📚lore_discussion

[split night]

sharing military tech might not even be enough
Wynn soldier have to be send back in Fruma to get trained and send out

[hybrid gazelle]

so th option of sending actual sodliers woudl be limited

milltiary tech mean nothing if you lack manpower

[split night]

yeah that too

we kinda fucked everything up in Wynn

[hybrid gazelle]

sending soldiers to Fruma also may be unviable cause unless Fruma have better resource than Wynn

[split night]

by killing her's majesty xd

[hybrid gazelle]

that still is not enough

yeah

[mystic fulcrum]

one of the option is build hundreds of player statue all over fruma

[hybrid gazelle]

well while yes player is the catalyst for the rebellion to spark and succeed

[solid ibex]

lowkey

[hybrid gazelle]

I highly dbout player would be worship to have statue built for them

well at least one

[solid ibex]

its a good way to continue from the fruma story

[hybrid gazelle]

though tere definitely more people out there that deserve to have statue

like for example Syndra and Mora

as they give their lives for the rebellion to succeed

[solid ibex]

since the beasts are moving and wynn is very vulnerable now without the recruit program, long story short ITS OVER

[limber swan]

ye the player definitely gonna be in big trouble when the King finds out

[mossy widget]

i feel like this may not really matter considering the world is on the verge of ending Orphion and saphanis are abt to pull up bro

[split night]

I expect the rebel build one for us

since we're sorta the catalyst

for all the changes

[hybrid gazelle]

I mean yeah but the rest of the people do not know that

[solid ibex]

it would be so interesting to see the extreme measure of multitasking the player has to do

[hybrid gazelle]

I dont think Ragni King know about Orphion and Saphanis

[mystic fulcrum]

the royal garden could be change to be some kind of museum

[mossy widget]

also didnt the corruption stop or was that the decay

[hybrid gazelle]

so I dont think he would be okay with the line of recruits no longer flooding in

no

Corruption did not stop

the decay is

[mossy widget]

ok

[hybrid gazelle]

the corruption still getting worse and worse

[mossy widget]

wynn may be cooked then gg

[hybrid gazelle]

we see this in the ARG

Yeah

Wynn is fucking cooked

Corruption literally become worse years by years

and then boom fruman recruits stop coming in

wtf you do

[solid ibex]

might be a great time for the player to actually venture in realm of war via corruption portal

[mossy widget]

blow up and die

[limber swan]

only people who can save Wynn now are the people of Gavel

[solid ibex]

its time that shit gets added back

[hybrid gazelle]

what is there to fight in Real mof War to get shit over

if killing realm beast is not enough

then what else?

[split night]

Wynn is very cooked unless the portal is close

[hybrid gazelle]

according to Anathema

[split night]

which doesn't seem like coming any time soon

[hybrid gazelle]

War would resume to its own course anyway

cause she was not in full contro lof it in the first place

so like

[limber swan]

since the decay is shrinking Gavel might be able to send help

[hybrid gazelle]

wtf you do in this situation

[mystic fulcrum]

player kill anathema, this might be enough to make all annie terrify and stop going through portal

[hybrid gazelle]

why would annie give a shit

devils do not give a shit about Anathema

she cant even control them

they are manifestation of hate

they would not give a shit if Anathemai s dead

the only solution rn

is somehow the player use resoance waver

to bind the corruption portal

[solid ibex]

this situation is literally so cooked lmfao

[hybrid gazelle]

that the only thing that can be done

or else Wynn is fucked

[split night]

oh yeah we have a command block in our hand

why not manifest golems or contrusts

to aid in the war?

like we can create more manpower if we lack one

[solid ibex]

and its 100% on the player's responsibility as the fruma folks are only concerned with Fruma, Player and Tasim now have to actually deal with the realms getting ready to go crazy

Tasim will most def helping us especially after our exchange in fruma lmao

only way to get redeemed

[hybrid gazelle]

just maybe Yusano figure it out

then player can close the portal

[split night]

woaw

we can go in dern and beat Saphanis ass then close their door

[hybrid gazelle]

okay but

[split night]

this is peak

[hybrid gazelle]

corruption corrupt golem

wtf you do at that point

[solid ibex]

who else would be more familar with glyphs

wait

the

[hybrid gazelle]

I have one person

[solid ibex]

whos his name again

[split night]

weave the golem back into material
do corruption infect non-living material??

[hybrid gazelle]

you know

[hybrid gazelle]

thyes

yes

they do

[split night]

oh wait yes

[hybrid gazelle]

they even reanimate shit

[split night]

i forgot about the shit in decrepit sewer

[hybrid gazelle]

they reanimate apple

they reanimate fucking rock

[solid ibex]

would olms be brought back into the picture again

[full jackal]

But uhh honestly I have a weird idea for boss rushes accessed from Temple of Time that goes like this.

Trial of the Steamworks [Lv.85-95]:
Big Boss Mech-DM4 > Rusted Warmachine > A16-L32 Roaming Destroyer > Adamastor > Mining Mech TERA-4M > Antikythera Supercomputer > Maxie + Rhay > Ava

Trial of Heights [Lv.80-100]
Kroton > The canary. > Sensei Miyagi > The Heroes of Rodoroc > Draani the VIII > Infernal Hound > Steam Ophidian > Ghost of Axelus + Korzim > Orange Wybel > Colossal Ahms Carvings > GARAHETH > The Canyon Colossus > Annihalation > Qira Unbounded

Trial of Silence [Lv.100-103]
50 Waves of Dernic creatures, Looming Prescence in wave 10, Panic Zealot in wave 25, Fool Eater at wave 40, The Eye at wave 50

Trial of Agony [Lv.103-120]:
Jenprest > Kymer > Lanu > Linton > Mel > Reynauld > Tasim III > Commander Lilles > Syndra I > Mora > Zhiraok I > Syndra II > Quill > Jiro > Yuman + Yusanu + Yulie > Zeph > Zhiraok II > Soosu I > Zeph > Gikyo > The Canopy > Majin > Tasim IV > Her Majesty > Hyhet > ANATHEMA, BEAST OF WAR (upgraded Anathema solo fight)

Like I’m sorta thinking when you finish every boss in-game for the trial, you unlock it in the temple of time and have to do them back-to-back, without any refills in-between, and when you finish it you can get items, emeralds, and potentially wards. Gambits also can be applied here, and bosses scale massively.

[hybrid gazelle]

well

there only one alive

and IDK

sound racist if we assume every olms know runes

that like saying every asian must know math

[full jackal]

I mean I’m Asian and I know.math

[solid ibex]

50 waves might be too much brochacho ✌️

might be a good use of Temple of Time tho

[full jackal]

No you must suffer

50 waves

[hybrid gazelle]

who else know runes

I feel like there should be

[full jackal]

But if you defeat them quickly you immediately get next wave

[hybrid gazelle]

I mean

we have Qira

SURELY

qira know how to use rune right

[full jackal]

Also you can do a cyber grind type thing for every area cuz why not

[hybrid gazelle]

like she is the socerers

LIKE SURELY

[solid ibex]

Qira needs to work her fucking ass in whatever shits bound to happen

[hybrid gazelle]

she would know

dude this is the only way for Qira to prove she is not a fucking fraud

so she better do something now

[solid ibex]

bro wait wait wait

[hybrid gazelle]

or else she on perma fraud watch

[solid ibex]

i just had a thought

what if TCC has some actual use in later quests

but like the canyon stuff ends really after the raid

but it would be cool to see bro actually be the protector

for once

[hybrid gazelle]

the doguns construct TCC lower half and pliot it like mech

[split night]

bring TCC into RoD and having it beat Saphanis ass

[hybrid gazelle]

https://tenor.com/view/gipsy-danger-walk-in-the-rain-jaeger-pacific-rim-gif-16632271

[solid ibex]

son 😭

[hybrid gazelle]

