subtlety

[tropic pier]

i just realized my auto tank misdirect weakaura broke is there an addon or something that replaces it?

or maybe a macro that works with roles or party lead?

[brisk onyx]

almost a 230 cloak

[swift tinsel]

If you sort party by role you can use a @party1 macro

[west tide]

is this trinket workin in the sims

[alpine wraith]

it will need extra implement because it has some quirks i think

[west tide]

is the void research only in this zone or with the trinket on im so confusedd lol

cause those protocols are from the tree

[wind peak]

can I keybind shadow blades into shadow dance?

or will I have to doublepress it

[torpid echo]

i have SB, SD, trinket and SS all in one macro and I press it once

[wind peak]

oh makes sense

will do

[torpid echo]

remmeber that DS wants to storm after SD

[wind peak]

what is DS if I may ask

[graceful osprey]

Darkmoon trinket worth?

[torpid echo]

Deathstalker

[alpine wraith]

yea you get exta points eventually

[maiden quest]

Just came from doing some dungeons and we had a holy priest in it and everytime I got a heal, I came out of stealth? Is it a known bug?

[west tide]

so i nany dungeon if i proc the trinket i get 25% crit chance?

seems crazy

[alpine wraith]

no the effects of the extra protocols are just what the trinket says

as you get them you make it last longer proc more often

and get a bit more crit

[crystal temple]

is there a 90 build yet

[west tide]

well that one isnt a protocol

its the first unlock unless 208 crit is 25% idk lmao

[alpine wraith]

read below that

it gets empowered later

[radiant swift]

are we apexing evis in st? is stec still not worth?

[alpine wraith]

cancelling apex in sec tech is whatever

[radiant swift]

canceling? i ment more forcing apex3 into apex1 for evis in st + dance

was that the optimazaton?

[swift tinsel]

I personally don't force it onto sectech but I do the strike-evisc-strike-evisc in st

the extra clones from sectech help jumpstart stacking

[vast zinc]

when do you slice and dice

[swift tinsel]

you don't

evisc takes care of it via Cut to the Chase

[vast zinc]

cheers thank you

[sly shore]

meters don't show clones do they

[swift tinsel]

nah just logs iirc

[radiant swift]

yeah i wasnt sure if i followed all the convos but i tought i read, that its not worth for stec

[swift tinsel]

been messing around with forcing apex onto coup though in aoe

as long as it means not delaying sectech

[radiant swift]

thats a must

atleast what charrend told me

holding coup for couple seconds to go dance stec storm coup

apparently crazy 3 button aoe

[swift tinsel]

toying with having stacks/full cp and coup prepped into -> dance+storm - coup - storm - sectech and fish for double coup

[radiant swift]

idk mybe

delaying stec tho

[swift tinsel]

its harder now that my haste is doodoo

[radiant swift]

surely the robot knows if good or not

[swift tinsel]

going from 17 sec to 21 sec cd on sectech does not feel nice

[radiant swift]

should be fine if around 20 no

[swift tinsel]

also losing two whole seconds on dance duration

[radiant swift]

u have to hold blades anyway and can send an extra dance+ stec

thats alot tho

[grand galleon]

is there a way to combine 2 buff condition in CDM?

[swift tinsel]

I'm just messing around in dungeons since there's no real content to do yet

[swift tinsel]

no they can't talk to each other

[radiant swift]

best time honestly

even in raid its just normal/heroic

cant even brick that much prob

[grand galleon]

fekin blizzard

[vague spoke]

did they increase the amount of time it takes to go ooc after killing a thing or am i just... idk

[swift tinsel]

omg my mouse is coming soon

was feeling the right click switch dying while leveling yesterday in real-time

gonna replace the switches when I get the new one

[wispy pebble]

im only seing sub rogues lmao

[swift tinsel]

good sub owns

[wet atlas]

did a few dungeons with fresh 90s and my sub dmg feels kinda low compared to other classes

[swift tinsel]

if they were below max level there tends to be some funky scaling

sub-max-level characters are often notably stronger

[wet atlas]

oh ok... how is sub with max level?

[swift tinsel]

big boom blasting

not top of the pile but def good damage

[wet atlas]

i feel like i am running out of dances so super quick and then my dmg falls into oblivion

[swift tinsel]

are you using them on cooldown or when secret technique is available

[pale rock]

We can use adventure crests now right? like, they dont matter at all?

[wet atlas]

well i am using 2 dances in a row in burst and then only when secret t is up

correct?

[swift tinsel]

yeah

[wet atlas]

i feel like a can go afk in between 😄

[swift tinsel]

damage is low though outside of dance so you take the ebb with the flow

yeah that's pretty normal feeling lol

lotta storm, lotta bp

[vivid cobalt]

is there really no option to track find weakness on buffs

[swift tinsel]

makes handling kicks and kidneys a breeze

[vivid cobalt]

blizzard wtf

[wet atlas]

Thanks 🙂

[lilac stag]

The good news is you really don’t need to worry about FW

[wispy pebble]

i tried one dungeon as assa and instantly switched back to sub. What in the snoozefest is that

[proper dune]

hmm, I am making it myself not so handy. I have stealth on keybind 1, but when in stealth or shadow dance, the 1 keybind is cheap shot.. This means I can't re-stealth untill shadow dance is over.

I am so used to have those two on '1'... shittt 😄

[lilac stag]

/cancelaura [nocombat] Shadow Dance
/cast !stealth
/cleartarget
/targetenemy
/cast pick pocket
/cast sap

[proper dune]

Not sure how this helps me. I still would need to change my cheapshop from 1 keybind in stealth bar no?

[lilac stag]

Put that macro in keybind place of cheap shot

and it will cancel dance & stealth you

[proper dune]

yea that is true, but I need to find something else for cheapshot then. Im just so used to have it on 1 hehe. It's a mind f-word 😄

[lilac stag]

f for figure it out

We lost binds. You gave plenty of open keys to choose from.

[proper dune]

yes, keybind isn't the issue. Re-learning however

3rd world problems

[west tide]

oh ya is there any cool pickpocket item

i bet there is somewhere…

[tropic pier]

do you guys recommend having shadow dance macros for shadowstrike, shuriken storm, evisc in addition to the one for secret technique?

or is the latter one used far more

[lilac stag]

You can’t macro strike and dance. There’s a slight gcd delay and it will not work

[minor trout]

We even Strike > sectec to procc apex?

[astral axle]

I've heard this rumor and wanted to know if people have other info. Is it true a good corewright always has his tools?

[minor trout]

I mean I don’t even get why it’s always a dmg gain, wouldn’t it only be a dmg gain if we get more finishers due to it into dance?

[astral axle]

read the last point of apex

[astral axle]

#subtlety message

[minor trout]

Ah ty so it’s more about the clones

[tropic pier]

really? it worked in previous expacs

[hazy breach]

They broke it sometime during dragonflight

Theres a ~0.2s or so delay between entering dance and being able to shadowstrike

[minor trout]

When stating we shouldnt Dance during GCD. Does that mean we should rlly wait until GCD is 0 and maybe lose a lil bit or should we just cast around our soellqueue?

