subtlety

[hollow spear]

That would be "tuning". The problem is that they've completely removed strike and evis from it.

[night sparrow]

heyo guys, sims don't start with 2 extra supercharges right ? Cause I see some evis back to back during the opener

[agile kernel]

i mean they want more hero talent choices, make an alternative to nimble fury tuned for 2-4 target cleave.

[hollow spear]

What does that have to do with supercharger?

[agile kernel]

like half the hero talents arent actually choices

[night sparrow]

nvm yeah there's no pre-supercharges on the buff list mb

[agile kernel]

back to back evis has to do with shadow tech

[hollow spear]

Supercharged cp don't give you a reset anyway

[night sparrow]

we are supposed to shadowstrike if no apex proc for supercharged evis aren't we ?

[warm marlin]

They are going to be murdered the second lura dies

[night sparrow]

I probably missed something

[stoic spire]

If I macro puzzle box and blades together would first press activate trinket and the second blades or that’s not how it works?

[warm marlin]

But also it’s hunter

So they will still be op

[hollow spear]

Don't even know what makes their low target cleave so strong

They'd have to specifically turn that down a lot

And give some of that to us

[verbal hedge]

!FUU

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[agile kernel]

pretty sure its aspect of the hydra is just insane value its basically just a permanent 50% of your ST damage goes to 1 other target

[still gazelle]

That son of a bitch

[dry plank]

interesting will assa beat us in raid after new tuning? xD

[agile kernel]

I mean if you look at how the hunter tree is set up they have the option between trick shots and aspect of the hydra where one is for low target cleave and one is for 5+. I think most don't even take trick shot even for m+, but its a shame thats subtlety literally has like 8 dead talents.

But like no one takes Night Terrors or Terrifying Pace, any of the shroud talents, shuriken tornado, gloomblade, rotten (i think this gets used in pvp), goremaw, darkbrew, perforated, lingering shadows.

Its not like there isn't room on the tree that can be used to talent toward low target cleave it just a lack of give a shit by the dev team.

[tribal blade]

nado at least might see play if we get a tier set that's focused on clones

[exotic steeple]

will sub fall behind the other 2 specs? after tuning

[dry plank]

we thought that they remove that to give us abnormal ST, yeah sure they'll do that ffs, balance this season is hilariously bad

[spare crypt]

could fall behind assa, outlaw unlikely

[exotic steeple]

fine with that tbh

[spare crypt]

but things will be boss-specific

as the different bosses have different dmg profiles that are good on them

[exotic steeple]

i can play assa and sub, outlaw never went into my brain

[spare crypt]

you can remove and add 700-800 mastery at a moment's notice?

respect king

[exotic steeple]

ill make 2nd rogue

kek

nah idk ill just hoard some assa gear

[spare crypt]

i personally cba

and am staying sub

[tribal vortex]

I don't think that adding and removing mastery is so much needed

I play all 3 with same stats and dmg is around the same

Mastery for assa is good

[dry plank]

difference will be huge i see only on paladins

[tribal vortex]

outlaw despises it a bit more but doesn't matter that much

[tribal blade]

mastery is good on sin for sure

[exotic steeple]

ill drop guidon for puzzle

ez mastery problem solved

[tribal blade]

the main thing you need for sin is a lot of crit

esp for FB

[spare crypt]

setting up everything only to play paladins as assa

this is the rogue life

[tribal blade]

sin is chill to play

[hollow spear]

Expecting "abnormal" st was maybe also just a bit naive

[tribal blade]

at least

[dry plank]

my guild will start paladins in 3 month so i have plenty of time 🙂 to gear assa

[spare crypt]

im chillin on bench at palas right now

theres a certain type of charm to it

[tribal blade]

my guild is working on saladbar so i have some time

[dry plank]

with huge passive cleave you always will get poop st bro, withour passive cleave at least you potentially could get it

[gilded garden]

Anyone bored rn and wanting to check my logs to see what I might be doing wrong?

[lilac stag]

@swift tinsel not sure if you saw it, max said addon is just collecting player input to display it. likely impossible without it.

[tribal blade]

lura is probably impossible without addons

[dry plank]

their addon is cheating, blizzard should ban for that

[tribal blade]

or you would add like +200-300 pulls without them

they clear it with blizz before they do it

everything they do gets the go ahead from blizz

[lilac stag]

It’s just communicating via raid chat.

[tribal blade]

it still requires player input to use

[exotic steeple]

watching casualaddict playing assa rn

[tribal blade]

it doesn't auto do it for you

[exotic steeple]

looks pretty chill

[lilac stag]

Correct

[tribal blade]

it's very chill if you play FB

just spread bleeds with CT

use cds on main target

boom

[exotic steeple]

yea

i hate deathmark

but not having to target swap now seems so qol

[tribal blade]

i suspect sin will pull ahead of sub in keys

possbily

at the higher lvls

because it's funnel and prio is very good

[upper narwhal]

Ye in weekly keys nothing lives long enough in packs to get your CDs out

[brisk onyx]

1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000% agree

[tribal blade]

yeah sin is pretty miserable when stuff dies fast

you're mega gated by energy when using CT

[dry flame]

already happening prior to buff (in some keys)

[upper narwhal]

Finish spreading -> pack is dead

[tribal blade]

not surprising yeah

[exotic steeple]

but that was always a sin thing

[tribal blade]

a lot of these keys have big scary prio mobs

like magisters is a huge one for that

AA

every key

actually

[dry flame]

Seat is pretty good for Sin too

every pack is prio target basically

[tribal blade]

yeah every single key

big prio is really good

sub is doing great dam right now but it's quite paddy

[dry flame]

last boss Seat, you just send KB on start and then full CDs during amp

[tribal blade]

just like mists 1st boss

cool

[hollow spear]

I tried sin once in a weekly key

Unplayable

Needs higher levels imo

[dry flame]

really? how so

[tribal blade]

i wouldn't play it in a 10

it takes a while to spread bleeds

CT costs 60 energy or something

very high energy cost

[dry flame]

i did +12 MC this morning as Sin, was pretty good - had like 40% of the boss dmg last boss

[hollow spear]

By the time you get going, stuff is dead

[tribal blade]

energy is less infinite in aoe for sin than it used to be

they drastically reduced energy income

if sin had the same energy income as before you'd have no problem

[dry flame]

and +12 many don't even consider high

so i guess it'll be better with even higher keys

[tribal blade]

12 is not high no

[dry flame]

yea, what i meant is that it still worked

[tribal blade]

hot

[dry flame]

and MC has also plenty of prio mobs

[tribal blade]

are they playing DS or FB?

[dry flame]

also just smoother for first boss than sub

[tribal blade]

if i play sin there's no shot i'm gonna use DS

[dry flame]

FB

[tribal blade]

nice nice

i would take the lower funnel of FB

for better mental

and more ST

[exotic steeple]

+1

lil practice on dummies

and wipe keys

[nocturne forge]

²²²²²

[exotic steeple]

but maybe blizz will buff sub before playing assa becomes relevant

[hollow spear]

Yeah, but 12 is higher than the standard 10 weekly

So stuff lives a tad longer

Still not optimal

[dry flame]

all 3 specs feel pretty okay in M+

[still gazelle]

As long as I don't have to play Outlaw (no weapon ready) I'll be happy.

