subtlety

[lilac stag]

you need enough energy for Sectech. That’s it

[ornate crystal]

its crazy how many sub rogues i see on warcraftlogs in mythic raid encounters with much less than 700 haste, some even at 400

[lilac stag]

to compare, you know what feels way worse than the non-premed opener?

[ornate crystal]

i have really good upgrades in my bag, but i cant use them cause ill be at below 700 haste

[lilac stag]

then they’re not really good upgrades?

[ornate crystal]

ye they are

[hazy breach]

Idk most do

Idk where youre checking

[lilac stag]

clearly not if you can’t use them.

[ornate crystal]

top 50 per encounter

[ornate crystal]

+16 agi upgrades etc

[paper stirrup]

why not take premed instead of silent storm in raid?

[ornate crystal]

like theres one with crit haste on it, but if i replace it with mine, ( which is haste master atm ) then ill be at 610 haste

[hazy breach]

Because you cant do that

Pathing doesnt allow it

[lilac stag]

I mean if you’re just sitting on crests and can’t figure out how to spend them and keep the haste high enough, it’s just something taking up bag space until you can use it.

Not being in crest deficit right now should be considered an issue.

go farm heroic items to off set the lost haste to equip higher ilvl

[ornate crystal]

thats a good one

[rotund rock]

is there like a haste number to reach for m+ with guidon or is it also just 700

[lilac stag]

Or just complain here. I’m sure that will help you equip them easier.

[ornate crystal]

i wasnt complaining btw

[shrewd lantern]

premed literally doesnt matter in keys

[ornate crystal]

sorryy if it came across that way

[shrewd lantern]

you just build with storm

[paper stirrup]

it is on the same tier, and you still have access to fade to nothing bc of ephemeral bond, am i missing something?

[shrewd lantern]

or if its a boss coming up

you can not be bad and hold pts from a pack

[paper stirrup]

i meant for raid

[hazy breach]

Well yes, but premed itself is a dps loss

Thats why its not picked

[somber sun]

Just use the new opener

[hazy breach]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

• The first Ancient Arts cannot proc while Premeditation is up, which is why it is a DPS loss to talent into it as the Shadowstrike clones with rotten up can crit insanely hard.
• There is also a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts 3. (This does not matter much numerically, but feels weird)

[lilac stag]

Just emotionless text in a chat my friend. It’s all good. I laid out your options. Use it as you will.

[shrewd lantern]

it just delays the opener slightly

i played no premed entire last reset and its fine

[lilac stag]

Your opener is 5-6 seconds now isn’t instead 3.

[dusky yacht]

Man the supercharge optimisation is weird as hell though

[lilac stag]

Boss likely getting moved in that 5 seconds anyways

[dusky yacht]

I just did shadowstrikes in opener on target dummy until my energy ran out lmao

[paper stirrup]

ah ok, i see

[dusky yacht]

I guess it won't really happen in raid

[granite schooner]

Quick question - How many sparks do we have in total this week?

[paper stirrup]

5

[honest meteor]

my crit is 796, haste 671 , mastery 922 , wanna try the cloud cover, Planned Execution, Finaly , Potent Powder build , should i go for 1100+ crit and less mastery

[shrewd lantern]

sparks are kind of useless now

[granite schooner]

I'm building an alt thanks for your input

[shrewd lantern]

so spend your rerolls on myth gear

from 10s

[lilac stag]

If we’re being completely honest I think people are more upset about having to look at their energy bar in the opener than it taking a few extra seconds. Oh no, a resource matters!!!!

[shrewd lantern]

and not wasting them on crafteds

[lilac stag]

Ring still a safe craft. Since you are eventually replace 2

And the spark doesn’t matter

[shrewd lantern]

crafting more than 2 kind of troll

[dusky yacht]

When you zone into a raid do you keep the shadow tech stacks you got?

[lilac stag]

As soon as you roll rings you’re spending crests anyways. If you’ve got nothing else to upgrade holding the crests is more troll

[shrewd lantern]

yeah but atp its crest inefficient since you get 2 bonus rolls a week

[edgy imp]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dzBu8yMxmyDLm4DxVyJHuK https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/cMPCqDbJgB278xayCZPx65 idk what gear to use in mythic vs raid , everyone says sim it so i did but idk if i use dungeon slice for dungeons and patchwerk for raids , just want to know what to gear up with still confused about different bis gear lists and what is best for my specific character

[lilac stag]

And you maybe only spending 1 a raid roll

Getting shit you can’t use

[shrewd lantern]

if its a new alt you 100% send on keys

2 myth pieces over 1

[lilac stag]

Who the fuck is knowing rolling an alt rogue?

[granite schooner]

I ONLY ASKED HOW MANY SPARKS

[paper stirrup]

when i engage a boss, do i lose stored supercharge combopoints?

[granite schooner]

THANKS

[shrewd lantern]

good question

[lilac stag]

Punch them in the dick

[shrewd lantern]

anyone making an alt rogue is uhh

lol

[hazy breach]

Above 2 yes

[grizzled rune]

Bit of a weird one, currently statted for Assassin but if I run a sim for ST to push me towards what Subtlety players are running in keys it's downgrades. Which seems odd because my Mastery is awful low

[paper stirrup]

so send 1 empy dance after every wipe to have 2 stored is worth it?

[shrewd lantern]

yeah

keys you can hold more

i.e AA start you can send two

[paper stirrup]

nice, ty

[lilac stag]

a lot of keys you can do pre key and immediate as key countdown starts

Tank is gathering anyways

[shrewd lantern]

yeah i mean in AA i dance as soon as the timer starts

and send another right away

you 100% always have both bsck by the time the tank gathers

unless you got a weirdo who goes arcane first

[grizzled rune]

Is this just because AoE benefits from mastery way more?

[hazy breach]

Yes

Read the talent Potent Powder, and youll see why

[grizzled rune]

Oh I see lol

What's optimal way to sim then without giving up a lot of ST?

[hazy breach]

You dont really give up a lot of ST

Just get your haste breakpoint then a mix of crit+mastery

[paper stirrup]

aim for equal amount mastery and crit?

[shrewd lantern]

whatever the sim says

on st its gonna slightly favor crit

[paper stirrup]

so for parses crit, for m+ push mastery?

[shrewd lantern]

I mean realistically you equip whatever gives more agi.....

[shrewd lantern]

we're not at crest uncapping yet

myth gear is just better than hero gear

[shrewd lantern]

lmao yep

[keen dome]

Hm, I think I can improve this one.

there

[lilac stag]

ain’t no one actually happy

[keen dome]

i'm happy

[fallow glade]

happiness score ||out of 1000||

[hallow mortar]

Are you actually firing all those farmed charges with apex proc ?

[lilac stag]

meds

[shrewd lantern]

its aoe

lol....

[keen dome]

all natural happiness.

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/smoking-chilling-relax-merryjane-snoop-dog-gif-10431620193504603976

[keen dome]

Nope, none of that too. I'm just optimistic and hopeful and also Diablo 4 tomorrow which is gonna be great fun.

[hollow spear]

Are you trying to summon the poe crowd to shit on d4?

[keen dome]

no

D4 is legit good now. And it's gonna get better. We're back to RoS level diablo and that's coooool.

