classic-discussion

[amber hill]

i just want to play cata but the only thing i saw in posts and YT videos from 2-3 months ago are the low population numbers in the servers

and i could not find any more recent content

idk, i just want to play an expansion, either cata or SOD (i cant afford the war within) in which i will be able to play with people, have a lil of wpvp or at least not bump into the 20-30 min long queues for battlegrounds

i dont rlly like pve that much

[silver snow]

first time progressing thru this game which would be the better loadout for my level. (spec'd into a combat sword build at the moment)

[long token]

Daggers are bad

[thorn walrus]

Best quests to do at around 35 for better weapons on my rogue in classic anniversary servers?

[wintry raft]

Hey ! Is there anybody i can ask a few questions about rogues abilities in cata classic? Like using expose armor in pve, combat readiness etc.

[quartz remnant]

yea you can ask here and if someone knows they will help

[rugged shore]

yo for anniversary hardcore do u wanna be running a low swing speed high damage weapon over a higher swing speed one w/ the same dps?

seems at first like itd be better to go for the slower one for more sinister strike damage

-should note this is for levelling not endgame or anything

[half yew]

Assuming equal sheet DPS, take the slower/higher damage range one in MH

[rugged shore]

sweet thank u :)

[stone imp]

If alliance do the SM quest in desolace

[amber hill]

is cata worth playing right now?

[neon verge]

classic rogue is a vibe man. Its so good

[rapid night]

Both the Classic P1 Compendium and the P1 Rogue Sims Spreadsheet are now updated with the following changes:

• Adjust P1 BiS for SS and BS to reflect choosing Shadowcraft (T0) over Nightslayer (T1). T0 was better by at least 10 DPS in almost every situation.
• Removed Rend world buff from standard sims, as most casual players won't receive it.

[rancid frigate]

how can i cheap shot without breaking the sap? do i need a stopattack macro? or is there another way

[magic mural]

hi, i've been looking to cb hemo builds and most of them recommend using a slow and strong main hand and a fast weapon in the off hand to proc poisons. my question is, which poisons should i use for each weapon?

[plucky nymph]

You can use a macro, you can also turn away from what your cheap shotting by like 180°, Auto attacks don't reach that far, at least as far as spells do.

[real axle]

what's the diff between krol/mirah and double dal rend for orc rogue

i'm at 43 rends and getting tired of it and have other shit to do lol

[plucky nymph]

Pretty sure you're clear to do anything else with your life at this point.

[rapid night]

You're not going to like the answer, lol.

(Or maybe you will.)

Krol/Mirah compared to Dals/Dals.

[plucky nymph]

Ohhhh noooo

[rapid night]

Alternatively, Thrash/Mirah is 7 dps worse than Dals/Dals (which seems like a reasonable reason to not farm Dals, given they'll be replaced and not a massive difference - unless you're aiming for max parses)

[plucky nymph]

Yeah but you won't look anywhere near as cool.

Dal/Dal or coward

[real axle]

Can you link me the sim you're using? Also I appreciate the answer, I mean i'm fairly sweat but not going to spend the next 3 days doing rend runs to not get one potentially, have other things to do lol @rapid night

[rapid night]

It's not live yet, but I will update the pinned Compendium when the time comes! (hopefully soon ™️ ?)

[real axle]

Ah okay

[rapid night]

Learning lots of fun new stuff with the sim available 🙂

(Like the fact it's 100% always a DPS loss to align sinisters with MH swing timers for Alliance, and instead you should just send it ASAP)

[real axle]

Yeah that's nice, wanted to just be able to do all of my own things on it lol. Appreciate the work you're doing!

[rapid night]

Soon soon! Will definitely enjoy having the help. been staring at this way too long (and as seen by the Krol blade question - lots of stuff to still figure out and optimize)

[real axle]

I'll try a few more runs, I haven't gotten truestrikes yet either which is disgusting, so I kinda have to keep doing this

One more question

Can you tell me the diff running SC chest/devilsaur gloves and legs vs cadaverous/truestrike shoulders + sc helm as 6pc

60 sec scenario, will have fast kill times in guild

[rapid night]

I just shut down the sims, but last I checked it was VERY minimal, like 5 dps difference between the two.

(which is why the compendium doesn't recommend devilsaur, to save some gold)

[remote walrus]

How bad is it to be Nelf over human

[rapid night]

Sinister Strike (no impact to Backstab)

[remote walrus]

Doesn’t seem that large? Or am I dumb

Ty @rapid night

[rapid night]

Decent amount, but human racial is good (not as good as playing Horde, but good nonetheless). I wouldn’t say it’s a dealbreaker or something that would make you do considerably less damage to make it no longer viable or anything though.

[remote walrus]

Well now I can’t decide

[rapid night]

Depends what you’re trying to and how serious you are with performance - can give a recommendation if you give some more details

In general: If Alliance, I’d go Human. If Horde I’d go Troll (or Orc if you’re in a very very top 15s kill guild).

(If you don’t care about parsing, just play what you want)

[remote walrus]

Ty

[warm canyon]

do we not have dark mantle in this phase?

[barren schooner]

Opinions on hardcore self found professions?

I’m thinking either mining+engi for target dummies but that locks me out of using blind…

Or I could go herbalism and alchemy which seems more what I’m leaning towards

[rapid night]

Phase 5

[warm canyon]

do we not play nightslayer? for full bis

[rapid night]

Not as good as Shadowcraft due to the 6p

[warm canyon]

i see

[rapid night]

Compendium SS Pre-BiS updated to reflect slight dps gain using Krol / Mirah and Devilsaur.

Using Devilsaur as BS was actually worse, as opposed to SS. Still recommend more non-sweatlords stick with the boss drops instead of BoE to save some gold for a VERY slight dps loss.

[warm canyon]

do we have a bis list like this for pvp situations?

[rapid night]

Nah, not really something you can simulate. But I'm sure some more pvp-focused folks might have some recommendations - balancing health with burst, etc etc.

[barren schooner]

Anywhere I can discuss hardcore rogue?

Even any other discords /sub reddits

[rapid night]

https://discord.gg/Aks573M

There's a #hardcore-chat on the Classic Rogue disc

[barren schooner]

Nice, ty

[delicate flare]

is any sword worth to buy from AH while leveling? im level 37 using DM sword still 😄

[half yew]

At that point you're so close to Sword of Omens/Sword of Serenity and Vanquisher's Sword you may as well wait

[frosty wolf]

Hello guys, im gonna hit lvl 40 soon my question. Is heavens light ( mace ) or sword of serenity better for combat rogue in main hand?

[warm canyon]

probs light

more dmg has agi and str

[true hollow]

hey, im a lvl 85 assassination rogue ilvl 372, and i am doing about 20k dps in dungeons, i use heliki to help with my rotation because i want to max my dps by learning my rotation more efficiently. is this dps normal, or should i be doing more, say 30k?

[open wing]

anyone know where a pvp p1 bis is?

[opaque leaf]

you can also get blind powder from lockboxes you get pickpocketing, not as stable as fadeleaf herb but still an option

[gilded sable]

When I see other people play rogue it seems they're able to sap someone and then go back into stealth when they exit combat. For me it doesn't exit combat for the whole duration of the sap. Unless this only works on other players and not on mobs?

[plucky nymph]

Sounds right.

[west zinc]

yo question

for world pvp and questing in general is a hemo build on rogue a good idea? or should i stick to ss

[livid palm]

SS

[candid lava]

has anyone had the opportunity to do raids in decent gear? wondering how rogue dps is performing now that the debuff cap is gone and they can use deadly poison without trolling

[rugged stratus]

rogue has always been a good dps in classic

[candid lava]

Im asking comparatively

[rapid night]

DP is better, but only on fights longer than 30s and still only very slightly (like most things in Vanilla). Also, only one Rogue in the raid can use it, so others are stuck with IP/IP.

[barren skiff]

Why's that?

[devout patio]

I only have the OH from UBRS so far, is Thrash Blade MH and Dal'Rend OH the best set up? Or Mirah MH and Dal'Rend OH?

[true hollow]

in terms of trinkets, the Fluid Death keeps my spell hit chance at 17%, while the Unsolvable Riddle brings it down to 16.98%. the UR has an added on-use agility bonus, while the FD has an agility bonus that happens automatically depending on RNG. wowsims is telling me the UR is better for dps, but i want to talk to an actual human about this, because i know that hit cap of 17% is very important. thoughts?

[half yew]

The Spell hit cap is only important in that you want to be close to or at, not over. Unlike the 8% melee hit cap, there isn't a good reason to always have exactly 17%, and the value of anything over 17% is pretty bad.

More specifically - past about 16.5% (for Assassination) the EP value of more Spell Hit starts to fall as the likelyhood of a Poison miss ever happening drops. The sim reforge logic knows this, and doesn't explicitly get 17% all of the time.

Riddle is a very strong trinket because you can macro it to Vendetta and never think about it; it's just a very big burst damage boost. That said, if you can, buy the 378 raid trinket, it's just Riddle but better.

[true hollow]

thanks! this is extremely helpful what is the raid trinket, though?

[half yew]

https://www.wowhead.com/cata/item=69001/ancient-petrified-seed

[light cave]

Thrash/Mirah is better than using Dal OH without the MH.

[hearty sonnet]

can someone help me

@versed hatch im really sorry to bug but I have a question about classic rouge that I cant find online

[versed hatch]

ask @rapid night I have never played classic in my life

[rapid night]

What’s up

[half yew]

Asking your question is faster than asking if you can ask a question

[paper sierra]

Can I ask a question about his question?

[plucky nymph]

No.

[solemn pond]

is felstrike and heartseeker worth to obtain ?

[rapid night]

Felstriker yes - about 30 dps more than any other pre-bis dagger. Heartseeker, not really, as there are comparable options you can farm.

Main Hand
Felstriker > Heartseeker (-30) > Keris of Zul'Serak (-34) > The Shadowfoot Stabber (-35) > Barman Shaker (-35) > Bonescraper (-38)

[solemn pond]

@rapid night felstrike or core hound for off hand ?

hard to get dagger in raid 😄

[rapid night]

Can find everything listed here:
https://www.thecomfywizard.com/classic-rogue-compendium-p1#quickLinkTalents

[solemn pond]

tyty

[vital escarp]

WTB WOW CHARACTER DEATH PST

[gaunt dust]

Hey can I please beg someone to tell me where I’m going wrong here on sub I know I need to focus my uptime on rupture over everything else but I was wondering if anyone else had any tips I’ve also heard taking a 2 Combo point Slice and dice is okay aswell and I’ve seen some rogues Shadow Dance + ambush right off the rip aswell I have a mastery set for S&D too any help will be greatly appreciated I have 24 other people investing their time in dragon soul to get me the lego daggers and I don’t want to let these people down

https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/pagle/jùicewrld?difficulty=4&spec=Subtlety&class=Rogue

[amber hill]

anyone here playing rogue on cata?

im a bit lost tbh

[river mesa]

Yes?

[amber hill]

which is the BIS gear for rogue actually?

do i need to get PVE gear?

cuz i rlly hate pve

[river mesa]

for pvp? its deader then dead in cata but yes, cata is the last expac that supports pve abuse in pvp. aside from that cant say much on pvp

[red locust]

Hey everyone! So I've got a few weapon choices, and hoping someone smarter and who knows Rogue in Classic prob more than me can help.

I've got the following 4 to choose from:
Cruel Barb: https://www.wowhead.com/classic/item=5191/cruel-barb
Toxic Revenger: https://www.wowhead.com/classic/item=9453/toxic-revenger
Meteor Shard: https://www.wowhead.com/classic/item=6220/meteor-shard
Prison Shank: https://www.wowhead.com/classic/item=2941/prison-shank

My current thought is Cruel Barb MH for Sinister Strike, and Toxic Revenger OH.

Appreciate any help or input in advance.
I should probably mention, this is for Classic Era

[misty stone]

with the rune broker being introduced, is there a meta for leveling?

[rapid night]

Classic Rogue Sims are now live!
An alternative to the spreadsheet, WoWSims Classic is a simulation tool in which you can configure your character, buffs, debuffs, encounter duration, etc and run actual simulations of encounters. Please let us know if you find any issues!
https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/

[rapid night]

P1 Rogue Sims Comparison Sheet is now updated with links to individual sims for Classic!