[tribal blade]

also no affix so dps is lower

[dry flame]

I only have a champ track outlaw weap and, at least in 11, it felt pretty okay

[swift tinsel]

Yeah I heard a couple pulls last night where they had designated Clickers to do the inputs

[dry flame]

For Sub, my stats are kinda bricked - this is with oils and flask, and my haste is just a bit higher than mastery, so food gives me haste

[swift tinsel]

Use main stat food

[wild vine]

[hollow spear]

Too much vers

Delete

[dry flame]

My haste is a bit high, because i crafted boots/neck with crit/haste, so i use for all 3 specs

but it's alright, not the end of the world

[wild vine]

kinda just depends on your other pieces

[still gazelle]

I think mine is as close to just right as I can get it

[wild vine]

my 3 crafted are with haste aswell

[dry flame]

I got these last week as "boe" drop when pugging mythic, so that definitely gives me quite a bit of haste

[wild vine]

certainly. think those would get me to 20% aswell

[dry flame]

also void/light rings 😛

ill prob swap one if i get a juicy AA one

[wintry blaze]

whats a good stat distribution to aim for?

[dry flame]

684-700 haste

and as much mastery

[wintry blaze]

what about crit?

The graph in the wowhead stat prio guide is a bit confusing

[wild vine]

we dont just aim for any stat amounts except haste anyways

just sim

[wintry blaze]

i am sitting at 718 haste atm

so i should be gucci?

[swift tinsel]

Ye

[wild vine]

yep

[wintry blaze]

aight thx!

[swift tinsel]

Having a little over 700 just gives you more of a buffer which is fine

[gilded garden]

how important are the macros?

[dry flame]

They just automate things which makes it more consistent, since we're not robots

[wintry blaze]

are you not?

[dry flame]

wish i was

to not feel the pain

[short radish]

i run 712 because i like being extra comfy

[hollow spear]

Feels like the cold side of the pillow

[gilded garden]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/blackmoore/kappakläusin?difficulty=4
dunno why but at some bosses I just seem to not be able to push out as much dps as the highest logs. How do you keep such a high dps on sub? Is it because of boss fight duration maybe?

[shut crypt]

Btw, what do u think about my stats? I’m using Raidbots to simulate myself in single target, and it says I have good stats, but I’ve seen that mastery is more commonly used.

[wise fulcrum]

Boss fight duration is definitely a piece of it. Sub overall DPS slows down a good amount over time.

[pallid jackal]

!guidon

[wicked jolt]

Light Company Guidon (haste on use) Optimization:
When? - Only with the Season 1 4-set bonus and Guidon.
How? - During Shadow Blades, line up your second Shadow Dance with the last 8 seconds of Shadow Blades instead of using them back-to-back.
Why? - This allows you to fit another Secret Technique into Shadow Blades+Shadow Dance. It will not be supercharged but thats ok in this scenario.

[pallid jackal]

The above is only for non-opener right? Because I can fit 3 sectecs in on opener

[slate matrix]

anyone here good at sub willin to check out my thread and help me plz?

[north garnet]

I literally just follow whats been suggested here on discord :D

700 haste everyrthing else crit mastery

[zinc wind]

700 haste, without all buffs/oils etc right?

ground stat

[tribal blade]

with all buffs and oils

[tribal blade]

i think that extra leeway is worth a lot more than having a few more mast %

depending on how you play ofc

[short radish]

yeah really helps when i press dance + sectech macro and the mobs aren't in range

[tribal blade]

lol true

a lot of these dungeons pulls have crazy area denial for melee

[wraith zealot]

hi guys i wonder got 17% haste atm so wich gems be good to put on sokets grren one with mastery haste or haste crit ?

[tribal blade]

big haste and small mast/crit

do either, the diff will not be big

i suspect if you have below ~25% crit or so your sim will be very crit hungry

[wraith zealot]

righty i has 18 % but i puit gems for ststs so i lose a bit haste but i have one more gem so can replace for haste and mastery i think i got 24 % crit so should be ok

[tribal blade]

keep the epic gem that gives main stat if that's what you mean, it's very good

[wraith zealot]

o yea i got other socked in ring so i can replace

[tribal blade]

you can also use haste enchants if you need

[plucky moon]

Do we need to have 700 with flask or widout guys?

[wraith zealot]

but is betetr change gem i thik

oil give u some haste as well i got 17 % whith oils on weapons need change one gem or enchant to get 18%

i think i be fine

is any soft cap for crit or is better put on mastery a mean haste 18% rest pumpin to mastery ?

[keen dome]

Ideally without 'cos then you can use a mastery flask for bigger dam

[tribal blade]

hard to say for sure, get your haste to ~684-700

and then honestly whatever your stats are elsewhere is what you've got

unless you have pieces you can swap around to get more crit or mast

[shut crypt]

Mastery is better than crit on raid? Or

[tribal blade]

general rule for gearing sub is 700 haste, then a lot of mastery

rest into crit

[tribal blade]

better everywhere yeah

[fiery fog]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1488547832062415010/drop_fixed.png

[harsh gale]

With the rogue patch notes/buffs. Does this put the other specs ahead of sub

[gleaming crane]

You think we got some buffs in the next class changes 😅

[short radish]

no

[hallow mortar]

subs look fine on last boss seems like

[alpine wraith]

we are all equally shit

dont worry

[hallow mortar]

unless they need something special for last phase and remove us 😄

[alpine wraith]

sub is doing quite bad boss dmg but at least for once the boss trucks omegahard

so they cant sit atro

[hallow mortar]

is it bad boss dmg? i though it may be fine since mostly ST

[alpine wraith]

well if by fine you mean 60k behind hunter then yea

[gleaming crane]

I mean i Play sub too But if i See the dmg done by casual playing assa it Looks op haha

[alpine wraith]

dmg was never rogue's problem in m+

problem is entering a dungeon

because of how useless we are

dmg can be done by everyone

[brisk onyx]

he played sub op too

so

whatever

[gleaming crane]

True and def cds Are Shit too

[alpine wraith]

our defensive is vanish because they decided cloak would not work on half the shit

[gleaming crane]

Every spec Looks op played by him haha

[alpine wraith]

good groups make anyone look op

but yea some specs just do infinite more dps

it may be another spriest devourer aug angle

or mage instead of aug

season zzzz

[harsh gale]

Time to max out my aug alt then

[hallow mortar]

hopefully they dont nerf BP more

[gleaming crane]

But we got Big buffs with the aoe blind in 12.05 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[hallow mortar]

sub timings is scufffed on last boss too, they are saving blades for 2:30 adds or something

[brisk onyx]

I rarely see you so negative, haha, but this is the most powerless I've felt besides 6.0 and 9.0

