subtlety

[vestal relic]

even during blades?

[gilded garden]

you lose something when getting two ready tho

[pallid jackal]

Yes I was wondering if that was better

[short aurora]

what is there to get

am i just surface level or what

[lilac stag]

supercharged cps are very strong

[vale pine]

it is not better to dance before secret is up

[unkempt oak]

Can I macro my pot into blades + dance + SecTec or does it need to be before like the trinket?

[short aurora]

im so confused

[red flame]

I’m also very confused here I thought it was pretty straightforward

[vale pine]

you can macro

[gilded garden]

what if you would have two dances up before sectech is up

[lilac stag]

none of this is done just to make it confusing or seem cute. It’s a dmg gain

[thin sinew]

https://tenor.com/view/futurama-fry-philip-j-fry-stop-circles-gif-22790188

[vale pine]

if you want to not lose dynamic

[chilly kite]

so if we're outside blades and have dance up but no sectek but are gonna have a 2nd charge up before that first dance ends, do we send the dance? or still wait and just sit on 2 charges of dance until sectek is ready?

[vale pine]

might want to use a modifier in case you don't want to use blades

if you need to delay on a fight

[lilac stag]

You did something wrong

[gilded garden]

not if boss mechanics dont allow for using it no?

[pallid jackal]

Always use the charge never not use it I suppose

[vale pine]

e.g. i have shift on my macro

so regular cast is dance + blades + secret

[lilac stag]

dance is 20 Sectech is 20 or less

[vale pine]

if i hold shift

its dance + secret

[lilac stag]

How are you disjointed that much?

[gilded garden]

doesnt always align though if you use sectech at the end of dance during pull

[lilac stag]

You send another dance right after or a dry Sectech

[vale pine]

you might delay your dance/secret if blades has a less than 10 sec cooldown remining

[lilac stag]

and it aligns

if you have enough haste you get 3 sectechs in lust

but that’s not exactly what you want for overall dmg

[gilded garden]

do you always want to have 2 shadow dances during shadow blades?

[chilly kite]

i have too much haste i'm guessing, because i wanted to hit breakpoint for another global during dance, so i can send blade dance, into dance 2 then dance 3 is ready before dance 2 ends, then dance 4 is up shortly after dance 3 and sectek 3 comes up shortly after that

[lime wigeon]

Scripe: "I think we should remove all melee. 1 DK, 1 DH and tanks. Done"

[valid yoke]

Well how much do you have? Tmk the magic number is 700

[lime wigeon]

Amazing design

Woops wrong chat

[crystal bone]

[lilac stag]

welcome to world of range: the main character.

[chilly kite]

if i use guidon 1680ish

[lilac stag]

This is good. Get the rogue out. Get us buffs.

[oblique stream]

Is there just a basic starter rotation

[valid yoke]

Ooo that’s a point don’t tuning changes drop today?

[vale pine]

haha, its all fine

[valid yoke]

As in for next reset?

[vale pine]

we all think the same thing

[lilac stag]

@lime wigeon you’re always welcome here. Proper color name.

[keen dome]

Purple club

[lime wigeon]

How kind

[lilac stag]

I did keys with RL last night. “So what did they fuck up with rogue?”

[keen dome]

Did you start with "What didn't they"

[swift tinsel]

I got asked that in raid last night too lmfao

"how come yall keep getting benched?"

[lilac stag]

I just laid it out. Removed all our cleave, tuned us around m0 and make the fights mostly range.

[hazy breach]

#subtlety message
Here i am comparing subs niche in midnight to their niche in tww

[lime wigeon]

I feel in keys Rogues are strong enough. In raids I still feel Rogue is one of the better progress classes for any guild outside like top 10

[lilac stag]

for our guild level it won’t matter

[chilly kite]

our RL thinks rogues are fine, and since the other rogue and myself are top damage atm, we just kinda go with, our ranged are terrible thats the only reason we are top

[keen dome]

I think that's a good take but we could really benefit from proper, long-term improvements like a raid buff, imo.

[valid yoke]

My biggest issue atm is consistency

[lime wigeon]

Yeah we could

[keen dome]

A non-Atro raid buff, to be clear. Atro is good but

[chilly kite]

hell our entire officer core, thinks that rogues as a whole are sandbagging this tier...

[lilac stag]

“What about assa?”
Well if any other spec was allowed to just sit full ST on a boss and ignore everything else, assa’s boss dmg would 📉

[valid yoke]

A haste raid buff would be awesome

[lime wigeon]

But like after progress the value of rogue drops a lot. But at that point, well does it matter than much

[keen dome]

Yeah

[keen dome]

@short radish's idea of a +3% crit raid buff is my favourite because of the thematic design and also everyone likes to crit.

[swift tinsel]

I would argue for a good amount of the overall playerbase yeah

[lilac stag]

just remember. this is an outlaw tier. FRFR

[swift tinsel]

not that rogues are that big of a slice of the overall population pie

[lilac stag]

so outlaw, we’re all benched

[keen dome]

Next tier is outlaw tier, scath

because it's the troll tier

[valid yoke]

I had a big thought about it, call it “killing instinct” and it makes you have more haste / crit

[lilac stag]

guys’s thanos vault could not have been any better

funniest shit I’ve seen in 4 years with loot

[keen dome]

I missed it, was it all belts

[versed swift]

Next tier is rogue tier for sure

[valid yoke]

I was straight up told that if I stayed outlaw I’d be bench warming lol

[swift tinsel]

it was huge lol

[valid yoke]

Fuckin better be lol

[lime wigeon]

We've had %crit raidbuff already, so I guess thematic to bring it back

[lilac stag]

No he had everything all in one vault. Also benched for prog.

[keen dome]

Damn

[lilac stag]

vs his 8 weeks of sockets

[keen dome]

That's honestly even more cursed than a bad vault.

[swift tinsel]

my pipedream is crit/haste+aa chance

but like I said before, redundant with skyfury

[keen dome]

Yeah

[valid yoke]

Well I’d also like a 4th rogue spec that brings back throwing weapons but I think that’s a bit long winded lol

[keen dome]

I like Crit because everyone benefits from critting more. It's going to be universally useful.

[chilly kite]

I want bard

[swift tinsel]

yeah

[lilac stag]

my dream is the keep it fucking simple so everyone wants us and just do crit dmg and lessen atrophic by 40%

[keen dome]

rogue tank

[swift tinsel]

crit%+crit dmg/heal

[valid yoke]

Nah, ranged rogue spec that uses combo points from range

[keen dome]

3% crit chance + 1.5% crit damage

[lime wigeon]

Kinda feel that throwing weapons is already DH's, hard to really do something cool with it as Rogue when so much design space eaten up by flashy cool rangde classes

[valid yoke]

Remember deadly throw? They have the framework lol

[keen dome]

Rogue tank

[fleet sluice]

You have to do this during shadow blades for the second shadow dance though right?

