assassination

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[fleet whale]

you can get saps out of dance too

that's more of a high iq arena play though

[strange python]

ya

can use to for d or o

can come in clutch depending on where you use it

[royal lantern]

yeha but thats pvp

and pvp is pvp

aka:dirt

[strange python]

lulz

no

agree to disagree

[balmy condor]

(And sub)

[strange python]

pvp is fun

but we can all get along

[royal lantern]

no

[strange python]

unlike those crazy outlaws

[royal lantern]

my opinions>your opinion

[strange python]

listen here you fox fuck

[royal lantern]

[strange python]

(:

was actually suprised at how hard PvE is at high levels

just started getting into it more

[royal lantern]

what did you expect lol

[strange python]

easy and dumb

haha

like the old expansions

[royal lantern]

ik that there are many pvp only bigbrains that alway say "PVP IS THE ONLY ENDGAME,PVE IS EASY"

[strange python]

well old pve was brutally boring

just spamming tab

not even dodging anything

[royal lantern]

but you can also just say "pvp at the end is always playing against the same 3 comps and everyone is rolling the same OP for this patch class all the time"

[strange python]

deff like where PvE is now

with all the stuff to dodge

haha ya

basically you choose a flex path for endgame

cosmetics, m+, raid, or pvp

then you can say i am ranked xxx

or your mog sucks

and flex on people

ezclap

[urban thistle]

#assassination in 2020

[fleet whale]

i mean assassination was the spec

for over half of 2020

[urban thistle]

Doesn't mean I can't still make fun of it

[fleet whale]

i'm gonna top meters as assassination in SL

by running illegal scripts that will let me press abilities faster than possible

[urban thistle]

[low girder]

some of us like specs that don't require playing piano in the opener

[strange python]

mozart bitch

[bold tendon]

damn sin is like 600 dps back?

😦

[balmy condor]

Somewhere around there

600 seems a little low

But ye

[strange python]

what are they at now?

[balmy condor]

What are what at now

[low girder]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[strange python]

sub dps

[fleet whale]

it's past both sub and outlaw

if you use my illegal scrips

[low girder]

sin is allowed to have corruption back

ez

[balmy condor]

Subs sitting at like 3700-3800 for prog

Sin is like 3050ish

[strange python]

ohhh i get the spreadsheets now

[rotund mauve]

God I hope they buff us a little bit

[strange python]

damn

[rotund mauve]

Like I don’t need to be the best class and spec

[strange python]

wait aren't we getting kinda innacurate sims rn with prepatch?

[rotund mauve]

Just make it a little better

[low girder]

we'll get something, i'd put money on that

these are SL sims

[strange python]

ah

[balmy condor]

These are shadowlands sims yeah

[rotund mauve]

Why did they have to remove toxic blade that’s what ruined it

[balmy condor]

I mean it’s coming back

[rotund mauve]

My rotation feels empty

[low girder]

we get it back at 58

[fallow otter]

It is empty

[balmy condor]

And alacrity is honestly better in its place

[fallow otter]

Sin is trash rn

Fact

[rotund mauve]

Shiv isn’t the same as TB and you know it

[strange python]

i have been killing it in preseason

like 90% wr

[rotund mauve]

Sin isn’t trash

[fallow otter]

Yes it is

[rotund mauve]

It’s pretty much dead center of the dps charts

[low girder]

it does less initial dmg but it's basically the same. the only real issue with it is our "utility" dispel attached

[balmy condor]

Well the kit isn’t much better

If we’re talking m+ for example

[fleet whale]

we have less utility than sub and outlaw

[balmy condor]

It’s strictly worse than the other 2

[rotund mauve]

It’s putting out the most average damage of all the dps classes

[royal lantern]

gotta love how people always cried that sublety is trash 10/10 unplayable garbage,needs a rework

[low girder]

10% would have it below sub still on ST btw

[rotund mauve]

In raids it still does more than Outlaw

[royal lantern]

then it got number changes and close too none gameplay changes

[balmy condor]

Yeah 10% probably isn’t enough

[royal lantern]

suddenly its THE BEST ROGUE SPEC, TRUE ROGUES PLAY SUBLETY ITS SO MUCH FUN

[fleet whale]

sub had some nice SL changes though

a baseline aoe finisher

[balmy condor]

The hivemind moves tryan xD

[low girder]

i've been a sub fanboi since wod lol

[fleet whale]

removing the nightblade damage amp

[royal lantern]

black powder was the biggest change

[low girder]

it just hasn't been playable for a while

[fleet whale]

longer dance duration

[royal lantern]

i mean, the nightblade thing is not that big

[fleet whale]

it's nice to be able to swap to weak adds though

and not have to put on a dot

[royal lantern]

cus keeping rupture and SnD up is ~the same time you spend keeping stuff up, then it was with nightblades

[fleet whale]

nightblade duration was also way too short

[low girder]

the bigger thing is not having dmg boost attached

[balmy condor]

Varo back to red

[fallow otter]

There is nothing to do for our patch sin

[balmy condor]

[low girder]

for quick add swaps

[fallow otter]

No buttons

[fleet whale]

blue doesn't look nice

[strange python]

haha i never liked sub

[fleet whale]

with my doomslayer pic

[low girder]

but yeah by and large the changes were small

[strange python]

expect for like classic when you could 1shot ambush

[balmy condor]

Welcome home friend

[fleet whale]

and yeah i'll just be the underdog

[royal lantern]

im too lazy too change color

like

[fleet whale]

top meters anyway

[royal lantern]

it doesnt matter lol

[fleet whale]

show off how big my dick is

compared to sub players with micro penises

[strange python]

luckily we have a ton of new blood so we should still get raid/m+ slots from the volume of games

[low girder]

just be blue for like 4+ years

[balmy condor]

It matters to me

[low girder]

then you never have to change

[strange python]

sin = massive futa dong

fact

[fleet whale]

the Chad Sin rogue

vs the Virgin fel hammer Sub rogues

[balmy condor]

I remember I went blue for like 2 hours

And it was pretty bad

[fallow otter]

Sin = take away our utility and make it dps

Toxic

[balmy condor]

And still do less dps

[fleet whale]

yeah why didn't they just make TB a baseline ability

why did they tie it to shiv lol

[fallow otter]

Vanish

Shiv

......

