subtlety

[oak grotto]

I think that in theory Deathstalker is better but I think that the nanosecond it becomes more than 1 target it falls behind Trickster

And I also think the difference between Deathstalker and Trickster isn't that big

[keen dome]

@swift tinsel Starting my heroic pugging, urgh.

[swift tinsel]

#1065728795455266888 message looks like deathstalker is leading at 2 targets currently but falls after more targets

[swift tinsel]

god's strongest soldier good luck 🫡

get that week one pug aotc

[keen dome]

I'm legit thinking it's gonna be a gear issue for pugs this week

[elder ibex]

Should I craft at 259?

[valid turtle]

II'm trying!

[swift tinsel]

yeah mechanically the fights don't seem crazy different from normal

[keen dome]

Yeah

It's all gonna be tuning, esp the first 4

[swift tinsel]

and def can't brute force anything with it being release day

[keen dome]

Yep

[swift tinsel]

of season 1 with no carryover gear

[keen dome]

No M+ means we can't just juice to full Hero

[swift tinsel]

ye which is nice-ish for longevity but also stinky

[keen dome]

Also general information hasn't cascaded down to pug raiders

[hazy lichen]

anyone know the methods of getting 80 over current heroic crest cap

[earnest prairie]

What slot are you guys crafting for the arcanoweave lining embelishment? Just your weakest slot that you couldn't fill out with champ gear like bracers/boots/belt?

[oak grotto]

That's what I'll do

[swift tinsel]

shadow dance dumps your threat

hits you with -10million threat

pew pew

[swift tinsel]

delve nemesis gives crests above cap

iirc its 30 for ? and 30 more for ??

[timid trellis]

what is the item called now for more gems in neck and rings

[swift tinsel]

its gone

rings/neck come with sockets now

[keen dome]

There isn't one. What Haptics said

[swift tinsel]

can only get the ones for pvp gear or from vault tokens

[timid trellis]

thx

[eager latch]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[hot seal]

? And ?? Delve give 30 each

Uncapped

[hazy lichen]

ty

[turbid pebble]

what are people crafting second after mainhand?

[limber folio]

😭

[oak grotto]

Fillerslots with Arcanoweave Lining

[golden thunder]

!trinket

[steep raven]

Is there a way to sim all flasks at the same time?

[verbal kelp]

hey guys, do we use Restored Coffer Key for Delve Tier 8, or we save them for higher? im reading that the loot between tier 8-11 is the same?

[low girder]

T11 gives crests but gear is the same 8-11

[verbal kelp]

so it doesnt matter if we use the keys at 8, and we keep running the delves, there's no like lockout

[fervent plover]

guys, im not a rogue player but ive been seeing a lot of sub rogues blasting m0s, are they secretly giga pumping?

[oak grotto]

We got hit with a pretty big AoE nerf

[fervent plover]

yes but some guyh was opening 200k every pack even after todays nerfs

[dreamy latch]

does anyone know how we use the beacon of hope from the pray quest?

[oak grotto]

Does the /cast Coup de Grace /cast Black Powder work for eveyrone else?

[fleet acorn]

xd

[hazy breach]

"Best in slot"

[fleet acorn]

so lucky i rolled on it

and got it another time warbound

can send it to dh alt

[vestal sphinx]

what does sim it mean?

[fleet acorn]

problem is rest of my gear i have 0 haste

unlucky loot with crit/mastery or critt vers

[swift tinsel]

inside a delve, after the respawn point unlocks you can use it to summon the delve nemesis who drops a chest that gives a map. you use the map in a delve level 8 or higher to get a guaranteed hero track piece

[chilly dagger]

I wasnt able to get to nightmare prey, but if I join my friend in such a delve, do I get the guaranteed hero piece for myself too?

[swift tinsel]

only if you use the map

unless it changed

[chilly dagger]

and what does t he beacon do? So the map usage gives me the hero piece?

[swift tinsel]

otherwise you'd do a 5stack and rotate who used the map

[warm socket]

Is it too early to be log reviewing? I was placing pretty high in my raid last night but still green parsed

[dreamy latch]

i seems bugged - dosent wrok for me

[swift tinsel]

it might be in some of the delves, saw other people saying it wasn't working for them

[limpid prawn]

the beacon summons the seasonal delve boss and you bring it to like 50%hp and kill the adds it leaves and drops a chest that you loot

[swift tinsel]

#subtlety message

[chilly kite]

does it matter what level delve you summon the the seasonal guy on to get the map?

[keen dome]

@swift tinsel people arguing over how the zone mechanic works on the first boss because they don't understand the word "Adjacent" lol

[swift tinsel]

praying even harder for your mental

lmao

[keen dome]

Thankfully I'm not leading

[swift tinsel]

oh nice

[keen dome]

or i would've started pasting dictionary passages

[swift tinsel]

hahahahahaa

[chilly kite]

legit spit my drink out from that

[keen dome]

It has happened before.

[chilly kite]

what do they teach kids these days??

[keen dome]

the mechanic is legit written as "three adjacent zones" and not "A line of zones" lol

[swift tinsel]

I don't think it matters what level you summon him on but you want to use the map on an 8+ until you unlock myth crests at seasonal journey level 4, then do it on 11's

[tawny plume]

if i have this do i use it before dance?

[swift tinsel]

and if you already got your map don't summon him

[swift tinsel]

yes, slightly before

[chilly kite]

i focused on prey instead of delves so haven't done any delves yet this week

[finite crow]

we can only use one delve map per week?

[swift tinsel]

yes

[tawny plume]

ok can i macro it to use before cds?

[swift tinsel]

one per character per week

[hazy breach]

You shouldnt macro it with dance no

[finite crow]

okay so i can save 1 if i have two

sweet

[swift tinsel]

wait you got two maps this week on the same character?

I thought they made that impossible

[alpine wraith]

you can get maps randomly on bountiful delves or delves too

[swift tinsel]

yeah but I thought they limited it to one drop per week

[alpine wraith]

low drop tho

[karmic harbor]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[alpine wraith]

the limit is for the loot i think

[swift tinsel]

hm

[karmic harbor]

is aa for aoe too?

[chilly kite]

at 250 is emberwing or executioner mandate better?

[chilly dagger]

but only source for beacons is the nightmare quest?

[swift tinsel]

you can buy beacon for 5000 undercoin

but you get 1 from doing 3 nightmare prey this week

[chilly kite]

mandate isn't ranked, since its not in the rotation.

[chilly dagger]

I cant - I just started playing last week

so maps are kinda irrelevant for me too then, without a beacon right

[finite crow]

ye i got one random drop and one from the quest

[chilly dagger]

Whats an undercoin, didnt see that curreny yet

[swift tinsel]

you get them from doing delves

[chilly dagger]

ahhh

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah you'd just use one beacon per week if you don't get the map natty

[chilly dagger]

missed it, thanks!