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/lionking-simba-baby-simba-throw-off-throw-from-cliff-gif-2491760533743383368

[valid yoke]

We had it first! #bringbackdeadlythrow

[chilly kite]

yea, they gave it to dh

[keen dome]

shadowstep

[lilac stag]

You still fell off the cliff

Unfortunate

[vale pine]

2nd dance in blades is an exception

[keen dome]

https://tenor.com/view/moe-simpsons-barney-e-moe-gif-23054386

[swift tinsel]

at least give us aa chance in class tree and blacklist from skyfury like csaa is for ret

in tandem with a raid buff

please I beg

[lilac stag]

that would be a better approach instead of 30% skyfury buff lol

[keen dome]

Raid buff would be the single best long-term improvement they could make imho. I really hope they consider it.

[chilly kite]

give us a version of lust

[swift tinsel]

doing so would alleviate skyfury reliance and all 3 specs would benefit

[keen dome]

Yeah

Big fan of that idea, Haptics

[swift tinsel]

plus our class tree is pretty eh until the very bottom gate

it would be immensely helpful overall I feel

[lilac stag]

It matches the spec tree, except that’s meh all the way down

[swift tinsel]

If all three specs get 5-7% bonus from skyfury but can't provide it, that's bad

plus then they can adjust sht proc rate independently of skyfury for us

if need be

[lilac stag]

The crit dmg also wouldn’t destroy PvP

[swift tinsel]

its just parsimonious I feel

[lilac stag]

becuse we still seemed to be burdened with that minigame

[swift tinsel]

idk if they want to do something with giving us a raid buff I'd also like them to address how much we rely on them

[hushed roost]

shadow clone rogue tank dattebayo

[swift tinsel]

skyfury in particular

[keen dome]

Crit chance + crit damage would be the ideal Rogue thing thematically, benefits every single class / spec. Winning.

[swift tinsel]

yeah

agreed

Realz if you're lurking please I beg

[keen dome]

3% crit chance / 1.5% crit damage (healing).

[valid yoke]

We’re pretty much fucked without warrior shaman and monk lol

[swift tinsel]

ye

[keen dome]

Bam we're in everything, a big boon to the group. If we're sat it's 'cos all melee are sat.

[chilly kite]

the damage difference last night, when our raids shaman was late and wasn't there vs when he got there, was kinda stupid.

[keen dome]

Yeah, the whole Shaman thing is another big problem.

[swift tinsel]

yeah, skyfury is just a generally frustrating situation

[uncut monolith]

Guys is any difference in bonuses when casting first- shadow dance then shadow blades then opposite ?

[swift tinsel]

the aa proc is just so damn strong

[lilac stag]

I just don’t want them to overthink it with some dumb execute shit. Give me something that works in all content

[chilly kite]

i don't want to do a key unless i have a shaman, it feels like i'm ice skating uphill in a key without a shaman

[keen dome]

Yeah, pretty much. That's why I'd rather they focus on something like a raid buff to start with.

[swift tinsel]

execute would just push sin even further on any fight you need execute

[valid yoke]

Perhaps shadow tech would be better on a timer? More consistent and less reliant on attack speed buffs

[swift tinsel]

nah

they can just remove the doubled sht stacks from shadowcraft

[lilac stag]

And you get sylvanas and poorly tuned rogue.

[swift tinsel]

and that would alleviate a ton of the sht overcap/waste

yep

[keen dome]

Rogue sighted in Liquid's comp

They're gonna carry the raid

[lilac stag]

Give it 2 hours

[foggy gate]

new to rogue, How bad is a mace in off-hand for sub?

[swift tinsel]

I'm afraid to watch exile's stream, the last time I tuned it it switched to Atlas a couple seconds later

[valid yoke]

Just increase the cap, we need some help somewhere haha

[hollow forum]

U guys think its gna be a small tuning

[valid yoke]

Awful, you want to use double dagger

[swift tinsel]

we already get so many that an increased cap wouldn't do much

need to throttle acquisition

[keen dome]

!oh

[wicked jolt]

Shadow Techniques is not normalized and this makes a slow weapon (axe/sword/mace/fist) in offhand significantly weaker and almost never worth equiping.

[lilac stag]

[uncut monolith]

!addons

[lime wigeon]

Funnily enough, I wonder if 1h will be so bad due 0.45 icd

[unkempt oak]

Assuming we aren't getting any gear from mythic raid, what's the optimal 3rd piece of gear to craft? Offhand dagger?

[foggy gate]

rip

ty!

[hollow forum]

NollTvaTre goated guild

[valid yoke]

I won’t be surprised if their addons get nuked lol they basically made a wa telling them exactly what to do for runes lol

[void ocean]

Slay!

[lilac stag]

The interrupt is stronger than the runes

[swift tinsel]

pretty sure they're telling the addon what to do for runes

[void ocean]

Still

[uncut monolith]

!commands

[keen dome]

The whole mechanic looks extremely awful imho

[valid yoke]

Yea but still too far imo

[swift tinsel]

I say just kick one add and speed-rotate around the boss to avoid getting blasted lol

[chilly kite]

how is this not having a wa do all the work

[swift tinsel]

eh not really

[swift tinsel]

if you have to tell it which runes are in which order then its doing the easiest part

[fallow nimbus]

Offhand is the last slot you think about

[swift tinsel]

its just less mental load

[valid yoke]

Yea anything like that needs nuking

[lilac stag]

Bliz developed a shit mechanic.
Programmers beat it.

https://tenor.com/view/surprised-pikachu-surprised-pikachu-face-face-gif-15329743

[swift tinsel]

idk I don't see it as a big deal

its not solving anything for you

unless you literally don't know how to form a circle

[void ocean]

Thats the definition of every WA ever

[keen dome]

I'd like to introduce you to many many pugs.

[latent finch]

Thats a banger gif im going to steal this one

[swift tinsel]

pugs are precisely why its useful

[lilac stag]

it’s cutting down communication. good. Fuck talking.

[keen dome]

Someone give me a lockout for Mythic Midnight Falls. I'll assemble a team. The worst team you've ever seen.

[chilly kite]

they symbols are random, and the order they are put in is also random. that one screenshot trivializes the entire thing

[swift tinsel]

how does that make sense

[chilly kite]

and you don't get to see half the symbols because your in different realms

[lilac stag]

I’m living in trumps teams. You ain’t getting close to that.

[keen dome]

Yeah, that's fair

Nobody in a pug is that bad.

[swift tinsel]

if you put in chat what the icons are and in which order, the mapping icon just translates that into a map

a visual representation of data you already know, in the order you gave it

[void ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/trump-dance-trump-2024-trump-gif-12734161508561409577

[lilac stag]

Ban this chat bot @vale pine

[swift tinsel]

that would be like dropping raid markers in the order using mapped marks for a given symbol

[valid yoke]

Tbh for me I’ve been looking forward to seeing an actual hard boss and my concern is that they’re gonna cross the line with addons and trivialise it

[short aurora]

a small typeracer before raid to determine who has the most wpm to be designated symbol typer

[void ocean]

Whaaa

[swift tinsel]

based goated send it

[chilly kite]

nicememes is doing it natty

[short aurora]

nicememes on redemption arc

[left ledge]

Idk man this is not the correct take

It is definitely doing a mechanic for them

[chilly kite]

nvm it just didn't come up the first time

[left ledge]

Without it they’d be marking every single time

And because they move

They have to redo marks

The mechanic is doable without them if you mark a tank and learn to position around them

But that def does give a heavy advantage

[latent finch]

Another point. Do we think this is a good mechanic in the first place?

