pzwiki_editing

[languid kayak]

btw, while AI is good at judging some things, I guess nothing beats the human yet 😛 Didn't pick the vacancy sign and you left 1. 2. 3. @proud cobalt also I guess it should be alphabetized and you left it with the ordering https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Ominous_Sign&type=revision&diff=383785&oldid=382361

[serene sage]

no not more work

[digital helm]

gpt really likes to make lists numbered

better than nothing/random though - I guess that's the point, something for us to work off of

[languid kayak]

I doubt it will happen before b43 😄

if not later lol

as that's where the first npc stuff will come

(or at least it's teased to)

[serene sage]

ok phew I will be long gone that far into the far future

time to set up my great great grandchildren to pick up maintaining the wiki

0% chance for Kate and Baldspot to spawn as part of "K&B story"

they never existed and never will

[languid kayak]

well, I don't have the crystal ball either 😄 The latest thursdoid should be this week, but I didn't see any survivor story changes being teased in any prior ones

Speaking of which, maybe not anytime soon, but if TIS don't mind, I think an idea of having Thursdoids mirrored on wiki would be nice, similar as we have changelogs. We currently only link to them, but having them on wiki would allow to search for stuff easier (I often find myself relying on google and memory to find some info from old thursdoids or mondoids even) and cross link the articles easier – pinging @digital helm for food for thought.

[languid kayak]

(images btw)

[digital helm]

Yeah, I think that would be fine. Maybe a little redundant, as it's already on the forum, website and steam (is it on reddit?). But I don't have a problem with it.
If we did, I think it should have (blog) in the name, or something, otherwise add a new namespace.

Search function on the website is pretty good btw

[serene sage]

The section on the "building story" page about safehouses has some overlap with the section on the "survivor" page and I'm not sure how to have both articles mention safehouses without both being redundant

either it's split off into it's own article

or one of the articles will link to the other which has the more detailed analysis

[languid kayak]

A brief summary and {{Main}} is what usually does it right

if it's too much and you don't want to do it yourself, use the {{Merge|section=true}}

[serene sage]

guess it's time to work on this task then

[serene sage]

I have to find the icons for all of these items

why do electricians have bombs in their closets anyway

[proud cobalt]

Probably won't do any of this clean up stuff until after I'm happy with the articles. But feel free to

Oh it is too 😆 would have missed deleting the layer

[proud cobalt]

The image is also off by a pixel

[robust latch]

Kentucky moment

[serene sage]

my electrician when my card declines:

[serene sage]

why are there a bunch of corpses in the school library?

wait-

[proud cobalt]

I specifically told it not to add numbers to the list. I guess 3-4/650 isn't a bad failure rate

0.6% or so

[steep karma]

Welcome to kentucky, America.

[digital helm]

A link to that page should be enough. Otherwise It'll need to be updated manually after every change. The list on that page is automatically generated

[languid kayak]

Technically we can add icons to the script, but dunno

[digital helm]

I don't think we should. The page is slow enough to load as it is. It'd be worse than the item list page, as there's multiple duplicates

[languid kayak]

Speaking of loading times, I do have to test if webp images load quicker

webps are smaller, so they download faster for sure

The decode speeds for lossless webp are slower than png, though in decode speeds the actual compression algorithm matters.

I didn't really find any benchmarks on that though, and not sure if they really affect page loads. Can be done by converting a page with lot of images to webp and placing it in sandbox and compare both pages load times

For lossy there's https://cloudinary.com/blog/jpeg-xl-and-the-pareto-front#decode_speed but most images in the wiki are lossless 😛

[digital helm]

it's certainly worth experimenting with

[languid kayak]

Not for us, but interesting find https://nigeltao.github.io/blog/2021/fastest-safest-png-decoder.html

Not sure what the server uses internally, I guess standard libpng library 😛

[languid kayak]

(and yeah, seems the PNG for actually decoding is faster than WebP or JPEG-XL, that's why for games, e.g. zomboid I guess PNG serves best) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33448087

nigeltao

From the "Lossless Compression Performance" section of the article:> JPEG XL can do lossless image compression in a way that beats existing formats (in particular PNG) in all ways: it can be faster to encode, produces smaller files, and more...Does "in all ways" include any decode (not encode) speed numbers? Such numbers are dependent on the tes...

Hacker News · Nov 3, 2022, 7:33 AM

[lucid junco]

Welp, now Ive got 5 days free due to having bronchitis, meaning that I have time to continue doing logos

[digital helm]

the perfect recovery exercise!

[languid kayak]

😄

[digital helm]

food icon variants added

not sure there's much i can do here though. Had to add _Cooked to the variants, as muffin tray and crayfish use it

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Sharpgolden/sandbox
I think enough time had passed to bring this up again

Should I start implementing this page or are there any suggestions?

[robust latch]

This looks very promising and well written. Categorization is correct, you can add [[Category:Lore]] to the bottom though. I didnd fact-checked everything in Lore section but from now on we need to be careful about adding speculative information regarding Knox Event, so if all of these sentences are directly taken (or only very slightly adjusted) from The Knox Event Real Time then they are good. You can add Knox Event to see also. I dont see what will become out of the 2 red section links though, if they are too small to begin with I'd advise not creating a page for it, but about those 2 you have a more firm idea than i do i am assuming.

[lucid junco]

I had used Lore page and looked through each channel to see if I have something to add specifically about it

Military homes will probably be left without a page

[languid kayak]

(leaving that https://groups.google.com/a/webmproject.org/g/webp-discuss/c/FPOfZs2cCS4?pli=1 here in case someone will want to dig deeper before closing, but yeah, hard to tell exactly without testing in live when there'll be occasion :P; TL;DR webp is slower, but jpeg-xl is even more or as slow slow at decoding)

[lucid junco]

But smaller checkpoints are on verge of "Something that is too small to care" and "It is something worth creating a page for"

[robust latch]

I would leave it then

We basically have something that already encompassing the whole border

If they are just part of something bigger and have no value&context in them they shouldnt exist

[lucid junco]

Lore page is a bit fuzzy on dates of erecting and expanding of the Event border and it doesn't mention deaths of notable figures, though it can be found by looking through the channels logs

[robust latch]

Its on Project Lore job board, along many things

That will be done too, so yes dont refer to that just yet i am afraid

[lucid junco]

I was thinking about specifying which channels and reporters were interviewing on the border, but as it turns out its hard to get via messages alone

Only definite ones were Jackie and Frank

And Frank is the only definite notable person who died within refugee camp on July 15th

It also stands as a day when entire border falls

Thought as I said, its vague in the Lore page about other dates

[robust latch]

yup, check the Twitter for that

[lucid junco]

I had supposed this includes the LV border, so put 6th as a first date when it was erected

[lucid junco]

I need to go on twitter?

[robust latch]

You can wait for me jump on the Knox Event page too. If ever

[lucid junco]

This throws me off a bit

So, does this say that LV border wasnt there since people were freely moving into the city?

But it should have been erected before 9th of July, since reporters say that they are taking interviews from there

To be clear, TKEiRT doesnt have any mentions in between 6th and 9th about it

This is just a big vague

Widened by how much is unclear

Maybe previously there was only main checkpoint, maybe it doesnt include the LV border, so it was that big from start

But it puts a question whether burnt town was burned on 6th of July or 11th

and military homes

https://tenor.com/view/pepe-iasip-charlie-conspiracy-gif-11562330

though this line should be reworded I think

Date that can be used as "Fall of the border" is July 15th

ish

Lemme check why I wrote July 17th

LBMW page is shitty, sad to say it

Jonas and Emergency Broadcast lack proper dates, making it a bit harder to navigate

So, yeah, 15th is the date when military pulled out of the border, so its an end date

Thats the only concrete date about the border

14th is when Border and camp around it was breached and attacked. Frank dies from zombie attack within the camp while Jackie got away

Though its not explained why does the border already has a breach before the event, I suppose its just a convention

13th, 10th, 9th are dates when notable persons released their statements within primary military checkpoint

I can assume that suspiciously shaped tent is where they were interviewed

11th is a supposed widening of the border

Though as I said, its not clear whether its about LV border or border in general

6th-9th is when border was put up, unclear when

but definitely before 9th and after 6th

[thin cloud]

Intentionally vague, but the non-Louisville border of the Event Zone will always be off-map

[serene sage]

it's too late, I've finished them all

[serene sage]

so no Memphis? damn those cannibals would sure be interesting once we have NPCs again

[tulip kiln]

thought those guys were nashville

[serene sage]

right, oops

still though

[tulip kiln]

I'd prefer it not go different states, it'd be better they just focus on a smaller area than several states so it's easier to make a more polished map

it's a trap a lot of open world games end up running into

u make the game world too massive, it's harder to have a well-polished map

[serene sage]

right

I wonder how many mappers would actually try to expand the game map outside the current map boundaries though rather than fill up the area inside

not too fond of the boonies east of Louisville

[distant osprey]

Hello there, as i'm already translating the game in French, I wanted to try to edit french wiki. Is there already somebody working on it ?
Btw I don't know how or where to start, if someone could guide me, I'll appreciate.