Ahhh so I just need the map then

beacon would just guarantee a drop

😄

[swift tinsel]

yep

the maps can drop from the non-bountiful chests at the end as well

[chilly dagger]

bountiful delves are somewhat special?

[swift tinsel]

bountiful give season journey xp, and have a chest at the end you can open with Coffer Keys for champ track loot

[regal flax]

Can I post logs in here to have my stupidity explained to me

Or is there designated log channel for that

[swift tinsel]

can do !log

[chilly dagger]

How do I identify if a delves a bountiful or not? Can I just spam the silvermoon delve? or is it a special one per day?

[finite crow]

glows

[swift tinsel]

the icon on the map has a glowing door

[chilly dagger]

❤️ Thanks!

[regal flax]

Okay I hate to sound skeptical/suspicious, is that gonna do something

I'm not terribly familiar with Moroes commands or whatever

[swift tinsel]

he's gonna shadowstrike you then full kidney

something to be mindful of

but once that wears off you can post your log

[regal flax]

[wet jacinth]

why does Sapling of the dawnroot outsim all my good trinkets ? it outsims the crit prey trinket and emberwing how ?

[young harness]

!log

[regal flax]

Oh

Sorry

Thanks

!log

[onyx flame]

Is there any info on how good the void renown trinket is compared to the others?

[keen dome]

First boss on heroic just seems to be tank crashout central.

[hazy breach]

You can just sim it

[lilac stag]

Oh god. Are you starting the heroic pugging arc today?

[keen dome]

YEP

Just did a load of IMperator pulls

Went through 5 tanks.

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/nbc-superstore-praying-gif-13571287818285409221

[keen dome]

I'm purposefully not leading this or I think I'd quit WoW.

[swift tinsel]

should have them post tic-tac-toe screenshots to get into the group

[keen dome]

did get to watch a french boomkin and a tank argue in a very incoherent manner though

Boss is a lot of fun though. Sub seems pretty comfy on it

[pure yacht]

Any reason to pop silent storm in single target?

I've been using it outside of dance. But are people using it inside dance for guaranteed crit + danse macabre?

[swift tinsel]

yeah the add spawns felt pretty favorable

[hazy breach]

#subtlety-faq message

[swift tinsel]

was one of the few fights sub felt less awkward

[keen dome]

Yeah

[lilac stag]

🤔

[stoic anchor]

U play imp black powder except on... ?

[swift tinsel]

feels like playing sub is gonna feel like swimming against the stream on a few bosses

[pure yacht]

Not seeing the answer in there

[keen dome]

The goddamn dragons, man

[mental kettle]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[keen dome]

Seems fine on first, voraius, saladbar 2.0 and Crown though

[stoic anchor]

Yooo, in ashran if you loot corpses u can get as a rare drop enemy race's heads. For example I got night elf head to decorate the chirstmass tree, it's waiting patiently in the bank

Elf

[swift tinsel]

Dragons def feeling like one of the least-fun fights in a while

[keen dome]

Yep

[swift tinsel]

like early Stone Legion Generals level

[keen dome]

I don't like the 10% HP balance mechanic even if it is, effectively, the same as any other council one

It's just going to be super obnoxious in pugs when people don't listen and push them too fast

[swift tinsel]

yeah our RL was having people swap a bunch even though their health was pretty even so it made things weird

[pure yacht]

Okay still doesn't answer my question.

Do you proc your silent storm at all in a fight?

[swift tinsel]

and positioning kept tail swiping the raid with the fear breath

[keen dome]

I found the best way is raid in mid, dragons either side facing the door so their tails are facing where the enxt boss stairs are

[swift tinsel]

or light side fucked up orb soaks

[swift tinsel]

I tried my hardest to get them to try this but it was too big an ask

[keen dome]

alas

[swift tinsel]

and kept yolo spinning the bosses

and the fear dispels were bad

[hazy breach]

No

[swift tinsel]

but could be partially from unit frames not being great for healers

[keen dome]

fear dispels suck 'cos of how awkward it is, but that's why everyone in mid is nice

[swift tinsel]

yeah we had a marker people were supposed to run to but that was a mess

[keen dome]

Never been a fan of set markers for that stuff 'cos of the fluidity of wow mechanics

gloom orb goes that way and rip

[silk fiber]

Ran all bosses last night some felt really good(council, saladbar, double dragon. Some I felt like I was fighting for my life especially on last boss of void spire.) I ran trickster all raid but some of those fights I just know that deathstalker is gonna be better.

[swift tinsel]

yeah

we have 3 priests too for MD if needed

idk was a bit of a frustrating first night bc no one wanted to try anything outside the video guide we watched

[chilly dagger]

Offtopic, but do you know, why I dont see the items when hovering over them in the Adventure Guide?

[torn tide]

man sub feels so sad after the aoe nerf

[hazy breach]

Some addon acting up

[chilly dagger]

Most likely Elv ui LOL

[pure yacht]

Interesting. A guaranteed crit SS is < regular backstab? @hazy breach

They both apply find weakness. They can both proc unseen blade.

I just practiced on dummies and the storm modified SS is doing more damage for the global. Is there a talent interaction I'm missing. Just want to make sure I'm doing it right.

(I'm standing behind the dummy for the extra backstab damage)

[tired heart]

Vibes guess, it costs more energy, and any damage that isn't finishers is basically white noise for overall.

[hazy breach]

It costs more energy, it doesnt proc weaponmaster

But more importantly both of them do insanely insignificant damage

It doesnt matter

[left ledge]

[hazy breach]

You can use storms instead if you want to, but its more effort for no reward

So why bother

[pure yacht]

Yea it's a minor thing- but questions like that help me understand the talents more, forgot about weaponmaster

Thank you

[left ledge]

was def an overnerf, but sub still feels strong in aoe

not sure why there's so much doom about sub's aoe

it seems like thats the only thing the spec CAN do

[frail kindle]

bro i absolutely hate multispeccing so much

[left ledge]

dont then

just be sat on paladins

[frail kindle]

shit is so cringe having to manage different haste values and shit and then you inevitably reset your muscle memory for a spec as you play a different hero talent or some shit

like i feel like this game is just like league, the best players are just one tricks imo

[hazy breach]

I mean that is precisely why people are dooming no?