Classic Rogue Compendium for P1 has been updated with links to sims and minor tweaks to boss optimizations.

[amber hill]

the queue for BG isnt even that long

5 min maximum

idk abt rated pvp

but normal bg is ok for me, its just that i need gear cuz everyone twoshots me

[plain leaf]

Hi, I'm playing on classic wow anniversary realms, can rogues not pick up 'The Azure Key' quest ? I'm lvl 52 and I can't see it

[half yew]

Sunken Temple class quests are in a later phase

-# I don't remember what phase

I think BWL

[plain leaf]

oh :(, I guess I have to get that other head piece

[solemn pond]

@rapid night can u plz explain rogue dagger opener pve

https://gyazo.com/eeb7c21ea72f3f95dbe0aad0f82a02a8

[rapid night]

If you click simulate and go to Results > Timeline, you can see the casting sequences and priority in rotation.

APLs are read top to bottom - if a rule fails, it goes to the next rule. If a rule succeeds, it casts the action and goes back to the top of the list again

[plain leaf]

How much gold should I pay for Devilsaur legs ?

[mortal marsh]

What is the proc chance on shadowcraft 6 set? And what is the difference in dps compared to using truestrike shoulders and cadaverous chest?

[rapid night]

6p T0 proc chance is 2%-5% on every white hit.

Regarding the difference in damage, your best bet is to sim it, as the answer will change based on if you're referring to SS or BS and somewhat relatively to your current gear and raid config (but less so).

[rapid night]

Relative to how wealthy you are and the average cost on your server/faction. I also would not purchase if you're playing Backstab, as T0 performs better. However, it is pre-bis for Sinister Strike.

**SoD **
Had a slow day, refactored all P6 sweaty APLs and standardized settings across 60s/90s/120s. (mostly doing for P7 research prep). Holler if you see anything wonky or have improvement ideas!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1v5WjDiZloY947wbVANK4bg1QO8S-6QcBjYM6vcWhdIs/edit?usp=sharing

[rapid night]

SOD

• More casual players will likely perform best playing Mutilate CttC, trailed by Backstab Assassination Carnage.

• Sweaty players will likely perform best playing Mutilate Carnage, trailed by Backstab Subtlety Carnage.

It's worth noting, Saber Slash is extremely strong in p6 (and likely P7), however it suffers greatly from most of the fights in AQ having to target swap and downtime, therefore it's only really strong on a couple fights in practice.

[worn cairn]

I'm leveling in HC and got Electrocutioner Leg, do y'all think it's better than Outlaw Sabre? Sabre has higher max damage for more dmg from SS n riposte, but Leg has much higher dps

[half yew]

Unsure what your OH is in this comparison, but assuming you're just asking which one to use MH, definitely Outlaw

Leg is probably going to cut your SS damage by 1/3rd or more, and (again, assuming Combat spec with Dual Wield Spec talented) the OH penalty isn't enough to warrant that special attack loss

[fierce crest]

Hey guys!

how good is skilled fighting blade? I saw somwhere online that it was even better than most of the raid dagger just because of the +4 daggers skill, but idk seems suspicious

any insighgT?

[warm cosmos]

Is BRD pickpocket farming also nerfed on Anniversary realms? The whole debuff thing after a few pickpockets then pocket lint? Haven’t tested personally so idk.

[atomic herald]

if it is nerfed on era then it would be nerfed here, we are on era rules

[rapid night]

It’s the pre-BiS offhand for Backstab (Alliance only), and very good. You can use the pinned sim link and click the “Backstab” preset, swap in what weapons you’d like to test, and click Simulate to compare them

[warm cosmos]

just tried and it doesnt seem to be nerfed on anniversary realms. maybe it was a SoD thing only?

[fierce crest]

I see! Why alliance only?

[rapid night]

Only available as an Alliance quest reward - Horde will use Bonescraper OH until P2 for pre-BiS, after which I believe it changes to Distracting Dagger (haven’t ran sims yet for P2)

[fierce crest]

Thank you ver much! I just checked your site and saw devilsaurs arent prdbis 😭😭

I was going shadlwxcraft-devilsaurs set

Very good site btw!

[keen axle]

Soooooo in classic wow, how can I get hit cap without devilsaur set?

I'm too broke to be buying devilsaur

Also I am currently combat sword spec for pve, and i have some daggers for a sub pvp spec. At what point should I go daggers for pve? Whenever i get raid daggers?

[fierce crest]

Is there a place in your site, or a good site for pvp reference?

@rapid night

[rapid night]

I only focus on PvE, but there are quite a few good PVP folks over on the Classic Rogue Discord who often share good tips (some pinned in the classic channel as well)

[fierce crest]

amazing thank you

[rapid night]

SOD

First draft, all feedback welcomed!
https://www.thecomfywizard.com/sod-rogue-dps-compendium-p6

[noble wasp]

sorry if this has been asked before, but is there a pre raid bis list for the new classic anniversary server?

[rapid night]

Pinned P1 Classic Rogue Compendium

[rapid night]

SOD
https://wago.io/vPZxHf4qU
Updated for AQ (only shows in major cities for stocking up before raid).

[visual bluff]

yo i got Vanquisher with 2.20 as and sword of the omen with 1.90 as and idk which should be main hand and offhand...will it really matter ?

[shut elm]

anyone know how rogues are soloing spirestone butcher on classic?

[shut elm]

yes slower in mh for more sinister dmg

[noble wasp]

Legend thank you

[rapid night]

Happy New Year rogue homies. 🎇

[thorn walrus]

Happy new year!

In classic wow as a combat rogue, what do you guys open up with in pve? From stealth I mean, do you go for sinister strike into a s&d for fast haste buff then back to sinister strike?

[rapid night]

Yeah, if you go to the pinned compendium and open the SS sim, press Simulate, then go to Results > Timeline, you can see the actual rotation laid out (a bit easier to read than the APL)

But yeah, SS into 1cp SND back into SS builder

[sharp field]

Ok idk how to start lock picking. I have my tool. I am level 16. But any box I find I can’t open.

[rapid night]

If you search for “Classic Rogue Lockpicking Guide” you’ll find a few options where they tell you which areas in certain zones you can level it up in. Probably the best bet to just follow one of those

[sharp field]

I saw something about some ship by Rachet. Guess will try that.

Thanks.

[half yew]

The first real lockboxes require 65-ish, so you have to grind it up using pickpocketed junkboxes, or world-spawn footlockers that are in certain locations throughout the world, i.e that Ratchet ship, inside Durnholde Keep, the shore of Ashenvale, etc. All have specific requirements so I definitely recommend bookmarking a guide so you can reference what the breakpoints are

[thorn walrus]

Hey guys, the 6 set from shadowcraft set, how good is that proc? And also is it worth putting Crusader on Mirah’s Song?

[plucky nymph]

SC is extremely good, whether or not to put crusader on song is up to how quickly you can get another crusader enchantment for a better weapon, and how quickly you expect to get a better off hand.

Also make sure to hold on to all of it so you can complete the darkmantle quests later, and then use that.

Unless gear has changed since the last classic cycle, this stuff should still be accurate enough.

https://classicroguecraft.com/

[thorn walrus]

Thanks for the detailed answer, I’ll try my best to farm SC shoulders and at the same time get another Righteous Orb ( have 1 already)

[plain flame]

Is it possible to blind two mobs using prep?

Oh And double sap

[plain leaf]

Hello, which pre bis guide should I follow ? this https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/# or https://www.icy-veins.com/wow-classic/rogue-dps-pre-raid-gear, they have a lot of different items

[half yew]

You should disregard Icy Veins for anything Classic. It has generally been incorrect across all versions, at least for Rogues.

[rapid night]

Man, I really wish Noxxic was still around.

[plain leaf]

So I assume this one is better https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/#, or do you recommend something else ?

[half yew]

Yes, that is the active sim for Classic. Myself and Comfy, along with a handful of others, are currently updating and maintaining it

[plain leaf]

You guys are the best, thank you very much

I have to say though, you guys are asking for some tough items to get 😛

[half yew]

Noxxic also started out being pure trash, any of the forum oldheads could tell you about how often someone had to correct something that came from it

[rapid night]

Haha, text carries sarcasm poorly

[half yew]

Well, I do think it improved over time is the thing. Icy Veins somehow started good then backslid

Or at least just started being more niche on the things that were good vs under-maintained

[sullen wasp]

Hi 😄 If i wanna lvl using daggers would Sub lvling build from Wowhead be best or is it better to just go straight for lvl 60 combat daggers build or lvl 60 pvp daggers build ?

[compact crag]

Hi! I am level 20 in Hardcore Classic with 2 2.60 Speed Swords ( Combat leveling talents ) but none of my talents benefit sword use at this point. Would it be better to get a Dagger Offhand instead of the 2nd 2.60 sword?

[autumn jungle]

Hello there ! I'm not sure but I don't think this channel is for cata classic. Is there any channel or other discord cata classic oriented ? Thanks in advance !

[buoyant light]

Hey guys, question! Currently using thrash blade and del rend off hand, will mirahs song be better in main hand over thrash blade? Or does the speed make it a no go

[plucky nymph]

If you have Song, then it should be your OH over DR-OH if you don't have DR-MH, and TB in the MH.

[rotund galleon]

guys, do i run mask of the unforgiven with 10% hit and 628 ap or do i run shadowcraft hood with 8% hit and 701 ap? crid difference is also like .3

[mortal marsh]

Crusader or +15 agi on offhand?

[half yew]

Sim it, check pins. Unless you have the 6p bonus on Shadowcraft though, probably Unforgiven

[half yew]

Fresh or Sod? What spec?

[rotund galleon]

i found the sim and ran it, i have traphook jerkin and no shadowcraft chest so it was like a 2dps difference being higher than unforgiven

[mortal marsh]

Fresh, combat swords

[rapid night]

I don’t think +15 agi is available until a later phase isn’t it?

[mortal marsh]

Oh might be

[half yew]

Even when it is, Swords is always Crusader. Daggers can +15 the OH as it's about neutral, IIRC

[mortal marsh]

It just seems to sim like 2 dps higher with agi

but its very close

[magic drift]

i just came back to SoD after near the end of p2. Whats new with rogue tank or whats the meta runes and talents i need to use? Everything online says that either mutilate or saberslash, but i cant hold threat for shit. is it something that gets fixed later on or something i dont fundamentally understand

[half yew]

Sounds like you might not have the Tank chest rune on

It adds an absolutely insane threat modifier. Like, you should never lose threat kind of aura, IIRC

[magic drift]

my warlock is doing quintouple my dps with dots

[magic drift]

for a little more context, we were duoing sm for leveling stuff and he would just drainlife and dot everything and i would never get threat

[rapid night]

SOD
Made some improvements to the boss strategies in the compendium - everything's in a pretty good spot and top performing logs are aligning well with all recommendations

https://www.thecomfywizard.com/sod-rogue-dps-compendium-p6

[half yew]

Sounds like he might have the warlock tank rune on, then

The demon form makes them a full tank as well with a hyper threat mod

Rogue is also kinda just dogass at level tanking. The AoE threat is simply not there. FoK rune might help a bit? The damage is pretty low, might not hold threat on someone full blasting a single target.

[magic drift]

his dots are doing 800 dps at level 30

plus drain life healing threat

[rapid night]

Fresh
Sims are now updated for P2

https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/#

[buoyant light]

Hey guys! I’m gonna play dagger rogue and wandering what’s the pre bis daggers?

[plucky nymph]

Scroll up or check the pins in this thread, I'm sure you can find something.

[plain leaf]

Oh maaan, just when am about to finish with my pre-bis now they have changed 😦

[rapid night]

Wompp - still good though!

[plain leaf]

how long does it take to get the pvp items in the new pre-bis sims ?

[half yew]

I believe there's still caps on how many ranks you can gain a week, so depending on what those are, possibly a few weeks

[rapid night]

I don't remember the weekly threshold, but yeah it was really easy in SoD and I think it uses the same system. Just takes whatever timegating is in place

[rapid night]

Classic Rogue P2 PvE Compendium
All Rogue Raiding information you need, consolidated into a single page. Useful for casual to even the sweatiest Rogues.

Classic Rogue P2 DPS Comparison Sheet
Rogue specs compared at different encounter lengths and variations (casual and sweaty), along with IEA.

