or even keys
#subtlety
twin trench
fossil forge
Definitely better in keys im not sure About last 2 though
why bother running double on use when you can start dungeon with 18 stacks
twin trench
oh you just hit dummy or something?
fossil forge
Bro doesnt know th,, tech
twin trench
i dont
twin trench
im the most casual ce player ever LOL
fossil forge
After key gets put in and yellow barrier falls down u need to be in loading
i leave when timer hits 4 but it really depends on your pc
twin trench
oooh gotcha
sounds a lil too sweaty for my weeklies but will be nice when im going for more 16s
wintry holly
!prism
wild vine
The prism thing is pretty unreliable depending on your PC ye, kinda wish they would nuke stuff like that immediately 
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
fossil forge
The prism thing is pretty unreliable depending on your PC ye, kinda wish they wo...
I dont think they care if you cant do it in raid
wild vine
Yep kinda unlikely
twin trench
so if you cant start with 18 stacks w/ a bug, then lily would be better than antenna?
wild vine
so if you cant start with 18 stacks w/ a bug, then lily would be better than ant...
Sims shouldnt take that bug into consideration
fair anchor
I tried the loading tech when m+ bubble pops but so far i still lose stacks
alpine wraith
someone said they fixed it some days ago
alpine wraith
it is very unlikely we get any buffs
we will have bad st unluck but cleave and aoe is fine
just as people get more gear it is less important
queen plinth
They need to buff sub
Like 25% flat
So I get invites in 16s
I cbs playing queue simulator just to deplete a key in 2 pulls cause others suck
shrewd portal
Does sub rogue want to wear daggers in both hands ?
or is it fine to wear sword / mace or watever in the off hand ?
queen plinth
Daggers
queen plinth
I think o have read multiple times that even a 600 ilvl dagger would outsim a high lvl sword
keen dome
!oh
wicked joltBOT
Shadow Techniques is not normalized and this makes a slow weapon (axe/sword/mace/fist) in offhand significantly weaker and almost never worth equiping.
keen dome
That's the reason
queen plinth
And that
shadow lance
We all agree it's a socket?
shrewd portal
Lol " OH ! "
shrewd portal
That's the reason
tyty friends !
queen plinth
We all agree it's a socket?
Is that the crit ring?
shadow lance
Lol " OH ! "
oh for off-hand
shadow lance
Is that the crit ring?
No
queen plinth
Well sim if
shadow lance
Alpha is the good one
shadow lance
Yes, just wanted to complain about the low quality of my vault
queen plinth
Oh yea got you
shadow lance
Crystal is the biggest upgrade but will be replaced instantly by Forge/antenna when I'll get it
Maybe neck for assa
shadow lance
It's a 1/6 MM
Was speaking about the M+ one ^^
Not a big save
And same for crystal so, not a save at all
sigh
placid elk
When sub buff
unfortunately i think this xpac is abandoned.
they work on remix and midnight
maybe small stuff on 11.2.5 which is in like 2 weeks
queen plinth
Oh nah they won’t do shit
warm dome
Hello Sub-Bros,
Is it worth crafting a waist to replace the DISC belt ?
Thanks 😄
queen plinth
Sim
tidal marsh
queen plinth
Prolly worth when belt got nerfed
tidal marsh
Somebody add DISC Belt to that
It will 100% be worth in a couple weeks though
But (probably) already worth now
queen plinth
unfortunately i think this xpac is abandoned.
they work on remix and midnight
...
I literally had my fdk get boosted through hc yesterday
Got forge+ prism
You know I will be same raider as m rogue in 2 days
And will easily time 16s cause I get invited
placid elk
true, and way easier to play, maybe too easy
tight monolith
any dungeons you cant do the prism stack because of zoning/instance stuff?
tight monolith
any dungeons you cant do the prism stack because of zoning/instance stuff?
like gambit
restive mauve
I have a Subtlety question. For trinkets, people usually use Prism and Forge. Since Prism is normally lined up with the 3-minute cooldown, they use Forge in the opener, then go without a trinket and just use Flagellation, and then Prism after that. (I saw this in some last boss logs.)
Wouldn’t it be better to use Weave twice and then Prism, instead? Is Forge still better, even if I have to go without a trinket for one use?
vale pine
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
restive mauve
thank you
shadow lance
I have a Subtlety question. For trinkets, people usually use Prism and Forge. Si...
It can depend of boss timing
If you only got 3 use and a damage amp on the 3rd, skipping a trinket use on 2nd might be the play to use max prism stack on the amp
carmine portal
Now me personally? I ONLY trinket outside of CD's
I like to pop 18 stack prism with no shadowdance or symbols
tall girder
based
restive mauve
Since I’ve got Mythic Lily, there’s no real reason for me to bother with Forge, right?
late oxide
I equipped prism for stat do not use it
hot ibex
!coup
wicked joltBOT
Coup de Grace Optimizations:
- **Number 1: ** You can hold coup up to ~20 secounds and stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. The later is used to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
- Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
- Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.
hot ibex
!mistakes
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
carmine portal
I equipped prism for stat do not use it
I got a HC prism in my vault that had leech on it, made me laugh
Leech mainstat on my trinket 
queen plinth
Since I’ve got Mythic Lily, there’s no real reason for me to bother with Forge, ...
Well having 40k main stat during your big burst has more value then mastery I think
But how could I know when we got a robot
queen plinth
U still have 40 k for your first sectech
hazy breach
Well yeah
queen plinth
So we better pass that question to raidbots right
north schooner
it will be higher than 24k average for the important part (blades duration)
hazy breach
Yeah a maxxed mythic one is higher, its like 28k
queen plinth
Isnt that absolute wrong button pressing? 😂
That’s actually funny to see you do shit like that when I saw you being rank 5 or so on loomithsr
golden totem
Why
queen plinth
What why
golden totem
Button pressing seems fine
queen plinth
Wait is this triple sectech?
short radish
That’s actually funny to see you do shit like that when I saw you being rank 5 o...
yeah when there were 8 other ppl who had killed it 
wet echo
i'd put the 2nd dance maybe half a second later to try get an additional gcd in cuz of the increased coup gcd but other than that it's very fine button pressing
short radish
nah i proc'd my 2p 6x in a row
golden totem
i'd put the 2nd dance maybe half a second later to try get an additional gcd in ...
