assassination

[sand sigil]

isn't it better than 226 necks whispyr?

[gusty mirage]

The real hard mode of m+ is the potatoes you meet along the way while pugging

[sand sigil]

i thought the proc carried

[winged basin]

Really? Even with on use primary stat?

[sand sigil]

tru

[gusty mirage]

They nerfed the proc I’m pretty sure

[sand sigil]

neck isn't on use

it's just proc

[balmy condor]

yeah, but the neck is a quest reward at 226, and a heroic sanctum neck is about the same last I checked

[winged basin]

Okay still, and yeah I know they fun detected it ecks dee

[sand sigil]

hm i was on ptr today and it was pretty big proc

[fathom swift]

the proc isnt in simc yet btw

[balmy condor]

is it not

I thought i saw it

[fathom swift]

not last i checked

[balmy condor]

hm

aight maybe there's hope

[fathom swift]

maybe it just got added and i missed it

[gusty mirage]

[winged basin]

It seems solid, 100 haste 100 mastery proc primary

how bad did it get nerfed?

It gave you like 50% uptime primary lmao

[inland jacinth]

does this mean, i have to craft it on 9.1

[fathom swift]

9.1 simc sheet still says nyi

[inland jacinth]

• Doomblade is looking to be the best legendary for raiding in 9.1. Craft it on a cloak. (LEGENDARIES ARE GETTING EXTRA SLOTS TO CRAFT ON IN 9.1 THIS IS ONE OF THEM) Dashing might also be good, will have to wait on sims.

for this?

[gusty mirage]

I think they nerfed the uptime on it. But I haven’t seen anything concrete yet

[gusty mirage]

Yeah you can’t craft it on cloak until 9.1 drops

[inland jacinth]

ah gotcha

thank u

[winged basin]

That would make sense it was 50% uptime lmfao

Busted

[gusty mirage]

I just want one tier where we get a busted weapon

Just one. Why must we pay for the sins of TBC

[inland jacinth]

is doom blade not 100% drop? i just did mortregar and it didn't drop

[balmy condor]

did you run it on a 3

it's close to 100

[gusty mirage]

^

[balmy condor]

it's not quite there though

you can run it again

[winged basin]

I wondered that but with deathspike

[gusty mirage]

Just rerun it worst case

[echo cargo]

Is it worth crafting Doomblade on cloak + something else, just until you get gear in multiple slots?

[inland jacinth]

i ran an 8

guess got unlucky

thanks guys

is any of these worth to make / up first?

[gusty mirage]

If you’d like, it’s about to rain soul ash. If you have the gold for the base item you can go nuts if you want. But with valor upgrades being a thing ASAP this season it’s probably not worth imo

[gusty mirage]

Unless you have a bunch of people to make the items for it’s not really worth the investment to rank any of them up tbh

[gloomy knoll]

^

just buy them

[gusty mirage]

The vendor shards alone cost like a ton of gold to get one of them to rank 4

[inland jacinth]

gotcha

[teal bluff]

I have two questions. Is it worth pooling energy before entering shiv burst windows? Also can I use shiv at max combo points, all the guides I read don't say I can't but idk if that's a dps loss or not

[balmy condor]

there's pooling rules in the pins, and yes

[teal bluff]

Ty @balmy condor

[worthy moth]

i just rerolled to necro assassination

saw some guides and idk what soulbind to choose

[scarlet spade]

heimir

[worthy moth]

why

[scarlet spade]

gem

[wanton terrace]

its the best one

[worthy moth]

uh, alright, but why he is the best

[wanton terrace]

check pin at the top of this page for the sims its best

[scarlet spade]

The first row you get flat agility for each piece of armor you have enchanted...and the last you get a bunch of crit

[worthy moth]

ohhhh...

[mental trout]

tazavesh doesnt cmoe out until week 2, same with the raid =/

[scarlet spade]

I started off NF for most of the xpac then swapped to necro for running m+ as sin and noticed quite a bit of a difference.

[wanton terrace]

did u swap before or after necro buff?

[rapid vigil]

what lego should i get for pvp

[wanton terrace]

master assassin i think

[mental trout]

i did doomblade

[scarlet spade]

@wanton terrace It was after..I played the first few weeks of the xpac and then had RL stuff to take care of and didnt come back till a couple of months ago

[worthy moth]

alright, done it

[rapid vigil]

doomblade looks sick

[worthy moth]

should i focus haste or crit

for overall m+/raid

[rapid vigil]

u tihnk doomblade will be good in 9.1

[wanton terrace]

crit over haste?

[worthy moth]

crit always over haste?

[scarlet spade]

So as I understand it...and im no expert by any means but crit/mastery for m+ and haste for raiding but there is people here who could better guide you.

[balmy condor]

crit/mast haste for m+
haste/crit vers for raid

[worthy moth]

my life is a lie

ppl told me that mast is shit for m+

[scarlet spade]

I have 2 gears set ups personally..one for m+ and one for raiding...my raid set up I have around 19% haste..m+ its like 10

[balmy condor]

mastery mostly is big in aoe

more aoe you got, more mastery is good

[worthy moth]

fuck.

[scarlet spade]

I wouldnt sweat it so much right now..I started off with higher haste and then slowly pieced together some higher crit/mastery gear

[balmy condor]

secondaries in general are really really overstated

we want agility over basically everything and that causes ilvl to be the main deciding factor in 95% of decisions

pretty safe to just equip highest ilvl and go

[teal bluff]

do i ever envenom in aoe?

[balmy condor]

you envenom to maintain slice and dice

[teal bluff]

ah ok i never refresh snd manually

envenom does it

[balmy condor]

yeah

[scarlet spade]

Yeah I have seen VODs where dudes only apply snd once at the start of the dungeon

[balmy condor]

that's how it's supposed to be

[scarlet spade]

and just keep it running the whole time

[cunning granite]

I've lost the fun on mplus pretty quick I managed to get ksm to upgrade but that was it. Maybe on 9.1 it's better

[worthy moth]

at least ill have a better idea

crit mast m+

9.1 has good things

[scarlet spade]

Yeah I am pretty excited for 9.1 myself

[balmy condor]

dont hard stack mastery tho

you can always and should always sim yourself

[worthy moth]

whats the limit

[balmy condor]

there are no limits or breakpoints or anything

[worthy moth]

lol

stats are so confusing

[timber abyss]

@balmy condor am i wrong or 5 target 2 mins sim fight on assasination and outlaw are really close? I mean is it possible, assination to be the new meta for mythic+ aswell?

[balmy condor]

it's confusing because you're overthinking it

[balmy condor]

no

we use dungeonslice to determine m+ stuff

but even then, sustained 5 target on 2 min

is a little bit weird

I don't think it really reflects anything, it's just a nice way to see aoe damage

[honest rain]

Single target: Lashing > Sudden >= WPS > Lethal >= Maim

what is lashing, the venthyr one?

[timber abyss]

yes

[cedar crater]

So should i switch back to Venth? Im currently necro, i plan on mostly raiding and doing M+ for weekly

[balmy condor]

are you planning on playing another spec?

[oak sky]

im at 32 renown and im gonna be on a trip for a week and a half

[hoary isle]

perfect plan bro

[hearty trench]

whats the play for 9.1 assassination

is it still venthyr for raids

[hoary isle]

necro for logs apparently

[hearty trench]

and necro for outlaw / keys

i've already done the questt to swap my cov , i havent handed it in yet

[hoary isle]

necro is bis for raids , atleast thats what everyone is saying

[balmy condor]

if you play outlaw, stay necro

[hearty trench]

atm my intentions are raiding as sin rogue for next tier

lol the meta is always changing

[whole mason]

Since @balmy condor you are here, many thanks for your efforts on the sims.

[balmy condor]

I'm always here

[whole mason]

BTW, since the outlaw sims have been removed from pin as out dated, sims for other specs should be considered as a progressing procedure as well?

