subtlety

[chrome palm]

I didn’t realize they cdr feint lol

That explains why I was pressing it so much

[tribal blade]

iirc they do unless they changed it

[chrome palm]

Also more energy than outlaw and sub so

[tribal blade]

lemme check

[chrome palm]

They’re able to press it more freely

I think you’re right

[tribal blade]

yeah

[chrome palm]

Sheesh

[tribal blade]

so insane

[chrome palm]

Remember that dks are stronger than this by standing still

[short radish]

right how could i forget my spiteful riposte build

[tribal blade]

TRUE

[tribal blade]

riposte ew

[short radish]

DPS INCREASE ON SPITEFUL WEEKS

wait

spiteful isnt a thing anymore

[tribal blade]

i do not miss spiteful

[short radish]

neither

[chrome palm]

Remember in s3 df when sin was strong as the start

[tribal blade]

looking back on it legit all the old affixes mostly punished melee

[chrome palm]

And then they nerfed it and the same week it was spiteful

So no one played sin after that week

At least I stopped after that

[short radish]

dont let ranged people hear that when they have to move for volcanic or the interrupting thing

[tribal blade]

oh shit true haha

[tribal blade]

LOL fucking volcanic

biggest non affix ever

[short radish]

yeah

best week

[tribal blade]

"oh no i have to slightly side step every once in a while as ranged"

@chrome palm so you have a group?

[chrome palm]

Yes I do

Pugging as rogue sounds very rough

[tribal blade]

it is 😦

unless you can find phys groups

i think i might not make cutoff w/o a group tbh

[chrome palm]

Waiting for a brew to log on is very annoying

[round charm]

Do you guys use feint a lot in keys? It feels so bad to wait for energy between cds for cdr and then press feint and wait some more 😦

[chrome palm]

Yeah feint is your primary defensive

You can press feint after a finisher in cds

Since you’re overcapped on energy anyways

Certain mechanics will just kill you without feint

Like the beam on mechagon last boss without feint is 1 shot

And you only have so many evasion and cloaks

[round charm]

That's true.. I should get used to it

It's probably not even so big energy/cdr wasted as I think

[chrome palm]

Easy rule of thumb is, if you’re going to take damage press feint

Feint can also generally be used whenever you use evasion or crimson vial outside of a few niche cases

This is assuming you’re playing elusiveness instead of cheat death

[round charm]

That's a lot of feints and lot of energy

Wish it was free as it is for assa in muli target and I guess outlaw (never played it, don't like pirate-theme)

[chrome palm]

It doesn’t really have a big impact

It’ll feel bad if you’re starved and you had to spend all of your hard earned energy on a feint

But if you’re starved the only other thing you’re gonna do is like press backstab

Which does nothing

But feint with elusiveness is basically the best defensive in the game so you should be using it

[shrewd lantern]

thats ankh

Immunes everything

[chrome palm]

Ok you used ankh

I’m gonna hit you in the head now

What are you gonna do

[shrewd lantern]

rez instantly

what other class can do that

Oh wait warlock….

[chrome palm]

Guess what

I’m gonna hit you in the head again, and it hasn’t been 30 min

[shrewd lantern]

Its shorter than 30

[chrome palm]

What is it

[shrewd lantern]

Also probably not fair to compare to the two god classes mage and lock

[chrome palm]

Maybe but mage is strong because they have so many defensives

Rogue is strong because of feint alone

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah

we’ve been crept up on over the years

[chrome palm]

I think mage is an outlier

I don’t know how they got away

[shrewd lantern]

lock

dk

[chrome palm]

With ice cold and all that

DK too sure

Warlock has always been strong

But we also have super juiced feint with two charges off cd with low energy cost

So I dont think it’s all that bad

[hollow spear]

I wonder how many rogues actually have feint bound

I feel like the average heroic raider doesn't

[shrewd lantern]

ngl when it was on gcd

good luck asking me to press that

mid dance

[chrome palm]

I was pressing it just for fun in my cds when they took it off

[hollow spear]

That was such a good change

[shrewd lantern]

I barely see pug rogues

[chrome palm]

Remember when we got changes

[shrewd lantern]

when i play alts

[chrome palm]

😭

[shrewd lantern]

we got it for df s3

that was all

[hollow spear]

I can't bring myself to spec elu in raid

[shrewd lantern]

Realistically assa got the lion’s share of rework changes

in df s3

nah fuck playing elu in raid

[chrome palm]

Yeah elu is a bad idea in raid

[shrewd lantern]

we already have enough cds to cycle through in raid

well ig sub doesnt have evasion for magic dr since no ds

[chrome palm]

Besides you’re not getting hit by bleeds in raid and if you are that’s what externals are for

[shrewd lantern]

but 5% passive dr+vers

[shrewd lantern]

so go dwarf

is what you saying

[chrome palm]

I prefer begging for an external but sure if you wanna be a little stout man go for it

[shrewd lantern]

i was for 2.5 years

[chrome palm]

Healers will do anything if you beg them enough

That’s why they’re healing usually

[shrewd lantern]

pug healers in rookery dont dispel me

until i ping them 10x

[chrome palm]

Think they just pug players

Or maybe I am more convincing

[shrewd lantern]

also im convinced

ams is better than cloak

in most situations you cloak

[chrome palm]

It is with the stupid 1s rule

Cloak just randomly not working on way to many magic affects with no indicator of it

Needs to be a full immune if it’s gonna be a 2 min cd

[shrewd lantern]

ams already prevents debuffs

if you have 2 braincells to pre press

[chrome palm]

Also like the rookery thing

Where the boss just ignores you when you cloak instead of deleting the debuff

[shrewd lantern]

lmao

every time i play my dk alt

im confused how people die as this class

[chrome palm]

The only acceptable reason for DK to die is basically being outside of death strike range

[shrewd lantern]

our dk had most deaths to ansurek pull

dont ask how

[chrome palm]

0_0

[tribal blade]

remember how they said cloak being a short cd was too much and nerfed it to 2

yet dk is allowed to have ams at 1 min

[hollow spear]

I had our dk on focus step

Theyd probably argue that we don't have a dmg limit

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah i usually focus step bdks

[hollow spear]

Which is kinda pointless in a lot of cases

[shrewd lantern]

I feel like since legion they've severely cut down on literal nuclear levels magic hits

besides tank mechanics

or you can have a prot pala run spellwarding

That button is super useful
Makes you only need to burn a brez on your priest healer 1/3 of pulls.