Classic Rogue Sims
An alternative to the spreadsheet, WoWSims Classic is a simulation tool in which you can configure your character, buffs, debuffs, encounter duration, etc and run actual simulations of encounters.

Classic Rogue Sheet
Spreadsheet created by Simonize used for modeling a Rogue encounter, buffs, debuffs, etc and calculating average damage and distribution.

======================

SoD P6 Rogue DPS Compendium
All Rogue raiding information you need, consolidated into a single page. Useful for casual to even the sweatiest Rogue.

SoD Rogue Sims
WoWSims SoD is a simulation tool in which you can configure your character, buffs, debuffs, encounter duration, etc and run actual simulations of encounters.

[neon wasp]

anyone know when you should go and learn 1h swords ?

[half yew]

When you can and the cost doesn't fuck you over. Same with maces. It's always useful, particularly pre-40. After that you can start to safely just stick to swords due to the big dungeon quest rewards

[rapid moss]

What poisons should I run with Mutilate build in SoD bois? Can't find anything specific anywhere

[rapid night]

For SoD, Muti runs the Deadly Brew rune, which means poisons are triggered automatically (if you don’t have poisons applied). So you actually don’t run ANY poisons, rather nothing on MH (for Wild Strikes if you have a Feral in raid) and you run Elemental Sharpening Stone on OH. If you don’t have a Feral, or solo, you can also run ESS on MH.

[sharp field]

these mobs that apply fire for like 20 seconds.... how can i remove it?

vanish is worthless when its on me and i have almost died a few times

[rapid night]

Best you can do is just eat until it wears off (assuming you’re talking about open world mobs with a lingering debuff). You could use a Greater Fire Protection Potion to absorb the damage, but that could get expensive for just solo content haha.

[sharp field]

Haha ok no problem. So if I’m facing those mobs. Just try not to fuck up and over pull. Or else… yeah didn’t know if there’s some anti fire thing like poison has. For removal. To macro onto vanish or something.

[sharp field]

holy shit... deathlog full of rogues dead from Polly tonight. RIP.

[plain leaf]

@rapid night Any chance you could let me know which items in the P2 BiS (Ony and MC) are more priority than others ? the reason am asking is that my guild is using thatsmybis website to handle loot allocation, and I'm suppose to give priority to each of my BiS items, that way I can get the gear that gives me the biggest boost from the prebis tier first.

[rapid night]

Weapons will provide more value than any other upgrade, prioritize those first

The rest are mostly comparable (minor, given Classic itemization) - if Backstab, ACLG is a good third priority.

[plain leaf]

Damn, thanks for fast reply, you're the best

[upper gust]

This might be a really dumb question but the Phase 2 PvE Compendium post pinned is for Classic, not SoD right?

Asking because I always assumed swords was BiS, but daggers is better under sweaty

[rapid night]

Classic, the current SoD one is here:
https://www.thecomfywizard.com/sod-rogue-dps-compendium-p6

[upper gust]

Thank you comfy

[rapid night]

Updated pin to include SoD links as well

[plain leaf]

@rapid night One more question, any other notable gear I should add to the "this is my bis" list, even though they aren't my bis if they are like a second bis or something. they told me I should add them but as lower priority

and sorry for asking you too many questions

[rapid night]

You're good - realistically I'd recommend getting comfortable with the sims, so you can compare different gear and see how much of an upgrade/downgrade items are (so you can add accordingly)

[sharp field]

i cant tell if im wasting my time in farm areas for mages.. just pickpocketing all the mobs they round up... but this is fun..

[rapid night]

Fun has value

[gilded sable]

Hey I just got dual spec in time for world pvp to start on classic anniversary. I'm level 45 and looking to go hemo spec for pure pvp purposes as I have combat swords as my usual spec. Does anyone have an example of a talent tree for a pure pvp hemo build?

[thorn walrus]

I just got Perditions Blade and many said it was bis until aq40, is it because of the proc or what is it?

[vocal tulip]

Because there is no better dagger in BWL + ZG. Death's Sting in AQ40 is the next upgrade

[vocal tulip]

Majority of it has to be with weapon dmg + speed:
Perds: 73-137 at 1.8 speed
Dragonfang Blade (in BWL): 69-130 at 1.8 speed
Fang of the faceless (ZG): 66-123 at 1.9 speed. Despite it being a slower weapon (which is what you want) it still has less dmg than Perds.

Stats + Procs do not play big factors in the dmg a weapon deals. Death's Sting is at 95-144 dmg at 1.8 speed, but what sets it apart is that is gives +3 daggers, which is very needed for dagger rogues.

[thorn walrus]

thanks for the detailed answer, very nice of u

[flint igloo]

anyone know if we can get through the door to last boss in DM east without killing bosses ?

[ebon oasis]

Hello there . I heard that we rogues has a job to be done for tribute runs , anyone can explain to me what is this job ;

[frigid flax]

Hey all, for PVP Hemo sword spec - do i ever cast sinister strike or am i always pressing Hemo for builder ?

[small onyx]

so what are people doing for gold atm

[vocal tulip]

You got 3 jobs as a rogue:

1. You pick up the Courtyard Key near Guard Fengus, as you have vanish incase things go wrong (anyone can do it tho without stealth, just need to pay attention to boss patrolling)
2. Have max lockpicking to open the last door before Captain Kromcrush
3. If skipping Captain Kromcrush, your group needs to be in a corner (preferably left side by the bonfire) and you pull Captain to the back right side while your group passes, once your group passes you vanish to reset the boss

[vocal tulip]

Always hemo as a builder

[spark gale]

gutrippers were EXTREMELY cheap on nightslayer, I scooped 2, have been using for a while, I am now level 52, is there a better weapon setup for me? I am currently running combat daggers because of the gutrippers

[sharp field]

Following mages that aoe farm and pickpocketing all their mobs.

[cosmic falcon]

hi guys

what spec are the best for 85 fresh to gear up to firelands as also to raid as

[sharp field]

is there a list of consumables to use while leveling or just playing in general?

is elixir of agility and stuff like that worth it?

[spark gale]

FAP if on PVP server, definitely keep up to highest lvl healing pot, FA bandages, all the elixirs like armor, regen, hp, agility, strength can help but take a lot of space

Agility is worth it imo

I think the elixir is 16 which is dope

Also, as a rogue

Engineering makes rogue life so much nicer

If you get a clump thats a little too large, grenades/bombs/other explosives make life a lot nicer

[sharp field]

i think im tired of the skinning/leather life.... maybe i will engineer.

[spark gale]

its insanely good

for solo play/pvp

[sharp field]

Mats are expensive but gotta. No chance I’m farming them.

[spark gale]

They are expensive but you can turn around and even sell what you make to engineer who only have it to use them and dont want to be bothered crafting their stuff

Sounds crazy, but yeah

Also ammo for gun users

And if you have a money making profession along side the engi then it helps out

Alchemy can pump even while having to buy from herbalists if you dont have gathering alts or as you said arent willing to farm the mats

[sharp field]

I’m level 28 now. I really need better gear. Questing isn’t doing it for me… falling behind damage wise.

Should I try to solo WC for the sword? Or Deadmines?

SFK good for me? My gear blows.

[spark gale]

id avoid DM personally

SFK has meteord shard

sometimes there are greens on the AH that are good enough

for cheap

[sharp field]

ill have to check. idk when i see fellow 28s in the area i check gear and im like.. wow i am probably spending 10+ more seconds per mob encounter.

[sage grotto]

If you are on Anniversary (as opposed to Cata), do the WC-related questline leading up to Leaders of the Fang. The sword you get off of that is stupid good for the level and almost certainly still relevant at your level.

With the above caveat of Anniversary, I would also say that at that level it's still perfectly fine to use a dagger if you can't find a good sword but find a decent dagger. Haven't run any math on it or whatever, but if you get an appreciable bump in DPS I would not think twice about running an offhand dagger. Fang of Serra'kis from BFD comes to mind in addition to the Meteor Shard from SFK.

[quaint lance]

lookin for a good gear sim sheet to use to theorycraft gear

[tepid jay]

am i trolling with this HC build lol. I am vll 54

[plucky nymph]

2/5 LR

[rapid night]

Pins

[tepid jay]

You suggest 5/5? Can't find many resources on the topic but the builds I've seen either 2/5 to allow deeper into tree or just 0/5

[plucky nymph]

For leveling

[solemn pond]

there bis list update ?

[rapid night]

For which version of the game?
(Both Fresh P2 and SoD P6 have compendiums pinned with recommendations)

[solemn pond]

@rapid night fresh

[rapid night]

Classic Rogue P2 PvE Compendium in pins

[fierce crest]

Hey! I recently got perds and gutgore ripper, + 6p sc + devilsaur, however, gutgore offhand is simming way lower than skilled fighting blade or distracting dagger. Even breaking devilsaur to use muggers belt and keeping 6p sc, any ideas?

Is it even worth to use gutgore in the offhand?

[analog sleet]

is there a bis pvp list?

[rugged crow]

is there imhocrafting for mop professions for rogue?

[rotund galleon]

In classic, human sword rogues get how much extra hit with their racial+5 wep skill from weapon expertise? 10 wep skill total

[spring totem]

I think it reduces the hitcap by 3, so its like getting +3 to hit

[granite summit]

for how long is HoJ BiS?

worth farming now? or will just be replaced in BWL?

[plucky nymph]

Farm it.

Especially if you don't plan on farming the zg trinket.

[analog sleet]

hey wiz, do you have one of these for fresh?

[rapid night]

Hmm, I don’t remember if I saved out a version for Classic. Let me look.

Looks like wago is having some server issues - will have to check later. Worst case scenario, you could probably go back to the MC version of the SoD WA and just delete the couple SoD-specific items

[rapid night]

This is the most updated SoD MC version - should be able to download this and then just go in and delete the SoD items (should just be a few)
https://wago.io/vPZxHf4qU/1.0.13

#180034493804052481 message

[rapid night]

SOD

Still working through the base 60s sims, but some of it is there. On-use P7 trinkets still not implemented, so will need to revisit those later. But feel free to start poking around. Ping me if you find any improvements, but please be sure to not touch the settings or APL, so they stay consistent!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ArglalTyrZR_lwN-xXNqmBUzOCHxAqSR1FzA7uDT9x4/edit?usp=sharing

[rapid night]

Naxx PTR VoDs for anyone interested (difficulty 2):
Night 1: https://www.youtube.com/live/qMGqOle0cUE
Night 2: https://www.youtube.com/live/BXhdtnV1FzE

[plain leaf]

Hey @rapid night do you have a pvp guide (talents etc), because I think this is for pve right ? https://www.thecomfywizard.com/classic-rogue-compendium-p2

[rapid night]

That is exclusively for PvE, correct - I don't work on anything PvP related, unfortunately. Sorry!

[astral plover]

hey i found this i was hoping some one could give me a few tips on the best rogue pvp classic build

[finite lake]

hello! I'm looking for an OG in the history of wow. I'm tormented by a riddle I can't solve: only orcs don't have a breath bar in the toxic water of Undercity (even the undead have one, slow but still there). Please help me!

[glad plume]

hello 🙂 i was wonder . so in classic we don't have any talents that affect if u have Fast OH right? like in TBC i mean . so is it better to have both slow weapons ? or at least while leveling is it better if i use like 2.7 \ 2.6 speed MH OH?

[astral plover]

Any where I can find Shibeks build in classic ?

[astral plover]

What’s a good classic PvP soc and build

[rapid night]

SOD
https://www.wowhead.com/blue-tracker/topic/us/season-of-discovery-phase-7-ptr-update-jan-22-2025-2049393

[spark gale]

Because its green

Orcs are green

[spark gale]

Fast OH = more poison procs

[glad plume]

okay thanks 🙂

[honest oak]

is it fine if my best daggers are both 1.8

does the dps matter that much

[spark gale]

Are they both gut rippers?

If theyre both 1.8 thats fine as long as your MH is in the top bracket of flat damage for your level/phase

Your main hand top end weapon damage matters because you are using abilities that deal WEAPON damage + some extra damage

Doesnt matter how fast it is besides for things like crusader where your proc chance is multiplied by your weapon speed and the basic fact that typically slower weapons have higher end flat damage

Your offhand should be fast as it is already heavily nerfed by dual wielding penalties and it gives you more opportunities to proc poison as it is not a set amount of PPM, it is a % chance per swing

[half yew]

Depends heavily on what version you're talking about, too.