[balmy condor]

all sims are shaky

there's a pin in #wow-general about implementation

but like blizzard had a blue post with buffs to soulbinds

and that's not even on ptr

so if it's not even on ptr, it's hard to sim it

[whole mason]

I see. Thanks for the clarification.

[balmy condor]

basically all sims are early, until blizzard decides they've tuned enough

a lot of stuff isn't implemented simply because we don't think it'll stay that way, or it's very untested and buggy

like the sylvanas daggers

[teal bluff]

Ok I think I finally got the sin rogue rotation down for ST and AoE. There's just one thing that's confusing and that's where does bone spike fall in the priority?

[balmy condor]

bugged to hell

[spare viper]

@balmy condor Do you think we'll know enough to be able to decide a Covenant for Heroic week? So that we can swap Cov for Mythic in any cases

[balmy condor]

no point implementing a sim for something that's giga bugged

[balmy condor]

I personally think the sims in the pins are accurate enough to make a fairly educated guess

some others might disagree with me (like guy for example, taking the pins down in outlaw)

and that's just a difference of opinion

it's all a bit of a mess atm regardless

but I'm of the opinion of getting out at least something that's close enough

and having that info

versus waiting for everything to be super super solid

[balmy condor]

bone spike is a priority generator after subterfuge garrotes

[spare viper]

Sure. I'm already Necro for Asn Raid + Outlaw M+ and I don't think Sub will see more play in practice

[civic trellis]

Also keep in mind the first weeks we are renown capped

[balmy condor]

then you should stay necro

[spare viper]

Yep, that's my intention for now. I'll prepare the swap quest the Heroic week just in case. Otherwise, it should be ok for early bosses anyway 🙂 ty!

[proven moth]

Yeah take in mind that nerfs and fixes comes pretty soon in first week of mythic, with luck in heroic week so Sims are pretty close so wait it's a wise choise imo :0

[spare viper]

I hope they fix Sylvanas's Dagger, the fact that only one rogue benefits them makes me think of Highmaul when only one rogue could benefit full dmg on Rupture

[civic trellis]

They will obviously

[spare viper]

They will most likely yes, the better question would be "when" 😄

[proven moth]

I mean... People take more than one rogue?

[obsidian socket]

In 9.2 🙂

You gotta be the best rogue and best the others out of raid teams lmao

[civic trellis]

I've never been kyrian, only nf and necro

I guess i will be able to catch up really fast in 9.1

The swap is instant iirc right?

[spare viper]

If you've never been there, yes

[misty holly]

Raids bring more than 1 rogue?

[sand sigil]

1 dagger rogue 1 sword rogue problem solved

[oak sky]

hmmmmm

wait

the man

[gloomy knoll]

i hate

the fact

that you can't mog double sword

i wanna use rapiers so bad

hate daggers low key xD

[drowsy coral]

https://www.wowhead.com/item=69620/twinblade-of-the-hakkari?bonus=0

Just use this

It's not a rapier but at least it's not a dagger or the overrated artifacts

[balmy condor]

Sounds like something an outlaw OTP would say

[oak sky]

does renown not let me go past 38?

im at 35 rn but i want to know when i should stop

[balmy condor]

You can’t get past 38 I believe that’s weekly territory

[oak sky]

kk

[balmy condor]

Either cant or very difficult

[oak sky]

i shouldve saved my weekly ones

[balmy condor]

I was hard stuck 39 until I decided to get off my lazy ass and do a weekly

[oak sky]

haha

i did the anima one every week passively

but the souls one only got done if i had a reason to be in the maw

at least when i was venthyr

[deft obsidian]

Yeh my alt was hard stuck at 36 until I decided to finish the campaign 😂

[oak sky]

i gotta say gemstone with necro feels really good, though i kinda miss venthyr anyway

[deft obsidian]

Was like any free renown to be had? Nope 😭

[oak sky]

ill just have to get from 38 to 40 around the 2nd week of the patch should be pretty easy doing M+ and everything

[deft obsidian]

Such a trip right, legit I love necro but i enjoy the vent play style too. Forever conflicted

[oak sky]

wish we could have 2

if we could have 2 and even be limited to 1 in combat almost every class would be able to multispec easy

[deft obsidian]

I get the whole meaningful choice from blizzard but it just feels pigeon holed and not even that badly on rogue as you can still multi spec somewhat efficiently but other classes suffer a good bit

[oak sky]

talk about venthyr/necro shaman

and fae really too

venthyr and necro dk

[deft obsidian]

I do miss necrobro shield as vent though, I’m pretty good on using cov abilities on cd but door of shadows I legit never remember to use 😂

Other than porting to the mailbox

[oak sky]

haha

door isnt really that bad

especially since sin both doesnt have 2 steps and doesnt have an untargeted movement like outlaw

[sand sigil]

@balmy condor if ur in 5t, but there's only1 target that needs any damage whatsoever (rest are literally irrelevant), u have ur 5 bleeds up, i would assume it's better to spam fok env than mut env right? also, is it more prio to sbs 3 of the other irrelevant targets for cp gen?

i'm thinking painsmith and the balls that roll across in this specific situation

[drifting imp]

I'm currently at 37 renown with necrolords right now, will I be able to get to 40 till the end of this id? Unfortunately I already did all the weekly stuff

[balmy condor]

Prio damage would be bleed till saturated, then mut env. Sbs is prio yes

[sand sigil]

ok so no fok. is there a certain # of targets where fok env is better prio than mut env?

[balmy condor]

I’m sure there’s a crit thing where it could happen

But the extra cp has to reconcile the loss of damage

Cause fok hits like a fucking noodle

So honestly, don’t know if it ever catches up

[sand sigil]

ok ok ok makes sense

[oak sky]

oh my god im getting so lucky with renown

4 dungeons in a row

[balmy condor]

[foggy flint]

the only time i'm getting a proper use out of door of shadows is when I'm chasing runaways in random bgs. double door + blind never fails to catch them

[nimble tartan]

tfw first and last time 2-2 today and i fucked up my cds in p3

[digital zodiac]

Yoo looking at the top logs, no one seems to cast ambush - am i being pepega by doing so?

[sinful cradle]

If they are playing ep vigor you do not press ambush ever

[limber lion]

!mut

[prisma monolith]

Ambush is currently only used from blindside/sepsis proc, not from stealth.
The reasoning is a little complicated, but the most important of them is the difference in combo points on crit (up to 4 vs 3).
Some other factors to consider are increased poison applications, blindside, and doomblade. This is true for all talent combinations and legendaries.

[digital zodiac]

AH yeah i guess it depends on if you run EP v blindside then

looks like i missed them memo that EP is highly used now 😄

[strange python]

On some fights

Also did those last minute soulbind changes push venthyr back over necro? But I just changed :(

[digital zodiac]

how do you guys set up your shiv windows?
do you hold off until you refresh your bleeds, then shiv and env spam?

or just use it on CD

[gusty mirage]

It’s not just you. EP/Vigor sims really close to BS/DS for necro profiles so a lot of people just go ep/vigor

[dusty sage]

Hello
I'm new to rogue (assass, ventyr, because I want to). I have a few questions and I am looking for a nice assassin to help me.
I could not find a clear state of the legendaries:

• I read in some places that doomblade is BIS on ST, but Ravenholt seems to say it's Dashing Scoundrel. What says internet wisdom ?
• Is there an all-rounder legendary for ST/AOE ?
• Do we have any data regarding the power of the new ventyr leg ? Is it going to be the new BIS, thanks to the perfect alignment with vendetta/vanish ?

[fading eagle]

@sand sigil for fok vs mut at 5 targets, the cp generation breaks even at 33.33% crit, below which mut is actually better for generation, and you would need 66.66% crit for fok to average just 1 higher cp gen. Interestingly, the difference in damage between fok and mut (not counting doomblade) is pretty much the same as a 1 cp higher envenom. At 8 targets, fok cp generation beats mut at only 16.66% crit, and at 40% crit you are getting 4.2cp vs 2.8cp, so maybe worth considering there. Either way, you will want to fok a bit to keep up poisons on bleed targets.

