📚lore_discussion

[rain saffron]

that cyclops is so cute but also staring into my soul LOL

[hybrid gazelle]

the big eye is the false eye

you can see it real eyes on the side of the head

[dim plover]

That’s like, SE fauna biology-energy type vibes

Sounds like biology an SE creature would have

[hybrid gazelle]

what

this is literally real life thing
you can find this in nature

[quartz mist]

that's what caterpie was based off of

[warm flicker]

i gotta know if its possible to get tasim and aledar there simutaniously 😭

[chilly bluff]

so i did a new character after what must’ve been years and went through recover the past, why did they remove there is no war in the fruma walls?

[gray elbow]

I believe because they intend to have war within the fruma walls.

[spring kernel]

cause that was just a reference and the quest is more about the actual fruma now

cause that's a thing that's actually being made now

[hybrid gazelle]

The war in fruma stuff is more of a pop culture reference LOL

[chilly bluff]

what’s the point of removing it? the content of the reference isn’t in the game yet lol

[hybrid gazelle]

No because it's just avatar reference

[chilly bluff]

i know that

[hybrid gazelle]

it serve no purpose in the lore because it just pop culture reference and nothing else

they never have plan to have war in Fruma

[spring kernel]

the quest was updated to be accurate with actual fruma

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah they ahve solid idea what they want for Fruma now

therefore the pop culture reference woudl give unintended false information to Fruma

[spring kernel]

back when the quest was first made i doubt anyone had even the slightest idea of what fruma would be

[chilly bluff]

yet it does not say espren and says ??? instead when players already know what the town is called ?

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah LOL

[hybrid gazelle]

because that not Espren?

[chilly bluff]

it shows multiple ones and one certainly looks like espren

[spring kernel]

I mean a normal player wouldn't know it's called espren

[hybrid gazelle]

It do not?

[chilly bluff]

but idk, maybe they all look the same

[spring kernel]

and when it releases someone doing rtp won't know about espren yet either

[chilly bluff]

the 60k views in question

[hybrid gazelle]

the place we see describe as Fruman Slum

Espren is an entire town so it likely that entire different location

[chilly bluff]

that is the smaller city, later on in the quest you see more

[spring kernel]

someone playing wynn for the first time won't have seen the teaser

your character also has not seen the fruma youtube teaser

[hybrid gazelle]

but yeah it either what magic said or it not Espren

It either of those two

[chilly bluff]

maybe, but in that case why are you not just hiding every other future town from quests then? it sounds like even if fruma is released you will keep it mysterious

[hybrid gazelle]

because they don't want it to be mystery?

It depend on context and reason to why they should keep the town mysterious

for context of recover the past, it meant to give limit what you know about Fruma as much as possible

[chilly bluff]

sure im just trying to understand the reason behind it

[hybrid gazelle]

it likely just to avoid unncessary information because even if you playing recover the past by the time of Fruma release, that would be unimportant information until very late game

compare to other city in the game where if it got mention, you likely will get to see it later on

[spring kernel]

I mean idk the actual reasoning behind not just saying espren on the screen

but it seems pretty logical to me

[hybrid gazelle]

I think what thye meant is that why dont the writer just show the town name LOL

[spring kernel]

you're watching a memory of a place you don't know

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah there a lot of reasoning you can come up with

[chilly bluff]

i also don’t know about the “fruma slums” but that isn’t hidden

[spring kernel]

the actual name of that place is also hidden

[chilly bluff]

well supposedly not

[hybrid gazelle]

the information you need to know at that moment that it's a furma slum

and that it

that what the writers want you to know in that moment

that is all you need to know

[drifting aurora]

i think the quest got reworked before the espren reveal anyway

[shut hornet]

espren was actually new info in that quest and it was really cool when it came out

its a little lamer now that youve seen more of it + its name

[drifting aurora]

not that that matters, though. the area names are obfuscated because that's kind of the point of the quest. you're seeing fragments of memories without being able to see anything around them

[shut hornet]

########## district is still something you can have fun speculating on though

and ##### imperial prison too i guess

[shut hornet]

well fruma is a mysterious place. outsiders know next to nothing about it

its not like Rodoroc is some crazy secret and therefore cant be mentioned earlier in the game

so yeah, we will be keeping it mysterious there, actually. thats just how it is in the world

the only change i can maybe see being made is the actual names being put behind the obfuscation so nosy players can figure out what it says with some tricks

[rotund gust]

eltom is also barely mentioned since it’s supposed to be a secret

[shut hornet]

same for the silent expanse

in the realm of light quests, there's a scene where you're given a sort of illustration of areas of the physical plane that are influenced by the realms. "silent expanse" is obfuscated, and in fact used to directly say silent expanse during beta

in aldorei secret part 2 there was a scene of the darkness portal opening after the realm of war portal, which was later cut since it spoiled the silent expanse a little

it's not just fruma we do this with, it's any area that isnt public knowledge in-universe or in the current context

[hybrid gazelle]

https://tenor.com/view/themercslaughing-gif-20727637

I will be real man Eltom is more secrets than SE ever is
Because for SE there will be like Mr. Jimmy who suddenly somehow know about SE for some reason and nevere xplain why

[shut hornet]

there is never a mr jimmy

[hybrid gazelle]

I am making joke

But in the game there like Dren and Aledar who just know about SE somehow and we never get proper explaination

they just know it

[shut hornet]

its kind of weird there because the quest sort of implies its known but sort of in a legendary way i think

[hybrid gazelle]

and there also Grookwart secrect implay they know of SE

[shut hornet]

like its rumored to exist or something. grookwarts knowing was just shoehorned in for fun because it was added in the same update

[rotund gust]

the AJB gang sure know a lot about the silent expanse for an area that’s been sealed for years

[hybrid gazelle]

then too bad becuase it exist in the game LOL

[shut hornet]

dont they have a map or something

[rotund gust]

like how did they learn about the seal on EO and just happen to know how to break it 😭

[hybrid gazelle]

Having a map for unknown area is defintiely something like sure LOL

[rotund gust]

yeah i think they say it was like an old mining map or something, but idk if they explains how they know about the EO seal

[shut hornet]

its crusty

[hybrid gazelle]

Even then map not make any sense because that imply they manage to explore SE to the extent of knowing the path but somehow still fuckin die to it

so like yeah whatever sure

[rotund gust]

i mean, the lutho citizens are all miners, it would make sense that a few escaped before the SE got sealed

[hybrid gazelle]

if SE a secrect then I am perfectly fine indivudal who is nice to people

[hybrid gazelle]

Nah man everyone for some reason mutually agree they should be bury in there fr fr

[rotund gust]

and maybe the silent expanse just wasn’t as badly “darkened” before the portals opened so they managed to explore up to EO

i don’t think we get a date for when the miners seal the expanse

the olm do it before the portals opened, then human miners go in and reseal it at some point

since at the very least the emerald mines are still relatively normal, and the eyeball forest was probably just a normal forest before the SE gets sealed

still doesn’t explain how they know about how to break the EO seal, but it explains how they know the general layout of the expanse and where lutho is

[rotund gust]

i mean then there’s fallen delivery which just drops the player into the expanse

it’s weird that there’s like three quests with expanse references from 70-80, and then like nothing until fantastic voyage

[hybrid gazelle]

That just refernece and build up which is like fine, it’s decent, it might be weird but it okay

Literally se got good build up in any other quest than ajb lmao

Which is actually sad

[chilly bluff]

that was rhetorical lol, i wasn’t trying to imply that it or other things should change but that after already knowing what the name is it makes less sense than the others to be hidden

[quartz mist]

for all of three seconds without telling them anything about it, but yeah

[rotund gust]

i guess, but it given how RoL 4 obfuscates silent expanse, and aldorei secret 2 had the dark portal removed, it’s weird how blatant fallen delivery is

[quartz mist]

well the other thing is that FD doesn't show anything important. iirc it dumps you at the start of the mine area or close to the very outskirts of the ruined city where you can't even really tell what's fucked up, just that it is, slightly

[rotund gust]

do you get the world discoveries for fallen delivery teleports? I know you do in lexdale witch trials when you get teleported around

[quartz mist]

(which is far better than the original version that i petitioned to change that DROPPED YOU PAST THE EO GATE)

[rotund gust]

😭

[solid lance]

What's going on with the "Acquiring Credentials" quest...? Why can't the player go back to Wynn to properly get a passport? (it is funny tho)

[vapid moon]

villagers

[warm flicker]

why cant we get our passport in detlas? Are humans too stupid to handle passport logistics?

[wispy bay]

It’s easier to go to the black market then deal with the wynn dmv (u need a drivers license to get a passport)

[exotic yew]

The miners probably know because they're in there but HOW does aledar know.

Also from what we have gathered so far the eyes is not always there

||It was after bob beat the living shite out of bak'al||

[exotic yew]

Villagers don't trust us. And since we're simply still alive thanks to them, they simply has almost all control on Wynn or something

[storm sage]

do u think u need a license in wynn to control a horse pulling a wagon around

[exotic yew]

Absolutely, infact you would get prosecuted and thrown into the portal if you did not get one

[wispy bay]

Yes

[rotund gust]

i mean, could’ve been before i guess. I don’t remember if we’re told bak’al was serving the dern beast before beating bob or not. I remember it saying he wasn’t but then i couldn’t figure out what the source was

also why did you spoiler it it’s the lore channel, everything’s a spoiler

[exotic yew]

it is in ultimate discover of SE iirc

[rotund gust]

i mean, all the ultimate discovery tells us is that bob placed the eye ontop of EO, not necessarily that it happened after bob beat him

“the forts of the humans still stand. you have failed” he could’ve said that at any point, not just after he got beaten once

[exotic yew]

well we have to established that bak'al has never lost to a human before

[rotund gust]

true, but the “you have failed” could just be the dern beast being annoyed that bak’al hasn’t fully subjugated the province yet, not mad about the loss of a fight

the forts of the humans still stand, (therefore) you have failed.

[dim plover]

Wait what

I thought it was Bak’al

[sage lagoon]

I just realized

Wynncraft is loosely implied to BE ULTRAKILL

SPOILERS FOR BOTH GAMES BELOW

||HEAR ME OUT

in the Corkus Lootrun, you can find a robot called the Cooling Unit

Y'know, it looks eerily similar to ULTRAKILL's Swordsmachine

• Both wield a shotgun and sword with reverse grip
• Both are yellow/black and follow the same general design
• Both have that weird tower head

What's funny is THAT'S NOT EVEN ALL

Another enemy in Wynncraft mimics an ULTRAKILL enemy
Namely, the Pure Principal, which mimics ULTRAKILL's Virtue

• Both look like Biblically Accurate Angels
• Both have the same attack, minus small differences (vertical beam that is summoned at the player's location)
• Both have similar behavior patterns
• Both originate from holy locations (the Realm of Light is Heaven right?!)
• While the Virtue is confirmed to have eyes until it goes to Hell, the lack of eyes on the Pure Principal could be because either
  A: they didn't want to rip the page directly from a religious source
  OR
  B: they couldn't figure out how to make that small of an eye idk lol
  Either way, I feel like this is more of a "they didn't want to it" thing than a "I need therapy" thing

Oh, you think that's all? How about an encore (heh)

Y'all know the Roots of Corruption right? that one place with the portal? Before the whole Corruption thing, it used to be a mining operation. Y'know, kinda like the ULTRAKILL PRELUDE AREA

• Both discovered the portal to a hellish area via mining
• Both were ravaged by war||

There ARE a few holes, sure and I'm likely missing a few big pieces but someone PLEASE get into this

uhh my sources besides my personal game experience with both is the wiki for both games

[crisp locust]

i usually support detailed analysis of lore and details but my fren have you considered that the bible is a fundamental text of western cannon

