assassination

[balmy condor]

you always pool

regardless of talents

I know I am

[dawn moat]

thx

[balmy condor]

aight time to see if 0 haste venthyr still runs deeper

[subtle kiln]

!bis

[stoic needle]

Am I a monster if I want to run EP+ds

[balmy condor]

that's what we're running next tier

very likely

[stoic needle]

[stoic needle]

[balmy condor]

or maybe towards the end of next tier into the tier after that

if nothing changes

either way

it's on the horizon

[stoic needle]

Big numbers less frequently > smaller numbers more frequently

[limber lion]

Rupture op

[balmy condor]

even with 0 haste

vigor still 65 behind

[stoic needle]

Lmao

I guess flag is enough

[balmy condor]

yeah

flag haste is nuts

[stoic needle]

Somehow the gap is smaller with more haste?

[subtle kiln]

mfd venthyr next

[stoic needle]

Maybe its just that profile

[vital haven]

gl on denny @limber lion

[lost mist]

plus 20% haste every 80 sec

[balmy condor]

it's wider

let me check

I assume EP+vigor is probably closer

but vigor/bs should be worse

yeah

[stoic needle]

Remember when MA and subt was 20 dps apart

[balmy condor]

every gain I found for subt got wiped out by every gain koji found for ma

so now it's back to where we started

[stoic needle]

The absolute dire state of sin talents

[ebon thorn]

What's the best secondary stats to go for

[balmy condor]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

In general simming yourself is the recommended way to determine stat weights.
The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simulation.
Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[balmy condor]

also in the pins

[ebon thorn]

thanks whispyr

[unreal sparrow]

whats the ideal opener on st with bs ma ds build as necro?

[balmy condor]

sbs snd mut gar rup and then cooldowns

[viral vigil]

Yo. What’s yalls thoughts on the new Souldbind trees?

[balmy condor]

they're new, and have effects that increase our damage

[viral vigil]

I’ve only really seen Venthyr. Any huge meta changing ones from the other covenants or all basically like Nadja where it gives stats.

[balmy condor]

we don't know how good they are until everything is implemented fully and we have sims for it

right now they're all just "do more damage"

like the current traits are as well

[viral vigil]

Roger, I’m just hoping Venthyr stays BiS

[balmy condor]

at first glance necro seems to be a winner

but again, it's day 2 of a 2 month ptr

so

who fucking knows tbh

[ebon hull]

Good afternoon, I'm seeing that Doomblade is just below Zooldick in M+, has anyone tried it?

[balmy condor]

it's okay

good for like ToP

but the moment you're doing aoe, lmao.

[manic harness]

Venthyr still bis transmog so

Obviously that's more important

Than actual dps done

[knotty grove]

!bis

[dawn ivy]

hmmm

[gusty mirage]

Where’s @icy crater with the whispyr bamboozle screenshot?

[icy crater]

cev has a good one too

[gusty mirage]

True

[radiant fossil]

Guys i got the skulker 226. I feel like this trinket is a bait. Sim lower than my shadowgrasp totem too.

[balmy condor]

it's a pretty good trinket

[shy dust]

Why is it a bait

[gloomy fern]

its good and easy to get

[balmy condor]

but shadowgrasp is pretty good

[stoic needle]

its doodoo garbage

its great if you like missing the target you actually want to hit

[shy dust]

Easy to get?

My rogue hasn’t seen it all tier

[gloomy fern]

nice yoke

drops 4 every kill

[shy dust]

I’m serious

[radiant fossil]

Its 1.30min versus 2min shadowgrasp. I'll try the skulker for a couple day to see if its even dps.

[shy dust]

You simmed it

One does more damage

[radiant fossil]

Yeah sim lower than totem. -0.4%

[balmy condor]

makes sense

[radiant fossil]

But skulker can crit right ? if thats the case, i think a single big crit is better than my totem who can crit every tick but in reality i have like 30% with totem

[balmy condor]

???

[radiant fossil]

My english isnt that great sry.

[balmy condor]

you realize 1/3 crits, or 1000/3000 crits

is the same

right

if you crit 30% of the time with skulk

and 30% of the time with totem

you're still critting 30% of the time

[hazy crater]

[shy dust]

The execute conversation

Has been molded into something new

[balmy condor]

actually though

it's insane

this is just "more execute phases" but in reverse

[gusty mirage]

It’s not doo doo garbage

[balmy condor]

it's devolving

[radiant fossil]

yeah but the totem is like 15 little hits, when skulker is one huge hit.

[balmy condor]

oh my god

if I could reach through my monitor and strangle you

[shy dust]

LOL

[radiant fossil]

👀

[solid ferry]

would you rather fight 15 little hits or one big hit?

[balmy condor]

would you rather have 100 ticks of 50 damage

or 1 tick of 4000

[shy dust]

Don’t tempt us with a good time

[balmy condor]

be aware

[shy dust]

👀

[balmy condor]

there is a wrong answer

[radiant fossil]

i'll take the 100 ticks ! thats my final answer !!

[balmy condor]

okay

so why wouldn't you take the totem

[gusty mirage]

When someone invents technology that lets people strangle others through the internet, Whispyr’s going to jail

[radiant fossil]

Because in my mind a bigger hit crit > lesser many hits

[balmy condor]

but you have the data in front of you

showing that bigger hit skulk > lesser many hit totem

is wrong

[solid ferry]

ok bigger hit skulk > lesser many hit totem, got it

[radiant fossil]

Maybe i wanted to ask you guys because i feel lonely and wants to talk

[balmy condor]

you're next on my strangle list you discolored pokemon fuck

[solid ferry]

🙂

[gusty mirage]

My 226 totem did almost as much damage as my 220 phial on inerva last night. The trinket’s legit boys and girls

Only situation it might suck is in m+ because of all the kiting tanks have to do. But even then you got a good window of use out of it

[radiant fossil]

Yeah i like it in dungeons, the cooldown reduction is pretty good

[balmy condor]

totem being hasted

[shy dust]

Isn’t the cdr based

[balmy condor]

is actually quite mongo cock

[shy dust]

On killing blow

I’ve used it on packs dying

And only gotten 1 cdr on it

[gusty mirage]