I assume he spammed dance to get every sects hit inside
queen plinth
Isn’t sectech meant to be during dance?
glacial stag
holy shit i rolled it
thats some juicy opener
golden totem
Isn’t sectech meant to be during dance?
It was during tfd dance
wet echo
sectech 2nd hit is 1s after and then 3rd hit is 1.3s after
as long as you press dance before gcd is over, you're fine for sectech
queen plinth
And blades after sec tech
wet echo
that's also good
glacial stag
Blades is instant buff
queen plinth
Why
wet echo
you get an additional GCD in blades and you just don't buff the initial weak sectech buffed
most of sectech dmg comes from 2nd and 3rd hit
hazy breach
Sectech isnt that weak
glacial stag
Like if you send your secret tech 2nd and 3rd hit are buffed even if you send SB after pressing ST
wet echo
and you get to buff an additional GCD later this way
hazy breach
On average its the same to buff the sectech hit and use it after, but the problem is people tend to fuck up using it after, by using it too early
hazy breach
No
queen plinth
Yea if anybody says sub is not complicated again imma find him
hazy breach
Ideally just use it with sectech
golden totem
I just press blade before sectec cause I don't wanna deal with sectec clones timings
wet echo
both are fine
queen plinth
How am I supposed to get better when I can’t even check my logs when u can have those rotational stuff and be better or not
short radish
Yea if anybody says sub is not complicated again imma find him
tbh
just press buttons
no one is playing 100% optiomally
golden totem
How am I supposed to get better when I can’t even check my logs when u can have ...
There is a lot of "it doesn't matter" stuff like this. But if you follow guides rules it's not that deep
wet echo
playing sub without the last 2% of minmaxing is not that complicated but fully maxing it out is a bit clunky
queen kraken
no one is playing 100% optiomally
That… u remember me crying about shadow tech Resets? Work was boring so I checked shindigg pov on king and he had 2nd st with 4s left on tfd
short radish
That… u remember me crying about shadow tech Resets? Work was boring so I checke...
just proc your 2p on every single generator
easy
queen plinth
So was it Rank 1 atleast
cosmic dust
Is there any difference between sin and sub lootspec?
north schooner
no
queen kraken
just proc your 2p on every single generator <:kek:890682113098133606>
Mb sorry 🤦🏼♂️ 😂
short radish
all good, it's just a skill issue tbh
lilac stag
wouldn’t be an issue if they used goremaw’s correctly
minor idol
yo quick question. Why do we do SD -> Backstab -> Sectec -> Shuriken and not first Shuriken and then Backstab (with the Rotten)
lilac stag
We don’t storm in dance
fossil forge
Ss is just too op
lilac stag
You sod rotten out of dance
And that removes your flexibility of the limiting cd in keys (sod)
crisp pond
in raid for sub how do you use araz+prism? is it araz -> no trinket -> prism -> araz?
minor idol
Sorry bro cant rly keep up. Whats sod?
crisp pond
Sorry bro cant rly keep up. Whats sod?
symbols of death
maiden oar
in dimmy most ppl dont trinket 1m30s flag at all
minor idol
stupid
maiden oar
but in full uptime u alternate
crisp pond
yeah its for dimmy prog so was wondering
maiden oar
oh ok
lilac stag
Finality gang keep pushing the propaganda
That’s just facts. Rotten has a hard sequence that isn’t flexible if you’re using rotten to spread FW.
Storm has plenty of crit chance and Finality gives you SoD flexibility back.
fossil forge
U can just spread fw anyways with storm
maiden oar
what im doing rn (havent killed it but best pull 6%) is:
flag1 - forge
flag2 - nothing (forge with dance at like 2:0x unless im chosen for 3rd gravities then pool coup and sht for platform 1)
flag3 - prism platform 1
flag4 - forge platform 2
flag5 - prism amp
flag6 - forge
flag7 - prism (probably wont see this)
lilac pendant
Why the ring parses so low? Isnt our bis?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/e1MkVC8NGeZtuK1jRD6SMw
lilac stag
U can just spread fw anyways with storm
Welcome to finality gaming
fossil forge
Ive always been on the finality side
maiden oar
if u know u kill fast can also maybe delay flag 6 and do it with more prism stacks but thats very context dependent
fossil forge
I tried doing some keys with rotten yday its just not it
crisp pond
if u know u kill fast can also maybe delay flag 6 and do it with more prism stac...
i see i see thanks a lot. we have just reached platform 2 so im not sure with killtime yet
maiden oar
i see i see thanks a lot. we have just reached platform 2 so im not sure with ki...
yeah this is also with 2:3x phase 1 push
like usually 2:35
maiden oar
if u hold forever u can flag 1 @ 1:5x or so and line up forge w the 2nd half but if ur holding why even risk it hehe
fossil forge
Iz giga dps loss without autumn no?
crisp pond
if u hold forever u can flag 1 @ 1:5x or so and line up forge w the 2nd half but...
we still bl at pull but suspect line up would be good as long as i get it for platform 1
maiden oar
Iz giga dps loss without autumn no?
oh im talking about dimmy phase 1
maiden oar
we still bl at pull but suspect line up would be good as long as i get it for pl...
only get the lineup if u hold til 2:50
fossil forge
yea bossmen i asked above
maiden oar
but id honestly just flag during devour 2
maiden oar
Iz giga dps loss without autumn no?
oh its not that bad
fossil forge
do u just send on cd
I havent Seen much of the fight our best pull was like 60 something
crisp pond
yeah flagging currently at devour 2. but i hate being backup 1 for the masses, it feels awful for sub
maiden oar
do u just send on cd
yeah
u dont get to consistently dance in first intermission and before flag on platform without autumn i think
so best to just go 1x dance intermission and rupture until flag on platform
fossil forge
just off the top of my head
minor sorrel
yo is cursed stone idol any good for us in m+?
maiden oar
yea just storm rupture wahoo
fossil forge
I havent Seen platforms on mythic.
maiden oar
i dont know how optimal it is but what i and a bunch of lorrgs people.did is pool stacks during intermission 2 and dance at 4:22 and send potion at that time also and then flag after for the amp
but bingusguppy (a better player than me) is doing this and i plan to try it during reclear
fossil forge
Bingus gamer
lilac pendant
Why the ring parses so low? Isnt our bis?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report...
