatures?

[tall vine]

ok that works

[tall vine]

https://gyazo.com/18ea599177b5ce473f41b09b2683ec4e

[tall vine]

when I merge the armature the mask just goes where every it feels like and since the mesh gets merged I cant do anything with it I think its capped 😦

[tender summit]

can anyone do a ms paint and show me where i would postion the bones for this model?

[red charm]

Any reason as to why the "mouth" would come out of the head as it tilts down? Don't fully understand weight painting. But the head has the entire "mouth" red, and nothing else has any weight set for it

[crisp tendon]

it definitely does have weight on another bone

[red charm]

The only vertex groups with weight on it are "head" "mmd_edge_scale" and "mmd_vertex_order"

Cause yeah, I assumed that was the issue at first. And there was some weight on it from the neck and the... shoulders for some reason... but I removed that

[languid ermine]

Need some help. I'm trying to export an animation that has IK rigging to unity, but it's not working.
I know that Unity doesn't support IK rigging models for VRChat, so I have another question: How do I transfer movement data from an ik rigged animation to an fbx file that unity can read and use?

[languid ermine]

Really need some professional help here. I'm trying to export an animation to unity, but my model has IK rigging. I've spent over 10 hours working on this animation, and the majority of the movements require the IK rigged extra bones. I'm trying to put all of the transform, rotation, and location information of the model to the base bones that unity can read. Is there a way to do that. Please i really need help here.

[valid relic]

I can't figure out how to select bones in weight painting :/

everything points to stupid tutorials that don't tell you the information

[crisp tendon]

Select bones then shift select the mesh in object mode, then ctrl + tab

[valid relic]

select the armature?

no i can't be following that right, ends up the same

[crisp tendon]

Have both in object mode

[valid relic]

yes

[crisp tendon]

then follow the steps above

[valid relic]

and i end up the same

as i said

[crisp tendon]

Then whatever you did to your blender configuration would be different from the default, i guess

[valid relic]

it's entirely default

are you missing something that you overlooked telling me 🤔

[crisp tendon]

I've done these steps for the past two years, and so have all the people i know

i'll record a video

[valid relic]

right, so maybe doing something that you don't need to think about normally

[valid relic]

select armature, select mesh while holding shift so it's selected 2nd
press control and tab to go to weight paint mode via selector, only switches to weight paint mode without being able to specify which bone

[crisp tendon]

do you use left or right mouse click to select things ?

[valid relic]

lmb select

rmb is context menu

[crisp tendon]

Try switching them, i think that's the issue

since left is also painting iirc

[valid relic]

so in this example here, what is making it select the top left segment

[crisp tendon]

my right click

it was pre selected from my previous weight paint

[valid relic]

okay, so how did you do that, because thats what im asking

not how to get to weight paint mode

[crisp tendon]

i select objects with my right click

Ever since blender 2.79

[valid relic]

i'm on 2.91 if that matters

[crisp tendon]

switch to right

and try again

[valid relic]

same agan

[crisp tendon]

Did you save the settings ?

[valid relic]

selects a part of the mesh, skips the bone entirely

[crisp tendon]

oh

Try disabling the face masking mode

[valid relic]

the what what

[crisp tendon]

that white square

[valid relic]

thanks, god that was stupid easy

[crisp tendon]

I couldn't tell in your first screenshot because you had nothing selected

[valid relic]

you know how many tutorials i've had to do to satisfy people that where completely unhelpful

waisted days on donuts and anvils just for you to make it happen in a click

[crisp tendon]

[valid relic]

😂 thanks for putting up with me

haven't blendered since 1.79

[crisp tendon]

no worries, good luck with the rest !

[valid relic]

if you wanna lurk, i'm twitching

[crisp tendon]

You might wanna add your twitch to your discord profile

[valid relic]

oh, right

thanks for letting me know it wasn't done xD

[gloomy ether]

so i keep getting this problem in unity. it has to do with a twist bone. the thing is. the bone is set properly in blender but for some reason in unity the twist bone is above the wrist. when i manually change this it doesnt save for some reason. and nothing happens. how do i go about fixing this issue?