Yeah I popped it on lust and it did quite a bit of damooj

[balmy condor]

it should retarget

[balmy condor]

we're fans of damooj

[gusty mirage]

I’ve learned to never doubt you again

[hazy crater]

why not use Zoldyck on council, so much execute

[balmy condor]

that's a horrible mistake

I doubt myself all the time

[shy dust]

It does ik

But I’ve definitely used it in packs

[gusty mirage]

same but I think that’s normal

[shy dust]

And like 1 mob was left

And it still didn’t get cdr

[balmy condor]

whack

[shy dust]

I ran a lot of keys with it on my WW

Felt weird

Could never get it to 1m30

[visual prairie]

my buttons were definitely mushier when i used it

felt weird

[limber lion]

Opener, P2 big add, P3 twice

[gusty mirage]

God that just reminds me of how long that fight is

[frail fossil]

why is this the first thing i see when i enter the channel bro

everything made to remind me of the dumb shit i said

[balmy condor]

you're not the only dumbass is the problem

[frail fossil]

i like the new name

very tasteful

[balmy condor]

zoldyck because more execute

is like

a common idea

because people don't take literally 3 seconds to rub their last remaining brain cells together

and think

[solid ferry]

which is better: three small execute windows or one long one??

[vestal wren]

if you have full cooldowns for all 3 the 3

[solid ferry]

Haha thanks man, I was mostly teasing whispyr

[heavy vessel]

I think the totem gets cdr if your current target dies, then you have to retarget and that target has to die for more cdr

but could be wrong

[vital haven]

im pretty sure you can squeeze another vendetta on phase one

but maybe that aint the play because it might delay the vendetta on phase 2

[gloomy knoll]

ideally you get

two vend p1

one p2 and

two p3

[daring plover]

or 2 p2 2 p3

[limber lion]

Ye you can but it's not necessary. We're already stopping dps.

[hazy crater]

2 in p2 and 2 in p3 is decent as well yeah

But requires that your CD isnt assigned to 2nd add

[stoic needle]

It is, just admit it

I mean who actually pays attention to boss hp? More boss = more execute it's simple maths whysper

The Nine in sanctum of domination looks like a 2-3t cleave fight with no healing bullshit

Sin stonks rising 📈

Eye of the jailer seems to have some add components too

[odd hazel]

the new raid looks poggers.

[stoic needle]

I'm way too excited for the dumb trap boss

[ocean verge]

Guys there is a big difference for pve between nécro & venthyr ? If u want pve /pvp it is probably better to take necro right?

[spring solar]

so i just switched to ass but i kinda feel energy starved alot is this normal?

[stoic needle]

That's just the pace of the spec

[spring solar]

ok, think i must get used to it for a while

so is for m+ venth still on top?

[gusty mirage]

you enjoy your trinket that gives your healers mana because you for sure have that one healer who's trying to pad and is oom asking for an innervate in the first 10 seconds of the pull

[stoic needle]

It depends on what you quantify as a big difference. It's roughly 100dps difference in st in favor of venthyr and 200-300 dps aoe difference in favor of necrolord. Necrolord has better pvp utility I believe? Overall it's pretty close and you can pick what you want

[gusty mirage]

[stoic needle]

Necro is better for m+ by a pretty large margin

I just swapped to necro for m+ among other things

[spring solar]

ah ok 😄 tyty thank god i dont have to switch

[ocean verge]

Ok well necro could be great for m+ and pvp thx for answer 😍

[stoic needle]

I will! In 40 pulls last night it only have non stats 5 times!

[compact pumice]

Hmm, do you guys prefer Outlaw or Assass on Council btw?

For progression

[gusty mirage]

[stoic needle]

Ngl I think the failure rate for skulker's and Iqd is pretty similar

But tbh most of those fails were my own inexperience

[odd hazel]

i've played both, and honestly i prefer sin. more damage on boss. since AoEing is pretty pointless

[balmy condor]

Remember when I told you it failed twice for me in 35 pulls and you didn’t believe me

[compact pumice]

Yeah... if you check top parses they're outlaw (ofc) but on Damage to Bosses it's Assassin by far so

Probably gonna go for it

[stoic needle]

I mean those were just me popping it too early

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[stoic needle]

Like, on the pull and it healed the tank

Or on the wrong pillar outside of lust

[balmy condor]

Yuck

[stoic needle]

I haven't played with an on use trinket for almost a month and change now so I kinda forgot how

[odd hazel]

i mean, realistically you do more damage thats actually useful as sin. If you want to parse go outlaw

[compact pumice]

yeah IDC about parses on progression. I'd rather kill the bosses tbh.

[balmy condor]

[stoic needle]

Your name

[balmy condor]

It was all lowercase

So one of the blades must’ve changed it

[gusty mirage]

^

[stoic needle]

Amazing

[limber lion]

I've done it

[vital haven]

you killed denny?

noice

[gusty mirage]

[limber lion]

Yeah holy fuck

[gusty mirage]

Congrats Cev! 😄

[limber lion]

I'm so happy

Got a rank 1 from it as well

[gusty mirage]

PARTY TIME IN #assassination

our boy got CE AND r1

what a legend

[golden saffron]

Hello guys. Was wondering how to chose the slot for my legendary (going for Doomblade). For now, my guild is struggling on Nathria nm (I cleaned it as a PU) and I have shoulders 203 (versatility/mastery) and gloves 200 (haste/crit). I am 60 since 3 weeks and I can clean MM+7. However I am not full on my jobs yet (specially cooking) so I don't think I could go in HM before a while (I'm new on my realms so not rich yet). Any tips please?

[balmy condor]

that is

Quite a question

Lmao

[icy crater]

saved that one

[balmy condor]

Just craft it on hands

You’ll be fine

[gusty mirage]

yeah don't be a dummy like me

🙂

[limber lion]

Hands are a safe bet for sure

[golden saffron]

Ok :) Thank you guys!