WTF you do when Doguns pliot TCC and beat up Saphanis

[solid ibex]

but that would be so cool

[split night]

im girl

[hybrid gazelle]

Qira riding her slave mobile to join battle at Dern

Corkians roll up but who care

Villagers pull up so they expand their teritory in Dern

[split night]

the elves are also here too

[hybrid gazelle]

the 4 orcs come up to solo army of parasites

[solid ibex]

i do wonder how Two will plan for the future

since she will handle the plans the queen had and future plans for whatever is gonna happen

[hybrid gazelle]

Thesand and Eltom mayors arrive with army of half human and half villagers(they are strong enough to one shot the player)

Dwarves arrive to call Saphanis the n word

[full jackal]

TOCHTER 😭

[solid ibex]

type shit

[full jackal]

Is that better

[hybrid gazelle]

Dern story looking great

Ragnar finally arrive in Dern

Bob dying husk in the corner

[full jackal]

Who is Ragnar even

[solid ibex]

pulling literally everyone to take down Saphanis ✌️✌️

ALSO we are gonna fight Orphion at some point icl

[hybrid gazelle]

https://tenor.com/view/avengers-endgame-avengers-assemble-captain-america-marvel-gif-14341304

[dim plover]

Ragnar but he isn't ok
Ragnarok

[hybrid gazelle]

Worid arrive to scam Saphanis

[solid ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/calm-gif-8293915206003753096

[dim plover]

It is also now that I've just realized that Ragnar is an incomplete word for Ragnarok

I've never made that connection before

[hybrid gazelle]

can we count Worid as Dernface

[split night]

Aegis is there to command the army

[solid ibex]

Sherk showing up with his donkey to destroy Saphanis 💔

[hybrid gazelle]

Grookwart students arrive to use the transphobic spell against Saphanis

[split night]

can we have the bread lover guy here to distract Saphanis too

[solid ibex]

Ava constructing the Saphanis Destroyerinator

[full jackal]

Saphanis would be weirded out

Then kill themselvesk out of secondhand embarrassment

[split night]

that would be Dr.Legendary job

[full jackal]

Problem solved huzzah

[solid ibex]

Dr Legendary would just ask Saphanis if he could make a stronger mech based on him 🥀

[full jackal]

Are you talking about the Flamboyant Wynn Larper person

[split night]

no

[hybrid gazelle]

Doctor Urelix and Qira collab to turn her villager slaves into Golem

[full jackal]

Who then

[split night]

the guy at the entrace of sky island

[hybrid gazelle]

(They are now stronger slaves)

[split night]

i forgot where he is

[hybrid gazelle]

everyone arriving on Dern but it's with powerpuff girl intro theme

[solid ibex]

bro

Yahya

with his mushrooms

its GGS for Saphanis

[full jackal]

No get Saph on drugs

Then they’ll chill for the rest of eternity and not bother with the physical plane evil shit

[hybrid gazelle]

Zhiraok using his hyper speed in Dern and fall off into the void(he actually die this time)

[full jackal]

NOOO MY GOAT 💔

[hybrid gazelle]

acutally nvm

that

that bad

that was fucking awful

[full jackal]

No I mean like that’d be uhh

[mossy widget]

we power of friendship rez him again

[full jackal]

Uh……

Imagine that though

[hybrid gazelle]

Dont worry QIra can save him

[full jackal]

Uhh…

[hybrid gazelle]

she can make him a new Nasin Charm

[full jackal]

Why did you make me think of Soosu hanging herself

That was sad

[hybrid gazelle]

but he would become her slave tho because she need accountant

[mossy widget]

tf

[solid ibex]

i wanna ask though

[full jackal]

Trashie was talking about what if Soosu hung herself

I’m sad now

[solid ibex]

what happens to the sovreign's blessings

[hybrid gazelle]

it stay

[full jackal]

Just like the time I saw a boy who had red hair

[hybrid gazelle]

Two talking how the mark presist

I think

[solid ibex]

oh ggs Soosu 💔💔💔

[full jackal]

And the kitten who was stuck in a tree then jumped off the tree and hung itself

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah soosu cooked but she probably learn how to live with herself

[full jackal]

And the diabetic kid trick-or-treating

[hybrid gazelle]

I hope so

[full jackal]

And the blind person in the 3D movie

[hybrid gazelle]

like I fucking hope

[solid ibex]

Soosu needs another way to find some way to live properly

[full jackal]

And the lost dog who didn’t have any legs

[solid ibex]

Zhriaok is probably gonna help her a lot

he the goat

[full jackal]

And the giraffe who had a short neck (that might’ve been a deer actually)

[hybrid gazelle]

implying that Zhiraok not be on pile of paper

trying to manage Fruma after the fall

[split night]

stay on near forever

unless they focus their effort on removing it themselve

[solid ibex]

i think the rebels are gonna handle that

[full jackal]

I mean I could definitely see Soosu trying to get rid of it

But Zhiraok is gonna be busy fixing Fruma and stuff

He’d never give up his blessing till his work is done

[split night]

she can have fun and fuck off, that's her wish

[solid ibex]

i dont think they would let the sovereigns manage the areas much

[split night]

they would

they said it themselve if i remember

[full jackal]

Why would they let some random terrorists run the place

[split night]

since most fruman wouldn't listen to them

they would have sovereign do the convincing for them

[solid ibex]

fair enough

[solid ibex]

so whats the point of the rebellion then if they just gonna be viewed as random terrorists lmfao

[split night]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1135348779877404869/1402455625816084580/1277048160359026770.gif

[solid ibex]

sure they are terrorists but the queen's reign is practically over

[split night]

for freedom

[solid ibex]

lots will be loyal but fruma is technically free now

they just need to manage the aftermath of the queen's shenanigans

[full jackal]

That’s like letting [[that one mayor who’s super fucking based]] be president. Would they be good? Yes of course! Would a big portion of Fruma hate them based on biased assumptions bigotry and false views? Yes

[split night]

my country was ruled over by the france years ago, we rebel and now im free to chat here

[solid ibex]

my country got ruled over by like 4 countries at some point and i wanna get the fuck out of here 💔💔

[split night]

😭

[sharp mango]

my country was ruled by the spanish, the americans, and the japanese and we still are a terrible country

W actors in the senate

[full jackal]

We used to be ruled by the Portuguese till like 27 years ago T_T

[solid ibex]

we were occupied by UK for like 2 years its geniunely crazy

[sharp mango]

hi im an actor and the medium of television is dying out, so i decided to take a spot in the national government so im still relevant

[sharp mango]

crazy.

[full jackal]

They even shot up protestors

[vestal sentinel]

how would yall rank sovereigns based on power and abilities

[solid ibex]

we moving a lot from the convo lmfao

[full jackal]

Uhhh

[solid ibex]

hmmm

[sharp mango]

powerscaling sovereigns 🔥🔥

[vestal sentinel]

yea

i think zhiroak on top tbh

[full jackal]

Maybe like: Gikyo > Soosu > Oru > Zhiraok > Tasim > Two > Majin

[vestal sentinel]

due to speed alone

or im just misunderstanding his ability-

[solid ibex]

slander wise ill rank Two below Majin

since she aint really a fighter but ofc spymaster

[full jackal]

I mean two literally says that if she fights us she has a death wish

[solid ibex]

its cool abilities but she prob gets one tapped by a lot of things

[sharp mango]

zhiraok is using projection magic to speed up

[hybrid gazelle]

speedblitzing as arguement no way

[full jackal]

Actually I think I overrated two

[vestal sentinel]

mf think it's jjk

[full jackal]

Two is like between Oru and Soosu

[vestal sentinel]

on wiki it says he's faster relative to the human body or sth

[full jackal]

I mean like based on what we see

He can probably circle all of Fruma in like 2 hours

Assuming we scale up Fruma to be more realistic

[vestal sentinel]

do we even know what oru does

[full jackal]

Nope

I’m bullshiting

[sharp mango]

potential sovereign

[solid ibex]

okay bro LMFAO

[sharp mango]

0 empirical feats
0 abilities listed
7 in-dialogue mentions

[split night]

why are we calling everything potential now

the guy is just not even in the game to know how he is yet

[sharp mango]

its blueprint slander

[split night]

this is like the thragg situation

xd

[full jackal]

Not **RETCHES

POWERSCALING

[vestal sentinel]

after testing in totally accurate battle simulator, soosu FOLD gikyo

real

and true

[full jackal]

What are these harrowing screeches entering the sacred palace of my eardrums? They are disgusting and filthy like a starved raccoon in a landfill! Cease your incessant babbling immediately!

