subtlety

[swift tinsel]

and a billion reroll cores by now

[empty bobcat]

can you immune the debuff on 1st boss skyreach that spawns the thing and kicks u back?

[small sleet]

Yes

[solar glen]

Just shadowstep it

[small sleet]

You can also eat the cloud that stays behind to get rid of it after you cloak it

[empty bobcat]

like after u get kicked? when I do I sometimes land in sh*t and get bounced around xD

[lucid jackal]

This is 2 heroic "boost" run

[solar glen]

You have to watch in intermission xD

[lucid jackal]

2 resets

[empty bobcat]

that sounds awesome

so like I just cloak it then stand still so I can literally stay at boss right?

[pale ravine]

Hi guys, Does ST 2/3 tick hit all the mobs that were hit at the first hit.
Or does it calculate dynamically for the position ST was cast at, just 0,5&1 sec later?

[small sleet]

Yeah if I have cloak up I just stay in melee and clear the cloud

[warm marlin]

the clones cleave in a radius based on the center of the targetted mob's hitbox .6 and 1.2s later

[brisk raptor]

!haste

[wicked jolt]

Secret Techniques cooldown gets reduced by all haste sources, while Shadow Dances duration only gets increased by Haste Rating from gear or consumables. When using an on-use haste trinket, make sure to use it a bit before Shadow Dance to get the extended duration.
The recommended ~700 haste gives you two additional globals in Shadow Dance and Guidon will grant one extra on top of that.

[pale ravine]

But what if the mob moves further then the size of that radius in those .6/1.2 seconds?

[brisk raptor]

Is 681 haste enough or should I gem to be here 700? I have a heroic guidon

[warm marlin]

it follows the mob, and the cleave radius moves (maybe i elaborate better. you press the sectec button, and an initial weak physical hit cleaves around the player. 0.6s later, wherever the targetted mob has gone, a clone will perform a strong cleave attack as shadow damage in a radius around the center of the target. the same thing happens after 1.2s)

if you press it on a mob that then jumps out of the pack very sad

[warm marlin]

700 is an approximation of 684 which is a somewhat arbitrary number that just means you have a fair amount of time to hit buttons so 681 should be fine

[small sleet]

681 is enough most likely, but the way to test it is to hit a target dummy and make sure you always are able to get 8 gcds in each dance

[brisk raptor]

Ty

[hollow spear]

oh baby

[keen dome]

damn

that's impressive

[graceful osprey]

Holy, M+ god

[vale pine]

nicu, perfect

[pale ravine]

Hmmm, that my invalidate my theory why ST, rather often (every 5th try or so), only hits once or twice. And i also found logs where it hits different targets (like salhadaar-> salhadaar->orb only)

[warm marlin]

do you have a log link

I think at times in the past if a mob moved far enough it could dodge one of the clones but iirc those were fixed

[swift tinsel]

There was a Lura log that had funny Sectech business yesterday

[golden totem]

doest crit/mastery balance vary a lot from trickster to ds ? like idk crit getting mroe value cause precise killer or something

[vale pine]

na, you are usually good off by just using whatever of the two you have

mastery typically a bit better than crit

vers you don't rly want

[brisk raptor]

In M+ do you want more mastery typically than raid?

[pale ravine]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KzgY6FVcPZdrfM27?type=damage-done&fight=27&source=721&view=events
Here i had only one hit at pull

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/f8GqyrTMcCgvLXx2?fight=16&type=summary&view=events&start=3720198&end=3982461&source=623
Here at 30sec i had a mix of different mobs hit despite targeting salhadaar.

[warm marlin]

3 sectec casts and you only hit lura with 2 total shadow clones

nice spell

well ig the 40s one did spawn 2 clones but it was in the down phase

but still your first sectec spawned 0 clones and the second sectec only spawned one

nvm im cooked

it was only the first one

apex making these things more annoying to read

[pulsar flame]

is there more bugs then this one?

[swift tinsel]

Sectech bugs just pile up

[pulsar flame]

so no more talent bugs?

[swift tinsel]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[swift tinsel]

Many talent bugs

[warm marlin]

from what i can tell its almost 100% that the boss is moving fast enough to dodge clones sometimes

[swift tinsel]

Rik Reverb speed

[warm marlin]

it looks like it happens a lot less to the other rogue who is the logger here but it does still happen to him too

@hazy breach did they not fix this

[torpid echo]

This seems to happen to my logs a lot. There's always like 2-3 ppl that logs in my guild and all of them have different outcomes for my damage for some reason x)

[warm marlin]

if the logger is more than 100m away or in a different phase (like chim, lura) your akaari's soul clones wont attribute to you

so you do generally need to log yourself on sub

but the stuff that guy linked its not hitting at all

i suspect some version control stuff since akaari can also be parried now from some logs i saw

which was also fixed before

[pulsar hemlock]

New bugs and old bugs

[brisk raptor]

Most people using lights potential potion? Or still best to sim it?

[pulsar hemlock]

Reck for mastery on aoe, lights pot on ST

[random mason]

huge recklessness stonks on ST for me actually

[pale ravine]

If i would have dodges i would have seen the shadowclones at least cast but they didn't.
Or i would have seen a missing shadowclones number.
I also have seen logs where the number was going from 15,85,16

[warm marlin]

ye i mean they just arent casting because it moved far enough away

which i believe was fixed in war within

but obv not if its happening now

[swift tinsel]

did we get version diff'd again

[warm marlin]

i mean this also certainly shouldnt be possible

[random mason]

they just ask AI to fix it unlucky

[swift tinsel]

right parrying something like the ability that grants fazed

[pliant pendant]

Do we drop the wep embelishment ?

[swift tinsel]

very odd

[random mason]

you can if you have 2 myth track daggers

[hushed pendant]

Can anyone riddle me this; why do some folks seem to be taking improved wound poison for pve?

[random mason]

just gotta grab another linen

[swift tinsel]

realz there's a problem with sectech again 🙁

[random mason]

healing mobs in M+

[swift tinsel]

please advise

[hushed pendant]

so very situational, rgr

ty

[keen dome]

dwagons got hands, damn

[spring trellis]

How would this macro look like?

[vale pine]

/cast dance
/cast blades
/cast secret
(replace abbreviations with the ability names)

[spring trellis]

ty

I thought that we would want to case blades before dance?

[pale ravine]

I rather have parries by standing at tank then ST being out of range especially at lura, which moves a lot in p1.
Will investigate further.