[left ledge]

It’s an ok mechanic

Nothing wrong with it

[lilac stag]

let me see the deaf guild communicate this

[chilly kite]

its a new mechanic

[unreal ledge]

it is interesting, i think stolen from ff14

[valid yoke]

I don’t think it’s bad, it’s nice to see blizzard doing new shit more than anything

[left ledge]

Order based mechanics exist in many boss games

[short aurora]

its easy, they're used to "sign" language

[left ledge]

Yeah ff has a lot of order based stuff

[short aurora]

https://tenor.com/view/wheeze-laugh-gif-14359545

[lime wigeon]

I think it'd be "ok" after they remove the RWF tuning. And you do with world markers like on hc

[chilly kite]

its just maiden simon says sorta

[solar mural]

weren't they supposed to give us AoE blind back this week?

[left ledge]

No

.5

This isn’t .5

[valid yoke]

On .5

[solar mural]

ah ok

[swift tinsel]

idk I just don't see it doing as much of the legwork as people are claiming

[left ledge]

.5 also has the void forged shit I think

[chilly kite]

thats in .5 thats our tuneing lol

[left ledge]

And bonus rolls

[swift tinsel]

unless it automatically "sees" the runes and auto-fills itself without any input from players

[valid yoke]

I think it’s more of a “where do we draw the line”

[solar mural]

so 3 more weeks

[left ledge]

Yea it’s ok to think that but it definitely helps when you can just not dedicate any mental space to it

[unreal ledge]

try with and try without and say that again, i think you'll be surprised

[swift tinsel]

I mean you still need to

[valid yoke]

I’m so happy bonus rolls are coming back

[left ledge]

You don’t though

[chilly kite]

which unless an echo player said it didn't we don't know if it is or not

[left ledge]

It just shows you the order and symbol positions

Nobody has to mark anything

[swift tinsel]

but if you know where beam starts and which direction it rotates, does that matter if you mark or not

[left ledge]

Obviously they developed it because doing it otherwise was a pain point

They didn’t make it for fun

[swift tinsel]

well yeah

very obviously

if it decreases mental load in any capacity they'll do it

[left ledge]

Yes the mechanic is doable without it

[lilac stag]

I’d dev it just to make blizz look like a fool

[left ledge]

So was fractillus

[tiny blaze]

!macro

[swift tinsel]

in bleeding edge content you'll take any opportunity you can to do so

[left ledge]

Yeah

[chilly kite]

when some of the symbols are blocked from your view by being in different realms, it would make it much more difficult to tell where to stand

[void ocean]

I mean they look like fools even without anyone trying

[lilac stag]

Sorry we’ve disabled all chat commands. They give an unfair advantage

[left ledge]

I mean that’s what WA mostly was

There are very few bosses where you actually could not do it without a WA

The last one was what

[swift tinsel]

so you literally just have someone say/type in chat/rw it

[left ledge]

Jailer?

[void ocean]

Stix

[swift tinsel]

you communicate the order, which is the entire point

[left ledge]

Yeah stix good point

I wasn’t in on stix prog

So I guess I didn’t remember

[lilac stag]

For me NK. I needed gfx setting changed on the fly. I also know I’m special.

[left ledge]

Nexus King?

I don’t even remember what the weakauras were on him ngl

[lilac stag]

Yes. In order to see o had to change setting every ghost set

[left ledge]

I just played off markers

Oh to see the ghosts

Ok that’s visual thing

[lilac stag]

So is this

[left ledge]

Uh

[lilac stag]

Just I’m disabled.

lol

[left ledge]

Yea idk if this is the same thing

[chilly kite]

I had to use the thing that hid your UI for ghosts because purple with light purple, on dark purple. being colorblind was just aids

[left ledge]

This is an order mechanic

The ghosts were just terrible in contras

[void ocean]

Ghosts were white

[left ledge]

Contrast*

[lilac stag]

How is the deaf guild communicating this?

[left ledge]

You don’t need comms for it

[lilac stag]

with 3 realms

Ok

[left ledge]

Liquid didn’t even use comms afaik

They just dropped markers

[lilac stag]

Because the addon read the keys

[unreal ledge]

the addon reads chat is all its doing

ppl are typing in chat what the order is and the addon orders it on the screen popup

[lilac stag]

how am I communicating key / order w/o words

[chilly kite]

we don't know if they are or not, because chats are alwys hidden on stream

[swift tinsel]

so it solves basically nothing

[unreal ledge]

you use keyboard and mouse

[swift tinsel]

bc you give it the order

[unreal ledge]

max said it is how it is done

[chilly kite]

is echo's addon the exact same tho

[unreal ledge]

that i'm not sure, but i bet it is yeah

[lilac stag]

my assumption is the first version did it all for you

[unreal ledge]

max said they got their addon ok'd thru blizzard and i bet echo followed suit

[lilac stag]

The first one was deleted

[unreal ledge]

ya maybe, if it did anything that reads game data or something like its not supposed to be able

[lilac stag]

They’re on their backup addon

[unreal ledge]

i mean i'm on your side, i hate teh addon

if the whole point was to eliminate weakauras and bring down the power of addons, they failed miserabily

[lilac stag]

maybe exile can share when they bench rogue

[chilly kite]

i wanna see rwf with the caviate of, oh your that good, ok all addons disabled you gotta use the natty UI only

[stray relic]

can someone explain to me how the rogue DR differs from paladin's DR on paladins?

like is it functionally the same thing

[swift tinsel]

I would not wish base ui on anyone

[chilly kite]

its not all that bad, I for the most part just use base UI

[lilac stag]

It’s fucking awful

[swift tinsel]

"we just don't feel like you need to see your trinket buffs, be able to manipulte any text at all in the cdm, "

"also you'll get NO useful info from our damage meter and you'll like it"

[chilly kite]

yea, that damage meter is terrible

[latent finch]

"we know you need to track your apex you know the new fancy thing. Here is a tracker that works once"

[swift tinsel]

"and if you're playing assassination good luck lmao"

[lilac stag]

TFD says help

Hmm. I wonder if I can arc bar it now

[swift tinsel]

if you have the spell ID you should be able to

just do a custom bar with a set duration and refresh enabled

[chilly kite]

i would like something to track gaze procs, just to see how many stacks i have at any one point so i can play around it a little

[keen dome]

Not being able to track trinkets in the CDM is continually surreal to me.