[balmy condor]

Kinda wild how different the game is depending on how casual you play

Always humbling to see it

[vagrant bison]

i started raiding in shadowlands and everyone was pretty satisfied after we killed sire in normal, it felt good😆

how do you deal with spiteful? its literally impossible to get a restealth when the tank goes into the other pull

[gusty mirage]

tbh I remember in legion when I played super casually and I found that I enjoyed the game a bit more when I didn't take it so serious

[balmy condor]

Yeh you just kinda live with it

[gusty mirage]

you just get sad

[balmy condor]

You can try to secretly hit the spitefuls and hope the tank doesn’t chain

But otherwise you’re just out of luck

[gusty mirage]

if the trash pack dies at the same time, you can usually sneak in a stealth before one puts you in combat

[vagrant bison]

i mean, as main tank i totally understand the tank logic since waiting to kill the spitefuls is a waste, but its very annoying

[gusty mirage]

tbh the way to make spiteful a nonaffix is on the DPS moreso than the tank

make sure you kill things like you would on bolster

that way they can get mass gripped and you move on

[vagrant bison]

yeah but

pug xD

usually i hit a spiteful with a fok and then its gg

no restealth till they are all dead

now i understand the frustration of a friend of mine that was complaining about me chainpulling 😆

[winged basin]

yall pop orc racial with vendetta right?

[visual prairie]

you play outlaw with celerity or deathly shadows so restealth isn't that important

[radiant fossil]

@limber lion gratz on the kill

[balmy condor]

Yes

[balmy condor]

Wrong channel?

[visual prairie]

no that's how you deal with not being able to restealth spiteful

[limber lion]

Thank you!

[visual prairie]

grats on kill and parse

[gusty mirage]

[gusty mirage]

what do you want for your celebration?

[balmy condor]

How do I play sin

Don’t

[limber lion]

Probably some ibuprofein and paracetamol, I've got a massive headache now

Hah

[visual prairie]

thinking outside your sinbox

[limber lion]

First reclear as Assa next week!

[visual prairie]

my tinder dates usually get a little freaked out around the sinbox

[ocean zodiac]

Can anyone help me on with my shierkwing logs? I cant for the life of me get good logs for that boss, https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/gFDYZR3HaA1GyvXM#fight=2&type=damage-done&source=10

Idk how people do 1k more dmg than me lol

I mean im losing a bit of uptime by moving LOS but thats like 2/3 secs

[stoic needle]

@limber lion congrats man!

Lmao how did you get r1 on your first kill

[limber lion]

Thanks!

Mega padding on first kill

[stoic needle]

dishonest

[limber lion]

Idk, I just tried to be glued to the boss at all times

[stoic needle]

I like it

[limber lion]

It's a really scripted fight so you learn where to use cooldowns pretty quickly

From like using IQD, to Vend and every single Shiv

Didn't get any loot, but wasn't expecting any either :p

[stoic needle]

Yeah that makes sense, I got the same feeling when I was suffering through heroic

That re-clear next week though

[limber lion]

Yeah can't wait!

Last reclear was Feb 10th

Over 2 months ago.

Glad it's over.

Sin stonks rising

[stoic needle]

Now you can finally rest

You earned it

[limber lion]

❤️

[gloomy rose]

does it matter which enchant is on main hand / off hand?

[stoic needle]

Hopefully my guild can kill sludgefist this week so I can get started on suffering through slg

[limber lion]

Keeping my fingers crossed for you!

Are you planning to play Outlaw or Sin on SLG?

[stoic needle]

My RL wants me to play outlaw

We don't have a ton of hunters so I think we might actually need the aoe damage

[limber lion]

Ah yeh fair enough

Do you know if you're doing the slow strat or the burst strat?

Or something in between? :p

[balmy condor]

Not one bit

[gloomy rose]

thanks!

[stoic needle]

The first time we talked about it he mentioned the slow strat but I'm going to try to convince him of the burst strat for my own sanity

[patent topaz]

doing burst strat with a bad guild is the easy way to 300 wipes

choose wisely

[stoic needle]

I'd say we're fairly average

Could use some better ranged

[ionic kelp]

whats the diff between the slow strat vs burst strat? is it how you are killing commandos

[devout prism]

question: for stone legion is is worth putting garrote and rupture on the shielded boss for energy regen?

[stoic needle]

Yeah I think the slow strat kills the commandos one by one and the burst strat tries to get 2 at once

[balmy condor]

Yes

[devout prism]

cool ty, I assume it doesn't work on something that is immune though

[limber lion]

That's a fair thought to have.

But it works just fine. The boss isn't actually immune either, it's a 95% damage reduction.

[ionic kelp]

oh ya we just bursted everything down but we also had really good burst for them. but missing hunters can make it harder

[balmy condor]

I’m fairly sure it works on immunes

[limber lion]

Yeh it does.

Just wanted to say that as a side thingy in case he wasn't aware, didn't really relate to the energy gain

sorry mi no englando

veri eu

[devout prism]

great ty for info

[compact pumice]

Wow, checked #pvp for some input or thoughts on the gear changes for 9.1, it’s a shit show. I’ll stay in here tyvm.

[balmy condor]

https://tenor.com/view/hang-first-time-smiles-gif-14991372

[limber lion]

It's a group of people who are all right and never wrong.

[tribal mauve]

110 wipe on slg, still no phase between p2 and p3

[ionic kelp]

[limber lion]

Hang in there buddy! I don't know if this brings solace or not, but our guild had 300 pulls on it.

So you most likely will kill it quicker than that!

[ionic kelp]

is ur team bad at holding dps

and pressing their big dick cleave buttons when they should just be STing

[tribal mauve]

sometimes they cant ST

like 1/2 pull

and that fuck our p2

[stoic needle]

Pvp brains man

Pvping makes you into a worse person especially in wow

[ionic kelp]

ya, everyone just wanna pad and dont realize that fight isnt about pushing the meters especially on prog

fight also slightly sucks cause timers are wicked blade / crysallize timers still dumbo

[simple wadi]

I had a similar experience - but we managed to luck our way into P3 a couple times and before you know it boss is dead

So you really are closer to the kill than you think

[vagrant bison]

@limber lion gg on the kill!

[vestal abyss]

Since #pvp is a battlefield atm: whats tbe best burst rotation for venthyr?

[balmy condor]

[compact pumice]

I mean assuming you have dots up, vend,flag,shiv,5cpenv,mfd,Env,muti,env is a good burst rotation

Vanish there after shiv if you have it and MA leggo or MA talent

Else it’s good to save for sap after blinding

[vestal abyss]

Oke ty

What wpuld you use with a hy priest in 2s, gloomblade or MA?