If Cata; dual 1.8 is bad universally. All 3 specs want a 1.4 dagger for the purposes of stacking Deadly Poison. For Asn and Sub, you'd basically have to jump a whole raid tier's worth of item level to even consider dual 1.8

And hopefully not dagger MH'ing as Combat lol

[spark gale]

Oh shit

Yeah

Im playing vanilla right now

[half yew]

I'm inclined to think the original context was Cata since that's where a clear distinction of 1.8 and 1.4 exists (as opposed to Vanilla "just wear what's best itemized/highest DPS") but yeah

[viscid tartan]

P7 Question for the SoD Tanks: What talent layout are we leaning toward now that we dont need to spend 2 points on the evasion cd reduction? Started using 2 variations of a sub build (19/2/30 and 19/10/22) and aoe dmg/healing/threat performed way better than I expected- wondering if this might continue to be the case with naxx sanctified scaling due to raw 30% aoe amp and 10% ap amp in talent tree?

Also I think we might finally switch to focused attacks on helm once we get access to dual wielding 1.3 or faster weapons in naxx to substitute energy economy from AQR set bonus but im not really sure which wep combo ends up bis from the 3-4 options

[old spruce]

Decided to try out rogue in the classic anniversary server and I was wondering if anyone could help me figure out hit chance in prep for level 60? If I understand it correctly 9% is the minimum so your spells wont miss, but considering auto-attacks are a huge part of damage, does it benefit to get more hit chance and if so, what would be a good breakpoint?

[balmy summit]

do we know what the bis list is gonna look like for mutilate spec in sod?

[rapid night]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ArglalTyrZR_lwN-xXNqmBUzOCHxAqSR1FzA7uDT9x4

[balmy summit]

thank you

[glad plume]

i wana get second spec for ambush build . i gues gut reaper right now is best but is it better to get slower dagger for better dmg i assume ?

[vague cloud]

Yo guys

about to be 60 on the Hardcore server, getting the devilsaur set is still the way to go yea?

[nimble shadow]

Someone have an talent guide for Hemo with dal'rends? (Is it viable for pve/pvp?) - For Classic Anniversary

[half yew]

There is no build you'd want to run that is viable in both PVP and pve.

Hemo is a non-starter for pve. Combat is the only viable spec outside of Seal Fate ImpEA. Similarly, there's no viable pvp spec that doesn't go down the Sub tree, so you'll just have to spec swap

[balmy summit]

hey does anyone know how to get rid of occult poison off your deadly poison in sod?

[half yew]

You can manually apply Deadly to your weapons, but there's zero reason to do so.

[hardy meadow]

There is a cleansing cloth you can buy with emerald dream rep or you can buy it from ah

Will remove all buffs off wpn. Useful for when you need to use frost oils in aq40

It’s called weapon cleaning cloth. There 18s ea at vendor

[balmy summit]

@hardy meadow @half yew thank you both for the help really appricate it

[ionic skiff]

Oh god, coming back after dropping in S2 - looks like the Deadly Brew/Mut/envenom/step build isn't a thing anymore?

if I am in the 40s, should I just go back to saber/combat?

[rapid night]

Leveling as Backstab is going to be the most approachable and fastest route. Keep your dagger upgraded every 5-6 levels and you’ll kill normal mobs in 2-3 globals for the most part.

[hasty kelp]

!sod

[rotund galleon]

does the sim over value the shadowcraft 6set?

[rapid night]

We think it's appropriately valued at this point, after some adjustments we made in P1.

[rotund galleon]

thank you

[languid wigeon]

question, should I refresh SnD with swing timing? or does it matter? Should I always refresh SnD right before it falls off or do I have to time it right after a swing finishes?

[half yew]

refreshing SnD immediately updates your swing timer, there's nothing you need to do in regards to swing timers.

It's ideal to only recast it once it's fallen, but the actual benefit of doing that and refreshing 2s early or something is extremely minor, and doesn't always convert into a DPS gain or loss depending on how long the fight still has remaining.

[blissful nova]

Hi! Curious if anyone knows any energy tick addons for classic, idk where to find any. Thank you :)

[languid wigeon]

Nug Energy

[high valley]

anyone know if I should be using slice and dice for leveling when playing hemo swords? I'm on softcore

[spark gale]

Depends on ttk without it

It can be a really efficient cross over finisher

It can be used out of melee range, and it stays active after killing whatever so considering most of your damage is white hits since energy/combo points is such a limiting factor, SnD uptime is preem

[languid wigeon]

I am a lvl 50 combat rogue, just got a trash blade. Is it worth getting crusader enchant on the trash? or save my gold for better upgrades?

[languid wigeon]

Anyone?

[half yew]

No one can tell you if that's worth it except yourself. We don't know how much gold you have, how quick you level, or if you'll be raiding immediately.

It's a DPS increase that costs gold; if you can afford it without an issue, do it.

[languid wigeon]

I don't have much gold, like 200, i do level fast and plan on raiding asap

[rotund galleon]

As daggers. I am currently wearing the pvp chest and shoulders with a shadowcraft 6 set. Putting on the tier 2 pants, and replacing the pvp chest to keep a shadowcraft 6 set, sims 1-2 dps lower than what I prevously mentioned that I have on. I would rather wear the raid gear, do I worry about 1-2 dps difference in the sim? I would go from 9 to 8% hit, lose 28 AP, but gain 2%~ crit.

[ionic skiff]

I’m sorry sir did you say one to two dps difference

[half yew]

The average performance of ShCraft and full raid tier is extremely close; what you gain wearing ShCraft is the ability to RNG proc to a very high parse (but sometimes not proc at all), while raid gear will produce more consistent damage, but lower high-end potential.

Pick the one you prefer and go with it. Keep the ShCraft items for getting Darkmantle.

[spark gale]

Trash…or thrash

[spark gale]

Well you wanna stay at 9% hit

[half yew]

Assuming Combat spec, their hit cap is 6% due to having 305 wep skill, so probably not

[orchid eagle]

Hey! 🙂 Does anyone have a link to an up to date tanking guide for SoD rogue? All the info I can find is phases 2-4. Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask this question.

[forest coral]

@novel plank crypto spammer

<@&224906552333697025>

(sorry for double ping koffing ily <3)

[grand comet]

!ban @raven snow crypto spam

[novel plank]

I think I was quicker

I was not

[thorn walrus]

Anyone playing dagger pvp spec in classic? i cant decide what talents i want to use

https://www.wowhead.com/classic/talent-calc/rogue/305300105-320302002-4502031303001

this is what im currently using, but im not sure, not sure how much ill lose in not using serrated blades and also Dirty Deeds

[civic hollow]

Where can I find pre-bis naxx backstab sim with 90s?

[languid wigeon]

Hi, what's the best sim for wow anni?

[half yew]

https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/

[naive mesa]

SoD rogue, what makes poisons scale? Attack Power? Spell Damage? Agi?

[vale flame]

Anyone know where the cata guides are for rogue

[spark gale]

If the poison is same as classic, nothing, its a set number range iirc

You might benefit from someone applying something like the Nightfall debuff on target which increases the amount of damage the target takes from all magic sources by 15%

Poison being nature damage

But it doesnt scale off anything you can do with gear

Unless SoD poisons are diff ofc

[distant nexus]

Is swords viable in SoD P7 or is mutilate still the build to go?

[wicked pecan]

hey guys im new to rogue and would love to switch to dagger, ive been told im screwed without shadowcraft set but just wanted to double check here.. heres what im rocking. https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/#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

i have lobos and the DM dagger in the bank ready to go

[solar lotus]

distracting dagger is very good

so you can go daggers asap if you get core hound tooth or perds imo

[wicked pecan]

thank you so much

i was hoping i could get by with the lobo and dm dagger in the time being

im using trsh blade and mirah song

[solar lotus]

whats lobo? I have never played on pvp server, only played on hardcore

[wicked pecan]

its the pvp wep

dagger*

[solar lotus]

hmm its probably better to go that + distracting already

[wicked pecan]

thank you for your time

i will do just that

[solar lotus]

I never got a weapon upgrade so I was stuck with main hand rend sword + mirahs in naxx

[wicked pecan]

im rank 11 already so ill have grand marshal weps before that

[solar lotus]

yeah sounds nice

so you want to play daggers? or would you prefer swords

[wicked pecan]

daggers for sure

i was told by a few poeple id be doing less dps becasue of my lack of shadowcraft gear

[solar lotus]

shadowcraft is kinda fried

darkmantle is ofc very good

but its also better for swords than daggers

[wicked pecan]

im in 3 peice nightslayer and 2 piece bloodfang

[solar lotus]

yeah ur gear is totally fine

would never drop it for 6 piece shadowcraft

[wicked pecan]

thank you!

[solar lotus]

the reason darkmantle is good is that the chest and helmet are actually good pieces

and then u can run belt+bracers or shoulders for not a big loss

[wicked pecan]

i took your advice

over 50 dps more

[solar lotus]

nice nice, gl on the parsing gamer

[gaunt dust]

https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/reports/DbPFnjQwBhJyvqtg?fight=19&type=casts&source=56&view=timeline can i get someone to log review and tell me how to improve

[naive drum]

Hey can anyone help me with sims? My sims showing 400 dps with krol + mira and shadow craft but 880 dps with lobo and full pvp gear.

[solar lotus]

could you link the sim

[naive drum]

the sim im using or the set itself

dm'd you

[vale jolt]

SoD Rogue, best leveling spec?

[rapid night]

Backstab

[vale fiber]

hi im new to this game and got a question, is the krol blade + mirahs song better then the 2 dal rends swords ?

[mild halo]

Krol / Sword of zeal + mirah is basicly the same as dal rends

[fiery magnet]

Anyone has a pre dragonsoul BiS list for rogue? With hour of twilight dungeons realesed and with the vendor

[kindred creek]

well, you're not screwed without shadowcraft set but it's better than what you're wearing so why wouldn't you do it

[rapid wyvern]

need some advice

im playing combat swords and have mirahs song and thrash blade

which one should i be using in my main hand? thrash blade is slower and has the spec effect but lower dps

[light cave]

thrash mh, mirah oh

[rapid wyvern]

ty thaths waht i thought just wanted some other opinions

[frank pawn]

Is this the classic (vanilla) section or is this the Cata classic section?

[open geyser]

how much hit you need for rogue swords and why accuria is so good in wow classic

[light cave]

9% minimum.

[open geyser]

but why

can you explain

[open geyser]

buy talents gave you 5%

and sword spec 3%

you need 1 then on items or what

[half yew]

As a Combat Rogue, you only ever "need" 1% more from gear.
9% hit is the default hit cap. However, this drops down to 6% when you reach 305 weapon skill, which you do by default via talents.
Then as you mentioned, Precision is 5% hit, leaving you with just 1% to gain from gear to cap your special attack hit chance. This is the buttons you press like Sinister Strike and Eviscerate.

Keep in mind, Hit continues to be quite valuable for your auto attacks, up to 27% (I think, this number changes over time and I never remember what it exactly is. May be 24% or 26%)

[remote glacier]

elemental sharpening stone vs poisons for dagger rogue in MC, thoughts?

[light cave]

Poison

[rain estuary]

Why does everyone say dagger rogue is a meme when sims have it barely behind sword rogue for P2 raid bis?

[solar lotus]

Daggers and swords are very even and theres less competition for daggers so idk why anyone would say its a meme

even with full naxx bis they sim very even, with swords of course having the chance to parse super hard with sword spec RNG

playing daggers also means you wont be put on expose armor duty

[sterile pike]

Anyone here playing sod? Trying to make a decision on what to play

[rapid night]

Two kinds of people saying this:

1️⃣ Uneducated who are basing their "facts" around 20 year old incorrect information based on their personal experience of wiping in Molten Core for weeks.
2️⃣ People memeing that playing anything other than a single IEA SS Rogue is pointless because you could just be playing Warrior.

[rapid night]

Whatcha need?

[sterile pike]

Trying to figure out rogue or warrior in sod. Based on leveling and rotation You’re the only one that replied

[rapid night]

Welll... considering you're asking in the Rogue Disc - I'm going to be biased. Kind of dependent on what you're wanting to do. Warrior is currently performing better in raids, but that changes every phase. Both are probably very fun to level, given all runes being available at level 1.

