#nms-the-future | No Man's Sky | Page 54

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 6:57 PM

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if they add elevators they should make them super slow, play really boring music, and add the chance for them to break down while moving

coarse prism Jan 17, 2021, 6:59 PM

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I think they should add placeable turrets. Large ones for bases, and portable ones to use in combat

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 7:01 PM

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in the current state the game is in, turrets would be pointless

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by that i mean, creating more dangers on planets worthy of being turreted

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 7:03 PM

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There's aggressive sentinel planets that aren't the easiest to adapt to.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 7:03 PM

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meh

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sentinels have always just been an annoyance to me personally

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but i’m referring to fauna as well

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so, fauna, sentinels, and wandering npcs in and out of their vehicles

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I think right now, my most desired request is for Hello Games to leave last gen consoles behind and go full steam ahead with the capabilities of current gen platforms and pc

weary iris Jan 17, 2021, 7:08 PM

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It would be cool if they come out with an update that gave planets an orbit path

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 7:16 PM

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We don't need moving planets

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 7:16 PM

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they kinda did before launch

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 7:16 PM

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That was rejected because of confusion.

golden cobalt Jan 17, 2021, 7:17 PM

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a pilot progression path - become more proficient with certain archetypes of ships. would not prevent a player from choosing any kind of ship earlier on, but as the player uses more and more a ship archetype, the harder it would be to expertly fly a different kind of ship. like, for example, if the player character flies explorers a lot, then it's possible that it became so good at warping, that it manages to create new tech for your ships.

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 7:17 PM

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testers felt it was too disorientating in relation to the space station

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i like it bk, a few more sort of RPG elements would be cool with that sense of rewarding progression

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 7:19 PM

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wasn’t it that they just rotated?

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and didn’t move along an orbit path

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 7:19 PM

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yea

gloomy hazel Jan 17, 2021, 7:29 PM

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I really don't get it

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People wanted a game about space exploration and got confused by basic orbital mechanics

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Like WTF

golden cobalt Jan 17, 2021, 7:29 PM

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yeah, that's where i was trying to go with the concept. i think there's some places where it could tie in with existing systems too, but again, it's just a concept

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personally, this game is about exploration, orbital mechanics and other things to make it closer to a space sim would be awesome to have tbh.

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 7:37 PM

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There are different genres and different interpretations of the space concept.

gloomy hazel Jan 17, 2021, 7:39 PM

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Fair enough I guess

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Can't really compare it to what we have now since I didn't play back then

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:26 PM

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Animals are teddy bears at most, can we make some of them more deadly?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:32 PM

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And create mini games around them as rare hunts and give us leaderboards To search for the rarest creatures

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:38 PM

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Animals may come with:
-hazard damage
-projectile launchers
-Protective shell: Parts of the creature resistant to damage.
-Offensive tail(spiked, clubbed, etc).

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:38 PM

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visual cloak And create mini games around them as rare hunts and give us leaderboards To sear...

Take some inspiration from monster hunter?

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 9:39 PM

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would be nice to see reworked creatures, i know they've been improved upon but just a complete overhaul would be nice

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:41 PM

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yes

ancient osprey Jan 17, 2021, 9:45 PM

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I wonder if NMS is headed in the direction of having as many biomes as Minecraft and being as diverse as it

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:46 PM

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Technically, we already have as many biomes. We could do with sub-biomes though.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:49 PM

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a lot can still be done to diversify each biome type

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:51 PM

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I think sub-biomes are the way to do that.

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Each part of the planet is close to the same.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:51 PM

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and the scaling/density of flora/fauna over terrain

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 9:52 PM

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i know it's a big ask and most likely a engine limitation but water needs improving

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better reflections, flowing water etc

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:53 PM

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it does, but flowing water may never happen, so our best bet is the illusion of flowing water

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like in the round plant conservatory

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:53 PM

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I don't know if rivers matter too much.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:53 PM

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they’d be amazing

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 9:54 PM

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ye just a fancy shader technique to give an illusion of flowing water

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like other games do anyway

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:54 PM

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mhm

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and flows ‘around’ rocks and stuff

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 9:54 PM

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yes

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frostbite does a good job of water

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:55 PM

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The thing is, all liquids look like some variation of water, I wonder what can be done about that.

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While plain water and solutions in water are fine, we do need some other liquids.

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I wonder if changing viscosity would help.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 9:57 PM

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having shaders would make lava planets way more interesting

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 9:58 PM

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With viscosity, some liquids would be harder to swim in than others. You, animals, and the nautilon would have a harder time getting up to speed in some liquids. Others are the reverse.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:08 PM

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lilac crane Technically, we already have as many biomes. We could do with sub-biomes though.

there are sub-biomes, but they could use an overhaul. Currently every biome shares two sub-biomes: underground & underwater.

They never intentionally differ across biomes, just uniform caves & underwater. An overhaul at the moment would be as straightforward as making them non-uniform, so that sub-biomes relate more strongly to their parent biome.

That's something I suggested earlier with mechanically-oriented exotics having caverns that are like the insides of a machine.

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:09 PM

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Ooh, I like that.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:09 PM

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Now that I think of it though, one could say there are in fact three sub-biomes.

There's the atmosphere, underground, and underwater, all three of which are more or less uniform across every biome.

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:10 PM

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Do deserts even have an oasis?

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:10 PM

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Not intentional ones

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You can find desert worlds with oceans or bodies of water

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So yes, but not in the way that you mean

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:12 PM

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For the desert, an oasis would be cool.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:12 PM

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at least on ones without water, yes

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:12 PM

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torn fractal i know it's a big ask and most likely a engine limitation but water needs improv...

first step, bring back the old translucency from a distance (so it looks less like paint), then fix reflections (because they are, in fact, broken), and then figure out how to handle shorelines and foam, lol

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:13 PM

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yes

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:13 PM

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where my sea foam at fam

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:13 PM

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The water's always been broken throughout each version, but Next really just mucked it up

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:14 PM

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they should revert tbh

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:14 PM

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it was terrible in next with the water creatures disappearing and stuff

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:14 PM

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still do

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:14 PM

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The opacity just feels off, the reflections are much rougher than in the past, particularly where local star reflections are concerned, and so many other details

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:14 PM

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yeah it's a little better though at least in my experience

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you can track the creatures a bit better from outside the water somewhat

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:15 PM

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The underwater fauna only ever appears as you step into the water a ways, lol

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At least in my experience

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:15 PM

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same

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:15 PM

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In the past you could see them while still on the shore from a bit away

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:16 PM

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which is far more interesting

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seeing a bigger one down below

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:16 PM

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i'm sure it's something they have in the pipeline but it's what takes priority first for such a small team to work on

glad plaza Jan 17, 2021, 10:17 PM

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Put actual rocks into planet rings

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:17 PM

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i thnk the content is there, there's plenty to do now just work on improving

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:17 PM

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It's one of the oddities of HG's approach. Every addition comes with a subtraction somewhere and sometimes you can chalk it up to maybe optimization, but then they add stuff that detracts from optimization so then you're left confused

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:17 PM

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Leave last gen behind

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:18 PM

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I do find that deserts lack diversification. IRL, you have sandy, salty, even somewhat grassy.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:18 PM

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I don't think older hardware has ever entirely been the issue tho

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:18 PM

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hate to say it but yes, slowly fizzle out the last gen

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:18 PM

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Not to say let older hardware keep them stuck, mind, but we've seen some of the stuff we're asking for on last gen hardware and they just inexplicably threw it out

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:19 PM

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oof

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:19 PM

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However, in NMS, the ground texture and color is the same for all desert planets. It should be opened up a little bit more.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:19 PM

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Like we saw better grass rendering for awhile up till Next, y'know?

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:20 PM

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Next gen grass is best it has ever been.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:20 PM

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eeeh

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:20 PM

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they are different aesthetics

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:21 PM

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If you're still seeing it fade out at a distance, prior versions would just go & go as I recall

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:21 PM

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for me, It depends on the type of grass

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:21 PM

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lilac crane However, in NMS, the ground texture and color is the same for all desert planets...

I take it Origins still didn't address that then?

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:21 PM

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Unfortunately not.

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:21 PM

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also seeing trees and other vegetation move like it did prelaunch when that dinosaur looking thing charged

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:22 PM

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i’ve hoped for that for years

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:24 PM

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This is unrelated to the environment discussion, but thinking past that to Stef's "things to do" comment, I still don't think there's anything all that new to do besides the derelict freighter crawls, which themselves are essentially the first ever space exploration moments we've had.

Rather than go off from there & say, "More of that!" although it would be welcomed, I'd really just like more actual character actions.

Not simply things to do, but abilities to do beyond jetpack about, analyze, blast, open stuff.

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Like think about how little the installable technologies enable us to do.

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:25 PM

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I would rather have the game hook up into what's already there.

ancient osprey Jan 17, 2021, 10:25 PM

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I am on last gen...

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:26 PM

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That's the thing though! What's already there is very limited, and that can work, but none of it allows for much, at least as they've been handling it.

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:27 PM

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For example, I want to be able to either abduct animals or create robotic animals for some kind of zoo.

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:27 PM

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i think it's needed if this game is to last, i know their original vision was based on exploration but maybe it's time for a different approach

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:27 PM

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Like think about the fact you can't even crawl, or hold an object, or toss an object.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:27 PM

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spiritfox, which is why, like Stef mentioned, they should do a gradual transition from last gen to current gen

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:27 PM

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Steff who?

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:28 PM

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they'd still be updates for previous gen, just with limitations

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:28 PM

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until there won’t be

ancient osprey Jan 17, 2021, 10:28 PM

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Yeah

glad plaza Jan 17, 2021, 10:28 PM

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i'd love to crawl

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:28 PM

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sorta like with how Bungie stopped supporting Destiny on ps3

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:29 PM

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supple warren Like think about the fact you can't even crawl, or hold an object, or toss an ob...

now, granted, we didn't have a character model for ages, but other first-person games have allowed crawling & prone positions for years

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:29 PM

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I don't think new movements add anything to this game.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:29 PM

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crouching maybe

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in caves

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you can in VR. lol

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:30 PM

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If you want new interaction, I think you should be looking to interaction with the environment.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:30 PM

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so, crouching

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:31 PM

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that's why i also mentioned holding & throwing objects

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:31 PM

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small animals

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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This game is beautiful, but NMS can turn into a walking simulator at times.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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which is fine

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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If you could pick up a rock to toss by a Sentinel to distract it, it adds a small but interesting new approach to getting around them

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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Turning it into a crouching simulator doesn't help.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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?

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it’s a simple movement that helps when in tight spots

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it’s in every game

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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Someone hasn't spelunked enough

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:32 PM

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visual cloak ?

You're suggesting crouching as the answer of most NMS issues.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:33 PM

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no

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:33 PM

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no...they're not...

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:33 PM

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Also: why crouch when you have a matter manipulator tool?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:33 PM

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tossing objects sounds nice though

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:33 PM

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It adds a small but different way to navigate environments, particularly caves

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:34 PM

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what if you started the game and didn’t have the terrain manipulator

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:34 PM

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Sometimes you don't want to manipulate the terrain, it's about options

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The point here is less about crouching, and more about enabling more character interaction options, at least from my end

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:35 PM

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back in my day we didn't have a terrain manipulator

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:35 PM

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the grenadess

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:35 PM

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ye if you remembered to have any

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:35 PM

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that was quite destructive

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i dislike that

nocturne kraken Jan 17, 2021, 10:38 PM

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Always died to grenades in the older days

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:38 PM

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Our characters are incredibly limited in what they can do. It's primarily:
-Tool use (to blast/beam/grenade/etc.)
-Navigate (walk/run/jetpack).
-Interact (talk/open objects/gather/use device).

What I'm pointing to is an extension of a couple of the existing options there, mainly navigate & interact, but also tool use.

I think rocket boots, personal shield, & scope are a good start to improving non-lethal tech options, but could be refined & added to.

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Like rocket boots could be cool if they adjust the double tap to activate to be less finicky, and instead of a quick forward boost, offered a constant hover over the terrain & movement speed boost faster than sprinting, but at a cost to life support drain.

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:41 PM

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wings to glide with could be cool

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:41 PM

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would be nice

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where’s that cape at btw

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guess they haven’t gotten the flowy cape physics right yet

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:42 PM

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tbh i'm sorta surprised they haven't enabled folks to slap decals on their characters, lol

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Slap some blob decals on ur backpack

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:43 PM

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now i just want to be a buzz lightyear

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:44 PM

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id put a blob on my face

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:44 PM

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i knew u'd say that

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:44 PM

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me too

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:44 PM

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everyone wants to set up zoos but really, what if u just analysed animals to replace ur head with theirs

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:44 PM

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hey now THAT is a good idea

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:45 PM

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no the real good idea is analyse their butts to replace ur butt with their butt

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nobutty expects the butt customization

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:45 PM

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supple warren The point here is less about crouching, and more about enabling more character i...

If the point isn't as much about crouching, than don't suggest crouching because crouching does not fix the issue at hand.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:45 PM

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procedurally generated butts

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:46 PM

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lilac crane If the point isn't as much about crouching, than don't suggest crouching because...

it's an example of one possible extension of character interactions

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:46 PM

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i do sometimes wish i could

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:46 PM

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i suggested crouching/crawling alongside holding & tossing objects, you just got hung up on crouching/crawling for some reason

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:47 PM

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lol

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:47 PM

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Personal shields are tool use, but ok. They do help with combat though.

nocturne kraken Jan 17, 2021, 10:47 PM

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Replacing heads is actually pretty cool

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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it’d give HG more stuff for us to purchase with quicksilver

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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nO

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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hehehejeje

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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scrap quicksilver altogether

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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lol

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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agreed

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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I am on the fence about QS, on one hand it is broken and on the other is has a lot of potential.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:48 PM

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they keep talking about adding better ways of earning it and it's resulted in next to nothing

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:49 PM

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i think they’re close to a fix right?