[crisp tendon]

You can ignore this one afaik

[gloomy ether]

I thought I could but when I went to make a test version and check it out in game I saw the problem with the twist bone not working properly. Thought I’d ask here before giving up on trying to figure it out. It’s not really too big of a deal in retrospect

[fading verge]

I’m looking for someone who’s god tier at rigging and understands the full body ik well to sit down with me later and trouble shoot a rig especially around the shoulder area I will pay you handsomely for your troubles dm for info

Issues like these

[sleek isle]

If your arm don't str... I need to make to make it visually at some point

[unreal shoal]

@gloomy ether vrchat doesn't use twist bones as far as i know, and they should be deleted

[kindred pollen]

Fairly certain VRChat does use twist bones o:

[sage patio]

@unreal shoal @kindred pollen it does not. that doesn't mean you can't use them, you still can. just add rotation constraints to the bones, with 0.5 weight to the bone below it

[fading verge]

Why can't I just publish this avatar?

[kindred pollen]

Add a VRC_AvatarDescriptor component to the top-most thing in your avatar's hierarchy o:

also if that avatar came with an SDK, you def might want to use the most recent one instead

[fading verge]

its not working

[crisp tendon]

How are they set in Blender ?

[river dune]

Is Blender required for rigging? Can you not do it in Unity? Because all I'm trying to figure out how to do is change the rig type on the model so I can upload it, because it currently shows 'Rig Type: Non-humanoid.'
Another thing I'm trying to figure out is how to select default animation type and set it to Female, but there's no option that shows that here. Can someone please help me with this?

[tender summit]

Any knowledgeable people can tell me if the bone placements are fine?

[gloomy ether]

It’s a hand twist bone. The parent is set as the elbow armature. Weird thing is both the left and right arms have identical armature set ups but only the right one is messed up in the conversation to unity

[crisp tendon]

Look up a basic upload tutorial

[crisp tendon]

You tried symmetrizing that your entire arm armature ?

[gloomy ether]

I would make the hip bone a little bit smaller to the green point. That’s just what I usually do when rigging

[gloomy ether]

I’ve made them symmetrical manually if that’s what you mean? It seems like it could just be a weird conversation issue when it gets uploaded into unity

[river dune]

The problem that I am having is that I don't see this menu anywhere, this is a YT Tutorial I took a screenshot of

[turbid cedar]

Huh, trying to weight paint but the Fallout Shape options are missing

[tender summit]

Is the neck fine?

its hard for me to see if its done fine

[gloomy ether]

hard to say with such a unique head shape. only way to really tell is to test it in pose mode or just upload a test model and see if its the way u want it to be. i usually like to make the neck bone smaller than standard so i dont get so much neck tilt. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sfTEBAl8sA this video goes over a good bit on how to make an armature fit well in vr chat. especially if u have full body

@crisp tendon I figured out how to fix the issue and i feel like an idiot for not realizing it sooner lol. i just needed to unpack the prefab than rearrange the bones manually.

[crisp tendon]

oh, i thought you already did that since you said "when i manually change this it doesnt save for some reason" glad you fixed it

[river dune]

I managed to figure out how to get to the avatar mapping, and I noticed for this particular avatar, the 'Chest (Transform)' was in the Spine's little green dot. I moved the 'Spine (Transform)' to the Spine's little green dot, and then the dot turned red saying 'Spine Transform 'Spine' has bone length of zero.' What does this mean?

Is it fine?

[crisp tendon]

the bone length is zero, needs to be fixed in blender

[willow knoll]

Is there a reference rig of some sort that the game uses internally when deciding how to operate each avatar's?