[split night]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1121844531155976222/1399761329375543306/aouwee.gif

[split night]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1121844531155976222/1399761329375543306/aouwee.gif

[slender copper]

I can see Soosu being powerscaled higher because she can bend matter and can probably separate every atom on a human being... but Gikyo's gift allows him to take the powers of anyone he shapeshifts into... and the only way to truly kill changelings (unless this was proven wrong and Gikyo stays dead from Sui), is fire.

So if Gikyo wasn't trying to tramatize the person they are fighting (like Gikyo intentionally shapeshifting into the <character>'s friends), he could probably just shapeshift into the <character> and kill everyone .

[solid ibex]

Gikyo stays dead

[split night]

someone really should turn this into a gif

[slender copper]

...IT AUTO CORRECTED TO HE BECAUSE I MISSPELLED "THEY" NOOO

[split night]

i know

xd

i'm just having fun pulling that image everytime it happens

[vestal rivet]

Gikyo do just be a silly guy-

[solid ibex]

im so glad we had new portraits for later Sui because that is not the right expression she should be making

[rain saffron]

Gikyo...

[slender copper]

*changeling

[full jackal]

Maybe it’s just me

But I constantly use “guy” as a completely gender neutral term. Same with “dude”

[rain saffron]

Gikyo is the best bean

[full jackal]

Trueeee

[slender copper]

Depends on how you use "guys", because in plural form it can represent a group of people.

[ashen salmon]

gikyo fucked my mom

[full jackal]

I mean I have called women “dude” before in front of their face

[full jackal]

Huzzah

I’m so happy

[ashen salmon]

every now and then they appear from the shadows to taunt me

“i fucked your mom dumbass”

[slender copper]

😭

[ashen salmon]

i have not slept in weeks

[rain saffron]

Gooo to bed go sleep

[vestal rivet]

guy is one of those words that changes in meaning based ono context
when you are referring to guys and using it as the word of reference, it means a bunch of dudes
but when you say "hey guys" it stops meaning just men
similar case with dudes

[full jackal]

Gikyo I heard you had s[[hyperlinked blocked]]x with an older woman last night!

Gikyo: That’s right!

What’s their kid’s name?

Gikyo: Their name is @ashen salmon I fucked his mother!

—Martin Luther King Jr.

https://youtu.be/dgF4rMS3y98?si=Tgg6GdmT0wU_x3v2 imagine this but with your name

[vestal rivet]

https://tenor.com/view/eyebleach-wtf-osomatsu-san-osomatsu-choromatsu-gif-747303098905210000

[full jackal]

And Gikyo instead of Bo

[slender copper]

Why is Martin Luther King Jr. talking to Gikyo.

[ashen salmon]

“Why is Martin Luther King Jr. talking to Gikyo.”

-Abraham Lincoln

[slender copper]

AM I ABRAHAM KINGKONG??

...what

[vestal rivet]

congrats, you ended slavery

[ashen salmon]

“I didn’t say that shit.”

-Sun Tzu

[slender copper]

Why did it autocorrect to that 💀

[vestal rivet]

now how do you deal with the political climate after a civil war and slavery, a system that many states abused and depended on, is gone
wait-

[ashen salmon]

AND HERE COMES ANDREW JOHNSON WITH A STEEL CHAIR

[slender copper]

I did not want this responsibility, time to go to the War of Realms.

Alright back being C0rrupted.

[vestal rivet]

I would also make a joke about the political party Lincoln was in but I don't want to now

[hybrid gazelle]

also about that giokyo pronoun thing

oh nvm

[slender copper]

lol

[hybrid gazelle]

my friend said it was nedw thing but nvm I already found it to begin with LOL

[sharp mango]

his pronouns are they/them!!

[split night]

it is pretty neutral as guys but not really as guy
i get icky when someone do that

[frail mortar]

start using fellas instead idk

[split night]

humans!

earthlings

terrist?

bean

[frail mortar]

pals

buddies

peeps

[full jackal]

Fellow earthlings

Creatures

I think there’s a word for this

It’s called semantic bleaching

When a more specific term is widened to become used for more uses

[split night]

https://tenor.com/view/get-blown-up-dog-dog-explosion-sticky-notes-gif-17071604041793579031

[digital swan]

@misty horizon would it be rude to corrupt them with "gm gays and guys"

[full jackal]

Guys

Girls

And other squirrels

[split night]

what about us yuris and girls 🥺

[full jackal]

Yurls

Gurils

[digital swan]

"mfs" gender neutral way to express your contempt for all of you mfs

[full jackal]

i really need to be paying attention in class instead of drawing ts

[full jackal]

Sorta irrelevant i guess

When Sui finally gets therapy

I want this to play

https://youtu.be/ArtRuJiTYbI?si=2xYN5g2mbAivz8v0

When I get better at drawing perspective I might try making an animatic of “My goodbye” from Epic the Musical but with Her Majesty instead of Athena and Bak’al instead of Odysseus

[full jackal]

This day, you lost it all. Consider this as my goodbye.

Barely started

[spring kernel]

Anathena

[full jackal]

What

[warm flicker]

Anathena

[slender copper]

They combined Anathema and Athena's names.

[split night]

Anathena

[full jackal]

Okay i guess

[low ether]

Attacking Vertical spotted

[full jackal]

Real knows real

Okay this is completely off topic but have you ever met one of those people who claim to be right-wing but just based on their artstyle and interests alone you know deep inside they were born to be a molotov-throwing building-burning homosexual anarcho-communist and they’re like one weird YouTube drama with some Luxembourgish 15 year old from reaching their true destiny? No? Okayyy

[split night]

is this politic

[full jackal]

Nope

This is a random thought I had after looking at the wastelands of YouTube recommended pages

what would the main political positions of Wynncraft’s political parties be

Like do they even have elections?

Mayor doesn’t really imply democratic processes I don’t think

[cinder cedar]

Corkus human society is a Technocracy from my pov

[full jackal]

Agreed

[cinder cedar]

Gavel's Villagers are "democratic" capitalists

[full jackal]

I mean like for a medieval society, Wynn and Gavel are oddly irreligious

[cinder cedar]

Aldorei Elfs are Theocracies, the other elf village might be just an inde with it's own mayor

[full jackal]

Frumans likely go to Her Majesty as a sort of pseudo-god and Aldorei worships Orphion but that’s really it

[split night]

Fruma is just any monarchy i think

[full jackal]

Bovemism has many churches but doesn’t seem to have any real meaningful impact

[cinder cedar]

Fruma is absolute monarchy but it's a multiprincipality

[full jackal]

I mean Sovereigns are sorta similar to dukes but more controlled by Queen

[cinder cedar]

not in the sense of territory but in structure

[whole river]

I mean gavel has a lot of their religion in kandar forest and they used to have crusades

[cinder cedar]

I don't know how to classify Wynn but it could be just citystates under a multiprincipality

[whole river]

The main issue is I kinda have no idea what their faith is structured as

[cinder cedar]

mostly closest to a Medieval Appanage Systems

Dwarfs are just Monarchy aswell

[full jackal]

And trashie touched upon this subject actually: #📚lore_discussion message

[full jackal]

Really?

[split night]

Trashie touched upon any subject we might discuss

xd

[full jackal]

Where?

