#career-chat | Unreal Source | Page 67

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:16 PM

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there is a multiplier

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but its a multiplier

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some people do learn faster than others, and can think faster. If they are not trained, they wont become anything

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:16 PM

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And vice versa

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It's just one of those fields that we simply dont know about enough to make any valid claims imo

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:17 PM

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but work is most of it. If you have high IQ or whatever, its just easier for you, but still gotta work and practise

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you could call it talent

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i have indeed seen talent for programming in some people, and in others just not

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:17 PM

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I know some of you hate the guy, but hey
https://youtu.be/fjs2gPa5sD0

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:17 PM

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ive seen people (myself and a few others) who learned basics of programming in a week, and had 0 difficulty

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ive also seen people that no matter what they do they have huge difficulty with it

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in computer science universities its super easy to see

finite mulch Jul 27, 2019, 6:18 PM

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Psychology Professor Dr. Jordan B. Peterson explains why IQ is a good predictor of success in the job market. The more complex the occupation, the higher the requirement of cognitive abilities. By ignoring this reality we do a big disservice to those who don't have the requirements even for simple jobs and get left behind. Both the conservative response 'They should work harder!' or the liberal view 'Everyone has the same potential!' are wrong and are ignoring the hard facts of intelligence.

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:18 PM

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some people just coast

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and other people cant do shit

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not only in programming btw, also in stuff like art

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:18 PM

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I'm far from stupid. But I've seen how my shitty memory gives me a hard time in coding stuff.
I can't imagine if the person intellectually struggles on top of that

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:18 PM

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I still stand by my opinion tbh, history shows how IQ levels have shifted drastically over different generations

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:18 PM

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different people have different talents

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:19 PM

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it just keeps increasing, and afaik is highly correlated to the environment/interests of the specific individual

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:19 PM

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@plucky hatch im dreadfully bad at remembering text

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its made me HORRIBLE at history and language classes

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doesnt affect programming

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:19 PM

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As soon as Im dealing with classes that branch out and it gets a bit spaghetii, Im done

lilac walrus Jul 27, 2019, 6:19 PM

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my memory is borderline non-functional, but I can still write half decent code

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:19 PM

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It's over

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lol

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:19 PM

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a lot of programmers have shitty text-memory

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:20 PM

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At best, it's a way to measure how smart a person is right this instant, not a way to measure how smart they are at any given time prior or the potential of how smart they can be

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:20 PM

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but improved/good visualization-memory

lilac walrus Jul 27, 2019, 6:20 PM

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obviously they should all just use Blueprint

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:20 PM

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Personally, I believe that ''IQ'' is more of a domain specific thing
It's not a general thing

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Some people have a ''business IQ'' others... ''gaming IQ'', etc

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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To be fair, and this is purely from experience, I've felt stupid my entire life 😂

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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lmao

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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Though the more I followed my goal (to become a badass programmer), the smarter ive gotten

finite mulch Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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Can I have "sleep IQ"?

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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best IQ

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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@finite mulch can we all? D:

finite mulch Jul 27, 2019, 6:21 PM

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😄

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:22 PM

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To the memory thing @plucky hatch I used to think I have bad memory, which was visible in how I coded a few years ago. This instant though, I can remember a significant chunk of the code ive written over the past 6 months or so

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sometimes prior, it's just muscle memory to me at the moment

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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Dude, I can't tell you what I did yesterday

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😐

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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I just remember to open file X and scroll down that much to find what I need

finite mulch Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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That's an issue thonking

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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hahahahaha

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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I can't tell you what I did yeterday either tbh 😂

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It's more of a long-term memory thing

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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All days look the same

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...

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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my short term is still hugely shit

west sonnet Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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IQ is only relative to a demographic. It's defining parameters are controversial enough
considering it has arbitrary bases. Its about as bullshit as a lie detector -almost no scientific creditability.

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:23 PM

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Point is though, this wasn't the case a few years ago

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I struggled to remember even the simplest lessons 🤷

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:24 PM

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so are we now underselling each other in how crappy we are?

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:24 PM

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Just saying, if you are a programmer and hang out with game dev, programmers, etc.
It is very likely that you have surrounded yourself, unvoluntarily with smart people.

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:24 PM

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@vernal kraken dont start a cult ;-;

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 6:24 PM

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neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerd

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:25 PM

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leave the room if you're the smartest

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:25 PM

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🤔

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:25 PM

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Where is the ''Smartest person'' detector

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:25 PM

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It exists; IQ tests

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😂

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:25 PM

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i thought whiteboard tests are good for IQ? 🤔

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:27 PM

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I also wonder how IQ plays out in Generalists, Specialists and Multi-Specialists.

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🍿 🕵 🍿

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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Going to comment without reading this whole conversation, but in my experience persistence in game dev is more important than a few IQ points here and there.

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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Not really something we can quantify

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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i like my specialists T-shaped

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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Lots of smarter people than I don't have the patience to do good work.

west sonnet Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority

Illusory superiority

In the field of social psychology, illusory superiority is a condition of cognitive bias wherein a person overestimates their own qualities and abilities, in relation to the same qualities and abilities of other persons. Illusory superiority is one of many positive illusions,...

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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Like how many game dev actually can Code, Design and Art at a fully proficient level?

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-shaped_skills

T-shaped skills

The concept of T-shaped skills, or T-shaped persons is a metaphor used in job recruitment to describe the abilities of persons in the workforce. The vertical bar on the letter T represents the depth of related skills and expertise in a single field, whereas the horizontal bar...

lilac walrus Jul 27, 2019, 6:28 PM

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@round belfry - you're probably right there

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:29 PM

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And the person who can Code, Design and Art at a proficient level must also perceive the world differently, connect dots that others can't.

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"Innovation is found at the crossroads of multiple disciplines''

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:30 PM

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i agree

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:33 PM

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imagine being someone who can proficiently Code, Design and Art...
Get an interview for a level designer job and the interviewers respond ''sorry, we are looking for a JUST level designer''.

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:33 PM

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Innovation comes in starts and stops though. It's a long term investment and is important for your career. But if you are just trying to get a job they have a very specific problem to solve and trying to determine if you can do it.

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:33 PM

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How many people understand the benefits of being able to do multiple things

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:34 PM

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They want to know if you can get the released in 2 years. They don't really care if you come up with something new.

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:35 PM

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What im saying is some people in the video games industry will be looking for someone who is only 1 thing
And won't understand that there are benefits when you also have a strong background in complementary areas

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Let's say a level designer with a background in 3D modeling and programming

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Some people will see that as less of a LD rather than a Super LD

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:35 PM

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this again...

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:38 PM

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Yeah, I'd say to a degree generalism is underrated. On a smaller team, being able to have a conversation with the modeler as a designer is important. It's benefited me directly as we don't really have anyone overseeing the asset pipeline. But at the end of the day they just want to know if you fit the role and get the job they want done.

plucky hatch Jul 27, 2019, 6:38 PM

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Do you think a VFX artist who has a background in coding and game design is less of a VFX artist?
Will he get a higher salary?

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:40 PM

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No, I dont care. I care about thr ability to do the job I hire him for.

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Hell get the salary he negotiatrd within the seniority bracket

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"We want someone with this specific background" is a covenient lie we tell applicants who fail rule 1.

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:42 PM

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what's rule 1?

ashen lynx Jul 27, 2019, 6:42 PM

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Don't be a..

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:42 PM

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Dont be a dick

ashen lynx Jul 27, 2019, 6:42 PM

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<

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:42 PM

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its also rule 2 and 3

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:43 PM

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Hey I passed that one 😂

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Most of what I've gotten though were "We're looking for someone within a specific seniority level"

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:43 PM

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thats valid

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:44 PM

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isn't the specific background already checked once you're at the point finding out about the personality?

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which happens likely on premises

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:44 PM

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sometimes the project does need a senior or can only afford a junior

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:44 PM

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"Don't be a dick" is an open statement meant to reinforce the status quo of the current ruling class.

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:45 PM

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wat

west sonnet Jul 27, 2019, 6:45 PM

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How much of an ego must you have to qualify as a dick? 😜

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:47 PM

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@flat gazelle i'd be disappointed though if the job descriptions says "senior" and only later reveals junior pay

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:48 PM

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sometimes the project does need a senior or can only afford a junior yeah this is pretty much

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my last application

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It was kinda funny though because they approached me

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:48 PM

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that's super weird

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:48 PM

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Then you run

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:48 PM

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They had hired the junior prior though

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:48 PM

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baaad sign

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:49 PM

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huh, why's that? o.o

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:49 PM

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nothings case

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:49 PM

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Not enough money to fund the project. Sinking ship

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:49 PM

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the senior on junior pay

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:50 PM

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like anything else that diverges greatly from the job description and likely skype call

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:50 PM

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yeah

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:51 PM

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though i still have to have a screening call for a fulltime positions where they give out salary numbers

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when freelancing it's one of the first things they ask

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😄

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:51 PM

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That's odd, it was supposedly a new ubisoft studio

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:51 PM

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in berlin?

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:51 PM

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Abu Dhabi

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:52 PM

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uh ok

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:52 PM

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the guy was quite eager to reach me, too

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🤷

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It just felt so odd when they changed their mind

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:53 PM

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maybe they anchored and did so poorly?

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:53 PM

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unless they pulled a bait&switch those things can happen

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:53 PM

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not sure what the term anchored means in this context 🤔

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They did state they had a hard time finding the candidate though, so maybe they just found someone with more experience 🤷

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I'd assumed they approached me due to the lack of options 😄

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:54 PM

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https://www.negotiations.com/definition/anchoring/

Negotiation Experts

Vitalii Hava

Negotiation Anchoring

Definition of 'anchoring' in your negotiations. Glossary of definitions of commonly used negotiating phrases and terminology.

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:54 PM

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the number of people willing to move to abu dhabi AND offer your skill set is probably quite small

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:55 PM

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start with a low number to prevent the negotiations to rise too far

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goes both ways

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:55 PM

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We didnt even get to that point sadly 🤷

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:55 PM

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damn

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thrn ruuun

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 6:55 PM

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They ran 😏

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 6:55 PM

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😃

vernal kraken Jul 27, 2019, 6:56 PM

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my reaction to anchoring as a freelancer: politely declining. as a fulltime employee: testing if they'd be willing to come into my direction, if not decline politely

round belfry Jul 27, 2019, 6:57 PM

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I should run from my current job honestly. I really wanted to get some game dev work on my resume, though.

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Remote and doesn't pay well. I looked for like 6 months and no one else would look at me.

