f1-technical

[civic fern]

And then you do the same thing for the lateral curves to connect from headlights to windshield

Now you have a “square” with longitudinal and lateral lines

Now you could just make a surface out of that (multi-section surface will do)

But what if you wan to control the shape in the middle?

You make a grid out of that square by making more longitudinal/lateral curves to fill it in, but since once again you did everything based off mathematical equations it makes maintaining tangency really simple

[fading cosmos]

how good math skill i need to do it? it's sound really complicated for me lol

[civic fern]

The standard MechE math courses will do it

Multivar/Diffeq level

I think tangency was covered in multivar but its been 3 years lmao

[fading cosmos]

i'm in vocational school, so i've been doing more practical course than math course, but i have some good basic on it

[civic fern]

iirc you find tangency at a point by taking the derivative of the equation of a line at that point. Dont quote me on that part, but the point is that the fact you made your curve based on an equation means finding the derivative is also really easy

Then its just a matter of coding to generate the lines

[fading cosmos]

it's look like i need to learn more

[civic fern]

But yeah thats how you would use Curve by Law and GSD to design class A surfaces

[fading cosmos]

are there any automotive design engineers or f1 design engineers here? i want to learn more

[civic fern]

@tall wyvern

[fading cosmos]

it's gonna be challenging for me

[fading cosmos]

wowww

[tall wyvern]

I’ve never used curve defined by equation

It’s all points, lines, splines, sweeps, multisection surfaces

[civic fern]

Are you using the sketcher?

[fading cosmos]

so you connected the point to make spline?? how about 3d curve?

[opaque arch]

ye i managed

[opaque arch]

I use both part design and Generative wireframe

most of the time

[opaque arch]

to make a 3d curve in catia u basically make some points and u link them using the spline function (Usually 3 - 4 points)

u can also make a 3d curve by combining 2d curves but i forgot how to do that

[fading cosmos]

nope, there is 3d curve without a making a point

just like solidworks 3d sketch

[opaque arch]

i dont think so - i dont know any people using 3d sketch

[fading cosmos]

i did it

[opaque arch]

is it in generative wireframe tho?

i asked an f1 engineer before and he said that they use generative wireframe for most of the time - at least for wetted models

[fading cosmos]

you mean generative shape design?

[opaque arch]

this one in 3dx

is this not included in student license?

[fading cosmos]

yeah they use it for f1 car

[opaque arch]

i think generative shape is another thing

[fading cosmos]

i think it's same thing

[opaque arch]

lemme check

they changed it to imagine and shape - not sure

[fading cosmos]

but how about a mass produce car? do they use generative shape design and wireframe?

[opaque arch]

ye

[fading cosmos]

it's different gsd is gsd

imagine and shape is different workbench

[opaque arch]

an f1 engineer they use wireframe for most of time - at least for CFD

for sure

[fading cosmos]

i talk about regular car, cause it's so complicated when use wireframe

[opaque arch]

no

even i use it

for all of my models

[fading cosmos]

or i don't know anything about it

[fading cosmos]

let me se some of it

[opaque arch]

sure

[fading cosmos]

catia workbench

[opaque arch]

thats one of them

[opaque arch]

hows ur generative shape design like

[fading cosmos]

i mean a regular car, not f1 car

[opaque arch]

i pretty sure there is a catia toyota rav4 or corollar on grabcad

[fading cosmos]

generative shape design

[fading cosmos]

i'll check it

[opaque arch]

its same

as generative wireframe

[fading cosmos]

i found a pdf tutorial using 3d curve

but i'm not sure if engineer in automotive industry do the same thing

[opaque arch]

watch tutorials from catia

or the user mannual

[opaque arch]

really good surface designers can make complex stuff with so little / simple geometry

[fading cosmos]

I don't think it's very specific

[opaque arch]

https://eduspace.3ds.com/CompanionManager/public/#/

i learnt catia from here

but i dont think its free

i think u need a license

[fading cosmos]

i'll check it

[tall wyvern]

Generative wireframe and surface is part of generative shape design

If I use 3D curves then I constrain the control points onto lines

[tall wyvern]

3D curve is its own function

[fading cosmos]

sorry, are you automotive design engineer/f1 design engineer?

i really want to know more about this industry

[opaque arch]

thats what i have in generative wireframe - where is 3d curve

[tall wyvern]

Alt+f then search for it

It’s in my action pad but like I said, it’s barely used

[opaque arch]

this?

[tall wyvern]

No it’s just called 3D Curve

[tall wyvern]

It’s possible it’s in GSD and not generative wireframe and surface

[fading cosmos]

where i can learn how to design a car? like class a surfacing

is it possible if I learn it on the internet?

[opaque arch]

?

thats all i have for generative

[fading cosmos]

try to search freestyle

[opaque arch]

found it

kinda cool

its in free style analysis

[opaque arch]

why

[fading cosmos]

maybe you can find it there

[tall wyvern]

I guess the license you have includes wireframe and surface but stops short of GSD

I use freestyle shape analysis for isophote mapping but that’s it

[civic fern]

You’re missing Generative Shape Develop (the stripped version of Generative Shape Design)

[opaque arch]

lmao

[civic fern]

Also look for FreeStyle Shape Design/Analysis

3DCurve is in there

[opaque arch]

ye i have that

[opaque arch]

should i get cheap student version or the expensive

i do cfd in openfoam

so simulia gonna be useless anyways

[civic fern]

Mine was $60

Per year

[opaque arch]

ye thats the expensive one i think

[civic fern]

Oh i thought you meant between that and DS Engineer or something ($72)

But you need the “3DX CATIA Student” role

Thats the one that comes with all the surfacing apps

[violet shard]

only 6 bucks more? go for the right one

[opaque arch]

that package has cfd and i use openfoam for most of the time

[fading cosmos]

what is the difference between 3dx catia and 3dx engineer?

[civic fern]

go left

[opaque arch]

ok

[civic fern]

right one doesn't include the same things

[civic fern]

left = more surfacing apps
right = you get a FEM solver

and a bunch of other things but thats the two most important

[opaque arch]

are those certificates useful

[fading cosmos]

like simulia,abaqus?

[opaque arch]

ye

[opaque arch]

i think there is a free abaqus student license

[fading cosmos]

yeah but the mesh element is limited

[civic fern]

not that ive seen

[opaque arch]

ye - still better than nothing

ansys student limit is like 512k

which is dumb

[opaque arch]

@civic fern

how can i see my 3dx license expiring date

[civic fern]

the one you bought lasts for a year

idk where you can find the exact date inside 3DX

just use your email lmao

[opaque arch]

I am still using a license so idk

[opaque arch]

?

[civic fern]

if you bought it for $60, you'll get an email with the link to your 3DX platform

[opaque arch]

Oh

[ashen venture]

Mclaren have like, a mini drs thing

[charred shadow]

https://youtu.be/BAGdX4Fxo3I?si=fJMyX5W0V-WvuCWA

[prime mortar]

mercedes double drs 2012-2012

mclaren drs trick 2024

welcome back mercedes double drs

[ashen venture]

is it legal?

[prime mortar]

as far as i have heard and what i know yes it is

similar to what rbr had last year before everyone else came out with their own version

they relied less on the downforce their beam wing made so they could get the bigger advantage with drs open

[ashen venture]

Ahh, I think teams will soon follow

[prime mortar]

that was last year so i think some of them already got it

[merry delta]

as far as the current flexing bodywork tests concern, yes it is. However, the FIA could introduce new tests basically whenever they feel like it if they find such a thing as "getting out of hand"

[short ether]

Looking at the f1 22 mclaren, why was there a bump on the mclarens sidepod

Which can also be seen here

[charred shadow]

New regulation shenanigans

[abstract pawn]

For the top side impact structure

[short ether]

Aha but i believe mclaren is the only car to have it that year

[abstract pawn]

It depends on how slimmed down your bodywork is

If you want to make it tighter than the sips allows then you will get that bump

[short ether]

Aha

[long crystal]

F1 2026 RV Rear Wing

[long crystal]

If someone knows how to read the technical documention and wanna help, please contact me

[opaque arch]

Bros asking free service

[opaque arch]

Just do it in here

[long crystal]

😅

[kindred remnant]

To manage your Reaction Roles please visit your server dashboard via the button below

[vestal dirge]

Where is technical documentation

[prime mortar]

FIA website. They release every single update to the rege

[opaque arch]

The first thing I would say is pls use a proper CAD software

Geometries created from blender aren't optimized for simulations / inefficient

[long crystal]

https://x.com/Qvist_Designs/status/1837544102813917396/photo/1

Qvist Designs (@Qvist_Designs) on X

#f12026 regulations made with official measures by @fia

Twitter · Sep 21, 2024, 5:27 PM

[vale ferry]

Why is Charles Leclerc technically superior to Max Verstappen?
Technical points only

[blazing saffron]

not really relevant to #f1-technical still

@vale ferry

[raven dock]

yo

I have something you might like

making a newer sidepod

[prime mortar]

So quick question, i know that the hyrbid component gets rid of the turbo lag on the current cars. Does is do that by making up for the lower power when the turbo is still spooling up? Or does it actually keep the turbo spooled up?