[balmy condor]

Well if you look at between the eyes, that’s a stun right, so it makes sense that shiv is Tb as well

Right.....

[fleet whale]

bte aint' a stun

anymore

[balmy condor]

Issa joke varo

[fallow otter]

Joke ruined

[fleet whale]

i mean if you play sin

[fallow otter]

Actually I take that back

[fleet whale]

that's like easy 99 parses for nathria

[fallow otter]

It was 2 jokes

[fleet whale]

and you can look good

[low girder]

abuse the thunderfury bug

while you can

[balmy condor]

What if I play sin and still only parse blue

[low girder]

look good as sin with tfury's

[fleet whale]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/dalaran/dalthuran?zone=8&new=true#difficulty=4&spec=Assassination

just look at my hfc assassin parses

fun times playing a weak spec but getting all oranges

(Ignore Hellfire assault, it's impossible to parse on that boss as any spec)

[low girder]

you could parse as combat, you just had to tell your hunters to fuck off

and mages i guess

[fleet whale]

i feel like most people didn't even care about Hellfire assault parses

cause it was basically just glorified trash

[low girder]

prolly not

and by hunters i meant warlocks

[fallow otter]

How are your parses now varo

[fleet whale]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/sargeras/varolyn#difficulty=4&partition=-1

alright but nothing special

[balmy condor]

Look good to me

[fleet whale]

note this is heroic, i didn't raid mythic past the first three bosses

[low girder]

that reminds me i need to talk to kihra to get my log history fixed lol. i namechanged in prepatch and it all died

[fleet whale]

also i couldn't really take advantage of full corruption since my guild basically stopped raiding in june

[fallow otter]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/thaurissan/stunkei#partition=-1

Looks like my mythic page

Lol

I have to try parse during sales so... Rip

Hivemind is double slappers

[fleet whale]

I had very good uldir parses, bad BDA parses, and pretty good EP parses but i was on a different server back then

my old guild really screwed my play in BDA, don't want to throw them under the bus but they did

[fallow otter]

Bfa?

[fleet whale]

dazar alor

[fallow otter]

Bod?

Ah ok

[fleet whale]

yeah

many of my guildies just really struggled with some of the raid mechanics

to the point where I, an assassination rogue, had to drop off the elemental thing in the back

in blockade

and that really tanked my dps

[fallow otter]

Yeah bod to parse you basically had to have your guild so the mechanics for you

We never do parse runs

So it's w/e

[fleet whale]

but i did well in every other bfa raid

but dazar alor did frustrate me a lot

[fallow otter]

Herod ye?

[fleet whale]

what's herod

[fallow otter]

Heroic

[fleet whale]

oh yeah heroic

[fallow otter]

Auto correct of champions

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/thaurissan/stunkei#partition=-1&difficulty=4

Heroic is pretty troll to parse

[fleet whale]

I have a hard time pushing myself to a true mythic guild even though i think i have the ability

i don't know if i can deal with the frustration that goes with it

[fallow otter]

Yeah

Find players that are the same level as you imo

[fleet whale]

there would also be a 0 percent chance that i would be able to play assassin

[fallow otter]

Then just see how far you can go

Why not

Ohhh you mean for sl?

Depends what level you at

[fleet whale]

It would be a hard sell

yes there were cutting edge sub rogues for N'zoth

but i guarantee most of those guys were in their guilds for a long time by that point

[royal lantern]

when you are in a guild for some time and prove too be good

its normal that a decent/good raidlead will just say that you can play w/e you want

[fallow otter]

Yeah we just play whatever we want, world 250

We just try and win horde oceanic first to keep the crown haha

[fleet whale]

Oceanic servers

the lone place where there are more alliance

[fallow otter]

Yup

[fleet whale]

I wonder how the oceanic servers

survived the horde hivemind

[fallow otter]

Look at us there in a sea of blue

[balmy condor]

[glad spruce]

because Honestly was alliance and all the other guilds moved to be on the same server and it brought everyone there

[fallow otter]

Yup

[fleet whale]

I want to say during like WoD there were very high ranking horde Oceanic guilds

[fallow otter]

Honestly is high

[glad spruce]

When did Ethical move across

[fallow otter]

Not that long ago, used to run keys with some of those boys

[fleet whale]

well it was Ascension in WoD

but now they are alliance lol

used to be horde

[fallow otter]

They renamed

Iirc

[glad spruce]

yeah Ethical is 16th world as well. If you want to raid or find OCE m+ you be fm ally

[dense cedar]

OCE horde

[fleet whale]

so is oce warmode

just alliance everywhere?

[glad spruce]

yes

[fallow otter]

It's rip

Can't do it

[dense cedar]

Horde on warmode on exist in one capacity

5 man groups

[glad spruce]

when its call to arms we get US players storming OCE realms just to find ally players lol

[dense cedar]

I basically never seen Horde on wm unless they are partied up to do dailies and world quests

[fleet whale]

i had warmode on briefly in Icecrown, horde surrounded every rare

i guess it's the opposite in OCE lol

[dense cedar]

Oh

Actually

[fallow otter]

We doin our best to fly the horde oceanic flag lol

[dense cedar]

Horde existed a bit more during Icecrown on wm

[glad spruce]

at this point stunkei its like

why

[dense cedar]

I saw a couple times that a lot of max geared horde showed up on wm

[fallow otter]

We pretty casual compared to ethical and honestly

[dense cedar]

to kill the 80 ilvl altsl lol

[fleet whale]

i do think that oceanic having more top end alliance players

shows that no faction is neccessarily

better than another, as far as racials go

[fallow otter]

