assassination

[odd hazel]

^

[azure flare]

with group ig

[strange python]

let me specify that i am not trying to unlock the next level

[odd hazel]

like, i literally did both wings, got rank 5 on one and did the adamanet vault. with 4 people in like 20 minutes or so

[strange python]

i am trying to clear it as fast as possible for the soul ash

you know the 186 soul ash that you get for clearing the same level after already beating it the first time of the week

[odd hazel]

yes

thats the fastest you're gonna get

i mean, i guess if i wanted to i could just skip right ot the boss stealth wise

but im 225 geared toward sin.

[strange python]

ya thats what i did to farm for doomblade

[azure flare]

some bosses could kick ur ass

if u dont have any good powers

[strange python]

yeah but even if you die boss hp doesnt reset

[odd hazel]

i have all the perm torghast upgrades so im usually pretty good

[strange python]

that slime mfer that splits is pretty annoying

[azure flare]

but if u have a good survival power ur good

ah yea then ur fine

[odd hazel]

either way----

you want to do as much as possible in torghast any way

because if you have the vault unlocked

and do it, i believe it gives you extra Cinder

[azure flare]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9UPDeKPjDjN4Moo3vrvTyt

this looks about right i guess?

till later on

[west yoke]

Would it be worth changing to venthyr from necrolord for assa or is the difference too small?

[odd hazel]

its like

100-200 difference

if that really

[odd hazel]

Vers/mastery shoulders

[west yoke]

and necro is still better for assa in m+ right?

[odd hazel]

when obedience comes out

its top for M+

But

and i want to make this clear

if you want to play necro its not gonna cost you much

like 100-200 dps

[azure flare]

well yea its currently what id be wearing if i had those legos

:sadCat:

[odd hazel]

i feel you

[strange python]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dfptir1cUxJe37xGTi2idR

[odd hazel]

i never got the generals shoulders

[west yoke]

@odd hazel alright thanks

[strange python]

wishing i had better m+ gear sadge

[odd hazel]

did you mean to link a patchwerk sim?

[strange python]

!bis

thats the wrong sim

[odd hazel]

No problem! the pins have a lot more info then i can relatively think of off the top of my head usually

[strange python]

oops

[odd hazel]

also

dashing

[strange python]

works on sub channel :/

[odd hazel]

what were you lookin for?

[strange python]

idk what slot to craft the legendaries for

[odd hazel]

Cape!

Both obedience ( if you're venth )
and doom on cape

[strange python]

Thank you 🙂

[odd hazel]

if you're necro you make zold on pants for M+

@balmy condor is there a reason people are suddenly going dashing lmao

[strange python]

its pure bait

[odd hazel]

lmao

[strange python]

it's not that far behind at all, but it's just because they see it on a sim

and that's it

[odd hazel]

i wish it was better

i'd much rather play with it then doom

[strange python]

why?

just like how jpc followers were running deathly on outlaw even though it was statistically worse

nothing changes either way

more energy

bleeds do more damage

[odd hazel]

just different leggo

doom is pretty meh gameplay wise and it would suck if itwas our best the whole expansion

[strange python]

poisons*

[odd hazel]

why i was okay with obedience being the way it was

atleast it effected our gameplay and let us use our main CD more often

[strange python]

I mean it shifts numbers

but nothing changes in playstyle or feel

they're both just "do stuff and it happens"

[odd hazel]

Feel? you get to whip the enemy more

[opaque tree]

They don't even do more damage, just crit a lot more, lol

@strange python I play with Dashing, because it's all I have atm

just came back 2 weeks ago

[strange python]

most haven't crafted a dashing at all is what they really mean

[opaque tree]

first "okay" leggo I got was dashing so I made it, feels okay, but you don't even notice the energy regen. sucks

[strange python]

but it's not a bad craft

just different

[odd hazel]

yeah, just a memein

[opaque tree]

I actually feels good in m+

[odd hazel]

if i didnt already have doom made

i'd prob use dashing

[azure flare]

its pretty chill for st

[opaque tree]

once you envenom and start spamming fok tons of crits

and good energy regen

[strange python]

-shrug- I never feel energy starved with doomb either mind

[odd hazel]

^

[opaque tree]

well, that's good to know because I'm going to be crafting doom most likely

[strange python]

I think I'd like dashing more if it made me feel like I could go ep and no vigor

[opal oriole]

Can we get covenant leggos next reset or nah?

[odd hazel]

some peeps just arent used to the slow gameplay of sin.

@opal oriole at renown 48

[azure flare]

yes

next reset ur at renown 48 if ur done with everything

[spice spire]

Yes this coming reset is the covenant leggos

[opal oriole]

Yeah i know renown 48, but do we get 3 renown

[spice spire]

Yes

[odd hazel]

yes

[opal oriole]

Sweet, tyvm 🙂

[azure flare]

you always do

[opal oriole]

❤️

[azure flare]

should be gucci

[odd hazel]

@spice spire

[spice spire]

Won’t always have the story quest :p

[dim yacht]

we will until we finish the capmaign

campaign

much like 9.0

[azure flare]

I mean obv until the story quest is over :^)

[spice spire]

Good morning gamer Krey

[azure flare]

just like previously yeah

[odd hazel]

gamer Krey

Poggers

[spice spire]

[odd hazel]

i got a 15 done quake, wanan bet on what awful item i get? from vault

[spice spire]

Flayed toxin

[dim yacht]

youll get one that has a domination socket in raid

[spice spire]

100%

[dim yacht]

so dumb that blizzard didnt remove items from m+ loot table that have domination sockets in raid, theyre completely useless

or at best used for a few weeks and then thrown away

[spice spire]

I did a 14 top end, but got all my slots. Not a true w, but we take those

[azure flare]

they're good for people's alts

but yeah

wish u could exclude them or some shit

[dim yacht]

i guess, idk. i just feel like we should be able to remove them

like think about it

5 dom socket slots + lego slot

so 6 out of 12 possible slots are useless for mains just because of its slot alone

[azure flare]

yeah

[dim yacht]

thats really shit

[azure flare]

but on the other hand

if tier sets were a thing

we'd be in the exact same spot

[odd hazel]

its the risk you take bb

[azure flare]

except this time you can at least choose, in legion

[dim yacht]

kind of, except we had 5 and in the past even 6 pieces in a tier set

and only needing 4

[azure flare]

u didnt even get a choice

in legion it was

u get x

[spice spire]

It’s an easy phial week

[azure flare]

regardless whether u liked it or not

[odd hazel]

imagine if i get a 252 phial

week 1

[azure flare]

well no

in the past u had 4 from tier set

and 2 legos

[dim yacht]

maybe offering an item from raid that lets you slot a domination socket into an M= item?

