manga-theories

[pure raven]

think you mean fiction lad

[idle dew]

even if it's fiction, the fact oda mentioned it in the first place means there's gonna be a reason for it

[late token]

It’s fiction. Kureha is like 160 years old

[ashen surge]

”Weird body” == labrat fitted with three people to use multiple DFs == Cerberus

[atomic portal]

mixed up

[idle dew]

Buggy said that? When

[pure raven]

People from the cold north do not sleep so they do not freeze to death was the explanation I believe

[late token]

The labrat part is convincing. Just not the Cerberus part ^^

[ashen surge]

What is the issue

Three dudes fitted into one is enough to call someone ”cerberus”

[keen kelp]

have you guys seen the theory that Koby may get the Hito Hito no Mi model Earth God or whatever

[late token]

Okay then I’m down for it. I thought u think he has a Cerberus devil fruit or smth like that

[pure raven]

in the oden flashback

[atomic portal]

how?

[keen kelp]

i read "his name translates to turtle and he's from shells town." and the earth god diety was a turtle

[ripe geyser]

Marco did say Blackbeard does not have the body of a regular human back in MF

[ashen surge]

This is based on absolutely nothing. Youtubers trying to reach their weekly quota

[idle dew]

Oh I understood wrong I thought you meant Buggy doesn't sleep 💀

[keen kelp]

there are 4 gods. earth, forest, sun, and rain

[pure raven]

LMAOOOOOOOOOOOO

[keen kelp]

oooo i see. henestly that makes sense. what about dragon having the rain god?

[ashen surge]

Again: youtuber crap

[radiant light]

Who said it?

[pure raven]

i think dragons ting is an ancient weapon

[pure raven]

And only the Avatar can become the god of all elements

[atomic portal]

still not convinsing

[ashen surge]

And Nika is Captain Planet

[pine nimbus]

Lets guess kaido's origin story

[radiant light]

I hope chopper is relevant to story with his hito hito 🤪🤪🤪

[keen kelp]

i dunno if he will be honestly

[pine nimbus]

He is from a different race an oni race right there are probably a few oni left in the world

[pure raven]

In Kings flachback Kaido had a smiling and bright face, looked very motivated but became very depressive with the time, I wonder why

[inland talon]

what if chopper makes a rumble ball for luffy?

[pine nimbus]

Perhaps oni race was extremely War driven race

[radiant light]

Omg luffy Goku gomu noooo rumbleeeeeeee monster pOintoooo

[atomic portal]

no

[radiant light]

Marco will spoiler to us the powers of bb crew very soon

[ripe geyser]

What if the rumble ball allowed for a longer lasting gomu gomu no giant

[inland talon]

i think chopper can do that but i don't think he will

[plain echo]

that would be interesting to see, though we don't know if the rumble balls work with other zoans

[pine nimbus]

Perhaps kaido's origin country was rival to the wano kingdom thruough history

[inland talon]

luffy's fruit is hito hito fruit like chopper

[atomic portal]

there is no need the hito doesnt require a rumble ball in order to transform

[late token]

Keep in mind that other than the gorosei no one actually know that luffy is a zoan yet

[radiant light]

I think vegapunk will tell us wat is the white form luffy had

[inland talon]

luffy should find out eventually

[late token]

Yeah but I don’t think it will be anytime soon ^^ propably in like 200 chapters ^^

[pine nimbus]

Rumble ball is required for special transformation especialy to increase efficiency of certain Perks they are not required for zoan transformation

[pure raven]

The problem about Luffy is he doesnt give af

[atomic portal]

i think there will be a big plot twist in one piece where zoro betrays luffy "opinion"

[ashen surge]

Why do you think Zoro would betray Luffy

[pine nimbus]

Luffy's white form is literally non colored manga character. Nika is a comic character more likely a manga character since manga is the japanese comic

[neon vessel]

is joyboy even real?

[late token]

Nah luffy isn’t black so racist zoro won’t betray him

[atomic portal]

because you cant make an anime without a betrayal and the show is still going so why not and havent you asked yourself why zoro is so loyal to luffy

[pure raven]

Kanjuro is enough

[atomic portal]

nah but he a nika

[atomic portal]

man fuck him i never liked him

[ashen surge]

Because Luffy saved Zoros life and provides him the possibility to achieve his personal goals

[pure raven]

And Blackbeard

[ashen surge]

Nami already "betrayed" Straw Hats once

[atomic portal]

but thats not enough

[ashen surge]

Ok, make the argument except something else than "why not".

!theories

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[atomic portal]

and it can happen to zoro so why not its just a theory and i would be happy to see it

[late token]

Luffy is now a nika. That’s enough reason for racist zoro

[pine nimbus]

Does Zoro knows his own race?

[atomic portal]

not yet

[pine nimbus]

He cannot be racist LoL the guy doesn't even know his own race

[ripe geyser]

Do you guys think Oda will explain the rumor of Luffy being a giant

[atomic portal]

he is probably a shimotsuki

[atomic portal]

its toon force

[vagrant lark]

luffy's bounty might have been foreshadowed in alabasta

[ripe geyser]

An ordinary guy in the colosseum audience randomly yelled that he thought the real straw hat Luffy was a giant (obviously this foreshadows the idea of Luffy eventually being able to turn giant)

[pine nimbus]

He probably wanted to tease fan base since g3 fan base was all about giant form

[pure raven]

What y'all think about Luffys fighting style to look more similar to Katakuris after he has more control over his DF

[vagrant lark]

filler too lol

[ripe geyser]

It’s not filler

[vagrant lark]

no i meant, in a filler luffy turned giant

[ripe geyser]

Well in canon a guy thought the real Luffy was a giant

[vagrant lark]

ye

[ripe geyser]

It’s obvious Oda’s purpose with this was to tease future gigantification with Luffy

[vagrant lark]

"150 billion", the agents that worked for crocodile

[pine nimbus]

His fighting style more likely Snoopy dancing lol

[atomic portal]

oda>>>>>>>>>> any mangaka

[pine nimbus]

He tries to dance like Snoopy but kaido doesn't let him

[ripe geyser]

What if Luffy doesn’t get a numerical bounty after Wano

[idle dew]

He will

[ripe geyser]

What if his bounty poster says “most wanted” and “only dead”

[twin widget]

I doubt zoro will ever betray luffy, from what he’s shown hes the most loyal and the one who understands luffy the most

[idle dew]

That's something someone like roger would have, but he didn't so

There's also dragon

[atomic portal]

what if the camera man was pandaman

[ripe geyser]

Dragon’s bounty could be most wanted

[ashen surge]

!theories

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[idle dew]

If zoro betrays Luffy his character is fucking butchered, why would he take all of his pain and claim nothing happened too?

[ripe geyser]

^^^

[ashen surge]

Zero effort after the US people get out of school

[ripe geyser]

Zoro betraying Luffy would rip apart his character

[pure raven]

Gotta give it to the Marines that they are not blaming Garp much about his damned seed

[atomic portal]

when are the next spoilers

[ripe geyser]

Garp helped stop the most powerful pirate crew and became the hero of the marines, the marines can’t afford to give him disrespect

[pine nimbus]

in the crew only person who would betray luffy is jinbei if he could have a reason.

[idle dew]

One Piece summarized

"Garp it's your damn family again"

[sharp anvil]

One name: Akainu

[ripe geyser]

Do you guys think we will learn about Zunesha’s crime in Wano

[idle dew]

Why would he go on in post marineford about how it's important to remember who's still with him, and why would he stand up against s fucking YONKO to say "I want to be part of the pirate kings crew"

Doesn't make sense dude

[ashen surge]

Yes but how is this related to this channel?

[sharp anvil]

It's an engaging question?

[pine nimbus]

What if they take entire kingdom as hostage?

[ripe geyser]

What do you think Zunesha’s crime is? And who was Zunesha punished by?

[idle dew]

Wdym

[ashen surge]

I don't enjoy speculating stuff we have zero information about

[queen ether]

Stepping on islands

[sharp anvil]

The fuck is this then

[ashen surge]

What? That is literally what happens in the first volume

[pine nimbus]

Robin have nobody left she wouldn't betray luffy. Zeff was taken as hostage before but it didn't work so sanji wouldn't betray either

[smoky fulcrum]

The only person we really don’t have a proper back story for is Zoro, but no one sees him betraying the strawhats

[ripe geyser]

Zoro betraying Luffy is a 0%

[pine nimbus]

Brook doesn't have anybody either but he was a soldier before becoming a pirate might have relation with marines but damn 50 years passed

[atomic portal]

at the end i think on of the crew will betray luffy

[sharp anvil]

And the latter of possibility?

[queen ether]

People think there will be another backstory for zoro to flesh out more on his character. But what else is there left for him?

[ashen surge]

I don't understand what you are asking, can you write an actual sentence?

[sharp anvil]

No. Maybe you'll learn context.

[smoky fulcrum]

Maybe how he arrived on that island, but that’s kind of irrelevant

[pine nimbus]

Entire fishman island can be taken as hostage by celestials and jinbei would betray luffy than

[pure raven]

By assuming that Zoro will betray Luffy we would ignore all defining things about his character: he is the right wing of the future pirate king, he is ready to throw his pride away to get stronger for Luffy, he is ready to die to save Luffy

[ripe geyser]

Zoro feels fine enough to me but with the whole thing of a reaper appearing, Kawamatsu pointing out Zoro’s connection to Ryuma’s, people think there’s gonna be more to Zoro

In terms of origin

[pine nimbus]

We didn't see much more about Zoro only when he decided to became strongest swordsman

[smoky fulcrum]

I really wanna see what’s up with Zoro tho, ppl saying he fighting the reaper but I don’t see that, and he’s not dying for shit either

[ripe geyser]

Zoro isn’t dying

[smoky fulcrum]

Ye he bound to be the greatest swordsman, he not dying for shit

[pure raven]

Bro as I am a German, this aint funny what you are doing

[atomic portal]

what?

[queen ether]

The reaper thing I believe is just a side effect from the mink medicine. But who knows if it’s a connection to ryuma

[pine nimbus]

He would choose a character to sacrifice and who would be that character

[smoky fulcrum]

Probably usoop since his goals aren’t as crazy as others

[weak arrow]

This channel is for more series talking, not minor chit chat. If you want to chit chat, please use #manga or #also-manga

[atomic portal]

ussop he is useless

[lunar shell]

No sense. People dying dont see the reaper before they die. They would all scream " omg a Reaper " and that would become a legend in two days.

It has to do with the cursed sword : Enma.

[ripe geyser]

Are you guys all sure Zoro will really fight Mihawk as his final challenge for becoming the greatest swordsman?

[atomic portal]

no

[ripe geyser]

Yeah I don’t think it’s certain either

[sleek lily]

probably WG

[lunar shell]

Yes I guarantee it.

[atomic portal]

what will come after wano and who is the enmy

[queen ether]

Yea I see that

[ashen surge]

Enma is not cursed and none of the other swords are cursed either

[ripe geyser]

Having the goal of defeating Mihawk from the start and then getting strong enough to fight him and beat him just feels too convenient

[lunar shell]

Those that dont understand Zoro vs Mihawk is 100% happening, and that Shanks can be evil, just dont grasp the root essence of a story construction. Sorry for being annoying here.

[pine nimbus]

Maybe his dream is also the lamest LoL he wants to be brave warrior of the seas but there is no end goal there right

[ashen surge]

#manga-theories message

[pure raven]

I like the theory about Zoros fight against Shiryu where he will need to learn to cut 'nothing'

[ripe geyser]

You’ve got a bounty on your head now buddy. Either you gain glory or loss, nothing in between

[smoky fulcrum]

Maybe after Zoro beats Mihawk, in the later arcs, maybe Zoro and Mihawk tag team some WG enemy

[ashen surge]

Or Shiryu offs Mihawk and Zoro has to face him

[ripe geyser]

Or what if someone else kills Mihawk

[lunar shell]

I'm ready to bet my life on this.

[ripe geyser]

Not gonna disrespect that✅

[atomic portal]

dies of old age

[lunar shell]

Freedom is not something you can " give " everyone. Freedom is attained.

[smoky fulcrum]

Imagine this scene, Zoro about to beat Mihawk, Mihawk turns around and says, “scars on the back are a shame” and then he says “I learned that from you, Roronoa” and Zoro smiles, prolly not gon happen

[ripe geyser]

I just think Mihawk dying would give Zoro very interesting self-conflict

[pine nimbus]

Zoro being strongest swordman will mean that he will be all alone. That is why mihawk is alone all the time because that tittle is cursed by loneliness.

it is some sort of samurai japanese think

[late token]

People who think shanks is evil also supported the resin theory

[ashen surge]

I was replying to your Shanks is evil thing

[ripe geyser]

Shanks being evil doesn’t sound likely

[ashen surge]

You don't have to be "evil" to have a conflict between two ideas

[lunar shell]

I supported the resin theory, I believe it to be one of the best theory I'v read.
I dont believe for 1 second that Shanks can be evil.

[pure raven]

Why would Shanks give up his arm to kill Luffy later

[ripe geyser]

oh boy now I’m really not sure of your validity

[night glade]

toki was most likely the one that treated the Nine Red Scabbards wounds, she doesn’t even have a official death

[lunar shell]

Alright to precise my line of thought I will ask u guys something. Do you know the story of the rabbit and the turtle ?

[late token]

Resin theory even worse than the theory that OP lies beneath enies lobby

[smoky fulcrum]

Y would the WG change the resins resin no mi to the gomu gomu no mi💀💀💀

WG: “resins to dangerous, change it to the gomu gomu no mi”🤣🤣🤣

[pure raven]

Hiyori

[lunar shell]

Just so you know, I still believe resin can be a thing.

[sharp anvil]

First thing I can think is he is a necessary ingredient to his endgame plans.

[ripe geyser]

I never ever believed the resin theory because it never gave an explanation as to why the name resin would be void century-relevant information worth hiding

[pine nimbus]

Shanks is a pirate and have ulterior motives but doesn't mean evil or Good. But I don't think shanks would betray the luffy at all.

[night glade]

he already met hiyori before the wounds, why would it be a dream

[late token]

Don’t troll in this Channel Bro. That’s some premium bait

[ashen surge]

He doesn't want to kill Luffy, he hopes Luffy will take his side at the almost top of the world or pass the torch to him as the guardian of the last poneglyph and effectively Laugh Tale

[lunar shell]

Let's drop it if you want. But I'm not a liar.

[ripe geyser]

Gotta be bait

[smoky fulcrum]

Imagine it from the WG perspective

[lunar shell]

So do any of you guys know the story of rabbit and turtle ?

[ripe geyser]

Yup

[lunar shell]

DO you think its possible the rabbit let the turtle win in purpose ?

[ripe geyser]

Hare was way faster but not as hard of a worker so the tortoise win

It’s a tale that gives the message that hard work can always pay off

[smoky fulcrum]

Btw quick question, yk how luffys df is limited by imagination, what’s the meaning behind that?

[weak arrow]

So I can vibe with part 1, but you really lost me on part 2. He cannot be a target for everyone in the world if only he knows that Roger told him where this poneglyph was or if he has possession of the poneglyph. He is not a target by anyone. If anything, becoming a yonko and making this deal makes him more of a target. By making a deal with the gorosei, there is both an inherent contradiction with the fact that it automatically gets rid of his freedom but also puts a target on his back that didn't previously exist (Other than being a Roger pirate, but not like anyone's targeting Buggy anyway).

[pine nimbus]

Why this resin theory never ends? LoL doesn't make sense Just think about it what would be so different than mochi mochi no mi

[atomic portal]

whats the arc after wano and who is the main antagonist

[ripe geyser]

Use your imagination and maybe you’ll be able to make sense out of it ; )

[lunar shell]

Do you think the hare could have actually let the turtle win or not ?

[smoky fulcrum]

Cuz it can’t be wtvr he imagination can happen

[ripe geyser]

Nah the hare didn’t let him win

[ashen surge]

I was talking about the personal burden in his head being the person only one knowing. He's not de facto target to everyone except in his head.

[lunar shell]

why not

[smoky fulcrum]

Lemme hear the sense u made out of it with ur imagination

[ripe geyser]

It’s a children’s tale, the hare letting the tortoise win would ruin the theme of hard work paying off more than talent

[weak arrow]

So instead of being a target in his head. He makes himself a target for real? How does that make any sense.

[pure raven]

I think it has something to do about what Luffy is doing all the time: he is imagining a bazooka and makes an attack called gum gum bazooka or other examples like gum gum thor axe and gum gum python as he gets inspired by his surrounding

[lunar shell]

Good.

It-is-the-same-for-Shanks.

It is also the same for Mihawk vs Zoro.

[late token]

Thanks for making sense bro appreciate it

[modest skiff]

Please don’t take people down holes like this. Either explain your theory or don’t

[ashen surge]

Because aiming for status you can use to leverage yourself that personal freedom and getting to the top is better than living a quiet life under WG opperssion?

[smoky fulcrum]

There’s a whole irrelevant ass argument about turtle vs rabbit💀

[atomic portal]

agree

[lunar shell]

Those are the core of the story, the meaning of the journey. A promise between the writter and the reader. Something the fan is waiting for years. Ya can't remove it. Its on the same line as : Will Luffy be pirate king.

Its a Shonen dont go crazy and understand what Oda is saying.

[modest skiff]

“It’s shonen” is not a theory or an argument

[lunar shell]

I am. By using this other story I can explain my line of thought. I dont see the issue here.

[ripe geyser]

Luffy’s awakening makes his rubber significantly more malleable. He can mold himself into way more shapes so he’s free to come up with way more techniques. His ability spreads onto other creatures and objects which gives him endless more ideas for attacks and techniques. Luffy’s imagination also seems to project onto other people, explaining the eye pop that other people get besides him. Gear 4 was able to fly and so I’m assuming Luffy had more freedom with aerial travel in Gear 5 and so figured he’d just run in midair, and well what do you know he was able to run in midair

[modest skiff]

You can introduce a folk tale as a premise and then explain from there. You don’t need to make people check in and acknowledge you each step of the way. People generally try to complete their thought all at once rather than this prolonged adventure through your explanation

[pure raven]

After his awakening he gains more control over it and can imitate those inspiring things better with his body, tranforming like knead maybe

[lunar shell]

It is. A shonen is about a young dude that become an adult, Luffy and Zoro goals are Shanks and Mihawk, they are adult model. You can't remove the closure.