[swift tinsel]

just wait til you swap from trickster to ds

[hazy breach]

Like the thing sub is good at, it got worse at

[frail kindle]

yeah bro i did and i forgot to start dance at low cp and start with storm

theres minor shit like that youre gonna forget if you switch specs all the time i swear that shit is unoptimal

[swift tinsel]

ds feels unnatural and gross already, then different rules make it feel even more unnatural and gross

[pure yacht]

Did you play sub last expac? It was way more ridiculous lol

[shrewd lantern]

this expac sub has more jank shit

tbh

[left ledge]

well, they're saying the aoe feels bad

[finite crow]

the expac is straight ass ngl

boring af

[left ledge]

the aoe is the only good part

cleave is ass, ST is subpar

[silk fiber]

I did an m0 after raid before nerfs and before big item upgrades I was bursting 170 to 180k in big aoe hero packs. I topped out at 120k in a perfect pull scenario it was a big ol aoe nerf

[pure yacht]

No way lol.

Last expac had:

1.) Symbols of death timings with dance and blade windows with some specs having a "naked symbols" part of the rotation

2.) Rupture management

3.) On press cold blood which you didn't actually use every 45s you used every 1m30s for the guarantee'd big boom sectech

4.) Inconsistent cooldowns with CP use reductions

5.) Flagellation

6.) Opening dance with backstab for full CP + DM stack before blades

[left ledge]

after raid before nerfs?

[shrewd lantern]

after raid

before nerf

[left ledge]

what the helly

[pure yacht]

This expac its way less complicated lol

[hazy breach]

Not really, it just had so much other stuff going on that most didnt bother with the jank youre doing now

[shrewd lantern]

if you think rupture was real management

instead of random filler you kept during downtime

[left ledge]

i mean i press sectec in an aoe pull and im already at 200k

so idk

[hazy breach]

The macro thing was relevant last tier too, most people missed globals in blades because of coups longer gcd

[young harness]

!log

[left ledge]

we're def not op, but i think our aoe is relatively good

we still wipe the floor with almost every spec in aoe

[silk fiber]

After raid I did algethar with the plant pull hero. Before raid and before the nerfs I did 180k in aoe. I barely topped at out 120k AFTER the nerfs and with better gear

[shrewd lantern]

idk what people smoking

aoe is the good part of this spec

[left ledge]

idk how man

maybe you pressed something wrong

i really dont know

[swift tinsel]

its good but it was better before the nerfs

that's the complaint

[frail kindle]

st lowkey felt good last night

[left ledge]

120k for AA pull is just not it

[frail kindle]

as ds

[vast basin]

yo guys in cd when we did our first dance, and have to press the 2nd we just send it right? we dont wait for sec tech

and press the 2nd sec tech with our 3rd sd

?

[left ledge]

top out at 120k sounds like you just missed sectec

[silk fiber]

I did not in fact forget to press my most important button

[left ledge]

also im just not sure how you did AA before the nerfs

are you a time traveler or something

comparing diff pulls?

diff dungeons?

[silk fiber]

You reading comprehension is literally 0, I didnt say I did AA before I said in big aoe pulls

[left ledge]

you are not topping out at 120k in the plant pull

[hazy lichen]

Is Nullaeus killable as rogue rn

[young harness]

if any of you sweats can glance at this to give me tips i’d appreciate it

[left ledge]

maybe your button pressing ability is 0 man idk

[pure yacht]

to me it makes sense to double dance inside your blades window. Then when those fade and your 2nd sectech comes off CD you should have another charge of dance like 3-4s later. So it's probably worth to save for that

[swift tinsel]

yes

[hazy lichen]

how?

[pure yacht]

Already did it

[hazy lichen]

the ?? variant?

[swift tinsel]

yes

[left ledge]

yeah

[hazy lichen]

how do u survive

[left ledge]

some people been saying they hotfixed valeera

but idk

tricks valeera

[swift tinsel]

don't get hit more than twice in a row

[left ledge]

you dont tank him

healer valeera, make her tank

[pure yacht]

Tricks valeera and have her tank lmao

Literally free

[left ledge]

do not do tank valeera

[hazy lichen]

when she tanks she keeps spawning those clones tho

[swift tinsel]

idk her healing was super inconsistent for me

[left ledge]

set her as healer

[hazy lichen]

ok

[swift tinsel]

so I just lucked into a pull where the hot ticked on her and it fell over

[pure yacht]

I had her tank and tricksd her and it was literally a training dummy with occassional adds

[vast basin]

yes thats what ive been doing

that is the correct way?

i just wanted to make sure

[swift tinsel]

you kick the cast you win

thats 100% of the fight challenge

besides picking up orbs

[lucid jackal]

@warm marlin This is before ive done my split

[night sluice]

is it a big loss to craft wrist over belt as second craft? I have champ belt but only advent wrist

[astral imp]

I did the same. No idea if it was the right choice though.

[shrewd lantern]

i mean the second slot literally doesnt matter

[lilac stag]

Sounds like a big gain to me

[shrewd lantern]

its just a weak slot

[pure yacht]

I believe so- usually the game of this spec is how big can I make my sec tech. It needs to be supercharged with ancient arts as much as you can help it. You're just not going to fit it twice into shadow blades- so you're not going to get any bonus there. And if you hold a dance you're missing out on 4-5s of dance/blades for what? Missing out 4s of sech tech's CD. I think that's worth

[left ledge]

lootfed?

[dire flame]

isn't cloak/bracer lesser stats than belt/boots anyway?

[vast basin]

Yes, i think as well too

Alright ty

[shrewd lantern]

the technical minmax is you make pvp bracers for the socket

as your second embellish

otherwise its just pick your weakest low stat slot

[night sluice]

pvp? 👀🤮

[lucid jackal]

No just done everything

[mental kettle]

!craft

[lucid jackal]

Preys, delves

[mental kettle]

!commands

[shrewd lantern]

i mean its 259 socket

[left ledge]

ya it was joke

[shrewd lantern]

which is better than most items this early

[stoic anchor]

Stuck @work 12h before normal tonight is diabolical

[mental kettle]

!trinkets

[young harness]

looking for pointers in this log if anyone is available

[lilac stag]

!bis

!BIS

!purple

[finite lark]

hello guys ! any tips from this random pic guys ( started learning today)? just going for opener then 5 min rotation getting around 33k-34k dps vs 37k simbot ST dummy ? any feedback? Should be decent right ?

[shrewd lantern]

you need a log

[lethal gale]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1476887002019270761/Midnight_s1_fixed.png

[shrewd lantern]

especially with how shit details is now

[oak grotto]

Would you hold second pair of CDs to align with Puzzlebox, or just play CDs + Box, CDs, CDs + Box

[swift tinsel]

alternate box useage

play it like a 3min

[shrewd lantern]

same with emberwing

[swift tinsel]

unless there's a really compelling fight timer

then you'd hold

[shrewd lantern]

which somehow is outsimmed by blinding vale lasher trink at same ilvl for me

[dire flame]

do you box pre-combat, or do some shit like shadowstrike - box - dance/blades etc

[swift tinsel]

trinkets in general are kinda shitty

[shrewd lantern]

[swift tinsel]

like there aren't any that jump out as "I really want that one bc its cool and stuff"

we got guidon

[shrewd lantern]

alnseer crazy clearly

def not just a statstick

with a funny name

[swift tinsel]

hey it spawns lil homies

shadowfiend friends

that glow

[shrewd lantern]

why tf is hc chim

[swift tinsel]

lightfiend?