[fiery magnet]

Anyne did dragonsoul yet and how many gem clusters did drop per boss?

[sterile pike]

I ended up rogue. Easy rotation. And fast ttk

[modest folio]

Been leveling my assassination and dps is horrible compared to other classes early on, even maxing out my combo points, I assume it’s due to limited talent points

Anyone else notice this

[crystal kelp]

hey guys. can you please roast/destroy me on my logs? i'm a complete smoothbrain who has never played rogue in pve and looking to get 80+ parses next week in MC/ony https://fresh.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/nightslayer/xmo

^^ roast as hard as you want but include some tangible feedback that I can improve on too 🙂

[solar lotus]

Hey 🙂
Would stop with any garrote/rupture shenigans, sadly useless abilites in classic
You are often also just doing a 1 combo point slice and dice in your opener and then going into adrenaline rush, which probably means your slice is falling off during it, usually best to atleast sinister strike twice and then slice in the opener
Not able to see your talents etc anywhere in the logs sadly and ur raider.io seems to have pvp gear on so cant do much with that

Also none of your gear seems to be enchanted, at the end of the day classic rogue is A LOT of autoattack damage, and having the right enchants and consumes is usually a bigger deal than playing stuff 100% perfect

I am not too familiar with how people are with consumes on softcore, because I only ever raided on hardcore and then it was always every consume at all times and no loss of worldbuffs to random deaths obviously, but realistically you are not gonna parse too high without buffs

[crystal kelp]

OK this is a great place to start thank you @solar lotus

I have a few pieces to upgrade, will get full enchants, and double check all my consumes

The issue is I die during 3rd/4th boss in MC usually lol and lose all my world buffs 😞

[solar lotus]

The biggest dps upgrade you can make is staying alive then 😄
But yeah shit happens

Could you link your talents?

[crystal kelp]

Not even worth garroting mid-fight after a vanish?

[solar lotus]

nah sadly not

damage is subpar and its also 50 energy

[solar lotus]

Looks good, can swap out the 2 points in muder for improved evis if you really want to but its very minor

[sterile pike]

Anyone playing sod, what is the damage difference between mutilate build and saber slash carnage build?

[brisk hare]

Hey, I'm trying to find any info on the legendary dagger questline. Can you enter and pickpocket the boss to start it without getting saved to that lockout?

[half yew]

Yes, so long as it's on Normal difficulty, you can enter and PP without getting saved. The raid can be done on Heroic, it just needs to be swaped to Normal before you enter.

[normal willow]

Hey, for you guys who has a bit more xp in SOD, do you belive there is any chance at all that they rework our t3 4-set bonus for DPS, since it currently does almost nothing? Have they reworked sets in the past? (SOD)

[tall rivet]

Rogue WA's:
Wago.io TWW Rogue
For more specific Rogue WeakAuras, run the !wa command in your preferred specialization channel.

[raven ibex]

any SoD speciffic discords? (mostly looking to improve tank rogue, and potentially AoE grinding

[green talon]

Hello, for cataclysm, does roguue have to upkeep something in the inventory for all specs, such as those applied poisons, or only for one spec?

[chilly violet]

Is Sebacious Poison affected by improved expose armor?

[sterile pike]

Yes I believe so

[bitter fiber]

Yes but you don’t really use it unless you are a backstab Rogue

You do more dps by putting expose armor on your target manually

[sterile pike]

Anyone playing sod, how does saber slash rogue compare to the other 2 builds?

[raven ibex]

all 3 of them are close the way i hear it. depends on playstyle and what gear drops for you

for leveling i wouldn't touch it, but for raids and any leveling dungeons it's probably pretty good.

[twilit sparrow]

Rogue tanks changing Shoulder enchant?

[raven ibex]

wouldn't be shocked. a 60% nerf in flat dr is considerable.

[uncut verge]

Is it viable to solo rattlegore for getting my shadowcraft boots?

so i'm not forced into an entire scholo run

[uncut verge]

What does this mean D;

I am stupid ahaha, Just saw some guy do it on yt

[uncut verge]

GOT THEM POGGER

my feet are finally in the right shoes

[plucky nymph]

[solar lotus]

Probably not doable solo but maybe try to find some people that wanna do Kirtonos runs and try to combine rattlegore into it with them (warriors for valor boots, paladins for the healing bracers, hunters for the hit% agi boots)

[deep reef]

Hey all - I am currently leveling a rogue going for Serrated blades/ swords and obviously that seems to lead into hemo but I don't really understand how hemo works "increases all damage by 3" and have heard some say that you don't need it. Can someone explain hemo to me? If one picks up ghostly strike it seems to compete with that ability as a combo point builder....

[gaunt dust]

Any WA's For Legendary Daggers

[radiant oyster]

i have seen several different pre bis guides for fresh classic some say devil saur set and shadow craft. others say just shadow craft with 2 pvp gear pieces. Im not sure which is better

[glad kestrel]

Hi all, does anyone have a clue about the dmg difference between IMPROVED EXPOSE ARMOR and SUNDER for wow sod naxx? What does it mean in dmg loss for the warrior applying 5 stacks of sunder against 1 rogue applying IEA? Does anyone have knowledge/Theory Crafting about this?

[half yew]

I forget the exact percentages, but a rogue applying EA increases all physical damage dealt by 4-5% (it's a decimal somewhere in between there, I just don't remember it)

It is generally always worthwhile to have someone applying Imp EA

Especially in SoD where it's more balanced than pure Vanilla. You can easily have a Backstab rogue using Sebacious Poison and it automatically solves everything, or Mutilate rogue manually applying EA for a fairly small personal DPS loss

[solar lotus]

Yeah in classic IEA rogue is very op, ofc you have warriors sunder the boss cause it takes like 7 seconds to get IEA up, but its a 5% damage increase

(assuming you have faire fire and curse of reck on all bosses execept like sulufuron harbringer who has 4k armor for some reason)

[rotund galleon]

I have the aged core leather gloves, bloodfang hood, and the rest 6pc shadow craft. Breaking the 6pc with nightslayer shoulders, feet and wrists is only a 14 dps diff from shadow craft. Would the few nightslayer/bloodfang pieces be better since it’s so close without the need for random procs?

[half yew]

You trade the possibility of giga high-rolls for more consistent damage. Only you can really decide if that's worthwhile

[wind raptor]

Anyone have a cool WA for legendary daggers?

[half yew]

https://wago.io/ZMEt4NqtR

[plucky nymph]

@novel plank
This was for spam, disregard.

[latent steeple]

im abpout to start a rouge

any1 wanna join?

[hoary sand]

anybody know how I can run a simulation to compare two weapons?

[ancient ingot]

https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/

[devout escarp]

https://youtu.be/36Nri29DjFY?si=ttiRJTg-r5Yss--q

This wild. SOD bonkers with Naxx gear 😂

[rotund galleon]

when will the sim update to phase 3?

[half yew]

All the items are already there. It'll get a preset at some point but nothing stops you from simming

[hoary sand]

THANK YOU

[candid estuary]

yo boys,anyone holds any sims for p3 classic anniversary?

[candid estuary]

nvm found the pin

[calm ginkgo]

Anyone know how to play sub on Ultraxion for cata classic? Mainly asking how are people backstabbing/ambushing? Saw a recent log where the rogue was actually playing sub instead of hemo spamming, then another rogue saying it wasn't working. Trying to find out how its possible before I go in tonight.

https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/reports/bjMV3ZJ1BGLqFC9f?fight=19&type=damage-done
log for reference

[uncut thicket]

Looking to try out sub for prog, probably stupid questions but how does sub and backstab interact with the madness fight. How does backstab positioning work with each platforms wing tentacle or the spawned corruption tentacle. Is it forgiving on positioning? Does backstab just work or not at all jw and weighing the benafits vs the downsides…ps”combat is boring af”

[plain bluff]

How much expertise should I aim for in Cata PvP???

[solemn pond]

hello there is bis list for bwl for rogue daggers ?

[flat dock]

afk harpy caves for r14 & cut a deal with ur tanks by spreading/supporting "hard res DFT for tanks" propaganda & be the 1st dps to get dft

[jade sand]

yo guys, which server should i join in sod to play into raids?

[shell spire]

Do anybody know if classic era is still very active? (Non-HC)

[bold tree]

Hey guys, does anyojne know of a good Classic Plater profile that displays CPs above the nameplate? Default Plater CPs are horrible 😦

Most Player profiles don't seem to take CPs into account

[sudden pilot]

Not sure if it was this week or last week, but devs made a change so you can backstab from the front on Ultraxion.

[half yew]

He asked that question and a day later left the disc so I never replied to it lmao

[sudden pilot]

Ah, lol

[uncut sable]

Hey classic cata question i see alot of rogues using tp t12 instead of t13 and using hurricane on offhand any reason why? im assuming its to gain stacks for daggers faster

[half yew]

Subtlety spec prefers to keep wearing 2PT12 because it deals a % of your crit damage, and Subtlety crits extremely hard.

Hurricane on OH is again a Subtlety thing; Recuperate counts as a spell, and can proc the spell version of Hurricane. This means you can have both a physical damage proc and a spell proc running at the same time.

A lot of logs of Combat/Asn having Hurricane on OH is simply because they prefer playing Sub and left it that way

[sudden pilot]

I might be wrong, but poisons can proc spell Hurricane too, right?

[uncut sable]

Thank you for such a detailed response. i really appreciate it

[half yew]

They should. They don't though.
It's even a bug in the Cata sims atm because it was assumed they would proc Hurricane. I'm unsure how to fix it (as in make Poisons not proc Hurricane) without breaking other things.

[uncut sable]

cheers

[umbral dune]

@cobalt lodge

[simple vigil]

(wow sod) which poisons should i apply in dungeons, raid, and open world

[half yew]

If you're playing a Deadly Brew build (Saber or Muti), none, since the rune handles everything. If you're playing Backstab, then it'll depend on who you're with and what's needed. The important ones are Occult Poison and Sebacious Poison.

If you're the only source of both ImpEA and Occult, then you put Occult MH and Seb OH. If you aren't the ImpEA guy, Occult OH and keep MH open for Wild Strikes. If you don't have Wild Strikes, then use Consecrated Sharpening Stone for UD mobs, and IP for anything else.

@rapid night Think that's right but haven't played since phase 4

[rapid night]

That's correct for the most part. There are some caveats, but nothing to worry about too heavily early on. (Some iterations depending on both mob type and what version of Backstab you're playing)

[frank pewter]

(wow sod) anyone got a good rogue guid for tanking?

[calm thorn]

on yorshaj what would be optimal poisons to use as a combat rogue

[half yew]

You should never be deviating from Instant MH Deadly OH. Asn can use Deadly on thrown; Wound for Combat or Sub for FoK, though it's extremely questionable to ever press that button.

On Zonozz you can opt for Wound MH (not as Asn) if there's no other -25% healing debuff, but the likelihood of that is extremely low in 25M, and in 10M the total healing isn't consequential enough

[dreamy basin]

does anyone have a weakaura with a audible for when fangs of the father proc

[timid timber]

new to SoD, the pinned comment is for season 6, is there any change in runes and talents from p6 to p7?

[rapid night]

https://www.thecomfywizard.com/sod-rogue-dps-compendium-p7

(I've moved basically all SoD Rogue content over to the Classic Rogue Disc, for awareness - link in pins as well)

[errant thistle]

Is there an internal CD on Instant Poison proccing?

[half yew]

No

[errant thistle]

Ty

[rain granite]

Thanks!

Leveling in a PvP server for sod is insane. Why there are alliance everywhere on a US server Cstrike?

Aren’t we usually horde dominance?

[half yew]

sod servers have been fiercely balanced by Blizzard. There's very frequently character creation and server transfer restrictions to keep the active pop balanced

[rain granite]

Ok perhaps I am just unlucky haha seeing so many high alliance chasing me all the time. I can’t believe there are so many characters in org but yet when I go to nightmare incursion trying to go LFG, there is no one signing up 🙂

[simple vigil]

As muti-cut to chase, do I maintain rupture and crimson on target or just keep sending envenoms?

[austere nacelle]

I just started playing SoD again and there are actually people out in the open world! I love it. Was playing horde and there seemed to be a good mix of factions

[rain granite]

good to know that. i thought incursion is the best way to level...it got slowed down a lot by alliance attack and no able to find ppl to do elites

[austere nacelle]

I left just as incursions were introduced and havent done any. I wonder if they would be worth doing

[simple vigil]

where can i find muti cut of chase rotation and priority list

[granite tide]

I had quit playing at like the second patch cycle of BfA and just came back to play SoD with a friend and I am loving it.