[swift tinsel]

all the more reason to make sectech one big hit

can keep the clone animations for visual flair

[small sleet]

There are quite a few healing mobs in dungeons this season, and instant poison is worth hardly any damage, so any dungeon with a healing mob wound poison automatically becomes better

I wouldn’t really classify it as situational, but more dungeon specific. Off the top of my head, wound poison is better than instant poison in skyreach, algethar, maisara, nexus point, magisters terrace, and seat

[warm marlin]

you can also just hotswap them before the relevant pull

so long as you have the talents

[weak horizon]

Is the thing about having 700 haste is good with guidons? but 800 haste otherwise

still a thing?

well that's a dumb question, its probably still a thing, i just mean if those numbers are correct

[keen dome]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1502605720099749898/image.png

[keen dome]

Still a thing

[random mason]

wtf is healing is skyreach

[small sleet]

The solar orbs heal every mob around them every time they pulse

If a single pulse goes off wound poison gets more value than instant poison even if you sit wound poison for the whole dungeon

[fossil forge]

wtf parsehack this reclear ?

[mighty citrus]

clever move to not play paladins 😄

[fossil forge]

Hopefully its ded this time ..

[random mason]

guess I'm just running wound perma now

[graceful rock]

Average beloren experience

[lean bone]

hey guys, did blizz kill m33kauras?

[hazy breach]

I thought they did

But seems like not

[random mason]

I think they just pushed old code again or something

[hazy breach]

Also sectech can be parried even as trickster

[sullen hare]

blizzard does not give a fuck about us

[warm marlin]

ye i liked that below as further evidence that some kind of version control incident happened

[small sleet]

Clones forgot to put fazed on the boss :/

[near herald]

how to get good log on paladins mythic?

[warm marlin]

maybe the akaari parry thing wasnt the fazed change at all but rather an akaari incident

[solar glen]

Just go bench

[random mason]

play a not yellow class

[solar glen]

I hate paladins

[sullen hare]

https://tenor.com/view/you-don't-invincible-omni-man-jk-simmons-that's-the-neat-thing-gif-4390372980992221432

[hazy breach]

I think the sectech thing is after they removed it being raidwide

[near herald]

3 target shurikan right?

[vale pine]

outside of dance 2

during dance 4

[near herald]

spam power and the other thingy macro

powder at 2 targets

[vale pine]

yes

[near herald]

aight am doing it right

xD

[vale pine]

with potent powder (and a decent amount of mastery)

[near herald]

1200

[vale pine]

more than enough ^^

[near herald]

aight ill give my best

[timid rose]

Parry just needs to be deleted from the game. Melee is already punished enough

[graceful osprey]

Blizzard brings back hit rating and expertise lol

[hazy breach]

I proposed we re-introduced resists at 3% for ranged too last raid

[swift tinsel]

yes please

[hazy breach]

So blizzard realizes how dumb it is

[swift tinsel]

its just a stupid vestigial system

should have left with hit/expertise removal

[vale pine]

i don't think suggesting something that makes ranged worse is anything taken as feedback

just from experience

[swift tinsel]

and the moment they specifically whitelist abilities against being parried like Colossus Smash and Kingsbane that's just indicative of it being stupid

[vale pine]

however, if melee dps life can be made worse, thats a diffrent topic

how about reducing melee range from 5 to 3 yards?

[swift tinsel]

that's a design goal*

[swift tinsel]

make melee range scale with weapon length

[vale pine]

maybe also reduce aoe range from the typical 8-10

to 3-5

[swift tinsel]

daggers 1 yard, polearms 8 yards

[vale pine]

because, you know, melees have it too easy

[swift tinsel]

storm now has a 30 yard range

[vale pine]

XD

[graceful osprey]

I mean….I don’t mind that

[swift tinsel]

you don't until you do

when you pull an entire circle around you

360 degree cast range

[graceful osprey]

Make secret tech hit everything in 30 yrd range too

[swift tinsel]

nah make it get parried harder

[calm wing]

you trying to get hired at blizz?

[swift tinsel]

fuck it we ball

[vale pine]

(btw. if it's not obvious, i am joking)

[swift tinsel]

nope its gospel now

too late!

[calm wing]

someone quote them

[swift tinsel]

idk it is very very annoying that melee has to contend with parry when range does not have an analog to that

esp when there's often/always a boss that cannot be attacked from behind

[spiral pewter]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[half sail]

Those bosses are coded to not parry, right? Like vorasius?

[random mason]

surely they are

[half sail]

Always have fun asking the guild where the chandelier's asshole is.

[hazy breach]

Yes those bosses generally cant parry

But theres a lot of bosses where you technically can stand behind, but the strat doesnt allow you to

And some dungeon bosses can parry too

[swift tinsel]

pretty sure p1 dimmy could parry

[hazy breach]

Ye

[swift tinsel]

haven't looked at fract in a while

[warm marlin]

fract could not

[random mason]

dragons can parry

[swift tinsel]

its just a layer of annoyance that has no real place being there

[random mason]

i had 7 ST hits parried last night over like 1.5 hrs of prog

[swift tinsel]

I lobby for eleem's idea about caster resist though

[surreal orbit]

anyone know how to enable the simple friendly class colored names?

its supposed to be default ui right

[weak horizon]

fuck ive got gaze n guidons on myth track, fully upgraded with voidcore, two 298 daggers as well, but im fucked on rings and neck, not a single mastery/crit piece, all haste/mastery and haste/crit lolol

its like the best bis rarest trinkets are there but stats are fucked

[astral mulch]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  If all of the above are true, use cast a Shadowstrike / Shuriken Storm (even if on full cp).

[quaint lodge]

since when did we add shuriken storm

oh ig cuz aor

aoe

[shrewd lantern]

i mean you want some haste

[weak horizon]

Yeah I got it worked out where I've got 702 haste(using guidons), 760 mastery, 870 crit. idk, just feels a bit too spread.

[iron dagger]

is there a list of known bugs somewhere available lads?

[swift tinsel]

nah that's fine, ideally you'd shift some of that crit to mastery but its not a big deal

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[iron dagger]

my goat

[weak horizon]

would I though? Isn't having slightly more crit important in raid than slightly more mastery?

