subtlety

[stuck arrow]

You saying sub is goated on midnight falls?

[vale pine]

oh oops, let me quick fix (fixed)

[keen dome]

@lilac stag I did a day 2 AotC

[fleet acorn]

y like on double dragons - when orbs spawn i dont have blades rdy never

[dawn cargo]

Which are you guys having the most fun with? I've always liked outlaw and I just switched to sub and it feels decent. I haven't tried out assassination yet.

[near echo]

Feel the same way I love outlaw but sub seems a bit better before the changes happened idk about now and assasin just feels horrible to play for me

[wispy pebble]

i loved sub until the nerf and now it pisses me off a bit in dungeons with alternating between shuriken storm and shadowstrike again. But im just pissed because my muscle memory keeps fucking me over

[dull fractal]

i assume we are crafting just mastery/haste for our dagger and belt right?

[pulsar cipher]

Assassination is enjoyable but currently mobs die to fast and all its aoe damage is tied to cooldowns, so it’s rough

[shrewd lantern]

second crafted slot kind of doesnt matter

[wispy pebble]

i feel like shit dies to fast for sub as well. I can barely double dance with SB in packs. M+ desperately needed

[dull fractal]

yeah but for stats just those

[pulsar cipher]

I think the specs will be a lot more playable in M+ for sure

I’m just getting clowned in M0 on Mut spec against classes with more forgiving cooldowns

[tepid trellis]

m0 are always a meme

[fleet acorn]

are guys sennding blades on pull (double dragons)? if yes i doont have blades for orbs

[wispy pebble]

im getting clowned on because my tanks keep chain pulling but only 3 mobs at the same time

[vale pine]

anything not vers is fine

[vale pine]

[shrewd lantern]

its m0

[fair monolith]

THE HECK is ds

[shrewd lantern]

whoever can blow their load in 10s wins

i.e not sin

[fair monolith]

oh

[wispy pebble]

Deathstalker

[fair monolith]

ya i figured it out

[wispy pebble]

lmao

[fair monolith]

i was just testing what i liked more

but everyone trickster

[fleet acorn]

do we not play firrst dance anymore?

[shrewd lantern]

sub feels fine on alleria

[wispy pebble]

5 seconds. Cant do more

[full spade]

has there been any general guidance on puzzle box? guess you just treat it as a 3m?

[shrewd lantern]

just pray your group lets you pad more little shits

[wispy pebble]

yea disenchant that pos cast time trinket

[full spade]

LOL

It feels weird to SS>CAST PUZZLE BOX>BLADES+DANCE+SEC+POT

[frosty axle]

can precast vanish into opener

[full spade]

if your tank trolls you while you cast puzzy b you just are sad

[digital hornet]

do you gotta play around dance macab anymore or no

[muted girder]

2 weeks from now we all getting myth track puzzle boxes in vault lul.

[full spade]

then youre more sad when you waddle up to boss or Step it

[wispy pebble]

Thats how im using it as well. Its like "boom i hit you in the face now wait 2 seconds while i solve my rubix cube"

[frosty axle]

is it right to not hold for it after first use

been holding everytime for its cd

[shrewd lantern]

you just pretend its a 3min trinket

[hazy breach]

Pretend its got a 3 min cd

[narrow tartan]

New to sub, do I just sent the first 2 shadow dances and then have one shadow dance for every Shadow technique?

[shrewd lantern]

and disenchant once you get a guidon

[frosty axle]

so blades on cd always

[shrewd lantern]

i got that meme delve trinket today

[frosty axle]

playing around add spawns

[shrewd lantern]

that increases all your secondaries but also horrifies you for 5s if you dont kill something

[frosty axle]

the one that fears you?

[shrewd lantern]

[frosty axle]

yea was my map item

[wispy pebble]

ouch

[frosty axle]

cloak doesnt work on itttt

[shrewd lantern]

i've yet to get my map yet

[frosty axle]

trash trinket

[stuck arrow]

You laugh but I bet someone says the top dragons parse with one of those.

[frosty axle]

do the nightmare preys

[shrewd lantern]

yeah its probably dispellable

[stuck arrow]

Giga pad

[shrewd lantern]

unironically they made a trinket more annoying

[frosty axle]

was thinking warriors could just remove it

[shrewd lantern]

than the s1 jump or you get stunned trinket

[upbeat moss]

-.- well thats loot?!

[stuck arrow]

Run it with a pvp trinket. 👀

[shrewd lantern]

i think horrify is different from fear

spriest horrify is usually on stun dr

idk

[shrewd lantern]

good thing you can mog swords now

[stuck arrow]

I might test that actually. 20s with big crit, haste, mastery, and vers is probably strong.

[night sparrow]

Do we still play with Transmitter ?

COLLEKT O STEND E CIRCOLE

[upbeat moss]

that loot is... 😄 idk

[shrewd lantern]

isnt puzzle box more stat

in total

[stuck arrow]

I didn't think so, but I might be wrong. Can check later.

[frosty axle]

it over doubled my mastery

[stuck arrow]

But I guess if you run a PVP trinket, it'd have to be giga strong. 😂

[dawn heron]

guys, what was the needed haste amount not in percent ?

[shrewd lantern]

go undead

[stuck arrow]

Ayyy there you go

[shrewd lantern]

unironically it probably works

[steel horizon]

#subtlety-faq

[still jacinth]

Anyone know if its possible to change ancient arts proc animation color to something brighter than the black that blends with litterally everything on my screen?

[steel horizon]

No but its trackable in the cdm now so you can put glows and other stuff on the icon if you use arcui or any other cdm addon

[zinc wagon]

the 3 paladins boss, when they are two together we do shadowstrike smokebomb and when they are all three we do shurikan smoke bomb?

is this correct?

• coup ofc

[fleet acorn]

why does this macro not work???
#showtooltip Shadow Blades

/use Fleeting Light's Potential
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Blood Fury(Racial)
/use Secret Technique

[potent frigate]

why is my higher ilvl dagger simming as better dps in off hand than in main hand?

[hazy breach]

Guessing you didnt select them both for both slots

[charred thunder]

Are we still feeling that with the black powder nerfs we're switching to it on 2+ targets?

[rare thicket]

!UI

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[potent frigate]

oh, maybe

[patent iris]

you need /cast for secret tech

[spare bobcat]

double press it for sectec

[spare bobcat]

oh this might fix it tbh........ nvm i have it on cast not use

[dawn cargo]

anyone able to make my Farstrider's Mercy at max quality? I have all mats.

[shrewd lantern]

its server only

[fleet acorn]

nah my dps pot doesnt workk

[shrewd lantern]

unless you put up a guild order

[fleet acorn]

it never uses my dps pot

[keen dome]

You'll need to ask in your servers trade chat 🙂

[lilac stag]

/2

[shrewd lantern]

mine is /3

idk why /2 is "WTS RAIDS"

that or my tradechat is politics chat

deranged mfs

[fleet acorn]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[keen dome]

just drop a real home truth in it

[south kernel]

YO scath u still got those haste breakpoints on you? of like how many extra gcds u get per how much haste

[keen dome]

"Are poptarts a form of ravioli?" or "Is a hotdog a form of pizza?"

