manga-theories

[mental juniper]

This leaves me with a lot of questions about how they all relate to Nika, considering he has fire habilities like lunarians but could very well be able to be in a sulong state like minks, as seen in gear 5's colour. Liking the theory so far tho. Oda just gave us vague foreshadowing about this so I have no idea what he has prepared in this regard

This is cool, I really want this to be true. If BB ends up having different personalities then that makes him a lot more interesting and unique as a character

[formal bridge]

Just got a clue that shanks didn't have observation haki during foosha village

[pure raven]

bruh when my phone died yesterday i looked to left and there was a charger 😭 wrong chanbel lmfao

[jovial olive]

I think Blackbeard has a zoan type too model cerebus

Hi

I think Blackbeard is xebexs son

[bitter kraken]

Idk I think the whole special fruit thing is done and done with luffy, BB’s specialness comes from his weird body that can hold two DFs

[lunar shell]

This will only be true if this serves the Teach's story that Oda has in mind. Else, since those D can hold previous D's will without blood relation, it is not needed.

[lunar shell]

Sigh.

Where do I begin here. I'll try and wrap this up in three points only.

-Teach says the fruit come to his hand by a twist of fate. We now know same twist of fate happens with Luffy eating a fruit willing to avoid Wg for 800 years. Gorosei explains Mythological zoan have a will of their own.

-Teach's fruit is ' special ' and doesn't work like a regular Logia, just like Luffy fruit isn't working like a regular paramecia.

-Teach fruit particularity is to deprive all freedom of anything it touch, so Ace's fruit doesn't work, even the freest thing like the light can't escape, he said. Seems like dark Teach attract it all.

Luffy's fruit seems to be able to give more freedom to anything it touch, so Kaido's strike doesn't work, even the mightiest blow power goes free. Seems like white Luffy free it all.

Oda present Teach as the mirror of Luffy, it couldn't be made more obv. Its like they r are the yin and yang.

[bitter kraken]

It wasn’t the same twist of fate casue luffy didn’t murder his nakama to get it lol I think teach just says those things to justify to himself what he did to obtain it, because he was taken in by the WB pirates when he was young my assumption is that he developed some kinda feelings towards them and prolly woulda rather he found the fruit then how he got it. If he had actually found it himself that’s more fate more choosing I think, similar to Enel

[hasty stump]

Viola has the biggest boobs in one piece

[pure raven]

Facts

[lunar shell]

It is exactly the same. The fruit will act the same way, I never said their will was the same, look, one chose Teach, the other Chose Luffy.

Both fruits made their way to their master.

[bitter kraken]

Yeah I don’t think so, so if you found a suitcase full of money and I put a 9mm in the back of your ear and took it, does that mean the suitcase choice me lol

[spark relic]

Makes sense but I've already explained how Luffy uses fire

You can see that whenever a mink activates sulong, it's always by looking at the moon and tapping into the power, Luffy was knocked out, just awakened and got up

Sulong is a skill, like Haki it's not something you just get, you train for it

[lunar shell]

It does, don't you understand the fruit make his way through the fate realm? He knows where he ends up in the end, it's like he uses haki to initiate a butterfly effect that makes him end up exactly where he wants.

If you dont understand what I say think of it as the force in starwars.

[warm bison]

Lamy, Law's sister is Ym sama confirmed

[spark relic]

🤣 Prove it

[bitter kraken]

So sulong dosnt activate on its own for all minks, all they need is moon light?

[spark relic]

Moonlight and the skill, yes

[bitter kraken]

But isn’t the skill to control it? Like any mink can go sulong as long as they look at the moon is what I thought

[deep musk]

i think i remember seeing it say that its somthing that happens but needs to be trained to controle as youll be consumed by a berserk fighting type thing and die fighting if they arent ready so they all have it just not able to control it i think

[bitter kraken]

Yeah that’s what I thought

[spark relic]

Oh yes they can

[deep musk]

i recently caught up and am confused on the whole joy boy thing ik there isnt much info on him or it and i cant find any good theorys on what it is anyone know of some?

[spark relic]

Yup i do

[deep musk]

👀

[spark relic]

How much do you know about Joyboy tho

[naive wolf]

i thought the thing that needs to train for it is the control over it, but as long as i know all minks have them. As for Luffy he was let lying down on the roof by Kaido, he was prolly dead, tho the moon was shining up above Luffy's body, so it is not fat fetched what i say, i think:/

[spark relic]

Lemme know where to start

[deep musk]

barely anything more just that hes on a couple ponogyfs on different islands and that there's multiple ig

from the start ig if that's alright

[lunar shell]

He is Luffy 800 years ago. He set up lot of event, like Fishmen island, Zou, Wano, Arabasta, poneglyph, in wait for the Luffy in present, we dont know why, I myself think he just created an adventure for someone to enjoy.

[spark relic]

Yeah all minks can potentially use it, but they need to learn to control it, which is the skill else you'll just attack people randomly

[lunar shell]

Roger, who inherited Joy Boy's will, did say he was waiting for a certain D to bring a new Dawn to this world.

[deep musk]

i think i remember seeing that joy boy could just be a title and not specifically a person too

[spark relic]

Plus minks use electro when in sulong, if luffy was really in sulong form we should have seen that by now @naive wolf

[spark relic]

It is both a title and a person

[lunar shell]

Hum. Well its the embodiment of someone, but I say it more qualifies than a random name.
Imu sound like "Hate" in japanese.

Chaos and Order
Dawn and Dusk
Joy and Hate

D. are Natural enemy of the Gods, that's all we know so far.

[naive wolf]

well i have to agree about the lighting stuff, tho fun fact Luffy's body is immune to it, yet he cannot generate it as for now yet

[spark relic]

Also, minks grow in size when in sulong

[spark relic]

That may be why

[naive wolf]

but there can be D's being gods too

[pure raven]

d

[lunar shell]

Sure why not.

[night glade]

hot take: ||people abuse the word “headcanon”||

[deep musk]

if d are the natural enemies of the gods then does that leave luffy to be the most free man in the world or the most outcast

[naive wolf]

rather a paradox if they are the god's enemies on the first place

[lunar shell]

Being the most free doesnt mean outcast, it mean you overcame everything in the world

[foggy gulch]

Kaidou's awakening will probably be special clouds that he can control the weather with. And one of them will be changing air pressure makeing it hard to breathe he'll be stupid and attempt to thin out the air inside the skull dome castle. I don't think kaidou's awakening was the dragon form

[lunar shell]

A god can be the enemy of a other god, if said God is a D, its not a paradox

[naive wolf]

if g5 really is a sorta Sulong form (i dunno how much im betting on it at this point honest) he should be rare and special for being the first one and the god of them somehow, cause my initial thought was that Nika was the god of beasts and that is why on his human embodiment he has several animal's qualities

[spark relic]

What do we know about sulong?
Increases size
Turns whole body white
Electro in greater magnitude
Change in eye color and more hair
Now ask how much of this Luffy has, if he doesn't have all he sure as hell isn't using sulong @naive wolf

[lunar shell]

You know, Nika has nothing to do with a sulong, I know there is a moon and he is white, but he is light, what the sun spread. In contrast of Teach's darkness.

[jovial olive]

I agree that but remember when norland was on Jaya, they had wings after that they got blasted to the sky, where it's shown that the skypieans had wings too.
2. I'm not talking about enel, I'm talking about God Gan fall

[deep musk]

the dagon obv isnt his awakening because look at all the animal zoans at the arc where they save robin (dont remember name) they become full and half animals of the bat

[deep musk]

no idea for what itll be tho so this is a cool idea

[naive wolf]

Increases size : gomu gomu no gigant; turns whole body while ✅ ; electro : being immune to it; not exactly the same but sorta i guess

[spark relic]

He doesn't have any animal qualities my guy

[naive wolf]

all his "animal related" call backs on his attacks yet

[spark relic]

Lol...Gigant is his fruit's ability, i'm talking about base size

His normal size is meant to be bigger

[jovial olive]

I don't think it's anyway close to sulong ... He isnt a mink

[deep musk]

monke😂

[jovial olive]

Just read my brother.. i don't want to talk and ruin the series with spoilers.. believe me u would hate that

[lunar shell]

U really think the "Sun God" Need the moon to show up ? ( dont bring me the sun reflect on the moon, cuz mink dont go crazy in sunlight )

[spark relic]

Okay...Luffy's name is Monkey, so is Garp and Dragon ...Are they all minks too?

[lunar shell]

Fair enought

[deep musk]

is nika based off of the actual sun god (the monkey on the cloud with a staff)?

[lunar shell]

y

[jovial olive]

I think that's the monkey King not nika

[lunar shell]

Sun Wukong

[jovial olive]

Sun wukong the monkey king

[modest skiff]

We don’t know

[lunar shell]

Y guess who else is going to be a monkey king

[deep musk]

"the sun god" is mainly what im going off tbh not the name nika

[jovial olive]

I'm waiting for the conclusion of wano arc and getting to know what's happening outside wano.. loads of cliffhangers there

[naive wolf]

he uses several animal names on his attacks, like Hawk, Cobra, Kong, Piton, prolly i forget somes; ya, the monkey thing of his familiy and also he normally laughs "shi shi" which means Lion on japanese (獅子); also @jovial olive im not refering Luffy being mink, rather Nika being some kinda mink's god

[spark relic]

That's just Luffy naming his attacks...Kaido and Zoro usually give their attacks poetic names but they have nothing to do with what they're called Farce of the Dead?, Three Worlds?,Ragnarok?

[errant rune]

I mean he'll be stronger than Mihawk, who as far as we know, should be stronger than Shanks

[deep musk]

not just minks god right?

[old siren]

yamato is actually the son of Big Mam

[naive wolf]

yaa prolly several races whorshipped him too

[deep musk]

shanks is either going to turn out to be the stongest or weakest yonko by the time we see him fight

[spark relic]

Well, that's your opinion

[deep musk]

i mean the sun god is first brought up as a god in skypia

[old siren]

yeh true, based on shanks stopping kaido from coming to marienford will soon be shown if they fought or negotiated which could accentuate him either being the strongest or weakest

[deep musk]

i think atm shanks is the most powerful in the verse theres to much evidence for it

[lunar shell]

Teach is stronger.

[deep musk]

🧢

[prime magnet]

bruh Kaido still the strongest lol

[old siren]

arguably yes, but i think Dragon. Separately, i think Teach's potential is the largest in the verse with Luffy's as he can awaken couple fruits and he might even have conquerors haki

[prime magnet]

ya'll crazy if this arc aint proof Kaido snagging bodies

[deep musk]

teach will become stonger its leading up to him vs luffy thats why they are getting the same number of crew but teach is definitely weaker atm

[old siren]

luffy is currently playing with kaido, i find that crazy

[lunar shell]

Actually, Moon Zoan God needs both fruit to initiate awakening.

[deep musk]

shanks is the stongest and everyone who has power knows it

[naive wolf]

well, all yonkous have attacks names poetic but they always have a specific topic of it, like dunno much about Roger or Big Mom, but Kaido uses several buddhist terms that are actually reflects somehow his ideologies, like he yelling at Yamato "this world is not only questions and answers"; it has a deep meaning in it i believe, Kaido being the king of beasts, don't remember if he ever use beast name on his attacks, and yes it can meanin nothing at all yet

[lunar shell]

Both fruit are two part of the same zoan god.

[old siren]

100000%, Teach will encounter a strong enemy soon since he's been in the dark just plotting

[sturdy sinew]

Guys do Luffy need to die to awaken his fruit?

[deep musk]

the teach vs luffy has been hinted at since alabasta tbh

[deep musk]

are you up to date?

[elder moss]

This whole new form is just an ass pull to me icl

[sturdy sinew]

Yeah

[naive wolf]

we don't know for sure, prolly yes, but some peeps also speculates that Zunisha's arriving can be related too

[elder moss]

The way he gets it and the whole awakening is just plot armour

[deep musk]

well its already hinted that hes died so id say no

[old siren]

yeh, who y'all think is the final boss though? i think Straw hats vs world government rather than luffy vs Teach

[pure raven]

Mink pill was an ass pull ibr, man said zoro couldn't move and minks suddenly provide a solution for that out of no where

[prime magnet]

did he "need" to die we dont know

[spark relic]

Names don't necessarily mean anything for attacks they are just what the user decides to call them

[pure raven]

can't even call it irrelevant when he beat king straight after

[sturdy sinew]

In impel down he is just knocked down right?

[prime magnet]

def but also it makes sense with their sulong being over taxing on themselves

[deep musk]

imu maybe

[prime magnet]

facts

[old siren]

yeh hopefully, it would make everything better bc its a long-term feud between imu and joy boy

[pure raven]

I get ur point but the thing is, it ruins u more after so what's the point

[halcyon tusk]

Why don’t the Minks use their Haki more

they definitely have it

[deep musk]

weve still got years for this to all happene tho we're definitely going to the giants island next

[old siren]

oppurtunity for shanks and usopp to defintely shine

[deep musk]

cant wait for red gunna get yassop backstory

[prime magnet]

well i doubt they go out and fight again after lol, its like an energy drink lol

[old siren]

whens red coming out?

[pure raven]

fair enough

[prime magnet]

i still agree with your point though

[deep musk]

idr in like 5 months i think

[sturdy sinew]

Are we not getting emotional damage zoro arc?

[elder moss]

What happened to zoro this was suppose to be his arc

[old siren]

what y'all think the soul reaper with zoro signified?

[deep musk]

never the stairs remain a mistery

[deep musk]

its gunna be enmas soul

[old siren]

oh shiitt that sounds interesting

[errant rune]

Well having the 2nd highest panel appearance in Wano only 2nd to Luffy is good enough, no? And we know for a fact he's getting a flashback

[deep musk]

it is called the god of death for a reason and zoro did say hed become the god of death so maybe its questioning him so itll turn into a black blade

[old siren]

so soon tho?

[elder moss]

I want it sooner than later

[sturdy sinew]

Need more zoro backstory?