[small sleet]

No

[swift tinsel]

not really

[weak horizon]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1502605720099749898/image.png

[small sleet]

It was when we played cloud cover but it’s not anymore

[swift tinsel]

the only stat breakdown that really matters is however much crit and mastery you end up with while getting 700 haste

[weak horizon]

ic

[swift tinsel]

having more mastery than crit comes into play if you want to use recklessness pot in m+

but beyond that its whatever

[grim wasp]

Considering a balance druid or evoker alt

[small sleet]

In general mastery is more value than crit in m+ even without considering reck pot

Mastery is better in aoe, and equal to crit in single target roughly

[weak horizon]

Ran a dslice sim now, with the results of what it wanted me to equip it put me at 710 haste with guidons(and haste flask), 982 mastery, 635 crit...

Does that sound about right or...?

[small sleet]

Ya

[shrewd lantern]

Why would people know better than the sim.

[weak horizon]

It's not about who knows what, the question is more based around others personal experience

635 crit seemed a bit low otherwise probably wouldn't have asked tbh

[shrewd lantern]

"bit low"

[ripe flame]

[shrewd lantern]

off.....random feels

lmao

[shrewd lantern]

Stop this heathen shit.

[small sleet]

Ds is enlightenment

[weak horizon]

Sorry if I offended you graf

[shrewd lantern]

I mean a bit low off feels

[ripe flame]

DS is the truth (I just wanna do something diffy )

[shrewd lantern]

It's just funny idk

[weak horizon]

Yeah it's humorous

[small sleet]

Mastery really good because of potent powder talent in aoe

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah but you only play pp on one boss.

[small sleet]

That’s why it’s more valuable than crit in aoe

[vale pine]

mastery is in general good in aoe

[shrewd lantern]

Every other boss is 2/2 finality really.

[small sleet]

Ya I’m just saying what helps swing it more that way compared to st

[shrewd lantern]

My sim likes heavy mast though

idk why

[random mason]

if you're out on paladins yeah

[shrewd lantern]

I just follow it.

[shrewd lantern]

I press the n key on paladins.

[small sleet]

Sim defaults to crit flask right now

[shrewd lantern]

i change my sim flask to mastery and it still wants more mastery

so idk....

[small sleet]

O ya idk mastery good

[random mason]

i only got off the mastery train when i simmed the NXP ring set

[shrewd lantern]

I have this.

It still hard leans into mastery

[random mason]

else i would be 1200 mastery unbuffed

[weak horizon]

Does the sim consider 700/800 haste break point for SD GCD's, and whether or not you have guidons? For when the sim considers if you should use haste/mastery/crit flask

[shrewd lantern]

Sim plays lower

since you technically need only 600 haste if a robot.

[weak horizon]

like 684 breakpoint right

oh

[vale pine]

sim is slightly below that

[shrewd lantern]

how does the sim profile sim over 130k though

[vale pine]

you can change weapon oils to ap to have a slightly more realistic sim

[shrewd lantern]

is what im wondering

[vale pine]

it uses pre pull supercharger

and all raid buffs/runes

[shrewd lantern]

Is that not included in the default sim?

I think i sim like 121k no vantus

[ripe flame]

vantus too right?

[vale pine]

ye

i think i ticked it on last time i re-did so i just added it to all

should probably remove it in the next update

[shrewd lantern]

I need to upgrade my neck but work been kicking my ass so.

cba for 500 sim dps

[fossil forge]

[small sleet]

I sim the same, but at like 127k with vantus and pre pull supercharger to give you an idea

[vale pine]

i am undead

[shrewd lantern]

yeah do you need to add a line for sc

[vale pine]

already means 2.5% dps loss

at minimum

[shrewd lantern]

LMAO

Void elf life

[vale pine]

yes, you need

[small sleet]

Ya I copied it from the header on the sheet sim

[weak horizon]

oh shit me too, is it a goated ring or what?

[shrewd lantern]

its decent if you dont wanna go for npx

which i mean. 0.5% dps isnt bad

[weak horizon]

is paladins really the only fight you take PP on?

[shrewd lantern]

No dragons

paladins you press n key

[weak horizon]

n

[shrewd lantern]

spec swap

[weak horizon]

what, outlaw?

[shrewd lantern]

either

[weak horizon]

i aint fucking play sin

[shrewd lantern]

None of the rogue specs are fun this season

imo

[small sleet]

You can play sub on paladins

It’s not good but it doesn’t matter

[shrewd lantern]

Atp i'm just the token atro buff.

Till they make this class less boring to play again

maybe

[hallow mortar]

gotta spice up the gameplay

like playing crystal on lura

[shrewd lantern]

lmao

p1 wipe factory

i have a kick at least

[hallow mortar]

we are past that with nerf to glaives

but im actually scared of P2 😄

[shrewd lantern]

Well yeah

[radiant swift]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[shrewd lantern]

We need to get to p3 with everyone alive.

[hallow mortar]

i had to find window where i can fit blades withnout dropping crystal

[shrewd lantern]

I debated playing outlaw on this boss

ngl

[hallow mortar]

idk that seems like bait

and i feel like it would only make fight harder for me

[shrewd lantern]

buff pushed sub ahead i think

and im lowk just lazy, sub i can play more autopilot

[hallow mortar]

yeah for sure

i start doing weekly keys atleast as outlaw

[shrewd lantern]

i wish our midnight crystals didnt die

in 2 gcds

[hallow mortar]

on pull or overall?

[shrewd lantern]

on pull especially but some sets overall

if they get gripped

[fossil forge]

big upg

[ripe flame]

2 eles 2 dev pov

[hallow mortar]

on pull you can delay two kicks little bit and you can hit them with second sectech

[shrewd lantern]

no we have the other blue spec

which also does alot to them

too

[hallow mortar]

its not my case tho

[weak horizon]

https://tenor.com/view/son-im-crine-gif-13090932573727637773

[cedar sapphire]

Why does my sim wants me to go even lower than 629 haste?

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vsoCTkYMA65TF16pbS74sE

[alpine wraith]

you need more dicipline

and first get the haste in place

[fast dome]

I seriously am having trouble getting my stats right. I just am unfortunate enough to have insane amounts of crit at the expense of haste and mastery

[swift tinsel]

can use r1 haste flask

will be over by a bit but thats fine

or craft something

[weak horizon]

uhm well to be fair my dslice result just had me taking mastery flask, which puts me at 560 haste (but have myth track guidons) i guess thats the move? @swift tinsel your thoughts?

