The Dks and hunters arent alternating it every 90s, theyre alternating every 45s or with 60s respectively
#subtlety
hazy breach
warm marlin
I think fdk does alternate eventually, its just scuffed at the start
because they actually have powerful 45s so it makes sense to send forge with one of them and double send prism on 130 and 3min, and alternate after that
so a bit more thinking than our stuff for sure
tribal blade
my raid team has been accusing me of fuciking up the bait on orbs on platforms on dimmy this entire time
and they just figured out i was right
one of the knockers was doing it
i have been redeemed
civic lake
!wa
wicked joltBOT
maiden oar
I think fdk does alternate eventually, its just scuffed at the start
is fdk kinda like sub rogue?
i hear its dmg profile is similar but i assume its less flexible
is it still interesting to play or not as much
lilac stag
It’s 3 buttons instead of 9
maiden oar
warm depot
!wa
wicked joltBOT
warm marlin
i hear its dmg profile is similar but i assume its less flexible
fdk and sub are quite similar. both 90s burst specs. fdk has a very powerful 45s burst cd (stronger than a sub dance for sure) that they cast with their 90s and need to instacast between cds to not grief their timings, so not really flexible.
their damage outside of cds is also quite a bit better than sub's
though not really great
maiden oar
is it stronger than 2 dances
b2b
like in a situation such as dimmy platform if they do 45s pillar and i do 2 dances am i the best or are they
warm marlin
their 45s are quite frontloaded so it depends on when you both press
warm marlin
if you can get both sectecs off it might be stronger
tribal blade
ok i'm gonna try not sending a 2nd cd set on P1 dimmy
because i'm landing on platform 1 with everything on cd for an eternity
maiden oar
ok i'm gonna try not sending a 2nd cd set on P1 dimmy
we had 2 buyers this week and i just sent 2nd cd set on p1 and dances on artoshion and flag on pargoth with autumn
works if ur not pushing pargoth insane fast
no autumn = hold for winds and fly very quickly
maiden oar
yeah for some reason our guild likes to push asap first phase and first platform and then wait for winds on pargoth
but it was a little strange bc of 2 buyers it was almost good to flag on artoshion but i think id have regretted it (or almost regretted it to the point where itd be too risky to go for it)
maiden oar
the way i was looking at it is that theres less competition for the adds if u flag on plat 2 instead of plat 1 (assuming 1 flag in p2) but that could be psychotic
are u getting a flag on pargoth too
tribal blade
nah i'm not flagging pargoth
no need
def won't get it back for burn
that platform is going pretty fast in my raid
warm marlin
we had a buyer and 2 dead and almost still pushed before winds
was like 1s off
plus pargoth flag is scuffed without autumn
blades is over by the time adds get in
maiden oar
yeah i got blades on my cb sectech on the adds
but not on the coup
but i think they died kinda as that coup was ticking
so could be worse perhaps
maiden oar
plus pargoth flag is scuffed without autumn
i was doing non autumn timing for some reason but i probably should just hold for like 2-3s
oh well goes out the window next week
maiden oar
just tried it
good comms btw ty will keep in mind for 15%
wispy crystal
can anyone help me understand why Outlaw is superior to Sub for M Soul Hunters?
i tried outlaw in M+ and im literally doing half the DPS of my sub rogue
warm marlin
outlaw has very very strong low target cleave and it can shoot the bosses in the air during intermissions to pseudo spread cleave them like ranged can
maiden oar
outlaw has very very strong low target cleave and it can shoot the bosses in the...
wtf
thats insane
that hits 2/3 of the bosses only right
the middle guy and the air guy u shoot?
warm marlin
ye
maiden oar
ah ok thats still good and funny
warm marlin
its still also not really much better than sub
they are quite close
very much a play what you're better at fight
maiden oar
yeah
do u think next week u might need autumn on plexus if u skip the final intermission
i am coming to that conclusion and i dont like it
warm marlin
my raid doesnt do damage so no
maiden oar
oh ok
warm marlin
but yes autumn very op in that case
maiden oar
autumn works on lily right
warm marlin
no
warm marlin
im not even convinced skipping that intermission is good
maiden oar
i dont think its good
warm marlin
even with autumn you wont get full flag
warm marlin
on that fight specifically
maiden oar
if i theoretically used the mfo portal thing that activates with the skip and secteched one of the guys who flies in on a boat before salhadaar
and then teleported back to the main raid area would i keep disorient
maiden oar
on that fight specifically
ok dont say anything then
warm marlin
i dont think you change instances
so it should be fine
ive never needed to do that tho
maiden oar
im doing rclc stuff and trading all the items
and sometimes i have to chase someone down outside of raid
so it helps if i miss trash
maiden oar
there are some bug things by soul hunters that respawn
critters?