[molten mural]

theres also rare mobs spawning in lootruns which are ultrakill references

[hybrid gazelle]

I will be real with you man most of these lore came before Ultrakill popularize in mainstream and most mobs in 2.1 are referencet Ultrakill

[vapid moon]

some of it is that I think the quest wants to reflect the irl nightmare of travel as well as that there's a reoccurring theme of villagers being racist towards bumans

[hasty field]

thank god ct is just straight up ripping mobs from other games

god bless ultrakill

[hybrid gazelle]

ULTRACRAFT

[lean ether]

bro what

[rotund gust]

yeah mb i mistyped i meant bak’al

[rotund gust]

also the street cleaners in corkus world events

[daring cloak]

wait till you find out they added the sentry from ultrakill to wynncraft as well.

also maurice in sky lootrun.

i think a ct asked and wynn was given permission from hakita to add all these ultrakill enemies. i think the ones we dont have right now is mindflayer, soldier, er.. the little guys with no arms and the layer 7+ enemies

[dim plover]

Oh really lol I didn’t know that

[rotund gust]

Bob Prime fight when?

or aledar prime since his soul is fully separated from his body

[hybrid gazelle]

you mean fucking deleted?

like Aledar gone like he dead gone gone

[rotund gust]

i mean, we don’t know what happened to his soul. It just kinda poofed

could be like.. trapped in the gate or something

[hybrid gazelle]

I pretty sure some CT describe his soul as being consume

[rotund gust]

consumed by the flesh panopticon 👀

when you beat the eye instead of the pupil gouging out aledar prime rips his way out like sisyphus

https://tenor.com/view/sisyphus-sisyphus-prime-ultrakill-ultrakill-sisyphus-prime-ultrakill-sisyphus-gif-14524267149125505654

[sage lagoon]

Hear me out

[rotund gust]

yeah but he kinda sucks

update him to just be the minos prime fight fr. No weird swords or different phases just ultrakill

[sage lagoon]

Wait
After more thinking
Bob Prime ISN’T possible

Simply put, greater and supreme angels have humanoid forms while lessers like virtues and that flower looking guy from fraud don’t

Moreover, we know most angels WERE people before the whole “mankind is dead” thing as seen in their terminal entry for virtues

Hear me out

Bob is a greater/supreme angel

[hybrid gazelle]

Whole point of prime soul is literally that they are strong soul empower by sheer will power

Bob would be a prime soul

well actually that also depend if he commited sin in the eyes of gods which is like depend

consider god is ultrakill literally range from punishing his subordinate for questioning him and then decide to leave everything because apperantly he did not take account that the thing he create which he given free wills

doing the free wils thing

[sage lagoon]

yea BUT
They have to die a second time

Neither prime souls just spontaneously became prime souls

Bob dying in reincarnation might be possible but also why would he just have his seal of approval on him

[hybrid gazelle]

Bob reincarnation is not even a real bob but IDFK bob lore is outdated as hell

as of rn dont take reincarnation for granted, this shit is like old

like this is same quest that think Bob is reasonable guy for sending his animals friends to fuck off nowhere and have them to be kill by random strangers???

literally most bob lore outdated as hell like the guy got like 2 tombs near location

Ragni does not even have tomb for Bob like the people just think "oh yeah this RANDOM ASS tombs made by SOMEONE in middle of nowhere is neough for their great hero

and Damn Nilrem really need to come up with better believable story because like a guy taking out annie being kiled by wolves definitely is something

[rotund gust]

the reincarnation isn’t necessarily proof that he died the first time. It only manifests after we gather the power of the 3 animals, and it does so in a fake tomb. If anything it’s a reincarnation of the fraction of his power he left in his animals, not of him

bobs reincarnation is not soloing anni

[hybrid gazelle]

Waiting for Bob quest to get remake someday

[rotund gust]

honestly, bobs reincarnation is probably just a trial set up by nilrem for the next hero if anything

considered the sealed letter tells nilrem to continue training the forces of good and bob reminds him about the 3 animals

[arctic badger]

I love loring

[rotund gust]

lorin it up in here

[hybrid gazelle]

forgot to release this art of the character in the remake Shattered minds

[bold stag]

https://tenor.com/view/jon-arbuckle-nermal-trash-can-the-garfield-show-gif-9365086984229579073

[rotund gust]

ultrawynn

[vestal rivet]

"There’s a new voice in your head. An echo, a scratch at the back of your brain, bursting with all the memories of a life you’ve never led and the desires of a will you do not hold and the fears of a mind that is not yours. Won’t you let it out? After all, two hearts beat stronger than one."
-the new Transplanted Psyche lore entry
is it just me or does this helmet now turn you into kris deltarune

[dim plover]

“You’re suddenly filled with the muscle memory of a battle you’ve never had”

[steel geyser]

The whole theory of wynn being ultrakill gets thrown out of the window when you realise, most of the models and how they look/their mob AI can be interpreted as having taking inspiration from other games, sometimes even parodying them. There is quite literally a DOOM cave (from the DOOM franchise), Harry Potter (Order of the Grook), also there is a post of salted talking about how most stuff is inspired by other games https://forums.wynncraft.com/threads/the-wynnic-archives-a-comprehensive-history-of-wynncraft.269539/#post-3244055

Most of the older skin models were taken from WoW. Its no secret that wynn takes inspiration from other games, and some of the mobs’ models reflect that, I’m sure some stuff was taken from Ultrakill

[eternal helm]

What would’ve somehow happened if you fked up time travel in the fate of the fallen quest

[hybrid gazelle]

You can’t I think it been explicitly state that what you can’t change the past

[eternal helm]

exactly- if u fked it up and changed smtn

(Like broke the rules etc on how it worked)

[hybrid gazelle]

I mean you literally cant but sure

[hasty spoke]

Wait how did you get tasim there

[rotund gust]

wdym that’s where tasim normally is

[lone urchin]

Where is that?

[eternal helm]

I fucked up the timeline 🤭

[hasty spoke]

It’s like stubbing your toe, it just happens and it’s really annoying for 5 minutes

I showed the ancients calculus last week

[rotund gust]

portal to dern behind EO

[wispy bay]

There are a few quests where npcs will blindly follow you to the ends of the earth

[hasty spoke]

I do remember soon after 2.0 aladar and tasim just followed me

Like both into mt Wynn

[eternal helm]

You see I kicked a stone a little too far in the fate of the fallen quest, and I messed up time traveling so what I did actually altered the timeline. So that stone then squashed a birds nest :( that stopped those baby birds from growing up, down the line this made it so this bird wouldn’t attack and scare away another bird when Tasim was thinking of going to Gavel so instead that bird shit on him the second he thought that changing his mind, he then met elphalba with Aledar but since warriors are superior Tasim was able to get them to the Outlook and sacrifice Aledar in the same scenario we faced and defeat the eye, then Tasim went on to do AHC to fight the player and Aledar and go to Dern. The end.

[hasty spoke]

I missed the stone and kicked theorick.

[rotund gust]

i forget is fate of the fallen a interactable vision of the past or actually the past. And is it like “the time travel always happened, so the player always appeared in the past” time travel, or “the original events happened without the player” time travel

cause it kinda fits that loki series apocalypse logic. Whether the soldier/player existed in the past or not, nesaak still freezes over and most of the population dies. so “original events happened without the player” even matter since them going to the past wouldn’t change anything

apart from stopping theorick from going into the portal or killing him AHC style, would anything the player does to try butterfly effecting current nesaak actually matter?

[solar ingot]

i wonder if we will get more tasim interactions on gavel

cuz.. lets be honest, aledar and tasim practically vanish from the game after recover the past

when i did AJB for the first time I didn't realize that aledar was the same guy from the tutorial until olinus pointed that out in his quest guide xD

[rotund gust]

aledar shows up in that one desert quest

the mercenary

but yeah tasim needs something in gavel. imo it should introduce lucio too, since elphaba has reclaiming the house

[solar ingot]

dude i completely forgot about lucio

give lucio some lore

like, we literally don't know absolutely everything about him

the silent expanse squad: you, elphaba, aledar and who?

[rotund gust]

put them in like a hidden city remake or make a level 82 quest for them that fills the lack of quest at that level

[solar ingot]

we don't even know where is he from

[rotund gust]

he shows up, blows up a wall, fixes the wall, blows up a wall and fails to fight a wither, leaves with elphaba, blows up a wall, finds a miner and dies

he likes blowing stuff up and he has a bit of an ego, that’s all we really know about him. and he apparently already knew aledar and elphaba

we need something introducing him prior so that all 3 of the deaths actually matter a bit. elphaba has atleast one quest, aledar has a few and lucio has nothing

put tasim and lucio together in a quest or something

then we can give tasim double the trauma when we reveal both him and aledar are dead

[eternal helm]

Tbh I kinda like ditching them.. don’t get me wrong, I like them but I feel like going out separate ways and reconnecting later in the game feels kind of special

Lucio I think it would be cool if we hear about him from someone but not actually meet him until AJB

[rotund gust]

true, and i guess tasim reappears in festivals. it’s just weird that we’re told tasim went to gavel, and then when we go to gavel we see no evidence of him

[rotund gust]

he would work well as a name drop somewhere yeah. with as impulsive and destructive as he seems people would know of him

name dropping either in like ahmsord or cinfras could work, considering the “hero” green name npc’s walking around ahmsord and the guild hall in cinfras

[eternal helm]

I mean it was said that you don’t alter the past or smtn so I think it’s just a vision of the past you an interact with and not change but you did it to get whatever info etc

[rotund gust]

gotcha

what would be funny is if lucio was in the crowd during hero of gavel and really wanted to meet siegfried

[eternal helm]

I think it would be cool maybe to hear about him from a few NPC’s like he’s speeding through gavel while you’re there to keep the player motivated to try to keep up with his adventures

[rotund gust]

idk i like the idea of lucio in sky islands though, mostly because i mentally link him to it because of legends crossing by corpe

[eternal helm]

i mean Lucio is kinda stuck up no?

Have him be one of the people who get into the ToL and brag and be a little bragging shit abt it

[rotund gust]

idk about stuck up, but he definitely has an ego considering he kinda just blows shit up thinking their strong enough to deal with stuff no matter what

[rotund gust]

ok that’s funny

i think either tasim or lucio would fit well in eltom though, considering their humans

and eltom doesn’t really have anything in it since the unlock quest for it is shared with thesead

[eternal helm]

Actually have Lucio be friends or smtn with Kleight so he’s like the special rich child to get into ToL for free and he can’t stop being a twat about it 👍

[rotund gust]

i think having 1 person we’re not attached to in a journey beyond works, but if it ever gets the rewrite it kinda needs, it would be funny for all 3 to go “who do we know that’s strong with no connections or social life” and they all think of the same person

[eternal helm]

☠️

I mean… “no social life..” they all thought of u but that means you all know them…

[rotund gust]

true. but aledar says that we were a perfect sacrifice cause we had “no relations, no loved ones, and no way to deny our fate”

literally “no friends, your alone and no one would miss you”

aledar fr says

my gif didn’t send man

[eternal helm]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1021980069452853268/1301388654039535656/anymorph.gif

[rotund gust]

i’m getting filtered nooo

https://tenor.com/view/no-maidens-gif-27260529

had to send the censored version

[rotund gust]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262010576295821312/1249160511325470730/wife.gif

everyone the player becomes friends with outside of corkus dies

[eternal helm]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1176753219683242055/1272340816102162535/thecanonsus.gif

[rotund gust]

axelus and lari both die, elphaba and aledar

[eternal helm]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1279708564222382153/1281528925604020295/TCC_i_said_watch_yo_tone.gif

[rotund gust]

well lari may not be dead but it’s possible

[eternal helm]

Lari didn’t die…?

yea

[rotund gust]

I mean she might’ve. Or she’s just in darkness jail with bob

[eternal helm]

Probably this imo- they can’t just kill off lari like that

[rotund gust]

meanwhile all the people we meet in corkus are completely fine

maxie, ava, rhay we don’t meet in corkus but i think he counts

gurix gets blackbagged and probably killed but it’s fine, we never actually see him in corkus

corkus npc’s have the lowest mortality/disappeared indefinitely rate

[eternal helm]

I forgot he was a Corkian

[drifting aurora]

it's an interactable version of the past that isnt actually... real. it's a glimpse at the past where you can mess with things that doesn't actually affect the timeline

[drifting aurora]

there will be tasim quests in gavel yeah. there just hasnt been time to work on them

[drifting aurora]

lucio to me is a character who is vastly unprepared to deal with the horrors of the silent expanse. he's the kind of guy who hasn't really faced any real danger before, so he goes through life with a more carefree attitude, up until he very suddenly can not do that anymore. and i think AJB currently doesnt do a good job of showing this, but he does adapt when he enters SE and gets more serious. it just isn't enough to save him

[hybrid gazelle]

Tbh I still like don’t see him as candidate for like expendition team

Like if they did not expect entire ass expanse when they enter tbe mine then sure but like yeah still not getting Lucio character

Like from what I read from that so far feel like Aledar just pick the worst person possible to explore this uncharted expanse

Which put his character into question

[eternal helm]

My main question is what map was Aledar reading to know his way through the expanse

[hybrid gazelle]

I have 0 idea

[eternal helm]

He also mentioned like- “these spikes weren’t here, they’re new we can break through them!” (How tf do you know this???)

