📚lore_discussion

[paper wyvern]

But also yeah now you need a skyraider outfit instead of a wig

[rugged trench]

I wonder if I still have the wig from that quest cuz to my knowledge they just completely killed that merchant

[split night]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1135348779877404869/1402455625816084580/1277048160359026770.gif

[rugged trench]

Unless it’s still being sold?

[split night]

they went to sell the wig in fruma for transfruman

[hybrid gazelle]

how Gavelian CT though they were cooking hwne they make entire fantasy spieces just make up being women

https://tenor.com/view/fire-writing-gif-24533171

[split night]

Amazonian but like, pirate

it's hilarious

[paper wyvern]

Also when are we gonna get a royal trials rewrite that gives actual lore instead of being a certain type of power fantasy

[hybrid gazelle]

how Gavel CT be making joke quest about fetching in MMORPG game like there there is not already 50+ fetch quests in the game

[rugged trench]

I’m still mad how you couldn’t save everyone in the wicker man quest

Doing the right thing just kills everybody 😭

[paper wyvern]

The funniest part is wynn used to have even more fetch quests

[split night]

I'm depressed after that quest

[rugged trench]

I’m also kinda mad I let what was his name uh Siegfried die in the one sky islands quest
I really wanted the super lore key that opens the tomb

[paper wyvern]

Area so depressing the mushroom shuts up

[rugged trench]

I tried so hard to keep him alive

But

Once he died

He’s just gone

No resetting

Nothing

I wish I could do over that quest

[hasty beacon]

My game was lagging so damn hard during that part but i somehow was able to save him

[paper wyvern]

I still don't know how he didn't die when I did it

[fallow heart]

New class:

[rugged trench]

Ig it doesn’t matter anyways cuz wasn’t it implied the actor is killed at the end anyways

Even if u make it back

With him

[hybrid gazelle]

the quest is not about who is at fault

it about sending the message

[hasty beacon]

Yea he gets slimed no matter what

[rugged trench]

Poor dude

[uneven basin]

Really??? Where's that implied ?

[hybrid gazelle]

well

he drag off to company hand

and he has a new replacement

[rugged trench]

At the end he’s taken away by mysterious guys in black suits

[hybrid gazelle]

it does not really do well

LOL

yueah

that mostly death sentence

[slender copper]

Really!? man that's very depressing (sadly wasn't able to complete it because there is no wiki guild about the quest... but tbh, don't think I'll be completing it regardless with what I've heard on it)

[rugged trench]

Plus the lore room has a pile of stacked Siegfried actor bodies

[uneven basin]

Oh it's been a while since I had him survive..

[rugged trench]

Yeah
The “true ending” isn’t even told by the quest book you gotta find it out yourself

In the end it’s revealed none of them burnt the stage and the whole thing was staged

And as a result all 3 die

[uneven basin]

So they slime the faulty actor and we get off with hush money ?

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah

[uneven basin]

Not like our character likes to spread information

[rugged trench]

Well if you “save” him you get a special key that unlocked the lore room
If you don’t you still get money either way iirc

[paper wyvern]

I don't think we are ever told who lit the fire but it was probably another part of the staging

[slender copper]

💀 I did hear about the summery that none of them were responsible, but the festival simply wanted someone to burn (which is really depressing)... but really?

[rugged trench]

Yeah

[hybrid gazelle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XOQYC-y8co

[uneven basin]

Oh yeah I remember that much x)

[hybrid gazelle]

oh yeah Fruma ost for highland and citadel is out

[paper wyvern]

Either way it wasn't any of the 3

[slender copper]

YES

[rugged trench]

The quest is so dark too
Cuz like the burn victims don’t make any noise it just slowly pans into the wickerman’s eyes you just see them in there

Morbid stuff

[hybrid gazelle]

I think in secrect discovery

[uneven basin]

After seeing that one discovery changeling scream I expected more pleads in the quest tbh

[hybrid gazelle]

it a lot more gruesome

because you get to see the flame burn intensely over the wicker flame

as you cut to ophril's pov of them getting burn alive

I think the SD one probably the best Wickerman burning

[slender copper]

||The one with Gikyo and Azeal with the wickerman correct?||

[hybrid gazelle]

yes

[tepid blade]

Yes

[rugged trench]

I wonder what the wastelands will bring

[paper wyvern]

First wickers spark yea

[rugged trench]

Does it have a sovereign,

?

I assume sohsoh would be there

[paper wyvern]

Yeah oru

[hybrid gazelle]

yes

Soverign Oru

[rugged trench]

Ah

[hybrid gazelle]

he is the warden

[rugged trench]

Have we seen images of it?

[hybrid gazelle]

no

he not a public figure

[rugged trench]

I meant

[hybrid gazelle]

do not come out often

[rugged trench]

The wastelands

[hybrid gazelle]

oh

[rugged trench]

Like the location

[hybrid gazelle]

it look like mesa

a bit

we see glimpse of it

but that it

no more

[uneven basin]

Bit disappointed if it's mesa 2 electric boogaloo

[paper wyvern]

We can see the edges from roughworks and mistwoods

[hybrid gazelle]

I dont thinki t will be

I think there will be subregion featuring volcano

consider the mobs

there used to be mobs spawning there

but it gor removed

[rugged trench]

Yknow
Since wastelands isn’t gonna be connected to the 13 part story

Do you think it’ll just all be misc quests in there or do you think it’ll have its own mini storyline?

[hybrid gazelle]

it oging to be side story

so likely its own mini storyline yeah

I already have theory about this

[rugged trench]

I hope it’s a sohsoh

Storyline

[rugged trench]

?

[hybrid gazelle]

Ppffff

LMAOOOO

[rugged trench]

What!

What did sohsoh ever do!

[hybrid gazelle]

Expecting villagers to be relevant in 2026

if they aint getting that spieces redesign I dont think they will be relevant

probably offhand mention and some cameo

Sohso is not major character this apply like the rest of his brothers

[rugged trench]

[hybrid gazelle]

he likely will give us exposition bout the cosmic

stuff going on

but he likely just going to be side character

I would not even be surpirse if he did not has a protrait

LOL

[paper wyvern]

I mean sohso is mentioned in the changeling notes but yes he is probably gonna be a side character for half a quest or we get ????

[hybrid gazelle]

they do

yeah

at best side character

[paper wyvern]

Idk it could be ????