[shrewd lantern]

isnt it is a hotdog a sandwich

[keen dome]

That's the question

[sick dagger]

Holy shit sub is in the mud on paladin boss

[astral axle]

below the mud

[shrewd lantern]

man i would hate to have 2 other specs

[hazy breach]

rouge*

[shrewd lantern]

*melee

[keen dome]

purple

[shrewd lantern]

I got to scroll down to see the non casters

[hazy breach]

I mean arms is doing almost MM levels

[sick dagger]

BLIZZARD FIX MY SPEC PLSSSS

[stuck arrow]

I mean the other two in the mud with us. Lol.

[raw ridge]

does someone custom weights for Pawn?

[shrewd lantern]

we're above ele

[sick dagger]

Its so fucking dark

[hazy breach]

No, and i'd recommend you just sim your stuff with topgear on raidbots instead

[sick dagger]

There is no light at the end of the tunnel🥀

[sweet creek]

Are we swapping between shuriken storm and shadow strike because of the Deathstalker bug?

[solemn mauve]

guys i jut fiz the rogue

just *

[keen dome]

i'm gonna make a raid of all arms warriors. And then put the dps buff just out of reach

[wispy pebble]

no because strike is better at 3 or less targets. Alternate was wrong word

[sweet creek]

Oh shit we use SS on three targets now? Thanks for the tip

[night sparrow]

tbf tuning inc next week (or we simply fucked till RWF is over) so it's not really worth to optimize and muscle memory things

[dire ravine]

#showtooltip
/Cast Shadow Blades
/use Light's Potential
/use 13

this macro still isnt working?

[stuck arrow]

Did you buy cheap potions?

[dire ravine]

its popping my trinket, and blades- but not the pot

and yes hehe

i was thinking that too?

[sick dagger]

Better to use item id

[stuck arrow]

Since multiple grades have and name - the name can only find one item ID so blizz defaults to the better grade

[spare bobcat]

we powder at 3 targets and shuriken at 4 now right? post tuning

[stuck arrow]

You need to use the item ID. It's trying to use a gold pot and sees you don't have one so skips.

[hazy breach]

Unless you have potent powder specced, in which case its still 2

[hollow locust]

is 630 haste before oils good or should i try squeeze a bit more?

[spare bobcat]

yea correct

roger ty

got confused in FAQ section with that, cus it says you can even use it on 2 targets with potent powder

so i thought it was either or, evis or powder

[keen steppe]

is it worth to upgrade weapon in 276 ?

or better to waitr for next week

[limber folio]

nah just hold for myth

[keen steppe]

ty

[fleet acorn]

somehow this cannot be macroed

[limber folio]

yea

i realized

[wicked urchin]

700 haste achieved

[fleet acorn]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[rain stratus]

Yes it can

[fleet acorn]

how? im spamming it right now

doesnt work

[west tide]

does antyoen know if the increased proc chance with doin shadow damage on the super rare neck is simmin proper

[rain stratus]

Worked fine for me when we raided earlier

[fleet acorn]

yes with rank 1

[west tide]

cause everyone and their mama sims way higher with that neck

[sick dagger]

Use id

[fleet acorn]

gotta check that quick

[sick dagger]

/use item:id 245898

[tepid trellis]

good thing they nerfed sub's AoE dmg we would be too good on this fight

[dry flame]

Tank managed to roll both trinkets for himself and insta left 😭

[tepid trellis]

lesson of the day for blizzard dont nerf shit until you actually see the performance

of specs in different contents

[sick dagger]

Blizz looked att m0 to determine sub needs aoe nerf

🥀🥀🥀

[stuck arrow]

Brought in line with the bottom of the table.

[fiery fog]

salhadaar timings are weird af man

[tepid trellis]

sub wasent even good if you played with the actual top specs

[fleet acorn]

i parsed a 0 i died to frontal no dispel

on salha

[plucky pier]

At least they saw they made a mistake and insta fixed their changes like they did for UH DK, right?

[tepid trellis]

bro

they nerfed UDK from the place

[lilac stag]

Lesson of the day for this discord. Don’t play rogue.

[fleet acorn]

ofc they kill it after xd

[tepid trellis]

they JUST brought them back to

they are actually just tuning in circles

just throwing shit at a dartboard

[sick dagger]

Guys aura buffs inc on reset

[frail kindle]

i mean at least they admitted they messed up and fixed it

[chrome palm]

they nerfed gaze so hard

[sick dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/copium-meme-pepe-frog-gif-26117735

[chrome palm]

its the same as the renown trinket

[lilac stag]

udk gonna be tippy top by next week

[long sun]

hello why is my sim not telling me to equip more haste

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7ExZKEQLa3SzKRHBtXBBy7

[still gazelle]

In raid I can get 2 sectec during sblades during lust. Outside of raid I can't currently. Is this normal?

No 4pc

[shrewd lantern]

renown trinket kinda crazy tbh

like 170 crit on like 80% uptime

[jaunty heath]

yeah the renown trinket make me not loot the dreamdrift trinket 😄

[tepid trellis]

yes you need 4set

[stuck arrow]

One of us blew up an M0 pack too hard too many times before a devs CDs could do anything. 💤

[sick dagger]

Question about this, do u want to super charge the second sectec in sb?

[tepid trellis]

yet frost mage does the same

mm hunter does the same

[jagged hamlet]

If im at 3 knowledge points this week and did singularity and the quest in the camp can i get to 4?

[chrome palm]

do not spend your DKP on gaze fellas

[jaunty heath]

are we playing around 4p actually? do we delay second dance or whats up with that? i just got 2p

[chrome palm]

my 2 target sim is lower than our unholy's 1 target sim

[tepid trellis]

no

well yeh cuz your only 2 target dmg

is sectech and nimble

so

its does fuck all

[chrome palm]

i clear him at 3 targets tho if hes only hitting 1

[jaunty heath]

thats not bad

[fleet acorn]

Love it

[tepid trellis]

blizzard tuning team just need to wake the fuck up

[fleet acorn]

played until 1st bbeam then afk

[jaunty heath]

i have R1 log at normal, is it cool?

[lilac stag]

They’re gonna buff DS and not fix it.

[chrome palm]

grok is going insane man

[jaunty heath]

stealthi arent you palying DH anyway?:D

[glass rock]

cant i add embellishment during recraft when i forgot the first time?