[opaque arch]

Can't read

[opaque arch]

Depends on engine modes and mapping but u can generalize that the MGUH spins the turbo before corner exits

[prime mortar]

Looks like the RB and RBR mixed together but the air flow looks like its getting sent underneath the side pod too quickly

I dont think much air is getting over the floor

[prime mortar]

Alr I see

[opaque arch]

Also throttle mapping and a lot of stuff

[raven dock]

the wing is gonna be pushing air under

it's alot better than my first car tbh

[opaque arch]

Is this blender

[prime mortar]

Torque maps correct?

[opaque arch]

Ye both

[prime mortar]

I know its not finished but the air seems to be going straight into the floor and not going over the floor. You can see the currect grid priortized the sidepod under cut because it leaves the most space underneath it to channel air to the back of the car and maximising ground effect

[raven dock]

it's finished now

I'm experimenting with new parts for the redesign

[opaque arch]

I don't think the front wing generate any downforce

[raven dock]

nah it didnt

it failed CFD testing

[opaque arch]

The air foil isn't even cambered

[raven dock]

the rear wing generated a load though

but I think I did a better design with my new car

because I built that before doing a full course in aerodynamics

[opaque arch]

The rear isn't cambered also

[prime mortar]

Try drawing your design before you start it in blender or anything

[opaque arch]

Also why the model looks like goofy ahh minecraft

[raven dock]

not fun

[opaque arch]

Don't really need to

[prime mortar]

Tbh the best way in my opinion is draw what you have an idea for and use clay to make a model. Then make some flowvis, get a leaf blower and a tunnel and actually experiment.

[opaque arch]

Bro it's 2024

We have CFD

[prime mortar]

Its kinda bush leauge but this guy made his British hill climb cars that way

[raven dock]

this car was a load more built for purpose

[opaque arch]

2026 gen

[raven dock]

it's what I'm redesigning the sidepods for

[opaque arch]

ur car doesn't fit the regulations for sure

[raven dock]

oh it does

[opaque arch]

Nah

[raven dock]

it's hard to see most of it on the black background

[opaque arch]

I was saying the previous one not the 2026

[raven dock]

ohh yeah that one

there was no regulations

slapped stuff together to figure out how CFD works

[opaque arch]

Lol

[raven dock]

I created a high pressure blast from the diffuser that shoots out and upwards

alot of downforce

and because the pressure builds as the air tumbles, it somehow added speed

[opaque arch]

Cda?

And Cla?

[raven dock]

Christian democracy appeal?

[opaque arch]

Drag coefficient u dumb dumb

[raven dock]

ohhh

idk

low drag, high pressure, it's confusing

I see air, I angle the air, car speeds up, car sticks down

[opaque arch]

What

[raven dock]

I'm autism enhanced

I look at an object, I can see the air

I see aerodynamics

[prime mortar]

adrian newey ahh

have you read his book before?

its a good read

[raven dock]

yeah

[opaque arch]

Bro did CFD but didn't know what he has done

[raven dock]

exactlu

[opaque arch]

Bro doesnt even know the coefficient

OpenFOAM?

[raven dock]

ngl, half the aerodynamics stuff I've done was approved by a guy at alpine

[opaque arch]

Lmao

[raven dock]

probably why it's bad

then again he asked the materials I used for some of the parts

[opaque arch]

I think it's good to know the theory side so u know what u r doing. U don't need to know specific CFD theories but at least general aerodynamics.

[raven dock]

I prefer to leave it at haha air make car go brrt

Also the fact that I'm studying strategies this year

[prime mortar]

strategies is something i would like to start getting into

[raven dock]

yeah

they're complicated at first

[prime mortar]

i have an okay knowledge from the technical side but I tried predicting track evolution and who would have the fastest car in singapore but then the track decided it wanted to be different

but I got it right in miami and in FP2 i was talking with my friend and we were talking about race strategy and I brought up the safety car

call me hannah schmitz

[long crystal]

Nope

to start with, the cut from the rear wing endplate is not allowed

[raven dock]

no cuts

it's the design of the livery

because it's got black parts on the endplate

[long crystal]

ah

cool

[tall wyvern]

Actually you can have a cut in the endplate

[long crystal]

i don't think so

that's the Reference Surface

and this the Volume

[tall wyvern]

Oh sorry I thought you meant now, at the wingtip

[long crystal]

ah yes

now you can yeah

W13 had that zone straight

and i think other cars too

it surprised me i just realized because my friend who did this told me. Mark Lane showed a car with this kind of rear wing

I was expecting to see some pre 2008 cars design in those areas but i think final design will be different 😅

[tall wyvern]

Bargeboards and front wing will be the big development areas

[long crystal]

oh yes

I think bargeboards can be split in two diff pieces

[tall wyvern]

Any z plane contain up two sections means two elements, yes

[long crystal]

@tall wyvern do you think we will be back to 2021 sidepods?

as the floor is almost the same

[drifting bough]

Velocity is proportional to the radius of curvature. That's why airfoils are cambered. That's why f1 wings are just inverted airfoils.

And as far as the flow over the side floors, most setups are diverting air from under the car over to outlets that dump it out onto the side floors

Most of the front of the car is focus on downloaded on the front wing, and diverting turbulent flow away from the car

Downforce*

Or manipulating aerodynamics in certain areas to lower the Reynolds number to mitigate turbulent flow

Or I should said modifying aerodynamics in order to manipulate the Reynolds number

[opaque arch]

Anyone has 2024 reference volume in 3dxml?

[tall wyvern]

Huh..?

[long crystal]

xd

[opaque arch]

What is side floor my friend

[drifting bough]

The floor

[prime mortar]

like the floor edge?

[vestal dirge]

What’s a good book to learn about the f1 technicals?

[prime mortar]

not a book but the F1technical.net is great and its forums with people who know what they are talking about. from what i’ve heard even some technicians from teams spend time there as well

[vestal dirge]

Ty

[tall wyvern]

Not sure about that

It’s renowned for absolute nonsense, good for pictures though.

Race car aerodynamics by J Katz is the standard one for aerodynamics, and there’s tonnes of vehicle dynamics books like race car vehicle dynamics by miliken and miliken.

[drifting bough]

You can learn concepts but you are not going to grasp it unless you have the theory and proofs behind everything. You need a degree.

There is a lot to the basics of fluid dynamics in general nevermind graduate level material in advanced aerodynamics

[drifting bough]

This is the book that was required for my advanced aero course.

You will have better luck searching for airfoil books and courses online. It's all the same.

Adrian's book is a good read by thr way

[vestal dirge]

Oh wow that’s good info

The aero route I’ll probably never get down but maybe it’s possible to be a control engineer for F1 someday. I do that for buildings right now

[prime mortar]

ik it’s boring ASF, but conceptual physics edition 23 chapter 25 and 29 are really good on fluid dynamics

and if your into exhaust stuff chapter 26 is really good on that

[fading cosmos]

so what is the step to learn aerodynamic & cfd properly?

[drifting bough]

You need the foundation of math and physics..

[fading cosmos]

i have it but, idk what is the next step

[fading cosmos]

should i learn fluid mechanic first or just learn it from aerodynamics fundamental book?

[drifting bough]

So you have taken calculus 1,2,3, differential equations, physics 1,2,3?

You need to understand derivatives and integrals like it's second nature

Or when you open any legit aerodynamics book, your going to get lost eventually.

You're *

Engineering isn't software, you can't learn it on YouTube. You have to go to a university and study your ass off 24/7 for 4 years just to get a basic foundation of everything in the degree path.

It changes the way you think, how you problem solve, and how you see everyday things.

But to answer your question, just read the aerodynamics book and see how far you can take it before you start to feel lost in it.

[tall wyvern]

It’s not all the same

Which is why the best aerodynamics text book is ‘understanding aerodynamics - arguing from the real physics’ by D McLean

It’s the most intuitive book and he proves and disproves things which even other textbooks say. It gives you a feel for the content rather than just spouting maths at you

[drifting bough]

Aerodynamics do not care whether it's a fuselage of an aircraft at 30,000 feet or the body of am F1 car at sea level. Physics and math is going to govern it. All am F1 car does it utilize inverted airfoils to generate downforce.....instead of lift.

It's all the same. Any mechanical engineer will tell you that.

[tall wyvern]

Are you saying transonic flight is the same as a car millimetres from the ground?

[drifting bough]

I'm not doing this. You don't get it. Goodluck.