[whole river]

They have a whole church in kandar forest

[cinder cedar]

then Orcs and Avians and other indeginous groups are their own indeginous groups but that is a broad stroke and I do not like that

[full jackal]

True, real dedication

[full jackal]

I wonder what they actually believe in though

[whole river]

That’s the thing, villager lore is criminally under-utilized

[full jackal]

Like they had actual witch hunts so they most likely believe in evil spirits

[whole river]

They believe the decay is a sign of their greed

[cinder cedar]

and im just here talking about goverment and political power structures, religion is it's own Beast

realm beast

[full jackal]

So, does that mean there could be villager monks who completely refuse to engage in anything other than frugality?

As part of their religion

Maybe that’s what the Bantisu monks are about

[full jackal]

Well… in that case I’d propose that Wynn operates on an HRE type system

[whole river]

I mean I imagine they probably are more of an ascetic faith

[full jackal]

With many duchies and kingdoms forming a broad alliance of cooperation

[whole river]

So very much a self-discipline styled religion

[paper wyvern]

HRE at least had a central figure, I think it's closer to ancient Greece

[full jackal]

One being Ragni, Troms, Central Wynn, Nesaak

[whole river]

I honestly would love to make a whole draft on setting up how villager religion works but idk how suggestions are drafted for wynncraft

[cinder cedar]

what is the Ocean tho?

[full jackal]

They might centralise through Detlas or smth idk

[full jackal]

Wild West

Anarchy

[whole river]

Ocean is technically owned by neither yeah

[cinder cedar]

but Mage society tho

[full jackal]

There are pirates here and there, Selchar likely has its own government and Ice islands too, that’s it

[paper wyvern]

If there was government on the ocean zhight island wouldn't exist

[cinder cedar]

what is mage society?

[full jackal]

Mage society is the only thing that is ordered

[whole river]

They’re the ones who calmed the waves

I think

[full jackal]

A…

Yea it isn’t really explained

[paper wyvern]

I'm not sure if that was retconned in, out or both

[cinder cedar]

Mages could be Technomancy

[whole river]

Lmao yeah imma just preface that ocean lore is a big unknown in what is still canon or not

For me

I just remember how tedious some of the quests were

[paper wyvern]

Ocean is probably the most outdated area

[full jackal]

#📚lore_discussion message

[split night]

sand with 10% gravel in it

[hybrid gazelle]

The idea of Therr being mage island is so funny

[paper wyvern]

Mage island existing is so outdated

[winged narwhal]

Dernel jungle

[full jackal]

Dernel jungle at least has cool builds

[winged narwhal]

By the way, are boats just gone now?

[full jackal]

I think so?

I mean, it’s not like they had any use whatsoever

[winged narwhal]

Can’t wait for the dolphin mount or whatever rin Ocean Reborn

[winged narwhal]

They were kinda nice earlygame

[full jackal]

Just spam tp spells T_T

Plus seaskipper is essentially free

[winged narwhal]

Again, earlygame

Level 35 mfs cant really do that

[full jackal]

I mean, you don’t really go out into the ocean though

[full jackal]

Ooh cool

[winged narwhal]

I’d personally argue that’s a design flaw of the ocean at the moment

[full jackal]

true

[winged narwhal]

It feels like a set of discrete locations more than a region, and there’s no incentive to do anything other than Seaskipper except for like two quests and a world event

[full jackal]

i mean name one good ocean quest (corkus doesn’t count)

I’ll wait

[nocturne nimbus]

misadventure on the sea

[full jackal]

shit

excluding that one i count that as a nemcract quest

haha arbitrary standards win again

[split night]

jofash dock and the GG dungeon introduction quest was fine ish

[full jackal]

The Jofash one was mildly tolerable imo

gg dungeon questwas… not nearly as fun as the dungeon was

[whole river]

Those two were serviceable at least, better to be old and boring than completely nonsensical and/or racist

[winged narwhal]

Christmas one

Order of the grook is alright even if the lore is outdated as shit

[slender copper]

Redbeard's booty, Order of the Grook, Misadventures at Sea I think were fun.

Hopefully the lore in Order of the Grook can be updated... actually all mid game quests to be updated lol.

[compact agate]

is there any mention of slavery in wynncraft

[whole river]

Yes

[slender copper]

Yeah, actually. Think Qira is a good example.

[whole river]

The dwarves participate in Dogun slavery

[compact agate]

well only before dwarves and doguns

and its not technically slavery

just race war

[whole river]

No they actually kept slaves too

[compact agate]

i thought the drones were literal drones

[whole river]

It’s mentioned in the black market area

[compact agate]

oh unless u mean like yansur

[formal bridge]

Well I mean it's not really slavery as it seems

[hybrid gazelle]

Roughwork is technically slavery

Technically

[formal bridge]

Dogun Merchant

Dogun Merchant: You see this fine selection of frozen Doguns behind me?
Dogun Merchant: That's what happens when you douse a Dogun in water. They're still alive, though. Just in exquisite agony.
Dogun Merchant: However, when we pour lava on them, they unfreeze. Well, they scream. Well, both, actually.

[hybrid gazelle]

She got villager servant

[compact agate]

more liek communism

[hybrid gazelle]

They are slave

[compact agate]

work is paid with more work

[formal bridge]

I mean I guess that might be slavery but it seems more like just weird messed up torture

[whole river]

I mean they call them dogun slaves

[formal bridge]

Where so?

[compact agate]

what the fuck

also related note why does wynn have so many race war questlines

[nocturne nimbus]

Roughworks is just capitalism

You do work and then are paid for it

[hybrid gazelle]

Yeah

That how people keep housing

lol

[nocturne nimbus]

If you don’t do work, you’re thrown out onto the streets

[compact agate]

you are paid in work

thats wage slavery

literally says so on the crossword

[hybrid gazelle]

That more of metaphor

[nocturne nimbus]

That is a joke

[hybrid gazelle]

Than literal

[whole river]

Think it was in the maex black market area

[hybrid gazelle]

It meant to say how roughwork working environment will keep you work and work

To the point that you might as well think living another day is to work for another day

Rather than aftually live

That what Soosu character is all about

[whole river]

They also mentioned how they liked to unfreeze them for fun so I’d classify it as slavery still

Entertainment slaves are still slaves

[compact agate]

eh

[winged narwhal]

Does Wynn have more race war quest lines than it does white man’s burden questlines

[compact agate]

why do we kill them then while walking through roughworks

and why do we literally supress a union

as a world event

kinda fucked up

[compact agate]

mayb

[toxic fog]

yall what age do you think mora and sui are, are they old or young

[winged narwhal]

wait which world event is this one lmao

[compact agate]

karoshi union

[hybrid gazelle]

Some of them though we were a cop

Or something idk

[winged narwhal]

The « death by overwork » union?