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 7:00 PM

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@flat gazelle mfw for a freelance contract i anchored at twice what i was willing to accept, and got accepted

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 7:01 PM

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it puts other contracts in perspective doesnt it? 😛

honest cipher Jul 27, 2019, 7:01 PM

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yup

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 7:05 PM

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Offtopic question

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my search appearances have been increasing significantly over the past couple months on linkedin

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good sign?

flat gazelle Jul 27, 2019, 7:06 PM

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meh

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it goes in waves¨

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its not bad

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but I wouldnt read a ton into it

mystic hull Jul 27, 2019, 7:07 PM

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Thank you sire

cunning sonnet Jul 28, 2019, 12:50 AM

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@plucky hatch Thansk for the advice mate. I will definately take it on board

dull acorn Jul 28, 2019, 3:47 AM

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Hey guys I am a junior college students and need to find an internship for my computer science degree over next summer. I could go find any random computer science internship but I prefer one specifically having to do with game development. Does anyone know any good ways to find an internship opportunity with a game studio?

plucky hatch Jul 28, 2019, 3:55 AM

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job indeed, internships are quite popular these days...

kindred mason Jul 28, 2019, 3:56 AM

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@dull acorn plenty of internship opportunities all over. Just goggle whatever company you're interested in working for maybe in the future and add "internship"

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Try big names first if you have no clue who you want to work for.

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Otherwise, look out for Paid/Royalty job offers remote (some are onsite) on UE4 forums or here #looking-for-talent

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But be quick, IIRC, a lot of companies close out their applications for Summer Internships in the Fall of the previous year

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If not, at the end of the year

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As you can imagine, they get hit by hundreds if not thousands of applications throughout the year

livid arch Jul 28, 2019, 5:12 AM

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Hey! I am programmer, currently learning Unreal and want to do a project for portfolio that I can use for Job search. I use Unity3D at my work and We don't use Unreal, so I need to make it a game that xna help me in job search in positions for unreal programmer. What is a good game genre in terms of scope (A game that can be done in a couple of months) and which can showcase my programming skills. 🤔

kindred mason Jul 28, 2019, 5:14 AM

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Battle Royale

frosty minnow Jul 28, 2019, 5:23 AM

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I'm willing to pay for ue workout / exercise animations. If anyone's interested send me a DM.

kindred mason Jul 28, 2019, 6:01 AM

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@frosty minnow #looking-for-talent

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:06 PM

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What is very important to cover in portofolio for artists ? Right now im doing modelling, texturing, level design and lighting, and usually just post the whole level in artstation sometimes with a cinematic, should I also post each prop I make for the level aswell ? Should I make a lighting breakdown for each portofolio piece that focuses on lighting more than props and models aswell or ?

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:16 PM

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is all of that your VERY BEST work?

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none of it is filler or worse than any other part?

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:19 PM

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Like skills ?

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Or my portofolio parts ?

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Should I delete my older ugly parts ?

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:20 PM

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The portfolio should be the pieces that best decribe your skillevel, so only the best stuff.

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:22 PM

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Ah alright! Well I got some fillers im gonna delete

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What should I show on the good work ?

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:23 PM

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@flat gazelle Allow me to make use of your higher knowledge sire, may I ask what recruiters/interviewers look for on a candidate's git profile?

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:23 PM

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Nobody wants to see the drawings yor parents hung on the Fridge. They want to see what you can do now.

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no clue

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artist

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:23 PM

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Hmm, allow me to ask another question then

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Oh

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I took you for a programmer this whole time 😂

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:24 PM

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VFX artist, so not too far off

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:24 PM

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That explains it 🤔

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So, another question to add to my first

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:24 PM

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I also have a artstation piece whoch was a game jam it does not look very good but it showcases some fundemental to advanced blueprint usage as of level design should I keep that ?

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:25 PM

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Kamii, it depends what your goal is. if you want to advertise as a generalist, show a spread. otherwise focus it

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:25 PM

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Back in 2013-15 I did some modding/private server work, illegal work for the most part (for anyone who'd used it anyway). Would it be a good idea to make that public on my profile, or would it scare people off? 🤔

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Namely things like ASM mods to eliminate certain crashes etc

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C++ hooks and whatnot

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:26 PM

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If its good stuff, wrap it in disclaimers and show it

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own it

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:26 PM

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Thank you, is it normal to advertise as a generalist in todays industry I thought it be good stuff for indies but what if later I want to get higher up is it only specialist ?

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:27 PM

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Thank you sire!

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So you wouldnt be particularly dissuaded to hire somebody based on such experience hmm?

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:27 PM

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AAA doesnt use many generalists, but there is a market for them in indie an medium sdized studios

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nah

honest cipher Jul 28, 2019, 6:28 PM

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not as experienced as glad, but if a programmer comes to me with "ive made hacks for real games in the past", he gets full mark

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it shows very good skill at understanding a mess, as hacking is based on reverse-engineering

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:28 PM

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unless its really illegal, like a hacking a bank

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:28 PM

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Nah just your generic memory mods, asm mods and whatnot

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nothing that'd get me in jail 🤔

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I've just always felt insecure about it, given its not particularly something im proud of

honest cipher Jul 28, 2019, 6:29 PM

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not even 1% of programmers know asm this days

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:29 PM

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working around blocks to fix someone elses shit shows understanding

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:29 PM

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just the only option i had back then 🤷

honest cipher Jul 28, 2019, 6:29 PM

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so being able to tinker with asm for hacks shows very high skill

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:29 PM

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That's really good to know & reassuring though

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Thanks a lot to both of you!

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:30 PM

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yuoll be sowing it to other coders who will likely get it. not a hr bot that people seem to think does the reviews 😃

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:30 PM

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😦 rip

📎 39f7be3723d351c3cb4b69b5d960de76.png

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:31 PM

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sorry for all the typos. injured an arm so I am only lefthanded now

mystic hull Jul 28, 2019, 6:31 PM

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All good! Value text* regardless 😛

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:31 PM

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cant you hide things on AS?

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instead of trashinh

dense heath Jul 28, 2019, 6:32 PM

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isnt trash a hidden folder?

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:32 PM

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I dont use it

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ah

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:32 PM

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i dunno, i trashed it anyways

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It was pretty shitty, young me was just more proud of it

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:33 PM

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yeah, sentimentality doesnt do one many favors when jobhunting im afraid

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:33 PM

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yeah

grave swallow Jul 28, 2019, 6:57 PM

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Btw thanks Glad, thought it be mean just to leave off like that haha

flat gazelle Jul 28, 2019, 6:57 PM

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hehe np

winged lotus Jul 29, 2019, 9:47 AM

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hello, can anyone help me with the career information in Europe. i am an architecture student in Viet Nam and will go to france next year to finish my DPEA. Currently i am learning UE4 archviz step by step and doing quite well, understand some basic material, sequencer and simple blueprint... . but what part of UE4 should i really focus on learning to prepare myself if i want a job. Because i have no interest in working as Game dev , only in archviz so learning advanced knowledge of creating material, code... seem not suitable for me ?

tidal moth Jul 29, 2019, 10:19 AM

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for archviz it's probably not worth it to go into the majority of the UE4 feature set, but having working knowledge of blueprints, mesh pipelines and material creation is probably worthwhile to get into

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plus sequencer and the like for camera movement

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but I am not an archviz person, so it could be what I'm saying is bogus. it's just what seems most reasonable to expect from someone doing UE4 archviz

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:12 PM

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fulltime freelancers, what do you do and how long did it take to get to 100% freelance?

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:16 PM

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Programming, a day?

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Not sure what that last question refers to exactly.

If you're asking how long did it take to set everything up and start working full-time freelance, then maybe a few weeks (putting portfolio and website together), if not less.

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But if you're asking if people usually go part-time to full-time freelance, and how long that takes. No clue. I started from day one.

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And I assumed that's what most people do.

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:17 PM

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How'd you start out just doing it full time? cs degree?

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:17 PM

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Game Dev degree 😉

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Based mostly on art

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😉

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But that had nothing to do with it

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I have already built up a solid portfolio based on game jams and other projects

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:18 PM

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I don't freelance but I run a tiny company. Took me like what, 15 years of work to get to that point? 😄

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:18 PM

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I did start up my own "legit company" last Nov though

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official

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So, that's what... two years

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I started full-time right after graduation in Summer 2017

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:19 PM

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Tbh it's not the official stuff that matters but when you actually start working on company stuff

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:19 PM

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

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But that's also when I started

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:19 PM

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It took me some time after formally registering the company to start working on it 😄

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:20 PM

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It took me hmm, a week or less

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Used LegalZoom

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Worst experience ever and probably wouldn't recommend it if you have the time

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But, relatively cheap.

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But if you have the time, and/or don't have the cash to do it through them. You can do it cheap (albeit it'll take a bit longer to establish yourself)

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:21 PM

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are you full time UE4 c++ or do you do other things as well?

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@fickle hatch what kind of company, games or?

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:21 PM

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Me? I typically just do Programming for contracts.

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Game/Experience prototypes

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:22 PM

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@fathom oasis engineering but we're making something that's basically a videogame

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:22 PM

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(so I do placeholder art / stuff as needed)

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:23 PM

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oh so like proof of concept stuff

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:23 PM

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https://giphy.com/gifs/train-buster-keaton-NGSbD5vI6lUvC

Giphy

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Well, depends on the company/contract

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Sometimes people just want a specific game system done

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Others want a whole prototype done

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Some want a full game to release 😃

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I've done them all

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:24 PM

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nice, i've not really pushed in the programming direction but I've made stuff. Trying to figure out how to get closer to game dev full time rather than part time

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:25 PM

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Honeslty, I wouldn't bother

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:25 PM

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Getting a gamedev job would be one of the easiest ways to get to full time gamedev

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:25 PM

#

You're sound guy right?

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:25 PM

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😄

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:25 PM

#

You should honestly concentrate on Sound

#

Like get yourself 100% expert on Sound tools for Game Dev

fickle hatch Jul 29, 2019, 8:26 PM

#

Find some indies and do sound design for them, get paid some peanuts at least, get comfortable with it, keep going

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:26 PM

#

Default Engine, WWise, FMOD, etc

mystic hull Jul 29, 2019, 8:26 PM

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You're in for a rather bumpy road my friend, but you will get there eventually 😄

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:26 PM

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Yea, I do sound design mostly. I've gotten freelance gigs and developed audio plugins, used fmod/wwise and so much in engine UE audio stuff

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:26 PM

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Yeah, I'm looking for a sound dev actually for my project, hohohoho

#

But seeing how I've never seen you post on #looking-for-work

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Or anywhere else

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:27 PM

#

oh does that work?

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:27 PM

#

I am going to assume your problem is you are doing a poop job at advertising yourself

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:27 PM

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lol yea, I haven't decided the best ways to do that

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:28 PM

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You should figure that out so you can reach your goals faster

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:28 PM

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Are you doing advertisement stuff like consistent posts on LFW sites or is it more word of mouth?

kindred mason Jul 29, 2019, 8:28 PM

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Consistent lol

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I have only ever had one (maybe two) posts in #looking-for-work

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And somehow I get PM'd quite a bit every week

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Other places like forums, upwork, freelancer help as well

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The more places you are, the more exposure you have, the more of a chance people will find you

#

Anyway, eventually, through WOM, and just seeing you around, people approach you

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Well, at least that's what people tell me when they first hit me up

fathom oasis Jul 29, 2019, 8:31 PM

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That's good to know, I guess I'll start on that then. I imagine that's probably what's making my freelance gigs slow

fading wind Jul 31, 2019, 10:47 PM

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What would I be looking for if I'm looking for someone to help me develop a story/lore for my game? Writer? Not sure I see too many of those in #looking-for-work. Anyone know of a decent place to search for that type of talent?

west sonnet Aug 1, 2019, 12:01 AM

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Story designer

plucky hatch Aug 1, 2019, 12:26 AM

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Or storyboarder, writer, narrative director, etc.
Something along those lines.

