programmers-off-topic

[devout vault]

You don't get to join the code crime club if they aren't heinous enough

Oh, that definitely counts

[lethal walrus]

It is
So cool

[devout vault]

If it weren't for having done some console mod stuff myself I'd give you the president position. You'll have to settle for VP though

[lethal walrus]

#making-mods-general message see reply chain from here

That's too high of an honour my word

[devout vault]

I'll give you the president position if you figure out how switch 2 modding + KAR2 modding

[lethal walrus]

Hmmm

Does having modded saves count

Bc I have cheated items in sdv on my switch 2

[devout vault]

No

[lethal walrus]

Sad

[devout vault]

Also, I assume you're doing that via cloud sync?

[lethal walrus]

noo..

[devout vault]

Like mod on your switch 1

[lethal walrus]

Local transfer

[devout vault]

Same thing

So that wouldn't work for KAR2

[lethal walrus]

idk what you mean totally different

[devout vault]

Same thing as far as "you're only doing it on the switch 1 and copying it ot the switch 2" 😛

I did specifically say KAR2, which doesn't run on the switch 1

[lethal walrus]

tbf moddes saves is how retr0id got [very limited] ace on the switch 2

[lethal walrus]

Not with that attitude

[devout vault]

I don't care about their grades, what would them acing their homework or whatever have to do with me? /s

[fleet wren]

I think Nintendo learned from the Switch 1 and if you tries to mod your Switch 2 you'd get instantly kidnapped by the Nintendo ninjas

[devout vault]

Hmm. That doesn't sound right but I don't know enough to dispute it

[fleet wren]

(from what I heard apparently the modding the Switch 2 is at least 5 years away)

[devout vault]

Yeah I don't expect it anytime soon

[lethal walrus]

estimates are always iffy but yeah it'll take a while

[devout vault]

But putting an estimate like that on it is funny

[safe dragon]

and they've adequately terrified emulator devs

so switch 2 titles will just die one day

[lethal walrus]

Hopefully won't need an old firmware

[devout vault]

Like, how do you know it'll get a breakthrough in that long? This isn't a physical thing you chip away at over time

[lethal walrus]

Well, you can physically chip it

[devout vault]

From shutting down the switch 2 emulators?

[lethal walrus]

Just not that kind of chip

[lethal walrus]

Both switch 1 ones and citra

[devout vault]

Oops, switch 1, yeah

[safe dragon]

by shutting down both switch 1 emulators yes

[devout vault]

Citra mainly got shut down because it was maintained by the switch 1 people as well I thought

[red crest]

they got both of them? i thought it was jyst yuzu

[devout vault]

Not gone after separately

The other one got taken down later

[red crest]

unfortunate

[lethal walrus]

Yuzu got sued and took citra with it
The Nintendo ninjas (allegedly) (peacefully) asked ryujinx to be removed (idk it was sprobably a lawsuit threat)

[safe dragon]

ryujinx got shut down later yeah

[lethal walrus]

It was nice how random ryujinx was in a way bc I had time to download the flatpak

Obviously not ideal in the first place

But not as coordinated as yuzu

[devout vault]

Honestly, if nintendo would just put KAR2 on PC or introduce decent modding capabilities to the existing one, I wouldn't care. ("decent" being "more than content patcher level")

But let's be realistic here, theres no way that will happen

[safe dragon]

but how will Nintendo release a virtual console for switch games in 10 years when they don't have an open source project to just steal

[lethal walrus]

Ha
Haha
Hahahaha

[devout vault]

But only some of them

[lethal walrus]

Modding?! My switch games??

[devout vault]

I did say "let's be realistic here" after that for a reason

[lethal walrus]

No it's mine anyway I made the console
Context: I am nintendo

[fleet wren]

easy: ||they won't||

[safe dragon]

[devout vault]

Honestly, if not for the fact that that only leaves xbox and PS really, I'd love for nintendo to flop enough to have to pull out of console making and go full crossplatform, just like SEGA did

[safe dragon]

people will just continue to implement every single Pokémon game as a Pokémon emerald/firered romhack

[lethal walrus]

At least the only console will be the one with numerous kernel bugs from open(or is it free?)bsd

[devout vault]

Did some of the virtual console games actually get stolen from the open source emulators? (That we've been able to find out, anyways)

wait is that still a thing

[red crest]

"leaves xbox" is also getting more and more dubious by the year lol

[lethal walrus]

I think the snes/nes mini was

[devout vault]

I know we had this discussion before after their logo appeared onm the raylib page

[lethal walrus]

huh

[safe dragon]

I don't think we technically know? but their emulator had exactly identical test results as a publicly available one I believe

[lethal walrus]

I remember that but idk what you mean

Most of the ps4 bugs come from bsd

[devout vault]

I know we're not supposed to like monopolies, but... valve, please absorb all the markets with the gabecube. plz?

[red crest]

if an emulator is correct, shouldnt it have the same test results... ?

[lethal walrus]

It'd have different ones wrong

[safe dragon]

unfortunately they didn't steal one of the really good ones

[lethal walrus]

Some emulators are too perfect etc

[devout vault]

I mean most of them are on consoles we have access to, so shouldn't someone have been able to examine the files and see

[lethal walrus]

If only Nintendo let dolphin onto steam :(

[devout vault]

Or was there nothing glaringly obvious

[safe dragon]

beyond the gba era it's rare for emulators to be 100% accurate

[devout vault]

Or did nobody care enough to check

Even dolphin is still doing things to become more accurate

[safe dragon]

I'm sure someone did

[red crest]

how do we know the set of tests used is the set of all things that could and should be tested and that nintendo doesnt have extra tests that they might pass and emulators fail

[devout vault]

...heck, for some games, it seemed like they had to fake worse performance to keep them from breaking (which seemed like a specifically anti-emulator trick from what I read)

[lethal walrus]

I knew I watched a video on this

[devout vault]

https://dolphin-emu.org/blog/2025/09/16/dolphin-progress-report-release-2509/#2506-29-game-patch-defang-the-disney-trio-of-destruction-by-josjuice-and-billiard

[red crest]

that seems reminiscent of the turbo buttons of old

[safe dragon]

after watching a video on ps3 emulation where Intel and amd couldn't play little big planet together cause of a accuracy difference in an x86 instruction I'm honestly surprised anything works

[devout vault]

I still think they should've give the cars the evil mustaches as well

[lethal walrus]

Lmao apparently they pirated and/or dumped with normal dumping things their NES roms??

[rain apex]

Casey what if u just make your own KAR

[lethal walrus]

Casey air riders

[devout vault]

I mean, disney once shared on official media a clip of owl house that was clearly pirate... (I think it was disney+the owl house)

[devout vault]

physics are skeery

(I've tried)

[lethal walrus]

They did what

[devout vault]

Having a hard time finding it since now it's just stuff about dana encouraging piracy of it after recent stuff (I think the disney AI stuff being the final straw)

[safe dragon]

can't wait for Disney to AI generate mickey mouse

[devout vault]

The only other stuff I can find besides what I just mentioned is stuff about all the leaks of the finale episodes, so maybe I'm thinking of something else

[fleet wren]

IIRC it wasn't disney, but dana herself who didn't have cable

[devout vault]

for those who didn't read the link

(also a followup that I forgot about)

That part being bold because of the previous paragraph

[devout vault]

That sounds very much not like what I remember, but since I couldn't find what I was thinking of I can't really say for sure

[dusty pollen]

today in "phrases I didn't expect to say in 2025", my copy of the original phoenix wright trilogy on the switch just got an update?

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/ace-attorney-phoenix-wright-objection-capcom-gif-20965907

(That and the fact that one of the other laywer people is called Godot (I think?) is all I know of the series)

Oh and that the legal system in that world is very messed up

[dusty pollen]

it's an art book, ost player and "scene creator" that lets you put characters on different backgrounds than in the game for some reason

[dusty pollen]

oh yeah for sure lmao

[devout vault]

"for some reason"
well, whatever the reason is, I'm sure the fanfic-ers will have a field day

[dusty pollen]

that's the only option though, single character on a background

[devout vault]

oh

[dusty pollen]

usually the fanfic people require more flexibility

[devout vault]

Why didn't they make it with the full power of the KAR2 license editor, smh

(typo not mine, I stole this meme)

^ Me right now wanting to play stuff but struggling to actually start

[dusty pollen]

never mind the art book has illustrations of franziska all is forgiven

[devout vault]

I don't know who that is but based on that reaction I assume they're a beloved character of yours that the developers always neglect

[dusty pollen]

she isn't neglected

other than that the entire game should have been about her ofc

[devout vault]

Oh huh the channel has been changed to its rightful name once more

[devout vault]

idk sounds neglected to me

[devout vault]

May the junimos's pillows forever be the perfect temperature, and their traffic lights always be the color of their forest

And also a gift that we all know junimos love

It's gone already? smh I got bamboozled

[rain apex]

Would junimos be good at KAR

They r roughly kirbo sized

[devout vault]

Junimos are just more apple shaped kirbys, are they not?

