subtlety

[night sparrow]

Play trickster. With current balance, turbo boost and ilvl your group gotta stop dps anyway

[hollow spear]

my group stops dps

I don't :^)

[night sparrow]

That's my secret :>

[lilac stag]

I’m sure they’re not pressing puzzle box in shroud or any possible spell casts when the time is at 1

[wispy crystal]

I see.

Why do most rogues press blades at the 20s mark on Baloren?

Sorry if noob question. Its my first time going into that fight as Sub

[night sparrow]

Cause adds spawn + egg phase is around 2mn

• as rogue you might have to soak since with a lil priest shield + feint you dont even need cloak

[wispy crystal]

Ah I see. Okay that makes sense.

[night sparrow]

(Yes I had 2 soaks and 2 back ups if needed )

[wispy crystal]

Thanks alot

[night sparrow]

yw

just send a dance at pull and you're fine

[wispy crystal]

I'm on trial for my mythic raiding guild. And they are on Baloren. So was looking at lorggs.io to understand when rogues use their CDs

[lilac stag]

@tepid trellis MN Sub Rogue Spreadsheet Gaming

[night sparrow]

Don't look at parses then, Beloren is a poor designed boss if you're not doing RWF

BTW any of you got a QoL m33kauras to track when deepening shadows gets updated ?

[lilac stag]

what do you need it for?

besides screen clutter

[night sparrow]

Nope with a sound

[hollow spear]

Flask has 165!

[lilac stag]

ah good catch.

[night sparrow]

That's not this useful but just some QoL

[hollow spear]

1 over target, it's rip

[neon valley]

Hello folks, i got a small question about Sub Rogue as i haven´t played WoW and Rogue since 6 Years.

I Play M+ 10 - 12 Keys quite often now and notice that my Overall DMG that i track with details!, shows me Secret Technique as nr1 dmg source. Looking at Players that play keys in my range having always Black Powder listed as nr1 dmg source.

I always use Secret Techniqe with SD and Ancient Arts Buff, plus the loaded Combopoint. next is the Coup de Grace, so my Black Powder casts get only AA buffs without loaded combos.

Am i doing something wrong?

[lilac stag]

i mean, just look at your trinket. once one sec is gone hit blades

if you want to get fancy make a timer bar in arc or whatever so you know when to snapshot second dance

[lilac stag]

completly ruined. THANKS

[hollow spear]

Thanks, Obama!

[lilac stag]

his interview with colbert made me sad

[wispy crystal]

Single target is Sub rogue the top melee DPS at the moment in raid?

[lilac stag]

FDK

maybe SV. all three close

2/3 are fun to play. We have

[wispy crystal]

Ah so next week single target raid boss. Will kept rogues be going death stalker to blast the meters?

[somber sun]

I mean trickster is already pumping

for way less effort

[lilac stag]

depends how much fucking around you want to do with gearing. 700 to 1100 haste isn’t practical for everyone.

[wispy crystal]

1100 haste damn. Okay didn't think of that.

As trickster if I have 660 haste is that fine while fully buffed?

Or do I need to hit 700 for the breakpoint

[tribal vortex]

684 is safer

[vestal fog]

is the haste baseline or is it when you use guidon

[tepid trellis]

with flask / oils

[hollow spear]

With 660 haste you better have not only oils on your character but also in your keyboard

And your server connection should be oiled up too

[eternal light]

Hey guys , how much boss dmg is funnel dmg for sub in m+?

[hollow spear]

Sub has no funnel

[eternal light]

Is it not better to shurikenstorm and evis then backstab evis?

[hollow spear]

If you pull stuff on the boss that doesn't have to die, ig you can

Not really consequential though, your damage outside of dances sucks anyway

And during dances you would strike

[eternal light]

Yea i mean just wandering how much better it is

Sometimes i rather let others pad andi get some boss dmg

But yea depends on the mobs that are getting pulled with the boss

[chrome palm]

You’re benefiting from them only outside of your cds so the gain is minimal

[graceful rock]

Shuriken combo my beloved

[chrome palm]

Combo (25% spender buff, st): 👺 👺 👺
Resonance (40% spender buff, cleaves) 🥰 🥰 🥰

[swift tinsel]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1488547832062415010/drop_fixed.png

[lilac stag]

Did you cap out the rogue or still need stuff?

[swift tinsel]

was looking at alt stuff

rogue is done

[lilac stag]

I need to see what vault has. Likely crafting engineering boots.

[tepid quartz]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Light's Potential
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[swift tinsel]

it's raid logging/enough vault slots to get sockets for the next 3 weeks

cba to really do anything on alts atm either

will look at stuff in 12.0.7

[grim wasp]

we can put sockets everywhere?

[swift tinsel]

helm/wrist/belt

[grim wasp]

i see I need to get 3 voidcores and some mythcrest been away 2 weeks

when is 12.07? this week?

[swift tinsel]

not til mid-June probably

seen the 16th floated around

[keen dome]

Mid to late June, yeah

[grim wasp]

I see then we have that filler raid until august

[zenith hollow]

Is this a wa or something in ayjiecdm? Not at my cpu rn

Ah its ayjie

[vale pine]

just personal opinion, the raid, for me, seems like its mostly about testing flex mythic

[hallow mortar]

dear lura gamers

does feint work on the soak in P2

the line soak

[brisk raptor]

Some of yall sim better with pot of reck in single target?

[hallow mortar]

@warm marlin @plush roost share your knowlage

[tepid trellis]

from what i can see no it does not

first 2 has feint last one does not

[west tide]

dam i do feel safer when i use it though...

lmaoo

[tepid trellis]

yeh nope

[grim wasp]

Feint is in gcd never paid attention

[hallow mortar]

thank you

[slim stag]

Hey do you know for running deathstalker next week or the buff isn't enough

[hallow mortar]

im doing crystal so if i know i dont need to press better for me

[plush roost]

I play elusive

So it works 8)

[hallow mortar]

you are real gigachad

[plush roost]

Idk cheat feels whatever on lura

[west tide]

yeah i should run elusive nothin actually kills you on lura

[tepid trellis]

i wouldve died without it today

i got last sec sniped by a guy in intermission

[west tide]

my tank ran over me on p2 spread cause he got lost but cloak tyyy

ohh i thought a snipe just 1 shot

through cloak

[plush roost]

Yeah its got the dimmy thing

Where like

Cheat is good on some stuff

And elu is good on the other stuff

So up to u lowkey

I think with gear and healers becoming better

Cheats probably better

[west tide]

true

ds evasion node

[plush roost]

I liked elu cause it helped the heal check in intrrmission/p2 a lot

[west tide]

we up

[plush roost]

But p3 cheats kinda goated

[west tide]

can you live a constellation with cheat??

i havent hit one yet we are almost done with p3

[tepid trellis]

if you move away after the first tick yes

if you stand still

[west tide]

ahh ok

[plush roost]

If u arent afk ye

[tepid trellis]

it will kill you through it

[plush roost]

Honestly talents builds are so w.e on lura

The real tech

Is the triangle tech

If u see a triangle of constellations in p3

Ur guaranteed safe if u stand in it

Big hot tip!