[hazy breach]

Just wait

[minor trout]

Ok that’s what I’m doing waiting Till in sure gcd is over, but might be a bit late due to it sometimes. But prob better this way then missing a gcd during dance

[hazy breach]

Losing one backstab outside of dance is completely whatever

[minor trout]

I had one idea when I was playing on Beta:
my dance lasts 7.2sec. Sectec was 19sec cd, so i was able to fit 2 sectec into blades. Wouldn’t it be better to Delay the 2nd dance to the last 7.2 seconds of blades, so sectec Profits from it?
Only works with enough haste i guess

[plush roost]

My power... is PEAKING!!!

[upper narwhal]

finally a 220 dagger

haste mastery too we take those

[swift tinsel]

lucky, got stuck with haste vers so far

been trying to get the daggers from BV but no luck

[upper narwhal]

ngl ive not ran a single hc dungeon yet

[jade urchin]

the ancient arts proc is the new indicator on the screen right?

[swift tinsel]

yer

[jade urchin]

cause i feel like im almost only shadowstriking in dance

with the new trickster rule

it feels really wrong

[swift tinsel]

the feeling will pass

[jade urchin]

just to be sure, its:
arts finisher > sstrike with 5+ st stacks > finisher > sstrike
for single target?

[tulip light]

at what ilvl do we replace cloak + boots? any estimates?

[wispy pebble]

whoever made that one black didnt run a single dungeon btw

Dude was at training dummies and said "yea thats visible enough"

[jade urchin]

true and real

[tepid trellis]

Turn up the opacity

[alpine wraith]

around 230 both

[wispy pebble]

how? I mean i will just add a buff indicator anyways

[alpine wraith]

if you have the M ones

it may be a bit earlier depending on your other gear

but if you natty drop 2 adventurer ones with decent stat just change them

for stamina

[tepid trellis]

Spell alert in settings. Also last i checked the apex isnt tracked in the cdm

[tulip light]

yeah i just replaced them with 224s i dont bother much

seems fine with what you said

[wispy pebble]

i swear to god......

this will be the norm for every talent change ever right? Blizz taking forever to put it into their weakestPossibleAuras

[bleak wind]

do you know if you can change the icon for it?

[tepid trellis]

Nop

You get shadow shit or nothing at all

[bleak wind]

love that

[jade urchin]

surely itll be added to cdm on raid patch

[wispy pebble]

copium

Surely they should have devs that are smart enought to write something that doesnt require adding every single spell to the cdm by hand

If only there was an addon that lets us put a spell or buff id and then we could customize the way that tracker looks

[jade urchin]

is there any point to still track flawless form?

[icy silo]

first time back on wow since df so we dont ever click slice in combat? since eviscerate gives slice? im guessing we use in between pulls even i come upon a new pack with 6 combo points?

[wispy pebble]

nah if its down just evis

[swift tinsel]

its not the worst idea to use snd before a pack if you're at full cp since premed gives you full cp anyways

premed or storm

[icy silo]

if i come into a pack with 6 combo points while stealthed im ss or eviscerating?

[wispy pebble]

BP 😄 Unless snd is down i guess

[icy silo]

bp from stealth? oh okay i been messing it up

[wispy pebble]

i think so

Haptics probably knows better though

[icy silo]

@swift tinsel

[swift tinsel]

if you have enough shadow techniques stacks ig you can force apex proc if you're at full cp

I snd after packs out of habit personally

[olive canyon]

Anyone got a recommendation for the best delve to spam up by chance on EU?

[icy silo]

what you mean apex procs?

[swift tinsel]

ancient arts

the buff that causes your finisher to spawn a clone

don't have to worry about that until level 90

[icy silo]

oh okay i see it now preciate it

[blazing badger]

I just switched to sub for levelling (I've dabbled but mostly play assass) and what the fuck did they do this spec lol

My bars are so empty!!

[left ledge]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[alpine wraith]

yep that is a change they did

[white badger]

Became the easiest melee spec. Still fun tho.

[thin echo]

Well, fury warr still exists. At the least theyre equal now in terms of "difficulty" lol

[alpine void]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tough umbra]

Are there any race sims yet?

[hazy breach]

Idk to me its insane people say sub is the easiest when assa is way easier

Thats not even mentioning specs where you just press the thing that glows like ret or fury

[warm marlin]

#subtlety message

except panda is same as mechagnome with diff food

[thin echo]

Well sin has more skills and more to track. I wouldn't say sin is easier

[hazy breach]

Does it

[thin echo]

Yes

[tough umbra]

Damn. Haranir down bad.

[chrome palm]

sin is super forgiving sub has more specific timings

[hazy breach]

Keep bleeds up, press your cooldowns when theyre ready

You dont just press everything when its ready as sub

[chrome palm]

dont you?

[thin echo]

I didn't say it was a lot more complicated, no spec is complicated rn tbh since we all got absolutely gutted

[short radish]

hot take: this sub is harder than old sub because of how much sectech desyncs from sblade

[warm marlin]

i think that take is scorching

[hazy breach]

I mean thats pushing it

[short radish]

idk maybe it's because i've only played this for 2 days

and last iteration of sub was 2 years

but im noticing myself sitting on sectech when it feels i shouldn't have

but because i made a mistake using cds 10 seconds ago

i fucked up

[warm marlin]

I think doing the apex optimization optimally is extremely hard mechanically

[short radish]

yeah that also

[warm marlin]

at least at low haste levels

sometimes your sht procs to 5 like 0.05s before gcd ready for old coup style reaction

[short radish]

like to clarify - the skill floor is higher but the skill ceiling is also higher

[thin echo]

The hardest thing about this spec right now is just having a little patience

[chrome palm]

its definitely worse than like getting old shadowcraft as a proc

besides coup you had a gcd to react

[short radish]

i'm not sure how much impact the ceiling being higher is % wise though

[warm marlin]

but strategically i think its lost pretty much everything for planning

[short radish]

i've also noticed it not proccing when it should

i assume its a bug?

[warm marlin]

its hard to tell

[short radish]

[warm marlin]

my ui kinda lags tf out outdoors

im not sure i can trust what its showing me

[chrome palm]

hoping arc adds a way to color stack text based on amount

[warm marlin]

but i def think it sometimes isnt proccing at 5

[chrome palm]

im using this to track sht

[thin echo]

My favorite bug that's still around is randomly getting unstealthed sometimes

[short radish]

pretty sure you can do that

[chrome palm]

text color i dont believe you can change

[short radish]

wait maybe you can't

since its not a resource

woooo blizzard

[chrome palm]

bar color can change

based on stack count

[short radish]

ahh right text

i can read

(i can't)

also am i gaslamping myself

but did weak auras play the GCD animation

because it feels like that's missing when i use arcui

[warm marlin]

can set it up so spells have a gcd thing

it wont show when theyre on cooldown though

[bleak wind]

Gotta love the art decisions sometimes

[hazy breach]

The raid has dark purple floors and mechanics too

[warm marlin]

im ngl dont even have the opacity for that thing on

just been mentally tracking if its up

i was gonna make a buff but uhh

not in cdm unlucky

[hazy breach]

Im fairly sure its going to be in the cdm whenever they decide to update it (ie the cdm) next, which is hopefully before the raid and not in .5

But who knows

[short radish]

do you know where it is?