But they have forsaken the sacred path it seems, so perhaps not

[rain apex]

With tiny arms

Which has aerodynamic implications perhaps

[devout vault]

Kirby has arms too

They're just blobs instead of sticks

[rain apex]

Kirby arms are thicker

[prisma flume]

shame on you. maya spinoff series with tv show and mugs

or mia. i'm not picky 🙂‍↕️

[devout vault]

It sounds like you are picky

Just not in a way that matches iro

[prisma flume]

i won't stand for this on maya monday of all days

[devout vault]

You literally swapped to mia before anyone even responded to you

[prisma flume]

i'm not picky 🙂‍↕️

[devout vault]

#programmers-off-topic message
(or in other words. "oh boy, recursion!")

[lethal walrus]

Hmm
Minecraft Dungeons + all dlc is less than sdv on steam rn

It was enjoyable when I did play it but I don't have the proper launcher for the ms store version on linux

[devout vault]

Oh, I could get the ones I don't have for $4.50

(I have never even installed the game)

[lethal walrus]

I'm quite bad at it but it is fun

[lucid sundial]

Incredibly simple, sadly, however

Attempting to learn C! ^^

[red crest]

learning always starts simple

have to start somewhere

[lucid sundial]

I do like the concept of prototypes, and have seen it elsewhere, so it's not bad. didn't know about printf being non aware of what's beingprinted unless declared prior with %x (d, f, s, etc), also interesting to see how you can possibly manipulate the string to print multiple variables with just one string, not sure what it's called yet but haven't tried

Also returning 0 is funny (in older C, you cannot have bools)

[lucid sundial]

yup! i'm very familiar with coding, but not with C, and C is a lot more, well how to put it, hands on and given to you in raw form

i wanted to learn C because of an app I am developing for Windows 95

it works, very minimal, and I know 50% of what is going on, but syntax, verbiage + definitions, no. Because of that, and because I am not and will never be a vibe coder, I intend to learn C from the ground up

[worn remnant]

main returning 0 is not due to the historical bool shortage. it's a return code, and you can (and many programs do) return all sorts of nonzero values

[lucid sundial]

oh yeah I know that

I meant like in functions returning a bool

in I believe Windows 9x systems you cannot use bools as it wasnt a standard

such as 98, 95 (almost 30 years old!)

[devout vault]

<flashbacks to googling the error codes I get when my C++ program crashes because I messed up and the debugger didn't like me>

Thankfully not an issue in stardew modding land!
hides AVE under the couch

[lucid sundial]

I heard C++ is C but with magic

(almost word for word for what Linus Torvalds the linux creator says, for some reason he dislikes it)

[lucid sundial]

isnt some of stardew mods written in C++?

i forgot but i think so

[devout vault]

god i hope not

[devout vault]

(we use C#)

[lucid sundial]

ohh its C# my bad

[devout vault]

Yeah that sounds like something someone who dislikes it would say

There's plenty of reasons to dislike C++ without making up a nonsensical reason for it

[lucid sundial]

c++ has advantages, but your given a power station, C is great, however, it has no magic, aka classes (which r very useful...however I am very used to FP)

[devout vault]

C++ is way more than just classes, I think you can do most of the things with just structs even

[lucid sundial]

😂 yeah, and totally more than just that, just was giving an example on what C does not have compared to C++

[devout vault]

I'm not sure class actually has any differences from struct besides the default visibility?

[lucid sundial]

coding for windows 95-98 is fun

you must make all UI purely in Win32's APIs (no UI framework) (For C, now you can do else, but, its not recommended)
you could do C++, however, Qt2 wasnt very good on 98/95, and also barely any downloads exist for it (for Python, PyQt3 and older no longer are on the internet, I had to call Riverbanks just to obtain PyQt3)

Also, Python on 98/95 is like asking Assembly to make an interface. Its very..unique, also has a lot of issues when making a terminal-free UI based application, also version matching is fun!!!! (its really not, it took me 2 hours to get the apps needed to even compile on there)

once you target Windows 9x systems, you're better off using C/C++. (For Rust fans, Rust does not even support XP, Windows 7+)

[devout vault]

Ah, but see, I hadn't been born yet for windows 95!

But even later but before/around 2011 (just a good comparison point for me because C++11), there wasn't really any nice solutions for UI. I tried wxwidgets and hated it

[devout vault]

people have used rust for embedded systems. skill issue

(but also I'm a rust hater so I don't really care, I just like the genre of code crimes involving making things happen that people say can't happen)

[lucid sundial]

Ahh, yeah I tried wx, wasnt a fan

For 2001+ there were actually good UI options, and in 2011 there was a very good option.

Qt4+ was amazing, its nowadays the most established and cross-compatible desktop interface out there, all my apps use Qt6 (Windows 10+/Linux/FreeBSD/Mac), Qt5 (Windows 7 and others around the time), Qt4 (Windows XP, its probably the best interface that you can still get in modern day to work on XP if your building for it now)

However, for Windows 98 and older, forget it, Qt was there, but it wasnt as good, and it was far more obscure

[lucid sundial]

dang

[lucid sundial]

🤣 I understand u well

[devout vault]

I recall not even wanting to try qt because of the precompile step nonsense that they needed to preprocess things.

And somehow, the build tools for C++ in general were even worse then than are now. Baffling that they could be worse that than already are these days, I know

[lucid sundial]

Ahh

To be honest, I never used Qt with C++

I used it with Python, PyQt

[devout vault]

(and also I was probably 13-16 when I tried doing C++ UI stuff and so probably was still in the "not knowing what I'm doing because I'm self taught from googling random parts as I need them" phase)

[devout vault]

My only recent exposure to Qt has been with trying to modify dolphin.

It's been painful, but I'm like 95% sure that that's the dolphin devs fault in this case

[lucid sundial]

PyQt4, Windows XP

quick snippet of the ui.py

[devout vault]

python, ew

[lucid sundial]

For the tool that I have, it's likely the best option

[devout vault]

I'd rather actually learn rust than try to make anything sizable in python

The typing system is so eugh

(not as bad as JS, but still)

(That being said, for editing existing stuff, I'd prefer python, simply because I actually understand the syntax of it 😛 )

[lucid sundial]

It's a very stripped down application, runs very light, since I remove practically 30% of it's ram consumption (which is like 15mb?) by removing networks, databases, etc, and some other factors

I got a pretty performant python app, so no worries

it runs very well and fast on any system, especially XP/7

[devout vault]

Bold of you to assume I've ever written anything important enough for performance to matter

It's purely syntactical hatred - typing is yuck, indentation based control flow, etc.

[lucid sundial]

dangg

im a perfectionist, if its not perfect, i dont like it

for reading files even streamed it into chunks

for better performance and no ram spikes

And my patch log for my 1.3 version as of yesterday:

1: Windows long-path (\?) patch: Enables automatic long-path support on Windows to prevent long-path errors.

2: Surrogateescape patch: Ensures filenames with invalid Unicode bytes can still be safely decoded instead of crashing.

3: Symlink-skip patch: Detects and skips symlinks early so they never break the ZIP or produce invalid entries.

4: NUL-byte filename sanitization patch: Automatically replaces \x00 in ZIP entry names to prevent malformed ZIP entries and downstream tool failures.

5: Alternate Data Stream (ADS) skip patch: Detects and skips files with colons (:) in the filename on Windows to avoid ADS-related errors.

6: Lock-file skip patch: Detects browser/DB lock files (parent.lock) and dismisses them with a clear log entry instead of raising silent permission errors.

7: Unreadable file skip patch: Preemptively skips files that are unreadable due to permissions or ownership issues, logging a warning without halting the archive process.

[devout vault]

See, unlike rust, I can read it

Still hate it though

[lucid sundial]

So, I'm a perfectionist, and want all edge cases also solved, its sad, but its good

[lucid sundial]

I heard Rust is very readable

and very amazing (it cant run on old systems)

whats the hype of Rust? also, their maintaners are very shakey

[devout vault]

Anything is readable if you already know it

[lucid sundial]

like, very very shaky

[devout vault]

What does shaky mean in this context

[lucid sundial]

linus torvalds made comments about it

[devout vault]

Do they like milkshakes

Because so do I

[lucid sundial]

yes

they love milkshakes!!

[devout vault]

You'd have to ask... (almost) literally any other of this channel's regulars. This place is practically a crab rave at times

[lucid sundial]

For python, its best to:

1: Follow PEP-8 and PEP-257 (very strict code formatting, makes it readable for any developer who hops onto the project)
2: Comments (can't stress on how this is skipped)
3: Documentation

The rest like specific variable names, function names, etc, are all in PEP-8 and PEP-257, annoying, but good practice

[devout vault]

don't care, still hate it

[lucid sundial]

I like being silly about rust users

but honestly tho

what is the dif between using C v.s Rust? I never looked into Rust

I would 100% hop onto Rust, however, its bad for legacy systems (cant run on even XP)

[devout vault]

No amount of coding practices will change python to not have indentation based control flow

[lucid sundial]

LOL

you can try

and dream, but yeah

[devout vault]

Again, I think it can if you use the minimal stdlib version.

If it can't, it's because nobody has cared enough to make it (since the people who need it probably need to spend that time doing more immediately useful things)

[lucid sundial]

Is it stable enough and mature enough to be used on 98/95?

Prob not but

[devout vault]

How should I know. I'm a rust hater who avoids it where possible

[lucid sundial]

rust hater, python hater, partial js hater...

What do you code in?