[swift tinsel]

trinkets/pots/healthstones

actual insanity

I'm still mad you can't move, resize, add miliseconds to text

you have to make icons ridiculously large to increase text size to something decently visible

[keen dome]

I would like to see HP .1's on the blizz bars, too

[chilly kite]

i have all my major cd's trinkets healthstone pots, all on like action bar 8 and moved it near the center of my screen to track them

[swift tinsel]

and also buff desaturation when not active

[keen dome]

But like. These aren't integral to play whereas trinkets (and I agree, fucking pots/healthstones) not being on the CDM is wild

[swift tinsel]

would be different if this showed trinket buff duration

[keen dome]

Like that should really, really be basic functionality.

[swift tinsel]

but its only cd unless they changed something

[chilly kite]

oh, i do that oldschool and count it down in my head lol

i find myself actually counting as I'm hitting gcd's to keep the active trinket timeing. it would be nice to use that mind space for something else. i'd prolly be better at the game lol

[swift tinsel]

My frustration stems from having a great system for having ready access to information and having it stripped away and replaced with a version that’s just objectively worse in every metric

[warm marlin]

you can "track" trinket buffs with addons

but its dumb it isnt base game ye

[plush roost]

Ye arc and midnightsimpleauras can custom buff track

[fallow rampart]

Guys am i right, we never dance without sectec its only in blades back to back if we dont have guidon ye?

[chilly kite]

i should prolly look into that lol

[plush roost]

Ye i have 1 setup for guidon

[fallow rampart]

Or we have some situations when we can use sectec without supercharged bonus ?

[uncut monolith]

Should I ever delay secret technique for fishing up Ancient arts stacks?

[sick epoch]

Should I use my shadowblades always when I can use 2 charges of shadow dance?

[lilac stag]

context matters. but no in general you don’t sit on sblades

[graceful terrace]

i really just cant get anything to sim better than this trinket.

[plush roost]

Hey guys, luckylee here. Im trying to find World First Beloran rogue pov, does anyone know if its uploaded yet? Thanks!

[lime wigeon]

Releases next week

[lilac stag]

hey lucklee, scathic here. Have you tried checking out foreverguy’s twitter / x account?

[bleak night]

Hey guys, luckylee here. Im trying to find World First Beloran rogue pov, does anyone know if its uploaded yet? Thanks!

[uncut monolith]

Please what is the exact playstyle difference between playing for Apex talent and just ignoring it? (somewhere was 1%dps lose)

[keen dome]

give me 10 minutes and I'll have the world first beloran rogue pug pov.

(entering the instance, pulling it once, immediately wiping, disbanding the group)

[lilac stag]

1.5%. More for priority dmg.

It’s not that difficult to learn if you sit down with it.

[cosmic prairie]

lwk even if u ignore it u still end up hitting it pretty often

[uncut monolith]

Thats alot. So while on CD on shadow dance+st i should fish up for max apex and release it in next Secret technique window?( in next 4-5s)

[lilac stag]

get max cp and aim for 3-5 sht stacks going into dance

[uncut monolith]

Ok, thx- 3-5 stacks. After that its just rng Secret technique strike(max or not) or? Iam strugling 60% average dmg in Secret technique comparison to same Ilvl guys, iam definitely wrong im smthing.

[lusty acorn]

Is there new class tuning 6 april?

[lilac stag]

#wowheadnews

[fair phoenix]

Hey guys, luckylee here. Im trying to find World First Beloran rogue pov, does anyone know if its uploaded yet? Thanks!

[lilac stag]

Can use !log

[uncut monolith]

!log

[limpid sage]

Ye but the lost % also accounts for that

[fallow rampart]

gguys can someone explain how we pressing dances and sectec in Bloodlust ? also back to back and sectec only suprecharged ? i saw ppls pressing sectec without dance in bloodlastt

[stuck lance]

Our raid buff is worse then pally we only reduce dmg of targets that can be effected by our poison anything from the environment is not counted.

[keen holly]

!AA

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[gilded thistle]

switching to this instead of vessel

biggest qol upgrade

from C tier to C tier I don't have to think about

please lord give me gaze in vault

i cant live like this

[graceful rock]

new split toon for next tier

[fiery fog]

im is st ww sub?

:v)

[gilded thistle]

im is single target windwalker sub

[small helm]

I refuse to play sub while puzzlebox is my best trinket.

[thorny ridge]

!FUU

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[cobalt patrol]

Does Blind work on Safeguard Matrix on Midnight Falls boss'

I cant see if it worked on logs

Or Gauge

[lucid jackal]

The paladin aura is an aura applied to all players, any damage they take is reduced.

Atrophic is a debuff applied to a target which causes them to deal less damage.

Atrophic is 0.6% stronger than dev aura on paper, and on a lot of fights it is just better, however on some encounters the damage is sources from not the target you are actively hitting, or might be fully untargetable

[indigo current]

hi

would you guys consider crafting a neck?

considering a very low chance of getting bis from crown or vault

[obsidian crag]

got this from this week chest

[indigo current]

mine is one of my last champion items

gz

\

i got this beauty

i feel like boots would be more value tbh

[obsidian crag]

im dreaming about that trinket

[uncut monolith]

Could you explain why the FAQ suggests this order—casting :ShadowBlades: during :ShadowDance:? Does the order matter( in 0,05s)?

[lucid jackal]

It can be

[warm marlin]

No doesn’t matter

[lilac stag]

There’s a perfectly good heroic quest reward neck for 40 minutes of PVE BGs available, so no.

[vivid cobalt]

is this op lol

[umbral cliff]

can you macro lights company? wowhead says you should not macro it?

[obsidian crag]

dont look OP to me, what u want is haste proc before shadow dance, so ur shadow dance can extand longer

[hazy breach]

#subtlety-faq message

Oh sorry wrong tag, meant @umbral cliff

[wraith zealot]

hi guys i wonder after i craft dagger and waist what is next ?

[obsidian crag]

bracer, cloak

[wraith zealot]

i gopt bracers from pit

so cloak i think need

[west tide]

guys guys guys

do not worry

we are coming up

[stoic pawn]

does crafting bleed dager makes sense if not going to craft a lot of things? casual playing right now

[hazy breach]

Nop

No point crafting it over crafting one with the hunt embellishment

[stoic pawn]

ok thanks

to be honest im very lost with crafting

what do i need to get max ilvl?

[uncut monolith]

80 myth crests.(80-90 idk)

[stoic pawn]

only have heroic

[stuck lance]

would there be a way in the raidbots sim to add a debuff of like -100 haste for sub xD

[fallow glade]

i remember people adding a custom shirt with like +100 stat, idk if you can make it negative

[vale pine]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1488547832062415010/drop_fixed.png

[stuck lance]

there used to be negative stat items i would think its possible

[lilac stag]

Set X to the number 100 less of your total haste
gear_haste_rating=X

[stuck lance]

true but that won't help finding top gear will it @lilac stag can i do computational like x-100

[lilac stag]

Nope

[stuck lance]

sad day

[lilac stag]

the only way you could try to get around it is using top gear and attempting to “force” great vault items so it only chooses 1 while still allowing you to change gems and enchants

the easier approach. Ilvl generally wins after 700 haste

[stuck lance]

yeah but also would be nice for droptimizer in guild lol

[lilac stag]

just manually edit your wow audit

put raw dps in notes or manually add percents

[stuck lance]

yeah i jsut dont have the best idea but like right now its saying voidsong chain is a .5% dps loss and i am just like no thats actually really nice please

[blazing night]

How much does radiant plume wane down to before resetting in combat?

