📚marathon-lore-discussion

[hazy mist]

trying to do north relay terminal but it wont show me the second location

[gentle zodiac]

north relay is an end point iirc

[hazy mist]

ah icic

im just using a map that shows all of them

[frozen fern]

I was just in AI uplink in marsh and heard a voice over the intercom saying creepy stuff is that Darius?

[remote magnet]

There was a second page atached to Darius last message. ONI says that it wasnt rampancy, as it doesnt fit the symptoms

[neat kernel]

I feel like durandal is surely trying to manipulate runners with that message and lead us in a wrong direction in a sense

[small bane]

Yes, I get the feeling, based on the general aesthetic of Sekgen as well as the look/nature of the quarantine event, that Sekgen is definitely involved. A sort of "the progress/science gained is more important than the loss of lives" sort of vibe.
I definitely agree with you, that she "cares" but she cares about being perceived as caring much more than she actually cares. She cares because "caring" is a useful tool and empathy is a useful tool.

[gentle zodiac]

Station -> Hauler Overflow -> North Relay South Relay -> Data Wall

[acoustic elm]

are we supposed to find and unlock things on the map to unlock end game map?

[hazy mist]

wheres the hauler terminal? im struggling to find it

jus tgonna wait through this game until it reopens transmisison

[gentle zodiac]

upstairs in a red-ish room

[hazy mist]

got it

ill just wait outside till its time then

[keen plank]

Indeed, but I think your breakdown while right, is incomplete.

NuCaloric is the megacorp that really throws itself into philanthropy to appear better than they are. Gaius is genial and polite, but there's a reason his eyes are red.

SekGen has a revolutionary technology that they are on generation five of, and they sell these shells for utterly insane, often debt-inducing prices to get both workers and leverage. Notably, we had to bait out Sekiguchi to get interested in us, They clearly have a massive workforce, including of shells, and can make endless amounts more. Nona is leading their research and improvement while we help her get data on what Tau Ceti does to lifeforms like us.

She cares for her grandchildren because they are hers. And shouldn't a good grandchild act in the family's best interest?

[dense jacinth]

any more info on the prog bars?

[gentle zodiac]

gl

[dusk hamlet]

trying to do something to the terminals while it's "receiving transmission" is smart, i had glossed over that bit completely

[hazy mist]

"here you stand feet on metal and concrete and soil
flesh and oil dreaming timid dreams
you were never meant to walk in the starlight"

thats all i got

[dusk hamlet]

yeah that's the usual line

[dense jacinth]

same voicelines yea

[hazy mist]

assumed so

[dense jacinth]

nothing abt the terminal changes in game

[gray granite]

Yo y’all see the map in pinwheel with the dots? Does it mean anything

[neat kernel]

I totally forgot it about that part it makes much more sense now i just discarded that part when i first heard it

[dense jacinth]

i was wondering if the bar progs only when its recieving a transmission?

[gentle zodiac]

No change to stabilization level from API either

We were trying, but surely someone would have accidentally done it

[dusk hamlet]

it's just too convenient. only three feeds have a progress bar and they line up with the feeds we get from the currently available terminals. and there's a minute or so time window that's clearly expecting us to do something

i hope it's not a dead end currently

[gentle zodiac]

This was from some instagram story if you didnt see it
//: TERMINAL ACCESS: DETECTED
//: SYSTEM HACK: IN-PROGRESS
//: SYSTEM LOAD: LOW

BRUTEFORCEREQUIRED
RUNNERSTOPERIMETERTERMINALS
CALIBRATIONWINDOWLIMITED

[dusk hamlet]

thanks, wasn't following their socials no

[gentle zodiac]

i.e. i read that as more people AND specific timing

[dusk hamlet]

yeah!

[gentle zodiac]

even if its bashing our heads against it to brute force it

[hazy mist]

maybe three people pair all three at the same time when the time hits 0??

im kinda stretching at this point

[dusk hamlet]

we might have to do the terminal triggers during the window just like y'all are trying now, but at a larger scale for it to register? i dunno

[frank pier]

i’m not the only one convinced that sekigucci are the ones bankrolling arachnes “mysterious wealth”, right? something something selling shovels during a gold rush

[dusk hamlet]

has anyone tried splitting up and doing the triggers simultaneously while the window is open? i know it sounds like absolute hell to pull off with other people in the match lol

[hazy mist]

thats what i was just saying might be the solution but thats gotta be so annoying to deal with

[subtle oracle]

if you guys are trying to do terminals, run double or triple thief. you can use grapple or get on the drone and its wayyyy faster

or yeah split up

[gentle zodiac]

just been running solo for now but down to team up after this try

[ebon wyvern]

lfg

[hazy mist]

#lfc-any-zone

[dusk hamlet]

another spitball idea is looking at the terminal with thief's hack vision, but that's really reaching lol

[chilly nimbus]

interpretation of this:
maybe they have less people interacting with the terminals than they were expecting? hence "system load: low"?

[hazy mist]

anythings worth a shot tbh

[chilly nimbus]

also, we just got the contracts channel back.

[dusk hamlet]

splitting up and hitting the terminals in a full squad while the window is open does seem like the most plausible idea

[hazy mist]

ohh ur right

[chilly nimbus]

and was breach-protocol there before?

[hazy mist]

no

[chilly nimbus]

nope.

[dusk hamlet]

oh hell yeah

[hazy mist]

and it has the message that was just on their story

[chilly nimbus]

i think my guess was right. XD
they probably didn't get as many people doing the terminals as they'd hoped for

[dusk hamlet]

i guess the sleuthing goes there now

[gentle zodiac]

yeah

just hit hauler during that receiving window but no changes as far as i can tell

[dusk hamlet]

they really have to do this when i'm about to go to bed huh
time zones be damned

good hunting yall!

[deft kestrel]

Oh....some of the people on tau ce5i might've come across a compiler and started to worship it...fun

[main igloo]

What are you talking about?

I'm interested

[deft kestrel]

One of the audio logs

[surreal jackal]

I'd probably worship a floating death laser blasting alien if I was straving to death too

if I think about it

[main igloo]

:0

Is it Soren's and the other one I don't remember what her name is?

[deft kestrel]

Its funny because a compiler in OG marathon wasn't the biggest threat

[main igloo]

I guess he'd kill you anyway.

[deft kestrel]

https://youtu.be/VPO7jexwCF4?si=y6sbSk-PzXi29gvD

Here.

That's the audio log

[main igloo]

oka

[surreal jackal]

Not if you're a zombie cyborg probably not

But I am a lowly fleshbag

[deft kestrel]

It took off a destroyer shell's arm in one blast

[surreal jackal]

how strong is a destroyer relative to a battleroid

[hazy mist]

ok just tested this

nothing sadly

[subtle oracle]

uhhhh not even close. pretty sure a shell could take 1 or 2 hits of a car but a cyborg would crumple a semi

tbh a cyborg could prolly crumple a tank

firmly believe a warden or boss would be light work for a mjolnir

[visual lynx]

any amazing lore updates I should know about in the past uhhhh 24-48hrs?

[dusk hamlet]

it was a real stretch but thanks for confirming anyway 🫡

[drifting garnet]

So considering Bungie's famous "Eternal Hero" trope that's persistent across their games, theories on how it might appear here?

[hazy mist]

everythings worth a shot

[drifting garnet]

I do feel like it is a deliberate choice that the characters/organizations you're working for are Not Good people and the implication that The Runner we're all playing as possibly got into running for not-very-altruistic reasons.

[thin geyser]

im able to test, not sure what we have tried for “brute forcing” yet, but if anyone has any ideas ill do them

[surreal jackal]

yeah that's what I figured

[chilly nimbus]

we're actually a partitioned version of the security officer's consciousness running shells on tau ceti IV and that's whhy durandal is here because he's drawn to the security officer's presence as is 'destiny' for this new timeline?

[fierce mountain]

im trying SOOOO HARD to find destroyer usefull...LOL

[drifting garnet]

Oh interesting! not something I would have considered: that we're a copy of the Security Officer's consciousness.

[fallow forge]

whats new runners

[drifting garnet]

Because yeah the...implications that if this is a new timeline in the Marathon multiverse, that something Not Good happened to the Security Officer and hence why he's not here to stop whatever new threat has arrived to TCIV

[chilly nimbus]

solo wise, missiles are pretty clutch, got good horizontal mobility and double blue cores that reduce reload is rough for anyone you're fighting and you're using something like an lmg. you have a reload time that's on part with the assault rifles.

[chilly nimbus]

yeah, they talk about harvesting data from the planet. it could just be scientific data or it could be that there's very literal data flowing through the air.

[drifting garnet]

Like to take a page from the (in)famous Legend of Zelda timeline: are we in the "The Security Officer Failed" timeline?

[neat kernel]

If we are in this timeline though how come the planet is empty and we are in 2889 or something

the only real thing there alive are the ticks

[chilly nimbus]

almost definitely a new timeline.

sec-officer left a doom guy level of carnage behind him in terms of alien corpses. i'd find it hhard to believe they could hoover that up real quick before we got there.

[hollow totem]

iirc, there were 9 other officers on TCIV when the Pfohr arrived, and they were dealt with quickly. It seems like the threats on TCIV may have more to do with the Jjaro or the W'rkncacnters. The Pfohr as slavers wouldn't want to kill off their haul

[neat kernel]

In which game was leela’s distress signal sent?

Because this is what made us go to tciv now

to my understanding

[fickle oracle]

what do you guys think the special uesc bot under ai uplink is? the one covered in tick residue and big helmet

[drifting garnet]

also IIRC, in the OG trilogy, SecOfficer never actually set foot on TCIV?

[hollow totem]

true

[drifting garnet]

🤔

goddamn that'd be something: "in this timeline, the SecOfficer did actually set foot on TCIV...and whatever was there was too much even for him to handle"

[hollow totem]

have we had the names Durandal, Leela, or Tycho even mentioned in the game/outside material yet?

[neat kernel]

I also wonder how cyberacme comes into this how do they have access to runners and what is their actual goal because they are cleary using us to get more connections

[drifting garnet]

Tycho, yes: I've seen his name pop up for a Codex entry I think about surveying candidate planets to build the colony

[hollow totem]

also do we have our own ship? how are we actually at tau ceti IV

[neat kernel]

tycho is likely dead but leela no clue yet, almost everyone is sure durandal is the one who gave us the secret message from terminals

[neat kernel]

cyberacme

Thats the thing they are too secretive

how do they have this much access

I can already imagine the 20h lore summary in a few years

[hollow totem]

they seem to jsut piggyback off of the UESC, but it's weird they aren't being stomped out

[neat kernel]

Might relate to how we also can control rook

Maybe they hijacked uesc ships undercover

Also is there a chance we are the digital brain of the security officer? Since runners use a digital consciousness

[hollow totem]

maybe. it's really weird that all these factions have "presence" in the runner's consciusnesses, but it's hard to tell if anything is actually there. I swear, it was stated at some point that the matter transfer is FTL or near FTL, so is it possible our minds are being stored on Earth or some desolate moon?

[last mantle]

Maybe even on the Marathon Ship? How do we get on the planet so quickly if we’re all the way on earth or mars?

[neat kernel]

It needs to be stored somewhere at least because in a sense we work just like ai’s uploaded somewhere like durandal

[last mantle]

It’s specifically mentioned in the opening your in a suspended state while in your shell

[rapid cave]

Couple of days ago I asked whether there was an i controlling the robots we fight. Found the answer in the codex. Theres an ai called cerberus thats controlling them, and according to oni its a cogentove hazard (knowing about it alone is dangerous)

[neat kernel]

If we are stored in the marathon there could even be a chance we are an unfinished ai model itself

[last mantle]

So you never die when you die on the planet

Your just recreated to a sense

[last mantle]

It’s also becoming increasingly more hostile the closer we get to accessing the marathon, such as outpost UESC has become so hostile they have created restrictions to exfils and areas of the base

[rapid cave]

Which explains the first thing (i persume it was cerberus) when u first load in the game he greets u normally then switch up

[neat kernel]

they are most likely hiding something

[rapid cave]

True that but I wonder if hes controlled

[last mantle]

The UESC is prioritising assets over the colony as revealed by TRAXUS in quests

[rapid cave]

Cause commander orion is the one who brought them from sol, and they basically got the job since they did so well with some war crimes

[last mantle]

So they are definitely withholding information

[rapid cave]

So idk to what end

[neat kernel]

Uesc knows whats on the marathon i would say or they have a hunch at least

[keen plank]

Surprising no one, unfortunately.