[hybrid gazelle]

Add onto this like surely thetr is like 5000+ individual out there that more suited for the job than Lucio

[rotund gust]

yeah, i just wish we saw more of that “carefree attitude” half. As it stands we see him blow up a few walls without thinking before he switches up and dies quickly after elphaba

[eternal helm]

AHHH MY LIVER IT TOOK MY LIVER

[hybrid gazelle]

This make the quest even worse because somehow they die to environment yhat they somewhat familiar to somewhat

[rotund gust]

it would be funny with lucio was the original candidate for the sacrifice before we come along. Lucio saying “we have our fourth let’s go” makes that impossible though since he knew they needed a 4th

[hybrid gazelle]

Even then Lucio is like better candidate sacrifice than us because not only we have feat and record

Lucio overall just burden the longer you have him

Like he is undisciplined for these kind of operation

[rotund gust]

i mean lucio is clearly powerful though. just not as battle hardened as the others

trashie if you make journey beyond rewrite art like your doing for RoL you should make lucio’s explosions fireworks, i think it would be cool

[hybrid gazelle]

No

[rotund gust]

aw

still, some more exposure to lucio would be good, even if it’s just further highlights his cockiness

[rotund gust]

that scene is so so bad with shift dialogue 😭

all of AJB is, but especially that

[eternal helm]

I hate how they talk and stop then keep walking

Like… can they just pace themselves with the dialogue or slow down if you’re taking ages to read it?

[eternal helm]

Iirc he says “we have our spare” ☠️

[rotund gust]

i feel like we’ve been over this topic before in this channel. the shift dialogue removes all of the cool factor of walking into the expanse alongside the other 3, elphabas death, and the start where you walk with aledar and the gang to the mine and lucio opens it for the first time

[rotund gust]

bros not even trying to hide it

[eternal helm]

You can still have shift dialogue and have it work

[eternal helm]

Like they could be pacing themselves with the dialogue and if you wait longer to press shift they start slowing down until you finish reading

[rotund gust]

eh, i dunno i think it’s just one of the handful of scenes that just can’t work with shift dialogue. Even if they start slowing down, then even without walk speed bonus the player will outpace them

it would be cool get like an afelis style side-quest with lucio, just as a white name npc who appears in various locations around gavel & maybe corkus

since that wouldn’t require a lot of effort compared to a full quest with him, and it mains his role as more or less unaffiliated with the player

[eternal helm]

Out pacing them is fine imo

Just the abrupt stops and inhuman moment is odd, if you walk faster you can wait for them- but when they speed ahead then stop instantly to say “whoah look at this place” then sprint again is stupid

[rotund gust]

i still don’t know what to call the afelis events. mini-quest is already taken and it doesn’t really fit thematically with the mysteries

side-quest kinda fits?

[limber swan]

lmao that dialogue

you can tell silent expanse was made in old era by that

[rotund gust]

peak wynn writing

[eternal helm]

Make them mini quests but call the current mini quests “Gathering Posts”… it’s what they are

Even for the combat ones… ur gathering items

[rotund gust]

i guess afelis kinda fits with the world encounters like bane of the great bridge and the less significant ones like cannible ambush and the unified gnome (which i’ve never been able to trigger but wiki says exists)

[limber swan]

what a shitty thing for aledar to say

[rotund gust]

but afelis is the only multi step ones

[eternal helm]

What tf even is the great bridge

[rotund gust]

the best piece of content in modern wynn

[eternal helm]

Just some olmic structure? (Also why do we have chat cooldown here this is bs)

[rotund gust]

oh you mean the location

[eternal helm]

No ik what it is but like how does it place in the lore

[rotund gust]

cause when the channel opened it was filled with uh… interesting spam

[eternal helm]

what…

[rotund gust]

lots of ava and lari stuff

the lari asexual discussion

[hybrid gazelle]

It literally not because of that wtf you mean

[rotund gust]

i thought it was

[hybrid gazelle]

It just to deter troll and that it

[rotund gust]

yeah that’s what i mean. the start of the channel was filled with trolling related to lari and ava “lore”

and then when the big debate about lari asexual came up it helped cause people kept coming and trolling

[eternal helm]

Can we get a special Wynn lore lover role where u have to take a lore test to get no cooldown in this channel :3

[hushed comet]

i wonder why

[rotund gust]

mmm

[eternal helm]

I mean if I was lari I woulda fallen for dulla..

[hushed comet]

funny how that bag of worms came back up again with the festival of bonfire gif in #📫noticeboard

[rotund gust]

mmmm we don’t talk about that gif

[hushed comet]

fwiw it was a bad idea then and emotes already being abused for degenerate purposes

but thats a tangent

[rotund gust]

really?

[hushed comet]

yeah bro u should have seen day 1 detlas

[eternal helm]

Doesn’t surprise me

[rotund gust]

i try to avoid detlas

[hushed comet]

detlas is sodom and cinfras is gomorrah

[rotund gust]

public chat in detlas is never good, i stay away when i can

[hushed comet]

actually no thats llevigar probably cinfras doesnt have much going on daily icl

[eternal helm]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1240662452652347452/1295377522011406439/59ea81992809a7b5.gif

[rotund gust]

no one does anything in llevigar. Lutho is gomorrah

[hushed comet]

oh yeah how could i miss that

[rotund gust]

or ragni? since ragni is filled with new players asking what to do

[eternal helm]

btw actual fruma lore question- do we know what causes memory loss etc/brainwashing

[hybrid gazelle]

Play recover the past again

[hushed comet]

explained in the recover the past quest (beat me to it)

[rotund gust]

cinfras is probably the most dead of the “capital cities”. Corkuscity atleast has some endgame stuff cause of the lootrun camp so people are there. Deltas is the festival hub. Cinfras is just kinda there

[hybrid gazelle]

Thetr is brainwash procedure and border automatically wiping people memory

[eternal helm]

I mean the actual cause.. who made it, why do people lose their minds (Corkians) just by leaving the premises of fruma??

[rotund gust]

i guess forgery is nearby? but forgery sucks nowadays and it has its own TP scroll anyway

[hybrid gazelle]

Because border also habe similar effect although it more generally and does not really direct as procedure done by inquisitor

[rotund gust]

but corkus city is also the only real “city” gameplay wise in corkus. Relos has nothing in it and the avos territory is just quest space

[hybrid gazelle]

And as for who make it

Idk lol

[rotund gust]

relos has the secret and it’s kinda it

Mixed feelings should take place in relos tbh.

[hushed comet]

i remember relos because it has that one accessory merchant that sold microchip so i could make a budget arcanist build

[rotund gust]

give it something

[eternal helm]

Tbh my idea is Sohso made it,,, he was the only scientist who kept his sanity as far as we know… why tf would he go to fruma of all places … also he went there recently and Wynn started requesting soldiers recently

Smart scientist…? Memory loss?

[rotund gust]

relos is like if efilim didn’t have the quests in it and even fewer merchants

[hushed comet]

towns become memorable when you're a budget build connoisseur like me

ornamental plate 🔥 garland 🔥 rask 🔥 fanatic 🔥

[rotund gust]

relos and lusuco are the only cities without quests if i remember correctly. And even then lusuco has ToA right there

[hushed comet]

diminished 🔥

[rotund gust]

is relos even a viable respawn point, i don’t think i’ve ever died close enough to it to not just respawn in corkus city

[hushed comet]

ok diminished sucks ass im trolling

[eternal helm]

Also do we have any reports of Grian still working on the lore,,

[hushed comet]

allegedly

[rotund gust]

wouldn’t be surprised if he’s just still around in like an advisory capacity instead of being a writer himself

[eternal helm]

I miss the days of grians Wynn videos,, they were made rly well lol

[hybrid gazelle]

He probably morr into building

[eternal helm]

Tbh I don’t expect him to promote the Fruma trailer whenever that happens

[hushed comet]

not intimately involved anymore in years definitely but he looks into things still i've heard

[rotund gust]

yall remember the tommyinnit wynn video 💀

ragni and detlas were wild the next couple days

[eternal helm]

Which sucks bc I miss the 5 days after a Grian promo when ragni is like an Annie lobby

[hushed comet]

i would be surprised if any tommyinnit watchers became longstanding active players

[rotund gust]

most of them are children with 0 attention span. I’d imagine most didn’t make it past rymek

[eternal helm]

Watching Grians Questing In Minecraft video and the hermitcraft video with the Silent Expanse trailer promo got me to play Wynn

[rotund gust]

if almuj

i don’t remember why i started playing wynn. Since when i first joined it was because that was the first time i had a laptop and actually could i knew about it a lot longer

[hushed comet]

i think wynn is extremely easy in practice but its also pretty punishing if you make abysmally bad choices like using ur ability tree for triple archetype spaghetti

quite less handholding to my knowledge which isnt bad but definitely something that gatekept noobs

[rotund gust]

idk i think the start is just a weird mixture of super holdy while also bombardment of choices

[hushed comet]

pretty much puts off the game for a sizeable amount of the mainstream minecraft crowd

[rotund gust]

like you forced to open your quest book and track the first quest, but also you have tons of other options, and a lot goes unexplained. If you skip the first couple quests your locked out of a bunch of arachnid ascent questline

but it’s really easy to over level and skip them because of how many sources of xp are shoved in front of you at the start

[eternal helm]

This is the thing I hate tbh

it then sets the player in the mindset of “I don’t need to do quests”

proceeds to skip all the lore and doesn’t give a shit

Then the players who do care and do content find it too easy bc they’re lvl 35 doing lvl 18 content

[rotund gust]

yeah i don’t really like arachnid ascent be a questline. aledar and tasim being there is fine, but it’s so early and so easy to skip just one of the quests where the whole thing feels kinda pointless to do, especially now that dungeons don’t require their quests

[hushed comet]

yeah quest book does need to be worked on to probably just to show content per region by level than showing literally everything through some esoteric "recommended order" thing

[rotund gust]

i hate recommended being the default order. Make highest level available default

[eternal helm]