#

But it's a bit tricky. Some people are really good at creating worlds, but aren't great at writing dialogues.

silk dew Aug 1, 2019, 6:43 AM

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i worked on a game that used a single writer to come up with character names, backgrounds, quests, the main story, item names, item descriptions, place names. It's seriously a lot of work

grave totem Aug 1, 2019, 11:02 AM

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Im pretty good at writing fps stories,deciding names,main story,backstory,etc and blueprints(only single player) @fading wind

tidal moth Aug 1, 2019, 11:50 AM

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@fading wind narrative designer if you are looking to develop lore that also has to be contained in the world somehow

wide jetty Aug 3, 2019, 3:58 AM

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Hey ughhh anyone know how to get a SVN server setup? If so DM me please

tacit siren Aug 3, 2019, 4:19 AM

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@wide jetty #source-control

wide jetty Aug 3, 2019, 4:19 AM

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Thx

plucky hatch Aug 3, 2019, 4:24 PM

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@silk dew 👍 yeah it is a lot of work

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When I was running D&D games, for a 2 days session it would take me 2 weeks of work.

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😫

iron nova Aug 5, 2019, 9:19 AM

#

I need help I want to make a battle Royale game can anyone help me

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Give me a battle Royale full tutorial please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please

lilac walrus Aug 5, 2019, 9:53 AM

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wtf

tidal moth Aug 5, 2019, 9:54 AM

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clearly a career topic as well

iron nova Aug 5, 2019, 9:54 AM

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Please help

tidal moth Aug 5, 2019, 9:54 AM

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you're not in the right place

flat gazelle Aug 5, 2019, 10:01 AM

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Surely that's a parody account

tidal moth Aug 5, 2019, 10:20 AM

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I wouldn't be so sure

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12 year olds do exist

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and they do have internet access

grave totem Aug 5, 2019, 10:23 AM

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@iron nova check out the br template on ue4 marketplace https://www.unrealengine.com/marketplace/en-US/slug/battle-royale-template-inventory-minimap

Battle Royale Template (Inventory + Minimap) by Amine Sidane in Bl...

Battle Royale blueprint project with an advanced inventory system and minimap, last man/team standing wins.

iron nova Aug 5, 2019, 11:00 AM

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@grave totem

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Already have it thank you very much 🙃

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Can you help me more @ @grave totem

lilac walrus Aug 5, 2019, 11:23 AM

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a) This is the career channel.
b) Most people are busy with their own stuff. If you have specific questions, ask in the relevant channels.

tidal leaf Aug 5, 2019, 12:40 PM

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When looking at a portfolio, would you prefer lots of projects showing variety, or a few highly polished pieces?

grave totem Aug 5, 2019, 12:41 PM

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Highly polished ones

tidal leaf Aug 5, 2019, 12:42 PM

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yeah it seems like that makes sense, I'm always conflicted by the idea of "be really good at a few things" or "show that you can do more then one thing"

flat gazelle Aug 5, 2019, 12:43 PM

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A couple of bad pieces can kill an otherwise good protfolio

tidal leaf Aug 5, 2019, 12:46 PM

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Noted, thanks guys

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 9:54 AM

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Guys, serious question here. I've been making a portfolio for quite a while. However, in my portfolio I'm using 3 packs I bought from the asset store for free (All of which are visual) and have downloaded from the internet some personal use pictures for inventory item icons.

Am I allowed to use this project as a portfolio? If I understand correctly, I can't publish the code because some of it is not mine. But how about the personal use pictures?

It's already stated with bold letters in the first stage with a disclaimer which packs are used and that the sole purpose of their usage is to show actual practical examples (like using weapon models). I'm a developer btw, not an artist.

tidal moth Aug 6, 2019, 9:55 AM

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developer as in programmer?

lilac walrus Aug 6, 2019, 9:56 AM

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so long as you're not misrepresenting someone else's work as your own, I don't see a problem with it

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 9:56 AM

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yes,I'm trying to show gameplay functionalities

lilac walrus Aug 6, 2019, 9:56 AM

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not unless the license has something weird in it

tidal moth Aug 6, 2019, 9:56 AM

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check the license yeah

#

but otherwise it should be fine

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 9:57 AM

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@lilac walrus I'm good with law etc, I've tried googling anything from UE4 about the subject or portfolios in general and I cant seem to draw a line on this

tidal moth Aug 6, 2019, 9:57 AM

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I think it's fair if you're trying to show functionality based on a weapon model for instance

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 9:58 AM

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https://law.stackexchange.com/questions/21550/do-portfolio-projects-count-as-commercial-use

Law Stack Exchange

Do portfolio projects count as 'commercial use'

I may be overthinking this bit but... I want to use a certain audio file with creative commons license, which states that I may not use it for commercial purposes.

Hence the question: do portfolio

#

how does this stack up?

tidal moth Aug 6, 2019, 11:06 AM

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I don't know law well enough, but my presumption would be that anything that is considered auxiliary for demonstration purposes, especially for an individual, would not constitute commercial use

elder mist Aug 6, 2019, 11:12 AM

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@sharp path why you're bothered about portfolio usage terms? most artists just link their Artstation/Behance/Deviantart page (which is not a portfolio)

#

CC has explanation on their license: https://wiki.creativecommons.org/wiki/NonCommercial_interpretation

NonCommercial interpretation

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 11:33 AM

#

@elder mist i'm not an artist. but I am using assets of others. I'm bothered because I don't know If I can upload the source code when it contains the work of others in it

Edit: and also whether portfolio means commercial use

elder mist Aug 6, 2019, 11:37 AM

#

@sharp path sorry it was not cleat that you're going to upload the source code, that means all the assets "as is"? if so the only thing you should be bothered is "redistribution" terms (Epic Eula prohibits redistribution of their assets)

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 11:39 AM

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@elder mist even if those assets were not directly created by Epic Games and were free for only a period of time?

lilac walrus Aug 6, 2019, 11:39 AM

#

if you don't own it, you can't directly redistribute it unless the license says so

#

ergo, you can distribute your source, you cannot distribute someone else's assets with it

#

triply so given they're apparently being sold for a price

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 11:44 AM

#

so, i'll have everything combined to send as packaged to job applications. but for source code, i'll rip off every asset and piece of code created by others and upload it to github with a warning to not run the project. sounds about right? @lilac walrus

serene basin Aug 6, 2019, 11:45 AM

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yeah i don't know if this counts as "distribution" a portfolio with clear source citation isn't counted as redistribution in Europe

elder mist Aug 6, 2019, 11:46 AM

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@serene basin "upload the source code" is not the citation

serene basin Aug 6, 2019, 11:48 AM

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He said the application was properly labeled and I imagine that he's able to make annotation in the source code to cite the work

elder mist Aug 6, 2019, 11:51 AM

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@serene basin how does labeling allows you to redistribute someone's else work?

serene basin Aug 6, 2019, 12:08 PM

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Here's what I understand: SecondCaller is uploading a project portfolio (to a site I guess). He doesn't know if he can upload the source because it contains code written by someone else.

Are other people able to copy this source code and use it on their own?

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 12:08 PM

#

So, I've decided to upload the packaged game to Google Drive and send it along with my CV once I remove everything apart from the asset store packs. With that said, I'll add a note that Source Code can only be shown privately where I'll give the proper citations. The project will be packaged with no intention of being above 1gb. All 3 of the packs I've download are but a very few MB (50 character animations and 5 weapon models) and I'm not even using Starter Content.

Does this suffice?

elder mist Aug 6, 2019, 12:09 PM

#

@serene basin no, he asks if he could upload the assets that he got from MP

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 12:09 PM

#

@serene basin yes i had the intention of putting the whole project to github since I've never uploaded anything to my git account but it seems like way too many problems will arise

serene basin Aug 6, 2019, 12:16 PM

#

I'm no lawyer (clearly), but it sounds like we're not talking about software then. We're talking digital assets. If they are not available for copy, then this is considered personal use - as far as I'm aware. The author does have to be properly cited however.

#

As soon as they are available for copy then it classifies as distribution.

#

It does not seem any different from using character rigs for animation reels.

lilac walrus Aug 6, 2019, 12:33 PM

#

difference is when you use someone else's (for sale) character rig to make an animation reel, you don't distribute the rig with your reel

#

this is a pretty important distinction]

#

you don't have the rights to distribute that rig, even in private

serene basin Aug 6, 2019, 12:34 PM

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yes, that is an important distinction

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 12:39 PM

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@lilac walrus so if someone asks for source code privately, I'll show only my own code and not the one from the asset packs through skype. Did i understand correctly?

serene basin Aug 6, 2019, 12:45 PM

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I'll leave this topic alone, it sounds like more than digital assets. And @sharp path I'd be as cautious as possible. If it were me, I'd just show my code. And disclaim that I also used source code from so-and-so, but not distribute it. Remember that when it can be copied it is then distribution. Also, if you're really concerned, consult a lawyer. There is probably a copyright lawyer at your Uni or even one available for students online.

lilac walrus Aug 6, 2019, 12:46 PM

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yes, only your own code

sharp path Aug 6, 2019, 1:12 PM

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ok guys, i decided that ill package the whole deal and upload the executable on google drive. and as for source code, i'll approach it with caution. thank you

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 10:33 PM

#

Say folks, who works solo on video games here?

#

Any aspirers of Undertale or Stardew Valley who'd rather work alone on games, or at least does not mind doing so?

#

I personally find it very beneficially working alone than with a team in this age. And I could go all day as to reason why I think the lone-wolf path is best for me. Its not for everyone but its not a fool's errand to be shunned and discouraged like some seem to be doing.

#

It's a rather underrated practice now.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 10:49 PM

#

@plucky hatch I do for 50% of the year 50% I do contracting

#

@plucky hatch when I go back on onsite which might be a year between jobs I do start out excited to be around new people and it is refreshing then working alone.

#

when I get back to working alone I also get refreshed as my comprise / limitation juice is all expelled also I feel free which is a nice reward.

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:16 PM

#

That's one interesting way to go about it.

#

Balanced stance is good too.

#

I do not dismiss my willingness to work onsite at AA or AAA companies, considering I've still yet to work with any of them onsite. AA companies I have worked with but there were all off-site and remote jobs.

#

Usually outsourced.

#

Which comes to the part I hate about team work - contracting. Freelance work has become mostly a non-option at this point. It has often bring me more stress and strife than it brings any true benefits. Either the communities have changed or the industry has changed, or both as it seems to gear towards. It use to be OK or even great when I first started in 2009.

#

I am finally getting interview calls from AA and AAA studios but usually falls flat there now. The resume I built seems more a liability than benefit as using my contracting/freelance history seems to be turning away employers due to the impression of "short stints" when in truth it was just short contracts I completed.