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:49 PM

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I do agree with that. Sometimes humans are the reason why things don't happen.

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:49 PM

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the missions that earn it aren't unique in any way

nocturne kraken Jan 17, 2021, 10:49 PM

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Animal cages to capture a pet, then feed it special bait to make it official?. Would love to see ppl walk around the nexus, or freighters with a small creature

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:49 PM

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it’s inevitable

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pets are

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:49 PM

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why would one even need to capture creatures tho? scifi, analyse & replicate creature

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:50 PM

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i'm pretty certain some form of pet is coming

nocturne kraken Jan 17, 2021, 10:50 PM

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That too

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:51 PM

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Creatures in NMS are a bit big to be pets. Maybe you want a bigger pet, but I like a pet that's the size of your character's head at most.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:51 PM

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you can find ones that small

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in baby form

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:51 PM

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It's still very funny to me that, because our characters can't hold & toss objects, bait for creatures is basically just...Emitted from oneself, lol

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:51 PM

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So, analyze, shrink and synthesize then?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:52 PM

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they just pop out your backpack

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spring loaded

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jappards that would make sense

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i like the way Starlink battle for atlas allows us to scan and discover fauna

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you scan one type a few times and get new data on it each time until you’ve fully discovered it

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:54 PM

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What starlink?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:54 PM

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it’s that star fox game that came out a couple years ago

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:56 PM

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So, what is it going to be with pets, Pokemon style or Cosmetic style?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:56 PM

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scanning is actually turned into a mini game

📎 image0.jpg

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i generally dislike/don’t care about pure cosmetics

torn fractal Jan 17, 2021, 10:57 PM

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make tasks a little less mundane

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:57 PM

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Be more specific?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:57 PM

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like a majority of the missions?

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 10:58 PM

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I think Zug means they'd like if pets weren't strictly cosmetic, but in what way that would be done 🤷‍♀️

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:59 PM

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We already have machines for automation.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 10:59 PM

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have cool little procedurally generated abilities

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 10:59 PM

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So Pokemon style then.

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Kinda

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 11:00 PM

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oh i thought jappards was talking to stef

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 11:00 PM

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Tbh I don't see much value in pets in NMS because:

Nothing really demands you have assistance in any form, player or otherwise.
There's nothing you can't locate on your own currently.
There are no systems in place to actively direct anything beyond your character.

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 11:00 PM

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Both really.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 11:01 PM

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i’m okay with it, but all i really was saying is it’s inevitable

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because it’s one of the most desired features

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 11:01 PM

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I generally just view pets, if they're added, as likely to be yet another throwaway thing added, like bobbleheads, to appeal to the collectors in the community.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 11:01 PM

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just hope it’s not too shallow

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 11:03 PM

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I don't think pets are optimal for collectors either. There has been a voice in the community that wants a zoo type system.

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 11:03 PM

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that too

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which i don’t care about at all

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a pet would be a ‘meet in the middle’ type feature

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 11:04 PM

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Oh, see, I was thinking of folks being able to have a bunch of pets

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 11:06 PM

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@visual cloak What do you look for in a pet?

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 11:06 PM

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multiple pets/more shallow system or 1 meaningful, more fleshed out pet

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when they lay on my shoulder and meow occasionally

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 11:06 PM

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I'm talking value, what do you look for?

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Companion, assistance, something else?

supple warren Jan 17, 2021, 11:07 PM

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If pets were coupled with a natural points of interest update, that would be interesting. That way if you tame certain fauna they could help guide you to different natural POIs that charts & signal boosters overlook

visual cloak Jan 17, 2021, 11:07 PM

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companion

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good idea

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and rare bones

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your pet comes back to you being chased by a few of those corrupted sentinels

lilac crane Jan 17, 2021, 11:09 PM

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lol

pearl viper Jan 18, 2021, 12:06 AM

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Gimme that zoo like feature 😂

bright flame Jan 18, 2021, 12:08 AM

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What stuff do you think would improve the balancing of NMS

pearl viper Jan 18, 2021, 12:17 AM

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Stronger pirates

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:21 AM

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Less grind

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:30 AM

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Better progression

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Progression and difficulty are all over the place.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:39 AM

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I thought they were just low plateaus

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:40 AM

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lol. This game is the hardest at the beginning really.

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The beginning isn't even very representative of the game. It would be a lot more helpful if you were given a small amount of goods.

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Basically, some ferrite dust, some sodium, some carbon.

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This should make the transition between the early and mid game a lot less grating.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:48 AM

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it's grating?

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tbh i think new folks might prefer to have to dig up fewer tech module things

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i forget what they're called but have heard more irritation with that from new folks

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:49 AM

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Early game: "I have to fill this bar or I'm dead"
Mid game: "I should have some sodium in my backpack."

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:50 AM

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that's the mid game? lol

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:50 AM

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Sort of.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:52 AM

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Early game is: wait recharge what, how do i find that, wait repair this with what, fuck am i dying? what do all these bars even mean, game what do you want?

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:52 AM

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Late game: "I have hundreds of Ion batteries, who cares"

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:52 AM

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alternatively, "i have 9999 sodium who cares"

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:53 AM

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True.

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For early game, having a small amount of resources to allow you to figure it out should help.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 12:56 AM

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I don't think so tbh. At no point do they ever really explain the player status indicators.

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Like they never explain that dropping hazard protection isn't immediate death, nor that losing shields isn't immediate death.

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That's what leads to much of the early player panic, a lack of adequate explanation

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 12:58 AM

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True.

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So, how do we fix the hazard issue?

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 1:00 AM

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what hazard issue?

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 1:00 AM

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The part about not explaining hazards well enough?

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I know there are more bars to be explained, but hazard should be the first thing the game teaches.

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One at a time.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 1:08 AM

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In Normal Mode they'd probably be better off starting folks next to their ship again, and with hazard protection either less depleted or, counterintuitively for teaching purposes, closer to depletion.

The idea with the latter is that it offers an immediate teaching moment, where a tooltip could appear or something laying it out, e.g.
Hazard Protection is your primary defense against an environment's ambient hazards. When lost, your exosuit shields will take damage, acting as another layer of defense.

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If they were going the tooltip method, you'd either want that to display upon depletion, or first recharge.

The tricky part is, if you also explain shields & hitpoints with tooltips, you wouldn't want either of those displaying upon first hit or depletion, otherwise you'd get overlapping tooltips from hazard protection dropping then shields taking a hit.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 1:17 AM

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If you are going to start closer to depletion, you might need players to have sodium in their backpack already.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 1:18 AM

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Note that's coupled with making it so folks are closer to the ship again

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Ship offers protection, so you can just pop in

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 1:19 AM

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To new players, that's not at all obvious.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 1:19 AM

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Add to the tooltip

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 1:19 AM

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Eh, both need explnation.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 1:19 AM

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I mean the obvious addition to that tip would be how to replenish the hazard protection

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By pointing to shelter (e.g. entering your ship, buildings, caves) or locating resources or products (e.g. sodium or ion batteries)

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Like at the bottom of it you might have:
How to restore hazard protection
-Find shelter (e.g. enter your ship, a building, or cave)
-Find resources/products (e.g. Sodium/Ion Batteries) in the environment

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 1:27 AM

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That’s the way to do it.

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I want to avoid tutorials where you are told everything. I think it can suck the enjoyment out of discovery.

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I think the player learns best from doing.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 1:49 AM

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Same here, and tbh I almost feel like the tooltips are a bit much, but the way they threw folks in at first was a little much. Now they've almost overcorrected in some respects

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 2:04 AM

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Hmm

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 2:51 AM

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As for life support, the game doesn’t explain oxygen well. Only recently did I find out you can get more oxygen by interacting with the plant before mining it.

gaunt hearth Jan 18, 2021, 3:03 AM

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Wait you can mine the plant too? I've just been interacting with it

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 3:03 AM

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Yeah

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 3:32 AM

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lilac crane As for life support, the game doesn’t explain oxygen well. Only recently did I f...

at first i thought you meant the hazardous flora that have oxygen 👀

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unless you did?

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 3:36 AM

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I do

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 3:36 AM

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can't remember atm if you can mine the regular oxygen plants...Was pretty sure you couldn't, but haven't played in a bit

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 3:40 AM

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You can mine them, yes.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 4:01 AM

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I wonder if NMS devs talk much to the fans about the future. While I do see some communication, there still seems to be a gap there.

lost robin Jan 18, 2021, 4:58 AM

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just want to say when I first started a couple months ago, all of that sort of stuff I was able to work out would say most newer players could as well, I kinda like the thought of not being hand fed every little thing.

There are several other things that the game just flat out never tells you about and you just kinda have to get lucky to figure them out I guess, that I feel would be better to address then hazard effects

sturdy lily Jan 18, 2021, 5:55 AM

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more things to do with flora/fauna? all you can do with them currently is scan them, and harvest them. feels quite bland and intriguing

lost robin Jan 18, 2021, 6:08 AM

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You can feed the fauna and have them bring you stuff. As well as ride them

brave plinth Jan 18, 2021, 6:09 AM

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Dying from hazards, pirates, sentinels, and whatever else should **absolutely **be a threat at all times.

Making the game easier is not a "quality of life" update, we already have Creative mode. If nothing is challenging in Normal mode, then playing Creative won't be any different anyway. Why put obstacles in front of your creativity?

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 6:31 AM

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(that's the reason i basically ditched normal mode, the "challenges" don't feel like challenges, and just annoyances)

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On the other hand, the more difficult modes don't do any better, since the challenges still don't feel like challenges, just more tedious versions of the minor inconveniences of Normal

sharp widget Jan 18, 2021, 6:59 AM

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The last time they interacted with the fans, things went badly @lilac crane . once bitten, twice shy

plucky lodge Jan 18, 2021, 10:31 AM

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I'm still holding my proposition for towns/villages where you can buy treaties and hire people from the different guilds to do missions

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But you would have to have full standing with them

vagrant jasper Jan 18, 2021, 3:26 PM

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What do you guys think the next update is I want like cities and ship building

silver rune Jan 18, 2021, 3:27 PM

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What about freighter modification? Such as more turrets or a change in class.

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Hopefully Hello Games shows some love to freighters

vagrant jasper Jan 18, 2021, 3:28 PM

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that was also be neat

silver rune Jan 18, 2021, 3:29 PM

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It would make freighters more useful and easier to upgrade

vivid phoenix Jan 18, 2021, 3:58 PM

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Will the future of NMS ever include the planet not respawning inside of your base?

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 4:00 PM

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What?

golden cobalt Jan 18, 2021, 4:15 PM

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terrain regeneration in player bases (like when you don't visit a base for a long time, and if you modified terrain in any way, the terrain regens back, burying parts of the base)

sharp widget Jan 18, 2021, 4:34 PM

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I have underground bases that I have visited only after months.
The terrain has never, yet, infringed upon the base.
I still think terrain growing back is related to terrain being edited when the base is not properly unlocked - i.e. after the player has returned via a warp or portal. i.e. if and when buildings are not snapping to anchor points.

golden cobalt Jan 18, 2021, 4:36 PM

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yeah

sharp widget Jan 18, 2021, 4:36 PM

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So thats just a bug. But I do think that the base computer can have a readout where it displays the bases current # of terrain and building edits, and the local max and players total max.

golden cobalt Jan 18, 2021, 4:36 PM

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i remember your theory; i've asked others to test it sometimes

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(that sounded awful)

sharp widget Jan 18, 2021, 4:37 PM

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Which doesn't speak directly to any bugs. But would serve to help players know how resource intensive their bases are

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and, for bases that are saved online, it could show the # of un-uploaded edits accumulated, so its clear if a new upload is required.

golden cobalt Jan 18, 2021, 4:39 PM

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the game should probably implement what you are suggesting, at least something that shows players terrain mods won't stick, or prevent them from modifying if base is locked.

brave plinth Jan 18, 2021, 6:03 PM

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plucky lodge I'm still holding my proposition for towns/villages where you can buy treaties a...

Ah, yeah, like the tech demo from way back when. Yeah, I have a strong need to hire a couple Gek mercs, maybe like a green frog looking one 🐸...or maybe one thats like a blue bird 🐦 🤔.
Yeah,...thatd be cool. :fox: 🐰 🐦 🐸

plucky lodge Jan 18, 2021, 6:04 PM

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Yeah, I got the game back in december so I don't remember those days, I also feel like being able to make space stations in empty solar systems would be cool, it would be resource heavy and cost a lot of units

brave plinth Jan 18, 2021, 6:26 PM

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It's honestly one of the few things from the original teaser at E3 that still hasn't made it into the game. Currently, factions that you have good standing with will help you in space combat but its not the "personal squad" concept that they showed. That would be totally awesome tbh.
I've really grown a distaste for the current state of space combat. I really believe it was significantly better in past versions, although much harder. I'd say, at the very least, the current harder difficulties (Surv/PD) should have the space combat difficulty that Normal mode used to have (my reference is Pathfinder update aka before NEXT).

nocturne kraken Jan 18, 2021, 6:34 PM

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being able to hand-pick crewmates for your freighter/frigates would be lovely

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If i like a certain NPC I want them on my ship. would be a cool visual display of your travels, looking back on your diverse crew

brave plinth Jan 18, 2021, 6:40 PM

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If you haven't tried already, you can actually move all of your base npcs (except exocraft specialist) to the freighter by building the terminals on there.
As far as replacing the crew members for the freighter itself, they're tied to the ship seed iirc, so I don't know if thats possible without completely changing how the freighters are generated. Basically, it could potentially be on the level of "you're freighter shouldn't change unless you want it to," but then a bunch of players report issues where their freighter totally changes design.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 7:07 PM

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Can we remove most build restrictions? I think they do more harm than good.

