manga-theories

[light onyx]

That has ruined my day

[modest skiff]

This is not true

[velvet edge]

@static anvil please keep the joke posts like that in #manga or #also-manga this channel is for serious theories only

[static anvil]

ok sorry

[pure raven]

what if observation haki is REAL and every blind peoples have it!

[mild oak]

There has been lot of speculation about this

[modest skiff]

Lots of speculation but no real hints or any reason to think anything concrete. We know very little about Shanks atm

[mild oak]

True I am not sure that portgas is his real name but it's all just people say I am just intruged in all these mistries

[elfin lynx]

The Wado Ichimonji was once Ushimaru's sword when he was born on Ringo

[silk sandal]

Let just go with it

[real swan]

This is the first I've heard the theory that people call him portgas. Why's that?

Or specifically why do they think he has that name?

[modest skiff]

There’s no indicators. It’s just people spinning the theory wheel and it landing on “family connection” and “something that would be really wild”. I looked into it and basically just found click bait posts that were baseless. If someone has something compelling, perhaps they can post it. But as you can see above, no one really cited anything or elaborated on anything

[bitter kraken]

Idk if this has been asked but kings horns or spikes that he had on his head, they’re not real right? They’re part of his gimp suit?

[vestal orbit]

probably

king would probably make some sort of reaction to his horn being cut off if that weren't the case

[junior cape]

Who's the guy who was saying something about a poneglyph in Impel Down? Just checked the wiki and there is no known poneglyph there. Not even a filler episode one.

Though I wouldn't put it past the WG to put one there to keep it hidden from the world.

[bitter kraken]

I think it would be dangerous to keep one where it’s packed with powerful enemies of the world gov, and they know impel down can be broken out of

[junior cape]

Well let's examine that thought. In its ENTIRE HISTORY, certainly hundreds of years long, perhaps even back to the void century, has only been broken out of TWICE. That's a pretty good track record. That makes it pretty safe to place sensitive info in, especially in the deeper levels like level 6, or even deeper (if they exist).

[weak arrow]

Actually at least 3 times since Morley escaped at some point

[junior cape]

Yes but Morley's escape was unknown for at least 60 years, as that's when Shiki broke out. Her escape was probably only discovered when she joined the revolutionary army, and started raising hell.

[queen arrow]

i don't know if this is the right place for this question, but i think Jozu would reflect the laser

[silk sandal]

I think joyboy had the Goum Goum no mi

[raw palm]

Goum?

[junior cape]

Doum Doum give me Goum Goum

🗿

[silk sandal]

Wat

The fruit thingy

[junior cape]

It's either Gum Gum no mi or Gomu Gomu no mi. Not Goum Goum.

[limpid holly]

an extension to my Nordic mythology, Kaido's Oni Demon-Giant Race and Elbaf Giants.

it just interesting that he used the word Ragnarku since it sounds like Ragnarok, which is basically Nordic Mythology version of Armageddon

@green basin here is my theory's thread if you're interested to read

[silk sandal]

Yup 💀

[junior cape]

He forgor 💀

[raw palm]

Ragnaraku is Ragnarok then acc to nordic

[junior cape]

yes

The next 5 chapters are gonna be the longest 10 minutes in One Piece history

[amber oar]

the Namek special

[junior cape]

But here's how I think it'll go.
With Perospero and Jack out of the picture now, the upper officers are gonna start dropping. First it'll be Queen, then King. Then we'll get some interludes of Luffy and Kaido, as well as Momo and Yamato holding back the island. Next, it'll be the leader fights. It'll swap back and forth between 3 fronts, being Everyone vs. Beast Pirates (Gotta keep them at bay otherwise the raid is toast, even with officers down), Kid/Law/Killer vs. Big Mom (This assumes that Killer finds a way to kill/incapacitate Hawkins without killing Kid, which I think he will manage), and finally Luffy vs. Kaido (The whole enchilada). Finally, in about 2 months, with some breaks in there, Big Mom will fall. At the sign of this, a lot of the Beast Pirates will give up, because "They just took down an emperor! Now what????". As more and more underlings surrender/get taken out, the tide on the performance floor will turn, until it's just mopping up the stragglers/diehards as Everyone vs. Beast Pirates wraps up. However, the fighting will not end until Kaido is down, and that'll take another month or more. But once it does, there'll be much rejoicing, and things will work out from there.

Of course it'll be either 1028 or 1029 when the people of Wano look up at the moon and notice a big f*ck-off island floating towards them. Then panic will set in on the capital. That is, until they see a dragon flying around it trying to push it back, and then they'll mostly calm down again.

After that, it's the race against the clock for the people of Wano. No reasonable way out, no time to run, they gotta believe that someone will come to save them.

And then Katakuri will come riding in on a pegasus with a cart full of donuts, ready to save the day After Kaido goes down, Momo will maneuver the island to Kuri, or perhaps another part of Wano, and leave it in the wastelands.

[untold yacht]

Just had this thought so not much detail but what if king is the one who kills kaido, so what if after losing to lufffy, kaido takes his defeat honorably but misses out on dying so maybe king rushes to kaido saying that they should retreat but kaido says hes done and now all he wants is death which would give him his satisfaction and as we know king admires and respects kaido a lot so he would respect kaido's wish and kill him.

[vestal orbit]

not to be a "ThE RAiD WiLl fAiL" conspiracy theorist, but i can't help but feel like wano might end on a bit of a downer

Kaido and possibly Big Mom are definitely falling here, but CP-0 is just chilling in Onigashima this entire time, not fighting with anyone, just relaxing and enjoying the view while the Big Mom-Kaido and Samurai-Pirate-Mink alliances tear each other to shreds

There's pretty much no way that CP-0 members are nearly as strong as Luffy or Kaido at this point, but they're definitely still a force to be reckoned with, and when the smoke clears, Luffy's going to be exhausted, half-dead, beaten up, etc

Unless CP-0 decides to fuck off out of Wano because reasons, I don't see how the alliance will be able to fight them off

actually ig if something like what Kira wrote happens, Kaido could decide to meet his end fighting them or smthn

[modest skiff]

Aren’t the BM pirates on their way? Maybe I’m just confused but imo once all her folks show up, BM being defeated feels extremely unlikely

[modest skiff]

First of all, my prediction is that CP0 are robots who ate artificial human human fruits.

I agree they are likely strong in some way but I anticipate they are highly functionalized. I think one of them is good at restraining, one is good at escaping, perhaps one has raw strength, something along those lines. I still have absolutely no idea what they are there for. I think one of them can fly though, so I’m really expecting them to kidnap at least 1 person and escape. I agree with your basic premise that cp0 will be successful in some way

[vestal orbit]

that would be really cool, but i personally doubt it considering lucci, kaku, and stussy seem to be human

wouldn't make sense to promote regular humans to the same organization as machines since they'd be a bit less predictable and controllable

~~unless they got pacifistacized ~~

[pure raven]

how many human human fruits can there be?

arnt there like 3 or 4 in circulation right now already?

[light onyx]

There could be many we don’t know

[pure raven]

what was the foxes human human model again?

[modest skiff]

Maybe I am misremembering timeline stuff but I don’t think we know the cp0 we saw in Dressrosa/Wano came after the whole Enies Lobby debacle. Since Vegapunk tried to replace warlords with robots, maybe he tried to replace cp9 with cp0. And maybe the former agents of cp9 were moved into cp0 partially to keep their existence secret. All fairly baseless, but I think it’s possible. Also possible so much has happened that I’ve confused myself though. But if I am thinking of this right, we don’t have any idea when cp0 became a thing.

No idea @pure raven . Could be a lot. But I’m saying I think Vegapunk may have had an easier time making artificial human fruits. Maybe since Vegapunk knows more about human lineage factor than dragon lineage factor, he had a relatively easier time making artificial human fruits

[vestal orbit]

so far we've got onimaru's, sengoku's and chopper's

[pure raven]

ohhh i thought you meant just straight up human human fruits not artificial ones

[vestal orbit]

eh, not sure either, prolly need to do a reread soon

[pure raven]

i believe in the theory (i think its pinned here somewhere) thjat the CP0 members in wano are bigmoms childhood friends from elbaf

[modest skiff]

Whoa, I’ll check that out if it’s pinned

Edit: don’t see it pinned so if you happen to find it id appreciate a link

[pure raven]

I thought it was posted here somewhere but maybe i was just looking around the reddit after reading spoilers a few months ago either way I found some screenshot through google that sums it up.

i guess the theory goes that since all of her childhood friends were from the sheeps house mother caramel sold them to the WG to become cipher pol agents.

Or after big mom went on her rampage and ate mother caramel, cipher pol/ the WG came and cleaned up their dirty work that got left behind and snatched up the kids while they were there.

[severe edge]

from what I recall oda always finishes everyone else's fights before finishing zoro, sanji and luffy's fights so I think killer vs hawkins will finish first then kid/law vs BM then sanji/zoro vs king/queen

[quaint dove]

I think this might be a bit of an exception considering BM is involved in a fight

[severe edge]

kid/law vs BM will probably not finish in them beating BM maybe immobilizing her or maybe it'll go on till the marines arrive when BM is forced to retreat cause as much as I want it I still don't see kidd/law beating BM maybe nami will get control of zeus and shock BM hard enough for her to forget she's BM and go into little linlin mode

tama taking control of BM could also be possible considering how much of a moster she is but I doubt it

[tawdry blaze]

I think she would be knocked off the island and maybe brook or nami or both would get rid of her new cloud thing.

[mild oak]

That's not how it works.

[opaque rain]

What ya think Abt this

[proven sand]

My question: some people in the world sure know about what happened in the void century....and probably its something shocking....but why they dont spread the news of what happened? they keep that as a secret....

[wet perch]

They may have, but over the hundreds of years since it happened, it probably turned into a game of telephone. The information has been warped by time and government suppression. The pieces are probably all there, waiting to be assembled.

[proven sand]

Dunno...i cannot think what will be in laugh tale...but its pretty strange that learning about all the tragedie that happened in the void century make you laugh

[wet perch]

May have been something super ironic

[severe edge]

If that's the case then welp shanks will have to lose cause the plot has already set to BB's defeat through the hands of luffy
The first part I can get behind but not the second

[severe edge]

They'll risk their own life and the life of the person they're telling it to

Also they probably don't know everything just some parts of it ao it's not worth it to tell half the story to someone and risk their life and the ones close to them for them to accomplish nothing the ones powerful enough to accomplish it will still have to go down the dangerous path anyway

[wild turret]

If Oda doesn’t let Luffy return the hat to shanks I’ll be pissed 😤

[lethal heath]

Luffy will keep the hat imo

He’ll give it to his successor, I feel like shanks will pass away or something.

[pine delta]

the only way i see shanks "making a move" is if he tells luffy to go to elbaf and davy black fight (which like...idk if sending an invitation counts as making a move?), he reveals himself as the cp0 at onigashima (makes absoluitely no sense but how else would he get there in time) or he attacks blackbeard/mariejois (narraratively taking himself out of the story, because luffy is the one to win those fights, so he will never be cool ever). thinking it all through im leaning elbaf but id love to hear another theory

luffy could be "returning the hat" just by being another amazing pirate to continue the straw hat legacy, kind of like shanks gets a return on investment. then luffy passes it on to Buffy for two piece

[night cedar]

i think luffy wont return the hat

[pine delta]

it really won't make sense for him to do that. its not like shanks returned his hat to roger

[night cedar]

right

[rustic granite]

yep

[lethal heath]

I still don’t get how Shanks was able to get a meeting with the world elders

[runic osprey]

Lots of theories about that for example some speculate that he used to be a celestial dragon

[static anvil]

I have a theory about Gomu Gomu No awakening:
1)I think user will get an invincible rubber (can be extended up to infinite).
2)Maybe ability to control body size (can transform into an giant or dwarf)(based on gear 3)also user(luffy)will be able to use gear 3 or 4 without necessity to transform into balloon, so damage will be a lot bigger.
3)Immunity to physic attacks just because rubber will absorb damage, but if enemy's haki is strong enough this ability will not work.
(sorry for my English)

[tacit veldt]

OR Shanks surprises everyone by actually doing what an emperor would do: go after the One Piece

[reef oar]

As we seem to be reaching the climax of the raid, something is still bothering me: who was that with the akuzaya? It doesn't look like Oden... Any guesses?

[eager pasture]

i think portgas d rouge was using gomu gomu fruit because she carried ace 20 months

[bitter kraken]

People think that’s either hyori, toki or Enel I forget who else

[static anvil]

why Enel? he is chilling on the moon

[reef oar]

Just kind of seems like we're at the point where that person would be revealed

[bitter kraken]

My money is on it being toki, but peeps think it’s enel based on the looks and other stuff I forget lol but whoever it is they look small right? And enel is a big dude. Buy anything is possible

[fallen wigeon]

toki

[static anvil]

is hyori or small chances for toki cuz she dyed 20 years ago but possibly she teleported to present and waited until war start

[weak arrow]

no one seriously thinks it's enel. 99% of the readers thinks it's hiyori

[bitter kraken]

Lol idk man I think I remember a few legit thinking it’s enel 😆 but I don’t thinks it’s hiyori because the fish guy who’s name I cannot spell would have been panicked I think if it was hiyori and woulda rushed out to find her but because he was like no it couldn’t be, I think it’s toki because to him and everyone else toki is dead so he’s sorta like thinking he’s seeing things of sum

[weak arrow]

I don't think Kawamatsu believewed it was Hiyori because he didn't think she would be there. I'd say the reason Denjiro is missing is because, just like you said, he's basically panicked and is rushing to find Hiyori

[static anvil]

What Enel forget in Wano? And if the person from image is really Enel, why is he crying?

[proven copper]

Chat do you think after wano arc, Law will still join the strawhat or no?

[static anvil]

lol no he have his own crew, but he can remain in alliance with straw hats

[ornate loom]

If he finds out that luffy is one step away from one piece after Wano he will probably try to kill him xd

[static anvil]

nah

[balmy wigeon]

What if Law takes down BM with minimal support from Kidd?