We all got too much gold and toons to move web

[glad spruce]

alliance is just better varo

there is just too many people on horde to make it worth moving

[fleet whale]

I wish alliance was better, or at least even on US 😦

it looked like dwarf racial was gonna be good in nathria

but blizz nerfed that

[glad spruce]

there is a reason that 90% of the m+ comps in mdi are ally

[fleet whale]

yeah ally racials are strong

[glad spruce]

surely recruitment is getting harder by the day

[dense cedar]

Shadowmeld is very fun for m+

[fleet whale]

if his guild is a solid roster with a stable core

they may not need to recruit much

[fallow otter]

People transfer to our server to join if needed and we just merged

[glad spruce]

yeah I guess being top OCE horde guild has its benefits. Even then top horde is 8th place in overall OCE

do you find it limits your available raid comps

[fallow otter]

It's not too bad, like I said we casual compared to honestly

So we just make it work

We took 4 rogues to nzoth

For example

As you can see I had no loot luck haha

Never do

You oce Web?

[dense cedar]

everyone is oce now

[fallow otter]

Lol

[glad spruce]

yeah im oce, played a mage for bfa and i've finally got a melee spot

[raven acorn]

Looking to maybe roll an Assassination Rogue for Shadowlands. Is Assassination considered a fairly low skill cap spec?

[balmy condor]

Yes

[rotund mauve]

I requires not having arthritis in your fingers.

[balmy condor]

But it’s so weak right now that I wouldn’t suggest assassination

[rotund mauve]

I feel like it’s about the same difficulty as sub just a little easier to manage cds

Roast me if you must

[raven acorn]

So its not difficult at all? Im looking for something that requires some thought to play. But it seems like Assassination is just a better feral druid

[balmy condor]

Just maintain everything

And that’s basically it

[rotund mauve]

It’s not mindless it’s all about keeping all your bleeds up at the same time

[balmy condor]

It gets a little tricky for some people in aoe

[rotund mauve]

It’s easier in raids harder in mythical

[balmy condor]

But single target can hardly be considered thoughtful

[rotund mauve]

Yeh it took me a while to get the aoe in mythics down

[raven acorn]

I mained Shadow Priest in Legion and that was the last time i played and i really enjoyed the gameplay of that but they apparently changed it to where voidform isnt exactly something you build into anymore

[rotund mauve]

Bruh like I want as many people on rogue as possible but shadow priest is too good not to play in shadowlands

[balmy condor]

Sin doesn’t build into anything either

[rotund mauve]

Their dps is nuts

[raven acorn]

I dont think anything has that playstyle in Shadowlands

But feral was what i was leaning towards but people said ass was basically the same thing just better

Ill be looking at doing mostly M+s

[balmy condor]

Oh

Lmao

Yeah you’re in the wrong channel for that buddy

Outlaw has more utility and does legit 30% more damage

Sin atm is really really poorly tuned

[light jacinth]

Whomst pinged me

[balmy condor]

Like bad enough to where pugs probably won’t take you if they realize you’re sin and not outlaw

[light jacinth]

@dense cedar

[dense cedar]

?

idk what u mean

[light jacinth]

[frail fossil]

how's the coping season going ?

[raven acorn]

Is there any spec in shadowlands that has the ramp play style I'm looking for?

Or that's basically gone?

[balmy condor]

Pretty much gone

It’s either sin feral shadow or aff

[frail fossil]

Affli yeah

[balmy condor]

We’re at grief

[frail fossil]

it's ok whispyr

cant win em all

[raven acorn]

Is the spec fun?

[balmy condor]

Depends who you ask

Bait af question

[frail fossil]

which spec ?

sin ?

[lost horizon]

some people enjoy playing DH

[frail fossil]

i think sin is pretty fun

[lost horizon]

you gotta get your hands dirty to figure that out for yourself

[balmy condor]

Actually horrifyingly true

[frail fossil]

i think Affli is really fun tho

[lost horizon]

i'm pretty sure some people even like sin on ST

[frail fossil]

yo sin on st is dope ???

[balmy condor]

Woah okay

[frail fossil]

it's chill

u out here

[lost horizon]

wait lemme clarify, haste juiced it was actually nice

[balmy condor]

Thems fighting words

[frail fossil]

honestly

[lost horizon]

you remember uldir?

[frail fossil]

playing haste juiced was no that good

like playing with like 15/20% haste and then crit on 8.3

felt better

[lost horizon]

hasted w/exsang was great

[frail fossil]

imo

[balmy condor]

Uldir was great

[lost horizon]

love me some single ring azerite

[frail fossil]

idk didn't play uldir

[lost horizon]

and you only got to use 2 cause of reorigination array

[frail fossil]

but i heard the best trait was like the champion of azeroth generic or smth like that

fun shit

[fleet whale]

champion of azeroth is bait

because only one piece of gear had it

the chest piece from champion's of azeroth rep

[balmy condor]

Our best trait at the end of 8.3 was that one trait from warfronts

That only dropped at like ilvl 300

[fleet whale]

yeah, i consider all of those things bait

[balmy condor]

Yeah ofc

[frail fossil]

lmfaooo

[fleet whale]

because of limited they are and the really low ilvl

[balmy condor]

It’s omegabait

Champ of Azeroth was always a good trait that didn’t exist on gear you would never use

Was really weird

[fleet whale]

it was only on

[balmy condor]

“Oh my god this trait is so strong”

[fleet whale]

the very first azerite piece you got

[balmy condor]

“Where do I get it”

[fleet whale]

from magni

[balmy condor]

“You don’t”

[fleet whale]

and the rep chest piece

[raven acorn]

Sorry i honestly dont know anything about rogues. Ive never played one past like presquish level 40.

