I am stupid
#assassination
wary ice
It's OK int doesn't increase our damage
gusty mirage
true
spice spire
I am stupid
True 
grim hornet
which stats on obedience legendary? crit/haste or crit/vers?
scarlet warren
which stats on obedience legendary? crit/haste or crit/vers?
if you wanna multi spec id say crit vers, otherwise crit haste for just sin
grim hornet
k, ty!
stark rain
Anyone made a sim if theothar is stronger this week cause of tripple empowered potency conduit?
subtle tundra
frost set
balmy condor
Anyone made a sim if theothar is stronger this week cause of tripple empowered p...
He was stronger last week for a lot of people too
balmy condor
why dashing scoundrel better than doomblade?
Are you necro?
spice spire
Low ilvl is usually the culprit
vagrant obsidian
venth
spice spire
Even necro dashing scoundrel will eventually be better
What’s your ilvl @vagrant obsidian ?
vagrant obsidian
246
spice spire
Could you post sim? I don’t doubt but I’m trying to make sure
That seems like it’s a lock
And also do you use frost set?
quasi grotto
simm not showing a piece i have already with socket inv ault as upgrade
vagrant obsidian
mb its because i have no conduit for poisons?
balmy condor
Doom and dashing are equal on necro
It’s to be expected
Was legit margin of error on multiple 255-256 profiles I ran
spice spire
mb its because i have no conduit for poisons?
Running now to double check
TFW no swift sim pleb tho :/
And I ran it on dungeon slice 
quasi grotto
does simming conduits just not work properly
tried simming 252 lashing. and says my 226 is better 😩
just feel like my sim is broken. in vault i got a piece i already have but with socket. also not an upgrade
vagrant obsidian
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/okX8xwEyUgjz4qJnctYQp1
wow, ty
balmy condor
Full haste enchants?
spice spire
Np king
balmy condor
vagrant obsidian
still have no idea how to sim enchants and gems 
balmy condor
spice spire
Make sure this is checked and choose the other options
ebon notch
Make sure this is checked and choose the other options
ive been referenced 
ebon notch
quasi grotto
can someone help me pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. i think im going crazy
balmy condor
With what
grim hornet
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jgCDwq4hEuYfoAvzMDP1B7 its usual that dashing sims more than obedience + mfd?
balmy condor
That’s bs/ds
harsh lantern
^
quasi grotto
simming my vault. i have an item that says upgrade on drpotimizer. or another piece i already have, but with a socket
but the simm is saying dps loss. pretty confused
harsh lantern
link the vault sim
bleak sun
Time for 60% mast m+ :pepeclown-1:
grim hornet
lower in the sim appears obedience + mfd, at +1094
ebon notch
Time for 60% mast m+ :pepeclown-1:
do it no balls
harsh lantern
lower in the sim appears obedience + mfd, at +1094
Can’t compare obe mfd to bs/ds ST
spice spire
Time for 60% mast m+ :pepeclown-1:
Oshosi disciple
gusty mirage
Time for 60% mast m+ :pepeclown-1:
grim hornet
Okey, someone before told me highest simming was obedience + mfd for st, or maybe i understood it wrong
harsh lantern
No bs/ds still sims top ST I believe
maybe the bis gear it does
But bs/ds always bumps my sim on ST
slow marsh
Hey guys new rogue here, was just wondering why everyone in logs go ep / vigor when blindsided deeper sims higher. Also please no answers unless you are 100% right period.
slow marsh
Yes only in normal though but don't tell anyone
harsh lantern
hehe
quasi grotto
what did i do wrong
quasi grotto
i tihnk i have an issue with my sim
gusty mirage
u parse 96?
Ye he’s in the top 5% of rogues
quasi grotto
even when i go to do 226 lashing to 252 to check what it would give me
gusty mirage
He’s 100% right. Period
spice spire
Even though it should have auto out it in
quasi grotto
says 226
spice spire
It just didn’t
balmy condor
i tihnk i have an issue with my sim
cobalt pelican
the vault sim is just simming without dyz
bleak sun
Socket neck +wrist you heretic @quasi grotto
cobalt pelican
because of how he ran it
balmy condor
drowsy parcel
what happened to that i know im right. Period. -guy from a couple days ago
i dipped out before things got juicy
spice spire
He lives in my heart 
harsh lantern
XD
drowsy parcel
well thats disappointing
spice spire
Reality often is
quasi grotto
https://tenor.com/view/frankly-thats-a-skill-issue-hazzikostas-ion-ion-hazzikost...