[tall wyvern]

lol

I’m an aerodynamicist

But nice attempt at a holier-than-thou I’m-so-smart lecture

[drifting bough]

You don't sound like one based off thr way you soeak

[tall wyvern]

Read this again and tell me thst

[drifting bough]

And no one calls themselves a fucking aerodynamicist. You are either an engineer or you're not.

What problem do you have with my statement?

[tall wyvern]

Oh that’s interesting

My job title is literally aerodynamicist

Don’t talk about what you don’t know unless you want to learn rather than lecture

[drifting bough]

Do you have an engineering degree?

[tall wyvern]

Obviously

[drifting bough]

You don't sound like it. But I don't really care.

I honestly think you're full of shit. And the fact you are trying to paste in algorithmic LinkedIn junk as if it has any relationship to your professional development is in itself comical

[tall wyvern]

Because I don’t act like it’s some super secret knowledge that only I am smart enough to know?

[tall wyvern]

Oh so you get searched for by f1 teams to do you? For the job title of aerodynamicist? (Which for some reason you think doesn’t exist)

I’ve somehow manipulated LinkedIn to show me to those teams even though it’s nothing related to me?

[drifting bough]

Mom said diners ready. You better go now.

Eat your veggies or no ice cream

[tall wyvern]

Very mature. Hilarious way to behave when you get called out.

[drifting bough]

I have a BSME and an MSME. You couldn't ask me a single question I couldn't answer.

Like I said Goodluck.

[tall wyvern]

Hahahah what a weird thing to say.

Except, apparently, what’s going on with the floors in F1. The side floor? Something to do with outlets? wtf?

[drifting bough]

I said teams are designing floors that channel flow out to the floor edges.

And the floor bodies

Not sure how else I can articulate that for you

[tall wyvern]

The floor edges and the floor ‘bodies’? Why? Channel flow out from where?

[rotund kelp]

.warn 1058572409860534363 technical ban because this channel isn’t for arguing or being rude. Try again in 6 months.

[paper wing]

lfod_0311 has been warned, this is their first warning.

[rotund kelp]

It’s spelled “dinner” btw, a diner is a restaurant

[fading cosmos]

i'm already learn it, i'm mechanical engineering student

[fading cosmos]

i looked at linkedin and i saw aerodynamicist and aerodynamics designer. does an aerodynamics designer need to learn and understand aerodynamics like aerodynamicist

[tall wyvern]

No but an understanding is very beneficial. For example - you have a wing which you have to manufacture in two parts. Where do you put the split line to have the minimal impact on the wind tunnel results?

[fading cosmos]

i really confused where i must start learning aerodynamics

do you have book references?

[tall wyvern]

The best ones (recommended by Mercedes aero department)

• understanding aerodynamics- arguing from the real physics by Doug McLean (my favourite)
• aerodynamics for engineering students by Houghton (second favourite, looks prettier than McLean so nice to cross reference)
• fundamentals of aerodynamics by Anderson (university classic but I don’t like it, way too dense)

For cars specifically,

• race car aerodynamics by J katz (literally the textbook, also f1 recommended but better to use it alongside a ‘real’ aero textbook so the physics make sense.
• competition car aerodynamics by Mcbeath (fun book, very specific compared to katz with cfd showing everything he says so you can really visualise)

[fading cosmos]

Do I have to understand 100% of all the book?

thank you for the recommendation

[tall wyvern]

No, but that’s why it’s helpful to have more than one. Say you don’t really get something in the Houghton book - maybe you’ll be able to make sense of the same thing written in the McLean book.

I think that also helps with understanding generally because you aren’t regurgitating information the way it’s written in a particular book, and also you avoid misunderstandings based on the way something might be described confusingly in a particular book.

The most obvious example I can think of is how induced drag works - most people think (and this is the way lots of textbooks describe it) it’s from huge wingtip vortices that roll up purely on the tips. This is wrong, the vorticity comes from every single point on the trailing edge as sheets, which then roll up themselves into what we know as wingtip vortices.

This is wrong

This is right

[fading cosmos]

so that's why learning from 'understanding aerodynamics- arguing from the real physics' by Doug very important?

are there lots of misunderstandings in textbooks?

[fading cosmos]

yeah, i've seen lot of this concept before and I just knew it was wrong

[tall wyvern]

Yes exactly. There’s not so much ‘this is the case because I say so’, it’s all reasoned.

[tall wyvern]

Amazingly yes

McLean has an entire chapter about all the wrong explanations of low how lift is produced.

[fading cosmos]

is that enough for understand aerodynamics?

what i need to get a job at f1 team? i have good basic at catia

[opaque arch]

It seems I got the wrong understanding, learnt sth new today

[opaque arch]

Python as well

[granite tundra]

"study your ass off 24/7" hahahahahahaahahahahahaha

[edgy anchor]

Time to BLAT

[violet shard]

bro got that “im god and if you dispute your wrong” ahh attitude

[long crystal]

so nice mate

i hope you find your way to F1

[west nimbus]

Yeah but he has a BSME and an MSME. You couldn't ask him a single question he couldn't answer.

Do not forget that 🙄

He IS the allknowing

[opaque arch]

bro already left the server anyways

[west nimbus]

Thank god

[rugged mortar]

2012, 2016, 2017, 2021 and 2024 cars in succession

[craggy moon]

the 2021 cars look more like the 2020 cars, they dont have the tapered floor edge in the back that was part of the reg changes for 2021 to reduce downforce in order to keep the tires happy

otherwise amazing work

are they modeled off any team in particular?

[rugged mortar]

well they are tapered, it's not so obvious in 3d perspective

[rugged mortar]

the 2012 car is by me, modelled in cad, the 2016 and 2017 are by perrinn, the 2021 is the leaked FW43B and the 2024 is the W15 pulled off of the merc site

the first three are generic designs that comply with the legality boxes, the remaining two are the FW43B and W15

[raven dock]

@rugged mortar i can give you a 2026 car

[paper wing]

Congrats @raven dock, you're now on lap 10

[rugged mortar]

wait is this bait lol, really you can?

[raven dock]

made this

[amber kraken]

The way Kimi puts the hammer down. I often wonder if they are drivers that has similar throttle applications

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzcuUQbCIOM&ab_channel=CiaronSmith

[dim mango]

Interesting note i just realised; Haas are still using last year's Ferrari engines

[raven dock]

the 2026 cars have a rectangular shaped exhaust instead of a cylindrical one

[eager stratus]

you mean the tip of the exhaust or the full exhaust system?

[raven dock]

hang on a sec

I'm not sure about the full exhaust system

but the outer bit is like

that

[eager stratus]

it might be just the tip

[raven dock]

either way

it's gonna change the sound of the car

[eager stratus]

it will definitely change mainly because of new engine regulations

[raven dock]

even just the exhaust can make a significant difference in the sound of an engine

[eager stratus]

yep, just hoping it will still sounds good despite new engine regs

[raven dock]

it's annoying

I know what the engine would sound like with the current exhausts

but not the new ones

oh well

finished the newer livery

[eager stratus]

is that the exact render of the 2026 cars?

[raven dock]

still tempted to add another arch to the front wing because there isn't anything in the restrictions about adding a whole plane

[raven dock]

yep

[eager stratus]

the nose part up to the front wing hasnt sink in my mind yet lol

im not sure if im a fan of that lol

[raven dock]

it makes me think of f2004

[eager stratus]

but surely not the endplates

[raven dock]

no

just the shape of the wing

[eager stratus]

these cars should fit beautifully around monaco circuit lol

[raven dock]

uh

uhm

a small electronics problem and these cars are NOT turning

I can't wait for December next year, where I get to pit my car from this restriction series vs fangio

[eager stratus]

steering angle is reduced?

[raven dock]

the wings move to change downforce

it's like breaking your front and rear wings both off

[eager stratus]

got it, sounds like a slower lap times

[raven dock]

possibly, only slightly around a circuit like monza

[amber kraken]

So Pierre and Alex couldn't get into grips with their Red Bulls due to the RB15 and RB16 fitting more of Max's driving style, while Checo performed decently in the RB16B. I guess due to Checo's experience he was more used to the car's driving characteristics though still far from Max's performance in the Red Bull

[raven dock]

probably no lap time around Monaco

[eager stratus]

I always thought Checo suited those kind of f1 cars, maybe mastered during his run at racing point

[raven dock]

I also found out my driving style, and it's fair to say if I was an F1 driver, I'd be besties with the wall

[eager stratus]

and his performance kind of falling off with these smaller cars nowadays

[eager stratus]

as long as you just tap the wall not hit it hard lol

[raven dock]

I don't know how, but I've adapted to a style of tapping the throttle, stabbing it, and then flooring it out a corner, all while using very linear steering

like a cracked up lovechild of senna and schumacher

it does mean that I don't really need to follow any line, but it also means a line would do great

"he's not defending, just hoping no one attacks while he does his thing"

[eager stratus]

50/50 huh

it will naturally change your style if someones attacking and you're force to defend

[long crystal]

this 3d model is everywhere in the internet

My friend did this model

Qvist Design

the same who already published the Reference Volumes and Surfaces of 2026 rules

[eager stratus]

Render is clean, easy to understand the aero

[civic fern]

That actually looks pretty good

[long crystal]

by Qvist Design

[lost jungle]

that's also according to the new regs?