[pine delta]

people keep theorizing about devil fruit awakenings when we only have one example of it (doflamingo) and the fact doffy is a celestial dragon and has secret info points me to believe the two are closely related to use effectively. We still don't have it confirmed for katakuri)

[balmy wigeon]

Wouldn't crocodile also have an awakened DF?

[pine delta]

@balmy wigeon as a law fanboy i would despise this, the best they are gonna do is occupy and stall her

theres only 5 confirmed canon instanced, the jailer beasts in impel down and doflamingo

[balmy wigeon]

Crocodile's dehydration ability and able to make deserts sounds like an awakening

[pine delta]

we can speculate about awakening all we want but nothing is really confirmed yet.

it makes sense to me too but we just don't know, its been an absurd amount of chapters since doffy used awakening and we still know almost nothing about how it works

[balmy wigeon]

Luffy probably has his awakening already

and I think it's damage reflection

His df is not that special at all, it looks very similar to BB's yami yami no mi

[pure raven]

Iirc Kata also had df awakened.

[balmy wigeon]

I think the WG confused the two fruits

[sand sail]

The yami yami is the single most unique fruit in the series tho

[balmy wigeon]

that's what I'm saying, BB's fruit is arguably the best and most powerful df to have

but you won't know what it is until you bite into it

the encyclopedia has limited number of df's and the yami yami and gomu gomu looks similar

[sand sail]

Well, someone had, because Blackbeard knew all about the Yami Yami and the Gomu Gomu was known to Shanks and his crew before Luffy ate it

[balmy wigeon]

I think Rocks had it

and this dude wanted to take over the world

[sand sail]

He shouldn't have, and the two fruits don't actually look too similar

[pine delta]

@pure raven I looked it up, on the wiki it just states it looked similar but was unconfirmed

[balmy wigeon]

the difference is real small

http://onepiecegold.altervista.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/3-10.jpg

the WG would get these confused

[sand sail]

They're not even the same shape though, the only thing they have in common are the swirls and color, but not even the swirls properly

[pine delta]

i can see that happening but, both fruits were correctly identified ahead of time by the groups that had possession of them

[balmy wigeon]

Shanks probably thought it was the Yami Yami as well

but when it was the rubber fruit, he left it to luffy

[pine delta]

even whos who knew what devil fruit it was

[balmy wigeon]

he knows now

[pine delta]

luffy accidentally ate it in chapter 1 and immidiately identified luffy as a gum gum human

[balmy wigeon]

I just hope Oda doesn't make the df special

the rubber fruit was supposed to be something silly that becomes overpowered if used correctly

[sand sail]

He couldn't really "leave" it to Luffy, he didn't want Luffy to have it

There's no way to remove it after all

[balmy wigeon]

what would have happened if it was the yami yami fruit luffy ate?

[pure raven]

It is confirmed awakened

[sand sail]

Then we'd have a protagonist with the most overpowered fruit ability in the series, but he'd still have had it

[balmy wigeon]

I don't think shanks would save him

[static anvil]

Katakuri have confirmed awakening

[balmy wigeon]

Katakurri has the most versatile df ever

after that, Don Flamingo

[cloud stag]

who is don flamingo

[static anvil]

Doflamingo

[sand sail]

The most versatile fruits are the Ito Ito, Ope Ope, Soru Soru and Buki Buki. Katakuri's isn't much more than a typical logia's would be lol

But his awakening was confirmed the moment he used it

[cloud stag]

ok ok

[static anvil]

His fruit is not logia is a paramecia

[faint aspen]

So guys who who do u think is the most powerful haki user is ??

[sand sail]

It's a logia in literally all but name, that's why I put him with them

[pine delta]

if you look up devil fruit awakening the wiki has conflicting information @static anvil

[sand sail]

This isn't really a theory for the channel, that's best asked in #manga or #also-manga

The wiki isn't a relevant source, the series confirmed he's awakened as soon as he uses it if that's the question

[pine delta]

ok just wanted to make sure thanks

[cloud stag]

his fruit if diff from logia
For a DF to be a logia:

1. It has to be liquid or molten or gaseous or plasma like.
2. The user must be able to completely form his body into the DF.
3. It has to be elemental.

[sand sail]

If you needed the scan, it's chap 882

[pure raven]

Never trust wiki completely

[cloud stag]

katakuri's df satisfies condition 1 and 2 not 3rd

[sand sail]

The third bit here is the only thing you list even remotely fact

[native flower]

shanks and his crew knew it was the gum gum, cus they realized right away that luffy had eaten it

[sand sail]

It's also not actually confirmed, Oda's never gone on record saying exactly what a logia needs. We know for a fact Katakuri fits it in all but name because it was so close Oda's editor made the mistake of calling him a logia on debut

He is in, literally all but name and maybe substance, a logia fruit user. We just assume because it's mochi and not something more naturally occurring, that must be the reason he's only a special paramecia

[native flower]

i always thought katakuri had more in common with doflamingo in actuality than luffy

like him and luffy are visually similar so all the parallels will be there but in practice he is more similar to doflamingo with the multiple tendrils and all that

[pine delta]

bet thanks guys

is that official translation?

[pure raven]

is it true kaido wants to continued rocks Will in order to destroy the world government is it true that rocks is not really bad but he just want to destroy the world government or imu sama :))) so he can be the king of the world and make the wolrd free

[pine delta]

its entirely speculation with almost zero basis

[static anvil]

Is a special paramecia cuz he using observation haki and is looking like a logia but he just see future

[native flower]

also yeah katakuri not being able to transform himself fully into the mochi i feel like is the main separator between him being a logia and a paramecia

[pine delta]

i do wonder if the distinction only came about because oda knows how devil fruit system works and realized he made a critical error to how the lore works

so in a sense its a hint at the truth behind df abilities and framework

[sand sail]

No, Katakuri reacts entirely as a logia does. His observation is why armament haki seemingly didn't work on him

[hollow grotto]

yeah, he uses his Future Sight to prevent attacks from hitting him by shaping his body to adjust to the attacks rather than them just phasing through his body. A bit of a difference there, not sure if that was mentioned yet or not

[sand sail]

He still has attacks pass through him naturally, he doesn't need observation haki for it. That's strictly so that nothing can hurt him. Katakuri is fully capable of turning into his element and completely warping his body to any shape he wishes, and producing as much of it as he wishes as well, there is literally no difference between him and any other logia except maybe that his substance isn't classically naturally.

[native flower]

he is warping his body but he isnt turning it all into mochi right? i thought it was in a way similar to how luffy is

[modest skiff]

@bitter kraken probably thinking of me since I discussed this at length with BrotherE. I’m team Enel because a silhouette makes zero sense for Hiyori. I think Enel has enough admiration for the Moon and the moon has enough symbolism connection to Wano/AK that it’s conceivable Enel would end up being a fan of Wano and want to help Wano. It’s a bit of a tinfoil hat theory, but IMO Toki and Hiyori make even less sense. Toki is dead. A mysterious silhouette of Hiyori is really silly. Why make Hiyori mysterious? Because she was somewhere else on Wano recently? Does not justify a silhouette at all. And I’m also not convinced the dot we see is a tear. That’s another part of it. But the main thing is that it makes no sense to mysteriously silhouette Hiyori.

[hollow grotto]

ahh, so bullets for example, which contain no Armament Haki wouldn't require him to adjust himself manually, but conscience effort is made when something involves Armament Haki that would actually deal heavy blows like Luffy's fist?

[sand sail]

Yes

[hollow grotto]

alright, thanks for the clarification

[sand sail]

Nope, he's turning completely into mochi. Hang on, let me grab a page...

[pine delta]

as much as i want it to be enel, it would require him to have warped his character completely

[native flower]

i just saw it on the wiki you dont have to post

[pine delta]

still a lot of mysteries in this arc left

[native flower]

very interesting, i wonder if the classifications of logia paramecia and zoan are in universe and have the potential to be incomplete or imperfect

[modest skiff]

Not at all. He could have entirely selfish reasons for going to Wano and helping the scabbards

[hollow grotto]

agreed, a lot to explore here

[modest skiff]

Wano’s new dawn could be essential for something relating to the moon and the White Sea. I’ve written about my theories regarding the White Sea and Wano here before. There’s a lot that could happen in Wano to relate to the moon and White Sea

[pine delta]

enel would have to
-stop being arrogant
-for some reason, help the kozuki AFTER they fight kaido and heal them, but hide his identity, and also disapear after they are healed, and then also not help out in the battle at all despite him loving that sort of thing, not using electric powers, etc

it makes way more sense that its just hiyori. or potentially a "spirit of wano" type deal like with the merry

[native flower]

it has a higher chance of being vegapunk than enel imo lol

[hollow grotto]

I wonder if the anime is going to downright spoil another silhouette again

[pine delta]

by the time the anime gets there we will probably know who it is

[hollow grotto]

don't mind it honestly but it does make me curious

[native flower]

but i want to say its hiyori

[modest skiff]

Enel could have uncovered something on the moon relating to what mysteriously needs to happen in Wano at this date. We know Oden found writings describing what happens in Wano 20 years from when Oden died. Shiki found info about the same time as well. This info could also be on the moon. Enel could still only be after power while still needing Kozuki clan to win

[weak arrow]

Enel makes no sense whatsoever in any fathomable way. At least Toki is legitimate tinfoil. #1, Enel would have to be there for some reason/ #2, Enel would have to learn medical knowledge, #3, Enel would want to have to help the scabbards for some reason, #4, Enel would have to have some familiarity to someone for Kawamatsu's speech bubble to make sense.

Hiyori is mysterious because she isn't supposed to be there, just like how we saw a shadow following Jinbe/Robin, and that was likely Otama. Otama wasn't supposed to be there. Hiyori even stated she doesn't want to be seen by anyone due to the war, hence silhouetted. Why do you think Denjiro is missing if it isnt looking for Hiyori because he thought the person who helped them was her? Oda even set-us up with the knowledge that Hiyori can do this kind of aid when she did it for Zoro after he fought Killer.

[quaint dove]

Luffys first hit on him wasn’t coated in haki though was it? I always took him being a special paramecia being that his body is physically mochi but things won’t go through him like with other logias

[pine delta]

i totally forgot hiyori healed up zoro good catch

[hollow grotto]

Toki did the same for Oden when he was downed, so it makes a lot of sense if Hiyori learned that medical expertise from their mother (not sure if this has been shown to be proven or not).

[modest skiff]

I do think Hiyori is possible, I’m just still not convinced she would be Silhouette’d

[pine delta]

oda likes to silhouette things for no reason

[jade moon]

Kuina could be a possibility as well

[hollow grotto]

Oda likes to make people overthink small things, and I think this was one of those cases

I'm a huge victim of that trap myself

[pine delta]

oda literally ended the chapter with "who is that behind the door???" when its obviously orochi. hes just a troll

[sand sail]

No, he's completely a logia except presumably that he's made of mochi and not some classical or naturally occurring element. Katakuri gets hit multiple times without haki and doesn't need to do anything about it

[ivory nexus]

That's debatable

[static anvil]

so...why enel crying?

[modest skiff]

Wasn’t a silhouette though. Also not convinced that’s a tear from crying

[grizzled fog]

Dunno how on earth Hiyori could make less sense than Enel lol

[modest skiff]

But just to be clear I am not saying I am like 100% sure it’s Enel. It’s a silhouette. I’m just saying I think Enel more than Hiyori almost purely because silhouette of Hiyori would make even less sense than Enel

[weak arrow]

As a former-believer of the silhouette being hawkins, i can see why you don't think it's a tear. However, I literally cannot fathom what you just said.

[jade moon]

Yeah i literally see no one except kuina revealing zoro’s true identity..none of the other people in wano knows about zoro’s origin. There has to be someone narrating it.

[native flower]

i thought otama was at the fire festival with hitetsu?

[weak arrow]

that's otoko

[modest skiff]

I am saying that I have low confidence in any theory but I have more confidence in Enel because I think Hiyori makes verrrry little sense

[weak arrow]

did you read my long statement

[hollow grotto]

Hiyori makes less sense than Enel?

[modest skiff]

I did and I explained most of your hesitations

The message I sent right before yours explained my answer to most of your questions

[modest skiff]

And also this one

[weak arrow]

You have to jump through 10 hoops to try and explain Enel when you can jump through one to explain Hiyori

[modest skiff]

Yeah, I can see that perspective

I just have a feeling this is a lot more spicy than Hiyori

But I won’t pretend I have some huge stack of evidence. It’s a silhouette and I don’t think it looks like Hiyori and I don’t think it would be Hiyori. My spider senses tell me it isn’t Hiyori but I won’t pretend that should convince you guys. Just saying that’s what I think

[ivory nexus]

Aah just let oda handled it

[pine delta]

we will find out probably very soon, have not heard from denjiro in a long time

[hollow grotto]

what was he last seen doing?

[ivory nexus]

But I am more concern about carrot turning into silong form (as it was explained those who can not controlled the power of sulong turns berserk) neko also mentioned it be careful

[static anvil]

probably is hiyori cuz she just can jump to this ship with Tama

[native flower]

carrot can already control her sulong form, we saw her sink some battleships earlier using it, i think right now the concern is transforming again, as i think its life threatening to go sulong multiple times

[ivory nexus]

Nah she ranoff immediately after that if I remember correctly and I bet oda did that intentially

[native flower]

she was laying down inside the sunny and resting

[ivory nexus]

Or maybe some kindoff side effects

[static anvil]

she don't need to transform into sulong cuz neko win the battle and is no necessity

[ivory nexus]

Ikr but neko mentioned it that's why am sayin this

• we r still on act 3 maybe some kind of tragedy will happened (not raid failing)

[static anvil]

Kin'emon,Kikunojo,Ashura Doji... (ik is not confirmed)

[native flower]

i still wanna know what the FUCK aokigi is up to

[static anvil]

maybe he want to kill bb

[ivory nexus]

He said something like this there r things which he can see better now or something like that I forgot😅

[pure raven]

Tbh the fact that he joined BB is unbelievable

[runic osprey]

Trying figure bb out maybe his plans and maybe stop him if needed

[pure raven]

Yeah maybe that's why he resigned

[runic osprey]

Nah he resigned cause of akainu

[pure raven]

But BB isn't stupid

[native flower]

i figure hes either using blackbeard for something or he knows something we dont

[pure raven]

Why would he take a marine in his crew

[runic osprey]

He doesnt want him as fleet admiral cause he is cruel af

[native flower]

cus its fucking aokigi who wouldnt

[pure raven]

Bruh seriously

He will take a fucking admiral in his crew just because it's aokiji

[native flower]

i think blackbeard not being stupid and aokigi not being evil is what makes it interesting. like what are both of them seeking to gain from it

[pure raven]

Yeah oda is up to something

[static anvil]

maybe aokiji want to know to bb can use 2 df

[native flower]

2 people using each other is an interesting dynamic

[runic osprey]

I think its cause aokiji wants akainu gone and he told bb that and bb agreed

[pure raven]

I don't think that aokiji will join BB pirates just because of that. he was a marine remember?