Backstab build is fun for dungeons, I'm building up my tank set for second spec.

It's why I joined here, looking for better community discussion for things. WowHead and Icy Veins stuff feels...lacking? Behind the curve?

[rapid night]

Muti -> SND -> Muti until 4+ CP -> Envenom

[north dawn]

is there a combat rogue section or am i blind ?

[plucky nymph]

[rapid night]

https://www.thecomfywizard.com/sod-rogue-dps-compendium-p8

Updated with everything we know so far for SoD P8 Rogue ✅

[heady cradle]

Thanks homie, glad to have someone doing all the heavy lifting around this channel

https://tenor.com/view/spyxfamily-spy-x-family-anime-proud-reward-gif-12306995752576825325

[rapid night]

Classic Rogue Disc definitely has more, but good to at least have something here 😛

[heady cradle]

Btw is your post worth pinning, or is it missing any kind of information so not worthy for now?

[rapid night]

I can just update my current pin with the p8 link

[viscid epoch]

This is in my MH

But I also have this

It’s correct to have the screaming dagger equipped right? Despite the heart seaker havjng +14 critical strike rating?

[cedar epoch]

new UI cracks me up. Also looks pretty sweet.

[half yew]

For leveling I'd just favor whatever has the most DPS + Agility. Each point of Agi is 2 Attack Power in Cata, so it's a very powerful stat; nearly 3x the value as any of the secondary (green color) stats

[viscid epoch]

okay thank you

Appreciate it

I had another ?, my friend is a fire mage and another is a hunter - we’re all around 60 but they do a shit load more dps than I do

I know they have advantage of AOE while I effectively have none right now, but will this balance out towards end game? I want to do big numbers too 🥺

[half yew]

What spec are you playing?

[viscid epoch]

Assassination, I tried sub but it was a lot to keep up with

I’m a long time league player and having to use this many buttons has been a hard adjustment

[half yew]

So Asn is a very sustained DPS spec. It doesn't really have good burst damage, and as you mentioned our AoE is nonexistant until FoK at... 70 or whatever, and even then it's not great.

You should do OK against mobs with a ton of health, but yeah I'd expect you to lose out on anything that only lives for 2-6 seconds

[viscid epoch]

Okay, fair enough. I’m in too deep to switch at this point and I do enjoy the playstyle so i guess that’s all that matters

[half yew]

You just have a ton of ramp up time putting up Garrote > Rupture > SnD > Envenoms

You're not dealing full damage until that Envenom point

[viscid epoch]

Yeah that would make sense why I’d be stronger in end game when I have time to actually get everything up

Thanks for the impromptu q and a sesh

[half yew]

np

[wanton iris]

can anyone send me an invite to the Gehennas cata classic disc?

[half yew]

Sounds like a retail question, this is the Classic channel

[rapid night]

SoD P8 Rogue DPS Compendium is now complete with quick reference strats for each boss. I'll continue to update them as I gain confidence in Rogue-specific optimizations and recommendations in the coming weeks

[lean turtle]

whats better, instant poison 2 or deadly

im lvl 34

[half yew]

Deadly is only useful in extended fights, and while solo it'll fuck you over when you need to blind/gouge. Don't bother with it

[near prawn]

do you guys think that backstabbing when playing duo with a war for leveling is better than combat (im lvl 27)

[formal relic]

Is there any way to macro Tricks of the Trade in with Mutilate? In this one, Mutilate never goes off:

/startattack
/cast [target=focus] Tricks of the Trade
/cast mutilate
/use 10

and in this one Tricks never goes off:

/startattack
/cast mutilate
/cast [target=focus] Tricks of the Trade
/use 10

[azure yoke]

Both are on the GCD so that just wont work like that

[azure yoke]

I would just suggest that you have a few trick macros for focus and/or a chosen dps/tank.

I have this:

#showtooltip
/cast [@focus] Tricks of the Trade

And then I have a separate one for a named rogue/mage/tank as well. Just replace "focus" with set name in your raid/group.
There is other similar ones out there that works perfectly fine obv.

[crimson kayak]

Hi, i have a question. I play on the anniversary Realms and got to play Dagger-Combat for Raiding.
Played a lot of Sword before and feel comfy with Swords but don't seem to get the hang of it. For me Dagger just feels off.
Could Seal Fate be a good alternative? I'm mostly on T0 + MC / PVP Gear going for the Rank 14 Weapons.
I'd like to stay Dagger, so is it too early? Should i try it?
How does it compared to the normal Dagger Combat in terms of Rotation and S'n'D upkeep? So many Questions

[solar lotus]

Sadly nothing compares to combat

but gotta remember as daggers, u pretty much never get to evis

just backstabbing and sliceing

Like just taking the preset backstab build in the sim, and comparing it to what would probably be the best sealed fate build is a massive loss @crimson kayak

[crimson kayak]

This feels somewhat sad. But i guess i'll try it anyways just to see if i like the Seal Fate version more than Dagger-Combat atm.

Can i get some Pointers to when use CD's while playing Combat? Feels really bad not sometimes with my AR timings CPs and not using Evis :/

[solar lotus]

Usually just backstabs into either a 1 or 2 point slice and dice and then just send flurry -> AR

depends on the fight also a bit ofc

[crimson kayak]

thanks for your Input @solar lotus
i guess i will look into AR and some Tea in combination for shorter encounters and take what i can get.
Feels still a bit sad thats it's "Backstab into S'n'D - Done" 😄

[solar lotus]

https://tenor.com/view/rogue-warcraft-wow-gif-11008475980691198481

theres a reason for this gif

[crimson kayak]

i know that there is 1 evis per AR and i'll find it 😄

[solar lotus]

yeah I mean you do usually get 1 or maybe 2

usually easier in fights u can go into with a pre-SnD

[crimson kayak]

there should alwaays be a 5point Evis in AR - i am so close every time xD

[viscid epoch]

So I’m fairly new to wow

Hit 85 yesterday and look at phase 4 pre raid bid gear on icy veins

I see that 80 percent of it is from dragon souls raid

Is it a bad idea / I’m too low level to attempt that with a group at i350, and where would I even find a group to do it with?

[half yew]

You buy/earn the ilvl 384 (390 in some slots) by doing 5 man dungeons. You still need to get a bit of gear before you can queue it, but you don't need to enter a raid.

[half yew]

https://www.wowhead.com/cata/guide/dungeons/protocol-twilight-dungeons-overview

[heady cradle]

I'm currently testing SoD for the first time and bought all the runes.
Currently level 22.
I'm kinda lost on what there's to do since I've never played classic whatsoever.
Is doing low level dungeons worth the time?
The low level raids?

[viscid epoch]

Thanks man, I did have one more question if you don’t mind

On icy veins all the phase 4 pre raid stuff shows it’s mostly drops in dragon soul heroic

Am I missing something here? How is it pre raid if it’s from dragon soul?

[half yew]

Read the whole post. It's how you buy the item level 384/390 raid drops

[half yew]

I also want to follow up on this - IcyVeins is fucking dogshit for Classic. It has never been accurate. I just did a double-check and there's major errors in their pre-raid setups for all 3 specs. Do not follow it. Use the WoWhead guides written by Warstry.

That's not to say it doesn't also sometimes have errors, but he'll actually correct them when we find them

[flat dock]

any accurate sims for darkmantle set bonus

[half yew]

Simon's sheets or wowsims, either works

[dark pendant]

Are there any updated bis lists for phase 4 now that darkmantle is included in it?

[half yew]

I don't think anyone is particularly active in making Classic Anniversary lists atm. Wowhead may have one, but unsure how researched it'll be

https://www.wowhead.com/classic/guide/classes/rogue/dps-bis-gear-pve-phase-3#rogue-phase-4-bis-gear-daggers Simonize had a Season of Mastery Phase 4 list which incidentally matches the game state of Anniversary Phase 4, it should be pretty close (but ignores R14 weapons; I'd assume those are better)

Ah, he mentions them in the full weapon list further down in the guide

[viscid epoch]

Hello gang - how detrimental is would it be to run two 1.8s in both hands in assassin spec?

Asking cause I had got unmaker through fragments and haven’t got pre raid bis OH yet but I did just get another unmaker through a drop

Was kinda thinking maybe just run both unmakers and get the bis OH last?

[half yew]

It's pretty bad. Run it through the sim

My assumption is at least a 2k dps loss

It's ~25% slower than a 1.4 weapon, which directly translates to 25% less Deadly Poison applications

[viscid epoch]

Okay, thank you as always sir!

[lucid valley]

hey boys&girls,
is there any relevant discord for SOD ? thanks 🙂

if not, i'm wondering if that'd be a good idea to create a specific channel in here!

[azure yoke]

This server is 99% retail. So if you want SoD chatter, tc stuff and in general a place to talk about that.
Head over to this discord instead https://discord.gg/MMVyeG4G

[lucid valley]

thank you!

[rotund galleon]

How close is daggers with perd+cht with darkmantle to swords with r14 weps in phase 4?

[half yew]

R14 is effectively Naxx weapons. Your comparison is fucked just from that alone

[plucky nymph]

Via shadowpanther;

[atomic zenith]

Hi there, what enchant do I want for MH for swords in pvp/pve? crusader, 15 agi, lifesteal, something else? thx

[solar lotus]

For PvE double crusader is pretty much always gonna be king

sometimes u can get away with something like 1x crusader 1x +15 agi, but double cursader has the highest ceiling

[plucky nymph]

Results might get closer depending on fight length, but I don't see crusader losing a meaningful amount.

Via shadowpanther;

[viscid epoch]

Whenever I go reforge according to warstry assassin rogue pre raid bis guide, I noticed that I do like 7-8k less dps despite following what he has for each item

Am i doing something wrong?

[half yew]

You don't copy the literal individual reforges, just do it in the sim tool

The guide reforges are examples

Unless you're in literally identical gear, your reforges will be different

[viscid epoch]

Ah shit okay

I owe you a beer by the way

[woven nexus]

Yo all Someone find better sim ? https://wowsims.github.io/classic/rogue/#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

[light cave]

Horde can use R12 pants for a tiny bit more DPS.

[jade sand]

just bought this filthy axe for my warr at lvl 36 and enchanted it myself xdd

hope it hits hard

[formal relic]

Is there a sim for cataclysm? can't seem to find one in an internet search. they're all for either vanilla classic or retail. Or wrath.

[sudden pilot]

https://wowsims.github.io/cata/

There's also an addon that lets you export your gear + talents

Called "WowSims Exporter" on curseforge, presumably other places, too

[somber vale]

Hi, I have a question. In the level 20 rogue questline, I got the debuff but it was accidentally dispelled. Now I'm stuck at the part where I have to drink the potion to get cured. Since I don't have the debuff anymore, the potion does nothing. What can I do? I talked to a GM and they told me to repeat it, but Mathias doesn't give me the quest again.

[half yew]

The step you're on to cleanse it isn't required for anything, it's purely for removing that debuff

So while it might be a bit annoying to not have the quest complete, there's nothing lost

[vapid lava]

guys i just started SoD as a human rogue. Any resources or tips on progression?

[heady cradle]

Get questie, at lvl 25(?) try to group up and head to dusk wood for the emerald dailies

Other than that use the backstab build

[vapid lava]

Can I get all the runes from the rune vendor at the starting zone near the abby or do I need to do the quests/discovery

[heady cradle]

You can get all runes for 1 copper each

[lost crystal]

To the rogues doing T0.5 on anniversary:
Have any of you seen the Libram of Hope / Totem of Rebirth from Isalien (DM:E) or Idol of Rejuvenation from Mor Grayhoof (LBRS) drop while progressing your quest line?