[hallow mortar]

its sad times, im thinking if i should reroll to DH and just play for fun

[brisk onyx]

I recommend ret

[wild vine]

uhdk looks pretty strong yet again too

[foggy estuary]

Finally 3k, not touching anything 10+ for some time now, really hated the dungeon finder endless queues. Ugh🤮

[brisk onyx]

it is almost sub plus

[hallow mortar]

i do play ret as my main alt now, but it feel kinda dull. What i like about DH is you can play tank mdps and rdps, which give you infinite options in theory

will see, have unistalled game for now 😄

did not save WTF may be mistake

[brisk onyx]

To be honest, this is probably the best way to protest their neglect of rogue; although there's not much point in saying a lot here

[hallow mortar]

i mean in not protesting anything, its like someone care in milion player pool

its just if you dont get to raid whats the point if you care only about raids

[alpine wraith]

we have been through worse but im also not a paragon of positivity tbh XD

[bronze turret]

You used to be

Old times

[alpine wraith]

ahaha

[hallow mortar]

push do you ever play casually or you just lurning around

[bronze turret]

I am more positive now that i dont play the game seriously

[alpine wraith]

well you do realize eventually that blizz looks at metrics in their own way

[bronze turret]

I play casually, like 254 ilvl or some shit

[alpine wraith]

i also try to explain it when i can that they just see sub midpack or rogue in general and are like

yea this is fine

[bronze turret]

Doing some keys, some lfr, some normal raid

[hallow mortar]

i may do it aswell, becasue i played too much that it affecting my IRL too much

[bronze turret]

Ye i quit almost 3 years ago cus of that

[hallow mortar]

yeah i know

[bronze turret]

Met my wife 6 months later and got a kid at 1.5 now 🤣

[hallow mortar]

well i have two kids and my wife very cool about it, but than you raid 4 nights a week and cant even go outside becasue of that

[bronze turret]

But i am kinda accepting being a lowlie pugger now. So it’s fine overall

[bronze turret]

Ye the game is ”fine” as a casual too

[hallow mortar]

just rogue do not feel that well as casual player or thats atleast something i think

[bronze turret]

It does

Because people assume it’s bad

But then you shit on them all

Cus just being better

Makes it fun

[void ocean]

Push smurfin those orange parses in LFR 😄

[bronze turret]

Not even

I just got 4p but I had orange for ilvl!

[hallow mortar]

i mean its harder to get into key or raid as pug, i can feel it and im overgeared and have "big" score from day2

[bronze turret]

Ye I just joined a group for a +2 and then we kept going because it went well.. kinda how you have to do it

[hallow mortar]

oh yeah, doing own keys help

[void ocean]

as sub in low keys i was outdpsing ppl 20 ilvl higher but i assumed they probably lvled alt they see the first time

[bronze turret]

Wasn’t my own. But I try to flex the most difficult title I have to show them I ain’t playing around

So currently I think it’s HoF for the harbinger, which is one of the rarer ones

Uunat

[slate matrix]

anyone here good at sub willin to check out my thread and help me plz?

[void ocean]

and then went on to play with ppl who dunno what hof is

😄

[bronze turret]

Welll

[lilac stag]

Use !log

[void ocean]

"if those pugs could read they would be very upset"

[slate matrix]

i did and no one is looking at it lol

[bronze turret]

I still have old guildies that play the game but I was an officer so not the most popular guy I guess.

[lilac stag]

People do when they have time.

[bronze turret]

Rough life when you have to tell people bad news sometimes and then you want favors

Pls boost me

[void ocean]

sandwich feedback

[still gazelle]

Since all sims will try to make me drop haste, which is better for Sub ST? Mastery or crit?

I can't sim them against eachother because it'll tell me to change all my gems/chants.

[bronze turret]

Haven’t simmed my character once yet. Just look at the top dawgs and copy

Very very nice

[void ocean]

"i like ur transmog"
"u r the worst raider i've ever seen, u went afk in a puddle"
"ur battle pets r nice"

i need a favour

[bronze turret]

An old guildie is doing a weekly heroic run. Shame it’s on fridays at 8 pm

And I was invited to that.. but ye,
Fridays are difficult

[lilac stag]

You’ve got a kiddo. That’s prime home time

[void ocean]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPVnOonSO-s

[lilac stag]

or collapse from exhaustion time

[hallow mortar]

i think most of pugs are going on friday

cos thats when they dont raid with guild

[bronze turret]

Yuh, but we have cozy fridays with movie time on Friday

So it’s unfortunate to drop that for wow

But ye, the game and sub is more fun than I expected as a casual. Just gotta lower expectations a lot

[sullen hare]

Hasn't compliment sandwich been proven not to work?

[void ocean]

does anything about management and hr theories ever work

[lilac stag]

Delves are still my favorite content in game

[bronze turret]

I give feedback all the time at work. Usually just find something positive and then break down the negative stuff

[lilac stag]

?? fun week 1 if you didn’t cheese it

[bronze turret]

Ye I managed to do 11 at least

[lilac stag]

nice

I can’t wait for the labyrinth one

[void ocean]

delves r cool shame u outgrow em so fast

[bronze turret]

Was confused as to why the follower was so dogshit

But at 90 she got better

[void ocean]

next season when u start with max lvl valera it will be overgrown even fatser

[uneven shard]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[sleek socket]

i have weapon crafted, and waist, isnt it better to craft wrist too just for ilvl till i get 1 myth wrist?
my wrist is champion

[hollow spear]

wrist is a slot that's commonly crafted

the crafting or not question usually comes down to how likely it is that you get raid loot funneled into you

which, as a rogue, is unlikely

[hallow mortar]

you guys getting loot as rogue

must be nice

[tribal vortex]

2nd boss bis loot

[soft oriole]

just play in a guild where most people die all the time and then the officers give you loot

[lilac pendant]

any of the engenieer "enchantments" better than Arcanoweave Lining?

[hazy breach]

Also looking over some logs rogue does seem to be doing fine, but at the high end its clearly struggling

[plush roost]

You talkin raid or keys

[hazy breach]

Non paladin logs

[plush roost]

Ye at the high end everything dies before rogues aoe matters at the low end u can fok envenom storm powder more

Boss dam has never been rogues issue

Makes sense to me

[sleek socket]

nothing funneled lol, solo player heroic raider, wrist champ, idk how important is the radiance for the rest of the season

[hazy breach]

Like the lower percentile you go

The more rogue goes up

Generally

[plush roost]

Ye then u go turbo low percentile m0s and the class gets nerfed

[glass torrent]

when does mastery get diminishing returns

[hallow mortar]

not m0s again

m0s which ended rogue dream

[warm marlin]

The burst aoe quite literally can die so fast my sectec clones disappear due to the adds dying

It’s not even worth casting on them

[verbal kelp]

Why 0 buffs for sub

[plush roost]

Collapsing starrrr

[hollow spear]

I inted my heroic dragon log by casting sectec on the adds

[warm marlin]

It’s not even cstar it’s legit eradicate

[hallow mortar]

i was coping that rogue actually good on last boss, but longer the fight goes lower he drop

[rain kernel]

can someone explain AA optimization for a noob?