It should require the quest imo— at least one completion on your whole account

[rotund gust]

dungeons requiring atleast 1 quest completion per account would be good

[eternal helm]

I love entering SST without breaking the spell… ☠️

[rotund gust]

being able to skip them is a good QoL change on subsequent playthroughs, but kinda bad on the first

[rotund gust]

ice barrows without knowing who tf theorick is or breaking the seal on it either

[eternal helm]

literally

[rotund gust]

the bad part is i’ve seen that in pfinder parties

new people don’t know who the hell any of the characters are cause they skip the quests and go straight to either dungeons or grind spots

[eternal helm]

We need a corrupted version of each quest to unlock the forgery counterpart /s

[rotund gust]

no but a quest to unlock forgery as a whole wouldn’t be bad

[hushed comet]

i dont like questlocking as much as the other guy but if dungeons would be to be hypothetically reworked to not be so archaic then i would force relevant quests to be completed

[rotund gust]

level 64 or 65 since 65 is minimum level to enter CDS

[eternal helm]

the game should be mostly skippable if the player wants, but I hate how Wynn rn feels like it’s pushing that idea rather than taking ur time

[rotund gust]

yeah we already have grind spots if you want to skip content (the scrapyard, mt. wynn spiders and flesh cave in question)

[hushed comet]

maybe complete the dungeon itself in order to finish said quests as well so it feels like a milestone

obviously should be perma unlocked after finishing once like raids tho

[rotund gust]

early game, like really early game ragni and road to detlas, feel like their trying to shove as much content at new players as possible to get them hooked, but accidentally makes a lot of stuff seem very skippable or not worth doing

when just grinding the mobs spawning around the emerald trail is faster for leveling up than doing the copious amounts of caves, quests and secrets, why bother. new people aren’t invested yet the only goal is “level up”

[hushed comet]

quests should also be also seperated into more subcategories of content rather than just between green storylines and the rest

like what unlocks major mechanics e.g. skill resetting

[rotund gust]

and decrepit sewers being right there and incentivizing multiple run throughs to the get items does nothing to help that problem

[eternal helm]

Add regional areas too and maybe dungeon quests etc

like “Wynn plains content” “desert content” etc. like secret discoveries

[rotund gust]

wynn early game is really really fast, and doesn’t really accurately reflect the slower pace of the rest of the game (unless your doing grind parties but that’s going out of your way to skip content)

[rotund gust]

it doesn’t help that most of the storyline quests have fairly noticeable flaws compared to the standalone quests

[eternal helm]

What flaws 😭

[hushed comet]

realm of light:

[rotund gust]

Lemme go down the list gimme a sec

[hushed comet]

a journey beyond/further:

[rotund gust]

Iron Heart’s moral being entirely contrary to RoL 2

[hushed comet]

dwarves and doguns i consider the best storyline but it's still pretty dumb with garaheth and how quickly the conflict is resolved

[rotund gust]

envoy and feathers fly are alright, although envoy could use some modernizing

[hushed comet]

nah fuck feathers fly bro that shit was so ahh 😭

[rotund gust]

d&d is just the racism questline

[rotund gust]

feathers fly is good the first time but the 3rd or 4th time i get tired of the tree growing minigame

[hushed comet]

hated it when i did it the first time

[rotund gust]

wynn excavation being the most outdated content imaginable

the orc questline is fine i guess; but them only humanizing the orcs in the last quest is an uh… interesting choice

[hushed comet]

i keep forgetting that wynnex is a storyline

like i know its a series of quests but that it's marked green like that

goes to show how much of a nothingburger it is

[rotund gust]

hunger of the gerts is

[hushed comet]

this as well i completely forgot but the twist is so incredibly lame anyway

[rotund gust]

frat bro gylia watch :/ bring back the battery farm atleast there was a moral to that

[hushed comet]

orcs not actually dumb wow so novel when literally every other fantasy setting has done it and to more developed effect

warhammer and dungeons and dragons off the top of my head

[rotund gust]

the problem is that all of the previous quests set up orcs being dumb and evil. It’s only really the last quest where they try to give it nuance

too little too late

[hushed comet]

just have it be the first quest lmao

and develop lore and culture and whatever from there

[rotund gust]

eh first quest is fine since like, we’re working for the villagers and what not, But reclaiming the house we sneak into the orc controlled base and everything

blazing retribution could atleast use some hints toward it though. As it stands Poxper just steals the magic axe and technically doesn’t break ceasefire. Doesn’t even tell us why

[hushed comet]

i think it could be interesting if they explained orcs were magically attuned initially through ancestors but then just forgotten it over time

that would explain blazing retribution better but that questline as a whole should be reworked tbh

[hushed comet]

yeah in like a rewrite or something

this would require orcs to have lore though which they dont 😂

[rotund gust]

Clearing the Camps and All roads lead to peace are fine. But reclaiming the house and blazing retribution could use some changes to help lead into all roads lead to peace

[rotund gust]

even the gerts have lore, we barely know about orcs trolls or goblins

the gerts being cosmic magic afflicted villagers is kinda cool

but it doesn’t actually play into hunger of the gerts at all

[quartz mist]

woulda liked to do more

[hushed comet]

dont ask trashie what they think on this

i also think that twist is kinda stupid as well though imo

for the exact same reason of not relating to anything at all

except to be shocking??? i think??? because they eat villagers???

[hushed comet]

what would you have done differently if i may ask

[quartz mist]

basically what you said- doing more with blazing retribution/the house

[rotund gust]

i think i can guess based on other trashie takes

3 quests of orcs being evil, and then 1 quest where were the bad guys for killing then for being evil (actually it was justified but were only finding out now)

[hushed comet]

i still stand that the subversion should be the first quest

which means entire questline rework /shrug

[rotund gust]

no the first quest is good for set up of us thinking their evil

[hushed comet]

well yeah you can have that during the first

[rotund gust]

and subverting it right off the bat kinda makes the other 3 quests redundant

[hushed comet]

im gonna be for real with you anyone could see the initial trope by a mile away

[quartz mist]

I really hate how much i was trying to emphasize my orc culture stuff, how they werent idiots and wouldnt fall for stupid caveman BS, and then the maker of reclaiming the house goes "hmmmm caveman cannon? trick orc by walking into mud bath and having them smell you instead of using your eyes? blind orcs on rope watching duty?? very good ideas!!"

[hushed comet]

because its been done to death so many times before

[rotund gust]

i mean yeah, but just because it’s a well used trope doesn’t mean it can be skimmed over

[quartz mist]

gonna be honest idk if I just havent looked at other media much but I hardly ever have seen orcs portrayed as good

[rotund gust]

All roads leave to peace orcs and the orcs from the other three feel like entirely different species they act so different

[quartz mist]

ik the trope of "classically evil species is actually good" but I dont see it applied to orcs much at all

[rotund gust]

the orcs from the first three may as well be replaced with gerts and there’s no change

[hushed comet]

not either but more about how its often subverted that orcs are meant to be the dumb race

[quartz mist]

that too. I havent seen that either.

[hushed comet]

or "dumb" as we typically think

[quartz mist]

but yeah I wanted to more radically change up blazing retribution and ramp up orc culture like I did when remaking all the orc mobs to have roles and unique camps and stuff like that but time restraints meant little was able to be done, and reclaiming the house took a baseball bat to the concept's skull

[rotund gust]

I think clearing the camps is good set up. We go and kill the 3 orc chiefs, very little talking and just doing military stuff. But blazing retribution should start the subversion or atleast get us thinking about “hey wait the orcs have a reason for doing this/maybe they aren’t so stupid” then reclaiming the house doubles down and like “wait maybe the orcs aren’t generic evil fantasy monster” , and it culminates in all roads lead to peace

[quartz mist]

got it in one

[rotund gust]

and i don’t remember any of the llevigar plains secrets well enough to know if they contribute to the storyline or not

[quartz mist]

I also wanted to add a bunch of post-quest stuff to ARTP to further elaborate on stuff, but that was always gonna be low overall priority no matter how much id like to do it

[rotund gust]

Yeah, as far as questlines go it’s far from the worst. It doesn’t need changes

[hushed comet]

again i can look to warhammer ig where orcs do exhibit these features at surface glance such as the memes with "moar dakka" and orkspeak but they are pretty much born with very high technological proficiency afaik

[quartz mist]

just generally bigger/more important stuff to work on

[hushed comet]

note that im not well versed in that lore just going by what ive heard from really

[rotund gust]

it’s a functional quest line and really skipable considering how wide the level range for it is and how little the rewards are. and it’s only relevant to one region

so like, not really top priority to make perfect like RoL or Wynn excavation

[hushed comet]

also orcs in tolkien's work which dont exhibit much "dumb" features if not at all so basically estimated to have as much intelligence as the other humanoid races barring select ones

[quartz mist]

idk much warhammer either but iirc the orks are only proficient in tech because they're strong psychics, and so because they believe stuff like "da red wunz go fasta" and "you never seen a purple ship" the red ones go faster and their bright purple ships are stealthy

[hushed comet]

not exactly an active subversion ig but could chalk that up to basically being the progenitor

[rotund gust]

i mean the base orcs are kinda stupid, or atleast simple minded. But the uruk-hai are intelligent

[quartz mist]

you give them a metal tube and convince them it's a minigun and theyll get it to hail bullets, and then you can put it in the hands of any other race and itll just be a useless metal tube

[rotund gust]

but that’s more a result of them being specifically bred for war, not really a “race” thing more of a “these orcs specifically”

[quartz mist]

from what i understand, anyway

[rotund gust]

as far as i’m aware yeah. I know nothing about warhammer but a bunch of my friends are really into it and keep info dumping

i know the orcs are psychic mushrooms or something

and also very into war

[quartz mist]

either way the orc questline kinda came out half-baked from a combo of not being able to do the adjustments i wanted to BR out of time/workload constraints, since the quest itself is and was perfectly functional, and HERE COMES RECLAIMING THE HOUSE WITH A STEEL CHAIR

[rotund gust]

elphabas death in AJB becomes less sad after doing a roads lead to peace because of reclaiming the house

[hushed comet]

i felt nothing in those quests

except for the final aledar sequence that was so bad it's funny

that i made a constructive feedback shitpost over it

[quartz mist]

ARTP was the only one that i was fully able to do what i wanted with it

[rotund gust]

the player is supposed to feel guilty for committing a few murders of orcs while not knowing the whole story. Elphabas part of the gavel military she’s been doing it a lot longer and probably had a lot more exposure to orc society 💀

[exotic bough]

goofy writing and the fact that aledar is not seen for the next 70 levels

[rotund gust]

https://tenor.com/view/flash-ssktjl-suicide-squad-kill-the-justice-league-barry-allen-gif-13406982454509934816

aledar death reminds me of flash in kill the justice league^

the “you have to kill us diana :(“

meanwhile the suicide squad is just standing there awkwardly like “yeah we were planning to do that anyway”

that’s how the player listening to aledar tell us to kill him feels

[hushed comet]

i mean we know that they have to add more presence for aledar throughout the game but the dialogue is so atrociously written to convey the most unsympathetic "selfless" sacrifice monologue ever

[rotund gust]

“selfless sacrifice” after planning to sacrifice us for the entire first half of a journey beyond

[quartz mist]

lorewise, anyway. still grudging over the boar section not being done how i wanted

[rotund gust]

what did you want for it

[quartz mist]

the plan was for many things to be in the bushes, and youd have to listen closely to the sounds coming out of each one, instead of it being a cup and ball game

[exotic bough]

that sounds pretty nifty ngl

like have chances to fight some other mobs or perhaps get some crafting ingredients

[quartz mist]

if you clicked the wrong one a few thing could happen, like a mob would pop out- one of the local area mobs, or another orc on the hunt would dope-slap you for interrupting