PoE is also good and fun

It's cool having multiple skeleton clickers

[crystal bone]

it's nice having several arpg's in the pool

im omega boomer and still play d2 mod and d2r lol

[dusky yacht]

Man the variance in my opener is crazy, 140k-160k ST

DPS in like 22ish seconds

Maybe a li'l longer than that I guess

[paper stirrup]

well if u crit secret technique will make big difference

[left ledge]

It’s mostly in your rotten strikes

If you crit a rotten strike that’s a lot of damage

[dusky yacht]

Yeah absolutely

[left ledge]

Probably the most damage we can do in a global

[dusky yacht]

Just was kinda shocked didn't expect it to be this high, I guess it's the update aswell

It obviously averages out as you go on

[left ledge]

Statistically it should

But it doesn’t always feel or play that way lmao

[dusky yacht]

True

[left ledge]

Sometimes you do just get unlucky

[dusky yacht]

When the dice just won't roll over 2 amiright

Or won't stop rolling 6

And everybody's angy

[left ledge]

Yep

[dusky yacht]

I need to figure out if shadow tech stacks disappear when you enter a raid

I haven't actually paid attention to it

But it might be mildly advantageous to have some at least

[swift tinsel]

Iirc they reset on pull

[dusky yacht]

Shit

[swift tinsel]

Haven’t checked in a while tho

[dusky yacht]

Eh who am I kidding I always forget the dances before pulls aswell

Mostly semi-anxiety of not having double dance on pull

[swift tinsel]

Just don’t vanish before you’ve gotten a stack in the opener

Get weird with it

[dusky yacht]

Good tip

[shrewd lantern]

150% more strike crit damage during cds

that was expected

[swift tinsel]

Idk if vanishing resets internal ShT AA counter

[dusky yacht]

Is there another way besides vanish to force fixate onto another raid member?

[swift tinsel]

Probably not but

Tricks

[dusky yacht]

That's odd I always use tricks before pulls

On tanks tho

[azure thicket]

no just vanish/racials the umbral essentia potions don't work in midnight

[swift tinsel]

Ye if it’s a legit fixate like Ick then just vanish or meld id imagine

[azure thicket]

you can evasion the ick fixate

[dusky yacht]

Damn so I shouldn't really vanish on opener on vorasius

[empty bobcat]

why we swap premed for bond? it sims lower for me

[azure thicket]

always face ick tho etc

[dusky yacht]

My readlead wants me to stay on boss during vorasius because I'm usually high/top dps there

It's my one moment of glory

I'll just save vanish for it

[swift tinsel]

Ye that’s what I do usually

[azure thicket]

definitely feels like whoever has the best time is gonna determine title spots moreso than last season or season 2 tww

but it nice that most people aren't stuck in s2 14 key purgatory

anyone can hit a high key if they're up to it/have the time

so the sub 1%ers are gonna have a run for their monies

[dusky yacht]

I have some guildies telling me the 10 keys are wild nowadays

But even in 14s I still see some wild shit

[azure thicket]

i hit 3 a few days ago but cba to do push keys with pugs running 16s with the homies for the game lol

almost banked a few 17s but stuff happened

[empty bobcat]

I dont even get invites to 12s - I already did 13/14s with my group - ppl hate rogues

[dusky yacht]

I still don't have my 14 resil cause I got a 13 maisara and the tanks I get there are wild

[azure thicket]

metagame advice

[dusky yacht]

I've done some 15s even

Just waiting for my guildleader tank to randomly get maisara I guess

[empty bobcat]

I am only 270 tho

[dusky yacht]

I'm 281 and sometimes I get declined by people with at least 200 less io than me, even though I'm usually top or 2nd dps when I do get invited

[azure thicket]

mention your parses in the apply

[dusky yacht]

I think they saw one video about rogues being L tier and they're like just insta declining

[empty bobcat]

I am 2900 and I get declined by lower score ppl

[azure thicket]

sup and hey bunch of 90 parses in 16-17s last season 3/9M

[left ledge]

Ngl

[dusky yacht]

How can you see your own parses on wc logs

[left ledge]

I would auto reject anyone linking dungeon parses

[dusky yacht]

For dungeons

I won't link it screw those people but I'm just curious

[azure thicket]

see the mentioned apply text, it sounds tubronerd to just be like check my parses

[left ledge]

I find more success getting invited into groups telling people my mog is a once in a lifetime sight for their eyes

[somber sun]

do you guys use an addon for combat logging ?

[azure thicket]

👮

im reporting this robbery

[left ledge]

Addons would just be for uploading

Logging is part of the base game

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah this is why

[left ledge]

You use /combatlog

[shrewd lantern]

geared people are 280 atp

[somber sun]

👍

[somber sun]

im 277 and not getting invited to +8-9s

[azure thicket]

i'm sure we're tuned pretty good just

in csgo the aug/krieg meta took forever to catch on

[somber sun]

matter of fact I would even be 290 ilevel and still wouldnt be invited

[azure thicket]

cause people didn't try to develop outside of crank smokes and 1tap

[empty bobcat]

dbm does it for u

[shrewd lantern]

bw better

[dusky yacht]

Oh right you need somebody to actually log before it registers your parse of course

That's why I'm missing some parses in m+

lmao

[gilded ferry]

how much IO you got

[azure thicket]

ye you don't link to your parses if they don't have time to check they're gonna wiff something else

[ornate ruin]

m+ parses

[gilded ferry]

to get a sure invite to 10s you need 3k at this point

[azure thicket]

you just ask them to check and hope for da best

[empty bobcat]

10s are a joke, it feels like normal

[somber sun]

2800

[dreamy sundial]

My note always says "Patient and nice guy" and I get invited loads.

[somber sun]

I cant even grind

it

[empty bobcat]

fun starts at 14

[azure thicket]

also does anyone know why adds keep snapping into this fight it's happened twice this week

[dreamy sundial]

I might not BE a patient and nice guy, but they never know that

[dusky yacht]

This is amazing and I wholly support this

[azure thicket]

birds?_?

[empty bobcat]

happened for me too no idea

[shrewd lantern]

why do you have giant bars in the middle of your screen

[azure thicket]

i swear its the knockup into the birds

[dreamy sundial]

get this UI abomination away

[empty bobcat]

might try this

[strange shore]

Is there ever a time where we yolo a dance, when Secret and SB are on cd?

The window is tight be it seems like we could possibly fit in a dance with just evis or BP as finishers, sometimes.

[shrewd lantern]

this is a tbc ahh resolution

[dusky yacht]

[azure thicket]

1 william ak spraydowns booboo
https://youtu.be/A46J6evda0k&t=217

[dusky yacht]

That's how my UI looked in vanilla

[gilded ferry]

will try that, my approach was to note "big dick dps"

[dreamy sundial]

It really works for me, I have 2700 rating and 276 ilvl and I only apply to 10's without issues.

[dreamy sundial]

I did this too, also got me invited more than without note

[glad bough]

People chasing meta and high IO players for 10’s are usually garbage players. You can ignore most everything in a 10 and have no lust and be totally fine

[empty bobcat]

I think 270 is my problem but this char is literally 2 IDs old

[dusky yacht]

I had to do 42 xenas runs total this season to get my hero omission cause I got myth occlusion in vault, and the one fun thing about it was that I felt like the best player in the world

[surreal orbit]

can confirm, 267* ilvl spent too long queing for a simple pit +10 and never got accepted

[somber sun]

++

[glad bough]

I’ve been stuck in Pit of Sauron gouging my eyes out

[surreal orbit]

lke impossible to pug at this point

[dusky yacht]

I think I was doing 10s first week

People are so dumb

[azure thicket]

don't play prio damage mentality with sub, you can't finish the arcane golems off in a cd set in higher keys etc

[gilded ferry]

yeah, it was totally doable with 245 ilvl

[surreal orbit]

people are too minmax brained

[shrewd lantern]

its mostly the fact other people in q

are already 280

[azure thicket]

play around dropping a caster or the lich with the adds

[gilded ferry]

and 3k IO

[glad bough]

We had a buddy who was 225 ilvl Resto shaman healing our 10’s. He was sweating but it was doable

[shrewd lantern]

the ilvl matters more

[surreal orbit]

yeah i get it just accepting the highest ilvl or a lust or w/e you want in your comp

[azure thicket]

not quite the same thing if that makes sense

[gilded ferry]

list your key and you will see the amount of dps in que

[shrewd lantern]

if you're over 280 you generally are decent and finished 10s week 1

[azure thicket]

if you can put your healer up a cd you're winning in m+ imo

[gilded ferry]

on the other hand, if you want easy mode, create a tank

250 ilvl and you are invited to 10s

[surreal orbit]

If I didnt have a guild to run most things with it would suuuuuuck to be dps

[shrewd lantern]

i got trust issues taking people below 280 in pugs ngl

so many apes who just passively geared

[empty bobcat]

I am one week behind launch on my main and 278 was doable

[shrewd lantern]

via other content

[gilded ferry]

oh yeah. the ilvl is just to level out the below average performance they will do in a key.