[warm marlin]

i think the only time i dropped remotely low on lura was glaives

cheat op

[night sparrow]

Hey guys, what's the % loss if you danse+sectec instead of danse+storm now we play DS ?

like is practicing new muscle memory worth it ? 🥸

[paper trail]

it is 100%

Enough to relearn for it

[fossil forge]

https://tenor.com/view/sadhotgirl-gif-22225832

[night sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/iwannadie-spongebob-gif-19637649

[coral bear]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[coral bear]

i think the damage is greather than 1 damage, unsure

[sturdy pilot]

i have a question:
does anyone know the prio for mythic vanguard?
should i be using SS when dancing?
spend black powder on 2+
shuriken when 3+? or 2+? or just backstab?

[lilac stag]

It’s listed in the #subtlety-faq

[night sparrow]

!storm

[lilac stag]

strike in dance.
storm outside of it.

[sturdy pilot]

even at 2+?

[hollow spear]

It's all in the FAQ

[sturdy pilot]

ok ill check it out, thanks guys

[lilac stag]

Something something you can lead a horse to water. Still ends up at the glue factory.

[hollow spear]

I'm a professional glue sniffer, too

[willow mantle]

do you have a pic?

[modern sentinel]

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/rockin-the-triangle-dancing-triangle-ring-the-triangle-funny-gif-15024457

[narrow tendon]

does anyone know if the 1% extra night elf haste at night appears on the character sheet? trying to recraft my gear down to 700 haste but im afraid i might be overshooting it

[lilac stag]

Just open a calculation app and add gear if you’re not sure. It doesn’t help get you what you need for dance

[hollow spear]

the 1% does not affect the absolute value you see on your character sheet

[lilac stag]

If you want high tech, spreadsheet game. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923898501529600/1508132546213314733/image.png?ex=6a146d62&is=6a131be2&hm=2e4680214161321946f5b21488726a8206d306a545f9b63215d48cece1ea2015&

[narrow tendon]

yeah i just summed the haste numbers from each gear piece I had and realized that

thanks guys

[red vortex]

well, here we go

[tribal vortex]

guys can I embelish engi head normally right ?

[lusty gazelle]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lilac stag]

Easy way to tell. Time to crafting order one and select the embellishment slot.

unless something drastically changed, answer is no.

You also really want to use tier helm as sub if possible.

[fossil forge]

[tribal vortex]

I am playing all 3 so having the haste requirement on the helm helps

Also feet dropped in raid so I wanted to know if I can take so I embellish head

[lilac stag]

I mean. You’re going to need jewelry from crown or lura and likely replacing a tier piece. For mine it was two arcano, recrafts to haste/mastery, crown neck, npx mythic rings , pit daggie and 100 haste/mastery chest.

I can still make boots and mess around a bit more. Trying tho make changing out 700 to 1100 as easy as changing gear sets vs relying on recrafts.

You can move an embellishment to cloak and craft bracers with haste

As another alternative.

[tribal vortex]

the only non 289 items are head and feet that are crafted so I am trying to be max ilvl

1%dps doesn't really change anything

spore helmet will be good so it doesn't really matter I will change by then

[lilac stag]

289 vs 285 doesn’t either but on the bigger pieces I rather not have crafted.

[tribal vortex]

Yeah me too

[lilac stag]

belt and helm are going to get replaced so bracers/cloak/boots are all good options. Boots are an easy swap out for tricky to ds

Running crown heroic neck stunts my ilvl by .5 oh no hahah

[tribal vortex]

I play more assa than sub and I have the pit neck

[lilac stag]

I’m just trying to help you process shit. Can tell me to STFU.

[tribal vortex]

no worries all good

[lilac stag]

Are you progressing still?

[tribal vortex]

just killed bird

[lilac stag]

if it was me I’d say keep big ilvl for sub and math out what gets you the haste on the side pieces.

Recraft after prog

[rancid crow]

On a scale of 1-10, how no-no is first dance? 👉👈

[lilac stag]

Nothing else matters at this point.

you’ve got one fight to focus on

[tribal vortex]

I mostly play m+ and pugging so the higher ilvl the higher the amount of invites

one does what one has to do

[lilac stag]

They’re gonna see your ilvl regardless

[tribal vortex]

Yeah but I will trade it to another raider if I cannot use 😛

[lilac stag]

You’re using it for prog in raid. That is the entire point of raid loot.

[tribal vortex]

I mean someone that has hero feet need it more

I would take if I could embelish head otherwise no

[lilac stag]

I thought you got a helm

[tribal vortex]

i got feet

and wanted to recraft feet

[lilac stag]

No give feet away. Craft engineering feet

Buy mythic feet for 300k on ah

[tribal vortex]

yeah it's ok everything sims kinda sameihs

[lilac stag]

feet are / should be easy enough to target in m+

And just cata

[hollow spear]

tfd + pp kinda big

[small sleet]

For m+ it’s fine to run if you like it

[hollow spear]

I just ran a tfd + pp dungeon

felt good

[small sleet]

You should always have potent powder in m+

[solar glen]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1502605720099749898/image.png

[vale pine]

potent powder is rly good

so you would not skip on it

[plush roost]

U can see how a triangle between 1 2 3 is formed? Its always safe between those

[willow mantle]

ohhh i see, thank you!

[hollow spear]

Where are you on the meters, Char?

[vale pine]

toxic

[marble sail]

he is buffing the spec, doing gods work

[hollow spear]

That's what you get for not playing DS!

[random mason]

The answer is bottom left

[plush roost]

I didnt bp so my paladin could have funnel so we could push boss on prog ex dee

Here i am

[hollow spear]

What weird type of subtlety rogue is this? 🤨

[spiral pewter]

heyy, is there any way to trigger unseen blade beside the ST , like aoe apply instant?

[hazy breach]

Shuriken storm applies it

on your main target

[marble sail]

have u tried assa on it yet?

[upbeat cradle]

In mythic do you use DS only on Vorasius and Lura

?

[vale pine]

you can on any single target heavy encounter

crown is a good fight too

[upbeat cradle]

Crown

[modern whale]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[brisk raptor]

@hazy breach if you’re going into a pack with sectech up do you use shuriken storm before you send sectech to apply fazed?

[plush roost]

Maybe next week i try

[hazy breach]

Sectech applies fazed already

And storm would only proc it on your main target anyway (if unseen blade is ready)

[marble sail]

Which feels better so far? (Idc about numbers just feel)

[plush roost]

Couldnt say for assa, only did like 30 minutes of prog on it when sub talents bugged out

Outlaw cranks boss tho

Unleas ur the double trouble bandit

Sub is gud in p3/4

Idk its kindof a play whatever youre most comfy on boss now

[marble sail]

Yeah ive done 1 clear on outlaw and sub, going next as assa

So far outlaw feels best imo, also enjoying the current playstyle

[ashen warren]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1488547832062415010/drop_fixed.png

[gritty crow]

Hello ppl, i am currently pushing 20 keys.
and trying new builds for some dmg amp
As of now i am standing on this
Crit 839 Crit 642
haste 713 Currently trying this new Haste 752
Mastery 884 Mastery 1034

Keep in mind these stats are only affected by oil.

which one you think is best ?

