manga-theories

[willow falcon]

Something from here should tie to fishman island as it's already been predicted it will be destroyed

But he is calling her mosa 😞 so may not be
Idk

[zenith river]

Do you think the panel showing Scopper thinking "It really is a 'white form' means whatever they found on Laugh Tale specifically mentions 'white form' in some way? Or just a vague confirmation of what he saw in a wanted poster?

Because that might give us more context as to what they found at Laugh Tale. I know a lot of people figure it's probably something like the mural, ergo the Roger crew choosing baddies over saving the world memes; but I believe that could be more info on what exactly it said.

[cosmic ermine]

He probably read about it or was told about it from Saul in some book in the giant library there, or its written on a poneglyph they found on their adventure

[zenith river]

Hmmm. And I guess there's also the flashback with Shanks, he might've said something, too. Nevermind, I'm chasing nonsense

[cosmic ermine]

Vegapunk even mentioned when he saw Luffy fighting Lucci on egghead that "Is that the warrior in white from Elbaph legend?" (or something smilar i forgot 💀 ) and he said he read all the Ohara books

So safe to assume its just written down somewhere and Scopper has/had access to that info

[zenith river]

That makes sense

[austere latch]

Someone on reddit pointed out that Roger had joked about Shirahoshi being a hairy daughter to Neptune. So the Mosa part checks out too 👀

[zenith river]

Can I ask what the agreed upon meaning of 'Mosa' is? A quick google gives me conflicting results in various languages; from African origin meaning "God's Grace, Kindness and Mercy" (fitting for the friend of a god, but origin is confusing), to "derived from water" (giving credence to Shirahoshi or another fish-man), and even 'theft' and 'trick' or 'trap'. It's such a range, is there a popular theory on this?

[mossy summit]

Isn’t it another variation of Moses?

[pulsar wren]

Maybe it still is! I can't send pics yet, but the name Mosa in Arabic means "drawn out of water" or "saved from drowning."

I can't say it means it DEFINITELY is shirahoshi, but considering she can't drown and its the fish man dream to live harmoniously in and out of the water... it would be so cute if Loki and Shirahoshi are friends and that he is talking to her in that scene.

[austere latch]

What i heard is that it’s a Japanese term for “shaggy” (as in, shaggy hair)

Imo Loki was calling the person Mosa only because the denden mushi had a long and shaggy beard. He doesn’t know what the person on the call with him looks like

[jade holly]

Kinda off topic, but do we have a theory on why Blackbeard went to Drum Island?

[quaint haven]

So what are peoples thoughts on what the revolutionary army is actually doing?

They don't appear to be after the one piece so it begs the question of how much do they actually know about the world.

An what they actually plan on doing within the story other than act as additional support to luffy

[jade holly]

They, at the very least, know about the God's Knights and about a few details of the void century. They seem to want to usurp the WG some way or another, historically focusing on convincing kingdoms to revolt against the WG.

[quaint haven]

Yeah that's the basics we know

My point Is what are theh actually bringing to the table for the final battle so to speak. Ud expect them to be after the one piece or ancient weapons but it doesn't seem that way atall

I mean look at it this way, if they had knowledge they would be after the one piece/ancient weapons. They would know of joyboy ect and the prophecies. They just don't seem to be in that loop

[jade holly]

My theory is that their skirmish in Mary Geiose was multifaceted, it was a mission to rescue Kuma, but I think they were also testing the defense of Mary Geiose and seeing what will trigger the God's Knights to deploy, hence why Dragon wasn't there. I'm not too sure what they bring to the table, I assume Dragon came up with the idea to rebel after God Valley, and then initiated the RA after OHara, so I'm guessing the entire purpose of the RA is to usurp the WG completely.

I think the reason why they haven't done too much is because they lack a lot of resources, and weren't able to do more than small skirmishes and political action, but that's changed with Sabo in the lead and the RA gaining popularity.

[loud nimbus]

Didn’t the den den mushi was a specialized winter resistant type? I’d assume the hair was due to that. And not the actual appearance of the person on the other end of the call.

[hybrid python]

you guys think mihawk gave zoro the circly eye? but he needs to cultivate it? so thats why its closed?

was this theory theorized before?

prolly im just like there must be a reason for why zoro's eye is closed

for a swordsmen an eye is too important to just lose outside of panels and not talked about since

[jade holly]

Idk, I think there is something with the eye, but what would a "cultivated" eye even do? We don't even know how the eyes help Mihawk.

[austere latch]

That’s exactly what I’m referring to

[hybrid python]

yeah prolly a way to fight imu or some

[pure raven]

I just watched a youtube short

It theorized that koala in the revolutionary army might be gunko and that she is spying on dragon

[cinder basin]

Well, it sure sounds like a theory you'd get on YouTube shorts

we already know Koala's origin for joining the RA, she is the literal least suspicious RA member

[pure raven]

I forgot ..

[pure raven]

It sucks now that im hearing that

Damn

[hybrid python]

why is she the least?

forgot that detail it seems

[cinder basin]

Because we've seen her origin for joining the RA. She was saved from slavery by Fisher Tigers crew and watched the marines kill him, which is what inspired her to join the RA

[hybrid python]

Thx bro

Ohhhh shit she’s that little girl. The one that kept smiling all the time?

[solemn sable]

The World of One Piece stands above (Either literally or metaphorically) a metaphysical world (Which I will call as “Abyss” for this case). Godlike entities inhabit this enigmatic realm, neither warriors nor destroyers, but more like natural phenomena.

To put it in a simpler way, it could be seen as a mix between the Nether of Minecraft and the Astral World of Berserk, a realm/world/dimension apart from the existing one but connected under different forms which can be used for several purposes, one of them could be used as a method of long distance transportation (as in Minecraft where the Nether dimension is used for fast travel because one block there is equivalent to eight blocks in the Overworld). Such a world would be sustained by the collective unconscious will of all beings that can wish or desire. Man demands for freedom, and the abyss listens.

The Devil's Fruits may come from this place, in the form of “drops” that seep from the Abyss into the physical world, either because of some kind of “overflow” in the flow of ideas in the Abyss, or because a third party interferes in the process.

If so, the physical world of One Piece may also be alive to some degree, since the Ocean, being mother nature according to Vegapunk, denies Devil Fruit users and leaves them unable to swim as punishment.

Please don't take it too seriously, even I don't believe it. 🗿

[cinder oriole]

I know it’s random and unlikely but could Kingdew and Avalo Pizarro be related?

They’re both commanders in a yonko fleet and have nearly identical gauntlets.

Although Avalo was born in the North Blue and Kingdew was born in the Grand Line, I wouldn’t put it past a man literally called the Corrupt King to have multiple children with different women and send some away.

[cyan scarab]

what about the Light coming from Ennies Lobby? We still need to find out if the same thing happened to Lulusia.

[gritty kite]

I also immediately thought of Minecraft’s nether traveling at first. But the chapter quickly discredited the idea with Sommers being clearly instantly teleported and not transversing any distance trough any other dimension or plane.

[solemn sable]

And I did think about that, but ironically, even with the not-so-correct analogy I made, in Minecraft there is a better analogy...

The Void, although it is never directly stated in the original game, in the canonical spin-offs and developer interviews, it is strongly implied that the ender-related thing uses an extra dimension or realm to be able to teleport (This extra dimension is often called "Void" by theorists). In the base game when you use an ender pearl to transport yourself it seems to be instantaneous, but the player (within the story) would be using that extra dimension to transport themselves. The same would happen with the portals to the Nether since, although you have to go through the Nether and it is more than noticeable, technically you are traveling through the Void to get to the Nether, and the journey through the Void is practically imperceptible.

Here, with my theory, it is something similar. The Abyss exists and is navigable, but it is imperceptible as it is a realm that connects with others, unless one purposely travels to the Abyss as a final destination.

[cyan scarab]

Maybe Laughtale is inside the Abyss?

[solemn sable]

Nah, although I do have another idea that stretches my nonsense theory even further.

As I said before, there could be godlike beings within this Abyss, so I don't think Mary Geoise's National Treasure is something related to those entities, perhaps some sort of Transmutation-type process .

Imu, while possessing clear Devil Fruit powers, also has esoteric abilities that don't quite fit with the powers of a Devil Fruit in general, such as apparently granting immortality to the Five Elders and communicating with them through a kind of telepathy (Or even having the same esoteric powers as the Five Elders but to a greater degree).

I don't want to think (and obviously it would be something that even I don't believe would actually happen in the manga) that Doflamingo's plan was the same as Imu did nearly a millennium ago, finishing with the then user of the Ope Ope no Mi in order to obtain immortality and endure the effects of that process, thus reaching a state similar to those cryptid entities of the Abyss, allowing him to rule almost the entire world.

[nimble fox]

What about Blueno's fruit? And perhaps the mirror realm

[tidal whale]

Is there any new theory, about that there is no new devil fruits ?

[iron thistle]

IMU using lili body has been talked for a while. Yes it does makes sense.
I think lili may been the original forest deity. I discussed it in manga chat..IMU somehow got forest deity powers from lili. So taking away her body may be one way it be possible. I will leave the SSs

Sorry I was taggin ya. Missed to tag while posting up there ^

[vernal lance]

Did Shanks sacrifice his arm to get rid of him?
Finally we realized that they can also be summoned involuntarily and after the shanks Luffy found the chosen one, he sacrificed his arm where it used to be so that he couldn't be summoned?!?
Maybe that was the moment when he got the bounty for the first time and his betrayal was noticed or suspected

[twilit mauve]

Hmm, that could be the case, but Shamrock said that he didn't like Mary Geoise and went back to the pirate world, so he didn't join the Holy Knights."

or could have left holy knight's

[silk dock]

How do you feel about Luffy vs Imu? I still see Dragon as the worthy opponent of Imu, not Luffy.

Basically I’m just saying right now Luffy needs more reason to fight Imu directly. He has to directly opposes the idea of WG like dragon does.

There has been a lot of build up like Robin, Sabaody Incident, & Vegapunk. Luffy knows WG is evil & scummy but never really opposes them directly head-to-head like Dragon does. right now he “just” cares about his friends who got opressed.

I think there needs to be a buildup between “Pirate King” goal and “Free the world from WG” goal that Dragon has.

Maybe there will be dragon teaches luffy moment about how evil WG is, so luffy will have more reason to fight Imu.

[silk dock]

actually now Dragon & Luffy have the same goal in liberating people being oppressed. But Luffy is doing it on every island he lands into, without discriminating the oppresser. Dragon picks a steady target, which is WG.

They need to somehow align to make luffy can fight imu

[low swallow]

We know 2 ways of reading Poneglyphs.
1.) Robin
2.) Possibly 3 eyed tribe

However here's a third and its based entirely on Vegapunk

So Vegapunk has shown 2 unprecedented ways to use DF
1.) Cloning Zoan fruits, including mythical Zoans, such as Momonosuke's fruit
2.) Feeding DF to objects

We know that those objects that eat the DF gain sentience and the ability to use their original form flawlessly such as Lassoo in Alabasta being able to shoot itself and Funkfreed/Cerberus understanding the use of their sword forms.

Also we need to talk about human human fruits and its variations. Firstly Chopper gains human intellect. Onimaru from Wano also gained guman intellect despite being some fox variation. However they keep properties of their original species. Chopper ages as quickly as his deer form and Onimaru maintains his penchant for theft.

Lets combine all this together.
If Vegapunk created 4 copies of any of the plethora of hito hito no mis, they can possibly feed it to the poneglyphs, which should have knowledge of their original form and be able to be coerced or persuaded to spill its contents

In addition the world government was also in possession of one of the hito hito fruits in the model: Buddha. Just as Kizaru has submitted himself for scientific discovery, Sengokus fruit could also have been cloned, just as Kaidos was, with no known adverse effects to him. The Buddha being q fogure of Enlightenment would probably be a solid fruit if the end goal is to bestow sentience onto a non living onject

Too bad Vegapunk is gone and Lilith is in SH hands. ||BORING||

[willow falcon]

Ohh interesting
Another interesting thing is there is Tree of Eve in fishman island and Adam tree in elbaf

[iron thistle]

@pearl oyster there

[pearl oyster]

But why would he still look at her poster
Maybe she did something that ruined his entire plan
Maybe she was the reason imu lost the sun god fruit

[iron thistle]

Coz IMU tricked Lili, he killed joyboy. Lili did not like it, she betrayed joyboy. She created poneglyphs and spread across the world.
So IMU killed her n took her df.
Rest explained there relating with current vivi.

Except vivi, all posters IMU had ..of Luffy , BB and shirahoshi. All of them have fated powers. Luffy n BB got the dfs. Shirahoshi was born with it.
Only vivi has not got anything. Means forest deity power was stolen from lili n is still in use by IMU . So vivi couldn't get it.

[willow falcon]

Vivi for nakama

[pearl oyster]

Was rewatching dressrosa
Doffy mentions something about national treasure hidden in the holy Land, that would make the world lose their mind.
It's so important that celestial dragons decided to let him use CP0 to trick the whole world
So it might be something like a machine/powers to wipe out the memory of people or a weapon that the entire world forgot about.
Because no way people would forget about void century it's only 800 year
That too gaints among all because 300 years 1 century
Wg could have wiped the written history but not something in people's brain
So it must be something related to that, imu hiding it from the world

[iron thistle]

Luffy, BB , Shirahoshi and vivi may be the reincarnated again to take place for the 4 ancient deities.
Earth god was used by some demon in first world
Forest god was used by demon possessed IMU..
And Poseidon has a life cycle of her own . Never locked her fruit into df.

[iron thistle]

Wonder if he meant IMU or Uranus or treasure in the form of secrets of ancient world wars.

[pearl oyster]

So imu stole one of the God's power

[iron thistle]

No idea of doffys secrets. Can just speculate. Since he may have heard of immortality somewhere

[iron thistle]

Yeah , it is most likely. He stole it from lili , the forest Deity powers

There were 4 posters IMU had. Most likely, all 4 are reincarnated versions of ancient gods

Also IMU is being used by some sorta of demon in second world. IMU was a ambitious monarch originally.
In the first world, same demon may have sent serpent of hell to fight sungod. Also may have used earth god against sun god.

[pearl oyster]

Ya the king with crown on zunesha might have been imu

[iron thistle]

Not sure of that , lili was a queen too in second world. I don't understand the mural picture 100%.

[pearl oyster]

It's only a depiction from the gaints view
So it can be more

[iron thistle]

Yeah ofc. Oda has not opened his all cards on the table yet. A lot may be comin until we reach raftel

[final kestrel]

Pirate king will become like a final ending is my guess,after they find the last poneglyph,they’ll get sidetracked,fight the war,then they’ll eventually go for the one piece.or the last poneglyph is in wg hands and they have to take it

[stiff goblet]

They need the one piece to defeat IMU

[raw scarab]

Luffy and Blackbeard are likely both connected to the Sun God

[polar trout]

I think King Harold is the one who gave the world government the Nika fruit, at which point shanks stole it, that’s the legendary fruit that was passed down and Loki’s thinks he ate it which is why he thinks he is the next joyboy, but he actually ate another fruit. This could also explain the connection they’re making of king Harold to the world government. If he wanted to be peaceful maybe he gave it to them to keep that peace in Elbaph

[raw scarab]

Yeah, this is good theory. Harold lied and held another devil fruit saying it was the sun gods.

[topaz robin]

Could Gunko be Law's sister (Lami)? We haven't seen her died, last shown was her being hidden in a closet. It's possible that Dragon saved her when the white town was being eradicated. Kinda the same thing with Sabo. That might be the reason why she's hiding her face, cause she's still infected by the white lead disease, or at least, she's cured but has traces of it on her skin.

This is addition to theories of others that she was part of the revolutionary before, and got invited to become a holy knight. Or maybe she's a spy.

[iron thistle]

Yeah this whole theory posted by someone in this server.

It is either herald or jarul. But being king , it is hard to believe Herald would have let go of the fruit. So that makes Jarul more suspicious, given the spread of lies about Loki around n only jarul was there left alive besides Loki.

[celest radish]

If this is the case, do you think Gaban knows? It would explain him giving up, he knows Loki isn't bad and he probably just wanted to see Gear 5 (Nika) because it has to have come up during his time with Roger

[hollow dock]

There is one revolutionary army under cover in holyknights?
remeber Dragon saying they will start when holy knights starts making their moves. How would dragon know weather holy knights are making move they has to be someone who giving info right.
My bet is on gunko as she is not from royal family.