[empty bobcat]

still has some champ gear

[shrewd lantern]

Like if someone is 282+ and 7/9m there's very low chance they underperform

[glad bough]

Ilvl doesn’t mean shit though let’s be real. You can have absolute brain dead players at top ilvl

[shrewd lantern]

just how it is

[empty bobcat]

funny enough when I get 10s invites I am always top dps tho

[shrewd lantern]

[gilded ferry]

The fact that you are hanging out in your class discord already puts you in advantage of most players

[glad bough]

Ilvl and raider io are all great for ultra high level content. Content 99% of wow players are not even remotely close to doing

[azure thicket]

im personally happy finishing a 17 with a 1 minute left this early in the season

[strange shore]

Do we always hold dance for Secret? It seems like there might be a time where we could possibly fit a dance with normal finishers in while waiting for SB to come off cd?

[somber sun]

thing is that yeah most people are 280i, but what if you only started 1/2 weeks ago

[shrewd lantern]

like when i fill my own vault keys early season

[somber sun]

if you get what I mean

[shrewd lantern]

people with high raid prog

are generally good

[somber sun]

• the only one interrupting and CCing

[azure thicket]

8.5 times out of 10 yeah

there's rare occasions where the dance + coup degrace are a good play

[shrewd lantern]

if i see a devourer dh in queue that is 6/9 h with all green logs

thats an instant decline

though

[glad bough]

Another false. People with high raider prog are not always good. I’ve meet people that were multiple mythic boss killed and sucked in m+

[empty bobcat]

I dance coup if sectec is on CD and mobs not gonna live much longer

[shrewd lantern]

have yet to see that be true in vault keys

[strange shore]

Thanks!

[lilac stag]

2 or 3 of / 8 is casual mythic raiding. Just as much of a roll
of the dice as anyone else.

[empty bobcat]

think M+ is much more situational, raid is mostly always the same routine each pull imho

[glad bough]

^ agree

[empty bobcat]

you can prog for that, its harder to prog for M+ at least if you dont have a high resi group

[shrewd lantern]

i said vault keys

[azure thicket]

considering the average sub 1% is working on resi 18s this week yeah honestly

[empty bobcat]

oh ok

[shrewd lantern]

whcih are hold w

do good damage

the end

[azure thicket]

that's legit the prescription

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah I really meant like at least 4/9m the first week

or 6-7/9m at this point

[warm marlin]

I attempted to pug mythic imperator and chim on my udk yesterday

it is a warzone out there

[slim anchor]

Is it just me or are the sub sims just fucked? Leading up to .5 patch it’s all puzzle box puzzle box. I have a hero gaze and a hero delve trink that gives agility and now sims are saying that puzzle box or even the feather are a dps loss even at 272 ilvl which is higher then my stupid delve trinket I can’t seem to get rid of? Telling me maxed out myth gear is a dps loss compared to my hero shit too

[warm marlin]

Legit ptsd from the days before i was an actual raider

[shrewd lantern]

i mean i watched people wipe to first boss mfo

[lilac stag]

We’re 5/9. have some that love keys. Others that see them as a chore. I’d imagjne most of your 7/9+ give less and less shits about keys than do.

[shrewd lantern]

4 months into the raid

[azure thicket]

in 17 keys as a casual guy keys it feels like living through dread screech x blade rush wombo combo is my goal

[empty bobcat]

the urn?

[azure thicket]

maybe bank a 20 by the end of the season or something idk

[warm marlin]

we had one group that had the damage and was doing very well on imperator and the same tank wiped the group 6 times while continually saying he knew what he was doing

[hallow mortar]

thats actually pretty good that you dont need to stand in cloud for buff now

[void ocean]

wait what

[warm marlin]

udk is ungodly busted btw if you guys somehow weren't aware

[shrewd lantern]

chim was guaranteed to be a cesspit

[hallow mortar]

yeah the buff auto refresh

[slim anchor]

I have withered sapto’s paw and gaze

[shrewd lantern]

lots of terribad m+ monkeys

[void ocean]

u mean if u leave and come back?

[lilac stag]

It’s never been all
Puzzle box puzzle box. People run it because they’re poor (no guidon).

[empty bobcat]

oh the paw, thats sh*t though - it sims higher than box? no way

[hallow mortar]

you dont need to come back

[azure thicket]

also post ui then you gnome 🙂

[short vessel]

Are we still using Droptimizer as simming tool for m+?

[empty bobcat]

you need to for the full duration

[lilac stag]

the gap between the two widened with the sb change and now needing more haste to make box work.

[compact violet]

i was wondering about MM puzzle box instead of hm guidon on beloren for more egg dmg

[lilac stag]

also mastery dr not helping

[void ocean]

u mean it will last 20 sec if i pop it and leave instantly never to return?

[compact violet]

guess im gonna give a shot tonight

[shrewd lantern]

i mean the fact people were wiping on plexus 4 months into the raid

pugs are just lol

[slim anchor]

That’s what I’m saying. And according to stat sim I still need a fuck ton of mastery so it don’t see how that makes sense lol

[empty bobcat]

I just puzzle 3s into the pull then vanish (I play premed)

[lilac stag]

stat sims don’t exist

[hallow mortar]

yes, you can try it yourself

[short vessel]

Im simming now and it wants me to get crit/haste for ST and haste/mastery for multitarget and im uncertain to what i use my coins on 🙁

[dreamy wedge]

Can you link the sim @slim anchor ?

[shrewd lantern]

more damage pretty sure

even if they're the same ilvl

[compact violet]

did some good burn yesterday with guidon

[void ocean]

i killed loom with pugs in 8 pulls with like full melee grp xD

[compact violet]

8.3 my best i think

[shrewd lantern]

think @warm marlin was standing under the dropzone and boxing

[shrewd lantern]

before birb lands

[empty bobcat]

you lack haste without the paw?

its a stat haste no?

[shrewd lantern]

i need a 300k PR

we get it next week

[warm marlin]

ye

#subtlety message

[slim anchor]

Yea just a sec I was checking another sim I’ll link it

[shrewd lantern]

also gaze+velf proc during cds

[empty bobcat]

get 800 Haste without the paw then box 100% better

[azure thicket]

was just thinking about buffs in the top left corner today and then i laughed

[dreamy sundial]

Why do you need to see your buffs anywhere else o_O

[azure thicket]

you're better off seeing what debuffs are currently rotting you/griefing the healer

[compact violet]

what gear ur running atm ?

[azure thicket]

2004 goofy ui lmao

[shrewd lantern]

guidon gaze

like 281

lol

[compact violet]

and wtf ur shadowblade hit so much more than mine

[dreamy sundial]

My debuffs are underneath my buffs 😮

[shrewd lantern]

the bank 7 sc for burn special

aka int p1

[dreamy sundial]

anyways, you just continue using your crappy UI, randomly smacked elements on a screen

[compact violet]

we kill tonight for sure, gonna try box 89 on early pull

[shrewd lantern]

i send my cds at :19 when eggs spawn

partly because im first immune

[azure thicket]

yeah i need them in separate spaces personally

[dreamy sundial]

cause you're like Sid the sloth? Your eyes are far apart from eachother?