[radiant swift]

are yall playing reckless potion in m+ despite so much mastery? im at like 1050 base and the pot pushes one so much into dr so wondering

[gritty crow]

I am using light potential.

[random mason]

I simmed it and it was neutral on ST for me

And a good amount better for AoE

With ~1200 mastery buffed

[thorny kestrel]

Hey I was told by some random that the guidon trinket pressage 1 sec before shadowdance doesn't matter. Is that true or are we still not trying to press dance right after guidon for deepening shadows to affect dance?

[peak ice]

It matters

[thorny kestrel]

okay thanks!

[hexed wave]

Any guides yall recommend nowadays for sub + assa mage tower?

[keen steppe]

1 key left for 19 res... its tough

sometimes i think i dont press bp hard enough x)

[peak ice]

https://tenor.com/view/the-simpsons-drinking-bird-kmtnewsman-king-size-homer-homer-simpson-gif-15380549810316743156

[keen steppe]

https://tenor.com/view/tense-csgo-cs2-keyboard-smash-gif-15753790563234321070

[peak ice]

What’s ur last 19

[keen steppe]

more like this

seat

[peak ice]

Oh

lol fuck seat

[keen steppe]

close to 3,8 now

i see you @hazy breach in nexus point :D

*i was

[quaint breach]

I had 19 seat as my last as well, last week. took probably 10+ runs before I got it. Hate the 3rd boss

[peak ice]

Legit always lose it on that pull before the 3rd boss

[drifting ether]

Got aa, wish my tank stopped dying p1 😂

[keen steppe]

aa was fine

but seat i hate third boss haha

[peak ice]

Yea no doubt

[quaint breach]

the channel hits so hard I loose focus on the orb bananza, n rip

[peak ice]

The orbs hit so hard too

[quaint breach]

1 shot

[keen steppe]

last boss is fun as sub

[peak ice]

And when they’re like right in the tentacles

rough

[keen steppe]

first boss cavern and second spire its a nightmare

for me

[quaint breach]

1st boss cavern is ez no, spire firebird or duo?

[keen steppe]

duo

its more the damage i do on this bosses

bird is fine

[quaint breach]

spire trash is harder than bosses

[peak ice]

I find the 3rd spire boss to be worse

He just fucks around so much

[hollow spear]

The orb hitbox also feels pretty weirdge

[peak ice]

It’s defo wider than the visual

[hollow spear]

real

[half apex]

Trying Sub for the first time. What poisons should I use in m+ and raids normally?

[warm marlin]

instant/atro raid
instant/numbing m+

[half apex]

Also rotation seems so difficult in paper compared to assa to me as a +10 year assa player xD

[warm marlin]

can swap atro in m+ in higher keys

[half apex]

Ty

[half apex]

Simed my current 280ilvl assa with assa gear on sub and had more st and aoe dps on sub lol so was interested

[sharp bolt]

looking at the notes for this Tuesday, haste will need around 1100 for Deathstalker builds, but how does this change the ratio for crit/mastery?

[hollow spear]

Priority is mastery

[warm marlin]

ds generally likes more mast but getting 1100 haste is hard

so kinda got to take what you can get

[steady sail]

Has anyone else had the interaction when you pre-cloak the dot application on Magister Terrace boss but it still gets applied? I dodged the first one but got hit by the second

[sharp bolt]

I find that odd, since eleem specifically states that the eye's of the eagle enchant shouldn't be replaced. having low crit makes that enchant worse.

[warm marlin]

well dn makes evis a guaranteed crit

so eyes is even better

[alpine wraith]

did you use the 1 sec cloak

[warm marlin]

but crit stat is worse

[hollow spear]

Crit is the worst stat for ds

[steady sail]

1 second cloak?

[alpine wraith]

first second of cloak is stronger and immnes more things

than after

so some things only work on the first second to immune but not after

[steady sail]

ah so maybe I sent too early

should have waited for it to apply and then clear with it to guarantee

did not know that, thanks for the tech

[alpine wraith]

uh well it depends i dont know about that debuff in particular

maybe someone that actually does m+ can tell you

[sharp bolt]

only when the final DS mark is consumed.

[hollow spear]

"only"

DN is incredibly big damage

[peak ice]

Kinda the reason it’s not a dead stat but is less than mastery

[alpine wraith]

it kinda gets equalized by the extra crit dmg

but still crit is not the best yea

[hollow spear]

Cramming two apexed DN into a dance feels so good

[hazy lichen]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[rancid crow]

I’m getting a bug that stops me from casting my second dance after the first one ends while I’m in shadow blades. It also seems to not last as long as it’s supposed to when this happens, and isn’t just a visual bug, because it takes me back to my non stealth hotbar.

Anybody have a fix for this? It’s happening both with addons on and off

[hazy breach]

Wait longer between guidon and dancing

#subtlety-faq message First question here

[rancid crow]

I don’t have guidon yet

[latent remnant]

one key remaining for resi 17, will get before raid tomorrow

[tribal blade]

how exactly does the kicks display work on lura

from NS

[plush roost]

Just puts a box with your order on the side of your screen

If the note is correct

[tribal blade]

does it actually alert you when it's your turn to kick?

[plush roost]

Similar to the old interupt anchor wa

Ye

[tribal blade]

watching some povs but can't see anything

ah ok

[plush roost]

Big airhorn and greenbox

[tribal blade]

ok gotcha

[tribal blade]

oh also got any hot tips for starting lura prog

things you wished you knew before starting

[warm marlin]

do copius amounts of cocaine to stem the misery of p1 prog as a non seed carrier

[ripe flame]

this

[plush roost]

^

[ripe flame]

you are a passenger princess for most of prog

[plush roost]

Its actually just waiting for seed people to figure it out and glaives

[warm marlin]

payphone doing nothing until i watch a seed blow up and get sad

[plush roost]

Glaives arent even hectic anymore

We were theory crafting ways to make the fight fun

[latent remnant]

every time just before next glaives spawn we still call out "watch out for-... oh."

[plush roost]

Gonna play hot potato some time

Where u cant pick your seed back up

And cant drop till next mech

[tribal blade]

lol nice

[latent remnant]

idk about p3 but (as melee) even having seed before then still feels like payphoning

probably a lot worse for rangeds though

[left ledge]

p3 is easy if you know what a triangle is

[latent remnant]

cant wait to get to p3 more than 4-5 times in one raid night

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/666-gif-15907701

Triangle?