[tepid trellis]

nop

[jaunty heath]

make sense 😄

[tepid trellis]

yes

[sick dagger]

One thing they atleast could do is fix the premedition bug

[tepid trellis]

i was the third Devourer DH

[sick dagger]

Holy thats annoying

[tepid trellis]

and we are only planning on 2

so im on rogue

[lilac stag]

Kneecap someone

[chrome palm]

mm bug: untouchable god on 2 target
sub bug: unplayable hero talent

[jaunty heath]

they wont fix shit on rogue

there no way they have time for it

[hazy breach]

They managed to buff all the clones with their buff

THats all we get

[jaunty heath]

they will be like "rogue bugs? cute"

[south kernel]

am i crazy or can u overstack supercharger?

or is this just a visual bug

[chrome palm]

you usually use eviscerate in dance

[sick dagger]

Can only stack up two I think pre pull though

[lilac stag]

They go down to 2 when encounters start

[civic sapphire]

share i pls

[dusty totem]

So once you get 4 piece on one char you can just farm as many catalyst charges as you want on alts?

[south kernel]

i guess it doesnt go down on dummies then

[fleet acorn]

hmm?

[civic sapphire]

share it*

[fleet acorn]

what my link?

[sick dagger]

I got 4p yesterday on my main rogue and I havent seen 1 cata charge drop

[zenith hollow]

If we have enough haste when do we send the 2nd sectech in dance during blades? I've been getting it on the 3rd gcd outside of supercharger

[civic sapphire]

yep

[fleet acorn]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/id/103588589?difficulty=4

[plucky turtle]

gotr a question about this trinket is a sim bait or something the souls it spawns are very hard to see and the uptime doesnt seem that good but its siming better then most of my other trinkets.

[fleet acorn]

sim bait dont use it

[plucky turtle]

Figured thanks!

[fleet acorn]

only prob worth in m+

[obtuse latch]

my philosophy is I am too dumb to do a trinket mini game, so the BiS is whatever gives me more dam without having to solve a rubix cube mid fight

[fleet acorn]

sits here in my bag

[spare bobcat]

fucking heard

i hate on use trinkets

[sick dagger]

Is it intentional that the 4p achievement is account wide, so alts can start getting extra cata charges btw?

[spare bobcat]

gimme back my arcanocrystal

[fleet acorn]

can we get back to my potion topic its not working item id too 😄

send me everything i should test haha

[sick dagger]

I could be item:ID ******

[marble sail]

Yes and no, its a feature they havent said anything about

[sick dagger]

thats my bad for sending item:id

[fleet acorn]

ahh now it works haha

great job mate thx

[plucky turtle]

Yea doing the raid atm and the souls are so annoying to find with all the other melee + spell effects XD rather not deal with a find X thing trinket for a small reward

[sick dagger]

Gotchu. A tip is to add every rank of pots to that macro.
So like:
/use item:ID 245898
/use item:ID 241308
Etc etc

[fleet acorn]

yep

[cursive hamlet]

is there anything im not taking into consideration, or sending 2 sparks for offset with embelish is the way?

[fleet acorn]

yea wanna do that now is it only the fleeting

[jade urchin]

is the 680ish haste bait? im 4set 540 haste and it wants me to take mastery flask over haste

[fleet acorn]

these 2 ids?

[jade urchin]

or is it just hard to sim the gain

[sick dagger]

The second is for regulsr r2 pot

[hazy breach]

The sim, by virtue of being a robot and not playing on a server, needs a little bit less haste

[fleet acorn]

kk nice thx

[sick dagger]

If u want r1 fleeting, change the 8 to a 7

At the end on item id

[wanton mantle]

Ive been gone all week hows sub performing in raid? Feel good?

[sick dagger]

Same for the regular

[jade urchin]

so its mostly for fuckups to make sure second sectech goes into 4set blades?

[fleet acorn]

yea i will put in both fleeting never know if we cheap out on progress xd

[runic sequoia]

my sim puts me at 538 haste do i blindly follow the sim as i usually do or should i listen to the 650-700 number

[hazy breach]

So we recommend a little bit more haste than what the robot wants to account for minor delays anywhere which inevitably happens

[sick dagger]

Thats one of the bosses

[jade urchin]

"fuckups"

[supple barn]

So if I got shoulders same ilvl, one pair has crit/mastery, one has haste mastery, but im not haste cap yet. still sim tells me to take crit over haste?

[jaunty heath]

post all bosses

[stuck arrow]

I mean to be fair that's vanguards. But it's not much better throughout the entire raid.

[supple barn]

oh someone else asking same question lol

[jade urchin]

makes sense it felt incosistent to get it in opener

[fleet acorn]

anyone here uses bcdm ? and knows how i add the dps pot to the buffs?

[jade urchin]

will just haste flask next raid then if i dont fix it

[stuck arrow]

You might do more damage with the other stats in that range.

Sims get fucky with haste breakpoints.

[fleet crow]

what do craft for items guys ?

[jaunty heath]

is this buff waiting room now

[jaunty heath]

how we are under other specs 😄

kek

did not see it comming

[stuck arrow]

The raid timers kinda rough for sub TBH.

[steel zinc]

If anyone ever says rogue is fine after doing splits you wont play any rogue spec in the race

thats my call

[hazy breach]

Tier set cope activated

[steel zinc]

its insane how bad rogue tuning is

even with tier your just dumbster dps and bench on paladin boss

[sick dagger]

Over pruned specs

And low dmg

[steel zinc]

ya

[sick dagger]

Lovely

[hazy breach]

Well yeah paladins is gg

[steel zinc]

yeah but gg even outlaw is dogshit

like you wont play rogue its utterly poorly tuned

[jade urchin]

outlaw not being way above this tier is so fascinating

[steel zinc]

I feel depressed and I got all the loot in splits

[jade urchin]

it feels made for outlaw profile

[steel zinc]

outlaw not being top on paladin boss is just so poorly tuned

[dry flame]

I remember back b4 Nathria released, Assa got 15-20% flat dmg buff and was still by far the worst spec of all classes.

Basically, new expansion, same story.

[jade urchin]

sub rogue ending same damage on single target as on paladin boss is also quite something

[steel zinc]

yeah but its really bad you wont play rogue this tier really in any serious prog. No 3% DR can save you if a tank can out dps you in st

[sick dagger]

They have to buff next reset

[steel zinc]

if not its over full doom close the discord

[radiant swift]

i was wondering since we can proc apex for a finisher with either sstrom or sstrike - why are we doing it with sstrike regardless of target count?

[stuck arrow]

Unironically I actually think Sub maybe the best rogue spec on paladins - subs better shield burst means you can focus less damage on shield and do more raid DPS because no one else target swaps.

Because none of the three actually have high through put.