[serene sage]

not a translator, but I think you can check out https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Project_Translations and join it as they're the ones who actually translate the wiki, also some pages are still being written/rewritten so they may not be ready to be translated yet. Pinging @languid kayak as you probably know more about this than me

also is there any way to increase the size of images in galleries? this is disturbing how it's not filling most of the page width

[distant osprey]

Alright thank you, I will take a look

[digital helm]

There's no one currently working on it. We have a translation guide https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Help:Translations
The pages I'd probably start with are the templates, specifically mboxes https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Mbox

The items pages are high traffic pages, if you'd rather do articles. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Items

Setting up a good way to assist with translating has been a work in progress for a very long time - we're currently looking at getting an extension that will greatly assist with it, but we're unsure when that will be available.

Let me know if you need any help

[distant osprey]

Alright, do I need to do something specific to start working on it ? I never edited a wiki in my life, so i'm really noob at it. I mean, when I translate something, is there some kind of "pull request" that is sent ? Or is it instant ?

[serene sage]

when you edit a wiki article, when you save it basically is "pushed" into the main article itself, though things can be reverted/changed

[digital helm]

As mid said, saving changes are live instantly. You just need to create an account then navigate to a page you want to translate. For translating, you can either follow a broken link (red), update an existing page or change the url by adding /fr e.g. pzwiki.net/wiki/Items would be pzwiki.net/wiki/Items/fr

here's a wiki markup cheatsheet https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Cheatsheet

[distant osprey]

Thank you 🙂

[digital helm]

Here's all the French articles https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Fr and articles that have been marked as 'translation needed' https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Translation_needed/fr

@distant osprey if you don't mind, we do actually need this translated. It's for the footer

PZwiki is the official wiki dedicated to sharing information about Project Zomboid. It covers all content relating to its gameplay, lore, and development. This is an official site of The Indie Stone, and is maintained by volunteers.
Want to contribute? Start on the community portal. For copyright information, please see copyrights.

[languid kayak]

Not really, as we have it all mirrored on the wiki 😄

[robust latch]

Articles under World and Player sections are good places to start. Also most locations (besides Doe Valley, Louisville etc.) are complete, they are also good to go for translating. I would stay away from:
1- Pages that will change in B42 -> Entire crafting, most skills, durability, animals and more.
2- Pages that have Improve, Underconstruction, Outdated or Stub tag.
3- Items and tiles because they are still getting updated on the wiki side. This one is a bit subjective though, up to you.

[distant osprey]

I don't know if you wanted this here, but here we go.

PZwiki est le wiki officiel consacré à partager des informations sur Project Zomboid. Il couvre tout le contenu lié à son gameplay, son lore, et son développement. Ceci est un site officiel de The Indie Stone, et est maintenu par des bénévoles. Vous souahitez contribuer ? Commencez par le portail communautaire. Pour les informations de droits d'auteurs, merci de consulter copyrights.

[distant osprey]

Thanks 😄

[serene sage]

looks fine from what little I remember from french class 😆

try uploading it onto the actual page now that it's good

[distant osprey]

Yeah I will try this out soon ^^ But I noticed that most of the fr pages have the old wiki style remaining. Do I need to do anything to update it with the new wiki style ?

[robust latch]

Compare it with the english counterpart

[distant osprey]

For example, can I press "edit" on the english one, copy/paste it in the fr one, and cancel edition ?

[robust latch]

You can if you want to, if you think the translations are bad&or outright way too old. If not try replacing necessary changes by hand

[distant osprey]

Aight, thanks

[lucid junco]

Arent Plonkies reference to that american junk food sweet that doesnt spoil that Ive seen in one video

Twinkies

They are also non perishable in game

[serene sage]

yup

actually quite a few of the in-game junk food are references to snacks from this one company

Sno-Globes, Choco Cakes, etc

[lucid junco]

Ill find them and reference

Though Idk how og snacks are called

[serene sage]

they're already on the pages for each of them

see: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Sno_Globes

in the first sentence it says they are a reference to Hostess Sno Balls

[lucid junco]

Shouldnt they be also in a Easter eggs page

Since thats where references are usually put

[serene sage]

yeah seems like they should

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak @digital helm

https://tenor.com/view/ghostbusters-egon-spengler-gif-24785581

[serene sage]

reminds me of a funny mod where the cure to the Knox Infection was a plonkie

made the game way too easy given how common they are

[lucid junco]

Now I want to try it

Stupid american food

[serene sage]

a lot of people like it in the US

a lot of them were sad when the company went bust 10 years ago

but they were bought by another company and Twinkies were brought back

[lucid junco]

Added them in

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Easter_eggs#Miscellaneous

[lucid junco]

Actually, there is also zebra cake by McKee Foods

[serene sage]

yeah that's the only one that's from a different brand

[lucid junco]

Though link in wiki leads to..

a fucking wayback machine

that doesnt work

Why would you lead to a wayback machine if there is a fucking wiki page

[serene sage]

no idea

[lucid junco]

Why they use a link instead of [[Wikipedia:

[serene sage]

guess this is what happens when things aren't updated in forever

[lucid junco]

I get mad

That what happens

Im wondering how many other food references are out there

[serene sage]

wow guys PZ ripped off diet coke /s

and regular coke

[lucid junco]

And pepsi

the blue pop

[serene sage]

yup

[lucid junco]

And fanta

[serene sage]

omg Kraft Dinner reference!!1!!!!1!!1!11!

[lucid junco]

Bourbon is jack daniels

100%\

[serene sage]

this is basically just Spam

[serene sage]

which version removed NPCs from the game? I'm looking at the patch notes on the wiki but got lost :(

oh wait nevermind I found it on the article for story mode

[lucid junco]

I think they were pretty much tied to the story mode

[serene sage]

yeah that's why I was asking

Building stories article is done

[serene sage]

time for some zombie hunting

[serene sage]

think we should have all 8 or so variations of strippers or only have one image for all of them?

[dusk yew]

dead for a week with travel and getting sick and seasonal pollen suplex but whosever efforts updated all the damn pages up to 41.78.16, I salute you

re: sweets though, does anyone know if the "unique food recipes" are actually functional in-game? ran into them a lot while doing the old food pages, it's one for tomato soup and one for "the cake is a lie" with an orange and blue berry

[serene sage]

I don't think they work anymore, apart from tomato soup which is basically just tomato + cooking pot with water

[dusk yew]

ah, fair

bummer

[serene sage]

think there was a tweet yesterday leaking some expanded cooking system though

stuff about chinese food and styrofoam containers

so who knows maybe Build 42 will make some of them work again

[dusk yew]

WHAT

is it finally time for more food pages

[serene sage]

probably

they might say more in the next Thursdoid

[dusk yew]

https://tenor.com/view/oogway-my-time-has-come-gif-8019684

[serene sage]

which is like this Thursday

[dusk yew]

food hyperfixation AWAY

[serene sage]

sources:
https://twitter.com/theindiestone/status/1795092020559552882
https://twitter.com/theindiestone/status/1795092592389972084
https://twitter.com/theindiestone/status/1795093487051833393

The Indie Stone (@theindiestone) on X

Your dream of running your own post-apocalyptic takeout restaurant has become a little more real #ProjectZomboid

Twitter · May 27, 2024, 1:57 PM

The Indie Stone (@theindiestone) on X

We're way ahead of you ;)

Twitter · May 27, 2024, 1:59 PM

they spammed these tweets yesterday so it should be a huge deal

[dusk yew]

https://tenor.com/view/yes-yas-wwe-scream-gif-17625417

I sleep: 300+ new weapons and thousands of pieces of literature forcasted to be added

real shit: one image of a takeout container

I live for the hyper-specific food items, you've given us previews of the vending machines, I am on my hands and knees for the snacks that will go in them, you're killing me!

...I'm gonna go eat lunch, I think my judgement is slightly impaired by low blood sugar

[serene sage]

oh right the vending machines

real shit indeed

I'm most interested in the new towns and the character voice lines

can't wait to hear my character whimper after force feeding them their 10th stick of butter

[proud cobalt]

Every edit you make goes straight to prod 😉 But dont worry anything can be reverted if you make a mistake

[proud cobalt]

You inspired me to get it done

[proud cobalt]

Give me some god damn primitive crafting. That's what im hyped about. Survival game go brrrrrr

[serene sage]

best part is the ability to craft a sledgehammer to finally put an end to those jokes

[languid kayak]

Hello, there isn't any organized "task force" or even active French editors at the moment, they come and go. The translations are detailed mostly in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Help:Translations – the new Citizen skin lacks French translation in the footer, so you can start with that
PZwiki is the official wiki dedicated to sharing information about {{ll|Project Zomboid}}. It covers all content relating to its gameplay, lore, and development. This is an official site of {{ll|The Indie Stone}}, and is maintained by volunteers.<br>Want to contribute? Start on the {{ll|PZwiki:Community portal|community portal}}. For copyright information, please see {{ll|PZwiki:Copyrights|copyrights}}.
I or Vail will have to add that manually.

For everything else, you can create (or edit) any page you want to translate as /fr, just keep in mind we skip {{Page version}} and Code section on non-English pages. The new templates should all have translation guide, you only translate bits of it, not the core code nowadays.