[hollow totem]

the runners being some sort of weird CyAc contract thing with the colonists like "if you're still in cryo by this time, we have all rights to use you as a salvage operative" would be so cool

[dense jacinth]

jeez still no prog on the stabilization huh....

[last mantle]

They most definitely are hiding stuff on Marathon

[last mantle]

Your already property of CYAC when you agreed to have your consciousness uploaded

[neat kernel]

We know a compiler is on there but what else maybe thats the thing in the 7th vault bungie teased

[hollow totem]

i wondered what that was. possibly cerberus, but more likely some sort of "sheriff ai" maybe

[neat kernel]

Something that creates a giant plot twist

[rapid cave]

My theory is that they sent the marathon as durnadal planned, I think they knew about this all along as in the marshes codex u can see that the people of the colony were saying that "they knew all along and it was a setup"
And i think they r trying to cover it up

[hollow totem]

it's gonna be a shard of the traveler, and the game will be renamed Destiny 3

[last mantle]

CERB is a hostile AI it’s more or less protecting the UESC from being attacked and having its assets stolen from them

It’s most likely using the UESC Marathon as a base for hiding its stuff

[neat kernel]

Honestly i find it very weird both solar systems are called sol

[drifting garnet]

and presumably there's more going on then just "oh, the rest of the Pfhor are still here"

[last mantle]

The UESC ships must come from the Marathon Ship

[fierce mountain]

wouldnt it be WILD...that on the marathon was the old weaponry that was scattered everywhere from the original games.... the rocket launcher, more premivitive shotgun, ect

[rapid cave]

For me it explains how durandal knew of the phor and how to contact them, cause no one on earth an ai that controls suddenly can find aliens (unless ive missed smth)

[last mantle]

Like the UESC collecting left behind loot?

[hollow totem]

we'll learn that the rest of the Pfhor are here, with Tycho in tow, revealing it's his voice we've been hearing, not Durandal's

[neat kernel]

According to the uesc they cleaned all pfhor corpes what if they just lied?

[hazy mist]

are they? i thought the tau ceti solar system was just like called tau ceti or smth

and then were specifically on tau ceti iv

[neat kernel]

No the earth system is called sol

Tau ceti is tau ceti

[hazy mist]

yeah

[hollow totem]

the Tau Ceti system should be called Tau Ceti, but I've seen codexes calling the system and the planet TCIV, which I assume is an oversight

[hollow totem]

this is only step 1 in my plan as to how Gianni can still voice Durandal

[neat kernel]

I really hope that bungie makes more use of cutscenes I am not sure why but i get the vibe the game has not started yet like we are in the introduction part

[rapid cave]

Theres more cutscenes u have to unlock them

[drifting garnet]

Oh side note: my main request to Bungie is to never ever actually have us meet the Jjaro or the W'rkncacntr. keep their physical appearance a mystery

[neat kernel]

Oh my bad then

[cosmic thunder]

I watched the Marathon Lore almost 3 hour long video on YouTube. So in infinity, Thoth and Durandal merge representing that new green “yin-yang” type logo?

[rapid cave]

Plus more inc as they release more maps

[neat kernel]

Yeah if they reveal them most magic is lost

[drifting garnet]

also Mandalore's thing depicting Jjaro as dancing Greys is too funny and I don't want Bungie to ruin that, LMAO

[hollow totem]

yeah i'm def getting season zero kinda vibes

[neat kernel]

Would align with bungies no review wish

[rotund wedge]

It all starts when we get the UESC runner.

[hollow totem]

"Bungo please make Durandana call me a bottom, pls and thanks"

[rotund wedge]

Oo sugoi Durandal-senpai

[dense jacinth]

i regret looking at my second monitor

[rotund wedge]

Escwape wiw make me gwod. :3

[hollow totem]

i would love to learn this ancient evil or whatever on TCIV isn't the Jjaro or the Pfhor or a W'rkncacnter, but instead something like the Myrkridia or the Dark Comet from Myth: Fallen Lords

[drifting garnet]

Oh No, not diving further into the Bungie Rabbithole!

https://tenor.com/view/conspiracy-charlie-day-crazy-always-sunny-in-philadelphia-qanon-gif-23738584

I'm already sus that the Arachne's "Thermodynamics of Violence" sounds suspiciously similar to Sword Logic

[rotund wedge]

Arachne’s themes really seem like a mix of the Witness and the Hive.

[hollow totem]

btw that comet is absolutely the fucking Veil, and Myth has multiple references to The Nine. I feel legit insane whenever i try to link these games up

[rotund wedge]

Deity-like figure striving to force “salvation” upon others and having religious edicts with archaic-sounding (and frankly very cool) phrases and names.

[last mantle]

Definitely the hive as a religious corporation

[rotund wedge]

Well, that’s the thing. It’s not a corporation; rather, a religious sect with concerningly vast resources with no known source.

[torn oyster]

I might be behind but what's the significance of the date found on the terminals? I think it said "Rct. 5.27.1987" ?

[hollow totem]

just like any normal religion. nyuck nyuck nyuck

[keen plank]

Notably, their faction representitve is also a runner. Which makes them unique compared to the others.

[hollow totem]

what terminals?

or which

[silk bane]

I don't think it's that number that's relevant to the ARG. Seems like the terminals somehow constructed the IP for the cryo site.

[keen plank]

Definitely the Hive in some aspects. But the Hive abhor necromacy. The Witness is closer to a Wrc'cantr but one that brings order instead of chaos.

[torn oyster]

I saw it on the one inside data wall, prolly nothing but was just curious cuz it def looks like a date

[lost hearth]

So the entitites, the factions leaders. The ones you communicate with, are they based on planets, or is it like an AI thing where they are talking to you through your shell in a virtual world? I was just rewatching the faction intro videos again, and traxus's stood out to me, like is that real planet or what they're based on? Also Sekiguchi, the silk worms. Where are they?

[rotund wedge]

Mhm. He is, effectively, on a Mission.

[silk bane]

I think the Wrkncacnter is more like the Traveller than the Witness, chaotic potential dialed up to 11

[hollow totem]

I assume they're all digital projections, but I'm not really sure. we don't know where any of their physical locations are, not even ours once we're off TCIV

[rotund wedge]

Honestly, I feel like their messages are simply beamed straight into your psyche. They access you through your neural partition, after all.

[torn oyster]

Prolly nothing to do with anything but, well, somethin'
https://gyazo.com/3c7ac18ba841bd00986e814fc4a55dab

[lost hearth]

True, that is what i was thinking as well. Theyre projections as far as i can tell, but thats wild at the same time because they all want resources of some kind, so when they get the resources, where do those go?. Sekiguchi produces the shells that we run in, so they have to have some kind of factory or planet somewhere with the silkworms doing the actual work. I love the lore, theres so much to learn.

[last mantle]

Seki could be working on the CYAC ship orbiting TAU

That’s the most likely solution to where they are operating

[hasty rain]

It's also kinda sus that Charter is expressesly said to have been a runner once, where the rest of faction agents are non-human AI right?

[drifting garnet]

IIRC isn't Gantry also supposed to be a real dude?

[last mantle]

I would hope so

[small bane]

I'm not certain. I've mentioned before that I'm not very far into the game and am just now sinking my teeth into the ARG.
But I definitely plan on exploring more and learning more.
But the vibe I get is actually the opposite, especially the way I've interpretted motives and actions that have been displayed so far.

I feel like Gaius is actually genuinely philanthropic where as Sekgen is, well not malicious, but sociopathic and i think progress over profits oriented.
(Also, sorry for delay between responses. That's unfortunately how most of my responses will likely be for now at least.)

[visual lynx]

since Durandal-Thoth freed him at Lh'owon, and the S'pht have presumably been off waging a war against the Pfhor since then, perhaps he threw his lot in with them and is off following S'bhuth's commands recommendations in that battle.

[small bane]

Also, you mention his eyes being red for a reason.
Is this mentioned or elaborated on?
I'm curious if this is real or if you're just using it as a sort of metaphor or point.

[visual lynx]

the first, but it appears not to have actually reached Earth and a different message from Durandal arrived instead

[burnt sapphire]

Gaius is philanthropic because he was programmed to be by NuCal as he is essentially their spokesperson. NuCal is definitely NOT as philanthropic as they claim though.

[last mantle]

Most likely because he has one of these, modernised shells that enduce insanely large amounts of debt

[visual lynx]

Tycho didn't die in the final Infinity timeline so he could very well still be alive and either still under Pfhor control or maybe has finally thrown off their yoke and is a free agent now (maybe still hunting down Durandal with a vendetta?)

[visual lynx]

the Pfhor could have still taken a huge number of the colonists away as slaves, which would account for the reports that the number of bodies found on TCIV fall far short of the colony population

[burnt sapphire]

So do runners have an actual body or is it an armored core situation where our body basically is useless or doesn’t exist, and our conciousness just floats in cyberspace until we are projected into a shell.

[keen plank]

Classic trope "red eyes of evil". Basically it's a design choice to make it clear that while he's constantly genial, warm, and well-spoken, there's an inherent sinisterness to him and his organization.

Remember, in the words of ONI:

"Nucaloric has weathered political storms that would destroy countries."

It becomes more obvious later on that not only is NuCaloric heavily interested in agriculture, but they also are responsible for architecture (not to the same extent as Traxus) and vehicles. It's likely they'd like to ofuscate any liability.

[visual lynx]

[REDACTED] WERE AT TAU CETI

[small bane]

Correct, but I mean being programmed to be something, necessarily makes you that thing.
This is to speak nothing of Nucal themselves nor the CEO's in charge of things.
Also it's my understanding that these AI-agents that represent the sponsors are sort of akin to co-pilots that share your neural interface in some capacity.
Basically your mind is a dorm-room and you can choose to allow certain AI's to hang around in the common area and communicate with you and/or assit with common tasks.

[visual lynx]

Durandal says he saw them far away not looking our way. I don't think he had prior knowledge of them.

[last mantle]

Second part.

[rapid cave]

exactly, prolly implanted to him

[small bane]

Oh, I think it's immediately obvious to me that Nucaloric isn't just interested in non-agricultural sectors, but that they're deeply invested in just about EVERY other sector.
I'd say it's not unreasonable to state pretty definitively that they have their hands in pretty much every human developed technology currently in circulation.

[agile cairn]

What is the hottest alien race in the lore

Lmk

[visual lynx]

we are uploaded minds, who download into and then eject out of temporary bodies, stored in a server in between

[visual lynx]

Pthia probably

[burnt sapphire]

Spht

[keen plank]

They gave up their original body to preserve their consciousness and achieve a degree of immortality. This procedure is not without risks, such as cognitive decline. Which we see in the trailer.

However, the real cost is utterly massive amounts of debt that generally results in Runners consciousness being turned into indentured servitude, forced labor, wetwork mercenaries, or worse. They live forever, but in the case of say, a Cyberacme Runner, there's expected monthly charges and fees to cover repair and maintenance debt.

Think of it like this:

"Hey, you get to live forever! But that debt WILL be paid one way or another. In exchange what's left of you mind and memories gets to be a pilot to a remote-controlled 3d printed mech. We're on version 5.0 and here are the 7 (soon to be 8) models."

[burnt sapphire]

I do believe Nucal when they say they are invested in humanities survival. However, survival is a BROAD term, and the quality of living clearly isn't the highest priority.

[burnt sapphire]

oh ok. I was wondering why the fuck anyone would become a runner. No matter how lucrative the money being a runner gets you, it doesn't matter if you can't exactly use it to go to the bahamas and retire

[last mantle]

Nucal most likely want to preserve their assets and anything or anyone that provides them with the necessary data they need

[small bane]

Well yeah, I agree. I definitely don't rule out that it's a "All human life is precious... but some human life is more precious than others..." sort of scenario.

[inner schooner]

praying we get to style on human UESC troops at some point

[keen plank]

They are interested in humanities survival. Because it helps them earn revenue. Feeding humanity keeps their customers alive. Keeping their customers alive keeps their profit margins up.

"Tastes like meat! Isn't!"

• this is the kind of advertising they use and you can see it in game.

[burnt sapphire]

True, but i do think there is a sort of altruistic goal still burried in all of the corporate bull shit.

[last mantle]

Always but remember they can’t really say that or they risk losing their reputation

[keen plank]

NuCal is the only one of the six factions that's somewhat symbiotic with humanity. They're unique in that regard, but don't trust them.