#

So I recently scrapped most of my freelance experience and left the few long term ones there.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:21 PM

#

ah I have been riddled by the pain of failure I started my own studio in the mid 90's got a million dollar deal and still failed mostly to my programming partner thinking he could beat carmack

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:23 PM

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Damn... It would be an honor to match skillset with Lord Carmack, but I never would ever think i can surpass his prowess. Such a feat was unheard of and exceptionally rare and nigh impossible to achieve. Only place that leaves such opportunity is Africa, but only if the barriers can be removed.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:24 PM

#

he is a very nice guy my programming partner invented choplifter the original apple but had been in retirement for over a decade he was a smart cookie but we failed the publisher got sick of waiting for his engine

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:25 PM

#

I can't blame the pub for that one. New engines are a huge risk to invest on and can take decades to complete.

#

I wasted nearly a full decade, trusting others in the freelance scene and appeasing them hoping that good will and fortune would come out of it and help me long term with my career efforts and my own projects. I was a fool and I suffered greatly for it.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:25 PM

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camarack was nice enough to let me back in the building after spent 30 mins throwing quarters at his window at 3 am in parking lot and my lighter I think the last nickle got his focus he didnt yell at me for bothering him so I was happy

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:25 PM

#

Lol what?

#

What were thinking mate? Lol

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:26 PM

#

I left my badge on my desk to go smoke on quakewars

#

and my keys and everything were on my desk

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:26 PM

#

Lol, now you're just screwing with me.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:26 PM

#

so I was chucking quarters at the window from my pocket at the 2nd floor window to get him to look out the window

#

no its true

#

I am aan idiot

#

that was the first time I talked to him and how it happened

#

or maybe the 2nd maybe the first was how I explained how splash damage had fucked up coding the changes they made on conference call

#

all I know I left the room when he started yelling at splash damage after about 15 minutes

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:30 PM

#

What year was this?

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:31 PM

#

ah when ever the ps3 was about to come out and quakewars was in development? ah.... maybe 2006?

#

I was working on the ps3 port of quakewars and got sent to help finish the pc version to id

#

or at id

#

that seems like the right date, I went to dreamworks animation after that and then have been a contractor the last 10 years

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:33 PM

#

So you are an id Software developer.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:33 PM

#

no I worked for acitvision

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:33 PM

#

Ah, Activision.

#

One of id's partners.

#

Former partner now...

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:34 PM

#

yeah after quake wars failed and wolf and some other things maybe rage too they had COD and didnt need id anymore

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:34 PM

#

The day Activision went full greed.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:35 PM

#

attaching humanity to a public company was something that got burned away from at EA

#

if you survive for more then 16 months people remember your name if you make through 4 years of layoffs you are elite

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:37 PM

#

I miss the old days of id. So much innovation. Their new id Techs were always something I'd anticipate for.
EA was crooked from the beginning, but at least with Trip, it was somewhat manageable. When he left it went from mediocre to worst, as far as their games and buyout mercy-killings are concerned.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:38 PM

#

they did it as a company at EA they made the choice as a group when the group was very small and Trip was still there

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:38 PM

#

So Trip is guilty of this nightmare that is currently EA today?

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:39 PM

#

he had a hand in it like Hilleman, and Probst etc

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:40 PM

#

That part I know. Trip was a one greedy God-f*cker. Shame too because I loved the Army Men series, I grew up a die-hard fan of the IP, but it was just created and poorly managed by a greedy despot who couldn't be bothered to exercise patience and allow creativity to improve the products he wished to sell.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:41 PM

#

they built it and around 98 when it grew from 700 mil to 4 bil in revenue during the ps2 era it became it's own being

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:41 PM

#

But his successors at EA proved far worse.

fickle hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:41 PM

#

Fascinating conversation btw

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:41 PM

#

The 6th generation of gaming (the so-called PS2 era), was EA's best decade.

#

And a best decade for most AAs.

#

and AAAs.

#

The 5th generation was the best for AAs and indies.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:42 PM

#

During the Larry era it became the borg cube it is today but he had helpers and minions I was a small cog in the machine producer / level designer

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:43 PM

#

Larry? As in Larry Elmore?

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:43 PM

#

Larry Probst the only Larry

#

😃

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:43 PM

#

Oh. I thought you were referring to the 80s.

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:43 PM

#

his son is being grown to take over from the sweeeds

#

no i was in highschool in the 80's

#

I started in 89 at atari

#

at 19 years old

#

the real atari the coin op divsion not the other home computer atari

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:45 PM

#

love me some larry elmore

merry tartan Aug 6, 2019, 11:46 PM

#

@plucky hatch sorry I dont know who that is I am old man trying to make one more game before I die

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:47 PM

#

Lol, you're not that old mate. I'd reckon you are in your 40s or 50s.

#

did alot of art for AD&D

#

@plucky hatch Fun fact, I personally met him at a convention two years ago.

#

now all i can think of is gary gygax's paladin sketch

#

And through my college professor James Simpson, who is one of Elmore's star pupils and die-hard fan of his IP Snarf Quest.

#

Snarf omg

#

The Art Institute unlocked so much secrets and perks I'd struggle to find otherwise. At the cost of my financial state...

#

I never knew of Snarf at all until I met Simpson at college, during my final year towards graduation.

#

It was an honor meeting him and learning from him. He is a good example of what game devs should aspire to be. He does not take shit from slackers or saboteurs in his own projects. Unlike me, he is not particularly anti-team, but he is very strict with who gains access to his progress. If someone is proving themself unreliable, he assigns them lower-tier/low-risk work. It could even as far as "making rock models and textures" and nothing more. Just to keep them from sabotaging vital progress on a game.

#

Definitely don't want such people messing with your code. Liabilities one must look out for.

#

That is an interesting strategy for dealing with clock punchers.

#

It was also thanks to him that I mastered my programming skills and my time effiency, getting code done faster than I use to.

#

My programming was already pretty good, but he helped me polish it more and optimize my code and scripts to perform better and efficiently.

#

The work on my fangame years ago was incredible but it was also a buggy, scattered mess, few programmers could read, thus I struggled to keep help as much as I did to acquire it in first place.

#

When it came to programming at least.

#

For a non-commercial project, its hard to get help and I blame them not.

#

Considering bad experiences I had working with unpaid charity games.

fickle hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:56 PM

#

Haha. I'm very sensitive about who I let to work with the code/assets/game/everything

#

I can appreciate people who are like this

#

I generally don't trust an arbitrary person to be able to figure out a workflow on their own to something

#

So if there's any work to be done of a new kind (where I don't already have workflows and guidelines to giving this work to people), I try to complete it first myself, write out workflows

#

Then I can tell how good people are at managing their time and other minor working things based on how they follow the workflow and what kinda suggestions they give to adjusting it

plucky hatch Aug 6, 2019, 11:59 PM

#

Definitely agree. Especially code. That and art are primary level content. Some stuff are secondary like voice and audio. I do not need them but I prefer having them, its recommended shit that improves game quality. Then there are teritaries - those that are just extra accessories and cosmetics. If they fail, the project is practically unaffected by it.

#

Now granted I am not perfect myself, especially with time manageament. I tend to juggle between priorities that I think are most important with my life, but I am no slacker.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:00 AM

#

No good worker blindly follows any workflow, the feedback from the team lead and team members (in my current project there are only <10 people, I'm just trying to always keep management scaleability in mind so I can re-use work I do today, tomorrow) is a valuable health indication for me

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:01 AM

#

I'd rather work with a small and dedicated team, than a large and ill-prepared one.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:01 AM

#

Then eventually the workflows get ironed out to the point where I can just take an arbitrary artist and tell him "do exactly as it says here, to the letter"

#

And then my health reports are feedback on how the artists are following the ironed-out workflows

#

If they ask the right questions, if they manage to follow basic steps

#

@plucky hatch "few programmers could read" <-- haha, what?

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:05 AM

#

?

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:05 AM

#

From a few messages ago

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:05 AM

#

Ah.

#

Yes, my code was rather unorganized, granted I was using UnrealScript at the time.

#

think he meant decipher not read

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:06 AM

#

Yeah, I see

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:06 AM

#

Decipher seems the better term.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:06 AM

#

Oh btw, this is a special consideration for our project - I would be interested to hear how this is handled at game studios - but for our project we work with proprietary restricted information

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:06 AM

#

They can clearly read it, they just struggling to find a good place to fix any issues I need them to fix.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:06 AM

#

So there's code & assets that can only be accessed by specific team members and such

#

Even though we're a tiny team, we run our own document system with confidentiality levels/restriction levels and all that stuff. I wonder how similar stuff is handled at big game studios (I would assume usually game studios assign same restriction level to all members of a team that works on a single project?)

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:08 AM

#

Or improve the code. One of them really did not appreciate that I rely solely on UScript for referencing assets instead of using Archetypes; something I eventually utilized but too late into development that it mostly served as a customizer for NPCs than actually relying on the core gameplay.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:09 AM

#

In other words, I can't give some work to new members of the team until they prove themselves trustworthy

main zenith Aug 7, 2019, 12:09 AM

#

@fickle hatch I would imagine it depends on the studio, but I often see programmers having one set of permissions, and everyone else a different set, just so nobody that is a non-programmer is touching the source code

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:11 AM

#

I religiously refuse to grant non-programmers access to my code. Or anyone I can not trust for that matter.

#

Art I was more liberal with, offering content if they prove their skills and have them resolve it. Rigging is good? Here is one model, prove you can do it and I will hand the rest of the necessary.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:12 AM

#

I don't let anyone but people who should work on the code to access the code

#

Same for blueprints and working documents (documentation for the game), but not art assets and other bulk stuff

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:13 AM

#

Now, I refuse to hand away either to anyone.

main zenith Aug 7, 2019, 12:13 AM

#

As a very technical designer I appreciate read access, even if I don't have write access, just so I can go see what things do when I have questions

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:13 AM

#

Some docs I may not fear handing away, others I am strict on defending.

#

I would quit if I didnt have read access, even if I was only hired to make the coffee.

#

But I make no habit of showing my GDD too often.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:13 AM

#

@fickle hatch What is the system that you measure trust worthness?

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:13 AM

#

It's pointless right now, but I'm trying to keep a set of documents that we could keep low restriction on so in the future we could get new employees familiar with engineering side to stuff they work on

#

@merry tartan Me and my business partner are good at reading people, we reach a consensus after talking to the person about how trustworthy they are

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:14 AM

#

but why would you hire someone that you didnt trust right away?

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

Cause some types of work don't require exposure to the restricted materials

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

Vexar I thought you were on this rock long enough to not trust anyone right away.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

Restricted info = mostly engineering blueprints, documents and drawings and such, stuff that isn't gamedev related, but relates to our simulation projects

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

sure so that makes sense but everyone you hire if you needed to give that person access you could?

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

One strategy I used when working on my fangame was write task lists of only the necessary and offer only samples of the necessary pertaining to the work profession.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:16 AM

#

@merry tartan different levels of trust, I'll hire someone who I trust to do the work, but I will only let people access to engineering drawings if I have full trust in them not sharing these drawings to other entities

main zenith Aug 7, 2019, 12:16 AM

#

isn't that what NDA's and other legal documents are for?