[fleet whale]

that was only like 355 ilvl

there is a wowhead guide that tells you the basics of all three specs

uhh i don't know how to link it

[balmy condor]

Issue is that you’re asking “is it fun”, which isn’t a question, it’s more like a scream into a void

If you go into a sin channel, and ask sin players, if the spec they chose to play, is fun

That’s problematic

[frail fossil]

lmfap

whispyr not playing

[raven acorn]

I guess im not realizing im not asking a fotm spec if its fun

Was the spec good in BFA?

[frail fossil]

yes

[raven acorn]

Or should i expect it to be dog all xpac

[frail fossil]

no

it's sin dude not feral druid

[balmy condor]

[frail fossil]

[balmy condor]

“What spec is best” clearly not updated

Don’t mind that

[frail fossil]

ooof

pain

will you play outlaw on raid at launch tho ?

[balmy condor]

I’d rather uninstall

[frail fossil]

lmfao

[balmy condor]

We either sin and suck, or sub and cry

[frail fossil]

lmfao

[fallow otter]

Can we rename #assassination to #affliction and just be done with it

[frail fossil]

lmfao

[balmy condor]

Rename to #deprecated

[grizzled jay]

#redacted

[frail fossil]

rename to #thebadspec

[lost horizon]

i hope you like your new crew

[frail fossil]

#subbutlessgood

based team tbh

[balmy condor]

Oh hell yeah

Survival mm and demo

All the homies back together

[frail fossil]

the gang is together again

[balmy condor]

Except arcane is like kinda good

[lost horizon]

yeah arcane got a scholarship and moved to the city

[frail fossil]

still giga awkward for a range to be in melee to aie

[fallow otter]

Demo like bis St atm

[lost horizon]

sub just tagged sin in

oh really? from actual testing or just sim comparison?

[frail fossil]

like arcane living the city life but u can still see it's an awkward countryside guy deep down

[balmy condor]

It’s like a prank where the twins switch lives for a day

Sub just wants to know what it feels like to be wanted

[frail fossil]

OOOF

[lost horizon]

day expansion*

fixed that for you

[balmy condor]

Gomenasai u rite

[lost horizon]

i don't even mind sin but

[lost horizon]

it's kind of oppressive

sub (or outlaw i guess) has to be pretty significantly ahead in damage before it's actually better than sin for prog

fuckingbleedsman

[frail fossil]

yeah

tha multidotters

sin dmg profile is really good for raids

sin is just giga awkward in m+

like u just out here fucked if your tank chain pulls

[lost horizon]

finisher based CDR hurts sub/outlaw for downtime compared to sin too

[frail fossil]

i think they should just remove bleeds

and u just press envenoms

that's it

[lost horizon]

tbh i don't mind when sin is just the ST bot

[frail fossil]

oh yeah

i enjoy sin the most on like 3 targets tho

[lost horizon]

rewards people being able to swap to outlaw for fights where it's better, or sub if that's the play

[frail fossil]

i kinda like bleed management

[lost horizon]

uldir balance was kinda cool, minus outlaw being ass

[frail fossil]

oof

[lost horizon]

sin on 2-3T is nice

[frail fossil]

but i agree with u

i think it's good that sometime u have to switch specs depending on the fight

i enjoyed doing that in ny'alotha

[halcyon oak]

Just will be more difficult in SL because of leggies and such

[frail fossil]

i mean like

[balmy condor]

You can craft them pretty quick

[frail fossil]

after a while prolly not lol

if u got the bank tho

because i am absolutely broke xd

[balmy condor]

Also much much easier to multi spec in shadowlands

Than in bfa

[halcyon oak]

hmmm

[frail fossil]

will feel weird having cloak and neck dropping again

[halcyon oak]

But conduits and leggies seem harder to change than essences

[balmy condor]

Essences weren’t what held you back from multi speccing

[frail fossil]

changing spec does not could as changing conduits

since like essences u have different set for each spec 🙂

and conduits drop no matter the loot spec

[balmy condor]

And legendaries are super easy to change

[frail fossil]

^

[balmy condor]

You just craft them

And equip them

[halcyon oak]

I've literally already forgotten about azerite armor

[balmy condor]

How much easier do you want

[frail fossil]

literally will be so much easier than before

[halcyon oak]

Well tbf there's a timegate on the crafting

[balmy condor]

I don’t really count 1-2 weeks for a legendary a time gate

[halcyon oak]

I do

[balmy condor]

Aight well that’s your problem then

Most people will have 2-3 legendaries crafted by the time real progression starts

[frail fossil]

lmfao like

[balmy condor]

Which is more than enough to play whatever spec you want however you want it

[frail fossil]

wow players will always find something co complain about

it is actually impressive

[halcyon oak]

I'm not complaining really I'm just stating a fact

[frail fossil]

like how easier can multispeccing get

than this

[balmy condor]

Every day I’m more convinced that people just want to play on a tournament realm with full bis, but everyone else doesn’t have dungeon gear

Just to feel like they’re better

[halcyon oak]

Yokes not at all I'm just saying there's time involved

[balmy condor]

Irrelevant time

Yes

[halcyon oak]

Okay

[balmy condor]

There’s time involved with everything you do in the game

[halcyon oak]

Thanks...

[balmy condor]

Any time

I got some bad takes too

[frail fossil]

literally when mythic week drops

[balmy condor]

Let me know if you want to hear some

[frail fossil]

you'll be able to craft 2 legendaries

or do u want your legendary to be there earlier so u can farm WQs more efficiently

[balmy condor]

But if I craft 2 legendaries, and only can equip 1

Can I cut them in half

And glue the pieces together

[viral silo]

^ asking the real questions

[balmy condor]

It’s not even like there’s a lot of thought going into the legendaries tbh

I’d say outlaw players got celerity, sub is pretty much set on finality, the 3 sin players in the world gonna go zoldyck

If you want to multi spec, pick another

If you don’t want to, pick a fun one

[lost horizon]

MA for multispec e z

[balmy condor]

Like uh

Tiny toxic

[frail fossil]

if u want the coolest name go dashing scoundrel

[low girder]

yeah i'll prolly go finality for sub and then MA to have something for the other two

in case something happens

though i'm still gonna sit until at least heroic week

[strange python]

70% of the game is flexing

[frail fossil]

i will go celerity but i wont craft until mythic week starts so well if sin got a buff i might go for another legendaries

[strange python]

how else are people supposed to know how much better you are then outgearing them

[balmy condor]

Quote me now, write it down, repeat after me

[frail fossil]

but at this point i am not very hopeful

[balmy condor]

sin. Buffs.