[spice spire]

Buy a lotto ticket then chief because it’s your lucky day

[dim yacht]

M+

[azure flare]

so 6 slots where you didnt want gear

[odd hazel]

i'll get that trink from mists

:^)

[azure flare]

EY

dont

mention that trink

wtf

[spice spire]

Oof don’t say that lol

[azure flare]

u trying to curse the entire discord

[spice spire]

Praying for everyone to get phials or daggies

[odd hazel]

i would take a shadowgrasp as well

so

curious

do i have to kill sylvanas for her loot to be in the vault?

[strange python]

only got sylv to 51 %

no daggers this week

[dim yacht]

yes krey, at least once

[odd hazel]

lame, cant cheese the dagger lmao

[spice spire]

What Nate said

[dim yacht]

after youve killed her, you dont have to kill her again to get her loot in the vault (on that difficulty)

so if you only kill her on normal, you wont get her heroic loot in vault ever until youve killed her

and same goes for mythic ofc

[odd hazel]

ye, thanks !

[dim yacht]

howd everyone do on raid this week

i only got to 5/10h

and a normal clear

[odd hazel]

my raid wiped for 3 hours on normal pain because....this group is special.

[dim yacht]

lol

[odd hazel]

made me want to cry.

[dim yacht]

i wish i coulda done more this week, i didnt think id play the patch

im still kind of feeling the depression from sin rogue 9.0

i havent fully recovered

[odd hazel]

im gonna have to pug more then my guild most likely.

[azure flare]

mm

[odd hazel]

did you play 9.0.5?

[dim yacht]

i did

[azure flare]

seems like obedience is rlly dogshit for me

no matter what I do

._.

[odd hazel]

they were fantastic

[azure flare]

EY ion

[dim yacht]

yeah, just i was into m+ and they still felt a little lackluster. or my gear was just bad stats

idk

[azure flare]

where's our promised raid utility

[dim yacht]

i quit after i got ksm in 9.0

and man let me tell you

9.0 sin rogue ksm, it wasnt fun lmao

i got kicked for being sin more than once

[azure flare]

im surprised u played sin rogue

[odd hazel]

thats idiotic

[azure flare]

back then tbh

[odd hazel]

i got KSM as sin

[dim yacht]

word dude, play the spec you want

[odd hazel]

i just meant the being kicked part

[azure flare]

people back then were just dumb

[dim yacht]

i was mindblown, because i was third sin rogue in world to get ksm lmao

just because of how shit it was

[odd hazel]

the thing is

it wasnt even bad

people just saw meta

and went blind

[dim yacht]

i dunno, it was pretty bad, especially before buff #3

and i was getting 15s before buff #2 even

[swift sky]

it was definitely pretty bad

[odd hazel]

i mean

before buffs of course

but 9.0.5 made it pretty good.

[dim yacht]

yeah, but before that? fucking garbage tier

aoe? what aoe

[odd hazel]

absolutely

[dim yacht]

so soon as i got ksm i was just like :yep: fuck this shit im out

[gusty mirage]

Don’t hurt me like this.

[odd hazel]

Oxi gonna get double pants

[gusty mirage]

Just let me accept my garbage

[gusty mirage]

I got pants 30% of all my vaults last season

[odd hazel]

[dim yacht]

pants sounds good right now

i mean sure id like a dagger or phail but

[gusty mirage]

Especially in m+ where my zold’s goes

[dim yacht]

better pants than a domination socket items

[swift sky]

dont need pants from vault when u can just buy the boe

[gusty mirage]

The goal is to expect garbage so you’re never disappointed

[swift sky]

[dim yacht]

thats true, but maybe i dont wanna spend the gold

[azure flare]

in how many hours does the reset happen for NA?

[dim yacht]

and im on moonguard

mythic boes here are fucking expensive

[odd hazel]

a moongaurd gamer

[dim yacht]

then again, mythic boe farms are easy this tier, yeah?

since theres plenty of trash before first boss

so it might get them on the cheap end

[swift sky]

yea with anima powers as well

fast clears

[gusty mirage]

Technically 3 hours assuming maintenance is done by then

[dim yacht]

im sure even moonguard can scrap together a boe farm group

[azure flare]

gotcha

ty

[dim yacht]

sometimes mg is so expensive its better to just find one on another server and xfer it

[odd hazel]

11 is when it resets

for EST

so like, 12? probably 1.

to give a little room for maintenance

i know a lot

of peopel said the sack is super strong from taz

but its just not better then a phial for me.

[wanton creek]

Am I better off as necro if I’m going to be maxing doom blade?

Or should I still be alright as venth

[odd hazel]

you should be fine

[wanton creek]

As I’m re rolling main I’ll not be 100% for a while and obedience sounds like you need to really know your shit to pull ahead of doom blade with the more passive benefit

[odd hazel]

tbh

they are close enough to the point it wont matter much

[dim yacht]

but obedience is better aoe than doomblade id think

i dont see why it wouldnt

[odd hazel]

well yeah it is

[dim yacht]

and is there much to know? wouldnt it just be flag on cd?

[odd hazel]

its flag on CD now any way

[dim yacht]

right

so what is there to know

[wanton creek]

I’m maybe being a dumbass I just recall saying prio changes etc with obedience

Seeing”

[odd hazel]

they do not

[strange python]

the only thing that would be remotely different with obe is that it would be worth using finishers early at the end of flag if it was the last thing you could fit in

and that's really tiny detail stuff

everything else is the same, just you push flag more often

[burnt star]

Well. Also on a 4 min fight u have 4 usage of flag. As oppose to doomblade where u have 3 usage only. Might be worth simming different time lenght then the casual 5 to know the real diff between both

[odd hazel]

i mean

realisticaly yes, i could see obed doing better in shorter fights

since the burst would be slightly or a little more higher

[dim yacht]

unless you dont do m+ at all, i dont see why woud want doomblade over obed

when theyre almost the same in ST and obed is clearly better in aoe

[odd hazel]

some arent venthyr

theres a lot of bone bois here

[dim yacht]

yeah i meant if you were venthyr

[odd hazel]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[dim yacht]

it changes if youre not of course

[shadow pivot]

Is the Deathly Shadows usebug on pull just not worth it on Assa because of master assassin?

[odd hazel]

it is not

[burnt star]

They also fixed it

[drifting cloud]

did they?

[odd hazel]

From reports i've seen yes

[north basin]

Obe on average will give 10-12% vers at best?

[odd hazel]

depends on how much stacks you get on average

[alpine latch]

I mean, yeah? I typically get around 21 stats on my Flag

stacks*

[north basin]

Ye asme, very rare ocasion i get more than 25%

[alpine latch]

I'm sure I could probably get more if I played better. But ~22 seems to be pretty much average for me most raid nights.