Also, we are still polishing both the English pages and ways to translate pages, so some things may change, keep that in mind.

[languid kayak]

Those are two separate galleries in your example; one is for Zone stories, another is for Building stories I guess?

[proud cobalt]

#pzwiki_editing message

[languid kayak]

oh, thanks :D. Slow to catch up as always 😄

[serene sage]

yup

the width is the real issue

[languid kayak]

go ahead, yeah 😛

[languid kayak]

The original link was available only in the US so I guess I switched to wayback machine, but feel free to replace it

[languid kayak]

It was originally whisky so it makes sense, though Jack Daniels isn't a bourbon 😄 The story behind bourbon is a forum post linked here btw: https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations/pull/282

[languid kayak]

we actually tried nailing the exact version some time ago in here, not sure we did nailed the correct one? I'd have to dig through history

[languid kayak]

Not sure anymore, they are vintage at that point, proof of concept that was never carried on, but maybe they do work, especially with mods (though I see mid said the cake one don't?)

[languid kayak]

The existing food ones need some love too, some templates, some cooked/rotten variants verifications, some need splitting too 😩

[proud cobalt]

Still on my break, but if anyone knows what IsLow actually does or where i could find the code responsible for it that would be awesome. I get the basic idea of it but would love to know specifics. @languid kayak Seems to know the most since his look into tiles

[dusk yew]

I'm nervous about splitting and like big decisions, but do you know any off the top of your head? I can pin them for looking at, currently I've only got one or two more stub articles I'm qualified to fix. Most of the remainder are locations, things I don't know how to do, or just need a distrib table here and there

[serene sage]

@robust latch @digital helm @lucid junco randomized stories is 100% done

we've got all the articles

the images

the outfits

I think it's done

finally

only took 8 straight days

6 hours each...

[languid kayak]

I only see I marked ice cream for whatever reason, but I'd love to go through each and every item page somewhere down the line to double check 😩
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Articles_to_be_split

The recipe ingredients got some some splitting rcently too

[dusk yew]

I was gonna add, just in looking at crayfish (which needs some work, on it currently) it seems like our code displayers are a little borked

like the former is what shows up, the latter is what's in the box- is it just me or did the formatting for viable recipe inclusions change? I think that might be what's cutting it off, but a quick glance shows its happening in crayfish, lobster, and fish fillet at least.

currently makes me concerned it's an issue for all the food items

also @proud cobalt I think this is your baby, any way to get the food recipes to show up? Tried a bit of fiddling but its connected to so many things it makes me a little wary https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Recipe_list

I can still go in and add its just nice to be able to visually scan like the rest of the catagories

[robust latch]

Congratulations, you did a lot of hard work. The pages look very good. Feel free to strike task as complete.

Let me know if you want to lead another sub project. ehehehe

[serene sage]

[proud cobalt]

Currently its not possible to display them all at the same time. If you just want a visual reference, go into edit mode, remove all the {{Crafting sections you don't need, then click preview. E.g. just leave the Food recipes section and click preview and it will show you visually

In the <noinclude> section i should add^

[dusk yew]

Ah, was worried that might be the case, but fair enough

[proud cobalt]

It's a limitation to do with the wiki and using the ll template. We're testing a workaround with the navboxes currently

But splitting the crafting templates back into language variants is really unideal

Its also a big factor in why most wikis have gone to using lua modules for recipes

[digital helm]

Thank you! We'll add it soon

[languid kayak]

too late; already added 😄

[digital helm]

I was thinking of just changing it to a list of available recipes, rather than trying to display them. E.g. something like

*motion_sensor
*amplifier
*receiver
*crafted_trigger```
Then we can also have a section for previewing a recipe before saving. Thoughts? @proud cobalt

[languid kayak]

not every, but some of the food recipes need escaping in <nowiki> and </nowiki> due to | in them, some are already escaped, some might not :/ I fixed the Crayfish for now

[digital helm]

I didn't know it was doing that. I might look into it so it's all done in the template

[languid kayak]

can you? If so, we'd have to go back and remove the nowiki, as I seen some pages having that

[digital helm]

It uses <syntaxhighlight> which is supposed to do the same thing, just with highlighting. I'll take a look

[serene sage]

@languid kayak people can merge images? how does that work?

just looking at https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:OKate.png and wondering what happens when they get "merged"

[digital helm]

It just means that they're an image of the same thing, so one should be replaced with the other.

[serene sage]

which one will be replaced tho?

[digital helm]

I'd say OKate should be deleted and Kate should be used instead. Since it was there first, and they're otherwise the same.

Btw, Faal has gotten a lot (all?) of the outfit images, which are here https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Outfit_images

[serene sage]

OKate seems to be what the actual Kate appears in the K&B building story, while the regular spawnable Kate seems to be random

since Kate's appearance seen from OKate.png seems to be what it spawns I think its more in line with what she would have canonically looked like

if it weren't for this fact I probably would have never uploaded OKate.png at all

[digital helm]

Ah, yes. I remember discussing that. Then we'll reverse it. Replace Kate with the OKate version

It was the others that the colours and hair were random

@serene sage feel free to re-upload Kate.png with the OKate version. Otherwise I can do it later. Not sure if this was discussed here or elsewhere about eventually replacing the K&B outfits with the ones in that story @languid kayak

[serene sage]

I’m away from my PC right now so I’ll let you take the wheel for this one

[lucid junco]

Good morning nerds

Since there were no noticeable critique to my Exclusion Zone Border sandbox page, I think Ill implement it today

[languid kayak]

Not directly really 😄 Just made it so we use the colors defined in codes. On one hand I wanted to delete yours and use mine instead, on the other hand, I'm not sure without looking what hair Kate has so didn't want to straight delete yours, hence the merge mbox ;P

[languid kayak]

just the NPC/survivor ones

going to work now, but doing some quick lookups, I noticed we have https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Safehouse page and it includes survivor zombies, there are survivor hordes too, not sure we want to have an articles about safehouse in MP too

[lucid junco]

Ik, even the text coloring isn't remotely the same

Thought Im curious if "Gone(?) Sun Foods" is a reference to something

@languid kayak @digital helm
Should we go a bit in depth about annotated maps?

They are telling some stories about previous survivors and have some ingame implications (stashes, cars, corpses spawn, ect)

I might be misremembering, but some of them even feature names

[digital helm]

Sorry, thought I replied. I think it looks good 👍 only minor thing like using {{main}} instead of using the heading as a link

[digital helm]

I think that could be helpful. I haven't looked at the multiplayer page in a long time, but if there's not much detail to add, it could go there

[digital helm]

Go as in-depth as you want, without speculating. You can use the {{Spoiler}} tag to notify readers

[lucid junco]

Idk how

Is it like {{Navbox}}

Or {{header}}

[digital helm]

I'm happy to add when you change it over. Otherwise it's just {{Main|PAGE NAME}}

[lucid junco]

Ooohh

I see now

[digital helm]

Whenever we say something like {{Main}} it's usually a template, which will be found at Template:Main which should have documentation

[digital helm]

Perfect

[lucid junco]

https://tenor.com/view/why-didnt-i-think-of-that-gif-27711265

It was easier than I thought

[languid kayak]

Minor nit @serene sage not sure if we want to trim the images or not, but I've been uploading them with all the gradient border visible, which turned to 128x256 or so, with arrow visible, just in case you want to keep them unified

[languid kayak]

At least we believe they are random 😄 I've yet to encounter those zombies in-game

[languid kayak]

It's it Shine Sun Foods? Like Sunshine, but reversed?

There's even a sun, not sure it's an existing brand?

There are stores like that, but might be coincidence

the logos are different I guess?

[lucid junco]

Sounds more like it 😄

[languid kayak]

That's the plan, yeah

[languid kayak]

There's both safehouse and factions, not sure these two are widely documented, but the bits of info and intricacies (like not able to camp spawn points at all) could be noted

[distant osprey]

To help people contributing to my language I wanted to start updating the community portal which is outdated. But, many link are red, and says that the page doesn't exist (for the /fr ones). Is it a problem if I post it the way it is with all the red links ?

A quick example (this is the preview)

[distant osprey]

I'm gonna create the pages needed for the red links little by little of course

[robust latch]

It is better to have red links than having blue english links. Dont stress about creating a page for every red link, there are 4000+ pages&categories.

[proud cobalt]

Red links are good! They encourage other users to contribute. Definitely publish with red links

[distant osprey]

Yeah ikr but I mean, if I can create at least pages related to how to contribute, it would be great I guess ? Or not, since people who want to contribute can speak english I suppose 😂

[distant osprey]

Aight, thanks 😄

[languid kayak]

It was briefly discussed whether the red links should lead to English pages, but they are intentionally red to allow people to create them. When you open a red link, you will have links to the page in other languages, maybe in the future it'll be more visible, but yeah, the red links should stay till the page will be translated 🙂

[distant osprey]

Alright, thanks for clarifying 🙂

[serene sage]

accidentally created a recursive subcategory

[distant osprey]

I have this issue, but I guess this one should stay in english, no ?

