assassination

[sand sigil]

the only reason why i was necro before is cuz necro sin was actually simming better ST than venth sin AND venth sub for early prog set up

but now ofc things have changed again

[civic trellis]

What did change?

[gusty mirage]

Obedience is too stonks to ignore

[civic trellis]

Because obedience stuff is not early progression

[sand sigil]

they implemented obedience properly

[hollow river]

we won't see 80 renown for a while

[cobalt pelican]

every human should just be necro with venthyr at 40 till mythic week

[hollow river]

[sand sigil]

obedience is early prog

u have it right when u go into mythic

[civic trellis]

Its in the third week isnt it

[gusty mirage]

fax

[slender berry]

you can get obedience on mythic release day

[civic trellis]

Oh really?

[gusty mirage]

yeah renown 48

you get 3 per week, 3 x 3 = 9

[civic trellis]

I thought it was at second week

[hollow river]

this, this is me

[oak sky]

So we have to save our soul cinders to make sure we dont fuck everything up then right

[limber lion]

No

[cobalt pelican]

unless you're literally raiding 18 hours a day and can't get 2 renown from non-guaranteed sources, there's no downside

[gusty mirage]

probably best yeah @oak sky

save em all

[limber lion]

Yoy can get rank 5 legendaries every single week

But if you want to have r6 the very first week it's available, then yeah

[oak sky]

I shouldnt care i dont even have a guild yet lol why did i even ask

[gusty mirage]

I still find it hard to believe Obedience will stay like this

idk

[civic trellis]

@sand sigil i think sub is the way to go in Dormazain, what do you think

[limber lion]

But all of this minmaxy shit doesn't really matter if you're 2 or 3 day raiding*

[cobalt pelican]

think it might stay tbh

[scarlet mist]

wich spec are going to be good for assa next patch?

[cobalt pelican]

it's not too outlandishly broken

[scarlet mist]

there are any guides in this disc? new here

[gusty mirage]

don't shit on my dreams

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[gusty mirage]

^

[scarlet mist]

thanks! 🙂

[civic trellis]

assa i think

lol

[scarlet mist]

sorry, not spec* meant convenant

[civic trellis]

😄

[gusty mirage]

venthyr looks strongest right now with early sims

[halcyon zealot]

and it changes by the minute so buckle in and stay tuned

[limber lion]

For st

[teal bloom]

Idk if I could get venthyr renown from 0 to 40 before patch 😦

[gusty mirage]

you can if you believe you can

[limber lion]

Yes you can

[civic trellis]

This is fun tbh

[oak sky]

Too much to pay attention to

[civic trellis]

Imagine: BREAKING NEWS, DREAMWEAVER WAS UNDERSIMMING

[viscid spear]

I always worry I'm making a mistake

[civic trellis]

would make my day

[oak sky]

Cant wait to go kleia for prog

[frosty cedar]

based

[sand sigil]

i'm not sure abt this take. depends on raid comp

[viscid spear]

Smurf angels, lol

[sand sigil]

u can't hit the boss w sub during the dance, whereas outlaw can + sin bleeds tick

however sub would be best prio for the cc immune add guy

if u have enuf prio elsewhere, then outlaw is probably best

[vestal wren]

btw. james its slightly offtopic

[sand sigil]

if u have enuf cleave, then sin or sub probably bis

[vestal wren]

but its no issue to drop rupture during the flag buff, however you shouldn't during the extended buff

[gusty mirage]

I was here

[sand sigil]

ahhh ok i remember asking about this ok sweet

[vale marten]

yeah im swapping

fuck the necro bois

[vestal wren]

#off-topic message

if you want to look at sims

[gusty mirage]

[sand sigil]

do u guys have any preliminary thoughts about holding the 2nd vendetta for the 3rd flag w obedience?

[vestal wren]

0.1% is error tolerance

[sand sigil]

cuz u won't get full 30s cdr like u would w sub

so every 2 flag going to put it 20s off vendetta

not accounting for holding for mechanics

[civic trellis]

whyspir was trying to optimize the apl afaik

[cobalt pelican]

you'll always sync the last where no lost casts

nothing really changes

[civic trellis]

like a few minutes ago

[vestal wren]

i think whispyr did some testing, not sure if he found some wins

[cobalt pelican]

whether it's flag for vend or vend for flag depends on kill time etc just use your noggin

you won't force sync early

unless it's very close

but you can basically do all of these things in your head better than a sim can

like a 2:30 vend in a fight is fine in most cases

even 2:40 can be fine if you know the fight and can preplan

[sand sigil]

yeah true, unless u could get 4 vendettas if u slammed on cd and u lose a usage by syncing it w flags

certain fights seem good for syncing tho

like fatescribe or painsmith

since boss immune during intermission phases w adds

would allow the flag to come back off cd

[balmy condor]

sheet is updated, can check the cast sequence on it

sin APL has a sync thing

[warm parcel]

Look at all these necros crawling back

[shy dust]

^

[warm parcel]

Now if only theyll start believing in MFD

[oak sky]

I mean shit i would be happy to go right back to venthyr

[civic trellis]

Eh i am still necro

[west cove]

kek never believed in necro myself

[keen mist]

😏

[vestal wren]

ye, up till obi gets nerfed

[west cove]

it wont

[civic trellis]

I'm going just for a walk to Revendreth

OO

[sand sigil]

necrolord bis mog anyways

[oak sky]

[sand sigil]

the godmog is avail for venth

[rocky ruin]

But necro is fun just saying

[warm parcel]

no reason to nerf the lege

maybe overall rogue

or daggers

[oak sky]

You know what

[warm parcel]

or something along the lines

[oak sky]

Bring back deathspike

[west cove]

best bet would be dagger nerf

[cobalt pelican]

is kinda funny all these numbers are

without the dagger functioning

[limber lion]

Yeh

Sub stonks will rise even more with the daggers

[ancient path]

is 10200 dps even that much compared to other classes? idk if it warrants a nerf

[west cove]

sp sims 11k

so dw

[ancient path]

exactly

[fallow glacier]

Anyone wanna queue some HC HoA

[limber lion]

Include the deathly cheese on top and it's getting there.

[shy dust]

Everytime shadow priest

Is brought up

The sim goes up

Was 10k before

[limber lion]

Last time I heard it was 10.3k

[shy dust]

Then 10.3

Now 11k

[limber lion]

Yeh

[gusty mirage]

did you guys hear?