[pure raven]

I predict Yamato is Whitebeard son, and therefore shanks kills Blackbeard coz zoro influenced his racism

[deep musk]

it may bot work and hell have to train to make it a blade black i wouldnt mind his first loss before becoming the greatest swordsman being to his sword

[prime magnet]

Peak theory lol

[pure raven]

Thank you, took me 52 years to conjure up

[errant rune]

We will more than likely get one

[sturdy sinew]

When senior pink have more backstory than zoro haha

[old siren]

i want him to awaken all blades and the last one to awaken to be wado ichimonji which hi

holds the most significance for him as an individual

[prime magnet]

I got one for y’all, zunisha Is coming to wano so momo can land onigashima on its back

[deep musk]

is that the one he got from the dead girl at the start?

[naive wolf]

did you guys notice how Zoro stops laughing wide open until Mihawk defeat him, since then he only smirks

[old siren]

i dont think one blade being awakaned will be enough to take down mihawk

[elder moss]

Icl zunesha just came to clap some cheeks

[deep musk]

it wouldnt complete his 3 sword style so definitely

[sturdy sinew]

It would be funny if he got green blade instead haha

[limpid trench]

Why rocks is from goa Kingdom.

• In 905 morgans highlights the numerous number of infamous people who emerge from goa.

• Goa is based of brazil. Goa is a Portuguese colonised town in India. Mt corvo is a Portuguese colonised island in Central America region.

• based on roche the brazilliano. Who was exiled in brazil. And grew up in brazil (raised there).

• oda is tryna say that goa produces a large amount of stars. Stars in terms of successful well accomplished people. This is neutral not necessarily becoming good.

• sterrys name comes from starry. Starry meaning abundance of stars. The king of foa has a name of goa that means abundance of stars as if to say that several stars come from goa Kingdom

Yo how can I post pics someone tell me

[old siren]

he'd also have to learn conquerors coating on his own which when you take it in, zoro has a LOT to improve on. Awakening all swords (which will take a lot of effort). mastering conquerors haki to use at will aswell as using coating and mastering foresight.

[spark relic]

And yo @naive wolf , if Nika was the god of minks as you claim, why did luffy name all those attacks animal names before he awakened, that would mean luffy was aware of his fruit won't it...If you're working with the names btw why aren't all his attacks named after animals, how do you explain Gomu Gomu no Pistol, Axe,Jet culverine, organ gun, rifle, bullet, bazooka,yari(spear), ogama(schyte)...If I go by the same logic as you doesn't that mean that Luffy is from the "Weapon Clan" 😆

[deep musk]

luffy can reach him he infused his sandle that one time😂

[limpid trench]

Lmao I love how all 3 people were typing about completely different things ignoring what the others said

Zoros conquerors
Rocks from goa
And some nika bs

[old siren]

lloooool

[deep musk]

lol

[limpid trench]

Completely different shit from one another

[spark relic]

I really don't know why you're over thinking things, Luffy clearly names his attacks based on their function and effect @naive wolf

[amber oar]

He laughs at Pica's voice

[limpid trench]

Yo how do I post pics

[deep musk]

bruh zoros colour of the king was fucking hard when i saw it especially when he claimed he could become the king of death because his king was of the sea😮‍💨😮‍💨

[old siren]

luffy is just a random mf who you can never guess what hes thinking about

[limpid trench]

Zoro in a bubble always looks top 1. Oda has always drawn him like that.

In a bubble he looks lime the strongest character. But in reality his not and not close

[old siren]

https://tenor.com/view/lebron-james-game6-miami-heat-gif-16098081

[limpid trench]

Have you not realised that oda has never shown this dudes internal monologue before

[deep musk]

only someone like that would effectbe able to use the power from the nika fruit someone with a straight laced mind wouldnt be able to handle fighting with a fruit thats entire power comes from laughter

[old siren]

yeh, when i first found out i couldnt believe it lol

[naive wolf]

there was a reddit post about how luffy change his laugh after eating the gomu gomu (first he laughs "hi hi" then "ni ni"). Yeah im overthinking, trying to make sense about god Nika's lore, he being the god of beasts is was just a thought kinda based on his white hair

[limpid trench]

Most anime have shown the mc internal monologue at least once.

Deku is speaking to himself in his head most of the story lmao

[old siren]

yeh true that, law would over speculate on the use of the fruit so having a free mind is defintely a catalysit of how he's able to adapt on using his fruit aswell

[naive wolf]

on one piece only once, on impel down lol

[spark relic]

Your theory is not accurate, but it doesn't mean it's dismissed either

[limpid trench]

Show me panel

[deep musk]

being able to use more or less tuneworld power in reality wouldnt work with any other character

[deep musk]

he thinks meat right

[pale temple]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vnTZ5WuP84&ab_channel=Dingo
Min 2:36 gum gum rifle LOOOOL
Popeye = Luffy confirmed?

[limpid trench]

Oh lmao

[old siren]

the funniest move was "airhead", that shit was so hilarious yet helpful (only defensively)

[deep musk]

not even airhead would be insane with gear 5

[lunar shell]

Ya know what's good ? If Luffy fell to the sea he can now turn it gomu and bounce on it !

[deep musk]

? he still cant use fruit power in the water

[limpid trench]

Yo I'm starting to think Uranus is a person like poseidon

[lunar shell]

Luffy wont be underwater cuz he would bounce on sea floor duuuuuh

[old siren]

yeh but since he can look into the future now i think he might aswell use that whilst maintaining his conscience and free to retaliate. Gear 5 is crazy how it is already though, he's literally beating the sh"t out of the strongest creature in the world

[deep musk]

like the think franky had the skematics to i thought that was a ship

[limpid trench]

That's pluton tf

[deep musk]

oh shit yh my bad

[old siren]

p

imma go sleep tho gn y'all

[deep musk]

👋

[deep musk]

when is pluton introduced again

[limpid trench]

Poseidon - Greek god of sea
Uranus - Greek god of land

Fishman - sea
Lunarians- sky

Fishman- water
Lunarians- fire

Fishman only humanoid race that can breath underwater.
Lunarians only humanoid race that can fly in sky.

Fishman live directly below red line. Lunarians live directly above red line.

Has me thinking that Uranus is descendant of the lunarian royalty

[spark relic]

It still makes sense...Because the minks called humans lesse minks in the sense that they had less hair than them...Ancient Giants are much larger than modern giants are now, the men back in Nika's time have been able to use it, but maybe evolution may have altered somethings in humans and rendered the, unable to tap into it ...The minks legit said that humans are minks too, they just have lesser hair and we know that the minks are very ancient too, so they def are not talking rubbish. Basically what I'm saying is that from Nika's time people including Nika were able to use sulong and every other minks ability because humans are minks too just with less hair, so maybe because Luffy ate the Nika fruit, he had the ability of Nika who probably had the power of freedom but not necessarily a devil fruit @naive wolf

[lunar shell]

Isnt Uranus God of sky ?

[limpid trench]

Yeah disagree

[limpid trench]

Oh shit that was a mistake. But sky makes the theory more legit

Yeah it is sky bro

[lunar shell]

Urg not you too

[deep musk]

your saying past nika everone could use sulong but not anymore because of evolution or something?

[lunar shell]

y obv it makes your point more valid, and that's an interesting point

[limpid trench]

And I think Uranus let's the user control a giant roc bird. That dwarves zunesha. The Arabian roc bird mythos states a eagle type bird so large it can hold elephants in its claws.

Oda has also highlighted that the roc is more powerful than the elephant in one piece through luffy.

Gear 3 + armament - elephant gun
Gear 3 + conquerors- roc gun

[spark relic]

No @lunar shell ...I don't agree with him but i'm saying there's still a possibility that Luffy is really using sulong, if you read what i said, you'll know that it's not impossible

[spark relic]

Something like that

[deep musk]

its not impossible but he's definitely not using a finalised version of sulong from what your saying after years humans could no longer use sulong so maybe it can be unlocked by special few like a devil fruit awakening

[lunar shell]

I will add that sun god is much portrayed with angel wings, and that maybe Oda introducing Lunarian that can control fire, and said Lunarian knowing about Joy Boy, may be related to the fact that previous Joy Boy was a lunarian.

[spark relic]

Exactly, which is where Nika comes in

[deep musk]

👌

[lunar shell]

It is. Sun god can't be related to the moon in such a core and strong way.

[limpid trench]

Dope idea

[spark relic]

Nika was human first, Sun God might just be an epithet for all we know

[deep musk]

but sun god is only from fruit luffy could still use it if he unlocked it from a past evolutionary stanpoint as his body is now that of nikas body

[steady prism]

Who said Nika was human?

[spark relic]

Me

[lunar shell]

Hum what we see is a being mostly shaped from Luffy corpse, beside, Oda said we will see the real Nika face sometimes, so no, what we see here is not the actualy Nika, more like an hybrid Nika / Luffy, imo

[limpid trench]

I also think rocks is a lunarian mink hybrid. And is based on skoll and hati. The wolves who were said to appear at ragnarok to devour the sun and the moon.

A black hole swallow all planetary matter. Moons and sun.

Moon(Imu)
Sun(luffy)

Moon - mink
Sun - lunarian

Niji has electro comes from experimenting. Sanji has flames from judge experimenting.

We know lunarians were experimented on. Nijis powers likely come from mink experimenting. And sanjis lunarian experimenting.

This is a little pun. But for someone who possesses this natural electricity and fire a combination of the 2.

This person might be called a combination of niji and sanjis names.

And when I deeped the combination of sanji and nijis name it was very surprising.

1st half
Nii-San = older brother.

2nd half
Ji-Ji = gramps/grandpa

[steady prism]

Oh okay so that's your own idea. Imo, given Luffy's white color scheme, Nika/Joyboy is more likely a "fallen Lunarian" but we shall see. Plus it helps him being lunarian given one of the 4 gods is the "Sun God"

[limpid trench]

A lunarian mink hybrid would he called a lunar mink

[deep musk]

yh but im still saying luffys body might have tapped into being able to use a power like sulong after becoming smushed with nikas fruit

[limpid trench]

If you notice in the top 5 silouhette. Shanks and rocks are facing sideways yet we can only see shanks ears. We can't see rocks ears at the side of his face

[lunar shell]

I may agree to it if I saw any sulong electricity power.

[limpid trench]

He may have furry type ears. Like anime and cartoon type furry

[spark relic]

He was always depicted as a warrior who fights for liberation and puts smiles on people's faces, if he was a god why wasn't he just called a god in the first place...Nika was a human warrior who as probably very skilled in the ancient times, and in the one piece verse ancient doesn't necessarily mean lacking development, remember that the shandians came from the moon whenever you hear ancient in one piece

[deep musk]

fair,, i mean only being able to tap into nikas powers bit by bit luffy went from rubber to making fire into gear 5 so i wouldnt be surprised if it was the strength of sulong then lightning and so on

[lunar shell]

God can also mean a being that is core to an aspect. A god for fire for exemple would be the core representative of the fire aspect that affect the world.

[lunar shell]

I would be, cuz it would mean Luffy or Nika is actually linked to sulong, that's inconceivable for me.

[spark relic]

Yeah, which further proofs my point that he was not a god

[lunar shell]

Why ? if he is born from the will of freedom and become his warrior, he would become the god of freedom, in this case, interpreted as the God of the sun.

[deep musk]

ig im thinking how humans and the animal people are related then luffy became nika throught the fruit so it's possible but only because he already had the ability to tap into sulong just never could reach it without a boost maybe

[lunar shell]

If you mean he is not a god as in "God that rule and is worshiped" then I'd agree, but they do worship him a lot, Ask who's who, ask King, ask Skypia people.

[spark relic]

#manga-theories message @lunar shell

[fathom matrix]

I think the Lunarians created the story of Nika the sun god.

I think Joyboy had the Nika Fruit, and was seen as liberation god to everyone, including Lunarians

I bet it was never called the Human Human fruit Model Nika, but it was given that name by the Lunarians, as they created a fictitious story around it.

AND the reason why it was able to spread the word to the jails or the holy land, such as that one guard who told Who's Who about Nika, was because the Holy Land was built on the Lunarians Home.

So in short. Lunarians made up the myth/story of Nika the sun god who was the liberator of slaves, around Joyboy who was an actual liberator.

And when the WG took over the red line, they came across the story

[lunar shell]

ya need to forget about sulong. Luffy have the fruit of Sun god, he is the light of freedom, he will win against his alter ego, the ??? god, teach, that is the darkness of ruling

[spark relic]

Giving him the epithet of sun god was to glorify him and that is when he became "a god"

[deep musk]

i like this

[lunar shell]

That's too complicated I dont think Oda have the time for such twist. But its just my opinion

[lunar shell]

Well a human can become a god, if he is worshipped like a god. Ask Bouddha.

A god is nothing but the receptacle of people will. It can be a spoon for what matter.

[spark relic]

Yes that is what I have been saying

[lunar shell]

Then we agree

[deep musk]

i dont really believe it tbh i was interested in what ezzy was saying and tryed seeing what kinda stuff would come out of the convo

lol

[spark relic]

Jsyk I don't believe it either but what I'm saying is it's still possible

[fathom matrix]

True, but Oda just revealled Luffy's rubber fruit was a mythical zoan of a sun god, and One Piece RN is full of complicated stuff like the anient weapons, black beard's 2 devil fruit usage, was Joyboy Nika first or vise versa?