[devout vault]

Everyone else has vanished lately

Pretty much always C# if I can get away with it

[lucid sundial]

Let's all just stick to making electron based apps, and react for operating systems interface

👍

[devout vault]

hissssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

[devout vault]

also you better remove that "partial"

[lucid sundial]

HAHAHAH

I hate Electron, I think its dumb, ram consuming, and innefficent

React...is...good....but...not...for...anything...but...WEBSITES!!

[devout vault]

When I can't (ie. old game console homebrew crimes) I use C++, which is the first "real" language I learned (ie. I'm ignoring game maker 7's language, and roblox lua since I didn't actually use that for long)

[lucid sundial]

Windows 11 uses it for its start menu

hence why it breaks and is so horrid + cpu spikage when opening it

I had the windows 11 start menu break on me in recovery mode, in normal mode after switching between many apps

and for other random things (i am also a win 11 hater)

[lucid sundial]

Nice!!

[devout vault]

My windows explorer seems to restart at least once a day and lose my window order and explorer windows and everything, but I'm guessing it's something going wrong with the windhawk stuff I installed

[lucid sundial]

I started almost 10 years ago with Luau, did it for 8 years.... (I am experienced enough to contribute to it if they actually LET US)

I then learned HTML + CSS, markup languages, then JS (hated it)

Moved to Python, got very good at it, then played around in Fortran (very nice language, however lot of things u cant do), then going into C now

[devout vault]

The non-modding ones of these was partially to use a scripting language so I didn't have to actually use C++ on those consoles

[lucid sundial]

ahh yeah windhawk is a bit weird, is this Reunion 7? Or a custom theme u made for Windows

[devout vault]

wow i cant believe youve never used any actually good languages

[devout vault]

I can't recall what theme I'm using, but theming isn't the only thing I'm using

[lucid sundial]

DONT DISRESPECT FORTRAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fortran is nice : ( and as performant as C/C++, and in some scenarios better when it comes to math/simulations

[devout vault]

The thing that sold me on using it was one that lets me move windows of the same program around separately.

ex.

[devout vault]

I don't do math/simulations, I do video game code crimes

[lucid sundial]

46k inbox...

[lucid sundial]

ahh

I use Windows 10 IoT Enterprise LTSC (yeah I do for sure own the expensive license, yes I do ask my lawyer saul)
I use Arch Linux (btw) on all other devices

[lucid sundial]

video game crimes...hmm..

[lucid sundial]

iOS 26.0

[devout vault]

The app store number is actually lower than it used to be since I updated everything a few months ago

[lucid sundial]

I am not minialistic, but I am in between that, my desktop is clean and simple

used to have more OS emulators

since I had to emulate them to build apps for it

[lucid sundial]

I am a very organized person

another example 👀

[devout vault]

This is great if you aren't on windows and so something can't suddenly fail because of file path length

(this happened to me recently)

[lucid sundial]

disable file path length

on windows

its just a setting

some apps dont care, but generally speaking ur fine if u do that

like explorer respects it

[devout vault]

It wasn't explorer

Can't recall what

[lucid sundial]

Am concerned

[devout vault]

Something development related

[lucid sundial]

speaking of recall do u want to install recall on ur win 11 pc 🥺 >_<

[devout vault]

git submodules, not something I did intentionally 😔

[devout vault]

banned

[lucid sundial]

i cant use windows 11, its so like

AI

do you use windows?

[devout vault]

Yeah

[lucid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/python-linux-linus-torvalds-gif-27620467

lol what is this

[devout vault]

I tried linux recently for some stuff on a separate laptop but monogame content building just refused to cooperate so I had to go back to windows

[lucid sundial]

linus torvalds would have lost his mind if he heard the word Python next to the word Kernel

[devout vault]

(I talked about it here a little)

[lucid sundial]

what is monogamee

[devout vault]

python is not next to the word kernel, it's on the other half of the sentence. taps forehead

[devout vault]

The framework SDV uses (and plenty of other C# games)

[lucid sundial]

ahh

[lucid sundial]

ah yes

firefox sucks

in the big 2025...

💀 who...even uses that

[devout vault]

dozens of us

[lucid sundial]

IM KIDDING IM KIDDING

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/arrested-development-david-cross-tobias-funke-there-are-dozens-of-us-dozens-gif-5426075

[devout vault]

I was rather confused given the general vibe you've given off here 😛

why use tabliss when tabby cats exists

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/tabby-cat-friend/

[steel kraken]

please don't use the iot builds of win10 unless you are actually an iot device.

its not just win10 with long term security updates, theres other stuff in there that can and will cause software incompatibility

[lucid sundial]

Never had issues

[lucid sundial]

me need nice clean background : D

[lucid sundial]

Software compatibility is very close to standard Windows 10 LTSC because it uses the same underlying Windows components. The big differences are policy hooks, provisioning tools, and device lockdown features...when running normal desktop apps, almost everything will behave exactly the same unless you're trying something exotic like dodging shell restrictions or depending on missing Microsoft consumer components/leaning on deprecated features. (Such as the Windows App Store that you can install, but I have never used it before)

Games, drivers, and more are treated nearly identically. The only possible issue is a popular fps game that detects IoT builds. However, I don't believe there is a game to date that does block it.

I’ve spent a lot of time tinkering with these builds, so here’s what I’ve seen in practice

[lyric bloom]

I moved to floorp, lol, but I still need firefox for anything with DRM

[devout vault]

Did you move to floorp because of the name

[lucid sundial]

Floorp is firefox-based thankfully, however, what does floorp and firefox have to do with DRM games?

[lyric bloom]

it's lagged upstream about firefox

[lucid sundial]

How do games relate to Firefox?

[lyric bloom]

...

[lucid sundial]

mm yeah thats firefox icon there

[lyric bloom]

stares at you with the energy of gas station attendant kept afterhours for no good reason

[devout vault]

Even besides that, we move between topics here faster than my ADHD moves between projects most of the time

[lyric bloom]

yes

[lucid sundial]

gonna be honest i got no clue with DRm means for browsers

[lyric bloom]

which is why I didn't expect people to respond to it, actually

[lucid sundial]

in the game industry DRM is like

annoying

[lyric bloom]

DRM is used for minor things like 'securing twitch streams', etc.

[lucid sundial]

hmm interesting

[lucid sundial]

bunnies

[lyric bloom]

(and youtube videos, and amazon prime, and netflix, and dropout..)

[lucid sundial]

bunny bunny bunny

oof

[lyric bloom]

... It annoy sme, but I kinda understand why floorp doesn't want to pay the licensing fees

[hushed raven]

ye pretty much any paid for video media has some kind of DRM to try to prevent theft

[devout vault]

There have been many times when I interrupt an ongoing conversation with my nonsensical rambling

[lucid sundial]

sad

[devout vault]

Sometimes from replying while backreading

Or even today I think I rambled on about something most of the channel had already moved past

Or was that yesterday

[lyric bloom]

anyway, speaking of that, and mostly on topic: I saw the windows copilot ad at work and now am determined to install blazzite over my winter break lol

[devout vault]

The horse girl conversation

[lyric bloom]

"your computer can talk to you!" "Cool, but.. I don't .. need it to?"

[devout vault]

That's what I was ignoring

[lyric bloom]

Haru Urara comes for us all. 😄

[lucid sundial]

blazzite on a spare pc or main? nice

[hushed raven]

I missed that entirely, any time theres 50+ new messages I just stop backreading, I can't be bothered reading a novel

[lyric bloom]

main, probably

[lucid sundial]

I am scared of Recall app, taking photos and sending it to Microsoft (it was originally unencrypted btw! i think in all beta and for even release it was unencrypted until more recently)

[lyric bloom]

I only have a minipc that occasionally makes worrying noises, tbh.

(I also, totally relatedly, will be reorganzing my desk a bit to give it more airflow)

[devout vault]

I sometimes do depending on what the conversation is about

Sometimes my eyes glaze over so I just skip it all

[lyric bloom]

I try to but it really depends on how energetic I am waking up

sometimes I just don't get up and have to remind myself I work at 8:30 in the morning in two days, and sleeping in til 11 is really bad for me

[lucid sundial]

laptop uses this

very clean and minimalistic

for file explorer

nooooo everyone lefttt

[devout vault]

currently avoiding really needing to go to bed so that I can actually wake up at a reasonable time tomorrow

[hushed raven]

my file explorer is sort of a mess, its cleaner than the rest of my file system for sure

[lyric bloom]

stares my file system, then hides it

[lucid sundial]

sleep at 5 am

good time to sleep

[hushed raven]

cleanest part of my OS

[lyric bloom]

I uh.. may just may need to reorganize the thumbdrive

but I keep having nine other things occur at the same time

[lucid sundial]

partition name and labels..
NOW!!

/j

[lucid sundial]

so many drives

[lucid sundial]

...wastebin?

is this in the UK?

[lyric bloom]

yeah, they'er from my old computer, actually

I don't need them connected, I should probably disconnect them, but.

[hushed raven]

I literally cannot get the labels to stick at all XD mostly because the "Basic Data Partition" is nfts drives, and the root drive is easy to spot

[lucid sundial]

i got a smart idea

how about you use your usbs or hdd's as a SWAP for RAM!!!

this is gonna be amazing speed

[hushed raven]

yep! I'd prefer it if it was just called bin but theres already a /bin folder so it would be confusing

[lucid sundial]

trust....