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I mean, glitch building exists because of build restrictions, it cannot exist outside of it.

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It's to the point where HG is featuring bases that use mods and glitch building.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 7:26 PM

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brave plinth If you haven't tried already, you can actually move all of your base npcs (excep...

reminds me, still need to be able to unlock exocraft aboard the freighter in some way, so one doesn't have to build geobays to do so

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 7:30 PM

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lilac crane Can we remove most build restrictions? I think they do more harm than good.

sure, but lifting the restrictions alone won't directly improve basebuilding.

You want to bundle that with QOL improvements like base computer readouts for number of terrain edits & parts used. Virtual coordinate plane to arbitrarily place parts without snapping to other parts or being placed on the ground, so you can place them in the air, rotate & rescale as desired, among other improvements.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 7:47 PM

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It's a QOL improvement.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 7:50 PM

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it's not a good enough one on its own.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 7:57 PM

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I disagree.

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Glitch building can be finnicky.

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I do see removing restrictions as an improvement, but I do want to go further than just that.

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Skip the semantics,

brave plinth Jan 18, 2021, 8:07 PM

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If HG takes away snap-fit just to cater to glitch builders, I will be wholly disappointed with base building.
Not everyone wants to glitch build.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 8:07 PM

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True.

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If you want to build snapless, Alt building is designed for that.

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Instead, buildings should be given more options on placement. So you can rotate floor panels upside down if you want to use the down side of the panel.

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And small walls can be turned horizontal.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 8:49 PM

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Tbh I think we agree more or less, I just avoid pushing for the low-hanging fruit because when the community does that, HG dives right in after it and we get another shallow change

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It's like the charts. They're just not great, and instead of looking at, say, expanding exocraft signal booster tech to exosuit & ship, so they have their own installable signal boosters, what do they do?

They let you buy multiple charts instead. 😐

brave plinth Jan 18, 2021, 8:54 PM

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supple warren It's like the charts. They're just not great, and instead of looking at, say, ex...

I was blown away recently by just how much better the old ship scanner was. It's astoundingly better. Why they nerfed it so hard is just not apparent to me.
I also hate those stupid charts with a passion now. I swear they weren't bad before Origins, but something happened with Origins that made them either totally bugged on my system, or just hot garbage all around.

supple warren Jan 18, 2021, 8:57 PM

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It's less that they nerfed it, and more that however it's set up seems to be very fragile. Each larger update has been prone to breaking it in some way.

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Which makes it all the more confusing that they keep messing with it, considering how fragile it seems to be

coarse prism Jan 18, 2021, 10:20 PM

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Water landing gear and a boat exocraft. For a few nanites you can buy a water landing gear ship upgrade, and let you land on the water. And the boat exocraft would have a cannon as powerful as a ship, to give it a reason to use instead of a nautilon.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 10:59 PM

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supple warren Tbh I think we agree more or less, I just avoid pushing for the low-hanging frui...

That's a problem you have with HG, don't take it to me.

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 11:00 PM

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coarse prism Water landing gear and a boat exocraft. For a few nanites you can buy a water la...

The Nomad can hover above water and land.

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It can have a cannon if you want it to.

coarse prism Jan 18, 2021, 11:05 PM

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Good point actually

lilac crane Jan 18, 2021, 11:06 PM

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Do you consider the nomad too slow? Because I find Exocraft in general to be slow.

visual cloak Jan 18, 2021, 11:06 PM

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they feel slow

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if only the mech turning was improved, it'd be the superior vehicle

torn fractal Jan 19, 2021, 12:06 AM

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ye mechs could be so much more

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i've never had an incentive to build one

nocturne kraken Jan 19, 2021, 12:25 AM

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Mech suggestion: sidestepping and tighter turns, and a sprint ability capable of damaging things it hits, but turns like a bus. As an added visual: the mech uses its arm to aid the turn, and holds one up/crosses them while charging

torn fractal Jan 19, 2021, 12:26 AM

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controlling the mechs arms in vr like they're your own would be cool

nocturne kraken Jan 19, 2021, 12:27 AM

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Yeah

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I’d love to see them use their arms

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A melee punch

torn fractal Jan 19, 2021, 12:29 AM

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mechs could be bigger, more useful, powerful, the ultimate way of traversing the lands

coarse prism Jan 19, 2021, 12:32 AM

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And they should let you put on decals.

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It's kinda weird that you can't do that on exomechs

torn fractal Jan 19, 2021, 12:34 AM

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i feel like they've sort of been shoved to one side. Just hope there's more planned for them

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 1:03 AM

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Can we turn deuterium into a consumeable, allowing you to get that deuterium boost anywhere?

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 1:40 AM

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no

polar tendon Jan 19, 2021, 1:42 AM

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basalt needs to be used by somethn

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i assume its gonna be for the flamethrower

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but news of that hasn't been around for a while

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:58 AM

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gloomy hazel no

Why? Deuterium rich plants exist and you can make deuterium yourself.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 2:58 AM

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idk

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 2:59 AM

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So you don't have to make it?

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 2:59 AM

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would be op to just have infinite boosters all the time

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:01 AM

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Not infinite, make it expensive.

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Make it require storm crystals.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 3:03 AM

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Make a PVP mode please

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:08 AM

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I am not sure PVP fits NMS, or its community.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 3:20 AM

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Come on, combat is essential for the further development of the game

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:26 AM

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BF is garbage to the point gamers did things never done before.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:26 AM

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gloomy hazel Come on, combat is essential for the further development of the game

If you mean PVE, I would agree with you. PVP no.

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Let's not take that conflict here.

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 3:31 AM

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Not every game needs PvP just saying..not everyone likes PvP either. I've seen PvP ruin a couple games

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:31 AM

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True.

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 3:32 AM

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But a little more in-depth with NMS battle would be cool I agree with that. Maybe more weapons

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Weapons beside the multi tool I mean. If they add more combat based system in game

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:33 AM

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Reminder: NMS is big, insanely big. The odds of meeting another player randomly are astronomical.

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If you're not in Euclid, even smaller. Not in Eissentam, even smaller.

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 3:35 AM

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That's why I said if they add more combat based system, IE like missions or something else that requires combat over exploration

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:36 AM

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I'm confused, PVE is not the best, but you want to add PVP?

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 3:37 AM

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No I never said that.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:37 AM

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No, ET.

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 3:37 AM

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Ooh lol

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Sorry xD

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 3:40 AM

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There are two separate combat segments, space or land(technically 3 if you include underwater as its own), so lets be clear what we're talking about.

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For land, I think the potential is there, but it's driven by lack of good enemies.

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 3:43 AM

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Yeah and I agree, and thats what I personally was referring to.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 3:58 AM

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lilac crane That's a problem you have with HG, don't take it to me.

yeah don't take it personally, that's just my response to anyone in the community that goes after the surface solutions

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:00 AM

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gloomy hazel Come on, combat is essential for the further development of the game

tbh it isn't. There's as much potential in non-combat interactions as there is in combat interactions.

Currently both are lacking in their own distinct ways

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:00 AM

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I do, you have an issue with HG, take it to them, but don't approach or give me blame for a problem I did not cause or had any agency in creating.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:01 AM

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I'm not, I'm criticizing the community

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:04 AM

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But you are by personally responding to me.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:07 AM

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anyway, let's talk about what we'd like to see instead

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:07 AM

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Yeah, that's a lot more useful.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:07 AM

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For non-combat interactions frigates would be a good place to improve things imo

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Make them more active rather than strictly passive, like being able to use trade frigates for remote trades

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:08 AM

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Not too many things at a time please?

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We have been talking about combat. Doing a test with the green goo aliens I forgot the name of, that while enjoyable, there are still some issues.

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Like charging while out of sight of the camera.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 4:12 AM

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lilac crane If you mean PVE, I would agree with you. PVP no.

Yea I mean pve

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:13 AM

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The enemy seems to just walk around in circles for half the time, or refuse to attack you while having your personal shield up.

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It's actually pretty fun shooting them down while referencing starship troopers.

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They do have occasional charging behavior, but not as much as I would like.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:16 AM

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Would be interesting to see non-player combat improved, so you can come across prey struggling against predators, rather than just fleeing all the time

See pirates going after traders, not just you or freighters. Have you stumble into conflicts, not just stir them up.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 4:16 AM

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Tbh I just want a combat rework

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:16 AM

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And they seem to completely ignore you while in an exocraft, which makes the combat part not very fun.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:17 AM

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gloomy hazel Tbh I just want a combat rework

Why rework instead of building on the old?

cerulean thorn Jan 19, 2021, 4:18 AM

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supple warren Would be interesting to see non-player combat improved, so you can come across p...

Exactly

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:18 AM

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It would be cool to have all sorts of new encounters.

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But I doubt you get too much of an improvement in space without overhauling space combat and enemies.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:19 AM

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lilac crane Why rework instead of building on the old?

'cause they've been trying that and it doesn't seem to be appealing to folks?

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 4:20 AM

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Exactly

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:20 AM

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in terms of combat specifically

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 4:20 AM

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First rework then update

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:21 AM

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what's more awkward is some of the changes they've said they made to combat, like in relation to Sentinel behavior, hasn't even seemed to actually happen 🤐

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:23 AM

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What issues are we talking about there?

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:28 AM

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Had to look it up, that Sentinels would appear in larger groups the more you had messed with them

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From the Desolation update:
https://nomanssky.gamepedia.com/Update_2.60

Sentinel health has been lowered, but once alerted and hunting the player, they now spawn in larger groups.

elder rune Jan 19, 2021, 4:32 AM

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Sentinels have always escalated as long as I've been playing...couple of waves of drones, then drones and dogs, finally walkers join in. In space sentinels were progressively larger groups of fighters until they rolled out the battleship.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 4:32 AM

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When do y'all think the next update is gonna drop?

elder rune Jan 19, 2021, 4:33 AM

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I got a group of seven several times in a row last week, so they do seem to spawn in larger numbers, too. My couple of encounters doesn't make much of a sample size though

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:33 AM

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If they follow previous patterns probably either in the spring or summer

harsh sun Jan 19, 2021, 4:33 AM

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gloomy hazel When do y'all think the next update is gonna drop?

maybe in a month or 2

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:33 AM

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elder rune I got a group of seven several times in a row last week, so they do seem to spaw...

yeah, that's always the tricky part of assessing changes with NMS

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:36 AM

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I wonder if the GTA wanted system even works in NMS. Unlike GTA, you do have players walking around with insane shields, weapons, vehicles and space ships.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:37 AM

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It flatly doesn't, considering many folks find it annoying rather than engaging to the point that they kinda pressured HG into making Sentinels sometimes not appear on planets at all, lol

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:40 AM

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The thing is, for new players walkers are insane. For everyone else walkers are tedious more than difficult. There isn't much progression here.

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Maybe, we need to alter the wanted system to take player strength into account.

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Or do progression another way, which is having security orders in addition to wanted levels, but that suggestion may just be too hard for normal.

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The idea to security orders is having regional levels of security assessment:
-Region level
-quadrant level
-planet level
-system level
-star cluster level

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I mean, if its too hard for normal, the people of survival or permdeath may appreciate it.

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Basically, the sentinel forces start blockading zones and enforce "sentinel laws" a lot more harshly.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:48 AM

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Sounds reminiscent of one of my old suggestions, tbh

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:49 AM

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It might be, I don't know who inspired me.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:49 AM

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So yeah, I'm inclined to agree

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But more often than not any suggestions to making Sentinels more engaging are ignored or shot down because the underlying combat is weak

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Or just because it's violating the ~chill~ of the game

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:50 AM

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Which is why it can be segmented or reserved for survival/permdeath.

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Don't people complain that survival and permdeath are too easy?

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:51 AM

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Both too easy and just uninteresting in their approach to challenge

torn fractal Jan 19, 2021, 4:51 AM

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They are, the beginning is the only challenging part

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:53 AM

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I do wonder if blockades are too much for normal, but regional security assessment levels sounds fine to me.

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Which means enemy spawns are determined by prior activity in said region.

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Regardless, both require more types of sentinels, which the game seriously lacks.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 4:55 AM

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hydrosentinels pls

torn fractal Jan 19, 2021, 4:56 AM

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I wouldn't mind aggressive sentinels if they didn't pop up everywhere you go

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 4:58 AM

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supple warren hydrosentinels pls

Lore states/implies that the water does something to the sentinels. It corrupts them to serve the abyss somehow. Underwater should have its own wanted system.