[steel zinc]

No joke this is pure doom imagen getting trinket tier everything and still feeling utter shit playing any rogue spec

[frail kindle]

ya actually could unironically be sub for mythic paladins if the shield matters cuz ur the only spec that can do good damage to it

[hazy breach]

I mean even if the shield actually matters i dont think its good

[frail kindle]

definitely not good at all xd

[jade urchin]

paladins feel gg regardless of rogue spec

all 3 do so poor

[hazy breach]

But yeah maybe youre right, but thats because all rogue specs suck on that boss

[frail kindle]

thats honestly so sad

[swift tinsel]

paladin's 95th percentile looks like prepatch tuning lmao

[steel zinc]

yes all 3 suck right now no joke

[frail kindle]

like assa and outlaw low target cleave shouldnt be that bad

[tepid trellis]

good thing they nerfed sub AoE tho!

[steel zinc]

yeah wtf is wrong

any rogue spec doesnt get like 20% buff we are done

you wont play it

[supple barn]

its a reroll angle?

[frail kindle]

nah

[steel zinc]

ill just chill on bench

[frail kindle]

we get buffs gg

[hazy breach]

Its definitely not that bad outside of paladins

[brave raptor]

Have any of you tried to do the Delve boss as sub yet ?

[frail kindle]

you need rogue for the buff anyway so always at least one

[tepid trellis]

you will still see Rogue on RWF

[sick dagger]

Bring back evis and shadowtrike to nimble flurry = gg

[thin sinew]

IT's ok guys
we have our raid buff 💀

[steel zinc]

its still bad outside of paladins

[hazy breach]

Its fine

[steel zinc]

you have 1 semi viable spec

[frail kindle]

nah

[steel zinc]

and with viable I mean just get another guardian druid in for better dps

[frail kindle]

overall warcraft logs statistics dont really tell the whole story

[stuck arrow]

And I agree - it's not good. The shield also not that hard or particularly important. See what it looks like in mythic I guess.

[jade urchin]

i think sub is actually fine

just needs a bit better cleave

[supple barn]

making it sound like one spot for a rogue is an easy spot to find and M+ will we get groups lol

[frail kindle]

bro rogue is not that bad

unless ur playing with actually good players you can still top lmao

[sick dagger]

This doesnt prove anything though. If everyone are good players

What then

[steel zinc]

thats with any spec still insane

[supple barn]

tried to join a resetro druids m0 yesterday and they whispered me lol goodluck finding groups as a rogue this season

resto*

[steel zinc]

yeah its over

[supple barn]

a fucking m0 group LOL

[steel zinc]

if no tuning is coming close the discord no meme

[small vortex]

gatekeeping m0s! yikes!

[jade urchin]

i mean we have 3 resets with weekly tuning

surely we dont have to doom completely

[sick dagger]

Copium

[shy scarab]

Inb4 they decide that 3% DR is useless

And bench rogue completely😆

[frail kindle]

whats the point of dooming lol

[hazy breach]

Actually is 3.6%

[shy scarab]

https://tenor.com/view/hump-gif-18311140

[dry flame]

I am just riding on the fact I'm 250 atm, and once the season starts I just retire and play other games 🥲

[steel zinc]

the louder you doom the more attention it gets and you more likely to get buffs

thats just sadly a fact

[frail kindle]

thats not true for rogue

in the slightest

[shy scarab]

True snd REAL

[supple barn]

ye im 245

[frail kindle]

like if we were mages or dks i would agree

[sick dagger]

Maybe we get pala treatmenr

[frail kindle]

but rogues bitch and nothing happens LMAO

[sick dagger]

If the class discord complains enough, maybe some good will come

[shy scarab]

Devs dont play rogue

[thin sinew]

all 10 of us

[spare bobcat]

nobody plays rogue

[shy scarab]

Yapp

We should all just quit rogueing

[spare bobcat]

never

one trick now and forever

[shy scarab]

Simp

[spare bobcat]

yes i am

[dry flame]

Someone needs to be the poor statistic

[shy scarab]

Got ele shamans for that

😆😆😆😆

[dry flame]

Arms warr

But we dominate as a class

[shy scarab]

They are above rogues tho

In statistic

https://tenor.com/view/prempdr-fc-mobile-fifa-gif-16778760554072111618

[dry flame]

The day we get into pugs without a sacrifice ritual is when we get other roles as specs

[gilded wadi]

why playing on deathstalker feels so bad even on salhadaar and vorasius...

[distant sage]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1476887002019270761/Midnight_s1_fixed.png

[tulip light]

if i got heroic belt + wrist do i just pivot to cloak craft? from what i gathered either of the 3 slots is fine

[supple barn]

wait how is arms higher than us

[stuck arrow]

They can cleave. 😂

[strong crypt]

Because we’re dead and we need a 300% all damage buff easy come on blizzard do it

[broken saffron]

We still gonna be viable in mythic plus or?

[olive canyon]

im so tempted to use a catalyst charge to get 2p

absurdly tempted

[shy scarab]

For premades yes but prob never gonna get inv

https://tenor.com/view/的9-gif-12565004940729182637

[supple barn]

i got gatekept from a m0

so i doubit it

[swift tinsel]

viable yes meta no

[broken saffron]

Damn... well. Guess I get to touch grass instead

[agile kernel]

meta is the only one that matters in this hyper efficient gaming hellscape

[shy scarab]

Imagine, meta can do 80% mistakes in a key and still blast rogue that plays 100%😆

[keen dome]

Just demand entry with a cool joke in your join note

[shy scarab]

So why would they bother inv a rogue

[shy scarab]

Dig bick dps 420 here

[keen dome]

Decline

[shy scarab]

Insta decline

😆

[stuck arrow]

Subs not exactly hard to play in M+. 😂

[shy scarab]

Haha bleeeeeck poooowwwwwwdaaaaah

Imagine this guy got 4 rogues hes playing on @limber folio 😆😆😆

[obsidian spade]

Hmmm, I have 608 haste, and the gear options to get to 700 easily, but when I give raidbots the option, it suggests I just keep my current gear on. Do I ignore and go for 700 or?

[west tide]

yes get to 700

[limber folio]

they already know

[west tide]

if u are at like lower just put a haste flask on

[limber folio]

atleast in #assassination

they want me to make more rogues

[shy scarab]

Doesnt hurt to have 700, gives you more "time" for pressing the button

[winged sun]

first craft is weapon, what's our second craft ?

[west tide]

belt

[shy scarab]

Or wrist

[tepid trellis]

belt/wrists w/e you have that worst

really

[meager coyote]

weird question, does which hand ur weapon enchant is on matter in any way for any of the specs?

[tulip light]

@winged sun maybe you can wait and raid first since the 2. embell is very small. i got bracer + belt and crafting cloak now for example

[valid yoke]

potentially stupid sectec question - so obviously cos sectec cd runs off haste, BL knocks sectec and SD out of sync - do I still use it on CD? Do I try and resync both abilities?

[hazy breach]

#subtlety-faq message

Added it to the common questions (because its been asked a lot)

[lusty acorn]

what best build for rogue ?

