subtlety

[warm marlin]

you save one supercharger for the last egg set

and dance sectec it

that one is scary

[shrewd lantern]

yeah thats what he did

[warm marlin]

and you only need 5 for burn

[small vortex]

this sounds incredibly cursed

[warm marlin]

you dont want to still be backstabbing at 1:50 though

[shrewd lantern]

wait where do you get 5

[small vortex]

but whatever kills boss deader

[warm marlin]

you want to stop your unseen blade icd

need it to come up asap in burn

[shrewd lantern]

the dance before that one he still spent

[steep raven]

How does the opener without Premed looks now?

[solemn isle]

backstab to full then send cds

[warm marlin]

6-1 from sectec on last set of eggs

[shrewd lantern]

the rebirth starts at 1:51 doesnt it

but all these logs send cds at around 1:59

lmao

[warm marlin]

no it starts at 1:58/9

if you hold properly

[small vortex]

rebirth cast starts but egg is targetable ~10s later

[shrewd lantern]

oh no 1:51 is when hes going to do the thingy

[warm marlin]

who is this im curious

[small vortex]

looks like the second log on lorrgs

might be wrong

[fathom adder]

[shrewd lantern]

yeah

its that one

[small vortex]

Bloodbagg

[gilded cosmos]

GV in assa or subt spec?

[warm marlin]

hmm interesting

[small vortex]

he's playing rotten eh..

op..

[vale pine]

both have the same loot pool

[frosty axle]

why isnt he eviscerating

[shrewd lantern]

holding supercharger for burn

[small vortex]

egg dmg is the only real dmg so holding burst for it

[frosty axle]

for over a whole minute?

[warm marlin]

if your raid can kill stuff without you ye

[frosty axle]

how many supercharged points

[fathom adder]

does the bonusroll always grant an item or can it fail like in mop?

[shrewd lantern]

yeah basically taking the pts from 2 dances

[warm marlin]

ideally 5

[shrewd lantern]

only spending 1 on sectech on add spawn

ig

[solemn isle]

always is the expectation

[warm marlin]

5 specifically is good because in my experience the very last SC point is the one you use on your second sectec in blades

[fluid sedge]

guys any rotation changes with new patch today?

[warm marlin]

having 4 would miss it

[fathom adder]

ok lets hope so, thank you

[ripe flame]

you always get a random item from the loot pool, and after you get it its out of the pool for next rolls

[small vortex]

if i understand looking at lorrgs they basically turbo blast first add with blades then just like afk till burn

[warm marlin]

meh if you want to parse

[small vortex]

just clicking dance with sectec then shadowstriking/backstabbing

[warm marlin]

in our raid those adds just insta die anyway

i just press on pull

[dusky yacht]

wtf is going on

[warm marlin]

pooling supercharger for beloren burn

[shrewd lantern]

i dont think he charged his 2nd st

lmao

[fair stump]

Are you guys using blades + guidon at the start of beloren

Or just dancing without blades?

[ripe flame]

he did not

[thorny obsidian]

currently i blade and guidon since i have blades up at the first egg

[shrewd lantern]

i mean if you're doing the most to egg wouldnt you want to aa optimize

each finisher

[thorny obsidian]

as folks dps increase i'll hold, you want it up for egg phase

[shrewd lantern]

@ripe flame also wait do the circles around people with an arrow go on the person its targeting or the person standing in the way of it

[hardy olive]

Do the pinned guides here also apply to PvP gearing?

[ripe flame]

standing in the way

[raw wadi]

where can i get the cloud cover icon ?

🙁

[ripe flame]

you are supposesd to get soaked by a person of the other color

and that aoe is around them

if it hits you it would be around you but if you are the one targeted by the quill that shouldn't happen since someone needs to save your buttcheeks

[hallow mortar]

does feint work on silver arrow on cosmos?

[shrewd lantern]

ahh yes so its going on the person saving you

[lilac stag]

#pvp

[ripe flame]

yep

[hardy olive]

Thanks

[rain stratus]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[shrewd lantern]

do you have dry no spend saving for 2nd burn or

looks like you send blades around 3:30 as normal then the second burn is around 5mins?

[ripe flame]

I haven't reached that yet so not sure how tight that 5 min timer is

[shrewd lantern]

yeah im just looking at timers and it seems they're sending around 5?

[ripe flame]

I think some logs send and some don't

[raw wadi]

@foss and what can i find in the pins?

[ripe flame]

I have seen some where the 2nd burn is faster at like 04:45 ish 04:50

[shrewd lantern]

death drop is at 4:46 so i assume the egg becomes a target around 4:56?

https://lorrgs.io/spec_ranking/rogue-subtlety/beloren-child-of-alar

[ripe flame]

and they obv don't send at 3:30

with more gear I'm assuming the 2nd burn will be faster

so prob holding will be better?

not sure

[shrewd lantern]

its based on when he "dies" isnt it

[ripe flame]

yeah when the bird's hp reaches 0

[shrewd lantern]

is it possible the 1st one starts earlier than 2mins

[ripe flame]

people hold dps

[shrewd lantern]

and i might need to send pull

oh

[ripe flame]

so they have 2 min

for burn

[shrewd lantern]

nvm then

2nd burn might be earlier then since we get another 1% buff and more gear

this week

[ripe flame]

yep

[shrewd lantern]

i guess we cant st the 4:31 lightdive

if that happens though

[ripe flame]

not sure, probably will depend on group damage, and I think people get one birb on boss there for extra funnel or w/e

so they kill one and let the other egg hatch again

don't quote me on that since I'm not 100% sure

but yea

[shrewd lantern]

well since the guides said to put birb on boss

people likely gonna do it

lets be real

[alpine wraith]

the real spec mm hunter gets a lot of dmg

because they get the extra crit etc from execute

so people will do it

[ripe flame]

The hatch damage is brutal for the other color. It taken us a while to get used to it

don't know much about MM so idk if with today changes they still get much dmg from that as well

[alpine wraith]

did they change the solar storm krangle

[dense coyote]

smoke

[tidal patrol]

hey, am interested in rerolling sub rogue but I keep hearing the specc is bottom tier and ill never get into groups. Is it that bad really?