Holy*

[compact pumice]

But it’s a bit trickier if you need to set 5cp for KS though

But not really, just do as much damage as possible after KS.

[fleet anchor]

It doesn't help that like.. padding on SLG actively makes the fight harder. Not just like "oh our DPS kinda sucks because people are padding"

Like "oh yay now our timings are totally fubar"

[compact pumice]

Going by what Raz does, he uses doomblade on things he can’t burst down, like palas or mages who will never die by a burst. Else uses MA to enable a burst kill more.

[limber lion]

Koji I killed Sire and got r1 log :3

[fleet anchor]

SLG is like the ultimate messed up spell queuing + percentage based pushes combo bullshittery fight

[vestal abyss]

Okay thanks!

Who is Raz?

[fleet anchor]

Ceverion with that CT pad lololol

😄

[compact pumice]

An assass rogue pvp streamer. He seems very good.

Highest rated rogue at some points recently etc, if that’s anything to go by

[vestal abyss]

Hmm im looking for him on youtube but no luck so far

[limber lion]

Hehehe, didn't want to go EB because that's a bit too much.

[fleet anchor]

Even Passassin isn't tryhard enough to run CT on that fight!

[limber lion]

Possibly never killing Sire again

[compact pumice]

Check twitch

[limber lion]

The first and possibly last kill

[fleet anchor]

wut

Why?

[ionic kelp]

wait your kill timer

for first kill is insane lol

[vestal abyss]

Okie ty

[limber lion]

Most of our guildies are thinking about going on a break and/or quitting.

As in taking a break until 9.1

[stoic needle]

oh nooooo

[limber lion]

Okay maybe not most but a good handful

[compact pumice]

Damn. Sounds like 300 wipes on SLG can do bad things to a person

[fleet anchor]

My best pull I'm still like 200 DPS higher than you on P3, so I'm gonna claim moral victory here

[limber lion]

Hey that was my first one, you've had more time to practice

I'm still kinda panic-mode during the last overlap

[fleet anchor]

haha

yeah that last overlap is sux

[limber lion]

I'm still not 100% sure how to deal with it

[fleet anchor]

Shadowstep to someone you trust during the knockback and prey

[limber lion]

Yeah that's pretty much what I did

[fleet anchor]

Just assume you'll proc Cheat there tbh

[limber lion]

After dying to Massacre 2 times because I shadowstepped to Sire I learned my lesson

Yeah, going there without cheat was a recipe for death.

[fleet anchor]

Assassination doesn't have many great ways of dealing with it

Kinda blows

[limber lion]

Yeh

Whilst our DK and Pala just jam there

Stand still

And don't even get knocked

[fleet anchor]

I've actually only got 2 Sire kills though

3rd tonight 😄

[limber lion]

Oh really? I thought you had plenty

Fair enough! :p

Have you gotten any loot yet?

[fleet anchor]

Not from the boss

I've gotten 3 Sire items from GV though 🤣

[limber lion]

Sheeeeez

[fleet anchor]

Nah should be like 4 Sire kills including this week, but we had a mental breakdown last week and didn't kill, week before we were rotating people in for FK

[limber lion]

I wouldn't mind seeing a Sire item or two from my vault in 2 weeks.

[limber lion]

Ah damn

[fleet anchor]

Hoping I get lucky and get Fractures tonight

[limber lion]

Fingers crossed!

I haven't killed Council yet

[fleet anchor]

I'm at 5 SLG kills without Recuperator big F

[limber lion]

That's gonna be interesting

[limber lion]

Ouch

I got mine on my first kill but I don't even use it xD

[fleet anchor]

wut

[limber lion]

Idk I like Nimble Fingers more

I think Recup would be the better choice

But I enjoyed having access to Crimson Vial at 10 energy more

[subtle tundra]

i've been on all sire reclears so far for 2 months just cause i dont die and and i do good dam ^^

[low girder]

i had like 9 kills on hungering before we started extending and i never got the cloaked conduit lol

good thing it's getting nerfed!

[fleet anchor]

I mean some of us are Necrolord

And can run Nimble Fingers AND Recuperator 😄

[slow marsh]

Wait you guys don't take both?

Venthyr I have both

[fleet anchor]

Can't run both as Nadjia

[limber lion]

Ahh that's right

Yeah Nadja gets 2 Finesse conduits

... boring

[low girder]

and they're all meh

hooray i get 4 seconds off cloak on sire

6s*

only the step one is useful

[fleet anchor]

Running QD+Nimble+Recup

As Heirmir

[low girder]

is there a possibility you take all 3 endurance as heirmir in 9.1

lmao

[fleet anchor]

Yeah

You probably will

Since that side is a DPS passive

[low girder]

oh it's carver's

welp

[fleet anchor]

https://ptr.wowhead.com/soulbind-calc/necrolord/bonesmith-heirmir/rogue/ApZqlgEFNhsAEgU1GAYlNiMGIxU1QAYlNT8GNTYZBg

[low girder]

kind of absurd tbh

[slow marsh]

Heirmers looks really good

[limber lion]

All of the endurance conduits are actually good

I think QD is the only good Finesse one

[low girder]

idk cloaked seems pretty meh

[slow marsh]

I'm debating if I should get my Necro up before patch

[limber lion]

Yeah true, not the best after the 9.1 nerfs

[low girder]

might be alright if there's a constant dmg fight

but outside of that

doesn't seem like you'd use cds at a time where a lot of dmg is happening

[hollow escarp]

@balmy condor loved your idea about Poison Bomb recharge from the Marcelian Podcast. Reminds me of Plague Bearer from PoE

[slow marsh]

Marcelian Podcast?

brb subbing

[hollow escarp]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FggsOgZfIH0

[limber lion]

I played Poison BV as my first character ever in PoE

[limber lion]

And PB kinda slaps

[low girder]

he tried

[balmy condor]

To be fair, not originally my idea

[hollow escarp]

my first build in PoE was Blade Flurry Poison

for whoever knows, it's trash

or used to be

[balmy condor]

[slow marsh]

Isn't it Whesper?

[limber lion]

It's okay Whispasrpyr, I'm sure they'll fix it soon

[slow marsh]

Whaspiyer

[vagrant bison]

do you still use shiv during fok spam?