[swift tinsel]

plus its super easy to prep double eradicate burst

[hazy breach]

Sub is genuinely pretty high on logs if you exclude paladins, especially on hc. #subtlety message

[shadow hamlet]

!ui

[wicked jolt]

Essential:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - Enhanced Cooldown Manager.
• WangBar / SensaiBar - Resource bar (when using blizzard CDM)
• MSUF / UUF - Unit frame mods.
• Platynator - Nameplate Addon.
  Quality of Life:
• Buff Reminders - Food/Flask/Poison Reminder.
• WilduTools - QOL enhancements.
• Mute Cold Blood sound

[latent finch]

is there even a melee looking good at paladins?

[hazy breach]

Arms and surv

[hallow mortar]

there are warriors in top50

[plush roost]

I hate devour

Bro we did shroud skip left side on algethsr 17, pull entire platform type shit

Do lashers last

I was ahead of dh by 20k

As soon as we get to lashers

[hazy breach]

[plush roost]

Fk this stuPUd PAD CLASS

[hallow mortar]

isnt devour fun to play?

like big boom

[plush roost]

I didnt enjoy it very much

Id rather be havoc

[hallow mortar]

i like dh in general but i try dev only for like minute on ptr 😄

[plush roost]

M+ rotation is somehow more braindead than sub rogue

[pastel geyser]

Damn sub got ignored in patch notes again

[hallow mortar]

does dev like 3 buttons

[plush roost]

U press consume like 80% of the key

[ionic python]

Do i lose a lot of dmg if i dont have haste breakpoint but i get haste flask, instead of having mastery flask with haste breakpoint ( asking cuz i kinda have better items if im not forced to get the breakpoint)

[hallow mortar]

you have eye beam and cstar only after that or

kush playing havoc on last boss now

[plush roost]

U mash consume, eyebeam eradicate, mash consume

Meta is fun

To try for the 6 stars

Then spam consume

[plush roost]

I mean unless youre maxing a ton of versa to use haste flask its fine, even then if robot says do it then do it

Lots of people are switching between haste and mast flask

Based on gear

[ionic python]

kk ty

[plush roost]

Its just like having a ring that gives haste crit instead of crit mast

Switcheroo

Typeshit

[hallow mortar]

i had so much mastery that game wanna crit flask me

[hazy breach]

Me when i get a new neck but i cant use it because i dont have another ring with another haste setup

[hallow mortar]

but thats ST sim

[plush roost]

I have both nexus rings finally

And alleria neck

Stat movement so ez now

(Until i get myth bond of light im vault 8( )

[rain kernel]

we arent suppose to proc AA with secret technique anymore?

[plush roost]

We never were

[rain kernel]

really? i thought in lust we suppose to proc AA every finisher in dance

what are the rules now ?

[hazy breach]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[plush roost]

^those

[hazy breach]

Ye i dont

But i also havent ran that many so i cant really complain

[plush roost]

My last run had 2 drop for people that hate masteru

[hallow mortar]

i ran many, did not get second ring. So i crafted ring and get in next run

[plush roost]

Gobbled them up

[thin echo]

Anyone else feel a little weaker with the 4 set for some reason?

[violet eagle]

So is assa doing more boss damage now in raid? 🙂

[rain kernel]

thank you...but with the rules above...im still casting shadowstrike to proc AA and then secret tech?

[plush roost]

If youre trickster, your first dance gcd should be sec tec which means no aa proc due to a bug with premeditation

U wanna start high cp

If youre ds, first gcd is storm and if you proc apex then feel free to send it

But apex sec tec is essentially an extra evis which is why its neutral

Since u can just apex an evis

[rain kernel]

so proc AA and with max cp...then using SD into sectech is wrong? cause the aa wont proc cause of premed bug?

[alpine wraith]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[plush roost]

No its correct, you dont care about apex on sec tec

If it happens yay, if not, w.e

[alpine wraith]

anyone has the macro with the known unseen blade

for storm with ds also

[plush roost]

Wat

[hazy breach]

ninjarobot posted it

[alpine wraith]

or known DN

thx

[hazy breach]

If you want to search

[rain kernel]

ohh understood...so if i have an AA already procd before going into SD and sec tech its still a yay...not a No no

[stuck tulip]

guys sub is dead, move over to assa

[plush roost]

(X) to Doubt.

[swift tinsel]

I'll play sin when pressing evisc at 80% regen stacks doesn't do literally nothing

[hazy breach]

We aint beating zerocool anyway, the ciggies are too strong

Might aswell not even try

[stuck tulip]

1 cig per boss

[hallow mortar]

i dont mind assa

[swift tinsel]

me in my 20's

[plush roost]

Well its not very fair that he debuffs the mobs with lung cancer for extra lethal dose damage....

[hazy breach]

But idk i think sub and assa are pretty similar

So just play whichever you prefer

[stuck tulip]

guys its calamitous story on the void delve, sub is dead reroll dk

[plush roost]

Ye for keys u just play sub in st boss dungeons and assa in funnel dungeons

[violet eagle]

and for raid?

[stuck tulip]

u keep the bench warm

[alpine wraith]

#showtooltip
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast [known: Unseen Blade] Secret Technique; Shuriken Storm

[hazy breach]

#subtlety message

[alpine wraith]

in case anyone wants to save it

[stuck tulip]

what is that illegal macro

[violet eagle]

Naah gotten to much gear to get benched xd

[hazy breach]

Its dance + sectech if trickster and dance+storm if deathstalker

[stuck tulip]

who plays ds

[soft grotto]

someone knows how much %+ gives the power infusion? (in dmg %)

[hazy breach]

Like 1%

[alpine wraith]

not much

[hazy breach]

Slightly less

You should ideally never give PI to a sub rogue

Most tanks benefit more

[soft grotto]

thx

[torpid snow]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[cosmic prairie]

doesnt haste technically increase ur attack speed meaning more cp meaning more apex

so pi especially in shadow dance if u talent 25% probably kinda crazy in m+

[hollow spear]

You overcap

[cosmic prairie]

oh :(

[hazy breach]

Yeah you do get more sht stacks, but like colo said you just overcap

[limpid sage]

Maybe if you can get a priest to do it off blades

[hallow mortar]

i have feeling blizz will make us assa rogues again soon

[fiery fog]

wrong channel buddy

[lucid jackal]

I don't think a 0.9% buff is enough to move the needle

[hallow mortar]

yeah one more 😄

little by little like in tww

[lucid jackal]

They said no more balance patches until 12.0.5

So

[hallow mortar]

i see

i did not see that

12.0.5 was rumored to be soon too tho as i remmeber

as it was release candidate on ptr

[alpine wraith]

finally managed to get through my backlog

now i can play LE

[minor trout]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[golden thistle]

guys is it possible to make a tracker for the first dance ?

[verbal kelp]

Guys what is better on use trinket for M+? Is it Guidon or Puzzle?