[cursive tundra]

is this all from the cloud cover upgrade?

[lucid jackal]

yes

[cursive tundra]

like 3 stacks of fazed? 24% increased damage during burst

dam

that's pretty neat

[abstract cosmos]

@rancid sierra hey bro i got a new ring from raid can u sim it again for me

[vast dust]

If you want to play Rogue do so because you enjoy (like all of us here) but don’t go into it with expectations of it being top tier at the moment.

You will get plenty of declines for M+ groups, yes. People don’t love us scoundrels

[vale pine]

yes

new talent makes us go brr

[cursive tundra]

makes outlaw go brrrr even harder

still won't play that shit tho

so yeah

[sharp lark]

What’s the best way to use puzzle box, being a 2 min cd it doesn’t line up with blades usage - guessing just send with your next available dance?

[topaz raptor]

like a 3min trinket

[thorny obsidian]

I'm excited to try these new specs

[sharp lark]

Just hold until your next blades cd, effectively sitting on it for a minute?

[wanton mantle]

Yes

[topaz raptor]

yeah

[sharp lark]

Oof dats a feels bad

Okie

[solemn isle]

solarflare prism becoming equal value to gaze on my sims

[swift tinsel]

as a prism truther I approve

[stuck arrow]

What kind of Crit do you have, out of curiosity?

[coarse raven]

hi, wwhat soes it coast to upgrade the weapon and trinket tomorow ?

[paper blaze]

so crit becoming the play over mastery as of tomorrow ?

[cedar sapphire]

where is this info stated that we shouldnt use plater anymore but platinator and the suggested profiles? I know I read it somewhere but cannot find it now

[knotty oak]

What trink is better for m+ ? M track puzzle box or hero track guidon ?

[wide wigeon]

Puzzle box 10/10 times

[wintry heart]

Guidon is like 10x better for st

[wide wigeon]

I believe even myth guidon is worse than heroic puzzlebox

[wintry heart]

So guidon

[wide wigeon]

In AoE****

[hazy breach]

Would recommend guidon everywhere

[topaz raptor]

289 box outsims 276 guidon ST

[small vortex]

if you want a higher overall you should play box for big aoe

[hazy breach]

Not really

[small vortex]

but bosses do need to die!

[rancid sierra]

How many upgrade voidcores per week?

[wide wigeon]

this this this

[wintry heart]

I just want to nuke bosses so we time the key

[wintry heart]

No idea yet

[hazy breach]

You get way too deep into diminishing returns on mastery with box

[small vortex]

but also box channel is cringe!

[wide wigeon]

You don't even nuke bosses as sub, you just do like 10k more with guidon

The overall is more worth it

[topaz raptor]

box only hits a 10% dimenish lmao.

[hazy breach]

For big pulls mastery enchants+guidon+700 haste sims slightly higher than anything with box

[hazy breach]

Yeah but then your pot hits the 30s and 40s

[topaz raptor]

pots dont dimenish.

[hazy breach]

They do

[warm marlin]

yes they do

[small sleet]

only being able to box every other blades means the "big aoe gains" are not near as big as they feel like

[dense coyote]

smoke

[wintry heart]

Holding a trinket feels very bad and for that alone I will be running guidon

[dense coyote]

i use the box

[wintry heart]

And also puzzle box?

[dense coyote]

well thats the box i was referring to

[rancid sierra]

I was just simming myself and 289 Gaze is +4000 dps and 289 Radiant Plume is +4456 - its better?

[wicked wadi]

In keys you end up having to hold blades sometimes for it to be even worth using, then it lines up with box anyway

[wintry heart]

I don’t think I’ve come across many situations where holding blades was beneficial

[small sleet]

if youre regularly holding blades for 30s ur nuking ur own damage

[sharp lark]

This is true, absolute epidemic of tanks pulling 3 mobs when my blades are up

[dense coyote]

eww i hate that

[rustic raven]

Send the blades anyway lmao

[small sleet]

^

[wintry heart]

Just “accidentally” jump into some mobs

[small sleet]

if you hold blades those 3 mobs last even longer

[paper blaze]

send the smoke

[swift tinsel]

plus holding too much just means you cast less blades over time

which is no bueno

[sharp lark]

Tanks think I’m a hunter with all these butt pulls

[dense coyote]

yeah we have tricks so it will be fine they wont even notice lol

[wintry heart]

I think I’ve only held blades twice and it was a trash mobs are dying before it’ll be out and next pull is boss

[wicked wadi]

If blades is going to last longer than the pack i'm fighting is alive I hold it. Seems good, no?

[dense coyote]

when it comes to holding blades or not holding blades and or holding box i just do what i feel is right and i believe in the power of my fingers on the keyboard

[solemn isle]

hell yeah brother

[wintry heart]

If you do that enough you’ll lose out on blades casts

[swift tinsel]

its all vibes at the end of the day

[sick epoch]

what does exactly change on rottation now?

[swift tinsel]

also if you're fighting packs that consistently die in under 20 seconds you're probs ready for a few key levels higher

[sick epoch]

opening?

opener

[wicked wadi]

I mean more like if blades comes up and the pack i'm fighting is like 30% health I see little point casting it. Just wait for next pack

[swift tinsel]

ye just send dance

[wanton mantle]

And id say just send it cuz u will pry get blades on the next pull as well lol

[sharp lark]

I agree, especially if it’s a pug tank and you don’t know what they’re gunna pull next

[wicked wadi]

I'm just pugging 13s anyway it doesn't even matter. Just interesting to talk about

[wanton mantle]

Well thats pry the difference when u start hitting bigger keys 30% means a little different haha

[wicked wadi]

true

[stuck arrow]

With So Tricky you can even gas light tanks to think they over pulled somehow if you're slick.

[south kernel]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[fair phoenix]

fuu made new biss list for dgs guys

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[paper blaze]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[wintry heart]

Fuu should make the servers come up

[wicked wadi]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[fair phoenix]

@vale pine sorry for ping, how much hast this build u make for dgs have?