[bleak wind]

I do like that style of alerts, but not this particular one

Its beyond garbage

[short radish]

ty

[warm marlin]

i dont play with it personally but a friend just put some 0cd spell tracked as a cooldown

and using that for gcd

[jaunty heath]

and what is that spell?

[warm marlin]

for sub id use backstab probably. hes a spriest

[grand wyvern]

eviscerate? also acts as coup tracker

[jaunty heath]

i mean the one in annsie screenshot

[warm marlin]

aa4 proc

[short radish]

ahhh that feels so much better

[warm marlin]

i.e. when you're going to get your shadowcraft refund

[jaunty heath]

cool

[chrome palm]

im using my coup tracker for gcd

[latent folio]

for AOE/dungeon packs, do u spam shuriken storm as ur generator while ur in shadow dance ?

[short radish]

at 3 mobs or higher

[latent folio]

thx

[night sparrow]

Hey guys, typo ? I suppose this is if ancient art is NOT up ?

or do I miss something

[hazy breach]

yes

[night sparrow]

alright ty

[modest lance]

Just logged in for the first time since shadowlands, feeling pretty overwhelmed, would anyone want to share their UI set up/bindings/ CD bars so I can focus on learning how to play this game again lol

[short radish]

https://www.luxthos.com/

this is a good free UI

[modest lance]

Youre my hero, thank you

[short radish]

no wukkas

[plush roost]

At low haste like sub 300~ its difficult and you wont apex every finisher so you need to track when to evis evis.

At 700 haste tho...

Just send and forget on god

Esp with windfuru

[warm marlin]

yeah that was the impression i got

200 haste seems fun

[plush roost]

Thats why i secretly want 200 haste to sim better

Skillcap is way higher

[alpine wraith]

we may get enough of the other stats that make lower than 700 haste better

[plush roost]

Eh id think the opposite would happen

We'd be able to support 700 haste with more stats later

[warm marlin]

you better hope puzzlebox is bad and flag is good

[plush roost]

Just have to wait and see what timings end up being

Also pbox is gonna be on farm for a while anywah

I predict sin buffs into march of quepatchwerk'danas

[warm marlin]

doesnt beloren look like a good sub fight

i guess if its 2mins maybe not but the egg thing seemed like burst would be important

[plush roost]

Thats the fight ive taken the least amount of looks at

Since it wont be on release

So maybe

[warm marlin]

my entire train of thought was: only real damage dealt to boss is in egg revival phase, burst = good

[chrome palm]

felt like you werent supposed to use cds on pull for beloren

phased super fast

[plush roost]

Hmm ig it depends on how long the egg phase lasts now that im looking at it

But ye thats lookin sub rogue coded

Add spawn and whoops sec tec apex coup ezclap

[night sparrow]

Hey, in this situation is there a reason i miss that we still cast SS even at 3 or 4 targets instead of Shustorm ?

since shustorm also procs apex

[hazy breach]

The extra combo points doesnt matter when you are at full cp

[night sparrow]

oh so shustorm does less dmg at 3/4 targets than SS ?

wasnt aware of that, thx

OH YEAH like way less lmao

[hazy breach]

Its not way less, its equal at like 4

[night sparrow]

My tooltips display 11k dmg SS and 1.1k per target on shustorm

[hazy breach]

Ye but tooltips are horrible in wow

[night sparrow]

alright thx again ♥

another one tho (sorry I'm into studying how "new sub" works). If coup is up and sectec comes off cd in 2 seconds, do we dance->coup->SS->sectec to avoid unwanted unseen blade proc ?

even 2.2sec precisely

[hazy breach]

You can

Doesnt matter a whole lot though

[night sparrow]

kk I guess this is less relevant than when dance and sectec cds were lowered by spent cps

ty ty

[sharp rapids]

How do I track ancient arts in cooldown manager? I cant find it

[hazy breach]

You dont as of now

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/316923898501529600/1477362674898702508/image.png?ex=69a47cb5&is=69a32b35&hm=6e88955357183a61884ca628372a4768c7f781f264ead445b2beeff4f28a46b1&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=478&height=214

Only way to track them is with these

[sharp rapids]

How do you get those? I dont have that

[hazy breach]

Should be on by default, but you probably have some addon that disables them ig

(assuming you are level 90 and have the last apex talent specced)

[sharp rapids]

ok ill check my addons thanks

[latent folio]

u guys watching any sub rogue streamers atm ?

doesnt matter how popular

[sharp rapids]

spell alert opacity was bugged. messing with the slider brought the graphic back

[bleak wind]

did they change the tooltip of spells for fun... how are things still not working as described

[alpine wraith]

ehehe

[modest lance]

Guys I cant get eviscerate to show up on CD bar pls halp

[alpine wraith]

why do you want evis as a cd

[lilac stag]

Easy way to visually see coup

[lilac stag]

usual suspects. addon issue or try swapping cdm profiles.

[thick jasper]

saltikok

[tribal blade]

@lilac stag "sub rogue braindead 2 button spec"

[bleak night]

you just got some lucky crits

[tribal blade]

probably did yeah

no shame on this guy though, just thought it was funny

10 mil BP vs 20 mil BP dmg

[frail bone]

I don't usually black powder but when I do, I black powder all the time.

[alpine wraith]

maybe he was DS

[tribal blade]

nah he was definitely trickster

[supple pawn]

is there any way to make macros change icon dynamically?

i.e. eviscerate macro that changes when you have darkest night or coup de grace

[plush roost]

I cant wait for everyones collective realization that our specs variance is if sec tec crits both clones and to despair over it

[alpine wraith]

getting double unseens is more rng

[grim vessel]

flexing on being slightly less mentally challenged

[tribal blade]

sure thing

[supple pawn]

how much do we hate my bars

[lilac stag]

can confirm from every new rogue in here saying assa is harder because buttons.

[pliant topaz]

wait is it not?

[lilac stag]

“I’m sUpPoSeD tO sTrIkE aT 7 cPs?!?!”

[supple pawn]

do we still shuriken storm at 2 targets?

and eviscerate until 3?

[lilac stag]

#subtlety-faq

[supple pawn]

wowhead guide didnt state

oh, sorry ty

[lilac stag]

wowhead should state as well

[supple pawn]

maybe i just missed it u.u

scath do you like my bars

[remote knot]

Trickster Sub w/ So Tricky still the go-to for Delves?

[pliant topaz]

eh thats kinda w/e just oversight in design as usual

this oens funny af

because like, we knew this would happen when they first made the hero talents

[lilac stag]

That’s legit every sub rogue min max since legion.

[pliant topaz]

yet here we are an expansion later

and its like ah yes gg xd nice one

[lilac stag]

so we can symbols during the gcd of DFA for a bigger boom? Surely intentional.

[pliant topaz]

i mean those are just oversights

usually get fixed in a patch or two

this one has been there

since beta of tww

because its brain damaged design

and its still here

[supple pawn]

how come this is?

[lilac stag]

Dance Strike broken since what DF?

I’m surprised they fixed the WM clone dmg

was expecting that to happen later

[pliant topaz]

2 of my other friends who quit got baited by some other friends and bought the expac today and started leveling

they quit again before level 81

like they saw their specs

uninstalled

-90$

[supple pawn]

oh,, you want to cancel ancient arts because you'd prefer to ancient arts black powder and sectech

right?