So very true
Although I've felt like my summer has been broken for a while. 0 upgrades in weeks 😩
Sim *
balmy condor
Well
slow marsh
for a week
He'll be back. And I'll be waiting 
harsh lantern
He'll be back. And I'll be waiting <:monkascheme:585734083590750219>
we can only hope 
hushed citrus
!oil
prisma monolithBOT
Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ
slow marsh
Next time I got the logs on hand ready to plaster everywhere there second he starts up
Honestly though the most triggering thing to me was the "I'm not here to learn at all - I'm only here to help others"
harsh lantern
Sign me up 
quasi grotto
you have his logs?
seems to have fixed it self for whatever reason. now showing correctly best item. ive been simming MFD for a while too now and showed a loss. but now its showing increase!
slow marsh
Yeah I found his logs and it makes sense why he never posted them in here
quasi grotto
name and shame
slow marsh
Nana it gotta stay low key fam
slow marsh
Let's just say he has an abnormal amount of normal clears
harsh lantern
oof that’s me on heroic
subtle tundra
were his 95% logs from normal?
hollow river
Next time I got the logs on hand ready to plaster everywhere there second he sta...
Please don’t do that
harsh lantern
Let's just say he has an abnormal amount of normal clears
too many? I stopped recently tho
heroic tho
harsh lantern
damn
slow marsh
Heroic is fine
fallen arch
But those are boosting their balls off
harsh lantern
Back to grinding
gusty mirage
But those are boosting their balls off
I mean ye thats normal if you regularly sell
but a normal full clear aint shit boosting
not worth imo
fallen arch
oh no that's true
meager meadow
Does anyone have a good Garrote wa that also works with Subterfuge? I fucked mine up and cant get it back to how it was 
clever kindle
in terms of what, tracking the timers on them?
I use nugrunning personally but that's not really what you were looking for, might be able to emulate the same effect though
By default dots of the target you're on are highlighted and moved above those on off targets
bleak sun
Using luxthos one & its OK tier
meager meadow
hmm maybe i should ask the weakaura community instead, maybe i can fix the one i currently have actually
what i want it to do, or what it used to do, is that it tracked the current target duration, showed cd of garrote, and if i had subterfuge it would show it empowered so i didnt override it
eager bridge
is there a target cap where you stop using garrot and just fok>spend>fok>spend etc ?
balmy condor
No
eager bridge
thanks ! 🙂
balmy condor
Np
eager bridge
and against like 3 target after subterfuge open, is it better to let garrot fade and then reapplying one by one slowly or i'd better replace a boosted one to always have garrot up on all targets ?
silk thunder
Interesting how MFD OBD now sims higher. These subtle shifts in min/max always leave me wondering what changed.
gusty mirage
and against like 3 target after subterfuge open, is it better to let garrot fade...
you're safe to reapply it if its in pandemic range
quasi grotto
tohught it was only obe it worked with
gusty mirage
assuming you vanish into 3x garrotes again
if you want to refresh it without stealth, you wait for it to drop off
eager bridge
assuming you vanish into 3x garrotes again
yeah i meant if i don't have vanish
gusty mirage
wait until they expire then
spice spire
Obedience also plays in with dagger, which is a working theory
Edge of night, that is
quasi grotto
that dagger exists?
still no edge for me
so im assuming, after opener , try get as many resets as possible to funnel into prio?
bleak sun
Got it 1st kill & never came back in raid tho 
quasi grotto
progging kt tonight. so should come in handy
quaint carbon
Got it twice in 4 hc kills 
harsh lantern
1 in 10 for me atm
hollow river
Obedience also plays in with dagger, which is a working theory
What do you mean?
spice spire
What do you mean?
Based on 3-4 sims I’ve done which is a very low sample size, obedience comes out ahead when you have edge of night equipped with MfD
hollow river
so im assuming, after opener , try get as many resets as possible to funnel into...
Also try to use mfd to fuel flag stacks. There’s a certain tolerance you can hold to sync. But yeah try to get resets on adds that will die before flag is off CD too.
hollow river
Yeye
spice spire
When I ran daps it was +60 or something with two daggers over dashing. And earlier I had an obedience with far less gear
oak sky
But like the more finishers more chance to proc should apply for regular flag also?
spice spire
Yeah, but maybe it’s the haste diff? 
I can’t tell you
Poy brought it up
And so far those who wield edges have obedience > dashing, and those who don’t have dashing > obedience
Again very small sample size, just a hypothesis
oak sky
I mean it definitely could be edge
But it doesnt seem like its because you get more finishers
spice spire
Sounds good
gusty mirage
Again very small sample size, just a hypothesis
hypothesize deez nuts on your face
for a more serious response
the logic seems sound
more finishers = good for obedience, more finishers = good for sylv daggies
oak sky
Yeah but there isnt a reason that you would get a large amount more finishers by running obedience vs dashing
Like the daggers and obedience want the same thing
But its achievable with any legendary setup
spice spire
Yeah but there isnt a reason that you would get a large amount more finishers by...