[umbral summit]

Its mosa

[atomic mist]

I have a strange feeling that shanks let them get on another ship and sailed theirs out to sea and destroyed it because he knew if others witnessed their ship explode they would assume they were on it. Shanks is really a nice guy, judging from the islands he protects and I doubt he witnessed Barto drink the poison for Luffy and then drowned them at sea afterwards. Shanks and Luffy are untraditional pirates, and wouldn’t destroy someone unnecessarily. I think the price they paid is their

[pearl oyster]

Then dragon could have found law too but he didn't
So gunko isn't a noble but someone

[cosmic ermine]

Holy Knights killed Harald, Loki got blamed for it, Jarul witnessed it but isnt speaking up for some reason

[loud nimbus]

Here’s an interesting theory regarding the abyss or pentagrams that the five elders and god’s knights use. Remember how Killingham said that only those who have the “mark” can use the abyss? I think any other living organism that crosses into the abyss does maybe? Remember when Sommers was summoned to Elbaph and was using a den den mushi to talk to the higher ups? His conversation was cut short because it lost the signal even though it was a mobile and portable den den mushi. And note the two god’s knights had to inform Shamrock that he was being recalled personally, why would they do that unless Shamrock and Gunko lacked den den mushi to communicate with the holy land. And why would they not bring any unless they could not? Additional at the early appearance of the abyss when Saturn uses it, it’s been shown he relies on telepathy to contact the other elders and not a den den mushi.

[final bloom]

he has a sword on his head perhaps it affected w the memory and all

[abstract hemlock]

https://youtube.com/shorts/fE7dxAWhoWw?si=HzfhjVzJ8q70H_JQ

can be a possibility

[cinder oriole]

Do you guys think that Scopper Gaban is the man marked by flames? He already has a flame-like scar, and if it is a burn, then maybe a burnt Oro Jackson can be the Black ship

Knowing that the man marked by flames can create whirlpools, could Gaban possibly make them with both his axes and his haki?

And since we know the Man Marked By Flames also attacks other pirates, it seems like someone who most likely enjoys fighting like Gaban would attack other crews.

[cunning iron]

Yes, I think he's the man marked by the flames, and I agree with everything you've said

[wicked swallow]

There's also how Crocus and Rayleigh are both positioned at key places in the Grand Line to help others figure out how to navigate further, so Gaban being the Man Marked By Flames with knowledge of the final poneglyph fits that trend

[west wave]

I’m more in the party of Harald was in talk with the WG and Loki found out and killed Harald

[past cipher]

My Abyss theory.
I think the abyss is not complete teleportation. What i mean is I think it's a transfer of consciousness with a body made of haki requiring permission from emu. For example in chapter 1122 4 elder stars had been hit with haki bomb but only 3 returned to mary geoise but Saturn didn't become his physical body had travel to egghead. Using information from 1140 it's seems the black lightning is what the physical body is formed from.

[hearty charm]

along with strong haki it also gets countered by going (or getting flung) to far from the summoning point

and theres probably a close distance variation which is more complete teleportation, which is what saturn used to travel from the boat to egghead, and he came from the ground instead of the sky

wait what if the elder’s regeneration was directly related to the abyss

[pulsar bronze]

like some high lv ability

[fresh isle]

what if shanks scar is from loki in fenrir mode? when they fought 6 years ago, and not bleackbeard?

[harsh jacinth]

Then why would he tell its blackbeard ☠️
And loki is like 100x bigger than shank.
1 slice and 80% of shanks body will have a "scar"

[final bloom]

didnt blackbeard had like that 3 claw or smth w him earlier on?

[sudden timber]

Not sure if this was already discussed, but I know Shanks mentioned he got his scar from Blackbeard, but what if he said that to hide his heritage, and the scars were actually from Cerberus? Not to mention their Jolly Roger proudly displays the scars as another finger to the Celestial Dragons for leaving them.

[harsh jacinth]

If you do the math it doesnt make sense.
Cerberus is huge. And shanks is not the guy who is lying.

Also Whitebeard might have known about shamrock.
Whitebeard to shanks"It makes my scar ache when i see your face" Chapter 434.

[cinder oriole]

I always assumed that by his face he meant Garling

From what we’ve seen at God Valley, Garling seemed to really look a lot like Shanks back then. He may have gotten his scar back in the past fighting Garling

[harsh jacinth]

Ah yeah. Forgot for a sec. About him. My bad.

But then whitebeard should have known about the connection of garling and shanks.

[cinder oriole]

Maybe he did know about the connection but
A. Chose to assume that Shanks already knew that Garling was his father
B. Chose to keep his knowledge of the connection with Garling from Shanks for some unknown reason

[livid anchor]

yes and it also says it was Blackbeard in his Vivre Card entry

[hallow bear]

gunko is a revolutionary spy in the gods knights

shes the only member so far thats not a world noble, she has the same hat and goggles combo that most of the revs have and is the only one listed to have a fruit meaning shes not in the same demonic club the other members are a part of

[dusky acorn]

How would you begin to explain the reason why they even accepted an originally non-Celestial Dragon such as her, though? Surely Gunko's strength can't be so much that it's comparable to the strongest giant of Elbaph, for them to have given her the same "miracle" of an offer as they did to Loki.

Wouldn't it also be strange that Dragon had such a fighter with this hypothetical level of strength in the backburner, yet never made a name for themselves to be publically known? That's what needed to be the case, for Gunko to squirm her way into this position at the very top of the world.

[white bronze]

the fruit maybe has some sort of crazy power? so wg trying to recruit her?

[echo rampart]

Maybe the Human Human Fruit: Mythical Type, Model Drayd?

[violet hare]

one of the god knights summoned has a Mythical Zoan devil fruit power (Kirin)

[daring mural]

what does ragnir means

[pure raven]

All we know is imu can control arrows maybe she has a smilliar power maybe ?

[gritty kite]

The holy knights could be empowered by imu.

[grizzled depot]

https://www.instagram.com/p/DGiJKkIzmxZ/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

chancil.chan

ONE PIECE MEGA THEORY
Romance Dawn, The Cosmological Axis of Love
By Chancil

20 Pages
#chancilromancedawntheory #ONEPIECE #luffy #joyboy #sungodnika #vivi #strawhats

Likes

26372

Instagram

[spice pier]

just saw this on tiktok and its amazing.

[hallow bear]

But was given the same treatment as the rest of the nobles, only stated as the beast

[versed echo]

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT2uGDJUx/

[sudden heart]

Not a bad theory, but the Adam tree is there so calling Joyboy Adam doesn't fit to me. But still the Lilith fruit makes a lot of sense. The demons from Lilith makes more sense now.
But maybe the love thing of romance is a bit much. Romance isn't just love per say, it's a strong emotional focus on something like adventure and joy.

[iron loom]

Loki Fenrir theory alive again?

[sudden heart]

How?

@pure raven hmmm so just for the sake of the Lilith argument and your comment about arrows, a classic devil tail often looks like red horns and a pitch fork and pointy tail that looks like an arrow at the end. This series loves using classic cartoon style tropes. Like homers here.
Lilith is considered also to be the mother of monsters like vampires and children of the night.
Even ancient Egyptian stories have vampires in them.
Since Imu or at least who she might be could have been lily from the Egyptian style alabasta kingdom, it would make sense that Imu's descendants come from alabasta.
And Imu it self would body hope from each descendant to keep her power alive or even when the next time Nika comes back.

Holy knights and the elders, all have been given powers from the devil queen her self who has the devil fruits Lilith.

Oh shit. What if all devil fruits really came from Imu?

[pure raven]

So i was correct ?

Oh and i got another theory bout the latest manga || since loki has been freed then will he start ragnarok the infamous viking war ? ||

[sudden heart]

I don't know if you are correct, I am saying I agree with a lot you put in there. But when it comes to Love aspect, I don't know, Lilith was casted out of Eden because she wouldn't submit to Adam. Eve then was created to be submissive.

But Ragnarok is the fall of Valhalla, so maybe the fall of eblaf? What I can say for certain that kingdoms are going to be destroyed. Fishman island being the major one. So maybe, the start of Ragnarok is really going to start the end of the world. The final war is coming, wano will be destroyed, water 7 sinking, fishman island will be destroyed, and maybe Nika isn't the harbinger of that end of the world but is the one who picks up the pieces to make a new world.

Everytime Nika comes along a new world follows. This new world will have the all blue and the redline destroyed.

So if eblaf is destroyed, then the Adam tree would have to be burnt down, and by your assessment on the sun tree and the Adam tree being connected, would leave a huge hole in the center of the earth.

One piece and laugh tale are in the center of the planet.

[wicked swallow]

i think Sommers wanting more time to get ready + remarking that his sofa was transported with him makes this unlikely if it isn't his actual body being transported- we even see him having to get dressed on Elbaph because he was just lounging around in his underwear at home

[mellow condor]

Isn't gear 5 just every gear combined?
We got the speed of gear 2, the growth of gear 3, and the haki of gear 4, and it has its own bonus of toon force,
so is Gear 5 basically just every Luffy gear but combined, and on crack?

[iron current]

I mean if you wanna see it like that but I would say no, because Haki isn't what defines gear 4, but it made it possible

[thorny viper]

I wonder if luffy would eat the rumble ball to defeat imu, cause look how strong is monster chopper but his devil fruit is not even Mythical Zoan type

[cinder basin]

i think the most popular theory for choppers monster transformation is that it is actually an awakening, just a manufactured and false one

[thorny viper]

That actually make sense

[thorny viper]

wow nice bankai answer u got there, ye oda doesn't kill his characters when they should be dead

[smoky basin]

i think theres an old ancient hag giant in cahoots with jarul and they are both the 'main villains'
and they work for the WG, Jarul and the hag hating how Harald was leading the giants of elbaph towards peace and love
maybe this hag is the one with illusion and trickery as powers while jarul stands for the main "brute" villain at the end
harald could have been manipulated too but loki discovers it and when he confronts jarul and this older woman a fight breaks out, harald is killed and loki decides to shoulder the blame or also gets tricked by her into thinking he did that shit

[soft storm]

EVERYONE I HAVE A THEORY THAT THE HAT THAT LUFFY WEARS IS SHANKS HAT

[cosmic drum]

simmons says YOU, yes YOU🫵 have 20 seconds to watch mha or everyone within of 20 mile radius of you will decay

[thorny viper]

According to the stages of the final war, I believe zoro will fight mihawk before the final war so he can be strong enough to defeat the 5 elders easily

Also casually will have imu clash feat

Also casually humbling Shanks father

or unless that is Shanks's opponent but I feel like he will help luffy to defeat imu

what u think @vast portal sorry for disturbing u king

[vast portal]

I completely agree

[thorny viper]

@prime rose what u doing, are u repying to my message

what is taking so long

[prime rose]

wasn't trying to. Was typing my own theory lol

[thorny viper]

oh mb, keep going king

imma be offline for 5 mins u better be done when I come back

jk

take ur time

Bro is not done

noo I am sorry @prime rose come back

bro once @prime rose is done, bro is gonna have a whole essay for us to analyze

[prime rose]

I think the Secret is going to be that the Entire World comes from the Adam Tree. Every Single Kingdom.

Just an Ocean with one Island and Giant Tree. And the Tree was home to EVERYONE. However, the smaller races had to live near the highest parts of the tree, which withered the quickest in the sun. The Sun is both the source of life, but also a danger to the Tree itself. which is why a few races were so close to the moon they could jjust basically fly over and decided to take refuge there. But those branches they left withered and collapsed, creating the first islands below with the creatures they left behind. Thee moon was probably seen as a safe haven for many of the racees who didn't want to fall into tragedy in the seas below, but also didn't want to burn in the sky if left unguarded against the sun.

Eventually this process continued, but not every kingdom had somewhere to escapee to, so their branches burned and they had to abandon their homes. So the Kingdoms on the lower branches then began to prune these branches early to prevent them from burning. This only caused turmoil below as each branch was as large as a continent landing in the ocean below and it didn't always come down in a single piece. But one time, it did. The largest branch that nearly circled the whole world caught fire and thus createdd the event that split the world in two. The Red Line was Born. The Sun Spread the FIres of War by burning the branches that grew too high.

We don't know what happened to the dragon itself, but it's probably likely it died after burning the Tree of Adam and causing an event where a bunch of branches burned off. That sword might have been used by the The Sun God (A Giant) to behead the dragon. It must have also been used to cut the tree branches when they were burning.

Seriously though. I thinkk they jjust said it in the manga. They branch had an entire village on it.

When it says the Forest God Tamed Demons though, I think The Sunlight Tree Eve is connected to how Imu's powers work - which is the earth below, on the RED LINE where they spawned the SUNLIGHT TREE EVE with a seed from the Adam Tree planted in the Red Line made from one of its fruit bearing branches.

[thorny viper]

OH HELL NAH

I AM OUT

jk

let me read this rq

[thorny viper]

Wow that theory is amazing, make a yt channel ❤️

@vast portal read this guy's theory when u free

[vast portal]

W theory

[prime rose]

Further - Born were first kingdoms who fell from the tree. They made up the continents that sat over the ocean, causing tension as each new kingdom would rise the tides on those who came before it. And although there was tension, they still remained at peace as there was enough turmoil to deal with between them.

THe Ancient Kingdoms of the Tree decided long ago to split up the shares of information on how to create the Mother Flame. The Undying Flame.
They wanted it so that only those with the consent of all Kingdoms could use it. The Voice of All Things that Were Once, Are Now or Will Be speak out in unison.
Via the Ponoglyphs, written by the First Gods of the World who had left long before. With only one wish, that all kingdoms consent lest one use it for war
The Ancient Kingdom of the Tree was a massively technological kingdom, and someone translated the message that needed to be heard.
The one called Joy Boy wanted to learn the truth, knowing the Ponoglyphs would reveal to him the truth of the power of the Mother Flame.
Joy Boy didn't want to use it to destroy the world though. he wanted to use it to create Sky Kingdoms.
It carries good with it, even if it was spread by someone who really meant to abuse its power.

The 20 kingdom's collapse was a tragedy that took the lives of many of their people with each new incident. And with the cutting of the most recent branch came the declaration of war. Imu took his chance to claim power by making a deal with the Devils of the Seas Themselves. And in Exchange for his Soul, he went to claim the tree with his new-found Devil Powers and stole the Mother Flame. But when Lili learned what he intended to do with this power, she betrayed him and stole the Dragon and she burned the Tree. So as to scatter across the world its Kingdoms and the ponoglyphs with them.

[opaque wyvern]

Nika is a Giant that's why Luffy Eats a Lot

Loki dyes his hair Pink to match Lola's hair

[keen trellis]

has anyone brought up the possibility of the monster trio, loki, and harjrudin’s crew being stuck in the underworld while the rest of the strawhats are gonna get the power ups they were needing when it’s up to them to stop the holy knights. Usopp time to shine🙏 and monster trio meet up with kidd

[solid heart]

whats gonnna happened next is probably classic oda formula. Oda going to show lokis strenght and strawhats will have some difficulties before getting the upperhand

[pure raven]

Somthing seems a little bit off i can tell you that but the possiblity is that maybe gods knights will maybe team up with loki or they will go against loki or just team up with straw hats but the percent is lower

Btw this is an articale i found

[solid heart]

idk about that, loki seems adamant about his decision hating on both shanks and shamrock. In addition, the mural also shows that loki will fight along the strawhats in the final war. i fee like he is anti hero in this arc

[pure raven]

But then what happens after ?

[solid heart]

guess the gods knight will start the game which will postpone the battle between the strawhats and loki

[pure raven]

Start the game like the game that is at the colliuseum or when the celistail dragons made a game ?

[solid heart]

i reckon the hunting game like god valley

[pure raven]

Hold up hold up

[pure raven]

Why was kuma running and the marines tryna hunt em?

[solid heart]

because he was a bucaneer and a slave to the cd?

[pure raven]

I think that after of what you said and if a war comes where the gaints interferes then it will be an all time war maybe ragnarok or maybe not

[pure raven]

Damn

[pure raven]

But regardless i think ragnarok will happen

[pure raven]

Why the chat dead

[rough storm]

let me revive it. lol

nami is shamrocks daughter.

[chrome badger]

*Bonney is Shamrock's Biological daughter

[rough storm]

i dont think shamrock would let saturn use him as an experiement.

[chrome badger]

you seriously think the CD's care what happens to slaves

[rough storm]

and it be hard to imagine a figarland mating with an insect

[rough storm]

celestial dragons wont even let nobody touch them

u think they will mate with a sickly dying person with diseases

[chrome badger]

2 things:

1. slave wives among the CD's is well established
2. this is what male bonney looks like. Seems eerily like Shanks/Shamrock

[chrome badger]

SAturn established he experimented on Ginney because she was pregnant

[rough storm]

nope. loks like sanji to me

[rough storm]

i thought ginny was captured because he was one of the high ranking commander of the RA. she was probably captured to lure kuma and dragon

[chrome badger]

I mean the RA says a CD took a liking to her and if its not a Gods Knight I have no idea how a CD would meet an RA officer

[fast goblet]

Probably just see her bounty poster or see her in the newspaper

[chrome badger]

Low key I think CP0 keeps newspapers away from the CDs so they dont have to go on rediculout fetch quests.

