manga-theories

[balmy path]

There are animals with multiple compartments in their stomach. He could have the goat-goat fruit, billy goat model, which explains the long beard

[dapper mica]

Gear 5 concept: Small/dwarf/ant man

By compressing his body (much like what he does to his arms in gear 4 but to his whole body), Luffy can decrease his size while increasing the rubber’s tension.

Strengths:
-Smaller so harder to hit and more agile, like the tontattas
-Body under tension makes his attacks stronger
-Smaller fists/feet/head means less surface area so attacks have more pressure

Weaknesses:
-Takes a lot of energy to hold his rubber at a high tension, so can find it difficult to concentrate on haki or strategy, and cannot hold this form for long

[brisk mirage]

So Ant-man?

[lyric dust]

I'm trying to imagine an ant sized Luffy punching Kaido, and I just cannot

[junior shoal]

Need awakening more than gear 5

[dapper mica]

Yes basically

[brisk mirage]

I imagine Luffy’s awakening as similar to Leorio’s ability in HxH. As in Luffy will be able to make objects rubberize and teleport punches remotely.

[dapper mica]

Rubber awakening would be useless it would just turn the world into a trampoline, it’s not like string or mochi which is controlled by the power user

[balmy path]

Luffy with go Snakeman and enter Kaido’s body (pause) and use Ryuo

[unreal merlin]

LOL

[kind gate]

whoaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[dapper mica]

It would increase his agility but that’s about it

[lyric dust]

you should probably spoiler tag that or delete it, cause it is hxh spoilers

[kind gate]

same

[cyan sand]

what does the '(pause)' mean

[unreal merlin]

i wanna see kid awaken his fruit

[junior shoal]

Nothing is useless, one could say something about mochi too before seeing how that power works like how mochi power user can be so strong? Mochi?

[brisk mirage]

How is it spoilers when it came out over 25 years ago

[unreal merlin]

not animated

[lyric dust]

some people still haven't read it

[kind gate]

kata can control mochi, luffy can only stretch

[dapper mica]

I don’t understand: if Luffy apparently learned gear 4 during the time skip why didn’t he use it at fish man island to destroy the boat/beat hordy quicker

[brisk mirage]

Kata is a bad example since he has an almost Logia form of Paramecia

[unreal merlin]

oda was saving the moment

[kind gate]

doffy

[dapper mica]

I thought it was logia

[unreal merlin]

special paramecia

[brisk mirage]

Nope Kata is paramecia, just a rare form

[dapper mica]

Logia awakenings must be op
Sakasuki proceeds to turn the world into lava

And how would a zoan awakening work?

[unreal merlin]

chopper

more than 3 transformations

[dapper mica]

Oh yeah more transformations

So has chopper had an awakening then?

[lyric dust]

you turn into a huge version of your animal or whatever and gain more endurance and strength

[balmy path]

@unreal merlin I thought it was bc of the pills

[kind gate]

I doubt logia awakenings are like the paramecia users we saw
I think logias just become stronger
zoans have recover faster and become stronger i believe

[unreal merlin]

he doesnt need anymore

[dapper mica]

Could a rumble ball then be a drug that temporarily awakens your power? No ones tried a rumble ball except chopper

[unreal merlin]

i always thought that

[balmy path]

The Impel Down guardians are Awakened Zoans too, right?

True

[weary cliff]

It's all but confirmed monster point is an awakening like the jailer beasts. Chopper just cant do it at will

[unreal merlin]

yea

[brisk mirage]

And can’t maintain the form indefinitely

[unreal merlin]

but he can do more than 3 transformations without it

[polar bison]

kata’s fruit works exactly like a logia, it’s just classified as a paramecia because mochi isn’t a naturally occurring thing

[unreal merlin]

doesnt it work like a logia only due to his observation haki?

[polar bison]

no, it’s better than a logia due to his obs haki.

[unreal merlin]

i mean yes

[weary cliff]

Not exactly. Its special because it does 2 things normal paramecia can: generate and become mochi. It just appears like he has logia intangiblity because he uses his haki to predict where he will be hit and moves his body around it

[polar bison]

without his haki it would still work fine against non CoA attacks

[polar bison]

this isn’t true.

[brisk mirage]

Um it’s pretty much exactly true

[unreal merlin]

thats what i thought lmaoo

like hes shaping his body

[polar bison]

yes, he’s doing that for specifically haki attacks

[weary cliff]

It was probably supposed to he a logia type but Oda made a very clever retcon

[polar bison]

jfc this server

[night jewel]

its not, awakening a zoan doesnt mean you can use more than 3 forms, thats now how crocodile describes them

[unreal merlin]

i see

[weary cliff]

I'm not the one advocating the 3 shape thing. I specifically mean MP

[night jewel]

chopper obtained his forms by messing up with his body, science stuff and whatever, while awakening is a vastly different thing

MP would be his 4th form, so its the same thing

[unreal merlin]

that makes sense

[night jewel]

it works like luffy's gomu gomu yea

[polar bison]

katakuri is immune to normal attacks not imbued by haki. the reason he’s worth $1b is he has great obs haki that makes him immune to most haki attacks as well

[night jewel]

its how luffy returns bullets, that doesnt mean it works like a logia

[polar bison]

we literally see katakuri detach his arm from his body and then reform it, how is this a question

[unreal merlin]

yea we can agree he is a logia

[grizzled fog]

He’s literally not

[night jewel]

he is a paramecia lol, and works like one too

[unreal merlin]

hes both then lol

[grizzled fog]

No, just a paramecia

[unreal merlin]

[craggy pumice]

dont think too much about ODas hackery

[night jewel]

Katakuri can produce, control and become mochi, but also convert the environment into mochi, so him launching his fists doesnt make him a logia really

[mild kite]

Katakuri's powers resemble a logia fruit, but isnt because mochi isnt an element and doesnt occur naturally.

[polar bison]

guys there’s a reason he was introduced as a logia by Oda originally, and that’s because his powers are that of a logia. this panel said logia in the original release. special paramecia literally means “it’s a logia under the paramecia banner.”

oda would’ve made him a logia if he hadn’t forgotten abt his own nature rules lol

bc that’s how his powers work

[night jewel]

yes...? its a mistake

[mild kite]

Jinbe has a lisp confirmed

[polar bison]

my point is his powers work identically to logias bc that’s how he was designed from the start

[polar bison]

that’s just on the official translation

[night jewel]

idk how that really proves that his abilities works like a logia, does koby being called a rear admiral make him a rear admiral now? oda just made a mistake, thats all really

[mild kite]

Yeah ik

[polar bison]

that’s a bad comparison

[night jewel]

I dont think it is, oda makes mistakes and there isnt much to think about it

[polar bison]

you can’t argue that future sight was introduced to retcon him being a logia, because it was introduced before he was called a logia.

so katakuri as we were originally presented was a logia with future sight. he was always going to be this new type of immune enemy that Luffy needed to overcome (since Oda loves those so much). all that changed was a title. there is no reason to believe his powers are somehow different now

[pure raven]

Isn't Katakuri's fruit classified as a special paramecia because it blurred the boundary between paramecia and logia

[polar bison]

going from logia -> special paramecia changed literally nothing abt the character is my point: it’s just a consistency change on Oda’s part to cover his ass, since he previously said Logias were natural elements

[pure raven]

Yea his powers are logia-esque but mochi isn't natural ergo he's a special paramecia

[polar bison]

thank u for making sense lillahk:-)

[unreal merlin]

thats all we were trying to say lol

we know hes a paramecia

[night jewel]

what part is logia esque? I don't see it really, it acts pretty much like a paramecia

[polar bison]

dude ur trolling

[night jewel]

huh

[craggy pumice]

Wasnt that just called a logia originally because of a mistake of his assisstance

[night jewel]

its better to not accuse people of trolling, I already answered why him launching fists doesnt make his df "logia-esque" or him blocking bullets like luffy doesnt make his df logia-esque

[polar bison]

when did u answer I did not see

[kind gate]

it changes the definition of logias

[night jewel]

.

[iron blade]

snk >one piece dont miss

[kind gate]

launching fists is a paramecia type ability
why do people here argue without reading

[night jewel]

ok

[pure raven]

Logia is one of the three Devil Fruit types, being the rarest out of all of them. This type of Devil Fruit allows the user to transform the composition of their body into a natural element at will, as well as create and control it.
Katakuri does all these things but mochi is not a natural element.

[polar bison]

ok so. he can become mochi. you said that.

[night jewel]

like luffy is rubber, yes

[polar bison]

you do understand that is the primary ability of logias

producing and becoming their element

[pure raven]

Luffy cannot create rubber but awakened Katakuri creates mochi out of things.

[kind gate]

logias can only control the ones they produce correct?

[polar bison]

not being a rubber man. but producing and being their element

katakuri is mochi, not a mochi man

[pure raven]

If Luffy's arm gets blown off, Luffy cannot generate rubber to create a new arm.

[night jewel]

doffy can produce strings too, idk how that changes much

[unreal merlin]

what does luffy have to do with this lmao

[night jewel]

oh wait nvm that

[polar bison]

bc arsal is trying to say his and kata’s powers are in any way equivalent

[night jewel]

it was a clone i was thinking about

[unreal merlin]

oh okay

i mean wasnt it said his fruit is a better version of luffy's

[polar bison]

yes

that doesn’t make it equivalent. it does what luffy’s does and way more. bc it works like a logia

[unreal merlin]

yes

[pure raven]

I wouldn't say Kata's fruit is a better version of Luffy's. That'll just open you up to criticism that isn't on topic with Kata having logia-esque abilities but being classified as a paramecia.

[polar bison]

yes but katakuri does say that in the manga

[pure raven]

Luffy has the ability to accelerate his blood flow and use gears. Kata will probably melt if he tries that.

[polar bison]

my issue from the beginning has just been this idea that if katakuri didn’t have great haki he couldn’t tank any hits. he absolutely would be immune to any non haki hits

[polar bison]

and funnily enough that’s how he wins. katakuri btfo’d

[polar bison]

bc he’s mochi

[night jewel]

because katakuri can produce mochi, he is throwing mochi fists that he can produce, or can convert the environment into mochi to make fists, like he has 4 at one point

[pure raven]

In a world without haki, logias can only be countered by a more dominant logia like Ace vs Akainu. But the world has haki so we have to deal with that.

Yea Arsal. That's a logia-esque ability.

[polar bison]

yes, and that means he can get his arm back because he also is mochi

luffy can’t add rubber to himself

[night jewel]

no, that doesnt make it logia-esque, it just makes his paramecia ability different from the usual you would see

[pure raven]

I think you're being stubborn with this one. Take Smoker as an example.

[night jewel]

and I didnt say its the exact same as luffy's btw, i was talking about your example where he stops bullets

[weak arrow]

Katakuri is effectively a logia except he isn’t a natural element. That’s the only difference.

[polar bison]

we’ve been saying that adam 😔😔

[unreal merlin]

ty

[pure raven]

I'm interested in hearing why Arsal disagrees though

[night jewel]

I am saying that its not that much like logia, not arguing whether its a logia or not, its factually a paramecia

[weak arrow]

Yeah I’m a little confused on what exactly the argument was supposed to be Khione.

But it is a logia in everything except name

[polar bison]

arsal doesn’t think it acts like a logia

and doesn’t think katakuri would be immune to non-CoA attacks if not for his haki??