[sudden nacelle]

So we gonna run a poll boys? pve - Doomblade vs Obediance

[plain thistle]

[alpine latch]

I'm personally crafting DB first, because I don't know if I'm sticking with Venythyr the entire patch.

[plain thistle]

our lord and savior bone spike

[alpine latch]

I know Outlaw reasonably well, and I haven't touched Sub since Legion

[plain thistle]

convert

[alpine latch]

Cranking out a r6 DB clock next week, then I'll figure it out.

Right now I'm still using my r4 shoulders

[odd hazel]

we got some M+ nerfs bois

coming

[alpine latch]

shiiiit

[odd hazel]

Tormented Lieutenant Nerfs
Incinerator Arkolath
This debuff caused Soulforge Flames to deal high AoE damage and since multiple debuffs were put out at a time, healers were unable to dispel them all.

Melt Soul Increases Fire damage taken by 100% down to 50%

Oros Coldheart
This debuff did very very high single target damage to the afflicted player even on a +15 and now the damage has been nerfed by 25% to be a little more manageable.

Biting Cold The caster afflicts a player with Biting Cold, inflicting 8 ( now 6 ) Frost damage every 1 sec to the target and any nearby players for 10 sec.

Biting Cold The caster afflicts a player with Biting Cold, inflicting 8 ( now 6 ) Frost damage every 1 sec to the target and any nearby players for 10 sec

[alpine latch]

i need to look at the patch list

Oh shit, I thought you meant rogues got nerfed.

[odd hazel]

nope!

[alpine latch]

None of them were even hard, though...

[odd hazel]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

i expected plumage to get hit

[alpine latch]

Whatevs

[north basin]

I expected they fix poison bug and give us free 200 dps

[alpine latch]

Yeah, the power system in m+ seems extremely disappointing. I was hoping for something more.

[timid cloud]

You mean Necro dagger.

[forest swallow]

no nerfs to rogues we in the clear..for now

[timid cloud]

That plumage is giga awful in comparison.

[odd heath]

[teal bloom]

Plumage probably good during fortified, necrotic dagger during tyrannical

[timid talon]

^ taking dagger this week is not the play

[north basin]

Gonna craft new necro leg! Fuck obe!

[timid cloud]

I’d probs only take Plum if I’m mass pulling, I’ll just stick to stats & stay safe on Fortified.

[timid talon]

we offer 0 utility in raid, so doing a little more damage is fine. I don't know why everyone was worried lol

[timid cloud]

All we do is live long & deal damage.

[timid talon]

Warriors, mage, paladins all almost do as much as us and have much more to offer the raid than just damage like us

[odd heath]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[chrome widget]

Consensus, if both played at a high level, Assa or Sub for Fort week? =)

[north basin]

Sub!

[drifting cloud]

sub

[alpine latch]

What are you better at?

[chrome widget]

Probably Assa, slightly, but I can pull more dmg on sub it seems almost

[timid cloud]

Longer fights also benefit Sin though cause stuff actually lives long enough to get all your bleeds out.

[thorny pond]

Sin on fort weeks is good if tank goes pack by pack

[alpine latch]

You're not a robot. You don't play at 100% efficiency. Playing what you're better at is almost always better than playing what is mathematically better.

[timid cloud]

Also longer below 30% phases for Zold.

[chrome widget]

That is a great point

[north basin]

Sub= easy 2 button giga aoe dps spam. Assa=150 iq fast switching and applying dots. Outlaw = 200iq demigods with less than sub aoe, but with better utility )

[chrome widget]

I am 100 percent a robot

=)

No but for real thank you all. Some good advice there from everyone.

[tacit bobcat]

Dear all, Is it Obedience still worth it after nerf?

[sand sigil]

depend on fight lowkey

[forest swallow]

shroud? lol nah yea i know i didnt think wed get gutted. I saw the slight obedience nerf coming though for sure.

[tacit bobcat]

Ok I see! Thanks

[faint fog]

I’m considering switching venthyr (playing 3 specs but assassination atm). Is everyone switching venthyr while doing mixed content ?(m+\raid). Until now the sims were in favour of necro for m+, but according to the latest ones venthyr is ahead in all content now. 🤔

[south belfry]

sin/outlaw necro sin/sub venthyr

[prisma monolith]

Deadly Poison doesn't apply on some casts like Garrote, Rupture, and Shiv.
It's a minor bug but "notable" in that it does have some noticeable impact on DPS.
Should be around a 100-200 dps loss

[manic pebble]

!pb

!poisonbomb

[hoary merlin]

and if you play only Sin ?

[south belfry]

Venthyr

[strange python]

venthyr+obedience

[fallen arch]

Pla don’t call Outlaw demigods

[dim ledge]

So no boss tuning came out?

[faint fog]

Thx. Still hesitating because I’m mostly running outlaw in m+ and assa in raids 😐.

[fallen arch]

They’re just backstabbers like us but with more range

[sudden bolt]

How do you reliably get the full 30 stacks of Flag?
I can never seem to get more than 20-25ish outside of lust on pull

[plain thistle]

you cant as assa

you need a lot of luck with crits to get 30 stacks as assa, really really lucky

[gusty mirage]

They’ve been busy hotfixing sylvanas trying to not bug out

[fallen arch]

Who said you need to get to 30 Stacks?

[sudden bolt]

do sims take that into account?

[gusty mirage]

Yes they do

[plain thistle]

of course

[strange python]

i do belive the difference in dps is like around 0.3% for assasination @faint fog
so in the end it's kinda a personal choise i guess

[gusty mirage]

Except for fae, fae kinda doo doo now

[potent dagger]

i wonder why sub is still ahead in raid on sims , but not in real play

[proud goblet]

which nameplates are you guys using? looking for something thats good for Tracking bleeds

[strange python]

i track bleeds with WAs not nameplates, for nameplates i use a custom plater profile

[potent dagger]

Elvui nameplates for me ^^

[sudden bolt]

Plater for me, but yeah, i track bleeds with WAs

[fallen arch]

Think he meant just 5min patchwerk sims

There sub is ahead

But irl they dont have obedience yet

[whole bluff]

Nah I read wrong, thought he was talking about assass being behind

[fallen arch]

So sin is mostly better

[whole bluff]

In raid

[pearl basin]

sin easier to execute + higher uptime when you have to run away

[strange python]

the next coming weeks is going to be interresting to see if everything changes in real play and not just sims

[potent dagger]

i enjoy playing both spec , but with the gearing system of my raid i have to commit to only one spec

so it's kinda hard to choose :/

[potent dagger]

when i sim with my current gear , sub is still ahead :/

but only on sims Oo

[fallen arch]

Yes in theory

[potent dagger]

even on DS i've way better overall dps on assa

[fallen arch]

But I haven’t seen one sub play like a robot and pull actually more

[faint fog]

Okay many thanks 💜

[fallen arch]

For M+ its different, there they all blast

[fluid raven]

So its doomblade better now as assa even if you are Venth?