[lucid sundial]

Neofetch or fastfetch or uwufetch

[hushed raven]

Oh hey the label do show up right in fastfetch

Disk (/media/Coding): 36.58 GiB / 1.82 TiB (2%) - fuseblk
Disk (/media/Games): 174.54 GiB / 1.79 TiB (10%) - ext4
Disk (/media/Windows): 133.28 GiB / 1.82 TiB (7%) - fuseblk

[lucid sundial]

nice fastfetch

better than neo

[hushed raven]

time to customise fastfetch, and remove like 90% of the redundant info

[ivory shadow]

The best part of being a JavaScript developer is when someone finds a ridiculous niche problem in a library mod that you have never heard of in your life but probably just colors console output or tells you if it's Thursday or something, but it's a dependency of a dependency of a dependency of a dependency of a very common project and suddenly GitHub sends you 90 emails saying your projects are vulnerable.

[dusty pollen]

left! pad! left! pad! left! pad!

[steel kraken]

don't forget all the critical severity vulnerabilities because they accept regular expressions

[hushed raven]

I've just found out that terminal based guis are called TUIs, I love it, such a great name

does remind me of holiday package deals though

[dusty pollen]

isn't TUI "text UI" rather than "terminal UI"?

[dusty pollen]

cross the ts, dot the is, and put U in the middle. tui (cue stock footage)

[hushed raven]

thinking about it it probably is, text user interface makes a lot more sense, it just so happens to run in a terminal

[gaunt basalt]

Hi

out of curiosity, has anyone had any experience working at any companies in the past? like EA or something

[dusty pollen]

working at any companies? I've had jobs, yeah

[dusty pollen]

are you asking about game studios in particular?

[hushed raven]

I have worked for manya company, game/tech companies not so much

[gaunt basalt]

No, just jobs

[uncut seal]

I've had a hell summer job in what could compete as the company with the worst management in France, and an ok internship

[cyan shadow]

I've had five internships but I'm in the wrong industry for this channel

[dusty pollen]

are you interested about something in particular? almost everyone in this channel will have had a job in the past

[gaunt basalt]

im curious about jobs involving coding and programming

[dusty pollen]

is there anything in particular you want to know about them? a lot of us here have had cs jobs

[soft knot]

I want to play multiplayer but for some reason I can't.

[hushed raven]

you'll probably want to make a post in #1272025932932055121 if you play with mods or #vanilla-tech-support if you don't play mods, they'll be able to help you better as those are the right channels

[devout vault]

How was the beginning of advent of code for everyone who is doing it

[gaunt basalt]

i wanna get hired

[rain apex]

I don't think randos on a discord can help you with that

Typical advice is get your resume fluffed up and go on the interview grind

[dusty pollen]

I don't think anyone here is hiring right now, if that's what you're asking

[sand frost]

Can confirm I’ve had jobs

Can also confirm I am not hiring

[topaz smelt]

What's everyones favorite Linux distro over here

[lethal walrus]

i use ubuntu on most of my things

kubuntu on desktop, servers all ubuntu, ubuntu on my switch (because it was the easiest one tbf)

[topaz smelt]

I've heard good things about it

[rain apex]

What do u want to do exactly

[topaz smelt]

I just want to know what others use

[rain apex]

It's for daily desktop things then

I use arch it is fine/10

[topaz smelt]

Same lol

I fully agree with that

[worn remnant]

my current pet favorite is void, but as with most things i like or use, i don't really recommend it

[devout vault]

Voids are indeed the best pet

* only cats are qualified to be voids

-# (otherwise its just sparkling black fur)

[lucid sundial]

TUI actually makes sense, nice term

[lucid sundial]

Not gaming, but yeah I have, and be sure to learn Github (assuming most have)

Most valuable languages are C/C++, Python, and JS right now. C/C++ is probably the most vauable, however Python is becoming a lot more valuable do to AI (code it in Python but it translates to C++ in runtime)

[lucid sundial]

Build up your skills on C and C++, those are like the golden tickets, then learn Python after, better to start with C if you already understand a bit of coding. If your brand new to coding, start with Python, learn a lot from it, then move to C, it'll be harsh, but doable

Then start working on some nice projects either in Python (try an AI project or something with a graphical interface), then a project in C, maybe something small. I'd say after that, take some project manager or just general leadership classes

This advice should hopefully make you golden before you get your first job

(Also, college is recommended, they teach a lot of this, if not, no need, it can all be learned without it)

C/C++, great for low level programming, lot of jobs want C/C++ developers. Python, well, because of AI, and because of how popular it is. Business/project management/leadership class because developing both confidence and leadership skills with help you a lot in interviews and understanding how things are handled, and what to say and when to say things

[lucid sundial]

Endeavour OS. It's arch (btw) based but makes things a lot easier, it's just a pretty installer for it, don't wanna manually install arch myself. I use KDE Plasma 6.5, very clean if you remvoe some entries and make it more minimal. GNOME is a good DE too, but not a fan of floating trays

[safe dragon]

alright that's day 1 of advent of code done

[lethal walrus]

oh i forgot about that

oh that seems easyish?

i love getting the sample right and the real answer wrong

[dusty pollen]

I don't think C is exactly a super hireable language right now (more so than python)

and python is based in C, not C++

(well, CPython is, which is the most common implementation)

[safe dragon]

part 2 is honestly pretty tricky for a day 1 puzzle

[safe dragon]

python is a bit of a weird one where there's a gigantic demand for people who can program in it, but almost all of this demand are specialized roles like data analysis/engineering, AI/ML stuff or really anything that's academic in nature

a few django jobs out there but I've never heard anyone be positive about django that's probably not a good thing

[lucid sundial]

its in a very high demand, mainly for Ai

[lucid sundial]

Python is a pretty hireable language, its right now one of the most sought after, my company is also one of them that is begging for them

its because of the AI bubble

[safe dragon]

python has been one of the most hired for languages since long before the AI bubble

[lucid sundial]

hmmm, I dont remember mentioning what python is based on, never actually looked, I was talking about C/C++, other languages that are important to learn

[safe dragon]

but that does help

[lucid sundial]

oh 100%, though now its even in higher demand

[sand frost]

I would say knowing only Python can be a red flag though

[lucid sundial]

though I am partially mad at AI

due to Ramflation

my 100 dollar ram is now 320 dollars

due to OpenAI buying all consumer ram

[lucid sundial]

yeah, which is why I recommend C/C++ to others

[dusty pollen]

"code it in python but it translates to c++ in the runtime"

[lucid sundial]

if they like front end then like

[lucid sundial]

OHHH, this is relating to AI models

specifically

its either C/C++ in runtime for the AI models

as AI models actually running purely in python would be a nightmare

[safe dragon]

idk someone only knowing python isn't a red flag to me because I don't really associate people python with regular programming roles. More roles that happen to include programming like data engineering

[lucid sundial]

it looks like python is doingthe math for ai models but its just really a huge instruction list for the framework to handle

[sand frost]

Sure, but sometimes I see students who are fairly shaky on programming fundamentals if they are Python-only and fairly self-taught

[dusty pollen]

yeah it's called numpy

and it's mostly based in C 😅

[lucid sundial]

its not a red flag, lot of new devs start there, but people grow pretty quickly

[sand frost]

It's not a dealbreaker, it just makes me assume they may not be as capable of expanding to new stuff as fast as if they knew multiple languages

[lucid sundial]

yeahhh i said c/c++ some even are different depending on whats being used

[safe dragon]

(and pytorch)

(also C)

[dusty pollen]

anyway I hate the idea that there's a single programming language that's most hirable or that that's a good idea to blindly learn languages for those reasons. Every part of the tech industry has its own most used languages and there are usually multiple alternatives

[safe dragon]

not unfair honestly

[dusty pollen]

data science is usually python or R, for example

[cyan shadow]

Yeah it really depends on what sector you're looking at, right?

[red crest]

i hear COBOL is popular if you're looking to get into the very hireable ultra legacy financial institution mainframes sector

[dusty pollen]

front end is a lot of the millions of js frameworks and a sprinkle of the css frameworks (and also some tears)

[cyan shadow]

Mom's in logistics and they still use C++ for a lot of things, alongside Python and other stuff

[red crest]

tbf all those frameworks typically use the same languages though

[dusty pollen]

this is a good point in general, legacy languages are a massive thing

[dusty pollen]

oh yeah but I would consider them things you have to learn separately

[safe dragon]

in my experience you won't find a shortage of legacy .NET shit to maintain either

[cyan shadow]

Someone put my mom on frontend work last week and I was subjected to lengthy rants about this

(She's only ever done backend work before so who knows why they did this to her)

[red crest]

i would equate it more to like, unity vs godot vs unreal or somethin like that though. a lot of things are transferrable between em

[dusty pollen]

backend web dev is anything from node to python to .net to whatever cursed language your employer dug up twenty years ago

[red crest]

(i dont actually know what language unreal uses dont crucify me for being technically incorrect)

[safe dragon]

unreal uses C++ or realistically visual scripting (blueprints)

[cyan shadow]

She ended up begging to be put back on hiring duty to get away from js

[red crest]

pretend i named some other game engine that uses C# then

[dusty pollen]

devops is mostly adderall a variety of scripting and cloud solutions. courses for horses and all that

[safe dragon]

back end dev can genuinely be any language

no matter what it is

[red crest]

at the end of the day its just pushing data to a port innit

[safe dragon]

yup and a lot of em are written by people who just used whatever language they already knew because of something else