[night jewel]

huh

did i say that?

[polar bison]

I mean that’s what this conversation was started abt

[night jewel]

no i wasnt arguing with that

[polar bison]

alright cool

[pure raven]

This is the only place where Arsal disagrees with us

[polar bison]

I still don’t see how u think it’s any different from a logia but like u can have that

[weak arrow]

He gets hit by plenty of attacks during the wedding which have no effect and he is not using future sight to completely dodge it. He has logia intangibility . He has the ability to reproduce his body like a logia. He has the ability to produce his element like a logia. So everything as a logia except in name

[night jewel]

I literally said that he can stop bullets because his df acts similarly as gomu gomu in that regard, so i dont think he will be unable to stop non COA attacks even without future sight

[pure raven]

(double negative might be a bit confusing there)

[night jewel]

yea true

[polar bison]

luffy’s fruit’s immunity to bullets is different from Kata’s and Logia’s complete intangibility against most normal damage

[weak arrow]

It is not just the bullets either, but is directly sliced by Pedro and direct hit by Ichiji

[night jewel]

take opera's cream cream as example, it also allows him to become cream, produce it and control it, but would that make him a logia?

[polar bison]

opera’s cream cream doesn’t let him become cream lol

[night jewel]

his entire body is literally always cream

[polar bison]

it coats him a la magellan/trebol

[night jewel]

we never see him without the coating, I am pretty sure he is cream as well

[pure raven]

Nobody's arguing that it makes him a logia.
Forget about the logia or paramecia classification. If it isn't natural, it's a paramecia.
Just ask if it means that he has 'logia-esque abilities'

[night jewel]

that was a bad way to phrase that, i should clarify that it doesnt make his abilities "logia-esque"

yea i am trying to see if we ever saw opera without "coating" but we dont

[weak arrow]

If opera was able to reproduce cut off limbs, is actually cream, and was impervious to non haki attacks, then yes I would label him as a special paramecia and would be a logia in everything except name

[pure raven]

I just remembered Jinbe smacks Opera but we never see if he's actually cream.

[weak arrow]

Yeah, +fishman karate would work even if he is cream, cause it’s a liquid

[night jewel]

dont think there is much point is always coating yourself, i think its safe to assume that he himself is cream

[night jewel]

yes, thats also cream

[polar bison]

normal human hands?? trebol and magellan also literally always do it lol

[night jewel]

what chapter is that ? lemme look at the colored manga

[polar bison]

when u produce cream it just comes off u naturally

[weak arrow]

Cracker also always does it 😉

[grizzled fog]

Magellan isn’t coated in poison 24/7 tho

[night jewel]

white, cream hands lol

[weak arrow]

But honestly I think most people assume he’s just covered in cream, cause no distinction was ever made

[night jewel]

I always thought he was cream, literally never stated to be anything else so...

[polar bison]

he could also just have a white skin tone?

[weak arrow]

Where’s the panel after big mom wastes him

[night jewel]

which happens to be covering him too?

oops

meant to say " which happens to be the same color as the cream covering him too?

forgot to add that

[pure raven]

It wasn't stated to be anything so we can't conclude anything other than a surface level observation that he's always covered in cream.

[weak arrow]

But yeah, this is the first I’ve ever heard someone thinks he’s cream, because normal paramecia don’t become their elements. Since he isn’t special, he isn’t cream.

[polar bison]

I think that generally fits the OP aesthetic yeah

[night jewel]

how is he able to maintain his coating while being unconscious?

[polar bison]

also oops wrong panel

[pure raven]

Cream doesn't just disappear if you're coated in it and fall unconscious.

[polar bison]

idk he seems pretty formed even while dead to me. like a man covered in cream, rather than cream forming a man

[unreal merlin]

shes using coa

[night jewel]

this is the first time i have seen someone say that he isnt cream, but also i have never had this argument before so ig that makes sense

no but devil fruit powers vanish if you fall unconscious

[polar bison]

he’s a cream man in the same way magellan is a poison man and trebol is a gross man I don’t understand the issue here

all three of these however are markedly different from how katakuri is the essence of mochi and can form his body however he wants and regenerate it because he can produce mochi and also is mochi

[weak arrow]

If he was cream, then yeah she’d have to use haki to even grab him. So I guess you have to believe she is unconsciously using CoA

[polar bison]

which canonically she doesn’t

so far

[night jewel]

bm is using armament

[mild kite]

The onepiece wikia says he has a paramecia type devil fruit. So he just covers himself in cream. This is from sbs volume 90

[night jewel]

wiki says a lot of stuff, they also state raizo as a df user, when he is not confirmed to be one

hm, lemme check that

[pure raven]

Opera's is the Kuri Kuri no Mi, making him a Cream Man. He can control the cream that comes out of his body, the sweetness carried in his new attack concepts makes him a troublesome enemy.

[night jewel]

Opera's is the Kuri Kuri no Mi, making him a Cream Man. He can control the cream that comes out of his body, the sweetness carried in his new attack concepts makes him a troublesome enemy.

oh there we go

[pure raven]

How does the cream come 'out' of his body?

[night jewel]

because his body is cream :)

cream man, like luffy is a rubber man

[pure raven]

The Kuri Kuri no Mi is a Paramecia-type Devil Fruit that allows the user to create and manipulate cream at will, making them a Cream Human (クリーム人間 Kurīmu Ningen?).

[night jewel]

now thats wiki

[pure raven]

It seems that he can generate/create cream.
No, Luffy cannot generate or create rubber.

[night jewel]

not the SBS

[pure raven]

Now that's headcanon. Not the SBS.

[night jewel]

well there is more clearer indication that he is made of cream and not coating himself

[mild kite]

This is why i think Luffy's awakening isnt a rubber world.

[night jewel]

but true, there is no definite proof

[pure raven]

No there isn't.

All we ever see is Opera coated with cream. We never see any indication that he is made of cream.

[night jewel]

I am not going to repeat what i said, I already said enough.

[pure raven]

I don't want this to be the case either

If anything, Jinbe's fishman karate should blow a hole in Opera if he's made of cream.

Instead, it just knocks him back.

[unreal merlin]

makes sense

[night jewel]

yes because he is attacking using the moisture inside cream's body, idk why it would blow a hole in him

er

opera

but yea, The reproducing cut off limbs is really the only part he is different at, which i think he is just doing by producing mochi, I didnt say it acts the same as luffy's gomu gomu, I said its similar, luffy is impervious to non haki attacks too, he can block bullets and shoot them back to opponents, which was one of the examples used, its not that logia-esque but i think the person i was arguing with has left so no use arguing any further

[pure raven]

Luffy is not impervious to non-haki attacks. This is why he avoids sharp objects.

[night jewel]

aside from sharp objects, thats why i used the bullets example

which was an example used to prove why its "logia-esque"

[pure raven]

If you stabbed Katakuri without any haki involved in the situation, what would happen?

[kind gate]

Nothing I think

[pure raven]

If you stabbed Luffy without any haki involved in the situation, what would happen?

[kind gate]

Luffy hold get hurt

[ancient vault]

What do we learn from this? Brook pre TS speed blitzes luffy easily

[night jewel]

we have never seen katakuri get hit by a sword i think

pedro only cuts the mochi he produced

[pure raven]

Arsal just doesn't wanna say he's wrong. That's all there is to it. Katakuri is a logia in all but name.

You've had 5 people explain it to you and still refuse to address the main points.

[night jewel]

if you dont want to discuss then its fine, dont.

[pure raven]

We've said everything that needs to be said

[night jewel]

why do you keep doing this weird " oh no this guy doesnt want to be proven wrong, oh no" thing, I have seen you act like this multiple times and it genuinely adds nothing to the conversation.

[pure raven]

It adds nothing to the conversation when you see logically sound reasoning and choose to focus on a weak side comment to straw man the main point we're trying to make. In any case, I'm not gonna comment on this any further. Have a nice day

[night jewel]

I dont see logical sound reasoning but have a nice day as well

[kind gate]

Then again we haven’t seen kata take sword attack

Also where’s the panel talking about his fruit

[mild kite]

Luffy can get damaged by attacks without Haki, Katakuri cannot.

[night jewel]

only attacks from a sharp object, and we havent katakuri take any

[mild kite]

Luffy can get hurt by blunt attacks too (ie. All of pre timeskip with opponents without haki). He is just way more resistant to blunt attacks than normal people.

[dusky acorn]

#manga-theories message

It's probably for the best that Katakuri was put into the paramecia category. If he was still a Logia, then that would have meant revealing what Logia awakenings actually are, way before Oda actually anticipated to have them put into the story

[night jewel]

pretty sure he is completely immune to blunt attacks

[kind gate]

I doubt logias would have those kind of awakenings too OP

[mild kite]

Nah I dont think he's completely immune.

[night jewel]

I feel like people look too much into oda's mistake, its just a mistake that he corrected, thats all really

I mean the man drew denjiro's silhouette instead of kanjuro's back in dressrosa, he forgets stuff at times

[craggy pumice]

he did that?

[night jewel]

yes

@craggy pumice

[craggy pumice]

interesting

[polar bison]

he can control that cream that comes out of his body. so. he can produce and control cream. he isn’t cream. this is a very clear cut thing

[night jewel]

that doesnt explain why he stays cream even when he is unconscious lol

[night jewel]

yes, thats the mochi he produced

[polar bison]

that’s his leg dude

same vibe

[craggy pumice]

Katakuri piercing Luffys face with his knee still looks so painful

[polar bison]

he’s not cream,,, it’s just on his body,,

[kind gate]

Huh

[ancient vault]

Like trwbol?

[night jewel]

that is literally mochi that he produced from his leg, thats why he is able to make it bigger without inflating it like luffy can

idk why oda would just never show this, you are just assuming that he is like trebol or w/e

[dusky acorn]

So basically the argument here is that Katakuri expands his limbs such as the leg in that example by instead creating a solely exterior layer of "mochi" armour to inflate it, which Pedro cut VS his literal leg just being entirely mochi?

[polar bison]

no, he made his actual leg larger, because he is mochi. there is no differentiation between the two: you see it more clearly in his most powerful attack

[kind gate]

I’m so confused

[polar bison]

the heart of the argument is whether or not katakuri has equivalent powers to a logia, but is simply a “special paramecia” because mochi isn’t natural

[night jewel]

i think this started from some theory about logia awakening, and devolved into that shim, but the argument is basically that katakuri's ability isnt very "logia-esque" but it mostly acts like a paramecia and that one mistake from oda doesnt prove otherwise

[night jewel]

this is again, the same thing, he isnt inflating his leg, he is producing mochi and basically coating his leg with that, thats how his legs are bigger

[dusky acorn]

Oh, then if I were to pick between the 2, I would say Katakuri's fruit functions more like a Logia. The only thing is, it runs on a man-made substance, so can't be put into that specific Logia category, but it's still so unique in it's variety of uses that it's special.