[modest skiff]

Keturin’s recent post is a good example of the better way to do this

[weak arrow]

But he's not gaining any personal freedom. He's just losing it now. Living as a regular pirate still allows him more freedom than making a deal with the Gorosei. Being a secret shichibukai still loses you freedoms and all this does is set more targets on Shanks' back. By being a yonko, it means hundreds of pirates are going to be out for you. The Marines do not even go after Yonko anyway (Until SSG created their new weapon), but this supposed deal would have been made much before that.

[smoky fulcrum]

Thanks fam, appreciate it👏🏼

[ripe geyser]

Mans prolonging his explanation more than Oda prolonged a fire spirit approaching bombs

[ashen surge]

@weak arrow but yeah imo the reasoning of Shanks is supposed to be contradictory because his ideals are wrong. Shanks has what he wants and if anyone found One Piece and used the knowledge to tip the scales of the world. That unknown would take Shanks' freedom away. He's simply afraid of the unknown future and enjoys the status quo

[lunar shell]

I do. By using this other story and have someone think on "why the hale isnt letting the turtle win in purpose", it let him understand exactly how I feel about shanks.

[weak arrow]

In the first chapter of One Piece, Shanks’ crewmates tell Luffy that the life of a pirate is great because there’s adventure and pirates have freedom.
So you believe Shanks changed his mind about this in his 7 years to become a yonko from when Luffy ate the devil fruit?

[ashen surge]

I think Shanks made the deal with Gorosei during the 10 year skip Luffy was training, yes. But to make such deals, you need influence and stature.

[pure raven]

Shanks closeness with the Gorosei is really shady

[modest skiff]

It isn’t clear what the Gorosei get out of this at all. It seems strictly better to just try to eliminate Shanks. If Shanks had the information you describe, the WG would not settle for a promise IMO. There isn’t really a give and take here. And I think Shanks has shown signs of wanting more than personal freedom and relaxation. We know he was doing stuff on Elbaf. It feels like we have a lot of reason to assume he is active and has goals beyond what he currently has

[modest skiff]

You mean 2 years right

[ashen surge]

I meant the 10yo skip in the first chapter

[modest skiff]

Oh gotcha

[ashen surge]

Yeah I'm mostly basing my analysis on what will be the conflict between Luffy and Shanks because I think the story requires that. Shanks probably wouldn't indulge Gorosei with the whole truth but just enough to be in a position to negotiate.

[modest skiff]

I agree with most of this except the end. I don’t think Luffy turns everyone toonish, it was just effect of certain people. Lots of people in the scene didn’t do the eye pop thing. Also I don’t think Luffy is running like looney tunes on air, I think it is similar to his gear4 ability where he is essentially pushing the air down very hard. It’s just that in gear5 he’s even stronger and able to do it with individual feet in a more fluid motion rather than burst motions in gear4

[pure raven]

Shanks is evil he’s the wg lapdog

[modest skiff]

I guess we disagree on the necessity of conflict between Luffy and Shanks. Have you read my Shanks theory? If not I’ll link it for my different analysis

[ashen surge]

Please do!

[modest skiff]

#manga-theories message

[wind saddle]

so toki could be imu?

[ashen surge]

I like that, it could work but I don't really buy the idea that Shanks knew it was Nika when he stole it, I think the meeting during Reverie was that Shanks had at that point gained knowledge that Gumi = Nika from somewhere else and shared the bits with Gorosei.

[wind saddle]

shanks brother?

[lunar shell]

Shanks would never do that. This story is about freedom, a true adventure. Ace doesnt want Luffy to help him, its Ace's adventure. Luffy doesnt want to know about the one piece. Shanks making deal with gorosei towards the goal Luffy's protection destroys the concept of the story. That would be a low blow to Luffy, as he wouldnt want that.

[tulip hedge]

Never say never

[ashen surge]

No one was saying that Shanks did that to protect Luffy. He did that to maintain the status quo and that One Piece is not to be found. // Oh right, disregard this xd

[lunar shell]

Mohdoo did in his theory

[wind saddle]

bb probably is related to xebec but the history of bb is made up like no one wanted him but he definitely is a son of someone very strong but may got put up for adoption by his father (xebec)

[modest skiff]

Luffy has had people bail him out and directly save him many times, such as Marine Ford. Luffy would be disappointed , but he’s never been on his own.

[modest skiff]

Thanks. Yeah, I think that’s possible too. Hard to say. We have very little info ><

[lunar shell]

Having someone to save you live, and having someone changing the rule in your favor in the background aren't the same thing. At least, it is how I feel.

[ashen surge]

And you're not supposed to be alone, you're supposed to do your thing with your nakamas and through the power of friendship

[ripe geyser]

Do you guys think Shanks will gatekeep Laugh Tale from Blackbeard

[ashen surge]

Our convo just now was about me thinking Shanks is gatekeeping Laugh Tale from everyone

[ripe geyser]

To be honest Shanks could definitely gatekeep it from Luffy too

[modest skiff]

Agreed

[lunar shell]

I think Shanks and Blackbeard will fight over the thing Blackbeard is trying to subdue to the marine. It might be a plot of Shanks with the marine, organised by the gorosei, to beat BB.

In any case. I think its going to be Shanks vs BB, BB win => Luffy vs BB, Luffy win=> Luffy prove this way him and his crew surpassed Shanks.

[foggy gulch]

Do we know what shanks's dreams is?

[lunar shell]

See Roger's dream fulfilled probably

[ashen surge]

Because Blackbeard is a fucking coward, I think he will go after Luffy only after he has all the pieces to reach Laugh Tale. He doesn't have to do anything before that

[pure raven]

Shanks character has paralles to Ymir from nordic mythology
Ymir also sacrified his arm for the future and got killed by a three-headed monster

[lunar shell]

I'm not sure he is still a ' coward ' at this point. He was just smart about his chance against Akainu for example and chose to retreat ( directly opposed to Luffy mindset, again )

Now I think he is ready, well he have to be, to go all in.

[ripe geyser]

Or what if Shanks wants to duel against Luffy to see if he’s one of the types of men Roger is waiting for. Chances are Shanks sends the rest of his crew to guard LT from the BB Pirates so that he can buy time for Luffy to get to him first. Luffy and Shanks duel, Luffy wins (and cries), BB pirates defeat Shanks’s crew and then they chase after Luffy when he’s weakened from his fight

[ashen surge]

He arrived to marineford to kill WB after he had been weakened by the battle against the marines. It fits his mo

[lunar shell]

Luffy will have 3 pieces and Teach one, and they will have to fight, whoever win can attain laughtale and be pirate king. I say its a nice set up, more focused to the core story than a ' island story ' - Oda did says we're not going to have a new island plot since now-

[ashen surge]

Where did Oda say that?

[ripe geyser]

Source?

[modest skiff]

I don’t think Oda said that

[ripe geyser]

I do think there will be no more “go to this new island and save the people from a corrupt ruler” arcs though, those just don’t feel fitting after Wano whose “corrupt tyrant” is a Yonko

[ashen surge]

With that I can agree. With the presumed publication timeline we have - assuming that Shueisha will let Oda end One Piece in his own terms - things need to start getting wrapped up. Elbaf, Laugh Tale and the final war plz

[pure raven]

Must be hard for Luffy beating up corrupt people but doesnt want to be a hero

[lunar shell]

I can't find where Oda said it but I believe he did. Wano being the last arc introducing new char, that now the story will only be resolving on the major plot, and that it would end in 5 year

[exotic portal]

Will be actually visit Elbaf

[foggy gulch]

Seeing how things are going after wano there will be a zoro focused arc and then usopp all the while building up for the final war

[ripe geyser]

Elbaf has to become relevant, it just has to. Little garden built up connection with Usopp and the giants, we met the two Oars variants, Luffy can become giant, there’s a giant straw hat, and most of all Elbaf spelled backwards is FABLE, which means a tale, and Usopp always made up tales to tell Kaya.

[ashen surge]

Wano was the Zoro arc where he learns to listen and communicate with the tools of his trade. Zoro is the dude who becomes world greatest by hard work.

[exotic portal]

I feel like Wano was meant to be Zoro focused but Luffy took the spotlight lol

[ripe geyser]

Zoro still has chances for spotlight that’s the thing

[lunar shell]

You know the arc like Dressrosa, Wano, introducing an island and a whole plot linked to said island : Its over now. Because I dont have the source ya can doubt me I guess

[pure raven]

Do you guys think it is possible that Usopp has Conquerors Haki? He lied about it on Wano and some of his lies become true

[exotic portal]

Could be I wouldn't be surprised at this point

[torpid mist]

Everyone has adcoc and a mythical zoan

[ripe geyser]

Usopp having conqueror’s would be amazing ngl but Oda said Usopp will always be the weakest SH

[ashen surge]

did he

[late token]

So you think there will be no small elbaf arc?

[lunar shell]

I hope we see Zoro in next chap ( but we're going off manga-theories topic here xD )

Ussop wont have conqueror. His sensibility is toward awareness ( fear develop this). As such, he has a strong and unseen observation haki length

[lunar shell]

I do think we will see Elbaf but we wont have an arc resolving around it ( Sorry if I take time to answer I have 45s counter cuz I went out of line with a rabbit tale earlier )

[tawdry bramble]

Elbaf is definitely having a plot and a bad guy to over throw. Might be big mom

[pure raven]

Or Loki

[late token]

It’s all good I got time. I hope we at least get as many elbaf chapters as zou chapters.

[ripe geyser]

Honestly it would be sick if one of the giants was as strong as a Yonko

[wind saddle]

imus big strawhat was joyboys because just like luffy could make himself bigger joyboy had made it too

[lunar shell]

Hum. Big Mom 3 arc straight ... Claiming to end One piece in 5 year with having Big Mom arc AND BB arc AND war arc.. idk dude

[cedar ivy]

is elbaf also out of the WG rule ?

[exotic portal]

I've wanted to see a giant with a logia fruit 😂, surely would be yonko level if they had good haki too

[foggy gulch]

Zoro had the biggest spotlight in wano compared to all other arcs since time skip it looks like it but after what zoro has suffered the strawhats will have to prioritize him over the getting to one piece

[late token]

Yes

[wind saddle]

maybe the skeleton of joy boy is the one piece and joy boy laughted himself to death on laught tale😅

[tawdry bramble]

Luffy said he would defeat Big Mom. He still needs to do that.

[lunar shell]

Suanjan Wolf pirate king then

[ripe geyser]

Luffy also said he’s gonna kick all the admirals asses but Oda ain’t gonna make Luffy fight all the admirals

[lunar shell]

He claimed his intention, the story unfold in a way that dont allow him to fight her imo. He wont fight Shanks either, as he claimed to Law. imo.

[pure raven]

Sanji vs Kizaru would be sick

[late token]

He could though at this point ^^ but I also think he will only kick akainus ass. I still have to figure out what kind of role aokiji is going to play.

[wind saddle]

nothing i would say

[tacit zephyr]

Heyya, just dropping my prediction for the next 2 chapters here

• Luffy wants to beat kaido, but first he needs to overcome the Devil Fruit's will that just wants to have fun.
• Orochi finally dies
• Kaido flashback begins, he was always feared by everyone even as a kid, he wanted to be able to smile and make people laugh but couldn't, then heard the legend about Joyboy who always smiled and admired him / wanted to be like him

[exotic portal]

Is aokiji officially apart of BBs crew

[ashen surge]

We don't know

[lunar shell]

xD Luffy is at his limit he wont last more than one chap, he dont have time to deal with the fun issue that isnt one cuz it develops creativity this state of craziness provides.

[ripe geyser]

I think Aokiji is a rat to BB (btw this cool down’s long af 1 minute long)

[foggy gulch]

I don't believe orochi will die! I would appreciate him if he died tho

[ashen surge]

Aokiji could be SWORD

[lunar shell]

could is.

[wind saddle]

one that has the side affect of bb not being able to sleep because he transforms perhaps..

[tacit zephyr]

so how do you suggest luffy will beat kaido?

[quartz remnant]

God Valley 2.0

I don't think BB is a bigger threat than Kaido. We know that Shanks has privileges to speak to the Gorosai. Why not BB too. after all, he was a temporary warlord and potentially has ties to Akainu. Both parties feel threatened by Luffy. We have already seen the fear of world government. We'll see BB's concerns and motives for attacking Luffy after Wano. God Valley originally showed us how the "good guys" unite against the greatest evil, Xebec. Well, in the second half of One Piece, like so many other things, it's reversed, except that the good guy stands alone and will win. The bad guys unite against our protagonist because he poses a threat to the goals of others... absolute justice for Akainu and a BB Pirate King competitor. From my point of view, both alone are no greater threat than Kaido. For example, in a 1 vs 1, crew against crew BB will take a beating.
God Valley 2.0 also offers very good opportunities to look back on God Valley 1.0 and show all eras.

[lunar shell]

Here is how it will go :

In the end, Luffy will launch himself up using the ground turned gomu.

When up in the sky he will shrink himself to a point only his smile remain visible.

He will then release the pressure and be thrust to Kaido.

That's when he will strike Kaido using a gigantic punch on fire, shining like the sun, covering the moon, defeating Kaido.

People in the fire festival are here for a treat, for this punch will bring the sun, if for but a moment.

[raven holly]

imagine if they somehow need to go back to skypiea to find enel terrorizing the citizens again

[modest skiff]

Fight predictions and power scaling goes in the manga channels

[tacit zephyr]

aight 🙂

[wind saddle]

I think the real war could start after finding the one piece and fighting bb then

[ripe geyser]

What if you need the power of the dawn and the darkness to beat Imu? Cause if that’s the case Luffy is either gonna have to fight the WG with Blackbeard (which I don’t think he would want to do) or he’d have to kill Blackbeard so someone else could get the yami yami fruit

[lunar shell]

In shonen enemies tend to be stronger and stronger, especially toward the end of the manga. I do believe BB is more powerful because of that, for the threat part, I'll trust Imu having him in sight alongside bloody Joy Boy and bloody ancient weapon Poseidon speak for itself.

[modest skiff]

Based on Impel Down I think Luffy just needs the right situation to ally with this or that person

[compact geyser]

So guys, I have a problem. There is a guy in the comment section of a german theory video who basically says that he has "the information" about Imu sama but he don't want to say it because "suprise" ... I really hate people who act so important with stupid lies

[hardy comet]

gm

[ripe geyser]

If BB really does die before Luffy’s final battle against the WG who do you think would get the Yami Yami no mi (“no one” is a possible option)

[ashen surge]

Two mistakes: youtuber theories and going to youtube comment section xD

[compact geyser]

Yes you are so damn right

[lunar shell]

Dont concern yourself with such things. Remember Shanks teach that you dont have to confront those that arent in your way. They are irrelevant.

[pure raven]

Arturs theory was good dont you think?

[quartz remnant]

I do Not believe that BB is more powerful. Why this huge Story from God Valley, where we know so little, cause it will repeat.

[ashen surge]

I don't watch youtuber theories

[compact geyser]

yep but I just want to know why those ppl think they have Odas informations? 😅

[lunar shell]

Y I agree. I believe next arc is Mugiwara / Sword vs BB

[lunar shell]

Helps with being trending I guess. You are talking about it after all.

[compact geyser]

A valid and good point

[ashen surge]

Yeah I generally don't watch youtuber theories because inherently I think anyone who is trying to build and audience or to make £€$ out of One Piece or pop culture theories doesn't actually believe what they are saying. Just throwing out random crap for the engagement.

[wind saddle]

there is

[quartz remnant]

That also sounds fitting. But then we need a fight against Im, Akainu and the wrong government.
I doubt That One Piece gets two huge Kaido Level wars. I hope that Oda will combine these antagonists

[lunar shell]

Coby is already showed like a genius, having crazy observation haki and huge speed. The story will ask for him to be very strong, I believe in him.

[compact geyser]

I hope so too

[burnt garden]

luffy won't change the gomu gomu no prefix of his techniques even after he learns the other name for his fruit, but when oda shows the previous joyboy via a flashback , the previous joyboy will prefix his techniques with something similar to hito hito no mi , or nika no mi or something related to the recently revealed name of the fruit

[lunar shell]

It is fitting isnt it. I dont see the ' kind ' marine fight against luffy during the grand war. Having the Sword in the previous arc is a way to have them exist in a meaningful way in the story.

[wind saddle]

enel?

[wind saddle]

luffy being the sun, bb being the moon and there should be other planets as well like the ancient weapons except the sun is the middle of everything

[ashen surge]

I absolutely hate the "BB is moon" theory

[lunar shell]

Sun god : Luffy
Rain god : Vivi
Forest god : Poseidon
Land god : Momo

...Tabun

[keen kelp]

Lol whered you get that from

[wind saddle]

joy boy could have been one too and also we know that there was something with elbaf

[quartz remnant]

Ok but when I think about sword. Who will we have alongside Luffy? Kuzan, Coby and potential new ones. When we these Guys and the straw hats, BB doesn’t even stand a chance against them.

[lunar shell]

Why ? I do like it a lot. I mean its not like I heard it I came up with it like many I think, since its really ' obv '

[lunar shell]

Luffy : Cuz
Vivi : She summon rains
Poseidon : She dream to visit a forest
Momo : He dont like to fly he is more grounded type of guy.

[torpid mist]

How tf is vivi a God. U saying she is uranus?

[ashen surge]

There's zero indications about BB being moon god in the script. It's 100% asspull

[lunar shell]

By putting herself in photography in Imu's hand

[keen kelp]

Alright here's what I've got. Dragon saved luffy at Logue Town with lighting. He has the Rain.

Koby sorta translates to turtle. The diety for the Earth God was a turtle. Koby is from shells town.

I know its silly, but man can dream

[lunar shell]

0 ? You mean 10 right ?