[shrewd lantern]

almost a 10min boss

though

brev

[swift tinsel]

idk need to justify going there for one boss

[shrewd lantern]

its a decent sub fight

it feels like at least

[swift tinsel]

I have paid zero attention to that fight lol

I'll check out the journal and lorrgs before we go thursday

[shrewd lantern]

we did it first

[swift tinsel]

I wanted to

[shrewd lantern]

before voidspire

[swift tinsel]

so we could do voidspire fully yesterday and thursday

but nope

we're progging last boss then hopping over

[shrewd lantern]

on hc?

[swift tinsel]

nah we're doing normal first for tier

and to just see stuff

we don't do splits or anything we're a baby guild

WR like 5k lol

[shrewd lantern]

honestly splits outside hof

is diabolical

[swift tinsel]

yeah normally we jump into normal first to fill out slots and get as many tier pieces as possible then send into hc once we clear

[keen dome]

I have given up on Imperator

and am trying Dreamrift lmao

[swift tinsel]

no shot you're still there

yesus

[whole lichen]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1476887002019270761/Midnight_s1_fixed.png

[swift tinsel]

idk after seeing bosses on normal I'm not really all that excited for hc

more excited for some of the m+ rotation tbh

[restive venture]

what if I cant reach 18-19% haste? how bad will that affect my dps?

[swift tinsel]

skyreach was fun, only one I was able to do last night before raid

gonna go there daily

pit also

[keen dome]

Imperator reminds me a lot of Plexus Mythic

[severe fox]

should i send 2 spark crafts or would there be a reason to wait with them?

[little sleet]

is there a place where i can check what to craft for raid (i use my rogue as a split character so idc if i waste sparks just need a boost in dmg)

[shrewd lantern]

Its nice our wep drops off the training dummy boss of the tier

aka godzilla wannabe

[keen dome]

Yeah he's gonna be easy

Just damage

[swift tinsel]

ye

having two possible myth tracks from m+ is nice too

[keen dome]

Main thing I'm seeing in heroic pugs today is gear issues, lack of prepareness, etc. Lotta groups killed normal and didn't learn the mechanics

[swift tinsel]

daggers

[keen dome]

Then pugging heroic and not understanding anything

So same 'ol

[swift tinsel]

yeah it doesn't help normal basically falls over so you don't have to learn much of anything at all

[keen dome]

Yep

[pure yacht]

Wanted to circle back cause I did some research on it- looks like it's really dependent on your haste. Your haste reduces your sec tech CD. If you can get it into the second dance in blades ,then use it there. If you cannot, hold the second dance charge a couple seconds

[swift tinsel]

and mechanics aren't punshing mostly

[keen dome]

It's def 'harder' than Manaforge was but a lot of it is gear atm

[swift tinsel]

for hc?

[keen dome]

Yeah

[swift tinsel]

or in general

ah

I think a few of us are mostly champ'd out

[keen dome]

Yeah I'm 245 atm

[vast basin]

Oh okay

[keen dome]

I could probably push to 250+

[swift tinsel]

got a couple of 250's, I'm at 244 iirc

I could for sure if I sent champ crests

I haven't upgraded anything

bc I'm waiting to see vault situation and raid drops tomorrow

but idk I'm not stressing about gearing quite yet

[west tide]

raid is awesome

easy feeling mechanically

i think it cranks the healing

[swift tinsel]

I'm waiting til we get through it in hc before I make up my mind on how I feel about it

bc after last night I was feeling quite meh

[west tide]

yeah we just killed the heroic dragons

[swift tinsel]

paladins a total mess of a fight and we ended on that

[west tide]

and chimaerous

[swift tinsel]

which might have tainted my perception

dragons into paladins was a one-two punch of anti-fun

[marble sail]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[swift tinsel]

at least as sub lol

[west tide]

paladins yeah not the best sub fight

but i liked dragons

[swift tinsel]

tank positioning made things feel bad on both fights as well

[west tide]

we cleaved dragons in p3

went crazy

[lilac stag]

dragons gonna be a beast in mythic

[swift tinsel]

yeah can't wait to see that shitter lol

[safe tundra]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/tGgJZX4aQP7pYL6h?fight=39&type=damage-done&source=97 i need log review

genuinely don't know why my dmg is so bad

[trim fractal]

do i have to use my map in an 11 delve, or can i send it in an 8 and get the same ilvl items

[swift tinsel]

use in an 8

ilvl doesn't change after 8

[shrewd lantern]

mythic chim will be funny

if it has the "dont touch other realm people or you both die" mechanic that sire had

[trim fractal]

tyty, and should i send it in a bountiful delve or doesnt matter?

no harm in sending it there?

[swift tinsel]

you'll use maps in 11's once you unlock gilded chests and myth crests (journey level 2 and 4 respectively)

[swift tinsel]

there's not really a point to doing non-bountiful delves

unless you're pushing level up fast

[trim fractal]

++

[keen dome]

All the pug groups demanding discord voice comm makes me sad.

[swift tinsel]

in-game voice works pretty nice

[young harness]

i dont think i would even attempt a pug without voice lol

[keen dome]

I cannot think of anything worse than a pug group with voice chat.

[tulip light]

what is the general advice on valeera in solo delves? tank / healer?

[swift tinsel]

oh yeah

healer

always

[tulip light]

do the curios matter in any bigger way?

[swift tinsel]

you dps - she heals, you tank - she dps, you heal - she tank

[keen dome]

I remember the one time I tried a group with voice on Ansurek, and it was this incredibly angry guy ranting at people the entire time. He'd been trying to kill it in a pug for like, 8+ hours.

[shrewd lantern]

the best parts of voice in pugs

1. someone playing right next to their tv

[swift tinsel]

not like hatarang did

[shrewd lantern]

2)someone with kids yelling in the background

[swift tinsel]

but they're still okay

3. the open mic heavy breather

[keen dome]

Also random, sudden slurs.

[swift tinsel]

4. keyboard a literal typewriter

[shrewd lantern]

op shit was mechasaur build kit and image creator from s2

tbh

no idea why mechasaur was a util curio

[young harness]

Any log reviewers in the chat

[swift tinsel]

hatarang 1-shotting is fun

homie rolls up like fuckin Oddjob

https://tenor.com/view/james-bond-gif-7286680

[shrewd lantern]

thats the best part

[keen dome]

You get enough of it in text chat.