[slow marsh]

use shiv on cd

[hollow escarp]

yep

[balmy condor]

Fok spam

[hollow escarp]

that as well

[low girder]

it's pretty clearly WhYdOnTyOuReAdThEpInSpYr

[hollow escarp]

hey, if you spam 4 foks, you might get 4 combo points

[slow marsh]

maybe

[low girder]

1 cp on sire adds

the most sad feeling

[outer lodge]

[hollow escarp]

that's why I keep vanish for ads

[low girder]

ye but the later ones

[vagrant bison]

i don't get the joke

[hollow escarp]

who am I kidding? I never had a Sire pull

[balmy condor]

We don’t spam fok

Cause fok is an awful ability

[subtle tundra]

i love subt on sire

[limber lion]

We are anti-spammers.

[vagrant bison]

yes but in multi target

[balmy condor]

That does negative damage

[vagrant bison]

to generate cp, no?

[balmy condor]

Yeh

In 4+

It’s only existence is cp

[vagrant bison]

well yes, i havent specified the scenario, mb

[balmy condor]

We used to spam it in 8.3

[vagrant bison]

is shiv still worth at 4 targets? it looks like a wasted global

[balmy condor]

It is

[hollow escarp]

it buffs nature damage

on that target

you are gonna lose it anyway

[limber lion]

Imagine if Shiv was a self-buff instead of a targeted debuff

[hollow escarp]

if you don't use it

[limber lion]

[hollow escarp]

that's what I dreamed about Vendetta

when I started playing sin

[strange python]

Necro Sin / Should i run Heirmir / Well Place Steel on Mythic Council, or Emeni w/ double potency?

[grand echo]

Tried my first m+ as assa with zoldyck, been playing outlaw till now in m+. Felt pretty good with decent dps even when I played like shit. Well would love that gouge.

[wise gull]

@limber lion my man really got the #1 sire parse on his first kill

[limber lion]

Heirmir with Sudden Fractures most likely.

[wise gull]

[balmy condor]

Heirmir gemstone sudden fractures

[strange python]

ty

[limber lion]

Told you I would.

[hollow escarp]

grats @limber lion

CT 3rd damage dealer

[limber lion]

Nothing to see here

[hollow escarp]

I mean

better than boss moving out of PB

[limber lion]

But to be fair it's 270k on Sire

[hollow escarp]

more than half

[limber lion]

It's more than half of the damage on Sire

Yeh

[low girder]

did you run EP/vigor with it too

[limber lion]

Yep

[low girder]

ah

[limber lion]

I would have ran EP/Vig even with PB

[low girder]

i'm just taking CT over PB atm

[limber lion]

I'm 100% sure that EP/Vig is the play on Sire.

[low girder]

EP/vigor is a lot more behind for me

[vagrant bison]

its a significant dmg gain on ST ( talking about m plus)? i Still struggle to use it in single target

[low girder]

on ST

need better stats

[limber lion]

It sims a lot better for cleave

[hollow escarp]

I actually learned to always question what talents might be better on some fights based on your logs @limber lion

[limber lion]

And 2T

[low girder]

yeah but i only really cleave in p2

[limber lion]

Yeah pretty much.

[low girder]

whereas CT with zoldyck is basically equal with PB in execute

[limber lion]

I like to push as much damage as possible

Without PI

[low girder]

with all the movement

[limber lion]

PI is for scrubs

We don't like them.

[limber lion]

Yeh, this was the main reason I chose CT

Not because I wanted to pad

But because I wanted to get the p3 mechanics down first

[low girder]

yeah CT is the play regardless

imo

[hollow escarp]

I got PI on most of my pulls today and I wasn't expecting to notice it that much

but I asked our priest to stop doing it

[limber lion]

But then I kinda stuck with it after playing with it for over 100 pulls

[limber lion]

Good man.

[low girder]

although ngl CT with deeper

[limber lion]

As long as you're not the one asking for PI's, I think it's fair game.

[low girder]

pretty

[hollow escarp]

he also PI-ed me 25 sec before a vendetta once

[limber lion]

[burnt star]

Wait so c.t

U use it like on m+

[low girder]

think m+ on a boss

[burnt star]

Keep it up outside of shiv window

[limber lion]

Ye. Outside of Shiv windows on single target.

[low girder]

yeah

it's really nice in p2

and better in p1 and p3

[burnt star]

I was thinking of that too

[low girder]

so may as well

[hollow escarp]

it's just a bit lower than PB on single target, so on fights with ads, it's probably worth it

[low girder]

for me it's -19 for CT in execute

[burnt star]

Progging on p2 right now. And man we move a lot

[low girder]

you combine that with all the p3 movement

i'm pretty sure it's just better

with zoldyck*

[limber lion]

Yeah

[low girder]

the gap's a bit larger if you run doomblade

[limber lion]

It doesn't lose value from movement

[burnt star]

Cant look at log now. Did u use zoldyc?

[low girder]

cev ran doomblade

[limber lion]

You can proc a poison bomb whilst the boss is moving and you lose more than the 19 dps.

[hollow escarp]

zoldyck

[limber lion]

Yeh, Doomblade gang. :p

[hollow escarp]

^

[low girder]

i got told to focus on execute

so, rip

[burnt star]

I mean. We pump on st target

[limber lion]

I was still #1 in P3 on most of our pulls

[burnt star]

U probly first dps on boss in p1?

[limber lion]

Our SP suddenly pulled his weight

And topped me

But we both did around 6.3k

Even though SP should be doing like 7k+

And he said that himself as well

[hollow escarp]

pretty sure if rogue is top dps in P1, they wouldn't kill the boss

[limber lion]

Yeah no

I was like #10 in P1 lol

[low girder]

even on boss dmg you're not really gonna beat the warlock in p1

unless you're double vendetta-ing

but that's padding

[limber lion]

Yeh, can't do that

[fleet anchor]

Kinda hard to compare though since it's replacing Envenoms

[limber lion]

Yeh exactly.