It’s 0.6% it’s not like it’s some GIGA gain
And that can possibly be attributed to the haste gain by having more flags
stray mural
Tfw rank 5 frost next reset but not the cinders for ds
harsh lantern
can you have all r5s yet
pure moth
Prob pretty close if youre someone who full clears mythic
clever kindle
Should have been yes, even without full clear its very close
Just depends on how many bosses you were killing a week in what mode
harsh lantern
yeah I think I only need like 2 more shards or something
Just wondering
Usually first 4 mythic and heroic
clever kindle
Im missing out on like a month of heroic clears to fill in extra bosses and adds and im pretty sure mine will be capped if I went and spent all my embers
placid pagoda
should i drop ilvl / raidbots advice to take more crit for dashing build? Going from 48 down to 45% Crit to take a high ilvl worse stat helm
fallen arch
Probably listen to sim
After a certain crit percentage other stats have more value, even with frost/dashing
balmy condor
soft shale
idk i remember getting 51% crit and it still hungered
placid pagoda
<:kekWat:717804265674113115>
you think take crit over ilvl?
balmy condor
I think why would anyone know better than a sim
soft shale
we are not wizards and heavily depends on piece
placid pagoda
I think why would anyone know better than a sim
true
hollow river
idk i remember getting 51% crit and it still hungered
Yeah I was heading in that direction too until I got some pieces with haste on them o.O
I was at like 50-51 now I’m at 41% crit 20% haste 17%(30) mastery and 9% vers
Feels good that the only mastery I have is from my 252 dagger 
brazen zodiac
lmfao
winter vapor
someone remind me of venthyr opener please :x
hollow river
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
hollow river
Ivey veins should have it
winter vapor
ty
chilly marsh
anyone know if CT target cap apply to the dot too on 9.1.5?
viscid spear
No target cap, so no limit on the amount you can hit with CT to apply the bleed
hollow river
I don’t think anything is for certain just yet
But that’s how it should work theoretically
viscid spear
The initial damage will be lower after a certain amount of targets but the DoT should still apply to everything in range
But yeah, time will tell
viscid spear
Renown caps in two weeks, and likely another month after that at least until 9.1.5
This whole lawsuit is making things wonky in terms of release
hollow river
I don’t see how the lawsuit really pertains to cadence of release
oak sky
It probably delayed it by a week or 2 at most tbh
latent copper
Whats your aoe opener from stealth with and without slice and dice?
hollow river
Gar x 3 - SnD - FoK - CT - FoK - Rupt - FoK - Rupt
Spread bleeds and use envenom to keep SnD rolling
Press shiv on CD
kind talon
latent copper
Ok thats what i do usually. Do dou apply more rup or normal garrote instead of a evenom?
hollow river
keep rupture/CT up on all targets
And garrote up on as many as you can
But always cast an envenom to refresh SnD or if everything has bleeds on it
latent copper
Ok so evenom only for rolling snd in aoe?
hollow river
Or if everything has full bleeds on it
Try not to 5 combo point rupture mobs about to die
latent copper
Ok ty
hollow river
If everything about to die I usually envenom
Unless you’re really energy starved and need a little energy refund, you can 3 combo point rupture a mob and when it dies it’ll refund that energy regen
bleak sky
Ok so evenom only for rolling snd in aoe?
or prio targets
strange python
can you kick tormented mobs if inspiring mobs are next to them
subtle tundra
no
i vividly remember how i told my group to chain into inferno guy with inspiring into insta wipe
strange python
lool
thank you dude my tank was planning a route with chaining
u most likely saved the key
late whale
Did anyone else encounter the serrated bone spike bug this evening? I started pulling every boss in SoD when we were in front of it. Even at a distance of 100yd or more
drowsy parcel
did you skip ahead and kill kt/sylvanas and then went back for the reclear?
late whale
Actually did yeah
drowsy parcel
ive had it too
theres something that makes sbs stick after sylv is dead
you get gemstones procs too
late whale
Yeah exactly
drowsy parcel
just tp out and back in and it goes away
echo geyser
do u get perma extra cp on other bosses or no
drowsy parcel
not sure actually
late whale
That not no, but i think it might proc extra dmg but no cp
weak crescent
do you guys eat crit food or feast ?
soft shale
feast
prisma monolithBOT
Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ
hollow river
yeah ik
hollow river
i just didn't expect it to be over 40-50 on patchwerk
yeah im gonna try it tonight at some point
get comfortable with some mechanics first
once i upgrade Obe to 262 next week/later this week it'll prolly be even bigger
262 obe doesn't outsim dashing with mfd for me, odd
ebon notch
timid lodge
Wait the dagger drops for you guys?
oak sky
Oh you know every once in a while
timid lodge
maybe ill get it next patch
oak sky
If you kill the boss on every or a few difficulties a bunch of times and sometimes have trade options and have vault theres no chance you won't get it eventually
timid lodge
usually kill on normal and heroic with 9/9 vault but im sadly only rogue
timid lodge
need re roll for dagger stack
oak sky
I got one in vault earlier on
kind talon
Agreon traded me one :)
oak sky
But it took me like 10 kills to get one from the kill
kind talon
gusty mirage
Agreon traded me one :)
sounds like he's your little pumper
kind talon
And now it’s in my hands
kind talon
sounds like he's your little pumper
He’s my little Pog daddy
gusty mirage
can someone translate that into english from zoomer pls?
copper salmon
Zoomer speak
gusty mirage
balmy condor
timid lodge
dagger dream might be dead anyway they are really pushing this re roll warlock idea
kind talon
pure moth
i just didn't expect it to be over 40-50 on patchwerk
Doesnt sim better for me on patchwork but im sure its still beneficial on certain fights. Might mess with it regardless of sims.
normal mist
Aight my dudes I'm pretty happy with my sin progress today!