[runic osprey]

No he didnt but he used it as a excuse to join him

[pure raven]

Ohhhh Thats interesting

[runic osprey]

Idk if its filler but didnt aokiji lose a leg or arm in that fight

[static anvil]

what if aokiji joined in SWORD organization and have mission to spy in bb crew like drake

[runic osprey]

Cause i saw it in the movie but idk if its canon

[pure raven]

Movies ain't canon bro

[runic osprey]

Yea its just the scars were the same

[pure raven]

That's actually a pretty good theory

[static anvil]

tnx

[pure raven]

If I remember correctly corazon also worked in sword right?

[runic osprey]

I think so

[native flower]

i feel like being an admiral is a bit above sword no? but either way i definitely think hes working with blackbeard or against him and not for him

[pure raven]

If that's is the case then HE IS DEFINITELY in sword cuz remeber corazon used to report to sengoku and sengoku wanted aokiji as an admiral

[static anvil]

maybe he is leader

[runic osprey]

Could be

[pure raven]

So maybe aokiji is reporting to sengoku

[runic osprey]

Interesting

Now something else

[pure raven]

Yeah it would make sense because sengoku likes aokiji and wanted him as an admiral

[bitter oxide]

I was under the impression that sword isn’t backed or known by the world government, meaning it’s not an actual rank in the marines

[runic osprey]

I think blackbeard and shanks are some how related or used to have a very close bond

[pure raven]

Nah

[runic osprey]

Yes

[spice patrol]

They used to be lovers iirc

[pure raven]

Proof ?

[static anvil]

is like SCP or something like this

[pure raven]

Shanks saw BB as a weirdo (oden flashback) plus they were in the opposing crews

[runic osprey]

Remember him talking to whitbeard he said dont let ace chase him.
And when whitebeard asked him about his arm he said this was just a bet but the most painful scar is the one on his eye that blackbeard caused

[pure raven]

Yeah that was because he was worried for ace and he knew that Ace can't handle BB

[runic osprey]

Now how can an eye scar be more painful than losing a fucking arm i think he meant it emotionally painful

[sand sail]

He didn't say it was more painful, he said it's the one that ached in that moment

[sand sail]

Sword is an official marine group, it'd be surprising if the World Government didn't know about it.

[pure raven]

Also wtf is shanks up to. Coming and talking to the gorosei

[runic osprey]

So what does he mean with that

[pure raven]

Sengoku himself is a part of it so yeah I agree with you

[sand sail]

Because Blackbeard was making his move and he learned about Ace searching for him. Blackbeard gave him the scar, and he was concerned about the guy, so naturally that scar hurt

[runic osprey]

Ace went to take kaido head where was shanks then

[runic osprey]

How does that scar hurt when happened long ago?

[sand sail]

Same way Whitebeard's scars from Roger hurt when Shanks got to the ship

[runic osprey]

Yea its cause of rogers and whitbeards bond

They used to be rivals no?

[pure raven]

So maybe Shanks and BB were rivals too

[runic osprey]

I think they were close friends even after buggy told him about his sleep issue he seemed very interested in him

[sand sail]

They weren't rivals, Shanks was concerned because him getting scarred was the big giveaway that Blackbeard wasn't actually this no-name pirate. It showed that Teach was a powerhouse who was just biding his time, that's what Shanks tells Whitebeard

[pure raven]

Although the only proof you have is shanks saying that his scar hurts

[pure raven]

Yeah and I think when he was discussing that issue with WB he was reminded of the scar BB gave him

[sand sail]

Yeah exactly, it's mostly metaphorical even though there's an actual ache there

It signifies trauma

[pure raven]

Exactly

[pine delta]

scarring a yonko is a pretty nuts feat tbh. i still wonder how he did it considering he didnt use any scratch type attacks on ace

[runic osprey]

What trauma

[pure raven]

The fucking scar

[sand sail]

Bodily harm and emotional attachment to the situation

It's a scar

[runic osprey]

Emotional attachment

[balmy wigeon]

BB gave him rabies

[pure raven]

We honestly have no idea how strong shanks is

[sand sail]

He used to have a set of steel claws

[static anvil]

cuz he is normal and don't have mental problems like big mom and kaido, shanks just have more respect form gorosei cuz he is peaceful

[balmy wigeon]

He probably still does

[runic osprey]

It emotionally hurt him
I think he got betrayed
And shanks could a have killed blackbeard in the marineford

[grizzled fog]

He didn’t scar a yonko. He scarred shanks before he was a yonko, and shanks was probably a teenager or young adult then, important to keep that in mind

[pure raven]

Yeah I am asking about what He was going to talk about.
The only thing we know is they were going to discuss BB

[pine delta]

we can assume shanks strength based on the fact he sparred with mihawk and stopped akainu/the war that he is very strong

i dont think shanks would've been like yo whitebeard blackbeard is strong he scarred me and whitebeard is like "didnt that happen when you were 7 years old"

shanks would've brought it up because he could tell bb is stronger than ace

i kinda dont understand when and how this could even happen though.

[static anvil]

maybe shanks know how bb ate 2 df

[sand sail]

Shanks brought it up because Blackbeard was clearly devious and stronger than he let on, and Ace didn't know, strong or not.

The scar didn't emotionally hurt him, he had a sudden realization during that fight that clearly stuck with him

[runic osprey]

Shanks could have killed blackbeard at marineford

[pure raven]

Or maybe because BB Is increasingly becoming a threat to WG and the pirates

[grizzled fog]

Shanks wasn’t really worried so much about Bb’s actual strength. However strong he was when he scarred shanks it certainly wouldn’t be a threat to someone who’s actually an emperor. It was more about Blackbeard’s hidden motives and personality

[static anvil]

maybe

[pure raven]

I think it's probably that

[runic osprey]

Exactly but whats weird to me is that shanks could have easily stopped him

[pure raven]

Both the sides are receiving damage so why not team up

[grizzled fog]

When. Marineford? He was trying to stop the fighting but yes he could’ve gone after him and killed him then.

[pure raven]

Shanks is honestly just sooo interesting

[runic osprey]

He said do you wanna fight and when blackbeard said no he patiently waited for him to leave he had no intentions of killing him even tho he is supposed to so concerned about him

[static anvil]

bb have 2 df (strongest logia and paramecia)and if he awaken his fruits he will be able to destroy the world

[pure raven]

Yeah that's why shanks went to gorosei. Because the yonkous are the strongest when it comes to pirates and The gorosei are the Strongest In WG (authority) so both the Powerful sides team up

To defeat a very strong enemy

[pure raven]

Its weird how he goes to gorosei to discuss about BB (he says “a certain pirate" ita not conformed) but leta him go when he has the chance

Maybe this “certain pirate" is luffy

[quaint dove]

If he fights BB at the war then he doesn’t stop the war, fighting continues and more lives are lost. Also certain pirate doesn’t mean BB it could be so many different people

[pure raven]

Yeah ik

[pure raven]

Wouldn't let BB go free cause more lives to be lost?

[quaint dove]

In that moment no

[pure raven]

Yeah but after that

He has two of THE STRONGEST DF in one piece

In logia and paramecia at least

Shanks should have definitely gone for him

Honestly my bets are on BB

[native flower]

i am like fully bought in to multiple theories that Shim has posted, one of them being the shanks was talking to the gorosei about kid thoery

[pure raven]

May you pls enlighten me?

[sand sail]

No real reason to. He has two of the strongest fruits, but Blackbeard wasn't trying to attack him and people don't just crush threats like that in the series. The marines not going after Blackbeard was the real strange part, but even they did that later on after the war

[native flower]

check pinned messages, its posted there along with multiple other well thought out and explained theories

[sand sail]

Shanks isn't some guardian pirate or anything, he's just another big wig on the seas. He doesn't seem to go out of his way to get involved in things that hard

[native flower]

i felt like the only reason the marines didnt go after blackbeard was that he was still a warlord on the books at that point, and he immediately fled after shanks showed up

[static anvil]

just wait until wano end cuz Oda say's this year is year of shanks so maybe we will get answer for few question like what he say to gorosei

[pure raven]

You do realise that shanks is a younkou? BB is a HUGE Threat to him

[pure raven]

More likely that they had suffered a lot of damage and so they decided not to chase after him

[sand sail]

Shanks being an Emperor is the direct reason why Blackbeard wouldn't be a huge threat to him then

[pure raven]

He literally talked to WB about how much a threat he is

[sand sail]

Shanks was a superpower in and of himself. No Emperor seemed actually concerned about Blackbeard, and even Shanks was more concerned about Whitebeard being toppled than Blackbeard personally

[pure raven]

nah I think shanks considers BB a threat

[sand sail]

He even tells Whitebeard that eventually Blackbeard would come for him after building his power

Sure, a threat the way any clever, powerful pirate would be. But not the kind of threat you're trying to imply, not until he actually got out to sea I imagine

[pure raven]

So wouldn't that make him a threat?

[sand sail]

At the time? No. That makes him a concern worth noticing

It's not like he had the Gura Gura when Shanks told Whitebeard about all of that, or that anyone knew any power he had at all

[pure raven]

So you think shanks will just chill out and let BB make his power and then consider him q threat?

[sand sail]

Shanks had no idea how strong Blackbeard actually was, he just knew he was stronger than he let on and the move he pulled means he was aiming for the top

That seems to be exactly what happened, yes

[pure raven]

But that's so fucking stupid

Why would shanks just chill and let BB become powerful

[sand sail]

Because he's not the reader. He doesn't have this one track plot line to Blackbeard and whatever he might be doing, he's his own character with his own concerns and doings

He's an Emperor

[modest skiff]

Shanks may have had more pressing matters to attend to. And I’m sure plenty of people with potential end up fizzling out or dying or being captured

I think when you’re an emperor, you’re probably spending your time on pretty high value things most of the time

[sand sail]

You may as well ask why the marines allowed the same thing, the world is big and everyone is doing something. Blackbeard wasn't the only thing on anyone's mind, he was just a big event

[pure raven]

I mean BB just got the most powerful logia to exist. You can't just expect him to die

[sand sail]

That's part of the appeal of the story, it grows organically in that way

Sure, but Blackbeard still wasn't nearly the threat Big Mom or Kaido were

Hell, according to the series, he still isn't actually

[modest skiff]

Well the person who had it before BB apparently died at some point lol

[pure raven]

He didn't consume it. He just had it

[sand sail]

Not Thatch, the last user of the yami yami

[modest skiff]

Yeah sorry I meant the last person who ate it and had the power

[pure raven]

And how old would that be?

[modest skiff]

We have no idea and no way of knowing

[pure raven]

Exactly so you can't make that a point

Even the previous user of The light fruit or gura gura fruit must have died but that doesn't means that they weren't powerful

You can't just expect them to die

[sand sail]

No one's saying that doesn't make them powerful, though. Mohdoo was stating the previous user did indeed die

Well, you can expect anyone to die. That's just how life goes. But the way you're saying, you realize that was literally the Gorosei's strategy for dealing with him right?

They just expected the other Emperors or Marco to kill him

[pure raven]

Marco got his ass owned

[sand sail]

But do you understand the point being made?

[pure raven]

So basically you are telling me that they just expected BB to die

[sand sail]

Yes, their strategy was literally to just leave him to someone else

[pure raven]

Even though he had the most powerful logia DF

[sand sail]

Because they recognized that he was impressive, but not a world ending threat. He wasn't an Emperor yet, he had barely any crew at all, he was just strong and a concern

Yes, having a fruit does not automatically situate your threat level

[pure raven]

So that's the reason shanks just left him?

[sand sail]

We don't know why Shanks just left him alone. The point I'm trying to make is you're heavily overstating Blackbeard's impact on things

[static anvil]

i seen a theory about shanks observation haki:
he is able so view moments from future (like katakuri and luffy but more far)like for months or years in future, and he seen blackbeard doing something very dangerous to world so he decided to say this to gorosei (this theory is based on scene when shanks come to whitebeard's ship and told him to be accurate with teach)

[pure raven]

We will see that in the future

[sand sail]

One Piece isn't a series where one big bad drives the whole thing and everything everyone does revolves around that one entity. It's a sprawling world that has its own politics, warfare, welfare and development all over the place

Blackbeard is one small part. Important, but still small

[pure raven]

If that is the case then again shanks shouldn't have left BB during MF

[craggy pumice]

wait Xplorer

[static anvil]

true

[modest skiff]

I would say I don’t know why Shanks just left him. But I will say I don’t think Shanks saw BB as an immediate threat. It is possible Shanks had an IMMEDIATE threat to take care of. Think about the life of a Yonko. They are doing a lot of stuff and they have a lot of fights with a lot of people. It’s possible he had a big issue going on immediately somewhere else and maybe he wished he had time to deal with BB. We don’t know. I’m not arguing he just decided to go have a beer instead of killing BB.

