subtlety

[vale pine]

there is a fine line between testing what is the most efficient for your raid

[lilac stag]

Loom is easy as soon as 2-3 ranged use cds on tendrils. It’s an uphill fight until then.

[vale pine]

vs. not doing mechanics at all

[crisp pond]

think u have a spare point which i usually put in the mist darkness node on right i forgor what its called

[karmic harbor]

playing mechanics properly is the base line, it's how much damage you can do while doing mechanics

[vale pine]

and hope your raid team figures out a way to make the boss die still

[lilac stag]

the tendrils are the fight.

[crisp pond]

i love you. u n me to the end

[plush roost]

Nah the tanks moving boss in p2 is the fight #unbiasedmelee

[shadow lance]

Agreed but in the other way. I was asked to cleave the first prog evening, then warlock ask to have less dps on it so he could destroy it. I've been ask to go assa

[queen plinth]

would u run cb in eco dome?

[crisp pond]

real

[lilac stag]

I just stack with range. Ezlife

[plush roost]

5head

[crisp pond]

i am bad with tea. but yeah tea in eco if u play optimally

[proven plover]

The rdps specs dont Lose nearly as much as the poor assa lad who has to physically move to them, dot them up and then hit them like a wet noodle without cds

[lilac stag]

they get yeeted further

So plenty of room

[queen plinth]

mean i just have it macrod to my shadow dance

since wowhead told me to

[vale pine]

thats correct ^^

[crisp pond]

yeha just go tea. we are talking a 0.3% (made up but prob small) minmax in like 2 dungeons

[vale pine]

you don't rly need to do much to play tea

cold blood is technically harder to play

[crisp pond]

that build works fine for almost everything forever

[limpid sage]

ok but where big sectec

[vale pine]

i play cold blood also in m+

so ^^

[queen plinth]

pressing a macrod sec tech with cb doesnt sound harder ngl

[vale pine]

well you lose damage if you macro it

[plush roost]

Its 1 extra keybind

[vale pine]

roughly 1% dps

[plush roost]

Meow

[crisp pond]

with cb u want to use it on 2nd dance eg when u fully stacked ur flag

[vale pine]

unless you have a 2nd secret bind

[queen plinth]

yea

got 2 sec binds

[remote shuttle]

With no rotten the extra 2% crit Is juicy, Need fast apply fw

[queen plinth]

if cb played correctly its a gain?

[plush roost]

Its honestly neutral with tea unless youre playing at the highest key level where things like boss damage vs aoe of the dungeon becomes relevant

[queen plinth]

im running my 15 eco now

with 703 ilvl

[crisp pond]

depends on target count. eg gambit its not worth i think

[plush roost]

Play what u prefer im doing 17s/18s rn and im just switching around vibe checking talents

[crisp pond]

yee just do tea imo too

[queen plinth]

they were both 711 in 14 gambit. i think im doing okayish

[crisp pond]

its fine and small minmax stuff

[lilac stag]

I think overall people enjoy playing with vigor more

[queen plinth]

sometimes im lagging when im going into cds

brainlagging

[crisp pond]

muscle memory comes with time dw

[queen plinth]

like pressing these fuck ton of buttons

yea was fine yesterday until i got prism and i had to switch binds

[crisp pond]

shindig made a intressting video about mastery of specs

like how ”sure” u are with ur spec

think it applies to sub and outlaw most tho

[lilac stag]

fake it til you make it

[crisp pond]

give it 2 days and u fine i trust

[lilac stag]

assa def still very easy to play wrong and do well with

The other two not so much

[alpine wraith]

think sub and outlaw oopsies have broken more than 1 keyboard and monitor per month

on average

[vale pine]

idk what people do

[alpine wraith]

we also get to enjoy goodies like the coup dash

[vale pine]

to break their monitors and keyboards

[alpine wraith]

anger issues

now you cant hit people

so you break other things

[lilac stag]

I had to move a trinket bind. Accidentally fat fingered araz when I had 18 stack prism. My life was joever

[limpid sage]

you did what to araz

[vale pine]

https://tenor.com/view/denzel-crocker-timmy-turner-fairly-odd-parents-super-f-meme-gif-1224341026557759176

[lilac stag]

Shift-R and Shift-T a little too close to each other.

[alpine wraith]

yea my prism is in shift 2 now

[earnest canyon]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[vale pine]

wait, so you are not manually clicking your rotation?

(i am joking)

[void ocean]

shift-10 here

[crisp pond]

like dying to bad stuff or doing major fuckups make me slam my chair

[lilac stag]

One button was too difficult

[void ocean]

(mouse button 10)

[unkempt glacier]

Our raid leads fix was making the rogue switch to sub and blast adds

[lilac stag]

That was me and Bel

[limpid sage]

dying right as you press flag with netherprism

alt f4

[crisp pond]

getting a fullstacked prism and dying to some shitty bolt or random beam in china

[lilac stag]

I asked if I could swap to assa for more st dmg. Pull up tendrils. You’re fooking 2nd.

[vale pine]

can image

[limpid sage]

ye or a silly little tank frontal that they decide to spin last millisecond

[lilac stag]

You can blast them, that’s for sure. Step makes it super easy

[crisp pond]

real af. for me like last sunday when i died to beam on nexus king got br and insta died to a beam 10 sec later

i was rerolling feral irl the way i wanted to scream

[willow egret]

can anyone help me finetuning my sub rogue pls unable to keep up my dps with other players

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/kdgG2QY1vqzMaZwF?fight=last&pins=0%24Separate%24%23a04D8A%24damage%240%240.0.0.Any%24214807839.0.0.Rogue%24true%240.0.0.Any%24false%240&playermetric=playerscore

logs in case more info

[fossil forge]

Do!log

[mighty citrus]

for people who are using liquid WA on frac, did it occur to you that you yell another symbol than what you actually got assinged to?

[woeful barn]

Bigwigs or dbm setting for markers p sure

Everyone in the raid has to have the setting unchecked

[mighty citrus]

i think it does not automark on frac mythic

but iam not sure

[obsidian crag]

!gear

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1406266615619784765/suble.webp

[tribal blade]

immediate thing is your BP is very low

if you're doing gambit the entire first area you're just spamming BP

[willow egret]

so i need to use more bp

[tribal blade]

it would help for sure

[willow egret]

and not evis

ok

got it

[tribal blade]

when you use evis you essentially cap yourself like outlaw

[finite sequoia]

should prolly evis if there are no other prio specs no?

[tribal blade]

not worth doing slightly more prio to do far less aoe

[tribal blade]

nah even then

BP isn't that far behind evis in dmg, and most of our prio comes from stuff like strike/ub/coup/sectec

[finite sequoia]

i see

[frank wadi]

I understand for Sub we should never macro flagelation with shadowblades as we want to use them before a finisher, especially on opener. Same idea as shiving late or TTing after kingsbane...