[dusty pollen]

so really the idea of "learn this language to be hired" is moot imo. learn any language! it will give you transferable skills to learn others more easily and there's going to be SOMEONE hiring in it (haskell doesn't count)

[safe dragon]

there are companies hiring for haskell devs. They're called universities and you'd be a professor

[red crest]

i think there is merit to starting with one of the more popular ones though

as a hedge your bets sort of deal

rather than just literally "any"

[dusty pollen]

yeah but out of the popular ones you may as well just pick one

[red crest]

that i agree with

[safe dragon]

it's sensible to start with a language that is used regularly in whatever field you are interested in

[dusty pollen]

and I don't think most new learners are going to stumble across scala before they do c#

[safe dragon]

unless there's some random university out there that decides to start with scala

[red crest]

i did actually stumble across scala before C# years ago

i didnt do anything with it but i knew what it was before i knew what C# was

[safe dragon]

incredible

[red crest]

pretty sure it was in the context of minecraft modding, so

[safe dragon]

I started with C# cause that's what my uni used

[red crest]

not exactly that obscure a thing

[dusty pollen]

guess why I know it

[safe dragon]

minecraft modding obviously

[lucid sundial]

In my own opinion its Python, C/C++ for backend
For front end, obviously HTMl + CSS + React + JS

(also i dont like electron so never suggest that for a web based application)

for the starter pack

for a new dev

[dusty pollen]

well we STARTED with haskell. then we were moved to scala

[safe dragon]

C# first, then basic SQL, then Haskell, then Prolog, then Python, then Javascript

that's my learning order

oh and then VB.NET

[dusty pollen]

oh this wasn't MY learning order this was my uni's curriculum

[safe dragon]

good ol haskell

[lucid sundial]

hmm, Haskell isnt really main stream, rarely used in big typical companies and loss job demand, I'd never recommend to anyone newer, unless they're a lot more experienced

[lucid sundial]

C# is a good choice

SQL is also great if u wanna get into databases

Prolog is very good, but its extremely niche

[safe dragon]

tbh you can't go wrong knowing SQL. I feel like it ends up showing up in almost every programming job eventually

[lucid sundial]

another one id not recommend unless they want to go a lot deeper

[lucid sundial]

100%, important language

[dusty pollen]

and eventually, in nightmares!

I actually like SQL tbf

[lucid sundial]

sql isnt bad

do you know whats bad?

Data Migration!!!!!

[safe dragon]

I think there's a good reason it has stuck around for so long with only really dialects

[dusty pollen]

isn't this the order you learned these languages in? or am I misunderstanding?

[lucid sundial]

the trigger word for anyone in IT who utilizes databases, data migration

especially large ones

[safe dragon]

yes that's the order I learnt them in

[dusty pollen]

yeah that's what I thought lmao

[safe dragon]

or really that's the order they appeared in in uni

[dusty pollen]

wait you were taught that many languages in uni? damn

[safe dragon]

somewhere in between there I learnt elixir and rust in my hobby time

[sand frost]

my hs was a bit less hardcore, we only started with scheme (lisp)

[lucid sundial]

I personally started with luau when I was very young, then to python, html + css, JavaScript, React, SQL, Ruby, Fortran (a personal favorite but niche, also can suck sometimes), C# (i didnt do much), C/C++ (learning as we speak)

[red crest]

technically the first language i used in uni (ignoring anything i did outside of schooling) was verilog... i did not enjoy it

[dusty pollen]

Haskell, Scala, and then python popped up during the ML class and js and webgl during graphics

[devout vault]

skill issue, just make your initial DB structure able to handle any future requirement changes from the start

[sand frost]

i did learn haskell fairly early on after that, probably 3rd, but not extensively

[safe dragon]

god our dacpac database migrations took like 35 minutes and it just got worse and worse every year

[devout vault]

If only @cinder karma were around 😔

(I had to type @ taxbill instead of @atra to find them since they haven't talked here lately)

[lucid sundial]

hahaha

do you think companies do that? no, sadly not. I think it was UWM that had a 2 day data migration and they lost like so much data and caused so many issues

[devout vault]

again

[dusty pollen]

(also ignoring everything I did outside of uni of course haha, it was rare for people to show up to my course without already knowing a language)

[sand frost]

I think my order was: Scheme, Java, bit of Haskell, bit of C-type Ardiuno code, Matlab, bit of C++, C#, Python

[devout vault]

skill issue

[lucid sundial]

companeis want fast fast not quality

[lucid sundial]

it is a skill issue ngl

[safe dragon]

and yet, none of em were C/C++

[dusty pollen]

step one: hire an oracle
step two: introduce them to Oracle

[devout vault]

Would somebody like to explain to me why carvana has shaq (some celebrity, I don't know anything beyond that) on the front page, and the search filters have an option for "Shaq's Favorites"???????????????????

[sand frost]

is carvana a programming website

[dusty pollen]

what is a carvana

[devout vault]

no

[sand frost]

darn

[lucid sundial]

thats weird, might as well add snoop dog at that point

[devout vault]

It's a me needing a car website

[lucid sundial]

car vending machine

[safe dragon]

I thought carvana was a pokemon

[sand frost]

ah, the joys of car-dependent lands

[devout vault]

They apparently do mail order cars now

[sand frost]

maybe this celeb loves driving cars

[dusty pollen]

I still think that

[devout vault]

Or doordash cars

[safe dragon]

https://pokemondb.net/pokedex/carvanha

[sand frost]

my hot tip for buying cars in the US is to buy through Costco

[devout vault]

Or prime shipping for cars

etc.

[devout vault]

Costco sells cars?

[lucid sundial]

...does costco actually...sell..?

[sand frost]

this helps you to skip over some of the horrid negotiations and sexism etc etc

[lucid sundial]

imagine ordering a costco pizza then a ferrari after

[sand frost]

they broker deals for cars on your behalf basically

[red crest]

doesnt costco sell everything

[devout vault]

But also I'm leaning towards an option that doesn't need me to physically go somewhere, since the whole issue is arranging transportation 😛

[lucid sundial]

from a pizza to a military jet, probably does

[sand frost]

you do need a membership but if it saves you more than $65 it's worth it

[devout vault]

I have never been to a costco

[sand frost]

and when buying cars that very well may be the case, though I have never actually bought a car

[devout vault]

but can I do the whole thing without leaving the house

[red crest]

plus, you get a membership out of it

[sand frost]

maybe

[lucid sundial]

skill issue..ngl

😂

[devout vault]

yes but this isn't my skill issue, it's my parents

And so I can't fix it

[lucid sundial]

ooof

[devout vault]

They so busy

[lyric bloom]

carvana isn't really worth it, though.

[lucid sundial]

how old r u i forgot

if i may ask

[devout vault]

In stardew modding community time? Stone age old

Maybe older

(I'm 28)

[lucid sundial]

wowza an unc (im kidding)

[devout vault]

I mean is there a better place that won't need me to go there in person?

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/how-do-you-do-fellow-kids-steve-buscemi-30rock-fellow-kids-one-of-us-gif-21904018

[lucid sundial]

i hope one day we can place orders for cars like calling in a pizza

[devout vault]

(I don't know what unc is besides presumably being old)

[lyric bloom]

😭

[lucid sundial]

unc short for uncle (its internet slang for being old, aka 18 and older...somehow)

[lethal walrus]

its either uncultured or uncle and im not sure which

[devout vault]

I mean that's kinda what carvana is 😛

[devout vault]

Better not be uncle, I'd rather be aunt

[lucid sundial]

...aun?

doesnt sound as funny to them sadly

[devout vault]

But also I'm still struggling to understand this

[lucid sundial]

advertisement

makes people who like em buy it more id assume + famous so more clicks

[sand frost]

People sometimes make poor financial decisions around cars, and the car place is hoping a celeb helps encourage this

[lyric bloom]

Becauase carvana is uh.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQW54Gd-sUQ

[devout vault]

why would I care what his "favorites" (ie. what his team agreed to sponsor) are
(not pictured: him smiling and holding a phone screen and a car key, I think)

[sand frost]

Some people are susceptible to celeb recommendations

Clearly not you tho 😛

[lucid sundial]

your name scares me

[devout vault]

You expect me to have the attention span for a 14.5 minute video?

[sand frost]

From waht I can find, Costco will not deliver the cars, but a dealership might

[lyric bloom]

i mean, you wrote spacecore...

runs

[sand frost]

You probably do have to visit the dealership, the main value is not having to haggle to get a good price

[lucid sundial]

did they actually?

[devout vault]

Easiest way to avoid that is to not know who celebrities are besides names sounding vaguely familiar

[lethal walrus]

2x speed like me

[lethal walrus]

yes

[devout vault]

In 5 minute increments spread across years

[fleet wren]

isnt shaq the icy hot guy

[lucid sundial]

i never knew the authors of such large mods/frameworks are such silly/nice people

i always imagined very serious and closed off peoples

[devout vault]

What'd be the point if I can't be silly

[fleet wren]

he also plays some sports apparently but it's probably not important

[lucid sundial]

Funnycore

[sand frost]

i am busy horturing my computer by asking it to read a 1.2GB csv file

[devout vault]

That's like half of the point of living. (The other half is petting kitties)

[sand frost]

i wish it would do this faster

maybe i will take a walk

[lyric bloom]

I mean, I'd say by now most of the super serious people are gone-ish

[sand frost]

pathos is kind of serious

but he does make jokes

i have seen it myself

[devout vault]

The whole problem with visiting a dealership is figuring out logistics to when my dad can take me to said dealership (or wherever).