[sand sail]

So yes, Shanks didn't stop him because he wasn't someone Shanks had to stop. He wasn't picking a fight with the red hair pirates or Shanks's friends, he wasn't even trying to continue the war. He didn't attack any territories, he didn't topple any kingdoms, he didn't do anything against Shanks

[craggy pumice]

Are you saying Shanks should have fought Bb in Marineford?

[pure raven]

If he is a threat then yes

[craggy pumice]

didn’t Shanks just say that the Marine should stop the war?

[native flower]

i dont think he wanted to take on the world government AND blackbeard

[sand sail]

Remember, Shanks is an Emperor. He's not some altruistic pirate who goes around doing good deeds all over, protecting everyone from everything. He's got his own world to take care of, and Blackbeard wasn't in it

[pure raven]

But shouldn't he consider about the damage BB will cause after MF

[craggy pumice]

so if he told them to stop fighting and then proceeds to fight Bb, wouldn’t he be a big clown?

[sand sail]

What damage did Shanks know Blackbeard would cause?

What damage has he caused?

[pure raven]

Wouldn't he become more of a clown onec BB becomes even more powerful

[sand sail]

It's not like Blackbeard declared he wanted to destroy the entire world and would never stop until everyone was dead

[sand sail]

Has he?

'Cause Blackbeard's an Emperor now

[craggy pumice]

if he fought Bb, the war would have continued and have caused far more death and imbalance

[pure raven]

Does t that means he is even more of a threat

[craggy pumice]

why? He isn’t responsible for everything Bb does.

[static anvil]

maybe he seen luffy beating bb and decided to let bb to be defeated by luffy

[sand sail]

Sure, now he is. And we see Shanks went to the Gorosei to speak with someone, it was probably Blackbeard

[pure raven]

But BB is a contende for becoming the pirate king and remember shanks wants luffy to become thepirate king

[pine delta]

the more i reread the more i feel shanks and blackbeard are very connected, and rocks might be the middle point

[craggy pumice]

Nobody expects of Shanks to care about Bb at all, he just does, but sometimes there are more important things for him than that

[sand sail]

^

No other Emperor cares, why should Shanks?

[pure raven]

Then why tf did he go the gorosei?

[sand sail]

That's really the big thing, not even the World Government has shown all that much zeal in getting Blackbeard

Shanks does care, that isn't to say he has to. No one is going to care about an Emperor who's not attacking them except the World Government, and even they actually don't seem to

[pine delta]

the WG is kind of disconnected in a lot of ways. people didn't know anything about rocks other than a few very high ups despite them being a major world player

[static anvil]

Big Mom just want to eat his weeding cake, but kaido have bigger problems now

[pure raven]

May you please elaborate on the important things you are talking about

[craggy pumice]

stopping the war

[pure raven]

And who will be one of the major players?
BB himself

[sand sail]

That was on purpose, they went out of their way to cover up Rocks.

[pine delta]

exactly, but thats how blackbeard is slipping through without attracting a lot of attention

[pure raven]

And shanks probably noticed that

[sand sail]

You seem to be arguing from an omniscient reader standpoint, though. Do you understand that these characters are written with an entire world of issues that they have to deal with?

By that same logic, why hasn't anyone cared about Blackbeard at all in the entire time skip except Moria?

[modest skiff]

Can someone remind me roughly when in the timeline BB gave Shanks that scar?

[sand sail]

We don't know when, but it's before he met Luffy, so 12+ years ago minimum

[pure raven]

Probably before he was a yonkou

[craggy pumice]

24-12 years ago

[modest skiff]

Gotcha, thanks

[pure raven]

So who do you think is shanks dealing with now

If he has other issues

As you say

[sand sail]

Anyone? He's an Emperor, he's got countless enemies. He's not dealing with Blackbeard at the least, or if he is the only thing he's done so far is talk to the Gorosei about it

Who is Kaido dealing with that isn't Blackbeard?

Who has Big Mom been dealing with?

[pure raven]

It is luffy

[sand sail]

But not Blackbeard?

Despite him being far and away a greater threat than Luffy ever could

[pure raven]

So what you are saying is that shanks doesn't care about BB and his dealing with other threats

[modest skiff]

Remember when we saw Shanks hanging out in some tower kinda thing we have no idea about? Keep in mind there are lots of components of the story/world we don't know about. It is possible Shanks is busy with things we have zero idea about

[sand sail]

No, I'm saying Blackbeard isn't the focus of everyone in the series and never should have been, so we shouldn't act as if they're being strange or ignorant or out of character to treat him the way they've treated every other equally powerful threat

[pure raven]

When did I say BB should be the focus of EVERYONE in the story?

[craggy pumice]

Shanks cares about BB and Bean has said that. The second part is true

[modest skiff]

When we learned about that bridge they were building for 700 years, we didn't know about the bridge before we learned about it. That's a part of how stories are told. We may simply not know what Shank's objectives are right now

[sand sail]

Because you may as well ask if they're not doing this for Blackbeard, then why aren't they doing it for any Emperor? Because Blackbeard wasn't even the strongest one, Kaido is. One Piece just doesn't seem to work that way

Shanks of course cares about Blackbeard, that's why he went as far as stopping the war and talking to the Gorosei two years later. Blackbeard isn't someone who needs to be concerned about enough to disrupt everything and go after him, or else it wouldn't make sense to wonder why no one else has done the same either

[pure raven]

Wasnt it mentioned that the marines dont Deal with younko because they have a disadvantage over territory

[sand sail]

Especially when the Gorosei, the people who would want him cut off more than anyone, didn't actually care to step in either

[modest skiff]

yeah if the navy tried to wage war on Wano, they'd likely lose other territory to other yonkos

[pure raven]

That's why shanks cares

[sand sail]

No, they don't because of the balance of the three great powers. Back when the warlords were a thing, it was how the world was kept safe and defended. The Emperors were a stopping point for upstart pirates, but ruled autonomously and against one another, while the marines had the warlords backing them up so that the Emperors couldn't step too far out of line

[modest skiff]

oh right that too

[sand sail]

To topple an Emperor creates a power vacuum that was so bad it threw the New World into chaos, and the marines couldn't keep up with it or stop it at all

And that was just one Emperor

[pure raven]

So is that the reason Shanks didn't went after BB?

[sand sail]

No, there was no concern for that back in the day. Blackbeard wasn't an Emperor yet

[pearl wagon]

Do you think momo will join the straw hats, or will it be like vivi where he joins but stays as the damiyo of wano

[pure raven]

I am talking about MF. BB literally killed WB and stole his fruit

Although not entirely killed WB on his own

[craggy pumice]

yeah he will become Shogun of Wano and stay there

[sand sail]

Yes, which is not a reason to go after him. Whitebeard was an enemy pirate who picked his own fight.

[pure raven]

But WB was on friendly terms with shanks

[craggy pumice]

Well not really tbh

[pure raven]

Alright then I gotta go for now

[sand sail]

They were on respectful terms, not all that friendly

[craggy pumice]

Bye

[pure raven]

I will be back later. Bye

[pine delta]

at the endgame i see the previous kings and queens joining the straw hats in their final stretch. i can see vivi rejoining the crew and by extension momo as well (more of a case where a worldwide event is going on so wano is in danger and to protect it he has to go to laughtale)

momo being a large flying dragon makes me think endgame arc will have him transporting a large group to a location on his back like a bus

[pearl wagon]

Yeah everyone luffy has helped, alabasta, dressrosa, wano, the pirates, colby probably, basically everyone who they helped, and then they beat blackbeard with 1 2 sunshine go in the background

[pine delta]

crazy rainbow star but okay yeah

[pure raven]

I am back again for a short times.
Why did he stage a funeral for WB then?

[pearl wagon]

Crazy rainbow star is my favourite haha

[pine delta]

i feel like if you consider oda originally had the series be much shorter, the ending has major beats at the start. therefore, vivi being the only family out of 20 to not become celestial dragons means they have big endgame value. imu even is like stabbing her face. therefore she is rejoining the crew in the final arc which could be after wano

[static anvil]

i want to see his power up cuz now he is weaker than Queen

[fathom matrix]

I might be wrong but I honestly don't think anyone else is gonna officially join the crew, after Wano.

Carrot's been fun, but I feel like she may end up going back with the Minks.

Yamato will either A. stay at wano to repair it and go off to sea, or B. be a tag along for the straw hats but end up departing some time on the journey.

Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike these 2, but what roles could they serve for the crew? Everyone at least has one. You could argue Zoro's the second in command/first mate of the ship/

[static anvil]

yamato possibly, like oden in roger's crew but is no logic cuz we have robin

[pine delta]

while each straw hat has a role, most did not join because of that role

[spice berry]

Carrot's no fun at all.

Choniki

[pine delta]

luffy wanted cerberus to join the crew if he wants someone they will join. plus yamato wants to go out with ace -> luffy

[fathom matrix]

True, but they do end up having one and serving a cause. Like, nobody really thought about Jinbei's role, up until he announced he was the Helmsman of the strawhats.

And yeah, all those randos like the zombies, he want them to join his crew, but they ended up not joining.

[pine delta]

i mean i can see carrot being the scout, yamato being the ____

[static anvil]

yamato maybe just will be a fighter like zoro(swordsman)or usopp(sniper)

[fathom matrix]

with the personality and patience of luffy

[pine delta]

yeah because like sniper isn't a real role, im sure yamato can do something

im more convinced she joins for lore reasons but. i just dont see her staying in wano when shes wanted to leave for decades

[fathom matrix]

It is a role and his sniping has come in handy a lot, and he's great with not only launching projectiles for attacks, but strategic advantages.

Like, what can Yamato do? Of cause she has a lot of strong attacks and can transform, wielding a canabou and has counqueres, but what role stands her out?

At least with Usopp's he used to play tricks and use a slingshot as a kid, and his dad is a sharp shooter too. Nami's a navigater because she used to enjoy drawing maps as a kid and is a genius with weather forcasts, Sanji loved to cook as a shild and was raised in a restaurant.

There is a lore reason for their roles.

Yamato was a kid that was inspired by Oden, wanted to be like Oden, learned to fight like Kaido, became strong, had help reading a log book, and wants to set out to sea.

I don't really know what she does besides wanting to help wano, be her hero, take down her dad, and go to the ocean.

[modest skiff]

I think its worth pointing out that the story is reaching a point where someone's raw strength capability is also very worthwhile. Someone joining the crew because they believe in Luffy, they are very strong, and they are passionate+kind, sounds like a winning combo. I think eventually it doesn't need to be some set in stone role such as navigator etc every time

[static anvil]

+one girl to garem...

[fathom matrix]

Garem?

[static anvil]

like monster trio but will be Nami, Robin and Yamato

[fathom matrix]

That's another thing. I know it sounds typical, but as Ichigo pointed out, the monster trio.

Zoro, Sanji and Luffy have been a pretty consistent triangle, and it's been cool to see 2 strong normal humans rise up in strength in the crew, to almost the captain's level, and if you add yamato, a coc, mythical zoan half oni, it kinda underwhelms the other two a bit.

TBH, there's also a new argument with jinbei asking if HE'S part of a new monster trio because peeps assume he's as strong if not stronger than sanji, where it's a little hard to say yes too, cause RN he's fighting a commander and jinbei just got done with a flying captain which is ranked below.

[static anvil]

Harem sorry(garem is in russian)

[static anvil]

sanji will get an power up (his germa ADN are finally awakening)

[simple bear]

lunarian?

[fathom matrix]

So having an ex warlord fishamn karate master and a really OP mythical oni be part of a new trio, again kinda underwhlems the other 2 a bit.

Sanji MIGHT be getting a super human power up because of the raid suit, but at least that's a way of him keeping up with zoro, who just found out to be a coc user and wield's enma

[static anvil]

Germa 66 not lunarian

[bitter kraken]

Sanji isn’t a normal human tho, he’s augmented

[simple bear]

as in

do u think he has ties to lunarian,if so ,how?

[bitter kraken]

Zoro isn’t confirmed CoC user is he?

[simple bear]

not yet

[fathom matrix]

Kaido confirmed he was, and the anime showed it. I know the anime isn't canon, but I'd imagine Oda would have specified they can use that, or have a final say on some things

[balmy wigeon]

anime is canon, zoro has CoC

[bitter kraken]

Kaido didn’t confirm it and anime is out it’s mind

[static anvil]

how tf anime is not canon?

[fathom matrix]

I know, but what I'm saying is that maybe Oda would have given them the green light to use something like that, if he was okay with it, like new devil fruits in the one piece movies.

[bitter kraken]

I don’t think zoro even has CoC, remember who trained zoro? Mihawk, sure zoro is kinda dumb and could walk around having CoC and not knowing but Mihawk isn’t dumb I’d imagine though their training he woulda noticed that zoro had CoC if he indeed does and then when kaido made a a comment about it zoro wouldn’t have been like wot?

[fathom matrix]

he aims to be the strongest swordsman and coc ties to being the best or aiming to be on top, and everyone has different growth rates of it.

Luffy only started to subconsciously use it at 17, where as Ace used it once at 10

[static anvil]

movies are like fillers but anime is making with Oda and every time anime give to us more info than manga

[bitter kraken]

What was ace aiming at then? Cuase he wanted to make WB the king I don’t think dude even had a dream himself? And he wasn’t the best at anything really :/

[static anvil]

also Crunchyroll say zoro have CoC

[bitter kraken]

Because of his pedigree he could been so much more, but his misfortune was being the protagonist brother

That’s from the anime lol

That site just shows anime episodes

[fathom matrix]

he wanted to be better than his dad? He wanted to stray far from him and still be better than Roger?

Also, people assume that once he met whitebeard, he didn't want to be a conqueror or the greatest at anyone, so he lost his drive to use coc

[simple bear]

i thought u meant conquerors coated attacks lol

im pretty sure hism being a conqueror is more or less confirmed tho

[bitter kraken]

Idk I still don’t think zoro has CoC, Mihawk would have noticed it while he trained him and zoro wouldn’t have been walking around not knowing he had If he does have it

[simple bear]

maybe coz he awakened it later

[fathom matrix]

not every coc user is aware of another. Unless you knock out people or emit a lot of electric black sparks on a clash, not alotta people can tell.