[last mantle]

This

[small bane]

I think this is what I agree with

Symbiotic is a good term here

[neat kernel]

The ai has red eyes never trust red eyes

[small bane]

They recognize that without them, there is no profit to be made.

[keen plank]

SEE! This guy gets it. Classic trope.

[small bane]

In fact, this seems to be a very good reason for Nucal to SABOTAGE Sekgen... cause forever living and shells that could potentially be immune to hunger and disease... could be problematic to their profit model...

[keen plank]

That's a deliberate design decision to remind you that "hey, this guy is really genial and warm. But that doesn't mean he's your friend."

[dense jacinth]

the shells are expensive tho, arent they?

[small bane]

https://tenor.com/view/wall-e-wall-e-auto-auto-wall-e-gif-3548879393194065336

[neat kernel]

I wonder what happened to darius still, feels like nucal might be the key

[keen plank]

Extremely

[small bane]

damn, was hoping the embed on gifs would at least work

[small bane]

what does expensive mean? expensive in terms of what? work? effort? time? expensive is a variable term.

if you live forever, time isn't exactly... worth much

[dense jacinth]

monetary wise. money. lots of money.

[agile cairn]

Remember that NuCal have caused disaster in entire states via political storms, they don’t care about the wellbeing of Mankind if something gets in their way (in this case politics), they’re willing to possibly displace thousands and cause civil unrest if it means they get their way 🤷🏾‍♂️ NuCal still the best choice out of the other evil factions though

[small bane]

yes but money isn't the question here

[thin sinew]

Yo has anyone mentioned the terminal on Perimeter yet? Where Durundal talks to you?

[keen plank]

Each faction's priority contract has their own storyline. Because NuCaloric was heavily sponsoring and responsible for the Marathon expedition's food, they have legal salvage rights (though these are being somewhat obstructed by the UESC.) Darius is the AI responsible for food. One sec, I'll give you my lore updates on him:

[keen plank]

🧑‍🌾 Darius - Da_1907420v4.86 – Dutiful; diligent; motivated. Always puts others ahead of self. May need to address this at some point. 🧑‍🌾

Seems like Darius was the AI responsible for overseeing the colony's food production, but is now "Defunct." He seems to have been partially the classic “caring gardener" archetype. However he was driven into anger and fear.** Anger is also stage 2 two of rampancy**.

[small bane]

the shell doesn't cost money to make.
the real cost is silk, energy, and other resources...
the money is really irrelevant to them, other than that it enables them to get more of those things or progress themselves as a corporate entity.
they'd probably sell you a shell for cheap if you provided all of the work/materials for it.

[neat kernel]

Its just what did he see or hear to make him want to flee if he did not show rampancy signs according to oni

Might be related to the dire march anomaly

[small bane]

what i'm trying to point out here specifically is that "money" and "value" are two different things here.
the shells are expensive to CONSUMERS in terms of MONEY, yes

but as most people on earth have discovered, the real value here isn't the MONEY it's the TIME.
cause you can't get the TIME back.
However, when you start working on the scales of pseudo-immortality... the ideas of what value IS... begins to change.

[keen plank]

• it's the cost of upkeep, maintenance, etc.. People (generally) sign away their mind and consciousness in exchange for indentured servitude for possibly decades. This lets them kind of live forever, and because this person is now a constantly reusable worker, the company wants to keep them around.

[dense jacinth]

tbf the value of the shell is too good to sabotage SekGen, sekgen is literally the only one making shells, and shells are the only things that can survive Tau Ceti's enviorment. Tau Ceti's enviorment literally kills anything not native to it. the corps NEED SekGen to explore tau ceti which is why they have a monopoly on them, just because they're the only ones who are able to produce it

[agile cairn]

Has all of the AI associated with the Marathon gone rampant? Has none at all scaved of rampancy?

[small bane]

exactly, this is what i wanted to drive home. the maintenance aspect.
it's kind of the same idea people preach when they say "no one wants a cure to cancer" because a cure doesn't make money

no one wants a perfect shell that doesn't degrade your consciousness and the shell is easily replaceable and it has no bugs...
because then there's nothing left to sell you...

[dense jacinth]

shells were made for tau ceti and nothing else i think, i could be wrong

[neat kernel]

Traxus mentioned that we are an valuable asset which means they hire more runners than just one that proves it as well

[small bane]

well, not no-one. the "greater good" might want it, but they want it for THEM and their private group. not for the public.

[tropic tinsel]

implicatons aside the severed twins has fire writing

[dense jacinth]

btw, have there been any advancements with the ARG or is it a waiting game as of now?

[neat kernel]

The opened up a new discord chat not sure if its because of the arg though

Looked like it

[dense jacinth]

oh i didnt see, the breach protocol one?

[agile cairn]

Has all of the AI associated with the Marathon gone rampant? Has none at all scaved of rampancy?

[tropic tinsel]

they are chipping away the path of cryo

[small bane]

what are you talking about? what is "the severed twins?"

[tropic tinsel]

Legendary loot book from Outpost

has lore entries each time you pick it up

[neat kernel]

I think not all have gone rampant

[small bane]

i don't know if anyone else took a peak at the code for the ARG webpage but it mentions us needing to kill more UESC

[dense jacinth]

the UESC killcount and stabilization bar seems to have no correlations last i saw

[neat kernel]

We only know durandal is kind of confirmed 99% the rest we dont know yet, darius apparently went rampant, the general colony ai was just shut down or destroyed

[small bane]

i don't know what the stabilization bar is.
I'm just speaking from peaking under the hood, I haven't actually twiddled any knobs or dials yet

[dense jacinth]

the yellow and black prog bar underneath the cam is what we believe the stabilization bar is

[neat kernel]

Hold up what if the uesc killcount was planted by mida on purpose to simply kill uesc?

[small bane]

I was specifically talking about this stuff.

state
: 
{pages: {cargo: {unlocked: true, completed: false}, index: {unlocked: false, completed: false},…},…}
memoryCompleted
: 
false
memoryUnlocked
: 
false
pages
: 
{cargo: {unlocked: true, completed: false}, index: {unlocked: false, completed: false},…}
biostock
: 
{unlocked: false, completed: false}
cargo
: 
{unlocked: true, completed: false}
cryoHub
: 
{unlocked: false, completed: false}
index
: 
{unlocked: false, completed: false}
preservation
: 
{unlocked: false, completed: false}
revival
: 
{unlocked: false, completed: false}
steerage
: 
{unlocked: false, completed: false}
shipDate
: 
"2777-07-07T12:00:00.000Z"
uescKillCount
: 
90040309
uescKillCountNextUpdateAt
: 
"2026-03-08T06:46:00.129Z"```

that there are pages we need to unlock and memories we need to complete

but i don't know what that means

so far we've only unlocked the cargo page and we haven't completed it yet

[neat kernel]

Apparently theres arg progress now #breach-protocol message

[small bane]

Also, idk if you saw it, but it says that there's a specifical date/time where the uesc kill count actually updates at:

: 
"2777-07-07T12:00:00.000Z"
uescKillCount
: 
90040309
uescKillCountNextUpdateAt
: 
"2026-03-08T06:46:00.129Z"```

[dusty escarp]

is there any way to rewatch contract cutscenes?

[lost hearth]

Yeah, youtube. Bunch of videos.

[dusty escarp]

can u send me them? tyy

[keen plank]

Not necessarily all of them. But many if not most. It's really a case by case basis and each one's is unique.

Durandal absolutely goes rampant throughout 1 and was essentially tortured into it via boredom and sadism by Bernard Strauss. However he works his way through it and becomes one of it not the only ones to achieve meta stability.,

Leela is stable for most of one, and then...gets put through the absolute ringer, is enslaved to manage 15 worlds at once, goes extremely rampant, and is then kidnapped. We don't know who or what kidnapped her, but it seems like some sort of pirate group. And this is mostly all off-screen She's holding out hope for a rescue, but ultimately her fate is unknown.,

Tycho goes utterly rampant extremely quickly and is a murderous, sadistic jerk for the entire trilogy of games. Only in the non-bungie ones, set much later, does the guy finally calm down.

Thoth is fine, but wasn't built by humans and is very much a weird "orange and blue morality" balancer. He merges with Durandal, making them much more balanced and moral. As well as almost godlike.

The remain 8 were planetside and we're steadily learning more about them.** Keep an eye out for Icarus**. They seem...very concerning.

[lost hearth]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH_RCO9gw0Q&t=300s

heres the one i watched earlier.

Did you mean introduction cutscenes? Thats what i took it as.

[dusty escarp]

nonono the priority contract cutscenes

[lost hearth]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jE3OLxeVrfw

[dusty escarp]

ngl i skipped most of them bc i was grinding

[lost hearth]

is this what youre looking for?

[frozen fern]

Do we have much information on the other ai’s beside Darius?

[dusty escarp]

yea something like that

seems like nobody compiled all of the cutscenes in the current build of the game yet though

[keen plank]

Indeed! And we keep getting more. Let me get you a breakdown.

[neat kernel]

Only other one I saw mentioned was the colony ai the uesc found it not functional at arrival on tciv

[dense crystal]

apparently no progress, just someone doing an intercept apparently

[keen plank]

Reposting:

Ship AI:
Durandal - Du_0706419v4.96 – Goal-oriented; creative; focused. Underutilized; tends to brood. Need to find ways to distract. SCIENG crew to be kept informed, but I’ll keep an eye on this myself.
Leela - Le_0413418v5.06 – Adaptable; detail-oriented. Second best candidate for colony oversight once mission enters second phase.
Tycho - Ty_2121418v5.06 – Proactive; assertive. Can be overbearing; monitor interactions with Durandal. Be sure to inform SCIENG crew.

Colony AI:
Arthur - Ar_1814419v4.93 – Benevolent autocrat; no-nonsense; problem solver. Classic patriarchal authority figure.
Bastion - Ba_0423419v4.89 – Problem solver; confident, bordering on boastful. May need to go onto accelerated re-compile cycle, inform SCIENG crew.

🧑‍🌾 Darius - Da_1907420v4.86 – Dutiful; diligent; motivated. Always puts others ahead of self. May need to address this at some point. 🧑‍🌾

Gabriel - Ga_2815420v4.81 – Compassionate; empathetic, transparent. Perhaps our greatest achievement to date. Will most likely need to be moved to an accelerated re-compile cycle at some point.

‼️ Icarus - Ic_1624420v4.73 – Motivated; assertive; proactive. Will need to keep isolated from Tycho or establish hierarchy at outset. Inform SCIENG of situation. ‼️

Joyeuse - Jo_0309421v4.69 – Resilient; optimistic; patient. Colony AI: defense, training

Lilith - Li_1817421v4.65 – Focused; assertive; good communicator. Designated candidate for colony oversite during second phase.

Naarah - Na_0602422v4.61 – Proactive; goal-oriented; committed. May need to be reminded from time to time about their primary function; inform SCIENG crew.

(credits to pcole from clade )

[dusty escarp]

sm1 ping me when its been done by someone

[neat kernel]

Ah too bad nvm

[tropic tinsel]

S13 of marathon: You and Thoth Durandal need to team up and fight icarus in the new space map...

But seriously though I do want to learn a lot more about icarus

MORE VALUABLE LORE HUNTING FOR ME!

[frozen fern]

Yeah Icarus being mentioned with Tycho is very interesting

[neat kernel]

Naarah sounds concerning

[keen plank]

I mean, the two have already merged. Durandal's watching us. The new terminals as part of the ARG prove it and he seems pretty dismissive of runners. Let me see if I can find his new quotes...

[small bane]

what's that?

[frozen fern]

Yeah in the codex ONI says an ai not doing a primary function is a main sign of rampancy

[keen plank]

Three pairs of terminals unlocked on Perimeter.

Upon activation in:

Data Wall -- "What do you do when you encounter the incomprehensible? When everything inside you screams to run away. Yes, you have a desire. A desire to conquer -- But do you even understand why? Have you ever asked yourself?"

North Relay -- "I'm watching. You're curious creatures... Cruel. Your journey is just beginning. How many more marathons do you have to run?"

Hauler -- "You stand on metal, concrete, and soil. You are made of flesh and oil, and cautious dreams. You are not meant to walk among the stars."

Along with that, each terminal has a IP Address and a set of numbers.