Can someone help me understand this please ^^
vale osprey
Can someone help me understand this please ^^
You probably just have a lot of crit
fossil forge
Aite ty boss
lilac pendant
You probably just have a lot of crit
12300
lilac pendant
should i take the weapon for OH then?
hazy breach
Youve just discovered why "bis" on anything besides trinkets is fake
and doesnt exist
vale osprey
Aite ty boss
For first like 70 pulls I had no autumn and it's fine yeah, you can just press on CD p much, you miss out on a tiny bit of it on i2
maiden oar
Aite ty boss
if u can get autumn do that though i might get it on reclear and never attempt this 1:1 hehe
hazy breach
Also you should enchant the weapon and have it in the mainhand if its going to be 723
lone halo
Hey guys. Is there a time you would want to send ST without SD?
vale osprey
should i take the weapon for OH then?
I mean you'd put it in mainhand
If you're gonna sim a weapon sim your crafted and vault option in both hands
fossil forge
Is the sliceanddice tech worth doing
maiden oar
also if youre doing the 3x dance in amp with potion thing w/o autumn you can delay flag maybe a gcd and still get all 3 in there
if you do 14 sht 4 coup and dance 1 at 4:22
but if u do bingus strat ignore everything i said
vale osprey
Is the sliceanddice tech worth doing
Depends how cringe you think it is in all honesty, me and our other rogue weren't, but if you're playing for every tiny optimisation then maybe?
glossy halo
is there a bug with the unyielding netherprism? It says "... gain 3685 Agility per Stack..." but i only get roghly 33k on 20 stacks?
maiden oar
Is the sliceanddice tech worth doing
its not the hugest deal its mostly for 2x disorienting
vale osprey
is there a bug with the unyielding netherprism? It says "... gain 3685 Agility p...
Damn how'd you stack it to 20?
You hack it?
fossil forge
I mean the 2 disorienting strikes is huge
glossy halo
aaah, 18 stacks of course ^^
vale osprey
Our BM hunter pumped too hard on our kill last night so I didn't get off my CB Sectec and like 3 globals before it
Sadge for my log
queen kraken
Also you should enchant the weapon and have it in the mainhand if its going to b...
I asked this a few days ago when u werent here but in sod + dance do u spam buttons asap or delay finishers/builders after finishers just a tad (shadow tech at like 5 stackish) cuz of some sudden proc into Full cp? I feel Like I fk up with spamming cuz im afraid to lose a cast in dance
hazy breach
The "delayed procs" is only during coup
glossy halo
its only 33k on 18 stacks, hm...
queen kraken
The "delayed procs" is only during coup
I feel Like I rarely get it just as I press a builder too sometimes
hazy breach
After coup yes
queen kraken
Also do we Storm After st if coup is up or just between coup
hazy breach
!coup
wicked joltBOT
Coup de Grace Optimizations:
- **Number 1: ** You can hold coup up to ~20 secounds and stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. The later is used to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
- Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
- Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.
queen kraken
!coup
Ye ik just unsure about that specific scenario cuz u lose one unseen blade
Guess im just stupid 🙈
fossil forge
its only 33k on 18 stacks, hm...
Has to be champion no
Mythic one gives like 60k on 18
glossy halo
yeah, thats what it should be.
glossy halo
its 723 ilvl
glossy halo
Are you attacking pvp dummies or something
i am stupid .... yeah. that was the problem
fossil forge
glossy halo
thanks a lot!
fossil forge
It works like that ?
hidden jasper
What exactly is the damage difference between blackpowder and eviscerate in 8 target pulls? Most of the time I'd rather send an eviscerate on a prio target instead of blackpowder, especially if it's something like a knight in priory or a miniboss. But is there a point where black powder is more worth it. I'm talking about in flawless form specifically
glossy halo
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
queen kraken
!mistakes
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
queen kraken
Is it just very bad procluck when im far behind on flawlessbuffs in total? On frac I got 216, eleem 236, anythng 274 and #1 yoinka Hit the Jackpot with 315. sounds like part procluck but some mistakes By me
north schooner
what is the difference in unseen blade procs?
many stacks you get from using cdg so some might be lost a) by pressing it on a target that isn't fazed or b) by wasting/proccing UB while you are at 4 stacks EB
north schooner
fazed can still drop in ST in theory
queen kraken
Yeye but its not targetswapping
north schooner
target swapping was not mentioned
queen kraken
Seems like huge rng cuz im 1 or 2 st behind but that accounts only for a max of 8 proccs which would mean 4 doubles
The difference in st is obv mb but still weird
north schooner
well if you take Eleem for instance who had only 4 more UB procs, that's 4 FF stacks from the procs, plus 10 from 2 cdg casts, which would put you only 6 FF buffs apart
brazen meadow
What is the damage loss on missing a CP reset and still pressing shadowstrike in CDs?
queen kraken
Still seems like im misplaying somewhere
plush roost
What is the damage loss on missing a CP reset and still pressing shadowstrike in...
A fair chunk
plush roost
well if you take Eleem for instance who had only 4 more UB procs, that's 4 FF st...
Only 6 as if that isnt 18% damage
limpid sage
What is the damage loss on missing a CP reset and still pressing shadowstrike in...
less than missing a global entirely
north schooner
well the way they overlap you don't have them all at the same time
it also matters when you get the extra procs
without a log it's hard to tell whether it's all just UB rng, but if it's just rng 216 vs 274 is crazy difference
or 315
limpid sage
As in, 5% more prio vs 5% more overall
I posted in tc-subtlety the other day about this - it's actually not that big of a difference when you stop skipping ruptures and only focus on the BP vs Evis part
(posted wrong photo before)
tight fjord
In m+ aoe pulls, how many ruptures after flag and before dance
north schooner
(posted wrong photo before)
this is at 8 targets?
limpid sage
yeah
lone halo
Any reason to send ST without Dance?
limpid sage
5 mins
limpid sage
Any reason to send ST without Dance?