[swift tinsel]

rn we have the Mid-Divorce Dad Trying to Reclaim The Edginess of His Youth

[keen dome]

You don't need voice comm to clear any of the Heroic content and I've always found it to be a mixture of a crutch or like, outright toxic shit in pugging. In organized groups it's great, 'cos it's so social.

[swift tinsel]

so the hooker and cocaine jokes are flowing

[keen dome]

gross

[swift tinsel]

yeppers

[eager latch]

how come the sim sectechs outside of dance

[swift tinsel]

theres a couple of people in guild who find that to be peak comedy

I just make old people jokes at him constantly

[keen dome]

lmao

[swift tinsel]

asking if the Old Folks Home knows hes up this late

[keen dome]

I wish M+ was out 'cos I could just go slam the hell out of it instead of feeling the desire to throw myself at pug raiding

[swift tinsel]

or if they still pin his contact info to his lapel when he leaves the house just in case

[dire ravine]

Do we not want to supercharge sectech? Or does it not interact?

[shrewd lantern]

also not sure where i fucked up that i sometimes dont have a second dance ready

for blades

[chilly kite]

does crucible sim correctly or is it sim bait

[shrewd lantern]

the buff is like over 80% uptime

[swift tinsel]

the lineups can be funny

[shrewd lantern]

assuming you have all 4 of the console upgrades

[swift tinsel]

bc dance is 20 sec and blades is 90

so you get a gap

without tier set I'm holding blades til I have 1 dance ready and the remaining cooldown on the 2nd is the duration of dance

but ye its bleh

my haste is also dumb though

drops will not let me get more than 550 haste

[silver yarrow]

Guys one question. on the faq it says to macro SD with tecnique. On the fuu guide on wowhead the opener is ST > SD > SB and then we use tecnique. So this means I need to have another SB button separated from the macroed one?

[chilly kite]

oof i only have 2

i find myself torn between sending backto back dances or waiting the like 6 seconds for sectek

[shrewd lantern]

if its not a 20s buff then yeah

[young harness]

wym console upgrades

[lilac stag]

You don’t have tier and it’s trying to fit everything in blades window.

More than likely

[keen dome]

The upgrades at the void console in Voidstorm

From Guy's very good pin in the Assa channel:

[subtle spruce]

What tier is subtlety in raid?

[keen dome]

Voidcured

[finite crow]

arent those just for void world content

[young harness]

huhhhh? these buffs work in raid? are they important

[finite crow]

im not sure they do

btw are we getting 2 embelishments of the bat?

[swift tinsel]

if you're crafting two pieces they should both be embellished

[light hull]

Hey colleges, do you know which are best embellishment to wear as second? (understanding that daagger + hunt is first craft)

[swift tinsel]

arcanoweave

[light hull]

Perfecto from Echo is wearing this one rn

could this be secretly broken?

[verbal kelp]

is it worth upgrading the crucible of erratic energies? or get the other trinkets from m+

[swift tinsel]

is only wearing one ring also secret tech?

(can't put arcanoweave on rings)

[west tide]

dam double acuity outsimmin crazy vs arcane mastery

[light hull]

it's not his main rogue, maybe he's testing

[open coyote]

how do we set the last 2 talent points in void spire, since there is almost always adds to hit do we take improved BP or do we just not care?

[swift tinsel]

or it was a cheap craft

[open coyote]

potent powder is what i meant with "improved BP"

[west tide]

i went full st default the whole way

i got r2 on da dragons heroic (before eu)

[swift tinsel]

yeah I just played regular raid build idk

will fiddle with talents later

[stuck arrow]

It out sims arcano for me, TBH.

But just generally having a second embellishment is good, you note he didn't spend a spark on it.

[swift tinsel]

its first clear its whatever

[grim vessel]

How many of you guys are up against devourer DHs who roll BIS for every loot drop

[crisp pond]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[thorn stream]

!talent

[west tide]

i got 2 tier from raid bro i just need 1600

for 4p..

[frail kindle]

same

[verbal kelp]

Is there a reason why this player casted vanish in the opener?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/2HKjw8ZytCYzW1GM?fight=33&type=casts&source=48&view=events

[west tide]

also i need at least another heroic track

[thorn stream]

some one help meee i need single target and aoe talent cant reach site 🙁

[west tide]

idk if its worth cata lower

[swift tinsel]

you want 4pc asap

to unlock catalyst charge drops

[frail kindle]

so those catalyst charge drops are unlimited?

[swift tinsel]

I assume you can hold 8 at a time like usual

[frail kindle]

ok so literally just cata any champ piece i have just for 4pc then next week replace

[west tide]

someone said it was 1 per week or somethin

[swift tinsel]

yeah

[swift tinsel]

I don't see any limits being listed anywhere

[marble oriole]

to get snd up before SB was the logic i had but they dont do that actually

i figured ud spend those points to get it back but the sectec

idfk id like to see an answer too maybe just a macro?

[spare oar]

How do we use Puzzlebox? Prepull , then strike blades secteq/dance marko and again after 3 mins?

Or use it after blades

[winter current]

If I'm solo I pop it then stealth shadow strike then pop the rest

[swift tinsel]

yeah idk why they vanish+dance+blades

[stoic anchor]

do u play black powder at those trash aoe fights?

[winter current]

Group I just pop it at pull

[west tide]

naww

shit dies so fast #notourjob

i can see it being good on dragons if ur guild doesnt have lots of aoe

[stoic anchor]

and mainly trickster not deathstalker?

[west tide]

ya i went full tricky

[stoic anchor]

are u like good or pug xd?

k i trust u friend. ur my friend now

i bring u rakija when i see u

[stuck arrow]

I think he's doing ok.

[west tide]

im pug

[stoic anchor]

thx ok

[trail bison]

leaked logs!!

[west tide]

yooo 90 okayy

[marble oriole]

yoooo

[west tide]

on chimaerus u wanna be group 1 p sure

they put me in group 2 prison

[lilac pendant]

whats the aliexepress version for weapon enchant?

[marble oriole]

what, u dont wanna spend 40k on the good one?!

/s

[lilac pendant]

enchanters are truly the ones pulling the strings of society

[marble oriole]

the real cabal

[lilac pendant]

So, we have a decent cheaper enchant?

or just this

[stuck arrow]

The Ali Express version was buying a bunch of them a week ago. 😂

I got a stack of 10 for the price single ones going for this week.

[lilac pendant]

wow

[stuck arrow]

The price will drop if you wait.

Just everyone trying to buy right fucking now.