Crafted dashing, got 3frosts + 1red shard, 32% crit / 18% haste, simming around 8k.
And no, no luck with the sylv dagger neither from vault, weekly quest or normal sylv :(
Next week for sure
brazen zodiac
"Next week for sure"
Half this chat been saying that since the first week this patch dropped
Your optimism brings a genuine smile to my face
normal mist
Fake it till you make it my dude!
spice spire
I passed up on the sylv dagger for vault this week (heroic)..
balmy condor
normal mist
spice spire
the neck was almost a +100 DPS upgrade 
balmy condor
normal mist
It's fine, we ain't sub
dense hamlet
spice spire
IT WAS A 252 AZURE WITH A SOCKET
dense hamlet
Fucking Susge
normal mist
I FEEL YOU
balmy condor
Mythic nerzul neck can be socketed too
spice spire
it was like a +25 DPS gain
balmy condor
spice spire
so can DN
dense hamlet
yeah Dn is like giga dps
normal mist
Is that the CRIT vers one?
spice spire
the azure venom, yeah
balmy condor
Oh no
dense hamlet
spice spire
i knew the question he was asking 😛
dense hamlet
close
balmy condor
Millimeters away from disaster
spice spire
if i had a nickel...
normal mist
Yo I'm lost rn
balmy condor
Better that way
normal mist
I require explanations!
spice spire
you almost got hit with a "Deez nutz" joke but you were asking about the neck I got, so instead of doing the bully thing i just gave you the real answer
any time someone says DN it's going to be deez nuts.
so ignore
normal mist
Oh. LOL
dense hamlet
spice spire
or do what agreon did and very obviously ask what it is
normal mist
Oh, weekly quest gave me hc shoulders mast vers, sims seem to ignore the existence of that item on my bags 😂
Using 233 CRIT haste ones
normal mist
I'm venthyr indeed, going for CRIT haste for sure.
Well good people, time for some rest, enjoy your morning/evening/night, where dafuq u are.
brazen zodiac
I passed up on the sylv dagger for vault this week (heroic)..
...
strange python
When the buyer gets fusion amp and you haven't gotten a raid upgrade in 4 weeks
Kill me plz
dense hamlet
ebon notch
@balmy condor oi bruv
Why is BS/DS bad on mythic remnant
The balls fuckin die instantly
They evaporate
brazen zodiac
yo daps does fok on balls keep up alacrity in painsmith?
brazen zodiac
not using mfd
brazen zodiac
kk thx
muted bramble
Another question about Pain balls. Can i just FOK them like crazy to build up frost shard damage? even after the first one dies
viscid spear
Mythic Tarra was a joke.
kind talon
Why is BS/DS bad on mythic remnant
Dot them when they spawn
?????
Literally free energy
Maintain 5 bleeds
It’s literally council of blood part 2
ebon notch
Yeah and then the frost set crits the ball for 800!
brazen zodiac
seems like i cant keep up alarcity during intermission rip
kind talon
Idk you can still play BS/DS and dot up the balls
the reason u run bs/ds is cause u have low energy
so u can technically play ep/ds
on that fight
vigor is good for windows with no balls
but yeah technically if u want to go full st and never touch balls
u can run bs/ds
but its just playing the spec incorrectly and makes me triggered
kind talon
you literally would just dot 1 close ball
usually the boss gets moved to a better position
brazen zodiac
im losin so much energy regen by not applying anything lmfao
oak sky
hes talking about remnant
agile grove
Anyone feel its really worth it to craft dashing scoundrel over doomblade if you're running frost shards?
or is the difference minimal? I cant seem to get a steady answer via my sims
agile grove
well im not venth
kind talon
like dashing is really good for venth
but necro without frost doomblade can sim higher
agile grove
interesting
agile grove
word ok ill stick with it
agile grove
ty
violet jackal
they are also playing marileth
muted bramble
Yeah and then the frost set crits the ball for 800!
what? why would it hit the ball?
kind talon
what? why would it hit the ball?
it hits "the last enemy that you have critically struck"
ebon notch
I mean after they lose immunity
They disappear
Wish they never nerfed that
Heroic balls are way better
balmy condor
Yeh but you don’t care about them after they lose immunity
spice mango
why does wowhead say mutilate for opener instead of ambush?
hollow river
why does wowhead say mutilate for opener instead of ambush?
because we use mutilate from stealth, not ambush
!mut
prisma monolithBOT
Ambush is currently only used from blindside/sepsis proc, not from stealth.
The reasoning is a little complicated, but the most important of them is the difference in combo points on crit (up to 4 vs 3).
Some other factors to consider are increased poison applications, blindside, and doomblade. This is true for all talent combinations and legendaries.
spice mango
thank you!
cobalt pelican
Select more items to resolve other constraints
hollow river
i've tried
cobalt pelican
pick an item in your legendary slot that you're using rn
or it can't make a set with the new legendary
hollow river
I saw “why does wowhead” and instantly shit a brick
spice mango
@balmy condor sorry, i tried hard to find the reason in the faq and stuff and didn't succeed 😦
balmy condor
<@!167090536602140682> sorry, i tried hard to find the reason in the faq and stu...