Instead of 2/3

[heady shell]

Question, this is basically my first season ever playing wow, I know sub isn't in the best spot, but I was able to get to 3444 io, would it be reasonable for me to try and push for M+ title next season? I think the bump at higher keys are expontentially harder right?

[alpine wraith]

you can always get title if you know the right people

[heady shell]

I guess for me it would be pugging

[alpine wraith]

but if you want to pug it will become difficult unless you begin to show yourself out there

there are not many people at a high lvl so eventually they kinda know the others

and if you dont omegaint and do decent dmg maybe you can sneak in sub here or there

but there are some dungeons assa is just so much better for rogue and even outlaw overtakes it quite a bit most of the time

[heady shell]

yeah

sad I suck at assas

granted I haven't played it too much

[sweet turret]

which would be that?

[tribal blade]

almost all of them

[chrome palm]

top, fg, psf, cb, ml specifically

[alpine wraith]

i think sub can be ok on ML and workshop mostly because of bosses

maybe on darkflame as a change to not die on candle king

[chrome palm]

yeah ml is at the end for a reason

[alpine wraith]

but there outlaw is better

tanky and does more dmg

[chrome palm]

candle king there is weird because i always feel like i dont get 3 1:30s as sub

maybe in 20+ you do

i also play triple 1:30 comp though

[alpine wraith]

tbh sub in next season seems to be way better

the trinkets and set seem good for dungeons

prism + forge or antenna or lilly and forge

[chrome palm]

is prism + forge real or is it cope

[tribal blade]

isn't sub being kinda forced into being hard capped

[alpine wraith]

seems real but i need to try more things

sadly i got mind controlled by a horse girls game

so i havent been on the ptr that much

but dmg is quite there

[runic trail]

Another one has fallen

[chrome palm]

who are you training hachadino

[runic trail]

I'm surrounded

[alpine wraith]

im at the point where im looking for 3* sparks

i kinda have many diff ones

[chrome palm]

i think ill watch the show before i try the game

[alpine wraith]

i havent watched 1 second of the animes and still enjoy the game

[vale pine]

what game?

[chrome palm]

uma musume pretty derby

🙈

have you seen it fuu

[vale pine]

is the game f2p?

[runic trail]

I saw people playing it but I'm terrified of falling down the gacha rabbit hole

[vale pine]

i have not seen it

[chrome palm]

its gacha so you gamba for characters but f2p

[vale pine]

it looks like a mobile game

is it on android/ios too?

[chrome palm]

originally i think

[alpine wraith]

it is a mobile game but also on steam

[vale pine]

ahh fair

reviews are funny

[alpine wraith]

people are already doing tournaments and betting on them

gacha+gambling same as sub rogue

cant escape

[chrome palm]

if you draw the horse girls as lewd the company will send the yakuza after you

so ive heard

[runic trail]

Good luck stopping the internet

[alpine wraith]

it is mostly for pr reasons too as they need permission from the owner's horse

there are already a ton of r34 as you might expect

[runic trail]

I'd have been shocked if there wasn't

[alpine wraith]

you will just get jp people yelling at you

but then you say me no speak japanisu

[chrome palm]

if the horse girl isnt japanese its fine :-)

[runic trail]

Subtly change one aspect of the horse girl. Problem solved.

[haughty mural]

How much dmg is magic again ?

Roughly

[chrome palm]

looks like about 40%

in st

[hollow spear]

Didn't know I was 40% magician

[haughty mural]

Ty - couldn’t access my sims right now but got asked

[hollow spear]

My raid leader didn't approve of my idea of swapping to arcane mage. Maybe he'll understand once I tell him I was already 40% of the way there.

[haughty mural]

In aoe it should be a bit less, because of nimble ?

[hollow spear]

I think so

[chrome palm]

possibly

[hollow spear]

Black Powder is also physical

[chrome palm]

sec tech clones will do more as well

BP probably less likely to hit a target with FW than evis in ST

but idk

[haughty mural]

Yea

[haughty mural]

Also that will change anyway

Since coup and ub will make more

[chrome palm]

yeah any raid cleave phys is gonna shoot up as well

more so than dungeons

like some fights where nimble goes crazy

[haughty mural]

Yea

[lilac stag]

You have to recruit a rogue if you want to get off the rogue.

I swear we don’t exist in normal recruitment pools

[runic trail]

scath wanna take my place on my raid team thanks

[lilac stag]

SV main. Sure.

I almost recruited Quake to take my spot this tier.

[hoary coyote]

yo guys have a question my details does not work in ptr
does anybody knows the problem?

should i install a sepcial version

[haughty mural]

So based

I am too weak

I’ll forever be in the yellow prison

[lilac stag]

Details should work fine on the ptr. Just grab the latest version and make sure it’s active. (Not disabled due to being out of date)

[lilac stag]

If quake joined it would have been SV arc.

Our Warrior roulette continues. Another new Warrior next tier.

[runic trail]

Meanwhile my guild is a constantly rotating set of people

There's so many trials

[vale pine]

there are sv mains?

[vestal escarp]

Stranglethorn?

[lilac stag]

for some reason we added like 5 people.

[lilac stag]

Probably close to the same number of sub rogues.

[vale pine]

lol

[haughty mural]

I’d argue more

[runic trail]

Looks similar when taking logs into account - sub has more parses than SV on mythic, SV has more than sub on heroic

Just over the last 2 weeks

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/game-recognize-game-game-respect-nod-good-job-gif-26194681

Hipsters gonna hipster.

[haughty mural]

Okay then ignore me please

[runic trail]

It seems kind of even

[nocturne hollow]

Just recrafted all my gear since i want to start playing sub, did my first key and did ok dmg, do we have a lot of prio as sub? was a 12 ML, and nuked the extracter very fast

[tribal blade]

prio as sub is decent if you spam evis

but not amazing

[nocturne hollow]

ah ok thank you, like it was 5 targets so i just spam evis right?

or black powder biss in 5 target also?
for overall dmg

[tribal blade]

actually i remember doing pretty high prio one of the last times i ran sub whenever i spammed evis

[warm marlin]

uhmm actually 🤓 the prio is very good if you're spamming evis, the funnel is not 🤓

[tribal blade]

it usually comes down to the pack composition, like if there's 1 big target that's all that matters and small shitters, you can spam evis even in big pulls

[tribal blade]

TRUE

yeah i self corrected myself there haha

[nocturne hollow]

Thank you mate

[tribal blade]

i remembered when i ran dfc as sub i was doing really good prio to the creepers

[tribal blade]

but yeah use BP on 7+ targets in general

[nocturne hollow]

About to go into a cinderbrew 17, so i guess that is a lot of BP mashing

[tribal blade]

probably yeah, ALTHOUGH i'm gonna be real, if your comp has 2 other pad aoe classes you might just be better off full evising muscles

but i haven't run cinderbrew as sub in forever so i have no idea

on higher cinderbrews we pull 3 muscles at the start so it's a race to kill them off asap

[remote shuttle]

Like in cinder 1st pull if u have other dps doing good aoe u can evis muscler, and funneling Is like shuriken to have max cp with a single cast aoe and evis on prio target... U get more resource on builder with aoe and unleash damage to major target by evi (cleaving others) ...doing this Just need to backstab/SS for escalating blades

Less overall but musclers die faster and maybe your party doesn't die

[hollow spear]

They should turn shuriken storm into something else when we have dance up. Just like the backstab shadowstrike thing.