[dusky yacht]

Is there anything to spend crests on beyond leveling them up?

[slim anchor]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rZ2BMbQfppoKLucDTq6LAp

[white siren]

is sub still good, ive been in a key with a sin rogue and he just blasted and made the rest of us dps look like we just started playing.

[slim anchor]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rZ2BMbQfppoKLucDTq6LAp

[azure thicket]

bruh i don't have goat eyes they're just accustomed to tracking vertical movement cause of all the sick nasty spraydowns

[dreamy sundial]

you can't call this a visually appealing UI. This shit is messy and you should tidy it up

[white siren]

holy hell how can, what the.

[dreamy sundial]

TIDY UP YOUR UI dad mode

[white siren]

'I dont like blizzards UI' then makes it worse.

[dusky yacht]

That's exactly what blizzard ui looked like in vanilla

In raids

[empty bobcat]

do 5min

but probably you lack haste?

but yeah mastery is bad for 1 target

[azure thicket]

the quest tracker/m+ timer/lesser dbm timers are pretty cursed but they're ultimately just not important

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1329608349670576210/1389510100468764722/hot_gravel.mp4?ex=69f0639f&is=69ef121f&hm=3ebbcb28213ff6e543cf2f338ff6444cdb0ad87b8b4c25df7825aa739ea5d7cf&

i did want to replace some of that stuff but it doesn't do anything

[broken saffron]

Wait. what was the reason for dropping premeditation for ephemeral bond?

[dreamy sundial]

if it's not important, then hide it or tidy it up in such a way that it won't be an eyesore.

[dreamy wedge]

@slim anchor You are sure you didn't just let it only replace your gaze and not the paw?

[azure thicket]

but i gotta see the clock i gotta see deaths

i think i'm doing just fine 🙂

weirdo goat eye horizontal health bar enjoyer

[empty bobcat]

oh sry its dungeon slice, I rarely sim that

[dreamy sundial]

yeah meanwhile you're the apex predator with the snake eyes.

[slim anchor]

Not sure if I can do that on my phone? It’s locked out at 6. But I’m definitely under the haste value because the sims seem to only want me to have like 14% for some reason. Have some extra gear I’ve been saving in my bags because of these stupid sims. Didn’t take first 2 myth vaults because of this shit.

[slim anchor]

It shouldn’t have but I’m at work so I don’t have the sim c code and all the shit I run when I’m home so I can check that to be sure

[azure thicket]

i mean in a 20 you probably wanna pre defensive infected pinions

but good lord

[empty bobcat]

yeah sorry I didnt see it was dungeon slice at first, looked like a 6min boss sim

[edgy imp]

yeah i sim and it sims like 600 haste , sometimes idk what to run for mythic dungeons on my build & i know im over thinking it

[keen dome]

i think you might be facing the wrong way

[empty bobcat]

box sims higher than guidon for me

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/itZUdDkp8k55tRnmzq7KGx

I have 720 haste

no gaze tho

[warm marlin]

your saptor paw is the only thing keeping you above the haste breakpoint

you fall to like 580 haste without it

[empty bobcat]

yeah I figured

[lilac stag]

You’re fresh 90 ilvl.

[empty bobcat]

2 IDs

🙂

[lilac stag]

a fake and a real one?

[empty bobcat]

just in case ye

one says McLovin

[slim anchor]

Okay. I have that stupid solarflare trinket as well I’ll swap some of extra haste gear over and see where I land after that

[lilac stag]

You have basically no secondary stats so congrats. Box sims better in dslice. Get any amount of mastery (read ilevel) and in practice guidon will run better in every non-organized lfg m+ group without killing your ST dmg.

[somber sun]

stupid... 😔wdym...

[empty bobcat]

? no secondary stats? what does that mean?

[azure thicket]

also post ui during keys cmon now

[lilac stag]

Fresh 90 gear is basically pointless to sim. You have no stats. Get ilvl.

[empty bobcat]

???

sorry what? I am 270 sir

[lilac stag]

so you’re just above fresh 90.

[empty bobcat]

think u missclicked

[lilac stag]

269 not a miss click

[slim anchor]

I have gotten that trinket at every level and yea the sim says it’s better in some instances but it seems to be a like 5-10k loss so it just rots in my bags unless I play assa which I don’t tend to do because I’m not good at it haha

[empty bobcat]

haha ok no idea what you mean but ok :3

I have Myth feather, box still sims higher in ST

[lilac stag]

There’s a big jump in what you need to be worrying about from 269 to 281+ gear wise.

[azure thicket]

you could always target heart of wind if you need haste

[empty bobcat]

until then I will just keep using box 🙂

[lilac stag]

Get a guidon. Get 700 haste. Focus on master/crit for m+

[azure thicket]

it's extremely okay and servicable til something else becomes available

[empty bobcat]

I have 700 haste sir

🙂

I focus on mastery crit already

[lilac stag]

You need 800 for box

[azure thicket]

srry meant sting

[empty bobcat]

I use feather in ST

and can go 750 haste with mastery neck for M+

[lilac stag]

and how are you swapping that out in keys?

[empty bobcat]

I have heart in 2nd slot to box

well not during keys

but in raids

[lilac stag]

And your boss dmg is then shit

[empty bobcat]

nah its ok at 750 haste and heart

I can fit 2 sectecs 🙂

[lilac stag]

[empty bobcat]

its close but it works

haha I get that u dont like box buts its fine for me

[lilac stag]

Just play assa with box

[empty bobcat]

idk is it still dot heavy? I hate monitoring dots/bleeds

[warm marlin]

you can also just play haste flask

[empty bobcat]

but also, I love sub too much 🙂

[slim anchor]

Agreed. My rogue has been sub since wrath. Not changing it. I played tank for 6 seasons before I played outlaw or assa haha

[azure thicket]

yeah it's plate spinning still but you should try it

it's not what it used to be

you don't need mouseover rupture macros to make it go off

it's the most prio cleave version of itself so far if i'm saying that right

[void ocean]

might be an unpopular opinion but imho assa is the best thats looked in years

if blizz increased ct to spread to like 5 targets at least it would be perfect

[azure thicket]

also if you could change the direction text appears on the blizzard boss ability timeline thing i'd probably run that and turn off lesser dbm reminders entirely

right now it only appears to the left which is just

https://tenor.com/view/isaac-binding-of-isaac-polyphemus-i'll-poly-your-phemus-the-binding-of-isaac-gif-14456471071462044285

[brisk onyx]

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/1stny7i/whole_weeks_raid_progress_ruined_because_of/

[dusky yacht]

Don't you just spam CT anyway

[brisk onyx]

OMFG

my guild meet this issue

fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck

[void ocean]

well you do since when u r done applying bleeds with 2-target spread its time to reapply and do all over

[azure thicket]

nope the implacable apex talent means you do not do that

[keen dome]

Well, that fucking sucks and is awful

[azure thicket]

after all targets have bleeds applied

[dusky yacht]

Why not

[void ocean]

fok crits more afaik

[azure thicket]

it's 60 energy versus 35 on fok also

so you will ooe faster and then spend more time getting implacable back up

[dusky yacht]

Weird, I remember people telling me in assas channel that I should spam CT perma

[azure thicket]

but there's some stuff from last week ye that says spam ct

[dusky yacht]

But eh doesn't matter I guess

[azure thicket]

the only time i found it to be good was on low hp mobs cause it is slightly more damage than fok per cast

im sure there's a specific cook to get the 1% dam increase there

[empty bobcat]

I actually have not the worst gear for assa - might try

[broken saffron]

Do we ever use to finishers right after the other? or is it best to to keep building for ancient arts?