[static anvil]

dude in anime zoro 100% use coc just watch Ep 984 and you will see confirmation

[bitter kraken]

I kinda feel like CoC has to be awakened while you’re either a child or a teen? Zoro is a grown adult

Anime is not the manga tho

[simple bear]

well 17 y o luffy awakened it

[bitter kraken]

That’s a teen

[fathom matrix]

that's the thing, it appears anyone can awaken it at any time and we don't know a specific age. HELL, maybe Boa didn't awaken it till she was 20.

[static anvil]

luffy first time used at 17 or 18 so is not an argument

[simple bear]

and zoros 21,so i dont think that makes sense

[bitter kraken]

Doffy was a child, Yamato child, and ace child

[fathom matrix]

yeah, and children are very reactive and emotinal

[simple bear]

correlation does not equal causation

[bitter kraken]

Lol I’m not saying that’s a sure thing but like idk less likely zoro has it in my mind

[simple bear]

lets just wait for it to be confirmed

[static anvil]

and? they have a very emotional moments

[bitter kraken]

I think emma was the reason zoro was able to cut kaido not coc

[fathom matrix]

Yeah, so if a kid has a dream to above others in a regard, and they're going rthrough some traumatic and intense moment, they could awaken and use conquerors a lot easier.

[bitter kraken]

Enma? Or however you spell it

[static anvil]

doffy nearly get killed,yamato, and ace too they was in a big danger

[fathom matrix]

and Doffy's a CD that looks down on others, Yamato wasn't be a strong man like Oden

[bitter kraken]

Zoro used to be a bounty hunter, he prolly was in very dangerous situations before he even met luffy

[static anvil]

no one know his backstory and what he do until he meet luffy (we seen only trainings)

[bitter kraken]

Yea his backstory is that he was a bounty hunter, he used to hunt pirates and collect their bounty

[fathom matrix]

That's different to an emotional child in danger. Plus we haven't seen a genuinely pissed off Zoro like this in a long time, emotionally I mean too. He has that strive of being the best swordsman, but he's pissed at Orochi for ruining wano, killing the man who helped him, seeing men knock over red beans where tama's best day was having a decent meal, he's pissed that the scabbards got hurt when seeing kiku's severed arm, and he finally got to face the guy who's running the show. Zoro's very calm a lot of the time and doesn't show being pissed or saying how he's feeling a lot of the time. This is different, and again, adults aren't as emotional or easily triggered as kids.

[bitter kraken]

Idk what you’re saying man? You’re saying all the stuff you just mentioned caused zoro’s “CoC” to awaken?

[faint aspen]

is luffy inherited both joy boy and rogers will??

[modest skiff]

I can't imagine the anime would give zoro CoC if it never ende up happening in the manga. Its too big of a thing. Likely just a spoiler

[fathom matrix]

What you're saying is yeah, Zoro's been in a lot of phycial danger, but it's different to a kid being scared shitless or angry, and coc is more will based and mental

and he's a very capable fighter, a helpless child who's terrified or angry isn't

[bitter kraken]

I get that but at this time I don’t see it being confirmed that he has it, the anime is retarded made it seem like he had mastered it used at will when in the manga it sounds like if he does indeed have it the guy has no clue that he does lol

[static anvil]

zoro 100% is from Shimotsuki Family so maybe he get coc like ace(being son of a very strong guy who use coc)

[balmy wigeon]

Garp had CoC as well

[static anvil]

or dragon

[fathom matrix]

he didn't master it, he got pissed and unknowilling released a shockwave. Luffy did that like 4 or 5 times before he even realised he had it after the war

[bitter kraken]

Lol I said the anime made it seem like he had it mastered, and made it look like he could use it at will

In the anime after he knocked them out he acted like he knew what he was doing while the others around were like wow what happened

Anyways the anime isn’t manga

[balmy wigeon]

Maybe Dragon has it too

I'm just saying for Garp to compete with Don CHinjao and Roger and Sengoku, he definitely needed CoC

[fathom matrix]

Honestly, I doubt garp has it. He's not confirmed to have it or not, but considering he wanted to stay as a vice admiral and even stepped down from the position, and not having a high position or wanting to exceed in anything, I could see him not having it.

That doesn't mean he couldn't rival roger, non coc users could stand up to coc users if they're strong enough, and he was.

[modest skiff]

That decision was purely due to not wanting to be directly serving the CDs though

[static anvil]

Zoro maybe awaken his coc while training with mihawk and he mastered it and know how to use it but don't used this power cuz just don't needed it until wano (just remember he got very angry at this idiots cuz they playing with tama's favorite food)

this is 100% zoro's father (they have same vibe)

[balmy wigeon]

I still doubt that's Zoro's father

[bitter kraken]

Man you can’t say things are 100% when they are not confirmed

[balmy wigeon]

maybe a distant uncle?

[bitter kraken]

But also that makes no sense, if zoro awakened his CoC while training with Mihawk why is he walking around like he dosnt know he has it? The guy is a dumb to a degree but come on lol

[static anvil]

this is zoro at in future (by oda)

[balmy wigeon]

so, that's Zoro from the future?

[static anvil]

yes

[balmy wigeon]

in the cave?

[bitter kraken]

Lol no no no, that pic is what zoro will look like when he is older

[static anvil]

no,this is zoro if all will be good

this is full image (if all will be good or bad)

[balmy wigeon]

Sexy

[minor patio]

Who's this?

One is sabo's brother ig

[static anvil]

pandaman

[hollow grotto]

Tomato Gang, Pandaman and uh, can't tell who the other one is

they look like Sogeking lol

[minor patio]

Also who's this?

Wanted poster

[static anvil]

Mikey Mouse

[hollow grotto]

I'm not sure, might just be a poster and that's it

[minor patio]

In the starting arcs he's in many places

[hollow grotto]

seems to be an easter egg, according to the Wiki

[static anvil]

maybe just an bandit from village

[hollow grotto]

https://onepiece.fandom.com/wiki/Mikio_Itoo

[snow grove]

in the latest episode kaido was hearing oroshi trash talking but didn't do any hint to king to give him his sword , i think it was kings idea

[silk rain]

During FMI when Luffy used his conquerors haki Zoro said "If luffy couldn't do that I would have to be captain" or something which hints that he could do that as well (he wouldn't say that if he couldn't do it, because luffy still beats him in strength).

[grizzled fog]

This is false, zoro didn’t know he had conqueor’s haki on the roof

[silk rain]

as far as awakened haki yes, but as shown in the anime he did have control of conquerors haki before the roof

Including the fight with the gang in wano and monet, those were both conqueror's haki attacks or at least foreshadowing of conqeuror's haki

[grizzled fog]

The anime scene isn’t canon. He definitely didn’t have control of it before the roof

[dawn patio]

he doesnt have control of it on the roof

[silk rain]

I see what you mean i just thought this was referring to conquerors in the attack itself

makes sense

[grizzled fog]

It means that zoro doesn’t realize that he has conqueror’s haki

[silk rain]

Yeah i guess it depends if u think anime is canon or not, that reveal was weird tbh but he def had conquerors before he just didnt know

[modest skiff]

head canon for me is that Zoro thought conq haki was some unrelated thing this whole time. Like he's like "oh that's conq haki? lol oh yeah i've been aware of that for a while, didn't know that's what it was XD"

[dawn patio]

i think he is aware of it in the anime, but not in the manga

[junior cape]

Yeah, in the anime you could rationalize that scene as just pure overwhelming bloodlust knocking them out.

[modest skiff]

Zoro has used his gaze to stun people in the past. I think its all related. I think Zoro honestly never put much thought into "what" it was

[visual merlin]

the anime's intention definitely seems like zoro uses CoC intentionally

[dawn patio]

knocking people out with bloodlust sounds a lil weird imo

[visual merlin]

but anime isn't canon so it doesn't really mtater

[grizzled fog]

Eh not really. There’s no in universe way to rationalize it whatsoever. It’s as blatant a use of conqueor’s haki as you can get. The anime just messed up

[modest skiff]

Zoro isn't the type of person to give a shit what its called or any of that stuff

[junior cape]

Because we know zoro can manipulate bloodlust into physical forms and mental illusions

[modest skiff]

Zoro would just find powers he has, use them, and not worry about the details or labels or whatever

[visual merlin]

yea but Mohdoo he's at least smart enough to put that together, or Mihawk would do it for him

[modest skiff]

Well Laww I also think its possible Zoro is being modest or coy

[visual merlin]

I don't see it, if he has CoC he has CoC I don't think there'd be any point in him not acknowledging it to that extent

[grizzled fog]

He’s not being modest or coy when he says he doesn’t know what kaido is talking about

[visual merlin]

as far as Im concerned the anime intended for him to use it in a way that conveys that he's aware of it

but since anime isn't canon it's not a big deal

the most it means is zoro definitely uses CoC in 1010 imo

[modest skiff]

I hadn't seen this panel before. What is meant by this panel if he wasn't implying he has conq haki?

[dawn patio]

do yall think sanji is gonna awaken his lineage factor

[grizzled fog]

That luffy should be capable of a feat of that magnitude, however he does it. Doesn’t mean coc specifically

[modest skiff]

yeah that's what i was starting to think. Zoro has stunned/knocked people out with his gaze in the past, so it makes sense he would say Luffy needs to be able to do the same

[grizzled fog]

He’s never knocked someone out with a gaze in canon

[modest skiff]

oh

[dawn patio]

didnt he do it in sabaody

[grizzled fog]

The bounty Hunter scene was anime only

[dawn patio]

i think he killed monet with a coc haki attack

[grizzled fog]

He didn’t kill monet. He didn’t even hurt her. All he did was stun her for a couple seconds

[visual merlin]

he didn't kill monet at all

[dawn patio]

but still

[visual merlin]

there's no but still there lol, he didn't do anything to her physically

the most he may have done there is use normal CoC at the same time, but I doubt that too

[dawn patio]

she wouldnt get sliced in half tho

[visual merlin]

why wouldn't she?

she's a logia

[dawn patio]

yeah but she wouldnt litterly slice in half

[wide rover]

he didn’t use CoC i think but that attack did hurt her

[visual merlin]

yea, she didn't literally slice in half

[grizzled fog]

The attack didn’t hurt her at all. He didn’t use haki

[visual merlin]

it couldn't have hurt her or else she'd die

[wide rover]

how can u say it didn’t hurt her, dude used no haki and she still was stunned af

[dawn patio]

^

[visual merlin]

because he used no haki

[grizzled fog]

She was stunned because she was afraid….

[visual merlin]

it can't hurt you if he's not using haki

[wide rover]

she was so petrified because the attack had no haki and still done that to her bro

[dawn patio]

but why was she afraid?

[visual merlin]

no, she was scared that zoro was going to kill her

[grizzled fog]

Seriously, reread that scene. That’s not how it works at all

[visual merlin]

because she thought zoro was going to kill her

[grizzled fog]

Because she thought zoro was about to kill her lol

[wide rover]

how many times did ppl in that arc cut her up and shoot bullets in her and it did nothing?

[visual merlin]

with logias you either hurt them like a normal person or you don't

[dawn patio]

she knew zoro didnt have CoA, so there would be no reason to be afraid

[visual merlin]

??

[queen arrow]

that's not true

[visual merlin]

she knew zoro did have CoA, he used it right beforehand

[grizzled fog]

?????? He did have coA.

[wide rover]

but when zoro sliced her in half she was struggling to even be put back together

[dawn patio]

why tf didnt he used it then

[visual merlin]

because she was scared chrollo

[visual merlin]

because he didn't want to kill her

[grizzled fog]

Do you think zoro defied the rules of devil fruits and somehow hurt a logia without using haki lmfao?

[dawn patio]

mans a sanji

[visual merlin]

we know zoro had haki back then Bureau

[grizzled fog]

He’s soft on women. He didn’t want to kill her

[wide rover]

so what ur saying is she was just scared coz if he wanted to he’d kill her?

[dawn patio]

possibly, its just wierd imo that she was that stunend

[visual merlin]

she's scared because she thought he was going to kill her

[grizzled fog]

She was scared because he acted as though he was going to kill her

[wide rover]

yhh that’s what i’m baffled about, why is she that scared?

[visual merlin]

like pretty much any person is when they think they are about to do and can't do anything about it

[visual merlin]

because she's going to die

[wide rover]

but if i remember correctly didn’t law attack her or am i tripping? And why wasn’t she petrified of someone like luffy then?

[visual merlin]

I don't recall that, and Luffy never got into a position where he was going to kill her

[wide rover]

fair enough

[grizzled fog]

She’s literally stunned before zoro actually attacks her.

[visual merlin]

she knew zoro used haki, he was charging at her, and she couldn't do anything to stop zoro, so she reasonably thought she was about to die

also the purpose of zoro's line

Monet previously pointed out how zoro didn't want to fight her

[wide rover]

ohh so zoro last minute didn’t use his haki obvs?

[grizzled fog]

And Tashigi explains it afterwards.

[visual merlin]

so now he cuts monet's cheek, then makes a comment implying he's going for the kill now

[wide rover]

all these years I thought she couldn’t get back together coz she was petrified through pain of an attack with no haki

[grizzled fog]

Chapter 687 if you’d like to reread it

[wide rover]

coz when it comes to zoro SOMETIMES oda does some retcons with zoro

[modest skiff]

I took this as Tashigi not properly understanding. This is what I was referring to before where Zoro stuns people and I assumed it was conq haki. The main thing is that I don't see Tashigi as some kinda encyclopedia that is always correct. This was her impression and I am taking her to be wrong

My thought was that perhaps a lesser version of conq haki can directly target people whereas we see Luffy use it as an AOE attack in a more advanced way. But who knows

[bitter kraken]

I don’t think there is any such thing as a lesssr version of CoC it prolly just is what it is

[modest skiff]

I mean in terms of "advanced CoC" is coating your attacks with it, some kinda lesser version is stunning fodder with it, perhaps another "lesser" form of it is using it as a stunning gaze

[patent sail]

If King is to destroy the Sandai Kitetsu and Zoro getting the Nidai I’d like for Tenguyama to teach Zoro how to make a black blade too.