[deep musk]

interesting convo ight got to get up in 6 hours😭 gn

[lunar shell]

My point. Oda, at this point of the story, is about unveiling things, I don't see him unveil something that is later revealed to be something else ^^

Oda has all the follow-up story until the end in mind, and to fit this, he needs to add a couple of news thing. Nika is one of them. I say we take at face value any new thing we learn now cuz the fake news can't happen this late in the story de yansu

'night all

[naive wolf]

I just found an interesting panel about the Nika thing related to minks and animals, i posted on #also-manga cause i thought it was kinda dumb but is funny to go deep down into this 🐰 hole for a bit more: so on 537, there is this random guy wearing a mickymouse outfit and it is written on his shirt: NKL, so as i just think it is just Oda's trolling with the letters of he was prolly thinking about while drawing, he came to this three symbol, and choose to draw the guy as a cartoon cosplay?, im also thinking about the 20 and 30 western cartoon was evolving their characters were always animal (felix the cat, micky mouse, oswald the bunny, etc). I think i heard that it was bec humans aren't that funny to play around with the limbs, and also the reason of Nika's will is to make people laugh, so i finally connected with my also headcannon that Nika was a cartoon god sorta

[spark relic]

Wow.. That's great, I think so too... His silhouette is a joke

[limpid trench]

I'm still of the belief that dragon has a logia fruit

[red nacelle]

I like it. NKL could mean NiKa Luffy

[limpid trench]

And I'm very sure that we will get at least an earth and wind logia in one piece

I mean we have a swamp logia for goodness sake and a smoke

[red nacelle]

i doubt it. very avatar like. maybe in a different weirder form...

[winter bolt]

Kaido only 5v1

[limpid trench]

What. One piece came out before avatar tf

And dragon was revealed as a character before avatar even popped in the creators mind

[red nacelle]

btw we had a lot of earth based fruit. Pika's fruit, the swimmer in doflamingo's team etc

[red nacelle]

oops fair enough! timeline error in my brain

[naive wolf]

yeah, honest i was looking for a panel of luffy's buble thought i used to believe it was somewhere on Impel down and i got caught but that micky guy

[limpid trench]

And having a couple mid paramecias doesn't take away from anything
An earth logia in one piece would be the chikyuu chikyuu fruit.

[red nacelle]

hahahaha nice

[red nacelle]

what does it mean?

[limpid trench]

Chikyuu chikyuu - sound of earth forming

Goro goro - sound of rumbling
Lightning

Mera mera - sound of fire burning
Flame
Go Go - sound of fierce wind
Wind

Gura gura - sound of tremoring
Earthquake

Zushi zushi- sound of heavy stomping
Gravity

Those are the naming patterns of alot of the more powerful fruits in one piece

[red nacelle]

i really wonder of greenbull's fruit

[limpid trench]

I believe its the genshi genshi no mi. An atomic/nuclear human.

• it completes the 4 fundamental force theme that oda set up with the new trio of admirals.

• nuclear activity is heavily associated with the colour green

• his bull epithet implies a temper and aggression of some sort. A nuclear fruit is perfect for that e.g bakugou

• nuclear weaponry is the strongest military force in the US military and any kind of military. Navy admirals are called strongest military forces.

• I also believe greenbull was in MADS. Since his intro is the same as kaidous. Kaidou calls wb , old wb in 795 and in 957 we learn same they were same crew with rocks.

• gb calls vegapunk old vegapunk in 905 in 1059 we learn they were in the same MADS group with gb as an apprentice.

Atomic fruit suits a scientist very well.

Explains why he doesn't need to eat. He can make his own food and energy

[pure raven]

i think law going to die when luffy beat kaido

[terse moon]

Law gonna be revealed marine

[limpid trench]

And the strong nuclear force is the strongest of the 4 fundamental forces.

Meaning greenbull is the strongest admiral of the 3

This does not include akainu as he is not one of the 4 fundamental forces

[glass comet]

Law will kill the panda

[naive wolf]

i just hope 1059 has a pun with the meaning of the numbers in japanese, other wise not possible confirmed from a chapter that didn't release yet hehe

[limpid trench]

Its a theory

And there's no pun lmao. Kaidous reveal and the reveal of wb and kaidous history is the same numbers rearranged.

I'm just going of that pattern

Puns. Yude Ron is not credible lmao

[naive wolf]

@deep musk @spark relic another impel down sus panel:

[red nacelle]

I am confused. Is it atomic fruit? Or explosion fruit? And if its atomic what would it do? Atomic explosions?

[jaunty elbow]

luffy's devil fruit is the third ancient weapon i bet

[tight stump]

Uranus?

[limpid trench]

The exchange particle of Electromagnetism is the photon aka light.

Kizaru can create become and control light.

The exchange particle of gravity is the graviton. Fuji can control and create this graviton.

The exchange particle of strong nuclear and weak nuclear is to do with protons and neutrons.

This means he can likely perform nuclear fusion and nuclear fission

[red nacelle]

No man joyboy is supposed to guide the ancient weapons

[limpid trench]

If you wanna visualise his powers.

Think Edward elric, scar face and bakugou

[red nacelle]

That's a broken df!!!

[limpid trench]

Kizaru is light g. Fujitora is gravity. These forces have infinite range

Plants does not scale to light and gravity

[glass comet]

Mm about this, I think Luffy is the one key or the one that supposed to use the ancient weapon we already see in Fishman island that Luffy used shirahoshi power and the sea king said cause she was moved by Luffys will that's why she use her power

[naive wolf]

Yuderon is more reliable as a reviewer than as a predictor (resin theory lol), like i think he was saying why -44 is always trying to foreshadow Nika-g5, ie on, 144, mr. 5 (from Baroque works) apprears for the first time, i do genuily believe Oda likes puns EDIT: it is not chap 144 whatsoever.

[limpid trench]

Both are mid to me

[red nacelle]

I don't think it's plants. I can't think of anything really

[tight stump]

Green beard

[limpid trench]

Oda does like puns it's just yude Ron doesn't get any of them lmao

[red nacelle]

Yuderon tries to find puns and correlations in every chapter... That's impossible

[limpid trench]

And I also have a theory that greenbull is from dressrosa and is the father of dellinger.

I believe greenbull is a gunsman. And uses derringer guns. This is the reason why he named his son this.

I believe he hates yknow people like sanji. And this is evidence of blood doesn't determine path. As dellinger is yknow and his father hates yknow

Yknow - guys like ivankov and morely

[red nacelle]

Especially since oda has proven himself that he cannot accurately predict timeline

[naive wolf]

144 about Hiruluks past i think he hightlighted about the mushrooms and how the second time of mushrooms mention was when Luffy lost all his nakama and starts to laugh, on Amazon Lily, like on g5 awakening. yeah, they mid sometimes but sometimes are mind-blowing

[limpid trench]

I believe greenbull is part fishman and part oni. So he has horns sticking out of his head

[red nacelle]

Question! How did you think of all this???

[limpid trench]

• you just look deeper into characters and you pick up stuff

• I believe Lindbergh is the snitch of the revs. He baited them out.

And Lindbergh and greenbull know each other very well

[red nacelle]

Honestly it sounds pretty impossible to me. But hey. We were down that nothing is impossible in one piece

[limpid trench]

What sounds impossible

[naive wolf]

for me the dellinger part is plausible, i also think that guy is part oni, the Lindbergh part it does sounds out of the blue

[red nacelle]

Everything!! It doesn't seem like something Oda would write. Nuclear fruit. Its hard. About dellinger no idea how you cane up with it. Lindbergh the same!!

[limpid trench]

Lindbergh is based on Charles Lindbergh who was an American aviator in ww2.

And was exposed as a NAZI. Aka he is most known for being an inventor and a traitor

Lindbergh is an inventor like Charles's Lindbergh

[red nacelle]

Now that is something you should say!! Now i easily believe it

[limpid trench]

The nuclear fruit is the only one that makes sense personally.

-The admirals never have zoans.

• plants doesn't scale to gravity or light.
• plants would not explain the bull epithet at all

• and it follows the theme of the other 2 admirals

[naive wolf]

i just hope that his fasting was not bec some "i have the fruit of survive without eating", i rather hope he is special body like BB, and also with meditation like Kumadori is able to stretch his hair with bio-feedback

[limpid trench]

I mean you can hope that but like there's no evidence for that

[naive wolf]

i just mentionated Kumadori and BB's cases

[limpid trench]

Those guys have nothing in common with greenbull.

Sleeping and eating are 2 completely different things

[red nacelle]

I dont like plants either. I heard a theory that before, all admirals had logias. Now there is one logia and one paramecia. The theory states that he may have a zoan.

[naive wolf]

what kinda quirk does nuclear power have to be able to not eating at all, also what kinda attacks would he have with that fruit? create nukes? that is ancient weapon level

[limpid trench]

No gravity just can't be a logia.
And an atomic logia would be retarded since 1

• we are all already made of atoms.
• atoms are small af so oda isn't gonna be able to draw that

[red nacelle]

Fusion creates energy. I mostly wonder about his attacks. Nuclear power is 1000000 boro breaths. ...

[naive wolf]

yeah the atomic thing is what people jokes about Buggy's awakening if im not wrong

[limpid trench]

Greenbull is the strongest admiral currently
The strong nuclear force is the strongest of the 4 forces

Again this doesn't include akainu as he is not a fundamental force and haki is also an extremely vital part of combat

[naive wolf]

you right, with infinite energy you prolly can keep going without eat and not starving at all

[red nacelle]

Why is he the strongest? And also, there are 4 forces but only three admirals. Unless you suggest that green bull has embodies 2 forces

[limpid trench]

I just explained why I think he is the strongest.

Fujitora is gravity
Kizaru is light
Gb is strong and weak nuclear.

The strongest fundamental force is the strong nuclear force.

The most powerful military weaponry is nuclear weaponry. The navy admirals of one piece are called the strongest military forces.

And yes these forces both are forms of nuclear

He embodies strong and weak nuclear. Both have nuclear in the names g. Just different applications of nuclear activity

[red nacelle]

And by the way, why do you say that the electromagnetism force has something to do with photons?

[limpid trench]

What do you mean why it's just a fact g

Electromagnetisms exchange particle is the photon

The photon is the way it's energy moves around

Yo how can I post pics on here

[red nacelle]

Electromagnetism is a branch of physics involving the study of the electromagnetic force, a type of physical interaction that occurs between electrically charged particles. This is from wiki. Electrically charged particles are protons and electrons. Nothing to do with photons

[limpid trench]

One second

[red nacelle]

Photons don't have charges

[limpid trench]

exchange of force carrier particles, such as the electromagnetic force produced by the exchange of photons

This is from the wiki

[jovial olive]

https://youtu.be/J22OP93lMJY

Want this happening

[limpid trench]

Overkill

[limpid trench]

Bro you really tryna argue with the wiki now

And virtual photon. The light we see every damn day is an EM WAVE

So a form of Electromagnetism

Light is made of particles called photons, bundles of the electromagnetic field that carry a specific amount of energy

And no one said photons have charges

Yo let's get back to one piece though any other theories

[naive wolf]

is kuina really dead?

[limpid trench]

Ooh that's a good one

I'm not too sure. But she was so depressed about being a girl and then she dies around the same time the revs and ivankov come to her island

She could be in the revs which would be interesting for zoros character development.

[naive wolf]

yes it is such a rude end, now watching Kiku who even when she had gender dysphoria, she overcome to be a great samurai, so if oda wanted to close this issue i think we can say Kiku is another kuina-like like Tashigi is, tho i really want her to be alive cause she is such kewl character, defeat more thatn 100 times to Zoro, i wish no peeps come to joke about stairs right now

[limpid trench]

Down D stairs strongest conquerors haki in the verse

And one thing on a different theory.

They said 2 sovereigns would be born. This is shirahoshi and someone else. We know shirahoshi is poseidon.

And being logical the other sovereign is luffy. So is he Uranus or some shit

[naive wolf]

yeah my best shot and is stupid as f, is that she may really be Imu somehow. Hope Oda don't pull a "need your body" scheme tho. I just found really poetic she saying to Zoro that in the male chauvinist world they live on, a woman cannot be the number one never. So if imu turns out being a lady, wheather being Kuina or not, i will find it great by oda's part

[limpid trench]

Yeah kuina is not imu

And lowkey zoro hasn't tried to prove kuina wrong. Him becoming the wss doesn't mean kuinas dilemma is at rest or some shit

[distant barn]

guys remember when tht old lady with boa hancock said there is a saying in east blue that "love is like a hurricane." Maybe that is Oda referring to Dragon and the reason why he hates the world government so much. It could be that the WG did something to his lover (luffy's mom) and now he is out there to take revenge (like a hurricane, kinda similar to his devil fruit).

[amber oar]

pretty sure Sanji said the same saying back in East Blue

[distant barn]

If Oda mentioned this twice it must be significant. We know that Oda leaves small hints like this in his writing all the time.

[limpid trench]

That's some elevated thinking but that makes me think its garp there referring to

I believe garps wife is a celestial dragon.

[distant barn]

that would be interesting.

[distant barn]

but it makes more sense for it to be Dragon because his devil fruit is kinda like a hurricane

[coral siren]

Why does kaido and one of the sea kings have the same Dragon-like design? the yellowish bottom, the blue and aqua scales, etc.

[steep viper]

Do you guys thinks this is when Luffy got looney tunes inspiration? https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.deviantart.com%2Fmdwyer5%2Fart%2FOne-Piece-Seducing-Woods-903404693&psig=AOvVaw0a4INRadMIUZmSFXVdYd1e&ust=1649122112545000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CAsQjRxqFwoTCMiitOCg-fYCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAP

[naive wolf]

what about this sus panel, 300 chapters before : #manga-theories message

[naive wolf]

can you share what sea king you are talking about?

[steep viper]

I'm just looking for a correlation to explain what fruit joyboy would have come across 800 years ago to inspire him to animate laughtale

[naive wolf]

so you are saying that Laughtale is a place as weird as the seducing forest sorta?

[steep viper]

I can't remember any other arcs that could have inspired Luffy's fighting style rn

I'm assuming that Roger found laughtale at an animated state with the devil fruit tree there and unable to produce fruit cause of it.