or the trash monsters
warm marlin
yeah
maiden oar
warm marlin
at the pavilion to the back left of them
warm marlin
my goat predisorient anti variance machine I will always hunt down the location of every critter in the instance for you
maiden oar
yeah i hate getting the 3 stacker in my opener
well
i guess for dimensius also
u could take the portal to nexus king area and hit a boat man
if u didnt get to sectech before wipe
just tell them ur waiting on flag cd
warm marlin
dimensius i just cry and pray i proc 2p in opener if we ever die to devour or something
warm marlin
its way too long a run no
maiden oar
i dont know where the teleport pad in dimensius room is
so i cant answer
if you can just take the tp to the docks whack a boater and tp back its fine
warm marlin
i dont think there is one
tepid trellis
Back left of the room
warm marlin
guess im blind
maiden oar
we are so back
tribal blade
ok i don't know anymore
if not sending 2nd cd set in P1 is better
it seems all over the place
fuck turbo boost
maiden oar
fuck turbo boost
🗣️
tribal blade
ok talked to my RL and he thinks holding cd set for plat 1 is the move, so just gonna do that
since we have not many issues in P1 anymore, platforms are more fucked
maiden oar
maiden oar
glgl
tribal blade
no use getting tilted over something you can't control
maiden oar
yeah
assuming a boss with like 2:50 killtime how would i tell what trinket combo is ideal
could be forge passive or prism passive or forge prism
idk how to get sim to delay 2nd flag for forge
or for more prism stacks
tribal blade
hrm
forge on pull then send 2nd cd set with prism at ~2 mins?
no wait 2:30ish you can send 2nd cd set
bit before that
like 2:20-25
correct me if i'm completely wrong like a numpty
maiden oar
yeah
maiden oar
but we love prism
tribal blade
yeah it's pretty cracked
tribal blade
no idea if it even will naturally haha
fossil forge
Inshallah we need to slay daddy dimmy before next raid buff
maiden oar
i think plexus killtime could be like really bad with final 3%
so im not sure how to make the best of a 3:00 or 2:5x kt
minor spruce
What's the usage of Netherprism?
fossil forge
With the extra 3% dimmy will be hella scuffed
ivory vigil
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
ivory vigil
does this here apply to m+ too? Or you hold prism for mega pulls? For example if the third pull is the biggest forge-forge(by holding SB for 30s) -prism
chrome palm
worse than wiping
maiden oar
worse than wiping
i was thinking about this and i looked @ the top logs for plexus and cut them off at 3:00
and the number was higher than the final number
so maybe its not the end of the world next week
unless thats not what putting ur mouse @ 3:00 and dragging all the way left means
void ocean
anyone knows whats with EU servers, is it maintenance o some sorts?
distant sage
tribal blade
Inshallah we need to slay daddy dimmy before next raid buff
i think since i'll be holding cd set for plat 1 it'll actually benefit me when we get the +3%
tribal blade
worse than wiping
that's big sad
tribal blade
that's what we call a 1st world problem
alpine wraith
who knows
jolly sleet
phase 3 of remix
last gate
new phase
last gate
phase 3 of remix
yeah
i was wondering wtf is happening
idgaf about remix
LET ME PLAY MY RETAIL
but hey
jolly sleet
honestly most 3AM-11PM updates are done by 6AM, its very surprising this one is still ongoing
last gate
honestly most 3AM-11PM updates are done by 6AM, its very surprising this one is ...
yeah
last gate
honestly most 3AM-11PM updates are done by 6AM, its very surprising this one is ...
its 8 AM rn yeah?
utc0 i guess
:3
jolly sleet
yeah
hollow raft
nah. its 2
last gate
yeah its 2
WTF
jolly sleet
math isnt mathing
last gate
math isnt mathing
++
hollow raft
clock isnt clocking
hollow raft
because its 09.07
jolly sleet
its gmt+1 I guess
last gate
let me see
viral phoenix
wound poison > instant poison for first area of gambit yeah?
I found it was kinda hard to keep stacks high at all w/ not storming that often until cds are over
viral phoenix
but I assume its still worth
last gate
wound poison > instant poison for first area of gambit yeah?
doesnt matter
youre sub
youre not spreading poison
jolly sleet
("the calculations they are not good, kevin")
last gate
give me 2 hours for shower and i will goon for the 1:99 hours
last gate
2 hours till u loot bracers with bad stats
going for raid slot anyway
just need forge / prism / boots
hollow raft
ey its a new dinar item this week aswell isnt it?
last gate
ey its a new dinar item this week aswell isnt it?
yeah
jolly sleet
yeeeppp new dinar !
jolly sleet
bud you're a pokemon
last gate
jolly sleet
thats honestly kinda good parses, gratz !
last gate
thats honestly kinda good parses, gratz !
:3
im still dog shit
sub is
weird
idk
i always find my self in a situtation where flag is ready
but idont have dance
cause i used all of them like a monkey
:3
(my 41 parse reason) xd
jolly sleet
I love the spec, but planning a 24 seconds sequence to output one big sec tech is kinda overwhelming to me atm
last gate
I love the spec, but planning a 24 seconds sequence to output one big sec tech i...