[hybrid gazelle]

it hard to imagine what happen with Soosu now since the Hallowground project got disconntiue

Sohso is lucky if he got feature as a main character of a side quest

I highly dbout they would want a character that would have no protrait to be that important to the story

consider players would just stare at text most of the time when he presence in the story

I mean

they COULD loop hole this

byt giving Sohso a cloak

and have his face hidden

hiding his face would rid all the problem of needing to draw a villager

[paper wyvern]

Also sohso will probably be insane hyper focused on the research

[hybrid gazelle]

either that or he look fucked up

[hasty beacon]

Why would drawing a villager be so bad

[uneven basin]

If he's even still alive

[hybrid gazelle]

who wwanna draw villager

like

srly

but beside that

it liekly that they dont know how to draw villager yet

[hasty beacon]

Oooh big scary nose i guess we cant do it guys

[paper wyvern]

Considering the only reason he would still be researching is if his cosmic hyper fixation is research

[hybrid gazelle]

Ah yes the big nose

truly harmless thing

100% has no other historial context

but joke a side, as we can see from the lack of protrait for Seaskipper and Ragni King

it seems they are avoid making protrait for villagers

[paper wyvern]

Yeah absolutely no potential issues

[uneven basin]

Yeah Besides the historical context they don't want to make villager portraits cause they don't want to keep the villager species (or so I heard(

[hybrid gazelle]

most theory i have this is that they plan for villager remake

but they dont really started yet

so making villager protrait rn would be waste of time

because it will get remake later on anyway

so why bother

[uneven basin]

Also villagers in Wynn being especially greedy / capitalistic and having a whole world dominating cabal has unfortunate connotation

Not that it's a pattern most would notice but it's still there xf

[hybrid gazelle]

not outright comfirm but some CT already make it clear that villagers are nothing but racist sterotype of a group

[paper wyvern]

Lmao

[hybrid gazelle]

so I think we can assume some people in the team are aware of how utterly insane that Notch guy is

[split night]

huh?
I thought villagers in wynn are genuinely cool
unless the only cool ones are like, Seaskipper and Ragni King

huh

[uneven basin]

In wynncraft*

[split night]

oh okay

[hybrid gazelle]

in perfect world

[paper wyvern]

Wynnex but they also definitely meant wynncraft

[split night]

im counting Captain Ragon too

[hybrid gazelle]

wynncraft would have different name

[split night]

deltarune

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah sure why not

[uneven basin]

Yeah Wynntale

[paper wyvern]

Honestly I imagine a problem with villager rework is all the easy humanoids are already around

[hybrid gazelle]

but yeah I can see them loop hole this by making Sohso just wear conceal cloak to hide his face

I think that could work

[split night]

hey @uneven basin
check this out https://discord.com/channels/143852930036924417/1495805797274484736

[hybrid gazelle]

Wynncraft graphic make small detail to like

hard to show

so villagers rework gonna be hard thing to crack

[uneven basin]

Holy hell

[paper wyvern]

Could literally be hiding his face to avoid looking to close at cosmic crystals to avoid insanity as much as possible

[hybrid gazelle]

any work

just any excuse to not draw villager feature

[split night]

wait this is just WynnSwap lore

shit

[split night]

i post a lot of thing in here xd
so far i have finished a few designs, Saphanis, Bak'al, Lari and Eulogia

i'm not counting rat orphion, he look too stupid

[hybrid gazelle]

So summary

villager is problematic meida

also like

out side of controversial and historial context

villagers just

a shit spieces name

like

imagine naming human, Cityfolks

[split night]

I agree with you on this front

[hybrid gazelle]

it like

[split night]

like

[hybrid gazelle]

awful fucking spieces name

that bad outside of minecraft context

[split night]

who fucking name themselves villager 😭

[hybrid gazelle]

it ONLY WORK

[paper wyvern]

It's a remnant of using villager models to distinguish them

[hybrid gazelle]

in minecraft context

Literally like

only Villager's village

in this ENTIRE GAME

is Maltic

[split night]

it's like calling Human "Firestarter" or something

[hybrid gazelle]

that literally it

in Gavel it either town or city

there barely any village

so their name does not even make sense

like

[slender copper]

That makes sense, yeah. Then what name do you suggest, Trashie?

[hybrid gazelle]

you cant even argue that "oh maybe vilalger is how they started out"

because at that point

we should just name human, Caver

[slender copper]

<@&268142859327242242>

[hybrid gazelle]

cause they live in cave during prehistoric time

[hybrid gazelle]

I always call them sellans

there like

probably million of better names

litearlly anything is better than villagers

there like 5 billions name

that better than villagers

[slender copper]

Why is this server getting these scams more frequently?

[spring kernel]

That fuckin mister beast that i hate

[hybrid gazelle]

also even worse

like EVEN WORSE

[slender copper]

That's a cool replacement name.

[hybrid gazelle]

villagers has 0 fucking asthetic in their civilization

it always

random bullshit

if you are a fantasy spieces

and your whole entire spieces has no appealing asthetic

you mighta s well just go fucking extinct

like why the fuck are you even here

all you make is make BULLSHITS

like

[split night]

I like to call them Quartzian cuz llevigar is make entirely out of combustible material

[hybrid gazelle]

have every fucking villagers

jump into nearest pit

so they extinct themselves

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah so it not quartz

so like

what is villager asthetic

like I wanna say they are modernize but like

Fruma got that already and outdone it by miles

so like

what does villagers has

[split night]

Modernites?

[hybrid gazelle]

what does do they fucking has

[slender copper]

Ragni King and Seaskipper:

[hybrid gazelle]

those 2 can stay

[split night]

can we just call them Racisties

[hybrid gazelle]

I mean the one in Gavel

villagers in Wynn are fine by the sheer fact that they live in Wynn

so wynn got at least medival asthetic to exist in

and has potential

but like

wtf does villagers has

there is no

[split night]

I find it hilarious that Villagers in wynn are more respected and toleratible than the assholes living in gavel

[hybrid gazelle]

there is no potentai lin the game

there probably is but you gotta search deep but might aswell burn it all into the ground and make an ew one

like

you could say their asthetic is like

high fantasy stuff

but like

that genreal Gavel

that literally just general Gavel

like urelix got big ass fucking factory

with convey belt and random bullshit going on

there is like passport system going on in airbase

there is fucking quatron?

like dude wtf is this tech tree

[uneven basin]

I hate urelix's big ass factory that's supposed to be corkus's deal

[hybrid gazelle]

villager tech tree must be fucked up

[vestal rivet]

predates corkus I think

[split night]

Honestly i agree with this statement a lot

[hybrid gazelle]

okay but

I would say

COrkus lack of factory make it better

HEAR ME OUT

okay

[uneven basin]

Also A FLAT SCREEN ????? And a MODERN SURVEILLANCE SYSTEM????? does fruma even have that 😭

[vestal rivet]

I think it would make the most sense if Gavel was the least technologically advanced province, but also the most magically advanced province.