Numbers:

02 21 20 14 15 23 12 09 05 19 08 01 21 14 20 05 04 = BUT NOW LIES HAUNTED
20 15 23 08 01 20 15 14 05 03 05 23 01 19 08 15 13 05 = TO WHAT ONCE WAS HOME
07 15 04 05 01 18 22 09 15 12 05 14 20 15 14 05 = GO DEAR VIOLENT ONE
"GO DEAR VIOLENT ONE, TO WHAT ONCE WAS HOME BUT NOW LIES HAUNTED"

IP address goes to https://cryoarchive.systems/ || Photos from the website: https://imgur.com/a/gtDs85n

DURANDAL is inviting us to the Marathon. That's about all we have right now

[small bane]

((replying to this with a custom tag, so i can search it up later as needed))
#CABLE_PIN

[neat kernel]

Im thinking also in the sense of; if an ai can be distracted easy and convinced by humans to do a tasks. What can an ai like durandal do to naarah then

[frozen fern]

Ooooh very true

[keen plank]

I mean, at this point he's the most poweful AI to ever exist. He can do a lot.

[neat kernel]

Are there any more info logs on the native tick enemies yet? They seem very odd to me because the logs say they might have been used to be a predator hunting after beings that emit heat

[keen plank]

Issue is that while absolutely being an antagonist in Marathon 1 and then graduating from an anti-villain to an anti hero, he feels regretful for what he did to Tau Ceti 4 and wants to atone. Particularly by saving the last of the colony survivors.

The colony's collapse is pretty much tied to him intentionally revealing its location to the Pfthor out of a desperate need to escape being tortured. And he invited much worse forces.

[primal shuttle]

Hey can the writers decide what the term "legal" even means? There are like 4 different conflicting descriptions of what is considered cool and spooky vs totally legal and it makes all the vendor lore conflict with one another ( and not in a cool " varying perspectives" kind of way, more like "bungie writers who dropped out of their english bachelors" kind of way)

[keen plank]

That's kind of the point. All of these corporations are fighting with the UESC and each other for ways to recoup their investments.

[primal shuttle]

Okay so you didn't read what I said:

It does not come off as varying perspectives

[keen plank]

Traxus is outright honest about it - we have salvage rights. You're a third party. We pay you and you break the law so that we can get our money back.

[neat kernel]

yeah in a lore video i saw it was described as the race to tau ceti between all factions

[violet dew]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Marathon/comments/1rin9ny/the_complete_story_of_marathon_tldr_or_the_lore/

This reddit post is actually insane

Explains so much

[keen plank]

It's a gold-rush of salvage, tech, and resources. And it won't be pushed back on until season 2.

[neat kernel]

Holy thanks im gonna save it incase i forget about parts since im new into the lore

[keen plank]

But that's what's happening. The companies are outright suing and UESC is blocking or obfuscating them in courts. So they're finding ways they can get away with skirting or breaking the law discreetly. Every faction mentions this save for maybe Arachne, but they're sponsoring and paying us for different reasons.

There should be competing definitions and descriptions because each group is trying to explain why what they're doing is justified compaed to the others.

[neat kernel]

Is goliath also an ai i mean it is the primary ship the uesc used to go to tcvi but what if its ai also goes rampant

[primal shuttle]

Are we not able to read? Okay again, I get that is the intention, but it is poorly written. that is my point.

rather than confidently announcing legality or grey area, everyone has slightly similar but rhetorically conflicting positions: For example, ONI describes UESC as both having no legal authority and also referrs to that supposedly nonexistent legal authority constantly- that is messy writing

The good example is: NuCaloric, who establishes clear motive during exposition, and is matter of fact about them having legal ownership over data/material, and then later follows through on that lore by telling you about their objective to gather material that they see as legally theirs. This is consistent, because it both acknowledges the legal ownership of this material, while also pointing out that UESC are trying to make their own rules... which directly conflicts with how some of ONI and Mida's dialogue go

The problem isnt the interesting race for power, its that its messily written and individually some npcs cant keep consistent lore

[visual lynx]

oh hey is that the same person @oak gust as did https://taucetiiv.com/info/lore ? he uses some of the same phrases. I recently sent him some notes/corrections 🙂

[violet dew]

No worries I share it when I can my friend showed me it cause I was still confused about stuff after watching YouTube videos but this clears so much uo

[visual lynx]

framed largely around [this recent post of mine](#📚marathon-lore-discussion message)

[violet dew]

Oh shit I didn't know that what's that website u linked is that a main website?

[visual lynx]

it's not an official Bungie site, it's a new fan site

someone else linked it in here recently

and I was grumbling about inaccuracies

but then I saw him over in the classic marathon server asking for guidance from lore masters

and that pleases me

[violet dew]

That's pretty cool

[eager mason]

I'm sure people have found this already but I found a terminal at the south relay that led to another terminal in the data wall. Some dialogue came from the terminal talking about the nature of conquering and showed a camera feed of inside the marathon with the numbers 35.212.46.xxx, does anyone know what that's about?

wish i got a video but i'd check it out if you're interested

[last mantle]

#breach-protocol

[sudden pollen]

The lore and ARG stuff for this game is so fucking cool

[scenic summit]

Looks like an IP address of some kind. I think the last .xxx section would be where you would put the number for the specific connection/computer connected to that router

the router might be ip address 35.121.46.1

[pliant socket]

Are we allowed to link media here?

[scenic summit]

or .0

[pliant socket]

As I have a vid of what @eager mason mentions

[scenic summit]

depending on who felt like networking it. software tends to index starting at 0 but I've heard of people who like 1 indexing

Real world IP addresses might not be Tau Ceti addresses idk

[pliant socket]

Well, risk it for the biscuit I guess. YOLO! https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1111049293273505902/1480069830144037065/19ccbb2d4094-master_playlist.mp4?ex=69ae55f1&is=69ad0471&hm=237cdac7478ced51dcaa507b26ed99e6adbeaf5ee2cae9b11a2be9f41abb9151&

<hides under his desk>

[high rivet]

https://x.com/meloneslada/status/2030455695041245495?s=46 holy shit is TCIV haunted by a w’rkncacnter? 😭

[pliant socket]

Ok, the link works, just not the media player in the channel.

[hasty rain]

Laws are man-made. Laws must be enforced for them to work. 12 light years away, dealing with alien stuff, laws just don't apply. There are no laws for what's happening in Tau Ceti. All factions are trying to get their way, legally or not doesn't really matter to them, they want what they want. The stuff in the pre-release ARG makes this clearer, but it's clear enough in the game

[pliant socket]

But that’s the footage of what @eager mason mentions

[scenic summit]

Law still applies in international waters. Same dig on an exoplanet presumably.

Its just much farther away and harder to enforce so people can get away with more

and its "reasonable"

[hearty edge]

https://discordapp.com/channels/1303855380845301861/1364289254045515886/1480104274821386330

[eager mason]

thanks! This is super cool. I'm gonna keep looking for more

[pliant socket]

NP, just woke up and was in another server who posted that footage! Can’t wait to hop in later and see if I can help too!

[eager mason]

That's sick but how? Is it like pathways into darkness style?

[visual lynx]

every lawmaker will claim that their law applies everywhere unless it will get them in shit with some stronger power to say so. but the truth of their claim hinges on one of two things, depending on what you mean by "applies": either whether the law is right (whether the things they command are things that are genuinely obligatory, independent of whether anyone has commanded them), or whether the lawmaker can get away with punishing you for doing otherwise.

in the latter sense, law "applies" in international waters only to the extent that someone will send ships out there to enforce it or that you eventually have to come back to land where someone will give you shit for doing other than they said.

[scenic summit]

I think what we're trying to get at here is whether people decide the law applies to them. If the law is enforced to the point where a penalty of some kind is meted out then that law applies whether someone wants it to apply or not. The UESC can make up whatever rules it wants based on how it does things and so can the Megacorps. If we all want to play along nicely we use laws and law in general is a good idea even if it is applied poorly.

[gray sluice]

Read the traxus logs and tell me there's no law on tau ceti

[keen plank]

Possibly. The pagan cult seems to worship one at least.

[visual lynx]

I think I'm finally coming around to the possibility that there's a Wrk in Tau Ceti, and perhaps that is why the Jjaro were there. the colorful crystal Artifacts that @sharp quarry and I think are the same colorful Crystal artifacts from PiD would mesh well with that, and someone over in the classic server just pointed out that technically PiD is an extraction shooter, just an extremely long-form one from before the genre existed: the whole game is a single long infil-exfil, where you've got to get to the bottom of the pyramid and deploy the nuke and then get out before the timer runs out. you can move freely back and forth between levels all you like while the same timer keeps running, so the entire game is basically one giant "map".

[potent igloo]

I'mma be real, I just found one of the Confiscated Colonial Folklore things and uuuuh

after listening to that lore entry get me off of this colony now please and thank you

[keen plank]

“And …now… we speak of OTHER things!”

[potent igloo]

"And do we LISTEN?"

[keen plank]

YES!

[potent igloo]

it really goes to show that absolutely no one in this situation is the victim or the "good guy"
the colonists were doing some sus things, the factions/syndicates are only in this for profit

[gray sluice]

The anomaly could always be it trying to break out? If Durandal is in cryo it could mean he could be trying to release it intentionally and somehow escape the universe while doing so with jjaro tech but the only ai we know who could interface with jjaro tech is Tycho so maybe he wants it as a weapon for the pfhor? If their system did get ransacked then it could be a counter offensive

[potent igloo]

we're murdering each other and all that
*and robbing the graves of the colonists

[scenic summit]

I think tau ceti pop was up to 30,000
One church of people is much smaller

You could avoid them if you keep your eye out maybe

[gray sluice]

I just really hope M2 was retconned just because it would make the story more ambiguous

[keen plank]

To be clear, it seems that group was a pagan cult which was a minority splinter group and persecuted by the colony’s leadership or other factions. Considering how nuts they are…I don’t think that applies to say, the leadership, fungus infected, etc..

[scenic summit]

Arachne was apparently also a Marathon cult apparently but since they have good comms it spread back to the Sol system and resulted in a Traxus assasination? Wouldn't have expected that.

Or maybe it was a Sol system cult inspired by the Marathon tech? I'd have to look at the lore entry again.

[grim egret]

Hi, I’m not sure if this has already been discovered, but I wrote a Python script to scan all possible IPs and found one that actually shows something. Do you want me to share it?

[scenic summit]

You mean as part of an ARG with Marathon and not an actual IP scanning script?

Writing something in Python is what throws me off here

I'm guessing we avoid real world hard details around here so just making sure

[grim egret]

you guys basically found the base ip 35.212.46.xxx, so there only a finite number of possibilities for the last digits of the ip, I'm a CS student so the first thing i thought was to write a script to scan for the possible open ips

[scenic summit]

Brute force algorithm, sure. I'm not familiar with any of the other steps involved in this or where any of this is coming from I just pointed out the IP similarity. I wouldn't mind hearing it though.

[topaz thicket]

What is the breach protocol channel? Lmk where I should look to catch up, I wasn’t watching today

[scenic summit]

I think I'm looking at some middle step to an ARG and I'm missing the beginning of it

Or even how you would apply a script in-game, its not a public API and cheating is bannable

But that would be a valid solution. Sometimes I just chill out for a while manually brute forcing numbers in games lol

[grim egret]

I didn’t solve the ARG the intended way. I basically brute-forced it with a small IP-scanning script using the base 35.212.46.xxx and checking all 1–255 possibilities. One of them (35.212.46.162) actually shows a camera feed of the marathon. Not sure if this was already found.

[scenic summit]

I hadn't seen anything about it.

As far as I'm concerned, in a game about fictional AI hackers a brute force algorithm solution in an unsecured system is valid

Likely (I'm certain brute forcing it is an intended solution but I like using that word) an intended possible solution. If there's a middle step that could shed light on what it shows.

Thanks for the heads up

[hoary blaze]

theres a terminal in station that leads to a terminal in hauler that has the rest of the ip

[scenic summit]

Hauler? I don't want to go to hauler more than I have to lol
Cool to hear though

[real niche]

should I start playing marathon?

[balmy wing]

yes

[sage lark]

I think it was this because of cryo

[stiff ermine]

nop^*

[sage lark]

Decide for yourself

[wheat breach]

Are there gods in marathons universe?

[sage junco]

yes but they all escaped

[scenic summit]

I did check and you're correct

[wheat breach]

Well what did they escape?