[kind gate]

Same

[dusky acorn]

Like, I don't think we've seen any other Paramecia be so special as to morph the users body itself, like in Katakuri's flowing mochi, or regenerate limbs

[night jewel]

and then i brought up opera as an example, because thats an example of a paramecia operating like katakuri's mochi mochi

[copper frost]

Katakuri is the only one we've seen so far but I won't be surprised if Oda brings in more such special Paramecia users ig

[kind gate]

Imagine a special paramecia with zoan like abilities

[dusky acorn]

Hawkins is pretty close to that special paramecia-ness I'd say. When Zoro cuts his body in Wano, we see that his body can literally turn into straw, when the voodoo dolls sprout out of him

[night jewel]

I agree that it is different from a regular paramecia, i havent disagreed with that, I am disagreeing with the entire notion that it was supposed to be a logia and that oda only made him a "special paramecia" to cover his ass because he forgot that mochi isnt a naturally existing element

[copper frost]

Nah, I think it was already decided that the classification was special Paramecia right?

[night jewel]

he made the mistake once in the magazine release

called it a logia or w/e

[copper frost]

Yeah, corrected that in the volume release?

[night jewel]

yup

[copper frost]

I see, yeah, I would consider the volume release here more so than the magazine version since we mostly talk volume chapters than in terms of magazine chapters

[kind gate]

No I think Oda changed it to
Probably not to confuse potential logia awakenings
Not to change the definition of logia

[night jewel]

ah yea, thats also a good example, forgot about that, but also he hasnt been called a special paramecia

I am not sure how that panel changed anything

[polar bison]

this is him actively changing/morphing his body

the same way he did in the prior two. he’s not “coating” it with mochi, he is mochi

[night jewel]

dont think i said otherwise, i think he is mochi too but that, and him suddenly bringing in a massive elephant gun to counter luffy's elephant gun is an example of him producing massive amounts of mochi instead of just inflating his body

[kind gate]

Oh yh he also has some paramecia type abilities

Huh what am I saying

[polar bison]

again. he is mochi. so he’s just making his body larger, by making himself - mochi - larger

[dusky acorn]

But yeah I'd say that's fair then. Tbh it's hard to believe Oda would forget one of the most basic qualifications of his fruit classes.
If Oda was really trying to make Katakuri a sort of parallel and +1 of Luffy, then still having his fruit in the exact same Paramecia category as him, but making it special seems like it was Oda's original intent. The Logia thing could have been a mistake just on a whim..

[kind gate]

Do logias do this¿

[polar bison]

idt logias being a natural element is a basic qualification of his fruit classification. it’s something he says off hand in an SBS, never in the actual manga, and he already blurs the line with shit like Caribou. so I think he yeah forgot that logias were natural only when he made Kata and then amended him to be a paramecia to stay in line with that

[polar bison]

enel, caribou, akainu... yeah

[kind gate]

Is it producing more or making themselves larger¿

[polar bison]

the entire point of logias is that they are their element. there’s no difference

[night jewel]

hawkins' doll also come out of his body so yea, its fair to assume that he is made of straw himself too ig

[dusky acorn]

Oh, it's really never been stated in story? If that's the case then I can see Oda having more reason to forget about it, if it's not something he constantly talks about

[copper frost]

Hawkins is the only one right now edging towards that special Paramecia territory tbh

[dusky acorn]

I see it restated all the time within the community so I blew it up to be a defining thing though

[polar bison]

yep. it’s been awhile since I checked but iirc he mentioned it once in an early sbs when differentiating the 3 types

[night jewel]

I am pretty sure its mentioned in the story, but him saying it in an sbs is enough anyways

[copper frost]

SBS details are canon, when it comes to story so I would say considering that is fine

[polar bison]

yeah no one’s questioning their canonicity

but I think it makes sense as something Oda would forget. especially considering Caribou

[copper frost]

Caribou's fruit is naturally occuring as mud isn't it? I think it's a pretty clear distinction to make between him and Katakuri for example

[night jewel]

yea i find it hard to believe that he just forgot such an important detail about his power system lol

[kind gate]

is hawkins a paramecia zoan or something?

[pure raven]

[night jewel]

paramecia

[copper frost]

Hawkins for now is considered to be a Paramecia, so it has to be seen otherwise folarin

[kind gate]

Yh I know what he is but I'm talking characteristics and stuff

[night jewel]

he can produce straw and is straw himself, if thats what you are asking

[kind gate]

oh okay thank you

he also transforms into that straw monster

[copper frost]

Oh I see, yeah, I thought you were just asking his clasification lmao

[night jewel]

well he produced the monster

but his straw dolls come out of him yea

[kind gate]

[polar bison]

besides the evidence being right there in him initially calling katakuri’s fruit a logia?

what is more likely. that Oda forgot a small detail about his power system that he’s never referenced in the story, or that he just, randomly called it something he knew it wasn’t?

how does that make sense to you. in what world would that be a mistake a human would make

[kind gate]

hmmm I think I understand the argument now

and khione you believe he's just a logia who didn't meet the requirement right?

[night jewel]

it is not a small detail, its like if he forgot the difference between CoA and CoO somehow, its a core detail that i dont think oda would forget, in what world would an author forget something like that? you can go look through the Wiki to see the kinds of mistakes he has made before, like calling koby a rear admiral, like drawing denjiro instead of kanjuro, like forgetting to draw zoro and kid's scar a trillion times, like calling kozuki "kogetsu", like calling big mom "big mam", etc etc

he is just a human who made. a. mistake.

[kind gate]

Arsal what mistake do you think he made

[night jewel]

he called mochi mochi a logia just one time but corrected it later

[kind gate]

I mean the reason for that
Like why do you think he made it
Just a mistake?

[night jewel]

because he is just a human being, and him making a simple mistake isnt out of the question

[ancient vault]

big meme

[night jewel]

what is out of the question is him basing an entire character's powers on a detail that he "forgot", that character being one of the two main antagonists of a major arc, and that detail being one of the 3 key definitions of his story's power system.

during the time he was planning the story, during the time he had meetings with the editors, during the probably good amount of time he had, he could have changed it if he simply forgot such a massive detail

a simple mistake that just got printed before it can be corrected during the short amount of time you have to submit a chapter with all the deadlines and whatnot makes a lot of sense than " oda forgot this massive detail in his story"

[kind gate]

Oh so you think he changed it later because ???
He could've seen other opportunities with the special paramecia type or?
or for any other reason?

[night jewel]

I think he just corrected it because he just made a small mistake that went unnoticed in the end

[copper frost]

He corrected it in the volume release, don't think he forgot such a large detail

[night jewel]

although, there being special paramecias might have been something he had in his mind already, considering that we already saw hawkins ( someone who also acts like a "special" paramecia user) during sabaody

but yea, i am just tired of arguing this any further, i will just leave because I dont think this is getting anywhere

[kind gate]

okay

[zinc iris]

also it's not like it's that special

it's that it has two "material traits" when most paramecia usually have one

but considering paramecia is the hufflepuff of DF categories it isn't saying much

[night jewel]

paramecias are just all dfs that arent zoans or logias so yea, its not really special

[zinc iris]

the biggest anomaly is tamago's df

that is almost a zoan but not really, so by definition should be a paramecia but most ancillary sources explicitly mark it as "unclassified"

[kind gate]

how's it a zoan?

[zinc iris]

zoans' entire power is having the ability to transform into an animal, and tamago's df is about transforming into a rooster upon taking damage

[kind gate]

[zinc iris]

so it blurs the line by its power being transforming into a humanoid animal, but with different shapeshifting rules that should exclude it from the zoan category

[kind gate]

[ancient vault]

Thinking back to my "Kaido is born in Ringo" idea. Maybe the page doesnt actually mean that Kaido was born there but rather will die in Ringo

[zinc iris]

what is it

[ancient vault]

#manga-theories message

Since Oden was not only born in the Flower Capital but also died there if im not mistaken

[copper frost]

This the one you told me about the other day?

[ancient vault]

yeah

[zinc iris]

is ringo where tama is from?

[ancient vault]

No why?

[pure raven]

http://forums.arlongpark.net/showthread.php?t=49663

This is one of the best theories I've read.

[ancient vault]

Good im not reading it then

[pure raven]

It's even better than the Red Line destruction theory.

[ancient vault]

What is it about?

Oh does it adress the crosses I once posted here?

[zinc iris]

I'm making dinner, a tldr?

[ancient vault]

Always asking for tldr
put spoiler tag lilahk

[pure raven]

It's so tough to tl;dr this so I'll just do the first bit. ||It links so much together using Oars' (continent puller) clothing cross design and the design above the door Imu walks through to get to the giant straw hat as a starting point, and suggests there were once multiple moon races (one for each of the seven doors that Imu is in front of) in the Oharan sculpture and how these moons were annihilated by the WG to prevent biblically apocalyptic tides. It also suggests Fishman Island, the Red Line (which was created by continent pullers) and the moons were the only safe places from these tides. There's also the assertion that Pluton is Noah and that's how people survived in such rough seas.|| @zinc iris

[zinc iris]

hmm

[pure raven]

That's like the first 1/3

[zinc iris]

I'm unconvinced about noah being pluton because noah is clearly a transport ship made of wood while pluton was a technological battleship with heavy weaponry

[pure raven]

The idea is that the WG left Noah to sink to Fishman Island when the Red Line was finally created and habitable.

[ancient vault]

[pure raven]

It's fully wacky in places but it's really good.

[zinc iris]

but is uranus a spaceship?

[pure raven]

Read the theory

[ancient vault]

Im keen on the Oars part but Im not sure whether I wanna read the rest

[versed hamlet]

the last part of the theory is a big stretch just saying

[zinc iris]

i skimmed a bit

I agree with the idea, that I also proposed once, that the 3 ancient weapons are each from one people and that gives it their name
poseidon is the god of the seas, so it's the ancient weapon of the sea people that are fishmen and mermen
pluton is the god of earth, so it's the ancient weapon of land people like humans
uranus is the god of sky, so it's the ancient weapon of the sky (moon) people

[pure raven]

Did you read the first 90%?

[versed hamlet]

yes i did

[pure raven]

What did you think bro?

[versed hamlet]

makes sense i can believe it, the 7 kings part im not so sure of tho

[ancient vault]

I didnt know this existed

[kind gate]

whats he pulling?

[night jewel]

land

[zinc iris]

must be really strong

[fresh gale]

That rope is extra durable

[pure raven]

The friends we made along the way

[night jewel]

its from OP magazine 3 btw, the other page describes his anatomy i think

[ancient vault]

does he shrink in size over age? or did he have san juans DF?

[night jewel]

the piece of land he is pulling is probably small

he is said to be 67 meters i think

[ancient vault]

yeah the one from thriller bark but if you look at the right picture you see no scars

an island smaller than like 20m is not an island

[night jewel]

he probably had scars because of whatever hogback does to a corpse to make it fit for moria's shadows, so makes sense why he didnt have any back when he was alive

[ancient vault]

Yes, Im saying its oars from a very different time

[night jewel]

vivre cards said that oars is 67m, but OP magazine says 39m... pretty weird

vivre cards are newer so i would probably take that info as canon though

[ancient vault]

67m still isnt really enough to move islands

[night jewel]

it is enough if he is strong enough

height doesnt really mean much there, a small man can lift weights bigger than himself if he is strong enough

[kind gate]

!bounties

[lone hedge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/164971940648321024/627040439953784862/unknown.png?width=800&height=349

[pure raven]

[ancient vault]

u telling me he was swimming?

[night jewel]

yea probably

[polar bison]

SBS I think confirms something way closer to 67m

[fringe tide]

I mean luffy isnt big enough to have the muscles to move buildings with his bare hands but he did so i dont see why orz couldnt move islands

[kind gate]

Does anyone see any more bounty hunter stories potentially coming?