1The fruit chose BlackBeard like it chose Luffy, like a mythological zoan would do, if I believe the 5 old fellows.

2Teach is portrayed as the mirror Luffy:

-While Luffy is spreading Joy that affect everyone around him, repelling all attacks with his fruit, Teach is attracting everything to him, depriving them existence, while not being able to repel anything.

3Imu have 3 person of interest. Two of them are strongly linked to void century, the 3's must be two ( Notice the three 3. )

4 The fruit doesnt act like a proper Logia does, this further increase the possibility of this fruit being something else than a regular logia.

5If Teach is indeed mythological of the Moon, Oda has a big story telling here : Who will win this fight with decide the face of the one piece, the light ( sun ) that will spread joy to everyone, or the darkness ( moon ) that will rules over everything.

6Ya guys need to understand the moon trade in gravitational business

7There seem to have a link with the 3 skull but that's a thing that no one is able to explains apparently

8It seems Teach crew have to do with the moon

9Not convinced by now ? Teach is not sleeping at night. Who else is not sleeping at night ? The moon. (y its prior to him eating the fruit but who cares its 9 no one is still reading at this point )

10The moon has quakes too (y true story so maybe both fruit make the " ultimate being complete " that teach talk about, that Shanks talk about to the gorosei, the god of the moon )

[foggy gulch]

Kaidou's devil fruit awakening is what made the white sea and the sky islands. We still haven't seen kaidou use his clouds against Luffy I think he can control the weather maybe he'll thin out the air inside the skull dome to kill everyone while he's getting defeated

[lunar shell]

Sure Dragon is a good candidate of Rain god ( I myself believe 100% ( y its dumb to think something, anything, at 100% ) to have the wind fruit )

I dont see Koby as an earth turtle ( you may be talking about genbu ? )

[pure raven]

From where comes the idea of a rain god? I thought it is just a sun vs darkness thing between BB and Luf

[keen kelp]

That may be true, but along with whatever medium has the Sun God, there are also the Forest God, Earth God, and Rain God

[ashen surge]

1 - nothing related to moon but cerberus for sure
2- nothing related to the moon
3 - nothing related to the moon
4 - nothing related to the moon
5 - moon has nothing to do with darkness, moon as a celestial object has a very different meaning
6- not folowing
7 - cerberus
8 - not following
9 - cerberus had three heads so it could guard the entrance to the underworld 24/7
10 - not in the script

[late token]

I don’t think this will have any revelance

[pure raven]

I skipped Skypiea (irony)

[lunar shell]

Me neither.

[wind saddle]

not those people but possible to have all planets of the sun system in there an d with the sun being the middle of it luffy could be the middle of everything

[keen kelp]

Brohow does that not have relevance

[late token]

They are portrayed as savages that believe in gods simple as that. Their sun god propably has nothing to do with nika

[foggy gulch]

Are you saying the devil fruits were once actuall ppl

[keen kelp]

I doubt it. But I also doubt Oda would make his story so convoluted, so maybe you're right

[pure raven]

Skypiea was the first arc I watched when I was 4 years old, completely missed this scene with the altar, the theory that Skypiea is foreshadowing the end of One Piece gets more serious

[wind saddle]

rain god may is enel??

[keen kelp]

Definitely not. He was a man who thought he was god. He was also MADE OUT OF LIGHTNING.

[late token]

Especially because oda is obviously speeding stuff up right now. Don’t think he will pick up the whole 4 gods theme again

[wind saddle]

just ignoring everything he tried to put out there and being a selfish

[pure raven]

I think Enel is representing Imu, who will be defeated because Luffy is immune against her 'power'

[wind saddle]

true but there definitely are gods that also equal as persons and probably df too

[lunar shell]

1- This argues about the probability that the Yami is a mythological zoan, if its indeed a mythological zoan, then the moon is the best assumption.

2-This argues on Teach being opposed to Luffy, dont you know the alter ego of the sun is the moon ?

3-True

4- 1's answer

5-1's answer ( moon have nothing to do with darkness ? plz, moon is only appearing in the darkness )

6- Understable, sorry for this

7 - Oh. thanks for this

8- I'm told Teach crew are link to the solar system, but I'm ok forgetting about this

9-Cerberus theory doesnt disregard this one ^^

10-its a fact related to the moon, its in the script of IRL life bro

[wind saddle]

tokis awakening is that she can time travel back so her fruit can't exist twice like people would exist twice if you travel back in time u should see yourself just like the movies and so it should be a right theory

[lunar shell]

sorry for my english btw

[wind saddle]

like i think toki is gonna be a important part in the next few chapters and definitely is gonna be a part of one of the many flashbacks that are coming

[ashen surge]

1 there's a third fruit, it's the zoan
2 thats not what alter ego means
5 moon is all about cycles of fertility, it's not a thing that sucks everything in
8 source
10 if you can't indicate a theory that has happened in the pages of one piece manga, then it's not in the script.

[wind saddle]

a theory is still a theory so it is what it is yk

[ashen surge]

Yeah but the LUFFY SUN SO BB MOON theory is just so fucking wack and lazy

[fluid snow]

I think luffy will die this arc and marco would do something to help him out.

[wind saddle]

what u think about tokis df awakening being time travelling back in time?

[pure raven]

Major point 😅 Glad that Kaidos fish-fish fruit turnt out to be a dragon

[ashen surge]

Zero indication of that

[fluid snow]

In process he will loose out more of his lifespan tho

[foggy gulch]

I think BB ate a mythical Zoan theat allowed him to have 3 personalities allowing him eat a logia and a parmicia

[ashen surge]

Something like that, it doesn't actually have to be mythical cerberus zoan, I'm more buying the idea of BB being Vegapunk lab experiment and BB himself is the cerberus and maybe there will be a zoan in his repertoire later.

[lunar shell]

1 So you says, but you can't debunk a theory with an other. Thats not how it works.

2 Ok I mean that Luffy is sun yang and Teach is Moon yin

5Moon is all about gravity, it is this power it exerce to the earth

8Like I said forget about it or watch a youtub video I'm told some talk about it

10 Ofc I can. One piece rules are mostly based on our IRL rules. There are river made of water, a sun, the wind, some scissor. Those all share their IRL representation's rule

[pure raven]

How does BB being shown with different numbers of missing teeth works ? like does his head just gets replaced or what

[pure raven]

Dont you think it has more likely to do with the yami yami no mi? He studied DF and was seeking for this certain fruit because he knew it would allow him to gain powers of multiple DFs

[ashen surge]

Yeah Kaido defo was a fish when he first got the fruit and then awakened it

[tulip hedge]

I just read moon has nothing to do with darkness xD

[foggy gulch]

Yeah and talking about Vegabunk what if BB is actually 3 ppl in one body one of Vegabunk's experiments

[ashen surge]

That's what I've been saying

[pure raven]

what if Blackbeard was like that one judge in Enies Lobby lmao

[foggy gulch]

No he said himself it's because yami yami is the strongest logia I think

Or BB has 3 hearts!

I like that the best it's pretty simple too

[lunar shell]

BB has superior strength, he doesn't sleep, and has a weird body. Luffy and Zoro saw him as ' them '.

3 hearts might do the trick. He would be a doctor who's who.

[lament flume]

i think teach has 2 heads on his shoulderblades or back

[pure raven]

Because its undoing of DF effects yes, what if this also means he can "undo" the effect of multiple DFs destroying the body of their owner? Something like this, maybe

[lunar shell]

Y the multiple hearth and the multiple face, namely one in the back of his head (that is always hidden by a bandana ) is something to consider

[tulip hedge]

harry potter quirrell vibe

[lunar shell]

https://tenor.com/view/voldemort-quirrell-reveal-gif-13273431

[lament flume]

i also think the reason he doesnt sleep is because his other guys on his back constantly sleep for him

[lunar shell]

Y good thinking. But all this doesnt make me understand where Oda is going with this, so idk

[foggy gulch]

Yami yami Nomi Contains the devil in the the devil fruit it kills the owner but he can give it to anyone he can

[fluid snow]

More than personality I believe in body parts. Lets hypothetically assume devil fruit powers reside in ones heart. What if one has more than one heart? This will also give us explanation about how big mom and bb were able to acquire the powers from their target bodies.

[lunar shell]

That said...It is true that the moon has always a side we earthen never see, the " far side of the Moon".

Humm

[foggy gulch]

Yeah 3 hearts! Is the simplest explanation!

[forest hill]

Usopp will die in last fight(no more explanation needed)

[fluid snow]

Most logical. Its hypothetical tho. Doesn’t has to be hearts.

[pure raven]

Nobody dies in One Piece

[foggy gulch]

Yeah but I think the Devil/power in the devil fruits reside in the heart of the owner

[lunar shell]

Considering how Oda works, with crew member having the same relation in them as the captain let us see Kaido king of beast, strongest creature, having in his crew only beast. Or BM and her yummy.

BB having a crew that links to solar system only strengthen furthermore the relevance of the moon god theory.

[fluid snow]

What about luffy? He has high chance as well.

[foggy gulch]

Orochi won't die he's highly resistant to heat

[lunar shell]

Luffy is dying alright. Do you see him chilling when his adventure is over ? Nah. Sun dont chill.
He give his hat to Tama and end it with a smile.

[pure raven]

When spoil ?

[lunar shell]

Now : Tama join the crew.

[pure raven]

What ?

[forest hill]

Usopp will die, luffy is too much main character to die before his arc ends(like roger), zoro has same problem of mc, same w sanji.
Usopp is the perfect mix of mc and joke character that will make it perfectly sad if he dies in the final fight

[pure raven]

Its my birthday now, anyway nobody dies in One Piece because their spirit and dreams live on, even Orochi low spirit will live on in characters like Blackbeard

[lunar shell]

Nah. There are only bones left when you die. Your way of thinking is has been bro ( jk )

[marble fog]

Ussop still needs to meet his father

[fluid snow]

Yo guys have you ever thought about that shandora girl. Who was born with an exceptional observation haki. For some reason whenever I think about ancient weapons snd voice of all things, i get a feeling that she might play a role as well in future.

[pure raven]

There are spoils tonight ?

[fluid snow]

Probably nah

[pure raven]

Yohohoho

[lunar shell]

Aisa, Ener, Coby, Ussop ( in a special way ) all have exceptional affinity to observation haki that allow them to hear the ' voice ' of all living being around them

[foggy gulch]

Poor cobi hes not more important than that girl!lol

[pure raven]

And Momo

[tulip hedge]

I hope Coby becomes strong af and in the end Luffy fights alongside Coby against blackbeard, like Roger fought along Garp against Rocks pirates

[pure raven]

Would be nice if Luffy has not to beat someone 1 on 1 like always in the end

[lunar shell]

Momo, Luffy, Roger, Oden, Sea king, Zunesha, Nika. Those dude have" voice of all thing". Its something else.

It may be linked, but thing is, Aisa or Ener dont hear the voice of all thing the poneglyph of skypia is giving, and Luffy, that can hear Sea King and Zunesha, dont show the same observation haki Ener and Aisa have.

My believe is that voice of thing can only be heard by those that are emitting a true king aura you know. Not just conqueror. Those Sea king talk about two king, there might be more, those that inherit will of such king can hear and speak to with haki => voice of all things

[slim wasp]

Hey guys quick question. Since Luffy power is really imagination as his zoan fruit would that mean his gears all manifested because he imagined them to?

[pure raven]

Yes

[lunar shell]

Freedom is only limited by imagination.

Oda gave gomu fruit cuz it allowed him to be free to do fun things, now with this awakening, Oda has even more freedom, look at him drawing those cartoon things, he is only limited by his imagination now.

Freedom have no rules

[tulip hedge]

His power is not imagination, that's just something resin theorists made up

[solar solstice]

Sanji will be sea king:D

[lunar shell]

Gorosei said ' the awakening give the user more strength and freedom, this is an absurd power only limited by the user's imagination " something like that.

[foggy gulch]

Before gear 5 his devil fruit is just elasticity gear 5 is imagination that is limited to his elasticity is how I understood it

[slim wasp]

But since he is a zoan he never had elasticity ?

[lunar shell]

Marco is a Zoan made of wildfire you know.

[sharp anvil]

You guys got me thinking about zoan elasticity

[foggy gulch]

He's always has been and will be rubber his gear 5 just let's him have full control of his body and his surroundings

[lunar shell]

Urg I forget about that, that only strengthen my Nika = Lunarian thinking

[tulip hedge]

That literally doesn't translate to that his power is imagination
What I personally understand from it is that his rubber powers are only limited by his imagination, there's literally nothing we've seen so far that isn't rubber related

[lunar shell]

Yes indeed.

[slim wasp]

That doesn’t answer my question

[lunar shell]

He is a zoan with an elasticity body ( for me ( for me ( imo ( its not elasticity its affecting self with freedom aspect ) ) ) )

[foggy gulch]

Also a human eating a human human fruit don't have a hybrid form! Orrr does it

[pure raven]

King is such a weirdo

[tulip hedge]

Yeah personally don't think it's really "rubber", it's more of "manipulation"? Not sure if that'd be the word

[lunar shell]

He should be living his best life right now and is acting all worried ( 😢 I cant loooose I'm too stronnnng )

[lunar shell]

Nika's will of freedom is affecting everything it touch. Just like Teach is depraving of freedom anything it touch.

The first distract the nature of thing so we see that as gomu

The second attract everything and increase their pressure. This explains why he feel more pain from attack. And well, basically how the yami works

One repels everything, the other absorb everything.

Luffy right shoulder, Blackbeard left shoulder

from wiki : Many natural dualities (such as light and dark, fire and water, expanding and contracting) are thought of as physical manifestations of the duality symbolized by yin and yang.

[fluid snow]

Do you guys think joyboys story was of a betrayal? If, lets assume, he was a pirate and had a huge crew but was betrayed by one of his nakama. Wont that be icing on cake on this pirates betray theme that gas been going on since post time skip. Like the whole void century happened because of a betrayal. It would be a master stroke…

[modest skiff]

@solar solstice nothing other series anywhere other than #other-series please

[lunar shell]

Maybe. I mean Zunesha has done a nasty thing, and Imu, ( that mean ' hate ' ) is destroying Luffy, Teach, and Poseidon picture, in a hateful way.

I say there are some dark deeds in there.

Luffy can become a damn giant, and he can expand other things than him with his awakening, see what he did to kaido ?

I wonder if this is how we have such a giant elephant around. Maybe Sea King too.
This also links to the fact we have gorosei talking about Nika fruit with Zunesha in the background de yansu

Anyway, 'night

[ripe geyser]

I feel like BB won’t have Kaido’s raw strength but I think the Yami Yami power will have a stalemate effect against Luffy’s ability and cancel out with it

[viscid solar]

I think Franky will eat a devil fruit (zoan) cause if u look at the chapter 1028 cover art. almost everything on it happened, so far.

[torpid mist]

Franky with one of these wierd prehistoric zoans would be a cool contrast to his mecha self

[spice dawn]

The 20th anniversary episode (906) is the first One Piece sketch Oda did? I want to know if the base is the same. So I can contrast information. And it looks like Oda invents the Haki later, so the basis of the manga is in the early episodes.

[junior nebula]

I was wondering the same thing at one point. Perhaps Joy Boy almost freed the world but the only thing that stopped it was an unforeseen betrayal from one of his own friend.

[hard arrow]

how did oz get his body stretched without the fruit ?

[merry sparrow]

Do you guys think in the final arc Franky will rebuild Pluton as a whole, implement it into himself (or the sunny), or will he be the one to dismantle it?

Wow what the hell, the message cooldown is so long now in here. Who spammed it and ruined it for everyone?

[modest skiff]

We have the long cooldown to discourage people from writing brief ideas and chit chatting

[compact fox]

so silly

[boreal anchor]

I believe this will happen - not a matter of if, but a matter of when.

[fervent flax]

Franky won't build Pluton , or consciously build one.
He will build a frankbot mk.69 or something and it's gonna be stronger than pluton

[compact fox]

I feel like my boi franky prolly just remembers it in his robo bwain

[brisk mirage]

I personally think we’ll get some kind of sacrifice from Koby. In thanks for Luffy saving him all those years ago

Not Ace level sacrifice, but maybe defending a knocked out Luffy until he recovers, tanking blows from the BB captains

[compact fox]

yea if koby don't do no sacrificial snuff i'll like em less prolly

[gray moth]

@merry sparrow franky gonna turn the sunny into pluton , he has the blueprints and has slowly been modding the ship

[brisk mirage]

I’ve always assumed that the ship Noah was a base platform for Pluton

[lyric berry]

We could also get the original Pluton. Robin is the only one in the world who knows where it is and the poneglyph with its location is currently buried

[gray moth]

the fact that luffy is also friends with Shirahoshi leads me to believe he will have some control over the ancient weapons one day

[boreal anchor]

I think it will mirror garp and roger with coby eventually outliving luffy after the battle, but will continue to tell the tale of joyboy's return

obviously in a whole new world setting where the world government aren't as prevalent anymore/destroyed or brought to a new order

[merry sparrow]

It’s really nice to debate the theories though in here. I feel like this channel will end up getting used less

[boreal anchor]

to add on to this, the brief ideas and chit chat also are what eventually lead to a lot of pretty cool theories by combining the ideas of multiple people

[fluid snow]

Do you guys think there are more to kings kind somewhere on the planet

[brisk mirage]

I’m guessing his people are on an island very close to Laugh Tale. Hence why they are so rare to see in the larger world

[fluid snow]

Maybe also in the devils sea. That is also a mysterious place

[tulip canopy]

Enma Daio(great king Enma) Is the ruler of hell in Japanese folklore. His true form is that of a Buddha or Bodhisattva. He is A guardian of the underworld, god of travelers, and protector of children.( Zoro has been seen protecting children since the start of one piece that was the first thing we saw him do.) Enma is the Buddhist god of hell and Asura(zoro nine sword style) is a demon. Enma job is to free all souls from hell so maybeee Asura will finally be able to be used to its maxed because enma will free it from the under world so what im saying is Zoro has been using power from hell itself. great i know right

[severe finch]

Hear me out guys, "Bink's Sake" is the One Piece

Although the Roger Pirates sang it, we don't know how old the song is, so maybe the person who found the One Piece 800 years before Roger created the song soon after and passed it down from generation to generation.