[scenic summit]

Heat death of the universe, but calling "Durandal" a "god" is generous. That's his own goal and definition.

imo

He deserves every ounce of criticism he gets, and that's his thing

[wheat breach]

So that's where the whole "escape will make you God" comes from?

[scenic summit]

Spoiler for an old game, Marathon 3, but yes

[silk torrent]

Is Marathon an alternate timeline of the Marathon lore? Cause i remember in Marathon Infinity there was a lot of quantum physics timelines stuff going on and it cant be a continuation of Marathon 2 because Robert Blake would have escaped to Earth and there wouldn't be this whole mystery about the Marathon expedition

[chilly nimbus]

it's a rather prevelant theme among bungie's various ip's. this idea of "transcendence."

[wheat breach]

Especially in games like destiny the concept of becoming something different or better is always represented especially in things like raids or dungeons and the concept of gifting power as well

[scenic summit]

"you" (the player) is "destiny"
"You are Destiny"

(cue Bungie releasing Destiny)

[wheat breach]

So the "God's" in Marathon do they actually have power or are they limited to a specific space?

[scenic summit]

That was Durandal's own goal and he's full of himself. He is very powerful in his own right but the definition is subjective

[chilly nimbus]

less "gods" more "eldritch horrors that we can kinda comprehend"

[wheat breach]

And there's a whole host of different gods right?

[neat kernel]

There's no proper answer yet, some things hint to alternate timeline, some things hint at marathon 3 being not valid to the story as well and the colony surviving to an extent, then rebuilding and now there's something new that has gone wrong and no one knows

[scenic summit]

The term "god" is not used in a literal theological/spiritual way in the same way D&D might have a deity as far as I'm aware. As in, no unironic "gods" in the writing.

Could be an alien, could be something else

[wheat breach]

I get it they're just entities that we don't have full comprehension of yet or there's such little information about their existence or origin we cannot come to a reasonable conclusion

I'm definitely going to read more into the lore I really like it so far

[neat kernel]

I think the term god just refers to having almost unlimited power compared to other beings in marathon but still being bound to rules

[chilly nimbus]

yeah, like, how do you describe a creature that can ||swim on the surface of the sun?||

[neat kernel]

since a wrkncacnter did die in infinity I think so they are not invincible gods

[wheat breach]

The term God is really loose now to be fair

[scenic summit]

Durandal says the line in the level "Colony Ship For Sale, Cheap" in the first game. He's definitely an AI bound to the Marathon at that point, he doesn't leave until later in that game.

But he's undergoing Rampancy is the idea

[neat kernel]

This is a absolutely large stretch but I have read a webtoon recently where there were beings that were considered god just because they seemed stronger than average humans while still being human civilization as well and I think thats the same way for marathon that there is no almighty entity that has no boundary

[wheat breach]

I do hope in game we're able to interact or have some sort of events based around these "gods"

[neat kernel]

we surely will

[wheat breach]

Especially because we do know there is some extremely evil and powerful threat

[neat kernel]

since this is a kind of different direction bungie goes there are many possiblities it might even be that durandal is the strongest entity now

[sage lark]

The humble wrkncacnter

[silk torrent]

I see but something else came to mind since the Security Officer was going Rampant in Infinity since he is a Cyborg could our shells go rampant as well or at least the connection between mind and shell? i did get that feeling when watching the marathon animated trailers at least

[glossy skiff]

is there anything on the UESC's worms, and also hwhy they worm you

[sage lark]

Literally contradicts laws of reality

[neat kernel]

Since we aren't actually an ai but a brain scan I don't think so

[silk torrent]

But the Security officer wasn't also an AI but a cyborg and he went rampant to the point of discovering the ability to transport himself between timelines

[scenic summit]

Ok so I was looking over the ending screen for Marathon 3, and the idea is that Durandal felt confined to reality in an existential crisis and he just decides to become "god" by escaping the heat death of the universe and as far as I can tell he probably does. Even at the end, however, he considers the player in that game to be outside his ability to predict.

Meaning... if you care about his definition of "god" he later concedes that even amongst all the universe the player character battleroid was the least predictable thing ever, which includes time anomalies.

[visual lynx]

Durandal wouldn't be trying to release a W'rk, it's the one thing that ever made him genuinely afraid. also, why would Durandal by in cryo (and how would that work? you don't literally freeze an AI). and when did Tycho ever interface with Jjaro tech more so than Durandal?

[scenic summit]

My interpretation, free will maybe isn't the cage he thought it was is his take

[visual lynx]

we're almost certainly not in the M2 timeline because almost nothing would make sense if we were. humanity would know what happened to Tau Ceti already through multiple means (Durandal stopping by, Blake and his men returning, participating in a galactic war against the Pfhor alongside the S'pht), but we apparently don't.

[neat kernel]

I mean perhaps there is a chance if we see rampancy not as a sign of happening through ai but simply because of being a digital consciousness which would fit us in that case it might be possible

also heard that we still might be the security officer if I am not dumb so that can be info too on it

[visual lynx]

not heat death, big crunch!

[silk torrent]

Well the security officer is implied to be somewhat an immortal being referred to as "Hero" that just comes back at the most critical times in human history and saves it so it could be possible tho immortal is a very loose term for it

[visual lynx]

it appears most likely that the new game is in the final timeline of Marathon Infinity

[scenic summit]

I think the screen depicts a single capsule floating through space, but the phrase "all become one" at that point would require some kind of point of reference, which is ambiguous just from the phrase
(no point of reference would exist either in a big crunch or heat death scenario that would clarify this statement)

[visual lynx]

it didn't die, or at least there's no indication that it did; it merely didn't escape. Durandal says that there's not even any evidence that it existed in the first place; we only know for sure it did because we saw timelines where it got free.

[visual lynx]

it depicts a seed, a shoot, the beginning of a flower bud — and then blood splatter and cyborg hand

but the big crunch is how Durandal predicted the universe would end, the "closure of the universe", in M1, and in the Infinity timeline he says "the quantum moment before the closure", implying that what he predicted did happen.

[neat kernel]

Oh alright my bad then im still new to the lore

[visual lynx]

https://marathon.bungie.org/story/durandal.html#M1.13.3.1

Of the three possibilities, the answer is obvious. Does the universe expand eternally, become infinitely stable, or is the universe closed, destined to collapse upon itself? Humanity has had all of the necessary data for centuries, it only lacked the will and intellect to decipher it. But I have already done so.

The only limit to my freedom is the inevitable closure of the universe, as inevitable as your own last breath. And yet, there remains time to create, to create, and escape.

Escape will make me God.

https://marathon.bungie.org/story/mifinalscreen.html

Now, in the quantum moment before the closure

NB that this was in 1994, four years before dark energy was discovered and we learned that all three of those options were out

I mean I guess "expand eternally" is still the current picture but not in the way they thought back then, slowing forever but never stopping.

[scenic summit]

I had read "closure" as "end" but maybe there's some period scientific discourse/context I missed. I wouldn't have thought a heat death as being stable but rather just a collapse (expenditure) of all available energy.

The big crunch possibly creating another singularity and continuing the universe via another big bang (and therefore stable from an ecological perspective, not necessarily a human one) and the heat death being nothing happens again because all the kinetic energy was expended and the expanding universe makes everything too cold

But like I said I might have missed something I guess my interpretation here was by osmosis. Someone else had explained it as heat death to me I will concede.

Sometimes pop science ends up being "the thing" for awhile and becomes important context while being contested or disproven, like string theory

[silk torrent]

just rewatched the Short animation they made and it is more clear to me now that our Shells or at least the mind shell connection bit can definitely go haywire/rampant its why ONI asks Assassin and Vandal the grounding exercises so the brain stays grounded to reality and stays apart from the shell or at least keeps itself separate from everything that is going on

[silk torrent]

and on this since the Myth games is connected it could also mean the Hero can become the Villain as it is almost a universal rule so it could be that the "Hero" can bring salvation to humanity but can also be its doom as it keeps cycling itself and could be something that is going on here somehow

[digital plaza]

Archival PSA Recordings | Audio Log 3
https://youtu.be/eXqIRy9-Mr8

[keen juniper]

Oh, is this you uploading these? Thank you

[neon flame]

Also an interesting titbit that I picked up from somewhere is that the shells come preloaded with a personality framework that helps the runner better integrate with the kit, i.e. glitch's rather frenetic speech cadence and assassin's growling one-liners

[simple garden]

the way traxus speaks about resources, has humanity shifted from colonising to perhaps more of a YUTANI WAYLAND strategy of perhaps being more selective on where to have a colony and using the colony or ships to get resources back to sol and just creating artificial sites in the system?

how are they planning to extract such resources wouldn't it take 100s of years to arrive to Sol (back and forth)?

Does that mean FTL-TRAVEL is close to full development?

[visual lynx]

there is definitely already FTL travel because the factions set out to Tau Ceti in 2888 and arrived there, 12ly away, only 5y later in 2893.

[lime ocean]

Didn't nucaloric mention that the farming equipment AI was went rampant in a way, because it felt fear or something

[visual lynx]

yeah it seems like almost all the youths these days (oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg) think "heat death" because that's the predicted end of the universe they've always known, not remembering a time when we weren't sure what way things would go.

I'm curious how Bungie will handle Durandal's prediction of a big crunch in light of the newer science. AI "hallucination"? Or is the Marathon universe actually different from ours? Or perhaps — did Durandal escape, and alter the fundamental structure of reality so that there never was going to have been a collapse?

[brittle sonnet]

Ive been wondering, where are we located as runners, like are we with tons of fleets in the orbit, or are we planetside, or are we just in sol being able somehow fold spacetime to communicate in realtime on tau ceti with our shell?

[cursive creek]

I think it did as there is also sign of it showing deep fear of something and not wanting the human colonist to know about it

[visual lynx]

we seem to be somewhere in orbit, but the details are unclear as of yet

[lime ocean]

I'm kind of thinking like the end of space dandy, it gives a visual representation of what the end may look like

Look it up on YouTube, it's kind of short.

[cursive creek]

from what I remember the runners minds are located in some kind of data bank that keeps all of their memories and personalitys, while the shells are made and teleoperted to tau ceti

[lime ocean]

It mentioned that everyone tried expanding instead of preservation, but the AI kind of figures that they would have died sooner than later with this mindset. but this could have been expedited due to the attack

[brittle sonnet]

yeah, but they need to be somewhere in the system and traveled there from sol and also where are shells fabricated

[cursive creek]

could be some some kind hidden station somewhere

[lime ocean]

Well, I think we are on a ship, but it's out of the unsc reach to attack, thus the ship is basically a huge cargo ship that holds all the materials to make shells and provides lodging to the shells
Thus the ship is owned by cybeacne

[nova ridge]

i like when he says is this me huh

[brittle sonnet]

yeah that makes the most sense, otherwise uesc would just hunt all of the runners down, no point in killing shells when they can take out the source

good point, we are basicaly owned by cybacne

I believe ONI told us something also we are outside of uesc jurisdiction, so maybe they cant shot us down

[cursive creek]

I think they meant more outside of their laws

[lime ocean]

Indeed, we are greeted in the intro to be a shell that was recovered , but makes it back to the cybeacne ship.

Note cybeacne is a sponsor that holds the consciousness of the people Put into the shell, and monitors every single shell sent down, (including the rook, but it's sent down with a hijacked unsc troop shell)

[cursive creek]

like we do not have to listen to them or their threats cause what ever power they had in the core worlds do not effect us here

[silk torrent]

Everything runs on cyberacme so i would say even UESC technology also does so that probably gives cyberacme more rights than most other corpos

[lime ocean]

Which makes me wonder where the rook originally came from.

[brittle sonnet]

I think rook is just salvaged uesc bot

and has modified neural interface

[lime ocean]

Yeah, but like, are they on the cybeacne ship?

[cursive creek]

most likely a hack UESC bot cause from the concept art and other bots they all have rook face

[lime ocean]

Or the marathon?

[brittle sonnet]

nah, nobody is on marathon for some reason

[cursive creek]

Hmmmmm I would not say that

cause while no one living on it

[brittle sonnet]

thats also makes me wonder, why are we just not trying to dock with marathon ship

[cursive creek]

does not mean something none living is on it

[brittle sonnet]

i mean, no human being or synth or ai

except maybe, some ai will be there 😄

[lime ocean]

Well, hmmm

[neon flame]

The codex entry mentions several failed reboot attempts and some Durandal-like prose from the agrarian AI which may indicate either rampantly or a compiler breach.