[hushed comet]

if they ever get around to touching silent expanse again please nuke the a journey beyond/further quests they are actively detrimental to the hype towards endgame

and replace it with an actual storyline that unlocks tna ig as the climax

[exotic bough]

was it not implemented due to technical limitations at the time (which might still exist?) or time constraints

[quartz mist]

the person i asked to do it interpreted the instructions almost completely incorrectly and refused to redo it when i checked in

[exotic bough]

ah

[quartz mist]

hence why im grudging about it

[rotund gust]

i mean EO is really the only thing that fits as the final unlock. consider the eye is kinda the central imagery for all of wynn

[hushed comet]

yeah but i kinda think ahc is meant to be the pinnacle quest before fruma

[rotund gust]

true

[exotic bough]

thing with tna though is that the only lore about it exists within the raid which makes it feel neglected and the rest of the se aged

[quartz mist]

also grudging about reclaiming the house being the way it is even after i said "if youre working on an orc quest heres a bunch of cultural/character guidelines, please follow them and ask me if you have questions" and even after i stated my gripes

[exotic bough]

so it either needs its own quest or play a major role in ajf

[rotund gust]

i mean. there’s like two secrets related to darkness conquering the void

they don’t mention greg but like… that’s lore for tna i guess, if unintentionally

[exotic bough]

yeah but tna is likely exclusively how void holes helped dern do it iirc

[quartz mist]

and nothing about it would be like it is if even a single guideline were followed

[hushed comet]

also idk if the eye shows up anywhere before apart from fantastic journey but i dont feel like it has as much presence as i think they were trying to go for

[exotic bough]

a passing mention in wynnex c as "the dark's gaze"

[rotund gust]

Its image is all over wynn excavations it’s on the ground in detlas, it shows up in the light forest ult

once you start looking for it it shows up a lot

[exotic bough]

idk if the one in the middle of detlas is meant to be the eye but i can see how some people interpret it as that

[rotund gust]

and it’s in the background of the logo

[rotund gust]

pretty sure it is

[exotic bough]

cuz if the detlas floor pattern was meant to be the eye that implies whoever constructed detlas knew of the eye in some way

[rotund gust]

the problem is that the eye has lost relevance since the silent expanse update, especially since 2.0 when raids overshadowed it

[hushed comet]

hence i would prefer storyline akin to the other raid unlocking storylines for tna first introducing silent expanse in place of ajf/b

but yeah do once and unlock like the breaking point

[rotund gust]

AJF showing greg in the background or having an encounter with it either in or replacing the weird void slime parkour section would be good set up

[hushed comet]

this time greg kills aledar 😱 and theres your raid setup

[rotund gust]

lmao

[exotic bough]

he is killed by john nameless to become the new nameless

[rotund gust]

idk i think at some point integrating greg into the journey questline might remove the main point behind it. (Imo TNA entrance should be in the void with a fast travel to in void valley because of just how tacked on tna feels to the expanse)

the raid takes place in the void, it’s more relates more to the void and dern than to the silent expanse itself, and it feel like it was just kinda dropped into the SE (because it was)

or atleast have an entrance to the raid from the void to connect the two (i will not stop begging for a fast travel between void and void valley its so perfect and convenient pleaseeeee)

[hushed comet]

i guess the quests are supposed to be horror i think but like i'd prefer if it was built up more over time

[rotund gust]

the silent expanse is supposed to build up the the eye. greg is just kinda tacked onto the side both narratively and physically

[hushed comet]

because lucio and elphaba are not it 💀

[rotund gust]

Give a journey beyond and further like… hollow serenity levels of horror, it’s the only quest i think does horror semi-well

[hushed comet]

i still think it should be more than 2 quests icl but yea

[rotund gust]

despite not really having all that gory or scary of a villain

[hushed comet]

when the psychological horror is insanity 🤯

[rotund gust]

ong. A journey beyond, a journey further, a journey’s destination

Part one just straight up ends when aledar gets eaten. And your left to fend for yourself. You can get into lutho but no further. Part two unlocks TNA and reunites the player with aledar you can get to the barrier blocking EO but no further (remove the alt route there) part 3 unlocks EO

[hushed comet]

and also slightly more people than just lucio (no name af 😂 replace with linton or something) and elphaba

[rotund gust]

lucio just needs more going on there’s legit no reason to care about his death

[hushed comet]

bro he's an original character to that quest

[rotund gust]

i mean elphaba was too, reclaiming the house was added later

[hushed comet]

shows up virtually nowhere else afaik like he just there 😂

[rotund gust]

which makes the liver scene kinda funnier

[hushed comet]

but yeah more people to drive insane and perhaps kill eachother

and that would make silent expanse pretty dangerous and spoopy methinks...

[hushed comet]

icl that whole sacrifice sequence has got to go

so i would think eo before tna

[rotund gust]

no, i think EO still serves as a good conclusion, considering the whole point of them leaving was to kill the eye in the first place

[hushed comet]

but im all for eye having more of a direct presence in the questline than background

[rotund gust]

the journey beyond gang has no reason to know about or go after greg. they know about EO and Lutho from like.. a mixture of old mining maps and olmic ruins. Greg is presumably a more recent phenomenon

[hushed comet]

yeah but like you said tna is just there in the corner tacked in as "mysterious endgame content"

which is kinda a shame that its less relevant in presence

[rotund gust]

yeah. I think it make sense to integrate into a journey quest remake, but not make the end goal

like, either when aledar gets eaten and the player is all alone or during the void valley parkour the player learns about TNA

or more major changes like an expansion of it into more than 2 quests with one of them focusing on TNA, like how RoL 1 unlocks grootslang but nexus of light is the culmination of all 5 rol quests

Iirc the eye was like a prototype for the raid bosses anyway, so i still think it works as a climax of the whole quest line, but tna would as the climax of one of the parts of the questline

what i do hope gets a remake though is fallen factory. it’s boss is so anti climatic and all of the other “wait around and fight with the minions” dungeon bosses have been replaced in recent updates

old garoth, old redbeard, old charon

it is weird that you don’t need to beat FF for feathers fly or breaking point. Maxies like “oh yeah this is the solider who helped with the factory” meanwhile the player never went in so it’s still producing robots, now with a fully unlocked front entrance

[quartz mist]

yeah, I think FF ended up being cooler in concept than execution. I wanna keep the feeling of having to tear through the computer's innards piece by piece and getting into places you shouldnt be, but it's definitely very dated and the new conveyor is awful

[rotund gust]

it feels very much like steampunk apature. Honestly the dungeon itself is kinda fine (i haven’t done new conveyor been a while) but the boss is so nothing

[drifting aurora]

we call em character quests internally

[rotund gust]

then lemme rephrase, give lucio a character quest

[drifting aurora]

ive been asking for a while to sort quests you dont meet prereqs for in the same section as quests you have combat lv for a while

so you can see what quests would be available, and what quests you need to complete to access them

[drifting aurora]

i have vague plans for lucio already

[rotund gust]

yeah, i always forget shadow of the beast exists because it doesn’t show up as meeting the combat level since i don’t meet prof level

[rotund gust]

https://tenor.com/view/yes-yes-sir-yayy-kataman-gif-12260883688244422951

[limber swan]

what is the lore behind these beside what seaskipper says?

[quartz mist]

There isn't.

[dim plover]

They look like the crows’ nest of the top of ships

But like, gigantic versions

(Buried colossal ships theory???)

[potent sleet]

Well, Hollow Serenity sure is new isn't it

[shell maple]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/917973975546605621/1400295899644694639/togif.gif

[potent sleet]

I accidentally stumbled upon the quest when looking for the bonfire flame in Gelibord, doing the quest was quite nice, especially with VoW

What I didn't expect was that it not only replaced an older quest, utilizes the new number prompts seen in a lot of the newer Wynn Quests, but is a quest that very recently got a fully voiced and re-enacted video in Minecraft that I watched prior to this

I had no idea this was a thing and is really cool....

But... the ending... what did ever happen to Eileen?

||Garvan forcefully encounters us as we try to learn info about Eileen's potential whereabouts, and more unfortunately so, as implied in one of the 2 endings for the Hollow Serenity re-enactment video, Eileen still might actually be out there, suffering for a cause and fate we may not fully know about or can connect it to in relation to all of the Decay in Gavel||

[red dome]

Didn't one of the secret discoveries confirm she died due to experimentation?

[limber swan]

Eileen died

the parasite in her head killed her

[frosty junco]

||https://wynncraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Ways_of_the_Wicked||

[potent sleet]

it would be that obvious wouldn't it

[red dome]

"Eileen's fate has been revealed. The Dernic Parasite manifested in her head and did not grant her immortality, rather, it emerged out of her head, presumably killing her in the process."

Man this is probably one of the darkest quests in wynncraft

[potent sleet]

I wonder if you get the LE despite what you tell Katarin

[red dome]

Which ending did you get?

[potent sleet]

Thanks to the re-enactment video, I already knew Katarin would murder pretty much the whole village in a fit of rage

But essentially lying to her puts her at ease, but... it's not true, and she'll never truly know what happened to her daughter after she died trying to protect her...

[red dome]

I sadly made the wrong choice on my first playthrough

[red dome]

I don't think I'd feel bad for lying to Katarin, her daughter is already dead and her solution is to murder presumably the ancestors of those who took her daughter away (If they're not the ancestors she'll literally just be murdering a completely innocent village that happened to be nearby).

Basically from that point on I made myself the rule "Always lie to ghosts when given the chance."

What is honestly more disturbing to me is that we never find out who those people where who took Eileen and what was their connection to the village

[potent sleet]

I mean considering the time they probably approached Garvan in the village

Decay had started to become a problem worth concern, and considering all it takes for decay to spread is a something that will let it nurture and breed, that group most likely made a deal with a devil to fulfill a very twisted promise and basically got beans in return

Very notably, and the video didn't go over this, Garvan had to change his opinions about the villagers

Some unique type of divine intervention clearly changed his mind and made him more compliant with the villagers, especially because spreading the word of his research caught the interest of one of them, the one of them likely being the mysterious hooded man that coerced Garvan to make the poor decisions he made

[red dome]

Yes but at the same time we don't know what they were hoping to achieve and what became of them

It would seem obvious the none of the villagers there in the modern day knew anything of the situation

Additionally the text on the signs in Ways of the wicked would seem to imply that they escaped from the Talor Folk

[unique cedar]

I tried to make the re-enactment close enough to the wynn canon but I took some artistic liberties to make it more entertaining and skipped over some parts. Like the reason I added Ways of the Wicked to one of the endings is because Eileen's fate is just weirdly skipped if you do the quest blind. In both endings you basically lie to Katarin because you wouldn't know what happened to Eileen at that point of the quest

There's also a Cultist Guy that appears in Lexdale after you complete the quest and I wonder if that's a hint to a possible continuation

[dim plover]

Is there a fanmade variant of this channel

Like how there’s a fanmade variant of #1265241987771006976

[shut hornet]

its actually pretty old relatively speaking

it came out in september 2022, 3 years ago

[red dome]

That still makes it one of the newer quests afaik

[shut hornet]

its from the latest big batch of quests which is a little crazy to think about

no quests in 2.1 since we're saving quests for fruma

[potent sleet]

I hope we see Tasim for the fight against Fruma

We know what happened to Aledar, but Tasim just disappears after the Ragni to Detlas Storyline

[red dome]

I really hope that means there'll be more than 3 quests in Fruma

[red dome]

He showed up in one of the festivals actually

[shut hornet]

i can promise you fruma will have more than 3 quests

[red dome]

He said he was in gavel the whole time

[shut hornet]

silent expanse is only the way it is because it began under a much smaller scope

[potent sleet]

I mean what value can you exhaust in an endgame quest?