[hybrid gazelle]

Honestly idk about that we

I am also confuse

[winged narwhal]

I mean the description honestly doesn’t sound like a union

[winged narwhal]

Subtle message to the content team from Salted

[compact agate]

It’s called a union tho

And we fight workers

[compact agate]

BIG FRUMA vs average worker in rough works

anyway less racewar more yuri please CTs

[winged narwhal]

Yusanu is a class traitor

[compact agate]

yusanu x zeph was way too forced

shouldve been rex and zeph

idk how they fumbled that

[winged narwhal]

Wait was that one yusanu I thought it was yuman

[compact agate]

yeah yuman i think

the soosu slave

[hybrid gazelle]

https://gif.fxtwitter.com/tweet_video/HAeL7GFbQAArcAX.gif

[winged narwhal]

The CT has a mandate against hetslop from Salted himself clearly

[hybrid gazelle]

Yuman is the music guy

Yusano is the one workwing with Soosu

Also this is funny because some people deny the Tasim x aledr

[winged narwhal]

Does anyone else remember that guy who thought that Wynn was surpresssing straight relationships

[hybrid gazelle]

While Yuman x Zeph said to be forced

So literally there is no win for this

[compact agate]

maybe thats why tasim so pissed we killed him

[hybrid gazelle]

Yes

[compact agate]

i still dont like the change they made for a journey further

cuz aledar literally admitted they were gonna sac us

but then they fuckin died and we had to escort quest aledar

[hybrid gazelle]

It simply got change because the writers want it another direction

It will be fully remake later

[solid fable]

Wasn't it changed to make aledar say it was him or elphaba to be sacrificed not us anymore

[hybrid gazelle]

So that part likely will be better

[hybrid gazelle]

Yes

Well

It more like Alrdar just say how if all of them survive to EO

[compact agate]

yes but thats dumb

[winged narwhal]

My headcanon on that is that Tasim is down bad but Aledar has no idea about any of it

[hybrid gazelle]

Elphaba probably offer herself to be the one

[compact agate]

truke

they should just revert back to old AJF

[hybrid gazelle]

The writer did want aledar to share similar feeling to Tasim

I think they said they want to make it clearer later

So yeah as far as we know, the feeling suppose to be mutual but not express

So doomed yahoo

[winged narwhal]

Doomed yahoo

[hybrid gazelle]

Yep

They likely won’t revert ajf

And what we have rn

Will be the base for ajb/ajf rrwrite

Which is nice

[winged narwhal]

I think I’ll probably just forget about that and keep believing it’s one sided like with my Jenprest headcanon

[compact agate]

they need to update SE in general

AHC combat is outdated

[winged narwhal]

A lot of places need updates more than SE imo

[hybrid gazelle]

But yes Tasim and Alrdar is not one sided, likely we will see more of it in mid game

[compact agate]

UPDATE RYMEK ALMUJ

ALMUJ RYMEK REWORK WHEN

[solid fable]

Yeah i think corkus needs a massive update revamp new quests

[hybrid gazelle]

But Alrdar do have tendency to not shut up about Tasim as well

[winged narwhal]

I mean Almuj got updated semi recently

[hybrid gazelle]

As according to Lanu, linton, and Mel group

[winged narwhal]

Its not like the Dernel Jungle

[hybrid gazelle]

Implying they throughout mid game, Alrdar likely mention Tasim a lot as much as taism mention Aledar

[compact agate]

they should turn rymek into coursant with hella layers and people living on different elvels of teh canyon

[nocturne nimbus]

crazy that in your headcanon it’s still one-sided

[solid fable]

Whats the jenprest headcannon

[compact agate]

mel x jenprest

[winged narwhal]

Jenprest is Rex’s brother

[solid fable]

ic

[winged narwhal]

Maybe I haven’t played enough of the new Aledar and Tasim content

[solid fable]

icic

[whole river]

We’ve heard of canon media erasure for LBTQ+ ships now get ready for headcanons erasing LGBTQ+ ships

[winged narwhal]

I apologize if I am committing queer erasure I just think it’s funny

[whole river]

You aren’t I was teasing

[winged narwhal]

If it’s any consolation I ship Gale and Qira

[solid fable]

@hybrid gazelle qira mention

[winged narwhal]

Is there a lore reason the Rymek bandits have guns

[foggy condor]

The bandits are from fruma

[ashen salmon]

is jenprest rex’s brother or is sailor cain rex’s brother

sailor cain does mention having a sister

[hybrid gazelle]

Caid

[ashen salmon]

caid not cain

[hybrid gazelle]

Rex is Caid’s sister

[ashen salmon]

that’s what i’m thinking but i’m not entirely for sure

the pieces look like they fit but that doesn’t mean they do

[winged narwhal]

Caid is canonically Rex’s brother

[ashen salmon]

i probably just missed some dialogue then

[winged narwhal]

My headcanon is that Jenprest is Rex’s brother who just transitioned after leaving Fruma but that has little to no basis in canon

[solid fable]

They both were made to look the same so i assume its caid

[nocturne nimbus]

Cain is Abel’s brother

[spring kernel]

jenprest is a woman

[torn lake]

yo thats kinda sad tbh

[winged narwhal]

🏳️‍⚧️

Wait do people actually not realize Jenprest is a woman

[hybrid gazelle]

I think they jsut worded it wrong

[whole river]

Now that I remembered Rex again why did we never get any clarification on her nobility origins

[hybrid gazelle]

We did

She came from highland

Most people from highland are noble

[whole river]

But like is her family not worried that their noble daughter joined a group of terrorists

[solid fable]

House Athassa

[shut mist]

We did get some specification

[cinder cedar]

both children "disgraced" the family, why would they care?

[shut mist]

Like the fact that they wanted her back safe

[whole river]

Cuz it’s the reason why majin held them hostage instead of just killing them

along with satisfying the player

[cinder cedar]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I just thouth it was to flush us out

[shut mist]

No

The highlands wanted her back safe

[whole river]

^

So she clearly wasn’t disgraced and if anything she was MISSED

[shut mist]

But she could only bring 1 friend with her

[cinder cedar]

no wonder Zeph was an acceptable torture target

[shut mist]

Mora chose to stay behind.

[whole river]

Imma pull up the convo again to verify but it’s so odd that Rex does nothing with the nobility thing

Even weirder is them just letting their son get Wynn-recruited but he did something particularly dumb for that ig

[hybrid gazelle]

She is a runaway

That why her family want her back to maybe properly disown her or some shit

Idk

Noble are weird

[shut mist]

He was warned multiple times to stop

[whole river]

I don’t think they wanna disown her

I just attribute it as a plot line that was drafted early but didn’t go nowhere in favor of ending the questline so people can get to WTP faster

But I definitely think it should be wayyy more than just an offhand mention

[hybrid gazelle]

Tbh

I think Caid getting recruited is because he is away in roughwork

So now he lost contact with his family

[whole river]

Oh true

[hybrid gazelle]

So he is free to get sent off

And it not like parents fucking care cause mf jsut go

“Oh well now he know how the real hard work is like”

[whole river]

He was picked up in roughworks so they could’ve just assumed he was with the rest of the brokies there and sent him off

[ashen salmon]

i dont think roughworks guys get exiled to wynn

[hybrid gazelle]

They do

Caid and raynauld did

[ashen salmon]

do they?

[hybrid gazelle]

If you prove too much of a trouble

Yes

[shut mist]

He was warned multiple times btw

[hybrid gazelle]

Reynauld was one of the guard for roughwork

[ashen salmon]

i just kinda assumed they just get thrown under the city to starve

[hybrid gazelle]

Nope

Thet is when you missing payment

[whole river]

From what I remember caid kinda hid the fact that he was a noble or at least didn’t wear it on his sleeve

[cinder cedar]

becomcing a wynn recruit is a free real estate in the entire providence IF you don't piss the crown too much to just outright kill you

[whole river]

In the old cutscenes

[hybrid gazelle]

He definitely did and also

Roughwork people don’t like Highlander

That maybe why he never address it

[whole river]

True true

[hybrid gazelle]

Rex also seems don’t like being highlander

[ashen salmon]

i’ll have to look at recovering the past again

[whole river]

I kinda hope wastelands adds a Rex quest where we meet the family or something

[hybrid gazelle]

I rather not meet noble family

[whole river]

It would also be a very good quest to explain Highlander culture beyond being rich assholes

[hybrid gazelle]

Do you have any idea what they are base on?