[meager coyote]

feels like something that raidbots could be forced to do tbh lol

[lusty acorn]

!build

[marble sail]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[hazy breach]

Yesnt

[meager coyote]

I kinda just used a haste flask today with 18%

got me to that sweetspot

[meager coyote]

sadge

[marble sail]

But BL u have to much!!!!!

Bad!!!!!

[zenith mirage]

might be a silly question of me but is the haste threshold with oils on?

played it on splits tn and it felt aight on 700 w oils

[hazy breach]

Its whatever it says in your character sheet

So yes oil would be included

[zenith mirage]

aite bet was wondering if its unbuffed/buffed since it felt gigasmooth

[meager coyote]

I simply played bad tonight

https://tenor.com/view/champoy-el-risitas-kek-issou-etu-gif-17837830

[zenith mirage]

chimaerus is lowk such an insane fight for sub

perma downstairs

[stuck tulip]

try crown on heroic as a rogue, shit is ass

[warm marlin]

chimaerus is lowkey a dose of melatonin

[meager coyote]

u can cloak the soak or what?

[zenith mirage]

ye

u go in first cloak next

cds line up perfectly kinda

[meager coyote]

damn

that explains a few things

[hazy breach]

You cant really force it to certain haste breakpoints, what you can do is increase the delay in between every spell the sim does, but afaik you can only do this locally (as in for your own sims) and if we wanted it to be default it would have to carry over to other things which just make it weird.

But yes the situation is not ideal

Honestly cant believe they saw the response to the outlaw haste cap and decided sub should have some too

[limpid sage]

ya too long between “mechanics” so just ends up feeling like patchwerk

[zenith mirage]

the flying phase is full sleeper

rest is giga

[open moss]

Are we Crafting already or do we wait?

[warm marlin]

am i cooked or does it not do this already

even when i give it the option to go down it pushes me to 700 haste about exact

[meager coyote]

I'm fuming over this change ngl

[meager coyote]

yeah I figured the delay should? just be a little bigger to make it human? idk

[meager coyote]

nah it pushed me lower today

[warm marlin]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dRuJFQimAwi9G2g1KDqoVj

this is like 690 exact iirc

[hazy breach]

Its not even only a "human" problem, since spellqueuing lets you ignore most of it

[copper river]

What does the Gilded Stash at the end of a delve contain on an 11 tier if I'm only Rank 2? Because Rank 4 has the myth crests.

[hazy breach]

But the server sometimes batches things a few milliseconds differently

[chrome palm]

raid pp

[warm marlin]

powdering

[sage flicker]

hero crests

[hazy breach]

But yeah idfk

[glacial lintel]

hey sorry i havent played sub since TWW, do you still backstab as your first global in SD?

[warm marlin]

maybe the crit gems are better

but still why it want haste over mast

[broken saffron]

I'll be sending blizzard a ticket for every 10 mythics I don't get accepted into. Might as well, since I'm paying to play the game. Thank me for upcoming buffs later.

[warm marlin]

my robot is just smart and knows i need human delay

[glacial lintel]

Do i backstab at all during SD?

Thank you!

[golden coral]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[still gazelle]

There a catalyst charge next week?

[marble sail]

Backstab STINKS

[oak hearth]

what level delve should i use my bountiful keys on

t9 or what

[stoic carbon]

8

[oak hearth]

8 or higher?

bet

[stoic carbon]

8

[oak hearth]

oh why not 9

[stoic carbon]

you can do 9 if you want

[oak hearth]

ok

im just going as high as I can fr

[stoic carbon]

https://www.wowhead.com/guide/the-war-within/delves-rewards

reward wise 8

[oak hearth]

ahhh i see

bet bet

ty

[stoic carbon]

was war within link apparently but anyways xd

[oak hearth]

oh wait rip

[supple barn]

if you equip your gear to hit 700 haste then sim it at all in the future its going to recommend u change everything

making it not possible to sim?

or am i dumb

[oak hearth]

i found the fuckin midnight one tho

[hot seal]

Is gaze of alsaneer still bis for us? It sims negative for me

[short radish]

no

[hot seal]

Whats the most accurate trinket combination now

I have the first boss haste trinket

[arctic abyss]

light and gaze i thought

[hot seal]

Gaze got nerfed and sims bad for mee

[short radish]

whatever sims the best for you in your current bags

[arctic abyss]

its like farstraiders mercy and fishhook... fishhook sims better for me

[lusty acorn]

Guya i have ques

About delve

[arctic abyss]

shoot

[short radish]

wrong channel, this isn't #outlaw

[hazy breach]

Gaze/plume+guidon

[amber oak]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[short radish]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[jaunty heath]

im freeee

[leaden glen]

wtf

[hazy breach]

hit something

[glass rock]

why was this needed again 1600 arena rating?

[steel wyvern]

how far behind is lingering / gloom?

[leaden glen]

a

[jaunty heath]

free catalyst charge

so i finished my 4set with it

[indigo wraith]

is it me or people simming 87 k and rogue like 67 something like this >?

[manic ivy]

hi...is there any doc with tierset upgrade % by class/spec?

[steel wyvern]

check dms

[hazy breach]

[steel wyvern]

can i post links here

[leaden sequoia]

so on raid bosses were only using finishers when AA is active, is that what i read?

[steel wyvern]

i have the ulria's sheet

[short radish]

rogue has aoe blind again, we're so saved

time to be #1 m+ class

i cant hold all of this utility

[south moss]

They listen to rogue feedback??

Doubt.

[short radish]

yeah but they need to wait 2 months to revert the aoe blind

[hazy breach]

THIS IS FOR THE .5 PATCH NOT THIS WEEK

• Aoe Blind is back!
• The vial talent seems genuinely pretty good for soloing.
• Cloud Cover is effectively ~15% dmg during Shadow Blades, which seems very good but at the cost of 10% finisher crit its not a guaranteed pick. Regardless its significantly cooler than the unpickable talent its been since Tww Launch.

Overall not much to complain about, pretty neat stuff.

[short radish]

not like DKs where they can buff them 3 days after nerfing

[short radish]

holy quick math as well

[warm marlin]

aoe blind back but only in .5

imagine the chaos if it was back rn

[fleet acorn]

yes rogue buffs

[alpine wraith]

if you see any rogue around

it will be buffed

in 3 months

[agile kernel]

not much to be happy about either when you are still not getting invited to groups

[hazy breach]

Fwiw i think cloud cover still stinks, but atleast it does something

[alpine wraith]

pvp talent

[glass rock]

0.5 means in what time? 2 weeks? later?

[hazy breach]

Should probably be 3 additional times atleast.