[red dome]

Frankly I kind of like the eriee emptiness of the silent expanse

[shut hornet]

originally it was going to be totally empty with like no content or mobs

[potent sleet]

The SE storyline is meant to help you explore the area and learn some lore of the land (i.e. point of no return)

[red dome]

Especially in the olmic city, it makes the content we do get kinda special (Ie the fool eater and obsessor)

[shut hornet]

but then the ct at the time woke up to how much that would suck so they decided to add a bunch more

[potent sleet]

How is Fruma gonna work then lol

[red dome]

Thank goodness, it has some of the coolest stuff in the game nowadays

[shut hornet]

it was also in the wake of the silent expanse leak, basically sort of an effort to make it a lot more interesting than what had been leaked

[potent sleet]

The second we step foot in there we get assaulted by an infinitely overwhelming army

[hybrid gazelle]

in the teaser we got it seemingly suggest we been invited to Fruma but then again I dont think we should take teaser for graNTED

but being invited can be an option

[red dome]

before the trailer dropped I was convinced we were going to meet up with Dr. Picard and he'd help us discover the passage into Fruma the the Corkian's used to escape

[shut hornet]

https://youtu.be/oyJWnQDrPkY (this. some builder decided to post the whole thing on youtube before it was done. sucked then but now its really interesting that we have this old version of road to dern preserved)

[potent sleet]

Yeah no what in the hell would Fruma want to do with its wynnian soldier exports

[hybrid gazelle]

calling us "soldier" is

generous

[potent sleet]

The players story is that they're a blank slate nobody who was exiled from Fruma to become a soldier for Wynn

[hybrid gazelle]

It likely that our reputation is notorious enough to be invite into Fruma for meeting but so far we dont know

[shut hornet]

this video shows off how it looked before entire biomes were added. theres no eyeball forest, no toxic wastes, no void valley, its all empty

[red dome]

It looks like Void valley was going to be a town at one point

Is that where lutho was going to be?

[hybrid gazelle]

hot take while Lutho is a good build

I dont think it give the vibe of a town made out of desperation to survive

[shut hornet]

im not sure

[hybrid gazelle]

it feel very well decorated and structured

[red dome]

Well the easy explanation is that they want to invite some Wynn soldiers back in to Fruma for some reason and that's where we meet Tasim

[hybrid gazelle]

The thing that I have gripe about that kind of premise is that

players are not really soldiers to begin with so it feel like they just invite mercenary which is fine but yeah

using the term soldiers for player and Tasim is very generous LOL

like VERY VERY generous

[red dome]

Well keep in mind it's supposed to me scrapped together with old mining equipment, so it makes since that the miners would be able to make it structured at the very least

[hybrid gazelle]

Aledar too actually

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah and it still does not look like it was LOL

[red dome]

I know what you mean but some of the builds look like they were carved out spikes and you can still see crossbeams and scaffolding everywhere

[hybrid gazelle]

then yeah that good I like those build but like some part of lutho does not really convey that message really well

[red dome]

Like there's this one building there with a cone-like roof which doesn't make much sense unless it was carved out of a spike

[hybrid gazelle]

also what mining equipment even lol

Does not SE uncover before portal openning?

what technology does the miners even have back in those ages?

Like that shit is +1000 years ago

[red dome]

They obviously have scaffolding and cranes at least given that you see those when you first enter the SE

[hybrid gazelle]

then yeah sure I guess

[red dome]

What I dont understand is why the miners would leave the mining site to build Lutho in the Eyeball forest, I'm pretty sure the real world explanation is because the content team wanted Lutho to be a central town for the Silenet expanse. But lore wise it doesn't seem like a great place to build in a hostle environment

[hybrid gazelle]

it not so I just chalk that down to gameplay lol either that or they try to navigate through SE manage to get to Eyeball forest but realize that it's too dangerous to continue or go back so they juset settle there

[potent sleet]

You start out as a new soldier recruit for Wynn, and everyone that recognizes your position points out that you're a Wynn resident

[hybrid gazelle]

TBH feel like I would like SE more if they make the wall feel makeshifty and not this well build

Liek the wall probably is better than some city in Wynn province LOL

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah but still soldiers as rank is very very generous

[red dome]

I mean its a town made by miners so it makes sense that they'd use stone

[hybrid gazelle]

but then agian wynncraft just have poor record of understanding how world work so that fine I guess

[potent sleet]

Don't forget about Lutho's past in Point of No Return

Legit it looked like a normal town that didn't get hit by the negative effects of Dern yet

[red dome]

I feel like wynn soldiers in the lore cover more than just town guards

[shut hornet]

im not sure the lutho in that quest is actually lutho in the past

[hybrid gazelle]

Well each city is their own civilization so realistically if you are wynn soldiers
you would be soldires of a city like Detlas, Ragni, Almuj or Troms.

So player oging around wynn province and later over the world in late game is not that of a soldier

It's mercenary

[potent sleet]

Look I go with Soldier because unfortunately, VoW has to use a term for the player when an NPC calls them by their username

[shut hornet]

objectively the player is a wynn soldier so its fine

[red dome]

And on top of that Gavel has a lucrative deal with wynn where they exchange soldiers for magical knowledge

[hybrid gazelle]

There literally no way player is a soldier LOL

[potent sleet]

Brother they were literally recruited into Ragni's army what

[hybrid gazelle]

that wouldmean Gavel must talk to high millitary personel like Admiral Ageis for that exchange and NOT soldiers themselves go to Gavel

[hybrid gazelle]

Yes on early game but later on they simply are not soldiers by definition and more mercenary

[red dome]

Dude you meet wynnic soldiers all throughout Gavel

[hybrid gazelle]

Yeah? And there is no evidence of them going there by themselves like the player does

[red dome]

How about Elphaba?

You meet her and help her to free some captured Gavel soldiers

[hybrid gazelle]

she said to be working with Gavelian army and she is commander of Olux outpost

So she probably got transfer to Gavel to be part of the army there

she has a rank and people under her command,

which tbh make her involvement in AJB questionable but we can cahlk that up that she leave the position after orc war is over

[red dome]

All of the Wynn soldiers you meet in The mercenary, and A journey beyond are acting mostly independantly just like the player

[hybrid gazelle]

Wynncraft so far have display some weird understanding of how ecnomy and millitary rank so it really nothing new

[hybrid gazelle]

look at the name of the quest

[red dome]

Yes but who gives orders during the quest?

[hybrid gazelle]

and A jounrye beyond pretty much again case of everyone involve likely no longer in the army and act on their own

[hybrid gazelle]

Just because you were hired and order by millitary personel does not mean you are a soldier

that literally the whole point of the quest, you are mercenary

Even Amerigo said that he rather have you and the group dealt wit hthe problem even if Detlas said they will support

[red dome]

It would seem to me that because of Heroes like Bob, Wynn soldiers act more independantly than your average soldiers almost like mercenaries but they still recognise Rank and show up to briefings when summoned. The scout in the beginning of that mission even mentions he was going to go look for other SOLDIERS for that mission.

[hybrid gazelle]

if soldiers act independent then that just bad LOL

That mean the entire army consist of people who can just do willy nilly

[red dome]

I think what Amerigo meant was that he'd rather have a small team handle the issue instead of a full military force

[hybrid gazelle]

yes that the whole point of GETTING MERCENARY

like the quest imply

it does not make us soldiers or part of Almuj army

we are mercenaries

[red dome]

But you are still referred to as A SOLDIER

[hybrid gazelle]

that part again is why I said that wynncraft have poor understanding of how thing work

it been long time issue now but I think the writers do see that flaw

it get kinda fix in recent quest but as of rn it still flaw that the story have in which I will wait to see what they will do

it not 100% perfect but yeah

[red dome]

Dude the Mercenary is one of the most recent quests in the game

[hybrid gazelle]

Hence not 100% perfect

[red dome]

You are still referred to as a soldier

[hybrid gazelle]

again you miss my meaning
I still do say they have still poor understanding but they are IMPROVING

just because it's new does not mean it lack the flaw I mention

even in tunnel trouble have similar flaw until they address it

been trying to fix the world building in this setting
it hard work but eh it's what it is

think again gotta fix some part of wartorn project after ROL rewrite

[red dome]

Honestly I think it's fine that different settings have different systems to address the challenges of that setting, in many D&d worlds for example adventurers are kinda treated as normal even though that's not accurate to the real world, but because of the lack of nation states it makes sense

[hybrid gazelle]

Different setting mean it should work for that setting

in this case it's not

[red dome]

How so?

[potent sleet]

So what can our player be called by? Yeah Wynncraft's story writing is flawed, but it's so woven into your ultimate identity as a player that Soldier is just easy and safe to use, especially in VoW's case in which lines that mention your username directly have to use the name "Soldier" so that lines don't have to be constantly modified

[hybrid gazelle]

Wynn province is a province filled by war in which while siege is rare, fighting to ensure the safety of trade route would often happen due to the undead appearing throughout the province

having army of soldiers that act "independently" aka do whatever they want like traveling the world or take on different job instead of being on the ready will never work.

[red dome]

I think the system makes sense if we assume wynn has been fighting the corruption war for 1000 years, if you constantly have corrupted popping up here and there you'd need a regiment of people who are experienced enough to go out and address issues when they arise

[hybrid gazelle]

tbh anything but soldiers work at this point like mercenary or whatever or adventurer if you want to go RPG classic

[hybrid gazelle]

except you cant relying on people who just travel the world willy nilly
Wtf you gonna do when 80% of your soldiers all go to Gavel because that place literally better to live there than Wynn

some moderation must happen becasue every soldiers count in war where your enemy have no concept of resources

[red dome]

Who ever said gavel was better than wynn? there are just as many threats over there as there are in wynn

[hybrid gazelle]

LOL yeah sure a magical land is far better place to die in corruption that literally reanimate your fellow men into zombie and probably corrupt your own soul for eternity

[red dome]

Obviously thats why you'd have some soldiers be stationed at posts and some soldiers available to be called upon when needed.

[red dome]

Gavel has the decay good sir

[hybrid gazelle]

anyway I feel like this is probably like a waste for both of our time so like welp gone

[red dome]

Alright thats fair

G'day

[dim plover]

(Still trying to get a download of that btw)

The aesthetic of that video alone inspired the Black Desert

I know people think it’s too empty or whatever but whatever mood and tone the video gave out changed something in me
It was actually a really specific one and I want to use that desolate map as a creative playground

Along with the song

Completely different from new SE which is a bit more crowded and fantasy-alien and I really want a “semi-liminal supernatural” location I can add the most weird stuff in

Whatever it’s called idk
Massive empty open spaces, eternal night, a singular lit path with zero entities in sight

But at the same time something that’ll make the player feel like something can jump out at any time and there’s monsters lurking around somehow

But since there are no corners for monsters to hide in and the area is so big and spacious the mind is forced to either imagine the monsters being so massive that you can see them emerging from the distant mountains or so strange that they appear in thin air in a non-regular mob spawn way

Anyways I’m pretty sure the CT don’t have this version of the map anymore but there’s a chance Wynnonymus does
I know at least one person who’s still active today who claimed that they had past contact so I might finally get off my ass and msg them again

[limber swan]

what was that building 2:54 gonna be?