I hope we hear more about bounty hunters in some ones flashback

Last time we got them was in punk hazard, but do we know anything else about the yeti brothers
Why weren't they with baroque works?

[dusky acorn]

Bounty Hunters are very much extras that aren't heavily integrated into the main conflicts and lore of the One Piece world. Bounty hunters are an isolated force entirely, with tough to create unique ideals besides collecting bounty rewards. Come to think of it, there hasn't really been a single hunter with much depth explored besides Zoro, for clear reasons of quitting it and becoming a pirate as a main character. (Unironically the best bounty hunter character expanded upon was a filler movie character.)As for the Yeti brothers, they were self employed and didn't seem to want under anyone for a prolonged amount of time so that's why they weren't in Baroque Works. But yeah, significant bounty hunters certainly don't seem to have a place in what's coming up for the last stretch of the story

[kind gate]

I agree with everything stated
Would just love to see a very strong and ambitious person working as one.
I mean someone of fujis caliber was doing god knows what before the draft

Also wish they explored the other seas in the story a bit more

But that would take too many chapters

also who is garps assistant during the coby training again?

[dusky acorn]

It's Bogard, not much is known about him but he supposedly has a high rank and has been with Garp for a long time

[kind gate]

okay

[dusky acorn]

And yeah, the West and South should be expanded upon more, the latter likely will be due to the amount of significant characters stemming from there

[kind gate]

yh where are kid and bege from?

[dusky acorn]

The only known thing we can really be expanded upon left from the West is Shanks' very early backstory and hometown

Whereas the South has things like Kid, Killer, Kuma, Bonney, Aokiji

[kind gate]

oh then there are plenty opportunities

[clever pecan]

Is it true about shanks being in cp-0

[kind gate]

That's prolly some crackhead theory

[dusky acorn]

No lol, the reason he was able to meet the Gorosei was because of his status as a Yonko

[clever pecan]

i knew it

[clever pecan]

Dont think so

[kind gate]

I think so

He prolly does it alot and is more aware of his status in the world and how to use it

[clever pecan]

Then shouldnt the other yonkos do it as well?

[kind gate]

kaido wants to start war bm's only goal is pk

[dusky acorn]

Sure, Shanks is a pirate, but the Gorosei are also aware that Shanks is someone who is still in the right sane state of mind as seen from his actions at Marineford. I doubt they would allow other Yonko to do this just due to their sheer viciousness compared to him, so yeah

Like, why not take the knowledge of him if it means helping to stabilize the world's balance

Which should supposedly be what Shanks is giving them insight on, if he's to be discussing the danger of a pirate

[amber oar]

Shanks is basically the only great pirate we have seen around moving to dialogue with other powers without hostilities, sure everyone knows he's not going to wreck shit in a whim.

Him being a secret WG agent or something makes no sense given his actions and specially, given what he has done when nobody's looking around

[kind gate]

What would be pushing sensible theories about who shanks went to speak about

[acoustic helm]

shanks cut kid's arm

[amber oar]

This is not how you talk a secret WG agent

[dusky acorn]

I won't be dropping any names, but the two plain evidence I can give you right now about who the pirate is would be:

1. Whatever knowledge Shanks posses about the pirate, it must have been something he only recently learned. He went through the entire two years without meeting them until this very moment, so something spurred the desire to meet.

2. Whoever the pirate is, they're not someone completely on the radar, and have some hidden aspect about them that only Shanks knows about and feels the need to tell them.

The most running theory is Blackbeard, but you can infer the figure with these details as you wish

[amber oar]

Or it's someone that has made waves recently one way or another, and compelled Shanks to talk the Elders. Be Teach, Weevil, a supernova, heck, could even be Luffy, but why Shanks would talk about Luffy.

[sonic lichen]

Could fujitora destroy earth if he called a meteorite big enough?

[dusky acorn]

Yeah, so far Shanks has kept a fair distance from Luffy's current adventure, even going as far as relucting to see his unconscious face at Marineford, since he's not a great pirate yet. I highly doubt he would tamper with Luffy's journey before they meet again to such a degree by telling the Gorosei some extra information about him

Well, are there even meteors around earth that are big enough? Not an astrology guy

Fujitora's gravity should have a certain range to it

[amber oar]

astronomy lol, but the chance one comes close is very slim

even a meteorite the size of a small city would fuck with the atmosphere and kill almost every alive being, but even if the whole moon dropped into the Earth, the Earth could still exist. Completely screwed and burning, but in one piece, that probably would stabilize millions of years later

Actually, the most accepted theory on the moon's formation is that a body the size of Mars impacted the Earth and the ejected material condensed in a new body.

so if by "destroying the earth" you mean convert it into an uninhabitable wasteland, a small asteroid does the job, but if you mean destroying it to the core, it takes basically other Earth

[dusky acorn]

Woops lol, that's how you can tell I'm not well catered to this stuff. But yeah, asteroids being that lethal is news to say the least, though I'm not sure if that's how Oda would want to write Fujitora's power in the story if he ever does reach that city-size.
Even if Fujitora can't reach that size in-story, those smaller meteors would probably mess with the earth if he just kept firing consecutive ones around the same general area. I wouldn't say it's as immediately destructive of a method as the quake fruit though

[ancient vault]

Maybe Kidd?

Its probably BB tho

[brisk mirage]

Fujitora=best navy boy.

Also I still think my theory of Fujitora stopping Onigashima from free falling at the end of this arc is going to come true

[amber oar]

Kid has a shout, indeed. Though a small one

[brisk mirage]

hard to shout when youre busy getting curbstomped again and losing an arm

[ancient vault]

"Shout out to lil bro Kid. I took his arm but hes still a threat. Just like his big bro "

[amber oar]

Then again the impact of an asteroid is a mix of the mass and the speed of the Earth. I talked purely in terms of mass because due to the magic of maths and physics, the speed it falls at a surface level (when they fall naturally and not affected by other forces) is roughly the same regardless of size. But then again, Issho seems to be able to control the speed impact as well, and he's even able to stop masses from falling and levitate them in the air. In fact, in theory the meteorite he used on Doflamingo and Law's meeting should be enough to not just sink the entirety of Dressrosa, but also damaging Punk Hazard and even affecting the Red Line. However he dropped it "slowly" so the impact was relatively smaller.

[kind gate]

Hmmm

Yh I was gonna say Kidd could know something but I wasn’t sure about the time thing

[dusky acorn]

Didn't occur to me how Fujitora's fruit lends itself to making the impact progressively devastating just based on the amount of pull he gives with his gravity. Unfortunately for him yeah, it doesn't seem like the story will lend itself to going too crazy with his fruit, unless he's ever in some extremely isolated place without allies

[kind gate]

Lmao

[brisk mirage]

Or very useful in the OP endgame

[kind gate]

Isn’t the earths mass what gives it its gravity, like the way Einstein described it.
But as larger objects move closer does their gravity just vanish as they enter the earths atmosphere
Also burning up could just be a thing.

[kind gate]

U think Hawkins could be from a weird tribe that practices magic¿

[craggy pumice]

maybe but then Big Mom would want him or she already has someone like him

also Oda once said there is no magic in One Piece

although I would call many things in One Piece magic

[kind gate]

There’s magic no way

[brisk mirage]

its his devil fruit that gives him all his Voodoo-esque abilities

but i think he was raised by the Romani equivalent people in one piece

[sacred hawk]

So wait, would you say Carrot and Wanda are particularly stronger than other minks?

[amber oar]

Pedro said Carrot was particularly talented. Probably just a potential yet to be fulfilled, though

[sacred hawk]

Sure, but Perospero had difficulty dealing with Carrot and Wanda, while Jack was able to take on an entire army of sulongs, and even managed to beat the musketeer and guardian captains.

So if Carrot and Wanda as of now aren't particularly stronger than average, I think that would put Jack above Perospero

[ancient vault]

Prepare yourself for VP to debunk all this "magic"

[grizzled fog]

Jack is undoubtedly above peros, and yea I kinda feel like Wanda and carrot are a tad bit above the rooftop minks for the most part

[amber oar]

She hurt Luffy badly... it was a gag scene, but immediately after that Pedro said she was indeed strong. So it was like half gag, half "yeah beware the bunny"

[sacred hawk]

I just realized. Even if Perospero helps to kill Marco, Queen knows from the reports that Perospero helped Marco get into Onigashima. So that might cause a falling out anyway

[fringe tide]

So how big of an astroid could fujitora actually summon to earth? Could he theoretically summon an astroid big enough to wipe out humanity or is there a limit to how big he can pull

[kind gate]

Didn’t Kaku have immense leaping ability

Wha happened to that

[rotund wedge]

One Piece theory:
You guys know how the Straw Hat grand fleet has around 5600 men. And how Usopp lied about having 8000 men under him. What if in the future, the straw hat grand fleet will have 8000 men and Oda is just foreshadowing.

[dusky acorn]

Well, the number 56 has always been very symbolic to Luffy's character due to his fruit. At the end of the day, the fleet is still his, so while Usopp's old lie can come true in some other way, it wouldn't make sense for it to be the grand fleet's hypothetical increasing number.

[queen arrow]

not relevant since he can fly

[dusky acorn]

I'm not an expert in this, but Jugol already basically said the chance is very small for an asteroid the size to completely obliterate Earth physically wouldn't come close enough for Fujitora to pull

[amber oar]

yeah but @fringe tide asked about wiping out humanity, rather than the planet itself. That's a lot easier, you just need to fuck all over the atmosphere

[dusky acorn]

Ah yeah

Would truly no organisms be able to survive though? Like, along with everything deep in the ocean? That's pretty wild

[kind gate]

Imagine if Fuji just borrows from the moon each time

[dusky acorn]

Gravity is really the weakest out of the 4 fundemental forces and yet Fujitora is still this strong lmao

Electromagnetism is supposed to be second, but Kid hasn't exactly been living up to it yet, if that's what he's supposed to be

[fathom matrix]

Yeah, he hasn't been round long enough to get the gist of things, like I'm sure he's been told about people aren't allowed to study the voind century, but if not, then if someone was studying the it, he would probably go "Ok, well be goodluck" but someone would have to step in and say "Umm, Admiral Fujitora, I know you rank higher, but you're new. We CAN'T let them study it", with him being confused going "oh it's not hurting anyon-" again getting interupted like "No sir, we LEGALLY can't let them study it. I'm not sure why, but we can't allow them to, and if they do and carry on...well (gesture some sign of offing them) and that's not even the worse case scenario"

[manic relic]

Yes Ussopp will have 8000 giants under him after Elbaf arc

[random yacht]

I think the grand fleet will just get 2400 more members

and then it would be cool to have a moment where he says "I have 8000 subordinates" and the whole grand fleet pulls up behind him

[dusky acorn]

The 8000 troops thing could just happen in Wano

Usopp is already collecting gifters and other soldiers are turning left and right

If Usopp is supposed to surpass his "God Usopp" bounty, then wouldn't it fit to do something reminiscent, yet even greater than Dressrosa

Well even besides that, Usopp got an extravagant bounty even for Soge King but there wasn't any rounding up troops happening

[random yacht]

the sogeking bounty was probably his lie that luffy's 30mil bounty was actually for him coming true

as his starting bounty was indeed 30mil

[tepid drum]

Hold up...If Fujitora is strong enough to call down meteors...cant he just squish people casually? Why bother with the meteor?