[gusty mirage]

Dashing is super close to doomblade right now damagewise. Sims are a little shaky but doom looks like the right move so far. Best “overall” legendary for assassination is zoldyk, but it’s quite a bit behind doomblade and dashing in ST. New venthyr lego isn’t the greatest for assassination.

[strange python]

So venthyr sin or kyrian sub. I hate being stuck with decisions

[gusty mirage]

Just go venthyr so you can play both sin and sub 🙂

[strange python]

Unless mikanikos gets nerfed it's gonna be a good bit behind as sub

[teal bloom]

@digital zodiac always use shiv on cd and refresh bleeds during the window if they are going to fall off. You'd prefer not to have to refresh bleeds during shiv window but there's sometimes nothing you can do about it.

[digital zodiac]

sweet thanks man

[gusty mirage]

Do you do m+ at all? If so what spec do you want to play in m+? If there’s any chance of you playing outlaw in m+ then you can go kyrian and play both sub and outlaw

[strange python]

I do m+ exclusively to make myself better for raid.

Only care about getting vault options and the seasonal mount

I'm basically fully raid focused

[gusty mirage]

You can also refresh your bleeds a bit earlier than pandemic too to cut down on that possibility @digital zodiac

[fading eagle]

imo, try out venthyr and kyrian sin and sub on ptr, see which you enjoy playing more

[strange python]

I enjoy doing the biggest numbers and killing the bosses /shrug.

I enjoy both but I don't like being suboptimal in raid

[gusty mirage]

If you want the flexibility of being able to switch between sub and sin depending on the boss just go venthyr then

Perks include sub being good in m+ next tier so you can still pump a ton of damage. If there’s any chance you play outlaw for keys, just go kyrian

[balmy condor]

Just wanna add you can also go to sleep a bit earlier

[gusty mirage]

I just woke up wide awake at 5am

[strange python]

Sub might be the play...

[gusty mirage]

Sub will be a very good pick for 9.1. I know our benevolent leader will be playing sub in m+

[south belfry]

Who is benevolent leader? :D

[gusty mirage]

Whispyr

[south belfry]

Sin raid + sub m+ sounds like its gonna be blasting

[strange python]

Sub might even be better raid if this mikanikos shit goes through.

And double shadowstep is always huge

[gusty mirage]

Yeppers. Looks like it’s the play, which is why a buncha rogues are going venthyr so they can play sin and sub

[south belfry]

I really wouldnt want to play Kyrian tho

I'm currently necrolord but i'd really like to go Venthyr

[balmy condor]

Me I guess

I don’t remember a vote or something

So I guess I’m a dictator in this bitch

But ya know

[gusty mirage]

You were appointed by the RH gods

[balmy condor]

Se la vide

[thorny lion]

necro is bae.Im just staying necro for sin raid and outlaw m+ 🙂

[vital haven]

[balmy condor]

A wise decision, traveler

[gusty mirage]

Yeah that’s why I ask peeps what other rogue spec they plan on playing. If there’s any chance you offspec outlaw. Necro’s the move

[pastel roost]

Is sub in M+ a real thing or is it whishful thinking

[gusty mirage]

Sub in m+ will be very real

[low phoenix]

What place are u gonna craft Doomblade on ? im a bit confused cuz atm, u can only craft it on Legs and feet, but i need the Donmination socket there ?

[gusty mirage]

Cloak

[thorny lion]

Bonespike ist just way to funny.Better then 1button cov

like venthyr

[balmy condor]

Pretty real if we are to trust people who tested and the sims and the buffs and the aoe potential

[strange python]

Mikanikos nerfs coming or nah

[low phoenix]

How can i craft it on cloak, when it says Shoulder, Hands only monkaHmm

[balmy condor]

Pins explains

Basically 9.1 new crafting slots

Doomblade new slot back

[thorny lion]

[regal pawn]

@ 9.1 release we will be able to craft legendary on cloak

[balmy condor]

Ez pz lemon Meerenge pie

[low phoenix]

Pog ty

[gusty mirage]

Who knows tbh. Ptr has changed like a million times since 9.1 hit the test servers. I doubt they’ll randomly gut kyrian though to it being useless

[strange python]

Listen

I've heard that before when sub was hype

[gusty mirage]

Sub was still really good. Just rogue as a whole was underwhelming and assassination got a billion aura buffs by the time 9.0.5 hit

[regal pawn]

dont u think Outlaw will still be the go2 m+ spec?

[gusty mirage]

For push keys, probably yes. Gouge is too important at higher keys for the extra free interrupt

But sub damage in m+ will be really good where gouge/your personal preference will be the only two factors that’ll influence your decision

[balmy condor]

something something damage profile something something

outlaw deathly diamond hands to the moon free prio damage with passive cleave something something

[dry void]

is the amplifier actually bis or only used for sims cuz it doesnt have secondary stats

[balmy condor]

Honestly still can’t believe we’re complaining about vanish reliance for damage

[gusty mirage]

The deathly voodoo got you too

[balmy condor]

And outlaw brainlets decide to INCREASE vanish reliance

[balmy condor]

Idk what this question is

It’s a strong trinket

[tulip nacelle]

Deathly Shadows isn't so great? Are you kidding me? When was the last time you saw a legendary with such a dps increase? DS puts the game on another level, and we will be blessed if we ever see an item with this much of a raider IO increase for rogues again. Celerity breaks records. Master Assassin breaks records. Deathly Shadows breaks the rules. You can keep your statistics. I prefer the magic.

[ember jay]

@balmy condor maybe you know this, where can I check if the last Emeni trait is implemented (fleshcraft go boom)? past pull request on simc?

[tulip nacelle]

It's probably implemented fleshcraft just isn't in the apl

[spice glade]

is kyrian sin much worse than other covenants?

[gusty mirage]

Early cov sims are in the pins 🙂

[spice glade]

ah got it those are the soulbinds

just started playing SL soz

[balmy condor]

You’d have to go hunting through GitHub commits probably

[gusty mirage]

No worries

Kyrian sin being viable is a new thing anyway

[spice glade]

wow theres actually barely a difference between the worst and the best setup

[south belfry]

Have you personally decided what you are going for, or still waiting?

[gusty mirage]

Yeah all 3 specs are in a good spot with every covenant (except night fae, fucking butterflies)

[spice glade]

much better than 8.3 balance for sure

[balmy condor]

He’s playing my feelings

[gusty mirage]

I would never

[gusty mirage]

I’m super torn between sticking necro and just playing outlaw in m+ and switching venthyr and playing sub in m+. Sub in m+ is kinda meh to me gameplay wise: 30-40min of shuriken storm into BP is kinda

[spice glade]

ah thats great well done blizzard

[gusty mirage]

But I also betrayed the dagger brotherhood earlier this expac so I’m already soiled goods

[balmy condor]

Kinda great

Tornado is sick

I was running it in Torg earlier

[gusty mirage]

My best parse this tier was outlaw don’t look at me I’m hideous

[azure bronze]

I am in the same boat

[balmy condor]

And it was so fucking jank I forgot how to play sub entirely

[thorny lion]

same here but tornado is fun

[gusty mirage]

I ran into the same issue when I was testing the sylv daggers. I was like “how tf do you play this shit”

Just the sloppiest rotation ever

[balmy condor]

Gotta beat the cobwebs off

Couple of dummy sessions

[gusty mirage]

Pretty sure I let snd drop and didn’t sync any of my CDs

[balmy condor]

Ez clap

[gusty mirage]

Haven’t touched sub since I cleared normal

[thorny lion]

^

[south belfry]

So few days ago?