[limber swan]

im pretty sure Axelus says were a mercenary anyways

[red dome]

I'm pretty sure that was an early version of Lutho

[warm flicker]

honestly, i think our personal ties with the ragni king would be enough to get us into Fruma. Maybe Fruma asks Ragni for their own envoy, and the ragni king, knowing we handled wynnexcavation, sends us as a capable representative for ragni

[warm flicker]

as for this, i thought it was stated that, apart from troms and ragni, every other town has militias or small defence forces. Ragni is the only city i know of that actually protects other nearby settlements like Maltic or Alekin (and probably Tempo Town when they finally get recognized as a town). Detlas only has a militia, and seems as though most other major settlements in Wynn do too - unable to match the quantity of soldiers Ragni has they band together to tackle each others' problems

[warm flicker]

its strange looking at all of this, and seeing everything passed the Olmic city being desolate wastes. Its strange, i understand completely why it was removed, but at the same time having a portion of SE devoid of mobs and plantlife would be really interesting compared to the rest of the game, sort of like what they accomplished with the ruined city but without even the ruined structures

[rotund gust]

nah the quest go enter fruma just gonna start with tasim right at the gate no set up

then tasim and the player have to fight Bane of the Fruman Gate together

[sage brook]

@river zodiac hai ;3

are you going to make a cameo in fruma perchance

like will we see the beautiful bovine goddess you are in full glory

[azure tangle]

cows are in most provinces

[regal spire]

What’s the WOC lore, exactly? How many cows are potential wocs

[true eagle]

fuck books

[drifting aurora]

2

[bold geode]

The fact that they have no past at ALL and the dialogue in the carriage says “Awaken.” Rather than “Wake up” Makes me believe they are some chaotic agent of change placed there deliberately to influence the ongoing war, especially considering wynns eldritch themes and such

[dim plover]

The player was birthed by a Fruma meteor that descended upon the border

This basically proves that Catalyst Comet Theory is real

[shut hornet]

i have no idea

[rotund gust]

player is the war beast frfr

[red dome]

What's the catalyst comet theory?

[exotic bough]

||Adventure time reference||

[azure tangle]

From my memory of the time and from what former CT said, that was infact going to be where Lutho was.

from this video you can also see why there are all of the ruins around the portal that look like the ruined city because it was all the same biome

[slender copper]

Okay here is the place to ask my question. I'm sure many people here have asked this before but, does the player (or in this case us) officially have a backstory in Wynncraft like Tasim has? From what I've gathered (currently just reached level 60 and playing an assassin at level 28), seems like we were captured and were brought after Tasim's memories were wiped away, judging from the ending of the memory. However, the "it was like it was reaching into memories that never existed" caught me off guard (this line was in the Memory quest), did we just... spawn in the caravan with the two- or is it one of those "find out in later levels" situation?

[remote river]

We don’t have one, allows the you to create one if you want

[slender copper]

Oh- so it's the same "captured by Fruma guards for ___ and was brainwashed and sent into a caravan with the two". Guess that makes sense especially with how the website even says "start YOUR journey".

[agile bloom]

does anyone know what your supposed to find for that question with the bonfire keeper "I found something interesting"

[regal spire]

Maybe something to do with aster

[drifting aurora]

it's just meant to be a few of the festival trinkets

i wonder if it's bugged though

[vapid moon]

kevin

[south kernel]

it seemed to work on rune of wind and the sun coin

[hexed nova]

the slab spam, my eyesss nooo

wait u can see the place coalesced lol

[dim plover]

What year exactly did the wave calming happen

I still kinda want to figure that one out

[shut hornet]

3 days ago

[kindred perch]

💔 🥀

[red dome]

No talking mushroom dialog?

How disappointing.

[red dome]

Llevigar's Secret Library says the waves were calmed "over 100 years ago"

Meaning we can assume it was calmed a little before 900 AP

[lean ether]

bro what

what the hell was supposed to be in there then

[red dome]

It was supposed to be empty kinda like the void

[regal spire]

Honestly, a desolate SE works really well, IF it meant that Dern would follow it up with the intended content

If we got the empty silent expanse as the intended content for the road to Dern, it’d be really disappointing, because all the necessary, fun content that we would be expecting from any sort of region expansion would just be completely forgone

Although, I’m never opposed to an SE rework, where it takes away all the added enemies—mimicking what we’re familiar with in expected enemy spawns—and 100% leans into the concept of having the entire ecosystem be ambush predators

I’d fall in love with SE all over if none of the actual mobs you’d fight were visible outright, having even simple mobs like Blinders wait before lunging out from wherever

[red dome]

They reworked their attack animations to look like they're pouncing now

Also let's not forget that a lot of the rarer mobs in SE are ambush hunters like the obsessors and fool eater

[cloud phoenix]

i feel like SE rn is fine thematically

it kinda deserves more content ngl but ig thats more for dern

[red dome]

People say that but a lot of the best content in the game is in SE

[cloud phoenix]

it really is but more to it would be so sick

[red dome]

True but I think they're saving it for Fruma

[cloud phoenix]

ofc

[rotund gust]

tbh, out of the 6ish biomes of the expanse, the mines, ruined olmic city, eyeball forest, toxic wastes, void valley and the portal behind dern, 2 pretty much are empty. The portal would be empty if not for panic zealots

the emerald mine has a few mobs but is fairly empty, and ruined olmic city is also mostly empty

[red dome]

The Emerald mine has several important secret discoveries while the olmic city is a spawn point for all of the cool rare mob encounters

[rotund gust]

i mean yeah but they still “feel” empty

like vibe wise, they feel abandoned and empty

[azure tangle]

mfw abandoned ruined city feels abandoned

[rotund gust]

i mean, it pulls off the vibe well

but like half the expanse still has the empty “feeling”, even if it isn’t actually empty, which is good

[dim plover]

I’m thinking of making Antikythera in my WynnEx rewrite repurpose part of themselves to be a star observatory in reference to the original mechanism solely to research and track down the Crystals

By retroactively making the already star-associated crystals connected to all the other stars in the sky so that someone with the right knowledge and technology can exploit cosmic phenomena to narrow down crystal phenomena

||Probs not the right place to talk about it but it sure is the closest||

[rotund gust]

i mean, trashie talks about their rewrites here all the time and no one’s stopped them

[rotund gust]

regular human from our world gets isekai’d into wynn, how long do you think they last?

like, dropped in the middle of detlas

[hushed obsidian]

a while probably. Assuming they don't leave detlas.

they might be susceptible to common bacteria etc. that Wynn folk can survive because evolution but that is probably not very isekai

[rotund gust]

i mean like, they’d need to leave deltas occasionally. the city is nice and guarded, but all the farms are outside the city, as are most trading jobs. There really don’t seem to be any jobs in wynn that wouldn’t require potential exposure to corrupteds

except like… shipping via airship, but then you need to deal with skyraiders

and to get a to city that has like… more in city jobs, like nemract or nesaak fishing requires traveling

and the jungle would require beating bane

well i guess the pigman ravine tunnel would work too, but i don’t think they’d have permission to use it

going toward almuj would probably get you mugged and killed by bandits

you could make enough money to try and get a ticket to cinfras, but you wouldn’t be allowed to permanently settle in gavel outside of eltom (maybe rodoroc/thanos? idk if they are implied to be under the gavel government or not)

but rodoroc seems more dangerous than it’s worth, given the lava everywhere

corkus might also get you killed? the mechs seem like a problem

honestly working on the ocean like the seaskipper seems like the safest option, as long as you can get to nemract

[unique hill]

you could probably open loot chests in detlas for enough money to buy a weapon at the weapon merchant

and then go clear the tunnel to ragni which seems like the least scary way to get back there

loot ragni until you could afford leather armor and some basic consumables

and then go kill some corrupteds and run to nemract by going down the shore and swimming around the zombie horde near mt wynn

buy the sea skipper pass to selchar and never leave

[rotund gust]

are loot chests restocking like a canon thing or a gameplay thing

[unique hill]

i have no idea. if the loot chests don’t work you can strangle the chickens in detlas and sell their feathers

[rotund gust]

true

[wispy bay]

They would probably get like arrested and experimented on for not being cubic

[rotund gust]

lmao

[regal spire]

“Babe, we’re in Wynncraft!”

[rotund gust]

how many people on the server do you think would run in front of a moving truck if they knew there was a chance at getting in a world with lari and ava in it

[regal spire]

Lari’s prolly dead, tbh, and she’s also not gonna want to be around the people that want to be around her. Ava is also not gonna want to hang out with the kind of people who would do that, so they’d uproot their lives to live in an apocalyptic, medieval-inspired world where they have zero connection to a vast majority of the people immersed in the given culture

With that said, I’m on the fence on whether or not I’d ever want to experience the world of Wynn

[rotund gust]

no no no, not the world after the player goes through. They would get dropped into Wynn 1000AP the same time aledar and tasim arrive

So no quests completed yet

[regal spire]

Then the latter of the lari sectioned sentence. I find it hard to believe Lari’s gonna want to be around any one of us, ESPECIALLY the people who are actively wanting it

[rotund gust]

true

[regal spire]

Honestly, I’d find it hard to believe any one of us could be dropped into Wynn’s world and make it beyond level 4

Infested plants is DEFINITELY taking a majority of people

If I was ever put on the death penalty, and I was forced to serve it in the world of Wynncraft, there are some crimes that I wouldn’t be too against

[rotund gust]

unironically I think the proffers would survive

low danger, high reward

[rotund gust]

the detlas suburbs goliath is taking out a lot of people

and it we go with the idea the person starts in the tutorial (or atleast in ragni) instead of being dropped on deltas, a bunch will die from heading to pigman ravines first

and of the people who do survive, and chose to be an adventurer instead of just settling down and living in a low level city, i think like half of them will probably die to Bane

[regal spire]

Nivla, imo, is gonna be the biggest roadblock. Sure, people might go to the ravines too early, but there’s enough guards around the entrances of it, as well as plenty of deterrents and warnings that would scare away plenty of people. Nivla offers the highest density of enemies in the entire game, with almost hundreds of enemies strewn about in such a small area. And, if they somehow manage to get beyond that, doing even 1 of the quests is sure to be the end of anyone, since infested plants offers a huge number of baby spiders, whilst also having a giant spider “boss” with an impressive health pool to boot

People would need to group together, for sure. But, that would imply that you’d need more than 1 person to have been sent in there with you. Most people would just end up as lvl 1 Ragni citizens, forever doomed to be dps dummies

[bold geode]

The question is really if we retain our knowledge and our abilities are similar to gameplay

Or if we’re just some guy/girl

In which case no one is ever making it to gavel

[rotund gust]

mmm i would say you have a grasp of the combat system and how to increase your “levels” (just train your abilities in this case), but not innate knowledge of the world

[regal spire]

I’d hope we’d get some kind of magic, but I’m under the assumption we’d get no magic

[bold geode]

Base heavy melee, using only the inherent magic of the items

[regal spire]

Just, if me straight up was just suddenly cubed up—lol—and dropped into Wynn world

[bold geode]

think about people dying to just… putting on revenant or holding ignis or sum

[rotund gust]

hmm, more like the wynn setting, not inherently wynn as a world with all the same gameplay mechanics like a skill tree or quest book

[regal spire]

Any single human being putting on disco and just never being able to stop dancing

[rotund gust]

so like wynn if it were a d&d setting or in a book. In universe wynn vs. how we see it as a game

what % of people do you think would live to see gavel?