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:16 AM

#

no

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:16 AM

#

NDA's are just the legal cushion, nothing prevents you from taking engineering drawings and making a run for it to another country

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:16 AM

#

@fickle hatch is this your own content or like an outsider companies content?

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:17 AM

#

@merry tartan both, a lot of the outside company content

#

The drawings we do aren't as valuable (just normal 'we wouldn't like anyone to see these' restriction level), but the ones provided by other companies are the valuable ones

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:18 AM

#

@merry tartan You don't have to trust someone completely to hire them. If I hired a female employee at my company, could I still trust she won't try to set me up to be framed for stalking or sexual harassment suit?
You trust people only to a certain degree and the trust is temporary and can be revoked at any time, usually when the work is done; cut the cord and move on. It is not complete trust and only grows when he/she earns it.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:18 AM

#

I recognize different levels of respect and trust

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:18 AM

#

When its outsider's content, that is a little different. I am working for them.

#

With my own content, I am always ever vigilant around trust.

#

In the USA, Intellectual Property is protected from the moment you speak it or write it, or sign it I suppose, but like @fickle hatch says, across the border not so much

#

Precisely why I tend to keep it protected unless really necessary. I dont fear North Americans hijacking my game, its foreigners I must be wary off. USA laws do not appy to them, their laws may not support protecting of certain creative rights. So its very healthy to be cautious of such sensitive info.

#

It is sad, everytime I find out the person who wants to work with me is outside the states, I have to clam up. All because I am too lazy to look up their laws.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:22 AM

#

I've got Russians working for me

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:22 AM

#

@fickle hatch it sounds like you have a good system, if you don't protect the clients content you are going to lose them if someone is an employee you are still at risk, the only people giving out work should be the owners of the company and enough access to do the work.

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:22 AM

#

Also scam risk is higher too. I got fucked over by an Australian a couple years ago and I have merely to no grounds to actually sue him because of complications for international law.

#

How does a US company sue an Australian saboteur who cost me a LOT of money?

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

There are ways, but none nice ones

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

Enough access that pertains to profession. Artists shall have only art-relevant access, Programmers, code-relevant access, etc.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

It would be easier to hire a thug to influence that saboteur

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:24 AM

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The US is a signatory to the international Patent Cooperation Treaty (PCT). Applications filed through the PCT can seek utility patent protection with the USPTO. ... US law, like Australia and Canada, allows a one-year grace period for an inventor to register a patent from the date of public disclosure. Thats what google tells me.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

at some studios they monitor your keystrokes and scan all your email and all ports coming from your box but people always figure out a way around it if they want. The big risk for them is getting blacklisted and never getting a job again but that might not be a big enough threat.

#

I was at EA for two major failures in security one was on Medal of Honor the other was on Bond

#

oh and a 3rd

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:26 AM

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Original MOH or the 2010 reboot?

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

I forgot about the FBI calling EA to tell them my old laptop was being used to serve porn

#

that was a funny call

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

What the hell?

#

God damn EA...

#

from Electronic Arts to Erotic Arts

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:27 AM

#

yeah I moved down to LA to work on MOH of PC the originals and I got a call from my buddy at EA after getting called by IT

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:27 AM

#

So 1999?

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:29 AM

#

I had been working for around 12 hours and 16 days with out a break IT guy said "Are you Victor Mercieca?" I like yeah is this test the build will be ready in an hour I am checking in the fixes now. "I don't care about the build" Oh, what can I do for you? I am from IT, oh. Do you know where your laptop is? What laptop? Sony Viao 850? Oh I had one of those when I was in the Publshing group I left a year ago.

#

IT guy do you know where it is? I was like I gave it to the Development Director. What was his name? Blah blah I gave him the name. Thank you sir, good bye, click. Confused I hung up the phone. Next day my buddy called me from that group, Hey the FB1 are here in the office asking for the password or your old laptop in a room with the dev director, apparently it was being used to manage server that were sending out 20% of the US nations porn at the time. I fell out of my chair laughing.

#

a group of producers had bought into a bunch of strip clubs using bonus money and then were recording the employees of these clubs and serviing it using EA equipement and nobody knew about it for about a year until the FBI called EA and told them.

#

LOLS

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:33 AM

#

Holy damn. Was your director using it to err... Exploit his body?

#

Was he even arrested?

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:34 AM

#

he was fired and deported and then rehired as a contractor to work outside of EA

#

but that took years

#

he was a good programmer turned into a dev director so

#

but he wasnt the ring leader either

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:35 AM

#

Deported his ass back to Canada!

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:35 AM

#

ah germany

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:35 AM

#

Thats still stuck in my head.

#

Ah to Germany.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:36 AM

#

the other one was small potatoes, a group of artists who not getting paid a lot started doing contract work using EA equipement late at night after everyone left

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:36 AM

#

This was '99 and the FBI was still crazy about porn sites?

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:36 AM

#

was maybe 2001

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:36 AM

#

FBI only gets crazy about one kind of porn

#

The illegal kind

#

That super illegal kind that disgusts me.

#

Well porn disgusts me overall, but there are few that infuriate me more.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:37 AM

#

the last one was 80 people from the MOH console team quit and took all the server data with them to go start COD console at Spark the FBI went to the house of everyone to collect the harddrives back.

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

Oh damn... EA sicked the FBI boys on them all.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

those morons used the network to move all the data instead of just plugging 1 Harddrive and stealing it all

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

I thought they worked at 2015 Inc.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

that was the PC team

#

that turned into IW

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

Yeah.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

and now Respawn

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:39 AM

#

IW is still around right?

#

but a shell of their former

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:39 AM

#

yeah they have the big trailer out for the new COD

#

the original guys left to form repsawn and got bought by EA and did APEX and a Star Wars game

#

my old bro is the art director at Respawn working on SW he was the God of War art director on the original versions

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:40 AM

#

EA bought Respawn?

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

yep like 2 years ago mang

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

Ah no...

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

trust me it is funny my friend ran from EA to join Sony and now he is back in EA

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

The mercy-killer company claimed them...

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

makes me cackle

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:42 AM

#

I made a vow to myself in 2012:

#

That whatever I do, I will NEVER allow Néotl Empire to be bought out by another company, regardless its financial state.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:42 AM

#

He is happy his hockey team won the cup after 80,000 years of sucking

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:42 AM

#

Especially NOT Electronic Arts!

#

Or Activision.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:43 AM

#

EA is a good place to learn I learned a lot I have no regrets about working there and I made a lot of great friends

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:43 AM

#

I would totally sell out if someone made the right offer

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:43 AM

#

EA gets around 10k apps a week they aren't starved for people wanting to work for them

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:44 AM

#

This was decades ago. EA was mediocre from what you explained. But now, I'd probably be smashing my head on a brick wall.

#

isnt sell out like the endgame?

#

Worse than I did working at FedEx Ground.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:44 AM

#

Selling out for me was the mid game

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:44 AM

#

sell out, spend money on a ticket into space, turn to kickstarter and try again

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:45 AM

#

and I am still selling out

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:45 AM

#

I refuse to sell out for Néotl.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 12:45 AM

#

I am the whore with a heart of gold

#

but only 50% now

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:45 AM

#

I will sell out on industries I care less for, like culinary and warehouse.

#

As long as offer is right.

#

I think you mean gold-digger.

main zenith Aug 7, 2019, 12:51 AM

#

EA has a lot of studios, and I'm sure each one is very different, the same with ATVI.
I always make the analogy to sports teams, everyone always labels their "team", but sometimes the personnel are what make it great or awful, and they move around a lot

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:51 AM

#

My goal is to retain minimum 51% until the day I ship. After that I dont care.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:52 AM

#

That's a very optimistic goal

#

Assuming you mean share in the project

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:53 AM

#

Plenty of pessimism on the way, need to balance it out.

#

The money isnt important to me, but need the ownership.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 12:58 AM

#

I expect more like 20-35% lol

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:00 AM

#

For developing your concepts or someone elses?

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:00 AM

#

Expected ownership/formal division share in a project/company that is based on your concepts and is ran by you

#

Basically giving up some share of the project to the potential third party (investor, publisher) + a potential business partner

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:02 AM

#

Hard to settle disputes if people want to vote on everything.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:03 AM

#

The contract between you and other parties must clearly divide areas of responsibility

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:07 AM

#

It is a difficult subject. How do you explain to a team you dont want 51% of the money, but you need 51% ownership? There are many other ways to organize a group, but I am of the school that believes the one with the entrepreneurial vision must keep majority ownership or you introduce new risks to an already high risk industry.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:08 AM

#

It's a subject on which thousands of books exist and none of them are too helpful 😄

#

I personally believe that big projects heavily depend on the specific person who will be at the public helm

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:09 AM

#

gosh i would be the worst candidate for public helm

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:10 AM

#

it is hard to have partners and keep the goals the same its like being married to someone even companys like apple broke up as they grew

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:10 AM

#

So my vision of a big project is a group of people producing potential decisions and a set of workers who will be the ones influenced by those decisions - these are in a hierarchical structure, but then there's the "CEO" or the project lead or whatever you wanna call him, who is the only person to transcend all hierarchy. CEO is the person who formulates stuff to the group of people making decisions (and maybe he's the source of some decisions too) and he is the person who has the public helm

#

So basically CEO steers the company by talking to everyone inside it, rather than strictly having the legal power to make decisions

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:11 AM

#

I would say rethink that concept and study how great products through out humanity have been created and who were the people that ran them if that is your goal

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:11 AM

#

With the project I run right now, I'm not the only person to make decisions about the company, but I'm the person who everyone decision-making asks before they commit to the decision

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:12 AM

#

most aren't nice people tyrants

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:13 AM

#

Yeah. To me the ability to influence people and present ideas to them in specific ways has proven to be more valuable than just having raw total control

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:13 AM

#

@merry tartan I did. I graduated with a 3.9 😜

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:13 AM

#

And as far as influencing people is... well, my principle is something like "be true, but still deceive"

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:14 AM

#

what?

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:14 AM

#

study business

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:14 AM

#

Lies and misleading information are unacceptable, I hold the view that it's only acceptable to influence people by presenting ideas in specific ways

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:14 AM

#

i partied too hard when i was a computer science major

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:15 AM

#

@fickle hatch you have to be yourself man, honesty and hardwork letting peopel know where they stand, transparency

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:15 AM

#

You can present an idea with real objective numbers as something very positive or something very negative, the usual politics

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:16 AM

#

all the web spining reduces progress

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:16 AM

#

agree

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:17 AM

#

I like to think of myself as a video game dev spec ops person and I got my crew and we run through shit and that is even when I manage around 40 people after that the same crew now each has a crew and I trust them to manage it

#

but i never managed an entire company with 100's of people do I am limited to know where my system would break down.