Consider the inspiration to fruma

They are worse than rich assholes

[whole river]

I mean my first guess is daimyos but I assume that’s not what you’re referring to

[hybrid gazelle]

Asian parents

Unfortunately

I get to witness the behavior of these creatures

And I say that fruma did very well portraying them in fruma as inspiration

So no

I rather not see more of them

[whole river]

I mean it would be a fun quest for more Rex lore at least! And they can just make the parents jerks or even add some nice passed down generational trauma in the family

[hybrid gazelle]

God I wish Asian parents are just jerk

[ashen salmon]

it’s a fine expansion i just didnt think itd be chinese is all

[shut mist]

Keep in mind house athassa isent in the game

[whole river]

Yeah house athassa would have to be added

[shut mist]

They mightve been wiped out for being digraced too many times

[hybrid gazelle]

I don’t think the game can handle accurate depiction of Asian parents

[whole river]

What

[hybrid gazelle]

I think th queen is enough

[hybrid gazelle]

I don’t think it’s that soon

[whole river]

How would they request their daughter back if they were wiped

[hybrid gazelle]

Yeah lol

[shut mist]

Fair ig

[hybrid gazelle]

The queen is enough Asian parent rep

We don’t need another

[whole river]

If anything this makes Rex a likely sovereign candidate

For highlands

she wouldn’t do it

[hybrid gazelle]

Anyone is better candidate than Majin if they met requirement

But to be fair

It depend if her house can afford citadel university

Which I don’t thjnk so consider it does not seem theu are notable house

[cinder cedar]

I mean they were trying to send Rex in there

[hybrid gazelle]

Really?

[cinder cedar]

yea

[hybrid gazelle]

Damn I must miss it then

Idk can rex handle 2 houses?

Majin literally habe 2 house

[cinder cedar]

Rex's dialogue says that her parents wanted her to study to go to the school in Citadel but she wanted to learn how to use the bow

[hybrid gazelle]

He would be better candidate no matter what

Consider his competition uhhh

[whole river]

Imagine being in the highlands as a top noble, happy af and being a rich snob and suddenly the runaway kid from your rival house was part of the first successful revolution in Fruma’s history and becomes your leader

[hybrid gazelle]

Fucking run away

[hybrid gazelle]

Oo yeah

I think I remember it now

[whole river]

Oh I forgot about this

[hybrid gazelle]

Idk I don’t thjnk rex want to be represent of highland

But then again

[whole river]

Ok house athassa as an actual location we can visit would be a fun addition they add landmarks all the time

[hybrid gazelle]

Idk who else could be

Rex definitely could be a good leader for high land as she experience the hardship

But then again

[whole river]

Idk where it would go but maybe like

Wait in the north maybe, since it’s highkey boring and empty rn

[hybrid gazelle]

The problem with highland is people see ignorant

They aware not aware of otjer district hard ship

They live in privilegelife

So their new leader must be someone who understand hardship and clear out all ignorant

[ashen salmon]

that’s part of the reason why the blossom of blades seemeed ineffective

[whole river]

Would also kinda give us a nice explanation for Rex’s bow skills like maybe as she grew up she snuck out and practiced up north

[ashen salmon]

their problems and everyone else’s problems are patently not the same problems

[hybrid gazelle]

Yep

That leader thst highland need

[whole river]

The only effective member of the blossom of blades being the train guy is hilarious

[foggy condor]

In the end he didn't get anything done though

[whole river]

He got Levi

Better than the blossom of the blades just debating on whether they should do nothing today or do nothing forever(they never do anything)

[formal bridge]

he successfully accomplished a task

[foggy condor]

That is true

[whole river]

And it’s funny cuz keep in mind he only got caught cuz of the player

He could’ve poisoned more if not for us

[ashen salmon]

wait what happened

i dont remember much of the blossom arc

[foggy condor]

It's in a side quest

[whole river]

In off the rails the perpetrator was part of the blossom of the blades and so you get the expectation that the rebellion there in hyloch is more the type to like poison you rather than take up direct arms. Real espionage type rebellion

But then it turns out the perpetrator was not like the others, and the others suck

[ashen salmon]

ah off the rails guy

props to off the rails guy for letting us finesse a free train pass

[whole river]

At first too I was like “man I get it but it’s a bit extreme” then going into hyloch you’re like “these people can’t be saved”

[winged narwhal]

When do we get to see Harvin and Maury again

[whole river]

I’m praying on every realm beast that we see them guarding the deraj entrance

[foggy condor]

Whoever was complaining about the price of bread was a real one though. I know that's supposed to be a petty concern, but concerns over food prices are valid

[whole river]

Yeah it was interesting that it raised in Hyloch, and the blossoms rebellion could’ve easily leaned into it more if they had balls. Even using the classic media manipulation since they write the newspapers

[ashen salmon]

did publishing those “majin fucking dies” articles accomplish anything

like even arranging the majin fight in the first place

[whole river]

Lmfao for some nobles who are in their castles they probably read that headline and went pale

[foggy condor]

It's so the player could aurafarm and say that the press never lies

[pine flower]

well the soldiers in the strong survive have no idea

[whole river]

The player deserves the aura highkey

Killing the strongest sovereign then hitting a total aura farming one liner was an iconic part of the quest

[slender copper]

In the newspaper in the roughworks it tells about those two and the Off the Rails incident.

[slender copper]

"What you gonna do about it, huh?"

[whole river]

Majin: “what are you gonna do, stab me”
dies in his first on screen fight

[slender copper]

Yeah, that's exactly what I did... bamboozle and spin attack while he stayed frozen in the air.

[whole river]

https://tenor.com/view/tiger-tiger-woods-big-dog-salutation-what-up-gif-2478767235926945002

Used trickster on the first fight too

Showed him what a real spellblade moveset is supposed to look like 🥱

[vestal rivet]

this is what I did lol
wayyy easier than the subsequent boltslinger run
although I did hear that all of the Apotheosis bosses were made harder some point so that may have also been a factor

[sick quest]

W revolutionary sentiment

[main dust]

Hey! That was a dialogue piece in the quest!? I didn't even notice it (or remember)

[whole river]

I imagine the nobles are definitely going to revolt and idk any uniting figure

Rex unwillingly the sovereign of the highlands incoming

[main dust]

That's actually incredibly funny and makes sense - Someone like that would come from Blossom of Blades - like, it would spawn the sort of edgy revolutionist that thinks killing some random general (let's be real this was a tiny blip in the army) would mean anything in the grand scheme of things and acts incredibly edgy about it after being found out and stuff.

I seriously think that's an incredibly good connection, someone knows their shit up on high to write a thread like that

Becoming disillusioned with the monarch is just step one, there's a lot more to understand about how you solve the problem of monarchy

Coming from Hyloch culture so close to the capital just makes that a hard set of steps, you're coming from a place of not understanding so it's really easy to learn to not agree with Monarchy but not get past that part so you end up stifling and doing random shit like that when it would have been better to go down to the lower districts where people that were fighting the crown understood so much more about how to truly do that.
It's just a really interesting way of showing a divide between the districts not themselves but the culture that mirrors real life people, it's super cool.

Thanks for saying that, I super love knowing that now.

If you were stuck with the Blossom of Blades after joining them thinking they were at your level of being disillusioned with the Crown and potentially willing to do something about it I too would be like '....What....' when the Blossom of Blades is all talk no bite and you'd be fast to leave them to actually do something like Rex would

I just think Rex understands the actual root problems at the core like Syndra does near about, Off the Rails person really needed to meet an actual resistance member (From any resistance) instead of whatever that was.

It's a little sad, I don't respect them and their choices but I want to be able to.
They know the crown is bad, want to do something about it but just doesn't know enough to really get the picture of the nation everyone's in - and because of that lack of knowledge and lack of people there's nothing to grow from.

It's like Lilo & Stitch - the beach scene where Stitch was all sad at the beach was because Stitch was being a bad friend to his family, if Stitch didn't meet Lilo and everyone he wouldn't have become better to friends (or would at least need another catalyst to help make him become good), he looked at how much fun everyone else was having without him and instead of continuing to be someone who was making things worse he joined in and understood what being in a family/having a friend can be and is.
Off the Rails person needed a person to understand everything, and because the idea of finding someone is either too hard or not something they can even think about we end up getting someone who results in the killing of a general who is just being posted at a vaguely unimportant Fort.
It's important because it's the border to the rest of the world but it's still like, girl they're going to be at that post doing nothing forever - protagonist was just a blip and a surprise that's literally the point of the protagonist; someone no one expected

I know it's hard to find resistance members out in the wild but they look purposefully for people like the person from Off the Rails - you should try but you shouldn't think it's impossible - it can take genuine time.