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak @digital helm Gun Stores are in POI or Buisnesses

May sound dumb, but I want to make a page bout them, like with conv stores and grocery stores

Oh, found it

So, Weapon store or gun store?

[languid kayak]

https://tenor.com/view/operation-teapot-nuke-nuclear-explosion-nuclear-test-nuclear-footage-gif-15618232923822161090

[languid kayak]

You can translate that if you want, see https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Administrators/tr for comparison

[languid kayak]

business I guess?

not sure, gun store seems to be just firearms, weapons might encompass other types of weapons I guess (if we ever get any lol)

[lucid junco]

Now he had became death, the destroyer of the wiki

[lucid junco]

I think Guns & hunting would be more appropriate

Since if something doesnt sell guns in ere, it sells camo clothes or camping gear

Why tf is Thumbs of Green is in it

Its a garden store

[distant osprey]

Finally, my first contrib ! Yay ! 🙌🏻
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Community_portal/fr

[languid kayak]

haha, feel free to take it out from there then

[lucid junco]

My favourite gun store

Love taking a shotty along with my flower pots

Is it "Sweet Satisfaction"

Or "Sweets Satisfaction"

There is definitely something after t in Sweet

[languid kayak]

Sweets seems indeed 🤔

well, I just moved it 😛

[distant osprey]

I was going to start with Mboxes as you suggested, but anytime i'm reading, I don't get how to translate it 😅 even when I read the "how to translate section". I don't get where to paste the code, I'm a bit lost about it.
I mean, I should translate each Mboxes pages seperately (such as this one https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Translate) and so, it will be shown translated when i'll go on fr pages ? I saw many of them are already translated, just need some improvments
Ok I guess I got it, here is the try I did : https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Outdated/fr. Does that mean it will be displayed in French as I translated when this template will appear on fr pages ?

[sharp axle]

i wish there was a loot tables thing so i could view what items spawn in each categorized room example, armystorage vs gunstore

if it’s possible it would be awesome

[robust latch]

{{Documentation/sandbox|doc =
}}
{{ll|Category:Mbox}}
</noinclude><includeonly>{{#switch: {{{1|}}}
| title = Bu {{{2}}} güncelliğini yitirmiş olabilir.
| note = Editörlerin bu {{{2}}}yi yeni bilgilerle güncellemeleri teşvik edilmektedir.
| #default = {{Error|translation}}
}}</includeonly>``` 
You can copy paste turkish versions and translate the context, as given in english in original template.

Most of the time just put <noinclude> {{Documentation/sandbox|doc = }} {{ll|Category:Mbox}} </noinclude><includeonly> at the beginning and an </includeonly>tag at the end.

[lucid junco]

269/423

Back to it

[lucid junco]

Andrei & Son?

[distant osprey]

Yeah i managed to do it I guess, but my question was, will it be automatically translated then on my language pages when used ? 😮

[robust latch]

Yes

[lucid junco]

Inkr Alley or Ink R Alley?

[serene sage]

probably Inkr or InkR

seems close enough to "inker"

[lucid junco]

I think second one looks clearer

[serene sage]

?

I can't tell the difference

[lucid junco]

Ive extracted second one directly from the game

First one was gaven to me

And I feel like the ones that were given are blurrier

[serene sage]

mmm ok

anyway

[dusk yew]

Its mild, but I agree with you that the second looks sharper. You can tell especially near clusters of the "neon" lines in the E. But I think either would work in terms of wiki resolution !

[robust latch]

Uhm. Would anyone like to lead Annotated Maps by any chance? I think some people are working on it.

[languid kayak]

Yes, c.f. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Controls/fr for example

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Room_definitions ?

[sharp axle]

🤯

ain’t no way

[languid kayak]

Though it only says what kind of items, the actual percentages are on the pages

[sharp axle]

no that’s exactly what i mean thank you so much

i’ve been looking

[serene sage]

I'll do it I guess

[distant osprey]

Ah pretty nice ! Thanks ^^

[serene sage]

I've already been cursed so yeah no way out now

[robust latch]

Alright, all set regarding the sub-project. Lets keep the job board as is, unless something new pops up.

[digital helm]

There's a minor issue that it sometimes isn't translated on the template page, but will appear correctly on articles

[distant osprey]

Alright, thank you 😁

[distant osprey]

This one isn't translatable tho
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Autogenerated

[digital helm]

Any templates that don't have the "translation guide" on them, assume they're not translatable yet. This one is very new and had to be set up quickly. I'll add it to my to-do 🙂

[distant osprey]

Aight, thanks ^^

[swift warren]

Should we still stick to the current translating method? Has Kirrus had some progress on translating extension?

[proud cobalt]

BTW due to how the wiki handles redirects it looks like theres alot of repeat items, if you hover over one the tooltip will say the specific name of the item.

[proud cobalt]

Kirrus is away at the moment i believe, last i heard it was very high on his to do list, but some urgent TIS work came up

[proud cobalt]

#pzwiki_editing message
#pzwiki_editing message

[digital helm]

I think the current method is fine for now. We've had some load time issues with them in some cases, but I think it's probably the best we can do with templates as they currently are. And as Calvy said

[lucid junco]

@digital helm @languid kayak @naive imp What should I do about gun stores?

I was thinking about creating a page about them like with others

But they are in the same category with hunting stores, camping stores and pawnshops

[languid kayak]

It's because of DISPLAYTITLE extension, and yeah, it's confusing sometimes :/

[languid kayak]

a general page? sure

as in a general page like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Gas_station or https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Convenience_store

ntw, I guess convenience store could use an image like a gas station so it appears in a preview?

[lucid junco]

Yes

Should I make a Weapons & hunting stores page, or just Gun stores

Thought there are no "weapon stores" in game

If a store sells guns it is a Gun store

If it sells gear, then its a camping store

If both, then its either a hunting store or military surplus

Idk why they are in one category, maybe for convenience sake

[languid kayak]

"gun store" I guess

Singular, as on the main page:

Businesses
Army surplus store • Church • Construction site • Fire department • Gas station • Grocery store • Gated community • Laundromat • Liquor store • Police station • Self storage • Wrecking yard

though dunno to 100% following the recent discussion?

At worst a redirect will serve it I guess though lol

[lucid junco]

How do you revert changes

[robust latch]

Edit history

[languid kayak]

oh right, gotta update the pics first 😛

oh nvm, it was mid 😛

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Exclusion_Zone_border

Page created

[languid kayak]

@digital helm Should it be Annotated Maps (in-game name) or annotated maps (sentence case?) https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Annotated_Maps

[languid kayak]

An oldie, that I didn't mark, but I guess this is fine to go @proud cobalt ? https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Keep_Afloat_Debt_Consolidation&curid=28239&diff=361591&oldid=354645 (IIRC you were the one adding it :P)

[lucid junco]

What a nice view

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Gun_store
Page created

[lucid junco]

[proud cobalt]

yeah np

[languid kayak]

As opposed to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happysad

[lucid junco]

Which one should I use?

[proud cobalt]

I go for tiles pointing left so 1st one

[lucid junco]

Tiles that are facing left are generally brighter

For some reason

[languid kayak]

huh, interesting the name's slightly different, I prefer the 1st one too

[languid kayak]

Probably intentional, simulating shadows kinda

[lucid junco]

Not really

I dont see the difference between `n' and n'

[languid kayak]

there's one ' difference 😄

Actually, the naming on the wiki are inconsistent

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Fryer_Tooks_Fish_N_Chips
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Milk_N_More
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Gas_N_More

but https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Haircuts_n'_More

Should the last be renamed? The n is lowercase though

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak @naive imp

Do we consider this as a separate business?

[languid kayak]

You mean the name?

Might be

[lucid junco]

Because wiki doesnt

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I recently changed the name of it, but might indeed be two unrelated ones dealing with the same thing

[lucid junco]

Beer & Liquor considers it as one the same

[languid kayak]

I guess they could be split, yeah

[lucid junco]

But I think if devs wanted it to be one from the Beer & Liquor chain, they would have.. you know, used the same logo

So is this one

Im no english expert, but there is a difference between "&" and "+"

Ill split them if no one minds/beats me at it

286/423

Huh

[languid kayak]

one is a redirect

[languid kayak]

That's more than 2/3rd!

[lucid junco]

But shouldnt redirect automatically show og name?

[languid kayak]

I think not in the search

[lucid junco]

Huh

[languid kayak]

that's Citizen or Vector btw? As I don't have it on Citizen

[lucid junco]

Vector

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Beer_%26_Liquor

Edited

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Beer_%2B_Liquor
Page created

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Liquor_store#List_of_chains
Updated

[languid kayak]

https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2024/05/image-103.png
*The National Dispatch
*The Kentucky Herald
*Louisville Sun Times
*Knox News

4 newspapers we'll see

(they will likely have straight headers, mind you)

As another part of us bedding down in the lore, meanwhile, we are also making sure that characters in broadcasts, flyers and newspapers who have an evident place of work (or place of demise) have their zombified forms spawn at the relevant location on the map.
So probably more zombified NPCs

[lucid junco]

Yay

Unrelated, getting unlogged from another image, cant update it proper

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Lbmw_network_logo.png

[languid kayak]

why? What's the problem?