[pliant topaz]

yea

[supple pawn]

i have a brain

^~^

[pliant topaz]

[lilac stag]

Just refund it

[narrow shadow]

I hope DS never ever ever ever becomes better than trickster

Hate the mark stuff

[lilac stag]

don’t play deathstalker

[supple pawn]

oh, yeah i just wanted to know the why of it haha

i'd need to know especially if tuning made DS better :p

[pliant topaz]

they prob will

[lilac stag]

I’ve been pretty adamant in here. The game changed. If you don’t like it. Quit. I think many are struggling with this lowkey hoping for major changes.

[pliant topaz]

they have sunk cost fallacy or weird attachments

for me it wasnt hard to move on cuz i started what in df beta? so it was w/e

but people who have played since they were 6 its like yea.;

[warm marlin]

renown done, both rogues 90, time to relax until reset

[pliant topaz]

?

go level romis account

bros cooked

[warm marlin]

we will be in good shape if he does NOT make it to 90

[pliant topaz]

bro thinks clavers gonna recruit a new healer by then....

hes busy getting farmed by ap briar support

[narrow shadow]

So verss is now our worst stat for all content?

[rancid sierra]

Gigachad or no

[final cliff]

201 gloves gross

[rancid sierra]

yeah.. 🙁

idk how to fix

[placid storm]

how did you gear? whats the most efficient way?

[rancid sierra]

@placid storm A mix of all content - mostly world quests and rares once 90.

[frosty kettle]

if you have a squad you can also walk into heroics despite being below the queue-required ilvl, worked wonders for me

[shy scarab]

Spam delve it drops 224

[frosty kettle]

what level? and are they quickly solo-able by rogues?

last expac i did not enjoy tanking spiders as rogue hahaha

[shy scarab]

Hahaha i think it was lvl1 i was watching some vids during the night and fell asleep😂

[frosty kettle]

ok nice ill give those a spin, that actually sounds nicer if i have 1-2 guildies around

[rancid sierra]

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/1r18pfs/updated_midnight_season_1_endgame_gear_rewards/#lightbox

[shy scarab]

Just do the speed run one

[rancid sierra]

whats that one @shy scarab

[shy scarab]

Outlaw fucking broken, oneshot mobs

Næææææææææææææææt

[night sparrow]

Hey why first builder in ShD not being backstab to trigger Macabre anymore ?

[warm marlin]

they changed how macabre works and buffed tf out of shadowstrike

[night sparrow]

I mean macabre does flat dmg instead of stacking ikr

[warm marlin]

and storm relatively

[night sparrow]

alright ty

[tribal blade]

it is yeah haha

[maiden oar]

i would like to just say one thing in response: the game will inevitably change again

[tribal blade]

it's just the meme

[maiden oar]

it will not exist as it is right now perpetually into the future

game devs will always change their mind after awhile no matter what feedback they are given (blizzard especially!)

[night sparrow]

So basically all ours top nodes are kinda useless except Shadowcraft ? Nice design🥸 🥸

[maiden oar]

itll be like this for an expansion maybe more than an expansion but saying itll be like this forever and either u accept it or quit is crazy imo

[warm marlin]

macabre lets you cast storm with a dance macro to not get trolled by stance delay

thats kinda nice

just backstab is terrible

can also cast bp in st once for macabre if you have a lot of mastery and potent talented

it's not completely passive

[night sparrow]

okay okay ty

[maiden oar]

does macabre cleave

[warm marlin]

no

[maiden oar]

ok jist making sure

https://youtu.be/FzFPmx96nnA?si=K3B1r80lJb2j2Ik_

[night sparrow]

so is it useful to have 3 binds for dance ? SecTec macro, Storm macro, and "dry" dance button ?

i guess so

[maiden oar]

i have 5

sectech / storm / bp / evisc / trinket blades dance sectech

bp storm are for 2nd dance in blades

since u cant always guarantee its on 0 cp

and sectech will be on cd

its a minor thing but i never wanna lose a gcd by manually pressing dance since i did that sometimes going over my logs from last seaosn

[night sparrow]

Alright ty ty

[night sparrow]

is this true for single target also ? or do you bp second ShD to proc macabre with high mastery ? because my first thought would be cast evis

[maiden oar]

oh i meant i have dance + sectech / dance + storm / dance + bp / dance + evisc as all different macros

unless you meant the other thing in which case its bc you shadow dance twice in blades

[night sparrow]

y y

[maiden oar]

and you cant use a dance + sectech macro bc sectechs not available

and you cant always use a dance + storm macro because what if you have full cp when dance 1 ends

[night sparrow]

but you said "bp storm" are for second dances, but also evisc isnt it ? on single target

[maiden oar]

no

dance + storm is always used when dancing at 0 cp

[night sparrow]

yes

[maiden oar]

due to strike having a delay after entering dance

[night sparrow]

yeah I mean bp macro and storm macros lol

sorry

[maiden oar]

dance + evisc is used in blades to enter the 2nd shadow dance in blades if dance 1 ends and you have full cp

and its st

dance + bp same thing but in aoe

[night sparrow]

yes okay i gotcha

yeah yeah that's the data I was lf, thx ♥

[maiden oar]

np

sry if i explained poorly

[night sparrow]

I asked poorly too lol dw

[maiden oar]

u can just also like

spend and then dance + storm macro

if u dont care

[night sparrow]

true since double dance doesn't cover full blades anyway

[maiden oar]

and sometimes it can be good to not dance back to back in blades

yeah

but if there are adds up or its a dmg amp or some other incentive to press it instantly

i want the macros

its minor tho

[night sparrow]

every little amount of dmg is welcome :> I also tend to dance > coup > ss > SecTec to avoid wasting unseen blades procs

[maiden oar]

sectech first is better

getting that thing on cd asap is the strongest

sim hates delaying it

[night sparrow]

Eleem told me it was minor dmg but was doing it since tww S2 so

[maiden oar]

its different now w static cd

[night sparrow]

I meant if you are 2.2 sec left on sectec

so you can't coup > ss > sectec

can*

[maiden oar]

oh ok

yea

but uh

u know premed bug

u wanna apex coup if u can

[night sparrow]

ha right

[maiden oar]

so sectech first gcd of dance then premed consume to build then apex coup supercharger is good

since u want coup to refill ur cp

so it procs apex 1

[night sparrow]

with the premed bug it might be worthless to do coup first yeah

[maiden oar]

and apexing sectech is bad except in large aoe

[night sparrow]

is there an expansion where rogue wasnt bugged ? like TBC maybe ? lul

[maiden oar]

but apexing sectech in big aoe is apparently not bad bc the phys hit cleaves well

idr the exact numbers on it

tbh i feel like the premed thing is on purpose

but everyone else says its a bug

so i call it a bug

[warm marlin]

is not bad anymore

[maiden oar]

what

[warm marlin]

can just ignore it

[maiden oar]

they fixed it?