[frail fossil]

[low girder]

you'll get buffed

[frail fossil]

sin will stay asss

[balmy condor]

It’s happening

[low girder]

question is by how much

[balmy condor]

We’ll be viable

I’m sin main again

It’s happens

You pepeclown me now

[frail fossil]

sub got the late game dont worry

[balmy condor]

But just you wait till you’re the pepeclown

[frail fossil]

u got the scaling

[balmy condor]

With your time gated legendaries

That you won’t have

Because you picked 3 sub legendaries

And can’t wait a week

[frail fossil]

lmfao

[balmy condor]

Or something

Idk

I can’t have everything instantly and that makes me angry

Or whatever the argument is

[frail fossil]

if there's a sin buff on hc week

i will rename on discord in whatever u want

like SIN #1 SIMP or smth

[balmy condor]

Pog

All the power in the palm of my hand

[frail fossil]

tbh if sin get a buff all them smoothbrained sub rogues will see red lmfao

[balmy condor]

Idk

[frail fossil]

i think sin got a better raid damage profile tbh

[balmy condor]

I feel like sin playstyle is still too niche for the pepegas

60apm smash my face into the keyboard or else

How dare sin not use an ability every gcd

That crowd

Probably will stay away

[frail fossil]

sin feels amazing to play with like 15% to 20% haste imo

[lost horizon]

sin's great for the right circumstances

raidlead? great

folding laundry? solid pick

[balmy condor]

Hey I do both of those

[lost horizon]

hands covered in peanut butter? just use your elbows you'll be fine

[balmy condor]

That also happens

[lost horizon]

hopefully not at the same time

[frail fossil]

u can watch an anime and play sin at the same time

[lost horizon]

sure but if you're watching anime then you're probably playing sub

[balmy condor]

Sin is like the one spec where you aren’t doing something constantly

[lost horizon]

and macroing shadowdancetechnique /yells

[balmy condor]

And it still gets shit on

[lost horizon]

wow is a very slow paced game to begin with

[balmy condor]

Like let me sleep on my keyboard in peace man fuck

[frail fossil]

i love how every once in a while a sub player ask if they can make an awfully cluttered macro to avoid them pressing 3 buttons

[lost horizon]

don't flame my SBlade+trinket+SoD+SD+SS macro wtf

[balmy condor]

They do that here too dw

[fleet whale]

how about the sub rogues that are trying to find ways

to remove rupture from the rotation lol

[frail fossil]

look man

rupture does not provide instant serotonin

[lost horizon]

beats the hell out of nightblade

[fleet whale]

there are legit people that wanted the pre nerf akaari playstyle

[balmy condor]

But nightblade gave 15% evisc damage and evisc is the entire spec, rupture just does damage man wtf

[fleet whale]

where you just spammed SS and evis

and 100% dance uptime

[frail fossil]

i mean yeah because for those people "fun" is just a word for "broken"

now they all here saying they "nuked" sub or that "sub is dead" cuz they cant abuse a legendary/conduits

[balmy condor]

Okay enough late night shit posting in off topic v2 don’t let this channel burn down overnight boys

Gnite

[frail fossil]

night

[fleet whale]

6 PM EST

[frail fossil]

it's 8 am still not sleeping oof

[low girder]

hey whispyr can i macro mut and ambush procs together?

oh he sleep rip

[sick scarab]

no you cant

or better you can do it wiht gnome sequencer

not wiht normal macro 🙂

[strange python]

i feel like i'm doing stuff the whole time

my keyboard is just going tap tap tap tap tap tap tapt tp atpatpaptaptaptpatpatpa

wait when do you ever have downtime? you're always mutalating to build combo points between your dots

[frail fossil]

sometime u run out of energy

and u need to wait to press thins again

[sick scarab]

if you manage energy well

you dont have downtimes more or less

[south drum]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[strange python]

haha for like a second

and you're usally spamming the next ability

11111111111111

[frail fossil]

for people it is too slow

it is def the lowest apm in the 3 rogue specs tho, also depends on ur amount of haste

[lament dove]

and maybe use different keybinds, T and A are quite far away from P

[strange python]

is outlaw really a high apm class?

thought it was just all cleave shit

[frail fossil]

outlaw is very much faster than assa, might slow down a bit in SL tho

and Sub is prolly the highest apm spec

[strange python]

i'm good haha, between target switching and keeping the bleeds up on multiple chars i don't think i could handle any more yet

[frail fossil]

I think all 3 specs are fun and offer different things which is great

[strange python]

ya i love pvp even tho i'm not great yet

just getting into PvE

[sick scarab]

we will rise

like the phoenix

[strange python]

https://tenor.com/view/latter-kenny-jonesy-hyped-get-pumped-excited-gif-14594144

[sick scarab]

assa are the true rogues others are pussies

[strange python]

i've played sin for like all of wow and I still feel like there is room for growth

[sick scarab]

i was warrior from beta usa to legion .. then swapped to rogue in bfa..

[lament dove]

that gif is so me while playing assa in m+

[strange python]

haha

i almost switched to fury

[sick scarab]

🙂

imho fury warr is like a rogue so.. i play rogue now 🙂

i mean.. cant offtank while in fury etc etc

[strange python]

ez mode rogue

what the fuck is this undercity layout

holy shit horde get it together

[fallow otter]

I disagree

[low girder]

it's like outlaw

not so much like the others 😛

[fleet whale]

@low girder yeah there is an ambush/mut macro

only works if you have 34% crit though

[low girder]

there it is

[thin trout]

'best' spec for pvp will be assassination agian right?