[lucid junco]

I dunno

[languid kayak]

oh and I missed the mark lol

[languid kayak]

It's caching

add ? to the end of the URL

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Lbmw_network_logo.png?

[lucid junco]

Thanks

That doesnt change anything

It didnt update

The file is bugged

[serene sage]

finished the article about Rosewood's annotated maps: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Rosewood_Annotated_Maps

so with five done, there remains 70 more from the other towns

[languid kayak]

It did, it's still catching, go to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Lbmw_network_logo.png? again

[serene sage]

honestly the Rosewood maps are pretty terrible

[lucid junco]

How is it cashing so badly

[languid kayak]

sometimes it happens, maybe higher traffic this time around?

[lucid junco]

If I have a nickel for every time image cached weirdly in wiki, Id get two nickels. Which isn't a lot, but it's weird that it happened twice

https://tenor.com/view/phineas-and-ferb-doofenschmirtz-if-i-had-two-nickels-gif-15378229905369786221

[lucid junco]

Stop doing my job /j

Damn rookies come out of nowhere and steal my job that I would have done in the future™

[serene sage]

can't stop me lol haha

what'll you do, send the FBI to my house? \s

[lucid junco]

Oh my fucking god

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Aa_ron_hunting_supply.png

Again

3 nickels

Though it appears that @languid kayak had already beaten me

[languid kayak]

me the entires time

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Stor-A-Max
What should we do with this

Store a max is a really weird chain

Its not a 100% self storage chain

And has a bunch of trailers with names on them

[robust latch]

They are mentioned in gallery which i think is enough?

Maybe a trivia can be made to honour these trailers

[languid kayak]

It seems they provide self-stores but also movable houses/trailers for constructions

[robust latch]

To me what the article already has is enough but i can dig if someone wanted to add extra information

[lucid junco]

The rousewood one is more or less a storage

[robust latch]

It is just another instance of a storamax trailer no?

[lucid junco]

Maybe

[robust latch]

Maybe 🤔

[lucid junco]

It also can be interpreted as "this is a log dump that stor a max owns"

Idk how you call places where logs are stored

[robust latch]

Lumberyard i think

[lucid junco]

Thought others leave a room for a bit of doubt

[lucid junco]

At least the Exclusion zone border one isnt mentioned

[robust latch]

Most of them probably arent, they re just there to give couple examples

[naive imp]

That is "logging camp (rosewood)

It had its own page already

Those trailers look like repurposed storage containers which are common to use on jobsites and other industrial applications where office space is needed

Which is also why they're always office themed

The logo on them can be interpreted as the containers belonged to them but were since repurposed

https://storage.mobilemini.com/office-solutions/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=nonbrand-temp-offices-gulf-south-division https://storage.mobilemini.com/office-solutions?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=nonbrand-temp-offices-gulf-south-division https://storage.mobilemini.com/office-solutions?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=nonbrand-temp-offices-gulf-south-division&&_bt=696121756455&_bk=container office&_bm=e&_bn=g&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwx-CyBhAqEiwAeOcTddI4srZWChsEaD1iUV0XPzPW6EZq695M_k2F6DKvWBSmEF7bs4grLxoCzsQQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Basically these

[lucid junco]

Aight, fair point

[naive imp]

HOLY FUCK yall gotta check the thursdoid that dropped just now

All kinds of crazy shit in there

[serene sage]

them cutting some of the crafting stuff out of the unstable release is the best part

maybe maybe a June release might happen

(I am delusional)

[languid kayak]

Yeah, seems some of the crafting stuff will make though, like fluid systems and workstations

[robust latch]

December

[serene sage]

also the map polish is pretty much just as good as the map expansion

should make exploring the four towns fun again

[languid kayak]

Yeah, the Muld expansion sceeens are imporessive

there are homes near the police office

The only bad part about this thurtoids is having to wait a month for the next one 😩. Unless some #tweets happen in between

[serene sage]

they revealed styrofoam containers through their tweets so yeah we'll only be sustained by tweets for a while now

[languid kayak]

the containers are on the screen too btw 😛

[serene sage]

the whole PZ community right now is basically like some guy lost in a desert who's trying to find water

every so often he finds an "oasis"

then it disappears when he gets close

[lucid junco]

"They wont change old towns in b42"
Im glad that I was wrong

[languid kayak]

no b42 for you, come edit the wiki

The interesting bit though, when inevitably b42 drops, will the wiki get more updates or the opposite as everyone including us will be busy playing the game 😄

[serene sage]

I spend a few hours a day on either the wiki or the game, I'll just double the time I'm indoors and it'll work out

[lucid junco]

But that also means that we will have to manually add in businesses, since map won't be updated any time soon

[languid kayak]

I finally got myself to at least slightly update the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Tiles pages – @proud cobalt I think the links to non-movable tiles with some exceptions (Well, Fireplace) should be removed, not sure we'll make individual pages for the non-movable tiles unless they will be movable at some point? They don't really have names either.

[lucid junco]

At least in game map can be used for that

[languid kayak]

Also not sure we want to use https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:& and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Or – since they aren't used in the recipe templates anymore, they are only used on the tiles page. Thoughts? @digital helm @proud cobalt?

Though they were brought up to date not so long ago (13 may) 🤔

[lucid junco]

Im curious about how old towns update and map expansion will affect coords on the map

I hope that we wouldn't have to manually readjust each coord of each business

[languid kayak]

true, with debug mode it should be not so hard too.

Alternatively, it's possible to generate the map yourself, I used one of the tool in the past, but a PZmap can be made that way too, but it will require several hundred GB of free space if not more, although I don't know how compatible they will be with the more than 7-layer hights and basements, as I didn't see they are on the cutting board for b42 unstable.

The tool I used (forgot which one) generates a map in the format of https://pzwiki.net/w/images/7/70/Knox_Country.png

[serene sage]

several hundred gigabytes? is that actually how large the map is when you load in all the cells? my pc

[languid kayak]

https://github.com/blind-coder/pz-mapmap

possibly hundreds of GB of space. For reference, the main Project Zomboid map occupies 461 GB after this.
And I think it wasn't the most recent version either

as tge readme was updated in October 2021 this didn't include the new areas (Brandenburg and Ekron, though maybe the spots were still occupied by trees, so maybe it wouldn't be that different)

[serene sage]

when did the unfinished Brandenburg actually appear in-game anyway? anyway it seems like a barren wasteland with no trees

I tried to survive in Brandenburg once through debug mode, the town was quite empty but a few POIs were actually functional and had loot spawning in them

[naive imp]

[serene sage]

I feel like if this town were a spawn point in B42 this would be my new favorite spawn

[naive imp]

FUUUUUUUCK

PTO here we come lol

Gonna go on my room dwelling gremlin arc lol

[serene sage]

I'm concerned about how much B42 will set back Project Lore

new newspapers

books

vhs

changes to randomized stories

[lucid junco]

Me after trying to run it on my laptop:

[languid kayak]

Not sure if we can do something about it, but the new Black Saddle logo is almost invisible in the dark Citizen 🤔 Pinging @digital helm for this

[lucid junco]

Oh yea, this and the olympus logo

I can't see both of them in vector

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Build_41#Build_41.73 – Still better than Ekron – it's just roads

(or Irvington, which is just the trees :D)

[serene sage]

"Gordon, get away from the-" *explosion*

[languid kayak]

At least no NPCs lol

[serene sage]

what about Indiana? not even any trees

[lucid junco]

100% CPU Usage 100% RAM Usage "Shut it down. Its not, its not shutting down. AAAAUUUGH" Louder explosions

[languid kayak]

Speaking of which, since we pretty much cover Brandenburg and Ekron now, I never got idea what is this; https://map.projectzomboid.com/#15442x1314x1236

[robust latch]

Dont worry, we will prepare for those too. Also the VHS and CDs are deployed so we are slowly editing them.

[languid kayak]

I like to call it Fort Knox, though it's definitely not that 😄 (nor location or layout)

[serene sage]

seems to be a civil war era fortification

idk not american

[lucid junco]

https://map.projectzomboid.com/#464x9897x1512

What is this town?

There aren't even any buildings there

[serene sage]

imagine needing to put in the wiki every single possible line of dialogue, every personality type, every possible relationship, etc

[lucid junco]

Though there is definitely a church
https://map.projectzomboid.com/#447x9928x20054

[languid kayak]

Ekron https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Ekron&redirect=no

[lucid junco]

Making it a.. 23rd church in the game

[serene sage]

is kentucky part of the south? sometimes it seems it is, and sometimes not

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Red_oak_apartments_logo.png too

[lucid junco]

And this one

[languid kayak]

What is the olympus though?