[tired vessel]

[potent dagger]

who they ? You mean all spec ? ^^

[strange python]

check newest pin, TLDR....dps difference is ~0.3%

[odd hazel]

yes??

[north basin]

15% vers looks more rounded and pleasible for eyes, we demand 30 stacks for assa!

1% vers still = 1% damage?

[winged basin]

Imma go NF for Toxic Onslaught coma err I mean dream

[hollow talon]

What's the plan after servers go up for people who want to beef up for raid

Spam m+?

Its 236 ilvl right

[winged basin]

Spam + fo show

I’m not making r5 for atleast another week or 2

[obsidian ridge]

sim 246 ilvl droptimizer, spam the dungeon with the best dps increase and upgrade that thing with valor

thats what im gonna do. gotta do some 15 fortified tho

[north basin]

Spam plague!

[obsidian ridge]

get the phial. yep

[hollow talon]

It's only 236 end of dungeon tho

[subtle tundra]

you can upgrade tho

[obsidian ridge]

• valor upgrades for 250 valor each

[winged basin]

I’m not gonna have to spam PF, my vaults going to have 252 Phial

[hollow talon]

Oooh true

[obsidian ridge]

[odd hazel]

sim for 252

get those 15s done

[winged basin]

See you at the top yo

[whole bluff]

Trinkets are 400 valor

[winged basin]

[hollow talon]

I already have a phial but it's 229

[rigid yew]

its been a while since i played my rogue, can someone help me understand why sometimes one of my combo points is highlighted?

[echo geyser]

if its 236 do we only have to upgrade 2 times ?

or how many steps is it to 246

[obsidian ridge]

3 times i think

[odd hazel]

are you kyrian?

[winged basin]

Mines 220 but I don’t use it cause 233 ticking bag of overtuned explosives sims higher

[echo geyser]

so 1.2k if 400 per?

[odd hazel]

ticking sims less for me

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rigid yew]

im leveling, so ya currently in bastion

[odd hazel]

its the covenant ability for kyrian

[echo geyser]

rly?

[odd hazel]

its a "encharged" CP

[odd hazel]

yes

[echo geyser]

what do u even have ?

[odd hazel]

220 phial and 220 decanter

shadow grasp sims higher then it as well

[echo geyser]

no shot

[hollow talon]

If you get 252 phial and 252 dagger which do you take

[odd hazel]

phial

100%

[hollow talon]

[echo geyser]

we are talking ST sims right?

not some dlsice or

[odd hazel]

Yes and M+

[echo geyser]

no shot ur trinkets are better than 233 ticking on st

0 chance

[odd hazel]

its also worse on dungeon slice

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[echo geyser]

yeah i cant speak for dslice

[odd hazel]

i just wouldnt say the trinket is overtuned

i mean its not a bad trinket at all

even simmed it against a 252 phial

and it was like...80-100 behind?

or something like that

[echo geyser]

idk what u simmed but

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pPYKxNgUzhbp858prUh49p

i have better trinkets than u

[odd hazel]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jw3LzcVyzP2XMZYaG8LhyB

[echo geyser]

yeah

so it destroys ur 220s

[odd hazel]

no

its better by like

90

thats not destroying i would say

[drifting cloud]

.. you know thats alot

right

[echo geyser]

1.5% and 2.6%

[odd hazel]

its not though

its not worth going after

jsut to be replaced

[echo geyser]

is a fuck ton lol

[odd hazel]

im not farming something that i could easily get from M+ and vault

[echo geyser]

yeah its a personal choice

[odd hazel]

personal?

nah

[echo geyser]

but people usually scram for 0.5% upgrades

[odd hazel]

if they did

you'd all be mechagnomes

[echo geyser]

noones alliance

[odd hazel]

i am my friend

and @thorny pond is

[winged basin]

It simmed almost 100 dps higher than my 220 phial

So that’s weird

[echo geyser]

anyways point is, 1.5% is huge

[odd hazel]

thats not enough for me to farm. if i had it already i'd use it but im not gonna worry about it

[echo geyser]

2.6% not to mention

[odd hazel]

since 1.5% isnt huge

[winged basin]

def

[odd hazel]

yall acting like you care about those slight differences

[thorny pond]

I am Velf Because not Belf

[odd hazel]

just saying your alliance 😛

[winged basin]

Nah, but it ain’t worth stressing over for sure

I just went undead because my first rogue was undead for nostalgia

[odd hazel]

That difference

[obsidian ridge]

90 dps from a single slot in your gear is massive sir

[echo geyser]

well in this case its 2.6% or 168 cause u always replace the worst slot right

[odd hazel]

Is like necro vs venth

Not when you can’t farm it really

Not worth going after

[thorny pond]

"Look good, play good"

[drifting cloud]

how you gonna farm 252 phial when you arent doing 15s?

[thorny pond]

Im not playing well as a gnome with gun feet

[odd hazel]

I’m doing 15s sir

[drifting cloud]

like you dont wanna do it fine just dont pretend its not big

[echo geyser]

u just do it once per reset thats it its not an endless farm

[odd hazel]

I’m just saying it’s not@over tuned

[drifting cloud]

literally sylvanas hc dagger from a 233 dagger is 200 dps

[winged basin]

Even at 20s you don’t have to min max that hard don’t sweat

[drifting cloud]

and thats the biggest single slot upgrade you can get outside of having-not having dom sockets

[odd hazel]

I mean, I just said it’s not over tuned

[drifting cloud]

but apparently 2/3 of that is "nothing"

[scenic root]

Why wouldn't you do one hard mode, give chance to get 233 for a few low slots and a decent trinket.

[winged basin]

I just call it bag of overtuned explosives cause it makes up anywhere from 6.5-8% of my damage on painsmith last night

[odd hazel]

I’m not sweating. I just don’t want to waste time getting a 233 to just get replaced by a better trinket

[echo geyser]

u know its about equal to a 246 totem

[odd hazel]

Yes

[echo geyser]

beats all raid trinkets at mythic

[winged basin]

Only reason I’m blasting through everything is cause we wanna kill the first 3 on mythic every week while progging heroic

[echo geyser]

phial is better ofc

[scenic root]

A trinket you could get next week or 2 months cause shitty m+ luck. again why wouldn't you go for something that doesn't take much effort to attempt once a week.

[odd hazel]

I could also just spam M+ until I get it

[echo geyser]

heres a fun comparison btw

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qZhXuyPMBVxQYVLLqNimsw

[spare crown]

what conduits we run?