[hybrid gazelle]

Corkus is Sci fi and Steampunk theme

the thing is that

these two theme oppose one and another

[split night]

they need to pick a lane 😭

[vestal rivet]

Death's Realm is an entire different deal I think lol

[uneven basin]

I was talking about the forbidden prison lol

[hybrid gazelle]

you could easily make sci fi part overshadow the steampunk

so in my opinion

Corkus not having factory is good

because it impl they make things by hands

[vestal rivet]

make their specialty magic
what little tech they have should be very magic-driven, like we see in Llevigar

[hybrid gazelle]

which make corkain tech even more valuable

which explain its rarity

[split night]

that is
electromagic

[hybrid gazelle]

becaus these things are made by hands

[split night]

that's just corkus again

xd

[vestal rivet]

Llevigar does the whole quartz thing instead but I get your point

[split night]

I still find it like
STUPID, IDIOT that they constuct the entire llevigar out of EXPLOSIVE and UNSTABLE material

[vestal rivet]

that do be really silly

[split night]

like imagine someone accidentally cast arrow bomb 😭

[hybrid gazelle]

but like If I have my way

Villagers would have asthetic where

they are entirel magical fantasy

but also very industiralize in a way

where things get simplified

and make commericalize

like magic staff for example

[vestal rivet]

in my joke Wynncraft 2 thing from a while back, I had every possible catastrophe happen at once
including Llevigar going off like a nuclear bomb and making a mini-shattering in western Gavel

[split night]

i really like the way you draw their nose

[uneven basin]

What if somebody cast arrow bomb in the quarry 😭

[split night]

it's messes with my brain in a good way

[hybrid gazelle]

I try to improve them

but rn

[vestal rivet]

"ah yes let's build out city out of dynamite"

[uneven basin]

What if we tapped into the decay stuff and had pollution aesthetic or maybe retelling the Lorax is too old lore

[hybrid gazelle]

all I have is 4 fingers, rectangle head, and big ear

I think big ear would fit villager

[hybrid gazelle]

I ahve this for my wartorn project

where villagers and elves get into territory dispute

decay accelerate the issues that awlays on the horizon

[vestal rivet]

that being the elf mouth shape is funny

[hybrid gazelle]

and that issue is every civilization in gavel will always fight one and another

[split night]

I genuinely think that if Orphion ever want to take over Gavel, the Sellans is gonna pull a bullshit and NUKE the entire gavel with llevigar

[hybrid gazelle]

wynncraft run into a problem where

[split night]

naturally :3 shaped

[hybrid gazelle]

its cartoony artstyle

would HEAVILY BENEFIT

for having more wacky spieces

but TOO FUCKING BAD

THAT BACK THEN

ALL THEY CARE ABOUT IS RIPPING OFF NEAREST DND BOOK

So we have like the most boring elves ever

[vestal rivet]

Gavel Reborn Reborn update when

[hybrid gazelle]

the most boring dwarves eve

the most boring halfling ever

the most boring

Whatever bullshit they have

even orcs are boring

[vestal rivet]

the idea that sapient races are a dime a dozen in Gavel is funny to me

[hybrid gazelle]

ALL THE SPIECES

THAT COULD BE INTRESTING TO PROTRAY

[split night]

why is wynn so scarce of species

[hybrid gazelle]

ARE JUST FILLER MOBS 😭

[ashen salmon]

there’s like 7 different furry guys in the canyon alone

[hybrid gazelle]

I AM GOING INSANE

yeah and those 7 furry guys might as well just be animal

the game do not care

lik the game do not care that you killing these

obviously sapient

[vestal rivet]

Jinko Banditos

[hybrid gazelle]

creatures

we literally do not see Jinko be anything else but bandits

[vestal rivet]

they exist as a joke

[hybrid gazelle]

this shit is like having entire civiliation base on spec-

Oh wait chicago exist

no this is valid

we got an ENTIRE SPIECES

BASE ON SKYRAIDING

this shit is liek calling human the city builder

[split night]

😭

[hybrid gazelle]

this is like calling dwarves, miners

[split night]

this is literally just the name "villager"

[hybrid gazelle]

this shit is like calling elves, tree hugger

[split night]

like literally

[hybrid gazelle]

like

THEY JUST NAMED BASE ON ONE THING THEY DO LIKE

What if skyraider dont wanna skyraiding?

is this build in their gene?

[vestal rivet]

still kinda ambiguous as to what they are
they look human, but have from Gavel...?

[hybrid gazelle]

do they have the urge to skyraiding?

[hybrid gazelle]

dude

[split night]

They are amazonian in concept

[hybrid gazelle]

there is elves and dwarves

[vestal rivet]

they're 100% women too

[hybrid gazelle]

I dont think 100% women spieces is that far fetch

it just the way they do it is fucking stupid

WE LITERALLY HAVE

[ashen salmon]

wait the skyraiders arent human?

[vestal rivet]

less talking about that and more about the fact they make no sense lol

[split night]

you know like, Amazon people?
yeah they're basically that

[hybrid gazelle]

SPIECES BASE ON
Huam nbut long ears
HUman but short
Human but shorter

so having
Human but women is not that far fetch

[vestal rivet]

no humans native to Gavel

[hybrid gazelle]

clearly the bar is low

[ashen salmon]

i kinda thought it was just an organization

[hybrid gazelle]

no they aren ot human

like they are 100% not human

[vestal rivet]

Eltom is the exception, and humans don't really leave there

[split night]

Lesbian club theory

[hybrid gazelle]

then you gotta explain how villagers not brought up them meeting skyraider in first contact

because they make it seems like

[split night]

they just recruit more women to replace dead skyraiders

[hybrid gazelle]

900 AP was first human contact

and not the skyraider

if skyraider are indeed human

which they are not

because it make 0 sense

the only PLAUSIBLITY

is somehow just like corkain

there are population of human from Fruma

that invent airship

consist entirely off women

send up to Gavel somehow

[split night]

That's like
way too hard considering the distant between them and Fruma

[ashen salmon]

when was corkus founded again

[hybrid gazelle]

and somehow still alive until 1000 AP

[vestal rivet]

Gavel Reborn Reborn would need to redo a lot of random lore bits

[hybrid gazelle]

850 AP

[ashen salmon]

was it like 50 years ago or

[hybrid gazelle]

before ocean open up

[vestal rivet]

a "few hundred years ago" iirc

[split night]

huh that's actually longer than i thought, neat
so Mark Corkus died really long ago

[hybrid gazelle]

you heard of Markus Corkus

but hav you heard of William Wynn, Garvey Gavel, and Freddy Fruma

[split night]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cats-explosion-explodes-cat-explodes-gif-10131775219258044191

[hybrid gazelle]

and most importantly

[split night]

i mean my oc name is Ari Fletcher so i shouldn't be complaining

xd

[hybrid gazelle]

Otis Ocean

[split night]

okay nvm im gonna complain

https://tenor.com/view/cat-look-cat-look-at-camera-silly-cat-in-a-cage-gif-889392959852579879