[regal spire]

There’s potential for survival, but if you wanna be an adventurer, you’re not gonna survive without outside help, or years of honing

[bold geode]

Considering many legendaries aren’t super hard to find people would probably die constantly of items that would be lethal to any normal human

[regal spire]

Honestly, it’s dicey, because the path to Nemract is significantly safer than other paths

[rotund gust]

true, but it’s also not the “natural” path if that makes sense. Like the path to detlas seem more traveled

[bold geode]

Consider: if the system is closer to the real world, you would probably be trying to maximize your stealth and staying out of obvious danger

[regal spire]

I’d imagine someone might end up going to the Katoa path, depending on how long they’re sanctioned in the city. Plenty of people visit it for produce and animal products

[bold geode]

People taking clever routes and just being really careful could get FAR

[regal spire]

I know that I would definitely wanna go to the coast, before anything

[rotund gust]

oh i forgot Katao existed

[bold geode]

like not ends of a province far but I think they’d get somewhere at least

[regal spire]

I wish more farms were by the coast. I know it’s not ideal for a lot of more specific crops, but I absolutely LOVE coastal produce

[rotund gust]

is going to time valley just a death sentence? what’s the chance you get stuck in a paradox or time loop

[regal spire]

It’s also incredibly difficult to upkeep structures, too, and you’re at risk of losing years of shelter to storms/shifting sands

But, sandy farms are just sooooo nice

[rotund gust]

Lusuco is probably one of the safest options, assuming you can handle the weather

[regal spire]

It’s definitely one of the most inconsistent and deadly places. Given the hundreds of time lost adventurers

[rotund gust]

ToA doesn’t leak monsters, no corruption, ice fishing for food

assuming you can get there and don’t accidentally wander onto the great bridge

[regal spire]

It’s got the advantage of having an entirely populated mountain society, too, so nothing is breaking through into it

[bold geode]

Elkurn would be so nice if it were not for the hordes of the corrupted around

[regal spire]

Currently, coastal towns/sectioned islands is your best bet to survival. You’ll want to hone your combat skills before venturing through the coastal trail, buy your first ticket to selchar, and live from there

[rotund gust]

yeah it’s just hard to get there, seeing as the easiest paths there are either emerald trail -> time valley -> nesaak -> lusuco or emerald trail -> alekin -> deltas -> the roots of corruption -> nesaak -> lusuco

[regal spire]

Potato island is also pretty safe, same with human island.

[rotund gust]

maybe stopping in elkurn?

[bold geode]

Yeah I was thinking selchar is like, among the safest places, no?

[rotund gust]

most of the ocean cities seem fairly safe

mage island, selchar, bear zoo are all pretty tame

[bold geode]

It’s reasonably easy to reach, there’s no threat whatsoever, and clearly there’s stable food and water cause they got a whole city going

[rotund gust]

pirate cove and ice islands you’d need to watch your back but you should be fine too

[bold geode]

Ice islands got a civil war

[regal spire]

Pirate cove is definitely a last choice for a domestic lifestyle. Selchar is overpopulated, so it’s better as a port stop for business, so your best bet would be to live somewhere like durum isles, rooster island, or the secret potato storage.

Isle of fiction is also, potentially, a good choice. Employment, food, housing, and sociability

Honestly, though, I’d want to be a lighthouse operator, if I was in Wynn

[rotund gust]

assuming you can make it that far and earn entrance aldorei would be a good place to settle

i’m not really sure how the rules for “no humans in gavel” work in elf or dwarf territory

[regal spire]

Lmao, that’s not gonna happen. No way anyone even makes it a foot into llevigar plains

[bold geode]

Again, I propose stealth if we’re assuming it’s gonna be slightly more realistic

[regal spire]

Orcs are no joke, not like some loopy zombies or coastal crustaceans

[rotund gust]

i mean, llevigar plains has active military right at the start, just get like an escort or something

[bold geode]

You could probably sneak around and avoid most things

Ahmsord% speedrun

[rotund gust]

offer to work in karoc quarry to pay for passage to bucie

[regal spire]

You’ll need an escort through 1000’s of blocks worth of pathing, too, and one of those may lay you center of the light or dark forest

[rotund gust]

nemract -> selchar -> jofash

or just like buy a airship pass to kandon beda, it’s a port city presumably there’s more ships going there than just the corkus balloon

[regal spire]

You’d got to get enough money for that, though

[rotund gust]

idk, it doesn’t seem that expensive seeing as the main issue would be getting the passport

[bold geode]

Is wynn even that large, considering how quickly you get places running 3.5m/s

[regal spire]

Canonically, something like even a single le is a lot. Most people don’t have even close to that, and the richer people aren’t breaching more than 10 of it.

[rotund gust]

fair

[regal spire]

I’d imagine that getting a ticket to selchar would take a lot out of someone, tbh, especially if they’re actively trying to provide for themselves

Couldn’t imagine what VISA processes would look like 😭

[rotund gust]

living anywhere in decay affected land is a death sentence. Olux you’re gonna get golemized. Gelibord you’re probably getting kidnapped for the prison or eaten by something. Lexdale you will be burned at the stake the second something goes wrong

lake gylia could be chill. If your fine wearing a pumpkin you could live with gerts

[regal spire]

You’d have to eat and kill animals 24/7 though

[rotund gust]

and?

[bold geode]

Simply hit the 1 in a million to be chosen as orphion’s pulse /j

[regal spire]

Gerten society is just eating nonstop, which I’d imagine would be incredibly unsustainable, for a human

[rotund gust]

it’s a simple chill life, not a fun one

[regal spire]

Not to mention that it’s implied that living near lake gylia is actively effecting everyone there, so how long until you just decay into a living zombie

[rotund gust]

if you could somehow get to troms through either pigman ravines or beating bane (you’d defo need to bring a squad of people with you, just like hitch a ride with some soldiers or something) it would be fine

[regal spire]

(Hunger of Gerts Part 2 be damned for being horribly conveyed)

[bold geode]

I was gonna say harassment by the gylia watch but they do jackshit so ehhh

[rotund gust]

just bring a few bottles of nemract ale with you and you have friends for life

[regal spire]

Troms has the threat of Slykaar, though, I’m sure that could get in the way of things

[bold geode]

Bane is so strong the bridge had to be abandoned by the army, no?

[rotund gust]

i mean, given the potion merchant right outside i assume people still travel across it

[bold geode]

What does the uhh dialogue of the guy outside say again

[rotund gust]

omw over to check rn

[bold geode]

I might just be dead wrong idk

Anyways you’d probably suffer severe burns regardless of who you’re traveling with

[regal spire]

I’m still going coast, forever. Cannot wait to see my comfy plan get entirely stomped by an ocean rework

[rotund gust]

i mean, you’d kinda be set though. Get healed up in iboju and live in troms for the rest of your life

[regal spire]

“Oh, selchar is gonna be entirely buried by a giant ahh kraken”

[bold geode]

Valid, though you’d need a way to dodge all the little shooting thingies until then

[regal spire]

Jungle fetishes are killing more people than bane ever will

[rotund gust]

wait does the npc only spawn near the bridge if you haven’t fought bane yet

[rotund gust]

fake

[regal spire]

Nah, he’s generally just there. Maybe the festival changed that

[rotund gust]

oh found him

oh the bridge keeps getting closed and the military has to come in and keep rekilling bane lmao

[bold geode]

We assume he’s gonna ambush us, then?

Oh I gtg

[rotund gust]

i mean, he’s a known about threat. Just a ride with whatever group of soldiers goes in to kill bane, or go through right after they finish taking him out

you could also just try and apply for troms citizenship in the hopes they’ll eventually let you use the ravine tunnel

[regal spire]

Then, you’re forced to survive the onslaught of jungle frogs and fetishes

[steel spire]

drowned by Idol
aged to dust by Grandmother

[regal spire]

Disintegrated by warp usage

Burst into flames by apoc

Believe you’re a total tool while holding hero

[steel spire]

Emptied (likely forgotten) by Oblivion

[regal spire]

Given horrifying, hopeless premonitions of the future by epoch

Achieve enlightenment by strapping a Nirvana to your belt

Disfigure your body permanently by wielding singu

[steel spire]

Have your sanity gone with Freedom, Grimtrap, etc.

[regal spire]

Less of your sanity drained and more your entire perception of empathy, as well as your moral compass, completely rewritten and—essentially—destroyed

Grimtrap just makes you evil

Freedom is my personal favorite, because it implies that we aren’t shooting things to hurt them, rather it’s like we’re helping them walk, or guiding them home. It’s as effortless as giving directions, where the action offers a bit of moral satisfaction.

Even more interesting is that anyone hit by them is, essentially, offered the perspective of someone who was guided, grateful for it

[steel spire]

Return to Ether literally disappearing and reappearing in player inventory randomly

[regal spire]

Hero only showing itself to those who believe themself to be worthless is, also, an interesting item to apply lore wise

At some point, we—as a player—believed our entire adventure to be pointless. We essentially lost our entire identity in a moment, and questioned its purpose through insecurity and hopelessness. Then, suddenly, an incredible spear appeared, but we still believe the above mentioned

It’s really sad, actually, where all hero users are just in a perpetual state of hopelessness and depression, losing all direction and want for themselves

Of course, the day they regain some sort of autonomy, the weapon will disappear, but in game, everyone using the spear is just sad 😔

[steel spire]

I'm taking that lore as "those who are struck by freedom will have their body, mind and soul torn apart from each other (in common terms, death would be a good approximation)"

Like what remains would be a body without a soul and a soul without a body

[regal spire]

I’d imagine it takes your soul, then your mind, and finally the body, and essentially scatters them across the universe, fractured into lil pieces. The concept, though, would imply “freedom” from the mortal world, whilst also offering that same perspective that we are now justifying to the target, just before this total destruction

It’s ironically kinda peaceful, despite how horrifying the concept is

[steel spire]

Az's lore imply that Az rune corresponds to the thunder element (and two other correspond to fire and water)
But on the other hand Nii and Uth runes seem to be able to manifest in all 5 elements

[regal spire]

My best assumption for it is that each element has potential within a given rune, but certain combinations amplify the potency of a specific rune’s chosen element. Az chose thunder because, for whatever reason, the chosen amplification was one of pure destruction, alluding to the collapsed civilization. And, it offers water and fire damage as a nod to whatever other rune had been combined with it, showing their potential in the weapon.

I don’t think there’s any actual lore for why this happens, so we’ve only got head cannons

Another head cannon I had for Az is that when runes are combined in the circumstances that would cause cataclysmic devastation, their natural response is to associate themselves with an incredible amount of thunder magic

[steel spire]

Post-Ultima+Heracul?

Soul Ink with -mr and +ms, Memory Dye with the reverse

[bold geode]

I wonder if we’ll ever get Ek runes

I thought those were mentioned somewhere

[regal spire]

They’re in the game, just not obtainable

[rotund gust]

ek runes in fruma trust. They’ll be used to make CFF and CEO keys, as well as entering the inevitable fruma raid

[bold geode]

Fruma royal castle raid 🔥

[regal spire]

Fruman Capital Raid

[rotund gust]

We’re probably gonna get a new raid and then like 1 new dungeon, maybe 2 imo

[bold geode]

Cff kinda makes little sense since there’s no corruption in corkus and ceo, tf would that even work considering it’s a place through and through shaped by dark, pocket dimensions you mysteriously travel between

[rotund gust]

not counting corrupted dungeons

[regal spire]

I mean, there aren’t any noticeable corruption spikes near GG, but it got corrupted somehow

[bold geode]

I guess the forgery works in mysterious ways

[rotund gust]

i just mean FF forgery, they could change the suffix and have it not be corruption themed but still like “bad ending” themed

[regal spire]

Put Ba’kal in a boat and there, CFF

[bold geode]

LMAO

you have placed the image of Bak’al having a chat with the sea skipper in my head

Thank you kindly

[regal spire]

I thought of him in some rinky dinky ol’ row boat

“Stroke. Stroke.” Type interaction

[bold geode]

The sea skipper has plot armor, they’d be chillin

[regal spire]

“So, you’ve been the one terrorizing Wynn?”
“Oh, don’t worry about me! I won’t judge.”

[bold geode]

Actually, forget the boat - darkness portal directly to the core room

[regal spire]

That would imply he knows where Corkus is, which—imo—would mean Ba’kal isnt a bone head

[bold geode]

I mean, he’s less braindead than the shambling undead, he actually speaks to people and such