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:22 AM

#

Management is more about facilitating your teams needs than micro managing their day. A larger group may actually be easier. I think the most Ive led is a little over 20.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:22 AM

#

At my previous workplace I was made the team lead after the team crashed a UAV

#

The aircraft guys didn't realize the UAV's brains had to be configured with correct guidance parameters

#

So on the first test we did for the military the UAV nosedived and exploded near some ammo as soon as I gave it the "fly automatic" command

#

I got the report done by end of day and they put me in charge of the aircraft team

#

I didn't lie in sense that I put all the real numbers into the report, but I deceived our boss in sense of downplaying the severity of the mistake the aircraft guys made

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:24 AM

#

maiden tests of UAV next to the ammo depot, ahh those were the days

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:24 AM

#

So they did not get punished or anything and could continue to work the next day full pace, even though it cost the company a lot

#

@plucky hatch it's why I don't work in gamedev but instead in engineering - it's fun to work with things that can hurt and maul people xD

#

The company was really terrible at everything, after that case I made sure we never crashed near ammo stashes anymore, but we still almost flew into a military general and into a cow on separate occassions

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:26 AM

#

Unfortunately I havent had a fire in my like I do for this game in a long long time, or I would stay as far away from the dev side of things as I can

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:26 AM

#

In the second case my single "if" statement saved a cow from a collision with a UAV

#

😄

#

It's a great feeling you don't get from making videogames

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:27 AM

#

if cow then stop

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:27 AM

#

if maybe collide with cow then emergency flight termination

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:27 AM

#

mine cost less

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:27 AM

#

It was basically that. if (time_to_impact < 7.0) { flight_termination(); } this sorta thing

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:27 AM

#

@plucky hatch I have had dreams of working at Chic filet making chicken for the people once I get out of the home

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:28 AM

#

Sorry for delay folks. My body is not going so well this day. Particularly my head and groin. I need to lie down for the night.

#

I really enjoyed this chat as far as game industry goes. It went beyond more than I anticipated and I was very impressed by it.

merry tartan Aug 7, 2019, 1:28 AM

#

cya man good night

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:29 AM

#

Sleep well

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:29 AM

#

cya, liked your game btw

#

I was getting worried about Unreal Slackers going sour, but I am glad there are still other areas that are tolerable.

#

Which one?

#

I only saw maze qore was it?

#

Yes

#

Thanks

#

looked cool

#

I plan to resume dev but only once I can update the 2D Top Down Shooter Template and release Maze Qore Arena.

#

not really my genre but it looked cool af

#

The latter depends heavily on the former.

#

Thanks. Its honestly a new genre path I took from the norm. Shooters are my specialty but RPG is not.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:32 AM

#

What's the game? I wanna see it too

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:32 AM

#

Maze Qore is more of a procedural prison-escape RPG game with some JRPG elements.

#

https://www.indiedb.com/games/maze-qore

Indie DB

Maze Qore Windows, Mac, XONE, PS4 game

Maze Qore is a top-down, squad-based, prison-break, single-player RPG shooter using Unreal Engine. You've been sentenced to life in a maximum security prison for a crime you did not commit. Luckily, a prison riot has occurred and you finally have a chance...

#

I just googled the name of his company. Its up in the thread.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:33 AM

#

I see

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:35 AM

#

A squad of 5, including the leader.
Character and weapon perks, character stats, different outcomes in the game.
Comical and controversial references and experiences.
Old-school throwbacks.
Perma-death for squad members, even unique ones.
Survival of your squad effects the outcome of the game.

#

That's singleplayer.

#

The multiplayer is a whole new ball game.

#

A new gameplay style, reinnovating the classic FPS modes with a radical top-down spin.

#

and squad-based twist.

fickle hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:36 AM

#

God, I would love to work on another STALKER-like FPS/RPG/survival horror game

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:37 AM

#

Did I also mention... Secrets?

#

LOTS of them!

#

Alright. Good night folks.

spice dagger Aug 7, 2019, 2:01 AM

#

Guys your way offtopic...

golden jay Aug 7, 2019, 6:12 AM

#

so guys I'm thinking of not going to any Univ after my last year on this school. Should I just become a freelance 3D artist/concept artist while also working on my own game?

#

and when I get a good amount of experience, I can apply for a game studio

spice dagger Aug 7, 2019, 6:17 AM

#

Sure, alot of people are self taught.

golden jay Aug 7, 2019, 6:20 AM

#

I do have 3 years of experience in level designing already

#

I'm trying to improve my programming and concep art(ing)

#

then I think I'll be confident enough to take freelance projects

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 8:03 AM

#

So I am always going to advocate university. Keep in mind, people who go to university are pretty much self taught as well, and there is nothing to stop you from taking freelance while at school. University is that special time in a man's life where the social potential is amazing, and that paper they give you at the end is a game changer when it comes to negotiating salary.

flat gazelle Aug 7, 2019, 8:08 AM

#

If you are applying to a studio, it's less likely that you will do all the things listed. That's more an indie/hobby approach.

#

As soon as the studio is a bit bigger, you need more specializing.

#

Programmers won't do art and vice versa

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 10:53 AM

#

I was visiting a university games programme a couple of a weeks ago, and honestly it seems like the landscape has changed quite a bit

#

at least for that particular school what I saw was very production focused with people developing their respective roles

#

the quality of games the students put out was certainly much higher than just a few years ago

#

@golden jay be careful how your advertise your experience, as many won't take experience not working at a proper studio as real experience

golden jay Aug 7, 2019, 11:04 AM

#

oh

#

thanks for the heads up

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 1:28 PM

#

definitely list it as a skill or competency, substitute years for generic term describing your level of competency. interviewers only glance at resumes to look for talking points. so if you can talk about level design, make sure it appears where they can see it.

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 2:51 PM

#

Hello Everyone !! My name is MK Dash.... or " MK Legend " on EPIC games. I am here to make a request. I am currently planning to design a game in Unreal ENGINE 4. I have a great plot in my mind . But, Unfortunately, I DO NOT HAVE Any previous experience with Unreal Engine 4. I am currently still learning, but All That I have achieved is just some NOT-SO-ACCURATE Level Designing. I went through various guides an all, but could find no suitable one. I previously had experience with GTA V and have released a MODIFICATION for it, but, making a game from scratch, it seems out of bounds for me....

SO, What I am requesting, is , can anyone here help me out with UNREAL ENGINE 4 ?? Like, some step-by step guide during direct chat ? I really need some serious help, guys... cuz I wanna make my idea successful... Please... can anyone help ??

lilac walrus Aug 7, 2019, 2:52 PM

#

Firstly, a plot isn't a game

#

it's a story

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:52 PM

#

lmao

lilac walrus Aug 7, 2019, 2:52 PM

#

secondly, if you have zero experience the first place to start is with the editor, the tools, and googling for tutorials

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:52 PM

#

agreed

#

third, this isn't the channel regardless of that

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 2:53 PM

#

@lilac walrus Thats the point.... I'm quite confused with which tutorial to follow

#

Uh.... so, what channel should I contact in ?

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:53 PM

#

try... the built in tutorial in ue3?

#

#ue4-general is the default channel

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 2:53 PM

#

Unreal Engine 3 ?

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:53 PM

#

4

lilac walrus Aug 7, 2019, 2:53 PM

#

he means ue4

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 2:54 PM

#

Alright. so.... I'll try the built in tutorial.... can you link me any step-by-step guide that I should follow ?

#

Cuz 99 % of the guides ask me to Do this, do that, click this, click that.. but literally never practically explain anything

#

Any suggestions ? guys ?

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:56 PM

#

a tutorial is a step by step guide..

#

you're asking for a step by step guide to a step by step guide...

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 2:59 PM

#

No.. I mean... Isn't there supposed to be an explanation of what which thing does ? Any particular description of each function ? Like, In GTA V's RAGE Engine, Lighting color is controlled by "light_dir_col_intensity" lines in the weather.xml files..... similarly, can't a get a proper defination of thing ? like.. Whats a Volume effect, whats point like ( For example of course.... )

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:59 PM

#

that's the tutorial

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 2:59 PM

#

Any particular online or offline tutorials that u can recommend ?

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 2:59 PM

#

literally that

#

it's built in

#

it even asks you to follow it the first time you boot up the engine

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 3:01 PM

#

So.... I gotta follow that BLUE cap-like icon that pops-up during the first launch ?

tidal moth Aug 7, 2019, 3:02 PM

#

so you managed to see it, disregard it, then somehow found this discord only to ask something that you could have answered yourself if you had read the prompt?

#

do you also go around the block in order to get to the store next door?

fathom knoll Aug 7, 2019, 3:04 PM

#

Nope... Before I even opened UNREAL ENGINE, I looked up for a Video tutorial series on Youtube.... So,, That damn guy over there said that, " So, right now... this video will teach you all the basics and functionalities of the engine, so, we can skip this damn tutorial ad get started ".... thats it... then we went ahead to building landscapes....And I was thinking " WTF is going on on this planet ?"

#

So.... pls don't mind me..... I know that these things take time, and i also managed to get myself a bit educated on the engine.. but.. I thought that getting some help from the really experienced people can help....

west sonnet Aug 7, 2019, 3:11 PM

#

#ue4-general

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 3:38 PM

#

@fathom knoll you miss all the shots you dont take. dont let anyone elses experiences deter you from having your own.

plucky hatch Aug 7, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

I rely heavily on this to guide me through with Unreal Engine and any new features.

#

https://docs.unrealengine.com/en-US/index.html

Unreal Engine 4 Documentation

Complete resources for learning to use Unreal Engine 4

#

@fathom knoll Take some time and read through this documentation. It would resolve most of your concerns mastering the UE4.

woeful dirge Aug 8, 2019, 4:24 PM

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I've been looking at jobs with unreal and it seems that VR gaming jobs are less demanding on the requirements as normal gaming jobs. That's making me think about focusing more on VR. Anyone noticing that as well? Maybe it's just my area

golden jay Aug 8, 2019, 4:54 PM

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Guys should I apply for a job offer as a Lightning VFX artist?

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I have around 4-3 years of experience in level designing but never really worked for a company

hallow crow Aug 8, 2019, 4:56 PM

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Best bet is have a portfolio with demos you can show off

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Never hurts to apply - but they're going to look at what you can do, not what you say you can do

karmic kayak Aug 8, 2019, 4:57 PM

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kinda hard to tell w/o more infos tbh

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Do you have the skills they're asking for etc?

golden jay Aug 8, 2019, 4:59 PM

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I have more than enough skills for meeting their qualification

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I can say that confidently

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I need to make my portfolio/CV though

flat gazelle Aug 8, 2019, 5:11 PM

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Lighting vfx artist is not a thing

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The level design experience is irrelevant. The reel is what matters.

golden jay Aug 8, 2019, 5:12 PM

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well by that I meant lighting artist and VFX artist

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I hate phones

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also can you elaborate "reel"?

flat gazelle Aug 8, 2019, 5:13 PM

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Showreel

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Without it, they won't even look at the application

golden jay Aug 8, 2019, 5:14 PM

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ah

flat gazelle Aug 8, 2019, 5:18 PM

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You can share it here or in #visual-fx for some pointers.

golden jay Aug 8, 2019, 5:21 PM

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thanks, will do soon

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I'm gonna go to my PC back in a few hrs

tidal moth Aug 8, 2019, 7:16 PM

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it's really strange to see someone in one sentence say 3-4 years of experience and in the next not knowing what to apply for or how a portfolio works

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idk if that's just me

plucky hatch Aug 8, 2019, 7:24 PM

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@woeful dirge The VR market is a very thin slice of the pie. I dont see that changing. Games are a high risk endeavor, and with VR the potential reward pool is greatly diminished. This has a good potential to slow or even halt the growth of that market. Logically my answer is no, but if its in your heart then you would be wasting your time doing anything else.

plucky hatch Aug 8, 2019, 8:48 PM

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@tidal moth
The portfolio is a bit messed up in design.