But besides having separate button for SOD, is it advisable to macro SOD and dance? I dont recall every pressing dance without using symbols
Thanks!

[tribal blade]

depends on the pull though

eco dome is a good example, on the pactspeakers and sentinels i just full spam evis

because those 2 mobs are by far way more deadly than everything else in the pack and need to die asap

[steel zinc]

S1 uses NS then just put in the note nadisable

[errant cobalt]

/wa

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[lilac stag]

People gonna argue this until you’re blue in the face. But streamer does evis.

embrace our overlord powder of the black

[tribal blade]

haha yeah maybe

honestly i dunno, maybe i'll experiment with using evis spam more on big mobs

but for now BP spam is doing fine

[lilac stag]

I tried it, do not recommend

[tribal blade]

but on huge pulls there's no shot i'm pressing evis

[lilac stag]

Like 3 paladin 2 priests. Fml evis is dog

Prio melts from blades, st and coup

[tribal blade]

yeah i've looked at my dmg on certain fights like big momma where i'm spamming BP

i'm still doing good boss dam

[lilac stag]

mmhm

[tribal blade]

not far behind the havoc

actually big momma is weird, aoe pad is ethical dmg on that fight because the adds must die lol

it's very bad if they die slow

[lilac stag]

all our dmg is ethical

Everything must die in a key

[runic trail]

I pad so that the other DPS can focus on boss damage

[lilac stag]

Screw your havoc’s funnel

[slate lantern]

Pretty much all subs damage is in our cd window which to do good damage, you need to exact perfectly. Just looking at the first window, you didn't case flagellation, you delayed casting shadow blades, symbols of death and sectec (which you didn't supercharge). Idk if the pack died or what but this window is pretty jank, I'd go back to the wowhead guide and see exactly what is being pressed when, and practice on dummies til you can do it in your sleep

[runic trail]

I shall shoulder this burden

[tribal blade]

honestly just be sin on big momma and do literally everything

[lilac stag]

@tribal blade I highrolled with 18prism on first boss in priory. Ended up being a 55 second fight and like 11.5m overall. the lock and fury were laughing wondering wtf happened.

[tribal blade]

niiiice

honestly the tier set seems to proc decently well on average

the times i low roll are not frequent

but are painfully obvious when they happen

[willow egret]

thank you for being critically honest

i shall practice the rotation more

[remote shuttle]

Learning piano Is always nice

[lilac stag]

It just made me laugh at how big the swing can be

[tribal blade]

oh yeah high rolling right now feels so good

[lilac stag]

I think I rather is be less highs and lows but it be what it be

or rng highs and lows

[tribal blade]

i think i would prefer if they increased the proc chance and reduced the dmg from the 2nd coup

but that might be even more busted

[lilac stag]

not sure. The delay irritates me

[tribal blade]

which delay?

[lilac stag]

shadowcraft / coup / premed blah blah blah

[native zodiac]

When your tierset doesnt proc a single time and theres no coup in the first dance in the opener

[cloud rover]

Skill issue

clearly

[remote shuttle]

Can't happen if u dance at 2 ub

[native zodiac]

Well thats hard to achieve in the opener

[remote shuttle]

Sec tec and u have 2 free ub to make 4

[remote shuttle]

Mmm u have 1 as u ss

[tribal blade]

oh yes

[alpine wraith]

this man is lost in the coco

[tribal blade]

100%

the delays are driving me nuts

[remote shuttle]

Just wait the second spreading rup

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/microwave-smell-blue-futurama-gif-11233131

[lilac stag]

RS all over again

[tribal blade]

yeah i have to do micro delays on gcds in cds

to account for it all

doesn't help playing with 200 ms makes it even jankier to deal with

[lilac stag]

which is batshit stupid for a gcd locked spec

[remote shuttle]

Think i could't be able to play with 100+ ms i dunno how u do what u do with 200

[tribal blade]

it's not fun sometimes lol

can't last second move out of anything, you get hit

also spell queueing nightmare

[remote shuttle]

I have fps trouble in raid, like araz 30 fps (in m+ i'm likes 90/120 fps)

[tribal blade]

sin is mostly fine to play with high ms, sub is moderately hard, outlaw is downright abyssmal

[remote shuttle]

Becomes so clunky and slow when things react slowly

Ye

[lilac stag]

switch from plater to Kui for raid

[tribal blade]

look into your settings for raid

[remote shuttle]

Oh ok bud ty for info

Will try today

[lilac stag]

you dont need plater for raiding

[warm marlin]

Noob isn’t hitting the prewipe sectec

[tribal blade]

this is what i have for raid

[remote shuttle]

Playing with quazii graphic settup

[lilac stag]

kui is streamlined and you can get it how you want it quite easily

[tribal blade]

the big ones are you want particle density on high

[remote shuttle]

Ye i use same exact

[tribal blade]

cool cool 😉

[lilac stag]

👍

[remote shuttle]

Ty Bud Always looking what u big guys are doing to do better

[tribal blade]

i am small guy

[lilac stag]

just remember to turn plater back on in keys hahah

[remote shuttle]

Guess i'm a microbe so 🧐

[lilac stag]

all my color coding gone

[remote shuttle]

Yepp

[tribal blade]

i've actually done quite a few keys with quazzi this season

[remote shuttle]

Have Add-ons setup for raid and m+ separated (likes no archon raider.io Quest helpers and other stuff for raid)

[tribal blade]

one last one we did he was having UI problems and had to keep reloading his UI in a 17 eco

and we barely missed the timer

it was sad

[remote shuttle]

Darn

[tribal blade]

granted people died in stupid ways

[lilac stag]

Why you calling me out

[tribal blade]

like the healer died on the last boss for no reason

and then after wondered why the timer was so tight

[remote shuttle]

I miss last 15 in time (halls) then Will try 16s but q simulator has become bad last week

[queen plinth]

during flag do i press dance the moment my first dance ends?

to play it optimally?

[tribal blade]

after reset halls will be much easier

[remote shuttle]

Also quazii having ui issue sound like curse bro

[queen plinth]

what if i dont get my longer dance from being out of combat? still just send

[remote shuttle]

Ye arakara and halls nerfs

[tribal blade]

lol yeah

i don't blame him at all, it sucks

no floodgate nerfs for some reason

floodgate will become the hardest key on reset

[remote shuttle]

Still i timed ara kara 15 with likes 5 mins on timer, didn't feel that bad as halls (timed 14 with like 8 secs and lotsof timer deplete before that One)

[tribal blade]

i played out of my mind to time 16 halls

[remote shuttle]

Ye think prio too

[tribal blade]

was able to kinda carry this feral in it

[remote shuttle]

Prio and flood new hardest

[tribal blade]

floodgate is just strangely hard right now

everything in there hurts so bad this season

[remote shuttle]

Ye

[obsidian crag]

during aoe, we only use shuriken storm dureing coup procs?