[left ledge]

yes that is 5 triangles

[latent remnant]

i did fuck up constellations once tonight because couldnt see one of the stars when they spawned 😔

[tribal blade]

oh shit i built one of these in my house

[lilac stag]

DS buffs gonna take 4 hours.

[lilac stag]

Lura prep getting serious

[tribal blade]

we're worshiping the devil in my house

nbd

[lilac stag]

Nice

if you bored tonight or tomorrow. I need to get a pit in on warrior to spend roll.

[tribal blade]

we start lura today 🙂

but i should be free tomorrow if my arms isn't doing keys

[lilac stag]

Just gonna slowly get gear on it incase rogue doesn’t get a raid buff next tier.

[tribal blade]

surely it happens

[short radish]

never stand behind the boss

only on the sides

[tribal blade]

got it

glaives?

[lilac stag]

Avoid them

[short radish]

also yeah do copius amounts of cocaine and never stop moving around hte boss so youre always watching all angles

no joke one of our prog nights

i put up my stand desk

and my gym playlist

[tribal blade]

haha nice

[short radish]

and absolutely vibed

[lilac stag]

4 scoops of preworkout

https://tenor.com/view/itchy-scratchy-smile-nods-gif-9311277262668528667

[odd quartz]

any good swaps to pick up a bit more ST boss damage but not lose so much aoe or naw

[lilac stag]

Huh

[odd quartz]

like dropping points of the tree to pick up some ST boss damage but not tank aoe too bad

[lilac stag]

We play basically the same exact build in raid as m+ minus PP

You have 1 talent you can “swap”

[odd quartz]

ya i dont wanna drop potent powder .. just seems lacking maybe im just badge .. thats prolly it for sure

[lilac stag]

our ST is cracked in keys

drop puzzle box if you’re have ST issues

[short radish]

you can't eat your cake and have it as well

at most you change your rotation

and press evis for funnel

or something

[fossil forge]

Outlaw gaming!!

[short radish]

you can drop PP

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/getout-gif-16327023334064302194

[short radish]

for any of the other talents

[dreamy needle]

is evasion feint and cloak our only defensives

[short radish]

but its also kinda whatever anyway

[short radish]

cheat death is a 90% DR that doesnt work all the time

👍

[lilac stag]

Only?

[dreamy needle]

😭

[lilac stag]

Don’t forget crimson vial

[fossil forge]

I am blasting though im cncr bad

[short radish]

im also like 85% sure this works on the chains in seat

[tribal blade]

MM interesting

[lilac stag]

Getting beat by Ret. Retire your dice.

[fossil forge]

My first ever law key that wasnt a 10

[short radish]

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/show-me-the-money-gif-gif-8685844190966791089

[fossil forge]

I have 0 clue what im doing sometimes im definitely doing more damage than sub though

[lilac stag]

At least you didn’t come in here complaining about all your one buff rolls. That’s my favorite.

[fossil forge]

i am the double trouble bandit

[plush roost]

Excuse me

[lilac stag]

it interesting seeing people complain about single buffs in keys. Me thinks you maybe doing something slightly wrong.

[plush roost]

Thats my title

[fossil forge]

Just roll natty b2b jackpots..

[plush roost]

U can legit just get fucked sometimes

[fossil forge]

couldnt be me

No uptime no bueno

[plush roost]

Variance gaming

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/gambling-gamble-gambler-old-man-addiction-gif-13539663578305331391

[plush roost]

Just hit lil bro

[fossil forge]

I am also getting much more invites as outlaw somehow

[short radish]

[lilac stag]

You’re not fucking up the warlocks.

[fossil forge]

Am i missing something

[warm marlin]

there are a LOT of phys comp people in queue

[fossil forge]

a crucial information

[plush roost]

Its cause phys comp is legit like half a key level behind meta

[lilac stag]

Somehow they’re trying to blame sub rogues for causing random mob pulls

[plush roost]

But people are too srubborn

[warm marlin]

I honestly think phys is also just easier to play

the smaller pulls seem much easier to execute

[fossil forge]

Wthelly

Phys is very enjoyable also

[plush roost]

Kinda sorta, theres more nuance and cc usage for phys, but the actual raw pull size of meta comp is heavy on your tanks

[lilac stag]

The short version. They never followed up. #subtlety message

[plush roost]

I think dps in meta can borpachat the whole key

[warm marlin]

yeah i mean zac's group does insane tech stuff

and udk in particular is just payphone

[fossil forge]

Interesting

[warm marlin]

you know my play doesnt change at all per keylevel and i dont even notice a difference because you already full immune half the mechanics anyway

[lilac stag]

AMS on CD

[plush roost]

You dont know peril till ur on saprish in a 22 without dwarf up

[fossil forge]

Redclsss lajf

[warm marlin]

i could unbind ibf in these 21s

dont need it

[plush roost]

21s chill ye

[warm marlin]

idk you're either full immuning mechanics or you're just spamming death strike

its chill

[plush roost]

Honestly 22s kinda fine too

[fossil forge]

Dw guys im playing this szn as a maghar orc

[lilac stag]

Unholy is just how every melee should play (range requirement)

[plush roost]

I do think tho you're gonna have to do more and more demanding stuff as phys to time keys that will definitely make it way harder than meta

[fossil forge]

Fatt lura prog today btw 56 pulls in p1 2x intermission and even p2

[plush roost]

Like how rogues can go left in alg and just play an insane lust pull and do lashers without lust

[warm marlin]

i have been finagled into pugging again

like my df days

its a lot less miserable on a hard meta spec lemme say

[fossil forge]

be a man and go pug on rogue

[warm marlin]

I dont even wanna play rogue bro 😭

[fossil forge]

So over man

[lilac stag]

I won’t be sad if we don’t get a raid buff.

red rogue or brown rogue

[short radish]

im getting every melee toon to 90 and ideally 285 ilvl by end of season

[tribal blade]

damn you know it's dire when all the die hard rogues are thinking of swapping

TIME TO MAKE ANOTHER FORUM POST THAT'LL JUST BLOW INTO THE ETHER

[lilac stag]

I just flat out asked if they wanted me to swap off rogue if it doesn’t have a buff

[drifting ether]

Ethical bp? 😂

[earnest bolt]

fuck this

boss

dude

ive never felt so useless b4

[short radish]

we bring a good and meaningful raidbuff

[dusky yacht]

ooooh baby

Lend me some sugar

I am your neighbor

[tribal blade]

are glaives coded as aoe dmg

[short radish]

press feint and test for us

[tribal blade]

SURE THING BUDDY

[dusky yacht]

We can always rely on Prophet

[tribal blade]

i'm gonna die

[gilded ferry]

Be the scientist for this one mate

[fossil forge]

2 ticks u survive

after that kaboom

[gilded ferry]

Is @warm marlin still banished into DK realm

[fossil forge]

Maybe actually like 1,5 ticks

They b hurting

[short radish]

nah im pretty sure ive taken 2 ticks before

when im running throuh it

[lilac stag]

not a banishment, a promotion

[lilac stag]

just wait for s2 3 target cleave fight

[gilded ferry]

dont fool yourself scath, rogue chose us and we love this godforsaken class

[prime glen]

lmao, its true

[lilac stag]

I enjoy sub. Fuck assa. Pirates need Jesus.