[rough storm]

i still dont think its the holy knight like do they have time to fall in love with a commoner? especially a noble like figarland?

[chrome badger]

I mean its probably wayy less than love (look at Charlos first appearance)

[rough storm]

the hair doesnt match. ginnys hair is pink. to get that. red hair has to be mix with white hair

[chrome badger]

I mean why doesnt Momo have green hair then

[rough storm]

because odins hair is black

[chrome badger]

And Ginney’s hair is an non established Color but could be pink

[rough storm]

if bonney was shamrock. then. her hair should be red like him or like her mom ginny also had red hair

ginny has pink hair.

[chrome badger]

Exactly

[rough storm]

its just hard to believe a figarland would even dare to touch a commoner

not just a commoner but a slave and a pirate

oda has been drawing nami wearing a crown a lot

[chrome badger]

Typically Luffy with the crown

[rough storm]

luffy will become the pirate King

but other than him only nami was drawn to wear a crown

my head canon is. nami was from okyot kingdom. okyot backward is teh capital of japan. that has to mean something. also we still dont know who her fatther and mother is or her origin. last her hair is orange closest color to red.

[fast goblet]

How does any of that connect

[rough storm]

its a theory of nami being royalty. im not saying theres connection but we still dont know her origin. and oda keep drawing her with crowns.

[fast goblet]

I honestly think it’s too late in the story to bring smth like that up and would just seem like a repeat of the Sanji storyline which was set up better

[rough storm]

i mean it depends on the author on how well he can write it. but it would be a good plot twist for someone who steal for money is actually part of the richest family in the world.

[gritty kite]

After Sanji we got Zoro being a descendant of the shimotsukis and ryuma. Nami is next in line for legendary bloodline welfare.

[unborn berry]

Is zoro gonna be sanji's wife?

[keen trellis]

are yall forgetting how the monster trio and all them are gonna get back up there without a ship

[dim gate]

Sanji is the "man marked by flames".

[wispy terrace]

Buggy the clown will awaken his fruit, have access to nuclear/atomic energy, that will power his new ship, Pluton!!!

[dim gate]

Are you thinking of splicing or splitting atoms?

[wispy terrace]

100%, i get its the chop chop fruit, but id like to think that he would go from:

Buggy Balls > Muggy Balls > ? Balls

I also believe this because there is a focus on energy sources in the series, Buggy's character would fit nicely with the themes of Motherflame/Drums of Liberation/Green Blood/etc. Primarily as a gag ofcourse

[rough storm]

possible i mean he already have buggy bomb. he could name his awakened attack buggy atomic bomb

[dim gate]

he is a paramecia type yet to awaken. So far he's only been chopped, but his awakening should allow other elements to be chopped while maintaining stability. It's the instability caused by splitting an atom that causes the explosion. I do think his ability will be important in the future, but I don't think he'll be doing nuclear fission/fusion or whatever. It ain't my field of expertise.

[rough storm]

his awakened power will be the one to cut the red line

[solid heart]

obviously oda going to showcase lokis power and current strawhat have no idea what his power is as they have to figure it out first before dealing with em. Just like luffy struggling fighting gaban but we know luffy would rekt gaban in the long run

its classic oda story telling

[keen trellis]

oh yea im not denying they gonna fight im just saying what the possible storyline of elbaf will prob be like going forward

[rough storm]

all the giants know what lokis power is. and loki is not going to waste time when he knows that the holy knights are going to destroy elbaph.

[keen trellis]

i think loki is gonna show off his strength and will prob outpower everyone but will then pass out from his injuries

[rough storm]

loki is weaken by the seastone and he is heavily injured why would he waste his power to show off?

[keen trellis]

because bro is prob not thinking straight rn the fact he grabbed his hammer

[rough storm]

he grab his hammer because he will go up and fight those holy knights

[keen trellis]

i mean i definitely think that’s his main plan but literally everyone there with loki rn would try to stop him atm

so yea loki isn’t gonna go off easy

the only person that would let loki go is luffy, everyone else don’t trust him and loki knows that

[rough storm]

they wont stop loki once loki tell them about the holy knights plan

[solid heart]

the giants may know what his power is, but doesnt mean they can stop it

[rough storm]

but he can't even use his power because of the sea stone. and luffy zoro and sanji is there. also saving the giant kids takes first priority

[solid heart]

doesnt stop oda showcasing his power abit, especially it was shown he is wielding his weapon

it is classic oda story telling, no way loki going to get whooped on the get go

on top of that, the new giant warrior pirates are weak af

hajrudin barely beats lower executive of doffy pirates

[normal quail]

what

you're saying ginnys hair is pink and arguing shamrock cant be the father of bonney because bonney has pink hair and not some mix

and then you go on to make the exact opposite point by saying that momonosuke doesnt have green hair like toki because oden has black hair and momo only got hair color genes from oden

if ginney has pink hair and bonney has pink hair it doesnt matter the hair color of the father because it just means she only got hair color genes from ginney

and while i dont think shamrock is bonneys father, hair color has nothing to do with it in this case

another case u see this is ace with his parents

roger had black hair and rouge had some kind of blonde hair yet ace just has black hair

[final bloom]

why r we seeing hair theories

[fast goblet]

How does Loki have purple hair when Harald is bald

Doesn’t make sense

[final bloom]

I thought shanks was kids father

[normal quail]

and yet another example is colon (apparently thats how you spell his name) whose parents are ripley and gaban

and gaban has black hair yet colon has pink hair

so idk why your reason for shamrock not being bonneys father is hair color

theres also loki whose hair is clearly a light color yet king haralds hair is black

and i imagine there are tons more example

especially with big mom and her children

[normal quail]

was his color scheme revealed?

[fast goblet]

Yea in the recent volume cover

[normal quail]

oh yea

[mighty moon]

but oda also had blonde and Ginger for loki during the concept but went with pink

[prime rose]

I went deeper into the Story to rehash some old plots and I realized theres probably more. And I'm making wild assumptions so forgive me if I'm absolute on this.

The Tree of Adam doesn't make Devil Fruits. It makes DREAMS come true. The reason the Giants are so big is because they BELIEVED they were the biggest and best. And the more you believe it - THE BIGGER YOU GET.

The same with every other race that lived on the tree. The more they believed it - the more they were the things they wanted to be. ELBAPH IS ACTUALLY MAGICAL and the PERHAPS THE TREE OF ADAM IS ALREADY DEAD. We saw a lot of things about the trees causing the poison in the story of Skypeia and the ancient tribe of Shandia. The trees were killing the people and they were too deeply rooted in their religion and god-fearing ways to see past the truth that the trees needed to be cut down to save the people and THATS THE CASE HERE TOO.

The Sunlight TREE EVE is the ONLY LIVING FRUIT OF THE ADAM TREE.

And if that's the case. Loki wasn't lying. HIS PLAN IS TO DESTROY THE WORLD and he is immediately looking to cut down that tree.

BUT HE ISNT WRONG TO DO SO. If the tree is really dying from disease, the rotting wood will needs to be removed to save the soil. And the only LIVING FRUIT will need to be protected and cultivated so that it can grow and bring back the MAGIC OF DREAMS. THE WILL OF DREAMS. Because DREAMING is BELIEVING and BELIEVING THAT YOUR DREAMS CAN COME TRUE is the power that the ADAM TREE produced and that the SUN LIGHT TREE EVE now has. But Imu's the only one with access to it. And the DEVILS DREAM is for a world FULL OF DEVILS. - which is why devil fruit just appear in the nearest fruit (and potentially die if cut off from reaching one). The Devil Fruit are Souls that IMU traded to power his DREAM.

IMU has the one piece. And it' s the 1 Living Piece of Adam.

[dusky acorn]

Ex-Warlord Hanafuda's Murderer THEORY

There exists a strong case to prove that the "pirates" who were powerful enough and more vicious than Ace to not just defeat, but actually kill ex-Warlord Hanafuda was none other than Kid and his crew.

Desire to Enhance Victoria Punk

Let's first take a look at Kaido, another significant pirate that Kid also held a grudge against.

This pirate ushered Kid to state that he wanted to cut his head off, and upgrade his ship by placing it as the new figurehead of his ship's prow.

(I think we can agree that Kid was certainly suggesting Kaido's dragon head here.

Replacing the dinosaur with Kaido's non-dragon skull would look tiny relative to the size of the ship, and certainly not an upgrade in aesthetic.)

Skulls as Trophies

Undeniably, it's already been established Kid enjoys enhancing the "Victoria" Punk with heads as trophies, in regards to spited enemies that also happen to be significant victories.

In that case, whose to say the dinosaur head on Kid's ship wasn't already taken off the corpse of a begrudged enemy from a significant battle too? This fits the identity of Hanafuda's pirate killer to a T.

Large Zoan Transformation

Of course, it's extremely likely Hanafuda as an Ancient Zoan collector had a power of this exact fruit type himself.

His epithet was "King of Lizards", and even his own children Ulti and Page 1 had Ancient models, which he likely gave in the first place.

Given that Hanafuda was 5.14 metres tall, (Kaido for reference was 7.1 metres tall), it fits that Hanafuda's supposed dinosaur transformation would be ridiculously big, to even use as what we saw as Victoria Punk's current prow.

Reuniting With Family

As we know, the King of Lizards was in the midst of desiring to return to the "loving bosom of his family", yet wasn't allowed to do so by other pirates, and ended up killed instead.

Doesn't this exact scenario sound oddly familiar to something Kid has already been known for doing to other pirates?

Matching Skull Marks

If we take a look a closer look at Hanafuda's mask, it even has the marking of a dinosaur head/skull.

There are all sorts of shapes of dinosaur heads out there, but this exact one looks eerily similar to the prow of Victoria Punk, right?

Kid and Ace, Both 4 Years Prior

Ultimately, we know Hanafuda was defeated around 4 years ago, due to the Kuma Flashback.

And due to Yamato's flashback, we also know that Kid was already a reknowned pirate 4 years ago as well.

Thus, I believe killing ex-Warlord Hanafuda and glorifying his huge victory as a trophy onto his ship could be what Kid did, potentially even in his 2+ years of pirating before Luffy's journey began, in order to gain such infamy.

This would further justify how Kid had the highest bounty amongst his Supernova peers, (and potentially Killer's bounty to be a Supernova as well.)

TLDR, Kid had already defeated a ||ex-||Warlord of the sea, too many 'coincidences' to not be such a convincing argument now. @craggy pumice @weak arrow @polar bison @versed hamlet @modest skiff @night jewel @gloomy canyon @mint prairie

[weak arrow]

@dusky acorn Would definitely think Ulti/Page One would have mentioned something about wanting to kill their father's murderer, especially since he was captured. Something you didn't mention that could be relevant is putting a reason as to why Kaido decided to take down Kid/Hawkins pirates, and capturing him in retaliation for killing Hanafuda would give it a reason, as we can see that Kaido somehow didn't take the BM poneglyph rubbing which would have been an even better reason to do so.

[dusky acorn]

Well, the grey area in all this is we're not sure about the timeline of events. Were Ulti and Page 1 old enough to have remembered their father or to be fond of him, before he left them in Kaido's employ? It could be a situation similar to Robin, not remembering her mother Olivia.

But tbh the real reason behind P1/Ulti's lack of mention about Kid may be that Wano was already too packed to include more little plot-lines, or Oda just hadn't concepted Hanafuda this deeply yet.

[dusky acorn]

Right, and Hawkins said that his chance of survival even if he threw his arms up and surrendered wasn't even guaranteed, rather only 40%.

if Kaido had this kind of unspoken beef with Kid to us as the audience. it would have motivated him to want to kill Kid and his little alliance, to return the favour of killing Hanafuda. But seeing Kid's strength and Conqeurors haki through their battle is what persuaded Kaido to keep him alive, followed by torture and imprisonment in an originally personal cell for Kid.
https://imgur.com/a/pYo2HkW

It would turn out extremely fitting that not only Luffy and Law with Doffy, but Kid would also parallel them by having taken out a (former) Warlord of his own connected to Kaido. Unlike Doffy's defeat though, Hanafuda's murder wouldn't have been as pressing to mention, considering it happened years ago.

If that's really Hanafuda's head as a trophy on Kid's ship, then as Kaido says Kid is definitely a member of this "generation" that was extremely "proud" of wiping out an ex-Warlord, after all.

[chrome badger]

I mean Queen and Franky don't meet that entire arc, and I don't think Page One or Ulti met any of the Kid Pirates, so it may have just not been brought up.

[craggy pumice]

another good kid connection I wouldve never thunk of, and as a former Ulti and Page One joining Kid theorist I encourage any connection between them of course, even tho this would lead to the complete opposite outcome that they would hate him lol. I feel like if Kid killing Hanafuda like those guys pre timeskip, it would be a bit too sad and paint Kid as too much of a villain, like of course hes not a good guy but that scene only was okay for Oda to do because we didnt know anything about those guys, with Hanafuda it would be pretty sad that he couldnt return to his kids. It can still happen, but I think Oda wouldnt make Hanafuda beg for Kid letting him live so that he can see his kids in that scenario. Honestly it would remind me of those scenes in movies where a cop is like "well this is my last day in duty before I retire and return to my family" etc and then dies lol.

But everything else I can see, I also never liked that it was only Luffy who defeated all the warlords and the other supernovas only got offscreen feats to boost their bounties, I mean of course we are following Luffy but for worldbuildings sake give the others some stuff too (which Oda did with Rocky Port, the supernovas being in Big Moms and Kaidos territories and Kid and Law beating Big Mom etc.) and Kid killing Hanafuda would definitely fall in line withthat, give him a warlord to beat as well and that would explain his bounty being higher than Luffys. And I already hoped that Hanafuda would have the T-Rex zoan that we lacked in Wano so Kid having that skull on his ship and saying he wants to upgrade it with another dinosaur like zoans skull from the guy who Hanafuda was working for would be very fitting. And I agree with Adam that would be a cool additional reason as to Kaido even was going after Kid, and compared him to Luffy and Law, who at the time did the same Kid wouldve done, defeated a former warlord worker of his (and that was why he was going for Ace as well).

[sudden pollen]

**Elbaf Arc and the connections to God Valley & Ohara
**
I am theorizing the possible future of Elbaf Arc using possible connections to previous events in the story.

First, Elbaf is known to be one of the most hyped up islands and considering it is going to be more or equally eventful as Egghead, we may have a God Valley level event on our hands in the upcoming chapters.

The possible evidence that we have for Elbaf connecting to God Valley:

1. Presence of Holy Knights
2. A "game" will possibly occur over the lives of innocent people
3. Elbaf island can be compared to God Valley just from general looks (These large sky reaching structures in the center of the island)

The possible evidence that we have for Elbaf connecting to Ohara:

1. Jaguar D. Saul and Robin are present
2. Massive hollow tree that is weak to flames (Ohara tree was burnt down and was hollow)
3. People researching the void century/Harley texts
4. Elbaf can be compared to Ohara from looks (Big hollow tree in center of island)

Now, we have basic connections to both God Valley and Ohara, even if they don't seem like much. However, I will explain why the combination of these two events somewhat reoccurring on Elbaf will connect to many of the characters development in One Piece.

Next, in order for this event to represent God Valley more clearly I believe there needs to be 4 main forces:
Someone who represents Roger's crew (Luffy and crew)
Someone who represents Rock's crew (Blackbeard and crew)
Someone to represent the Navy/Garp (Akainu or Koby)
Someone to represent the WG/Holy Knights (Gunko/Sommers/Gillingham)

If Blackbeard decides to arrive on Elbaf (for various reasons), not only will someone who represents Rocks be there, but Kuzan will also present--this may connect to Ohara. Kuzan may prove his character to be good if he stops the Adam tree from burning and ultimately resolving his story with Robin and his good giant-friend Saul.

If Akainu decides to show up to represent the Navy (buster call or H.K. called for help), he could represent himself from the past when he lead the buster call against Ohara. Additionally, this would allow luffy to resolve his beef with Akainu or Kuzan/Robin beef with Akainu. However, if Akainu does not show up to threaten the burning of the Adam Tree, Kuzan can still theoretically save the tree from some other burning.