[remote shuttle]

And using prism doesn't help 🤣

Deaths are so punishing

[tribal blade]

yeah honestly the only dungeon i'm at serious risk of dying seems to be FG

every other dungeon i don't really die

[tribal blade]

yes between coups in blades

[remote shuttle]

Mmmh i see that's good, i still Need to work, some runs 0 deaths, but others i die like once in the entire Key... If happens with 10+ prism stacks Is so bad

[tribal blade]

random deaths happen

it's the nature of keys

[obsidian crag]

during aoe, if i am out of cd, should i keep backstabing to generate combo points? So i can get coup procs, or should i go shuriken storm all the time?

[tribal blade]

storm

[remote shuttle]

Ye Just improving day by day, that's the fun part of playing

[tribal blade]

dmg out of cds is very low for sub, you use that time to farm cdr

[remote shuttle]

Shuriken fast generate cp aoe (faster CDR than bs) bs if u sniping ub, also shuriken saves Ur passive stacks If u aim pooling to send back to backs in cd

(mean Shadow Techniques stacks)

[tribal blade]

yeah more cdr and more dmg because you can storm>BP>storm>BP

instead of stab>stab>stab>stab>finisher

[remote shuttle]

Yup or also storm rup storm rup if u spreading rup to cover effect under incoming cds

[slate marlin]

stah stab wait wait wait stab stab finisher

u proc tea after the 3rd stab

[obsidian crag]

are u guys using chaos flasks?

[lilac stag]

You won’t proc tea if it’s macro’d to dance

[tribal blade]

god they need to remove that part of tea

[remote shuttle]

Stab stab gograbacupofcoffe stab stab rollacig stab finisher

[tribal blade]

so toxic

[remote shuttle]

The auto use?

[tribal blade]

yeah

[remote shuttle]

The reason why im not using tea

[tribal blade]

i still use tea

[remote shuttle]

Is Just that

[tribal blade]

i love having vigor talented

better mental = more dps for me

[lilac stag]

you cycle them out quickly and the one or two that fuck it procced are whatever

[remote shuttle]

1 vigor + 2x crit (no tea no cb) should have sense with no rotten?

[lilac stag]

we have so much crit rotten isn’t really a concern afaik

[remote shuttle]

Just to not lose so much crit and grab some extra energy (mainly to play with tornado, with 100 energy Is pretty bad)

[lilac stag]

Just don’t play tornado

Ignore that shit

[remote shuttle]

Ye i usually don't

[lilac stag]

Like it’s haste

[remote shuttle]

From DF i hated it

But woha It burst CDR After cds

Or fast fw before cds

[lilac stag]

FW really ain’t that difficult to have up these days.

[remote shuttle]

True

[swift tinsel]

Imo once you’re at or above 25% crit rotten falls off

[remote shuttle]

CDR still juicy

[swift tinsel]

And FW becomes auto in aoe

[remote shuttle]

Im exactly 25%

Crit

[swift tinsel]

Storm gets so much passive crit

[limpid sage]

doesn't help that the timer is crazy small in relation to the amount of count you need

like every pull feels like it's a bl pull in terms of size

not in terms of danger though

[swift tinsel]

I’m kinda hoping they look at a few other dungeons and knock 10% off the count

Like they did with halls

[lilac stag]

My shit vision hates the water boss. I avoid it just because of that experience.

[limpid sage]

it's seriously testing my object permanence

as soon as I can't see a wave under the boss it doesn't exist anymore in my mind

and then I get surprised seeing it 0.3s later coming towards me

luckily you can play reactively xd

[lilac stag]

for everything else they’ve tried to make more “visual” that shit is in game now twice in an expansion

fuck right off

[limpid sage]

I'd imagine it's impossible if you're blue green color blind

[graceful osprey]

Ladies and gentlemen, may the RNG gods bless your vault today

[limpid sage]

ok nvm the water is actually very muddy and a different color

[swift tinsel]

I’m either getting hc forge or myth tier

Maybe myth pacemaker

[lilac stag]

my depth perception is kinda a mess after a slew of eye surgeries. There’s no setting I can get to make the bubbles actually more than a soft halo with nearly no contrast. I absolutely hate it.

[lilac stag]

That’s the water setting with the liquid textures adjusted via a WA afaik

[fallow nimbus]

That's the old school water texture

Like minimum setting

[limpid sage]

I need to change it to this

[lilac stag]

yea you force it for that encounter with a wa

[fallow nimbus]

The setting one above is the best, clear water but no fancy ripples or reflections

[spiral sierra]

with the araz trinket and nether prism, how does the timings look?

i think theres a ! command, but i don't remember it

[hazy breach]

Rotate them on every blades

[spiral sierra]

ok

[graceful osprey]

I’m hoping to get prism today. Blizzard please

[spiral sierra]

GL 🙂

[rancid spade]

for m+ what are good players doing that bad players aren't

i only recently started playing rogue and i feel comfortable with sin in m+ but not so much with sub. i feel like i have rotation down but my dps is not keeping up with other classes

[junior light]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[graceful osprey]

For sub, go all gas, pop CDs all day everyday

[ivory salmon]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[graceful osprey]

We just want to capitalize on our burst timings, so if you’re with a tank that likes to chain pull, hold for when the tank grabs everything and then go to town

[short radish]

uhhhhh

no

do not pop cds all day every day

????

!design

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety is designed to be a spec with highs and lows. During your cooldowns you do immense burst and have plenty of buttons to spam but conversely outside of symbols and dance you do not do any damage whatsoever. This means that having some periods of "afk" downtime where you do not press a button because you're out of energy is the intended way the spec plays. As long as its not happening inside your cooldowns (flag/blades/dance/symbols) its not a problem at all, and especially nothing that having more haste would "fix".

[lilac stag]

Using CDs aggressively. Treating the key as one big encounter and not hyper fixating on saving stuff for start of boss pull.

can be more of a challenge in less organized pugs

[graceful osprey]

Well, I didn’t mean to pop CDs just all off cooldown. But scath explains it better lol

[lilac stag]

but sitting on cds too long and losing casts overall generally really bad practice

[short radish]

brother you can't just say "go all gas pop cds all day" and not have someone take it as "don't pop all of them on cooldown"

[lilac stag]

It lights up, I pop it. I am Ret

[swift tinsel]

https://github.com/Xadro3/Smashatar/raw/master/gif.gif

[rancid spade]

sometimes i accidently press shadow dance or symbols twice is there a way to make it press only once every second?