if it fits one
but the tradeoff is that it if you don't get sectec back up in time you have to delay cds
lone halo
and inverse you always send Dance with ST
limpid sage
which is not worth
lone halo
they always get unsynced for me and I end up having to wait
i dunno im doing something wrong
limpid sage
if you have more than 30 seconds left on sectec and pooling for next cd window you can send it naked
north schooner
yeah
I see, so this is best case scenario kinda since the more targets you add the more evis falls behind overall, and the more BP falls behind in prio due to sqrt scaling
limpid sage
this is the diff on 4 targets
north schooner
makes sense that prio gap remains but total is much closer ye
hazy breach
Im mostly confused as to why you would want the prio_rotation, the thing that weve previously used when anything but prio damage is irrelevant and we only care about prio, to be lower
Besides priority_rotation is mostly redundant now with nimble flurry
woven peak
how does stacked prism work for first pull, any command?
weary tree
Heard you stack it up, start the key, leave the dungeon and wait for the start timer to pass and then enter the dungeon again
And then you keep your max stacks
feral knot
doesn't work anymore
vale pine
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
hazy breach
how does stacked prism work for first pull, any command?
raid_events+=/buff,buff_name=latent_energy,stacks=18,first=0,cooldown=999999
Put that in advanced mode
north schooner
blizzard really named the buff Latent Energy but calls it Latent Power in the tooltip 
lean bane
Is there some form of up-to-date beginners guide to sub with a basic setup/rotation to get started with the spec? It seems so complex just startig out
frail path
Is there some form of up-to-date beginners guide to sub with a basic setup/rotat...
Just keep hitting the target dummies. You'll get a hang of it in no time.
Compare with the guide, keep a mental note of what you do wrong, and try to improve
limpid sage
Im mostly confused as to why you would want the prio_rotation, the thing that we...
I think it's too big of a tradeoff just to fit some extra eviscerates and I don't think it's very realistic as to what people do
I don't think anyone thinks "skip Ruptures" when thinking of prio rotation
maybe that's just me
or there's a mismatch between the use-case of the variable and what I thought it was for
stone patrol
we only use backstab before shaodwblades when premed is up right? mid fight during normal dances we press shadowstrike right?
north schooner
you can BS any premed including in normal dances
strange chasm
Are you guys just sending vanish whenever? I wonder if it's a gain to hold it for when you proc coup in dance without blades to coup vanish storm coup.
wet robin
Does anyone offer coaching, VoD/log review for gold? I know a lot of you would do it for free, but I’m an exhausted dad single digit grey parsing. Everything about my prep and play is a mess so it would maybe be a heavier lift
short radish
Is there some form of up-to-date beginners guide to sub with a basic setup/rotat...
!guide
amber sedge
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
long marlin
If there a guide somewhere on how to effectively use double on use? Do I always send netherprism with Shadowblades and use Forge anytime after that in a dance?
hazy breach
!prism
alpine wraith
most of the time yes
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
quartz prism
what do you guys think, heroic antenna or myth lily. I dont raid (this vault was a one time thing) so I only really have acces to M+ trinkets
lilac stag
what do you guys think, heroic antenna or myth lily. I dont raid (this vault was...
Sim it, but Lily is likely your best trinket if you’re never going into raid.
bitter halo
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
short radish
what do you guys think, heroic antenna or myth lily. I dont raid (this vault was...
if youre never going to raid again
then i reckon antenna
wooden tendon
Yoyo, mythic fully upgraded antenna or 710 ritual forge? Antenna Sims way better, but I'm not sure. What would u guys say?
short radish
and grab the lily later
nova cairn
Does araz undersim on Top gear or no?
plush roost
Does araz undersim on Top gear or no?
no its implemented correctly
alpine wraith
no just most people have antenna at 0% miss
placid elk
Yoyo, mythic fully upgraded antenna or 710 ritual forge? Antenna Sims way better...
lol im in the same boat, but add a mythic dagger on top of that 
weak atlas
might be stupid, but what's the real gain on fitting a 2nd sectech in tfd instead of just having it during 2nd dance? are you actually able to fit in 3 sectechs inside 2 dances somehow if you rush it like that?
alpine wraith
if you have something that is 50 secs cd and you waste 10 secs of cdr
do or more
do you think it might affect dps a bit
hazy breach
You get your unseen blades from disorienting strikes earlier
weak atlas
well but that'd depend on kt right
weak atlas
yea didn't think about unseen
placid elk
wait, we need to do 2nd technique in first dance with increased duration?
weak atlas
I can see your CDR point but that'd be very kt specific yeah?
placid elk
i felt like theres some minmax, i always send one for each dance.
weak atlas
alright appreciate the answers, ty sub bros
swift cloak
hey guys , I wonder if myth lily might be better than a forge , does anybody knows which is more profittable ( so far im playing with antena and prism)
swift tinsel
just got a hc forge last night and I'm liking it
lilac stag
hey guys , I wonder if myth lily might be better than a forge , does anybody kno...
you can sim it, myth lily should beat heroic forge
swift cloak
fossil forge
I might have bribed the entire loot council to rig the odds to my favor
fossil forge
It doesnt exist stg
lilac stag
watch it not show up on the dinar vendor.
fossil forge
The non raiding Andies would cause a mayhem
lilac stag
One of our hunters got a prism in vault. This we had 3 boots too. Our actual drop in raid have been aweful
swift tinsel
we've literally had one prism drop in normal and that's it
lilac stag
though warrior now 716. Got boots and trinket off plexus which was big. Both with speed.
swift tinsel
1 hc forge, 1hc antenna
fossil forge
We are maxxed out on hc and mythic antennas
lilac stag
Fury running around with 17% speed and 2 avoidance enchants. lol
swift tinsel
I think 4 people got myth antenna this week from our first mythic vault
fossil forge
Zoomin
lilac stag
I have to see if there is a DR for speed
Leech or avoidance maybe better on cloak now.
swift tinsel
they probably didn't put one in bc they didn't think anyone would hit them lol
fossil forge
there are 2 DHs before me that get boots 
Last from leather guys to get them because i joined hc soulhunters and alt f4d after getting the boots
lilac stag
I likely won’t see them on warrior. Rogue is probably not unless vault.
fossil forge
Leather boots legit dont drop too
lilac stag
The joys of running two toons for buffs
swift cloak
you can sim it, myth lily should beat heroic forge
diffrence is 4k with lily being better on full up , but isnt penalty on mastery making it worse ? dont know how sims works
vale vault
might be a very specific question, but does anyone have a visual SoD weakaura that show on how many stacks im sitting? like 3 dots or something
buoyant leaf
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
lilac stag
diffrence is 4k with lily being better on full up , but isnt penalty on mastery ...