I LOVE IT
play outlaw then
planning 32min sequence to output no damage
fun on its own way
:3
jolly sleet
yeah thats a really good feeling but sometimes it doesn't click anymore and u gotta leave to come back stronger 🙂
fossil forge
but idont have dance
U must not be following the 2 dance in cds 2 dance outside 2 dance in cds 1 dance outside of cds loop
last gate
U must not be following the 2 dance in cds 2 dance outside 2 dance in cds 1 danc...
yeah i know
but my fingers wont agree with me
THEY CLICK DANCE
with SYMB
AND THROW SECTEC
on its own
fossil forge
Well you lose all your damage If you fuck up your dances
last gate
Well you lose all your damage If you fuck up your dances
thats why i parsed 41
tbh
idk how people managed
to parse lower than 41
lol
fossil forge
7m is criminal though
jolly sleet
I played presvoker for the patch and I think I might come back to sub if its ok (yeah, "ok", not even "good") next tier because i really like the fantasy and shadowstrike
last gate
7m is criminal though
yea xd
incase you want more detail about how to waste dances
xd
last gate
I played presvoker for the patch and I think I might come back to sub if its ok ...
in alpha its shit
lets see beta
jolly sleet
yeah i've read the other chan, state is concerning but i'm hopeful
fossil forge
U took fat shit on shamans at least
maiden oar
I played presvoker for the patch and I think I might come back to sub if its ok ...
it might be good even if its bad right now bc in a patch note they basically said: we know its bad and we are sorry and we will give it alot more attention
so surely it pans out
last gate
U took fat shit on shamans at least
they are bots
maiden oar
and with that they fixed the worst part
jolly sleet
it might be good even if its bad right now bc in a patch note they basically sai...
i missed that patch note, ty !!!
Can't wait to play 32 specs on beta to settle on sub
maiden oar
so i think 1) they know what the bad parts are and read us complaining in midnight channel 2) we get extra attention now
maybe im coping
but im sure they can save us
last gate
PRO TIP: ignore other spec playstyle and play sub only
until you get high ilvl
then youre lazy enough to not swap
at all
i want havoc but i dont want to gear it up AGAIN
fossil forge
Abuse sub early play assa later 
maiden oar
i played sin in prog for the st bosses but now im just only playing sub bc its more fun and progs over
i am much happier
WE LOVE SUB
last gate
Abuse sub early play assa later <:garf_sit:1334889429449314456>
I DID THE SAME THING BUT OPPOSITE xd
i played sin until 3k
maiden oar
well my guild wants me to stop playing sub on soulbinder
bc i kill all the adds and they cant parse
so maybe i dont get to play sub there
last gate
then started boosting +7 by sub ( i had 0 sub knowledge so i learned it in 7s)
maiden oar
no its fine
fossil forge
Assert dominance grouch
maiden oar
i think its funny
fossil forge
maiden oar
i already did
i already asserted dominance every single week
except when we extended
i can let up just once
distant sage
first time myth raiding
(got omega cucked on forge we pun adds behind the pool and i got the first set of them)
jolly sleet
bc i kill all the adds and they cant parse
man I swear when i'm playing dps my guild dps are LIONS and when playing heal they hit like toddlers, those adds dont die
maiden oar
hehe
its literall yjust me
im like 2m dps over the next guy
i kill them all in 1 hit
sub rogue is so evil
jolly sleet
13,12 would be a good dps
fossil forge
Ion think i ever got over 10
jolly sleet
gotta push harder
fossil forge
let me lock it in twin
U hold first cds no
Or wats the move even
I havent been on that boss for solong
jolly sleet
first time myth raiding
(got omega cucked on forge we pun adds behind the pool a...
that orange parse is hot
maiden oar
im going 1x on use because there is only 1 flag that matters and i want it to be really big with antenna
this could be wrong but i do it
distant sage
that orange parse is hot
the worst thing about it is that there wasnt a single cold blood cast in that parse
fossil forge
Maybe forge antenna
maiden oar
the dance timers arent exact btw i try and have the sectech hit the second the ccanisters break
distant sage
that orange parse is hot
jolly sleet
the worst thing about it is that there wasnt a single cold blood cast in that pa...
did you keep it for next boss ?
distant sage
did you keep it for next boss ?
nah i was spamming 12 and forgot to cast it since i used skuriken tornado
maiden oar
so if ur just playing for 2mins when all the dudes spawn
distant sage
and just autopiloted on it
maiden oar
12 stack prism is way better
fossil forge
yep
maiden oar
bc of flawless form and flag mastery staccks
its why u get autumn instead of frost dk
fossil forge
Dont mention autumn.