Or just be an OG and play Dashing with PB

[low girder]

lol

[limber lion]

Revolutionize the meta

I don't like the FoK padders though

[hollow escarp]

open with ambush and get rank 1 Sludgefist

[limber lion]

That take HB

[hollow escarp]

[fleet anchor]

But yeah like

[burnt star]

wait u actualy read wrong

[fleet anchor]

PB is not gonna be super amazing in P3 because of all the movement, so it's hard to say

[burnt star]

im not saying p1 damage overal

[limber lion]

Yeh

[burnt star]

im saying bosss dps only

so no add

[limber lion]

That was the main reason as to why I chose CT

[hollow escarp]

ohh

[limber lion]

And I just stuck with it.

[low girder]

same, but again it's a much easier decision if you're not running doomblade

[limber lion]

Yeh there's that too as well

[low girder]

on rekills i'll probably run doomblade

and not take CT

[limber lion]

For Zoldyck it seems like an obvious choice

[low girder]

at least for a bit

once it's smooth i'll swap to EP/CT lol

[limber lion]

And Doomblade loses some value as well from using CT

[low girder]

maybe we kill it tonight if we're super good on the overlap

[limber lion]

Because you get less Envenoms

Kinda troll playing with CT + Doomblade tbh

But eh, works fine.

[fleet anchor]

Doomblade gains from CT iirc so I think it's fairly neutral in that regard

[hollow escarp]

I might need to change faction to see that boss

[limber lion]

Yeah, true.

[fleet anchor]

PB was like 2.6% of my damage for "free" in P3

[limber lion]

Yeah well my CT was 8.4% but my Envenom was 10.09% as a sacrifice.

Your Envenom is probably closer to 16-19%

[fleet anchor]

18.75%

[limber lion]

Sheeeez

[fleet anchor]

Which is about what I'd expect based on sims

My PB was actually higher than expected.

[limber lion]

I was looking at Pass and his Envenom was only 16%

[fleet anchor]

It should only be like 2% lol

[limber lion]

Ah fair

[wise gull]

Do you think it's worth running EP/Vigor on prog? Or should I just stick with the usual BS/DS?

[burnt star]

wait your ct is higher then what u said and envenom lower 😉 cev

[fleet anchor]

Think he was talking about P3 specifically

[limber lion]

Yep

[burnt star]

ahhhhhhh

😉

[wise gull]

cursed emoji

[burnt star]

let me erase that then

out of shame

[wise gull]

good

[hollow escarp]

no

keep it

so we will never forget

[wise gull]

I want to forget already

[burnt star]

i mean the picture

[limber lion]

I'm an EP/Vig gamer.

[burnt star]

😉

[limber lion]

I mean they're pretty close

But Ep/Vig gets a lot more value in P2

Compared to BS/DS

If all you care about is P3 then BS/DS is probs better.

[burnt star]

when did u guy lust in p3 (for melee)?

[fleet anchor]

I mean at the end of the day CT vs. PB is probably only like -1.5% in ST.. I'd generally advise just running PB for P3 until you're happy with your guild's DPS push but on the other hand for most groups it probably doesn't matter.

[limber lion]

Yeh that's true and it's one button less to press

Especially if you're swapping from Outlaw to Assa for Sire or something then it's easier to just stick to PB.

[fleet anchor]

Then again, we did have a 0% wipe once so

[limber lion]

And playing with talents that you're comfortable with is probably a bigger dps increase than using "slightly better" talents but not using them optimally.

A lot of people complaining about DS and how they do less dps than with Vigor.

Like, just play Vigor if you get better results.

[fleet anchor]

probably if I were to pick anything though

Most likely you'd gain more ST in P3 from going to Blindside over EP than to PB.. But I'd need to check

[limber lion]

Yeh almost certainly, wouldn't be surprised.

Especially if running Zoldyck where the difference between CT/PB is even smaller.

Blindside is great for such a long execute phase.

[fleet anchor]

Yeah looks like EP is -3.2%

In execute range

CT is -1.5%

[limber lion]

8:30 which is around after the second Blood Price.

[fleet anchor]

For execute

[limber lion]

I'm giga trolling

But we didn't really have any trouble with P3 dps

So it's fine.

When we had a pull with everyone alive, the boss died.

[vital haven]

with these gear levels as long as everyone survives

its a kill ez

[limber lion]

But there's quite a few Assa logs where they do less than 6k in p3

[fleet anchor]

Our kills have been pretty fast, it's just bringing in new people has lead to slower kills so I'm probably gonna put off parse attempts for a few more weeks

[limber lion]

Yeh with new people it's better to play it safe

[fleet anchor]

Until the whole team is more comfortable anyway

[limber lion]

Unless you want to progress it for 100 more pulls again

:p

[gleaming viper]

guys, can we use cloak for avoid knockback on denathrius mythic ?

[fleet anchor]

Our actual kills have been like 9:53

Not really very close at all

[limber lion]

Damn

[limber lion]

No

[fleet anchor]

It's physical because reasons

[gleaming viper]

ty

[limber lion]

Mirror realm is jank

[wise gull]

What are the best uses of cloak?

Blood price?

[fleet anchor]

probably a sketchy blood price yeah

[limber lion]

Yeah or for the last overlap by running in to the red stuff in the floor

Ravage

That's the one

[wise gull]

gotcha

[fleet anchor]

I might Fleshcraft the 3rd Blood Price tonight pogggers.. if I remember to Fleshcraft

Which I won't

[gleaming viper]

@limber lion im dead from ravage with cloak

[limber lion]

😄 one day

[fleet anchor]

Cloak doesn't work on Ravage

It's also physical

[limber lion]

Not tanking the ravage cast

But using the cloak to stand on the red stuff

That's on the floor

After ravage.

[fleet anchor]

yes

Cloak will keep you from dying when you Cheat Death

[wise gull]

I'm scared of the last shattering + massacre combo

[fleet anchor]

from the other stuff lol

[limber lion]

Yeh that's the hardest part of the fight tbh

[fleet anchor]

Just do what Rogues have to do and press every survival button at the same time

and MAYBE you will survive

[limber lion]

It's quite close to the kill at that point and people start to panic

[limber lion]

[thorny pond]

Fient + Flesh?

[fleet anchor]

While the Paladins are just like lololol

[limber lion]

• Health stone and potions

[fleet anchor]

Look at me standing in everything

Aren't I cool

[limber lion]

Paladin's are dank

They can just bubble themselves and bop their partner on Sludge

To get rid of chains

[fleet anchor]

Step 1) Me thinking Paladins are safe to step to since they don't get knocked back

Step 2) Die anyway because the Paladin is standing in a triple Massacre like a boss

[nimble tartan]

tfw i get bop so im chillin

[wise gull]

Does deaths advance stop the knockback for DK?