[warm marlin]

no the phys hit of st just does about the same as eviscerate

its nbd to apex it

[maiden oar]

oh

[warm marlin]

plus most are premed bugged anyway

[maiden oar]

u still wanna premed bug sectech over coup right

if u have the choice

[night sparrow]

will see, we can hope for the classic 80 lines patch notes for every class except rogue with "All dmg increased/decreased by x%" and "Fix an animation bug"

[warm marlin]

ye apex coup is biggie

[maiden oar]

ok cool

[rancid sierra]

What do you mean my apex coup? sorry new to sub

[maiden oar]

apex talent makes any spender u press w black ( ) around ur guy refill cp

apex talent pt 1 makes cp filliing attacks (that expend shadow techniques) make a clone that copies the attack

copying coup goes crazy

[rancid sierra]

Yeah I understand the refill. So you want to coup the spender after cps refill?

ty btw

[maiden oar]

no

u want to coup to make cps refill

like the spender that causes the refill being coup is good

[tight roost]

Hey, is there a reason i cant spent my last skillpoint in the apex Talent

[night sparrow]

Because you are level 89 no I have no idea

[maiden oar]

u dont wanna sacrifice ur rotation as a whole to force it

[rancid sierra]

Ok - so say sectec is on CD in dance as it should be, and you have coup would you spend cps on like.. black powder to reset so coup is apexed?

sry is that is confusing

[maiden oar]

no uh

if u wanted to force it ud auto attack at max cp pre dance and pool coup into dance

[tight roost]

Im Level 90 and when I Play Assa I got all 4 points and passive, but on sub I only got 3

[maiden oar]

u dont like have coup and 4 sht and keep shadowstriking until it procs

just send the coup in that scenario

[night sparrow]

was jk, I have no idea bro :<

[maiden oar]

idk either

[maiden oar]

send coup w/o apex

[night sparrow]

did you reset your internet box

[maiden oar]

bc u can guarantee coup on apex before the dance is pressed if theres adds or an amp or smth

in most cases

[tight roost]

I was Like playing sub without Bugs ? No way

[maiden oar]

and cycling disorients/ubs is good

sectech clones hitting generates sht + premed the builder after sectech means if u coup after sectech itll be apexed almost always

w minor sht pooling pre dance

if u enter dance with 2 escalating blades and go sectech -> premed builder (3 ebs, didnt proc double hit) and its 4 or less targers

can go bp -> strike (proc apex and 4 ebs) -> coup

if u didnt pool ebs

[pastel quarry]

I'm not in this convo but I'm trying so hard to understand all of this lol

[maiden oar]

but usually if u want to u can enter dance with 3+ ebs

[rancid sierra]

im in it and still trying to understand @pastel quarry

[night sparrow]

lol was thinking the same, didn't think new sub would be this deep compared to tww

[maiden oar]

sry

[night sparrow]

that's pretty cool. I liked the deepness of tww sub tbf

[pastel quarry]

not like I'm doing anything outside of questing but I've just been sending off whatever I have when I have the proc :p

[maiden oar]

yea i love tww sub

[warm marlin]

the theory behind what grouch is saying is much more complicated than the actual gameplay implication, which is mostly just pool procs a bit

[rancid sierra]

I was just dance > sectec > SS > BP spam in dungeons

didnt know there was so much more

[maiden oar]

im not spreading misinfo right

i assume its true that forcing apex coup by means other than pre dance pooling is bad

ik it was when i last checked but idk if sim wants to do it now

[night sparrow]

WAIT don't we storm on 3+ targets on dance now ? I feel like that spongebob meme lmao

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-spongebob-reading-meme-spongebob-eyeball-reading-two-pages-gif-8397699332299369323

[rancid sierra]

I think it's storm on 2+ targets unless youre in dance you shadowstrike.. @night sparrow

[warm marlin]

robot man will pool coup for dance at least a bit, so a very large portion of coups will be apexed because they follow right after sectec

[maiden oar]

yea

i mean uh

[warm marlin]

in st, you do apex optimization so it's probably also apexed with a decent amount of haste/the haste on use

[maiden oar]

bp over coup in aoe to guarantee apex on it

vs sending coup asap

[warm marlin]

in bigger aoe, afaik no one has tested whether it's worth forcing apex on coup after recent bugfix to the nimble thing, but a lot of those will also be apexed due to the nature of how coup procs

[maiden oar]

yea

last i checked send coup = good

but idk now

[night sparrow]

so do you skip coup by casting bp right before dance + sectec -> apexed coup ?

[warm marlin]

nah just backstab at max cp

[night sparrow]

ha alright yeah I'm dumb otherwise you have no cp for sectec

[warm marlin]

it takes like 8 full seconds to build back to max anyway

depending a bit on your sht procs

also u need to pool energy now for dance macro anyway

[night sparrow]

yeah and that's shitty lol

[warm marlin]

because you dont get the symbols insta energy anymore

sad!

[maiden oar]

i miss symbol

[night sparrow]

bring back instant energy from symbols when entering dance

[warm marlin]

easy fix

[night sparrow]

Welcome to Blizzard Entertainment Ryldd

but since we autoattack a bit to stack sht it's not that important. But would be nice QoL anyway

[maiden oar]

bingus did u figure out if a specific delve tier is required to get 227 gear

i have determined that the memory pit delve in harandar is this days fast rogue delve

[warm marlin]

i think the warbound stuff can drop at 227 as early as like t4

[maiden oar]

u just pull dinos onto monsters and blow them up 3x and go boss

[warm marlin]

or t5

[maiden oar]

icic

[night sparrow]

just finished a delves 4 and got 220. Unless it scales based on your current ilvl ?

[warm marlin]

the warbound procced items are higher ilvl

titanforge lite

[night sparrow]

okay, aint got any warbound so far but was my first 4 so idk

[warm marlin]

t7 drops 224 soulbound

[night sparrow]

nomnom

1h md on Valeera tank op

[warm marlin]

she died on the first pack in a tier1 delve I did while levelling today, and in t7s at 90 she's a raid boss

very strange

[rancid sierra]

• So - I know it makes sense, but can someone make this easier? I cant track ancient arts in BCDM, and you just...spam shadowstrike?

[dusky tundra]

is there any addons that will play a sound on ancient arts proc?

[night sparrow]

the only way to track it easily is 100% opacity gameplay alerts and having those ( ) things around your char afak

[maiden oar]

need spell alerts on

[night sparrow]

I miss the gunshot releod sound from weak aura :< was pretty satisfying

[maiden oar]

u press shadowstrike at full cp and 5+ sht stacks if u dont have ( ) around ur man

as trickster with 4 or less targets

[rancid sierra]

@maiden oar where is that setting? combat?

[dusky tundra]

there are situations where u canrt see the () in dungeons

[maiden oar]

search spell alert

idk where it is

[rancid sierra]

just this?

[maiden oar]

yea

[rancid sierra]

kk

[maiden oar]

i want an addon that changes that setting based on spec

i hate it on outlaw and sin

[rancid sierra]

so during that you ONLY press shadowstrike?