maiden oar
hehe
but yeah ur backloaded so forge is less cool for u
idk though maybe 2x on use is fine on soulbinder
fossil forge
Ive been begging for hpal
maiden oar
just try to dance in a way where u press sectech as the cast bar for the orbs that break the canisters finishes
if that makes sense
can hold globals to make it perfect
that is the secret
jolly sleet
that is the secret
the secret tech for sec tech is holding global, roger that
maiden oar
if u press the sectech gcd right as the canisters break the clones will hit
there is no way
maiden oar
this is the best picture i could get
im full cp and in the middle of going dance symbols sectech 123
and i didnt press sectech yet
fossil forge
U wait for beams to shoot?
maiden oar
yeah
castbars like here and i didnt start but im about to start in a tenth of a second
maiden oar
no
its basically instant after castbar finishes
if the boss is next to the canister
the soulfray annihilation one
fossil forge
Ic
maiden oar
btw dont take my word as gospel about 1x on use i could be insane and wrong
maiden oar
yeah i use 1x on use too much
fossil forge
last gate
its 10:30 and still no servers
north schooner
the maintenance is officially until 11:00
haughty rose
surely that patience test from opening the vault rewards me with either myth netherprism or myth forge right?
void ocean
surely that patience test from opening the vault rewards me with either myth net...
haste vers ring best i can offer
haughty rose
haste vers ring best i can offer
I'd take alpha ring too i just remembered because i generally roll a sub 40 on it when it drops
lusty epoch
first time myth raiding
(got omega cucked on forge we pun adds behind the pool a...
We also do adds behind pool, you can shadowstep to someone behind the pool last second to avoid losing too much uptime
barren haven
nope
last gate
time to sleep
serene bear
good morning colleagues could I please ask what are all the "!" prompts to show all relevant guidance for Subtlety Rogue? I would like to review them as I am slowly returning to playing my rogue after years of tanking.
jolly sleet
servers are UP
serene bear
Thank you very much 🙂
haughty rose
surely that patience test from opening the vault rewards me with either myth net...
no prism no forge no ring
but i got atomic phasebelt to replace my crafted belt for 0,3% increased dps which is a minor W
tribal blade
no prism no forge no ring
but i got atomic phasebelt to replace my crafted belt...
upgrade is upgrade 😉
this late into the tier it's always a W
short radish
!atro
wicked joltBOT
Atrophic /Feint in Raid: > Click to Open <
wispy crystal
!sod
wicked joltBOT
Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs
steady coral
Question: why is it, that in higher keys (+19-20s) it varies so much with talents ppl use? Whats the reason some go cold blood instead of tea, and others rotten instead of one point in finality? I know it probably comes down to comp, dung, gear and key lvl - but is there a significant difference to change in terms of dmg, or does it come down to preferance since its so split in the top 10? I tried to find some answers, but havent found any yet. My sim says best talents in general is cold blood and rotten
hazy breach
Its not a significant change in terms of damage no
steady coral
Its not a significant change in terms of damage no
so you think its just down to preference and dung?
ivory vigil
yes, for example if you lack priority damage in your team, you go cold blood for sectec and use eviscerate more than black powder, things like that
steady coral
Ye thats what I was thinking would be the reason in some keys. Ty for answers! 🙂
distant sage
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/fXNoAnkjzcM6j5s1xE1rZg
idk how ot feel about this sim
less ver than crit doesnt really feel right
fossil forge
Im pretty sure i had higher crit than vers before i swapped gems
hazy breach
Side note thats not related to the damage talents
You should prob spec into improved wound and/or crippling for halls
Instead of unbreakable stride which does literally nothing
distant sage
noted noted
plush roost
fervent elm
i imagine unbreakable stride is good in pvp
pretty matchup dependent i dont usually use it
but it is popular
hazy breach
Well yeah, i was referring to PSF HALLS GAMBIT, which is the name of his talent page
limpid sage
-30% on all snares seems really nice
how does this interact with the 2nd boss in halls btw
the turn to stone mechanic
tribal blade
how does this interact with the 2nd boss in halls btw
not sure if it interacts with it at all
hazy breach
Fairly sure it doesnt do anything there
ancient leaf
is araz and prism the best trinket comb in m+? 18+ keys?
tribal blade
prism and antenna sims way better than forge+prism for me
and then you don't run into weird holding issues too
i had to set antenna to 80% miss rate for it to be worse than forge in dslice
last time i checked rio most high IO sub rogues are running prism+antenna now
nvm looks like forge is slightly more popular
latent finch
Yes you can disable it here. But the default is always with rune
hazy breach
Yeah you cant really easily sim the vantus rune
wet echo
i guess take top sim and reduce a bit of vers and add a bit more crit and mastery then
hazy breach
But it doesnt really matter much
last gate
i got araz
so its
cd araz -> cd prism -> cd araz
i mean
we start from araz or prism
latent finch
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
last gate
got it
sly shore
!mistakes
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
sly shore
!coup
wicked joltBOT
Coup de Grace Optimizations:
- **Number 1: ** You can hold coup up to ~20 secounds and stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. The later is used to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
- Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
- Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.
wet echo
is wax still worth using ?
fallow nimbus
It's free, so always worth it
limpid sage
is wax still worth using ?