[small sleet]

u still run 700 haste

[alpine wraith]

any NA people can confirm if you can get the upgrade for the weps?

or is still not up

[small sleet]

still not up

[topaz raptor]

670 is what his ST sim has

[wintry heart]

Not up

[small sleet]

not supposed to be up for another hour

[alpine wraith]

kk

[fair phoenix]

where u can see that

[astral axle]

6....,,7??

[thorny ridge]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[fair phoenix]

k, thanks

lol 1278 mastery

[vale pine]

haste breakpoints don't change this patch

[fair phoenix]

[fair phoenix]

was just asking cause i see rings with ggiga mastery and low hast

❤️

[pseudo verge]

why exactly do we take ephemeral bond talent instead of premeditation in 12.0.5? dont really understand

[small sleet]

there's a bug with premed that makes you lose damage basically

[shrewd lantern]

[pseudo verge]

perfect time to be alive

[shrewd lantern]

its a feature wdym

[pseudo verge]

[vale pine]

It is mostly because we don't want to reduce shadow strike cast amounts during blades due to cloud cover

the bug mentioned is just on top of it

shadowstrike does a lot of damage due to the tripple fazed benefits

[shrewd lantern]

unless you dont crit

[vale pine]

150% crit damage is big

[shrewd lantern]

dire times

[vale pine]

ye

[pseudo verge]

i hope the meta won't be to just spam shadowstrikes during SD and only use Coup and ST

[eager latch]

does that mean we'll lean more into crit/haste gear?

[vale pine]

yes

[eager latch]

or is it still gonna be best to just follow the sim

[vale pine]

well for single target

[eager latch]

oh that's sick actually ngl

i wanna regear for outlaw, but i wasn't sure about secondaries

[vale pine]

you essentially switch to crit flask

thats the main change

[eager latch]

crit/haste regear is kinda based

[vale pine]

can go further into crit if you want

[sharp lark]

Oh do we switch to crit flask?

[vale pine]

but just try to get crit/mastery on gear once you have the 700 haste

[vale pine]

yes

[sharp lark]

Good friggin coms

[pseudo verge]

already sitting on almost 900 crit with flask

i was prepared for this change

[sharp lark]

I’m rather critty myself

[sacred shell]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lethal gale]

How big of difference is ~680 haste vs 700

[west tide]

any rogues on lura changing weapon embellish since it gives vers

or is it still da goat

[alpine wraith]

vers is fine

[hazy breach]

No point switching no

[alpine wraith]

unless you already have 2 leather pieces

double arcanoweave is still ok

[vale pine]

you typically want 700 to have enough wiggle room

[paper blaze]

voidsong chan neck is the go to then ?

[lethal gale]

Gotcha I’ll need to regem some stuff prob ty

[west tide]

i want the neck so badd so i can put on sexy rings

[dense jasper]

what is the number for night elves at night time?

[pseudo verge]

its around 0.05 second actually i think

[west tide]

im using heroic pit neck though im barely hittin 700

[vestal fog]

So the upgrade thingi, you need a myth item to upgrade it to 298 right

[west tide]

im going to bonus roll vorasius for a mythic weapon i still dont have, i will fel soo bad if i use my item upgrade on my crafted dagger

[hazy breach]

1%, so it doesnt matter for this

[dense jasper]

thats how i've been treating it, haste to 18% regardless of what my number says. which is something like 584ish i think

[hazy breach]

You want ~700 haste

[summer cloud]

with crit becoming important now for sure gaze/puzzlebox will still be better than the voidegg right?

[dense jasper]

you're saying regardless of NE racial, still want 700?

[hazy breach]

Yes

!Haste

[wicked jolt]

Secret Techniques cooldown gets reduced by all haste sources, while Shadow Dances duration only gets increased by Haste Rating from gear or consumables. When using an on-use haste trinket, make sure to use it a bit before Shadow Dance to get the extended duration.
The recommended ~700 haste gives you two additional globals in Shadow Dance and Guidon will grant one extra on top of that.

[weak glade]

what do yall plan on spending ur upgrade on my plan is to upgrade my MH dagger thats myth to higher idk if thats the best idea

[dense jasper]

i've been confused on that. that gives me something like....20% haste

[hazy breach]

Ye stop looking at the percentage

[frank wolf]

Dont worry abt %

[dense jasper]

rip

[pseudo verge]

668 -> 1.37s on SD
694 -> 1.42s on SD
without guidon idk how much it adds

[shy scarab]

So now we aim for 700haste ish and blast critt?

[hazy breach]

700 haste then rest into crit/mastery

[shy scarab]

Sheeee

[barren pike]

can i get an import for new talents?

[pseudo verge]

is it without oils or with?

[shy scarab]

Pins

[small sleet]

with

[barren pike]

ty

[hearty mural]

I see alot of puzzle talk. Is Guidon not good anymore ?

[small sleet]

guidon still good

[weak glade]

Tbh i refuse to use puzzle box

I hate the cast time

Unless it’s MARGINALLY better

Ima just use my guidon

[shy scarab]

Guidon goat

[frank wolf]

700 haste is so hard to get without some fatass rings or neck

[weak glade]

Plus i have a thing that tells charge every time the flag is planted lol

[frank wolf]

Im still using champion void neck to get the haste ffs

[alpine wraith]

puzzle box is only better in M+ tbh and not by a lot

double passive sims best

and guidon is more st

you might play puzzlebox mainly because of how pull things work

[hearty mural]

Should I re craft my haste/mast gear to haste /crit ?

[hazy breach]

It doesnt even. Guidon still sims highest even in huge aoe

[shy scarab]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[rancid sierra]

puzzle box fake news

[hearty mural]

How do you pool for supercharger ?