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And it is a bit laughable at one point when they ask to see documents

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And as you get more experience and add skills to your belt. you really dont have time to build portfolios for everything

woeful dirge Aug 8, 2019, 9:07 PM

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@plucky hatch I see, thank you

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 9:07 AM

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I would expect anyone with 3-4 years of experience to know how to set up a portfolio is my point.

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I would also expect them to know what to apply for

plucky hatch Aug 9, 2019, 1:54 PM

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I can see if someone was hired with no experience, worked somewhere for 3 years, then turned to seniors in the field for advice on how to arrange their portfolio as perfectly normal.

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 1:54 PM

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you don't get hired without a good portfolio in the first place

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so that point is moot

vast nest Aug 9, 2019, 2:01 PM

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Boy are you in for a surprise

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:05 PM

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I've yet to see anyone get hired without a portfolio, and the ones I've seen have shown at least a basic standard even for juniors

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so I stand by my point

inner anchor Aug 9, 2019, 2:06 PM

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🤔 "I've never seen companies do a specific stupid thing so it doesn't happen"

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:06 PM

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feel free to show me a counter example

inner anchor Aug 9, 2019, 2:06 PM

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I don't have one, but that seems like a pretty poor thing to bet on

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:07 PM

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nah

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usually it's easy to weed out the people who can from the people who can't... again, speaking from experience

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I should say this is from a design point of a view

flat gazelle Aug 9, 2019, 2:08 PM

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I hire VFX artists. There's no way in hell I'd even call anyone for an interview without seeing previous work.

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A portfolio is OK. Reel is better.

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:09 PM

#

there you go

inner anchor Aug 9, 2019, 2:10 PM

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well, my ignorance about hiring practices for design roles aside, I do wonder how you can say "3-4 years experience" if none of them were doing anything that could help generate a portfolio

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:11 PM

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that was my initial point

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surely there has to have been a production with some work

flat gazelle Aug 9, 2019, 2:12 PM

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He did say he's never worked at a company so I'm guessing he counts hobbywork. Which may or may not lead to anything to show. Depeninding on the rate of learning

inner anchor Aug 9, 2019, 2:12 PM

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I think the equivalent would be like a college CS grad saying they have 4 years of experience in java when applying for job and expecting it to be considered the same as industry experience

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I'd expect hobbywork to be better at generating a portfolio, since you aren't bound by any NDA's for unreleased works etc though?

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:14 PM

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I'd expect just some work to be able to show

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for my first job I had a portfolio with 2 levels on it. super basic, but it showed work.

ashen lynx Aug 9, 2019, 2:24 PM

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I wanted to insert a sharp comment that I got the job without portfolio, but realized I had one too.

tidal moth Aug 9, 2019, 2:29 PM

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https://tenor.com/view/played-yourself-gif-9271168

Tenor

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...almost

plucky hatch Aug 9, 2019, 2:35 PM

#

the point i was trying to make is that people have to start somewhere, this is a good place to figure out how to start. so if you have some insight to help someone, this is a good place to help them, if not try reddit.

flat gazelle Aug 9, 2019, 6:10 PM

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<@&213101288538374145>

finite mulch Aug 9, 2019, 6:11 PM

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Shit too slow

north narwhal Aug 9, 2019, 6:12 PM

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discord why aren't you purging messages 🤷🏽

granite brook Aug 9, 2019, 6:12 PM

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Idk, shouldn't the ban purge?

north narwhal Aug 9, 2019, 6:12 PM

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yeah

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i blame discord

flat gazelle Aug 9, 2019, 6:12 PM

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Offtopic guys! 😉

plucky hatch Aug 9, 2019, 10:42 PM

#

"the point i was trying to make is that people have to start somewhere"
Sure, as long as it's not QA

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Portfolio and networking first.
Find jobs that pay well and allow you to have more time to build your portfolio
And meet people

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Find the hottest online communities for game devs

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Where you'll find industry professionals

tacit siren Aug 10, 2019, 12:50 AM

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so your idea is to start with no portfolio at a well payed job that leaves you time for hobby projects? 🤔

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 1:09 AM

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The point is what get you a job is your portfolio and your contacts.
If you find a low paying job, chances are you'll need to do overtime = no time for portfolio

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So you want a high paying job that also give you more time to work on your personal stuff

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With money you can get hardware, tutorials, etc.
Whatever you need

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"How do I get a job in the video games industry''
There is no correct answer.

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I've seen recruiters turn into level designers
QA tester become level designers or artists
modders that became programmers
etc

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My answer is, look, it's like rolling a dice.
Yes. It's fucking random.
But you know that in order to get the job you need to keep rolling the dice.

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So just keep doing it until it happens.

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I keep reading in here ''portfolio, portfolio!''
I've seen many people that got jobs and had a really bad portfolio.

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But they had many other qualities.

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Charisma, fast workers, likeable, good rep, etc

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I went to college with a guy who is now a 3D artist.
He still doesnt know sub-modeling

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It's been 5 years

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 6:04 AM

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I don't know any studio that would willingly take risks/potentially shoot themselves in the foot by hiring someone with no portfolio

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my take is that studios who do that don't last long

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it's a base requirement of almost any role because it's one of the few ways you can prove that you can actually do the job you're applying for, in an industry where a large part of the workforce still relies heavily on tacit knowledge

#

likewise given that this is the career chat, I would never advise anyone to apply anywhere without first building a portfolio

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for people that come in through QA you still have them do tests for their particular discipline of choice, it's not a "free" transition

#

in regards to soft skills and team ability, that is something you can hopefully filter for in the interview after your portfolio has been picked out

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to put it concisely:

#

bring a portfolio

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be real about your experience

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and in general, be real with people, or they will find you out anyway

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don't be a dick

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and don't rely on luck

#

#looking-for-talent

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no

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<@&213101288538374145>

north narwhal Aug 10, 2019, 6:23 AM

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uh

#

what

#

#looking-for-talent

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gonna just ban him for spamming

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and vauge homophobia i think?

#

i honestly have no idea what just happened there

tawny kayak Aug 10, 2019, 6:25 AM

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Guessing I missed something bizarre.

weak bough Aug 10, 2019, 6:26 AM

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yep

north narwhal Aug 10, 2019, 6:26 AM

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very

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 6:26 AM

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florida man is the only thing that comes to mind

north narwhal Aug 10, 2019, 6:27 AM

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lets just say that if you kept up with what he was saying, you most definitely should not have been working for him

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 6:02 PM

#

As level designers, how do you guys approach your portfolio?
If there are NDAs that prevent you from showing anything dev-related.
Can't show scripting, can't show level design docs, can't show the level in the editor and how you placed everything, etc
So all you can really show is actually the finished product.

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Do you recreate it afterwards to explain the ins and out of everything?

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Do you just post pictures and say what you did?

#

--
Or do you just show personal projects instead?

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 7:14 PM

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show as much as you can, don't show what you can't show

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if you post a few screenshots from a released game most studios are going to be ok with it

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beyond that everything else can be answered in the interview

#

unless it's a personal project and you're a junior I wouldn't bother putting too much design knowledge into your portfolio

#

you want your work to speak for you most of the time

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for junior it's a bit different seeing as they have to prove some basic design thinking beyond just levels

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 7:32 PM

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Wouldn't you agree, that unless the designer shows us a video walkthrough of what was put where and why, there is no way recruiters and designers can just look at a few pretty pictures and go...
Oh yeah, this candidate is great, great thinking, great design skills.

#

Unless they actually played the game and remember the level specifically.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 7:33 PM

#

there is a time and a place for everything

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unless you're completely green then I'd say there is no reason

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most of this will be rehashed through the interview

#

or you will be given a design test if they're not sure etc.

#

sometimes both

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 7:34 PM

#

What if you fall on a recruiter who just expects to see nice design docs?

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 7:34 PM

#

no recruiter is looking for docs

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nobody wants to read

#

and recruiters spend most of their day on looking at stuff

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you're not going to come across as unique for having a bunch of documents in your portfolio

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 7:35 PM

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If no recruiter was looking for docs, I wouldn't have mentioned it.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 7:35 PM

#

if they're published articles, then maybe, but even so they'll glance over it and chalk it up as a plus

#

from the companies I have been in touch with, nobody has been interested in documentation. people want walkthrough videos perhaps, but even so you could add those with zero commentary and it would still be valid

#

the recruiters are just gate keepers, and they don't generally care what you add

#

if they forward your stuff though, then the designers might give you more scrutiny

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 7:38 PM

#

https://espresso-jobs.com/conseils-carriere/comment-decocher-un-job-chez-ubisoft-quand-on-est-junior/

And how is it necessary to present all these projects to attract the attention of a recruiter like you?
This is a very very important point: you absolutely need a section of the portfolio dedicated to the documentation of the design of the game. It is an essential document so that I can understand the logic of the designer, how he articulated his role in the game , and that I can see all the visual showing the evolution of his work and his reflection. In addition, it allows to see how the candidate is in communication, because it involves a lot of writing.

Are there people who apply without adding this documentation to their portfolio?
Yes, far too many young designers neglect this essential document ... I have no idea why! They really shoot in the foot ... Because it's part of the job of a game designer and a level designer. Often, postulants send me a short video that introduces the game ... it's fine, but there may be 20 people who worked on it! I want to know what the designer has done, and without the detailed document, it's impossible.

Without this documentation, is the application automatically rejected?
I would say most of the time, yes, unfortunately.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 7:38 PM

#

but again, by that time if you're interesting enough they'll ask for an interview

#

like I said, if you're a junior applying, then yes

#

add some

#

but if you've been around in the industry, you're showing released products

#

the work is the hero, not your documentation

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 7:39 PM

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I'd say it's always different depending on who is involved with the recruiting process.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 7:39 PM

#

you make it sound like the recruitment processes for every company is miles apart

#

it's the same recruitment process

#

and I've worked for Ubisoft

#

I can tell you I got an interview without documentation on my portfolio at the time

#

most of the time you'll be given a test, and in that test you can then implement your theory well and talk about it

#

but up until that point, there's no reason to hardline tons of documentation in your portfolio

#

especially when the whole point is for recruiters to skim it and look out for things that are interesting

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 8:45 PM

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I don't know man. I've done interviews for Gameloft, Eidos, Ubisoft, Warner Bros, CM Labs, EA, etc.
And what they were looking for, their requirements, their needs, etc. Were all different.