[swift tinsel]

!sod

[wicked jolt]

Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs

[swift tinsel]

Dance is special and can’t be double-pressed so no need for same macro for that one

[rancid spade]

oh true

[warm marlin]

heavy vers mast boe ring is already 3mil on NA

[swift tinsel]

Yeesh

I’m hoping to make that much reselling inky black potions

[alpine wraith]

i will try to get an only mastery one

but will wait a bit

[warm marlin]

i will get the alpha ring eventually and boe will replace the db one since i will not get from vault

[brazen cypress]

hi all,
on my elemental shaman, I'm using this macro that replaces chain lightning with tempest when it procs

#showtooltip /cast [known:Tempest] Tempest(); Chain Lightning

I'm trying to create the same for the sub replacing the black powder with Coup de grace. but for some reason I can only see coup de grace when it procs, but never black powder

#showtooltip /cast [known:Coup de Grace] Coup de Grace(); Black Powder

anyone tried it?

[swift tinsel]

Sounds like a more complicated way to just press coup when it procs

Coup is a weird ability

[brazen cypress]

2 buttons for finishers in aoe (this macro + sectec)
2 buttons for finishers in ST (eviscerate + sectec)

but you are right, i'm just lazy xD

[swift tinsel]

3 buttons total (evisc BP Sectech)

[brazen cypress]

the weird part is that the coup part of the macro just works fine. is black powder that doesn't

[swift tinsel]

[karmic harbor]

hmmmmmm

[fallow nimbus]

Eviscerate is coup but bp isn't so it will always use the first ability in that macro

[lilac stag]

^ our special is just a fancy name for evicerate

[brazen cypress]

same is for shaman tempest is on lightning bolt, not chain lightning

[swift tinsel]

If it works for tempest tho

[lilac stag]

is it on your stealth bar?

[swift tinsel]

Which replaces lb

[brazen cypress]

nope

[rough jewel]

if u shadowdance then u are in stealth

[lilac stag]

Look at you assuming blizzard codes the same. So cute.

[swift tinsel]

I already said coup is weird

[lilac stag]

Add it to your stealth bar

Then try it

[swift tinsel]

Three eviscerates in a trench coat

[lilac stag]

6 with little shadow friends

[brazen cypress]

testing the macro on first row, 7th column

[short radish]

thats a quick ban

[limpid sage]

Have you tried without any of the conditionals and “()” at the end of coup

Donno if it works like bloodbath did on fury

[brazen cypress]

without conditionals it only shows coup. without the () at the end doesn't work coup either

[karmic harbor]

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder```
this works btw, but it doesnt show black powder icon ever

[warm marlin]

[karmic harbor]

but ig if you arent looking at keybinds it's w,e

[lilac stag]

#showtooltip Black Powder

[limpid sage]

This is what I meant ye

[karmic harbor]

sry i forgot to add #showtooltip at the top

still doesnt show bp icon, just coup

[lilac stag]

Even forcing it to BP?

You can make show tooltip show anything

[lone linden]

it will only show the coup tooltip if coup has procced

[karmic harbor]

if you force it to BP, it never changes to coup

[lilac stag]

You don’t need it to. Evic will show it

Or idk a WA

[karmic harbor]

you dont need the icon for bp either?

[swift tinsel]

Yeah is a bit redundant if you already have evisc on bars

[karmic harbor]

it's just weird

but it works

[swift tinsel]

And/or WA

Unless you PvP

And change every tooltip to show stuff lol

[lilac stag]

Every tooltip is shadowstep

[brazen cypress]

this does the job

#showtooltip Black Powder /cast Coup de Grace /cast Black Powder

never shows coup icon, but it triggers it, thank you

[lilac stag]

We’ve got a winner!

Go team!

[swift tinsel]

Yay redundancy!

[lilac stag]

add shuriken storm to it

[swift tinsel]

U won’t

[lilac stag]

I will

[brazen cypress]

i'm just going sub after evoker, shaman and dh.... too many buttons on my subs, need time to manage them in my head xD

[brisk onyx]

!def

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Defensive Spreadsheet: > Click to open <

[limpid sage]

What happens if you add () to the back of coup

And remove the specified tooltip

[lilac stag]

I mean we have way less shit than enhance

[brazen cypress]

never played enha, just elem (it's 3 buttons....)

[north schooner]

you can surround text in triple backticks (`) to create a code block

[lilac stag]

Yeah enhance stole them all.

20 situational keybinds

I just want to zap lighting from my fists

[swift tinsel]

And also have your key presses feel like you pressed them

And sound like it

[brazen cypress]

shows question mark instead of BP and the coup icon when it procs

[lilac stag]

can you add known to the tooltip, I thought you could but I maybe mistaken.

[brazen cypress]

nope, it breaks the macro

[umbral fulcrum]

someone mentioned yesterday that lily+prism isn't worth and i should just use a passive+prism, but my sim shows lily+prism as a gain on patchwerk 1t 5m. should i be simming some other way?

[lilac stag]

Lily and prism is fine

and you likely got partial information from your inquiry

[limpid sage]

Weird

[spiral sierra]

get this man (or woman) a medal!

[limpid sage]

Given the macro still works for using bp

[umbral fulcrum]

my original question was should i stack up prism to 18 or just alternate lily/prism if there's no amp on a fight

since you can just lily for every cd window

i know you alternate prism + forge bc forge is a 2m

[lilac stag]

Fight timer dependent.

[umbral fulcrum]

so i want to end on a prism use i assume

[lilac stag]

Prism should be stronger than lily at both 9 and 18, so I wouldn’t want to lose casts of it

Double on use helps offset the trinket less blades

[warm marlin]

alternating lily and prism will lead to stacking prism to 18 no

[umbral fulcrum]

what

[lilac stag]

If you alternate it’s Lily and 9

otherwise it’s Lily, Lily, 18

[umbral fulcrum]

it takes ~3m to stack prism to 18

[warm marlin]

lily pull
prism (9 stack)
lily 3mins
prism (18 stack)
lily
prism (18 stack)

[umbral fulcrum]

yea thats basically what ive been doing

[lilac stag]

again it’s fight length dependent. If you’re shits dead at 3 mins, I want 18 there

so you have flexibility

or thinking for some people. Haha

[warm marlin]

yes always end with prism

[umbral fulcrum]

this is almost exclusively for mythic prog so i dont think ill be seeing any short fights like that any time soon

[lilac stag]

mythic you’re looking at Amps and adds

[umbral fulcrum]

im so bad...

first tier playing sub

[lilac stag]

they’re dead so you can’t be that bad

[graceful osprey]

True, my explanation was bad lol

[umbral fulcrum]

im used to better parses as assa

feeling exposed lol

[lilac stag]

look at lorrgs and see cds timings. Ignore stuff that uses prism on pull since I don’t think it has all onuse trinkets filters or.