[halcyon zealot]

sp simming 15k this just in

[gusty mirage]

sp is simming at 11.3k

[shy dust]

Spec gains strength everytime it’s mentioned

[oak sky]

Nah i heard sp got reworked into a melee for 9.2

Not worth anymore

C tier

[slender berry]

well our sims are going up every day too so

[west cove]

lets just cope for 2 weeks

[sturdy merlin]

@balmy condor Do you sim all talents and only put the ones who sim higher or do you just use one set of talents ? Especially for dungeon slice

[balmy condor]

I use the highest

[sturdy merlin]

👍

[gusty mirage]

@balmy condor

[sonic schooner]

Oxi 😒

[vestal wren]

do it

don't let your dreams be dreams

[gusty mirage]

here we go again

[shy dust]

[oak sky]

Haha

Im swapping back asap

It was a fun week of being necro

[limber swallow]

your s will be here when you get back.

[oak sky]

Yeah but in return i ge this wicked

[slender berry]

actually same symbol as wicked blast

[limber swallow]

meh.. I was venthyr for most of the expansion.. I still don't miss

[oak sky]

I like both really

[limber swallow]

I love the venthyr transmog... but bonespike feels more fun to me

[sonic schooner]

do u miss door of shadow tho ?

[faint harness]

How are we doing assa friends, enjoying life at 30 yards out are we?

[sonic schooner]

[limber lion]

[oak sky]

Im gonna miss gemstone more than anything else from necro i think

[faint harness]

Spike spike bang

Am i right

[hasty loom]

is necrolord viable in raids?

[oak sky]

Yeah

[sonic schooner]

necro is the love

[fallen arch]

Traitor

[hasty loom]

how much worse is it then venthyr?

[limber swallow]

not as a rogue.. it's fun for getting to areas that normally wouldn't be possible (w/o flying)

[oak sky]

@hasty loom theres sims in the pins but necro gets a lot of value when more than 1 target is brought into play

[hasty loom]

yeah i main outlaw but want to swap

hence why i cbf swapping from necro to venth

[west cove]

then gl

[hasty loom]

its still viable in raid? just not as good an venth ?

[oak sky]

Yeah

[echo geyser]

do u just complete the first quest and dont turn in to stay necro but able to switch insta?

[gusty mirage]

yeah I'm going to get the 2nd quest to 100% next week and just sit on it and wait

[oak sky]

In pure st you do like 450 less damage ish as necro according to those sims but you probably do more with adds or 2 bosses than venthyr

[echo geyser]

ah so complete first one and take 2nd too

[gusty mirage]

yeppers

[echo geyser]

nice ty

[coral imp]

!deathly

[prisma monolith]

Deathly Shadows Prepull macro: /use vanish /equipset SubUse case: Getting 5 cp and the deathly shadow buff (+20% damage for 15 secs) without using the Deathly Shadow legendary during the fight.
Requirements: Deathly Shadow equipped, a equipmentset with the same name you use in your macro that uses a diffrent legendary item.

[lean coral]

oh god is that a thing

[faint harness]

Surprise!

Its only a thing on sub tho

[true pelican]

is that actually a gain for sin?

[limber lion]

No it is not.

It's a gain on fights under 2 minutes and if you play Nightstalker

So

[shy dust]

Sin has a weaker DS with a shorter duration

[limber lion]

No

[oak sky]

Nightstonks

[plain spruce]

@balmy condor do you by chance do work for outlaw or only sin/sub?

[faint harness]

Seems weird that the command is active in the prog spec channel

[vestal wren]

yes

[royal lantern]

no sane human goes into outlaw channel

[vestal wren]

the command wotks in all channels iirc

[royal lantern]

thats guys turf

[bleak valve]

So is the smart money on just waiting til the end of Herioc week before swapping back to Venth?

[royal lantern]

you should always chill with stuff like that until mythic release week

[bleak valve]

Figured as much, thanks

[royal lantern]

simply because blizz loves to do adjustments with outliners during mythic release

thats also why overhyping stuff rn is stupid

[winged basin]

so my dreadfire is simming as my best trinket while also using my shadowgrasp totem

how do I go about using to on use?

sounds really not fun

[balmy condor]

you cast one, then the other

[winged basin]

[balmy condor]

neither one gives stats

so it really doesn't matter when you cast or in what order

[winged basin]

pain, wish phial would just drop so I can use dreadfire and phial

[placid adder]

a cov legoo being the best leggo gross

[solid venture]

Deathspike got nerfed into oblivion so dw, obedience will meet the same fate

[winged basin]

yeah thats absolutely insane

made me feel icky about going necro lol, that gap is wide as my ass

429 dps difference oof

[fleet anchor]

I think it's so much higher for Sub and in general that it's hard to keep it the same without basically just strong-arming everyone to Venthyr which is probably not what they want

[balmy condor]

9.1 Comparisons No Sylv dagger, everything else good.
Conduits:

• Single target: Lashing > Sudden >= WPS > Lethal >= Maim
• Dslice/5Tar: Lashing > Sudden >= Katar >= Lethal >= WPS
  Profiles are full mythic gear with 262 legendaries (256 ilvl overall). Trinket wise they are using Phial + Fusion Amp or Shadowgrasp.
  THESE DO NOT INCLUDE THE SOULBIND BUFFS YET (please check wowhead). PLEASE REMEMBER SIMS ARE SHAKY
  Change: Obedience vers persists now and it's huge stonks, and also pustules on emeni apparently
  Link to sims: https://tinyurl.com/2xav5yk8

[winged basin]

wow

[limber lion]

419 dps

[sweet zealot]

holy moly

[winged basin]

thats insane

[shy dust]

I wanna hear all those

Necro is worth it

It’s barely worse in st

[silent fossil]

https://i.imgur.com/B05nJgc.png

[drifting cloud]

hehexd

[limber lion]

well it used to be

but obviously not anymore

unlucky

[azure bronze]

5 hours ago it was like that

[shy dust]

Times changed old man

[limber lion]

that's true

it's over boys

pack your bags

#subtlety is calling us

[azure bronze]

time to be a vampire

[limber lion]

[azure bronze]

[oak sky]

Wait how much better is sub

[sweet zealot]

w8 im a bit confused

how does obedience work?

[azure bronze]

about 200 dps better

[sweet zealot]

does it give 1% vers or 1% vers per stack?

[azure bronze]

vers per stack

[limber lion]

1% per stack.

[sweet zealot]

oh shit

[limber lion]

The same amount that you get as haste

you now get as vers as well

[tardy compass]

Any chance venthyr could be top for alle 3 specs?

[icy ember]

[limber lion]

Looking like it now.

But

again

nothing is final

anything/everything can change

still missing a lot of things from the sims

[tardy compass]

Awh shite

[limber lion]

and not everything has been implemented

[tardy compass]

Here we go again

[tardy compass]

Sure, thanks!