Last I checked it was like 20k more dps?
wet echo
good shit, ty
limpid sage
That was when I was 10% lower crit and 10% more mastery though, so it should prob be more now
fleet acorn
What flasks are u Running on 15+ keys as sub Im thinking of switching to crit instead of chaos
last gate
What flasks are u Running on 15+ keys as sub Im thinking of switching to crit in...
chaos
tempered gave you all the other stats
lilac stag
Sim consumables if you want the proper answer.
your gear matters more than what any of us do for emulation.
wet echo
if you're using pots during keys (which you obviously should but it's expensive), it's always chaos
if you're not popping pots, you're better off with single stat flasks
i'd say mastery but sim is smarter than me
limpid sage
Is the last post in tc-research the 30th september to you guys as well
last gate
if you're using pots during keys (which you obviously should but it's expensive)...
dude just use r2 pot
its like 30 40 g each
20 g
lol
limpid sage
I keep getting notifs for the chat but nothing updates in there
last gate
im using them on dummys
wet echo
dude just use r2 pot
fair
wet echo
i don't have the habit of popping pots in m+ cuz i've been mostly doing weeklies
last gate
but not using it is like 2.4k
hazy breach
I keep getting notifs for the chat but nothing updates in there
Its because bots post there (and in every other channel) before they get banned
Bots/hacked accounts
limpid sage
Its because bots post there (and in every other channel) before they get banned
Ah makes sense. Funny that it doesn’t remove the notification after though
swift tinsel
I usually know a bot was banned bc I'll see tc channel posts lol
shrewd lantern
@warm marlin new lily tech?
warm marlin
for some bosses
shrewd lantern
whats the reasoning?
warm marlin
either A: if you were to hold to forge the second flag, your third flag would be cut short by the boss dying (so kill timers between 3:15-3:40 ish are lily kill timers)
or B: it's araz, and you only get one forge with flag anyway, since you need to cast exactly at 0:20ish and 2:02ish
getting to lily flag 1 and flag 2 appears mildly better than just playing antenna according to my sims and then you don't have to play the minigame 🤓
shrewd lantern
are you just using lily on pull and 3mins in A
warm marlin
lily on pull and at 1:30, then prism last flag
shrewd lantern
oh yeah that makes sense
warm marlin
unless you are stupid and forget to hit prism before your blades macro so you use lily when you have 18 stacks of prism
dont know who would do that on fractillus this week
not me for sure
shrewd lantern
already have all my needed items so extra dinars are like
either buy lily to fuck around
or an offhand for 3 ilvl
warm marlin
lily was my dinar for that reason ye
think pacemaker is my second, there might be some potential
shrewd lantern
you had prism forge boots and antenna pre turbo?
warm marlin
yes
hazy breach
I bought prism
warm marlin
love those things
shrewd lantern
yeah i was like
shrewd lantern
lily to fuck around ig
warm marlin
pacemaker is a maybe this will be useful at some point
shrewd lantern
or just buy the db wep
hazy breach
Pacemaker+Forge for the 2:30 kill timers
shrewd lantern
man
hazy breach
(it was only slightly better than antenna when i simmed it)
shrewd lantern
artosh is dying for us
hazy breach
So doesnt matter much
shrewd lantern
barely after i finish my cb sectech
warm marlin
im trying to get sat at least one week
so i get out of the note
and i keep getting put in anyway
horribly cringe fight anyway
timers barely work on prog and then it all goes to shit
shrewd lantern
ngl i barely look at antenna buff
except once i was in an fg weekly
and i saw 5 orbs spawn on last boss
this is just the peak of 1st world problems where im considering to dinar for 3 offhand ilvls
since we've only had 1 loom wep drop ever
fallow nimbus
You will get haste and you will love it - John Blizzard, probably
lilac stag
so i get out of the note
Just get assist and sabotage the note.
warm marlin
only ethical behaviour around here
lilac stag
distant canopy
!ui
vale pine
!wa
wicked joltBOT
limpid sage
do you have to send cds instantly on dimmy?
or is it fine to wait till 1:40 for example
hazy breach
Depends a lot on how much damage your group has
But generally just send on cd until you see that you can get anything by holding
velvet grove
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
long storm
Should i buy SH boots or Ritual forge, alrdy have netherprism and simming forge just doesnt work
hazy breach
Forge sims perfectly fine
lilac stag
Droptimizer was bugging it out at one point no? Just add it to top gear if it’s buggy.