[nimble tartan]

it does

[ruby birch]

evasion the massacre

[fleet anchor]

Dude

Evasion should like

Reduce Physical damage taken by 90% or some shit

[limber lion]

FROM ALL DIRECTIONS

[ruby birch]

95%

[limber lion]

I hate how it's only from the front as well

[wise gull]

you could do something like shadowstep the DK on the overlap then, yeah?

[limber lion]

It's the dumbest thing

If you get hit by a physical ability that's aoe

unlucky

[fleet anchor]

Funny enough, I think the best luck I've had with a Shadowstep target is the person with Fatal Finnese

Since I know they are actually running out

[limber lion]

That's actually pretty giga

[fleet anchor]

And not being tryhards dodging Massacres by 1 pixel

Shadowstep is so damn disorienting too 😦

Knockback + Shadowstep and my camera decides to just spaz

Takes me a while to even figure out where the hell I ended up lol

[wise gull]

Shadowstepping a DK with deaths advance seems pretty safe there

[fleet anchor]

Yeah probably

[limber lion]

Yeah, good luck dodging the last few massacres when your camera is still spinning around

[vital haven]

i hate shadowstep dude

[fleet anchor]

Our tank suggested a 2000 IQ move

he's like

[limber lion]

I love Shadowstep, but I think we should have 2 of them like Sub does.

[fleet anchor]

"Why don't you two Rogues Shadowstep each other and see what happens?" 🤣

[limber lion]

[wise gull]

also what the fuck is orgrimmar

[plain thistle]

I shadowstep my dk too

[wise gull]

i already feel lost

[nimble tartan]

i just set down my flag in a safe spot and shadowstep to it

[wise gull]

i've been an alliance baby all my life

[fleet anchor]

Honestly I've always wanted a glyph that is like

"Shadowstep is ground targeted"

[vital haven]

i suggested to my rogue buddy kind of in jest @fleet anchor to shadowstep at the same to sludge in sludge prog if we are both linkked

[limber lion]

"Shadowstep is an instant grappling hook now"

[vital haven]

he didnt wanna go for it lmao

[limber lion]

"Shadowstep is Shimmer"

[fleet anchor]

haha

[limber lion]

Shadowstep could be an instant Door of Shadows

[plain thistle]

"dont kill me please" every try tho

[fleet anchor]

Honestly I think you actually can Shadowstep back to Sludge now as long as he is faced the right way

[vital haven]

ye

the link is big enough now

[limber lion]

Yeh

[fleet anchor]

But the facing is still sketch

[limber lion]

Shadowstep is 12yrd, the link is 15 iirc

[vital haven]

and the circle is small enough as well

[fleet anchor]

Because you know on some pull

The tank is gonna be like "TIME TO SPIN"

😄

[limber lion]

[vital haven]

i know the answer is to git gud but on xymox when you are getting pulled in

and you shadowstep

and you are all disoriented

[fleet anchor]

Step 1) Tank faces him to the center

[hollow escarp]

it's fun when you shadowstep and the boss turns on Xymox

[vital haven]

and sometimes the direction you shadowstep is the same as the direction of the pull iun

[hollow escarp]

haahah

[fleet anchor]

Step 2) You Shadowstep and you are facing the center of the room

Step 3) Gain run speed bonus from Shadowstep

[hollow escarp]

happens all the time

[vital haven]

and you die man

[fleet anchor]

Step 4) End up closer to the center of the room than you started

[vital haven]

fucking hell

[hollow escarp]

neah, you instant turn

I never died to shadowstepping the boss

while facing center

I died to carrying seeds though

[fleet anchor]

I've definitely gotten pulled further middle by stepping

[limber lion]

Okay sleepy time, still got a massive headache. Maybe I can sleep for more than 3 hours this night. :p

[fleet anchor]

Depending on latency and facing

[limber lion]

Good night boys

[vital haven]

gn cev

[hollow escarp]

night Cev

[fleet anchor]

Generally I try not to use step until the last second

As a last resort

Sprint is usually fine

[hollow escarp]

I also sprint to the end

after I get some boost from shaman totem

[vital haven]

meanwhile

hook is like god ez mode

[fleet anchor]

Yeah Totem+Sprint should be enough

[hollow escarp]

I remember night fae on Xymox, such good times

[fleet anchor]

Or Roar

Yeah Night Fae is just cheating on suck

ezmode

[vital haven]

if you start channeling door

while you get sucked in

[hollow escarp]

first time I died on Sire HC was after I swapped from NF to venthyr

not enough stacks

[fleet anchor]

haha

Yeah I almost did that the other day

I'm like "3 is fine"

o wait

3 not fine

panic

😄

[vital haven]

does the cast get cancelled because the range is exceeded

[hollow escarp]

to clarify, "first time" I died to cleansing stacks

[fleet anchor]

@vital haven one thing I did notice on Sludge though. I'm not actually sure Shadowstep isn't kinda buggy with chains though. Because I fan-fingered Shadowstep and broke a chain the other day, but he was facing the "correct" way and my partner really shouldn't have been far enough to break it. And it broke instantly. Was kinda confusing.

[vital haven]

hmm

thats interesting

[fleet anchor]

Gonna measure the x/y positions later and see

[timid coral]

!oil

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[slow marsh]

What stats should I put on master assassin for the m+ NS mfd build @balmy condor

or anyone else who plays that

[limber lion]

Haste/Vers

[lilac sparrow]

What happens to shadow grasp totem?

[slow marsh]

Cool I wasn't sure if it was worth at all to do haste mastery

[dawn ivy]

shadowgrasp totem was found to benefit from haste so it had to be resimmed

its been a good trinket the whole time (i think)

[slow marsh]

I think it only got good after buffs

The damage buffs that went through for a bunch of trinks

[stoic needle]

no, it was always good, it just wasn't simming correctly

[slow marsh]

ah nice

[gusty mirage]

@stoic needle

shadowgrasp in a 18 top

[honest lake]

THere is a reason to use dreadfire over skulker even when skulker sim higher?