Put it in top gear, recraft items to crit+vers and clear out gems. Force meta gem with 4 colors and then see.
lilac stag
might be a very specific question, but does anyone have a visual SoD weakaura th...
Most of the packs have a sod wa with either a number or dots. Fuu’s specifically has dots if I remember correctly.
swift cloak
Put it in top gear, recraft items to crit+vers and clear out gems. Force meta ge...
diffrence is even smaller
lilac stag
diffrence is even smaller
Fully maxed?
swift cloak
yep
lilac stag
forge is really strong. So not that surprised
vale vault
Most of the packs have a sod wa with either a number or dots. Fuu’s specifically...
ty for ur answer, im using LE WA pack and it shows with number - i'd just personally like it a bit closer to my character with dots/circles w/e - if that doesnt exist im gonna figure something out
alpine wraith
you can use or steal fuus one
just get that node and move it around
delete everything else
i have a mix of LE and my own
wicked joltBOT
lilac stag
Fuu’s uses ingame textures if I recall, the crafting ranks for charges. Very nice.
vale vault
i havent played sub since s2 df and it would just help me for now since symbols usage is prob the thing im still messing up
vale pine
basically
weakauras has a function to track overcharged combo points
you can use that in any form you want
lilac stag
i havent played sub since s2 df and it would just help me for now since symbols ...
Keys or raid?
vale pine
e.g. i just color the combo points if you have supercharges
vale vault
Keys or raid?
mostly keys, in raid its fine
lilac stag
yeah. Symbols is our limiter in keys. If you play rotten it’s a pretty set rotation with it. If you run finality you can be more liberal when you use it (I find that easier for me)
vale vault
in raid its pretty straight forward and i have no mental overload playing a spec im rusty on
but in keys with cc/interrupts constant pressure on my defensives
its hard for me, atleast for now
lilac stag
It’s a lot
vale vault
its the one thing i need to improve after rewatching my VoD
ty guys
yeah works perfectly, just what i was looking for
lilac stag
gl!
rigid delta
What does stealthis Coup de Grace WA do? New addition to the WA list
hazy breach
Its a bar that shows when coup does damage
It can help if youre struggling with the bugged shadowcraft refunds that happen mid coup
vale vault
!tea
wicked joltBOT
Thistle tea use:
It is recommended to macro Thistle Tea with Shadow Dance like this:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
crystal bone
its nice, i think zac added it to his wa pack recently
nova cairn
!wa
wicked joltBOT
solemn lance
mythic forge and prism on M+ or does mythic antenna outperform forg in keys
crystal bone
antenna + prism for keys
forge + prism for at least king and dim on myth
not sure what else
worthy escarp
Is there any macro for Forge and Prism ? since they don't line up tgr ?
ionic tinsel
Is there any macro for Forge and Prism ? since they don't line up tgr ?
I macro each to shadow blades and have separate binds for them since you alternate use
crystal bone
^
worthy escarp
I macro each to shadow blades and have separate binds for them since you alterna...
Ay thats not a bad idea
crystal bone
u can macro forge and prism in 1 since forge is a 2min, then seperate bind for prism
glad rampart
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
merry bolt
Any tips to know when your next finisher will be refound combo point with shadowcraft ? i have put shadowcraft weakaura but i am still learning the spec and i don't want to waste 1 gcd with combo generator
glad rampart
!race
lucid jackal
Whenever you have 7 or more shadow technique charges during symbols it'll give you a refund
hazy breach
If you have 7 or more shadow technique stacks during symbols and you press a combo point finisher you get a refund
lucid jackal
If you get 7 during the 3hit combo of coup, you will get refunded at the end of its cast
alpine wraith
and if you have premed it wont refund at all!
deft igloo
Hi, I'm fairly new to Subtlety rogue and I've been taking a look at logs and comparing my damage breakdown to other Sub rogues' breakdowns at my ilvl and I'm seeing them with significantly higher Coup De Grace damage than I have with less Eviscerate damage/casts than I do - I'm struggling a bit to bring out the damage that I believe I should be doing for my ilvl and was wondering if anyone here might be able to help
alpine wraith
do you have the new 4 set
that is what usually makes coup do big damage
regardless of ilvl
deft igloo
Yea, I've got the 4 set
merry bolt
Ok thank you for your answer, do you know any wa that track shadow techniques ?
alpine wraith
then just try to not waste as many unseens as possible coup is very strong
wicked joltBOT
deft igloo
then just try to not waste as many unseens as possible coup is very strong
This may be where I'm struggling, I'm not tracking unseen blades and I've been struggling to understand it and how it works with the kit
mortal hamlet
sub or assa for nexus? i notice assa rising whats it good at add dmg or boss dmg
left ledge
sub or assa for nexus? i notice assa rising whats it good at add dmg or boss dmg
sub is better
assa isnt rising
it just has less than a tenth of the sub parses
so when you inevitably have people upload shit logs to sub
lucid jackal
sub or assa for nexus? i notice assa rising whats it good at add dmg or boss dmg
Sub is better sin sucks ass
left ledge
it drags their average down
just happens to be that the assa parses uploaded arent complete ass
signal lotus
where rotation
quick swan
Have seen some decent sin logs, If you play it right it’s fine I think
I wish it wasn’t so bugged
chrome palm
how is it still bugged we are on like week 8 or something
hazy breach
I mean weve had tons of bugs since alpha
Assa isnt even particularly buggy, its the least buggy rogue spec
chrome palm
yeah but its bugs are a lot more obvious than subs
hazy breach
Just the tier set one
quick swan
And thats saying something, considering how lengthy the pinned list is haha
hazy breach
But i think thats pretty close to the shadowcraft refund bugs
quick swan
I dont mind sub on bosses with adds but pure ST, Fatebound just feels nice
chrome palm
considering how easy fractillus was fb assa also being incredibly easy made that a very boring fight
quick swan
It was cozy hahah
round latch
Sub is better sin sucks ass
this can and will be used against u in the court of law
lul
lyric ice
hey, started rogue last week so very new,
i see a couple of different variations on talent choice for m+, mainly tea vs cold blood, and the typical aoe vs ST/cleave which is where WCL will have most top rogues playing heavy aoe while obviously depending on comp and key playing more ST is usually better for higher keys.
my question is, i saw a guy on raiderio play the rotten
and im wondering if i still backstab first builder of dance for macabre if i play rotten or if i use both rottens on shadowstrike
or do we dance backstab then symbols
woeful barn
little fractal
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
hazy breach
and im wondering if i still backstab first builder of dance for macabre if i pla...