late violet
why peope using araz instead of antenna in mythic dimensius
lilac stag
to not deal with orbs
junior pecan
hey, is there an apl for cursed stone idol, it keeps using it instead of prism
hazy breach
Thought i had i pushed to default but ig i forgot, anyway here it is:
(fwiw stone idol still isnt particularly good)
junior pecan
I put that in, but it uses prism at 4:53 whithout cds up... sadge
hazy breach
Yeah but its used it before
lilac stag
I put that in, but it uses prism at 4:53 whithout cds up... sadge
It’s likely a right around 5 min fight and it’s dumping it like it should
hazy breach
Idk what you wanted it to do
lilac stag
Be a 300k dps upgrade outsimming BM hunters 
junior pecan
if i sim lily it uses prism at 3 mins but idol uses it at 4:53
hazy breach
No it uses it at 3 min too
junior pecan
it's just the order of using prism thats wack
lilac stag
Link sim pls. Worse case swap trinket positions
hazy breach
Well you didnt use the custom apl
junior pecan
might be doing something wrong but, I have tried every option stated
lol didn't think i needed to download it, MonkaS
limpid sage
But generally just send on cd until you see that you can get anything by holding
okay so it won't fk something up in terms of alignment for amp?
junior pecan
yeah thanks
hazy breach
okay so it won't fk something up in terms of alignment for amp?
Idk depends on how fast you kill
limpid sage
or I guess we can always hold
hazy breach
Literally no way of me knowing
limpid sage
yeah
mental shore
someone know how to change color on rupture from plater?
swift tinsel
someone know how to change color on rupture from plater?
I use this and made one in Constructor for rupture https://wago.io/398Lv0cuq
very easy to do
swift tinsel
you can mod it to only be border
distant canopy
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
swift tinsel
their interrupt plugin is nice too
mental shore
I use this and made one in Constructor for rupture https://wago.io/398Lv0cuq
where i import
is script?
swift tinsel
where i import
modding
vagrant fulcrum
prisma acorn
does order of my trinkets + potion matter much on opener? like if we accidenntly cast potion after shadow blades, is it an issue
hazy breach
Does not matter
placid elk
would u take this crap if ur rolling hero with crit vers?
feels nice to get myth piece but stats kill me
23k dps increase 
warm marlin
yep
shadow atlas
hey guys, does cloak work on the pull mechanic in p3 dimensius ?
alpine wraith
you will get stunned and die from gravity collapse
because likely the guy with it will move and you wont
placid elk
i see a lot of ppl have 2x focusing lens, i have a writhing armor band.
do i need to recraft the writhing band to focusing lens or does it work like having 2x?
alpine wraith
best thing to cloak is devour or last ring
best dps is usually writhing+ascendance or double dawn
but the diff is so little
no one really cares
cursive vapor
!stats
wicked joltBOT
The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Mastery >= Versatility >= Critical Strike >>> Haste
radiant island
how do i use shadowstep on dimensius correclty without spawning in his front?
placid elk
stop pressing movement keys when u shadowstep and orient after, you can't change shadowstep location
loud brook
The laser on Nexus King sometimes double-hitting within like 0.3seconds, is it normal?
ornate heron
he steps to skillydk
swift tinsel
yeah you can see his focus target next to target frame
warm marlin
you will get stunned and die from gravity collapse
cloak immunes the stun
but ye prob better to immune rings
radiant island
oh true. thx
shrewd lantern
stepping dks is usually safe
unless your dk likes to floorpov
then consider someone else
hazy breach
Ye just step someone reliable
shrewd lantern
i kind of regret not taking bracers
now that my sim is showing highest lens sim is putting them on ring and neck
shits tiny regardless
vast tusk
is there anything that can make it easier to see what I'm hitting? I do have plater but ideally i want something that can make the red circle target thing more visible. In dungeons like Eco Dome the mobs are always moving and i find that a lot odf the time i'm not in range of the hit box and i lose a lot of dps because of those situations
twilit gorge
is bubbling wax good?
wet echo
yes
quaint lodge
is there anything that can make it easier to see what I'm hitting? I do have pla...
In plater there is a specila buff you can track
just make it really big
short radish
is there anything that can make it easier to see what I'm hitting? I do have pla...
you can get a weak aura that plays a noise when you step out of melee range
thats what i do
lilac stag
you can get a weak aura that plays a noise when you step out of melee range
You’re fucked in midnight ain’t ya?
short radish
yes
even wiht combo points
im conditioned to press when my CPs are a certain color
astral pewter
How long range does sectech have around the main target?