[umbral idol]

I tried searching for an answer, but my search-fu has failed me. I am having an issue with my hands being really really wide in VRC, but it looks fine in Unity and Blender. Am I missing something obvious?

[umbral idol]

VRC uses the Humanoid rigging from Unity. In Unity, there is a configure button in the rig section of the model. That will show you a hierarchy that will work. Leave upper chest: None

[crisp tendon]

What does your armature look like in blender ?

[crisp tendon]

What about the rest of the avatar, proportions matter a lot

[willow knoll]

@umbral idol Thanks I'll look into that, as for your issues, perhaps the Inherit Scale option for some bones is set to something strange?

[umbral idol]

Oooo! Good point Krunk.

[willow knoll]

Also check that the Roll for each bone is 0 degrees. I haven't heard of that causing any specific issues, but people seem to imply it is a soft requirement.

[umbral idol]

Testing a version with the wrist not inheriting scale.

[willow knoll]

Hmmm, what was it set to before? Also check every bone around it, all the way up the shoulder, too.

[crisp tendon]

You need to connect your neck/chest/spine/hip bones, scale your shoulder bones down

[willow knoll]

It's supposed to be set to Full afaik.

[umbral idol]

Inherit Scale was set to "Full"

Does connected versus not connected matter?

Disregard that question.

Just slowed down and read what you said Ruuubick. 🙂

TIL how to take a screenshot in VR. ^_^

Hey doctor, does this look normal to you?

[willow knoll]

The Connected option just causes the head of the bone to snap to the tail of it's parent.

The legs, the shoulders, the eyes and the first finger bones should not be connected, everything else should.

Basically anything with a position offset from it's parent.

[umbral idol]

That's what I would assume. Also make editing easier. But the dreaded CATS has other oppinions.

[crisp tendon]

Try clearing bone rolls before exporting

also thumb rotation is rough

[umbral idol]

I bet that is it.

[willow knoll]

That's one of the reasons I asked about that reference rig too. 😅

[umbral idol]

I assume the main axis of rotation for the thumb is the x?

[willow knoll]

My thumb bones always seem offset by the time they get moving in game.

[umbral idol]

I would go with Rigify's default skeleton if I was going from scratch,

But I am a nubbins. Take that with salt.

[crisp tendon]

Are you both on index ?

[umbral idol]

I am.

Does it make a difference?

[willow knoll]

It shouldn't, I'm on Quest.

[umbral idol]

Ah. I think this avatar will not run on Quest. 😛

[crisp tendon]

It's worse on Index by default yeah

[sleek isle]

Unity rotate the thumb0 up. Rotate back down. You get a t-pose warning but you can ignore.

For index I usually un-map the third bone.

You could make an animation for it but. Whatever

[crisp tendon]

You mean the first bone of the chain right ?

[sleek isle]

Yes thumb0

Animate the transform of the third

Since it's not control by the animator

That way you can have a straight thumb and a rotate one

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/656776546576629791/731645184432930876/handex.gif

[tender summit]

Anyone know why i get an error saying that weight paint cant find a solution for one or more bones

[tender summit]

no idea why its not working

[fading verge]

anyone know why my avatar's head is tilting up like this? how its supposed to look in unity: https://i.imgur.com/SDHpeU3.png versus how it looks in game: https://i.imgur.com/cRGvObi.png

[kindred pollen]

would you mind posting a screenshot of the armature? o:

[fading verge]

https://i.imgur.com/8m94gUz.png

[sage patio]

@fading verge the neck bone is tilted forward

straighten it in edit mode

[fading verge]

are you sure? looks fine to me https://i.imgur.com/JKHyZmk.png

[fervent hornet]

Bone tails dont exist in unity, they are only gameobjects, your neck bone is tilted because the connection from chest to head is tilted

[tender summit]

Anyone know if its possible to auto weight paint only some bones?