[stoic pawn]

is deathstalker mark buggy as hell right?

[chrome palm]

im gonna jump

[lilac stag]

It’s not that great, especially if you can’t make the stats work.

[lilac stag]

outlaw tax

[chrome palm]

thats no outlaw ring

[lilac stag]

then you don’t need it

[limpid sage]

Dude I was farming the other one for like 17 dungeons and this happened 3 times

[chrome palm]

if it doesnt drop from this im going to tc and buying it

[idle flint]

[umbral sable]

I Should shadowstrike during dance on 3 target boss, yeah? Trickster

[frail kindle]

yes

[stray relic]

So on lightforged vanguards which would you consider better?

[icy mulch]

You have really good atro uptime on vanguards except when one runs out to do an aura

Which is kinda when you want to have the uptime

[frosty bramble]

necks bait, 0.31% in fights (50m and it does 150k)

[graceful rock]

Rogue being sat on vanguards isn’t really raid buff related, it’s just that we do tank damage in that profile

[lucid jackal]

On vanguard, it's more or less the same

Because of the downtime of them going away sometimes

But also, on vanguard, rogue does no fucking damage

So paladin buff ends up being better

[vale pine]

think its better to do what eleem suggested in the faq

to just switch to non haste weapon oils

so you get some extra haste value in sims

[west tide]

i think on vanguards at least the few pulls i did me and the ret did the same mitigation

he just does way more dam

[nimble mesa]

probably a noob question but: why is atrophic poison better than mind numbing for m+? 3.6% damage reduction from atrophic but 18% slowed attack/casting speed from mind numbing

if attack speed is reduced by 18%, wouldnt the damage be reduced by 18 as well?

as in 18% less attacks so less damage

[tepid trellis]

one is generally speaking only a DR for the tank on melee swings on mobs

and the other is 3.6% to everybody

so it just depends really on what you need in the given key

[hazy breach]

In general id say numbing is better, unelss you are specifically dying from oneshots

Which tends to happen at the highest keys

But yes its not 18% reduced damage

[nimble mesa]

ah right cause aoe's etc, makes sense

[proud nest]

Haven't posted in here before, but I'm having a huge issue with Tricks of the Trade and wanted to know if anyone else is experiencing it or if it's a known bug?
I use the 1hr talent, I've experienced this a few times but it has now completely bricked a +12 and made it incompleteable.

I tricks my tank. If my tank dies and releases, the mobs start running back to where they release to - In Skyreach, on the last platform, they snap back to the tank who just released and start evading. So then we're in this super fun loop of releasing ontop of mobs and just chain dying. We all stayed dead, waited for release, ran back and the mobs are now forever evading. Can't complete the key.

[tepid trellis]

if the tank dies you need to cancel aura it

if pressed release

cuz the tricks is still on him

[proud nest]

How can I do this quickly when he dies and releases?

[tepid trellis]

its quite shit yes

i generally speaking just dont tricks

[proud nest]

The worst I've seen. I may have to stop using tricks, which sucks

I use it often to save healers from aggro being taken while running to gather

[tepid trellis]

just take the other talent

and you can still use tricks when he gathers packs

to start hitting early

[proud nest]

Oh, fair. That's a good call.

[plush olive]

Also gives ur blind some DR

Will be better when that's aoe again

[proud nest]

Thank y'all! Back into it and see if it fixes it 🥲

[tepid trellis]

do you have the meme picture of classes being dogshit out of top 3

i need it

asap

xD

im ragebaiting someone

[hazy breach]

Its in our DMs somewhere

[tribal anchor]

this?

[tepid trellis]

yeh found it

just having the exact convo on disc with someone and i cant help my self to ragebait

[alpine wraith]

fan the flames

[balmy gate]

No new Class balances today ? Weak😂

[pulsar hemlock]

All specs are perfect, move along.

[olive canyon]

did they confirm that?

[balmy gate]

Nah some streamers said it today

[fair phoenix]

waiting too

lets go blizz, buff us

[tacit loom]

Streamers are incorrect

[dusky yacht]

Does anyone happen to know the actual % diff in DPS roughly that puzzle would give over guidon at equal ilvl in m+?

I kinda love guidon but idk the difference

[wise fulcrum]

What’s the consensus about using the ring set?

[hazy breach]

It does about 0.5% dmg on ST, but it doesnt cost anything so might aswell

[spare crypt]

didnt tuning drop way earlier on previous fridays

[alpine wraith]

yea ring combo is lit

you can fix stats elsewhere

[spare crypt]

we might not get anything today?

[quick marlin]

is there even tuning today

[green torrent]

Where in the opener do we use puzzle box? Just before second dance?

[hazy breach]

Eh its very hard to quantify. But after doing some more sims im pretty sure the best way to handle stats is to still have 700 haste+guidon but use mastery enchants+secondary stat pot (used before guidon) for big pulls

Sims better on both ST and aoe. Since with puzzlebox+secondary pot you end up way too hard into diminishing returns

[polar schooner]

where is the idea that tunning is going out, coming from?

[spare crypt]

its the last announced tuning pass

for 7th/8th of april

question is when we get the preview

[polar schooner]

oh thats dope!

[dusky yacht]

Thanks Eleem

[dense mountain]

bro @hazy breach do i have to top gear every raid drop its so annyoing using droptomizer for sub

[hazy breach]

Yep

It is what it is

Complaint to blizzard so they can remove the haste breakpoints

[dense mountain]

i got no gear from mythic cause my % inc is always bad on the drops lmao. makes gearing so annoying T_T

thank god haste is a useful stat now!

[quick marlin]

wait

why is droptimizer bad

[hazy breach]

Its not bad

Its just not very useful as sub with the hastebreakpoint

[half dock]

i have a 276 offhand but I am tempted to make another weapons 285 think I should or just wait

[lean rover]

I'm currently using two acuity ren dorei enchants bc they sim higher is there a reason I should convert to mastery off hand

[obsidian crag]

how much haste should i have if i am not running guidon?

24%?

[hazy breach]

The same as you would with guidon

~700

[hazy breach]

Nop both is good too

[obsidian crag]

800 is too much?

[hazy breach]

A bit ye

[obsidian crag]

im at 799 atm, will recraft haste out of my gear then

[dull fractal]

got 10% of mastery up to 80 but haste went down to 15%

with pvp necklace

[obsidian crag]

me

[half dock]

to much haste - 18-20%

[stuck lance]

I more want the neck cause it let's you move more gear around without worrying about haste as much

[dull fractal]

with pvp neck

does that look better?

[oblique stream]

Are we holding 2nd shadow dance for sectec

it's like a 7s window

[fair phoenix]

How much good is the ring combo for dgs?