[warm marlin]

press dance to supercharge 2 points and then dont finish until the burn starts

[eager latch]

not finishing until the burn starts

[hearty mural]

Do you press dance with no combo points or doesn’t matter

[warm marlin]

idk doesnt matter

ideally you still do damage to the boss/birds/little eggs so you just spam shadowstrike/storm

[hearty mural]

Ok

Ty

[shrewd lantern]

how does it work with the second burn

[warm marlin]

we didnt get there

but it will depend on if you need boss damage in p1.2 or not

im not sure its worth full pooling when you dont have pot or lust

[shrewd lantern]

wait i thought you guys killed

whats the main prog point

[warm marlin]

uhh

our tank kinda died a lot

[shrewd lantern]

like watching the guide mechanically the boss doesnt seem

that intensive

but

[warm marlin]

usually adds live/eggs live

or someone rots out/gets hit by an orb and then you lack dps

[shrewd lantern]

so its kind of more numbers

[warm marlin]

our tank is on ppal for extra external and that class is not very tanky

[shrewd lantern]

than mechanically demanding

ig

[warm marlin]

no the fight is mechnically easy i would say

[shrewd lantern]

hmm i see

feint does reduce the dive damage right

if its on you

[swift tinsel]

Iirc it’s all the same meteor damage if you’re targeted or soaking but I’m not 100% sure

[warm marlin]

yeah

[shrewd lantern]

but i mean the soakers are either an immune or targeted people

from what i saw of guides

[warm marlin]

you dont actually need to immune as rogue either

we are adopting new strat self developed

i will eat every soak yum

tasty

melee uptime is fake

[shrewd lantern]

dont you need cloak to double soak the overlap

or do you not

[swift tinsel]

There’s egg or there is no target

[earnest crane]

one hour Q and no accept

[warm marlin]

no

feint + dance for fade dr is more than enough

[shrewd lantern]

i guess you're just dancing and not attacking during that

[warm marlin]

im gonna be below the healers

but ye

[shrewd lantern]

or do you finish the soak then unload the sectech onto the bird

and thats it

ermm the egg

[warm marlin]

idk we will find out

tonight maybe

there are 2 soaks and you use 3 dances to pool

u use the 3rd on egg and 2 on soaking

[ripe flame]

[shrewd lantern]

i thought you pooled 2 dances

i.e didnt spend except for one sectech

[warm marlin]

is 3 for 6 SC

[shrewd lantern]

can you hold more than 6 sc

[warm marlin]

and you spend one to go to 5

then dance opener on burn puts you at 7

the cap

[shrewd lantern]

wait sc caps at 7?

[warm marlin]

well technically it caps at however many combo points you have

[shrewd lantern]

Oh

if you pool 3 dances are you basically not spending combo points

after your first sb set

[swift merlin]

that rogue life

[warm marlin]

yeah im gonna rip a sick grey parse

gonna be lit

[warm marlin]

this is the full event list for casts leading up to burn

i am doing negative damage

[dusty totem]

when will servers go live again`?

[shrewd lantern]

did you blades on pull

[warm marlin]

ye

[native zodiac]

i did that aswell

first time i soaked i was like "this doesnt do dmg huh?"

[shrewd lantern]

did you send another dance in between those or

[warm marlin]

one pull i just decided to walk in without cloak

[hallow night]

i noticed sometimes i can squeeze in a second shadow technique at the tail end of a shadow blades window when we lust at pull. however, at this point i already spent the 2nd shadow dance. is it worth using a naked shadow technique to take advantage of it getting buffed under shadow blades or wait for shadow dance to come back up?

[warm marlin]

and it didnt hurt

[native zodiac]

i had a soak assigned to cheat on

but cheat never procced so i decided to soak every single one

[paper blaze]

is the 2 set rings not really all that good from nexus now cause got both and one on myth track ?

[warm marlin]

yeah so I was told all immunes were hard assigned and i just didnt think to move my cloak to soak the orbs at 230 until after our last raid night of the week

a bit dumb on my part

the second i knew i could live it raw i should just eat them all and move cloak

[native zodiac]

do the tech

vanish shroud cloak and soak orbs

[shrewd lantern]

wait you soaked the overlap

with just feint?

[warm marlin]

i cant take speed shroud

[alpine wraith]

yea think it is like 300kish with feint and fade

[shrewd lantern]

[warm marlin]

especially not now

[alpine wraith]

maybe 350k

[warm marlin]

you cant take premed

[native zodiac]

ah yeah now its prob even more fucked

[warm marlin]

fade dr helps

[alpine wraith]

just have the disc put a shield on you or something and you survive

[warm marlin]

with fade you just live it

i ask them to top me now before every one and ill walk in with dance feint

[alpine wraith]

yea but living with 100k life or 200k

[warm marlin]

no risk involved

[alpine wraith]

can be a bit of a diff

[shrewd lantern]

i thought you danced to strike the boss

[alpine wraith]

you save vanish

[warm marlin]

i did but now ill move it to the soaks

i do 0 damage anyway

[shrewd lantern]

i guess ill ask

if its ok i noodle during non egg

XD

[neon stump]

sub looking like going to leap frog sin on all fights now in raid?

[alpine wraith]

unlikely

assa people like assa and it is fine

so they will play that

[warm marlin]

I am genuinely losing to the disc priests after my opener blades burst even pressing strike on the boss btw

[alpine wraith]

sub might be better on many bosses because we are king padders tho

[warm marlin]

they are not gonna miss my damage

[sick epoch]

when guidon? after potion?

[tidal solstice]

only rogues get called padders. kinda sick of it

[native zodiac]

imagine beloren with tww sub rogue

[neon stump]

if you not padding you not trying lol

[soft summit]

700 hate or 800? I've heard both numbers

[warm marlin]

imagine half this raid with tww sub rogue

[shrewd lantern]

did you fit in another dance with spending @warm marlin

before that sequence

[native zodiac]

real

[wintry heart]

800 without guidon

[hazy breach]

#subtlety message

[shrewd lantern]

i assume you were able to send a dance around 20 ish seconds?

before that 40 one you didnt spend

[warm marlin]

i send 2 in opener blades

and thats it

maybe im overcapping

[native zodiac]

watching hunters blow up the lura adds while im there doing tank dmg to them hits different after what we did on dimensius

[shrewd lantern]

alot of people seem to send on the first add spawn

so was unsure

[warm marlin]

like you can do that

[shrewd lantern]

their cds

[warm marlin]

but those things explode anyway for us

so why bother

[shrewd lantern]

yk why

[alpine wraith]

say yea my man

[warm marlin]

we private log prog for this very reason

[shrewd lantern]

xd

i guess ill test if i can do that and still have max sc

for the burn

[placid blade]

i'd take doing guardian dmg

[stuck arrow]

Wait.