[vestal rivet]

Randal the Vandal type of naming

[hybrid gazelle]

so yeah

skyraider being human is impossible

that would be a lot of explaination and strange implication

and also

the fact they are entirely consist of women and exist WAYYY before 900 AP

[split night]

Mitosis woman theory

[hybrid gazelle]

is somehow they mitosis

and somehow mange to stay pure until 1000 AP

which is like

[vestal rivet]

either that or they take the Gerudo route

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah no mitosis is only explaination

[split night]

they're like
Amazonian people + Pirate + Mitosis Kris theory

[vestal rivet]

Gerudo are a species that is like 99% women, they marry into other races and almost exclusively give birth to more gerudo girls for some reason

[hybrid gazelle]

imagine being like

[split night]

Is this just Viltrumites

[hybrid gazelle]

spieces that ocnsist of 99% women and the only male that you will ever give birth to would fated be the hitler of your verse

that fucking rough man

[vestal rivet]

I hate that I know enough about that show to know what you mean

[split night]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1135348779877404869/1402455625816084580/1277048160359026770.gif

[hybrid gazelle]

no

becuase viltrumite issue is their inbreeding

and not them having just too mcuh of a specific gender

their population is too small and run the risk of inbreeding with eahc other

so the only solution is to search for other spieces that viable of breeding and making offspring

[split night]

I have a weird thought about the skyraiders

I mean i can talk about it but it's still kinda weird

[vestal rivet]

eh
we see no Skyraider children but we also see 0 orc children
they could literally be doing the gerudo thing to repopulate

[hybrid gazelle]

Okay but

We see orc women and men

So it easy to connect the dots

[vestal rivet]

I used orcs as an example because Doguns live way too long, Elves have the breeding restrictions (...), and we do see examples of human, Dwarf, and Villager children

for what it's worth we see no Gert children either

[hybrid gazelle]

But we do have record of them fucking

[split night]

i think the cosmic thing just make new one-

[hybrid gazelle]

So yeah

[split night]

what

[exotic canyon]

where i can read fruma lore ?

[hybrid gazelle]

No they just fuck

[hybrid gazelle]

In as

Sd

[mossy badge]

In the game

[hybrid gazelle]

They literally talk about how gerts fuck like rabbit

[ashen salmon]

what

[exotic canyon]

😭

[hybrid gazelle]

And that how the military can’t get rid of them

[split night]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cats-explosion-explodes-cat-explodes-gif-10131775219258044191

[mossy badge]

W lore

[vestal rivet]

iirc Gerts are meant to be mutated Villagers
so either the mutations are still going on and are rampant but somehow also unnoticed, or they are repopulating themselves somehow

[hybrid gazelle]

Because gerts only habe 2 things in mind

[exotic canyon]

except game

[hybrid gazelle]

Eat and fuck

[summer bluff]

Every single highlands song's description is blurred ;-;

[vestal rivet]

I missed this then...

[mossy badge]

Idk wiki

[split night]

yeah we just got that they fuck like rabbits

[ashen salmon]

EAT N FUCK KINGDOM STEVE

[split night]

i'm surprised by this too don't get me wrong

[vestal rivet]

I mean
they have little restraint when it comes to the more traditional meaning of hunger
ig it makes sense they don't have much restraint for the carnal version either

[exotic canyon]

hmmm,who is the strongest one base on lore ?

[hybrid gazelle]

Depend

[mossy badge]

https://tenor.com/view/ishowspeed-speed-fortnite-early-stream-reunion-gif-143982391907906686

[hybrid gazelle]

The player is stepngest

Cause they got plot armor

[split night]

p*werscaling

[ashen salmon]

obviously it’s the GOAT ARIODO

[split night]

Seaskipper Captain solo all fictions 😔

[mossy badge]

https://tenor.com/view/ishowspeed-speed-random-kid-random-kid-gif-10698606526004440975

[uneven basin]

Us B)

[split night]

what if Wynncraft had Deltarune battle system

[mossy badge]

-99% playerbase or smth

[hybrid gazelle]

Then build channel will die

[split night]

are we that ass at dodging 😭

[split night]

biggest consequence

[exotic canyon]

what is anathema?

[mossy badge]

I mean idk i never played it

[mossy badge]

Realm beast

[uneven basin]

Play wtp

[mossy badge]

U can know before

[split night]

It's not very hard, kinda easy if you get the hangs of it

i played too many sans fangame that i'm pretty decent at it, i beat roaring knight without mantle and no heal before so

[split night]

Just play the game and read the dialogs, like, enjoy the game, and REALLY read the dialogs and have fun

if this is your first time

being in #📚lore_discussion is guarantee for you to get spoiled

[mossy badge]

Bro doesn't read dialogue and just asks who's the strongest in #📚lore_discussion , not surprised

[exotic canyon]

im just a gay skip player

[split night]

😭

[exotic canyon]

i will try my best

[split night]

then you don't care about the lore in the slightest and just the gameplay xd

like the undertale people who "z" and "x" everything

[exotic canyon]

like this @@

[summer bluff]

Everyone is wrong, it's yahya who's the strongest

[mossy badge]

^^ This post was fact checked by

YAHYA THE ULTIMATE FORM

True ✅

[split night]

he had 100m hp in the drug quest so

[slender copper]

He has WHAT

[summer bluff]

That was merely only what we could comprehend

[uneven basin]

Yahya is actually the beast of the realm of shrooms

[slender copper]

Judging from how we were well... high at the time... probably 💀

[split night]

yeah it's actually confirmed in the secret discovery in Fruma that we were actually high while meeting professor Eih

[slender copper]

I thought that Eih knew that the elf who sent us did not know the effects of that specific mushroom on humans, and decided to help guild the player throughout the entire quest till they finally sobered up... by jumping into the fish pond and probably almost drowning.

[hot timber]

how big of a difference will tasim's alternate route be when it gets added?

like how much will change

[split night]

I don't think any of us is gonna be sure until it's out

I'm just gonna replay fruma again if it's out

[slender copper]

Oh? I thought that alternate thing was scrapped in the update... in that case I'm gonna save my archer when it comes out lol.

[split night]

might as well powerlevel until you reach lv 115
it should be good enough to play through Fruma uninterrupted

[mossy badge]

Different dialogue in quests

[tepid blade]

If I had to guess, only dialogue changes without much changes to the actual gameplay or story progression

[pine flower]

assuming the trailers is how it wouldve been, pretty major changes

[slender copper]

Not the word to describe it, keyboard.