That would explain why the WG needed Vegapunk instead of just capturing the island that DF tree is on

[naive wolf]

well there is not confirmation of existing a unique df tree, rather there are some hints (like in punk hazard, where the giant CC's pet, Smiley dies, and his axolotl df regen into another regular fruit near of it) that df are more of a cycle rather than one only tree producing them all. As per Luffy's inspiration, well there are people saying that maybe another personality inside Luffy (Nika's?) or just the type of awaken/state of Joyboy being looney. We don't know how many time Oda's elaborated this toon force/rubber hose ability of Luffy now, but yeah, the seducing woods was some bizarre way to introduce us on those aesthethic into his manga

[lime stirrup]

Character dies, long lost sibling with same abilities comes out of the woodwork with amnesia

[solemn shell]

Falling off stairs doesnt mean she really did... In japanese its more like a suicide

[ionic notch]

My take on Kuina aspect:
What if the twist is that, Kuina killed herself from overworking to being the best swordsman on the isalnd, and they said stair as they did not want Zoro to know the truth and that he a kid he might have not handle?It also brings a new dyanicmic to the lost quick that Zoro and reveals a different side of Zoro conflict. that being whether it was his intention to bring Kuina legacy or repear the same mistake Kuina to the point of killing yourself as we seen with the Grim Reaper in last chapter?

[naive wolf]

yeah i know, and i stated that it be real sad if she kills herself for some stupid child trauma, she deserved a bit more as kewl as she is

[naive wolf]

well Kuina's fans like me appreciate oda drawing her a brief moment in the last zoro's flashback, tho it be really great if oda brings her back again somehow with the grim reaper (if she is really dead in the afterworld yeet) or reveal she was alive all the time and the stairs was a facade for something more. I dunno, Kuina is such a hard theories' character imo

[ionic notch]

I do not think she alive

it would greatly dimmish alot of thing including Zoro aspiration

[naive wolf]

not if oda planned to find each other on the road. although another thing that is interesting, on chap 5, when Kuina defeats Zoro with real swords, she nails her sword (wado ichimoji?) very close to Zoro's left eyes, which is completely closed by now, dunno it this was Oda's intention somehow, like wanting him to be a one eye swordsman from the start and it was Kuina make him half blind, tho he choose to change zoro's aspect until time skip

[mint prairie]

@grizzled swift@lavish snow@solemn shell
This is not the channel for chit-chat and jokes.

!theories

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[pure raven]

do you think that chopper has a hidden fruit like luffy, every other hito hito no mi that we have seen has been a hito hito no mi model, and no other hito hito no mi has more than one form except for nika, is it possible that choppers fruit is a legendary zoan or even a mythical zoan

[naive wolf]

i like the idea of Chopper having the hito hito model forest god, since the deers is related to forest divine in some cultures, if im not wrong

[pure raven]

that sounds cool, WRITE THAT DOWN WRITE THAT DOWN.

[mint prairie]

Not the channel to chit-chat. Try providing something more substantial than a literal Sponge-Bob meme. @pure raven

[maiden terrace]

Im curious about luffy's mother,
What is y'all theories about it.

[modest skiff]

!theories

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[modest skiff]

Please no non-serious theories in this channel

[tulip canopy]

oki sorry

that bonnie one was a real theory

[tulip canopy]

n e ways back to what i was saying I think it’s jewelry Bonney. Oda stated that we have already met luffys mother. She is angry seeing kuma (who was part of the revolutionary army and the leader of that army is luffy’s father) as a slave at reverie. She is wanted badly by akianu and one of the reasons might be because she had a relationship with dragon, luffys father, and could lead him straight to dragon. She can change her age at will so it’s very possible she is hiding her real age. She eats as much as luffy does. She is always seen alone without a crew. She is also the only one besides Urouge from the worst generation that luffy hasn’t met yet. That’s just some of the facts that can point to her being luffys mom. so yeah

means she knew kuma was part of the revolutionary army duhh

[vestal moth]

Kuma is the king of Soberet Kingdom. Maybe Bonney must be citizen or very close to Kuma. We know that Kuma is kind and gentle and just like Sabo even she felt angry

[vestal moth]

This doesn't mean she is Luffy's mother

[tulip canopy]

its a theory for a reason dude

[vestal moth]

Ok fine, it may be true as well. We never know

[tulip canopy]

its not a bad theory tho many things back it up lol

[vestal moth]

There were many good theories which never came true. And we are no one to decide Good or Bad theory. Oda has always been unpredictable most of the time. If bad theory comes true, what then?

[tulip canopy]

exactly

[vestal moth]

In Zou Arc Zoro says "I'll have the samurai of Wano following my lead in no time". There has to be something big related to it.

I am madly waiting for his flashback being Shimotsuki. Luffy awakening and Nika is just a small part of Wano, I guess real story of Wano Kuni starts after Luffy defeats Kaido

[naive wolf]

underrated opinion tho i do believe too that Zoro miss a big moment hereon Wano dunno if ZKK, but he needs his "warrior of" chapter

[vestal moth]

Wano is the perfect arc/saga for him to get his "warrior of" chapter.

[mighty narwhal]

Yes cos oppression a massive theme aswell

[dawn thorn]

@delicate mirage don't joke around in this channel/send memes in here

[delicate mirage]

ok

[dawn thorn]

@obtuse flicker you too, keep theories serious

[obtuse flicker]

But I was

[dawn thorn]

No, you weren't

[obtuse flicker]

How do you know if I was?

[dawn thorn]

Because it was a shitpost, don't do it again

Keep things actually serious in here

[obtuse flicker]

Ok :(

[pure raven]

what happens if luffy hasnt reached his full potential yet in awakening

as in he still thinks about his fruit as the gomu gomu no mi

and not the hito hito no mi model nika

and will he use the fruit fully only after realizing its name

instead of being guided by joyboys will in the devil fruit

[unreal topaz]

I don’t think realizing the name will mean anything

He’s already so good with the awakening and he’s had it for 2 mins

[pure raven]

but luffy only thinks about his fruit as a rubber fruit

[unreal topaz]

Which is what it is essentially

[pure raven]

once he starts thinking about it as a sun god fruit, then he can make gears that utilize the sun fully

such as controlling sunrise

[unreal topaz]

The sun? I don’t think thats part of the fruit

Like it’s rubber and imagination (supposedly)

[pure raven]

exactly. He only thinks about his fruit as a rubber fruit so his imagination is limited

[unreal topaz]

Ahhhhh

That’s interesting

[pure raven]

which is why his awakening showed the properties of the class his fruit was meant to be in

and once he learns of the fruits name , through shanks or anyone else

he will utilize the fruit and awaken the fire part of it

[unreal topaz]

Imagine if Kaido knew, I feel like he has some crazy knowledge on the void century

[pure raven]

yeah , but he thinks that luffy is not joyboy so i dont think he knows about the hito hito no mi model nika

when he beat luffy for the first time he said you coudnt be joyboy, which means he doesnt know of the fruits name as well

[unreal topaz]

Ig

[naive wolf]

Luffy does not who is Joy boy as far as i concerned

Oh right you edited, now is a very diff idea hehe

yaa i think Luffy right now doesn't know what the heck is happening with his body, Oda said (not quite sure when tho) that when someone eat a df, immediately know the name of it, so thinking that Nika's fruit has a double name and Luffy was told to be the rubber doesn't change too much right know although he realized that he is right now on zoan transformation, we will wait to see 👀

[autumn oracle]

I think that Zunesha hearing JoyBoy’s voice, is actually Zunesha feeling JoyBoy’s inherited will in the fruit, the Hito Hito no Mi, Mythical Model: Nika.

As for the fruit’s capabilities, I’m not entirely sure, but that’s not the focus of my theory.

What I will say is that I believe that the fruit CHOSE Luffy BECAUSE he was already the JoyBoy of this century. He shared a similar will as JoyBoy, and that is why he acquired the fruit.

Luffy’s joy, his kindness, his boundless creativity and fun personality I think are all his own. The fruit just allows him to utilize all of that to the fullest. To become not JoyBoy, not Nika, but to let him be the freest man alive.

There was no destiny. He was only chosen because of who he is. Who he would have been.
That’s my theory, anyways.

Edited for a little rewording. Twice.

[wind saddle]

When it was the era of gold d. roger it was to early on laugh tale because joyboys df wasn't found then but now were luffy has it it is time... so in theory luffy is gonna be the next gold D. Roger but this time he has the df that is known for it's laughter and joy dand blackbeard is gonna be the next rocks d. xebec with coby being the the next garp. Also with blackbeard being so strong with his 2 df they're gonna need coby and luffy to defeat him just like xebec.

[spiral ginkgo]

I still like the idea that the reaper Zoro saw is actually Sandai Kitetsu turning into a Black Blade after the defeat of King

[wind saddle]

The big straw that was shown is reasonable for joy boy because the user of the fruit is only limited by his imagination so that's why joy boy was so big.

[wind saddle]

Yesterday i saw someone say Shanks is either the weakest or the strongest of all yonkos but he clearly is the strongest.
Because:

• Kaido has only lost against one yonko.

• Whitebeard was to scared to actually fight kaido even though he had planed to take him down he never really went there and did.

• Big Mom hasn't seen Kaido for decades so she couldn't be it.

• Kaido got captured once before all that and still remember that all the criterias above still count so it could only be one yonko...Shanks that defeated him

• We can also say that when Shanks came to stopped the war at marineford, he was in Wano before and fought Kaido a little because Kaido would definetly go there to try taking down Whitebeard, Ace (Rogers Son) and also the Marine but Shanks did defeat him twice but the marine was to busy at Marineford so they couldn't capture him .

[wind saddle]

also everyone feared Shanks at Marineford they may could've been able to take him and his crew down all together but definitely not as weak as they were after fighting.

[plain echo]

so here's something I realized, Luffy's new form has him go completely white, and the different kinds of Haki are categorized as colors, I don't know if there is something here but there might be

[wind saddle]

It's mid he is gonna be the one with the strongest Haki but at the moment he still has quite a weak one but he'll definitely get on Garps level or even surpass him and Shanks.

[wind saddle]

It's just a color it doesn't matter that much because we don't have many informations about his df but just like Katakuri it could be a Material made out of imagination because it's only limited by that or a innuendo to the clouds which the monkey god is mostly showed in...

But who is Imu a old friend or enemy of joy boy?

[teal crane]

When will the new spoilers come?

[wind saddle]

Or even someone that had the same df like Toki just in the void century and because she travelled this far into the future and the fruits special abilities it may exists more than once in different timelines if u get what i mean by that because travelling is quite fcked up

[wind saddle]

for the manga?

[naive wolf]

Imu is Kuina? (not shitpost) : #manga-theories message

oh great feedback thanks :C

[slate mirage]

do you think some sort of advanced awakening could exist?

[low arch]

Hello!

It is to my understanding that this chat is dedicated to one piece related theorys. Does power scaling speculation also apply within the discussion?

[gloomy canyon]

No it does not

[tiny ocean]

Kaido got captured many times but he never lost a 1v1. And they couldnt execute him.

[naive wolf]

yeah i thought the same but i forgot to reply him, that i don't remember hearing about "Kaido lost against one yonko", tho i believe that it is possible and Kaido himself put Shanks in the same spot as Luffy, Rocks, WB, Roger; yaa they prolly fight each other during Marine ford, tho i heard about Shanks dealing with Kaido without fighting at all, maybe some kinda "parley" where both yonko having what they wanted, Shanks wanting to Kaido not going to Marineford, maybe the Yamato's df in exchange?

[modest skiff]

Let’s keep discussion regarding power comparisons to the manga channels please. This topic is commonly discussed in #manga and #also-manga so feel free to post this there

[low arch]

Dayumn

Thanks anyway

[wind saddle]

he did

[dense canopy]

Lol even if he was the weakest yonko, he isn't so weak that the marineford could handle him after fighting whitebeard. Second, kaido said that feel the strongest power house or something like that which means he didnt loose to shanks(Like I don't think that line would be used if he lost, if he lost, the person is dead).

[pure raven]

ok we got it, let's end this discussion now

[wind saddle]

Or perhaps stopping the war after Whitebeard is dead because that was probably what Kaido wanted the most

[dense canopy]

Now stop this discussion.

[pure raven]

stop already, this channel is only for serious theories

[wind saddle]

it was the topic yesterday and nobody said anything so this is getting ridiculous

[pure raven]

power scaling is not theory, it's just debating

[wind saddle]

who was it then?

[pure raven]

[wind saddle]

it is quite serious because Kaido was taken down by a yonko once and we don't know which one it was to be fair

[dense canopy]

Like I told, stop this discussion

[pure raven]

like i said, power scaling are not theory, it's only debating also where was is stated that kaido lost anyway, i don't recall any

[wind saddle]

i wasn't starting the discussion in the first place just put my theory in here and answered to someone so don't be rude and try cutting me off

Sorry Shin wrong person😅

[pure raven]

lol. you do know you are starting a new discussion by replying to the message, right?

hmm the channel is quite dead now, not so many with great theory anymore... for now

[wind saddle]

Shin there was my theory and someone else just started so don't give me the fault for everything before a mod comes in here and gives us both a mute for like 1 hour

thx😁

[pure raven]

yeah yeah, ik that but it's better not do it again

[wind saddle]

let's just leave it there ok... no need for other people to read unimportant stuff

[wind saddle]

yea i was just trying to put a theory about who took Kaido down but thanks for the hint i really appreciate it

[pure raven]

L

but all theory is W but what i mean is the L part in the theory is that the theory merged with fan fiction (hold up, i think what i said here is whole disrespect)

[wind saddle]

Could be that there is more than one god like Enel was a "god" too but there is another theory with luffy being the sun and blackbeard being the moon (kinda like ying yang or light and darkness).

[mint prairie]

!theories @opal hollow

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[mint prairie]

Please elaborate more, posting a TikTok and a letter is not what this channel is for.

[opal hollow]

Oh my bad sry

[naive wolf]

yaa it may be dead sometimes, tho this is the raddest chanel as long as there are some interesting thoughts here and there. umm i recently elaborating with some guys, the theory of Nika being the god of the races and beasts, and his white hair is like an ultimate sulong form, what do you think about Nika's origin at all?

Here some tryhards explanations and then conected somehow with the cartoonish Nika's style yeet: #manga-theories message, #manga-theories message

[pure raven]

interesting i think i'll read these later

[harsh niche]

the stairs that killed kuina were built in wano and shipped out

[pure raven]

huh uh no jokes here

[keen vault]

You never know 🤷‍♂️

[pure raven]

hm hm still wrong channel

[keen vault]

Ik mb

The channel was dead so

[pure raven]

also doesn't mean that you can live it up with jokes as like this channel is for chit chat

[merry sparrow]

Sup kenes

What you guys think of the predictions for 1046 on the subreddit?