[bitter kraken]

Oh I gotcha, but I feel a lesser version of imposing your will above others would sorta cheapen CoC and it’s supposed to be the supreme ability folks are born with

[bitter kraken]

I think zoro already knows how to make a blade black

[modest skiff]

I still see it as imposing will. Just less powerful. Walk before you run sorta deal

[bitter kraken]

I see what you’re saying, this would make zoro the first and only one to use it to that degree that we know of tho. Zoro isn’t that special, but that would be hella interesting

[patent sail]

What makes you say that?

[modest skiff]

yeah, not gonna pretend I have some kinda compelling evidence, just explaining how I have seen it

[bitter kraken]

Idk the exact chapter or who it was, it might have been Mihawk but I’m pretty sure someone explained to zoro how a blade becomes black

[fathom matrix]

I think with black blades, you NEED to have an actual connection with your sword. Like, Zoro is very respectful with blades, even having funerals for them and caring when he loses them.

Big Mom, Kaido, Shanks and Newgate probably don't have black weapons, because they're JUST weapons to them, things on hand to slice people or bash brains. Haki is will so it doesn't just have to be weaponised, as we've seen it can understand, feel and transfer, so the user may have to develop a really stronger bond with a blade, and maybe like how you could temper a blade to strengthen it, maybe there's a specific moment in which you need to clash blades with someone else, while it's in armament, and that temper sticks permantly, forever making it black.

[junior cape]

Dressrosa would've been over instantly if Kyros could use haki. Just swoop in, kill Duffy, and off we go

[sand sail]

This isn't really the channel for that thought. But no, haki wouldn't have helped, Kyros never touched Doflamingo.

[wild dove]

so think luffy is yonko level or very nearby yonko level

1. Luffy and kaido dont even touching
2. Sky split

[real swan]

It's a bit to say Luffy is currently at the yonko level cause he's had to have Kaido fight the equivalent of a WoW raid to finally be weakened enough to fight. Luffy might be able to take him out now but I still don't see him being there quite yet. After wano concludes he will probably be at the level.

[narrow latch]

what if kaido was trying to intercept WB during marineford because of what 'Ace' did to the dragon statue?

[real swan]

Once he awakens his fruit he'll be there.

[pure raven]

Luffy already at yonlo level

Not at top of the chain but at the bottom of all the yonkos however he is now full fledged 5th yonko

[mint barn]

will luffy ever get a gear 5

[pure raven]

i hope not

[pure raven]

Hope after awakening

[amber storm]

Love this

[fathom matrix]

Thanks, I think the issue with people wondering why yonkos don't have black blades, is because they're not proper swordsmen and they're just weapons.

Heck, I still think that if you eat a devil fruit, that's cheating and you can't claim to be the worlds's greatest swordsman. Cause that's extra power, and you haven't developed your skills pure of yourself.

[amber storm]

I very much agree bro. You said it perfectly

[solar knoll]

Seems like only the best of the best develop their swords into pure black like Ryuma and Mihawk

I got a feeling it has something to do with the breath of all things

[modest skiff]

@fathom matrix @amber storm I'd like to direct you to my thoughts on this topic. I'd enjoy hearing what you think:

#manga-theories message

[silk sandal]

I think Luffy will beat kaido and big mom then blackbeard will show up cuasing Luffy to awaken his devil fruit and gear 5 then after that Luffy will defeat Blackbeard and Will get very sick en chopper will cure him making him the greatest doctor en after Luffy GETS CURE THERE WILL BE A WAR EN HE WILL JOIN SABO TO DEFEAT THE WORLD GOVERNMENT

[modest skiff]

One more thing to add to the black blade stuff:

I think black blades, the going merry's spirit, devil fruits in inanimate objects, and glyphs having a voice all relate to the same basic idea.

[silk sandal]

And then everybody dies

[amber storm]

Meh. Feel like you are reaching very deep into lore in that thought process. I liked the part about cursed swords having different wills. But the second about zoans and hietetsu are tough

[modest skiff]

yeah, totally fair

[celest mica]

also to make an object 'eat' a devil fruit I feel like there should be a loving caring relationship between the owner of the object and the object it self. we can see this in mr 4's gun introduction card where if i am not mistaken it was said that it was his favorite toy or something like that.

furthermore to make an object get a devil fruit u don't need advanced scientific methods or vega punk in person to do it. because in Wano Tama's teapot had a tanuki fruit and I can't see how such advanced science will reach an isolated country like Wano.

[junior cape]

wonder if devil fruits can eat devil fruits...

[vestal orbit]

i wonder if things created by devil fruits can eat devil fruits

like big mom's homies or moriah's zombies

actually in retrospect big mom's homie ship can float and isn't weakened by water, so i guess they probably could

man, big mom's fruit is even stronger than i thought

[junior cape]

I bet Shanks and Co. don't even have a island base, they just travel around on their ship, and wherever they stop is a new piece of their turf

[pure raven]

👍

[grand tide]

[mild pewter]

Mihawk dies and zoro becomes the strongest by default

[muted ember]

Zoro Piece

[gloomy canyon]

@ancient vault

[ancient vault]

The 925 Squad and the new Blackbeard Pirate: Moria, Shiryu, Devon and ??? | THEORY:

This is a theory that some might've thought about already but I'm gonna take another direction that after doing my research I haven't seen anyone go before.

a) Laffite:

I believe Laffite was the first member to enter Wano way before the raid even started. I'm basing this on the intel Blackbeard had about "all the young folks like Strawhat" entering Wano and BM chasing.
Yes, he could've easily wired BM's call and found out about BM chasing and luffy heading to Kaido but the way Blackbeard speaks about it is like he knows about every single Supernova. Luffy, Zoro, Law, Kid, Killer etc..
In conclusion: Someone is giving Blackbeard info about the events in Wano from inside out.

And I believe that someone to be Laffite.
Why is he there? For that we have to look back a few hundred chapters. To be precise to the reveal of "Drunken Iron Ore":

Back in chapter 803 Koala revealed a special metal called "Drunken Iron Ore" that was found in the weapons that were dealt from Dressrosa. She also revealed that this metal can only be produced by small number of countries.

What country? The first thought is obviously Wano since Wano was the main supplier of weapons to Dressrosa. This thought is further strengthened when we see multiple weapons factories and mines in Udon throughout the Wano arc. I believe those mines produce the Drunken Iron Ore that is later included in the weapons that are shipped out to Dressrosa and dealt with in the underworld.

But back to chapter 803. In the same chapter we see Burgess who managed to infiltrate Baltigo by sneaking onto the Revo's ship. He calls both Shiryu and Laffite to contact Blackbeard to attack Baltigo to get "a ton of weapons". He's talking about the weapons the Revos got from Dressrosa. Later on we find out the Blackbeard pirates destroyed the island and briefly clashed with Cipher Pol.

I think Blackbeard got the weapons and might've found out about the weapons specialty either by analyzing it afterwards or through the brief clash with Cp-0 who was already chasing the Revos. I prefer the former.
Through his own underground network he could find out that the weapons trade originates in Wano. But since Wano is a closed nation where information doesn't get out I believe Blackbeard sent Laffite to infiltrate the country and to gather information.

Why Lafitte?
First why only one person? As this mission is supposed to be only for spying and information gathering I think one man is ideal.
As much as Devon and Shiryu (who just recently got his fruit) are perfect for stealth and infiltration what they lack is the way to get into Wano to begin with which is why I believe Lafitte to be the perfect fit for this mission for several reasons.

1. Obviously we haven't seen him in chapter 925 with BB as we did Shiryu and Devon which automatically disqualifies those two while it leaves the door open for Lafitte.

2. Lafitte is a stealth master.

• He managed to sneak into Mary Joa completely unnoticed and get into the Shichibukai meeting.
• He also managed to sneak into the control room in Impel Down.
• What's the most surprising here is that he has tap shoes. Those tap shoes should give him away in an instant but they don't.
  Whether that's related to his ability to fly or to his Devil Fruit possibly being able to somehow suppress the sound is still unclear.

3. He can hypnotize people. This is one perfect for infiltration as well as information gathering.

4. Hes the navigator of the crew which is what let's him stand out from Devon and Shiryu. He would have no trouble finding Wano.
   Coupled with the fact that he can...

5. He can fly! Marco made it to Wano by flying without any trouble it seems. This gives Lafitte the ability to avoid all those dangerous sea currents underneath as well as the patrol on the waterfall.

So Laffite went to check out the island for the mines and came across Kid and Caribou working in Udon in the meantime. While also coming across Hawkins who was probably checking Wano's regions per usual doing his patrol. Zoro was already wrecking havoc and becoming famous in Wano himself and well the same for Luffy after fighting Kaido. All that he reported back to Blackbeard who talked about in 925 as I've shown at the beginning of this theory.

After staying there for a bit longer Lafitte must've figured out that the young folks are planning a war on Kaido. Telling this Blackbeard it is very likely that he plans on gathering Devil Fruits at the end of the war as well as finding out more about the weapons elements in general.
Which leads me to...

b) The 925 Squad:

The Wano Squad consists of Lafitte, Shiryu, Devon and Moria. As their plan is to only gather Devil Fruits towards the end of the war as well as infiltrate Wano as a whole what they need are several other Stealth masters.
(I'm assuming Moria joined Blackbeard as I don't think he could escape nor do I think Oda would introduce him to the arc he has a past with just to kill him offscreen.)

Shiryu's epithet "Shiryu of the Rain" is similar to the ones of the scabbards and other samurai such as "Raizo of the midst" or "Kikunojo of the lingering snow".

Devon's epithet "Crescent Moon Hunter" also could have a connection to Wano as the crescent moon is the symbol of the Kozuki's.

Moria has already been in Wano once and knows how to enter the country with a ship as well as the region which is why they will take him with them. I believe for him to have navigation skills and to have been the one to teach those to Perona which she demonstrated when she brought Zoro all the way to Sabaody alone. Moria was the one to have raised her from childhood on so I don't think anyone else could've taught her. Especially not herself.
Moria might also have suggested himself to go to Wano because of his hate on Kaido.

Not only are they here to gather information and Devil Fruits. I believe Moria is doing what he can do best. **Grave rob! **
For that being said the perfect location for that is Ringo for one reason.
The Eternal Graves in Ringo.

That is probably the reason why Moria went to Ringo 23 years ago to begin with. As Hiyori explains here the bodies in the coffins can remain preserved for centuries because of the cold which is perfect for Moria and his zombies. The other factor are the katanas that are stuck in the ground next to the graves. This is how he managed to steal Shusui together with Ryuma's body. Onimaru put the sword back to Ryuma's grave after stealing it from Zoro but I don't believe it ends here.

I wanna propose two ideas for Shiryu:

Since the grave as we speak right now is badly or not even guarded at all depending on where Onimaru currently is Shusui will be stolen again.
Shiryu will take it and be the next wielder of the legendary sword Shusui.

If Shiryu doesn't steal Shusui I think the idea of stealing Kaidos fruit and putting it into his sword is a good one. Oda has already hinted at a dragon sword in the SBS with Zoro being its potential wielder. Shiryu would have 2 Devil Fruits while Blackbeard has (probably) 3.
This is a bit outlandish but I think its absolutely possible. When Kaido gives in to his death and is finally ready to die Shiryu with his invisibility fruit comes in and sneaks the kill on Kaido. This way Kaido's dreams get crushed and he does not get the grand death he wished to have.
Afterwards Shiryu will somehow steal Kaido's fruit and either he does it on the spot or he takes it with him and puts it into his sword later on.

Little word play:
'shi' in japanese can be read as 'death' while 'ryu' means 'dragon'
Together, 'shi' and 'ryu' make Shiryu.

Devon on the other hand could come across Onimaru an actual kitsune (it seems, probably just a monk Devil Fruit tho) which would make for an interesting interaction. As well as her epithet could be hinting at a connection to the Kozukis.
In addition to that is her hobby of decapitating the heads of beautiful looking woman and adding them to her collection. Depending on where Hiyori currently is and where she will be I believe her to eventually come across Devon who will try to behead her. Most likely through deception with the help of her shape shifting Devil Fruit.
Devon's "Crescent Moon Hunter" epithet will play a role here as I believe Hiyori as a Kozuki to become the "Moon Princess" (but that's for a theory I will be writing out some other day).

Moria will collect some more samurai zombies and as the war progresses and comes closer to the end the Wano Squad will make their way to the battle place to collect Devil Fruits and some more corpses.
Moria will come across Kaido and they're gonna have their moment.
This is the obvious part of the squad's mission but there is one person that will come in contact with them and play a huge role in the future and that person is...

c) Caribou

Many believe Caribou to be secretly working for Blackbeard as a spy which to me makes no sense.
Caribou has not been seen anywhere in affiliation to Blackbeard.
He didn't have the time to team up with him unless it happened during the timeskip in Paradise.
Caribou has been stuck in Wano for weeks now why would Blackbeard not even make an attempt on getting him out of there if he is allegedly his spy.
Even in the latest chapters Caribou is insisting on the Strawhats being his only way out of this country.

Therefore I don't think he's affiliated with Blackbeard yet.
"Yet" because the Wano Squad will be the one to bring him to Blackbeard.
But step by step...

Caribou seems to want to impress a certain someone. That "certain someone" is most likely Blackbeard as many theorized before.

The crucial information regarding Poseidon is clearly gonna be shared with a high profile pirate like a Yonko. Caribou had the chance to tell Kaido but he decided not to it seems. If it was Big Mom he wouldn't have attacked the BM Pirates on Fishman Island so therefore only Shanks and Blackbeard are left. I do not believe Shanks would like to be associated with someone like Caribou leaving Blackbeard open. Both of them seem to be quite similar and showcase a few parallels.

Aside from the obvious same skin color they for example both entered Pirate Crews with the intent to betray them later on.