[gusty mirage]

[vital haven]

nice

[balmy condor]

Damn

I just witnessed oxi getting fucking iced

[gusty mirage]

They’re encroaching on your territory though

[balmy condor]

Him clearing normal though would require his guild to actually play the game

So false pretenses here

[gusty mirage]

True

They’re all clearing karazhan right now and trying to get me to play tbc classic

[bleak phoenix]

I hope sub being good isnt a bait this time. Would really enjoy not having to play outlaw in aoe content as well

[gusty mirage]

It’s not. AFAIK the bait earlier this tier was because akaari’s was “bugged” in beta

I didn’t have beta access so idk if that’s true or not

[balmy condor]

80% dps legendary is obviously intended

[gusty mirage]

I mean other classes had 80% dps from one ability so it made sense

[balmy condor]

Made dark shadow viable because you literally couldn’t cast enough dances

[bleak phoenix]

Im a bit overwhelmed at the rotation atm tho lol. So on early prog my guild will probably be better off by having me stick with assa

[gusty mirage]

Man that’s def some dps blue balls though. You see people running m+ on ptr with double sub rogue and then you go live with the shit we had

[vital haven]

it was the most popular rogue spec in castle nathria at the beginning iirc

[balmy condor]

Yeah that’s cause sin was healing the boss

[gusty mirage]

Lmao

[tulip nacelle]

outlaw tier

[balmy condor]

Make sin do 1700 less dps than now

That’s sin on launch

[gusty mirage]

It really was until 9.0.5

[balmy condor]

[gusty mirage]

No copium needed

[cobalt flame]

I am still healing boss as sin

[gusty mirage]

[bleak phoenix]

Outlaw tier made me reroll UH dk for prog, i will never forgive blizz for that

[vital haven]

and people were still putting it high on tier lists from what i remember as well

[gusty mirage]

AMZ tier made you reroll dk

[vital haven]

even after all the beta shenanigans

[gusty mirage]

“Yo let’s just make this ability super strong in this raid. People will still bring the player and not the class. We’re totally in touch with our player base” - some dildo at blizzard

[bleak phoenix]

I mean if u wanted a raid spot u had to

[cobalt flame]

I made DK alt just to be safe, but damn its super boring. Going to play WW as alt, at least i enjoy that a little

[gusty mirage]

I started the tier with 2 rogues friends. I refused to reroll and I was the only one left by the time we got into mythic

One guy rerolled firemage the other rerolled DK. Rogue weapon tokens still didn’t drop. Not one all tier

[vital haven]

uuf

[bleak phoenix]

We had 2 rogues at the start and 1 uh dk. 3 uh dks at the end of the tier with 0 rogues

[strange python]

It got fixed from the bug then it got nerfed again. Needlessly

[cobalt flame]

We had 1 rogue 2 DK at the start, ended with 1 DK 4 rogues

[vital haven]

like https://www.wowhead.com/news/shadowlands-dps-rankings-best-dps-for-castle-nathria-raid-predictions-319694

scroll down to the front runners section

[gusty mirage]

You ever watch a mob movie? Where they get a guy all pumped up about something they wanna show him out back? That’s blizzard’s treatment of subtlety

[cobalt flame]

And then they beat him with iron pipe?

[gusty mirage]

Yep

[cobalt flame]

True true

[strange python]

Yep. I remember it verrryyyy well. Akaaris was double proccing CPs and giving 85% dps value. That got fixed. Then it was giving 16% dps value. Then blizzard nerfed it again and said "legendaries should do about 5%"

Meanwhile, boomies, mages, hunters, DKs laughing with 15% Legos.

I'm still salty

[gusty mirage]

If blizz ends up nerfing subtlety I might just send Ion a cease and desist letter

[strange python]

I'm indecisive by nature and 9.1 has my brain frozen. I don't know what to do.

[gusty mirage]

Class action lawsuit for intentional infliction of emotional distress

[bleak phoenix]

I cant believe how they let boomies just absolutely destroy the tier throughout. Nothing to see here

[strange python]

Boomie was overrated imo.

Pad spec. Useful on council and otherwise just okay

[gusty mirage]

I watched a boomie spike up to 60k dps in a key once

And “even out” at 21k dps by the time the poor boss died

[bleak phoenix]

On early prog they were absolutely pumping esp on single target so idk about padding

[gusty mirage]

[strange python]

I legit cannot decide what to do for 9.1

[cobalt flame]

I mean i could burst more on fresh 60 boomie than on mythic gear 9.0 assa

[strange python]

I guess just roll venth and build doomblade and wait for heroic tuning?

Low risk

[limber lion]

@balmy condor @gusty mirage Hey hotties

[gusty mirage]

Hi cutie

[balmy condor]

[gusty mirage]

What covenant are you now?

[strange python]

They gave you a green name!

I swapped from venth to necro after raid Tuesday :) kill me

[bleak phoenix]

I was happy being necro assa, but sub popping up outta nowhere kinda messes with my head now

[south oak]

word brotha

[strange python]

I will probably start the swap back quest asap and stick with venthyr sin for heroic week and first few on mythic while shit shakes out

[gusty mirage]

Oh so you have venthyr good to go. If you want to make it easier on yourself just do the first part of the switching quest and you can get the 2nd one to 100% and just wait until 9.1 is actually out and tuning is all done

[strange python]

That kyrian sub shit is luring me like a fat stack of Oreos at 4 am though

I just wanna do big fucking damage as a stabby boi

[gusty mirage]

Echoing reprimand sucks compared to flag

Ez choice

[bleak phoenix]

Im thinking venth or necro. I just dont wanna buy into the kyrian hype for my own sanity

[strange python]

Reprimand is a nightmare to use as sub too

[gusty mirage]

Plus I’m pretty sure the sims for kyrian use the new lego which you unlock with renown levels

[strange python]

The fucking Charlie Brown football pull of ST proccing as you evis is enough to make you wanna die

[gusty mirage]

So you’ll have plenty of time to see if things change by the time we unlock the renown for it

[bleak phoenix]

Also hard to use it 100% optimally at all times

[strange python]

Omg true? That makes my decision for me. Now I can sleep <3

[gusty mirage]

Yeah I think the new cov legos unlock in the later 40s so it’ll be about 2-3 weeks after launch before we get them

[strange python]

Nice

[bleak phoenix]

So does the venthyr one i assume?

[gusty mirage]

All covenant ones unlock with renown

I just can’t remember which level exactly. I know it’s somewhere between 46-48

[azure bronze]

It's 48 renown so that would be mythic release week

[gusty mirage]

So no need to stress it just yet

[arctic bronze]

i'm on this covenant fence and i'm so hoping its not kyrian for any of the specs

[strange python]

I think the venth leggo isn't as good though

[azure bronze]

As the Kyrian one?

[gusty mirage]

Venthyr leggo is bis for sub raiding afaik

[azure bronze]

As far as I know the thing that is carrying kyrian sims atm is mikanikos not the legendary

[strange python]

But not by as much as the kyrian one

Mikanikos with akaaris is on par with nadjia akaaris per the Sims I see

[balmy condor]

Mikanikos and the legendary actually

[gusty mirage]

I think the sims also have all soulbind traits unlocked

[strange python]

It's definitely the combo of the two

[balmy condor]

For sub, the kyrian legendary is on par with obedience

It’s that strong

[gusty mirage]

Owlboi stonks

[azure bronze]

Hmmm

[strange python]

Sim shows it even stronger than obe, no?

[balmy condor]

In combination with mikanikos yes

[azure bronze]

In before I am back in 2 cp hell when I use ER

[strange python]

3% gain over akaaris for kyrian, compared to 2% for obe

[balmy condor]

I’m talking a fresh 60 equipping either legendary

[strange python]

Ah

[gusty mirage]

Doesn’t the legendary empower 4 CPs?

[balmy condor]

Ye

[gusty mirage]

Combo point lotto with a built in safety net

[strange python]

Whispyr

Does the reprimand mikanikos leggo assume you get the empowered finisher off during symbols?

[balmy condor]

You just get the same outcome tho

[balmy condor]

It finishes on the cp whenever it’s able to

[strange python]

So not always

Cause I could imagine getting it off during symbols would be big dam, but suuuuper unreliable

[balmy condor]

It’s very hard to finish on 2 during dance for example

3 and 5 would be doable

The main thing about it isn’t the damage

7cp finisher is whatever

Fuck that noise

It’s the cooldown reduction

[strange python]

Reprimand itself does the dam and no CD is big

Yeah

[indigo ginkgo]

depper strat

[strange python]

On pure ST, does the CD reduction make it line up with every symbols??