[faint harness]

Its always hard to know whats good if ur just 1 man

[dry void]

point and laugh at people swapping kyrian yesterday

[distant cypress]

Holy shit, night fae are so low

[odd hazel]

Atleast it’s safe to stay sin until we know

[distant cypress]

I'm gonna cry

[faint harness]

Its always safe

[odd hazel]

Well yeah

But for peeps wanting sub

[oak sky]

Im actually happy all 3 might go venthyr for a while

Gives me some good chance to practice

[faint harness]

I mean unless you actually like sub there is no other reason to play it because it sims slightly higher

Most fights are not dummies

[odd hazel]

Yes

Of course

[cobalt pelican]

week 1 mythic st gap between necro and venthyr is kinda biglarge

[limber lion]

lol

What is your "serious"

[cobalt pelican]

it ends up being close to 400 which is.. a lot

[limber lion]

just out of curiosity

[vale marten]

i swear they are gonna make it that instead of 1% vers per stack you get 0.5%

[cobalt pelican]

world rank 2000+

50% chance ce

coinflip it

[limber lion]

As in like

What world rank?

[void pecan]

Well shit. We're back on the blood boy train?

Sheeiit

[solid venture]

Necro boi 4 lyfe

[true pelican]

in favor of which covenant?

[limber lion]

Okay well, not every guild works like that.

[versed mica]

Wait, why are people saying venthyr is the best now?

[limber lion]

A lot of us have 1 main character and 1 alt for splits

We don't exactly have the entire cast of classes/specs to choose from.

[vale marten]

which week will be able to get obidience?

[limber lion]

We usually bring the player, not the class

[limber lion]

Mythic

[faint harness]

My guild take pride in beating other guilds that run splits and have alts while we play meme specs

[azure bronze]

week 3 so 13/14th of july

[faint harness]

Serious is not fun

Playing what you enjoy is fun

[drifting cloud]

Do you need another sub rog for meme quota push?

[strange python]

!bis

[oak sky]

Some people get their enjoyment from being bis

[limber lion]

But didn't you just say that you'd rather just stack a "good class" instead of a worse one

[drifting cloud]

Lmao we broke dk

[limber lion]

Because that's what I understood from you earlier

Why play something that's 2nd best when you can stack the best class.

[oak sky]

If rogue is the best melee for st, hypotheticqlly, that could make it worth bringing

Even if sp is better you probably dont want to replace every unnecessary melee with sp right?

[faint harness]

Ofc it would be worth bringing

Why are you all talking like ur limit or echo

[silent fossil]

just bring fury warriors, similar dam, good execute, good mobility, raid CD

[oak sky]

Because that was the conversation right?

[cobalt pelican]

i am limit and echo

at the same time

[limber lion]

Too many people think in terms of wfr when they're nowhere close to that level. Usually playing a class that's comfortable for you will yield better results than trying to jump to a fotm class that does 200 dps more.

Like

chill

[oak sky]

Obviously i dont personally care if I'm 100% optimal, but they were talking about stacking classes and stuff

[dim temple]

I can't remember when going back to a covenant before a reset. u make one bar, and then turn in the quest and redo the bar again after reset. or wait to turn in the first one in after reset?

[limber lion]

Well, that really depends.

You also have to keep in mind what simulations are in nature.

They are patchwork fights

Nothing in this game (currently) is patchwork

[balmy condor]

One bar, turn in, second bar

[limber lion]

But it relays really important information and allows you to compare different setups and specs to each other.

Doesn't mean that you have to hit the number that the sim says, nor that a better simming setup would perform better for you because it sims higher.

[main rover]

hey

[thorny pond]

Hey cutie

[limber lion]

[main rover]

Im from spain, would like to ask a couple of questions abour rogue assa if possible

[thorny pond]

Go for it

[main rover]

sorry for my english first of all

😛

[faint harness]

Exactly

I dont try to meta it

[main rover]

im running vent btw, about talents, elaborate planning or blindside?

[faint harness]

This discord would have been empty for months if people tried to meta it

[limber lion]

A lot of people are fotm hoppers and like to stick to meta, that's true.

[thorny pond]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[faint harness]

The meta chasers are like top 5 raiders

[thorny pond]

The wowhead guide has all the useful info

If language barrier is an issue let us know

[limber lion]

Yeh or people who are very bad at the game and are chasing ways to get better by hopping specs

instead of actually getting better at the game

[faint harness]

And yea some just like to chase meta. But if you just want to game the game, plenty of guilds accept non meta specs as long as they are not full troll, like sub rogue

[limber lion]

I know of someone who plays a different class every patch because he just picks up one of the top 3 highest simming specs

And he's awful on everything else but a mage

And he often complains how boring a spec is

and he's barely a CE raider

Like, just stick to your favorite spec/class and you'll do fine

if you're not raiding in top 10, it doesn't honestly matter.

[austere orchid]

^^^^

Play what you're comfortable with

[thorny pond]

Even then those players a more skilled than the average player. Clumsily playing a fotm spec won’t make up for lack of raid awareness or poor play

[oak sky]

It feels better being off meta shitting on people too yeah?

Start of CN i was pugging as sin and topping meters all the time

[placid pagoda]

Right boys, so looking at the new sims, is venth the play for raid prog this season? Or is it still worth staying necro if we dabble in outlaw for keys

[oak sky]

I was playing dogshit old venthyr too

[gusty mirage]

well I did it, I hope you're happy @balmy condor

I'll be back in sinfall on tuesday

[azure bronze]

It might turn out that venthyr might be bis for OL too

[placid pagoda]

Just saw JPC is re rolling they’re pushing World 3

[placid pagoda]

Shutup

[gusty mirage]

if you're going to push keys as outlaw, I'd recommend sticking with necro

[civic trellis]

How hard would it be to catch up 48 renown from renown 40?

any idea?

[pale heart]

that's not entirely true, i played my rogue, as usual, in 9.0 and it felt horrible being bottom of the barrel dps on details having 90+ logs
it felt like my guild was carrying me a lot of times tbh

[main rover]

@thorny pond I do not like wowhead for rotation info for assa rogue, they say u gotta use Flag right before vendetta, that does not have sense for me, should be Vendetta right before flag

[civic trellis]

Which spec

[balmy condor]

Great name btw

[thorny pond]

The wowhead guide is the most up to date info. And that is the correct play to do it

[pale heart]

started with sub, then outlaw, then assa in 9.0.5

[gusty mirage]

@limber lion I'm abandoning you again I'm sorry forgive me

[main rover]

if vendetta applies 30% damage increased to the target, whats the point of using the first tick of Flag out of vendetta?