[void ocean]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  If all of the above are true, use cast a Shadowstrike / Shuriken Storm (even if on full cp).

[broken saffron]

Lord. I wonder how much this have been affecting my dmg haha

[hazy breach]

Not that much

[broken saffron]

ah man...

[stuck arrow]

They're was a CT bleed bug iirc. I think fixed a bunch of patches ago.

[empty bobcat]

its minmaxing

[void ocean]

well iirc its more than 1%, innit?

smth like 1.5, no?

its even bigger for DS but i guess we dont play ds anymore

[broken saffron]

What was the site where I could check how poeple are perfoming on m+?

[empty bobcat]

warcraftlogs?

[broken saffron]

Yes thanks!

[void ocean]

im not sure how many ppl logs m+ tho

so the results might not be representative

[fading whale]

Tuning coming 5th of may?

[empty bobcat]

not many rogues on warcraftlogs

[void ocean]

that too

what keys r required for 3400 rio, is it like all 17 or...

[empty bobcat]

nah 15s I think

[hazy breach]

Maybe, maybe not

[quaint breach]

all 16s

[broken saffron]

yeah, I just need a reference point. Last dung I was at 70k on single target

[empty bobcat]

rly? our main tank has 3300 something with some 15s and 14s

[quaint breach]

mine

[keen dome]

16/17's or some mixture of it and some 15+++ stuff

[empty bobcat]

oh ok

[void ocean]

aye, tnx

still long way to go 😄

just timed several 14s on my 2 chars

[azure thicket]

ye ppl are still getting owned by wind chakrams in 16s so

it's definitely doable

[void ocean]

will probably wait till i get more gear

i expect in a few weeks to have first few mythic bosses on farm in pugs

which is all i need

[fading whale]

Wasnt it scheduled

[trail rover]

is building to 6 instead of 7 in the opener/pre sd a big loss? feels like i often end up with 6 and need to hit another backstab for 7

[void ocean]

shiv 😄

[somber sun]

Why not try pugging it on this week's reset ?

[azure thicket]

considering sec tec is uncapped

probably yeah

[void ocean]

i spent several hours on Saturday queing... 0 invites

most likely due to not having kills already

[somber sun]

what's your ilevel if I may ask?

[fading whale]

Always sec at 7

[void ocean]

276 on dk 274 on rogue

[somber sun]

I mean if the guys had chim on Heroic compeleted and 280ilevel why not accept

[somber sun]

ohh

yeah prob by next vault

should get to that juicy 280

[stuck arrow]

Oh yeah, that won't happen.

The entire list is people 280+ with 4-5 mythic kills, even if they not Chim.

[void ocean]

naah ppl r all about "write exp in note, checking logs, checking blood pressure, urine..."

[dry flame]

I see I'm not the only one in 3.3k jail.

I've barely gained io past 2 weeks, because pugging has been really bad. All the 16 and 17s I've joined were abandoned.

[stuck arrow]

They don't look at that shit lol.

They look at your ilvl and your parses, and that's it

Anything you say about xp is meaningless.

[void ocean]

yea, i tried fishing with "almost CE last season" but didnt help

[pallid jackal]

So now we recraft our item essentially? After patch and new updates

for bis list

[somber sun]

then lowkey the plan would be to get 280i, apply to a H/M guild, pass the trial and get to M progs

only way I can see it

cause even if you kinda meet reqs on pugs

its very annoying to get in the group

[dry flame]

And by check logs, they just look at how shiny the number is.

I got declined for myth chim a couple weeks ago because I had a blue log. But if he knew to check I was by far top boss dmg and 3x everyone else's interrupts...

(I rekilled on Assa to have a higher parse later)

[void ocean]

it takes a bit patience true, but last season i was 3/8M on alt with just pugs

kileld first 2 bosses multiple times and sometimes when dinars came to be i killed loom as well

[azure thicket]

i got into a myth chim pug with a 6 parse on myth vorasius

[void ocean]

got antenna for my dk

[somber sun]

yeah idk what hit people this expac

[azure thicket]

didn't puzzle box it and did maximum safety plays didn't even die ._.

but also hot 90s this season and last so whatever

[dry flame]

Yeah, Ive been reclearing chim weekly, wasn't issue long term, just funny

[azure thicket]

ye im just being goofy lol

[dry flame]

People with the most requirements are usually the worst

[azure thicket]

sometimes you just gotta play the hand you got

https://tenor.com/view/seal-scream-gif-11245258

[void ocean]

good thing is since im not a progress raider this season i rly dont need to rush so chillin a bit for like 3 weeks is fine

i got hc guidon and gaze so its alright

[dry flame]

My hand is work, queue for m+ for 2h after work and go to sleep

XD

Emphasis on queuing for m+, not actually doing

[dry flame]

Me neither, I'm pug lord

[void ocean]

i just wish they start unlocking pug ids sometimes

so u can do it boss by boss

[dry flame]

But @keen dome can confirm my hatred for mythic lockouts

[void ocean]

good thing with having these raids separated is that u do chim and VS on separate lockouts

[azure thicket]

yeah run a good key and add the tank afterward

if you keep doing that you will run into ultra ballers who do 18s and stuff

[grave parcel]

You have to build up your own key it’s the only way as rogue in this meta. And sometimes that means doing lots of keys u don’t need but at least your gaming and not sitting in LFG

[dry flame]

It seems none of the good tanks are pugging 16-17s but I will keep trying

[dry flame]

I've been rebuilding my own key for 2 weeks, i don't have time to keep bouncing between my resi 15 and then get depleted after xD

[calm wing]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Single Target / Mythic+: Haste(~18%, roughly 650-700) > Critical Strike = Mastery > Versatility`

[keen dome]

Hate it with a passion, too

[azure thicket]

did 4-5 pulls of mythic salhadaar with the guild and smoked my lockout cause i overslept on tuesday <_>

[keen dome]

rip 🙁

that sucks

[azure thicket]

yeah im not pressed about it still 280

steak just buttery enuff lol

mythic flex seems balanced since you only get what 3 pieces of loot sub 20 raiders

hopefully they push it to all raids sooner rather than later 10 mans were what i knew back in wrath/cata

[glacial stag]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Light's Potential
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[azure thicket]

also the gear sets were different in 10s..so if you wanted the full bis you ran 25s

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS9HFfRgME_s-k5EtZn8lvGoear6Yvc-c9-cw&s purple man 🙂

[hard shard]

anyone else suddenly missing the black arcs that serve as the visual indicator for the ancient arts proc?

[warm marlin]

spell alert opacity in game settings

[stuck lance]

There's a setting for it @hard shard something transpancy or opacity

[hard shard]

yeah thats it ty vm

[dry flame]

@vale pine i like the new color formatting on the macro command - good job!

[dusky yacht]

Punz is being positive again

Anyway Moroes told me to go take a nap so I'mma go take a nap

[vale pine]

its the same code highlighting

discord just updated the highlight colors

XD

[dry flame]

no, im upset and negative

ive not gained io in two weeks

big madge

ive plato-ed as a pug

[woven nimbus]

[dusky yacht]

I would totally understand this brilliant pun if I knew anything about philosophy

[dry flame]

😉

im contemplating my subscription, that's why

[dusky yacht]

I'm at 3230 io right now

Been doing some 15s with guildleader

It's comfy not giving a shit about io

[dusky yacht]

Please don't quit you're my only hope when we're doommaxxing on patchday

[empty zinc]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Light's Potential
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[dry flame]

its all we have, guildless pugs

[dry flame]

I remain for now

https://giphy.com/gifs/arnold-schwarzenegger-predator-pHb82xtBPfqEg

[dusky yacht]

https://giphy.com/gifs/tophermcgee3-denzel-washington-my-man-gictytW9IIIkNGIMcs

[weak horizon]

Anyone know by chance if I didn't use my 2 bonus rolls this week, or don't even complete the voidforge quest line until after reset, if I'll be able to have a total of 4 bonus rolls after reset?