[lilac stag]

Congrats on playing the mindless spec well

assa’s worst nightmare. Sub is good.

[karmic harbor]

yeah the skill gap between sub and assa players is quite high

im jk

[lilac stag]

it’s just different and well not kind to errors

[karmic harbor]

sub is like opener and dance

if you can do those 2 things you're good

[young path]

Mechanics and raid positioning can bring immense pain to a parse

Example, getting the first circle debuff on plexus on pull

Almost unrecoverable

[lilac stag]

Uptime is bad, CDR goes to shit, cds don’t line up.

[karmic harbor]

[young path]

And recommend not playing on starlink… the daily MS struggle is real

[lament fiber]

haste

[karmic harbor]

i also think people forget if you've killed soul hunters your parses are up against other good players

compared to playing assa on plex/loom/soulbinder

which even pugs are killing these days

[warm marlin]

how far u running out cuh

sprint + dip out last 2s step back, drop like 1 global

[warm osprey]

is there anyone who does cheap good coaching, it may not help, i may be too old and slow to play this game, but my god am i dog shit this tier

[plush roost]

Shadowstep your boomkin 1 1 second before circle

[steel jolt]

People will help you for free here

[plush roost]

Show him whos boss

[warm marlin]

real

[karmic harbor]

i know boomkins are bad but they might react after 11 seconds

[young path]

Our raid lead is super sensitive about insta running them out because of damage it causes around u and people too brain dead to move

[short radish]

i dunno if it's cheap though

[sweet raven]

is the double ST 1st dance is actually 100% achievable with every scenario (no shadow technique stack, no sham buff, no lust) or anything?

im struggling hard sometimes

[short radish]

dont think so

[sweet raven]

and idk why

[karmic harbor]

why do we even want double sectec in 1st dance

[short radish]

because you can just squeeze it in sometimes

but like

dont bother

[lavish girder]

It's not mandatory it's just if you can you slam it

[short radish]

just do your rotation normally

[astral axle]

show your dominance and shadowstep your RL when you get the circle

solution simple

[swift tinsel]

its not 100%, needs a bit of luck/rng

[sweet raven]

Ok i thought i was doing something wrong

[swift tinsel]

benefits from fully stacked flag, DM, flawless stacks

[lilac stag]

Ask permission first. Consent is important.

[swift tinsel]

bigly button

and also means likely triple sectech in blades

[short radish]

[plush roost]

The third sec tec is super tight

[swift tinsel]

ye

[young path]

If u vanish and evis in the opener, won’t the odds of getting coup almost immediately after sec tech go up? Which then has a higher potential into ensuring second sec tech cast w/TFD?

[plush roost]

But can be done with good coup rng

[vernal drift]

Iam kinda confused with m+ builds, some use the rotten with tea, others cb etc. Any tips here?

[swift tinsel]

if you pre-disorient it helps with double sectech

[plush roost]

If youre predisorienting ye its guanateed

[warm marlin]

i assume u mean flag

[astral axle]

getting the pre-di-- yeah what haptics said

[lilac stag]

You can drop rotten with enough crit.

Vigor vs CB is personal pref. Most enjoy the gameplay of vigor better. CB is better in constant lower target pulls and ST

[swift tinsel]

ye I use them kinda interchangeably

[warm marlin]

triple sectec in blades needs like taza hm style prestack

[swift tinsel]

in blades is highroll heaven

[warm marlin]

nah not possible

without prestack

[upbeat sorrel]

If we drop rotten do we go finality

[sweet raven]

How much dps variance sub has btw

[swift tinsel]

a fair bit with tier set

[lilac stag]

ye

I’m at around 30% crit now and FW spread so easily.

[short radish]

more th an last tier

its like 8%?

or something

or 12

[sweet raven]

Any %?

ok its quite big

[plush roost]

Prestack. Pot. Lust. Flag rupture. Backstab Sectec coup coup strike evis strike coup sectec storm coup strike evis strike coup coup strike sectec simple.

[short radish]

but i might just be making that number up

[warm marlin]

4.6% stdev

[sweet raven]

Ok it might be quite low

[warm marlin]

on simulationcraft

[short radish]

okay yeah im making that number up

[sweet raven]

Lmao

[short radish]

[warm marlin]

its within the top 10 of all specs tho

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/misinformation-spreading-spreading-misinformation-online-gif-4543841945782036495

You would never

[warm marlin]

so its pretty high

[astral axle]

[plush roost]

Mm variance psh

[short radish]

sometimes you try your best, and it just isn't enough

but that's okay I just need to accept i'm a failure sometimes

[plush roost]

How about my shadowcraft refund bugging out variance?

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/krill-issue-skill-issue-krill-issue-gif-25572478

[lilac stag]

How do we go from RS hell to Shadowcraft hell.

at least RS you could drop

[short radish]

it's not a bug, it's a feature

[swift tinsel]

double the coups, double the fun

[astral axle]

every day i play sub
is a day im not playing sin
and therefore a good day

[lilac stag]

My subscription was a bug. Fixed that.

[plush roost]

The fact that it can award the refund after coup at 1.7 seconds.is so criminal man

[swift tinsel]

I play sin when I have trouble sleeping and need help

[plush roost]

Just end me

[short radish]

wooooooo delayed damage

whoever could have seen this coming from blizzard

[swift tinsel]

surely they fix that with midnight

[short radish]

no they're going to add another button that has delayed damage

[swift tinsel]

hell yeah

gimme more split damage while you're at it

[short radish]

so now we have

coup
sectech
midnight storm (new ability)

[swift tinsel]

I want backstab to be

Back

then Stab

[lilac stag]

Every CD back on the gcd

[plush roost]

Subs apex talent is just bug fixes

[warm marlin]

i think the coup gcd thing is actually a bigger issue that most arent realizing yet

with 4p

[swift tinsel]

and storm to be

[upbeat sorrel]

Do you open with storm after dance

[swift tinsel]

Shruriken

then Storm

[warm marlin]

the amount of good players whose logs ive looked at who are dropping gcds in dance is more than it should be

[plush roost]

Oh buddy ive realized it since ptr

[umbral fulcrum]

is that whats happening to me???

i thought i was just lagging

[lilac stag]

I do a storm into evic to get snd running. Then CDs

[plush roost]

Theres a delay and sometimes it literally happens at .01 second of your next gcd

[short radish]

wait what's the cause of this?