[civic trellis]

Where are you going

:/

[sturdy merlin]

The point is to apply rupture before pressing vendetta

[pale heart]

it's legion meme from here

[sturdy merlin]

And you rupture after flag

[limber lion]

I'm still not sure what I wanna do

Will have to simerino when patch drops and during heroic week

[sand sigil]

us 3

definitely not world 3

lmfao

[main rover]

but WHY do u press Flag before Vendetta? i do not understand

[thorny pond]

Strafe has it correct. Rupture is a low priority move to waste in vend window. You don’t wanna waste time

[thorny pond]

You press flag rupture vendetta

[sturdy merlin]

So you don’t waste a gcd on rupture during vendetta 😛

[placid pagoda]

What I meant

Holy fuck so it’s a re roll back to venth?

[oak sky]

Us 3 would be pog good luck jpc

[gusty mirage]

yeah I'm just going to get the 2nd quest to 100% and sit and wait

[balmy condor]

Gratz on pieces application

[drifting cloud]

Which guild was us 3rd in cn?

[sand sigil]

XD

[limber lion]

Damn a lot of giga gamers in the chat today

[sand sigil]

i interested to see how method does

[thorny pond]

Big boi chat

[silent fossil]

i peaked back in mop, 2 day guild scrub now :(

[gusty mirage]

could be worse

[balmy condor]

Guys obedience won’t be craftable till mythic anyway

[gusty mirage]

you could've peaked in ICC and never recovered

[balmy condor]

Just week 1-2 clear mythic

Blizzard won’t have enough data to nerf it

[gusty mirage]

[limber lion]

Yeh exactly

massive stonks

[sand sigil]

i was actually thinking abt this lmfao

[thorny pond]

That’s me

[gusty mirage]

what can I say, I'm a fan

[placid pagoda]

Is necro still looking like the best blend for assa : outlaw or is venth just pulling ahead with both? @balmy condor

[limber lion]

I might switch to Venthyr and have Necro ready for Sylvanas

[balmy condor]

https://tenor.com/view/how-do-they-know-bryan-cranston-big-think-how-would-they-know-as-you-already-know-gif-18118058

[sand sigil]

still no pi for us 😭

[oak sky]

I was wondering if blizz has insiders in class discords looking at sims and stuff

[ancient kraken]

how does the diff between vent and necro look now when 2/3 targets come in the fight?

[main rover]

maybe its because im from spain, but what I am asking. is why are u telling me to use 5 or 6 flag cp rupture vendetta, instead of 5 or 6 cp rupture, then build again 4 or 5 cp then shiv, Vendetta Flag vanish envenom with the mark of the assasin¿?

[thorny pond]

Reroll SV hunter with me

[gusty mirage]

say less, I have a level 56 hunter ready to go

[balmy condor]

Depends on focus tbh

Necro outlaw m+ is good

[limber lion]

You vendetta right after Rupture*

[thorny pond]

You get flag stacks from the rupture

[oak sky]

I have a hunter on alliance

[limber lion]

Flag - Rup - Vend

[sturdy merlin]

Because that is too much time loss

[placid pagoda]

Focus is raiding, with keys as a way to fill gear & vault

[balmy condor]

Then go venth given current tuning

[civic trellis]

I wonder if we'll get in 9.1

[hollow river]

O:

[placid pagoda]

Holy fuck hahahahah, is it gunna change much between now and release ??

[oak sky]

Maybe theyll do class utility tuning in 9.1.5

[balmy condor]

🔮

[placid pagoda]

Looooool

[thorny pond]

I understand why you think you would want every stack of flag to be vendetta buffed but missing a few from rupture isn’t a big deal since the rest of the stacks will be vendetta buffed

[hollow river]

you guys gonna make me get off my lazy bum and go back venthyr

[placid pagoda]

Honestly fuck blizz for throwing things around so late

[hollow river]

would be nice to mess with sub keys next week anyway

[gusty mirage]

I'm going to be an unethical BP spammer in m+

[civic trellis]

Any idea how hard is 48 renown catchup in 9.1?

[hollow river]

❤️

[civic trellis]

starting from 40

[oak sky]

Shuriken tornado go brrrrr

[gusty mirage]

nothing's been changed as per the "3 per week" that we've had the entire expac

[hollow river]

i don't even have any soulbinds unlocked for venthyr

and my lashing is low i think

[gusty mirage]

so you can assume 1 from campaign, 1 from anima quest, 1 from souls quest

[ornate lake]

Wow. These new vent Sims are looking significantly better than necro

[strange python]

is there any way to check what renown you are on other covenants? 😄

[civic trellis]

I mean, imagine if i switch cov in third week, to a cov with renown 40

[balmy condor]

People say “where sim why no info”
And then I sim
And then blizzard tunes
And then people go “okay but what about the tuning”

Never ending cycle

[civic trellis]

XDDD

[placid pagoda]

Holy shit man

[gusty mirage]

oh, idk. They never elaborated on how they're actually improving the renown catching up

[gloomy knoll]

wait wtf

[placid pagoda]

Kinda funny really

[gloomy knoll]

sin uses obedience

[gusty mirage]

yes

[gloomy knoll]

what the heck did i miss

[civic trellis]

haha

[placid pagoda]

Least swapping isn’t horrendous as just so it a day before reset

[civic trellis]

Obedience 📈 📈 📈 📈 📈

[faint harness]

Obey the fucking flag ok

[gloomy knoll]

pog

[balmy condor]

Watch I’ll wake up tomorrow and there’s gonna be a hotfix post like “fixed a bug that caused obedience to exist, we got rid of it”

[gloomy knoll]

now i can venthyr sin and venth sub

for prog and be bis at both

[gusty mirage]

that's fair, it does seem like a bug

[gloomy knoll]

this is literally the best possible scenario

[placid pagoda]

Honestly I wouldn’t even doubt this to happen

[gusty mirage]

sub simming well seems out of place

[sonic schooner]

fk obedience

the real homies stay necro

[gloomy knoll]

welcome to the bottom of the dps meters my friend would you like some tea

[balmy condor]

I mean at the end of the day

And I literally can’t stress this enough

[placid adder]

4 weeks for it to change

[balmy condor]

You’ll be fine as necro, as kyrian, as venthyr

And it won’t matter much

[faint harness]

You can play necrolord and it probably doesnt matter a single fucking bit

[oak sky]

Fae

[thorny pond]

Fae?

[balmy condor]

Fae sucks

Fuck fae

[drifting cloud]

What about dreamweaver waifu

[faint harness]

Only fuu plays fae

[sonic schooner]

ysera is hot

[gusty mirage]

I don't think covenant choice will affect how many times my guild wipes to stupid mechanics

[oak sky]

Fuck fae

[thorny pond]

Tag Fuu

[balmy condor]

Mystler swapped?