If Koby shows up to represent the Navy (or Sword), he would definitely represent Garp back in God Valley. Koby now has reason to engage with the BB pirates (to save Garp), AND it would be a great moment to watch Koby and Luffy reunite and work together. It is possible both Akainu and Koby show up but I think unlikely. If Koby shows up, its more likely a conflict in the Holy Lands will occur between Dragon and Akainu.

Lastly, the conflict between Dragon and Akainu would match up nicely as we know they were both young and possibly in the Navy together at the time of God Valley. It is theorized this may be where their beef began. Additionally, the burning of Ohara (lead by Akainu) prompted the creation of the Revolutionary Army (lead by Dragon).

Extras: Kuma is present - like on God Valley. Ivankov was present in God Valley and may show up with Dragon. --If Vegapunk is restored we can get interactions between them all.

Altogether, the current connections between Elbaf to God Valley and Ohara paints a perfect picture to not only set up the final events of One Piece by holding a large conflict between all major parties, but also develops the plot lines of so many important characters in the story (Kuzan, Koby, Robin, Saul, Akainu, Dragon).

[zenith river]

I'd say Loki Fenrir theory certain. Neil Gaiman's Norse Mythology has a retelling of the tale of Fenrir, who was tricked into manacles to prove he was strong enough to break them. The gods, fearing his growing strength, tricked him into being bound by an unbreakable magical chain called Gleipnir, which was made of seemingly harmless elements like a cat's footsteps and a fish's breath. Fenrir remains chained until Ragnarok, when he is destined to break free and fulfill his role in the end of the world.

He was also known to continue physically growing, getting bigger and bigger. That ties nicely to Loki's massive size and how much that's being emphasized.

[polar current]

Is the gura gura no mi a paramecia or is it another gomu gomu no mi situation where it’s actually classified as a mythical zoan fruit. If true, then, it may not be blackbeard’s body that has the gura gura no mi but the rings on his left hand

[sudden pollen]

It’s def paramecia, I would argue that perhaps Blackbeard having the ability to carry a zoan, logia, and paramecia to be more likely

[round bay]

to add on to this, if its only one ring that has it, in theory bb could have 5 different powers on one hand effectively making a devil fruit infinity gauntlet.

[polar current]

It’d need to be a zoan df for it to work on non living things.

[chrome python]

I believe Aokiji has the same bounty as Luffy

[silk dock]

hanafuda didnt give his kids the fruits. it was revealed that ulti & page one stole the fruits when they’re taken care by beast pirates. they stole them to survive and rise the ranks.

whether those fruits were in kaido’s possession in the first place because of hanafuda, no info on that

[prime rose]

I think Oda is taking on the task of representing the ancient Norse Dragons by combining both the Fafnir and the Nidhogg into one being with Loki himself. Taking from Fafnir as the born son of the Dwarf King, Brother OTR killed by Loki, Fafnir demanded treasure but Loki cursed it and Fafnir murdered his father out of greed and transformed into the legendary Dragon. Meanwhile pulling from Nidhogg who was said to be the world ender - gnaws at the roots of the tree and is trapped within them (as we found Loki).

fits for Loki and we've yet to see someone with a devil fruit that looks like a traditional western dragon vs the fish fish fruit that creates the more eastern style dragons we've seen. I'm guessing the fake dragon that we saw on Punk Hazard were copies made by Dr Vegapunk based on what he knew of this Elbaph Dragon. And given that these creatures are giant beasts to begin with - it might even be bigger than it was in its original form when the transformation is done by a naturally large giant like Loki.

I think that Elbaph Dragon is what we see featured atop of the tree in the Harley and is likely the representation of the SUN GOD.

Which then begs the question - WHAT IS THE SERPENT on the right? I already gave my answer to what I believe. I don't think the giant serpent on the right is an actual creature so much as a representation of the EARTH GOD and World Serpent (Jormungandr) Being that the Red Line is going to most likely be remains of 1 or more branches from the Adam Tree being cutt off after having started burning. The reason it is shown rising up and shooting flames is because the tree was set on fire, and the branches landing on top of the world's civilizations was likely a tragic event that added to the machine of war.

When the Earth God Raged and the people living below the tree finally revolted and tried to confront the people of the World Tree - that's when the SUN GOD APPEARED and caused the RED LINE event by burning the tree's branches.

[sudden pollen]

the entire red line is made of a few adam tree branches burning?

[prime rose]

I can't be the first one to suggest the concept. But that is my theory based on the recent chapters and just how big the scale is.

[sudden pollen]

where do lunarians fit into this theory, considering they used to be the "gods" on the red line

[prime rose]

I this arc, I believe we will see the Will of the Devil Fruit overpower the will of the user born in Loki. What happens when the Awakening is too much. And the Dragon's Will is so great that Why Supreme King Haki is so necessary to overcome the weakness of the Devil Fruit - which is that your will is competing for control whenever you tap into the powers there of - kind of like how Naruto can lose control if he takes on too much of the Nine Tails in his early years.

I Think the Lunarians were the ones who lived on the biggest branch. And that it stretched out into the heavens across the Eearth itself. So when it was struck by lightning and finally was cut, it wrapped itself around the earth on fire, creating the main body of the Red Line.

My guess is the reason their wings were so big was because they travelled often between the moon and the earth. I'm not sure how breathing works out in One Piece Space yet, but the Enel Cover Story leaves a lot of questions about how feasable it is to just float on over.

[sudden pollen]

We have seen failed awakenings in Impel Down. If conq haki is required to use mythical zoans with great will, how does Bonney turn into nika.

[prime rose]

Good Question. Bonney is the child of Kuma. I assume something to do with the bloodline just gives them inherently strong will. She might have Haki of the Supreme King once she builds a little more confidence -- but I assume in that case it was Luffy's 5th gear affecting the world around him to empower her already broken abilities.

Basically If Nika is around. Anything is possible as long as you believe it is

[sudden pollen]

BONNEY ISNT KUMAS BIOLOGICAL CHILD

DO YOU REAAD THE STORY

[prime rose]

She's not?

It's a big story. I may have missed that part. >_>

[sudden pollen]

Celestsial dragon graped Bonney mom Ginney

[prime rose]

Celestial Dragons Suck.

[sudden pollen]

For real

[cunning iron]

How on Earth did you miss that part? 😅

[sudden pollen]

I think the part of the theory where Loki represents nidhogg is rly good but the Adam tree is no where near the size of the red line unfortunately.

[quaint haven]

Theory: Law is a revolutionary. Dragon sent him to marineford to collect luffy.

[iron current]

any evidence supporting this?

[quaint haven]

None atall 🤣 just feel like it's very strange the way he helped luffy, danger he out himself in for a stranger.

I definitely think laws hiding something

[elder dirge]

I don't think so, especially because during marineford mihawk stated that strawhat has a the legendary power to draw people together, I think it was just a continuation of what he said

[elder dirge]

I agree with hiding something as you wouldn't want to give everything up in a pirate alliance, but I don't think it's that he's part of the RA

[thorny viper]

I see what u talking about, but law hates doffy, since warlords are there required to fight, he prob wanted to fight him but just realized how dangerous the war was in that time

also shanks was ending the war

so the only thing he can do is save luffy

since he a d member like himself

why not save him, and team with him to fight his number 1 opps which is doffy

since law would know luffy would easily help out because he saved his life

[cosmic ermine]

I think this promise will be fulfilled later. Probably after this arc. I think Loki and Luffy will end up being friends after or even later during elbaf

Maybe he'll use this favor on the blackbeard pirates when that battle happens

[proud crystal]

I feel like Luffy would see it as cheating but at the same time, I don't see why Oda would put that in if it didn't come back somehow...

[pure raven]

anyone else ever noticed that this thing from Enel's mural and the patch on CP0 seem to be similar?

[cosmic ermine]

ill be honest they dont look similar at all

[pure raven]

i don't think so

[chrome badger]

I mean I think it would explain why Law is able to know so much about the One Piece World: Doflamingo and Punk Hazard, Doffy and Kaido, the man marked by Flames. I don't think he is a revoluatoinary but he may be tied to someone like Sabo or Koala. It would also add to his interactions with Robin if they both have that connection.

[chrome badger]

But Im not a bet on it person

[iron current]

All that knowledge can easily come from his years with Doffy, he also most likely had been planning his revenge and was gathering info

I just think there are better odds that he works with sengoku

[keen trellis]

i hate to say it, but Kuina is probably alive, the fact the revolutionary are close with kuina’s dad feels so random

[keen trellis]

what if Gunko is Kuina

a spy for the revolutionary army

[final bloom]

why would kuina be in relation w revolutionary?

[keen trellis]

did you look over the part that kuina’s father helped out the revolutionary army

it’s very interesting that oda even had that in the storyline at all

it comes off kinda random

and that questions if Kuina is apart of the revolutionary army, why haven’t we seen her?

it’s because she’s a spy, secretly giving info to the revolutionary, so they would know when the holy knights would strike

she has the goggles, which all the top revolutionaries other than dragon and ivankov have

there’s also the possibility that she isn’t a spy, but was kidnapped during a possible battle between the revolutionary and holy knights

but that’s all i really got

we will probably get a reveal of her actual face by the end of the year

[cinder basin]

yeah Luffy wouldn't use that but it's gotta be relevant somehow

[brave bridge]

Loki doesn't seem to honor promises if we can take anyone on Elbaf seriously about him

[cosmic ermine]

Im sure he was saying it as a lie to Luffy just to get set free. What I'm getting at is after the events of this arc play out and Loki sees that Luffy has the sun god nika power, theyll end up friends/allies or something and Loki will end up fulfilling his promise at a later time in some way. We did learn after all Loki does have a good side like the Mosa guy he was talking to said, and the fact he loved Lola and has animal friends and some followers even. He has a good side its just a matter of time until we see it

[iron loom]

Final arc: Blackbeard after being defeated by Luffy is going to go back in time to take over Luffys body

[normal quail]

i think my favorite theory of D clan is that the D represents a half moon (literally, it is a semi circle) and the people with the D in their name are direct descendants of the first people originally deemed to be people of the half moon. i think imu had some sort of truce with the people of the full moon (people fully from the moon originally) and promised to leave them alone if they never came down to the planet. so when the people of the half moon came to exist imu despised them because essentially certain people from the moon decided to descend to the planet and ended up reproducing with the humans, and in order to keep track of all of the people of the half moon they were given the middle initial D which is what half of the moon (a circle) looks like. i also believe that minks would technically be classified as D clan members being people of the half moon, but they retained genes making them closely resemble people of the full moon (which are just weird looking creatures and animals) but retaining more humanoid features. since they look more like people of the full moon they are never given the middle initial D but are persecuted by humans because they arent supposed to be on the planet anyways. i dont think zuneshas curse was necessarily to walk the seas for eternity and nothing else, but was cursed to carry an island full of the minks (seen as people of the full moon who broke the truce to never come to the planet). since zunesha was a companion of joyboy he was meant to have been killed but either was unkillable at the time (too massive and tough or something, and over time he weakened) or had a "deal" made, so as punishment for trying to protect these people of the moon he is doomed solely to carry an island for them to inhabit in order for them to be allowed to exist, and should he die or something then the minks would be erased from the world.

[normal quail]

the sulong form is exactly what its described as, a primal instinct. essentially they are calling to their home. but i think that alone wouldnt bring out sulong as we see it, rather the willpower of the half moon people brings out greater power. what im basically saying is that the half moon people themselves are the dawn or change in the world. they represent and embody liberation, and the power/hope instilled by joyboy to the original people of the half moon became embedded in their bloodline and therefore all descendants. not necessarily in the form of strength but inherent determination to see through to the dreams they desire, and that factor combined with minks' primal attachment to the visible full moon allows them to take the sulong form which as we know closely resembles luffys gear 5 form. now back to full moon people if you look at all of the little minion guys they literally look like chopper in base form, the only difference being that chopper is a reindeer. so there is some kind of devil fruit that returns the user to the original form of their ancestors (full moon people), and his many forms can also be explained by looking at the people on the moon that look unique from the many minions. the little guys are the initial form of all full moon people and eventually they gain their own unique form and can likely take on unique forms at will based on what power they are desiring. and this takes me to my next big point, which is that the original half moon people (D clan) are the ones that brought devil fruits into existence by imagining them. the power of gear 5, or the sun god nika, is to bring imagination to life. the original nika was not a devil fruit user, that was just the power he had. he knew at some point that he was going to have to leave this world and the half moon people would be on their own, so he bestowed a great power onto them which allowed them to bring their imagination to life but not in the same way nika does.

[elfin tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/luffy-gordo-luffy-gordinho-gif-25125796

[normal quail]

they imagined a power they wanted or something they wish they could do, and at some point that would manifest as a devil fruit. the very first half moon people bestowed this power had the absolutely height of this "wishing power," and were able to wish for something as powerful as the power of the sun god. for each generation of the half moon people, the power of things they could wish for grew weaker until they eventually could not bring any wish into existence. this also explains why some devil fruits are utterly worthless while many are godly, and why people cant still wish for devil fruits. back to what i said about chopper, i think someone knew about the full moon people and wished to become their original intended form and then in the current story chopper ate that devil fruit. its not the human devil fruit but exactly the opposite. the full-moon-species devil fruit (whatever the name of the species is). hes not tapped into peak human understanding as many people think, but the innate power of the devil fruit is to "return to original form" or something like that.

now i dont necessarily think that them just wishing simply brought the devil fruits into existence. in fact the power of the wishing was too great and needed to be contained so the forest god "tamed devils," or in other worths forced these wishes to manifest as devil fruits. either that or every new power that came from a wish, it was forced into the form of a devil fruit. this contained and also weakened the power, and awakenings are just the user tapping into the original full power of when it was wished into existence whish is most clear with luffys gear 5 resembling the sun god. the sea god then added an additional "nerf" to these powers by refusing any user of a devil fruit to roam in the sea gods domain, aka refusing their ability to swim in the sea.

the sun god essentially wanted to liberate all moon people on the planet that the half moon people originated on. the sun bringing harmony between the moon and the earth (or whatever the planet is called).

the half moon people are simply the bridge between the humans and moon people, but a bridge nobody asked for. so in a way the half moon people were meant to liberate and connect all species, but in the end they fight to even liberate themselves.

[normal quail]

i would like to clarify that when i say my favorite theory of d clan is that it represents a half moon, it was not a preexisting theory to my knowledge and i got these ideas after watching a grandlinereview video where liam made a joke about the capital letter D looking like a half moon

everything after that was also just my own theories

[tacit mirage]

We all know Luffy wasnt supposed to eat the Nika fruit, but what was Shanks' (and the former Roger pirates) original plan supposed to be for it?

I believe that Shanks was going to combine the Nika fruit with the Straw Hat itself in an attempt to resurrect Joyboy.

[sudden pollen]

It’s generally theorized he was saving it for Ace. Roger mentioned how the One Piece is meant for the next generation as they were “too early”. It’s also believed Roger attempted to pass the role onto his son, that is why he had a child at the time he did rather than earlier in his life.

But we don’t know for sure

Shanks knew that Luffy inherited Roger’s will through his dream. Although I’m not sure if that was before or after he gave him the fruit.

[topaz rune]

bruh yall writing whole of wano script in the chat

[stiff patrol]

I just realized.. we know that Luffy wants to set Loki free to know more about Shanks and where he is, but have we ever seen the full deal before.? Back in chapter 1132 where Luffy first met Loki, they made a deal, and we all assumed that Luffy might free Loki so he could get more info on Shanks since, that was kinda the whole point--
But looking at the situation now with Luffy being on board with getting banished from Elbaph just to free this man..
What the hell could've happened in their first encounter for Luffy to take such measures?😭

You could argue he's being reckless again, but like... he's straight up worried for the guy who was known for killing their own father from other giants' perspectives, and upon these rumors, Zoro has every right to be worried and on-edge as he currently is

Idk, the whole situation just feels a bit... off.
I'm still on board with trusting Loki and thinking that maybe he's not such a bad person(although, the situation here and with more context about him is putting him to actually being one, so I'm a bit mixed on that), but I'm also having mixed feelings with Luffy's decision here..

I want to think that maybe this could be some sort of sign of what Arnot meant about staying in Elbaph for a long time, but I highly doubt it

Over all, the argument between Luffy and Zoro and with Luffy freeing Loki gave me Baron Omatsuri vibes for whatever reason.
Probably because Loki's freedom is Luffy's problem now, pfft--

Spoilers if you haven't watched the movie: ||And probably also because of the whole thing about the movie is breaking up 'friendship' part of the strawhats and ultimately getting them all to argue with one another and the fact that I remember Sanji (i think it was him) once telling Luffy that going into the island was his fault. So uhm....||
||y a h--||

Those are just my thoughts so far tho

[hardy trench]

doubt we'll be getting into that kind of situation here but it would be really really cool

[lone plaza]

anyone have a close to accurate theory on what loki's fruit is?