They buffed DDH again. 😂 For why? 😂

What chart could they possibly have been looking at that made them buff DDH again?

[warm marlin]

playrate chart

[frigid dragon]

With the new smokescreen change, does that make trickster better than Deathstalker in ST?

[alpine wraith]

got a grey log on paladins because we didnt move bosses together well all the time pog

then looked at logs and saw only 20 were up or something and i was midway

so i was like ah yea

[warm marlin]

im not sure i will even care to parse this tier

in farm

[shrewd lantern]

the best part about melee paladins strats

[warm marlin]

its kinda cringe raid

[shrewd lantern]

is they position assuming everyone got

udk or ret range

[soft summit]

I dont have guidon so i want 800 haste before oils and any buffs?

[alpine wraith]

it took so many pulls for ranged to understand

[glad bough]

i only do bosses i need items off of then when said items drop i never run it again

[alpine wraith]

how the charge to melee worked

[tidal solstice]

they fixed some bugs. its like a lot of what we are getting now was already in the pipeline and not connected to balance at all but rather fixing design issues or bugs

[alpine wraith]

after oils is fine

[lilac stag]

Who are you kidding, you’re just playing Aug on reclears

[shrewd lantern]

hes playing outlaw i thought

[warm marlin]

I didnt consider this as a possibility

maybe i should change my plans

[formal helm]

anyone has the effect of cloud cover somewhere?

[lilac stag]

I’m here for you brother

[lilac stag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923898501529600/1495606826664988702/image.png?ex=69e8d626&is=69e784a6&hm=0cfbda5c7c561a593f516f8a9329de8acbf9b49b93b23514f0f733e4263dd74d&

[formal helm]

hm.

is it visible to other people?

also ty

[lilac stag]

Yep

[vast dust]

👀

[wintry heart]

Open world yes

Raid and m+ tbd

[spiral needle]

I hope its visible for a few days before the hotfix

[hearty mural]

Any rotation change ? Or macros changing ?

[steel wyvern]

pins

[vast dust]

👀💨

[tulip light]

Do you get a buff to track and see if you are inside or not ?

[stuck arrow]

If I have to deal with 3 bajillion particles from shit like Devastation Evoker... They can deal with smoke. 😂

[formal helm]

bunch of backstabs!!

[vast dust]

“Out of smoke range” warnings lol

[formal helm]

love backstabs.

[hollow compass]

so surely sub is better for beloren burst now than sin after the buffs yeah?

[tulip light]

Psure it already was and is even better now

[formal helm]

^

[nocturne oriole]

I was enjoying assa…I know it’s still good, but back to sub we go

[gilded ferry]

you might still run assa in keys

[dreamy wedge]

Anyone done a sim to check how much of a dps loss it is to run premed? I really don't want to do keys without it -_-

[nocturne oriole]

I’m fine with that too

[tulip light]

Im Not on the fight myself but I believe with the extra gear + turbo boost there is no dmg issue anywhere anymore

[hearty mural]

Don’t see anything about rotation changes

[hearty mural]

Nice what are we doing different exactly

[hazy breach]

No premed

[stuck arrow]

It's clear to me that your tank loves you more than mine loves me. 😬

[hazy breach]

So start of the fight by vanishing/backstabbing to 7

Instead of instantly getting 7 with the first strike

Thats all there is

[hearty mural]

Oh shii ok

Ez

[formal helm]

ye.

[hearty mural]

Ty

[formal helm]

as people said

[swift tinsel]

NA just came up

[formal helm]

ye?

[swift tinsel]

fighting login boss

[red flame]

Hell yeah, I’m only like ~30mins from being home

[swift tinsel]

will probs take that long to get in lol

[fossil forge]

Wallahi may all my cuhs get gazes today

[wintry heart]

Logging in now

[swift tinsel]

myth shoulders, we take this

[left ledge]

veteran guidon

we take it baby

we take it

[west tide]

i think ima take the crit haste neck

[wintry heart]

Okay so is it worth it to take hero guidon so I just don’t have to raid anymore 😂

[west tide]

im not gonna get a mytrhic alleria neck i have all slots mythic except for the pants

[fiery fog]

did na just get its servers back up or what

[placid blade]

we running same slots for 4 piece?

[warm marlin]

yes

[magic coral]

all kinda bis upgrades

[fiery fog]

damn so i cant go open my vault in 6 hours on eu

man

[gilded thistle]

myth guidon acquired

today we are victorious

[woeful quartz]

I need that piece

[elfin magnet]

Help me find a few lego pieces

I need to step on all of them

It might hurt less than this

[dreamy wedge]

Drums are not terrible.

[small sleet]

i got a beetle stabber in the vault

this is gonna be the week the main hand off vorasius finally drops

[elfin magnet]

I dont think I could have conjoured up a worse vault

I cant even get a tmog, or a speed piece.

[upbeat sorrel]

reroll DK angle as best option?

[warm marlin]

@lucid jackal no trinket but my last tier slot mythic

[elfin magnet]

Merit tokens it is. Best of luck everyone else. Ima go cry in a corner now.

[stuck arrow]

That means you get a bonus rolls, doesn't it?

[shrewd lantern]

already has chest?

[lucid jackal]

[elfin magnet]

Yeah. I have 6/6 hero chest.

[shrewd lantern]

oh wait thats not myth chest

[elfin magnet]

Yeah. Im lfr/delve

[hard trellis]

talents are fubar in pins gg

[hazy breach]

Boots are fine

[shrewd lantern]

thats prob reroll token

for if you ever do 10s

they aint hard

[lilac stag]

LETS FUCKING GO

[warm marlin]

another brother escapes renown trinket jail

[shrewd lantern]

grats on your hook

[warm marlin]

someday i will be free

[lusty acorn]

Give it to me

[small sleet]

bro i just talented out of premed and a single tear came out involuntarily

fuck i miss her so much already

[lilac stag]

outlaw loot spec

[warm marlin]

i did outlaw loot spec

[lilac stag]

fuck

[harsh gale]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[swift tinsel]

looks like the crit dmg made it in

yeehaw

[silent umbra]

i dont think this was clear but if i have gear from chimmy on myth track and reroll on the boss can i still get the same shit. like do drops count against the reroll memory

[shrewd lantern]

no it has to be obtained from the bonus roll

to be taken out

[swift tinsel]

no stealth nerf to surprising strikes triple stack lfg

[silent umbra]

perfect : ) awesome : )

[stuck arrow]

Parse now before the hot nerf lol

[slender granite]

Guys, since when crit is valued over mastery and haste? it used to be mastery>haste>crit

[swift tinsel]

who cares about parsing I'm about to mog on my guild so fucking hard

[naive tapir]

guys, some1 parced light pot vs recklesness?