[hazy breach]

Early may probably

Or somewhere along those lines, not very soon

[chrome palm]

at least its a visual that we can see

but this might be a bit much LOL

[glass rock]

is this smokebomb xD

[chrome palm]

cloud cover

[jaunty heath]

so whats opener like with 4set? do we delay second dance or what

[sullen spruce]

how do you guys use puzzlebox ?

put it in macro ?

it has cast time

[hazy breach]

Right before blades

[sullen spruce]

im noob to wow

[steel wyvern]

press it before you press your cds

[warm marlin]

delay for last second of guidon/4s before sectec up or so

around there

[sullen spruce]

ah so use it seperate

[steel wyvern]

puzzlebox > press macro

W

[sullen spruce]

okay thnx all ❤️

[jaunty heath]

ty

[short radish]

blizzard will do everything except give us smoke bomb back in pve

[agile kernel]

which is probably the only thing that would make them actually want to invite you

[glass rock]

does it matter if i use dance when i know sectec is on cd for 3 secs or do i want insta sectec when i dance?

[meager coyote]

okay fucking how the sims robot is cooking up rn is killing me

[short radish]

wouldn't want to give us too much utility

[honest void]

Rogues getting changeS?

https://tenor.com/view/omg-he-finally-finished-a-full-sentence-gif-26746139

[chrome palm]

i just asked a guildie

they can see the entier thing

LMAO

[short radish]

holy shit

[chrome palm]

that shit is gonna be so obnoxious lol

[short radish]

this is a pure W

[agile kernel]

don't worry here is 3% reduced damage taken poison

[warm marlin]

surely that makes it to live

[short radish]

because now we can finally join the ranks of absolutely fucking over melee visability

[eager latch]

holy shit

what the fuck

[swift tinsel]

lol us memeing about cloud cover the other day and they whip this out

[short radish]

move over DKs with your DnD + path of frost

[eager latch]

@lucid jackal thank you for those tweets my king

we are so fucking back

[hazy breach]

The new assa talent is actually hilarious though

Wtf is the point of that

[alpine wraith]

deathmark kek

[chrome palm]

this lines say apply fazed, not hit with unseen blade, hopefully they mean the latter

[alpine wraith]

maybe to pop diff mobs in a row with the bleed pop

[hazy breach]

What

[swift tinsel]

nah if its like cloud cover initially it was just fazed

aoe ub hits would be insane

[frosty vector]

What trinkets are currently bis on sub rogue for ST?

[worn sapphire]

so did you all craft a heroic offhand already?

[hazy breach]

It makes all spells apply fazed, just like it does right now

Except the fazed stacks up to 3 times

[chrome palm]

oh wtf

[swift tinsel]

its kind of a neat idea

[stuck tulip]

lets face it rogue is down in the dumps eitherway

[hazy breach]

So fazed gives 24% damage instead of 8% while its up

[eager latch]

kind of insane ngl

[hazy breach]

But its probably not worth it anyway

Since you have to give up 10% crit for it

[swift tinsel]

yeah its competing with a good node

take out Tricky and put it there

[hazy breach]

10% crit on all finisher OR 15% more damage during blades

[swift tinsel]

and make Tricky baseline

well

[torn tide]

yooooo aoe blind is back!!!

checking the pins was a happy day today

[swift tinsel]

hopefully this means they're secretly working on a full ds rework if they're toying with trickster tree

but probs not

would be cool tho

[agile kernel]

I would say that when blind was a 22 second cd with 6 sec of 30% dr, you brought value, but blind going to 6 seconds every 1 minute is trash

[swift tinsel]

airborne coming back is quite nice though

[hazy breach]

Airborne is exactly the same as it was in tww

[short radish]

i still dont know why we need to wait till 0.5 patch to get it back

[swift tinsel]

still sad it wasn't stunning secret but that love wasn't meant to be

[agile kernel]

its basically a worse dragons breath on 50% increased cd

idk i may be wrong

[short radish]

you are not wrong

[steel wyvern]

so the new blades thing gives you 2 more stacks of fazed for 20 seconds?

seems kinda good no

[jaunty heath]

how do you track gudion timer

[short radish]

dragons breath is technically a damage button since it provides hot streak

[hazy breach]

~15% more damage during blades is fine

[frail kindle]

HOLY SHIT

CHANGES

[steel wyvern]

wait no its 22% increased

[hazy breach]

Unfortunately you have to give up 10% crit for it

[steel wyvern]

goes from 11% to 33%

cause of hoodwink

[hazy breach]

Fazed is 8%

So your damage goes from 1.08 to 1.24

Aka ~15% more damage

[steel wyvern]

does this make it go from 5 to 8

[chrome palm]

i just like it for spawning a giant smoke bomb so noone can see any mechanics on the floor

[hazy breach]

Yes

[steel wyvern]

i see

[torn tide]

hm is that even worth it?

[agile kernel]

doubt

[hazy breach]

With subs current damage profile its probably not gonna get picked unless its a smolderon type beat

But its not completely unpickable garbage like the current one

So

[wanton oasis]

Oh thank Jebus.

“Airborne Irritant has been updated – Blind has 50% reduced cooldown, 70% reduced duration, and applies to all nearby enemies.”

They actually fucking listened.

[hazy breach]

In .5

[short radish]

[jaunty heath]

it do not work like that?

[chilly kite]

In 4 weeks but sure

[steel wyvern]

pretty good for dimenius type fight as well no?

[torn tide]

well atleast theres options now lolol

[steel wyvern]

[wanton oasis]

Beggars can’t be choosers

[agile kernel]

I think most would rather of had the 80% cdr and nerf the duration to 90%.

[steel wyvern]

any dmg amps

[warm marlin]

cant macro haste stuff + dance, there's a delay for it to update

[hazy breach]

You probably dont want to give up almost 10% damage at all times for 15% dmg for a small period

[jaunty heath]

yeah but i have blades + trinket and dance + sectech

i donnt have blades dance sectech macro

[hazy breach]

As we arent nearly as bursty now

[steel zinc]

rogue buffs inc already on ptr

[swift tinsel]

attach it to dance instead please

[spare turtle]

I see people using secret technique right at the beginning of shadow dance, does it matter if you use it later during those 6 sec, to get coup de grace in it aswell?

[swift tinsel]

get silly with it

[agile kernel]

i think the only thing is to supercharge it

[jaunty heath]

i needc some tracker for this trinket

[carmine bear]

Do we trust the CoEE sims? It beats all my other trinket by a mile

[misty condor]

At least they are reverting airborne irritant. When will they give us back acrobatic strikes?

[swift tinsel]

never

unholy dk took long arms from everyone

[agile kernel]

they at least got an apology letter

[misty condor]

Yeah you know that's my hangup. They took away acro strikes because it was unfair or whatever, but turn around and turn unholy into an all ranged caster. Not to mention paladin has been flinging hammers from the next area code for a long time

[fierce kite]

Hello guys i have a question,

When i sim in dungeon slice, raidbot said me this trinket is not https://www.wowhead.com/fr/item=249344/guidon-de-la-compagnie-de-la-lumière?ilvl=289 BIS and he recommand play with another!! I dont understand because all guide said this trinket is a big BIS for rogue sub can you help me plz?