[iron current]

how would that work if we havent seen him do anything yet

[vocal glen]

Hello, I’ve come up with a theory about a specific character’s devil fruit, but I just want to make sure it was cool to post it, I don’t want to break any rules that I may not know about

[winter ocean]

Provided it’s not spoiling next chapter, you can post it

[vocal glen]

Uhh it definitely doesn’t spoil next chapter I will post it thank you

Well frick it’s too long I don’t have nitro

[proud crystal]

Just break it up into parts and post it in multiple messages. Nothing wrong with that.

[stiff patrol]

I once saw someone theorize that his fruit could potentially be a zoan due to some claw marks we see on the background of the throne room in one of the previous chapters
So maybe something like that.?-

But over all, I got nothin on that
Can't wait to find out, though

[fierce thorn]

Ok I've worked out the reason/the mechanism how usopp will be one of the greatest warriors on Elbaph and yet still not change his character.

The answer is simple Alcohol.

It just hit me, that Usopp is drunk. We've never seen Usopp on mission whilst drunk before and he seems a lot more confident in this state, if confidence in himself was what held him back before more than anything. Then the lack of concern atm due to being drunk might make him actually over powered in a way meaning he could do everything he needs to be a brave warrior of the sea in a traditional way and then wake up with a huge hangover not remembering what he did as the classic usopp we all love.

Usopp becomes great warrior, and he hasn't changed at all.

[quaint haven]

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/15kFufe4Xv/

[short sun]

Im sure you’ve all heard of the one piece being a manga/comic book theory already, but I think I found oda foreshadowing it back in the sbs of chapter 232, volume 25 (the same volume where he foreshadowed the new 4 yonko.

Someone asks “Why is it that in the manga world people always understand whatever language is being spoken no matter where they go?” and Oda responds with “Because manga is about people’s dreams.” The way he responds with this isnt like his usual joking manner that he uses during sbs and its just a one liner (maybe to not have it too obvious?)

[quaint haven]

Iv been rewatching one piece from start to finish. Currently in dressrosa. Who remembers this little scene describing the King of the tontana 900 years ago..... looks like a awfully familiar silhouette of blackbeard don't ya think

[short sun]

idk how a df for him would even work, hes only known as strong, no special powers

[short sun]

I see the vision

[quaint haven]

This was described as a member of doffys family. I always thought doffy could be a D due to him always smiling.

Maybe blackbeard is related to his family. Far fetched theory I know but oda isn't silly. He did that silhouette deliberately

An I know what ul say, odas silhouettes are never accurate. But to choose one that's extremely similar to blackbeard is a potential early clue

That would satisfy the special bloodline

Anyone seen any good theories on potential Nika or joyboys decendants? It's not too far fetched to suggest there could be living relatives of joy boy or nika. And just because your a decendant of these legends doesn't imply you are "good"

[loud arch]

My guess would be all of his lies would be true. 10 ton strength. 10,000 men. Etc

[drifting yew]

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZNde29CeK/

What do you guys think about that? Seems logical

[white bronze]

A few chapters ago, the Holy Knights said, "Are we visiting King Harald's grave?"

King Harald had removed his horns so he wouldn't remember the wars and wanted Elbaf to become a peaceful country.

So, I assume that Elbaf wanted to join the World Government, but the WG insisted, "Loki must become a Holy Knight," or something along those lines.

They even tried to force Loki to become a Holy Knight.

Loki refused, and when they tried to do it by force, he defended himself, which could explain the current state of the castle.

That's my theory.

{ sorry if you are having an stroke ]

[storm swift]

i really dont think it makes sense if he really wanted the mark gone he would have done it Years ago or just removed the mark itself

[drifting yew]

Yeah probably. I don't think that shanks losing his arm is really a big thing that has been planned out from the beginning

[storm swift]

Oda didnt even want to have Shanks arm cut off that was the editors idea

[final bloom]

but now it lowk makes sense

[vague robin]

random theory with almost no evidence but what if gunko’s related to imu

she’s said to not be a celestial dragon, but somehow became part of the holy knights

and, aside from that one giant child who drew nika in the latest chapter, she and imu are some of the only people who fear nika and are this closely related to the world government

also she has those freaky ass eyes

[toxic sorrel]

But imu is a celestial dragon

How would that work

[slate jasper]

For some reason her being scared of Nika had me for a hot second wondering if she was Luffy's mom

[analog yacht]

guys , imu is very careful and kind of knows who the dangerous people are gonna be as we saw him stabbing luffy shirahoshi and bb posters.. and he also asked to take vivi hostage most prob cuz her link to lily..... but if imu is being so careful why didnt he do that when vivi visited the reverie during her childhood, idk ...am i wrong somewhere??

i have too much freetime ig

[analog yacht]

ya she may be related somehow... but i hear some dumb ppl saying she is imu...lmao i mean.. i dont think imu will be the guy to tolerate bein ordered by shamrock.. why would imu be working his ass off , he can just chill and i bet hes chilling thinking abt lily in his garden... but yea ig he is related to gunko somehow too

[analog yacht]

idk i heard somewhere that oda mentioned that he had alredy shown luffys mom somewhere and i dont think gunko has appeared before this.. so i dont think and ig she aint that old , but we never know

[livid anchor]

ive seen that theory in a different way just recently actually, some people think Gunko could be a satellite of Imu's, ala Vegapunk and his satellites. I dont know if I necessarily agree with that but it seems more possible than just straight up being Imu

But I still think shes like a descendent of Imu or another Nerona

[dusky acorn]

Why is it that Sommers brings up how both parties in a given context end up getting hurt and scarred by the act of "love"?
Is it in reference to the teachers and their students?

But then why does he direct the question onto Gunko for confirmation, as if she has experience / knowledge in this aspect?
I wonder if he was expecting her fear to be related to that notion of getting scarred by loving, too.

This potentially supports my hypothesis of Gunko being the girl Kid loved and apparently died, in the past.
Victoria got hurt and broke their friendship, while Kid and his partner have a most hated food due to her, and trauma in their past thanks to believing she died without being able to save her.

I wonder if this nightmare fruit could reawaken past trauma. It would be interesting to see it used on a supposed-to-be fearless conqueror type character.

@desert quest @cobalt igloo @slate burrow

Luffy for example, his biggest fear isn't running out of meat. If this fear fruit is the real deal and can even reawaken latent feelings and memories, then it would be the Akainu that ripped a hole through Ace

[cobalt igloo]

I was wondering how her fear of Nika could tie into the possibility of her being Victoria. Maybe she fears the life or freedom she could have had if her home island had been liberated by Nika. Or maybe she fears meeting Kid again, and because Kid “liberated” their island by defeating the criminal gang it could be that she attributes nika (freedom) to him

[vague robin]

i like this theory but the only thing causing me to have any doubts about it would be her fear of nika

[dusky acorn]

Well, if the oddly surname-lacking Gunko was originally a non-Celestial Dragon but got a "miracle" to be crowned as a godly figure like Garling did with York, then it makes sense to fear Nika though.

Nika exists to destroy the exact existence she thought was a miracle of a life opportunity to live in. It would reverse everything she chose and believed in.

She would have been better off even being a slave, since Nika would have meant saving her. "Gunko" is so far gone in this path that she has no choice but to fear Nika now, that's what I believe.

The only instance she wouldn't fear Nika is if she's like a 12-13 year old Law, and could still be saved. I believe she's more like a Doffy at this point, beyond saving

[ionic kelp]

I just had an idea and I don't know if its been done before. if any youtubers, except anime no mi, (fuck you specifically) want to make a video on it if it seems credible to all yall, I would love that

so basically, you know what the time period directly before the void century was called? "The Era of Slaves". and who ruled the world back then. some creeps called "Devils". and there sure has been a lot of demonic iconography lately between the pentagram summoning signs, the tattoos on the god knights, this gave me the idea that maybe, the 20 kings and Joy Boy were originally allies against the devils, but Joy Boy was betrayed in a power grab at the end, which led Lili to distance herself from the remaining monarchs. What if Imu was actually a devil that promised them power in exchange for betraying Joy Boy? that would also set up some interesting real world parallels between this ancient past and real world resistance to colonial occupation, where many times the leaders of the resistance are betrayed for the personal gain of someone they trusted and their oppressor

[opaque yew]

Anyone else have thoughts on why Nightmare Loki was holding King Harald's sword?

[jagged steppe]

I believe that Dark Nika is gonna be Blackbeard

[opaque yew]

I had that thought too, he's literally a warrior of liberation

Except he released a bunch of psycho murderers after making them kill each other

[jagged steppe]

His fruit is practically the same as Luffy's, aka Nika model

[ionic kelp]

for a long time I was hoping he and Luffy would put aside their differences temporarily to fight the world government given how much they have in common despite everything, but the fact Teach wants in with the WG makes it so that unless this is another con, thats not happening lol

[analog yacht]

ic

[fierce thorn]

Teach is looking to over throw the WG and all his pieces to do so are nearly in order. I don't think Imu will survive BB

[pure raven]

Ok, remember how old these giant children are. One child says "my mommy" and in the spread we see in the right corner a woman that looks a bit like Big Mom, and a cloud that looks alot like Zeus

[rich quarry]

I could buy it that these giant children when thinking of their moms in a scary form would think of big mom. But we do know that she does not have any giant biological children right?

[livid anchor]

I think so. That was the little plot point during WCI of her wanting to marry someone off to a Giant so she could get there blood in the family, IIRC

[analog yacht]

ya thatswhy she asked ceaser to make children giants... she didnt have any relations with giants so idont think his mom is big mom

[vast sigil]

Love this theory

[keen trellis]

to further invest in my gunko is kuina theory, this arc’s theme seem to be about conquering fears, what if Zoro’s fear would be the realization of Kuina still being alive which questions his point of even attempting his goal anymore

[uneven finch]

Gunko is a martial artist though, not a swordswoman.

At least as far as we have seen*

[keen trellis]

No one in One Piece has been more determined than Zoro, his determination is what makes him who he is, all the sacrifices he’s made throughout the series was all due to that one promise he made when he was a child, Kuina being alive wouldn’t just be for some shock value, it would challenge Zoro’s mindset and everything he stood for up to this point. By overcoming this obstacle, he would be achieving this dream not for someone else but for himself

i think giving Zoro a proper arc in the final saga as well would just makes sense since he is the 2nd lead of the story

also giving one of the most fearless characters to have something to actually fear when actually raise the stakes for this arc, leaving characters like Usopp to have to be the hero for once

[keen trellis]

yea i think she gave up on that goal a long time ago

also this could be ironic foreshadowing, but Zoro saying him becoming the greatest swordsman would reach to the heavens so Kuina would know could basically be Mary Geiose, where Kuina is basically considered a “God’s” Knight

[cedar saddle]

The bearded nika must be pointing to something important
We see the children drawing on nika and fenrir
Fenrir is almost 1 to 1 while nika is changed drastically
I have a feeling this might be oda foreshadowing something important

To people saying that it is just a childs imagination ignore it,
As far as we know the mural was also 'just a childs imagination' like how ripley said to franky but that didnt stop nobody from disecting that.

[mighty moon]

The nika isn't changed drastically it just got a mouth compared to the drawing plus it probably through the kids fear/nightmare to make it more "life like"

[earnest pecan]

Imu sama. Man or woman. Vote your answer here.

[lunar acorn]

imu and 5 elders are/were drawings and kids imaginations manifested

[spiral berry]

Pradcam that make no sence if luffy is niki

[hybrid rune]

I was thinking about a parallel between our world and the One Piece World which is that the Celestial dragons killed off the races who worshiped Nika and the other gods just as the English and Spanish did to the Native Americans when they went to the New World

[fast goblet]

Colonization might be a theme here in Elbaf too since its obviously based on the Norse who were pantheists until the church converted them to Christianity. Elbaf worships Nika but the WG has very Christian theming associated with it, plus with Harald (who might have been working with the Holy Knights) attempting to change the culture Elbaf

[hybrid rune]

true and I rlly rlly think that Kind Harald is a bad person

and that's why Loki killed him

[pure raven]

Yeah I think so too. He was definitely framed

[clever lintel]

I'm not sure about Harald being a bad guy given that he gave refuge to Saul and the recovered books of Ohara.

If he truly was a sell out, then he would have turned in Saul and had the books destroyed.

It may be a circumstance where Harald went to the holy land like Otohime but came back posessed by Imu's powers.

Maybe the claw marks in the castle were from him transformed into a monster rather than it being from Loki. Perhaps the posession ended when Loki dealt the fatal blow and Harald returned to normal as he bled out. Harald asked Loki to promise to protect Elbaph from going to war 14 years too early. Then Loki decided to frame himself as a murderer to hide the truth of what the wg did.

[cold seal]

Is the name miss wednesday inspired from wednesday addams

[iron current]

I mean the females in the team all had day names, like Miss All Sunday

[dire compass]

wasn’t that after his killing?

[hardy trench]

nah harald died 14 years ago, saul and the books came shortly after ohara

[clever lintel]

And Ohara incident happened 22 years ago.

[earnest pecan]

what if the meaing D is just 🌅. The D on its side

[rugged pollen]

i dont know where i read this theory but im a big fan of the idea that the name of the ancient kingdom was "Many Joys" as a homophone for Marie Jois

[clever lintel]

I kinda think it's going to be Atlantis given the flooding but it could be a lot of things.

It's probably going to be something that gives new context to the story like Ace being Roger's son, Momo being sent forward 20 years, the world is flooding, etc.

[cosmic ermine]

Eden

[pure raven]

I think Elbaph will be our very serious set up for the end of the story, but we’re probably going to get a silly arc after this to lighten the landing before the final arc. My guess is this arc will end after a clash between Luffy and the Holy Knights displays enough proof to Loki to join the Straw Hat Fleet as the new captain of the New Giant Pirates. Vivi and co will reunite with a nice reunion and reveal between Skopper and Big News Morgan.

Unfortunately this will be met with simultaneous news that Shanks crew likely being defeated by Blackbeards crew and we might not ever get our fateful reunion that Luffy was hoping to get here on Elbaph.

The next arc will then be Straw hats and a Davvy back fight against the Cross-Guild who block their path to the end of the grand line. Cross guild will lose and assimilate into the Straw Hat Fleet while Blackbeard will set up for the final battle where the winner will get to go ahead and take on Imu to fight for the fate of the world.

That’s my guess for where we will be ~ 3 years from now

[prime magnet]

Has anyone ever brought up the theory that maybe the straw hat is part of what Roger saw that made him laugh and that’s why all they could do WAS laugh at home funny it was that the one thing they needed they gave away for FREE to inspire someone else to live FREE

[lethal island]

Pretty nice, I’ve been so badly wanting a Davy back fight with the cross guild or the red hair pirates

[iron current]

Even though it's proven wrong by Oda?

[uneven lion]

Anyone have any ideas what this means? I’ve just been thinking about it for the past few weeks

[cunning iron]

A lot of people have been sharing their thoughts and ideas about this ever since this chapter got out, so yeah many people have their own ideas about what it could mean 😅

[vast sigil]

Those are silly pictures made by children, no deep meaning

[cunning iron]

Imagine if it was made by an adult with very low drawing skills? 😂

[gentle holly]

new theory
luffy's destroying elbaf with loki

not the most behind it but
but Ragnor from Loki which is lightning
Red Roc from Luffy which is fire

legit already said weaknesses and luffy almost always makes a mess of the island he's on

[gentle holly]

hope not for that middle

i want that reunion so bad

[keen trellis]

thinking one piece will end in 2029

[tepid fable]

thats pretty soon ngl

[gentle holly]

i just dont see it that soon

[tepid fable]

yeah, same

[gentle holly]

see it closer to be in the 2030's at the least

[keen trellis]

yea back in 2019, oda estimated it would end in 2025

[gentle holly]

he's been saying that

lmao

like saying "fires hot"

[tepid fable]

haha def was a bit off 😭

[iron current]

so you think he can end it in like 120-140 chapters

[keen trellis]

around chapter 1320-30 or so

[gentle holly]

Oda's still got the whole of elbaph
still got whatever BB is up to and the whole of that
then the joyboy BS
One Piece ITSELF
Imu and WG

thats way long than that

basically saying the whole of Wano+ a bit is the whole final arc

[iron current]

thats 190 chapters

[gentle holly]

with no breaks or real pauses for a bit of time

[iron current]

thats at least 2031

[gentle holly]

mid to late 2030's is my guesstimate

i dont think we have another 1k chapters in us

[iron current]

impossible

[gentle holly]

unless Oda hits us with a fucking banger next few arcs

[keen trellis]

that’s unless oda goes back to around 40 chapters year which has been the usual it’s just these past few years have been in between that

oda has been on a roll so far this year

[iron current]

sure, but he is also not getting younger

[gentle holly]

already had to stop for health issues a couple times

and showed some... strange issues with publishing chapters inconsistantly

but maybe just me not here for previous strange messups

[keen trellis]

well i think we got 2 arcs left that being elbaf and the final war

[gentle holly]

hold up

2 arcs

[keen trellis]

yep

[gentle holly]

1 being Elbaph

[keen trellis]

correct

[gentle holly]

thats kinda insane

[keen trellis]

not really this would still be the longest saga

[gentle holly]

there'd have to be 3 at least

not counting anything ELSE

besides that we also have Lodestar, the final island

[keen trellis]

elbaf i think is gonna be around egghead length maybe a lil longer

[keen trellis]

those are definitely not gonna be arcs to themselves

[gentle holly]

so what, lodestar is not only BB but also final war
but ALSO joyboy
BUT ALSO One Piece????