All good man, I just saw it and thought I wrote something wrong
spice mango
i was following its direction anyways, but it kept naggin me in the head that ambush was just sitting there, unused except for a proc. so i had to ask lol
great info in there thank you for what you do ❤️
balmy condor
sonic spire
hello friends, is anyone a Sylvanis Log Connoisseur that can help a girl out? :3
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/id/61934438 this is embarrassing :c
ancient kraken
hello friends, is anyone a Sylvanis Log Connoisseur that can help a girl out? :3...
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/guldan/inthedark
I think more pulls will solve it
sonic spire
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/guldan/inthedark
<:pepehands:820660637...
i just feel like there's gotta be something i'm missing for my dam to be 2k under top logs 😢 i checked CD timings and all the normal stuff but i can't figure out what i'm doing wrong, obviously a couple rotational errors but i make mistakes on any fight :/
oak sky
hit p3 a couple times today : D
mortal smelt
whats the best legendary for necro / raids?
oak sky
@hollow river are you done with prog for tonight or still going?
sonic spire
whats the best legendary for necro / raids?
Doomblade generally
strange python
i just feel like there's gotta be something i'm missing for my dam to be 2k unde...
You have like 5 casts less per minute than the top logs, another thing is u cast feint 11 times which isnt the greatest for logging unless u would overcap either way. Just fixing ur uptime/casts should give alot of damage
sonic spire
You have like 5 casts less per minute than the top logs, another thing is u cast...
i just wanna live :3 lmao i didnt even think about that i always joke "feint is a dps loss" but i always just press it anyway for aoe damage thanks though ❤️ i appreciate you taking the time to look
amber fossil
just 1 shotted H fate in a pug, this never happened before. Did the universe just align itself?
oak sky
no, the runes did 😉
strange python
i just wanna live :3 lmao i didnt even think about that i always joke "feint is ...
I mean looking at your other logs you clearly understand the spec so it essentially just is about uptime, and sylvanas especially is a tough fight to minmax it on and even moreso if you missed out progressing it
amber fossil
no, the runes did 😉
hahah, I see what you did there
atomic estuary
hey guys the sin FAQ shows obedience > zoldycks for M+, does that still hold true?
oak sky
both are good
zoldyck is generally better especially for aoe but obedience can be very strong if you need prio or boss damage
atomic estuary
so theyre kinda even?
oak sky
just good in different ways mostly
atomic estuary
i personally didnt really like using flag on assa tbh cuz of how crit dependant it was to get to 30 stacks
felt bad getting only 20 stacks sometimes
oak sky
in aoe at least running flag it should be 25-30 pretty consistently
atomic estuary
hmm ok
oak sky
also if ur necro zoldyck that is really good for keys as well
single target is more variable for flag though
atomic estuary
im still venth atm, was mostly sub for keys but going back to old school sin m+ for off meta push this week
oak sky
do you have a group?
sonic spire
I mean looking at your other logs you clearly understand the spec so it essentia...
yeah it feelsbad to not see progression from week to week and I've felt like my uptime has been improving but i guess just not enough :c
oak sky
well your gear isnt very good
typically we flag before vendetta in the opener
also always make sure you have a full finisher queued up before you flag and use it immediately after
it looks like you probably did that somewhat
and make sure your bleeds don't drop off your bleed uptime isn't low but it is below what i typically see
and also keep in mind kill time can be a factor for parses so if your group is killing a little slow because of gear its all good
also make sure you shiv on cooldown
you miss a cast on a few kills
on remnant you can try rupturing any immune balls immediately for the energy regen
you don't want to go out of your way or hit any balls that are about to die or get debuffed
lavish lichen
Why flag before?
oak sky
its what the APL does
lavish lichen
Don’t you want the lashes to be buffed?
oak sky
pretty sure its various reasons
getting the haste during vendetta but you still get most of the lashes in there
lavish lichen
My opener is REALLY janky
prisma monolithBOT
oak sky
should be in wowhead and icy veins
yeah opener is normally a little bit weird with energy
lavish lichen
I need to het r5 shards too 😦
oak sky
yeah that helps for sure
getting gear will improve your damage but theres always some rotational stuff to work on
lavish lichen
Yea just my 
dw took note of what you mentioned
Ty for taking the time to look through them
oak sky
ill tell you opener with mfd since it isnt on wowhead
mut snd mut gar flag rupture vendetta shiv vanish mut envenom mfd envenom
you basically just mfd and get a 2nd envenom in the vanish window
lavish lichen
Yes mfd part is easy
oak sky
cool cool
lavish lichen
Tysm
oak sky
np
oak sky
let anyone else in here know if you have questions though
theres usually someone with an answer
balmy condor
No answers here
manic pebble
thick rock
hey guys I was comparing my logs with this guy, I was wondering why he's using that many mutilates?