[stuck arrow]

Man's doing work.

[torpid snow]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[torpid snow]

Should I use AA when I have 2 supercharged points?

[swift tinsel]

the first one gets consumed by sectech if playing trickster

[mortal skiff]

Anywhere to see how sub is going in the raids?

[swift tinsel]

warcraftlogs.com

[stone vessel]

surely a missclick

[topaz crow]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[stone vessel]

do normal mode raid bosses enrage?

[lilac stag]

They’re actually not. Up until this week every single craft, even at the 36k+ price was a loss or at most a 500g gain after AH take.

[left ledge]

i prefer to just be the aoe anyways

forced aoe

sectec was waiting to explode on em

[paper trail]

Thoughts on puzzle box for sub?

[swift tinsel]

some have enrage mechanics

[left ledge]

fuck puzzle box

its dogshit

[warm goblet]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lucid jackal]

I think the issue is that sub Cd's do not like up well on that fight

Like u have to hold a lot to get Ur Cd's properly

[left ledge]

i feel like that's every fight ngl

[lilac stag]

That’s ok. We have CDs we can move around.

[left ledge]

you just wont ever have sectec unless you hold a bit

[lilac stag]

[swift tinsel]

this part honestly felt the most awkard of the raid so far

personally

just a lowkey miserable fight

[shrewd lantern]

saladhaar pt 2 is the most awkward

[marble oriole]

yeah i was watching perfecto and he was just like sitting on cds and cp backstabbing at full

[lucid jackal]

Only fight that felt good for sub Imo is probs alleria and nexus king ofc

[marble oriole]

for like 2-3 globals

[lilac stag]

so the play is getting enough haste to have Sectech auto line up with dance.

[left ledge]

nexus king yeah is nice

[marble oriole]

waiting to go punch adds

[shrewd lantern]

do you just hold for beams

[left ledge]

i didnt do alleria

[swift tinsel]

yeah we get to alleria tomorrow

[west tide]

yeah u have to hold somethin or be unoptimal to do good dam on the orbs fs

[left ledge]

all the other fights are kinda ass for timing

[west tide]

it was awkward af

[rose parrot]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[night gyro]

raidbots says i should use double acuity enchants - is there any reason not to?

[west tide]

my boy said he found the timing with puzzlebox to make it all line up i gotta tap in

[hazy breach]

Nope go ahead

[swift tinsel]

the orb timings on dargon

[shrewd lantern]

im guessing going dance sectech strike evis is fine for the aa optimization

[swift tinsel]

and they do the spawn portion then succ

[shrewd lantern]

does aa clone coup

[worldly coral]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[swift tinsel]

ye

and it flurries

[shrewd lantern]

i’ve had multiple instances in raid

where i get coup right after the strike post sectech

[lucid jackal]

And then by doing good orb damage Ur throwing away some st

[shrewd lantern]

so was curious

[lucid jackal]

It's just like, unironically not a good sub raid imo

[swift tinsel]

I personally try and force apex onto coup any time I see it up

supercharged cp or not

but I'm a big vibes gamer

[shrewd lantern]

i mean its fine to hold coup outside dance for a few secs

isnt it

[swift tinsel]

yea

[marble oriole]

i was wondering that like if u have coup up a few globals b4 dance do u just hold it

[swift tinsel]

you're holding finishers anyways for a few sec to farm sht

[forest moss]

is there a reason to hold sparks?

[swift tinsel]

ye I just backstab at high energy to not cap

[shrewd lantern]

spark gear kind of sucks outside the 2 crafts for embellish

[swift tinsel]

then full send cds and usually have 4-5sht before sectech grants more

[stuck arrow]

I don't think it's that bad.

Sub looks worse than it is because no one has tier yet.

[forest moss]

yeah i would craft dagger + belt

[shrewd lantern]

i mean you can

if you choose not to go pvp bracer

and pvp belt

[west tide]

i feel this slightly but its less about sub and more about melee, like id feel equally as bad as sin or otl i think

overall

on that boss prolly less so on other specs

[shrewd lantern]

i gotta scroll down

to see a non int class

on details

[stuck arrow]

Some of the mechanics straight up aids for melee. 😂

[torpid snow]

Not always sometimes you just press solo Shadow Dance

[west tide]

theres just no mechanics for ranged

[shrewd lantern]

play devo omr

vibes

[west tide]

hell naww

[swift tinsel]

you're only pressing dance without sectech in the 2nd dance in blades

[stuck arrow]

There's also several times in raid with like straight up 5-10s RP moments where melee can't hit the boss but ranged can.

[west tide]

im a frost mage lover

[stuck arrow]

😂

[shrewd lantern]

man is a paint dry enjoyer

lowkey tempted to go off maghar to not be annoyed i have to press it before cds

in case it gives haste

[lucid jackal]

I'm not looking at logs

Looking at like, how the fights actually play

[swift tinsel]

yeah tier isn't gonna help when timers aren't good

[lucid jackal]

It will help just not fundamentally

[swift tinsel]

well ye

lil bandaid bump

[stuck arrow]

That's fair. Timers kinda suck for CDs.

[shrewd lantern]

we’re all just here until sin gets a week 2/3 mythic buff

then people will say it has good funnel damage

or some meme shit

[vale osprey]

What was a cute lil pre-raid sim for you guys? Got mine to ~56k going into raid tn

[stuck arrow]

I was simming around 61k pre-raid.

[dusk badge]

Is it just me or does Rogue feel low key ass

[shrewd lantern]

*melee

with current tuning this is a terrible melee raid

[west tide]

all the other little shitter adds being blendered on other fights its chill

st chads we up

[shrewd lantern]

tbf we are a blender shitter adds spec

when they line up

at least

[lucid jackal]

I think fury is really good

[lucid jackal]

Rogue feels very average

Fury might be the best melee this tier

[stuck arrow]

Tuning not quite where you'd want it to otherwise not really have utility, particularly given the fights.

[warm marlin]

peep ur guidon privilege bud

i only speak to those blessed with the loot

[lilac stag]

Be interesting to see what tuning hits next week

[keen dome]

[swift tinsel]

You’re not still on imperator are you

[upbeat sorrel]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

Appreciate your very unbiased and insanely informed tweet

[shrewd lantern]

Well none of the specs feel particularly great

maybe paladins is an outlaw boss idk

[warm marlin]

can't believe we are witnessing the first ever guy doom and sandbag

rogue must be really broken

[west tide]

yeah they look super sweet

[spiral needle]

man just wants to shoot bosses with his pistol

[stoic steppe]

Guys, any1 else have an issue with coup tracking? I mean after i hit 4 unseen blade im not getting coup buff and icon

[lucid jackal]

Dude it's true

[warm marlin]

yeah you need to combine the eviscerate tracking and the escalating blade tracking

only one is accurate at a time

[lucid jackal]

Not doom not sandbag

Real news

[stuck arrow]

Good thing they giga buffed havoc. 😂

[warm marlin]

read it and weep bud i'll be posting this all week

[spiral needle]

there's always a chance for final boss to have execute gimmick and sin to rise up

[lucid jackal]

LOLOLO

[warm marlin]

not cherry picked data!