[plush roost]

Its insane

[swift tinsel]

def been feeling this

[short radish]

is this what you guys were cooking upw ith the WA last week?

[short aurora]

Can we roll with 0 haste or is that illegal?

[short radish]

illegal because chest has haste

[swift tinsel]

ye lowest haste you can get is like

900

[astral axle]

Midnight leak:
[Stab] Only usable from the front of enemies. [Backstab] Only usable from the back of enemies. [Sidestab] Only usable from the side of enemies. [Shadow Strike] Only usable while standing inside of an enemy's shadow.

[plush roost]

Haste is bad ye

[warm marlin]

because both

1. getting full coup/all sectec clones in dance (requiring near insta chaining dance sometimes) and
2. not dropping a gcd in dance

is actually very hard

[short radish]

you could try run cursed rings and also roll negative haste on flask

[swift tinsel]

with full myth chest

[short radish]

but then you also get some back from mana oil

[short aurora]

I got vers mastery non set from m+ so i can get shoulder from loomi and actually run 0 haste

[warm marlin]

like with 4 coups per blades, if you insta chain dance to not lose coup/sectec damage, you only have 0.2s of grace period

[short aurora]

Chest

[plush roost]

...? Whetstone brotha

[short radish]

mana oil is more damage

gotta get that 0.1%

[warm marlin]

and most people are not instantly queueing their gcd after pressing dance

[plush roost]

Whetstone sims higher for me

[short radish]

tier shoulder also has haste

[short aurora]

Oh

[short radish]

tier shoulder is BIG haste

tier chest is little haste

so we take tier chest

[short aurora]

Oh true

Im dumb

[swift tinsel]

and loom off-set shoulder

[short radish]

oil + wax sims higher for me

[plush roost]

I set my spell queue window to 150 because of this bug btw XDDDD

[lilac stag]

Wax + AP should be even unless you are crit deprived

[warm marlin]

i made a new keybind with a dance/symbols/bs macro just for blades opener, where i wait until my gcd is ready to press it

because you just need the leeway of instantly casting after dance

[nova cairn]

Is there a way you can actually change our fibers on raidbots

[astral axle]

yuh in the gems section i think

[plush roost]

Little + icon should be what u want in top gear

[lilac stag]

I like how sub is doing damage, the bugs and gameplay interference is just not fun.

[nova cairn]

Ohh ffs

you're jokin

I am dense

[lilac stag]

I have zero confidence anything gets fixed

For midnight

unless they blow it up

[swift tinsel]

this is mostly where I'm at too

[bright briar]

supposed to be the best expansion...

[astral axle]

oh you saw

[swift tinsel]

as long as they don't make things worse

[spice lichen]

oh damn am i supposed to be rocking the oils instead of the sharpening stones

[swift tinsel]

which is def a possibility

[short radish]

[lilac stag]

Every expansion ever

[spice lichen]

yeah nvm i see your message now

oopsie

[swift tinsel]

Lol was just watching Madseason's Shadowlands retrospective

[plush roost]

What do you mean, like a macro that does all 3 if the global is available?

[nova cairn]

I am so dense

[swift tinsel]

and how it was supposed to be great relative to BFA

[astral axle]

easy to miss, there's a lot of knobs and stuff in raidbots nowadays :]

[swift tinsel]

and I'm getting similar vibes about TWW->Midnight

[warm marlin]

yes makes it so i have a 0ms gap between dance activation and gcd starting

[nova cairn]

tyty ❤️

[plush roost]

Bro its just like season 2 df omfg

[warm marlin]

in my testing so far allows me to insta chain dance to not lose my sectec clone damage without dropping a gcd in the second dance

[plush roost]

Yeah makes a lot of sense good comms

I remember old tfd was +4cp on dance cast

[warm marlin]

because like 80% of my nexus king pulls i was dropping a gcd in second dance

[plush roost]

So i had a macro that combined gloomblade and dance on the same global

And one that did it for evis as well

Back when this spec was 4 buttons

Maybe i should do that too tbh, just annoying since i have so many keybinds being eaten up already

[stoic token]

you end up going into dance with full cp often, that doesnt really work

[warm marlin]

not for blades

[plush roost]

No its as an extra button

[warm marlin]

and ya an extra bind

[warm marlin]

i looked at my logs and i usually had 150ms-200ms gap between dance cast and backstab

[short radish]

wait so how does your opener work now with this?

[warm marlin]

and just this amount is enough to lose gcd in second dance with insta chain 💀

[plush roost]

Yeah that is enough to lose a global zzz

[short radish]

shadow strike -> flag -> rupture -> new macro with everything?

[warm marlin]

strike flag rupture (wait until gcd ready) macro

[short radish]

👍

thats

Dance
Symbols
Shadowblade
Backstab

right?

[stoic token]

no you cant macro anything unfortunately

[warm marlin]

no blades is later with sectec

[short radish]

oh so
Dance
Symbols
Backstab

[stoic token]

blades is 1 global later

[warm marlin]

need another macro for shadowstrike too

[plush roost]

So youre just doing it on your first dance cast and not the second one obv

[warm marlin]

xd

[hazy breach]

Hi its me

[short radish]

wait

[plush roost]

Fun

[short radish]

what the fuck

[stoic token]

you can bind them together and honestly not lose much dps

[short radish]

how many macros do you need

holy shit

[swift tinsel]

we're fdk now

one for every builder

[short radish]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/s27aLma4E1WQp6UUG7vJN5

nvm just run wax + whetstone

[warm marlin]

I was referring to you your second clone on nexus opener

[hazy breach]

Ye it was a bad pull

But theres a bunch of others too last i checked

[plush roost]

Btw were talking like insane super duper minmax HoF stuff. Not asking if we can macro stuff as noobs all g tho

[lilac stag]

Haha you’re welcome

[hazy breach]

Especially when you get good coup procs

[short radish]

old sims for me was having wax + oil at 0.4 inc and wax + whestone at 0.2

[warm marlin]

yes happening to a lot of people

[short radish]

maybe i got more crit though

[plush roost]

Hi its me 2

[lilac stag]

likely.

[warm marlin]

the macro also allows me to not get griefed by the sod rupture refund bug

so its double usage

[lilac stag]

Sims keeps wanting more

[karmic harbor]

what's the macro?

[plush roost]

Real

[stoic token]

when going into your second shadowblades should you just always refresh rupture after flag?

[warm marlin]

just dance/symbols with the null thing/backstab, only use to open blades, for gcd minmax cringe

[swift tinsel]

if its duration is less than like 28-30sec I do

[leaden prairie]

But your screen is flat tho, so depth perception doesn't do anything right

[plush roost]

Not required, if your rupture is already 30 seconds u can just evis or just send dance

[warm marlin]

macro gaming in taza hm

no more delay gg

[plush roost]

?