[tribal vortex]

700 Haste for m+ is nice too

[fast dome]

Sadly I have the myth emberwing only

no Guidon for me

[random mason]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1502605720099749898/image.png

[weak horizon]

yeah thats the weird part, my dslice result puts me at 560 haste and wants me to use mastery flask over haste, but I guess that's justifiable with myth track guidons?
I wonder if that amount of haste from guidons then puts me in the 8 GCD thingy for dance

[small sleet]

Dslice says weird shit for haste pretty often I wouldn’t trust it personally

[weak horizon]

You'd still take haste flask then in my case?

[drifting elbow]

Hi, I'm proggin Vaelgor myth and I have a question for the vanish use. If I use vanish while i'm the beam target (fear). Does it change target or is it safe ? I know I can cloak of shadows, but what about vanish ?

[random mason]

you can run pretty low haste in m+ bc mastery is so good for AoE, but you'd obv trade single target for it

[small sleet]

Yes

[swift tinsel]

dslice has trouble properly modeling around the haste breakpoint so its best to take it with a grain of salt and just use the consumes/gear that gets you to the appropriate haste

[random mason]

if you're rich you can swap flasks for boss and Trash

[tribal vortex]

You can also go like 200 haste and ufll mast

[normal spoke]

where can i get help for rotation and logs

[fast dome]

#outlaw

[vale warren]

Deepening shadows currently gives me 0.00 sec bonus duration on shadow dance?

doesn't matter if i swap from 650 or 750 haste. and shadow dance is stuck at 6 seconds 🤔

[glass kelp]

I think something borked

[vale warren]

okay fixed it. problem happened after i got bluescreen on Lura prog. HS'd to silvermoon and it works again

[weak horizon]

Talent out of deepening shadows then take it again

[fossil forge]

any lura kickers in the chat

#showtooltip Kick
/use [@boss3,exists,nodead,harm]Kick
/tm [@boss3,exists,nodead,harm] 3

1 press insta kick?

[small sleet]

thats the macro you should use as the first person in the rotation

[vale warren]

was wondering why my shadow dance was so short

[fossil forge]

i am first

👍

[small sleet]

then yea that will be one press to kick and mark

[fossil forge]

w comms reldo

[pale ravine]

I wouldn't risk it.
Consistency is better, your healer will just dispel.
Too small of an optimization.
Focus on orb timers and on shadow blade timers if you want to improve DPS

[glass kelp]

Are we still meant to hit shadow blades separately from everything else during CD windows for hast interactions or should I carry on with the turbo macro that pops everything

[pale ravine]

Trinket before manually

[west tide]

no alleria neck no problem

[glass kelp]

NVM I think I made something up. Can't find in the guide but I thought it said to hit shadow blades separately to micro delay it for some reason. Ty though

[fossil forge]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/e1ywqhM52JsLNYRppUZkch

wthelly no alleria neck big problem

[west tide]

hell yaa

[fossil forge]

i need it to equip paladins ring..

otherwise back to haste flask prison

[somber sun]

@fossil forge ??

teach me bro

[fossil forge]

parsehack bro

[somber sun]

damn

sucks bro we dont have aug evoker

[fossil forge]

anlaki i didnt get pi..

aug abusing 📠

[somber sun]

[old lynx]

anyone here doin higher than 19's? i had an awesome group for my AA +19 and i was behind about 20k we had uh dk enh shammy monk and druid. I feel like ive mastered the rotation and lining up cds, we never wipes but finished third boss w only 9 minutes left and called it.

My gear does have alot of room for upgrading

My vaults have been dogshit

[lusty solar]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[small sleet]

as sub rogue, on first boss you should be eviscerating the whole time, which will kill your overall for the rest of the key

[fossil forge]

Ethical gaming 😭

[small sleet]

biggest advice i can offer for aa is to make sure you really leverage your single target on all 4 bosses

for example, i managed to do 120k st to tree boss in my most recent aa, and we killed it like 15s faster than normal

[old lynx]

no shit, i was Ss and bping the adds when they popped. So basically let the other 2 dps take adds and funnel boss

[small sleet]

yea, if you bp boss the kill will literally be like almost a minute slower

because you go from very high st to tank levels of st

[swift tinsel]

if you're playing with a dk and enh they should easily be able to handle the adds

[small sleet]

you can use shuriken storm outside of dance to get more eviscerates off

yeah, i try not to even swap to the branch when it spawns

unless it looks like its dying way way too slow

[urban horizon]

is it okay to use pot of recklessness

[small sleet]

you should use pot of recklessness in aoe, as long as it gives you mastery

[hazy breach]

Remove deepening shadows talent

And then swap bakc

Oh mb my discord didnt update

[somber sun]

ohh sorry btw did you just spam shadowstrike on double target or full shuriken storm

[fossil forge]

strike on dragons and storm when orbs spawn

and also storm bp outside of cds

[somber sun]

do you save full cds for the add ?

[chilly tree]

Anyone know any streamers doing sub rogue keys at 19+?

[somber sun]

even if it costs you like 5-8 sec of downtime

[fossil forge]

sent on cd

held dances for orbs

[somber sun]

thx man

[dusky yacht]

3% wipe on dragons and my parse on logs profile is 28 FML LMAO

I mean at least I figured out how to line up the cooldowns properly

[somber sun]

yeah this sucks

so much times it was a 95 min

we die so much on the 2nd inter

with the double spread

[dusky yacht]

Just a few days ago a guy who was flaming me in whisper after a key was mocking my 28 parse on dragons and now this lmao

[fossil forge]

i maybe did commit a crime with cloak there

[dusky yacht]

[fossil forge]

wont say though

[chilly tree]

Are you doing this for prio mobs in keys or just pressing backstab?

[tribal vortex]

the number is not real when you die

[small sleet]

if you ever have more than one mob around, there's no reason to press backstab

[dusky yacht]

I mean it's 43k more dps than the log I actually have, but yeah I think it might've been higher then no? Cause I just ran into gloom when they said wipe

[fossil forge]

i did line up my cds with pot though

or did it

idk i was autopiloting

[chilly tree]

Was told it does more damage st before

[tribal vortex]

It's kinda random, it doesn't compare with kill logs (idk exactly how it works)

[somber sun]

damn hats off

[chilly tree]

Even during dance?