[hollow kettle]

Looks like it

[long crystal]

yes

[karmic gate]

Dude

No pic before release

[karmic gate]

Damn

[karmic gate]

Hehe thanks

Some clean renders soon

[long crystal]

Sorry mate 😭

[karmic gate]

Why did you not ask me

[tall wyvern]

crash structures will ruin your fun

[karmic gate]

I did make them too

Within regulations

On mm

And a low quality radiator

[tall wyvern]

they fit inside that sidepod and floor?

[karmic gate]

Yes

I have halo and side impact struktur and space for roll hop

And front is easy

[tall wyvern]

I mean they fit inside the bodywork that you’ve drawn? I’m surprised the sidepod and floor are thick enough

[karmic gate]

And rear to

[karmic gate]

Ye they fit

[tall wyvern]

Wow good job

Is the inlet under the rear halo junction legal?

[karmic gate]

Floor are a bit higher in front so impact structure fit

[karmic gate]

Yes

Intake need to be with in 3 boxes

3 specific

[tall wyvern]

What is it? Bodywork aperture?

[tall wyvern]

i can't see that legal anywhere, are you including it as part of the roll hoop inlet?

[karmic gate]

A mid chassis inlet

[tall wyvern]

the only mid chassis inlets are the cockpit entry and the roll hoop inlet

[karmic gate]

what do you mean

[tall wyvern]

go to apertures in the rules

the only aperture in the mid chassis is the cockpit entry and the roll hoop inlet

and strap but that's the top obviously

[karmic gate]

F, I'm so stupid

How the f did I not see that part

To late

[karmic gate]

working on removing it😭

[civic fern]

Is “Aerodynamicist” a general title for someone working in Aero?

Asking cuz in my industry we would have one guy pulling out CAD, another running CFD, and a third guy shoving it into the wind tunnel. And a 4th guy whos supposed to be Subject Matter Expert on aerodynamics

[tall wyvern]

In F1 aerodynamicists are all of those, but then there are surfacers who are CAD wizards that do the fancy stuff, CFD methodologists who fiddle with the CFD itself, and aero methods (/experimental/wind tunnel depending on the team) who work out how to best run the tunnel and associated methods. But an aerodynamicist does cad, submits cfd cases, analyses the results, does wind tunnel runs, releases parts, then repeats.

[fading cosmos]

may i ask you??

[karmic gate]

Ask what

[fading cosmos]

how to read f1 technical regulation

[pastel cape]

Sup

[karmic gate]

Ok

Ask

[fading cosmos]

What is the first thing I should read in the technical regulations? And which part should I work on first?

[karmic gate]

First, what will you do

Make f1 car 3d model?

[fading cosmos]

yeah, make the 3d model

[karmic gate]

Start with getting regulations volume

And go yo every bodypart sections in regulations and see what you are allowed to do

[fading cosmos]

ok, i'll start to read that

thanks

[karmic gate]

Sorry for no detailed description

[fading cosmos]

it's ok, for the next step can I ask you again?

[karmic gate]

Idk

[karmic gate]

I am not good at helping other people

[fading cosmos]

Just help as much as you're able, that's more than enough

[civic fern]

lmao so what i hear is you've got the exact opposite. you have one guy taking ownership of designing faster parts and 3 SMEs to support the workflow (CAD expert, CFD expert, testing expert) but i have 1 SME and 3 people playing hot potato. the CAD people for example would never touch CFD, let alone see the inside of a wind tunnel

[karmic gate]

f1 2026 concept within technical regulations by FIA

[gritty sun]

does anyone here uses fusion 360? or any other 3d modelling software

i have to design a space settlement for a competition

[karmic gate]

i use blender

[viral harness]

I use fusion

[fading cosmos]

✋

[gritty sun]

how do i make a space settlement

i have to make something similar to these two

[opaque arch]

whats this for

what comp

[gritty sun]

ARSSDC

[zinc bison]

What wind tunnel is Haas using at the moment?

[quiet mantle]

Ferrari

[torn cradle]

guys my teacher is helping me get into the F1 in schools program but it prefers I have previous motorsport/STEM projects under my belt. do you guys have any idea of ones I could do? thank you

[half egret]

Well it depends what kind of projects they need. You could code like a live standings or they need like a project RC car?

But also, can't people join without any experience? That sounds too harsh ig

[torn cradle]

it is optional but prefered

[opaque arch]

tbh just learn how to use CAD

and that will be good enough

most people know nothing before the competition

and also read the regulations

[rich hatch]

if you mean the thing where you build a car to get fired down a track, you dont need motorsport or stem for that

if they insist, ask if you can help in designing a livery or uniform or something, maybe find a sponsor

[torn cradle]

thank you all

[raven dock]

rear exhaust slightly too short, could cause to go slower, depending on if you have an engine too

Also try flip the sidepods down, you want higher pressure around the entry I think

the best I came up with so far was this

[raven dock]

I'm working on making a league, where people build their own cars depending on what kind of spec is running for the season, and the cars get tested against each other

[karmic gate]

I made it as long as the regulations allow it

[raven dock]

just sorta slapped it together, or planned it out and looked at the aeros?

[high thunder]

Computer Aided Depression?....🤣

[raven dock]

pretty much...

[stray ibex]

does anyone have a formula for tyre degradation? or at least know how to narrow down a formula

[marble stirrup]

I would follow some online tutorials. Coding would be easier if you have some experience (LLMs can also help). Other than that, you could download Blender or some other CAD software and follow a motorsport-related tutorial. I don't think it's necessary, but if you need something quick and easy, do something like that. You could make some quick analysis tools using Fast-F1 or similar too.

gl hf

[marble stirrup]

This is a huge area of research and simulation. I don't think there is a simple answer. Most formulas/ models of note are not available publicly, and you probably cannot replicate them without significant tooling and infrastructure. If you want to look into it more you can start with Pacejka models. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_B._Pacejka

Also, a good paper to start with. It depends on how in-depth you want to go. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/342319061_Application_of_Monte_Carlo_Methods_to_Consider_Probabilistic_Effects_in_a_Race_Simulation_for_Circuit_Motorsport

[upper ivy]

There are free CAD-specific programs, Blender is more for organic modelling tbh

[stray ibex]

tysm, Ill check them out

[marble stirrup]

I suppose it depends on what you want to do. F1 teams use blender for specific tasks. It's simple and free. The geometries aren't suited for simulations though.

[marble stirrup]

no worries

[fading cosmos]

blender? really?

[marble stirrup]

Depends on what you are doing. I can’t say more than this. Just make sure you are using the right tool for the task (often times more complex tools are not required)

[fading cosmos]

like what? i really don't know if they use blender for design

[spice dune]

is red bull upgrading anything for US GP?

[quiet mantle]

Red Bull are bringing upgrades, same as Ferrari and Haas (I think)

[last stone]

I’m just praying RBs don’t get overshadowed by McLarens again 😭

[quiet mantle]

I’m praying for it, I want a WDC fight that’s decided in Abu Dhabi

[prime mortar]

so question on this, i guess we are keeping the skinny side pods going into 26? i’ve heard some people say some teams could be going back to the 2021 side pods

the concepts for the alpine style side pods we have right now are similar to the 2011 mclaren. obviously 21 was a different aero reg.

[karmic gate]

in 2026 will they have as big undercut as possible like in 2021

and like i did

[prime mortar]

in 21 most teams were still running the small side pods?

all teams actually. alfa was running a bigger side pod

[karmic gate]

i think it will be somthing like mercedes 2021 or the one i did

[tall wyvern]

Why?

[prime mortar]

my opinion is that the less dependency on ground effects means the the need for air to be directed over the floor is why

[tall wyvern]

Pretty big changes including two new components

[opaque arch]

rendering and ads

[long crystal]

mostly

if the floor is gonna be plain as it was in 2021

im pretty sure yeah

the rear wing is gonna have the same shape

too

or maybe idk

maybe the overbite still there but the end of sidepod are old style

https://x.com/bensrac32/status/1847361802184667206

Ben (@bensrac32) on X

Modified F124 W15 3d model to include the new upgraded sidepod inlet, with an overbite style like RB20. Also the new cockpit shape introduced at Baku (which I also did in the same day it was introduced)

Twitter · Oct 18, 2024, 7:39 PM

[tall wyvern]

Literally nobody knows what the sidepods will look like and anybody that says so is completely guessing

[karmic gate]

Because you want to get a clean airflow to the insideof the car

I have even talked with a engineer

[tall wyvern]

Then why not have super skinny sidepods?