[earnest bolt]

surely we get

better cleave

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/no-sleep-agnes-gif-22667021

[fossil forge]

2 things we can Shake hands on

[lilac stag]

And sub is far from perfect, but the vibes are good.

playing UH makes me really miss acrobatic

[dusky yacht]

Shirley

[short radish]

i sure love how blizzard decided that they didnt want melee classes to be able to play from ranged

and then make the entire uhdk rotation ranged

[lilac stag]

Copilot is a hell of a dev

[warm marlin]

i went willingly

[hardy charm]

Undusting my old sub rogue ive not used since late DF, how is it doing for the next patch in pve/pvp?

[shrewd lantern]

Let's ask the crystal ball.

[hardy charm]

thats either very good news, or a terrible omen

[shrewd lantern]

Who would know for next patch?

Not like sub is ever bad in pvp though.

Toolkit is too good.

[hardy charm]

-# excellent >:)

[shrewd lantern]

I mean when is rmp ever not good?

[hardy charm]

Glad to hear its still pretty good

[shrewd lantern]

Comp has been s tier since bc.

With the odd shift to rmd or rmpal

[hardy charm]

Not to sound old but, what the rmd and rmpal stand for again?

[shrewd lantern]

there's only one healer that starts with d

[hardy charm]

ah the arena team comp ofc...

staying off rogue for years has made me dumber

[shrewd lantern]

Well yeah thats where pvp balance matters.

3v3

[ruby sun]

is the deathstalker rotation the same as trickster rotation?

[heady tangle]

anyone got an ideal build that meets the haste requirement for deathstalker? 1100 is wicked i have 699 exactly lol

[jagged hamlet]

recraft of boots/bracer/helm for just pure haste or getting an alleria neck or lura ring

the engi aetherloom (sp?) pieces can be single statted and thats what i did + flask

[earnest bolt]

u dance at low cp as DS

[surreal orbit]

DS about to rip

[jagged hamlet]

how you all handling 2nd dance in shadowblades?

just sending immediately? or lining up a DN with supercharger/apex?

[steady osprey]

Pretty much, but the optimization for AA and Darkest Night is especially important for DS to work. That's the only major difference - it's a modest improvement to worry about it for trickster, but it's completely necessary for DS. In short, avoid sending DN without AA procced in most circumstances.

Also, if you have two supercharged combo points entering dance and you have both DN with AA and sectech available, send DN first.

[jagged hamlet]

think guide could probably be more clear about that

thank you

[steady osprey]

You are very welcome!

[jagged hamlet]

and yeah i just kinda assumed that would be the play, ngl its hard to get used to switching burst windows around but it feels.. fun? to play around with the mark and optimizing, rotating it etc

idk

but i also prob need to set up some reminder shit if i havnet transferred

[steady osprey]

It's much more fun than Trickster, I agree with you. There's more plates to spin and more places to make little mistakes, but when it works it feels great. Haste is especially important for DS, I should mention. The way it works didn't start lining up well until I got to around 1100, which is honestly not that hard to do. With 700-800 haste like in trickster, playing DS almost feels like you have a weird perma-lag for some reason.

[shrewd lantern]

I mean trickster gets cdr on sectech.

That's the entire reason DS goes for more haste.

[steady osprey]

One thing that really helped me with the AA procs, by the way, is going into cooldown manager and putting a cooldown bar under my character when it procs instead of relying on the smoke clouds on the sides of the character. That can be really hard to see when shit hits the fan.

That's certainly true, but I feel like it also helps you line up DNs between the first dance and entering the second dance during the blades window, especially since DN gets priority over sectech in DS.

[shrewd lantern]

pretty sure you still blades the same

Most of this is severely overthinking it

the core difference is ds dances at low points

compared to instantly ripping sectech

[steady osprey]

Would you consider sending DN only with AA overthinking it?

[shrewd lantern]

I mean the apex just kind of naturally happens

....not that I'd play DS on more than one boss

anyway

[steady osprey]

I assure you it does not. Very often, you have to SS multiple times to proc it.

[shrewd lantern]

Then you weren't pooling stech

That's kind of on you for continuing to build spend with sectech coming off soon.

[steady osprey]

I'm not sure I follow. What would be your advice for the other 18 seconds in which sectech is on cool down after being used?

[shrewd lantern]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  If all of the above are true, use cast a Shadowstrike / Shuriken Storm (even if on full cp).

[shrewd lantern]

you just replaced supercharged with dn

its not more load really

[steady osprey]

This information has already been covered. My question to you is: how else you going to generate sht stacks without shadowstriking multiple times before the 2 second or so pool before sending a sec tech immediately off cooldown?

[shrewd lantern]

You pooled before going into blades

or rather into dance

you get a gorillion shadowtech during dances

[steady osprey]

I see. I'm not trying to argue, I'm genuinely interested in learning now to play DS better. I appreciate the advice.

[shrewd lantern]

have fun its only good on one boss

I mean not doing finishers before sectech is up has been a thing for awhile now

[dire jolt]

I think the apex is fun

[shrewd lantern]

I might bite the bullet and play DS on vora but realistically I might fuck around with outlaw on that boss.

already have my 99 on sub anyway

and sub getting stale

anyway

[dire jolt]

once you get the idea that you can add to your stored CPs to not cap energy while waiting for sec tec or coup it's nice QoL right?

[shrewd lantern]

maybe i go for the trinity and get a 99 on all 3 specs for the boss

[shrewd lantern]

apex is just they nerfed shadowcraft

and packed it into a "new" talent.

[steady osprey]

I'd be very impressed to see it happen on assassination!

[shrewd lantern]

lmfao

I mean, assa isnt even bad

LMAO

[dire jolt]

I mean there's a few tier sets/hero talents like that

[shrewd lantern]

People will unironically say assa is bad

[dire jolt]

I can't believe that once again Prot Warrior's tier set is something they had by default before

[shrewd lantern]

with a straight face

[steady osprey]

I never said it was, graf. You can relax.

[shrewd lantern]

No i mean community unironically thinks that

its funny

People will raid wr 800 and say assa is unviable

actual clown world

I'd probably play outlaw on windchime but i was too lazy to learn the nuances for a real boss.

And i can autopilot playing sub.

[rose trout]

Hey everyone! This is my first time playing rogue since s1 of DF. If anyone could give me some tips on my mythic rotation it would be great appreciated

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qDBLZMW8dRj1HJxQ?fight=7&type=damage-done&source=4

[shrewd lantern]

read #subtlety-faq

and the guide

[mossy mauve]

is it normal for my raidbots sim to cast a single shuriken storm on 5min patchwerk?

link: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/t4SvogQNqJxwVqUnubQNp1

[supple pawn]

around about how many weeks should we have of season once 12.0.7 drops?