[pure raven]

care to send me the link in dm?

[merry sparrow]

“Which character will be show in chapter 1046?”

Cracker and/or Katakuri
Denjiro
Zoro
Kinemon
Rocks D Xebec
Or none of them

https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/tvvd0u/which_character_will_be_shown_in_chapter_1046/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

This is the link for what I’m referencing

[pure raven]

r/whoosh, whatever

[merry sparrow]

Whoosh? You know that’s only for jokes right

Not for just misreading a message, I’m tired 😂

[pure raven]

lol at least send the link in dm also nice embed fail, let's stop this convo now

[merry sparrow]

Why do you care so much?? You wanted a link and you got it. Stop whining it’s not against the rules to put a link in here

Your messages aren’t even open for people that aren’t friends with you so I couldn’t send you one anyway

[pure raven]

ok that one is weird

[merry sparrow]

Add me as a friend and I don’t mind showing you a screenshot of what it looks like on my end

There might be something wrong with your social settings or something. I don’t mind helping ya out if you’d like

But what’s your thoughts on the predictions for the chapters? You didn’t really answer my question about it @pure raven

[pure raven]

Imu. I'd say Imu

[merry sparrow]

Okay somebody’s confused. So you think that none of the people listed will be in it, but Imu will? What’s your reason for that

I feel like it’s not impossible for Imu to be in it, I just don’t think it’s more likely than the others on the possible list of characters

I feel like Imu will most likely be shown after the fight with Kaido when they’re doing the resolution of the arc

[pure raven]

no reason, i just think imu will show up considering that he might be the one who told the gorosei about luffy's fruit like back in reverie arc that ended with imu summoning all of them

[sturdy rampart]

I previously posted about a theory where I explored the possibility that the names of pluton and uranus are inspired by nukes.My main arguments were:

1. plutonium and uranium are elements used to create nukes.
2. that Oda chose Pluto over the more popular name Hades and the fact that Oda chose Uranus over Zeus(or jupiter) who is a much more popular god.

Poseidon felt sorta left out in that theory since you know there is no poseidonium. so i thought about some more. Poseidon stands put in another way too. Poseidon is the only weapon not named after a planet. Why didnt oda call it neptune for consistency? I think the names are hints about the different origins of the three weapons.

Here is my hail mary theory.I think this hints at extraterrestrial origins of pluton and uranus. That's why they are named after planets. Being named after nukes i think the two weapons would be technological. There are already plenty of evidence that there had been a advanced civilization in space in One Piece. I think pluton and Uranus are weapons they have created.

On the other hand poseidon which is not named after a nuke or a planet is a naturally occurring superpower. I'm theorizing that ancient weapons could be dividee further into two subgroups: "alien" technology and naturally occuring entity. This theory explains the odd naming decisions Oda made, specifically why Poseidon isnt called neptune.

I just wrote it up on my phone so i hope its not too difficult to read.

[ashen surge]

Uranium is named after uranus

Same with pluto and plutonium

[sturdy rampart]

Wut?

[naive wolf]

ooo interesting, i did heard about the nukes theory. I wonder if you take on consideration that is hinted that the ones that made/named the weapons are the same ones (joyboy's crew?) who left the One Piece treasure, if im not readind bad chap 967:

[ashen surge]

You’re implying that Uranus and Pluton are named after chemical elements but the said chemical elements are named after the planets in question. Secondly uranium is not a weapon, you can enrich it to a point of weaponization but it has a ton of other uses well

[sturdy rampart]

Oh im not familiar with that bit of information

[keen vault]

Mb shin

[sturdy rampart]

Can you tell me in which chapters i can read more about it?

[keen vault]

Yooo

[naive wolf]

I read the "Uranus and Pluton = chemical elements used on bombs" as symbology Oda could use as for state a point about the dangerous of ancient weapons

[ashen surge]

The greek mythology exists elsewhere as well so kinda one dimensional thinking it would be just "lmao nukes"

[sturdy rampart]

I think ch 967 is just talking about poseidon

[sturdy rampart]

With out a doubt i agree on that point.

I just think the names will reflect the designs of the weapons as well

[ashen surge]

We don't know if Uranus is a mechanical contraption

[pure raven]

what if shanks is actually god thats why no hurt when arm get gone#

[ashen surge]

Come on, we have these "Ancient Weapons" which all have named after Greek gods, Poseidon is the ability to control Sea Kings and Pluton is a manufactured weapon of mass destructon which is named after the Greek god of death so probably Uranus has something to do with the sky or the fact that Uranus is the father of 12 greek titans and the grandfather of the first six olympian gods

[sturdy rampart]

What was zeus god of again?

[ashen surge]

Thunder - and rain and winds

[pure raven]

god of gods

[sturdy rampart]

Google says sky.

[ashen surge]

he's the king

[harsh niche]

I meant it

[pure raven]

same thing

[tulip hedge]

"Sky and weather"

[spark relic]

I don't know why people feel it's necessary for Uranus to be someone, Pluton wasn't someone, Poseidon is Shirahoshi... Uranus may be just another weapon like Pluton or may as well be a person... We have no facts to use to discern what Uranus is

But in my personal opinion I think Uranus is neither a person nor a thing but a power... I follow the chronology of these weapons, When Pluton was introduced it was a weapon on Land(A battleship), when Poseidon(A person) was introduced it was a weapon in sea, I think that Uranus will follow this order and be a weapon of the sky

[pure raven]

isn't uranus in alabasta

[spark relic]

No it's not... Pluton was in Alabasta

[pure raven]

eh

isn't pluton is a ship

uh wait i forgot which one is in alabasta

[merry sparrow]

Pluton

[spark relic]

Yes that's what I said

[pure raven]

so it's only uranus we didn't know anything about it know yet

[merry sparrow]

Honestly, I think Pluton could totally end up being Franky. Man is in need of a real power up. And if it’s a contraption that he has the blueprints literally memorized in his brain I don’t see why he couldn’t just configure it into himself

[pure raven]

Yh that's a decent theory ngl

[merry sparrow]

Uranus might be a devil fruit if it’s something in the sky. People already think it could be Momo because he has the voice of all things, and he has a dragon fruit. But he could also just have the voice of all things because he’s from the Kozuki bloodline (which is the more likely reason he has it)

[neon vessel]

do you guys remember when zoro called luffy the "son of the devil" was that a hint at dragon being something like a devil of the sea? because he does have weather powers or maybe just water powers

[merry sparrow]

Tytyty. I’m definitely not the first one to say that, but I agree it’s a very plausible theory of what can happen there

[ashen surge]

We literally know that Pluton is a warship that can destroy entire planets and it sleeps somewhere in Alabasta.

[merry sparrow]

Very true

[ashen surge]

How do you create lightning with water powers?

[neon vessel]

i think he might be loosely based on the god indra? it might be foreshadowing him taking over marijois ir the celestial dragons

[ashen surge]

What

[merry sparrow]

I mean why would you need blueprints for it tho? Like if they end up not bringing it out of alabasta they’d just rebuild it and there’s nothing stopping franky from just giving himself a power up

[ashen surge]

Rebuild it with what

[merry sparrow]

Parts?

[pure raven]

Think he means he can implement the characteristics of the pluton on to himself so he can be a modern twist to the pluton, different form of one thing

[merry sparrow]

What type of question is that? How else do you build something?

[neon vessel]

it might be part of the will of the d where instead of them "destroying the world" they rebuild it and dragon might be essential

[ashen surge]

How do you build something you don't know what it is, how its made, what its made of?

[pure raven]

He had the blueprints

[merry sparrow]

What do you think blueprints are man? They’re instructions on how to build something

[lone oak]

The fact that blueprint tells about that is ignored

[merry sparrow]

How do you think anything is made? You have instructions for it and get the parts. It’s really not that complicated

[lone oak]

But if we think about it, Thousand sunny might be pluton.

[merry sparrow]

If anyone could do it too, it’d be franky for sure. I mean think about how crazy it was when they went from the going Mary to the thousand sunny. Crazy upgrade that unless you knew spoilers you wouldn’t have expected

[ashen surge]

You think Franky would've plagiarized someone elses work so he can build a ship that travels around the world?

[pure raven]

um no it can destroys a whole island, not the world

[ashen surge]

Oh that's a mistype from me, I stand corrected

[merry sparrow]

I mean franky wasn’t the guy that created the boat, so yeah I think it’s totally possible he takes inspiration from something and improves upon it

And when I say the boat I mean like literally franky is not the person that discovered sea travel if that confuses you

[lone oak]

Pluton is one of the ancient weapon from the void century, If we literally have the main character of void century ( referring to luffy as joyboy ). then it is possible, Also pluton may had been the ship joyboy was travelling with.

[merry sparrow]

If you really think about it the void century was 900 years ago, so it would almost be stupid to not improve upon the idea of pluton because technology surely advanced since then

[lone oak]

And franky is the only person who can do it.

[merry sparrow]

100% he is. Quite literally the only person that can do it because he’s the only one that has the blueprints memorized. Which makes him insanely special

[lone oak]

Franky took inspiration from vegapunk's beam, And created his own. It's possible he has advanced version of pluton as the thousand sunny.

[ashen surge]

What capabilities of Thousand Sunny indicates that it's a weapon of mass destructon that can destroy entire islands?

[merry sparrow]

Maybe they just haven’t needed to build pluton yet? Lol

I could see the 1000 sunny (or franky) being it later in the series for sure

It’s a stupid argument to say it’s not possible it could be it because it isn’t it right now

[lone oak]

Well it already has stuff that normal ship doesn't . And It is possible that he might later on add pluton on the order of luffy.

[merry sparrow]

Let’s state some facts. Franky has the blueprints the pluton memorized. Another couple facts. The sunny is 100% a ship different from most other ships. Frank is 100% a human different from most others because he’s a cyborg. Now it’s totally fair to think, well if either of them are pluton why not just build it and be over with? The answer to that is because they haven’t needed to yet, and it’s pointless for the story

[ashen surge]

Ok let's put it like this: the show has zero implications Thousand Sunny has anything to do with Pluton and in my opinion Franky is opposed to the idea of creating actual weapons that are not build into his actual body because of his history.

[merry sparrow]

Franky makes weapons not apart of his body all the time? What do you mean?

[ashen surge]

And what are those weapons?

[merry sparrow]

Lol? Are you serious dude?

He literally made a fucking tank bro and chopper and usopp fucking used it in wano

And that is extremely recent in the story

[ashen surge]

And? What else?

[lone oak]

The point: You said earlier that pluton is a warship, And the only one with the blueprint memorized is franky. We know that if luffy is going to destroy the redline. The ancient weapons are necessary. Second of all, If ancient weapon weren't necessary in the future. What's the point in introducting it. If pluton is a warship. The only person able to create a warship is franky. Franky said that his dream ship is thousand sunny. He won't build another ship. So either franky will build the pluton inside the thousand sunny. Or the pluton itself was already constructed on thousand sunny. Making it the pluton itself.

[ashen surge]

We don't know if Luffy is going to destroy the redline

[merry sparrow]

Do you need anything else?

[merry sparrow]

Yeah to be fair that’s not 100% guaranteed but like that’s totally going to happen

[lone oak]

That is not the point, the point is whatever happens in the future. The ancient weapon are necessary for the straw hats.

[carmine minnow]

Is Luffy skin white?

[pure raven]

always was, always will be

[merry sparrow]

I would say yes to maybe medium tan. He is Brazilian I believe

[carmine minnow]

I meant g5

[ashen surge]

My argument was that Franky is opposed to the idea of building weapons that can end up in the wrong hands and your counterargument is the one tank we've seen recently? Come on

[carmine minnow]

And paper white, not pale complexion sorry for incomplete question

[ashen surge]

How are they necessary?

[lone oak]

What's the point in introducing them then?

[ashen surge]

The world doesn't revolve around Straw Hats even the story does revolve

[merry sparrow]

Yes because that’s actually relevant in the story and a very recent example of him doing the exact opposite of your point. So yeah I think that’s really all that’s needed to prove that

[pure raven]

only the hair and clothes were mentioned i think.

[carmine minnow]

Ah kk, I was thinking it's all white

[muted ember]

If the argument is that Franky doesn't build weapons outside of himself u really only need the one example

[pure raven]

yeah i thought so too in the beginning, but in chap 1045 i think it is mentioned that his hair and clothes turned white.

[strange remnant]

[ashen surge]

Thousand Sunny was built two years before the tank and in the beginning Thousand Sunny had zero combat capabilities - save some of the complimentary cannons on both sides - but we were talking about if Thousand Sunny is based on Pluton

and the capabilities of Thousand Sunny has nothing that could imply it's based on a warship capable of destroying islands

[merry sparrow]

That’s not what I’m saying at all though? I’m saying later on down the line he could implement pluton into himself or the sunny. Not that the sunny currently is pluton. Why would that happen in the story? That’s literally pointless and ruins it?

[merry sparrow]

@ashen surge

[ashen surge]

Do you know how you can also utilize the blueprints of Pluton?

[merry sparrow]

Yeah you’d utilize blueprints by building off of it

[ashen surge]

Or to destroy it

[lone oak]

Because the world government wanted it.

[ashen surge]

It was Spandams own project

[merry sparrow]

How else do you utilize blueprints? That’s a stupid question

Yes he destroyed the blueprints, but he also has them memorized. He did that so the WG couldn’t steal the blueprints. So there is literally no reason to say it’s completely impossible for him to implement things from pluton into himself or the sunny

[lone oak]

CP-9 is the special agent of the world government

[ashen surge]

Franky knows the blueprints of Pluton so he can destroy Pluton if it's awakened

[ashen surge]

Spandam personally went to Gorosei asking to find the pluton or the blueprints for it

[merry sparrow]

That is a very valid point. But he might also just know it so he can rebuild it if necessary? Lol

Just say anything can happen and move on man

[lone oak]

And the government agreed? No, They also showed interest on it.