[compact fox]

i feel that joyboy made up for fun most likely

[obtuse shore]

Theory: Longarms and longlegs exist because Joyboy stretched the limbs of some of his enemies for fun (or something similar) and they stayed like that forever and so their children inherited these properties and these races were born. This relation to Joyboy explains why these pretty random races exist in the first place.
(Or the WG experimented trying to recreate this part of the Nika fruit but the most they could do is what led to longarms and longlegs as kind of failed experiments. But the first thing seems more likely to me.)

[keen kelp]

i think thats silly

[obtuse shore]

So like chapter 1045?

[keen kelp]

lol what does that have to do with unorganic mutations that wouldnt carry on in your genes?

[primal smelt]

Big mom is the reincarnation/embodiment of the God of destruction https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/twjoxe/big_moms_hunger_pangs_reason_1045_spoilers/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

[obtuse shore]

Awakened devilfruits can permanently alter whole islands, who's to say they can't permanently alter living things?

[keen kelp]

im open to theories, but im just not seeing it

[severe finch]

oh wait i forgot about this, i have more evidence for this too

In the first verses of the song, it states that they are "Going to deliver Bink's Sake", which means they already have the booze (the One Piece) and are giving it to a guy known as Bink?

[frozen birch]

w the teach moon god stuff, got me thinking bout the old teach is a kurozumi theory

[mortal trench]

Hey guys so what if Ace is actually Sabo but he sprayed his hair yellow it would be kinda cool right?

[keen kelp]

agreed

[compact fox]

i think this actually kinda factual

[severe finch]

The rest of that verse is basically not really important, except it is. A few lines later they state that they are going "Far across the salty depths" which means they have already probably traveled far and wide across the Grand Line, seeing as though they probably know where they're going. "Farewell to the harbor, my hometown" also implies the same thing.

[obtuse shore]

BB is Kurozumi? That serves no purpose and he's the opposite of Luffy and Luffy has no direct relation to Wano. That's like saying BB is related to any other villain really.

[keen kelp]

im just not seeing it dude. how does that make binks sake the one piece?

[severe finch]

it doesn't; stating this was just implying that whomever wrote the song had probably already traveled across the world

[obtuse shore]

Also moon god makes no sense because the moon reflects the sun and its symbolism isn't a negative one in One Piece, for example the moon empowers the minks and it's the symbol of the Kozuki clan.

[keen kelp]

well of course, silly. binks sake is very relavent to the one peice story as a whole

[severe finch]

yea thats why im saying it could be even more important than we realize it to be'

[obtuse shore]

The moon is the part of the sun that is present even in the darkest night.

[keen kelp]

nah, we all know it is very important and it definitely foreshadows something. we just dont know what yet

[obtuse shore]

Yeah basically the whole theorist community agrees that Bink's Sake is insanely important and very connected to the One Piece and the void century and or potential prophecies

[severe finch]

That’s what I’m saying

[obtuse shore]

Yep, well, not exactly, you said people don't give it the importance but they actually do

[severe finch]

Oh

[obtuse shore]

Randy Troy shouted out a theory that BB might be the earth god. In Skypia a sun god, rain god, earth god and forest god were mentioned. Luffy is sun, Vivi could be the rain god (easy connection), Shirahoshi could be forest god (she wants to see a forest, maybe she is meant to be the protector of the Eve tree?) and BB could be the earth god (earthquakes?). Imu held the pictures of these four people in their hands. A bit whacky but Vivi and rain fits so perfectly that who knows... Also Shirahoshi wanting to see a forest is a suspicious piece of foreshadowing for... something.

[ripe geyser]

What do yall think of this headline:
"revolutionary army chief of staff captured after murdering alabasta king"

[weak arrow]

That's probably the headline, along with him being set for execution

[compact fox]

That would be mega fuckin' interesting i'd actually like that because that'd tie all those events together. Unless it was sabo who died then pooie

[brisk mirage]

That would be so boring to reuse the Marineford plot line

[weak arrow]

Being set for execution doesnt mean Luffy has to rescue him.

#manga-theories message

Lemme shill this real qucik

[ripe geyser]

well it's not like nobody can sabotage the ship Sabo is being sent away in (ahem grand fleet)

[brisk mirage]

Did you just advert another discord channel? That’s mutable lol

[fervent flax]

you would think the WG learn their lesson in holding big names execution , shit will go down

[ripe geyser]

I thought carefully about the revolutionaries and Dadan's reactions:
Dragon - wanted to confirm facts
Koala - sad and confused, thought "this isn't like Sabo"
Ivankov - angry, thought Morgans made shit up
Dadan - sad, especially cause she just found out Sabo was alive

[compact fox]

HOLY SHIT I FORGOT DADAN DIDN'T KNOW YET

[balmy girder]

Didn’t they get what they wanted?

[obtuse shore]

It (Sabo rescue) would invert it if Luffy didn't fail and had his friends this time. But I don't want this kind of repeat of Marineford either necessarily. I feel like Luffy powering up so much and defeating Kaido makes it more likely that the WG captures Luffy and he has to be rescued and that would be the inversion of Marineford and Luffys solo adventure. That could take Luffy out of the picture until the final war. Oda loves taking characters that would cause problems to be around at certain points out of the picture. Like how Luffy is often stalled at the end of an arc, this could stall him at the end of the series now that he is too powerful. Tinfoilhat theory.

[weak arrow]

No, it's my pinned theory about how the situation will unfold check pins for a lot of other theories

[ripe geyser]

do you think the headline will also say that Sabo attempted to murder Vivi

[obtuse shore]

(Also gives Zoro an opportunity to grow as the vice captain.)

[compact fox]

nah vivi is luffy's friend im sure she would say something i don't think she would be minelessly killed by sabo

[ripe geyser]

The major catch is: Morgans rejected the WG's request to cover up info so if the news were to lie that Sabo killed Cobra and attempted to kill Vivi then that would be Morgans's own lies

we know for sure Sabo didn't actually kill Cobra or Vivi, but it definitely seems like the news is framing him

If the WG wanted to eliminate Cobra then I think I might see what's aboutta go down in Alabasta. Alabasta may actually have an ultimate weapon (I'm thinking pluton) and the WG wanted to eliminate Cobra so that they could cause instability and panic in Alabasta. This would give them the edge when sending the marines to the kingdom to take the weapon. The WG may even Buster Call Alabasta to find Pluton. However, it's not just gonna be the Marines. Blackbeard said he wanted to "take it for himself" before letting the marines take it, so I'm thinking a huge battle that destroys pretty much the entire Alabasta is gonna go down: Buster Call vs the BB pirates for pluton.

[analog sun]

How does the fact that Kuzan may be an infiltrated agent for the revolutionaries within BB's crew? Are they getting involved?

[harsh axle]

I think franky has pluton not alabasta.

[ripe geyser]

I mean Crocodile's objective of going to Alabasta was finding Pluton

[brisk mirage]

Did we see a headline claiming Sabo killed them? I thought the headline was saying Sabo was killed

[harsh axle]

How are we sure that crocodile had the right info?

[brisk mirage]

Didn’t Franky burn the blueprints?

[modest skiff]

Franky burned the blueprints after memorizing them

[ripe geyser]

the headline is unconfirmed right now, but I have a serious feeling the WG framed Sabo in order to make a double play:
-bait the revs
-get a step closer to purging Alabasta

[harsh axle]

Yeah franky definitely knows what pluton is at least

[brisk mirage]

Why would they purge alabasta when the nation is the current poster child of solid monarchy and membership in the WG

[analog sun]

Franky memorized the plans. But there is also probably a built version of pluton from the void century in Alabasta

[ripe geyser]

Alabasta is the one Nation that didn't represent the holy land of mariejoia when the holy land was created

plus, at reverie we saw that "an incident concerning the Alabasta kingdom" occured and saw Alabasta citizens crying. Im-sama was also holding a picture of Vivi, very sus.

[analog sun]

Headline is "Vivi murders father, runs off with revolutionary hotshot"

[timid niche]

Hi, i need the theory about evil shanks, like hes planning something behind everyone or hes Im-sama or Rocks' son ?.

[ripe geyser]

I don't have invalid theories in my memory capacity so I won't be able to tell you anything

[timid niche]

Damm, i swear i read it somewhere

[analog sun]

You have, it's a common one. There's even an emote

[fervent flax]

ooh another alabasta arc. love it
Crocodile will come help out the alabastanian , it will be his redemption arc

[ripe plume]

@Shanks' Right Pinky

😢

[ripe geyser]

how can you say 3 incorrect things in a row

[viscid latch]

Crocodile won't help out nobody. Do we even know where he is at the moment?

[fervent flax]

sorry this is in response to your bb and wg fighting in alabasta for pluton.
i didnt know there was right or wrong as this is a theory discussion

[timid niche]

Soooo will shanks be evil or he just Oda's figure, there to clean his own mess ?

[analog sun]

Last we saw him in action, in the war, he was pretty helpful

[ripe geyser]

Crocodile is not a nice person and he's def apathetic to the people of Alabasta and always will be, and having another decently long arc in the same place is just story repetition

[viscid latch]

We also saw him again, I believe it was after Luffy started being called the Fifth Emperor. He was reading the newspaper with a strange grin on his face

[pure raven]

ah hell nah they found qunadale dingle in impel down

[analog sun]

That's why I said "in action". Hard to be helpful while reading the paper.

If his goals of getting/protecting Pluton align with protecting the island, I don't see why he wouldn't do it.

[ripe geyser]

where do we think Vivi currently is

[compact fox]

dead lol

[ripe geyser]

I don't think Oda would offscreen Vivi like that though

[full cairn]

shanks a pirate, ofc hes evil… hes been evil since day 1

[ripe geyser]

by that logic Chopper is evil

[rustic jasper]

N e ways most likely shanks would always be neutral and vivi is probably in alabasta

[harsh tangle]

I don't think that Vivi is in alabasta

[rustic jasper]

Imo she is, or maybe with the revolutionaries or smwhere safe

[rapid oxide]

Franky's bounty is too low

[harsh tangle]

I think that imu was targeting the ancient weapons (imu was trying to kill luffy so maybe he was thinking to kill other two also)

[ripe geyser]

I'm thinking Sabo may have seen that Vivi was in danger and so put himself in danger to buy time for Vivi to escape to the other revs

[harsh tangle]

You have a point there

[keen kelp]

im rewatching the episode where they see the news, AND blackbeard seems to finally have an opportunity for something he wants. i think sabo mgiht already be dead. thats also how they could avoid redoing marine ford

[ripe geyser]

oh wait, if Sabo saved Vivi then the news may frame the revs by saying that they captured Vivi

[keen kelp]

why would they capture vivi though? i super like your thinking though

[rustic jasper]

Imo they're desperate to wreck rev and vivi

[ripe geyser]

the revs wouldn't capture Vivi, what I'm saying is that the revs may be keeping Vivi safe but the news may frame the revs by saying that they captured Vivi

[keen kelp]

i dont think so. the bird man made it clear that he'd write facts

[rustic jasper]

Bcuz nerfetari is one of the og celestials that stepped down, they probably jsve smt importnt

[abstract owl]

Where is sunny in Wano ?

[keen kelp]

in onigashima. they sailed in with it and its docked. its hidden and all the samurai destroyed their boats

[bitter kraken]

No way sabo is dead, the dead bother thing already happened and served it’s purpose. Also why let sabo get the mera and inherit ace will to just off screen him lol. I’m with the peeps who think he is on the run with ViVi after having saved her, and is being blamed for dads death.

[ripe geyser]

We can't be entirely sure Morgans was 100% honest about the news
A) He said he wasn't gonna hide the death. He doesn't have to be honest about how the death happened
B) Morgans literally said he sometimes spins his own lies
C) He got a call from Wapol shortly after defeating the CP agent. Perhaps Wapol is paying him to make something up. We don't know what Wapol's motives are but we know he isn't well acquainted with Alabasta because of Vivi

[amber oar]

Not really, the government asked him to hide a particular story and he was like "I lie however I want"

[keen kelp]

but he turned down a big money offer because the story was just that good

[ripe geyser]

Don't forget about the call from Wapol. Wapol was said to "have more information to leak". What if Wapol was actually in cahoots with the WG for going against Alabasta and told Morgans that the revs were the ones who murdered Cobra and captured Vivi? Wapol would definitely pay Morgans to add this if he had to

[timid niche]

I swear i will get some cancer cells into my body just to know how op ends

[balmy girder]

He is

[grim pine]

[cedar venture]

Im thinking Sabo is the prince of the OP world and Vivi would be his wife

[modest lava]

Kaido is a failed Luffy, we will learn this in his upcoming flashback

[prime magnet]

I’m on this 4 “gods” theory hard

[modest lava]

also luffys gear 5th is a parallels to the minks, theyre both white

[quaint frost]

i would love to see kadio flashing back then luffy walk in and hits him just go full on cartoon

[modest lava]

@quaint frost yeah something like Kaido explains why he chose wano and stuff and the reasoning why he is the way he is and luffy just straight up hitting him mid flashback and saying something like thats just an excuse

Luffy is going to liberate Kaido and change him back to his old self, I am adamant that he will.

A real villain wouldn't be angry for winning a fight due to tricks

[daring tinsel]

After Wano, is it likely Elbaf? If so I wonder who the antagonists will be?

[modest lava]

Elbaf is most likely going to be as short or a tiny bit longer then Zou. IMO.

post wano when the straw hats need to set sail though, I think something like what happend with Jinbei and his former crew holding big mom off will happen, except it will be the world government/blackbeard/green bull attempting to prevent the straw hats from setting sail

Zou is coming to Wano, and so is the world government, something huge is going to happen. Bigger then marineford.

[tulip hedge]

imo Nika has to have been a lunarian or have some connection to them, same for minks

[modest lava]

^^

[naive wolf]

yoo im completely up to the idea of Luffy tames Kaido, i mean nu joke intended: Kaido being somehow Luffy's ally, I immediately remember Katakuri about the man's honour stuff after Kaido on 1044

[modest lava]

@naive wolf also his power to make people his allies could be his fruit, who knows...

[naive wolf]

yeah but he ain't make allies all his enemies yet, but there is crocodile, kata and some big others shots there, even with the 💩 Cesar Clown on WCI

[modest lava]

i would say he can probably only use it on people who have a tiny bit of good in them

[daring tinsel]

I’m not sure if the encounter with Shanks is being saved for the very end with WG and Blackbeard.
I guess it could be Straw Hats + Red Hair Pirates vs Blackbeard vs WG

Or red hair pirates vs straw hats serious/davey back for the last poneglyph. Shanks is still at levelley though

[naive wolf]

the guys who didn't ally to Luffy on the end are left to the oda's forgetfullness like captain kuro, arlong (he just on flashbacks), don krieg, prolly doflamingo for now; maybe all those guys only going to came back until final war ; also i got to add about the Kaido's stuff that he really showed to be evil and no mercy against wano's people; tho he probs is super angry about humankind in general, probably cause the oni race being part of the races who suffer discrimination and persecution by WG, tho is still hard to believe Kaido fighting aside with Luffy ngl i don't think will happen

it be interesting to know how a tenryubito would like to pay fore a oni people? imagining Yamato on Matygeoise right now

[pure raven]

rafael is made out of rubber, that’s why u can’t use a log pose, that’s why everyone is laughing, that’s why roger said we too early. It’s because joy boy needs to reverse the rubber

[naive wolf]

Shanks snitching on Luffy's real devil fruit name is a clear possibility that even could clean up some ploholes, like about how soft WG dictate Luffy's persecution on the first place since he were rising even more (like if they know Luffy have a rubber body and make the conection with the Nika's fruit, why not rush to kill him immediately?, like really make sure for him to dies). This can be debanked, of course, people says that Shank's kinda knew that Nika's awakening was required for Luffy to die (?), others say that even when Gorosei may know about Luffy's power, they ain't act bec they doubt Luffy could ever awake this god-like devil fruit, but this is also contradictory with the suddenly change on cp0 orders received on Onigashima right now (they went from "who cares who wins this battle - go catch niko robin at all cost - kills Luffy right now (even when one of their best agents was sacrified). So i think this is the strong basis idea of "Shank's evil" tho i probs forgetting more shady stuff to add

[fervent flax]

Shanks is evil scenario

I can only see it working out like a double agent scenario. Else i would feel it undermine the one piece theme and luffys motivation

[prime bluff]

Joyboy will spread joy
kaido knows this
So he has everybody around him in wano eat smile fruit so they can always laugh
Kaido knows that by dying zoan fruit awakens
So he wanted to die multiple times he tried and failed
Kaido wanted to become joyboy

[modest lava]

@prime bluff maybe his depression is because his fruit has never awoken, he is the worlds strongest, yet he still cannot surpass his own limits and he will in this fight? duno

[idle monolith]

this sounds yes

[prime bluff]

Well to awaken your devil fruit you had to be yourself
Kaido all this time want to be someone else, who he is not

[rose spoke]

Kaido is a dragqueen

Maybe when the fight is over, Robin may read odens book and find Smth out

What I wanna know is how the marines are gonna enter the story again, it's not like Dressrosa when they were there already. If the Strawhats win which they will, Wano will protect them like Arabasta and so n so

[rocky stirrup]

Damn wtf

[prime bluff]

@tepid coral

[naive wolf]

im not dissing cause that sounds plausible, but in which moment was stated that in order to awake one devil fruit you have to be yourself

[tepid coral]

Yeah joyboy speads joy and we can assume that kaido knew this but if he knew this and wanted to become joyboy why will he make the the wano people eat the smile fruit cause like he wanted to become joyboy and if he had become joyboy the people had automatically started laughing.

Also don't think it was stated anywhere that zoan fruit awakens by dying cause it makes no sense like if someone dies he should just die and not awaken and if that's not the point and we make an assumption that this is true then it contradicts the whole existence of brooke's fruit

[prime bluff]

Maybe not zoan fruit
But luffy df hito hito no mi awakens which was the joyboy fruit in death

[ashen surge]

@gloomy canyon is this pin worthy?