[slender granite]

It now shows crit>haste>mastery in guides

[west tide]

is that crit gem better now

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

Still inconsequential

[fiery fog]

https://tenor.com/view/seado-negan-stare-serious-gif-12291022

[hazy breach]

Yes

[stuck arrow]

Smoking them in the meters and also literally smoking them in the raid.

[fast dome]

Is a mythic emberwing feather at all decent for sub?

[naive tapir]

so which better?

[hazy breach]

Per the #subtlety-faq

[weak vector]

Anyone else stuck at this?

[lilac stag]

Now the real question, what to bonus roll, nexus for rings

[timber quiver]

Yup

[slender granite]

recklessness for aoe

[small sleet]

reck for aoe only if it will give you mastery

[naive tapir]

i mean in raid, in keys fs i use reckle, but i m still struggling to buy another for raid, my money ending((

[small sleet]

so you need to reck pot before guidon usage, and with mastery as your highest stat

[slender granite]

Yes, reck before guidon

[upbeat sorrel]

let it wait a few min it goes through

[hazy breach]

Ok so if it says that with aoe talents its good to use recklessness instead of the usual light's potential, which one do you think should be used for ST?

[still gazelle]

Is there a way to force raidbots to realize I want a certain amount of a stat?

[fiery fog]

nop

[pure jay]

technically bis bracers or bracers with a socket?

[small sleet]

avoidance socket bracers holy

[glad bough]

so i am reading in here people are no longer using premeditation is that correct? If so what are we running in place of it

[small vortex]

catalyst bracers are haste crit no?

[small sleet]

fuck the crit haste ones bro you have gold right there

haste mast isnt even bad

[fiery fog]

just because crit is now better doesnt mean mastery is in the dumpster guys

[small sleet]

^^

[wintry heart]

Okay so - I have hero guidon in vault and also myth track pit pants (which aren’t bis anymore*… I really would like to be free of heroic pug prison

[pure jay]

i mean haste/mast bis stats, i just know the "bis" list has void skinned listed

[naive tapir]

u can sim, tbh + second myth boss is beer, so its lootable

[stuck arrow]

Bro socket is 25% more secondary stats. Socket 100%

[naive tapir]

imho, i`d take ring

[pure jay]

i didn't know the math on it. o7

[fiery fog]

sockets are huge

[fast dome]

oh raidbots is broken whee

[fiery fog]

hero 6/6 with socket is better than myth 6/6 no socket iirc

[hallow mortar]

NA gamers, do we know how to upgrade the weapon yet

[oak bear]

i have no idea what to take

[swift tinsel]

no premed is jarring lol

[stuck arrow]

I mean you get 80 secondary stats on bracer. A gem is 23 secondary stats

[pure jay]

trinket personally

[naive tapir]

haste now not bis bis stat, in raid u wanna up cs + that ring is bis now

[fiery fog]

i sincerely hope my vault doesnt troll me yet again with first 2 boss items when i have alleria down

[pure jay]

uh oh

[fossil forge]

Smaller lootpool?

[warm marlin]

no

[light finch]

Box is good on Sub and Assa

[hazy breach]

No thats wrong, you still want haste to the breakpoint

[warm marlin]

2 items bigger

[hazy breach]

And then the rest into crit+mastery

[warm marlin]

but i save a lot of myth crests if i roll alleria weapon

[tulip light]

Gear choices in here are already getting VERY wild 😂

[pure jay]

is this info in the pins?

[fossil forge]

Ah

[naive tapir]

y

[swift tinsel]

these nuclear bomb strikes are big fun though

[fiery fog]

mastery used to be a tad bit better right?
now with the changes is it more like 50/50 between them?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[dire ravine]

if i rehide my items, do you think i can proc a reroll xD

[naive tapir]

just sim

[hollow raptor]

wow this opener feels really bad!

[sharp peak]

all these people in my guild getting myth gaze, and i'm stuck getting all necks and rings

[pure jay]

can we trust the sims now? it always hated the 700 breakpoint

[small sleet]

you still want 700 haste

[pure jay]

but seems like we still want that at least

[small sleet]

nothing changed about that

[still gazelle]

If you were at 728 mastery as trickster with guidon

would you recraft this?

Haste**

[small sleet]

i would personally

[fiery fog]

i would

[small sleet]

but its not super necessary

i play at 687 haste after oils

and have never had an issue

[still gazelle]

Would bring it to 688 which should be fine

[naive tapir]

~650 in raid its good enough, in keys now u wanna 100% crit-mastery-haste.

[hazy breach]

No

[west tide]

chat i sim less today 🙁

lmfaoo

[still gazelle]

Hard to sim when the sims tells you to lose a bunch of haste

[pure jay]

technically we should wait to sim anyway right

[small sleet]

i play 45 ping with 687 and i never miss the last global in dance so you could recraft, hit dummies for a while, and if you're missing it sometimes, just recraft back into the haste

[naive tapir]

just w8 then)

[naive tapir]

wym no?

[west tide]

WOO CRIT

[hazy breach]

in keys now u wanna 100% crit-mastery-haste.
This part

[naive tapir]

with what u disagree? ok, push haste over crit

[dreamy wedge]

what

[hazy breach]

Get your haste breakpoint

Then fill the rest with crit+mastery

[halcyon roost]

are u giga juiced wtf

[hazy breach]

Same as before

[halcyon roost]

why are ur numbers so small

maybe thats normal for sub

[west tide]

im 282

[tranquil sorrel]

Brothers. I hate my life.

[nocturne oriole]

help - I think it's dagger..but ugh! otherwise chest. I'll miss M raid for a few weeks so Mythic Hungering is a ways away (IRL)

[light finch]

haste breakpoint of a simulation is lower than what you are able to play, so haste gets demoted, even if you really could need some.