Nah not worth, just play like you would without it
cursive wyvern
hey guys, recently picking up rogue as an extra alt for some keys and heroic raids and jesus its so much more confusing than all the other alts i play
lilac stag
yeah but its bugs are a lot more obvious than subs
assa propaganda trying to take sub's last niche
pure flare
can someone explain to me how i play 2x on use in m+
nova cairn
@hazy breach This look right to you? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3GseB4XL92ZvoFQoUgNyqu
hazy breach
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
lilac stag
can someone explain to me how i play 2x on use in m+
same way you do in raid
hazy breach
<@212854714197344256> This look right to you? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/re...
Ye why
chrome palm
assa propaganda trying to take sub's last niche
lmfao
lilac stag
Thought forge would sim higher than lily tbh
put it at 723
nova cairn
Ye but I was simming 710 vs 710 was all
hazy breach
Forge is good, just not nearly as good as people think
alpine wraith
yea after the nerf it is fine but not overwhelming
hazy breach
Its not outclassing everything else by miles
maiden oar
assa propaganda trying to take sub's last niche
sub will always have the advantage of being more fun than sin
alpine wraith
at most it sims like 0,5% above antenna for me
lilac stag
you're likely low enough on mastery
nova cairn
!wa
wicked joltBOT
hazy breach
But the thing about trinkets is that its kinda very heavily depends on the fight timer
nova cairn
Ye oke
45k ain't that much tbh
I thought tho that the trinket would DR mastery and be less impactful
lilac stag
1% at this stage of gearing is big
alpine wraith
also try to get any dungeon or something shoulders
the tier ones are very bad
any crit mastery crit vers or mastery vers would work
nova cairn
Ye I am trying to get raid ones, I pray tomorrow they drop
nova cairn
Same with antenna
alpine wraith
i have antenna but it performs quite badly on nexus boi
also sent gilded on other things so it is still 714 because of that
still can upgrade neck and chest
and those are more dps than upgrading antenna ahaha
vale pine
i hate how we still have crest caps
alpine wraith
yea it is what it is
the 8th of october will be omegagoon time
going 7 ilvl that day
subtle magnet
Is it confirmed they will be uncapping ?
I didn’t see it anywhere unless we can assume it’s like last season
long marlin
If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
is there a singular macro for that?
alpine wraith
you can macro both to blades with /use 13 and /use 14
lucid jackal
Use 13 use 14
alpine wraith
and it will use it there
lucid jackal
Put forge in top slot
alpine wraith
only need an extra bind for prism for places where you delay cds sometimes and forge can come off cd
but you have a 18 stack prism ready to send
long marlin
#showtooltip Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/cast Shadow Blades
and put forge in 13, that right
alpine wraith
yea
long marlin
ty
hazy breach
It does break if you end up delaying cds though, so beware
alpine wraith
yea big warneng
hazy breach
If you hold cds for 30 seconds for any reason you'd end up using forge isntead of your 18 prism
lucid jackal
Manually bind prism
long marlin
roger that, thanks again
scarlet gull
vale pine
glass cape
Am I supposed to have like a dick load of mastery 24% verse and not very high crit?
like I'm at 18% crit 25% verse and like 108% mastery
vale pine
you cant stack it before anymore
the "leave before timer runs out" trick too?
alpine wraith
you are supposed to have good ilvl gear and almost no haste
alpine wraith
the "leave before timer runs out" trick too?
yea
vale pine
interessting
alpine wraith
that is the idea
crit vers and mastery are almost the same for us
only stat behind is haste
so just do topgear to know the best combinations but numbers on stats are whatever
glass cape
should I like well balance my stats then instead of going so hard on haste?
not haste
mastery
glass cape
my dad said if I simmed wow I would be disowned by the family
pine mirage
How big is this setting in sim?
median nacelle
i respect it
glass cape
he says why would you sim a ps2 game
glass cape
i feel ike
108% Mastery before pots buffs and trinks is kinda insane
maybe 1 crit verse ring
unkempt drum
Praise be to the timewalking quest, it can happen
median nacelle
maybe 1 crit verse ring
vers is big value for nimble aswell
i run alot of vers, but i feel like its nice for m+
glass cape
ihave verse on alot of piece
unkempt drum
i run alot of vers, but i feel like its nice for m+
How much vers? I'm at like...18k now
glass cape
I have 17.9k verse
median nacelle
25k
glass cape
how T-T
unkempt drum
Got damn
median nacelle
its with flask tho
glass cape
i might be able to get that if I use my hero's teir souldbreaker trink
glass cape
we have the same mastery stat
but you have more crit and verse than me
my teir shouldvers have hast yucky
vale osprey
Are these with a flask on? They seem too high
glass cape
what if i wanna build has and have speeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed
iron plover
swift tinsel
avoid at all costs
fossil forge
chrome palm
i can't get mine below 1% :(
cursed crit
median nacelle
sexy cow
swift tinsel
might wanna rethink that statement
fossil forge
already have cursed crit on both :D
chrome palm
haste is almost as good as primary stat for me
fossil forge
i was mastery b4 but clanker told me i need more crit
warm goblet
!sim
chrome palm
assuming you arent running haste on anything, haste seems good
warm goblet
hey, is dslice supported for sub rogue?
chrome palm
yes
warm goblet
cool, thanks guys
warm marlin
haste is almost as good as primary stat for me
I won’t accept this haste propaganda
fossil forge
tell em bro
clever delta
guys, does the ring recraft bug still work or not
warm marlin
actually messer do you know if haste is better in cds or outside
I assume outside
but maybe shadowcraft procs going hard
chrome palm
"pi me i just got out of blades" 💀
hazy breach
Flat haste constantly is fine
warm marlin
I know lust is better than people make it out to be
hazy breach
Big bursts of haste are not particularly strong
warm marlin
(in cds)
warm marlin
"pi me i just got out of blades" 💀
alright fair point
chrome palm
I won’t accept this haste propaganda
i did a stat weights for fun yesterday
chrome palm
we been mana oil gaming
plain juniper
I have a myth antenna in my vault and currently using myth pacemaker + hero netherprism. Is the antenna better for m+?