The whole point of getting a car is to not have these problems anymore

[lucid sundial]

just overclocked my 4070 super by a bit for like 5% extra fps....thinking of overclocking my ddr5 ram, i dont have ECC ram so I gotta be careful

[devout vault]

He does have some good one liners on the occasion he bestows them upon us

[lucid sundial]

pathos has been nice to me, but yeah id say hes more polite than serious rude, like a polite serious

[sand frost]

Yeah, I do feel like the current problem is temporary though, and the solution of "buy car" is more permanent. Idk buying a car is a big deal to me so I'd try to invest some time in buying the right car.

Do you already know which car you want?

[lucid sundial]

I want a car with a 5090 and amd threadripper so I can game,a lso want rgb and i want it to fly tysm

[lethal walrus]

i know someone with a wii in their car

[devout vault]

Yeah, the "main three" I remember are:

• Pathos (still around, and I wouldn't call closed off / serious)
• Ento (definitely fits that group, and some adjacent ones)
• Routine/Platonymous (wasn't around much, and has disappeared into the ether by now)

[sand frost]

why don't you ask for it to swim while you're at it 😛

[lethal walrus]

the entertainment system has a video input

[sand frost]

fly/swim/drive really covers a lot of ground

[devout vault]

Ah but you see, that's another aspect of the problem: I need one sooner rather than later, but we don't actually know how soon because of the nature of the thing that needs it

[lyric bloom]

i was thinking of ento and routine, yeah

[devout vault]

It could've been a few weeks ago, it could be in a year

[sand frost]

unfortunate

[lucid sundial]

I'd say 6480 might be more serious/reserved I think? Idk anyone else that is other than the ones u mention and that

[sand frost]

i am very serious and dignified

[lucid sundial]

meow.

[lyric bloom]

like cjb and cantordust were never that serious (and they are super long gone now

[fleet wren]

you're talking about the creator of truffle juice

[devout vault]

6480 doesn't seem serious to me

Like, not super out there and energetic either, but definitely not serious

[lyric bloom]

and something about SDV never really attracted the super serious type modders that are in Beth modding

[devout vault]

Thankfully

[lucid sundial]

ahh probably was just me, cause was a bit more on the cold end/serious, maybe cause I did ask if he wanted to collab on something. I made a bad joke and got blocked, so I'm very careful around here

[lucid sundial]

oh yeah beth modding is...unique

[fleet wren]

beth modding is srsbsn if you're caught making a collection including mods from two modders who don't like each other they'll mutually skin you alive

[lyric bloom]

I lurk in Arthmoor's discord, believe me, I know, lol.

[fleet wren]

(note I do not know if this actually happens I'm making a joke at their expense)

[devout vault]

Yeah, sometimes it seems like MC modding had a lot going on looking back. But then I hear about bethesda modding

[lyric bloom]

no, it can kinda happen. Like there are massive groups of people who hate each other to the point where I think /r/skyrimmods should be nuked from orbit.

[heavy dagger]

https://reddit.com/r/skyrimmods

[devout vault]

But also do you wanna tldrw this for me

[lucid sundial]

dangg

[lyric bloom]

"Carvana (a rising, 40 billion dollar online car Reseller) is a complete disaster of debt financing and family conflict. When a Father and Son control two separate, yet interwoven companies, while selling billions worth of stock almost every single day, (as they target the poorest people in the nation for loans they will likely never pay back)... important questions need to be asked about what is legal, what SHOULD be legal, and why were letting it happen.

Carvana is a double bubble behemoth in the used car sector, with (in my opinion) broken economics and a doomed business model." the desc is good enough as a tl;dw

[devout vault]

I guess the main thing I care about given my time crunch and the relatively few alternatives is "will I be really badly affected by doing this"

[lyric bloom]

If you must, is do not do financing through them

[devout vault]

Oh, yeah, no

I got prequalified through someone else (the place I did my last car from)

(not with them directly, but still)

[lucid sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/meowl-owl-cat-owlcat-spring-excited-gif-9638611985122140704

[dusty pollen]

I’m the most serious mod author by far

[devout vault]

I know you are, ichor

I would say that's gotten better lately but I also am unsure if I've even seen ichor around lately so it could just be so bad I haven't noticed

(but also it's slightly easier right now since you are shiny and ichor is cheeto)

[lucid sundial]

do u know what a meowl is

[steel kraken]

Don't forget that bukkit got nuked by being DMCA'd to oblivion by a core contributor for other core contributors getting hired by Mojang

[devout vault]

Oh right, I forgot about that. That was wild

I was mainly thinking of stuff like the TiC vs GregTech wars

humble bundle offers a "all in one dev game dev bundle"
looks inside
doesn't include the drive and self-discipline to actually dev a game

We really gotta get on these companies for false advertising smh

[lethal walrus]

I thought it was more bc mojang had bought out the rights to the code and not that the people just happened to work for mojang?

Not a good thing to do either way but

[steel kraken]

It was something like that but a distinction without a real difference

[lethal walrus]

I think this was also back in the days bucket worked by just republishing the minecraft server source but under gpl, so mojang definitely could've got very mad at that

[red crest]

i thought it was just someone getting mad at something non-mojang related and reclaiming all the code they contributed but i was much younger when it happened and didnt pay too much attention

[devout vault]

same

[red crest]

after a quick google refresher: core contributors of Bukkit were hired by Mojang and as part of their employment they transferred the rights to Bukkit to Mojang and thus for a few years Mojang owned Bukkit but this was not made public. eventually it became public when someone who was not hired by Mojang but was a project lead announced Bukkit was shutting down due to some EULA stuff? after which mojang said "uh actually, we own bukkit lol you cant discontinue it". other contributors of bukkit who were not hired did not know Mojang owned Bukkit bc it was never revealed until that point that Mojang bought it. so that one dev DMCA'd his contributions to the project in response.

something about GPL licensing somewhere in there too and mojang using parts of bukkit for their official stuff maybe but then not following GPL idk

[devout vault]

huh

I can't see how a DMCA would make sense if the project is GPL, and Mojang didn't use bukkit code in official things (which I find hard to believe they would)

[red crest]

the GPL stuff im shakier on and couldnt find solid info about in my quick google refresher so take it with that grain of "maybe idk"

[devout vault]

One of my favorite types of grain

[supple ether]

Quantum Uncertainty

[red crest]

after a little less-cursory research bc im bored and was curious: the thing with GPL is because before Mojang bought Bukkit, Bukkit was hella violating Mojang copyright bc they were using decompiled minecraft server code in their repo. very legally in the wrong here but Mojang didn't ever care to enforce it even though Bukkit was claiming GPL. but then Mojang did buy Bukkit, so they were no longer illegally distributing Minecraft server code, because Mojang owned it, they cant illegally distribute their own work. But then, Bukkit was still supposed to be GPL. So you have proprietary Mojang code in a GPL repository. that code has to be made GPL too or else its violating the GPL license of Bukkit. but then if you make that code GPL, and that code is used in official, non-bukkit minecraft server code, the official server code must also become GPL. Mojang obviously was not going to open source their server code so that one Bukkit contributor DMCA'd his contributions because the distribution was no longer GPL compliant, which was the licence they made the contributions under

whether or not one side or the other is actually correct about that DMCA being valid or invalid or how GPL works with decompiled code was afaik never resolved because neither side relented and instead both sides just let the project die off (at least in its then-current form)

[devout vault]

Ah, so the standard reason why casey hates GPL, got it

[lyric bloom]

.. it sounds like they were abusing GPL and got hit

[devout vault]

I would go with misuse rather than abuse, at least pre-drama. Like, the intention being for the bukkit stuff to be GPL but the hooks in edited decompile not.

But GPL being so infectious is why I hate it, so not sure that’s even a “supported use case” for GPL

[lyric bloom]

i mean, GPL is basically a response to early Microsoft shenaigans, but yeah

[devout vault]

So, should I do this, or not.
https://itch.io/jam/demastering-jam-2025

And if so:

• should I try to make it actually run on the original console (not a requirement according to the rules)
• what game should I do it for

[devout vault]

don't care still hate it

[steel kraken]

it somewhat makes sense for foundational things like the linux kernel, but once you are in userland and nothing is truly dependency free, gpl is awkward

[rain apex]

At work we have some gpl code in proprietary shit that's not distributed

Apparently that makes it ok to not gpl the rest??

It confuses me

[steel kraken]

in gpl3 at least, they explicitly say a company can be the individual, and so as long as it stays inside the company, it was never distributed to other individuals

gpl2 might allow it also but its less clear

[red crest]

does that extend to different companies owned by the same parent company

[rain apex]

I guess it is true that it never leaves company computers

[steel kraken]

there is a clause in there about contractors or some other thing iirc

as Microsoft did try some schenanigans

Each time you convey a covered work, the recipient automatically receives a license from the original licensors, to run, modify and propagate that work, subject to this License. You are not responsible for enforcing compliance by third parties with this License.