[somber sun]

autopilot and top 1

[dusky yacht]

[somber sun]

[fossil forge]

full blast music

[warm marlin]

ye st but it only gives 1 cp

[fossil forge]

https://tenor.com/view/pepe-jam-jam12323-gif-19133853

[somber sun]

true true

forgot

but yknow

rl calls

[fast dome]

well, guess rogueing pays off

[small sleet]

during dance you press shadowstrike, but backstab's damage gain over shuriken storm is not even close to the value of extra combo points that can go into finishers

[upbeat cradle]

is the TBC whetstone

still stronger than oil if you have the 700 haste ?

[fossil forge]

i am still using it

still working probs

[upbeat cradle]

cuz I thnk i can reach the 1100 haste for DS

if I use a haste flask

but i'd have 720 haste if i go back to trickster

[fast dome]

While I am 99.99999% sure this is a known issue on wowanalyzer, is it going to be updated, or is it a case of a maintainer has quit or something?

[alpine wraith]

it has not been mainteined in 2 expansions or more

[fast dome]

rip

[alpine wraith]

or someone did once or twice but no idea

[hazy breach]

Its got some stuff now thats alright

The dance gcds

[dusky yacht]

Yeah I use it mainly to check if I need to work on that for a certain fight

[chilly tree]

Do we no longer press bp on 2 targets?

With that one talent

[alpine wraith]

we do

with potent powder

[fossil forge]

PPMAXXING 💯

[fast dome]

If I'm pulling about 112k ST am I good to start doing 14s? Been living in +10/+11 land.

[fossil forge]

you might just be ready for 19s

[rain swift]

yippie i got myth guidon from raid today finally, got my bis trinkets now

[somber sun]

guys, is my %ilevel parse always around 60-70 ( with 80 ish main ) because we dont have aug evoker ?

excuse my ignorance

[swift tinsel]

well that's a lot of haste on the new raid ring

[fast dome]

Uh i don't think I'm QUITE that brave lol

not yet

[fossil forge]

wthelly

new bis

[swift tinsel]

no more random roll stats on spore raid loot

[somber sun]

yeah better than eye of m*dnight

[fast dome]

that ring right there is the solution to my haste problems

want

[somber sun]

when is the new raid dropping ?

[fossil forge]

just get the one from magisters

[swift tinsel]

with what, a 4 item loot pool

[fossil forge]

budget version

[fast dome]

12.0.7 I think

[swift tinsel]

sounds like june I think

[fast dome]

yeh I've run that place 3x today.

no luck thus far

still sitting on dual crit/mastery rings

[swift tinsel]

heavy haste/crit helm, heavy crit/master belt

that ring, and a random stat proc trinket

[fast dome]

I need Krick's dagger to do the belt, cause currently I have dual 295 crafted haste/mastery daggers

I mean I guess I could just drop the embellishment on one of them but idk if thats worth

assuming you meant crafted belt.

[fossil forge]

Where would one find people to play keys with

(Eu)

[fast dome]

I just invite people in my guild without telling them why and queue us up

its worked so far

[fossil forge]

i would like to push keys but all my friends are raid only

[somber sun]

you should get invited by now man

290i and no invites ??!!!

[fast dome]

I get invites at 280. thats weird

wait is your IO like 0 or something?

[cerulean mirage]

Sub not outlaw ^^

[fast dome]

is outlaw hated now or somethin?

I dont really keep up on meta

[cerulean mirage]

outlaw is better

[somber sun]

would be very weird

[fast dome]

I basically never see another rogue, presumably because no one wants 2 of us in a group

[fossil forge]

i only have 1 19 timed i am a scrub

+they hate yellowclass

[somber sun]

no one reading rogue patches when outlaw is turbo buffed

and suddenly when it gets nerfed everyone becomes an avid reader

mhm

[fast dome]

im too old to keep up with the insanity that is outlaws buttonmashing

my hands dont function as turbo buttons

[fossil forge]

Outlaw is fun

[fast dome]

been doing this rogue game since launch, beard is now grey lol

[somber sun]

damn, would like to push keys too someday

[chilly tree]

"If you are using Light Company Guidon be sure to use the potion before the trinket as you do not want it to give you a ton of haste."

so i can just bind my pot to guidon then right?

[fast dome]

👵

[somber sun]

but cba ngl, this game just becomes a gacha atp

just log in 2 times a week

raid and vault

[fossil forge]

i sit in q for 40minutes give up and go soloq

Get ingame and be mad for 40 mins and then req for dungeons

And repeat the loop

[fast dome]

I been learning holy pally cause our M+ group backup healer switched to hunter so we only had 1 person who could heal.

[somber sun]

become pvp high elo player

[fast dome]

silly easy to get runs as heals

makes me jealous

[sick sand]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[fossil forge]

I dont think i have the iq required to pvp

[somber sun]

250i sham in +16

very good and fun

[sick swift]

If I don't have the neck from alleria should I keep using the myth 2 set rings or should I use bond of light/bifurcation band until I get the neck from alleria?

[fast dome]

I seen a 242 bear do a 14. so I believe it.

https://raider.io/characters/us/arathor/Linstriker?utm_source=discord&utm_medium=notification sorry hes up to 243 now

[spring trellis]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dUP8CqK9WKab4eBZ4nFgyj

How are we so different in or sums

sims

[somber sun]

!log

[alpine wraith]

you have 3 set bro

[spring trellis]

omg.

[fossil forge]

HAHA

[spring trellis]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/h86HcWhzNSMdoPHBKJuaB7

Still tho

[fast dome]

🤦‍♀️

[spring trellis]

is that 2ilvl diff really a 6k diff

[fast dome]

fuckin 288

piss off

😠

🧂

[spring trellis]

?

Im honestly asking, I havent played sub in forever

[fast dome]

just being jealous I was stuck on gearing for like 2 weeks cuz I was dumb with crests

now that theyre unlocked im playing catch up

JUST hit 280 today

[fossil forge]

wtf

how did u fk up ur crests so hard

[fast dome]

I had no fucking clue what I was doing so I was crafting stuff with hero then upgrading to myth

[fossil forge]

I was rly behind on crests but i was 288 b4 turbo

[lilac stag]

Rogues doing rogue things

[fast dome]

also made a hero belt I couldnt use cuz I didnt realize belts with effects counted as emblellishments

so I hit hero cap and was stuck for 2+ weeks

couldnt upgrade

[lilac stag]

you know you can remove embellishments ye?