[echo geyser]

prob worth skipping sylvanas too then

[scenic root]

Not like anyone would get daggers anyway. Can't farm them like mists dagger.

:

[odd hazel]

My phone is shit at loading these triggered

[odd hazel]

I think you’re taking this way out of hand lmao

[narrow ravine]

has anyone looked into if sylv normal dagger is worth taking over a heroic generic one?

[echo geyser]

yeah its just a fair comparison cause u can only do both these once a week

[narrow ravine]

is the proc that much of a gain

[alpine latch]

It's funny to see you guys argue points that you both agree on but have a different philosophy approaching. Krey isn't saying that a 90 DPS upgrade isn't worth getting, he's saying that it's not worth going out of your way to farm something that isn't your BiS.

[odd hazel]

^this

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[echo geyser]

its not about telling someone to farm something

its saying 1.5 - 2.6% isnt big

[odd hazel]

It’s really not

[alpine latch]

In the grand scheme of things, it's not

[odd hazel]

Not for something that isn’t BiS

Go off fam

If you want to farm for it

Go for it

I already said if. I had it I would use it

[scenic root]

BiS is what you get from drops. Can't magically get something because it's BiS. You take what you get and improve as best as you can

[odd hazel]

But I’m not gonna go for it

You all took this very seriously lmao

[narrow ravine]

one of the reasons im not super excited about switching covs for a minor bump

[odd hazel]

^this too

[narrow ravine]

its a lot of work when necro isn't that bad

[scenic root]

I have had people call me troll for suggesting someone not switch to venthyr if they don't want to.

[alpine latch]

Yeah man, people are dumb af

[narrow ravine]

its not just the renown levels its leveling the mission table, and getting the teleporter again, its having to collect souls in the maw again.. its tedious

[alpine latch]

Everyone plays this game as if they are playing in the RWF

[drifting cloud]

very far from the truth

[echo geyser]

nah i just think if u are in a progress guild no matter what level u should optimize ur character at least a bit to reach the goal

even hc is hard right

not saying 1% will make a diff ofc

[odd hazel]

You can do mythic as the worse spec

[echo geyser]

but in all slots it does

[sacred yarrow]

What is It like 70 ish guilds have killed sylvanas heroic

Fukin super hard tier

[echo geyser]

yeah

[drifting cloud]

dont worry its EU overtime day its going to a 100 today

[scenic root]

98 I believe as of na reset

[drifting cloud]

its at 80 right now

[sacred yarrow]

Would i be lying if I said ian/blizz made heroic harder to prolong heroic raider subscriptions

Feels so strange coming from full clearing the heroic raid in one night in previous tiers

[drifting cloud]

its just sylvannas kt has like 800 kills

[narrow ravine]

anything ever come from Ian's acknowledgement that rogues need a raid cooldown of some kind? just blowing smoke?

[drifting cloud]

and you would very rarely full clear hc in 1day, maybe in nya/antorus where it was actually easy

[sacred yarrow]

Yeah

That's what I meant

Since then it's been rough

[drifting cloud]

but most other raids didnt get full cleared in 1day, but yeah end boss would usually end up at 500+ 1st week easily

then we had sire into now this

atleast on sire we were 25ilvl lower than the loot he dropped

[sacred yarrow]

Yeah

[drifting cloud]

were pulling this boss at 230 and getting wrecked

[sacred yarrow]

They tried so hard to make that sylvanas fight epic and

Just missed the mark

[drifting cloud]

like a hc guild isnt killing this version of sylvanas even if theyre all 235+

[sacred yarrow]

The dps check is super hard

I hear 19 manning is optimal atm for raid numbers

[echo geyser]

yeah it scales rly hard above

def cant have any dead ppl going in to p3 without CRs available

[shadow pivot]

the damage taken by the raid above 19 players is insane

The boss isn't even really that hard, im pretty sure most people will oneshot the fight with a few more raid ilvls, its just high number requirement

probably tuned for a raid that has 20 domination socket sets

[echo geyser]

its sad that hc dagger mainhand is lower upgrade than offhand for outlaw

[shadow pivot]

yesterday someone was talking about sylvanas dagger being horrible on sylvanas fight but i couldnt read everything

[echo geyser]

yeah cause she dies at 50

[shadow pivot]

is there a statement about it like is a normal dagger just straight out better?

[echo geyser]

so theres no real "execute"

not building all the stacks

not sure what happens on mythic

[drifting cloud]

should be same fight probably like 16min or something

dont think anything is hidden

[echo geyser]

it is wayy too long for sure

[shadow pivot]

i guess its an unpopular opinion but i really enjoy the fight

p2 is slightly too long

[echo geyser]

its fun apart from lag in p1

but long so people lose focus after many pulls

[runic maple]

when vanishing, does it matter if I use ambush or mutliate for that quick burst?

[shadow pivot]

mut is better for multiples reasons (poison application/cp generation)

[runic maple]

mutliate gives 4 on crit but ambush gives 3?

[odd hazel]

!mut

[prisma monolith]

Ambush is currently only used from blindside/sepsis proc, not from stealth.
The reasoning is a little complicated, but the most important of them is the difference in combo points on crit (up to 4 vs 3).
Some other factors to consider are increased poison applications, blindside, and doomblade. This is true for all talent combinations and legendaries.

[tacit pilot]

so how many ppl are making obedience tomorrow?

[silk valley]

Im making it for my sub but i think will stick with doom for ass

[potent dagger]

i will make it for both spec

i can go crit haste for both spec

[sacred yarrow]

Ima stick with obed on assa I think

[potent dagger]

since for sub crit / versa / haste are so close that it doesn't even matter

[echo geyser]

isnt haste usually lowest or is that for aoe only?

[scenic root]

Haste is kinda bad for sub

[echo geyser]

im making my obedience crit vers

[odd hazel]

I will

[echo geyser]

but not sure about if r5 obed or doom

[scenic root]

Yeah versa is not horrible for sin.

[hollow river]

Haste is fine for sub

No secondaries are bad

[echo geyser]

venthyr prefs less haste anyways so works out fine

[odd hazel]

I’ll be make it for M+ for sure

[echo geyser]

is it better than zoldycks=

[odd hazel]

Yes

[echo geyser]

ah damn thought it wouldnt be after nerfs

[scenic root]

For m+, chart in pins

[echo geyser]

obed is like 1% loss for me rn in st

[granite thistle]

Hello Obedience gamers. Todays the day!

[bleak sun]

Eyo boi

[digital zodiac]

is obed still looking like the play for ST and AOE? (Yes doom is like 20dps ahead in ST w/e)

[potent dagger]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1GMXg8KjFMLnqcu9irkBXeLDhELg2wNtG9bteEV5BsZ0/edit#gid=580596424

[echo geyser]

ah well 1% isnt big

not worth to make i guess if i got zolds

[potent dagger]

it's more up to date on the gdoc

[hollow river]

Sim yourself with it

[scenic root]

Well if you are making for sub anyway, doesn't matter.