[civic trellis]

++

[faint harness]

Shit maybe

Idk

[placid pagoda]

True

[oak sky]

Too many other specs go fae

[odd hazel]

@gusty mirage I’ll still have to deal with my raid team so

[faint harness]

Otherwise they are 2

[oak sky]

Vampires rise up

[limber lion]

me not doing +269 damage with optimal spec and legendary means that we will not kill boss and i want kill bossman :(

[gusty mirage]

maybe your boomkin will step their game up for 9.1

have hope

[gloomy knoll]

if i do even 1 dps away from absolute bis we won't get CE and it will be all my fault

[placid pagoda]

I mean the ranged attack from SBS is so nice

[odd hazel]

:^) maybe

[gloomy knoll]

[sand sigil]

wait till u guys see the godmog

ez +5% dps

[limber lion]

[oak sky]

Cant wait

[gusty mirage]

but if I don't do the maximum amount of damage how will I make fire mages quit raiding?

[placid pagoda]

Ultimately, if I / we want to pump hard in a raid prog setting, the play is venth @balmy condor ?

[limber lion]

your maximum is still less than fire mages worst setup

unlucky

[sonic schooner]

just seen sims

wtf is obedience doing at the top

D:

[limber lion]

fire mage stays

[gusty mirage]

oh you said setup I was going to say

[sonic schooner]

that far

[placid pagoda]

It’s a frost takeover

[azure bronze]

Go night fae . It can only get buffs

[balmy condor]

The play is to press your buttons harder probably

but yeah venth good

[gusty mirage]

OVER MY DEAD BODY

[limber lion]

the higher apm you have during gcd's, the more damage you do

it's common knowledge

[oak sky]

True!

[sonic schooner]

yep

[limber lion]

even though sin is like 40 apm

you gotta smash that shit

[placid pagoda]

APM = big damage

[limber lion]

like its 200 apm

[sonic schooner]

spamming ADADADAD between GCDs

[limber lion]

What a monster

[oak sky]

Jumping kills bosses

[gusty mirage]

nah our mages just suck ass

[civic trellis]

hammering your keys gives like +100 dps

secret cpm technique

[placid pagoda]

God damn I’m swapping back

[hybrid cosmos]

what is "sudden" in the pins?

[limber lion]

Sudden Fractures

Necrolord conduit

[sand sigil]

i can't wait till the sims all updated on simc w sylvanas daggers. like the page w all specs and everyone sees the yellow bois chillin at the top like woah when did this happen

[hybrid cosmos]

ah kk

im an idiot

[vestal wren]

sylvanas dagger will make rogue seem like a bit to strong

[sand sigil]

well still below spriest but that class is broken tbh

[oak sky]

Yellow boys

[limber lion]

Yeah, fuck sp's

[gusty mirage]

yeah I heard SP is doing 18k dps now

[oak sky]

Even pirates with the fist are gonna pump right?

[gusty mirage]

[sand sigil]

my spriest in guild linked me a 254 ilv sim and they still beating ours lmfao. and we even have wft and mechagnome, whereas they have minimal loss playing goblin and no wft to worry about

[limber lion]

those boys got the highest execute, they're ranged, highest st

[gusty mirage]

yeah?

well we have something THEY don't

we have you @limber lion

[sonic schooner]

6 SP world first inc

[balmy condor]

No nerfs

[limber lion]

and you :3

[balmy condor]

[sand sigil]

don't forget about raid buffs in fort and ve lmao

[oak sky]

Spriest is pretty fun but nothint has my heart like rogue

[sand sigil]

honestly spriest is really similar to sub tbh

vf kinda same as dance

[strange python]

if you swap one day before reset, will you complete the covenant switch on the actual reset day or do you have to do another week?

[sand sigil]

aoe is 2 buttons

really similar

[faint harness]

Rerolling

[limber lion]

their aoe is so boring

[brazen rampart]

Can I make my colour red like the assa role but keep the sub role?

[limber lion]

it's the most boring thing in the world

i hate it

[brazen rampart]

[placid pagoda]

Reset day

[limber lion]

It's the reason why I couldn't alt an SP

It's so much fun in st honestly

but the aoe is so bad

[strange python]

ok then i'll wait until monday to see if any hotfixes happen 😄

[oak sky]

Yeah agree

[placid pagoda]

Is best

[sand sigil]

spriest gonna be pretty big for tyrannical io next season i have a feeling

[balmy condor]

No

[limber lion]

could be

[brazen rampart]

[gusty mirage]

technically yes

[indigo ginkgo]

the thing is that they got nerfed in single target and still out max us

[sand sigil]

play like vdh ele frost spriest or vboomy frost spriest

[fallow glacier]

Just do st in aoe

[sand sigil]

should be good

[gusty mirage]

Become a patreon, for $5 a month you get a cooler red name @brazen rampart

[brazen rampart]

[limber lion]

it's gonna be interesting to see how the m+ meta evolves as well

we're pretty raid-heavy in here

[gloomy knoll]

i beeen saying it

rogue is literally diet spriest

they just our upgrade

[faint harness]

Scaling

[sand sigil]

diet spriest lmfao

[civic trellis]

Is the red role a patreon role?

lol

[sand sigil]

look at this fking meme my guild made of me

[gusty mirage]

esra why didn't you send a pontoon to come save me from the flooding?

[gusty mirage]

yes

[civic trellis]

what is the patreon destined for?

[gloomy knoll]

i didn't know you had a flood lol

we have a sailboat

coulda broke it out of dry dock

[gusty mirage]

state of emergency declared for wayne county

[gloomy knoll]

hope no damage or nothin

happens to you

or yo stuff

[gusty mirage]

just to help support upkeep of the website

nah I was up simming crazy shit with the help of @balmy condor and I was awake for the actual flooding so I managed to save everything

[gloomy knoll]

naisu

[gusty mirage]

Simming saved my basement

[gloomy knoll]

LOL

[civic trellis]

I simmed the first 1-2 weeks with @balmy condor profiles aswell

so thankfully he shared his sims

[silent fossil]

the homie is on to me https://i.imgur.com/FZtbOcb.png

[grim jay]

He must be full of joy getting pinged all day

[balmy condor]

55-80 on any given day yeppers

[grim jay]

[limber lion]

That's what happens when you put your dick in every single hole that you can find

they call you back

[balmy condor]

It was like 1150 pings I think

[viscid spear]

Quick, pocket sand!

[dapper solar]

links not working on sim sheet?

[faint harness]

This is kinda fun, cus ”simma” is = to swim in swedish, so simming is kinda swimming

[grim jay]

@limber lion He had so many, he doesnt even remember us answering "when do we use tb" all day every day 4 years ago. Back when he was a regular.

[limber lion]

I'm kind of confused, who are you talking about again?