Wdym

Theres a .003 delay

[stoic token]

like dance/symbols, sectech, shadowblades?

[plush roost]

8^)

[warm marlin]

server lag

[plush roost]

Ye

[short radish]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[hazy breach]

For some reason my muscle memory always ends up with like 0.2-0.3s delay inbetween my dance and backstab and it didnt use to be a problem, but now with twice the coup i probably should get on the macro boat

[short radish]

!dance

[warm marlin]

ya i was good with it but its definitely an issue with new 4p

[stoic token]

if i have coup i should hold and open dance and if i have evis i evis and then dance?

[plush roost]

This is good comms ty mr bingussy

[warm marlin]

np gamer hope they fix all the coup stuff with midnight

[hazy breach]

But surely its getting fixed soon right

[plush roost]

Real

[hazy breach]

[sweet raven]

btw talking about naked sectech this morning, i learned its useless in single target but what about AOE

[plush roost]

In aoe its fine just make sure its up for cds

[short radish]

so it's

#showtooltip
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Symbols of Death
/cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow Dance

?

[hazy breach]

If sectech is up you should just dance

And start of with sectech

[short radish]

and acutally sit and wait for the gcd

and not spam like a monkey

[stoic token]

really how is secteching outside of shadowblades worth it... i dont understand lol

[warm marlin]

i cant login but its just
/cast dance
/castsequence symbols, null blah blah normal macro thing
/cast backstab

[hazy breach]

!sod

[wicked jolt]

Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs

[swift tinsel]

it does more damage than evisc

[hazy breach]

This bit

Not sure the /cqs is needed

[short radish]

#showtooltip
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null
/cqs
/cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow Dance

[warm marlin]

i took the cqs out and it seemed to be fine not sure what it does

[stoic token]

right so why not put it inside shadowblades instead of pressing shadowblades after

[junior timber]

what is the cqs?

[leaden prairie]

It's so you can't spam the button

[warm marlin]

no bonusbar thing needed

[swift tinsel]

bc the clones inherit it

[leaden prairie]

And it send out a bunch of sod

[stoic token]

ty makes sense

[swift tinsel]

and it's habit for a lot of people to press blades after sectech bc it didn't benefit until relatively recently

[warm marlin]

im not sure if it works different with an extended macro but i mashed the backstab one and it didnt multi send

[leaden prairie]

But there is a natural delay I'm pretty sure on off GCD abilities so that's not really possible

[gritty kite]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: **You can stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. This is to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[short radish]

#showtooltip
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null
/cast Backstab

3rd times the charm

[warm marlin]

yeye

[sweet raven]

macroing shadow dance with backstab is shit btw? i have an old reflex from legion to shadowstrike right after shadow dance lmao

[short radish]

thanks bingus

[warm marlin]

and make one for shadowstrike too if you need FW

[short radish]

fuck

surely not

FUCK

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/arthas-gif-23435752

[warm marlin]

got them on ctrl 1/ctrl 2 only cast them once every 90s anyway

[swift tinsel]

we get our pillar macros!

[spice lichen]

am I crazy is dance not on gcd?

[short radish]

im using ctrl 2 for my potion though

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/hell-descent-descend-going-to-gif-12003417268237105589

[leaden prairie]

What about one that starts with sec tech Instead

[hazy breach]

Ctrl 1 is hp pot

[short radish]

stop it

[swift tinsel]

Alt 1

[warm marlin]

i always rupture reapply

[leaden prairie]

And one that starts with dispatch in some rare cases

[short radish]

alt f4

[leaden prairie]

Not on dimmy damage amp you won't

I flag sec tech

[swift tinsel]

alt Q healthstone

[leaden prairie]

Bim bam

[warm marlin]

yes true

but thats a problem for later me

[leaden prairie]

Ye

[warm marlin]

because ctrl f (f my sectec bind) is my mount

[leaden prairie]

I realized I needed to track few recently playing dimmy

Cause it was Perma down

[warm marlin]

ye

[short radish]

im sure blizzard will fix this issue by the time i get to dimmy

[leaden prairie]

And I was always doing bs instead of strike

[short radish]

im sure blizzard knows about this issue

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[leaden prairie]

Cucking myself

[queen plinth]

so how do we sim. for m+ we use dungeonslice?

[short radish]

yes

[leaden prairie]

I would spend legit the entire damage amp without fw

[warm marlin]

yes indeed, was easy to add to your pack tho

[dense geode]

are yall saving stech for every living masses especiall for 2nd set

[leaden prairie]

Cause I would bs first and then proc the whole phase

[leaden prairie]

Ye

I never dance on boss

[queen plinth]

and raid st patchwerk 5 min? how about araz for example

[leaden prairie]

No wait I do one dance on boss after my last set of cd

That's it

[short radish]

hectic add cleave i guess but like

who cares just sim patchwerk

[dense geode]

so are you hold CDS for an extra like 15s on 2nd set of CDS

[leaden prairie]

Sub very good to nuke adds I like

[warm marlin]

you need to mash the shadowstrike version though

the stealth bar delay thing i think

[hazy breach]

Thats almost every boss in the raid

[neon frigate]

Should i align thistle tea with flag? Or doesnt it matter?

[warm marlin]

you cant macro dance strike

[leaden prairie]

Yes I send right after the bump

[hazy breach]

You just hold dances until adds spawn

[dense geode]

are you not having a problem with not having 2 dances there

[leaden prairie]

But you can't press before anyway that might be during the mechanic

[dense geode]

i keep having liek 1 and a half ig sometimes cause i get pulled up

[leaden prairie]

No I almost overcap dance

[queen plinth]

how do we play in raids with adds? we afk until adds come then we send dances?

[swift tinsel]

p much

[short radish]

pretty much yeah

check lorgs

[queen plinth]

but kinda send cds on pull?

or do we even hold on soulbinder or araz

[swift tinsel]

you can send dance/sod/sectech typically

[short radish]

check lorgs

[swift tinsel]

then flag into the first adds

[short radish]

but its a send dance on pull

send flag at 20ish seconds

[swift tinsel]

and timers line up after for the most part

[queen plinth]

ah yea fair

[umbral fulcrum]

for araz i saw ppl sending a dance+sectec on pull and then its all up again for the first add set

[queen plinth]

so sub is hard padding spec with cds

[umbral fulcrum]

so thats what i did

[queen plinth]

gotya

[short radish]

no

[swift tinsel]

not really padding when adds need to die

[short radish]

its not pad

adds need to die

fuck ive been ragebaited

[swift tinsel]

we're not ret paladins lets be clear

[short radish]

im so stupid

[queen plinth]

so are we pooling energy and barely press buttons?

bascially jjust deal dmg with rup and autoattacks?