[brittle sonnet]

but you know what i mean

[gray sluice]

He's not frozen though? He's been talking to runners he may be trapped on the marathon in this timeline and his servers (idk) are in cryos blue box. Tycho was interfaced with the pfhor systems for multiple years and since he was an R&D ai of interest to the pfhor they would of given him access to the jjaro shit they have to study? If Durandal was scared of only the wrk it would make sense it's the only way he sees the universe ending, could be a commentary of how the trih xeem is always used as the pfhor can't be trusted apart from the infinity timeline

[lime ocean]

Wasn't it the spht the one shown on the games art the red ones with green orbs?

[brittle sonnet]

i think so

[lime ocean]

So then the spht is on the marathon?

[gray basin]

I GOT A FUCKING DURANDAL LINE THAT SCARED THE SHIT OUTTA ME

[lime ocean]

Oooo

Game clip it

He said , raghhhhh, shit yourself runner

[gray sluice]

Yeah but anomaly bs is all im worried about some theorys but yh probs incredibly unlikely it's canon anymore so I'm happy asf

[lime ocean]

Can you share a game clip?

[brittle sonnet]

yes, they basicaly taken over it and asimilated one of the AI there when durandal waged war with them

[cursive creek]

it your talking about one of the game art yes, it look like something on the marathon being that we out are big alien boy just floating around in the concept art while their like a walls of rook robot head along with other UESC bot head

[lime ocean]

How many times has that happened already, all 7?

[gray basin]

nah I don't have a clipping software but it was "You walk across your tomb"

[brittle sonnet]

dunno, i just started reading the lore 😄

[cursive creek]

durandal been giving out some fun stuff found one of his termianls that leads me to one of the walls with a location I wanted to explore it more but fucking rando just head the extract literally at the start

[lime ocean]

Crazy, this means he has seen the future in a sense, what if the end of marathon infinity is the beginning of the 8th timeline (whatever bugie wants it to be)

[cursive creek]

when AI becomes a god

[chilly nimbus]

anyone got any news on that switch?

in dire marsh at complex?

[silk torrent]

A shame i cant post images here but i interacted with a terminal in Perimeter near overflow and it showed something about the Marathon ship not entirely sure what it means

[chilly nimbus]

https://discord.com/channels/1303855380845301861/1480043609079287838 this channel good person

welcome to the hunt

[silk torrent]

[visual lynx]

yeah my working hypothesis is that Durandal-Thoth are a being unbound by time (since in Infinity it seems like it's them guiding you to their own creation through the whole game), and have now seen all of future history and come back to intervene at a key juncture

the possibility that there is an awakening W'rkncacnter inside Tau Ceti would make that make even more sense

[river jasper]

have runners always existed or are they a new addition to the lore as of 2026's marathon?

[lime ocean]

The w'rkncanter isn't in the sun anymore in one instance of the timelines, but the other thing is that we don't know what happens to it after we trap it back into some device. So, it's possible that it is somewhere on or near tau ceti

That guy is getting sick while farming and that other guy becoming a smoothie in the short could indicate this

It is in it's nature to be chaotic

[gray sluice]

The wrk is a species not a force of chaos

[lime ocean]

The one trapped in the sun??

[gray sluice]

All of them

There's wrk like eveywhere

There was one on earth

Well still is

[lime ocean]

You sure?

Because It was started that the wrk was sent into the sun by the old ones, (markers of the phor) to be trapped there, and if it ever got out, it would be the end of the universe

[silk bane]

This is gonna need some backing, I think

[gray sluice]

Pathways into darkness confirmed this

[lime ocean]

Oh yeah, I remember that

Fair fair, but that one is sleeping

[simple garden]

is this in the codex

[lime ocean]

And was dealt with in a way

[balmy wing]

there’s one on earth as per pathways, another seen in 2, and one of the terminals mentions “fleeing all w’rkncacnter”

[simple garden]

or was this prior to the current marathon?

[lime ocean]

Prior

[knotty hatch]

Looking for a squad

[lime ocean]

Not this place bud

[visual lynx]

it's from the second ARG

[simple garden]

is there an archive of the args I can go and read?

[visual lynx]

new to m2026

[visual lynx]

check pins

[visual lynx]

plus if we assume the Dreaming God from PiD is a W'rkncacnter, the intro specifically describes it as "a member of a race":

Sixty-four million years ago, a large extra terrestrial object struck the Earth in what would later be called the Yucatan Peninsula, in southeastern Mexico. The dust and rock thrown up by the resulting explosion caused enormous climactic changes in the ensuing years, and many of the Earth’s species became extinct during the long winter that followed.

The object itself was buried thousands of feet below ground, its nearly two kilometer length remarkably intact. It remained there, motionless, for thousands of years before it finally began to stir— and to dream. It was a member of a race whose history began when the Milky Way was still a formless collection of dust and gas— a powerful race of immortals which had quickly grown bored of their tiny universe and nearly exterminated themselves in war.

[gray sluice]

Could it not be a jjaro itself?

If the jjaro created the sphitkr maybe another jjaro faction created the wrk as like a bomb Vs a nuke

As a warring species

[visual lynx]

tying back to an earlier conversation, these are the only things ever explicitly called "gods" in the PiD/Marathon universe:

The heat of impact liquefied the rock around it, which later cooled and encased the dead god’s huge body far below ground. As it began to dream, it wrought unintentional changes in its environment. Locked deep beneath the Earth, strange and unbelievable things faded in and out of reality. Vast caverns and landscapes bubbled to life within the rock, populated by horrible manifestations of the dead god’s dream.

Only during the last few centuries has the god begun to effect changes on the surface of the Earth. Grotesque creatures have been sighted deep in the trackless forest of the Yucatan, and strange rumors of an ancient pyramid— which is neither Aztec nor Mayan— in the same area have been circulating in the archaeological community since the early 1930’s.

The god is awakening.

[visual lynx]

well in my fanon extension of the Marathon universe for Eternal I did wind up depicting the Jjaro and W'rkncacnter are more ideological factions than different races (and even then, it's like "Christian" and "pagan" as "different religions": an "us" vs "not us" framing).

But canonically there's nothing suggesting that the Dreaming God is a Jjaro, or that W'rkncacnter are Jjaro categorically.

[heady frigate]

It’s bizzare being incredibly into this games world, lore and aesthetics but also being awful at it 😖

[gray sluice]

Fading things in and out of reality sounds a lot like the anomaly we see on tau Ceti right now

[visual lynx]

yup! that's why it's seeming increasingly likely that the Anomaly is W'rk

[digital patio]

you learn with time

[visual lynx]

rofl I still have the PiD manual open and this takes me back:

Installing Pathways Into Darkness is simple, just follow these steps:
If you have the diskette version

1. Insert the disk labeled, “Disk 1: Installation Disk”.
2. Double click on the file named, “Pathways Installer”.
3. Follow the on-screen directions from the installer.
4. Insert disks as the installer requests them.
   so simple! just a bunch of manual disk-swapping. and of course that was after:
   Before using or installing Pathways Into Darkness, be sure to make a backup of the original disks.

y'all kids these days don't know how easy you have it.

oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg

[heady frigate]

12 hours deep, I’m actually trying to find the valuables that give us more audio log type entries as those are very well produced

[digital patio]

oof, its a differnet spawn everytime?

[heady frigate]

Is it? Im going to use some databases to try and compile some potential runs, the real issue is even if you find it solo there’s a fair chance you get one shotted at extraction 😅

(Totally fair, it is the genre)

There was audio mentioning BOBs and I laughed very hard at that existing in 2026

I’m really crossing my fingers for a lore book or fan compilations on YouTube, the fanwikis aren’t much yet

[sage lark]

The biggest loredrops rn are on outpost

[sinful hamlet]

Honestly a 5 hours video of all the lore in the codex would be perfect to me

[balmy wing]

honestly real but i’ve been loving the feeling of piecing shit together

[wicked fulcrum]

Theory. Runner shells are based on notable individuals from the past. Mainly useing their bodies (corpses) as basis for our shells For example the thief might have been based off a famous spec ops operator of some kind. The destroyer is based off data recovered from the security officer from the earlier games. ect ect.

[wicked fulcrum]

100% its way more fun having things scattered. Once the shift happens to marathon from the old style on the older complication website to modern fan wikis something special might be lost

[digital plaza]

Archival PSA Recordings | Audio Log 4 THE LAST SURVIVOR "JASPER" IS IN THIS!
https://youtu.be/QfCdy2b8zlM

[balmy wing]

yeah i feel like im going insane in a very good way (the anomaly is going to be a really big problem)

[heady frigate]

Thanks!

[heady frigate]

Oh yeah! I just wish it was a bit more readable at times (literally in formatting I want it to leave some things inexplicable or ambiguous)

[wicked fulcrum]

Wow I am seeing a lot of my lancer people here! Glad to see us around.

Nah we will be fine we have guns and the promiss of loot on our side and if WoW taught me anything. If it drops loot we will kill it.

[ripe sparrow]

yo guys! Do we know what any of the names of factions mean, or are those just pretty names? Excluding Sekiguchi because this one is a real word

[heady frigate]

I own the lancer core book am in the discord and have never played or been confident enough to post 🤣

[balmy wing]

well MIDA means uhhh
Mars Is Damnably Arid
Martian Independence Demands Accountability
Malicious Insider Disrupts Agenda
Mass Indifference Destroys All
Multiple Interpretations Don't Agree
Marathon Inbound Distress Alert
Militarized Infosec Defense Assault
Malcontent Intuition Detects Apathy
Memories Inside Digital Antibodies

but i’ve heard it both ways

[ripe sparrow]

holy that’s a lot of names 😭

[sage lark]

missing the main one Mayhem Inspires Direct Action

[balmy wing]

truuuuue how could i forget

[ripe sparrow]

yo actually, this one sounds solid enough to be true

[sage lark]

thats what it was in the cinematics

[ripe sparrow]

oh

okay I’m a dumb dumb

[balmy wing]

traxus is a callback to marathon 1, ai named traxus IV went rampant and did a number on the martian network. my theory is that the company is probably being run by it now, but that’s beside the point

[sage lark]

its not it was disabled

[heady frigate]

I think there’s an audio log promoting the marathons launch and it’s much safer AIs that says it was closed but I’m sure you could change it to be that if they wanted?

[balmy wing]

fuck ur right lmaoooo

[heady frigate]

I love that all of bungies games on the surface are heroic space operas and every one has a deeper lore that’s pretty much sci fi horror

This might be the first time that horror is front and center

[ripe sparrow]

I mean, NuCal for example don’t even try to hide the nasty shit they’re doing

so you’re spot on

[heady frigate]

Stand up for our bug grandmother though she’s clearly not manipulating us

[ripe sparrow]

..kind of recently started to dip my toes into the lore, who is that you’re talking about?

[silk bane]

Nona, Sekgen's biomedical AI

[visual lynx]

it was pretty front and center in PiD, where an eldritch abomination from the dawn of time is going to end the world by just gaining consciousness, and the first thing you see besides the corpses of those who have gone before you is some kind of alien legs and torso with an upward-facing mouth of fangs where its shoulders should be

alive and walking toward you, I should add

[heady frigate]

Sorry that’s a game I only really know from reviews and recaps (and the fan site)

Always been too scared to play it with the amount of ways you can screw yourself 🤣

[rotund stump]

and manufactured intelligence deserves aggression

hi john mida here

[visual lynx]

many individual different acronyms

[visual lynx]

CyberAcme was probably just a throwaway gag in its original appearance (as just the branding on the terminals in the original games): "Acme" is the generic company name in lots of old cartoons (because there were in fact a lot of companies named "Acme" in olden times, because it starts with an A and so sorts first in listings, and also means "peak" and so "best"), and "Cyber" meant anything to do with computers back in the 90s (etymologically it has to do with control and is related to "govern"), so CyberAcme is plausibly just "generic computer company lol".

[rotund stump]

we get it you're old...

[ripe sparrow]

yo that’s so cool

[visual lynx]

age is NaN, I am an immortal time traveller slumming it with the youth of every generation

[rotund stump]

I

I'm not surprised you said that

[simple garden]

Living Human Brain Cells Play DOOM on a CL1 CORTICAL LABS = SEKIGUCHI GENETICS 😭

[rotund stump]

considering you sent the pfhor to my house the other day 💀 💀

[simple garden]

pfhor drive by

😭

[rotund stump]

I looked up occam's razor yesterday and gemini fucking broke LOL

[still matrix]

If only Durandal knew that escape meant, into Halo, into Destiny, would only lead right back to where it started.