[split night]

Honestly it would take a lot of effort but man, alternative route that isn't just dialog changes is just gonna be so PEAK

like it cannot be PEAKER than this

deltarune level of PEAK

[pine flower]

i mean in the trailers he literally had a 'aura edit' where he wiped the floor with what i think were constables

[paper wyvern]

I think that works

[shut mist]

wings

not constables

[pine flower]

oh it was wings

i didnt remember

[shut mist]

yeah

[pine flower]

fodder either way

[whole river]

Tasim haters when he pulls up with the rebel route (all you have to do is tell him his boyfriend died)

[pine flower]

fr

[split night]

when are we getting Snowgrave route

[uneven basin]

Erm it's called nesaak

[hybrid gazelle]

Tasim hater asking why he did not change the entire social structure of fruma on his first day as sovereign

[whole river]

That was a funny convo yesterday lol

“Why didn’t tasim simply revoke fruma’s government in his first five minutes”

[fierce oasis]

Why is Tasim titled “the last sovereign” when Oru is still around?

[whole river]

He’s the newest and last one to be made

[hybrid gazelle]

Because at that point might as well call him the last sovereign cause oru ass not doing anything

If mf believe his warden job going to stay intact after everything in apotheosis

Yeah man might as well just kick him out

[whole river]

Yeah idk what Oru’s plans are

Especially ignoring the giant eyeball

[hybrid gazelle]

Not even giant eye balls

Just general news of citadel being attack

Like

???

Bro just doing warden job for fun I guess?

[whole river]

He’s gotta be there on a secret mission

[fierce oasis]

Not to mention Deraj got broken into already

[whole river]

There has to be

[hybrid gazelle]

Bro I heard stick to the schedule but this is insane

[whole river]

Cuz no way did his prison get raided, his queen gone, his government in upheaval and nothing

[fervent sun]

his boss was dethroned and he stood there due to his schedule

[fierce oasis]

I feel like they would have said if they killed him in the raid. I’m sure the next story stuff will explain it

[mossy badge]

Schedule>>>>>>>>>everything else

[pine flower]

the giant portal was probably during his nap time

yeah

[mossy badge]

I'll be sad if he turns out to be a chill guy and we'll just murder him anyway

[pine flower]

95% of all our kills btw

[mossy badge]

https://tenor.com/view/murder-spongebob-rainbow-gif-15431155

[split night]

I wish we had a spare option that somehow can intergrate well with this combat system

there is a lot of people i don't want to murder

[pine flower]

i wish there was some way to not commit acts of terror in torann

[uneven basin]

The Undertale is seeping through

[mossy badge]

Just run away 🤯

[pine flower]

i did NOT need to kill all those guys i have a teleport spell

[split night]

I'm natural UT/DR fan you caught in the wild

[uneven basin]

That would create another alternate tasim route tho lol

[fervent sun]

the cows from Shadow of the Beast 😔

[uneven basin]

I do wish we could meet the family of one of the guys we kill

[mossy badge]

Me when i kill a newborn cow for a ritual 🤑 🤩

[pine flower]

meh just make someone else do it and frame us to make frumer seem even more corrupt

[hybrid gazelle]

Who else tho

The fort Torah massacre is inportant for the story to take place

It one of the main driving reason to why zhiraok deems us dangerous

[mossy badge]

Sneaking illegally into the province is totally not enough crime

[split night]

Fort Torran weren't equip to deal with a beast like us
we just genocide them

[pine flower]

me when i go into a territorial animals home and come back from the dead just to kill it (koltron)

[uneven basin]

Koltron is a bit more than that tho

[pine flower]

true idr their lore

[mossy badge]

Atleast not sentient or idk

[uneven basin]

Anyways it endangered the canyon locals

[hybrid gazelle]

So no matter what the incident at fort torran is too important for the story to be alternative

[pine flower]

the canyon endangers canyon locals tho

[ashen salmon]

the player had non-lethally beaten people up before right

[signal bough]

it is extremely powerful, enough so that its spirit attempts to escape

[pine flower]

the illusion of choice

[mossy badge]

Ye

[signal bough]

mostly in duels, right?

[mossy badge]

I mean i think so

[pine flower]

yeah we just HATE soldiers ig

[signal bough]

actually

[ashen salmon]

i don’t think it was hate more like an animalistic panic

[signal bough]

they keep fighting even until they're on their last legs

[hybrid gazelle]

Tbh we have no idea what soldiers will do to us

[signal bough]

people can say 'hey I'm beat' and the player stops, even if they don't know them that well(shaman girl in queen's recruit)

[hybrid gazelle]

So we react out accordingly to ensure our goal to finding Tasim is block

Cause if we get capture

[split night]

I think a bunch of people trying to attack and capture something like us is just
like
provoking a beast that can blast you to dust

[hybrid gazelle]

We could get memory wipe again

And that bad

That really bad

[pine flower]

how to survive the player: dye your tag to be blue or green

[split night]

yeah

that too

[hybrid gazelle]

If we let ourselves be capture, we either get memory wipe, kill, or whatever

Fruma has 0 reason to keep us alive

[signal bough]

I think the player's actions at Torann are legally okay according to real-world laws of warfare

[rugged trench]

I actually wonder about this
There was that super early game quest involving creepers… like straight up just Minecraft creepers

What gonna happen to that?

Would they rebrand it?

[hybrid gazelle]

Will be gone

Someday

[pine flower]

super retconned

[hybrid gazelle]

Creeper in rol also got phase out

[ashen salmon]

when will cls become cts

[hybrid gazelle]

Lost sanctuary already gone

[uneven basin]

Creeper will really become an extinct species

[mossy badge]

Forgery update in 2040 🔥

[hybrid gazelle]

Good

[split night]

I think player's Character is required to kill in Fort Torann because of how important it is to the story and just like
reasonably they will either kill us off or wipe our memory, which mean we lose our friend Tasim

[hybrid gazelle]

Yeah

And we know how bad memory wipe can be

Also to be fair

[split night]

There's no other way to spin this really, we won't just be a dumbass and let them capture us xd

[hybrid gazelle]

Due to the amount of soldiers being there

Trying to keep it non lethal is almost impossible

There too many people to keep track of

And all of them want player dead

[split night]

being careful not to kill anyone in an environment where there are just too many things around is REALLY hard
it's like trying not to damage cardboard while walking in a field of JUST cardboard

[pine flower]

definitely not, but there are more ways of escaping than mass murder

[signal bough]

well let's go over the exact events

[uneven basin]

I wish we could like, get to defend ourselves a bit more about torann

[hybrid gazelle]

It no longer option the moment we got captured lol

[uneven basin]

Maybe we can and I forgor tho

[hybrid gazelle]

You can’t

[pine flower]

why not? torann is completely open above itself

[hybrid gazelle]

Only massacre option

[split night]

considering we GOT captured and was fighting to escape them in the first place

yeah

[hybrid gazelle]

I don’t think player can canonically climb wall but sure

[ashen salmon]

wasnt the fortress kinda locked up tight

[pine flower]

teleport

spell

wyvern

[hybrid gazelle]

Maybe there way out if player is Spider-Man or some shit

[split night]

are we deadass gonna use a wyvern in Fort Torann 😭

as an argument??