[small sleet]

do u have myth track shoulders already?

[craggy thunder]

crit haste til 700 then mastery? thats prio for us?

[west tide]

i have 685 haste valko

[tranquil sorrel]

No, but I truly need gaze

[small sleet]

oh i just saw the hero track gaze

[tranquil sorrel]

BAD

[west tide]

i am playing legos withmy gear dw

[north garnet]

NA enlighten me, How time gated are the weapon/trinket upgrades?

[small sleet]

rest in peace

[shy ferry]

what changed why is crit good now?

[wintry heart]

Okay have any of you nerds gotten an upgrade token yet

[tranquil sorrel]

Do I get gaze??

[light finch]

good look

[tranquil sorrel]

Hero track feels awful man

[lusty acorn]

You will get 2 myth gear in dungoens when you play +10 and roll the lott 2 timtes

[dense jasper]

time gated cant upgrade for 4 weeks

[light finch]

just bonus roll it

[lusty acorn]

Times

[shy ferry]

oh geez

[wintry heart]

Legitimately?

[tranquil sorrel]

fk it i'm takin gaze

[north garnet]

Can you upgrade everything after 4 weeks?

[lusty acorn]

@tranquil sorrel

[tranquil sorrel]

yeah

thats why im takin gaze, cause I can get good catalyst pieces and I dont need anything else

myth track

[dusky yacht]

Wait what I thought you could upgrade instantly

[lusty acorn]

And you have 298 item upgrade i think from quest so yeah

[dusky yacht]

More waiting

[lusty acorn]

Wtf?

No 298?

Until 4 week

Or what

[north garnet]

thats good

[frail kindle]

bro cloud cover is awesome

im actually so happy just pressing this button

[lilac stag]

seems they area is a little smaller on live

[fair phoenix]

lol bro wtf

smoke arent appearing

for me

[frail kindle]

bro im just walking around silvermoon pressing blades on cooldown batchesting

[lusty acorn]

How sub damage now?

[spice matrix]

did you forget to talent?

[swift tinsel]

Cloud Cover in CDM now woo

[hollow raptor]

did they fix our apex talent

so we dont have force it now?

[still gazelle]

I don't see a raid cleave build in wowhead

[lean rover]

I just input the new talent build for cloud cover and sims are 3k less

[still gazelle]

wutdo

[hollow raptor]

nvmd its lagy

[tidal solstice]

im guessing were just stuck in combat for the entirety of a void strike

small fucking indie dev team

[buoyant leaf]

Raidbots says new sims take an hour after launch

until they are ready

[lean rover]

ty

[hazy breach]

Oh mb wrong tag

[lilac stag]

Change to the talent

[iron obsidian]

thats because sims arent updated

[fair phoenix]

did, i just reload and fixed for some reason lol

[dusky yacht]

I think the real question is are we back

[fair stump]

Do we swap talents at some crit breakpoint or is it worth it doing it now?

[lilac stag]

ArcUI tracks the buff and the 10 seconds after

[swift tinsel]

ye its nice

was wondering if that would make it in since I heard it wasn't in cdm on ptr

[ashen warren]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[north garnet]

Never left 😼

[frank wolf]

NA lads how are you getting in whats the meta

im in logging in purgatory

[dusky yacht]

[fiery fog]

its time to learn sub baby

as always

[outer flare]

so for opener only change is shadowstrike into backstab till max combo points right

[stuck arrow]

I think ol probably kinda cracked in m+ though.

[half comet]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[swift tinsel]

I crave the crit now

[north garnet]

Wtf

[fiery fog]

https://tenor.com/view/liminal-liminal-space-liminal-archives-crit-critic-gif-25430327

[lucid jackal]

Idk what to pick........ this is hard

[winter current]

gee i wonder

[swift tinsel]

28% with flask is not enough

I require all the crit

[fiery fog]

well

both rings are good tbh

[tranquil sorrel]

Wait I just did the new opener on dummy to practice and cloud cover didn't even proc when I used shadow blades

??????

IT IS SPECCED!

[fiery fog]

take the bonus roll and use it 3x on NXP to get both rings on myth track

[native sand]

what type of flask we use now, crit or mastery?

[fiery fog]

big brain time

[north garnet]

Arm of the Law?

[neon frigate]

Is the patch big difference in dmg fir sub?

[fair stump]

hm? are those rings good on sub?

[stuck arrow]

6%

[stuck arrow]

I mean yeah, free damage is good.

[fiery fog]

the stats are alright

haste crit / haste mastery

[dusky yacht]

Reload

[stuck arrow]

They aren't like Giga bis or anything but like

[fiery fog]

one of the better ones for sure

[north garnet]

I like the Nexus rings

[gilded kestrel]

is the play now to recraft the gear to haste/crit?

[fiery fog]

rings only really matter in a sense to get you to your haste breakpoint and dump the rest into crit/mastery

[outer orchid]

in an hour

[mellow arrow]

Anyone else noticing Dance not being usable again immediately after leaving dance? I leave dance and even with a charge available it won't let me reuse it for 2-3 seconds
I am using the First Dance talent

Maybe this is something that was intended and I missed

[stray oyster]

is crit potion better than lights

[stable plume]

guys idk if its a bug but when i press my shadow blade macro i lose like 30 energy

[harsh gale]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[stable plume]

and then i can't secret technique

[stuck arrow]

What's in your macro?

[strong jay]

Removing premed sounds cringe, is it a huge dps increase?

[alpine wraith]

do you have a working timer for dance? it lets me use it instantly with first dance

it just lasts a long time

[outer orchid]

in an hour

[left ledge]

wait so

are we still dancing full cp into sectec

[warm marlin]

ITS LAW TIME BUD

YEAR OF THE PIRATE

[outer orchid]

as far as i know

since you want to apply fazed as soon as possible

and get st on cd

as soon as possible

[left ledge]

would be very nice if premed didnt bug our apex

[south pelican]

why do we not take premed anymore?

[left ledge]

because it bugged the apex

but i swear dont we just lose so many combo points without premed...