[warm marlin]

yes

second dance in blades, you want to dance last 8s of blades

if you dont have cp you can dance/storm macro

[mossy mauve]

Why not SS?

[warm marlin]

stance delay means it takes about .2s for you to be able to cast strike

storm is instant

you do have long enough dances in guidon that you can just eat the delay but meh

[short radish]

4 or 8*

blizzard have been trying to do 4 week patch cycles but given the diaster of 12.0.5 they might not continue

.7 already been delayed 2 more weeks

[shrewd lantern]

ask copilot

if it should be still 4

[tribal blade]

how tf did i have a blades on pull on lura where strike didn't gen full CPs

[dire jolt]

there's no evidence of that

If anything it's more likely 12.1 is gonna stick to the 8 week cadence to give room for the race before Blizzcon

[short radish]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/turbulent-timeways-dates-changed-on-ptr-381707

i mean could be wrong

[dire jolt]

That's Timeways. Timeways frequently don't start on patch drops

[short radish]

past performance isnt an indicator of future performance

but th eyve been a decent indicator

of patch cadence

[dire jolt]

that change also changed the end date of timeways to 8/11 from 8/25

I mean it's possible they do a 6 week 12.0.7 but eh?

why make people accuse them of rushing 12.1

[short radish]

so they dont release a patch filled with bugs galore

so bad they apologised on multiple wow forums and discords

[dire jolt]

Wowhead is pushing a narrative on stuff so for some reason they ignored the fact the same change they're using for a "delay" is also showing they're "speeding up" 12.1

[supple pawn]

Thank you. Just trying to plan end of season pushes and such

I'm probably going to be levelling characters during turbulent timeways so I'll need to have my main done PvP wise

And probably M+ close to done too

[dire jolt]

Regardless they're already starting their content previews for 12.0.7 and 12.0.7 is in "spring" for the roadmap and has updates for Midsummer and a new event currently scheduled to start on 6/27. So yeah, I'm not jumping on a 6/30 patch date until proven otherwise.

[short radish]

good to know they're sticking to their plan of releasing bug slop then

idk who the fuck is asking for faster cadance

i know there's some "hurr durr end of patch nothing to do"

but holy shit these patches have gone so fast

[dire jolt]

this is the exact same cadence we've had since 10.0?

going on 3 years now

[short radish]

is it?

feels like 1-2 weeks faster

[dire jolt]

yes, Dragonflight started the 8 week cadence

[tribal blade]

intermission 1 on 1st day of lura prog

these P1 nerfs must have been huge

[supple pawn]

Big

[short radish]

maybe its all the gear that's been thrown at us

that feels so much quicker

[dire jolt]

the only difference between TWW and DF is DF had a longer x.2 patch that included the awakened s4

[tribal blade]

TRUE

[supple pawn]

Ikr? I feel the exact same

[tribal blade]

yeah prenerf there would be no way we hit int 1 on day 1

[supple pawn]

But I wonder if maybe it's because I do PvP and PvE

[short radish]

like okay yeah sure the patchs are coming out at the same speed, maybe 1 week quicker than usual

[supple pawn]

Whereas most people don't do PvP at qll

[short radish]

but there's been so much mid patch shit

[short radish]

theyre kinda massive

[dire jolt]

If I was a betting man I'd bet on Aug 18th for season 2 right now.

Which gives about 3 weeks before people need to travel for Blizzcon

[supple pawn]

Who's ready for 10.2 to take place in the Shadowlands for some reason

[short radish]

CANT WAIT TO GO BACK TO THE MAW

[supple pawn]

I wouldn't be so upset about Val and Naigtal being new zones if they were expanded on

But the way we're getting them looks like

[short radish]

wtf is val and naigtal

[supple pawn]

"we need new shit but we dont have time to do new shit"

[supple pawn]

The 12.0.7 showdown zones

[short radish]

ah

[supple pawn]

They were previously invasion points in legion

From 7.3

[short radish]

i'll be honest. i shit on blizzard for a lot of things

[dire jolt]

I mean the maps are updated pretty extensively for a x.x.7 patch.

[short radish]

but reusing old content isn't one

[dire jolt]

It's not even reusing old content. They are new zones

[short radish]

like i kinda feel bad for all the map and world designers

who go into all the effort for the world to be ignored by 80% of the players after week 3

[supple pawn]

Another issue I have with recent expansions is the absence of .3 patches. I feel like the previous two expansions would've felt better with more time to flesh out the story

[supple pawn]

Oh really? That's good to hear then

My issue isn't necessarily reusing old content

It's just it feels like they're doing it explicitly because of time contraints

[short radish]

tbh we kinda had that with the weekly release

of the timegated raid story

[dire jolt]

Maybe you can gripe about it reusing existing zone textures and assets, but they're put together in a new way.

[supple pawn]

That's fsir

I guess the main issue is moreso the disconnected patches? Question mark?

[short radish]

we've had a .3 patch in all but in name

with voidcores also thrown at us

[supple pawn]

Like aberrus or next patch were getting troll stuff now

[short radish]

weekly story release

idk if ritual sites contributed to teh story as well

but thats also .5 isnt it?

ive done 0 of them except running t1 for 2 hours on that singular day of hel

[supple pawn]

I meant .3 like 7.3 or 8.3 lol

Not 12.0.5

[short radish]

oh right

[supple pawn]

I understand why they did it for SL

And WoD

[dire jolt]

The last .3 patch was BfA, but Blizzard clearly likes the 3 tier and done expansions so far as they joked during one of the Time Rifts quests in 10.1.5 that a good story has 3 parts.

more than anything, Legion and BfA were the exceptions rather than the norm at this point.

Cata and MoP only had 3 raid tiers.

[supple pawn]

TBF I started in legion so that's what I'm used to x3

[short radish]

yeah and i distinctively remembering everyone hating farming DS/MoP for basically a year

[dire jolt]

Well we haven't had that type of downtime in years.

[short radish]

yeah i get why they do the fated seasons

i just dont like it

[short radish]

^ i know i said this but like

reusing old content that hasnt been touched in a decade

vs doing some old content i did a year ago

or the exact same raid i did a month ago

is no bueno

[supple pawn]

Fated tiers should have legacy raids

Like sure, scale current expansion raids to heroic if you want

It is supposed to be a sort of fuck around season anyways

[short radish]

i think my biggest gripe of fated raids is that it's not consistent

[supple pawn]

But like Legion and earlier raids are definitely old enough to be brought back

[west tide]

i love woww

[short radish]

as a parse monkey it really fucks with me when i need adjust every week

[dire jolt]

Are y'all ready for the fact we'll probably be nearing 13.0 prepatch this time next year?

[west tide]

we did the glory achieves for this tier they werent so bad!

[shrewd lantern]

Going to any gaming event irl is a mistake.