[karmic gate]

you can but it do not work with all engines

and maybe want some separation form top of sidepod and upper sidepod so you maybe can get some small amount of downforce from sidepod

[tall wyvern]

the reason the undercut exists is because there is no front tyre wake control in these regulations which means the sidepods are as wide as possible, but with that undercut to allow energy to the back of the car. the 26 regs have a gigantic bargeboard and totally different front tyre furniture so the wide sidepod might not be necessary.

everything is speculation

[karmic gate]

there is no reason to do the same in 2024 because they have no beam wing or big diffuser or areo part on wheel hub

[opaque arch]

3dx is big as

[tall wyvern]

It’s not only the beam wing. Before 2022 there were bargeboards doing a similar job.

[karmic gate]

blender are only 300 MB

[tall wyvern]

Blender isn’t cad

[opaque arch]

blender is a rendering / animation software

[karmic gate]

it is a 3d modeling software

[karmic gate]

it i polygon modeling

i use blender

[karmic gate]

for this

[karmic gate]

3dx max re not cad too

[tall wyvern]

Whaaaaat

[opaque arch]

3dx is catia v6 mate

[karmic gate]

maya are better for animation an render then blender and bleder are better for modeling

but blender cycles are still a realistic render engine, maya are just a bit better

[opaque arch]

how does that relate to 3dx

[karmic gate]

i dont know anmything about 3dx

ooo i did think you did talk about 3ds max

what is 3dx?

[karmic gate]

i just use maye as a reference in this argument that blender are good

with polygon modeling are blender the best

[opaque arch]

3dx is basically catia

3d Experience

[tall wyvern]

Polygon modelling isn’t how f1 cars are drawn though

[karmic gate]

i know

[karmic gate]

but every team have someone that re make the model as polygon model so they can do renders with it

you need polygon models for renders and games

[opaque arch]

ye

a light stl model would do the job tho

[karmic gate]

it would be hard to work with

and it would be to low qualety or to high

[opaque arch]

i mean u can render in catia

[karmic gate]

not the same as a real render engine

[opaque arch]

good enough

[karmic gate]

you cant do UV for livery on a cad model

[opaque arch]

u can import UV

[karmic gate]

import?

i know the dude that make the offical polygon model for formula E

[opaque arch]

how does that relate once again

[karmic gate]

to sum it all up, both cad and polygon modeling are important but cad is for things to be manufactured but polygon models are for advertising or other renders/ showcasing

[tall wyvern]

Cad outweighs polygonal models 100x, the car itself comes from cad.

[karmic gate]

i dont mean in f1 i mean in general

[gritty sun]

does anyone here knows how to use fusion 360?

i need some guidance for the drawing part

how do i make drawings of individual components on the same sheet? how do i even draw individual components in the first place ?

[gritty sun]

i want to make drawings of each component seperately on the same page

[civic fern]

Does your model already exist?

I.e. are you making 2D drawings of an existing 3D object or are you trying to build something from the ground up?

[civic fern]

That seems insanely big wtf

[fading cosmos]

import the base view, and hide the other part you don't want to draw

[gritty sun]

of an existing one

[sturdy lantern]

Does anyone know which Airfoils do current year cars use? Both for front wing and rear wing

[tall wyvern]

Completely bespoke

[rugged mortar]

Like beam wing said completely bespoke, however as a starting point for you to look into, teams really put heavy emphasis on vortex generation and generally have thin profiles when compared to aircrafts so you can try to look into NACA 4-digit series of airfoils when it comes to the front wing for the lack of transparency by the teams in this field of research as everything is proprietary

[viral harness]

Is this COTA to Mexico

[prime mortar]

yes mexico usually has some crazy cooling packages

[viral harness]

I knew they have crazy cooling but damn

At this point they have to have changed the under body too

[stiff linden]

Im amazed every time how much they can change of a car in one week

[iron shale]

Yes

[weak sparrow]

Has anyone got any pics of the cooling packages other teams have brought?

[viral harness]

They start making the part way before they need it, they’ve probably been working on it for a couple weeks, designing and manufacturing it

Over the break

[rugged mortar]

https://fxtwitter.com/Reel_SonoDas/status/1849569913221824768

[tall wyvern]

Definitely not, ‘slower air’ is meaningless without mass flow. The slowing down is done after the inlet in the diffuser section.

[long crystal]

F1 spanish engineer Toni Cuquerella said F1 might reach 400kmh here in 2026 with the new regulations

wow

[static breach]

Oh wow

[upper ivy]

I kinda doubt that

[opaque arch]

MGUK Deployment wont allow that

as soon as the car hits 350kmh MGUK deployment drops significantly

[amber kraken]

I'm curious to know how the 2026 Regulations were "updated" so the new gen cars could be at least 2 seconds faster. Also 2 seconds faster than the current Ground Effect cars, isn't that near pre-2022 levels of speed and lap time

https://au.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1s-2026-cars-now-two-seconds-faster-after-rule-tweaks/10664813/

[opaque arch]

i think that 2 seconds means 2 seconds faster than 2026 v1 regulations

[tall wyvern]

The rules are public, you can just read them. https://www.fia.com/regulation/category/110

They are very different to the previous set. The front wing box is bigger, the endplate is higher and the endplate body box is wider, the endplate fence is now a diveplane, there’s a completely new strake under the front wing, the floor is much bigger, the foot is wider, the bib is wider with a sharper edge, the board can be three sections now and has a new brace to the chassis, there’s a new leading edge device on the floor which will be 5 strakes, the diffuser is longer and starts earlier, the rear wing box is bigger, the inboard face of the endplate box is further inboard, the engine cover box (which includes sidepods now) is wider. That’s all off the top of my head, nearly everything has changed for more performance, and there will be at least one new set before January, possibly two, since some bits still don’t make any sense and some bits are still left out (wheel furniture)

[opaque arch]

so thats basically a new car

[rugged mortar]

I still wish they stuck with a major emphasis on ground effect tunnels, the fia prolly succumbed to the teams' issues and complains with porpoising and the backmarker teams not having as sophisticated floors as the top teams rn or something

[long crystal]

I mean he said Mexico

I think it's the only track that might expect that speed

because the height

[faint flicker]

Anyone notice this technique some were using?

Never thought I'd see the gutter run technique used in the top level of motorsports 😄

[viral harness]

How long does it take to CAD a whole car

[opaque arch]

Half a year to get a surface model by myself, I work about 2 hours each week

[olive ore]

Given you have enough volume of air for what you’re trying to cool. If you slow down air speed enough to the right speed. You reduce turbulence in vortices but more importantly you give the air enough time to absorb the heat. Allowing for proper heat exchange. The same principle works in the opposite direction. Too fast of an airflow will heat up the body you’re trying to cool via friction. The only problem with this comes when you must achieve the right air speed so that the air exchanges heat BUT also exits quickly enough to allow new air to come in. Too slow and you’re working backwards.

[olive ore]

This is an essential driving technique. If you’re not cutting every corner on the track you’re not going to be achieving any sort of speed period. It’s comparing apples and oranges.

[faint flicker]

Yeah the times showed it too

I honestly wish more tracks would impliment smthn like that

lowering the outside of the curb so the wheels can hook onto the curb like that

godlike turning speed

[tall wyvern]

Vortices are more or less irrelevant in this context, as is aerodynamic heating for these subsonic speeds.

[olive ore]

Vortices keep air in a certain area for longer. That’s bad for cooling. Faster airspeeds cause more turbulence. Think of it like merging into traffic that’s moving at a high speed. The faster that traffic is moving the harder it is to merge in, therefore air will just “stay in the merge lane” and go in circles, because it’s easier to do that than merge.

Air usually begins to heat a surface (Against all odds!) At about 600mph. Anything below that, air will still create friction and heat, but it can be overcome by the temperature of the air or object in motion.

But then again at 600mph, air doesn’t care what temperature it or the object is. It creates heat regardless.
I used that as a principle example that air causes friction and creates heat no matter what speed. But the faster the air speed, the more friction.

And not just friction, but also turbulence. And also less time for heat exchange.

And even if you achieved successful heat exchange, the turbulence will keep the hot air from escaping for longer.

[karmic spade]

colapinto complaining about his steering going stiff, then soft, stiff then soft, is that likely to be the rack and pinion or the power assisted part of the steering?

or is there no way to really know

[tall wyvern]

Are you confusing vortices with recirculation? Vortices still have a bulk movement.

[bright hemlock]

quick question: does pirelli provide tyres to a team when they test their cars in a wind tunnel?

[rugged mortar]

yes

[opaque arch]

years before, pirelli provide couple types of wind tunnel tyres but now there is only one. They used to provide corner tyres, straight line tyres, etc

[rugged mortar]

Gordon Murray's proposal for 2012 cars to promote overtaking instead of the need for gimmicks like DRS

[karmic gate]

2026 regulations Issue 9 vs Issue 8

[karmic gate]

now can you see

[elfin harness]

Dk you have a full visualisation ?