[crisp tendon]

You select one in weight paint mode and do weight > assign auto from bone

[tender summit]

Wait for some reason in weight paint, theres more bones on the hands than there should be

and i cant delete them since they go away in edit mode

and they show up in pose mode

[crisp tendon]

Alt + H in edit mode ?

[tender summit]

yep thanks that did it

[tender summit]

how do i do the weight > assign auto from bone

i select the bone from the hierarchy right

[crisp tendon]

Sure, then you have the weight paint menu at the top

[tender summit]

yeah with cursor options

strength ect

[crisp tendon]

No, in your main window

Should be top left corner

[tender summit]

top left of main window?or top left of screen

[crisp tendon]

They're kinda the same since the main window is 90% of the screen

[tender summit]

oh yeah got it drop down menu

alright think i got it now cheers

[fading verge]

yeah so no matter what i do, i can't fix that issue with my avatar's neck from earlier

doesnt seem to be the angle of the bone i think

[fading verge]

nevermind, it turns out for some reason the rig's neck bone in unity was somehow rotated -18 degrees

[brisk terrace]

I have a question but its not entirely about rigging. Im trying to make a 4 armed model but i'd like to have my extra limbs move with the opposite arm. Ex: when i lift my right arm , my secondary left arm moves too. How would i go about that?

i already tried with rotation constraint but i cannot get them to work in the opposite direction

[sage patio]

@brisk terrace did you try setting the weight to -1

[brisk terrace]

i did , and when its at -1 it doesnt move at all

[sage patio]

sorry,.not the weight, but the source's weight

the number to the right of the source

[brisk terrace]

yeah thats the one i meant

[unborn sandal]

So I changed the chest and upper chest settings that a tutorial said was required to change, what would this error need me to do

Upper Chest=None
Chest=Spine 2

[unborn sandal]

So it says it should have the shoulders and neck set to spine 2, how do I move them and should I delete spine 3?

[worn quiver]

Maybe something to do with animations?

[fickle cosmos]

I have been doing some silent rigging and tried to find answers by my self from google.
Now im at the point I have kind of done all visemens and I need to do some small tweaking and finish my textures before I familiarize my self with Unity and AV3.

Help!
I cant remember how it was called when you want to clean your shapekeys.
Like if I remember wrong there was some command that does something when your shape keys suck!
I have modified my basis and I want to apply modifications to rest of the shapekeys. Not the visemens but like hair and all other parts of the model.
Probably I select everything else but the face and then do something, but I just cant remember what it was called!

[crisp tendon]

Modifying basis should modify all shapekeys automatically

[fickle cosmos]

I have probably done something wrong with shapekeys then!
But there was some trick what can help me here, I just cant remember what it was called

[crisp tendon]

blend from shape

it's a manual process though

[fickle cosmos]

Shape propagate was thing what I was looking for! ah !

[thorn cobalt]

I helped uwu

[crisp tendon]

Oh, i see what you were looking for, usually i wouldn't expect someone to voluntarily shape propagate something than something that they don't want to change

[fickle cosmos]

I dont know what it does/or how it should be used 😄 but it gets the job done If I leave face un-selected!

[thorn cobalt]

if you only select the few vertices you want to propagate, and they don't affect your shapekey areas, it's gucci (so far when I've created avatars or helped Lady 'Dusa here create hers)

I could've understood it's function completely wrong, and this is a similar situation like in W40K where the Orcs simply believe strongly enough in their tanks to work, and they do

[crisp tendon]

Yeah, i just never saw someone ask to propagate something purposefully working, so that caught me off guard

[thorn cobalt]

in this case she just had a few hairs messed up, so propagating their shape into all shapekeys was legit. Now if she had messed up facial vertices that would be a whole nother headache

[crisp tendon]

Then my solution would have been the correct one

[thorn cobalt]

good to know, will hafta return to it if need arises!

(that was not a passive aggressive "good to know" I'm just still waking up and my English is fumbling a bit)

[fickle cosmos]

What is the difference? Like does shape propagate do some damage what I could avoid by doing blend from shape?