Or did that already exist at some point?

[remote shuttle]

Dep on what your party needs more for that pull you decide what to do... Brainless pad (bp) or prio/funnel evi (if pox)

[hazy breach]

Theres not that much difference either way

BP does like 75% of what evis does so youre not losing that much prio anyway

Striking and secteching the prio target is the more important bit

[remote shuttle]

Ye but you known... When in a pack u have a single really dangerous threat, that more dmg on a single target can some times be the Better choice

[hazy breach]

Its not +25%

Its like +5% more prio damage overall

[remote shuttle]

Just lets say more dmg

[warm marlin]

people are far too prio brained now

5% more prio for 50% less aoe is not worth except in rare cases

[lilac stag]

Thanks Max and Tettles

[hazy breach]

Its not 50% less aoe anyway

Like theres very little difference either way

[lilac stag]

just press buttons. Get CDR. Win.

[remote shuttle]

Yep and we are supposed to know if we are in that rare case or not

[lilac stag]

If priority is that important.

[hazy breach]

Or you can play deathstalker sub

[haughty rose]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[lilac stag]

Who hurt you today?

[remote shuttle]

Nice One bud 🤣 can we have another One?

[hazy breach]

I mean it does unironically do better prio than trickster, about on par with assa

But thats assuming you use darkest nights on eviscerate even in aoe

Which is kinda questionable for overall

[remote shuttle]

Brrrr

Feel so lone and cold 🤣

To even think playin ds

Ts has a very nice flow to me

Enjoying so much the actual gameplay (less numbers... But Is fun to play anyway)

[hazy breach]

Heres a bunch of fairly small changes i would like to see that would improve the AoE situation for sub quite a bit, since weve pretty much been relegated to be a raid spec ever since the 10.2 rework.

• Fix all of the bugs associated with Nimble Flurry
• Change the tierset to allow coup to stack while 4p is active.
• Change secret technique to be softcapped at 8 instead of 5. (Since our other spells are 8)

Theres also the hero talent situation where unseen blade not being proccable from storm and darkest night not working on BP are way overdue changes that would make the spec way more fluid to play since i believe those are just needless friction

[swift tinsel]

Honestly those would solve almost every gripe I have for a not-full-rework set of updates

[remote shuttle]

Wish they Will listen your huge knowledge bud

First two of your three point should be mandatory btw

[hazy breach]

First one would be roughly ~20% more damage to nimble, third would be roughly 25% more damage with sectech on big pulls and the middle one is hard to guess but not munching procs feels good

[haughty mural]

That makes me think how comes that the free coup is coded like that

[swift tinsel]

Been wondering this since day one ptr

[chrome palm]

fix coup refund 🙏

[swift tinsel]

It’s such a ham-fisted implementation

[haughty mural]

Ye

Should have just been another instance and not some krangled shit using the other ones stacks

If it makes sense what I mean

[swift tinsel]

Like it’s the least-elegant way they could have done it

[warm marlin]

they copy pasted exactly how the bug worked earlier in season 2

[swift tinsel]

Agreed, make it a unique buff/aura so it doesn’t conflict

[warm marlin]

you kept the escalating blade stacks for 1 second which allowed outlaw to double cast it

they just extended it to 5s

[haughty mural]

Ye that

[chrome palm]

can you imagine how bugged it would be if it was a separate proc as a free ability

[haughty mural]

That’s the most lazy implementation they could have done

[chrome palm]

if it was unique none of the interactions would work with it

[haughty mural]

„Let’s just copy paste a bug and give it to them as a feature huehuehue“

[swift tinsel]

Fel scarred dh has that and it seems to work fine

[chrome palm]

it would make sec tech look like john carmacks finest work by comparison

[haughty mural]

Mhm could be

[hazy breach]

@tribal blade You know how i mentioned 20s are kind of a wall? The EU title has stopped going up by the standard 3 rating per day and its now going up by 1 per day instead

[tribal blade]

HAHA i knew it

i was looking through my entire friends list and i have quite a few people who haven't budged beyond ~3800

in weeks

[hazy breach]

Like as soon as it hit ~3770 which is pretty much all 19s it dropped from 3 to 1 per day

[tribal blade]

i'm honestly dreading going beyond 3770 which i'm at right now

the amount of 20s in lfg at any given time is basically 0

[hazy breach]

DFC and Motherlode 20 is probably easier than priory 19

Just have to get the key

[tribal blade]

yeah if i can game with the people i timed 19 rookery and psf with

those 20s will be piss easy

but they have a group sadly

good thing is they know i'm solid now because we essentially 2 shot rook and 1 shot psf together

just need to see if i can weasel my way into anything

[vestal escarp]

we have bugs eating nimble dmg for 20%

tf is left

[hazy breach]

Shadow damage gets reduced by armor so shadowed finishers cleave way less than they should

And any crit bonuses do not get cleaved (so no lethality or surprising strikes)

[vestal escarp]

yeah i was reading

[hazy breach]

And blades

[vestal escarp]

i think the only part accountable for a bug id the crit stuff

the others are questionable for as much as it sucks having them

[hazy breach]

Well blades should just work

Not necessarily be cleaved

But a 100 nimble hit should also hit with blades for 20% of it

[vestal escarp]

thats every instance of nimble hitting for shbaldes too

(it absolutely should but gl with it)

it's one year it's in

[hazy breach]

Well we got sectech working with blades after more than a year

[vestal escarp]

[lilac stag]

careful. They’ll take it away

[vestal escarp]

is this back? i remember being gone at some point in TWW

[hazy breach]

I dont think it was ever fixed

[tribal blade]

found blizz's development process for sub

[lilac stag]

We should be so lucky

[swift tinsel]