dawn ivy
it doesnt look like hes overcapping too harshly
thick rock
oh so the overcap are just mistakes then
dawn ivy
oh youre running mfd
hes running vigor which means hes going to be spending a large portion more energy than you would be
drifting cloud
every muti cast is 2 lines in the logs as you can see with same timestamp, mh hit and oh hit
uneven summit
mut snd mut gar flag rupture vendetta shiv vanish mut envenom mfd envenom
ive been doing mut snd mut gar flag rupture vendetta mut shiv vanish envenom mut envenom mfd envenom or mfd envenom before the mut envenom to get 3 envenoms in the MA thought that was the point?
oak sky
MA is only 3 seconds
so you cant really get 3 envenoms in MA
usually we use globals with MA buff to use mut since generating a lot of CP is a big dps gain
uneven summit
yes you can 😛
hollow river
<@!629463378250956810> are you done with prog for tonight or still going?
We stop at 10 pm CST, Monday Tuesday Wednesday
hollow river
Why what’s up
hollow river
yes you can 😛
You can’t
And the general consensus is to use MA for mut env mut so you get the extra combo points from your crits
=even more flag stacks
Etc
oak sky
its not a significant loss to use vanish envenom mut envenom but in opener you pretty much always mut envenom mut(or with mfd envenom again)
hollow river
Yeah ik
kind talon
i c
hollow river
I typically envenom mut envenom because I’m lazy
But I started trying mfd tonight and am trying not to
deft obsidian
Yeh felt weird breaking the habit but it juicy flag stacks 
uneven summit
And the general consensus is to use MA for mut env mut so you get the extra comb...
and with mfd it´s just mut env mfd env, i assume then
hollow river
and with mfd it´s just mut env mfd env, i assume then
Ye
uneven summit
hmm so building straight for a vanish env mut doesn´t help?
hollow river
No
uneven summit
im guessing it´s not a significant loss either way though, i mean my openers are typically up in the 22-26ks with hero and 18ks without
hollow river
It’s not inherently bad, but it’s not a gain either
uneven summit
yea figured
thick rock
What's mfd?
thick rock
oh thanks!
ruby oyster
Is zoldyc on painsmith a bad idea? P1 and p2 damage seems irrelevant as long as we are not losing people and it would help with p3 damage, right? or should I just stick to dashing? I don't really see anyone using it there so I guess there is a reason for that
oak sky
you should probably stick to dashing
zoldyck doesnt have a lot of use in raid this tier
execute is either not quite important enough or the damage loss in other phases is too bad
ruby oyster
Ok got it
west geode
If IQD is giving me haste as a stat instead of crit is it worth using still if im using frost set
versed mica
Sim it
Either way, haste means more bleed ticks in the 20 second window which means possible more crits
jaunty kayak
how should i open up as a necro on the Nine optimally? what i've been doing is to start normal opener on one valkyr, then after the vanish/shiv window mouseover dot-up the second valkyr whilst attacking the first one with the vendetta still on.. after that just regular 2 target dot maintanance.. is that okay or should i change something?
frigid kestrel
how should i open up as a necro on the Nine optimally? what i've been doing is t...
I was looking at the logs a while back when I had the same question and it looks like you do the full opener on one, and when the opener is complete you just start popping your bleeds on the other one.
If you are using Dashing
You will benefit more getting them initial envenoms out vs swapping back and forth getting Bleeds up
jaunty kayak
so far using doomblade.. but already saving up to try out dashing
frigid kestrel
Im not sure if the way you approach it is different using Doom
gusty mirage
Sylv prog guys, she dies soon best pull was 85%
alpine latch
Basically a kill at that point
fallen arch
Ye killed almost p1
alpine latch
P2 is splitting the group, right?
That seems like a much harder phase than in heroic
spice spire
Sylv prog guys, she dies soon <:copium:854628182104080414> best pull was 85% <:...
Only 40% more damage
P2 is but is also a set phase, which makes it just a grind to learn. P3 is where the gaming takes place
gusty mirage
Only 40% more damage <:copium:854628182104080414>
Dies soon
spice spire
She dies tonight
ebon notch
All fights are scripted :3
lavish lichen
Not exactly
What people usually mean by scripted is when the fight is literally on rails and the spell order doesn’t change
I don’t think a fight being unscripted automatically makes it better imo at least
fast nacelle
All fights are scripted :3
gusty mirage
p3 is not that exciting
Almost there I’ll let you know
fast nacelle
just kill and loot dagger
ebon notch
my pvp friends were talking the other day about how pvp is much harder cause all of pve is scripted
hollow river
How far do you think people are getting into Sylvanas their first night or two?
lavish lichen
So weird to compare them like that
fast nacelle
thats a stupid statement aswell
pvp takes xp and pve takes xp... you have different areas of skill
in pvp its about knowing the other classes... trading cds and stuff. its also 2v2 and 3v3 only - however a lot of mechanical skill in terms of awareness
pve is more about prep... organisation (20 people) ... research.. adaptation ..
and a lot of concentration and discipline
whole pilot
How far do you think people are getting into Sylvanas their first night or two?