[thorn cobalt]

to my understanding you can uhhh mix different shapekeys to create a new basis with the "Blend from shape" option, but I never had much luck with the option myself for some reason, I believe we were both having trouble with this the last time you and me were making avatars

I think it might not be the right option for this case because if you have had the wrong shapekey selected and you modified the vertices, then those modified vertices become part of the shapekey that was selected, so a new basis wouldn't fix them

the (wrongly) modified shapekey would still be wrongly modified and apply on top of the basis like any other shapekey, which is why you want to override those vertices with propagate. But propagate will also completely override those vertices in all shapekeys so it's only useful if that area is not affected by any shapekeys

idk tho

[fickle cosmos]

This Blender sounds like fun!

[crisp tendon]

Blend from shape is pretty powerful if you can figure it out !

[vivid lark]

Where can I start with an avatars bones to make it close to 1:1 with full body? It’s kind of like stilts right now.

[vivid lark]

Match the number and style of bones?

[sage patio]

pretty much. some bones are not required, like the toe bones

you can also have chest and upper chest bones, rather than just the chest

but not necessary

[vivid lark]

Because my thing right now is my leg trackers are calibrating in the avatars knees.

[sage patio]

did you adjust the User real height in your settings

[vivid lark]

Yeah, I’ve used other avatars that match up perfectly with all my trackers.

[sage patio]

do you maybe have your viewpoint too far back?

[lethal cedar]

I have a model, rigged it in blender, named bones, named vertex groups, works, but in unity (generic) rig only makes the root bone affect the mesh

I'm considering either making a "fake" humanoid rig (if it'll even work) or just splitting it into separate objects

[sage patio]

if you want it to track at all, you NEED it to be humanoid

even if it doesn't look like it

all the humanoid bones need to be there

whether they are used or not

[vivid lark]

Got it right on the bridge if the nose in between the eyes. Would that have anything do do with the feet position though?

[sage patio]

that should be fine. and yes, it can cause issues

because the whole avatar will be shifted either forwards or backwards

[lethal cedar]

well yea, I did some like that before, but what if I just want to have it animated on my shoulder or something?

[sage patio]

oh well if it's not supposed to be an avatar, then a generic rig should work

after all, gun models also use bones

last I checked guns don't have humanoid rigs kek

[vivid lark]

Gotcha, I’ll check the bones

[sage patio]

send a screenshot of your rig while you're at it

[lethal cedar]

yea well, it doesn't, is it maybe that I'm importing as .blend? it worked for humanoid rigs

[sage patio]

could be. try exporting as fbx

[lethal cedar]

I also noticed it doesn't import as a skinned mesh by default, I changed it myself before, what could be causing that?

[sage patio]

could be FBX import settings

[lethal cedar]

imported as fbx, no change

[sage patio]

check the import settings

[sage patio]

go to the Model tab (iirc)

to the left of the rig tab

[sage patio]

this is unrelated to the issue but you should have this on Import

otherwise it'll double (at least) the file size

[lethal cedar]

I know it pops up in the builder, I don't have any blendshapes anyways

[sage patio]

so what happens if you try moving one of the bones in the scene?

[lethal cedar]

I have to replace mesh renderer with skinned mesh renderer and set root as root, then only root moves the whole

[lethal cedar]

no idea what I did but it has skinned rendered as default now

what I THINK I did, maybe, possibly... I unparented the mesh from the armature in blender and added an armature modifier instead (friend made this model for me, I just added the armature)

[fading verge]

I am making an avatar that works fine in desktop mode, but when I test it in VR, the avatar's head flops upwards when I move in a forward direction as if i'm looking straight up in that direction. Anyone know what causes this? I dont have any animations on it or anything

[tender summit]

Anyone know why the arms on my rig in vrc are very bent at the elbow? as in i cant straighten out the arms

[sage patio]

check your User real height

you meant in game right

[tender summit]

yep

my other rigged avatars are fine however

[unborn sandal]

So it says it should have the shoulders and neck set to spine 2, how do I move them and should I delete spine 3?