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Those sentinels are how Nada happened.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 5:14 AM

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meh, they're not that caught up in the lore to not toss stuff here & there where it seems it'd be interesting

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The lore didn't keep them from randomly removing Sentinels from some planets

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 5:27 AM

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A few ideas:
-Duo: Two-eyed flying sentinel. While attacking, it has two modes: scan mode and attack mode. In scan, it’s looking at its surroundings and you. In attack mode, it will attack and stand in your way. More vulnerable during scan mode.
-Igna, Toxa, Cryo and Luma: Depending on the environment one of these will spawn. These sentinels do hazard damage instead of regular damage. Destroying them refills upgrade or hazard bars depending on which one is active. They walk on the ground using six insect-like legs.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 5:44 AM

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-Auto: Hovercraft sentinel, can follow exocraft.
-Volo: Plane sentinel, can follow you even at high altitudes. It’s as big as a ship.

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 6:20 AM

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In games as large as this, having a broad appeal I think is important.
So there are at least two dimensions along which HG could build a difficulty gradient that would implicitly sort players by capability and playstyle preference.
First, the galaxies are pretty pointless at the moment. So one of the things that could change as one goes to higher numbered galaxies is the game becomes harder. Tougher sentinels and pirates. larger spawns. larger aggression radiuses and so on. This leaves the first 16 galaxies as a chill exploration experience.
Alternatively, just create a heat map for each galaxy that tunes the aggression level of the sentinels and/or pirates. It should be really cool at 600kly out so new players get the usual experience . and either get hotter towards the core - but this is problematic as getting to the core is a gameplay mechanic that everyone experiences and the core of civilized space would end up in the most aggressive space - or there should be hotspots 300kly out. But that I think would just confuse new players who wouldnt understand the change in aggression after a black hole jump.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:45 AM

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Still considering, why not hotter away from the core?

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Broad appeal does not have to mean easy, it doesn’t mean hard either.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:46 AM

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supple warren Or just because it's violating the ~chill~ of the game

And again, I say to those players...the game has a Creative mode. The entire point of having it is a chill experience.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:46 AM

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I disagree.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:47 AM

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Well, thats great.

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I'd like to see the survival exploration game that I hopped on board for 5 years ago.
Not buggy minecraft in space.
Survival, Exploration, Trade, Combat...that's what the game was sold to some of us as.
Not peaceful base building 24/7

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:48 AM

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I think normal needs a balance. Let survival and perm be hard and hostile.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:50 AM

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Survival and permadeath are not hard and are barely hostile after the first 5 hours.
Those of us that play survival and pd have to intentionally handicap ourselves for an actual challenge.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:50 AM

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That’s a problem with survival and perm. Difficulty modes exist for a reason.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:51 AM

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What if i told you Normal mode from 3 years ago is harder than survival is today?

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:51 AM

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Why bother other players because you want a hard mode that you did not get?

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:51 AM

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They made blanket changes to the difficulty of the game.
Some of us want an actual survival game again

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We did have a hard mode, it got heavily "rebalanced" across all dificulties

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:52 AM

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Then they need to make those changes to survival and perm.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:53 AM

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I would be absolutely thankful for that.

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But it wont happen

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:53 AM

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Normal is not meant to be hard.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:54 AM

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I play on survival/pd for a reason.
Neither are difficult, but at least there's a possibility of a survival game in Surv/PD.
All I'm really saying here is...players complain literally every day about how easy the game is, and that survival is just as easy.
It didn't use to be that way, but players keep pushing HG to add things that continue to make the game easier.

gloomy hazel Jan 19, 2021, 6:54 AM

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I want to see Primate like Fauna other then the Proto-Geks

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:55 AM

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I’m not a fan of bothering other players for selfish reasons.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:55 AM

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Do you play on Survival?

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If you don't, then does it bother you?

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:56 AM

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You ask for normal to be changed.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:56 AM

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And better question, would you suggest players who want an easy experience to play on Survival

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:56 AM

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No, I would not.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 6:57 AM

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The issue with Normal is it's barely even engaging, which goes back to the point of it benefiting from improved balance

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 6:57 AM

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Cool. My suggestion has always been make Survival/PD actually challenging.
I honestly dont care what happend to Normal mode because I dont play on it predominantly anyway

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:57 AM

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We’re good then.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 6:58 AM

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The awkward thing with the difficulty modes is that, to the best of my knowledge, they're still interwoven. That is, Survival & Permadeath are little more than Normal with some light modifiers, e.g. x2 hazard drain or something.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:58 AM

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That’s stupid design.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 6:58 AM

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For any meaningful balance to occur, they would want to separate these out.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:58 AM

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Exactly

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 6:59 AM

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Again, that's to the best of my knowledge tho, and I haven't reviewed the different tables regarding these things in awhile, so it may be that some separations have begun, but I'm doubtful of that

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:03 AM

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That's pretty accurate tbh. They basically just doubled/halved everything and increased the damage slightly. That's why it's so evident that the changes that have been made regarding difficulty were sweeping. They made blanket changes that really affected every game mode, when really, they could have just focused on Normal if they wanted to make things that easy for the players who wanted to have a chill experience.
Just going to reiterate my "future request"...make Survival mode an actual survival experience, because currently its just inconvenient Normal mode.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:05 AM

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I consider normal to be a lot more nuanced than chill. I think the right balance is having zones of chill and zones of conflict.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:15 AM

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Here's my list of suggestions for revamping Survival/PD:

make sentinels more tenacious to get away from
make resources scarce, and purchase amounts at terminals limited.
make pirates better than your current ship. Also make them inescapable (no boosting away).
make ship summoning only possible if your freighter is in the system
change the refining times back to Normal speeds.

This is written with the assumption that players know that Survival mode is the harder difficulty, not just the more tedious difficulty that it currently is.
And if you hate every one of these ideas, just ask yourself, "Do I even play Survival mode?"

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:23 AM

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The old system is using nav data to summon, why not go that approach?

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Consume nav data if you want to summon your ship

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:25 AM

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The point of Survival mode is that it shouldn't be easy though

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All my suggestions are ideas for Survival mode specifically

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:26 AM

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That’s a progression problem.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:26 AM

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Why not?
It's Survival mode. There's a Normal mode for players who've never played before

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:28 AM

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Perhaps in survival, you want to limit RNG upgrade modules to a single one?

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You say you handicap yourself.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:29 AM

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I already dont do things like reload at the same space station to refill the inventory at the vendor.
I was going to suggest either increasing their price in nanites, or reducing the available stock at each vendor, but I'd rather see pirates just scale with your current ship

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:29 AM

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Or to go to the real old style of ship summoning, in survival & permadeath remove the option from the quick menu and require you to find the ship recall points near POIs or have a freighter.

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That puts some pressure on you to grapple with how far you want to stray from your ship on planets in the earlier parts of the game in survival/permadeath

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:31 AM

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brave plinth I already dont do things like reload at the same space station to refill the inv...

Doesn’t that turn survival into inconvenience mode, given grindiness?

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:31 AM

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supple warren That puts some pressure on you to grapple with how far you want to stray from yo...

Yeah, i remember how bruatl that was in the early days. Not quite that rough, but it shouldnt be an absolute cakewalk in the supposed harder difficulty.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:31 AM

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But more than that, it also just makes you survey the land some more before even landing, something you barely have any reason to do these days

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:32 AM

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lilac crane Doesn’t that turn survival into inconvenience mode, given grindiness?

That's why I didn't suggest increasing the cost of them.
I'd rather see the pirates actually be threatening in the game's hard mode

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:33 AM

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Wouldn’t survival players always carry a chart with them? “Given opportunity, players like to optimize the fun out of their game”

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:33 AM

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An interesting idea might be to make it so only c & b class upgrade modules are available at the vendors, whereas a & s are limited to more difficult mission rewards, and defeating more difficult pirates, e.g. three star or whatever the max is, for pirates

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:34 AM

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supple warren An interesting idea might be to make it so only c & b class upgrade modules are ...

That is honestly a fantastic idea.
Like, holy crap, that's a really simple balance fix tbh

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:34 AM

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Back in earlier versions you'd have looked for signal scanners

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So yeah, i guess they'd carry charts, or cheap out and use the signal booster

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:36 AM

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Given sentinels need to be harder in most versions, what are your thoughts on my sentinel ideas?

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:36 AM

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I'd probably just carry a nav data. That's not really optimizing out the fun, thats preparing for a survival experience, especially if you were stranded before without one.

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The additional sentinel types, i think.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:37 AM

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A few ideas:
-Duo: Two-eyed flying sentinel. While attacking, it has two modes: scan mode and attack mode. In scan, it’s looking at its surroundings and you. In attack mode, it will attack and stand in your way. More vulnerable during scan mode.
-Igna, Toxa, Cryo and Luma: Depending on the environment one of these will spawn. These sentinels do hazard damage instead of regular damage. Destroying them refills upgrade or hazard bars depending on which one is active. They walk on the ground using six insect-like legs.
-Auto: Hovercraft sentinel, can follow exocraft.
-Volo: Plane sentinel, can follow you even at high altitudes. It’s as big as a ship.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:37 AM

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lilac crane A few ideas: -Duo: Two-eyed flying sentinel. While attacking, it has two modes: ...

these i think

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or that

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:38 AM

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I just copy pasted it

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It’s the same

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:38 AM

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Yeah, i was busy replying to the old, lol

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:38 AM

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It would be interesting, especially if there were some lore added in to explain them.
Sentinels shouldn't be a pushover at all tbh, so it could make for a more robust experience dealing with them.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:38 AM

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they also still clip through POIs to this day, lol

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I'm sort of skeptical of enviro-hazard anything. On one hand I do want more localized hazards like what you describe, but then when I see how they're kind of negligible once realized, I'm like, "well, we have it now, but...Is it even really adding much?"

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:40 AM

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I hope that Auto and Volo prevent fleeing too much.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:40 AM

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A simple example of this is in the cave spewers

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Love the idea, but i'm not sure how threatening they are

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For spoilers you want || these ||

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:41 AM

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use || for spoilers

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:42 AM

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Unlike the spewers, these drain your hazard. They don’t bypass protection.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:42 AM

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I was under the impression the spewers still drained hazard protection? thonk Guess I misread what they were doing

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:43 AM

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Nope, they bypass it, they act like the oxygen plamts and abandoned freighter radiation leak this way.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:43 AM

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At any rate, I do think having in-atmo & exocraft attacking Sentinels would be good additions, might even make messing around with exocraft more amusing

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I'm not sure I follow the Duo idea. Is it meant as a smarter version of the Drone?

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:46 AM

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Sort of, yeah

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 7:47 AM

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lilac crane Still considering, why not hotter away from the core?

Its an idea from game design theory. "unsorted" players arrive at the beginnign level with a wide variety of preferences. In order to cater for the widest audience, the game starts easy, but has tiered levels of difficulty, allowing players to sort themselves by exploring to the limits of their comfort.

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As they get better, the get to go deeper, or, if peaceful exploration is their thing, they stay in the outer rings.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:50 AM

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I was thinking of having a sentinel specifically designed to act as a “Brain”, basically coordinating sentinels to act smarter and more efficient. However, I don’t know if that either makes sense or is doable to program.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:55 AM

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sharp widget Its an idea from game design theory. "unsorted" players arrive at the beginnign ...

That’s not my question. My question is a matter of direction, given lore and gameplay, why not put the hot zones on the edge? It works with both lore and gameplay.

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 7:55 AM

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oh, go further out?

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:55 AM

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Yeah

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 7:55 AM

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interesting

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i forget where players spawn approx, in terms of radius, how far out can you go before things get iffy?

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:56 AM

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The lore states that the Gek First Spawn were halted advance by Sentinels appearing from the outer edges.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 7:57 AM

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Players spawn roughly 710k from center now. The fade starts around 850k but extends out in the corners to about 1.159m ly from center

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 8:00 AM

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Sounds like its doable then.

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 11:25 AM

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lilac crane That’s not my question. My question is a matter of direction, given lore and gam...

700kly of no difficulty change corewards, but squeezing an entire difficulty gradient into ~140kly outwards seems a bit asymetrical is my only reservation with this approach. Also, getting too close to the fade gets a bit iffy doesn't it?
Perhaps if the outer systems were revamed, and systems 850kly and beyond simply became sentinel systems that are impossible to warp to due to sentinel interference that would work

lapis falcon Jan 19, 2021, 1:06 PM

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||does it work||

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||it works le go||

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:15 PM

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sharp widget 700kly of no difficulty change corewards, but squeezing an entire difficulty gra...

Do you have any idea how much 140kly is? I mean, it still comes down to hundreds or thousands of stars.

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The fade systems are filled with phantom stars.

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 2:23 PM

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Quick bit of info, without the use of portals, it basically would take as much time to travel that 140k ly outward as it would to travel 600k inward, since you wouldn't be able to use black holes to expedite the travel. To get out there would take a lot of warping unless you knew how to effectively use glyphs to get out there.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:26 PM

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Fair point.

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I was thinking adjusting jump range on freighters to allow those with an upgraded enough freighter to get there.

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That is a suggestion I want to implement regardless

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 2:36 PM

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I am not sure its that fair. a S class freighter can go so far per jump, and thats before upgrades, that the effort of walking, launching and flying a ship to use a black hole every alternate jump... it would probably be faster to just chain in freighter jumps in that time.

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unless you luck out and hit a really good black hole.

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so an upgraded freighter could outwards could traverse quickly methinks.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:40 PM

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Current upgraded freighters reach 5kLy at most.

sharp widget Jan 19, 2021, 2:41 PM

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that said - because of the r-cubed volume relationship, there are way more stars between 800-700kly than 700-600kly

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and typical black holes average 10kly? 15?