• Blackbeard was planning on betraying Whitebeard eventually down the line while Caribou (almost) entered the fake Strawhat crew which he had mistaken for the real one in order to kill them from inside.
• Caribou doesn't shy away from shamelessly using his people around him to his advantage the same way Blackbeard doesn't.
• Both have similar abilities with Caribous ability having the advantage of not destroying whatever is sucked in. So he's basically able to store anything in there which I will come to later.
• Both use supernatural justifications for their evil. While Blackbeard calls it fate, Caribou calls for God.
• Both seem to fear death a lot and shamelessly would be ready to do anything to avoid death. (Bb's reaction to almost dying to Whitebeard and Caribou begging for forgiveness when he gets caught on the Sunny)

Caribou looks up to Blackbeard and is stuck with Luffy constantly. It is not a coincidence that Oda decided to make his favorite food "meat pies" out of all things.

He also seems to have learned quite a lot too while he was imprisoned. As he describes he has been stuck in Udon for a while but he hasn't been doing nothing. He has gathered critical information.
For instance: He managed to find out about the snail system of Wano and also where the boss snail of Udon is located. Additionally he knows that these seastone cuffs are designed to have a mild effect.
I suspect him to also have found out more about what specifically they are mining regarding the metal. Such as the Drunken Iron Ore.

That metal is still unexplained and we don't know its real qualities that make it a "special metal". Though I assume Blackbeard would have interest in creating more of these weapons for himself.

Which leads me to the reasons Caribou would ask the Wano Squad to take him with them to Blackbeard.

d) Caribou the new Blackbeard Pirate

As explained before Caribou looks up to Blackbeard in some way and hopes that he would curry favor with him. Therefore he will be trying to join his crew by asking Shiryu/Devon and offering them two things.

1. To continue on the thought above Caribou's first argument will be the manufacturing of weapons containing the "Drunken Iron Ore". If he had mined Drunken Iron Ore which is highly likely then he knows about it being part of the weapons they are manufacturing.
   But is Wano the only place in which these weapons are being manufactured? I don't think so and for that we need to take a look at Caribou's cover story specifically the time when he was on Kaido's favorite island.
   On the island we see lots of metal and a weapons factory.
   In the weapons factory we see a guard looking over the workers holding a weapon and a sword next to him. So it's clear these people are being forced to work here for Kaido.
   Caribou frees these people later on and consumes the entire factory and as of right now we don't know whether he still has the factory inside of him or not.

After working together with Luffy and the scabbards to prepare for the raid Caribou disappeared for straight 68 chapters, from chapter 952 to 1020 where he made his reappearance. The last time we saw him before that was 7 days before the raid. Judging by the fact he made his reappearance in Tokage Port he must've stayed behind in Udon. But why?
In the last chapter that we've seen him before he disappeared he talks about how "we", as in him and the samurai, will surprise the enemy on the big day of battle. He was claiming to come with them but ultimately ended up staying back.

So what was he doing? In chapter 1021 he revealed his storage of one month worth of food supply. Filled with fresh meat, fruits and all that which he most likely stole in the meantime he disappeared. It's clear now he wasn't planning on staying on Luffy's ship until he reaches home but rather he wanted to leave alone as soon as possible to somewhere else. Nor was he actually planning on fighting with them.

Next to gathering food for his trip to somewhere, Caribou collected what he needed most to leave the island. Which I think to be the metal "Drunken Iron Ore".
As I said I suspect him to have found out about what they are mining, meaning:
He has taken all the weapons the samurai have left behind and the metal that was still not manufactured into weapons. The raw material.
The samurai have only taken the swords as we've seen through out Onigashima and it was also said samurais mainly fight with swords and spears and they would have had to have figured out in like a day how to use a canon, machine gun, firearm, etc.

Before he leaves Wano he will use the fact that Raizo owes him as an excuse to steal from Wano.

The end of Wano is approaching and we know nothing about Kaidos favorite island yet which leads me to believe that Caribou might actually lead the Blackbeard islands to that island depending on how important that island is and what exactly is hidden there which we will find out in a flasback.

We also dont know where Scotch is as Caribou drowned him and possibly consumed him because I doubt Oda is killing him.

Lastly Caribou will play a crucial role in stealing some poneglyphs out of Wano since we know that he can store them as he did in Fishman Island. This will be the way of Blackbeard obtaining information on the way to Laugh Tale and the general history of the world. How he will read those poneglyphs is up for another discussion…

2. Second option is the obvious one of simply telling Blackbeard about Poseidon leading to him going after Shirahoshi. I think both of these are possible at the same time.

TLDR:

• Laffite infiltrated Wano because of the metal they found in Baltigo which they traced back to Wano.
• The 925 Squad consisting of Moria (forced), Devon, Shiryu and possibly Laffite again infiltrates Wano to collect Devil Fruits, weapons and metal.
• Caribou has all of these except the Devil Fruits and offers a deal to the 925 squad if they take him to Blackbeard and let him join the crew.

@gloomy canyon done
@modest skiff @dusky acorn @grizzled fog @sand sail@hollow grotto @cedar sinew @weak arrow @craggy pumice @amber oar @night jewel @waxen dust @limber matrix

[gloomy canyon]

Nice, I'll pin it

#manga-theories message

[pastel summit]

Yes, he could've easily wired BM's call and found out about BM chasing and luffy heading to Kaido but the way Blackbeard speaks about it is like he knows about every single Supernova. Luffy, Zoro, Law, Kid, Killer etc..
In conclusion: Someone is giving Blackbeard info about the events in Wano from inside out.
The call was public. I'm still reading the theory, but I'll post this now. The call between Big Mom and Kaido was explicitly mentioned as being public, so you would not need a spy to know this information.

[gloomy canyon]

THEORIES

Kaido's Devil Fruit
Keturin#6669
#manga-theories message

~Pluton is a construction ship~
Salmy Gondy#9504
#manga-theories message

The True History of the Rocks Pirates and Fullalead Island
Homie Seal#7117
#manga-theories message

The 925 Squad and the New Blackbeard Pirate: Moria, Shiryu, Devon and ???
swrml#6817
#manga-theories message

Myou-ou and Luffy's Gear Fourth
The Yellow Vespa#3102
#manga-theories message

Laugh Tale, and how to get there
Elfansoer#0045
#manga-theories message

The Moon Fruit/How to Tame a Sulong (Using Dumplings)
Olisanto#3220
Badoulin#6146
#manga-theories message
#manga-theories message

Law's Awakening
Salmy Gondy#9504
#manga-theories message

Thriller Bark and Wano Parallels
Stoop#0307
#manga-theories message

Big Mom Takes Kaido's Soul
Salmy Gondy#9504
#manga-theories message

Luffy Ate the Resin Fruit
Pringles#2749
#manga-theories message

What and Who Exactly Is Joyboy?
Typical Toph Fan#9741
#manga-theories message

Why Luffy Is Still Rubber: Nika Nika no Mi, Awakening and What it Means to Become Joyboy
Badoulin#6146
#manga-theories message

Shinobu's true fruit: Toki-Toki no Mi
Su Long Bepo#4545
#manga-theories message

Monkey Man, Ruyi Jingu Bang, and Uranus theory after Chapter 1043
b9#8468
#manga-theories message

Theory: The importance of opening Wano and Luffy’s devil fruit can both be understood by examining Indonesian history and botany. Luffy’s fruit is based on the Indonesian Rubber Tree.
Mohdoo#9227
#manga-theories message

Devil Fruits
Stoop#0228
#manga-theories message

[copper frost]

oh new swrml theory

[ancient vault]

It wasnt public. It was just easily wireable which is what I said. THe call didnt have anything to do with the other novas except for luffy

[gloomy canyon]

Alright, gonna turn slow mode back on

[ancient vault]

Mistyped. I meant the call only mentioned luffy but none of the other novas

[gloomy canyon]

FYI, given shim is no longer a mod just ping me if you want your theories pinned I guess from now on

[pastel summit]

They mentioned Luffy, and Law and Luffy alliance was known to be public since before Dressrosa. and fair, it was publicly wireable. but I think it's naive to say that it wouldn't have become public information, especially considering that BB scene happens well after the call happens and Morgans exists. The point is that a spy isn't needed to know the information.

[ancient vault]

oh he isnt? alright

[ancient vault]

fair

I also didnt theorize to much on what the drunken iron ore exactly is. I might do some seperate stuff about it but I've seen someone say that it has the same characters as the kitetsus and that it might be realted to the cursed swords

[waxen light]

What da...

[ancient vault]

Didnt because I think its to much headcanon to spin around

[pastel summit]

Aside from the Lafitte stuff, and saying this would be happening so late, I think it's pretty solid. but I am against the idea right now 'cause I do not believe BB had a spy, and I strongly believe the war going on in Wano right now is completely unknown to people outside of Wano. Or at least, no one outside Wano knew that a war of this magnitude was going to happen.

I can buy something like knowing the ore was in Wano beforehand maybe. His crew is full of experienced pirates, maybe some of them knew about it beforehand. I did also completely forget about the drunken ore stuff prior to reading this though lol

[ancient vault]

[pastel summit]

Maybe.

[ancient vault]

Im always grabbing forgotten stuff up lul
Like with the wapol thing
Or what corazon said

Did u see my xebecs theory?

[pastel summit]

interesting.

[waxen light]

I appreciate your theories, swrml and I bet that youtuber does too.

I'm excited to see his next video.

[ancient vault]

Im not gonna post it on WG for a while to see if he steals it from here

[copper frost]

Ohara has been looking forward

[ancient vault]

Who exactly do you think also doesnt know? Cause the WG does idk about the navy

[pastel summit]

Before it started? Everyone didn't know. Kanjuro was the only spy among the ranks of the alliance that we know of, and the plans were completely hidden else as far as we know. and even Kanjuro didn't report accurately, so not even Orochi knew there would be a war until it happened. Assuming CP0 and Drake reported as soon as it started, then sure. WG and Marines would know. but that was only a few hours ago, not enough time to mobilize people to move in to Wano imo.

Like, you can infer that a fight would happen with the knowledge that Luffy and Law were in Wano, and BM chasing them. but after Drake reported the BM and Kaido alliance, I don't think anyone expected there to be some massive thing happening that would collapse that alliance. Like, from the outside looking in, you would never think a few supernova could topple 2 emperors teaming up. Hence why I don't think anyone is coming to "clean up" or anything like that.

[ancient vault]

Well as I've said in the theory they could use the war as a distraction to get that drunken iron ore.
But I get your point. But for the WG I think they could actually make it to Wano pretty quickly if Bruno is part of the cp0 or just still working for the WG

[pastel summit]

Blueno can't teleport I don't think, he just has access to a parallel dimension. Doesn't seem to distort space relatively. So 1m in the dimension is still 1m irl.

[ancient vault]

Hm didnt know

[pastel summit]

well, not a fact, it just doesn't seem like it can do that from what we've seen of it.

[ancient vault]

Who knows what other powers they got hiding but fair.
Theres still sengokus comment at the end of 957 that couldve meant that they cant ignore the situation in wano

[pastel summit]

Yeah. Idk what to make of Sengoku's comment tbh. Just I think no one really knows what's going on in Wano, and it's going to be a while before they can really react to it.

[pure raven]

The news of two emperors teaming up should get the WG on their feet and knowing luffy, it's safe to assume that BB thought about a war breaking out in wano and might want to make the best out of the situation.

[pure raven]

I think the fact that BM left some of her sweet generals behind in WCI was to protect it while she was gone. BM has a poneglyph and we know BB want's them so I feel like it would be a perfect time to make a move on a yonkos territory when they aren't there.

[pure raven]

@brazen igloo Leaving the strongest creature alive and uncaptured since the marines have no access to wano is a bad idea. The SHs already had to ally with the samurai, Minks and supernovas just to be able to have a chance against Kaidos crew. Luffy won't surpass Kaido after this arc and if Kaido decides to go after the SHs it will be major trouble for them. Luffy doesn't kill I know that but Zoro I feel will start building a grudge against kaido after he realizes that he is from Wano and he basically was robbed off of his family. There is also many foreshadowing for Zoro killing kaido. Now I am not saying Zoro will defeat Kaido but I'm saying Zoro will kill Kaido after the war is won etc. If zoro doesn't end up killing Kaido then someone else must or he has to be captured.

[pine delta]

who is even protecting big mom territory rn? injured katakuri/cracker/snack?

[pure raven]

I think so

[amber oar]

if Luffy already recovered I'd assume Kata did as well

[pure raven]

What you think will happen in the next chapter?

I mean if luffy defeat kaido then it's done for. Onigashima itself is a huge bomb

[pure raven]

Probably. I think Luffy was more damaged after the fight than katakuri was. Luffy had better endurance tho

Momo lifting onigashima will be an asspull ngl

[pine delta]

momo doesnt have to lift it just slowly lower it somewhere

but i agree, i dont know how he can move it all the way somewhere else considering how far mainland its gone

[pure raven]

Bruh it's festival there..

There are people everywhere

[pine delta]

its kinda an asspull but not really considering we still dont know why vegapunk made this fruit specifically to copy kaidos
plus something could still happen to change things up

they are in the middle of the country practically though...where would they even put it? even if they "slowly lower it" they just radically altered the landscape by putting essentially a island on top of a field

[pure raven]

The thing I'm conserned about is momo just turned into a giant dragon. Even of vegapunk did something. He is doing this within an hour..that's sounds really odd. I will be disappointed with this. I don't how other people consider this.. i just said my view

[pine delta]

oh i mean he was aged 20 years thats not really an asspull considering we've known of shinobus fruit for dozens+ of chapters

and he's still struggling a bit. I will be dissapointed as well though if he just carries the island back to where it was

[pure raven]

I wasn't talking about shinobu's fruit

It was about momo mastering his DF.
Luffy took 10 years to get control in it ig

Momo doing it in minutes

[weak arrow]

Momo already made flame clouds back on punk hazard. Some people get good control of their fruit right away like kalifa and Sabo. Others not do much like Luffy and tashigi in smoker’s body

[pine delta]

i will say those are two bad examples considering kalifa is cp9 with training and sabo had the brother connection+2nd RA

[hollow grotto]

@ancient vault A little late to the party but I like this idea. It gives Caribou more reason to be in Wano beyond the unfortunate circumstances that led to him being here, and gives Blackbeard more reason to care about him beyond his information about Posideon.