[lapis bough]

600k-800k/DG

[dusky yacht]

What’s a dg

[boreal narwhal]

Crafted 285 legs. Fuck pit of saron

[dull fractal]

how much crit should be enough?

just fixed haste lol

[fallow glade]

i got saved from the saron farm by getting legs from alleria

[dusky yacht]

Yo hold up if I already got 4p this is a massive W no? I just save 1 catalyst at all times for set upgrading other pieces?

[lucid jackal]

Yeah u can save however many u want but yeah

Just sitting on charges is smart for mythic clear/vault at the least

[dusky yacht]

You got a point, but I'm unsaved for normal and doing a normal run with guildies (mostly to test my new addons) before next mythic raid

So screw it I'mma go for it

[tribal vortex]

why catalyse it?

the first one has better stats probably

[somber cedar]

@lucid jackal why is sub better? Why did you do this to outlaw?

[lucid jackal]

Huh

Wdym

[slate fable]

so do we hold dance for 2secs left on sectec in blades still or nah? i see that the FAQ and guide were updated but this is still on the guide

[spice matrix]

!guidon

[wicked jolt]

Light Company Guidon (haste on use) Optimization:
When? - Only with the Season 1 4-set bonus and Guidon.
How? - During Shadow Blades, line up your second Shadow Dance with the last 8 seconds of Shadow Blades instead of using them back-to-back.
Why? - This allows you to fit another Secret Technique into Shadow Blades+Shadow Dance. It will not be supercharged but thats ok in this scenario.

[short radish]

wait wtf rogue in for lura?

is this a pity bring?

[hard cape]

yes

[halcyon roost]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[plush roost]

Our raidbuff finally does things !!!

[short radish]

our raidbuff did things last boss

[north garnet]

GUIDON FEELS GOOD

[tribal blade]

just wait for them to get sat when they need to optimize dmg again

[plush roost]

This fight should be very good for sub but we'll see

[tribal blade]

then blizz will be like "see rogue is fine, not benched on 1 boss"

[plush roost]

Im almost 100% sure sub isnt being touched

[north garnet]

do we even expect any buffs before 0.5?

[plush roost]

Assa and outlaw would be winners if noticed

[north garnet]

i feel this too

Tbh sub is good in m+

[lucid jackal]

Rogue was in for beloren, until it wasn't

[short aurora]

Just give me back some cleave

[serene plank]

is sub top rn for m+?

[short aurora]

Nimble shit flurry

[plush roost]

Its just "good enough" for lura

[north garnet]

no but its competitive

[short radish]

yeah sub is "good" in m+

constant aoe damage

[lucid jackal]

Who knows if it will be in a day or two

[plush roost]

It was better before they turbo buffed spriest and made demo good again

Now idk why u play rogue in keys

[serene plank]

I've been doing assa since start of xpac and idk if im trash or if its just not doing good damage

[lucid jackal]

Rogue does no dmg

[hazy breach]

Assa buffed, sub is no more

[serene plank]

when did an assa buff come out

[swift tinsel]

LMFAO

[hazy breach]

4 minutes ago

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/class-tuning-incoming-–-april-7/2285930

[swift tinsel]

specifically not sub changes

fuck this game

hahahaha

[short radish]

is that even that much of a buff?

[plush roost]

#subtlety message

[serene plank]

Buff seems mid

[plush roost]

Called it

Assa key season w

[short radish]

bladeflurry nerfs still

[tribal blade]

what's with this pitty patty rogue tuning

[swift tinsel]

this is stupid

[short radish]

none of this helps in raid though

ecks dee

[spice matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/ship-ocean-sailed-boat-shiphassailed-gif-6074692

[short radish]

"blizzard doesn't tune around m+"

[hazy breach]

Probably around 4% in aoe

[tribal blade]

well sin becomes slightly better on paladins

when it was already the best rogue spec on it

[short radish]

time to hit the dummies then

[tribal blade]

so now it's even more mandatory to play sin on it

[swift tinsel]

my RL might not be benching rogue but I am

[frigid canopy]

huge sub changes boys! we back in the race!

[north garnet]

no more tuning before 0.5

gg

[weak glade]

actually ISNANE

NOTHING before .5

[north garnet]

[tall girder]

its so joever

fim ill see u on feral druid

[alpine wraith]

ok we are donezo

wait

[hazy breach]

thats pvp

[alpine wraith]

that is pvp yea

[swift tinsel]

bait

[alpine wraith]

only mode where rogue is good

[north garnet]

wait wait

THEY NERFED OUTLAW CLEAVE

[lucid jackal]

It cancels out

[hazy breach]

Well yeah you just cut out the part where they got a 4% buff

[north garnet]

well yeah

but isnt cleave the painpoint?

of all 3

[tribal blade]

YES

YES

[serene plank]

Syx over here directing the narative

[tribal blade]

YES

[astral axle]

look at outlaw boss damage

[lucid jackal]

The pain point of all 3 is that they don't do damage

[tepid trellis]

gege's

p7

o7*

[deft moss]

w

t

f

[spice matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/jake-gyllenhaal-kiss-goodbye-gif-27337603

[north garnet]

[deft moss]

are these rogue changes

[strange chasm]

no

[sudden quarry]

wtf am i reading

[honest basin]

no

[deft moss]

shutdown the discord

[sudden quarry]

they want to fool us right?

[honest basin]

assa negligible buff, outlaw effectively got nothing

sub literally got nothing

LMAO

[fading saffron]

These "buffs" are a late april fools joke, right? Surely.

[tribal blade]

they really really really don't want rogue to be good in raid

[spice matrix]

they saw exile #6 on L'ura meters and redacted the sub buffs

[light finch]

Blizzard Dev: "How much do we have to care about other specs before we give DH an BL and CR ?"

[dusky yacht]

My god what is going on this friday night, I'm applying to lvl 10 xenas' with 2534 m+ score and 270 ilvl and these mfs with lower scores and ilvls are declining me xD what a massive cringe moment, at least 20 applications declined

[short radish]

i mean anyone not expecting this was kidding themselves tbh. this is exactly as tradition

Sub is strongest rogue spec for the start of prog, then assi and outlaw gets buffed and sub falls to the wayside again

[serene plank]

Microsoft decisions :3

[short radish]

yeah everybody and their mother wants to do xenas

gl

[serene plank]

Why is everyone wanting Xenas

[alpine wraith]

ring combo

[potent relic]

Rings

[short radish]

rings that are overrated

[open vortex]

Rogue must be in on Lura cause it drops a dagger

[lucid jackal]

Strongest spec for prog, is a 0 of

[short radish]

sub was brought in for 1 boss which is infiintely more t han the other specs

[serene plank]

got myth ring in vault and other ring on a 6, lucky me

[short radish]

therefore sub is the strongest spec

[inland glacier]

With this buff to the outlaw, will the sub still be better?