[low girder]

sub most likely

[sick scarab]

at some point after years i felt warrior just became a nopoint dps i speak playwise.. as fury i cant do nothig than dps and so i prefer go rogue that all

[sick scarab]

i prefer wayyyy much hopw the warr was in old times.. wiht stance dance etc..

[sick scarab]

but this is my opinion ofc 🙂

[hardy mural]

is there like.. a rogue sim that compared spec

result

[low girder]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[hardy mural]

nice! thank you very much

[dusk lodge]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[fallow otter]

@sick scarab I'm just saying that rogue isn't like fury, like at all 👍

[warm star]

rogues bring so much utility compared to war fury, that's why I changed main.

[royal lantern]

Wjat utility

Pls tell me

Rogue has almost no real utility lol

[sterile jackal]

[jade jewel]

Which one of you pick-pocketed this mans brain?

[royal lantern]

Tell me the insane rogue raid utility pls

[sterile jackal]

2 stuns, blind, rupt, mass cloak, magic immunity

[royal lantern]

Ah yes

Shroud

The 10/10utility

Im not sure if you are trolling rn lol

[low girder]

literally one of those is useful in raid

lol

[royal lantern]

^

Shroud is a m+thing at best

When did yiu use cheapshot Last time i raid lol

[sterile jackal]

you can use it, you asked for utility

[royal lantern]

Cloak is litearlly our deff cd WICH IS GOOD but also doesnt work on the majority of mechanics at this point

How is somethig that is extremly nieche and never sees play utility lol

Thats like saying "priest has new utility with mindsooth!"

Wich is a spell that probably doesnt even get pulled out of the spellbook

Warrior has AP buff and shout

2things that are allready more raid utility lmao

[magic thorn]

Guys is the pin still relevant in terms of what covenant to pick ? Because it kinda contradicts with the wowhead covenant guide

[strange python]

i think we're telling wowhead to fuckoff

[magic thorn]

?

[low girder]

pins are based on early prog rather than later on when everything is unlocked like wowhead has

that said they're all extremely close

pick whatever you like

[magic thorn]

thats the thing, for me its not about playing what i like. i just want to play the best no matter how ugly it is to play

[low girder]

if you're going that far then i would rather stress you don't play sin

lol

the difference in covenants is tiny. 1% or less. your dps variance is more significant than this

[magic thorn]

well i sticked with sin the last 8 years so im not gonna change but i still want to play the best

but if its so tiny i will decide for anything

is there any choice that is especially good for pvp ? as sin ?

[low girder]

that's more of a #pvp thing

[strange python]

don't pvp shame

[low girder]

i'm not, you're just very unlikely to get any pvp answers here in this channel lol

[strange python]

until i see PvE at the top of the bar it doesn't make sense

especially for organization

[low girder]

it's always been a primarily pve focused discord

[strange python]

who actually runs it?

the shadows?

seems like just some people like it to be pve more

[desert swallow]

there is a dedicated pvp channel

[strange python]

ya there is

with 3 specs jammed in, so it seems more surface level

then you go into the specific spec rooms for more in depth discussion

then you search and its all there

not mashed together with other specs

[warm star]

Speaking of MM+... for utilities.

[frigid kestrel]

Ok, here is the plan. Imma play sub in SL, but ask questions like I’m maining sin in discord every week.

[strange python]

https://tenor.com/view/three-finger-salute-good-luck-jennifer-lawrence-katniss-everdeen-hunger-games-gif-14699764

i think a lot of people are dual speccing

i figure i am just gonna keep my extra pieces then build two sets instead of running content twice

[frigid kestrel]

Ye imma keep every piece of gear that drops and get at least one Lego for sin. Cause Blizz has to make use relevant again sometime soon....... right?

[royal lantern]

eh

rogue as a class is fine

2specs work and are good

making assassination "viable" is really low priority for them

same what happend with sub during bfa tbh

[low girder]

Since like wod at the very least the play has been play the stronger st spec + combat/outlaw

Puts you in a good spot

[royal lantern]

blizzard trys too always atleast make 1spec of a class good

wich is why monk is always in such a weird spot, brewmaster is fking bonkers for raidtanking

[vestal wren]

i think monk is in a bad spot because they put to much effort on the wrong point

e.g instead of reowrkingxi shadow 7 times they could have spend a lot of the time fixing their bugs

[low girder]

They needed to fix convoke the spirits for the 15th time

Ran out of time

[sinful sluice]

Wait...am I reading this right or is it all /s? Is assassination going to be in a bad spot? Decided to play rogue for first raid

[dawn merlin]

It is currently bad, ye

[unkempt nacelle]

Assa is pretty bad hea

Yea

[strange python]

going sin/outlaw probs so i have my bases covered

[vestal wren]

Is assassination going to be in a bad spot?
blizz can change that at any time, but yes its currently undertuned

[strange python]

sin for pvp outlaw for m+

[west cove]

so guys been away a while, how is rogue fixed for Shadowlands? Im hopinh to play sin raid and m+. Whats the meta prior to future tunes? I sub still top tier or been nerfed?

[strange python]

i felt like such a dick playing m+ with sin haha

[balmy raft]

@west cove currently sub covers all bases with outlaw having the edge in mythic plus

however like many here, I'll go all in sin rogue

[strange python]

sin ftw haha its such a cool kit, poisons and bleeds have always been my shit

never found such a cool rogue class in any games

[balmy raft]

We just require a bit tuning, perhaps snd refreshing with finishing moves, or similar. I am very disappointed at our single target performance

[sterile jackal]

for lvling sin will be the slowest spec

[balmy raft]

mark of the master assassin + wild hunt tactics will be very decent early on in mythic+, not so much in the raid

[sterile jackal]

amount of burst provided by sub is way better for questing

[strange python]

flavor comes at a cost

haha no that's dumb they can give us a buff

we can have both

[unkempt nacelle]

I love playing sin 100x more than other specs but it’s just not performing well at all atm

Still gonna play it

[balmy raft]

I am pretty confident we will see a tuning buff before the raid opens.