[karmic gate]

pic of full car?

[elfin harness]

Yup

[elfin harness]

That sidepod looks significantly different

[karmic gate]

it can be very diffirent but i like this one

[elfin harness]

It looks cool

Nice visualisation though

[karmic gate]

thanks

i try my best to understand the regulations

[olive ore]

Vortices in airflow are disturbances. They’re bad for getting air to enter and exit efficiently.

That’s why we have different valve cuts. We can add more “steps” to a valve seat, this allows air to flow with less vortex because 5 small angles is much less aggressive to the flow of air than 3 large angles.

Allowing air to enter and exit the chamber quickly.

[olive ore]

In theory these things sound reasonable however, overtaking happens multiple times a lap in Indycar, crashes are a frequent occurrence. And Indycar has taken into consideration none of these things with the intent of making overtaking more common. The problem lies within the over-regulation, the punishment, and even the societal backlash that follows with overtaking in the F1 scene. Problem isn’t the car, it’s F1.

Why? Because if you told any of the drivers out there, that they could risk the car, to overtake another driver. And no one would judge them for it. They’d do it in a heartbeat. Why don’t we see drivers going through the grass to make a pass for the lead like Dale Earnhardt? The answer has nothing to do with the cars. It’s because the sport has a problem with traditional forms of racing where no fucks are given as long as you’re holding a trophy.

That is why the sport will eventually die. And who knows, maybe they’re running so low on money they can’t afford to swap body panels. Maybe their problem is that they spend too much money on cars, or maybe it’s because their sponsors are afraid of social media backlash. Or maybe it’s just because Formula One no longer embodies the racing spirit.

Perhaps if you threw in a few more American drivers it’d be entertaining again. 😂

[elfin harness]

WOOO I SAW YOU ON A VIDEO

https://youtu.be/FrC4Gy-c1xE?si=F-B5Y755NFXQCKSM

[karmic gate]

oooooomg

😱

thanks for showing

[elfin harness]

Glad to be of help !!,

[feral flame]

WAIT YOU'RE THE ONE IN F1UNCHAINED'S VIDEO?

YOUR DESIGNS ARE SOO GOOD

[karmic gate]

yeeee😎

[karmic gate]

thanks

[short ether]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIt20DAVbwI Amazing video on how a Formula 1 car is started

[spring egret]

.regs

[paper wing]

F1 Regulations

FIA Formula One World Championship Regulations

All F1 regulations documents subject to change, see link in title for most recent versions

Sporting Regulations

2022 Formula 1 — Sporting Regulations — Issue 3

Technical Regulations

2022 Formula 1 — Technical Regulations — Issue 8

Financial Regulations

2021 Formula 1 — Financial Regulations — Issue 8

FIA Sporting Code

2022 FIA — International Sporting Code

Last Updated · Jan 14, 2022, 12:00 PM

[jade swan]

.regs

[paper wing]

F1 Regulations

FIA Formula One World Championship Regulations

All F1 regulations documents subject to change, see link in title for most recent versions

Sporting Regulations

2024 Formula 1 — Sporting Regulations — Issue 7

Technical Regulations

2024 Formula 1 — Technical Regulations — Issue 8

Financial Regulations

2024 Formula 1 — Financial Regulations — Issue 21

FIA Sporting Code

2024 FIA — International Sporting Code

Last Updated · Oct 29, 2024, 9:00 PM

[prime mortar]

your yapping way too much. the sport will get bigger if they allow teams to actually innovate rather than deem everything illegal and kill the technical aspect of this sport. there are so many things we havent discovered bc regs are getting in the way

[viral harness]

But you do sometimes what vortices

[opaque arch]

bro they are spending 100mil per year now - thats damn cheap when u compare to previous years and dont forgot about inflation

100mil is nothing for those manufacturers - they are not broke

[opaque arch]

whats bro yapping about look at max's dive bombs, Kyats torpedoes, Michael's defense.......

[opaque arch]

bro watched f1 from tik tok reels

[feral flame]

Fr

[olive ore]

An overtake every 2 laps is not entertainment. Indycar has multiple overtakes a lap and frequent crashes.

[olive ore]

100m per year is considered broke in formula development.

Not sure where you got that figure from, but that’s pretty low.

[tall wyvern]

Not true, eddies yes, vortices no.

The scale is far too small at a valve seat for any kind of discrete vortex, but small turbulent eddies yes.

[olive ore]

They’re the same thing in this context. The vortex is made up of eddies.

[tall wyvern]

No they aren’t, vortices don’t imply turbulence, and what you are talking about is literally just turbulence.

[opaque arch]

That's the budget cap bro 😂

[karmic spade]

is this what you made? either way it looks very interesting

gives a better visualisation than the dark images provided by the FIA 🤣

[karmic gate]

yes i made it

[zinc bison]

If Lando wins the WDC, how many times has a driver won their first race and first championship in the same year?

My concrete knowledge goes as far back as about 84, could it be Piquet?

No, he took some wins in 1980

I believe it's Keke Rosberg if anyone wants to confirm

[prime mortar]

jacques villneuve

[zinc bison]

He won races in 1996 and the title in 97 so not him

[prime mortar]

oh

whoops

hm

i guess ascari

[opaque arch]

@karmic gate is 0,0,0 at XF = 0? I am confused

[karmic gate]

If it dont say ant X then it Is in 0,0,0 global location

[opaque arch]

where is global

btw how do u do this in blender since it's not CAD

do u have points and wireframe

[karmic gate]

0,0,0 in wourld space

[karmic gate]

you can do this in any software as long you have the knowledge

[karmic gate]

everything is exact on mm

[rugged mortar]

blender also uses the right handed Cartesian coordinate system just like the technical regs instructions are given in

[opaque arch]

issue 9

[karmic gate]

i think you can change it

[short ether]

Why McLarens new rear wing able to have soup poured on it.

[rugged mortar]

Made the 2026 ICE, the grey one is the 2022 version and the blue one is the 2026 version

Looks nice in the car

[karmic gate]

Do you need to do higher connections in 2026?

[karmic gate]

Is this my file?

[rugged mortar]

nope, these reference planes aren't specific to yours

I had to make these planes to gauge where to place my engine

[karmic gate]

The halo did look like my

[rugged mortar]

You sure about that?

[karmic gate]

No

This is much better then my

Where you did get it?

[feral topaz]

What app do you do this on ? ( website)

[buoyant pollen]

can someonr explain the why when air is squeezed and accelerates (venturi effect) it creates a low pressure? usually I would think it would be high pressure. Even if watching a few million videos explaining it i cant get it to comply together in my head. I would convince myself its because it influences the air around it to go along and so it sucks the air around it representing low pressure kinda, but they still sound wrong. if anyone can explain that'll be appreciated

[rugged mortar]

As the speed of a fluid increases, its pressure decreases and vice versa, why? Think about it in terms of energy conservation, air or any fluid has two main types of energy, they're kinetic and pressure energy. The total energy must remain constant. So if one form increases, the other must decrease. It's like a trade off. When a fluid is forced through a narrow space a water hose in this case the same amount of fluid must pass through a smaller area, to accomplish this the fluid must speed up at the pinch point you create in a garden hose, this increase in speed means more kinetic energy and since total energy stays constant, pressure energy must decrease, thus we get lower pressure.

The pinch point at the end of the garden is indeed a high pressure point but since there is no restriction on beyond that pinch point the water gushes out and expands. It is indeed being squeezed but the key is that once it's moving, we're looking at a steady state condition where the velocity necessitates lower pressure to main energy conservation. This high pressure is what forces the fluid to accelerate, the pressure drops because the energy is now in the form of speed.

[buoyant pollen]

And so as the pressure energy has to decrease, it is basically lower pressure and that sucks other stuffs around it right?

[rugged mortar]

yeah there have to be high pressure zones for the low pressure to suck. All the vortices being generated from wings and the pressure gradients of managing this balance of high to low pressure is tricky in F1, all the upper bodywork and the floor diffuser work together, the high energy flow generated from the bodywork meets with the airflow that's coming out of the diffuser and when they meet the high pressure bodywork accelerates the low pressure flow coming out of the diffuser, fluids moves from high pressure to low pressure

Low pressure airflow coming out of the diffuser is nothing without some flow that energizes it, diffusers without any help would have expansion, slow down and lose energy. The high pressure air from the upper bodywork attaches with the diffuser to energize it and accelerate that flow.

[buoyant pollen]

so in the case of the diffuser, the concept of generating downforce from it is not entirely based on lowering the pressure only in the diffuser, but using the high pressure air from above to keep it attached for speed and create that high low pressure suction correct?