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:41 PM

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The distance to traverse is still 140kly to the fade

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The thing is, black holes cannot take you away from the center.

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They always move closer

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So you cannot use black holes to enter the fade

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:47 PM

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sharp widget that said - because of the r-cubed volume relationship, there are way more stars...

The ring may be bigger, but you don’t circumnavigate, you go straight through. So probably incorrect.

copper dawn Jan 19, 2021, 2:52 PM

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lilac crane So you cannot use black holes to enter the fade

So far no black hole sent me closer to the center. It sent me usually to opposite side of Galaxy instead. 🤔 Unless you mean the ones in 2016 No man´s sky, before they were changed to have some generated exit point. 🤔

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 2:53 PM

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No. Closer to the center does not mean distance from destination to exit

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So they sent you to the other quadrants, but that number shown on the map still decreases in value

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NEXT changed black holes to always take you closer

brave plinth Jan 19, 2021, 3:18 PM

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sharp widget and typical black holes average 10kly? 15?

6k roughly if you ignore the ones in the fade and the ones close to the center.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 6:03 PM

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supple warren Make them more active rather than strictly passive, like being able to use trade...

I promised myself I would get to you. I'm interested, how would this system work?

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How does one use a trade frigate for remote trading?

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:26 PM

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Use the fleet command terminals or something, set certain amount of whatever is to be traded to pull from freighter inventory, then have an option to select system(s) to attempt trade in, which would bring up galaxy map from which to pick nearby systems.

If there's a station available to trade with, sell the stuff selected & return to freighter with units & for new direction.

If looking to buy, flip it around to seek certain amount of whatever in system, based on what you already have in inventory/have discovered, buy it, return to freighter with whatever & to await new directions.

Something like that, roughly speaking. Essentially save yourself some warping/teleporting.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:27 PM

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That sounds pretty cool.

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So these are basically custom frigate missions.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 7:32 PM

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No, no timegates

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:33 PM

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How would you do this without a time gate?

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I mean, it is automation.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 7:52 PM

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What about the other frigate types? Support, Exploration and Industrial?

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For trade, I do have a different idea. What if the trade frigate allows access to more and rarer goods?

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Trade frigates can be deployed(does require fuel or a consumeable). Once docked, you can trade there or setup automatic trades. Once deployed, it will trade it's automatic trades.

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The trade frigate has an internal bank, that can be cashed in or out.

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Internal bank is 0, and the frigate cannot buy anything, only sell.

plucky lodge Jan 19, 2021, 8:40 PM

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Get this, get this...Different kinds of living ship, like a hauler living ship or fighters etc.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 8:55 PM

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Why?

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 9:01 PM

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lilac crane I mean, it is automation.

It's not automation, you're actively directing the trade frigates in terms of what to haul & sell, or to buy & bring back, which system(s) to attempt trade with, and so on.

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The entire aim of this change, of which that is a single example, is to offer more direct, active engagement with frigates. They are a throwaway feature for anyone wanting to actively play during a game session at the moment, due to their passivity.

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This goes back, in part, to what I was discussing awhile ago in terms of improving player capabilities, to enabling them to do more than just the super basic things one can do now.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 9:25 PM

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It is automation.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 9:48 PM

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We have different understandings of what automation means, apparently

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The fact that it's not a recurring activity after you set it up is what prevents it from being automation to my mind

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 10:04 PM

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Semi-automation is also a form of automation, where you automate things only partially. You move some or all tasks to be done from yourself to a system.

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I don't see automation as a bad thing.

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It's such a shame that they are a throwaway feature.

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 10:14 PM

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Whatever the case, the degree to which you're actively directing them and having to redirect them if you want them to continue, is why I distinguish it, and also why I would avoid putting timegates (in the sense of what we currently see on frigate expeditions) on this activity.

lilac crane Jan 19, 2021, 10:15 PM

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What limits trade frigates from making unlimited money under your proposal?

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What regulates it?

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 10:22 PM

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Been juggling ideas between better adjusting economy response so sales eventually net less & less and/or having it so if you want to make bank, you'd need more trade frigates.

The idea being that you cap off what each trade frigate can haul so they can't just haul stacks of 9999 and easily econ crash.

At the same time though, I'm not terribly concerned with it because the economy is already thoroughly broken, and you can already make unlimited money with several activated indium mines.

nocturne kraken Jan 19, 2021, 10:26 PM

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If races get a little more flavor to them, it would be neat to take advantage of the korvax hive mind and allow their bodies to vary immensely in appearance. I mean things such as: large heavy machinery types for constructing korvax structures, small, agile scouts to survey land, extremely resilient types for collecting/exploring dangerous planets, and a huge stationary “moderators” that oversee local korvax populations.
These would be primarily to add spice and variety to a race that is pretty much the same as the other two. These wouldn’t be playable

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If they can upload their minds to other korvax, it’d make sense to have different bodies they can pilot for a goal before switching to their next

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 10:30 PM

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Yoo, that would be super cool

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In a similar vein to enhancing the NPC variety, having them around revised Points of Interest, like seeing the large machinery types in the process of constructing part of a POI would be cool

proud moon Jan 19, 2021, 10:54 PM

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Bet you guys it’s gonna be a procedural update again

nocturne kraken Jan 19, 2021, 10:58 PM

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supple warren In a similar vein to enhancing the NPC variety, having them around revised Point...

exactly. big boys around construction, small ones sometimes seen in the wilds scanning land for future sites, and the extreme type can be found drilling away on some hellworld. or maybe just his dead husk

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i wouldn't mind a procedural update, tho id love more clothes/armors in the QS shop too

supple warren Jan 19, 2021, 11:07 PM

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I'd prefer more outfits/outfit pieces as rewards from missions or scavenging outta the way places

coarse prism Jan 19, 2021, 11:35 PM

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Procedural armor would be super amazing. Just imagine clothing being sold in stations, trading posts and minor settlements

visual cloak Jan 19, 2021, 11:46 PM

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confused as to why they didn't give customizable rewards for completion of missions instead of creating a shop

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though i'm thinking they had in mind to create the quicksilver shop with the intention of charging actual money, then added it and decided against it

visual cloak Jan 20, 2021, 12:04 AM

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would be nice

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But I still hope they find a workaround to everyone’s bases so they can regenerate every planet

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:16 AM

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visual cloak confused as to why they didn't give customizable rewards for completion of missi...

Isn't that like exactly what the quicksilver shop sells?
Can you clarify what you're asking?

visual cloak Jan 20, 2021, 12:17 AM

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Would be nice if it didn’t exist and we could earn everything by exploring and playing missions

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:20 AM

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I'm still not sure I understand.
How is that different from players earning quicksilver (by exploring and missions) and choosing what they want to unlock at the vendor?

visual cloak Jan 20, 2021, 12:21 AM

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I think the store and the quicksilver is pointless and should not exist

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:22 AM

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Well, its already implemented at this point and fulfills the same purpose, so im not sure what changing it would help.

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Plus you get quicksilver from doing the story missions too, not just Nexus stuff.

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I don't see how completing the story missions would give players an equivalent reward (if there was not the whole quicksilver thing).

visual cloak Jan 20, 2021, 12:23 AM

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That’s OK I honestly don’t care that much. I was just replying to the previous conversation

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:38 AM

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brave plinth I'm still not sure I understand. How is that different from players earning qui...

Instead of earning carnival tickets to exchange for rewards you just get the reward. It's more rewarding, at least to some of us.

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All quicksilver does is add a grind to earning rewards, and makes the missions less satisfying since you're not getting much from them, just vendor trash & carnival tickets.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:41 AM

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It's literally the exact same concept as earning nanites to buy upgrades,

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:41 AM

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The problem with quicksilver, nanites, and salvaged data is it adds an intermediary step for no fucking reason.

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Just let people scavenge or do missions & get the things directly

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:42 AM

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Its added because players keep using duplication glitches to get infinite amounts of it

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HG keeps adding new currencies because players keep cheating and diminishing the entire value of anything in the game

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:43 AM

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Well that means there's an underlying problem...Your regular gameplay isn't satisfying enough to encourage them to play normally.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:43 AM

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The regular gameplay isnt satisfying enough so players have to cheat to cutout the entirety of the gameplay?

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:44 AM

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They choose to cheat because of that, yeah

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Why they even bother when there's creative mode is baffling to me, but 🤷‍♀️

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:44 AM

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The game has loose progression. The underlying issue is that there's just no progression at all because players hated that in 2016.

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Players hated the game in 2016 leon

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:45 AM

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Players hated that there wasn't progression in 2016, so they added progression, but it's still bad progression

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How is the progression bad:
-Lots of it still heavily RNG based
-Difficulty still plateaus very quickly, so any benefits of progression are negligible.
-Lots of it still very bland grind.
-Portions of it are just timegated for no apparent reason.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:47 AM

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There was progression in the game in 2016, but the game overall was shallow.
Now, the progression has every shortcut imaginable with zero reason to explore any depth they may add in the future.
There's zero reason to do anything in the game because there's no reward for doing so that can't be easily circumvented, whether its by cheating, glitching, or a new feature.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:47 AM

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The game is still very shallow.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 12:49 AM

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It's impossible to give it any more depth at this point because everything is within reach from the getgo.
No player is wowed by anything because they hang out here and reddit and go "wow, that's so cool" and a week later its "I'm bored and seen everything."
The majority of players don't want an exploration game at all, and unfortunately, Hello Games is going to continue to cater to those players first.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 12:49 AM

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I think some of the issues are less that there's no reason to do anything, and more that regardless of what there is to do, it's questionable in its intrigue or enjoyment.

Like I said, people choose to cheat/glitch/exploit, because much of the moment to moment gameplay is found to be unsatisfying.

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Like, think about the majority of the moment to moment gameplay. It's hold button to mine, or gather something, then it's menu interactions for crafting/repairing/recharging, and when it's not that, it's basic navigation.

Occasionally it's disrupted by Sentinels, predators, or pirates, but only ever occasionally, and many folks just find these annoying rather than engaging. However, without these disruptions, there's little else to enliven the moment to moment play.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 1:49 AM

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brave plinth Its added because players keep using duplication glitches to get infinite amount...

“Given enough time, players will optimize the fun out of a game.”

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Dupe glitches are a recurring issue in the entire industry.

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Even the oldest games still have dupe glitches if you’re willing to find them.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 1:51 AM

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supple warren Like, think about the majority of the moment to moment gameplay. It's hold butto...

What's wrong with basic navigation or crafting things in a survival setting?
Swap out the sentinels, pirates, and planets, and you have one of the most successful games to come out in the last 10 years.
Why are those things bad just because NMS uses them?

If anything, it seems like a radical increase in difficulty would make those things more engaging (it works for nearly every other survival game ever made).
Right now, they are as you describe, mundane chores. They have no worth to most players. You mine this thing to craft this thing to build this thing so you can sit on your butt and make money while not playing, then only log in to drain the ATM.
Go to the Anomaly and you'll find players who afk to wait for another round of handouts because they wouldn't play this game if it had any amount of depth because they just don't want to play a game that has any challenge and they don't want you to call it Easy or Creative mode.

This game has an identity crisis that's perpetuated by players who continue to push HG to make things even easier (but don't dare call it Easy mode).
Think of the following, is there any balance here:

S class everything is king shit, so why is it so easily attainable?
Crashing Cobalt is the top dollar, so why do stations sell thousands of it?
Why are resources even valuable in the first place?
Sentinels are so easy, so why are they not a. more difficult and b. absolutely everywhere?
Trading Pugneum for black market mods was an awesome idea, so why the hell does the Station sell it? (the station guarded by sentinel ships)
There's nothing to do with 4.3B units, so why are players racing to riches and why is getting rich so easy?

The game has so much content potential but it really needs to offload half of the garbage that's turned the game into Farmville and focus on the stuff that's actually adding game play. Otherwise, it's going to just be another shallow Minecraft clone.

gloomy hazel Jan 20, 2021, 1:57 AM

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yes.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 1:57 AM

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lilac crane Even the oldest games still have dupe glitches if you’re willing to find them.

The difference is that this community preaches exploits as gospel. It's not "Activate the EBR to scan for a Derelict freighter," it's "Make sure to hide the EBR in your personal refiner so that you get it back for free."
It's not "A Void Egg will cost 3200 quicksilver to purchase, like 6 Nexus missions," it's "hang on, I've got 30 Void Eggs, I've been duping them and handing them out all day."
You could make the Nexus missions the most exciting missions in the history of gaming, and the players will go, "no thanks, I'll just dupe them."

gloomy hazel Jan 20, 2021, 1:58 AM

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Would be cool if they interested the concept of being stuck in between realities in the actual game. Atemis really seems shaken by their experience there, I think it would be really interesting and effective to see what HG does to integrate it into gameplay and making it worthwhile and enjoyable/engaging

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 2:02 AM

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I would be stoked for an expansion on the story with Artemis (or a season of weekend missions).
However, a surprising number of players hate the fact that the game even has a story, so I really doubt something like that would ever happen.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:09 AM

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You know what I see? A community that doesn't have things to strive for. Multiple different splinter groups each trying to promote their own values as ambition. And that those that do strife for things, either build bases or seek efficiency by finding exploits.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:10 AM

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brave plinth What's wrong with basic navigation or crafting things in a survival setting? Sw...

Here's the thing, basic navigation & crafting aren't necessarily bad, on this you're correct.