hazy breach
In the past haste has been at like 1/2 or 1/3 of our top stat
hazy breach
Now its like 2/3 so its not that bad
warm marlin
wax/oil are the goat for a lot of profiles
fossil forge
whetstone gaming
hazy breach
Still worse than the others, but not awful
chrome palm
does haste get better in aoe/m+ any knower
hazy breach
Worse usually
As extra combo points are worth less and unseen blade isnt used exactly on cd as often
chrome palm
counterpoint i have 30 ruptures
ornate lake
crystal bone
slow gorge
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
slow gorge
there was a command that talk about prism and lily what was it again?
fossil forge
!prism
wicked joltBOT
Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:
- If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
- If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
- If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.
lilac stag
use the WA make your own tutorial
chrome fern
why you say that
lilac stag
so I could report them apparently
random mason
do we have a weak aura to track prism stack?
Theres a trinket wa that works for all current season trinkets
I just use that
Murlocs trinkets or something like that
chrome fern
i think that being able to make your own weak auras is a worthwhile skill to try and learn, they aren't hard to do
and there is a tutorial to "make your own"
slow gorge
i know in wa the guide but its only for spells no trinket :(
tepid raven
!warn @slow gorge like there's just no reason that being told to make something on your own needs to insta be responded with an insult
It literally has trinkets
final wasp
karmic harbor
if i understood french im sure that'd be offensive
fossil forge
!wa
wicked joltBOT
fossil forge
wat new aura do
chrome fern
if i understood french im sure that'd be offensive
it was very similar to what it was in english with the words reversed in order
lilac stag
if i understood french im sure that'd be offensive
i'm sure you can look it up on translate
something something girls suffering
lusty epoch
what miss % do you guys put for antenna?
slow gorge
if you are offended by that you need to waky waky
final wasp
20
chrome fern
why did you even say it?
lilac stag
if you are offended by that you need to waky waky
keep going. ignore the warning you were given
final wasp
Nothing bad, but its just the insta insult behaviour that is megacringe
chrome fern
narcissistic pervert in french, to being told to make his own WA
fossil forge
left ledge
What the helly
final wasp
Hint taken?
fossil forge
wthellyburten
final wasp
Thank you.
slow gorge
like i'm asking a question becasue i dont know how to make it i'm pretty new to all the weak auras and answering "do it yourslef"
left ledge
FUCK EM
slow gorge
jsut dont answer for saying that
vale pine
what miss % do you guys put for antenna?
depends on perosnal play and boss fight/dungeon somewhere between 10 and 20% is usually good
lilac stag
you literally asked if there was one, none of your skill or lack there of was in that comment
chrome fern
like i'm asking a question becasue i dont know how to make it i'm pretty new to ...
he told you to follow the tutorial which has a guide on how to make a WA
lilac stag
hold your tongue accountable
chrome fern
open up WA, create new aura, track, buff, type in "unyielding netherprism" done
vale pine
you need to also tick stacks
hazy breach
The templates can track it too
lilac stag
it litereally walks you through all of it
lusty epoch
ok so antenna is not bis in other words if you don't catch 100%?
With 20% miss, both forge and lily myth sims better, while pace myth is 0,1% worse on 5 min fight.
For 7 mins lily is best, followed by pace, and antenna is 0,1 worse than that. Also forge sims the same as antenna
Just asking cus idk if i should press BiS if antenna drops
final wasp
Its pretty simple
left ledge
I think sims have a % option for antenna right
final wasp
High movement fights, antenna bad, pace better
left ledge
Or is that not in yet
merry bolt
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jDJV3wqj2BQs28wmbj6hzh Is forge and prism still better than what sim say ?
left ledge
IT IS ME
lusty epoch
Low movement fights, antenna good
yeah exactly my thought, just wanted to have confirmation
left ledge
I PASSED ON ANTENNA IN VAULT
lusty epoch
thanks
left ledge
FOR HELMET SOCKET
final wasp
Why dont you just roll natty socket from tier LMAO
lilac stag
Why dont you just roll natty socket from tier LMAO
we are the same
left ledge
Do you know who I am
chrome fern
queue L bozo meme, but not sure if sub channel partakes in that like sin
final wasp
God willfully ignores people that want gloomblade back
left ledge
Then I am willfully forsaken
merry bolt
Low movement fights, antenna good
sorry does that mean still go for it ? m+
left ledge
BUFF BLACK POWDER AND MAKE GLOOM BASELINE
glass cape
why are delves so stinky and bad?
left ledge
why are delves so stinky and bad?
Because they’re in caves and shit duh
merry bolt
Do you move alot while fighting packs in m+?
always straf
final wasp
lilac stag
God willfully ignores people that want gloomblade back
this is why he did not get raptured
shut ridge
BUFF BLACK POWDER AND MAKE GLOOM BASELINE
delete BP
lilac stag
BP is bae
beat the other sub rogue in boss and over dmg on forge using BP over evis 
surely it wasn't rng at the root cause
final wasp
Doesnt count if the other rogue is dead
lilac stag
rogues die?
left ledge
You guys see other rogues in raid?
lilac stag
we somehow got a second. now I'm on rent-a-warrior duty
left ledge
I’m like an endangered species here
shut ridge
rogues die?
it’s the only thing I’m good at
chrome fern
You guys see other rogues in raid?
there's actually 2 of us in our guild, we learn to play sub together this tier after walking up to araz
left ledge
The only other person who would play rogue is in dk prison for us
lilac stag
woyer is 5.5 simmer after 2 resets. kinda crazy
hot ibex
!wa
wicked joltBOT
warm marlin
I PASSED ON ANTENNA IN VAULT
That’s crazy
I would swap to antenna on dimmy rn if we had a little more plat2 damage
And I played it on nexus (no choice but I think I would have anyway)
frigid aurora
hey do you guys use shiv anywhere in st rotation
left ledge
No
left ledge
Use it to BM the boss
frigid aurora
gotcha
left ledge
playing assa and sub
Sim antenna vs boots most likely antenna
sour marsh
but do we play antenna in m+?