On average? Probably not even seeing intermission
gusty mirage
How far do you think people are getting into Sylvanas their first night or two?
We’re still struggling in p1 with 30 pulls
whole pilot
Or wiping in the process of it
gusty mirage
It’s rough
fast nacelle
We’re still struggling in p1 with 30 pulls
i know guilds who wiped 100+ times before getting consistent in p2/p3
gusty mirage
I have a feeling p1 is going to take about 30-50 more before we get it clean
Our add management is kinda awful
fast nacelle
boomies and eleshaman help a lot in p1 / p2
gusty mirage
We had people soaking the wrong arrows 
Their WA yelling “right” as they’re standing near the left pile
fast nacelle
hollow river
We’re still struggling in p1 with 30 pulls
Yeah we got like 20ish pulls in and struggling too
We phased her on our last pull
With like 2 alive lol
We have no boomie, no monk
2 DKs, 2 rogues, 2 arms, 1 DH, 1 ret pal
grim tangle
we had a guy soaking the wrong arrows for like 200 pulls
lavish lichen
Honestly
I think Ret
Is the most underrated spec rn
Maybe the one in my guild is just insane
hollow river
Yeah if they’re a good player
karmic crystal
I think it’s one of those classes, a bit like outlaw
hollow river
They can be sick
lavish lichen
Not only damage wise, but utility is also sick
Their damage patterns are insane as well
1 min burst is always nuts I guess
UMM
what did I fuck up here?
lavish lichen
I want dslice
harsh lantern
ah
hollow river
.>
hollow river
Well placed steel
lavish lichen
what about it?
hollow river
Instead of poison/karat conduits
lavish lichen
lavish lichen
lol wth is this
lavish lichen
has to be something stupid idk
or maybe the fact that dslice is like 45% ST
quake checking REALLY hard lol
hollow river
Nah something seems off
lavish lichen
something has to be
spice spire
Doing a couple of testers to make sure
lavish lichen
the talents are correct?
spice spire
Because it still showed same talents as you
lavish lichen
i mean there is no fucking way lol
idk
sketch
idk if its 10%
i cant play that LOL
spice spire
Yeah what I’d do here is check for 90 secondes 8 patchwerk kinda deal
lavish lichen
yea thats what I was thinking
spice spire
Because iirc it’s 25% ST, 25% cleave and 50% aoe
And the 50% non aoe could be messing with it
lavish lichen
nah
its what more than 25% st
its legit 45%
something like that let me double check
spice spire
Yikes
lavish lichen
iirc
~135s ST fight
to start
ofc Im assuming you're aware of the variance in fight timings
2 min 8t
as expected
Subt/Vigor/CT
Still telling me to pick dauntless over 3x pot tho
spice spire
What the fuck
Also any Non swift sim enjoyers?
Stat diff I guess
262 + Theo does it for dungeon slice
lavish lichen
theo is sub bind
lavish lichen
yea rip
but I can change i guess
you know what the funniest thing is
its still on 50 dps
over the other talents
wait, are the defaults from your sim different?
lavish lichen
I mean like talent set
bc the 2nd option in your sim
only changes conduits
so it means the talent change is only 50 dps increase lol
spice spire
It shouldn’t have been but could have
But yeah it’s hella minor on that
Time to check the OW
PW*
Oh god patchwerk even more cursed
lavish lichen
What is this 
spice spire
Yeah - and it’s about what you’d assume a normal pack would live if you did a nutter pull
Idk man getting some weird results rn
spice spire
Goon shit
Just trying to see why funky talents are being selected
Just leading to more questions
lavish lichen
I have no idea at this point LMFAO
hollow river
I’d ping Whispyr but he’s probably seeping
Or he’s already tabbed in, seen some shit, and ran away from his comp
spice spire
I’ll ask him later. I’ve asked him about a lot of sims recently, I’m sure he’s running lmao
slow marsh
Just trying to see why funky talents are being selected
What talents for what
spice spire
Yeah
slow marsh
I am retired from sin m+ until I get my 262 obed
hollow river
I think I’m about to make 262 cele instead of obe
Since dashing mfd sims better than one mfd for me
lavish lichen
Prob a good call if you dont play sub much
spice spire
Almost 2300 sin only m+ first season doing more than just 15s
Sin actually feels nice in m+ imo
But I’m hard OTP :/
slow marsh
Yeah I crafted celerity second so obed is the only real next choice for me I guess. Unless I go zold for when I swap Necro for aoe fights in 9.1.5
Might have to plan it out a bit more but idk.
gusty mirage
Yeah I crafted celerity second so obed is the only real next choice for me I gue...