[kind gate]

I mean maybe distance doesn’t play a role and the gravitational pull it would take wouldn’t be much to attract meteors since they’re just floating around

[hazy wing]

He did that once with zoro

There was a big hole in ground remember then zoro used air blade

[odd lichen]

What's Luffy's dream? Anyone knows from the manga.

[weary cliff]

Something about the one piece or pirate king

What are you talking about

[sand sail]

It's the first thing he attacks with

[wild veldt]

A meteor is also a way for fuji to show off or hurt enemy moral or deal wide range damage without really trying. A set and let go attack

Of course, he does still just use gravity to squish people

But Fuji wants to flex too

[grizzled fog]

It can be pretty terrifying too, doffy did a double take when Fuji called a meteor on them in green too

[errant oxide]

Bro if you could use gravity to throw meteors at people would you just not use it?

[random yacht]

squishing is purely the power of his gravity
calling a meteor is the power of earth's gravity + heat from friction + an object to fracture and cause even more damage in form of a crater

a meteor is obviously stronger than just squishing

[hazy wing]

yeah but squishing takes less time and works when u dont wanna hurt others or make a big hole in ground

[sand sail]

Squishing is how the big hole in the ground is made

[hazy wing]

yeah but it isnt that big... squishing creates hole like a manhole meteor creates a hole for pond

[sand sail]

No, it makes a giant gaping maw of darkness lol

Depending on the intensity of the crushing, of course

[grizzled fog]

Zoro’s hole was super deep in dressrosa, and Fuji only applied gravity on him for like a second

[junior cape]

But at the same time he knew Zoro was super strong, and he was just trying to subdue him

[junior cape]

I feel that if Issho wanted to, he could just force all the blood in a person into their feet, killing them basically instantly

[remote sentinel]

Isn't the first thing issho does is crush the people trying to cheat him in the gambling house?

[junior cape]

I still think the bounties after Wano will be 500Mil+ MINIMUM for everyone involved. Let's think about it a bit, using some history as a guide: The major players in WCI were mostly given bounty bumps, and all they did was CHALLENGE an emperor to a fight; Sanji went up from 177mil to 330mil, Luffy went up from 500mil to 1.5bil, and I imagine Bege's went up too. Now in Wano we're talking about BEATING 2 emperors at once, as well as a bunch of their officers, all of whom have high bounties of their own. Plus, with no journalists to spin a story, and CP0 to accurately report things to the government, Things are gonna get spicy.

Because of all this, Every MAJOR player (captain, first mate, major fighter, etc.) of the allies will receive at least a Billion berry bump. Everyone else will get a 500mil bump minimum just for being there and helping things along.

Plus on the political side, this will topple 3 nations at once, and reinstate one of them.

All these world shaking events at once will absolutely influence bounties

[grizzled fog]

I can’t imagine anyone other than the three main captains on the roof getting a +billion added to their bounty

[junior cape]

Not even Zoro?

[grizzled fog]

No? Captains as a rule get bigger Increases than their subordinates, and a billion is ALOT. Keep in mind the credit is gonna be shared, in wci most of the credit was attributed to luffy, bege got shafted

The maximum I can imagine zoro reaching is about 1.1 bil, but I think 700-900 mil is more reasonable

[keen portal]

with no journalists to spin a story

That was exactly what gave Luffy such a high bounty in WCI because the tamato box explosion was seen as the start of the assassination incident by the SH and thus Luffy was spun as the mastermind of it all

[grizzled fog]

Yea, if wci was more fair luffy would’ve gotten a much smaller increase and bege would’ve shared a significant portion of it

[woeful coral]

if true i guess that would mean chopper gets the biggest bounty jump in the series

[acoustic helm]

If they beat both yonko then their collective bounty will be 6 billion+

[lilac mirage]

I personally think beating the yonkos might be too much, a draw might be fine

[grizzled fog]

?

Wym draw. They can’t draw in this battle lmao. They either win and beat them or die

[lilac mirage]

hmmm, you got a point, but what about the government they are there too, i think they'll interfere,

[junior cape]

Literally if they want to live to see tomorrow they cannot lose

They have no choice in the matter

[errant oxide]

Supernovas: beat Kaido and Big Mom
World government: GIVE THE STRAWHAT PIRATES PET A 500MILLION BOUNTY

yes that makes sense

[lilac mirage]

500 million?

[errant oxide]

^

[lilac mirage]

ok 500 million for ussop and others, right?

[errant oxide]

Maybe

[lilac mirage]

cuz luffy got 1.5 billion

makes sense

[junior cape]

Well by all accounts it looks like Chopper is gonna defeat Queen, who has a billion bounty, soooo..........

[errant oxide]

We don’t know how Kaido and big mom are going to get defeated. I doubt it will be from the 5 on the roof now

[lilac mirage]

i think kid might fight big mom

[errant oxide]

There’s no way chopper can beat Queen

[dry dirge]

Kid's gonna fight Kaido

[tame plover]

this may be a large number but chopper is getting a 500 beli bounty

[lilac mirage]

lol

[dusky acorn]

Kid has no interest in Big Mom, what they're trying to do is split her off from the fight since all 5 care about Kaido more

[tame plover]

i know it sounds fake but i feel like it it jumps the gun like 400 beli

[junior cape]

Who knows, maybe this is the battle Chopper needed to fully awaken his fruit

[cloud solstice]

1k

[junior cape]

All transformations, all the time, no restrictions

[tame plover]

if chopper awakens his df he will get 1k

[lilac mirage]

then luffy and kid (zoro maybe) fight kaido, and other's big mom?

[dusky acorn]

Chopper bounty is a pretty mundane discussion, we all know where that's going to keep going

[lilac mirage]

yea lol

[grizzled fog]

If they split up like that they are doomed to fail, they need all five on kaido

[dusky acorn]

Well presumably their plan should be to send Big Mom far away from the entire conflict or something. Putting her down to the other fighters to deal with her won't be very helpful either

[lilac mirage]

ok, how you see them splitting big mom and kaido?

[dusky acorn]

She'll just demolish our numbers and won't be stalled for long

[dry dirge]

Law

[junior cape]

"Hm yes this animal who is an awakened devil fruit user beat a person valued at 1 billion berries. His bounty shall rise to 1000 berries. That seems appropriate." I get the joke, guys, """"HaHa ChOpPeR lOw BoUnTy Xd LmAo!!!!!1!!"""

[lilac mirage]

hmmm, he throw her down and hygoro holds her there
?

[tame plover]

its not a joke oda always memes with chopper

[junior cape]

That joke is old and tired and has well overstayed its welcome

[grizzled fog]

Isolate her somewhere else, away from the others, by teleporting her or something. But splitting up their own forces isn’t gonna help shit lol

[snow herald]

Why are people thinking it's going to be 3vs1 and 2vs1?
Last chapter they clearly said fighting two yonko is hard so why would they split their 5 man force? Lol

[tame plover]

maybe the WG will not know because the news arent a thing in wano?

[lilac mirage]

.....

[dry dirge]

i hope they have a portrait of caramel handy

[dusky acorn]

Yeah they're certainly not splitting off, they're just going to do one huge 5 man team combo to get Big Mom away and resume their fight with hybrid Kaido

[dry dirge]

shoulda made photocopies

[tame plover]

and think law,kid,luffy fought big mom and kaido

[grizzled fog]

People are mad underestimating the yonko. I’ve seen a load of people say just luffy and zoro can handle kaido

[lilac mirage]

i understand now,

[snow herald]

They are a joke

[junior cape]

CP0 is THERE. They are GOVERNMENT AGENTS, Intelligence gathering is their JOB. If Chopper's bounty after Wano isn't something that actually reflects his strength, then Oda's just taking the piss at that point.

[keen portal]

Yes he can, and there's nothing you can say or do to stop it

[junior cape]

True, but I can be upset about it 😠

[keen portal]

shrug

[dry dirge]

I wonder how the huge sword off Onigashima is gonna play into the story

[junior cape]

falls on big mom and she dies

[tame plover]

chopper is a supporting character

[grizzled fog]

Kid will use it for a major attack hopefully

[dusky acorn]

Hopefully Kid grabs a hold of it and finally uses Repel after 2 years with it at some extreme high speed

[dry dirge]

oooo

[snow herald]

Of course oda is taking the piss. It's the gag. But he also incorporates the gag into plot. People always underestimate the strawhats cos they are nobodies or have low bounties

[grizzled fog]

God I hope kid lops off an arm or impales kaido or smth. I anticipate a major injury with that

[keen portal]

Kidd pulls off an armbar

[pure raven]

Need him to lop off the club arm mid devastating swing

[grizzled fog]

Yes

[dry dirge]

I wonder who will join the Straw Hats after Wano

[grizzled fog]

Or impale him

[dry dirge]

gotta be at least 1

[pure raven]

Even if that happened someone would still say “kid did no damage”

[grizzled fog]

“Zoro’s attack still did more tho”

[junior cape]

Yeah and at this point they have gotten roped into a ton of crazy shit, including toppling MULTIPLE (now ex-) warlords, overthrowing/saving MULTIPLE countries, punching celestial dragons, fighting in wars, fighting off admirals, gathering a world-wide following, etc, etc

Their achievements and associations place them far above 'nobody' status, everyone has heard of them

[dusky acorn]

I can already imagine the doublespread if it were to happen, I hope the sword gets used.
It could fit to be a new factor in the fight too, since there clearly wasn't anything quite like this huge sword in their environment for the first Kaido fight, could be that defining difference

[junior cape]

Anyone who says otherwise is naive

As for how swords will be used in the battle for Onigashima, I think Zoro may figure out how to make the Wado Ichimonji a permanent 'black blade'

And yes giant sword will make a stellar appearance, even if only to get laughed off by Kaido

[dry dirge]

I find it interesting that Luffy never kills his opponenets

[junior cape]

No he just leaves them with crippling medical debt

Like Batman

[dusky acorn]

I think it's the opposite, Wado will be blackened last in Zoro's last fight to achieve his ultimate dream, for Kuina's sake and all that

It's too early to have her sword get that relevance

Especially when it would be sudden in comparison to Enma currently getting all this shine

[junior cape]

Well the way I see it, in this battle against 2 of the most powerful people on the planet, the use of Haki on both sides will be pretty much constant, with high volumes moving at all times. If there were a good place for this to happen, it would most definitely be now. Remember, these are EMPERORS. Just challenging them alone means you're gonna have to surpass yourself a bunch to even stand a chance. Also keep in mind, this wouldn't be the first time Oda has given characters mid-fight powerups (Zoro vs. Mr.1, Luffy vs. Katakuri, Usopp vs. Sugar, Zoro vs. Kaku, Sanji vs. Jabra, etc.). Doing this now, even after """just""" giving him Enma (back in 2019), would not be the strangest thing to do. HOWEVER, if he does refrain from doing so, I will commend him for doing so, as it means he has an even deadlier confrontation planned for that kind of advancement.

Yes, I agree the power scaling would feel a bit jank, but it would be understandable given the odds they're up against.