[leaden prairie]

Like on pull you send your cds with 2 dance, hold the dance for add, hold the dance for adds, hold cd a bit for right after devourer cast or after bump whatever the fuck you wanna do doesn't change shit, then dance again whenever you feel like it, then start stacking everything for p2 since you DPS stop anyway, full coup, send one sod for max stack and 2 SC, one sec tech for 2 ub

Then do that again in every P2 platform gg

Easy win

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/kangaroo-fairly-odd-parents-computer-internet-australia-gif-10670357

[queen plinth]

yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa sub is the hardest padding spec ive played for sure

[short radish]

nope

im not falling for this anymore

[clever delta]

60m burst in m+ look sick

[queen plinth]

its okay if adds "need to die" 😉

😉

😉

[swift tinsel]

is that a twitch or

[queen plinth]

ngl im not even being mad or saying its bad

i love sub

would even say i like sub as much as playing mage.

and immaining mage since df

[short radish]

oh youre a mage main

[swift tinsel]

ohhh explains it

[short radish]

okay your opinions are instantly invalidated

thanks for stopping by

[swift tinsel]

we're stealing your funnel

[short radish]

have a nice day, good luck with your vault

[swift tinsel]

not sorry

[queen plinth]

what are you even saying

i thought rogue and mage are shaking hands

[swift tinsel]

only in pvp

[austere bison]

gang im interested in shuriken storm is it actually useful or just spam shadowstrike(backstab)?

[queen plinth]

so this not enough?

[dense geode]

we dont pad tho unless youre pressing BP

😭

[warm marlin]

@leaden prairie im sure you've noticed this bug too #subtlety message would be happening on your flag starting p2

[short radish]

out of dance with like 4 or 5 targets up

[warm marlin]

can counterplay by dancing before symbols

[queen plinth]

dayum why does everybody hate mage

only valid hate is against hunters

[short radish]

bp isn't even pad

[swift tinsel]

if you have to ask..

[queen plinth]

dayum

[dense geode]

im just talking about in raid

[short radish]

okay everyone press full single target and adds will passive die to cleave eventually

[leaden prairie]

Ye

I don't get a refund

Iirc

Or idk

But I noticed my CDs were weird but always the same

When I had full stacked thing

[calm urchin]

#showtooltip
/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

then do a WA that changes the icon accordingly

[leaden prairie]

I think the way I play it I don't get a refund

[warm marlin]

if you cast symbols with supercharger up and 7sht, it will refund you randomly

[leaden prairie]

On the first sec tech

[warm marlin]

unless you cast dance first

[leaden prairie]

Oh no you are right

Wait let me think

[warm marlin]

yes another bug you can't get refund with premeditation up

[leaden prairie]

I legit cannot remember

[warm marlin]

wait

WAIT

that's why dance counterplays the sod bug

premed is preventing the late sod refund

[hazy breach]

Atleast it cant refund on rupture ticks anymore

[warm marlin]

aint no way

[leaden prairie]

Cause I know I noticed it was weird and I adjusted how I play

[hazy breach]

Yes

[leaden prairie]

Oh I didn't know that

[warm marlin]

thats so funny

bug1 is fixing bug2

the rogue special

[swift tinsel]

sub design in a nutshell

[short radish]

holy bandaids lmao

[swift tinsel]

lmfao

holy based

[twilit phoenix]

LMAO

[iron plover]

Lmfao

[leaden prairie]

Ah ye I remember now

Ye

Like I do this always

I always have max stacks and I did notice it was refunding me after sod

Which I then just ended up playing around

[warm marlin]

ye the sod late refund bug is refunding you when you press it. if you want that, its fine, could dance first and get the backstab to sectec coup coup

[leaden prairie]

And then always striking after cause it doesn't refund

But I didn't know why it didn't refund

[leaden prairie]

Idk if I can change how I do it

Cause I do it legit the same every single time

[warm marlin]

thats the other reason im using the backstab macro now

it does dance first for me so i dont break muscle memory

[sweet raven]

why backstab after shadowstrike? does it change anything?

[leaden prairie]

Do you know

[sweet raven]

or not at all

(im newb)

[leaden prairie]

Mistake

[sweet raven]

Ok just wondering

[leaden prairie]

I manage to get triple sec tech sometimes in the damage amp ryldd

That's pretty crazy

[warm marlin]

no wei

isnt it 15s

[leaden prairie]

Ye

[turbid edge]

If your big cds come up when pack has 20-30% hp left, do u just send symbols/dance/sectech and save flag/blades for next?

[leaden prairie]

Like 10 or smth idk

Ye 15 maybe

[warm marlin]

link log!

[leaden prairie]

No way I find it

But basically

If I do it good

[sweet raven]

wait but you are tomelvis and you're french

[leaden prairie]

Sometimes I get to damage amp with coup, 2 ub or 3, full sht stacks, 2 SC prior, and I will triple sod

And sec tech first GCD

[warm marlin]

ohh triple sod

[leaden prairie]

Or second I guess

[warm marlin]

maybe is how

[leaden prairie]

Since flag sec tech

[leaden prairie]

Ye idk pure vibes

[warm marlin]

no i think its prob good

dimensius soon for us

[leaden prairie]

If I play it good and have the rng I can get 3

I think I did it like twice

You have lust as well so

I get my second sod in the first dance ryld

So 6s in

[warm marlin]

looks like a fun sub fight to think about that sort of thing

[leaden prairie]

Ye

It's the kind of fight that makes sub shine

[warm marlin]

im doing sort of same on nexus guy but less opportunity

[leaden prairie]

(DPS stops and downtime and burst )

[warm marlin]

cant prestack as hard unless giga proc

[leaden prairie]

Stupid spec ngl

Like we DPS stop end of P1 and every end of plat

And DPS stops are just

Prepping mega nuke for sub

Goes crazy no cap

I would be fuming as outlaw

As sub I just want longer DPS stop

[warm marlin]

ye its so fun

[leaden prairie]

Let me auto attack baby

[warm marlin]

i dont think any other spec can do that sort of thing to prep so hard

like in taza hm its just sub by far

[leaden prairie]

Yes it's me

[tiny skiff]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[leaden prairie]

One thing tho

I wish I had araz trinket

[warm marlin]

same

[short radish]

same

[warm marlin]

maybe my vault in 10 mins

[leaden prairie]

I think I fumbled a bit not forcing to get one in splits

[short radish]

same

[short radish]

its up