[warm marlin]

cap goes up by 2 each week

[weak horizon]

Ok so kinda like crests I guess?

[warm marlin]

yes

[weak horizon]

[short vessel]

I'm not sure if i sim correctly or not, but when using Droptimizer to check what gear i target with my Voidcores, but all the items are just a minor minor upgrade. Am i simming wrong?

[astral axle]

sharing a link to the sim results you mention may be more helpful than your character sheet

[charred sandal]

mogs clean tho

[shrewd lantern]

nothing matches

besides the helm+tabard

[gleaming crane]

we sim with this right ?

[shrewd lantern]

2 bosses why

also latest

[gleaming crane]

someone told me as rogue you sim 2bosses 5min

[shrewd lantern]

???

[gleaming crane]

thats my im asking

[tepid trellis]

that guy should

ehm

not speak

[shrewd lantern]

eat british food

for a week

[gleaming crane]

yeah thats my i ask here xD

[prime mortar]

Who? So we can put some shame on his name

[vale pine]

latest instead of weekly but ye

[prime mortar]

And wish him a hot pillow. On both sides.

[gleaming crane]

so 1 or 2 bosses ?

[prime mortar]

1 boss, latest.

5 min

[flat snow]

Revel in this divinely abundant boon!

[prime mortar]

Change the optimal weapon stuff for something AP

See here #subtlety-faq message

[keen dome]

Praise dundun

[hazy breach]

For ST you'd do 1 boss ofc, and if you for some reason want stuff about 2 targets you'd sim that

[vale pine]

1 boss for single target

[sick dagger]

is it poss to sim adamantite sharpening stone btw?

[hazy breach]

No

But use it on your mainhand

Since blizzard seems to not fix it

[prime mortar]

Wait

What the fuck is going on with this?

Is there a secret tech?

[vale pine]

its just weapon damage and crit

[prime mortar]

But like thalassian phoenix oil isn't better?

[hazy breach]

Not on your mainhand no

[shrewd lantern]

also if you want to be

super cheap on irrelevant content

bubbling wax still works

[surreal orbit]

!log lol poisons Chimaerus Heroic

[shrewd lantern]

👍

[hazy breach]

R1 oils are like 4 gold each

[shrewd lantern]

it did like 0.5% of my overall

is it that bad

[hazy breach]

Worse than oils yeah

[shrewd lantern]

wait is an oil more than that lmao

thought that was how much wax did last ssn

only annoying part of adamantite is the buff is only 1h

[prime mortar]

K, guess it is not mentionned on the wowhead and icyveins

Was there a post or something about it?

[hazy breach]

I mean this is the type of thing blizzard usually fixes really quick

They just havent this time

[prime mortar]

Well, cursed tech here i come

[vale pine]

correct. link

[short vessel]

Sorry about that, here you go:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bTfYqdd83NcWM1rbAqnQVi Patchwerk 1 target.
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bQewmKWDcoYXTtsEnkoTXC Patchwerk 5 target.
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mxZ561PwBvNNpfZ25XzgDb Dungeon Slice

[prime mortar]

Watch me buy a whole stack for it to be fixed right away

[prime mortar]

Sorry Fuu then, it is
I just stopped by the cheat sheet a bit more up, didn't go that far

[warm marlin]

these gains look normal to me

[pure grail]

Can I still trust raidbot, even if I try to get to 800 haste and he has a different one (around 650). I keeps feeding me versa and mastery and I am not sure weither I can trust him or not. Not sure if these results are just a follow up mistake due to the wrong haste break point or not.

[hazy breach]

Not sure what you mean by minor, 1% seems completely normal

[vale pine]

all fine ^^, i was just mean

[warm marlin]

you need more crit though fella

for st at least

[hazy breach]

Also droptimizer undervalues your mainhand upgrade as its only replacing your mainhand without putting your embellishment in the offhand

Nvm im stupid it doesnt do that anymore

[prime mortar]

Ah yeah question.

Droptimizer doesn't care about embelishment no?

[hazy breach]

Not sure what you mean

[prime mortar]

It is replacing my offhand with the embelish for something with 289 ilvl

Top gear too

Maybe i fucked up something tho on the sim settings

[hazy breach]

Topgear factors in that you can only use 2 embellishments yes

[prime mortar]

Weird, as said, it recommended that i remove my offhand with embelissh to put a dagger 289 i have

[hazy breach]

Sounds like you messed something else up, enchants or whatever

[prime mortar]

Probably yeah

[prime mortar]

Btw. I'm always asking myself this question.
When going with the top gear, what is the best approach? Sil to pick the best gear and then sim again to replace enchants and gems accordingly, or try to do everything at the same time?

[hazy breach]

You dont really need to sim replacing gems or enchants

[sick dagger]

Still on main hand if it makes ur char not reach the 700 breakpoint?

[sharp sapphire]

just wondering. do we delay Shadowblades to get it in line with 2nd Light's Potential?

[hazy breach]

Sometimes yes. Most of the time no though

Like if a fight is 5:30 long, you only get 4 uses of blades either way, so might aswell hold the last on for pot

[prime mortar]

So... How do you pick which one is the best then?

[hazy breach]

If the fight is 6:30 you get 5 blades if you send on cd, in which case you'd want to hold the pot for the last blades instead

[hazy breach]

What? You sim it once or just follow the guides

You just dont need to do it every time you get an upgrade

[prime mortar]

Oh.

Well

[sage tangle]

!ui

[wicked jolt]

Essential:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - Enhanced Cooldown Manager.
• WangBar / SensaiBar - Resource bar (when using blizzard CDM)
• MSUF / UUF - Unit frame mods.
• Platynator - Nameplate Addon.
  Quality of Life:
• Buff Reminders - Food/Flask/Poison Reminder.
• WilduTools - QOL enhancements.
• Mute Cold Blood sound
• The first dance tracker

[sturdy mortar]

Just to make sure I am understanding, our cloud cover is no longer visible to anyone but ourselves? Ima make a text alert, "Dropping smoke, don't move too far please" as I watch my tank pull everything away from my cloud cover. Big sad.

[lilac stag]

Why?

[swift tinsel]

don't hit blades if the tank is still gathering

you really only need to worry about cloud duration if its nearly up and you've been out of it for a bit

unless the tank is actively griefing you or you're intentionally trolling yourself, its really not that hard to manage

[warm marlin]

you do not have to stay in the smoke at all

[sturdy mortar]

Sun roof flow.

[spice matrix]

yea I'm not sure if that's intended but I'm chill with it

[warm marlin]

I very much hope they do not make any more changes to how smoke bomb works!

any changes at all

[swift tinsel]

maybe it is intended as a bone they throw to us

[karmic harbor]

How do i make it so swirlies arent impossible to see

[swift tinsel]

but almost certainly not

[hollow plinth]

it's been a week, they already forgot how it works and the code is unmaintainable magic

[azure thicket]

make sure they're not hiding under your action bars :)c

[swift tinsel]

I'm just happy they didn't 'fix' anything with the energy removal

I think its in a fine state personally

[warm marlin]

turn particle density down to low

[swift tinsel]

they didn't like how fdk's dnd/oblit cleave worked, hard to imagine they'd want to actively add it to a different class

[warm marlin]

but also related to the above

[swift tinsel]

different for bdk bc they're the ones that would be moving

[warm marlin]

try to press it during tank movement so that it drops far away from where you end up and doesnt block your vision

(this is a lot easier on outlaw)

[surreal orbit]

Which situations best utilize cloud cover?