[faint harness]

Anotha one

[grim jay]

Whispyr😁

[placid pagoda]

Realistically are they going to change anything between now and reset on Wednesday? Yoh recon it’s worth waiting until Tuesday to swap back to venth ?

[grim jay]

Considering you gain nothing by swapping now, waiting is kinda safe

[placid adder]

leggo aint commin out for 3 weeks

[placid pagoda]

Agreed

[silent fossil]

no harm in doing the initial swap quest

[lone wren]

we should all just go play sub if you ask me

[drifting cloud]

thank god we didnt

[main rover]

@thorny pond I've been in the dumie (stick of sw) dont know how to write it, like 3 days 12 hours every day there, for my dps, i've been testing the way u open, with deeper stratagem, 6 combo point Flagellation 6cp Rupture Vendetta, then mutilate mutilate shiv envenom.. makes so much less damage than (with deeper stratagem too)6 combo point rupture then mutilate twice to 4 or 5 combo points, then shiv to 6 cp. Vendetta Flag Vanish Envenom(30%dmg V window. 20%nature Dmg Increased by Shiv, 50% crit from master of assasin if u talented) then skulkers, pff so much much more damage u can test it by urself.... give it a change. Doesn't mind that u gotta replace garrote or rupure inside of Vendetta window after the 9 shiv secs window.. U also gotta think that running nadjia the Euphoria buff from Thrill Seeker u got at 1.20 secs into combat, means that second Euphoria buff is 2.40 mins in, if u do the open the way i say, rupture 6 combo points, then rebuild 4 or 5 then shiv (maybe its seems like ur wastint time like u said) but ur second Vendetta Flag Vanish Full buffed envemon synchs with the euphoria so ur decimating the boss. i've been testint it for 3 days, much more dmg this way

[echo geyser]

[cobalt pelican]

um

the fuck

[main rover]

sorry for my english

[thorny pond]

Not to sound dismissive but target dummy damage is hardly a real test compared to sims with thousands of iterations

[balmy condor]

Happy for you, or sorry that happened

[limber lion]

I don't think your English was the problem, buddy

[thorny pond]

If you are running blindside/Deeper you still open the same right, Mut/SnD/Mut/Gar/Flag/Rupt/Vend etc

[echo geyser]

Big chungus wall of text

[viscid spear]

Finally home, access to my plethora of memes!

[vestal wren]

its better to keep your questions short

[fluid glade]

[limber lion]

I hate how good Obedience is on sin.

[thorny pond]

same but

[limber lion]

All the power to the sub boys, love to see it

[faint harness]

Do you raid target dummys, then yes play sub

[hollow river]

[limber lion]

but sin, eh

I couldn't care less for it

[thorny pond]

At least it gives us less to farm

Obi/Zolds

then easy swap to sub if we want

The flexibility sounds nice

[drifting cloud]

I saw you wave at me 2 days ago

[echo geyser]

[strange python]

so since obedience won't be available for the first few weeks, the play is crafting doomblade r4 on cloak and the crafting obedience?

[strange python]

getting nerfed anyway no worries my man

[grim jay]

The possibilities are endless

[thorny pond]

also never hold flag to sync with vend

[limber lion]

Oh ye big true

[placid pagoda]

If it got nerfed would that put necro back on top?

[thorny pond]

Hold resources for R6

[limber lion]

I mean still loses in single target

[drifting cloud]

have they nerfed any other legos than the boomy thing shortly after patch?

[viscid spear]

You are not my pogchamp yet, boy. Nor would I obey that command if you were!"

[drifting cloud]

just seems unlikely but hard to say with how broken it is

[limber lion]

I mean, if it survives into mythic

[placid pagoda]

But generally, as soon as it’s 2 target, necro overtakes?

[limber lion]

I think it's a pretty safe bet

[limber lion]

Ye

[sonic schooner]

i ll swap to venthyr when it will be a 1000 dps gain

[oak sky]

Not getting the full reduced cd on flag sounds really sad come to think of it

[grim jay]

They will hit obedience with a small nerf and nerf evis and shadowstrike damage by 20% prevent sub from being a competitive choice :pepeclown-1:

[sonic schooner]

whispr

told us to not freak out

😔

[echo geyser]

u need 30 stacks right? and thats hard to get outside of lust i guess?

[placid pagoda]

The fear of losing out on major dps an gimping urself is overwhelming can’t lie 😂

[unkempt zealot]

which is the best spec/covenant for the next raid? maybe venthir assa?

[placid pagoda]

Looking like it

[faint harness]

Implying its competitive outside of the order halls

[main rover]

at the start of the season being sub kyrian in raid, u pressed shadow blades symbols then echoind, now I dont undestand why they want to use Flag before the only Dmg increased window assa has, only bc a global condown?

[drifting cloud]

yes.

the opener is also such a small gain or loss if you swap 2 globals around it doesnt really matter

aslong as you dont botch it 100%

so maybe just work on fundamentals instead of worrying so much about that 1 global

[sturdy merlin]

It’s just « optimal » use

[strange python]

aside from the "panicking" on what covenant to pick for the coming patch, i'm really glad that we have so many covenants to chose from, seeing as other classes have 1 BiS cov and everything else is trash 😄

[balmy condor]

It does bring out the worst in spec channels tho

[main rover]

im not worried about a global, every spell u use inside of Vendetta window, deals 30% more damage, so ur telling me is "optimal" to use 5or6 cp Flag rupture then enter in the Vendetta window and start it with mutilates instead beneficing of 30% more dmg on flag and 5 or 6 combo points rupture inside the V window.. or just delaying a 2 gloobals for 2 mutis and 1 shiv and entering the V window withe 5 or 6 cp flag envenom wich is the way u get more dps

[viscid spear]

So what was this about not doing the weekly quests for Renown right away?

[balmy condor]

You can only farm renown up to the weekly cap

So this week is 38

Since 40 is the max

If you do the weeklies early, you won’t have them for 38-40

[strange python]

what do you mean with that? sorry i didn't understand that

[violet hemlock]

@main rover rupture is still doing 30% increased dmg cause its a dot

[balmy condor]

Having a lot of good options makes everyone go crazy because “WHATS BEST”

[violet hemlock]

and snapshotting hasnt beena thing for a while

[frosty bridge]

But what’s best

we need to know

[strange python]

oh yeah 100% i'm that guys aswell, just glad there are so many close options 😄

[azure bronze]

Shadow priest

[frosty bridge]

these damn theorycrafters slacking

[balmy condor]

Have you tried aloe

[frosty bridge]

Whispyr playing PoE instead of simming all day ruining our class

[viscid spear]

@balmy condorso just farm dungeons, do the world boss, and progress through thee campaign first?