[balmy condor]

What

[gusty mirage]

The ER torghast power where it gives you a 20pt finisher is hilarious with the shadowstep 400% finisher power

[indigo ginkgo]

more shadow daamge even more buuf shadow daamge from the dagger that are not even implemt on sim

[strange python]

I only played kyrian sub briefly, but you open with reprimand in symbols right?

[balmy condor]

Yeah

[strange python]

Does mikanikos CDR bring them reprimand CD down enough to line up with symbols better?

It's 45 iirc

[azure bronze]

depends on how many targets you hit

[balmy condor]

It’s 3 seconds per target hit

[strange python]

That's wild

Oh god

Y'all ready for mikanikos ret pals in pvp with divine toll?

im ready to not play pvp at all this tier

[indigo ginkgo]

only thing that should be buff its the legendarie of the vendetta cd,s make it for us to get a vendetta every 1 min like the fuking mages in this patch

[strange python]

Ret pals gonna walk into rbgs and yeet a whole team

[balmy condor]

Still wouldn’t be good sadly

[strange python]

Obedience not good for sin??

[balmy condor]

No

He’s talking duskwalker tho

[strange python]

It's in none of the Sims, must be actually trash

Yeah, just curious

None of the St**

[balmy condor]

Yeah pretty much

It’s like MA/Zold levels of single target

Sin just can’t pump enough cp

[indigo ginkgo]

they have to buff it again dusk, so we could have an option of a legendarie that could makes have a nuke bomb for prio addds without losing boss damage or something

[oak sky]

im curious, in a 2 legendary scenario would we probably go doomblade dashing or doomblade zoldyck for the execute value

[indigo ginkgo]

they have 0 imagination, a legendarie that make exsanguinate viable ? So we can have a nuke bomb for prio adds !?

[tribal marlin]

probably dashing doomblade as a default setup

but when they will (if they) implements double leggo, it will obviously come with a round of leggo tunning so kinda hard to say

[gusty mirage]

[spice spire]

[gusty mirage]

[strange python]

How long is the change cov quest?

[azure bronze]

2 weeks

[strange python]

If I start now can it be ready on Tues next week?

How longs the actual stuff take after reset though? Can I just bang it out in an hour on Tuesday if I do the first half this week?

[ionic flume]

it's just wq's and stuff

[strange python]

Kk

[gusty mirage]

If you turn in the first part this week you’ll be venthyr on Tuesday

Just run halls of atonement on normal twice and do 1 WQ

Bam. 100% finished

[naive cypress]

Or just open 1 chest instead of the WQ too, pretty fast

[mint brook]

Since Sylvanas daggers are BiS and can only apply to 1 rogue, does it mean you ideally want only 1 rogue in your raid comp?

[digital zodiac]

any new update on cov choices in the recent day?

[limber lion]

That's very likely going to be fixed.

[limber lion]

No, pins have all the updated info whenever they get updated.

@mint brook Careful with your word choice, mate. But yeah, I agree.

It's a very similar bug that has happened before quite a few times.

I highly doubt it's intentional.

[azure bronze]

They will probably fix that before raid release

[limber lion]

Ignite used to work like that like a million years ago and so did Exploit Weakness before SL, but they've gone and changed both.

As long as they do it just as I get the dagger, or a bit before

[gusty mirage]

You’re getting the dagger first week so I hope you’re right

[south belfry]

I have a feeling it'll take me like 2 months to get one lol

[gusty mirage]

The rng gods owe you a mythic sylv dagger at this point

[south belfry]

Good thing the vault is there so it can also give it

Sanctum weapons arent a token right?

[winged basin]

Correct

[indigo ginkgo]

and bonus rolls

[winged rock]

Which Leggo should we be going for peoples?

Doomblade i'm thinking?

[gusty mirage]

For raid? Yea doomie is looking good

[winged rock]

Shweet, thanks.

[scenic meteor]

Doomie is bae

[potent dagger]

i wonder if there is a lot a multitarget on the raid

i can't find any meaningfull information on that

[gusty mirage]

There are some vods floating around of the fights

[limber lion]

I mean you can just open up the encounter journal in Wowhead and it'll give you an idea

[gusty mirage]

But yeah it’s weird this new tier has like very little widely available info

[limber lion]

But there's like 4 single target fights, a few cleave fights and well, not really any aoe fights as far as I remember

[potent dagger]

ok so it goes in favor of assa for raid

[gusty mirage]

No more SKS/Hivemind fights blizz pls

[limber lion]

Well, Sub is looking good as well.

[trail locust]

@limber lion whatis best assanination spec

[potent dagger]

if there where numerous aoe oriented fight , it would have favored the other two spec

[limber lion]

[gusty mirage]

[potent dagger]

@limber lion sure thing , but sub can be so easily fucked up by movement / hicukps in the strat during progression that i don't think it can compete with assasination progression time wise

[limber lion]

Well it depends, because Sub is quite a bit ahead of Sin

Both specs suffer from downtime, but yeah, Sub does suffer slightly more.

But doesn't mean it's an awful spec by any means.

[potent dagger]

i know , i used to play it and enjoy the gameplay

but in cleave it's purely outmached by the other two spec

[limber lion]

Well, Sub might be ahead of Outlaw in cleave tbh

[potent dagger]

Oo

[limber lion]

But yeah, Sin is definitely the cleave spec.

Outlaw will probably see the least amount of play among the western audience

It's often a very popular pick among the eastern audience.

[potent dagger]

for raiding it seems to go that way yeah

[limber lion]

I'm sticking to Necro Sin myself.

[potent dagger]

i will stick necro Sin for the moment as well

[tribal marlin]

for me kyrian (sub) kinda lack consistency in real progression environnement and Venthyr Sub is not ahead enough to justify the spec, unless the fight really favor funneling

[hoary night]

I just don't like the CDR mechanism of sub, which means your burst quality is pretty much depended on your flat window behaviours

[limber lion]

Yeah, don't have to play sub if you don't enjoy the gameplay

[potent dagger]

even tough i love the fast pace of playing outlaw , i have to play optimal in my guild

[tribal marlin]

Gotta see how it goes up, but for now I don't think i'll swap to Kyrian sub for the progression.

[gusty mirage]

Plus all the cool kids play assassination

[limber lion]

Which wr are you, if you don't mind me asking?

[frosty bridge]

oh boi

[gusty mirage]

Like @limber lion he’s the coolest, hottest dude around. He gets all the girls. Plus he’s jacked

[frosty bridge]

Cev is 100% jacked

[hoary night]

lol

[limber lion]

💪😊

[potent dagger]

@limber lion Elune , but i've just changed guild for intensive Mythic progression this patch

[frosty bridge]

Cev, what talents/covenant did you run on your first Sire kill?

and leggo

[limber lion]

Oh, no, I was asking about your guilds world ranking.

[limber lion]

EP/MA/Vig/CT and Doomy

[potent dagger]

in wr it's insignificant

[limber lion]

That's a lot coming from a super smart hunk like you, sheeeez

[potent dagger]

in rr it's top 3

[limber lion]

Yeah, well, I don't think you "need" to be super optimal if you're not pushing for really high ranks

It's a good thing you're doing so

But all rogue specs are very close in output honestly and the covenant balance is pretty good as well

You're honestly well off playing any spec with their respective best covenant.

[tribal marlin]

It definitely comes down to other aspect than raw output

[limber lion]

Playing a spec that your comfortable with is a major thing

Even if Sub sims higher for me, I'll probably perform better on Sin

Because I know the spec by heart and don't even have to think about the rotation whatsoever

I can just put my full focus on the fight and the mechanics.

[tribal marlin]

If the fight favor funnel, you might want to play sub, if it has annoying downtimes you'd go for sin etc..

If burst dps on specific timer is relevant you might play the spec which have the best timings

[winged basin]

He fucks.