[candid stump]

idols and all such things come with p5 (AQ patch)

not zg

its very cocked tbf

no oils either

very weird deciscions blizz is making

[lost crystal]

Idols, Librams and Totems from the 0.5 summonable bosses are out

[candid stump]

i just hope those fuckers dont dare to shorten tbc lifespan

[candid stump]

oh shi ok

first one to show me this

[lost crystal]

Was looking for information if someone had seen it, but figured it out the hard way

[candid stump]

thats g2k since my prem8 guild grp didnt saw one drop

do we thought it must be aq patch

ty tho 🫡

[lost crystal]

🫡 It's only the summonable bosses tho, so only these 2 are available (+ Libram of Hope):
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/item=22345/totem-of-rebirth
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/item=22398/idol-of-rejuvenation

[odd pollen]

!fuu

[tall rivet]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[formal relic]

I just got my legendary daggers (yay!) but I still have some elementium gem clusters sitting around. Is there anything useful I can do with them? Can't vendor them.

Just seems scary deleting an orange item lol

[half yew]

You can hold them or toss them, they'll still continue to drop

[olive token]

Hello everyone, I'm new here! Sorry for the silly question, but is there a dedicated discord related to rogues, for Season of Discovery by any chance? Where I could find some builds / meta info

[heady cradle]

Yeah, you could join simozine show's discord

https://discord.gg/u5Bt6Ujw

He also has a youtube channel and (IMO) it's worth watching

[strange rivet]

Is there a disxord for Cata Rouges?

[jaunty osprey]

?

[heady cradle]

https://discord.gg/uq9F6xnX you can try this one

[errant tinsel]

hey so quick question. i want to play rogue in classic for openworld pvp i guess the anniversary servers are the right choice then. but there is only 1 pvp server and its full (cant make a horde char duo to population problem) it says.. is there no way to play on it beside play alliance?

[half yew]

Probably not the place to ask for help, since it's the Classic channel

[indigo sandal]

Mb

[past leaf]

can you resend that link please i have a couple questions

[heady cradle]

https://discord.gg/RQJAA49Q

[sullen estuary]

!guide

[tall rivet]

Rogue Guides:
WoWhead: https://www.wowhead.com/classes#rogue
Icy Veins: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/class-guides
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides

[timid hatch]

Hello can anyone help me with this group quest

[heady cradle]

ooooh.... We don't use the server for LFG stuff. you gotta use the in-game channels for that homie

[timid hatch]

oh.....

ok

hopefully someone will respond cuz i already asked for help there

[heady cradle]

https://tenor.com/view/god-praying-im-for-you-gif-16088398739439144027

[timid hatch]

2 people responded and i got help

thanks Royal D for telling me stuff

sorry again for the hassle

[brisk lintel]

hi guys, i have a question

does Supreme flask works with instant poison ?

[half yew]

No, it only boosts Dragonbreath Chili, and if you choose to use it, Shadow/Frost Oils (I think Shadow is better but it's still a meme)

[heady cradle]

No worries, happy it worked out for you homie!!

[timid hatch]

how do i stop accidentally looting people

i wanted to look at some gear like this dagger looking two hand sword and cloth spaulders with good sub stats but i got kicked for it

i forgot to unloot them

[heady cradle]

Turn off auto loot

[timid hatch]

aight thanks

cuz it was either that or i keep clicking the dice option on accident

i should not have auto loot on at all and not click the dice option

[heady cradle]

Yeah the dice option is for when you WANT the item. The coin option (greed) is for when you kinda want it, but it isn't a big deal if you don't get it @timid hatch

Also if you just want to preview the items, you can just shift + mouse click items icons/names to preview them

Is it shift? Either shift or ctrl CTRL + Left click

[timid hatch]

ohhhh ok

thanks

ive never had to grind in dungeons before so this is still all new to me

and im doing this first in classic

[heady cradle]

You'll have fun probably, its way different that what retail wow is

[sacred gate]

Hi, on classic era, Elemental Sharpening Stone stacks crit or work for each hand separately ?

With Source plz

[timid hatch]

should i go for enchanting as my profession to add more damage to my weapons?

[half yew]

Ele sharp stones increase your aura crit, applying to both hands. If you put on two, you'll see your net crit chance on your character sheet go up by 4%

[covert tundra]

logged onto mop classic beta and decided to look at some stuff my dad used to play (combat rogue being a big one), WHY DO WE GET RID OF COOL THINGS?!

whether this is strong or not is whatever, but classes giving buffs like this is cool

[heady cradle]

"... My dad used to play" holy shit I feel old now

[covert tundra]

i’m not insanely young, I had just stated leveling my first character towards the end of MoP. I’m 25, but my dad used to play all the time. I thought it’d be sick to check out some stuff. I took some screenshots, I’m gonna talk about it with him today :)

[heady cradle]

Okay now I don't feel that old

I'm 30 and I did start during late tbc

[half yew]

MoP into WoD is when Blizz took the "everyone has raid buffs and cooldowns so no one is useless" stance. At some point they moved away from it again.

[heady cradle]

MoP, where rogues could Smoke Bomb for AoE dmg reduction...

[brave wharf]

Got a bit of a dilemma. Trying to maximize output on Spine of Deathwing (Heroic) during the tendon phases, and in general, am feeling like I'm not pulling my weight. I'm on par for a 22% parse which makes me want to gouge my own eyes out. I am (humbly) submitting the logs here (I am Sassyduck, if this wasn't easily discernable) I would really appreciate feedback on optimal burst phases, and in general, things I can do to shore up anything I can to help us down this before the MOP prepatch. One other thing of note on this particular log is our other rogue was falling asleep at the keyboard, so this is not about them, specifically about what I can do, thanks a ton in advance. https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/reports/zGJWvaRphATB3nD2?boss=-2&difficulty=0&wipes=1&type=damage-done I'm also attaching my talents and glyphs

[half yew]

First is buying the Valor trinket (this goes for every single DPS in your raid. I only checked you but I'm assuming most people don't have it). The on use effect is insane for Spine. Replace your Vial with it, as Vial's ICD may cause it to underperform on the Tendons.

You should never be pressing Garrote ever as Subtlety. Waste of energy and a GCD.

You're relying on Warriors to press sunder and it does not look like they do it consistently. Less than half of your total lifts achieved 3 stacks of Sunder. I'd HIGHLY consider you or the other rogue investing a low-point Expose Armor on specifically the tendons so that all physical damage gets that full boost near-instantly.

Replace your Hemo glyph with Eviscerate - just for spine, it's more net damage than what one Hemo provides.

Since you have warriors in your raid, don't bother with Rupture on the tendons. Any bleed from any source is sufficient to activate Sanguinary Vein. Putting those points into more Eviscerates is better.

You should have Shadow Dance for every single tendon. It looks like you might be using it on other things or just forgetting to press it. This is a huge part of why your parse is suffering

You're pressing Hemorrhage a bunch of times. Remove it from your bar if you have to, but there's no reason to press it on Spine

[brave wharf]

got it.

Thank you for the insight.

you're referring to Kiroptyric Sigil?

[half yew]

Yep

[tardy ermine]

Hey hey can anyone tell me why my buddy is missing 12% with sinister strike?

https://fresh.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/spineshatter/aggressive

[half yew]

Linking to the actual log in question would help

This is an example on auto attacks, but the Miss column combines Miss, Dodge, and Parry so I'd assume that's what you're seeing

[tardy ermine]

Incoming

@half yew

https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/reports/vFMgWQwzdf9JxPCa?fight=2&type=damage-done&source=32&start=1053624&end=1075118

9% here

[half yew]

Yeah it's a dodge

You can't mitigate against those, Hit chance only reduces your chance to Miss

[tardy ermine]

But he is the only one with miss %

Sec

Ok i got ur point

He has way more than the others

Thats his concern

And still more dps then them

[half yew]

If there's ever a Parry present it means he's standing in front of stuff, or possibly too close to the center of the hitbox which can sometimes register as being in front

Dodge there's nothing you can do about, pure RNG

[tardy ermine]

Ty buddy

[sick mango]

Hi im new to wow im playing sub rogue in wow cataclysm, someone can tell me when can I find a pvp build? im farming arena points. Thanks a lot.

[rancid frigate]

Im gonna level a rogue for mop, any suggestions on race? I'm beetwen orc/undead/belf

[half yew]

Orc will be best for DPS out of those options (Troll and Pandaren will be better) but unless you plan to push top parses it doesn't matter too much

[weak cave]

anyone managed to pull stillgiss in a bank run in this Version?

[worn anchor]

is sub one of the top single target dps specs on the last patch of mop?

[half yew]

"Last Patch" as in tuning, or as in specifically Siege of Orgrimmar tier?

Though in either circumstance, the answer is no. We're top-middle, largely brought more for utility rather than actual DPS output.

[brave citrus]

[plucky nymph]

[weak zinc]

Which spec is best for pve in mop? Is it just sub unless cleave targets then combat?

[half yew]

More or less

Though Asn isn't far behind, and it has insane execute damage which may be applicable depending on your comp or fight needs

[obtuse crest]

is there a seperate server for mop classic rogue or is this it

[half yew]

#classic-discussion message Rogue Classic is the main one, though there's also SimonizeShow's discord which has Classic discussions. Rogue Classic has a link to Simonize in it

[obtuse crest]

oh i didnt see that, thanks!

[open sorrel]

2. Question
   Can somebody tell me where i can get the elixir of agility?

[sudden pilot]

Auction House or Alchemist

[obsidian kite]

how is rogue in mop vs cata

[half yew]

Easier to bring 1-2 due to raid buffs, feint/cloak soaking mechanics, and Smoke Bomb being a raid DR CD. Hard to bring more because we're not the best in any single damage profile (but good enough to be worth it for the other things)

A well played one can still dunk on any random group, assuming they're playing the optimal spec on every fight. You will want to be comfortable at all 3 specs.

[blazing needle]

Hey gang, got a question about the book quest for the 2 hit trinket. Playing on HC and don't wanna fuck it up sneaking in there myself. Is it ok to do alone?

[rugged shore]

i havent tried it myself so be careful but i think it should be possible

[heady jungle]

any thoughts on feral druid vs rogue? was planning on rogue but really enjoyed feral druid and now im kinda torn between the 2.

[half yew]

No idea

I don't think I've seen any feral logs, though I'm sure they exist

[heady jungle]

ill wind up leveling both and gearing, just hard to find stuff that i would consider reliable or pve focused

[ruby bridge]

banned

[coarse dirge]

bis professions for mop?????

[gloomy plinth]

Since TBCC is gonna be relaunched is there a comparison when it's worth to switch from 4p Darkmantle to T4/T5?

[molten owl]

basically immediately, darkmantle doesn't even come close to prebis iirc

tbc ilvl bump is large

and energy devalued a bit i would assume

[plucky nymph]

💯

Stats > everything till cap

[solar lotus]

I mean you also run tier 3 over darkmantle so

[molten owl]

full tier 3 almost always beats darkmantle

[solar lotus]

even with just 4 piece tier 3, I am pretty sure you can drop darkmantle for good tier 2.5 pieces

unless ur doing IEA where the energy is more valuable

as daggers you for sure drop it for 4 piece tier 3 + ACGL etc but swords depends

[flint hill]

hello, didnt play original mop but gona start classic mop as a rogue, heard sub might be the best spec overall. Does anyone know if assa still remains viable and would playing assa/combat be fine

[sudden pilot]

All the rogue specs are viable, especially after recent tweaks, they are pretty close together. Sub still performs best, but there's like 5% between the specs

Sin is decent and a fairly simple rotation, so maximising DPS on the spec is pretty straightforward.

[flint hill]

nice to hear been maining sin since legion when i started so it has a special place in my heart

[half yew]

Do note that Legion+ Asn and MoP Asn will not feel the same. They've made the spec a lot faster over time

[flint hill]

yeah noted played it in wrath and cata classic aswell

[vocal knot]

Hey guys whats the best faction for pvp in mop?

[novel plank]

[latent valve]

Hey all! Any good resources for pre-patch that include the recent buffs?

Still playing Combat for Dungeons and SUb for Raid?

[half yew]

This is more of a retail-oriented discord. Most classic info is hosted instead on Classic Rogue, it's linked in the pins

[tribal bear]

yo where's the tbc rogue discord?

[plucky nymph]

meebee

[tribal bear]

i did, dont see anything for tbc

[plucky nymph]

Wowhead should still have all of the old TBC guides as well...I THINK.

[edgy garnet]

Anyone here going to play/playing MoP classic?

[sudden pilot]

Yep, actively playing

[dapper rune]

are we gaming

[shrewd oxide]

Hey guys! Hope you all are having a great day! I have a question. I just got my new legendaggers, I usually go Assassination but I read that sub is better once you get daggers (and that sub is the bis way to go to MoP too). Is there a specific rotation for once u have daggers? Do I just spam eviscerate on procc?