[golden thistle]

its impossible to track this thing at top right corner when u have 30 buffs

[cloud rover]

1BUG

!bug

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[lilac moss]

Id also like to know, squinting 247 after clearing a pack to see how many seconds left😮‍💨

[cursive tundra]

If there's no addon for it, I'll make one tomorrow

Cause I am also annoyed by it

[wintry blaze]

So i was previously told that crit is kinda irrelevant for sub, but the WoWHead guide tells me to buy the Ring enchant that buffs crit effectiveness? 😄

Not irrelevant, but like X haste and the rest full mastery

[cursive tundra]

Idk, for me crit sims well

once I reached haste breakpoint

sim likes mastery crit quite a lot

But keep in mind

Crit gives you crit CHANCE

That enchant gives you crit dmg

[wintry blaze]

ye that kinda adds to my confusion xD

[cursive tundra]

Normally if you do 100 damage and crit, you do 200 (or 150 in pvp). That enchant makes it 202.5 dmg

[wintry blaze]

Although that makes sense, it didnt neccessarily help me figure out which ring enchant i should get for m+ xd

[cursive tundra]

you know everyone on this discord will tell you

sim it

[wintry blaze]

how do i sim M+ though

Didnt they remove Dungeon Slice?

[fresh canyon]

Why wouldn't you get the increased crit dmg for m+?

[cursive tundra]

now you see everyone has their opinion on that. i still use dungeon slice for generic m+ idea, if you want more accurate, you can export route from MDT and put that into the sim footer to sim an actual dungeon with route

or that was actually a weakaura

Try https://keystone.guru/

[buoyant shale]

Is the Coup tracking broken or just really bad? I want to track when coup is ready not how many stacks of escalating blades I have

[lilac stag]

Crit Dmg is not irrelevant. Crit as a stat is not a primary focus.

[gleaming crane]

Isnt the Set Ring from Nexus bis for us i mean it Sims the highest for me

[hazy lichen]

anyone know why my sim doesnt follow this

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/feLXDjuCNqD5wKaEKESM1W

[warm marlin]

It’s technically slightly better (like 0.2%) to perfect snapshot stuff but it’s very difficult with in game delay on stuff

The faq rule is for humans/those who suffer from deepening update delay

[hazy lichen]

wdym

[warm marlin]

There are just some very precise timings that for various reasons are hard to do as a human that the sim does, the easy faq rule is very very close

It’s a lot to type out on mobile

[hazy lichen]

is it the fact that its snap shotting the guidon with the last second sd

[fleet acorn]

what addon do people use for party frames cd tracking?

[warm marlin]

yes but it’s only good if you also supercharge sectec

which is very hard with deepening delay

[hazy lichen]

so cant u press evisc and then just wait half a second at max cp to supercharge it

it aligns up

pretty well

at least for my current haste

[warm marlin]

Then you drop a gcd in dance which is bad

[ashen warren]

hello guys is it still important to wait as a tank for the sub rogue to restealth between each packs ?

[hazy lichen]

but i feel like supercharged sectec is so much better no?

then a extra shadowstrike at the end

[hazy lichen]

no

[ashen warren]

okay thanks

[hazy lichen]

u dont play deathstalker in keys anyway ps

[cursive tundra]

if they really want a big sd with first dance they can vanish and drop combat for a few seconds

but it's no longer that significant

[hazy lichen]

wdym

[golden totem]

You can put evis on ur cdm it will show up as coup when it's ready (or count to 4 the stacks)

[ashen warren]

oh yeah I forgot about this talent

[cursive tundra]

i'm responding to the tank question

maybe i'm just dumdum

[hazy breach]

Ok so the options are:
A. Supercharge sectech but have around half of your dance outside blades
B. Fit all of dance inside blades but dont supercharge sectech

[cursive tundra]

but I vanish to drop combat and get first dance if the tank is chain pulling the entire way and I have sb+puzzlebox up

[hazy breach]

And theyre about the same

[hazy lichen]

ok ty so its fine to do either?

[hazy breach]

Well yes but the first* one is significantly easier to do

As you dont need to cast your dance at the last millisecond of your guidon trinket

[hazy lichen]

arent you doing the same but with last 8 sec of blades tho

ig less punishment tho if u f it up

also i noticed that sometimes my guidon falls off and half a second or so later ill press dance and it still has the haste buff

[hazy breach]

#subtlety-faq message

Yes

That is the exact window you want to press your second dance in everytime

If you do the supercharge thing

Which is why it is hard

[hazy lichen]

so it also takes the same time to update the buff falling off?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[hazy lichen]

wtff

thats so niche

is there a way where u could have it set up on cdm to where it tracks it for an extra 0.5 sec

[hazy breach]

Nope

Again

Just dont bother

And do the other thing

[latent finch]

Why did they have to add haste interactions the worst ways possible. We not only have stat breakpoints now but also extremely cringe snapshotting

[hollow spear]

@warm marlin are you still trying to make it happen?

[swift tinsel]

because they had to change it mid-alpha bc the first version was so bad

[dusky yacht]

Wait upwards of 1 sec? Damn I've prolly been messing this up lmao

[hollow spear]

I'm practicing in m+

[swift tinsel]

and didn't dedicate enough time to 'fix' it

and apex had a fuckton of bugs that needed to get fixed

[hazy lichen]

wait it aligns perfect with meld + vanish

u dont even have to time it

[dusky yacht]

LIke how are you supposed to use guidon then, guidon before blades and sectec+dance macro, but you wait .. "upwards of 1 sec"? That's so weird

[swift tinsel]

guidon-wait one second-send blades/dance/sectech

the buff itself is kinda whatever as soon as you snapshot it with second dance

[hazy lichen]

i have my guidon macro'd with strike then blades sd sectec macro

[swift tinsel]

it not lasting all of blades doesn't really matter

if it were a main stat proc that would be different

[dusky yacht]

Interesting

[hazy lichen]

by the time strike gcd is done it usually aligns perfect every time

[swift tinsel]

but bc of how snapshotting works with server update timing its butt

[buoyant shale]

How min/maxy is this? Like what are we talking in dps deifference cause I'd rather just macro it into dance

[swift tinsel]

it won't snapshot haste into dance which defeats most of the purpose of the trinket

[dusky yacht]

Right and it comes off cooldown with blades anyway so even if you somehow manage to ss before dance (idk how but ok), it's right when you wanna blades basically

[swift tinsel]

is basically just an agi stat stick at that point that gives some more sht that will be overcapped anyways

its less min-maxy and more the entire point of the trinket

[hazy lichen]

i only do it when u can stealth opener obviously

anyone know why its doing the shuriken storm sd macro

[swift tinsel]

macroing guidon into dance is pretty much the worst thing to macro it to

[hazy lichen]

oh

nvm still dont get why

[dusky yacht]

Wait what you're supposed to macro shadowdance with shuriken storm? Isn't that only ds?