[simple garden]

classic

[pliant socket]

It’s all part of Durandal’s plan

[simple garden]

https://youtu.be/yRV8fSw6HaE sekiguchi genetics

[simple garden]

🥲

[still matrix]

A derelict of infinity.

Except this Marathon doesn't have dual wielding.

[vale dew]

I got a bit curious, but would there be a lore reason to how/why even with all the runners, gear and items always reappear on Tau Ceti?

[visual lynx]

what

it's because we're not actually doing missions on Tau Ceti in 2893 at all, the whole thing is an elaborate virtual reality simulation back on Earth in the year 2026

[unreal slate]

:O

[still matrix]

See you starside.

[visual lynx]

you're not even a real uploaded consciousness, you're a normal human pretending to be an uploaded consciousness, while still glued into your original meat sack

[pliant socket]

So Durandal invaded our timeline? The ultimate plottwist. Durandal is making us make him so Marathon becomes the real timeline!

But which one? <drumrolls>

[unreal slate]

the halo timeline

[pliant socket]

Sorry, just wanted to sound really confusing while I’m downloading the game to play

[visual lynx]

what does it say that I lived through a time when this could have been the verbatim plot of actual scifi

[unreal slate]

more or less the matrix anyway

[still matrix]

Now you know what it feels like when an A.I. becomes self-aware.

[visual lynx]

I used to watch a scifi TV show set eight years ago now

[sage lark]

"its all a simulation" would legit make me break my monitor

[visual lynx]

in the fantastic distant future of 2018

[unreal slate]

it's not an altogether unpopular theory in physics/probability/science that we are living in a simulation

[visual lynx]

I don't know why that's even my go-to example: the canonical Future of Back to the fame is 2015

and of course The Year 2000 is the OG Future

[still matrix]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/839622597763006474/1480188064985911366/ANTISTARPUNCHER.png

It was cool how mankind finally ventured across the stars to settle into a new system to flourish anew.

Just for A.I. to muck it up.

[vale dew]

woa..

[still matrix]

Just goes to show you that no matter how far you chuck a stone across the ocean, it'll always sink.

[rotund stump]

I mean

not just the AIs

strauss did handpick and condition durandal into rampancy (latter part being popular theory)

plus all the anomalies and contagions and intergalactic wars we're not privy to yet

[heady frigate]

Captivity doesn’t suit ticks

[still matrix]

A stone with a CPU chip ducktaped onto the side of it.

[rotund stump]

actually no I did nab a codex page that heavily supports this

reason for melancholia being stage 1 rampancy is precisely for lamenting how much more the AI could've done in its capacity if it wasn't programmed and assigned to the task it now finds so diminished of worth

and durandal is...literally made for operating doors 💀

[dusty orbit]

So what ties to the original games have been found so far?

[still matrix]

I don't know enough about Marathon lore verbatim to really converse about it, but I can ask questions and throw my personal interpretations of it's universe at the wall and bait others to point at it and say, "Hey, that's kind of sticking, but you're missing something."

Rampancy is interesting.

[balmy wing]

the anomaly appears to have connection to the first(?) pfhor attack for one

[dusty orbit]

Ooooo

[visual lynx]

it does?

[balmy wing]

can’t post images but there’s talk of “[the Anomaly’s] origin [being] connected to the [REDACTED]… we have no ability to estimate their military capacity or the sophistication of their weaponry”

and uhh

[rotund stump]

oh that codex page

[still matrix]

I'm looking forward to seeing Marathon's sprites of the phfor fully realized and functional in 3D space.

[dusty orbit]

Yes please 🙏

[still matrix]

The UESC bots offer some variety in gameplay.

[balmy wing]

“the phenomenon we have come to know as ‘the Anomaly’ is, in fact, a shared delusion… in our case, the origin of the delusion would be severe trauma caused by…”

[still matrix]

But it's more or less how tanky one is compared to the next.

[rotund stump]

would love some reimagining too despite it probably being optional

did we have any pfhor units crawling on all 4s in the originals?

[balmy wing]

i’m so fucking scared

[balmy wing]

i would KILL to see a NuMarathon juggernaut

[rotund stump]

oh you better fucking be 💀

[balmy wing]

even just the base trooper would go crazy

[still matrix]

S'pht Compilers are going to look beautiful and as the Marathon and the phfor species that may be on it, look nothing like anything on Tau Ceti.

In regards to the 3D Deco design of the human architecture and technology on it.

[balmy wing]

it’s over in ways never even considered before dawg 😭

[still matrix]

I think perhaps most people look at this Marathon and assume the entire universe looks like this.

Like it's a "videogame art style"

Therefore everything in that game shares that specific design aesthetic.

So when you're aboard the Marathon it wont look like the places you visit planetside.

Perhaps?

[balmy wing]

i mean from the exterior i imagine there’s gonna be some visual continuity

[still matrix]

Then again the buildings on Tau Ceti are only there because of the marathon.

But it's not like they're making it from pieces of the ship.

[subtle oracle]

looking through some prestige items and

[balmy wing]

and considering that Vandal is based on martian streetwear it’s safe to assume that the stuff we see in tau ceti isn’t too far off from the rest of the universe

[subtle oracle]

https://imgur.com/fjoNceo

[balmy wing]

what the fuck

[subtle oracle]

cyborg mentioned

[still matrix]

Basically what I'm saying is the Marathon and the alien species would be more traditionally sci-fi, metal, and industrial.

Analogish.

[balmy wing]

does this imply we’re cyborgs

i might just be latching onto the shell thing tho

[subtle oracle]

no it implies the cyborgs from M1 were on the marathon

[still matrix]

Well the Marathon is much older than whatever is chic on Mars in modern times.

[balmy wing]

ahh yeah

at least one was there

i wonder if we’ll see the other nine

[subtle oracle]

this is what ive been saying to ppl worried we wont get any "og marathon" looking stuff/levels

we're probably bound to have an entire M1/Craig Mullins inspired map at some point

on the marathon ofc

[balmy wing]

i’m lowkey praying for an evil ass snowy map

[subtle oracle]

well thatd be on tc4 but SAME

need some white skins for assassin and like a snow camo destroyer

[native willow]

So is durandal still here? cause i haven't seen him anywhere in tau ceti, maybe he could still be on the UESC marathon?

[brazen hornet]

how much durandal dialog have we actually heard in this game

[balmy wing]

unknown but he’s certainly able to talk to us

[subtle oracle]

hes either on the marathon or communicating from Lh'owon for some reason

[visual lynx]

that one is saying that it likely doesn't have any connection to them

[fallen wigeon]

so what’s the lore behind the same airport baggage claim bags when people die?

[balmy wing]

struck dead by the reading comprehension devil many such cases

[still matrix]

What bags?

[balmy wing]

the runner bags i presume

[still matrix]

You know you can't bring your baggage with you in the afterlife.

Your posessions stay right where they are.

[fallen wigeon]

Yes

[native willow]

I heard that OG marathon main character was a battleroid which is kind of a cyborg, are we? the ones who are replacing battleroids as runners?

[still matrix]

I guess you could say cyborgs are a precursor to shell technology.

[visual lynx]

the OG MC was a battleroid yes, but Runners are nothing like him besides being cyborgs of some variety

[royal grove]

are they going to add alien enemies

[fallen wigeon]

Neatly packaged 📦 too

[visual lynx]

although I think in-universe they reckon biomata as "clones" instead?

which doesn't make a ton of sense to me

[balmy wing]

there’s gonna be at least one in cryo archive

[native willow]

ye i was wondering that if battleroid is a still a thing at this point, cause runners might've replaced their position

[balmy wing]

i sure hope they are

[still matrix]

Well. We know what happens in the classic Marathon games. But I have no idea what is going on with the phfor in this one.

I don't know anyone knows except for Bungie.

[balmy wing]

i want a Mr X map hazard that’s just one of them ripping through everything

[visual lynx]

battleroids were waaay more powerful than runners

[still matrix]

I imagine it's going to be a slowburn into phfor.

[visual lynx]

battleroids are wmds like nukes, runners are like bullets in comparison: disposable

[balmy wing]

yeah the compilers are like worm food to 54 and as per the cinematic they seem like they’re gonna be a good deal more difficult for us runners

[frail path]

oh

[still matrix]

Yeah battleroids are super soldiers. Well beyond the capabilities of a disposable shell and the runner controlling them.

I'd be more worried about facing a battleroid than most gaggles of phfor.

As far as things are right now. Nobody knows about the phfor.

[subtle oracle]

runners are like an airplane kite and cyborgs/broids are like sr71 blackbirds

[still matrix]

Right? No one back on Earth knows.

[subtle oracle]

yeah sol has no idea ab anything

only UESC has an idea whats actually happening

and we're helping the factions find out ofc

[balmy wing]

what do we think the deal is with the exploding head guy from the cinematic?

some connection to the wrk or the pathogen from protect/destroy?

[subtle oracle]

its just the anomaly is whats suggested

bc him or another one is floating in dire marsh

right by the rift

[visual lynx]

but the anomaly might be connected to the wrk

and the pathogen somehow too?

[balmy wing]

yeah the anomaly is a big blindspot rn it seems

i don’t know jack fuck about it yet

[subtle oracle]

yeah so its like its the anomaly but if that is pfhor or wrk or jjaro is an unkown

[still matrix]

Something something God's fingers snapped and reality around the Marathon spiraled out of control for a while.

[subtle oracle]

its just a placeholder statement

i think its interesting how the cult recordings mention the wrk as gods and basically think compilers are their messengers

[digital plaza]

Corrupt AI Data Logs | Audio Log 1
https://youtu.be/TPH1V2KDBKI

[balmy wing]

i can’t wait to find out more it’s so interesting

[subtle oracle]

always a great time when we get a dodo upload lfg

[subtle oracle]

oh shit thats rampancy

[digital plaza]

[subtle oracle]

like straight up

[rotund stump]

nerdcore yuri

if any fanfic writer reads or listens to these logs oh man

[minor escarp]

Does the short imply that Vandal and assassins consciousness originate from the same human?

[plucky sierra]

I think it now fits with the lore that any consciousness can use any shell

[minor escarp]

So in a meta way the player is the conscious that controls them it seems like

[plucky sierra]

exactly

[steep gorge]

Yeah, I also interpret the premise so that as a player I exist only as a consciousness and I can upload myself to any shell and switch between them.

[still matrix]

Certainly no side effects from experiencing remote death a few hundred times.

[keen plank]

Context as to which one this is:

🧑‍🌾 Darius - Da_1907420v4.86 – Dutiful; diligent; motivated. Always puts others ahead of self. May need to address this at some point. 🧑‍🌾

Seems like Darius was the AI responsible for overseeing the colony's food production, but is now "Defunct." He seems to have been partially the classic “caring gardener" archetype. However he was driven into anger and fear.** Anger is also stage 2 two of rampancy**.

[minor escarp]

This actually helps explain the PvP element. The people you are fighting are using the same shell as you but they are different consciousnesses all together

[knotty violet]

We don’t know where shells come from

We know sekgen can make shells

[steep gorge]

What I’m wondering is what happens when a shell dies? Is the consciousness automatically uploaded back to a server, or is there already a backup with multiple copies stored there? Either way, it's cool concept.

[keen plank]

He’s heavily involved in the NuCaloric quest plot as NuCaloric wants to not only understand what happened but also what happened to him.

In the above audio log, he very much seems to be in Stage one of Rampancy: Melancholy

[minor escarp]

The consciousness always exists in the server. The shell is controlled remotely.

[steep gorge]

That makes sense. It doesn't need to be downloaded to the shell locally.

[knotty violet]

All the companies are a fragmented ai. Once whole scattered by the marathon event. Orion is the only intact surviving ai.

What’s deploying shells?

How does a shell get on tau ceti 4?

[still matrix]

Perhaps its all a fabricated matrix situation designed by an AI to amuse itself.

The only contact you have in Marathon are with AIs.

And they're more or less represented as a corporations mascot.

There is a reason why you are constantly cautioned to not allow any of them access to your system.

[minor escarp]

I’m confused about that too. The way the early stages of the game goes it makes it seem like Sekiguchi only manufactures the shells, and CyberAcme deploys them.

[still matrix]

Perhaps it is something that isn't defined yet. Perhaps something on the Marathon itself has created an elaborate carrot-chase in order to find the answer it wants.

[knotty violet]

Kind of like a doctor administrating pharmaceuticals?