[merry sparrow]

The stance of putting a definite no onto something that isn’t definite is pointless

I would love it if discord had a remindme bot like Reddit does

For situations like these where later we can go back and discuss things

[ashen surge]

I'm not interested in headcanon, I'm interested in the stuff that's actually in the story. Franky started out as a dude who builds weapons of destruction that brought death and trauma to his family, his journey is to be the person who takes down the most dangerous weapon in the entire world of one piece.

And Franky has already pivoted hard away from his past where he built weapons

[merry sparrow]

You know what man, I could totally see you being correct on that. If you had said that earlier instead of just saying no he can’t do that because he’s against weapons then we would’ve never debated it honestly 😂

I think that would be a great character arc for him if his purpose is to dismantle pluton if it gets into the wrong hands, and honestly because that sounds really cool I hope it does get into the wrong hands

@ashen surge thanks for being a great person to debate with. I’m very excited to discuss more theories with you in the future

I’m going to head to bed because it’s 4 in the morning where I am, so I need to get some sleep 😂

Have a great night everyone!

[ashen surge]

I could argue that the tank has a cannon since it's a part of general franky so the original argument kinda stands

[merry sparrow]

Sure man, whatever, I’m going to bed

[lone oak]

I am more interested in uranus more then pluton at the moment.

Btw remember that zunesha being pluton theory

[ashen surge]

Theories like that remind me that I think you'd have to pass some quiz that you're allowed to post theories to the public internet

[lone oak]

what quiz?

[ashen surge]

Some quiz where you're asked FACTS about one piece

Like "what is pluton", if you know that it's a manufactured warship then it's unlikely that you come to a conclusion that it might be zunesha xd

People just like to throw around random shit and see if something sticks

[lone oak]

xd

[ashen surge]

But yeah looks like I'm beginning to be actually active in #manga-theories so I probably should write up some of my analysis of Shanks and how everyone else in the previous gen or everyone else except luffy is missing the capabilities of being the King of Pirates and stuff

[merry sparrow]

You totally would man, that would be awesome

I’d love to hear your thoughts and discuss them with you. That sounds really cool

Should not would

[wind saddle]

True

[ashen surge]

Shanks is the final Road Poneglyph and Personal Freedom. 1/2

Ok here’s my first proper write up theory how I think Shanks is the final road poneglyh. There are four road poneglyphs in total and and we know the physical current location of three of them: Whole Cake Island, Zou and Wano. I’m going to assume that missing Road Poneglyph is the same one that was moved from the Fisman Island. I argue that Roger personally moved the poneglyph. Chronologically this happened 25 years ago, Roger was executed 24 years ago. The Roger Pirates had already been disbanded and Roger set out on his own during that time and did god knows what. As Rayleigh has stated, they learned the history of the world but were too early. I think Roger was trying to set things up for the future where Laugh Tale will be reached only when the time is right. That’s why he picked Shanks from his crew because of his age and revealed the info regarding the location of the last poneglyph OR told Shanks what it says but didn’t reveal it’s location. After Roger was executed, Shanks was the only person in the world who knows about the final Road Poneglyph. Probably didn't even know why, that’s a massive burden to give to a child.

“If everyone is not free, then no one is.” - me, 2021

In the first chapter of One Piece, Shanks’ crewmates tell Luffy that the life of a pirate is great because there’s adventure and pirates have freedom. I’m going to call that freedom Personal Freedom.
Luffy has stated that the King of Pirates is the person who is the most free person in the world. Conquering Grand Line and reaching Laugh Tale doesn’t make you the most free person in a world that is plagued by a systemic oppression of the World Government which is built on top of lies, genocide and abuse. Are you truly free if you can’t enjoy that freedom with other people? Was Roger the most free person when he was given the moniker of The King of Pirates? We the readers and the pirates in One Piece think that the King of Pirates is a title to be sought after. In reality you’re de facto public enemy number one. Why? Because you have knowledge that can be used to realistically challenge the WG and Celestial Dragons. Roger and his crew had the keys to revealing the secrets of the world which could topple the reign of Celestial Dragons and WG, but they chose not to do it. Roger was ill and dying, even if he wanted to move the masses against the WG, even if he'd been able to, he didn’t have the time. Roger wasn’t even Personally Free since his own mortality was catching up to him.

Shanks is the final Road Poneglyph and Personal Freedom. 2/2

Shanks thinks he’s already Personally Free and that’s is enough for him.

Most of the characters in One Piece have personal ambitions they are seeking. Nami wants to draw the world map, Sanji wants to find the All-Blue, Coby wants to be admiral, Whitebeard wanted family, Big Mom wants the perfect family etc. What if Shanks’ ambition is just that Personal Freedom? He’s burdened by the fact that only he has the information of the Road Poneglyph, that must’ve been tearing him apart. He personally is a target to every player in the world. I argue that Shanks made a deal with the Gorosei that he will not pursue One Piece and will stop anyone doing so in exchange for his and his crews Personal Freedom. He was given a duty he wasn’t asking for and in a way, he was able to escape that burden. Except he wasn’t.

Shanks doesn’t want One Piece to be found because that would jeopardize his idea of Personal Freedom. Because Luffy and Shanks have an interpersonal relationship that idea of his Personal Freedom extends to Luffy. Shanks would be happy if the Red Hair Pirates, Luffy and in extension Luffy’s crew Strawhat Pirates achieved that Personal Freedom. And this will be the conflict between Luffy and Shanks. Every single antagonist in One Piece so far has been an oppressor of the common people and at this point I’m sure Luffy knows that Personal Freedom doesn’t mean shit. There’s still the oppression and totalitarian reign of World Government that is making Luffys friends and loved ones outside his crew suffer. But Shanks doesn’t care about that. He probably doesn’t even care about the true history of the world. He only cares about his Personal Freedom and wants to uphold the status quo that maintains it. When finally Shanks and Luffy clash, upon Shanks’ defeat, he will realise that he’s been a selfish prick and in reality he isn’t Personally Free. He’s a prisoner of the said corrupt system because he's valuable to that system.

Sorry for the essay, hope you like it. @merry sparrow

[ashen surge]

@gloomy canyon

[harsh niche]

i didnt read any of that but it looks like you put a lot of thought into it and i think thats cool, man

[idle dew]

Read it

[vestal moth]

You described "Freedom" very well. To look at entire Shanks crew, they act so freely just like Roger Pirates. and that's why I idealise Red Hair Pirates.

[grim pine]

which pirate crew doesn't act free?

[pure raven]

Shanks is poneglyph or shanks has poneglyph?

[harsh niche]

shichibukai

[grim pine]

lmao exactly

[grim pine]

they are the only exception..but now they are free too

[ashen surge]

I don't think Shanks has it

[harsh niche]

most pirates arent free actually. being wanted is not freedom. its just one step away from inprisonment

[grim pine]

bruh..red hair pirates have bounty too

[pure raven]

Bro. Either shanks has it or Blackbeard .

[harsh niche]

yeah but if keturins theory is correct, the bounty isnt pursued. thats the key difference to all other bounties

[ashen surge]

Why do you think Blackbeard has it?

[harsh niche]

the marines dont look for shanks and no pirate is strong enough to dare step to shanks

[pure raven]

Cheeky bastard 🤭

[harsh niche]

blackbeard and shanks are enemies to lovers

[pure raven]

One poneglyph leads to another bro so doesn't really matter who has it at this point

[ashen surge]

What, no they don't

Maybe Roger asked the sea kings "hey bois, can you dump this rock to the depths of calm belt khtx" and no one knows where it is but Roger passed the contents of the poneglyph to Shanks

[slow agate]

I thought you just need to read all 4 to pinpoint the location of Raftel (?) Was it said somewhere that they lead to next one etc?

[ashen surge]

all 4 together pinpoint Laugh Tale yes, they don't tell talk about the location of other poneglyphs since they can be moved

[abstract pond]

Pirates under other pirates. Like Jinbei and his crew

[grim pine]

[hardy robin]

D. Xebec next chapter?

[pure raven]

I think that the world of one piece is a post apocalyptic world and those of the twentieth century are the survivors and that is why they had a very advanced technology and since they had to start from scratch everything was born the pirate era, as if it were that the era was restarted world and maybe the awakening of the fruit of oden's wife is going back in time and so he could go anywhere and investigate about the poneglyf and the empty century.

[frank forge]

I've never seen anyone talk about ryokugyu's identity

[pure raven]

He can be rock`s son

[pure raven]

uh people did tho you've just never seen them

[frank forge]

I meant not as much as Xebec or Joyboy

[pure raven]

people are assuming him to be god of forest here

[ashen surge]

Toki was going forward in time

She’s literally from the void century

[sand robin]

BB: logia & paramecia
Liffy : zoan & paramecia
we need someone from WG who using both logia and Zoan

[abstract pond]

why you laughing?xd

[grim pine]

no reason

[vestal moth]

Maybe 1047, because there is a break after 1046. And Oda likes to give a cliffhanger when he takes break

[heady parrot]

greenbull 🤔

unlikely but hey ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[grim pine]

idk the reason why people thinking that xebec will be shown..like why? in kaido's bs?

[ashen surge]

I guess, Kaidos flashback would be about god valley to tell about origin of his fruit and setting up Xebec to how he is related to BB

[vestal moth]

I didn't say he will. I meant maybe due to Kaido's Backstory

[vestal moth]

He is very obsessed with Joyboy and we may know why in his bs

[ashen surge]

how is he obsessed

[abstract pond]

He mentioned joyboy like 1 time in Wano and 1 in a flashback because King said it. Hardly an obsession

[ashen surge]

And King introduced the concept of joyboy to Kaido, that was after god valley

[warm nexus]

if u wanna talk about obsession talk about yamato

[sand robin]

its too easy, oda will never using that plot

[ashen surge]

I still think Kaido wasn't able to turn into a dragon in the very beginning and through training and hardships he was able to awaken his fruit. Maybe King had knowledge that becoming Joyboy is behind an awakening of a mythical Zoan fruit.

[vestal gulch]

The idea that shanks is holding the final road poneglyph fits. I've been saying for a couple years now that Roger, knowing his death was imminent, likely entrusted shanks with a duty along these lines. My theory is that shanks was ordered by Roger to "betray" him to the wg to protect the crew, whatever they found at Laugh Tale, and the glyph . It explains how someone as strong as Roger was captured and executed in a corner of east blue, while the rest of the crew escaped unscathed; and more importantly, why the gorosei so casually welcomed shanks during the reverie arc. It also helps explain his ability to so quickly end the war at marineford despite being yet another pirate. If even a hard line militarist like akainu listened to shanks, something deeper is going on there than just "shanks is strong."

So shanks is likely holding the final poneglyph "for the wg" under the pretense of being a sort of final barricade to Laugh Tale. If that barricade also ends up being an ideological one for luffy as you're describing, it would make for a satisfying conflict.

[ashen surge]

Roger turned himself in and Loguetown was his birth town

[sand robin]

i have better theory that Shank is celestial dragon or half breed CD

[vestal gulch]

We only hear this from raileigh

[ashen surge]

You think Rayleigh is not a trusted narrator?

[vestal gulch]

It's hardly confirmation imo if the setup I'm describing is what happened. There's a good chance he wouldn't go around saying to people "Roger had one of the crew pretend to betray him to curry favor with the wg"

We didn't see it in a flashback, it's just a thing he said, so it's plausible Roger didn't simply turn himself in without any greater context

[ashen surge]

The first mate of Roger Pirates says Roger turned himself in on purpose and you want to bring in some weird conspiracy that would somehow protect the rest of the crew? Roger was the only one who could read the poneglyphs, he could've said. Yo, I hid one of the poneglyphs so if I turn myself in, you leave my crew alone kk? Probably the only conspiracy was that Roger secretly told Shanks.

[vestal gulch]

the angle that doesn't make sense without some kind of grand act - like giving the wg the pirate king - is how trusting the wg has shown to be of shanks

[ashen surge]

Well it depends when Shanks stroke the deal with Gorosei

[vestal gulch]

he could have even done so under the pretense of protecting his 'personal freedom' i.e. "if I give you the pirate king, you leave my crew alone forever. We'll even guard this final road glyph"

[ashen surge]

what crew?

[vestal gulch]

the group he assembled after roger dropped him off before heading on to LT

presumably he had a small outfit of beckman and maybe a couple others early on

we really know next to nothing about shanks. maybe the movie will expand on his backstory significantly

[edgy viper]

Just wanna praise this real quick.
Narratively, there needs to be a conflict between Shanks and Luffy, for our hero to emancipate himself from the father figure. "Shanks is evil" is an idea I never subscribed to, as it's way, way too shallow of a payoff for 1000+ chapters of buildup.
Your theory on the origin of said conflict fits perfectly into their respective character. Also, Shanks being respected by the Gorosei due to him safeguarding the fourth Road Pon on what they think is "their" behalf makes perfect sense and I'm mildly salty I didn't figure this out on my own lmao.

[ashen surge]

So you think a rookie kid captain who was like 15-16yo when he formed his crew, proactively went to the WG "yo, i have crucial information about the one piece" how would that protect he and his crew

To negotiate you need leverage and telling "I know stuff" is not that, you only get shot in the face with that

[vestal gulch]

the circumstances surrounding a deal like that could be set up any number of ways, but again it helps explain the wg's attitude towards shanks from admirals to the gorosei

[ashen surge]

You don't think that he rose to Yonkodom first and then went to WG hey sup, let's make a deal

[vestal gulch]

if there isn't some sort of meaningful partnership there i don't see how he's casually visiting the gorosei, or instantly convincing basically all the highest ranking admirals to abandon a war

a setup for how he 'betrayed roger' could be as simple as: young shanks and his crew get into some kind of trouble, are interrogated, and sell out roger to save their own hides and avoid being sent to impel down

[ashen surge]

You're completely ignoring what's in the script for an argument for the sake of an argument

[abstract pond]

I don't believe Shanks has any kind of deal with the gorosei. It felt like that was one in a lifetime meeting and they probably let him because yonkos keep a certain balance in the world and there was a lot of chaos going on.
He could have been a cd at birth but like Doflamingo it wouldn't change much.