[maiden oar]

no

[warm marlin]

if you press shadowstrike, and after casting it you still have 5+ shadow techniques remaining, you get the ancient arts proc (black bars alert).

you then cast a finisher with this buff, and it will spend your sht to refund combo points and spawn a clone that replicates the finisher for big damage.

then, you're back at full cp, but you don't have the buff anymore, so you strike if you have 5+ sht to proc the buff again, repeat.

if your gcd comes up and you don't have 5+ sht, you finish instead of building again

[maiden oar]

if u dont have ( ) and u have max cp and 5+ stacks of shadow technique (and its 4 or less targets and ur trickster) u press strike

ryldd explained it better

[rancid sierra]

readin it now lol

[maiden oar]

is there an addon that changes ur settings based on what spec ur playing

i tried to find one yday and couldnt

[night sparrow]

no idea

maybe a macro ? that set spell opacity to 0 ?

not automated but better than nothing I guess

[maiden oar]

maybe

the outlaw one is so distracting

[rancid sierra]

@warm marlin thaks. I feel like I have a good grasp on sin but this extra stuff with sub im like....??????

[night sparrow]

I'm too old and too broke to buy cocain to play outlaw 🥸

[maiden oar]

and i dont think blindside has changed my decision making once

now that sanguines gone

[maiden oar]

outlaws just adderall spec now

no need to go skiing

[warm marlin]

np, the tooltips are kinda wack but the end result is that you mostly just press 1-2-1-2

ancient arts tooltip is genuinely terrible at explaining what it does

[maiden oar]

yes

the distinction between any button that makes cp and backstab/shadowstrike/storm is very unclea

and i guess shiv and cheap

[finite hedge]

What makes full CP ShS worth it? To proc the shadow clone on evis?

[maiden oar]

yep

[night sparrow]

didn't realized that apex part 1 was also triggered by apexed finishers before this convo lol. I've read "things that consumes sht" so was assuming it was only fillers and fuck it

[warm marlin]

yea that specifically is my main issue with it

[rancid sierra]

@warm marlin I think it just clicked for me with the opacity thing. So basically when dancing, if you have full CP and ancient arts, you spender. When your CP's refill, you wont have ancient arts, so you shadowstrike again to proc ancient arts then finisher...?

the spell opacity thing made it not nuclear science

[warm marlin]

yes

[finite hedge]

Does evis even hit that much harder than ShS? Seems like ShS trucks now

[warm marlin]

unless you don't have the sht to proc ancient arts

then you just finisher

[rancid sierra]

Has anyone done dungs as sub and sin? I'm 225ilvl and havent tried sin. wonder whats better

prob sub cuz burst and shit dies fast

[finite hedge]

Sub is better. Sin is kinda poopy right now

[rancid sierra]

I know ZERO about outlaw so thats prob off the tablE

[night sparrow]

that's a pretty legit question but I guess robot guys figured out SS x2 -> Finisher x2 is better than SS -> Finisher > SS -> Finisher

[finite hedge]

yeah, guess so haha. Seems like evis barely hits harder if at all anymore. But then it has the shadow portion as well

[misty dome]

is the sin apex talent also broken too? i see posts occasionally but no one engages

and am i right in assuming that ours is bugged with sectec?

[maiden oar]

no bc i made an error and left my loot spec as outlaw (did it deep into mfo farm bc i had all my daggers and i wanted to luck into an outlaw weapon from vault)

[finite hedge]

Not bugged just annoying to track to 80 stacks

[maiden oar]

so i have like a lv180 knife and 2 220 swords

before i realized

outlaws fun though

[misty dome]

outlaw felt way slower in prepatch, hopeful that if i go back it'll feel faster with the apex

[rancid sierra]

Does anyone have a sick way they display CP's? I feel like as Sub my CP's are bouncing so fast that I find myself always looking at my lower screen and have had thoughts of maybe changing CP's to vertical next to my char.

[night sparrow]

Play outlaw if you have a fresh 15 years old brain, or being able to play on cocain everytime. Otherwise, I would not recommend it 🥸

it's still fun tho

[rancid sierra]

@maiden oar I got bangers daggers from rares.

[misty dome]

they're slowly fixing my chief complaints with outlaw but replacing them with new concerns

[maiden oar]

i wish that was me

[misty dome]

i loved the speed of it last expansion but it felt way slower in prepatch, but rtb randomness has slowly been getting better

[rancid sierra]

@night sparrow got it, ill stick with sub/sin

[maiden oar]

its much slower than before

sadly

i didnt play much old outlaw bc i mostly raided

but i feel sorry for ppl who loved it

[misty dome]

last expansion it never really hit a good spot imo

[maiden oar]

i think new outlaws fun though i like the 123 rule where at 1 cp / 2+ rtb levels / 3 stacks of opportunity u dont press pistol shot and ss instead

[misty dome]

i finished a fight with a 98 parse, 130 cpm and i was 5th on our dps chart and an evoker blue parsed above me with like 35cpm

[maiden oar]

gives me something extra to react to thats fun

HEHE

wanna see something funny if i can find it

[rancid sierra]

sorry to repost, anyone insight on this? Do you guys just place with combo points low like this?

[warm marlin]

the apex optimization being a thing is actually on the back of shadowstrike being strong

[misty dome]

like i was almost literally sweating IRL on that fight, hitting stuff so much, and i still only came in 5th

[maiden oar]

this was so funny and sad

i came in 5th too

i tried SO HARD

but sub rogue st is so sad

[misty dome]

@maiden oar at least those were 99s

[maiden oar]

yea

[misty dome]

i got beat by a BLUE parse

[maiden oar]

but the gap is 180k

from me to the next 99

so id have gotten smoked by lower

esp if u look @ the hunter and shaman

[misty dome]

my only ever chance at a 100 was ruined on harj by a 0.8% wipe

[maiden oar]

7-800k

[maiden oar]

no..........

[misty dome]

i used tbe consistently in the 90s but i don't really play as hard anymore

don't even have a raid team atm

[maiden oar]

if u want one its not too late

i am rooting for u

[misty dome]

haha i appreciate it

i dunno, we'll see... i'm kind of on the fence about how hard i wanna go this expansion

[maiden oar]

yeah i just play w it like that

[misty dome]

i have friends in aotc raid groups asking me to join but i can't imagine aotc being my goal for a season

[maiden oar]

my source is just "i read the dungeon journal" but the last boss this tier looks really really fun

my excitement for raiding has more than doubled

bc that fight looks like an insane banger

[misty dome]

some of them look fun for sure

[maiden oar]

and the other final fight seems to have a secret phase

[misty dome]

btw, just for confirmation, our apex4 isn't proc'ing on sectech right? like it eats the buff but doesn't give cp... that's a bug right?

[maiden oar]

uh

what happens is if u have premeditation from entering dance / stealth u cant proc the apdx

and bc u sectech first global after entering dance almost always u will not get the apex

[rancid sierra]

One more question, I assume the shadowstrike to get ancient arts thing is only ST? If you're aoeing you dont drop a shuriken storm to shadowstrike, or you do?