[pine delta]

currently momo is supporting kaido's clouds. we don't know whats gonna happen

ive been feeling caribou is blackbeards agent but im torn between him wanting to join blackbeards crew or being part of it all along. it could be either

[ancient vault]

It honestly makes no sense that hes his agent imo

[hollow grotto]

I can't see Caribou having been part of his crew for a while, it feels more like he's trying to join up with them as swrml's theory suggests

[ancient vault]

Many believe Caribou to be secretly working for Blackbeard as a spy which to me makes no sense.
Caribou has not been seen anywhere in affiliation to Blackbeard.
He didn't have the time to team up with him unless it happened during the timeskip in Paradise.
Caribou has been stuck in Wano for weeks now why would Blackbeard not even make an attempt on getting him out of there if he is allegedly his spy.
Even in the latest chapters Caribou is insisting on the Strawhats being his only way out of this country.

@pine delta

[hollow grotto]

but it wouldn't surprise me if they rid themselves of Caribou having exhausted his usefulness. He's a character that, if tragically killed/betrayed by Blackbeard, I would be genuinely sad over

[pine delta]

to be contrarian, i could see blackbeard laughing and telling him good luck
(also theres little radio communication out of the country so he couldve just been stuck)

narraratively, caribou knowing about poseidon is gonna be the ticket for a (unknown) major force to attack fishman island and trigger events that lead to the prophecy. At this point its either blackbeard or WG because every other player is out of commission

[ancient vault]

I also think its possible that hes following a grand plan like Blackbeard

[ancient vault]

and yh that'd be kind of sad

[hollow grotto]

you think Caribou has some sort of grand plan?

He comes off as very opportunistic, sure, but not a mastermind

[ancient vault]

I think he could have but thats just headcanon and just part of the parallels to blackbeard

maybe not grand plan but like a bigger goal he wants to reach

[hollow grotto]

oh right, fair enough

[ancient vault]

'shi' in japanese can be read as 'death' while 'ryu' means 'dragon'
Together, 'shi' and 'ryu' make Shiryu.

@hollow grotto

added

[waxen dust]

https://tenor.com/view/shiryu-one-piece-gif-18374250

[faint aspen]

Do guys think joy boy was the first haki user??

[pure raven]

no i think joy was the first person to use a df and make / find df

[empty barn]

ay yo i got a question

HOW THE FUCK

DO YOU BREAK
SEA PRISM

[earnest steppe]

Only the tip has sea prisim

[sand sail]

She didn't, only the tip of the jitte is sea prism. That's a question better for #also-manga or #manga though, this is more for theory discussion

[rugged cove]

its obvious the tip only has sea prism or else how is smoker gonna hold it

[empty barn]

i mean
gloves

and the jitte has some cloth onto it

the holding thing

is covered

[pine delta]

Is the consensus that moriah joined blackbeard? if so, do we think he will revive a few characters like Whitebeard for the final battle?

[empty barn]

nah when wano is over the bb pirates the world gov and the strawhat fleet will probably appear

there will be a fuck fest pretty much

[sour gust]

Anyone have a good theory video about the Gum Gum no mi Awakening?

[real swan]

No videos but imo it probably won't be like other awakenings we've seen. The reason doffy and karakuri work the same is because their fruits already allowed them to produce what they are made of.

Luffy doesn't produce or create rubber in any way, so his awakening would be weird if he could turn things into rubber. My theory is that he will be able to stretch himself as much as he wants and become a full giant, or can control his own size and shape at will.

[sour gust]

Would be logical according to his former Gear form

[wary fossil]

Is there a specific reason people think awakening has to do with the super/magical power aspect of DF? Why not just improving the lineage factor to allow for even more massive growth in general?

[sour gust]

Because just being big isn't really interesting

[wary fossil]

not size growth, stuff like strength

[sour gust]

How would you materialize it ? big muscle

[wary fossil]

that's not true

zoro and sanji are capable of big strength without increasing their muscles to look like burgess

[sour gust]

Yes but they're not made of rubber(this is a bad argument)

[wary fossil]

so?

[sour gust]

I don't know but awakening == Being just stronger is just a power up imo
And a simple power isn't suited for One Piece

[wary fossil]

there are weightlifters in smaller categories that are capable of much greater strength than average muscular guys of the same weight. There is much more to muscles than size

[sour gust]

That's why I have hard time to accept that part of theory

I got your point,but it's just a power up,nothing interessting

[wary fossil]

my point is that why does awakening have to be fruit power related? Doesn't the DF just improve the already existing lineage factor to allow for the "growth" of these powers? Why not a massive increase in haki use before exhaustion or something

[sour gust]

Like gear is lufy being faster and stronger but with counter parts during his form and backlash after
Juste being stronger isn't worthy enough imo

[wary fossil]

akainu-aokiji could've just fought so hard for so long that they permanently affected the weather, might not necessarily be their "awakening" affecting the area

[sour gust]

No? No one would or should be able to turn into a dragon or into a literal lightining

[wary fossil]

am I missing something?

[sour gust]

Do we have other awakening hints? because you could be right but this looks kinda big

Other than dofi turning things into strings

[wary fossil]

people think that akainu-aokiji awakened their DF and that's why the island is half and half

[sour gust]

Ohh

[wary fossil]

and the zoan jailers looking weird

[sour gust]

I see

[empty barn]

is salome wearing an oni skull ? hmmmmm

[sour gust]

It's a casual skull shape

[wary fossil]

but my point is that why not just a massive increase in strength(doesn't have to be pure strength, can affect stamina/haki/speed/etc)? Chopper achieved monster point through the use of rumble balls but couldn't control it before his timeskip power up

[empty barn]

no like onis could have been any size

[wary fossil]

the horns are different though

[sour gust]

Because strengh is weak in my opinion,also luffy is rubber fruit so there's no logic about a strengh focused awakening

[empty barn]

but thats only a theory
a one piece theory
and ima leave now

[empty barn]

eh they could have been any shape no ?

[wary fossil]

kaido and yamato have a different shape and it's the same shape between the two. Oars and Oars Jr has the same shape

onigashima also has the same horn shape as kaido/yamato

[cosmic bear]

my friend mentioned this to me im not sure what it means

i assume its blakbeards crew right? and its just a stretch lmao

[empty barn]

black beard identifies as they which indicates that he is trans xD
i mean which indicates that he has many souls

[wary fossil]

@cosmic bear some people think that they are referencing the fact that luffy/zoro know that BB is a pirate captain, some people think they are referencing the fact that luffy/soro know that BB is more than just 1 person

[cosmic bear]

oh is that the theory

[wary fossil]

people theorize that blackbeard is either 3 people in 1 (his jolly roger has 3 heads) Cerberus or that he is a kraken (which apparently have 3 hearts?)

[sour gust]

For me this page is random I wonder if there was really something behind it

[wary fossil]

I think it was just luffy and zoro acknowledging that he is a pirate and not just some rando

but I do subscribe to the theory that blackbeard will have 3 different type DF by the time him and Luffy fight and the last revealed one will be a zoan

[sour gust]

Yes but nothing more

[pine delta]

oda really be writing one line of dialogue at 3 am before a deadline 15 years ago and mf still thinking about it

[wary fossil]

that's just how good Oda is

[pine delta]

I believe a lot of details like that are kinda overblown. its clearly just referring to the entire crew

[sour gust]

And this is why I'm reading this manga lol

[wary fossil]

they are overblown, but Oda has made good use of small details, so people get thrown off by stuff like this

[cosmic bear]

^

[sour gust]

I don't get how he can't disapoint us

[cosmic bear]

i only thin a handful are overblown. this one is plausible

[wary fossil]

I get the feeling he's going to disappoint a lot of fans when he reveals that Sanji's newest powerup comes from Judge and not his mom like people are theorizing

[sour gust]

I mean The One Piece could disapoint, the sun god thing could too, the void century too

[wary fossil]

nah

[sour gust]

I mean there's a toki toki no mi,which implies time travel so a lot of stuffs could be like zetsu in naruto and make a deus ex machina

[wary fossil]

at this point, it's practically impossible to disappoint because we have enough pieces that it's interesting no matter what the reveal is

[sour gust]

I agree

[real swan]

The ultimate shonen ending...don't answer anything

[wary fossil]

if it was about the reveal, then Robin/Luffy wouldn't have cared when Rayleigh was talking about it

tbh I don't even think finding the one piece will be the end of it lol

or it will be the "end", where finding the one piece starts off a new adventure that we don't get to see

[pine delta]

theres no way we dont get answers, considering the direction of the plot will resolve every theory, setup, lore in one big bow

[sour gust]

I wonder if we'll still have some empty plot

[wary fossil]

I don't think so. Just empty specifics like I doubt we'll encounter all the meito

[dense shadow]

yk i really believe that after wano there's gonna be a lot of talking between characters in one piece, luffy meeting shanks, maybe dragon, zoro finding out about his lineage, etc... because by that point luffy's a yonko, and his crew is a yonko crew, a legitimate one with territories and allies all over the grand line. so then who's gonna want to take them on? everyone's gonna see it's a battle with too many losses so they won't bother.

so then the logical answer to "what's next" is separate character arcs and dialogue, preparing for the final destination, laugh tale.

[wary fossil]

Cipher Pol monitoring Wano, so probably the WG

[dense shadow]

yea but a dialogue and character dev arc is bound to happen, maybe i jumped the gun a little bit on the "after wano" part. but still when you get too op for anyone to fight you, you talk.

[wary fossil]

Becoming a yonko isn't a guarantee that you won't be attacked. Remember the WG took on a massive war just to publicly execute a yonko commander

they could've just dipped out with Ace once the yonko Whitebeard arrived if they were only interested in killing Ace

WG is by far the most powerful force in the One Piece world

[dense shadow]

that was roger's son, and they didn't want the war, blackbeard brought it to them. plus roger playing them hard, reaching raftel and creating the golden era of piracy kinda got them butthurt

[wary fossil]

and you think all the things Luffy did aren't gonna leave them butthurt enough to attack?

[dense shadow]

they were also confident they were gonna win because whitebeard is old

would they have taken on a young whitebeard? i doubt it.

[wary fossil]

yes they probably would've

[dense shadow]

sorry meant whitebeard lol

[wary fossil]

Whitebeard has the power to sink them regardless of age and they still fought. Smart strategy would be to run away with Ace and transmit the public execution somewhere else

[dense shadow]

he could sink them anywhere, he just didn't wanna sink ace his son

[wary fossil]

WG's folly is that they are so powerful they mess up because of their complacency

[stone onyx]

Do you have a feeling that cipher pol isn't really in it for some action but to update the bounties and steal "who's who"

[wary fossil]

Cipher Pol is there for information. What is Kaido (and now the Strawhats) doing in Wano? Why Wano? When does he plan on moving? etc

Wano isn't part of WG, so they have to control it by different means

[stone onyx]

Well. They can take Robin while we are at it. But bounties. They are the secret agency, we may have no update right after Wano.

[wary fossil]

It's still possible. WG could lie about it and say the SHs were working with Kaido or something

[stone onyx]

3 Yonko: Kaidou, Big Mom and Monkey D Luffy alliance. WG trembles in fear

[wary fossil]

wouldn't put it past the WG to show up at the end of the battle with Akainu and just melt Onigashima into oblivion after Momo puts it back where it was

[stone onyx]

By the way didn't he mention Kaido has a poneglyph makes sense for it to be in Wano. Still not a panel hinting it's location.

[wary fossil]

Oden also says there's a poneglyph in the flashback iirc

that's when he goes back to Wano for a very short time I think

[stone onyx]

So they have to win to get it, not copy like big mom's. Also in Wano, pretty sure Kaido could find masons to erase it.

[woven burrow]

Oh yea Law was looking for it

iirc he was anyway

[stone onyx]

By the way, Robin was in Wano and copy is on Sunny, do you think she already has 2nd coordinates.

Cause they might just have already 3 done by the end of Wano and only 1 to go. Presumably hidden poneglyph by WG or Whitebeard. Boy, one piece is coming to an end isn't it.

[woven burrow]

Yessir

I'm guessing the last Poneglyph is either:

• In Whitebeard's village
• In Elbaf
• In Shanks' possession

WB may have taken it from FMI when he made it his territory so the island would be safer

[amber oar]

WB would have never made his hometown a target

[pine delta]

its both last two

[stiff patrol]

Perhaps in elbaf which is guarded by shanks

[pine delta]

shanks def has a red ponyglyph but i do wonder where they all got them. it kind of feels like rocks was the one who originally gathered their ponyglyphs but if roger stole big moms they had it for a while. id assume the WG would work hard to gather them all and hide them in mariejois? Unless gorosei think that splitting up the ponyglyph with each emperor would keep any of them from allying. i dont buy that tho

i do wonder where the red ponglyphs were originally and how they got scattered. zunisha having one and the minks having the kozuki crest means its clearly void century planning, are there 3 other major animals that died/were killed or did the rest have much less interesting hiding spots?

[woven burrow]

Well, we know the original location of 3 of the 4 (Zunesha, Wano, FMI). Idk where Big Mom got hers

So 3 of the 4 came from non WG spots

[pine delta]

wano and fmi both originally had red ponyglyphs??

[woven burrow]

FMI had it with Joyboy's apology poneglyph so I'm assuming it was there since void century

And the Kozuki created the poneglyphs so I'm also assuming there was one there originally as well

[pine delta]

i meant more the 4 road ones.

[woven burrow]

Yea FMI had a road poneglyph right next to Joyboy's during Roger's time

So I'm assuming Joyboy delivered both of those himself to them

[pine delta]

ok i see that now i checked the wiki. im assuming big mom took it when she took over? Kaido directly was asked where his ponyglyph was so theres still the possibility its in a unique spot