[potent dagger]

and on the last update obedience is up ahead in ST as well

[digital zodiac]

i mean i guess my main question is, am i still okay playing venth right now 🤣 unfortunately dont have necro levelled if needing to swap

[echo geyser]

i just got shit gloves with dom socket

[hollow river]

That’s with end of tier 252 ilvl but yea

[hollow river]

Yeah you should be fine

[odd hazel]

Why would venth not be okay

[hollow river]

I’d still sim it and then make your own judgements

[scenic root]

By 24 dps

[potent dagger]

yes but still ahed

and sice it's ahead in DS , it kinda a go to

[low epoch]

!bis

[odd hazel]

What were you looking for

[low epoch]

bis gear list

think i saw one on wowhead

[odd hazel]

Sim

Don’t go by those

Your results may vary

[misty hemlock]

haste is the worst for sub tho

[misty hemlock]

i'm going crit/versa for sub/assa obedience, seems better imo

[odd hazel]

Haste isn’t awful for sub

[hollow river]

Haste is fine for sub

[potent dagger]

sim your stats weights ^^

you will be surprised ^^

[hollow river]

This hasn’t really been recommended either this expac

But idk

[odd hazel]

It’s fine just simming gear gets better results

[hollow river]

Yeah gear sim is usually recommended over stat weights

[terse stone]

Yo im switching to ass for raid but still need to craft a leggo at rank 4. I do outlaw in m+ so dont need a leggo specific for that. Which leggo should I go for and what slot is best for the raid as a whole?

[scenic root]

Stat weights is fine

[hollow river]

Cloak doomblade or obedience

[lean coral]

people are allergic to the pin button

[hollow river]

You ain’t lying

[terse stone]

I mean i check the pins thought people might have more insight rather than just pure ST sims if thinking about the whole raid

[thorny pond]

here we go again...

[terse stone]

its all good my g

[odd hazel]

traitor to the cause beach

[thorny pond]

I still play sin

[odd hazel]

All is forgiven

[thorny pond]

But I enjoy when sub becomes relevant. Have been sin since BC

[quaint carbon]

what first Dyz chard should I put into shoulder item ? (no dyz nuts plz )

[lean coral]

you have multiple?

[thorny pond]

if you have multiples then damage

[ornate dawn]

havent got any unholy shard yet sadge

[arctic hare]

Heh, dyz nuts, hadn't thought of that

[quaint carbon]

ohh nvm i thought i was colored group but its not

[lean coral]

theres also like only 1 dps one so i feel like its kind of obvious

[thorny pond]

You can unsocket them

[narrow ravine]

the rng of getting shards is terrible

[thorny pond]

and reuse

[lean coral]

yer

i got 3 shards

1 of each

[narrow ravine]

I have 1 total

[thorny pond]

settle down thanos

[narrow ravine]

and its a cor

[lean coral]

i did get the dps frost and blood one tho

[nocturne remnant]

Sorry for the bother, but what covenant/legendary should i use? and is assa the go to for m+ and raid?

[thorny pond]

Pins

[nocturne remnant]

I read the pins

and it says different stuff from infexious

[thorny pond]

lol

[ornate dawn]

Got a rank 3 Shard of Bek, and a rank 3 Shard of Cor, nice for burst and target swapping with a little execute thrown in for good measure

[plain thistle]

[thorny pond]

infexious is an asshat iidiot

don't listen to him

[odd hazel]

Why people do I don’t know

[dull cloak]

i only get my info from infexious

[scenic root]

Because he is a popular YouTuber and no one else puts out better video guides. He had good production quality

[thorny pond]

please no

[gusty mirage]

Because he’s wrong. So fucking wrong

[thorny pond]

Good quality =/= good content

and video guides get outdated quickly

[scenic root]

I didn't debate that

I agree he is wrong

[odd hazel]

This is a joke right

[gusty mirage]

Videos? His fucking spreadsheet said that subterfuge is the play for SoD

Garbage content

[thorny pond]

SUBTERFUGE

[ornate dawn]

lel what

[willow eagle]

I'm not familiar with infexious but you guys seem to treat him like he's some sort of big bad

[thorny pond]

SHOW ME THE SIMS!

[thorny pond]

He does more harm than good

[subtle tundra]

production quality means jack shit

[gusty mirage]

He wouldn’t be so bad if he didn’t talk out of his ass 90% of the time

[thorny pond]

No offense to the guy who asked but we spend more time fixing what he does wrong

than actually having meaningful discussions

[subtle tundra]

i can hire an editor and make good videos aswell but say only wrong shit

[willow eagle]

Maybe gotta watch a couple vids and see what's up

[scenic root]

When there is literally nothing else on YouTube... It means people watch it when they search for rogue guides

[gusty mirage]

He just comes here steals the sims that’s our TCs and CFs work hard to do. Then spreads misinformation

[willow eagle]

Iirc the red rogue is a solid source for all 3 specs

[thorny pond]

Again, searching for video guides on class play is highly skeptical

[gusty mirage]

Fuckin subterfuge guys.

Didn’t realize shrouded suffocation came back

[odd hazel]

I never watch video guides

[thorny pond]

Things change weekly and depending on gear and scenarios, a video format is the worst medium to present that info

• he's a moron

[gusty mirage]

His stat weights are my favorite part. We should all follow his stat weights

An absolute joke

[scenic root]

I am not debating that he is wrong in details and doesn't know what he is saying. I'm saying when there is nothing else and he puts out videos people who are visual learners and don't want to read a spreadsheet go to YouTube and search guides and his comes up and has good production. So people believe him

[gusty mirage]

I just can’t with him, and I’m not sorry

[thorny pond]

If your comeback to being called out on bad info is "duel me bro" or "1v1 me" you've lost

We agree with you Garn

but we just wish he wouldn't

[scenic root]

True

[quaint carbon]

Why is internal bleeding a top talent for Sylvanas ? (checking wcl)

[thorny pond]

It's an irrelevant row

can use it on adds

for some extra damdam I guess

[candid jewel]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[delicate bone]

he makes it easier to parse, im not too upset with what he does

i just dont listen to it lmao

[thorny pond]

Did we kill my ability to emote here

[maiden plaza]

So everything still pointing to ven obedience for sin?

[scenic root]

[subtle tundra]

no

[delicate bone]

yes

[thorny pond]

Close enough

[glass gate]

Obedience at 235 is siming as a 117dps loss for me over doomblades (light movement)...are you all still making obedience as your first lego? I do a lot of m+ and mythic raid

[drifting cloud]

dont sim light movement

ever

its not giving you useful information

[thorny pond]

It's a busted profile

[scenic root]

Then follow your sims instead of random people online.