[short radish]

the worst part of that was seeing write "we're wanting to make sure they are competitive in nature"

wtf do you think shamans/rogues are atm

[agile kernel]

i am a 3% damage reduction applier

[jaunty heath]

and do you actually have some stuff to track that trinket duration ?

or you go by sectech

[short radish]

hey hey dont spread misinformation. we're 4% now

i think

[agile kernel]

3.6%

[short radish]

i rounded up

[agile kernel]

im a glass half empty fella

[short radish]

or at least wowhead tooltip does

[misty condor]

rogue participation is comparable to a rounding error, yes

[short radish]

[obtuse orbit]

what are ppl mainly running for raid? weapon master/potent powder or swapping between PP and veiltouched depending?

[steel wyvern]

definitely going for PP

[agile kernel]

I think most fights have enough aoe that you get pp on 90% of fights

[steel wyvern]

gotta grab that PP

[obtuse orbit]

fo sho

[wanton oasis]

Alligator arms are really no fun. They should increase base melee range a couple yards at least. Nothing feels worse then constantly getting zoned by swirlies, especially when you’ve gotta use coolies early and often to thrive.

[carmine bear]

weapon master for a couple of fight, and pp for rest

[west tide]

chat we are so large https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/p4qkdrfBF3Xz4a7YKTwwZn

[brisk creek]

why is hungering victory bis dagger for MH sub its vers mast?

[west tide]

i spent all my champ and vet

[plush roost]

What is this ptr update for rogue bro

[swift tinsel]

charity

[plush roost]

Cloudcover burst window

[swift tinsel]

tax writeoff

[plush roost]

Hahaha

[wanton oasis]

I’ve wondered, what does/doesn’t atrophic apply to?

[swift tinsel]

I wanna like it bc conceptually its kinda cool

but its competing with 10% crit chance on finishers

[gentle temple]

Our cds kinda desync after second blades right? Im running out of shadow dances to send 2 on 3rd blades

[short radish]

the short answer is "doesnt apply to enviroment effects" but really the answer is "it applies to most things"

[misty condor]

more bp nerfs on 12.0.5 PTR datamining

[short radish]

aint no way lmao

[hazy breach]

No thats the old nerfs

[stuck arrow]

Anything used by something with the poison works. Melee, spells, etc.

Anything that is like environment damage it doesn't. So like pools / random raid wide burst, etc.

Spotty.

[misty condor]

Thank god

[tribal blade]

nah if anything they would revert the nimble nerf

and maybe bump up our ST a bit more

[wanton oasis]

Thanks

[crystal quiver]

whats the dps increase of getting pi

[hazy breach]

Practically nothing

You can check bloodmallet for it

[torn tide]

i think the best part about those changes in .5 is the aoe blind coming back lol

[stuck tulip]

react to this with a thumb if we need 50% increase in ST and 45% increase dmg in AOE 😂 👍

[west tide]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vague garnet]

The newest tier lists put us in B-tier, is that rly true? Will we struggle in higher keys? Seem decent right now tho

[torn tide]

fuck the tierlists

[vague garnet]

true, but just wondering, will we struggle ?

[short radish]

fuck the tierlists

[misty condor]

rogue is fine for 95% of content. we bitch and moan a lot but things aren't that bad

[west tide]

chat do u want avoidance leech or speed on the shoulders

[woeful quartz]

I am looking for help to get my dps better and have a good rotation for sub. Anyone available?

[west tide]

what yall rockin

[short radish]

yeah when 95% of content is housing decor we're fine

[torn tide]

getting more decor than gear lmao

somehow when playing raids i rolled low on every gear i could get but rolled 99 on a toy

[short radish]

gear is temporary, housing decor is forever

[jaunty heath]

true

[torn tide]

but yesterday was pretty fucking lucky, i got the puzzle box and the magisters ring back to back

[short radish]

oooh nice

puzzle box is acutally kinda easy to farm on m0

since you can just leather stack

and set it to agi loot

[torn tide]

a guy offered 500k to trade it, hes nuts

[torn tide]

lol true thats a good idea

now that its daily reset it shouldnt be THAT crazy

[misty condor]

I would 100% take that trade

[torn tide]

i thought he was kidding so i told him "good one" and then left lmao

[woven sonnet]

not the worst start so far

[vague garnet]

should I craft my weps, or are ppl waiting for final tunings ?

[misty condor]

Don't quote me on this but I believe that unless you already have two champion weapons, you craft one

[pure yacht]

!aa

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[rain hull]

any tips for Vaelgor & Ezzorak fight? do i send dances on boss or mby hold to pad adds? lel

[keen yew]

is not proccing the apex for supercharged sectec not worth it because the apex will only duplicate the first hit ? because otherwise i see no reason not to pool some sht and proccing aa before going into cd window

[hazy breach]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

There is a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts. This is not something you need to play around, as using Ancient Arts of Secret Technique is about the same value as using it on a regular Eviscerate.

[spare quiver]

u have spreedshet for pi and tier¿

[hazy breach]

But also sectech apex isn't the highest priority, it does about the same damage as apexing a regular eviscerate

[hazy breach]

Tier good, PI useless

[maiden quartz]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[hoary orchid]

is Nemesis ?? still easy with valeera? i haver her at level 23 but she kinda getting 3-hitted

[spare quiver]

should i use catalyst for 2p in a champion piece?

[keen yew]

Yeah but like if im at 1:25 and i can proc it this is just either i send an evis before blades or i do the aa thingy for the first sectec, but i guess this kinda answer the question, ty

[stuck arrow]

No. Very hard. With hof closed just Lfg it.

[hoary orchid]

oh i see, i tought she would just easily tank it as healer with trickster

[stuck arrow]

She did before. They hot nerf her on the fight.

[hoary orchid]

oh ty!

[lilac stag]

Don’t send cata this week unless you can get 4 piece. Otherwise you run a significant risk of losing a charge when vault drops only the same piece you just turned into tier.

[delicate wedge]

Why can you combine

#showtooltip
/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

In one Macro? Coup de Grace is using CP's and BP too?

[flint sundial]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

Its not used at the same time

It will use coup instead of BP if its up

And its because of janky coding on coup

[torn tide]

would sending cata on hero track gear be good?

[short radish]

if it gets you 4p, send it on vet track (don't acutally send it on vet track you can farm champ gear so easy)

[torn tide]

lol i know for a fact i wont be getting 4p

i mean i hope but realistically probably not

[charred horizon]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[thorn sundial]

guys does veiltouched add 5% magic damage to all our damage, or just increase all our magic damage by 5%?

[hazy breach]

The latter

[vague oar]

can i macro guidon to blades? i think i remembered reading somewhere that i cant

[spare totem]

anyone elses macro with the pre pot not working?