[soft rivet]

Hey guys . I have a rogue in classic anniversary and I use 2 fist weapon . But idk why my damage is very bad at raids . Maybe I'm doing wrong with rotation?

[molten owl]

most of your damage in classic is made up of world buffs and raid buffs/kill time, so make sure you have all the consumables and world buffs

rotation is mostly just sinister -> slice and dice -> sinisters and eviscerate, keep slice up, so likely not much you're messing up there

make sure to use all your cooldowns like adrenaline rush and thistle tea

there generally aren't many very good fist weapons so there's a chance you can upgrade your gear a bit which could help, but is usually less important than the above

[soft rivet]

Is daggers better for pve?

[molten owl]

generally yeah, you can get +dagger skill items which are great against +3 level enemies/bosses, and there are just a lot of really strong daggers available

usually you just want to use whatever best weapons you have access to, but that is just usually daggers since nobody else really wants them, they are quite good, and the dagger skill items make them a bit nicer

swords work great too if you get them, warriors just really want them too

maces and fists are also fine but there just aren't really that many good ones that exist

[soft rivet]

Tyvm for guide . Last night I was 17th dps in mc and it made me sad . I thought maybe reason is my weapons .

[golden cave]

Comrades. How viable is combat rogue in Mop pvp? Twos and bgs?

[molten owl]

can send the logs if you want i can peruse, it will probably be mostly world buffs and consumes but there is probably some things you can also do better

[rancid frigate]

is rogue gonna be this strong in mop? prepatch dmg looks kinda broken (talking ab mop prepatch)

[sudden pilot]

Rogue will be pretty decent, yes. They won't be gapping every class, but on a S-D tier scale I expect they will be high A

[rancid frigate]

u think rogues still have oneshot potential in mop? mainly because i heard they fell down a bit and it becomes more of a cc/utility spec

[sudden pilot]

In PvP? They still have a lot of stunlock capability and do decent damage. The bigger factor will be the relative ease-of-access to good pvp gear. Given that the best gear will come from conquest (and have no rating requirements), more people will have better gear with higher resilience.

Not to say one-shot won't be possible through it, I just think it'll be less likely when you factor in gear and abilities of other classes to get out of stuns. But, Rogues are good duelers and with Shadowstep and other talents strong in PVP available to all specs, I still think Rogues stand a high chance of winning that duel.

[prime harbor]

Hey guys,
Will the rogue sub be competitive with arm warrior and unholy dk in pve?

[jade whale]

Yes, but depends on gear

[quasi cosmos]

Is rogue really that bad in tbc? Was thinking of getting started on anniversary realms

[molten owl]

it absolutely has a reputation of being bad and that will hamper your ability to get into public groups whether they are "actually good" or not

generally they aren't actually really that bad in pve output, but the issue with tbc is group buffs are super important and rogues don't provide any but want all the good melee ones, so it's hard to fit a lot of them into a raid comp and have everyone be happy with good damage output

and there are way more rogues than spots since it's a fun class and super fun in arena which is super popular in tbc

most raids will bring 1 for expose and not really be happy for more

i played tbc rogue in a guild that i vibed with and it was awesome and carried my weight and didn't have any problems, but tons of people have told me how the pug rogue experience was pretty bad

i would get your foot into the door in a guild in anniversary now, or just be ready to make fast friends in tbc

if you just wanna roll up and solo pug stuff sometimes it won't be as good of an experience

could also consider have a shaman alt/main and use that as leverage to get your rogue into the other raid team

[quasi cosmos]

Haha thanks, good advice!

[frosty fiber]

i heard Panda Ass is Bis for rogue in Mop

Could anyone confirm?

[half yew]

As in Assassination the spec, or Pandaren racial?

Assassination should be relatively competitive with Subtlety (less potential DPS but easier to play) for single target DPS
Pandaren is not bis for DPS unless you're Alliance. On Horde, Troll is better.

[wanton gorge]

Panda ass replaces the night elf goldshire meta

By a huge margin

[shadow folio]

!wa

[tall rivet]

Rogue WA's:
Wago.io TWW Rogue
For more specific Rogue WeakAuras, run the !wa command in your preferred specialization channel.

[grizzled otter]

Hey guys, got a question regarding raid dps strategy:

In ZulGurub, there are some bosses that allow for cleave damage on co-spawns.
E.g. second boss Venoxis spawns with 4 snakes that can be cleaved, Mandokir spawns with his raptor and Thekal with 2 other „priest“ guys.

Are there other cleavable bosses in ZG?
Like do these small spiders count, that High Priestess Marli spawns?
And/Or there other cleave options on other ZG bosses?
Thanks 🙂

[jaunty jetty]

https://tenor.com/view/stitch-licks-slime-gif-7826310196799265789

[gleaming basin]

Where my rogue mop classic players at. Feels lonely out here

[polar shadow]

Dw we all levelling atm

[agile knoll]

Waiting on epoch

[coarse rock]

what spec should i be playing for MoP PvE?

[half yew]

Join the Rogue Classic discord, this is a question with a lot of nuance thats answered by the FAQ and guides there

[coarse rock]

i tried to find it but couldn';t

could you dm it to me

[half yew]

It's pinned

[rotund path]

honest question is sub annoying in mop, because we have to maintain s&d + multiple dots?

If I see it correct, sub has to maintain more then assation?

[silent hawk]

Is reforge lite a good add on to use?

[sudden pilot]

yes

[wind phoenix]

Has anyone been pickpocketing in MOP and know where the sweet spots are? Too many old and updated spots now....

[short nova]

anyone can tell me what region i need to do my reputation?

[wheat wren]

Was wondering which spec would be best to do challenge mode in mop?

[quasi cosmos]

What’s a good dagger leveling spec for classic anniversary?

[keen leaf]

anyone knows when i should change my legendaries?

[fluid lodge]

yo! new to WoW (and playing a Rogue), and have a question about trinkets. i'm doing my best to figure out which combo of trinkets to run when, and i'm looking for advice.

i've read sno's guide and it seems like double-active is the way to go for raid bosses. should i be running double-active for trash too? or hoj/bb?

i'm carrying:

• earthstrike
• renetaki's
• hoj
• blackhand's breadth

[fluid lodge]

https://www.icy-veins.com/wow-classic/dagger-rogue-leveling-talent-build-from-1-to-60

[quasi cosmos]

Cool thanks! How do you think this compares to more Sub heavy?

[fluid lodge]

it depends on your playstyle and what you find yourself doing—subtlety is especially good for pvp, so if you’re on a pvp server, or plan to play pvp, sub could work for you.

that’s not to say it’s not a good leveling build, but generally leveling combat with daggers, or swords, is going to be more efficient.

it’s totally up to you and what you like.

[molten owl]

i looove leveling as sub, it's very fun and feels very flavourful. you can see the talent order under the talent calc here https://www.wowhead.com/classic/talent-calc/rogue/02-302005002-350050130030101/0B2BEHgaMaapr1AccFJ, but mainly remorseless -> improved ambush for near 100% crit chance on ambush, and you keep a great main hand dagger and fight lower level mobs and basically one shot them with ambush

it's made for hardcore so takes prep early but you can go to precision from combat earlier if you want, missed ambushes feel terrible when it's most of your damage

it is potentially not as good in terms of speed and flexibility as combat but i really enjoy playing with a specific niche and specific strengths

can fill out damage in combat or sub or whatever or even respec when you're 45ish, the spec does start to fall off then because mobs have a lot of health, i took it to 60 and had a blast though

[molten owl]

generally on trash you use actives if they are up and swap them off for passives as you drop combat (can vanish to drop combat if it seems like you're gonna be stuck in a 2m gauntlet with your trinkets down if you want)

itemrack is a great addon for this, you can queue up swaps in combat so they happen immediately on combat end, and you can even automate it so when your actives are on cooldown they automatically swap to passives, and back when the actives are 30s away from being up. this doesn't always work since you can see the future better than it in terms of how long you'll be in combat, but can be helpful

if your raid group pulls tons of trash back to back to back with no combat drops, you'll likely want passive trinkets since it's essentially like one super long boss fight

if you get any combat drops to swap off to passive, that's likely better

i usually just try to line up an active with my blade flurry and swap around otherwise

[fluid lodge]

such a helpful write up—thank you so much, dude. i really appreciate it!

[molten owl]

ez answer is one perma active trinket so it always lines up with blade flurry, other one active or passive or whatever swap around

[fluid lodge]

that makes sense to me. my guild runs at a respectful pace, ha. i think running active trinkets could work well for me, based on your explanation, considering we’re pulling a pack or two at a time and get at least 30s in between pulls.

[molten owl]

hell yeah sounds like actives are going to be really good then

if the cooldown ticks down while you're not in combat the active % just goes up and it's very very good

[ruby halo]

where is the mop channel ?

[molten owl]

in another discord https://discord.gg/rKF9G7zusj

[soft rivet]

Guys . I got a problem. My damage is in top 5 in bwl as detail show but my log show I'm in last 5. I cant understand what is this mean

[molten owl]

probably they are measuring different things (details is set to all damage including trash, logs only boss, or something similar)

[light pewter]

I heard using Feint first global on a 0 threat mob still makes it being less likely to get attacked next is that true and if yes can someone explain how it works? (Wow Classic)

[molten owl]

feint simply applies negative threat, so theoretically it could set you to a negative value on the threat table - but i don't know if that is actually allowed by the threat table to go negative

ie. it is an attack that applies -200 threat, so if you were to then do a 300 threat auto attack you'd be at 100 threat, which is lower than the 300 if you didn't feint first. again i don't know if threat tables actually let you go negative

[light pewter]

yeah thats the part i wasnt sure about aswell

[molten owl]

i don't really see a use case because it's not like you cast feint on cooldown or wait to attack, usually you just blast and vanish, and lip if you're in danger

but threat meters read the game api so you could test it fairly easily

have friend pull a mob, hit it, see the threat go up. have a friend pull another mob, feint, hit it, see if threat goes up

[light pewter]

thats a great idea gonna try ty!

[molten owl]

while you're testing know the threat values will be a bit weird, damage is 1:1 threat usually but rogues get -23% or so baseline threat

don't recall the exact figure

[latent steeple]

im getting back to wow. is classic pandoria worth it rn?

[static crane]

I dinged 60 on hc and im considering gold farming in brd. Pickpocketing that is. Can someone advice a specialized build for this. I know a pvp build works fine but mayb i can min max it more.

[formal relic]

If you like endlessly grinding dailies for rep. That's what MoP Bucket is all about. You can probably guess where I stand on that. LOL

[wary smelt]

quite literally nothing to do other than dailies, cm dungs to gold and raid twice a week

if youre a pvp enthusiast its quite fun though

and when u get exalted with reps and finish cm dungs u can only do raids xd

[latent steeple]

So if I’m mainly just for the PvP then I assume worth for me thrn ?

[quasi cosmos]

Is rogue really that bad in tbc pve content?

[plucky nymph]

Nah.

[naive stream]

btw did i mess sometihing up? wowsims on mop classic is hell bent 6% exp and like 9% hit but it should be 7.5% on both?

[wary smelt]

yeah its alright then

another thing for pve on mop (could just be eu), joining a decent guild is harder than landing a job for some reason

wouldnt be surprised if they start asking for blood work or pictures of your passport at some point

[chilly glacier]

whats the best mop classic sub rogue guide?

[gentle thunder]

is sub still better than assassination with the nerf on MoP

[tawny juniper]

if you are good sub then I would say yes, if you like assa more play assa

[half yew]

Unless you think you can max roll Sub DPS every single fight, they're pretty equal on average

[distant pond]

From what I've heard assassination scales better now in higher lvl gear

https://youtu.be/msOjsOEkITI?si=tbNHLiqFF2UJOwAW

[acoustic pawn]

why does my curse forge still say cata

[forest coral]

did you never update your game?

[jaunty helm]

Is there a different discord for WoW MoP?

[distant pond]

Sent you the invite

[teal pendant]

Need help maximizing DPS as AzN rogue classic MoP pve

[distant pond]

https://discord.gg/e79Pwdvw

Also wowhead

[light ferry]

is the game down? T_T

[upbeat wyvern]

Does anyone know of a good dps rotation addon so i can learn rogue in MOP