[misty dome]

but it consumes the buff though

[finite hedge]

Sure, but it still has to be weaker than an evis for the optimization to make any sense trading a ShS clone for an evis clone

[maiden oar]

i have no idea this has never happened to me

bc my sectechs are basically all premed bugged

[misty dome]

it happens very consistently to me, i'd be fine if it just held the buff for my next finisher but i lose it so i essentially just waste the first proc of it

[warm marlin]

an apex eviscerate approximately does the damage of 1.8x normal eviscerates, because of various buffs to shadow/clone damage and armor meaning the 50% clone damage is more like 80%.

thus, consider two 4 global sequences, both starting at max cp, no ancient arts buff

1: strike, apex evis, strike, apex evis -> 2.0x shadowstrikes, 3.6x eviscerates, end at 7cp no aa buff

2: evis, strike, apex evis, evis -> ~1.6x shadowstrikes, 3.8x eviscerates. The 1.6x shadowstrikes are because you may proc an AA1 clone off the shadowstrike because you aren't casting it at 7cp. End at 0cp no aa buff

the net result is that you cast slightly less eviscerates overall (obviously because you're mega overcapping cp), but you get a lot more shadowstrikes

the math gets a lot more complex with shadowed finishers and weaponmaster, but generally u get the idea

[maiden oar]

what should happen is u enter dance at full cp -> press sectech (cant proc the thing because of premeditation being up) -> your shadow techniques are not reduced because u cannot proc the thing

so im not sure

bc i think it consumes the sht to fill ur cp

and if it cant consume the sht due to premed bug

[rancid sierra]

Is this ST and AOE?

[maiden oar]

the apex going away and no refill doesnt come at any cost because ur shadow technique stacks are intact

[rancid sierra]

it shows on ST and AOE page so want to be sure.

[maiden oar]

not sure if thats whats happpening but thats how it should theoretically work

[misty dome]

actually yeah you're right, it doesn't consume the shadow technique stacks so it's just an annoyance

[maiden oar]

says 3 or less here

ive been saying 4+ bc i heard its like neutral and a prio gain on 4

but maybe thats evil and should be 3+

[misty dome]

i feel like a lot of these are pretty small optimizations right now too, but we'll see when there are log parses to compare

like they have been trying to reduce the skill gap, so skill expression doesn't amount to massive dps swings anymore

[maiden oar]

this is like 1.5 %

on st

[rancid sierra]

so 3+ targets you still shadowstrike for ()

[maiden oar]

i think in any non target dummy fight this can never be true

[maiden oar]

i meant 3 -

i typod

[misty dome]

or, i guess, to your point, they are moving the skill gap from rotation to fight positioning/strategy

[rancid sierra]

so basically you shadowstrike for () before you dump with black powder

[maiden oar]

to some degree yeah but i think little minmaxes add up

[maiden oar]

yea at 4+ targets u can just ignore that though

can be a prio gain for some aoe loss but

not worth worrying about for most situations

[misty dome]

i'm too much of a min/maxer to not be aware of what's optimal... even if i'm not doing it heh

[finite hedge]

Wouldn't #2 be more like 1.8 ShS? You get a ShS clone.

[pastel quarry]

I'm enjoying reading all of this even if I don't know if I will ever be able to put it in to practice

[warm marlin]

in blades it'll only be like a 60% chance

but ya in regular dance

maybe more like 1.6x strikes

[misty dome]

hah you'll be fine i'm sure, curious brain already puts you ahead of most people

[pastel quarry]

I think I just need to read specific talents and stuff more to understand the why and how

[misty dome]

see, that's why you'll be better than people who just blindly follow guides

if you understand why you're doing things, you'll be able to adjust to real fight situations

and, to be fair, things are a lot simpler now

[pastel quarry]

like I get why we'd want to do apex coups, but I don't understand the how of fishing for them while still doing our normal stuff

[maiden oar]

u can just either not finish or bp instead of evisc to preserve your escalating blade stacks

so you enter dance with 3-4 escalating blades

you dont really want to do this for a very long time in st (like 5s max or so, and spamming backstab at max cp is better than bp if ur just hitting a dummy)

but if there are going to be adds or a dmg amp soon then apex coup becomes more valuable

and maybe the time youd want to not send coup goes up

or it could be valuable to force it more aggressively by building at max cp or bping over coup on purpose in aoe situations like m+ after the nimble flurry bugfix but we dont know if thats the case

[pastel quarry]

I guess I'm struggling to understand the managing your dances while just not finishing, wouldn't that be a huge damage loss to just waste your dance

[maiden oar]

u dont

lets say uh

sectech comes off cd in 6 seconds

and u have 4 stacks of escalating blade (coup ready) and max cp

u just spam backstab

then when sectechs up u go dance + sectech -> shadowstrike -> coup (has apex)

instead of sending coup 6s before dance and not having the apex coup after sectech

[pastel quarry]

okay that makes a lot more sense

so if you get coup right before you get your dance back, don't waste it

[maiden oar]

yea

5s is a good rule of thumb but fight circumstances could change it

ryldd said earlier takes like 8s to build to full w/ 0 energy and cp

and u already pool to some degree bcc u want to enter dance w/ max cp

so its not a crazy adjustment to bring coup in there

[pastel quarry]

I'm very new to sub (haven't played Rogue seriously in ages) so even those little things you just said are news to me lol I've just been firing off what I got when I got it and making sure to sectec in dance

I gotta get reading lol

[maiden oar]

new sub and old sub have 1 thing in common: theyre harder to learn / wrap your head around than they are to execute

so do not be too concerned

[pastel quarry]

I appreciate the help

[rancid sierra]

#seemsgood

[maiden oar]

like id say its more complicated than hard

if that makes sense

[pastel quarry]

yeah I get what you mean, I was originally gonna play Assa then I thought Sub would be a little easier but now I'm thinking maybe I was wrong lol

my brain is just 😵‍💫 trying to learn 3 specs at once

[maiden oar]

nah i think once sub clicks u will find it pretty simple

ah

well u can probably focus on the dagger ones they are both easier and have a higher chance of being good

[pastel quarry]

I know I don't NEED to, just trying to see what feels best ya know

[maiden oar]

yea

and also early gearing decisions next season mean u have to like

[pastel quarry]

I haven't really touched Outlaw I've been flipping between Sub and Assa

[maiden oar]

commit to either outlaw or sub/sin at least for the first part of the season

and sub/sin is just by far the safer decision

ah

[vale pine]

good morning lovely people

[maiden oar]

i think both of them are very simple once u get past the initial hump

gm

[pastel quarry]

morning fuu

[maiden oar]

@warm marlin does arcui have a delay between the 3rd/4th escalating blade stack if flashing steel procs

the cdm addon im using rn goes up to 3 and then 4 like .2s later

and sometimes i miss my coup bc of it

[warm marlin]

the game itself has a delay

[maiden oar]

but idk if thats how the game just is

ok

[tribal blade]

HELLO

[warm marlin]

shit sucks

[maiden oar]

hehe

[warm marlin]

i know what u mean tho

[maiden oar]

idk if i try and react to it and be pro

[warm marlin]

it feels worse than tww3

[maiden oar]

or just refuse to compromise not queueing gcd instantly in dance

and accept the loss

[tribal blade]

i'm using CDM and it definitely has a delay

[maiden oar]

yeah it SUCKS

[warm marlin]

i think its outdoor lag

[tribal blade]

long enough to be annoying

[maiden oar]

I HOPE SO

[warm marlin]

thats my scapegoat for everything rn

[tribal blade]

happens to me in dungeons too

[warm marlin]

nop nop nop im safe in instances

[tribal blade]

but i'm not a good person to base it on because i play with 200ms

[warm marlin]

nothing bad will happen in there

[tribal blade]

🙂

[vale pine]

oh wow

[tribal blade]

i'm slowly getting my haste up, at 15% right now

[warm marlin]