Redo the gif with the tape removed

[warm marlin]

so i have been seeing if any degenerate pacemaker stuff is possible with holding the proc

[vestal escarp]

this or striaght up negligence

[warm marlin]

and my last time in the raid I found it procced almost insta despite me just auto attacking, which didnt happen on dummies in dorno

i auto attacked a dummy for 10 minutes and it happened once

[hazy breach]

I dont think the pacemaker proc is strong enough to warrant it ngl

[warm marlin]

i checked the logs from the raid and did some big testing

i think the thousand cuts unseen blade cd reset

procs pacemaker the first time it occurs

[warm marlin]

i wont spill the full tech, but on a specific boss i believe there is one instance it is worth

however i dont think it is possible with the thousand cuts thing

[remote shuttle]

That guy seems to perfectly know what he's doing

[warm marlin]

nvm it just happened 7 minutes into autoing a dummy as deathstalker

i dont get it

[tribal blade]

couldn't be radiant power initial hits could it

[remote shuttle]

Did u have any fun at least?

[warm marlin]

oh someone procced fatal intent

maybe that was it

[swift tinsel]

I’m Screams of a Forgotten Sky-pilled for deathstalker

[warm marlin]

nop the only damage event near explosive adrenaline proc is just a melee attack

[swift tinsel]

Just bc I like the name

[hazy breach]

Maybe but at that point might aswell play the delve void crystal thing instead that gives way more stats no?

[warm marlin]

this is for this tier

and i did test that but that crystal is too hard to control

[hazy breach]

Ah

Just play azerokk/alchemy trinket and proc it at the right time

[warm marlin]

if you can get it to proc nicely in 3min prism cds it goes bigly

[swift tinsel]

Azerokk, foul temptress trinket

[hazy breach]

Unironically the highrolls with those trinkets are very very big

[warm marlin]

but some pulls it procced at 1:10 just randomly

its too hard to game i think

[hazy breach]

It stacks up when you get a killing blow

So might be really strong for assa in keys

As you always get the killing blows

[warm marlin]

ye for keys it could be

if you can get it to 12-13 stacks around the 2:20 mark you can just afk not even autoing to pool it for big prism burst

the real dream

but it often procs before then

[hazy breach]

Rolling into the 200% burst on the last boss with coup, 12 stacks of that trinket, fully stacked prism and 7+ sht

[warm marlin]

I think i was like 453% mastery or something ridiculous

maybe less

[hazy breach]

And get out bursted by boomies that go into bear with their new set

[warm marlin]

maybe 353

even on a dmg amp fight though it just seemed too random, you're going to often proc it too early and then you're cooked

[hazy breach]

Ye its probably not it

But when it procs

Youll be slapping

Imagine if we got a set like the boomy one though

[warm marlin]

also unlike pacemaker void frag does consistently proc off autos

so if you're trying to hold you are actually full afk running around outside melee

it would be extremely funny to watch in someone else's vod

[hazy breach]

"Sec ill go grab a coffee"
Just pop that in discord in the middle of the fight

[warm marlin]

itll probably get nerfed anyway

no way 30k mastery makes it to live

[runic trail]

Turning wow into a turn based RPG.

I took my turn now to afk for a bit

[hazy breach]

Theres the 25k haste one thats pretty much the same thing

Which obviously sucks for sub

[warm marlin]

aren't all of those trinkets just mega insane numbers

[hazy breach]

ye

[warm marlin]

please no

[hazy breach]

Well their numbers are high because their uptime is low

[warm marlin]

that is what i do not like, am not a variance enjoyer

[haughty mural]

[warm marlin]

last procced it at 0:53

trinket just has a mind of its own sometimes

[hazy breach]

Speaking of overtuned trinkets

The one from Halls is not balanced

For some reason it just gives an absurd amount of stats

[swift tinsel]

maybe that's why they're trying to hide it from us by not having it on the vendor

[chrome palm]

devious mm developer snuck that one in there

[swift tinsel]

gotta add more stuff for pookie

[alpine wraith]

the one that gives a bazillion crit

?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[alpine wraith]

ah yea that one is getting hammered

[hazy breach]

For reference at the same ilvl as house of cards its giving roughly 60% more stats

[alpine wraith]

ahaha

[lilac stag]

Watch none of them get touched. “We hear you wanted good trinkets”

[alpine wraith]

tbh would be fun for once

imagine being exited about gear

[lilac stag]

Though I think we’re back on the Ion SL arc

[hazy breach]

I'd prefer the prism being strong compared to a basic bitch one like the halls

Surely they change the prism to cap at 20 stacks so we dont have to waste stacks if we want to hold for 3 min instead of sending at 1:30

[lilac stag]

I don’t recall seeing a 90 str trinket.

[swift tinsel]

they don't have one kekw

[warm marlin]

prism

[lilac stag]

It’s same boat through with stacks

[warm marlin]

the halls crit one is also str

[lilac stag]

Was that on use?

[warm marlin]

ye

[lilac stag]

Wonder where that lands in ST

[swift tinsel]

funnily not that great for the 1.5min str specs bc fury and uhdk do not like crit lol

idk about arms tho

[lilac stag]

and we all love a good channel.

Usually crit haste.

Not positive with changes

[nocturne hollow]

in M+ i find that im out of symbols of death and shadow dance quite a lot, like im saving them for CDs, what is a good time to start saving for cds? 30seconds?

[lilac stag]

Treat the dungeon as one long boss encounter. Learn when to save and when to send. You’re going to have dry times just getting CDR going.

it’s more about pack health than specific time left on CDs

[hazy breach]

Pretty sure it doesnt matter when the numbers are this big

But theyll get tuned down to reasonable levels soon enough

[swift tinsel]

for ones like fury or even fdk the crit portion is eaten by Recklessness/Obliteration

though I think unholy is getting crit interactions with their changes

[hazy breach]

For reference that trinket sims around 3.5% higher than prism right now as sub

[swift tinsel]

ye running top gears atm

[hazy breach]

Because the numbers are like 60% higher than it should be

[nocturne hollow]

Thank you mate, also in this https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sa0-tfel1pc he is pressing storm during his shadow dance, is that not troll? i thought we shadow strike during that and then spend on evis

[swift tinsel]

are you throwing any specific calls/conditions in for prism?

[lilac stag]

Wait musclebruh is still alive?

[warm marlin]

you want to use your last charge of rotten on storm in aoe to spread find weakness

if you intend on pressing BP

[lilac stag]

I would have assumed he’d have been canceled by now.