imagine not having 3 262s already
Obe, Dashing, and Celerity gang
oh wait I have 4
forgot about zoldyk's
slow marsh
I stopped doing torg and assaults like 4 weeks ago
gusty mirage
lmao I don't blame you
slow marsh
Unlike some people who still grind korthia every day even after tier 6 full conduits and sockets
slow marsh
gusty mirage
if you think I do korthia outside of tuesdays you're tripping
Got the paragon mounts, we're done with korthia
slow marsh
Mmmmkay
slow marsh
I wonder if next tier they expand the soulbinds even more but don't add new conduits so we just get screwed
gusty mirage
nah they become super duper empowered
quaint carbon
318 level conduits when
gusty mirage
and give you wings
or the traits themselves get empowered because we're running out of shit
lmao
slow marsh
We have to do 4d mechanics in the air with our new wings
gusty mirage
can't wait
because we all know blizz is really good with coding mechanics in regard to the Z axis
slow marsh
Careful the blizz devs will see and tweet about being harassed by players
Wait nvm there can't be any devs in here cuz they don't play rogue
dense hamlet
slow marsh
Man I am so sad they said talent reworks were gonna be a focus for 9.1.5 and we don't get anything other than 26% buff to dreadblades and a half assed attempt to make NF decent
dense hamlet
gusty mirage
Wait nvm there can't be any devs in here cuz they don't play rogue
none of us play rogue either, we're just WW monks in denial
vestal wren
i am to lazy to play more than 1 class tbh
hollow river
Prob a good call if you dont play sub much
I play sub plenty
262 Obe compared to 235 is hardly anything
hollow river
Man I am so sad they said talent reworks were gonna be a focus for 9.1.5 and we ...
I feel like that could end up being more changes than that
subtle tundra
i also feel like there should be a 915 release date soon
hollow river
dense hamlet
yeah i mean we are close to 80 renown
soon
release date should be somewhere near that
or not
subtle tundra
thats pure speculation
dense hamlet
gusty mirage
That's probably better off in #wow-general
stuck knoll
Yep
slow marsh
Yep
viscid spear
Anyone planning on working on an alt in 9.1.5 that they've been neglecting?
gusty mirage
like working on a serious alt?
until embers catch up is a thing I can't take any alt seriously
alpine latch
Shards/Embers are still fucked and those are harder to come by
gusty mirage
I'm already behind on my rogue, so I'm giga behind on any alt
hollow river
Yeah embers are going to be the main thing stopping me
alpine latch
If you full clear Heroic you're 10 weeks from a full set of r5 shards just for raid.
I'm good
hollow river
My GM is tryin to get us to play ranged
hollow river
Some of us
gusty mirage
don't worry guys
upbeat needle
fuck that
upbeat needle
well then I mean
if you're funneled gear I'd do it but
can't be asked to do torghast weeks on end to get a leggo catch up on renown etc etc
hollow river
I can’t decide
upbeat needle
fuck dat
gusty mirage
yeah grinding dom shards and sockets and embers? fuck that
hollow river
BOOMkin?
gusty mirage
the ash isn't even an issue anymore tbh, I got like 7k sitting on my rogue
hollow river
hollow river
Idk what ranged to play
gusty mirage
yeah the cinders is grief
hollow river
Cinders is farmable
alpine latch
Cinders is 3 weeks. That's not even remotely that bad
gusty mirage
will be farmable*
hollow river
And 2x more per layer
hollow river
will be farmable*
Yea I meant in 9.1.5
upbeat needle
even in 9.1.5 man
alpine latch
Yeah, but that's the point. It's not THAT bad compared to everything else. It's like 45 minutes a week
upbeat needle
fuck that
upbeat needle
Yeah, but that's the point. It's not THAT bad compared to everything else. It's ...
so here's the thing right
my rogue 251
alpine latch
Torghast is boring af but it's easier than every other grind you gotta do
upbeat needle
anything I can get that's an upgrade comes from raid bosses we ain't killed yet
I'ma raid log for the rest of the tier
lmfao
cause I'm playin rogue next tier so like
ye
alpine latch
My rogue is like 244 and I'm in the exact same spot as you
spice spire
Heroics
alpine latch
I mean ... I can get a few items from GVs that are 0.2% upgrades?
upbeat needle
same
alpine latch
I'm not spamming m+ to give a shit about 19 DPS
spice spire
I am at 247 and deadass have like
upbeat needle
facts
alpine latch
IF I get lucky on Tuesday
spice spire
6 252 pieces that are upgrades
hollow river
You guys aren’t full clearing heroic and doing 10 keys a week???
spice spire
Thanks to dom shards
alpine latch
You guys aren’t full clearing heroic and doing 10 keys a week???
Fuck no
spice spire
You guys aren’t full clearing heroic and doing 10 keys a week???
18 key a week Andy here
alpine latch
There's only 2 items that are upgrades from me in Heroics.
hollow river
So
alpine latch
We have only had a single pair of leather gloves drop from the Eye and the rogue quit the next week
hollow river
I have 0 upgrades from hero
spice spire
Sylvanas actually has all but the dagger as an upgrade
hollow river
I want embers for all 3 shard sets
alpine latch
I have killed the Eye on heroic every single week and never got the gloves.
And Sylv's dagger is an upgrade because I haven't gotten a 252 yet after weeks of farming m+
That's literally all I got
hollow river
Are you doing your 10 keys a week still?