[tribal marlin]

Like Kel'Thuzad for example, if it happen (It should be 2mn but who knows) that you go down every 1:45 you might just play Sub

[low phoenix]

is there a page where i can read what leggos get a new slot to be crafted on ?

[gusty mirage]

I don’t think every leggo has its full slots out yet. But I’ll find you the wowhead link

Un momento

https://www.wowhead.com/news/legendaries-to-recraft-for-patch-9-1-advice-from-wowheads-class-writers-322953 I think this has most of em

[low phoenix]

ty 🙂

[gusty mirage]

[low phoenix]

Do u know if the Zoldyck is gonna have a new slot? cuz its not on the list for rouge

[fallow glacier]

Legs will be the craft for them, but that’s already a thing

[gusty mirage]

Yeah zold doesn’t change, still goes on the legs

[low phoenix]

Ty just checking, wanna buy all the rank 4s i need before next week, cuz they will proberly sky rocket in price

[scarlet sequoia]

np

[magic gale]

I wish there was a log section on this channel 😁

[gusty mirage]

R4 Rings and necklaces on my server skyrocketed

[limber lion]

What do you mean by that?

[gusty mirage]

To look at other people’s logs or to post yours?

[magic gale]

Posting your logs to ask for people for help

[gusty mirage]

You can do that freely

[limber lion]

You can do that here

[gusty mirage]

Highly recommend doing it when Cev is here

Dude’s a machine

[magic gale]

So i've read 😁

[gusty mirage]

He’ll get you purple parsing in no time

[magic gale]

How much is he charging?

[frosty bridge]

He doesn't charge any money

😉

But he takes other means of payment

[pale ibex]

[magic gale]

kekw, i wouldnt mind paying for a service of that kind if there was one online...

but here is the log, if anyone can point my mistakes i would appreciate it honestly!! im quite happy with how i did on the pull but i just feel like im doing something wrong and i cant figure out what it is.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qwzvdnDHthRPB8FW#fight=10&type=damage-done

[limber lion]

Private log

[magic gale]

ohshit

[gusty mirage]

If Cev or someone else doesn’t get to it I’ll hop on the PC as soon as I get out of bed and look through it

Wcl on mobile is scuffed af

[magic gale]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qwzvdnDHthRPB8FW#fight=10

shouldnt be anymore

thank you alot

im getting pi every 2mins aswell

[limber lion]

Tiirikka?

[magic gale]

yes sir

[gusty mirage]

MY BOY

[limber lion]

Are you finnish?

[magic gale]

i am

[gusty mirage]

Finn connection

[limber lion]

Ok, I'll just dm you then

[magic gale]

<333 rakastan sua

[strange silo]

Is there a way to check if the zanda troll bleed scales with doomblade lego?

[gusty mirage]

Idk if there’s an easier way to do this but you could hit a dummy with the bleed proc and doomblade for a while. Then switch aspects and try it again and see if you notice any changes

[strange silo]

hm problem is i dont have doomblade and cant switch aspects for 4 days xd

[rancid warren]

Can FoK be superior than mutilate as combo generator in ST?(even without hidden blades)

[indigo ginkgo]

2 flag on burst windonw ?»

[potent dagger]

i'm comfortable with all the three spec , i enjoy the fast gameplay of outlaw and the availability of CD , i enjoy the regularity of the assa , and enjoy the burst damage of the sub , so it will be a class tuning choice :/

[gusty mirage]

Nope, mut will always be better

[potent dagger]

@rancid warren never , the ratio damage / cp / energy is not on favor of Fok under 3 target

[rancid warren]

Thanks

[bright bane]

Hi there

For "high-level" raiding (progress) necro seems to me (according to the new raid) overall better, what are your thoughts?

[shrewd night]

[bright bane]

I did check the pins 😉

[shrewd night]

Ok so.. Its listed there what our recommendations are

[bright bane]

Well, it's mostly saying sim results rather than actual recommandations based on raid design

[gusty mirage]

Some people are going necro assassination because it’s close enough to venthyr in ST and gets better when there’s an add present. Blizzard loves adds in fights so people maining sin in 9.1 are drawn toward it. Plus fleshcraft is a super strong defensive

[shrewd night]

wha-

[gusty mirage]

Biggest deciding factor in covenant for 9.1 will be what other spec you’d like to play and what you like the most

[bright bane]

Yeah i love also the 20% mitigation + shield where rogues don't have tools to mitigate besides feint

[gusty mirage]

Yeah fleshcraft is insanely strong

[compact pumice]

@bright bane third pin from the top was pretty clear without sims of the covenant recommendations

[lone minnow]

You guys think sylvanas belt (hastevers) will be better than soulrender one (crithaste)? for single target

[gusty mirage]

Is it higher ilvl?

[thorny pond]

Toxi back already?

[lone minnow]

it is

[gusty mirage]

No that’s a legit question I don’t know anything about the loot lol

[thorny pond]

High ilvll > all

[lone minnow]

but its like 5agi difference

[gusty mirage]

Then yeah it’ll win

[lone minnow]

5 agi over 80 crit? ;o

[gusty mirage]

The 5 agi will make up for any minimal optimizations on secondaries

[thorny pond]

There’s very few cases where that isn’t true

[compact pumice]

Stats are very close for rogues so ilevel means the most

[gusty mirage]

Like top secondary to worst is like .5 dps max per point

[thorny pond]

Yep. Difference between best and worst secondary stats is small

[gusty mirage]

Whereas agility is always our biggest source of dps outside of weapon dps

[lone minnow]

Aight, thx boyz

[bright bane]

Yeah as i said, i did check it, and it's some very useful ressources!

I wanted more to talk about fight design & stuff

As an example, i think that fights like dormazain will be very good as an outlaw rogue, and going necro looks very fine in this fight

Thought, for some others, like "guardian of the ancient ones", where we will have no room for extra serated bone spike, venthyr'll be better

There is also the funneling component with necrolord, even if our role is to just "kill the boss", because it might be as a sin, i think that the serated component'll be better to just burst that shit

[frosty bridge]

Anyone proficient with ElvUI? It's probably pretty simple but i messed something up and can't get it fixed

[compact pumice]

Thing is, Venthyr is so close to Necro in ST it’s almost neglible. So since there’s an add on a few bosses in 9.1 it’s just more reasonable to be Necro

[frosty bridge]

Basically, I can't get garrote/rupture/ct etc to show on boss frames

[compact pumice]

Elvui comes with shitload of filters on their target frames etc... annoying af

But on nameplates just change to plater or something

[frosty bridge]

Do i need a whitelist and blacklist if i want to show only specific ones?

I'm fine with that, it's easy with Plater

[bright bane]

I think so

[frosty bridge]

But I need the boss frames specifically

[bright bane]

Thought i did notice "jpc" saying that he's not going necro

Don't know if it was a troll or not

[gusty mirage]

Yeah you’d need to whitelist the buffs iirc

[compact pumice]

I think there’s a whitelist and blacklist already setup, just add to it

[thorny pond]

If you plan at all on going sub venth can be the play though

[gusty mirage]

Yeah if you plan on playing sub and assassination, venthyr is the move

[frosty bridge]

Is that enough to not show anything else?

[gusty mirage]

[bright bane]

Sub "buffs" are not enough to make it playable instead of sin & outlaws, right?

[compact pumice]

If we’re talking multi specs I’d just refer to the pins yeah

[thorny pond]

Can I move in with you?