[swift tinsel]

you can use it if you find yourself dancing on low/no cp

[hazy lichen]

thats what i thought

[swift tinsel]

its not ideal but it can happen

[dusky yacht]

Eh I'm just gonna keep doing what I'm doing but just use guidon asap after opener, all these weird niche things are mindfking me

[swift tinsel]

there is also a literal warning above the sample cast sequence saying its sometimes silly

[hazy lichen]

but its doing it every time

[warm marlin]

Update soon

[warm marlin]

2nd dance in blades you’re sometimes low cp

It’s ok to start with storm there

Every other dance should be dance sectec

[swift tinsel]

2nd dance in blades is where all the fun niche stuff comes up

sometimes sending supercharged sectech with lust, sometimes sending in last couple seconds, sometimes on low cp

[wintry blaze]

So what's the conclusion on the ring enchant now? 😄

[swift tinsel]

eyes of the eagle

[steel wyvern]

I basically always have full cp for second dance

Idk

[swift tinsel]

"sometimes"

[steel wyvern]

I mean

I always do

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/jose-mourinho-special-one-the-special-one-i-think-i-am-a-special-one-premier-league-gif-15745626

[steel wyvern]

Cause you just get so many extra sht from dance

Yeah sure man I’m special

[hollow spear]

Idk outside of lust you're eventually running dry

At least in my experience

If you don't int globals

[hazy lichen]

yo whats the issue with pressing vanish and not being able to strike sometimes

[swift tinsel]

ye usually if circumstance forces you to start second dance on a builder it'll just kinda happen

[fossil forge]

Pressing buttons too fast

Is the gcd mouse cursor ring still a thing

[swift tinsel]

ye I've seen a handful of people use it

idr what its called

[hazy lichen]

its called

cursor ring

[fossil forge]

this 1?

[warm marlin]

mine is called ultimate mouse cursor I think

same idea

[fossil forge]

whats the command to customize it bossman @warm marlin

[steady osprey]

I'm curious about why all the top 3 RWF guilds are using a sub rogue for the current fight. What makes them ideal to use there?

[warm marlin]

idk I think I looked in addons menu?

[warm marlin]

best st, good burst cleave

[alpine wraith]

tankier and has decent burst aoe when adds spawn

[lilac pendant]

is deathstalker good vs L'ura?

[swift tinsel]

gentleman's agreement not to bring a third mm hunter

[hollow spear]

The question is: why would you play deathstalker?

[lilac pendant]

I love it

[fallow glade]

[lilac pendant]

the fantasy and the huge evis

[hollow spear]

From a performance perspective, there's no reason to play it on lura imo

[lilac pendant]

[hazy lichen]

does the sim take account for the sectec apex talent bug

[hazy breach]

Yes

[gilded garden]

is there a way to tricks of the trade your groups tank without having to click on his character name?

[hazy breach]

!tricks

[wicked jolt]

Auto Tricks on tank Addon - TankMD

[gilded garden]

ty

[hazy lichen]

do u know why my sim is building apex for a supercharged sec tec

by double casting strike

[tulip light]

Because it’s a dps increase

[fleet acorn]

WHAT party addon? for cds? i cant use minicc cause i use it in pvp

[crystal comet]

[fleet acorn]

congratz on raidfinder

[hollow spear]

Did I understand correctly that the dps difference between !guidon and the technically optimal play (sc the sectec) is a measly 0.2%?

[shrewd lantern]

You say that yet people were making a huge deal out of AA optimization

which was less

[lean rover]

Yeah but if you nail the CD rotation you still not topping DPS meters

[cosmic prairie]

https://i.imgur.com/u1wv8DZ.png

speak fo yoself

[warm marlin]

If you are referring to the second dance thing again, it’s because sectec is not off cd yet

Another part of the guidon shenanigans

[hollow spear]

I kinda find the shenanigans fun to a degree, but I'm somewhat convinced that it leads to enough mistakes due to how krangled it is that you might end up losing dps on average.

[shrewd lantern]

sometimes when im farming 10s for certain items i like to try fishing with coup st coup

to start a pack

also makes me not hate myself spamming storm bp for 20 minutes

[warm marlin]

The current rule Eleem has is just better

You have to practice the guidon stuff a lot and it’s probably not even better without the currently nonfunctional timer thing

[hollow spear]

Yeah

Sadge

Changing my guidon bar to a shadow blades bar that changes colour at 8.2 seconds left :^)

[chrome palm]

do you like my bar

[warm marlin]

Its very pretty

[chrome palm]

i had to relog in raid last night and my deepening shadows was giving me +0s of dance

after i logged back in

6s dance goes hard

[jagged hamlet]

what are you using for these?

[flint parrot]

!guidon

[wicked jolt]

Light Company Guidon (haste on use) Optimization:
When? - Only with the Season 1 4-set bonus and Guidon.
How? - During Shadow Blades, line up your second Shadow Dance with the last 8 seconds of Shadow Blades instead of using them back-to-back.
Why? - This allows you to fit another Secret Technique into Shadow Blades+Shadow Dance. It will not be supercharged but thats ok in this scenario.

[crystal comet]

this bar looks great, really like it. I'm gonna have to try te same

[chrome palm]

the pink/green is a custom addon the rest is arcui

[hollow spear]

I tried to do an overlay for sht like I had with the devlin wa

[crystal comet]

ah damn, I was hoping I could get get potion into CDM.

[jagged hamlet]

is the pink/green basically the tick for deepening?

[plush roost]

Thats pretty sick ngl

[hollow spear]

But in arcui the sht bar and the cp bar are misaligned

Drove me crazy

[chrome palm]

i like arcui for sht

[jagged hamlet]

i miss devlin

[chrome palm]

its why im using arc in the first place

red = <5 pink = 5+ blue = AA

[hollow spear]

Wait you can change colour based on aa?

[crystal comet]

Hey, got a potentially dumb question, another rogue told me I should use 285 crafted dagger in mh and 276 hungering victory in oh, but wowhead has them the opposite. Is that right?

[hollow spear]

Or is it a second bar?

[chrome palm]

second bar

[hollow spear]

Smart

[jagged hamlet]

use highest ilvl dagger in mh

[hollow spear]

You never put the lower ilvl weapon in your mainhand, that's pure int

[plush roost]

Messer do u prefer it constantly filling up the bar every single second? Im not addon guy but wouldnt it be less jarring for it to just fill up on 5 second intervals with miliseconds

Idk i just cant stand a bar flashing like that

[hollow spear]

Did you get the sc cp to permanently show?

I hate not seeing my pre pull sc cp

[gilded thistle]

just so it's clear, the reason the guide has them that way is because it assumes your hungering victory is 289.

[dusty totem]

Is crazy that all these beloren cheese groups have zero dmg. And no one is proging normal way makes boss unpugable

[crystal comet]

that makes sense, I realized afterwards that was prob why.

[gilded thistle]

what's the cheese?

[lilac stag]

For sht I prefer it at 5 and have a number for everything after.