[glass gate]

ahh okay this is my first xpac raiding, what profile should I sim? I'm using topgear on raidbots

[thorny pond]

Patchwerk

or DSlice for M+

there are some other scenarios where you do patchwerk 5 targets and play with fight length but that's a bit more indepth

[smoky merlin]

If you use dslice make sure you turn on certain buffs. Cause usually you don’t have some

[glass gate]

thank you!

[smoky merlin]

Off*

[maiden plaza]

Yeah I’m max necro with DB so the gain with ven obedience would need to be substantial to swap I feel like. Everyone’s saying go obedience I’m just not certain any further nerfs wont happen

[odd hazel]

I doubt it’ll get touched again

[thorny pond]

The nerf we had put it in line

Expect ones like Hysteria to get the bat

[nocturne remnant]

So my rogue just dinged 60, won't play much today cause it's my birthday

What lego should i go for? i'm necro atm but can swap

[thorny pond]

Necro is fine if you plan on staying sin/outlaw

[nocturne remnant]

Is obedience the go to for everything?

[thorny pond]

What content do you do?

[nocturne remnant]

M+ and plan on raiding too

[thorny pond]

Obedience is Venthyr only

Hopping in with a 190/210 Zolds then Doomblade next aren't bad options

[smoky merlin]

Obedience is bis for m+ and slightly lower on single target

[thorny pond]

Depends how much you want to farm torghast

[delicate bone]

why would they nerf it anymore? lol this justification is inaccurate

either you want to go whats strongest or you accept that you dont

[nocturne remnant]

@thorny pond why?

[maiden plaza]

Because they already nerfed it once? Who’s to say they won’t again. Wdym

[thorny pond]

Why what bud?

[nocturne remnant]

Should i play Venthyr Sin or Sub?

[thorny pond]

Play whichever spec you want

[nocturne remnant]

Why depends on how much i farm thorgast

[thorny pond]

Soul Ash

If you stay sin, then necro or venth are fine choices

if you wanna play sub, you can be necro it's not as optimal

and will be more leggo farming

[nocturne remnant]

Are specs so close in dps?

[thorny pond]

Close enough

[nocturne remnant]

I will keep necro assa atm then, if they change something i'll change

[thorny pond]

Sub is getting a "zenkai boost" this week with Obedience but both have strengths and weaknesses in popular content

[alpine garden]

Will they ever make night fae good again

[thorny pond]

no

no snek for you

[nocturne remnant]

zenkai boost?

[alpine garden]

Sadge

[thorny pond]

anime joke

[nocturne remnant]

yeah forgot which anime

I'm a weeb too

[thorny pond]

DBZ it where it originated at

[nocturne remnant]

I heard sub will get stronger tho

[sick aspen]

Q: How come Shadowgrasp Totem is ranked so highly for us on bloodmallet?

[thorny pond]

Yea I just said that lol

[cobalt pelican]

it do dam

[alpine garden]

Will sub sim over 9000 tho?

[thorny pond]

sub will sim over 900

[plain thistle]

it does good damage

[glass gate]

So are you all still making obedience to 249 as your first lego?

[plain thistle]

[arctic hare]

Nope

[thorny pond]

starting small but ye

[arctic hare]

I'm glad I already made doomblade

[nocturne remnant]

Idk about sims tbh, i'm kinda new

[alpine garden]

I'll probably make doomblade just for flex, because making a cov specific one is too much commitment for me

[odd hazel]

Tbh I’ll prob make it at 235 because I most likely won’t be making r5 or 6 for a little

[quaint carbon]

how do you use flag in m+ on packs?

[odd hazel]

I use it after I’ve spread dots and dump evenoms on that target

And keep crimson up

[plain thistle]

before a finisher, like normally

you dont need to dump envenons to the flag target, just use before a finisher and play a normal AoE rotation

maintain CT and spread rupture/garrotes

[odd hazel]

Yeah you don’t need to

[granite thistle]

Obedience gamers rise up

Lets get them sick parses bros

[quaint carbon]

aight thanks that what i was wondering

[nocturne remnant]

What spec are u gonna main guys?

[arctic hare]

Sin

[fallen arch]

Sin

But this is the sin chat so ..

[nocturne remnant]

There is no generic rogue one i think

[odd hazel]

Sin

[fallen arch]

You might get a lot of the same answer here

#wow-general

[woeful orbit]

whats the play for this week in raid? Sin or sub? Also, if venth, should i buy an obedience cloak now?

[raven vapor]

anyone know if on guardian feinting obliterate removes that damage or just splits it against every one else soaking?

[slow marsh]

Does good damage and it's hasted. So if you look at most classes/specs with any kind of haste ramp it will probs be near the top if not the best ST trink

[slow marsh]

Get obedience, try both and play whichever feels better to you

[woeful orbit]

ty!

[noble umbra]

is any one able to help me with some raid logs

cant figure out why me evenom does so much elses dmg than other peoples

[thorny pond]

link them

[noble umbra]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/4VJQfnj93zZWhyND#fight=16&type=damage-done&source=22

thats a exmaple of someone doing good

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/hgw976ZYMtP4m3TF#fight=last&type=damage-done&source=20

then there is me

but the average evenom dmg is what seems really low to me

[thorny pond]

Right off the bat I see the difference is talents

Deeper vs Vigor

[woeful orbit]

are you shivving, vanishing with full CPs (with MA talent) and then getting as many evis in during your shiv window?

[thorny pond]

Secondly they have WPS conduit, you don't

[raven vapor]

your log is 1min30 longer as well

[noble umbra]

does WPS make that much of a diff?

we were skipping half the add's by just healing thru them

also i got told to just use shiv on cd and not pool for max evenoms

[thorny pond]

If you aren't envenoming inside of shiv/EP windows that's a bit of damage right there

You should still make an effort to go into shiv windows with high CP and energy

[noble umbra]

so try pool before shiv is off cd?

[woeful orbit]

best practice is to try and sync flag/vendetta/vanish+MA with shiv, with as much energy as possible

if you need to wait on shiv and hold your other CDs for a few seconds, that is ok as well

[noble umbra]

kk

[odd hazel]

Never hold shiv

[peak badger]

is it possible to get more than 3 envenoms off during shiv?