Someone will always be looking for someone acting more odd than the rest of the culture because that has the potential to be a spark

Like those films where main characters enter a new city and are looking for someone who gives out intel - you ask around and read shit

Fruma's super propaganda but so is any world that sparks a rebellion, shit finds it's way into every crack

Like girl, try harder - you've already got money so you're fine on being able to be somewhat stable for long enough

Look for information

And if you're not scared enough to kill a military general you're not scared enough to go find out more information

[rustic nexus]

Cemor is a really fun character

great addition to off the rails

[chilly tulip]

It’s funny to me imagining how people in Fruma react to meeting the player, especially guards

[clear scaffold]

i just liked off the rails in general. It was funny how quickly some became friends and i hoped i'd see them again

[rustic nexus]

I wish we saw the other npcs outside of the quest yea

[clear scaffold]

i can almost guarantee the roughworks guy and student became besties

[rustic nexus]

I'd love to see what the friendship between the roughworks guy and the aelumia girl formed out into

[clear scaffold]

those two were the characters i was just like "can i join"

[chilly tulip]

Like imagine being told by your higher ups, “Oh by the way, there’s a maniac who broke into the province from the war torn province outside that immediately killed an entire fort, and has now been running around destroying anything and killing anyone in their path. So, uh, good luck, try not to die” and then you meet them face to face

[clear scaffold]

To be fair they clearly think they have a chance

[clear scaffold]

I feel like majin was REALLY the beginning of the end for the bravery

[rustic nexus]

I really wish we had more interactions with the general fruma population

[slim belfry]

"That's some strange armor you're wearing."

[rustic nexus]

like, that one newspaper in hyloch talking about an unknown armored person outside of town is so fun if you imagine it's referencing the player

[chilly tulip]

The Queens perspective is funnier to me tbh, just hearing every couple days stuff like “Your majesty, the Cursed has broken through the gates!” Your Majesty, the Cursed has destroyed the Roughworks water treatment plant!” “You Majesty, The Cursed killed Sovereign Gikyo!”

[clear scaffold]

i think they pretend it's fine

[chilly tulip]

Just building annoyance and frustration

[clear scaffold]

actually this is over weeks

[rustic nexus]

yea

but like c'mon

[clear scaffold]

It doesn't give an exact time frame but one quest mentions you've been at this for a few weeks

which tbh, i'm surprised the player's done all this in a couple of weeks

[main dust]

Off the Rails killer would react to that by going 'Oh my god I'm your biggest fan, should we go kill a general together and/or do some other very public murder that just feels like we're making a dent into the nation when it was Bob the General of Frumamart' when player is out there doing legitimate rebellion shit - we're not about to kill Bob the General of Frumamart when that just starts sirens for the higher-ups to go 'Huh, maybe that spot has a lot of rebellion activity.' rn lmao

[rustic nexus]

"your majesty, a cursed one has overrun fort torann!"
"your majesty, a cursed one has attacked the dam and released water flow for the people of the forest!"
"the cursed has defeated a sovereign! the cursed has killed a sovereign! the cursed has escaped capture dozens of times!"
and then you get to see her exact reactions to the stuff you continue doing to infuriate her in the last 2 quests

[clear scaffold]

in all honesty, all of the leaves were more rebellious than the guy in the off the rails

[rustic nexus]

the leaves also helped their communities, those in need

cemor did... what exactly

pull some strings to get the 2 constables to not be posted in the highlands?

[clear scaffold]

and killed some random higher up

[rustic nexus]

me when we've done that and more

[clear scaffold]

then you got sui who killed gikyo in a way that anyone would find that corpse terrifying

[main dust]

That's 👏 What 👏 I'm 👏 Saying 👏
LIKE SERIOUSLY WHAT ARE WE DOING RN

Cemor needs to meet Syndra and Quill so they can slap him silly and actually get him doing something useful

[chilly tulip]

Do you think Syndra actually believed that she could kill the Queen

[rustic nexus]

I think cemor needed to just sit the train ride through and talk with the player in espren

[clear scaffold]

no. But it would of been insulting to actually give the queen a fight

[rustic nexus]

she definitely had doubts

[frozen turtle]

Syndra like wanted to die

[rustic nexus]

not exactly

it was like

a passive thing

[main dust]

I think so.
She's deeply passionate but also is deeply passionate in a way that trumps her own willingness to hold back when you need to.

She's a very 'I used all my balls for this one court' person who YOLO'd it because she needed - it wasn't necesarry for her to die and it could have just been them moving to Mistwoods but she saw the festival was happening and acted faster instead of slower.

Sometimes in rebellions they take years, years and years, whole lives - some people have waited forever to get their chance

[clear scaffold]

syndra really had nothing to live for, she only had the leaves but the player she clearly trusted the player to take over.

And losing her girlfriend was killing her

[main dust]

Syndra got her chance and needed to make it win, attempted killing of the Queen was just one way, it was silly but as her character she felt it was the choice and it paid off in the long run

[chilly tulip]

I’m still mad we couldn’t tell her at all about Elise at all

[whole river]

Is it a hot take to say I think she knew fully well she was condemning them all to death

[clear scaffold]

i honestly think she did visit Elise

[frozen turtle]

they keep talking about Tasim alt route, what about Elise alt route

[chilly tulip]

I hope so

[rustic nexus]

she did visit Elise

[clear scaffold]

but because of how bad elise was, she never actually remembered it

[rustic nexus]

but she didn't recognize syndra

[clear scaffold]

which... is a lot more painful

[rustic nexus]

it's referenced in echoes of change iirc

[main dust]

We can also say that she also knew she was the strongest too - her quotes to Player about being close in combat power in her own rebellion also leads the player to understand her personal insights; she feels like she's one of the best options to deal with it.

She should have helped her group grow and formed even more blips through the districts instead of the risky festival manuever and she wanted to solve the problem then and there, no pain to her kids.

[clear scaffold]

i cried at that quest... it was one of the biggest gut punches to work out it's syndra.

[clear scaffold]

Literally the player was stronger but she sure as hell wasn't throwing the one person to their deaths. who could help the leaves

[whole river]

The thing is syndra is not stronger than the player, the player pretty much held back in their duel

[rustic nexus]

I wouldn't say held back

but more like

[chilly tulip]

Eclipsed?

[clear scaffold]

made sure not to kill

[paper wyvern]

She also thought she had a ohko move

[whole river]

the player never undergoes a training arc in Fruma he is cooking anyone in Fruma day 1 in a 1v1 barring the Queen highkey

[main dust]

Oh yeah 100% that's like, the fact - she knows that almost assuredly on her comments but while I believe entrusting the power of the player is important and stuff I still wouldn't want her to choose her own risky death over the multiple options - she snuck her way through the border, she can go through a few more - it's organized transporation.

But also she hinged getting through the border in Auburn on Zhiraok and that must be a terrible mindset of hope to be stuck on for her - the only way she got passed is through the political power of the crown's own leaders.

[rustic nexus]

wait didn't syndra literally say "dont hold back" before the 2nd duel

[frozen turtle]

well Syndra didnt hold back

[paper wyvern]

Probably would have led to the queen breaking if it did it but it probably wasn't gonna kill her

[clear scaffold]

Syndra defintely didn't

although i think they should of made syndra's death message be you got knocked out

[frozen turtle]

the player is like, not necessarily powerful by like pure strength but just cuz we keep fighting

so us holding back is more like us just not keeping fighting

[clear scaffold]

the player is one of the most stubborn idiots in the game

[chilly tulip]

I mean personally I didn’t go below 3/4 that fight

[whole river]

I mean he has enough in his punch to kill the parasite, there is strength to that

[paper wyvern]

And taism exists

[frozen turtle]

yeah e're strong but thats not the main reason why we're like powerful

[clear scaffold]

The player in a good canon has so far, lost like two fights?