[rugged mortar]

yeah

in F1 or cars in general, they have inverted wings and the underside of the wing is the low pressure area it's the opposite for aircrafts

Energy isn't created or destroyed, it changes forms from high pressure/low velocity to low pressure/high velocity. It just changes forms between velocity and pressure. It's this synergy that's been harnessed. This is just fluid dynamics 101

[buoyant pollen]

ooo okay, this helps explain alot of my questions in my mind. Really appreciate it

are you studying in fluid dynamics or something college/university?

[rugged mortar]

nah I'm just an armchair aero engineer who likes the technical side of F1

[buoyant pollen]

thats very interesting. may I ask what do you work on for the aero engineering?

[rugged mortar]

nothing really besides my own F1 CAD modelling adventures and doing openfoam CFD simulation on F1 models or taking part in the mantium virtual racing championship

[buoyant pollen]

thats cool. nice to meet ya. and thanks again for the information, that clarifies alot of things

[rugged mortar]

glad to be of help

[viral harness]

Not necessarily F1 but I just joined my school robotics team, anyone have tips for being a more efficient member of the build team or should I just wait and gain experience

Or anyone have CAD tips, that’s my official role on the team or going to be soon

[opaque arch]

like where is 0, 0, 0 reference at

[tall wyvern]

Good explanation generally, but this part doesn’t make sense. Expansion is exactly the point of the diffuser - to decelerate the flow to as close to freestream as possible. The use of high pressure around bodywork is that it acts as a pushing force for tyre wake. The mechanism by which air loses total energy (total pressure) is viscosity, not expansion/slowing down. All the shear in the air takes energy out via shear stresses.

The other thing I would clarify is language. The kinetic energy you mention is still a form of pressure, and it’s confusing to say the total energy is split between kinetic energy and pressure because of this. The terms are total pressure (total energy), dynamic pressure (kinetic energy) and static pressure (what you just called pressure).

[tall wyvern]

Literally whenever you want, the boxes which start at places like 0 0 0 are for small bits like hangers, which are positioned once the bigger bits they fit onto are drawn, hence the boxes are just for size, rather than position.

[rugged mortar]

aight thanks for the clarification, but like does the high pressure from the bodywork still need to meet with the diffuser to energize it?

[short ether]

So why is the halo only there to protect whats matters most, because a debris that's perfect in size can just slot through there severely injuring driver.

[quiet mantle]

Halo is designed to stop yourself being crushed when you go top first into a wall or end up upside down

Imagine how much worse Zhou’s incident in Silverstone would have been without it or Hamilton having Verstappen parked on top of him

I don’t think a glass or plastic exists to put into those front gaps that will stop debris flying into you

[upper ivy]

Halo mostly exists to deflect big debris like tyres; and other cars.

For smaller debris, the helmets themselves habe been significantly strengthened in 2011 and then again in 2019

[upper ivy]

They could do it like Indycar

[quiet mantle]

I honestly don’t like that, if they’re upside down and on fire it’ll be hard to get out, I’m unsure if you can kick off those screens if that happens and crawl out

[upper ivy]

the opening on top is the same as in F1, isn't it? The front openings aren't exactly made to be crawled through.

Also rescue teams are at the scene very quickly anyway nowadays. Especially in Indycar

[karmic gate]

Making custom regulations for my 2030 concept

[edgy anchor]

Oh I love that

[bitter summit]

Does anybody know what all the green/yellow light panels that light up next to the grid/pitlane are for?

[karmic gate]

2030 regulations

[vestal depot]

Looked like late 60s cars without front wings

Might as well go all the way and mandate front mounted radiators

[karmic gate]

[rugged mortar]

I wanted to ask, I have the text info box checked in the viewport overlays but the name of the mesh doesn't really show in the viewport like how it does in your planes, what else is there to enable

[karmic gate]

I'm not on pc rn so hard to tell

[karmic gate]

Did you make that

[rugged mortar]

yeah, the hard part was making those damn decals

[rugged mortar]

I think if you just make better PBR textures and decals for this, it would look a lot more convincing

[opaque arch]

if it is not specify - does that mean i can put the front wing sensor wherever i want as long as it's sticked to the front wing

[opaque arch]

C2.8.3 Front Wheel Position
The plane XF=0 must lie between XA = 0 and XA = 150 inclusive. - Where should I put my XF? I know that can i put wherever i want as long as its in the limit but whats an ideal value

[opaque arch]

I am thinking to put XF at about XA=25 so the entire front bodywork would be pushed to the front. Thus the COG would push more to the front and the center of pressure would be more back

the XA and XF is literally at the same point for the mcl 38

[rugged mortar]

aight thanks

[tall wyvern]

You’re looking at the volumes, the actual rules are much earlier.

[opaque arch]

Ahh - i am goofy ahh

making reference volume is actually quite tedious

quite time consuming

[opaque arch]

since some planes are defined by a competitor - does that mean there could be possibly different types of reference volumes

[rugged mortar]

yeah teams will input their wheelbase, front bulkhead and differential locations into the FIA CAD portal, with the volumes autogenerating for download.

[opaque arch]

That's so convenient

[rugged mortar]

also making a comprehensive guide for this wheel, what each button does

[short ether]

What is this device infront of the T-CAM

not the lights

[stark gyro]

isnt that the cooler?

[short ether]

idk It has a camera sensor like thing on it

[stark gyro]

yeah it looks like a camera thing maybe its where you plug the power cables

[blazing saffron]

could be the charger for the T-cam

[delicate thicket]

what does this mean? They are not to have respect to one another? This is also under the insurance section.

[raven dock]

I making my own concept F1 car in accordance to no particular rules

idk whether to go with an airflow that pushes inwards behind the car, or outward

does anyone have any idea on how to make a 3-plane wing aerodynamic

[rugged mortar]

ferrari vs alpine

[opaque arch]

Is that from NX - that does not look from CATIA at all

good effort tho

[rugged mortar]

I am not familiar with any of those CAD software, but both of these were made in blender based off of images

[opaque arch]

Were u an engineer

[rugged mortar]

no lol

I'll try making these soon

[raven dock]

I'm too lazy to do an actual suspension model, because my course is focused on the body work

and I'm pretty sure my teacher hates the class as the aerodynamic restrictions are so open, yet restricting at the same time

[glass anvil]

what sw did u use?

[rugged mortar]

I'll use this fw43b as a base since it has suspensions bits and a pull rod setup just like in the pics

[rugged mortar]

those pics are from merc

[glass anvil]

i see, so like from the merc website?

[rugged mortar]

yeah those rear suspension pics are from their site, you can reverge image search that image and the site will show up

merc also has a video on their youtube about that specific suspension setup

[glass anvil]

sweet! tysm!

[vestal depot]

They should switch to a HUD asp

Lighter and naturally seems like the next technological evolution with the steering wheel

[prime mortar]

wdym hud

like williams had before?

[zinc current]

heads up display probably

like they have in fighter jet helmets

the visor overlays data over what the pilot sees

[vestal depot]

@prime mortar Yeah

[zinc current]

why did williams have the screen off the wheel?

[short ether]

Weight reasons.

[prime mortar]

well I would think the future would gyroscopic MFD's. Sure the hud works and is probably the next if we get rid of the screen on the wheel. But I wouldnt be suprised if we see a gyro display before 2030. The other issue with a Hud is what would it project on? The visor? Increased helmet weight is tougher on the drivers head.

[opaque arch]

Why would u need a gyroscopic MFD when drivers only look at their steering on a straight

[prime mortar]

mid corner adjustments if they get lost

[opaque arch]

drivers rarely do adjustments in mid corner - or i should its never

[opaque arch]

also why would add extra parts and components to sth that works properly and comply the regulations

[opaque arch]

drivers look at the apex at mid corner lmao

like no one looks at steering wheel when turning whether u driving a car, a kart, a bus etc

its pretty much a gimick and if u add a gyroscopic mfd ur steering wheel's mass and size gonna increase by a lot

[edgy anchor]

I do find it funny that the Gyro MFD's rn are mainly like oh no, the giant Gear and speed text that I can read at orientations anyway

[prime mortar]

um im sorry, certain tracks require mid cornern adjustments. tracks with back to back corners like qatar, suzuka, and saudi arabia and parts of cota. ill send a video that breaks down the adjustments fernando alonso made (some of witch mid corner, like apex of the turn) in qatar during quali in 2021. came back to me after watching this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CT2kCuBEObU&t

not only are adjustments made during push laps mid corner. but during warmup laps multiple adjustments are made depending on where in the lap they are, and the prepping needed.

but yes it is true most adjustments are made on straights, and there are also driver preset puttons on the wheel, but you can only use it so many times in a lap.

alex albon discussed with his new williams wheel, that it helped that the screen was on the wheel now beause he was able to see the adjustments more clearly m mid corner. the previous seperate screen design williams had made it tough to make sure your settings were correct mid corner. whether you like it or not, drivers glance at the MFD mid corner. watch a rear facing cockpit cam and tell me how many times they look at the MFD. there are glances at the screen mid corner

and yes not all adjustments need to be checked, most are made while still looking at the track. but for the times you do need to glance down, it is beneficial '

[opaque arch]

Bro when u are at the apex ur head is tilted so the MFD shouldn't even be horizontal relative to the ground so no gyroscopic display

Again the current steering wheels comply with the regulations and they are light

[opaque arch]

Drivers don't look at the screen mid corner, it's dangerous and unnecessary

And u don't need to look at the wheel to press presets right

Have u even done any kind of racing? Even esport drivers don't look at their HUD when turning, so there's no point to make gyroscopic MFD.