[slender berry]

sure

[marble magnet]

What does " 1 CP for every active bones spike" for necrolord mean?

Does this only matter in AoE

[warm star]

if you have the dot already on one mob > you get 1 CP, if the dot is already on two > you get two... etc

[summer spade]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[summer spade]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[stray ivy]

Sin is shit in m+ in SL?

[slender berry]

yes

[sterile lodge]

😦

[stray ivy]

fuck.

[vestal wren]

sin is undertuned

the spec still is gameplay wise similar

[scenic shale]

can i make a macro that ambushes when available otherwise it mutilates?

im used to having them in the same keybind

[warm star]

#showtooltip
/cast [bonusbar:1]ambush;mutilate

?

[jovial aurora]

just how bad is sin compared to other specs? cause I love sin and still want to main it

[halcyon oak]

Sin is not as deadly as it should be

[vital kettle]

Are WA's up to date ?

(new assasination DI dwarf looking for macros and stuff)

[cinder horizon]

so i have seen 3 different sources say different things for witch covenants rogues should be going. anyone got the up to date info to share?

[ripe bone]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[cinder horizon]

ooo that is a nice spreadsheet thanks

[manic pebble]

what's the stats priority right now?

[halcyon oak]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[forest nacelle]

if i were to go necrolord instead of night fae..... how much am i gimping myself in percent?

just curious is all. nothing serious.

ehh nvm.

fleshcraft dosn't sound fun.

[vestal wren]

not to much

[balmy condor]

Not a lot

[vestal wren]

also keep in mind that you buff up to 4 allies with lead by example

[balmy condor]

Only through gnome sequencer

[forest nacelle]

according to that picture in pins, you eventually pick 4 soulbinds at once? but you only get 1 ability right?

[balmy condor]

You pick 1 covenant, that gives you the ability, each covenant has 3 soulbinds, you pick 1 of them, but can switch between the 3 like a talent row when you’re in the covenant capital

[forest nacelle]

so i only get one tree?

at a time

[balmy condor]

Yes

[forest nacelle]

becouse the arrows seem too point out that its like a pathway for me, but thats just how im reading it i guess.

[balmy condor]

Correct

That’s the optimal path to take in each soulbind

[forest nacelle]

no i mean in the pick picking each soulbind

[balmy condor]

Oh the arrow is just which one is best, theres a legend at the top, red for bis, purple for bis at higher renown

[forest nacelle]

oh its just showing what is best compared to others?

[balmy condor]

Yeah, the best soulbind out of the 3

[fathom pewter]

Hello, I am brand new here. Why did !macro recommend me subtlety macros in this channel?

[balmy condor]

It shouldn’t recommend you any macro’s in this channel

[fathom pewter]

Oh weird, where do I do the command?

[balmy condor]

Sub macro’s would be in the sub channel

Sin doesn’t have any macro’s

And I don’t think outlaw does either

[quaint dragon]

!covenant

[fathom pewter]

People don't use macros with assassins?

[shadow tulip]

Nah

[balmy condor]

No need

[shadow tulip]

Only tricks to focus

[balmy condor]

Pins

[fathom pewter]

Ooh ok

Is there a good beginners guide anywhere for Rogue? I was sent here from Wownoob Reddit lol

[balmy condor]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[balmy condor]

These are both fine

You can probably find a guide on YouTube which would go over the basics, but I wouldn’t recommend it generally since there’s a lot of clickbait and misinformation on there

[fathom pewter]

Yeah that's what I seemed to find already, but thanks so much for your help 🙂

Will try the Wowhead guide out~

[balmy condor]

Any time! Hope you find what you’re looking for

[shadow tulip]

Welcome to the brotherhood!

[fathom pewter]

Thank you!!

[quaint dragon]

What is best covenant early on for sin?

[shadow tulip]

Kyrian

It's a good one overall, I think

[quaint dragon]

Oke thanks, and can u switch covenants now or u are stuck with one?

[fair minnow]

So since Sub got nerfed. Is Assas the way to go for me dmg now?

[balmy condor]

???

Sub didn’t get nerfed

[balmy condor]

You can switch to each one once, if you want to rejoin, you have to do a 2 week long quest chain. You don’t lose anything in the process, but you will have to catch up in renown again

[maiden wolf]

is there any information out there on how many weeks to legendary upgrades? More towards the question of is it worth crafting 2 legendaries vs holding soul ash for upgrading later on?

[quaint dragon]

Oke thanks @balmy condor

[shadow tulip]

If you want to do multiple things, prolly better to craft more

Or even multiple specs

[balmy condor]

Yeah that depends entirely on how you’re playing

You can get 1 legendary by the mythic week, and then pretty much craft 1 every week

The upgrades are more expensive obviously

[shadow tulip]

Except rank 2

[maiden wolf]

is there an estimate on the number of weeks to an upgrade?

[shadow tulip]

I think upgrade to rank 2 is pretty cheap

1250 to craft one, 750 to upgrade to rank 2

I think

[maiden wolf]

ok so likely rank 2 in 2 week

[shadow tulip]

If you only want 1, yea

[frigid kestrel]

Ok

So stupid question

I’m guessing my best bet is to go NF. Imma main Sub until Sin gets better (because it will) but that also gives me two trees to play around with, right? So I don’t have to consistently swap talents.

[ripe bone]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[grizzled jay]

NF has the most Soulbind diversity

[frigid kestrel]

Ye that’s what I will do then

[sick scarab]

rotation question.. it is like mut snd mut garrote rupture or ambush snd ambush etc ?