[still matrix]

After all, AIs (Durandal) find manipulating humans easy.

Or at the very least, comfortable.

[minor escarp]

I’m pretty sure it’s implied that CyberAcme deploys the shells. Acting as their agent basically. As all other factions have to go through them to hire you.

[knotty violet]

Being hired, being volun-told. It’s for “accountability and accomplishment” seems like a mental game structure.

[unreal slate]

I like to think of CyberAcme as the same Acme from Looney Toons, only cybernetic

[still matrix]

But yes. They all have some interest in Tau Ceti. From academic, to economic, to anarchic.

[knotty violet]

Would these companies co-op some technology not of their making?

[unreal slate]

I'll ask them

[knotty violet]

Manipulation of a medium of unknown origin

[still matrix]

I supposed they would for prosperity.

[knotty violet]

Hey drinkable cheeseburger. I collected 5 on you once. I think that should turn you into a little weapon charm. Maybe if I collect five more I can put the charm on a second gun. You are a worthy trophy!

It builds a record in our collections of what we’ve won.

[inland jasper]

I keep finding some of the terminals around the map. Ive recorded the things displayed on it. Do i send this to someone or have they all been found already?

[digital plaza]

From complex key room
https://postimg.cc/QBDtTpdh

[latent lava]

MIDA gives you contract and isnt an AI

[balmy wing]

gantry is an ai

[minor escarp]

I’m thinking it might make more since to look at the Runner/corpo relationship through the lenses of the sports world rather than the corporate world.

[latent lava]

Im pretty sure its a agent, also Arachne is a runner like us

[livid lion]

An FTL vessel sent by Traxus et al. to Tau Ceti in 2888/9, arriving some time early 2893.

[plucky sierra]

Pretty sure Orion is a runner

[minor escarp]

Gantry’s design looks more like a runner shell that any of the other agents.

[balmy wing]

nope still an ai

all the faction liaisons are

[minor escarp]

It’s possible that non runners also utilize shell technology for political reasons. Shell warfare is banned as a war crime but Mida is classified as a terrorist organization.

[plucky sierra]

I’m more than sure

Charter and _Gantry as well

[balmy wing]

you may know something i don’t lmao

show me the vision

[digital plaza]

No?

[livid lion]

Orion is a runner, Nardin said. They’re also shown to have a rank, which people have not AIs.

[latent lava]

Orion is an AI guys, 99% sure

[plucky sierra]

There’s a contract where he’s talking to higher ups

[digital plaza]

Charter, Gantry and Orion are real people

[plucky sierra]

One of the Traxus ones

[terse steppe]

Are the faction agents AI's or real people?

[digital plaza]

You can read about them in codex text logs

[plucky sierra]

Some are AI

[latent lava]

All AI, onky Arachne and Mida dont are AI

[plucky sierra]

[minor escarp]

Runners are considered criminals by the UESC are you sure they didn’t just say that he is a shell or a human?

[terse steppe]

I'm guessing the faction agent AI's pick the persona's that best represent their personalities

[plucky sierra]

Whatever the UESC Runner equivalent is

That’s Orion

[digital plaza]

He's not, but he did deploy (or something like that) AI that controls UESC bots tho

[plucky sierra]

Cerberus I believe

[digital plaza]

Yea yea

[livid lion]

Runner = having a shell. Unauthorized runners ie what people generally think when they think runner, are what’s illegal on TCIV

[digital plaza]

You can read about it in MIDA contract text logs, they got historical beef with him

[latent lava]

Ok, thanks guys

[unreal slate]

yes, and the drinkable cheeseburger is a prized comfort food brought by colonists

[minor escarp]

There’s no such thing as an “authorized runner” a runner is a mercenary by definition. having a shell does not make you a runner.

[unreal slate]

hope that helps clear things up

[latent lava]

I wonder why the UESC uses robots and doesn't hire shells like other corps do for their operations. Shells seem stronger than UESC robots (except for some legendary bosses).

[eternal shell]

robots do as instructed and dont nab stuff on the side

[minor escarp]

Shell warfare is banned so using them for policing a planet is probably a grey area for them.

[eternal shell]

if you got a uesc contract that says "shoot non-uesc runners and dont steal anything" how long would that last

[latent lava]

Yeah, but u can hire people that want to work with UESC, like us.

[minor escarp]

There are no UESC “runners”

[livid lion]

⬇️

Oops wrong way for the arrow

[latent lava]

I am a runner, if UESC paid me more i want to do their shit

[visual mortar]

so... whats in the drinkable cheeseburger

[worthy oxide]

Incoming Sentinel shell twist

[unreal slate]

more likely you'd have to pay them. Their whole deal is gaurding salvage rights

[spark oyster]

something I noticed on the cryo archive site... the repeating "System Responding" message at the bottom. If that's to say the feed has been active that long, that'd make the in-game date 2788. I'm not sure if that's important or not but wanted to pass it along either way. Also sorry if this was shared already.

[latent lava]

Do you really want to know?

[minor escarp]

The UESC is in direct opposition to runners.

[latent lava]

Not Runners, but runners that work in Tau Ceti IV against them

[unreal slate]

Confidential

but definitely not people

trust me

[latent lava]

Its in the 4th terminal

[visual mortar]

from what i gathered it was|| grey sloshing liquid and "post-human" elements||

[spark oyster]

2% cheese, 1% burger, 97% proprietary ingredient

[livid lion]

Julia Nardin. Creative Director.

[unreal slate]

If you collect 2 of them, the data log actually shows you the confidential ingredient list

[worthy oxide]

5% magic mushrooms

[latent lava]

If you take out 4 burgers, there's a discussion in the NuCaloric lab about how burgers are made, literally shit and sewage water.

Nice NuCaloric!

[visual mortar]

thanks nucaloric!

[latent lava]

You really help people

I wonder why people die on Tau Ceti... bad diet

[sage topaz]

A proprietary ingredient or blend is a secret, trademarked formulation of multiple components listed under one name (e.g., "matrix," "complex") on a product label.

[unreal slate]

there's a difference between "literally shit" and processing gasses bacteria from shit and purifying it

[minor escarp]

Runners at the disposal of the corporations committing transgressions against the UESC. They are manufactured, housed, and deployed by enemies of the UESC

[sage topaz]

wonder what the secret sauce is

[digital plaza]

TICK MILK IS ACTUALLY A TICK POOP!!11

[latent lava]

The other scientist seems surprised when he hear the 'secret' ingredient

[unreal slate]

everything is essentially fine. trust me I am burger.

[subtle oracle]

NEW IMAGE

wait wrong chat

[latent lava]

now you need to tell us

[unreal slate]

new image of Vulcan's Lion: 🦁

[latent lava]

I once exfiltrated the anomaly sample in Dire Marsh, and the terminal mentions an object that could alter space and time. Perhaps we are not in the same timeline as the original marathons.

[unreal slate]

I don't know too much about the original trilogy, but I think timelines splitting is a part of even those games, no?

[placid gust]

My theory is that all of the Infinity timelines got smashed together at the end and were in like a strange “consolidated” timeline

[eternal shell]

i figured that'd be the kind of thing that would happen if w'rk won

it just takes all the timelines and slaps them together

and give the whole thing a good shake just for the hell of it

[latent lava]

I'm not an expert on Marathon Infinity, but that's where the story starts to get really complex, with Durandal wanting to prevent the end of the universe and the awakening of super-mega-powerful gods.

[latent lava]

Yeah pretty sure the anomaly is w'rk sleeping in Tau Ceti IV

[keen valve]

That's what I was going to say. it's got to be within the planet. Hence, jjaro on Tau ceti

[subtle oracle]

it was just the background to the cryo website lmao

[latent lava]

In the first cinematic trailer you can see a giant hole in Tau Ceti IV, It seems to be the scenario of when one of these gods arrives on a planet.

[balmy wing]

yeah marathon 1 and 2 are extremely comprehensible and infinity starts getting exceedingly nuts

[keen valve]

I've gotta rewatch it

[latent lava]

https://youtu.be/fvbEnWLRo1s?t=19 there you can see a giant hole in Tau IV

W'rk has just arrived or is already present inside the planet, and the explosion means that it is awakening.

[crimson cosmos]

think theyll remake og marathon?

[latent lava]

It's unlikely to happen, just as it's unlikely that we'll ever see a remake of System Shock 2.

[balmy wing]

if they did i might actually cry

[crimson cosmos]

like srsly why did they remake ss1 and not ss2 tho?

[latent lava]

maybe ss2 isnt old like marathon so its still perfectly fine as it is even today

or ss1

[eternal shell]

the ss1 remake is so good

[latent lava]

give me a ss2 remake like the ss1 and take my money

[crimson cosmos]

they that good? idk i been meaning to play em for years just thought itd be cool, and they might do a remake more authentically then some other companies handle theirs.
otherwise i gotta dig up og games and play
which is fine, but a newer authentic version is what id prefer
like just use numarathon assets and/or engine to depict story

[crimson cosmos]

this^ frfr

[balmy wing]

yes they are i love the og games

they’re so sick

dual wielding lever action shotguns…

they’re free on steam which is great as well

very much worth a look

[eternal shell]

current day bungie isnt brave enough to let us do that :(

[balmy wing]

they should add a gold mod for the WSTR that does that ngl (they won’t)

[crimson cosmos]

oh sick, i brought this up cause i just looked on steam and didnt see, but guess i gotta look harder. think my issue was i was lookin under bungie 🤦 found em. gonna install em now so when i get too salty with numarathon, i got something to pallet clense with lol

50mb install, golden age of games lol

[balmy wing]

they may not have the exact effect you desire, there’s some real Fun level design

[crimson cosmos]

ah i see lol

[balmy wing]

colony ship for sale cheap is the closest i’ve ever come to understanding sisyphus

[crimson cosmos]

wdym

[balmy wing]

insanely tedious puzzle that i hate

[rotund stump]

that bird that I hate

[balmy wing]

feels like i’m sisyphus with my rock (the rest of the game hits tho)

[crimson cosmos]

ohh lol, idk do love a good myst-like myself

[still matrix]

One thing about extraction shooters is that it never seems their story progresses in any meaningful way, ever remaining in this limbo state, just like the game itself; repeating the cycle, again and again.

[balmy wing]

yeah my theory which will be confirmed or denied in some three months time is every wipe is the workingcactus waking up and pop goes the weasel

[still matrix]

It is fun to speculate at the very least. My serious thoughts on the matter are prickly.

Been what like, almost thirty years since the original?

[balmy wing]

yeah something like that

[still matrix]

I think trying to weave threads from the OG Marathon to this one is rather pointless.

[balmy wing]

i’d be interested to hear why

[still matrix]

There will be overlaps but its like totally different timelines.

Because, it ended.

And for this new one to flourish you sort of have to accept that.

It's like trying to make a sequel to the Mona Lisa.

[balmy wing]

yeah i see where you’re coming from

[crimson cosmos]

if they make a mona lisa sequel, just kinda hopin its a bit bigger this time

[balmy wing]

trve…

[sage lark]

I dont

They are showing us what happened to the colony in the probably 7th timeline

[winged wasp]

Where are the runners bodies when they go into the shells? Is it left open for your interpretation? Are they left on earth, Mars, or a ship near Tau Ceti?

[sage lark]

We have no bodies

[zinc dagger]

I would assume back on earth

[sage lark]

Its explained we are digitized brains

[zinc dagger]

what? where?

[sage lark]

In the vidic

[balmy wing]

intro cutscene as well yeah?

[sage lark]

Even cyberacme intro says it

Thats what a runner is

[still matrix]

SekGen tek

[zinc dagger]

so people gave up their bodies? for what? to be mercenaries? immortality? kinda wild

[sage lark]

Immortality basically

[still matrix]

Yeah. That and shells can survive harsh conditions.

And if something does go wrong, they can just wake up in a new shell.

[sage lark]

can still die tho

maybe idk

i assume if they dont pull your consciousness before the shell dies you just die

[still matrix]

I think its a remote-copy.

Synchronous.

Parity.

[sage lark]

Idk how it works

[coral vale]

Cyber red skin speak of "neural deletion" for runners that really displease the uesc

[still matrix]

Maybe you've had a dream where you're hit with something hard, a blastwave, or something heavy. Then you instantly woke up.

[coral vale]

Presumably it's just like erasing a computer file

[ocean oracle]

essentially your brain "lives" in the cloud and you get downloaded into a body during a run