[dusty totem]

1 egg phase

[plush roost]

Im talking abour deepening shadows internal cringe timer

[gilded thistle]

so their cheese is "do absurd amounts of damage" and they just aren't bringing damage?

lmao

[dusty totem]

Yub

[gilded thistle]

good stuff

[lilac stag]

Ah sorry.

[dusty totem]

Yeah is very nice. group is 2-2-21 so it has to die in 1 phase

And it just doesnt

[plush roost]

I do like ur sht bar tho

I really dont wanna install arc but maybe ill come around to it

[lilac stag]

I need to see if I can get something going for TFD with it

I’ve got an idea I want to try today

[vestal escarp]

Tf you mean starfall dmg up 16% ???

[lilac stag]

boomkins were suffering

https://tenor.com/view/moonkin-dance-starfall-dancing-moonkin-gif-20256106

[swift tinsel]

now they can facetank Alleria adds in the middle of nowhere even better

[gilded garden]

can you SS the boss when you have Tricks up without worrying about being oneshot?

[balmy gate]

at the raid the boss with 3 paladins do i use bp ?

[void ocean]

Its a dairy product, but thats not important right now

[obsidian crag]

does this trinket dmg makes the neck proc?

[swift tinsel]

we don't really have any problems proccing it on our own

[hazy breach]

Well youre already doing 50% of your damage as shadow

So you should not be equiping a bad trinket

[obsidian crag]

ic

[cosmic prairie]

that neck + nexus rings is peak

i love synergies

[fiery fog]

this will be coming in 12.0.5 and it seems to make myth track items go to an even higher ilvl (298)
i guess this will be just popped on an myth track dagger for main hand

[warm marlin]

only on trinkets or weapons!

[fiery fog]

i wonder if it puts a crafted weapon to 298 as well

or 295 because its crafted

[keen dome]

Probably 295, if I had to guess

[fiery fog]

i think the prio will be myth track dagger - gaze - crafted dagger - guidon or something

[chrome palm]

4 ilvl on mainhand = an entire embellishment

[fiery fog]

mainhand goes crazy

[tulip light]

Yes

[hazy lichen]

k ty

[summer peak]

how much effort are people putting in to hit 18% Haste? i have 16.8% but sims are lower when im looking to regem to get me over the line

[wooden wagon]

!haste

[wicked jolt]

Secret Technique cooldown gets reduced by all haste sources, while Shadow Dance only from haste which increases your baseline haste. When using a haste trinket, make sure to use it before Shadow Dance to get the extended duraiton.
The recommended ~700 haste gives you two additional globals in Shadow Dance and Guidon will grant one extra on top of that.

[gilded thistle]

I'm at 20% unbuffed and I still find myself missing gcd's sometimes with latency

[hazy lichen]

how much

and are u using haste crit oils

[torn tide]

whats the highest level u can craft something at?

285?

[gilded thistle]

700 with oils

[dusty totem]

Yes

[dusky yacht]

Guys what spec for beloren

is it cleave

The pin isn't updated with march

[gray kelp]

In a 2 target cleave situation do i use shuriken storm and black powder?

[steel zinc]

2 targets outside dance yes

In dance strike BP

Just 2, targets

[gray kelp]

ah good to know thank yoo

[sturdy mortar]

Strike BP if you run potent powder, was my understanding, otherwise ST like a pleb.

[cloud parrot]

With oils and everything in raids, Im coming up around 670 haste with my current gear. Just short of the 700 for Trickster. Would taking a Flask of the Blood Knights and pushing over 800 be a waste compared to getting the mastery from Magisters?

[steel zinc]

You should get with enchants etc over 700

[warm marlin]

670 is close enough imo

[cloud parrot]

yeah i got gems and enchants. Once i swap out a few gear pieces ill be good, I was just stumped on when I should swap from Blood knights to Magisters

[dry flame]

Not the craziest, but solo / pug life
(shit loot, no trinket)

[hallow mortar]

gratz, i have like 50 pulls with pugs yet to kill

[dry flame]

yeah, that's the toughest part for sure, to find people who will stay and learn

i went through 30+ groups

i knew the fight by heart at that point

[restive chasm]

Congratulations!

[keen dome]

the new puglord rises

[dry flame]

its not something i necerily recommend

[lilac stag]

@keen dome are we back?

[keen dome]

Back where

[lilac stag]

Above tanks?

https://tenor.com/view/delorean-time-travel-back-to-the-future-marty-mc-fly-gif-11295533

[fresh valley]

if yall had to pick between mag orc or normal orc what u goin with for raid?

[keen dome]

https://tenor.com/view/death-stranding-like-success-yes-thumbs-up-gif-25421194

[warm marlin]

for now normal orc

later seasons maybe maghar

[lilac stag]

Night Elf

[fresh valley]

im night elf rn but most logs showing both orcs

lookin to swap i think

[narrow shadow]

Male blood elf

Always

[fresh valley]

ewwww lmao

[narrow shadow]

You gain 0.1% damage per person who hates you

So you get infinite damage

[warm marlin]

wtf?

[oblique stream]

https://tenor.com/view/im-a-god-god-bill-murray-groundhog-day-groundhog-day-gifs-gif-10874241

[narrow shadow]

Male blood elves feed from discord hate and get stronger

[patent lichen]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[dusky yacht]

randomly joins guild alt run
gets bis trinket from normal
wtf

[fathom fulcrum]

What’s a decent alt if you enjoy sub playstyle? Haven’t found anything else to scratch that itch in the same way as rogue but maybe I haven’t spent enough time on the class

[dry flame]

arcane mage maybe?

[spice matrix]

Dev DH. Has about the same amount of buttons

[dusky yacht]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923750073499648/1487567692931010621/puzzlebox.gif

[keen dome]

A second sub rogue

[fathom fulcrum]

Based

[reef osprey]

Brand new rogue here... Can anyone tell me how this class survive? cause my defensives are non existant

[hazy breach]

Feint

[dusky yacht]

Feint, Crimson Vial, Health Pot, Healthstone, Evasion (in some cases), Cloak of Shadows

[narrow shadow]

Wtf.

[dusky yacht]

Use Feint before you are going to get damaged

[narrow shadow]

Feint, Evasion, Cloak, Vial

[dusky yacht]

In general just read these abilities so you understand how they work

[light hull]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lucid jackal]

Feint makes u God

And Cloak should be used liberally, generally

[dry flame]

https://giphy.com/gifs/dance-movement-kid-shadow-mV03KSc5gZw9LovoUv

movement

[dusky yacht]

Yeah sprint and shadowstep are lowkey defensives too tbh

[lilac stag]

@lucid jackal are we back yet? or is it still over?

[celest drum]

idk if im doing something horribly wrong

but in liek

16-17's

i have 0 chance

of competing with other dps atm

[lucid jackal]

Rogue seems like, barely good enough on last 2

It's like

It could be worse...

But still not great

[lilac stag]

surely the 4% outlaw buff will change that narrative.