[gusty mirage]

Yes

[thorny pond]

Who upset you last night while I was sleeping

[gusty mirage]

Sub’s going to be insanely good in m+ and looks to be neck and neck (even beating assassination in ST)

[bright bane]

😮

[gusty mirage]

@spice spire resurrected toxi last night

[spice spire]

🙂

It ain’t much but it’s an honest days work

[thorny pond]

So the theory behind sub is that it'll be close, however sin often performs better in progression raiding for a list of reasons such as mechanics and uptime whereas CDs for sub often don't line up with mechanics and needs more planning

But sub M+ will be juicy

[gusty mirage]

You make one mage ragequit your raid group and you’re just inherently toxic

@spice spire

[odd hazel]

@limber lion https://tacticalairhorse.itch.io/sanctum-of-pineapples

[vital tapir]

[thorny pond]

I made so many ranged quit in legion

[frosty bridge]

Sub really gotta blast to be the play in M+ over Outlaw, would be good fun with shuriken storm

[thorny pond]

And I was a hero

[vital tapir]

you could honestly just check the pins in channels

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/youre-right-breaking-bad-walter-white-gif-5292336

[spice spire]

@gusty mirage

[thorny pond]

We're also here to discuss things. Checking the pins for data is great but discussion is always welcome

[vital tapir]

the extent of buffs is pretty visible from the pins

[gusty mirage]

It’s looking like it’ll blast the aoe buffs were giga

[vital tapir]

massive aoe pulls ye

[thorny pond]

AoE and priority damage is going to be huge next season

sub will shine

[bright bane]

Ah yes

I did also notice that i often have a bigger cap between sim & resullt with sub rather than sin

(even when logging at 99)

Sin is good for that, it feels not good as a sub to lose uptime for mechanics while danse & symbole is up

[gusty mirage]

2-3T cleave still kinda dookie

[thorny pond]

Yea 2-3T cleave ask you tank to pull more lol

[frosty bridge]

Especially with the autoattack nerf :p

[thorny pond]

It's inherently easier to plan around a set of 2min CDs versus 3 varying length CDs during prog

[frosty bridge]

As Max said yesterday, if you make stuff hit weaker tanks won't stop kiting, they will just pull more

[bright bane]

Indeed

[thorny pond]

That's the goal. Let us tricks the tank and keep on pulling

[gusty mirage]

Tru

Even as assassination in m+ stop making my rotation harder. Pull more

[thorny pond]

Sin and Outlaw will still be good for M+ especially pugs who don't understand shit

sub in a coordinated group will wreck

[gusty mirage]

I yelled at my tank

Like bro I don’t want to push more than fok. Stop it

[thorny pond]

FoK you tank, let's go!

[lone minnow]

having a blast reading this but back to work time

ill be back l8R with probably more bad questions

😄

[thorny pond]

Get another monitor

[lone minnow]

ive got 3

[thorny pond]

4th for discord

[lone minnow]

It's open but can't be reading all day boi

😄

[thorny pond]

Don't blame me for your poor choices >.>

[lone minnow]

D:

[thorny pond]

c u l8r mate

[lone minnow]

❤️

[outer iris]

Hey guys! Will we craft Zoldyck in Legs in 9.1? Checked the pins, but i only found answer about Doomblade

Thanks for your help!!

🙂

[thorny pond]

Yes

[outer iris]

Tyvm

[dire spoke]

[gusty mirage]

[thorny pond]

So hopefully only some kyrian nerfs and we look good!

[gusty mirage]

everyone's hoping for a mika tweak that makes covenant choice easier

some degenerate shit I swear

[spring root]

exactly 😄

[grim jay]

for most people its prolly rather a "some tweak that justifies the pick I will make anyways"

😄

[undone eagle]

Guys is this discord server only about rogue guides?

I was sure I could react to my spec to see other channels but I guess im thinking of the wrong server?

[dim shoal]

This is Fuu and Whispyr appreciation zone only

[little sky]

i'm here because of the drinks

[winged basin]

Sorry but you severely spelled Cevs name..

[dim shoal]

WH

[limber lion]

[dim shoal]

[gusty mirage]

I'll cut you

[dire spoke]

wdym, the wowhead guide writers are literally in this discord

even icy

[gusty mirage]

we have off-topic guides too

you callin us one trick ponies?

[slender berry]

no he literally is thinking of the wrong server

[gusty mirage]

I can make him a sick boomkin fae guide

[slender berry]

theres a server with guides for all classes where you choose your roles to see channels

[gusty mirage]

"Push CA, Convoke, AFK"

done

[dire spoke]

lole, imagine copy pasting class discord pins just to have an own server

[slender berry]

i think its not even that i think its just a collection of wowhead links

[thorny pond]

Imagine multiclassing

I can barely sin rogue

[gusty mirage]

[undone eagle]

yeah i mean, my alt is DK and i wanna find a discord like this with good guide etc

so i can ask people live

[thorny pond]

DK discord kek

[gusty mirage]

I think the welcome channel has other class discord links in it

[thorny pond]

You're better off shaking a magic 8 ball than going to DK discord

[gusty mirage]

nope it doesn't

[dim shoal]

The patch notes with the soulbind nerfs arent coming to PTR right?
we have to wait till 9.1

[gusty mirage]

https://www.icy-veins.com/forums/topic/16114-class-discord-channels/

[dire spoke]

bicepspump does great work

[undone eagle]

cheers mate

😄

[frosty bridge]

Bicepspump is super wholesome, same with Archimitros from the warrior discord

Meanwhile the DH discord

[azure bronze]

is it on fire?

[frosty bridge]

a living immolation aura basically

[thorny pond]

DH discord is the best meme server

[kind dock]

I visited the DH discord one day.. Slowly backed out and closed the door.

[thorny pond]

Fel Hammer: Max Appreciation Channel is the best discord channel

other than this one

[topaz echo]

[north basin]

so right now on ST sub have 400 dps more than assa?

right now i mean in 9.1

[slender berry]

how did you get that number

[north basin]

9600 something on assa and 10k+ on sub. in our channels pins

[slender berry]

10006- 9789

[north basin]

sorry my thoughts run faster than my type speed XD i meant we are 90% necrolords now xD

and probably on prog we will choose necro aswell

[grim jay]

depends on if you plan on playing sub aswell

😄

[cobalt pelican]

kyrian sub is gross just use the venthyr numbers

[north basin]

new sims incoming today? anyone have info?

[spice spire]

More than likely no

Mans can only work so hard

[gusty mirage]

Whispyr seepi rn

[vestal wren]

kyrian isn't bad

it just doesen't feel super good to play

[gusty mirage]

The pins do have a link to the sims if you wanna try resimming stuff with the changes yourself

[south belfry]

I really hate how kyrian plays

[vestal wren]

i don't think that the changes are in simc

[south belfry]

Even if it was bis i probably wouldnt play it

[vestal wren]

esp. not the ones that go live with "reset"

[south belfry]

And just go for 2nd best

[vestal wren]

most changes seem rather minor in impact

the main complain i saw was from guy that kyrian sims "to low"

but i don't think that we can expect kyrian to get you twice the current benefit without it going on the "potential nerf" list

[gusty mirage]

do you think the bron changes would make any difference? @vestal wren

[limber lion]

Kyrian nerf waiting room

[slender berry]

quite a few other classes arent even picking mikanikos yet so who knows

[gusty mirage]

idk if the bron changes are in the sims yet or not

[burnt star]

also. no sim, is with the dagger yet

[vestal wren]

i don't know, it was the main reason guy removed the pins in outlaw iirc

[burnt star]

it could change

[vestal wren]

he seemed quite concerned that the sim didn't do the double dipping

[burnt star]

but. wont sub benefit more from the dagger?

[gusty mirage]

bron was never a significant source of damage

so idk how big the changes are

[gusty mirage]

yeah more finishers would benefit sub for the dagger

[vestal wren]

i mean the majority of the changes don't seem to change a lot

best case kyrian gets slighty better

[ember jay]

bron changes are not implemented in simc yet, and I guess we wont know if the way the stacking works will be on live until reset? unless bliz say something

[north basin]

if right now ST necro is 9600 in top gear, with 2 sylvanas daggers i can expect this number go up for?

[gusty mirage]

good thing they're super good at communicating

[vestal wren]

the main problems are last minute changes

[gusty mirage]

we're about to see dozens of them too before raid drops

[vestal wren]

instead of having things somewhat balanced we always get a lot of changes just before the patch comes live

[gusty mirage]

good thing 9.1 wasn't on PTR for like 2 months now

[vestal wren]

i rly think its just a issue of evaluation and data representation

[gusty mirage]

I agree

they dropped the ball with 9.1 tbh

[north basin]

cant wait til end of the heroic week. to see all final changes for mythic raid xD

[vestal wren]

we have strong 3rd party tools (herodamage, wcl, r.io)

[whole mason]

May I ask what bron changes?