[edgy viper]

@ashen surge One thing I'm iffy about, tho, is the timing.
I am not entirely convinced Roger removed the Road Pom himself. I lowkey suspect Marco being responsible for the relocation after the Summit War. Knowing that Fishman Island is a hot issue as is, now that Whitebeard cannot vouch for it anymore relocating the Road Pon at least shifts the big players' focus away from FMI. Giving it to Shanks is a natural decision in this instance, considering what went down in Marineford.

[vestal gulch]

the glyph being moved as a reaction to whitebeard's death makes sense

[ashen surge]

but it was removed 25 years ago

[vestal gulch]

did they say that in fishman island arc? it was so long ago I dont remember exactly

[edgy viper]

Do we actually know that? Iirc we only know it was removed sometime between 25 years ago and now.

Marco being responsible would also allow for a direct setup of the next destination once the raid of Onigashima is done with. But that's not an argument per se.

[grim pine]

oh

[ashen surge]

The last known location of the road poneglyph is fisman island, 25 years ago. After roger pirates disbanded, roger was doing something by himself. The poneglyph disappeared between disbanding Roger pirates and Roger's execution

If Marco knows about the poneglyph, then Shanks doesnt have the leverage I'm arguing for

Marco may know that shanks has the intel.

[vestal gulch]

looking into it now and as far as I can see the only evidence is that there was one glyph when the strawhats get there, and we see two in the roger flashback

it makes sense that roger may have taken it, but there's no explicit mention of if he did or when it was moved at all

[abstract pond]

It could have been Shanks or WB (or anyone or his crew) but we can't know. WB was the less interested in the road poneglyph so I would say it was Shanks (or other Roger pirate) who took it.

[edgy viper]

Not necessarily. Marco wouldn't be updated on what Shanks does with the Road Pon. He mustn't, because that defeats the purpose of safeguarding the Road Pon in the first place.
Another indicator is the Payback War. If the Road Pon was still at FMI after the Summit War, the remaining WB pirates/Marco surely relocated it before Payback War as it could've ended in total annihilation for them.

Also, I'm searching but I don't find it. Where did you get rhe info that the Road Pon wasn't in FMI anymore by the time of Roger's execution?

[pure raven]

Hey people, behold this theory.

About devil fruits. First they have soul. But those souls are different.. than like shadow souls used by moria. Like soul is there, but not sync with the host. Thats why, when anyone eats two.. those two of df being not in sync like merges and creates some thing which host's body cannot handle. Like mutation of sorts. And body can't handle it.

But.. with bb's mythical zoan.. with mythical ability, he can allow the soul within df to sync fully. It means, blackbeard can switch souls.. like one moment bb is controlling his body.. another moment, its bb's df's soul. Much like that sword guy who turns when sleeping.

But bb and his df's soul are in good agreement of sorts.. or similar. So, they can co -exist. hence, zoro and luffy called bb as "they", meaning two souls in same body. BB thus went and got two strongest fruits.. of different category. Maybe the same soul told bb about all dfs, and thats how he knew about strongest logia. and why can't bb sleep? If he sleeps, the df's soul would take over his body completely. so, bb is forced to stay awake. or, maybe he changes his sleep schedule with another soul.. explains his changed personality

[ashen surge]

I don't but the timeline of things works. By hiding the last poneglyph and having only shanks know its whereabouts or whats on it he sets shanks on the path I'm describing

If there's anyone else, then it doesnt work.

[vestal gulch]

it's most plausible that roger moved it since we see him at FMI with both glyphs present, and when the strawhats are there, we only see one. That said, since it wasn't mentioned that he moved it - and oda had every opportunity to say so in that flashback - we really don't know what happened

[pure raven]

just imagine. roger took last road poneygrif box with him to raftel. And thats why the entire crew laughed. Why?

without road box, how would anyone hope to find raftel? and with red box in raftel, nobody will find red box itself. its hilarious

[vestal gulch]

i mean, a rubbing works fine. that's exactly what brook put in his skull during WCI

[obsidian sun]

does the lunarian race have anything to do with sun god nika?

[pure raven]

yes, roger left rubbing. but on strawhat. see that red thing on strawhat? its actually rubbing of the last red box.

[vestal gulch]

I'd be shocked if the lunarians don't end up being incredibly important. Skypiea in general has proven to be a hugely important arc, and oda spent like 20 chapters on Enel and moonmen cover stories, yet we haven't seen that pay off yet.

[pure raven]

they were hoping nika will save them. but nop.. last one remained. then, kaido saved him.

[ashen surge]

Lunarian's werent slaves?

[obsidian sun]

oh cause i was gonna see if there’s like a link between lunarians “white” hair and the hito hito no mi MMN awakening covering the users accessories in a “white” coat

[pure raven]

we'll be shocked when we find zoro is now the last lunarian surviving, after king is dead. It will certainly trigger sanji fans. Imagine if zoro is descendent of ryuma.. and his mother is from lunarian. Zoro looks same as king. his hair aside

[pure raven]

they were kings.. later celestial dragons attacked

[ashen surge]

But there's no indication they were slaves

[vestal gulch]

it was confirmed that the winged residents of the sky islands are descended from moon people. they may not be "pure" lunarians, while King is the last true survivor

[pure raven]

what? the manga says they were slaves, and later experimented upon. what else is meaning of slaves?

why nobody replied to my long theory?

[edgy viper]

Ah okay, so it is a conclusion you came to, not an information from the series. I didn't get that.
After careful consideration I do agree with your notion now. It wouldn't change much for Shanks if he only assumed this role 2 years ago, after already becoming a Yonkou. It's more likely that becoming a Yonkou is a direct result of his path.

[ashen surge]

Yeah it's not in the script so far but with the bits we have, we can make a plausible assumption.

[vestal gulch]

shanks valuing personal freedom over overall freedom creates a really interesting conflict for him and luffy, but shanks encouragement and support of luffy's exploits kinda throws a wrench in that

[pure raven]

this makes no sense. like if shanks die somehow.. nobody find it ever

[vestal gulch]

I really hope he ends up as an antagonist for luffy, but oda likely has something else planned since he's been so supportive for so long

[ashen surge]

Well WG doesn't have to know that

[ashen surge]

I disagree, I think Shanks wants to support Luffy but wants him to stop to the same level where he is at.

[pure raven]

i think shanks is imu's son. thats why he can do whatever he wants. even sengoku knows that.. so he took responsibility back at war time. otherwise, why would they not fight.. they had like entire marine right there. and marine cannot defeat one or two yonko?

[vestal gulch]

Could be. Shanks is largely tablua rasa at this point. I really hope we learn something significant on august 6

[pure raven]

current luffy destroys shanks in terms of fight.. due to his df. so this is super irrelevant beyond this point in manga. i am sure oda planned it out

[vestal gulch]

I mean we know basically nothing about shanks abilities

[ashen surge]

And also, Shanks is also mortal. Maybe he wants to pass the torch of guarding Laugh Tale to Luffy

[vestal gulch]

or his crew's abilities for that matter

[pure raven]

unless he has df.. which he doesn't .. there is nothing shanks can do

[ashen surge]

This is not a power level convo

[vestal gulch]

It isn't. but even if they did fight, again we know nothing about shanks aside from the fact that he has at least armament haki to block akainu, and is fast as fuck

[pure raven]

why would luffy guard it ? luffy wants to be free, not guard island

[ashen surge]

Did you read my theory above

[pure raven]

roger was dying. and thats why he surrendered. there indicates nothing of there being agreement. Nobody could defeat roger in his prime, so why would he fear government

[vestal gulch]

Change of topic, but something I've been wondering about the past couple chapters is all the emphasis of Luffy's 'voice' disappearing, of him dying. Oda has brought up repeatedly over the past ten years or so the significance of Law's fruit - how it can save a life in exchange for the life of the user. I think we may see that subplot pay off soon.

[pure raven]

I don't think we will see that this soon tbh

It would make perfect sense storywise, if shanks is mihawk's opposite. Mihawk reached pinnacle of strength.. and now he is bored, nothing to do, nobody to challenge.

Shanks is at that level with his crew. but he wants to have fun and see what happens next. Roger giving some role to shanks isn't matching. If anyone, he would say ray to do it. I think shanks just wants to see where life goes next

[vestal gulch]

Hard to say. All we really know about Shanks is he doesn't take much of anything seriously aside from his friends being hurt, and he loves to party. It's been 25 years and we really don't know anything about the dude

[pure raven]

Yes, afterlife is coming up. Life zoro is dead.. technically and literally.. and what we saw was actual death.. not brook or his sword enma. Coz enma was forged, nobody is putting that grim reaper thing into enma. And if luffy dies, and goes to afterlife.. and some story thing happens there.. it will be cool. Like zoro meets ryuma and learns about black blade.. and luffy meets old joyboy. and joyboy tells what exactly happened.

i'm find with luffy defeating kaido and zoro taking his head

[vestal gulch]

if oda shoehorns in some dbz-esque afterlife arc I'd be really surprised tbh. That's borderline shark jumping territory there.

[muted ember]

I think the panel where Law and Kids eyes are popping out shows that Luffy's powers can affect ppl he's not even touching

[pure raven]

Brook with afterlife.. and there is underworld theme going on. I don't like naruto bullshit powerup from old dead person.. but learning about story would be nice

[pure raven]

mythical zoan .. there is 0 need to discuss that. we all know luffy can do whatever he wants. its loony toon power with no restrictions

although.. i think.. luffy cannot deal damage that way. If luffy can do whatever, and it can deal damage, nobody stands any chance against him. Technically, he can beat anyone at this point

Point being, i never saw anyone in cartoons getting hurt.. significantly. so, maybe luffy has that power. Luffy cannot get much damage, and luffy cannot do damage either. Perfect fruit for luffy

[muted ember]

He has restrictions due to his own stamina. And I don't think he can do whatever he wants

[frank forge]

Luffy being joyboy concludes that there will be a shanks and luffy gayporn

[pure raven]

manga stated it depends on his imagination. LIke making eyes pop up, running in air, getting big, .. these are examples of him doing whatever. And also, making kaido's body into rubber and expanding his belly.

It also says luffy is coated in armamanet and kings haki the entire time. So, if he could do damage, punchine straight through kaido's head, with advanced kings haki coating.. yh, that would kill kaido. but it did no damage? I think it only hurts, but does no actual damage

[ashen surge]

he didnt punch throug kaidos face, he stretched kaidos face

[vestal gulch]

yeah that was an oddly drawn panel

[prime magnet]

He punched him from the side

[vestal gulch]

it's surprising oda didn't add stretch lines or something to make that face punch a bit clearer. He obviously wasn't going for 'luffy literally impaled kaido's head', but that's what it looks like at first glance

[steady gull]

someone pass me rule 34

[vestal orbit]

good theory

[ripe geyser]

Yeah I can’t deny that Oda drew that panel a bit awkwardly

I understand that Oda was trying to show that Luffy stretches Kaido’s face but it truly did look like Luffy donutted him with the punch which isn’t the case due to the last panel

[viscid heart]

Do you think Joyboy is a title or a person that lived in the void century?

[gleaming lintel]

kinda both

[timid bolt]

I don't really have evidence to back this up other than other movies or shows but I think Shanks will be the ultimate/final boss villain

[prime magnet]

I actually think it was multiple people

[lunar shell]

Both.

I think we will never know or see what happen in Teach blackhole.

I think Oda will want to show he can't act on this realm

[viscid heart]

welp , i kinda agree too

Joyboy's name later becomes a title, kinda thing ig

[pure raven]

Yo, what y'all think about JoyBoy skeleton is on Laugh Tale. We have a quote in One Piece which appears several times: When we die, all we left is bones.
Like Luffy said to Kaido in the current fight. Like the line on Binksu Sake (which seems to be like written from Joy Boy). My guess is Joy Boy and Luffy have the same philosophy of life. Not being afraid of death and don't value what others will tell about you when you are gone. As they take many things lightly, always with a smile, even if they are close to die.
People like Roger and Oden lived the same way and died with a smile, taking it lightly. And remember the first chapter when Luffy told Corby: If I die fighting for my goal, it is OK.
My further guess is that all Jolly Rogers represent Joy Boy (the first pirate?). When look up someone, you can see the bones. And the skull is smiling. Not afraid because he lived free.
When Gol D Rogers crew arrived at Laugh Tale, they find the skeleton with a message: All I left is bones. The crew starts laughing.

[left hare]

is there break this week?

[lunar shell]

Its possible its a name cuz Luffy is " laughy " so he is actually literally related to Joy

[warm nexus]

Oni is the third missing specie in Big Mom's collection. Giants, Lunarians and Onis.

[viscid heart]

finna get kaido for that

[viscid heart]

it's possible too , yea and joyboy most probably has a D in his name too or he might even have something to with it's origin

[lunar shell]

That doesn't relate to " an awesome treasure "

[lunar shell]

D.efinitly.

[viscid heart]

idk man, it's kinda creepy

[lyric berry]

That would be horrifying to stumble upon

[fluid snow]

This is just hypothetical situation but lets say after Wano we have luffys bounty goes 4.5 billion or more.

What could blackbeard do that will keep him step above luffy? What are possible situation?

Maybe kill an admiral and steal their fruit? Off screen defeat of shanks crew. Maybe an attack on celestial dragons important property?

Im in for Kizarus off screen death tbh.

[lyric berry]

I’m a prominent believer of BB getting a third power (or already having one the whole time before yami yami)

What that power is I got no clue. But it ain’t gonna be resin

[pure raven]

Another clue of mine would be Brook. People get scared by him too. But he makes jokes about it. "My eyes will popp out, but I have no eyes left" etc... The first person who sang Binksu Sake. Maybe a hint. Brooks symbolizes many important things. He lived after he died. Like Joy Boy and Roger knew: We won't die.