[short radish]

[raw wadi]

[short radish]

no we're all crafting outlaw weaps

[north garnet]

id play outlaw if it was good at 2 target in some keys lmao

gg

[lethal thorn]

no buff for us 😭

[hazy breach]

Imagine having any form of niche

[alpine wraith]

where is the max clip

raid has many situations

[dusky yacht]

Bro solved the equation, I just do diff keys until I get xenas from rerolls

[alpine wraith]

rogue just sucks at all of them

[serene plank]

So whichever spec we play, its all trash huh

[hazy breach]

Assa has execute. Sub has mediocre aoe pad

[tepid trellis]

3 pictures on a wall and throw a dart

[spice matrix]

I posted it in here yesterday

[gilded ferry]

i wanna congratulate @lucid jackal , looks like your tweets worked

[brisk onyx]

[hazy breach]

But also like, a tuning pass isnt gonna give us any niches back

[strange harness]

so in raid what are we playing xd

[dusky yacht]

Bro they need to randomise loot from keys so this balances out, xenas is a li'l loco rn, a party leader told me 50 dps applied in like a second

[raw wadi]

rogue raid buff when? 🙂

[fading saffron]

is rogue as a class getting the WoD Demo warlock treatment?

[lethal thorn]

well my guildy complain that i do to much dps in key and always top the meter xd

[gilded ferry]

is there any lead dev in rogue/

the last one quit right?

[swift tinsel]

who knows what they're doing

[tepid trellis]

nope he still works at blizzard

[hazy breach]

Sub is pretty good at constant big aoe

Thats about it

[tepid trellis]

last i heard

[gilded ferry]

was it still scarizard

or no

[tepid trellis]

no

[swift tinsel]

no

[hazy breach]

But thats not a very common scenario in raids

[forest moss]

"works"

[tepid trellis]

scarizard was an item designer not a class dev

[lethal thorn]

at least we are in the raid comp xd

[gilded ferry]

i dont remember the name of the guy, i know he was here and interacted a bit

[raw wadi]

didnt he left after rogue rework mid awakening season in df?

[short radish]

reminder to not get mad at what's probably our singular dev who acutally cares about the class

[atomic bobcat]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lucid jackal]

Welll

[strange chasm]

i think these buffs legit solve nothing

[frigid canopy]

just bring back old nimble for sub, and ill be happy again

[swift tinsel]

they don't

its just piss words

[ionic flint]

i dont think the buffs for the other specs will help rogues as a whole get in a raid still

[twin quartz]

They don’t do much

[swift tinsel]

they do literally nothing meaningful

[hazy breach]

Theyre not intended to do that either

[ionic flint]

(cope) i think after RWF they will do something

[hazy breach]

Blizzard almost never disrupts the general class balance with their tuning

[fair phoenix]

ok so no sub?

[lethal thorn]

they just need to buff us by 6 7 % and zoomer will group us

[hazy breach]

Its always just shrinking the gap inbetween the best and the worst

[arctic heart]

we dead?

[swift tinsel]

ye

[arctic heart]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-rip-sad-sponge-bob-stephen-hillenburg-crying-sponge-bob-squidward-gif-12966776

[serene plank]

I've got an 80 boost, which class is the best

[swift tinsel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923898501529600/1342596269193039943/9l2o5h.gif

[fading saffron]

rogue

[arctic heart]

mage

[split shore]

MM hunter

[gilded ferry]

warlocks are never out of fashion

[serene plank]

I dont like waiting for casts, whats next gents

rogue has been 95% of what ive played since im started wow im an old dog dont want tricks that are too new

[soft oriole]

Honestly ret kinda slaps

Boost pala

[short radish]

mage/warlock

[short aurora]

Enhancer might be a jam

[short radish]

ret paladin is basically easy outlaw rogue gameplay

[gilded ferry]

you asked for a buff, they did, should have asked for them to delete boomies

[ivory orchid]

so 4% we are the best now almost mandatory

[void ocean]

wait

where tf is sub rogue

[light finch]

closed the discord

[gilded nebula]

https://tenor.com/fN6fNO8DBIM.gif

[dusky yacht]

I'm right here mommy uwu

[void ocean]

ARE U SHITTIN ME

[fair phoenix]

ok, time to outlaw so?

[void ocean]

good thing frost got another buff like 2 weeks in a row

[brisk onyx]

Their meticulous approach to Rogue, like that of a high-level mathematician, was absolutely hilarious

[void ocean]

was about to respec to unholy

[light finch]

outlaw is always simbait

[void ocean]

ppl in charge of rogues are imbecils

its official

like crayon eaters

[lucid jackal]

LOLOL

[burnt loom]

they cant buff subtlety coz everyone plays it. not underperforming on their charts

[gilded nebula]

ill let the smart people figure out the exact number changes but mainly just feels like we have 3 kind of even specs and none are particularly good for prog

[short radish]

numbers are up for assi at least

but yeah

nothing really changed

[tepid trellis]

fuck all changes

Assa got slightly better at paladins

and thats it

rogue still niche-less and mediocre dmg

[short radish]

maybe its enough to be brought to paladins

[swift tinsel]

[tepid trellis]

compared to the actual good specs

when none of those got nerfed

hard pass

[void ocean]

so fdk gets 2 buffs in a row and sub gets none

[marble path]

now you can do half as much as an mm hunter!

[soft oriole]

I can still just play sub and get benched on paladins right

I can be happy

[ionic flint]

thats my plan

[teal coral]

where's the sub pin

[hushed roost]

bro..

[tepid trellis]

......

[teal coral]

too soon?

[tepid trellis]

ive got 0 words

[teal coral]

that sounds like 3 words and a contraction

[tepid trellis]

that wouldnt get me in trouble so im keeping to myself

[thin sinew]

I'll take the bullet

[tepid trellis]

atleast i can somewhat take consolidation in reading outlaw crashout

[teal coral]

anyways I'm gonna go record video, revert haste talents, fuck stance swapping macro cringe

stealthi x eleem r34 smut when

[tepid trellis]

give rogue back their niche's

dont forget that

also wtf

xD

raichu raccoon smut

[thin sinew]

the good old. i'm not angry i'm just disappointed

[teal coral]

https://tenor.com/view/thanos-i'll-do-it-myself-fine-i'll-do-it-myself-gif-8520717464660444716

[tepid trellis]

not even dissapointed tbh ive got 0 words like im completely lost

[swift tinsel]

yeah I'm just glad I have alts that are fun

[tepid trellis]

i dont understand it one bit

[frail kindle]

Yep I’m still dooming

Rogue in its worst state since castle nathria

[hushed roost]

i treat myself to the fotm tank every season to alt

[thin sinew]

so push for a 1400 haste build and see if we can fish for a bug. our last hope

[tepid trellis]

like sure dont buff sub alright

[swift tinsel]

I'm locked out of raid loot at this point in the season if I switch raid main

[tepid trellis]

but like

[frail kindle]

Gonna switch to playing bear I think

[swift tinsel]

so I'm stuck on this shit ass class

[tepid trellis]

CAN WE FCKING BUGFIX MM HUNTER ALREADY

[ionic flint]

they need to give rogues a better raid buff so they are required so atleast 1 rogue per guild can play

[swift tinsel]

nah dude too much work

[tepid trellis]

so they dont do 40% more cleave than any other class in the fucking game

[swift tinsel]

its only been egregious for

[frail kindle]

Nah

[swift tinsel]

4 weeks now?