[warm marlin]

hes trolling by spamming it though

[lilac stag]

what’s next, infexious comeback?

[warm marlin]

and by not spending coup

bro did not have slice and dice for the entire clip

[lilac stag]

on god, I didn’t know he still played wow

I would not look to him for advice

[nocturne hollow]

ah ok i just find it werid how he is spamming it, like i shadow strike into BP or Evis, hes just storming as builder the whole time

[warm marlin]

ye hes clueless

[lilac stag]

streamer doesn’t equal knows how to play the spec

[warm marlin]

guy who makes "INSANE DAMAGE" videos for every spec in the game can't be expected to know how to play them all competently

[nocturne hollow]

ahhhh ok, thank you, i thought i was doing it wroung lol

[hazy breach]

No because those are all worse than just using it normally

[swift tinsel]

seems to like idol and sigil

[lilac stag]

All of the guides have aoe rotations. Those are correct. The rest is learning cd management.

!guides

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[lilac stag]

things may slightly change in 11.2 but we’re still a bit off from worrying about those min/max rules

[nocturne hollow]

Im getting a bit confused with the AOE rotation, is there a youtuber who does high keys with sub that i can watch?

I cant seem to find any vods of high keys for sub

[lilac stag]

what are you confused on?

no one is doing high keys as sub

[nocturne hollow]

Do i shadowstrike in AOE? or Storm? ik i sotrm out side of BD window but during it i ST right?

[lilac stag]

assa / outlaw are just better.

[nocturne hollow]

Wanna be like the 3.8k boys on murlockio

[warm marlin]

strike whenever possible, except when you have 1 stack of rotten and you want to press BP (i.e. 5+ mobs to apply FW to and you don't want the slightly extra prio of eviscerate)

[lilac stag]

Play assa

they’re legit swapping to sub for a boss or two.

pokes @tribal blade

[nocturne hollow]

ohhhhh lol

like for last boss of rookery?

[tribal blade]

YESSIR

sub is crazy on that boss

[lilac stag]

Literally in the guide spelled out as well. https://www.method.gg/guides/subtlety-rogue/playstyle-and-rotation

[tribal blade]

you can pretty much afk between shields and you'll match everyone else's dps

easily

big burns during amps goes crazy

[warm marlin]

ya but that says this

i know storm isnt that good

that's cooked

[nocturne hollow]

ah dam ive been pressing shadowstirke in aoe

my bad lol

[hazy breach]

You should be, except #subtlety message

[tribal blade]

it seems rare for rogues to do the hearth out swap to sub strat

i have the feeling a lot of rogues aren't comfortable enough with sub to do it

[nocturne hollow]

Oh

[tribal blade]

every group i got in and told i was gonna hearth to swap to sub were slightly surprised and very happy

[warm marlin]

the real question is what is stealthi cooking with this

[lilac stag]

[tribal blade]

that reads like the old rules before hero talents

[cloud rover]

I mean this guide was written by a Raccoon

[tribal blade]

back when you used strike on 3 targets and only storm during dance on 4+

[cloud rover]

DO you trsut in Raccoons

[haughty mural]

I do

[warm marlin]

ah ye later down it says as trickster you only shadowstrike except for the FW spread thing with rotten

[empty plume]

does anyone remember if they had any actual reasoning why they nerfed the self-heal from shadowdance and replaced with this utter garbage leech that only scales on damage?

[warm marlin]

carry on

[haughty mural]

Mate they didn’t even add in the blue post that they changed the coming 2p

[cloud rover]

It was too convenient for Rogues in Open World

[empty plume]

i don't even play my rogue anymore since that change, it's so weak as fuck solo

[cloud rover]

Rogue needs to be one shotted

[empty plume]

other classes: pull all the shit and survive

rogue: pull too much and die

[lilac stag]

Keep reading.

[cloud rover]

Yes

[warm marlin]

#subtlety message already did!

[empty plume]

like it's less shit if oyu just overgear everything, but man leveling an alt and trying to kill elites is like bruh

i don't have enough damage for that 'leech' to do anything, it's a joke

[hazy breach]

Not sure which leech youre talking about

Shadowheart in the class tree?

[empty plume]

yeah, that replaced the shadowdance heal

[hazy breach]

Because that doesnt work with shadow dance nor subterfuge, its literally only during stealth

[empty plume]

wait really, so it doesn't do anything

[lilac stag]

and what can’t you kill, use defensives and blow it up

[hazy breach]

Or do you mean leeching poison

[empty plume]

i use that too on that alt

[chrome palm]

leeching good

[hazy breach]

Yes shadowheart is completely useless

[lilac stag]

feint good

[empty plume]

who designed that shit

wtf

[lilac stag]

Evasion good

[chrome palm]

right next door

is unbreakable stride

guess what

also useless

[hazy breach]

Exhilarating Execution in the sub tree is good though

[lilac stag]

Sub is tanky as fuck. Rogue just isn’t going to magically heal itself

[haughty mural]

Crimson vial tho

[cloud rover]

But its kind of impossible to take it

[haughty mural]

Really strong

[cloud rover]

(maybe not in Open world)

[hazy breach]

No?

[haughty mural]

[cloud rover]

Or do i think of the wrong thing

[swift tinsel]

just drop 8% heal taken

[haughty mural]

Ye

[swift tinsel]

ephemeral bond or w/e its called

[cloud rover]

oh i think ive mixed it up

[warm marlin]

my goat shadow focus though

[cloud rover]

mb

[haughty mural]

Just take EE instead of ephemeral bond

[chrome palm]

sf believers... not like this

[warm marlin]

you don't understand... the 2 energy i save feinting will add up!

[cloud rover]

pressing Crimson vial 8 times heals as much as one warlock or mage shield

[swift tinsel]

no one should believe in either sf in our tree

[cloud rover]

pog

[hazy breach]

Aint no way yall even conjured up the phrase SF believer

[haughty mural]

Ikr just memeing (:

[keen dome]

At least we have a cool animation by which i mean we toss a vial at our face and soak ourselves in tomato juice

[cloud rover]

Imagine we got the Vial rework

[sullen hare]

Haters will disbelieve this true reporting of facts and science

[cloud rover]

with pickpocket

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/im-a-believer-voices-rock-prime-canadas-got-talent-i-have-faith-i-believe-i-can-do-it-gif-16845633724494101428

[cloud rover]

Another thing

THINK ABOUT

VIAL AS AN ANTIDOTE

FOR POISON DEBUFFS

[sullen hare]

Well that's just silly

[cloud rover]

True

[sullen hare]

They'd have to nerf us super hard to give us something that nice

[cloud rover]

I mean a Rogue who uses Poisons, why would they have antidote

[sullen hare]

[lilac stag]

No snake is making an antidote

[cloud rover]

Man

I would love a poison dispell

for Ara Kara

Some affixes

man

[haughty mural]

Just press feign death

[cloud rover]

True

[haughty mural]

Oh wait

[empty plume]

also with the changes to slice and dice... why is that even still a buff and not baseline and the ability just removed lol .-.