#

The recruiter and the other person behind (lead, director, etc.) have different needs. Sometimes they are trying to find a skilled person, sometimes they are more into someone who fits their team profile, etc.

#

Just like some people would only hire someone from university and others believe more in the portfolio or past work experiences, mods ,etc

#

Different mentalities

#

It often mirrors their own backgrounds... just saying

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 8:53 PM

#

by the time you get to an interview your portfolio takes a seat and it's on you to start explaining the things you went through

#

so it's a moot point

#

pretty much every studio I've interviewed for has had the same process

#

your portfolio gets picked out, you have either a quick interview first then do a test, or just the test alone, then you have a bigger interview after the test

#

as far as I am concerned, the test is all that matters

#

so the portfolio is just a means to get to that point

#

I don't buy that people are looking for different things in a role like level design, everyone is practically on the same page

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 9:13 PM

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See... I got my first job after I finished making a map for a 3DBuzz level design contest. Didn't have to do a test. At another studio (AAA), a test was given to me, stuff happened, but had a second interview. Never had to give back the test.

#

Portfolio, networking.

#

If someone would give me a test now, I wouldn't be amused.

#

Oh, I also passed an interview for a database company to work as full stack programmer, didn't have to do a test either.

mystic hull Aug 10, 2019, 9:31 PM

#

Worth mentioning that what works for one individual doesn't necessarily have to work for another 🤷

#

No rules in this game really

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 9:35 PM

#

I don't know what the standard is for programmers, but we weren't talking about programmers

#

and @mystic hull I beg to differ... as long as company hiring practices are the same or similar, then we can assert that the process you go through is the same. I don't buy this "everyone is different" mentality. There might be some details that differ per company/studio/project, but overall level design is a transferrable skill between projects

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 9:56 PM

#

I agree that level design is a transferable skill.
But game design and level design are quite obscure fields.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:04 PM

#

yeah but nobody is going to ask things of a level designer that isn't transferrable. even with stuff like VR there might be a different context for level design than for non-VR games, but level design skills will still apply regardless

#

as far as I know when people say "there isn't a good fit" it's code for something else

#

but that's just hearsay on my part

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:15 PM

#

When Gameloft transitionned from Mobile to IOS (in other words 3D games), we had a change in the realm of level design.
First of all, level designer and technical game designer positions didn't even exist. We created them. Within our design department, many people were either more technical and some more designers and had to interchangeably do both jobs. And level design was, for some people, learned on the job.

#

And level designers that have ''no idea what they are doing'', I find, was very common.
Not pointing fingers saying it's bad. Im just saying games are so vast and complex, you cannot be experienced with every single genre.
if you work at id Software and just make FPS games, that's very specific.
But if you work on a big companies that make absolutely anything....

#

A bit different

#

Ive seen people that had no experience whatsoever with a specific genre and lead that kind of project

#

Games like Thief, who even played those older games? No wonder why it took several years to get started and find the right people for the job

#

You make a game like deus ex and all of a sudden your players break all your maps by staying in vents shooting legs

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:23 PM

#

I don't disagree that context matters, but design is universal, and the details of implementation of something like a match 3 level versus a first person level still have elements in common that should be known by a designer making either of them

#

I think the level designers having no idea what they're doing is mostly how they are taught

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:24 PM

#

I don't disagree.
All Im saying is you talk is if every designer in the industry had the same education and were design gods and that is so far... far far... from the reality of this industry.

#

My level design lead couldnt make a multiplayer map. He was more technical.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:24 PM

#

I've found that Ubisoft teaches only what is immediately relevant, I can't imagine Gameloft being that different given it was owned by the brother of the Ubisoft CEO

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:25 PM

#

Was

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:25 PM

#

highly doubt anything changed on the level of management of designers

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:25 PM

#

And no, it was a free for all.

#

And I had to push for it.

#

Just to get us on same level as other AAA studios

#

And to get the proper salary

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:28 PM

#

as far as I know Gameloft is making mobile games?

#

not heard of a AAA type game from them

#

anyway getting off topic either how

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:31 PM

#

What I said is they didn't follow the standards.

#

3D games require level designers and they didn't have such job role

#

Because mobile didn't have that

#

And integrators were going to fill that gap, but werent paid for those skills

#

And i had a level designer education

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:33 PM

#

sounds like a special case to be honest

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:33 PM

#

Big budget mobile games

#

Something other studios cant do.

#

A game like Gangstar Vegas or else is huge.

#

It's no different from GTA 3

#

or San Andreas

#

And now graphics are so good..

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:36 PM

#

AAA is dependent on budget, I doubt the budgets are that high for mobile

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:37 PM

#

https://www.giantbomb.com/gangstar-vegas/3030-47173/credits/

Giant Bomb

Gangstar Vegas Credits - Giant Bomb

The fourth installment of Gangstar series, this time in Las Vegas.

#

Yeah. They are THAT high.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:39 PM

#

seems like the typical ubisoft approach where studios are involved sporadically, but still get full credit

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:39 PM

#

We had a 50+ people team

#

for a ''mobile'' game

#

It's no different from any console game...

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:40 PM

#

anyway it's a digression

#

in terms of your case with Gameloft not knowing LDs in that particular scenario is not something I've seen before, and I think it's a special case

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:41 PM

#

That's called an industry transition.

#

Means, Im old.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:41 PM

#

but even if it wasn't, let's assume that if you're applying for a level design position, you are looking for a position that says level designer

#

not game designer

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:42 PM

#

😂

#

Wrong

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:42 PM

#

I said let's assume

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:42 PM

#

yeah, I read.

#

Every studio is different.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:42 PM

#

🙄

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:42 PM

#

In the case of gameloft, level designers were very involved with game design, notably in pre-production.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:43 PM

#

I'll withdraw, this is going nowhere

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:43 PM

#

You want to talk about careers in games, then you should be very aware of what that means

#

You seem to come from big AAA studios and think it's all the same everywhere. It's really not.

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 10:44 PM

#

I've worked in indie as well

#

across the board, I've seen very similar trends

#

I think Gameloft is more an exception

#

than it is a rule

#

hence my previous statements

#

and now, like I said, I'll withdraw

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 10:45 PM

#

👌

flat gazelle Aug 10, 2019, 11:04 PM

#

XD a valiant effort Cranz

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 11:07 PM

#

💞

#

@tidal moth
Is your portfolio still available online?

tidal moth Aug 10, 2019, 11:19 PM

#

not currently

#

had some issues with my provider that I don't have time to resolve, so the site remains offline

plucky hatch Aug 10, 2019, 11:32 PM

#

😟 good luck with that

lilac walrus Aug 11, 2019, 10:47 AM

#

50 people is small in the console space. The AAAs probably have ten times that number involved these days. 50 isn't unusual in the AA space.

flat gazelle Aug 11, 2019, 11:07 AM

#

50 people is a pre prod team these days 😛

vague jackal Aug 11, 2019, 3:16 PM

#

Hey guys need an advice, will i be any useful if i only learn Blueprints(Of all kinds)? Because i have a different case here I can code yes and that is what i do in my studies but when it comes to UE4 well my PC can't really handle the 3 min Hot reloads and the compilation turns my PC into a snail, (I also don't build lighting if possible I use full dynamic lighting).

#

I do have plans to use Cpp in Game engines, I am thinking about downloading Amazon Lumberyard for that but I think I feel relaxed with Visual Scripting if it is possible that I can get a job only with Visual Scripting?

mystic hull Aug 11, 2019, 3:29 PM

#

It is possible but it really hurts your chances & lowers your salary ceiling

plucky hatch Aug 11, 2019, 5:45 PM

#

Yeah haha. 50 people is considered a small team these days, indeed.

#

But that also brings me to another point, we also lost our ability to make fun games really fast

#

How many years did it take Id Software to produce Quake 1, 2 and 3.
Quake 1 was released in 1996. Quake 3 in December 2, 1999.
Quake Champions has been in development since 2013, it is only multiplayer and it is still in Early Access today, not yet completed or officially released.

#

We are spending a lot of time on graphics and building that high tech game engine.

lilac walrus Aug 11, 2019, 8:59 PM

#

Quake began development in 1991. Doom 3 was first demoed in 2002. With the exception of Quake 2 which may have been short, most of those games had unusually long development cycles for the era, partly owing to the tiny size of the team, and also to just how forward-thinking Carmack was with regards to tech

#

Game development periods overlap, it's not entirely consecutive

tidal moth Aug 11, 2019, 9:11 PM

#

I don't think people are entirely aware of how much we owe Carmack for being the catalyst for where games are today

lilac walrus Aug 11, 2019, 9:16 PM

#

Aye, when it came to games tech he really pushed boundaries for over a decade

plucky hatch Aug 11, 2019, 10:04 PM

#

All I want to do is experiment with art and game Dev but I need money so I work a shitty warehouse job that depresses me plus I want more sex and social life help

slim stirrup Aug 11, 2019, 10:15 PM

#

laugh at your warehouse job, they are paying you to make games

#

go play sports, join hobbies, whatever for the rest

#

and listen to epic music while practicing your craft

regal swallow Aug 11, 2019, 10:37 PM

#

Many in your position (jobs-wise at least) @plucky hatch - Use your job as a means to pay bills, and be sure to focus on your time off. Schedule what you want to do, when not at work. Start working on a project, with a plan. Try and find local groups, with similar interests (a creatives group), who you can either chat with online, or maybe they even meet up regularly. Surround yourself with people of similar interests, and you'll learn and grow.

plucky hatch Aug 11, 2019, 11:40 PM

#

wish i could work part time

regal swallow Aug 11, 2019, 11:48 PM

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If you can, maybe try saving some of your wages, so that part time "might" be a possibility further down the line? If you feel that you're suffering from depression or low mood then please make sure you speak to someone and seek help. If it's more of a boredom type of situation at work, then are there opportunities to maybe do anything else, within the same company? Any secondment opportunities? Speak to your manager/boss and let them know that you'd like to be involved in a certain area.

plucky hatch Aug 12, 2019, 1:35 PM

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@plucky hatch get some type of contractor licsense, like plumber or painter. You can make enough working one week out of the month if you work for yourself.

plucky hatch Aug 12, 2019, 4:42 PM

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Lol 6 month waiting list for psychiatrist for 4 half hour sessions XD not worth

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Yeah I can upgrade from picker upper to pusher man

mystic hull Aug 12, 2019, 5:27 PM

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Nobody has any magic pill that'll immediately change your life & pessimism only pushes you backwards 🤷

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All you gotta do is try and try until it happens, really

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Easier said than done, though.

slim stirrup Aug 12, 2019, 9:06 PM

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It is doable though, just geg focused and push harder

leaden fulcrum Aug 13, 2019, 1:55 PM

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Dunno if this question is placed right in here. But I'm going next year to college for game programming after 2 years of self employment and they require a laptop. Anybody can reccomend something along those lines ?

Thanks to you all in advance.

lilac walrus Aug 13, 2019, 1:56 PM

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fast multi-core processor, 16GB+ fast memory, and probably a minimum of a 1050ti for graphics