[frosty bridge]

😡

[balmy condor]

Like aloe ver the fuck did anyone ask

[balmy condor]

Yeah

[frosty bridge]

[sonic schooner]

Whisp is cute

[viscid spear]

Welp omw to Sinfall to start my long and arduous journey

[faint harness]

Congrats on making a manly decision

[balmy condor]

No u

[sonic schooner]

if u really want to make me cute, go make necro sim ahead 😠

UwU

[dense narwhal]

Okay. Outlaw does in fact pump lol

[whole mason]

Now assa and sub look so great! It looks like 9.0PTR deja vu?

[dense narwhal]

I made 2 tweaks, and now I'm finally doing more dps in m+

I used to crush as sin, but outlawl...

[faint harness]

Gz man

[viscid spear]

I do like the overall feel of the Venthyr. Zones, characters, the entire flavor.
Wanted to start off as Venthyr but was convinced to go NF.

[placid pagoda]

Yeah bro outlaw is big Pepe when you get it right

[faint harness]

Any raider.io flex for us? To cap it off

[sonic schooner]

Does anyone have the famous SP sims that pumps btw? wanna see them 🙄

[dense narwhal]

best outlaw m+ advice I heard; keep blade flurry on CD. Don't try wait for it to fall off before re-applying.
also, don't waste CPs
Just cleans up the decision making a bit

[lost horizon]

As much as sin is fine too, there's a reason outlaw is the meta spec for jeys

[dense narwhal]

no point in min-maxing your blade flurry, when you're tracking so many other things

[grim jay]

The 13k dps ones?

[oak sky]

Dont worry spriest does 20k damage

[placid pagoda]

That’s a basic, you want BF rolling as much as you can

[sonic schooner]

i ve heard about 18k

[civic trellis]

the first is simply not true

[sonic schooner]

that s why i was wondering

[faint harness]

Its 14k now

[lost horizon]

There's definitely a point LOL cause overcasting blade flurry is wasting gcds

[placid pagoda]

My best advice with outlaw is using marked for death

[lost horizon]

And energy

[sonic schooner]

So i just got baited

i see

[dense narwhal]

I'm guilty of forgetting to re-apply blade flurry when i wait for it to get to 0 everytime

because i'm a sin rogue at my core. lol

[oak sky]

[fluid glade]

need to get yourself a weakaura my man

[lost horizon]

That's fair, but a bad habit to get into and suggest to people

[placid pagoda]

Depends, if your on ST or nearly about to kill a mob then it’s best tk hold it and either pop it and stealth - open or open & apply

[lost horizon]

Slamming it on cd may have been a dps increase compared to forgetting to press it, but it's def not optimal

[loud birch]

is multi-dot worth on mythic council?

[fluid glade]

yeah the energy and gcd time is crucial

especially when you get the triple buff or god roll

cheee

[placid pagoda]

MFD low HP targets for constant max CBP ambush is gr8888

[viscid spear]

I should still work on Replenish the Reservoir, just not turn it in yet

[civic trellis]

Well, but that's a missplay anyway

[fluid glade]

yeah MFD makes it feel so fluid

[civic trellis]

Doesnt make it better

[forest delta]

so now assa rogue on raid plays venthyr ha?

[placid pagoda]

Open, ambush, MFD ambush feels incredible

[placid pagoda]

Yes

[fluid glade]

sucks having to use it for SD sometimes tho

if i dont get sd rolls

[sonic schooner]

ambush mfd ambush

[fluid glade]

sadge

[sonic schooner]

🤔

[civic trellis]

at third week

[oak sky]

Mfd snd or mfd dispatch no?

[placid pagoda]

Yes but also nice as opening CBP go straight into ambush vs SND and that ambush directly reduces MFD CD

[sonic schooner]

most likely dispatch yea

i dont see the point of mfd ambush

[oak sky]

Wastes cp

[fluid glade]

i think he just misspoke

[placid pagoda]

MFD Snd mainly

Depends if it’s already rolling

[forest delta]

so now everyone needs to change to venthyr if wants to raid

[fluid glade]

snd is better most of the time unless things die super quick

[placid pagoda]

Yes

[forest delta]

I miss BFA...

[civic trellis]

no

[frosty bridge]

no

[oak sky]

Necro is still fine

[civic trellis]

Necro is still better the first weeks

[sonic schooner]

as outlaw you anyway have 4mn SND uptime why would u mfd snd

[civic trellis]

until you can get obedience

[forest delta]

I won't change anyways

[harsh anchor]

How 'bout you play what you want

[sonic schooner]

i wanna me fae mastery stacking 🙏

[forest delta]

I hate these new systems

[oak sky]

Mastery

[frosty bridge]

as people said, even if you are top 4 world you can probably run the ‘suboptimal’ covenant because let’s be honest, echo or limit will win it anyway

[sonic schooner]

and play exsanguinate

[placid pagoda]

I mean I’m still on the fence whether it’s worth swapping for extra couple hundo dps

[lost horizon]

Yeah that's my point

[fluid glade]

yeah ima stick necro for now

just the usual swap panic before a patch

[viscid spear]

VENTHYR

[placid pagoda]

As soon as 2target onwards necro pulls ahead

[sonic schooner]

when i started playing sin i was venthyr and i struggled getting 30 stacks

🤔

[oak sky]

Nvm im not swapping cov rerolling spriest they do 16k now

[fluid glade]

i love m+ and necro outlaw still looking good

have a geared priest too, aoe shadowflame build is very fun

[faint harness]

Shadowflame is a 20% dps increase

Wont get any nerf

Obedience says hello, gets nerfed

[civic trellis]

even in st

[frosty bridge]

Ion’s girlfriend plays SP

That’s why

[civic trellis]

until you get obedience

[faint harness]

His wife

I hope

[placid pagoda]

No, ST venth is leading

[frosty bridge]

One doesn’t exclude the other

[civic trellis]

is not without obedience

[faint harness]

[whole mason]

obedience is like 2 weeks or 3?

[inner temple]

3

[civic trellis]

3

[sonic schooner]

3

[faint harness]

3

[whole mason]

3 should be fine

[civic trellis]

i think its 3

[faint harness]

3 is mythic release week

[sonic schooner]

isnt it 2 ?

[faint harness]

Nej

[civic trellis]

yes

but 2+1

[hexed karma]

obedience is venthyr lego ?

[thorny pond]

When did push become a red guy?

[sonic schooner]

3

i c i c

[civic trellis]

yes

[thorny pond]

Yes

[faint harness]

43 46 49

Thats the 3 first weeks

[sonic schooner]

52

[faint harness]

48 is obedience

Do math

[sonic schooner]

52 weeks is a year

[civic trellis]

40+3n

[sonic schooner]

[thorny pond]

Censi has such a big brain he can run 10k sim iterations in his brain

[strange python]

3

[sonic schooner]

true true big true very true

[whole mason]

actually i dont think it really matters. limit and echo probably have no rogue for this tier. The world will be oblivious about this leggo.