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Olympia_department_store_logo.png

[languid kayak]

oh, just the part of it, indeed

Didn't even realize there's something there lol

Pinging @digital helm for that too, I wonder if we can do something about it other than manually editing it 🤔

[lucid junco]

Change the theme, obviously

[languid kayak]

Huh, I just realized we don't have https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/File:Appliances_cooking_01_24.png but we do have https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Appliances_cooking_01_25.png and the microwave in game uses a 24 instead of 25, which is facing in wrong direction

[languid kayak]

Out of curiosity, I extracted four different tiles, but when cropped, they are 1:1 the same 😄

(cropped)

[dusk yew]

anybody know what the "node count, limit exceeded" error means? was looking to add crayfish to the crafting template but no matter how I fiddle with it its just not having it

it should be as simple as adding the marker up top and then the actual code for crayfish (which is basically the code for lobster) underneath, but every time I do it has a hissy fit, I think it's something with the code specifically since I can add the empty referal to crayfish just fine up top

[languid kayak]

It's the limit we've been dealing with, often caused by {{ll}} or similar templat usage, if it hits then the error is displayed

Ironically, I don't see any manual explaining it…

Actually, I think this explains it? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Template_limits

[dusk yew]

Shoot, uh

so does that mean no new recipes?

[languid kayak]

not sure, maybe @digital helm or @proud cobalt can be more helpful on that

[dusk yew]

I was purging blocks of non-food crafting recipies and references to try out just if it was like a hard limit, but it looks like even that was a no-go with the error- for sure, any help would be appreciated!

[languid kayak]

btw, just in case anyone wonders, the movables images are also cropped (at least it seems so) in-game

[digital helm]

I think categories should ignore the in-game name rule and just use sentence case

[digital helm]

If it has the apostrophe in the sign, should probably be in the page title then too. Redirects will help here

[digital helm]

I think these ones though @languid kayak should be without the s, as they appear in-game. I think we should prioritise not pluralising page names otherwise they become a PITA to link to.

[digital helm]

They're used on the tiles pages, specifically for tools. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Tiles#Cooking_appliances Brought up to date as other languages used them too. I'm happy to remove them eventually

[digital helm]

Might have to adjust the brightness on these ones, to something neutral. Thoughts on it not being the authentic logo? @lucid junco

[digital helm]

Is this in recipe list? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Recipe_list The recipe will work, just won't be able to preview it. I've got a workaround on my to-do so you can preview it
Or is it somewhere else?

[digital helm]

I'll take a look at adding 32x32px or img max-width: 32px and max-height: 32px for the tile infobox. Which should fix those icons that are hard to click
@proud cobalt or do you think having the ability to make it bigger than 32px is still better? as discussed a while ago

[digital helm]

@languid kayak I've reuploaded OKate.png to Kate.png (keeping original dimensions) - I've also removed the arrows, I think this looks cleaner. Should we do this for all outfits?

[lucid junco]

The Cosy Crackpot

[proud cobalt]

Nothing inspect element cant fix 😆 #pzwiki_editing message

[proud cobalt]

The cache can be pretty rough sometimes, was much worse in jan-feb

[proud cobalt]

Me with Louisville

[digital helm]

I've made Template:Autogenerated translatable, and moved over your translations to use it.
You also may want to translate this template https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Page_ns a lot of the mboxes use it for words like "article" and "section"

[proud cobalt]

They said more info in the next monthoid, so im hoping for July at the earliest

[proud cobalt]

Im happy with that, fireplace deserves one

[proud cobalt]

My plan is to swap the tools for tool tags like the crafting templates, but definitely with an image by that point

[proud cobalt]

I think it was an accident in one of the last few updates

[proud cobalt]

Project lore was mostly set up for VHS but with the idea of B42 in the future, so not set back just expanded

[proud cobalt]

Yes

Kentucky is deep south

[proud cobalt]

I hate this

[proud cobalt]

It still works! it just wont display on that page. Its a known issue. If you add the code and save it then call the recipe on another page it will still work. Please still add the line to the top as well, it wont show but it keeps a valid list for when we have a solution (Translation extension)

Oh @digital helm beat me to it 🙂

[proud cobalt]

#pzwiki_editing message

[proud cobalt]

Also @naive imp

[proud cobalt]

Wow thats going back a while. I dont particularly remember the issue, i think the tile infoboxes look ok these days. Unless im missing something. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/White_Standing_Sink

Ok that's my spam done. Been incredibly busy irl so i'm on an impromptu wiki break

[proud cobalt]

Could we add file to this? Archive just says page https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Appliances_com_01_0.png

[lucid junco]

307/423

[proud cobalt]

https://tenor.com/view/hai-gif-10567033442484308038

[lucid junco]

Fuck

I had used "None" Interpolation, instead of "LoHalo"

Is it noticeable?

[digital helm]

It's more of an issue for tall and thin images like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mannequin
It currently sets a border around the img element, so it'll scale with that. so I don't think my solution would work anyway.

[proud cobalt]

Ahh yes, having a minimum width would be good

[digital helm]

I forgot I was going to look into the images cycling! Thanks for the reminder 😄
I don't think this would be a solution for removing the &/OR on the tiles pages though, as it uses things like "Propane Torch" & "Welder Mask" - but could also just display it as it is in recipes

[digital helm]

Took me a minute to get this 😅 I'll add it now

[digital helm]

not really. I think it's fine

[lucid junco]

A bit jagged for me, but aight

[distant osprey]

Amazing thank you, I noticed another untranslatable one, the following one : https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Page_version

[proud cobalt]

Page version is only used on english pages

[distant osprey]

Oh my bad then, thanks for clarifying

[proud cobalt]

Np, its used to add them to this category https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Version. The old header also added language pages but it was decided we wouldnt add them with the new header.

The version category only finished getting cleaned up in the last few weeks

[lucid junco]

@digital helm @languid kayak
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Army_surplus_store
What should we do with this page?

I mean, redesign at least, but should we merge it with Gun store?

Though, thinking about it, its distinct enough to have a separate page

[digital helm]

They seem pretty similar... at least their loot is. The whole "camping and hunting" thing.
I'd consider merging them @naive imp

[lucid junco]

Difference is, not every gunstore has an armysurplus, but every armysurplus has a gunstore

It can even been seen on map with roomdef

And army surplus has more broad items it can spawn, be they meds, clothes and camping items

[digital helm]

sounds reasonable enough to keep them separate then

I guess it also has camo clothing

[lucid junco]

https://map.projectzomboid.com/#13258x5440x18471
Also, is this shooting range a gun store?

Since it has a gunstore roomdef

And probably sells guns

[digital helm]

I don't know the whole gun/hunting scene, but I'd probably keep shooting range and gun store separate. Is there more than 1?

Maybe include in see also at least?

[proud cobalt]

It is most likely just to spawn the right loot instead of making a new roomdef. Many ranges have attatched gun stores but not in house. At least in Australia

[lucid junco]

Nope

There is currently only one shooting range

And its a bit strange to see that there are only 3-4 gun stores outside of Louisville

2(3) in doe valley, 1 in Fallas lake and 1 in WP

[lucid junco]

Funnily enough, there is only one actual camping store in the game

Out of these, Bait shops dont sell anything hunting related(unless you call fishing a fish hunt)

"Hunting Centers" are just gunstores trying to mask themselves

Pawn shops are a separate category completely

Unnamed camping store is the only one that sells anything hunting and camping related

Books, tents, clothes

Farming and Rural Supply does sell hunting clothes If I remember correctly

That was a really long way of saying "The arbitrary categories in the navbox are ridiculous"

[distant osprey]

Alright, all translatable Mboxes have been translated 🥳
Let's get into something harder 😂

[distant osprey]

A little question, is it possible to change "pictures" with my language translation on the wiki ? If it's the exact same picture but with french written on it or is it too complex or impossible ?

I'm completing the health pannel page where the fr translation is incomplete, and I was wondering for the picture

[proud cobalt]

You'd have to upload a new image. Here's an example for Brazilian Portuguese
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Criacao_de_Personagem_Tracos.png

[distant osprey]

Oh okay thank you, but i'm really noob in editing wiki, where should I upload the file ?

[proud cobalt]

Either here https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Upload

Or you can upload directly in the article by draggin images into the edit box

[distant osprey]

Oooh nice ! Thank you very much 🤩

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Army_surplus_store
Page remade

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Shooting_Range_(Valley_Station)

Page created

Im a bit unhappy how it turned out

But oh well

[distant osprey]

Just noticed a little mistake on this page about Hyperthermia, but entitled Hypothermia on the right above the icon 😮
Should I edit it ? Or somebody in charge with English will do it ? Just to know since i'm a beginner, I don't wanna do something wrong 😅

[lucid junco]

@serene sage which annotated maps are you going to do?

which town

[digital helm]

yeah, anyone can edit anything 😄

[distant osprey]

Fine thanks ! I'm going to edit it right now then 💪🏻

[digital helm]

I guess there's scope for this to change in b42, since 'camping' loot is lacking currently

[digital helm]

looks fine to me. Just the title should be sentence case: "Shooting range (Valley Station)"

[serene sage]

I thought it was in-between south and north

some people say Louisville is more north and Lexington is more south

but anyway 23 churches on the map seems like a lot but still a reasonable amount

[distant osprey]

One more question, sorry. When I'm done translating a page where the "Translate" Mbox is set, should I remove it myself ?