[drifting cloud]

it shouldnt be simming higher

do you have double on use?

[low girder]

even double on use it should still sim higher

[drifting cloud]

because sim always uses the trinket in your first slot first

[fleet anchor]

Top gear does both combos typically

For on use

[honest lake]

I have a 226 skulker vs a 220 dreadfire

[timid coral]

skulker's will make you teleport, sometimes requires you to move out a bit before it will trigger, and takes some extra attention with positioning to make sure it doesn't trigger on an unintended target

[low girder]

oh, well in that case

[timid coral]

depending on how close the difference is, these things might be enough of a downside to use dreadfire anyway

[fleet anchor]

But a Mythic Skulkers could be better than Heroic Dreadfire

[low girder]

yeah if you're talking mythic vs heroic

that isn't weird

[stoic needle]

not bad

[low girder]

only real reason is things where it could fuck you and pick something else

ie SLG

or council

actually

[shell cloak]

ey guys while on the subject.. is there a simple way for me to sim and see all trinket values? or must i equip/unequip relog and run simcraft each combo?

all slot values for that matter, not necessarily just trinket

[main forge]

Raidbots + simcraft string

[low girder]

yeah get the simc addon

and type /simc in game

paste that into top gear

[shell cloak]

aight i'll get the addon and have a play, cheers ol/

[low girder]

https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/simulationcraft

[shell cloak]

got it working already mate, i knew there would be a simple fix figured it'd be my best bet to ask you guys here

[low girder]

nice

[shell cloak]

okay raidbots was the website i remember using that in MoP, i can just use my ingame copy with that?

https://tenor.com/view/hello-old-people-computer-technology-biff-gif-12085559

😂

[low girder]

yeah paste it into the top gear section

and then you can pick whatever items you want to sim from your bags

[viral vigil]

Ok so im finally goign and reading all the new soulbidn stuff... Korayn seems to once against be busted for multitarget???

Night Fae return to grace????

[shell cloak]

cheers Juan 🙂

[stoic needle]

the heirmir one seems pretty crazy for multitarget

korayn is just a 5% damage buff for 10s every 1 min

doesn't seem that amazing to me but maybe i'm underestimating it

depends on if it has an ICD

[shell cloak]

@stoic needle could you direct link please so i can have a read 🙂

[stoic needle]

https://ptr.wowhead.com/news/spell-soulbind-and-class-changes-for-patch-9-1-ptr-build-38312-321828

[indigo mulch]

Vampire rogue is the only true rogue though.

[odd hazel]

until proven to be good, im staying venth because i just switched lmao

[indigo mulch]

I mean i only raid on my rogue so swapping to necro isent really an option for me i suppose.

[viral vigil]

Venth is honestly probs still very strong for ST. Esp since Nadja is basically if you're stated right Haste into Vers after a Euphoria

[indigo mulch]

Dosent it take your highest secondary stat? That should prob be crit no?

o:

[odd hazel]

its crit or verse

[indigo mulch]

Witch ever was highest

[odd hazel]

which if you have that much verse

wow

[indigo mulch]

Fatal Flaw When the Haste effect of Euphoria ends, gain 10 sec sec of either 20% increased critical strike chance or Versatility, whichever you currently have more of.

So 99% of the time its more crit i just assume people have way more crit than vers as assassination

[main forge]

I enjoy soulshape too much and sepsis is really easy to use. so staying night fae, plus I enjoyed the story thus far with it.

[odd hazel]

i mean

flag is very easy

just use it on CD and use your rotation

[indigo mulch]

Pretty much

lol

[odd hazel]

only one that requires any thought is SBS

not sure on kyrian

because

ew

[main forge]

kyrian does too... but I think it's only good for outlaw?

[stoic needle]

might be more competitive now with the literal 12% agi buff

[indigo mulch]

Venthyr is still going to be the go to 😦

[odd hazel]

the crit is to good to pass up

especailly 20%

[shell cloak]

say wat 12% agi from what a torghast buff? 😛

[odd hazel]

now

[main forge]

I went sub after the first month playing sin and not getting buffs and being bottom of the dps with nothing to bring to raid.... So between Sub and Sin.... Night Fae is still a decent choice.

[odd hazel]

i doubt it'll actually matter to the point you cant pick a certain cov and be competitive

[indigo mulch]

I mean unless your the top 1% it dosent really matter what you play tbh.

lol

[odd hazel]

^

[main forge]

actually best choice imo... especially now that I might be going meta and trying to learn outlaw >_> I really enjoy Sin the most though.

[odd hazel]

i mean

[indigo mulch]

But if you wanna min max then sure you prob have to play venthyr for raids.

[odd hazel]

sin can perform just fine

[indigo mulch]

Unless they add some crazy ass legendary for one of the covenants

[odd hazel]

the necro mage one

is nuts

[shell cloak]

indeed at least they're all (if not a few) close enough to not feel like we HAVE to switch, some class/specs got it hard

[odd hazel]

outlaw is the really only one i feel like it makes a HUGE difference.

[main forge]

It's not like we have a Convoke... Which cov you play isn't going to be the issue.

[indigo mulch]

I would actually embrace the necro rogue though

Imagian being sin necro for dungeons 😦

so gud

[shell cloak]

yeah and outlaw dps can vary so much per pack depending on your RtB buffs? so surely nobody would reroll cov for such a minor boost considering how the spec is built out

nvm they definitely would, i retract aha

[main forge]

I sadly prefer Sub rouge for dungeons... multiple stuns via shadow dance is just too sweet.

[odd hazel]

i mean

outlaw has 3 stuns.

without stealth

[main forge]

damn... I really don't know how outlaw works lol.

[odd hazel]

i'd sacrifice a stun for a AoE stun tbh

[shell cloak]

yeah sub is definitely my favourite spec but definitely the worst feeling for dungeons 😛 i'd never trade a 5p evisc for utility 🤮

[slow marsh]

heirmir looking real sexy tbh

[main forge]

yeah... i'd kill for a leg sweep or something. should be a talent for an AOE stun instead of the free cheap shot.

[shell cloak]

@main forge if you press blade flurry and utilize gouge as much as possible you're good to go 🙂

[odd hazel]

yes but thats not an AoE stun

[wide elbow]

is snapshoting still a thing in sin ?