Plus, it would feel like a major payoff for accrued effort, unlike some powerups in some ahem other series that show up without warning (cough cough ||Star Finger||). Forging a Black Blade through battle is a concept that's been around since Baratie, when Zoro fought Hawkeye, and has only been expanded on and hinted at again and again. We know that it's possible through large amounts of battle, with massive amounts of Haki expenditure, we just don't know how much Haki or how many battles. Zoro pulling it off in this battle would just go to show how far he's come and how much he's grown and progressed in terms of his dream, as it seems only the finest swordsmen in the world (such as "Hawkeye" Mihawk or "God of the blade" Ryuma) can pull it off, as opposed to powerful people who JUST SO HAPPEN to use a sword, like Gol D. Roger (He could imbue it with Haki, but it wan't permanent) or Whitebeard (He could also imbue his pole-arm with haki, but he focused more on his DF powers).

[dusky acorn]

I agree with everything stated, it's merely a matter of which blade should be forecasted to being the one Zoro will turn black. Zoro is not leaving Wano without one, considering the repeated reminders of them throughout this specific arc, and even a potential explanation Zoro was actually given by Hitetsu offscreen on how black blades are achieved. It would have been continued in the second last page of 955, with Zoro continuing the conversation off to learn exactly how it's done, which he couldn't do last time due to being interrupted by Hiyori in his fight with Gyukimaru. The supposed flashback to the process would of course be revealed during this fight as he achieves it in real time. Kuina may have minor relevance in Wano, but it's not something Zoro is aware of, nor has Wado been widely highlighted by other characters. For this arc, Sandai has arguably stood out even more than Wado, due to Hitetsu and the existence of Nidai coinciding with it. But both of these swords are besides the current point, because Enma out of all three blades has by and afar trumped in instrumentality against Kaido in both power and significance, therefore its sole blackening is very viable.

[junior cape]

While I dont disagree with your assessment, I think itll likely be the Wado Ichimonji because while it may not be the strongest of Zoro's blades, it is his most battle-proven. I believe making a BB requires familiarity with your weapon above all else, since you can fight with any sword and use Haki much the same. Sure, Oden used his swords for years and years, but he never made a BB. Zoro has not used any sword longer than the Wado, and it's the one he used to cut steel, so it is HIS best sword for this by familiarity.

Plus, it would make sentimental sense for him to perfect Kuina's blade before any others.

[dusky acorn]

If your theory for which blade will blacken is layered on another theory featuring the fundamental qualifications for it having to do with the congruence between swordsman and blade, then that's a different thing entirely. I don't have an ambitious theory of my own for the qualifications, so I can only argue based solely on how the narrative would befit Enma to continue rising in highlight scenes, only to finally plateau by blackening. If Kuina had at least one in-story namedrop or reminder by Zoro anytime during the latest Wano arc however, I would have likely sided with Wado over Enma for this purpose. On the other side, Wado's relevance against Mihawk specifically shouldn't be underestimated. Back in that fight, Zoro was flashing through all sorts of scenes to Kuina. Mihawk is the main person that reminds him of her, since he holds her dream in his hands. Not to mention, Wado was the only blade that didn't break back then. Those two things being extrapolated into making Wado the significant figure during the final fight with Mihawk again is just too fitting. But yeah, if the dissonance in our opinions stems from the fundamental reasons for why blackening itself occurs, then we won't exactly be able to see eye to eye in this discussion.

[acoustic helm]

Even hyo hasn't blackened his blade in his prime

[nova spindle]

Dragon was a slave, the mark on his face is a brand. He's going to recruit Hancock, and she will accept because he's Luffy s dad

[acoustic helm]

Garp son slave
No

[nova spindle]

Garp doesn't like celestials and nor does dragon

But garp is a marine

[acoustic helm]

Garp never liked them before God valley

[grizzled fog]

I think his son being enslaved would probably make him go beyond disliking them

[acoustic helm]

Its garps moral compass

[nova spindle]

Hmmm

[grizzled fog]

No way on earth would Garp continue to work for them complacently if his son were enslaved, assuming Garp isn’t a massive piece of shit

[nova spindle]

Good points

But garp is a massive piece of shit

[acoustic helm]

Marines will rally behind garp if he goes rogue

[nova spindle]

In a sense

The red mark looks a lot like a slave brand to me

Introduced right after arling as well

[dapper mica]

How the navy can beat Luffy:
Step 1: fire cannon balls at him
Step 2:Luffy does gum gum balloon
Step 3: Cannon ball remotely activated to explode with razor sharp shrapnel just before it hits him
Step 4: Luffy is severely wounded (tho probably won’t die)

[nova spindle]

Precognition

I'd point to the elephant trunk tying feat

[strong violet]

Armament can be used defensively too, not just offensively. Luffys at the level where attacks such as the above being sent by haki-less or weak haki characters would be ignorable

[dapper mica]

No he said at beginning he wanted a 10 person crew, and including him he now has a 10 person crew

[strong violet]

Even needles or swords can't damage Luffy now if they're not using haki against him.

[nova spindle]

100% yamato joins

[dapper mica]

He wouldn’t use CoA for a cannon ball or gum balloon

[nova spindle]

There are ways, like sea prism needles

I meant CoO

He can easily see far enough

[strong violet]

Luffy would detect that the cannon ball would explode into needles. He can see a few seconds in advance now.

[dapper mica]

Oh yeah forgot that

[strong violet]

Potentially a topic that has been discussed before but I was thinking today about how Luffy will fight blackbeard with his 2 (or more) devil fruits.

Blackbeards "dark" fruit can nullify devil fruit powers via physical contact, and his quake-quake fruit can basically cause enormous damage to people through shockwaves/vibrations. Gomu gomu would allow Luffy to withstand shockwaves because rubber can absorb vibrations pretty easily if it wasn't for the fact that BB has the darkness fruit.

With all that said, I think Luffys haki will have to progress to the extent that he doesn't have to touch Blackbeard at all. When they clash, their haki will keep them at least a foot or two apart (similar to WB vs Roger). This would allow him to withstand Blackbeards devil fruit cancellation.

[grizzled fog]

Tbf he said at least 10 people

[dapper mica]

Is seeing the future a passive ability (he is always seeing a bit into the future as long as the conditions for CoO are met) or an activated ability?

[dapper mica]

Yeah but I think Oda will stick with the ridiculously small but powerful crew idea

[grizzled fog]

1 or two more won’t make it large, I think the last one is joining in wano

[dapper mica]

Can Blackbeard do ryou?

[near beacon]

Mihawk is the son of Rayleigh
Shanks is the son of Rock D Xebec
Robin is the daughter of Monkey D Dragon

[strong violet]

No confirmation yet but probably

[dapper mica]

Or in elbaf, though he already has hajrudin (probably didn’t spell that right)

[dapper mica]

Would robin be Luffys sister or half sister?

[grizzled fog]

Uhh a giant crewmate would be a tad oversized for the sunny

[near beacon]

Yeah thats my guess. Nico Olivia had white hair and wanted to fulfill her husbands goal. There is a reason Dragon was after Robin

[dapper mica]

Why? So far it seems like WB was the only emperor that does it, as big mom and kaido don’t seem to understand what Luffy is doing to hurt them

[near beacon]

Also Dragon's age is 53, same as akainu. Robin is 28.

robin is 30 after TS

[dapper mica]

Yeah but is luffys mum nico Olvia or is his mum someone else?

[near beacon]

thats a mystery, no doubt. But oda mentioned that luffys parents are already drawn. I think nico olivia is mother of luffy. Because of Olivia and Dragon, nico robin as a child was dragged into the mess of the World Government. For this reason they left luffy so he can decide his own fate

[dapper mica]

Damn Luffy’s family is hectic from the WG and publics perspective

Mother: theorised to be one of the devils of Ohara
Father: leader of revolution army
Sister: theorised to be surviving devil of Ohara, “devil child”
Brothers: Two brothers-by-oath, one is chief of staff of revolutionary army, other was 2nd division commander of WB’s fleet
Grandfather: navy hero
Other relationships: somehow got Boa Hancock, considered the most beautiful woman in the world, to fall in love with him.

[pastel summit]

you guys realise it's heavily implied Robin's dad died already, right?

it's not directly stated, but Olvia sets out in order to "fulfil her husband's wishes"

[dapper mica]

It’s kind of ironic how Luffy has no interest in Boa and that’s probably why she likes him because she looks down on all the men who go sanji over her

[near beacon]

Look, there is no way we know he died. Second, if there is a mention of fulfilling her husbands wishes then that means that guy is not some nobody. He is definitely connected and in future there should be more details as the wish itself is kind of vague (they already knew about the history of the void century). Dragon is for sure a potential candidate but not confirmed

[pastel summit]

they don't know about the void century, that's what they were researching.

[near beacon]

Well the professor knew about the name of the civilization, and why government was trying to hide it. I agree its not clear how much they knew

[dapper mica]

The real question is if Luffy and Robin are siblings, is Robin aware and just hadn’t told him or not? She knew about Sabo for the whole of the Fishman Island Saga and didn’t even hint at it once

[pastel summit]

he knew about the name, and said it was only a hypothesis. They 100% without a doubt, did not know everything about the void century. for one, a lot of that information is hidden on Laugh Tale, and none of the Oharan scholars ever made it there.

[near beacon]

Yeah, she knew about Sabo; but i think Sabo and others told Robin not to spoil. They want to meet themselves and reveal it

[near beacon]

hmm so the wish of nico oliva's husband could be to get to the truth. But we dont know for a fact.

[dapper mica]

Well maybe dragon wants to meet Luffy and reveal it himself?

[near beacon]

maybe his mom

[dapper mica]

Robin has repeatedly asked Luffy if he has any interest in his father

[pastel summit]

no, but I doubt her father is dragon, no one ever knew, she's not a D, have to explain dragon even being in Ohara, have to explain Olvia being alive if you're saying she's also Luffy's mother. Has a lot of holes.

[near beacon]

True

[pastel summit]

Also, I'm sure Garp would've known if robin was his granddaughter

[dapper mica]

Why would Luffy’s mother have to be alive?

[pastel summit]

?

[dapper mica]

Oh yeah Olvia died before Luffy was born

[pastel summit]

I mean surviving the buster call.

[dapper mica]

Yeah it doesn’t seem that likely anymore

Maybe dragon is robins father but Luffy and Robin must be half siblings of so

[dark palm]

that'd be... strange

[dapper mica]

Yh

[dark palm]

and something we'd probably have learned after the timeskip

[dapper mica]

I guess that theory is duff

[pastel summit]

just seems like if it were true, it'd be weird for it to be held-back knowledge

[dapper mica]

Dam I really want to see Oda’s plan, I don’t really care if the manga is drawn or not I just want to know the story

[dapper mica]

Well Sabo being alive was held back

[pastel summit]

and yeah, we don't know how the "D" is passed down, but if he was her father, you have to explain why she is not Nico D Robin. Garp having no idea is just the biggest thing. He is obviously aware of Dragon's activities, literally 0 reason why he didn't say anything at Water 7.

[dark palm]

sabo had amnesia though

[pastel summit]

sabo being alive wasn't really held back, but sure. that was purely for it to be an emotional moment. It's not some emotional reveal if robin was dragon's daughter.

[dark palm]

yeah it's just like "wtf"

[pseudo pewter]

This or next week Gear 5?😂😂

[fathom matrix]

yaknow how pleasures can't stop smiling?

And the D clan's all about smiling, but people have pointed out, that if you turn the D around, it looks like a smile?