[deep marten]

I'm.trying to weightpaint a long sleeve shirt onto a male base and it seems like no matter what I try, when I go into pose mode to check and see if everything works there is always clipping somewhere on the elbows, shoulders, etc. I have tried weight painting , I have tried sculpting the shirt to fit better, but it seems like nothing is working. I fix one spot and another spot starts to clip.
Does anyone have any tips or advice because this is driving me crazy lol

[crisp tendon]

Tried the data transfer modifier ?

[deep marten]

No, I am fairly new to blender so I'm not sure what that is !

[crisp tendon]

https://youtu.be/yOy6NgwRPaI?t=79

[deep marten]

I'll take a look thanks !!

I think that worked thank you so much !!!!

[grand bough]

wait so

whenever I create shape keys I need to create 4 right?

1 for each lid

2 bottom

2 top

[crisp tendon]

nope

[grand bough]

o

what do I need to do then?

[remote notch]

if you didn't make the shapekeys from scratch, in blender CATS plugin should have generated them for you and in Unity you can click "detect shape keys" and it will fill them out for you

[grand bough]

I made my own shape keys

[remote notch]

yeah I have no idea then :/

[grand bough]

???

I assume I only need 1 shapekey then

whenever in unity, the VRC descriptor only had one shapekey option for blinking

[crisp tendon]

https://docs.google.com/document/u/1/d/1W5KFa_aszCMrJaFD8mb9a-GHYO4X4S9M63GjM4UwuEw/pub

[grand bough]

oh, so I do need 4

hm

[grand bough]

isnt there a way to limit how much the eyes can move?

I thought it was possible to do that because in the CATS plugin on blender it allows me to change the movement range

oh wait

I found it

sorry

I'm getting back into the swing of everything

[fading verge]

Guys i got this model for free and it got bones but not ones for boobs and this script in unity makes the bone/mesh jiggle but i cant do it on boobs since there is no bone i can attach this to

how do i fix it

i can send u model and u can fix it maybe or even show me?

[tender summit]

Anyone know how to fix this?

[kindred pollen]

#avatar-rigging message

[tender summit]

oh thats great thanks

[kindred pollen]

yw! c:

[unborn sandal]

Sorry to keep asking about this, but I still can’t figure out what I gotta do here. Says these are supposed to be under spine 2 but how do I fix that

[crisp tendon]

Merge it with the below spine bone in blender

[tender summit]

Anyone have any good tips for setting up cloth coliders
along an uneven surface?

if im putting colliders on the the back for cape how many coliders should i use and attached to what bone

[unborn sandal]

This is my first time trying to port an avatar, any idea where I’d want to go about doing that?

[crisp tendon]

https://youtu.be/7P0ljQ6hU0A?t=1108

[unborn sandal]

Thanks pal, appreciate it!

[unborn sandal]

So two questions:

1. I’m assuming I’m going to want the Cats Pluggin for most things I’m gonna do
2. Is my avatar bones supposed to look like this by default

[frozen jacinth]

I believe in avatar 3.0 if you use shape keys/ blend shape you actually only have one. I had to make a new one for my avatar coming from 2.0 at least

[grand bough]

yeah

I figured that out the hard way

thanks anywas

[spice dirge]

I got two questons:
1: This character i am working on, when I test them out in VR Chat and look down, their legs lift up off the ground
2: This character's shoulders when I am testing the avatar are much narrower than I set them up to be on the rig in blender, resulting in their wings ending up being INSIDE their body in VR Chat

here's my rig setup in blender

[dusky socket]

Anyone got some good weight painting and rigging tutorials? I built my first avatar from teh ground up...and while it mostly works, its still got some wonkyness that I'd like to work out. Like at the knee it divits in.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/683557850454556675/826127261694296064/0002.gif

[frozen jacinth]

what would you call the green bones and is there tutorial on where to learn this?

might try to edit this area, but new to blender

[regal copper]

this is a shot in the dark, but it might be where the viewpoint is?