[fast dome]

5 hero gear slot levels a week was ALL I could do cause I didnt have hero of the dawn yet. literally levelled a DH and got it to hero of the dawn to unclog my rogue

[fast dome]

yes but I got a hero belt eventually so said to heck with it.

[fossil forge]

i sacrifaced my alt for discount ig

He bounced back though

[fast dome]

Damn Heroic Voidforged Guidon > Mythic Voidforged Emberwing. Feelsbadman.

[hazy breach]

Surprised theyre even that close

Guidon is literally just twice as good as the wing

[fast dome]

Im way over on crit and way under on haste

so maybe thats doing funky stuff to numbers

[latent remnant]

wouldnt a champ guidon beat out emberwing

[alpine wraith]

not likely agi main stat is quite strong

[latent remnant]

I just remember seeing these graphs on bloodmallet

[fossil forge]

what do i trade for better wound poison

iron stomach?

[fast dome]

double on use would make me cry

I have puzzle box on my DH and really really really hate it

"stand still and channel this shit."

[small sleet]

i dont take shiv

[true coral]

On 2 targets only, do we black powder or not?

[hazy breach]

Only shiv thats somewhat useful is the puddle dude at the start of pit

[true coral]

I've seen confusing things

[fast dome]

if oyu have the talent yes

[fossil forge]

i never take shiv though

[small sleet]

also conveniently you dont need wound poison for this dungeon

[hazy breach]

But since we are most often playing with a druid and a monk, you already got 2 de-enrages

[small sleet]

uhh do you take virulent poisons?

i also dont take that

[fossil forge]

yes

[true coral]

potent powder?

[halcyon star]

what do you take instead?

[hazy breach]

If you have potent powder and a decent bit of mastery yes

[small sleet]

10% weapon poison damage is only worth like 100k damage on a dungeon where you use instant poison, or 60k on a dungeon with wound opison

[fast dome]

yup

[small sleet]

he was asking what to drop for improved wound poison for keys

[true coral]

okay, thank you!

[halcyon star]

Ohhh ty!

[hazy breach]

Pog a 0.05% dps increase

Massive

[small sleet]

!!!!!

especially since i play with a warlock, id much rather have iron stomach

[fossil forge]

iron stomach is kinda goated so virulent gotta go

[plush roost]

Damage is damage this is why youre RelSLOW

[small sleet]

FUCK

[plush roost]

Idk how u cant take imp wound

[fossil forge]

the blackpowder monk has appeared

[plush roost]

Drop slow resist?

[small sleet]

ya i have the same tree except virulent poisons

[tidal solstice]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kNiXEV76TeA6tYKFShGqTA

[plush roost]

Drop shadowrunner ANYTHING FOR THAT SWEET .05% DAMAGE

[small sleet]

???

run fast good

[plush roost]

U have fade to nothing

U already fast

[small sleet]

but faster

[plush roost]

No das bad

Too fasr

[fossil forge]

https://tenor.com/view/taking-notes-write-that-down-gif-27686706

[plush roost]

My tank cant keep up

I pull before he do

Tricks no redistribute

Dead

Too fast

I must zug zug damage

Not zgzg damage

Cause im too fast

[small sleet]

speed shroud him

[timid rose]

I love getting slapped with tricks up and hitting a big shadow strike

[plush roost]

But ye its basically a lil bit of dps or movespeed

Like very marginal

Like 2 gcds of a key

[hazy breach]

So sad its a choice node with EE

[outer tree]

in general, is darkmoon hunt + arcanoweave more dps than 3x arcanoweaves?

[plush roost]

U cant run 3

[hazy breach]

Yes, but theyre about the same. 2x arcano that is

[outer tree]

ah ok thought it was 1 point per arc, 3 points, my b

[small sleet]

i really miss speed shroud but its actually so troll to drop ee

[plush roost]

Meh

1 heal

Amrn

[small sleet]

this why charrend is floor pov every dungeon :/

[plush roost]

Lmao

[hazy breach]

Speed shroud should be in the class tree

[subtle aspen]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[plush roost]

Ill have u know my live rate is actually very high compared to certain warriors and other rogues i know

[small sleet]

that wouldnt surprise me with half the creatures ive seen in high keys

[hazy breach]

Its me, im a creature

[small sleet]

gg....

[plush roost]

Im actually so liberal with feint i actually overfeint and THATS how i die

[small sleet]

i almost did that on vexamus a second ago

we pulled 6 fuckin foragers onto vexamus

[plush roost]

6 is wild

[small sleet]

and i ran out of feints before overlap

[plush roost]

6 is wild as a pull lmfao

[small sleet]

yea i died to double charge like 1 min into fight

it was inevitable

[plush roost]

Double is livable ?

No AV?

[small sleet]

i was soaking an orb at the same time

[plush roost]

Ah

Gg

Did u see our

Reverse aa

Shenanigans

[small sleet]

like the squishvegan route?

[plush roost]

Ye

[small sleet]

i was just trying that route with mana

[plush roost]

Forrest was

Uh

[small sleet]

it feels harder to execute

[plush roost]

Having a good time

[small sleet]

by a lot

[plush roost]

I think its cause people are dumb tbh

[small sleet]

but we reached overgrown ancient room with like 14:30 left

[plush roost]

Like in a real key

[small sleet]

21

[plush roost]

Youll just shockwave

The boojs

Sync them

Let them cast

Tremor

Gg

Ez

[small sleet]

for some reason

it took us like 4 attempts before people actually kicked the surges

[plush roost]

Mental overload

I get it

I had to lock in a bit

Focus mark early

[small sleet]

i guess so yeah, it gets hard to even see your focus target on that pull

[warm marlin]

Exboss has a giant focus cast bar

Those things are goated

[plush roost]

Thats why i have my focus unit frame above my target frame

[subtle aspen]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[plush roost]

I should really try exboss

[small sleet]

i should prob get this tbh

[plush roost]

Setting it up is just

Ugh

[warm marlin]

ye half the settings are still Chinese and some things you just can’t turn off

[plush roost]

I need an NA dev to translate and take all the good features

Like saprish cat leaps

[small sleet]

charrend can you carry me to 21 resil so i can pass you in io

[plush roost]

I cannot

For i am bound to never defeat skyreach

[fossil forge]

are you a dwarf bro

are you even trying..