[balmy condor]

For the opener?

With MA you would go mut snd mut rup gar covenant/vendetta shiv vanish env mut env

As a baseline

It changes a little based on covenant and stuff

[sick scarab]

so no ambush instead of mutilate wiht MA ?

[balmy condor]

Mutilate gives more cp

I don’t have the numbers on it

But the opener gets messy when you use ambush instead

[sick scarab]

so basically we use ambush ONLY when it procs from blindisde

[balmy condor]

Yeah

I’m sure there’s opener things that are super minor gains with ambush

But you’re not losing out like 100 dps because you didn’t ambush in the opener

You’re losing like 10 probably at most

[sick scarab]

y y i prefer mutilate so good good 🙂

[jagged axle]

5 more hours for a last minute buff guys I still have faith haha

[sick scarab]

ehehe

if we get some buff it will happens after first week

when raid start imho

btw guys go buy glblin gliders and bear tartare LOL

[gritty mist]

So, which one is good for raiding and m+??

[balmy condor]

Kyrian early, night fae later

[gritty mist]

ok thx dude

[balmy condor]

They’re all close though

If you don’t like either one, you can pick what you prefer

[gritty mist]

Ah ok, and another qst u maintain S&D up all time right?

[balmy condor]

Yes

And in aoe up to 6 targets (although maintaining higher really isn’t too much of a loss, so you could just always maintain in aoe)

[gritty mist]

Then on opening u use s&d first or rupture?

[balmy condor]

Snd is a very minor gain

Like incredibly minor

If you feel more comfortable doing rupture first, you’ll be fine

[gritty mist]

okok thx

[pliant apex]

did anything change last min and sin become competetive lel

[balmy condor]

Nope

[full parcel]

!BiS

[balmy condor]

You can check #tc-research, there’s a link in there

[fringe kraken]

Just flipped 10k goblin gliders from 11g to 39g lol

[full parcel]

where?

[balmy condor]

The top gear sim

It’s pre-raid bis

I haven’t gotten around to full raid bis

[strange python]

do i have to relogg when sl launch?

or can i just play?

[full parcel]

!BiS

[strange python]

I don't think you need to relog, it worked instantly the expansions before

was a nice transition

you didn't even notice the new expansion was live

lol

[pulsar zealot]

does anyone have any recommendations on a good ui setup?

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[sick scarab]

i am using afenar

[balmy condor]

I'm using my own

[sick scarab]

and it is good 🙂

[pulsar zealot]

I mean like an entire ui. not just the weakauras

[sick scarab]

i am not good ad doing WA so i have to use others 🙂

use elvui and be happy

[balmy condor]

https://wago.io/p/Whispyr

my stuff is on there

[pulsar zealot]

thanks whispyr

[balmy condor]

yup

[pulsar zealot]

can always count on you

[balmy condor]

[pulsar zealot]

do you have a recommendation on which WA to use?

[balmy condor]

my sin wa's are in there as well

[pulsar zealot]

😮

[lapis dragon]

https://wago.io/HyTFFBSV-

same as @balmy condor , using my own 🙂

[frail fossil]

whispyr carrying sin rogue on his back

[balmy condor]

still mostly fuu and koji doing all the heavy lifting tbh

seli doing all the high level m+ stuff

I'm just the idiot that talks too much XD

[frail fossil]

that's is a fair role to have

[lapis dragon]

Well Trump also is idiot that talks too much.. but look at him 😄

[frail fossil]

some people do the thinking other do the screaming

i do neither because i am bad at the game 😎

[pulsar zealot]

it wont let me import your elvui profile whispyr?

[balmy condor]

what version are you on

[pulsar zealot]

12.13

just updated it

[balmy condor]

hm. okay give me a couple min

[pulsar zealot]

wait

im an idiot

please dont mind me

[balmy condor]

lmao

[frail fossil]

oof

[pulsar zealot]

just trying to import wa into elvui and vice versa

[balmy condor]

classic

[fallen slate]

!wa

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[fallen slate]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/HJUbINlV7 (Mizerok's Group)
https://wago.io/E1EB91OtM (Lokkek's Group)
https://wago.io/SyLUNGD4X (Sovv's Group)
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[prisma yoke]

i mean they dropped a "nerf" of some sort for powerlevelers 3h before the expansion.
maybe we get a buff for sin soon

[celest mica]

best convenants for all rogue specs?

[balmy condor]

They’re all close, but I personally would suggest kyrian or night fae as an all around pick

[vestal wren]

you should pick necrolord for the transmog

its very unique

[balmy condor]

also true

[forest nacelle]

should i pick nightstalker for speed meme?

[balmy condor]

I mean, you can

[cloud reef]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[prisma yoke]

i did. 135% speed sneak gang

[spice cedar]

they are all within 100 points of each other

choose what ever calls to you

[lethal ginkgo]

Is sin still weaker than sub and outlaw or is it a bit higher up the power chain

[shy dust]

It is weaker

[balmy condor]

much weaker

[uneven sky]

y so much hate 😦

[balmy condor]

because it's weaker

[fleet whale]

assassination is sadly bottom tier at current tuning

with pretty much no niche

[lethal ginkgo]

Alright I was planning to go outlaw for multi target and swap to sun for single target stuff

[fleet whale]

you would be better off

just going outlaw for both

[lethal ginkgo]

Sub

[fleet whale]

oh lol

[lethal ginkgo]

Alright

[balmy condor]

that's fine

[fleet whale]

thought you meant sin/outlaw

[lethal ginkgo]

I am just not super happy with outlaw single target but i do enjoy playing all three specs

[balmy condor]

outlaw single target kinda really good atm

[lethal ginkgo]

I did not play outlaw on beta I only gifted around with sub

[fleet whale]

yeah, outlaw's main flaw is that you have to be on the target 24/7

at least for sub, it has amazing mobility