[sleek isle]

I think its call. corrective bone

[spice dirge]

Could be... the character is kind short (like 3 feet tall) and has proportions that are diff from humans

ive been putting the viewpoint where the eyes are

[regal copper]

I usually put the viewpoint right in between the eyes, but I think if the avatar is small it might do that

[spice dirge]

ill experiment with different heights

thanks for the suggestion

[odd hill]

1. Cats will be useful in a lot of ways, yes
2. Those bone orientations are typical for game rips, but they aren't the end of the world unless you have dynamic bones on them. If you need dynamic bones, you'll need to reorient those manually and merge bones

[burnt goblet]

would i fix this with bone roll or rotating the leg bones

[odd hill]

what are you trying to fix exactly

[burnt goblet]

my feet are straight irl

in game my shins are facing outward

[odd hill]

you'd want to do bone roll for that I think

[burnt goblet]

okie

what does bone roll even do other than rotate things

[odd hill]

You can see what it does if you go into Pose mode. When you give a bone roll, you can determine the angle at which it rotates along its local axes

[odd hill]

btw also, you can possibly fix the bones being oriented like that by checking/unchecking "automatic bone rotation" on the import settings in blender

[burnt goblet]

will would i adjust the bone roll in ward or outward to fix this

[unborn sandal]

Where would find these setting at and would they need to be done before anything else has been done to the mode, such as Mixamo

[odd hill]

@unborn sandal You'd find those settings as you import the FBX into Blender.
@burnt goblet Inward, just roll them until they look right

[unborn sandal]

Is the only way to tell if it worked to put it into unity again I guess?

[fading verge]

Just finished rigging my character in blender
Never again.

[bold patrol]

So Im trying to get a model that was rigged in Maya using Advanced Skeletons into blender. Whenever I import the model into Blender, this is what I get, any suggestions?

[crude schooner]

hey folks, not very active here, but i have a question related to rigging/animating. I've got a character with double jointed knees (image below) and I was wondering if anyone had tips for working with this sort of character design? Thanks! (this is just a very rough 3d mockup btw)

If this isn't the right channel to ask just lemme know

[solid adder]

Probably set it up like a normal leg, but have constraint or two perhaps. If there's a specific way you want it to bend I guess.

[crude schooner]

Yeah, it doesnt bend at the ankle or top knee

[coarse delta]

https://www.autodesk.com/developer-network/platform-technologies/fbx-converter-archives

[bold patrol]

Its already an FBX file, would putting it through this program help the issue? Im new to this sort of stuff so I have no idea

[fickle cosmos]

I dont know enough about bones, but im pretty sure this is easy to do if you just find out how bones work!
I think you should have your normal humanoid armature and have extra legs next to it that follow your legs and they can bend in "wrong" direction!
Like exo-skeleton 😄

more like this, I dont know how those legs even work.. 😄

[fading verge]

hey i got this model for blender and it seems to be humanoid rigged but i wanna add bones to parts so they can be moved too

i even got it to tpose and export to fbx or obj and load up on mixamo and the animations work there but can i add more bones to parts?

like in unity i wanna attach a script to certain bone then and do things in code to modify there position

[sage patio]

easiest way would be to rig it like a normal leg, with one of the joints being the actual knee, and the other not moving. what you're trying to do with those two opposite joints is essentially a digitigrade leg

the issue with that is that you not only need to have the bones for that, but since you need to have only 2 leg bones for Unity to consider it a humanoid rig, you need to have another set of leg bones which are normal

then, you would either need to use Constraints to make it work, or FinalIK, which would in theory work better, but is MUCH harder to set up

[foggy flower]

where can i add a neck and chest to this avatar