[uneven basin]

No like after the fact when tasim gets mad for example

[hybrid gazelle]

Damn why don’t ct make escape route for all of these

Are they stupid???

[split night]

😭

[hybrid gazelle]

Surely

[pine flower]

oh and no they cant wall climb but they are great at parkour

[split night]

Not even needing teleport, bring a wyvern

at this point in the story we should have a Wyvern

[hasty beacon]

Movement spells aint canon

[split night]

damn why did CT didn't think of this

[hybrid gazelle]

Being great at parkour is entirely different than somehow able to climb very smooth 90 defeee angle surface

[uneven basin]

Like damn sorry guess I should've let myself get KILLED is that what you want mister complicit in genocide??

[pine flower]

oh youre right the retconned movement spells when they reworked bobs tomb opening

[hybrid gazelle]

Also

You do realize wyvern is gameplay thing like

Also this is fucking fruma

Don’t you think t hey when anti air shit over the wall

Yoh gonna get shot out of the sky

That shit too dangerous

[split night]

I'm trying to compare the person who make the argument about movement spell to wyvern to point out how stupid it is

xd

[ashen salmon]

they got the Panopticon

[pine flower]

ok then ill just break the door like we do in the normal version

[hybrid gazelle]

They have literal

Fucking sniper

[hybrid gazelle]

Ah yes break the door while soldiers surrounding us

Great plan

[pine flower]

yes

[split night]

Aelumia lighthouse 😨

[uneven basin]

I was going to bring up corkus but it was a long enough time ago

[whole river]

Aye bro if that’s how you roll sure, but if I got captured by the fascist monarchy, IM DIPPING BY ALL MEANS

[pine flower]

i can use spells just fine while im surrounded by soldiers

[hybrid gazelle]

All the fort soldiers will 100% sit back and wait for us to break the door

Take your time man

Just take your time

[pine flower]

homeboy

[hybrid gazelle]

Don’t worry we will sit back and and wait for yoh to break the door

[pine flower]

surely you jest?

i dont need more than a second to destroy one door

[hybrid gazelle]

Well in game it not a second

So like

What going on with that

[pine flower]

whatre they gonna do in that time? show of their cool new animations?

[signal bough]

Player is lured to Fort Torann under false pretenses by active-duty non-combatant(Caravan Driver was blessed and in the employ of the Fort)
Player is restrained, but still has weapons. Player escapes and kills initial detail.
Player holds out against relentless waves of assault. At no point do any soldiers attempt surrender.
Even when it's just him and the Player remaining, Commander Lilles does not attempt to retreat, and attempts to fight the Player.
Player escapes Fort Torann. Caravan Driver only survivor, did not attempt to engage

[split night]

riddle me this, you are willing to kill soldiers of a monarchist-fascist regime to either escape or protect other right?

[hybrid gazelle]

Idk restraint you?

Capture?

Knock you out?

[hasty beacon]

I wish we couldve killed the caravan driver

[pine flower]

yeah cause that worked so well last time

[hybrid gazelle]

Idk man player’s head kinda vulnerable

[hybrid gazelle]

It work well a lot of time

[split night]

The FACTthat they DID restraint you and Knock you out PRIOR to this massacre is hilarious to me

[whole river]

It’s funny cuz originally I thought he was our intro to the rebels

[hybrid gazelle]

Player literally get bonk by nobody

[split night]

😭

[hybrid gazelle]

Ardulf be single handedly one shot the player

[ashen salmon]

autodelete moment

[pine flower]

anyway my point is there is no point in trying to reason why we had to kill them all
we had to kill them so the story could happen

[hybrid gazelle]

Aftually

Wait

This make Ardulf the strong wynncraft character

because the only reason he did is us creasing his airship

We did not get to fight him

But what we know he capable of knock out us in one hit

[signal bough]

This sounds entirely legal. Soldiers are under no obligation to incapacitate or capture soldiers who refuse to surrender

[hybrid gazelle]

So logically

[split night]

I think we have a lot of reasons to kill them
you just kinda ignore it for the sake of morality high grounds xd

[hybrid gazelle]

Ardulf is strongest character

[split night]

which is fair, we are humans we tend to do that

[signal bough]

I think it's only a point of debate because the Frumans say something like 'shows no care for military lives' which caused me to laugh when I saw it

[split night]

The resistance might genuinely killed more military people than us

if we count throughout history

xd

[hybrid gazelle]

The canopy?

That like

[pine flower]

Im not saying this for the sake of a high ground i kill detlas citizens daily
yes there are reasons to kill them, but how does that lead us to "we had to kill them" and not "it was the easiest thing to do"

[split night]

can you like, rephrase this sentence so it can be a little bit clearer what you trying to convey, im getting mix signals

[signal bough]

if anything, I would say that the battle shows that the Frumans are an extremely fanatical enemy, and were fighting against a force which had been utterly demonized by their government and military for false reasons

[split night]

The resistance in general i think

[ashen salmon]

mostly the canopy though

[split night]

since there were more of them before

[ashen salmon]

those guys had to have killed a LOT of sussy impotsers

[split night]

yeah i guess mostly the canopy and that cursed one group that rediscover the 5 class focus

[signal bough]

the Canopy is effectively the military arm of a society under siege

[hybrid gazelle]

If we combine like the past resistance

Then yeah

But leaves, steel, and blade?

Fuck no

Only the leave lead small scale operation

[split night]

yeah no

they are way too outclassed

[hybrid gazelle]

I don’t think they barely kill guards

[split night]

I think I mostly refer to the Cursed group in that one secret discovery that is about them rediscovering the 5 class focus
idk what they're called

the leader is someone named X

[hybrid gazelle]

Hmmmm

[split night]

what prompt you to create such atrocity

the golden tasim

[vestal rivet]

Steelfeather were more some kind of humanitarian group than a rebellion, the Leaves lacked manpower and were in a region where resistance wouldn't actually do all that much, and the Blossomed Blades were more concerned about gossip with their more posh lives in the Highlands
The Canopy may as well been THE rebellion

[pine flower]

alright ill try
first i said; my point is we only 'had' to kill them because that was needed to make the story happen
then you said; i think we have a lot of reasons to kill them, you are ignoring it because you want a moral high ground
then i said; no im not, and i agree that there are reasons to kill them, but that doesnt make it something you 'have' to do

[spring kernel]

golen tasim

[pine flower]

golen tasim

[whole river]

when you think about it the leaves was a suicide pact except only syndra knew about it

[signal bough]

Leaves and Feather were also theoretically subverted

[split night]

ah, you want the sneaking through Fruma option?

isn't that already happened and we got caught in the process of trying to sneak through

[ashen salmon]

we were never told how ||tasim knew that we were compromised||

[vestal rivet]

the Canopy is awesome
best resistance

[pine flower]

that is what we do the whole time yeah

[ashen salmon]

maybe there’s a secret i missed though

[signal bough]

I figured he just overheard the queen talking about it

[pine flower]

but in one we have terrorism added to the list

[split night]

the massacre is a desperate move from us at that point, we genuinely cannot sneak through that many eyes laying bare on us really

[ashen salmon]

he did say something about someone in the group being in cahoots with the crown?