[swift tinsel]

where you want to do damage

typically a good way to utilize it

[surreal orbit]

where tf did I import a build from that wasn't using Cloud cover and I labeled it M+

Welp I was working that shit in 10s last night and topping soo if it's the better talent Im happy to have fixed it lol

[fierce ivy]

Yea, but then you have to run back and dip into it to extend it

[hallow mortar]

you dont

[fierce ivy]

what? really?

[west tide]

chat what i i just sub on lura its so chill and ez

[hallow mortar]

they fixed it, you dont need dip in it after you use it

[west tide]

aint no way otl gonna be crazy betta…

[sturdy mortar]

I was partly kidding to be fair, but there are times where I have been waiting to send and as soon as I think everything is gathered.I send and bam we start moving again. Blades I try to hold until I am pretty confident we aren't moving... I can't say the same when ive been practicing outlaw though, I just be sending that shit and ive definitely had to grapple back to Narnia for the second half of the buff lol.

[surreal orbit]

whats homelander hollerin about

[hallow mortar]

look at this crazy guy representing us like that

among all sps

[swift tinsel]

milk

[fierce ivy]

Damn, you are right. I really do just get another 10 seconds of the buff after the smokebomb expires

Makes me wonder why the smokebomb is even there then. fml

[surreal orbit]

class fantasy

https://klipy.com/gifs/smokebomb-im-out--k01KQ825ZF12M59S7B5YM9HH8N8

[hallow mortar]

its there so you feel that rogue animation

[light finch]

holy snapshot batman, where does this damage from p1 comes from.

[hallow mortar]

idk he is crazy

[light finch]

dont want to piss on the parade, but first phase damage is worthless

[fierce ivy]

Well, thank you Kappucino! Makes at least some headaches go away 😁

[sturdy mortar]

This I didn't realize, haven't played since the hotfix. If that is actually the case that is cool.

[spice matrix]

Has to be intentional. Remember how shit it was for hunters with Wild Spirits

The screeching

[hollow spear]

I'm not going to cope myself into thinking it's intentional just yet

[sturdy mortar]

Is this on live? I just tried it and I got the 10 second countdown immediately leaving the smoke.

[final gulch]

im pretty sure u do have to be in it at some point

the buff lasts 10 seconds, the smoke lasts 10 seconds

if you just immediately leave the smoke the second half of your blades wont be buffed right?

you need to refresh the buff before the smoke fades im pretty sure

[hazy breach]

Youd think so

[final gulch]

is that not how it works

[hazy breach]

Try it

[velvet jay]

just tested it, you can stay out xD

[final gulch]

i haven't messed with it too much but that was my initial understanding

im at w*rk rn 😔 but that's crazy if that's not the case

i've been wasting my precious melee braincells trying to play around the smoke bro...

[azure thicket]

what about the taking reduced damage component that's also part of the fazed debuff right

also in pvp this is just mean lmao

[sturdy mortar]

I just retried it after my first initial, I must have dipped back into it, force of habit I guess. This time I stayed out the entire duration and I did receive the 10 seconds extra after. Nice flavor smoke I guess.

[vale pine]

!ban @rocky sage compromised account

[warm marlin]

blizzard blessed us when fixing the energy bug

and introduced this intended mechanic

[final gulch]

oh it's new with the 30 energy bug fix?

[warm marlin]

yes

[final gulch]

thank god they fixed that btw lol

it was so annoying having to wait for 60 energy sometimes

[sage meteor]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[alpine wraith]

so now we dont even need to stay in the cloud

ahaha

[swift tinsel]

maybe its an apology bug

lmao

however it ended up in there I'm a fan

[alpine wraith]

maybe it was the masterplan of a dev

introduce a bug so then you can fix it and buff roguye

[swift tinsel]

I'm of the mind its intended

[sick sand]

guys are we still using stone on mainhand?

[calm wing]

I have a question sorry if it was already asked here but after the changes, do I spend combo points as soon as I can during dance or do I just spam shadowstrike ?

[jade oasis]

wdym

[karmic harbor]

Are you guys using blades on alleria or the 2 adds?

[calm wing]

I'm not sure either, I'm genuinely confused. I saw some people talk that that you're supposed to overcap on combo points sometimes during shadow dance

so I'm asking if thats the case or not

[warm marlin]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  If all of the above are true, use cast a Shadowstrike / Shuriken Storm (even if on full cp).

[warm marlin]

this is the only time you overcap cp with strike (and the command isnt clear but you don't do this with secret tech up)

[warm marlin]

i held it for the 2nd add set in p3 but otherwise tunneled boss

[calm wing]

I see so I only want to use a spender to spend ancient arts?

[calm wing]

okay okay

sorry im slow

[jade oasis]

no reason to apologize

for asking a question

[wintry dock]

puzzle box is really good yes?

[calm wing]

thank you

[warm marlin]

build spend at 6+ like normal until you're in dance and your secret technique isn't ready to be cast and you still have a supercharged point and you have 5 shadow techniques stacks, then you strike (at low target counts) or storm (at high target counts) to proc ancient arts, then finish and continue as normal

[calm wing]

you're very nice

[jade oasis]

anyways time for an actual stupid question

how do i pre pot?

[wintry dock]

https://tenor.com/view/akakichi-no-eleven-bro-bad-news-i've-got-bad-news-for-you-hand-on-shoulder-gif-4737126791591033318

[sturdy mortar]

Ryldd is the fish goat.

[alpine wraith]

go back in time like 8 years

[calm wing]

This is my second season of playing wow and the first season of playing rogue as I played MM hunter in S3 TWW so I genuinely feel like a lobotomized monkey infront of a church organ but rogue is really fun

[alpine wraith]

then use a potion before pull then you can use another

[graceful rock]

Okay I’ve been kinda vibing this situation previously but I’m curious is there’s a correct way to do it.

Beloren egg phase, I have 5 pre charged combo points. What do I do after my first dance expires but before my 2nd sec tech is up? Am I spending normally? Doing the AA min max on the super charges out side of dance? Holding them until dance? What do I do?

[alpine wraith]

you send 3 dances in a row

slam it down

[warm marlin]

you have lust yes?

[graceful rock]

Yes

1st phase

[warm marlin]

if you have 5 before and you do the apex optimization entire time

you should be able to chain dances and use the last supercharged point on sectec

[graceful rock]

Oh

[alpine wraith]

also try to bank sht

[graceful rock]

I see

Yeah I’m practically afk for 1 minute

But I chain the 3rd dance too?

[warm marlin]

nah you hold that one for last 8s

you can fit 3rd sectec in

see here #subtlety message

[graceful rock]

That one doesn’t need sc right?

[sturdy mortar]

I remember for manaforge Salhadaar, I looked at logs and was like, "Who the hell is Tingus Bingus(guppy)" and when I saw him put the droptimizer link, I swear I heard a choir.

[alpine wraith]

it is to get the damage in that is why you hold kinda

[warm marlin]

no way to sc it

[alpine wraith]

so just send it when 8 secs left

and it gets mdway i think

[warm marlin]

back when i wasnt washed amen

[sturdy mortar]

Nah you still the goat, if Ryldd no longer has someone chanting goat status, that means Charrend assassinated me.

[graceful rock]

Okay yeah

I was seeing some crazy variance on Thursday and want to try to mitigate it as much as we aim for a kill today

Literally from like 220k to 290k it was weird

[alpine wraith]

crit variance will still be there

but still

[graceful rock]

I mean surely it’s not 70k?