[plush roost]

Oh

Haha

U think its me

[fossil forge]

who is the racist

point the finger

[plush roost]

I had a HEALER a RANGED HEALER

Die to the frontal

On first boss

3 times

[fossil forge]

[plush roost]

Brez ankh dead

Like HOW

[somber sun]

cant blame him, crazy hitbox on that glaive

[plush roost]

The streets are nasty bro

[somber sun]

xdd

[small sleet]

21 skyreach really feels so free too

im kinda annoyed i havent timed it either

[plush roost]

I am dwarf tho ye

Dude every 22 feels free i just have no friends no time no bitches

[warm marlin]

we go crazy with the stove team routes soon

[plush roost]

That maisara route

Is juicy

Maybe an assa key

[warm marlin]

it’s pretty much what we were already playing

[fossil forge]

https://tenor.com/view/captain-america-marvel-chris-evans-steve-rogers-old-man-gif-14744550

[warm marlin]

But we play warlock

So we can do the spirit tech on vordaza

[plush roost]

Dont u

Also play with disc

[warm marlin]

Ye

[plush roost]

Insane comp

Kekw

[warm marlin]

Gdru disc Aug dk lock

[plush roost]

Zero raid buff comp

[warm marlin]

yep

[plush roost]

Bdk to complete exodia

[warm marlin]

Imagine someone dies and the comm is “rebuff”

Rebuff what blud

[plush roost]

Fort !

[warm marlin]

Blessing of the bronze?

(Do not look at the 16% motw uptime in one of our recent keys)

[plush roost]

Dw i timed an aa without skyfury bshout for 20 minutes

They just never applied it on start of key

Im like man

Whys energy feel so bad

[warm marlin]

we also did most of our 19s with dh instead of aug

Drums gaming

[fossil forge]

bl is overrated

[peak ice]

Will poisons proc this ring?

[somber sun]

yeah

[peak ice]

Sweet

[somber sun]

do we have info on the whole drop table

so we know how much rolls we could prepare

[peak ice]

Uhhh yep

https://www.wowhead.com/news/sporefall-raid-gear-has-new-stats-in-patch-12-0-7-381697

[somber sun]

ty

[peak ice]

Belt loots primo

These drop like 298 at mythic right?

[hazy breach]

yeees

[somber sun]

yup

[peak ice]

Sick

[somber sun]

do they release stuff usually like that or is it a midnight exclusive?

[timid rose]

Kinda weird they went with different slots for each armor type. Seems like possible power imbalance

[somber sun]

like from 289 drops to 298 on one raid patch

[small sleet]

you can only roll once per week, so theres no point in prepping rolls

[hazy breach]

Well all the slots have the same budget anyway

So it doesnt matter

[solemn patrol]

are you able to loot the boss, then change your spec and bonus roll on a different loot spec?

[somber sun]

I will be away for a really long time that's why

[timid rose]

Oh hmm for some reason I was thinking helm was 3/4

[peak ice]

Can’t tell if that trinket is good or not

[plush roost]

Cant wait for the twist where all gear can be sporefused and its just turboboost 2

They would never....

[peak ice]

I mean

[timid rose]

Curious what s2 Ilvl bump will be

[plush roost]

49 ilvls usually

So like 347?

[peak ice]

What happens to crafted gear when you go to next like season

Do you recraft it or is there like a new item you need to craft?

[timid rose]

You recraft it with a new spark from the new season

So you don't need to do the initial investment in materials just recraft materials

Embellishment and missive stick around

[crude dragon]

!UI

[wicked jolt]

Essential:

• ArcUI / [AvijeCDM](<https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/ayijecdm) - Enhanced Cooldown Manager.
• WangBar / SensaiBar - Resource bar (when using blizzard CDM)
• MSUF / UUF - Unit frame mods.
• Platynator - Nameplate Addon.
  Quality of Life:
• Buff Reminders - Food/Flask/Poison Reminder.
• WilduTools - QOL enhancements.
• Mute Cold Blood sound
• The first dance tracker

[ebon tiger]

do a quest that takes 4 weeks to power up the sporeforge. then collect 5 ascendant sporeshards to upgrade any 289 to 298

psychic damage

[swift tinsel]

officially upgrade capped, til I replace either OH or belt

[manic ice]

if my raid is bad/slow at kicking on lura, is it better to just hold CD's till after the first set goes out? feels bad missing most of my CD's waiting for kicks to be done

[small sleet]

are you talking about heroic or mythic

[manic ice]

mythic

[small sleet]

the kicks dont dr the boss on mythic

[manic ice]

oh

well, the more you know

[small sleet]

yeah it gives the boss a damage buff instead i think

[manic ice]

ty for clearing that up lol

[tribal blade]

it does yeah

[swift tinsel]

now for three weeks of socket vaults

[bleak night]

sockets op

[swift tinsel]

also need to decide if I want to roll skyreach for dagger to replace crafted OH

am also lazy so probs not lol

[lilac stag]

@warm marlin is it time? 4 ilvl lower, 2k higher

[random mason]

Outlaw sims even higher you should try that spec

[twilit gorge]

do we shuriken the kick adds on lura

probably not right

[prime glen]

single target...

Fuu has bond of light and eye of midnight as double BIS rings

what about the double mythic+ ones from xenas? i feel like the proc is good no?

[random mason]

If youre not in dance you can save sht stacks by storming once to get to full cp faster but it would be basically no gain over the fight i think

[twilit gorge]

makes sense, ty!

[warm marlin]

Yes

[random mason]

Theyre also good but the BiS setup does a miniscule amount of dmg more i assume

[fringe lava]

sub bis is weird cuz of the haste breakpoints

you can probably get close with a completely different jewelry set

[prime glen]

ahh true, there's huuuge haste on that one ring

could be the diff between them, esp for the deathstalker build due to needing more haste. thanks!

[drifting ether]

That ring looks nice I’m guessing it works on our poison?