[exotic echo]

i don't know if I like where this is going

[fathom matrix]

What if something similar happened to them back in the void century, where the D clan couldn't stop smiling, and the reason why Joyboy's called 'Joyboy', is because he couldn't stop smiling?

Either that, or he kept bringing happiness and joy to people, so that was a nickname

[pseudo pewter]

Tbh i think that the D has another explanation, yeah the smilie, the will and something which we don't know...

[fathom matrix]

probably dawn

cause the word "dawn" is references a LOT

[dapper mica]

It might be an avatar-esque thing where there was the first D, probably in the void century or maybe before, and when he died his will was passed on to his decendants

[pseudo pewter]

I think it is Devil from Devil fruit, all the People who lived in the void century are now devilfruits or something like that hahahaha

[fathom matrix]

bit iffy on devils

[dapper mica]

Or maybe it’s like ofa from mha where the will of D is passed on and accumulated

[fathom matrix]

maybe they were called "devil fruits" because the way they made was considered "devillish"

[pseudo pewter]

Maybe The Worlgoverment give them the D

[dapper mica]

Did you miss the d in world government on purpose?

[pseudo pewter]

So they could know how has the will from the void century

[dapper mica]

Pun intended? Or no?

[pseudo pewter]

I think they give them the D intended

But idk I'm bad in English sorry

Hahaha I'm from germany

[feral pike]

any apoiler for 1009?

[errant oxide]

#spoilers

[feral pike]

ohhh its late here thanks! just read the incomplete spoiler

[keen portal]

dont. and not in this channel

[dark palm]

Post it in #spoilers if you have it

[ancient vault]

[covert hazel]

Man hoarding spoilers?

[pseudo pewter]

There is no spoilers today I thought...

[feral pike]

blackbeard appearance 😆

[pure raven]

[celest olive]

Translation

[keen portal]

porque no hablas espanol

[copper frost]

Translation: random bullshit in caps

[celest olive]

Lmao

[night jewel]

@pure raven 1- stop using caps, only going to tell you once now.
2- speak in english.

[ancient vault]

[pure raven]

sorry bro am trying to speak it the language of my friend not for you

[celest olive]

[night jewel]

well bro, this is a public one piece server, so you will have to follow the rules here, if you are talking to a friend, go dm him, dont post it here

[pure raven]

k chill bro

[night jewel]

I am completely chill.

[pure raven]

its just a language bro

[ancient vault]

[hidden tinsel]

anyone have any theories on Luffy's gear forms

[pure raven]

Yes.

[lofty oak]

Do you guys think it's still too early in the series for luffy and co to beat kaido or BM? Any good theories on how this war will end? Personally I only see them winning if BM leaves with the red poneglyph and just ditches Kaido

[marsh warren]

One Piece has more than 1000 chapters now and people think its 'too early'

i can see BM ditching Kaido, betrayal was emphasized

but its time for the Supernovas to step up, push their limits and defeat the Yonkou

[tacit veldt]

It isn't "too early", it's not at all, but i really can't see the alliance winning as things are right now. Sure Luffy's crew can (and will) defeat Kaido's crew, that's going to be huge, but the roof situation seems hopeless atm. My best bet is BM actively betrays Kaido (she is a betrayer and betrayal is a big theme in the arc), maybe even hurts him in some way

[acoustic helm]

For wano I thought last year,
King vs zoro
Queen vs sanji
Jack vs luffy later jimbe takes his place
Koido vs scabbards and later kidd ,law luffy
big mom vs Marco
No bm pirate climbed waterfall

[tacit veldt]

As far as additional help that was set up, everyone has already come to fight, and those still missing (Hiyori, mainly) aren't likely going to turn the tide of the battle

[lofty oak]

Oda did mention there still is a lurking legend in Wano, right?

[acoustic helm]

Wasn't that oden

[lofty oak]

Could be, I'm not sure.

[tacit veldt]

Honestly, my best bet is:

• The alliance downstairs takes over Kaido's crew
• BM ditches Kaido
• Kaido stands alone and is slowly taken down a la Newgate, with wave after wave of enemies straining his endurance. I would love if the last fight where he's finally defeated was between him and the entire Strawhat crew, as a parallel to both Oars and the way WB went down at last

[lofty oak]

I do think it's too early for Luffy to 1v1 Kaido though

[keen portal]

What happens to Big Mom then? Does she just slink back to WCI?

Does she stop being an antagonist for the SH? Does she give up on road poneglyphs?

[tacit veldt]

She might get taken down at Erbaf. She does have ties to that

[lofty oak]

Maybe someone will plot something with Perospero to give them the red poneglyph in order for them to leave

[dusty galleon]

The last point I really am hoping for, but unfortunately I can't see anything making BM leave

[keen portal]

She has ties to Elbaf yes but dragging Big Mom along for a third arc where she's a villain will be incredibly stale and devalue her as a villain.

[dusty galleon]

And this too

[lofty oak]

Guess we have to think of anything BM wants more than to have revenge on Luffy

[keen portal]

She'll be like smoker but a yonko smoker. Always chasing SH

[tacit veldt]

BM has a plan through all of this, 100%. That scene where she tells Perospero to trust her wasn't just about "trust in this alliance with Kaido", i'm sure

[dusty galleon]

Personally, I am already almost too tired of BM, she's been around as villain for close to 200 chapters straight now, and that's making me grow really weary

[mental tundra]

More actually

Since fishman island

[tacit veldt]

But no one has even touched Big Mom so far, Kaido took every single attack

[dusty galleon]

I am considering as a frontline villain, not some far off threat

[tacit veldt]

They'd have to do it all over again since it's quite clear that ultimately Kaido will go down by attrition

[lofty oak]

Perhaps black beard will attack whole cake island (for the red poneglyph) which will make big mom return?

[dusty galleon]

If there was another yonko fall arc, it would have to be a minimum 40-50 chapters more so a cumulative frontline villain time of 250-300 chapters would be waaay too much

[pastel summit]

not even smoker is this persistent. I wish he was.

[dusty galleon]

So I am really hoping she goes down in Wano

[tacit veldt]

What i'd love is for the SHs together to fight both Kaido and BM in the end

[dusty galleon]

Especially since its 250 chapters straight

[tacit veldt]

If BM starts taking hits in the next 5 or so chapters, i'll start believing she can be taken down right here and now

[mental tundra]

Im guessing kaido will kill big mom

[hidden tinsel]

maybe the supernovas will get defeated along with Luffy, then fight again later with Luffy's awakened devil fruit?

[pure raven]

i think luffy get his awakening after wano in the last arc, he'll get g5 in wano

[celest olive]

I agree

[pseudo pewter]

Last Chapter Zoro says to Luffy "do something to help ua beat them" something like that, I think that Luffy will use in the next chapters Gear 5 or something like that

[celest olive]

I think he should beat kaido with no new random power up

[pure raven]

he'll get g5 in the end of the 4 act

[celest olive]

Because we just kinda did that in wci

[pure raven]

yea i dont think hell get a random new power, it kinda will be the last chance i guess

[pseudo pewter]

Nah bro he will use it 2 times one in act 3 and he need after that a break and the other in act 4

[celest olive]

I can see if he awakened but a whole new form would be to random

[pure raven]

is the awakening not stronger then a new form?

[pseudo pewter]

And we need conquerors haki I mean we are waiting like 10 years to see the real power

[celest olive]

Mmm i think it would depend on the extent of the awakening

[pseudo pewter]

I think the awakening will give Luffy more speed

[celest olive]

Like if he could mold himself like katakuri and rubberize anything id say thats stronger than a new form

Id make his normal form stronger

Yea but what else would the awakening be

[pseudo pewter]

Maybe he can make his enemies for 10sec to rubber

[celest olive]

That would be a buff tho

[pseudo pewter]

Or swords...

Yeah

[celest olive]

So to mold himself like katakuri

I think he should be able to turn things into rubber and mold himself

Because it would so sick to see him bouncing around like a pinball

[hidden tinsel]

i can see Luffy using a technique like pinball or something bouncing off of things

[celest olive]

Yea that would sick

[polar bison]

kanjurou said he was a dead man walking, and orochi is trying to burn down a castle that he himself is inside, so it’s like yeah probably I think they’re onboard with that too

[amber oar]

Oda is connecting hard Kanjuro and Orochi's fates

First he faked their deaths in the same chapter, then revealed them alive in the same chapter. If they're dying for real, 100% they're dying in the same chapter, together or in parallel

A closure for the Kurozumi clan

Damn, their (non-)death was perfect. Why, Oda

[zinc iris]

If anything the conflict is never ending because everyone is always out for revenge, those two are burning Wano to the ground because they are seeking revenge themselves for being hunted by Wano people for something an ancestor did

[silent valley]

weird

[solar glade]

do you guys think orochi will die again?

[lyric dust]

ehhh maybe

[pure raven]

Yes as will kanjuro according to him

[lyric dust]

kanjuros a filthy liar

[pure raven]

A dying filthy liar

[night glacier]

Things aren’t looking too hot for the scabbards

I’m really hoping that the act 3 tragedy isn’t them dying one by one as I’ve read

[keen jacinth]

no theories needed, chopper will kill both kaido and bm there is no conflicts about that

[night glacier]

😳

[fringe tide]

We are all thinking that act 3 tragedy is an alliance member dying what if oda instead makes it bm betraying kaido and leaving him severely injured enough so for the current members to defeat/kill him

Or would that not work and only the protagonist side has to go through a tragedy at the end of act 3

[pure raven]

There doesn’t have to be an act 3 tragedy

Feel like at this point if act 3 ends it’ll be with the raid ending leaving 4th for post wano festivities

[junior cape]

The aftermath of Wano will shake the world like nothing else. Remember what happened when Whitebeard died? Now imagine that happening with TWO emperors.

[pulsar lotus]

true

[junior cape]

Rocks, the Paramount War, the death of Gol D. Roger, they will pale in comparison

[dusty galleon]

They will pale in comparison

But yeah, should have very similar, maybe a little more impact

[junior cape]

I dunno man having half of the new world become a lawless wasteland is gonna be pretty impactful

Sakazuki knows about SWORD

He may be their leader or founder

Chapter 592, he's shirtless with Kizaru doing bonsai trimming, and he has a small tattoo of a sword on his right arm

Seems kind of odd for a man who is made of MAGMA

Unless he's a member of a secret military group on top of being fleet admiral.