[woeful orbit]

dude you have ForeverGuy in guild, just leech of his knowledge lol

[odd hazel]

Never hold shiv or any CD really

[thorny pond]

No he's comparing against Guy's guild

[woeful orbit]

ohhh

[noble umbra]

no im not the rogue in forever guy lol

im the second one

[woeful orbit]

word

[thorny pond]

Your opener looks fine

agi pot will also add a tiny bit to envenoms in that window

vs PF

[noble umbra]

kk

shud i be using CT for single target?

like i just hold it until adds

[thorny pond]

Yea outside of shiv windows keep it up

[noble umbra]

ok

[thorny pond]

But biggest thing you could minmax @nimble tartan is to get more envenoms in shiv windows

And pooling in general

you want to maintain high EP uptime

since you don't get the flat finisher % that DS does

[odd hazel]

That’s the one thing I feel like I could do better

Is pooling

[thorny pond]

Every sin rogue ever could do better

[odd hazel]

I feel as if I don’t give it enough attention

[thorny pond]

Maxing EP is like min minmax endgame for that talent setup but will creep up

[woeful orbit]

if you can get 3full CP envenoms (assuming Vigor) in the shiv window youre golden

[odd hazel]

You want to finish at max -1

[noble umbra]

is it ok to refresh bleeds early in prep for shiv window?

[odd hazel]

Never full CP if you can help it

[noble umbra]

like reapply bleeds early and pool to 70-80 for shiv?

[nimble tartan]

why me ping

[subtle tundra]

cause he gotta midmax

[noble umbra]

why not finish max cp?

[odd hazel]

Energy regeneration

[woeful orbit]

lol @odd hazel i dont think we are on the same page

[odd hazel]

I mean

You don’t ever want to finish at max

[woeful orbit]

i think full CP envenoms are huge

[noble umbra]

finishing at 4 is better than 5?

[odd hazel]

You do you

[nimble tartan]

i dont believe in pooling though…

[odd hazel]

Yes, you waste energy finishing at max

[nimble tartan]

i forge my own path through world of warcraft by spamming my buttons at my pleasure

[red atlas]

Should I craft obedience or not, Im assasi in raids and outlaw M+

[teal bloom]

You want to finish at max? Max is better than max-1 but you finish at max-1 still

[odd hazel]

^

[noble umbra]

hows it a waste of cp if u get the extra xp from a passive for free

energy regen*

cos u get the extra for passive crits right?

so a mutilate hitting for 3 instead of 2 wont cost u anything surely?

[odd hazel]

You don’t ever want to waste CP.

[fallow glacier]

Just finish at max if you get it, or finish at max-1 if you end up on it

[light mirage]

Obedience will be better in cleave fights for raid

[fallow glacier]

It’s not hard to understand really

[odd hazel]

^

^^^^

[red plaza]

The only time you would ever want to “waste” CP is using shiv at max CP to keep it on CD

[scenic root]

The whole point of max -1 is that you don't use mut to go from 4 to 5 CP. That's it.

[odd hazel]

It’s also a waste of energy

[ebon minnow]

tldr overcapping CP is bad

[woeful orbit]

no one ever said to overcap CP

[odd hazel]

Trying to always get max on shiv will lead to that

[woeful orbit]

i just said i try for max CP envenoms...

[odd hazel]

Trying will lead to over capping

[scenic root]

What do you even mean by this, that's just confusing.

[woeful orbit]

Through power, I gain victory. This is the sith way

[odd hazel]

It would be a waste of mut which will cost energy

[timid coral]

If I’m at max-1 and need to refresh garrote, is there a difference between garrote-envenom vs envenom-garrote and if so where is the wasted energy coming from that you mention?

[woeful orbit]

or Krey's way

[odd hazel]

I mean

It’s just the truth, you don’t want to openly try for max finishers

[harsh anchor]

Letting your bleeds drop means you failed as a sin rogue

[scenic root]

It's more a waste of CP which is also bad, so it's the same thing. You wouldn't mut to get max because its over capping, nothing to do with energy

[odd hazel]

Wasn’t trying to say you were wrong just adding to it

[scenic root]

Kinda moot, and makes it more confusing. That's all. If you don't overcap CP, you will save on energy and increase the deeps

[odd hazel]

^

[harsh anchor]

It’s the same concept. Don’t do it. It bad. More dip n dots

[noble umbra]

If I’m at max-1 and need to refresh garrote, is there a difference between garrote-envenom vs envenom-garrote and if so where is the wasted energy coming from that you mention

this was more the question i was getting at

[odd hazel]

Refresh garrote then dump

[noble umbra]

ye

so ideal wud be 5 points if ur not overcapping

[odd hazel]

Ye

[noble umbra]

lol

[odd hazel]

If your DS that is

It’s easy as garn is saying

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[rapid yew]

!guide

[odd hazel]

Obviously max finishers are good but don’t openly try for them, finish at max-1 and you’ll be golden. If you get a max with out over capping GG

[rapid yew]

Coming home to assassination today boys, only spec I've ever orange parsed with so here's hoping my elite "keep rupture and garrote up" gameplay technique will be sufficient

[loud hearth]

In this opener, if I get a Blindside proc off 1st or 2nd Mut do I just ignore it or where would I fit it in?

[narrow ravine]

are people crafting the tier 5 legendary or just waiting for tier 6?

[odd hazel]

Finish opener, dump evenom and then use proc

Don’t mut or you’ll waste a proc if you get another

[odd hazel]

I’ll just be waiting

[loud hearth]

So it's okay to let the Blindside proc expire?

[deft wagon]

Dont u use Vendetta before rupture

[scenic root]

You would hold till after shiv+ vanish - envenom

[odd hazel]

Yeah, you would vendetta - flag - rupture

[rustic whale]

i m gonna do it but still unstable if i either to do obedience or continue to doomblade

[scenic root]

If per say you get off of first mut, I would use instead of second mut.

So mut -Snd - ambush - garrote

[noble umbra]

wud u vandetta before garrote as well?

or just rupture

[loud hearth]

Won't you lose a CP then? (3 from Blinside crit vs 4 from Mut crit with MA talent)

[deft wagon]

Just rupture i think

[indigo mulch]

I do it before or after first garrote. Prob not optimal but i feel like i get energy starved if i dont.

[fleet anchor]

I'm waiting. If they don't increase the crafting drop rate it seems pretty nuts to burn twice as many crystals just for a one week minor ilevel bump

[visual prairie]

having more energy in the opener is prob worth more than that one cp and you don't risk munching it

[fleet anchor]

The increase in ilevel is super minimal, especially for a cloak slot

[narrow ravine]

I am thinking of just waiting too, I craft my own cloaks so might just sell all my cloaks this week for profit

[rustic whale]

@fleet anchor are you vent? if so are you gonna build obedience?

[fleet anchor]

I am not Venthyr yet, I'm not going to swap until next week

[visual prairie]

i am making r4 obedience

[fleet anchor]

Necro is actually really good this week because they get Carver's Eye 😛

[visual prairie]

and waiting

[fleet anchor]

Necro sims higher than Venthyr this week for me lol