Or am I clueless

[warm marlin]

hm probably misplay or something

[graceful rock]

I’ll clip my best pull

[warm marlin]

i kinda generational lowrolled on our kill pull and was still 250k

[graceful rock]

And my worst

[warm marlin]

charmander my mortal enemy

filthy red name

[daring raptor]

Are we using the adamantite sharpening stone still?

[alpine wraith]

if your haste is fine you can use it mh

[daring raptor]

got 651 with weapon enchatns right now

[radiant swift]

do we not have to sit in cloud anymore or was that a meme?

[warm marlin]

you do not have to sit in cloud anymore

[radiant swift]

damn nice

surely on both specs right

[warm marlin]

yes

[sacred jewel]

What has changed?

[warm marlin]

when they changed the energy the smoke cloud behaviour also changed

[daring raptor]

got 651 haste with current oils- Do i use adamntite sharpening stone or the oils?

[warm marlin]

there is a possibility you may not have to be inside it for the buff to refresh anymore

[trail bison]

is this optimization still true

[warm marlin]

if that is how it worked im sure they intended it though

[sacred jewel]

I’ve been redipping into the cloud cover to refresh the buff, so you actually don’t?

[warm marlin]

not anymore

[calm wing]

How do I do the opener now that we dont play premed?

[hazy breach]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

• The first Ancient Arts cannot proc while Premeditation is up, which is why it is a DPS loss to talent into it as the Shadowstrike clones with rotten up can crit insanely hard.
• There is also a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts 3. (This does not matter much numerically, but feels weird)

[hazy breach]

wait nvm

[sturdy mortar]

!opener

[wicked jolt]

The following opener is recommended without Premeditation:
Shadowstrike-> Vanish +Shadowstrike -> Backstab until 7 cp + Guidon -> Cooldowns

[sacred jewel]

strike vanish strike backstab until 7

[formal pollen]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[warm marlin]

noob

[calm wing]

thank you !

[radiant swift]

wait wdym there is a possibility

[calm wing]

in aoe I don't need to vanish as ill hit max combo points form 1 shuriken stormright ?

[radiant swift]

[warm marlin]

we keep it on the downlow

i dont want to go back into the smokecloud

[radiant swift]

bet bet bet

police aint gettin a word out of me

[west tide]

ty for this i will do more damage now

i just never thought about poolin the supercharge lmao

[warm marlin]

Good luck gamer

[spice matrix]

just make sure Switching gets all those pesky birds

[west tide]

switchin my goat

[sturdy mortar]

told you homie, Ryldd stonks going up.

[west tide]

we gonna get that first egg to 25% with this change bro

i will crit every ability

[quartz prism]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Light's Potential
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[sturdy mortar]

Out of curiosity, for this tech, did you rely on lust solely, or did you bump up to 800 haste since you are running without guidon?

[grave wyvern]

does the macro with guidon work to get the extra dance time ? i read that we need a smal delay in order to work

[hazy breach]

You need a delay inbetween guidon and dance yes

[nocturne totem]

Guidon -> 1 sec -> Dance -> Blades

[grave wyvern]

okay thx

[outer orchid]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1488547832062415010/drop_fixed.png

[lilac stag]

You’ll crit the backstab.

[west tide]

may god guide my hands

[graceful rock]

youre not criting the goremaws tho

[warm marlin]

probably correct to play 800 haste

i ran my top gear with guidon and forgor to change for puzzie only

you can still fit triple tech at 690 or whatever with lust so its probably mostly fine

[wispy star]

somebody mentioned, that you slightly have do delay shadow dance -> shadowblade when using light company guidon. So you cant macro that trinket. Does anyone know how long that delay has to be?

[warm marlin]

triple tech with pot maybe > optimal 2x sectec in blades in second amp

[warm marlin]

1s to be safe

[wispy star]

sry just few messages above somebody mentioned it

[astral axle]

you'll know you did it too quickly if something like this happens

#subtlety message

[trail bison]

wait was this an answer to my question or the cover one

[warm marlin]

both

you just dance last 8s of blades now

hard to do the supercharger thing with the guidon delay bug (and its within margin of error anyway)

[trail bison]

i figured it wasnt that much of a difference but I think it lines up consistently for me. good to know tho

[vale osprey]

!log

[vale osprey]

If any big brainers feel like a bit of puzzle solving - all help welcome.

[solid bear]

Is it better to ss in cds and not evis?

[weary tree]

done a bit

[quaint breach]

in maisara caverns, how big is the dmg radius of the trash mobs shields after 1st boss? (when removed)

edit: rip it's 60 yards

[frigid light]

!prem

[potent relic]

for mythic beloren, if i have both myth track guidon & puzzle box, since we are holding cds for egg burn does puzzle box end up being better in that case?

[edgy imp]

anyone running Enchant Weapon - Jan'alai's Precision in MH ?

[alpine wraith]

yea puzzlebox is strong but guidon is also fine

just remember if puzzle is your pick get 800+ haste

[lilac stag]

you can if your only focus is raid

[hazy breach]

What weapon theyre on has no impact, but you can run it for pure ST raid if you want. Id just recommend 2 agility ones though

[chilly dagger]

Elusiveness or Cheat Death for M+? 😮

[vale osprey]

Thank you mate - I'd noticed a lot of what you said too but idk if it explains the lack of dam our other rogue is doing there, will have to investigate more!

[weary tree]

Better take an average to see

Instead of 1 pull

[vale osprey]

Yeah, if we had more than 1 p2 pull I'd aggregate haha

[mortal arch]

cheat death until you reach a key level where you think you need the 20% dr to live non-feintable damage

[weary tree]

Cant have anything to check for you myself. Did it before the rotten changes and was Assa then since it did more damage at that point for intermission

[jade oasis]

i take elusive

DR is nice

[quaint breach]

I'm elusive and I take cheat 🙃

[jade oasis]

wtf

[fiery cobalt]

If I don’t mythic raid is it worth spending rerolls on heroic raid over spending rerolls on a puzzle box?

[hazy breach]

I wouldnt go for puzzlebox either way. Either go for other slots in myth track from dungeons (like chest/helm/weapon) or aim for trinkets from raid

[timid rose]

I was all like... I came from monk and enhance I can just run elusive . I don't need no cheat. Then my group teased me because I died the first big pull we did without it

[hazy breach]

But probably more worth to get myth track

[fiery cobalt]

Okay! I just have atrocious trinkets right now so I wasn’t sure because I know that all the dungeon trinkets are kinda booty

[vagrant sinew]

a heroic guidon goes a long way on itself aswell

and its the first boss, barely classifies as raiding

[shrewd lantern]

myth solarflare is probably better

[hazy breach]

Very little difference between the different ilvls of guidon too

[shrewd lantern]

than heroic passive

[fiery cobalt]

I just wasn’t sure if it was even worth using a 2 rerolls for a single attempt at a hero trinket vs getting 2 myth pieces

[glacial hinge]

can someone help me sim related ( cuz of the 700haste threshoud) ?

[paper stirrup]

anyone have a macro to use stealth and vanish on same button? stelth out of combat, vanish in combat?

[shrewd lantern]

dont think you can set that conditional

[paper stirrup]

it was simple #showtooltip
/cast [combat] Vanish; Stealth

[shrewd lantern]

what if you want to mash for restealth

and vanish is off cd

😂

[paper stirrup]

then ur fucked

[shrewd lantern]

yeah no thanks

better to have seperate binds

[paper stirrup]

sure, but im a lazy fuck

[shrewd lantern]

sub needs more buttons anyway

lost 4 with the prune