[keen trellis]

yeah final arc would likely be very long

those are all endgame stories

[gentle holly]

you are basically saying to take the whole of OP before the finish of reverse mountain arc
and MORE

as a single saga, damn near that many plot points

just bc endgame stories does not mean all one arc

[keen trellis]

huh

have you seen wano?

[gentle holly]

yeah

and wano
was a single island

[iron current]

Wano basically played in a single area, sure you could make the argument for Onigashima but thats basically part of Wano

[gentle holly]

aye

[keen trellis]

and what are yall saying lodestar and ??

[gentle holly]

lodestar, the final island

its the "final" island before you get to reverse mountain/red line

pretty much is the last stop before the OP
from what I've picked up

your saying:

• lodestar
• BB crew / Pirate Island
• WG and Imu BS
• One Piece
• possibly heading to marijoa

not counting more

[iron current]

personally im not convinced about Loadstar, but Laugh Tale, Hachinosu, i feel like we might go back to the Red Line eventually

[gentle holly]

which maybe also the ancient weapons too

since BB knows of 2 of them now

[keen trellis]

elbaf very much seems to be the last arc where the crew is gonna be really settling and adventuring on

[gentle holly]

that i can somewhat believe
but even if not, thats stupid amounts to cram into a single arc

not to mention Revolution army also supposedly
maybe making a play

(i stg if they dont )

[keen trellis]

like i said the final arc i think would be very long like 3 years

[gentle holly]

for sure probably one of the longest arcs in the series

[keen trellis]

are you referring to hachinosu for the bb pirate island?

[iron current]

Yes

[keen trellis]

yea i dont think we going there

we already witness a big battle in there

i doubt we seeing another one

[gentle holly]

reason i put it as BB crew / Pirate island

as its either a fight with them on pirate is;and or somewhere else

[keen trellis]

yea the somewhere else is probably where the final war is happening which is either lodestar or laughtale

maybe mary geoise idk

[robust bough]

#manga message

[keen trellis]

i very much think it’s going to be one big brawl with everyone

[keen trellis]

and that’s my THEORY

[robust bough]

then we're connected through vegapunk records?

[keen trellis]

oh wait i thought you were trying to move the convo

[prime magnet]

I don’t like this “black Nika” theory everyone is throwing around about Blackbeard right now because of the nightmare Nika that just appeared

[keen trellis]

i like it since there’s nothing else blackbeard could really represent in prophecies

[cunning iron]

Me neither, the chapter itself never mentions a "black Nika", there's only one, just that some giants in Elbaph believe he brings destruction or he's a savior but it's the only one Nika they're referring to

[keen trellis]

i like the idea of Blackbeard being the actual nika that is told in stories as a fear

[cunning iron]

It doesn't make any sense to me so far

[keen trellis]

while luffy is the nika described as the hope

since it depends on different cultures in the world, there’s different interpretations of nika

so luffy and blackbeard representing different interpretations of nika would be kinda dope

[cunning iron]

This distinction between "two" Nikas only lies on the misinterpretation of what the Harley text says because it's written in ancient language and no one can know for sure if Nika is savior or destructor, that's all

[keen trellis]

if you at believe in the theory of Nika not actually being real but more of an idea of hope or fear

As like in real life for religion with multiple interpretations

[keen trellis]

i just don’t know where blackbeard would fit in with these prophecies

[cunning iron]

I don't see why he'd have to fit, for me Nika is the "warrior of liberation" and more specifically the person who ate the df "model Nika", so Luffy now. Blackbeard isn't a second Nika for me, he's another character that's all.
About the prophecy, it seems logic to me that when Nika brings freedom to the people, it implies destroying what was enslaving them, a bunch of people or a system. I mean, Luffy did fight and defeated Kaido, this way he "destroyed" what Kaido had built in Wano for years and it brought liberation and freedom to the people of Wano.
I don't see any contradiction between destruction and liberation from this point of view, and so that's why I refuse to believe there are two different Nika.

[keen trellis]

yea u prob right and i will retract on some of my nika statements, but i will say blackbeard could be still be a feared version of nika even if its not the correct interpretation of him, since blackbeard and luffy have similar ideals mainly being freedom, but that freedom can be used for good or bad

even if he isn’t the actual nika, he could become one with the power he gains

[cunning iron]

I don't know what he's gonna become but definitely not the "warrior of liberation", he has slaves on Hachinosu lol he just wants to replace Imu as the king of the world basically

[hexed obsidian]

maybe he is the black nika as child drew

[keen trellis]

an unstoppable force that could overthrow imu and the government for freedom but use it for bad use, like yes he’s very much gonna be a hypocrite that’s with most villains storyline’s who believe their doings are for good when it really isnt

[eager sedge]

YO

[keen trellis]

i believe the final showdown will be luffy vs blackbeard, deciding the use of freedom

[normal quail]

i believe chopper ate one of the very first zoan fruits to exist

but i don't necessarily think it's just a human fruit

i think it has something to do with the people of the full moon

the identical tiny space people look exactly like chopper just without reindeer traits

copper base form

and the many forms could have something to do with some of the space people appearing more matured or fully formed

like they grow up and change or develop a different appearance and maybe the matured moon people can change to different forms similarly to chopper but its about desire, the desire for a specific benefit from a specific form

so i think choppers fruit could be "human fruit model (original/full-moon-species)" or yk something along those lines

whatever the name of the full-moon species is

like if the full-moon people species was for example called "alien" then it would be "human fruit model alien"

although it might be kinda similar to luffys fruit where its a false categorization, and it might not be a human fruit at all but just a zoan for the original forms of their ancestors and so it could be BELIEVED to be just the human fruit because a majority of the previous users, unlike chopper, knew about this fruit before consuming it and therefore believed it to be just a simple human fruit whereas chopper, as a less intelligible species and not even knowing what it was, ate this fruit and actually felt its true power with no pre-established influence of what its power actually are

so choppers base form is also the original form of the full-moon people before they mature/develop into fuller creatures, although there other full-moon people with more developed appearances i think the little ones can transform into different forms but mostly maintain their base form, and theres some of them that end up having a specific form as a more permanent base form either from chance or from using that form for very long and eventually adapting to it as to never be able to return to the small form

or maybe like i said its a desire thing, they deeply and truly desire another more permanent form and upon using it for long enough that desire manifests into the reality

all the forms chopper is able to take on could be manifested purely by his desire but he sees the forms more as tools for him, something he can access for benefits rather than assuming a more permanent role

and here is more crazy theorizing

i think its foreshadowing that robin is obsessed with chopper

of all the straw hats chopper has the deepest connection to ancestral history and the origins of the people of the current day

bc of his devil fruit

of course luffy and the nika fruit but i think thats also meant to distract everyone from another historically significant crew member

so robin being obsessed with chopper is a fat clue for chopper being insanely significant to the history of the world

robin is "fascinated" with chopper (fascinated being used to vaguely say she finds him super cute and adorable) also and "fascinated" with history (archaeologist not only as her role on the crew but her actual dream and passion, and shes the only person alive who can organically read the poneglyphs)

i dont think chopper and the minks are actually connected in any way but i think while chopper has become a manifestation of full-moon ancestors, minks are half-moon people that kept creature-like appearances (and theres half-moon people who kept human-like appearances, who are otherwise known as "D clan members")

so half-moon people = D clan members, but minks were never labeled as D clan because their appearances made them viewed as full-moon people because full-moon people are creatures. full-moon people came down and reproduced with humans therefore creating half-moon people aka D clan members and minks, but the ones resembling humans had to be differentiated from regular humans so they are permanently slapped with the middle initial D (the letter D looks like a semi-circle, aka half of the moon) and minks dont require that differentiation because full-moon people were never meant to come down to the planet in the first place so the minks are simply considered traitors that deserve discrimination for "invading"

ive already kinda somewhat covered my theory about this stuff so u can read it from here --> #manga-theories message

[clever lintel]

I wonder if Killingham dozing off is him going into the dreams of children and deciding what to materialize.

What if Usopp could jump into the dream world and lead the children into materializing a giant version of Usopp to defeat the nightmares.

[stiff patrol]

Is anyone else also getting the feeling that Nika used to be an ancient giant, or is it just me?
It's just a thought, but i guess you could say it's cus of the reputation he has in Elbaph and also having the words "warrior" in the title, but that could just be me having G5 brainrot again-

Oh, and another I've been wanting to mention for a while now--
I have a very huge feeling Whitebeard was a buccaneer...
It's mostly how his chin looks very similar to Kuma's and how big he is--

[pure raven]

You probably right on nika being a giant im almost certainly sure he was, but we’ll just have to wait and see

[stiff patrol]

Yea

[simple orbit]

@normal quail I always figured Chopper ate the Mythical Zoan Tanuki Tanuki fruit. That’s why they always call him a raccoon-dog. One of the nicknames for it is just that. Also Tanuki were known as tricksters and shape shifters in Japanese mythology which could be choppers different forms and he might unlock the ability to do it without medicine.

[ruby ingot]

Also the giant hat Imu was looking

[stiff patrol]

Yea, that was mostly why I was thinking of that possibility, too-

[stiff knot]

guys I have a theory what if the will of 'd' is debt. like a debt because they stood against the government or something like that?

[silk dock]

so the celestial dragons were taught to be afraid of people with debt?

[silk dock]

tanuki frui exists and a teapot in sukiyaki’s home ate it

[quaint haven]

Yeah I think the hat imu has is nikas hat not joy boys

An with regards to choppers devil fruit that definitely isn't just a basic human fruit no chance.

Nothing about chopper is remotely human 🤣

I have no theories on what it could be though. But i do agree its not just human

[hexed obsidian]

It is a kid kid fruit zoan type for chopper

[spring saffron]

Void Century theory:

A powerful kingdom once ruled the world. It was highly advanced with knowledge and technology beyond what exists today. It promoted unity, free will, and a connected world without borders. 20 kingdoms saw this as a threat. They wanted to keep their power so they declared war against the great kingdom. The leader of the great kingdom, Joy Boy, fought back. The great kingdom lost. Before its destruction, it recorded its history on the pone glyphs. Joy boy also left something on Laugh Tale --> meant for the future. After the war, the twenty kingdoms formed the world government. They erased all records of the great kingdom and banned research on the pone glyphs. When the scholars of Ohara tried to uncover the truth, the world government wiped them out. They fear what this history could reveal. If people knew the truth it could weaken their rule. The “Will of D” may stand for the “Will of Dawn” (as in awakening, rebirth, renaissance) a world free from oppression. Joy Boy’s plan was never finished.

[quaint haven]

Just had a idea. In the mural you see what looks like balls of energy being carried. What if those balls are actually the healing ability we see the tontana princess use to heal ppl

Probably isn't that, but food for thought

I'm rewatching dressrosa arc at mo an I forgot about that power

[gritty kite]

The only thing that makes sense is if he is a Bigfoot or yeti variant of the human fruit. He should have a pure human form where he looks like a completely normal human and he doesn’t. Every zoan user is supposed to have his original form, hybrid and the purely animal form where you can’t distinguish it from the real thing. Choppers human form looks more like a yeti, he even has fur.

Whatever this is, that should be his zoan variant.

[simple orbit]

Correct but if I’m not mistaken, the Tanuki is able to shape shift into any form. Even inanimate objects.

[simple orbit]

Do you have a source for that. I must’ve missed it

[spring saffron]

I think the One Piece contains the blueprint for using Poseidon's power with the Noah

[gentle holly]

snrk

[sudden heart]

Do you guys think it's safe to assume that Loki has Thor's hammer? Mulnier, I know it's spelled wrong but you all know what I mean.

[edgy cloak]

some variation yea

[sudden heart]

I wonder if his eyes were taken out because of the legend of Oden too.

[bright pollen]

theory time: In the Harley text and mural, the forbidden sun is the motherflame and was in the core of the earth. It's the source of life on the planet. when men started to abuse it's power and removed it, the core became unstable. It caused large scale volcanic activity. Lava infused with the motherflame's life giving powers spread across the planet. This lava ended up forming the redline aka the serpent of hellfire. Life energy infused lava also temporarily boosted the water that nature uses. Some of the trees grew into adam trees. Some trees directed the energy in to their fruits making devil fruits. People during the early era after the volcanic eruptions with the help of the unusual levels of exposure to life energy started mutating at accelerated rates. Some became giants, some grew wings etc.

So why would this happen? In the one piece World, to live is to dream. the power of life is also the power of dreams. This power is what originally not only brought life but gave people the power of haki. Now with unseen levels of exposure to this power, fruits which were brought to life, came to life according to the dreams of the people around them. Similar thing was happening inside the people. For example people living around the ever growing elbaf tree desired to grow as well to be able to utilise said tree effectively, so they started to grow taller and taller. With time this high level of life energy on the surface died down which stopped the development of new devil fruits and races.

Normally the life energy would spread when the core emits it towards the surface and it entering the circle of life through water, the thing life even in our world depends on. But since it was removed the water doesnt have as much life energy as it needs, so it forcibly pulls it out of people who have an unnatural form/amount of life energy in them aka devil fruit eaters. the world is in a chaotic state with it's life core removed as nature is slowly running out of life energy. It can only be fixed by returning the forbidden sun back to the core. This will bring the new dawn of the world just as the Harley says.

[mighty scroll]

I kinda like The idea of usopp getting some sort of Elbaphan hammer as a new weapon with how often he’s been shown with fake giant hammers, weather it’s Mjolnir or some other new hammer

[silk dock]

https://onepiece.fandom.com/wiki/Bunbuku

[dusky acorn]

"Captain" Kid's Heritage to "Captain" John, Contents of John's Legendary Treasure, and Kid's Weapon Dealings THEORY

After rereading many hundreds of One Piece chapters, I am now a firm believer in the theory that "Captain" Kid is the son of former Rocks Pirate, "Captain" John.

Kid and John Design Similarities

• Kid pre-timeskip and John both wear captain cloaks that resembles one another, both outlined & featuring squared button-ups.

• Child Kid and Captain John wear matching coloured, vertically striped pants. https://imgur.com/a/6wnIcKN

• Captain John has a fascination with treasure, as does Kid two years ago at least. Both are seen wearing VERY similar golden bracelets, coincidentally on both of their left arms.

• Despite John's spiky-ended hair mostly being very long to be able to lay flat, he has a distinct cowlick that stands straight up, just like "Jaggy", AKA Kid.

• A potential design of Kid existed in Oda's notes featuring Kid with his spiky hair laying flat, which would have resembled John even further.

• Both have hair colour with warmer colours as opposed to cool colours. Kid's red hair, and as for zombie John's hair.. it's a wilted pinkish colour.
  (Considering what happened to Denjiro's hair even with sheer anger, it's not entirely decisive what John's hair colour was like in his prime days though. It was likely a different, more vibrant colour.)

Shared Epithets

• As of now, Eustass "Captain" Kid and "Captain" John are currently the only two One Piece characters in existence who have this epithet. Why is that?

• Unlike many other Rocks Pirates including Rocks himself, John's surname is still undisclosed as of now, and room for the possibility of Eustass "Captain" John still persists.

• I believe in honor of his late father, Kid was the one that proclaimed the "Captain" epithet himself. Thus, this relation may be unknown to the world at large, just as Ace being Roger's son was hidden, and originally with Luffy being Dragon's son as well. This would explain Kaido and Big Mom's lack of mention about this connection.

Treasure Marker Similarities to Kid

Captain John's treasure marker bears strong resemblance to Kid, particularly Kid when he was a kid.

• The armband features 2 circles, which would symbolise Kid's circular goggles.
• The band symbolising Kid's goggle strap.
• The jagged spikes would represent Kid's actual hair, atop the goggles.