[cloud rover]

Just press feigndeath

[hazy breach]

[cloud rover]

Its basically removed

[hazy breach]

Theres lots of good questions to ask about why things are the way they are on rogue

And most of the time the answer is

[cloud rover]

Why is stealth so buggy eleem

[empty plume]

this class needs a visonary to declutter, redesign this shit class

[cloud rover]

tell me like im 4

[lilac stag]

let’s us get CDR back between packs in m+

[empty plume]

im so sick of it

[hazy breach]

So does BP though so its

[empty plume]

let me play rogue without feeling like i should play literally any other class to have a better experience

[warm marlin]

BP knocks you out of stealth

ick

[lilac stag]

Why doesn’t sub get any blue posts Eleem. Tell me like im Tiramil

[hazy breach]

Well ye but stealth has 2 sec cd

[haughty mural]

Tell me why

[cloud rover]

[alpine wraith]

we dont get blue posts because they are saving power

for sure

trust

[warm marlin]

BP will also drop your tier set stacks

even if it doesnt hit anything

[vestal escarp]

it's the crysis

[swift tinsel]

rogue blue post, in this economy?!?!

[hazy breach]

Yes but the tier is gonezo

[lilac stag]

There’s a reason it’s the least played class sans evoker. Walk away now and save yourself a stress related heart attack.

[empty plume]

i did with tww

i just can't anymore, this class is just getting not what it needs

[cloud rover]

because you literally should

[haughty mural]

Ain’t nothing but a heartache

[cloud rover]

[warm marlin]

i got nothing

[alpine wraith]

dont worry if you leave i will create another rogue in your memory

[lilac stag]

Still in TWW. Asking rogue questions.

math not mathing

[cloud rover]

tell me why

[warm marlin]

snd will give you more cdr if you happen to have a supercharged combo point up still

[empty plume]

my rogues are just alts now

[haughty mural]

Ain’t nothing but a mistake

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/i-want-it-that-way-backstreet-boys-aint-nothin-but-a-heartsche-aint-nothin-but-a-mistake-tell-me-why-gif-20768209

[hazy breach]

Wasnt that fixed

As outlaw abused it

[warm marlin]

[lilac stag]

Rogues plural.

[lilac stag]

It won’t consume the SC point

[warm marlin]

press snd with 1 cp and supercharger up and see how much dance cdr you get

[hollow spear]

Yes, this is him, mister policeman

Casually generating extra cdr out of thin air

[lilac stag]

SnD is one of Sub’s best abilities.

Read into that what you will

[hollow spear]

It's free real estate

[hazy breach]

Fair enough it wasnt fixed

[cloud rover]

It was fixed for ER

But supercharger is a completely different ability

[haughty mural]

[hollow spear]

At least they're consistent in their inconsistency

[hazy breach]

Oh well, surely we get some attention in beta

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/wrong-kiddo-guns-gif-19570543

[hazy breach]

PTR copium has run out im afraid

[keen dome]

Hey we've still got two PTR's before 12.0 stuff.

There's still time

[swift tinsel]

I'm telling myself we're getting top-tier fixes in 11.2.5

[keen dome]

high5 same braincell

[left ledge]

Blizz is exhausting this guys copium reserves

[swift tinsel]

even though I know we aren't

[hazy breach]

Like sub is probably gonna be good for raid

[left ledge]

He not lasting as long as he used to

[hazy breach]

But keys is just

doomed until we get fixes

[swift tinsel]

we're 'good enough' to be shelved indefinitely

[left ledge]

But flurry and goremaw

[keen dome]

I'm super curious what the hero talent gimmick will be for midnight, and what they're gonna do. Maybe they'll add a new spec to all the mono-DPS classes. maybe that's their gimmick and how they 'improve' rogue

[left ledge]

[cloud rover]

Okok, here another 15% BP buff

[swift tinsel]

idk maybe they add another row of hero talents

[hazy breach]

Ye and tripling the deathstalker tier set

[swift tinsel]

or a secondary set of them like with artifact weps

[left ledge]

Midnight will prob not go into changing talents

[swift tinsel]

after seeing ours not get anything all expansion idrc what they do

[hazy breach]

If anything the only thing we are likely to see is buffs to deathstalker and its tier

[keen dome]

I'm still thinking it'll be Void / Light talents. Like a couple of nodes you swap between that empower to either a void effect or a light effect.

[hazy breach]

Which is unwelcomed

[left ledge]

At least not drastically

[keen dome]

Comedy option: artifact weapons 2.0

[swift tinsel]

the cloak continues into midnight

one less slot

[keen dome]

Haha

[vestal escarp]

chat..... im tired.... i wanna play sub.......

let me play sub

pls

[left ledge]

Play sub then

[vestal escarp]

😭😭😭😭😭

[keen dome]

The cloak is pretty interesting 'cos at this point Midnight is gonna be hammered out for launch so it makes me wonder if they're doing artifacts for Midnight and this is a "see what works" shit? But that's probably cope

[left ledge]

I hear it’s meta next season

[keen dome]

'Cos they are specifically calling the cloak an Artifact.

[swift tinsel]

idk

[hazy breach]

Mfw im the burst spec but i get absolutely dunked on in burst by boomies and their bugged tier set

[swift tinsel]

I'm fully expecting nothing at all

I'll be pleasantly surprised if we get positive changes for sub

[keen dome]

Shove hero talents into artifact weapnos. Make them run from Midnight -> LAst Titan. Add new stuff every patch, cry because it's a balance nightmare.