[tepid coral]

Don't really get u so basiacally u are assuming that this fruit was with joyboy too,if yes then it is a valid assumption but it is not yet confirmed yet

[prime bluff]

Thank you for considering my theory

[ashen surge]

I likes the idea that Nika fruit empowers on laughter and that’s why Luffy is so powerful in Wano rn, because of all the people enjoying themselves

[pure raven]

I don't really get this "Shanks snitching Luffy's real df name" when Gorosei already knew about it and each era they tried to get their hands on it .

[placid ore]

Is it a plausible theory that we get a Zoro awakening (Luffy, Sanji have had theirs) when the Marines show up and he absolutely decimates most of their fleet?

[robust frost]

I think Zoro is fighting death so that when luffy dies after the fight with kaido, death is like iss alright ill come later maybe

[pure raven]

Zoro awakens his sword to blackblade atleast enma

[charred river]

Was king supposed to eat the inu inu no mi Model: Okuchi no Makami originally?

[placid ore]

I think Zoro is Luffy’s parallel in that he somehow represents the moon and whatever Oda wants that to mean. They’re obviously the 1-2 punch and them being connected just seems right to me.

[tulip hedge]

Weren't there theories that Sanji might have some lunarian blood in him? That would make Sanji more of the one representing the moon in the crew

[placid ore]

Fair.

[naive wolf]

perhaps yet unlikely, like mixing a fire related "god" into a fur ice mythological?, well oda already gave us Pekoms being a lion mink with turtle zoan fruit , it is misterious about the origin and the true purposse Kaido gave to that devil fruit

[timid niche]

Why theres the word "model" in kaido's fruit name ? Like theres another uo uo fruit ???

[naive wolf]

yaa, that breaks the theory but the question about why sudden change about cp0 is still up

[mortal field]

Maybe. Plus Kaido’s df is a reference to a folklore about a carp going over a waterfall and turning into a dragon, so it make sense for him to be a fish

[naive wolf]

i personally find a bit uncanny some gorosei behaviours but that is another mid headcannon, which it says: that maybe gorosei are brainwashed or even cyborgs, completely damaged by imu-sama maybe

[pure raven]

I don't have a solid answer for that

[delicate hamlet]

so basically magikarp to gyarados with extra steps

[mortal field]

Magikarp was based off of that folklore too

[round fjord]

Spoilers ??

[placid ore]

Luffy uses his fire abilities to get revenge on Akainu.

[ashen surge]

Because Beast &Big Mom Pirates were actually starting to lose, Queen defeated, King defeated, Big fucking Mon defeated. Gorosei was relying on Yonko alliance defeating the upstarts but that was not the case anymore.

[merry sparrow]

Yo @ashen surge what’s up homie!

[sturdy pond]

In another sub they said Friday

[ashen surge]

@merry sparrow at work, did you read my thing

[cyan berry]

this channel is not for casual conversation

move conversation like this to either manga channels

[merry sparrow]

Yeah I read your theory on shanks and the final road poneglyph. I think that’s awesome and totally plausible

[old ocean]

in 1045 why Luffy can use his "rubber" power even if kaido weapon is coated with haki?

[sturdy pond]

I dont watch one piece theory vids on yt. What's the latest speculation on what D stands for?

[naive wolf]

yaa it really can be like that, then somehow kaido has a link with WG, and that is why on punk hazard with the beast pirates symbol plus the wg sign, then they just backing up a big shot ally but not quite sure tho:

[timber comet]

probably he just changed his shape with fs before being hit

[naive wolf]

drums perhaps

[merry sparrow]

A lot of people think it means dawn. Some people think it’s devil. And for some reason there is some people that think it’s just a half moon or you can put it in front of Enies Lobby (DEnies Lobby) or in front of One Piece (DOne Piece) but I think that one is fucking stupid

@naive wolf I like your idea, that seems totally plausible. Will of the drums

[ashen surge]

thats the beast pirates jolly roger

[sturdy pond]

Hmm ..okay

[jolly mortar]

Probably the logo of Ancient Giants, we know that on Punk Hazard they experimented on Kaido and King. Kaido is some sort of ancient giant hybrid

[naive wolf]

ooo is diff, then what the skull refers on punk hazard? does it have a clear meaning, it seems like onigashima skull, then it is true the theory that Kaido when leaving wg captiveness, he just flew the center of punk hazard with his dragon clouds and move all the way to wano, and that is why there is a hole in the middle of punk hazard actually

[ashen surge]

What, Onigashima is a construction that Kaido had built

I think Will of D is somehow related to the Ancient Kingdom of Void Century, don't really know how so I'm going to keep my Will of the :D -theory

[jolly mortar]

That is not true, there are many theories that it's the leftovers of an ancient giant that made Wano kuni. Ancient giants are also called Continent Pullers and Wano consists of several small islands. When the ancient giant pulled Onigashima he died on it. (THEORY) Kaido only built the interior

[charred river]

It could work, using the zoan properties while turning off his fire thus becoming much faster

[ashen surge]

Just generaly danger?

[charred river]

A fast hunt wolf that freezes his enemies and turning to his normal form with deadly flames. Plus with the hybrid form he won’t lose durability. I think its more likely he got it for king due to him being his right hand man and first mate

[ashen surge]

Only Oars was called continent puller so the argument for "giants build the world" is pure headcanon. The Skull Dome at Onigashima is a rock formation that probably looked something like a skull and was then carved into looking like a skull

[naive wolf]

i was looking up for the scene when Marco says: "oh, so that is how they call this island now", i just trying back up a popular idea, Kaido was using by experimentation and that is where he frees King (dunno if it's confirmed if they were actually on punkhazrd) and also, aren't there anothers signs to express the warning than a skull heck similar to the actual island on wano

[ashen surge]

When Kaido arrived to Wano, the Onigashima island was alrady there and it was deserted

The hole in Punk Hazard is probably due to Akainus and Aokijis fight

[charred river]

King beast form if he had the inu inu no mi? With the addition of wings. I think he would use it much more then his current fruit

[naive wolf]

onigashima being a deserted island... which evidence are there for that?

[naive wolf]

it is flipping kewl, i personally think King is Kaido's fav one to give that power (if he really ain't felt love for Yamato at all which i doubt it tbh) or maybe Jack, because the way he confort him after lost against sulon neko and inu; "you aint weak, they are just too strong", somethinh like that. But this debate can be senseless if we take in consideration that zoan df chose their own user

[ashen surge]

Because the plan to get the blueprints of Skull Dome was literally part of the plot for the raid of Onigashima? Franky was Minatomos apprentice for that very reason

[charred river]

King is kaido right hand man so most likely it was meant for king

[naive wolf]

yes you right, but that doesn't totally clear up the origin of the island imo, just his architecture being planned by kaido during wano's invation, i may have to reread those chaps, cause i don't remember how long ago it was stated those building were constructed, maybe Oden could mention somethinh about "the island who was brought away i didn't know about" like refering their sudden aparition, i think is still open but you may right about Onigashima being just an island close to wano all along

[ashen surge]

There's zero indication in the story that Onigashima is some weird island that was suddenly carried there. Islands don't work like that. There's no water under Islands, you do know that right?

[wheat quest]

Black bear is 3 peopl

[waxen prawn]

there's zero indication that it was a weird island. But there has been big indications by big characters related to wano that noticed and said something about onigashima. Yasuie, marco, nekomamushi

[ashen surge]

Noticed exactly what?

[naive wolf]

if Kaido grabs the island onto the sky right now, it is plausible he did it on the past too, my headcannon is that when he liberated king and going to leave the place where wg was experimenting with him (again punkhazard is a posibility since the hole on the middle match perfectly with the circular shape of onigashima and this similar sign on it), he just literally tear off a big land and carry on his clouds to near wano. we dunno for sure why kaido thinks wano is "special", but my guess about the oni-island, it may be fore some heritage kaido wanted to posses. Like on real like, there is an ancient aztec penacho (monctezuma's headdress) on Vienna that mexican people want to carry back to Mexico bec they say that piece belongs to their land. Similar it may be if the giant onigashima skull was meant to be possesed by oni-tribe, but rather was WG territory until Kaido snatch it away

[abstract pond]

Isn't stated in One Piece that Oars(or an ancestor of him) was called the continent puller because he literally moved islands?

[naive wolf]

there is also, and various one piece theories state that the oni-race (kaido's kin) is related strong with Oars people somehow

[pure raven]

I don’t think it can be punkhazard the hole is explained to be a result of the Aokiji and Akainu fight

!punkhazard

[lone hedge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/164971940648321024/795015111625801728/hdgmrphiqgm11.png%3Fwidth%3D1095%26height%3D227

[ashen surge]

That’s it

And. The legend says Oars was so fearsome he was able to conquer whole islands as a whole, not that he literally moved islands by his hands

[lone oak]

I believe oars/his ancestors might have been one of the joyboy's nakama

[abstract pond]

The phrasing it's a little odd there. Sounds more like he literally took the islands of the nations he conquered.
Maybe there was a little loss of meaning in the translation? It happens sometimes

[mental juniper]

Oh, just realized. If act 3 will end in a tragedy it might even be Kaido's flashback and his defeat. Considering how much Kaido's character has been developed and the sad tone he has to him. People probably already considered this but I am kinda slow and just thought of this now

[ashen spindle]

Sounds legit especially that Big Mom had some flashbacks as well

[gaunt chasm]

Hi guys I come here to explain a Theory that I have. The problem is that I don't have a really deep knowledge of the manga so I'm not sure if there are some facts that are going against it that I might not remember. That's why I come to get your opinions.

Gol D Roger is Luffy.

I believe at some point near the end Luffy will be teleported back in time, (with or against his will that I'm not sur yet). It will all be before he reaches the final step of his journey. Back in the past and knowing everything that would happen in the future, his new goal would be to set up the way for an other pirate to reach one piece and complete his dream. This pirate is most likely to be Shanks. Hence the very deep but mysterious connection between Gold Roger Shanks and Luffy.

Points that back up the theory :
1/ Luffy and gold Roger are really alike in term of dreams, behaviour.
2/ In Rayleigh flashback, Roger looks exactly like Luffy.
3/ Roger is dying that could be a side effect of using Hito Hito no mi power.
4/ The Straw Hat would be a time paradox item, it has only be given through time but doesn't have a real origin
5/ Ace is actually Luffy's son that would explain why they look alike even tho there are not real brothers. It would also deepen the meaning of Ace's death when you look back at it.
6/ There is a devil fruit capable of sending people to the future, why not an other sending people to the past ?
7/ Gol D Roger and Raiyleigh seems to know way too many things.

Points that don't back up the theory :
1/ Roger doesn't have any of Luffy's scars
2/ That's a bit fucked up 😋

Let me know your thoughts on that !

[timid steppe]

no god pls no

[gaunt chasm]

Please elaborate so I can fill in the 2nd list !

[simple parrot]

Nothing adds up

[haughty wharf]

**** is a *****?

What if Nika is a Djinn?

​

https://preview.redd.it/acjtext81pr81.png?width=1899&format=png&auto=webp&s=766c2eed982676ae82840cbf2cd72b637b4845cf

​

https://preview.redd.it/v8e5b6kb1pr81.png?width=1199&format=png&auto=webp&s=5f6f22a7a194601c55abd361bebc4804ab65513e

"Many scholars regard their existence and ability to enter human bodies" (Devil Fruit?)

it counts as a mythological creature.

there's this movie called Aladdin, and there's a Djinn there too: "the Genie serves as comic relief in each of his appearances. He is shown to have unlimited shapeshifting abilities, which allow for many and varied sight gags; however, he is unable to kill anyone, make anyone fall in love, fully revive the dead, or provide additional wishes. The Genie's supernatural abilities permit him to break the fourth wall, as well as parody real-life people and popular culture completely beyond the boundaries of his native universe." (from Wikipedia)

https://preview.redd.it/79rx326p2pr81.png?width=1648&format=png&auto=webp&s=bba1053b4e291868fd100e73ee2c0252b2640076

So what do u think?

[lone oak]

A confirmed fact is that hito hito no mi is a mythical zoan fruit, And the time control abilities sounds like a paramecia type to me, And the only person who could travel time known so as is toki. who came from the past, Not even roger's era. she came from the void century. i doubt a devil fruit would have same abilities specially a fruit with a ability of time travel. And if we say that, Wouldn't that mean roger has a devil fruit?

[gaunt chasm]

I never said it would be Luffy ability to do so, nor Toki. Just saying that such a fruit could exist cause it does for porting people in the future.
Are we sure Gold Roger doesn't have any fruit ?

[charred river]

What if the darkness darkness fruit isn’t really a logia?

[gaunt chasm]

What about mythical Zoan of the devil

[lone oak]

A fruit with time travelling abilities could exist. However, If it can teleport people against it's will, It would be a problem. Either later on luffy would want to travel back to the world, But it doesn't really add up. My theory says that in the ponegliff it was written that a guy would come to change the whole world as the new joyboy. And that person is luffy, So roger might be waiting for them, Also roger might have made changes in ponegliff to confirm that luffy is that person. idk really know what to say about it.

[abstract pond]

It would feel cheap if suddenly more fruits aren't what we were told. One is good, an exception. But more it starts feeling wrong.

[rugged sand]

I think 1046 we'll see the akazaya 9 (those who are awake) implement their final plan...

[charred river]

I could see his fruit being more of a kame kame no mi model: Genbu

[gaunt chasm]

I'm not sure to get your point, gold Roger could very well know he is joyboy him self but still set up the path for everything that had to come. It is said they had the same ability to gather people around them so it's going in the direction of them sharing the same fruit

[safe ruin]

i think roger eaten devil fruit but oda didn't reveal it yet.

did anyone notice what's a devil fruit awakening power's yet? i notice and remember something along the way.

[lime stirrup]

Totally agreed, the Luffy fruit blew everyone out of the water and totally felt like a cool surprise. If it became a pattern, it wouldn't be as fun

[split glacier]

People really want every other fruit to be Mythical Zoan now...

[ripe geyser]

What makes you think this? I’m thinking we get more Luffy vs Kaido

[cerulean trout]

Lufy is 2 years younger than ace

[pure raven]

i'm sorry but rather than calling it a fully theory, that part is fan fiction

[timid niche]

Is sabo dead ?

[pure raven]

we don't know yet. it's either he is captured, missing in action or died for now but i doubt oda would kill him off screen

[gaunt chasm]

Man come on if you wanna blow my theory, get some good arguments. Doesn't matter if Aces is older than Luffy in case of time travel 🙂

All I see is people aren't happy about it but no one made a point to disprove it yet

[ashen surge]

Here’s a blow to your theory: nothing in the manga has ever indicated anything about time traveling to the past and we are in the assumption that Roger didn’t have a df. What you’re proposing would create an infinite time loop as well.

[gaunt chasm]

But time travelling in the future yes so we know it's not completely off the table.
For Roger's DF as you said it's an assumption never confirmed. We know he shares luffys ability to gather people around him.
Infinite time loop only for the hat, which is a famous time paradox. It's is called the bootstrap paradox and it seems legit any time travel theory would have theirs

[ashen surge]

With your logic it's not completely off the table that the world of One Piece is the same as the one in Wind Waker. Both have lots of islands and seafaring

[tawdry bramble]

The world government lied about eating two devil fruits killing you so that people don’t gain too much power.

[ashen surge]

That's a pretty thin lie that can be easily tested

[tawdry bramble]

Most people won’t risk killings themselves to test a theory

[warm fern]

Dumb theory: enma is a sword that ate a mythical df (model grim reaper idk) ala funkfreed

[haughty shale]

they could try it on death row inmates while cuffing them with seastone, government definetly knows how to retrieve both fruits when the host is killed
besides, i don't think they would rely misinformation to CP9 since lucci explained to jabra that the death only occurs when you eat two fruits(about 2 fruits killing you)

[lime stirrup]

yeah i mean in that case higher ups in the navy would each have multiple fruits

[lunar shell]

I'd say its better if Oda focus on the aspect of sword curse, rather than giving on of them a df

[abstract pond]

Maybe the fact that nobody that knew Roger recognised him. Like Garp for example.

[rotund ibex]

When the time comes for the final war, of all characters Buggy and Usopp are going to be in a situation where they team up: The two memetic "Gods" of One Piece.
Exploding Star has been the cornerstone of Usopp's arsenal since day one and is arguably his signature move
Buggy despite constantly blundering his way to success by pure chance and dumb luck has consistently proven time and time again that the one thing he's consistently good at is making explosives.
Muggy Ball + Usopp's marksmanship = A deadly combo

[late token]

Also Roger is a sword fighter. Luffy isn’t

[lime stirrup]

this is 100% going to happen

[gaunt chasm]

This point is actually supporting the theory. Characters who both knew Roger and met Luffy always mentionned how strong the ressemblance was between the 2 of them (rayileugh, Shanks, Whitebeard,...). They would not be able to recognize Luffy in Roger as Luffy was not born yet, they would only be able to sense some of Roger aura in Luffy

[gaunt chasm]

Luffy mentionned 2 or 3 times that he would love to become a swordsman

[compact fox]

This is a pretty cool theory and it has a good selling point to it but I feel like the whole time paradox biz will overall devalue the story idk

[errant nova]

Not hating but awful theory lol. Awesome that one piece can invoke all these diff trains of thought, that one just isn’t it

[lime stirrup]

it's lame and is super tropey

[abstract pond]

It's not supporting your theory. Nobody recognised him.
They compare Roger and Luffy for their personality and dreams.
And Rayleigh for example met Roger when he was young. Isn't weird that nobody ever saw Luffy and thought he looked like Roger?

[compact fox]

[lime stirrup]

Also, Roger says that his son will find the one piece, If he were Luffy, he'd know Ace dies

[gaunt chasm]

Well he didn't say it but they do really look alike from the flash back

[compact fox]

I feel like people take that line outta context too much He was hopeful of that and said it in a joking tone.