[tepid trellis]

like cmon

[hushed roost]

maybe next expax we'll get a raid buff

[swift tinsel]

3?

[light finch]

Blizzard: "Sorry can't fix, now part of the class design"

[frail kindle]

Mm gets to gain over 100% damage when a second target is nearby

[short aurora]

You dont want other to have fun or what

[frail kindle]

It’s only fair

[short radish]

yes

fuck other classes

why do they get to have fun and we don't

[fierce wigeon]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tepid trellis]

when tuning is that widlly different

no i dont

[dusky yacht]

Watching others have fun while you're suffering reminds me of something lmao

[tepid trellis]

they can go fuck right off

[swift tinsel]

nah dude its chill to stack 4 of the same spec

super chill

[tepid trellis]

bring them in line with everything else

[dire ravine]

Who is the dev that does the rogue tuning?

[swift tinsel]

and bring as few melee as possible

[marble path]

Netenyahu

[short aurora]

Not on this discord obviously

[serene plank]

dude what, is he really?

[marble path]

Been known.

[dusky yacht]

https://giphy.com/gifs/editingandlayout-NEvPzZ8bd1V4Y

[serene plank]

Big Yayu keeping our dps down 🙁

[lyric patrol]

I just got mythic guidon dont tell me i gotta switch to ass

[uncut sluice]

bring back shuriken combo

[tepid trellis]

bro they suck just as much

they got fuck all

[frail kindle]

Every spec is garbage lol

[tepid trellis]

they buffed shit that does 0 dmg on the spec

[soft oriole]

It’s a sub until raid is over then quit angle

[marble path]

Nooo I gotta play dookie instead of diarrhea 😭😭😭

[serene plank]

At least we all get to suffer together

[tepid trellis]

has to be some AI tuning shit idfk

[hazy breach]

...it could make Subtlety’s rotational gameplay feel much more rigid than it should for a spec that is intended to give players flexibility and control over its cooldown-driven damage windows. Subtlety’s Midnight updates are focused on giving cooldowns and effects a clear purpose while also reducing the number of conditional effects that need to be tracked. This will better reward intuitive decisions and produce more reliable damage output and satisfying rotational gameplay.

[swift zinc]

can some send a link pls for class tuning i cant find it :/

[hazy breach]

Remember this?

[lyric patrol]

Fair point we all suck still

[tepid trellis]

me when i blatantly lie

[dusky yacht]

What does intuitive decisions even mean in a game

[swift tinsel]

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[dusky yacht]

Oh I just felt like it's such a good idea to hit stuff rn

[light finch]

https://tenor.com/view/pinocchio-pinocchio-nose-gif-27046138

[tepid trellis]

the fact that MM hunter Devourer DH and Aug evoker gets to do what they are doing in raid while most of melee is just watching from the sidelines

is fcking wild to me

[hazy breach]

Stuff like "oh the apex talent makes my finisher do more damage, i should probably have it up for my biggest finisher secret technique"

[swift tinsel]

blizz is just lost clueless and flailing

[tepid trellis]

last time a rogue spec did this week 1-2 of a tier

what happened back then?

[dusky yacht]

Very intuitive, I felt that

[tepid trellis]

nerfs 3 weeks in a row

[lyric patrol]

Bring 4 hunters no problem for blizz....whens the last time you saw more than 2 rogues 😆

[light finch]

SS into BP into SS into BP into SS into BP into SS into BP

[tepid trellis]

like fuck off

[hazy breach]

Like you read the talents/spells and you can pretty easily figure out what to do

[ionic flint]

when is the last time you saw one rogue

[arctic scroll]

BUT THEN ITS BUGGED XDDDDD

[hazy breach]

When you read Deepening Shadows, its not immediately obvious that it makes you want specific haste breakpoints and require macros

[lyric patrol]

Had 2 in amidrassil when we were basically goated for smolderon

[alpine wraith]

surely singular focus makes me cleave with all my abilities

and ther effects

onto my main target

[hazy breach]

But when you read something like Death perception, its pretty clear that it wants you to use finishers during cooldowns

Which is what the spec is about

[soft oriole]

What’s the next round of buffs, how long do I have to doom before I start to cope again

[vagrant sinew]

vault is an all timer, nerfed on hc week with no tier and then like 5 specs got buffed above what assa was

[tepid trellis]

amirdrassil

Assa

boosted by PI and aug hooks

[swift zinc]

where do you see the buffs and nerfs guys ?

[tepid trellis]

into getting nuked

from orbit

[vagrant sinew]

hopeful played assa on fyrakk must have been broken!

[lyric patrol]

That was the best rogue tier in a while to be fair....basically the good old days at this point

[tepid trellis]

well not really

[marble path]

blizzard mossad ragebait

[soft oriole]

Luckily crimson vial is getting buffed in .0.5 so that’s nice

[tepid trellis]

Rogue was good in Nerubar palace too

and very fcking strong in Manaforge

[still gazelle]

How's the timewalking trinket?

Is it OP busted?

[hazy breach]

nop

[frail kindle]

Take me back to tww s3….

[lyric patrol]

Tru ill take manaforge rogue over the shit we got

[thin sinew]

minus the coldblood bug

[lyric patrol]

Pretty solid tier

[dusky yacht]

Maybe we should get a self healing spec and just soak shit

[vale osprey]

Just read these rogue changes - crazy times

[stuck tulip]

so we going assa spec now or nah

[lucid jackal]

Rogue has been very good for a long time

[sudden quarry]

surely we get buffs after world first right?

[lucid jackal]

I get shit sucks now but it's important to be not too dramatic

[thin sinew]

won't make a different we're still shit as a class lol

[dry surge]

Mm hunter

[stuck tulip]

true

[dusky yacht]

I mean that's true though

At the same time I get it that people are losing their shit

[arctic scroll]

The up is 0.8% in mono and 3% in aoe at best, its still garbonzo

[stuck tulip]

rogue still stuck in queue simulator then, gg

[thin sinew]

checks tweet history 👀

[light finch]

sure but maybe closing the discord for just 5 minutes would help

[swift zinc]

makes no sense bc we dont have buffs or something an we are low dps agains other classes

[stuck tulip]

yeah shit sucks

[lucid jackal]

Nothing I've tweeted is dramatic

[swift zinc]

got 3150 rating and dont getting 16 keys bc we are shit xD

sucks ass

[stuck tulip]

at 3150 u dont get invited to 15s brother

[swift zinc]

i did

[stuck tulip]

its rare

[sweet moss]

what’s changing in 0.5

[stuck tulip]

u get aoe blind

[patent lichen]

That's it, shut the discord down

[soft oriole]

Crimson vial resets on killing blow too

[sweet moss]

kinda pog

make crimson not on gcd

ong

[dry surge]

Don't say that out loud they'll send a hit squad out for you

[sweet moss]

😂😂

[swift zinc]

maybe one day we getting good

[sweet moss]

why