[whole river]

He’s not just this super tank he does actively win fights 😭

[clear scaffold]

and nearly died three times

[main dust]

Syndra is just someone who takes a lot of risks and those risks are infinite burdens on her mind - Elise, the fact she doesn't have much power in the hierachy of Fruma but HAS to fight somehow and that includes using the only option to progress; Zhiraok giving passports - She's not got an infinite amount of ideas and hope for her own personal capabilities, she's trying her darndest but that doesn't defeat how much work she really had to do in order to get even to Roughworks - she's old now - being old after spending a good part of your whole life barely starting a rebellion? That's hard.

[chilly tulip]

“If I keep all this trauma inside me, it’ll eventually go away”

[clear scaffold]

lari, the queen are the only two who really actually beat the player in a fight

or nearly beat the player

[digital swan]

? lari?

when does lari beat the player

[rustic nexus]

the guardian stops the fight

[frozen turtle]

lari never beats the player in a fight

[clear scaffold]

dialogue makes it clear you would of defintely died in her fight

[frozen turtle]

and the player never beats lari

[digital swan]

yeah after you shred her to half health

[chilly tulip]

ROL IV says that she probably could’ve killed us

[frozen turtle]

probabvly but again

[clear scaffold]

dialogue's very much "yeah you nearly died" which granted is very believable

[whole river]

The guardian stops the fight midway through and also it’s just kinda logical

[frozen turtle]

The Guardian doesnt know our strength,

[paper wyvern]

The queen does almost kill us though

[digital swan]

does the guardian stop the fight if you nearly die???

[whole river]

The player could not keep up with Bakal and lari fended him off

So yes there’s levels to this

[clear scaffold]

I will be blunt, at that point in the game, you were not beating lari

[frozen turtle]

if the Queen couldnt see how strong we are, why would the guardian know

[rustic nexus]

rex the goat got us out of that situation though

[digital swan]

I thought it was only when lari reaches half health
which took a grand total of like 20 seconds because lari might be the weakest boss ever

[paper wyvern]

Gotta love grappling arrow

[rustic nexus]

grappling hook clutch

[clear scaffold]

do not take game strength in to account, there's only a few times that ever comes up and that's items.

[rustic nexus]

always select grappling hook when playing archer, kids

[clear scaffold]

But yeah lari does nearly beat the player, The queen outright does beat the player

[frozen turtle]

speculation is all we have at this point

at least imo

[clear scaffold]

do you think the player would of been able to fight bak'al?

[rustic nexus]

I loved the cutscene of the player and the queen ngl

[digital swan]

they should like really buff lari's attacks ingame then

[whole river]

Did y out ignore the Bakal example?

[main dust]

Bak'al is considered stronger because he's with the 'antagonist' group of the game - at least the current 'truest' kind.
Dern is sort of the endgame villain writing-wise so obviously you want your main antagonists minions to be stronger than most but he's also got 'I sided with the current winning side' aura and isn't as much shit as he talks

[chilly tulip]

Bak’al is a fraud

[paper wyvern]

By fruma yes at RoL5 no

[clear scaffold]

rekindled fight when

[digital swan]

because she doesn't really deal any damage

[whole river]

Do you think they specifically are going to update the lari damage instead of rewriting ROL anyway

[clear scaffold]

fruma fight with bak'al would be just hulk with loki

and bak'al ain't the hulk

[frozen turtle]

we dont even know how much "stronger" we get, also Lari is a novice at fighting when we fight her btw

bc of her whole

pacifist thing

[whole river]

Baby’s first serious fight and it’s Bakal

[clear scaffold]

which is why she carpet bombs the area with full strength

[clear scaffold]

and she nearly wins

[frozen turtle]

and Bak'al also kinda seems weak to me but

[digital swan]

mf had 1000 years of practice fighting the parasite and still can't do shit

[whole river]

The goat

[chilly tulip]

But guys, is the player stronger than the most powerful character of all?

THE AMAZING SIEGFRIED

[digital swan]

yeah

[main dust]

Yahya.

[frozen turtle]

we see bak'al mainly leading armies with some hand to hand but

[rustic nexus]

player vs siegfried prime

[clear scaffold]

bak'al needs better power representation

[rustic nexus]

he needs presence

[main dust]

I think I'd like it more if Bak'al was all talk - if he really wasn't as strong as we're lead to believe but strong enough to put on a show the fact he would fall so quickly would just be a showcase of his character - he ditched Anathema to join the evil dark evil evil lord and that's just because he was an edgelord - him being unable to be stronger than most people is just 'Oh so people are just scared of you and you have 'corruption' powers and a bunch of armies

[whole river]

Lmao I meant to say Bakal got hyped a heck ton in Fruma all he needs is a good fight

[clear scaffold]

but yeah the fact the player has only really nearly lost against lari and well. the queen does outright nearly kill the player had it not been for rex kinda says how stubborn the player is.

but at the same time god i'm glad the queen kicked the player's ass.

[chilly tulip]

maybe have Ba’kal actually do anything in AHC

[frozen turtle]

we're trying to powerscale a character whose written so weirdly that like, im just saying we cant really tell if Lari would've killed us because they dont really make that apparent in the quest

[rustic nexus]

he kills aegis !!!!

[chilly tulip]

Anything valuable

[whole river]

He want from lame ass bum to the orchestrator of Fruma and lowkey went from a nobody to a scion to a leader of armies

[digital swan]

Bakal is a massive fraud
I guess in game strength shouldn't really be taken as like the truth but
Lari barely touches the player in RoL 4 fight
and by RoL 5 fight is shredding Bakal after presumably getting Zero practice since she asked us to do like 75% of the fighting :/
So surely this would mean Bakal has ZERO defense against SHIT

[rustic nexus]

and lights a few TNT's in detlas!!!

he's not a fraud, guys

trust

[frozen turtle]

i feel like the player could've beaten lari just by attacking for a while and just jumping around

[shut mist]

Aegis survived annihilation

[clear scaffold]

i think people forget how powerful lari was even as a pacifist

[frozen turtle]

cuz i dont think lari has that level of stubbornis

[whole river]

Again they literally spell it out that you can’t handle Bakal

[frozen turtle]

yk what im

trying to powerscale

[whole river]

Ignore whatever agenda you have in your heart

[frozen turtle]

this is bad

[rustic nexus]

she killed an ADULT grootslang in one spell

[frozen turtle]

??

[whole river]

Also was not trying to kill it either

[clear scaffold]

and also the entire parasite fight where she was causing actual spikes in the land just from blocking attacks

[rustic nexus]

yep

lari is strong

[clear scaffold]

Like lari's pretty powerful as a pacifist, when she's trying to kill the player you've suddenly got someone with incredible power just deciding not holding back this time

[rustic nexus]

she just doesn't channel that strength well

[whole river]

She’s responsible for consistently maintaining perhaps the largest barrier in Wynn too

[digital swan]

I think what's also possible is she isn't actually trying to kill you in RoL 4
because like if she's powerful enough to wreck all of that but her attacks deal like 10 damage in her bossfight
she definitely pulling her punches

[frozen turtle]

what im saying is Lari is strong but new to fighting and not used to it which is why i think the player could potentially win (idk tho cuz the questline is so stupid and powerscaling is stupid)

[whole river]

I don’t see any other mage with that motion

Where’s majin’s barrier at?

[clear scaffold]

Do not use stats

[main dust]

Magical Prowess is different to skills - She's got the magic powers but that doesn't mean she just innately knows how to use it (also mention she didn't aggressively fight for so long) like the 100 years researched Combat Mage
She's powerful just by default.

[shut mist]

Wynn ?

Its gavel

[rustic nexus]

the world as a whole