[digital helm]

yeah, remove it if translated

[distant osprey]

Alright thank you 😊

[digital helm]

Any number of questions is fine

[lucid junco]

What are these %

[serene sage]

chance of spawning?

[lucid junco]

No, I mean why are they so fucked

[serene sage]

damn only a 2-4% chance for some beer

[lucid junco]

Pistols can spawn in drawers

Tis T shirt is one of the rarest Wardrobe items

[serene sage]

I find gun cases like every four houses

I think something's wrong with the percentages

[lucid junco]

I dont

[lucid junco]

Anyway, where did you get annotated maps images?

[serene sage]

I used the stash debugger thingy that can be found in debug mode

there's a large list of maps to spawn in

[lucid junco]

The maps themselfs

Did you print screen them

[serene sage]

once spawned, you have the map and you teleport to the location of the stash

yeah I screenshotted them

[lucid junco]

Biker zeds can spawn with guns

[serene sage]

makes sense I guess

[lucid junco]

Were you planning on doing Riverside?

[serene sage]

I was planning to do all of them, but if you want to you can do some of them

might actually need the help

[lucid junco]

Riverside is mine

I KNEW IT

Corpses can spawn in car seats!

I thought I was going crazy and they never did

[lucid junco]

162% chance

[serene sage]

cool, just don't take West Point (my love ❤️)

[serene sage]

ok so they're not out of 100%?

[proud cobalt]

These are the real effective chance. The distribution tables round to 2 decimal places

[serene sage]

[lucid junco]

Definitely not

[serene sage]

weird

[proud cobalt]

161% could be true it would just mean it spawns in every time it is rolled

[serene sage]

seems like a really specific number

why not just 100%?

[proud cobalt]

Because it's effective chance not actual chance, pz uses a complicated function that uses chance and rolls to choose items from a loot table. Effective chance just gives an idea of how likely it is for that item to spawn

[lucid junco]

Huh

[serene sage]

probably a "personality" trait they used when NPCs existed

[proud cobalt]

https://www.reddit.com/r/projectzomboid/comments/12eq1b9/the_lucky_trait_wont_really_help_you_find_a/

This post gives a good insight into spawning mechanics

[lucid junco]

Probably

[proud cobalt]

100 * item chance * loot rarity multiplier * lucky or unlucky multiplier + 10 * MIN(8, density factor)

[distant osprey]

What does an "in game tick" refers to ? Having trouble to translate it

[lucid junco]

Literally me

What is hypochondriac

Oh, fake infected

[serene sage]

damn seems like the Lucky trait is pretty much the same as Unlucky

never tried taking lucky nor unlucky

maybe next time I will take unlucky

[proud cobalt]

A tick is a measure of time, it is the smallest possible time between things happening in game. It is also used to track time.

I believe zomboid runs on 60 ticks per second. Meaning 1 tick is 1/60th of a second. So a tick is word for 1/60th of a second

[lucid junco]

Omg guys, cassettes coming in b42

[serene sage]

isn't that the VHS icon?

[lucid junco]

maybe

[serene sage]

though the other colored icons seem suspicious

[proud cobalt]

Yeah a 10% buff doesn't turn out to have much of a change in effective chance. You'll have a much bigger difference based on the density of the area

[robust latch]

That may be true, lucky not being the most effective loot spawn modifier. But one cannot deny how impactful the damn trait is

[languid kayak]

yeah, they look better indeed 🙂 You just added the gradient manually or is there a way to hide arrows in the character creator? Either way, can copy that for other outfits now, just gotta add proper look for Bob and Raider

[serene sage]

hmmm

might want to do some testing

[robust latch]

It pays dividince when you pick it. The difference between lucky and not having any luck trait is plain and observaeble imo.

Easily S tier

[serene sage]

surviving in West Point for a week with the same sandbox settings and seeing what we get from looting the same places

usually I pick neither

[digital helm]

cassettes have been there since waklie talkies and the other radio items were added 😄

[serene sage]

I don't really like the small hit I get with Unlucky (no mater how small it's still there)

[languid kayak]

There's no way it can be right!

[serene sage]

but I also think for four points I would rather spend it on something like Baseball Player rather than Lucky

[digital helm]

This was a really interesting read! Just like real life, luck is just a psychological mindset 😄

[languid kayak]

literally unplayable! (jokes aside though I guess it could be reported as a bug if not already fixed in b42)

[digital helm]

nah, I just coloured over the top of it. Thankfully the gradient starts higher on the image, so it's just a solid colour where the arrows are

[distant osprey]

Oh alright, thank you

[proud cobalt]

Yes it is! This is what I based my formula off of for distribution tables after some follow up research

[proud cobalt]

This ended up being my final formula

final_chance = round((1 - (1 - effective_chance) ** rolls) * 100, 2)```

I hardly remember how it works

[digital helm]

Just like the weapon condition, "it's not that simple" - but this seems much more complicated

[proud cobalt]

Gun == 10% chance nah but what if we made it harder

[lucid junco]

It is not that simple and we dont know why

[serene sage]

my conspiracy theory is that this is how the game makes one item really rare in any playthrough

one time I couldn't find a sledgehammer

other times a sewing needle

it has to be connected

wake up wiki editors!11111!!11! \s

[languid kayak]

Almost 75%

[proud cobalt]

https://tenor.com/view/conspiracy-charlie-day-crazy-always-sunny-in-philadelphia-qanon-gif-23738584

[digital helm]

I guess the wording on lucky and unlucky would need to be changed then +10% chance of finding loot to be "+10% luck modifier"?

[proud cobalt]

It would be more accurate but I believe word for word that's the current trait description

[digital helm]

oh... yikes...

[proud cobalt]

Yeah...

[languid kayak]

I guess? My impression is "Page" is everything as per https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Statistics but wouldn't hurt

[proud cobalt]

Someone should fact check this. I could be thinking of the more trait descriptions mod

[digital helm]

I think you must be

    UI_trait_lucky = "Lucky",
    UI_trait_luckydesc = "Sometimes, things just go your way.",
    UI_trait_unlucky = "Unlucky",
    UI_trait_unluckydesc = "What could go wrong for you, often does.",

I'm going to go ahead and change it

[languid kayak]

Actually, isn't Cubic slightly better than Halos?

[lucid junco]

Dunno

[languid kayak]

Actually, maybe NoHalo is better https://www.reddit.com/r/GIMP/comments/dgdd6y/cubic_nohalo_lohalo_linear/

[proud cobalt]

Cheers, I think it would be worth doing even if it was direct from in game

[digital helm]

I've added a link to the reddit post too. I'm assuming their maths is correct 😄

[proud cobalt]

Good idea. They seemed to be the most accurate from the couple days research I did.

I've got CalvyBot doing some edits while Im on break too

[languid kayak]

But yeah, it does looks like it sells guns 🤔

[digital helm]

@proud cobalt I've removed transcluding ALL the recipes to the recipe list. It's now just a list of recipe ids and their products. There's a significant load time improvement.
I've also added a "recipe preview" section, so you can simply add the recipe id and check if it's working correctly
Edit: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Recipe_list

[proud cobalt]

Yeah this is the best way to go to keep ll functionality until the translation extension is deployed

[languid kayak]

Calculated chances of item spawning, never actually tried how accurate they are but I suppose they should be?

[languid kayak]

Funnily all decals from TIS T-shirt can spawn on a regular t-shirt as well 😄

[languid kayak]

yeah, I do confuse them with an audio cassettes 🤔

Would be nice to have cassettes though, but we got CDs. There are some other dubious items in-game too, as earphones not really popular in the timeline 😄

[digital helm]

A mix of cassettes and CDs would've been good, and true to its time

[languid kayak]

it is, yeah

[digital helm]

although from a gameplay perspective, may have been a pita

[languid kayak]

btw, you don't keep the original projects? Would be handy if you'd want to go back to change it 😄 (but yeah, I don't either, it's a bad habit, don't do that)

[languid kayak]

There were devices with both CD and cassette tapes, no sure about 1993 Kentucky?

[lucid junco]

Like saves of tilesheets?

Or each tile separately

[languid kayak]

nah, the GIMP projects

btw, from 5 years ago

LoBlur method (yet to come) will produce very sharp outcome

There are also Non Destructive Editing that is being implemented fro GIMP 3.0 that will improve all this a lot.
has it ever come? lol

[digital helm]

newer cars probably had both, but I doubt portable devices like a walkman would've had both. Mostly just radios - which don't take CDs now 🤔

[lucid junco]

Only for tilesheets

Thought they arent up to date

And I had accidentally overwritten Logos10

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Center_park_logo.png

Hmm, yes, CENTER PARK

My beloved

[languid kayak]

I do have onewithcassettes and cds at home 😄 (was supposed to be a reply to #pzwiki_editing message – was quick replying from mobile)

[serene sage]

is it true that there is a throwable football? found it on the main Items page but I can't find info on this anywhere else

it's in the Sports section (duh)

[woven portal]

hey guys

about the new wiki style

i notice on most of my devices i gotta scroll to the right now to see for example the weapons page end? wasnt an issue before

like this

idk who is capable of adjusting it, but can we revert this particular thing somehow?

sorry, it gets confusing checking stats when the icons and names get cut off on the left

[languid kayak]

I assume it's a Citizen? If so, can you set the width to 100wv in the preferences (cog on the bottom right corner)?