[warm marlin]

well and because we want to spend sht on builders

[hazy breach]

Its not really a bug

[warm marlin]

especially rotten buffed ones

[left ledge]

i feel like i wont ever be proccing apex without premed outside blades

[fair stump]

Blades is dealing so much dmg wtf

[cosmic crescent]

what are we replacing premed with?

[hazy breach]

The apex is just designed to not work with premed

[mellow arrow]

just base ui stuff (action bars / cooldown manager)
I'll record to see if it happens again - maybe I'm dreaming lol

[warm marlin]

sectec gives a lot of sht

just did my first key with the new build

[wary locust]

thought we were supposed to get some smoke clouds when we attack with shadow blades

[outer orchid]

you do no damage outside blades anyways

[warm marlin]

it is def a lil strange with no premed

[left ledge]

you do damage outside blades

[craggy thunder]

how much mastery do we have wanna? anyone know?

[left ledge]

its just weird that consuming sht to not proc a finisher refund

[stable plume]

i'm checking logs now to see what's taking like 30 energy in my macro

[left ledge]

is somehow more damage

[crystal atlas]

Have been at logging int ogame server for 35 mins now amazing

[frail kindle]

so no first dance anymore?

[spiral needle]

I'll bet its spaghetti code tying distract to it

[frail kindle]

for keys

[swift tinsel]

no premed only really kinda smelly on opener anyways

[spiral needle]

since that takes 30 energy and used to be what caused it

[swift tinsel]

since you can prep sht for your following dances

[eager latch]

i mean, we still need the 700ish haste right

just dropping some mast for crit now?

for raid at least

[swift tinsel]

I'm going to maniacally stack crit

[dire ravine]

Im kind of having the same issue?

[left ledge]

its just bugged rn yeah

it takes 30 energy

[swift tinsel]

and only take mastery from tier slots

[strong jay]

What if they coded it to drop a distract when you shadow blades

[spiral needle]

its 100% because it used to be distract

too convenient

[warm marlin]

im pretty sure it is manually casting distract

[eager latch]

LMAO

yeah that's for sure it

[left ledge]

wait so

[alpine wraith]

funny one eh

[left ledge]

if distract is on cd

will it still do it

[swift tinsel]

imma try

[left ledge]

maybe we distract prepull

[spiral needle]

opener was already annoying now need to wait for 30 more energy lmao

[frail kindle]

no

just tested it

[left ledge]

no it doesnt

[frail kindle]

if distract on cd

[left ledge]

or no it still does

[swift tinsel]

okay so distract does not give buff

[frail kindle]

it still costs energy

[left ledge]

i see

we're just shafted then

nice

[frail kindle]

i was wondering

[alpine wraith]

distract on cd does not affect it then

[frail kindle]

why my sec tech wasnt going off

[deft moss]

wait its fucking broken?!

[frail kindle]

cuz im running out of energy

LOL

its just a slight bug

[alpine wraith]

so now we enter dance with 60 energy at least

[stable plume]

here's my log in case anyone knows how to find it: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/PVmBpn16T89zdKQh

[swift tinsel]

ye I'm noticing that I'm noticing energy going into dance now lol

[left ledge]

focusing sht stacks on shadowstrike rather than finisher refunds just

feels so weird

[swift tinsel]

also I'm 99% sure if you cast blades with distract on cd it blocks cloud cover

just did it and didn't have the buff lmao

[left ledge]

nice

LMAO

[frail kindle]

i just did it and i noticed it still cost the energy

[swift tinsel]

in delve testing atm

[frail kindle]

even though distract was on cd

[fiery fog]

what am i reading

i cant

[left ledge]

eh idk

[steel wyvern]

yeah

[swift tinsel]

hahahahahaha

[left ledge]

i just used distract and blades

and it still gave me cloud cover

[steel wyvern]

if distract is on cd it still does it

[swift tinsel]

weird

it didn't for me

[hearty mural]

how can you get refunded spender abilities? i thought it was only finisher ablities is what you get refunded back

[left ledge]

you dont

[steel wyvern]

i mean it stilll

costs the energy

[left ledge]

if you spend sht on shadowstrike, it can spawn a clone to strike

thats why we're dropping premed

[carmine rune]

Guys guys mythic prism (from skyreach) or heroic alnseer ?

[left ledge]

because apparently that is more worth than a finisher spawning a clone

[frigid dragon]

Ok this is a stupid question, but we aren't just sitting there spamming builders at full CP in a smokescreen right?

[swift tinsel]

okay now it works, must have been a cdm bug

[left ledge]

unless im wrong idk @hazy breach can you set me straight on this

[swift tinsel]

not showing the buff

[alpine wraith]

nope

[hazy breach]

Yes

[alpine wraith]

all other rules apply normally

you only build to full on pull

with stabs or storm

[left ledge]

damn

[alpine wraith]

and now also POOL to around 60

kekw

[frigid dragon]

Oh so just make sure before popping CD's you are at 7 not just 6+

[left ledge]

i mean it is what it is i guess

[alpine wraith]

or you might enter dance and wont be able to use sec tech

and look at the screen funny

[drifting ether]

Is it because distract cost energy? 😂

[alpine wraith]

with a big ??¿¿?

[harsh gale]

is there a new build or does anything change about our gameplay

[frigid dragon]

Also does the trickster change put it ahead of Deathstalker on ST?

[alpine wraith]

read pins new build yes

[obtuse dirge]

why no more the first dance for keys. i love it

[fair stump]

Can't we upgrade heroic trinket to myth with the new voidcore now?

[hearty mural]

sht is secret tech?

[alpine wraith]

first dance is still good

[thorny obsidian]

well, him saying opener being cursed is an understatement

[fair stump]

shadow techniques, passive CP-like points build by auto attacking

[frank wolf]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[warm marlin]

it is quite impossible to see swirls through 2 smoke bombs

[hallow mortar]

How do we get those bonus rolls?

[hearty mural]

ok ty...so are we still spending finishers the same? or spammign shadow strike

[lucid jackal]

The problem is I already have

[warm marlin]

year of the socket

[alpine wraith]

year of the extra thingy to get items

[pure cloud]

Will any of the changes result in us changing talents?