[opaque arch]

Have u watched helmet cam f1 before 🤣 ?

[opaque arch]

U sure about that it's a good idea when u are pulling 5GS and u look down on the MFD instead of the apex or corner exit. Also, if it's a back to back corner, u should be looking at the next apex, not looking at ur screen.

Also how does ur point (looking at the steering wheel during mid corner) support gyroscopic mfd? I think u went too far

[deft burrow]

Although they do have very good peripheral vision, which explains how Alonso can miss a mode by one or two clicks and then correct it immediately

[prime mortar]

okay well looking at what your saying and the lack of understanding i’m just going to let you yap. f1 helmet cams aren’t going to have the drivers visibly look down at the mfd. and the cams i’m talking about are the backward facing cam that let you see the driver. there is a pretty popular one of seb in 2014 doing a flying lap at abu dhabi. multiple times thorough out the lap he can be see doing short glances down at the led’s (rb didn’t have a screen that year) to check his settings.

[prime mortar]

raced karts for about 7 years and do quite a bit of sim racing

in fact between the messages i spent and hour and a half on assetto corsa doing a race around melbourne

oh and i also did a weekend f4 racing school but idk that’s just me

[prime mortar]

you make a good point that their peripheral vision is very good. not to add the whole mfd flashes the setting so it’s hard to miss even if your don’t look at it

[opaque arch]

How does this prove ur point "gyroscopical mfd" 💀

Yes ur statement partially makes sense but aren't u trying to prove ur "gyroscopical mfd"

So what are u trying to prove now

[prime mortar]

okay last time i argued with someone who was insufferable i was banned from f1 technical for 6 months. so im going let you settle but my point is that it’s easier for them to look down at the dash if they need to mid corner. and for it to be level rather than tilted. that simple

[opaque arch]

i mean ur head is titled in mid corner so u dont want the mfd to be horizontal

[opaque arch]

This is not a formula car bro and look at the lag

bros typing an essay

[rugged mortar]

yeah there's noticeable lag but it's from a preproduction jesko, the production jeskos respond way better now. It can all be improved at the end of the day, however even this gyroscopic mfd thing doesn't seem like something teams would bother going out of their way to do because the way the F1 wheel's interface is, it's very barebanes without anything fancy designs.

When you start rotating the screen the UI elements shouldn't clip out of the screen, like if you take this image below and start rotating it, it would just clip, for it to not clip stuff would need to be heavily refactored and I don't think teams want to have a whole UI team putting an emphasis on a design that's spherical so it doesn't clip out of the screen.

[opaque arch]

that's literally what i have said

[rugged mortar]

I dunno why y'all being so uppity and defensive, I just joined in and trying to think through this with nothing but plausible options

[opaque arch]

I mean u were trying to prove the usefulness of a gyroscopic mfd and proving how good it is, while in reality, it's not even beneficial to any kind of racing.

[subtle holly]

Damn homie has hate in his heart for gyroscopes.

[prime mortar]

ong

bros villain arc started over a gyro scope

[hollow kettle]

What is brake shape and how does it affect the car. There is so much i don’t understand about this wheel

[rugged mortar]

it manages brake-by-wire parameters and braking balance

also forgot to mention it determines how much kinetic energy should be harvested from braking depending on how much bias the front or the rears have

[hollow kettle]

And this is for the ers

?

[rugged mortar]

yeah

[hushed trellis]

Hello when you play player career dose the AI tell you when to box or do you have to tell them to box

[opaque arch]

To be specific brake shape is one way to describe brake migration. When you brake, your car weight shifts to the front which technically requires more braking force at the front tyres. As you brake, the brake bias shifts (depending on brake shape). For example, if you have 5% brake migration and a peak brake bias of 56%, it means that as front braking torque increases, brake bias will vary from 51% to 56%. Brake migration can prevent lock ups and increase braking efficiency. Since weight shifts to the front, more load is applied the front tyres, which means a higher braking force can be used (shorter braking distance). A too aggressive brake migration results front lockups, whereas a 0% brake migration increases braking distance. Usually, brake migration settings changes %of brake bias being moved when braking while drivers have brake bias offset to change brake bias. Brake migration doesn't control brake bias. Braking migration doesn't directly control the ers system. Throttle and strat mapping does.

[hollow kettle]

Why would you need different differential in a corner

[opaque arch]

DIFF: Controls the locking value for corner entry, activated above a

specified longitudinal deceleration value.

● MID: Controls the locking value mid-corner, activated below a specified

longitudinal deceleration value.

● EXIT: Controls the locking value on corner exit, activated above a
specified longitudinal deceleration value or above the "Mid Hispd Switch"
speed value.
● Mid Hispd Switch: This is the speed threshold above which the differential
switches to EXIT mode.

[hollow kettle]

Oh wow thats the best explanation for brake migration i have gotten tysm

[opaque arch]

Diff basically controls how much the outer wheel spins more than the inner wheel

if a diff is fully locked (100%) then both wheels spin at the same rate when turning

this can result understeer

[hollow kettle]

And u want it to be fully unlocked mid corner?

And locked on straights and exit?

[opaque arch]

not fully but partially

[opaque arch]

basically yes

btw brake migration can affect aero balance since more braking force could affect pitch so its a really important tool

[hollow kettle]

And the computer does this automatically. And the knobs on the wheel change the preset?

[opaque arch]

Driver have presets

they can either change it with knobs or with presets buttons

[hollow kettle]

Damn

[hollow kettle]

Different presets?

[opaque arch]

ye

a locked differential can provide more traction, but if the tyres exceed the friction coefficient (wheelspin) then u will spin

basically diff affects how oversteery and understeery in corner phases

[left geode]

Wrong channel

[brave quartz]

Anyone here program backend and frontend services?

[left geode]

https://www.instagram.com/p/DCOa4EttNqX/?igsh=MXdjdnh2dWJsdGs4eg==

formula_aerodynamics

The #FIA has presented a new update of the 2026 #F1 Technical Regulations. The elements below have been modified, as researched by @Qvist_Designs and @F1Ingenerale… 👀🔎

“The front wing will be characterized by a flap for managing aerodynamic flow with an “up-wash” effect, the previous version adopted the “out-wash” philosophy (in yellow). Air is...

Likes

13998

Instagram

[karmic gate]

😎

[tall wyvern]

Not a flap, and not for upwash. It’s a wing/diveplane, and it’s for vorticity.

[karmic gate]

we know that the teams want it for vortex but was that realy fia's goal

i did think fia did not want to much vortex

[edgy anchor]

Well that's gonna work

[tall wyvern]

Yes, if in doubt the answer is vortex

[craggy moon]

it also looks a ton better imo, the new 2026 regs just look faster

[tall wyvern]

Especially the newest set compared to the previous ones. So many new bits.

[pliant coral]

guys i need a bit of help with stuff

[ripe acorn]

no

TU TU TU TUUU MAX VERSTAPPEN

[pliant coral]

i have a course going on in uni rn which is on chemical thermodynamics and the prof is asking for an example of real life application of thermodynamics in the real world. I was just wondering if there are any that you guys have in mind that are used in f1 cars

[pliant coral]

bruh

[opaque arch]

An engine?

Cooling system?

[mild nacelle]

Tire blankets, Leaf blower thing to cool the brakes, Tire temperature and how it degrades with laps, Track temperature and how it evolves

[pliant coral]

thanks ill look at it

[prime mortar]

anytime there is a transfer of temps then it can be counted. drivers pulling from the race line to the wet line to cool their tires when a race is drying is also one

a great example of heat transfer is on warm up laps. drivers will use the heat generated from hard braking to warm their tires

[gray wave]

Maybe not the right place to ask but it's about the regulations. Does the 'outside assistance' rule still apply on the formation lap? Like if a driver stalls on the grid can they be pushed to the pitlane or if a car goes into the gravel can they be given a push?

Also, what would have happened in Brazil if Stroll got going again, but he was really far behind the field. If he pitted, whilst the field went round again for the aborted start formation lap, would he have to wait in the pits and start a lap down?

[mild nacelle]

i forgot to post here

[marble stirrup]

Nice work!

[opaque arch]

ye

thats why lance beahced before the race and he couldnt ressume. Conditions for warm up laps and formation laps are the same

[zinc bison]

What if Max is 9th and Lando is 10th + FL, so two points each? Championship still on?

[eternal kettle]

were large sharkfins banned after 2009?