[lime stirrup]

Okay, but if he were Luffy he couldn't have hope of that because he'd know Ace dies. Also, there's 0 chance Luffy would even joke about that considering how he feels about Ace's death

[gaunt chasm]

What if he meant Shanks

[tacit zephyr]

actually really cool theory. also roger says to reyleigh 'i think we were destined to meet, rayleigh', even if not roger = luffy maybe there is a time/space connection

[compact fox]

Oh I’m not tryna defend the theory btw I’m just stating that that line I feel is misconstrued a lot for how little it really impacts the funny pirate tale yknow?

[lime stirrup]

Ohhh okay, yeah I don't know how else people use that line. Just saying I think it's another hole in that theory

[compact fox]

Yes yes, I hear it used in theories often as a foreshadowing line some how instead of it really just being a joke roger told and I find it odd. As stated by that Buci guy it is interesting how bended theories can turn out in the community thanks to the story.

[lime stirrup]

ohhh yeah nah I think it's kind of a throwaway joke line

[abstract pond]

Not to anyone who ever met Roger.

Wait, aren't you the guy who comes with a strange theory from time to time, ignore everything against it and disappear until the next account?
You talk like it.

[gaunt chasm]

Whats up with the hate ?

[abstract pond]

I'm not hating...

[compact fox]

That’s actually pretty funny

[gaunt chasm]

I understand why they disappear if they are received this way

[errant walrus]

I have a feeling Luffy and Zorro will be in a Coma after this

Momo keeps emphasizing how his voice disappears

when he wakes up. whatever shocking news involving Sabo will be the next main focus for conflict

[modest skiff]

I think a lot of this theory relies on Luffy and Roger look really alike, but in the attached image, they don’t really. They are just wearing the same hat, smiling, and have the same skin tone. And as you pointed out, at this age, he doesn’t have scars. In the older drawings of Luffy provided by Oda, he doesn’t look like Roger and he still has his scars.

(2) simply isn’t true

(3) is not remotely supported by anything and just a shot in the dark. You could say he died from his mustache and we’d also have no argument against it. Asking people to prove a negative does not mean the theory is good

(4) same as 3

(5) it feels like look alike is again just hair

(6) we have already been told nothing can go to the past

(7) know too many things? And that means Roger is Luffy?

You are getting defensive about people saying the theory is bad but you really have not built a solid case. This channel is intended for serious discussion where people can freely post and critique. Since some of your points have very little effort, people are putting very little effort into the critique. Since I am still drinking my morning coffee I wanted to comment in detail what I think caused many others to quickly dismiss the theory.

Don’t take the criticism as discouragement. Read some of the pinned theories and learn from how others piece together their logic. Continue to participate in the channel and grow with us

[steady prism]

3/ Roger is dying that could be a side effect of using Hito Hito no mi power.
I don’t think we’ve ever seen a df having “side effects” that alter time. Nor do we know of any reason why the Sun God would need to have time altering powers. Also, if that’s true, why didn’t Roger immediately know that Wano and Zou had road poneglyphs? Why didn’t he know that there’s a red Poneglyph at FMI? If Luffy was Roger, I’d be confused and disappointed to why it took him so long to figure out “oh we need red poneglyphs”. Plus, Luffy isn’t the patient calculating type that would play “the long con”.

4/ The Straw Hat would be a time paradox item, it has only be given through time but doesn't have a real origin
Then how do you explain the frozen straw hat at Mariejois? The straw hat imo definitely symbolizes “something” and has an origin to the ancient kingdom given how closely Imu has kept it a secret

5/ Ace is actually Luffy's son that would explain why they look alike even tho there are not real brothers. It would also deepen the meaning of Ace's death when you look back at it.
Imo all they have in common is hair color and eyes, which are both are black. There isn’t “something special” that they have in common.

6/ There is a devil fruit capable of sending people to the future, why not an other sending people to the past ?
Imo, Oda purposely made sure that the Time-Time fruit, the df that is named after its ability to control time, to only travel “forward” in time so that OP doesn’t become a time-travel story and lead to changes in the timeline.

7/ Gol D Roger and Raiyleigh seems to know way too many things.
Yes, they do. They reached Laugh Tale. They learned the truth of the void century. It makes sense that they know a lot on purpose.

The fact that Toki time traveled into the future has already spun up a bunch of crazy time-travel theories. Idk if OP needs Luffy to travel back in time as well. Anyway, hope this makes sense.

[neon vessel]

hahaha what if the one piece was a book

[pure raven]

would a book make roger laughs?

[neon vessel]

the story inside it might

[modest skiff]

!theories

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[pure raven]

I'm not sure if that's enough but nice assumption better than an expired bottle of sake. but tbh in my perspective, one piece is a "last" poneglyph which tells who joyboy is and what kind of person he is

[neon vessel]

what if the poneglyph pointed to a pop up book that had joyboy doing a funny face that's why it's funny

[pure raven]

is that a joke? cuz we don't do that here

[neon vessel]

no I'm serious

[pure raven]

doesn't sounds like it. anyway end of discussion

[neon vessel]

what if dragon is connected to the sea devils that made devil fruits

[modest skiff]

Bogart, please read the Koya message above. Low effort “what ifs” are a better fit for #manga

[gentle lily]

So this is really funny, I was just thinking about Roger and his straw hat. Heres something thats really interesting, if we assume that like Shanks and Luffy, Roger always wore his hat, we could know that he gave shanks or someone else the hat 38 years ago during God Valley cause he is seen wearing a captains hat in it

[modest skiff]

So that means at one point Roger stopped wearing the straw hat, but held on to it, waiting to give it to someone

[ashen surge]

Isn't it the same hat, Roger, Shanks and Luffy?

[modest skiff]

Yeah

[terse fog]

I do think the straw hat symbolizes something, and it is harder to pin point what it symbolizes based on there being another straw hat that seems to be frozen at the holy land of Mariejois. Also Why would a hat need to be frozen even if it is stored for 800 years I don’t think freezing it would help preserve it at least if it is by itself in the freezer but we don’t know if it is or not. I think the straw hat could mean passing on of a will possibly that you choose the receiver but I doubt this because there really is not any solid evidence and reasoning for this but I don’t know what else it could be ? Such as how ace’s and oden’s and roger’s will seemed to be passed down. Another thing is it would be a symbol of promise which is more likely such as how zoro made a promise to his sword, making luffy having a promise to shanks, and possibly shanks making a promise to roger and once that promise is compete you can return the hat and maybe that is also why luffy took off his hat to keep his promise on hold. And when shanks gave luffy his hat was him completing the promise to roger that shanks made, which was probably to fine a successor, which also could be what shanks was talking to roger about that we did not know was said but I believe he already had the hat at that point so probably not at that moment

I think it is most likely the symbol of a promise which I do actually think shanks had said that hat resembled that when he said that at romance dawn. I had just remembered that when I was writing this

[ashen surge]

Or the followers of Sun God Nika donned straw hats as a symbol because it's a hat you in a sunny weather. Straw Hat symbolizes freedom to everyone

[naive wolf]

some people says that this is an upside down strawhat, drawn on the moon, if that so, how does it connect with god Nika and the promise system? :o

[formal bridge]

Btw is moon related to nika too do they need to go to moon to for robin to see this

[ashen surge]

which chapter is this

[naive wolf]

470 during Enel mini story

[modest skiff]

I think the straw hat represents dawn. When a sun comes up across an ocean, the red strap across the bottom of the hat is present on the ocean in that kinda reflection part. Then the yellow on the hat is the actual sun itself.

[terse fog]

Those are fairs points for both of those and I do think it still probably has a symbol that is probably more in depth that just a promise but probably is still related to a promise. I feel like it has to be one of the most important lore mysteries but it is really hard to even develop theories for it because there are so many variables it seems with so little information. I do like the idea especially of it relating to the dawn based on the fact it used on sunny days and the straw hats ship being named the thousand sunny and this also leaves the option relating to the sun god Nika part and even possibly that relation to the cover story on 470 of Enel. But also what is the dawn of the world, the removal of the world government? I do think it has something to do with this but that just seems like not enough such as what happens after the removal of the world government? The ancient kingdom revival? A new kingdom? The seas becoming one (this is from a well known theory that was made in 2013 I think)? This also could relate to the ancient weapons specifically Uranus (being the god of the heavens in Greek mythology which also could mean the sun) the only thing that contradicts this is the fact that some things are called like gods such as lunarions or celestial dragons (and the leader of these could be called Uranus since he was the god of the heavens so like the leader of the celestial dragons such as Imu? Possibly?) I doubt this though since Uranus was not the leader of the Greek gods.

[primal cargo]

You only need a straw hat when it's sunny. The hat is the promise that the sun will come ?

[naive wolf]

could it be that the upside down straw hat means the reverse of the idea of the dawn, and maybe on Enel's story Oda is telling us how the ancient kingdom befall

i had a theory about how Enel's ministory means the exact opposite of what may happen onon void century, like Enel is a god from Earth, go to the moon, find some fallen warriors, the oppressors try to attack to the god and god defeats them easily, so why if somethinh similar happened from a moon's gos coming from above to calm under down, i try to laborate maybe something later...

[terse fog]

Also as I was searching about if Uranus was the leader of the Greek gods (Zeus is FYI). Also in Greek mythology plays a huge part in one piece especially the order of Greek mythology taking place such as gods being born and different periods such as “chaos”. Which goes Phanes (order), chaos (void, representing the void century in one piece and most likely was chaos since the war between the ancient kingdom and the presumed world government took place during this time) thalassa (sea, this one does not make sense but maybe more so the creations of devil fruits but I can’t say) Gaia (earth, another one that does not make sense unless life came from the moon in the first place) Uranus (sky, the creation of that ancient weapon maybe but this was most likely during the void century not after which does not make sense) I am not saying it has to be in this order but probably is related possibly but probably not of the order but the Greek aspect of chaos (void) probably relates to the void century

I am taking a lot of guesses there but I do know for sure the void century relates to the period in Greek mythology known as chaos and the fact that one piece relates to Greek mythology way more than most people think which we know it does but even more so than we think. Also the event of the gods overthrowing the Titans also is probably related such as the Titans being the world government and the other gods such as sun god Nika over throw them. And that could relate to the dawn of the world. I am kinda just venting out ideas here without too much thought, so I am sorry if there is a lot of text here

[naive wolf]

yoo oden's story is too similar to Hercules in some many aspects

[ashen surge]

Uranus is the sky itself, much bigger thing than a puny god

[edgy viper]

I'm gonna put out a little theory on the potential significance of the Shandian gods. Gonna be a handful of posts

Decoding Nika and the Gods of Shandora

The Skypiea Arc has always been a microcosm of One Piece as a whole. With the reveal of Luffy's fruit being model „Sun God“ Nika, it's worth revisiting the beliefs of the Shandians. Kudos to @primal cargo for contributing.

In chapter 287 we get acquainted with the four primarily revered deities: a sun god, a rain god, a forest god and an earth god. First of all, we need to establish the inspiration for Shandora and these alleged gods.

If only we had a clear reference to a real-world culture somewhere in the ruins of Shandora... what's that, we do? The “ancient text“ Robin finds in chapter 264 is actual Ancient Mayan glyphs? That's... tangible evidence in manga?!

Upon comparison, we find that these are indeed Mayan glyphs and that Oda littered virtually all of Shandora with them. If that isn't sufficient proof to you, consider the following: Mayan glyphs are the only mesoamerican language that is deciphered to a reasonable degree. The glyphs of the Olmecs, Aztecs , etc. are still a mystery to us.
And wouldn't you know it, Ancient Mayan writing is actually similar in structure to modern Japanese writing, as both are considered logosyllabic. But that's the deepest we're going into linguistics.

On to the Mayan pantheon. Quite handily, there is an alphabet of Mayan gods. Seriously. For the longest time, scholars could only refer to Mayan gods as God A, God B, etc. simply because they couldn't decipher their name glyphs.
And wouldn't you know it, three of the four Shandian gods are among the first four letter gods. Now that's intriguing. I want to propose that these four gods correspond to four central figures in the OP-verse, seeing how Luffy obviously corresponds to the Sun God. But alas, there's a fifth!

OP Sun God = God D / Itzamna = Luffy & previous Joyboy

Itzamna is the highest creator deity in the Mayan pantheon. Kinich Ahau, technically the most revered Mayan sun god, is an aspect of Itzamna, making the latter the top solar deity by proxy. Itzamna is revered as a culture hero that brought the people medicine, science, large-scale agriculture, calendars and writing. The last one is especially curious, as it may hint directly to the creation of the poneglyph script.

Sounds a lot like Joyboy, doesn't it? Keep in mind that Itzamna had a wife called Ixchel. She will be very important later on.

OP Rain God = God B / Chaac = Dragon

He's the Mayan rain god and rainbringer. Chaac, sometimes brother of Kinich Ahau, also god of lightning and storms, is a good guy. He first introduced humans to farming and will always bring enough rain to make for a proper harvest, but never so much that it causes a destructive flood.

Interestingly enough, Chaac was accoompanied by four deities called the Bacabs or Chacs that each held up a cardinal direction of the sky. This resembles the four officers of the Revolutionary Army with Oda taking artistic liberty and adding the fifth cardinal direction (the Grandline officer) as a nod to his own cultural background.

OP Earth God = God A / Cizin = Blackbeard

In Mayan mythology, Chaac has a stalker. Where he goes to bring rain and plant trees, Cizin follows him to uproot said trees again. Cizin is the primary god of death, lord of the underworld and god of earthquakes. This fits Blackbeard so perfectly that I believe we can excuse the discrepancy between an Earth God and an Earthquake God.

Additional features that tie Cizin to Blackbeard are the fact that both are regularly depicted with an incomplete set of teeth as well as the number ten. Cizin is considered patron of the number ten while Blackbeard's fleet sports the Ten Titanic Captains. Moreover, Cizin is associated with owls and dogs as these are animals of the underworld. These reflect in Lafitte with his owl-like wings and the ability to hypnotize people and Devon's Inu Inu no Mi.

OP Forest God = Yum Kaax = Yamato (?)

The Forest God has me scratching my head. Yum Kaax is the god of hunters, wild vegetation and animals and one of the most important deities of the Maya pre-Europeans. Sometimes he's regarded a sorcerer, some accounts mention his youthful appearance. Some say he's the son of Itzamna and Ixchel.

My best guess at this point is that it's Yamato, considering the Okuchi-no-Makami is the only Mythological Zoan so far to sport the same vapor ribbon (called „Tenne“) Luffy does. This ribbon is a common motif around Japanese Buddhist deities (Bodhisattva and Myō-ō). It originates from the Indian “Flying Apsaras“, celestial musicians, that are called “Hiten“ in Japan.

At this point, only Nika and the Makami have been likened to a deity in-series by the Gorosei, Kaido and this ribbon respectively. Moreover, the Makami is closely associated with forests as seen in the story of Yamato Takeru. The fact, however, that Yamato for all we know is not a member of the D clan throws me off quite a bit. I'm still suspecting that there's another Jaguar D. somewhere out there, but that's a can of worms for another day.

The Secret Moon Goddess: Imu

Remember Itzamna's wife Ixchel that I mentioned earlier? Imu is inspired by Ixchel. Ixchel, goddess of childbirth, has been regarded as a moon goddess for the longest time. In the Dresden Codex, she is also a rain deity that empties her jar to bring a flood upon the world. Another description has her as a withered woman capable of destoying the earth. She is thus depicted in quite the contrast to her perpetually benevolent husband Itzamna.

Now let's talk theory. I genuinely believe that Imu is not as inherently evil as characters like Orochi or Blackbeard and comes with a much more nuanced background. I want to suggest that, in some befitting circumstance, Imu „sacrificed“ her husband Joyboy in a desperate effort to contain the predecessor of Blackbeard, offering the 20 Kingdoms a Faustian Bargain in the process: The domain of the former „gods“, elevated from all other living beings, and virtual omnipotence in exchange for making her the dea prima, the first goddess among the selfproclaimed new gods, that quietly maintains the balance between the powers.

In the end, Imu's story may be that of a broken woman who couldn't but see her own husband die and bear the weight of her sin for centuries, all alone and removed from the world in a flowery dungeon. Thus she reminisces over the only item that reminds her of her long gone love: a straw hat.

All that said, the deities we just discussed are represented by the four people that will ultimately challenge Imu and her supremacy over the (Empty) Throne. We could also discuss what the inspirations we've established mean in terms of further god-like Devil Fruits but I'll save that for another day.

That's it, thanks for your patience.

[stark spindle]

Wait you think imus husband was joyboy

[naive wolf]

@edgy viper it is great theory , yet i have to doubt about the forest god, yamato feels a bit weak if i may to say ; i was thinking about this and find out that more mythologies represents this god as a deer-like (Chopper's?), but not going to lie, as first read of the Yum Kaax description you gave, i first thought about Ussop, i dunno why (sorcerer: big lier?) also Ussop's post time skip attacks are veggie related

[ashen surge]

Wdym Orochi is evil

[vestal orbit]

nice people don't kill people but orochi has a sword meaning he does kill people 😨

[stark spindle]

What is with this 1 min difference between typing. But anyway.

Theory: Uranus is a Lunarian

-The 3 ancient weapons were owned by the ancient kingdom. We know pluton is a ship and we know poseidon is shirahoshi.
-I strongly believe that Uranus like poseidon is a person. The fishman and lunarian contrast is extremely apparent and oda has made this too obvious.
-Fishman control water. Lunarians control fire. Fishman live directly below red line, lunarians live directly above red line.
-Fishmam are sea. Lunarians are sky. Uranus is sky Poseidon is sea.
-I believe the fishman and lunarians were at war for a long time. And this war was ultimately stopped by joyboy in a similar manner to the way shanks stopped marineford.
-The ancient weapon is the fishman princess. I believe -Uranus was the lunarian Prince of the void century.
-Shirahoshi can control the sea Kings Kings whim.
I believe Uranus grants the user the ability to control the sky Kings.
-Now your probably wondering what sky Kings exist in one piece. I strongly believe that oda has hinted that this ability allows the user to control a giant roc bird.
-The mythos of the roc says it was so huge It could carry ELEPHANTS in its talons.