An “entity transaction” is a transaction transferring control of an organization, or substantially all assets of one, or subdividing an organization, or merging organizations. If propagation of a covered work results from an entity transaction, each party to that transaction who receives a copy of the work also receives whatever licenses to the work the party's predecessor in interest had or could give under the previous paragraph, plus a right to possession of the Corresponding Source of the work from the predecessor in interest, if the predecessor has it or can get it with reasonable efforts.

the FAQ also has

Is making and using multiple copies within one organization or company “distribution”?

No, in that case the organization is just making the copies for itself. As a consequence, a company or other organization can develop a modified version and install that version through its own facilities, without giving the staff permission to release that modified version to outsiders.

However, when the organization transfers copies to other organizations or individuals, that is distribution. In particular, providing copies to contractors for use off-site is distribution.

I was very surprised by it when I ran into this 6-8 months ago, as it feels like a loophole in GPL as the whole point is to force opensource code, and as long as you keep it internal you don't

[red crest]

is the whole "a company can be an individual" thing actually legally tested or is that just what gnu says it means

[devout vault]

I mean wasn’t that a big part of a particular court decision (in the US at least) a while back

[red crest]

i have no idea

[lucid sundial]

unrelated sadly (idk much about GPL)

attempted to overclock my 32gb ddr5 ram from the base 5200 to 5800

fans went wild for a few seconds and my power button light was turning into a circus

..scared me so bad, but ran many tests, checke temp, event logs, hardware errors

nothing, so it seems stable

[worn remnant]

(i have been less terminally online for the last week or so, due to regularly scheduled maintenance american holidays)

[steel kraken]

I mean citizens united was all about companies are people and so their free speech rights are impeeded if they cant throw infinite money at political campaigns.
so GPL isnt the sole place where this happens

[red crest]

im aware of that, i just am not legally aware enough to know how a software license fits into that

[steel kraken]

the specific wording in gpl3 is

“The Program” refers to any copyrightable work licensed under this License. Each licensee is addressed as “you”. “Licensees” and “recipients” may be individuals or organizations.

[lyric bloom]

today in fun: discovering you do sorta need those shelves you had up on your desk, but they also are why your minipc has so much dust on it.

also more python adventures. >_>

[lyric bloom]

    if not databaseVerify.is_sane_database(dbMetadata, engine):
        #backup old file
        shutil.copy("rachennPokedex.sqlite", "oldRachennPokedex.sqlite")
        file_path = "rachennPokedex.sqlite"
        try:
            os.remove(file_path)
            print(f"File '{file_path}' has been deleted successfully.")