Additional, there is this famous pirate phrase: A dead man tells no tales. Maybe Oda wants to flip this around. A dead man (Joy Boy) tells the Laugh Tale, like Brook (dead man) sings Binksu Sake, which says on its own line: What a laughing tale or something like that.

[lyric berry]

I think he can do that without leaving his corpse for people to find

[late token]

Yeah I think it will be either a conflict with the marines where he beats an admiral or he destroys WCI while big mom is gone

[pure raven]

I am not saying his skeleton is the One Piece. Just that it is there.

[lyric berry]

I know but that doesn’t make it less creepy. Idk how “leaving my smiling dead body for future generations to find” constitutes as a joke. It would come across as horrifying for both discoverers and readers

Like my first reaction to finding a smiling skeleton would not be laughter. It would be “oh Jesus “

[wary dagger]

Well yeah, the skeleton alone is creepy. It's its relation to the lyrics in the song making it a pun that's supposed to make it funny.

[thorny bloom]

Maybe the one piece is a plan to unite the 2 world's divided by the grand line into one by destroying the grand line, thus making it "ONE PIECE"
Which could only be achieved by using the power of the ancient weapons
And luffy as joyboy has control over it

[ashen surge]

You can read the japanese name of One Piece also "One sea at peace"

[idle dew]

and "the rope that connects all men"

i think the one piece is a time capsule

[ripe geyser]

One piece is an object

when Oda says One Piece is an object I'm not sure is he's implying that a gigantic, unified sea can be an object

Making a unified sea could very well be what roger was "too early" for though

one thing is certain: finding the one piece isn't the end of Luffy's journey

Luffy still has the grand task of "turning the world upside down" and this can't be done if you are too early

[tranquil anchor]

What if Luffy has been the only joy boy? What if the next arc is them getting sent to the past and Luffy takes on the name joy boy to hide his identity but they fail their mission and he looses his hat which would explain the giant hat. So the final arc is luffy getting his straw hat back.... just a thought.

[ashen surge]

I really hope Luffy doesn’t have any of that Chosen One lineage crap

[ripe geyser]

well Luffy's own personality and character undoubtedly made him worthy of "becoming a Joyboy"

Luffy's sheer determination, willpower, carefree personality and creativity is what allowed him to awaken a fruit that hadn't awakened in 800 years

[pure raven]

Well, he quitely has.. The grandson of Garp the Hero, son of Dragon, the most dangerous man in the world, brother of Ace, the son of the pirate king etc

[ripe geyser]

Oda is most definitely not gonna make it so that the prophecy is "A dude named Monkey D. Luffy will be born in 20 years and he's gonna bring the dawn"

and if Oda did do this I would truly be disappointed

I just wanna know why and how Oden was so sure that pirates would come save the land of Wano in 20 years

[idle dew]

an object that destroys the red line and connects all men if you will

[ripe geyser]

If the One Piece is what Roger found on laugh tale then no it's not an object that destroys the red line

I'm thinking pluton is what does that

[idle dew]

grandson of garp
and? its not like he trained him or whatever, i would say that makes luffy less of a chosen one considering he abandoned him

son of dragon
also abandoned him...

brother of ace
why does that matter, that's so random lmfao

[ripe geyser]

ace is the son of the pirate king

[idle dew]

and

[idle dew]

why, it could still be a silly weapon like for ex; a rubber ducky

[ripe geyser]

not implying anything else, but Luffy was pretty much bound to accomplish great things

[idle dew]

i still dont get how that's the case at all
just because he knew ace doesn't mean anything

he isn't bound to accomplish great things, the only thing that could imply that is him being a D

[ripe geyser]

"Joyboy, I wish I lived in the same era as you!"

-Roger after laughing

I feel like laugh tale is just a stupid picture book about joyboy and that Noland The Liar hinted at One Piece

[slate mirage]

he wasnt really abandoned. it's not like they don't have any feelinga for Luffy

[ripe geyser]

Dragon def abandoned Luffy

[idle dew]

ok but something that'd imply he's destinied for greatness is smth like "trained by the world's most wanted criminal" or "raised by the hero of the marines"

[ripe geyser]

feelings for Luffy or not, it is without question that Dragon abandoned Luffy

[idle dew]

whitebeard said this:
when someone finds it, the world will be shaken to it's core, a huge battle will engulf

how does that do so

[slate mirage]

he also saved Luffy at loguetown, i wonder why if he abandoned him

[ripe geyser]

because the new era is an era where you won't be "too early" if you find One Piece

[slate mirage]

Luffy was trained by the right hand of the pirate king

[idle dew]

and that's the only valid point

[ripe geyser]

in this new era you can actually turn the world upside down if you find One Piece

[ashen surge]

Truly Luffy is special and has the qualities to get to the top but I don’t like the idea it has to be Luffy

[ripe geyser]

whatever Roger was too early for, someone else won't be too early for if they find One Piece

[pure raven]

Garp did not train Luffy? Wtf? Guy wanted to make him a strong marine

[idle dew]

it's just the poseidon weapon wasn't born yet, maybe he needed all 3 weapons
you're looking too much into the whole "too early" thing

[ripe geyser]

Luffy was thrown into a forest with deadly animals at a young age and Garp tried building him into a strong marine, chasing after Luffy and shit. Luffy also explored and adventured with Sabo and Ace, getting stronger by running into trouble like that too. Luffy himself even said he trained his rubber techniques for 10 years before setting sail

[pure raven]

And if you dont understand what the matter between Ace and Luffy is, as they got brothers by drinking sake and inspiring each other you are missing huge points

[ripe geyser]

Luffy was bound to become someone strong based on the environment he grew up in, but hopefully he isn't fated to free the world upon being born cause that would be dumb

[idle dew]

how does luffy exploring with sabo and ace and him training with his rubber abilities make him destined to become pk LMAO

[ripe geyser]

I never said that? Are you a fucking idiot?

[ashen surge]

Hey manners

[idle dew]

.

[ripe geyser]

Bound to achieve great things does not imply becoming pirate king

[idle dew]

still tho bro, croc said he trained with his fruit to master it, is he detined to accomplish great things?

the point is weak

[ripe geyser]

it's based on the environment Luffy grew up in that was bound to make him strong. He was thrown into a forest with bandits and dangerous animals and had to fight for his life. Oh, also Garp tried making him a strong marine. Garp is the guy who fought with Roger to stop the world's strongest pirate crew btw.

I'm not saying Luffy was predetermined to become strong because of his sheer existence, it's because of where and how he grew up

[ashen surge]

I said that I hope Luffy is not some chosen one or some other prophecy crap and you’re arguing that it was inevitable that he’s going to become a prominent figure in the world

[idle dew]

you changed your fucking point

[ripe geyser]

1. I didn't
2. Don't continue this argument, HALT

[pure raven]

I think he is not the chosen one but will become the chosen one, the one Roger waited for

[ashen surge]

You don’t ”become” the chosen one

[ripe geyser]

Luffy finding One Piece and changing the world isn't something that was predetermined before Luffy was born

and if it was I would be incredibly disappointed

[idle dew]

correct
"a very rare few" are the D clan
but it's not teach

[idle dew]

dw this isn't naruto it won't happen

[ripe geyser]

yeah I bet Oda's got better stuff in store, plus he wouldn't wanna repeat Kishimoto's ideas

[pure raven]

You can, by achieving it to become pirate king, if he messes up it will be Blackbeard for example

[idle dew]

they were friends when both were releasing weekly, he would learn from his friends mistakes

[ashen surge]

Being chosen one is that your destiny is predetermined

[late token]

I think the official translation is different isn’t it? Isn’t whitebeard talking in singular there?

[ripe geyser]

This is a very interesting line too, the men that Roger waits for. There isn't one and only one person Roger is waiting for, which likely means Luffy's whole Joyboy thing wasn't predetermined before he was born.

[idle dew]

idk, it's really obvious to me the "men" are the D. clan

especially when oda went through the trouble to show us the scene between WB and roger of him asking about D.

[idle dew]

not sure sorry, but it's the same in the anime

[late token]

Ah okay then I think plural is correct when they also use plural in anime

[pure raven]

Change the vocabulary if you want 😂 Switch "chosen one" with "pirate king", satisfied? 🙂

[ashen surge]

Completely different things so yes

[late token]

U guys think BB is lying about his name? Maybe he is not a D.

[idle dew]

wait why, he doesn't know what D. means yet

also for fuck's sake this cooldown

[ripe geyser]

I definitely think Luffy's own personality and development (and circumstance of eating the Nika fruit) aren't predetermined

[late token]

I mean IF whitebeard is talking about the D. In that panel. He practically says BB isn’t one of them

[idle dew]

oh wait, that's the plural you were talking about, let me check the scene in the anime again sorry

[pure raven]

Rocks D Xebec is another D who was a mf like Blackbeard, I dont think it is fake

[late token]

Yeah I remember he says „it’s not you“ would be great if u can check 🙂

[pure raven]

He might be a guy like Xebec

[ashen surge]

Xebec and BB have to be related somehow

[idle dew]

wtf, the entire "very rare few" part is entirely omitted

[late token]

Yeah that’s what I remembered

[idle dew]

that's actually really weird

[late token]

So he is talking singular and not about multiple men

[ashen surge]

It’s just in the subs, probably original audio line has the exact part

[idle dew]

should i check the dub or

"It's not you teach, the man roger was waiting for is definitely not you, not a damn chance"

[late token]

I think this is official translation

[pure raven]

I want to know what Blackbeards plan for the world is

[idle dew]

screw the translator that added the "very rare few" part 💀

[ashen surge]

He just a powehungry monger

[idle dew]

WB lowkey spoiled all of one piece before he died tho

[pure raven]

He wants to eat all devil fruits 🤣

[late token]

I hope and think that BB grew up in a country that heavily screwed by the power dynamic of the current one piece world and that he wants all the power in the world to be pretty much king of the world

[ashen surge]

That was Doffy

[idle dew]

was about to say that

[pure raven]

Yes, I always imagined that Luffys and Blackbeards goal has some similarities, like to bring the world government down, but the way they want to achieve it will be very different

[idle dew]

i really hope oda doesn't mess up blackbeard, he's super interesting, i feel like he'll become one of the best antags we've ever seen

[idle dew]

blackbeard and luffy step on laughtale, the news reach the entire world so the marines head there too, they work together to hold them off then blackbeard backstabs luffy

[ashen surge]

I’ve been pondering if Pluton was a warship that was able to harness the power of the devil fruits and maybe BB is some vegapunk lab experiment to make a person who can be rigged with multiple fruits

[idle dew]

blackbeard is a result of eugenics 😲, oddly dark, love it

[ashen surge]

This only because Pluton and Cerberus are related in Greek mythology and BB is a Cerberus

[pure raven]

Or Corby and Luffy vs Blackbeard like Garp and Roger vs Xebec

[idle dew]

i like that idea but there's no way coby gets that stronk

[pure raven]

Good point

[ashen surge]

Coby will be the good cop to help overthrow WG and be the reformist ”good” admiral of the marines

[late token]

God I hate the BB is a cerberus theory I hope that doesn’t come true ^^

[idle dew]

it has convincing evidence

[ashen surge]

Yeah I’m merely going with what is in the script

[late token]

As convincing as the resin theory was to me ^^

[pure raven]

What is the name of Blackbeards ship? Queen Annes Revenge like the former ship from the real Blackbeard?

[ashen surge]

Sword of Xebec

[idle dew]

"Xebec's Saber"
we all gave different answers lmfao 💀

[late token]

Saber of xebec

[pure raven]

Xebec of Saber

[idle dew]

nah it's actually Xebec's Sword of Saber

[ashen surge]

Cerberus in his jolly roger, multiple DF’s, not needing to sleep - Cerberus had three heads so they can guard Underworld in turns - etc not convincing to you?

[daring urchin]

Did roger and garp 2v1 rocks or fight rocks and his whole crew?

[late token]

Where is a Cerberus in his Jolly Roger? It just has 3 skulls doesn’t it? I think the df correlates with his weird body as Marco says in the paramount war. Sleep I think correlates with his upbringing in a war torn country

[pure raven]

Whole crew I think

[daring urchin]

Bruu

[ashen surge]

Three skulls is the cerberus, three people as one

[pure raven]

But Roger and Garp werent alone too bro

[atomic portal]

does any one think current luffy can control gravity

[ashen surge]

BB was weird even before he got yami

[pure raven]

blackbeard doesn’t sleep at night

[fluid snow]

Nahhh.

[late token]

Yea but it’s not exclusive to a Cerberus ^^ if he also had a dog on his Jolly Roger then it would be more convincing to me ^^

[idle dew]

"weird body" is a lame explanation that was probably dropped to showcase that no one knows how

and the sleep... a normal human can't live for long long

[ripe geyser]

What if BB has 3 total personalities and each one sleeps for 8 hours

[ashen surge]

So what do you think? Why is BB like he is?

[pure raven]

yeah garp probably had a large bulk of the marines and roger had his crew, would like to think garp beat whitebeard, roger beat rocks and rayleigh beat kaido or big mom

[night glade]

well, there’s not much confirmation on who else was there except the regular old gen marines (not admirals)

[ripe geyser]

So in a day…
1st 8 hours: personalities 1 and 2
Next 8 hours: personalities 1 and 3
Final 8 hours: personalities 2 and 3

[idle dew]

I think WB betrayed rocks and helped roger and garp

[pure raven]

https://preview.redd.it/p31ry69g53s41.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=264666433762a1204f1bbf49a116c479e40d4c2e

[idle dew]

https://preview.redd.it/p31ry69g53s41.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=264666433762a1204f1bbf49a116c479e40d4c2e

[late token]

No sleep = bc he is from a war torn snowy country. Multiple DF = weird body and/or Yami yami

[pure raven]

yeah whiteboards personality vs the rocks who wanted to rule the world doesn’t make sense

[idle dew]

He'd literally die if he didn't sleep bro, shit upbringing or not

[pure raven]

remember buggy said he doesn’t sleep plus that sbs drawing of kid blackbeard crying at night

[atomic portal]

bro its non fiction