[peak ice]

Should do

But also like doubt the damage is much tbh

[swift tinsel]

its probs between crown and xenas procs

[prime glen]

ah

[drifting ether]

Ahh might be interesting to use

I saw this today who cooked with ds 😂

[tribal blade]

the explanation for how they measured not computing with the result

[drifting ether]

I’ll have to find the log for it later I always wanted to try ds for m+

[tribal blade]

might be somewhat playable who knows

[drifting ether]

Ya because with trickster I tell my team I either st or aoe no in between 😂

I tried outlaw, it’s not for me I keep forgetting to rtb

[tribal blade]

outlaw just takes a lot of reps to get used to

because of how the rotation works

[drifting ether]

Ya it’s a lot to react to and manage at once compared to sub where you preplan your rotation ahead of time

[tribal blade]

you're not experiencing as many different rotational situations with sub compared to outlaw if that makes sense

[tribal blade]

yup and any hesitancy costs you lost globals

and for outlaw those compound over time

[drifting ether]

Like I can play arms and fury good aswell but outlaw feels way harder

[tribal blade]

like as sub you can lose globals outside of dance and it doesn't mean a whole lot

outlaw has more to track for sure

[drifting ether]

Yeah it’s like 6s till dance I’ll just chill and perform the same rotation I done 1000 times

[tribal blade]

yeah sub chill right now

[sharp bolt]

not if you are trying to push high tier keys

[fossil frost]

for this macro do you have to hit your keybind twice? or should it be casting both abilities from one keybind press?
#showtooltip
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shadow Blades

should be shadow dance then secret technique...linked the wrong one

[sharp bolt]

no

[tribal blade]

i mean that's just high keys being hard

not sub becoming more difficult

[sharp bolt]

yes they are hard, but Sub isn't meta

[tribal blade]

we weren't talking about sub being meta or not

we were talking about the rotation

[sharp bolt]

well part of the rotation includes properly timing intertupts and stuns. which is part of the meta

[tribal blade]

huh

again that has nothing to do with the rotation

[sharp bolt]

if what you mean by rotation excludes interupts, stuns, positioning, etc. then yes Sub is chill, but thats not the case in high tier keys

[tribal blade]

everyone is doing that in keys regardless of spec

[tribal blade]

#subtlety message

you can apply that statement to every single spec

[sharp bolt]

yes, whats the issue?

[fossil frost]

#showtooltip Shadow Dance
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

any idea why its not working? I'm used to TTW piano opener so I'm still just slaming SD then Sectec right after while the macro doesnt work

[peak ice]

do you have enough energy/combo

[tribal blade]

do you have the macro on your non stealth bar too

[fossil frost]

ye

I mean, if it doesnt matter then fine. I'm used to sub when there was more to it

[tribal blade]

we were talking about the difference between outlaw and sub rotational difficulty and sub being chill has nothing to do with high keys

if anything it has more of an effect that sub being chill becomes easier in high keys

outlaw becomes way harder needing to do top tier dmg and manage kicks/ccs too

[sharp bolt]

like i said, if you exclude high key rotations, then yes I agree. but in high teir content, sub rogue and outlaw are both not that chill. Can we get off this stupid hampster wheel please?

[tribal blade]

brother i did not start this weird argument

[sharp bolt]

🙄

[plush roost]

Sub is about 20x more chill in high keys than law

Im borpa typing as sub, hardest part is staying awake my dudr

[sharp bolt]

I disagree.

[tribal blade]

this

[tribal blade]

LOL

[sharp bolt]

LOL

[tribal blade]

bruh i'm dead

[plush roost]

Hey man, fair enough

[peak ice]

tbh i dont track anything in high level keys

[plush roost]

Man disagrees

[sharp bolt]

right!

[plush roost]

I respect that

[left ledge]

sub is better than outlaw

it is what it is

[plush roost]

I disagree!

[swift tinsel]

owned

[left ledge]

im not here to listen to your opinion

im here to state mine

[plush roost]

Okay go off king

[left ledge]

LETS GET DEATHSTALKER IN KEYS

LETS GO

WE DID IT ON LURA

[plush roost]

Not very... subti of you

[left ledge]

LETS DO IT IN KEYS

[peak ice]

no

[plush roost]

Eheheheh

[left ledge]

heheheh

good one

[tribal blade]

naurrrwww

[left ledge]

guess i should be more

s

u

b

t

l

e

[plush roost]

I dont get it can u be more straightforwars

Ty

[left ledge]

not right now

ill try tomorrow

[left ledge]

yeah ngl idk if i even have it in me for that

[tribal blade]

hahaaa based

juggling mark way more toxic in keys than raid

[left ledge]

its just

you have to press evis

[tribal blade]

although there's the new button now

[left ledge]

and thats so fucking bad

[peak ice]

brain off > ds

[left ledge]

though i will say

i genuinely like DS more in ST

[peak ice]

https://tenor.com/view/eww-tim-robinson-i-think-you-should-leave-with-tim-robinson-gross-surprised-gif-15396111211900312060

[left ledge]

next week i will not fuck up my cds

and i will widen the gap on lura

[tribal blade]

they had so many opportunities to put BP on DN

[left ledge]

eh

if they put BP on DN

we would not touch trickster

[tribal blade]

then it would be super unga bunga too

[left ledge]

yeah

it would be kinda broken

[tribal blade]

yeah sub would be doing massive aoe

[left ledge]

imagine just shitting out DN BPs in aoe

you finish waaaaay too often in aoe

[tribal blade]

i suppose they could tune the DN BP number

[left ledge]

maybe

but again

it would just replace trickster then

[tribal blade]

true yeah

[left ledge]

they kinda designed themselves into a wall with our hero talents

[tribal blade]

i wonder if we'll get another "trickster is too overrepresented, time to mega buff DS" moment in midnight

[left ledge]

they should just revert the nimble nerf

and for DS i have the perfect idea

give it shuriken combo

[tribal blade]

THEY SHOULD JUST REVERT NIMBLE NERF

ooo i like combo

or

[left ledge]

combo DN evis

[tribal blade]

that would be nuts

[left ledge]

the literal nuke

[tribal blade]

something like activating dance gives you 1 combo charge

or something

so it's not completely broken

[left ledge]

i mean honestly they can just replace the bp talent that makes mark aoe

and give them combo as it was

just tune it lower

[tribal blade]

i'd be down for that

[left ledge]

then you actually have a funnel spec on sub and an aoe spec on sub

[tribal blade]

that would for sure make DS feel better to play

[left ledge]

doesnt even have to be as crazy as like

[tribal blade]

i still think they need to make mark a player buff

[left ledge]

turning evis into a literal nuke every DN

[tribal blade]

agreed yeah

[left ledge]

but rn if deathstalker were to ever compete in aoe

it would just be completely replacing trickster

i mean wtf would be the diff

its just bp spam

[tribal blade]

yeah the dmg profile more ethical

[left ledge]

could be dependent honestly

i feel like a lot of pulls just favor heavy aoe

but sub funnel is like

a boogeyman to them

zul still haunts blizz hq