[cloud rover]

How come, that positive Bugs on other classes arent fixed asap as on rogue

[swift tinsel]

but I'm holding out zero legitimate hope

[vestal escarp]

if only it was only the boomies

[swift tinsel]

because the track record is

literal ass

[left ledge]

Listen

[warm marlin]

tettles will still say boomie is weak

[left ledge]

Let’s not doom guys

If they see us underperforming it’s simple

They’ll buff assa

[keen dome]

Just buff nimble flurry again. job done

[hazy breach]

Sub is undoubtedly going to be good in the raid with all the damage amps

[vestal escarp]

the least i wanna do next season is playing assa with 50% uptime on kb

[vale pine]

https://tenor.com/view/moonkin-dance-starfall-dancing-moonkin-gif-20256106

[lilac stag]

S3 is outlaw arc

[keen dome]

Gunmage arc

[hazy breach]

Dw fatebound still unplayable

[warm marlin]

sure doesn't look that way

[vestal escarp]

emphasis on still

[keen dome]

When you pop KS, you have to shout "I cast: guns"

[left ledge]

S3 atrophic arc part 2

[lilac stag]

patience

[vestal escarp]

it is if assa cant keep up in aoe with their crap tier

[warm marlin]

fundamentally, a raid that favors sub will not favor outlaw

even if they fix stuff like the trickster tier being 2.5x as good for sub as outlaw

[lilac stag]

Outside of the first 3 weeks it won’t matter

Then it’s gunslinger go time

[left ledge]

I don’t see it as exclusive fundamentally

Outlaw can do fine with sub doing fine

[lilac stag]

let’s not kid ourselves how useful dmg amps are to anyone outside of top 50

[left ledge]

Outlaw is very consistent damage

This discussion already took place before

[lilac stag]

mmhm

[left ledge]

Damage amp good for everyone not just sub

Depends on how and when the amp even happens too

[lilac stag]

Sub was the you need to kill shit asap.

That’s not exactly an exclusive these days

[left ledge]

Like if an amp is at 4 minutes

Is that.. good?

Maybe?

[chrome palm]

40s amp at 4 minutes

[lilac stag]

holding 30 seconds then boss dead at 5:05

[left ledge]

Maybe it’s terrible

[lilac stag]

Lost a send

[cloud rover]

S3 Assa gets the Legion poison back

[lilac stag]

man I miss dust

[cloud rover]

which wasnt eniterly broken

what was the name

[left ledge]

Anyways though what matters is how good the player is outside of rwf as long as we don’t get comp brick walls like oab

[chrome palm]

if they are serious about the grip raid buff thing

[left ledge]

They are most likely

Last boss is going to hard require a dk

[chrome palm]

the issue is that every fight in this tier

[warm marlin]

in max's video he suggested last boss probably needs 2 dks

one for each side

[chrome palm]

the answer was split cleave

[cloud rover]

2 BDks

alright

[warm marlin]

wouldn't be surprised after the grip incident this tier

[chrome palm]

rik barrels? split cleave
stix bombshells? split cleave
oab assistants? split cleave

[left ledge]

Did dk grip anything this tier

[lilac stag]

and if the spec you’re playing matters for your push to top 50, im thrilled for you. When the lowly mortals of the mythic raiders start parsing, I expect outlaw 📈 if tuning isn’t fucked

[cloud rover]

Bombshells, when they were under 85%

🙂

[left ledge]

Oh yeah

[chrome palm]

good for gripping under your friends ball

[left ledge]

My eyes are closed on stix

[cloud rover]

jesus take the wheel

[lilac stag]

Killing Spree!

[warm marlin]

I have 2 stix kills this tier

miserable fight

[lilac stag]

1 and proud

Haha

[hazy breach]

Just like how outlaw was 📈 on tindral

Where the first person to kill it as outlaw was like 4 months after release

[left ledge]

Outlaw cope will always amaze me

[warm marlin]

they made poor loktark play sub on that fight

[left ledge]

I remember early ish this tier

Or not too early

Sprocket

The highest outlaw was like 200-300k below windwalkers

Despite outlaw simming high

But the thing is that dude was in shit gear

And simmed for less than he even did

[lilac stag]

No rogue was simming high

[left ledge]

Fixed

[lilac stag]

So almost all of BFA

it’s still kinda funny how all three specs dumpstered even further overall dps in raid with the belt.

[cloud rover]

Its cursed, when even zac doesnt play Outlaw on a boss

[warm marlin]

zac plays sub on prog

or do u mean he never played outlaw

because that is cursed

[lilac stag]

in general I think the uptime stigma keeps people away on prog. Killing spree really did it no favors as well.

I physically can’t play the spec (or fury) that long in a single sitting without triggering my fibro.

circles back to play what you enjoy if you’re most raiders.

[shrewd lantern]

I mean sub is pretty inted by forced downtime too.

unless they ever make dance a flat cd again

[lilac stag]

it’s perception.

[cloud rover]

He never

[alpine wraith]

you can also play around better as sub

[cloud rover]

played outlaw on tindral afaik

[warm marlin]

just hold a dance charge as sub

[alpine wraith]

yea in between dances are whatever anyways

just have them ready for cds

more important

[cloud rover]

Im not even sure if he did play outlaw on mug'zee yet

[shrewd lantern]

Idk I’ve seen people still cite rtb

as an rng factor for outlaw

its funny

[swift tinsel]

mafic kekw

[lilac stag]

he’s as much of an outlaw main as prophet is a sub main.

[warm marlin]

i mean especially early tier the weapon thing is unironically a large factor

[lilac stag]

yup

[warm marlin]

you craft mh for sub/assa and outlaw is cooked unless you burn 60 gilded

and another spark

[shrewd lantern]

and then pvp sub andys created a brainrot perception

of sword offhand

Run out mechanics feel worse as sub imo.

Can’t just last second hook out

[north schooner]

why did they normalise fatal flourish but not shadow techniques?

[shrewd lantern]

and come right back in

[warm marlin]

i mean outside cds you actually lose almost nothing running out as sub tho

you're not gonna overcap on energy

rupture still ticking

not many shadow techniques lost since no symbols

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah i mean depends how long you’re out for

[lilac stag]

Silken court is the last boss I think uptime mattered for fitting CDs in

as sub

[warm marlin]

especially with new tier set you're just shitting out cdr

[shrewd lantern]

1-2 sec downtime i still feel is not so bad for outlaw

due to hook

[warm marlin]

no skyfury ptr is almost more cdr than live with skyfury i think

[swift tinsel]

it feels fairly close

if not outright better

[warm marlin]

i can sometimes do 2x dances after the 130 flag without skyfury on ptr

[shrewd lantern]

worst part about btm as sub

doing no skyfury keys

why is enhance banned

hello blizz?

[swift tinsel]

yeah that one is a bit baffling bc its barely above the middle of the pack using their metric for determining spec popularity

[haughty mural]

Agonizing?