[sonic schooner]

lemme tell you something

3

[thorny pond]

Not a single millimeter of smoothness in there

[sonic schooner]

gonna run 6 SP anyway

2 night of prog

[harsh anchor]

Perfecto will babyrage if he has to play anything but rogue this tier in prog again

[frosty bridge]

At least Lorgok is back from his forced vacation lel

[thorny pond]

Good rogue content inc?

[faint harness]

The best content

[thorny pond]

Thank god

If I have to watch more mm POV streams I’ll neck myself

[placid pagoda]

@sonic schooner what will be the talent setup for sin st now?

[sonic schooner]

3333333

[strange python]

the good one

[sonic schooner]

using obedience rank3 obviously

[thorny pond]

https://tenor.com/view/the-shell-has-spoken-magic-gif-19450862

[strange python]

thats getting nerfed

[faint harness]

All 3s is the chad build

[strange python]

so doomblade gang

[placid pagoda]

Really?????

[strange python]

exsanguinate doomblade synergy

[sonic schooner]

[strange python]

imba exodia build

[placid pagoda]

SPRIEST doing 18k ST if they nerf rogue then fuck blizz

[sonic schooner]

exsanguinate overcap mastery is the play

yepyep

[faint harness]

Only 18k? My latest fax print says 20k ez

[oak sky]

I just got a wire says 20.5

[placid stream]

Exsanguinate is the truth

[sonic schooner]

0% haste 10% crit 0% vers 70%mastery

🙏

[proper halo]

4raidbotrs

[balmy condor]

Stop trolling in my chat boys

Meme getting old

[sonic schooner]

ok

0%haste 10%crit 0%vers 0%mast 100%whispyr

[placid stream]

I really wish exsanguinate was good though. I like the idea behind it

[oak sky]

Ok the memes dead

[spice spire]

WHY THE FUCK IS DK PINK?

[hollow river]

i was wondering the same

[spice spire]

Oh he’s memeing excellent

[balmy condor]

Meme that sub is dead because downtime and sin has bleeds so you just play sin 24/7

[sonic schooner]

sub downtime

[spice spire]

Ahh I see

Dead memes

Or as it should have been called at the beginning of xpac, copium

[outer iris]

Hey guys, if i play Venth in the next patch, does it even worth to craft Zold? In the pins the sims says that Obedience pulls ahead not only in single target, but even in d.slice. What do you think ? Thanks for your help!! 🙂

[sonic schooner]

might be good, might be nerf, so who knows 🤷‍♂️

[thorny pond]

Zolds probably has uses still where execution range is high value

More feelycraft than numbers based take

[faint harness]

Nah thats true

If there is any sire like fight

Zold is prob very good for prog

[limber lion]

Sylvanas might be a contender for Zoldyck

But we're not exactly sure yet.

[void pecan]

IMO i'd stay whatever you are until further tests/runs happen

Is what I'm gonna do for a week or two

[faint harness]

Yea just complete any potential going back quests and dont turn them in

And then you hold like a good soldier

[west geode]

I’ll be waiting until at least the first week after raid comes out. Something changes every day

[faint harness]

Its very unlikely there will be big changes to rogues during heroic week

Obedience is the top contender and its not even playable, and they usually dont nerf things mid tier

[dapper solar]

thats pretty bold they will for sure adjust the cov leggos mid tier if need be

[faint harness]

I mean boat went months

[dapper solar]

or rather before it even comes out

[faint harness]

Without a nerf

So you’re saying blizz would take easy on nerfing the covenant legendary which is part of a meaningful choice

They might do it before the raid is out, but if they dont i think its in the clear

[dapper solar]

im saying they could nerf/buff them before they are craftable

[faint harness]

Also its not incredibly op or anything

[limber lion]

I highly highly doubt they will touch any legendaries/covenants during the first month.

They'll do some tuning during heroic week and that's it

Of course if something is broken, busted or bugged, then those might see changes

But something like Obedience, I don't think so

[short chasm]

Damn Obedience is pretty good, kinda regret going from Venthyr>Necrolord because apparently thats better if you both play Sin/Outlaw?

[faint harness]

Its not like obedience is a 20% legendary, its slightly better than the average.

[pale fossil]

It is, but Necro is still better in non-ST situations as I understand it. Necro is more than viable.

[faint harness]

Its not a candidate for a kneejerk nerf imo, but its Blizzard so who knows

[short chasm]

I can always switch back ofcourse

I always played Sin for ST and Outlaw for AoE, didn't mind gearing both of them either.

[pale fossil]

Sin for 1-2 and >5 targets and Outlaw for 3-5 targets is ideal, and Necro is great for anything above one target. So you’re in a solid spot.

I’m doing the same thing but haven’t decided if I want to play Outlaw in addition to Sin or just stick to Sin.

[short chasm]

oncoming raid looks pretty ST heavy so I'll see to it if I need to make a switch.

[placid pagoda]

You can play outlaw with venth, flag is nice burst for outlaw

[faint harness]

Playing outlaw in raid is inting like 9/10 times

[placid pagoda]

Also venth then@plays into SUB well

[short chasm]

Outlaw feels like int in raid

[pale fossil]

Totally! It’s not bad for Outlaw, but it’s a good bit below Necro.

[frail fossil]

so true

[steep obsidian]

infinity flag stacks with shadowblades

[frail fossil]

Would never do it

[faint harness]

Never

Luckily, we celebrate bad choices. So yay for outlaw adventures

[short chasm]

Might as well level necrolord to 40 and then switch back to Venthyr during raid release :P

[pale fossil]

I’m also staying Necro because SBS is too fun a button. And I don’t have any interest in playing Sub really.

[short chasm]

Sub

[placid pagoda]

holy@shut boys made the swap back to venth

[cobalt pelican]

unlucky necro is best now

[soft shale]

shhh we dont talk about the red thing

[stray ivy]

But would you say Sin in M+ is inting as euqally?

[faint harness]

Well

[fleet anchor]

Also something to keep in mind here

[faint harness]

Probably

[fleet anchor]

Performance for next tier BiS sims is not always gonna match your personal gear situation

[balmy condor]

Nor does it reflect actual fights

[whole mason]

It gives you an educated evaluation.

[soft shale]

yea we area always better lets goo

skilllords

[placid pagoda]

Can you do dungeons for complete your tasks quests?

[balmy condor]

Boomy on council

[balmy condor]

You should

[soft shale]

more like sub on council

[strange python]

[balmy condor]

1 world quest 2 dungeons

[pale fossil]

Two dungeons and a WQ and you’re chillin