sour marsh
I personally prefer forge prism
thats what i use atm
left ledge
Ye it just feels better for my cds
alpine wraith
antenna can go both ways
i kinda dislike it tho
you can kite orbs to us ethem in dances
they last 20 secs
warm marlin
I miss pacemaker
left ledge
If boots aren’t far behind I’d take boots
tropic nimbus
Go to raid than pick
left ledge
But antenna is a good option
left ledge
SAME
sour marsh
😄
chrome fern
i cri now on H dim, we kill p1 too fast i dont have cds for platform 1
hot ibex
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
sour marsh
and boots have leeeech
raven rune
!mistakes
wicked joltBOT
Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:
- Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
- Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
- Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
- If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.
hazy breach
I would swap to antenna on dimmy rn if we had a little more plat2 damage
I begrudgingly took a myth pacemaker out of my vault today, but unfortunately it wont be 723 as im still rocking hc prism
lilac stag
im more of a no rng guy
Says the guy that wants to full stack mastery looking for the one big hit. 
hazy breach
Should be insanely consistent on dimmy
alpine wraith
so will have to wait a long while
warm marlin
or maybe end of plat1 so it’s fine
left ledge
Does anyone else crash out when you only proc single stacks of EB until 3 then it procs the double, do you ever just smash your table and then have to buy a new one mid raid
hazy breach
Just have to hold for like 2 or 3 seconds at the end of plat2
hazy breach
Like 62 or 63 yea
But also even if you do proc its still up for the burnb
Or most of it atleast
Wait nvm it doesnt get the refresh things
Its not 30s by default
warm marlin
It also was proccing when I was legit out of melee when I tested it on rik
I think some other stuff can proc it
Had a sub 3mil p1 yesterday 5 total dances and afk out of melee the rest of the platform
Get this forge off me please it has one good use on pargoth
alpine wraith
time to get our own clip
summer peak
Hey guys, im sersiously struggling to get my macro below to work. Out of combat in Dorng it works perfect but on boss fights the trinket does not pop??
#showtooltip shadow blades
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
tepid trellis
@hazy breach 
hazy breach
Bro is playing without teammates
tepid trellis
paid them all off
solemn lance
!wa
wicked joltBOT
shut ridge
paid them all off
bribery is his secret, noted
nova cairn
<@212854714197344256> <:Pepelaugh:653264351494406156>
Also what is the addon you use for this funny text
shut ridge
need to do the same because they do too much
unkempt drum
__**Unyielding Netherprism**__
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades...
If prism is your only on-use, does this mean you do not use it in M+ for a lust pull at the very start of the dungeon? Because it wouldn't have any stacks yet, right?
warm marlin
<@212854714197344256> <:Pepelaugh:653264351494406156>
Inshallah this boss is removed from wcl
shut ridge
oh wait you got the second big add set lucky
nova cairn
rigid delta
<@212854714197344256> <:Pepelaugh:653264351494406156>
Any VoD of this?
rigid delta
If prism is your only on-use, does this mean you do not use it in M+ for a lust ...
You can cheese it, you can get full stacks on a dummy before you start, then leave the dungeon just before the timer finishes then go back in with full stacks for first pull
unkempt drum
You can cheese it, you can get full stacks on a dummy before you start, then lea...
Turnip time! What if you mess this up or forget it though haha
Just hold for the second flag window in the dungeon?
tepid trellis
Stealthi only streams when an eclispe occurs
nah i just woke up 5min before raid and its first raid with new guild so i cba
nova cairn
nah i just woke up 5min before raid and its first raid with new guild so i cba
This isn't myst?
Ohh ye no Tmy
Where you gone now
tepid trellis
tmy is there
small crag
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
tepid trellis
the feral is tmy
left ledge
I HAVENT BEEN ON SOULBINDER SINCE WEEK 2
warm marlin
left ledge
IM SHADOWBANNED FROM IT
warm marlin
I still have more assa kills of that boss than sub
tepid trellis
Never heard of TheDen before tho
just 80% of myst
nova cairn
just 80% of myst
Reformed Myst
tepid trellis
we are just doing a 6/8 fast run which is the reason im not streaming it
cba turning it on for 1hour
im gonna eat those words now and we are gonna wipe 7 times to araz
nova cairn
im gonna eat those words now and we are gonna wipe 7 times to araz
Payem off on araz as well
mental kettle
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
wicked joltBOT
Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs
fossil forge
@tepid trellis how 11milion pump on soulbinder
dusty totem
Yeah gotta pump those numbers up
tepid trellis
<@83652604344664064> how 11milion pump on soulbinder
press 1-2-3 in the correct order and have people do z
fossil forge
tepid trellis
Payem off on araz as well
nah im assigned to soak
still did like 8.6 but missing 1 dance on adds is just massive
crisp idol
i cant find what am i doing wrong, why do i suck? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/8MQ9w6JcmWVyzCgf?fight=9&type=damage-done&source=49
fast iron
need some help 😛
Got a pretty bad vault, not sure if it's a socket angle or just a ilvl increase angle
I alrdy have myth helm with socket, so this myth helm has socket+speed. other than that idk whats the play
neither of the trinkets are good i guess but i have a champion soulbreaker's sigil...
is screams even good on sub?
dusty totem
The delve belt is getting nerfed soon
fast iron
i mean yeah but how big of a diff would that be as it is
i already have a hero track belt in inventory
is this myth track worth it? its crit/mast
dusty totem
Yeah hero track belt will be better than delve belt after nerf i am pretty sure
So myth track will be the normal amount better in that case
fast iron
the myth in vault is crit heavy, low mast. my hc one is mast heavy, low crit
dusty totem
Yeah crit heavy is a bit sadge
vale pine
20% nerf is quite big
vale pine
also keep in mind you can upgrade heroic pieces higher soon
fast iron
i meant how big of a diff would grabbing a myth belt over my hc belt in inventory would be
so the diff would be hc>myth i guess
regular diff
vale pine
you just go mastery, vers or crit. all 3 is good.
If you craft mastery/vers is usually the best