[split night]

if anything, killing the caravan driver give us the trolley problem

[signal bough]

like 'hey soussy can you make me a sand homunculus? these resistancoids are gonna try attacking me and I want to style on them.'

[cinder cedar]

there is a possibility it was Soosu

[fervent sun]

most of the leaves kills can be seen during the quests, and most of them i imagine are from Sui

[pine flower]

we dont need to sneak out of our capture
when was that implied?

[split night]

... you are saying we let them continue our capture to our punishment??

[ashen salmon]

“look at this absolute loser trying to get one up on me. bee tee dubs quotas are going up again”

[pine flower]

no

[split night]

either that or you just misinterpret what i said, what other option do we have when we got captured like that

[pine flower]

run

[split night]

the door is block by a strong spell that require 5-6 cast to break through 😭

run to where exactly

run back to out of fruma?

[pine flower]

to the train station that thing has zero walling

torann train station*

[split night]

what are we even doing at the train station then

[pine flower]

killing everyone ig

[split night]

there we go

[whole river]

Why would we go back…

[split night]

see, desperate option

unless you start to suggest we operate a train that happen to be here while all that happen

[pine flower]

....
killing everyone is what we are doing there, not what we can do to leave without killing everyone there

[split night]

which at that point is just ridiculous

[pine flower]

that is what the player is doing

buh

[whole river]

Ok but why would we be going back?!

[pine flower]

oh my god

i give up

[whole river]

We entered Fruma to find tasim 😭

[split night]

It's so illogical trying to play pacifist here

just like a certain someone

gosh I love Lari

[whole river]

Even lari would tell this guy some times you just gotta snap a neck or two

[pine flower]

i said i give up stop spouting your black and white nonsense

[split night]

RoL5 Lari would say this

[ashen salmon]

we wouldn’t need to operate the train though right

[whole river]

Indeed

[ashen salmon]

couldnt we just follow the tracks

[split night]

you are trying your black and white nonsense too 😭

[cinder cedar]

Fruman guard and the state are hostile that doesn't even give a chance at pacifisim without bending the knee to them

[whole river]

Isn’t…the black and white nonsense from you?

[pine flower]

No?????

[pine flower]

what??

[cinder cedar]

the moment we decided to go get Tasim back we knew heads were going to roll

[split night]

are we talking to RoL 1 Lari rn

[ashen salmon]

and thus began the corruption arc

[pine flower]

oh my god

you. are. arguing. we could only either; doom ourselves, or kill a ton of people.

two options

[split night]

yes and may you enlighten me with a third

I've been begging for it

it must be at least logical

[uneven basin]

The quest explanation for this is that you're too restrained in that moment but if there was more dev time I could see a divergence here where we break our cuffs right there and jump off the cliff

[whole river]

What’s the third option, let’s say this is right after we got captured in a heavily fortified fortress with soldiers everywhere and a door that cannot break easily

[split night]

not... running into a train or like, run back out of fruma

[pine flower]

run, kill like the six guys actually holding you down, fly up

[fervent sun]

if we hadnt killed everyone in fort toraan the first quests from leaves in the wind would have been way different not only because of mass killing but also we would'ave been spotted way more quickly than we were.
there are alot of reasons why fort torran happened that way

[whole river]

Fly?

[split night]

again with the movement spell 😭

[pine flower]

I NEVER SAID THAT

ts ragebait

[whole river]

Where has the player ever took to the skies lmfao

In any quest

[fervent sun]

pulls out the idol

[split night]

have we ever use a movement spell canonically in quest to fly up

[whole river]

If it was that easy like 10 quests would’ve been solved easily

[pine flower]

every class has a height gaining movement spell, aldo wyverns also thats only one of them

[split night]

i repeat this statement

[whole river]

BRO WE DIDNT BRING THE WYVERN

😭

[fervent sun]

we for sure cant bring wyverns in the train

[whole river]

Also does this mean the player is cooked if they have a shit movement spell

Shaman players HAVE to be murderers

Makes no sense when you think on it

[split night]

If wyvern is a thing then why isn't it being used in like ANY quest after Canyon of the Lost guide quest

😭

it's a gameplay thing

you can't really spin it to make it actually a thing we can use in the story

[pine flower]

ok fine lets say we remove that one, please counter the two other options

[fervent sun]

caravan driver letting a ragni soldier with a big giant flying lizard to fort torran with a train

[whole river]

I think it would be funny if you have a warp equipped you just start floating up like Jesus

[split night]

xd

[pine flower]

back to this btw never fucking said that

[cinder cedar]

not all gameplay mechanics or aspects are canon

[split night]

yeah i just said that

im pretty sure

[whole river]

Think he meant to reply to the other guy

[split night]

yeah i'm still waiting for a third option

that is logical

[pine flower]

broski
crowski
vroski
there was more than one suggestion in the message you retorted with "movement spell isnt canon"

[split night]

in my defense, you said fly

what are we gonna do at that situation

[pine flower]

that was one of the suggestions

[split night]

start levitating??

[split night]

where in this have more than one suggestion

i beg of you to explain
unless Run and Kill like the six guy actually holding you down and Fly is 3 different options

[whole river]

You have to forgive us because one of your options was genuinely the player taking a wyvern out from their back pocket

[pine flower]

1 run away
2 kill the guys actually restraining you and get away
3 fly

genius

[split night]

YOU ACTUALLY WEREN'T KIDDING

😭

[whole river]

Wait but lemme level with you

How are you escaping

[split night]

this is so stupid i can't even

[pine flower]

this has gotta be the stupidest convo i ever had

[whole river]

It’s a heavily fortified base

[split night]

like
the first one has already been to nowhere, literally, where do you run to

[whole river]

On that much we agree

[split night]

the second one, yeah you kill 6 of them then what?

and the third one is 😭

[uneven basin]

There's a huge gap right by the train tho

[pine flower]

well when you get captured, at the train station, there is no wall stopping you

for one

[whole river]

So you’re running to the unknown woods in an unknown land while the entire base chases you down?