However, I presume you're referring to Minecraft, and it handles these two substantially differently. For navigation, it's largely similar, but there's actually spaces to find and explore.

In No Man's Sky, those spaces are few & far between, or largely pretty basic. What I'm referring to when I say spaces there, are points of interest and sub-biomes, e.g. caves & underwater.

As to crafting, No Man's Sky still has a tangibility problem with its crafting. The vast majority of what you craft has next to no real presence in the game world, nor any function outside of the menus. In Minecraft, next to everything crafted has some tangibility to it, whether it's as simple as being able to drop it in the world, or as subtle as appearing in your hands as you eat it, but more than either of those, much of what you're crafting is literally building blocks, or pieces.

Beyond that, this relates directly to the process of gathering. Much of what you gather in Minecraft also has a physical, tangible form, and in gathering it, you directly change the world.

In NMS, some of what you gather has a physical, tangible form, but even what does just eventually regenerates, so there's less of a sense of affecting anything in the world.

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(sorry if you address some of that in the latter portion of your response, I just went after the first part and, in glancing at the rest, noted it seemed to be going after other ideas)

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 2:25 AM

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supple warren Here's the thing, basic navigation & crafting aren't necessarily bad, on this yo...

Yeah, and for the most part, I'd agree with you here.
In reference to MC (which, you are correct), even those worlds are predictable. That's just the nature (and weakness) of procedural generation. If you know all the ingredients in a loaf of bread, you aren't exactly surprised by a bakery.

NMS has a leg up by having significantly more world-building than MC though, however, the type of player that HG has been trying to capture is the type of player that just doesn't care about world-building. Do villagers in MC have a fleshed out backstory, or is there some insanely twisted lore about creepers that I wasn't aware of? Because of that, there's no distractions from players just building stuff. After all, it's foundational to that game. You mine it, you craft it.

That aside, I hope true multiple biomes per planet happens soon but tbh I think there will just be more complaints afterward.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:26 AM

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brave plinth Yeah, and for the most part, I'd agree with you here. In reference to MC (which,...

The lore community likes to disagree with that, not caring about world building

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I don't think the minecraft player is captured by HG at all.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:27 AM

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Yeah, NMS' worldbuilding is way ahead of Minecraft (not that that takes much), but then it falters in making it relevant at all in regular gameplay

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 2:27 AM

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Well, I guess MC got major updates over the last couple years then. I've been playing that since 2010, and I've always known it to have effectively no lore that wasn't stapled on as an afterthought.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:27 AM

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(I think Jappards meant that the NMS lore community would disagree)

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:28 AM

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Yes

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I very much see an active NMS lore community.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:28 AM

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The problem is lore is lore and lore is dead except as animated by the community discussing it.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:28 AM

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Theorizing on things, trying to predict what HG will do next.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:29 AM

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Story is more compelling than lore alone, albeit both play hand in hand, and at their best harmonize.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:30 AM

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Well, Today's story is tommorrow's lore.

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I'm not sure if each splinter group in the NMS community is willing to get along with the others. Depending on who, they either dislike that the other splinter group exists, or don't care as much.

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Because if we are dealing with small communities that don't like each other, that is very much a problem.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:32 AM

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It'd be more interesting if HG would go their own route more, but with more focus behind things. The frayed ends they leave are what tempt the community to play armchair designer/dev so much.

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And trying to accommodate that sort of community is bound to be a nightmare, lol

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:33 AM

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No, HG needs to play consumer politics to accommodate the different groups that make up this game.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:33 AM

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I very much disagree, lmao

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Trying to accommodate has been what they've been doing and we still have disparate groups with mixed vibes on the game

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 2:34 AM

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I saw someone arguing on reddit because the unit cap was 4.3B and they wanted it to be higher.
Somebody commented saying that there wasn't anything to spend that on.
Their response, "I know but I don't care. I just hate that the cap is so low and I want it to be higher."
So really, I don't think the player base knows what the hell they want tbh.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:36 AM

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supple warren Trying to accommodate has been what they've been doing and we still have dispara...

Which is why I lay the problem on the community.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:38 AM

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brave plinth I saw someone arguing on reddit because the unit cap was 4.3B and they wanted it...

More like two different groups, one group wants to accumulate more and more money for the sake of earning money and the other group wants to be able to use it to live in luxury.

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It doesn't help that HG keeps trying to create new groups of people rather than fix the problems the old groups have.

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Wait, that sounds familiar.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:41 AM

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HG kinda did that in one case, in the game itself, lol
Community: "we want more meaningful alien faction relations"
HG: -creates guilds-
Community: "not like that!"

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:41 AM

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What update was that?

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:41 AM

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Guild relations are to faction rep what nanites were to units, in a way.

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Atlas Rises, I believe.

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But yeah, it's basically as you say, they sort of keep adding stuff to create new groups instead of addressing the old groups as much.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:48 AM

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This reminds me of what happened to Space Engineers. The developers added more and more stuff to cater to existing groups based on what people modded into it. Different groups wanted to take the game in an entirely different direction, to the point where the game had no focus. Each time the devs tried to make a hard decision another group revolted. Each time they did, the devs put things back. In the end, the game looked more like a tech demo.

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There were more problems, but it did come down to that.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 2:50 AM

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Not to dwell on days of old, but if space combat wasn't an absolute walk in the park with even the starter ship (or worse), I'd actually value the help from the local factions when ambushed by pirates. Having the local npc's save me from pirates in a previous version of the game showed how damn useless they are in the current version.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:52 AM

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lilac crane This reminds me of what happened to Space Engineers. The developers added more a...

This is more or less why my kneejerk response to, "Accommodate the community" is nah at this point. Address our bug reports, please, but don't follow the community for feature ideas or problem solutions.

The latter they claim to know, but in reality, we've sometimes seen the opposite (e.g. buying multiple charts instead of scrapping charts altogether for a retooling the existing exocraft POI scan system for exosuit & ship).

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 2:53 AM

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lilac crane This reminds me of what happened to Space Engineers. The developers added more a...

I would actually say that's totally whats happened with NMS at this point.
I've said this before, they need a project integration team. Just a group or person that asks the question, "How do we mesh this into the game so it doesn't feel tacked on and disconnected?"

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:53 AM

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I do think that Project Integration is the right move. I agree.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 2:53 AM

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Which yes, I recognize some irony in that last point as it's yet another community solution, but if you're the dev, you've already created that system, it's baffling that you'd not expand its use and would instead develop a whole separate system.

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Yeah, project integration may even have avoided them creating a redundant system, lol

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 2:55 AM

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Well, I think there is a right way and a wrong way to accommodate community feedback.

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It's still important to know what your players are doing and who they are.

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Usually market research has that job.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:03 AM

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Sure, but then you risk overvaluing the active/vocal folks, or mistaking the players' behaviors for an indication of interest in a feature, overlooking context like the newness of the feature, or the absence of much else to do besides it.

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Like the basebuilding feature in the game has seen continual development and focus, probably because the data rightly indicates many are engaging with it, but that data wouldn't necessarily indicate that they're doing this because there's not much else to engage with.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:09 AM

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Did not say they are perfect. AAA makes the mistake often in thinking that market research is the end all. It’s not.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:12 AM

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supple warren Like the basebuilding feature in the game has seen continual development and foc...

The hard part is that there is a group that does base building because they like it and a group that does it because they have to do it to unlock the rest of the content.

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I don’t think we are at the point of no return yet for our community. I have a few ideas to salvage what’s there for groups.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:14 AM

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There's also that group that does it just for the automated moneyprinters

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:15 AM

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Resources now sell for 10% value. Problem solved.
Honestly, though, how hard is it to just put the same local area restriction on extractors that refiners have?

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:16 AM

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Local area restrictions? Lost me on that

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:18 AM

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For the people who don’t like base building, I suggest blueprints as a band aid. Either buyable at stations or you can create them yourself. BPs are for copying and placing bases, assuming you have the resources.

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Not sure how much of a band aid it really is.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:22 AM

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supple warren Local area restrictions? Lost me on that

Limits the placement of machines in an area, so you can only place so many of one type close to each other.

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Not sure how effective that really is.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:25 AM

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Oh, I wasn't thinking in relation to the extraction devices, so wasn't sure what that might be relating to

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:26 AM

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Yeah, sorry, i should have clarified that.
I mean, the local area restriction is effective enough that you have to keep additional refiners at least 50u away (the limit being 2 large, 4 medium per area).
Push players that want to be mining tycoons to explore and survey new areas/planets.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:30 AM

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Or just create new bases based on the existing planet?

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:30 AM

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The weird thing with the extractors is that, I'm not entirely sure what purpose they're meant to serve. Automation of resource gathering, sure, but there's next to nothing that demands such a constant feed of resources like they produce.

Most tech you craft is once & done at a certain point, so it wouldn't be that. Crafted products might be what they're for, but when the raw resources extracted outsell them, that's unlikely the case.

The only thing that comes to mind would be for rechargeable tech, but you can typically find those resources or products so easily, it leaves extractors as a big ???

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:30 AM

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Well, I guess that would not be an issue with sub-biomes.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:30 AM

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Like, I hate to say nerf things, but if something is just enabling players to never leave the same location ever, its clashing with the base concept of an infinite universe to explore/claim/etc

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:32 AM

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The people who dislike base building, what is your biggest annoyance related to it?

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:32 AM

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supple warren The weird thing with the extractors is that, I'm not entirely sure what purpose ...

I actually have a really good example. I've set up small outposts to mine the resources needed to fix crashed ships. Typically, I use these to help new players get a decent second ship up and running, but I could make an entire run out of finding, fixing, and selling ship wrecks.

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No real issue with base building, I use it to enhance my exploration experiences. Some players want 1 giant base on the perfect planet, so they never have to explore again.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:35 AM

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I am a base builder myself. I consider big bases to be pretty unwieldy. I have actually gone smaller over time.

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I like to be able to populate the galaxy with bases, but I often just don't have a reason to.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:36 AM

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lilac crane The people who dislike base building, what is your biggest annoyance related to ...

Shoehorned into the starter tutorial before you even know what kind of planet you might want to build on.

Later still shoehorned into the Artemis Path, so either you have to build another base or not have scrapped the first.

It's inflexible & clunky-feeling to build anything more creative. Not being able to move parts around w/o deconstructing & reconstructing is annoying, and no virtual grid to place things arbitrarily along to be more creative with.

It's grindy to build much of anything besides small huts.

There's no way to save base designs to reconstruct elsewhere, should you find another place you prefer and don't want to rebuild from scratch.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:37 AM

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I do think the blueprint system I suggested earlier is going to help with #5, so you can copy and setup at will.

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For #1, are you talking about the archive system? Yeah, not a fan of that one myself.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:41 AM

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Maybe? It's the part of the tutorial where it's like hey learn to build a shelter or NEVER LEAVE THE STAR SYSTEM

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:42 AM

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Ah, you don't consider it to be time to settle yet.

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The thing is, awakening is meant to serve as a tutorial to introduce you into the game.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:45 AM

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yeah but i don't consider basebuilding something to introduce ppl to that early

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:46 AM

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I disagree.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:46 AM

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It's not a core part of the game.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:47 AM

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Base building is a core part.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:47 AM

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Nope.

halcyon mason Jan 20, 2021, 3:47 AM

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Maybe if base building was the only feasible way to even survive on some planets, its importance would be more clear. Like, environments even more hostile than current extreme planets

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:48 AM

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Yeah, it's not all that integrated into...Anything.

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A good portion of unlocks that were tied into it have been offloaded to the Anomaly

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:49 AM

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You and I have different definitions of what Core means.

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The thing is, a lot of new players don't even come to know that the anomaly exists.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:50 AM

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Have you played the new start recently?

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If you follow it, it basically shoves that in your face pretty quick

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:50 AM

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I started in the new start.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:50 AM

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Okay, hold up, which new start, I guess

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Because there's been several changes to the start, lol

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:52 AM

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Please explain to me why a whole bunch of new players say to me that they never heard of the base building at the anomaly.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:52 AM

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Base building in the tutorial is only there because they pushed it there.
The main aspects of the original game concept are still there without it.
Dont get me wrong, I like that we have it, but it's definitely forced in, and a lot of new players hate the tutorial.

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You have to have a base before you can get to the Anomaly

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That's actually how the missions are set up

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:52 AM

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lilac crane Please explain to me why a whole bunch of new players say to me that they never ...

Joined friends' games? Returning to old saves? 🤷‍♀️

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:53 AM

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No, the base building parts unlockable at the anomaly.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:53 AM

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Oh, i think we misunderstood due to a typo

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:53 AM

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Oh, never heard of unlocking basebuilding parts at the Anomaly?

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I think that may be one part they failed to direct people to in the revised tutorials then

halcyon mason Jan 20, 2021, 3:54 AM

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You know what would fix it? Teaching the player about bases before they even get their first ship working. Put the player on a planet with storms or freezing nights, and tell them to build some kind of shelter while they look for resources to fix their ship, or die

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:54 AM

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Probably not lol

halcyon mason Jan 20, 2021, 3:55 AM

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Would need other reworks as well

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:55 AM

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I think its a matter of quality, not quantity.

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Could always seperate base building introduction into its own mission.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:55 AM

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Hiro, that would be amusingly misleading to the value of bases then, lol

Unless you also made it so planets were harsh enough to justify setting up shelters on

halcyon mason Jan 20, 2021, 3:55 AM

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supple warren Hiro, that would be amusingly misleading to the value of bases then, lol Unless...