[sour horizon]

AoE Blind coming back!!

Whyd them clowns remove it

[soft latch]

Can someone explain to me "Ancient Arts". What benefit do I get from using a supercharged finisher with Ancient Arts active?

[thorn sundial]

do we know roughly how much of sub dmg is magic dmg?

[hazy breach]

50/50

[hazy breach]

It buffs a finisher, so you want to buff the big finisher

[soft latch]

Buffs it how? It consumes 5 stack of Shadow tech to give me more combo point. So probably more effective at building CP. But it does not say it makes the finisher stronger, or did I miss it?

[hazy breach]

The first ancient arts

[prime pier]

!log

[fallen depot]

in 2 target cleave do we use SS?

[soft latch]

Oh, so I assumed it was builders only. But it makes sense the final talent point of Ancient Arts can turn finisher into builder as well. So 75% chance of shadow clone doing a supercharged finisher at 50% power?

[hazy breach]

If you only got 5 sht stacks and you are not specced into replicating shadows yes

Its 100% chance since youll alawys have that selected

[soft latch]

I thought it only spent 5 shadow tech at time. I read it wrong, it will spend as much as it can to give me maxed combo point?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[vital sage]

are you guys sending your champion crests, don't really have an upgrade plan, I'm curious to hear what you guys are doing

[short radish]

yeah theyre useless next week

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1476887002019270761/Midnight_s1_fixed.png

[vital sage]

thanks

[short radish]

@hazy breach why do we care about apex for supercharger but not for coup? I thought supercharger works in the same way that it's just + combo points

[soft latch]

I assume cause you dont want to trigger Unseen blade above 4x that triggered Coup?

[vernal drum]

Hey, how can i track my apex talent pro + the combo points refiller talents

[hazy breach]

Most of the time theyre the same

[karmic harbor]

guys post your normal logs

[short radish]

most?

[raven blaze]

2 piece tier

good.

[hazy breach]

As in the supercharged finisher is coup most of the time

[short radish]

ah

ty

[hazy breach]

But also it probably has something to do with it being at the start of the dance so we dont end up with as many leftover sht or something

Idk robot said so

[dawn cargo]

what do you have to use extra of if you make your Weapon without the crests and then make it with the mythic crests next week?

is there a downside to making it now without them?

[spring viper]

are the builds on wowhead solid reccomendations? new to sub and have tried a few different bujilds and i seem to do well with them

[swift tinsel]

lol

maybe nudge backstab up another 200%

from a quick 0

[short radish]

backstab less than wax in 2026

[swift tinsel]

you fuckin bet

oh wanna see something funnier

it barely beat instant poison

[short radish]

can they buff instant poison by like 400% or something

i forget to cast it

and i kinda dont care sometimes

[swift tinsel]

bro you're missing like

[short radish]

because of how little it does

[swift tinsel]

0.7% of your damage

[placid lynx]

black powder or evis on 2 targets?

[eager latch]

worth taking potent powder on council boss?

[torn tide]

isnt there something u can do to make it appear in the middle of the screen until u do apply it

[short radish]

pretty sure theres an addon ive not bothered to install

[torn tide]

me neither

i just dont apply it when i dont remember and when i realise i go "eh whatever"

[swift tinsel]

I just have an instant/atro poison castsequence macro in my consumes action bar that I click when I apply those

[torn tide]

we can only get 6 coffer keys this week right?

[glass rock]

8 if you open the bag after 600 shards i guess

[vernal drum]

how do i track apex talent like th screen ?

with which addons ?

on the left

[torn tide]

what bag?

[fair phoenix]

without tset, trickster or ds for raid

st fight

[azure mauve]

yo withour potent powder at what target count do you use bp?

3?

[lucid jackal]

always trickster

Deathstalker is just larp

[short vessel]

Im super confused about Crucible trinket. Does the upgraded console version upgrade the effect when outside of Voidstorm aswell? Will it be upgraded inside dungeons for example? Is it any good? I'm trying to decide if its good or not?

[frosty vector]

What trinkets are bis for ST right now? Still Light Company Guidon and Gaze of the Alnseer?

[lucid jackal]

It affects everywhere yeah

[short vessel]

With the upgraded version? So i should do the weekly quest and get it upgraded?

[pure jay]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[lucid jackal]

yer

[short vessel]

Shame its not warbound though =/

the weekly quest*

Oh wait, it is. My bad

[plush roost]

2 entire splits no tier for leather in my split

its over

[unkempt oak]

So what do we think about this, worth taking now?

[short radish]

[prime pier]

!log

[glass rock]

for the delves quest you get

[coral trail]

Is there any reason not to use shadow dance 4 times before pull to max your charges?

[dire ravine]

Evis doesnt cleave, ye?

why evis on 2 target in council, and not BP if taking potent powder?

[short radish]

stacks reset to max of 2

[torn tide]

hm i dont remeber if i did it already, ive done like 3 t8 delves

[grim vessel]

is drudge pit xp farm still around?

[tulip light]

how to approach ?? delve at the moment? valeera lvl 27 , 258 ilvl

[warm marlin]

hmm crown seems to maybe favour ranged a little bit

or not

all these spread cleavers are eating all these slop adds

[dire ravine]

tricks valeera

[tulip light]

she just dies

[dire ravine]

feint, and res her

strategically 🙂

can evasion tank ?? too

[potent heath]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[potent heath]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[potent heath]

!delves

!neck

[unreal musk]

do we have a list of current bugs?

[short radish]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[unreal musk]

oh ty!

[short radish]

no wukkas

[simple sapphire]

are y'all going for wrists, waist, or boots for your second craft?

[unreal musk]

thank god its mentionned i thought i was crazy

[tulip light]

@simple sapphire depends on what you get from raid. all small slot are fine

[misty iris]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tulip light]

will try, do you set her as healer still tho?

[unreal musk]

kinda sad we didnt get any bugfixe

[marble sail]

where is this

[unreal musk]

bottom of the sheet

[warm marlin]

@hazy breach im not sure the snapshot tech will actually work

[torpid echo]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[warm marlin]

the timing is really tight to get guidon in and sc sectec

im trying to play it rn and the deepening delay is brutal

[lilac stag]

900 haste it is

1200?

[warm marlin]

it's not dance duration

you just have to press dance too early

well ig maybe more haste for sectec

but you'd need sooo much

[lilac stag]

ye Sectech tech

mostly jokin

But curious

[short radish]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

There is a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts. This is not something you need to play around, as using Ancient Arts of Secret Technique is about the same value as using it on a regular Eviscerate.

[soft summit]

Hey, is WoWhead's bis lists wrong or is the simcraft/raidbots wrong? I have both "A" tier trinkets and yet, they come way behind C both single target and dungeon slice. What gives?

[short radish]

tier lists suck