[ashen salmon]

MR BREAST

[split night]

another fallen soul

[pine flower]

THANK YOU

[split night]

not to mention, they are fucking familiar with the place, we are not

[pine flower]

literally what happens anyway

[whole river]

Look maybe it’s a good thing the player has their own personality cuz some of yall sound like you would’ve gotten cooked in detlas

[whole river]

No, there’s no one chasing you

[fervent sun]

we can use movement spells in game but we cant canonically spam them to fly away (quests are for all classes and for sure most shaman players cant fly)
wyverns for sure werent with us during fruma invasion
the guards seen our faces that would ave ruined our time with the leaves in the wind
and they werent weak enough for us to ignore them, they would have catched us somehow i imagined

[uneven basin]

Yeah ? Not saying it's a better choice xD

We already have the whole fruman army after us anyways

[pine flower]

so you reason we mass murder everyone is "no witnessess that can hunt us immediately"

[split night]

I'm actually getting nausea from this conversion genuinely
are we dead ass just trying to be white in this kind of situation?

[whole river]

That’s his argument

[split night]

and not like, fucking gray?

[fervent sun]

one of many reasons

[whole river]

Yes? We only killed people who fought us

[pine flower]

yeah

[whole river]

Also let’s stop using murder

It’s not murder

[pine flower]

its murder

[whole river]

They have weapons aimed at you

[split night]

we literally already reasoning with this are you intentionally forgot the discussion

[whole river]

In no court of law is it murder

[split night]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1398295183568666714/1429158760386924774/ragebait.gif

[fervent sun]

no escape, witness, treating our lives, thats enough reasons to fight to death

[uneven basin]

Tasim disagrees

:p

[split night]

Are we deadass

[whole river]

Tasim is not a court of law lmfao

Also he’s killed soldiers

[uneven basin]

No I know I'm jesting x)

[split night]

like we literally discuss about the Fort Torran thing just some conversation above about whether or not if it was necessary and justified

[uneven basin]

I find it funny we're having the tasim torann debate

[split night]

and then back down here they literally said we murder with no reason

is this ragebait

[whole river]

Like it’s just not murder at all, and the player HAS murdered before

[split night]

I agree that on like, all the case where we actually kill defenseless people

this SITUATION however

IS NOT KILLING DEFENSELESS PEOPLE

[ashen salmon]

we did kinda kill ardulf

[pine flower]

Murder; the crime of unlawfully and unjustifiably killing a person
sure its probably justifiable, but was it lawful? you are a trespasser and are not under any direct threat to your life before initiating them

ergo, murder

[split night]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cats-explosion-explodes-cat-explodes-gif-10131775219258044191

[cinder cedar]

plus it has to be pre-meditated aka planned

[whole river]

^

[ashen salmon]

…not necessarily

[pine flower]

no thats just a specific kind of murder

[split night]

Self defense murder, are we gonna come up with this term and use it

[whole river]

It’s justified and the law itself can be contested if Fruma was a non fascist monarchy

[cinder cedar]

it depends where you live

[uneven basin]

To be fair our life is kind of at stake, we have good reason to believe they don't have our best interests in mind taking us into custody

[fervent sun]

in fruma laws we did invade their province and kill their guards, after all in the end we were the most wanted there

[split night]

I'm pretty sure in Fruma law, it's okay to kill the cursed or capture them and exile them

[pine flower]

so we can ignore it being unlawful because you dont agree with the people running the place?

[whole river]

Yeah I disagree with hitler’s policies, sue me ig lol

[fervent sun]

well yeah thats what we do in the whole questline

[pine flower]

this is literally a fallacy, do better.

[whole river]

The whole law about the cursed is based on a fabrication

[split night]

AND FUCKING
why are we twisting this conversation into about murder?
like
give me your third option

[whole river]

So it’s not even lawful at best

[whole river]

Nah it’s that the law is based on a lie

the cursed aren’t a thing

[warm flicker]

goes from illegally entering the province, to murder of multiple guards, to the murder of multiple sovereigns, general treason against Her Majesty

[whole river]

there’s no curse

[fervent sun]

yeah lmao

[split night]

I find it hilarious that "law" is being considered morality now
when it never is and will never be morality

[whole river]

It’s also just a fake law

[split night]

yes we break the law, of course

[cinder cedar]

is it really Treason if we no longer are Fruman Citizen?

[whole river]

To detain people who have magic for no reason

[split night]

then this should be under war law

[pine flower]

i have, and you havent listened, as always, just called it fake cause you dont like it, the player does it cause it has to happen for the story and its the easiest thing for them to do, thats it

[fervent sun]

we break laws even for places that we are welcome, fruma's queen is just more reasons to break everything

[split night]

running into the mist with soldier guarding the entrance to the wellspring of immortality is not a good idea

[warm flicker]

the only way Fruma can invade Wynn is through the Ragni pass or by sea. Therefore, we just drop a bunch of Corkian payloads on Fruman soldiers as they cross through the Ragni pass, instant Wynn W

[cinder cedar]

also I wouldn't really say we are invading, but we are tresspassing and illegally trespassing the border

[ashen salmon]

i’d have to take another look around fort torann and the mountain pass but i kinda feel like we could have snuck past the fort

[split night]

mountain on both side as well

[pine flower]

1. we are discussing the definition of murder because lari defender insisted we werent murdering people
2. murder is both unjust AND unlawful, i never stated that law was morality

[cinder cedar]

while the player is one man army, we are not repesenting Wynn or Ragni any way for form

[split night]

what is this reasoning

[split night]

okay give this a reasonable escape route like you said running off to the train station side

[pine flower]

you should like, actually go there and check the train station we arrive at torann at

[split night]

without movement spell to stick as closely to canon quest line

[split night]

bet

after this was disproven, give me a better third option

[warm flicker]

truth be told i can see the player slipping past the guards without causing a mass casualty event, heck it wouldnt even alter the story that much (instead of catching a mass murderer fruma would be catching someone evading the guards, which in a draconian society like Fruma carries the same punishment)

[cinder cedar]

can we actually use the back door in the train wagon before the guards get to us?

[pine flower]

'was' is not the correct word to use there

[muted crypt]

if anything what we’re doing would be considered treachery or desertion

[split night]

going to fruma to save our friend, only to go back out

[cinder cedar]

on Wynn and Ragni side yes, but you cannot charge crimes commited to Wynn in Fruma in Fruman court

[muted crypt]

I also feel like having the player be generally less known (not murdering an entire fortress) would make more sense gameplay wise with how ur not immediately arrested in cities

[uneven basin]

Gonna get an ugly phone picture of the torann gap

[ashen salmon]

the player did canonically destroy their own criminal record

[muted crypt]

doesnt change the fact that we’re the most wanted criminal in fruma

[split night]

yeah not even massacring those people and we would still be a criminal

[split night]

as if they can't just make another one

[muted crypt]

not like theyd just forget that happened

[split night]

like it would be weird if that was the only criminal record of us in Fruma

[ashen salmon]

tbh? that copy was probably the only one at the time