Luffys gear 3 punch with armament is ELEPHANT gun

Luffys gear 3 punch with conquerors is ROC gun

This is odas way of saying that the roc is stronger than the elephant. A roc stronger than zunesha.

Shirahoshi also means White star. The idea of the colour white could suggest purity or innocence.

I'm not saying the ancient weapon Uranus will be named Kurohoshi. But Uranus may embody a black star.

[edgy viper]

The forest god is definetly the one that has me wondering the most. There's not really a lot of original material to go by.
I don't think it's Chopper, that's too much Ghibli. But Usopp is actually a thought worth thinking, interesting.

[stark spindle]

Uranus is a person descended from the lunarian royalty.
Poseidon is a person descended from the fishman royalty

[edgy viper]

There's other ideas on the table, but I do like this one very much, yes

[naive wolf]

tag me if you elaborate something about ussop i catch it later, gotta go, good vibes everybody

[stark spindle]

Read my theory aswell though

[naive wolf]

it is worth reading too

[stark spindle]

Uranus and poseidon contrast is the same as the lunarian and fishman contrast.

The ancient weapon Uranus allows the user to control a giant roc bird that dwarves even zunesha.

The characteristics of shirahoshi are the opposite of uranus

[sturdy hound]

I like the idea of imu living as the one true god, that kind of self proclamation fits in with sitting on the empty throne.
I just don’t see how the basis for your theory support that.

My main issue is using Yamato and luffy’s tenne and linking Yamato to another god arbitrarily.
Wano has “gods” as a major theme. Examples start with tama’s pet komachiyo, who’s just a komainu, a guardian lion-dog that can be seen irl in front of Shinto shrines in Japan.
We can also see it in onimaru, who has a mythical fruit and is protecting the bridge. Foxes are sacred protectors of shrines in Japan.
Even kaido is viewed as the guardian deity of wano by its citizens, mostly due to his dragon form which he might have intentionally utilized to fool them into thinking that. The actual word oda used to describe kaido as the wano citizens see him is “myoo”. Kaido even has the name of a myoo in his attack, gosenzei ragnaraku, and put the word “myoo” on the tori gate on the way to onigashima.

Finally we have luffy, who fits into this whole theme in two ways, just like the previous examples.

1. Wano is based on feudal Japan where yokai and gods are prominent, hence why brook masqueraded as a yokai, and nd the red scabbards are known as ghosts or shadows.
2. The raid is ending up as a “battle of the gods” so to speak. The citizens of wano pray to the gods to save them in the fire festival, and luffy and Yamato - our gods here - are fighting the malevolent god, kaido. Just like people used to pray to nika as ww explained.

Tl;dr the matter of the gods here is a thematic choice by oda rather than foreshadowing.
Although it can fit if we view imu as a god, which oda certainly does since imu in Japanese イム looks like the kanji for Buddha 仏. But again, it is more thematically relevant since imu sits on the throne where no one should, and rules the entire world like a god would do. Not too far off from what enel did

You have some interesting ideas but I think they’re fit more for a thematic analysis rather than a theory imo.

[primal cargo]

It feels like an attempt to fill a blank with what we have, whereas the answer is probably something we don't have
Even following your idea that Imu was a wife who lost her husband, it doesn't have to be Joyboy does it

[primal cargo]

Even kaido is viewed as the guardian deity of wano by its citizens, mostly due to his dragon form which he might have intentionally utilized to fool them into thinking that. The actual word oda used to describe kaido as the wano citizens see him is “myoo”.
I don't remember the people calling Kaido their guardian deity, when was that ?

[stark spindle]

Imu is based of athena right. Doesn't mean she has some kind of virginity beliefs.

She is based of athena as she wields the shield aegis as her main source of protection

The aegis shield in Greek mythos was used by athen and zeus

[terse fog]

Did you read my theory from a while ago but not too far back it is also related to this? Just curious if that is included of what you are mentioning. Also sorry to reply/ping to that message

[sturdy hound]

act 1

the actual japanese term there is myoo, viz went with deity

[sturdy hound]

no i dont thinki have read it. i dont frequent this channel

got a link?

[terse fog]

It was more of a rant of notes but one second let me get it. Also you don’t have to scroll much at all. It starts here #manga-theories message

Like I said not so much a theory but a note of things that I came across that I thought that could be relevant and was writing them in the channel to possibly go more in depth on them

[sturdy hound]

the hat is def a symbol of joyboy for me at this point. we dont know where roger got it from but it seems to be relevant not just because shanks told luffy to return it, but because of the giant possibly frozen hat imu has, and bc sharly prophesied that someone wearing a straw hat will destroy fmi.

im leaning into the idea of there being multiple straw hats in imu's possession rn. mainly bc the gorosei said that they have tried to capture the nika nika fruit for the past 800 years to no avail, and that it hasnt awakened. so perhaps those slots where the giant hat was stored house more hats worn by previous joyboy candidates.
so yes, it is probably some sort of symbol of threat to the wg and hope for the opposition. a trademark of joyboy

i havent given this much thought so i dont have much to back it up, safe to call it pure speculation.

i dont think it's the same type of symbolism as deities in wano tho. not sure how to describe it but i guess the symbolism in wano is much more elaborate as of now. while we're left guessing about the hat and joyboy

if that makes sense

[terse fog]

See why would there be multiple joy boy candidates? For example zuneash has not heard the drums of liberation in 800 years which represents joy boy. The other thing is roger would probably be considered a candidate then but he definitely would of succeeded if he was but he wasn’t after all he said he was 20 years too early meaning that is determined when joy boy will come back or a new joy boy arrives meaning there never were precious candidates

[neon vessel]

if dragon is loosely based on the hindu god Vayu then who would be indra?

[sturdy hound]

roger was definitely a candidate in my eyes. he had everything ready except that he was too early (as you can see in the first ss).
he didnt have the fruit as far as we know, but that doesnt matter much bc he could have looked for it after learning the truth on laugh tale. the thing that stopped him was his illness, you can say that fate didnt want roger to be the one.

another thing that makes him a candidate in my eyes is the second ss. wb calls him a little boy, which suggests to me that his idea was so wild, carefree, innocent, and brought laughter to wb's face. all characteristics luffy - and by extension nika, and potentially joyboy - have.
same for what oden says, it is reminiscent of mihawk saying luffy has the power to attract others to himself. i feel like that's smth mihawk observed in roger im some capacity, or maybe heard about it from shanks.

as for the prophecy and luffy being the only true joyboy, it doesnt invalidate the existence of candidates before him.
those candidates would just be the ones carrying out the will of joyboy through the 800 yrs until luffy, shirahoshi, and other instrumental figures are born.
just look at roger, he started the great age of piracy which set the world in motion, and he was shanks' captain and an indirect reason for luffy wanting to become a pirate, and shanks entrusting the hat to him and wagering his left arm on his success.
everyone plays a part in fulfilling the prophecy, be it intentionally or not.
even oden telling toki to read the torn pages and send the scabbards 20 years into the future, it lead to luffy meeting kinemon and having more of a reason to go to wano, and yamato loving him and joining the fight.
it is all fated, but everyone plays a part and has their own agency that all culminate in the dawn of the world.

[weary tendon]

I have a theory that just like luffy got recently defeated by cp0 interfering kaido will ultimately be defeated unfairly and then die before the great war which was what he wanted to experience to die a glorious death

[neon oracle]

Let me fix your theory Kaido will be defeated he wont die, no one dies it's one piece.

[opaque ember]

Luffy might be on the autism spectrum Sarcasm goes over his head and he constantly miss interprets when people imply things instead if saying them normally people around luffy misinterpret his goofy personality and wild imagination as him having a low iq And iq is you ability to learn and adapt and luffy learns as fast as goku So luffy actually has a high iq
he littarly learned all 3 forms of haki before the lessons where over and got all v2 of haki with low amounts of training or none for conquers i think luffy is at least 140 iq but just misunderstood

[neon oracle]

People might say this is a meme but if you do research on autism spectrum it lines up with luffy's character so I would also go as far as to agree with you on this entire post

[opaque ember]

i realized this because i have close friends with autism

[neon oracle]

@gloomy canyon You should pin Sae's theory its the best one i've read in a while that does not reach

[modest skiff]

Keeping the hat stored in inert atmosphere (argon or nitrogen) would prevent oxidation or other forms of decomposition. This is the same reason stuff is preserved in epoxy. Perhaps Oda used an idea more familiar, cryostasis, to be a more obvious form of preservation.

As for passing of will, I think that the forms of haki can be represented in a few different ways:

Mohdoo's Haki Headcanon

1) Armament: Willing strength and endurance within yourself or extending the will to endure to an object you are holding, like a sword

**2) Observation: **The desire to know or understand someone or something. The extreme example of this is represented through Otohime: She was hellbent on understanding the people living on surfaces on the ocean surface. She was able to understand people's thoughts and feelings to a degree we have not seen anyone else possess.

A further extreme version of this is whatever mechanism Shirahoshi and Momo possess to communicate with Seakings and Zunesha.

**3) Conquerors Haki: **The desire to impose will on other wills through force or through inspiration. The extreme ability of this is to be able to actually pass your will on to others and to inspire people to reach further. During Sabaody, we are told that an abnormal percentage of people who attended Roger's funeral went on to be high profile people, whether navy or pirate or otherwise. I think this is why only awakened devil fruit powers from Kid and Law were able to overpower BM's conq haki. And that is why Luffy's Nika powers overcame Kaido's conq haki.

When Roger told Rayleigh "Don't worry, I'm not going to die", he meant that his will would be passed on. When he realized he was too early to properly utilize the One Piece, he chose to turn himself in so that a large group would gather. He took the opportunity to pass his will to people who would be alive long after he was dead by yelling about the One Piece and telling people to go find it. He inspired greatness in the crowd.

Oden did the same thing when he passed his will to the Scabbards. That is why Kaido actually senses Oden during their fight. He specifically comments on sensing Oden himself. He is sensing Oden's dying wish, which he imposed on the Scabbards shortly before his death, same way as Roger did on the crowd.

Symbolism of the straw hat

As for the straw hat, Rayleigh says "Straw hats are often worn by dauntless people". I think it is a symbol of the desire for freedom, which is a desire held by Joyboy/Nika. The prominence of straw hats in the ancient temples in Skypiea feels like good evidence for this.

[modest skiff]

I think the promise is to free the world, which is the promise Joyboy couldn't fulfill to the previous Poseidon. He promised to free the fishmen and everyone else and he didn't succeed. Joyboy's promise/will is essentially the Nika fruit: Bring freedom to the world around him. The reason the Nika fruit has the ability to stretch and distort not only themselves but the world around them is that it is more so "freedom of movement/flexibility". And as I more elaborately described in a previous post here, Luffy's transformation is the only time we have seen a conq haki attack be distorted. Luffy bends as if no haki is being used when Kaido uses a conq haki coating attack on Luffy once Luffy gets really fired up. The WG fears this fruit because it is the only fruit that can give people immunity to physical damage, which is the method of choice by the WG to impose their will on people who would otherwise be free. Without physical intimidation, people are free from the WG. So that is the will that is being passed, the will to free the world.

As a small side note, I think the only caveat here is that Imu and/or Marie Jois is believed to have the ability to increase the sea level, which means the ability to kill everyone who isn't inhabiting the red line. The only way to save everyone is to use Noah, which was constructed by fishmen for a final battle to save everyone against the flooding of the planet. So even if you free everyone, if someone increases the sea level, they all drown anyway, so you also need a backup plan for when you try to take down the WG, which is Noah.

[cerulean trout]

Ayooooo imagine thats what roger meant with “i wont die” when he said his last words to rayleigh, bc he knew he would see him(in luffy form) years later again

[modest skiff]

Great theory and I think it makes a lot of sense. I think the reason it doesn't quite fit perfectly with what we have seen is that Oda quite simply doesn't like sticking to the script of mythology. As an example, Zeus. He likes to stick to ideas and rough sketches but sometimes he takes lots of liberty, which is great.

I'm happy to see you point out there were more than 4 gods because in that scene that lists 4 of them, it ends with "...", so I have been assuming there is more than those 4. I also really like your comparison to Mayan lettering.

Overall I think you make a lot of great comparison to the various gods and how they relate, especially BB's. That one and Imu feel the most solid.

The other thing I strongly agree with is the idea that Imu is able to flood the world, as I have ranted about many times in the past. I think the ability to flood the world is the checkmate move Imu has kept in their back pocket and I think it is why the Navy is supremely subordinate to the CDs/Gorosei/Imu. Ultimately Imu is the one with the power.

[modest skiff]

I agree with your basic premise that we can't use the word for word mythology to imply foreshadowing. We have no reason to assume strict adherence to mythology in One Piece. As I said above, I agree with the Imu and BB parts in a lot of ways, but I agree that the Yamato stuff is less certain. But the overall explanation by @edgy viper was still very good.

[sturdy hound]

Yea, unless the premise of the story is rewriting or reinterpreting specific mythological timelines, it will almost always be thematics and cool references.

Bado has some great stuff in their explanation, I agree

[stark spindle]

Garp is strongly based on kesari in Hindu culture.
It is said kesari defeated a monster who was persecuting holy saints

It Is said kesari had the face of a monkey. This obviously links to garps name and this distinct monkey d. Smile.

Notice how oda shows that luffy and garp have this smile that only monkey d members can do. Another hint to the fact that dragon isn't garps son.

It is said kesari defeated the monster with a powerful fist/punch. Garp is called garp the fist.

In the myth it is said kesari married a celestial maiden. Translated to one piece this is a celestial dragon.

Explains why sterry asked garp for his connections to the celestials.

It is said his wife saw him pulling of a heroic feet and she fell in love and became a monkey. Became a monkey is essentially marrying garp and taking his name.

[modest skiff]

Garp is Dragon's father, as described here #manga message

[clever sandal]

Wouldnt this contradict his vice admiral scenario?

[stark spindle]

His wife was likely killed for marrying him. His wife was an odd one out

[alpine lichen]

For Kaido it's different, here he REALLY WANTS to die

[copper hill]

Just shouting this out that this is extremely good and way more coherent than most theories.

[severe ice]

Have anyone talked about this theory? This could be besides to Sun God Nika...

[modest skiff]

#manga-theories message

[severe ice]

It is interesting but I meant the possibility of another mythical fruits in One Piece other characters with those features. Example Dragon: God Of Rain something like that

[prime magnet]

People will be like “AsS pUlL 🥴🥴”

[lunar shell]

The sea level thing is very interesting. Coincidentally, all kingdoms under Joy Boy protection are way above the current sea level, or below: Fishmen island, Zou, Wano.

The gorosei is strongly thinking about a new " cleansing ". I fear the sea might rise again, at least the pirate are immune to this, and they might be able to save the day.

Also, I read about Mop stuff and Imu Kanji being alike those of Buddha is interesting in light of the fact that all Gorosei members are inspired by peace figures IRL (Gandi is the one with the katana eg). I wonder where Oda is going with this.

[sacred thorn]

https://youtube.com/shorts/0Iqnk4C8b9Q?feature=share

[sacred thorn]

These bounties seemed the most legitimate to me

[amber oar]

Why 2050, estimated year for the end of op?

[analog sun]

Estimated end of Act 3, where we were introduced to Yamato

[left marlin]

No one know if Yamato will join or not

[late token]

Some of you say that imu/WG have the ability to make the sea level rise … this is the First time I hear this. Is this based on anything? What are the clues?

[naive wolf]

i think is @modest skiff headcannon i just read up there, is the first time i heard about it and honestly it feels plausible :o

[heavy ocean]

When will Vegapunk show up and also curious on his involvement with the WG, specifically gorousei and imu

Will not be too surprised if his character design and mannerisms are based off Rick Sanchez

[wet plume]

I feel like Oda was waiting to show us this and now all the devil fruit secrets will come out. I want to know who else has named God fruits. So far it's only Sengoku and Luffy

[short folio]

I believe Chopper didn’t eat the hito hito no mi, but rather a special model of the hito hito no mi, maybe something related to the forest. I can’t find any zoan fruit where both a base form and different models exist. For example: ryu ryu no mi has 6 known models, but there is no ryu ryu no mi. Same with inu or tori no mi. Also whenever choppers df powers are disabled he turns into his hybrid form, but if he ate the hito hito no mi which supposedly only turns him into a human, he should turn into a reindeer. Choppers points also have lots of resemblance to luffys gears

There is also this panel from chapter 287 which makes me believe there are more mythical fruits related to gods

[lyric berry]

Sengokus fruit is not a god fruit it’s a Buddha. Buddha was not a god

I also don’t think chopper or anyone else had renamed devil fruits. That trope only works once

[short folio]

In choppers case it isn’t really renaming he could have just assumed it’s the hito hito no mi based on its effect

[wet plume]

Oh shit you are right. I forgot is was "a" buddha

[lyric berry]

true but itd still be another retcon that i wouldnt really expect oda to do

[prime magnet]

Vivi can’t be the “rain god” either can she without a devil fruit?

[lyric berry]

people are shoehorning every character to be a god now

[naive wolf]

peeps who say that are based on the scene on Alabasta when Vivi is screaming to stop fighting and sudden it starts to rain; honest at my firt read, i though it was smoker doing it but who knows if he was saying the truth

[leaden trench]

So y'all believe this?

[lyric berry]

not one bit

gods are the new resin in the OP community

[leaden trench]

My theory for the Gods are Shiraoshi Forest Vivi Rain BB Earth Luffy obv Sun

[clear kraken]

Ppl saw lightning flash behind dragon and ran with it

[leaden trench]

Mainly because of this I can be wrong like always

[vestal orbit]

yeah hackda needs to take some inspiration from peak fiction, luffy's fruit would have been a pickle if oda was a good writer

[modest skiff]

@naive wolf @lunar shell my basic reasoning:

Imu can change the sea level of the planet

1. Wano is really high up and appears to be built like a fortress. Elbaf appears to be built on an incredibly tall tree. Rather than going sideways, I think Elbaf is a kingdom which extends up into the white sea.