[queen arrow]

it's doubtful that he created or that he's a part of it, since it seems to have existed since the times Sengoku was only an admiral, seeing that he and Corazon had a similar thing going on

i'd say he knows about Sword because he's the Fleet Admiral and not because of something unrelated

[dusky acorn]

Well SWORD still hails from "Marine HQ" as Drake's reveal box says. Akainu would be a pretty bad Fleet Admiral not to be aware of its existence, so he must know about it. Even if Sengoku was the one to create it, that would have been knowledge passed down to Akainu too.
The only way it wouldn't is if Sengoku and other marines part of it were afraid of telling him in case of Akainu's extreme ideals going so far as to want to relinquish SWORD as a system, since part of the nature has to do with associating with pirates, like Drake is. I find this unlikely though

[zinc iris]

I'm pretty sure the existence of SWORD is official

but is more dubious about how open is the knowledge of its members

that is, know who is in it

[sacred hawk]

Also, why do people say sword is a counterforce to CP0? From what we've seen, sword is just an initiative to place marine officers into the inner circle of powerful pirate crews

[junior cape]

Akainu has no problems with working with pirates, as long as they bring down other pirates in the process (see: Squardo)

[queen arrow]

mainly X Drake's comment about CP-0 in Wano

[queen arrow]

yeah, he's even okay with the 7 Warlords of the Sea

[sacred hawk]

Eh, being surprised about CP0 being there doesn't mean they were specifically opposing CP0. It just means CP0's agenda is classified

[junior cape]

they are celestial dragon dogs after all

[sand sail]

Akainu didn't want to do it, Sengoku made him

I believe he even tells Squard he'd rather kill every pirate there instead

[kind gate]

What’s with Akainus pirate hate lol

[junior cape]

Who knows, all we know is that he hates them and has always hated them

[light cobalt]

i think its less pirate hate but more of a justice boner/criminal hate thing

[safe harness]

I'm waiting on his backstory cause he for sure had daddy issues

[kind gate]

Lmao they prolly killed his parents or something
And maybe he’s been living with the gorosei ever since

[clever pebble]

lol

I guess CP9 is Dark Justice
for Akainu is Absolute Justice
storytelling standpoint

[peak ingot]

after this arc we wouldve had 9 out of the 11 supernovas take central stage so what will the other two do??

I think both will be linked with elbaf

[dense wing]

Bonney will be linked to the Sabo/Alabasta aftermath, and has a past with Kuma, so I doubt she's taking center stage until we have a plotline with the Revos.

As for Urouge, I'm not exactly sure where Oda wants to put him, but we'll see. We had no clue about Bege before Zou after all. When Urouge comes in it'll make sense

[weary cliff]

Urouge possible titanic captain

[dusky acorn]

Blackbeard certainly seems like Urouge's best window to tie into the story. I will admit though, trying to give him a history and grudge with Enel AS the reason for joining Blackbeard for more power was potentially a bit too ambitious by me. The main reason I did it however, is because most Worst Generation members we've known who joined Emperor crews have all had deeper reasons for their actions.

Drake joined Kaido to infiltrate as part of SWORD, Bege joined Big Mom to betray someday, Hawkins joined beyond his choice as his cards told him to, and likely plans to betray soon since he doesn't actually want to be there. And then there's Apoo, the one person who joined out of his own volition for wanting to have an easy life by riding the right horse,. That's why I wouldn't want Urouge's reasoning to be as simple as a repeat of that again.

Although yes, on the surface it does seem like something Urouge would want to do.. given his hobbies of drinking and lovemaking, paired with what rampantly goes on in the pirate's paradise, Beehive Island.

But like, Urouge called Bb the key is the main thing, which there has to be some deeper reason to it, if it was stated in prospect of joining his crew. He obviously wasn't saying it as "This guy is the key to living the sweet life, or allowing my hobbies to thrive even more." Like, that's just dumb lol.
There has to be some deeper reason to the quote I'd say, and an Enel grudge just happens to be a great figure to look as far as sky people are concerned..

[ionic peak]

his arm broken for real ?

[junior cape]

yup

he done

[grizzled fog]

Broken is an understatement

[copper frost]

His hand is gone

[ionic peak]

rip diamond jozu

[keen portal]

jozu not so jozu

[grizzled fog]

He’s still alive

not for long cuz Burgess gonna take his fruit tho

[covert hazel]

Nooo I love Jozu

[clever pebble]

damn really

oh jozu lost an arm

did not remember that

blackbeard truly whitebeard worst ebemy

[ionic peak]

what chapter bruh

[grizzled fog]

“Gonna” meaning future tense

[ionic peak]

yeah not askin that, umm is blackbeard or burgezz ever mention he was "gonna" do that?

[grizzled fog]

No, just trust me

[ionic peak]

[solar glade]

if orochi were to die for good i think yamato will kill him

[ionic peak]

those marine alongself with kizaru and akainu are WG's slave dog, lower than slave itself covered in good marine suit, their real identity is a blood thirsty doggos who just want to murder, well they can start to help treating each other while the pirates escapes, oh also they can also back up sengoku to blackbeard attack , but, they know blackbeard is stonk enemies which them cannot defeat, lowest idiot blood thirsty always lookin for small prey easy kill anyway

thamks oda for making such a characters that i can hates much

[ionic peak]

maybe this was how sengoku retired - or fired bcoz opposing WG decision

[dark palm]

was definitely part of it

he had already done a similar thing to Ohara, probably became jaded over time

[ionic peak]

ah yess ohara

he shot the ship which brought only villager , he thirst for blo0d thats why WG makes him the next admiral fleet, aokiji neglect it, they fought, but WG is on BLOODTHIRSTY side, since WG also blood thirsty , they kick aokiji
what bou tthis theory lol

[prime hatch]

how did i never realise burgess getting jozus fruit, thats like perfect fit

[dapper mica]

Those with the initial D are decendants of the royal family of the fallen kingdom and the will of D is their ancestral memories of what the WG did to them which is why they are known as the enemies of the Gods and often disrupt the order that the WG created

[zinc iris]

so you mean
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PsychoForHire

[dark palm]

God every TV Tropes article reads so insufferably

But the real example of that trope is Lucci, normal VA dudes don’t seem to be in it just to kill

[copper frost]

TVTropes is a cancer I hope we get rid of, it doesn't add anything conducive to how we perceive storytelling

[dark palm]

It’s useful for writers I’ll give it that

[zinc iris]

tvtropes is based

based on literary devices

[dapper mica]

Kaido uses awakened zoan form just as he’s about to be beaten?

Kaidos fruit awakened would be epic

[zinc iris]

I can see that as his final form

[dapper mica]

Monster point but base form is already a monster

[dark palm]

Wonder if awakening actually had a form

Those impel down guards looked mighty strange

[zinc iris]

it looked like hybrid but bigger and more savage

[dapper mica]

The ancient kingdom is on raftel/laugh tale

[median slate]

what if Imu is Rocks

[worthy hedge]

Hey who do you think the next BIG marine war is going to be for ??

[cyan berry]

against the world government

[worthy hedge]

i think is going to be like marineford

[dapper mica]

Maybe Sabo was actually captured and Luffy will go to rescue him, but this time he succeeds

[zinc iris]

it still seems too much of a rehash of saving ace

there's no going back, only forward

[dapper mica]

Usopp’s ultimate rubber band of doom: Luffy holds onto his feet to turn himself into a rubber band and Usopp shoots him

[zinc iris]

it's one of those ideas that easily fall apart thinking about its implications
like that after the god valley incident the gorosei just let rocks walk in mj and rule over the world

[solar steppe]

rocks became wandering evil and blackbeard is his vessel , since he have 2 df, one for teach and one for rocks

[plush coral]

What do you think of the connection between laugh tale and smile? Maybe there's more to the fruit than just the laughing side effect. There's a lot of pleasures out there, that probably will support their retaliators after all this.

[worthy hedge]

i would like the marines to capture luffy and every one comes to save luffy and you have a flashback memory for every strawhat with luffy
and just at the point that they almost kill luffy just like Loguetown he says I am sorry i am dead and at that point zoro and sanji junps on the gourdes and save him

i dont think is going to happen but i would like it allot

[worthy hedge]

for me there is a possibility that rocks survived the god valley at a rly bad shape and he tool baby black beard and made him his next successor or something like that

[fringe tide]

Has kaido hit luffy with a physical attack yet? Ik luffy tanked a fire blast but i don’t remember if kaido actually landed a direct hit on the roof

[sand sail]

The first thing he hits him with is a Thunder Bagua

[fringe tide]

I thought luffy dodged that? That was after luffy nailed him with g3 right?

[surreal vector]

no, he almost dodged that, i pass you the panel rnow

well dont know why i dont have the option to send files in this ds channel

[kind gate]

images?

[sand sail]

!pics

[lone hedge]

Get a role (pirate/revo/marine/civilian) in #old-role-info to be able to post pictures!

[surreal vector]

thanks

[pure raven]

I have a theory, Kuina didnt die

like cmon, if she was to die she would've had a better death than just the stairs, I think she'll appear sooner or later in the series

[kind gate]

This channel is for serious theories only
Please take this to #memes

[copper frost]

First attack from Kaido after being hit by Luffy with the Red Roc

[dapper mica]

Tashigi or related to tashigi?

[pure raven]

no I mean literally Kuina

[onyx light]

Why I think the mysterious figure that helped the scabbards was toki:
As we know, toki can't go back in time, and it'd ruin her character if she went forward and stayed there. However, we know spirits exist and can alter physical things (such as the merry fixing herself in skypia). Hence why it would make sense for toki to be able to help them. This would also mean oden is a spirit too, and with mononoskes voice of all things, he could possibly hear oden, token, etc at the end of wano and learn some secrets

[zinc iris]

I think it was relevant that she just died by chance

[clever pebble]

why Momo can give Zou an order, but not Luffy btw ?

[zinc iris]

we don't really know, it seems Momo's lineage is from people that have authority over Zunesha so he obeys to them while ignores other people even if they can hear him using the voice of all things

[clever pebble]

sounds about right

[onyx light]

Isn't the voice of all things better for wano people?

[zinc iris]

considering that zunesha also refused to talk to roger and oden himself, it might come from Toki's side of the family

[onyx light]

Roger also had it but he still needed oden

[zinc iris]

that was to read the poneglyph because with voat roger gould only glean, and oden instead knew the full language because his family crafted the poneglyphs to begin with
voat allowed them to understand the sea kings, and then allowed them to perceive zunesha, but zunesha ignored both

for the poneglyph part roger needed oden the same way luffy needs robin

[worthy hedge]

I think that zoun talked to momo and luffy because he was getting blast from jack and he had to do something

[lilac mirage]

i heard some one saying that she now is choco

[worthy hedge]

and just like nothing happened when Roger and Oden while they where on Zoun he would not talk to luffy and momo if the same thing happened

[zinc iris]

Luffy could hear him too, but zunesha was only addressing Momo and ignored any question from luffy

[worthy hedge]

yes u right

[pure raven]

My theory on how Sanji can use Diable Jambe
The anti-superhuman drug only affected Sanji, however all it did was suppress his superhuman abilities until he became an adult or some shit. You know how the rest of his siblings has shit like Dengeki Blue and Poison Pink? Maybe Sanji's ability let him control fire and he somehow used his unknown ability to make Diable Jambe.

[kind gate]

I thought this was a shitpost but its decent I guess

[keen portal]

Didn't sanji himself already explain this via using friction?

[lyric dust]

do you think falling down a flight of stairs isn't fatal?

[worthy hedge]

hey i have a theory for BB i dont know if any body else has done it but

what if Moria took Xebecs shadow and transfered it too Black beard and that is why he is not sleeping because if he sleeps he know that Xebec is going to take over his body and that exaplains why luffy called him they and why he has such an obsession with Rocks

[lyric dust]

moria would've been 10 at rocks' downfall, so yeah that doesn't seem too likely

also, is moria able to insert a shadow into a living being? or can he only do it to corpses

[wild veldt]

He can put shadows in the living

Anyone can, tho anyone aside from moria can only hold the shadows for a time limit

Shadows can stay in the dead

[lyric dust]

oh yeah, nightmare luffy

[wild veldt]

But shadows can not stay in the living