[cloud rover]

Yes

exactly

[haughty mural]

Was glad when they yeeted that

[lilac stag]

Just renamed it Deathstalkers mark

[vale pine]

XD

lets keep deathstalker stuff out of subtlety

[keen dome]

But.. purple 😦

[wild hornet]

but dstalker is cool

[vale pine]

Deathstalker vs. Trickster

[wild hornet]

so a deathstalker looking like a legitimate rogue vs a circus actor

hmm

[vale pine]

hey... how dare you critisize my art

[swift tinsel]

when I hear trickster I picture something closer to the picture on the right vs whatever theme they went with for the hero tree

bit of whimsy, bit of madness

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/tim-burton-danser-johnny-depp-willy-wonka-charlie-et-la-chocolaterie-gif-12891002

[haughty mural]

I picture a lot of smokebombs and feints and surprising moves as well as distractions as when I picture trickster

So for me they kinda nailed it

But I think that’s an unpopular opinion

[warm marlin]

the feint and smokebomb talents are unplayably bad tho

[haughty mural]

That’s true

[warm marlin]

they're just there as choices so they can say the theme is there

[haughty mural]

But they are there

[lilac stag]

Aligns with the spec tree design

or 70% of the spec talents.

[haughty mural]

[lilac stag]

[haughty mural]

I mean could just a real smokebomb in there

But let’s not get over ourselves

[warm marlin]

you know what is surprising

the rogue vanishing in front of you

imagine if you just got unseen blade procs from real stealth

and disorienting/thousand cuts just reset cd of vanish

you know, where the blade is literally unseen

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/archer-smoke-bomb-disappear-gif-11704105

We got this instead

[haughty mural]

Commit with the theme ??

https://tenor.com/view/we-dont-do-that-here-black-panther-tchalla-bruce-gif-16558003

[lilac stag]

and then the masses complain my dps is tied to a defensive or whatever assa enjoyers

[warm marlin]

dps tied to a defensive complainers when they proc soothing darkness 80 times a fight

[lilac stag]

why would I press feint? It uses energy. stupid defensives impacting dps. Fix it

[haughty mural]

Legion feint

[hazy breach]

Ye but having dance on it was too powerful so we removed that

[keen dome]

August 5th 🙏

I was a week off.

[ashen dock]

So we have 4 weeks to pray to the gods

I will live on my knees

[swift tinsel]

just felt that tiny inkling of hope for any more fixes or changes disappear

Okay hear me out.

that gives them one week to implement >4 EB stacking, one week for DN/Mark fix, one week for tuning and one week to chill

inc scath doom

[bleak night]

4 weeks to chill

pog

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/trust-me-its-gonna-work-lauren-german-chloe-decker-tom-welling-marcus-pierce-gif-17398033

[lilac stag]

I’m traveling week 1 of raid.

and realistic expectations are not dooming.

you all just manifest it with hopium

[keen dome]

Guess I'll level a DH during the winds of fortune.

So I can kill Adarus as Adarus

[lilac stag]

haha

[keen dome]

I was expecting the patch a week later, but I'm glad my estimate wasn't too far off haha

[lilac stag]

I was hoping for patch the 12. Raid the 19th

[keen dome]

That was my guess, yeah

[lilac stag]

Oh well.

they know im traveling more for dog sports. It is what it is.

[keen dome]

Alas.

dog sports -> WoW

Fully expecting a late Jan / early Feb Midnight launch now.

[lilac stag]

the short version. The youngster has legit potential for world team events so have to get out of our midwest bubble and show in-front of folks on the east coast.

[keen dome]

Ooh, that's rad

I hope they do well

[lilac stag]

It’s me more than her. The dogs are generally perfect.

the handlers usually cause the offcourses

[keen dome]

Dogs are generally perfect, that's true wisdom

[swift tinsel]

pugs are where its at. they're so fucking dumb and dopey and I love them dearly

[keen dome]

Same

Also the dogs are cool too I guess

[lilac stag]

yea. Love dogs that come equipped with Asthma.

[swift tinsel]

[lilac stag]

it’s pretty crazy how that breed was purposely changed to not be able to breath.

[keen dome]

You know what dogs are cool? Border terriers. Get five or eight border terriers. You won't regret having five or eight of them.

[keen dome]

Yeah it's wild

[swift tinsel]

yeah their skulls look insane

[keen dome]

Absolutely inhumane

[lilac stag]

As long as they have a job, they’re nice.

[keen dome]

I have two, they have never worked a day in their life.

Never had a pair of dogs with as much personality.

[swift tinsel]

dated someone who had two and thankfully their brachycephaly wasn't super bad so their breathing wasn't scuffed

we had an english springer spaniel and soft-coated wheaten terrier and the latter was a fucking menace

[lilac stag]

Sorry. Can’t use a blowdryer on your dog post bath because it’s likely to kill them.

[keen dome]

I grew up with a black lab, and then we got two borders.

Black lab best dog

[lilac stag]

Wheaten can be assholes

[swift tinsel]

yeah she sucked. we're convinced she was taken from the mom too early and had insane separation anxiety

[lilac stag]

im a BC person. Love their devotion and their quarks.

Maybe a Mal some day

[keen dome]

BC's are rad.

[swift tinsel]

I'm a cat guy so they're all I'll own on my own

[keen dome]

Ye, I'd be a cat guy if i could.

[lilac stag]

We’ve got a piebald dsh, black dsh & orange dsh

The black is the void. She legit disappears and launches at you

[swift tinsel]

if it wasn't just me or my work schedule was a bit different I'd consider a dog though

[lilac stag]

The orange is 100% the orange cat stereotype

[swift tinsel]

yeah same, he was the first cat I ever got and I refuse to admit he's getting older bc he's still the same orange doofus

took in a floofy tabby from a coworker who is 3 now and shes the snuggliest baby ever

[warm depot]

AH WELL

NO ROGUE CHANGES GUYS

wcyd bros

[lilac stag]

reroll

quit

[keen dome]

Be rogue forever

Never log off

[lilac stag]

League

underwater basket weaving

Topple a gov’t

[lilac stag]

That forced disconnect gonna hit your hard isn’t it

[keen dome]

Incredibly.

I will absolutely have people whispering me going "hah you had to log off"

[lilac stag]

I’ll be your emotional support american when it happens.

[slate marlin]

huh are there new patch notes?

[pale spoke]

honestly call me crazy but no changes feels like good changes

i’m digging things as they are and set bonus feels good

[swift tinsel]

when outlaw and sub are calling for the same thing to address tier issues, I'd disagree

[pale spoke]

i’d like to be more informed

can i get the tldr?

or a forum link