Alternatively, try the old skin https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Weapons?useskin=vector (you have to log in and change it in your preferences to have it automatically applied) – does it happens there too?

The weapons page had some columns added, though I tried to reduce the width a little by adding icons

[woven portal]

yeah, old skin is perfect

i can see it all in one page

and sorry, what do you mean by Citizen?

Im just talking like in general user experience, I think most would prefer to see the whole table at once

i use the wiki a lot for referencing so if i google it on mobile or away from my home pc, its not easy to read

[serene sage]

he means the new skin, which apparently is called "Citizen"

[woven portal]

Oh lol, yeah, the new skin

the one you get when googling and entering the page

[serene sage]

the old (and possibly better?) one is called "Vector 2022"

[woven portal]

i like the sections on the right but 1) i think it needs to be on the left cause its easily missed and 2) not being able to see the whole table at once is kinda annoying

i think with some extra space for the table and moving the contents to the left it would be a good improvement

Btw I think people dont appreciate the wiki work enough so

I think yall been doing some great work

the days of a half innacurate wiki are far behind us

Shame the stigma of that has stuck till now even

[serene sage]

https://tenor.com/view/im-doing-my-part-serious-stare-gif-11979677

(I have carpal tunnel now)

[woven portal]

lmao

fr tho i also try to contribute any fixes when i can, honestly atm wiki is very reliable for info

more so than most reddit and discord users anyways

[round flume]

real

btw i found an issue

lunch bag is wrong

Idk how to edit the wiki without messing things up

also if anyone would want to upate the bags section with organized perks i made a spread sheet

[woven portal]

ooo

thats a nice thing to just have on hand actually

thank you

[round flume]

np 🙂

Im working on a video about it right now and made the spread sheet to reference while making visuals

[woven portal]

i always run organized so i barely remember what the baseline values are

[round flume]

because the wiki doesnt have the values 😦

[serene sage]

honestly it's pretty difficult to mess up the wiki as it's pretty easy to change things back

[round flume]

I might start fixing the things i notice then

Cuz im constantly on it for my videos

[woven portal]

could you possibly add a third collumn

for weight reduction

[round flume]

sure

[woven portal]

cause its also quite important for consideration

[round flume]

yeah I can do that rq

[woven portal]

nice nice

[round flume]

do you want full encumberance values as well?

or just reduction

[woven portal]

well tbh as much info as possible is good

but definitely reduction is the more important one

[round flume]

ill add whatever info is on the wiki 🙂

[woven portal]

kk

[serene sage]

one time I accidentally forgot to pick Organized and found out the hard way that without it the Large Backpack has less carry capacity than a Big Hiking Bag with Organized

never again

[woven portal]

i believe the main pages like weapons have the info correct

[round flume]

Its the type of trait you use and then cant live without ever again lol

[woven portal]

its only once you get to sub pages that sometimes people miss stuff

[woven portal]

yeah im never going without organized

too much of a loot goblin

increasing every container size? op as shit

especially if you utilise something with more seats over a large trunk

[serene sage]

right

[woven portal]

6 seater van on toop

[serene sage]

sometimes I'm too paranoid about putting things in seats

[woven portal]

how come?

[serene sage]

it blocks you from going through that seat to get out

I got trapped once and coudn't get out because I was surrrounded with stuff

then I died

and then I learned

[woven portal]

ig but you can keep just one of the side seats clear

[round flume]

quick question

this says it has the lowest reduction

according to this the satchel does

[woven portal]

i mean i know not to rely on switching seats if im filling my car up

[serene sage]

yeah I could do that

[round flume]

Why the 6 seater compared to the normal van?

[languid kayak]

Yes, not sure if it spawns, I actually thing we should make a separate page for it simialr to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Rubber_Duck_(battery) as https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Football has only info about the non-throwable one

[woven portal]

i have left my car behind on multiple occasions just because it was dangerous to get to it

[languid kayak]

oh, that's the new skin 😄 https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Items?useskin=citizen

[woven portal]

fucking internet isnt working

oh there we go

[serene sage]

one time I didn't think of this and ran back to my car and died because "E" stopped working; that sucked because I had spent the last 10 in game days trying to defeat the overweight trait

[woven portal]

because 1 you can force over seat capacity with gennys and bags, and 2) the capacity for loot is non degradable

unlike a trunk space

so you will always have 26x5 amount of space

[round flume]

Thats actually real as fuck never thought about it that way

[woven portal]

ooh ok ok

[woven portal]

i think it would be better this way, but at the very least i think itd be better to see the whole table at once

[languid kayak]

The Citizen is a 3rd party skin, originally developed for the Star Citizen wiki, but used elswhere to – it can switch between light and dark (also have some customizable options like font size or width), new version is available at https://starcitizen.tools/

Vector 2022 is the skin used by default on MediaWiki projects, most notably the English Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/ – our doesn't support switching colors yet

The even older skin is Vector (classic) https://pzwiki.net/?useskin=vector

[languid kayak]

I wonder how it'll be after b42 drops, though may be a while since we catch up 😩

[woven portal]

oh god yeah

itll be the same thing again

all this work and itll be considered a bad source lmao

but hey we got more dedicated contributers now i feel like

compared to when b41 iwbums was around

I for sure will try and contribute as much as possible

[languid kayak]

I still want to go through each item one by one to catch this, some are still missed being udpated for every stats sadly. Fixing should be easy enough if you ever spot it though, you just edit the value in infobox

(the organized and discorganized is in tooltip btw; will think of something to show that for mobile folks more clearly)

[round flume]

ok thank you 🙂
how easy it it to update items to show organized stats

Like can i just add another section?

[serene sage]

essentially, yes, though you may need to be careful about making the table too w i d e

[round flume]

^

[round flume]

Ill keep that in mind thank you 🙂

[woven portal]

thanks

[round flume]

oh it was you that wanted it

[languid kayak]

the page lists are generally easier to fix en masse, weapons and clothing should be mostly checked, but the individual pages may have issues. Currently you have to update it both in the list and in the individual pages

[round flume]

my bad

[woven portal]

and its sorted in order of best to worst right?

or just there

[round flume]

In terms of capacity its sorted best to worst

[woven portal]

gotcha

[languid kayak]

I do have a plan on going through items, starting with weapons→clothing→food, but might take a while since I'm always getting distracted with other stuff as we're working on several things at once 😄

[round flume]

I think the sleeping tablets overdose may be slightly wrong

I think the stats are if you are starting at 100 health

[woven portal]

yeah i imagine its hard to catch it with all the individual pages

thats the only places i see any issues with

i try and report it here when i notice it 😄

[languid kayak]

Yeah, still until recently we were stuck in things from like build 0.2 (!) not to mention the organizational work 😄 Some languages are still not up to date, but it's all up for the translator to translate the up-to-date English pages hopefully, so we don't really track versions on those pages

[serene sage]

I think there is one part of the wiki we may have been neglecting...

[round flume]

Theres a modding section?

[serene sage]

yeah there's a "project" about information that modders might need

[woven portal]

if i have time i could do the russian ones

[round flume]

I didnt know that lol, i gotta check that out

been wanting to learn how to make a mod

[serene sage]

it's a little barebones but it does have some stuff at least

[languid kayak]

yeah 😄 No one really wants to contribute a lot. The link's on the main page, there's no leader currently and even back then no one really wanted to organize it. I do mention the edits here and there on the monthly summary. Last time I talked about linking to scripts parameters more, as they seem handy and renaming the pages maybe to avoid subpages too much.

[serene sage]

PZ modding is not as well documented as I thought

even copying existing mods netted me with only a broken mod that crashes the game

[round flume]

damn

Thats a shame

[serene sage]

not even sure how the big name PZ modders made their mods

might just need a lot of dedication

[woven portal]

i imagine #mod_development have the right sources for that

[serene sage]

right

[woven portal]

its actually kinda funny how many different kinds of users there are in this server

[serene sage]

wasn't in the server back then so ehhh

[woven portal]

mod dev, modelling, pz wiki and pz chat/gen have all so many different groups of regulars

[serene sage]

ikr

it seems weird but for example I've never spoken to any PZ mappers

or PZ modders

[woven portal]

i really think most of it is the intimidation factor of adding stuff to the wiki

like me personally

i dont wanna mess something up? so thats why i usually ask one of you guys to add the edits for me

[woven portal]

yeah theres a lot of Vet rank people in this server who ive never even interacted with

despite being the most active user on the server lol

[round flume]

real

[woven portal]

mainly because they keep to their channels

[round flume]

I didnt realize there was a wiki section until just now so i could post the spreadsheet

[woven portal]

yeah and i only found out in the 2nd year of being here lmao

[serene sage]

what are even the different ranks anyway

what order do they fall under

all I know is Recruit --> Builder

because I saw mines change today

[woven portal]

Recruit
Builder - required to post images in pz chat
Survivor - required to post images in gen chat
Specialist
Veteran

you can rank yourself in gen chat

do /rank