30 man raids week 1, notorious for their lack of lag

[tribal blade]

yeah sucks /cry

[tribal blade]

can't wait for the fps fiesta

[warm marlin]

nah bro they nuked all the bad guy addons so now the game is gonna run great

[tribal blade]

we're likely gonna have helpers in getting a free kill to max out gear drops

[tribal blade]

TRUEE

[maiden oar]

my cope is the numbers are smaller so its less taxing to calc everything

[warm marlin]

[maiden oar]

surely

[tepid trellis]

Lol

[hollow spear]

People out there outdoor-maxxing and it's in a video game

[night sparrow]

do you guys use Sensei Ressource Bars ? Sometimes when I log on alt and play with my custom vanilla UI profiles it resets my bars position and appearance

[maiden oar]

i think it has to do with the edit mode profile

but i dont know bc im using atrocityui

[tribal blade]

i think there might be some global setting option possibly

i might be mixing that up with platynator

[hard trellis]

whats fastest delv

[night sparrow]

kk ty

[tribal blade]

not logged into wow but i'm pretty sure i mixed up my memory with platynator haha

[night sparrow]

HA

dw :>

[vale pine]

game seems laggy today, anyone else experiences the same?

[alpine wraith]

yea outside it is quite laggy

maybe more people getting to max lvl

[tribal blade]

yeah was laggier than usual for me

also had intermittent game freezes

[tulip light]

are sims accurate at the moment regarding trinkets?

[alpine wraith]

they will likely change a bit

they buffed all dmg trinks

[hardy agate]

Is it a bug that after our first shadowstrike opener the ancient arts indicator shows but we wont get the combo points back after the finisher? or what is the reason for that?

[alpine wraith]

i still hope they buff the flask trink so we can play a 1:30 instead of puzzle for m+

you still need to have 5 sht at least even after the proc to get the cp back

or sometimes it lags a big and they come after

oh and also premed bug

remember that one

cant proc ancient with it up

[hardy agate]

i see, i thought it only procs if you have 5 sht. so time to track the shadow techniques buff i guess

[alpine wraith]

likely it is premed bug the one you said

but yea it can be a bit buggy

[hardy agate]

ok yeah really sounds like the premed bug... imagine living in a world where no rogue spec has any bugs.

[alpine wraith]

well there were times we didnt have many bugs

but were badly tuned

so maybe dont ask the monkey paw

[tribal vortex]

So if let's say I am fighting a dungeon boss like gemellus in Magisters'

do I ss? or storm \

he spawns 2 adds

[alpine wraith]

3 targets you can storm

but striking for apexmaxxing also works

just remember to use bp

[tribal vortex]

I was thinking that i don't care too mych about add dmg, so I'd prefer to ss for boss dmg

[bleak night]

Is that the jellyfish

[tribal vortex]

yy

[bleak night]

Bc they share hp im pretty sure

So add damage good

[tribal vortex]

yeah didn't think of that, but if they didn't share ? is there logic to what I am saying or just don't use brain ?

[alpine wraith]

also depends on your haste

if you dont have 700 or so you cant really apexmax well

[lilac stag]

Mate every class is buggy. We ain’t special.

[alpine wraith]

we got the funny ones sometimes

[tribal vortex]

Also same question for BP vs evis ? Can I evis on 3-4 targets for the prio dmg ?

[alpine wraith]

not worth at all

[lilac stag]

Play assa if you want prio

[tribal vortex]

I am an assa main trying to learn sub and outlaw 😛

[alpine wraith]

as sub we kinda just use diff finishers depending on count

[tribal blade]

you'll lose a ton of overall for barely any gain in prio

[alpine wraith]

prio is not really a thing we try to min max although using apex on coup is a thing

[tribal blade]

esp with potent powder BP is gonna do decent dmg to your main target

[tribal blade]

i've been doing that a bunch in some dungeons

but it's hard to tell if it's worth or not

[tribal vortex]

how do you track coup at the moment ? you put evis in cdm ?

[tribal blade]

yes either the evis icon or you can see when escalating blades buff hits 4

[alpine wraith]

think it depends on how total finishers per that dance end up

if you lose 1 maybe we lose a bit of dps but if not it can be fine

or if we lose unseens

[tribal blade]

oh true you could potentially be losing UB procs

also i imagine at high enough target counts apexing BP becomes better

[alpine wraith]

also have to check if flawless is about to drop

dont think there is much a diff in the end yea

[tribal blade]

mm i actually stopped tracking flawless, should maybe start tracking it again

[proper dune]

maybe a bit of a noob/silly question, but I am wondering if you guys use cheapshot/kidney shot during questing or just full blast dps spells mode.

[alpine wraith]

you get it back after the coup but if you use some bp in between maybe it affects overall dps

i use cheapshot quite a bit

it is free after all

[tribal blade]

makes sense yeah

yeah the free cheapshot is worth i think

because the clone strike hits hard

and you get a free stun out of it

[proper dune]

I was using shadow strike from stealth, but been thinking of applying cheap shots

[tribal blade]

past like 87-88 stuff starts hitting quite hard

would be worth using then on mobs

[scarlet heath]

well if you need the stun then use it

with this node you dont even lose that much on dmg

and save yourself some hp

[proper dune]

I am currently 86, almost 😄

[proper dune]

true, forgot that we use that talent. I have it.

[zenith oriole]

Is there a way to reduce shadow technique cooldown? Gameplay loop of sub feels so giga trash

[vale pine]

should be fine

[vale pine]

stabalized now, but was quite unplayable for a bit

[tribal blade]

get more haste

[tribal blade]

ah it didn't get that bad on NA

just felt sluggish at times

[alpine wraith]

yea remember the 700 haste is with wft so even with taht it can feel oh boi

[tribal blade]

yeah i think i have ~500 haste atm

and every dungeon has been without skyfury

and it doesn't feel smooth like maxed out gear on beta and shammy in the group

already been looking to the future and imagining sub in S3 with insane stats UwU

[alpine wraith]

i will likely craft the engi things with haste on it meanwhile

[tribal blade]

i haven't looked into that

are you going down the gear specialization?

[alpine wraith]

yea head boots and wrist

dont need to go deep to be able to use gears

[tribal blade]

ahh cool, non spark gear?

[alpine wraith]

yea also the pvp gear

when hc week drops you can craft 2 items with champ ilvl kinda

and socket them

[tribal blade]

ah ok yeah just looked into it cool

[glacial hinge]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[ashen thorn]

does sub cast slice and dice?

[keen dome]

Nope:

[ashen thorn]

ahhh ty

no rupture feels weird af

[lilac stag]

outlaw color name questioning missing rupture.

[ashen thorn]

outlaw color?

[lilac stag]

you’ll forget about it by Monday.

[cursive vapor]

not really nah

[lilac stag]

You’re chosen role on this server is outlaw = yellow

[ashen thorn]

hm didnt know that, dont think i ever really done outlaw. usually assassination

[lilac stag]

The good news for you is that assa still has rupture if you are missing dots and bleeds that much.

[tribal blade]

losing rupture means sub can go in it's own direction in the future

[ashen thorn]

yeh seems its going the ninja route and shadow clones

[lilac stag]

It also irritates the 8 pvpers who haven’t swapped to devourer

[radiant swift]

u cant before?

[tribal blade]

teehee