That’s exactly what I mean, that would be the other half

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:56 AM

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I'm inclined to think basebuilding tutorial should occur as you place a base computer, not be something pushed by the intro tutorial or later story missions, but 🤷‍♀️

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 3:57 AM

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Warp into new system, ship locates an abandoned base computer, that starts the whole base building chain?
Foundation-ish, but not as forced.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:57 AM

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New players don't have the same info you do, they probably don't know the base computer exists without the game giving info on it.

halcyon mason Jan 20, 2021, 3:58 AM

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@lilac crane I started playing like a month ago and I knew about bases from the beginning tutorial

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 3:58 AM

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~exploration!~
I kid, buuut

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 3:58 AM

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I started NMS kind of blindly TBH.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:01 AM

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brave plinth Warp into new system, *ship locates* an abandoned base computer, that starts the...

That inadvertently reminds me, I'd love the ability to dismiss missions from the log and disable suit notifications/tips.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:01 AM

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Unlike you, I do consider it to be important enough to teach it very early.

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I do agree with dismissing missions, I absolutely hated the hire-able NPCs and wished I could clear them out. The game forced those NPCs on to me.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:03 AM

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Well, obviously (to the consideration comment), but I think it distracts from learning other gameplay elements, or worse, may overwhelm an already overwhelmed new person trying to wrap their head around the other parts of the game.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:06 AM

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I disagree because I consider bases a core part of the experience.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:07 AM

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I think even if you think that, you might be inclined to agree that it might be overwhelming at the start.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:07 AM

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As for overwhelming a player, that's a pacing issue.

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I wasn't overwhelmed at all, thats because I took my time building my base first.

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However, do we really want a universal start?

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:13 AM

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Creative starts right next to a free base computer. Your choice if you want to claim it or not.
Or you can hop in your ship and leave. Maybe something like that for a new start, idk.

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Knowing previous updates, I can probably expect that Survival mode will end up just as easy anyway.
Maybe they could just have a Free Start vs Normal Start.
Free Start giving you a ship, a base, and all the normal restrictions in Normal mode with none of the story and Normal Start being what they have now, and let those players play together.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:20 AM

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Or maybe tailor the tutorial to a chosen role and leave the rest to be picked up later?

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:20 AM

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Honestly, I'm either out of ideas or just out of energy to contemplate it anymore. I'm probably going to be done with the game soon and that makes me sad.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:21 AM

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lilac crane I wasn't overwhelmed at all, thats because I took my time building my base first...

yeah, but imagine you're also entertaining the idea of jumping star systems and this basebuilding junk is shoved at you.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:24 AM

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I don’t understand your point. There’s a significant population that likes base building.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:27 AM

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My point is that if you're starting the game and say the only thing you know about it is, say, big space exploration game, and you're hit in quick succession by:
-Hazard protection low!
-Tech damaged, repair!
-Recharge ship tech!
-Btw also check out building a base.
-But also wait isn't this a space exploration game how do I go to other star systems?

You might get a little overwhelmed.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:29 AM

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My suggestion was meant to enhance existing roles, not take them away. It’s the diplomatic solution of a custom start or custom tutorial branch.

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TBH, do we really need to include repairing tech in the start tutorial?

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:33 AM

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Nope, take it out.
Who cares about repairing stuff. Its just chores that gets in the way of this awesome base building game

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Like, why do planets have hazards anyway?

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:34 AM

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Sigh, way to strawman my position.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:34 AM

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What if I just want to build a base on a really hot planet?

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Have you ever started a Creative mode save?

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:35 AM

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I dislike creative.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:35 AM

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You start right next to a free base computer and a perfectly functional ship

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:35 AM

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Are you going to let me explain why I think that is the right idea?

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:35 AM

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Why do you dislike Creative? It doesn't hinder your ability to base build at all.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:36 AM

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lilac crane My suggestion was meant to enhance existing roles, not take them away. It’s the ...

sorry, i think i may have mixed up which of us you were addressing, i'm not opposed to custom starts for what it's worth.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:37 AM

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brave plinth Why do you dislike Creative? It doesn't hinder your ability to base build at all...

Because I like to earn my things, that’s why.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:38 AM

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Here's the perfect trifecta of planet selection for new players:
Earth like
No sentinels
perfect weather
[bonus] glowy mushrooms, probably.
Creative mode makes all of that quicker to get to so those players can start building their dream base right away without worrying about money to source materials to build the base.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:38 AM

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I like progression.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:39 AM

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It's hard to explain this because you started with Origins. Getting off the planet is one of the first steps of progression in the game. It even plays a curated song for the first time you land at the space station.
Making it easy takes away from the game.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:40 AM

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Nope, I didn’t start in origins.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:40 AM

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Well you started after NEXT at least, and that made it way easier

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This game was a survival game at onepoint

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And I'm honestly tired of pretending it will stay that way.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:43 AM

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Did I touch a string by suggesting the removal of it in the tutorial?

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I did intend to introduce it, just at a later date.

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Do you want to make it so tech requires regular maintenance?

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:48 AM

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I have not suggested that a single time.
Your suggestion was to give all game modes the Creative mode start.
This is a survival game. If you didn't want to deal with any survival aspects, there's a Creative mode.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:49 AM

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No, not the creative mode start at all

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:49 AM

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Your suggestion even removes the possibility of players intentionally handicapping themselves by passing on the starter ship.

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I just started a creative mode start a day ago.
Thats exactly what you described. Fixed ship and a base computer right nearby to start base building right away.

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The reason I dont like the suggestion is because HG is lazy af and will put it on EVERY game mode.

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And that will be the end of the survival game

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 4:52 AM

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I think you may be talking past each other a little

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 4:53 AM

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Yeah, im moving on. I'm playing a different game atm anyway.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:53 AM

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At the start of the game, the game gives you a choice on what role you like:
-Explorer
-Bounty Hunter
-Engineer
-Survivalist(? Still figuring it out)

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Depending on this, you get a different tutorial.

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 1:04 PM

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as long as they remove the trial by death the game currently starts with.

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nice for storyline. bad for casual players.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 4:19 PM

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Trial by death does not help, no.

tardy wave Jan 20, 2021, 4:22 PM

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I think a good way to introduce base building early on without forcing it on people would be to have it be an optional way to start. Instead of starting and immediately having to run to your ship for hazard protection, they could let you build a little hut and recharge it in there if you wanted to, then find your ship afterwards. That could also help to introduce bases as a tool to be used for specific purposes, instead of a place where you have to live out your life.

gloomy hazel Jan 20, 2021, 4:48 PM

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So basically StartMeUp from Fallout 4

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You pick options like start with basic base and starter ship , start with small fleet and basic freighter

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 5:12 PM

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Not what I have in mind.

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 8:13 PM

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Frankly I really never had a issue with the game start in NMS. Save for the few times I started on bugged worls without life support

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NOW THAT will kill ya lol

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 8:17 PM

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survivorship bias.

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of course people in a discord channel dedicated to nms passed the death trial.

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but, the majority of people that ive shown the game, and decided to try it on my xbox, took a gander at the start sequence, and just never showed up for session #2.

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those players are clearly not here. telling us how much the beginning sucked so much that they never even found and repaired their ship before giving up.

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 8:43 PM

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Huh, yeah as a survival gamer it felt, very easy.

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 8:43 PM

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Well, its a good thing they dont use the words "survive" or "survival" on any of the descriptive media for the game...

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 8:43 PM

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You run from red to yellow, get your ship, wala

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They do actually

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 8:43 PM

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I was being sarcastic. Apparently the common consensus is that No Man's Sky is actually not nor has it ever been a survival game. I guess Hello Games didn't get the memo though.

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 8:43 PM

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Oh

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I fail at humor and sarcasm

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😛

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 8:44 PM

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sharp widget those players are clearly not here. telling us how much the beginning sucked so ...

also even if they muddle their way through some of it, the tutorial is just a draaag

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(i have gone through it too many times now 💀 )

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Even tho it's not too difficult to stay alive, that's probably one of the big reasons I've never bothered with permadeath.

Losing "progress", whatever, having to go through the tutorial slog over & over? Pls no.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 8:55 PM

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sharp widget but, the majority of people that ive shown the game, and decided to try it on my...

The thing is, the tutorial doesn’t represent the game too well.

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 8:56 PM

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exactly. which is why its stupid that its the first thing new players encounter. Esp when the game is now on gamepass and those new players perhaps downloaded the game on a lark, and will judge a game on its first hour of gameplay

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 8:57 PM

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The reason why I suggested removing repairs in the first tutorial(and teaching later) is because you don’t do too many repairs anyway.

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 8:58 PM

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most new players are too busy looking at stuff to even be paying attention to the prompts the first time

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 8:58 PM

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If it’s low priority, you can teach it later.

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 8:58 PM

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and then when teh game kills them they're all confused. "whats happening"

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:01 PM

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Two options:

Start the player with a high hazard bar
Start the player off with some sodium already in the inventory.

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:01 PM

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Well I dunno about the tutorial, It was pretty alright in my book, what I don't really like is that Asimov (the track which plays when you are approaching the space station) kind of feels off

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:01 PM

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then, they might be unlucky enough to have figured out how to actually recharge their shields and not die

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:02 PM

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Nothing really happens when you enter the space station

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:02 PM

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i say unlucky because, invariably, theyve wandered away from the spawn area and cant find it again

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:02 PM

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The compass should redirect them to their ship.

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:03 PM

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no ship yet

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:03 PM

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olive sentinel Nothing really happens when you enter the space station

Maybe moving the track to the moment where you warp to the space station might fix this problem

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:03 PM

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The ship is not active on the compass?

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:04 PM

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then they spend 30 or so minutes gathering sodium and getting closer and closer to dying. before they finally do. and respawn back where there are some items and objectives. But generally put the controller down and enough with this bullshit

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i dont frankly know? i imagine not before youve found and repaired it.

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and all the beginning players ive watched have gone off script before that

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:05 PM

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It's just a little bit a hit or miss situation, because my first playthrough was on Survival and I had literally no problems following the tutorial along

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:06 PM

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me to

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:06 PM

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I've changed up the thing to Normal of course, but yeah

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:06 PM

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It is, which is the problem with the current tutorial.

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 9:06 PM

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lilac crane The ship is not active on the compass?

I think you have to repair either the analysis visor or scanner before the compass appears at all, I forget which it is atm

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:07 PM

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but... older I guess gamers come into games with an expectation of objectives to meet.

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my friends. and kids. picked up the controller and started exploring right away.

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:07 PM

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That's stupid. The ship should always appear as a marker, you should always know where your ship is, regardless of damage.

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:07 PM

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and exosuit messages went totally under the radar

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:07 PM

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What I would like to change about the tutorial is make the building quest separate, because I personally just don't want to build anything most of the time

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 9:08 PM

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It may seem stupid, but it's one of those carryovers of how you're in a spacesuit and reenabling its systems

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:08 PM

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And the Asimov situation just really bothers me, I absolutely love the soundtrack, but it feels really off to listen to it when you literally do nothing

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Either make the space station much larger, or move the track to the moment where you warp to the space station, I wouldn't even mind if it locked the controls for a while

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:11 PM

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The dilemma here is having a linear tutorial, a nonlinear game and avoid players getting overwhelmed.

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:11 PM

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I mean, moving the building thing will be a really huge step, like it would clear up a ton of stuff at the same time

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You can move along the plot, the game can teach you that you can have several quests at the same time and all that good stuff

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 9:13 PM

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True. You could open up the tutorial into multiple quests rather than 1 questline?

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:14 PM

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It's just all about finding the balance, since giving the player a ton of quests at the same time will overwhelm

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 9:15 PM

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Im not even sure approachability will be all that much of a focus of course. The product sales arent likely to spike much past the rate they see with those changes. Spending time on that versus new content, wouldnt make much sense

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:15 PM

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I mean, it might attract some players who have abandoned the game because of the tutorial

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 9:16 PM

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True, though something like space stations or more procedural story content to engage in would bring in way more players

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Its all a math issue with development

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:16 PM

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I have several people who really don't understand why the game keeps shoving building mechanics down their throats

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:16 PM

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the goal, in good game design, is to offer the player a bite, but let the player choose the size

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 9:17 PM

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Oh I agree.

storm barn Jan 20, 2021, 9:17 PM

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I just learned that you can’t change the main color of your freighter if it’s black. Are they looking into this?

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 9:17 PM

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? Black?

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Ive yet to see a black frieghter

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:17 PM

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olive sentinel I have several people who really don't understand why the game keeps shoving bui...

I mean, me neither, but I've managed to find a really cool planet, so the game was lucky to give me a planet I could actually want to build on

storm barn Jan 20, 2021, 9:18 PM

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Yeah. If the main color is black you can’t change that part to a different color

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Which sucks for me

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:18 PM

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a. its not black. its metallic green. Which means its actually untextured. There is no paint on that section of freighter. And a freighter painted black looks totally different.

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:18 PM

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Otherwise I would be totally more annoyed if it gave me a total mess of a planet

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 9:18 PM

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I traveled a lot so I have thousands of worlds

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Maybe a few hundred Id live on

storm barn Jan 20, 2021, 9:18 PM

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So a glitch then or something?

gloomy plume Jan 20, 2021, 9:18 PM

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Maybe.

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I dunno Toasty

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:19 PM

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no. when all models are wrapped, the game chooses to paint them with a pattern that can be transparent, with areas of primary, secondary and trim? color.

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some freighter patterns are very transparent. Revealing the freighters actual metallic texture.