[vestal wren]

but all of them have issues presenting data in a obvious way

[gusty mirage]

https://ptr.wowhead.com/news/undocumented-buff-to-bron-soulbind-trait-on-9-1-ptr-mikanikos-a-dark-horse-322987

they changed the way you build stacks to summon bron

[whole mason]

thanks

[rustic whale]

can we just thank to @balmy condor for his hard working. Thank you!

[sonic schooner]

Kiss you whisp

[quaint carbon]

[plain thistle]

[odd hazel]

@cobalt pelican what happened to CF

[cobalt pelican]

i got fired and now i'm homeless and my kids are starving

[odd hazel]

Understandable

Wait

[mighty kiln]

You >do not< need to craft your legendary at rank 4 in a new item slot to avoid conflicting with domination slots. When you are crafting your first R5/6 legendary, you can just craft it on the new slot without ever crafting the lower ranks. >Do not< waste your time and money crafting these legendaries before 9.1 at rank 4.

is that true?

[pure moth]

Where did you read it?

[umbral rapids]

i mean you just use a base item like we did in 9.0

[mighty kiln]

reddit

[odd hazel]

Oof

[mighty kiln]

https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveWoW/comments/o7i8jc/legendary_crafting_psas/

[odd hazel]

Don’t listen to Reddit lol

It’s fine to make the rank 4, we won’t be able to make the 5/6 right away most likely any way

[mighty kiln]

misread it ):

[odd hazel]

You also don’t want to conflict with your slot if you get the slot any way

It’s ez to get it and we still use doom

[floral shoal]

We only get enough soul cinders to make rank 5 week 1 and rank 6 in week 3. So rank 4 is unnecessary but I'd say most of us will spend the gold to get R5 and R6 instead of waiting 3 weeks.

[south oak]

You can pay for it?

[neat tartan]

Obedience legendary only increases vers by 1%?

[thorny pond]

per stack

[plain thistle]

for each combo point spent, for sub you can get to 30 almost every time

which means you get 30% haste AND with the legendary 30% versa

[thorny pond]

pretty huge

[neat tartan]

I see, so that description is wrong. Thank you 👍🏻

[nimble tinsel]

Not wrong, just clunky wording since it is adding on to the normal effect of Flag, which is worded the same way but makes more sense with the appropriate context.

So the usual Blizz tooltip lol

[gusty breach]

bros, stupid question, do you guys know if at release of 9.1, you get increased gear from normal/heroic/m0 dungeons?

or is it at 6-7th depending on region

[gusty mirage]

Yes 9.1 dungeons will drop higher ilvl when it releases in your region

[gusty breach]

amazin

[lone minnow]

oxi how are you so fast

[gusty mirage]

Fastest typer this side of the Atlantic

[lone minnow]

fast as fuk boi

[fallow glacier]

Which side of the Atlantic

[nimble tinsel]

This

[gentle summit]

As it stands is vent good for sub/assa?

[gusty mirage]

the "free" side where a hospital visit bankrupts you

[cyan kite]

Wait so m0s will start dropping 210 ilvl gear next reset?

[lone minnow]

@gentle summit check the pins

😄

[gusty mirage]

correct, https://www.worldofmoudi.com/patch-9-1-gear-item-levels-ilvl-in-shadowlands

[gentle summit]

@lone minnow my bad 😂

[lone minnow]

dw I asked same thing 3 days ago

😄

[fallow glacier]

[gusty mirage]

good way to catch up on gear for an alt/fill in any spots you may have missing

[strange silo]

tazavesh opens 6/7th right?

[nimble tinsel]

Ilvl increase isn't live until Season 2 July 6th/7th

[gusty mirage]

yeah opens w/ the start of the season iirc

[nimble tinsel]

and yes new dung also 6th/7th

[gusty mirage]

is this confirmed even for normal/heroic/mythic 0s?

[lone minnow]

what ilvl can we get from keys next week then?

[gusty mirage]

226 from vault still

[nimble tinsel]

The following changes go live with Season 2 on July 6:
Item levels of rewards from level 60 Normal, Heroic, and Mythic dungeons have been increased by 26. Baseline rewards are now item-level 184 from Normal, 197 from Heroic, and 210 from Mythic dungeons.
Mythic+ dungeon rewards have had their maximum item level increased by 26 item levels, and some interim Keystone level rewards have their item level rewards adjusted.
Great Vault rewards have been increased by 26 item levels.
Heroic dungeon's enemy damage has been increased by 6% and enemy health increased by 16%.
Mythic dungeon's enemy damage and health has been increased by 26%.
Mythic+ dungeon's enemy damage has been increased by 35% and enemy health increased by 39%.

[lone minnow]

what abt end of dgn keys

[nimble tinsel]

Directly from patch notes

[thorny pond]

+26 all around

[cyan kite]

So really 9.1 releases on the 6th

[lone minnow]

i c

[thorny pond]

Get a week to play with class balance

[gusty mirage]

idk why they'd wait for dungeon gear ilvl bump

oh blizzard why do you do the things you do

[nimble tinsel]

tImE gAtInG mUh CoNtEnT

[thorny pond]

Because then we could farm 15s for 236 on old difficulty scaling

[worthy moth]

alright quick question, dont think about raid or mythic plus:

FOR ASSASINATION, NECRO OR VENTHYR?

[thorny pond]

#pvp

[strange silo]

big f i still need like 20ilvl on my new main D: just have 206

[gusty mirage]

they could easily cap the ilvl for m+ while changing the base loot

[thorny pond]

That would require them to not fuck it up

[gusty mirage]

TRUE

[lone minnow]

What ilvl key you reckon we'll be able to clear first week

[gusty mirage]

nah you'll be fine, there's a buncha catch up gear from Korthia iirc

[lone minnow]

lvl*

[thorny pond]

15s if you've been pushing

[gusty mirage]

If you were able to do 15s in season 1, it'll be a little harder in season 2 but you should manage just fine

[thorny pond]

We were doing them on PTR pretty simple

[gusty mirage]

esp w/ all the affix nerfs that are going live

[thorny pond]

Seasonal affix feels overtuned asf

[strange silo]

yeah but if i wanna raid week 1 i cant. i dont think i can get around 20 ilvl day 1 :d

[lone minnow]

isn't the ilvl of the drops fixed in first week?

or is that only vault

[thorny pond]

Next week is still season 1 M+

just new tunings

[gusty mirage]

so you can still get 210 gear and upgrade it to 220 w/ valor + get a 226 from your vault

[nimble tinsel]

Same rewards, harder content 🙂

[thorny pond]

Easier content

all the dungeons are getting nerfed

[lone minnow]

So next week is not actually that exciting

loot wise

[gusty mirage]

they're also bumping up the base level difficulty for 9.1

so idk if it's per se easier

[thorny pond]

Probably a wash

[gusty mirage]

I can't wait for them to fuck up something with scaling so prides are one shotting people at 19s

[nimble tinsel]

Oh wait the scaling isn't active until S2 either

[gusty mirage]

lmao

[thorny pond]

Yea what Wowslayer said

[gusty mirage]

I'm sure we'll experience some sort of other scaling fuckery

[bleak sky]

prideless hakkar at high keys

[thorny pond]

I think dungeons are nerfed but the tune ups aren't until S2 starts

[gusty mirage]

remember junkyard m+ week 1 with explosives?

[thorny pond]

Seasonal affixes will make it easier + he got hella nerfed

[bleak sky]

did he?

[thorny pond]

Yea

[umbral rapids]

oh lord that was horrible LOL

[gusty mirage]

yeah they nerfed tf out of hakkar

[nimble tinsel]

Yea all the direct dungeon tuning changes are live next week

[gusty mirage]

he's a joke now