So many of you mfs don't know how to take a shower.

[tribal blade]

what is a show wer

[shrewd lantern]

Ok in asia it ain bad tbh

besides the odd uncle

[tribal blade]

lol i would say it's worse in HK

so hot and humid

stinky armpits

[shrewd lantern]

I MEAN....

i'd say a joke but i might get uhh

actioned for

funni

[tribal blade]

HAHA

well at least in HK

every single room has AC

without fail

[shrewd lantern]

Oh i'm aware

thank god my place there is by the water

[tribal blade]

nice nice

where at

[shrewd lantern]

repulse bay ish

[tribal blade]

ohhh ok nice

i haven't been down there in a while

but when i was younger i had a bunch of friends who lived down there

[shadow snow]

!logs

[tribal blade]

i actually kinda miss repulse bay, the beach there is dope

[shrewd lantern]

Oh yeah not much to do there.

[tribal blade]

i think there's that big shopping complex

and that's it

[shrewd lantern]

It's HK you know all the girls avoid the sun

[tribal blade]

and the beach

[shrewd lantern]

like its a plague

[tribal blade]

LOL true

[shrewd lantern]

let's be real

[tribal blade]

but all the westernized chinese girls go out in the sun

[supple pawn]

My personal idea for Fated would be that all current expansion raids are available on heroic/normal, with their respective tier sets available. Then a legacy raid is available on LFR/N/H/M, and drops curios that can be exchange for any other raid tier set. And specifically for the fated season, I'd add cloak tier pieces for each tier set

[shrewd lantern]

I mean....

Idk how many there are nowadays

[supple pawn]

There's a reason I don't get hired to blizzard

My ideas are too fire

[shrewd lantern]

My mom says alot about those type of people.

None of it is positive.

[tribal blade]

haha i know a lot of those people

[shrewd lantern]

harbour city has better malls anyway

[tribal blade]

IT DOES

harbour city is so massive

[supple pawn]

is harbour city city sized

or harbour sized

[tribal blade]

lemee see

it's freaking massive

like you can legit spend all day in there

and walking through it is like walking through a mini indoors city

[shrewd lantern]

I mean I have

[tribal blade]

yeah me and my ex used to go there a lot

also just outside there you have so many people milling around

you have the indian/pakistani guys advertising bespoke suit stores

you have the falun gong people protesting mainland china

all the tourists

HK is amazing for people watching

[shrewd lantern]

Me watching the western tourist.

Thinking speaking mandarin is going to give them brownie points.

And not stink eye from old people.

[tribal blade]

HAHA

yeah hearing westerners trying to speak canto or mandarin

is so cringe

[summer peak]

Guys trying to understand DS min maxes, if we wana go into SD with low CP, how would we have ST stacks (for Apex conditions)?

Are we not spending prior to going into dance

[shadow snow]

i posted some logs to review guys https://discord.com/channels/124169701881282560/1508337772375834634

please help cause i do bad dps 🙁

[tribal blade]

ideally it would be have 1 mark>build to full CP>afk till 5 sht>evis>dance+DN

[short radish]

knee how ma

[tribal blade]

HEN HAO

NI NE

[short radish]

share share

[tribal blade]

sheeye sheeye

[shrewd lantern]

theres phrases besides hak gwei?

[tribal blade]

LOL true

[tall girder]

Woo fimb woo prophet

[tribal blade]

WOO

[short radish]

woooo jontic

[tall girder]

Actual lura prog today

I’m actually gonna have to look at stuff before prog gg

[supple pawn]

damn i think thats bigger than my dad

[tribal blade]

sheeesh how big is your dad

[supple pawn]

like 2 meters tall at least

[tribal blade]

that's pretty tall!

[amber berry]

Sub rogue buffs do we swap to deathstalker or we still on trickster ?

[shrewd lantern]

All the buff does is make it more tempting on vorasius

to take the risk of being parried

[short radish]

hold strong

hold firm

do not give in

[shrewd lantern]

im doing ethical crystal damage

why would i play DS

[short radish]

crystals need to die

theyre the wipe condition

boss dps isnt important

[shrewd lantern]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-high-five-high-five-gif-gif-11749178764953808365

[short radish]

🤝

[vagrant fossil]

I mean, as you guys get more comfortable they will die a lot easier and some can swap to more ST oriented for the P3 burn

[lone girder]

Hi guys
I main outlaw but wanted to try sub for prog with the guild a bit, to try to apport a more "steady" damage profile, but when i sim myself i do -10k dmg with sub..idk what rolls are considered jn the sim for outlaw toh
I dont have guidon (that sims worse for some reason) and I tried simming with around 700 800 700 stats or around that
This could be related to stats?

And are there any vods of good subs in the raid?
Beside shindig i didnt find much on yt

[tribal blade]

sim number doesn't really matter tbh, it's more what is actually achievable during a fight

[lone girder]

Hence why i was asking for vods, since i've never played it pretty much

Rotation looks fine

[tribal blade]

i'm confused you were asking for outlaw vods

[lone girder]

I tried some dummy testing but my dps is shiet

[tribal blade]

did you mix up the spec names

[lone girder]

No sorry, was asking for sub
I main outlaw but I want to try sub for raid
I wrote wrong

Im a monkey

[tribal blade]

np!

[lone girder]

Now i changed the messagge haha

[tribal blade]

https://www.youtube.com/@Stealthi/videos

this is stealthi

he hasn't uploaded much though

if you want to see for specific fights you can just type "sub rogue <encounter name>"

and you'll see results of decently good sub rogues

[lone girder]

Tyvm, very appreciated

[hollow spear]

Stealthi is an omega slacker when it comes to streaming

[alpine wraith]

i do stream prog and others too

but idk if you would learn a lot if you dont know the basics

[lone girder]

I mean..the spec basics seem easy, as pretty much all other specs do this season (rotation wise ofc)
When it comes to minmaxing or being attually good at the game its another whole story

I am but a newb going for 19s and at Vaelgor with guild, so u can guess there's lot to learn

Sorry for improper english but its not my main language so i might miss-spell some stuff

[alpine wraith]

dont worry you are in luck sub is that hard right now so it wont take long

only annoying one to learn is DS and not even

[hollow spear]

The thing that was the hardest in ds was the "just one more evis, bro"

[alpine wraith]

i mean it will get a bit getting used to cancel apex or to stop stabbing and wait

people do like pressing buttons

[lone girder]

I do

[hollow spear]

I krangled so many dance windows by doing that

I'm still not entirely sure what the point of cancelling apex is

[lone girder]

Expecially since i main outlaw, i can't imagine a life where in 30 min of M+ I dont get cramps in my hand

[alpine wraith]

it is to not get a refund on the evis before dance

otherwise you fill cps again

and cant dance storm to kill premed

maybe i do an updated video today about DS

some things have changed

[lone girder]

Btw i'll watch ur videos too, to get a grasp!
Tyvm

[upbeat cradle]

Is it a big dps loss to just send another evi and empty CPs before dance ?