Is it possible that Captain John modelled the treasure marker after the look of his own son at the time?

Kid's Tattoo

• Eustass Kid and some of his crew-mates feature interesting tattoos on their shoulders. When combining both tattoos on each arm into one, it also resembles the treasure marker:

• Two circles to resemble the goggles.

• Two "U" shapes which form a circle to resemble the strap when combined.

• Spikes around each side, which match the spikes all around John's bracelet, when combined.

I've done a drawing to better represent what I mean as well, (please pardon the poor art-job.)

Known Info About John's Treasure

• Thanks to Buggy and his crew, what's known about Captain John's Treasure is that it's supposedly hidden within a cave, and one must dig inside the cave in order to claim it.

Sake Iron Ore

• When it comes to something valuable that can be found through digging, there IS something in One Piece found by excavation that seems like it could have a connection to John. --"Liquor Iron Ore". This is a rare metal befitting of Captain John, as he was a known drunk that would always get hammered, before and after death. Perhaps the name of this ore originated from Captain John and his hoard of it?

• If "Captain" Kid really is related to "Captain" John, then I hypothesise that "Kutzk Island", Kid's birthplace may be where Captain John could have left his legendary treasure.

• This would have included his gold (including bracelets we see Kid wearing).

• A stash of drunken iron ore

And as for my next hypothesis..

• Potentially even the Magnet-Magnet fruit, to make perfect use of the hoard of this special metal that would be within his cave!
  https://onepiece.fandom.com/wiki/Kutsukku_Island

• This would mean Captain John wasn't actually being stupidly greedy for himself. His strong resolve to even die in order to keep the treasure secret was actually for his son Kid to inherit.

• After all, Captain John is known for considering devil fruits as "treasure" too, by his own accord. He can be seen attempting to hunt the Paw and Dragon fruits on God Valley, to claim as part of his own treasure.

Eustass Kid's Black Market Connections

• Eustass Kid has connections to the black market. And although Kid states he isn't into weapons of mass murder such as Ceasar's deadly gas, what about other weapons? What about actual weapons that can be magnetised? Surely the magnet-magnet man would love those.

Although Kid states that Killer isn't one to deal on the market, that doesn't mean Kid isn't.

• In fact, it's very likely Kid is a prime dealer that has been involved in black market trading. After all, Kid's known hobbies include collecting weapons. And his real-life profession would also be a weapons dealer.

• Besides the Victoria Punk, Kid was even showcased having multiple of his own ships stationed at his hideout. What for? Potential supplying of special weapons, going by this theory.

Black Market Culprit

• Due to it being such a rare metal with such limited islands that contains it, Koala stated that who the culprit was behind the alcohol iron ore weaponry to Doflamingo and other nations at war was going to be uncovered.

• Meanwhile, Kid was already aware of Doflamingo's underworld position as Joker, and relation to Kaido. This is why I believe that Kid may have been the culprit responsible for all of these alcohol iron ore weapons he had been creating and dealing out himself.

• After all, it's not even like it truly strengthens Kid's enemies to dish out such strong weapons to Dressrosa and all around the world.

• Kid knows he has the perfect devil fruit to turn his own enemies weapons into strength of his own, even if he does encounter them. It would be a great benefit to Kid to scatter as many weapons as possible, especially if they would feature this high-quality, drunken metal that the drunken John would have left behind for Kid to uncover.

Kid's Future: Blackbeard's Raid on Balitgo

• Due to Burgess sneaking into Baltigo and having his whole crew raid it and take their weapons, including the drunken iron ore, this now makes Kid pose a greater threat to Blackbeard in the future. Or not necessarily fighting Blackbeard's crew, but sharing the same battlefield and utilising his weaponry which consists of the rare metal weapons that Kid may have originally put into circulation himself.

• As the series comes to a close, it would be very interesting to see Kid fight using materials that are more than just "scrap to begin with", utilising weaponry from this special drunken metal that he may very well have dished out all over the world on his own, after inheriting his father John's treasure.

Kid's Future: Interactions With Buggy

• As we know, Kid is currently furious with Buggy as an emperor, even moreso than Luffy. From the Marineford broadcast and Luffy's own opinion, Kid should know Buggy is supposed to be a joke that doesn't deserve his title.

• Meanwhile, Buggy would be incredibly interested in Kid, if he really is Captain John's son. Both of their investments in these respective characters, Kid to Buggy and Buggy to Captain John could lead to some interesting interactions between these two characters.

By the way, Buggy has seemingly either not found Captain John's treasure, or it was already claimed by the rightful heir Captain Kid if we go by this theory of it involving gold such as his own personal golden bracelets, the Magnet-Magnet fruit, and drunken iron ore.

If Buggy really did claim such a legendary treasure, then he should not have needed Crocodile's help to lend so much funds in order to start his Buggy Delivery business in the first place. Buggy claims to be low on income even in the present, and cannot afford to pay Crocodile back. Fitting for Buggy, as both the luckiest pirate of all time, and unluckiest pirate of all when it comes to claiming treasure.

@weak arrow @desert quest @cobalt igloo @craggy pumice @slate burrow @craggy pumice @cold thistle Please pardon me for doing what us Kid fans do best, derailing the chat with cultish greatness as always

[slate river]

Sogeking is luffy

(shocking)

[steep wolf]

Luffys dream is to fulfill everyone's dreams

( sorry for spoiling it not really a theory )

[young oar]

The left side of Jaya's jaw resembles the dragon and snake on the right mural of the island of the giants where the first and second worlds are discussed.

[lunar acorn]

guys I have a theory that the other side of Jaya flew to the sky and is still there

[jade breach]

wow

[night parrot]

Theories

Is it possible the iron giant was actually a race of people?

In the giant mural, Emet was present. The modern Emet would be Franky, no?

So is it possible, like franky, Emet was built into a robot/cyborg?

and further.

If franky is the modern Emet and can hold haki like Emet, would it be possible for franky to have figured out a way to become the ancient weapon itself? And/or maybe even be a thing where the sunny merge with franky power rangers style to become the Pluton?

And what if emet used to be the key to Pluton

Thus why franky chose to go the route he did

Because he saw the blueprints

[mighty moon]

No

Maybe

No pure robot

No cause Joyboy created a haki knot in emet in case of emergency but it uses the same principles as imbument like haki into swords and stuff but on a whole diffrent level

The Sunny will probably have some aspects of pluton

[night parrot]

Note: be easy on me, im a new one piece fan. Im caught up but i binge watched one piece so i may have missed some things

[mighty moon]

That's fine

Pluton was confirmed to be a ship in water 7

[night parrot]

Facts I remember that. But i also think franky’s innovativeness may have been overlooked. Ive been reading and watching theories and not many people in my algorithm really tackle the Pluton issue. The conversation just rests at the Sunny being Pluton, which I agree. But as I continue to see Emet, how Haki is being used, and other non-haki related things (those demon circles, the naming of new races, etc), maybe the Ancient Weapons in the Third World are upgraded/final form versions of what they used to be

I guess what im trying to say is,

I think Franky is the Pluton, and he needs to transform with the Sunny, similar to the mini robots and tanks and shit he got, to use its full power

[normal quail]

read the whole thing and i dont pay attention to kid or deeper world relations like the underworld and trade semantics, but this theory is fire

[sudden heart]

I have never heard of this theory. But Franky did ask if Luffy wanted him to build it and Luffy said no.

But the ancient weapon knowledge will be necessary in the future.

I do hope however that Franky takes Iron Pirate and the ship to make a mecha.

[pure raven]

Dragon Dragon fruit model: Nidhogg will be Loki's fruit perhaps

[cosmic ermine]

Copy-Copy Fruit

He'll copy Luffy's DF

and become the destroyer Nika and start ragnarok

[silk dock]

a ship once built in water 7, used in void century, then stored in old wano

any confirmation about the thing imu used mother flame for? was it uranus confirmed?

[mighty moon]

Probably Uranus not confirmed

[silk dock]

imu has 1 ancient weapon, luffy has 1 (shirahoshi is his ally), and nobody has pluton

however a new pluton can be rebuilt using franky’s blueprints

[mighty moon]

Franky burnt that

So probably the one in wano is going to get used

[raw scarab]

we dont know if Franky memorized them, and we also dont know if there is something difficult in building it.

still feel like pluton will come under BB control

[mighty moon]

chekhov's gun as you will

[frosty jewel]

I believe that the Sun God did not exist before the First World. It was mentioned that after the slaves 'touched' the Forbidden Sun, and prayed, the Sun God appeared. It may sound crazy but I think the 'Sun' they mention here, actually is the Sun God. As in the second world, it was said that they slew the Sun, which I believe indicates that it was a person. Finally the third world mention how the 'Sun' would return once more, which means it will no longer be in the Sun God form. You may be asking, why would the Sun only return in the Third World, well I believe the prayer from the slaves, was to be free, and the Sun God was not able to fulfil it till the Third World. The Sun God will return to the Sun and it will be whole again, they will surely meet again.

Don't flame me if it sucks, show mercy

[flat lagoon]

hmmmmmgfgfgfgfheweqkbfj well I think it's a valid theory, Sun God being the actual deity etc ... and coming in the first world, then coming as a df in the 2nd and third world. Kinda similar to something I had cooked ngl Pt1 #manga message Pt 2 #manga message Pt 3 #manga message why Imu is GoF/E : #manga message etc.

[frosty jewel]

oh no

im cooked

[flat lagoon]

u cooked

[frosty jewel]

🙏 thank god ill read all of urs rn

dude the third one is amazing, I watched so much Utubers and none of them had the idea of the mother flame possibly expiring

2nd one as well I agree with the og mother flame being the sun

well I'm in this server now so ill properly be apart of upcoming theories

[flat lagoon]

Bruh thanks lmao, I never ever fw Pootubers man they are lame af plus what they make is copied content from obscure forums etc. Some may even be lurking here n shiii.

[flat lagoon]

yes eternal flame, like literal sun being harvested or such a crazy powersource.

[buoyant stirrup]

Nika will end up being a comic strip character that got deitized

then black nika will be the enemy of Nika in the comic strip kind of like a white spy vs black spy

[hushed linden]

There’s an ancient city at the top of elbaf and it ties to the Birkans.

[iron loom]

Imu preserving Joyboys strawhat in cyrostasis to preserve the blood elements (DNA)

To attempt to replicate the Zoan as Vegapunk stated was possible.

[iron loom]

Joyboy was a slave who touched the forbidden sun.

[hushed linden]

Luffy will reach gear 6 mark my words

[ruby apex]

brilliant theory, lots of points were provided to support it

/s

[nocturne siren]

Yeah I think so too. 6 gears is pretty common in manual transmission cars. So is 5 though. But since he had to go gear 5 just to beat Kiado and this enables him being able to square up with even stronger opponents. But I think he will need to go up one more in order beat his final adversary.

[deft chasm]

Oda is gonna pull out the florian triangle monsters, they’re probably the only thing that had the entire crew freaked out, and they’re either gonna be background characters or main antagonists

[keen trellis]

“this is my peak”

[hearty charm]

this doesnt prove anything though

the awakening can be an entire branch of powers that facilitates a gear 6

especially if luffy gets an external powerup like eating the mother flame (you never know)

[hearty charm]

they were scared of the skypiea shadows but those were explained

[woeful summit]

makes sense. each gear allow him to push through his limits and the story will surely demand another upgrade for his final battle (against Imu?)

[dim gate]

You can argue that it translates to "this is a glimpse" of Nika's power

[keen trellis]

i can see him getting upgrades like gear 4 did with tank and snakeman

[cunning iron]

In a sense, Gear 5 is a state that lets Luffy do pretty much what he imagines possible. I doubt an hypothetical "Gear 6" could bring anything more than that. Whatever Luffy is gonna accomplish from now will be just Gear 5 but put in practice in more ways

[woeful summit]

It literally translates to "This is my highest point"

but it likely means "the highest point I've reached so far"

So if Oda wants to introduce gear 6, he could easily justify it by saying Luffy's perspective has changed, or he's found a new level beyond what he previously thought was his peak

[wise moss]

Maybe there could be a “reverse gear” within gear 5 or something but i dont have enough evidence to support that lol

[iron loom]

Yes, gear evil

[wise moss]

Oop

[distant berry]

Hi, I’m sorry for asking out of the (all) blue, my dad told me that the tree that grows the devil fruits is in the holy land. I kinda got mad because I haven’t read like the 3/4 latest chapters and I thought he spoiled it, has it been confirmed that is is or not?

[cosmic ermine]

Not confirmed and likely not true since we've seen a devil fruit manifest in the story in real time (punk hazard)

https://tenor.com/view/akuma-no-mi-gif-19411478

[distant berry]

That’s what I thought, I just had to make sure my dad was just joking and not actually trying to spoil me, thanks for the help 🙂

[worldly nexus]

ee

[chrome badger]

Was Imu at god Valley? if Saturn was there why not imu?

[worldly nexus]

we don't know yet

Maybe

Maybe not, who knows

[shadow kestrel]

Go Mu: 56. This seems like a hint to gear six imo.

[stiff patrol]

Not sure why, but--
With the way things are going rn in Elbaph, either:
A. We'll probably have the Strawhats going against their worst fears due to Qillingham(or Killingham's) 'devil fruit' <- (quotations since it's implied but not confirmed yet) and maybe that'll be the moment Ussop might just conquer his fears to be more braver than before.
Or B. Loki's release is going to cause some friction between Luffy and Ussop since this is Ussop's dream we're talking about here, so a part of me thinks he'll take it personally but I highly doubt it at the same time and maybe it could just be played off as a little gag.

Either way, I think it's safe to say that Ragnarok might come to fruition sooner than we thought

Loki's already hammering the tree and we haven't even seen what his devil fruit is, yet.
That special bounty placed on him was definitely no joke, the guy has some serious strength so far, especially with how easily he can still move even with injuries and a seastone cuff on his leg

On a side-note- as for Shanks, a part of me thinks he's not in good ties with the Figarland family in terms of communication.
I can still believe that he holds some authority due to his family bloodline, but a part of me thinks that the reason why he never spoke of his family is probably because he doesn't remember them as much-- or maybe he did encounter some sort of information about his family on his own time and didn't speak of it to anyone because of the reputation the Celestial Dragons and those who work for the World Government, have.

I've heard others (mostly Tekking) say that the reason why Shanks cried infront of Roger was because of Roger telling him about where he came from and who their real family is and, honestly, I can definitely go with this theory as well.
It could also make sense on why he was crying cus like, Shanks knew the Roger Pirates for so long and even almost considered them as family, so for little Shanks to find out that they're not his family would obviously be sould-crushing to hear that his actual family are a bunch of scumbags.

Anyways-- these are just the thoughts I have on some stuff currently knsnddnd

[unreal topaz]

highly doubt he has any authority because he returned once and went back, just like doffys family they won't let him back in

[dreamy sinew]

maybe probably not all straw hats the power might not affect people like luffy zoro sanji jimbei since they have strong haki

i think ragnarok has already started

[stiff patrol]

Yea, true-

[stiff patrol]

Actually, yea--

It definitely has

[dreamy sinew]

yeah

next chapter we will know where loki stands probably

[pure raven]

Loki probably wont succeed in Ragnorak right away. I think he's more concerned about getting payback for his forest friends.
But that probably means we're going to see Zoro and the Giant Pirates get wrecked
Loki likely wont even bother to remove the last seastone cuff and will run off with it still on
Sanji is likely to go looking for the Giant Pirates and Gerd and then take their side calling Luffy an idiot for trusting Loki
I think the Monsters will probably cause some massive damage
The Giant Children will get kidnapped and taken to the ship

Loki will then go to fight the Holy Knights only for them to give him the slip and leave him to be caught standing over a Pentagram
Luffy will offer to unlock Loki and tell him to stand down
But once the cuff is off we'll probably finally get to see his Devil Fruit powers.
Luffy wants to believe him but everyone else just blames him for the damage and probably working with the Holy Knights
The Giant population will generally be confused with some probably even blaming the Straw Hats themselves for the incident
Gear 5 Luffy vs Dragon Serpent Loki
Luffy should be able to win, but Dragon Serpent Loki will definitely take this fight for one reason or another

Loki might even kidnap or swallow Luffy

Then I think Loki ditches the tree to go save the children because he puts the people of Elbaph over his own selfish desires

Hearing this the Straw Hat Crew will team up with the remaining Giant Pirates + Sol to go after Loki and the Child Traffickers
I assume Loki's devil fruit has some form of alternative form of flight if not just being a winged serpent - making him the ideal one to give chase.
Luffy will probably need to get rescued by someone. If Loki did eat him, then Zoro cutting open the monster's gut could be fitting.