            dbMetadata.create_all(bind=engine)
        except FileNotFoundError:
            print(f"File '{file_path}' not found.")
        except PermissionError:
            print(f"Permission denied to delete the file '{file_path}'.")
        except Exception as e:
            print(f"Error occurred while deleting the file: {e}")
        finally:
            sys.exit(1)
``` Here's hoping this works like I think it does. >_>

i think finally only runs if try fails

time to check

ah, nop

fixes

[devout vault]

(We Americans do need holidays as maintenance thanks to the lack of regulations about work stuff meaning we get no benefits. Or negative benefits even sometimes)

[lyric bloom]

hm.. use curses or pyqt..

pyside, I think.

[uncut seal]

ok so

it turns out C is hard

I got kicked into hell by malloc and free

I can't figure out how to make char *repeat_string(char *string, int n) properly

Could someone explain how to make this work:

char* repeat(char* part, int l, int n) {
    char* result = malloc(l*n+1);  // I know this malloc is bad since it makes a new size each recursion layer
    if (n == 1) {
        strcpy(result, part);
    }
    else if (n%2) {
        result = repeat(part, l, n-1);
        strcat(result, part);
    }
    else {
        result = repeat(part, l, n/2);
        strcat(result, result);
    }
    return result;
}

[dusty pollen]

doing aoc day 1 one day late

except I can't pick a language

...what if this is when I start using rust

[hushed raven]

invoke carcinization, become crab

[dusty pollen]

temptation to ping selph is high

[hushed raven]

I completely forgot about aoc, I was too busy watching jinglejam

[dusty pollen]

day 1 challenge 1 looks fun

if I'm not paying attention to timing I could do it pretty quickly in python tbh

(quickly for me. not quickly for the code)

[uncut seal]

yeah, the 2 first days are pretty easy to BF

[dusty pollen]

I do love me some ipynbs

you know what, I feel like doing this day in python first and then attempting rust

[hushed raven]

reading the brief I was thinking "oh okay thats just addition and subtraction" until I got to the actual password definition XD

[dusty pollen]

I mean, it still is, isn't it

[hushed raven]

It is, but with extra steps that rendered my initial idea null and void

[dusty pollen]

two findings from profiling some python solutions:

• numpy is slower than not using numpy in this case
• file io is a hell of a bottleneck

jetbrains why tf is your rust ide 3.4GB

[crystal wren]

Bundled JRE!

[dusty pollen]

why would

huh

why jre

[crystal wren]

I mean their IDEs are all Ja.. probably Kotlin?

[dusty pollen]

blurgh

we're doing this in vscode then

[pliant snow]

I should actually give waydroid a try

i have no idea what i'd run with it, but we'll worry about that later

[lethal walrus]

Good luck on internet

[devout vault]

Instead of recursion couldn’t you just do a for loop of 0 to n, and copy the original string to &result[i * l]

[lethal walrus]

Seems to be very common it breaks, and in my solution I couldn't fix it

[devout vault]

The recursion is confusing me for this

Oh right AoC is a thing.

Hmm, should I pretend that I might actually try it all this year

It’s 12 days this time right?

[pliant snow]

Yeah, the recursion seems like a very bad idea. I think you should just be able to do

char* ptr = malloc(l * n + 1);
for (i = 0; i < n; i++) {
  strcat(ptr, part);
  ptr += l;
}

or something similar

[devout vault]

I couldn’t remember what strcat did since I basically never use it

(Since I always use c++ std string 😛 )

[pliant snow]

copies the string at the second parameter pointer into the first parameter pointer

I think it assumes it's null terminated

[devout vault]

I guess if it’s not null terminated you could just use memcpy (assuming there’s no string analogue)

[hushed raven]

'strcat' = string concatenate?

Or have I pulled that out my arse?

[devout vault]

I assume so but like I’m not gonna pretend I know C stdlib

[pliant snow]

it is

[hushed raven]

C certainly is one I don't see myself ever learning, as much of a brag as it would be, I think I would do poorly XD

[devout vault]

I think youd do ptr += l;? And also need a copy of the pointer before you iterate to return (or do the &ptr[…] thing I mentioned)

[pliant snow]

I guess you do need to worry about buffer overflow

oh yeah l

I think the function would return the original pointer location, yeah

[devout vault]

Something something this is why you don’t use single letter variables

[pliant snow]

and then the caller would need to remember to free

[devout vault]

(Don’t look at Moon Misadventures map generation code)

(To be fair a lot of that was because I pulled it from mathematical stuff)

[pliant snow]

well no, I guess buffer overflow shouldn't really be a problem, because you're the one allocating the memory

I'm not sure if strcat puts a bunch of nulls into the middle of the string tho

memcpy might be easier

[devout vault]

If I did AoC I should make it interesting by doing a new language

But I can’t think of any I care enough to try

[crystal wren]

...command blocks in Minecraft?

[devout vault]

I don't hate myself that much

Besides if I was gonna do it in MC it would be much more interesting to do it in redstone

[lethal walrus]

Use sethblings reasonable language that transpiles to datapacks?

[devout vault]

But then it's just using a weird more limited language

At which point why not use a normal weird more limited language, not a minecraft one

Unless I wanted to do visualization using MC mechanics I guess

[lethal walrus]

But then you can input your data and run it in minecraft

[devout vault]

That's insane given MC basically doesn't have reasonable text input systems 😛

[hushed raven]

Redstone would be a cool idea but then why not just use logic gates which is a much less painful ordeal BC there's no MC jank to deal with

[devout vault]

Or even number to some extent

[lethal walrus]

Book

Blocks

[devout vault]

I don't want to binary encode all my input

[hushed raven]

Discs

[devout vault]

because haha funny i did aoc in minecwaft

[hushed raven]

Bragging rights, good point

[crystal wren]

Plus side, got back in perfectly easily.

Downside, that.

[hushed raven]

Less than a week's worth on arch, glad you got back in

[dusty pollen]

brainf*ck

[devout vault]

A language with a swear in the name? On my Yoban framework laptop?

[devout vault]

I am once again seeing an addon/extension/etc. for an IDE that does this https://github.com/jotson/ridiculous_coding/raw/main/readme-example.gif

Now with extra distraction! (the key names)

Oh it popped up again

Sorry King the Luck, I might have watched it once upon a time but now I just can't, simply to spite the YT algorithm

Steam review: "Playing at 30 fps on PC is practically unplayable, it feels awful and makes you motion sick. "

...it's a 2d game????

[fleet wren]

is it like that one image that shows the Pokemon show is split between like 12 different streaming services

[devout vault]

(To be fair, the reason - if they are correct - is bizarre. What netcode nonsense needs the framerate to be lowered since the servers can handle the player spike???)

[fleet wren]

yeah found it

[robust quarry]

...hmmmmmmmm

[indigo mist]

@robust quarry You leveled up to Shepherd. Wow, you've been talking a lot! Have a prettier, slightly more brag worthy, shade of blue.

[robust quarry]

oh yay

[devout vault]

I mean I really don't know since I refuse to let the YT algorithm get a win for something they've been pushing for so long

[robust quarry]

and it was my catchphrase LOL

[robust quarry]

anyways- does this exist for VS code-

[devout vault]

Yes

[robust quarry]

asking for a friend

[devout vault]

I know I've seen it before

[robust quarry]

HMMMM

yesss omg

[devout vault]

Different name though

Unsure what

[devout vault]

(Also I just realized that pokemon has more episodes than one piece)

[robust quarry]

wild that this will be my fist forray into extensions-

[devout vault]

(Ash was a 12 year old for longer than whatever-one-piece-guys-name-is has been looking for the one piece (so far))

[devout vault]

Make sure to get this one.
https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=tonybaloney.vscode-pets

[robust quarry]

FOUND IT

[robust quarry]

i shall 🫡

[devout vault]

Huh, I know the ones I've seen before wasn't called "ridiculuous"

[fleet wren]

(on a close inspection it isn't that bad - if you're willing to sell your soul to Bezos Amazon has almost the entire series)

[robust quarry]

eh, bezos has most souls in the world atp

what's one more

[rain apex]

https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=hoovercj.vscode-power-mode

[devout vault]

suddenly sees a wind waker video

[robust quarry]

ty

[devout vault]

I really should get my wind waker modloader finished so people can make fun content for me to play

[devout vault]

Yeah that's the name I recognize

[rain apex]

What would wind waker mod loader be able to do

Does it have fun name yet

[pliant snow]

Legit tho, would you need a modloader for wind waker? Wouldn't you just patch the iso directly?

[devout vault]

For code mods

And multiple coexisting

[devout vault]

At the moment? Print some text to the screen and nothing else 😛

I have a bunch of ideas though

[rain apex]

Well it'd do stuff like compat right

[devout vault]

no

[pliant snow]

Just tell the authors just to not overlap

ez

[devout vault]

You're so right. That worked incredibly well back in the modloader days of MC modding

[robust quarry]

i am very overstimulated 10/10

[rain apex]

R there wind waker mods that add like new islands rn?

[pliant snow]

I really need to learn how to make gamecube homebrew

[devout vault]

Some of my ideas include:

• ability to add or overwrite songs
• ability to add or overwrite items
• ability to add or overwrite upgrades/alternatives for items (ex. the types of arrows)
• ability to add new oceans
• ability to edit specific nodes in the data files instead of overwriting them entirely

And then non-framework stuff, like bringing certain QoL features in from HD

[devout vault]

I think technically there's a few that add new locations, but not whole new islands

That's not really feasible without overwriting another at the moment

[rain apex]

The ocean isn't truly infinite...

[devout vault]

I'm just modding the wind waker decompile.

You can't edit the main code because they aren't even close to having it ready enough for code to be relocated. BUT, wind waker has many code files that are loaded dynamically anyways, and I tested adding code to the earliest loading one, and it worked.

Nope

Even if it was, the game turns you around if you try to leave the 7x7 grid

[rain apex]

Well that's ur first challenge then crime hard enough to get out of 49 cells

[devout vault]

I mean

Why do that when I can just allow people to make a second grid

(or third fourth etc.)

[rain apex]

How do u get to grid 2

[devout vault]

It's easier to allow you to leave, I think there might eeven be a gecko code for it

[rain apex]

If it is "you sail there" I'd count that as get out of 49 cells yeah

[devout vault]

But adding things out there is harder. WW doesn't keep the entire ocean loaded already because of memory constraints

[devout vault]

Up to the mod author I guess, but I was thinking going through a "normal" loading zone.

[pliant snow]

I meant more generally. I've found very few gamecube homebrew apps out there, it would be interesting to write my own

[devout vault]

Ah! Yeah I'm interested in that too.

I have a program locally that runs on windows, wii (could compile to GC if I wanted), 3ds, and web, but it doesn't do anything yet.

I even got angelscript running on all of them 😛

I need to get raylib running on the wii before doing graphics stuff

[pliant snow]

I'd like to do something like dump games from the GBA player

[devout vault]

ooooo

One of my crimes would need custom hardware for the GC, but I wonder if might be possible on the wii

[pliant snow]

I have a hardware modded GC so I could do this today if I knew how to write it

[devout vault]

I want to make a (3)ds be able to downloadplay from the console game, similar to how you can do with other DSs

[rain apex]

When I played WW i was always bother by how you just get the water orb

No dungeon

[devout vault]

I don't know about the GBA player, but I used devkitPPC (part of the devkitPro stuff)

[rain apex]

It would be cool if mod could let you add ur own water dungeon

[devout vault]

Yeah from what I understand that's cut content (I assume from time constraints).

People have datamined a little bit that makes it seem like greatfish island was originally gonna be an island with a dungeon. (And not actually be destroyed)

[pliant snow]

Yeah that's what I'm looking at. However I've found zero documentation as to what's actually inside of gamecube-dev

[devout vault]

Is gamecube-dev one of the packages?

[pliant snow]

yeah

[devout vault]

Custom dungeons is definitely something I want to be possible

Half the point of a wind waker mod loader is so people can make content for me to play 😛

(The other half is so I can make silly things myself, of course 😛 )

(ex. I have ideas on how to make a multiplayer mod happen - and recently I realized I might even be able to do it through the dolphin broadband stuff, rather than a custom dolphin fork where I can poke at the memory easily)

[devout vault]

I can look at my devkitppc later if you'd like, but it's mainly the compiler, some libraries, and some fairly minimal examples

[pliant snow]

Yeah that's what I figured

[devout vault]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/1pcb9mj/contemporaryprogramming/

[crystal wren]

https://www.anthropic.com/news/anthropic-acquires-bun-as-claude-code-reaches-usd1b-milestone

...hmm.

[fleet wren]

hmm indeed

[devout vault]

What kind of bun

Cinnamon bun?

[fleet wren]

it's a JS runtime/Node replacement written in Zig

an interesting acquisition choice for an AI company

[devout vault]

ew

[fleet wren]

(arguably the most high profile program written in Zig currently)

[lethal walrus]

sigh

well i guess that's where the VCs are repaid for bun.com

[safe dragon]

ewwww

bun was actually good

advent of code was a really tough day 2

they're ramping up quick

[lyric bloom]

bitrot is real when trying to find people who are making things work together

or: "so, wait pyqt has it's own model stuff???"

[marble jewel]

Linux peeps - what's your Terminal emultor of choice? Wezterm has been mine for awhile now, but I started looking at Ghostty. It's nice but missing a few things for me.

[fleet wren]

I use Kitty which is good enough for my case (tabs/panes, decent theming support, GPU accelerated, supports ligatures)

[marble jewel]

Yeah, Wezterm and Ghostty meet all those criteria as well. Which are things I look for (and why Alacritty is not an option for me)

[dusty pollen]

kitty has some fun ssh stuff too. when I realised I could kitten ssh into my uni servers rather than using normal ssh and it configured all the preferences in a sane way for me it was a game changer

[fleet wren]

the most I did with kitty was back when my desktop theme had automatic light/dark theme switching via a script I also set kitty to also switch its color scheme

[pliant snow]

I need to try some of those fancy kitty features, i never use them

What does kitten ssh offer

[devout vault]

It's cat themed

[fleet wren]

I would post the video I posted to r/unixporn but I hosted it on gfycat and the company went under

[heavy dagger]

https://reddit.com/r/unixporn

[devout vault]

What more would you need

[dusty pollen]

it auto sets all the config so it actually works, which is useful for things like my uni servers where I couldn't even use the arrow keys if I just sshed in

kitten ssh made it play nice with kitty and also did some auth management stuff iirc?

[devout vault]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLGfeiMdi1Q

This went a further than I expected from the title/thumbnail

[fleet wren]

ah, back when buying a pc meant buying a pc
keyboard, mouse, monitor, double speakers, the full package, none of this bring your own bs /s

[devout vault]

well, except this person had to bring-your-own literally-everything-except-the-case

[dusty pollen]

but isn't that worth it. the flames alone add 30fps

[devout vault]

True

[sand frost]

this looks like a welding helmet

like this guy: https://media.tractorsupply.com/is/image/TractorSupplyCompany/2021854?wid=554&hei=554&qlt=90&fmt=jpeg&resMode=sharp2&op_usm=0.9,1.0,8,0

[long verge]

Konsole came with KDE and I'm satisfied with it, should probably try other but atm it does the job so

(I use arch btw)

[marble jewel]

I use Arch Cachy btw

[lethal walrus]

i tried kitty but its confusing there's no buttons

so im on ghostty atm

[pliant snow]

Ive switched over the years, based on the simple metric of "when i type on them, which feels fastest". I went from alacritty to foot to kitty

[dusty pollen]

buttons?

what are the buttons for

pillow are you running this terminal on switch

[marble jewel]

Are you...using your mouse?

[lethal walrus]

no but like

apparently there's tabs

where do i make tabs

[lethal walrus]

no i just use uhh
no idea what it is there actually

OH

ctrl + shift + t looks to be tabs ?

[long verge]

• Jarvis, switch to kitty it feels faster
• Based on which metric ?
• Shut up jarvis

[dusty pollen]

who uses terminal tabs anyway. if you have a terminal emulator you have a wm

[lethal walrus]

oh thats actually cool

however i will stay with ghostty