[alpine wraith]

well i dont really know how much of a loss it is but you may lose another apexed DN evis so yea

oh i also forgot you want to have 1 mark before the dance

if you already kinda messed that one up it is whatever

[hollow spear]

You could technically storm at max cp with dn up, but that's obviously not optimal

[fiery summit]

so im at 1100 haste with DS - am i not meant to be able to fit 2 sectec's into blades? i seem to be like a second off

[hollow spear]

I had the same problem

Don't send and do another dance right after blades

[upbeat cradle]

Sectec doesn't consumes the mark right ?

[alpine wraith]

DS is more spread over 4 dances in 50 seconds or so

than 2 dances

sec tech does pop 1 mark

mainly because lingering darkness is also quite a buff

[upbeat cradle]

oh right so 1 mark, SD storm Sectech strike DN/apex Evi ?

[alpine wraith]

well it is having 1 mark and full cp

cancel apex if it is procced then evis

then dance storm to apex and supercharge the DN evis

then strike etc as always

[upbeat cradle]

oh you don't supercharge sectec ?

[alpine wraith]

supercharge last 2 finishers

so you do supercharge sec tech

[upbeat cradle]

oh right i see what you wrote

you mean proccing DN before the dance

so you go into dance with

DN up

Apex

[alpine wraith]

yes

[upbeat cradle]

and do DN evi

then sectech

[alpine wraith]

1 thing you need to be aware is quietus procs in dance tho

they may make things a bit annoying

[drifting ether]

Finally

[upbeat cradle]

is it worth delaying sectec and dance a bit to make sure the evi in dance is always DN ?

[fiery summit]

tbh DS is doing my head in, trickster is so ingrained into my brain im struggling to make the DS adjustments

might just take the dps loss and stay trickster lmao

[dreamy root]

dw its propoganda, until the top logs are filled with DS, its fake news 🫡

[marble sail]

[upbeat cradle]

Same I became smorc since midnight

[neat jackal]

Hey guys im a returning sub rogue..where do i start to learn everything there is to know ? wowhead guide and then reading here? Also if there is a guide on youtube i can watch i would appreaciate if somebody can help

[alpine wraith]

there are several written guides yea wowhead is one of those

[bronze turret]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lilac stag]

#subtlety-faq & @alpine wraith likely has the only current sub video guides on his YT channel.

[hollow spear]

Haven't checked Hacha's latest videos, is your UI back to being as scuffed as it used to be during TWW?

[hazy breach]

No

You just hold it for the dance after blades (which should be right away)

[fiery summit]

ah ok ty ty

[peak ice]

Anyone here use nsrt on lura and can give me a bit of a steer

might be a wowgeneral question

[sly shore]

oi do we still black powder on 2 targets if potent powder talented

tooltip error

[lilac stag]

@hazy breach has any sim work been done with the cancel aura shenanigans and to see how much of a loss it is if you go into dance with single mark and full cp. Hopefully I wrote this out correctly. Too early.

[daring raptor]

What cancelaura macro do we need to use ?

[hazy breach]

It doesnt matter

[lilac stag]

as in neutral

[hazy breach]

As in backstabbing once or twice extra at full cp is irrelevant

[lilac stag]

gotcha

Was curious how much we are trying to over complicate things

[hollow spear]

So basically we can just afk for a bit and let energy overcap

Is how I understand this?

If we're at full cp and one stack

[hazy breach]

Most of the time you dont even need to, as you'd want to evis once you hit 5 sht anyway

[lilac stag]

I feel like is going to if/then scenario post to eliminate confusion for most people

we’ve all been patterned trained for full cp + a couple sht and dance + Sectech

[hollow spear]

Took me a long time on the dummy and joining heroic pugs to reprogram my muscle memory

I still sometimes go into my blade window with sectec first even though I had prepared a dn

[daring raptor]

So how many stacks do we need before going into dance? 5? and then we start with SS?

[hollow spear]

You have one mark stack, 5 sht stacks (can probably get away with 4, but it's a gamble). Then you evis - dance + storm - evis (dn)

I tend to skip apexing the sectec, not sure if that's int

[lilac stag]

Im curious too if there’s a gain for getting more than 5 sht and where that cutoff is

[daring raptor]

do we really need to be on 1 mark stack?
Impossible to always have it like that

[hazy breach]

It naturally lines up like that most of the time outside cds, so you want to get back to that rotation everytime

[daring raptor]

Gonna be so weird have to stack shadowdance with a shuriken

[earnest crane]

is there any info about 12.0.7?

[hazy breach]

New boss coming out, thats about it

[earnest crane]

i mean tunning

[hollow spear]

It feels a bit unintuitive to hold for so long to be honest, but if you think about the damage you lose by messing up your dance window (i.e. starting with two marks) versus the damage you gain from one or two eviscerates outside of dance, it kinda makes sense.

[earnest crane]

and class change

[hollow spear]

There's no info

[hazy breach]

I wouldnt expect any either

But there might be

[hollow spear]

I'm hoping for no tuning changes

[earnest crane]

as long as i remember meta comp is hard to change mostly whole expansion so i wish there will be no tunning cuz i m ok with current rogue state

[lilac stag]

this is where sub tends to end up each tier. Starts strong, gets gapped. Gets some tuning. Still strong on last bosses. Still good in keys. No utility.

[earnest crane]

self defence is a utility

[fiery summit]

explain to me like im 4 what the storm cast is for with DS

[lilac stag]

It’s not.

[earnest crane]

i count on it

[lilac stag]

only class that is dog shit survivability is mage

[hollow spear]

It's all relative. Uhdk has better survivability and utility.

[earnest crane]

really?

[lilac stag]

dk literally does everything better than rogue

except misdirect

[earnest crane]

we have better dps than dk off cd

[void ocean]

it sux in stealth

[hollow spear]

To prepare an apexed dn. You would strike if it didn't have the 200 ms delay.

[lilac stag]

So does ours with the trusight every mob in a key

[hazy breach]

#subtlety-faq message

[shadow lance]

That man is true

[fiery summit]

ahh right ok ty

[earnest crane]

i dont know whats the point of stealth if every thing gonna have true sight

[hollow spear]

I hate the strike delay so much

[hazy breach]

But also, with the DS storm talent getting buffed its probably worth it anyway

With danse

[earnest crane]

we dont gain much dmg like past from it

[hollow spear]

Oh, didn't even consider that

[hazy breach]

And it also preserves your unshakable stacks

So your next strike hits with 2 stacks

[fiery summit]

so i can just use the SD/Storm macro every time?

[hazy breach]

YEs

[fiery summit]

sweet ty

[shadow lance]

How big is the gain to SC a DN evisc?

[hollow spear]

Massive

[hazy breach]

Its ~43% more damage than a regular 7 cp DN

[shadow lance]

Wait wat

[hollow spear]

We alway apex dn during dance (if we can)