[past current]

All the fruits originated from that tree but they can now just transfer from one fruit to another after the users death

[elder dirge]

It hasn't been confirmed where the originals came from just that they're born from people's dreams

[serene patio]

I'm not sure on that, but latest info is that when a user dies, the fruit incarnates the nearest fruit of the same type (apples, oranges, bananas)

[rough storm]

Guys i solve the mystery why emeth and zunesha betrayed joyboy and probably Imu too. In the One Piece universe, Zoan fruit awakening can lead to a takeover of the user's body so what if Nika took over joyboys body and personality and became evil that lead to emeth and zunesha to betrayed joyboy?. vega punk said that its unclear who was evil and who was good back in void century. then now in elbaph we found out that nika was also called the god of destruction!!..

[cosmic ermine]

I'd like to see more zoan users get taken over by their fruit

I thought that's what was going to happen to kaido during wano

But it never did

[rough storm]

maybe it did. i mean that could explained kaidos multiple personality?

[iron current]

what they mean is the awakening that turns them into beasts like the jailers in Impel Down

[rough storm]

zoans devil fruits nature. those zoan beast in impel down. their fruits was probably a beast like creature like i mean they did look like beast on their awakened form. nikas awakened form looks like a human form

[rough storm]

meaning whatever devil zoan fruit was inside a fruit will take over the person who eat that said fruit.

[iron current]

and you wanna tell me a dragon is not a wild beast?

[rough storm]

and i think that explaines why lucci when he awakened kinda seems like a good guy now. because maybe the devil inside the fruit he ate was probably a good one

[rough storm]

um. what gives you the idea that all dragons are bad?

[iron current]

where did i say bad

[rough storm]

okay. then what are you trying to imply? kaidos fruit?

[iron current]

that a dragon neither good or bad is a wild beast so if Kaido had a failed awakening which took him over wouldnt he have behaved more like the jailers

[rough storm]

wasnt dragon in a myth history was one of the wisest creature?

[iron current]

when was Lucci a good guy

[iron current]

even if you go that direction it wouldnt explain what you tried to imply that his drunken stages are like a failed awakening

[rough storm]

trying to care about kaku and stussy

[rough storm]

i didnt say failed. i said personality.

[rough storm]

because maybe the devil inside the fruit kaido ate had personality like what he showed us in wano

[merry quail]

Of course it looks like human form. It's Hito (Human) Hito no Mi Model Sun God. The same way greek/roman/indian gods usually depicted has a human body (in general)

[stiff patrol]

Ah-- yea, you're probably right on that, actually-

[proven lion]

Okay I got time to kill time to talk about a theory

I believe that the Nika Nika fruit might have been the first devil fruit

The harley text says basically that in the first world the slaves wished for the sun god and he appeared, we also know that Vegapunk said devil fruits are formed from wishes. The harley also goes on to say that in the second world the Forrest god sent forth demons, I interpreted this as devil fruits coming to be for the first time.

I also feel as though the first person to have the Nika devil fruit might have been a giant, the straw hat at Marie Jois is not Joyboys, as we know based off the scaling compared to emeth in the manga panel silhouette of joyboy he has normal proportions. That hat is definitely the original Sun God Nikas, who I believe was a Giant

It is no coincidence that the Harley text is in Elbaph either, because the first people to be effected by The Sun God was the giants, this could imply then that giants were enslaved at some point.

[rough storm]

thats a good theory but i think nika was one of the founder of the ancient kingdom. and we know that the ancient kingdom was so advance that even vegapunks technologys are probably primitive compare to the ancient kingdom technology. so if vegapunk can create a devil fruit. for sure the ancient kingdom probably could create a god like devil fruit power. and nika was probably one of the scientist that discovered and created a devil fruit power.. and no the harley text didnt say that the sungod was from elbaph.

[proven lion]

I feel as though JoyBoy was part of the ancient kingdom actually not Nika, there wasn't a scientist who created it because we know that from what it says it was wished for by slaves.

[rough storm]

joyboy was from the ancient kingdom. but the thing is the ancient kingdom probably ruled the one piece world for 4000 years.

[proven lion]

The very first Nika was wished for, the 2nd super advanced kingdom was when they figured out how to make them.

[rough storm]

remembe the ancient kingdom created 3 ancient god. which i think was the monster shown in the mural

[proven lion]

Where does it say that

[rough storm]

i mean its called "ancient weapon" for a reason

[proven lion]

It only talks about the sun god in the first world

[rough storm]

no im not talking about the harley text. im taling about the mural

theres 3 demon like monster

[proven lion]

That's what I'm talking about to

It doesn't mention anything about 3 demons being created in the first world

[rough storm]

people are seeing the mural as 3 different timeline but i think its just showing one event from the past. because it clearly looks like everyone, every race with joyboy and imu riding zunesha was fighting the 3 anceint god.

[proven lion]

Flames engulfed the land, that to me means the red line, touching the forbidden sun to me means they figured out the mother flame power that vega punk still hasn't figured out, and later was used to wish for sun god nika

The key is that mother flame

[rough storm]

imu joyboy, the giants and the 20 kings and every race was fighting against those 3 monsters

[proven lion]

The reason why there is no new devil fruits is because the real mother flame was extinguished

And it is the key to everything, it is what imu wants most

And I feel as though in the 2nd world, that's when they figured the power out and that's when every devil fruit was made, look at what it says

[rough storm]

okay this is what you guys are not thinking.

the ancient kingdom was so advance like vega punk said that vega punk technology looks like a primitive technology compare to the ancient kingdonm

flames engulfed the land. could litteraly be mean that the ancient kingdom have a nuclear bomb

the desire touching the forbidden sun. could actually mean that human are trying to be god creating a living being

[proven lion]

It could just mean the red line was formed too think about how un natural it is lol, nothing can grow there and it's always sun light

It is not natural

[rough storm]

like we need to remember. 4000 years ago and 900 years ago is 1000 times way more advance than what we are seeing now in one piece

[proven lion]

Correct

[rough storm]

so meaning their technology probably have a mother flame that is 100 times way more powerful.

[proven lion]

But it's not the same kind of advancements, I think what they had was infinite energy.. that they had from the mother flame

[proven lion]

That's what I said earlier

Lol

[rough storm]

bro look at emeth

[proven lion]

Vega punks mother flame wasn't complete

He said that

U just aren't reading what I'm saying

[rough storm]

when did vega punk said his mother flame wasnt complete>?

[proven lion]

No lol those 3 monsters are probably just 3 different versions of Imu.

[rough storm]

we could clearly see imu in the mural riding zunesha

and to imus right. 20 kings

also vega punk saying that it was unclear who was evil or who was good kinda imply that maybe imu was one of the good guy

[proven lion]

Well think about it he was mentioning the ancient kingdom and said that his goal was to create a endless power source, we know that was his ultimate goal.. if it was complete then that would be his life's work.

[rough storm]

didnt oda said that zoan awakening can lead to the zoans personality and will taking over the users body. so what if the reason why zunesha and emeth betrayed joyboy because. nika took over joyboys personaly and body and bcame evil that made zunesha emeth and probably the whole joyboys crew including imu to go againsts joyboy.

harley text first world was probably talking about. joyboy with imu and the 20 kingdoms fighting the ancient kingdom. second world was when the 20 kingdoms with imu and zunesha and emeth killing the sungod which was joyboy. and third well obviously is whats happening now in the one piece universe

[proven lion]

No lol

Emeth can't possibly kill JoyBoy dude

Just sound half baked I'm sorry

[rough storm]

emeth did say sorry. im not saying emeth killed him

emeth littaraly said "sorry" to joyboy

same with zunesha

[proven lion]

Correct because he probably couldn't do something he promised, same as what joyboy did with the original poseidon

They all were meant to meet each other but couldn't

[rough storm]

yes. zunesha and emeth failed to make joyboy a king. and the betrayal message came from zunesha. saying that zunesha betrayed his companion.

zunesha apologize to joyboy. and the narrator at the time said that zunesha did a crime that got her punished to walked around the one piece world forever

[proven lion]

Also do u think someone with that much will power that had so much power of will (haki) that he litteraly knocked some of the current strongest people we know of back to mariejois

U aren't thinking man

[rough storm]

yes. his whole crew could probably do it including imu and the 20 kingdoms.

[proven lion]

How could someone like that lose control of their will

Litteraly doesn't make sense

[rough storm]

for example if luffy became evil right now. zoro, sanji, ussop, robin, franky, nami and chopper including the grandfleet and their allies will try to stop luffy

[proven lion]

No lol

I don't buy that either

[rough storm]

vega punk mention that zoan awakening can do that.

[proven lion]

So what

Its the loss of will power that causes it

Joyboy litteraly has the strongest will of anyone we have ever seen

[rough storm]

maybe thats what happen to joyboy.

[proven lion]

Haki is will

So it's impossible I'm sorry

[rough storm]

no joyboy doesnt have the strongest will because he apologize to the fishman and to the slave people back in the days for not fulfilling his promise

[proven lion]

Haki is litteraly will power dude

[rough storm]

joyboy betrayed the people trust

[proven lion]

Joyboy by far has the strongest haki in the series

That we have seen

Meaning he has the strongest will

[rough storm]

i know. lol. but he still betrayed peoples trust. u can have the strongest will and still fail.

[proven lion]

Okay but u can't have the strongest will and lose control of ur devil fruit

That just doesn't make sense

[rough storm]

what if the fruit is a god

[proven lion]

Then Luffy would have lost control already

Just think bro

Lol

[rough storm]

but luffy is the mc lol

just like naruto taming kurama

even tho kurama was one of the strongest creature in naruto

[proven lion]

So was JoyBoy like I said ur theory is just falling apart bro

[rough storm]

not saying im right.

[proven lion]

Think back to what I was saying now cus I want u to disprove what I was saying legitimately, all u gave me was a bunch of nonsense

[rough storm]

but for oda to state that zoan fruit awakening can take over the user body kinda says all. at the time we didnt know that luffys fruit was a zoan so it didnt register to us. well now we know he is

[rough storm]

like i said. it did say that joyboy failed. because he isnt the mc so he probably can't control the nika devil fruit. but luffy is

hes the main character

[proven lion]

I don't buy that

[rough storm]

like i said im not saying im right. its just a theory

[proven lion]

It just doesn't make sense dude it's all will power and if that's the case then joyboy is by far the strongest because of that knot we saw with emeth.

He has the strongest will

[pure raven]

I imagine that Luffy tapping into the power of Nika is probably akin to grabbing a handful of water out of the pool. There's probably a much vaster resource availablee but it might require him to dive in to use it. And if that's the case, he might not be able to handle the will-power of Nika.

But even if he can't, I'm sure the Straw Hat Crew's bonds would be able to snap him out of it

[proven lion]

I don't buy "he's the MC so he can control it better" Oda isnt like that

[rough storm]

yes joyboy has the strongest will but still got betrayed by his crewmate and lost to imu.

[proven lion]

Yep he did

Because it wasn't meant to be

[pure raven]

"lost to imu" makes me feel like Oda's about to pull a dirty one on us and reveal that Imu is actually Joyboy. Obito lookin mfer

[proven lion]

Think back to what Raleigh said "maybe everything happens for a reason" it's all pre written dude Oda knows EXACTLY what he's doing.

[rough storm]

from what i understand from reading one piece like a lot. joyboy could probably beat imu. but i think he lost on purpose.

[rough storm]

i still believe that imu was once part of joyboys crew. and one of joyboys companion that betrayed joyboy

[proven lion]

I don't believe that, I think imu is a product of the 2nd world though forsure

He didn't come from the first world I don't think.

Because the world government was formed in the 2nd world

In the void century

[rough storm]

exactly. imu and the 20 kings was the one who made the world government after defeating the ancient kingdom

[pure raven]

That seems to be the narrative direction. But then the subversion would be that Imu could be Joy Boy just... broken or otherwise mentally afflicted.

I'm also convinced Imu could be the original kings all soul-bonded into a single being.

[rough storm]

imu could be one of the 20 kings that defeated the ancient kingdom.

[proven lion]

In the 2nd world, yes.. but the first world was when the first Nika was formed think about what I said, I feel as though the first world wasn't as perfect as it's cut out to be I feel like they also used slave labor that's why I believe the giants we're the slaves during the first world and the first Nika being the first devil fruit was a Giant

And during the 2nd world they figured out how to make more devil fruits

[rough storm]

the first world. everyone was a slave to the ancient kingdom. that what prompts imu and the 20 kings alliance to fight them.

[proven lion]

In the 2nd world

[rough storm]

that includes the giants, the tontata. the fishman. everyone

[proven lion]

Who knows how long that time gap was

[rough storm]

the second world is the void century after they defeated the ancient kingdom.

[proven lion]

Imu and the 20kings happened in the 2nd world

[rough storm]

second world is talking about the void century

[proven lion]

Correct I know

Thats litteraly what I'm saying

Read man lmfao

Ur just writing without reading what I'm even saying trying to defend ur point

[rough storm]

bro i said this. first world. and u said "second worl"

[proven lion]

Yes because Imu and the 20kings was not first world

That was all void century

[rough storm]

bro. they are. imu and the 20 kings fought the ancient kingdom. and the first world harley text litterally talked about the ancient kingdom.

touching the forbidden sun. "mother flame"

[proven lion]

No lol ur not getting it then, it is explicitly stated that the void century was part of the 2nd world, that is the void century.. the 1st world is far before the void century

[rough storm]

the void century could litterally started after they defeated the ancient kingdom

[proven lion]

Correct meaning the 2nd world starts there.

The first world is atleast 800 years before the 2nd world or more

[rough storm]

yes. so void century started after they defeated teh ancient kingdom

we know who defeated teh ancient kingdom which was imu and the 20 kings

[proven lion]

In the 2nd world

Yes

The first world was many years before that

[rough storm]

imu and the 20 kings defeated the ancient kingdom. then what did the 20 kings and imu did after. they wanted to be god. the celestial god

they slew the sun

to become god

[proven lion]

YES DUDE I FUCKING KNOW

That is literally what I am saying

What YOU are not getting is that the first world happened WAY before that

[rough storm]

no u keep saying that imu and the 20 kings wasnt part of the first world

[proven lion]

Meaning there was a sun god even before the void century

[rough storm]

they are because the first world talks about the ancient kingdom

[proven lion]

And he MIGHT have been the first devil fruit user

[pure raven]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the 1st world refers to just over 900 years ago. It might not be referring to much more than the time before the void rather than having to go back too far beyond that. Then the void century was 800-900 years ago. And the second world would then be anything after the 100 year gap.

As for when the Second World Ended - who knows?

[proven lion]

They can't be because Imu is part of the 2nd world not the first world

[rough storm]

no u are right. it could be referring to 900 years ago when the "ancient kingdom" lost to imu and the 20 kings. which started the void century

[proven lion]

I don't think they would separate them into different periods of time if it was just 100 years before 800 years ago

Litteraly doesn't make sense

First world was way before the void century

[pure raven]

it does if you're not assuming that the pattern is 800 years lol

[proven lion]

Why wouldn't it be

[pure raven]

I just explained why

[proven lion]

Each world is separated by the coming of joyboy

[rough storm]

im not sure you understand me. the ancient kingdom could have ruled one piece for 4000 years but 900 years ago they were defeated by imu and the 20 kings alliance.

[proven lion]

Or rather nika

The Nika fruit is what makes each world separate

The first time it came from a wish

[rough storm]

bro u are not understanding me at all

[proven lion]

Why would Nika come 2 times in 100 years

[proven lion]

I understand that part but what YOU ARE NOT UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THE FIRST WORLD WAS BEFORE THE VOID CENTURY, AND EACH WORLD IS SEPARATED BY THE COMING OF NIKA.

[rough storm]

dude. yes the first world is before the void century. because it was ruled by the ancient kingdom.

second world started because the ancient kingdom lost.

[proven lion]

So the first world can't POSSIBLY be only 100 years before the 2nd world

That litteraly does not make sense

Because each world is separated by the coming of Nika

[pure raven]

We have no time table other than the void century being 800 years ago and the Harley Text giving us some vague idea of worlds. We don't know if the second world lasted 400 years or 2 years. We assume it probably lasted at least a few centuries but I don't think there' s anything there to say 100% sure cause Oda's left it pretty vague.

We understand that the arrival of the Sun God is what designates the end of one world, but other than that...

[proven lion]

Well he didn't leave it vague that the Nika fruit comes very rarely and the fruit itself was in hiding for 800 years, the Nika fruit is what separates the worlds dude each world is a failure of Nika until the last world where they "finally meet"