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It's just the paint job the freighter has.

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now, in fairness, I think we should be able to discover and learn? buy? different patterns we find. and then change our freighters pattern.

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I would like a freighter in WWI style dazzle camoflage

storm barn Jan 20, 2021, 9:22 PM

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That does sound cool. So does that mean I’m stuck with it then?

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I like the pattern idea

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:22 PM

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yep. go farm up a new one

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sucks if thats the S class you spent a weekend farming

storm barn Jan 20, 2021, 9:23 PM

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No it’s a crappy C class

sharp widget Jan 20, 2021, 9:23 PM

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Well then.

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At any rate, your first clue is a freighters color scheme should match the station.

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Think of this as a stupendous opportunity to pillage the pins in #nms-questions and go and find the 5kly range 48:21 S class freighter of your dreams

brave plinth Jan 20, 2021, 9:27 PM

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If you mean this color, its usually an indicator that the actual color is something else

📎 20210120112431_1.jpg

storm barn Jan 20, 2021, 9:30 PM

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Yeah, I think I’ll stick with it for now and just hope it’ll change to the color I gave it at random eventually

supple warren Jan 20, 2021, 9:36 PM

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Off the wall but putting it here for future reference.

Frigate unit sink idea:
Every time you send them on expeditions, you have to pay a varying amount of units depending on expedition difficulty, and number of frigates deployed.

This way they're no longer just free units or stuff for some low cost fueling. They actually cost some amount of units to operate & deploy.

Alongside this, an alternative way to repair them might be to pay a certain amount of units. With that, you're given the choice of "free" repairs with resources, or quick repairs with units.

olive sentinel Jan 20, 2021, 9:41 PM

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I totally agree about the fast repairs

lilac crane Jan 20, 2021, 11:53 PM

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TBH, I don't use frigates because the benefit does not outweigh the cost of sending them.

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So, increase the cost, and increase the potential benefits?

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:01 AM

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I was of the impression many found them pretty cheap to send off & make some easy money back

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:07 AM

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From the wiki:

📎 NMS_loot_table.PNG

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This does not look the best for value.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:10 AM

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still, fair amount of folks seem to just see it as free stuff/money

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:12 AM

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If you're trying to fix people getting free stuff, this thing is the least of your problems.

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We need to get rid of all "cycling" recipes.

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And for fabricators, two options:
-Don't fabricate.
-Consume resources to fabricate.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:15 AM

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I'm less concerned with free stuff and more with addressing the absurd requests for unit sinks, when it comes to the above idea

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:16 AM

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Yet your complaint is people seeing it as free stuff.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:16 AM

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This is one weird spot that makes some sense to have unit costs

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I'm not complaining, I'm highlighting that as a positive reason people bother with the expeditions

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So I don't really see added costs as that detrimental when they consider it a little bonus to pick up when they load into the game

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:19 AM

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I think we need to turn down the faucet a little.

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Before messing with sinks.

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Having the biggest sinks will not change the fact that AI is such a big farming method.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:24 AM

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The thing is, you mess with the faucets, then the existing sinks become even worse and grindier.

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The only people messing with the faucets doesn't impact that much are those that have already taken advantage of them for ages now.

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However, adjusting costs with those groups in mind is its own sort of problem.

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:27 AM

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supple warren The only people messing with the faucets doesn't impact that much are those that...

Leave those be, it will prevent the group from becoming bigger.

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It will shrink over time.

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However, I think the best way to do this, is to be gradual with these changes. Think the boiling frog analogy.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:28 AM

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How though? Besides leaving the game, or new folks coming aboard to offset them, any that remain will remain stupidly wealthy since there's next to nothing to spend all that money on

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Unless HG were to empty their wallets out by starting everyone off with a cut of their units, lmao seanbomination

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:31 AM

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The thing is, after messing with faucets you can mess with sinks.

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You want to avoid making sinks worse and grindier to the point where even players who don't exploit or AI farm have to do it in order to keep up with the game.

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Which is why you nerf the biggest faucets first.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:37 AM

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yeah but a bunch of the costs are already predicated on the existing profits/pays

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So you mess with the profits without simultaneously messing with the costs and you risk just making things miserably grindy

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:41 AM

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What sinks are the problem?

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:43 AM

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Better starships, freighters, frigates, multitools, exosuit slot upgrades, emergency broadcast receivers.

If you scale back the faucets as you call them, suddenly those all look a lot worse to try & afford.

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 12:55 AM

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I don't understand what direction you really want, do you want bigger sinks or smaller sinks?

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 12:57 AM

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Personally I'd prefer smaller sinks, but with recurring ones available for the folks that can't help themselves making money hand over fist or just fixated on trade for whatever reason.

There are currently next to no recurring unit sinks/costs in the game, which is why people are able to get crazy wealthy.

It's not just that the game is overly generous with units, though that is also a factor.

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Frigate expeditions make perfect sense as an existing element to which to associate recurring unit costs with, considering there are crews operating them, that are currently unpaid (😱).

Plus ppl aren't too fond of the current dock & repair method for when they return damaged, so offering a quick way to repair them via units is a simple QOL touch that also just adds another unit sink.

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 1:01 AM

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What's the problem of people fixating on trading? Some people trade in order to trade, not because it makes the most money, but because they like the experience of trading.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 1:02 AM

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No real problem, except when you build costs with trade profits in mind, which in turn pushes others to have to trade that might not want to to afford stuff because you've also not provided other methods of getting said stuff.

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All part of that balancing act of appealing to different groups

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 2:14 AM

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You do want to be careful not to increase recurring maintenance too much.

gloomy hazel Jan 21, 2021, 3:34 AM

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sPaCe cApe

storm barn Jan 21, 2021, 4:17 AM

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I feel like multiplayer modes would be great, like fleet combat or something

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 4:22 AM

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I don't think that's what NMS needs.

visual cloak Jan 21, 2021, 4:37 AM

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every time i come in here for the past few days i see a lot of opposition lol

#

like come one, respect each other’s opinions

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i don’t really agree with toasty, but toasty didn’t say ‘this is what nms needs’

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 4:39 AM

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I am respectful. I want to be careful not to create too many groups.

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There are some things NMS just isn't. NMS is only half a multiplayer game, not even that.

visual cloak Jan 21, 2021, 4:42 AM

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but it’ll probably end up getting more attention down the line

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even though i’d rather it doesn’t

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 4:44 AM

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I also think that creating too many modes will cause issues. I have seen it cause issues for other games.

visual cloak Jan 21, 2021, 4:45 AM

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would be best if accessible through missions or going through a portal or something

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i think we have plenty of game modes

#

only one i use anymore is normal. tried creative for like...10 minutes, and quit my longer survival mode because sentinels and extreme weather are just an annoyance

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 4:55 AM

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lilac crane I am respectful. I want to be careful not to create too many groups.

they're there whether or not you'd like to see them emerge. Hell, we have a specific demographic that would love nothing more than to blow up planets because ???

visual cloak Jan 21, 2021, 4:59 AM

#

🤯

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 5:02 AM

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If they were to add any more modes, there's just a couple I'd like to see, and if they do one of those right, the other wouldn't necessarily even need to exist...

...That's a Custom Mode, where you can adjust various parameters relating to, say, biome frequency, amounts of high conflict/wealthy star systems, frequency of galaxy types, frequency of extreme hazard/Sentinel planets, blueprints/upgrade modules/equipment (ships/multitools) as scavenge/mission rewards, etc.

The other is an adventure mode that reduces the focus on crafting/recharging & trading, in favor of scavenging & unlocking stuff through side missions, and has some more frequent pirate/predator/aggressive Sentinel encounters to create more little skirmishes. If they were to go further with it, have more involved puzzles that require paying attention to the environment and interacting with aspects of it.

#

Adventure Mode, as I imagine it at least, would be a balance between Creative & Survival, and distinct from Normal in that it sheds the largely mildly annoying survival/crafting elements that don't add all that much to the gameplay given the minimal difficulty in Normal.

visual cloak Jan 21, 2021, 5:08 AM

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i like the adventure concept

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 6:12 AM

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supple warren Frigate expeditions make perfect sense as an existing element to which to associ...

Other than the starting missions when the frigate fleets are being built and upgraded... when do frigates ever return damaged?

#

I mean, its completely player choice if they want to engage in repairing frigates or not. I don't

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 6:15 AM

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sharp widget I mean, its completely player choice if they want to engage in repairing frigate...

? If you don't repair them, you risk losing them...And frigates aren't exactly cheap...Plus not everyone knows how to, or bothers to, arrange optimal fleets for expeditions to avoid damages

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 6:15 AM

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I dont repair them because my frigates never take damage.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 6:15 AM

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Yeah, and good for you, but there's folks out there that have frigates that do take damage so 🤷‍♀️

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And one of the primary complaints you see from them is that the current process of repairs is on the annoying side

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 6:16 AM

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and I wasn't aware that "sending exploration frigates on a science mission" was complicated "arranging an optimal fleet"

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 6:18 AM

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There are all sorts of ways people handle the expeditions, and they're pretty heavily RNG, so even if they do them like that, their frigates can take damage through no fault of their own

#

The point is, they can take damage, some have bad luck or whatever and they have them coming back damaged often enough to where doing repairs gets annoying and they'd like some other way to deal with them than boarding the frigate and going spot to spot repairing them.

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 6:22 AM

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I will agree that there is a time when the fleets being sent are mostly composed of C class frigates that this can happen.. But it's short term. and stops as soon as you are more agressive in beating the mission parameters. especially with the freighter upgrades and frigion mission bonus craftables.

#

If anything, I am here to ask for harder frigate missions. I deliberately send out weak fleets to try and provoke some damage now

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 6:29 AM

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At any rate, it was a minor part to the larger suggestion I was making, which was essentially Pay Your Damn Crew to send them out at all, lol

#

Also I don't even know wtf "harder" frigate missions would look like considering how they are now. Worse RNG rolls?

Not my idea of fun personally but 🤷‍♀️

brave plinth Jan 21, 2021, 6:49 AM

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How about these for a frigate expedition revamp:

Combat Missions: requests reinforcements for massive raid on Sentinel battleship (defeat # of drones or make the battleship destructible) or a (hastened) freighter rescue event.
Trade Missions: Bolsters supply of trade goods in systems visited during expedition and returns with some decent valuables as normal.
Explorer Missions: locates system anomalies (the first wave anomaly for that system) and portals that have been opened mysteriously to an unknown destination.
Industrial Missions: offers to identify several resource hot spots in each system visited during expedition, or collect resources as normal.
Support Missions: Locates emergency signals in each system visited during expedition, including Desolation freighters.

gloomy hazel Jan 21, 2021, 8:21 AM

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I like the combat one, I wish that you could encounter such things in game

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 11:26 AM

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I like it.
Ive been thinking of ways to use frigates in system for missions.
industrial frigates could harvest space based resource nodes.
explorer frigates could 'light up' POIs on the planets below
combat frigates would protect the others from pirate raids.
supply frigates could literally be sent to harvest their own frigate fuel so I don't have to refine dilithium gel all the damn time.
trade frigates - could have some role in finding settlements, tradeports and colossal archives.

plucky lodge Jan 21, 2021, 11:55 AM

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Unlockable freighter building structures

solar shard Jan 21, 2021, 12:32 PM

#

What is the consensus on further improvements (or any) and additions for the living ships? I really like their aesthetic and the idea of them having a personality, and I appreciate there is a balancing aspect with the ease that comes with fuelling them, but I’d still like to see hello do more with them.

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 1:44 PM

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id like to see living ships added.

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Ive been waiting, ever since the preview.

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 2:15 PM

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Living freighters you mean?

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 2:38 PM

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Can we have a sort button on inventories?

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 2:41 PM

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supple warren they're there whether or not you'd like to see them emerge. Hell, we have a spec...

There is a difference between groups that come here for something and groups that would like something.

sharp widget Jan 21, 2021, 5:17 PM

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lilac crane Living freighters you mean?

No. i mean living ships.

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I mean, clearly HG wouldn;t be so utterly brain dead to officially release a new ship type without bumping the ship cap? There are currently 5 ships types, and ship scrapping is a necessary gameplay mechanic, and we currently have 6 ship slots. Until there is a 7th ship slot, living ships are dead to me.

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And HG, if they had a thinking neuron between the lot of them, would know that many players would be in that situation. And would not have released the ship update without a corresponding ship slot.

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As there is no ship slot. And I don't want to cast aspersions on HGs developers as drooling imbiciles incapable of forming half sentences. They surely didn't release the living ship update then.

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and I don't want anyone else insulting HG by calling them brain dead troglodytes. So please don't try and tell me the living ship update was released. I will be forced to report you.

lilac crane Jan 21, 2021, 5:29 PM

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Jeeze man, chill.

#

I do want more ship slots. That there are ships that are living you can use, is a factual statement. Whether or not there are enough slots is another matter.

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You don't have to go around the teacup here. The messaging format that is discord doesn't allow for it. If you want more ship slots, you can say you want more ship slots.

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I was thinking adding landing pads specifically for ship storage, so you can either show off your collection or get more slots.

supple warren Jan 21, 2021, 5:51 PM

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I think a ship management terminal would probably be a little more workable. Interact with it and it shows ships stowed away to pull back to the hangar floor/landing pads, swapping with whichever one you select.

Ideally it would also let you dive into the inventories and sort those out, so the one withdrawn from storage would already have whatever you want ready in its inventory from another ship.