Is it known because its not displayed in tooltip
hazy breach
I mean its technically 8 yards
But that doesnt matter because where those 8 yards originate from depend on the hitbox of the boss
Its more a case of "on this boss you cant cleave with sectech"
bright elk
We can cleave sectec from the living mass to dimmy but not the other way around right?
hazy breach
yes
bright elk
Cool, that’s what I thought but wasn’t 100% sure
mint maple
how can avoid getting TPd while using shadowstrike on dimensius FFS
short radish
how can avoid getting TPd while using shadowstrike on dimensius FFS
hold W
and be inside his hitbox
tulip folio
guys new to sub here
my dps is bad in keys / aoe
i have no clue why
im doing opener properly like it is in guide
fleet wharf
logs generally help with that. Use coup whenever you can, if you have more than 4 targets, use black powder
tribal blade
my dps is bad in keys / aoe
nobody will be able to help unless you upload a log
tulip folio
logs generally help with that. Use coup whenever you can, if you have more than ...
yep 1 sec sending it
tulip folio
nobody will be able to help unless you upload a log
.
like it got noticable worse once i started playing m+ tea build
now that i think im not sure about black powder usage rules too
so theres lot that is wrong here, i just need tips on improtant stuff
fleet wharf
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
tulip folio
yeah i do that
tulip folio
yeah sometimes i pop blades when my dance is on cd
but i feel like if dont ill contribute low dps to pull and pack wont die fast so we fail key
warm marlin
I don't think theres a single flag in that log outside of the very first one that remotely resembles the opener. your burns are being massively griefed with dead globals, casting dance then flag sending flag as a dead global inside dance and blades, not holding charges enough, etc.
hazy breach
You generally dont delay blades, you skip dancing earlier
shell rune
#showtooltip
/cast [stealth] Shadowstrike; Backstab
Can i use this or does it cause issues?
tulip folio
I don't think theres a single flag in that log outside of the very first one tha...
ok can u explain it for easyer to understand terminology
idk nothing feels intuitive about this spec
maybe its me but
thats how i feel about it tbh
short radish
!mistakes
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
hazy breach
idk nothing feels intuitive about this spec
Thats true, its insanely non intuitive
As a rule of thumb if flag has ~25s or so left of its cd, dont press dance or symbols
Can go up to like 30-35 to start of with to make sure
tulip folio
so i have to always have at least 1 set of dance and mark for blades
hazy breach
2
short radish
1.5 dance and 1.3 symbols
tulip folio
and i should send flagg befor i go into dance right
tulip folio
1.5 dance and 1.3 symbols
whats does that even mean 😭
hazy breach
You always want to use 2 during, so you need roughly what fimbul said at the moment you press flag
Stacks
tulip folio
ah ok i get it
short radish
0.3 of symbols is like 9 seconds
fleet wharf
idk nothing feels intuitive about this spec
I disagree about it not being intuitive. all of your damage happens in CDs. you dont gaf about anything out of CD except to farm it back up
fleet wharf
but to add onto what fimb said, stop pressing dances once you have 30 sec left on flag cd
short radish
you are better wasting a dance for 10 seconds
short radish
then doing flag and not having 2 dances
fleet wharf
and forget about sending naked sec techs, that seems to be fucking some things up too
warm marlin
do i just hold dance ?
it depends on how many charges you have and how far away flag/blades is
fleet wharf
do i just hold dance ?
you hold if it'll make it so your next big cd (with flag and blades) are gonna be fucked up
warm marlin
if you have almost 2 charges of dance and flag is 30s away, you can send. if flag is 15s away and you have 1 charge of dance and are 45s away from the next, you cant
tulip folio
ok ok
hazy breach
Subs rotation revolves around making sure you can always use 2 sectech, 2 dances and 2 symbols during shadowblades
tulip folio
lts say i finish first pull my blades and flag are 35 sec cd for example im approaching scound pull i have 1.5 shadow dances
what do i do
do i just spread rupture black powder ?
fleet wharf
just hold
or try sending it and see if it fucks up your cds
i mean in that situation you can prolly send a dance+symbols and hold your flag for like 5 sec or so until you have everything up going into next cd
tulip folio
ok so what i get from this is that my biggest problem atm is sending sblades flag wwhen i dont have dance mark or both
and i spend my cds not fully going into opener like when i have everything up
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
fleet wharf
basically, every single one of your big cd usage needs to look the same
essentially, that's it. Everythingn else you do is to make it so you can get clean cds off
fleet wharf
think of your dances and symbols more as avoid overcapping, and not as cds you need to optimize
tulip folio
or do i need to press them seperatly
fleet wharf
dance+symbols is technically not advised, but ok as long as you have them on separate buttons so you can press them as needed
tea you can macro to dance
!dance
I forget the command, but there's another macro that might be useful too
tulip folio
like why dance not give symbols itself what the f its another button
ok ill figure something thanks for help
btw about black powder
do i use it or no
if yes whats rules for it
tulip folio
4 or more outside of cd i black powder
coup over powder
what if im in dance symbols
fleet wharf
doesn't matter. if there are 4 or more live targets, you black powder over evisc
short radish
!sod
wicked joltBOT
Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs
short radish
!tea
wicked joltBOT
Thistle tea use:
It is recommended to macro Thistle Tea with Shadow Dance like this:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```but i still dont understand how this is intuitive 😄 maybe i played alot of simple classes but this compeared to hunter pala or evoker warrior my alts
short radish
trust us
tulip folio
this is like playing chess to do damage
tulip folio
yeah ofc
short radish
your rotation is largly static
tulip folio
im not swiching my rouge ever so i have to get better at it
tulip folio
i love class alot but its just painfull to play
bro im 3.4k rio
still dont understand how this shit works
:DDD
tulip folio
i do what i gotta do
short radish
you have 2 dances that are casted in dance
tulip folio
bro just wait
short radish
then you have 2 dances that are cast before the next flag
theres some variation when they are casted
some people cast them back to back
other people cast them 20 seconds apart
but the important part is that they only cast dance twice
the AMOUNT of dances is relatively static
tulip folio
ok so only 2 dance symbols with my blades flag
short radish
then afterwards as well it's always 1-2 dances
you should never really cast more than 2 dances between flags
unless youre in aoe the entire time and you can shuriken storm -> finisher outside of dance
and thats very rare
tulip folio
okay that was much needed info i regained hope
i cant play assa coz people wont let me restealth or funnel on st coz of ire tank trinket or some shit
i dont have gear for outlaw
and im cooked on sub
short radish
who cares about restealth
you just seethe and cope
even as sub
restealths are amazing
because 4 extra seconds is kinda huge
but its never worth playing around
short radish
jia you
short radish
💪
tulip folio
short radish
this is from the fuu article
if it helps with your visualisation of cds
(in a ST scenario)
and remember the longer you delay pressing flag/blades
the less casts you get throughout the dungeon
and the less casts you get the less damage you do
so youre better off overcapping on dance
than you are at pressing more dances and less flags
ember hound
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
wicked urchin
160 wipes still no p3 jeeze
short radish
wooooo dota
short radish
160 wipes still no p3 jeeze
salad or jonathan dimensions
wicked urchin
jonathan dimensions
bitter lark
How does one go about getting a log review? I definitely need to be casting Coup more, but am missing something.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/pXNhwLDA7YnF4BvR?fight=116&type=damage-done&source=1055
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
short radish
then start reading from here
and the same shit kinda applies
i cbf writing out the same stuff again
short radish
celest juniper
Can someone explain to me like I’m an idiot how I am supposed to play coming back from the platforms into the damage amp on saladbar?
maiden oar
u have 2 options
the cowards path: farm coup / sht for the amp and basically just afk (keep rupture up then use a symbols charge to farm shadow techniques really fast and make sure you have coup)
the risky approach: send 1 dance and then go from there
personally im a coward
but i probably ccould get away with the dance
can look like either
but you want to try and get coup and 14 shadow technique stacks before the amp
for me it was the first img but if youre really brave you can do it like the second img
also probably better to spam storm at 4 escalating blades so u can have an unseen blade ready the backstab spam in first img is a misplay from me
had to really zoom out on the 2nd one because he pressed way more buttons
also if you dont have autumn you flag later into the amp and can therefore start prepping for the amp a little later
limpid sage
the cowards path: farm coup / sht for the amp and basically just afk (keep ruptu...
You can never get 3x dances in amp if you go risky though, can you?
maiden oar
yeah
but rank 1 did it
and that guy gapped me by a ton
so maybe he knows something i dont
personally im going to keep not being risky bc im not very brave
tepid trellis
You can never get 3x dances in amp if you go risky though, can you?
Depends on dances spend earlier on the platform
maiden oar
Depends on dances spend earlier on the platform
thats true i was assuming u get 3 dances on the platform
tepid trellis
I do not
limpid sage
Depends on dances spend earlier on the platform
Yeah if you send 3x on platform you can’t send off platform, but you still overcap slightly on dances and symbols iirc?
maiden oar
Yeah if you send 3x on platform you can’t send off platform, but you still overc...
was like this
but i did a symbols to farm sht fast before intermission
and i had autumn
limpid sage
Yeah I do the same
limpid sage
Considered making a cancelaura macro for symbols specifically on that fight
Just so I wouldn’t get a reset from Rupture after flag
maiden oar
hehe
forgot all about that bug
limpid sage
my macro has been protecting me very nicely
which one
don't you have like 5 that you alternate between
warm marlin
Lmao yes but mainly the backstab one
The symbols delayed refund thing was turbo cringe
maiden oar
<a:rotating_skull:1105379925034274826> forgot all about that bug
huh is it a bug
i notice it only ever happens to me on artoshion
and i just assume im getting parried ro something
i always forget what pull it is on the replay so i never chekc
but something refunds after rupture when i try and flag that guy
and it catches me off guard every time
warm marlin
If you cast symbols with supercharger charges ready and 7sht you will spontaneously consume all your sht to generate cp
It’s essentially a super delayed shadowcraft refund
Very cringe bug for prestacking
However, you can’t get a shadowcraft refund while you have the premeditation buff active, so you can prevent this shadowcraft bug by dancing before symbols
maiden oar
If you cast symbols with supercharger charges ready and 7sht you will spontaneou...
waht
thats insane
thank u
i think that also happened to me on nexus king amp