[stuck arrow]

Oooof.

[swift tinsel]

that's fucking hilarious omg

[lucid jackal]

Rogue damage is just so average rn

[swift tinsel]

gonna be so blessed come tuesday

[dusk badge]

Pre patch I was actually doing decent.

[shrewd lantern]

brother prepatch dont matter

[warm marlin]

trust we are about to go astronomical with this tier set

[spiral needle]

great job applying atrophic, the team appreciates your contributions

[shrewd lantern]

Press nk trinket

kaboom

[swift tinsel]

gonna get another 5% backstab buff

[upbeat sorrel]

whats the best hero talent for sub right now? is it trickster or reroll warlock/hunter

[swift tinsel]

maybe another bp nerf

[shrewd lantern]

reroll yeah

[wet atlas]

does it make sense to craft 2 daggers?

[warm marlin]

I need them to buff eviscerate so I can ignore my aoe spender and keep pressing my st one on 2 target

[wet atlas]

with sparks

[swift tinsel]

nah best we can do is change the animation of evisc

no numerical change possible

[warm marlin]

my giga cleave value (pressing eviscerate)

[lilac stag]

Outlaw tier really fell hard yesterday.

[swift tinsel]

or they add evisc back to nimble

[eager yoke]

i keep trying to use a shadowdance before a boss pull to get 2 supercharged combo points but it doesnt seem to work at all

[upbeat sorrel]

no craft dagger and belt or some other armor piece

[shrewd lantern]

considering offhand is like the worst slot

[molten locust]

so many races have a bad animation

[warm marlin]

can't believe eleem lied to me like that saying removing evis from nimble wouldn't be that bad smh

look at us now

[sick jackal]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[winged anvil]

Played sub rogue for the first time last night in raid. I think I've got a grasp on the rotation but something still feels weird to me in the opener.
When I use both charges of Dance during Shadowblade, SecTec comes off CD before I get my first charge of Dance back. Do I send a SecTec outside of Dance to let me Dance recharge, or do I wait for Dance to come off CD before I SecTec again?

[spiral needle]

outlaw simming middle of everything else means it was kind of doomed for raid at the start

[mental kettle]

!embelishment

[spiral needle]

hardest spec to do sim perfect damage

[swift tinsel]

nah outlaw will ascend to the heavens

[steady copper]

guys am I an absolute degenerate or is stuff just constantly pulling you out of stealth in certain dungeons?? I just got back to wow late TWW and I'm so confused

[spiral needle]

gluck when raid mechs are involved

[swift tinsel]

just wait

[warm marlin]

"oh they removed regular evis from nimble, but it's net neutral because they also buffed nimble fom 50% to 75% so it's about the same overall" -> proceeds to nerf nimble back to 50% but now you have no passive cleave

so you just suck on low target

[tired heart]

Nope that just happens.

[swift tinsel]

auto attacks go brrrrr

OH

[steady copper]

its his a known bug or is this a feature ... ??

[west tide]

they look good lowkey i saw ostdarva crank

[swift tinsel]

another auto attack buff inc

[hazy breach]

Yeah no counterplay

[swift tinsel]

OR

instant poison buff

HUGE

single target

[shrewd lantern]

its just pulsing aoe dmg

[lilac stag]

It’s no rogue tier.

[swift tinsel]

suddenly Dark Brew bis capstone

[eager yoke]

bump

[stuck arrow]

Poisons so troll on Sub. 😂

[spiral needle]

nerfing sub AoE based on massive non-seasonal pulls M0s is like when they nerfed tank damage based on that

[celest ice]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[swift tinsel]

bc of the poison proc chance part

[torpid snow]

Exactly that what I mean sometimes it happens that I have 2 supercharged points and my AA isnt active should I press SS then?

[tired heart]

A bug that's existed for years now. I wouldn't count on it being fixed.

[swift tinsel]

it meets the criteria

[keen dome]

yes

[steady copper]

that is depressing

[shrewd lantern]

its not a bug its just the instance has pulsing aoe

[obsidian spade]

I got a champ track dagger. Do I send crests for 263 MH and use sparks for other stuff or do I still craft a weapon?

[shrewd lantern]

and aoe knocks you out

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/gandalf-lotr-fly-fools-gif-5144058

[steady copper]

its happened when I am not in aoe

[shrewd lantern]

honestly stealth barely matters for sub

[steady copper]

unless the aoe is global

[shrewd lantern]

ironically

no the aoe just hits everyone

[warm marlin]

#subtlety message

[hazy breach]

[shrewd lantern]

nowadays you barely lose anything if you already had tfd prepped

[steady copper]

😠

ok banger, I absolutely hate that

[smoky bough]

I just got the trinket from the world Boss with crit. I cant find it in and List. Is it viable?

[vale pine]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1476887002019270761/Midnight_s1_fixed.png

[celest ice]

am i understanding this right that we do the ancient art tech, basically only one time per dance since first supercharged cp goes to sectech so we have only 1 left and we SS if 5stack+ Stechniques and ancient arts is not up

[shrewd lantern]

thats a question for raidbots

[shrewd lantern]

it really makes no difference

in aoe you’d just storm into cds anyway

[steady copper]

it makes a difference for me 💔 🥀

[shrewd lantern]

windrunner spire has a random pulse aoe

from the mobs

[warm marlin]

wait another one #subtlety message

gg

[shrewd lantern]

instant burst looks goodge

who woulda thunk

[steady copper]

idk its just annoying when I think I can shadowstrike to a mob but instead I get cucked and have to step or run

[shrewd lantern]

strike a random mob on the gather

[warm marlin]

i was simply wrong on the timing, thought it would take until after heroic week

[steady copper]

well that is my point, I get pulled the second a mob is pulled in some instances

pulled out of stealth I mean

[shrewd lantern]

This is why you pull for the tank

[west tide]

guys if u need puzzlebox if u go with all leather agi lootspec its the only item u can get

[shrewd lantern]

absolute chad moment

[west tide]

tap in

[steady copper]

real

[steady copper]

this is fr we had full leather group and got 2 puzzleboxes

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah but puzzlebox stinky

[wise fulcrum]

Is sub really the best spec? Or are higher quality players playing it, thus making it the best? If it is the "best", why exactly?