2. Zunesha, protecting Zou is taller than the red line (Zunesha is 35 km, red line is 10 km)

3. I think Noah is not built for giants and also not built for fishmen. Fishmen can swim faster than any boat and essentially do not benefit from a boat the size of Noah. The windows in Noah indicate it has many floors within it, so it is intended for smaller humanoids. So that means it is meant for an insane number of inhabitants.

4. The classic story of Noah's ark is god getting mad at the world, causing a flood, then life on Earth being preserved by bringing stuff on a boat. If CDs are "gods" and Imu is the supreme one, kinda like god.

5. The navy being utterly subservient to the CDs doesn't really make sense. Preserving the world government is important, but the CDs don't contribute anything and basically just live as murderous, slave keeping rapists above everyone else, causing nothing but harm. Even members of the Reverie are deeply scared of the CDs. They plunder and don't add anything. They essentially coast on reverence exclusively.

6. Akainu and other high ranking navy personnel clearly totally despise the CDs. I really just don't buy the idea of authority and hierarchy and whatnot. They are clearly such an insane level of bad and operate outside of all laws. There is no reason for anyone in the world to want the CDs to exist other than the CDs. This to me indicates the CDs have some sort of ability to force their power on the world. I think they have a doomsday switch of some kind. Wano and Enies Lobby both being protected by enormous whirlpools feels like a clue as to what this doomsday switch is: flooding.

Put all of this together, look at the Gorosei being subservient to Imu, I think Imu is the one with this doomsday switch. I don't have any evidence to point towards a mechanism/method for this.

Head canon:
Separately, I think Marie Jois is built exactly where it is to control a giant tree that extends up and through the red line, into the white sea, and perhaps beyond what we have seen. I think the secret that Doffy learned is that the CDs are not actually able to use this doomsday switch and that the whole thing is a bluff. Whether this tree is involved in the flooding, who knows. This part is mainly head canon. But my numbered points above feel a lot more evidence based.

[naive wolf]

yaa it is a good reasoning as for why and how the tenryuubitos exists, kings of all the nations always afraid for a possible doomsday is a fair reason as for why they pay to the tenryuubito their high gold's taxes thay ask for, also that they don't even try to feign a good face to the world, they are arrogant, and everybody knows that you cannot even look at them at their eyes without wait for being punished. I guess i wish that it could be a stronger hint about this, like someone on the story talking about why tenryuubitos control the world but the evidence showed here is enough to make those asumptions. Maybe doflamingo tried to give us some info about why the treasure of Marygeois is sucha hax power to control the world (that it may be this "Imu's doomsday switch"), but then on Levely is implied that this treasure may just be a giant frozen straw hat (?), so Oda just let us confused about all this again. The Ennies Lobby hole now makes much sense if the flooding theory turns out to be true

[late token]

Could very well be. If it really is the case then all the props to you ^^ I always thought their power just comes from money and influence like in real world.

[late token]

You have to keep in mind that when oda introduced the character chopper with the rumble ball and all the different forms he thought one piece was going to be finished in a few years. He propably didn’t even think about all the god themes at that point

[modest skiff]

I think this is good reasoning. I agree with you and wrote some stuff similar to this here #manga-theories message

The main thing is Chopper never actually being human. That feels like a huge clue. ⫷ L ⫸ (can't tag him for some reason) posted something similar too. I don't think Chopper only ever appearing as what looks like some kinda hybrid is a design choice. Every other transformation goes into exactly what the name is, not some kinda humanoid version. I think if a human ate the same fruit as chopper did, they would look the same. It was just a coincidence that Chopper ate a fruit with a humanoid transformation similar to his.

If it does turn out there’s some god devil fruit for all 4 listed in skypiea, I think it’s most likely that Chopper is the forest one. But I am not 100% sold on the 4 god devil fruits idea yet. Chopper is the only reason I consider it possible

[umbral creek]

you don't need the nika fruit to be a joyboy candidate, it just helps
I think there are only two conditions needed to be a joyboy candidate. you need to be a conqueror and you need to be from the D clan. those are the only two requirements
rocks and kaido are both failed joyboy candidates. roger also failed but not because he didn't inherit joyboys will, but because he couldn't due to not being long for this earth
the reason shanks went all the way to goa was to give ace the nika fruit to ensure that a new joyboy candidate would be viable. he never found ace because all he knew was that roger handed his son off to garp
also because law and kid only fill one of two boxes each they will intentionally give up the race for pirate king to luffy because the one piece can only be used by a joyboy

[naive wolf]

dang you may be right and that makes me sad bec at the start of the series it is stated that all pirates set sail to the grandline in order to chase the big dream that it's "to be the next pirate king", we see Crocodile, Big mom, and Doflamingo with the same dream too, as an example, but as the story progressed, the path of the chosen one is been narrowed and shortened to only D's clan, or now they said, even only the Nika's fruit user, etc. Which it blows in my opinion, cause the freest sea is that where everyone can conquer it, not matter their origin or their reasons to reach the top whatsoever, not even mention the timing with the ancient weapons that adds just another problem too, as for why Roger couldn't do anything at all but starts the great piracy age. So i just hope the will of D turns out to not be related at all with the chances that someone has to be the ultimate king of seas

[weary arch]

it was kaido who carried shank's crew to marineford

[torpid mist]

the red force was there

[timid niche]

Any theory to explain why yamato's booba huge ??

[red nacelle]

Her mom + Kaido having bigger boobs that zoro

[abstract tulip]

Try

[pure raven]

sanji manifestation of women having booba

[abstract tulip]

Try

[formal bridge]

They can become king of pirates (everyone has different pov of who is king of pirates) maybe but just can't learn about void century

[hoary hatch]

Regarding 5, nobles and royals doing what they want is the classic problem of feudalism. CDs use their inherited power to rule the world, even over the members kindgoms of the World Government. But without a revolution, like what the rebels try to do, none of the kingdoms can oppose this.

[formal bridge]

Btw does anyone think roger left his sword on laughtale

Gorosei sound like veto nations in UNSC like murica , russia, uk, china, france.

[queen ether]

It’s possible. Do we know if he still had it after finding the one piece?

[formal bridge]

Not at his execution atleast

@queen ether btw what sword does shanks use

[paper lintel]

Bruh i got warned for saying d**k.. people really got will smith kinda tolerance lmao

[naive wolf]

now this is kinda new to be honest: "D's folks are the only one who can achieve the mysteries of vc", i mean i know for sure that will of D be something kewl and huge, but there heck should have to be D folks normies and boring as everbody familiy tree. Like it is okey that between 20 or 30 top tier on the sea, 3 or 4 are D's is okey, but rambly it seems like if they were having a huge advantage in front of the others competitors, in the race to the "all mysteries unlocked plus turn upside down the world" award that it is what finally means for everybody (imo) to be King of the Pirates.

[formal bridge]

@naive wolf only 2 D's know of void century until now in manga roger and xebec others in their crew aren't D's also all oharans weren't special either

[ashen surge]

6. I think Akainu is a fundamentalist believer in the Absolute Justice and sees it as an lesser evil or he's just a plain fascist who thinks a society needs its enemies to function

[naive wolf]

how crocodile knew about pluton, and minks gyojin and skypians knew kinda what is written on the poneglyphs, i think that is open data for everybody with enough guts to go fo there, definitely not only D's folk

[formal bridge]

Yeah that's what i am saying

[naive wolf]

o h, so what is your shot about will of D?

[formal bridge]

They are people that oppose wg ideals it can be either good or bad(ex: bb) Even garp doesn't like their ideals

[lime stirrup]

I think there's more to it than that

[naive wolf]

but i don't believe they inherently want to, like what about Law's parents who were just random people who just wanted to be normal doctor's life not drawing too much atention; but if someone out of the D's clan listen about all those mysteries and may figure out he has a "will of D too"; honest my headcannon is that D is like an "ancient reward", like anybody can be a D and be then recongnize it as a D and even can put the letter on his name cause he "earned" the right, so not all offspring of course but maybe the great-great-grandfather won the D and maybe the great-great-grandson does not have any intention to live that will and just want a regular life (so tried to hide it) but, there is also the probability of that offspring inherit the will, like prolly Luffy has taken an ancient D will, but is not that arbitrary, you know what i mean?, by that logic Oden was kinda D too (he died with a smile on his face), and maybe kaido strives for it too, maybe even doflamingo) so i m thinking there are peeps that says on One Piece hasn't been protrayed the idea of "pure blood", like other shonen mcs, but still the story repeat us that the will of D matters, and i just trying to advocate that destiny is not a thing on One Piece, which it is clearly

[lunar shell]

3. That makes sense now that I think about it. So Noah would be to save every man on sea-level island in grand line ( y I think only grand line is concerned by the "cleansing", the way the sea level rise might be linked to the creation of calm belt ). And so the fishmen's goal would be to save everyone with the help of the sea king maybe. When it's almost too late for the last islands, fishmen can even swim to save humans, what a strong bond between human and fishmen that would make.

4. Yes this make for a strong case for the " sea flooding = secret weapon of CD ". To me, this also makes the "Rain God = Imu" 's case while explaining the 5) 6), their domination over the world.

[lime stirrup]

Law hasn't been shown to particularly care about the WG, and Blackbeard was a warlord

[formal bridge]

Law's parents were also against wg they wanted to find the cure not kill everyone just because oden died with a smile doesn't make him d

[formal bridge]

Just so you know both didn't want to stay as warlords they wanted to use wh for their own plan
You could have taken garp or saul as examples but they are also against wg

[coral siren]

Theres a theory where Koby is a second sun god. Vegapunk might've made the Smile Nika Fruit and Koby ate it, do u guys think this will be confirmed?

[red nacelle]

No. Other than being obsurd, they never had Luffy's fruit so no lineage factor

[formal bridge]

I think koby eats toki toki no mi

[coral siren]

Didn't they used to keep it before shanks stole it tho?

[red nacelle]

Who's who was on his way to deliver it but it was stolen

[coral siren]

Oh alright. But still tho that was a huge misopportunity for him, he could've ate it and became the strongest man alive at his time

[red nacelle]

Orders are orders. Besides i doubt he would awaken it. He would only be a rubber punch bag

[coral siren]

To awaken it, you have to die right? Oh yeah, and I was wondering, since you get the charasteristics of your Zoan Devil Fruit, what if Luffy's attitude and personality changed after eating the Human Human Nika fruit?

[formal bridge]

He didn't knew it's importance or maybe he already had that zoan fruit the one he has now

[red nacelle]

From what we can see he was the same. My personal opinion is, since zoan fruits have a will of theur own, the fruit chose Luffy BECAUSE he had this character. Not the other way around.

[coral siren]

Makes sense. But can we not ignore Momonosuke tho? I think his Dragon Adult Form is so cool and might even be more powerful than Kaido (keyword: might)

[red nacelle]

I don't think so. I believe Momo's fruit is the same as Kaido's but without the will. And yes he is cool, but i believe that 1) he doesn't yet know his fruit well enough to use it. 2) Kaido is awakened (i believe) and that is why he is so durable and strong. Plus he can use fire based attacks, lighning based attacks, wind. And he can control fire clouds remotely. I bet some of those are due to awakening

At least that's what makes sense to me

[formal bridge]

Yeah and maybe momo won't be awakening

[red nacelle]

Momo is a fucking 8yo. In his mind at least.

[spark relic]

What do you mean without the will?

Kaido's durability is a passive ability, dragon scales are hard af, that's why he's also hard, dfs make modifications to the user's body not just the ability itself... Example you can see that Luffy is always rubber, that's why kaido is very durable he's always dragon scales lol

[spark relic]

The fruit was deemed a failure that's why it was scrapped, he def won't be as strong as Kaido the original fruit user

[red nacelle]

I mean how all zoan have a will of their own.

Maybe what you are saying is true. But i believe what I wrote. If it was like that then momo wouldn't hurt so bad when kanjuro hit him. He would have a "passive" as well

[spark relic]

That may be one of the reasons why it was deemed a failure

[red nacelle]

Or that it has no will. Because so far we see that they are the same in form. Besides this is vegapunk. His failure may be different from what we think it is

[pure raven]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/959994216702943304/959994301444653096/image0.png?width=1630&height=911

[spark relic]

If VegaPunk tried to replicate Kaido's fruit and said it was a failure, even tho Momo can transform like Kaido that is probably one of the reasons too... It has no will

[red nacelle]

Thats nice but why would the world government have one piece and the poneglyphs to their logo?

[pure raven]

idk i just think its interesting. the one piece also could have something to do with the creation of the world government. it feels like one of the whole purposes of the world government is to prevent people from getting to laughtale because they know that there is going to be something there that will bring them down.

[ashen surge]

The world goverment logo is the 4 Blue seas where WG is in the middle, connecting them together...

[pure raven]

o. that makes so much more since im a dumbass and the lines are for the grandline and the redline

[pure raven]

nah

[charred river]

Is the all white form of luffy holds connection to the sulong form?

[reef oar]

I think it holds connection to Skypeia more than anything

[lunar shell]

I dont think so. I agree that the color white directly links to the sulongs, that aside, nothing relate to such an assumption.

[reef oar]

Think about this volume cover. It might connect to Luffy's fruit in some way. Skypeia may hold more significance than we realize even now. Luffy having Skypeian wings? Could his ancestry be traced back to Skypeia and thus his devil fruit his further connected to him/joyboy in that way?

[lunar shell]

I doubt Oda had in mind Nika at the time but I do believe Nika was a lunarian, at least its a strong possibility cuz of King being able to stretch and use fire ( luffy might show fire ability like a giant punch in fire later )

[reef oar]

I think the idea of Nika was not as fleshed out at this point of the story. However, Skypiea has a heavy emphasis on religion and gods. Re-reading Skypiea, it is difficult to pinpoint anything obvious in the story that might stand out as a hint to Sun God Nika himself, but I do think the hints are there. More importantly, I think Oda is going to reveal to us at some point Luffy's ancestry goes back to the Shandians in some way, and his gear 5th being white only solidifies this idea more for me.

[late token]

What difference would it make if he was actually of skipean descent?

[lunar shell]

Idk about Luffy. But if Nika is a shandian or lunarian, it would explain his powers. He is just way more powerful than other of his race. Like Buddha for humans.

[reef oar]

Before Nika was mentioned in the story, I held the belief that Luffy is of Skypiean decent because it would fit with the themes of the story. Luffy is a man who can bring people, in land, sea and sky together. The significance of those who carry the "Will of D" is those who carry the traits of both the angel races, and the people born on the world below. I believe the "D" symbol represents a half moon. Get it? The people of D are half Lunarian and half Earthlings. Luffy is winking and has wings on the cover because he carries the blood of those on the world below and the angel races in the sky/moon.

[lunar shell]

Oh that’s very interesting

[late token]

Saul D. Jaguar was a Giant. So he was 1/3 lunarian, 1/3 giant and 1/3 human? I just don’t see how it would make any difference to the story if luffy had a different descent than just plain human

[lunar shell]

That links to my belief that ppl of the moon crash on a island and those two tribe made the ancient kingdom, descendant of said island would be D. What you says really add to this.

[lunar shell]

No Saul-sama is simply half giant half lunaria ( or whatever the name is for moon people )

[reef oar]

Saul could also be half giant and half Lunarian as well. I think Saul is a very interesting person in the story, given how significant giants are now. I'm saying that the Will of D is the will of the half-lunarians/half-earthlings, able to "bring the dawn" of the new world, and bring the people together again. Connecting the world back to... one piece if you will.

[lunar shell]

If luffy is son of dragon or not wouldnt necessarily change the story but its cool yk.

And if you read Aangot you will see the D are half moon, meaning half lunarian ( or w/e the name is )
So its not that it link to the story, it is the story

[reef oar]

Think about the cover story with Enel, and how the Shandians/Skypieans/Berkans used to all live together on the moon. And for some reason, they had to leave the moon and decend down to earth. This was long before Lunarians were mentioned in the story.

[late token]

But that would mean they always have to pair with a lunarian to produce offspring. We know that both of laws parents are normal humans. Or does this half half just apply to the very first child?

[lunar shell]

I m sure those guys were the one to bring advanced technology, maybe resulting in the ancient weapon pluton, and to the devil fruit ( cuz those arr tied to vegapunk that try to reproduce them )

[late token]

And there is only king left as of now. So luffy could not produce another D.?

[prime magnet]

Oda the ultimate drip feed/bread crumb story teller. He puts all these little pieces and bits of information scattered throughout the world for us to find and out together. JUST LIKE PONYGLYPHS

[lunar shell]

Descendant of full lunarian are call lunarian, like King or Ener’s race. And they dont have D

Those that are descendant of full Humans dont have D

[reef oar]

The decendants of the D tribe. Garp, Dragon, Luffy, etc, you dont think they're all having sex with Lunarians to have half-lunarian babies do you? If so, thats not what I meant. I mean people who are decedents from the original D tribe, during the void century. Does that make sense?

[plucky kiln]

Lunarian and Skypiean related ?

[late token]

It doesn’t make sense to me at all that’s why I’m asking all these questions ^^ but it’s all good

[reef oar]

Rocks D Xebec, Marshall D Teech, these are desendants from the original D tribe. The Will of D? A will, lost to the annals of history.

[lunar shell]

You bet. Chinese mythologie have those white and black winged fellow I m not sure why

[pure raven]

what would be the aftermaths of luffy vs kaido?
will luffy fight teach next?

[plucky kiln]

Rocks, Marshall, Jaguar, Monkey, Portgaz, Gol, Water might have been fellow companions of Joy Boy's crew

[lunar shell]

A bright future for Wano.
Yes.

[late token]

But we don’t even know if they are a “tribe” it could also be some sort of medal or achievement that you could earn back in the time if you did smth special.

[pure raven]

will luffy be called a yonko officially?
what about sabo?where is he?

[plucky kiln]

"The man who will become the pirate king"

is what he should be called

[lunar shell]

sure why not, not that he’d care

[reef oar]

Oh like you think that Garp is a decendant from someone who earned the "D" initial? I can see that.

[lunar shell]

Sabo… that’s a mystery. I dont have a clear answer, I say he is captured and interrogated by Imu. That would allow us some Imu time