[celest drum]

it's only st buff

[lucid jackal]

Rogues job in raid Is st only really

[celest drum]

true

[dry flame]

from what i've been seeing, ppl go Assa after 14-15

seems to be quite consistent

[reef osprey]

Ok.. One last question, during shadow dance, shadowstrike does way more damage than eviscerate (at least for now since I'm a fresh 90) I guess it's always shadowstrike follow by eviscerate, correct?

[sick sand]

can we macro guidon to shadow blades?

[vale pine]

subtelty seems to fall off in higher keys

but well

[vale pine]

you want to use it 1 sec before dance

[dusky yacht]

No you want to shadowstrike until Ancient Arts and then Evis or Coup De Grace, look at the WoWhead wiki and see the rotation there for details

[vale pine]

so ideally not

[sick sand]

ohh

ty

[reef osprey]

Thank you

[narrow shadow]

Top Rogue plays Sub tho.

Some Chinese guy doing 20s

Not even playing with shaman

[fair wedge]

is it js a swap outlaw angle

aoe feels so ass rn

[narrow shadow]

Assa. Too much mastery for Outlaw

[dusky yacht]

Yeah your stats are good for assas, but for sub you are lacking way too much mastery I think

[fair wedge]

yup unforch all gear i got this week had 0 mastery and went from 800 to 400

[narrow shadow]

It's perfect assa spread

[dry flame]

could be true, I've just seen a couple streams and vids

technically zac is doing a 20 rn on outlaw

[hollow spear]

Idk, your stats are not stopping you from playing sub

[fair wedge]

its not at all

[plush roost]

Ill keep it a buck 50 fellas

[fair wedge]

js feels a bit sad on aoe

[plush roost]

When the dust settles, only assa will be doing top keys

[narrow shadow]

I think Assa just becomes playable at 15s. But sub is still good all the way through

[fair wedge]

balling on st tho

[plush roost]

And outlaw zac

Hehe

[lilac stag]

I’m assuming it’s going to trickle down to people running weekly keys after Tuesday

[dry flame]

i like that all 3 specs are seeing play, its fun

[celest drum]

stats good?

yes no?

[keen dome]

But they removed dust

[dusky yacht]

I would say yes

[lilac stag]

Haste too low

[celest drum]

still no damage

[dusky yacht]

Rotation, mainhand wep, ..

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/frankly-thats-a-skill-issue-hazzikostas-ion-ion-hazzikostas-skill-issue-gif-21595688

[celest drum]

got told by a bm hunter that sub is s tier in keys

and his class is trash

[keen dome]

Well sub does begin with s

[celest drum]

true

[dry flame]

https://giphy.com/gifs/sexy-look-madagascar-elhmwUMsAUbScKLLzl

[void ocean]

evening kings

what r we glooming about atm

i just set up my assa specs

for this season

[vale osprey]

Guys did you hear echo went dark to transition to their secret 16 sub rogue strat?????

[quaint breach]

https://tenor.com/view/well-then-homer-hid-in-bushes-gif-13481888

[hollow spear]

Ah that's what the moon thingy means on rio

[narrow shadow]

When the black powder settles

[narrow shadow]

I jump between them all the time depending on key and comp

[vale osprey]

I've resisted playing assa because I like sub ATM and I am a sucker for dots so ik if I play too much assa I'll stick playing it

[alpine wraith]

well assa does 1 thing better than sub

it dies quite well

[narrow shadow]

And runs out of energy

Pressing feint as non sub is painful

[dry flame]

I've always been a class main, not a spec one, so this is great vibe for me

[potent heath]

16 blades, litteraly OS boss

16 hunt same

[humble rover]

@vale pine you dont happen to know how well skyfury performs between all rogue specs?

[vale pine]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vale pine]

its the best buff by quite a bit

[vale osprey]

Fuu you don't happen to know how battle shout performed between all rogue specs?

[uncut monolith]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[uncut monolith]

/use guidon
/cast shadow blades
/use potion..
Im getting desync CDs with this macro causing that trinket is not used since i double triple click the macro:( why and how to fix?

[vale osprey]

Okay I appreciate you linking that I want you to know it was a joke xoxo just tryna riff on the "Fuu do you know X about sub rogue"

[vale pine]

ohh

sorry, i am tired already

its midnight here

[tepid trellis]

in m+?

[uncut monolith]

I noticed it in m+ yes. Im not sure in Raid

[tepid trellis]

could be the weekly affix which gives spell cooldown reduction

which does not work on trinkets

[uncut monolith]

Ajaj true ok ty. Dat afix made guidon from s tier for nubs to B 😄

[barren wolf]

every damn time the affix appears

same ass question

[iron obsidian]

real

[karmic dagger]

should I macro blades, dance and sec tech?

[vale pine]

you can

ideally you either have one macro without blades or add a modifier key

for instances you don't want to use blades

[dusky yacht]

Yeah and also isn't it better for guidon to have blades seperate? Like Guidon -> Blades -> Sectecdance?

[shrewd lantern]

Just do keys the affix isnt a thing

[iron obsidian]

^

[summer peak]

my haste is 590 with oils,

should i gem all haste to get me to 700, or of course i can also use haste flask for 165 haste.

[rose parrot]

!Tricks

[wicked jolt]

Auto Tricks on tank Addon - TankMD

[cold citrus]

try to get 650 haste with gems and drop your vers gear asap

[upbeat cradle]

ayoooo got Alleria's neck HM from our first kill

now i can do no damage, but more efficiently

[wide cave]

Quick question is anyone aware of any add ons that can alter the spell effect for ancient arts? Its not that I cant see it but i would prefer if it wasn't solid black

[plush roost]

Spell opacity

[wide cave]

Yeah i have it cranked

looks like someone has drawn on my screen with marker pens

[leaden plover]

Nimble flurry does not cleave normal evis anymore??

[hazy breach]

Correct

Nor does it cleave shadowstrike

[thin sinew]

it was giga gutted

[leaden plover]

bro what the heck is this spec anymore

[lucid jackal]

Mediocre

[shrewd lantern]

storm bp

basically

[leaden plover]

thats reason enough to just swap

[hallow mortar]

storm bp is fun

[leaden plover]

https://tenor.com/view/grass-mower-mowing-gif-26074145

[shrewd lantern]

as fun as watching paint dry

[hallow mortar]

yes, very fun

[leaden plover]

last titan rework

https://tenor.com/view/fingers-crossed-i-hope-so-please-please-gif-19730905

[hallow mortar]

we had too much fun so we slipped into no fun, what can you do

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah tww was too much

[hallow mortar]

it was good

[lucid jackal]

As to the shadowstrike evis spam of last expac

[hallow mortar]

i felt alive playing sub back than

[fossil forge]

Tww sub would go brazy rn

in raid

[hallow mortar]

or dust sub 😄

that was peak fun

but half of rogue playerbase hated it

[twin quartz]

Dust sub was the greatest thing ever put in this game

Imagine you can mesh to whatever the best parts are in any fight

[hallow mortar]

tindral was peak with dust sub

[shrewd lantern]

Well dust outlaw

was better

but yeah

[swift tinsel]

dust sl outlaw