[shrewd lantern]

2mins+channel time

[steady copper]

always has been

[warm marlin]

no one knows best spec yet

[shrewd lantern]

This isnt a melee tier

[warm marlin]

they all look kinda mid on some important fights

[shrewd lantern]

all rogue specs are meh rn

[warm marlin]

every boss we kill is just 8 ranged at the top of meters

[olive canyon]

realistically, play whatever you want regardless - but each spec meets a dps profile. Sub will be fine on some fights where its burst is good, if its say 2 target cleave then its a major yikes

[random trench]

I might be just dumb but i dont see anywhere in guides how many targets do i need to start black powdering instead of evi

[olive canyon]

assassination likely gets stronger and probably buffed

its 2 for bp

[stuck arrow]

Copium but maybe all the mythic mechanics only effect ranged. 👀

[warm marlin]

xd

[shrewd lantern]

thats what ranged players claim

literally every tier

[stuck arrow]

😂

[warm marlin]

most ranged can just ignore most mechanics

unless you're like a warlock without gate up and gotta peeporun

[hot seal]

Trying to find information about sending craft or not and what embellishment

anyone can help me out?

[stuck arrow]

Hey. They had to cancel a cast. That's what worse then not being able to hit the boss for 20s.

[shrewd lantern]

no just be a mage

canceling cast is optional

[warm marlin]

i will say the fights felt mostly melee friendly

wasn't getting griefed at least on heroic

[olive canyon]

dagger can be safe craft with hunt as you can OH if needs be on outlaw and its obv a good mainhand for assa and sub

[warm marlin]

maybe alleria is a bit wack

[shrewd lantern]

just dont press cds

then get poop circle on nk

[olive canyon]

vet crests dont really matter after this week, so if you want to max juice, do everything you can - you should have only a few pieces of vet left, then send on those

[hazy breach]

And we wont get buffed because our tierset is good

It is known

[shrewd lantern]

is our tier even good

2p is 9

[west tide]

yeah its everyone friendly theres nothin goin on 😂

[warm marlin]

our tier is objectively good

[shrewd lantern]

and 4p is 5

[hazy breach]

Yeah

[west tide]

our tier is top dam gain

[alpine wraith]

yea tier set is nice

[shrewd lantern]

idk who has strongest leather tier

[hazy breach]

Others 2p+4p is worse than our 2p

[warm marlin]

the second highest tier set in the game is 11% btw

on sims

[shrewd lantern]

prob devo

[warm marlin]

ours is 14%

[west tide]

its us and the boomkin feral

but we gap em in tier sims

[shrewd lantern]

Idk boomkin players sandbag sims

[west tide]

they look good dude

[warm marlin]

ah but tier sims they dont want to

tho ig it doesnt matter much

[west tide]

my boy rerolled feral and in raid yesterday hes like “bro i fucked up”

the ferals feelin it too they thought they were gonna be hot hot hot

[shrewd lantern]

i dont recall how big our mfo tier was

[west tide]

issa boomkin pivot

[warm marlin]

mid 30s

iirc

or some crazy number

[shrewd lantern]

Well

all i can say is

we cant get worse than lou tier bonuses

only up from here

[graceful perch]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[shrewd lantern]

gotta prayge for dagger week mythic 1

aint no one letting the hunter mains play sv

[ripe acorn]

Guys i got lucky on the puzzle box but im struggling to use it/it feels bad. 2 min cd and cast time throws me off im not sure if im using it right… any tips?

[swift tinsel]

I'm just gonna get a myth dagger from first vault trust

once m+ is out

[shrewd lantern]

you use 2min trinkets as a 3min

thats all there is to it

ig if you want to tryhard you can use it 2s before sb is back

[ripe acorn]

Have to press separately right rather than bind to shadow blades etc otherwise it gives item not ready yet error

[shrewd lantern]

to instant go

[ripe acorn]

?*

[shrewd lantern]

well the haste trinkets you need to as well

otherwise they wont extend dance

[ripe acorn]

Well i got that and the ampule thing from the zulaman one

So im chilling if i work it out

[hazy breach]

Thats just how it is

[magic coral]

so when are instances that we would use shadowstrike to proc AA so that we can send it on the second charged CB point of Shadow Dance?

im trying to figure out how this works a bit better im having some troubl undrstanding

[lilac stag]

@warm marlin m0 logs went hard. didn’t even make it to heroic week.

[warm marlin]

ye

its ok we are tier copers now

[shrewd lantern]

guidon tier copers

[warm marlin]

well

my log screenshot was with guidon

so we are well past that already

[shrewd lantern]

how much longer is dance with

[warm marlin]

idk i macroed it to dance like a complete moron for the entire night

[shrewd lantern]

Oh

not ideal

[warm marlin]

i just tried to rip it in silvermoon and apparently im too fast with it

im actually gonna setup ahk and get banned

the gameplan is real

[rustic raven]

did they nerf valeera for the delve boss?

[shrewd lantern]

watch there be some degen shit later

[rustic raven]

heard somewhere that she was nerfed

[shrewd lantern]

where human lets you

[west tide]

what the heck is guidon

[warm marlin]

absolutely she got hotfix nerfed

but you can still do it the same method

[west tide]

oh the trinket u have to press early

[warm marlin]

just harder

[shrewd lantern]

you have to like

rez her insta

when she dies

[cold citrus]

valeera died twice for me on my kill

[west tide]

u can go with a group to get the crests for that shit

5 man it

[gilded ferry]

being underdog is way cooler guys

[shrewd lantern]

Also hope she doesnt tank shit in the poop

thats the real challenge

[warm marlin]

the poop does 0 damage

[shrewd lantern]

the hof for that shit closed anyway

[stuck arrow]

She 100% was nerfed.

My first few pulls it was not bad she lived long. Then she started dying in 20s. 😂

[warm marlin]

you ignore it unless ur giga low

[shrewd lantern]

so

[swift tinsel]

if you could move valeera like a hunter/lock pet

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah for me i just got bored

[swift tinsel]

with a reticle

jfc

[shrewd lantern]

and forgot to kick the cast

[swift tinsel]

you can cloak the cast

[tawdry geyser]

The amount of times I wish I could use pings to tell her where to go man

[swift tinsel]

and take zero damage

[shrewd lantern]

ngl shes worse than brann

[swift tinsel]

been saying that lol

[shrewd lantern]

oh i cant say that word

[keen dome]

@swift tinsel Fuckin' 8% wipe

[shrewd lantern]

she doesnt rando teleport

[warm marlin]

its like 8.4ish

[swift tinsel]

h-how...

[warm marlin]

i dont actually hit 700 baseline without full consumes so im a bit low atm

[hazy breach]

The trinket is roughly 1 additional gcd

[warm marlin]

ye